[04:40] <tachyons> cjwatson, dobey if you are not busy can you help me to find why this package failed to build in amd64
[04:40] <tachyons> https://launchpad.net/~aboobackervyd/+archive/apertium/+build/5393470
[04:48] <saiarcot895> tachyons: I think I can explain this; liblttoolbox3-3.2.so.0 is located in debian/lttoolbox/usr/lib, but not in /usr/lib, which is where it is expected to be.
[04:50] <tachyons> saiarcot895, thanks for your input, but I didn't got your point :-(
[04:50] <tachyons> debian/lttoolbox/usr/lib is the path while packaging isn't it?
[04:51] <saiarcot895> The shlibdeps is trying to find the libraries on which the applications are dependent on, and then include them as dependent packages. There are a set of paths that shlibdeps (anything, actually) looks in to find libraries; debian/lttoolbox/usr/lib isn't one of them
[04:52] <saiarcot895> It is the path for the packaging, but it's not included in the list of paths to check, in the same way that debian/lttookbox/usr/bin is not included in PATH
[04:53] <tachyons> saiarcot895, means I have to edit rules files to add it?
[04:53] <saiarcot895> In this case, I think you can just set the LD_LIBRARY_PATH here to include debian/lttoolbox/usr/lib, and shlibdeps will work fine
[04:53] <tachyons> BTW it works without any problem in i386
[04:53] <saiarcot895> tachyons: interesting, let me check that
[04:55] <tachyons> saiarcot895, https://launchpad.net/~aboobackervyd/+archive/apertium/+packages check this all i386 builds are success full
[04:55] <tachyons> but none of the amd64 build succeeded
[04:58] <tachyons> export DH_OPTIONS
[04:58] <tachyons> %:
[04:58] <tachyons> 	dh $@ --with autoreconf
[04:59] <tachyons> this my current rules file , I don't know how to configure dh-shlibdeps
[05:04] <saiarcot895> tachyons: ok, I'm not sure what it is; according to the i386 builds, it seems that the usr/lib folder is indeed included in the list of paths to check, so I'm not sure what the problem could be on amd64.  The only thing I can think of is that, on amd64, shlibdeps is expecting the library to be in usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu instead of /usr/lib (which should probably be true for everything except Precise), but in the case of Precise, then, it shouldn
[05:04] <saiarcot895> 't fail
[05:06] <tachyons> not only for precise, same output for precise to trusty
[05:06] <tachyons> 12.04 to 14.04
[05:07] <tachyons> saiarcot895, how can I tell to check usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu
[05:08] <saiarcot895> Well, it shouldn't fail on Precise because Precise didn't have the concept of multi-arch, so the libraries should be installed in /usr/lib instead of /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu
[05:08] <tachyons> saiarcot895, what about other distros?
[05:09] <saiarcot895> tachyons: On that, I'm not entirely sure. If you're using cmake, I  think it's handled automatically by cmake. If you are installing manually, I think there's a way to check if the distro version is multi-arch
[05:10] <saiarcot895> tachyons: if you mean other distros as in outside of Ubuntu, no idea
[05:10] <tachyons> I mean other ubuntu versions
[05:10] <tachyons> it is using gnu make not cmake
[05:10] <saiarcot895> Quantal and up are multi-arch and so use usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu in amd64
[05:11] <tachyons> how to specify it in .install file?
[05:12] <saiarcot895> tachyons: I meant the build system itself, and the autoreconf switch tells me it's using autoconf
[05:12] <tachyons> saiarcot895, change build system to cmake?
[05:14] <saiarcot895> tachyons: I wouldn't change the build system to cmake just for this; at the moment I'm not sure what the problem could be, so I would wait for cjwatson or dobey to respond
[09:41] <dennis__> Hi there, I would like to provide ppa packages for both 12.04 and 13.10. Now the ppa only builds for 13.10. What do I have configure in this case? Is it possible to add the supported series in the changelog? Now it only contains 'saucy'.
[17:52] <tachyons> can any one help me on this issue , still not fixed :-(
[17:53] <tachyons> cjwatson, dobey
[18:00] <cjwatson> tachyons: I can't spend much time on this.  If multiarch is being a problem for this backport then you may need to apply http://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch/Implementation in reverse
[18:01] <tachyons> cjwatson, sorry for the disturbance , build failed in precise too
[18:01] <tachyons> afaik precise do not have multi-arch
[18:02] <dobey> precise has multiarch support
[18:03] <cjwatson> it does indeed#
[18:03] <cjwatson> but maybe not for all the build-dependencies
[18:03] <dobey> and your package isn't being built with multiarch anyway
[18:03] <cjwatson> dunno, I didn't really look hard at this build failure
[18:03] <cjwatson> maybe it's one of those that doesn't notice that it failed to actually build the library until it gets round to trying to install it
[18:04] <dobey> though the library package is named incorrectly-ish
[18:05] <tachyons> cjwatson, reading multi-arch documentation , I hope it will solve the issue
[18:05] <cjwatson> multiarch is clearly a red herring, having looked at this a bit harder
[18:05] <cjwatson> don't bother reading those docs
[18:05] <cjwatson> I wonder if it's depending on a feature of newer dpkg
[18:06] <dobey> the library did build and appears to have installed to the usr/lib/ dir as expected. no idea why shlibdeps isn't finding it. doing override_dh_shlibdeps isn't helping, surely
[18:06] <cjwatson> I vaguely recall dpkg-shlibdeps having been made nicer in this area recently-ish
[18:07] <dobey> Note: libraries are not searched in other binary packages that do not have any shlibs or symbols file.
[18:07] <cjwatson> you might need:
[18:08] <cjwatson> override_dh_shlibdeps:
[18:08] <dobey> adding a .symbols file for the library should solve it
[18:08] <cjwatson>         dh_shlibdeps -ldebian/tmp/usr/lib
[18:08] <cjwatson> or similar
[18:08] <tachyons> let me try
[18:09]  * cjwatson -> out
[18:30] <tachyons> dobey, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/161105754/buildlog_ubuntu-raring-amd64.lttoolbox_3.2-1ubuntu9_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[18:30] <tachyons> build failed again
[18:44] <tachyons> .
[18:58] <tachyons> dobey, are you there? :-)
[18:59] <tachyons> I took diff of two results
[18:59] <tachyons> debian/rules build-arch
[18:59] <tachyons> dh build-arch --with autoreconf
[18:59] <tachyons>    dh_testdir -a
[18:59] <tachyons>    dh_autoreconf -a
[19:00] <tachyons> debian/rules build
[19:00] <tachyons> dh build --with autoreconf
[19:00] <tachyons>    dh_testdir
[19:00] <tachyons>    dh_autoreconf
[19:00] <tachyons> why this difference?
[19:18] <Dudytz> hi all! I am noob in launchpad ... how to list all branches of a project with the "bazaar heads" command? eg: the project https://launchpad.net/~webupd8team/+archive/themes
[19:19] <Dudytz> I tried: bzr heads --tips lp:~webupd8team/ubuntu/raring/themes/master
[19:19] <Dudytz> and bzr heads --tips lp:~webupd8team/ubuntu/raring/themes
[19:19] <Dudytz> and bzr heads --tips lp:~webupd8team/themes
[19:19] <Dudytz> but always I get an error: You need to run this command either from the root of a shared repository,
[19:19] <Dudytz> or from a branch.
[19:21] <tachyons> Dudytz, you may have to use cd
[19:21] <tachyons> to source directory
[19:22] <Dudytz> but I dont have the source project ... I need a initial import
[19:22] <Dudytz> like a git clone
[19:25] <Dudytz> I need to clone this project: https://launchpad.net/~webupd8team/+archive/themes ... specifically the faience-azur-dark package .. for the ubuntu raring
[19:25] <Dudytz> how to do this with bazaar?
[19:27] <TheLordOfTime> i'm not sure git or bzr work very well with the PPAs...
[19:28] <TheLordOfTime> at least in terms of being able to "get" the source of something published inside a PPA (not sure though, don't take this as an answer)
[19:29] <Dudytz> ???
[19:29] <Dudytz> but bazaar is the version control of launchpad
[19:30] <Dudytz> I believe that all launchpad developers uses the bzr commands to clone, pull and push files to launchpad
[19:30] <JanC> packages aren't built from version control
[19:30] <Dudytz> like github
[19:30] <Dudytz> with the git command
[19:31] <JanC> are those themes in LP version control or elsewhere?
[19:32] <JanC> and you can get the source package using apt-get, of course
[19:32] <Dudytz> in lp
[19:32] <Dudytz> Yes, I can
[19:33] <Dudytz> But I need to learn to use launchpad .. to create branches of projects
[19:33] <JanC> you will have to ask the PPA maintainer(s) where the bzr repositories for those themes are then
[19:34] <Dudytz> oh god ...
[19:34] <Dudytz> the project is hosted in launchpad with bazaar
[19:37] <JanC> Dudytz: it seems to me like many of those themes were downloaded from gnome-look.org, deviantart.com & such?
[19:37] <Dudytz> JanC ... this is an example! I need to learn to "clone" a launchpad project
[19:39] <JanC> Dudytz: PPA & source repository are two separate parts of a LP project, they don't have to be used both, and in this case only PPA seems to be used for the themes
[19:41] <Dudytz> ok, thanks ... but I need to learn HOW TO CLONE A PROJECT
[19:41] <JanC> and 'themes' isn't a project, just a PPA of the user group 'webupd8team'
[19:41] <Dudytz> NOT THEMES GOOOOD
[19:42] <Dudytz> ITS AN EXAMPLE
[19:42] <Dudytz> GOOOOOD
[19:45] <JanC> ...
[19:46] <tachyons> cjwatson, dobey thanks issue resolved


[06:04] <jam> morning all
[09:29]  * Chipaca struggles to find his voice
[09:35]  * bthomas recommends some ginger tea
[09:55] <mup> PR operator#369 closed: use yaml instead of json for pod-spec-set call <Created by chipaca> <Closed by chipaca> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/369>
[09:56] <Chipaca> oops
[09:56] <mup> PR operator#369 opened: use yaml instead of json for pod-spec-set call <Created by chipaca> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/369>
[10:15] <facundo__> ¡Muy buenos días a todos!
[10:17] <bthomas> 𝔊𝔬𝔬𝔡 𝔐𝔬𝔯𝔫𝔦𝔫𝔤
[10:17] <bthomas>
[10:18] <facubatista> hola bthomas :)
[10:18] <bthomas> :)
[11:46] <mup> PR operator#370 closed: Update README.md <Created by alejdg> <Merged by chipaca> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/370>
[11:56] <Chipaca> ballot: have you been able to set aside a bit of time for testing the fix to #293?
[11:56] <mup> Issue #293: passing k8s_resources to pod.set_spec does not work <juju-workaround> <Created by jetpackdanger> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/293>
[11:57] <Chipaca> heh, i just realised why you said "if pjdc doesn't have the time"
[11:57] <ballot> Chipaca: hello ! Not yet, was planning to do this afternoon.  The fix is committed but not released so I guess I need that to test fully the code
[11:58] <Chipaca> ballot: why comile juju?
