[03:35] <drumhead> Using Ubuntu Studio 10.4, JACK, linux-rt, firewire driver (FFADO), Presonus Firepod. JACK starts, but stops itself within seconds
[03:35] <drumhead> getting error: firewire ERR: Could not start streaming threads: -1, DRIVER NT: could not start driver
[03:35] <holstein> hey drumhead
[03:35]  * holstein has a firepod
[03:36] <holstein> your in luck :)
[03:36] <holstein> drumhead: open jackcontrol
[03:36] <holstein> dont start JACK yet
[03:36] <holstein> just open 'setup'
[03:36] <holstein> and uncheck the realtime box
[03:37] <holstein> then set the sample rate to 44.1
[03:37] <drumhead> ok
[03:37] <holstein> and set frames/periods to 512
[03:37] <holstein> and periods/buffer to 3
[03:38] <drumhead> done
[03:38] <holstein> after that, what is the ms latency reading down in the right?
[03:38] <holstein> lower right?
[03:38] <holstein> 60 or so?
[03:38] <drumhead> 34.8
[03:38] <holstein> that'll do
[03:38] <holstein> OK
[03:38] <holstein> close that
[03:39] <drumhead> done
[03:39] <holstein> go ahead and close JACK
[03:39] <holstein> what firewire card do you have?
[03:39] <holstein> texas intruments is the deal
[03:39] <drumhead> its a Rosewill
[03:39] <holstein> hmmm
[03:39] <holstein> do you see it in lspci ?
[03:39] <holstein> run
[03:39] <drumhead> I think it is VIA unfortunately
[03:39] <holstein> lspci in a terminal
[03:39] <holstein> and double check
[03:39] <holstein> i got a VIA thats not bad actually
[03:39] <holstein> totally useable
[03:40] <holstein> but i use TI when possible
[03:40] <drumhead> FireWire (IEEE 1394): VIA Technologies, Inc. VT6306/7/8 [Fire II(M)] IEEE 1394 OHCI Controller (rev 80)
[03:41] <drumhead> I've heard that about TI, good news about VIA though--thought I might be screwed
[03:41] <drumhead> above was from lspci, btw
[03:41] <holstein> lets go on
[03:41] <holstein> and we'll emilinate some other things
[03:41] <drumhead> ok
[03:41] <holstein> first
[03:41] <holstein> run
[03:41] <holstein> cat /proc/interrupts
[03:42] <holstein> and maybe put that in pastebin
[03:42] <holstein> what we are looking for
[03:42] <drumhead> not sure about pastebin, sorry
[03:42] <holstein> no worries
[03:42] <holstein> go to http://paste.ubuntu.com/
[03:43] <holstein> and paste your output from cat /proc/interrupts
[03:43] <holstein> and drop me the link
[03:43] <drumhead> http://paste.ubuntu.com/483215/
[03:44] <holstein> COOL
[03:44] <holstein> so
[03:44] <holstein>  17:     146391   IO-APIC-fasteoi   ohci1394
[03:44] <holstein> i read that as your firewire being off by itself
[03:44] <holstein> which is good
[03:44] <holstein> drumhead: OK
[03:44] <holstein> in a terminal
[03:44] <holstein> well...
[03:44] <holstein> before that
[03:44] <holstein> how do you have it hooked up?
[03:45] <holstein> try unplugging any other firewire gear
[03:45] <drumhead> no other firewire gear is plugged in
[03:45] <holstein> with the old freebob driver, i could have an external HD going too
[03:45] <drumhead> have bare bones
[03:45] <holstein> but now that seems to be broken
[03:45] <holstein> ANYWAYS
[03:45] <holstein> run
[03:45] <holstein> sudo qjackctl
[03:45] <holstein> and try starting jack
[03:45] <holstein> make sure
[03:45] <holstein> you have the firewire driver
[03:46] <drumhead> ok, stopped almost immediately
[03:46] <holstein> and hopefully we get the awesome blue light
[03:46] <drumhead> should I run in verbose?
[03:46] <holstein> hmmm
[03:47] <drumhead> does go blue for a few seconds
[03:47] <holstein> drumhead: run
[03:47] <holstein> uname -a
[03:47] <holstein> make sure you are booting the RT kernel
[03:47] <holstein> still should be able to run though
[03:47] <drumhead> Linux ustudio00 2.6.31-11-rt #154-Ubuntu SMP PREEMPT RT Wed Jun 9 12:28:53 UTC 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
[03:47] <holstein> if your getting the light for a second
[03:48] <holstein> im suspicious of that VIA chip then
[03:48] <holstein> i cant remember what the exact chip i had was
[03:48] <holstein> and its not in a box right now or id look
[03:48] <drumhead> the worst part is that i had it running for a couple hours last night, but with not-so-great latency in a vanilla kernel
[03:48] <holstein> hmmm
[03:49] <drumhead> installed the rt kernel today, and neither work
[03:49] <holstein> interesting
[03:49] <holstein> drumhead: well
[03:49] <holstein> i can run mine stable at around 2.4 ms
[03:49] <holstein> so you'll get there
[03:49] <drumhead> what kind of hardware to you have?
[03:49] <holstein> i had a P4
[03:50] <holstein> with a gig of ram
[03:50] <holstein> and TI chip
[03:50] <holstein> 2.4 i think
[03:50] <holstein> nothing special
[03:50] <holstein> and i got that
[03:50] <drumhead> i have another machine that i'll try next with an AMD 3800+, 2 GB ram, and a different firewire card... maybe better luck with it
[03:50] <holstein> i got a dual core box recently
[03:50] <drumhead> did the dual core help?
[03:50] <holstein> drumhead: there is a couple live discs
[03:50] <holstein> that make it easy to test
[03:51] <holstein> drumhead: i go in and run sudo qjackctl
[03:51] <holstein> and test the firepod
[03:51] <holstein> that saves some time
[03:51] <drumhead> hrm... UbuntuStudio live disc?
[03:51] <holstein> hmmm, the dual core didnt hurt :)
[03:51] <holstein> http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/
[03:52] <holstein> kxstudio is live, and very similar to ubuntu
[03:52] <drumhead> what you use?
[03:52] <holstein> i like to test with http://www.bandshed.net/AVLinux.html too
[03:52] <holstein> drumhead: i use ubuntustudio
[03:52] <holstein> and im working on a live disc for it
[03:52] <drumhead> nice
[03:53] <holstein> i gotta get a friend to help :/
[03:53] <persia> The problem with live environments is that the overlay filesystems tend to increase latency (although they are *great* for investigating look&feel)
[03:53] <holstein> i'll get it though
[03:53] <holstein> but til then
[03:53] <drumhead> well, i'm a programmer, but new to linux, would help if i would be worth anything to you
[03:53] <drumhead> :)
[03:53] <holstein> ^^ those are good
[03:53] <holstein> persia: totally
[03:53] <holstein> i just like to see if the hardware will work
[03:54] <holstein> without waiting on an install
[03:54] <drumhead> gotcha
[03:54] <drumhead> well, that makes sense
[03:54] <drumhead> you've been a great help
[03:54] <persia> holstein, It's great for that too.
[03:54] <holstein> drumhead: its do-able
[03:54] <holstein> quite nice acutally
[03:54] <holstein> drumhead: how long you had the firepod?
[03:55] <drumhead> i hope so, i don't like my windows/cubase setup... i've had it about a year and a half
[03:55] <holstein> cool
[03:55] <holstein> i used cubase/XP for years
[03:55] <holstein> i felt like someone bought me a ton of new gear though
[03:55] <holstein> when i got JACK and everything up and running :)
[03:56] <drumhead> yeah, i'm excited about learning how to use ardour and jamin, etc.
[03:56] <holstein> drumhead: check out #opensourcemusicians
[03:56] <drumhead> do you play an instrument then?
[03:56] <holstein> theres a podshow
[03:56] <holstein> and some handy info
[03:56] <holstein> drumhead: i play bass
[03:56] <drumhead> podshow?
[03:56] <holstein> drumhead: podcast?
[03:56] <holstein> audio show
[03:57] <holstein> live broadcast
[03:57] <holstein> i studied percussion in school though
[03:57] <drumhead> will check it out then
[03:57] <holstein> and switched to bass
[03:57] <drumhead> nice, where did you go to school?
[03:57] <holstein> western carolina university
[03:57] <holstein> here in the woods :)
[03:57] <drumhead> hah
[03:58] <drumhead> unfortunately i've had very little musical schooling
[03:58] <holstein> good for you :)
[03:58] <drumhead> lol
[03:59] <holstein> yeah, i dropped out when i figured out you can get paid to play
[03:59] <holstein> http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2010/03/03/new-release-from-ron-brendle-and-mike-holstein-rhizome/
[03:59] <holstein> thats the latest thing i got
[03:59] <holstein> interesting 2 bass project
[04:00] <drumhead> very cool... i have bookmarked it and will check it out when i get sound working on this stupid thing
[04:01] <holstein> drumhead: what kind of programming are you into ?
[04:01] <holstein> im sure the ubuntustudio team would be interested in that kind of help
[04:02] <drumhead> currently i work for a GIS company doing mostly C# programming
[04:03] <drumhead> but, i've been meaning to learn a bit about signal processing, etc for a while
[04:03] <holstein> and now you can
[04:03] <holstein> pure date seems cool
[04:03] <holstein> and i bet its easy if your a programmer
[04:03] <holstein> puredata*
[04:04] <drumhead> interesting. I hadn't heard of that... also bookmarked.
[04:05] <drumhead> well, thanks for all the help holstein
[04:05] <holstein> drumhead: anytime
[04:05] <drumhead> i'm sure i'll see you around here some time
[14:37] <antidonee> whats the latest version
[14:37] <antidonee> of us
[14:37] <persia> 10.04
[14:40] <antidonee> is that over a year old
[14:40] <persia> No.  Four months.
[14:42] <antidonee> whens  the next release
[14:43] <persia> October
[14:44] <antidonee> right around the cornr
[14:44] <persia> Yep.
[14:47] <antidonee> is there a beta version before the relase
[14:47] <persia> Yep.
[14:47] <persia> !schedule
[14:48] <persia> That wasn't quite what I expected :(
[14:48] <persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaverickReleaseSchedule
[14:48] <persia> Beta in just over a week.
[14:49] <antidonee> is that studioo tho
[14:49] <persia> Same archives.  Same schedule.
[14:50] <antidonee> i c
[14:53] <antidonee> wow dates on things that havent happend yet
[14:53] <antidonee> 10/10/10 on 10.10
[14:54] <persia> That's the plan.
[14:59] <antidonee> everyone is goign to throw a massive party
[15:00] <antidonee> and get loaded and be installing 10.10
[15:01] <persia> Lots of folks do that every year.  Join #ubuntu-release-party the day of release.
[15:01] <persia> (it doesn't exist before then)
[15:02] <antidonee> are the file timestmpe going to be 10:10 am   ha ha
[15:02] <persia> I doubt it, but it would be nifty.
[15:03] <antidonee> yes, 10.10  was a great idea
[15:04] <antidonee> lots of smart people around to save the day
[20:02] <Davidmp> how do i use the feisty artwork?
[20:02] <holstein> hey Davidmp
[20:02] <Davidmp> i downloaded it but i want to activate it
[20:02] <Davidmp> hey
[20:02] <holstein> try in themes
[20:03] <holstein> Davidmp: are you running 10.04?
[20:03] <Davidmp> yeah its awesome
[20:03] <holstein> system-preferences-apperance
[20:03] <holstein> and find the wallpaper
[20:03] <holstein> where ever it is
[20:04] <Davidmp> and i noticed that the ubuntu studio uses gnome as its service name
[20:04] <Davidmp> any way to change that?
[20:04] <holstein> Davidmp: service name?
[20:05] <holstein> DNS ?
