[08:52] <Scary_Guy> so...  apcupsd or nut?  I haven't really played with either
[08:57] <Scary_Guy> I'm leaning toward nut since they have an actual website and not just a blog with releases
[11:55] <jrwren> Scary_Guy: I use pwrstatd from powerpanel pkg
[11:56] <jrwren> Scary_Guy: I have a cyberpower ups, so I use their pkg. it works *shrug*  ymmv
[17:36] <Scary_Guy> thx
[18:03] <cmaloney> afternoon. :)
[18:04] <Scary_Guy> hey
[21:30] <cmaloney> Are we having fun yet?
[22:02] <jrwren> lol
[22:33] <rick_h_> wheeeeee


[17:50] <harmw> harlowja_at_home: seems CERN is interested in RDO for el6, just like Y!
[17:50] <harlowja_at_home> hmmmm, RDO
[17:51] <harlowja_at_home> i'm not sure RH wants to further RDO for el6 though ;)
[17:51] <harlowja_at_home> el7 is the future, ha
[17:52] <harmw> lol yes
[17:52] <harmw> but I want just Juno, not an upgrade to centos7 as well :p
[17:52] <harmw> not yet
[17:52] <harlowja_at_home> ya, well wait till juno is released in like 2 weeks, lol
[17:52] <harmw> there is a topic on the RDO ML about this
[17:53] <harlowja_at_home> once y! starts to get juno running (without RDO) i'll have the packages that u can use
[17:53] <harlowja_at_home> *without RDO
[17:53] <harmw> and how whould they differ from RDO?
[17:53] <harlowja_at_home> do u have a link to the RDO ML?
[17:53] <harmw> sure
[17:53] <harmw> sec
[17:53] <harmw> https://www.redhat.com/archives/rdo-list/2014-September/msg00122.html
[17:54] <harlowja_at_home> harmw, packages are built from upstream, so in reality they don't differ much,  https://github.com/stackforge/anvil builds them automatically, code is all there and stuff if u want to use it
[17:54] <harlowja_at_home> specs @ https://github.com/stackforge/anvil/tree/master/conf/templates/packaging/specs
[17:55] <harmw> and those specs do the same stuff RDO does?
[17:55] <harlowja_at_home> pretty much
[17:55] <harmw> 'pretty much' :p
[17:55] <harmw> you already got that stuff packaged somewhere?
[17:56] <harlowja_at_home> get a VM, and it will pop out the packages for u ;)
[17:56] <harlowja_at_home> it generates the packages, lol
[17:56] <harmw> I'm not particularly interested in building a crapload of Juno packages by myself :P
[17:56] <harlowja_at_home> ya, i can probably get them published somewhere when i/others get anvil working for juno
[17:57] <harlowja_at_home> those spec files probably need some tweaking for juno
[17:57] <harmw> ye, they look old :p
[17:57] <harlowja_at_home> but the idea for anvil is that it sucks down git repos, analyzes there python requirements, fills out those spec files, finds and downloads dependencies, builds those all into rpms
[17:57] <harlowja_at_home> *builds those into source rpms
[17:58] <harlowja_at_home> and then has a further stage to convert all that into rpms
[17:58] <harmw> just like rpmbuild handles my perl dependencies (sometimes wrong or competely unwanted)
[17:58] <harlowja_at_home> :)
[17:58] <harlowja_at_home> hey, u can change anvil at least ;)
[17:58] <harmw> hehe
[17:59] <harlowja_at_home> i even made terminal recordsing @ http://anvil.readthedocs.org/en/latest/topics/examples.html
[17:59] <harlowja_at_home> a while ago, haha
[17:59] <harlowja_at_home> u can watch it
[17:59] <harlowja_at_home> haha
[17:59] <harmw> lol
[17:59] <harlowja_at_home> *super exciting*
[18:00] <harmw> omfg
[18:00] <harlowja_at_home> lol
[18:00] <harmw> superdupercool :P
[18:00] <harlowja_at_home> ha
[18:01] <harlowja_at_home> ya, showterm.io was neat when i found it
[18:01] <harlowja_at_home> lol
[18:01] <harmw> indeed
[18:02] <harlowja_at_home> although the viewer is still somewhat buggy
[18:02] <harlowja_at_home> still doesn't always scroll right
[18:02] <harmw> so what if I wanted to build me some el65 packages for Juno RC1
[18:02] <harmw> ha no
[18:03] <harlowja_at_home> first watch http://showterm.io/12c29e87094f128d945fa/
[18:03] <harlowja_at_home> but anyway, u can try anvil
[18:03] <harlowja_at_home> and give ./smithy a --origin option
[18:03] <harlowja_at_home> and make an origin file for https://github.com/stackforge/anvil/tree/master/conf/origins for juno rc1
[18:04] <harlowja_at_home> and see how it goes
[18:04] <harmw> what's it doing with passwords in that 'movie' ?
[18:04] <harmw> and this stuff doesn't require root, right?
[18:05] <harlowja_at_home> building rpms does
[18:05] <harmw> still?
[18:05] <harmw> wasn't that squashed ages ago?
[18:06] <harlowja_at_home> for when say later if anvil installs say mysql, it will need root to, and a password
[18:06] <harmw> could be wrong on that though
[18:06] <harmw> ah ok
[18:06] <harmw> makes sense
[18:06] <harlowja_at_home> maybe, i haven't tried turning it off in a while
[18:07] <harmw> you happen to know if epel6 contains all requirements?
[18:07] <harlowja_at_home> not likely
[18:07] <harmw> regarding python versions and stuff
[18:07] <harlowja_at_home> anvil will scan epel for requirements so that it doesn't have to build them
[18:07] <harlowja_at_home> it usually doesn't find them all there
[18:07] <harlowja_at_home> seems to always be some missing, lol
[18:07] <harmw> hehe, but if that happens anvil will build it itself?
[18:08] <harlowja_at_home> yup
[18:08] <harlowja_at_home> or try to
[18:08] <harmw> sounds like anvil is holy grail
[18:09] <harlowja_at_home> ha
[18:09] <harlowja_at_home> depends if it works for u
[18:09] <harmw> ok, so the movie says packaging blabla
[18:09] <harmw> but that is not rpmbuild, right?
[18:09] <harlowja_at_home> thats a source rpmbuild build
[18:09] <harlowja_at_home> which doesn't require root
[18:09] <harmw> ah ok
[18:09] <harlowja_at_home> the non-source-rpm (build stage) requires root
[18:10] <harlowja_at_home> http://anvil.readthedocs.org/en/latest/topics/examples.html#building
[18:10] <harlowja_at_home> ah one reason it requires root to build
[18:11] <harlowja_at_home> 'Installing build requirements'
[18:11] <harlowja_at_home> that one won't work so well without root ;)
[18:11] <harmw> makes sense :)
[18:11] <harlowja_at_home> so ya, anvil builds its own RDO in a way :-P
[18:12] <harmw> hehe
[18:12] <harmw> well my bigest concern with packaging by myself is keeping it updated is also something I need to do, by myself
[18:12] <harmw> and that sucks
[18:13] <harlowja_at_home> ya, well for just local testing and stuff, it should be fine
[18:13] <harlowja_at_home> if u don't have resources to keep on running anvil and stuff, then ya, go with RDO
[18:14] <harmw> yea well
[18:14] <harmw> :)
[18:14] <harlowja_at_home> although y! and godaddy (which have been using anvil) aren't running against trunk openstack, so we sometimes hit anvil issues when moving to the next release, aka, binaries move around or some crap
[18:14] <harmw> hmk
[18:15] <harmw> well I'm not neccesarily after trunk
[18:15] <harmw> stable is fine :p
[18:15] <harlowja_at_home> ya, i don't think stable is juno yet though ;)
[18:15] <harlowja_at_home> so u are in a transitionary period, lol
[18:15] <harmw> :P
[18:15] <harmw> I guess it'll take another 10 yrs for openstack to reach a true stable point :>
[18:16] <harlowja_at_home> 100
[18:17] <harlowja_at_home> 1000 years
[18:17] <harlowja_at_home> lol
[18:18] <harmw> hm, or I could just start reading about this inplace centos6>7 upgrade path
[18:19] <harlowja_at_home> or that
[18:20] <harmw> hm hm, well that actually sounds like a plan
[18:21] <harlowja_at_home> let me know how it goes
[18:21] <harmw> it'll nuke my designate setup, probably
[18:22] <harlowja_at_home> ya, thats the part i'm worried about, epseciall when u have alot of hypervisors on el6 (like yahoo does)
[18:22] <harlowja_at_home> not so good to nuke hypervisors
[18:22] <harlowja_at_home> lol
[18:22] <harmw> designate isn't the hypervisor
[18:22] <harlowja_at_home> *that sort breaks the inplace upgrade, haha
[18:22] <harmw> its openstack-designate, which I'm running in this centos6 vm I'm targetting for an upgrade :p
[18:23] <harlowja_at_home> gotcha
[18:23] <harmw> and I built the rpm myself, so ditched systemd
[18:24] <harmw> http://wiki.centos.org/TipsAndTricks/CentOSUpgradeTool
[18:24] <harmw> ok, lets just see what happens :)
[18:24] <harlowja_at_home> good luck
[18:24] <harlowja_at_home> haha
[18:28] <harlowja_at_home> hmmm https://www.redhat.com/archives/rdo-list/2014-September/msg00128.html
[18:28] <harlowja_at_home> i know perry
[18:28] <harlowja_at_home> hmmm
[18:29] <harlowja_at_home> sucks for people using RDO :(
[18:29] <harlowja_at_home> * https://www.redhat.com/archives/rdo-list/2014-September/msg00133.html
[18:29] <harlowja_at_home> they know about anvil to... argggggg
[18:30] <harlowja_at_home> *at least some of that team knows about anvil
[18:30] <harlowja_at_home> stuff like 'We'd love to have people outside of the Red Hat engineering team doing some of the packaging work that we lack either the time or the priority to do. ' when anvil does exactly this confuse me :-P
[18:31] <harlowja_at_home> maybe i should get on that ML and post, anvil...
