 @AdamOutler Can WSL compile windows binaries?
 I'm mainly using msys2 as a compiler and library management tool
 @RazPi, Networking
 @SivaMachina, Blahhh, this storm need to disappear.
 Hopefully it will...
 Maybe with a sharp turn right
 I have time scheduled off work about the time this thing may get here but I'm part of a fly out team. I'd like to not cancel plans to be stuck flying out to GA for more work.
 @SivaMachina, Fingers crossed
 some faith in humans: https://youtu.be/3uoJtF03QQg?t=146
 3 people come to stop a guy from jumping
 @KMyers what's the plan?
 Raz wsl compare windows binaries?
 Compile?  No.
[13:21] <floridagram-bot7> <Hector Arista> @Ivoriesablaze Keith's on the road. Be by the trirail (Boynton Beach station by the hack lab) between 11:30 and noon.
 @AdamOutler yes I have to compile windows native x.x
 Well, then, you do need a windows shell.  Have you tried power shell?  It was created because bash was better than cmd, but there were politics that prevented enhancing cmd.  I do prefer Cygwin which actually is bash.  Also I have a "apt-cyg" script that lets me install anything like apt does.
 @Ivoriesablaze, I am in Boynton Beach now
 Of course you are... I'm still waking up
 @Ivoriesablaze, If you can meet me at the Boynton Beach Tri Rail station between 11:30 and Noon. I will drive you back. I need to do some shopping
 Ah, okay
 @ahoneybun - how many RSVPed?
 Not many tbh
 @KMyers me you and 2 people from RT Florida
 Ok
 I will get one pizza
 So I may be switching to T-Mobile
 @SivaMachina, You should
 Crickets customer service makes Metros look good
 @KMyers on my way
 @Ivoriesablaze, We are at Dean Anthony's now
 what does this magical place look like
 omg @KMyers I think there's a Dean Anthony's BY MY HOUSE
 357 Congress Ave 33426
 The mind meeting you at Dean Anthony's or the Tri Rail station
 @RazPi, Yes...  The one for 30usd?
 @RazPi https://dashwallets.com/
 @KMyers
 oh btw the Connect Watch with AsteroidOS will be preorder for the US as well
 @RazPi
 @ahoneybun ooh cool
 @KMyers
 @KMyers
 @KMyers
 @KMyers
 @KMyers what's the name of that pizza? How do you order it @_@
 @KMyers !!!!!!!!!!!!
 new wallet https://dashwallets.com/collections/bifold/products/ultra-slim-id-bifold @RazPi
 Guys guys I'm trying to drive right now so I'm trying to get Keith to answer me
 yea I know
 @Ivoriesablaze, Tri Rail
 @Ivoriesablaze, Tri Rail. I just went to Dean Anthony's to get the Pizza
 Okay
 Where are you?
 In route. Give me a few moments
 @ahoneybun, We are outside
 Um... Does anyone want to buy my 2 week old MonoPrice MP Select Mini 3D Printer (~$200 ish)
 You can get them for $179.
 @AdamOutler, That is for the V1, this the V2 (I will also throw in a roll of filament )
 Sure.  I will take it.
 Ok
 Google/PayPal/cash app?
 Google Wallet is best<EMAIL_ADDRESS> @AdamOutler, Let me know the color of filament. I have White, Wood and a few others
 I'd like the wood fiament.  But I think I want the most of the cheapest so I can get the hang of it.
 You know.. room for error.
 I will give you the wood and a partial roll of something cheaper
 I will make sure it is calibrated and I will pre-slice the model for the Android phone holder so you can print from the SD card.
 Cool! We are going into the outernet later for Pokemans. Are you around?
 I am at @ahoneybun 's right now. It would depend on where you go and when
 We are heading out in an hour or two to head from my house to Pembroke Pines City Center, or maybe just to starbucks.
 Not sure. Maybe tomorrow if your schedule allows it
 sure!
 Doesn't Aaron live somewhere near me?  I don't know where.
 I do
 Well if you guys want to pick out some place to meet up, we can do it then.
 We will probably be out for a few hours.
 He actually lives closer to Myako then he does to you
 oh, ok. well we can go to the end of pines blvd.
 I need to get it from my house first. Aaron lives at the end of pines
 Nope I don't
 Right. Hollywood
 Nope
 ok.  well, let's do myako tomorrow then?
 Pembroke Rd and 441 but I need to get it from my house . You know vaguely how far that is
 I maybe up to that
 Oh, he lives by Mojo?
 About 15 minutes
 Ok.   Yeah.  It's odd that the time difference is so large on that side of town.   Out west I can make it all the way from the glades to pembroke pines city center in about 20 minutes.  But then it takes so much longer to get the last 2 major blocks to Mojo.


