[18:25] <jdstrand> hi
[18:25] <jdstrand> sorry we are a bit late
[18:25] <tyhicks> hello
[18:25] <mdeslaur> \o
[18:25] <sarnold> hello
[18:25]  * sbeattie waves
[18:25] <jdstrand> #startmeeting
[18:25] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Jan 14 18:25:46 2013 UTC.  The chair is jdstrand. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[18:25] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[18:26] <jdstrand> The meeting agenda can be found at:
[18:26] <jdstrand> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Meeting
[18:26] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Announcements
[18:26] <jdstrand> Thanks to the following individuals who provided security for Ubuntu:
[18:27] <jdstrand> Stefan Bader (smb) provided debdiffs for oneiric-quantal for xen
[18:27] <jdstrand> Chad Miller (chad) for getting chromium-browser up to 23.0.1271.97 for lucid-quantal
[18:27] <jdstrand> Benjamin Drung (bdrung) provided an update for precise and quantal for vlc (LP: #1084054)
[18:27] <jdstrand> Christian Kuersteiner (ckuerste) provided a debdiff for precise for xymon (LP: #1092412)
[18:27] <jdstrand> Your work is very much appreciated and will keep Ubuntu users secure. Great job! :)
[18:27] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Weekly stand-up report
[18:27] <jdstrand> I'll go first
[18:27] <jdstrand> I'm on triage today
[18:28] <jdstrand> rather, this week
[18:29] <jdstrand> I planned to get nss out last week, but was unable. I need to do new upstream releases for nss and nspr for this update, and I spent last week preparing those
[18:29] <jdstrand> that should go out today or tomorrow
[18:29] <jdstrand> chromium-browser (as mentioned) is now at 23.0.1271.97 for the stable releases, but upstream releases 24 last week, so I'll be sponsoring/testing that as well
[18:30] <mdeslaur> ±o/
[18:30] <mdeslaur> argh
[18:30] <mdeslaur> \o/
[18:30] <jdstrand> I'm going to look at the recent java issue some more
[18:31] <jdstrand> and I need to patch pilot
[18:31] <jdstrand> mdeslaur: you're up
[18:31] <mdeslaur> I'm on community this week
[18:31] <mdeslaur> I've just released a couple of security updates, and will pick some more off the list
[18:32] <mdeslaur> and that's pretty much it. sbeattie, you're up
[18:32] <sbeattie> I'm again an apparmor monkey this week
[18:33] <sbeattie> My primary focus is on getting the display manager prototype going
[18:33] <sbeattie> I'm not sure where jjohansen is on getting the alpha out the door, but may pitch in to help on that after getting 2.8.1 out last week.
[18:34] <sbeattie> I'll also poke at the random things that have popped up on the list.
[18:34] <sbeattie> that's it for me. tyhicks?
[18:34] <tyhicks> Similar to last week. Embargoed item and apparmor policy kernel interface.
[18:34] <tyhicks> That's it for me. Back to you, jdstrand
[18:35] <jdstrand> actually, we skipped sarnold
[18:35] <jdstrand> sarnold: you're up
[18:35] <mdeslaur> who's sarnold?
[18:35] <tyhicks> sorry, sarnold :)
[18:35] <mdeslaur> :)
[18:35] <sarnold> I'm in happy place this week, hoping to make forward progress on dnsmasq update, now using mdeslaur's suggestion for VM with two NICs, will combine with jdstrand's suggestion to use two VMs rather than do the testing via my host...
[18:36] <sarnold> .. but if I have more trouble reproducing the reporter's situation, I'll be leaning towards just regression testing.
[18:37] <mdeslaur> sarnold: sounds reasonable
[18:37] <sarnold> (I'm thinking end-of-the-day today as the decision point...)
[18:37] <sarnold> jdstrand: back to you
[18:38] <mdeslaur> sarnold: you can get one of us to review your changes too, as a sanity check/second opinion since it affects an important package
[18:38] <sarnold> mdeslaur: thanks :)
[18:38] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Highlighted packages
[18:38] <jdstrand> The Ubuntu Security team will highlight some community-supported packages that might be good candidates for updating and or triaging. If you would like to help Ubuntu and not sure where to start, this is a great way to do so.
[18:38] <jdstrand> See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures for details and if you have any questions, feel free to ask in #ubuntu-security. To find out other ways of helping out, please see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/GettingInvolved.
[18:39] <jdstrand> Normally we provide a list of 5 packages. However, this week I'd like to ask for help on updating the recent raills vulnerabilities:
[18:39] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2013/CVE-2013-0156.html
[18:39] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2013/CVE-2013-0155.html
[18:40] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Miscellaneous and Questions
[18:40] <jdstrand> Does anyone have any other questions or items to discuss?
[18:43] <jdstrand> mdeslaur, sbeattie, tyhicks, sarnold: thanks!
[18:43] <jdstrand> #endmeeting
[18:43] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Jan 14 18:43:36 2013 UTC.
[18:43] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-14-18.25.moin.txt
[18:43] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-14-18.25.html
[18:43] <sarnold> thanks jdstrand :)
[18:43] <mdeslaur> thanks jdstrand!
[18:43] <tyhicks> thanks!
[18:43] <sbeattie> thanks jdstrand


[00:43] <bryceh> RAOF, I'm going through the queue of bugs that have been nominated for lucid and assigning them out to people, so I'm going to assign a few -intel bugs to you
[00:44] <RAOF> Sounds good to me.
[00:44] <bryceh> RAOF, but the way we handle these at this stage in the release is that they need *reviewed* more than fixed
[00:44] <bryceh> look at them and decide if they look doable and worthwhile to fix for lucid - if not, unassign yourself and mark them 'ct-rev'
[00:44] <bryceh> if they do look important, forward them upstream (or find a patch to fix them)
[00:45] <RAOF> :)
[00:45] <bryceh> keep in mind we can also fix some post-release via SRUs
[00:45] <bryceh> ones that are going to affect people from booting the livecd will be higher priority since sru's won't be of help there
[00:45] <RAOF> I can track those by milestoning them to lucid-updates, right?
[00:47] <bryceh> I think so, yes
[00:48] <bryceh> haha, looks like when there is a nomination proposed for karmic, if no one declined or accepted it, launchpad makes a new nomination proposal for lucid even if no one actually asked for it
[00:48] <bryceh> this explains why I'm having to decline like 80% of the nominations :-)
[00:49] <RAOF> :)
[01:47] <jg> bryceh: I tried installing lucid beta 1 on this dell latitude xt I have, and X doesn't start...  Any chance in beta 2?
[01:48] <RAOF> What video does the dell have?
[01:48] <jg> it's a ATI Radeon Xpress 1250, I believe.
[01:53] <jg> RAOF: worked ok in koala...
[01:54] <RAOF> Hm.  I'm not aware of any particular problems with that chip.
[01:54] <RAOF> It's difficult to say anything without logs; Xorg.0.log & dmesg are the favourites.
[01:56] <jg> RAOF: if I can get to the logs....
[01:56] <RAOF> Always the problem! :)
[01:56] <jg> particularly with a fresh installation....
[01:57] <jg> and as I had to start over since the upgrade had gone sour from a dying disk...
[01:57] <RAOF> :(
[01:57] <bryceh> jg, new thing for ati this release is we're doing KMS by default
[01:57] <RAOF> You can always try adding radeon.modeset=0 to the kernel boot line.
[01:57] <bryceh> jg, so you could try going ... yeah what RAOF said :-)
[01:58] <jg> bryceh, RAOF: I'll try that in the morning.
[02:37] <johanbr> isn't Xpress 1250 closely related to Xpress 200M?
[02:38] <johanbr> you may also want to try "pci=nomsi" as a kernel parameter
[02:39] <johanbr> see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/509273
[02:42] <bryceh> johanbr, yeah you might be right
[03:08] <Sarvatt> jg: thats a rough one because it has a super rare GPU, i dont think it's working at the moment
[03:09] <Sarvatt> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati?field.searchtext=rs600
[03:11] <Sarvatt> jg: http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=25408
[03:33] <jg> Sarvatt, ubottu: certainly seems the same bug
[03:35] <jg> Sarvatt, ubottu: should I add a "mee tooo" to the bug?
[03:54]  * Sarvatt wants a fdo-bug command
[03:59] <bjsnider> is the latest nvidia-settings package going to be added or is it going to be the one in the archive now?
[04:09] <superm1> bjsnider, what changed between the two?  new features, or just bug fixes?
[04:12] <Sarvatt> bjsnider: nvidia-settings 195.36.08 IS 195.36.15
[04:14] <RAOF> Sarvatt: That IOMMU bug doesn't affect me; either with VT on or VT off.  It's possible that it doesn't affect the x200s BIOS', or that I've got a new (or old) enough BIOS to be unaffected.  Or, it's fixed in 2.6.33, but that doesn't seem right.
[04:14] <Sarvatt> RAOF: we dont have DMAR enabled
[04:14] <Sarvatt> i was off
[04:14] <RAOF> Ah, ok.  Cool, false alarm.
[04:18] <Sarvatt> programmable EC = I think I found my next laptop :)
[04:19] <RAOF> EC+
[04:19] <RAOF> EC?
[04:30] <Sarvatt> wow, first time i've seen a bios *that* crappy
[04:31] <Sarvatt> dug up an old dell vostro 200 out of storage and apparently you can't boot syslinux based stuff on it
[04:32] <RAOF> Ah, intel-agp.  The gift that keeps on racing.
[05:08] <bryceh> does lp #546871 look like a DMAR bug?
[05:09] <bryceh> maybe not
[05:10] <RAOF> There doesn't seem to be any DMAR messages in dmesg, and that doesn't seem to be the symptom (which seems to be a freeze soon after starting X)
[05:13] <bryceh> hmm, well I'm not seeing any LP bugs that match up with the DMAR bug
[05:13] <bryceh> maybe there's something filed against the kernel
[05:15] <RAOF> Sarvatt says we don't actually have DMAR enabled.
[05:22] <bryceh> RAOF, aha
[05:23]  * bryceh un-gtg's a todo :-)
[05:25] <RAOF> Damnit, apple.  What have you done to the macbook such that a perfectly acceptable G96 doesn't boot right?
[06:56]  * bryceh waves to ara
[06:56] <ara> morning bryceh :)
[07:33] <ricotz> Sarvatt, hello, you need to trigger a xserver rebuild in order to get it built against the new x11proto packages
[08:36] <bryceh> Sarvatt, RAOF:  http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Graphs/drivers.svg
[09:34] <hceylan> Hello I am trying the packages from ppa:xorg-edgers I upgraded the packages and installed nouveau-back-ports but I get "KMS not enabled" any ideas
[09:34] <hceylan> My main objective is to test nouveau+galliğum3D
[09:49] <RAOF> hceylan: What Ubuntu version are you using?  I think that xorg-edgers is very much tailored to lucid right now.
[09:52] <bryceh> good god -intel is a buggy driver
[09:52] <hceylan> lucid
[09:54] <Ng> bryceh: it's a shame it's not maintained by the creators of the chipset so they can make it really good ;)
[09:55] <bryceh> Ng, *sigh*
[09:56] <RAOF> hceylan: There's all sorts of problems that could be.  Can you pastebin dmesg & Xorg.0.log?
[09:56] <bryceh> Ng, I spent the past month focusing on -ati and have gotten spoiled
[09:56] <Ng> bryceh: oh? is their stuff good now?
[09:57] <bryceh> Ng, well, they seem to be much more sane in how they handle bugs
[09:57] <hceylan> RAOF: gotta go for a meeting I'll be back later. thx
[09:59] <bryceh> Ng, btw how's your -intel experience been lately?
[10:01] <Ng> bryceh: apart from the weird flashing bug going round gm45 people, pretty much solid :)
[10:01] <bryceh> well that's good
[10:01] <bryceh> Ng, have a lp# on the flashing bug?