[18:31] <harmw> well, yes
[18:33] <harlowja_at_home> lets see if i can do that
[18:33] <harlowja_at_home> they'll probably get all pissed at me, why would people pay for RDO then haha
[18:34] <harmw> but isn't RDO the free countrpart of rhel openstack? I never realy got that :p
[18:34] <harlowja_at_home> hmmm, not sure, anything associated with RH makes me think of $$
[18:34] <harlowja_at_home> lol
[18:34] <harmw> hehe
[18:35] <harlowja_at_home> i guess i've been in to many of there meetings which end up becoming, use RH product XYZ at yahoo :-P
[18:36] <harmw> hhe
[18:36] <harmw> I only know of CentOS :p
[18:36] <harmw> though that's about to change, since new $job uses RHEL
[18:36] <harmw> and AIX :>
[18:40] <harmw> ok, running # preupg -s CentOS6_7
[18:44] <harlowja_at_home> ya, i'm debating on whether i want to send mail to rdo list about anvil
[18:44] <harlowja_at_home> lol
[18:44] <harmw> just go for it :>
[18:46] <harlowja_at_home> hmmm, maybe
[18:46] <harlowja_at_home> lol
[18:47] <harlowja_at_home> bb, i'll think about it, ha


[00:15] <busy_> Just switched from Mint back to Ubuntu MATE. Any sugguestions about a good theme?
[00:17]  * nomic has a zero black background
[00:19] <busy_> I'm looking for something a bit colourfull that my old eyes can easily see.
[00:20] <busy_> I love the Gnome 2 layout, just need to customize a bit, thanks in advance.
[00:34] <pilne> there are some colorful options in the ones already installed IIRC
[00:40] <nomic> z.z.z.
[00:53] <HetroErectus> green submarine
[00:53] <HetroErectus> thats the one i use
[00:53] <pilne> does mate make much use of the "vala" programming language?
[00:56] <newbsCoder> hello I am installing QT creator for the first time on Ubuntu Mate and I downloaded an *.Run file double clicked it and ubuntu is telling me thert is no program to run this type of file \
[00:58] <pilne> right click it, choose "open with other application" and find qtcreator
[00:58] <pilne> if that is what is supposed to open it.
[00:58] <newbsCoder> no its an online installer of qtcreator
[00:58] <pilne> that doesn't sound like a linux based installer
[00:59] <pilne> qtcreator might already be in the repos for ubuntu
[00:59] <newbsCoder> http://download.qt.io/official_releases/online_installers/qt-unified-linux-x64-online.run
[01:01] <pilne> not sure that is the way that link should be working that way
[01:02] <newbsCoder> ok how can I download the latest version from the repository?
[01:02] <pilne> this might help with .run files thought: http://askubuntu.com/questions/18747/how-do-i-install-run-files
[01:03] <pilne> or you can download from this link: https://www.qt.io/download-open-source/#section-2
[01:03] <pilne> scroll down to qtcreator
[01:04] <pilne> hrm, those are all .run too... wtf
[01:04] <pilne> why not just package it like... normal lol
[01:04] <pilne> the askubuntu link has some good info about .run files
[01:06] <newbsCoder> yeah thanks
[01:06] <newbsCoder> :)
[01:07] <pilne> and to answer my own question, vala should be fine to use since it compiles down to c and headers.
[01:08] <pilne> ohhhhh we're on the MATE wikipedia page!
[01:09] <newbsCoder> you need to set the permissions to run as an exe
[01:14] <pilne> or you could just do it the "easy" way and use a slightly older version in the official repo
[01:14] <pilne> or use a PPA for a more up-to-date version: https://launchpad.net/~adrozdoff/+archive/ubuntu/qtcreator-git
[01:15] <ubuntuNewbs> Whats a PPA ?
[01:15] <ubuntuNewbs> Piracy Protection Act?
[01:16] <pilne> personal package archive
[01:16] <ubuntuNewbs> Sweet
[01:16] <pilne> community-maintained packages.
[01:17] <pilne> honestly if you are very new to ubuntu/qtcreator
[01:17] <pilne> i would just do sudo apt update
[01:17] <pilne> and then sudo apt install qtcreator
[01:17] <pilne> and when/if you run into issues
[01:17] <pilne> look into other ways
[01:17] <pilne> because that will be the easiest to remove if you end up not liking it.
[01:18] <ubuntuNewbs> Yeah Removing Software is a hassel in linux. :D
[01:18] <ubuntuNewbs> I want to invent an easy uninstall software for Linux
[01:20] <ubuntuNewbs> question, Can I split my partition to install arch after Ive already installed Ubuntu mate?
[01:20] <pilne> you can, but you have to boot from a live cd so that the partition isn't mounted
[01:21] <pilne> err live usb
[01:21] <pilne> or cd.. or dvd, but yeah, you can't partition it while it is part of the active system
[01:21] <pilne> but...
[01:21] <pilne> if you are new to linux... i wouldn't dick with arch just yet tbh
[01:21] <ubuntuNewbs> Yeah Thats why Im here in ubuntu
[01:21] <pilne> and if you really want to get a taste of it, try something like manjaro
[01:22] <ubuntuNewbs> I used to mess around with Kali and Backtrack
[01:22] <pilne> it's the ubunto of arch
[01:22] <pilne> err ubuntu
[01:22] <ubuntuNewbs> But Got tired of windows Creeping On my keystrokes
[01:22] <ubuntuNewbs> Microsoft the Creeper Of Keystrokes
[01:23] <pilne> heh
[01:23] <ubuntuNewbs> I do Dev stuff for blender.
[01:23] <pilne> IMHO for most people moving to linux, ubuntu is going to be ideal, and ubuntu mate is so very slick and polished, i haven't even looked at distrowatch in like 2 weeks except to read the review of ubuntu mate lol
[01:23] <ubuntuNewbs> Thats why I need a good dev environment
[01:23] <pilne> nice, my gf rocks the shit outta blender
[01:24] <pilne> she's the director of marketing for a local craft brewery
[01:25] <ubuntuNewbs> I see
[01:26] <ubuntuNewbs> Yeah Im the director of and Open Movie project too,
[01:26] <ubuntuNewbs> An epic Sheeps tale. We just joined forces with a game company too.
[01:27] <pilne> very cool :)
[01:28] <pilne> i'm just a lower-management bitch-boy at UPS LMAO
[01:28] <ubuntuNewbs> haha
[01:28] <ubuntuNewbs> pays the bills
[01:29] <pilne> this is true, and it is a pretty "not going to dissapear anytime soon" type of job
[01:32] <ubuntuNewbs> yeah, thats presicely why I work as a Herb Farm Guy
[01:53] <Steveaustin1971> no questions (yet) just popped in to say great job on Mate. I am loving it.
[01:55] <[7666]> i wonder if anyone is around that has installed the powerpc variant
[01:55] <Newbs> anyone know if my downloads in Firefox will be good if I restart them after being disconcted?
[01:57] <kisb> probably not
[01:58] <Newbs> crap. :)
[01:59] <kisb> use downthemall extension next tym
[02:00] <Newbs> Whats that
[02:48] <luong> hello! I want change my login screen, but I can find Login Windows, LightDM GTK+ can't run file .desktop. Please help me!
[02:51] <pilne> system/control center/lightDM GTK+ Greeter settings
[03:25] <kfox> does anyone know how to install juniper network connect?
[06:16] <mate|36265> good morning
[06:16] <mate|36265> or should I just say hit everyone
[06:16] <mate|36265> if there is anyone out there
[06:17] <mate|36265> I have problems with the proprietary nvidia driver
[06:17] <mate|36265> on my laptop, when I connect a monitor
[06:17] <mate|36265> I can't arrange the screens
[06:18] <mate|36265> in the nvidia settings manager all I see is 1 giant screen with "no scanout" message
[06:29] <sagar> hi
[06:30] <alkisg> Hello
[06:30] <mate|36265> hello
[06:30] <sagar> you r from
[06:30] <alkisg> sagar, this isn't a channel to make friends, it's specifically for ubuntu support
[06:30] <Guest53434> yes
[06:31] <Guest53434> ok
[07:05] <alkisg> !ask
[08:02] <amy_> hello, sbdy there to help me ?
[08:02] <mra_> amy_: what's your problem?
[08:02] <amy_> hello is thezre sbdy to help me ?
[08:03] <amy_> thx
[08:03] <mra_> don't thank me yet
[08:03] <amy_> :-))) i've just install mate. it's my 1st linux
[08:03] <mra_> okay, so what's the problem?
[08:04] <amy_> i'm french and i'm sure i have install keyboard and langgage in french but firefox or Tbirds are in english
[08:05] <alkisg> Are the menus in french?
[08:05] <alkisg> The system menus, the panel
[08:05] <alkisg> Not the firefox/thunderbird menus
[08:05] <amy_> even all the store is writing in english (the description of the softwares not the headline of the store)
[08:06] <amy_> the system menu is in french but softwares are in english
[08:06] <alkisg> Go to the control panel and run language support, it will prompt you to install the language packs
[08:06] <amy_> even hexchat here is in french so i dont understand
[08:07] <amy_> ok where is control pannel ?
