  The chair is skaet. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
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[15:02] <Riddell> hi
[15:02] <skaet> We're now in FeatureDefinitionFreeze,  all blueprints should be up to date and reflect your team's plans for this cycle.  As of this morning there are 2282 work items in the tracker.   The trend line will now
[15:02] <skaet> be reset for the burndowns.
[15:02] <skaet> .
[15:02] <skaet> Based on the follow up from last week,  A3 has moved to July 26.    Also changed since the last meeting is DebianImportFreeze is July 5,  per UDS discussions.   Schedules have now had the DRAFT indicator removed.
[15:02] <skaet> .
[15:02] <balloons> o/
[15:02] <skaet> Before we go into the open Q&A session,  just want to give a reminder of some other key links.
[15:02] <skaet> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseTeam/Meeting/Agenda  (this meeting's conventions and format are documented there).
[15:02] <skaet> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QuantalQuetzal/ReleaseSchedule (12.10 Schedule)
[15:02] <skaet> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QuantalQuetzal/ReleaseInterlock  (12.10 and 12.04.1 interaction with other teams)
[15:02] <skaet> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseSchedule (12.04.1 Schedule)
[15:02] <skaet> .
[15:02] <skaet> Key events:
[15:02] <skaet> 2012/06/07 - Alpha 1 Milestone Release  (soft freeze and images available on 06/04)
[15:02] <skaet> 2012/07/05 - DebianImportFreeze
[15:02] <skaet> .
[15:03] <stgraber> I also created a wiki page for the 12.04.1 team with links to relevant resources: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/12.04.1
[15:03] <stgraber> ..
[15:03] <skaet> Here are the status's received on the mail list:
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-May/001277.html - hardware cert (brendand)
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-May/001278.html - ubuntu studio (scott-work)
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-May/001279.html - security (mdeslaurs)
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-May/001280.html - Kubuntu (ScottK)
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-May/001282.html - Edubuntu (stgraber)
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-May/001284.html - Kernel (ogasawara)
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-May/001285.html - Lubuntu (gilir)
[15:03] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001287.html - Server (arosales)
[15:04] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001288.html - Xubuntu (astraljava)
[15:04] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001289.html - Desktop (seb128)
[15:04] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001290.html - QA (jibel)
[15:04] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001291.html - Foundations (ogra_)
[15:04] <skaet> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001296.html - QA community (balloons)
[15:04] <skaet> [TOPIC] Comments and Questions
[15:04] <skaet> thanks stgraber.  :)
[15:04] <skaet> Comment:  NCommander, stgraber and skaet will be contact points for the A1 release next week.   Please ask questions in #ubuntu-release if there are concerns/issues as we work on the images next week.
[15:04] <skaet> ..
[15:04] <skaet> any one have questions from reading the mail list, or others, before I start in?
[15:05] <ogra_> the linux-base MIR mentioned in the foundations report blocks A1 for armhf, would be nice to have that proceeded with high prio
[15:05] <ogra_> ..
[15:05] <skaet> heh,  thanks ogra_ that pre-empts one of mine quite nicely ;)
[15:05] <ogra_> :)
[15:05] <cjwatson> o/
[15:05] <skaet> go cjwatson
[15:06] <cjwatson> Not a response to status mails as such, but I'd like a volunteer (from the intersection of ubuntu-core-dev and ubuntu-archive) to run auto-syncs at least on Monday and Tuesday, and if possible occasionally over the weekend, since I'll be away
[15:06] <cjwatson> ..
[15:06] <Riddell> can that be done without command line access?
[15:06] <cjwatson> Yes
[15:07] <Riddell> show me how and I'll give it a go
[15:07] <cjwatson> Great, thanks, will follow up with you out of band
[15:07] <cjwatson> (done)
[15:07] <Daviey> cjwatson / Riddell: Do you want to wiki-tize it, making it easier for volunteers in the future?
[15:07] <skaet> +1
[15:08] <cjwatson> Gosh, might almost think it was already
[15:08] <Daviey> (The irony of auto-sync's needing a human isn't lost :)
[15:08] <Riddell> should be on ArchiveAdmin if the world worked perfectly I think
[15:08] <cjwatson> It *is* on ArchiveAdministration
[15:08] <cjwatson> The world works perfectly.  QED
[15:08] <skaet> lol
[15:08] <Daviey> wow, i suck.
[15:08] <cjwatson> Daviey: automation is blocked on two LP bugs, referenced from the foundations archive-admin spec for the cycle
[15:08] <Riddell> nice
[15:09] <cjwatson> (full automation, that is)
[15:09] <Daviey> cjwatson: Sorry, i thought that the Sync section was referencing shell based syncs.. not api based ones.
[15:10] <cjwatson> Daviey: I believe I nuked all of that since the old code is no longer available
[15:10] <Daviey> rocking
[15:10] <skaet> .. (feels like it,  on to next question)
[15:10] <skaet> ogra_,  any updates on when we'll be dropping the alt installer images?  (Nick's question from the mail list).
[15:11] <ogra_> ??
[15:11] <ogra_> why do you ask me ?
[15:11] <skaet> cjwatson then.
[15:11] <ogra_> :)
[15:11] <skaet> (foundations rep ;) )
[15:11]  * ogra_ wont drop any alternate images for x86 :)
[15:11] <Daviey> RE: Nick's question.. if they can't use the desktop installer.. the mini.iso is still being shipped.. So they can get Ubuntu on there.
[15:11] <ogra_> i thought the plan was to do it asap
[15:12] <ogra_> but i have no idea if that also means A1
[15:12] <ogra_> surely depends on raid and lvm in ubiquity
[15:12] <balloons> Well, alpha 1 is next week, I assumed the question was more for cjwatson and team.. we can drop once the installer supports everything
[15:13] <ogra_> which rogresses well but i dont think is finished yet
[15:13] <brendand> skaet, cjwatson - before that happens would you mind hearing a few concerns from the cert team?
[15:13] <ogra_> *progresses
[15:13] <gilir> o/
[15:13] <ogra_> brendand, you have netboot and mini iso
[15:13] <cjwatson> skaet: Not until beta
[15:13] <ogra_> both will go on using alternate
[15:13] <cjwatson> The desktop image won't be a complete replacement until then
[15:13]  * ogra_ notes that down for the next time this question comes up
[15:13] <skaet> cjwatson,  ok.    thanks.  :)
[15:13] <ogra_> ..
[15:14] <cjwatson> brendand: ?
[15:14] <balloons> ok, does it make sense to test images we'll be replacing?
[15:14] <cjwatson> balloons: low priority
[15:14] <Daviey> brendand: Can you comment on why mini.iso wouldn't cover any gaps lost with alternate?
[15:14] <Daviey> seems disingenuous to ship an image for Alpha, we have no intention of being in final.
[15:14] <brendand> Daviey, ogra_ - i'm not au fait with the mini.iso
[15:14] <balloons> I mean, I wouldn't want to publish alt images for alpha1, if we're dropping
[15:15] <Daviey> super.
[15:15] <stgraber> balloons: a good part of the installer code path (partman) and the post-boot experience will still essentially be identical whether you install from alternate or from desktop, so I think there's still value in testing lvm/crypto on the alternates until desktop supports it
[15:15] <ogra_> balloons, there are install methods missing in live the alternate offers
[15:15] <xnox> Daviey: we have a contingency plan. until we know that ubiquity has luks/lvm and it works well we will not be dropping alternative cd.
[15:15] <brendand> ogra_, i'm not entirely sure netboot is an adequate substitute
[15:16] <xnox> and that piece of work was long time in the cooking and still a highly desirable wishlist item, becuase it's not easy to implement.
[15:16] <ogra_> brendand, well, it uses the same installer as alternate, it just doesnt have packages in a local pool
[15:16] <xnox> at any case we do not want to loose offline encrypted installation option.
[15:16] <cjwatson> balloons: as xnox says - if we turn out not to be able to finish the luks/lvm work (although it is extremely high priority and we'll do our best), it would be bad to ship 12.10 with very significantly reduced partitioning capabilities
[15:16] <xnox> for the desktop that is currently the alternative image
[15:17] <cjwatson> we don't *want* the alternates to be in final, but they're a fallback
[15:17] <cjwatson> it would be worse to have to resurrect them in a panic
[15:17] <Daviey> So it should be captured that it's not definite that alternate is going away.
[15:17] <xnox> alternative cd until last minute is our contingency plan.
[15:17] <balloons> that makes sense, but I'm divided about it...
[15:17] <cjwatson> it is the plan of record
[15:17] <brendand> ogra_, so the reason we fell back to alternate sometimes was because desktop didn't work on a particular system. it would be reasonable, but not ideal to ask an end user to use alternate to install
[15:17] <cjwatson> like most things, plans of record may occasionally be subject to contingencies
[15:17] <brendand> ogra_, i don't think so the same can be said for netboot
[15:18] <ogra_> brendand, not easily, but surely for mini.iso
[15:18] <Daviey> brendand: burn mini.iso to disk, select ubuntu desktop. go home. :)
[15:18] <cjwatson> It is reasonable, but not ideal, to ask users to use mini.iso
[15:18] <xnox> Daviey: doesn't mini.iso require network access?
[15:18] <Daviey> yah
[15:18] <ogra_> yes
[15:18] <cjwatson> If they were having to download the alternate ISO anyway, it's not much worse
[15:18] <cjwatson> And it's the same interface
[15:18] <ogra_> or a local mirror
[15:18] <brendand> Daviey, we'll have a look at mini.iso
[15:19] <ogra_> or a cd with a locla mirror (which makes it nearly an alternate install ;) )
[15:19] <xnox> there is a usecase for isolated, non-network accesible machines.
[15:19] <cjwatson> Yeah, but they tend to have stronger local admin capabilities
[15:19] <cjwatson> I'm not worried about those at the moment
[15:19] <xnox> mini.iso + desktop.iso for the upgrade pool = ugly
[15:19] <xnox> ok.
[15:19] <xnox> ..
[15:19] <brendand> cjwatson, one technical thing was a recent discovery we made about interaction between ubiquity and usb sticks inserted on install
[15:19] <cjwatson> Anyway, I don't think we need to get all the way into this in the meeting ...
[15:20] <balloons> sounds like we could use a usecase -> iso enablement mapping
[15:20] <cjwatson> brendand: That sounds like a bug we should fix!
[15:20] <ogra_> ++
[15:20] <brendand> cjwatson, indeed!
[15:20] <skaet> .. I think.
[15:20] <skaet> gilir,  go
[15:20] <ogra_> balloons, that scalled manifest and is on the wiki :)
[15:20] <cjwatson> Yes, we should take further stuff out of band; say -devel or -installer
[15:20] <ogra_> ..
[15:21] <gilir> the plan is to drop alternate for Ubuntu and all the flavors ?
[15:21] <cjwatson> gilir: IMO it's up to flavours
[15:21] <gilir> or are flavors free to produce 1 or more alternate images ?
[15:21] <xnox> less images the better.
[15:21] <ogra_> why "more" ?
[15:21] <ogra_> ..
[15:21] <cjwatson> ogra_: architectures
[15:21] <ogra_> ah
[15:22] <cjwatson> The alternate image is inherently more flexible and it's a perfectly legitimate per-flavour decision to produce them
[15:22] <ogra_> yeah
[15:22] <cjwatson> The "no alternate image for 12.10" is primarily a matter of Canonical paring down the set of images it has to care about
[15:22] <cjwatson> i.e. Ubuntu desktop
[15:22] <cjwatson> It is not an edict that applies non-negotiably to all flavours
[15:22] <gilir> alternate is still usefull for us, but I didn't check is mini.iso can replace it
[15:23] <Daviey> Well, it's also.. as a project.. too many flavours IS confusing.
[15:23] <Daviey> err, options
[15:23] <cjwatson> We have to support the underlying software for automated deployments, netboot etc. anyway
[15:23] <cjwatson> Daviey: that's negotiable though
[15:23] <gilir> I just want to be sure the installer for alternate will be updated and maintained :)
[15:23] <skaet> gilir, I'll do a survey before B1 so we can finalize the manifest on this subject.   It will be a per flavor decision.
