[01:15] <jmarsden> Morganvd: It is always OK to remove lubuntu-desktop ; it is just a meta package and no actual software will be removed when you remove that package.
[01:20] <MrChrisDruif> jmarsden; Late to the party? :)
[01:20] <jmarsden> Apparently :)
[01:20] <MrChrisDruif> I answered it about 80 minutes ago, with a link even :P
[01:22] <jmarsden> MrChrisDruif: I read the "I've read something about" line you senet, so I answered it, then realized you had more completed answered it already :)
[01:24] <MrChrisDruif> :)
[01:44] <mr-rich> I can't get X to start. did the mini install first, then apt-get lubuntu-desktop. startx fails
[01:44] <bioterror> what startx says
[01:44] <mr-rich> compaq armada 1700 laptop. PII 266/160 MB ram
[01:45] <mr-rich> xinit: connection to X server lost
[01:45] <bioterror> what do you have in /var/local/Xorg.0.log
[01:46] <mr-rich> ran sudo Xorg -configure first ...
[01:47] <mr-rich> tail'd that file ... looking now ...
[01:49] <mr-rich> bioterror: what am I looking for?
[01:50] <bioterror> you tell us
[01:50] <mr-rich> bioterror: there's a bunch of stuff in there about the touch pad ...
[01:50] <mr-rich> I don't see any specific errors ...
[01:50] <bioterror> usually the last lines tells why it did not load
[01:52] <mr-rich> the last line sez "ddxSigGiveup: Closing log"
[02:07] <jmarsden> mr-rich: Can you pastebin the file so we can read it?
[03:48] <mr-rich> jmarsden: sorry ... break for dinner ... I'll try to off load it to a usb stick and upload it ...
[03:52] <mr-rich> jmarsden: how many lines shoud I paste?
[03:55] <mr-rich> jmarsden: http://pastebin.com/c9eZaGWB
[03:55] <mr-rich> 450 lines ...
[04:01] <mr-rich> Would installing from the lubuntu iso be any better/different from doing the mini install first?
[04:03] <Ahmuck-Jr> what do you gain with mini install?
[04:05] <mr-rich> Ahmuck-Jr: trying to use as  little disk space as possable
[04:08] <mr-rich> Ahmuck-Jr: any clue as to my X problem?
[04:12] <mr-rich> ok ... installing from lubuntu iso ...
[04:19] <mr-rich> well, the lununtu iso locked up my old laptop solid ...
[04:24] <Ahmuck-Jr> ah, oldie?
[04:26] <mr-rich> for its day, it was a screamer ...
[04:26] <mr-rich> PII 266/160MB ...
[04:26] <mr-rich> Hense the use of lununtu ...
[04:26] <Ahmuck-Jr> um, u might consider puppy
[04:28] <Ahmuck-Jr> slitaz or crunchbang
[04:30] <mr-rich> puppy hasn't benn updated in a while ...
[04:31] <mr-rich> is there a way to force the lubuntu to do a text based install?
[04:31] <Ahmuck-Jr> 2/19/2011
[04:31] <Ahmuck-Jr> if ur wanting a text based install, i'd try server or ubuntu used to have a JeOS
[04:33] <mr-rich> I see the 5 series of puppy ...
[04:33] <mr-rich> I tried installing the mini iso then following the lubuntu install instructions ...
[04:34] <mr-rich> I got it to install ok ... memory looks good, got double swap space & HD space is at 41% (4GB HD) ... I just can't get X to start ....
[04:36] <Ahmuck-Jr> After the base system is installed, log in, and type "sudo tasksel" to select the system to install.
[04:40] <Ahmuck-Jr> bbl, gtg
[05:04] <mr-rich> Ok ... I rebooted and X finally started ...
[05:04] <mr-rich> but I have an 800x600 screen ... I need 1028x768 ...
[05:04] <mr-rich> not available ...
[06:09]  * Ahmuck-Jr is back
[06:09] <Ahmuck-Jr> mr-rich: u still there?
[06:16] <mr-rich> still here ... installing wary puppy 5.1.1
[06:18] <mr-rich> too tired for this crep now ... installed puppy and it still wants to boot ubuntu ... gebus ...
[06:19] <mr-rich> I'll  play more tomorrow ...
[06:19] <mr-rich> nite-nite
[06:27] <bioterror> mr-rich, install SalixOS
[06:28] <bioterror> it has support for i486 :D
[06:32] <Ahmuck-Jr> mr-rich: u need to format the drive
[06:33] <bioterror> no noneed
[06:33] <bioterror> just / partition
[06:33] <bioterror> and install grub to sda
[06:36] <Ahmuck-Jr> well, i'm out
[06:36] <Ahmuck-Jr> shutting down one pc to move to another
[06:38] <Ahmuck-Jr> exit
[06:48] <utterfrustration> Does anyone know how to make Lubuntu properly use two monitors? (Nvidia driver (Works) and Xubuntu worked with it fine...)?
[06:48] <utterfrustration> (and I'd like to beat Nvidia employees over the head with one of the monitors... 270. has a nifty bug where when I maximize a terminal, it eats 'buntu's panel)
[06:49] <bioterror> xrandr
[06:49] <utterfrustration> xranr only shows one screen...
[06:49] <utterfrustration> for some reason, lxde (is that right, for lubuntu?) doesn't seem to like the dual monitors.
[06:50] <utterfrustration> Of weird note is, I _can_ use Twinview --- but not separate monitors ... which tends to be how I like my workflow.
[06:55] <utterfrustration> So... nothing?
[06:56] <utterfrustration> This seems specific to lubuntu/lxde, since it works fine with (sigh.)unity and xfce.... of course, lubuntu looks awesome by comparison...
[06:56] <utterfrustration> so I can either have a distro that's nice (lubuntu) or one that works (xubuntu)... *eye roll*
[07:09] <jmarsden> utterfrustration: This is an interesting issue... but I think if xrandr does not see two screens, the issue is most likely to be at the X level or driver level in some way, not at the LXDE/Xfce/Unity level.  Does xrandr on the xubuntu setup show only one screen??
[07:10] <utterfrustration> No...I don't think so...
[07:10] <utterfrustration> Though, here, it does. Erm, on lubuntu.
[07:10] <utterfrustration> And using the 'Monitor' config tool gives just one option.
[07:10] <utterfrustration> I'm pretty sure it's specific to lxde, because it _does_ work just fine with xfce.
[07:11] <jmarsden> Wait... <utterfrustration> xranr only shows one screen...
[07:11] <utterfrustration> (and, I'm sorry if I'm coming across as terse; I do appreciate help --- I've been banging my head on this for hours; this, and the damn nvidia bug...)
[07:11] <utterfrustration> Yes...
[07:11] <jmarsden> Was that in Lubuntu??  Because now you say <utterfrustration> Though, here, it does. Erm, on lubuntu.
[07:11] <utterfrustration> Yes, here, on Lubuntu, there is only one monitor seen.
[07:11] <jmarsden> So in Lubuntu, does xrandr see one screen, or two?  I'm confused :)
[07:12] <utterfrustration> Sorry, just one, in Lubuntu
[07:12] <utterfrustration> Please note, even here, IN Lubuntu, nvidia-settings sees both monitors just fine...and shows both active... and working
[07:12] <utterfrustration> AND, for even more fun, I can happily move the _mouse_ over to the monitor beside this one --- which is completely black...
[07:12] <utterfrustration> It's just... augh!
[07:13] <jmarsden> I know nothing about the specifics of the nvidia drivers, and persuading nvidia to fix something for Lubuntu is... probably not going to fly.
[07:13] <jmarsden> So if it is a driver issue, we're probably stuck.
[07:13] <utterfrustration> Well, the nvidia bug is in all the distros...
[07:13] <utterfrustration> but that's something different.
[07:13] <utterfrustration> (when maximizing a terminal window, it eats the panels... )
[07:14] <utterfrustration> Of course, I can't seem to go back from 270 to 260, so I figure I'll just open 5 or so terms on boot, maximize them, refresh the panel (toggle from left side to top) and I'm good
[07:14] <utterfrustration> that's not a problem wtih Lubuntu --- though it's one of the reasons I found lubuntu! ;p
[07:14] <utterfrustration> What's happening here is, for some reason, lxde doesn't _use_ both monitors.  With everything the same, xfce did. (can't test unity; it's gone, now... and good riddance.)
[07:14] <jmarsden> Seems odd that the nvidia driver "knows" the difference between a terminal window and any other window... logically it shouldn't be treating them any differently to any other window, at that level, should it?
[07:15] <utterfrustration> I wouldn't think so...
[07:15] <utterfrustration> but, to add to that description...
[07:15] <utterfrustration> If I open a terminal window ... I have a huge black square (size of initial term)
[07:15] <utterfrustration> and the term window in center of screen
[07:15] <utterfrustration> increasing the size of the term window (dragging lower right corner...) increases black square in upper left corner
[07:16] <utterfrustration> so it seems like it's crapping all over itself...
[07:16] <jmarsden> That is a known bug with nvidia drivers and lxterminal, but we don't know much more than that at this point.
[07:16] <utterfrustration> lxterminal --- and xfce-terminal
[07:16] <utterfrustration> Maybe it's something to do with how terminals expect to draw on the screen? No idea --- I can live with that...
[07:17] <jmarsden> Oh, interesting!   On the two screen front: would it be worth installing xubuntu and then installing lubuntu-desktop and seeing if you can then persuade LXDE to handle the two screens?
[07:17] <utterfrustration> Hrm...
[07:17] <jmarsden> If it worked, you could then uninstall xubuntu packages that you don't want... sort of an ugly way to do an install, but it might be a workaround.
[07:18] <utterfrustration> That's what I've done, though.
[07:18] <utterfrustration> I had xubuntu, installed on top of ubuntu...
[07:18] <utterfrustration> and installed the lubuntu-desktop (and aux packages) on top
[07:18] <utterfrustration> Of course, I should note...
[07:18] <utterfrustration> prior to that, I went from 10.04 -> 10.10 -> 11.04
[07:19] <utterfrustration> And honestly, I'm a hair's breath from just doing a wipe and install...
[07:19] <jmarsden> Oh... hmmm.  How practical is backing up the world and... yes... it might help... but if it doesn't, you'll be unhappy at the time you spent trying it :)
[07:19] <utterfrustration> I've already got the unofficial x64 lubuntu iso... but, tomorrow, I've got 'real work'(tm) to do... and it's late...