[08:07] <alkisg> I have Greek menus and you have French so I can't help much, it will be somewhere under system settings, preferences, language support or something
[08:08] <alkisg> Or, press alt+ctrl+t to open a terminal, and run: /usr/bin/gnome-language-selector
[08:08] <amy_> i hve someting in the left menu called system tools (in french) the pics is a wheel
[08:09] <alkisg> press alt+ctrl+t to open a terminal. There, type this and press enter: gnome-language-selector
[08:09] <alkisg> Fortunately this is the same in all languages :)
[08:10] <ouroumov> hi amy_
[08:10] <amy_> indeed it run something :p
[08:10] <amy_>  maybe i should restart Mate after ?
[08:10] <alkisg> Did it prompt you to install the language packs?
[08:10] <ouroumov> I'm French too and I can set the language fine on the login screen.
[08:11] <alkisg> ouroumov, he already has french menus
[08:11] <amy_> can we talk french ouroumov it would be easier ?
[08:11] <ouroumov> amy_, when you're at the login screen, on the top right corner there's a language setting. If you switch to fr_FR and then login you should have Welcome in French
[08:11] <amy_> maybe it's my version. i run 16
[08:11] <ouroumov> I'm running 16.04 too
[08:11] <alkisg> Language packs for firefox, thunderbird etc are not installed by default
[08:12] <ouroumov> oh
[08:12] <ouroumov> yes
[08:12] <alkisg> That's what you're missing and that's what I was trying to tell you how to install them
[08:12] <amy_> it's says that full take in charge is not fully installed (la prise en charge de la langue n'est pas completement installée)
[08:13] <ouroumov> amy_, do that step and you should have the language packs
[08:13] <amy_> ok so i clicked install"
[08:14] <amy_> cool ! it seems that fr language is installing for all softwares :-))
[08:15] <amy_> i think i will abandon windows :-)))
[08:16] <amy_> by the way if you know him, kiss the guy in the team who had the idea to put a button in the welcome menu (only in 16) to resize automatically
[08:16] <amy_> i couldn't get resize on 15
[08:19] <ouroumov> amy_, si t'as besoin de plus d'aide en Français il y a le chan  #ubuntu-fr que tu peux aussi utiliser
[08:20] <amy_> hello ?? in fact i just opened again TBirds and it's still in english
[08:20] <ouroumov> Et pareil, si t'as besoin d'aide pour un truc spécifique à Ubuntu MATE tu peux aussi parler ici en Français je pense, je n'ai pas vu de règle l'interdisant
[08:20] <ouroumov> amy_, the changes might not come into effect until after your logout/login
[08:20] <amy_> bon merci. en fait TBirds est tjs en anglais, du moins le parametrage du début
[08:21] <amy_> ok so i will restart and coming here again. excuse me for my exit. i'm coming back to tell you my position
[08:26] <amy_>  again. thank you all. it worked.
[08:27] <alkisg> You're welcome
[08:28] <amy_> in fact, i never saw such a support. the more it's free, the more the quality is :-))), i thank you very very much
[08:45] <alkisg> !ask
[09:02] <newbs> Anyone familiar with installing cuda toolkit or latest video drivers for Gpu?
[09:10] <Cryterion> Hi
[09:11] <newbs> \o
[09:12] <Cryterion> Anyone know how to exec binary files on the raspberry version of Ubuntu-Mate? Having a bit of hassle doing it!
[09:13] <mra_> is it somehow different to execute binary files in rpi?
[09:14] <Cryterion> seems so, http://askubuntu.com/questions/770906/qt-unified-linux-x86-2-0-3-online-run-cannot-execute-binary-file-getting-exec-f
[09:14] <Cryterion> that's someone else post, but same problem
[09:14] <mra_> maybe it's not an x86 platform
[09:15] <mra_> isn't it arm something?
[09:15] <Cryterion> hmm, you're right, arm7
[09:19] <mra_> i posted an answer to the question you linked
[09:20] <mra_> but didn't find an arm binary for the program he was trying to run
[09:33] <gordonjcp> Cryterion: it needs to be built for ARM
[09:33] <gordonjcp> Cryterion: what are you trying to run?
[09:34] <Cryterion> yes, that's what I'm seeing now
[09:34] <gordonjcp> Cryterion: the clue is right there in the filename
[09:35] <mra_> is it this qt-unified that you are also trying to run?
[09:35] <Cryterion> Writting my own application, working on rebuilding QT on laptop to support Arm cross compiling
[09:35] <Cryterion> I was using the offline version
[09:38] <gordonjcp> Cryterion: why not use the packaged versions of Qt?
[09:42] <Cryterion> The packaged version doesn't seem to have the toolchains needed to cross compile for the arm11 type processor
[09:53] <gordonjcp> Cryterion: that doesn't make a lot of sense
[09:53] <gordonjcp> Cryterion: Qt wouldn't have compiler tools, gcc would
[09:54] <gordonjcp> cross-compiling for ARM on x86 does take some fairly specific setting up
[10:12] <Cryterion> looks like this might work http://hertaville.com/2013/07/19/cross-compiling-gtk-applications-for-the-raspberry-pi/
[10:49] <Guest52029> How to use Netflix?
[10:59] <Guest52029> How to use Netflix?
[10:59] <ouroumov> Hi Guest52029
[11:00] <ouroumov> Easiest is to install google chrome from the software boutique
[11:00] <Guest52029> OK thanks
[11:26] <curry> hey guys, i tried using google to turn off mouse acceleration but i couldn't figure out how to do it, could somebody help me?
[11:40] <Guest18096> Can't get Netflix to work with Ubuntu-Mate? Tried Chromium, Firefox, Opera/
[11:42] <ouroumov> Guest18096, try google chrome
[11:44] <Guest18096> Tried Chromium. Don't see Chrome on Ubuntu. Isn't that for Windows OS?
[11:46] <mra_> you can get chrome for linux too
[11:46] <hid|ninja> chromium is good
[11:46] <ouroumov> No it's not
[11:46] <hid|ninja> ?
[11:46] <ouroumov> Guest18096, go to the software boutique
[11:46] <ouroumov> Guest18096, http://i.imgur.com/eIjqwIC.png
[11:47] <mra_> but don't know what helps with netflix though
[11:47] <ouroumov> hid|ninja, sorry that wasn't an answer for your statement
[11:47] <hid|ninja> ah :D
[11:47] <mra_> oh, well that ouroumov's screenshot answers it then
[11:47] <curry> Hey I'm trying to disable mouse acceleration by editing my xorg.conf, but I can't find 50-mouse-acceleration.conf anywhere. Any suggestions?
[11:47] <Guest18096> OK I'll look for the Chrome browser download. Thanks
[11:48] <ouroumov> curry, there's an acceleration setting in the mouse settings
[11:48] <ouroumov> curry, system -> preferences -> hardware -> mouse
[11:49] <curry> I know, but I dragged it all the way down but there's still acceleration
[11:49] <ouroumov> hm
[11:53] <curry> Never mind, I think I got it working
[12:54] <Paddy_NI> Trying to ssh into the Ubuntu MATE live system and have been unable to figure the password out
[12:54] <Paddy_NI> I think the user name is "ubuntu-mate"
[12:55] <ouroumov> have you tried the empty password?
[12:55] <Paddy_NI> It does not work
[12:56] <Paddy_NI> I don't think ssh allows for an empty password
[12:56] <Paddy_NI> I wonder if I have to create another user
[12:56] <ouroumov> Why are you even trying to log into the live that way?
[12:56] <Paddy_NI> Or would it be just as easy to set a password for the default live session user?
[12:57] <Paddy_NI> ouroumov: I need to copy some file of the hdd over the network
[12:57] <ouroumov> Paddy_NI, can't you do it the other way? scp -rv user@hdd:/path/ .
[12:58] <Paddy_NI> ouroumov: Actually good point
[12:58] <Paddy_NI> :-)
[12:59] <gordonjcp> you can actually set PermitEmptyPasswords in sshd_config
[12:59] <gordonjcp> or you could create an ssh key
[13:00] <ouroumov> Does the livecd even ships with sshd active?
[13:00] <Paddy_NI> ouroumov: No I installed it
[13:01] <Paddy_NI> Any way I have opted for mounting the destination computer within the live cd inorder to copy the files
[13:01] <Paddy_NI> Happy days
[13:01] <Paddy_NI> Are there faster ways of moving files over a network other than ssh?
[13:02] <Paddy_NI> This clients "Ultrabook" has no ethernet port
[13:02] <Paddy_NI> :-(
[13:03] <gordonjcp> Paddy_NI: it's about as fast as it gets, really
[13:03] <Paddy_NI> Cool
[13:03] <Paddy_NI> Good to know
[13:03] <ouroumov> yeah
[13:03] <gordonjcp> there's a *bit* of overhead but nothing drastic
[13:03] <gordonjcp> like
[13:03] <gordonjcp> you could set up nfs or samba
[13:03] <Paddy_NI> I suppose when you are gaining encyption then I cannot complain
[13:03] <gordonjcp> get the remaining couple of percent overhead back
[13:03] <ouroumov> samba is slow
[13:04] <Paddy_NI> Yeah in my experience samba has always bee slow
[13:04] <Paddy_NI> *been
[13:04] <gordonjcp> you could set up iscsi, or ataoe
[13:04] <Paddy_NI> hmm
[13:04] <gordonjcp> or, you could just go "scp that:/this/stuff /over/here" and walk away
[13:05] <Paddy_NI> Moving 97.1 GB of data over wifi is not my idea of fun
[13:05] <gordonjcp> make a cup of tea, go for a walk while it's nice out
[13:05] <gordonjcp> Paddy_NI: at that size, I'd be removing the disk
[13:05] <ouroumov> Paddy_NI, yeah take the sun for a while
[13:05] <Paddy_NI> Totally true guys
[13:05] <gordonjcp> it's pretty cloudy here today, and only 8 degrees
[13:05] <ouroumov> Paddy_NI,  if the transfer breaks at some point, use rsync the next time
[13:05] <gordonjcp> it's been really warm all week
[13:06] <Paddy_NI> Gorgeous
[13:06] <Paddy_NI> Take the two Mini Schnauzers out
[13:06] <Paddy_NI> They are looking at me quite depressed
[13:06] <Paddy_NI> I do have a dock for 3.5 and 2.5 inch sata hdds
[13:07] <Paddy_NI> and ssds I am sure
[13:08] <Paddy_NI> The Ultabook looks fairly seamless though and metal so my laziness is preventing me from dissembling it
[13:09] <Paddy_NI> Thank you, catch you later :-)
[14:26] <festerB> So I just did a clean UM 16.04 install with full disk encryption
[14:26] <festerB> where is the key file? how do I back it up?
