[10:12] <fedesog> hi, I have a comment for the HowToMD5SUM Wiki page in the Ubuntu Documentation. Is this the right place?
[10:36] <mdke> billybigrigger: we have a problem with access to the site at the moment but it will be updated asap
[10:37] <mdke> fedesog: sure. In fact you can generally just go ahead and edit wiki pages as they are free to edit. If you're not sure, go ahead and ask
[10:43] <mdke> DarkwingDuck_: right. When making string changes, ordinarily you need a process for updating translations too - but in kubuntu's case, I don't think translations have been updated in Lucid
[10:47] <fedesog> mdke: it was about the verification of the checksum of a cd, some cd burners, like mine (Sony) pad some data (like a signature of the hardware) finalizing the cd so the md5 of the original iso and the md5sum /dev/cdrom are different. I just wanted to add a note that this method to check the cd could fail even if the cd is good and I wasn't sure if I could do it. Thanks
[10:49] <mdke> fedesog: sure, go ahead. That sounds a bit odd! I suppose in that situation the best strategy is to use the software cd check?
[10:56] <fedesog> mdke: it is odd, I threw away 3 cds before starting to suspect something and comparing iso and cd I saw the signature. I have another cd writer (Philips) that doesn't have the same problem. Software cd check is probably the only solution in these cases. I'll dig in the problem some more and then I'll add a note. Thank you
[11:08] <mdke> fedesog: thanks for the contribution
[18:03] <qp> hello to all. I would like to help with documentation, mostly with finnish language, are there any need for this?
[18:37] <starcraftman> qp: I'm not sure tbh, this is the doc team page on translation > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Translation
[18:57] <RunePhilosof> https://help.ubuntu.com/ is not up-to-date, it lists 9.10 as the latest stable version
[23:53] <ausimage> Can someone help me include an image in mallard formatted file?
[23:54] <ausimage> I know about the <media> tag and all but no images show when run from its directory :/


[14:16] <photon2038> Hello All.   I have a few applications that I wrote and think might benefit other people.  I already managed to package and upload them to launchpad.  What is the recommended path to get them to universe?
[14:21] <rbasak> photon2038: thanks for your interest! Are you aware of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages? Essentially, the Debian path is preferred. When a new package enters Debian, it'll get auto-synced to Ubuntu (subject to the release schedule).
[14:21] <photon2038> Thanks, I'll read it
[14:22] <rbasak> We're too late for Utopic now really. But if you get your software into Debian, it should be in time for the release after Utopic.
[14:22] <rbasak> (though Debian will enter freeze soon, too)
[14:23] <photon2038> Yeah, there's no hurry.  Just feel like a waste to have invested time in useful software without ability to share.
[14:31] <rbasak> A PPA is an excellent start.
[14:31] <rbasak> To get software into the archive though, we have to follow the release process.
[14:31] <rbasak> That's a quality standard that users except from software in the official archive.
[14:31] <rbasak> expect
[20:03] <filipsohajek> Hi
[20:05] <filipsohajek> Can i get sponsorship for package here?
[20:26] <shadeslayer> Uh .. :p
[20:31] <teward> unless i'm blind, i'm unable to find what DEB_TARGET_ARCH does in Debian package building and such - anyone got any idea?  Checked manpages, checked a google and can't see it  (related: http://askubuntu.com/questions/533789/repackaging-deb-with-an-alternate-target)
[20:33] <teward> nevermind...
[20:36] <geser> I guess DEB_TARGET_ARCH is specific to binutils only
[20:39] <teward> geser: which is what i found, after the person edited their question being specific enough :)


 Is this information provided within the database of Ubutto? If not, shouldn't we add it, to help newcomers?
[08:16] <rocket16> Oops, sorry my mistake. I saw that it is there, with !fcm command. Thanks all.
[09:17] <Misterio> Hi, I am thinking about connect to freenode via Tor. But befor ethat, I would like to know if I would have any problem when I connect to ubuntu
[09:25] <Misterio> anybody knows?
[09:38] <ikonia> !fcm
[14:48] <tsimpson> !-chown
[14:48] <tsimpson> !no chown is <alias> permissions
[14:48] <tsimpson> !no chown is <alias> permissions
[14:48] <tsimpson> !chown
[14:49] <tsimpson> !no chown is <alias> permissions
[14:50]  * tsimpson really needs to get that rewrite of Encyclopedia done
[19:14] <h00k> @btlogin
[19:15] <guntbert> Hi, I had promised to put up a wiki entry about booting into text mode. In the meantime I found above mentioned entry in help.ubuntu.com for the same purpose
[19:16] <guntbert> I promised to tsimpson about a week ago
[19:19] <h00k> gotcha, but it's already there, guntbert?
[19:20]  * h00k clicks
[19:20] <guntbert> h00k: the factoid? yes, but I want to / shall add the pointer to help.ubuntu.com
[19:20] <h00k> Oh, look. It's there.
[19:20] <h00k> guntbert: cool, it'll be reviewed by the powers that be!
[19:20] <h00k> whoever does that.
[19:21] <guntbert> h00k: thats ok with me - just wanted to keep my promise
[19:21] <guntbert> (even if it was much less work than expected
[19:21] <Pici> !nox
[19:21] <guntbert> !no nox is reply To start your system in text-only mode append 'text' (without the quotes) to the kernel line in the grub menu. You can access the grub menu by pressing Esc (Grub legacy) or Shift (Grub2) during boot. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootOptions#Text%20Mode .
[19:23] <Pici> !no nox is reply To start your system in text-only mode append 'text' (without the quotes) to the kernel line in the grub  menu. You can access the grub menu by pressing Esc (Grub legacy) or Shift (Grub2) during boot. For more info see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootOptions#Text%20Mode
[19:23] <guntbert> Pici: thx
[19:23] <Pici> !nox =~ s/  / /
[19:23] <Pici> guntbert: thank you
[19:24] <guntbert> have a nice time :)
[19:44] <bazhang> !nox
[20:18] <nhandler> !no nox is <reply> To start your system in text-only mode append 'text' (without the quotes) to the kernel line in the grub menu. You can access the grub menu by pressing Esc (Grub legacy) or Shift (Grub2) during boot. For more info see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootOptions#Text%20Mode
[20:18] <nhandler> !nox
[21:00] <ikonia> eyeballs on perlsyntax
[21:21] <bazhang> ikonia2?
[21:25] <ikonia> where ?
[21:25] <bazhang> * [ikonia2] (5c02bc0d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.<IP_ADDRESS>): <IP_ADDRESS> - http://webchat.freenode.net
[21:25] <ikonia> oh yes, not me
[21:25] <bazhang> already left #ubuntu
[21:26] <ikonia> uk user too
[21:26] <bazhang> figured it wasn't you.
[21:27] <IdleOne> that ident is familiar
[21:28] <ikonia> what ident ? he's using webchat
[21:28] <IdleOne> 5c02bc0d
[21:28] <IdleOne> unless webchat recycles
[21:28] <ikonia> BT shows nothing
[21:29] <ikonia> no harm done, not to worry
[21:34] <marienz> IdleOne: that ident is a hexed version of the ip
[21:36] <IdleOne> marienz: so possible I have seen it before
[21:36] <marienz> sure
[21:39] <ikonia> just odd a uk ip using the nick ikonia2
[21:40] <ikonia> have to keep an eye out for someone trying to pass themselves off as me
[21:40] <IdleOne> it joined as webchat
[21:40] <IdleOne> then changed to ikonia2
[21:41] <ikonia> wouldn't be the first time someone pretended to be me
[21:42] <ikonia> North west UK IP too
[21:42] <mneptok> ikonia: i dress up as you, but with a cape and utility belt. i walk around town, leaping in front of people and yelling "TO THE RESCUE!"
[21:42] <ikonia> I know the company
[21:42] <ikonia> mneptok: photos ?
[21:43] <mneptok> http://www.fotosearch.com/bthumb/IMG/IMG137/147001.jpg
[21:44] <ikonia> that's quite like me
[23:50] <maco> jpds: you get it. im stuck :(
[23:51] <jpds> maco: :(
[23:52] <maco> i just setup my own quassel core since jussi's is going away, and i didnt configure aliases in it yet
[23:52] <maco> or well... i tried to, but i tried from memory, and apparently got it wrong, since i dont have the syntax for remove in my head
[23:53] <maco> i think i figured it out, but not til after you got rid of the person


[05:33] <enyc> ItzSwirlz: hrrm familiar name =)
[18:59] <remline> Get Invovled!
[19:25] <enyc> remline: remline Get Involved to update https://ubuntu-mate.org/irc/ to no longer point to freenode?
[19:43] <Mekaneck> stop nagging about it, it will be updated when they have time
[19:44] <Mekaneck> or get involved yourself
[20:38] <enyc> Mekaneck: I've been added to ubuntu wiki editors so been able to fix others
[20:38] <enyc> Mekaneck: but this is separate ubuntu-mate.org


[00:43] <LoLface299> nevermind; installing bsd
[00:43] <LoLface299> screwed it up
[01:23] <LoLface299> poweroff
[19:35] <Ruber> Hello guys
[19:35] <Ruber> I am in real help to get lubuntu to work on my computer
[19:36] <wxl> what's up @Ruber ?
[19:36] <Ruber> i have installed both 16.04.2 and 16.10 on my usb stick with rufus
[19:36] <Ruber> and when i try to start it on my computer it will get stuck at blinking cursor
[19:37] <Ruber> cant do anything
[19:37] <wxl> i can't really vouch for rufus
[19:37] <Ruber> i have right now on the computer dual boot with windows 8.1 and linux mint but i want to format it totaly and get lubuntu for a clean install
[19:37] <wxl> i'd just use dd
[19:37] <Ruber> what is dd?
[19:38]  * wxl wonders
[19:38] <wxl> !dd
[19:38] <wxl> nope
[19:38] <wxl> it's a linux utility
[19:39] <Ruber> you mean i should do it from linux mint to the usb?
[19:39] <genii> Yes
[19:39] <wxl> i'd trust that a lot more
[19:39] <wxl> dd is a bit by bit copy
[19:39] <Ruber> okay
[19:40] <Ruber> because when i tried now on my other computer the rufus 16.04
[19:40] <genii> The ISO files are hybrid images. This means you can use dd to just copy it bit-by-bit to a USB stick and it will work
[19:40] <wxl> like i said, i can't vouch for rufus
[19:40] <wxl> it's unclear if rufus does any checking of the installation media
[19:40] <wxl> plus, you also have to make sure you check the hashes of the download iso
[19:40] <Ruber> i got to the start screen where i can click start without install and then i just got black screen
[19:41] <Ruber> okay
[19:41] <genii> !nomodeset
[19:41] <wxl> one bit of difference can lead to strange problems
[19:41] <wxl> ^^ it could also be that
[19:41] <wxl> you could also try mkusb
[19:41] <wxl> it uses dd
[19:41] <wxl> !mkusb
[19:41] <wxl> darnit ubottu you're no fun
[19:43] <Ruber> haha
[19:44] <wxl> !mkusb is <reply> mkusb is a front end to dd, the bit by bit command line utility. It is arguably the safest and most reliable solution to preparing a USB as installation media. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/mkusb for more information.
[19:46] <Ruber> okey thanks
[19:47] <genii> wxl: Hm. http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?searchon=contents&keywords=mkusb&mode=exactfilename&suite=yakkety&arch=any
[19:48] <wxl> @genii: yeah, community supported thing.
[19:48] <wxl> @genii: we seem to have no instructions on dd from what i can find
[19:50] <Ruber> this is not easy
[19:50] <Ruber> but how do i get nomodeset
[19:50] <Ruber> where do i put it in
[22:58] <musician_pro> firefox is telling me that I've not installed PulseAudio
[22:58] <musician_pro> I don't know why I have not this problem since 2 week
[22:59] <musician_pro> https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/PulseAudio/Download I went here but I don't understand how I can install it
[23:00] <lyn||ian> musician_pro, try installing from the repos with your paackage manager of choice
[23:01] <lyn||ian> if something on your firefox needs pulseaudio
[23:01] <musician_pro> ok
[23:01] <musician_pro> I try thx
[23:05] <musician_pro> I try
[23:05] <musician_pro> sudo apt-get purge firefox
[23:05] <musician_pro> and after
[23:05] <musician_pro> sudo apt-get install firefox
[23:05] <musician_pro> but nothing :(
[23:05] <wxl> @musician_pro: he means install pulseaudio
[23:07] <musician_pro> :\ ok sorry
[23:09] <musician_pro> did it <3 really thanks lyn||ian and wxl !
[23:09] <musician_pro> I'm producer and composer if you need some sounds for sound design, software or OS you are welcome.
[23:10] <musician_pro> (I really love Lubuntu)
[23:13] <wxl> @musician_pro: personally i'd suggest using jack
[23:14] <musician_pro> wxl, what do you mean for "jack"?
[23:20] <wxl> @musician_pro: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/What%20is%20JACK
[23:23] <wxl> !jack is <reply> The JACK Audio Connection Kit is a sound server meant for professional applications, allowing different audio protocols and applications to interconnect in nearly unlimited ways. This is the core of Ubuntu Studio's audio workflow. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/What%20is%20JACK for more information on JACK in general.