[15:23] <cjwatson> You could make the same argument that too many flavours is confusing, but I'm pretty sure that's not something you want to say to flavours ;-)
[15:24] <cjwatson> The question is a little more nuanced than ">1 => bad"
[15:24] <gilir> skaet: ok, thanks :)
[15:24] <skaet> more info should be known then too.  ;)
[15:24] <cjwatson> gilir: yes, if necessary (and I hope it's not) I'll be doing it in my free time
[15:24] <skaet> ..
[15:24] <gilir> but yes, it's maybe not usefull to have more than 1 alternate
[15:25] <gilir> cool, thanks cjwatson :)
[15:25] <gilir> ..
[15:25]  * ogra_ wasnt aware cjwatson had such a thing like "free time"
[15:25] <ogra_> ..
[15:26] <skaet> jibel,  new email format looks good and is useful.  :)  Thanks!  Question: bootspeed testing: has anyone started to look at why the plumbing has gone up by 5 seconds since the last runs?
[15:27]  * skaet just trying to figure out if its on a team's radar or not?
[15:27] <jibel> skaet, we are struggling with hardware issue and the job is not stable yet. I wouldn't consider the results as reliable.
[15:27] <skaet> jibel,  fair nuf :)
[15:27] <skaet> thanks.
[15:28] <skaet> ..
[15:28]  * skaet was happy to see them again though ;)
[15:28] <skaet> seb128,  will we be picking up a unity/compiz stack update for A1?
[15:29] <seb128> skaet, no, refactoring is still going on for compiz as well as merging in one source
[15:29] <seb128> things are getting in shape but they will not make it for a1
[15:29] <ogra_> phew
[15:29] <skaet> seb128,  thanks.
[15:30]  * skaet crosses that worry point off her list ;)
[15:30] <skaet> ..
[15:30]  * ogra_ is happy he doesnt have to care for it for arm A1
[15:30] <ogra_> ..
[15:30] <skaet> Riddell, when is KDE SC 4.9 Beta 1 likely to land (before or after monday).   If it doesn't land,  does it make sense to spin up A1 images?  and which images make sense to release and ask for testing?
[15:30] <skaet> What's Kubuntu Active looking like?
[15:31]  * skaet referencing ScottK's comments in the Kubuntu status)
[15:31] <Riddell> 4.9 packages are avilable to packages but unknown if they'll be done by tuesday
[15:31] <Riddell> I've not looked at Kubuntu Active, I presume it looks just the same as precise unless you know different
[15:32] <Riddell> I think it makes sense to try for alpha 1 even without SC 4.9
[15:32] <skaet> no,  just figured there may be some different paths/packages so wasn't sure if it fell into the category of not worth asking for testing or not,  if 4.9 didn't land
[15:33] <Riddell> right I think kubuntu active can be missed for alpha 1
[15:34] <skaet> if you want to try for alpha 1 with the rest of Kubuntu without SC 4.9,  that's possible.
[15:34] <skaet> Can you reply to my manifest email,  and state which ones you want explicitly?
[15:34] <Riddell> desktop images anyway, not fussed about dvd and alternate
[15:34] <skaet> heh
[15:34] <Riddell> is that a recent e-mail?
[15:34] <skaet> that's what I was wanting to know.  ;)
[15:34] <skaet> yup,  ubuntu-release mail list
[15:34] <skaet> yesterday
[15:35] <skaet> trying to nail down what we're aiming at next week.
[15:35] <Riddell> ok added that to my todo list
[15:35] <skaet> balloons,  ^ see comment on Kubuntu desktop images ;)
[15:35] <skaet> thanks Riddell.  :)
[15:36] <skaet> ..
[15:36] <skaet> I think that's it for the questions I had from reading through the emails.   Thank you to those who got it mailed out by scheduled time yesterday :).
[15:36] <skaet> anyone else before we end meeting?
[15:37] <skaet> Thanks all.
[15:37] <skaet> #endmeeting
[15:37] <meetingology> Meeting ended Fri Jun  1 15:37:40 2012 UTC.
[15:37] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-01-15.01.moin.txt
[15:37] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-01-15.01.html
[15:37] <mdeslaur> thanks!
[15:38] <seb128> thanks
[15:38] <stgraber> thanks!
[15:38] <ogra_> tnaks skaet
[15:38] <arosales> thanks skaet for chairing
[15:38] <jibel> thanks for chairing skaet
[15:39] <Daviey> thanks skaet
[15:39] <skaet> Have a good weekend.  :)
[15:40] <Daviey> Yes, Good long weekend.  God save the queen.
[15:40] <balloons> thanks skaet et la
[15:40] <xnox> thanks to all =)
[16:37] <penguin359> Did I miss the meeting?
[17:00] <jussi> penguin359: which meeting are you referring to?
[18:59] <penguin359> jussi: The Quantal Release meeting
[18:59] <jussi> penguin359: yup, its over a good while back
[18:59] <jussi> !logs
[19:01] <penguin359> I thought it was set at 1600 UTC.
[19:03] <jussi> no idea
[19:05] <Pendulum> penguin359: the Fridge calendar says 1500 UTC
[19:20] <penguin359> Does it shift with DST or is it 1500 UTC year round?
[19:20] <micahg> shifts with DST I think, it's consistent been 10 AM Central Time US
[19:45] <penguin359> That's probably my confusion, I read the time from a static webpage and added it to my calendar as UTC (No DST).  I expect it's more correctly 1600 BST, and not UTC.


[09:15] <rbasak> teward: sorry, I was out last week. What's up?
[09:33] <rbasak> caribou: why is bug 1464227 Invalid? /var/log/dmesg is out of date on my system. Or has systemd saved it in the journal somehow?
[09:34] <rbasak> cpaelzer__: I don't see any tags in your NIS git branch. Did you push them?
[09:34] <caribou> rbasak: pitti told me that those were saved in the journal so I removed the systemd equivalent job of the upstart one when I merged the rsyslog package
[09:37] <rbasak> caribou: ah, if it's in the journal then that's fine with me. Thanks.
[09:39] <cpaelzer__> rbasak, tags now uploaded
[09:39] <cpaelzer> rbasak: there was so much confusion on friday for the first LP git upload that I missed them
[09:39] <cpaelzer> rbasak: now they should be good
[09:39] <caribou> rbasak: journalctl --dmesg has it
[09:40] <rbasak> caribou: aha. Works for me. Thanks again!
[09:40] <caribou> rbasak: np
[09:40] <rbasak> cpaelzer: I see them now. Thank you!
[10:24] <davegarath> Hi all. I would like to logging scp session from my server ( what are downloaded/uploaded ). I tried to configure /etc/sshd_config with "Subsystem sftp /usr/lib/openssh/sftp-server -l INFO" but scp session aren't logged
[10:24] <davegarath> I just can see connection and disconnection in the auth.log file
[10:26] <rbasak> Does scp actually use sftp
[10:26] <rbasak> ?
[10:27] <rbasak> Or does it just run an scp at the other end like rsync does?
[10:27] <davegarath> mmm I don't know maybe not
[10:27] <rbasak> If you're logging for auditing purposes then you can't rely on any logs if you permit shell access.
[10:28] <davegarath> mh ok
[10:28] <maswan> rbasak: scp does not use sftp
[10:28] <davegarath> so I can't log scp activities...
[10:28] <rbasak> You could provide some kind of restricted shell and wrap the scp command I suppose.
[10:29] <rbasak> It would be rather hacky though.
[10:29] <maswan> scp is very very close to cat $name | ssh fooo "cat > $name"
[10:29] <davegarath> ok. I'll think some wrapper
[10:30] <rbasak> It might be better to eliminate scp from your workflow entirely.
[10:30] <rbasak> It's handy for ad-hoc stuff but less useful for workflow things.
[10:31] <rbasak> If I were to set up something where I need an audit trail of what happened to a bunch of files changing, I'd use git and a hook to update it when required.
[10:31] <rbasak> Possibly with git-annex if large file support is required.
[10:32] <davegarath> I don't want eliminate scp to break some functionality on the server that could use it. I just want  to know if someone use scp for normal operation and watch for what....  The media is stored on a nas, so the locations are network based for read/write.
[15:13] <rbasak> cpaelzer: first draft. Maybe I need to tone it down a bit? Feedback appreciated. http://paste.ubuntu.com/13576789/
[15:17] <cpaelzer> rbasak: tone down a bit in paragraph #3
[15:18] <cpaelzer> everything else is totally fine, non-offensive and asking what we like to understand "why special"
[15:20] <jeroentbt>  Hey, I just installed an ubuntu server (14.04.3) and would like to connect it to an IPsec VPN. This server needs to be the client in this connection. Which application would allow me to set this up? (a walkthrough would be great too!)
[15:22] <hateball> !vpn
[15:23] <jeroentbt> hateball: thanks, that page does specifically mention IPSec VPN is not covered though..
[15:23] <TJ-> jeroentbt: you actually want it to operate in tunnelling mode, or just 'plain' IPSec encapsulation ?
[15:24] <jeroentbt> TJ-: You've got me there (noob... :/) I want a VPN connection to connect to some specific servers, All other connections should not use the VPN
[15:25] <jeroentbt> If that was what you were asking.
[15:26] <TJ-> jeroentbt: yes, IPSec and VPN terms are used incorrectly at times. 'standard' IPSec is 'just' transport security (encrypting packets between hosts). 'on top' of that you can do tunnelling, which is where the 'virtual network' sub-net 'tunnel' comes in
[15:27] <jeroentbt> Then I would need option 2, tunneling. thanks for the clarification!
[15:27] <TJ-> jeroentbt: the usual package for doing it is openswan
[15:28] <jeroentbt> TJ-: Thank you, I'll look in to that
[15:29] <TJ-> jeroentbt: there's a reaonably easy-to-understand overview here: http://clauseriksen.net/2011/02/02/ipsec-on-debianubuntu/
[15:33] <jeroentbt> TJ-: Thank you!
[17:29] <teward> when's the next server team meeting?
[18:04] <beisner> coreycb, confirming:  is kilo: oslo.concurrency/nova is ready to promote to trusty-kilo-updates today?
[18:05] <beisner> coreycb, also kilo: python-novaclient g2g?
[18:07] <coreycb> beisner, not yet because they're not in vivid-updates yet.  and that's blocked on a dep8 regression that I'm working on fixing.
[18:07] <coreycb> beisner, I'll keep you posted, thanks
[18:07] <beisner> coreycb, ack, thx.  i'll watch the cards for updates.
[18:34] <rbasak> cpaelzer: I'm struggling to understand how to tone down the third paragraph. Which bit of it should I focus on?
[18:36] <teward> rbasak: hello!  hope you enjoyed holiday/vacation/etc., just an FYI the libuuid1 headaches broke my sbuilds, so i couldn't test merges, that's back on track now and i'm getting real close to a merge
[18:36] <teward> (for nginx)
[18:36] <teward> just wanted to give you the heads up
[18:36] <rbasak> teward: OK, no problem.
[18:39] <vahid> Hi, I want to make a custom Ubuntu server image to install in every virtual machine, That ISO should contain some files. Is there any way ? I can make ISO with selected packages but not files.
[18:40] <teward> vahid: you could make the virtual machine, then make clones of the VM for new virtual machines (changing network setups, hostnames, IPs, etc.)
[18:40] <teward> just an option :)
[18:40] <teward> (I haven't found a way to ship separate files on the ISO, myself)
[18:41] <vahid> I should Install on VPS.
[18:44] <danawar> Hey ubuntu server i have an issue i ran a python script on my server at work which edited the /etc/fstab file to mount some smb shares on startup problem is there is an issue with it and now the server wont boot up so i can SSH into it. Is there any way i can recover this machine without getting physical access to it?
[18:49] <sarnold> danawar: use serial or ILO or ivkm or whatever your system has to add "single" or "shell=/bin/bash" to your grub kernel command
[19:17] <sokoll>  I'm trying to configure a this module https://confluence.atlassian.com/doc/configuring-apache-to-cache-static-content-via-mod_disk_cache-295305963.html. But, there is no /etc/httpd/conf/httpd.conf directory/file on Ubuntu. This page gives details on the Apache config files in ubuntu https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/httpd.html, but I'm just not quite clear on which file I need to edit
[19:17] <sokoll> in order to load the cache mod.