[10:02] <Ng> bryceh: bug #538648
[10:02] <bryceh> ok
[10:03] <Ng> it was happening a lot last night so I rebooted with the i915.powersave=0 suggestion, but I'll need to run it for a few days to be able to say whether it's made any difference. Some days I don't get it at all, some days it happens most minutes
[10:03] <Ng> but never when I have my second monitor attached at work, otherwise I'd be smashing my laptop against a rock ;)
[10:04] <bryceh> :-/
[10:04] <seb128> intel works fine there as long as you don't play with a dock station
[10:04] <seb128> if you start docking and undocking a laptop things just break
[10:05] <seb128> displays don't activate when they should, xorg crashes, etc
[10:08] <Ng> interesting
[10:09] <Ng> I wonder how docking differs from just plugging in a monitor
[10:09] <Ng> I hook up a monitor to DisplayPort via a DVI adapter every day and poke Fn-F7 and it's been very reliable
[10:09] <seb128> well I tend to close the lid while docked
[10:09] <seb128> suspend and take the laptop
[10:09] <seb128> and open it later somewhere else
[10:10] <bryceh> seb128, is it messing up gnome-display-properties, or X in general ?
[10:10] <seb128> which leads to have the laptop screen still off
[10:10] <seb128> bryceh, in the scenario I describe I've no active screen
[10:10] <seb128> so I need to switch vt to get one
[10:11] <seb128> also user switch when docked = fail
[10:11] <seb128> it turns off the external screen
[10:11] <seb128> and I've no way to reactivate it
[10:11] <seb128> I though for a while that the box was crashing
[10:11] <seb128> until I opened the lid of the docked laptop to notice the laptop screen works
[10:11] <Ng> seb128: ah right, I'm quite cautious about doing things while it's suspended, so I unplug everything, poke Fn-F7 and then close the lid :/
[10:11] <Ng> I'll try suspending first :)
[10:12] <seb128> fn-n7 doesn't success to activate the external screen again after user switch
[10:12] <bryceh> good god -intel is a buggy driver
[10:12] <seb128> I need to restart xorg to have it working again
[10:12] <bryceh> http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Graphs/drivers.svg
[10:13] <seb128> urg
[10:13] <seb128> nice drop in the ati count
[10:14] <bryceh> it's at least going in the right direction
[10:14] <seb128> right
[10:14] <seb128> I'm wondering if intel is that buggy
[10:14] <seb128> or if there is just a lot of bug noise or users running into the same issues there
[10:14] <tjaalton> yeah it could be the same bugs all over again
[10:15] <bryceh> maybe
[10:15] <bryceh> we do pretty good triaging on -intel though...
[10:15] <tjaalton> true
[10:15] <bryceh> I could buy that on -nvidia which we largely ignore
[10:16] <seb128> I'm not so sure what videocard I should look at in my next laptop now
[10:16] <bryceh> seb128, I recommend not getting a video card
[10:16] <tjaalton> hehe
[10:16] <seb128> lol
[10:16] <tjaalton> headless laptops ftw
[10:16] <bryceh> seb128, seriously, they make your laptop unstable
[10:17] <tjaalton> a braille "display" for your thumb
[10:17] <tjaalton> and then just type away ;)
[10:17] <seb128> let's get a good old serial vt
[10:18] <bryceh> 965 seems to be ok
[10:18] <bryceh> ati 5xx is ok but you can't find those on laptops
[10:19] <seb128> 965 is what I have now
[10:19] <seb128> which I'm fairly happy with out of docking issues ;-)
[10:20] <bryceh> at least with intel they put out fixes fairly routinely, so even if it's broken now, it'll improve next go around
[10:20] <tjaalton> yeah mine works as well, but I don't use another displays
[10:20] <bryceh> of course, the go-around after that all bets are off
[10:20] <tjaalton> -an
[10:20] <bryceh> ati gets better over time
[10:21] <tjaalton> my next laptop will be a lenovo again, so it's likely with intel gfx. the desktop will get ati next
[10:22] <bryceh> ati seems to have performance and corruption issues, but less of the crash/freeze issues
[10:22] <bryceh> intel is the opposite
[10:22] <bryceh> nvidia is just mad
[10:24] <tseliot> heh
[10:26] <bryceh> at least with -nvidia you're in good company
[10:26] <bryceh> and if you don't like being in good company you have the option of -nouveau
[10:28]  * tseliot nods
[10:31] <bryceh> heya tseliot
[10:31] <tseliot> hey bryceh
[10:32] <bryceh> tseliot, btw I've assigned a few bugs to you but don't feel they all need to be solved... just review and decide if they really need attention for lucid; if not, tag them 'ct-rev' and unsub from them.
[10:32] <bryceh> (and if they're kernel issues, please reassign to 'linux')
[10:34] <tseliot> bryceh: that's fine. I think I can bug upstream about some of those bugs and fix the issues if they are in the packaging
[10:34] <bryceh> cool
[10:36] <bryceh> http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-lucid-workqueue.svg
[10:36] <bryceh> good news is we're continuing our downward trend
[10:37] <sebner> tseliot: is there still a nvidia update planned? (You know, I once told you that my performance dropped with the driver upload before the last one)
[10:37] <bryceh> ^ the above graph excludes bugs sent upstream or waiting on users (Incomplete without response).
[10:38] <tseliot> sebner: only minor packaging fixes will get in, unless Nvidia releases something that fixes other bugs
[10:38] <sebner> tseliot: grrrrm kthx
[10:39] <tseliot> sorry but I doesn't depend on me
[10:40] <sebner> tseliot: heh, sure. I'm definately not angry with you but nvidia ;)
[10:44] <bryceh> night
[10:48] <tseliot> good night bryceh
[10:49] <tjaalton> night bryceh
[10:49] <tjaalton> ok, waltop wacom hotplug works, now to merge the kernel driver
[13:28] <apw> anyone know if it is possible to reneble a DRM output which is forced off in a video=foo:d specifier?  from X as it were?
[13:29] <tjaalton> xrandr --auto?
[13:31] <apw> tjaalton, doesn't seem to do anything no
[13:31] <apw> trying to work out just how to handle the booting with screen closed mess
[13:31] <apw> and trying out the video= to try and fix it
[13:33] <tjaalton> hmm ok, maybe xrandr can't help if it's forced off from the cmdline
[13:33] <tjaalton> which probably means the driver can't see it at all
[13:34] <apw> tjaalton, its listed as disconnected
[13:34] <apw> but i don't seem to be able to undo that
[13:34] <apw> which is a shame
[13:35] <tjaalton> ah, ok
[13:57] <bjsnider> tseliot, are you planning on updating nvidia-settings to the latest tarball?
[13:58] <tseliot> bjsnider: I uploaded a fix so that it can work with legacy drivers (no more issues with the lack of the noscanout property). Do you know if there's anything useful in the new release?
[13:59] <bjsnider> i don't know that, but i asked because i have it in the ppa, and users who are upgrading are keeping it because i guess apt is choosing it over the lucid package
[14:00] <bjsnider> i have to add conflicts: screen-resolution-extra (>= 0.13) or whatever to force it out i suppose
[14:01] <bjsnider> it didn't occur to me that apt would keep karmic packages during a distro upgrade
[14:02] <bjsnider> it's possible that someone upgrading from hardy to lucid would still have hardy packages afterwards
[14:03] <bjsnider> !info screen-resolution-extra lucid
[14:07] <tseliot> yes, well if the version in your ppa is greater than the one in lucid, that's expected
[14:29] <jg> bryceh, RAOF: booting the live cd nokms works.
[15:45] <Sarvatt> seb128: funny enough problems like you describe are usually fixed by bios updates, might be worth looking into
[15:47] <seb128> Sarvatt, oh, thank you
[15:48] <Sarvatt> I just looked up pitti's D430 after seeing he was 10 updates behind and they fixed a similar issue on his
[15:49] <Sarvatt> seb128: what model is it?
[15:51] <seb128> Sarvatt, the laptop? dell d630
[15:59] <Sarvatt> seb128: what bios version are at? it's up to A17 now, I bet you're at A00 too :D looks like all the same upgrades from pitti's d430 are also on this d630, hangs on resume, crashing opening and closing the lid too fast, bios A12 updated the video bios too
[15:59] <Sarvatt> dell site is taking way too long to go through every changelog, i just looked at the latest 5 updates
[16:00] <seb128> Sarvatt, dunno, how do I know the version?
[16:00] <Sarvatt> sudo dmidecode -t bios
[16:00] <seb128> out of looking at the screen on boot
[16:00] <seb128> I never touched the bios in 3 years
[16:00] <seb128> so I bet it's outdated :p
[16:01] <seb128> 	Version: A03
[16:01] <Sarvatt> i mean i only looked between A12 and A17 versions and I saw a ton of major fixes
[16:02] <seb128> I need to look at how you update a bios from linux
[16:02] <seb128> I didn't update bios since I stopped having a dos floppy to do that :p
[16:05] <Sarvatt> yeah same thing here, i just made a freedos boot usb with unetbootin and put the update on it last time though
[16:05] <Sarvatt> i think dell has a bunch of ways to update it in linux
[16:05] <seb128> thanks for the hint
[16:06] <seb128> I will look into trying that
[16:07] <Sarvatt> hmm the firmware-addon-dell package it looks like?
[16:07] <seb128> indeed
[16:08] <Sarvatt> looks like a pain in the butt to set up, freedos boot usb probably much easier :D
[19:30] <apw> bryceh, about?
[19:32] <bryceh> hi apw
[19:33] <apw> bryceh, any idea how to test this multitouch stuff ?
[19:34] <bryceh> apw, heh was gonna ask you the same thing
[19:34] <bryceh> apw, I've got your kernel and my bits on the laptop, and played with gimp a bit
[19:34] <bryceh> doesn't crash, and the finger touches work now (they didn't before)
[19:34] <bryceh> but only for moving the cursor, not for clicking.
[19:35] <bryceh> apw, was hoping the qa team could sketch out a testing process for us
[19:35] <bryceh> apw, know of any tools which will just print out that it received the MT data?
[19:36] <apw> bryceh, mine works ok but only single touch
[19:37] <apw> i am told evtest is the toy, but i can't udnerstand the output
[19:37] <apw> bryceh, i also thought multitouchd was the magic for testing, but i can't make it work
[19:40] <bryceh> no, they decided against using multitouchd, so don't waste time with that
[19:43] <apw> bryceh, any idea where rafi is?  looking to find out if i need newer firmware
[19:44] <bryceh> apw, haven't seen him on irc for a long while
[19:44] <bryceh> probably reachable via email though
[19:45] <bryceh> just tried evtest, but can't seem to get output out of it when touching screen.  Do I need to make something stop grabbing the events?
[19:50] <bryceh> apw, looks like rafi has a test tool
[19:54] <apw> bryceh, ok i can use evtest to get multitouch data
[19:54] <apw> on mine i have three event channels
[19:54] <bryceh> apw, ok how are you running it?
[19:54] <apw> the one which calls it Multitouch
[19:55] <apw> evtest /dev/input/event13
[19:55] <apw> in my case
[19:56] <bryceh> when I run xinput list I see two 'N-Trig Touchscreen' entries, id=13 and id=14
[19:57] <apw> No i have 3
[19:57] <apw>    name    : "N-Trig Pen"
[19:57] <apw>    name    : "N-Trig MultiTouch"
[19:57] <apw>    name    : "N-Trig Touchscreen"
[19:57] <apw> and its the middle one of those i am using
[19:57] <bryceh> when I run evtest /dev/input/event13 and 14 from within X, and touch the screen, I see nothing printed out
[19:57] <apw> this is all with stock kernel now, as the stuff has gone into lucid
[19:57] <apw> hrm
[19:58] <apw> running as root yes?
[19:58] <bryceh> ok I have two Pens, two erasers, and two touchscreens
[19:58] <apw> hmmm
[19:58] <bryceh> also a generic mouse and a mac mouse button emulation
[19:58] <apw> one pen :)
[19:58] <bryceh> hrm
[19:58] <apw> you do have a different machine of course
[19:58] <bryceh> this is with the kernel in the ppa, not stock lucid
[19:58] <apw> which device id is it?  vendor/product ?
[19:59] <bryceh> I've got the -19 kernel installed, I could boot over to it
[19:59] <apw> that would be the one i am testing on
[19:59] <bryceh> Dell XT2
[20:00] <apw> sorry i mean what vendor/product does lsinputs list for the touchscreen ones?
[20:00] <bryceh> are you running evtest from under X, or from the console?
[20:00] <apw>    vendor  : 0x1b96
[20:00] <apw>    product : 0x1
[20:00] <apw>
[20:00] <apw> running sudo evtest ... under an xterm
[20:01] <bryceh> for event13, vendor/product is 0x111d/0x76b2
[20:01] <apw> so thats not an n-trig then
[20:01] <apw> ?