[00:28] <Eickmeyer> Result of the discussion was that the security team did not consider it a CVE, but did consider it a security bug. As such, I have attached a debdiff as instructed to the bug for the security team to upload to jammy-security.
[00:42] <arraybolt3> This is thinking way ahead, but when we do start thinking about Wayland support, we're going to need to start thinking about how to do screen locking without XScreenSaver. I would prefer really like if whatever solution we come up with works with X too, so that we can Get. Rid. Of. XScreenSaver.
[00:42] <arraybolt3> s/prefer//
[00:43] <arraybolt3> I like the screensavers, but I am sick and tired of things like time bombs that need to be removed from the code and junk like that.
[00:44] <arraybolt3> Maybe we can even get the screensavers from XScreenSaver to work under a different screen locking solution.
[00:47] <arraybolt3> (That would be really neat.)
[01:23] <arraybolt3> Rebooting, sec
[01:28] <arraybolt3> k back
[02:32] <kc2bez[m]> Secure boot tests out OK. I am off to stare at my pillow.
[02:32] <arraybolt3> Thanks kc2bez[m], rest well :)
[02:32] <kc2bez[m]> 👍
[02:32] <guiverc> Thanks heaps kc2bez[m] !
[02:33] <kc2bez[m]> Of course.
[02:44] <guiverc> lots of blacklist messages on sony.thingy... :(   I'll see support questions about that (how to stop..) but it boots...
[02:44] <arraybolt3> Blacklist messages? Never seen those here.
[02:45] <guiverc> I've not seen the LONG LIST before on this thingy either..  some ubuntu base change but for now I'm ignoring it.
[17:07]  * arraybolt3 grumbles and makes note to actually *remember* the encryption passphrase I provide when doing an FDE install test
[17:09] <arraybolt3> Pretty sure I used some variant of "P@ssphrase1" but I did it on a Spanish keyboard layout and it is being quite stubborn.
[17:10] <arraybolt3> Ah, because the Spanish keyboard layout puts a double quote where I am typing an at symbol.
[17:10] <arraybolt3> OK, so that's a bug to file.
[17:10] <arraybolt3> Yep, that opened it.
[17:27] <kc2bez[m]> I feel like that should be a dupe.
[17:27] <arraybolt3> I looked for dupes in Calamares and couldn't find any.
[17:27] <kc2bez[m]> It is a long standing issue in Calamares
[17:28] <arraybolt3> Hmm... maybe it's in upstream GitHub then and only now in LP.
[17:28] <arraybolt3> (I tried several search terms before filing a new bug.)
[17:28] <arraybolt3> Anyway, that was the last two tests done.
[17:28] <kc2bez[m]> It is a limitation of how minimal the environment is at that stage of the grub process
[17:29] <arraybolt3> Theoretically Calamares could change the keyboard layout when the encryption text fields are selected though, right?
[17:29] <kc2bez[m]> There are no other keyboard layouts available
[17:29] <kc2bez[m]> No, it is more complicated than that.
[17:30] <kc2bez[m]> Grub would need to be precompiled per my understanding
[17:30] <arraybolt3> Hmm. Well with the fact that LUKS1 and PBKDF1 are possibly no longer safe, we may want to get rid of encrypted /boot and then have Plymouth do the unlocking.
[17:30] <arraybolt3> (see the link I posted in -members last night)
[17:30] <kc2bez[m]> Recompiled *
[17:31] <arraybolt3> I meant that Calamares would change the live system's keyboard layout when someone clicked in the passphrase box so that they would be typing in English into that box even if they didn't know it.
[17:31] <kc2bez[m]> Same situation with that though I think the article has a good deal of FUD
[17:31] <arraybolt3> Then whatever they typed into Calamares would work in GRUB, even if they didn't know what they were typing into Calamares.
[17:31] <arraybolt3> Actually Plymouth allows you to change the keyboard layout at decryption time.
[17:31] <arraybolt3> (IIUC)
[17:32] <kc2bez[m]> Plymouth isn't loaded yet
[17:32] <arraybolt3> I meant if we stopped encrypting /boot.
[17:33] <kc2bez[m]> Oh sure but I think that is a large compromise .
[17:33] <kc2bez[m]> That was a discussed solution on the upstream bug
[17:38] <kc2bez[m]> arraybolt3: https://github.com/calamares/calamares/issues/1203
[17:38] -ubottu:#lubuntu-devel- Issue 1203 in calamares/calamares "Encryption does not work well with non-QWERTY keyboards" [Open]
[17:41] <kc2bez[m]> That was filed by one of our members and has discussion from us on the bug ^
[17:54] <arraybolt3> Looks like they aren't too keen on fixing it at all.
[17:54] <arraybolt3> I wonder what was wrong with apt-ghetto's solution of adding another key slot?
[17:55] <arraybolt3> Maybe we just need to implement it ourselves and then submit a PR.
[18:24] <arraybolt3> tsimonq2: Now that all of the tests for Lubuntu have passed, do you think it's reasonable for us to be marked as Ready at this point? Or is that something we want to wait a bit for? (I noticed ItzSwirlz already has Cinnamon marked as Ready.)
 I may be busy thursday so getting the last bits merged over for the manual might be a bit later than usual on realease day
[18:25] <arraybolt3> The entire testing checklist was knocked out last night and this morning (my time) between guiverc[m], kc2bez[m] and myself.
[18:26] <tsimonq2> lynorian: No worries
[18:27] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: Let me give everything a once-over tonight and I'll mark as ready when that's done.
[18:27] <tsimonq2> In the meantime, we need some draft release notes
[18:27] <arraybolt3> Sounds good. (Also looks like kgiii, guiverc[m] and sudodus gave the live session testing a serious workout.)
[18:28] <arraybolt3> Generally release note stuff isn't anything I've been involved with. Is that something I should start learning how to do, or would it be preferable for me to leave that to the rest of the team?
[18:28] <arraybolt3> (er, I've done some reading of release notes, but never helped write them that I can remember.)
[18:29] <tsimonq2> You're more than welcome to start on them if you get the chance at the next couple of hours before I get there
[18:30] <tsimonq2> Just remember to give it a read out loud. Make sure it's all grammatically correct. Follow RFC 2119
[18:30] <tsimonq2> Oxford comma :P
[18:31] <arraybolt3> +1, though I'm not in a spot where I can actually read things out loud so I may have to do the best I can mentally and rely on others to do that part.
[18:32] <tsimonq2> Sure. I really like Markdown but ultimately it gets converted to HTML
[18:33] <tsimonq2> Try to remember everything we've done this cycle and summarize it. Try to read a few previous iterations, a couple by me and a couple by Dan and the rest
[18:33] <arraybolt3> I'm basing the one I'm writing on the 22.10 one, is that an OK idea?
[18:33] <arraybolt3> Like I just copied everything into CodiMD and am going through and updating things.
[18:34] <tsimonq2> Sure
[19:12] <arraybolt3> Do we remember when we first started shipping a screensaver in Lubuntu, and how long that default has been Flurry?
[19:12] <arraybolt3> I'm documenting the switch to GL Matrix.
[19:14] <kc2bez[m]> Git history on - default-settings should show
[19:16] <arraybolt3> Looks like we've been using Flurry since 22.04.
[19:16] <arraybolt3> *20.04
[19:16] <arraybolt3> (heh, I'm *sure* we've been using it longer than 22.04!)
[19:19] <arraybolt3> If anyone has the time, can someone do an install of 22.10, **change the screensaver to something else,** upgrade it to 23.04, and then make sure the screensaver still works? We had XScreenSaver configuration file problems in the past and I'd like to make sure that the user-specific config file that XScreenSaver generates doesn't cause issues.
[19:19] <arraybolt3> (I'll get to it if no one else can.)
 https://forum.manjaro.org/t/why-are-non-us-keyboards-not-supported-while-prompting-for-decryption/133287 (re @lubuntu_bot: (irc) <arraybolt3> Looks like they aren't too keen on fixing it at all.)
 Same in manjaro


[00:00] <ompaul> did I mention the irish whiskey in there
[00:00] <LjL> i think you've been hit by a train of thoughts
[00:02] <ompaul> LjL, na, that would be linear, this is more like a railway station all on different tracks with only their proximity to each other being the bond, there is no other relevance.
[00:02] <ompaul> that was brought to you by the GNU station
[00:03] <ompaul> an EU funded project to smash the commissions obsession to sell peoples first born to the "Intellectual Property Monopoly Machine"
[00:03] <ompaul> yeah right
[00:05] <nalioth> so is it safe to upgrade?
[00:05] <Gary> jdong, hope you don't mind me deopping you then
[00:06] <LjL> Gary: he'll just kill you
[00:06] <ompaul> LjL, in his dreams
[00:06] <Gary> I thought he was away
[00:09] <ompaul> LjL, so the question is, why after a lovely meal in a great Chinese tonight with a my wife and her brother and sister and their spouses when someone said "Mickey Mouse" as a joke cos the next Chinese year is the year of the Mouse (or is it this one, I missed that part) did I straight away think, and utter out loud, "ohh, that one is no use, it is still bound by copyright"
[00:10] <ompaul> Pici, what were you looking for me for?
[00:11] <Pici> ompaul: some ban.
[00:11] <ompaul> ask
[00:11] <ompaul> or pm better still
[00:11] <Pici> I think PriceChild took care of it.
[00:11] <PriceChild> I didn't.
[00:12] <ompaul> bad enough me rabbiting on here about copyright
[00:12] <ompaul> :)
[00:12] <Pici> well.. they arent here.
[00:12]  * ompaul goes for scroll back
[00:12] <Pici> PriceChild: still have that pastebin? I accidentally rebooted a few times
[00:13] <PriceChild> http://pastebin.com/fa53dedd
[00:13] <ompaul> quit message
[00:14] <ompaul> took me a moment to figure out what I was at that day
[00:14] <ompaul> note what happened
[00:17] <LjL> ompaul: because the copyright on it has been extended
[00:17] <ompaul> LjL, again
[00:18] <ompaul> LjL, lets go to do geometry in egypt, just no triangles
[00:18] <ompaul> ;-)
[00:20] <LjL> ompaul: Δ
[00:21] <ompaul> LjL, :)
[00:21] <ompaul> LjL, you rock
[00:21] <LjL> you scissors
[00:23] <Pici> hmmm
[00:23] <Pici> Does anyone have a problem with me kickbanning pici_juvenile from #ubuntu?  I think thats our troublemaker chuy
[00:24] <ompaul> Pici, let me do it for you :)
[00:24] <nalioth> is he trolling (other than by nick choice)
[00:24] <LjL> you're just jealous
[00:24] <Pici> nalioth: no.
[00:24] <ompaul> LjL, water rusts sissors
[00:24] <ompaul> :)
[00:25] <LjL> Pici how'd you say it's chuyu
[00:27] <ompaul> okay I removed it
[00:27] <Pici> pici_juvinile's ident has fullmon-t's ident. plus another fullmon-t in my logs with chuy's ident and hostmask
[00:28] <Pici> I wouldnt even have noticed had it not been setting off my hilights
[00:28] <LjL> wyclif got back in - dynip
[00:28] <LjL> enigmata? i don't remember that...
[00:28] <LjL> though, yes, fullmon-t *is* chuy, i have him changing nicknames
[00:28] <Pici> #ubuntu.log:16:54 >>>> FullMon-T is now known as pici_juvenile
[00:29] <LjL> ah.
[00:29] <ompaul> have fun
[00:29] <nalioth> troll alert
[00:29] <ompaul> I am out of there, here and all irc for the moment
[00:29] <LjL> Pici: ever had a fanclub before?
[00:29] <Pici> LjL: nope.
[00:29] <nalioth> so what is the status of wyclif?
[00:29] <Pici> not enjoying it either.
[00:29] <LjL> well it's gonna be interesting
[00:29] <nalioth> is he evading?
[00:29] <PriceChild> I've never had a real fanclub
[00:30] <LjL> nalioth: well, he really should know he's still supposed to be banned, i think
[00:30] <Pici> Well.. here goes.
[00:30] <nalioth> LjL: well, let me take care of 'im
[00:30] <PriceChild> I've been here longer than pici, its unfair.
[00:31] <nalioth> let's see him get past that one
[00:32] <Pici> You banned verizon
[00:32] <wyclif> why did i get banned from #ubuntu just now????!!!!
[00:32] <nalioth> Pici: i know what i'm doing.
[00:32] <Pici> nalioth: I know you do ;)
[00:32] <nalioth> wyclif: why were you in #ubuntu just now?
[00:32] <wyclif> i was trying to find help!
[00:33] <wyclif> i didn't even get to ask my question!!!!!
[00:33] <wyclif> c'mon
[00:33] <nalioth> evading bans is not acceptable
[00:33] <wyclif> what???!!!!
[00:33] <wyclif> EVADING BANS????
[00:33] <PriceChild> calm down wyclif
[00:33] <Pici> Well, I'm going to try watching a movie.  I wonder if my fanclub will come back.
[00:33] <wyclif> ::ominous feeling:::
[00:33] <LjL> wyclif, did you get the impression that you had been unbanned, after the last talk you had with us in here?