[11:58] <Chipaca> ohh.... no i meant just the fix on operator side, ie #369
[11:58] <mup> PR #369: use yaml instead of json for pod-spec-set call <Created by chipaca> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/369>
[11:58] <Chipaca> because after noticing the fix on juju side, i realised we'd still be broken on older jujus so we really should work around it ourselves as well
[11:58] <ballot> Chipaca: aaaah, ok, much easier then :)
[11:59] <ballot> I thought I needed the fix on both sides
[11:59] <mup> PR operator#368 closed: Clarify ops.testing.Harness.update_config usage <Created by darkalia> <Merged by chipaca> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/368>
[12:01] <Chipaca> ballot: both fixes fix the issue independently :)
[12:18] <Chipaca> off to lunch, bbl
[13:17] <Chipaca> facubatista: #113 could use a re-review
[13:17] <mup> Issue #113: Automatically transform config into pod spec <Created by knkski> <Closed by niemeyer> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/113>
[13:17] <Chipaca> er
[13:17] <Chipaca> charmcraft#113
[13:17] <mup> PR charmcraft#113: init: include series in metadata.yaml <Created by chipaca> <https://github.com/canonical/charmcraft/pull/113>
[13:18] <Chipaca> narindergupta: 👋
[13:19] <narindergupta> Chipaca, hey I am starting work on writing a new k8s charm from scratch for Cassandra on k8s just need to know how to start with the k8s component in framework?
[13:20] <Chipaca> narindergupta: so I pulled mark's work into https://github.com/chipaca/ops-lib-k8s
[13:21] <Chipaca> narindergupta: the way you use it, add that to your requirements.txt, and then 'k8s = ops.lib.use("k8s", 0, "chipaca@canonical.com")'
[13:22] <Chipaca> narindergupta: the "that" is "git+https://github.com/chipaca/ops-lib-k8s.git", but it'll be in pip as soon as it's "done" (at which point the API will bump to 1)
[13:22] <Chipaca> narindergupta: am i making sense?
[13:22] <narindergupta> Chipaca, so start with charm craft init then make the change
[13:23] <Chipaca> yep!
[13:28] <narindergupta> Chipaca, ok I think I can see that
[13:28] <narindergupta> ops_lib_k8s-0.0.dev0+unknown.dist-info/ and ops-0.8.0.dist-info/ in c=venv
[13:29] <narindergupta> After charm build
[13:29] <Chipaca> 'charmcraft build' i hope :')
[13:29] <facubatista> narindergupta, you should not use the 'charm' tool
[13:29] <narindergupta> facubatista, I am using charmcraft
[13:30] <facubatista> great
[13:30] <facubatista> narindergupta, what is "c=venv"?
[13:31] <narindergupta> What I meant is in venv directory
[13:43] <narindergupta> Chipaca, yes I am able to start the work now and still has to go through the pod status to make sure I set the status in charm application as well. Do we still explicitly set the status?
[13:45] <Chipaca> narindergupta: sorry i didn't follow that
[13:46] <narindergupta> Chipaca, in my earlier charm I explicitly set the status of the application using activestatus call based on the pods status. Are we following the same as well?
[13:46] <narindergupta> Like _on_start(self)
[13:47] <narindergupta>         if (self.model.pod.is_leader()):
[13:47] <narindergupta>             self.model.app.status = ActiveStatus('ready')
[13:49] <narindergupta> Basically I wanted to set the application status as pod status if it is leader
[13:58] <facubatista> narindergupta, I'm lost if you attempted to do that and didn't work, if it worked but you're not sure if it's the best way of doing it
[14:01] <Chipaca> narindergupta: that is something the charm would do, yes
[14:01] <Chipaca> narindergupta: I'm not sure if that's your question though
[14:01] <narindergupta> Chipaca, yes that answers it and currently seeing to pass app data to k8s pod
[14:02] <narindergupta> Will let you know if come across any issues
[14:02] <Chipaca> narindergupta: also note you can write self.app.status (it's the same, just shorter)
[14:03] <narindergupta> Chipaca, gotchu you that is helpful
[14:03] <Chipaca> narindergupta: and AFAIK it's not pod.is_lader but unit.is_leader :)
[14:04] <Chipaca> so you can write self.unit.is_leader
[14:04] <narindergupta> Chipaca, thank you
[17:08] <Chipaca> ok, i'm out of here
[17:08] <Chipaca> ttfn!
[17:38] <drewn3ss> qq, I'm moving from using submodule to pull mod/operator for the ops module to using charmcraft to build my charm.  What should be done with the dead symlink from $CHARM_ROOT/lib/ops that prior pointed to ../mod/operator/ops?  charmcraft dies on looking for where this symlinks to.  https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/GKmQy44jTm/
[17:38] <drewn3ss> is there a specific path I should look for when doing import ops?
[17:39] <drewn3ss> or is it just available in my built venv?
[17:39] <drewn3ss> and I shouldn't worry about pathing
[17:58] <drewn3ss> ok, I did a build of my charm.  the venv directory didn't get created....I see that requirements.txt at the top level is actually equivalent of wheelhouse for reactive.
[17:58] <drewn3ss> that seems really weird, but I'll roll with it
[17:59] <drewn3ss> I think long term it'll make more sense for people joinnig into charming, so I'm okay with the rename
[18:26] <drewn3ss> answer: use requirements.txt to get the modules you want installed from pip into the charm's venv.
[18:26] <drewn3ss> and remove symlinks and calls to lib paths for anything that was submoduled.
[18:26] <drewn3ss> because the import will work because it's part of the venv
[18:38] <narindergupta> Chipaca do you know why am I getting this error ERROR cannot repackage charm: symlink "config.yaml" is absolute: "/home/ubuntu/narinder/charm-k8s-cassandra/config.yaml"
[18:39] <narindergupta> I am trying to deploy the charm but getting this error
[18:50] <drewn3ss> how do I make charmcraft build include my CHARM_ROOT/files directory?
[18:50] <drewn3ss> or /templates, or any other path for that matter
[18:50] <drewn3ss> seems it pulls in /lib and /src and several .yaml/version files
[18:51] <drewn3ss> I'd expected it to pull everything not in .jujuignore
[18:51] <drewn3ss> facubatista: ^
[18:53] <facubatista> drewn3ss, it will do that, I'm currently working on it: https://github.com/canonical/charmcraft/issues/39
[18:54] <facubatista> narindergupta, how are you deploying the charm?
[18:54] <drewn3ss> I see https://github.com/canonical/charmcraft/blob/master/charmcraft/commands/build.py#L123 if your entrypoint dir for build is same as your whole charm dir, then it skips all files
[18:55] <facubatista> drewn3ss, the "entrypoint" is your main Python file, not a directory
[18:56] <drewn3ss> ack
[18:56] <facubatista> drewn3ss, to hack it until a proper solution is ready, you could include your files in the CHARM_OPTIONAL list
[18:56] <facubatista> drewn3ss, in that build.py, line ~38
[18:56] <drewn3ss> is that environmental, arg-able or am I forking the code?
[18:56] <drewn3ss> forking the code...cool.
[18:56] <drewn3ss> that's...a non-starter
[18:57] <facubatista> drewn3ss, as I said, I'm working on the proper solution
[18:57] <drewn3ss> thank you :)
[18:58] <drewn3ss> I can also move my files dir to src
[18:58] <drewn3ss> as it seems all of src is included
[18:58] <drewn3ss> that's reasonable for now
[21:12]  * facubatista eods


[00:47] <mornau> hi, i'm having trouble starting X with the radeon driver on oneiric with Sarvatt's x updates: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/972024
[00:48] <mornau> I would appreciate any help you can provide, or hints on how to improve my report
[02:09] <lesshaste> hi
[02:09] <lesshaste> I have had to turn off 3d as the system freezes regularly
[02:09] <lesshaste> I get
[02:09] <lesshaste> [ 1934.458109] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: fail pre-validate sync
[02:09] <lesshaste> [ 1934.458114] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: validate vram_list
[02:09] <lesshaste> [ 1934.458238] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: validate: -16
[02:09] <lesshaste> is this a known problem?
[02:11] <lesshaste> also seems to be this bug
[02:11] <lesshaste> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=663763
[02:13] <RAOF> lesshaste: On what chip?
[02:13] <lesshaste> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation NV44 [Quadro NVS 285] (rev a1)
[02:14] <lesshaste> RAOF, does that answer the question?I am not sure how to find out the exact chip
[02:15] <RAOF> That's enough, yeah.  The other way would be “dmesg | grep nouveau | grep Detected”
[02:15] <RAOF> So, when you asked in #nouveau mumpf suggested that might be fixed by a new libdrm.
[02:16] <lesshaste> RAOF, well yes but one in the future
[02:16] <lesshaste> it's a pretty fatal bug
[02:16] <lesshaste> and 11.10 doesn't have the latest kernel/X
[02:16] <lesshaste> so I was hoping there might be interim fixes
[02:19] <RAOF> You can try a newer kernel, but that doesn't look particularly promising.
[02:19] <lesshaste> RAOF, ok thanks.. so just a newer kernel, not a new X ?
[02:19] <RAOF> (You can try, for example, the 3.3.1 kernel here http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/ )
[02:19] <lesshaste> I am not sure where all the parts of nouveau live
[02:19] <RAOF> Newer X is unlikely to be interesting.
[02:19] <lesshaste> so the driver is entirely in the kernel?
[02:20] <RAOF> Much of it is.
[02:20] <lesshaste> ok
[02:20] <lesshaste> I vaguely remember this debate :)
[02:20] <RAOF> 3D lives in mesa, which would be another candidate for update.
[02:20] <lesshaste> oh well it's definitely  a 3d problem
[02:20] <lesshaste> it all works fine in 2d
[02:21] <scientes> epiphany flickers for me
[02:21] <scientes> im using nvidia
[02:21] <RAOF> lesshaste: But a lockup is always a kernel bug :)
[02:21] <scientes> RAOF, :P
[02:22] <scientes> also, xorg-edgers
[02:24] <RAOF> scientes: You're using the binary nvidia driver, and edgers?
[02:24] <scientes> no i am not
[02:24] <scientes> im using stock precise all over
[02:25] <scientes> and epiphany is flickering with h264 video
[02:25] <scientes> i was just participating in the conf on mainline kernel
[02:26] <bryceh> RAOF, you in?
[02:27] <scientes> bryceh, he is
[02:27] <RAOF> Indeed.
[02:28] <bryceh> RAOF, been poking at those memory corruption bugs this afternoon, think I got a feel for what's going on
[02:28] <bryceh> RAOF, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server?field.status:list=NEW&field.status:list=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status:list=CONFIRMED&field.status:list=TRIAGED&field.status:list=INPROGRESS&field.tag=precise&field.tags_combinator=ALL
[02:28] <bryceh> that should get the main ones
[02:28] <bryceh> now, the bugs all have different back traces and seem to occur under a random variety of situations
[02:28] <bryceh> however they have a few things in common
[02:29] <bryceh> a ton are going through __libc_message
[02:29] <bryceh> so, like it could be they're trying to print out an error message, or generate a stacktrace in Xorg.0.log, or even just print out the usual input device spew
[02:30] <bryceh> they hit malloc_printerr(), then __libc_message, and poomph
[02:31] <bryceh> so this is characteristic of Ye Olde buffer overflow or other out-of-place memory write
[02:31] <bryceh> and I'm betting ALL of these bugs are going to be traceable to the same flaw
[02:31] <RAOF> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/93074590/Stacktrace.txt looks like the initial error is in malloc, and the reason why it's going through __libc_message is that libc is abort()ing.  That would be entirely consistent with memory corruption due to out-of-place writes.