[20:01] <bryceh> it should be
[20:02] <apw> hrm ... 0x111d is something else
[20:02] <bryceh> wait, looks like id's for xinput != id's for lsinput
[20:02] <bryceh> how fun
[20:03] <bryyce> here we go
[20:03] <bryyce> /dev/input/event7
[20:03] <bryyce>    bustype : BUS_USB
[20:03] <bryyce>    vendor  : 0x1b96
[20:03] <bryyce>    product : 0x1
[20:03] <bryyce>    version : 272
[20:03] <bryyce>    name    : "N-Trig Touchscreen"
[20:03] <bryyce>    phys    : "usb-0000:00:1d.1-2/input0"
[20:03] <bryyce>    uniq    : ""
[20:03] <bryyce>    bits ev : EV_SYN EV_KEY EV_ABS EV_MSC
[20:03] <bryyce> that looks better
[20:03] <apw> thats n-trig at least
[20:03] <apw> so next why don't you have a multi-touch like i do ...
[20:03] <apw> i guess next i'd say get into -19 so we're sure its the same kernel
[20:04] <apw> but i suspect that won't help at all
[20:05] <bryceh> ok one sec
[20:05] <apw> bryceh, ok my 'Touchscreen' event channel does not seem to produce any events
[20:06] <apw> i only get pen events from pen ovviously, and only get finger events on Multitouch
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎡ Virtual core pointer                    	id=2	[master pointer  (3)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ Virtual core XTEST pointer              	id=4	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ N-Trig Pen eraser                       	id=11	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ N-Trig Pen                              	id=12	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ N-Trig Touchscreen                      	id=13	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ N-Trig Touchscreen                      	id=14	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ N-Trig Pen eraser                       	id=15	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ N-Trig Pen                              	id=16	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ PS/2 Generic Mouse                      	id=18	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> ⎜   ↳ Macintosh mouse button emulation        	id=19	[slave  pointer  (2)]
[20:07] <bryyce> Linux tytherleigh 2.6.32-19-generic #28-Ubuntu SMP Wed Mar 31 17:46:20 UTC 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
[20:08] <apw> bryyce, what printed that output?
[20:08] <bryyce> apw, xinput list
[20:08] <bryyce> dev/input/event7
[20:08] <bryyce>    bustype : BUS_USB
[20:08] <bryyce>    vendor  : 0x1b96
[20:08] <bryyce>    product : 0x1
[20:08] <bryyce>    version : 272
[20:08] <bryyce>    name    : "N-Trig Pen"
[20:08] <bryyce>    phys    : "usb-0000:00:1d.1-2/input0"
[20:08] <bryyce>    uniq    : ""
[20:09] <bryyce>    bits ev : EV_SYN EV_KEY EV_ABS EV_MSC
[20:09] <bryyce> /dev/input/event8
[20:09] <bryyce>    bustype : BUS_USB
[20:09] <bryyce>    vendor  : 0x1b96
[20:09] <bryyce>    product : 0x1
[20:09] <bryyce>    version : 272
[20:09] <bryyce>    name    : "N-Trig Touchscreen"
[20:09] <bryyce>    phys    : "usb-0000:00:1d.1-2/input0"
[20:09] <bryyce>    uniq    : ""
[20:09] <bryyce>    bits ev : EV_SYN EV_KEY EV_ABS EV_MSC
[20:09] <bryyce> +1 pen, +1 touchscreen
[20:09] <bryyce> still not seeing any multitouch
[20:09] <apw> bryyce, ok so i have a third one
[20:09] <bryyce> hrm
[20:10] <bryyce> bryce@tytherleigh:~$ dmesg | grep -i trig
[20:10] <bryyce> [    2.720204] ntrig 0003:1B96:0001.0001: input,hiddev96,hidraw1: USB HID v1.10 Device [HID 1b96:0001] on usb-0000:00:1d.1-2/input0
[20:10] <bryyce> [    2.727766] ntrig 0003:1B96:0001.0002: input,hiddev97,hidraw2: USB HID v1.10 Device [HID 1b96:0001] on usb-0000:00:1d.1-2/input1
[20:10] <apw> you may have an old firmware
[20:10] <bryyce> apw, have you updated your firmware?
[20:11] <apw> bryyce, nope ... i don't know how
[20:11] <bryyce> heh
[20:15] <bryceh> apw, I'm sure it's something like, "First just boot into Windows 7, then..."
[20:15] <apw> bryceh, i've not booted windows on mine if that helps
[20:15] <apw> but i do think you have to have the latest firmware to get multitouch
[20:16] <apw> so i wouldn't be supprised if its not up to date in there
[20:16] <apw> no idea how one changes it of course
[20:16] <apw> mine is demonstrating two finger tracking, no more than two, and no finger identifiers
[20:16] <bryceh> ok, ...navigating a maze of twisty dell web pages...
[20:16] <apw> but hey ... its doing something
[20:18] <bryceh> ok dunno, but lunchtime.  bbiab
[22:49] <Sarvatt> sheesh, rediculious how many flickering bugs i've googled the laptop name + flicker and seen its a general issue with the model
[22:50] <Sarvatt> like http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=Dell+Inspiron+1545+flicker
[23:35] <Sarvatt> RAOF: what bios version do you have on your x200s?
[23:35] <RAOF> Sarvatt: Let me fire it up.
[23:35] <Sarvatt> 3 bugs now from people with x200s's that need i915.powersave=0
[23:36] <Sarvatt> one on a T500 too
[23:40] <Sarvatt> RAOF: is it really an x200s? not an x201s or anything?
[23:40] <RAOF> Ok.  You seem to have triggered a bug on my x200s - it's not coming out of suspend at all.
[23:40] <RAOF> Really an x200s.
[23:41] <RAOF> Says so right under the screen.
[23:41] <Sarvatt> whats the last 4 digits of the model underneath?
[23:41] <Sarvatt> like x200s 7401 or something
[23:41] <RAOF> 7465CTO
[23:43] <Sarvatt> sheesh they give you bios update cd's and everything
[23:43] <RAOF> Bios revision 2.8
[23:43] <RAOF> Well, a BIOS update CD isn't really that useful on an x200
[23:43] <Sarvatt> sure it is, usb image creator :D
[23:44] <RAOF> Good point.  Is there a newer bios for me there? :)
[23:44] <Sarvatt> LOTS
[23:44] <Sarvatt> with nice fixes :D
[23:51] <Sarvatt> - Fixed an issue where the computer might hang when the battery was low  - Improved the speed control of cooling fan. - Fixed an issue where VT (Intel virtualization Technology) setting was not changed at the first startup - Fixed an issue where some DVI monitors did not work. - Fixed an issue where 1-3-3-1 beeps might sound at boot or take time to resume normal operation from standby mode. - Fixed an issue that set wrong memory type.
[23:53] <bryceh> Sarvatt, has the bios update confirmed to fix the problems?
[23:53] <bryceh> (my experience has been that bios updates *sound* like they will fix whatever issue I have, but hardly ever actually *do*)
[23:53] <Sarvatt> no i was just asking what he had since he has the same system and doesnt see the problems
[23:54] <bryceh> ahh
[23:54] <Sarvatt> not too much else to go on :D
[23:56] <Sarvatt> RAOF: do you have a dual channel memory setup in that machine? it's a CTO so cant compare
[23:57] <RAOF> Yeah; I've got two dimms in here.


[00:28] <DarkTrick> EviLEd, you CAN set a custom format
[00:29] <DarkTrick> oh, where do you want to change the time format? on what display?
[00:33] <EviLEd> i only have 1 display
[00:33] <EviLEd> i want to change it from the command line
[00:34] <EviLEd> i have a custom format set now. but after a fresh install i want to set it via command line
[00:36] <EviLEd> bbl
[00:39] <EviLEd> maybe the easier question is changing the date from the command line.  so it looks likie Month Day, Time (AM/PM).
[00:40] <EviLEd> like date -s "string"
[00:41] <DarkTrick> where is the date/ time displayed?
[00:41] <DarkTrick> inside the command line?
[00:41] <DarkTrick> or are we talking about the clock inside the tasklist?
[00:41] <DarkTrick> aka Panel
[01:05] <DarkTrick> [
[01:05] <DarkTrick> @EviLed ^
[01:40] <EviLEd> the clock in the taskbar. how do you set the date from the command line?
[07:11] <friendlyGoat> howdy!
[07:11] <friendlyGoat> i have a question that i cant seem to find an answer to anywhere else and was hoping i could find help here
[07:11] <friendlyGoat> im trying to find out how to set an animated gif as my screensaver? i have xscreensaver if thats any help
[07:14] <well_laid_lawn> you have to have a screensaver app that supports that
[07:15] <friendlyGoat> do you have any off hand?
[07:17] <well_laid_lawn> I don't use any screensavers but I'll have a web search :)
[07:17] <friendlyGoat> alright thanks!
[07:20] <diogenes_> friendlyGoat, theoretically you could do it with xwinwrap and gifsicle but it would need a good dose of trickery
[07:21] <well_laid_lawn> have a look at   man screensaver
[07:24] <friendlyGoat> whats man screensaver?
[07:24] <friendlyGoat> also i'll look into xwinwrap
[07:28] <well_laid_lawn> in a terminal type  man xscreensaver   and have a read. It shows having a gif running can happen but it isn't easy
[17:00] <xubuntu57w> Hello World! Could someone check please how much space left after installing Xubuntu 18.04?
[17:02] <gnrp> xubuntu57w: The amount of space left depends on your partition size ;)
[17:03] <xubuntu57w> I did upgrade from 14.04 and it took 21.5 GB. It's too much in my opinion. Before upgrade it was 12 GB.
[17:03] <gnrp> you find the space requirements here: https://xubuntu.org/requirements/
[17:03] <gnrp> did you auto-remove packages already?
[17:03] <xubuntu57w> One sec let me check.
[17:03] <gnrp> `sudo apt-get auto-remove` on the terminal
[17:04] <gnrp> and then, when you already used the system before, I guess you very likely have some software installed which takes up space?
[17:05] <xubuntu57w> Yes with auto-remove.
[17:07] <xubuntu57w> 12.77 GB was before upgrade and 19,2 GB right now - after upgrade.
[17:07] <xubuntu57w> Where is 6,43 GB?
[17:08] <gnrp> Some packages simply grow bigger over time.
[17:08] <gnrp> but you can try this: `dpkg-query -W --showformat='${Installed-Size;10}\t${Package}\n' | sort -nk1 | less`
[17:08] <gnrp> (from here: https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=599424)
[17:08] <gnrp> this will show you which packages take up how much space
[17:09] <gnrp> .oO(omg, I have like 8GB of cuda stuff installed)
[17:12] <gnrp> oh, and did you check if there are maybe old kernels left? I had this bug sometimes with 14.04 systems
[17:12] <xubuntu57w> Will check kernels now.
[17:13] <xubuntu57w> No only two one in use and one as backup.
[17:14] <xubuntu57w> Maybe 6,43 GB is fine then.
[17:14] <gnrp> did you check what the big packages are?
[17:15] <xubuntu57w> This: `dpkg-query -W --showformat='${Installed-Size;10}\t${Package}\n' | sort -nk1 | less` is not showning sizes,
[17:15] <xubuntu57w> Only list of all packages.
[20:42] <SeTunTun> hello, I installed xubuntu 18.04. Everytime I boot bluetooth is on. Is there any way to boot up with the bluetooth adaptor off?
[21:01] <Spass> hello SeTunTun, I would try changing to AutoEnable=false in /etc/bluetooth/main.conf
[21:01] <Spass> but maybe someone has another easy solution
[21:05] <SeTunTun> Spass, viel Spaß!
[21:06] <SeTunTun> I tried your solution but nothing happened after rebooting :(
[21:14] <Spass> hmm, so maybe "sudo systemctl disable bluetooth.service"
[21:14] <Spass> and to enable it again - "sudo systemctl enable bluetooth.service"
[21:16] <Spass> since systemd rules all now :)
[21:31] <duskull> Hello everyone!
[21:34] <duskull> After upgrading my kernel and xorg (to the Ubuntu 18.04.2 ones) my touchpad does not register tabs like before, left/right buttons still work
[21:35] <duskull> No option to enable touchpad tabbing in the xfce4-settings
[22:01] <SeTunTun> thanks Spass I'll wait for the moment
[22:26] <gnrp> duskull: What do you mean with tabs?
[22:26] <gnrp> I mean, what is tabbing?