[00:32] <RoyK> sarnold: what do you mean?
[00:33] <RoyK> sarnold: USA: Deaths per 1M 1861, Norway: Deaths per 1M 122
[00:33] <RoyK> a wee difference there
[00:33] <sarnold> RoyK: the left graph here looks like things are much worse now than february https://graphics.reuters.com/world-coronavirus-tracker-and-maps/countries-and-territories/norway/
[00:34] <sarnold> RoyK: oh yeah, we've fucked this up bad
[00:34] <RoyK> sarnold: yes, it's not good now - all time high on hospitalisation, but apparently not on deaths
[00:35] <RoyK> and btw, you don't have to pay to go to a hospital here ;)
[00:35] <sarnold> RoyK: yeah the doctors have done great work figuring out how to keep people alive, amazing stuff there
[00:35] <sarnold> RoyK: *sigh* sounds so nice :)
[00:36] <RoyK> it's all paid over the tax check, so wether you're rich or poor - it's all free
[00:38] <RoyK> A lady from the US I once dated for a short time, moved to Graz, Austria, and had a wee accident riding a bike. She broke a leg and it was fixed up and so on. She was stunned by having to pay only around $40 for the whole thing. I just shrugged.
[00:39] <sarnold> even as a non-citizen? wow
[00:40] <RoyK> She lived there and paid tax, so somewhat a citizen, yes
[00:40] <RoyK> It's like that in Europe
[00:41] <RoyK> For some stupid reason, she moved back to the US and is now a professor in music at a university
[00:42] <RoyK> usually, if you have a permit of permanent residency, it's all free
[00:42] <RoyK> I guess that varies between countries, though
[00:43] <RoyK> IIRC in Norway, also a temporary residency (if that's what it's called) will suffice
[00:44] <RoyK> sarnold: as once said in a film I quite liked "Welcome… to the real world!" :D
[00:44] <sarnold> lol :D
[00:47] <sarnold> it'd sure be nice to fix things up here but there's probably hundreds of thousands of people if not millions invested in the current mess we've got now
[00:49] <RoyK> did you know that the US government spends more money on heathcare than most European countries and still, people have to pay for it?
[00:49] <RoyK> *healthcare*
[00:50] <RoyK> IMHO that is just money laundery set in a large system
[00:51] <sarnold> and despite paying something like twice as much per capita, we get worse results, too
[00:51] <RoyK> I know
[00:51] <sarnold> some of that is subsidizing drug development for the rest of the world
[00:51] <sarnold> but not all of it
[00:51] <sarnold> probably not even most of it
[00:52] <RoyK> I saw this docu about drug overdoses in the US - the fire department was called - not an ambulance - since the latter wanted payment up front
[00:52] <RoyK> it makes me sick
[00:53] <RoyK> I'm not saying it's perfect over here either - not even close - but I beleive it's a lot better
[00:53] <sarnold> I went on a 'Live PD' binge on youtube a few months? year? who knows how time moves any more.. anyway, yeah, I saw dozens of people turn down medical treatment because they didn't want to be billed for the ambulance ride to the hospital..
[00:54] <RoyK> doesn't surprise me
[00:57] <RoyK> I had an accident - I rode a bicycle - electric one - while drunk - not a good idea - and I broke my leg rather badly. The ambulance came and I had three operations. Later, I fell over at a point and got the pain of hell in that leg. New trip with an ambulance, since I really couldn't walk, another week or so in hospital and so on. I started working again, but I had to get a cab to and from work. The
[00:57] <RoyK> hospital stays cost me zero. The cab rides cost a bit, but mostly covered by the governent.
[00:58] <RoyK> x-rays, CT scans, medicines blabla
[00:58] <sarnold> owwwwww
[00:58] <RoyK> when I first arrived, a nurse asked me if he could bring me something and I asked for a glass of dihydrogenmonoxide
[00:59] <sarnold> :D
[00:59] <RoyK> it took him a few seconds before he frowned and smiled
[01:01] <RoyK> sarnold: tell me if you ever come over here - I'll show you around a bit
[01:01] <sarnold> RoyK: oh yeah! sounds fun :D
[01:06] <RoyK> sarnold: and beleive me - I'm a sworn socialist ;)
[01:07] <sarnold> ooo scary! :)
[01:07] <RoyK> I guess some people in the US thinks that communism, but - well - it's not
[01:08] <RoyK> I don't have a problem with private companies and so on - it's part of the game - but things like hospitals and other important infrastructure shouldn't be private
[01:09] <RoyK> in the UK, they opened up for buying services from private hospitals to help out the queues in public hospitals. Bad idea. Instead of spending that money for public hospitals, they ended up paying way more to private hospitals, resulting in closing down public hospitals and that's a slippery slope
[01:11] <RoyK> The same thing is somehow happening here - but hopefully a bit more slowly. The current govt is quite right-wing (that means perhaps "left-wing" in the US in comparison but whatever), but we have an election soon and hopefully, we'll get them kicked out
[01:13] <sarnold> I'm surprised about the uk private hospitals, I thought they were proud of their nhs
[01:14] <RoyK> they are, but nhs was pressed and purchased a lot of services from private hospitals and it cost so much they had to cut down on their own
[01:15] <RoyK> I'm just hoping we get a good, socialist or socialdemocratic (or a combo of those) govt this autumn. The current one isn't good.