[20:06] <Davidmp> no
[20:06] <Davidmp> when you first start ubuntu there are sessions
[20:06] <Davidmp> ubuntu studio is named gnome though
[20:06] <holstein> hmmm
[20:06] <Davidmp> -ill be off and on so sorry i dont answer-
[20:06] <holstein> im not sure what you mean
[20:06] <holstein> i think out there
[20:07] <holstein> you are choosing between gnome or KDE
[20:07] <holstein> or whatever LXDE
[20:30] <Davidmp> yeah brb
[20:33] <davidmp> i dont see a session for ubuntu  studio -just restarted for updates-
[20:34] <davidmp> is it just installing apps and a theme?
[20:34] <holstein> davidmp: by the time you get to that login screen
[20:34] <davidmp> mmhm
[20:34] <holstein> you can only login to ubuntu
[20:34] <davidmp> how do i get ubuntu s?
[20:34] <holstein> session lets you choose between gnome or whatever
[20:35] <holstein> ubuntu = ubuntustudio
[20:35] <davidmp> o.o it looks different
[20:35] <holstein> the studio part is just some extra meta packages of software
[20:35] <holstein> yeah
[20:35] <holstein> and a theme
[20:35] <holstein> and no network manager
[20:35] <davidmp> ive had ubuntu studio over xubuntu
[20:35] <davidmp> is that why it looks a little different?
[20:35] <holstein> so, your running XFCE?
[20:35] <davidmp> different icons etc
[20:35] <davidmp> i was i run ubuntu now
[20:36] <holstein> SO
[20:36] <holstein> how did you install ubuntu?
[20:37] <davidmp> i did a fresh install from the iso
[20:37] <holstein> from a xubuntu disc?
[20:37] <davidmp> wiped the harddisk
[20:37] <davidmp> no
[20:37] <davidmp> from a usb flsh drive using ubuntu
[20:37] <davidmp> from ubuntu.com
[20:37] <holstein> OK
[20:37] <holstein> then you added the ubuntustudio stuff
[20:37] <davidmp> yes
[20:37] <holstein> SO you've got vanilla ubuntu
[20:37] <davidmp> yes
[20:37] <holstein> gnome
[20:37] <holstein> and you added the ubuntustudio meta packages
[20:38] <davidmp> no session?
[20:38] <holstein> the session is still gnome
[20:38] <holstein> ubuntustudio just themes gnome
[20:38] <davidmp> ahh ok
[20:38] <holstein> differently
[20:38] <davidmp> i sorta like xfce version of ubuntu studio lol
[20:39] <holstein> you can run whatever widnow manager you want
[20:39] <holstein> and use the ubuntustudio software
[20:39] <davidmp> just have to install ubuntu studio meta packages correct
[20:39] <holstein> what i do
[20:39] <holstein> i tell folks to go to synaptic
[20:39] <holstein> and search ubuntustudio
[20:39] <holstein> and read about the packages
[20:39] <davidmp> mk
[20:39] <holstein> i only get the audio ones
[20:40] <davidmp> im a animator lol
[20:40] <holstein> ubuntustudio-audio
[20:40] <holstein> ubuntustudio-audio-plugings
[20:40] <holstein> ubuntustudio-audio-plugins*
[20:40] <holstein> and linux-rt
[20:40] <holstein> and ubuntustudio-controls
[20:40] <holstein> davidmp: so you dont need most of that stuf
[20:40] <holstein> f
[20:40] <davidmp> yeah
[20:40] <holstein> you probably only need ubuntustudio-graphics and ubuntustudio-video
[20:41] <davidmp> SO i can install xubuntu over ubuntu and download ubuntu studio to that?
[20:41] <holstein> OR you can just go and install the packages you want/use
[20:41] <holstein> davidmp: you can install the meta-packages into whatever
[20:41] <holstein> but the theme related ones will only work in gnome
[20:42] <holstein> i wouldnt get the theme related ones with XFCE or LXDE
[20:42] <holstein> or KDE
[20:42] <davidmp> yeah
[20:42] <holstein> you can install xubuntu
[20:42] <holstein> and run sudo apt-get install ubuntustudio-video ubuntustudio-graphics
[20:43] <holstein> thats probably all you need
[20:43] <davidmp> thank you for all your help
[20:43] <holstein> anytime
[20:43] <holstein> davidmp: you can also
[20:43] <holstein> opps
[20:43] <holstein> oh well
[20:44] <holstein> installing xubuntu-desktop would be easier :/
[22:29] <plotino> hi all
[22:29] <plotino> there is any guitar tuner in ubuntu studio?
[22:52] <plotino> anybody in?


[00:34] <TimoJJ> I am looking for a good examples of use for Bzr in Web Site developing.  I read the many doc but so much!  I look for ideas of central server that holds Production and Development repositores. And then I am checking out at my laptop somewhere else for Development then pushing to Production at central again.
[00:35] <TimoJJ> I am so much confused with to use branches or checkouts.  Good examples are nice!
[00:35] <TimoJJ> Can you help if you have time?
[00:35] <poolie> TimoJJ: maybe http://beuno.com.ar/archives/80
[00:36] <poolie> or http://wiki.bazaar.canonical.com/BazaarUploadForWebDev
[00:38] <TimoJJ> poolie: I read the second before but it also added trees.  I dont know if or no to use trees in central server.  It was more advanced right then than me.  I am looking to the other reference now also.
[00:40] <TimoJJ> poolie: These is intersting but I start in the other direction.  WIth every thing first on the central server then to check out at remote.    On the Central server I think to have /path/DirA as the Master branch that will publish on web server to public.  Then I want to work developing only at a different branch or maybe chekcout that will publish on web server only to me privatly.
[00:46] <TimoJJ> When I am happy with the private web project apparance then to push the changes to the Master branch again for the public to see.
[00:51] <jam> hi igc
[00:51] <igc> hi jam! Back from leave now?
[00:52] <jam> poolie: I just sent you an email with some of the details about the 'denormalization' stuff I was talking about. It would be nice if you could give it a look over
[00:52] <jam> igc: technically back last week, but not particularly high-availability :)
[00:52] <TimoJJ> jrib Thanks you also.  Yet the URL is for the laptop first then the server but I can make it back ways too.
[00:54] <poolie> TimoJJ: in that case you do need a tree on the server for the version exposed to the public
[00:56] <TimoJJ> poolie: So it is not to expose to the public the Master branch but a checkout of it?  The checkout is in the tree then, yes?
[00:59] <poolie> so one setup you could have is
[00:59] <poolie> a repository on the server with all your branches
[00:59] <poolie> jam: o
[00:59] <poolie> jam: ok
[00:59] <poolie> and then a separate checkout of the production branch, with a cron job to update it every hour or so
[01:05] <Peng> jam: <3
[01:06] <Peng> Loggerhead currently supports pretty old versions of bzr. Back to 1.13, IIRC. I personally don't really mind dropping <2.0 in the next release, but I always run bleeding-edge stuff anyway.
[01:07] <Peng> Plus, this is probably worth it anyway. :-\
[01:08] <Peng> beuno: Noo, I'd be a terrible maintainer. jam touched the code last, let's make him do it. :P
[01:09] <Peng> Anyway I was AFK...
[01:09]  * Peng goes back to that
[01:19] <lifeless> Peng: so tht was a 'yes' then ?
[01:45] <GungaDin> How long does bzr patch usually take to patch about 5  files?
[01:45] <GungaDin> sorry for the weird question... but for me it takes AGES!
[01:46] <lifeless> instant, I'd expect
[01:46] <lifeless> unless the files are big (megabytes)
[01:46] <lifeless> or perhaps you have a lightweight checkout of a network branch or something
[01:47] <GungaDin> no, they're just regular txt files. nothing too big.
[01:47] <Peng> lifeless: What did I just agree to?
[01:52] <lifeless> maintaining loggerhead?
[01:57] <GungaDin> my bzr on another machine doesn't recognize the command 'patch'
[01:57] <GungaDin> is it in bzrtools?
[01:57] <poolie> could be, 'bzr help patch' will tell you
[02:22] <GungaDin> how am I supposed to create the diff file to? if I want directory A to change into directory B?
[02:28] <lifeless> what do you mean
[02:36]  * igc out for a few hours
[02:47] <GungaDin> I tried to create one with diff -crB but when I try to patch --dry-run I get an error saying it can't find the file to patch (and it exists!).. so I'm doing something wrong.
[03:00] <mwhudson> is the news_merge plugin bundled with bzr
[03:00] <mwhudson> ?
[03:00] <poolie> yes, in 2.2
[03:01] <mwhudson> i guess we should be looking at upgrading lp to the 2.2 series
[03:24] <bignose> I've branched from an upstream Git repository. can I generate changesets that, when upstream adds them to their repository, will be recognised by Bazaar as the same changes I made?
[03:25] <lifeless> thats 'round tripping', and no, its not supported for bzr-git yet.
[03:25] <lifeless> however, bzr handles duplicate changes pretty well, most of the time - so it may not matter.
[03:29] <bignose> okay. is it supported for any of the foreign VCSen?
[03:30] <lifeless> bzr-svn
[03:32] <bignose> do I require commit access to upstream's Subversion repository for successful round-trip changesets?
[03:32] <bignose> or can I generate changesets that upstream can incorporate for themselves that will be round-trip changesets?
[03:32] <NfNitLoop> bignose: you'd need to be able to push your own changes for svn round-tripping.
[03:32] <lifeless> commit access, for bzr-svn
[03:33] <lifeless> I suspect git round triping, when it happens, won't require that.
[03:51] <poolie> hello bignose, lifeless, NfNitLoop
[03:52] <thumper> I wish I could go `bzr merge -i :next some/file` in a pipeline
[03:53] <NfNitLoop> poolie: H'lo!
[03:59] <bendj> Can bzr-explorer initiate/open a bzr+ssh URL?  I can easily do it from cmd line, and then have explorer 'explore' the local store ... but simply not clear how/where to specify the bzr+ssh connection IN bzr-explorer GUI.  Is it right in front of my nose, and I'm missing it?
[03:59] <poolie> Open/Location i think
[04:04] <bendj> poolie Yup, thanks.  NOT in the 'get source from elsewhere' tab.  sigh.
[04:10] <poolie> lifeless/jam: what do you think of https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/551391
[04:11] <lifeless> poolie: from the one liner it sounds interesting if it works
[04:11] <lifeless> thumper: try :next/some/file
[04:11] <thumper> lifeless: ah, thanks will try
[04:11] <poolie> mm, i think i don't have a good enough idea what data realistically helps
[04:28] <lifeless> poolie: if it got a meliae dump we can figure out what matters later
[04:29] <lifeless> but they are big
[04:29] <poolie> yes, and also we're not likely to have it in every case
[04:53] <Peng> jam: ping
[04:55] <jam> Peng: what's up?
[04:55] <Peng> jam: Hi. :D
[04:56] <Peng> jam: Wanted to ask you about Loggerhead, known_graph and statictuples.
[04:57] <Peng> Basically, I run my statictuples branch on my server, I'd like to try merging known_graph, and I was wondering what I should do about the conflicts. :D
[04:57] <Peng> I'm not sure if I had a more specific question formed when I pinged you. :P
[04:57] <Peng> jam: You wrote in a comment that you tried using StaticTuples in it. Do you still have the code? :D
[04:58] <jam> well if you have a conflict, clearly you should revert to my code :)
[04:58] <jam> I didn't to ST everywhere, but certainly inside that func
[04:59] <Peng> I had stuck compute_whole_history_data full of StaticTuples, and you rewrote the whole thing, so it conflicts everywhere. :D
[04:59] <Peng> Well, not all of it, but...
[05:00] <jam> rev 409 has some ST stuff, I think, though that might have just been the timing comments
[05:01] <jam> i can  redo it if you want
[05:01] <Peng> It doesn't have any code.
[05:01] <jam> it wasn't very hard
[05:02]  * Peng shrugs.
[05:02] <Peng> On the one hand, I'm selfish and don't want to do work. On the other hand, I also feel that's immoral. :P
[05:05] <Peng> Also -- that "What about ghosts?" comment sounds ominous. Is it likely to explode?
