[14:07] <arraybolt3> !ping
[14:07] <arraybolt3> (just testing to make sure I won't have technical difficulties when the meeting starts)
[15:59] <arraybolt3> o/
[16:00] <tsimonq2> o/
[16:01] <Eickmeyer> o/
[16:02] <leokolb> o/
[16:02] <teward> *burps loudly on entry*
[16:02] <seb128> hey, I'm off work today (covid) but will be around to try to vote if I'm needed to have a quorum
[16:03] <teward> seb128: you might be, i'm abstaining on any vote on arraybolt unless *I* am needed because otherwise there's bias in my vote.
[16:03] <teward> :P
[16:04] <teward> without you and I we aren't quorate though
[16:04] <teward> though we aren't quorate anyways
[16:04] <arraybolt3> two does not a quorum make :P
[16:04] <teward> need 4 to be quorate, and there are 0 voting members of the DMB present it seems
[16:04] <bdmurray> I'm here but in another meeting
[16:04] <bdmurray> I've heard sil_2100 is out
[16:05] <rbasak> Ah sorry o/
[16:05] <tsimonq2> Whew. :)
[16:06] <arraybolt3> I already have my Wiki page and introduction note prepped, so I should be able to move forward quickly once we start.
[16:07] <rbasak> Sorry I hope to be more available in a few minutes
[16:12] <rbasak> Am I the only voting person who will actually be here then?
[16:12] <arraybolt3> :shrug: grill now and vote later I guess?
[16:12] <bdmurray> I'm able to vote although I'm in another meeting
[16:13] <rbasak> Well I quite strongly request IRC meetings, so I guess I should ask the questions rather than defer then.
[16:13] <arraybolt3> Does anyone actually mind if teward votes? I trust he's not going to risk the safety of the archive to make me happy, and I'm guessing he has questions ready.
[16:13] <tsimonq2> I think he *should* vote, because I don't see a single package on your list that he's sponsored. ;P
[16:13] <arraybolt3> but in any event, if the vote happens later that's not an issue
[16:13] <bdmurray> I don't mind.
[16:14] <rbasak> I know of no specific reason he shouldn't.
[16:15] <seb128> I'm fine with him voting
[16:17] <tsimonq2> (#startmeeting? :))
[16:18]  * arraybolt3 waits for teward to emerge back from the black hole he appears to have vanished into
[16:18] <teward> i have a flurry of C-level execs calling me right now unexpectedly
[16:19] <arraybolt3> well tell them all to wait a sec! :P /s
[16:19] <teward> *throws arraybolt3 out the airlock*
[16:19] <teward> i can vote, but we need quorum
[16:19] <arraybolt3> teward: we have quorum
[16:19] <tsimonq2> teward: We *have* quorum.
[16:19] <arraybolt3> there's four people here.
[16:19] <arraybolt3> you, seb128, rbasak, and bdmurray
[16:19] <teward> bd, robie, me, and seb (if seb's alive) count
[16:19] <arraybolt3> and there's only seven people on the board
[16:20] <teward> i'm aware, but i'm just making that point that I don't know if seb is still around, but i can see he is
[16:20] <teward> i'm alive and we have quorum so
[16:20] <rbasak> Sorry for my slowness. I'm a bit thrown by this being the first week after the break.
[16:20] <rbasak> I would like to be more prepared, but I'm not.
[16:20] <teward> rbasak: welcome to my world.  *slides a coffee*
[16:20] <Eickmeyer> Seriously? <seb128> hey, I'm off work today (covid) but will be around to try to vote if I'm needed to have a quorum
[16:20] <rbasak> But I think I should still do this now, since you're owed that.
[16:20] <Eickmeyer> DMB is an Ubuntu function, not a Canonical function.
[16:20] <tsimonq2> rbasak: Understandable, thanks for clarifying. :)
[16:21] <teward> Eickmeyer: you can cut that line of thinking/discussion right there
[16:21] <teward> and i say that with the CC hat on :\
[16:21] <teward> (stop opening random cans of worms unless you want me as an enemy)
[16:21] <tsimonq2> Okay, let's *NOT* do this now, and actually start the meeting, please.
[16:22] <Eickmeyer> I was just saying that because he said he's here.
[16:22] <teward> i can't chair from my phone sanely, who's gonna chair
[16:22] <rbasak> I can, but I'm also reviewing the application as fast as I can.
[16:23] <teward> someone send me the link again for it?
[16:23] <teward> (so i can rereview it)
[16:24] <arraybolt3> https://ftp-master.debian.org/NEW-checklist.html
[16:24] <arraybolt3> no
[16:24] <arraybolt3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArrayBolt3/MotuApplication
[16:24] <arraybolt3> but now you know what I have prepared for the meeting :P
[16:24] <tsimonq2> :D
[16:25] <rbasak> #startmeeting Developer Membership Board
[16:25] <meetingology> Meeting started at 16:25:00 UTC.  The chair is rbasak.  Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
[16:25] <meetingology> Available commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick
[16:25] <rbasak> I'm going to jump straight to arraybolt3's application so as not to keep him waiting
[16:25] <rbasak> #topic Ubuntu MOTU Developer Applications
[16:25] <rbasak> #subtopic     ArrayBolt3 2024-01-08
[16:25] <rbasak> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArrayBolt3/MotuApplication
[16:26] <rbasak> Welcome arraybolt3!