[19:18] <sarnold> sokoll: iirc it'd be in /etc/apache2/ somewhere -- grep -r for LoadModule and see if that helps you find anything
[19:22] <sokoll> sarnold: what's the correct command for that?
[19:22] <sokoll> grep -r LoadModule?
[19:24] <sarnold> sokoll: yeah, once you're in the apache configuration directory
[19:24] <sokoll> ah ok
[19:24] <sokoll> bear with
[19:27] <sokoll> I have mods-available/cache_disk.load:LoadModule cache_disk_module /usr/lib/apache2/modules/mod_cache_disk.so
[19:28] <sokoll> but no conf file
[19:32] <sarnold> sokoll: nice; that looks like you ought to be able to do a2enmod cache_disk  to enable to module, and then add the <ifmodule> block from https://confluence.atlassian.com/doc/configuring-apache-to-cache-static-content-via-mod_disk_cache-295305963.html  to wherever your virtual host configuration is stored, probably a symlink from sites-enabled/ to a config file in sites-available/
[19:33] <sokoll> ok lemme give that a bash (no pun intended ;) )
[19:36] <sokoll> How do I know if it's working or not?
[19:37] <sarnold> hopefully apache will pass through some headers that you can spot in curl or wget output
[19:42] <sokoll> hmm, I'll fiddle about with it. thank you so much sarnold
[19:42] <sokoll> :)
[19:43] <sarnold> cool :) have fun sokoll ;)


[00:22] <thumper> wallyworld, axw: if we are bumping all the API versions and hacking at the wire protocol with a machette, can you please add explicit serialization directives to everything on the wire?
[00:22] <wallyworld> we can try
[00:22] <thumper> surely this is just a sed script right?
[00:22] <wallyworld> :-(
[00:22] <thumper> because sed is all you need
[00:23]  * wallyworld growls at thumper
[00:23]  * thumper hums the "all you need is love" tune...
[00:23] <thumper> all you need is sed... sed...
[00:23] <thumper> sed is all you need
[00:23] <wallyworld> groan
[00:24]  * thumper is distracting himself from what he really needs to be doing
[00:26] <mup> Bug #1540076 changed: Storage Hooks before Install <juju-core:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540076>
[00:32]  * thumper is wondering when master will get another CI run...
[00:32] <thumper> last was several days ago...
[00:32] <thumper> like four
[00:32] <thumper> the dep engine merge hasn't been blessed or cursed yet...
[00:49] <wallyworld> thumper: CI is paused over the weekend, should get another run later tonight our time. i'm keen to see it get a run because after i merged the dep endgine stuff into the api-command-rename feature branch CI reports intermittent leadership failures which i claim have nothing to do with renaming some methods
[01:16] <axw> wallyworld: was out, Charlotte's first day of grade one. responded to your email
[01:16] <wallyworld> np, hope she went ok
[01:16] <axw> yep
[01:39] <axw> wallyworld: I think one use-case for adding volumes after deploy is, e.g. if you have a MAAS and add a disk to the machine
[01:39] <axw> wallyworld: MAAS has no agent, so you have no other way of discovering it
[01:40] <wallyworld> that is true, but that then becomes an add storage thing maybe
[01:40] <wallyworld> needs thought as to how it all fits the model
[01:41] <axw> wallyworld: how do you mean? add-storage would always be required, to associate the volume with a unit
[01:42] <wallyworld> exactly, that's after a unit is deployed, you add a volume, possibly one you added post deploy to the machine
[01:42] <wallyworld> but at deploy time, i'm not sure it makes sense to have to have storage and placement directives macthing
[01:42] <wallyworld> maybe i'm wrong
[01:43] <axw> wallyworld: well if you have the machine already, then you wouldn't be able to deploy a unit that *requires* storage if you only have that OOB-added disk on the machine
[01:44] <axw> wallyworld: anyway, this is just speculation, needs more requirements
[01:44] <wallyworld> yep
[01:51] <wallyworld> thumper: can you let me know if you have 5 minutes for a chat/question
[01:51] <thumper> wallyworld: sure, now is as good as any
[01:51] <wallyworld> ok, 1:1
[03:48] <davecheney> thumper: it works!
[03:48] <davecheney> root@ip-10-251-40-215:~# echo -e "GET /debug/pprof/goroutine?debug=1 HTTP/1.0\r\n" | socat unix-connect:/tmp/.5636.pprof STDIO | pastebinit
[03:48] <davecheney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/14847387/
[03:49]  * thumper took a minute disecting that command
[03:49] <thumper> very cool
[03:50] <davecheney> yeah, it's a mouthful
[03:50] <thumper> davecheney: what are the lines like this: 2 @ 0x437b2a 0x446382 0x445372 0x713277 0x737040 0x464d41
[03:50] <davecheney> most http tools are like "unix socket, wat?!"
[03:50] <davecheney> those are the raw program counters
[03:50] <thumper> ah
[03:51] <thumper> is there memory dumps?
[03:51] <davecheney> here is what the comp[uter see, http://paste.ubuntu.com/14847399/
[03:51] <thumper> ah
[03:51] <davecheney> the extra lines are for humans, see the ?debug=1 flag
[03:51] <thumper> much nicer to see the full method
[03:52] <thumper> what about memory?
[03:52] <thumper> can we see that?
[03:54] <davecheney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/14847418/
[03:54] <davecheney> i don't immediately know how to interpret those numbers
[03:55] <davecheney> but pprof can
[03:55] <davecheney> i've never found the go heap profiler to tell me useful information
[03:55] <davecheney> i wanted to implement this facility so I could find out what the goroutines were doing inside a program
[04:34] <davecheney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/14847633/
[04:34] <davecheney> friday the juju deployer worked fine for me
[04:34] <davecheney> today, nothing
[05:06] <thumper> see y'all tomorrow
[05:07] <jog> davecheney, juju-deployer==0.3.6 is an old version of deployer. You probably want 0.6.1-1 from 'deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/juju/stable/ubuntu trusty main'
[06:54] <mup> Bug #1540047 changed: Error in Jujuclient with Python3 <python-jujuclient:Fix Released by aisrael> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540047>
[07:00] <mup> Bug #1540047 opened: Error in Jujuclient with Python3 <python-jujuclient:Fix Released by aisrael> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540047>
[07:09] <mup> Bug #1540047 changed: Error in Jujuclient with Python3 <python-jujuclient:Fix Released by aisrael> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540047>
[09:03] <frobware> jam: ho? (though I have no camera today.)
[09:03] <jam> be there in just a sec
[10:02] <dimitern> voidspace, frobware, fwereade__, standup?
[10:02] <voidspace> dimitern: omw
[10:03] <voidspace> dimitern: got booted out - rejoining
[10:20] <dooferlad_> voidspace: are you rejoining?
[10:21] <dooferlad> ok, 2fa for me.
[10:21] <dooferlad> yay, in the middle of a hangout!
[10:26] <voidspace> dimitern: jam: dooferlad: not sure if any of my last messages got through
[10:26] <voidspace> dimitern: jam: dooferlad: internet went down briefly
[10:27] <voidspace> dimitern: jam: dooferlad: dependency engine stuff may mean I get to simplify my tests a bit, I think that was all I wanted to say
[10:27] <dooferlad> voidspace: we didn't get that bit. sounds goodf.
[10:27] <wallyworld> fwereade__: hey, did you have 5 minutes, i just wanted to run something by you
[10:29] <dimitern> voidspace, that sounds like a good next step, yeah
[11:07] <mup> Bug #1540301 opened: adding storage to a unit should be able to take a specified block device <storage> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540301>
[11:40] <mup> Bug #1540316 opened: provider/maas: bridgescript should support vlans <maas-provider> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540316>
[11:58] <axw> wallyworld: might be a minute or two late
[11:58] <wallyworld> ok
[11:59] <davecheney> jog: i'm running the version of hte juju-deplouyer that ships in trusty
[12:00] <davecheney> and it worked right up til friday
[12:00] <davecheney> but this week it just decided not to work
[12:02] <wallyworld> perrito666: meeting?
[12:37] <cherylj> fwereade__: ping?
[13:53] <mattyw> wwitzel3, you around mate?
[13:54] <mattyw> cherylj, don't suppose you know anyone who might be awake and knows about the lxd provider, I'm having problems
[14:08] <wwitzel3> mattyw: ping
[14:08] <mattyw> wwitzel3, hey hey, you worked on the lxd provider?
[14:08] <wwitzel3> mattyw: yep, ericsnow and myself
[14:09] <mattyw> wwitzel3, awesome, I'm having problems with it (it was working fine) I've almost finished typing it all out in an email I was going to put on juju-dev email list. If it's ok I'll finish that and ping when it's sent. I basically need help debugging and env that seems screwed
[14:09] <mattyw> wwitzel3, I'll finish off the email to save time typing it all out again
[14:10] <wwitzel3> mattyw: yeah, ok, I'm not on the list anymore, so if you want to also pastebin it to me, I'll give it a read and see if I have any insight
[14:12] <mattyw> wwitzel3, I've emailed you as well
[14:12] <wwitzel3> that works
[14:16] <tasdomas> menno, ping?
[14:23] <wwitzel3> mattyw: I'd also ping ericsnow and direct him to the list message, he might have some insight on it too .. but yeah, I'll poke it a bit more and see if anything shakes out
[14:23] <mattyw> ericsnow, are you around?
[14:23] <mattyw> I wish irc displayed timezones for everyone
[14:25] <wwitzel3> mattyw: he'll be around soon (if he isn't out of office)
[14:25] <wwitzel3> mattyw: moonstone standup is in 30 minutes
[14:31] <frobware> mgz, did we ever get a dedicated 1.25 CI run for bug 1532167  - this was the backport of the maas-spaces bridge script
[14:31] <mup> Bug #1532167: maas bridge script handles VLAN NICs incorrectly <addressability> <maas-provider> <network> <juju-core:Triaged> <juju-core 1.25:In Progress by frobware> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532167>
[14:46] <mup> Bug #1540394 opened: Juju does not handle 429 "too many requests" from Azure <azure-provider> <bootstrap> <ci> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540394>
[14:52] <mup> Bug #1540394 changed: Juju does not handle 429 "too many requests" from Azure <azure-provider> <bootstrap> <ci> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540394>
[14:55] <mup> Bug #1540394 opened: Juju does not handle 429 "too many requests" from Azure <azure-provider> <bootstrap> <ci> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540394>
[14:58] <ericsnow> mattyw: present, but about to go to standup
[14:58] <ericsnow> mattyw: I'll ping you when we're done
[14:58] <mattyw> ericsnow, ok cool
[14:59] <ericsnow> mattyw: nevermind, I'm the only one around apparently
[14:59] <ericsnow> :)
[15:01] <mattyw> ericsnow, take a look at my email to juju-dev for the strarting point
[15:01] <ericsnow> mattyw: will do
[15:28] <katco`> sinzui: ping
[15:29] <katco`> or, mgz: ping
[15:29] <sinzui> hi katco`
[15:29] <katco`> sinzui: o/
[15:30] <katco`> sinzui: at the charmer summit, have a person here trying to try out juju on joyent
[15:30] <katco`> sinzui: and he's getting a strange error on bootstrap
[15:30] <katco`> sinzui: (one sec getting err)
[15:31] <sinzui> katco`: joyent has several ill regions over the last few weeks. us-east-3 is good. us-east-2 is locked down. us-east-1 has network issues, us-west-1 is not cleaning up networks
[15:31] <katco`> sinzui: we're using eu regions
[15:31] <katco`> sinzui: 2016-02-01 15:27:04 ERROR juju.cmd supercommand.go:429 there was an issue examining the environment: cannot create credentials: An error occurred while parsing the key: asn1: structure error: tags don't match (16 vs {class:0 tag:23 length:23 isCompound:true}) {optional:false explicit:false application:false defaultValue:<nil> tag:<nil> stringType:0 timeType:0 set:false omitEmpty:false} pkcs1PrivateKey @2
[15:32] <katco`> sinzui: the environments.yaml looks like it could be ok, but wouldn't completely rule that out
[15:32] <sinzui> katco`: I don't think someone setup their account keys properly. CI has never seen that kind of issue
[15:33] <katco`> sinzui: so we checked the keys in his account, and they match what's in environments.yaml
[15:33] <katco`> sinzui: i've not used joyent. what kind of setup could be wrong in this case?