[00:33] <LjL> i didn't think so
[00:33] <wyclif> what did i do that was wrong??
[00:34] <wyclif> i just joined the channel, that's why I thought i was unbanned
[00:34] <wyclif> pls tell me what i did that was wrong??? WHY is the #ubuntu channel so unfriendly to new people?
[00:34] <LjL> wrong impression. that was just your ISP changing your internet address under the hoods.
[00:35] <LjL> !hi | wyclif
[00:35] <ubotu> wyclif: Hi! Welcome to #ubuntu-ops!
[00:35] <wyclif> also
[00:35] <wyclif> i tried to go to ubuntu-ops earlier but nobody even acknowledged me there
[00:35] <LjL> wyclif: you didn't say a word.
[00:36] <wyclif> i just don't understand why i'm being punished
[00:36] <wyclif> eh...forget it.  Google will work for me.  or maybe I'll just switch to something else on the desktop
[00:36] <LjL> wyclif: ok
[00:37] <nalioth> alrighty then
[00:39] <wyclif> can somebody pls help me
[00:40] <wyclif> i was asked to come back here yesterday
[00:41] <PriceChild> wyclif, we were just talking to you and you left?
[00:42] <wyclif> sorry, i got frustrated.  LjL wanted me to leave anyway
[00:42] <LjL> i just said "ok".
[00:43] <LjL> wyclif, i assume you've checked your logs?
[00:43] <wyclif> can somebody help me?  i was told to come back here yesterday?  LjL yes
[00:43] <PriceChild> wyclif, i'd suggest you continue your discussion with ljl
[00:43] <LjL> yes, STML
[00:44] <LjL> wyclif: so you now understand why you were banned, if you did. correct?
[00:44] <wyclif> can anyone help me? Seveas?
[00:44] <LjL> enough
[00:46] <LjL> ooh he knows about -irc too
[00:51] <nalioth> crap
[00:52] <mneptok> connecting to Rizon? ;)
[01:15] <Jack_Sparrow> Creationist.. (seems to be the same person) with a religious nick that caused countless problems over in #Mepis, I see issues starting..
[01:15] <LjL> uhuhm
[01:15] <LjL> i heard that nick before
[01:16] <Jack_Sparrow> Just thought I would tred lightly and bring it to this room attention
[01:17] <LjL> which is one of the reasons this channel exists.
[01:18] <LjL> not in the bantracker, though. i think i merely remember someone questioning his nickname, possibly in #kubuntu, must have been quite some time ago anyway
[01:18] <nalioth> actions speak louder than nicks (in most cases)
[01:19] <Jack_Sparrow> A nick can be used to bait people as well...
[01:20] <LjL> well we certainly can't ban because of the nickname in any case
[01:20] <LjL> just highlight
[01:23] <wyclif> what happens when a user gets highlighted?
[01:25] <nalioth> wyclif: we highlight on certain words
[01:25] <nalioth> wyclif: so when folks arrive in #ubuntu using "fartknocker" as a nick, we can be pretty sure they're not here to find out how to fix their screen resolution
[01:39] <wyclif> nalioth heh!
[01:42] <ubotu> In #kubuntu, mia said: ubotu the website is not in english
[01:52] <LjL> !no source-o-matic is not available anymore, please use Software Sources (in your Applications / K menu) to configure your repositories. Do NOT enable "Proposed updates" unless you're willing to test possibly seriously flawed packages.
[01:52] <ubotu> I'll remember that LjL
[01:54] <LjL> !no gpgerr is <reply> Getting GPG errors after adding custom repositories? Find the GPG keyword for the repository (it's 437D05B5 for the standard ones) and run « gpg --keyserver hkp://subkeys.pgp.net --recv-keys <key> ; gpg --export --armor <key> | sudo apt-key add »
[01:54] <ubotu> I'll remember that LjL
[02:11] <wyclif> q
[02:11] <wyclif> ok
[02:14] <LjL> try again
[02:17] <ubotu> zenwhen called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[02:18] <Jack_Sparrow> hj.. is a problem..  do I have a second opinion
[02:20] <LjL> i've given mine
[02:20] <Jack_Sparrow> Thanks
[02:20] <LjL> Seveas: there's riotkittie in - nevermind, you aren't awake
[02:23] <LjL> banned hj from -ot, resulting in (aside from __mikem asking stupid questions)
[02:23] <LjL> [03:22:53] <hjhfi__> listen fucktard
[02:31] <hjhfi__> hey freenode said to unban me from all ubuntu channels
[02:31] <hjhfi__> ljl
[02:31] <hjhfi__> oi
[02:31] <hjhfi__> khanki
[02:31] <LjL> oh crap
[02:31] <LjL> freenode said that?
[02:31] <nalioth> LjL: no, freenode did not say that
[02:32] <Seeker`> I know what he did wrong.  Texas?
[02:37] <mneptok> this smells of Texan "diplomacy"
[02:37]  * nalioth shows mneptok a picture of mneptok
[02:37] <nalioth> mneptok: i think not
[02:37] <LjL> hjhfi__: i'm sorry but i think i will take my time to decide whether or not to comply with your kind request
[02:38] <nalioth> hjhfi__: is coming to us from CPE8af052323062-CM00194757ed42.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com
[02:38] <mneptok> oh dear. a fellow Canadian.
[02:38]  * nalioth smells mutton
 what's your point? why are you banning and destroying my ips?
[02:39] <LjL> nalioth: how do you destroy IPs? that seems like an hobby i could engage in
[02:39] <Hobbsee> nalioth: Pumpernickle is having connection trouble - can you temp-kline or something?
[02:40] <Seeker`> LjL: There aren't enough IPs as it is :(
[02:41] <Seeker`> Every time you say you like Windows, an IP address dies :(
[02:41] <hjhfi__> LjL my ip reputation which costing my isp money. 3 ip = $100
[02:42] <hjhfi__> mnetok where in the country are you ratboy?
[02:42] <hjhfi__> Ljl only if i saw yu in person
[02:44] <LjL> hjhfi__: what would you say to me?
[02:44] <nalioth> he said "good bye"
[02:44] <LjL> i see
[02:45] <Seeker`> nalioth: Would that be the kind of goodbye that involves swearing at staff?
[02:45] <nalioth> no, that would be the personal threat good bye
[02:46] <Seeker`> ah
[02:46] <ubotu> FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)
[02:46] <ubotu> FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)
[02:47] <LjL> [03:46:55] <__mikem> LjL, did you just unban the guy that was cursing at us earlier?
[02:47] <LjL> really
[02:47] <LjL> why does he have to ask about EVERYTHING i do
[02:48] <LjL> and if his client doesn't show modes, as he claimed before, how would he know i did it in the first place
[02:49] <Seeker`> I'm beginning to get really fed up with stupid people now :(
[02:49] <LjL> [03:48:46] <__mikem> You know whats really fun to do, go into a gnu channel, ask them the difference between freeware and free software, and absolutely refuse to get it no matter how many times they tell you
[02:49] <nalioth> mneptok: i want you to go visit hjhfi__ in person please, and LEER at him.  ( A picture just won't do )
[02:50] <LjL> how's that for a troll
[02:51] <Seeker`> I know how you can get people in advanced driving forums really wound up, you ask them whether or not you should go through the gears sequentially or block shift while slowing down
[02:52] <Seeker`> never done it, but i've seen it
[02:57] <nalioth> Seeker`: but is clutchless shifting more economical than using the clutch?
[02:57] <Seeker`> nalioth: you mean changing gear without using the clutch at all?
[02:58] <nalioth> Seeker`: yep
[02:58] <Seeker`> I wouldn't want to try in my own car
[02:59] <Seeker`> well, if I owned one that is
[02:59]  * Seeker` would quite like to have a gearbox with gears left
[02:59] <nalioth> once learned, it's perfectly safe and actually increases clutch life (as you don't use it)
[03:00] <Seeker`> yeah, but I wouldn't like to think how many gear boxes you would get through learning
[03:00] <Seeker`> I'm not going to try learning that yet, i've driven < 2500 miles in my life
[03:01]  * nalioth has driven hundreds of thousands of miles w/o using the clutch
[03:02] <Seeker`> how long have you been driving for?
[03:02]  * nalioth is a retired truck driver
[03:02] <Seeker`> ah
[03:03] <Seeker`> I learnt in 11 weeks last spring, did 600 miles or so in a week in august
[03:03] <Seeker`> and I hadn't been in a car again until this morning, when I did about 3 hours
[03:03] <nalioth> practice makes perfect
[03:03] <Seeker`> yeah
[03:03] <Seeker`> thats what I am hoping :D
[03:03] <nalioth> i did not start out driving w/o a clutch
[03:03] <nalioth> i was just giving you troll fodder
[03:04] <Seeker`> heh, I mainly lurk
[03:04] <Seeker`> I'm sure I could think up perfectly good trolling comments
[03:05] <Seeker`> like "People who dont pass their driving test first time shouldn't be allowed to drive"
[03:05] <Seeker`> I'm sure that would annoy more than a few peopel
[03:07]  * LjL didn't yeld at the first crossing and then immediately stalled the engine (in the middle of the corssing) after realizing
[03:07] <Seeker`> ouch
[03:09] <LjL> the second test i passed mostly because the tester didn't care and because i was given few or no roundabouts
[03:09] <Seeker`> whats wrong with roundaboutsd
[03:09] <Dave2> few or no roundabouts?! lucky you.
[03:10] <LjL> i hate roundabouts
[03:10] <Dave2> I swear all our test centres are placed right in places with loads of roundabouts. My test centre had a REALLY busy roundabout as the first thing you hit.
[03:10] <Seeker`> are there amny where you live?
[03:10] <LjL> especially in italy
[03:10] <LjL> since they haven't yet frigging decided whether the ones should should yield are the ones *entering* the roundabout, or the ones in
[03:11] <LjL> and there are roundabouts which *mix* both ways
[03:11] <Dave2> ...nice
[03:11] <Seeker`> in the UK, people on the roundabout have priority
[03:11] <Dave2> which makes sense.
[03:11] <LjL> yeah that's obviously the sane thing to do
[03:11] <LjL> however our roundabouts were mostly the other way... 'round
[03:11] <LjL> then they started changing them, but never really finished
[03:12] <Dave2> one word: "Italy"
[03:12] <Seeker`> I can cope with roundaobuts now
[03:12] <LjL> so now the idea basically is that when you you peek and see if you can spot a yield sign
[03:12] <Seeker`> its hill starts that get me
[03:12] <LjL> when you're in the roundabout you peek
[03:12] <Dave2> I'm fine with hill starts, hate roundabouts. Busy ones, that is.
[03:12]  * nalioth drove through Italy
[03:12] <Dave2> I'm fine with mostly empty ones
[03:12] <Seeker`> well, I was driving a diesel this morning, which seems to be infinately easier not to stall
[03:13] <mneptok> nalioth: no one drives in Italy. you aim and pray.
[03:13] <LjL> mneptok: aim at the pedestrian?
[03:13] <nalioth> mneptok: well, then, that's what i did.  every white-knuckle-covering-my-eyes minute of it
[03:13] <mneptok> LjL: are they a foreigner?
[03:13] <LjL> pff exaggeration
[03:14] <LjL> mneptok: they better RUN whoever they are
[03:14] <mneptok> divertente. :)
[03:15] <LjL> meh, you should see me when i'm desperate to catch a tram
[03:15] <mneptok> sexual?
[03:15] <mneptok> oh, "m"
[03:15] <LjL> ...
[03:16] <LjL> a STREETCAR
[03:16] <mneptok> O:)
[03:16] <LjL> or a bus for that matter
[03:16] <LjL> i run the same
[03:16] <LjL> subway too
[03:16] <LjL> if i can feel the train coming from pavement vibrations
[03:18] <LjL> sometimes i see the tram driver actually staring at me and making a quick mental count of my chances to reach the tram alive
[03:18] <LjL> you know, to decide whether to close the doors and go or wait
[03:19] <mneptok> ah, the "Am I A Bastard" moment.
[03:19] <Hobbsee> mneptok: for you, that question should always be answered with a "yes"
[03:20] <mneptok> Hobbsee: wait until you get the package i sent.
[03:22] <LjL> anyway what's driving in italy compared to the Magic Roundabout
[03:22] <Hobbsee> it'll got delivered to the wrong address.  australia post is excelling themselves, at the moment.
[03:22] <mneptok> Hobbsee: i just made someone in Perth very sticky, then.
[03:23] <Seeker`> eww?
[03:24] <Jack_Sparrow> Should never send ice cream sandwiches through the mail
[03:28] <mneptok> LjL: http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=51.568561,-1.80135&spn=0.002231,0.005&t=h&z=18&om=0
[03:30] <Seeker`> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&time=&date=&ttype=&q=magic+roundabout&sll=51.568511,-1.801189&sspn=0.002241,0.007167&ie=UTF8&ll=51.562852,-1.77146&spn=0.002241,0.007167&t=h&z=18&om=0
[03:30] <Seeker`> mneptok: Thats the proper one
[03:33] <mneptok> Seeker`: yeah, Swindon is crazy.