[07:19]  * utterfrustration grins
[07:19] <utterfrustration> Exactly. ;p
[07:20] <utterfrustration> Also, I just got ZFS for Linux working ... the bitch of this is, until midday, I didn't have second monitor on...
[07:20] <utterfrustration> since I was doing mostly console stuff + constant reboots. It's only when I settled in to 'finalize' I started bumping into this.
[07:20] <utterfrustration> I'm taking it, though, that this is NOT a known issue with lubuntu/lxde?
[07:21] <jmarsden> Not known to me, at least.  But many Lubuntu users are on older hardware, low RAM, etc etc so using nVidia cards and multile monitors may not be all that common.
[07:22] <utterfrustration> Heh... I wanted a main box that kicked butt; this is actually only a core2 (circa '05...).  My W7 system (i5... bought in '09) ... I use to burn dvds. *laugh*
[07:22] <jmarsden> I have a bunch of PCs here at home, but none have an nVidia graphics card in them :)  So I can't easily test this... I'd have to try to find a "spare" machine at work I could... repurpose :)
[07:22]  * utterfrustration grins
[07:23] <utterfrustration> Well, again, it DOES work with Twinview... so, it just seems that either openbox or lxde (the two 'differences') just don't like 'separate screen' and my setup...
[07:23] <utterfrustration> lxrandr only shows whatever monitor is in use when logging in.
[07:24] <jmarsden> OK.  I'd say you should probably file a bug report on launchpad and hope someone with the hardware can check it out further.
[07:24]  * utterfrustration nods
[07:24] <utterfrustration> Well, thank you for trying... it makes it less frustrating to get to whine a bit to a live person. ;p
[07:24] <jmarsden> You're welcome - sorry it didn't result in a fix for you, though.
[07:25] <utterfrustration> No worries... thanks again!
[07:25] <bioterror> In order to have Openbox manage multiple X screens (this is not the same as multi-monitor TwinView or Xinerama), you need to run an instance of Openbox directly on each screen. We've put work into making Openbox work well with other instances of itself, for this type of configuration.
[07:27] <ich7x64> Better nick...
[07:27] <ich7x64> jmarsden, are you still here?
[07:27] <jmarsden> Yes.
[07:27] <ich7x64> Here's a 'son of a bitch!' for you...
[07:27] <bioterror> ich7x64, http://openbox.org/wiki/Help:FAQ#How_do_I_run_Openbox_across_multiple_X_screens.3F
[07:27] <ich7x64> DISPLAY=:0.1 openbox 2>1 &
[07:27] <bioterror> !language | ich7x64
[07:27] <ich7x64> bioterror: Hah. Yeah. ;p
[07:28] <ich7x64> erm, to your paste. That's what I just tried.
[07:28] <ich7x64> So... what's it mean?
[07:28] <ich7x64> It works.
[07:28] <ich7x64> So, how do I actually make it work all the way?
[07:28] <bioterror> so yes, it's openbox related
[07:28] <ich7x64> That was my [vulgar language] revelation. ;p
[07:29] <ich7x64> That "Ah ha!" --- somewhere!
[07:29] <ich7x64> but I must confess, this is at a level deeper than my knowledge goes; I'm not really clear what the difference is between openbox and lxde --- I thought a wm was a wm...
[07:30]  * ich7x64 snickers evilly
[07:30] <ich7x64> Well, THAT's neat; I can use Openbox's 'terminal emulator', and maximize it, and not have it eat the panel on this screen.
[07:32] <ich7x64> Erm, sorry for rambling. Which config file would I put the display line to automatically start a second session on the second monitor?
[07:32] <jmarsden> ich7x64: If it helps, GNOME is a DE that uses metacity as a WM.  LXDE is a DE that uses openbox as a WM...
[07:33] <jmarsden> ich7x64: I'd try adding it to /etc/rc.local
[07:33] <ich7x64> I wonder if I killed things when I got rid of compiz?
[07:34] <ich7x64> since I think I had xfce with compiz...
[07:34] <jmarsden> Sounds like your system has used every DE on the planet!! :)
[07:34]  * ich7x64 smirks
[07:34] <ich7x64> Before this system...
[07:34] <ich7x64> my main linux system was running slackware... celeron 300mhz, overclocked to 450mhz... ;p
[07:35] <ich7x64> So, yeah, I wanted to play around a bit... in the old days, Enlightenment was all cutting edge. ;p
[07:35] <ich7x64> but, really, I can happily compile my own kernel, but I've never really gotten the gist of the gui end.
[07:35] <jmarsden> ich7x64: In the really old days, X wasn't there at all... I ran the MCC distro from two floppies in 1992 :)
[07:35] <ich7x64> I enjoyed the eye candy --- but really, I just need to be able to launch programs. (usually terms to run vi in, because I haven't gotten used to gvim yet)
[07:36] <ich7x64> two floppies! Hah. ;p
[07:36] <ich7x64> I didn't get into Linux until the mid-90s... by then, you know, we had darn near 30 floppies... and, of course, 10 of those would have CRC errors.... ;p
[07:37] <jmarsden> Yes, I am singlehandedly responsible for importing Linux into the Phillipines in about 1993, on 30+ 720k floppies...
[07:37]  * ich7x64 grins
[07:37] <ich7x64> That's awesome. ;-)
[07:42] <bioterror> jmarsden, you could have drilled them to 1.44MB ;)
[07:43] <jmarsden> bioterror: I think I only had a 720k floppy *drive* in the relevant PC :)
[07:43] <bioterror> :-)
[07:53] <ich7x64> Well, I'm going to reboot... again.  Now that I know it's software... well, really, I use the smaller monitor for vlc (TMF mixes are nice. ;p) or with hexer open in a full screen term, so... it actually might be better only having openbox (with nothing else) running on it.
[07:53] <ich7x64> Thanks again for the help guys; i appreciate it. Have a great evening!
[07:53] <jmarsden> ich7x64: You're welcome.
[08:06] <poltak> hey guys. got a quick question about a bug that happened to me this morning trying lubuntu
[08:07] <poltak> not really a fan of ubuntu but I love lubuntu, and decided to give the new 11.04 a try on my netbook this morning
[08:07] <poltak> anyway, it installed perfectly and ran perfectly
[08:07] <poltak> until I connected to wifi
[08:07] <poltak> then i got kernel panic
[08:07] <poltak> ...
[08:07] <bioterror> what's your wifi chipset
[08:08] <poltak> and then I tried to connect to a different wifi hotspot and it happened again
[08:08] <poltak> It's on an eee pc 1001px (r101 in some regions), so I'm pretty sure it uses some kind of atheros chipset
[08:08] <bioterror> lspci or lsusb
[08:08] <bioterror> should tell it
[08:08] <bioterror> depends where it is connected
[08:09] <poltak> yep, I'll do that in a sec
[08:09] <bioterror> |grep Network
[08:11] <poltak> yep, atheros AR2427
[08:11] <bioterror> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/linux/+bug/762496
[08:12] <poltak> Thought it might be something wrong with the kernel, so I tried connecting it via ethernet once I got home, but then realised ethernet drivers don't work ootb :P
[08:12] <poltak> (to update)
[08:12] <poltak> oh lovely
[08:12] <bioterror> change wpa2 to wpa or even wep with mac filtering, hahaha
[08:13] <poltak> so "fix committed" means it's not yet fixed, yes?
[08:14] <bioterror> The new proposed kernel 2.6.38-9 seems to fix the problem, no more kernel panic for now...
[08:15] <poltak> strange, I was running a fairly up-to-date 2.6.38-* kernel on Arch distro on it before and never had these issues
[08:15] <poltak> but yeah, I suppose there's not much to help it other than updating
[08:15] <jmarsden> poltak: "Fix committed" means the fix has been created but not yet released to the general Ubuntu-using public, basically.
[08:16] <bioterror> use ppa
[08:16] <poltak> oh oh I see, I'll check that out now :)
[08:16] <poltak> thanks for your help and responses guys
[12:54] <callaghan> Hi everyone. I've just installed Lubuntu 11.04 and it's cool so far. One thing, though: Is it possible to move the window buttons to the left side like they are in Ubuntu? I'm just so used to it.
[12:58] <bioterror> oh just like in OS X
[12:59] <callaghan> bioterror: Exactly :)
[13:01] <bioterror> hmmm
[13:01] <bioterror> dunno if that's possible with obconf
[13:03] <bioterror> as ex-os x user I never liked that
[13:05] <callaghan> bioterror: It took a long time for mee too to get used to it, but now I move to the wrong side of the window every time. Thanks for the obconf command, I'll take a look if some setting is in there.
[13:08] <bioterror> there's button configuration
[13:08] <bioterror> not so sure if it moves anything
[13:08] <bioterror> might just change orders
[13:15] <callaghan> bioterror: Yeah, thanks. In obconf/appearance/button order, just enter "CMILN" and it's like OS X. Thanks :)
[13:55] <yoshi_> hej, can I ask for support. from the live cd startx won't work but it comes with a gui, doesnt it?
[13:56] <phillw> live cd comes with gui
[13:57] <yoshi_> well it says failed to load module nvidia (module does not exist, 0)
[14:00] <phillw> do you have nvidea graphics?
[14:01] <yoshi_> yeah, thats to new?
[14:02] <phillw> which version of lubuntu are you running?
[14:05] <yoshi_> newst one, just downloaded to see how it is
[14:08] <phillw> yoshi_: have a read of http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1742952 that should get you up and running, it is very clearly written, so should be easy to follow.
[14:12] <yoshi_> thanks for this threat. I will definitely come back to that when i install it ;)
[14:19] <andygraybeal> yay official! hooray
[14:20] <andygraybeal> i wonder if they will retire xubuntu!
[14:23] <sagaci> no
[14:23] <poltak> sagaci: why you tell me this?
[14:47] <szczur> hi guys
[14:47] <bioterror> hi sz
[14:47] <MrChrisDruif> Aloha
[14:48] <bioterror> are you from tahiti or what?
[14:48] <szczur> :P
[14:49] <MrChrisDruif> Nope, I wish I was from Hawaii thou
[17:14] <Ahmuck> is there a way to set tab length in the story editor?
[17:59] <Timo_> Ahmuck: isn't there a file in the .config folder where you can set stuff like that?
[18:07] <lubuntu_lover> hi there. how do i install firefox (or anything else) on lubuntu? where can i find the software center?