[22:26] <gnrp> duskull: In general, use the tool `synclient`. That is very powerful and does almost everything you want for the touchpad
[22:27] <gnrp> SeTunTun: Try using `rfkill`
[22:27] <gnrp> when you do `rfkill list`, you can see the devices. You can block then the specific device (e.g., use in general `rfkill block bluetooth` and put it in your autostart stuff
[22:33] <duskull> gnrp: I messed up a bit...
[22:34] <duskull> I installed the synaptics driver using apt but that removed a lot of other stuff
[22:34] <duskull> Now I can't use my keyboard at the login screen
[22:36] <gnrp> can you at least switch back to the console with ctrl+alt+F1?
[22:36] <gnrp> although I wonder how you manage to deinstlal keyboard stuff. Oo
[22:36] <duskull> I'm a recovery root console now
[22:37] <duskull> And I finally have wifi on that
[22:37] <duskull> No broken packages
[22:37] <duskull> What do you seggest to install now?
[22:38] <gnrp> I have no clue what happened
[22:38] <gnrp> but look to /var/log/dpkg.log. There you find what has happened
[22:38] <duskull> Okay thanks
[22:41] <duskull> Everything fixed! I installed xserver-xorg-input-all, both touchpad and keyboard are working now.
[22:43] <gnrp> and now use synclient to do whatever you want. I still don't know what you mean by tabbing
[22:43] <duskull> I mean just tab on the touchpad and register a left click, not to use the buttons below it for left/right click
[22:45] <duskull> There is an option for that in the xfce4-setting under mouse and touchpad, it is called "tab touchpad to click"
[23:01] <brainwash> duskull: tap not tab
[23:01] <duskull> Oh sorry, my bad
[23:03] <brainwash> you may need to install xserver-xorg-input-synaptics
[23:03] <brainwash> and remove xserver-xorg-input-libinput
[23:03] <brainwash> in case it's still not working 100%


[02:38] <rawang> hello, anyone here?
[02:38] <rawang> while I run "maas-cli necadmin node-groups import-boot-images"
[02:38] <rawang> i got "    check_call(['sudo', '-n', '-E', 'maas-import-pxe-files'], env=env)
[02:38] <rawang>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/subprocess.p    check_call(['sudo', '-n', '-E', 'maas-import-pxe-files'], env=env)
[02:38] <rawang>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/subprocess.py", line 511, in check_call
[02:38] <rawang>     raise CalledProcessError(retcode, cmd)
[02:38] <rawang> CalledProcessError: CalledProcessError("y", line 511, in check_call
[02:38] <rawang>     raise CalledProcessError(retcode, cmd)
[02:38] <rawang> CalledProcessError: CalledProcessError(
[02:46] <rawang> julianwa, hi
[02:55] <rawang> hello anyone?
[02:56] <julianwa> rawang: hi
[02:56] <rawang> julianwa, hi you didn't connect to the irc?
[02:57] <rawang> julianwa, just quick question, can you login the irc, i'll pm you
[02:57] <julianwa> rawang: I'm on it
[04:00] <rawang> hi guys, how do i know if maas-cli foo node-groups import-boot-images is finished or not?
[05:46] <rawang> hi guys, how do i know if maas-cli foo node-groups import-boot-images is finished or not?
[08:54] <jtv> rvba: can't add a zone!  The "Add zone" page just looks like the zones listing that I just came from.
[08:54] <rvba> jtv: yeah, I know, this is not implemented yet :)
[08:54] <jtv> Ah!  OK.  :)
[08:55] <jtv> I'll use the factory then.
[08:55] <jtv> (I added a factory method)
[08:55] <rvba> jtv: but the url exists, have a look in src/maasserver/urls.py
[08:55] <rvba> jtv: there is a factory method already
[08:55] <rvba> make_zone()
[08:56] <rvba> jtv: also, I added 2 zones to the sampledata, for convenience.
[08:57] <jtv> rvba: the HTML on the form is pretty weird actually!
[08:57] <rvba> Which form?  The "edit node" form?
[08:58] <jtv> The empty item reads: <option value selected="selected">---------</option>
[08:58] <jtv> Yes, the "edit node" form.
[08:58] <jtv> The zone dropdown, like you suggested.
[08:58] <jtv> Note how the "value" attribute has no value.
[08:58] <rvba> That's weird indeed.
[08:59] <jtv> It's allowed in HTML5, but I don't know off the top of my head what representation you get.
[08:59] <jtv> (HTML allows this in its non-XML representation)
[09:00] <jtv> I'd better get into that middleware...
[09:00] <rvba> jtv: that's not what I see :)
[09:01] <rvba> <select id="id_zone" name="zone">
[09:01] <rvba> <option value="">---------</option>
[09:06] <jtv> rvba: different versions..?
[09:06] <jtv> I'm running django 1.5.4.
[09:07] <rvba> Same here.
[09:07] <rvba> jtv: I think I know where the pb is.
[09:08] <rvba> The node->zone ForeignKey has null=True.
[09:09] <jtv> Which sounded redundant to me, for a foreign key, but you're about to tell me that it means something unexpected, right?
[09:12] <jtv> Hmmno, no difference when I remove the null=True.
[09:13] <rvba> No, because we need to regenerate the migration.
[09:13] <jtv> !
[09:14] <jtv> Doesn't the form logic just use whatever it currently sees in that code?
[09:16] <jtv> rvba: oops, when I leave the blank=True in place but remove the null=True, South thinks the field becomes NOT NULL!
[09:16] <jtv> rvba: I tried setting DEBUG, but where does the POST body get logged?
[09:16] <rvba> jtv: which is all right, but we should also add default=''
[09:17] <jtv> Add it where?  For the model field definition we already have default=None
[09:17] <rvba> Which we should change to default=''
[09:17] <rvba> Now, South has a problem with that apparently.
[09:17] <rvba> jtv: in maas.log
[09:17] <jtv> WTF that worked
[09:18] <jtv> maas.log..?  This is a dev setup.
[09:18] <rvba> The appserver log then.
[09:19] <jtv> Removing null=True and passing default='' got me past South, but it doesn't get the tests passing.  :(
[09:20] <jtv> Ah, it said "nothing to migrate."
[09:20] <jtv> No, no, that was a different run.
[09:21] <jtv> I grepped the webapp log earlier, but didn't see the recognizable string I passed in my POST parameters...  I'll re-generate and have a closer look.
[09:24] <jtv> rvba: I wonder if I set the DEBUG option in the right way and place...  Not exactly clear.
[09:25] <jtv> Still no POST bodies in the webapp logs.
[09:26] <rvba> I removed null=True and passed default='' but now South errors when running the migration.
[09:26] <jtv> Not for me...  but it turns the database field into a text field!
[09:26] <jtv> Which is... probably not what we want.
[09:26] <rvba> It is what we want I think.
[09:26] <rvba> The foreignkey points to the name of the zone.
[09:27] <jtv> Ah
[09:27] <jtv> But how can we have referential integrity in the database if the empty string is allowed there?
[09:27] <jtv> (At least, without creating a zone with an empty name)
[09:28] <rvba> Isn't there provision for an "empty default"?  At the db level I mean.
[09:28] <jtv> Yes, NULL.
[09:29] <jtv> SQL makes lots of sense.
[09:29] <rvba> Okay, so I guess we need to use that then.
[09:29] <jtv> Yes, it's definitely the appropriate choice from a database point of view.
[09:29] <jtv> But what's the appropriate choice from the form's point of view..!?
[09:31] <rvba> It probably means we have to re-defined the choices the form uses.
[09:31] <rvba> re-define*
[09:47] <rvba> jtv: I'd be curious to know how you interpret https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/models/fields/#django.db.models.ForeignKey.on_delete
[09:50] <rvba> jtv: my testing shows that the node's zone field is set to None when the related zone gets deleted.
[10:01] <jtv> Phew.
[10:01] <jtv> So no deletefest then.
[10:04] <rvba> No.  But that seems to contradict what the doc says.
[10:05] <jtv> Didn't it do that only in some particular case where the Django-level schema implies that one kind of object is "contained" in another?
[10:06] <jtv> And to be honest, I'd be very very careful before making a framework set null on cascade as well!
[10:08] <jtv> rvba, do you remember what caused this error?  I'm getting it in the test suite now.
[10:08] <jtv> IntegrityError: duplicate key value violates unique constraint "auth_user_username_key"
[10:08] <jtv> DETAIL:  Key (username)=(test) already exists.
[10:08] <rvba> Looks like test isolation violation.
[10:09] <jtv> Argh yes it does
[10:11] <jtv> Ahh... the maasserver factory test was a MAASTestCase but should be a MAASServerTestCase.
[10:11] <jtv> Too many test-case classes!
[10:11] <jtv> Oh, no, wait, there's something else...
[10:12] <jtv> Maybe it's this: Got an error creating the test database: database "test_maas" already exists
[12:45] <jtv> Quiz time.  How can a test that starts with a @skip(...) cause well over a hundred failures in the test suite?
[12:47] <jtv> I would guess, by affecting ordering of the tests somehow and exposing a subtle bug somewhere else.  :(
[12:47] <rvba> Sounds nasty :/
[12:47] <jtv> Feels nasty.
[12:50] <rvba> Reviewer needed: https://code.launchpad.net/~rvb/maas/zone-placement/+merge/198547
[12:51] <jtv> What the hell, I'll give it a go...
[13:02] <jtv> rvba: I don't see any CSS fix in that branch...  Did some wires get crossed?  A change not committed/pushed?
[13:02] <rvba> jtv: the fix has been pushed, but the diff is not updating…
[13:03] <jtv> Weird.  There was no diff in the MP earlier, so I used "Download diff," and must have gotten the older version.
[13:04] <rvba> jtv: that's the commit in question: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6555915/
[13:04] <jtv> Thanks.
[13:05] <jtv> rvba: review done.
[13:06] <rvba> Ta
[13:26] <jtv> It gets worse.  Just the @skip in front of my test is breaking all those tests.
[13:40] <jtv> rvba: if we strip None values out of a request, why does passing 'zone': None produce an error, while 'zone': '' acts as if you never passed a zone?
[13:42] <rvba> jtv: what's the error you're getting when you pass 'zone': None?
[13:42] <jtv> The error said it was an invalid choice.
[13:43] <jtv> It seems exactly the wrong way around.
[13:44] <rvba> The default choices includes the empty string.
[13:44] <rvba> So it validates fine, but is later considered the same as None.
[13:44] <rvba> 'later' meaning later in the process.
[13:45] <rvba> But None gets rejected by the first validation step.
[13:46] <jtv> I don't suppose the same would happen if we tried to set another string field to the empty string...
[13:46] <jtv> ...Because that just doesn't bear contemplating.
[13:52] <jtv> rvba: yup, can't clear agent_name either.  This could be bad.
[13:55] <rvba> jtv: given what agent_name is used for, it's fine.  But we ought the general problem.
[13:55] <rvba> ought to fix*
[13:55] <jtv> Exactly.


[01:08] <Ahmuck-Sr> boot from a usb drive
[01:09] <Ahmuck-Sr> bypass a transparent proxy via tunneling
[01:09] <Ahmuck-Sr> boot from a usb drive to bypass firefox and os altogather
[01:09] <Ahmuck-Sr> dgroos:
[01:10] <dgroos> howdy Ahmuck-Sr!
[01:18] <dgroos> Ahmuck-Sr: if some pseudo-named person comes to this irc, asking how to bypass firefox prefs, don't tell, ay? ;)
[02:23] <Ahmuck-Sr> dgroos: sure thing
[04:16] <ulead> im barry kauler
[18:04] <dgroos> Any idea what the lockPref command is for locking down the firefox prefs that control private browsing and deleting history?
[18:05] <mhall119> does anyone know of any easy to to disable all internet access for a given user account?
[18:15] <alkisg> mhall119: some person in #ltsp once proposed iptables for this: iptables -m owner -A OUTPUT -j DROP
[18:16] <mhall119> yeah, I'm looking into iptables now
[18:16] <mhall119> thanks
[18:17] <alkisg> ...and another variant he proposed: iptables -m owner -A OUTPUT -j DROP --gid-owner STUDENT_GID
[18:20] <alkisg> dgroos: to find the lockpref commands, (1) you reset all firefox preferences (2) you change the preference you care about (3) you go to about:config and sort the changed settings first.