[05:08] <jam> Peng: http://paste.ubuntu.com/406331/
[05:09] <Peng> Oh. Thank you. <3
[05:09] <jam> I didn't explicitly test it, but the KGmerge_sort code knows how to handle ghosts
[05:10] <jam> *without* having to stirp them
[05:12] <jam> strip
[05:21] <Peng> I just pushed it to https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mnordhoff/loggerhead/statictuples_and_known_graph fwiw
[05:27] <Peng> Trying it out, it hasn't died yet. \o/
[05:33] <spm> Peng: is that a challenge for me to break it on you? no reason for asking.... >:)
[05:34] <Peng> spm: Go ahead. :)
[05:34] <Peng> It's running on http://bzr.mattnordhoff.com/loggerhead/ too
[05:34] <spm> woo!
[05:37] <lifeless> EODing
[05:38] <Peng> lifeless: See ya. :)
[05:43] <Peng> spm: BTW, the most important branch to break is lp:~jameinel/loggerhead/known_graph. The StaticTuple stuff probably isn't going to be merged any time soon anyway, so it doesn't matter as much.
[05:44]  * spm has stepped into an alternate universe where users encourage bofhs to break their work. this is wrong. WRONG i tell you!!! it's like cows pointing out which part of their anatomy is tye best to eat!
[05:45] <lifeless> spm: oh, you saw that simpsons episode?
[05:45] <spm> lifeless: was thinking hitchhikers GTTG?
[05:46] <Peng> Hey, if you don't kick the tires now, it'll fall over when it eventually gets deployed to Launchpad/
[05:46] <spm> Peng 1, spm 0
[05:50] <bendj> When creating a *shared* repo, containing multiple branches etc, is there just *one* .bzrignore file at the top level of the repo that applies to all contained branches?  or does/can each branch have its own .bzrignore?
[05:50] <Peng> .bzrignore is a branch thing.
[05:50] <Peng> Shared repos are simply a storage and performance optimization.
[05:54] <bendj> Peng Ah, so every branch gets a .bzrignore, if needed.  Do I need to include ".bzrignore" *IN* .bzrignore, or does it knwo to ignore itself?
[09:20]  * igc dinner
[12:13] <nlisgo> is there any way to get bzr to create a diff file that contains differences in binary files too?
[12:13] <nlisgo> not saying I'm going to use it, but is it possible?
[12:19] <maxb> The diff format itself has no way of representing binary files
[12:21] <Peng> Although there is git's extension.
[12:22] <Peng> nlisgo: Why? You can use "bzr send" to create a file that bundles revision data, including a diff for text files. (Binary files are just encoded in the base64 chunk at the end.)
[12:25] <nlisgo> peng: I'm working on a site that is versioned by svn. They didn't give me access to the repo but just provided me with the site files. I've versioned with bzr for my development and now want to create a patch file that can put everything in place for them
[12:25] <nlisgo> peng: can send create a patch file that can be applied using the patch command?
[12:26] <Peng> nlisgo: Probably, but mostly it's intended for bzr. Certainly nothing else supports the binary part.
[12:26] <nlisgo> bzr diff allows me to create a batch file from revision 2 to the present version. How do I do this with a send file
[12:26] <Peng> Um. Convince them to use bzr-svn? :D
[12:26] <Peng> Although if *you* didn't use bzr-svn it would still be a huge pain.
[12:27] <nlisgo> I think for ease in this instance I'm going to give them a diff genrated patch file and then just zip up the image folder
[12:27] <Peng> That sounds like a good idea.
[12:27] <nlisgo> just wanted to ask the question
[12:27] <nlisgo> bzr gets funny if file names contain a single quote
[12:28] <Peng> I doubt it.
[12:29] <Peng> Creating a file called ' works fine for me.
[12:29] <nlisgo> I tried to version a site the other day and it churned out an error when it reached so files that had been uploaded with single quotes in the filename
[12:29] <nlisgo> when I tried to commit those files to the repo
[12:30] <Peng> What kind of error?
[12:30] <Peng> Um.
[12:30] <Peng> Scratch that. What was the error message?
[12:30] <Peng> Perhaps you weren't escaping shell args properly or something.
[12:30] <Peng> Oh... Is this on Windows?
[12:30] <nlisgo> on linux
[12:31] <nlisgo> i'll try and recreate the problem again because I just deleted the files because they weren't being used
[12:31] <Peng> Ah.
[12:31] <nlisgo> i'll be back in a few minutes
[12:31] <Peng> Linux should really be fine. Bazaar doesn't do anything to arguments and the kernel and file systems aren't stupid.
[12:38] <nlisgo> couldn't recreate problem on my local machine but it might have been to do with the tree that is used when a bzr repo is initialised on the server
[12:39] <nlisgo> i'll try again later on the server
[12:39] <nlisgo> thanks for your help peng
[12:49] <Lo-lan-do> G'day all
[12:53] <Lo-lan-do> Is there a working email-on-commit plugin that I can install on a remote server?
[12:56] <Peng> nlisgo: When pushing to a server, Bazaar doesn't create a working tree. It doesn't use any unusual characters at all.
[13:09] <nlisgo> well, if I see the problem again I'll come back with the error
[13:47] <mgedmin> waaaah! either bzr or launchpad is being nasty to me
[13:47] <mgedmin> a while ago I did bzr branch lp:zodbbrowser
[13:47] <mgedmin> now I can't push back to launchpad
[13:48] <mgedmin> bzr: ERROR: RemoteRepository(bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~zodbbrowser-dev/zodbbrowser/trunk/.bzr/)
[13:48] <mgedmin> is not compatible with
[13:48] <mgedmin> CHKInventoryRepository('file:///home/mg/bzr/zodbbrowser/.bzr/repository/')
[13:48] <mgedmin> different rich-root support
[13:48] <mgedmin> sorry for the paste
[13:48] <Peng> Uh-huh.
[13:48] <mgedmin> actually, this appears to be a bound branch (aka checkout), so turns out I don't need to push
[13:48] <mgedmin> but the error message is ... confusing, to say the least
[13:49] <Peng> It's a pretty straightforward error message, just not very...explanatory.
[13:49] <mgedmin> wait, it's a lightweight checkout of a branch in my home directoryu
[13:49] <mgedmin> I was following the instructions at http://wiki.bazaar.canonical.com/GitStyleBranches
[13:49] <mgedmin> bazaar, you're not winning any friends this way
[13:50] <mgedmin> what do I do now?
[13:50] <Peng> mgedmin: Either create a non-rich-root repo and redo your revisions somehow, or get lp:~zodbbrowser-dev/zodbbrowser/trunk to upgrade to a rich-root format.
[13:52] <mgedmin> I hate people who go to a project's channel and say "you're crap, I'm switching to $ALTERNATIVE"
[13:52] <mgedmin> but now I deeply understand that urge
[13:53] <Peng> One day everyone will be on rich-root formats and this won't bite anyone anymore. Until then...yeah. :-\
[13:55] <SamB_XP> Peng: what, who's not on rich-root yet?
[13:55] <SamB_XP> I need to go byte them!
[13:55] <Peng> SamB_XP: lp:~zodbbrowser-dev/zodbbrowser/trunk apparently
[13:55] <SamB_XP> zodbbrowser, switch, if you value your neck!
[13:55] <mgedmin> I don't suppose mere mortals can upgrade repositories stored on launchpad?
[13:56]  * mgedmin tries bzr upgrade lp:zodbbrowser
[13:56] <mgedmin> wow, it's doing something
[13:56] <mgedmin> ... very slowly ...
[13:56] <SamB_XP> sure they can, if they've write access
[13:56] <Peng> mgedmin: You're in ~zodbbrowser-dev?
[13:56]  * mgedmin is
[13:56] <SamB_XP> but it's probably smarter to just steal them, convert them, and then upload them again
[13:57] <spiv> Isn't there a button in the web UI for upgrading now?
[13:57] <SamB_XP> oh, is there ?
[13:57] <Peng> Oh, right, I've heard something about that.
[13:57] <SamB_XP> who would have delayed-computation (er, that is, thunk) it ?
[13:58] <spiv> Yeah, there is.  Well, a link rather than a button.  .../+upgrade
[13:58] <mgedmin> cool
[13:59] <SamB_XP> hmm ... how come upgrade on a remote smart repo doesn't just ask the server end to do it ?
[13:59] <Peng> The developers are mean?
[13:59] <spiv> SamB_XP: because no-one has written that yet
[13:59] <mgedmin> because it's fun to have people wait at 10 kB/s
[14:00] <mgedmin> upgraded!
[14:00] <SamB_XP> spiv: good answer
[14:00] <SamB_XP> well, I mean, tolerable
[14:00] <spiv> SamB_XP: the most immediate problem is that there's not really any infrastructure for streaming progress info via the smart protocol yet
[14:00] <mgedmin> thank you, Peng and SamB_XP!
[14:01] <SamB_XP> spiv: ah, that *would* be an issue
[14:01] <mgedmin> I had no idea I could/had to upgrade repositories hosted on launchpad by myself
[14:01] <spiv> SamB_XP: the current version of the protocol supports streaming info
[14:01] <SamB_XP> mgedmin: what'd I do ?
[14:01] <mgedmin> SamB_XP, said "zodbbrowser, switch, if you value your neck!"
[14:01] <SamB_XP> lol
[14:01] <spiv> SamB_XP: just no-one has taken the time to figure out what streaming progress should look like for bzrlib (although subunit is probably a good place to look for inspiration if you're interested...)
[14:01] <mgedmin> which made me try 'bzr upgrade lp:zodbbrowser", which I trully expected to fail with "cannot do that remotely"
[14:02] <SamB_XP> the thing is that bzr is perfectly happy to do remote filesystem access when the "smart" protocol is missing a piece of functionality
[14:03] <spiv> And even some smart remote fetching, in this case, I think, but not as much as it could.
[14:04] <spiv> I'm sure that we'll fix 'bzr upgrade' via smart server before the next major format bump, but at the same time we're also not planning a major format bump any time soon.
[14:05] <spiv> It'd be very nice to fix, but there are plenty of other very nice to fix things I'd probably want to fix first.
[14:05] <spiv> e.g. commit to stacked branch
[14:06] <mgedmin> commit or push?
[14:06] <spiv> Or support resuming interrupted fetches.  Although they are both probably a bit harder, but they'd also be more valuable I think.
[14:06] <mgedmin> a friend was recently complaining that a trivial bugfix to a large repository took ages to bzr push to a new hosted branch
[14:07] <spiv> (especially now that LP has the 'upgrade' link in its UI)
[14:07] <spiv> mgedmin: that's odd
[14:07] <spiv> mgedmin: there aren't any major known issues there
[14:08] <mgedmin> it could be a case of old repository formats
[14:08] <mgedmin> schooltool is not a new project
[14:10] <spiv> Definitely worth upgrading to 2a
[14:12] <spiv> (Also, I have a patch in review that helps one of the minor known issues with pushing via non-smart server: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~spiv/bzr/smarter-index-search)
[14:13] <spiv> mgedmin: if poor performance persists after upgrading, please ask your friend to file a bug or post to the list about it.
[14:13] <Peng> Hello, jelmer's evil twin. :D
[14:14] <SamB_XP> Peng: it looks like he just changed IP address or somesuch, nothing to be alarmed by!
[14:14] <jelmer> Peng: I thought jelmer was the evil one?   I think I fixed it…
[14:22] <jelmer> Lo-lan-do: I don't think he is
[14:23] <Lo-lan-do> Who should I send the merge request to then?
[14:24] <jelmer> Lo-lan-do: Congratulations on becoming the new bzr-hookless-email maintainer!
[14:25]  * jelmer runs
[14:25]  * Lo-lan-do grumbles
[14:25] <Lo-lan-do> I guess I'll push to somewhere under pkg-bzr in Alioth :-)
[14:26] <jelmer> heh
[14:26] <jelmer> Actually, I think LarstIQ was doing some maintainance work on it recently
[14:26] <jelmer> not sure what happened to that
[14:26] <Peng> He gave up so we wouldn't make him the new maintainer. :D
[14:34] <SamB_XP> Peng: you must be more careful not to remind people of that tradition before they are drafted!
[14:35] <Peng> SamB_XP: I was already victimised today.