[02:32] <bryceh> afaict this is not afflicting upstream, so that would suggest it's either the fault of frankenserver, or one of our patches added in precise
[02:32] <bryceh> (or maybe somehting underneath X, but slangasek didn't think that was likely)
[02:33] <bryceh> it is *possible* we could narrow things down by finding the earliest one of these reports
[02:33] <bryceh> if we were able to reliably reproduce it, then we could try iterating through the patches or some such
[02:34] <bryceh> however while some people are able to get it reliably, there aren't steps identified to reliably reproduce it independently
[02:34] <Sarvatt> it's going to be the first frankenserver that did it so not much narrowing down, guaranteed :(
[02:34] <RAOF> Other option is in my barrier patch (again!)
[02:34] <bryceh> Sarvatt, yeah I'm afraid of that too.  Offhand I think I recall seeing these reports right after we put it in
[02:35] <bryceh> anyway, I'm EOD so wanted to hand that off to you.  also hoping maybe you're more clever than me and can figure it out from here
[02:36] <bryceh> now, one bit of good news, it seems that while we have a lot of reports, a large chunk of these occur on shutdown only, so won't be noticeable once we shut off apport
[02:37] <bryceh> but enough are occurring otherwise, that I think this might be our #1 bug in X for the release
[02:38] <bryceh> I'm wondering if it might be something as simple as a some struct or memory chunk that changed size between 1.11 and 1.12, but some code is using the wrong size when writing it or freeing it
[02:40] <bryceh> RAOF, one thing you might try is running valgrind with and without your patch, to see if anything turns up in just a static analysis?
[02:41] <Sarvatt> from what i saw from every bug i've filed its mostly, sigsegv in X for the actual bug, signal handler called, trying to print a backtrace for that crash, some input closedown "stuff" is going on past that and trying to write to the log at the same time, memory corruption bug duped to doko's even if its unrelated because its looking at the __libc_message abort higher up
[02:42] <Sarvatt> aka 100_rethrow_signals.patch causing it most likely
[02:43] <bryceh> yes, some portion of the bugs are double crashes.  Crash, then in the segfault handler it's crashing again when trying to print the crash out
[02:44] <bryceh> and yes the signal throw in that patch might be partly to blame; it's always been a bit of a  klunker
[02:44] <RAOF> bryceh: Yeah.
[02:45] <bryceh> or I should say, we've had to debug it a few times in the past...  we might want to consider disabling that patch for the release, just to mitigate any chance of it contributing to the problem
[02:45] <bryceh> that'd mean we'd need to have people gather crash dumps manually, but that's nothing new
[02:51] <lesshaste> RAOF, sorry.. back
[02:51] <lesshaste> RAOF, it isn't a lock up exactly.. I mean you can ssh in
[02:51] <lesshaste> RAOF, and the mouse pointer moves :)
[02:56] <RAOF> lesshaste: Eh, so it's a GPU lockup then.  Still, try a newer kernel.
[02:56] <lesshaste> RAOF, k
[02:56] <RAOF> You could also try a Precise livecd; there's a newer mesa on it, but I don't think there's been much work on 3d for the nv4x family.
[02:57] <lesshaste> RAOF, ok thanks. I still don't understand if mesa can cause a gpu lockup
[02:57] <RAOF> It can, by submitting an invalid command stream.
[02:58] <RAOF> The kernel would ideally disallow that, but there's all sorts of fun ways to kill the GPU.
[02:58] <lesshaste> ah ok
[02:58] <lesshaste> thanks
[04:47] <tjaalton> meh, desktop hung during the night, ssh works
[04:52]  * RAOF suddenly remembers he has a bunch of *tests* that can easily be run under valgrind.
[06:11] <tjaalton> hmm, turns out that turning the kvm box on really helps in getting to the session.. :P
[07:23] <RAOF> Heh.
[07:24] <RAOF> Bah.  That valgrind session has not been very helpful.
[07:24] <RAOF> Although at least I know that the barrier event overflow code works.
[08:17] <tjaalton> hmm, should some part of the system save the brightness setting or not?
[08:17] <mlankhorst> already happens afaict, at least on kde
[08:17] <tjaalton> oh
[08:18] <tjaalton> gnome-settings-daemon then :)
[08:23] <seb128> tjaalton, known feature request, no need to file it
[08:24] <tjaalton> seb128: ok, it was filed already so I moved it there..
[08:24] <seb128> tjaalton, well you can guess that such requests got filed several times ;-)
[08:24] <seb128> like that's one of those coming back regularly
[08:28] <tjaalton> seb128: ok found the master bug
[08:28] <seb128> tjaalton, I'm not sure what was the current trend upstream, I think some of the upstream people think it shouldn't be an user thing
[08:28] <seb128> but rather a system one
[08:29] <tjaalton> yeah, we probably needs systemd for that ;)
[08:29] <tjaalton> -s
[08:30]  * seb128 slaps tjaalton
[08:30] <seb128> tjaalton, you also need systemd to make you coffee right? ;-)
[08:30] <tjaalton> seb128: good thing I don't drink that stuff :)
[09:43] <tjaalton> ah, downgrading freetype to the oneiric version fixed monospace font size issues..
[09:53] <tjaalton> seb128: ooh, your commit fixed that too :) bug 966654 should be duped to the one you just fixed
[09:53] <seb128> tjaalton, oh, feel free to close it then ;-)
[09:54] <tjaalton> seb128: sure thing, upgrading now and comparing the terminal size to the one with 2.4.4
[09:54] <tjaalton> i mailed ubuntu-desktop@ early in the cycle about the regression, but didn't look deeper into what caused the bump in the font size
[09:57] <seb128> tjaalton, upstream reply seems the old style is wrong
[09:58] <seb128> tjaalton, upstream just replied to my email
[09:58] <seb128> "For years, FreeType had this metrics
[09:58] <seb128> bug, and unfortunately the users got used to the appearance of far too
[09:58] <seb128> widely spaced lines.  What FreeType now returns is what the font
[09:58] <seb128> designer has had in mind while designing the font, and what can be
[09:58] <seb128> found in the font."
[09:59] <tjaalton> meh
[10:01] <seb128> tjaalton, well I've no strong opinion on rendering but I want _ to display in gtk when underline markup is set ;-)
[10:02] <tjaalton> seb128: yeah, my vote is to keep it this way for lts and fight the issues with upstream for q->?
[10:03] <seb128> tjaalton, that's sort of what my upload and email to upstream just set up for ;-)
[10:03] <seb128> i.e revert to avoid regression and let them time to deal with it
[10:03] <tjaalton> yup
[10:04] <tjaalton> and confirmed that I get the same font as on 11.10, whee
[10:24] <tjaalton> yup, total horizontal size of the terminals 344 -> 416 characters :):)
[10:24] <tjaalton> of course now i've used this for months, takes some time to get used to the old again
[11:38] <RAOF> bryceh: I've got a valgrind log of one of those X crashes in abort().  From which I can determine three things: (1) the Intel driver *still* does a huge bunch of stuff valgrind considers suspicious on initialisation, (2) in this case the crash is triggered by the [mi] EQ overflow message being written, and (3) there seems to be some valgrind-suspicious ioctls in synaptics initialisation, but I didn't have debugging symbols for that.
[11:50] <RAOF> Given that trigger, and that X under valgrind is hella slow, I should be able to trigger it again with more debugging symbols.  Tomorrow, though ☺.
[15:03] <mornau> ricotz, Sarvatt: could one of you help me with this one by chance? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/972024
[15:12] <Sarvatt> mornau: I just looked into it and apparently ati just needs a rebuild, but the machine i do my uploads from got hosed from the grub update and i'm fixing that so it'll be about an hour until i can upload it
[15:13] <Sarvatt> ati built against libdrm 2.4.32 when it requires 2.4.33 for KMS support
[15:15] <tjaalton> that's an edgers bug?
[15:15] <Sarvatt> so it silently dropped kms support when it built - checking for LIBDRM_RADEON... no
[15:19] <Sarvatt> tjaalton: yeah edgers bug and argh this iso needs to download faster so i can fix it :)
[15:23] <Sarvatt> stupid macs using rEFIt that can't boot a liveusb unless they are created a certain way. you have to make the vfat file system on the usb stick directly, it wont boot off a partition
[15:35] <ricotz> Sarvatt, hmm, which grub update caused this trouble?
[15:35] <Sarvatt> 20ubuntu1
[15:35] <Sarvatt> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/+bug/972250
[15:36] <ricotz> ah, just wanted to ask if this is gpt related
[15:37] <Sarvatt> yup it was, silly me left the laptop unplugged last night and got stuck with the screwed up grub install that was full of errors after the upgrade :)
[15:38] <ricotz> that is bad indeed :\
[15:48] <ricotz> mornau, the fix is on its way
[15:50] <mornau> thanks guys, you're great
[15:54] <mornau> btw. should i have added some tag to the bug report to ensure you get notified? (It's a pity that common tags aren't documented on launchpad)
[15:57] <ricotz> mornau, i think you could use something like "[xorg-edgers ppa] ..." as bug title
[15:58] <mornau> alright, i'll try to think of it next time if it turns out it's likely PPA related.
[16:01] <ricotz> mornau, you probably want to use a newer kernel too to get the kernel-space drm-updates while using edgers
[16:02] <mornau> I remember there's a PPA for newer kernel builds but i tend to forget its name, and have trouble finding it on a search engine then.
[16:03] <ricotz> the edgers ppa contains a rebuild of the precise kernel
[16:03] <ricotz> currently 3.2.0-20.32 (and 3.2.0-21.34 building)
[16:04] <mornau> "apt-cache search linux-image" doesn't seem to list it on this oneiric amd64 system
[16:06] <ricotz> https://launchpad.net/~xorg-edgers/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/2321458/+listing-archive-extra
[16:09] <mornau> okay, this is not yet built for amd64
[16:10] <mornau> hmm actually it is, sorry
[16:59] <mornau> the availability of this updated kernel image might also be a good hint to add to the edgers page on launchpad
[17:10] <bryceh> RAOF, ah interesting findings. If you happen to still be around and can post one of the valgrind logs somewhere, I wouldn't mind perusing it a bit myself.
[17:14] <Sarvatt> RAOF: building libdrm with valgrind installed should fix most of that
[18:45] <mornau> so just to report back: linux-image-3.2.0-20.32-generic with libdrm-radeon1 2.4.33+git20120403.43704256-0ubuntu0ricotz~oneiric fixes radeon X output via DRM/DRI.
[18:48] <mornau> this kernel image looks a little buggy (gives me trouble with apparmor -> libvirtd keeps respawning, and dhcp fails somehow (haven't looked closer into it, yet)) but i guess that's why a newer image is just building now.
[19:39] <Sarvatt> phew, good thing cairo 1.12 didn't get shoved in at the last second https://lists.debian.org/debian-x/2012/04/msg00076.html
[19:40] <Sarvatt> exa's all kinds of busted with it
[19:54] <bryceh> heh
[23:14] <RAOF> bryceh: http://paste2.org/p/1965772 is the valgrind log.