[18:34] <dgroos> alkisg: Cool. how do you sort the entries in about:config by most recently changed?  I don't see it.
[22:56] <dgroos> I've tried unsuccessfully over the last couple of weeks to get iTALC to see the clients, trying all permutations that come to me.  Please someone direct me to an up to date install instructions for Jaunty/LTSP.


[00:34] <mup> Bug #1556514 opened: Juju bootstrap does not assign and use floating IP on openstack <floating> <ip> <juju-core> <network> <openstack> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1556514>
[00:40] <mup> Bug #1556514 changed: Juju bootstrap does not assign and use floating IP on openstack <floating> <ip> <juju-core> <network> <openstack> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1556514>
[00:49] <mup> Bug #1556514 opened: Juju bootstrap does not assign and use floating IP on openstack <floating> <ip> <juju-core> <network> <openstack> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1556514>
[04:28] <mup> Bug #1532841 changed: cannot add charm to storage <charm> <ci> <juju-core:Expired> <juju-core structured-metadata:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532841>
[04:35] <mup> Bug #1532841 opened: cannot add charm to storage <charm> <ci> <juju-core:Expired> <juju-core structured-metadata:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532841>
[04:38] <mup> Bug #1532841 changed: cannot add charm to storage <charm> <ci> <juju-core:Expired> <juju-core structured-metadata:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532841>
[15:54] <mup> Bug #1556630 opened: Timeout github.com/juju/juju/cmd/jujud/reboot <ci> <go1.5> <regression> <test-failure> <wily> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1556630>
[16:15] <mup> Bug #1555291 changed: TestStartInstancePopulatesNetworkInfoWithoutAddressAllocation fails on centos <centos> <ci> <regression> <test-failure> <juju-core:Fix Released by sinzui> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1555291>
[20:46] <davecheney> thumper: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/4706
[20:46] <davecheney> two things
[20:46] <davecheney> 1, do you have lxc installed ?
[20:47] <davecheney> i don't and the tests always pass reliably
[20:47] <davecheney> but the test was ignoring basically all the error handling
[20:47] <davecheney> so I added it back in
[20:47] <davecheney> at least the test won't hang now
[20:47] <thumper> yes I have lxc installed
[20:48] <davecheney> thumper: PTAL https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/4706
[20:48] <davecheney> it reduced the test run time from 10s of seconds to milliseconds
[20:49] <davecheney> i cannot get it to fail on my machine
[20:49] <davecheney> ask you have the failing sample, can ypu try please
[20:49] <thumper> I'll try
[21:05] <thumper> tests pass here now
[21:05] <thumper> davecheney: but I'm not sure why
[21:05] <thumper> how does your branch fix it?
[22:50] <davecheney> thumper: i don't believe that this change will make the test pass where they previously failed
[22:50] <davecheney> but previously the test didn't fail, it hung
[22:50] <davecheney> with this change
[22:50] <davecheney> you'll get an immediate error
[22:50] <davecheney> which is better than the test hanging
[22:50] <davecheney> then the test runner being killed and we get zero output
[22:50] <thumper> right
[22:51] <thumper> why did they hang?
[22:51] <thumper> it isn't clear to me
[22:52] <davecheney> no idea
[22:52] <davecheney> i cannot reproduce the problem on my machine
[22:52] <davecheney> and when we do it in CI
[22:52] <davecheney> the test runner kills the job before we get any output
[22:55] <thumper> well, even with your stress.sh it passes every time ow
[22:55] <thumper> now
[22:56] <davecheney> thumper: if you can make it hang on your machine without that CL
[22:56] <davecheney> can you run the test with debug turned up to 11 pls
[22:56]  * thumper tries
[22:57] <thumper> hmm...
[22:57] <thumper> without your changes...
[22:57] <thumper> it hangs first time
[22:59] <davecheney> what output do yo get
[23:00] <davecheney> are any of those log lines firing ?
[23:00]  * thumper looks
[23:00]  * thumper added -check.vv
[23:01] <thumper> [LOG] 0:15.878 WARNING juju.cmd.jujud.reboot Waiting for containers to shutdown: [lxd:juju-c0518c0b-97b5-47ab-8c1b-541906fb2c73-machine-0]
[23:01] <thumper> juju-c0518c0b-97b5-47ab-8c1b-541906fb2c73-machine-0 | STOPPED |      |      | PERSISTENT | 0         |
[23:02] <davecheney> hmm, lxc-ls is being *ahem* patched
[23:02] <davecheney> you should not see that
[23:02] <thumper> this is lxd
[23:02] <thumper> not lxc
[23:02] <thumper> lxc list
[23:02] <davecheney> we'd that would explain it
[23:02] <davecheney> welp
[23:03] <thumper> why did it pass with your patch then?
[23:03]  * thumper is confused
[23:03] <davecheney> i don't know
[23:04] <davecheney> i cannot get it to fail on my machine
[23:04] <thumper> got any lxd containes?
[23:04] <davecheney> i have to do this surgery via remote
[23:04] <davecheney> nope, don't have lxd installed
[23:04] <thumper> ah...
[23:04] <thumper> that'll be why it is fine on your machine
[23:04] <thumper> because lxd isn't initialized
[23:04] <davecheney> that's some great test isolation we have
[23:04] <thumper> fricken amazing
[23:05]  * thumper heads to lunch
[23:16] <davecheney> cherylj: I don't have permission to close this bug https://github.com/juju/juju/issues/4705#issuecomment-195956659
[23:16] <davecheney> may I please have that permission


[11:18] <luca___> rick_h_: are you there?
[12:26] <rick_h_> luca___: party
[12:26] <luca___> rick_h_: your at a party?
[12:27] <rick_h_> luca___: I'm here aren't I? :)
[12:27] <luca___> rick_h_: :P
[12:27] <luca___> rick_h_: do you know if the demo is connected to a state server at the moment?
[12:28] <rick_h_> luca___: comingsoon?
[12:28] <luca___> rick_h_: yes
[12:28] <rick_h_> luca___: no, it's in pure sandbox 'fake' mode
[12:28] <luca___> rick_h_: all in the browser?
[12:29] <rick_h_> luca___: to do a live demo connected to an environment you'd have to deploy to an environment using quickstart or manually
[12:29] <rick_h_> luca___: yes, all in the browser
[13:27]  * bac does ux contuing education by reading about teslas.  umm, teslas.  thanks luca.  http://uxmag.com/articles/tesla’s-groundbreaking-ux-an-interview-with-user-interface-manager-brennan-boblett
[13:27] <bac> s/contuing/continuing/
[13:34] <rick_h_> nice :)
[13:56] <rick_h_> the ec2 server that runs my irssi/remote irc session is up for retirement so need to shut it down and bring it back up. Will be back in a bit. /me crosses fingers.
[13:58] <gary_poster> hey rick_h_ if you are around, shooting you a mail
[13:58] <rick_h_> gary_poster: rgr
[13:59] <gary_poster> rick_h_, also, Huw is on vacation for next two weeks, so as team we need to try and move his branch forward
[13:59] <rick_h_> gary_poster: yep, I was going to ask about that. Most of the stuff I'd be happy to tweak. I am curious ont he landscape link but sure I could figure it out
[14:13] <rick_h_> gary_poster: k, see the email and looking into it. We do run the relation validations, but that's part of the code we're reusing from the deployer as well.
[14:18] <gary_poster> thank you rick_h_ .  I'm also checking with Maarten if he can proceed without ganglia, which reduce the need to worry about this today.
[14:18] <gary_poster> which would
[14:19] <rick_h_> gary_poster: ok, will take a bit to get my local instance to ingest enough to try it out. Working through that to replicate proof processing locally.
[14:20] <gary_poster> cool thanks
[14:21] <rick_h_> gary_poster: ah, ganglia is still at 0 because 1 failed proof errors. That charm is in a borked state because it's hanging between versions I bet
[14:22] <gary_poster> ah! ok
[14:22] <rick_h_> http://manage.jujucharms.com/tools/proof-errors see cs:precise/ganglia-1
[14:22] <gary_poster> gotcha
[14:22] <rick_h_> oh, that's ganglia-1, not ganglia-node
[14:22]  * rick_h_ keeps looking while ingest runs
[14:22] <gary_poster> ah, indeed
[14:23] <rick_h_> but ganglia-4 is in his bundle as well.
[14:25] <rick_h_> must be an old error I guess then since the store has -4 and that looks good
[14:36] <gary_poster> probably unintended side-effect og ingesting older charms
[14:36] <gary_poster> of
[14:37]  * bac reboots.  bbiab
[14:37] <rick_h_> gary_poster: yea, I can duplicate the ganglia-node locally. It's name isn't matching the regex in place to check if a charm has a version or not so looking into why
[14:38] <rick_h_> gary_poster: so that looks like a legit bug and working on it
[14:38] <gary_poster> cool thanks rick_h_ .  Don't stress about it.  Maarten says I can remove it for next week if we have to
[14:39] <gary_poster> But something we should fix
[14:39] <rick_h_> gary_poster: yep, and the second one is definitely a blind spot. Had no idea about juju-info relations so will have to add support for that as an option
[14:39] <rick_h_> pulled up the docs that mention it to see if there's any rules to be aware of on that
[14:40] <gary_poster> cool.  yeah, dunno.
[14:41] <rick_h_> gary_poster: ah! if int('0'): False doh!
[14:41] <gary_poster> heh
[14:43]  * rick_h_ changes all if revision to if revision is not None
[14:59] <hatch> oh the standup isn't earlier today
[15:00] <rick_h_> jujugui small charmworld review please. https://codereview.appspot.com/23600043/
[15:00] <gary_poster> jujugui, has anyone ever seen x-y annotations honored by the real-world deployer?
[15:00] <bac> nope, same bat time every day
[15:00] <bac> rick_h_: ok
[15:00] <gary_poster> luca___, alejandraobregon do you have a hangout?  if not we can use https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/calendar/Z2FyeS5wb3N0ZXJAY2Fub25pY2FsLmNvbQ.t3m5giuddiv9epub48d9skdaso
[15:00] <rick_h_> gary_poster: I did not, but I thought benji in qa said it didn't stack them for him
[15:00] <Makyo> jujugui emergency appointment at 8:30 (in ~30), may be a little late to call. It's by phone, so I can join as soon as it's over, shouldn't take that long.
[15:01] <gary_poster> Makyo, ack
[15:01] <hatch> gary_poster: no I've never seen them working on a real env
[15:01] <rick_h_> Makyo: rgr, thanks
[15:01] <benji> gary_poster: I don't know if it was from the annotations or just the "natural" placement, but yesterday I deployed a bundle to ec2 and the (two) services had an arrangement (i.e., they weren't stacked on top of each other)
[15:01] <hatch> ok stepping out for an hour until the meeting
[15:01] <gary_poster> rick_h_, hatch, benji, ok thanks
[15:01] <benji> rick_h_: I'll take a look at your branch
[15:02] <gary_poster> interesting: https://micknelson.wordpress.com/2013/11/08/juju-ansible-simpler-charms/
[15:02] <rick_h_> benji: cool, bac has it but more the merrier. Rick had a dumb boolean moment :)
[15:02] <bac> benji: i'm already looking
[15:02] <benji> bac: ah, ok
[15:02]  * benji averts his eyes
[15:02] <rick_h_> gary_poster: yea, not checked out ansible so not sure how much bootstrap is there but cool
[15:02] <gary_poster> y
[15:02] <bac> gary_poster: i deployed a bundle to ec2 doing frankban's qa yesterday and the two services were on top of one another.  annotations were in the bundle.
[15:03] <gary_poster> bac ack thanks
[15:03] <luca___> gary_poster: I'm trying to rally the troops :)
[15:03] <gary_poster> luca___, heh ok cool
[15:03] <rick_h_> lol, use the force luca___ !
[15:03] <rick_h_> "this is the meeting you're looking for"
[15:04] <luca___> rick_h_: rofl
[15:12] <rick_h_> thanks bac
[15:40] <rick_h_> jujugui bug-fix-o-rama part two please https://codereview.appspot.com/23660043/
[15:41]  * bac defers to benji if he wants
[15:41] <benji> bac: sure, I'll take it
[15:41] <bac> you seemed so disappointed last time
[15:42] <rick_h_> lol, you guys work together so well
[15:42] <rick_h_> "after you sir, no after you, no I insist"
[15:52] <hatch> jujugui call in 9
[15:58] <gary_poster> jujugui call in 2
[15:58] <gary_poster> or 1
[16:00] <gary_poster> benji Makyo yo
[16:00] <benji> gary_poster: hmm
[16:01] <gary_poster> (Makyo on call will show up when he can)
[16:08] <hatch> very bad net connection right now so I'm on my cell hangouts
[16:09] <bac> frankban: how did you decide to do your laptop?  metal vs vm?