[14:43] <vila> morning jam, ping me when you're here
[16:06] <jam> morning vila
[16:59] <Lo-lan-do> branch.revision_history() will only return a linear sequence of revisions, right?  Not a DAG?
[16:59] <Lo-lan-do> (Still working on bzr-hookless-email)
[17:00] <james_w> Lo-lan-do: I'm pretty sure
[17:00] <Lo-lan-do> Okay, thanks
[17:00] <james_w> it's the left-hand history, you need to use branch.repository.get_graph() to look at the DAG
[17:01] <james_w> bear in mind that computing revision_history() involves loading the whole graph and sorting it, so if you care about performance and aren't doing whole-graph things then using the Graph may be better
[17:02] <james_w> sorry, doesn't involve sorting, but does mean loading a potentially large chunk of the data
[17:03] <Lo-lan-do> I'm just trying to understand bzr-hookless-email's logic when dealing with new branches or disappearing tips due to merges.
[17:04] <james_w> ok
[17:05] <Lo-lan-do> Dealing with new branches is okay, I think.
[17:05] <Lo-lan-do> Now for merges, it might make sense to use the graph indeed.
[17:06] <Lo-lan-do> There seems to be a graph.is_ancestor() method, which is good if it does what I hope it does and doesn't walk the left-hand only.
[17:06] <GaLiLe0> How does this work with or without Eclipse or VS? If there are merely plugins for these does it work without them?
[17:07] <GaLiLe0> In other words do you have to interface it with an IDE?
[17:07] <GaLiLe0> Or does it simply back up the files from the file system itself?
[17:07] <Lo-lan-do> GaLiLe0: What's "it"?
[17:08]  * Lo-lan-do uses Bazaar without an IDE
[17:08] <GaLiLe0> bzr of course
[17:08] <james_w> Lo-lan-do: it is full-history
[17:09] <Lo-lan-do> james_w: Great.  Would you know of a method to find a common ancestor to two revisions?  I can search, but if you know it offhand that's easier :-)
[17:09] <jelmer> Lo-lan-do: Graph.iter_ancestry() ?
[17:09] <jelmer> Lo-lan-do: There's also Graph.find_common_ancestor() I think
[17:09] <GaLiLe0> Lo-lan: without the IDE how do you sync to your repository?
[17:09] <james_w> not offhand, but I would expect something like jelmer suggests
[17:10] <Lo-lan-do> Thanks j*
[17:10] <Lo-lan-do> GaLiLe0: With the Bazaar commands or the Gtk interface or whatever else
[17:11] <GaLiLe0> So the plugins are unnecessary. Is there an advantage to using the plugin?
[17:13] <Lo-lan-do> Some people don't like external tools, and they prefer doing everything from their IDE.
[17:17] <GaLiLe0> it works for source code. word documents etc?
[17:17] <Lo-lan-do> It works for any kind of files, so yes.
[17:18] <Lo-lan-do> It's more efficient on text files than binary files, though.
[17:18] <GaLiLe0> binary files like WORd docs?
[17:18] <Lo-lan-do> Yes
[17:21] <GaLiLe0> do you like the Tortiose interface?
[17:22] <Lo-lan-do> I never tried it myself.
[18:09] <ejat> i got this error (server certificate verification failed. CAfile: /etc/ssl/certs/ca-certificates.crt CRLfile: none)
[19:07] <CoffeeIV> If I have a source tree retrieved from launchpad with "bzr branch lp:whatever" , can I move that directory around and have it still work, or is it's full path hardcoded into itself somewhere ?
[19:08] <Lo-lan-do> You can move it around
[19:08] <Lo-lan-do> I do that all the time :-)
[19:09] <Lo-lan-do> It sometimes gets tricky when you have a local repository because sometimes the references are using relative paths, but for standalone branches it's not a problem.
[19:10] <CoffeeIV> Thanks !
[19:22] <james_w> has anyone ever seen a tag not be sent on push?
[19:22] <james_w> commit; tag; push; with the tag not being visible at the remote end after the push?
[19:28] <james_w> hmm, it's not that
[20:57] <lifeless> moin
[21:04] <cody-somerville> Whats the easiest way to see if a branch is a decedent of some other branch?
[21:05] <james_w> cody-somerville: "bzr missing"?
[21:05] <james_w> bzr missing --mine-only should be empty
[21:05] <james_w> err, hang on, you want to know if they are related, or if they have diverged?
[21:06] <cody-somerville> If they are related
[21:06] <james_w> merge --preview might tell you
[21:09] <phinze_> this should be simple, but i'm at a loss -> "find all commits by a given committer"
[21:10]  * phinze_ needs bzr-search it seems?
[21:10]  * luks recommends bzr qlog if it doesn't have to be a command line
[21:18] <cody-somerville> What branch format do I need to use to have interoperability with 1.13.1?
[21:19] <cody-somerville> (bzr version 1.13.1 that is)
[21:19] <james_w> I think the 1.9 are the most recent supported by 1.13.1
[21:46] <exs> hi
[21:46] <exs> need helü
[21:46] <exs> i have a repo with code. someone had downloaded this repo and changed it. how to merge them together?
[21:46] <exs> but he downloaded without bzr
[21:48] <awilkins> If he downloaded the whole repository, that's still fine
[21:48] <exs> yea
[21:48] <exs> how to merge them together
[21:48] <awilkins> He will need to get the changes to you ; if you don't have common file system access or a shared server, he can send you a merge bundle
[21:48] <exs> he can zip them into a file
[21:48] <exs> then send my the zip file
[21:48] <awilkins> Yes
[21:49] <exs> and i want merge his code with my code
[21:49] <awilkins> Look at `bzr send`
[21:49] <exs> how to do this?
[21:49] <awilkins> Essentially you receive a file and you merge that
[21:49] <awilkins> Bazaar just knows what to do with them
[21:54] <exs> awilkins, can u try to explaim me how to solve the problem
[21:54] <exs> i trying to read the docu but Its difficult to understand
[21:58] <awilkins> Your friend needs to do `bzr send <branch URL>` where the URL is the original branch that you want to merge with
[21:59] <awilkins> His email client will open (if properly configured), or you can dump it to a file
[21:59] <awilkins> You take the file and merge from that as if it was a branch
[22:04] <IslandUsurper> exs, it helps if your friend commits his changes first
[22:05]  * awilkins had assumed this was true when it was said "changed (the repo)" but that's a fair point
[22:06] <jpds>  /1
[22:14] <lifeless> jpds: haha
[22:53] <cody-somerville> hmm... running bzr add results in: bzr: ERROR: exceptions.AttributeError: children
[22:53] <lifeless> cody-somerville: bzr version?
[22:54] <cody-somerville> 2.1.1
[22:54] <lifeless> and the exact command line ?
[22:59] <cody-somerville> bzr add
[23:00] <cody-somerville> lifeless, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/406738/
[23:01] <cody-somerville> I rmed a symlink and then copied over a directory with the same name.
[23:01] <cody-somerville> remvoing the directory makes bzr add work
[23:03] <cody-somerville> Seems to be bug #341555
[23:05] <cody-somerville> I'll reopen that for you.
[23:08] <lifeless> cody-somerville: 'bzr add', not 'bzr add path' ?
[23:08] <cody-somerville> both throw the exception
[23:08] <lifeless> cody-somerville: please don't reopen fix released bugs
[23:08] <lifeless> open a new bug
[23:08] <cody-somerville> too late :(
[23:09] <cody-somerville> I attached my crash report and everything.
[23:09] <lifeless> ugh
[23:09] <lifeless> its almost certainly different, because we unit test things quite thoroughly
[23:10] <cody-somerville> It looks like maybe the bug just got closed because it was for 1.6.1.
[23:11] <cody-somerville> fyi, it works when if you replace the symlink with a file and not a directory
[23:14] <lifeless> I suspect if you run 'bzr st' first it will work too
[23:17] <AfC> oh dear
[23:17] <AfC> worthil ~/vcs/java-gnome/mainline $ bzr pull
[23:17] <AfC> Using saved parent location: /home/andrew/src/java-gnome/mainline/
[23:17] <AfC> bzr: ERROR: No such file: u'/home/andrew/vcs/java-gnome/.bzr/repository/obsolete_packs/': [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/home/andrew/vcs/java-gnome/.bzr/repository/obsolete_packs/'
[23:18] <cody-somerville> lifeless, how wonderful. it does!
[23:18] <exs> hi
[23:18] <exs> i need help
[23:18] <exs> i executed bzr uncommit
[23:18] <exs> and he deleted all my new changes
[23:18] <AfC> a second `bzr pull` succeeds
[23:18] <exs> can i undo bzr uncommit?
[23:19] <lifeless> AfC: someone deleted that dir, make it by hand
[23:19] <lifeless> exs: yes, it will have printed instructions when you ran it
[23:19] <lifeless> exs: follow those instructions
[23:19] <exs> these structions are away
[23:20] <AfC> lifeless: fine. Perhaps bzr should just make such a directory on demand? Floating around here for a while now has been "yes it's ok to delete obselete_packs to save Gigs of disk space" so it'll be a common case
[23:21] <exs> lifeless, did he saved something?
[23:46] <mathrick> hey guys, I just pushed a branch over sftp, and it created some files with 600 perms
[23:46] <mathrick> -rw-r--r-- 1 mathrick mathrick   35 2010-03-24 04:44 branch-format
[23:46] <mathrick> errr
[23:46] <mathrick> wait
[23:46]  * mathrick can't read
[23:48] <lifeless> mathrick: that looks like 644 to me :P
[23:48] <mathrick> yes, I know
[23:48] <lifeless> AfC: making the directory is another round trip; we've only ever said its ok to delete the *contents* and then only if you have done sync.
[23:49] <mathrick> I was going off on a bzr: ERROR: Transport error: Server refuses to fulfill the request (403 Forbidden) for http://sei.meidokon.net/repo/thesis/report/.bzr/branch-format
[23:49] <poolie> good morning
[23:49] <mathrick> the client that gives that is 1.15.1
[23:49] <mathrick> poolie: good midnight :)
[23:54] <mathrick> lifeless: so the error is completely bogus, but I can read it fine with 2.1, so I guess it's just "1.15.1 horribly broken when it encounters an unknown repo format"
[23:54] <mathrick> 1.3 correctly barfs on unknown format, FWIW
[23:56] <mwhudson> igc: now fix all the loggerhead bugs!!
[23:56] <igc> mwhudson: wow - that's service!
[23:56] <igc> I only applied for membership 30 seconds ago :-)
[23:57] <mwhudson> i guess i saw the mail as it arrived by chance
[23:59] <lifeless> mathrick: interesting
[23:59] <AfC> lifeless: right, but surely if the write failes you can check for the directory's existence and just mkdir the damn thing rather than failing back to the user
[23:59] <lifeless> AfC: we can try I guess, but error handling like that tends to go wrong IME
[23:59] <poolie> rebooting


[03:26] <karGa> selamlar
[14:14] <motdd> merhaba
[14:14] <motdd> The command could not be located because '/bin' is not included in the PATH envi                ronment variable.
[14:14] <motdd> ls: command not found
[14:14] <motdd> ubuntu kullanýyorum
[14:14] <motdd> sanýrým þu dosya ile oynadým
[14:15] <motdd> ~/.bashrc
[14:15] <motdd> nano ile ulaþamýyorum
[14:15] <motdd> nano ~/.bashrc
[14:19] <motdd> kimse var mý
[14:36] <dsec> Selam motdd
[14:36] <dsec> tüh tam yazacaktım çıkmışsın kardeş :>
[14:37] <dsec> https://gist.githubusercontent.com/marioBonales/1637696/raw/337f7b60d4e3d9e887a0206dec6a737e94cdd


[00:03] <rogerthebird> hello fellow xubuntu users
[00:04] <XRS1> hi
[00:04] <rogerthebird> at least someone around here is talking
[00:04] <rogerthebird> Got a question.
[00:05] <rogerthebird> I'm using the Albatross GTK+ theme, and I would like to change the text color of dialogs so I can read them better. Is there any way I can do this?
[00:20] <XRS1> looks like its controlled by css files in /usr/share/themes/
[00:21] <XRS1> .....