[15:34] <sinzui> katco`:  I've never seen an error like that to day
[15:34] <sinzui> say
[15:34] <katco`> sinzui: hm ok
[15:36] <katco`> sinzui: manta information should be the same as sdc?
[15:36] <sinzui> katco`: my config looks like this https://pastebin.canonical.com/148857/
[15:37] <katco`> sinzui: ahhh possibly what's wrong. the key he posted looks possibly like a fingerprint
[15:37] <sinzui> katco`: yes, sdc-key-id and anta-key-id are the same, as ar sdc-user and manta-user.
[15:38] <katco`> sinzui: scratch that, he's specifying the path to the key
[15:39] <sinzui> katco`: private-key-path works, though I don't use it often
[15:39] <katco`> sinzui: he's on os x if that helps
[15:40] <sinzui> katco`: I haven't seen a difference between OS X and Ubuntu for joyent. ssh and keys are the same.
[15:40] <katco`> sinzui: hm ok
[15:41] <sinzui> katco`: unless someone trued to compile their own juju on that host. OSX requires CGO=1 to link to the native keystore
[15:41] <katco`> sinzui: nah he just brew installed
[15:42] <katco`> sinzui: fyi when he tried to brew install alpha1, he got an error
[15:42] <sinzui> katco`: we don't support it
[15:42] <katco`> sinzui: looked like the brew recipe had some kind of utf error
[15:42] <katco`> sinzui: ah ok
[15:43] <sinzui> katco we onlt support jujus in *releaed* streams. other wise peoples configs break when they get updates
[15:43] <katco`> sinzui: right, we're just showing alpha1 here to show everyone the new stuff
[15:43] <katco`> sinzui: but seems like a bug in the brew recipe for 2.0? or are you saying we don't do the support for brew?
[15:44] <sinzui> katco`: not a bug is the recipe, it is about streams not working at the time the binaries are meade
[15:45] <katco`> sinzui: no, i'm saying the recipe seems broke. as in brew install doesn't work for alpha1
[15:46] <sinzui> katco`: we did suport devel, users were not happy about incompatible configs
[15:46] <sinzui> katco`: We solved this by creating cient for testers https://launchpad.net/juju-core/+milestone/2.0-alpha1 got clients *before* ubuntu users
[15:47] <katco`> sinzui: right, that's what he ended up downloading
[16:04] <mup> Bug #1540437 opened: lxd provider: machines stuck at "pending" <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540437>
[16:04] <mup> Bug #1540447 opened: error: r.runner.RunCommands: tomb: dying <run> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core 1.25:Triaged> <juju-core api-command-rename:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540447>
[16:07] <mup> Bug #1540437 changed: lxd provider: machines stuck at "pending" <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540437>
[16:07] <mup> Bug #1540447 changed: error: r.runner.RunCommands: tomb: dying <run> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core 1.25:Triaged> <juju-core api-command-rename:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540447>
[16:10] <mup> Bug #1540437 opened: lxd provider: machines stuck at "pending" <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540437>
[16:10] <mup> Bug #1540447 opened: error: r.runner.RunCommands: tomb: dying <run> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core 1.25:Triaged> <juju-core api-command-rename:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540447>
[16:18] <voidspace> dimitern: omw
[16:33] <natefinch> morning ericsnow
[16:33] <ericsnow> natefinch: hey
[16:33] <ericsnow> natefinch: interested in a late standup?
[16:33] <natefinch> ericsnow: yeah, definitely
[16:37] <frobware> cherylj, some success with VLAN nics on 1.25 - https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1532167/comments/28
[16:38] <mup> Bug #1532167: maas bridge script handles VLAN NICs incorrectly <addressability> <maas-provider> <network> <juju-core:In Progress by frobware> <juju-core 1.25:In Progress by frobware> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532167>
[16:38] <frobware> cherylj, this change was also going to get a CI branch as well. I haven't seen any reports. The PR is good to go, just waiting on sanity CI run.
[16:39] <voidspace> dimitern: frobware: do we still have the networking thing this afternoon?
[16:39] <frobware> voidspace, yes.
[16:39] <voidspace> frobware: thanks
[16:40] <cherylj> frobware: okay, I had held off since the initial feedback showed it had problems.  I'll get it on the queue
[16:41] <frobware> cherylj, thanks.
[16:41] <dimitern> voidspace, we do, but I might skip it
[16:46] <mup> Bug #1540469 opened: [ARM64][LXD Provider][2.0-alpha1-0ubuntu1~16.04.1~juju1] juju run command ERROR fork/exec /usr/bin/ssh: cannot allocate memory <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540469>
[16:47] <voidspace> dimitern: ok
[16:48] <voidspace> dimitern: frobware: dooferlad: unless anyone has any questions/follow up for Jay, maybe we should skip it this week?
[16:48] <dimitern> voidspace, +1 from me
[16:50] <frobware> voidspace, dimitern, dooferlad: agreed. need to merge :)
[16:50] <voidspace> I've emailed
[17:00] <dimitern> cheers voidspace
[17:01] <voidspace> dimitern: can I tell the difference, on a buffered channel as I *do not* want to block, between a closed channel and a channel with no messages available
[17:01] <voidspace> dimitern: I'm starting to think that the bool is just easier
[17:03] <voidspace> dimitern: I think I can
[17:03] <voidspace> dimitern: unping
[17:03] <natefinch> voidspace: a closed channel never blocks
[17:03] <natefinch> voidspace: an empty channel always blocks
[17:04] <voidspace> natefinch: and I need to tell the difference between those two cases
[17:04] <voidspace> natefinch: but I think I can use the ok parameter for that
[17:04] <voidspace> (thanks)
[17:04] <voidspace> natefinch: ah, I misread
[17:04] <voidspace> natefinch: I want a non-blocking way to tell if a channel is closed or not
[17:05] <voidspace> natefinch: just reading from it isn't enough as it will block if not closed
[17:05] <voidspace> natefinch: but I can provide a default path in the select for that case
[17:08] <natefinch> voidspace: yeah, was goign to say, with a default you get the non-blocking, as long as you're ok with actually taking a value off the channel if there's something there
[17:08] <natefinch> voidspace: also, for a := range ch {    works really nicely if you're looping anyway
[17:09] <voidspace> natefinch: thanks
[17:10] <voidspace> natefinch: in my case I'm not reading from the channel, just need to know if it's closed
[17:12] <natefinch> voidspace: You can't tell if it's closed without trying to read from it.. the notification that it's closed is a value you read off the channel.... Why do you need to know if a channel is closed without reading off it?
[17:14] <voidspace> natefinch: I thought it was a common pattern to use a channel to signal something - the signal being that you close the channel
[17:14] <voidspace> natefinch: reading from the closed channel then doesn't block - which is how you know it's closed
[17:14] <natefinch> voidspace: yes
[17:15] <voidspace> natefinch: the problem was that attempting a read would block, and I need the check to be non-blocking
[17:15] <voidspace> natefinch: but that's easy enough with a default path in the select
[17:15] <voidspace> natefinch: so no problem :-)
[17:15] <natefinch> voidspace: yep
[17:25] <dimitern> voidspace, dooferlad, frobware, here it is: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/3693/
[17:25] <voidspace> dimitern: cool, mine is nearly ready for review too
[17:26] <dimitern> in the mean time I'm still finishing a few tests
[17:34] <voidspace> dimitern: dooferlad: frobware: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/3694/
[17:34] <voidspace> dimitern: looking at your review
[17:35] <dimitern> voidspace, ta, looking at yours
[17:35] <voidspace> dimitern: switching to a channel meant undoing a bunch of code, but it is nicer
[17:37] <dimitern> voidspace, I suspected as much ;)
[17:42] <frobware> dimitern, taking a look now; would some manual testing help at all?
[17:44] <dimitern> frobware, sure, in fact what I'm seeing now is that it seems to work live (bindings included), but I still have hard time fixing the unit tests
[17:45] <frobware> dimitern, how many unit tests are broken? what's the nature of the breakage? and depending on how many are to be addressed could these be done post the merge as collateral damage?
[17:45] <dimitern> frobware, so the biggest issue is one of the apiaddressupdater tests hang
[17:46] <dimitern> frobware, the rest are mostly trivial - e.g. endpoint_bindings_test.go, service_test.go - related to incomplete test setup or outdated asserts to fix
[17:47] <frobware> dimitern, for the test that hangs is this something the CI test would run into?
[17:47] <dimitern> frobware, well, yeah - the merge bot will hang
[17:48] <dimitern> frobware, I'm close to actually skipping that test for now
[17:48] <frobware> dimitern, right. :)
[17:48] <frobware> dimitern, ok, another way. if we skip the test, is there likely to be a genuine functional failure that CI would run into.
[17:53] <dimitern> frobware, I don't believe so
[17:54] <frobware> dimitern, so we could throw caution to the wind here.
[17:54] <frobware> dimitern, cherylj: another way is to get a CI run on your branch before we merge to maas-spaces
[17:55] <dimitern> frobware, the test in question is related to the legacy address selection by scope followed by filtering of lxcbr0 addresses, both of which are skipped on 1.9 with controller space used for selection instead
[17:55] <frobware> dimitern, as an aside just found an interesting problem with lxcbr0
[17:55] <dimitern> frobware, that's perfect, if it can be arranged
[17:55] <frobware> cherylj, ^^
[17:56] <frobware> dimitern, is your branch now rebased against maas-spacs? I know on friday you were holding off
[17:57] <dimitern> frobware, I rebased before proposing, that's why it took some time - a couple of conflicts - easy to resolve though
[17:57] <voidspace> dimitern: frobware: manual test on my branch works fine by the way
[17:58] <dimitern> voidspace, I'm still looking, but it will take some time as I have a few suggestions
[18:01]  * cherylj reads scrollback
[18:01] <voidspace> dimitern: ok
[18:03] <natefinch> ericsnow: so, for deploy --resources, if we're doing multiple resources as a single string, space separated, how do we handle paths with spaces in them?  like --resources "foo=./bar foo2=./my docs/baz"?
[18:04] <natefinch> rick_h__: ^^
[18:05] <ericsnow> natefinch: --resources foo="./bar" foo2="./my docs/baz"
[18:05] <ericsnow> natefinch: or  --resources "foo=./bar" "foo2=./my docs/baz"
[18:06] <ericsnow> natefinch: or  --resources foo=./bar "foo2=./my docs/baz"
[18:06] <voidspace> dimitern: are you passing controller space straight through to maas as a constraint at bootstrap time
[18:06] <ericsnow> natefinch: any of those should work
[18:08] <natefinch> ericsnow: that's different than how constraints work, though
[18:09] <rick_h__> natefinch: understand, it'll have to be in order to be cross platform/etc. None of the others have actual directories in there like that.
[18:09] <ericsnow> natefinch: if this is not a problem that constraints has then we'll probably have to do it differently than constraints, no?
[18:09] <rick_h__> natefinch: constraints are built by us so we got to curate what was in there. I'd be curious if you can create a space or storage pool with a space in the name?
[18:09] <rick_h__> guessing not
[18:10] <natefinch> ericsnow, rick_h__ : it's also sorta hard to parse.... juju deploy mysql --resources foo=bar mydatabase  is mydatabase the name of the service or a resource?