[23:14] <RAOF> Sarvatt: Oooh, if I build libdrm with valgrind installed it fixes a bunch of those ioctl warnings?  How?
[23:15] <RAOF> Also, could we build-depend on valgrind for libdrm ☺
[23:18] <bryceh> RAOF, thanks
[23:26] <RAOF> This *is* easy to trigger; firing up a unity session under valgrind and thrashing around on the touchpad will overflow the EQ and trigger.  I'll rebuild libdrm to clear *that* noise out and go again.
[23:26] <Sarvatt> RAOF: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/mesa/drm/log/?qt=grep&q=valgrind
[23:27] <RAOF> Yeah, found it by updating my libdrm git and grepping.
[23:56] <bryceh> RAOF, you might also try comparing a valgrind run with patch 100 commented out
[23:58] <RAOF> I'll give that a whirl.  I *think* what will happen is that it'll die in exactly the same place; the rethrow-signals codepath is only being hit once ErrorF has thrown a SIGSEGV anyway.


[00:22] <hggdh> I have a problem with opendns
[00:24] <oerheks> What? does it allow dangerous sites?
[00:25] <hggdh> I think so
[00:53] <tomreyn> pick one of the others then, there's no shortage lately
[00:54] <oerheks> could well be, that we hear in hours that opendns was vulnerable
[00:54] <oerheks> gamblore, now hggdh
[00:55] <oerheks> one might as well open a ##opendns channel, to spot
[00:56] <tomreyn> https://quad9.com https://<IP_ADDRESS>/ https://developers.google.com/speed/public-dns/
[00:56] <tomreyn> but i'm not sure i'm getting the issue properly
[00:58] <oerheks> 'vulnerable sites'... maybe the browser says so
[01:01] <tomreyn> google safebrowsing might
[01:03] <oerheks> "You have until July to Install SSL or Google will mark your site “Not Secure”
[01:03] <oerheks> ah
[01:04] <tomreyn> TLS 1.1+ rather
[01:04] <oerheks> http sites like some of canonical, http://torrent.ubuntu.com:6969/ will be blocked
[01:04] <oerheks> TLS 1.3 .. that is key feature in FF 61
[01:04] <tomreyn> maybe why its impossible to build it ;)
[01:05] <oerheks> also because of 32 bit, i read back?
[01:05] <oerheks> and translations
[01:06] <tomreyn> probbaly rathe rthose, i would guess tls 1.3 will be smooth.
[01:07]  * oerheks hits update icon
[01:08] <oerheks> you have 17.10 .. yeah yeah
[01:08] <oerheks> laptop is 18.04
[01:09] <tomreyn> hmm, sounds unhealthy
[01:11] <oerheks> i am not a laptop person, actually
[01:14] <oerheks> and i have those handy bags for doorstopper
[01:18] <tomreyn> bags for door stoppers instead of laptops?
[01:21] <oerheks> yes, bags with sand, like this https://cdn.agradiservices.net/products/1200x1200/es-lh118.79e706.jpg
[01:21] <oerheks> also silica, but different
[01:22] <oerheks> .. or an aspire 5738g
[01:31] <tomreyn> :))
[01:32] <tomreyn> just smash the door, problem solved
[01:38] <oerheks> my chihuahua would love that
[01:39] <oerheks> https://www.dropbox.com/s/e3wr0nahq2ibuvi/DrabberEnIkOpPaard.JPG?dl=0
[02:00] <tomreyn> is it a bit angry at times? or does it just like the open door policy?
[02:10] <oerheks> he likes to greet people, nosy little raskal
[02:11] <oerheks> and yes, if you are impressed by his bark, then you have no life :-D
[02:11] <oerheks> but he does it friendly, attention seeker, like his master
[02:40] <hggdh> oerheks: yes, I was referring to gambalore (or whatever is the nick)
[02:42] <oerheks> :-)
[03:56] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[04:04] <lotuspsychje> cool, update-manager is deleting unused kernels
[04:05] <lotuspsychje> https://imgur.com/a/YRJY5pE
[05:13] <lotuspsychje> updated https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/1779723
[06:07] <lordievader> Good morning
[06:23] <EriC^^> morning lordievader
[06:30] <lordievader> Hey EriC^^ , how are you?
[07:03] <ducasse> good morning
[07:06] <lordievader> Hey ducasse
[07:06] <lordievader> How are you doing?
[07:07] <ducasse> hi lordievader - all good here, thanks. and you?
[07:07] <lordievader> Doing good here 😁
[07:07] <ducasse> good, all is well with the world ;)
[10:09] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[10:30] <daftykins> hey BluesKaj \o
[10:30] <daftykins> do anything special for Canada day? :)
[10:32] <BluesKaj> 'Morning daftykins, yeah we had a get together and jammed off and on all day and well into the evening...it was a good time ;-)
[10:33] <daftykins> :D sounds good
[10:35] <BluesKaj> yeah, takes me 2 days to recover and this heat isn't helping any. my old a/c unit has a difficult time keeping up, but it sure helps nontheless
[10:36] <daftykins> had quite some warmth here, but we're not really a region for having AC in homes
[10:37] <daftykins> thankfully all that property work i had done last year has vastly improved the deflection of the heat out of my roof - and the 17th century granite walls at ground level work nicely to keep at least the ground floor cool :D
[11:17]  * BluesKaj nods ...nice
[11:21] <daftykins> great fun with learning to be compliant with necessary regulations for my clients with card machines today, oof :P
[11:21] <BluesKaj> card machines? .....
[11:22] <BluesKaj> oh you mean readers
[11:23] <BluesKaj> credit and debit card readers?
[11:35] <coconut> Any apple magic mouse 2 like mouse which is guaranteed to work with ubuntu?
[11:37] <lordievader> daftykins: Those things are quite strict, right?
[11:39] <coconut> I ask because a screwed an magic mouse under elemetaryOS. (and i like the comfort of an flat mouse)
[11:40] <daftykins> BluesKaj: yep
[11:41] <daftykins> lordievader: yeah it looks like i'm going to have to buy a router with multiple interfaces so the card machine can be totally segmented from their office LAN
[11:41] <daftykins> which amusingly is exactly what i thought on the first day i saw they'd gotten one - but i was never consulted on it :)
[11:42] <BluesKaj> heh, at first iwas imaging those ancient unix machines i saw at the local U in 1970 :-)
[11:42] <lordievader> Ah, the classic case of 'I could have told you so' 😋
[11:42] <daftykins> indeed :)
[11:42] <daftykins> BluesKaj: :D before my time, the old punch card
[11:42] <BluesKaj> yup
[11:43] <BluesKaj> I MUST be getting old ...sheesh
[13:57] <mystic> Hi
[13:59] <BluesKaj> hi mystic
[14:02] <lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
[14:03] <BluesKaj> Hey lotuspsychje
[14:04] <lotuspsychje> hey there BluesKaj can you heat yourself?
[14:04] <BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, ?
[14:04] <lotuspsychje> summer heat
[14:05] <BluesKaj> yeah it's going up to 33C here today ... got the a/c on already to give it a head start :-)
[14:06] <lotuspsychje> 28c here today, we went for few hours swim BluesKaj
[14:07] <BluesKaj> nice\
[14:07] <lotuspsychje> in tropical swimparadise
[14:08] <lotuspsychje> with outside pool
[14:12] <BluesKaj> we have a lake 2km away, but it's a beach, there's no dock to dive from
[14:12] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: water a bit clean?
[14:13] <BluesKaj> water's clean,  it's a spring fed mountain type lake
[14:13] <lotuspsychje> nice
[14:15] <BluesKaj> we don't have real mountains ,they're ancient shield mountains , billions of yrs old that have been ground down to a  few hundred meters at the highest points
[14:16] <BluesKaj> glaciers and manay ice ages later
[14:16] <lotuspsychje> nice
[14:16] <BluesKaj> it's ok
[14:17] <BluesKaj> lots of lakes in this area, very few people have pools, but many have summer cottages on the lakes
[14:18] <BluesKaj> or by the lakes rather
[14:18] <lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: but if it comes from the mountains, water is pretty cold right?
[14:19] <BluesKaj> yes, the local lake is still cool , it will be warm enough for swimming after this heat wave , 20C or so
[14:20] <BluesKaj> the water come from springs which are deep down in the earth's crust not from any mountain streams
[14:21] <lotuspsychje> i see
[14:23] <lotuspsychje> welcome mystic
[14:23] <mystic> thanks
[14:25] <mystic> i was in here yesterday
[14:25] <lotuspsychje> mystic: nice you found us
[14:25] <mystic> took the plunge and installed ubuntu on my ssd
[14:25] <sonicwind> hey lotuspsychje
[14:25] <lotuspsychje> mystic: ah your the guy with ubuntu sd persistent
[14:25] <lotuspsychje> hey sonicwind
[14:26] <sonicwind> everything still going well, mystic?
[14:26] <mystic> sd persisnetnt?
[14:26] <mystic> no ,just standard ubuntu i think
[14:26] <mystic> sorry, one hand typing, eating
[14:26] <lotuspsychje> mystic: did you have ubuntu installed on an sd card?
[14:27] <lotuspsychje> 64gig?
[14:27] <mystic> yes
[14:27] <mystic> lol
[14:27] <lotuspsychje> see its you :p
[14:27] <sonicwind> I use mine from an external docked HD
[14:27] <mystic> lol.. so it is
[14:27] <lordievader> How fast is that sd card?
[14:28] <lotuspsychje> we told him yesterday it would bottleneck ubuntu lordievader
[14:28] <lotuspsychje> thats why he installed on ssd now
[14:28] <lordievader> Hehehe, that is quite the difference ;)
[14:28] <mystic> im not sure
[14:28] <mystic> samsung evo
[14:29] <sonicwind> always good to make sure you have some sort of live media though... I can't believe how many times it has helped me
[14:29] <BluesKaj> sd would die from too many writes in no time at all, they good for booting a RPI tho
[14:30] <mystic> rpi?
[14:30] <BluesKaj> they're
[14:30] <lotuspsychje> mystic: raspbery pi
[14:30] <mystic> oh ok
[14:30] <BluesKaj> arm architecture
[14:31] <sonicwind> what made you decide to try Ubuntu, mystic?
[14:31]  * daftykins points at the penguin in the room
[14:31] <daftykins> it was him, he makes us all
[14:31] <lotuspsychje> lol
[14:31] <sonicwind> lol
[14:31] <BluesKaj> hehe
[14:31] <mystic> ben trying it on and off for yours.   ther ewas always something about it i liked, the aesthetic.. but in the past i could never get enough done on it.  but now it seems its evolved enough for a relative newbie like me to use
[14:32] <BluesKaj> mystic, perhaps your experience has "eveolved" :-)
[14:32] <lotuspsychje> yeah penguin got it nice togheter this time
[14:32] <mystic> hardly lol
[14:33] <BluesKaj> oops evolved
[14:33] <sonicwind> I'm just past 2 1/2 years in... I had enough of M$ and decided it was worth a try... still have a Win 7 system, but using Ubuntu more
[14:33] <mystic> uhuh
[14:33] <mystic> i like wind 7.. just a bit heavy
[14:33] <mystic> win*
[14:34] <lotuspsychje> i dont have the patience anymore for windows
[14:34] <sonicwind> I love w7... but I know it isn't going to last forever
[14:34] <sonicwind> and I'll be damned if I'm ever going to give MS another chance at something else
[14:34] <daftykins> only 18 more months until 7 goes EOL in fact
[14:34] <mystic> lol
[14:34] <lotuspsychje> perhaps windows 11 sonicwind :p
[14:34] <mystic> eol?
