[23:18] <cellofellow> it's, well, not working ever since I installed Avant Window Navigator, used its notification daemon, and now decided to just use GNOME panels.
[23:19] <shawn__> Section "Device"
[23:19] <shawn__> 	Identifier	"InteATI RADEON X1300"
[23:19] <shawn__> 	Boardname	"ati"
[23:19] <shawn__> 	Busid		"PCI:3:0:0"
[23:19] <shawn__> 	Driver		"fglrx"
[23:19] <shawn__> 	Screen	0
[23:19] <FloodBot3> shawn__: Please don't flood, use http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org to paste, don't use Enter as punctuation.
[23:19] <shawn__> EndSection this is my section for my ati card does anyone know hwo i could get 3d working
[23:19] <spork969> Sorry, let me clarify. I have about 75 pictures and i need to rename them all
[23:19] <cellofellow> where are notification-daemon's settings or library's kept? It still works in other user accounts so I think it's something to do with the configs.
[23:19] <spork969> but I would prefer not to have to do it one by one. also, it would be nice to know how to do it for later use
[23:20] <leroy> you have pictures i have folders :)
[23:20] <shawn__> i have fglrx as my driver but in my restriced drives my computer says im using my ati driver
[23:20] <ArthurArchnix> spork969: I used to use this wicked  little app... come to think of it... I haven't reinstalled it since reinstalling gutsy... one sec...
[23:20] <IndyGunFreak> cellofellow: notification-daemon?   you talking about the mail-notification applet in the system tray?
[23:20] <Chese> ok, better question.  Is it necessary to upgrade to 7.10 before I can use Rhythmbox 0.11.2?
[23:20] <cellofellow> spork969: there's this bulk-rename program called Metamorphose I found on getdeb.net.
[23:20] <tsukasa_> hey, do i have to do anything special for compiling a new kernel for wubi? i got the latest rc6-b1 kernel last night and its crashing on a loop mount error
[23:20] <shawn__> doea anyone know that if that is happening and ym drivers are only for 2d can i get 3d gl out of it
[23:21] <cellofellow> IndyGunFreak: no, I'm talking about the underlying system that does the little popups involved with Pidgin and Update-Notifier and other programs like that.
[23:21] <snypzz> hello all
[23:21] <IndyGunFreak> cellofellow: gotcha, no clue on that one
[23:21] <moparisthebest> how can i change the keyboard layout for the whole computer?
[23:21] <snypzz> anyone get the media player to play dvd's
[23:21] <snypzz> anyone get the media player to play dvd's ??/
[23:22] <snypzz> anyone get the movie player to play dvd's ??/
[23:22] <snypzz> anyone get the movie player to play dvd's ?
[23:22] <darkscript_> yum install libdvdcss
[23:22] <spork969> cellofellow: i would prefer to just use some scripting
[23:22] <darkscript_> erm...apt-get install libdvdcss
[23:22] <ArthurArchnix> spork969: found it!
[23:22] <Ward1983> is there some package i need to install to read DVDs burned by a mac?
[23:23] <tems> Hey guys - I'm getting the following error during Ubuntu installation:  file://cdrom/pool/main/p/perl/perl_5.8.8-7ubuntu_i386.deb was corrupt [Go Back] [Continue]
[23:23] <cellofellow> spork969: ok, well, just learn all the ins and outs of BASH then, which will do what you want.
[23:23] <Ward1983> (an old powerpc nased laptop)
[23:23] <Ward1983> based
[23:23] <ArthurArchnix> spork969: Installing now. :) I love this app. It's called pyrenamer.  sudo apt-get install pyrenamer
[23:23] <sushicucumber> im curious about the ln -s command. after reading on the net, ln -s file1 file2 creates a symbolic link from file2 to file1...my question: what exactly does this do? why would someone *want to make a symbolic link??
[23:23] <tems> I got it for another file a few seconds earlier but I hit continue without noting the name.  Should I just ignore these warnings?
[23:23] <Flannel> !repeat | snypzz
[23:23] <ubotu> snypzz: Don't feel ignored and repeat your question quickly; if nobody knows your answer, nobody will answer you. You can search https://help.ubuntu.com or http://wiki.ubuntu.com while you wait. Also see !patience
[23:23] <spork969> ArthurArchnix: great, however, i would prefer to use scripting... =[... not a huge fan of installing apps just for a single use
[23:23] <Starnestommy> sushicucumber: so that if they try to go to file2, they'll get file1
[23:24] <Flannel> cellofellow: I believe pidgin does it via this extension: http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/pidgin-guifications
[23:24] <mj> Sorry to keep spamming, but does anyone know how to mess around with display settings in Ubuntu?
[23:24] <cellofellow> snypzz: for DVD's I use VLC and libdvdcss2 from Medibuntu.
[23:24] <sushicucumber> why not just do cp file1 location2 ?
[23:24] <santookA> hey ppl
[23:24] <spork969> snypzz: use VLC, it plays DVDs along with everything else
[23:24] <Ward1983> mj, what kind of display settings?
[23:24] <Starnestommy> sushicucumber: because cp doesn't also copy changes to the files after it's done
[23:24] <ArthurArchnix> tems: Risky. Looks like you got a bad disk. I'd reboot and do a disk check. It's possible you'll be able to install. But then again, if you come to the grub part and there's problems with that part of the disk you could be left with an unbootable system :(
[23:24] <ArthurArchnix> tems probably not worth the risk
[23:24] <santookA> this is the first time for me to enter an urc chanel for linux newbies
[23:24] <tsukasa_> hey, do i have to do anything special for compiling a new kernel for wubi? i got the latest rc6-b1 kernel last night and its crashing on a loop mount error
[23:24] <cellofellow> Flannel: no, it's pidgin-libnotify. Problem is libnotify doesn't work.
[23:24] <snypzz> not working for me
[23:25] <santookA> and i wanted to ask this
[23:25] <mj> Ward: I need to get S-video out to a television working on an IBM thinkpad T42 and Ubuntu Gutsy, and I have no idea where to start
[23:25] <snypzz> is there some plugin I need?
[23:25] <Flannel> mj: What type of graphics card?
[23:25] <Ward1983> mj, /etc/X!!/xorg.conf ! :)
[23:25] <ArthurArchnix> Sounds like you want to look into sed spork969
[23:25] <santookA> i got nvidia card and since then there's a strange buzz coming out of the speakers
[23:25] <Ward1983> X11 i mean
[23:25] <sushicucumber> oh hmm.. is there an example of why you would do it? like something that you did ln -s that was helpful?
[23:25] <Javid> mj: I'm on an A31p with the same need :p
[23:25] <santookA> i guess it's the sound of the hard disk
[23:25] <Ward1983> mj, so its /etc/X11/xorg.conf i made a type
[23:25] <Ward1983> typo
[23:26] <kris_ph> how to know what''s the latest django available at repo?
[23:26] <Flannel> kris_ph: Which Ubuntu version?
[23:26] <SkillerCow> What would be someting equivlent to DVD Shrink on windows ?
[23:26] <kris_ph> gutsy
[23:26] <JohnMM> !info django | kris_ph
[23:26] <ubotu> kris_ph: Package django does not exist in gutsy
[23:26] <santookA> does anyone knows what's wrong with my pc?
[23:26] <sushicucumber> why not just go and open file 1 and not link it with file 2? (ln -s file1 file2)
[23:26] <Flannel> !k9 | SkillerCow
[23:26] <ubotu> SkillerCow: For playing DVD, see http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/desktopguide/C/video.html - "libdvdcss2" can be found at !Medibuntu or (for Feisty and earlier) http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeveasPackages - Try k9copy (available in !Universe) for backing up DVDs
[23:26] <santookA> why am i getting this buzz?