[16:26] <rbasak> Your contribution history looks impressive. Thank you!
[16:26] <arraybolt3> o/ Thanks :)
[16:27] <rbasak> I will have questions shortly
[16:27] <rbasak> Anyone else, feel free
[16:29] <rbasak> arraybolt3: let's say that you're about to upload a package merge from Debian and it's a couple of days before feature freeze. How would you check, technically, that you're not about to inadvertently trigger a large transition?
[16:29] <arraybolt3> Probably my first step is to look at the reverse depends with apt-cache rdepends.
[16:29] <arraybolt3> after that, if there were some reverse depends, I check those reverse depends and so on.
[16:29] <arraybolt3> Usually shared libraries are at higher risk of causing these sorts of things than applications.
[16:30] <arraybolt3> (shared libraries including things like Python libraries, not necessarily libwhatever1 packages)
[16:30] <rbasak> What would you be looking at in the rdepends list?
[16:30] <rbasak> s/at/for/
[16:30] <arraybolt3> mainly to see how big the network of rdepends is. One or two might not be a huge deal depending on what those one or two are...
[16:31] <arraybolt3> ...but if there's a large network of them then I know to exercise caution and potentially not attempt the process at all.
[16:31] <arraybolt3> I could also check the update excuses page to see if packages that were rdepends were already part of transitions.
[16:31] <arraybolt3> Since entangling those could block other transitions and cause Big Problems.
[16:31] <arraybolt3> (the page I'm referring to is https://ubuntu-archive-team.ubuntu.com/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html)
[16:32] <rbasak> Could you explain to me what you understand a transition to be exactly, please?
[16:32]  * arraybolt3 opens the Proposed Migration page...
[16:33] <arraybolt3> A transition is when a package migrates from -proposed to -release after Britney and autopkgtest verifies that this won't break anything.
[16:34] <arraybolt3> (won't break anything = passes all five points at the top of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration)
[16:34] <rbasak> I think you're describing proposed migration as opposed to a transition
[16:35] <arraybolt3> for some reason I didn't realize there was a difference, we call it a "python3 transition" when the python3-default package is uploaded.
[16:36] <arraybolt3> since that triggers a whole web of autopkgtests and if any of those fail, then the package is blocked and the failures need to be fixed before the transition can migrate
[16:36] <rbasak> It's true that a transition should hold up proposed migration until it is complete, so the two concepts are very closely linked.
[16:37] <rbasak> And you're right that autopkgtest failures hold up proposed migrations
[16:37] <rbasak> ie. there are multiple things that hold up proposed migration, and one of those is that there's a transition in progress
[16:38] <rbasak> It's possible that you understand what I'm looking for and we're just getting stuck in terminology
[16:39] <rbasak> Let's say that src:foo 1.0 is in the archive, and it produces binary packages libfoo1 which various packages depend on, and libfoo-dev which those packages build depend on.
[16:39] <rbasak> What are the implications of uploading src:foo 2.0, which moves on to libfoo2?
[16:39] <rbasak> In relation to proposed migration?
[16:40] <arraybolt3> API breaking changes which would very likely cause autopkgtest failures due to the need for the entangled packages to be updated to use the new API.
[16:40] <arraybolt3> in which case you end up with multiple interrelated packages migrating together once everything passes the proposed migration tests.
[16:41] <rbasak> Let's pretend that there are no autopkgtests in any of the relevant packages, so nothing is held up by autopkgtest failures
[16:41] <arraybolt3> (er, sorry, I mean reverse dependencies when I say entangled packages)
[16:41] <rbasak> Why would proposed migration be held up?
[16:41] <rbasak> Why would proposed migration _still_ be held up?
[16:41] <arraybolt3> Lots of possible reasons: it could no longer build and publish on an architecture it used to...
[16:42] <arraybolt3> ...there could be dependency issues that would result in unsatisfied dependencies if the package(s) migrate...
[16:42] <rbasak> What dependency issues exactly?
[16:42] <rbasak> My example is the common case of a completely routine transition, so my expectation is that you should be able to follow and give me the specific dependency issue that would hold things up
[16:43] <arraybolt3> Anything that would cause apt to be unable to install the package were it in the archive, i.e. a dependency is missing or the proper version isn't available because (for instance) one of the reverse depends isn't updated to use the new version of the library.
[16:43] <arraybolt3> so for a concrete example:
[16:43] <arraybolt3> src:libfoo 1.0 exists, and package bar 1.0 depends on it.
[16:43] <arraybolt3> libfoo2 is uploaded.
[16:44] <rbasak> package bar 1.0 depends on what exactly?
[16:44] <arraybolt3> bar 1.0 depends on libfoo1.
[16:44] <arraybolt3> hold on, I'm getting slightly mixed up
[16:45] <arraybolt3> so src:libfoo 1.0 is uploaded, bar 1.0 is uploaded which has a Depends: libfoo1 (= 1.0), then src:libfoo 2.0 is uploaded.