[18:17] <Ahmuck> Timo_: sorry, wrong channel.  i meant scribus
[18:20] <Timo_> well same thing relaly
[18:21] <Timo_> if there is a config entry, you can change it, if not, probablyt not :p
[19:15] <winsen1> hello everybody
[19:16] <winsen1> how can i see my partition type? i mean if it is on fat, ext3 or ext4...etc ; thank you
[19:17] <winsen1> what's the command line?
[19:17] <bioterror> sudo blkid
[19:17] <bioterror> for example
[19:17] <bioterror> df -hT
hi, thank you for answer, unfortunly it doesn't work
[19:20] <bioterror> how so
[19:21] <bioterror> explain
[19:21] <bioterror> sad157@dopethrone:~% sudo blkid                        .:21:21:31 on 11-05-16:.
[19:21] <bioterror> /dev/sda1: LABEL="Windows" UUID="3EE0E0DEE0E09D81" TYPE="ntfs"
[19:21] <winsen1> it says df needs an argumant "t"
[19:22] <bioterror> and df -hT works
[19:22] <bioterror> notice the CAPITAL T
[19:22] <bioterror> which means type
[19:24] <winsen1> yes it works now thank you very mutch
[19:24] <winsen1> with capital T
[19:24] <winsen1> but only on root
[19:24] <winsen1> without sudo
[19:27] <winsen1> i mean i should be superuser to use this command, it's ok thanks
[19:27] <bioterror> blkid requires sudo
[19:28] <bioterror> df does not
 but "sudo bllkid" doesn't work
[19:29] <bioterror> blkid
[19:30] <winsen1> yes blkid works only on superuser
[19:30] <winsen1> both on superuser
[19:34] <winsen1> with "blkid" comand we've  UUID information add, but i personnly i prefer "df -hT" presentation
are you there man?
[19:36] <bioterror> yes
[19:36] <bioterror> reading about acpid
[19:38] <winsen1> sorry what 's acpid?
[19:38] <bioterror> !acpi
[19:38] <bioterror> !acpid
[19:39] <bioterror> haa
[19:39] <bioterror> bot doesnt know
[19:39] <bioterror> ACPID is a completely flexible, totally extensible daemon for delivering ACPI events. It listens on a file (/proc/acpi/event) and when an event occurs, executes programs to handle the event. The programs it executes are configured through a set of configuration files, which can be dropped into place by packages or by the admin.
thanks for information
[19:43] <winsen1> can you tell me witch is best magazine computer? 2 or 3
[19:48] <bioterror> winsen1, I dont understand that question
[19:51] <winsen1> sorry my english is so bad, i am searching for best "computer magazine
[19:51] <bioterror> why? :D
[19:51] <bioterror> you can read omgbuntu :D
[19:52] <MrChrisDruif> xD
[19:52] <MrChrisDruif> It's pretty much the best there is about Ubuntu indeed
[19:52] <winsen1> omgbuntu?
[19:53] <winsen1> is it special for ubuntu ?
[19:54] <bioterror> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/
[19:57] <winsen1> ok, you didn't answer me, i am asking you if it's special for ubuntu magazine?
[19:58] <MrChrisDruif> Not a magazine, online newssite
[19:59] <winsen1> ok, thank you
[19:59] <winsen1> but it's specialy for ubuntu, is it?
[20:00] <bioterror> there's Linux journal on some other
[20:00] <bioterror> 90's magazines
[20:00] <bioterror> they just offers you news from the past
[20:02] <winsen1> ok, i see, you mean there's no magazine as i am searchin, do you?
[20:02] <winsen1> or newwsite
[20:03] <winsen1> sorry newssite but for all systems
[20:05] <winsen1> anyway, can you tell me with command can show me IP adress under (linux, windows, Mac OS X)?
[20:05] <bioterror> ifconfig
[20:05] <gomiboy> linux/osx = ifconfig windows = ipconfig
[20:05] <winsen1> i wonder if that exist
[20:06] <bioterror> gomiboy, rather *nix
[20:06] <winsen1> i mean only one command for all system
[20:06] <gomiboy> bioterror: i wanted to be question specific :3
[20:06] <gomiboy> the one ring to rule them all? ;)
[20:08] <bioterror> !man | winsen1
[20:09] <winsen1> i've had this question  on exam;  = echo $IP under php program
[20:11] <winsen1> but i don't understand why they 've given this question, cause on linux, or windows or Mac doesn't have php by default...
do you agree with me?
[20:13] <bioterror> why my school gave me a practice to write a windows script ;)
[20:14] <winsen1> <bioterror>sorry, i dont understand , what do you mean
[20:18] <Ahmuck> ifconfig
[20:19] <Ahmuck> will show you the ip address
[21:08] <head_victim> gilir: let me know when you're finished on the "todo" page ;)
[21:09] <MrChrisDruif> Indeed
[21:10] <gilir> head_victim, you can go, I'll wait for the next edit :)
[21:10] <head_victim> Cool I take 2 mins at most
[21:13] <head_victim> I'm done, NEXT! :)
hi, only for linux
[22:12] <phillw> head_victim: thanks, I'm just back on WW3 at the moment :/
[22:12] <head_victim> phillw: no worries mate, just making sure you didn't have plans for it that would make my change not work
[23:41]  * Newk discovers lxshortcut


[09:34] <BUGabundo> btw guud morning guys
[09:37] <asac> gm
[09:51] <asac> fta: daily builds blew up? got a bunch of fails
[09:51] <asac> or was that from yesterday?
[10:25] <BUGabundo1> fta: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/pastebinit/+bug/337666
[10:51] <fta> asac, https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-daily/+archive/ppa
[10:51] <fta> I moved the dailies earlier
[10:52] <asac> fta: moved?
[10:54] <fta> for 4am to 7pm
[10:54] <fta> from
[11:03] <asac> ah
[11:15] <BUGabundo1> asac: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/305567
[11:16] <BUGabundo1> it just confirmed by another user
[11:16] <BUGabundo1> and an upstream bug
[11:16] <fta> works for me in 3.2
[11:19] <BUGabundo1> yeah
[11:19] <fta> but it's of no use for me, with >150 tabs
[11:37] <BUGabundo1> eheh
[11:38] <BUGabundo1> open more windows
[11:38] <fta> why? 1 is enough
[11:40] <BUGabundo1> not for me
[11:40] <BUGabundo1> each window is a subject
[11:44] <asac> BUGabundo1: 100% sure one of your 40+ extensions
[11:53] <BUGabundo1> LOL
[11:53] <BUGabundo1> 53 last counted
[11:54] <fta> you need an extension to count them now ;)
[11:54] <BUGabundo1> yes
[11:55] <fta> i have one to count the tabs: Tab Counter 1.8
[11:56] <BUGabundo1> ROFL
[11:56] <BUGabundo1> I just save a session with tab mix plus
[11:56] <BUGabundo1> and that tells me how many I have
[11:57] <fta> i dropped tmp during the ff3.0 cycle, it created too many regressions, and ff3.0 catched up on the features so it's no longer needed
[11:58] <fta> asac, i like this one to debug extensions or even bad packaging: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/4453
[12:02] <asac> fta: hmm. does that work for xul too? i mean do you see the xul chrome files in ffox?
[12:03] <fta> i think so, try it :)
[12:34] <asac> first i have to figure out why gtk apps dont honour fontconfig
[12:41] <fta> boooh https://edge.launchpad.net/+builds spoiled by private builds
[12:57] <fta> jcastro, how can I move https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Chromium outside of MozillaTeam?
[13:37] <asac> fta: rename
[13:41] <fta> oh, ok
[13:41] <fta> asac, btw, did you read it?
[13:41] <fta> i will probably create chromium-ia32-libs with a different content
[13:42] <fta> per arch
[13:42] <fta> -arch+dist
[13:42] <fta> probably not the best idea but it's messy anyway
[13:54] <asac> fta: no. you forked your stuff out of mozillateam :) ... so i dont really track chromium stuff anymore
[13:55] <fta> it was about nss/nspr but nm if you're not interested
[13:56] <fta> i forked it because chromium is not related to mozilla, not because i didn't want you to contribute, sorry if you felt it that way :(
[14:30] <jcastro> fta: sure!
[14:30] <fta> jcastro, about the wiki? nm, i renamed the page
[14:31] <jcastro> ok
[14:38] <asac> fta: i am waiting for reply from wah-teh
[14:38] <asac> what he thinks
[14:44] <fta> debian bug 497087
[15:17] <asac> fta: http://identi.ca/asac ... your image is still a name there ;)
[15:17] <asac> not sure what you did wrong, but you seem to be a minority ;)
[15:18] <fta> hmm
[15:18] <asac> kenvadine also has the same issue
[15:20] <fta> no idea, in my prefs, it's fine
[15:23] <asac> fta: well. your pic is fine on your page too
[15:23] <asac> just the smal image not
[15:23] <asac> is that a png?
[15:23] <asac> or jpeg?
[15:23] <asac> maybe try the other format ;)
[15:24] <asac> i would think that scaling pngs is harder ;)
[15:24] <asac> if anything is hard at all
[15:26] <fta> jpeg, from gimp
[15:27] <fta> from the m-t picture in pragues
[15:27] <asac> ;)
[15:27] <asac> see how its useful
[15:28] <asac> fta: hmm. so maybe try png
[15:28] <asac> seems mine was a png (if i can trust the preview)
[15:29] <asac> fta: http://paste.ubuntu.com/126310/
[15:29] <fta> ?
[15:30] <BUGabundo> latest linux update lost my intel wifi
[15:30] <BUGabundo> :((
[15:34] <asac> fta: patch that into your gtk. and you get real fontconfig experience
[15:34] <asac> so finally you can fix the rules and stuff will look the same everywhere ;)
[15:34] <asac> current situation is more than borked
[15:34] <asac> i am doing the right fix for that after this sec round
[15:34] <fta> asac, i forwarded you a complain from someone finding ff31/32 ugly
[15:34] <asac> e.g. implement "automatic (fontconfig)" mode in gnome-settings daemon and implementing the proper controls for that in control center
[15:34] <asac> fta: no need to ;)
[15:35] <asac> fta: the reason is really the "left-over" stuff from fontconfig
[15:35] <asac> e.g. 10-no-subpixel ... or even the other without number you had
[15:35]  * asac finally became a font-apprentice
[15:35] <asac> ;)
[15:36] <fta> png is fine now
[15:40] <asac> fta: thanks ;)
[15:41] <asac> there you are :)
[16:19] <asac> fta: i really think we should invent something to make get-orig-source smarter for "releases"
[16:20] <asac> fta: something similar to .bzr-builddeb/default.conf ... we could commit .mozclient/default.conf ... and put metadata like DEBIAN_TAG=....