[23:26] <mj> Ward/Flannel: I am using an ATI Radeon Mobility M7... And what am I supposed to do with xorg.conf? I am a total newbie, thanks for the help
[23:26] <kris_ph> no.. I installed it using apt-get command
[23:27] <kris_ph> ubotu might be outdated.. :)
[23:27] <tems> Arthur - OK thanks for the advice
[23:27] <Ward1983> mj, you need to check for TV out settings for your card, you can probably google them, and then try them, but ALLWAYS backup your original xorg.conf first, so you can replace it using the CLI, the graphics wont work with wrong xorg settings :)
[23:27] <Flannel> kris_ph: the python-django package?
[23:27] <tems> Might just install from Wubi to ensure no disk problems
[23:27] <kris_ph> Flannel: http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/all/python-django/filelist
[23:28] <Flannel> kris_ph: p.u.c will give you a version number.  Also, apt-cache policy python-django will as well.
[23:28] <Ward1983> so make sure you know how to copy files using the CLI (and nano is a CLi based text editor you can use if you want to edit xorg.conf from CLI)
[23:28] <mj> Ward: This process sounds intimidating. So I should google for the correct configuration file, replace the existing one, and hope for the best? What do I do if everything goes to hell?
[23:28] <kris_ph> I just wonder why ubotu was telling lie :)
[23:28] <sushicucumber> thanks for the help on the ln -s command.. i guess i still dont get why you would need to make a symbolic link.. why not just go to file1 and open it there, instead of making a link from file2 back to file1?
[23:28] <chaosrl> hey guys, i just upgraded to hardy, and i have a few problems. the first of which is: how do i get audio?
[23:29] <ezeki3l> can someone recomend an unexpensive RAID card for Sata drives that work with ubuntu, preferebly that has some kind of BIOS layer for RAID opeartions and is independant of OS?
[23:29] <Flannel> mj: No.  Don't do that.  You'll need to install a driver that supports it.  Whether thats the closed ATI one or the open aTI one, that's what you need to know.
[23:29] <Flannel> chaosrl: #ubuntu+1 for Hardy support, thanks.
[23:29] <chaosrl> Flannel, thanks!
[23:29] <Ward1983> mj, make a backup and make sure you can replace and copy files using the CLI (a terminal)
[23:29] <kris_ph> !django
[23:29] <ubotu> django is a high level python web framework that encourages rapid development and clean, pragmatic design. - see http://www.djangoproject.com
[23:29] <Ward1983> mj, so if it goes wrong you can put the backup back
[23:29] <Rezagrats> Xvidcap keeps crashing on ubuntu 7.10 is there a fix to this ?
[23:29] <krz> hello all
[23:30] <Ward1983> mj, if it goes wrong ubuntu will boot into CLI (command line interface)
[23:30] <krz> what version of ubuntu do i need to install gnome?
[23:30] <tsukasa_> hey, do i have to do anything special for compiling a new kernel for wubi? i got the latest rc6-b1 kernel last night and its crashing on a loop mount error
[23:30] <deuryte> can someone show me how to get this effect ?  im in ubuntu gutsy, compiz-fuzion is active , but need to know settings.>>        http://wiki.compiz-fusion.org/Welcome
[23:30] <Flannel> krz: ubuntu is gnome based
[23:30] <Ward1983> mj, still even then you can pop in the live cd and use it to replace your xorg with the backup or your original one
[23:30] <Ward1983> mj, but that will only take longer
[23:31] <kris_ph> ok.. now I know.. 500 http://ph.archive.ubuntu.com gutsy-updates/universe Packages
[23:31] <mj> flannel: how do I update drivers in Ubuntu? Is there an easy interface, or should I google search it?
[23:31] <Flannel> mj: I believe you'll need the proprietary driver to use TV-out
[23:31] <Ward1983> mj, but look for a good TV out tutorial to read so you have a good idea what you're up against
[23:31] <Flannel> !ati | mj
[23:31] <ubotu> mj: For Ati/NVidia/Matrox video cards, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto
[23:31] <Flannel> kris_ph: eh? what?
[23:31] <ArthurArchnix> deuryte: Have you installed ccsm?
[23:31] <mj> Ward: Okay, so using the command line, how would I copy the file? cp filename1 filename2?
[23:31] <cellofellow> sorry, got eaten by huge lag monster. Anybody know what to do for libnotify/notification-daemon problems?
[23:32] <deuryte> ArthurArchnix: let me check.....brb
[23:32] <Ward1983> Flannel, mj correct
[23:32] <Flannel> kris_ph: http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/python-django 0.96-1ubuntu0.1 is the most recent version.
[23:32] <Ward1983> Flannel, oops wrong highlight sorry
[23:32] <krz> im currently migrating from windows. my only BIG concern are the software i am currently used to, such as ms word, ms power point, photoshop, illustrator. IM NOT WILLING to consider the alternatives for this: openoffice, gimp, inkscape. I DONT WANT to dual boot. so i am thinking of installing a VM (perhaps virtual box) and using the VM if and when i need to use these applications. will there be any problems with this approach?
[23:32] <Ward1983> mj, correct
[23:32] <Flannel> Ward1983: no worries
[23:32] <ArthurArchnix> !ccsm | deuryte
[23:32] <ubotu> deuryte: To enable advanced customization of desktop effects in Ubuntu 7.10 (Gutsy), install 'compizconfig-settings-manager'. A new option will appear in your appearance properties - See also !compiz - Help in #compiz-fusion
[23:32] <Ward1983> mj, live cd will work too if youre unsure with CLI
[23:33] <kris_ph> Flannel: but the current version in their official site is 0.97
[23:33] <moparisthebest> what startup script is responsible for setting the keyboard layout?
[23:33] <Ward1983> mj, (by that i mean the way you probably installed ubuntu)
[23:33] <krz> anyone?
[23:33] <matt9000> My install is failing with message 'The failing step is: Select and install software' (while installing Ubuntu Studio 7.10 via PXE).   I really appreciate the help guys, Im off to find a tutorial on installing proprietary ATI drivers... You guys have been very helpful, thank you Ward and Flannel
[23:34] <Ward1983> mj, cant help you with the settings though, never had a ATI myself
[23:34] <Ward1983> mj, no prob, good luck
[23:34] <Flannel> krz: Not except speed, no.  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/VMware/Workstation/NativeVirtualMachine and http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=380699
[23:34] <Flannel> kris_ph: That may be.
[23:34] <deuryte> ArthurArchnix: i checked my synaptic and my add/remove.....  i dont see   ccsm...
[23:35] <Flannel> matt9000: try #ubuntustudio for studio specific support
[23:35] <santookA> hello?
[23:35] <minimec> krz: Tell me your reason to swich to ubuntu, because until now we now, why you love your windows...
[23:35] <spork969> ArthurArchnix: never mind, i love pyrename, it ROCKS
[23:35] <matt9000> flannel: ok thanks... didnt notice that channel in the irc wiki :)
[23:35] <santookA> i was asking about the buzz!!!!
[23:35] <santookA> that is coming from my speakers?
[23:35] <Crisp1> hey, can anybody help me with some problems I'm having with Ubuntu? (new Linux user)
[23:35] <Flannel> !anyone | Crisp1
[23:35] <ubotu> Crisp1: A large amount of the first questions asked in this channel start with "Does anyone/anybody..."  Why not ask your next question (the real one) and find out?
[23:36] <Ward1983> deuryte, try looking for compizconfig-settings-manager
[23:36] <deuryte> Ward1983:  brb...
[23:36] <Flannel> !ati | mj
[23:36] <Ward1983> deuryte, yes its long i know :p
[23:36] <ubotu> mj: For Ati/NVidia/Matrox video cards, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto
[23:36] <crashhandler> how to remove 'gnome skin and appearance'(i dun want its apps deleted,just the environment only) since ive installed kde and satisfied with it..anyone?
[23:36] <deuryte> Ward1983: its alrite.  brb
[23:36] <untermensch> can i partition a hard drive without formatting it ?
[23:36] <santookA> i asked the real question and no one answered?!
[23:36] <Flannel> crashhandler: What do you mean skin and appearance?