[16:46] <arraybolt3> now bar 1.0 can no longer satisfy its dependency, so bar 2.0 has to be uploaded also before they can migrate together.
[16:47] <rbasak> OK I think you have enough of an understanding there. Though note that a straight rebuild of bar 1.0 might be sufficient, since it's the ABI that changed, and it's possible that the API remains the same or that bar uses a small enough subset that it works without changes against foo 2.
[16:47] <arraybolt3> True.
[16:47] <rbasak> So, going back a few steps, what exactly would you be looking for to see if you're going to inadvertently trigger this kind of situation?
[16:48] <arraybolt3> ah, I get it better now. Soname bumps mainly, but also versioned Depends since it's not just shared objects that can cause transitions.
[16:48] <rbasak> At least in the common case. I realise an exhaustive search is difficult, but what are the most common indicators?
[16:48] <arraybolt3> so if I build libfoo and end up with libfoo2 when I had libfoo1, that's a red flag.
[16:48] <rbasak> OK. Thanks!
[16:49] <rbasak> My next question was going to be about proposed migration but I think you've covered that enough already :)
[16:49] <rbasak> Next question: when is feature freeze for Noble, where would I look up that information, and who can authorise an exception and where is that process documented?
[16:50] <arraybolt3> The page where the freezes are documented for Noble is at https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/noble-numbat-release-schedule/35649. According to that calendar, Feature Freeze is February 29, 2024.
[16:51] <arraybolt3> The freeze exception process is documented at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess.
[16:51] <arraybolt3> the Release Team are the ones who can ACK an FFe.
[16:52] <rbasak> Let's say that you'd like to upload new upstream release of foo 1.2.2, and 1.2.1 is currently in the archive, and it's March 1st. Is that acceptable? Or if that's not enough information, what extra information do you need to make a decision?
[16:53] <arraybolt3> Not enough information - what versioning scheme does foo 1.2.2 use? Is is a purely bugfix release? Or could it incorporate new features or breaking changes?
[16:54] <arraybolt3> Assuming it uses semver, an upload of 1.2.2 is *probably* OK since 1.2.1 -> 1.2.2 is a patch release.
[16:55] <arraybolt3> (I say probably since upstream might not strictly adhere to the rule of only making backwards-compatible bug fixes in a patch release, if they do make breaking API changes that's still a no-no)
[16:55] <arraybolt3> (or if they introduce new API at all)
[16:56] <arraybolt3> if for some reason the patch release is really important and isn't suitable for introduction after Feature Freeze, then I would either backport the parts of the release that are Feature Freeze compatible that I need, or request an FFe if necessary. That would have to be decided on a case-by-case basis.
[16:57] <rbasak> OK. Thanks!
[16:58] <rbasak> I'm just looking at your "regular" SRU history
[16:58] <rbasak> I only see bug 1989203. Have you done any others?
[16:58] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 1989203 in manuskript (Debian) "Manuskript crashes on start" [Unknown, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1989203
[16:58] <arraybolt3> yes, one sec...
[16:59] <arraybolt3> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lubuntu-update-notifier/+bug/2002255
[16:59] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2002255 in lubuntu-update-notifier (Ubuntu Jammy) "lubuntu-update-notifier provides no good way to resolve a forcibly terminated system update" [Critical, Fix Released]
[17:00] <arraybolt3> I've written SRU paperwork for other SRUs before but I can't remember any other ones I've done myself other than this one. This one I wrote the code for, wrote the paperwork for, did the testing for, etc, and everything went as planned.
[17:00] <rbasak> OK. I don't think it's necessary to go deeper.
[17:01] <rbasak> Just one comment, DMB meeting aside: please specify what package version you tested in your SRU verification report. We've had serious regressions in the past due to oversight/ambiguity there.
[17:01] <rbasak> I think I'm done with my questions.
[17:02] <rbasak> Anyone else?
[17:02] <arraybolt3> +1, that's good advice.
[17:02] <bdmurray> None from me.
[17:02] <rbasak> Shall we move to a vote, even if incomplete, to make some progress for now?
[17:02] <teward> none from me
[17:02] <rbasak> #vote Grant Aaron Rainbolt MOTU permission
[17:02] <meetingology> Please vote on: Grant Aaron Rainbolt MOTU permission
[17:02] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, -1 or +0 in channel (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1|-1|+0 #channelname')
[17:02] <rbasak> +1
[17:02] <meetingology> +1 received from rbasak
[17:03] <bdmurray> +1
[17:03] <meetingology> +1 received from bdmurray
[17:03] <teward> my vote comes last, so seb128 votes ahead of me
[17:04] <teward> unless seb128 had to bow out due to COVID
[17:04] <teward> +1
[17:04] <meetingology> +1 received from teward
[17:04] <rbasak> I think we need a vote from seb128 in order to conclude today.
[17:05] <teward> yep, we do.  because otherwise we are not quorate.
[17:05] <rbasak> He did say he's ill, so let's give him five minutes. If he's unable to vote by then, we'll close for the today and move to the mailing list.
[17:05] <rbasak> for the day / for today :-)
[17:06] <seb128> +1
[17:06] <meetingology> +1 received from seb128
[17:06] <rbasak> Thanks Seb!