[14:27] <festerB> I understand the password is not the same as the key file
[14:33] <TaZeR> i think this might be of some help: https://www.lisenet.com/2013/luks-add-keys-backup-and-restore-volume-header/
[14:36] <festerB> TaZeR: thx, It's a lot of text, I'll try it out
[14:37] <TaZeR> basically look at the part of adding a backup key
[14:45] <sg> Beautiful distribution.  Congrats to developers.  Keep it up !!!
[14:46] <festerB> TaZeR: If I'm getting this right, the key file is the LUKS Header?
[14:48] <sg> Though I could not succeed in getting notification for my headphone.  All the time, I need to manually right click on sound icon, select sound preferences, select connector from output tab as headphone.. Also I wished to see openssh-server installation  by default.
[14:49] <sg> Any suggestion / url for my headphone problem are most welcome.
[14:50] <TaZeR> the header is like the container which holds all information and keys that decrypt the master key, you dont really backup the master key but the keys used to decrypt it
[14:50] <TaZeR> and can backup the entire header as well
[14:51] <TaZeR> so if you have a saved backup of a key you've added you have access to the header or encrypted disk
[14:52] <festerB> TaZeR: I just know that password does not equal key
[14:52] <festerB> and for a removeable backup drive I found that out the hard way
[14:54] <TaZeR> i think what you want to do is backup the header
[14:55] <TaZeR> that way your safe for anything that can go wrong and can restore it anytime
[14:57] <TaZeR> is the problem you forget the password or what?
[14:57] <TaZeR> or just trying to be safe
[14:57] <festerB> I did have the passwd
[14:58] <kallin> Greetings! Has anyone experienced UI sluggishness w/ mate 16 on virtual box? Just did a fresh install, guest additions added, 3d acceleration enabled. Even dragging a window around is very laggy. Had no problems on vanilla ubuntu 16.
[14:58] <festerB> but after installing UM it did not work
[14:58] <kallin> my first time trying mate, so can't say if it's a 16 specific issue.
[14:58] <TaZeR> you upgraded from 15.10?
[14:58] <TaZeR> and it stopped working?
[14:59] <TaZeR> oh i see now clean install
[14:59] <TaZeR> thats strange i have no idea why it wouldnt work unless you spelled it wrong in the installation twice, is that possible?
[14:59] <festerB> TaZeR: I went Linux Mint 17.3 Rosa Cinnamon, did a encryped backup there, then did a clean UM 16.04 and I have no backup...
[15:01] <TaZeR> not sure im understanding still, you had Linux Mint 17.3 installed and you did a clean install with format over that with UM 16.04?
[15:01] <TaZeR> and you made a backup before of the mint installtion using what?
[15:03] <festerB> TaZeR: Yes, encryped backup done inLM 17.3, where it works fine, then system disk format, install UM 16.04
[15:03] <TaZeR> where did you store the backup of LM 17.3?
[15:04] <TaZeR> if it was on the same disk then it would get erased when installing UM 16.04 over it
[15:04] <festerB> TaZeR: backup on an external drive, usb connected
[15:04] <gordonjcp> encrypted disks, what a great way of losing all your data :-)
[15:04] <TaZeR> oh ok
[15:05] <TaZeR> and now ur trying to restore mint?
[15:05] <festerB> TaZeR: Nop, I've installed UM, I'm trying to access my backups
[15:06] <TaZeR> oh ok, can you tell me what you used to make the backup the specific command tools
[15:08] <festerB> TaZeR: In LM 17.3 I plugged the usb drive to my system, formatted using LUKS (i guess) with a password and a passphrase, copied files on backup drive for about one month, it was woring
[15:08] <festerB> working
[15:09] <TaZeR> and now when you try to decrypt the way thats worked before whats the output?
[15:10] <festerB> passphrase not found, something like that
[15:10] <festerB> I have both the passphrase and password, used the drive for about a month, it was all fine
[15:11] <TaZeR> can you dump the header?
[15:11] <TaZeR> like cryptsetup luksDump
[15:12] <festerB> TaZeR: using the link you just posted? I'll try, brb
[15:13] <TaZeR> yea i think theres info on that there, although i thought u were trying to do something different when i posted that
[15:13] <TaZeR> but yea the dump information should let us know if somethings wrong with it
[15:14] <festerB> TaZeR: No, you were right the fist time, I've made new backups and I'm making sure I'm walking eyes wide shut into the same problem again ;)
[15:14] <TaZeR> make sure to target your external drive like /dev/sdb or whatever
[15:15] <TaZeR> oh ok
[15:16] <festerB> TaZeR: but the old drive is still around somewhere, I'll give it a try
[15:26] <mate|12898> Hey, guys! Can someone please help me with my poor sound quality? This is my first time trying linux and the sound is really bothering me!
[15:30] <festerB> TaZeR: I created the header backup file as sudo
[15:32] <nomic> mate|12898  there are also forums -- #ubuntu is more busy than ubuntu mate  ubuntuforums.org  sound may depend on the app .. on mate, the media player to use is "omxplayer"
[15:32] <nomic> mate forum https://ubuntu-mate.community/
[15:32] <festerB> TaZeR: ie. sudo cryptsetup luksHeaderBackup /dev/sdc1 --header-backup-file ~/sdc1-header-backup
[15:41] <festerB> TaZeR: hmm, also had to use sudo on cryptsetup luksDump /dev/sdc1
[15:41] <festerB> but it works that way, perhaps all I need is a sudo where mounting?
[16:51] <Gallomimia> definitely keep having a problem with panels flipping to the opposite monitor after waking from screensaver. it's not consistent either. sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't. is this a known issue?
[16:51] <Gallomimia> do i have to file a bug report?
[17:12] <nomic> gallomia  go to forums - mate forums ubuntu forums
[17:12] <nomic> ask there
[17:39] <jiex> Hi ! Is there a Numix variant in green ?
[17:44] <jiex> I've find one
[18:09] <l_> Is it normal to override a password login of a user when CTRL+ALT+BACKSPACE is used on the login screen?
[18:10] <alkisg> l_: and that combination restarts xorg and kills everything?
[18:11] <ShadowGallow> Hi guys - I just saw this story about Raspberry Pi 3 getting bluetooth support :
[18:11] <ShadowGallow> https://hardware.slashdot.org/story/16/05/13/1740218/raspberry-pi-3-gets-major-update-adds-bluetooth-support
[18:11] <alkisg> or do you actually mean overriding as in bypassing the password protection?
[18:11] <ShadowGallow> Is there something in the repos about getting bluetooth on the Rasberry Pi 3 for Ubuntu Mate - a bug/feature maybe ?
[18:12] <l_> Yes it does restart xorg but then doing the key combination a few times on the login screen can log me back in without needing to input a password.
[18:15] <l_> I have the system set to automatically login on boot though.
[18:16] <ShadowGallow> I'm just starting out with Ubuntu Mate but cud someone please answer the above question (please) ?
[18:18] <ShadowGallow> flexiondotorg: ping.
[18:26] <ShadowGallow> no response . err... This seems like a little silo'd to me (this community). Maybe I'd better move on.
[18:28] <usrdrc> What did you ask?
[18:29] <ShadowGallow> usrdrc: https://paste.ubuntu.com/16395172/
[18:33] <Guest54107> heloo I am vanivan011
[19:15] <Gallomimia> ten character passwords. wow
[19:16] <Gallomimia> Guest54107 use /nick to change it
[19:24] <Gallomimia> is it just me or is the community page rather borked?
[19:24] <Gallomimia> keep getting 400 errors
[19:31] <Gallomimia> well. so much for asking on the forums. it's locked in read only for now
[20:30] <s> hello
[20:30] <s> i installed 16.04
[20:30] <Guest66901> and i also tried to install Skype
[20:30] <Guest66901> but problamatic
[20:30] <tiox> Forum is accessible, but incredibly broken.
[20:31] <Guest66901> oki
[20:31] <tiox> Guest66901: You are better off using the web version of Skype if you rely on group chats because Microsoft hadn't updated Skype in ages.
[20:31] <Guest66901> yes, maybe the direction i will have to go in
[20:32] <tiox> Then, you just need to figure out how to make PulseAudio not act up on you. If you can do it, I'm all ears as t how you did it.
[20:32] <Guest66901> funny, it worked on 15.10 xubuntu
[20:32] <Guest66901> but i guess skype is running behind the curb
[20:32] <tiox> For the desktop version, you should be able to install skype-bin:i386 and then do skype itself.
[20:33] <Guest66901> yes, i tried that
[20:33] <tiox> But, Skype from Welcome installer should do that auto atically.
[20:33] <tiox> automatically*
[20:33] <Guest66901> very strange. some messages come in....others do not
[20:33] <Guest66901> so, your having Pulse problems on UM 16.10?
[20:34] <tiox> Does dpkg --print-foreign-architectures produce any useful input?
[20:34] <Guest66901> let me try
[20:34] <tiox> Becuase for any i386 package to install, dpkg must accept i386 packages.