[23:36] <cptcavern> remote control works on Ubuntu ????
[23:36] <Gladiator> Hi there. I managed to get ubuntu up and running off the live CD by removing "Quiet" and "Splash" from the startup options and adding "noapic acpi=off", and install it.  I dunno, 15% of the way loading.
[23:36] <ArthurArchnix> spork969: :)
[23:37] <Gladiator> Any way to fix that that anyone knows of?
[23:37] <Ward1983> cpTanis, what kind of remote control?
[23:37] <crashhandler> Flannel^  i dont know...maybe remove all gnome desktop environment
[23:37] <Ward1983> cpTanis, sorry wrong highlight :(
[23:37] <cptcavern> tv card
[23:37] <krz> minimec i used to use other linux distros in the past. linux was a big disgrace for the newbie back in the old days. so im wondering if this linux distro is up to par with "JUST WORKS"
[23:37] <Crisp1> How do I fix my audio settings so that my USB Logitech webcam mic can record audio? So far, I could only get my desktop mic (not USB) to record.
[23:37] <Dr_willis> my hauppage remote works with my hauupage tv tuner.
[23:37] <Ward1983> cptcavern, what kind of remote control?
[23:37] <Flannel> crashhandler: By removing gnome, you wont gain a whole lot of space on your HDD without affecting the gnome apps as well.
[23:37] <kris_ph> Flannel: you're right.. acco. to their official site it's 0.96..  sorry for the wrong info I got from somebody in their channel..
[23:37] <santookA> thanx alot :D
[23:37] <santookA> ciao
[23:37] <untermensch> can i partition a hard drive without formatting it?
[23:37] <cptcavern> Ward1983 its a tv card receiver
[23:37] <krz> minimec im still guessing linux is still a disappointment for people who want things to just work
[23:37] <crashhandler> Flannel^  so just leave it there?
[23:38] <arcticpenguin380> what kernel schedualr does ubuntu use?
[23:38] <Flannel> kris_ph: Well, even if it was, Ubuntu's versions are frozen per release, so its entirely likely that we're a few months behind.
[23:38] <Flannel> crashhandler: yep
[23:38] <Flannel> arcticpenguin380: the old one
[23:38] <Dr_willis> krz,  i find windows often a dissapointment for people wanting things to 'just work'
[23:38] <Ward1983> cptcavern, dunno, but you can build this tiny serial receiver that will work with any 38Khz modulated remote, with Lirc
[23:38] <kris_ph> Flannel: what do you think is the reason?
[23:38] <crashhandler> Flannel^  tq ..i thought it is wasting my hd space
[23:38] <arcticpenguin380> whic one is that?
[23:38] <krz> Dr_willis you must be coming from a comp sci degree
[23:38] <arcticpenguin380> is CFG the old one?
[23:38] <cptcavern> Ward1983 ok thanks for help.
[23:39] <Ward1983> cptcavern, cost me less then 5euro in parts and even your 8 year old sister can solder it, its easy
[23:39] <minimec> krz: So my advice is... By a new Harddrive or some 2nd hand HD (20GB will do). You will like your Ubuntu and you don't risk to harm your productive system.
[23:39] <Ward1983> no prob
[23:39] <Dr_willis> krz,  not really.    I managed to get ubuntu up and running off the live CD by removing "Quiet" and "Splash" from the startup options and adding "noapic acpi=off", and install it.  I dunno, 15% of the way loading.
[23:39] <linux_user400354> i need help please. http://pastebin.com/m6b9499c2
[23:39] <Dr_willis> krz,  its amazing how many thing  one can find goofy in windows..
[23:39] <Flannel> crashhandler: Well, it's using it.  I don't know about wasting.  But yeah, unless youre streally strapped for space, its not worth the effort (unless you want to remove it all, and then just re-add the apps you want)
[23:39] <Ward1983> Gladiator, no errors?
[23:39] <Gladiator> Nope
[23:39] <Ward1983> damn
[23:39] <Flannel> Gladiator: Did you verify the CD? (check for defects?)
[23:40] <Gladiator> Just shows the loading bar with the Ubuntu logo above it, and gets stuck
[23:40] <Gladiator> Flannel: Yes
[23:40] <Dr_willis> krz,  the main diff i see. is that with linux - you can dig in and debug check logs and try things,, with windows often you can only 'remove/reinstall software' and hope it starts working.
[23:40] <Gladiator> I have no idea what I'm really talking about, but I'm guessing it's related to the noapic acpi=off thing.
[23:40] <Ward1983> you should be able to boot without the screen, so you can see what happens, but i dont recall how
[23:40] <krz> Dr_willis yea i agree, its typical, but most end-users dont have the time to type console commands or edit config files. i remember the days i spent just trying to get my first linux distro running
[23:40] <untermensch> is it neccessary to format a hard drive to partion it ?
[23:40] <untermensch> partition*
[23:40] <Flannel> Gladiator: Are you trying to install Ubuntu? or just try out the liveCD?
[23:40] <alexman> anyone here use macmenu-applet? i want to install it
[23:40] <Ward1983> is there some package i need to install to read DVDs burned by a mac?
[23:40] <Gladiator> I'm guessing removing the "quiet" and "splash" parameters, but I don't know where to do that
[23:40] <Crisp1> Can anybody help me with audio problems I'm having with Ubuntu? My sound settings (ALSA, OSS) are screwed up and are giving me annoying side effects.
[23:41] <Gladiator> Flannel: It's already installed
[23:41] <Gladiator> I'm trying to run it off my HD for the first time
[23:41] <Dr_willis> krz,  ive spend days trying to figure out why windows idsnet doing this or that.. that its SUPPOSED to do just fine.. computers are complex tools..
[23:41] <deuryte> Ward1983: yes, i do have ccsm, and many of my effects are working but just wanted to see how to do this >>  http://wiki.compiz-fusion.org/Welcome
[23:41] <Flannel> Gladiator: Ah!  Have you tried adding those two options during boot off the HDD?
[23:41] <mj> how can I tell which version of XFree86 i am running?
[23:41] <Dr_willis> krz,   everyones experience varies.. and with flexibilty comes responsability. :)
[23:41] <Ward1983> deuryte, the plugins?
[23:41] <Flannel> mj: you're not.  You're running Xorg.
[23:41] <Gladiator> No, that's what I'm trying to figure out how to do =P
[23:41] <crischan> hey - how do i disable php's suhosin patch in 8.04?
[23:42] <Dr_willis> mj,  try X -version or --version
[23:42] <Flannel> mj: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto
[23:42] <Shogun> hello
[23:42] <minimec> krz: For me it was SuSE 6.1 *lol*
[23:42] <tyler_> i've got a problem where the top and bottom bars only fill up 1024x768 resolution, but the desktop fills up 1280x1024, system>preferences>screen resolution only goes up to 1024x768 (even though the background is larger...) i was thinking of changing /etc/X11/xorg.conf where it says Modes "1024x768" to 1280x1024, but how would i do that properly / restart x to load the new confic?
[23:42] <Flannel> Gladiator: Alright, at the GRUB menu, hit 'e' and you can change the line (add parameters, etc)
[23:42] <Flannel> Gladiator: temporarily, of course, once you boot you'll want to make them permanent
[23:42] <Gladiator> ... what in the name of jesus is the GRUB menu?
[23:42] <Gladiator> oh
[23:43] <Gladiator> nevermind
[23:43] <jasbond> Yo sup ubuntu!
[23:43] <Dr_Link> Humans are like slinkies.
[23:43] <Dr_Link> Practically useless.
[23:43] <Dr_Link> Yet they're so fun to watch fall down stairs.
[23:43] <Gladiator> How do I make it permenant once I boot?
[23:43] <Ward1983> deuryte, im not sure what on the page youre talking about, but in ccs; you can set any settings in any way you like :)
[23:43] <Ward1983> ccsm
[23:43] <jasbond> UBUNTU!!!