[17:06] <rbasak> #endvote
[17:06] <meetingology> Voting ended on: Grant Aaron Rainbolt MOTU permission
[17:06] <meetingology> Votes for: 4, Votes against: 0, Abstentions: 0
[17:06] <meetingology> Motion carried
[17:07] <seb128> np, sorry for the delay!
[17:07] <rbasak> Congratulations arraybolt3!
[17:07] <arraybolt3> \o/
[17:07] <tsimonq2> CONGRATULATIONS arraybolt3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
[17:07] <rbasak> And thank you for all your work
[17:07] <arraybolt3> Thank you!
[17:07] <rbasak> #action rbasak to add arraybolt3 to MOTU
[17:07] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to add arraybolt3 to MOTU
[17:07] <leokolb> Congrats Aaron!
[17:07] <rbasak> #action rbasak to announce arraybolt3's successful application
[17:07] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to announce arraybolt3's successful application
[17:07] <Eickmeyer> 🥳
[17:08] <rbasak> We're over time, so I'll skip the other items for now, unless there's anything urgent?
[17:08] <rbasak> #topic AOB
[17:08] <tsimonq2> rbasak: ...where's kanashiro and Utkarsh?
[17:09] <tsimonq2> That's my only question, and it can be punted.
[17:09] <rbasak> I suspect they're still off from the break period
[17:10] <tsimonq2> Okay. :)
[17:10] <rbasak> I know DMB attendence is not necessarily a Canonical function, but people are still allowed time off :-)
[17:10] <rbasak> #endmeeting
[17:10] <meetingology> Meeting ended at 17:10:40 UTC.  Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2024/ubuntu-meeting.2024-01-08-16.25.moin.txt
[17:10] <tsimonq2> Oh, absolutely. I just haven't seen them in a while and want to make sure they're okay. :)
[17:10] <bdmurray> Especially if they are ill.


[08:10] <alkisg> Hi! I'd like to deprecate answers in a project, https://answers.launchpad.net/epoptes, in favor of github issues. But the only option I have is to close them completely without having an archive of the previously answered questions or even a link to the github issues.
[08:11] <alkisg> E.g. https://launchpad.net/epoptes/+configure-answers => Click "External" and OK => Answers disappear completely, without me being able to even provide an "External link" there...
[08:11] <alkisg> If that's by design, np, I'll do it; I'm just asking in case I missed an option somewhere
[10:35] <wgrant> alkisg: There's no customisation there, I'm afraid.
[10:42] <alkisg> wgrant: thanks a lot :)
[11:09] <ginggs> node-tap-mocha-reporter fails to upload because the orig.tar.gz has "has 34 file(s) with a time stamp too far in the past"
[11:10] <ginggs> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/node-tap-mocha-reporter/3.0.7-1


[03:14] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: Hoz your nouveau skills ? Got some time to talk a thing over ?
[03:20] <OerHeks> Whats up, Bashing-om ?
[03:28] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: Well I swapped out my old ATI card for a nice new nVidia GT 710 . Tried to boot up my core install of 14.04 .. and much to my consternation ,, nope ! .. messed about a bit ,, and 16.04 has no problem with that card . All day long messing about .. and seems 14.04 (3.13 kernel ) does not support this Kepler chipset . So, my next thought is to go with HWE and install the xenial kernel . BUT would rather see what can be done to make
[03:29] <OerHeks> according to http://www.nvidia.com/download/driverResults.aspx/97474/en-us you would need the 361 or up
[03:30] <OerHeks> try the driver ppa ? https://launchpad.net/~graphics-drivers/+archive/ubuntu/ppa?field.series_filter=trusty
[03:30] <OerHeks> boot, ctrl alt f2, login, add ppa, update, and install 361 ( i think)
[03:31] <OerHeks> sudo ubuntu-drivers list # would give a list after adding the ppa, and choose
[03:32] <OerHeks> ( maybe sudo ubuntu-drivers autoinstall  does it automatic )
[03:33] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: Yeah .. had that though also to install the 367 version driver .. and with my minimal install .. the Nvidia driver wanted to install a BUNCH of other stuff . 57 new packages ! .. Well I like my system as is minimal . so do not think I want the proprietary driver ( shucks - was a good thought ) .
[03:34] <OerHeks> oh, does it pull in that much ?
[03:35] <Bashing-om> I wish I had copied it off ! .. I was some kind of amazed at what all it was going to pull in . what I took to be off the wall stuff that I sure did not want .
[03:37] <OerHeks> you can do it again with ' apt-get install --dry-run '
[03:37] <OerHeks> it does not install, just shows the list
[03:38] <Bashing-om> It took me several hours- looking at this and installing that -  to realize the likely issue was that the hardware was just too new ..and there was no open source driver .
[03:39] <OerHeks> too new :-(
[03:39] <Bashing-om> K. will install the PPA once more and show ya .
[03:40] <Bashing-om> Too new for 3.13  is what I presently think . And the course of least resistence - and the less learning - is HWE .