[16:10] <frankban> bac: fusion for now, it seems to work very well
[16:46] <bac> jujugui, sorry my network has dropped out and i can't get back into the hangout
[16:56] <gary_poster> bac rick_h_ was I supposed to stay around and talk to you?
[16:57] <Makyo> fading, layinf diwn fir a bit
[16:57] <rick_h_> gary_poster: well, we're trying to figure out friday deploy of charmworld
[16:57] <rick_h_> gary_poster: if the deploy happened monday would that hurt the planned stuff?
[16:57] <gary_poster> rick_h_, ack.  it might.  don't do it.  ask bac to do it Monday morning.  I'll warn Maarten and he can choose what escape hatch he wants
[16:58] <rick_h_> gary_poster: ok, sounds good then. I'll check staging and proof against it to verify the bundle here
[16:58] <gary_poster> cool thanks rick_h_
[16:58] <hatch_> that call used up 33% of my battery on my phone lol
[16:58] <hatch_> apparently decoding 7 video streams is battery intensive work
[16:59] <rick_h_> gary_poster: http://paste.mitechie.com/show/1072/
[16:59] <rick_h_> gary_poster: so looks good on staging
[16:59] <rick_h_> bac: can you do a deploy on monday then please?
[16:59] <gary_poster> rick_h_, awesome :-) thanks
[16:59] <hatch_> gary_poster: If I don't end up driving I can also take a look at huw's branch pending I have decent LTE/3G on the highway
[17:00] <rick_h_> hatch_: cool, if not I'll update it on tues
[17:00] <hatch_> no I will!
[17:00] <gary_poster> hatch, you are a madman :-) thanks
[17:00] <rick_h_> :PO
[17:00] <hatch_> haha
[17:00] <hatch_> well if I'm not driving it's either code or read a bood
[17:00] <hatch_> book*
[17:00] <bac> rick_h_, gary_poster: ok, monday deploy
[17:00] <rick_h_> bac: thanks, I'll be around if you need anything.
[17:00] <gary_poster> awesome thanks
[17:01] <gary_poster> I won't :-P text me if you need me
[17:01] <rick_h_> gary_poster: so did you want me to reply to the email or are you?
[17:02] <gary_poster> rick_h_, you mean one about maarten?  I can, unless you want to fastest ever
[17:02] <gary_poster> why don't you go work undertime :-)
[17:02] <rick_h_> gary_poster: umm, not sure what the fastest ever is.
[17:02] <rick_h_> gary_poster: ok, thanks.
[17:15] <hatch_> ok have a good weekend everyone
[17:15] <hatch_> talk to you tuesday
[17:20] <gary_poster> bye hatch_ have fun
[17:27] <Makyo> Back, sorry about that.
[17:27] <Makyo> Wow, bad typing :P
[17:47] <jcastro> ugh
[17:47] <jcastro> hey rick_h_
[17:48] <jcastro> remember when you said "we don't support constraints" with quickstart
[17:48] <jcastro> is that still the case?
[17:48] <gary_poster> rick_h_ is not here jcastro.  we do, but they need to spelled like go constraints
[17:49] <gary_poster> making example...
[17:50] <gary_poster> jcastro, see these constraint names: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6383339/
[17:50] <jcastro> got it
[17:52] <gary_poster> hey bac, do you have log access to see why lp:~gary/charms/bundles/demo/bundle is not ingesting on staging?  Rick thought it was on its way after bug fixes, but I don't see it in staging search results
[17:52] <jcastro> gary_poster, the constraints I am trying to map are mem=7G cpu-cores=2 arch=amd64
[17:52] <jcastro> can I do those three or do I need to worry about this cpu-power one?
[17:53] <gary_poster> jcastro, those three are fine
[17:53] <jcastro> awesome, just waint for the CF charm to finish
[17:53] <gary_poster> jcastro, IIRC go does not understand "7G" though
[17:53] <jcastro> and then all I have to do is shift-D that bad boy
[17:53] <jcastro> right, I'll have to do 7048 or whatever the real number is
[17:53] <gary_poster> right
[17:53] <jcastro> nod
[18:05] <rick_h_> gary_poster: staging is still at the 11 original bundles pulled in. Notice manage is up to 13. I bet that the charm needs updating on staging for the charm fixes we did to production
[18:05] <rick_h_> gary_poster: bac I'm not sure how the charm is managed on staging to know how to update that
[18:06] <gary_poster> rick_h_, ack, thank you
[18:09] <bac> rick_h_: i'll look at it
[18:10] <gary_poster> thanks bac
[18:10] <bac> rick_h_: just make sure the new charm is running?  never done that.
[18:39] <benji> bac (or someone else): here is my add-metrics-api charmworld branch: https://codereview.appspot.com/23740043
[18:39] <bac> benji: ok, i'll get to it in a bit
[18:54] <bac> benji: thanks for the note about the merge failure.  i was just thinking it all looked familiar
[18:56] <benji> bac: I wish I knew how that happend.  I'm thinking rv-submit doesn't push before merging
[18:56] <bac> ohhh
[18:56] <bac> ewww
[18:58] <jcastro> gary_poster, aha! a pleasant surprise, the gui exported the constraints properly anyway
[18:59] <jcastro> so basically I didn't even need to care about that
[18:59] <gary_poster> jcastro, oh right, sorry, I thought you were talking about translating old ones.  Yeah, as far as we know, that bit is stomped for the future.
[19:01] <jcastro> gary_poster, man, this is awesome
[19:02] <jcastro> gary_poster, ok, so we want to give this bundle to CF/altoros immediately, I have pushed it to lp
[19:02] <jcastro> so basically, the instructions from scratch are:
[19:02] <jcastro> install the quickstart ppa
[19:02] <jcastro> then `juju quickstart X`
[19:02] <jcastro> X being the url to the bundle right?
[19:03] <gary_poster> right, that's in code now, or bundle:XXX  in the future
[19:03] <bac> benji: done
[19:03] <benji> bac: thanks!
[19:04] <benji> bac: how in the world does that not-tuple code work!?
[19:05] <benji> I've got to investigate that.
[19:06] <bac> 's' in 's' is True
[19:08] <bac> thanks gary_poster.  i was adding reviewer notes when i saw you were done!
[19:08] <benji> right, but when did "str1 in str2" start meaning str2 contains str1
[19:08] <bac> ignore them
[19:08] <benji> that is something I didn't know Python did -- it surprises me that there is anything left like that :)
[19:09] <bac> but in your cast str1 and str2 are the same, yes?
[19:09] <bac> s/cast/case
[19:09] <benji> bac: yep
[19:10] <jcastro> juju quickstart lp:~jorge/charms/bundles/cloudfoundry/bundle
[19:10] <jcastro> it's looking for the charm to be local on disk
[19:10] <benji> but it means that any substring of "deployments" would have worked
[19:10] <benji> bac: what does the comment "del" mean at the top of https://codereview.appspot.com/23740043/diff/1/charmworld/views/tests/test_metrics_api.py?column_width=80 ?
[19:11] <jcastro> gary_poster, am I missing something wrt to the URL?
[19:12] <bac> oh, you have a blank line for no reason
[19:12] <bac> gary_poster: QA instructions sent
[19:12] <bac> benji: ^^
[19:13] <benji> bac: oh!
[19:13] <bac> i could've been less cryptic
[19:15] <jcastro> hey bac, can you help me figure out how to deploy a bundle from a remote URL?
[19:15] <jcastro> we need to give the cloudfoundry guys this bundle asap
[19:16] <jcastro> and I've got it all pushed
[19:16] <bac> jcastro: from cli?
[19:16] <jcastro> yeah
[19:16] <bac> jcastro: lp url?
[19:16] <bac> jcastro: sorry, what is the LP url for the branch?
[19:17] <jcastro> https://code.launchpad.net/~jorge/charms/bundles/cloudfoundry/bundle
[19:17] <jcastro> lp:~jorge/charms/bundles/cloudfoundry/bundle <-- I tried that too
[19:19] <benji> bac: how do I install rv-submit?  (my bzr config broke badly recently)
[19:20] <bac> bzr branch lp:rvsubmit ~/.bazaar/plugins/rvsubmit
[19:20] <benji> ah, I was missing "plugins"
[19:20] <benji> a README in that branch would be good
[19:23] <bac> jcastro: sorry, i'm having to fetch the deployer
[19:24] <jcastro> I am wondering if I am just missing the right syntax for the url?
[19:35] <jcastro> gary_poster, any ideas?
[19:35] <gary_poster> sorry on call will pay attention soon
[19:36] <bac> jcastro: your bundle is not on manage.jujucharms.com or staging, right?
[19:37] <jcastro> bac, I pushed it about 15 minutes ago
[19:37] <jcastro> oh, so I can't have an arbritary URL?
[19:37] <jcastro> it also needs to be ingested?
[19:38] <bac> jcastro: what does your deployer -h say?  can you paste it?  i don't seem to have a working one atm
[19:38] <rick_h_> jcastro: no local charms support
[19:38] <rick_h_> jcastro: was in the email as a limitation righ tnow
[19:38] <rick_h_> right now
[19:38] <jcastro> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6383899/
[19:39] <jcastro> rick_h_, I don't want a local charm I want from a remote URL
[19:39] <jcastro> bac,  URL has the -h
[19:39] <rick_h_> jcastro: looking at the cloudfoundry one you linked at it has a charm: local:
[19:39] <rick_h_> jcastro: this a different one?
[19:39] <jcastro> oh!
[19:39] <jcastro> crap, I can fix that
[19:40] <jcastro> ok so I their charm is here: https://github.com/Altoros/cloudfoundry_charm
[19:41] <jcastro> I don't suppose I can substitute that URL in the bundle can I?
[19:41] <rick_h_> jcastro: can you just juju deploy url?
[19:41] <jcastro> no, but we're supposed to
[19:41] <rick_h_> jcastro: it won't get ingested as it'll fail proof. It only supports charms loaded in the store
[19:41] <jcastro> ugh
[19:41] <jcastro> so basically, there's no value for them to put this in a bundle
[19:41] <rick_h_> jcastro: if you're calling the deployer itself, I'm not 100% sure what it does
[19:41] <bac>  rick_h_: i thought the juju-deploy had an option to take a URL
[19:41] <jcastro> it does
[19:41] <rick_h_> bac: that url is the yaml file in the store
[19:42] <bac> jcastro: what is the command line you tried/
[19:42] <rick_h_> so juju quickstart http://manage.jujucharms.com/bundles/~jcastro/......
[19:42] <rick_h_> bac: but that's juju quickstart and not the deployer
[19:43] <rick_h_> jcastro: no, you'd have to get that charm out of github and into bzr/store
[19:43] <bac> rick_h_: right.  we added it to the deployer a long time ago.
[19:43] <jcastro> ugh
[19:43] <rick_h_> bac: ok cool.
[19:43] <jcastro> ok but using the manage.jujucharms.com would work as the url?
[19:43] <bac> rick_h_:  but now i don't see it
[19:43] <rick_h_> jcastro: so maybe bac knows of a cli command to make it work from the deployer itself
[19:43] <bac> rick_h_:  but now i don't see it
[19:43] <jcastro> well it needs to work from quickstart
[19:43] <jcastro> not the deployer
[19:43] <rick_h_> jcastro: if you go to a bundle in the gui there's a 'deploy' tab that shows you how to deploy it via cli
[19:44] <bac> yes, use the new goodness
[19:44] <rick_h_> jcastro: http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/sidebar/search/bundle/~jorge/wordpress/5/wordpress-simple/?text=wordpress#bws-deploy
[19:44] <rick_h_> jcastro: walks through deploying via quickstart and deployer
[19:44] <gary_poster> we might need to update the PPA
[19:44] <gary_poster> for quickstart
[19:44] <gary_poster> that slipped through the cracks
[19:46] <gary_poster> jcastro, can this be ready Monday morning?  I can ask Francesco to update the PPA for you then.  I'm not set up for it and I have other things going on
[19:46] <jcastro> no I'm just going to tell them to do it manually
[19:46] <gary_poster> ok
[19:46] <jcastro> it doesn't make sense for them to use quickstart if they have to migrate all their stuff over to bzr/lp anyway
[19:46] <jcastro> that'll end up being the same length as just doing it by hand
[19:46] <gary_poster> jcastro, they don't
[19:47] <gary_poster> jcastro, quickstart can take any arbitrary url
[19:47] <gary_poster> as long as the other end of it is a deployer file
[19:47] <jcastro> what's the exact syntac?