[23:43] <newyorkerjj35> could someone help me get kiba dock?..i was following some instructions and i came to the point where i had to type in "sudo apt get install kiba-dock" and it says it couldnt find the package
[23:43] <jasbond> UBUNTU!!!!
[23:43] <untermensch> can i partition my drive without formatting it ?
[23:43] <Ward1983> :s
[23:43] <Flannel> Gladiator: Edit /boot/grub/menu.lst (there's a line that starts with # kopt=, edit that one) then sudo update-grub (don't uncomment the kopt line, just edit it)
[23:43] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  you can use gparted to resize existing partitions in many cases.
[23:43] <minimec> untermensch: no.
[23:44] <thedoom> quit
[23:44] <Gladiator> Ok, thank you Flannel.
[23:44] <thedoom> exit
[23:44] <untermensch> wow. that sucks]
[23:44] <untermensch> =[ *
[23:44] <JoCo_> Hi!
[23:44] <shawn__> con someone help me
[23:44] <minimec> untermensch: If you do a replacement of an ubuntu installation you can...
[23:44] <newyorkerjj35> can someone help me to install kiba-dock??
[23:44] <Ward1983> untermensch, you can, Dr_willis is correct
[23:44] <jasbond> WHATS UP SHAWN?
[23:44] <untermensch> omg this is confusing
[23:44] <shawn__> my xorg is set to use fglrx as my ati driver
[23:44] <untermensch> half of everyone says yes, everyone else says no...
[23:44] <Dr_willis> untermensch,    Im thinking you are asking the question wrongly. If you want to install linux, You can resize an existing windows partition and free up space to an unallocated  partition. Thus install linux to that. without loseing the windows data
[23:45] <shawn__> but in restrictted drivers it syas im using the ati one
[23:45] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  it pays to ask a VERY clear question.
[23:45] <lab^rat> jasbond: caps lock...
[23:45] <untermensch> ok! thank you
[23:45] <untermensch> that' what i wanted
[23:45] <DrIP> amenado: you arround?
[23:45] <zrajm> after doing "aptitude update" on two different machines I get different versions of the same program on doing install. Why is that?
[23:45] <untermensch> i have fuckdows, i want linux. but i don't wanna hose windows
[23:45] <MilitantPotato> fglrx is ATI's
[23:45] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  formating = loseing data. ,  resizeing with gparted = not loseing data. but thats NOT formating.
[23:45] <Ward1983> untermensch, you can for sure, but backup your data because it can occasionally go wrong (never went wrong with me so far though)
[23:45] <shawn__> okay
[23:45] <shawn__> but my 3d gl isnt workjing
[23:45] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  the installer can auto-resize the partitions. read the install docs.
[23:45] <MilitantPotato> shawn
[23:45] <deuryte> Ward1983: here is what i have...compiz, ccsm, compiz-core, compiz-fuzion plugins extra,   compiz-fuzion plugins main,  compiz-gnome,compiz -plugins, /  there is a picture on that site that shows a "cube"  in the {middle} of the desktop,  how do i do this??
[23:45] <MilitantPotato> type fglrxinfo in console
[23:45] <untermensch> i did, but i got a diff partition window than it talks about
[23:45] <zrajm> how can I check which version of a package is the latest in ubuntu?
[23:45] <shawn__> yes potatoe?
[23:45] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  the 'best' way is to have linux on its own hard drive.
[23:45] <Flannel> zrajm: What versions and of which program?
[23:46] <Ward1983> untermensch, lol you can pop in the cd and ubuntu cd will resize your partition !
[23:46] <ArthurArchnix> Dr_willis: I might change that to say "resizing with gparted = *most likely* not losing data"
[23:46] <untermensch> yea i thought about buying an external drive just for linux
[23:46] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  you may want to read up on how partitions work in  linux and computers in general. :)
[23:46] <zrajm> Flannel, git-core, versions <IP_ADDRESS> and <IP_ADDRESS>
[23:46] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: and after that, do glxinfo | grep direct
[23:46] <Dr_willis> ArthurArchnix,  this is why i alwyas use a 2nd hd. :)
[23:46] <shawn__> as sudo?
[23:46] <Ward1983> untermensch, just READ every step carefully and read a tutorial in advance so you know what to expect
[23:46] <MilitantPotato> nah
[23:46] <M4rotku> hello, can some1 tell me how to log in as the root user?
[23:46] <Ward1983> untermensch, and backup your important files to make sure
[23:46] <shawn__> ok
[23:47] <untermensch> yea i have a windows backup disks, i just don't wanna lose all the good stuff on my comp
[23:47] <MilitantPotato> 'fglrxinfo' and 'glxinfo | grep direct'
[23:47] <shawn__> direct rendering: Yes thats what i got
[23:47] <MilitantPotato> @ shawn__
[23:47] <shawn__> direct rendering: Yes
[23:47] <MilitantPotato> what's fglrxinfo give you?
[23:47] <shawn__> when i typed it
[23:47] <psyphen> M4rotku: Username should be root. or from a command prompt type in su and then the root password
[23:47] <Flannel> zrajm: Feisty has <IP_ADDRESS>, not <IP_ADDRESS>  do `apt-cache policy git-core` on the one with .4, see what repos it's using
[23:47] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: pastebin the results
[23:47] <shawn__> OpenGL vendor string: ATI Technologies Inc.
[23:47] <shawn__> OpenGL renderer string: Radeon X1300/X1550 Series
[23:47] <shawn__> OpenGL version string: 2.0.6473 (8.37.6)
[23:47] <shawn__> thats what i get
[23:47] <Flannel> psyphen, M4rotku:  You don't login with the root user, it's locked.  Use sudo instead.
[23:47] <MilitantPotato> ok, looks good
[23:48] <shawn__> so
[23:48] <shawn__> how can i test it
[23:48] <Flannel> !paste | shawn__
[23:48] <ubotu> shawn__: pastebin is a service to post multiple-lined texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic)
[23:48] <newyorkerjj35> in terminal i typed in "sudo apt-get install kiba-dock" and it says "couldnt find package kiba-dock"..what do i do from here?? is this bcause i havent properly downloaded kiba dock??
[23:48] <shawn__> srry
[23:48] <MilitantPotato> you'll need XGL to use compiz fusion with those drivers shawn__
[23:48] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  lets just say that even without messing with linux. Your windows data is at risk.. the HD could fail at any time.. even now.. it pays to have backups of your good data.
[23:48] <M4rotku> Flannel, I need to edit a folder that is under Root's permission
[23:48] <Starnestommy> M4rotku: use sudo
[23:48] <zrajm> Flannel, one machine runs feisty, the other etch
[23:48] <Flannel> M4rotku: right.  Use sudo instead.  "sudo [whatever]"
[23:48] <Dr_willis> untermensch,  ive been seeing a lot of HD's dieing this week at work...
[23:48] <shawn__> were can i get xgl?
[23:48] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: you can compile the newest ATI drivers from source, I've got a good guide for that, if you want.
[23:48] <reinaldo> hi
[23:48] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: in synaptic, it's called xserver-xgl
[23:48] <M4rotku> is there a way to change the permissions of a directory within the terminal then?
[23:48] <zrajm> Flannel, etch = <IP_ADDRESS>, etch = <IP_ADDRESS>
[23:48] <shawn__> okay
[23:48] <Flannel> zrajm: ah!  Well, that's your disrepency.  One is using Ubuntu feisty, and the other one is using debian etch.
[23:49] <shawn__> ive reied to edit my xorg
[23:49] <Flannel> M4rotku: What directory are you changing the permissions of?
[23:49] <shawn__> and it always crashes
[23:49] <shawn__> tried*
[23:49] <Flannel> newyorkerjj35: kiba-dock isn't in the Ubuntu repositories.
[23:49] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: fglrx is what ya want.
[23:49] <newyorkerjj35> flannel what is the easiest way to install kiba-dock?