[18:10] <ericsnow> natefinch: you'd have to use quotation marks
[18:11] <dimitern> voidspace, not exactly - it's a bootstrap argument which if unset will be inferred and set during bootstrap (see the finalizerWrapper)
[18:11] <natefinch> ericsnow: no, that could be legal for deploying mysql with the servicename mydatabase
[18:12] <natefinch> ericsnow: or it could be a typo for a resource called mydatabase without a path
[18:13] <natefinch> my point is --flag item1 item2 item3   is really hard to parse unless you guarantee it has to be the last thing on the line
[18:13] <natefinch> which is probably why constraints have to be a single string
[18:15] <natefinch> ericsnow: looks like gnuflag doesn't even support that kind of thing
[18:16] <ericsnow> natefinch: so we use a comma for a separator?
[18:16] <natefinch> ericsnow: that or semicolon.... I think we use semicolon somewhere else....
[18:18] <natefinch> (although now I can't find where... maybe I'm crazy)
[18:19] <natefinch> ericsnow: oh, well, loggo uses semicolons *shrug*
[18:24] <voidspace> dimitern: right, but is it used to select the space to bootstrap *to*?
[18:24] <voidspace> dimitern: (as well)
[18:25] <frobware> cherylj, ping
[18:25] <dimitern> voidspace, no, that's what bootstrap constraints are for
[18:26] <cherylj> frobware: in mtg, give me a few
[18:26] <frobware> cherylj, ack
[18:26] <voidspace> dimitern: so you could set controller-space and end up with an apiserver not in the controller space?
[18:26] <dimitern> voidspace, and in fact if you specify --controller-space admin-api, you'll get a node there, as after validating the controller space we also update the bootstrap constraints to match
[18:27] <voidspace> dimitern: ok, so the controller-space *is* turned into a bootstrap constraint?
[18:27] <voidspace> dimitern: (that's what I was really asking - but I can't see the code that does that)
[18:27] <voidspace> dimitern: because if so we have an issue with the space name
[18:27] <dimitern> voidspace, but if you don't specify --controller-space, you'll get arbitrary node, from which we'll then infer contr.space and also set env. constraints
[18:28] <voidspace> dimitern: I am specifically asking about the case where you *do* specify it
[18:28] <dimitern> voidspace, yeah, the issue is commented in a todo
[18:28] <voidspace> dimitern: we'll have an issue with space names
[18:28] <dimitern> voidspace, that we need to apply the same transformation as in discoverspaces
[18:28] <voidspace> dimitern: the bootstrap contraint should be a maas space name, but we require controller space to be a juju space name
[18:28] <voidspace> dimitern: right
[18:28] <voidspace> dimitern: that's the point I wanted to make
[18:28] <dimitern> voidspace, well, both need to be a valid juju space name
[18:28] <voidspace> dimitern: but it's still a todo then?
[18:29] <voidspace> dimitern: except you can't "untranslate"
[18:29] <voidspace> dimitern: our name transformation is one way only
[18:29] <voidspace> dimitern: you can't go from juju name back to maas name
[18:29] <dimitern> voidspace, so you can't use "space=Default space" in cons or --controller-space "Default space" as well
[18:29] <voidspace> dimitern: we'll have to do discovery on the client I'm afraid and then match the name
[18:29] <dimitern> voidspace, you can :) that's why we discover them and keep both id and name
[18:30] <voidspace> dimitern: and for the bootstrap constraint the user will have to "guess" what the juju name will be
[18:30] <voidspace> dimitern: not before discovery has been done you can't
[18:30] <dimitern> voidspace, there are still things to fix, I'll give you that :)
[18:30] <voidspace> dimitern: and discovery hasn't been done until after machine-0 has been selected and jujud is runnign
[18:30] <voidspace> *running
[18:30] <dimitern> voidspace, but it's a necessary first step
[18:31] <dimitern> anyway, really should be going now, perhaps back later
[18:31] <voidspace> dimitern: why don't we just use provider names in state instead of having restricted juju names requiring a transformation?
[18:31] <voidspace> because of binding syntax restrictions I suppose :-(
[18:31] <dimitern> and because we have provider ids on maas only - i.e. not the common ground
[18:32] <voidspace> dimitern: maas is the only place where we need discovery
[18:32] <voidspace> dimitern: so technically it is fully common ground...
[18:32] <dimitern> voidspace, I'll think about it tomorrow and I'm happy to listen to ideas how to generalize this approach
[18:32] <voidspace> but anyway, this is just a distraction
[18:33] <voidspace> life would be easier if we dropped the name restrictions and didn't have to do the transformation though
[18:33] <voidspace> (well - easier in places, maybe harder in others)
[18:33] <dimitern> yeah - mongo special chars in keys, and bad cli ux for constraints and bindings..
[18:34] <dimitern> there's a better way I'm sure
[18:35] <katco`> sinzui: hey, got past the problem. getting a new error "cannot read product data, invalid URL "https://us-east.manta.jpyemt.com/cpcjoyentsupport/public/juju-dist/tools/streams/v1/com.ubuntu.juju:devel:tools.json""
[18:35] <katco`> sinzui: what environments.yaml thing do i tweak to make that work?
[18:36] <katco`> sinzui: again he's using 2.0-alpha1
[18:37] <sinzui> katco`: per the annoucenment to the juju and juju-devel lists, users of 2.0-alpha1 in aws, joyent, and azure must set "agent-metadata-url: https://streams.canonical.com/juju/tools" which restore 1.x behaviour
[18:40] <katco`> sinzui: ty trying now
[18:40] <katco`> sinzui: sorry for the verbose questions, in a bar trying to get this to work lol
[18:41] <sinzui> katco`: :) that situation is crazy. by manually setting the streams to the default location that juju is already checking, it will find the agents in the public cloud it said it could not find.
[18:45] <katco`> sinzui: ty! that seems to be working
[18:52] <perrito666> cherylj: will get coffee, might be a couple of mins late depending on the expreso machine mood
[18:52] <cherylj> perrito666: np :)
[18:57] <perrito666> back, its so hot outside that the machine didnt need to pre-heat
[19:33] <frobware> cherylj, just wanted to say that dimiter has committed changes to his dev branch only. the tests that he mentioned in the meeting still need fixing but are simply commented out and skipped for now. Is it possible to get a CI run on his branch so we can look at the net result in the morning?
[19:34] <frobware> cherylj, PR -> https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/4255
[19:59] <mup> Bug #1540469 changed: [ARM64][LXD Provider][2.0-alpha1-0ubuntu1~16.04.1~juju1] juju run command ERROR fork/exec /usr/bin/ssh: cannot allocate memory <juju-core:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540469>
[20:05] <mup> Bug #1540469 opened: [ARM64][LXD Provider][2.0-alpha1-0ubuntu1~16.04.1~juju1] juju run command ERROR fork/exec /usr/bin/ssh: cannot allocate memory <juju-core:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540469>
[20:07] <natefinch> anyone online who knows how deploying bundles works with the juju client?
[20:07] <perrito666> natefinch: dont you need deployer for bundles?
[20:07] <natefinch> perrito666: it's been added to the client
[20:08] <mup> Bug #1540469 changed: [ARM64][LXD Provider][2.0-alpha1-0ubuntu1~16.04.1~juju1] juju run command ERROR fork/exec /usr/bin/ssh: cannot allocate memory <juju-core:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540469>
[20:09] <natefinch> it looks like we just blindly throw away all CLI flags if you target a bundle
[20:10]  * perrito666 is suddenly attacked in linkedin by solo recruiters offering the dream job, I wonder what is the algo that triggers those
[20:10] <natefinch> heh
[20:20] <lazypower|summit> natefinch - are you referring to the new "juju deploy" or python juju client?
[20:22] <thumper> cherylj: did you want to talk through those few bugs?
[20:23] <thumper> o/ lazypower|summit
[20:23] <lazypower|summit> \o heyo thumper
[20:24] <cherylj> thumper: give me a minute, I'm chatting with frobware
[20:24] <thumper> k
[20:24] <thumper> mramm: are we chatting today?
[20:24] <natefinch> lazypower|summit: juju deploy
[20:25] <lazypower|summit> natefinch - interesting, what flags were you passing that weren't respected? i can try to reproduce over here to confirm if you'd like
[20:25] <natefinch> lazypower|summit: I haven't actually tried it, was just looking at the code
[20:25] <rick_h__> thumper: he's in DE still and might be be around. after 9pm atm
[20:26] <lazypower|summit> rick_h__ - while i see that you're here - code challenge one. We still cool to riff on slides tomorrow am?
[20:26] <lazypower|summit> s/one/done/
[20:26] <rick_h__> lazypower|summit: definitely
[20:26] <lazypower|summit> <3 awesome. 'preciate you
[20:28] <natefinch> lazypower|summit: basically any deploy flag at all, other than storage, looks like we just drop on the floor... which, granted, most of them don't make sense when deploying a bundle... like series or numunits or spaces... it's just surprising that I don't see code to alert the user that they've typed a command that doesn't make any sense
[20:28]  * perrito666 discovers that the dual channel setup on his computer was the exact oposite than what is on the mobo manual...
[20:29] <lazypower|summit> natefinch - yeah, i can see that being obtuse... Messaging would be good there.
[20:29]  * lazypower|summit hattips
[20:29] <lazypower|summit> i'm outy 5k for now, see yinz tomorrow
[20:30] <perrito666> natefinch: it would be nice to yell one time per flag that doesnt make sense
[20:30] <perrito666> so we avoid the typicall loop that users have to endure on some apps to figure out all that is wrong
[20:30] <natefinch> perrito666: yeah, definitely.  but right now it won't yell at all, it just silently ignores the flags and deploys the bundle, which is far worse
[20:31] <perrito666> natefinch: sounds like you just bought yourself a bug report and a task? :p
[20:32] <thumper> lazypower|summit: how goes the summit?
[20:35] <mup> Bug #1540469 opened: [ARM64][LXD Provider][2.0-alpha1-0ubuntu1~16.04.1~juju1] juju run command ERROR fork/exec /usr/bin/ssh: cannot allocate memory <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540469>
[20:36] <cherylj> thumper: you still free?
[20:36] <thumper> cherylj: briefly
[20:37] <cherylj> thumper: standup HO?
[20:37] <thumper> kk
[20:47] <mup> Bug #1540580 opened: Broken symlink to charm breaks `juju deploy` <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540580>
[20:50] <mup> Bug #1540580 changed: Broken symlink to charm breaks `juju deploy` <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540580>
[20:53] <mup> Bug #1540580 opened: Broken symlink to charm breaks `juju deploy` <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540580>
[20:57] <frobware> cherylj, before I go... there will be no blessed build if the CI tests still exercise against MAAS 1.7 and 1.8. Just a heads-up.
[20:58] <cherylj> frobware: yes, thank you :)
[21:33] <natefinch> ericsnow: meeting?
[22:04] <cherylj> thumper: looks like master got a bless, so you can merge it
[22:04] <thumper> sweet!!
[22:04] <thumper> thanks
[22:08] <mup> Bug #1540647 opened: local provider: Name com.ubuntu.Upstart does not exist <kanban-cross-team> <landscape> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540647>
[22:41] <mup> Bug #1540647 changed: local provider: Name com.ubuntu.Upstart does not exist <kanban-cross-team> <landscape> <juju-core:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540647>
[22:41] <mup> Bug #1540650 opened: lxd provider: juju destroy-controller hangs <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1540650>
[23:15] <wallyworld> axw: anastasiamac: a minute late
[23:18] <anastasiamac> k. ping when ready
[23:19] <alexisb> anastasiamac, we are on bantering if you would like ot join us
[23:19] <alexisb> saying horrible things about wallyworld
[23:40] <alexisb> cherylj, sinzui I see that the maas-spaces branch failed
[23:40] <alexisb> any thoughts what is causes the deploys tests failing


[05:31] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[05:37] <lotuspsychje> happy new year to all ubuntu users & crew
[06:38] <gry> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-hwe-5.4/+bug/2000491 ubuntu 16.04 works ok for them, they think it's software issue in a newer version
[06:38] -ubottu:#ubuntu-discuss- Launchpad bug 2000491 in linux-hwe-5.4 (Ubuntu) "Dell Latitude 7390 running Ubuntu 18.04.6 fresh install system non-recoverable after screen lock and screen completely fades to black or after system goes into sleep" [Undecided, Invalid]
[06:39] <daftykins> gry: did you get anywhere having them check firmware?