[16:20] <asac> in there
[16:20] <asac> so i could bump that when bumping the stable release
[16:21] <fta> the only thing we need to store is the tag
[16:21] <fta> when one has been used
[16:22] <asac> fta: yeah. but why not allow to set the complete DEBIAN_TAG= line?
[16:22] <asac> e.g. DEBIAN_TAG=MOZILLA_1...=3.0+final1
[16:22] <asac> hmm
[16:23] <asac> actually it should be clear which version to use from changelog
[16:23] <asac> but otoh, that smells like a place for inconsitencies on how it works for snapshots vs. releases
[16:23] <asac> for now i prefer to put the complete line in there
[16:23] <asac> but that can change of course ;)
[16:23] <asac> just got the idea a minute ago ;)
[16:24] <fta> i need to let it boil for a little while in my tired brain..
[16:25] <asac> fta: yeah. thats what i mean :)
[16:25] <fta> i'm currently concerned about ia32-libs containing obsolete copies of tons of libs
[16:27] <asac> fta: my hint: don't bother. you will open a box and will get rid of the things you didnt call for ;)
[16:28] <asac> fta: a good idea was to just tell \sh to add stuff ;)
[16:28] <asac> at least for me it worked to delegate it away
[16:28] <asac> avoiding headaches and screem sessions ;)
[16:28] <asac> scream
[17:09] <jcastro> asac: huats is on python-webkitgtk
[17:10] <asac> jcastro: yeah. already got that through identica ;)
[17:10] <asac> http://identi.ca/notice/2601038
[17:12]  * asac again struck by bzr-builddeb brokennes with python 2.6
[17:12] <asac> sigh
[17:13] <asac> re ln'ing
[19:03] <fta> Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "canberra-gtk-module": /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/modules/libcanberra-gtk-module.so: wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS64
[19:03] <fta> hm
[19:12] <asac> fta: thats known
[19:12] <asac> well. i see it too ;)
[19:12] <asac> ia32libs probably lacks that too?
[19:33] <fta> yes, but i'm not sure gtk is smart enough to change the modules path when doing ia32
[19:34] <fta> doesn't seems to be a showstopper though, at least not for now
[19:34] <fta> -s
[19:34] <fta> i have an amd64 build of chromium running just fine
[20:31]  * asac scared for using a THUNDERBIRD tag to checkout a firefox 1.8.1 tree :/
[20:31] <asac> fta: i think it is
[20:31] <asac> fta: we had the same issues with themes and engines... adding those was enough to fix that
[20:31] <fta> ?
[20:32] <fta> "it is" ?
[20:32] <asac> fta: smart enough ;)
[20:32] <asac> make -f client.mk checkout MOZ_CO_PROJECT=browser
[20:32] <asac> checkout start: Wed Mar 4 21:32:21 CET 2009
[20:32] <asac> cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs-mirror.mozilla.org:/cvsroot -q -z 3  co  -r THUNDERBIRD_2_0_0_21_RELEASE   mozilla/client.mk mozilla/browser/config/mozconfig mozilla/build/unix/modules.mk mozilla/build/unix/uniq.pl
[20:32] <asac> :-P
[20:33] <asac> i guess i should check the tag status of some browser/ toolkit/ files
[20:33] <asac> 20:33 < fta> yes, but i'm not sure gtk is smart enough to change the modules path when doing ia32
[20:33] <fta> use mozclient
[20:33] <asac> fta: how would that help if there is no THUNDERBIRD tag for some files that are not thunderbird?
[20:33] <asac> fta: its ffox 1.8.1 also we dont have it intregrated
[20:34] <fta> it's a matter of creating a local .conf file
[20:34] <asac> heh ;)
[20:34] <fta> you are saying that the tag is not properly done upstream? it's another story
[20:34] <asac> thats a "stable" package ,)
[20:35] <asac> fta: i am not scared that i do that manually ... i am scared that i use a THUNDERBIRD tag to bake a firefox EOL release ;)
[20:35] <asac> scare that i get unreproducible situations because not everything is tagged ;)
[20:35] <asac> but i think it is
[20:35] <asac> at least a few files in browser/ are
[20:35] <fta> the conf file is just an addon, it should not impact the build at all, but well, do as you prefer ;)
[20:35] <asac> hehe
[20:36] <asac> i will think about it ;)
[20:36] <asac> i still hope that those branches become EOL in ubuntu sson
[20:36] <fta> bug 337903
[20:36] <asac> hmm. isnt gutsy EOL yet?
[20:36] <fta> do we have that in the repo now?
[20:36] <asac> fta: yes. sure
[20:36] <asac> sunbird.head
[20:36] <fta> songbird
[20:36] <asac> oh ;)
[20:36] <asac> hehe
[20:36] <asac> fta: how was that submitted?
[20:37] <asac> interesting. i will tell pitti
[20:37] <fta> donno, just got that bug mail
[20:37] <asac> i mean crashes being submitted against ubuntu if there is no package probably doesnt make much sense
[20:37] <asac> though otoh, in that way users can report 3.2 crashes ;)
[20:37] <asac> fta: are you subscribed to the songbird upstream project?
[20:37] <asac> oh. also notified. mozilla team
[20:37] <asac> hmm
[20:38] <asac> probably sonbird has mt as bug driver
[20:38] <asac> nice
[20:38] <asac> should be mozilla-bugs though i think
[20:38] <fta> damn http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23440353/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-amd64.ia32-libs-chromium-browser_0.01~ucd1~hardy_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[20:38] <asac> hardy only?
[20:39] <asac> oh ia32
[20:39] <fta> https://edge.launchpad.net/~chromium-daily/+archive/ppa
[20:39] <asac> please dont build ia32 daily :(
[20:39] <fta> ?
[20:40] <asac> fta: thoguht you build ia32-libs in daily now ;)
[20:40] <asac> i mean on a daily base
[20:40] <asac> s: cannot access /usr/lib32/libnspr4.so.*: No such file or directory
[20:40] <fta> the package is just an helper to add the missing links, it's not daily built, but it's needed for chromium on amd64
[20:40] <asac> maybe those libs are gone ?
[20:40] <asac> i mean we renamed the soname
[20:41] <fta> yeah, my bad, it wasn't supposed to fail but ignore.
[20:41] <asac> not sure if someone fixed that in ia32libs
[20:41] <fta> nss/nspr are not in ia32libs in hardy: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Chromium/Build
[20:41] <asac> fta: is that package supposed to provide -dev as awell=?
[20:41] <asac> fta: i know
[20:42] <asac> fta: but cool. that you tackle that
[20:42]  * asac looks forward running chrome on his amd64
[20:43] <asac> even on hardy ;)
[20:46] <fta> i don't really know how to stick nss/nspr into my ia32-libs-chromium-browser package just for hardy
[20:46] <fta> add the debs in my branch??
[20:47] <asac> fta: depend on lsb-base or something and check output of lsb_release -r or lsb_release -c
[20:47] <asac> fta: and add the deps everywhere
[20:47] <asac> just dont install them for != hardy
[20:48] <asac> that would be in line to our nice approach for keeping our moz packages buildable everywhere
[20:48] <asac> without tweakage of deps
[21:13] <asac> fta: i guess the folks are not happy that all umds are now on +builds i386 ;
[21:13] <asac> fta: funny puck ;)(
[21:22] <asac> ouch
[21:29] <asac> tar cvjf firefox-<IP_ADDRESS>~tbird.21+nobinonly.tar.bz2 mozilla/
[21:29] <asac> :)
[21:30] <asac> i rather should use tb
[21:30] <asac> more cryptic and lest exciting -> less noise
[21:42] <fta> -rw-r--r-- 1 fta fta 305833390 2009-03-04 20:06 chromium-browser_<IP_ADDRESS>~svn20090304r10900.orig.tar.gz
[21:43] <fta> 305833390
[21:50] <asac> thats insane ;)
[22:11] <fta> hm, why nss/nspr should i take for hardy? http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/n/nss/
[22:11] <fta> asac, ^^
[22:12] <fta> !info nss hardy
[22:13] <fta> !info libnss3-dev hardy
[22:13] <fta> !info libnss3-dev hardy-updates
[22:14] <Nafallo> o_O
[22:14] <Nafallo> it has jaunty-backports, but not hardy-updates
[22:14] <Nafallo> how... helpful :-)
[22:15] <fta> asac, ^^ s/why/which/
[22:18] <fta> hm, hardy = 3.12.0~beta3-0ubuntu1, hardy-updates = <IP_ADDRESS>-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>
[22:19] <fta> google is using 3.12.0~beta3-0ubuntu1
[22:19] <fta> i mean, chromium
[22:27] <asac> even official builders seem overloaded: https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-security/+archive/ppa
[22:27] <asac> fta: i dont know whats up with the bot ... try -proposed
[22:27] <asac> !info libnss3-dev hardy-proposed
[22:27] <asac> so yeah
[22:27] <asac> !info libnss3-dev hardy
[22:28] <asac> thats ok
[22:28] <asac> fta: so seems the bot looks at -updates for hardy
[22:28] <asac> main  updates  <IP_ADDRESS>-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>
[22:28] <fta> yep
[22:39] <fta> mozlla Bug 422540
[22:39] <fta> mozilla Bug 422540
[22:40] <fta> hm, bugzilla said "fixed"
[22:40] <asac> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_activity.cgi?id=422540
[22:40] <asac> dont see that there
[22:41] <fta> oh, mozilla bug 382267,
[22:42] <asac> ok off for 20 minutes
[22:42] <fta> confusing http://paste.ubuntu.com/126463/
[22:43] <asac> yeah ;)
[22:43] <asac> thats bugzilla
[23:29] <fta> asac, you can try chromium-browser on amd64 jaunty & intredid right now if you use my PPA
[23:34] <asac> fta: fta PPA?
[23:34] <fta> yes
[23:34] <fta> the daily is coming, but builders are busy
[23:35] <fta> it should be ok for hardy too
[23:36] <fta> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~chromium-team/chromium-browser/ia32-libs-chromium-browser.head
[23:38] <asac> it starts
[23:38] <asac> i will try more when i finished this UI freeze thing
[23:38] <asac> in an hour
[23:38] <asac> (i hope)
[23:50] <fta> eh? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23449107/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-amd64.ia32-libs-chromium-browser_0.01~fta2~hardy_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz


[22:01] <BrianHechinger[m> OvenWerks: Just upgraded to 21.10. I like the new Studio Controls layout.