[14:34] <daftykins> end of life
[14:35] <lotuspsychje> !eol | mystic
[14:35] <mystic> ohh
[14:35] <BluesKaj> W7 is a good OS , W10 is awful
[14:35] <daftykins> works for me :)
[14:35] <BluesKaj> heh
[14:36] <sonicwind> I stopped upgrading my Win 7 system years ago... never been more stable. Yes, I have everything else covered... NoScript, AdBlockPlus, etc.
[14:36] <sonicwind> updating
[14:36] <sonicwind> I swear MS puts out crap updates so people go out and buy new systems.
[14:37] <daftykins> Windows Update on 7 did go funny since 10's release, but i have the 3 updates you need to fix that in a zip
[14:37] <daftykins> also, when they released the May 2016 update rollup which was essentially as close to a Service Pack 2 as Windows 7 was ever going to get, i made up my own custom ISO with it integrated
[14:37] <sonicwind> thankfully I stopped updating Win 7 *before* all their updates to force you to Win 10
[14:37] <daftykins> so whenever i have the misfortune of needing to reinstall 7 instead of move to 10 for a client, i install from that, apply the 3 updates in the zip, then Windows Update is fine
[14:37] <BluesKaj> i gave up on Windows , Kubuntu does what i need without much fuss
[14:38] <daftykins> yeah they stopped releasing those actually, so that's a moot point now
[14:38] <daftykins> i have plenty of clients on 7 that are running it fine
[14:38] <mystic> win 10 is a bit  hit and miss for me.  but can be ok for a basic user.  i hated how they prety much forced the update on to eveyone tho.   my two other old computers were running win 7, and win 10 install popped up. it didint work properly on both
[14:38] <mystic> scandalous
[14:38] <sonicwind> I still don't trust that they stopped doing those, daftykins
[14:38] <daftykins> well i can tell you it's fact :)
[14:38] <sonicwind> they completely violated my trust over the years
[14:39] <daftykins> didn't get any trouble with the alleged forcing of updates myself
[14:39] <daftykins> i firmly believe that the people who ended up moved to 10 clicked something as part of their standard rushed attempts to dismiss on-screen prompts
[14:39] <lotuspsychje> yeah a steady hand can get any Os straight
[14:40] <daftykins> lotus' tale from the other morning of a 'buntu customer who hadn't been installing updates continues to seal my confidence that users are the same no matter which OS you're on :D
[14:40] <lotuspsychje> true this
[14:41] <sonicwind> too many of the updates screw things up, regardless of the OS it seems... I've learned to keep a backup. Just recently read about Timeshift and plan to try that out.
[14:42] <daftykins> yeah no argument there from me
[14:42] <daftykins> MS did some kinda USB driver screwup the other day, it only affected a friends wifes PC though :D
[14:42] <sonicwind> I'm using fsarchiver for the backup
[14:42] <mystic> shame ubuntu doesnt have a system image back up option
[14:42] <lotuspsychje> !backup
[14:42] <daftykins> no USB devices would work so you couldn't even use mouse+kb to interact with it - i have some old PS/2 peripherals though so they brought it to me
[14:43] <daftykins> there are plenty of options :)
[14:43] <mystic> but not sure a system imag eback up is one of them?
[14:43] <mystic> clonezilla maybe
[14:43] <mystic> but u may have t orun windows for that
[14:43] <daftykins> no you don't
[14:44] <daftykins> it's a bootable Linux ISO
[14:44] <mystic> hmm
[14:44] <daftykins> but full system is a total waste of time
[14:44] <lotuspsychje> agree
[14:44] <mystic> systme image is good for me i think
[14:44] <sonicwind> mystic check out fsarchiver
[14:44] <mystic> saves me reinstalling the tweaks and fixes etc
[14:44] <daftykins> you'd be better off learning to script them for a new install :>
[14:44] <lotuspsychje> mystic: just abckup /home with all config files?
[14:44] <mystic> sounds dangeroulsy difficult lol
[14:44] <lotuspsychje> backup
[14:45] <daftykins> but if you're planning to require a full reimage theeeen i think it's fair to say you're planning to fail with the OS to begin with :D
[14:45] <mystic> fail how?
[14:45] <daftykins> with the idea that you'd have to revert to said backup
[14:46] <daftykins> another approach -> 'buntu OS installed on the SSD, but /home on a 2 disk RAID1 volume
[14:46] <mystic> not a fail for me, just a safety measure.  after ages of tweaking, why relearn or go thru al lthat again
[14:46] <daftykins> that'd be the ideal
[14:46] <lotuspsychje> mystic: choosing an LTS, installing tweaks every 5 years?
[14:46] <daftykins> well you'll be surprised how quickly things change on any desktop OS anyway, what you learn today could be useless next month
[14:47] <mystic> every 5 years is fine.. but if it fails in between, id have to do again
[14:47] <daftykins> hence RAID that /home :)
[14:47] <mystic> i only have one disk in this laptop though
[14:47] <lotuspsychje> mystic: ubuntu doesnt just fail in between easy
[14:47] <mystic> hmm
[14:47] <mystic> disks can though
[14:48] <lotuspsychje> unless you have bad disk yeah, and that daftykins solution
[14:48] <mystic> which one lol
[14:48] <lotuspsychje> mystic: also first lesson ever, make a second backup of your data
[14:49] <lotuspsychje> raid on /home
[14:49] <mystic> i dont know raid.  and i only have one ssd in this laptop
[14:49] <mystic> this is why i just like a system cloner
[14:49] <mystic> just done with
[14:49] <lotuspsychje> mystic: you can also choose backing up to external media
[14:50] <mystic>  ialso have a 'cliclkfree'  external hdd with some data on it, but cant access it with ubuntu
[14:50] <sonicwind> I back stuff up to a separate external HD, and in the process of putting what data I can on pcloud and/or protonmail
[14:51] <daftykins> laptops :(
[14:51] <daftykins> mystic: no reason you shouldn't be able to, unless you mean files that need Windows only software
[14:51] <sonicwind> what is a "clickfree" hd?
[14:51] <lotuspsychje> a home NAS can be great :p
[14:52] <daftykins> ^
[14:52] <sonicwind> ok
[14:52] <mystic> its a hdd with built in software, aut oback up kinda stuff
[14:53] <mystic> which infortunately means it wont even open in ubuntu
[14:53] <lotuspsychje> one touch backup?
[14:53] <daftykins> sounds crap
[14:53] <lotuspsychje> lol
[14:53] <mystic> something like that i think
[14:53] <lotuspsychje> what brand, what format mystic ?
[14:53] <mystic> clickfree
[14:53] <mystic> probably ntfs
[14:55] <daftykins> it sounds like one of the typical drives that offers encryption features and so on, the USB bridge chip presents as two devices - one is the HDD - the other is a small volume of software
[14:55] <daftykins> typically the software then offers the encryption element so can lock the drive portion from the user
[14:55] <lotuspsychje> =trashbin
[14:56] <daftykins> yep or just a total format to bypass all that junk
[14:56] <daftykins> it could also be implemented on-disk with two partitions
[14:56] <mystic> its fine in windows
[14:56] <lotuspsychje> mystic: perhaps take a look on that thing with gparted
[14:56] <mystic> i just turn of fthe clickfree process trhe naccess my stuff normally
[14:56] <mystic> cant access it with ubuntu tho
[14:57] <mystic> may try gparted yea
[14:57] <lotuspsychje> mystic: perhaps take alook on that thing with gparted
[14:57] <daftykins> just show is how it looks right now plugged in
[14:57] <daftykins> sudo parted -l | pastebinit
[14:57] <daftykins> *show us
[14:58] <daftykins> my fingers are trolling me with vowels it seems
[14:58] <lotuspsychje> lol
[14:59] <mystic> how to screen capture?
[14:59] <daftykins> why would you need to
[15:00] <daftykins> or do you mean in general other than running the command above? :>
[15:01] <mystic> i didnt see it
[15:01] <daftykins> but it's right up there ^
[15:01] <mystic> i didnt know it a a command
[15:01] <mystic> im not used to it
[15:01] <mystic> eiterh way, it only shows my internall ssd
[15:02] <mystic> no info of the clickfree at all
[15:06] <daftykins> and it's definitely plugged in by USB?
[15:06] <daftykins> the full command i typed would give you a URL to share here, so i can't be sure you're doing it right
[15:06] <daftykins> there's also "lsusb | pastebinit" which may show the device plugged in
[15:06] <mystic> im supposedto put pasbinnit also?
[15:07] <mystic> ok, i thought you were telling me to 'paste bin it' myself
[15:07] <mystic> bloody terminal codes...
[15:07] <daftykins> that would have spaces and a sequence of english that makes sense :)
[15:07] <mystic> i thought it was aquick slng rewuest
[15:07] <mystic> request
[15:07] <mystic> slang*
[15:07] <daftykins> then it wouldn't be in quotes either
[15:08] <mystic> its not
[15:09] <mystic> sudo parted -l | pastebinit
[15:09] <mystic> [sudo] password for mystic:
[15:09] <mystic> Command 'pastebinit' not found, but can be installed with:
[15:09] <daftykins> by that i meant my second command
[15:10] <daftykins> you're just being picky now :)
[15:10] <mystic> jeez..  how do i know  lol
[15:10] <daftykins> you need to ask when you don't know
[15:10] <mystic> i was asking
[15:10] <daftykins> yeah ok, so pastebinit isn't installed, so "sudo apt update && sudo apt install pastebinit" <-- that's a command :)
[15:10] <mystic> but cant follow that if its not clear for begginers
[15:11] <daftykins> yes with the first one i should have said "you need to run this in a terminal"
[15:12] <mystic> whats supposedto happen after pastebinnit?