[03:43] <OerHeks> not sure there is HWE for 14.04.5 ... as xenial is released
[03:46] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: See what I  mean : http://termbin.com/gj1m . And I an fairly certain I can upgrade the base 3.13 kernel with enableing HWE and get the xenial kernel and X stack .
[03:46] <OerHeks> oink ... that is insane
[03:48] <OerHeks> you might as wel install 16.04 with --no-install-recommends
[03:48] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: My thouhgt too ! ..  Got that SSD in here also . and will start on getting the SSD prepared to build a minimal 16.04 . But going to keep 14.04 'till I am comforable with the 16.04 .
[03:50] <OerHeks> :-)
[03:50] <OerHeks> 16.04 is not that different, with nvidia
[03:51] <Bashing-om> Oh, once I get started, will not take that long .. just not too sure how long setting up irssi is going to take .
[03:52] <OerHeks> I wish you succes, i am off to bed
[03:53] <Bashing-om> K .. sleep well .
[04:20] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[06:05] <ducasse> good morning everyone
[06:06] <lotuspsychje> morning ducasse
[06:06] <ducasse> hiya lotus, how are you today?
[06:07] <lotuspsychje> great here
[06:07] <lotuspsychje> working day today
[06:07] <lotuspsychje> you?
[06:07] <ducasse> fine thanks, enjoying a big cup of tea and waking up
[06:08] <lotuspsychje> great :p
[06:09] <ducasse> when do you start work?
[06:09] <lotuspsychje> 11
[06:10] <lotuspsychje> till closedown kitchen
[06:11] <lotuspsychje> around 19h30 weekends
[06:11] <ducasse> long days?
[06:11] <lotuspsychje> bartenders are working longer
[06:11] <lotuspsychje> till 22h
[06:11] <lotuspsychje> i can close kitchen and go home
[06:12] <ducasse> it will be worse when your business get going, and you just run from one job to the next :-p
[06:13] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: still waiting less hours/week like they promised
[06:14] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: but they forming a new guy atm, so good news
[06:14] <ducasse> they finally found someone? good for you :)
[06:15] <lotuspsychje> yeah a 4th cook
[06:17] <ducasse> i don't remember if i asked, have you found a host for your webshop? how are you handling that?
[06:18] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: website almost done, icons need to change and need to add items
[06:18] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: lotuscomputers.be
[06:18] <lotuspsychje> payments system goes over https
[06:19] <ducasse> looking good
[06:20] <lotuspsychje> tnx
[06:20] <lotuspsychje> icons will change to attribution free ones
[06:21] <ducasse> what does 'herbron uw computer' mean?
[06:21] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: it means resource your computer
[06:21] <lotuspsychje> or back to the source
[06:21] <lotuspsychje> like you go to a wellness
[06:22] <lotuspsychje> refreshing
[06:22] <ducasse> aha, nice
[06:22] <lotuspsychje> meaning ill give the computers a second, ubuntu life :p
[06:22] <ducasse> :)
[06:22] <lotuspsychje> not always need to buy a new one
[06:23] <ducasse> absolutely not, as i recently found out when i put a spare ssd in my laptop :)
[06:23] <lotuspsychje> yeah that will be the upgrade section
[06:23] <lotuspsychje> pro 850 ssd + ubuntu upgrade
[06:24] <lotuspsychje> and ram upgrades aswell
[06:24] <lotuspsychje> i also ordered 50 usb sticks with website logo
[06:24] <ducasse> why not just the 850 evo?
[06:25] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: the pro gets 10 years warranty
[06:25] <lotuspsychje> its more expensive i know
[06:25] <lotuspsychje> but i want stable rocksolid systems on lts
[06:27] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: the 850 pro getting hammered on servers without fails
[06:27] <lotuspsychje> with many plug it in for desktop use aswell
[06:28] <ducasse> i understand the warranty thing, i just didn't see the need myself - got 2x 850 evo.
[06:29] <lotuspsychje> thats just fine aswell
[06:29] <lotuspsychje> it probably will endure a lifetime aswell
[06:30] <ducasse> works really well, good performance. i expect them to last 'long enough' :)
[06:31] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[06:31] <lotuspsychje> for customers its nice to hear their hardware will last long
[06:33] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: http://www.samsung.com/semiconductor/minisite/ssd/product/consumer/850evo.html
[06:33] <lotuspsychje> 5 years for the evo one
[06:33] <lotuspsychje> plenty :p
[06:34] <ducasse> i know, i don't expect to be using it much longer anyway. hopefully i'll have new m.2 drives by then :)
[06:34] <lotuspsychje> wich ones did you order
[06:34] <ducasse> i have a 250 for /, containers and vms, and a 500 for /home
[06:35] <lotuspsychje> nice
[06:35] <ducasse> everything else lives on the zfs server
[06:35] <lotuspsychje> :p
[06:36] <ducasse> nfs <3
[06:38] <lotuspsychje> movies music?
[06:39] <lotuspsychje> i got a mede8er mediaplayer
[06:39] <lotuspsychje> can be used as NAS also
[06:40] <lotuspsychje> plays every codec in the house
[06:40] <ducasse> nice, i use an rpi2 with kodi, was thinking of getting a wetek box or something similar
[06:40] <lotuspsychje> whats a wetek?