[22:07] <BrianHechinger[m> one small nit. Ray Session got uninstalled during the upgrade. (I didn't know this) when I clicked on the Start RaySession button it turned into a grayed out button saying I needed to install it first (VERY SLICK I LOVE IT) but it gets "stuck" pressed in and the only way to fix it was to restart Studio Controls (obviously not a big deal)


[00:43] <jamie12> anyone know if the sony xperia z3c has a port?
[00:52] <jamie12> or if CyanogenMod firmware has been ported to ubuntu?
[04:58] <karthik> Hi, i have aquaris E5 ubuntu touch phone. It is getting stuck at bq splash banner. how can i fix it?
[05:18] <koneboo> hello
[05:19] <koneboo> ?
[05:52] <wjx> I get package iso-codes_3.57-1_all.deb Size mismatch error when trying to create build target in SDK , Does  anyone know this problem?
[06:03] <lotuspsychje> karthik: maybe try power + vol down hold to reset?
[06:03] <lotuspsychje> karthik: branching usb perhaps
[06:08] <karthik> lotuspsychje,  i tried resetting but didnt worked.
[06:08] <karthik> lotuspsychje, i was working in the backup, theere i guess i might have corrupted some files.
[06:08] <karthik> backend*
[06:40] <lotuspsychje> karthik: youl might have to restore the BQ image to your phone...
[06:41] <karthik> lotuspsychje, any link available?
[06:41] <lotuspsychje> karthik: the one in the topic shows howto install, guide
[06:42] <lotuspsychje> karthik: then in the available images you need the bq one
[06:42] <karthik> lotuspsychje,  thankyou.. i will try that
[07:05] <karthik> lotuspsychje, i reproduced the steps specified, but when i ran "ubuntu-device-flash touch --channel=ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu --bootstrap" i am getting following error "mkdir /root/.cache: permission denied"?
[07:06] <lotuspsychje> hmmm
[07:07] <lotuspsychje> karthik: did you do that bootloader unlock thing?
[07:08] <karthik> nope.
[07:09] <lotuspsychje> karthik: best to follow the steps real carefull, and make sure you got the right image for BQ right, not another image
[07:10] <karthik> lotuspsychje, okay :)
[16:16] <bshah> ogra_: ping, around?
[16:55] <ogra_> bshah, only for a moment, whats up ?
[20:09] <CheeryLee> Hello everyone! Could you help me?
[20:16] <tathhu> mAYBe~
[20:16] <CheeryLee> So, I built Ubuntu Touch on my Samsung tablet, but... don't know how to flash system
[20:17] <CheeryLee> All methods in Internet are deprecated
[20:17] <CheeryLee> rootstock-touch-install erase cache directory after install.
[20:18] <CheeryLee> Some ways?
[20:19] <k1l> doesnt the porting guide tell about?
[20:19] <CheeryLee> Yep, porting guide contains info about flashing device.
[20:20] <CheeryLee> I already wrote abou it
[20:23] <CheeryLee> Nobody knows? The big system with no support. It's sadly.
[20:25] <mcphail> CheeryLee: this channel is sparesely populated on a SUnday evening (europe time), and many regulars will be returning from UbuCon/SCaLE in California. I suggest you take the time to carefully formulate your question (including what you have done already, what guides you are following etc) and ask again in European office hours later this week
[20:30] <CheeryLee> I followed official wiki. All done perfectly (building kernel, system etc). But rootstock script doesn't flash the device. It only push the Ubuntu tarball  in cache and erase it after rebooting.
[20:30] <CheeryLee> So, thanks for your reply! :)
[20:31] <CheeryLee> I will come tommorow
[20:31] <CheeryLee> tomorrow*
[20:31] <mcphail> CheeryLee: good luck
[20:45] <dobey> https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/start/ubuntu-for-devices/porting-new-device/ seems pretty clear
[23:23]  * ljp yawns


[05:08] -queuebot:#lubuntu-devel- Unapproved: libfm-qt (disco-proposed/universe) [0.14.1-0ubuntu2 => 0.14.1-0ubuntu2.1] (lubuntu)
[05:11] <tsimonq2> wxl: ^
 SRU testing stuff
 I ran sudo do-release-upgrade -d. And it says download will take 2 mins and after that actual upgrade may take hours, it doesn't know. I hit yes. Now downloading. How much time does it usually take for upgrade?
[05:28] <tsimonq2> It depends on your machine and network speed.
 Network speed is good. I am running in a vm with 2gb ram.
 Done. In 19.10
 @HMollerCl window tilling is removed.
 @The_LoudSpeaker [@HMollerCl window tilling is removed.], @lynorian won't be happy
 Should we keep window tilling?
 I believe we should
 but not with Meta or Super key
 Alt+arrow keys?
[15:56] <lynorian> I understand why it was done unfortanetly
[15:56] <lynorian> I could always add it back
[15:56] <lynorian> if I really wanted to
 Wait, why not Meta or Super?
[15:59] <lynorian> @universalsuperbox super would not work with opening menu on super as it would just open the menu
 KDE has solved that problem, it involves treating Super as a modifier and non-modifier key. But I understand that's not a simple solution
 Standard for desktops that have that limitation is Control+Super
 +Arrow (Left for tile left, Right for tile right, Up for maximize, Down for unmaximize)
 @UniversalSuperBox problem is with openbox, in openbox there is no "release key" (for meta alone to open menu) and it conflicts with lxqt
 @HMollerCl the Ctrl+Fx setup for switching to desktop 'x' is there currently. It is modified to Super+Fx since D18.
 aaa ok. My point was that we could use ctrl+alt+arrows for the tiling instead as changing desktop becasue other keys allready do that.
 That also seems a little non-standard. Super+number launches a docked application in most DEs
 Not that being nonstandard is a bad thing, just playing devil's advocate
 @UniversalSuperBox [+Arrow (Left for tile left, Right for tile right, Up for maximize, Down for unma …], Personally I like that.
 ^we need to take care of this, good point @UniversalSuperBox we should use the standards, other wise we could broke othe things.
 By standard I mean "People notice it very clearly when it is gone". The trend was started by Windows 7 and Unity.
 There seems no standard. We could follow ubuntu. Wait Inwill send a link.
 Unity had the same Super problem, though, so it used Control+Super for tiling
 Should we follow this: … https://help.ubuntu.com/stable/ubuntu-help/shell-keyboard-shortcuts.html.en
 I think we should as much as we can. wxl?
 @The_LoudSpeaker [Should we follow this: … https://help.ubuntu.com/stable/ubuntu-help/shell-keyboard …], But that page also doesn't have any info about tilling.
 We could try to follow ubuntu but it's shortcuts are tailored for gnome. Not lxqt.
 I know, that's why I say "as much as we can".
 wxl: waiting for you.
[16:33] <lynorian> fwiw alt+left or right arrow would break keyboard back and forward in firefox
 yes, alt+ is normally use for the app controls.
 Right, that's why shortcuts around Super are better for the desktop environment.
 Pesky apps like those Control and Alt keys
[16:39] <wxl> there's nothing wrong with using super
[16:39] <wxl> just not in openbox, at least not while we have super opening the menu in lxqt
[16:40] <wxl> and personally i am *** NOT *** willing to base everything around supporting a crappy version of window tiling. that's something that should not get a first level shortcut
[16:41] <wxl> if we want to worry about what everyone else does, i totally support that but we should look at what EVERYONE else does. i think we'll find there are actually few standards at all
 Every other DE has gone through this bug (Super can't be a modifier and a key) and fixed it. I don't think rejiggering your shortcuts is the real solution here, even though the real solution is way harder.
[16:43] <wxl> the real solution is way harder when upstream kind of doesn't support it
 there are 2 things: 1) openbox can't handle Super as modifier and key, but lxqt can. 2) openbox can do "tilinig" but lxqt can't.
 With tham in min we can define the shortcuts to make them "standard"
 so, leave all super to lxqt, and use another combination for tiling without super in openbox.
[16:45] <wxl> https://github.com/lxqt/lxqt/issues/1605
[16:45] <wxl> if we didn't use openbox, i'm sure we wouldn't have this problem
[16:46] <wxl> ^^ Unit193 looks like ubot93 is broken
[16:48] <wxl> anyone really familiar with dualbooting windows want to get in on this madness? https://discourse.lubuntu.me/t/oops-grub-and-windows-boot-loader-both-working/155
[16:51] <apt-ghetto> First, he has to reinstall the windows bootloader into the MBR and then he can remove grub from Lubuntu
[16:51] <wxl> it's all yours apt-ghetto :)
[16:52] <apt-ghetto> I am not registered
[16:52] <wxl> i'm sure you can fix that :)
[16:52] <kc2bez> I had to DDG EasyBCD, never heard of that one before.
[16:54] <apt-ghetto> I fear, that after the successful registration, I will have less time to spend for programming and packaging and bug reporting
 Mute notifications lol
[16:55] <wxl> yuuup
[16:56] <apt-ghetto> A propos packaging: Is there something to do regarding the keyfile/initramfs problem?
[16:57] <teward> apt-ghetto: you mean with Cala?
[16:57] <apt-ghetto> Yes
[16:57] <teward> not until they have confirmed fixes, IMO, that work
[16:57] <teward> even if they don't have it in a 'release'
[16:57] <teward> since I think they said they had to test their 'committed workaround'
[16:57] <apt-ghetto> There are some commits, but they are not sure, if it will fix the problem
[16:58] <teward> that's why i said they have to test
 @apt-ghetto [<apt-ghetto> First, he has to reinstall the windows bootloader into the MBR and …], His windows bootloader is already in mbr. He just has to remove grub.
[17:07] <wxl> @The_LoudSpeaker sounds like YOU need to respond XD
 Yup! in a min.
[17:08] <apt-ghetto> As far as I understand, he installed Ubuntu, so Grub was also installed into the MBR and the system is booting Grub
 wxl: have you checked about D18? whether we need lxqt-globalconf separate or not?
 @apt-ghetto [<apt-ghetto> As far as I understand, he installed Ubuntu, so Grub was also insta …], Yeah. but you mentioned he needs to reinstall windows bootmgr. he doesn't.