[15:12] <mystic> nothing showing
[15:13] <daftykins> it'd likely ask for your user password first, to allow using sudo
[15:13] <daftykins> or if not, it should've installed the package
[15:13] <mystic> it didnt
[15:13] <mystic> it installed
[15:13] <mystic> im talking about your other command
[15:14] <mystic> pastebinit
[15:14] <mystic> nothing happened
[15:14] <daftykins> no... it was "lsusb | pastebinit"
[15:14] <mystic> you rtold me they wer etwo seperate commands lol
[15:14] <mystic> so i seperated them
[15:15] <daftykins> by that i meant "lsusb | pastebinit" and "sudo parted -l | pastebinit"
[15:15] <daftykins> you have to be doing this on purpose because nobody is this challenged :P
[15:15] <mystic> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/KYSqZWwXgj/
[15:15] <mystic> no,, im fine on windows.. ubuntu is just shite for beginners
[15:15] <mystic> how do i knw owat u meant.. never done it before
[15:16] <daftykins> i'm talking about understanding that a single thing counts as text on one line between two "
[15:16] <mystic> nevermind
[15:16] <daftykins> other than mystery device on line 4 then, it's not giving up a lot of info
[15:16] <mystic> doesnt work anyway
[15:16] <daftykins> never say 'doesn't work' in IT, that's the most useless two words ever
[15:16] <daftykins> "i tried x, y happened, i expected z"
[15:17] <daftykins> anywho, time for a new external HDD :D
[15:17] <mystic> or just go bac kto windows lol
[15:17] <mystic> stuf fworks without having to learn terminal code
[15:17] <mystic> or have people hinting that im a retard
[15:19] <daftykins> this is why desktop Linux is a bit of a joke still to me (i don't use it) because you can't do all the things graphically
[15:19] <daftykins> but this is true of Windows at the intermediate level too, gotta dip into command line
[16:00] <sonicwind> didn't know about pastebinit... pretty slick... https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Pastebinit
[16:00] <sonicwind> yet another thing to add to my install to-do list
[16:00] <daftykins> though since it's not installed as default, surprisingly, it's more useful to pipe to netcat
[16:00] <daftykins> commandhere | nc termbin.com 9999
[16:01] <sonicwind> easier to remember pastebinit :-)
[16:01] <daftykins> yeah but sometimes we help people that the installation would be yet another delay for
[16:01] <sonicwind> right
[16:01] <daftykins> or their install might be broken and they can't install, at that moment in time
[16:01] <daftykins> also recently i've seen pastebinit give URLs back with no paste ID ;/
[16:06] <sonicwind> neat... only vaguely familiar with netcat... just tried that out
[16:26] <mystic> cant start my windows 10 in virtual box
[16:26] <mystic> 'VT-x is disabled in the BIOS for all CPU modes (VERR_VMX_MSR_ALL_VMX_DISABLED).'
[16:26] <mystic> please advise
[16:26] <mystic> sorry, wrong room
[16:31] <daftykins> you need to enable virtualisation in your BIOS
[16:32] <daftykins> when you turn on the system, assuming this is the laptop you mentioned, when you see the manufacturer logo (or even slightly before) you have to press F2 or delete, (it's different per brand) which lets you enter BIOS setup
[16:32] <daftykins> you can turn on virtualisation technologies inside there, but only if supported by that laptop (some hide the setting, or don't even offer it)
[16:59] <pauljw> hi everyone
[17:48] <BluesKaj> hi pauljw
[17:49] <pauljw> hey BluesKaj, how's things?
[17:50] <BluesKaj> ok here pauljw, still hot tho. how about you
[17:50] <BluesKaj> ?
[17:51] <pauljw> yeah, very hot here, too.  real feel: 107F going up to 108F, same tomorrow.
[17:52] <BluesKaj> gawd
[17:52] <pauljw> :)
[17:54] <BluesKaj> we have close 100F "feels like" degrees/index
[17:55] <pauljw> it's miserable but we're hanging on inside even though the a/c went out yesterday afternoon.
[17:55] <BluesKaj> ouch
[17:57] <pauljw> inconvenient, makes me happy that we rent.  haven't bothered the landlord with it yet, it's a holiday so he won't be getting anyone out today.  will let him know in a bit so he can get on it in the morning.  :)
[17:58]  * BluesKaj nods
[17:59] <BluesKaj> started the a/c early to get a head start, it was still 77F in the house at 6 this morning
[18:02] <BluesKaj> it's supposed to pass tomorrow evening , should be normal temps on fri, 75-80F during the day
[18:05] <daftykins> pauljw: glad i'm not dropping by in summer ;)
[18:09] <BluesKaj> guess i'll take walk to the mail box...bbiab
[18:10] <daftykins> well, if it's good enough for Versace...
[18:12] <pauljw> heheh... well, it's normally not an issue.  but i agree, glad no one is here for this.
[18:12] <daftykins> :>
[18:13] <daftykins> very warm and humid here too, i'm in shorts and t-shirt mode for sure
[18:13] <daftykins> bare feet around the house to keep cool
[18:13] <pauljw> we have ceiling fans and the whole house fan which i opened the intake vent in the basement so it's bringing some cooler basement air up.
[18:14] <daftykins> that's neat, Lorie's place has fans but i've not seen what they can do
[18:14] <pauljw> i don't do bare feet, every time i hit my toes on something that doesn't move... :(
[18:14] <daftykins> oof
[18:31] <mystic> so clueless gets to stay but im kicked, yet he insulted me first
[18:31] <mystic> i like the way you ubuntu cats roll lol
[19:01] <hggdh> mystic: the issue there is you would not stop
[19:01] <mystic> i didn tstart it, thats the issue
[19:02] <mystic> then he expects me to  accept his 'help'  when he decides to be 'nice'
[19:02] <mystic> i dont bend over like that, sorry
[19:02] <tsimonq2> B/or
[19:02] <tsimonq2> whoops
[19:03] <hggdh> so you got banned. I fail to see how this helped you
[19:03] <mystic> being banned from a ubuntu chat room is better then bending over
[19:03] <hggdh> OK.
[19:04] <mystic> now, can anyone help me get wine working, or i will have to do a win10 reinstall
[19:04] <mystic> one or the other
[19:05] <coconut_> mystic: install windows, you have given up on linux already.
[19:06] <mystic> i was insulted in here ,then insulted in the other room
[19:07] <mystic> now im asking again, and u reply with some gnarly comment
[19:07] <mystic> lol
[19:07] <hggdh> coconut_: just don't
[19:08] <hggdh> mystic: and you, please do not start here
[19:08] <mystic> go to puppy linux room and see how to treat other human beings
[19:08] <mystic> i didn tstart
[19:08] <mystic> i was started on
[19:08] <hggdh> mystic: I do not care. If you keep going, you will be out of here as well
[19:08] <BluesKaj> mystic, you blame everyone for one person's ignorance
[19:08] <mystic> oh, at least 2 people
[19:09] <hggdh> mystic: stop.
[19:09] <mystic> help me then
[19:09] <mystic> then i can leave
[19:09] <daftykins> you're going to need to accept your own abilities and take the advice given as it is offered, otherwise this isn't the place for you
[19:14] <pauljw> gotta run for a bit, going to find an air-conditioned restaurant for dinner... bbl.
[19:43] <daftykins> hehe poor paul
[20:50] <oerheks> hggdh, maybe gamblore runs into this https://www.theindy.us/is-firefox-lying-to-users-about-viruses-in-downloads/
[21:12] <hggdh> oerheks: he might, but I think his issue was DNS cache
[21:12] <hggdh> I generically consider these type of warnings as uselessly dangerous
[21:14] <oerheks> yes, sometimes hilarious..
[21:14] <oerheks> https://www.dropbox.com/s/eakrho2sfpgdvbw/virusaanval.png?dl=0
[21:14] <oerheks> old one, 2011 or so
[21:15] <hggdh> heh
[21:16] <oerheks> c: drive .. spaces in folder names.. i was questioning myself too
[21:20] <daftykins> spaces in folders have been fine on Windows for years :)
[21:23] <oerheks> sure, C: drives too
[21:23] <oerheks> :-D
[21:23] <oerheks> but basicly, i think it is nuts, spaces in names
[21:24] <daftykins> sure is annoying for script making :>
[21:24] <oerheks> or irc user names that start with _ or ^
[21:24] <daftykins> ah those symbols are easy on a UK keyboard ;D
[21:27] <daftykins> $ mv Rise\ of\ the\ Tomb\ Raider\ 8K\ 4320p60\ Gameplay\ Titan\ X\ Pascal\ 4\ Way\ SLI\ Gaming\ 4K\ _\ 5K\ _\ 8K\ and\ Beyond-FcvmrTsZuDM.webm RotTR-8K.webm
[21:27] <daftykins> :D
[22:02] <hggdh> yeah. They suck, these spaces


[02:31] <mup> PR snapd#13292 opened: o/state: implement core support for Notices <Created by olivercalder> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13292>
[07:12] <mup> PR snapd#13149 closed: interfaces/microstack-support: read access to /proc/task/sched{,stat} <Created by hemanthnakkina> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13149>
[07:12] <mup> PR snapd#13150 closed: i/b/microceph: allow more access for microceph-support <Created by sabaini> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13150>
[08:53] <mup> PR snapcraft#4400 opened: Return 1 if any remote-build failed <Created by Hook25> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/4400>
[09:33] <mup> PR snapd#13288 closed: packaging: fix unneeded errtracker patches <Squash-merge> <Created by andrewphelpsj> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13288>
[10:49] <mup> PR snapd#12607 closed: configcore: allow to run core configuration on classic via env <Precious but later :heart:> <Needs Documentation -auto-> <Created by mvo5> <Closed by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/12607>
[10:49] <mup> PR snapd#12919 closed: tests: add test that explores `apparmor_parser {,no-}expr-simplify` <Precious but later :heart:> <Created by mvo5> <Closed by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/12919>
[10:49] <mup> PR snapd#13065 closed: snap-confine: extract helper from sc_join_preserved_{per_user,}_ns <Needs security review> <Precious but later :heart:> <Created by mvo5> <Closed by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13065>
[12:44] <mup> PR snapd#13235 closed: overlord/notices: /v2/notices POC <need-architecture-review> <Needs Documentation -auto-> <Created by Meulengracht> <Closed by Meulengracht> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13235>
[12:54] <mup> PR snapd#13293 opened: interfaces: add console-conf interface <Created by kubiko> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13293>
[13:55] <mup> PR snapd#12938 closed: tests: revert skip uc20 create partitions encrypt <⛔ Blocked> <Simple 😃> <Created by sergiocazzolato> <Closed by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/12938>
[14:10] <mup> PR snapd#13294 opened: i/b/fwupd.go: Allow write access to COD capsule update directory <Created by valentindavid> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13294>
[14:15] <mup> PR snapd#13295 opened: testing failures <Created by andrewphelpsj> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13295>
[15:20] <mup> PR snapd#13296 opened: o/devicestate: copy seed on finish install API call, for UC <Run nested> <Created by alfonsosanchezbeato> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13296>
[16:11] <mup> PR snapd#13297 opened: aspects: support "number" type in aspect schemas <aspects> <Created by MiguelPires> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13297>
[17:41] <mup> PR snapd#13298 opened: o/snapstate: fix flaky local cleanup test <Created by MiguelPires> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13298>
[19:52] <mup> PR snapd#13295 closed: testing failures <Created by andrewphelpsj> <Closed by andrewphelpsj> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13295>


[18:59] <salgado> (completely forgot to add my name to the topic, sorry)
[19:21] <salgado> rockstar, you up for reviewing some massive removals?
[19:59] <rockstar> salgado, I'm not actually reviewing, but yes!
[20:00] <salgado> rockstar, oh, no need to worry, then.  it's not urgent, but if you'd like I certainly wouldn't mind. :)
[20:00] <salgado> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~salgado/launchpad/remove-logintoken-unused-code/+merge/22719
[23:13] <jpds> sinzui: Hey, did you have time to look at my c_d_m model branch?
[23:14] <sinzui> jpds, yes
[23:30] <jpds> sinzui: Could we possibly land it now?
[23:30] <sinzui> yes, sorry. I was distracted by my son. I will land it now. I think your changes were great
[23:34] <jpds> sinzui: No worries, thanks!