[06:39] <gry> yes, they commented on the bug
[06:42] <daftykins> hmm i must be blind this morning
[10:53] <gry> where do the people who triage bugs sit on irc?
[10:58] <lotuspsychje> gry: there's #ubuntu-bugs if you like
[10:58] <lotuspsychje> gry: whats going on?
[11:03] <gry> nothing in particular, just would like to become more familiar with the process
[11:03] <gry> i did it for mozilla in some miniature quantities back in 2011 and it was fun
[11:03] <lotuspsychje> gry: we also got #ubuntu-bugs-announce + a small pre filter team helping the devs out
[11:04] <gry> does that team mostly go to irc too or not really
[11:05] <lotuspsychje> gry: well we got a lot of volunteers mixed up in helping on bugs from #ubuntu and here in -discuss too
[11:08] <lotuspsychje> gry: it also depends wich package you file against to find the proper bug channel
[11:10] <lotuspsychje> gry: the pre filter team uses this very handy wiki https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses to respond on bug filers
[16:42] <cartdrige> hoi.
[16:43] <cartdrige> Any of you guys use a digital assistant on Ubuntu?
[16:44] <cartdrige> like the google assistant, to sets alarms using voice, or to read out text, to get system info using audio, etc?


[00:07] <zacarias> Can you update xfce4 (to the latest version) from 10.10?
[00:10] <GridCube> dunno
[00:10] <GridCube> dont think so
[00:13] <csenger41> hello everyone :)
[00:13] <csenger41> could you help me why Empathy does not want to log in to MSN?
[00:15] <Artemis3> msn issue, in the meantime try amsn or pidgin
[00:16] <GridCube> or emesene
[00:16] <GridCube> the best of all
[00:16] <GridCube> :P
[00:22] <csenger41> im using gtalk and aim too and dont like pidgin, im missing bubble chat theme
[00:25] <jmcantrell> what's wrong with pidgin?
[00:35] <csenger41> its chat theme is so outdated
[00:36] <GridCube> also its pretty ugly
[00:36] <Unit193> You can change that :P
[00:36] <GridCube> and you can't disable notifications
[00:36] <csenger41> Unit193: i couldnt find adium themes for it
[00:38] <Artemis3> GridCube, notifications can be disabled and there is a plugin for libnotify
[00:38] <csenger41> well sorry guys i g2g now
[00:38] <csenger41> see ya later, bye :)
[00:38] <GridCube> Artemis3, how do you disable them?
[00:39] <Artemis3> see the preferences
[00:39] <GridCube> theres nothing there
[00:39] <GridCube> but i disabled the plugn libnotify
[00:41] <Artemis3> mine are disabled
[00:41] <Artemis3> its there somewhere
[00:42] <Unit193> Tools > Plugins > Libnotify popups
[00:43] <Artemis3> with the plugin enabled perhaps?
[00:43] <Artemis3> and change the config
 my desktop and application panel doesn't work. When i try run it in terminal i get Segmentation fault. (sorry for my english). Help me plz.
[01:18] <zus> can some one  please help me resolve these errors? http://pastebin.com/AHdwq6gA
[01:19] <spanther> zus, you need to import the correct keyring :)
[01:20] <zus> ive already redid the  kxstudio key ring, and still get the same errors.
[01:21] <spanther> so there are two solutions then. 1) the repository isn't reachable. 2) the keyring given is wrong :)
[01:21] <spanther> nothing you can change hehe
[01:21] <spanther> but you can contact the repository maintainer :)
[01:26] <zus> i have, at least the  lead dev before  comming in here.
[01:26] <zus> we redid the  ppa/key ring.
[01:28] <Artemis3> hmm this sounds like a topic for #ubuntu-devel
[01:28] <spanther> well at least it is very specific. nothing i could help with heh :)
[01:29] <Artemis3> ah never mind that doesnt include app devel
[01:30] <w30> Does xubuntu have a graphical find, search  utility?
[01:31] <zus> w30 would catfish help?
[01:31] <zus> menu>accessories>catfish
[01:31] <w30> zus, I donno, let me check..
[01:32] <zus> also application finder has worked for me with apps, it was in my  hidden bottom bar.
[01:36] <w30> zus app finder works well for apps in my experience
[01:37] <w30> zus I was interested in a grep for words or phrases in a file
[01:38] <w30> zus like finding all files with my name in them for example
[01:39] <kharnov> Hi. For some reason, my Xubuntu 11.10 install doesn't seem to remember my saved settings. For example, it keeps asking me what my default browser is, even though I've clearly set it to Google Chrome a dozen times.
[01:41] <zus> oh, there i dont know, of an app. and as i learn more about linux and use it more and more daily  i think i'd  prefer a command line for such
[01:51] <w30> zus, this is for a Windows defector that doesn't see a need to quote "do all that typing".
[01:52] <w30> zus "oh Wellll......"
[01:52] <GridCube> khaard, close a session without saving it, and then close a session saving it
[01:56] <zus> w30,  ahh. :)
[01:58] <kharnov> GridCube: thanks!
[02:17] <phunyguy> OK maybe I'm  just not doing something right, but I can't find a good gray-dark theme that actually changes the internal contents of a window.
[02:18] <phunyguy> stuff still stays light/white except the xfce-dusk theme
[02:18] <phunyguy> what am I doing wrong?
[02:19] <well_laid_lawn> find a dark gtk theme
[02:19] <phunyguy> I actually really like the current theme, just not the window colors
[02:20] <phunyguy> well_laid_lawn, if I do that, how do I select it without changing to the rest of the theme?
[02:20] <spanther> why? they are shiny silver nice! :)
[02:20] <phunyguy> I just want the inside of the windows to change
[02:20] <phunyguy> ack!
[02:20] <phunyguy> lol
[02:20] <spanther> i love this silver look :P
[02:20] <phunyguy> spanther go away ;)
[02:21] <spanther> aww :(
[02:21] <well_laid_lawn> you might have to edit one  yourself
[02:21] <phunyguy> as do i, just not with dark everything else.
[02:21] <GridCube> phunyguy, did you talk to ochosi ?
[02:22] <phunyguy> no, was I supposed to? lol
[02:22] <phunyguy> wait, what?
[02:23] <GridCube> phunyguy, ochosi is the master of costumizing xubuntu
[02:23] <knome> he's asleep already
[02:23] <GridCube> if he doesnt know how to help you no one can
[02:24] <spanther> phunyguy, what's about this one? http://xfce-look.org/content/show.php/Simply+Choice+1.0?content=142017
[02:26] <spanther> there you can find many themes for xfce :)
[02:40] <phunyguy> I've been on that site all day
[02:41] <phunyguy> and spanther, the insides are still gray
[02:42] <spanther> hmm :/
[02:43] <spanther> i'm sorry then
[02:49] <spanther> welcome back again grind xD
[02:56] <spanther> I do have an ALC662 Chipset Realtek HD-Audio with 5.1 feature. I have plugged in a 5.1 surround system over 3.5" to cinch cables.
[02:56] <spanther> how to setup my sound? :)
[02:59] <phunyguy> you know I just realized something.   My browsing has been working fantastic.  Maybe it took my ISP having a core router go down to fix it?
[03:01] <phunyguy> hmm that is a good question, spanther.  Not as easy as it is in Kubuntu / Ubuntu
[03:01] <spanther> hrhr *g*
[03:01] <phunyguy> wait, are you serious or not?
[03:01] <spanther> yep :)
[03:01] <spanther> i do have an Edifier S550 Soundsystem ;)
[03:01] <phunyguy> ok.  Well it seems to use Pulse Audio
[03:02] <spanther> look for it yourself :P
[03:02] <phunyguy> dont care to ;)
[03:03] <phunyguy> does Xubuntu have the same sound config capability as Ubuntu?
[03:03] <spanther> well inside sound settings i can enable elements for "HDA ATI SB (Alsa mixer)" Main, Surround, Center, LFE :/
[03:03] <spanther> but how to check their function?
[03:03] <phunyguy> as in test speakers?
[03:03] <spanther> yes
[03:03] <phunyguy> play a movie with surround sound
[03:03] <phunyguy> lol
[03:03] <spanther> in windows you have this realtek software where you click a speaker and then you hear if it is the right one :)
[03:04] <phunyguy> yeah Ubuntu has that
[03:04] <knome> speaker-test ?
[03:04] <phunyguy> wish I knew the name of the app
[03:04] <spanther> hmmm :/
[03:05] <spanther> oh and inside the windows realtek menu i can check sound upmix (fill channels) to use stereo upmixed as surround
[03:06] <well_laid_lawn> http://www.upubuntu.com/2011/06/how-to-test-speaker-channels-of-your.html
[03:06] <knome> well_laid_lawn, isn't that what i just said (speaker-test) :)
[03:07] <well_laid_lawn> yep and it gives the command for the surround sound test
[03:07] <phunyguy> well I remember in alsa, there are "profiles" which essentially do just that, spanther
[03:07] <spanther> okay i'll install speaker-test
[03:07] <knome> that will be different depending on the number of speakers you have
[03:07] <phunyguy> but I haven't messed with that stuff in forever.  I have a digital receiver which handles all that for me
[03:08] <phunyguy> via TOSLink
[03:08] <phunyguy> or whatever it's called
[03:08] <phunyguy> Optical.
[03:08] <spanther> toslink :)
[03:08] <spanther> i do use analog connections with 3.5" to cinch
[03:08] <phunyguy> yeah i got that
[03:08] <phunyguy> hopefully someone can help ya
[03:08] <phunyguy> i wont be much help
[03:09] <spanther> all 3 outputs from my soundcard. problem is, still on windows, i had to configure first, which output is what, so that the soundsystem worked right. so i think it could give problems here :(
[03:09] <spanther> if there is no way to switch the output (which output is LFE and so on)
[03:09] <phunyguy> you would be surprised.
[03:10] <spanther> speaker test says "error, ressource is used" lol
[03:11] <phunyguy> fail :)
[03:11] <spanther> i think it could be the pulseaudio sound daemon using this ressource :>
[03:12] <spanther> but a direct hardware test (which speaker-test does use) doesn't help me, if later pulseaudio still handles it wrong :)
[03:12] <spanther> so this speaker-test is no way :(
[03:15] <spanther> linux really needs a professional sound setup GUI tool for pulseaudio x.x
[03:15] <phunyguy> spanther: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PulseAudio#Using_PulseAudio
[03:16] <phunyguy> lots of good info there
[03:16] <spanther> thank you! :)
[03:17] <spanther> oh, i found an information here http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=795525 stating: gedit ~/.pulse/daemon.conf   line:  default-sample-channels = 2  to change into 6 :)
[03:17] <spanther> and restart
[03:19] <phunyguy> spanther: pavucontrolis the package you want
[03:19] <phunyguy> err
[03:19] <phunyguy> spanther: pavucontrol is the package you want
[03:19] <spanther> yay! :D
[03:19] <spanther> yes internal audio has a 5.1 profile
[03:20] <phunyguy> haha nice
[03:20] <phunyguy> upmixed click sounds and other crap
[03:20] <phunyguy> =D
[03:21] <spanther> lol
[03:21] <spanther> well i build a new starter for the bottom panel with pavucontrol
[03:21] <phunyguy> yeah it's my GTK theme that is all upset
[03:21] <phunyguy> is there a way to JUST change gtk theme in XFCE?
[03:23] <spanther> I wonder why pavucontrol wasn't shipped out of the box :)
[03:24] <spanther> with "gnome-audio" as icon to display it looks nice
[03:25] <spanther> do i have to reboot?
[03:26] <phunyguy> i wouldnt think so.  It is controlling the existing pulse-audio
[03:26] <phunyguy> which is QUITE dynamic
[03:28] <w30> agemoi102
[03:28] <spanther> phunyguy, oh, maybe you can use it one day. http://www.halfgaar.net/surround-sound-in-linux
[03:28] <spanther> many tweaks i found now for upmix and so on :)
[03:28] <phunyguy> k
[03:29] <spanther> he offers a check file! :D
[03:29] <spanther> point 6 testing ^^
[03:30] <phunyguy> with that being said, I am going to sleep.