[19:47] <gary_poster> *in trunk*
[19:47] <rick_h_> gary_poster: but his issue is finding a url to put into the deployer file to load a charm from github
[19:47] <jcastro> ok so if my bundle is here: https://code.launchpad.net/~jorge/charms/bundles/cloudfoundry/bundle
[19:47] <rick_h_> gary_poster: is my understanding of the issue
[19:48] <jcastro> what's the syntax? because it's not taking that url
[19:48] <gary_poster> rick_h_, doesn't github have a "raw file" url?
[19:48] <jcastro> rick_h_, yeah but I can fix that by pushing the charm to lp in the meantime
[19:48] <rick_h_> gary_poster: for a whole charm?
[19:48] <gary_poster> what?  I thought jcastro was trying deploy a bundle
[19:49] <rick_h_> gary_poster: that references a charm in github
[19:49] <gary_poster> oh!
[19:49] <gary_poster> sorry
[19:49] <gary_poster> correct
[19:49] <rick_h_> jcastro: try this url with quickstart http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jorge/charms/bundles/cloudfoundry/bundle/download/head:/bundles.yaml-20131108185817-d8vxvhytvqmrpw43-2/bundles.yaml
[19:49]  * rick_h_ ducks from url fussings
[19:49] <jcastro> ok so to solve that, I can push the charm to lp in the meantime
[19:49] <jcastro> man ...
[19:49] <jcastro> *slow clap*
[19:49] <gary_poster> that won't work and we haven't scheduled work for it
[19:49] <rick_h_> jcastro: because it's not in the store you're getting a direct LP url
[19:49] <gary_poster> "that won't work" == charm from github
[19:50] <jcastro> rick_h_, oh because I'm failing proof, so first step is to get that charm in lp
[19:50] <jcastro> and then fix the bundle
[19:50] <jcastro> wait 15 ...
[19:50] <jcastro> and then .... it should work?
[19:50] <rick_h_> jcastro: if the charm is in the store and you pass proof and your bundle is ingested: http://manage.jujucharms.com/bundle/~jorge/liferay/liferay-simple/json
[19:50] <jcastro> rick_h_, I am writing down that URL though, that is awesome.
[19:50] <bac> jcastro: get it done in the next 9 minutes and you won't have to wait!  :)
[19:50] <jcastro> juju quickstart http://manage.jujucharms.com/bundle/~jorge/liferay/liferay-simple/json
[19:51] <jcastro> but with the right url
[19:51] <rick_h_> jcastro: and later on (not today) bundle:~jorge/liferay/3/liferay-simple  will work
[19:51] <rick_h_> jcastro: right
[19:51] <jcastro> why is there a 3 there?
[19:51] <rick_h_> jcastro: and once it's ingested the deploy tab will show up
[19:51] <jcastro> oh, nm, let me bust this out, then I can whine
[19:51] <rick_h_> jcastro: version 3 of the bundle
[19:51] <rick_h_> jcastro: well of the deployer file
[19:52] <rick_h_> jcastro: yes, first get charm in lp, update bundle with real charm: url, then go to gui, go to deploy tab, and copy/paste
[19:52] <bac> gary_poster: if quickstart will take an arbitrary URL why do our deploy instructions way to wget it locally?
[19:52] <gary_poster> jcastro, this is trunk's --help.  It will tell you what you can have as bundle: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6383960/
[19:52] <gary_poster> bac because it is not in the PPA
[19:53] <bac> oh, the update to use urls.  gotcha
[19:53] <jcastro> ok, so tldr, we need to update the PPA soon
[19:53] <jcastro> that would have solved my first issue
[19:53] <jcastro> the 2nd is, we still can't deploy charms from other URLs
[19:54] <gary_poster> correct, and we won't be able to because that work is not scheduled
[19:54] <gary_poster> bac, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6383970/ is the PPA's --help fwiw
[19:54] <gary_poster> so, PPA: bundle                The path to the bundle file to deploy
[19:54] <gary_poster> trunk: bundle                The optional bundle to be deployed. The bundle can be
[19:54] <gary_poster>                         1) a path to a YAML/JSON file or 2) a path to a
[19:54] <gary_poster>                         directory containing a bundles.yaml file or 3) a URL
[19:54] <gary_poster>                         (starting with http:// or https://) to a YAML/JSON
[19:55] <jcastro>      charm: "cs:~jorge/charms/precise/cloudfoundry/trunk"
[19:55] <jcastro> does that line look right to you rick?
[19:55] <jcastro> gary_poster, afaict that's juju's fault not yours?
[19:55] <rick_h_> jcastro: yes, looks ok
[19:55] <rick_h_> jcastro: make sure that the charm is in the store first though or the bundle won't pull it in because it won't be able to find that charm yet
[19:55] <jcastro> I need to wait for the CS to ingest
[19:55] <rick_h_> jcastro: and yea, juju's fault. :) Sounds good to me :)
[19:56] <jcastro> which I think is 15 min
[19:56] <rick_h_> jcastro: yep
[19:56] <rick_h_> jcastro: they pull in every 15min starting at the top of the hour
[19:56] <jcastro> 4 minutes and then both things should ingest
[19:56] <bac> gary_poster: are you going to do my QA?  I've done it myself so i'm ok to land without you doing it.  (it's friday)
[19:57] <gary_poster> jcastro, not really a fault: deployer is the thing that handles git charms, not juju.  we don't support it in gui because we would have to download charms to the GUI server, and that is a risky thing
[19:57] <gary_poster> bac, do it, I'm slammed
[19:57] <bac> thought so
[19:58] <jcastro> wait so what happened to all the github first class citizen stuff?
[19:59] <gary_poster> bac, https://codereview.appspot.com/23800044 please? pretty please?
[19:59] <bac> on it
[19:59] <rick_h_> jcastro: it got put in line
[20:00] <gary_poster> jcastro, oh, yeah, sorry, you are right that if juju core supported github for charms (and charmworld did too) then gui wouldn't care
[20:00] <bac> oh chunk mismatch my old friend
[20:00] <jcastro> ok I just need to know who to whine to
[20:00] <gary_poster> gui just wants to be able to talk to charmworld
[20:00] <jcastro> and I just need to understand that your support of git (or anywhere URLs) is just a symptom of core not supporting it
[20:00] <gary_poster> which itself wants to talk to charm store
[20:01] <rick_h_> jcastro: I'm not sure tbh
[20:02] <gary_poster> jcastro, gui does not support deploying charms that are not in charm store/charmworld.  bundles in the GUI have the same constraint.  Therefore you can whine in two directions
[20:02] <gary_poster> (1) GUI doesn't support local charms! if they did it could maybe eventually support bundles pointing to arbitrary locations
[20:02] <jcastro> I just don't get why we can't do `juju quickstart http://jorgecastro.org/my-kickass-wordpress.json" or whatever
[20:03] <gary_poster> jcastro, we *can* for bundles
[20:03] <gary_poster> we *can't* for charms\
[20:03] <jcastro> yeah I just don't see anyone saying "sweet, I'll put my bundles on github and my charms on launchpad"
[20:03] <gary_poster> happy to explain briefly on hangout if would help
[20:03] <rick_h_> jcastro: right, the bundles.yaml can be anywhere. The charms defined in that bundle need to be in the store
[20:03] <jcastro> they're going to say "I want everything in github"
[20:03] <gary_poster> sure
[20:03] <gary_poster> you never let me get to my #2
[20:04] <gary_poster> (2) Core/Store/charmworld doesn't support github charms! if they did gui could immediately handle bundles with those charms
[20:04] <gary_poster> #2 and #1 are unrelated: you could have one without the other
[20:05] <gary_poster> does that make sense jcastro ?
[20:05] <jcastro> nod
[20:05] <gary_poster> k
[20:06] <gary_poster> #1 is not planned on our side, and would be a lot of work.  I have no idea about the planning for #2, but if core does their part of it, somebody (like us) will need to do it in charmworld
[20:06] <bac> gary_poster: with your branch, hatch's TestBundle deployed a-ok running against sandbox.  is that good QA?
[20:06] <jcastro> rick_h_, ok closer now
[20:06] <jcastro> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6384035/
[20:07] <jcastro> E: cloudfoundry: Could not find charm: cf-release
[20:07] <rick_h_> jcastro: looking to see if it got ingested
[20:07] <jcastro> I've pushed the charm here: https://code.launchpad.net/~jorge/charms/precise/cloudfoundry/trunk
[20:07] <jcastro> it didn't it seems
[20:07] <rick_h_> jcastro: right, looking
[20:07] <rick_h_> jcastro: no, proof the charm?
[20:07] <gary_poster> bac, sent a set of 4.  maybe try one or two of them?
[20:09] <jcastro> rick_h_, that could not find charm error cf-release is what proof tells me locally
[20:09] <rick_h_> jcastro: right, but what about proofing the charm itself
[20:09] <rick_h_> jcastro: so the charm didn't get into the store, the bundle won't be able to find it/land either
[20:10] <rick_h_> jcastro: so now the focus is on why didn't the charm get into the store
[20:10] <jcastro> rick_h_, oh! the charm itself
[20:10] <rick_h_> jcastro: +1
[20:11] <jcastro> oh yeah that's the issue
[20:11] <rick_h_> jcastro: yea, and you pushed the whole directory and such
[20:11] <rick_h_> jcastro: you needed to push just the charm, not the charms dir, ruby.md, etc
[20:11] <rick_h_> jcastro: and the charm in charms/precise/cf-release has proof errors
[20:12] <rick_h_> http://paste.mitechie.com/show/1073/
[20:12] <jcastro> gotcha
[20:12] <bac> gary_poster: all four deploy
[20:12] <gary_poster> bac cool, with good positioning?
[20:13] <jcastro> this is insane, no one is going to want to go through this
[20:13] <rick_h_> jcastro: dude, what are we going to do. Search your whole directory tree to see if anything looks charm-like in here?
[20:13] <bac> lovely positioning.  some of the best positioning i've seen in giant bundles.  pleasingly symmetric.
[20:13] <rick_h_> "You pushed a blob of stuff, down four directories this might be charm-like"
[20:14] <jcastro> no it's just the naming convention is totally non obvious
[20:14] <rick_h_> jcastro: isn't there  a charm "publish" thing to help with that?
[20:14] <jcastro> nope
[20:14] <jcastro> it's the same place github integration is
[20:14] <gary_poster> bac thank you!
[20:15] <rick_h_> jcastro: heh, well one day it'll not suck then I guess
[20:20] <jcastro> https://code.launchpad.net/~jorge/charms/precise/cloudfoundry/trunk
[20:20] <jcastro> how's that?
[20:20] <jcastro> I have warnings and stuff, but it passes
[20:21] <rick_h_> jcastro: awesome, see you in 14min
[20:21] <jcastro> heh
[20:21] <jcastro> 9 right?
[20:21] <rick_h_> right, but then it takes a few min to process the queue. Usually 4 or 5 min
[20:22] <rick_h_> when http://manage.jujucharms.com/heartbeat gets the queue filled and then empties again we can chat
[20:28] <jcastro> ooh, that's a handy URL
[20:30] <bac> gary_poster: while i plan to work on monday i just remembered the coast guard brings in helicopters for veterans day.  may take some strategic breaks to go to the fort.  :)
[20:30] <gary_poster> bac, cool :-)
[20:35] <bac> gary_poster: it looks like i need to replace the charmworld service on staging to update to the new version of the charm.  i'd like to wait until the morning as i need to take the dog now and then have a full evening
[20:36] <gary_poster> bac, oh. um.  ok, will work around it.  thanks.
[20:37] <rick_h_> jcastro: looking
[20:37] <bac> gary_poster: if it is hurting us i can try to do it sooner.