[00:21] <XRS1> well at least now I know
[00:35] <xubuntu422> hi people. I would like to ask a question. How can I recover my friends Xubuntu? I haven't got experience with this system so please can anybody help me? cheers
[00:36] <XRS1> whats going on?
[00:37] <xubuntu422> apparently he installed updates and since than He cannot start the system.. It just freezes while it's loading
[00:37] <XRS1> what i would do is make  boot the computer with a live USB, create a folder called bak in the root of the drive, move his personal files to /bak;  erase all other folders, reinstall xubuntu, then move his files back where they go
[00:37] <XRS1> dont format
[00:38] <XRS1> just reinstall after deleting everything but what u want saved
[00:38] <XRS1> easiest solution
[00:39] <xubuntu422> ok and can I make the same thing with a Xubuntu Installation CD?
[00:39] <XRS1> yes you can do that with the xubuntu install CD
[00:39] <xubuntu422> and than plug in the USB
[00:40] <XRS1> you can use the CD or you can make an .ISO of the CD and "burn" it to iso
[00:40] <XRS1> "burn" to USB*
[00:41] <XRS1> or download the xubuntu .ISO and "burn" that to USB
[00:42] <xubuntu422> because that is what I have tried but I could not access some of his files.. it just told me that I have not the access right or something like that
[00:42] <XRS1> open a terminal and type gksudo thunar
[00:42] <xubuntu422> whoo  :) terminal what is that?
[00:43] <XRS1> that will open the file manager as root.  if you move the files as root, they will belong to root, you will have to then open a terminal and paste this:
[00:43] <XRS1> sudo chown nobody.nogroup /bak -Rv
[00:43] <XRS1> to open a terminal go to the "Start" menu -> Terminal Emulator
[00:45] <XRS1> the "sudo chown nobody.nogroup /bak -Rv" command will make everying in the /bak folder belong to no one so you dont have to worry about ownership restrictions on the files u backed up
[00:46] <xubuntu422> ok I'll try.. even if it looks like nuclear sience right now :)
[00:46] <XRS1> you can come in here and get help while on the live disk
[00:46] <xubuntu422> ok.. cheers
[00:47] <xubuntu422> I am going to start it now
[01:03] <xubuntu422> ok I have started xubuntu on his pc with a help of XUBUNTU install cd
[01:03] <xubuntu422> what next again?
[01:04] <XRS1> open a terminal and type gksudo thunar
[01:04] <xubuntu422> so to open the terminal I have to go into the menu in up left corner?
[01:05] <XRS1> yeah go the the application launcher menu in the upper left -> select Terminal Emulator
[01:05] <XRS1> then move all the files you want saved into a folder on his hard drive called bak
[01:06] <XRS1> then delete everything from his hard drive except that back folder
[01:06] <xubuntu422> i am not a pro in it.. how shall I move it into this folder?
[01:07] <XRS1> use the mouse to drag and drop files
[01:08] <XRS1> you can do that gksudo thunar  comannd into another terminal to get a second window to make things go faster
[01:08] <XRS1> drag and drop from source window to destination window
[01:10] <XRS1> so like, have 1 window open on the left that is his home folder with all of his files, and on the right have the other window the bak folder. drag files from where he has them on the right to where you are backing them up on the left
[01:10] <XRS1> wow i dont know my left from right...
[01:10] <xubuntu422> well I'll need to ask you to guide me step by step.. so I have opened the terminal.. in this terminal I am seeing one line "xubuntu@xubuntu:~$
[01:11] <XRS1> yes this is likke DOS in windows (this is also what you would be doing if he had windows)  you type commands into that window and press enter
[01:11] <xubuntu422> yes but are this commands the same like in windows?
[01:12] <XRS1> different OS.   now since you got errors telling you you cant open the files (no permission) you want to type:
[01:12] <XRS1> gksudo thhunar
[01:12] <XRS1> this will open thunar as the administrator (aka root)
[01:12] <XRS1> gksudo thunar
[01:14] <xubuntu422> ok it has opened another window
[01:14] <XRS1> so do it again to get a second
[01:14] <XRS1> using one of the windows, navigate to his home folder where all of his files should be saved
[01:15] <XRS1> using the other window (2) create a folder in his hard drive called bak
[01:15] <XRS1> drag and drop his files to the bak folder
[01:16] <xubuntu422> shell I create a folder or something where I am going to move all the files?
[01:16] <XRS1> using the other window (2) create a folder in his hard drive called bak
[01:16] <XRS1> thats where you are going to save everything
[01:22] <xubuntu422> is there any search engine in Xubuntu system that will help me to find all the files I need to save?
[01:23] <XRS1> launcher menu -> accessories -> catfish file search
[01:23] <xubuntu422> because I am struggling a little bit to find what I need
[01:25] <XRS1> his stuff should be located in /media/xubuntu/%his-harddrive-serial-number/Home/%his-username
[01:25] <XRS1> in thunar there should be a shortcut to his hard drive on the left. named whatever size hard drive is it
[01:26] <XRS1> in his hard drive it will be in /Home/his-user-name/
[01:27] <xubuntu422> yes I tought the same but in thunar all I can see is "file system" , "root" , "browse network"
[01:27] <xubuntu422> there is no hdd drive
[01:27] <XRS1> select files system, then media, then the serial number for his hard drive (50-50 chance of choosing the right one) then Home, the his user name
[01:28] <xubuntu422> but I can see it in this search engine
[01:28] <XRS1> right click and "Show in file manager"
[01:29] <XRS1> then note the location
[01:29] <XRS1> it should give you breadcrumbs you can follow up at the top in the address bar
[01:29] <xubuntu422> all I can see under media is "cdrom" icon
[01:30] <XRS1> launcher menu -> file manager
[01:30] <XRS1>  do you see a shortcut for the hard drive on the left?
[01:30] <XRS1> do you see a shortcut to the hard drive on the desktop?
[01:30] <xubuntu422> yes
[01:31] <XRS1> open it. the address on the top will have the breadcrumbs telling you where its located
[01:31] <xubuntu422> I can see his drives in file manager
[01:31] <XRS1> use those breadcrumbs as a guide. follow the trail in the window you have open as root
[01:33] <xubuntu422> they just became visible even in the thunar after I have opened them in file manager
[01:33] <XRS1> good
[01:33] <xubuntu422> they were not visible before
[01:33] <XRS1> it had not been mounted yet
[01:34] <XRS1> you mounted it by opening it
[01:34] <xubuntu422> ok so once again what shall I do next?
[01:35] <xubuntu422> I have found what I need and I will copy it into the bak folder
[01:35] <xubuntu422> is that right?
[01:37] <XRS1> okay so you have 1 window open where his files are. that is source window. now in destination window, navigate to the beginning of his drive (you should see folders like  etc, home, var. make sure it is his hard drive, open home and make sure his username is there) go back to the begining of the drive now that you have confirmed its the right place, create a folder called bak and move the files there
[01:39] <XRS1> then when you are done go into the View menu in the destination folder -> select location selector -> Toolbar style.   now copy the address ffrom the address bad
[01:39] <XRS1> bar*
[01:41] <xubuntu422> give me a sec please it's copying now
[01:41] <XRS1> then open a terminal (start -> terminal emulator) and type: sudo chown nobody.nogroup (then use CTRL + Shift + V on the keyboard to paste the address of the bak folder) then spacebar then -Rv so it should look something like:
[01:41] <XRS1> sudo chown nobody.nogroup /path/to/bak/folder -Rv
[01:42] <XRS1> then delete everying off his hard drive except that bak folder. then install xubuntu (make no changes to the filesystem just use it as is and install)
[01:42] <XRS1> now i have to go ill be back in 2 hours
[01:43] <xubuntu422> ok thank you for your patience..
[02:24] <xubuntu012> hello Anybody here?
[02:35] <Unit193> !hi
[04:09] <pentest> is 12.04 Alternate CD ltsp broken..
[04:09] <pentest> it fails to build chroot environment
[04:09] <cfhowlett> pentest, tis not
[04:10] <cfhowlett> pentest, md5sum check?
[04:10] <pentest> yup..
[04:10] <pentest> ok.. so I do F4 while installing .. and choose the last option which is LTSP..
[04:10] <pentest> it goes all the way till the end of installation and then fails to build chroot environemnt
[04:10] <cfhowlett> pentest, bring this over to #ubuntu   and note the error messages you're getting
[04:11] <pentest> okay
[04:11] <cfhowlett> more eyes in #ubuntu
[04:15] <pentest> http://imgur.com/19Gkzfr
[04:15] <pentest> just for your eyes only
[04:16] <cfhowlett> pentest, as LTSP is server related, might be worth checking in at #ubuntu-server as well
[04:17] <Unit193> I do know someone had LTSP working fine in Xubuntu 12.04.
[04:17] <pentest> gives me hope..
[04:18] <cfhowlett> pentest, #edubuntu does ltsp all the time as well.
[04:19] <pentest> yeah..makes sense for edubuntu
[07:05] <louigi> hey fellas! just installed xubuntu 12.04, having problems with kdenlive
[07:05] <louigi> It starts with the error: QWidget::insertAction: Attempt to insert null action
[07:06] <louigi> then, no matter what icon you click - Add Clip or whatever - kdenlive crashes
[07:27] <elfy> louigi: http://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=11156 though you're likely to be better asking in #kubuntu for it
[07:30] <louigi> elfy, I did try that, but ny Task Manager shows no process of that kind %)
[15:27] <metal__> boa tarde
[15:27] <metal__> tem algum brasileiro ai?
[15:28] <Myrtti> !br
[15:29] <metal__> ok mais la é ubuntu e não xubuntu!
[15:29] <Myrtti> they probably help you with Xubuntu on that channel as well
[15:29] <metal__> mais tudo bem obrigado
[15:31] <Myrtti> Seja bem-vindo
[16:22] <xubuntu378> hello
[16:22] <xubuntu378> Im in the process of installing and it seems stuck
[16:23] <xubuntu378> at the point where conflicting system files are removed
[16:23] <xubuntu378> ps ax shows 2 ubiquity running
[16:24] <xubuntu378> are they the processes blocking the install?
[16:24] <xubuntu378> if yes, can i stop them?
[16:47] <puff> Now that's annoying... my external video stopped working for no obvious reason.  Undocked my laptop last night, put it into suspend mode, went elsewhere, used it for a couple of hours, put it back in suspend mode, brought it home.  Docked it this morning, brought it out of suspend mode, external monitor says no video signal, going into power saving mode.
[16:57] <puff> Okay, so that's even odder... shut down everything and did logout/restart, video came back JUST as it was shutting down... and now everything is working right.
[16:57] <puff> As the years go by, linux feels more and more like windows :-(
[16:58] <Sysi> you didn't try restarting X11 or reloading graphics driver?
[18:34] <puff> Sysi: No, by the time I'm restarting X Imight as well reboot.
[19:25] <likemindead> Anyone know how to fix crash issues with ZSNES in Xubuntu 13.04?
[21:06] <kristal> Soo is 13.10 working fine now?
[21:09] <brainwash> kristal: feel free to test it (live mode or separate installation)
[21:10] <brainwash> and join #ubuntu+1 and/or #xubuntu-devel
[21:10] <kristal> brainwash: I already have 13.10 lubuntu, it works alright, some bugs left.
[21:10] <kristal> So gonna shove in xubuntu-desktop
[21:11] <kristal> I'm scared to try kubuntu because I find that likes to break after big updates...
[21:11] <kristal> It's funny, Nemo(nautiluc reskin for cinnamon) is the same size as thunar.
[21:13] <brainwash> interesting, but this isn't the right place/channel to discuss development releases or offtopic stuff
[22:36] <kristal> How do you undecorate a window?
[22:37] <GridCube> undecorate?