[20:34] <tiox> Because*
[20:35] <tiox> If i386 shows up as a foreign arch that dpkg accepts, you shouldn't have issues installing Skype.
[20:36] <Guest66901> yes, it is listed
[20:36] <tiox> skype-bin is unlisted. Hmm.
[20:36] <Guest66901> yes.
[20:36] <Guest66901> and skype is installed
[20:37] <Guest66901> just acts weird
[20:37] <Guest66901> i read some where that maybe a problem GTK3
[20:37] <Guest66901> so i so, i put a GTK2 Library in there
[20:38] <Guest66901> looks good now but still weird :)
[20:38] <Guest66901> btw...i am not technical
[20:38] <tiox> Odd. I am installing Skype right now from the software boutique and it's going through fine,
[20:38] <Guest66901> just cut and paste stuff
[20:38] <Guest66901> if u dont mind...try and send a message to someone
[20:39] <Guest66901> i kept getting a caustion symbol
[20:39] <Guest66901> caution
[20:40] <tiox> Works for me.
[20:40] <Guest66901> hmmm...maybe i can try an uninstall and stat over
[20:40] <Guest66901> start
[20:41] <tiox> If you are going to do that, then do --purge autoremove, not remove on its own.
[20:41] <Guest66901> other than that i think um 16.10 is great :)
[20:41] <tiox> So sudo apt-get --purge autoremove skype
[20:41] <Guest66901> i will do that now
[20:42] <tiox> And then try to install from the software boutique' It's under Internet.
[20:44] <Guest66901> its being removed as we speak
[20:45] <tiox> Guest66901: Asking for the heck of it; Do you prefer the Compiz desktop compositor?
[20:48] <Guest66901> and skype is currently being installed via boutique
[20:48] <tiox> No hitches so far?
[20:48] <Guest66901> i have switched to compiz dc
[20:48] <Guest66901> because i like the way it arranges windows side by side
[20:49] <Guest66901> found it somehow easier than marco
[20:49] <tiox> You can customize that behaviour.
[20:49] <tiox> And even redefine shortcut keys so it works your way.
[20:49] <Guest66901> really?
[20:50] <Guest66901> that would be cool
[20:50] <Guest66901> btw...the software boutique thing is downloading way more stuff than previuos install
[20:50] <Guest66901> so lets hope :)
[20:51] <tiox> If you want to stick with Canonical's version of compiz (0.9), you can install compizconfig-settings-manager and use that (by running ccsm) to edit how Compiz functions.
[20:51] <Guest66901> ii will try that beciase alot of my work
[20:51] <tiox> Alternatively, a recent backported version of Compiz had been released which allows for more effects and plugins to be used.
[20:51] <Guest66901> is like a two browser job :)
[20:52] <Guest66901> i am going to try skype now
[20:52] <tiox> But you'd need to completely remove compiz 0.9 from your system before you run a script from soreau's git repo to compile and make it all work.
[20:53] <Guest66901> looks better!
[20:53] <tiox> But, soreau's compile script grabs all depends that compiz 0.8 needs before compiling and includes a version of CompizConfig Settings Manager. Also comes included with Emerald theme manager if you wanted to use that.
[20:53] <Guest66901> thank you so much Tiox
[20:53] <tiox> Welcome.
[20:54] <tiox> Buger, forum is STILL broken.
[20:54] <tiox> bugger*
[20:54] <Guest66901> i will try those compiz things
[20:54] <Guest66901> i like the emerald theme manager
[20:55] <tiox> Guest66901: Emerald theme manager causes some issue that will always persist when you update apt-get for some reason.
[20:56] <Guest66901> hmm...
[20:56] <tiox> I would still recommend backporting; I made a guide for doing it on Linux Mint too if you wanna try it; https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=221700
[20:56] <tiox> It's the same guide, just made more special for Linux Mint. Most fo the commands are still the same.
[20:56] <tiox> And I would recommend changing back to marco if you already used mate-tweak to use compiz.
[20:57] <Guest66901> understood
[20:57] <Guest66901> so, marco is mate specific?
[20:58] <tiox> Not sure. Probably.
[20:58] <tiox> Yes, marco is MATE specific.
[20:58] <Guest66901> your manual looks great
[20:58] <Guest66901> los of cut and pastes for me lol
[20:58] <tiox> Hehe.
[20:59] <tiox> I say use Marco for the time being when using that guide because things might break if you stick with compiz while you're following that guide.
[20:59] <Guest66901> understood
[20:59] <tiox> I really, really wish it was easier. I want soreau to release a snap package some time so nobody has to do that crap.
[21:00] <Guest66901> yes, i was reading about snap
[21:01] <Guest66901> so then u could download it as a complete package without all the dependencies?
[21:01] <tiox> No, snap would give you a package WITH the dependencies, isolated in its own folder.
[21:02] <Guest66901> ahh! got it
[21:02] <Guest66901> well...thanks again!
[21:02] <tiox> It's like if you installed a program in WIndows and made it work outside of its normal install path by putting in Windows DLLs where the exe is.
[21:02] <Guest66901> and have good night :) tiox
[21:02] <tiox> Alright.
[21:02] <tiox> PM me if you have any issues.
[21:03] <Guest66901> thank so much
[21:03] <Guest66901> bye
[21:03] <tiox> That, or refer to #compiz-reloaded
[21:09] <aleetati> Hi
[21:45] <tiox> Forum is still broken af, cannot edit anything.
[22:01] <Gallomimia> tiox i think that's not "broken" that "disabled"
[22:01] <Gallomimia> there's a message that says it's read-only. something's up with the db. maybe they're doing some maintenace to it
[22:02] <Gallomimia> but yeah. i'd really like to post about my 2 monitor setup borking panels and swapping them on me
[22:02] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, This sounds like something I'm experiencing...
[22:02] <Gallomimia> so it's a prevalent issue eh?
[22:02] <Gallomimia> it happens when i wake up from screensaver with lock
[22:03] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, Well, for ME it's a prevalent issue :)
[22:03] <Gallomimia> it also only happens sometimes. and it appears to be paired up with totally borking the graphics on a game i play frequently these days. which the devs say is common from wake-ups
[22:03] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, Yes - lock or switch monitors, etc etc etc - randomly moving about "locked" items and the likes...
[22:04] <Gallomimia> YankDownUnder: do you turn your monitors off at night? i've been avoiding it because of the way my graphics card plays with display port
[22:04] <Gallomimia> i let the system time them out.
[22:05] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, I'm not going to avoid anything if it's within my "normal routine" - because I shouldn't have to do so...therefore, I've been trying to work out a different means by which to deal with it...
[22:05] <Gallomimia> well yeah. i'd rather do that too...
[22:05] <Gallomimia> oh no. monitor only supports DP1.2
[22:05] <Gallomimia> well, i guess it's not 4k so it won't matter
[22:07] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, For the moment - I've resolved to NOT depend on the "mate-panel" - so I'll primarily use "plank" or "docky" or "cairo-dock" - as well, I've gotten to a point where I set the "mate-panel" to "not expand" so it floats in the middle of the screen (top, for me)
[22:07] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, And when using compiz, it's worse...but I digress...
[22:07] <Gallomimia> ive got some forum posts open that deal with those things so i'll read them and try a few things
[22:08] <Gallomimia> compiz eh? i think that's what i abandoned unity to get away from...
[22:08] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, My issues with Unity go back to a time when it was merely a "beta" and not a primary "point" in Ubu...
[22:08]  * YankDownUnder hates Unity
[22:09] <erkan^> I still am satisfied with Ubuntu MATE :-)
[22:09] <Gallomimia> i very much agree on both points
[22:09] <Gallomimia> hated unity. but didn't know there were alternatives for quite a long time
[22:09] <tiox> The ont thing that could make Ubuntu MATE better is if they modified mate-appearance-properties to make editing the mouse easier.
[22:10] <Gallomimia> soon as i installed MATE i was like "wow. this is so much better"
[22:10] <tiox> It's still a PITA to change the mouse pointer.
[22:10] <tiox> While on the other hand, the kind folks at Linux Mint and their Cinnamon DE has this stuff down.
[22:10] <erkan^> Ubuntu MATE is same as Ubuntu 10.04 LTS, Gallomimia (-:
[22:10] <Gallomimia> yes well i was still a mac fanboi back then
[22:10] <erkan^> or GNOME 2.x
[22:11] <Gallomimia> in fact that's what year i got my laptop
[22:11] <tiox> Gallomimia: erkan^ is half-right. MATE is GTK 2.0 with 3.0 compatibility.
[22:11] <erkan^> Do you mean MacBook, Gallomimia ?
[22:11] <Gallomimia> no. i had an apple IIGS
[22:11] <erkan^> owo k, tiox
[22:11] <Gallomimia> been an apple fan for a good long while
[22:11] <tiox> Well, try installing GTK3 apps in Ubuntu 10.04. :P
[22:11] <erkan^> I use MacBook Pro too
[22:12] <Gallomimia> i've got a ubuntu install on mine. haven't switched to using it as my primary OS yet tho :/
[22:12] <Gallomimia> when i get my desktop setup properly and wired in, not on wifi
[22:12] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, Careful with the "Mac Fanboi" stuff (joking) - my primary workstation is a Macbook Pro... :)
[22:12] <Gallomimia> i'll make a change
[22:12] <tiox> Gallomimia: If you don't do that much with Windows, you may do better than most.
[22:12] <Gallomimia> i don't do anything with windows :P
[22:13] <Gallomimia> well, i used to boot windows on the macbook to play Borderlands 1
[22:13]  * YankDownUnder still clings to the ancient Gnome2 days...and clung to Gnome 1.4.6 longer than was "normal"
[22:13] <tiox> Ultimately it depends on how you used Windows or Mac. If you relied on system-specific tools, you'll have a harder time.