[06:42] <ducasse> it's a media player with openelec (or probably libreelec now)
[06:42] <lotuspsychje> cool
[06:44] <ducasse> they sponsor openelec (or sponsored, not sure if openelec is still alive)
[06:44] <lotuspsychje> http://wetek.com/product/wetek-play2
[06:45] <lotuspsychje> look neat!
[06:46] <ducasse> nice enough, all i really want is a lightweight linux with kodi, optical out and a remote
[06:47] <lotuspsychje> http://www.mede8er.eu/en/
[06:47] <lotuspsychje> i got this
[06:48] <lotuspsychje> but just plays local/nas no webstuff
[06:50] <ducasse> jesus christ, see all their domains at the bottom of the page :-D
[07:13] <lotuspsychje> bbl guys breakfast
[11:41] <BluesKaj_> Howdy folks
[11:43] <OerHeks> hi BluesKaj_
[11:43] <BluesKaj_> Hi OerHeks
[11:43] <OerHeks> seeding 18 gb down, 45 gb up :-D
[11:43] <OerHeks> (over night)
[13:02] <pauljw> Hi everyone
[13:03] <OerHeks> hi pauljw
[13:03] <OerHeks> :-)
[13:03] <pauljw> hey OerHeks :)
[13:33] <BluesKaj> Hi pauljw, OerHeks , so did the upgrade to YY go well ?
[13:33] <OerHeks> BluesKaj, i cannot update :-(
[13:34] <OerHeks> hi hi .... still seeding, 18 gb down, 49,63 gb up
[13:35] <BluesKaj> I have a messed up systemd/sddm login, gotta use upstart
[13:37] <BluesKaj> but this began a week ago or so ..think it was the new kernel version
[13:38] <pauljw> hi BluesKaj :)
[13:40] <BluesKaj> grey, wet and cool here this morning , supposed to clear and warm up this aft
[13:41] <pauljw> about the same here.
[13:42] <BluesKaj> leaves are turning
[13:43] <pauljw> :) this is my favorite season, our leaves are slowly turning but i'm afraid they'll fall before a full color change.
[13:44] <pauljw> i really need to get up on the roof and clean the gutters before we get any rain.
[13:45] <BluesKaj> yeah some years the oak trees are a fanatstic bright yellow, other years they're just bown..kind of in between this year
[13:46] <BluesKaj> err fantastic
[13:53] <OerHeks> after spring this time is the most beautifull time of the year with changing colours
[13:58] <pauljw> :)
[14:34] <pauljw> well, places to go, people to see...  bbl. :)
[21:20] <tsimonq2> argh
[21:20] <tsimonq2> I'm removing the annoying "
[21:20] <tsimonq2> I dragged and it didn't like me
[21:21] <tsimonq2> Better
[21:23] <tsimonq2> It's probably not visible by /topic because it's a string?
[21:23]  * tsimonq2 shrugs
[21:23] <tsimonq2> whatever
[21:23] <tsimonq2> I'm happy now. :P
[21:55] <OerHeks> Oh ..


 Nearing 20 hours with a sinus headache but getting better. You?
[07:49] <seb128> :(
[07:49] <seb128> I'm alright, a bit tired as usual
[07:49] <duflu> I should try to chart these against air pressure changes
[07:50] <didrocks> salut seb128 !
[07:50] <seb128> didrocks, lut, ça va ?
[07:54] <didrocks> ça va, et toi, à part la fatigue ?
[07:55] <seb128> ça va oui :)
[08:00] <oSoMoN> salut didrocks, seb128
[08:00] <didrocks> salut oSoMoN
[08:01] <seb128> lut oSoMoN, comment ça va ? ton oeil est retapé ?
[08:02] <oSoMoN> seb128, oui, il est comme neuf!
[08:02] <seb128> bonne nouvelle :-)
[08:02] <oSoMoN> j’en ai été quitte pour une bonne frayeur
[08:05] <Laney> yo
[08:06] <oSoMoN> yo Laney
[08:08] <didrocks> hey Laney
[08:09] <Laney> hey oSoMoN and didrocks!
[08:09] <Laney> happy thursday
[08:10] <oSoMoN> happy Thor's Day
[08:10] <seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
[08:13] <Laney> what up seb128
[08:13] <Laney> I just went outside in the rain to get some water to give to the plants inside
[08:13] <Laney> so ... quite wet
[08:13] <Laney> and tired, was up late hacking on cdimage
[08:14] <Laney> but if you have a raspberry pi, you can try the results of this: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/daily-preinstalled/current/
[08:14] <seb128> I managed to mostly avoid the rain this morning \o/ but tired as well
[08:14] <seb128> nice one
[08:14]  * seb128 needs to get a raspberry to play with at some point
[08:18] <Laney> yes indeed
[08:20] <seb128> we have dynamic wallpapers now?
[08:27] <duflu> seb128, depends what you mean by dynamic. In Settings > Background you can choose auto-changing wallpapers as the one(s) with the clock icon on them
[08:27] <duflu> Hi oSoMoN and Laney
[08:28] <seb128> duflu, I was reading a french review of 20.10 beta and it claims that we have now 'dynamic wallpapers on the forest theme' preinstalled
[08:28] <duflu> ??