[23:50] <zrajm> Flannel, well according to the #git ppl both versions are ancient, how do I get up to speed?
[23:50] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: this is the guide I use for installing the latest ATI drivers http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=593348
[23:50] <zrajm> Flannel, I already have done "aptitude update" on both machines
[23:50] <shawn__> i have the newest drivers i think
[23:50] <shawn__> before it didnt sya it supported open gl
[23:50] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: the ones in the repositories are old
[23:50] <shawn__> i knwo
[23:50] <shawn__> ive updated
[23:50] <Flannel> zrajm: Ubuntu freezes its versions of software (you stay with whatever version was released with feisty, except bugfixes), as does debian to some extent.  Thats why you don't have the latest versions.
[23:51] <Ward1983> is there some package i need to install to read DVDs burned by a mac?
[23:51] <shawn__> to 8.2
[23:51] <Flannel> zrajm: You can either use feisty-backports, or upgrade to Gutsy
[23:51] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: OpenGL version string: 2.1.7412 Release
[23:51] <MilitantPotato> those are the latest
[23:51] <kris_ph> what's the equivalent command for dir in ubuntu?
[23:51] <Ward1983> kris_ph, ls
[23:51] <Flannel> kris_ph: ls (LiSt)
[23:51] <shawn__> okay let me install that synaptic package
[23:51] <SiriusTux> ls -l
[23:51] <poseidon> I upgraded from 7.04 to 7.10 and now when I boot I get error 17: file not found, then it asks me to press any key to continue and it takes me to a screen which gives me the option to reboot or halt.
[23:51] <raidium> hey open i just saw your msg
[23:51] <kris_ph> thank you
[23:51] <zrajm> Flannel, ohkay. isn't an upgrade likely to break a system that's heavily tweaked?
[23:51] <Ward1983> lol
[23:51] <Dr_willis> !bash | kris_ph
[23:51] <ubotu> kris_ph: The linux terminal or command-line interface is very powerful. Open a terminal via Applications -> Accessories -> Terminal (Gnome) or K-menu -> System -> Konsole (KDE).  Guide: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UsingTheTerminal
[23:51] <Flannel> newyorkerjj35: I'm not sure, you'd hvae to find a third party repository that had it.
[23:51] <poseidon> I'm running linux alongside windows.
[23:52] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: follow that guide
[23:52] <Flannel> zrajm: Depends on how heavily, but with no additional information, sure.  backports might be your best bet then.
[23:52] <Flannel> !backports | zrajm
[23:52] <ubotu> zrajm: If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
[23:52] <kris_ph> Dr_willis: m using server
[23:52] <mj> flannel: lol, ok, so I dont have XFree86. Can I make XFree86 drivers work in Xorg? Is Xfree86 used in KDE?
[23:52] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: if you follow that guide you won't need XGL
[23:52] <Flannel> mj: No.  Why are you wondering about Xfree86?
[23:52] <Dr_willis> kris_ph,  and you havent learned the shell basics yet? You got a lot of learning to do.
[23:52] <mithraic> Okay, so my Xorg still freezes up when I run xrandr -o left. My only recourse seems to be an alt-SysRq-K.
[23:52] <poseidon> Any advice?
[23:52] <zrajm> Flannel, what does "backports" mean exactly? That I run the latest version of one or two packages, but not the whole system?
[23:52] <mithraic> How should I go about gathering information about the problem?
[23:52] <shawn__> i knwo but i alwasy crash
[23:52] <MilitantPotato> shawn__: some of the filenames will need changed, but otherwise it works perfectly for those I've helped through it before
[23:52] <shawn__> im sure ive seen that guide
[23:52] <Ward1983> mj, you just need to read the guide he gave you several times
[23:52] <mithraic> There's nothing in .Xsession-errors, which is the only place I know to look.
[23:52] <zrajm> Flannel, how do I do that? (links to docs?)
[23:52] <shawn__> okay
[23:52] <smallfry> how do i transfer a video file  from a ubuntu opereating system to a coby mp3 player?
[23:53] <smallfry> help!!!!
[23:53] <Dr_willis> kris_ph,  there are text based web browsers also you can use to browse web sites/docs :)
[23:53] <shawn__> ill take a look at ti but if tis the same im gonna have to stick with xgl
[23:53] <poseidon> What should I try to do?
[23:53] <Ward1983> smallfry, talking like that wont get you help faster in here
[23:53] <Dr_willis> smallfry,  you mean CONVERT a video to a playable format? or copy the allready compatiable video over?
[23:53] <Flannel> zrajm: yes.  People have taken the time to compile newer versions against the older libraries (in hardy).  Basically, the safest way is to manually odwnload the packages, and then install with gdebi.   http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=git&searchon=names&suite=feisty-backports&section=all
[23:53] <newyorkerjj35> can anyone here guide me through the process to install kiba dock??
[23:53] <smallfry> convert and transfer
[23:54] <Flannel> zrajm: although, alternatively, you can add the -backports source to your sources, and do it that way as well.
[23:54] <matt9000> General question - my install is failing with 'Couldn't find task _____' ... tasksel: aptitutde failed (100)' during the installation step.  Any thoughts on how to track that down?
[23:54] <Flannel> newyorkerjj35: I'm not sure, you'd hvae to find a third party repository that had it.
[23:54] <Ward1983> smallfry, connect the mp3 player, and it should show up at locations -> computer
[23:54] <bluefox83> smallfry, i dunno about yours, but i just plug mine in, and drag and drop the file...
[23:54] <mj> Ward: ok, I'll go read it now, sorry to ask questions that have already been answered
[23:54] <Ward1983> smallfry, ALLWAYS do a safe disconnect though
[23:54] <zrajm> Flannel, would that force all packages to use backports, if I added it to sources?
[23:54] <SiriusTux> iwconfig says that my ap DWL-900AP+ is 802.11g, but this is not true how can I force wlan0 to work 802.11b?
[23:54] <Ward1983> smallfry, if oyu dont youll loose data
[23:54] <mithraic> Answering my own question: /var/log/Xorg.0.log seems like a good place to poke
[23:54] <Dr_willis> smallfry,  id say you need to google to see what kind ofr format the player needs, then perhaps use  avidemux to convert to the proper format.
[23:54] <Flannel> zrajm: Not force, but that is the danger of doing so (updating to backports packages without realising), which is why we don't recommend it.
[23:55] <Dr_willis> smallfry,  then you can mount the device as any other usb device, and copy the files over.
[23:55] <poseidon> How can I troubleshoot my boot error?
[23:55] <zrajm> Flannel, gotcha. might be better off checking out the code in question directly from the git repos and building it from source.
[23:55] <Ward1983> mj, no problem, good luck
[23:55] <zrajm> Flannel, thanx for the info though.
[23:55] <Ward1983> is there some package i need to install to read DVDs burned by a mac?
[23:55] <Ward1983> anyone?
[23:55] <njenkins> just installed ubuntu
[23:56] <njenkins> took me roughly 20 minutes works flawlessly
[23:56] <SiriusTux> anyone?
[23:56] <poseidon> Ward1983, Usually the os that burned it doesn't matter
[23:56] <ergyjean-baptist> welcome njenkins
[23:56] <matt9000> ward, data dvds?  iso?  movie?
[23:56] <clearzen> Ward1983: it would depend on the type of dvd not the platform used to burn it
[23:56] <icesword> hello?good morning
[23:56] <njenkins> How do I find the loco teams irc rooms?
[23:56] <pros977> Must resist urge to run out and spend $1000 on awesome computer hardware
[23:56] <pros977> Must resist....
[23:56] <Flannel> njenkins: Which team?
[23:56] <poseidon> ward1983, VLC maybe
[23:56] <njenkins> michigan
[23:56] <icesword> languauge
[23:56] <ergyjean-baptist> google it
[23:56] <Ward1983> poseidon, i know but them damn things use some proprietary FS or something
[23:56] <njenkins> ok
[23:56] <Flannel> njenkins: #ubuntu-us-mi
[23:56] <Ward1983> poseidon, now i just cant mount it
[23:57] <njenkins> thanks
[23:57] <poseidon> what did you burn?