[22:13] <Gallomimia> nah. i tinkered in command line some on the mac.
[22:13] <Gallomimia> so i'm fairly familiar with it coming into the world of linux
[22:13] <tiox> Only reason I mention that is gamers still have a hard time ditching windows completely. Know why?
[22:14] <Gallomimia> games ><
[22:14] <tiox> Not games.
[22:14] <erkan^> flexiondotorg: http://webwereld.nl/open-source/93474-de-reden-achter-het-bestaan-van-ubuntu-mate (-:
[22:14] <tiox> There's a deeper reason.
[22:14] <Gallomimia> twitch?
[22:14] <tiox> That's fine. One more guess.
[22:14] <Gallomimia> i'm out of guesses actually
[22:14] <Gallomimia> and i should know this one
[22:14] <tiox> DirectX.
[22:14] <Gallomimia> but hey, i'm having a tea break from donig some physical work
[22:15] <Gallomimia> yes. but that's just a marketing gimmick
[22:15] <Gallomimia> it runs on exactly 2 platforms.
[22:15] <tiox> Games could be made in SDL, LUA, LOVE, Vulkan, any combination thereof which is compatible etc but nope.
[22:15] <Gallomimia> windows desktop and windows console. i mean xbox
[22:15] <tiox> DirectX is what stops gamers from switching.
[22:15] <tiox> Developers stop gamers from switching because they don't optimize for OpenGL.
[22:15] <Gallomimia> they add a bunch of gamma to the new version screenshot and say "look it's brighter!"
[22:16] <Gallomimia> tiox: and they dont do that because microsoft pays them not to
[22:16] <tiox> Yep.
[22:16] <Gallomimia> but, look what happened last year. valve did some tests on oGL vs dX and found GL is faster on windows
[22:16] <tiox> In some cases.
[22:16] <tiox> And with certain hardware.
[22:16] <Gallomimia> or was that all the way back in '14?
[22:17] <tiox> You can't present that to a gamer and say "This is why".
[22:17] <Gallomimia> well, in valve's case, with their games
[22:17] <Gallomimia> card makers its the same.
[22:17] <tiox> If OpenGL was universally faster, that would be definitive.
[22:17] <Gallomimia> they bow and scrape to the dX and leave oGL alone? why? msft pays
[22:17] <tiox> But there are some cases where OpenGL can be worse, and it's down to the dev.
[22:18] <Gallomimia> its my understanding that much of the "new developments" in dX are ripped off from openGL anyway
[22:18] <tiox> Ultimately, it's a double-whammy. Not only does Microsoft pay them to be DirectX-exclusive, but also Linux userbase is still not up to snuff.
[22:18] <YankDownUnder> Microsoft - from the inception of DirectX and it's integration into "gaming" - has "socked in" developers - as they have with hardware manufacturers - so that they will have exclusive "ownership" of the "marketplace" - gamers eventually turn into business folks and workers - so, if you've been enslaved to a Microsoft platform from your early days, you're going to continue to run it in your later days...this has been
[22:18] <YankDownUnder> happening since before Win98...(I've watched it all happen)
[22:18] <Gallomimia> and they don't make it into support for cards under openGL... same reason
[22:19] <Gallomimia> so have i YankDownUnder
[22:19] <Gallomimia> remember the lineups for win95?
[22:20] <tiox> Now, Microsoft intends to have the BASH shell inside Windows 10. Of course, bring the open-source to the commercial system and charge people for it.
[22:20] <tiox> Know who's helping them?
[22:20] <erkan^> No idea?
[22:20] <tiox> Canonical.
[22:20] <tiox> I'm serious.
[22:20] <Gallomimia> sigh
[22:20] <Gallomimia> oh well
[22:20] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, Unfortunately, yes...and back "in the day" I was TRYING to push OS/2 Warp3 and Warp4, along with Desqview...and then BeOS...
[22:21] <Gallomimia> i'm not terribly excited about microsoft breaking into the OSS world
[22:21] <Gallomimia> it's telling of how upset their executives are
[22:21] <Gallomimia> so, that makes me happy.
[22:21] <Gallomimia> besides, if they teach people to use bash on their platform
[22:21] <tiox> See this; https://linux.slashdot.org/story/16/03/30/1021224/confirmed-microsoft-and-canonical-partner-to-bring-ubuntu-to-windows-10
[22:21] <Gallomimia> they'll be ready when windows craps out and they need to switch to linux
[22:22] <Gallomimia> no, i see that as a good thing
[22:22] <Gallomimia> the writing's on the wall.
[22:22] <YankDownUnder> One of the things that's "dawning" on Microsoft - especially since so much is moving "to the cloud" is that end-users are finally, FINALLY getting the "shirts" with the constantly broken OS platform...
[22:23] <Gallomimia> soon as you let the herd of cattle out of then pen and they find out the grass really is greener on the other side, you'll never mend that fence
[22:23] <Gallomimia> seems to me they're trying to plug a hole in the dam with a lifesaver
[22:23] <tiox> The alternative outcome is, Microsoft is going to just make their own version of BASH and implement into Powershell, so developers end up still needing to port to (what I'll call) MS-BASH (Remember MS-DOS? DOS devs was robbed!)
[22:23] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, I have a strange and sneaking feeling that eventually, the "Windows OS" is going to change from "pre-emptive multitasking kernel" to "real-time multitasking kernel" and the only way to do so is to align with a linux biggie, and start from the subsystem level first...and then work their way outwards...
[22:24] <Gallomimia> apple did it.
[22:25] <Gallomimia> Jobs was ceo of this other company that was trying to make this awesome GUI + API and had a pretty good thing going, he came back to apple, paired that with a BSD-esque kernel, and got a pretty solid system
[22:25] <Gallomimia> they manufactured a "transition" style backend for the app maker community, called Carbon
[22:25] <Gallomimia> that ran on both the old system and the new one
[22:25] <Gallomimia> and smoothed out all the wrinkles on the way.
[22:26] <Gallomimia> windows still hasn't done this. it's going to be a mess.
[22:26] <YankDownUnder> Apple was smart enough to realise that the "NeXT" ideology was perfect in that they could "rebuild" on a unix based OS, tailor it to their needs, etc etc etc - and ditch OS 9 - which was machine dependent - and voila - here we now have OSX - which can very happily run on nearly anything "intel" based...
[22:26] <Gallomimia> oh. OS9 was the transition OS
[22:26] <Gallomimia> they started when it was still OS8.5
[22:26] <erkan^> Do you mean that Canonical helps Microsoft for Windows 10 Insider - testgroup, tiox ?
[22:26] <YankDownUnder> I actually rather like OS9...
[22:27] <erkan^> 95 or 98, YankDownUnder ?
[22:27] <Gallomimia> i didn't :/
[22:27] <Gallomimia> i had a G4 that came with both os9 and 10.0 installed
[22:27] <tiox> erkan^: No, I mean, Microsoft reverse-engineers Bash, makes a version that's Microsoft-exclusive and keeps users locked into the Linux ecosystem. It's still Bash, but with special extras that "Aid Windows integration" or other BS like that.
[22:27] <Gallomimia> it didn't take me long to ditch 9 and stick with 10
[22:27] <Gallomimia> mostly because i was taking computer science on solaris, and we could SSH to the campus and run our code from home
[22:28] <YankDownUnder> It has been postulated for years that eventually, Microsoft will migrate their UI to a "unix based" underlying OS, re-write all of their "cash cow" software packages for such - and in the interim, move stuff to "the cloud" - and then quietly rebuild everything...
[22:28] <Gallomimia> tiox: i bet they introduce key stealing measures :P
[22:29] <YankDownUnder> SOLARIS...mmm...fun days on SPARC stations...
[22:29] <Gallomimia> yeah. sparc 4's and sparc 5's
[22:29] <YankDownUnder> Gallomimia, CDE is what kept me using XFCE for years...(I digress yet again)
[22:29] <Gallomimia> i think we had kde2
[22:29] <erkan^> I want to get of Ubuntu MATE: @ubuntu-mate.org :-P
[22:29] <Gallomimia> i honestly don't get most of what you're talking about :)
[22:29] <Gallomimia> never used any of those
[22:29] <tiox> Trust me, I want that future where Windows becomes a Linux OS, they ditch NTFS altogether and they put as much effort into WoL (Windows on Linux, hypothetical name) as they did in WoW (Windows on Windows) but I don't see it happening.
[22:30] <tiox> DirectX as an upstream project would tear down the final barrier between the two userbases and let all the gamers use Linux but it won't be seamless.
[22:30] <Gallomimia> tiox: i want them to just die, and stop hoarding all the talented programmers into doing things that put the brakes on the computing industry
[22:31] <YankDownUnder> tiox, As all of this transpires, I shall perform my business functions on OSX (it's stable and solid) - and do testing and utility work on linux (graphics, vbox, forensics)
[22:31] <Gallomimia> i actually see a problem with integrating given projects in together.
[22:31] <Gallomimia> like lets say they release directX as open source. and some smart folks merge it with the openGL project. get the best of both worlds
[22:32] <Gallomimia> now we have only one choice when it comes to a graphics library, package.... thing
[22:32] <Gallomimia> having only one choice is bad.
[22:32] <YankDownUnder> ...sometimes having too many choices for a given objective can be bad, too...
[22:32] <Gallomimia> what happens when we find a backdoor in it, or a nasty bug that's not fixable
[22:32] <Gallomimia> i agree YankDownUnder. i feel the magic number is 3
[22:33] <Gallomimia> more than that and you're spreading developer effort way too thin.
[22:33] <Gallomimia> it's already thin enough with just one.
[22:33] <Gallomimia> but with 3 you can have "the one you just hate" "the one you like but just found a security hole in" and "the alternative"
[22:34] <YankDownUnder> Who is to say that there isn't a backdoor already built into the linux kernel - or subsequent drivers?