[03:30] <spanther> n8 :)
[06:52] <MVanDruff> hello
[06:53] <MVanDruff> is there a way to expand my xubuntu partition
[07:41] <kirua> whats the difference between xubuntu and xfce ?
[07:42] <Sysi> xubuntu uses xfce, xfce can be used on other distributions too
[07:43] <kirua> no cause i can choose between xubuntu and xfce at the start
[07:50] <kirua> i wonder what are the differences
[07:51] <Sysi> xubuntu-session loads xubuntu default settings if you select it on first login, xfce-session loads upstream defaults
[07:51] <Sysi> after first login your own settings override those
[13:32] <daniel> Hello! I just switched to xubuntu & I have a 2nd-monitor setup issue.
[13:32] <daniel> I get an error when opening the display settings "Unable to query the version of the RandR extension being used"
[13:32] <daniel> Can anyone help?
[13:36] <TheSheep> daniel: are you using some 3rd party graphics drivers?
[13:41] <daniel> Not as far as I know
[13:44] <kritztopf> hello there, i am running into problems with the alternate installation cd
[13:45] <kritztopf> seems like the installer can't find libsasl2-modules required by some packages
[13:45] <kritztopf> and the bugfix announced on launchpad is nowhere to be found on the internet
[14:55] <orgthingy> hello, I just switched from ubuntu to xubuntu..how can I enlarge the font size in the panel and so on?
[14:55] <orgthingy> seems too small
[14:57] <orgthingy> actually nevermind, problem solved
[15:05] <baizon> nice :)
[15:08] <orgthingy> baizon: any idea on how to make the 2 panels look like classic GNOME panels?
[15:08] <orgthingy> like, the application-windows on the bottom and so on
[15:08] <baizon> orgthingy: yes
[15:08] <orgthingy> instead of having a list of app-bubbles on the bottom
[15:08] <baizon> right click
[15:08] <baizon> panel preferences
[15:09] <baizon> and then just cahnge it
[15:09] <orgthingy> baizon: been there, I guess I have to look arund
[15:09] <orgthingy> 'til I get everything right
[15:10] <baizon> yep
[15:10] <baizon> just need to take a look around the system
[15:10] <baizon> then you will get it :)
[15:11] <orgthingy> the last time I used XFCE was maybe 2 years ago, or 3
[15:11] <orgthingy> baizon: things improved greatly
[15:11] <orgthingy> loads are switching to xubuntu since ubuntu's "unity" is just horrible
[15:12] <baizon> i know :D
[15:12] <baizon> i switchd 2 years ago
[15:12] <baizon> xfce 4.8 has many improvements
[15:15] <orgthingy> baizon: it's lovely
[15:15] <orgthingy> I greatly thank the XFCE community for such an improvement
[15:15] <orgthingy> well done
[15:55] <jmcantrell> is it possible that 4.10 might be in a ppa whenever it gets released?
[15:57] <baizon> yes it will be in a ppa for sure
[16:00] <jmcantrell> do you think it would be safe-ish to install on oneiric?
[16:00] <jmcantrell> i'm really looking forward to this thunar desktop integration thing
[16:01] <baizon> i dont know :)
[16:01] <baizon> but i wont install it from a ppa
[16:01] <baizon> i will wait until 12.10
[16:02] <jmcantrell> bah :)
[16:06] <jmcantrell> i am so in love with XFCE right now. i feel like i'm back to what attracted me to linux in the first place :)
[16:08] <baizon> :)
[17:40] <ironfoot> Hi, just installed 11.10 xubuntu. Really nice accept i can't browse pc's on the network through the file manager
[17:40] <ironfoot> ?
[17:42] <madnick> !gigolo
[17:42] <TheSheep> !info gigolo
[17:42] <madnick> sorry wrong name
[17:42] <madnick> oh
[17:42] <ironfoot> ta
[18:39] <stephane56> bonjour
[18:39] <stephane56> j'ai installé xubuntu11.10
[18:40] <stephane56> j'ai un souci a l'affichage il me met coupure 92.7 khz 58hz
[18:40] <TheSheep> !fr
[18:40] <TheSheep> stephane56: sorry, we don't speak French :(
[18:41] <stephane56> dommage je parle pas en anglais
[19:05] <eNepper> Hi how do I enable numlock at login?
[19:08] <baizon> eNepper: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/NumLock
[19:15] <plasticdoc> @ baizon & eNepper: Obviously that won't work
[19:15] <baizon> plasticdoc: ?
[19:15] <plasticdoc> 1st install:    sudo apt-get install numlockx
[19:16] <plasticdoc> 2nd:         printf "\ntest -x /usr/bin/numlockx && /usr/bin/numlockx on\n" >> "$HOME/.profile";grep ^ "$HOME/.profile"
[19:16] <plasticdoc> All the other usual tweaks won't work in the latest Xubuntu (11.10)
[19:17] <baizon> ok
[19:17] <plasticdoc> won't work:         sudo sed -i '$ a\greeter-setup-script=/usr/bin/numlockx' /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf
[19:17] <plasticdoc> won't work:          printf "[Desktop Entry]\nVersion=1.0\nType=Application\nName=numlockx\nExec=/usr/bin/numlockx\nStartupNotify=false\nTerminal=false\nHidden=false\n" > "$HOME/.config/autostart/numlockx.desktop"
[19:18] <plasticdoc> won't work:        (cd ~/.config/autostart;ln -s $(which numlockx))
[19:19] <plasticdoc> There seems to be "something wrong with the 'xubuntu-default-settings' package
[19:19] <plasticdoc> and/or in the way the scripts in /etc/xdg/xdg-xubuntu/ are processed
[19:19] <plasticdoc> during or after lightdm."
[19:19] <knome> !pastebin
[19:19] <knome> plasticdoc, please
[19:20] <puff> It appears that xubuntu-desktop or xfce maps alt-insert to add virtual desktops to my workspace... It's interfering with another alt-insert mapping in the IDE I'm using. How do I disable this?
[19:36] <TNorris> compiz has a nice shortcuts to use the numpad to position windows on the screen in a grid. does xfwm4 support the same sort of shortcuts?
[23:02] <arnaud_d> Hi ! May I ask you something about lunching scripts with Xubuntu ?
[23:02] <knome> !ask
[23:04] <arnaud_d> Ok Thanks. I have been under xubuntu for 2 weeks now and I miss the windows that pops under Ubuntu when you double-click on a script file. I'm talking about the window that offers you the choice to run the program in a terminal. Is there a way to make this window appear under xubuntu ?
[23:05] <knome> unfortunately, i don't think so
[23:08] <arnaud_d> Thank you knome for your answer. This is probably a gnome-dependant stuff. Anyway, how do you run scripts that need terminal ? Do you open a temrinal fisrt (right click > Open terminal here) and then $./YourProg.sh ?
[23:08] <knome> yes, that is the easiest way
[23:12] <arnaud_d> Ok fine. I would like to take the opportunity to say thank you to the guys who work on xubuntu. It's a great distrib. I was bored with Unity so I changed and this freedom is priceless. Thank you and see you soon.
[23:12] <knome> no problem, and enjoy xubuntu


[18:45] <bobweaver> gosh people just do not listen sometimes lol
[18:47] <bobweaver> mhall119,  let me try to explain something to you about qt and qml
[18:47] <bobweaver> 1) gtk is supported
[18:48] <bobweaver> 2)  you can make c++ files in your project then export them to qml in a Plugin file
[18:48] <bobweaver> if I have the file filemanager.cpp and .h in my files
[18:48] <bobweaver> I can Now Make a file called "plugin.cpp "
[18:49] <bobweaver> in this file called plugin.cpp I add the header file
[18:49] <bobweaver> #include "plugin.h"
[18:49] <bobweaver> #include "filemanager.h"
[18:49] <bobweaver> void PLUGINNAME::registerTypes(const char *uri)
[18:50] <bobweaver> {
[18:50] <bobweaver>     qmlRegisterType<FileManager>(uri, 0, 1, "FileManager");
[18:50] <bobweaver> }
[18:51] <bobweaver> Now when I build my project it compiles and tells QML that there is now NEW   ELEMENT called FileManager
[18:51] <bobweaver> Now In my main.qml    I can do stuff Like
[18:51] <bobweaver> include PLUGINNAME
[18:52] <bobweaver> FileManager {id:foo; what ever what ever what ever }
[18:52] <bobweaver> woops forgot to add PLUGINNAME version number but I hope that you understand this now
[18:52] <bobweaver> mhall119,  do you understand ?
[18:53] <bobweaver> or have any questions
[18:54] <bobweaver> why I say this is because One does Not need to put 500 plugins into the sdk kit
[18:54] <bobweaver> this will slow it down and make use more ram
[18:54] <bobweaver> that is how a plugin is made That is how the SDK kit is made
[18:55] <bobweaver> But Like the SDK kit is is mainly only QML files that there doing that with
[18:58] <bobweaver> mhall119,  Please dont take all that ^^^ as I am talking down to you that is not what I am trying to do. What I am trying to do is show you that there is other ways
[18:59] <bobweaver> No need to include things in the SDK kit that are not needed you know what I am saying ?
[18:59] <bobweaver> as All the sdk kit is is a altered Desktop.Compents thingy as it seems
[18:59] <bobweaver> things that need to be add3ed are things like
[18:59] <bobweaver> Box2d
[18:59] <bobweaver> tiles
[19:00] <bobweaver> not to the SDK kit but to the QT repo
[19:00] <bobweaver> and if one wants true control of a gnome desktop then
[19:00] <bobweaver> dconf-qt
[19:00] <bobweaver> that is so imporant that it is driving me NUTS
[19:01] <bobweaver> it makes it so one can connect to any dbus
[19:01] <bobweaver> say com.canonical.Unity.HomeLens
[19:01] <bobweaver> org.gnome.desktop.nataulius
[19:02] <bobweaver> if one can connect to them things and alter them then one can alter there desktop
[19:02] <bobweaver> and even keep them files in say something like UBuntu One
[19:02] <bobweaver> so when they change one desktop it changes them all over the cloud
[19:03] <mhall119> bobweaver: sorry, in the middle of other things atm, I'll go through the scroll back when I have a minute
[19:04] <bobweaver> cool mhall119  just remeber that you know 50X more about community stuff then I do I give you props for that please tihnk about that when I talk about QML
[19:04] <bobweaver> that came out wrong :/
[19:04] <mhall119> I get you, don't worry
[19:09] <bobweaver> mhall119,  here is a example of a plugin file that calls Libdee libbamf ect
[19:10] <bobweaver> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1683614/
[19:10] <bobweaver> look at line 221
[19:11] <bobweaver> see I am calling all them things to be now set as objects in qml
[19:11] <bobweaver> and at bottom
[19:11] <bobweaver> Q_EXPORT_PLUGIN2(Unity2d, Unity2dPlugin);
[19:12] <bobweaver> whamo we now have a new plugin called unity2d 1.0 that we can all all them c++ elements that are in that file
[19:12] <bobweaver> again came out wrong
[19:13] <bobweaver> and QConf [19:25] <bobweaver> mhall119,  maybr you can help promote this https://plus.google.com/u/0/113051860352311525753/posts/evD4GukaN9J
[20:26] <bobweaver> mhall119,  when you get a chance can you look at this and tell me if there is More things that I should Add ?  Please and Thanks
[20:26] <bobweaver> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1683997/
[20:26] <bobweaver> README file ^^


[03:01] <mpt> tedg, around?
[03:02] <tedg> mpt: Of course!
[03:02] <tedg> I await your ping!
[03:02] <mpt> good boy
[03:03] <mpt> tedg, why is ~/.config/indicators/messages/applications-blacklist/whatever a text file containing the pathname of a .desktop file, rather than an actual symlink to that .desktop file?
[03:03] <tedg> mpt: Mosty because I figured we'd have to put more data in it at some point.
[03:03] <mpt> ok, that makes sense
[03:04] <tedg> mpt: Probably should have made a GKeyFile or something, but, eh?