[03:33] <mneptok> Seeker`: so much so that native Andy Partridge writes songs about the roundabouts
[03:33] <Seeker`> heh
[03:53] <PriceChild> think
[05:17] <Thugacation> hi i wanna contest bans!!!
[05:44] <elkbuntu> how about you state your situation calmly
[05:44] <Thugacation> nvm
[05:44] <Thugacation> i dont wanna contest them anymore
[05:46] <elkbuntu> then you have no need to be here
[06:26] <kahrytan> Hello Ops
[06:29] <Thugacation> yo
[06:29] <Thugacation> i changed my minds
[06:29] <Thugacation> id like to contest some bans now
[06:30] <kahrytan> Ha!
[06:31] <jussi01> Hobbsee: ping
[06:36] <kahrytan> hello jussi01
[06:36] <jussi01> hi kahrytan
[06:41] <kahrytan> I don't remember you  as op
[06:41] <nalioth> kahrytan: can we help you?
[06:41] <nalioth> Thugacation: can we help you?
[06:42] <kahrytan> nalioth➲  just stopping by
[06:42]  * nalioth waves
[06:42] <kahrytan> It's been awhile since i said hi
[06:42] <Thugacation> yea man i just been chattin and chattin
[06:42] <Thugacation> i wanna contest some ban
[06:43] <nalioth> Thugacation: you've been here for over an hour and a half.  can we get on with it?
[06:44] <Thugacation> well you tell me
[06:44] <Thugacation> im not the 'ubuntu op
[06:45] <nalioth> Thugacation: this is getting repetitive.  please tell us what you want to tell us
[06:45] <Thugacation> i wanna contest sum bans
[06:45] <nalioth> Thugacation: you're repeating.
[06:45] <Thugacation> whats the next course of action
[06:45] <nalioth> we're waiting on you
[06:46] <Thugacation> to do what
[06:46] <Thugacation> i wanna contest some ban
[06:46] <nalioth> kahrytan: can we help you further?
[06:46] <kahrytan> am i still not allowed in -offtopic?
[06:46] <nalioth> are you?
[06:47] <kahrytan> i'm not going to try.
[06:47] <ubotu> stdin called the ops in #ubuntu (Thugacation abusing the bot)
[06:47] <kahrytan> might consider it ban avoidance since I changed isps
[06:47] <stdin> hmm, ubotu is being slow today
[06:48] <nalioth> lovely
[06:48] <nalioth> kahrytan: you can access the ban list just as easily as we can
[06:48] <kahrytan> I don't know how
[06:48] <nalioth>   /msg chanserv help
[06:49] <kahrytan> umm how do i read it?
[06:49] <nalioth> if there's nothing else we can do for you, kahrytan, /msg chanserv help provides some very informational reading
[06:50] <nalioth> you can play with chanserv all you like, you're not gonna break anything
[06:51] <kahrytan> chanserv doesnt do banlist
[06:52] <kahrytan> So, no I can't get -offtopic banlist
[06:53] <nalioth> kahrytan: that is very very annoying
[06:58] <kahrytan> nalioth➲  sorry about autojoin and thanks for /mode tip. However, the date in the list. thats the date ban was set?
[07:00] <nalioth> that usually is what it means, yes
[07:00] <kahrytan> I don't see any verizon ban for december so I guess i'm ubanned
[07:02] <kahrytan> nalioth➲  Did -ops have anything against me being team leader for loco?
[07:02] <nalioth> this is irc
[07:04] <kahrytan> fine.
[07:05] <nalioth> i removed all the bans for him in #ubuntu-offtopic.
[07:05] <nalioth> everyone needs a fresh start
[07:10] <Thugacation> hi id like to contest some bans
[07:11] <elkbuntu> Thugacation, when i asked you to give more information, did you?
[07:11] <Thugacation> that was you i was talking to??
[07:11] <Thugacation> i thought that was nalioth
[07:11] <Thugacation> i dont know what more information u need
[07:11] <elkbuntu> we both asked you then
[07:11] <elkbuntu> as in, where are you banned from, what did you do, do you understand why it was wrong?
[07:17] <Thugacation> oh
[07:17] <Thugacation> i was banned from #ubuntu, i was banned for "bot abuse", i understand i was wrong and other people were wrong but im the only one that got banned
[07:17] <Thugacation> ty
[07:26] <elkbuntu> i hope you're aware that other a. other people doing stuff wrong doesnt mean you have to and b. you dont see who we ban after you're banned
[07:28] <Thugacation> yeah but i know im the only one that was banned
[07:28] <Thugacation> before the ubuntu staff have something against me
[07:28] <elkbuntu> throwing accusations will not help
[07:28] <Thugacation> so anyway
[07:28] <Thugacation> id like to contest these ban
[07:29] <elkbuntu> do you understand why bot abuse is wrong?
[07:29] <elkbuntu> if so, please explain why
[07:30] <Thugacation> because ppl take the bot very seriously
[07:30] <Thugacation> and i shouldnt mess with their emotions
[07:30] <Thugacation> and im sorry
[07:31] <elkbuntu> that's not the reason at all. bot abuse is spammy to the channels, confuses people who need help, and annoys people
[07:36] <Thugacation> well
[07:36] <Thugacation> the !ops command sure is
[07:36] <Thugacation> which is what guy did
[07:36] <Thugacation> this is what i did
[07:36] <Thugacation> 	<StrangeCharm>	!botabuse > crwlr#
[07:36] <Thugacation> 	<UberDay>	gutsy gibbon
[07:36] <Thugacation> 	<StrangeCharm>	!botabuse > crwlr
[07:36] <Thugacation> 	<Thugacation>	!botabuse | your mom
[07:36] <Thugacation> 	<ubotu>	your mom: Please investigate with me only in /msg or in #ubuntu-bots (type also /msg ubotu Bot). Don't use commands in the public channels if you don't know if they really exist. Also avoid adding joke/useless factoids.
[07:36] <Thugacation> why didnt strangecharm get ban
[07:44] <Thugacation> exactly
[08:19] <elkbuntu> exactly nothing, i was off eating dinner
[08:21] <elkbuntu> you're the only one who abused the bot. strangecharm was piping a factoid to someone else, mispelled and repeated so it would work -- this is acceptable use. .. you on the other hand just used it to _try_ be funny -- this is *not* acceptable use
[08:21] <elkbuntu> so no, you do not understand proper use of the bot, why what you did was wrong, and hence i am not willing to unban you.
[08:33] <ljsmithx> :<
[08:33] <elkbuntu> ljsmithx, this is not the first time you've made a stupid 'girls on the internet' joke
[08:33] <ljsmithx> it isnt?
[08:34] <ljsmithx> Tell me the time before the last one.
[08:36] <elkbuntu> the last time, you even used the xckd comic as part of your 'joke
[08:36] <ljsmithx> what?
[08:36] <elkbuntu> you have several removes and bans in the ban logger, i'm having trouble finding the right one
[08:36] <ljsmithx> As is the language one?
[08:37] <ljsmithx> I don't understand it, Ive been awake for more than 24 hours and I have trouble understanding things like that.
[08:38] <ljsmithx> Also, how long ago was it?
[08:39] <elkbuntu> late last year afaik
[08:40] <ljsmithx> umm, I have only been running Ubuntu since 2nd of January
[08:41] <ljsmithx> and I only registered this nick on the server a few days ago
[08:42] <elkbuntu> hmm... it looks like im confusing you with another person... however, you made the exact same 'joke' as some loser late last year.. it wasnt funny then, and it wasnt funny tonight
[08:42] <elkbuntu> calling it a joke doesnt make it funny or any less offensive, just so you know
[08:42] <elkbuntu> you may go now, but since you've accumulated alot of disciplinary actions in less than a month, you may want to think about how you act in general
[08:42] <ljsmithx> I do understand what you mean
[08:44] <ljsmithx> The last time I was here was because of a bot thing. I don't hate woman or think they don't exist on the internet btw
[08:47] <elkbuntu> in between now and the last time you were here, there has been several other unrelated disciplinary actions, so just try and behave responsibly. you may leave this channel now
[08:48] <ljsmithx> OK, just one more thing, you said "and it wasnt funny tonight" implying your in aus or newzeland?
[08:49] <ljsmithx> because of the tonight thing
[08:49] <elkbuntu> im in australia
[08:49] <ljsmithx> anyway bye
[08:49] <ljsmithx> ok im in adelaide
[08:49] <ljsmithx> bye
[12:48] <ikonia> heads up on tinman claiming he's been dcc attacked and kicked off the network
[12:48] <Pici> ikonia: dc'd = disconnected
[12:48]  * Pici hands ikonia a coffee
[12:50] <ikonia> I thought he said dcc'd
[12:50] <ikonia> sorry I'll take that coffee now
[12:50] <Pici> :)
[12:51]  * jussi01 hands ikonia a cup of good coffee :)
[12:52] <ikonia> ta
[12:59] <ubotu> IdleOne called the ops in #ubuntu (fudus)
[13:03] <ikonia>  Vladt<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit ["fuck the
[13:03] <ikonia>           coca fuck the pizza, all we need is shlivoviza"]
[13:03] <ikonia> not the best part message
[13:07] <Seveas> not really
[13:07] <Seveas> where's that?
[13:07] <ikonia> Seveas: just parted #ubuntu
[13:15] <Seveas> forwarded here now
[13:16] <ikonia> coolio
[13:18] <ubotu> bidossessi called the ops in #ubuntu (bliss)
[13:31] <adub> well i am having no luck on getting my exploit thing fixed
[13:32] <adub> i did what the site said and changed irc.ubuntu.com/8001
[13:32] <adub> but no luck
[13:32] <Pici> adub: try now, the bots were a little lagged.
[13:33] <adub> test me
[13:33] <Pici> adub: try to join #ubuntu
[13:33] <adub> cool im back in
[13:34] <Pici> adub: the bots in #ubuntu-read-topic already did the testing.
[13:34] <adub> thanks pici
[14:42] <ubotu> In #xubuntu, totalwormface said: !xfcemem is <reply> A Xubuntu system will boot on less than 64Mb of memory, and will run comfortably on a machine with 128Mb or less installed. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstallingXubuntu
[14:46] <ubotu> In #xubuntu, totalwormface said: !xfcespace is <reply> A Xubuntu system needs less than 1.5Gb of hard drive space to function normally. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstallingXubuntu
[14:50] <LjL> !requirements-#xubuntu is <reply> Hardware requirements to install, boot and comfortably use Xubuntu are listed at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstallingXubuntu
[14:50] <ubotu> I'll remember that, LjL
[14:50] <LjL> !requirements > totalwormface    (totalwormface, see the private message from Ubotu)
[14:50] <jpatrick> if he's here
[14:50] <LjL> !requirements is <reply> Hardware requirements to install, boot and comfortably use Ubuntu are listed at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/SystemRequirements
[14:50] <ubotu> I'll remember that, LjL
[14:51] <LjL> !requirements-#xubuntu > totalwormface    (totalwormface, see the private message from Ubotu)
[14:51] <LjL> jpatrick: ?
[14:51] <jpatrick> LjL: the () bits
[14:52] <LjL> jpatrick: eh those are output automatically by my client, i'm not typing them
[14:52] <jpatrick> LjL: ah, right
[14:52] <LjL> !requirements-#xubuntu
[14:52] <ubotu> Hardware requirements to install, boot and comfortably use Xubuntu are listed at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstallingXubuntu
[14:52] <totalwormface> overlooked that one
[14:52] <LjL> it wasn't there
[14:52] <totalwormface> ah
[14:53] <totalwormface> well, Hobbsee also added '!xfcemem' and '!xfcedisk'
[14:53] <totalwormface> i guess they could be merged then :]
[14:53] <LjL> think they're a bit redundant
[14:54] <totalwormface> probably :P
[14:54] <LjL> !no xfcemem is <alias> requirements-#xubuntu
[14:54] <ubotu> I'll remember that LjL
[14:54] <LjL> !no xfcespace is <alias> requirements-#xubuntu
[14:54] <totalwormface> those specific questions are asked many times in #xubuntu, but i guess the requirements factoid covers it all ;]
[14:55] <LjL> totalwormface: if someone asks the memory question, it's likely they'll ask the HD question later, and vice versa
[14:55] <totalwormface> oh, btw, my nick 'totalwormage' is on the ignorelist of ubotu, i don't know why, could that be removed?
[14:55] <totalwormface> LjL: lol, yeah :P
[14:56] <LjL> totalwormface, it's not in the ignore list if we saw your factoid submissions, i think
[14:56] <totalwormface> no i mean my linked nick 'totalwormage'
[14:57] <totalwormface> notice the slight difference hehe
[14:57] <LjL> !no xubuntu is <reply> Xubuntu is Ubuntu with Xfce instead of !GNOME. More info at http://www.xubuntu.org and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/ - To install from Ubuntu: « sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop » - Join #xubuntu for support - See also: !Ubuntu and !Xubuntu-Channels
[14:57] <ubotu> I'll remember that LjL
[14:58] <LjL> well, i'll ask the bot owner
[14:58] <totalwormface> cool :]
[14:59] <totalwormface> well, thanks, and keep up the good job :D
[14:59] <LjL> !requirements =~ s/$/ - For a !flavor with lower requirements, see !Xubuntu
[14:59] <ubotu> Missing end delimiter
[14:59] <LjL> !requirements =~ s/$/ - For a !flavor with lower requirements, see !Xubuntu/
[14:59] <ubotu> I'll remember that LjL
[14:59] <totalwormface> !botmaintainerssnack
[14:59] <LjL> !flavor is <alias> flavors
[14:59] <ubotu> I'll remember that, LjL
[15:19] <white_eagle> hey, why have you banned me on #ubuntu-offtopic?