[22:37] <kristal> strip the frame
[22:38] <kristal> So when I run an OGL app at the same horizontal res I don't have a bar on one side because of the snap
[22:38] <kristal> I can do it in kde and lxde, dunno about gnome and xfce
[22:52] <Viva_Caligula> My splash screen stopped working and I have no idea how to fix it
[22:53] <Viva_Caligula> Now it's just a black screen with Xubuntu on it in white text, some dots, then more text
[23:12] <kristal> Anyone know how to get scroll wheel to make winodws max/minimize? I have this is kde and lxde, kinda useful
[23:12] <knome> try scrolling on top of the titlebar
[23:13] <kristal> knome: that shades


[01:51] <mup> Bug #1718561 opened: MAAS backup and restore documentation omits permission preservation <doc> <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718561>
[14:25] <mup> Bug #1718686 opened: [2.3, master] Machine lists shows green checks on components even when no tests have been run <MAAS:Triaged by ltrager> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718686>
[14:34] <mup> Bug #1718686 changed: [2.3, master] Machine lists shows green checks on components even when no tests have been run <MAAS:Triaged by ltrager> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718686>
[14:40] <mup> Bug #1718686 opened: [2.3, master] Machine lists shows green checks on components even when no tests have been run <MAAS:Triaged by ltrager> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718686>
[15:19] <mup> Bug #1718706 opened: [2.3, tgt] When not using tgt, MAAS shouldn't be managing tgt <MAAS:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718706>
[20:59] <mup> Bug #1718776 opened: [ui] Tooltips missing from the machines listing page <ui> <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718776>
[21:05] <mup> Bug #1718776 changed: [ui] Tooltips missing from the machines listing page <ui> <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718776>
[21:11] <mup> Bug #1718776 opened: [ui] Tooltips missing from the machines listing page <ui> <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718776>
[21:11] <mup> Bug #1718779 opened: 00-maas-06-get-fruid-api-data fails to run on controller <MAAS:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718779>


[09:31] <juergh> ahasenack: no we didn't loose it. we just haven't added it yet.
[09:32] <juergh> there's currently a new kernel building which hopefully has it included.
[12:00] <ahasenack> juergh: ok, thanks


[07:30] <flocculant> terminal appears to look ok other than the green :p
[07:30] <Unit193> GTK3 one?
[07:31] <flocculant> yea
[07:31] <flocculant> Unit193: I assume by staging you mean the unit/gtk3 rather than xub/gtk3 at least
[07:31] <Unit193> Cool, well I guess I can copy it over then.  Thanks.  Yes exactly, the latter is testing. :P
[07:31] <flocculant> and in a vm that is - not got time to add the gtk3 ppa's here and undo it when ff looks pants again
[07:32] <flocculant> Unit193: ack - and welcome ofc :)
[07:32] <flocculant> I'll add them properly here this afternoon
[07:32] <flocculant> bbl
[07:33] <flocculant> Unit193: got link for the core iso's - lost it again ...
[07:33] <Unit193> flocculant: Ayea, https://unit193.net/xubuntu/core/pending/
[07:34] <flocculant> ty
[07:34] <Unit193> flocculant: I haven't gotten a chance to even smoke test them yet though, Tues.
[07:34] <flocculant> I can do that this afternnoon - you get some sleep :p
[07:35] <Unit193> Need it, aye.  Long day tomorrow...
[08:18] <ochosi> flocculant: well you could also say that it's the greeter's fault to some extent because it seems there are multiple classes set in the panel (or something like that), but i fixed it in Greybird so Numix can also fix it
[08:19] <ochosi> Unit193: thanks for packaging up term, i'll check it out asap (i usually just use git head ;))
[08:20] <Unit193> ochosi: I didn't.
[08:21] <ochosi> oh, i thought you said you did
[08:21] <Unit193> Nope, just that it's there.  Exp sync.
[08:21] <ochosi> oh right, then thanks for syncing ;)
[09:49] <bluesabre> If I were to set the next meeting for tomorrow 10PM UTC, would anybody be able to make it?
[09:49] <knome> i can likely do it
[10:10] <ochosi> bluesabre: could be a little tight as that is the lunchtime of our daughter, but i can try..
[10:10] <knome> lunchtime? at 10 *pm* ?
[10:10] <ochosi> oh, i read am :D
[10:10] <ochosi> then i can probably make it
[10:10] <ochosi> ;)
[10:11] <ochosi> bluesabre: meh, sorting still doesn*t work as expected
[10:11] <ochosi> even with g_ascii_strncasecmp
[11:53] <flocculant> ochosi: right - thanks - that makes more sense to me if it's greeter at fault :)
[11:54] <flocculant> bluesabre: if I can stay awake that long
[12:06] <flocculant> Unit193: couple of points re core, 1st no internet, 2nd currently tracker is reading to install via mini.iso and xub minimal via tasksel - is that what we want still? Do we not want same type of thing as normal iso install tests?
[12:06] <flocculant> there was a week or so back no internet on iso(s)
[12:15] <flocculant> added entire/manual to core list of tests
[15:49] <nairwolf> Hi, someone can confirm this bug, please ?
[15:51] <nairwolf> I'm not seeing flocculant report this bug, so I'm wondering why
[15:51] <nairwolf> Is it because it would be fixed in the next version of the theme ?
[16:28] <flocculant> who knows - almost 45 minutes later - no-one has a clue what specific thing you're talking about :)
[16:28] <flocculant> or have I lost some backlog somewhere
[17:25] <flocculant> Unit193: somewaht akin to bug 1617063 perhaps
[18:24] <knome_> pleia2, you got CC (interest to you: potential xubuntu at -article)
[18:41] <nairwolf> hi flocculant
[18:41] <nairwolf> I was so inattentive, let's me give you the bug number
[18:42] <nairwolf> This one : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/greybird-gtk-theme/+bug/1619059
[18:42] <nairwolf> It was on my keyboard memory....
[19:09] <flocculant> nairwolf: yea I see it - everyone see's it - and as I said a few days ago ochosi knows about it :)
[19:10] <nairwolf> oh, okay ;)
[19:10] <flocculant> that said it's not actually greybird - as you see the same type of thing if you use numix - and o chosi knows about that too "you could also say that it's the greeter's fault to some extent because it seems there are multiple classes set in the panel (or something like that), but i fixed it in Greybird so Numix can also fix it"
[19:10] <nairwolf> so, I'm going to wait for the next version packaged
[19:10] <flocculant> yup
[19:10] <nairwolf> I missed that
[19:11] <flocculant> nairwolf: if it's still present in 2 weeks it'll get flagged for final beta
[19:11] <flocculant> that was this morning
[19:12] <flocculant> that milestone is sneaking up pretty quickly ...
[19:17] <nairwolf> okay, I'm reading logs actually
[19:17] <nairwolf> so, what should I do ? Continue to report this bug if I'm seeing it again ? Or just waiting for the final beta ?
[19:18] <flocculant> nairwolf: you can continue tor eport it on the tracker - no need to keep bringing it up in here though, we know. If at final beta nothing's changed - bring it up again
[19:19] <nairwolf> okay
[19:19] <flocculant> tbh I tend to smoketest in the morning quickly to make sure iso works - logging out isn't something I would test
[19:19] <nairwolf> I keeped bringing it up here because nobody said it was affected on launchpad, that's why
[19:19] <nairwolf> okay
[19:20] <nairwolf> but, I don't see that when I'm logging out. I'm seeing that just after the end of installation, ubiquity ask you to remove the installation media, and then, you have the login menu
[19:20] <flocculant> thanks for seeing it though - and reporting it :)
[19:21] <nairwolf> you're welcome
[19:23] <nairwolf> bluesabre: the meeting for tomorrow is confirmed ?
[19:30] <flocculant> nairwolf: it'll be on the dev mailing list when it's confirmed - and the meeting wiki page ;)
[19:39] <nairwolf> I find the timing is really short ^^
[19:50] <flocculant> well - there's usually more than 1 day :p
[19:51] <nairwolf> yes, technically, yes ;)
[22:28] <pleia2> knome: thanks
[22:43] <knome> np


[00:24] <moreal> @PSuserinfo !PhotoFans 6.32	4.12.080609+b34	ON	:C3AA1PJ6BY9:	50088	0	nofilter
[17:30] <l3on> Hi all.. where can I ask some questions about Ubuntu planet?


[08:47] <kalikiana> sliff
[09:17] <zsombi> indeed :D
[09:18] <zsombi> kalikiana: renatu: I am not sure you can affect the focus order of the Sections. Doesn't that use ListView to show the delegates?
[09:18] <zsombi> if yes, you're screwed, you cannot really affect the TAB order
[09:21] <kalikiana> zsombi: Yes, it does. That could be an additional problem.
[09:22] <zsombi> and, with the focus index, we'd add additional complexity :(
[09:22] <zsombi> as the delegates must then handke the TAB/BACKTAB themselves
[09:22] <zsombi> *handle
[11:30] <renatu> zsombi, timp, about the sections I like the way that works today. But if you see my email we are trying to change the header focus order and setting "KeyNavigation.tab: pageheader.sections" is not enough
[11:35] <timp> perhaps it needs to be changed in the header code itself
[11:36] <timp> so if the order must always be 1. header buttons, 2. header extension (sections), 3. page contents then maybe we can enforce that in the Page/Header components
[11:55] <zsombi> timp: that can be driven by the order they are instantiated
[11:56] <kalikiana> timp: It seems to be 1. header contents 2.page contents 3. header actions in this case but yeah, possibly it could be defined like that - the question is, is that fine for all apps, or do we need to allow changing that order as well
[11:57] <timp> I'd say it is the least confusing for users if it is always the same.
[11:57] <timp> but we need a bug report and then someone from design to decide :)
[11:57] <kalikiana> zsombi: from the component itself it's easy enough to override even after the fact. the question is if it needs customizing - in my proof of concept I used KeyNavigation.tab
[11:58] <kalikiana> timp: I do agree, consistency is king
[12:21] <renatu> timp, I did not add you in the e-mail sorry, let me forward it to you
[12:39] <zsombi> kalikiana: right, that overrides the default tab handling
[12:39] <zsombi> but may not work in the ListView... but seems it doesn't need to
[14:29] <Mirv> FYI stable overlay now has Qt 5.6.2 for xenial, up from 5.6.1. It should not affect you, but maybe nice to know and it might have a fix for your Qt bug of you had one bugging you.
[14:29] <Mirv> After all upstream did hundreds of bugfixes over five months or so.
[14:31] <timp> renatu: thanks. The image is missing from the e-mail.
[14:31] <timp> renatu: if you report the bug we'll discuss it with design
[14:31] <renatu> timp, I will, thanks
[14:44] <kalikiana> Mirv: You realize that can also be read as "hundreds of potential new bugs"? :-P
[15:00] <renatu> timp, kalikiana https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1659869
[15:14] <timp> mpt_: hello. Can you have a look at the bug above, or if you're not working on UITK ask someone who is?
[15:15] <Mirv> kalikiana: nooooo :)
[15:15] <mpt_> looking
[15:16] <timp> kalikiana: I approved https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sdk-team/ubuntu-app-platform/+git/ubuntu-app-platform/+merge/315696 and https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sdk-team/ubuntu-app-platform/+git/ubuntu-app-platform/+merge/315701 but there's no autolanding.
[15:16] <timp> do you want to merge them?
[15:17] <Mirv> I trust their LTS QA are sensible, they have also rejected changes based on not being suitable for LTS. Overall, it should be beneficial. 5.6.3 will follow by June or so.
[15:30] <matv2> hi I am supposed to start converting my clicks to snaps. I have not yet worked withg snap untill now. As I have the clicks hosted on LP, what would be advisable? creating the click from within LP or doing it locally? Is there benefits to either one?
[15:30] <timp> I would first create snaps locally, so you can test it immediately without waiting for launchpad to generate it.
[15:31] <timp> matv2: there is a tutorial here https://tutorials.ubuntu.com/tutorial/create-first-snap#0
[15:32] <timp> but once your snapcraft file is good and part of your code repository, I think you can set up launchpad to automatically create the snap when the code is updated.
[15:33] <timp> mpt_: thanks
[15:37] <matv2> timp right, thanks you. I believe that tut isn't on snapcraft.io is it? Maybe I missed it but otherwise you might want to link to it.
[15:41] <timp> matv2: right, it is not there (at least I don't see it either).