[22:34] <Gallomimia> there'll be options to switch to in the interim between when an exploit gets published and the OSS community fixes it
[22:34] <YankDownUnder> Let alone all the hardware that is produced?
[22:34] <Gallomimia> YankDownUnder: they've found one. and they've published that the NSA offered them $10M to put one in
[22:35] <Gallomimia> code that was in the kernel repo that no dev checked in.
[22:35] <Gallomimia> so i feel that if there's any backdoors in the kernel, it wasn't put there by linus and his team
[22:36] <Gallomimia> anyway... i gotta go finish hooking up this light. back soon. good talk
[22:39] <YankDownUnder> Cheers
[22:40] <erkan^> Why isn't "xcalib" in Software Bouqitue?
[22:43] <YankDownUnder> xcalib?
[22:45] <tiox> Excalibur? (Sorry, ignore me, I am just noise.)
[22:46] <tiox> About the "Find a hole that cannot be fixed" thing, therein lies the problem with multiple projects; Different idea cannot be implemented easily together. ESPECIALLY VIDEO AND PHYSICS LIBRARIES
[22:49] <YankDownUnder> tiox, Ah. Right. Fair enough. Time to get back to cleaning things that shouldn't need cleaning... :)
[22:49] <tiox> Having one that is just "The standard" is what allows for moving forward in a group to improve the one thing, rather than reinventing the wheel.
[22:50] <tiox> Think if different systems used non-interchangeable versions of the Linux kernel? That would be catastrophic.
[22:51] <tiox> I mean, it can be that way depending on how the kernel is configured, to work on a specific system but if you couldn't replace it with your own that has more of the features you want? That would be bollocks, and an affront against open-source.
[22:52] <tiox> But it's still the same thing at the core.
[23:04] <nomic> z.z.z.
[23:14] <tiox> Aha, fixed my issues with the website... I think.
[23:14] <tiox> I cleared my cookies fro ubuntu-mate.community and the site loads now.
[23:14] <tiox> s/fro/for
[23:14] <Gallomimia> ah. light works :)
[23:15] <Gallomimia> moved it over, rewired.
[23:54] <Gallomimia> whewt! psensor finally shows me all my system's sensors. thank you ubuntu mate!
[23:54] <Gallomimia> or maybe it's just the updated kernel
[23:54] <Gallomimia> a lot of them are freakin' NAMED too
[23:54] <Gallomimia> <3
[23:58] <Gallomimia> temperatures on all 6 drives, named. 3 on the mobo, one on the cpu, not named but details given for location. and the gpu usage, fan speed, and temp. hot diggity damn!


[06:28] <DanaG> Who decided to change the GDM theme?
[06:28] <DanaG> Oh, and is there now a wiki page about it?
[06:28] <DanaG> And has the latest wallpaper been wiki'd?
[07:26] <DanaG> http://troy-sobotka.blogspot.com/2008/03/hardy-heron-wallpaper-fela-kuti-botch.html
[11:54] <afflux> morning. Is this the right place to ask why the murrine theme was removed?
[11:56] <kwwii> afflux: yes it is
[11:57] <kwwii> although first you might want to know that it is included in the default selection (just update your hardy system)
[11:58] <afflux> huh
[11:58] <afflux> I currently have no updates, but I have gnome-default theme (you know, the grey one) because I had human-murrine enabled and the ubuntu-artwork update took it away again
[11:59] <kwwii> there was an update today which has it again
[11:59] <afflux> ah, cool!
[12:00] <afflux> okay, that's all I wanted to know, thank you!
[12:00] <kwwii> np
[14:47] <_MMA_> kwwii: Did you try that make file script?
[14:47] <_MMA_> *makefile
[15:00] <kwwii> _MMA_: no because it us much more than just the one script
[15:00] <kwwii> I tried to run it and then I saw that there are lots of other files I needed to have
[15:00] <kwwii> lots= a few
[15:03] <_MMA_> Well you could always adapt it. Really does make things easy with large edits.
[15:07] <kwwii> yeah, I would like to include it eventually, but yesterday I just wanted to get the package done :p
[15:07] <kwwii> hehe, here is a good bug
[15:07] <kwwii> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/211740
[15:07] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 211740 in ubuntu-gdm-themes "Hardy: Ubuntu login screen art has brightnes increased" [Undecided,New]
[15:09] <_MMA_> Oh FFS.
[15:09] <_MMA_> kwwii: Oh.  I can't even laugh about it atm.
[15:12] <kwwii> the wierd thing is that it is not clear what the problem is
[15:14] <_MMA_> Well Im gonna remove the gtkrc from the GDM theme. That change should hit the next disk. If it doesnt clear up, it's *NOT* a themes gtkrc.
[15:14] <_MMA_> But we'll see.
[15:14] <kwwii> well, it could still be a problem with the one it gets from the desktop
[15:15] <kwwii> I think it is some wierd bug in gdm itself, not the theme
[15:15] <kwwii> what else have you changed in your theme since gutsy?
[15:16] <_MMA_> Its not the desktop one either because that's a constant between the other GNOME themes as they don't have gtkrc's ant the issue would pop there as well.
[15:16] <_MMA_> Not just with 1 or 2 themes.
[15:16] <_MMA_> kwwii: Everything but the gtkrc.
[15:17] <_MMA_> I'm really thinking its how GDM sets an alternative theme.
[15:17] <_MMA_> Some odd combination of issues.
[15:38] <DanaG> http://troy-sobotka.blogspot.com/2008/03/hardy-heron-wallpaper-fela-kuti-botch.html
[15:50] <kwwii> _MMA_: yeah, I thikn it does have something to do with the theme changing mechanism
[15:51] <kwwii> oh man
[15:51] <kwwii> troy_s: give me a break
[15:51] <kwwii> do you take negative pills?
[15:51] <kwwii> I won't even get into it
[15:51] <kwwii> wait a mounumental waste of time
[15:51] <_MMA_> Just got sand in his... Well.   It's a classic hack job.
[16:44] <kwwii> troy_s: you should/could have mentioned this critic to me early and things would have been worked on
[16:44] <kwwii> in fact, we can still change things although time is short
[16:45] <troy_s> kwwii: I uh... tried.
[16:45] <troy_s> kwwii: In fact, I believe I was quite vocal about it.
[16:45] <kwwii> troy_s: when did you talk to me? this is the first I have heard of it
[16:45] <troy_s> kwwii: As I was with the Gutsy choice.  I have always been straight up in those discussions.
[16:45] <kwwii> in fact, I talked to you about gdm
[16:46] <kwwii> I did not even know you had a blog until now
[16:46] <kwwii> btw. all I am talking about here is the wallpaper and hardy art
[16:47] <troy_s> kwwii:  Shuttleworth and GDM are what they are.    No one cares.    I have no idea how to say that any clearer _again_.    It would seem less 'lazy', but such is the nature of the last minute.)
[16:49] <kwwii> yes, and I agreed with you
[16:50] <troy_s> kwwii: I _do not_ know what to do.  I get email and try to listen to the new and fresh users.  That's all.
[16:50] <troy_s> kwwii: Unfortunately our little clique still believes it knows better.
[16:50] <kwwii> well, I do not log the channel so I cannot come up with anything I said....anyway
[16:51] <troy_s> kwwii: I was straight up.  I think it was an absolutely idiotic decision (as you can see from the log).
[16:51] <kwwii> I think that being positive and working towards a better future is the way to go, not just harshly criticizing the work of others without doing it directly to their face
[16:51] <troy_s> kwwii: The biggest stumbling point is this hey throw the shit against the wall, wait for the arcane meeting to take place on a whim, then poof -- it happens.
[16:51] <kwwii> and there will never be a case where everyone is totally happy
[16:52] <troy_s> kwwii: You should know that I have chanted not worrying about making everyone happy countless times.
[16:52] <troy_s> kwwii: That isn't the issue.
[16:52] <kwwii> yeah, well, maybe I just don't understand you and never will - that's life
[16:52] <troy_s> kwwii: And you also know that I don't backpeddle.  I was vocal on the choice of walls for Gutsy, and that is straight up.
[16:52] <DanaG> hmm, here's something interesting -- I stuck the Heron on top of one of HP's wallpapers:
[16:53] <DanaG> http://users.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/hp%20kuti%20heron%20tweaked.png
[16:53] <DanaG> There are scaling artifacts due to me downscaling the background.
[16:53] <DanaG> But I think that looks pretty snazzy.
[16:54] <DanaG> I do like the red on the head a bit better -- it looks like some real birds that have red crest feathers.
[16:54] <_MMA_> Wow. Nice and original. :P
[16:54] <kwwii> I think that troy_s version of the non-red neck is better as well
[16:55] <kwwii> DanaG: that HP background does not fit at all with the heron in my opinion
[16:55] <_MMA_> Not at all.
[16:55] <DanaG> You're right there.
[16:56] <DanaG> Oh yeah, another note:  in the recent changes to the gdm theme -- it went from looking pretty nice to looking washed out.  I joked:  "/me takes his notebook outside and watches the GDM theme get a sunburn"
[16:57] <kwwii> yeah, I will be reducing the whiteness quite a bit
[16:57] <DanaG> Cool.
[16:57] <DanaG> You could probably put it back where it was about 2 package versions ago.
[16:58] <troy_s> DanaG: Powers that be love the status quo.
[16:59] <DanaG> Dang, that's irritating -- when people above you make decisions you consider ugly.
[17:00] <_MMA_> Hahahaha. We all have bosses.
[17:01] <DanaG> Hmm, I just had an idea: take the current wallpaper, replace the heron with the better red-crested one, and make the background semitransparent so users can specify their own main colors for it.