[15:19] <Pici> white_eagle: Because you sent a ctcp ping to the entire channel.
[15:19] <white_eagle> I had connection problems
[15:20] <white_eagle> I didn't did that intentionaly
[15:20] <white_eagle> I didn't even know how to do that
[15:20] <Pici> Perhaps you did /ping #ubuntu-offtopic
[15:20] <white_eagle> really?
[15:20] <jdong> why is that even a feature of IRC clients?
[15:21] <white_eagle> would you take that ban? It wasn't my intention
[15:21]  * jdong smacks LjL
[15:21] <white_eagle> to do that
[15:21] <Pici> white_eagle: It was an automatic ban.
[15:21] <white_eagle> oh
[15:22] <Pici> white_eagle: Can you make sure that in the future you don't do that? :)
[15:22] <white_eagle> yes I do
[15:22] <white_eagle> :)
[15:23] <Pici> white_eagle: Okay, you can rejoin #ubuntu-offtopic, be careful in the future :)
[16:01] <Seeker`> nalioth: ping
[16:31] <nalioth> pong, Seeker`
[16:47] <jpatrick> nalioth: is there a way one can transfer things like modes from one linked nick to another?
[16:57] <nalioth> jpatrick: all linked nicks share everything
[17:08] <jpatrick> nalioth: well, if I change to "jdavies" I lose +6u
[17:09] <nalioth> jpatrick: i can't tell (because you're not jdavies)
[17:09] <nalioth> jpatrick: are you sure it's not removing it and putting it right back?
[17:11] <jpatrick> nalioth: well, it happens only when I set jdavies as master
[17:11] <nalioth> jpatrick: the +6 is set in your client onjoin
[17:12] <nalioth> and the +u is lost because you are playing with master nicks
[17:12] <jpatrick> ah, I see
[17:37] <Jack_Sparrow> Does cobolt in ubuntu deserve a remove ?
[17:38] <nalioth> he deserves !offtopic first, if ya ask me
[17:39] <Jack_Sparrow> Tried that discretely, perhaps a more public !ot will work
[17:39] <nalioth> we start at the "assume good faith" end of the field, and work our way down it
[17:40] <Jack_Sparrow> Didnt take long for him to be back at it
[17:43] <Jack_Sparrow> Skype 2.0 with Video Chat installed without a hitch here this morning.
[18:27] <PriceChild> ardchoille deactivated himself from ubuntu cloaked people on freenode as well? What's going on?
[18:28] <Pici> Weird.
[19:00] <jussi01> Ok, so whats the usual/best way of dealing with:
[19:00] <jussi01> [20:56] *** DaveDorm is now known as Dave_AFK
[19:00] <jussi01> [20:56] < jussi01> !away > Dave_AFK
[19:00] <jussi01> [20:56] *** Dave_AFK is now known as Dave_zZzZzZzZzZz
[19:02] <Pici> I'd kick with /msg ubotu away in the reason.
[19:03] <jussi01> Pici: thanks, did just that.
[19:16] <Martian> Is talking about past wars OK in #ubuntu-offtopic? Or is a blanket ban on all wars ever? Or only all wars people still have strong feelings about?
[19:16] <Gary> what past wars?
[19:17] <Martian> The two world ones?
[19:18] <Pici> I would think it depends if you are talking history or politics.
[19:18] <Gary> I think those are classed as touchy, depends how they are approched
[19:18] <PriceChild> !o4o
[19:18] <ubotu> Some things are inappropriate for #ubuntu-ops. Controversial topics, which always turn into flamewars: war, race, religion, politics (unless related to software licencing), gender, sexuality, drugs, questionable legal activities, removing of oneself from the planet (except by space or time travel) are not for here, perhaps #off-topic or ##politics. Microsoft software in ##windows (Please note Freenode Policy) - Thanks.
[19:18] <PriceChild> war is on the list
[19:18] <PriceChild> Martian, ^
[19:18] <Pici> oh, is it now. I guess I kind of glossed over that one.
[19:19] <Martian> So even the wars during the bronze era are not allowed?
[19:19] <nalioth> Martian: what is wrong with ##history ?
[19:20] <Martian> Nothing.
[19:20] <Martian> Which I know of.
[19:21]  * Martian parts having cleared the matter up.
[19:23] <Pici> Quiet today... almost too quiet.
[19:25] <nalioth> careful what you wish for  :)
[19:26] <jpatrick> PriceChild: looks like ardchoille is off LP entirely
[19:26] <PriceChild> indeed
[19:29] <ompaul> did some low down good for nothing other than destruction troll get the better of him, he seemed reasonable
[19:30]  * ompaul invokes the protection of kraftwerk - I need more kraftwerk albums
[20:00]  * jussi01 walks in
[20:00] <jdong> jussi01: OH GOD IT ISNT WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE
[20:01] <jussi01> hehe
[20:02] <ompaul> jdong, so ehh, how did you think of that
[20:02]  * ompaul coughs
[20:02] <jussi01> jpatrick: what happened to ardchoille?
[20:02] <jpatrick> jussi01: I have... no idea
[20:03] <jussi01> ok then..
[20:03] <ompaul> jussi01, it is said I was right looking back to 7:30pm
[20:03] <ompaul> my time
[20:04] <jussi01> ok
[21:36] <ubotu> rsk called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[21:38] <ompaul> and dealt with it
[21:38] <ompaul> LjL, idea
[21:39] <ompaul> so if someone ops in the few seconds after a call for ops or is removed the bot might say - appears to be dealt with
[21:39]  * ompaul thinks LjL has nothing better to do :)
[21:41]  * nalioth suggests the New York Times crossword to ompaul
[22:04] <mneptok> ompaul: oooo ... your tolerance is low today :)
[22:04]  * mneptok hurls candy and liquor and hides
[22:05] <ompaul> mneptok, no he has been blabbering for a while and asked three times
[22:05] <mneptok> ah, i came late
[22:05] <ompaul> I don't have to be the one saying please desist
[22:05] <ompaul> your comment was funny though
[22:06] <ompaul> I checked before I ban forwarded him to -offtopic he was already there
[22:06] <ompaul> hehe
[22:06] <ompaul> my humour is querky this evening
[22:10] <nalioth> this evening?
[22:11] <SportChick> heh
[22:11] <SportChick> nalioth++
[22:12] <ompaul> nalioth, fair point, and well made
[22:13] <ompaul> did I say that out loud, drats, meant to say it under my breath
[22:13] <ompaul> ohh well
[22:13] <ompaul> :)
[22:15] <ompaul> Pici, u there or here even?
[22:17] <ompaul> Pici, can you go to the factoid factory and try to get something that says, "please don't, your first comment sufficed, continuing now seems more than futile please stop" but really nicely - for people who answer a question and then go to kill the goodness when they actually continue on with their after thoughts?
[22:17] <ubotu> MrObvious called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[22:18] <nalioth> do we not even talk to people any more?
[22:18] <nalioth> just aim and shoot?
[22:19] <ubotu> In ubotu, Mez said: !rm-rf is <reply> WARNING: someone just posted a command to do with "rm -rf" - THIS WILL DELETE EVERYTHING ON YOUR HARD DISK - DO NOT RUN THIS COMMAND!
[22:20] <Mez> nalioth, for stuff like that - aim and shoot is the best way IMO
[22:20] <Mez> though - maybe a forward here might have been appropriate
[22:21] <Mez> there.
[22:23] <ompaul> nalioth, he was asked a few times if you are talking about x-X-x
[22:23] <Mez> I think he was on about osiris
[23:16] <PriceChild> I don't like all the caps in the !hardy factoid.
[23:18] <mneptok> !hardy
[23:18] <ubotu> hardy is Hardy Heron is the code name for the next release of Ubuntu (8.04-LTS), due April 2008 - For more info, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyHeron - CONSIDER IT TO BE PRE BETA (ALPHA) SOFTWARE - Discussion and support in #ubuntu+1, NOT #ubuntu
[23:18] <mneptok> my eyes!
[23:32] <Seeker`> PriceChild: Would alternating caps be better?
[23:44] <Mez> Seeker`, pRiCeChIlD?
[23:45] <Seeker`> nah, PrIcEcHiLd is better
[23:59] <Mez> yeah, the first 3 caps letters spell PIE
[23:59] <Mez> thats always better


[17:15] <tgm4883> bkerensa, you mentioned the next shirt having the logo's of the different flavors
[17:17] <tgm4883> bkerensa, I've sent you our logo with notes
[20:23] <bkerensa> tgm4883: huh ok I will pass it along to James he already has a final logo done :)


[07:32] <seb128> goood morning desktopers
[07:36] <nteodosio> Good morning seb128, how are you doing?
[07:38] <ricotz> seb128, nteodosio, good morning!
[07:39] <ricotz> seb128, hey :), please pick up thunderbird 102.15.0 build1, tarball and builds in the usual PPA
[07:39] <seb128> ricotz, hey, how are you? did you have a good weekend?
[07:40] <seb128> ricotz, I will pick it up, thanks! I will also do the stable updates for it, next I will need to work on SRUing 115
[07:40] <seb128> upstream doesn't seem to care about https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1849509 which is annoying, I find it quite an user experience regression :/
[07:40] -ubottu:#ubuntu-desktop- Mozilla bug 1849509 in Thunderbird "From TB 115: Theme no longer integrates into the operating system theme (Linux KDE)" [--, Unconfirmed]
[07:41] <ricotz> seb128, I am fine, slow weekend, but got some sunburn :\
[07:42] <ricotz> seb128, moving 102.x forward seems essential for now which gives some more time for 115.x
[07:42] <seb128> ricotz, btw I'm just checking bu if I upload your work, you prefer the changelog style where I keep the entry under your name? or the 'dch -r' style where it would put the changelog description after a [] with your name and the bottom with mine?