[15:42] <timp> tutorials.ubuntu.com is quite new still, but I'll propose to add the link to snapcraft.io.
[15:42] <timp> thanks :)
[15:43] <mpt_> timp, commented
[15:43] <renatu> popey, could you top approval this? https://code.launchpad.net/~carlos-mazieri/ubuntu-filemanager-app/fix-network-crash-1609051/+merge/315772
[15:43] <renatu> popey, I do not have the permissions for that :D
[15:44] <timp> mpt_: thank you
[15:53] <kalikiana> timp: Oh, I remember talking about the CI setup. I guess I could have another look at that. I think something else more urgent prevented me from finishing the auto merging jobs.
[15:53]  * kalikiana doesn't like manual merges at all
[15:57] <timp> kalikiana: yes, it would be great to have it :)
[16:55] <popey> renatu: lemme see
[18:09] <pmcgowan> renatu, not sure where popey went but I can approve it
[18:28] <popey> pmcgowan: had to setup my build env again to make the click
[18:30] <pmcgowan> popey, isnt it friday after 5pm :) must be a nearby pub calling your name
[18:30] <popey> i wish
[18:30] <popey> i have a meeting at 22:00
[18:30] <popey> can't really do that from the pub
[18:31] <popey> testing the click on an m10, took a while to get the build env working.. won't take long to test
[18:33] <popey> \o/ that fixed it
[18:34] <popey> renatu: approved, thanks
[18:50] <pmcgowan> popey, use the old "my camera is not working"
[19:04] <renatu> popey, pmcgowan nice that is working. popey are you able to release a click on store for it?
[19:06] <popey> renatu: yes, I will publish an update
[19:06] <renatu> popey, thanks


[15:59] <paultag> Heyya LP - Anyone know if I can grant someone upload rights to a PPA I own without creating a group and adding both of us to it + a PPA?
[16:00] <dobey> you cannot
[16:01] <paultag> right, thought so
[16:01] <paultag> thanks :)
[16:08] <maxb> paultag: Well.... you can actually
[16:08] <maxb> But only through the LP API, the UI doesn't let you
[16:08] <maxb> Also, upload rights granted in this way won't grant delete-package rights
[16:17] <paultag> maxb: word :)
[16:17] <paultag> thanks :)
[16:18] <paultag> I just made a group, a little senseless, but it's ok :)
[16:22] <cjwatson> maxb: You can add an admin ACL, can't you?
[16:22] <cjwatson> edit-acl from lp:ubuntu-archive-tools should allow it
[16:22] <cjwatson> (IIRC)


[19:40] <seb128> pmcgowan, yw! did you find the emails?
[19:40] <cyphermox_> robru: depends if there was someone from your team or something already meant to be handling this
[19:40] <pmcgowan> seb128, yes, sigh
[19:40] <mhall119> pmcgowan: added you
[19:40] <pmcgowan> mhall119, ty
[19:40] <mhall119> np
[19:40] <seb128> pmcgowan, well, at least it explains the issue ;-)
[19:40] <pmcgowan> indeed
[19:40] <robru> cyphermox_: it should be in a reasonable state, ping me if anything really horrible comes up (like tracebacks in the logs)
[19:40] <cyphermox_> ack
[19:40] <barry> robru: i guess i can help with landings, if i can remember how to do it and can muddle through whatever new rules there are for rtm
[19:41] <robru> barry: haha, best bet is just let other people tell you what to do.
[19:41] <barry> robru: i am a good monkey, as you know
[19:41] <cyphermox_> barry: we can look at things
[19:42] <barry> cyphermox_: cool, thanks.  do ping me if you need a hand
[19:42] <dbarth_> hey guys, so i re-verified silo 2 now
[19:42] <cyphermox_> yeah
[19:42] <dbarth_> with the included oxide-qt packags to fix the dep problem
[19:42] <cyphermox_> ok
[19:43] <dbarth_> you should be able to clean th situation there, to let unity8 and Saviq land his work
[19:44] <cyphermox_> omg
[19:46] <cyphermox_> davmor2: still around?
[19:50] <jdstrand> elopio, ToyKeeper: fyi, rtm silo 002 is ready for QA signoff
[19:51] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: so what did you change, basically just copying oxide-qt to the silo, re-testing?
[19:52] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: yes
[19:52] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: to resolve the dependency in webbrowser-app
[19:52] <cyphermox_> no code changes?
[19:53] <dbarth_> nope
[19:53] <dbarth_> just smoke testing once oxide was part of the silo
[19:53] <cyphermox_> ok
[19:53] <dbarth_> i did a clean flash to r234, devmode
[19:53] <dbarth_> then apt-add-repo
[19:55] <cyphermox_> right
[19:56] <cyphermox_> so oxide-qt is already in utopic, it's just that u-s-s-o-a is blocked because of architectures for which oxide-qt isn't available, and webbrowser-app regressed a test because of oxide, and probably needs that test to be re-run
[20:01] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: oxide-qt 1.2~bzr was in utopic this morning, not 1.2 final
[20:01] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: this is what i understood blockd the whole landing
[20:01] <cyphermox_> yes
[20:01] <cyphermox_> just a minute :)
[20:01] <dbarth_> nw
[20:06] <tedg> davmor2, https://bugs.launchpad.net/url-dispatcher/+bug/1367400/comments/2
[20:06] <tedg> davmor2, What did I do different there?
[20:06] <elopio> jdstrand: I hope ToyKeeper can take that one. I'll check back later if it's still pending.
[20:07] <elopio> tedg: davmor2 is gone for today.
[20:07] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: what is ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts using oxide-qt for? does it totally fail if oxide-qt is unavailable?
[20:07] <jdstrand> elopio, ToyKeeper: ack, I'll be stepping away for a bit, but read backscroll.
[20:07] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: I think the depends should be adjusted to not require oxide-qt on powerpc/ppc64/arm64, where it's not available.
[20:08] <tedg> elopio, Ah, okay. I'll just mark it "incomplete" then.
[20:08] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: it's using its webview and captures cookies
[20:08] <cyphermox_> so very crippling? ;)
[20:08] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: the cookie API changed between oxide 1.2~bzr, and 1.2 final
[20:09] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: yes, that's why they are in the same silo
[20:09] <cyphermox_> hm
[20:09] <cyphermox_> the thing is, oxide-qt never built on these arches, or at least 1.2~bzr doesn't seem to have
[20:09] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: but i checked that use case as well, ie create an account, enable the webapp, and autologin in twitter
[20:09] <dbarth_> yeah!
[20:09] <cyphermox_> so the depends was added?
[20:09] <dbarth_> hmm, not sure for ussoa
[20:10] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: yes, it was added as well:
[20:10] <dbarth_> +         liboxideqt-qmlplugin (>= 1.2.0),
[20:10] <cyphermox_> I see that
[20:11] <cyphermox_> yuck
[20:13] <cyphermox_> so it seems to me like the correct fix would be to limit which architectures ussoa builds on, but it's kind of awkward to do while it's half-landed as far as citrain is concerned
[20:14] <cyphermox_> rsalveti: awe_: btw, I would like to land your ofono landing as requested, but the spreadsheet line isn't set to testing pass; could you adjust that if it really was tested and good?
[20:14] <dbarth_> long thread, but cjwatson essentially recommends not to put any arch-specific constraints here
[20:14] <cyphermox_> rsalveti: ^since you can confirm, this was requested by awe_
[20:14] <cyphermox_> oh
[20:15] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: could you point me to the thread?
[20:16] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: scroll back to this morning here, between Saviq and cjwatson
[20:16] <rsalveti> cyphermox_: awe_ was testing that one, let's wait his feedback
[20:16] <dbarth_> but the qustion was raised on a couple of occasions already
[20:17] <cyphermox_> rsalveti: well, he asked me a few minutes ago before leaving to the gym
[20:17] <cyphermox_> rsalveti: but the spreadsheet state doesn't match :)
[20:17] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: ok, let me read it and get it back up to speed on this, to really understand what to do
[20:19] <Saviq> dbarth_, thanks, cyphermox_, it's basically about publishing oxide-qt from silo 2 and once in proposed retrying the failed adt runs for ussoa, unity-scope-click etc.
[20:19] <cyphermox_> yes
[20:19] <balloons> plars, re: fm and terminal failures. Are we ok with letting those ride for the moment as they are only on utopic?
[20:20] <plars> balloons: that's a question for sil2100, but iirc they are also failing on rtm
[20:21] <plars> yeah, there's quite a few failures on rtm for them also. Either way, I'd suggest looking at those
[20:22] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: Saviq: as I understand it, cjwatson was fine with uninstallables for this kind of case. I hope I'm reading this right
[20:22] <balloons> plars, can you provide a complete link? I see very small runs for those on rtm
[20:22] <balloons> plars, mm.. touch-stable I guess has the full runs
[20:23] <Saviq> cyphermox_, you mean that on some arches you won't be able to install? I believe so, that was the case before already
[20:23] <cyphermox_> yes
[20:24] <Saviq> cyphermox_, our discussion was really about whether packages that only build on certain arches should be limited, and Colin said that shouldn't be the case except when it's known that it will basically never be possible to build, otherwise we want the failures to be visible
[20:24] <Saviq> cyphermox_, as for uninstallables, it's probably best to make such a dependency optional if at all possible
[20:24] <cyphermox_> yeah
[20:25] <cyphermox_> Saviq: this case doesn't seem to be
[20:25] <cyphermox_> tedg: charles: I'm looking into the failure above
[20:26] <charles> cyphermox_, ty
[20:26] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: Saviq: I asked on #u-release to have the proper steps taken, but it seems like there is nothing needed at the citrain level
[20:26] <cyphermox_> once things transition from proposed it will get cleared up
[20:26] <Saviq> cyphermox_, one thing at least is needed, is to publish oxide-qt, is it in proposed already?
[20:26] <cyphermox_> it's already in the archive
[20:27] <Saviq> ah
[20:27] <Saviq> cyphermox_, then yeah, adt just needs reruns then
[20:28] <cyphermox_> yes, and ussoa forced in
[20:28] <Saviq> right
[20:28] <cyphermox_> as per my last messages in #ubuntu-release
[20:28] <tedg> cyphermox_, Sorry, confused, which one?
[20:29] <infinity> Saviq: The simple way to satisfy both the "don't build on arches where it can't install" and "make the failure visible" cases are to build-dep on the thing you depend on.
[20:30] <cyphermox_> rtm silo 1
[20:30] <Saviq> infinity, right, makes sense
[20:30] <infinity> ie: if ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts had a build-dep on liboxideqt-qmlplugin, it would dep-wait on all those arches instead of building a useless binary.
[20:31] <tedg> cyphermox_, Ah, I see. Thanks!
[20:31] <infinity> cyphermox_ / Saviq: You can read the above as "no, I won't force in ussoa and raise the uninstallable count".
[20:32] <cyphermox_> I did read it that way
[20:32] <cyphermox_> I was just thinking "why didn't I think of it"
[20:32] <Saviq> infinity, well, the count is already there
[20:32] <balloons> plars, right.. since pin/pass is set on phones, rtm is affected too. I don't see an open bug for it, I will file one if you confirm there isn't one
[20:32] <cyphermox_> now, the problem is also how to fix this in citrain with the least amount of pain
[20:32] <cyphermox_> ie. on a half-done landing
[20:32] <Saviq> infinity, that situation is already there in the archive, I'd say we need a bug against ussoa instead
[20:33] <infinity> Saviq: Err, no.
[20:33] <infinity> Saviq: The "situation" is in proposed, which is exactly what proposed is there for.  TO prevent the situation migrating to release.
[20:33] <infinity> Saviq: "It's broken in proposed, may as well call it a wash" would be ignoring the whole point of porposed. :P
[20:33] <Saviq> infinity, ah, I thought that was just a bumped dep, not a completely new one
[20:34] <infinity> Saviq: It's a new dep.
[20:34] <Saviq> infinity, no no, I thought it wasn't a new dep
[20:34] <Saviq> right
[20:34] <cyphermox_> itś a new dep
[20:34]  * Saviq wonders if it was just a missing dep before, i.e. it didn't work anyway...