[20:38] <bac> i just assumed it was a minor inconvenience
[20:39] <gary_poster> bac, I just need to be able to give maarten a way to deploy a bundle of his on comingsoon on his Monday morning.  the one he needs is not ingesting.  m.j.c and s.j.c both have their own respective issues, it seems
[20:39] <rick_h_> gary_poster: I think a mjc deploy is the ligher weight work in that case
[20:39] <gary_poster> bac, my work around will be to remove the parts that don't work from the bundle, and hope that ingests
[20:39] <gary_poster> rick_h_, ok.  I think everyone needs to not do a deploy
[20:40] <rick_h_> ok
[20:40] <gary_poster> so either the bundle edit will work
[20:40] <gary_poster> and maarten will be somewhat happy
[20:40] <gary_poster> or it won't
[20:40] <gary_poster> and he won't, but then don't give me a Friday to get something working on a Monday
[20:40] <gary_poster> :-)
[20:43] <rick_h_> jcastro: is http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/sidebar/search/~jorge/precise/cloudfoundry-0/?text=cloudfoundry it?
[20:43] <jcastro> yay!
[20:43] <rick_h_> jcastro: so then your url for your bundle needs to be  cs:~jorge/precise/cloudfoundry-0
[20:43] <rick_h_> which will fail because of the bug I fixed today :/
[20:43] <jcastro> hah
[20:43] <rick_h_> put another version please. Change a readme, don't care. Just needs to not in -0
[20:44] <jcastro> excellent
[20:44] <jcastro> ok
[20:44] <jcastro> of the charm you mean
[20:44] <rick_h_> jcastro: right, -0 version charms are broken. Fix landed today will be deployed on monday
[20:44] <rick_h_> jcastro: aren't you so glad you wanted to do this now :)
[20:45] <jcastro> heh
[20:45] <jcastro> I'm posting to the internal list
[20:45] <jcastro> we learned a bunch here today
[20:45] <rick_h_> k
[20:45] <jcastro> but I have some questions about what core is up to, etc.
[20:45] <jcastro> rev pushed
[20:45] <rick_h_> jcastro: yea, the joys of a 1.0 (beta) feature getting users
[20:46] <rick_h_> jcastro: cool, next load is right now, not sure if it will have made it in or need to wait until top of the hour
[20:46] <jcastro> k
[20:52] <rick_h_> jcastro: looks like the answer is no, you missed the window.
[20:54] <jcastro> of course I did
[20:54] <jcastro> it's Friday
[20:54] <rick_h_> well the timestamps say you hit it in a 15s window :P
[20:56] <jcastro> that's the kind of day I am having!
[20:56] <rick_h_> jcastro: going to grab the boy from day care, be back in a few. Will check back in
[20:56] <jcastro> rick_h_, I'll either be 100% working or half way through a bottle of rim
[20:56] <jcastro> rum even. :p
[20:57] <rick_h_> jcastro: :)
[21:03] <jcastro> rick_h_, ok go get drunk
[21:03] <jcastro> gary_poster, posted some feedback to the list, sorry I am coming across so whiny
[21:14] <bac> gary_poster: i'm updating the staging charm now
[21:18] <bac> gary_poster: done.  huh, that was easy.
[21:21] <rick_h_> jcastro: woot, bundle get in to?
[21:22] <rick_h_> jcastro: so the charm is cs:~jorge/precise/cloudfoundry-1, you've got cf-release in your bundle
[21:23] <jcastro>  charm: "cs:~jorge/precise/cloudfoundry-1"
[21:23] <jcastro> waiting for it to ingest too I guess?
[21:23] <rick_h_> jcastro: ah, cool see it now
[21:23] <rick_h_> jcastro: yes
[21:23] <rick_h_> jcastro: then it'll show in the gui and everything should be all cool
[21:24] <jcastro> what do you mean by show in the gui??
[21:24] <jcastro> I was just going to do a `juju quickstart` cli as the example
[21:24] <rick_h_> http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/sidebar/search/?text=jorge
[21:24] <rick_h_> jcastro: yea, that's cool. It'll work and all then.
[21:25] <rick_h_> jcastro: just saying once the bundle is ingetsed you'll see it in the gui and the deploy tab will walk through the cli steps
[21:25] <rick_h_> just like http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/bundle/~jorge/mediawiki-simple/2/mediawiki-simple/
[21:29] <jcastro> OH!
[21:29] <jcastro> dude that is way better
[21:29] <jcastro> good idea
[21:30] <rick_h_> jcastro: yea, getting into the store stuff sucks, that's the pita up front work. Once done though we're trying to take care of ya :)
[21:30] <jcastro> oh ok
[21:30] <jcastro> so the Deploy "tab"
[21:30] <jcastro> it'll basically make one of those but with the right commands?
[21:30] <rick_h_> jcastro: right, the deploy tab is your copy/paste way to do this via cli
[21:30] <rick_h_> it loads the right urls, etc
[21:31] <jcastro> man
[21:31] <rick_h_> so you don't have to think about it
[21:31] <jcastro> that is badass dude
[21:31]  * jcastro high fives
[21:32] <rick_h_> oh crap, comingsoon is using staging?
[21:33] <rick_h_> gary_poster: did we setup comingsoon to staging for marteen's stuff?
[21:36] <rick_h_> jcastro: ok, so you're fubar'd. The good news: http://manage.jujucharms.com/bundle/~jorge/cloudfoundry/cloudfoundry
[21:36] <rick_h_> there's your bundle yay
[21:37] <rick_h_> jcastro: now for the bad news, for something that maarten's demo'ing on monday it looks like we changed comingsoon to hit up staging.jujucharms.com which won't ingest your bundle right now because it's not up to date.
[21:37]  * rick_h_ sighs and runs away
[21:37] <jcastro> ok so
[21:38] <jcastro> juju quickstart http://manage.jujucharms.com/bundle/~jorge/cloudfoundry/cloudfoundry
[21:38] <jcastro> should work though?
[21:38] <rick_h_> jcastro: yes!~
[21:38] <jcastro> GOOD ENOUGH FOR A FRIDAY
[21:38] <rick_h_> woot!
[21:38] <rick_h_> jcastro: will get better/nicer next week
[21:38] <rick_h_> jcastro: I don't see your email?
[21:38] <jcastro> internal juju list
[21:39] <rick_h_>  jcastro oh, I must not be on that one.
[21:39] <jcastro> oh hey
[21:39] <jcastro> oh I know why
[21:39] <jcastro> the bundle should work
[21:39] <jcastro> but I need to be running trunk
[21:39] <jcastro> so when the PPA lands that should Just Work
[21:39] <rick_h_> running trunk of quickstart? oh right, I remember seeing that go by
[21:39] <rick_h_> yea
[21:43] <rick_h_> oh dude it did load on staging. http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/sidebar/search/bundle/~jorge/cloudfoundry/3/cloudfoundry/?text=cloudfoundry
[21:43] <jcastro> OMG
[21:43] <jcastro> brilliant
[21:43] <jcastro> I am sharing it with kirkland on G+ now if you wanna hangout
[21:44] <rick_h_> why not, can answer any questions
[21:44] <rick_h_> linky?
[21:44] <jcastro> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7ecpjuhi7oqg6echhll48cj70g?authuser=0&hl=en
[22:13] <bac> gary_poster: are the bundles you need here: http://staging.jujucharms.com/search?search_text=precise&op=
[22:14] <bac> rick_h_: staging looks to be happy now
[22:14] <bac> rick_h_: since i upgraded the charm it has added 4 new bundles
[22:14] <gary_poster> bac, yes, was just looking at that and writing to maarten.  did you do that?  If so, I'm sorry but thank you!
[22:14] <gary_poster> awesome thank you very much
[22:14] <bac> don't be sorry
[22:14] <gary_poster> :-)
[22:14] <bac> it was easy.  much easier than i thought.
[22:15] <bac> juju upgrade-charm charmworld
[22:15] <gary_poster> oh awesome
[22:19] <gary_poster> rick_h_, bac, thank you both very much for helping with getting maarten's stuff up.  looks good.  http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/bundle/~gary/demo/2/mixAndMatch/ and http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/bundle/~gary/demo/2/instantBigDataNoSQL/ fwiw
[22:19] <gary_poster> jcastro, you might like one or both of those
[22:21]  * gary_poster running away
[22:21] <gary_poster> have a great weekend everyone!
[22:22] <marcoceppi> Hi GUI people, quick question about the "Import bundle" button
[22:22] <marcoceppi> It expects a deployer yaml file, right? What if you have multiple deployments in it?
[22:23] <gary_poster> marcoceppi, yaml or json.  ATM it will be unhappy.  sorry.  in the future it might ask you what you want.  For now, divide up the file by hand
[22:23] <marcoceppi> gary_poster: that's cool, playing devil's advocate while I try to word this bug-for-discussion
[22:23] <gary_poster> cool :-)
[22:23] <gary_poster> ttyl
[22:24] <marcoceppi> gary_poster: o/ have a good one!
[22:24] <marcoceppi> 0.12 looks awesome
[22:35] <rick_h_> bac: yep, thanks! I missed you had done that.
[22:36] <rick_h_> thanks marcoceppi, appreciate the bundle/proof help to get it out the door
[22:39] <marcoceppi> rick_h_: np, to address some of jcastro's gripe I plan to add a `juju bundle get` command to charm tools for the 1.2 release
[22:40] <rick_h_> marcoceppi: juju bundle get?
[22:40] <rick_h_> which gripe was that?
[22:40] <marcoceppi> wget <some really long web address for quickstart deployments kind of sucks atm>
[22:41] <jcastro> that's in trunk already
[22:41] <jcastro> just not in the PPA
[22:41] <rick_h_> right, but with the quickstart taking urls you won't need that
[22:41] <marcoceppi> yesss, one less thing to do
[22:41] <jcastro> that will just be `juju quickstart url`
[22:41] <rick_h_> yea, it's in trunk and we'll support bundle: urls next
[22:41] <rick_h_> so soon it'll be just juju quickstart bundle:~gary/demo/2/mixAndMatch
[22:42] <marcoceppi> rick_h_: why not just cs:~gary/demo/2/mixAndMatch ?
[22:42] <marcoceppi> too ambiguous with charm store charms?
[22:42] <rick_h_> marcoceppi: cs urls are tied to charms
[22:42] <rick_h_> yea
[22:43] <rick_h_> so bundle: == cs: for bundles
[22:43] <marcoceppi> why not bs:
[22:43] <rick_h_> har har
[22:43]  * marcoceppi giggles
[22:44] <marcoceppi> They're still technically in the charmstore, I think it's a valid URL, but I can argue that later when I have time
[22:44] <rick_h_> technically they're not in the charm store :)
[22:44] <marcoceppi> well, in what the user knows of hte charm store
[22:44] <rick_h_> they're in charmworld, will pulls data from the juju charm store
[22:44] <marcoceppi> jujucharms.com, for all purposes to the user, is the "charm store"
[22:47] <marcoceppi> anyways, those can all be updated later, I just love being able to juju quickstart <3
[22:48] <marcoceppi> I actually wrote a plugin to do this a while ago, called juju-guistrap, since I tend to tear down and setup all the time, but this is way faster and servces so much more purpose in life
[22:48] <marcoceppi> it was just a three line bash script that ran the bootstrap then deploy --to


[09:12] <Ginalo> Hi. For some reason, Carla won't show the `Audio Input` and `Audio Output`, not like in QJackCtl where `system`capture and playback, and `pulse_in` and `pulse_out` appears. What should I do?
[14:02] <OvenWrks> MauroGaspari[m]: not 21.10. I am finding that there have been a number of changes already in 21.10 (maybe 21.04 for all I know) that I am having to account for. Pipewire is still in heavy development and while it is not hard to beat pulseaudio (made by non-audio devs) it is much harder to to make something that is (semi)pro ready. Certainly there are still problems with running some of the main
[14:02] <OvenWrks> audio apps still.
[14:03] <OvenWrks> I installed 21.10 with the idea of trying out pipewire, but found that studio-controls needs work first.
[14:05] <OvenWrks> MauroGaspari[m]: pipewire (well ALSA really) still does not deal with firewire audio devices which are still better than almost any USB device and Linux does not really have a pathway to use Dante devices which might come close.
[14:06] <OvenWrks> s/deal with/deal well with/


[17:57] <linuxtech> marcoceppi and others: Key Signing Tuesday night, if you want to participate, send your keys soon.  See https://www.usenix.org/conference/lisa13/birds-feather-sessions#cacert and the gpg Bof following it.  9pm is the CAcert Bof and 10pm is the GPG Bof.