[17:10] <apt-ghetto> He has to install the windows loader to overwrite Grub in the MBR, and then he can chainload bootmgr or grub
[17:11] <wxl> haven't yet @The_LoudSpeaker
 Yeah. I you are right. in mbr only last installed bootloader remains. My bad. XD
[17:12] <apt-ghetto> No problem
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[18:34] <lynorian> Welcome back lugito
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[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUALee619b7c9722: Properly style fast menu text] wxl (Walter Lapchynski) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUALee619b7c9722
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rLIBFMQTPACKAGING4e3f68e82b01: Upload to Disco.] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rLIBFMQTPACKAGING4e3f68e82b01
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T59: fix keyboard shortcuts] wxl (Walter Lapchynski) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T59#1260
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUAL711fbcbeebb0: Style set position tab] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUAL711fbcbeebb0
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUAL676ddb6692c5: Add default fonts for noblenote] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUAL676ddb6692c5
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUAL05964ef4a076: Add  multimonitor fast screenshot] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUAL05964ef4a076
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T59: fix keyboard shortcuts] wxl (Walter Lapchynski) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T59#1251
[18:37] <tsimonq2> Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeez.
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T32: Make checksum verification automatic] Tj (Tj) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T32#1235
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUALee619b7c9722: Properly style fast menu text] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUALee619b7c9722
[18:37] <tsimonq2> Good work lynorian :)
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUAL979819c8b153: Add extending displays and boxes for exact pixel alignment] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUAL979819c8b153
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T30: Theme GRUB] apt-ghetto (apt-ghetto) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T30#1244
[18:37] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T25: Make Calamares work well with smaller screens] kc2bez (Dan Simmons) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T25#1317
[18:38] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T59: fix keyboard shortcuts] wxl (Walter Lapchynski) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T59#1313
[18:38] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUALcab947d380cc: Add summary of Fast Menu tab] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUALcab947d380cc
[18:38] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUAL2eb69e58a27d: Update lxqt-panel-config.png screenshot] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUAL2eb69e58a27d
[18:43] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T87: Calamares: Address security issue related to FDE] teward (Thomas Ward) just created this task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T87
[18:43] <teward> *derps and adds a task for reasons*
[18:48] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T87: Calamares: Address security issue related to FDE] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T87#1339
[18:50] <apt-ghetto> tsimonq2: I was playing with qemu and I replaced calamares from https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-ci/+archive/ubuntu/unstable-ci-proposed/+build/17215555 (with the latest commits), but I got an error with initramfs during installation
[18:52] <tsimonq2> apt-ghetto: What's the error?
[18:52] <apt-ghetto> https://termbin.com/3bdd
[18:53] <tsimonq2> apt-ghetto: Please ping [ade] in #calamares, that default timeout value needs to be raised I think.
[18:53] <tsimonq2> At least see what he thinks.
[18:53] <apt-ghetto> Not sure, if I forgot something or if it is a "known", but fixed bug
[18:54] <apt-ghetto> We had some initramfs problem some weeks ago
[18:55] <tsimonq2> Right,
[18:56] <tsimonq2> My reasoning in asking him is that he rewrote that whole module.
 I think that got fixed
[18:56] <tsimonq2> Right, the error we had got fixed.
[18:58] <apt-ghetto> And it is in the latest iso?
[18:58] <tsimonq2> The new version of Calamares isn't.
[18:59] <tsimonq2> We're a few versions ahead in the CI.
[18:59] <tsimonq2> However, we should probably look at getting this dealt with before we update the version in the ISO.
[18:59] <tsimonq2> Nice catch, apt-ghetto
[18:59] <apt-ghetto> I downloaded calamares from the ci-proposed pocket and did a apt install ./calam...ppa
[19:00] <tsimonq2> Right
[19:00] <tsimonq2> The ISO currently has the tip of master.
[19:00] <tsimonq2> Actually...
[19:00] <tsimonq2> Ooh.
[19:01] <tsimonq2> I can probably work on doing a weekly ISO based off of the CI.
[19:01] <teward> update: simon broke things :)
[19:01] <tsimonq2> teward: noU
[19:01] <tsimonq2> SSL certs borked again
[19:01] <tsimonq2> For reasons
[19:01] <teward> evidence and information or die.
[19:01] <teward> :P
[19:01] <tsimonq2> nooope
[19:01] <tsimonq2> Neither
[19:02] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T87: Calamares: Address security issue related to FDE] teward (Thomas Ward) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T87#1340
[19:04] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [T87: Calamares: Address security issue related to FDE] tsimonq2 (Simon Quigley) commented on the task: https://phab.lubuntu.me/T87#1341
[19:07] <kc2bez> I didn't want to take cala too far for fear of incompatibility with kpmcore. That and [ADE] cranks out the new releases relentlessly :)
 You'll want to update to 3.2.11 when it comes out though :)
 But yeah, I get your point
 We still have a few months to go in the development cycle
[19:30] <apt-ghetto> There is another commit which sets the timeout to 120 seconds instead of 10 seconds
[19:31] <apt-ghetto> And in about 12 hours, our servant jenkins will build the package
 @apt-ghetto [<apt-ghetto> And in about 12 hours, our servant jenkins will build the package], Or I can just trigger a build now ;)
[19:41] <apt-ghetto> tsimonq2: You are very hard-working today, respect! And the missing ubuntu/eoan branch appeared as well in the lxqt-archiver repo
[19:56] <tsimonq2> Yep :D
[19:56] <tsimonq2> Thanks!
[22:27] <kc2bez> wxl: @tsimonq2 calamares settings, which branch do I want?
[22:34] <teward> @aptghetto it helps I'm lighting fires under Simon's butt today lol
[22:34] <teward> it's why he's so productive :P
[23:14] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUAL1f781fd2dc49: Fix show desktop shortcut in appendix F] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUAL1f781fd2dc49
 @kc2bez [<kc2bez> wxl: @tsimonq2 calamares settings, which branch do I want?], master
[23:15] <wxl> master of calamares is pulling your strings
 @tsimonq2 [master], that's what she made you say to her that one night.
 *shot*
[23:16] <kc2bez> Ok, I thought so but I was anticipating eoan to be there.
 @kc2bez [<kc2bez> Ok, I thought so but I was anticipating eoan to be there.], I'll rearrange that later
 For now, just use master
[23:16] <wxl> in case no one gets that reference https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5Sr__xoD8c
[23:16] <kc2bez> It is ok, I just wanted to make sure I was on the right branch. Thanks.
[23:18] -lugito:#lubuntu-devel- [rMANUAL088b8b182066: Fix launch pcmanfm-qt from openbox keyboard] lynorian (Lyn Perrine) committed: https://phab.lubuntu.me/rMANUAL088b8b182066
 @kc2bez [<kc2bez> It is ok, I just wanted to make sure I was on the right branch. Thanks.], Thanks for checking :)


[07:59] <JimboPea> Hi guys, I have a HP laptop with an amd apu a8, and discrete graphics. I have the latest beta driver installed. Buw when i run "aticonfig --od-getclocks" it only shows t.he clocks for the intergrated gpu and doesnt see the discrete card. Any ideas?
[08:00] <directhex> add --adapter=all ?
[08:01] <JimboPea> thanks :)
[08:06] <JimboPea> So im trying to overclock my discrete card, which is adapter 1. I know i need to run "aticonfig --od-setclocks=500,420" but im not sure how to apply this to one adapter only
[08:13] <directhex> er... try --adapter=1
[08:58] <brobostigon> good morning eveyrone,
[09:18] <Myrtti> Azelphur: where did you see the Huawei for 70quid?
[09:29] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[09:54] <AlanBell> morning
[09:58] <brobostigon> an ingress sea of blue, :)
[09:59] <bigcalm> I should really get around to playing ingress
[10:00] <brobostigon> it sucks battery, as it requires the gps to always be on.
[10:05]  * bigcalm skips off to collect his wedding rings and suit :D
[10:05] <brobostigon> :)
[10:05] <brobostigon> good luck bigcalm
[11:19]  * penguin42 realises he has three songs in his collection named 'Last train to...'
[11:30] <Azelphur> now you just need to mix them together, so you can have last train to last train to last train
[11:32] <penguin42> hmm
[14:19]  * Monotoko watches his production server fall the ground
[14:20] <Monotoko> turns out that "rm -rf ./*" is pretty close to the evil command
[14:20] <penguin42> oops
[14:21] <AlanBell> the command that shall not be named
[14:26] <Monotoko> times like this, I actually like the cloud
[14:26] <Monotoko> makes it really damn easy to restore my disk to an older version
[14:27] <Monotoko> let this be a lesson to all, don't attempt to do a quick fix on a Sunday afternoon
[15:59] <dwatkins> woohoo, finally got Ubuntu installed on my MacBook Pro using a Nifty Minidrive :D #SmugModeEngaged
[16:00] <penguin42> Monotoko: Your cloud provider provides regular snapshots or something?
[16:15] <Monotoko> penguin42: I take regular snapshots before doing anything major
[16:15] <Monotoko> so if I do screw it up I can just revert
[16:16] <penguin42> yeh always good
[16:59] <mungbean> ugh , yahoo groups is so afwul
[17:01] <mungbean> also, depending on which yahoo page i'm on, i have either no mail, 99+ emails, or 55 emails
[17:16] <popey> Evening ratfans.
[17:34] <penguin42> ratfans?
[17:35] <penguin42> Roland?
[17:46] <mungbean> just bought a set of linka moulds \o/
[17:46] <mungbean> the younglings here won't know what that is
[17:46] <ali1234> i know what those are
[17:46] <ali1234> without googling too
[17:47]  * penguin42 doesn't
[17:47] <ali1234> i'm too young but my brother had a set
[17:47] <penguin42> modelling?
[17:47] <ali1234> penguin42: they are moulds for model buildings basically - you pour in plaster and get wall pieces that link together
[17:50] <ali1234> interestingly enough one of the computer programs i am trying to recover from these C64 tapes is the program he wrote to design linka building layouts for wargaming
[17:52] <penguin42> uisng an emulator?
[17:54] <ali1234> using a tape player and recording the sound
[17:54] <penguin42> nod, I'm assuming some of the c64 emulators have demodulators for it?