[23:57] <LjL> ergyjean-baptist, "google it" is not an answer :)
[23:57] <Dr_willis> pros977,  wait for that EEE desktop :)
[23:57] <Ward1983> clearzen, i cant mount it
[23:57] <LjL> !channels > njenkins    (njenkins, see the private message from Ubotu)
[23:57] <ergyjean-baptist> google is always the answe
[23:57] <njenkins> that's one handy bot!
[23:57] <Ward1983> poseidon, i didnt burn it, a friend did, its video on there but not a video-dvd for in a standalone dvd player
[23:57] <Dr_willis> 'google it' is what you should be doing , while you are waiting in here for abn answer...
[23:57] <njenkins> there is another one for Spanish right?
[23:57] <clearzen> Ward1983: are you using sudo mount -o loop /path/to/dvd /path/to/mount
[23:58] <LjL> ergyjean-baptist: maybe, yet this channel isn't just made by some bot repeating "google it" all the time, for some reason :)
[23:58] <pros977> Dr_Willis the EEE looks neat
[23:58] <ArthurArchnix> !google
[23:58] <ubotu> google is the helpers' friend; many newer users dont have the google-fu yet; For GNU/Linux:  http://google.com/linux
[23:58] <Ward1983> clearzen, lol no i insert the cd and close my drive :p
[23:58] <LjL> njenkins: botijo, yes
[23:58] <narain> hi all, i was thinking about hacking on my gnome-panel for fun and wondering whether this would break ubuntu package updates. is this an appropriate channel to ask questions about that or is there some ubuntu-advanced channel i should go to?
[23:58] <ArthurArchnix> see... google is your friend.. not the questioners
[23:58] <Ward1983> clearzen, then ubuntu tells me it cant be mounted
[23:59] <Dr_willis> pros977,  yea. But the next generation of the laptop one. is more expensive then  my last laptop. :(
[23:59] <clearzen> Ward1983: hang on


[00:05] <ailo_> Len-nb: Most of those settings I guess are only valuable for certain tasks
[00:05] <ailo_> There's one for midi (timer), one for multi track recording (disk)
[00:05] <ailo_> rtirq is good for solving the type of headache that you have, all though it does not seem to solve it for you
[00:06] <ailo_> We should put together a list of things to test
[00:06] <ailo_> Multitrack recording, live audio processing. I guess a bit workflow based
[00:07] <ailo_> Didn't do much today for the wiki today. Haven't had the time.
[00:07] <ailo_> Another day tomorroq
[00:08] <ailo_> We could automate the test with a script
[00:08] <ailo_> Get some measurement data from what is measurable
[00:09] <ailo_> Anyway, gn
[13:11] <len-dt> ailo_, ondemand/performance (cpu throttling) gets reset to ondemand on my netbook. Maybe by powerd or something. I need to look more.
[13:13] <len-dt> network-manager starts some things that it does not stop. Rebooting with NM disabled is wonderful, stopping NM (and wireless BTW) is worse.
[13:16] <len-dt> Cron, anacron and atd can be stopped by changing runlevel. This is probably more important than we might guess as it is much more random, having apt update it self in the middle of a session could be a pain.
[13:18] <len-dt> Hydrogen uses very little resources compared to (other) sound generators
[13:23] <len-dt> I was able to run 5 synths at the same time (cpu60%) with no problem. (-p 128 as low as I can start Jack)
[13:23] <ailo_> Hudrogen mostly plays samples, but I'm sure you can make it use more cpu if you add some fx to it
[13:24] <ailo_> Hydrogen*
[13:24] <len-dt> The reason I could only run that many is because I ran out of memory and swap.
[13:25] <ailo_> len-dt: The cpu throttling gets reset during your login?
[13:25] <len-dt> I mean swap became a problem
[13:25] <len-dt> I am not sure when cpu throttling get s set
[13:26] <len-dt> Just that it did not seem to end up where I left it.
[13:26] <ailo_> Aught to be a default config for it to be set somewhere. I haven't dabbled much with it
[13:27] <ailo_> So, what other implicactions are there in changning runlevel?
[13:29] <len-dt> Run levels 2345 are all the same right now. So changing the config for cron like stuff just affects them.
[13:29] <len-dt> I used *.override files so the original files are untouched.
[13:30] <len-dt> That is installing a config change can be unistalled.
[13:31] <len-dt> Because of my memory limitations, the PA-jack bridge wasn't really a problem.
[13:34] <len-dt> ailo_, I think though that memory is cheap enough that upgrading to at least 2G ram could be a strongly suggested first improvement.
[13:35] <len-dt> I was using virt/keyboard to stress test, so a max of 4 notes polyphony was the best I could do.
[13:37] <len-dt> I will try tracking when I get the USB audio IF. Down the road... I am deciding if I should get a usb midi if or a USB KB. I have a lot of little midi KB around already though.
[13:38] <len-dt> ailo_, I'm off to work today... bye now.
[13:42] <ailo_> 2GB seems like a minimum for a typical linux based OS right now
[13:43] <ailo_> Perhaps not for everything audio related, but just for the usual programs, like firefox and chrome
[13:43] <ailo_> A P3 will often have a maximum 512MB limit, or maybe 1GB, so they are barely usable anymore
[13:44] <ailo_> Also, finding graphic cards for them that you can use to just browse the web is hardly worth the trouble
[13:46] <ailo_> netbooks may have less processing power then your usual PC, but the other components are up to date, and you can usually install at least 2GB RAM
[13:46] <ailo_> So, I agree. 2GB is a good lowest limit to recommend at this time
[13:47] <ailo_> For people who like to work with large sample libraries, you need at least 4GB, or more
[13:55] <len-dt> ailo_, what does memlock do?
[13:56] <len-dt> I guess what I am asking ... is there a way for an app to say don't swap this out?
[13:58] <len-dt> I wonder what the max memory a netbook can take is...
[14:02] <holstein> i have 2gb's in one of mine
[14:02] <holstein> the one that i use only for field recording has 1gb
[15:21] <ailo_> len-dt: Don't know exactly what memlock does. I just know you can use it to lock down memory for @audio applications. If you want anything other than unlimited, you need to specify it manually
[15:25] <ailo_> I think you specify with KB, not MB. Don't remember. The Ubuntustudio-controls application does this correctly, only it edits the wrong file
[15:26] <ailo_> I've just spent days programming something that more or less already existed right in front of me :(
[15:26] <ailo_> Sometimes, not always, it can be good to take the long way around
[18:42] <len-dt> holstein, 1 Gig for recording would be fine. I am trying to find out what the limits of the device are and found that with midi softsynths, memory ran out before cpu power.
[18:44] <len-dt> holstein, I'm just testing more as a documentation project than anything. I can at least recognize the difference between not enough memory and not enough cpu, some users can't.
[18:44] <len-dt> holstein, I think for my use, two tracks of recording will be about as much as I ever do.
[18:54] <len-dt> ailo_, according to what I can find on some of the mysql pages, memlock locks the memory used by a process in memory and prevents it from being swapped out.
[18:55] <len-dt> The downside of using memlock, is that on running out of memory, the kernel starts killing processes :-)
[18:57] <len-dt> ailo_, none the less, it would make sense to me that any audio software that is well made, would use memlock for at least the thread that does the audio work.
[18:57] <len-dt> ailo_, That being so, the swappiness value may have less effect than it would seem.
[18:58] <astraljava> Set it to 0?
[18:58] <len-dt> ailo_, also, the user should be aware of how close to swap they are when using their machine for realtime uses anyway... or at least that there is such a problem.
[19:00] <len-dt> ailo_, we, through the jack install, set memlock to unlimited for audio devices/applications that know how to use it, but each application sets what it wants as well.