[07:42] <seb128> ricotz, ack on 102.x
[07:42] <ricotz> I guess this theming issue should not be a blocker for 115 if this doesn't change within the next weeks
[07:44] <ricotz> seb128, afaik this seems to be the choice of the uploader, but if you don't change anything and just sponsor the package then keeping the original credits would be preferred
[07:49] <seb128> ricotz, ack
[11:05] <KGB-2> libadwaita pipeline Jeremy Bicha 571076 * [3 minutes and 24 seconds] running (build: pending; test-build-any: skipped; test-build-all: skipped; build i386: failed; test-crossbuild-arm64: skipped; reprotest: skipped; lintian: skipped; autopkgtest: skipped; blhc: skipped; piuparts: skipped; build source: failed; extract-source: success)
[11:18] <KGB-0> libadwaita pipeline Jeremy Bicha 571076 * [14 minutes and 53 seconds] success (piuparts: success; reprotest: success; test-build-all: success; test-build-any: success; autopkgtest: success; test-crossbuild-arm64: failed; lintian: success; build i386: success; blhc: success; build: success; build source: success; extract-source: success)
[11:28] <KGB-2> nautilus signed tags edd4a1f Jeremy Bicha upstream/45_beta2 * Upstream version 45~beta2 * https://deb.li/3XPU0
[11:28] <KGB-2> nautilus pristine-tar 2e0e1f8 Jeremy Bícha nautilus_45~beta2.orig.tar.xz.delta nautilus_45~beta2.orig.tar.xz.id * pristine-tar data for nautilus_45~beta2.orig.tar.xz * https://deb.li/NHQi
[11:29] <KGB-0> nautilus upstream/latest 1a3a25a Jeremy Bicha * pushed 117 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/zvin
[11:29] <KGB-0> nautilus upstream/latest 57b484a Ekaterine Papava po/ka.po * Update Georgian translation * https://deb.li/38Ub7
[11:29] <KGB-0> nautilus upstream/latest fd15db8 Christian Kirbach po/de.po * Update German translation * https://deb.li/HU00
[11:29] <KGB-0> nautilus upstream/latest ce49bc9 Philipp Kiemle po/de.po * Update German translation * https://deb.li/3SfS2
[11:29] <KGB-0> nautilus upstream/latest e6fd057 Baurzhan Muftakhidinov po/kk.po * Update Kazakh translation * https://deb.li/3mans
[11:29] <KGB-0> nautilus upstream/latest 3265cfe Corey Berla src/resources/ui/nautilus-window.ui * window: Adjust sidebar width * https://deb.li/3Uqvv
[11:51] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center signed tags a8176f9 Jeremy Bicha upstream/45_rc * Upstream version 45~rc * https://deb.li/3zHgj
[13:00] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 1924ae6 Jeremy Bicha * pushed 146 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/ii0kc
[13:00] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 1967c1d Alice Mikhaylenko panels/color/cc-color-panel.ui * color: Make it fit on narrow widths * https://deb.li/37Hk1
[13:00] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 6a76a8d Alice Mikhaylenko panels/applications/cc-applications-panel.ui * applications: Make it fit on narrow widths * https://deb.li/mU5d
[13:00] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master ec8a2c8 Alice Mikhaylenko panels/common/ cc-split-row.c cc-split-row.h cc-split-row.ui * split-row: Add :compact property * https://deb.li/rf9C
[13:00] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master f145e14 Alice Mikhaylenko panels/mouse/ cc-mouse-panel.c cc-mouse-panel.ui * mouse: Make adaptive * https://deb.li/jfVx
[13:00] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 13b2771 Alice Mikhaylenko panels/removable-media/cc-removable-media-panel.c * removable-media: Ellipsize app chooser buttons * https://deb.li/3D0lE
[19:16] <KGB-0> gnome-control-center signed tags 4d07695 Jeremy Bicha ubuntu/1%45_rc-1ubuntu1 * gnome-control-center Debian release 1:45~rc-1ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/3reVv
[19:16] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 0bf0d25 Jeremy Bícha debian/patches/ubuntu/diagnostics-Add-Whoopsie-support.patch * Fix rebase of the whoopsie patch * https://deb.li/yRdz
[19:16] <KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 55370d8 Jeremy Bícha debian/changelog * releasing package gnome-control-center version 1:45~rc-1ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/3Mogs
[19:35] <ricotz> seb128, and yet another thunderbird build - https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/ubuntu/thunderbird-next/+sourcepub/15093557/+listing-archive-extra and https://git.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/thunderbird/log/?h=ricotz/mantic
[20:04] <seb128> ricotz, thanks
[21:34] <KGB-0> gnome-session Jeremy Bicha 423529 * commented merge request !13 * https://deb.li/3KlFv
[22:29] <KGB-0> gnome-session David Mohammed 423530 * commented merge request !13 * https://deb.li/3ApsD


[12:36] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[19:58] <valorie> upgrade to jammy on my travel laptop last night was aces
[19:59] <valorie> might do this one tonight because something in the last upgrade or two broke my onboard camera -- computer no longer detects it has one, therefore zoom can't start it
[19:59] <valorie> i'm assuming that some driver got borked


[04:03] <Unit193> pleia2: There's also ~/.local/bin/
[06:43] <flocculant> no images again Dave :)
[08:54] <Unit193> [04:37:30] queuebot:#ubuntu-release: Unapproved: accepted xserver-xorg-video-intel [source] (xenial-proposed) [2:2.99.917+git20160325-1ubuntu1.1]
[08:56] <ochosi> \o/
[08:56] <ochosi> just saw the email
[08:56] <ochosi> (from the lp bug)
[09:02] <ochosi> https://github.com/shimmerproject/Greybird/releases/tag/v3.20.0
[09:56] <SwissBot> feed xubuntu-artwork had 20 updates, showing the latest 3
[11:09] <flocculant> ochosi: wonder how many people affected will comment the verification tag :p
[12:12] <astraljava> ochosi: flocculant: Are you referring to the intel driver bug? I just noticed it as well, will have to enable -proposed for that.
[12:35] <pleia2> if we only get one nomination, do we get an XPL again? :D
[13:04] <akxwi-dave> dave nominates Pleia2
[13:04] <akxwi-dave> :-)
[13:05] <pleia2> I need to sleep sometimes probably /o\
[13:06] <akxwi-dave> You can do that on the flight to Philly  :-)
[13:06] <pleia2> lol
[13:06] <akxwi-dave> only been their twice.. god how big is that airport
[13:06] <akxwi-dave> there*
[13:08] <SwissBot> feed xubuntu-artwork had 4 updates, showing the latest 3
[13:27] <pleia2> knome: we got a pair of really nice #LoveXubuntu submissions :)
[13:37] <pleia2> knome: there's still that one in the queue, what are we doing with it?
[14:06] <flocculant> pleia2: if we only get 1 nomination then I guess you all go to wing and a prayer :)
[14:19] <flocculant> knome pleia2 - can we possibly social media the intel test please :) https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-users/2016-August/009560.html
[14:19] <pleia2> sure
[14:21] <pleia2> flocculant: oh, should this fix the missing cursor thing for everyone?
[14:22] <flocculant> pleia2: for xenial evryone's yea :)
[14:23] <pleia2> \o/
[14:23] <flocculant> if anyone else has a problem *shrug*
[14:23] <pleia2> ok, people on the social media will be excited, so I'll have to craft this carefully
[14:23] <flocculant> pleia2: yea for sure it's \o/
[14:24] <flocculant> pleia2: I guess 'we need to test AND comment at bug # or it won't be released - no stories at bug please' :p
[14:24]  * pleia2 nods
[14:24] <flocculant> one of the times it would have been really helpful if ubuntu was affected ;)
[14:26] <pleia2> ok, posted on twitter, fb and g+
[14:26] <flocculant> flexiondotorg: I believe the intel thing affects you - you might want to check out -proposed
[14:26] <flocculant> pleia2: thanks <3
[14:35] <pleia2> my cursor survived suspend \o/
[14:36] <flocculant> \o/
[14:36]  * flocculant checks the bug ...
[14:36] <flocculant> lol
[14:38] <pleia2> my comment is there :)
[14:53] <flocculant> thanks pleia2 :)
[15:00] <flocculant> knome: at https://launchpad.net/~knome is display name your name or is name your name?
[15:00] <flocculant> launchpad succeeds in confusing the old man :p
[15:00] <flocculant> or pleia2 ^^ :)
[15:08] <flocculant> bluesabre ochosi: what's going on with bug 1598316 then?
[15:09] <flocculant> some update lands and screws things up - how does that get allowed?
[15:09] <flocculant> what can we do now?
[15:09] <flocculant> pretty sure I've had this discussion lol
[15:24]  * flocculant commented at bug
[16:22] <flocculant> got a reply - which I replied to - perhaps a comment from ochosi or bluesabre there
[16:37] <ochosi> flocculant: i'll reply to jeremy (again) and state that the bug is not fixed anywhere
[16:37] <ochosi> i think it was an oversight that it landed
[16:37] <ochosi> and the most likely way this is going to get fixed is if someone bisects murrine and finds the offending commit
[16:38] <ochosi> as it is fairly unmaintained, there shouldn't be too many updates and it shouldn't be too hard
[16:40] <flocculant> ochosi: kind of got some response - apparently it was an SRU *shrug*
[16:40] <flocculant> which I obviously knew nothing about
[16:41] <flocculant> seems xubuntu-bugs doesn't get those murrine bugs
[16:41] <flocculant> maybe worth dealing with perhaps
[16:43] <flocculant> ochosi: also - I know you've been replying there - I'd not blocked *that* bug, just the intel one :D
[16:44] <flocculant> was getting messages faster than I could read lol
[17:15] <flocculant> ochosi bluesabre - left -release and murrine to you to argue technically]
[18:01] <knome> flocculant, "Pasi Lallinaho" is my display name
[18:02] <knome> flocculant, if you go to your own page and press "Change details" it's very obvious :)
[18:14] <flocculant> knome: well that's where I went :)
[18:15] <ochosi> hmm, nice, the regression potential for the murrine patch was noticed quite early on: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk2-engines-murrine/+bug/1294699/comments/19
[18:15] <ochosi> just went on to be ignored
[18:15] <flocculant> ochosi: mmm
[18:16] <flocculant> which perhaps adds weight to us ading that package as one of ours
[18:17] <ochosi> hm, well it certainly affects us quite a lot (as long as xfce is all gtk2)
[18:17] <knome> s/all/partly/
[18:17] <ochosi> but the question in this particular case is what is more important, visual noise or the crash/es that was fixed
[18:17] <flocculant> ochosi: well
[18:18] <ochosi> and anyway, the best avenue would be to fix the fix
[18:18] <flocculant> of course
[18:18] <flocculant> but the QA issue being we didn't know about SRU
[18:19] <flocculant> well - originally :)
[18:38] <flocculant> bluesabre: not sure what time you'll be about - iso's not building due to issue with some apt python package, there was talk in -release a few hours ago - perhaps you could check that out
[18:39] <flocculant> seems the same issue is kicking out printer unless you install packagekit - at least I appeared to need to add that to get printer(s)
[21:09] <Unit193> I should likely clarify, I accepted under the presumption I wouldn't be the only one on the council. :P
[21:11] <ochosi> :D
[21:11] <ochosi> what about all the 192 other units?
[21:11] <Unit193> Not enough room in the council.
[21:22] <knome> :)
[21:22] <Unit193> Erm, anyone else hit exo?
[21:22] <knome> happy to see Unit193 being nominated
[21:22] <Unit193> knome: Because you're silly.
[21:23]  * knome dances the silly dance
[21:23] <knome> nah, even if we don't consider the fact we're silly :P
[21:24] <knome> we didn't mention in the XSD whether the candidates need to list any information and future plans
[21:24] <knome> but maybe that's not exactly needed now as the potential candidate group is people who are active anyway
[21:26] <Unit193> bluesabre: Heeey, so upgrading exo kind of screws the env.
[21:26] <ochosi> Unit193: rly? what happens?
[21:26] <ochosi> i built and installed it locally, all seemed well
[21:26] <Unit193> ochosi: Check the output of `env`, $HOME is unset in new terminals.
[21:27] <ochosi> oh fun
[21:27] <Unit193> (Note, didn't restart because shouldn't have to. :P )
[21:27] <ochosi> well i'm not sure how that would happen
[21:27] <ochosi> but then again i dont have the exo changelog in my head
[21:27] <ochosi> so i'll leave it to bluesabre, conveniently
[21:28] <Unit193> I pulled the one from xfce4-gtk3.
[21:28] <ochosi> it wasn#t there yet when i tested it
[21:28] <ochosi> i think i'm still using it
[21:28] <Unit193> dpkg -l | grep exo
[21:29] <ochosi> 0.11.0
[21:29] <Unit193> (As in, all packages are there, -helpers, etc.)
[21:34] <ochosi> Unit193: 0.11.0-0ubuntu1 for all packages
[21:35] <Unit193> ochosi: 1. Did you reboot?  2. `env` looks good?
[21:35] <ochosi> i guess i did meanwhile...
[21:36] <ochosi> but i don't remember what i did when i built it
[21:36] <ochosi> env looks good to me
[21:36] <Unit193> Time to poke a VM.
[21:36] <ochosi> anything in particular (apart from HOME) that i should be looking at?
[21:37] <Unit193> As long as it's about ~70 lines rather than about ~13, you're good. :P
[21:37]  * ochosi starts counting the lines...
[21:46] <bluesabre> my env is fine
[21:46] <knome> o hai bluesabre
[21:46] <bluesabre> I'd imagine xfce4-session would be a more likely culprit
[21:46] <bluesabre> hi knome
[21:46] <Unit193> bluesabre: Downgrading fixed it.
[21:47] <bluesabre> Unit193: well, that makes it look like the bad guy :D
[21:47] <bluesabre> I wonder what the trigger is
[21:47] <ochosi> ah right
[21:47] <ochosi> i think i had heard of that before
[21:47] <Unit193> Still might help to restart the session, but downgrading is nicer right now.  Trying it in VM of ocurse.
[21:48] <bluesabre> ah
[21:48] <bluesabre> I have exo-0.10.7 installed for -1
[21:48] <bluesabre> and 0.11.0 for -2
[21:48] <ochosi> hah
[21:48] <ochosi> fun
[21:48] <bluesabre> :D
[21:48] <ochosi> i have 0.11.0 for everything ;)
[21:48] <ochosi> and things are still fine
[21:49] <bluesabre> I'll poke around and see if I find anything
[21:56] <Unit193> VM did the same thing.
[21:57] <bluesabre> rebooting now
[21:57] <Unit193> Just restarting lightdm. P
[21:58] <Unit193> ...Now rebooting.
[22:01] <Unit193> bluesabre: Does this depend on newer xfconf or something?
[22:01] <bluesabre> Unit193: nope
[22:01] <bluesabre> Unit193: and yep, env is trashed for apps launched from whisker
[22:01] <Unit193> Rebooting the VM fixed nothing.
[22:01] <bluesabre> fine from keyboard-shortcut launched apps
[22:01] <ochosi> indeed
[22:02] <bluesabre> and in indicator applet is dead
[22:02] <ochosi> ouch
[22:02] <ochosi> never noticed, i always use kb shortcuts
[22:02] <bluesabre> so thats fun
[22:02] <bluesabre> I'll try to work on that tonight :)
[22:02] <Unit193> I don't have whisker, used kb to open it...
[22:02] <Unit193> TTY is good.  :D
[23:04] <bluesabre> :D
[23:04] <bluesabre> we'll fix it
[23:04] <bluesabre> .really4.12.1
[23:05] <Unit193> Oh gosh.. :P
[23:05] <Unit193> ...I thought about trying to delete the PPA and then re-add everything else back, buuut. :P
[23:06] <bluesabre> :D
[23:06] <bluesabre> D:
[23:06] <Unit193> (Because that's the exact version of xfconf that will work, once the panel or whatever is patched.)