[20:35] <infinity> Whee, and it has rdeps too, of course.
[20:35] <infinity> So glad we keep picking technologies that aren't actually ported.
[20:36] <dbarth_> cyphermox_: ok, so i guess all good for today
[20:36] <dbarth_> see you
[20:36] <cyphermox_> dbarth_: sorry, just trying to pick this up and piece the information back together
[20:36] <Saviq> infinity, could you upload a fixed packaging version to proposed directly and we'll resync trunks as needed?
[20:37] <infinity> Saviq: I could, but I'm taking a sick day and not actually home.
[20:37] <cyphermox_> Saviq: I can do that, it was mostly just a matter of figuring out *what* to do
[20:37] <Saviq> infinity, ah sorry, take care then
[20:37] <infinity> I wonder how painful it would be to port oxide to the 3 arches where it's FTBFS.
[20:38] <Saviq> infinity, it was missing "gyp" which IIUC is some google built-time tool thingy
[20:38] <infinity> Saviq: No, no, gyp isn't missing, it's just missing platform definitions.
[20:38] <Spads> also a racial slur
[20:39] <infinity> That bit is easy, what's not is that it might explode later. :P
[20:39] <Saviq> infinity, right
[20:39] <Saviq> Spads, ;)
[20:39] <infinity> I could probably convince IBM to fix it on ppc/ppc64el, but not sure who I'd talk into fixing arm64.
[20:40] <infinity> And arm64 is something we should really deeply care about, since phones are going that route.
[20:40] <infinity> We won't be armhf forever.
[20:41] <Saviq> +1
[20:42] <infinity> cyphermox_: That'll still need some archive admin massaging once it stops building on those arches, so give me a ping when it's all built and stuck.
[20:43] <cyphermox_> ok
[20:43] <cyphermox_> thanks
[20:43] <Saviq> cyphermox_, ok, so to resolve this I believe we need just a bit of packaging changes (build-dep on liboxideq-qmlplugin) and the rdep infinity mentioned
[20:43]  * cyphermox_ stabs iwldvm
[20:43] <Saviq> cyphermox_, so I'd vote for uploading a fixed version directly and we'll handle the resync tomorrow
[20:43] <cyphermox_> brb; I first need to fix my wifi if I want to be ableto upload anything at all
[20:44] <Saviq> sure
[20:46] <infinity> It would probably be nice to make ubuntuone-credentials build-dep on ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts to give the same hackish workaround.
[20:46] <infinity> All the other rdeps are arch:all and thus not a big deal.
[20:52] <infinity> Argh.
[20:52] <infinity> cyphermox_: Hold the phone.
[20:52] <cyphermox_> aye
[20:52] <infinity> cyphermox_: The second level of rdeps has a ton of arch-specific stuff. :/
[20:53] <cyphermox_> where are you looking so that I can look at the same place?
[20:53] <infinity> cyphermox_: reverse-depends ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts, and then drill down.
[20:53] <infinity> So, removing this will break severl other bits (singon stuff, sync-monitor, etc)
[20:54] <infinity> OOI, why was the new dep needed? :P
[20:56] <infinity> Still not happy about forcing it in, mind you.  But not keen on rebuilding the whole rdep stack just to perpetuate the build-dep hacks and remove a bunch more binaries.
[20:56] <cyphermox_> I can file a bug about how damanged the situation is
[20:57] <infinity> "Use new Oxide cookie API"
[20:57] <infinity> Oh.
[20:57] <infinity> Are we pulling in a whole web rendering engine just for cookies? :)
[20:58] <cyphermox_> why not? :)
[21:05] <cjwatson> infinity: there's no reason why we can't do a binaryful copy into a silo.  citrain doesn't support it but you can do copy-package -b.
[21:06] <cjwatson> infinity: people seem to be paranoid and want rebuilds for some reason but if anyone thinks that's reasonable for glibc I will be happy to challenge them to explain why
[21:07] <cjwatson> awe_: fiddly I'm afraid because you have to do amusing things to debootstrap - for the time being it's probably best to grab the one linked from https://api.launchpad.net/devel/ubuntu-rtm/14.09/amd64 or similar
[21:15] <infinity> cjwatson: So, thoughts on ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts?
[21:16] <infinity> cjwatson: New dep on oxide makes it uninstallable on 3 arches, the naive fix would be to build-dep on oxide and stop building it,but that has rdep fallout that cascades anyway, so we either propagate the same hack to N packages, where N is approaching 10, or just force the count up. :/
[21:16] <cyphermox_> jhodapp: could you check what's up with your package in rtm silo 5?
[21:16] <cjwatson> infinity: Ugh.  Might be worth sucking it up for now; online-accounts is always tricky
[21:16] <infinity> cjwatson: I'm leaning to the latter for now, after evangelising the former.
[21:16] <cjwatson> I suspect it will need something more involved
[21:17] <cjwatson> infinity: You'll want both force and force-hint IIRC
[21:17] <infinity> cjwatson: Well, what it really wants is oxide ported (or, hey, Canonical stopping this "it exists on an arch and a half, sweet, let's standardise on it" trend), but meh.
[21:19] <cjwatson> Agreed
[21:20] <infinity> cjwatson: And yeah, I know I *can* do a binary copy to a silo (well, since I'm in a group that can upload to them anyway), I was just arguing with people who seem rebuild happy. ;)
[21:21] <infinity> cjwatson: And I think when I initially asked "how do we do this", I was assuming a copy straight to RTM, bypassing CI.
[21:22] <cjwatson> I think you should ignore the rebuild bit and JFDI.  Going through a silo for QA is sane; rebuilding glibc because the copied binaries might depend on some incompatible ABI (in, er, what exactly?) isn't.
[21:22] <cjwatson> It would be helpful for reduction in later panic if you could get QA signoff on the silo though.
[21:22] <balloons> plars, I filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-terminal-app/+bug/1367453, just fyi for the failures
[21:22] <cjwatson> Otherwise we'll spend ages with people wanting to ascribe whatever's broken tomorrow to glibc ...
[21:23] <plars> balloons: ack
[21:37] <Saviq> infinity, so, FWIW, the dependency is not new (except it is new in debian/control), online accounts actually render web pages to log into services
[21:38] <Saviq> infinity, so it basically should've been there already months ago, and now only bumped to use the new API calls
[21:50] <cjwatson> qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu autopkgtest worked on retry; should clear some things out, including ubuntu/landing-003
[21:51] <cjwatson> Retrying unity-scope-click autopkgtest too on the off-chance
[21:53] <infinity> cjwatson: Heh.  Well, I'll dance through the paperwork and hoops tomorrow for glibc, then.
[22:10] <cjwatson> unity-scope-click passed too.
[22:15]  * cjwatson squints at citrain
[22:15] <cjwatson> In what sense is ubuntu-rtm/landing-001 "All packages are in destination"?
[22:16] <cjwatson> The PPA has 13.10.0+14.10.20140908.1~rtm-0ubuntu1, but no sign of that in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-rtm/+source/indicator-datetime/+publishinghistory
[22:16] <cjwatson> robru,cyphermox_,rsalveti: I'm probably not the first to notice this, but don't believe citrain's lies for merge-and-cleanliness of sync silos
[22:16] <cjwatson> tedg: cc ^-
[22:17] <cyphermox_> yeah, it happened to me before
[22:17] <cyphermox_> it´s early enough that it´ s easier to fix
[22:22] <infinity> cyphermox_: For better or worse, ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts is migrated now.
[22:30] <cyphermox_> infinity: thanks
[22:36] <robru> cjwatson: yeah i know, it fails on sync silos when the package names are implicit (eg sync:n silos). The other symptom of this issue is the lack of package names appearing in the dashboard. I was hoping to fix it bit I'm sick :-(
[22:42] <cjwatson> robru: ok, just wanted to make sure you knew about it, thanks, GWS
[22:43] <cyphermox_> cjwatson: so I guess it´s time to copy-package
[22:44] <cjwatson> ah yes, it's tested
[22:44] <cyphermox_> how can I specify ubuntu-rtm proposed?
[22:44] <cjwatson> $ copy-package --from=~ci-train-ppa-service/ubuntu-rtm/landing-001 --from-suite=14.09 --to=ubuntu-rtm --to-suite=14.09-proposed -b indicator-datetime
[22:44] <cyphermox_> ah!
[22:44] <cjwatson> I have it queued up here if you want ...
[22:44] <cyphermox_> feel free
[22:45] <cjwatson> done
[22:45] <cyphermox_> I'm trying to follow a discrete math class :)
[22:45] <cjwatson> you'll have to watch rmadison or something for when it's actually M&Cable
[22:45] <cyphermox_> sure
[22:45] <cjwatson> or I guess https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-rtm/+source/indicator-datetime/+publishinghistory
[22:45] <cjwatson> damn that hit Published quick :)
[22:45] <cjwatson> (in -proposed)
[22:45] <cyphermox_> woo
[22:51] <cjwatson> ok, published for real in 14.09 now; ubuntu-rtm runs quickly when it feels like it
[22:51] <cjwatson> cleaning
[22:53] <cyphermox_> ah, yeah you want to tick the ignore project checkbox
[22:53] <cjwatson> had to ... that
[22:53] <cyphermox_> dah
[22:54] <cyphermox_> hmm, means I'll go merge the branch in manually
[22:54] <cjwatson> there's no 14.09 branch anyway
[22:54] <cjwatson> which is reasonable since it's a sync
[22:54] <cyphermox_> oh, true
[22:54] <cjwatson> well, except a pseudo-sync with a different version number, but anyway
[22:55] <cyphermox_> ah, I meant to ask about this
[22:56] <cyphermox_> why are these syncs with ~rtm- ..., a version number lower than what's in utopic?
[22:57] <cjwatson> I haven't the faintest idea
[22:57] <cyphermox_> ah, I thought it was somehow done on purpose, for some reason I didn't think of
[22:57] <cjwatson> well, I mean in general it's probably to reduce the incidence of different binaries with the same version number
[22:58] <cjwatson> but I don't think I agree with the practice of rebuilding
[22:58] <cjwatson> lower than utopic will be because these are morally sort of backports - we want utopic to supersede eventually
[22:58] <cyphermox_> I was really expecting ubuntu -> ubuntu-rtm  transitioning to work much the same as debian -> ubuntu
[22:59] <cjwatson> the problem with that is that we're going to want to bulk-copy utopic (or v) over the top for the next time round
[22:59] <cjwatson> we might have a problem with mismatching binaries with the same version when we get there
[22:59] <cyphermox_> ok
[23:00] <cjwatson> anyway, tired, ICBW, night
[23:00] <cyphermox_> good night, and thanks again!
[23:03] <cyphermox_> lies
[23:09] <Saviq> cyphermox_, thanks!
[23:10] <cyphermox_> Saviq: np
[23:17] <ToyKeeper> Is it a known, expected thing that 'phablet-click-test-setup' by itself fails on a rtm image?  (fails while trying to get a unity8 package from LP)
[23:20] <cyphermox_> what's the error message?
[23:20] <cyphermox_> I guess it could well not work
[23:21] <ToyKeeper> cyphermox_: pull-lp-source: Error: Failed to download: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+files/unity8_8.00+14.10.20140903.1~rtm-0ubuntu1.dsc: 404 Not Found
[23:22] <cyphermox_> yeah, that's broken alright
[23:22] <cjwatson> --distribution=ubuntu-rtm
[23:22] <cjwatson> oh and probably --series=14.09
[23:23] <cyphermox_> cjwatson: are those parameters that can be passed to phablet-click-test-setup?
[23:23] <ToyKeeper> Nope.
[23:26] <cyphermox_> ToyKeeper: update your phablet-tools maybe?
[23:26] <cyphermox_> seems to be in lp:phablet-tools
[23:28] <ToyKeeper> cyphermox_: *facepalm* ...  thanks.  :)
[23:32] <ToyKeeper> ... and now it's failing on UITK.  I get the feeling I might need to bug bzoltan about this though.
[23:32] <ToyKeeper> (because I think I found the reason why he's getting different test results than QA)