[08:29] <seb128> which I didn't know about/don't see here
[08:29] <seb128> right
[08:30] <marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
[08:30] <oSoMoN> that reviewer probably installed a separate wallpaper pack and didn't remember it?
[08:30] <oSoMoN> morning marcustomlinson
[08:31] <Laney> hey duflu marcustomlinson
[08:31] <duflu> Hi marcustomlinson
[08:32] <Laney> I bet they saw the forest one (wink @ oSoMoN) with the clock icon and guessed what it does
[08:32] <duflu> Maybe they only saw it change between forests
[08:32] <seb128> I was wondering that
[08:33] <duflu> which is an interesting idea
[08:33] <duflu> you could timelapse the same scene
[08:33] <bendman_> oy, speaking of wallpaper, has anyone considered making the login screen wallpaper higher resolution for high dpi displays? it looks a bit jank on a modern laptop
[08:34] <seb128> the article is not very nice, I'm a bit disappointed
[08:34] <marcustomlinson> hey oSoMoN Laney duflu
[08:34] <seb128> they basically are saying that we don't innovate much and a 'resting' compared to other distributions
[08:34] <seb128> like nothing fancy in 20.10, just software updates
[08:34] <seb128> which I guess is somewhat true...
[08:35] <seb128> (they do mention new GNOME and AD integration in ubiquity)
[08:35] <marcustomlinson> It’s a non-LTS they can chill
[08:35] <duflu> bendman_, the login screen is a single blank colour so it should scale to high DPI perfectly :)
[08:36] <bendman_> duflu: hm... I had a grainy ubuntu logo in the bottom middle, at least when I first booted after the install. is that a different layer?
[08:36]  * duflu checks another machine
[08:38] <duflu> bendman_, oh that's not the wallpaper. It's a separate logo. Are you saying it doesn't upscale nicely?
[08:38] <duflu> I can't tell because my 4K monitor gets scale 1.0 on the login screen for some reason
[08:40] <bendman_> duflu: yup, it was a good size, but looked grainy on a high-DPI screen. I'd link a screenshot or something but I'm on a different machine
[08:40] <duflu> Also we get that logo from plymouth where it's used in the boot animation. I'm not sure plymouth can handle downscaling if we give it something bigger
[08:41] <duflu> We could give the login screen a higher resolution version of the same logo but I am still not sure what problem you are seeing
[08:43] <duflu> bendman_, please take a photo of the issue and attach it to a new bug, created by running 'ubuntu-bug gnome-shell'
[08:45] <seb128> marcustomlinson, right, which I think is part of why they are surprised. Traditionally the LTS cycle is conservative and changes start happening after the LTS is out at the beginning of the next LTS cycle
[08:45] <bendman_> duflu: will do, thanks :)
[08:47] <Laney> seb128: push a switch to wayland now, that'll do it
[08:48] <seb128> Laney, right, they explicitly mention that compared to e.g fedora no brtfs or wayland adoption in Ubuntu :p
[08:49] <Laney> heh
[08:49] <Laney> next cycle ... 👍
[08:49] <Laney> WHY
[08:49] <Laney> that actually seems like a bug wtf
[08:49] <Laney> 👎
[08:49] <Laney> there's some error in selecting the emojis from the search provider
[08:50] <Laney> 😱 <- that should have been "face screaming in fear"
[08:51] <duflu> It is, from this angle
[08:51] <Laney> it's "astonished face"
[08:51] <Laney> 😰
[08:52] <Laney> there's an off by one error
[08:52]  * Laney looks a bit
[08:54] <Laney> poor gnome-characters, it looks a bit dead
[08:56] <seb128> Laney, I wonder if the issue is your IRC client because the smiley are right here
[08:56] <duflu> +1
[08:56] <seb128> already yesterday, you said you used the wrong one but it was the right one afaik
[08:56] <Laney> yeah I was checking, they are right when pasted into gedit
[08:56] <seb128> like your next cycle one is a thumb up
[08:57] <Laney> it's like vte or tilix though
[08:57] <seb128> which I think is what you intended
[08:57] <Laney> someone else paste an emoji please?
[08:57] <Laney> just paste one of those back to me
[08:58] <seb128> 👍
[08:58] <seb128> thumb up one
[09:00] <Laney> https://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/bork.png
[09:00] <Laney> it's right in gnome-terminal which is also vte
[09:01] <seb128> Laney, https://people.canonical.com/~seb128/laney.png
[09:01] <Laney> fixed after restarting tilix
[09:01] <seb128> ah
[09:01] <Laney> 🙄
[09:01] <seb128> weird one
[09:01] <Laney> quality software™
[09:01]  * Laney channels mclasen
[10:11] <Laney> oSoMoN: did you want to do the honours for tepl/gedit/plugins?
[10:12] <oSoMoN> oh, right, I forgot I can upload gedit
[10:12] <oSoMoN> looks like I can upload tepl too, but not gedit-plugins
[10:13] <Laney> ah ok, I can sync that one
[10:17] <oSoMoN> Laney, how do I sync a package that's still in NEW ?