[19:31] <ailo_> len-dt: Then I the issue must be that without /etc/security/limits.d/audio.conf the user cannot  start a process which will use memlock
[19:31] <ailo_> The same as with rtprio
[19:32] <ailo_> I've been asking around for another way to grant those privileges to processes, but it seems pam is what many prefer
[19:33] <len-dt> astraljava, The standard swappiness is 60, suggested for audio is 10... that is start swapping when 10% memory is left. But well written audio apps should lock their memory anyway...
[19:33] <astraljava> len-dt: Yep.
[19:34] <ailo_> There are some people that prefer not using memlock unlimited, since that may cause a system freeze, when using up all resources
[19:34] <len-dt> ailo_, There is that too, but we set it. And the page a got the swappiness from setts it too.
[19:34] <ailo_> But to set it at any other level we need a startup script that measures memory, and sets something like 95% instead
[19:35] <ailo_> Or less
[19:35] <len-dt> ailo_, hyrdogen uses enough lock that it needs to be very close to unlimmited on "my" !Gig machine.
[19:36] <len-dt> ailo_, it seems a sliding scale would work... 95% for a 1Gig machine, 75% for a 2Gig and 50% for higher.
[19:36] <ailo_> In that case, maybe 95% would cover all of them
[19:37] <ailo_> Since 5% is quite a big chunk on larger memory sizes
[19:38] <len-dt> ailo_, Ok, I just thought that the sizes we would likely see are 1, 2 and 4G so 950m, 1.5G and 2G for anything else would work...
[19:39] <ailo_> People who use big sample libraries will use more than 2GB easily
[19:39] <ailo_> Don't know about video processing
[19:39] <len-dt> ailo_, point.
[19:40] <ailo_> I wold think unlimited is just fine, unless it didn't cause any danger, as it seems to do
[19:41] <ailo_> las thinks unlimited is preferred, and ardour will object if you don't have that (or something close to it)
[19:41] <ailo_> But they may have changed that
[19:41] <len-dt> ailo_, I have pushed it as hard as I could, but I think some of my audio apps do not use memlock.
[19:42] <len-dt> an application does not look for unlimited, but a certain amount I think. Still, it may look at what there is and ask for all of it.
[19:43] <ailo_> ardour pops up a warning message, or used to at least. Haven't tested for a while
[19:43] <ailo_> So, it's a lookup think during ardour startup, to tell the user what settings it prefers
[19:47] <len-dt> ailo_, something like that should be settable. but it seems that while an app may say it needs x amount of memlock, it doesn't take it till it needs it. So hydrogen asks for 900M or so, but runs with a lot less and is ok with other apps using/locking what it is not using.
[19:49] <len-dt> Looking at some of the cpu shield stuff for multi-core machines was quite interesting and could be of use to audio stuff.
[19:50] <len-dt> basically, they move all the system procs to one cpu and use the other cpu(s) for one user's processes with RT.
[19:51] <len-dt> ailo_, that way there is always one cpu running system stuff that can control things like shutdowns and kills.
[19:53] <len-dt> ailo_, anyway, all those little changes did seem to help with the stability of all my softsynths running at the same time.
[19:54] <len-dt> However, I think they should be mostly "if you need them" kinds of things not default.
[19:58] <ailo_> len-dt: Interesting. I was trying to find out how to set memlock. Not on Ubuntu now. If you'd like to see quickly, install ubuntustudio-controls. Use it to set your memlock to something small, like 50% or less. The change will appear in /etc/security/limits.conf. Take the values form that file, delete the @audio entries and add the memlock amount to /etc/security/limits.d/audio.conf instead
[19:59] <ailo_> If you like, you can quickly edit the python file for that program, so it will edit the right file
[20:00] <ailo_> len-dt: It's a line in the pythonfile called ubuntustudio-controls. I don't remember where it ends up, but the file is this:
[20:00] <ailo_>  memlock = ChangeSettings("/etc/security/limits.conf", "@audio\s-\smemlock (\d*)", "")
[20:00] <ailo_> The line, I mean
[20:00] <ailo_> Er...
[20:00] <len-dt> ailo_, search of the file name in other words..
[20:03] <ailo_> It's either /usr/share/ubuntustudio/ubuntustudio or a python folder
[20:04] <ailo_> I guess for just tweaking memlock, it might be useful to use that app for now
[20:05] <ailo_> I did a whole new ubuntustudio-controls a bit over a year ago, but it was a bit hacky, even if it worked. So, I had a chance to do some python coding with gtk
[20:07] <ailo_> len-dt: Anyway, if you just replace the "/etc/security/limits.conf" with "/etc/security/limits.d/audio.conf" you'll be happier using ubuntustudio-controls for tweaking memory
[20:07] <ailo_> The other controls you don't need to touch
[20:07] <len-dt> ailo_, For me... manual is almost easier ;-)  I think we want it do some more things before it gets used in release though.
[20:07] <ailo_> ubuntustudio-controls is in the repo
[20:07] <ailo_> At least the last time I checked
[20:08] <len-dt> I know, but not this release... I think.
[20:08] <ailo_> I saw it the last time I looked
[20:08] <len-dt> Yup, still there.
[20:09] <ailo_> So use it. At least it's good for something :)
[20:10] <len-dt> Ok, so why am I changing memlock from unlimited again?  :-)
[20:10] <ailo_> len-dt: You could see what happens when you start ardour for example.
[20:11] <len-dt> Ja, yust yolking..
[20:11] <ailo_> Also, it will let you know the right way to edit memlock
[20:13] <len-dt> what does "enable raw1394 access do? Or is that now in group audio?
[20:13] <ailo_> len-dt: It's the old way to enable firewire
[20:13] <len-dt> ailo_, I don't have firewire stuff anyway
[20:13] <ailo_> Was still needed for 10.04
[20:13] <ailo_> The old firewire stack
[20:14] <len-dt> OK, and nice doesn't really do anything seeing as our audio apps aren't nice anyway ;-)
[20:14] <ailo_> Since then, there's a udev rules file that identifies all known devices and gives them access through @audio group. ffado is talking about adding that to their source now
[20:15] <ailo_> Yeah, I don't know if nice was ever needed. Hasn't been used for a while
[20:15] <len-dt> ailo_, is ffado stuff being added to alsa as well?
[20:15] <ailo_> len-dt: That's what I've heard.
[20:18] <len-dt> ailo_, what direction is US going? Or is tha on hold till after web page release?
[20:18] <ailo_> len-dt: What do you mean with direction?
[20:19] <len-dt> What are we trying to accomplish this cycle. I sort of have some ideas... but there seems to be no real roadmap.
[20:20] <ailo_> For my own sake, I'm in this mostly to make sure Ubuntu and all its derivatives are more easily made audio capable. To me, that is a responsibility US has, since it's in the main repo. I recognize that US is it's own distro, with it's own goals, but for me, I have already enough to think about with the former to be able to contribute to both for a long time
[20:21] <ailo_> len-dt: I'm sure ScottL will start making one shortly.
[20:21] <ailo_> A roadmap, I mean. He was asking for ideas a few weeks ago
[20:21] <len-dt> ailo_, Ok. That would explain why you are most vocal just now :-)
[20:21] <ailo_> Like you, I'm getting some ideas recentlyu
[20:22] <len-dt> Ja he was and writing things down in a list... but I guess we are waiting for it to be somewhere I can see it.
[20:22] <ailo_> I think ScottL is just occupied with the Ubuntu get together right now
[20:22] <len-dt> And the web page... which to be fair all of us want to see ASAP.
[20:24] <len-dt> I should probably sit and fix up the menu some more. So that when audio/video/graphic/photo apps we don't ship get added the menu listing ends up in the right place.
[20:26] <len-dt> ailo_, I am thinking we may want an audio utilities submenu as well. Depends what everyone else thinks though. I will just fix what we have now for now.