[14:30] <cpaelzer> hey
[14:31] <didrocks> o/ (for once, in a meeting, but mostly around)
[14:31] <cpaelzer> #startmeeting Weekly Main Inclusion Requests status
[14:31] <meetingology> Meeting started at 14:31:27 UTC.  The chair is cpaelzer.  Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
[14:31] <meetingology> Available commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick
[14:31] <cpaelzer> Ping for MIR meeting - didrocks joalif slyon sarnold cpaelzer jamespage ( eslerm dviererbe )
[14:31] <slyon> o/
[14:31] <eslerm_> o/
[14:31] <dviererbe> o/
[14:31] <cpaelzer> Let us see if the release week is calm or already showing a barrage for next cycle
[14:31] <cpaelzer> #topic current component mismatches
[14:31] <cpaelzer> Mission: Identify required actions and spread the load among the teams
[14:31] <cpaelzer> #link https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.svg
[14:32] <cpaelzer> #link https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.svg
[14:32] <cpaelzer> empty but the known false positive
[14:32] <cpaelzer> #topic New MIRs
[14:32] <cpaelzer> Mission: ensure to assign all incoming reviews for fast processing
[14:32] <slyon> cpaelzer: thanks for promoting all the recent mismatches!
[14:32] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?field.searchtext=&orderby=-date_last_updated&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&assignee_option=none&field.assignee=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[14:32] <cpaelzer> np slyon, it was my contribution to get the release ready
[14:32] <cpaelzer> list is empty as well
[14:32] <cpaelzer> #topic Incomplete bugs / questions
[14:32] <cpaelzer> Mission: Identify required actions and spread the load among the teams
[14:32] <sarnold> good morning
[14:32] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?field.searchtext=&orderby=-date_last_updated&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[14:33] <cpaelzer> one case not yet discussed (6 days old AFAICS)
[14:33] <cpaelzer> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-reportlab/+bug/2028054
[14:33] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2028054 in hplip (Ubuntu) "[MIR] python-rlpycairo" [Undecided, Confirmed]
[14:34] <slyon> nothing new here, I guess.
[14:34] <slyon> can stay as-is, or be set to Invalid..
[14:34] <cpaelzer> a good explanation on why things can be not in main
[14:34] <cpaelzer> thanks Till
[14:34] <slyon> gentle reminder for sarnold to have a brief look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nbd/+bug/2054480 -- but it will be post Noble at this point.
[14:34] <cpaelzer> can stay as-is
[14:34] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2054480 in nbd (Ubuntu) "[MIR] nbd-client" [Undecided, Incomplete]
[14:35] <slyon> (so take your time)
[14:35] <sarnold> slyon: aye :( it's beena  busy week. last time around I forgot this, time around around I deprioritized it :(
[14:35] <cpaelzer> ack to have this early in 24.10
[14:35] <cpaelzer> sarnold: understandable, and now the ship has sailed - so take your time
[14:35] <sarnold> :(
[14:35] <cpaelzer> do not be sad!
[14:35] <cpaelzer> #topic Process/Documentation improvements
[14:35] <cpaelzer> Mission: Review pending process/documentation pull-requests or issues
[14:35] <cpaelzer> #link https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/pulls
[14:36] <cpaelzer> #link https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/issues
[14:36] <cpaelzer> two newer cases worth to discuss
[14:36] <cpaelzer> https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/issues/54
[14:36] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Issue 54 in canonical/ubuntu-mir "Remove libgoa from the upstream redflags" [Open]
[14:36] <cpaelzer> +1 from me as well
[14:36] <slyon> +1 for dropping the libgoa-* restriction!
[14:36] <cpaelzer> any objections, maybe we miss why it was excluded
[14:37] <slyon> This is related to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/msgraph/+bug/2060035
[14:37] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2060035 in msgraph (Ubuntu) "[MIR] msgraph" [Undecided, Fix Released]
[14:37] <didrocks> +1 too
[14:37] <sarnold> it's funny, I had the impression goa overall was deprecated or similar?
[14:38] <eslerm_> I have not looked into libgoa deeply. It sounds reasonable due to webkit removal, but extra attention around oauth2 sounds useful as well
[14:39] <cpaelzer> would that extra attention need effort?
[14:39] <cpaelzer> or is it just a benefit of the new goa handling it that way?
[14:40] <eslerm_> it is certainly a much better scenario than including webkit
[14:40] <cpaelzer> ok, then I think I'll land a change as requested
[14:40] <cpaelzer> thanks for the discussion
[14:41] <cpaelzer> Next is an absolutely valid complain https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/issues/55
[14:41] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Issue 55 in canonical/ubuntu-mir "end-of-cycle unexpected changes" [Open]
[14:41] <sarnold> +441 -1334  :D :D :D
[14:41] <cpaelzer> hehe @sarnold
[14:41] <cpaelzer> was that a rush - yes
[14:41] <cpaelzer> but no one had better options
[14:42] <cpaelzer> Instead of just shrudding I usually aim for lessons learned and improvements
[14:42] <sarnold> indeed, what I'm hoping to come of this is perhaps an idea of how some automation could be built to help us find cases half-way through a cycle
[14:42] <cpaelzer> In this particular case i can tell you that the reason for it was a loss of ownership between 4 teams
[14:42] <cpaelzer> and the fix is also already clear, we have concluded who owns it (will be CPC) properly and that will be in place in a bit
[14:42] <cpaelzer> working with Eric on this
[14:42] <cpaelzer> the other outcome is something along the suggestion of sarnold
[14:43] <cpaelzer> how to detect "unmaintained" earlier/better
[14:43] <cpaelzer> but just to mention, this was known to be unmaintained - yet it fell into the responsibility cracks
[14:43] <didrocks> I would put unmaintained equating multiple owners, which ends up to no owners
[14:44] <cpaelzer> didrocks: exactly
[14:44] <cpaelzer> didrocks: at least the chance of behaving that way
[14:44] <cpaelzer> does anyone have code to check project health in a sane way this could be built upon?
[14:45] <cpaelzer> Hmm
[14:45] <sarnold> in some sense there's probably too many "project health" metrics that exist and could be used, and none probably has enough signal to noise
[14:45] <didrocks> nothing comes to mind, I think this task needs a proper owner (pun intended) with research to provide metrics + ubuntu specifity and so on…
[14:45] <cpaelzer> This might be a step in the release process
[14:45] <cpaelzer> like Release -x weeks
[14:45] <sarnold> didrocks: lol :)
[14:45] <cpaelzer> check all your subscribed packages if they are maintainable
[14:46] <didrocks> maybe a first easy step is how long since the last package update?
[14:46] <didrocks> not a very good metric, but sounds an easy one enough (we need to exclude pure rebuild-only upload though)
[14:46] <didrocks> that would mean some maintainance, but a random definition of "some" :)
[14:47] <sarnold> how long since a new upstream release?
[14:47] <slyon> There's the Canonical spec CT002, which might help with that..
[14:48] <slyon> "CT002 - Supply Chain Community Analytics"
[14:48] <sarnold> heh :( the search function doesn't find find it via 'ct002' or 'suppl'
[14:48] <didrocks> (I don’t have access to it)
[14:49] <sarnold> .. and the site lacks the usual 'report a bug on this site' -- who owns this site to report a bug that it lacks a bug report link? :)
[14:49] <slyon> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tUrHVI-EIC7vJ4QmOkr_SoJX7b4ykSyoxVffGPwgLBw <- Canonical employees should be able to access this
[14:49] <didrocks> sarnold: heh :)
[14:50] <didrocks> thanks slyon
[14:50] <jbicha> sarnold: GNOME devs seem a bit meh about GNOME Online Accounts in a world with lots of sandboxed apps; I think UOA may have had a better architecture for that. But meanwhile GOA is still useful for the base desktop
[14:50] <cpaelzer> Updating the issue
[14:51] <slyon> I think they are planing some recurring porject health checks, which we might be able to rely upon
[14:51] <sarnold> jbicha: hmm, I hadn't thought about sandboxing here.. I can see why that would influence their thinking. but if it's not explicitly dead, yay.
[14:52] <cpaelzer> updated the case, it will stay open until there is an owner to work on the tooling and/or the discussion to get it into the release process
[14:52] <cpaelzer> thanks for the input on GOA jbicha
[14:53] <cpaelzer> going on in the agenda
[14:53] <cpaelzer> #topic MIR related Security Review Queue
[14:53] <cpaelzer> Mission: Check on progress, do deadlines seem doable?
[14:53] <cpaelzer> Some clients can only work with one, some with the other escaping - the URLs point to the same place.
[14:53] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/+bugs?field.searchtext=%5BMIR%5D&assignee_option=choose&field.assignee=ubuntu-security&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[14:53] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/+bugs?field.searchtext=[MIR]&assignee_option=choose&field.assignee=ubuntu-security&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[14:53] <cpaelzer> Internal link
[14:53] <cpaelzer> - ensure your teams items are prioritized among each other as you'd expect
[14:53] <cpaelzer> - ensure community requests do not get stomped by teams calling for favors too much
[14:53] <cpaelzer> #link https://warthogs.atlassian.net/jira/software/c/projects/SEC/boards/594
[14:53] <cpaelzer> thanks for having the boto stack there
[14:53] <cpaelzer> all else looks as I'd expect
[14:55] <sarnold> eslerm_ knocked out the libyuv mir while traveling :)
[14:55] <slyon> thank you so much!
[14:56] <sarnold> otherwise seems to be mostly known states
[14:56] <cpaelzer> great
[14:56] <cpaelzer> #topic Any other business?
[14:56] <slyon> nothign
[14:56] <sarnold> thanks for making this the smoothest lts cycle that I remember
[14:57] <slyon> do I hear sarcasm there? Or does it just relate to the MIR process?
[14:57] <didrocks> I really appreciate how the security part is now predictable and working well!
[14:58] <sarnold> it took a lot of concerted work from a lot of people to prune dependencies, work with upstreams, and figure out how to get things done predictably
[14:58] <didrocks> on the smooth part, I would say at least for me that the MIR part woud qualify as such :)
[14:58] <didrocks> would*
[14:58] <sarnold> slyon: the MIR process -- xz was  a thing, but you and vorlon and crew managed to keep us on schedule all the same
[14:59] <cpaelzer> yeah
[14:59] <slyon> indeed, MIRs were mostly well planned and executed this cycle!
[14:59] <cpaelzer> that thanks I definetly share
[14:59] <cpaelzer> in the past MIR process weird, Release easy - now the inverse :-)
[14:59] <eslerm_> thanks everyone :)
[15:00] <cpaelzer> I'll call the meeting done with these nice words
[15:00] <cpaelzer> onto another good cycle (for the things we can influence)
[15:00] <sarnold> :)
[15:00] <cpaelzer> #endmeeting
[15:00] <meetingology> Meeting ended at 15:00:17 UTC.  Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2024/ubuntu-meeting.2024-04-23-14.31.moin.txt
[15:00] <didrocks> sounds like a nice way to end up the cycle! :)
[15:00] <sarnold> thanks cpaelzer, all
[15:00] <didrocks> thanks!
[15:00] <slyon> thanks cpaelzer, all! o/
[15:00] <eslerm_> o/
[18:59] <amurray> o/
[19:00] <seb128> hey
[19:01] <amurray> hey seb128
[19:01] <seb128> bah, looks like I forgot to update the wiki after the previous meeting!
[19:01] <seb128> https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2024/04/09/%23ubuntu-meeting.html
[19:01] <seb128> "Next chair will be vorlon, with sil2100 as backup"
[19:01] <seb128> Steve sent apologies
[19:02] <seb128> I expect Lukasz is busy on release week but he didn't decline/send an email, let me ping him
[19:02] <seb128> Robie declined the calendar invite
[19:04] <seb128> amurray, Lukasz doesn't seem to be online...