[10:25] <Laney> oSoMoN: you can't, you'll have to rebuild the source package, add '~fakesync' or similar to the version and upload it normally
[10:27] <oSoMoN> Laney, ack, so we don't want to wait for it to be accepted in Debian?
[10:27] <Laney> I guess we might if there were more time before the release :(
[10:29] <oSoMoN> ok
[10:30] <oSoMoN> I'll upload the rebuilt package then
[10:31] <Laney> NEW processing is a bit of an unknown quantity in Debian, so we will often have to re-upload to Ubuntu and then sync back over
[10:31] <Laney> https://ftp-master.debian.org/stat.html
[10:31] <Laney> I don't envy those guys, it's a difficult/boring job
[10:40] <Laney> good to see jbicha wake up and find the sync button again :>
[10:41] <oSoMoN> Laney, so "5.0.0-1fakesync1" would be the right version number?
[10:42] <oSoMoN> nevermind, you already wrote what the suffix should be…
[10:43] <Laney> yeah ~ makes it lower so the real one can be synced over
[10:45] <oSoMoN> now I get "Error connecting to remote host" when dputting to ubuntu
[10:45] <oSoMoN> I experienced the same problem last week for about a day, then it was gone and I could upload again
[10:45] <oSoMoN> is it just me?
[10:46] <oSoMoN> ah, now it worked
[10:46] <oSoMoN> transitory problem I guess
[10:48] <oSoMoN> Laney, done fakesyncing tepl and syncing gedit
[10:49] <Laney> 🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘🤘
[11:58] <GunnarHj> Hi seb128! gnome-software was just built, and this was a surprise:
[11:58] <GunnarHj> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/groovy/+source/gnome-software/+imports
[11:58] <GunnarHj> i.e. the .po files were not imported. The reason may be that it's set to share translations with snap-store-desktop. Usually we solve that kind of things by deleting such share links, but in this case that's probably not advisable...
[11:58] <GunnarHj> Any thoughts on how it should be set up?
[11:59] <seb128> GunnarHj, hey, opt out of langpacks and just ship the upstream translations with the software?
[12:01] <GunnarHj> seb128: Yeah, that's one thought. But then we break the attempt to share translations between the two projects. Or maybe that has never worked as intended anyway?
[12:07] <seb128> I don't think that we ever properly figured that out, see the bug I mentioned recently
[12:08] <seb128> we need to figure out how to properly handle snap store translations
[12:08] <seb128> that's probably just by merge the upstream .po back to the vcs with msgmerge or something
[12:12] <GunnarHj> seb128: Upstream's translation updates seem to be fetched into snap-store trunk (but they are a bit old ATM).
[12:13] <GunnarHj> seb128: I'm thinking that if we opt out of langpacks, we could as well drop the translation template for the gnome-software package.
[12:13] <seb128> right
[12:14] <seb128> or if we don't rely on sharing just untick the sharing box and keep langpacks...
[12:14] <GunnarHj> seb128: Right, that's the other way.. Probably better. Can you do that? (I don't have access to do it.)
[12:16] <seb128> GunnarHj, you don't have access to https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/groovy/+source/gnome-software/+sharing-details ?
[12:16] <GunnarHj> seb128: Yes, but my previous attempts to change something used to fail.
[12:16] <seb128> try clicking the red minus?
[12:17] <seb128> if it fails I can do it but it should work...
[12:18] <GunnarHj> seb128: Just did. Let's see if it's persistent... Will upload a no-change rebuild then.
[12:18] <seb128> it seems to have worked, at least from a page refresh, thanks
[12:19] <GunnarHj> np
[13:26] <hellsworth> good morning desktopers
[13:26] <hellsworth> marcustomlinson: would you please upload the 7.0.2~rc2 LO that is in https://launchpad.net/~hellsworth/+archive/ubuntu/lo-dummy-repo-1
[13:26] <hellsworth> ricotz: approved
[13:38] <oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
[13:40] <marcustomlinson> hellsworth: can do, have you tested manually?
[13:43] <marcustomlinson> and I assume autopkgtests are good
[13:49] <marcustomlinson> school run bbiab
[13:52] <hellsworth> marcustomlinson: yes i tested manually and all autopkgtests passed
[13:52] <hellsworth> o/ oSoMoN marcustomlinson :)
[14:52] <hellsworth> amurray: emitorino could one of you please do a manual review on the libreoffice snap with lzo : https://dashboard.snapcraft.io/snaps/libreoffice/revisions/193/
[15:14] <emitorino> yes hellsworth ! BTW, the review-tools are already updated to support lzo, and the store is pulling the updates
[15:15] <hellsworth> ah ok great thanks :)
[15:15] <emitorino> you are welcome!
[15:18] <emitorino> approved hellsworth !
[15:26] <hellsworth> thanks!
[15:28] <hellsworth> i just noticed that the snap is actually way larger with lzo, by almost 200Mb...
[15:28] <hellsworth> i'll go investigate
[15:30] <hellsworth> nevermind. to be expected :)
[20:24] <ricotz> seb128, Wimpress, hi, nv-codec-headers <IP_ADDRESS>-0ubuntu1 looks a bit broken when files are installed to /debian/libffmpeg-nvenc-dev/usr/