[17:01] <DanaG> It'd have a clear area, with little accents.
[17:01] <troy_s> DanaG: Goal being?
[17:02] <troy_s> DanaG: Please tell me this isn't heading down the 'The problem is brown.' path.
[17:02] <DanaG> It'd let users choose their own background colors.
[17:02] <_MMA_> There's _nothing_ stopping _anyone_ from creating alternative themes for Ubuntu and gettin' them in.
[17:02] <DanaG> It's not brown, per se, but two things: the specific color used, and the contrast between the background and the accents.
[17:02] <kwwii> I bet the orange-yellow-red would look great on a bright teal to pink gradient!
[17:03] <kwwii> :p
[17:03] <DanaG> Eek!
[17:03] <thorwil> more green!
[17:04] <DanaG> I use a bright-orange theme, myself.
[17:04] <troy_s> DanaG: 1) Brown is _massively_ in vogue right now.  2) Brown in Ubuntu has almost always been sub-standard due to monochromaticism and a distinct lack of communication / motif / etc.  See OpenSUSE for an extreme example of the same tripe.
[17:05] <DanaG> I haven't seen {,Open}SuSE lately.  The last I used was 10.1 or 10.2.
[17:05] <DanaG> My mom had described the previous wallpaper (with the copied herons) as looking like "baby puke".
[17:05] <kwwii> I left SUSE after 10 :-)
[17:06] <DanaG> But the Gutsy wallpaper is a nicer shade of brown.
[17:06] <troy_s> DanaG: Go look.  Its monochromatic / green / and worse, suffers from a complete lack of audience and communication.
[17:06] <DanaG> Oh yeah, I remember.... I put 10.3 in a VM for about a day, then killed it.  It was quite bland.
[17:06] <DanaG> Everything up until then was far better.
[17:07] <troy_s> DanaG: Compare with Diana's most excellent work in F7.  The hot air balloons?
[17:08] <troy_s> DanaG: Yes.
[17:08] <DanaG> That gives me a mental image of the Cal Poly lab computers -- so much software missing.... like SANE backends for hte scanners they have there.
[17:08] <DanaG> But hot air balloons did give a nice theme.
[17:09] <DanaG> Oh yeah, I do actually use the Nodoka engine, but with a way different gtkrc and metacity:  http://users.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/screenshot-orange-nodoka.png
[17:10] <troy_s> nodoka works for me.  _MMA_ isn't Nodoka the engine that was causing Cimi fuss?
[17:10] <DanaG> Yeah.
[17:11] <DanaG> I think so.  You could probably (almost) recreate it with the svn Murrine, but I don't have the right .gtkrc for it.
[17:11] <_MMA_> Yeah. Kinda a unneeded fork.
[17:11] <DanaG> s/almost/almost?/
[17:12] <DanaG> The windeco is Tropic without the red button.
[17:14] <troy_s> Tropic!  Long live Viper.
[17:14] <kwwii> LOL
[17:14] <troy_s> Nodoka lessens the heavy outline affliction.  That wins for me.
[17:14] <troy_s> kwwii: AHA YOU REMEMBER.
[17:15] <kwwii> Viper actually told me that he liked some of the stuff I did
[17:15] <kwwii> at which point I got a bit worried
[17:15] <kwwii> :p
[17:15] <troy_s> The most serious blight in most of our FOSS stuff is something that Oxygen avoided last time I saw it -- that nasty 'usable' outline on every icon / interface element.
[17:16] <troy_s> kwwii: Now _that_ is some funny shit.
[17:16] <kwwii> hehe, you like something I did!
[17:16] <nothlit> i don't mind that tango let me uses dark themes, personally, that spec allows everybody to get an icon in and have it 'together'
[17:16] <kwwii> :p
[17:17] <nothlit> beyond that tons of icon artists do their own thing and recreate a huuge spectrum, so :)
[17:17]  * DanaG just had an idea to try the heron on the Tropic wallpaper.
[17:17] <DanaG> Though desaturated.
[17:17]  * kwwii gives DanaG permission
[17:17] <kwwii> and then runs out to get dinner
[17:17] <DanaG> Eeh, color is too different from the orange I now have.
[17:17] <_MMA_> DanaG: Why not try something from scratch?
[17:17] <troy_s> nothlit: But at which point are we going to stop worrying about the utopian pursuit of everything and everyone.  One of the strengths of our culture should be specificity.
[17:17] <thorwil> DanaG: desaturated? try adding an outline
[17:18] <_MMA_> hahahahhaah
[17:18] <andreasn> troy_s: why so much hate all the time?
[17:18] <DanaG> I mean I'd be desaturating the orange.
[17:18] <troy_s> DanaG: Honestly -- go play with some good palette tools first.  Once you have a scheme, adjust the tones accordingly via SVG.
[17:18] <andreasn> give me some love from time to time ;)
[17:18]  * andreasn goes back to work
[17:18] <nothlit> well, i imagine oxygen is quite 'in' atm, if we have enough artists beyond those with the project that have the capability, i'd say we're pretty set
[17:18] <DanaG> I'll have to try it some time, then.
[17:19] <troy_s> andreasn: Why is it that when one tries to actually discuss some of our aesthetic issues on point people start talking hate crimes?
[17:19] <nothlit> but really, creating your own look is most likely going to be a distro project rather than one of tango/oxygen style
[17:20] <andreasn> because I want hugs and free beer of course
[17:20] <thorwil> yes. oxygen uses too many colours for an "own look". but maybe running it through a green and an oarnge filter would make it suitable for suse and ubuntu
[17:20] <DanaG> Have you ever seen the red HP dv6700 series at Best Buy, with their color-matched wallpaper.
[17:20] <DanaG> s/[.]/?/
[17:20] <nothlit> i don't think any sort of group can speak for the 'entire' community
[17:21] <DanaG> It looks cool -- it creates coherence between the wallpaper and the laptop lid.
[17:21] <nothlit> no, but i didn't like that felakuti on hp at all
[17:21] <thorwil> the community is much like anonymous
[17:21] <DanaG> Eeh, now that you mention it, those two (bluegrey and heron) do clash.
[17:21] <troy_s> andreasn: You will easily get free beer from me when we meet in person.  Free beer has nothing to do with the debate.  Your beer will _not_ have an outline however.
[17:22] <andreasn> haha
[17:22] <troy_s> Woo -- look at this.  Chatter in #ubuntu artwork.  That is amazing.  Now we need coz_ to show up.
[17:22] <thorwil> troy_s: it will be brown-orangish, though
[17:22] <troy_s> thorwil: Maybe in a green bottle.
[17:22] <DanaG> Oh yeah, would the color of beer itself look good?
[17:23] <thorwil> DanaG: a beer background might make quite a number of people happy. with little bubbels and foam at top
[17:23] <DanaG> Heh, I just saw my new-message icon in the screenshot, and went to check for a new message... silly me.
[17:25] <_MMA_> troy_s: "Chatter" we obviously have in spades. It's getting people to work together and stick around that's the problem.
[17:26] <DanaG> Hmm, I wonder how this sort of thing would look in brown or orange:  http://www.flickr.com/photos/longzheng/1412301374/sizes/o/in/set-72157602082194372/
[17:26] <DanaG> Eeh.
[17:26] <_MMA_> DanaG: Do you have any original work?
[17:27] <DanaG> I haven't created anything myself, so far.  I've just experimented tweaking random stuff.
[17:27] <DanaG> I don't know what original thing I'd make.
[17:27] <nothlit> lol
[17:27] <nothlit> get out there and just do it :P
[17:27] <_MMA_> (tm)
[17:27] <troy_s> Speaking of which... nothlit how come the Fela Kuti first post to the wiki was regg'd under your handle?
[17:28] <nothlit> probably because lasse and i did some moving
[17:28] <troy_s> Ahh.
[17:28] <troy_s> That makes sense.
[17:29] <troy_s> nothlit: Are you going to the UDS?
[17:30] <nothlit> yes
[17:31] <troy_s> nothlit: Ahh good stuff!
[17:31] <nothlit> have to get a new laptop for it, apparently my folks need the laptop we've got and my tablet's screen is dead so
[17:33] <DanaG> Interesting thing: you can get desktop LCDs with built-in Wacom tablets.
[17:34] <nothlit> cintiqs have been around for like half a decade
[17:34] <nothlit> you can hack one together yourself as well
[17:34] <nothlit> theres instructions on the net and even youtube videos of it
[17:35] <nothlit> tbh, a regular nonscreened tablet is a lot more gestural, but for those with 14+ hour workdays i've read that it lightens fatigue
[17:36] <nothlit> it helps that its just so huge and its there though, always setup
[17:36] <nothlit> kk bbl
[18:31] <savvas> DanaG: something like this? ;)  http://img367.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brownishlw0.png
[18:32] <DanaG> That's kinda' interesting.
[18:32] <savvas> gimp's colourising rules hehe
[18:34] <DanaG> Hmm, it doesn't quite fit with my orange, though -- but then again, I've chosen an orange that perhaps nothing will "go with".
[18:35] <DanaG> It definitely reminds me of a beer bottle, or something, though -- with odd spiky things you wouldn't want in a real bottle.
[18:37]  * DanaG goes off to roam.
[18:37] <DanaG> I'll be back later.
[19:49] <nothlit> interesting, blender doesn't like to start windowed in compiz
[19:50] <_MMA_> nothlit: No. Always goes fullscreen here.
[19:51] <_MMA_> Kinda odd. Noticed it a while ago.
[19:51] <_MMA_> Personally I wouldn't use then both together anyway.
[19:51] <nothlit> if you disable the fullscreen legacy support in the workarounds, or use the -p option it will
[19:52] <nothlit> i wouldn't, but i was just trying to take a quick look through some old files, didn't bother/forgot