[17:54] <popey> oh, i always wondered how those houses were made
[17:54] <gordonjcp> ooh, I've got some linka moulds somewhere
[17:55] <popey> didn't realise there was a whole thing to make them
[17:55] <penguin42> popey: I'd always assumed it was people who were just very clever and patient
[17:55] <popey> heh, ditto
[17:55] <ali1234> penguin42: there's software to demodulate it from wav files yes - it works well but in this case the tapes have been taped over which presents rather more difficult challenge
[17:55] <penguin42> ali1234: Hehe oh that's a bit special then
[17:56] <penguin42> ali1234: tried moving the tape head a bit on the playback machine to see if you can get one better than the other?
[17:56] <ali1234> that's what i want to try
[17:56] <ali1234> but i can't do it on my tape player cos it's a walkman
[17:57] <ali1234> so i have a plan: i built a tape winder with lego, and i'm going to try to read the tape with a floppy drive head
[17:57] <ali1234> using the stepper for fine tracking control
[17:57] <penguin42> heck, not got a clue if that would work or if the tape speeds are anywhere in similar speeds etc
[17:58] <ali1234> they are very similar
[17:59] <ali1234> track width is almost the same, floppy disk revolves a bit faster than cassette tape though
[17:59] <ali1234> but i can wind the tape any speed i like
[17:59] <penguin42> good luck
[18:00] <ali1234> the tricky bit is going to be figuring out the pin-out of the drive head and how to amplify the signal enough for a sound card
[18:00]  * penguin42 has enough tape decks around here that I could probably find one I could move
[18:00] <ali1234> i'm not old enough to have a large collection of tape players
[18:00] <penguin42> haha
[18:00] <ali1234> i do have a couple of portable CD players and a minidisc player
[18:03] <ali1234> and of course a box with about 50 old floppy drives and CD drives
[18:24] <ali1234> hmm... so my tape player has auto-reverse but it seems that the reverse heads are kind of misaligned, because the audio is very quiet from them
[18:25] <ali1234> maybe i can make use of that...
[18:27] <ali1234> either that or this tape is just disintegrating
[18:34] <mungbean> gordonjcp: made anything withthem?@
[18:34] <gordonjcp> mungbean: not for at least 30 years ;-)
[18:35] <mungbean> used to make stuff as a little kid, don't remember what happened to the moulds. thought it miht be nice family activity
[18:35] <mungbean> beats lego for creating nice stuff
[18:40] <mungbean> there's also fantasy stuff too http://www.hirstarts.com/projects.html
[18:41] <ali1234> the trouble with this type of thing, which doesn't apply to lego, is what do you do with the models when you've built them?
[18:41] <penguin42> ali1234: Run the trains around them?
[18:47] <mungbean> make dioramas
[18:48] <mungbean> make houses for the kid to play with his cars/train set
[18:48] <mungbean> for my airfix stuff, the act of creation is most of the fun but i have a display case with them in
[18:49] <mungbean> my wife is understanding because half the house is full of knitting paraphernalia
[18:52] <mungbean> i gather quite a few people do it for wargaming but i don't really know much about that
[19:21] <mungbean> watched grave of fireflies...rather depressing.
[19:41] <diddledan> was it in here that I came up against backpush about the us healthcare obamacare nhs type reforms?
[19:41] <ali1234> i doubt it
[19:41] <diddledan> yeah, so do I but I can't think where else it would be
[19:41] <ali1234> don't you have logs?
[19:41] <directhex> computery places are a bastion of hardcore liberalism. also libertarianism, though
[19:42] <diddledan> directhex: indeed
[19:42] <ali1234> ironically they are completely opposite philosophies
[19:43] <diddledan> well anyway, it's an interesting watch and completely offtopic, but I feel like sharing some "facts" about us healthcare vs nhs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSjGouBmo0M
[19:43] <ali1234> when you say pushback what do you mean exactly?
[19:43] <ali1234> i men what direction?
[19:43] <diddledan> against national healthcare
[19:44] <ali1234> i'm pretty sure everyone here loves the nhs
[19:44] <diddledan> as in pro the insurance company system
[19:44] <directhex> ali1234, economically, yes, they're opposites
[19:44] <diddledan> I certainly love the nhs
[19:44] <directhex> ali1234, very few "social conservatives" in these parts though
[19:45] <diddledan> I guess it might have been in the wordpress channel but I believe I was surprised that someone would mention it in the ubuntu-uk channel
[19:45] <diddledan> I gonna go search for logs now
[19:45] <ali1234> well there's nothing in my logs
[19:45] <ali1234> for "obama"
[19:46] <ali1234> you've only said it once before here
[19:46] <directhex> the nsa is deleting your irc logs?
[19:46] <directhex> *thanks* obama
[19:47] <diddledan> dammit, I haven't been logging
[19:47] <ali1234> that meme is hilarious
[19:47] <diddledan> logging turned on now
[19:48] <ali1234> wordpress seems a likely place for this argument - lot of americans there, and freelance web devs do tend to be libertarian in my experience
[19:48] <ali1234> the american ones anyway
[20:12] <pr0ph3t> hi all
[20:13] <popey> yo
[20:17] <pr0ph3t> I have a lil problem, I'm trying to share the public folder, with samba installed in both ubuntu boxes, but I can't see them in Browse Network, Nautilus. What's strange is that my cousing can see my shares from his mac!
[20:20] <directhex> ali1234, the thing about libertarianism is we know what it leads to - there is already a country out there living the libertarian ideal. no government interference in private affairs, no government regulation getting in the way of private enterprise. just free men and women, contracts, and private enforcement. i call this place "Libertaria", although i believe the commonly used name is "Somalia"
[20:20] <pr0ph3t> we're connected to same network, I was wondering if there was a command line way of checking available shares
[20:21] <ali1234> directhex: yes i agree
[20:21] <directhex> pr0ph3t, there is. erm... something like smbclient -L?
[20:21] <directhex> pr0ph3t, definitely smbclient is the command you want, but i can't remember the flags, it's been so long since i've used it
[20:21] <pr0ph3t> directhex, I guess the problem is in trusting human beings to much, after all some kill, rape and do other horrible things, so to say that no control is needed from "above" is to forget the nature of some human beings
[20:22] <ali1234> libertarians typically do support some government regulation though - contract law and property law but nothing else
[20:23] <bigcalm> Hi peeps :)
[20:24] <directhex> ali1234, yeah, they have a very childish view of "the only parts of law that are needed are the parts that support my drawn-in-crayon philosophy, everything else is pointless"
[20:24] <ali1234> yes, quite
[20:24] <ali1234> but to be fair, somalia isn't that
[20:25] <directhex> ali1234, the key issue is libertarians don't believe in negative externalities or public good, so things like "poisoning air" can apparently be handled 100% by private contracts between every person in the country and  every single polluter in america - but not govt regulation because that's evil
[20:26] <ali1234> yes
[20:26] <pr0ph3t> directhex, smbclient -L 192.168.x.x was the command, and it shows the Public folder share, but it doesn't on nautilus
[20:26] <directhex> ali1234, the whole philosophy is drawn in crayon, it doesn't account for "reality"
[20:26] <directhex> ali1234, much like basic marxism
[20:26] <ali1234> i wonder what happens in libertarian world if someone buys a large plot of land and sets up a democratic system of government and hangs a "no libertarians" sign on the front door
[20:27] <ali1234> presumably they would be fine with that?
[20:27] <ali1234> since it is private property
[20:29] <ali1234> marxism is at least based in mathematical truths. i like that part of it
[20:32] <ali1234> you are still right of course. mathematics is an abstraction and therefore not reality
[20:36] <pr0ph3t> ali1234, economic determinism
[20:36] <mgdm> http://news.stv.tv/politics/239574-nick-clegg-warns-against-outright-tory-or-labour-victory-in-2015/ yes, I'm sure he does
[20:36] <mgdm> eejit
[20:38] <ali1234> i want to see more coalition
[20:38] <ali1234> if we had four or five different parties instead of two they'd never be able to get anything done
[20:39] <ali1234> lab-con coalition would be funny too
[20:39] <pr0ph3t> I can't even see the computer name in Browse Network, I have two Ubuntu boxes, but they do not show up for me, I can see my cousin's MacBook, but not the linux boxes names, but I can access them with smbclient, is it a Nautilus problem then do you think?
[20:40] <ali1234> pr0ph3t: that is not unusual. try typing in the ip address in smb:// format
[20:40] <ali1234> network browsing is a really horrible mess - it often doesn't even work on windows
[20:45] <pr0ph3t> ali1234, it works with smb:// format, I can access or mount the share
[20:45] <pr0ph3t> strange that nautilus does not recognise it though
[20:45] <pr0ph3t> do you all use nautilus?
[20:45] <ali1234> i use thunar/xfce but it uses the same backend
[20:45] <ali1234> gvfs
[20:45] <ali1234> and i used nautilus until two weeks ago
[20:46] <ali1234> browsing is done on a different protocol to smb
[20:46] <ali1234> it is really complex and never works right
[20:48] <pr0ph3t> sometimes it does :P
[20:50] <pr0ph3t> plus I really like nautilus
[20:51] <ali1234> well you won't find anything that works any better than nautilus, that's for sure
[20:54] <directhex> computers are terrible. stick with videotape.
[21:12] <pr0ph3t> how about email client? You're all using thunderbird/evolution?
[21:15] <bigcalm> Mutt!
[21:16] <pr0ph3t> eheh, I had some problems viewing html pages with Mutt unfortunately :-)
[21:20] <bigcalm> Thunderbird is the default, so most people use that if not gmail
[21:30] <bigcalm> I wonder if popey managed to salvage the audio from last week's podcast
[21:30] <popey> not yet
[21:31] <bigcalm> Waiting for an interface?
[21:31] <popey> waiting for time
[21:31] <popey> working right now
[21:32] <bigcalm> Ah
[21:32] <bigcalm> Eugh
[21:32] <bigcalm> I say eugh and I've just loaded my IDE :(
[21:32]  * bigcalm goes to find a glass of wine to take the sting out of the evening
[21:33] <popey> ☹
[21:33] <popey> over a month since I had any booze
[21:34] <popey> or coffee
[21:38] <mgdm> given them up?