[19:04] <seb128> it's not really surprising that on release week that people are busy with other things
[19:05] <seb128> amurray, should we just skip that one?
[19:05] <amurray> yeah, fair enough
[19:06] <seb128> alright, I will update the wiki with the content with the previous meeting and bump the next meeting date / keep the chairs
[19:06] <amurray> also the next one is scheduled during the product roadmap - so I assume we'll skip that too and so next TB meeting would be 21st may
[19:06] <seb128> amurray, thanks and have a nice day!
[19:06] <seb128> ah, fair comment, I will do that directly and email the list about  it
[19:06] <amurray> cheers - you too - have a good night :)
[19:06] <seb128> thanks :)


 Do I have rwwbian? no, I don't.
[01:04]  * Unit193 wonders if rww knows he's ranting against Unit193. :D
[01:04] <rww> i'm just ranting with no specific target, it's a character flaw
[01:05] <Unit193> I do know, yes.   :P
[13:47] <sxunil> I have a complaint against popey . He is a bully that just randomly bans people.
[13:47] <bazhang> sxunil, thats not correct
[13:47] <chu> I'm not sure it actually was random.
[13:49] <chu> Disgusting.
[13:49] <sxunil> Wait .


[02:44] <vorlon> force-badtest autopkgtest/5.10ubuntu1/amd64 autopkgtest/5.10ubuntu1/i386
[02:44] <vorlon> yay
[07:44] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected ubuntu-release-upgrader [source] (disco-proposed) [1:<IP_ADDRESS>]
[08:50] <Laney> vorlon: When removing packages per-architecture, can you start looking at reverse test-deps too please?
[08:50] <Laney> dbus-test-runner/ppc64el broken by bustle removal
[08:50] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: ubuntu-release-upgrader (disco-proposed/main) [1:<IP_ADDRESS> => 1:<IP_ADDRESS>] (core)
[09:18] <LocutusOfBorg>  Suggests: bustle
[09:18] <LocutusOfBorg> Laney, ^^ you mean that?
[09:18] <LocutusOfBorg> its not even a real dependency... :/
[09:19] <Laney> LocutusOfBorg: I said test-deps
[09:19] <LocutusOfBorg> so, the real build has no bustle support, and the test builds with it...
[09:19] <LocutusOfBorg> Laney, I was saying that the test is enabling features that nobody can use?
[09:19] <Laney> it's perfectly valid for a test to use its own dependencies
[09:20] <LocutusOfBorg> and I agree, but why test a feature that is not really built and used in the archive?
[09:20] <LocutusOfBorg> anyhow, I wish I could have a way with reverse-depends to pick up tests/control packages...
[09:21] <Laney> packages don't exist only to serve the Ubuntu archive
[09:21] <Laney> If a package offers a feature, it is legitimate to test that it works
[09:22] <LocutusOfBorg> it would be legitimate to build it too in the archive, unless I'm missing something obvious...
[09:23] <LocutusOfBorg> I'm not saying that "testing the matrix of various configurations" is something useless to do, but it is something that upstream should do, not Ubuntu :)
[09:23] <Laney> you're muddying the waters by attacking this case btw
[09:24] <LocutusOfBorg> this case is my fault, so I want to understand and possibly help to fix it
[09:26] <Laney> OK, you can use dbus-test-runner with bustle if you want to, it had a test to check that this functionality worked, bustle was removed so the test can't be run any more
[09:27] <LocutusOfBorg> ok, so we can change the test to not run with bustle? I wish I could fix bustle, I asked for help, but there is no upstream activity
[09:28] <LocutusOfBorg> even the new release is building a little bit more, but not up to the end
[09:28] <Laney> I mean that's what the test is, it's called 'with-bustle' ...
[09:29] <Laney> I'm not particularly saying that it was wrong to remove this binary (I don't know the case)
[09:29] <Laney> more asking for tests to be checked in the same way that in-archive reverse-build and reverse-binary deps are
[09:30] <LocutusOfBorg> [11:20:59] <LocutusOfBorg> anyhow, I wish I could have a way with reverse-depends to pick up tests/control packages...
[09:30] <LocutusOfBorg> this is why I said this ^^ I would like to avoid next time the same issue, to have a way to do it
[09:31] <Laney> laney@disco:~$ xzcat /srv/mirrors/ubuntu/dists/eoan/*/source/Sources.xz | grep-dctrl -FTestsuite-Triggers -sPackage bustle
[09:31] <Laney> Package: dbus-test-runner
[09:31] <LocutusOfBorg> thanks
[09:32] <LocutusOfBorg> now I have to find a way to download that file
[09:34] <Laney> you might want to use something like chdist
[09:51] <LocutusOfBorg> Laney, it might be looking bad, but it works https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/W9KVdRzhGQ/
[10:08] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: webkit2gtk [amd64] (eoan-proposed/main) [2.26.0-1ubuntu1] (desktop-core)
[10:39] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: accepted s390-tools [s390x] (eoan-proposed) [2.11.0-0ubuntu1]
[10:54] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New source: salt-pylint (eoan-proposed/primary) [2019.6.7-1ubuntu1]
[10:57] <LocutusOfBorg> ^^ this is a leaf new package, please accept it, I would like to finish the pylint sadness in the archive
[10:58] <LocutusOfBorg> (it might be not needed, but the Debian tracker shows it)
[12:27] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed [amd64] (bionic-proposed/main) [4.15.0-63.72] (core, kernel)
[12:27] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed [ppc64el] (bionic-proposed/main) [4.15.0-63.72] (core, kernel)
[12:39] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed [amd64] (bionic-proposed) [4.15.0-63.72]
[12:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed [ppc64el] (bionic-proposed) [4.15.0-63.72]
[13:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: linux-signed-oem-osp1 [amd64] (bionic-proposed/universe) [5.0.0-1021.23] (no packageset)
[13:33] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted linux-signed-oem-osp1 [amd64] (bionic-proposed) [5.0.0-1021.23]
[15:29] <vorlon> Laney: is there an index of reverse test-dep that I can refer to?
[15:30] <Laney> vorlon: not that I know of
[15:31] <Laney> well, unless you count Sources.xz Testsuite-Triggers
[15:39] <vorlon> Laney: do you think we should extend reverse-depends to cover those?
[15:40] <Laney> vorlon: sounds reasonable, maybe reverse-depends -t or similar?
[15:41] <Laney> (britney is also triggering for direct reverse binary dependencies too, but you're already checking that as part of the usual process)
[15:41] <vorlon> tumbleweed: ^^ I forget, is there a way to report bugs on the reverse-depends service?
[15:42] <tumbleweed> not really. Should move it to a launchpad project
[15:44] <tumbleweed> there: https://bugs.launchpad.net/reverse-depends
[16:04] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted webkit2gtk [amd64] (eoan-proposed) [2.26.0-1ubuntu1]
[16:24] <vorlon> tumbleweed: cool, LP: #1843614 filed
[16:25] <vorlon> tumbleweed: interestingly, I see the latest commit on https://code.launchpad.net/~stefanor/reverse-depends/reverse-deps says "cover pre-depends", but my recent experience was that reverse-depends multiarch-support did not report the list of packages that needed fixing
[16:29] <vorlon> coreycb: currently looks like python-microversion-parse, python-pbr, stevedore are critical-path for removing another chunk of the graph
[16:52] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: virtualenvwrapper [amd64] (eoan-proposed/universe) [4.8.4-4] (no packageset)
[16:59] <coreycb> vorlon: thanks i'll take a look
[17:21] <RikMills> Hi, could qtwebengine-opensource-src package 5.9.8 be removed from bionic-proposed please?
[17:21] <RikMills> the last comment on LP: #1830807 requests this
[17:22] <RikMills> its presence in proposed will cause some of the things I am getting ready for SRU to FTBFS
[17:26] <vorlon> RikMills: doing
[17:26] <vorlon> RikMills: done
[17:26] <RikMills> thanks!
[17:29] <coreycb> vorlon: python-pbr reverse depends opens a bag of worms
[17:34] <coreycb> vorlon: do we need to remove python-pbr in eoan?
[17:57] <vorlon> coreycb: if we don't remove it, it'll be ftbfs due to missing build-depends
[17:58] <vorlon> that's probably a reasonable tradeoff
[18:00] <coreycb> vorlon: ok i didn't really look to see if its (Build-)Depends have already been removed. so yeah i guess we need to do that work this cycle.
[18:05] <vorlon> coreycb: having one or two packages ftbfs due to missing build-deps is better than leaving NBS packages around at release time, so I am willing to draw a line there and we can burn down python-pbr revdeps if time allows
[18:06] <coreycb> vorlon: that sounds like a good plan then
[18:10] <ahasenack> hi, just letting you know I'm looking at the red ruby-ferret on arm64 now, the only red that is blocking ruby2.5 from migrating
[18:10] <ahasenack> "you" == "the collective you"
[18:30] <bryce> ahasenack, "all y'all" ;-)
[18:31] <ahasenack> works :)
[18:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected asterisk [source] (bionic-proposed) [1:13.18.3~dfsg-1ubuntu4build1]
[18:42] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected mailsync [source] (bionic-proposed) [5.2.2-3.1build<IP_ADDRESS>]
[18:42] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected prayer [source] (bionic-proposed) [1.3.5-dfsg1-4build2]
[18:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected asterisk [source] (disco-proposed) [1:16.2.1~dfsg-1build1]
[18:44] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected mailsync [source] (disco-proposed) [5.2.2-3.1build<IP_ADDRESS>]
[18:45] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected prayer [source] (disco-proposed) [1.3.5-dfsg1-6build<IP_ADDRESS>]
[20:02] <vorlon> coreycb: I uploaded python-diskimage-builder (revdep of stevedore), and this reveals that the openstack package build scripts are only half magic; the package has manual update-alternatives maintainer script code, but because we're no longer building the python module, the files in the packages are installed to different locations
[20:03] <vorlon> coreycb: Debian dealt with this by just dropping the maintainer scripts when dropping python2.  I'm following suit, but this makes the package not sanely upgradealbe.
[20:13] <coreycb> vorlon: thanks. it seems like it should be ok. pkgos-dh_auto_install won't create the /usr/bin/python{2|3}- prefixed files unless it is installing for both py2 and py3.
[20:15] <coreycb> so in eoan it'll install /usr/bin/dib-block-device but in disco it would install /usr/bin/python{2|3}-dib-block-device and point the alternative /usr/bin/dib-block-device at one of those
[20:28] <vorlon> coreycb: the reason it won't upgrade cleanly is that after upgrade the alternatives will still be in the database, and best case those'll be floating around in the dpkg database forever, worst case their presence will prevent the package from being upgraded at all
[20:32] <coreycb> vorlon: will the prerm script from the old package get run before the package is upgraded?
[20:33] <vorlon> it will, but I believe I saw that the old prerm script only removed the alternatives if the package was being removed, not upgraded
[20:36] <coreycb> vorlon: alright yeah just noticed that
[23:04] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted virtualenvwrapper [amd64] (eoan-proposed) [4.8.4-4]