[23:09] <bluesabre> gotcha
[23:09] <bluesabre> almost certain its that commit now
[23:10] <bluesabre> specifically
[23:10] <bluesabre>        /* try to run the command */
[23:10] <Unit193> Well, that'd be easy to test+revert.
[23:10] <bluesabre> -      succeed = gdk_spawn_on_screen (screen, NULL, argv, NULL, G_SPAWN_DO_NOT_REAP_CHILD | G_SPAWN_SEARCH_PATH, NULL, NULL, &pid, &err);
[23:10] <bluesabre> +      succeed = g_spawn_async (NULL, argv, envp, G_SPAWN_DO_NOT_REAP_CHILD | G_SPAWN_SEARCH_PATH, NULL, NULL, &pid, &err);
[23:11] <bluesabre> yeah
[23:11] <bluesabre> playing with it now
[23:20] <bluesabre> seemingly the correct way to do it https://osdir.com/ml/commits.gnome/2011-01/msg11044.html


[07:01] <mlankhor1t> morning
[07:05] <mlankhor1t> RAOF: I've been added to xorg-pkg :)
[07:05] <RAOF> Good morning!
[07:06] <RAOF> And has Pete got back to you regarding hardware at all?  ☺
[07:07] <RAOF> That was a bit weekendy, though.
[07:08] <RAOF> mlankhor1t: If you want review before/after you push to pkg-xorg feel free to ping us!
[07:32] <mlankhor1t> sure
[07:35] <mlankhor1t> what about packages that are identical to precise? For example if x11proto never changed
[07:39] <RAOF> mlankhor1t: I'm not sure what your question is - at the start all the packages from precise are copied into quantal, so what we've currently got is what was in precise, plus anything that we've uploaded to quantal.
[07:39] <mlankhor1t> RAOF: do they need to be reuploaded with a changelog bump for precise?
[07:40] <RAOF> Unless there's some reason why we'd want to rebuild them then there's no need.
[07:43] <RAOF> (Assuming you mean "quantal" there; if that's in regard to the precise-backports work, then we'll only be backporting things which are necessary; if, say, x11proto-xv hasn't changed between precise quantal then we don't need to backport it)
[07:43] <mlankhor1t> oh indeed I did
[07:44] <RAOF> I am the master of the semi-colon!
[07:45] <mlankhor1t> hm, not all x11 packages have ubuntu changes?
[07:45] <bryceh> most don't
[07:45] <bryceh> e.g. we don't have any changes for proto libs.
[07:45] <mlankhor1t> ah k, no point in checking those out then
[07:46] <bryceh> mainly the things we tend to change are the server, mesa, and a few drivers
[07:47] <bryceh> and 'xorg' but that's a debian package more than upstream
[07:49] <mlankhor1t> hm k
[07:50] <mlankhor1t> has there been a synch to debian then yet for all the updated x packages?
[07:53] <RAOF> We've got a bunch of updated packages; -ati, -nouveau, and a couple of other drivers that we don't have a delta on got autosyncd over the weekend.
[07:54] <mlankhor1t> ok :)
[09:33] <mlankhor1t> RAOF: shall I see if I can rebuild xserver-xorg-core then?
[09:47] <mlankhor1t> RAOF: actually what was the magic you used to automatically merge conflicts in debian/changelog?
[09:52] <tjaalton> git mergetool? i use meld
[09:52] <RAOF> mlankhor1t: dpkg-mergechangelogs in .git/info/attributes
[09:52] <RAOF> Specifically, “debian/changelog merge=dpkg-mergechangelogs”
[09:53] <tjaalton> huh, never heard of that
[09:53] <RAOF> That obviously goes for everyone else who doesn't already use it to merge changelogs with git :)
[09:54] <tjaalton> hmm I seem to have it in ~/.gitattributes
[10:00] <mlankhor1t> weird
[10:15] <mlankhorst> RAOF: I'm trying to merge debian/changelog but it filters out the most recent debian changelog entry?
[10:15] <mlankhorst> automerge*
[10:16] <mlankhorst> what's the proper way to merge it, looks wrong it's filtered out
[10:17] <mlankhorst> oh derp, some utf-8 dash was used for the -m, making it fail
[10:20] <tjaalton> are you using git mergetool?
[10:21] <tjaalton> ie. what's the next thing you do after git merge?
[10:21] <mlankhorst> I added the dpkg-mergechangelogs thing, the manpage online converted the dash for the ~/.gitconfig entry into a smart dash
[10:21] <tjaalton> i've never had conflict-free changelog merges, so have to resort to using meld every time
[10:23] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: well, it requires an entry in .gitconfig for dpkg-mergechangelogs to work
[10:23] <tjaalton> wonder why I have it in .gitattributes
[10:24] <mlankhorst> 'man dpkg-mergechangelogs' had the entry you need in ~/.gitconfig
[10:24] <tjaalton> if it's supposed to be in $git/info/attributes, then .gitattributes is the proper place and not -config
[10:24] <tjaalton> ah
[10:24] <mlankhorst> it auto merges the conflicts properly with that entry :)
[10:24] <tjaalton> well, doesn't sound like it :)
[10:25] <tjaalton> oh it needs both
[10:25] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: that was because I had some weird −m instead of -m
[10:26] <mlankhorst> i wish there was some global option for $git/info/attributes, though
[10:26] <mlankhorst> oh
[10:26] <tjaalton> ok so that's why my ~/.gitattributes doesn't work
[10:26] <mlankhorst> seems ~/.gitattributes should work
[10:27] <tjaalton> should?
[10:27] <mlankhorst>  Attributes that should affect all repositories for a single user should be
[10:27] <mlankhorst>        placed in a file specified by the core.attributesfile configuration option (see git-config(1)). Attributes for all
[10:27] <mlankhorst>        users on a system should be placed in the $(prefix)/etc/gitattributes file.
[10:28] <mlankhorst> I guess if it doesn't work for you globally.. git config --global core.attributesfile ${HOME}/.gitattributes
[10:33] <tjaalton> ok, need to try it out then :)
[10:34] <mlankhorst> I guess this shows my knowledge of git is higher than that of packaging
[10:49] <mlankhorst> RAOF: I'm updating xf86-input-synaptics atm to 1.6.1, style fixes are annoying >:(
[10:50] <tjaalton> you've pulled in git master to upstream-ubuntu?
[10:50] <tjaalton> or 1.6-branch
[10:51] <RAOF> mlankhorst: Are you starting with what's in Debian git?  IIRC one of the Debian guys has started(/finished) that for Debian.
[10:53] <tjaalton> also, http://www.bryceharrington.org/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/package_status.html
[10:53] <tjaalton> though it's not showing the quantal versions yet
[10:54] <tjaalton> the ubuntu specific upstream branches are used only when we need something newer than in debian
[10:57] <mlankhorst> RAOF: ubuntu has a lot more changes..
[10:57] <mlankhorst> at least, 01-99 is for debian only right?
[10:58] <RAOF> Right.
[10:58] <RAOF> By convention - we'd be in trouble if Debian needed 100 patches :)
[10:58] <tjaalton> what's upstream/1.6.1+
[10:58] <tjaalton> ?
[10:58] <tjaalton> a mistake?
[10:58] <tjaalton> don't push tags, btw :)
[10:59] <mlankhorst> woops
[10:59] <mlankhorst> seems so
[11:01] <tjaalton> though it's not a tag but some branch
[11:01] <mlankhorst> just kill it
[11:01] <mlankhorst> what's the exact name it shows up as ?
[11:01] <tjaalton> also, join #debian-x on oftc
[11:02] <tjaalton> you don't get the commit messages? join<EMAIL_ADDRESS>too
[11:03] <tjaalton> then you'll also get all the debian bugmail, but you can filter the commit mail separate from that
[11:03] <mlankhorst> was a wip, but accidentally did git push -a instead of quilt push -a :)
[11:04] <tjaalton> looks like git pull didn't pull it here
[11:06] <mlankhorst> i think it rejected it
[11:07] <tjaalton> maybe
[11:20] <mlankhorst> could someone look if this is correct? http://pastebin.com/zNp9hSsX
[11:22] <RAOF> mlankhorst: The debian/changelog entry should be more verbose - check one of the previous merge entries. It'll start with ‘merge from Debian unstable, remaining Ubuntu changes:’
[11:22] <tjaalton> and don't do everything in one commit
[11:22] <tjaalton> you've dropped a bunch of patches too
[11:23] <tjaalton> or at least should have I guess :)
[11:23] <tjaalton> most of which should be upstream now
[11:23] <mlankhorst> the fixes aren't in 1.6.1 yet
[11:23] <mlankhorst> 1.6.1 seems to mostly consist of a massive 'indent consistently' commit
[11:24] <mlankhorst> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/driver/xf86-input-synaptics/log/?h=synaptics-1.6-branch
[11:24] <mlankhorst> hm that might actually screw things up
[11:25] <tjaalton> so, first merge with debian, mention it in the changelog listing the whole diff, commit that, then start making changes to adapt it to whatever upstream or debian has done in the meantime
[11:25] <tjaalton> it's easier to sport mistakes then
[11:25] <tjaalton> spot even
[11:26] <mlankhorst> hm actually, seems to be diverging after that style fix
[11:29] <mlankhorst> woops, I guess it's really <IP_ADDRESS>0.0~git-20120517 not 1.6.1 :)
[11:30] <tjaalton> what we have now?
[11:31] <mlankhorst> i mean what i was working on
[11:31] <tjaalton> no
[11:31] <tjaalton> you merged from debian-unstable, so it's based on 1.6.1
[11:32] <tjaalton> at least that's what the current ubuntu branch has
[11:32] <tjaalton> and now I see cnd's update to 1.6.0-0u1, dropping the upstream patches
[11:33] <mlankhorst> hm true
[11:34] <tjaalton> in any case, it's painful to update to 1.6.1 :)
[11:35] <tjaalton> since we carry so many patches..
[11:35] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: I fixed it though
[11:36] <tjaalton> ok, if it builds and works then it's just a matter of doing the changes piecemeal imo
[11:37] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: since my changes from the debian merge are only refreshing the patches to apply, what do I have to fix? just a more verbose changelog entry?
[11:40] <tjaalton> mlankhorst: well, probably leave it UNRELEASED too
[11:40] <tjaalton> the subject looks wrong too
[11:41] <mlankhorst> I was just following the previous commit
[11:42] <tjaalton> the [PATCH] part?-)
[11:42] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: that's not part of the patch
[11:42] <mlankhorst> it's because I used git-format-patch to export it
[11:42] <tjaalton> ahh
[11:44] <tjaalton> well, like RAOF said the changelog should be more verbose, and there's no need to mention the upstream version since it's already covered in the debian update
[11:45] <tjaalton> just need to remember to include those to the source.changes when running dpkg-buildpackage/debuild (-v$previous_ubuntu_version)
[11:47] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: in that case, I just need to add in my changelog from quantal to UNRELEASED, and the fact that I refreshed the patches?
[11:48] <tjaalton> mlankhorst: yes, that would be fine
[11:49] <mlankhorst> http://pastebin.com/j9kpabeC ?
[11:50] <tjaalton> the subject should probably mention the refreshes, not the upstream version, and the changelog should have '* Merged from Debian unstable' on top
[11:50] <mlankhorst> ok
[11:52] <mlankhorst> anything else or is that it
[11:52] <tjaalton> I use debcommit -a -e, meaning that when the changelog entry has multiple lines it'll give me an editor to change the commit msg, so I'll leave the real meat in the subject and rest as details
[11:54] <mlankhorst> ok that changes git's subject to 'Update to debian unstable' though :P
[11:54] <tjaalton> drop that line :)
[11:55] <tjaalton> that would be a commit of it's own though, if you want to split it
[11:55] <mlankhorst> that was the previous commit
[11:56] <tjaalton> right
[11:56] <tjaalton> this would be 'update the changelog'
[11:56] <tjaalton> then the actual changes to patches etc
[11:56] <tjaalton> but it's not that critical, just mention the merge
[11:56] <tjaalton> in the changelog
[11:57] <mlankhorst> http://pastebin.com/bvZStqLG last attempt I hope
[11:58] <tjaalton> yes :)
[12:01] <mlankhorst> I'll see if it runs on my laptop then ask if I can get someone to upload it :)
[12:05] <mlankhorst> annoyingly, all the commits right on top of that in the upstream 1.6 branch are exactly all the bugfixes we want
[12:08] <tjaalton> yeah
[12:09] <tjaalton> you can add them as individual patches though
[12:09] <tjaalton> guess 1.6.2 isn't that far away either
[12:09] <mlankhorst> true
[12:10] <mlankhorst> I'm tempted to just do git-format-patch -o debian/patches xf86-input-synaptics-1.6.1 and commit those unrenamed (git uses 4 numbers)
[12:12] <tjaalton> you mean s/xf86-input-synaptics-1.6.1/synaptics-1.6-branch/
[12:12] <tjaalton> ?