[21:40] <popey> ya
[21:40] <popey> lost a stone so far
[21:40] <bigcalm> Well done
[21:40] <mgdm> blimey
[21:41] <bigcalm> OMG, it's the RAT in 6 days
[21:41] <popey> indeed
[21:42] <popey> thats going to be interesting. never been on the RAT and had no booze
[21:42] <bigcalm> We got our wedding rings today (had to wait for them to be made). Having a sneaky trial run with mine to see how I get one while typing
[21:42] <popey> hah
[21:42] <popey> i take mine off _all_ the time
[21:42] <popey> i also drop it on the floor a lot
[21:43] <popey> dropped it on our honeymoon, through the cracks in the wooden decking and onto the sand underneath
[21:43] <bigcalm> :O
[21:43] <popey> had to crawl about 20 feet under the decking from the beach
[21:43] <bigcalm> Clever lad
[21:43] <popey> lucky to find it again
[21:44] <bigcalm> Does Clare like to remind you of this?
[21:44] <popey> she does
[21:44] <bigcalm> Hehe
[21:44] <popey> whenever we are in the lounge and she hears the familiar sound of metal on carpet
[21:45] <bigcalm> How long have you two been married for?
[21:47] <popey> it's 2013, so 13 years :D
[21:50] <bigcalm> That's a handy way to remember
[21:50] <bigcalm> Maybe Hayley and I should have tied the knot 3 years ago
[21:52] <popey> we got engaged in 1999, and married exactly one year later to the day
[21:53] <popey> should probably get my ring polished at some point
[21:53] <popey> just went to look at my hand to see how scruffy it was and noticed it wasn't there, but was on the desk ☻
[21:53] <bigcalm> Fnar fnar
[21:53] <bigcalm> Oh, wrong channel
[21:53] <popey> \o/ highlights
[21:54]  * bigcalm turns into a giggling 14 year old
[21:54] <bigcalm> No difference from a giggling 34 year old it would seem
[22:02] <bigcalm> Lets play Fez!
[22:12] <ali1234> fez \o/
[22:12] <mgdm> g'night
[22:12] <ali1234> bigcalm: i found a weird thing in fez nobody else on the internet has ever mentioned
[22:12] <bigcalm> Night mgdm
[22:13] <bigcalm> ali1234: which is?
[22:13] <ali1234> in the room where you lower the water, the pillars have some suspicious looking markings on them
[22:14] <ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=x_FbFIR1Tq4#t=28 <- this room
[22:15] <ali1234> below the "mouths" there's that 2x4 block pattern... in different ones a different block is missing
[22:20] <bigcalm> ali1234: not noticed that before. But I don't know if it has meaning or not. I've completed the game enough to get the stereoscopic view (but lack glasses for it) and haven't seen it mentioned
[22:28] <ali1234> another weird thing that nobody seems to have looked at is those 3x3 "photos" in the starting village houses
[22:28] <ali1234> there is something odd about the colours they use
[22:28] <ali1234> they are neither RGB nor CMY
[22:30] <ali1234> they are from a specific palette though, it's kind of orange-turqoise-dark green
[22:30] <ali1234> i don't know what to make of it but it seems nothing in this game is accidental
[22:38] <bigcalm> Fo show
[22:39] <bigcalm> ali1234: have you found a game that you aren't able to complain about? :D
[22:39] <ali1234> when did i complain?
[22:39] <bigcalm> You complain about a lot of things
[22:39] <ali1234> when did i complain about fez though?
[22:40] <bigcalm> That is my point
[22:40] <ali1234> oic
[22:40] <ali1234> well, yes
[22:40] <ali1234> there are other games i don't have any complaints about though
[22:41] <ali1234> i think fez is might be my new favourite game though
[22:41] <bigcalm> I loved it
[22:41] <ali1234> i could go on for quite a long time about why it is great
[22:42] <ali1234> like for example there is no killing in it, at all
[22:42] <bigcalm> It's very well thought out
[22:42] <ali1234> there isn't even anything "living" that can kill you
[22:42] <bigcalm> You can kill Gomez by jumping off things and into holes
[22:42] <ali1234> yes and that is it
[22:42] <ali1234> lava/sewer water kills you
[22:43] <ali1234> that's the most dangerous thing
[22:43] <ali1234> they also didn't include a slippy slidey ice world. i hate those
[22:43] <bigcalm> Hehe
[22:43] <ali1234> and unlike, say, braid, the gimmick feels completely natural
[22:43] <bigcalm> Saying that makes me want to play some Zelda
[22:44] <ali1234> i don't see how anyone can ever make another platform game that doesn't have this rotation mechanic now
[22:44] <bigcalm> You had some of it with paper mario
[22:45] <ali1234> there are also no walls anywhere
[22:45] <ali1234> the only direction that blocks stop you moving is down
[22:46] <ali1234> that really gives a feeling of being able to go anywhere
[22:46] <bigcalm> So how far have you tried to swim?
[22:47] <ali1234> swim?
[22:47] <ali1234> i tried to swim off the side of one map cos i thought that was the solution
[22:47] <bigcalm> In the worlds where water doesn't kill you
[22:47] <ali1234> and then later on that turned out to be the solution to a different map XD
[22:48] <ali1234> there's also a code that lets you fly anywhere in new game+
[22:48] <ali1234> i managed to get trapped with that and had to quit the game
[22:48] <bigcalm> Oooo
[22:49] <bigcalm> I haven't found that yet
[22:49] <ali1234> i flew on top of something really high and even if i tried to fly down it registered as "fell to your death"
[22:49] <bigcalm> Something new for me to see
[22:49] <ali1234> so you did the lava room without cheating? nice
[22:49] <bigcalm> Ug
[22:49] <bigcalm> That was painful
[22:49] <ali1234> yes, the only frustrating bit of the game
[22:50] <bigcalm> But rewarding
[22:50] <ali1234> this game is most like the dizzy games i think
[22:51] <ali1234> except without the fake difficulty that made you smash the controller and throw the computer out the window
[22:51] <bigcalm> Glad I didn't get to play the Dizzy games as a child
[22:52] <bigcalm> Though there were plenty of other such games to frustrate me
[22:52] <ali1234> super meat boy :)
[22:52] <bigcalm> I didn't have that as a child either :P
[22:52] <ali1234> well yeah - it's a modern game
[22:52] <ali1234> in the USC - good game, if you like that kind of thing
[22:53] <bigcalm> But I do now have an xbox controller (played all of fez with it). Will have to give it a go on Super Meat Boy
[22:53] <ali1234> annoyingly no linux version on steam
[22:53] <bigcalm> No, that is annoying
[22:53] <bigcalm> I got it from the HIB I think a long time ago
[22:53] <ali1234> yeah me too
[22:53] <ali1234> tip: you can remap controller buttons ina config file
[22:54] <ali1234> for me, they were all wrong on the defaults
[22:54] <ali1234> but there's no in game remap
[22:55] <bigcalm> http://dbsoundworks.bandcamp.com/album/super-meat-boy-digital-special-edition-soundtrack & http://dbsoundworks.bandcamp.com/album/super-meat-boy-choice-piano-cuts let me enjoy the game without playing it
[22:56] <popey> bigcalm: you using an xbox controller on linux?
[22:56] <bigcalm> The piano cuts are wonderful - I'm a fan of piano solo music
[22:56] <bigcalm> popey: yes
[22:56] <ali1234> popey: me too
[22:56] <popey> ooh!
[22:56] <bigcalm> popey: saved me from buying an xbox
[22:56] <popey> what sorcery?
[22:56] <bigcalm> popey: none
[22:56] <bigcalm> popey: just works (tm)
[22:57] <popey> a bog standard xbox 360 controller?
[22:57] <bigcalm> Yes
[22:57] <ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBHGtPL_KZQ if you haven't see it, this is great
[22:57] <bigcalm> popey: though I bought one that came with the usb adapter in the package
[22:57] <ali1234> popey: i use a original xbox controller with a usb connector soldered on it
[22:57] <ali1234> it works ootb in fez
[22:57] <ali1234> but only after i mapped it properly in steam big picture mode
[22:58] <ali1234> the button mapping is slightly different to the 360 controller
[22:58] <popey> i have an xbox 360 controller here
[22:58] <bigcalm> Works out of the box in linux in fez for me
[22:58] <bigcalm> Sorry, xbox 360
[22:58] <ali1234> but it works correctly in all steam games due to them all taking the config from steam
[22:58] <bigcalm> Ah
[22:58] <bigcalm> I've been playing fez from steam, which is why it works then
[22:58] <ali1234> that's why i needed to edit the meat boy config i guess
[22:59] <ali1234> well the 360 controller is "standard"
[22:59] <ali1234> it probably works everywhere
[22:59] <ali1234> but original one is nearly but not quite the same and most games don't handle it (because you need to solder a new connector to even use it)
[23:00] <ali1234> steam has many controller profiles built in also: it has the 360 but not the orignal mapping
[23:00] <ali1234> this is all done wit SDL2 btw \o/
[23:00] <ali1234> SDL is now sponsored by valve
[23:01] <ali1234> in the sense they employ the lead developer and big picture mode uses it
[23:01] <bigcalm> Yeah, that metal remix wasn't for me :S
[23:01]  * bigcalm goes back to the piano cuts
[23:01] <ali1234> i love the crazy 7/4 time signature
[23:02] <bigcalm> Oh look, it's Monday :(
[23:02] <bigcalm> Time to stop pretending to be married and put the wedding rings in the safe
[23:02] <bigcalm> Nighty night peeps
[23:03] <ali1234> night
[23:03] <popey> nn
[23:22] <popey> wonder what the maximum number of bluetooth remotes you could support on one machine
[23:22] <popey> practically speaking
[23:25] <ahayzen> popey, think it is 7?
[23:26] <ali1234> bluetooth remotes?
[23:27] <popey> controllers, like the xbox360
[23:28] <ali1234> i think the 7 limit is only for piconets, which is BT-PAN basically
[23:28] <ahayzen> the PS3 has a limit of 7 controllers and it uses bluetooth as the connection IIRC
[23:28] <ahayzen> Wikipedia states 'A master Bluetooth device can communicate with a maximum of seven devices in a piconet'
[23:28] <popey> hmm
[23:29] <ali1234> yeah but a piconet isn't limited to 8 devices total
[23:29] <ali1234> it's a tree
[23:29] <ali1234> and basic bluetooth comms (rfcomm) doesn't use it anyway i think
[23:30] <ali1234> blah... i've forgotten how it works
[23:30] <ali1234> i have no idea :/
[23:31] <popey> whereas you can have many many USB devices
[23:31] <popey> well, you could have multiple bt dongles and 7 per dongle?
[23:31] <ali1234> 127
[23:31] <popey> per root hub?
[23:31] <ali1234> per port
[23:31] <ali1234> technically yes
[23:32] <ali1234> and yeah you can have multiple bluetooth adapters without problems