[03:04] <mpt> I don't know what that is, but this smells like a job for xattrs :-)
[03:04] <mpt> doesn't really matter
[03:05] <tedg> I think everything should be XML.  People love XML.  It's hip.
[03:06] <tedg> Honestly though, after using the json-glib I'd probably consider using JSON for more things.  It's very flexible and pretty simple to write.
[03:43] <mpt> tedg, so perhaps the per-app custom actions should be defined in that same file?
[03:44] <mpt> probably they would map to command lines
[03:44] <tedg> mpt: Yes.  Perhaps.  It also makes sense at some level to put it in the .desktop file.
[03:44] <mpt> "New Message" = some-mail-client --compose
[04:09] <mpt> durnit


[04:00] <kargi> Why does firefox reset to the ubuntu mate start page everytime I close it?
[04:02] <hggdh> kargi: because this page is set as the home page?
[04:03] <kargi> No, I change the home page to duckduckgo.
[04:03] <kargi> And everytime i'd close it, it'll change the default home page to the ubuntu mate start page.
[04:04] <kargi> It's annoying.
[04:04] <hggdh> then I don't know
[04:04] <kargi> This didn't happen on 16.04.
[04:05] <kargi> I'm currently on 17.10.
[05:38] <atheernisan> hi
[05:42] <atheernisan> hi
[09:06] <nextsigner> hello
[11:29] <BubuIIC> Hey! I upgraded to Ubuntu Mate 17.10 and now all my windows have an annoying fade-out/fade-in time.
[11:29] <BubuIIC> Using Marco GPU compositor
[11:29] <BubuIIC> I didn't find a setting for this anywhere
[11:29] <BubuIIC> Any idea where I can find further information/the appropriate bug-tracker?
[11:29] <BubuIIC> "Enable Animations" in MATE Tweak - Windows is already disabled
[14:03] <mate|57967> Hi there, can someone help me with skype 8 statusbar indicator, how can i enable it?
[14:27] <sixwheeledbeast> not on 17.10 yet so not sure about your animation issue, I recall someone asking about something similar yesterday tho.
[14:36] <Lengsdorfer> 1st try: start mate-tweak as root.
[14:46] <BubuIIC> sixwheeledbeast: that was me I guess ;-)
[14:47] <BubuIIC> Lengsdorfer: will do
[14:50] <sixwheeledbeast> yep
[14:52] <BubuIIC> Lengsdorfer: doesn't seem to make any difference
[15:56] <ejmcoding> ok anyone on here that can help me with getting my computer working properly
[16:01] <marosg> ejmcoding - hard to tell as you did not tell what is wrong. Start with what problem you have and see if somebody can have an advice
[16:06] <ejmcoding> ok I install ubuntu mate on my new hd and install steam through the .deb file through software bouique and it wont run I've updated it, installed winehq
[18:40] <sixwheeledbeast> You don't need wine for steam
[21:12] <Khan89> this is weird, has anoye experienced the Caja Dropbox tray icon showing a blank menu when righ-clicking it??
[22:52] <sixwheeledbeast> yes i have had that happen


[22:51] <mimp> Just installed ubuntu studio - was working wonderfully with my RME card until I got cocky and started playing with jack buffer sizes. Choked on 16 and now can't boot jack regardless of settings. Any idea what's up?
[22:52] <mimp> have tried doing a hard restart and deleting .config/jack
[22:53] <mimp> [1m[31mERROR: Failed to acquire device name : Audio0 error : Cannot allocate memory[0m
[22:53] <mimp>  is the error I'm getting
[22:56] <len-dt> Have you tried removing .jackdrc? mimp
[22:58] <mimp> nope, but just did and still getting the same :)
[22:59] <len-dt> Thats about what I know....
[23:00] <ailo> mimp: You mean, after you tried 16, nothing else works?
[23:00] <ailo> Just being thorough
[23:00] <mimp> yup
[23:00] <ailo> mimp: Have you tried rebooting in between?
[23:01] <ailo> Not that you have to, but that would help
[23:01] <mimp> yes, even tried completely disconnecting the power in case there was anything stored on the card that had got messed up.
[23:01] <ailo> The buffer size should not matter at all
[23:01] <ailo> So, that's not it
[23:02] <ailo> mimp: what is the device called?
[23:03] <mimp> um, it's just hw:0 I think
[23:04] <ailo> mimp: Ok. Did you try the others?
[23:04] <ailo> mimp: Each time you reboot, the order of the cards might change
[23:05] <mimp> yup - none of them work. There's only the one card in this machine as the on-board audio is disabled so I don't think ordering should be an issue.
[23:07] <ailo> mimp: Ok, but if you see something called hw:1, that means you have at least one more device attached
[23:08] <ailo> Actually, it could be a midi device!
[23:08] <ailo> Doesn't mean you can use it for audio though. qjackctl just thinks so
[23:09] <mimp> nope, just hw:0, /dev/audio, dev/dsp and plughw:0
[23:09] <ailo> mimp: If you had the device working, there's nothing saying you can't have it working once again.
[23:09] <len-dt> mimp, Can you get it to work without jack? Like with pulse and the audacious?
[23:10] <mimp> How does alsa/jack lock devices? could there be a lock file left over somewhere that's stopping it grabbing the thing? (just guessing)
[23:10] <mimp> hang on, hadn't actually thought to try that
[23:11] <ailo> mimp: jack uses alsa drivers, so if you are using that device with pulseaudio, jack will try to grab the device
[23:11] <ailo> Both jack and pulse use alsa
[23:11] <len-dt> It seems to me I have heard that some RME devices need to be set up with alsamixer
[23:11] <ailo> If you suspect there's an error in the grabbing, try enabling the onboard device, and let pulse use that
[23:12] <ailo> mimp: I actually use PA with onboard, and jack with a M-audio device. Connecting them through a mixer
[23:12] <ailo> Simultaniously
[23:12] <mimp> pulseaudio doesn't seem to work either
[23:13] <mimp> will allow playback but no sound and no moving meters in hdspmixer
[23:13] <mimp> hdspconf still seems to react to changes though so it's not enirely dead (I can change sampe rate for instance)
[23:14] <mimp> I was working with both (individually) initially, which is why it's weird it's broken
[23:14] <mimp> I = it
[23:14] <ailo> mimp: Ok, so it seems you have gone through a lot of alternatives. I would recommend asking on #opensourcemusicians and #ardour where there might be people who have the same device
[23:15] <ailo> mimp: That is strange in deed
[23:16] <ailo> mimp: Also, do please subscribe to the LAU mail list, and ask questions there. http://www.music.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user/
[23:16] <ailo> And don't be a stranger to the Ubuntu forum either http://ubuntuforums.org/
[23:17] <mimp> ok, well cheers for your help = think I'm going to try a reboot into windows to check it's not just randomly died then might just start again - only installed ubuntu studio this evening so don't have much to lose
[23:17] <ailo> mimp: If a reboot to windows helps, then it's clearly a harwdware problem
[23:17] <ailo> And then you need to get cumfy with the mixer
[23:18] <ailo> I mean, if you get sound on Linux again after that
[23:18] <ailo> And that would mean it is alsa related
[23:19] <mimp> ah the hdsp mixer is pretty much the same, just without channel grouping.
[23:19] <mimp> should really poke around in the source and fix that
[23:19] <mimp> once I have sound :)
[23:20] <mimp> anyhow, cheers for the help, cya later/
[23:24] <ailo> Well, that was an odd problem
[23:24] <mimp> ok that sorted it out straight away
[23:24] <ailo> mimp: Oh?
[23:24] <ailo> Do tell
[23:24] <mimp> my guess is that this card doesn't actually support buffer sizes that low and asking it to screws it up until you go for a valid size
[23:25] <mimp> but that is a guess
[23:25] <ailo> mimp: It's a valid guess
[23:25] <ailo> Most cards do not support 16
[23:26] <mimp> I have absolutely no need to have latencies that low, i was just seeing how far I could push it
[23:26] <ailo> Don't know how that works, but in practice, if you can get 64, you're good
[23:26] <ailo> I would say 64 is a good lower limit
[23:26] <ailo> 32 is great, if you can get it to work without xruns
[23:27] <ailo> 16, only a few cards can handle
[23:27] <ailo> And I have no idea why
[23:27] <ailo> USB, not usually
[23:27] <ailo> pci, yes
[23:27] <mimp> this is a pci card, but I'm perfectly happy with 64
[23:28] <mimp> seems rock solid too
[23:28] <ailo> mimp: If you do get xruns on that install, using 64 as buffer size, do tell
[23:29] <mimp> will do
[23:29] <mimp> have to say this has been way less painful then any other time I've messed about with linux audio
[23:29] <ailo> mimp: If you want to try a kernel that might be a bit better at performance, try this https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BuildOldLowlatency
[23:30] <mimp> ah cheers, will have a look at that if I hit problems
[23:32] <ailo> mimp: Cheers. Midsummer cheers, in fact!
[23:32] <len-dt> ailo, thats funny we call it the first day of summer here...
[23:33] <ailo> len-dt: Yeah? It is the longes day of the year
[23:33] <ailo> That is also why christmas is actually midwinter
[23:33] <len-dt> I know. Summer vacation for school starts in another week...
[23:34] <ailo> Ahaa
[23:34] <len-dt> Here dec 21 is the first day of winter
[23:35] <mimp> :-), reminds me I should get to sleep, shortest night so not all that much left of it. Thanks again especially to any of you that are involved with this release, between this and ardour 3 linux is actually turning into something I want to use for audio.
[23:35] <ailo> Sounds about right. It's really the only reason for the holiday. Originally, perhaps, there was a religious context. Eventually, the church adopted some of that, but in the end: it's just a holidayu
[23:36] <ailo> mimp: There's a bug with qjackctl + jack, which hopefully is solved soon
[23:36] <ailo> Otherwise I agree
[23:37] <ailo> Actually, with A3, newer jack, and a lot of other things, might be LTS will seem quite boring
[23:38] <mimp> have been using A3 a lot at work for editing, actually prefer it over pro tools for simple stuff as it doesn't take a week to boot up
[23:38] <ailo> len-dt: Around here, midsummer is huge though. Herring, vodka, potatoes. And singing "little frogs" while jumping around the midsummer pole
[23:38] <mimp> just does some really weird stuff like numbering exported regions from the end of the playlist
[23:39] <mimp> put that down to its unique charm
[23:39] <ailo> mimp: haven't yet done any real work on that. a2 was not good enough for me. Got mixbus. Seems ok (with the fx)
[23:39] <ailo> a3 seems ok. just need to get my hands dirty first
[23:40] <len-dt> ailo, Canada day (jul1 ) and the US jul 4 get more time around here.
[23:40] <mimp> yeah I've not done any proper mixes, just use it for chopping/tidying stuff up
[23:40] <ailo> len-dt: Is july 1 national day?
[23:40] <len-dt> Here in Canada Ya.
[23:41] <ailo> mimp: Same here. But once I got serious, I did have some problems. Hopefully those will shortly disappear
[23:41] <len-dt> The US probably grabbed July 4 in the same way as the church used christmas.
[23:41] <ailo> len-dt: What's the thing with july 4th then?
[23:41] <mimp> was impressed by their bug-squashing speed, reported a problem and it was fixed in svn within 24 hours
[23:42] <ailo> mimp: That is a strong point in open source
[23:42] <ailo> Happens to me to
[23:42] <ailo> You can contact with the guy in charge
[23:42] <len-dt> July 4 is supposed to be the US birthday. Canada took july 1 to be first I think.
[23:42] <ailo> (-with)
[23:44] <ailo> len-dt: So Canada had a birthday, and US stole the concept?
[23:46] <ailo> I'm born on a beautilful day
[23:46] <ailo> Finnish liberation day
[23:46] <ailo> I'm like a super-Finn
[23:48] <len-dt> ailo, other way around, The US is about 100 years older.
[23:53] <ailo> len-dt: Funny you would say that. It used to be the other way around. Wouldn't say US is 100 years older, but maybe a bit behind in some areas. That is not for me to say..
[23:53] <ailo> In other areas of course..
[23:54] <ailo> Oh, just to clarify. Finnish liberation took place 6th of December