[20:26] <ailo_> len-dt: btw, I just read something where the maintainer who takes care of ardour, and a bunch of other packages claims that Ubuntu does some subtle changes to those
[20:27] <len-dt> ailo_, That is why I think we should make it as easy as possible to run both versions
[20:28] <ailo_> I meant the maintainer of the Debian packages
[20:28] <ailo_> So, they are not unchanged, according to him
[20:28] <len-dt> What kind of changes?
[20:29] <len-dt> I expect to make it use whatever libs we have. So we don't have to run two...
[20:31] <ailo_> len-dt: I was thinking about just doing a simple diff between packages to see what sort of differences there are
[20:31] <ailo_> Downloading now
[20:32] <len-dt> The ardour realease is static. Our libs change almost with the weather, but are (hopefully) more secure
[20:43] <len-dt> ailo_, ubuntustudio-controls does not work well with our stock audio.conf file:
[20:43] <len-dt> len@music:/etc/security/limits.d$ cat audio.conf
[20:43] <len-dt> # Provided by the jackd package.
[20:43] <len-dt> #
[20:43] <len-dt> # Changes to this file will be preserved.
[20:43] <len-dt> #
[20:43] <len-dt> # If you want to enable/disable realtime permissions, run
[20:43] <len-dt> #
[20:43] <len-dt> #    dpkg-reconfigure -p high jackd
[20:43] <len-dt> @audio   -  rtprio     95
[20:43] <len-dt> @audio   -  memlock    unlimited
[20:43] <len-dt> @audio - memlock 975007
[20:43] <len-dt> #@audio   -  nice      -19
[20:45] <len-dt> ailo_, you can see that it does not remove the old (sorry original) value.
[20:45] <ailo_> len-dt: I guess cause it's not identical with the spacing
[20:46] <len-dt> ailo_, is there a difference between 100% and unlimited as far as apps are concerned?
[20:46] <ailo_> len-dt: Just remove the unlimited line all together, and it should work
[20:46] <ailo_> len-dt: I don't think so, except that ardour let's the user know that it would prefer something else
[20:46] <ailo_> If it still does that
[20:47] <len-dt> ailo_, I will test...
[20:47] <ailo_> len-dt: I just looked at the ubuntu version of ardour-i686. It does say that the maintainers are from Ubuntu
[20:48] <ailo_> len-dt: I suppose you'll need to log out and log in again for changes to take effect too
[20:48] <len-dt> Ja, but one of the better places to get help is at ardour.
[20:48] <ailo_> orignal maintainers are Debian. There were quite a few diffs
[20:48] <ailo_> len-dt: I'm not arguing that. I'm just trying to find out what the deal is with the Ubuntu version
[20:50] <ailo_> If one would decide that ardour in Debian or Ubuntu repo is not up to par, I'd rather fix the one we have than ask users to download manually
[20:50] <ailo_> Another option would be not to include it all, which would be strange
[20:51] <len-dt> ailo_, my personal feeling is that US should ship what is on our repo, but freely encourage people to use ardours if they want to.... and please tell us if there is something that work in the ardour one that doesn't in ours.
[20:52] <ailo_> Yeah. But what about the desktop file btw? Doesn't it work as it is?
[20:52] <len-dt> Ours should be the same from any use point of view. But use less memory.
[20:53] <len-dt> I am not sure, it works with ardour3b3, I don't know about ardour2rel though.
[20:54] <len-dt> ailo_, I will have to download it and see.
[20:56] <len-dt> I made a copy of our ardour.desktop just in case.
[21:03] <len-dt> The real reason there is no support for ubuntu/debian users is that they don't have to navigate through tons of beg screens. Even downloading from the ardour site they say there is no support for linux users who pay $0 dollars.
[21:07] <len-dt> ailo_, Oh, and by the way, the "free" version "The free version of Ardour 2.8.12 for OS X Intel does not support saving AudioUnit plugin settings, or using presets for AudioUnit plugins. If you prefer a version without this limitation, please return to the previous page and choose to make a financial contribution to the project."
[21:08] <ailo_> len-dt: Though you can always build it yourself of course.
[21:08] <len-dt> Ah, wrong download
[21:10] <len-dt> That was the OS X version. I was wondering what a dmg file was...
[21:10] <len-dt> ailo_, The linux version is complete.
[21:12] <len-dt> I could build it... but I would still have no support. They only want to talk to people who have downloaded their static build and paid something.
[21:14] <astraljava> Non-free support is one thing, and totally acceptable. But ridding features from free releases... meh.
[21:15] <len-dt> Ja, I notice _not_ from the linux releases, but from the OS x releases.
[21:15] <len-dt> I guess MAC owners are used to it...
[21:16] <len-dt> And $5 is a lot less than what they normally pay for anything.
[21:16] <astraljava> Perhaps. I do not intend to pay for any, though.
[21:17] <astraljava> I'd rather fight with the compiling etc.
[21:17] <knome> hey astraljava :)
[21:17] <astraljava> o/
[21:17] <len-dt> As long we are willing to give freely of our own stuff, why would I pay?
[21:19] <astraljava> Exactly.
[21:19] <len-dt> ailo_, I don't know where they put their *.desktop files... still it doesn't seem to interfere with ours.
[21:19] <ailo_> len-dt: I'd be more concerned with the /bin file, but maybe that doesn't conflict either
[21:20] <ailo_> I've forgotten what their version of ardour2 is like
[21:20] <ailo_> /usr/bin/*, I mean, if it has one
[21:20] <len-dt> bin file is in /opt/ardourwhatever/bin
[21:20] <ailo_> ok
[21:21] <ailo_> las offers quite a lot of support, and I would think a lot of it is free too
[21:22] <len-dt> So US should be saying we will help as we can, but if you need more help you will need to pay for it at ardour and install that version. It should work just like ours... please let us know otherwise.
[21:22] <len-dt> Actually pay for it can be $1
[21:22] <ailo_> There's other means of support too, like the floss manual
[21:23] <ailo_> http://www.flossmanuals.net/ardour/
[21:23] <len-dt> I would have to send a cheque... no pay pal no way...
[21:23] <ailo_> It would be good to look around for more of such manuals and save their links
[21:23] <ailo_> There's a lot of docs out there, but a lot of users don't know about it
[21:24] <len-dt> Anyway. I'm out for a bit.
[21:24] <len-dt> Its pick kids up time.
[21:24] <ailo_> Why not dollar bills, lol
[21:45] <len-dt> ailo_, we don't have any dollar bills any more... or deuces either..., but yes I get the point.
[21:45] <knome> "just my two cents for the development"
[21:46] <len-dt> GA
[21:47] <knome> i wonder which expression you was referring to? http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ga
[21:47] <knome> ;)
[21:47] <len-dt> Go Ahead...
[21:47] <knome> heh no, that was just a pun
[21:48] <knome> i mean, supporting ardour with "two cents" for the development
[21:48] <knome> as in literal $.02 ;)
[21:48] <ailo_> I never knew there was an opposite to BA
[21:49] <knome> yeah. AB.
[21:49] <len-dt> I think the stamp is $.80 or so...
[21:49] <knome> what if you pay via paypal?
[21:49] <knome> they'd actually lose money if you sent less than like $2
[21:51] <len-dt> I prefer to ignore them... also for them to have none of my personal info.
[21:51] <len-dt> I'd like to be rich enough for a credit rating of zero too, but life is the way it is.
[21:52] <knome> mmh
[23:11] <len-dt> It is somewhat difficult to find much information on cpu throttling... a cpu throttle meter would be nice...
[23:18] <len-dt> It doesn't appear that this machine scales.
[23:19] <len-dt> It is older after all.


[20:22] <tjaalton> karolherbst: prime-select intel, or nvidia-settings
[20:52] <karolherbst> tjaalton: I found the issue, /var/lib/lightdm had the wrong access rights so gpu-manager was invoked :/


[11:51] <disp0sed> Hi guys, anyone familiar with Struts2 - have simple problem but can't get my head around it? sorry not exactly gentoo Java question but can't get to ##java.