[12:12] <tjaalton> hmm that doesn't work either
[12:13] <mlankhorst> tjaalton: no, checkout the git, then do a git format-patch relative to that tag
[12:13] <mlankhorst> :-)
[12:13] <tjaalton> ah, right
[12:13] <tjaalton> but you won't have debian/patches there :)
[12:14] <mlankhorst> hm true
[12:16] <mlankhorst> might as well
[12:16] <tjaalton> git format-patch -o debian/patches xf86-input-synaptics-1.6.1..upstream/synaptics-1.6-branch
[12:16] <tjaalton> and with --start-number 200 :)
[12:17] <tjaalton> hum no, it'll use four digits anyway
[12:18] <mlankhorst> exactly :P
[12:20] <mlankhorst> rename s/000/20/ 000?*
[12:21] <mlankhorst> do I append it to the existing changelog entry?
[12:22] <tjaalton> yes, as long as the current one is UNRELEASED
[12:22] <tjaalton> that's the point :)
[12:22] <tjaalton> then after it's uploaded a new one needs to be created
[12:23] <tjaalton> sometimes we pull an unreleased debian version, and add on top of that. then we'll change the version from -1 to -0u1
[12:23] <mlankhorst> http://pastebin.com/H3Lbefnz ?
[12:27] <tjaalton> I'd reverse the order of description / patch
[12:28] <tjaalton> also, it's enough to refer to the bug number, no need for a full url (so, fdo #nnn or such)
[12:28] <tjaalton> and would be greate if you have lp bug numbers to match
[12:28] <mlankhorst> ok
[12:28] <tjaalton> *great
[12:29] <tjaalton> those would have (LP: #nnn)
[12:34] <mlankhorst> what about bugs in redhat tracker?
[12:36] <tjaalton> so it's not on the commit msg?
[12:37] <tjaalton> if the fdo bug# is linked to rh, then it's enough to just mention the fdo bug imo
[12:38] <tjaalton> but best would be to find a match from lp and then just mention that
[12:40] <mlankhorst> true
[12:40] <mlankhorst> but there are so many resume bugs linked to synaptics hard to find the CORRECT one ;)
[12:42] <tjaalton> maybe put it in a ppa for precise and ask people to test
[12:43] <tjaalton> it's not like there's any rush pushing it to quantal yet..
[12:43] <tjaalton> or push the merge now, and test the fixes separately
[12:44] <tjaalton> or just skip the part adding lp bug refs
[12:44] <tjaalton> linux is about choice!
[12:44] <mlankhorst> k
[12:44] <tjaalton> plenty of choices here :)
[12:45] <mlankhorst> I choose not to waste more time, did a best effort search and now pushed it. ;-)
[13:54] <mlankhorst> hm.. I really need to figure out how to automatically fix all those patches to work with the coding style commit, automatically
[13:54] <mlankhorst> I have something evil in mind..
[13:56] <jcristau> coding style commits are evil
[13:59] <mlankhorst> no easy solution sadly
[14:03] <mlankhorst> I'm trying to think of ways to automate it
[14:04] <mlankhorst> best i can come up with is manually moving tree back to before big style commit
[14:04] <mlankhorst> apply each patch, rerun style change on affected files
[14:06] <mlankhorst> 29 patches that will probably all need to be restyled :\
[14:06] <mlankhorst> hm 27 debian excluded
[14:07] <tjaalton> oh speaking about the xserver now?
[14:07] <mlankhorst> yeah
[14:08] <mlankhorst> although I guess other packages are probably affected
[14:08] <mlankhorst> so I'm going to automate it :)
[14:29] <bjsnider> tseliot, have you taken a look at the changes in the 302 nvidia-settings?
[14:29] <tseliot> bjsnider: yes, and I have the relevant packaging changes in a local branch of mine
[14:31] <bjsnider> local meaning not in the cloud anywhere?
[14:32] <tseliot> bjsnider: yep, I haven't committed them yet
[14:32] <bjsnider> tseliot, could you pastebin me your rules?
[14:36] <tseliot> bjsnider: drop Drop 02_nvidia-settings-format-string.patch and here's the rules file: http://paste.ubuntu.com/999114/
[14:41] <bjsnider> looks like you pasted it twice or something
[14:41] <bjsnider> tseliot, the problem i ran into was that a lot of it is now being built into /usr/local
[14:41] <tseliot> bjsnider: I think I worked around that
[14:42] <bjsnider> the main makefile is totally different than it used to be
[14:42] <bjsnider> my solution, which i assumed was too ugly, is this: mv $(CURDIR)/debian/$(PKG_name)/usr/local/* $(CURDIR)/debian/$(PKG_name)$(PKG_libdir)/
[14:50] <tseliot> bjsnider: what I did in override_dh_auto_install does the right thing
[15:52] <mlankhorst> ok, created a dumb script to port all the patches
[16:40] <mlankhorst> bryceh: ping?
[16:54] <bryceh> hi
[16:55] <mlankhorst> was refreshing the patch series on x
[16:57] <mlankhorst> it's annoying, have to refresh literally every patch because of coding style changes
[16:57]  * bryceh nods
[16:57] <tseliot> bjsnider: sorry this is the actual debian/rules I was talking about : http://paste.ubuntu.com/999349/
[16:57] <mlankhorst> i created a script to automate it though
[16:57] <bryceh> mlankhorst, excellent
[16:57] <bryceh> mlankhorst, maybe worth adding to xorg-pkg-tools?
[16:58] <mlankhorst> bryceh: maybe, drivers might be affected too
[16:59] <mlankhorst> ah might as well
[17:53] <mlankhorst> the real scary part is that it actually builds except for the pointer barrier thresholds patch
[18:11] <Sarvatt> mlankhorst: http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~sarvatt/patches/500_pointer_barrier_thresholds.diff
[18:11] <Sarvatt> might want to run your script over that, thats refreshed for xserver 1.12 and what i use in edgers
[18:12] <Sarvatt> i didnt fix up coding style, just made it work with xserver 1.12 and made it apply
[18:12] <mlankhorst> ok
[18:13] <mlankhorst> Sarvatt: I updated all other patches for 1.12 at least :-)
[18:22] <mlankhorst> Sarvatt: blegh, I fear running indent twice produces DIFFERENT results..
[18:27] <mlankhorst> I'll just take that patch raw, easier
[18:30] <mlankhorst> Sarvatt: actuall.. what happened to the gtest parts of that patch?
[18:30] <Sarvatt> mlankhorst: oh right
[18:30] <Sarvatt> forgot i dropped that, sorry :(
[18:30] <Sarvatt> so not a direct replacement
[18:30] <mlankhorst> ok that's fine
[18:34] <mlankhorst> looks like it's just gtest parts and easy to do mself
[18:54] <tjaalton> so are we merging 1.12 soon?
[18:55] <bryceh> in quantal?  RAOF had thought we should wait a bit longer
[18:55] <tjaalton> right
[18:56] <mlankhorst> bryceh: I'm just practicing on packaging, if we need 1.12 I did a lot of the patches rebasing now. :-)
[18:56] <bryceh> yep no prob
[18:56] <tjaalton> yeah
[18:57] <mlankhorst> would still need a bump for all the input/video drivers before I could push it, though.
[18:58] <mlankhorst> should I just set up a ppa?
[18:59] <mlankhorst> hm actually, how do I just rebuild the input/video drivers against my newly built xorg-dev package
[19:00] <bryceh> yes
[19:00] <bryceh> actually I seem to recall we had a work item from UDS to do exactly that
[19:00] <bryceh> let me dig it up
[19:00] <mlankhorst> I think that was for testing lts stuff
[19:00] <bryceh> [ubuntu-x-swat] consider PPA per stable release 1.12.x 1.13.x: TODO
[19:01] <bryceh> nope, unrelated to lts
[19:01] <bryceh> want to take that work item?
[19:01] <mlankhorst> sure
[19:01] <tjaalton> probably wisest to do it once it's in quantal first
[19:02] <bryceh> there was also a discussion on ubuntu-x@ last week about it.  I was trying to rope in a community member that expressed interest in it.
[19:02] <mlankhorst> well so far x server succesfully refuses to start because of abi mismatch, but since it's succesful, ship it? :D
[19:02] <bryceh> the question raised was whether it should go into a ppa under ubuntu-x-swat or xorg-edgers.
[19:03] <mlankhorst> I vote for x-swat since it's supposed to be slightly more stable than xorg-edgers
[19:07] <bryceh> mlankhorst, ok, fine with me
[19:08] <mlankhorst> but yeah done for today, should I push the x 1.12 commit as a form of backup?
[19:09] <bryceh> pushing to git would be ok, but maybe wait on pushing to the ppa until you actually feel it's ready for people to use
[19:10] <tjaalton> also, maybe we should write a policy for all the backport ideas flying around?
[19:10] <bryceh> or push to a personal ppa if you just want to get it built experimentally
[19:10] <bryceh> tjaalton, probably a good idea, what are you thinking?
[19:11] <tjaalton> bryceh: well, i'm worried it might otherwise get a bit out of hand :)
[19:12] <mlankhorst> hopefully the x.org can be left to just a few packages only
[19:13] <tjaalton> the x.org?
[19:14] <bryceh> tjaalton, ok, would you like to draft something up?
[19:14] <tjaalton> bryceh: i might
[19:14] <mlankhorst> erm I mean the packages we have to update in the updates pocket so userspace won't suddenly break (x11proto)
[19:15] <bryceh> tjaalton, if nothing else a naming scheme would be useful
[19:15] <mlankhorst> also EOD :-)
[19:15] <bryceh> mlankhorst, enjoy :-)
[19:16] <bryceh> tjaalton, now that ppa's can be deleted and so on, I'm a lot less concerned about ppa cruft than I used to be
[19:16] <bryceh> but certainly if we set up PPAs for an LTS, they're likely to be around a long while
[19:17] <tjaalton> right, we already have a number of ppa's, so defining their function wouldn't hurt I guess, and the way they're supposed to be updated/used
[19:17] <mlankhorst> true
[19:18] <tjaalton> speaking as one who has never pushed to any of them :)
[19:18] <bryceh> hah
[19:18] <mlankhorst> bleh I'll leave channel, i want to be done so ttyall in morning :P
[19:18] <bryceh> mlankhorst, ok cya.
[19:19] <bryceh> tjaalton, there's also the distinction about what belongs with each team.  And even why we have two teams.
[19:20] <bryceh> like, I wonder if we should make one team a sub-team of the other (now that we can do that)
[19:20] <tjaalton> bryceh: oh canonical-x vs. ubuntu-x-swat?
[19:20] <bryceh> ah, three teams then :-)
[19:20] <bryceh> ubuntu-x-swat, xorg-edgers, and canonical-x
[19:20] <tjaalton> oh edgers, yeah
[19:21] <bryceh> but canonical-x is clear enough, it's the other two that feel a bit fuzzy to me
[19:21] <bryceh> *shrug* not a big deal though
[19:21]  * bryceh wanders off looking for food
[19:21] <tjaalton> well, u-x-s gets all the bugmail, which x-o probably doesn't want
[19:32] <Sarvatt> xorg-edgers is crack from git with as many ubuntu patches dropped as possible, ubuntu-x-swat is everything else, hows that confusing? :P
[19:34] <Sarvatt> xorg-edgers has always been crack from git, the confusing part is what goes where in ubuntu-x-swat because there never has been any concrete plans for the ppas outside of a "best effort" to update things in x-updates
[19:35] <Sarvatt> we had to do crack from git for nouveau, so nouveau went there before the distro
[19:38] <Sarvatt> by concrete plans i mean people interested in uploading, bjsnider has been doing x-updates for the past year and i'm trying to do stable driver releases in there but there are always transitions like an intel driver needing newer libdrm that breaks nouveau until there is a mesa release that works with it in august now..
[19:48] <bjsnider> more than the past year
[20:03] <bjsnider> Sarvatt, that reminds me, do we care about putting fglrx in x-updates at this point or is it ok for people to use the amd installer?
[20:30] <Sarvatt> oh fun, cairo in quantal is already 1.12? sucks for nouveau users :( the fixes to make cairo 1.12 usable need the libdrm-nouveau2 change, and mesa that works with that wont be released until august
[20:30] <Sarvatt> bjsnider: well the amd.com installer makes debs that work fine, my care level is low personally :)
[20:32] <Sarvatt> bjsnider: sheesh time flies by
[23:45] <Prf_Jakob> Sarvatt: Hey I saw the updated on the bug, when will the package be downloadable?
[23:46] <Sarvatt> Prf_Jakob: takes 7 days from the upload to go from precise-proposed to precise-updates and come in automatically
[23:46] <Sarvatt> its already in quantal
[23:46] <Prf_Jakob> ok
[23:47] <Sarvatt> so ~may 25th
[23:47] <Prf_Jakob> Thanks
[23:48] <Prf_Jakob> We are also going to do a release to fix bug 996821, I hoping todo that tomorrow.
[23:49] <Prf_Jakob> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/driver/xf86-input-vmmouse/ <-- there are two other fixes as well in the release but it should be safe to upgrade.
[23:50] <Prf_Jakob> But I don't know how paraniod you guys are about updating packages.
[23:51] <RAOF> Bugfix only releases can be SRUd without problems.
[23:51] <Prf_Jakob> K thanks
[23:52] <RAOF> It's once you start adding things that aren't clear bugfixes that the SRU process becomes patch cherry-picking :)