[01:16] <RoyK> Btw, our prime minister is being investigated by the police after holding a party with a lot of people during the pandemic, breaking the law she herself signed for
[01:16] <sarnold> if it's any consolation, it's not so bad that it makes the news regularly :) hehe
[01:16] <RoyK> which is rather nice
[01:16] <sarnold> RoyK: oof
[01:16] <sarnold> why do politicians do that
[01:16] <RoyK> hehe
[01:16] <RoyK> My guess is that they're just people, after all
[01:16] <sarnold> they must be addicted to those parties..
[01:16] <RoyK> She had her 60th birthday and wanted to have some fun
[01:17] <sarnold> well.... okay, that kinda makes sense. but it sends the entirely wrong signal :)
[01:17] <RoyK> indeed
[01:17] <RoyK> Do as I say, not as I do
[01:17] <RoyK> lalala
[01:17] <sarnold> "but the rest of the year I was good"
[01:17] <RoyK> not really
[01:19] <RoyK> but hell - I'm a left-wing - the sort you'll call a bloody communist over there, so I'm disqualified, so to say
[08:31] <maret> Hi all, something has happend with my ubuntu server yesterday evening. Its running on my local pc. When I woke up  and plugged in monitor, it was going to sleep. I couldn't ssh into it, services which have been runniing on it weren't working, but pc seem to run. No clue what happened this are auth.log, syslog and kernel log from yesterday  https://paste.debian.net/1192720/
[08:39] <maret> could it been because of overheating?
[08:44] <maret> + this is output from journalctl https://paste.debian.net/1192723/
[10:39] <RoyK> maret: can't find anything particular interesting there - if this happens again, you might want to setup netconsole to have it dump debug messages to another server in case of a crash. sometimes linux crashes hard before it can write anything to anywhere, perhaps except the console. But again - no OOPS or Panic on the console might mean it got some sort of hard hang. impossible to tell, relly, without
[10:39] <RoyK> anything in the logs
[13:59] <aloini> For the Ubuntu Pro images that are on GCP/AWS/Azure, is there any potential that these will be pushed into Docker Hub?
[14:29] <powersj> aloini, hi - we currently do not have container images for Pro, but it is something we are looking into
[14:35] <leftyfb> what exactly is "Ubuntu Pro"?
[14:40] <rbasak> leftyfb: see page 2 for example at https://assets.ubuntu.com/v1/feafb61c-Ubuntu_Pro_AWS_04.11.19.pdf
[14:40] <rbasak> (via https://ubuntu.com/aws/pro from a quick Google)
[15:10] <RoyK> I'd rather use Debian than paying for Ubuntu ;)
[15:11] <Ravage> but don't you want to get creepy messages from canonical staff after you started your container? that sounds SO fun :D
[15:18] <sdeziel> this is a way to get longer support then what ESM offer (3y with ESM and 5y with Pro) so there's that ;)
[15:55] <xnox> sdeziel:  ESM durations are different for every series.
[15:55] <xnox> sdeziel:  they are not different under UA or under Pro
[15:57] <sdeziel> oh I see, 3y for 1{4,6}.04 and 5y for 18.04+, thanks for the clarification xnox
[15:57] <rbasak> Ravage: you might be interested to read https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-motd/ubuntu-motd/trunk/changes/89?start_revid=89
[18:33] <RoyK> sdeziel: IIRC it was five years for 1[46].04 as well, but never for the non-lts versions. Those were 3Y or so at a time - now they're only a few months.
[18:34] <sdeziel> RoyK: according to https://ubuntu.com/security/esm : "Ubuntu 14.04 (Trusty Tahr) and 16.04 (Xenial Xerus) will have updates  provided for up to three years after the end of the Standard Security  Maintenance window. Ubuntu 18.04 (Bionic Beaver) and subsequent releases  until further announcement will have ESM updates provided for up to  five years."
[18:39] <sarnold> RoyK: the non-lts releases were supported for 18 months before 13.04, when it moved to nine months: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases
[18:48] <RoyK> sdeziel: That's 5+3
[18:49] <RoyK> sarnold: I know - just didn't remember the exact numbers
[18:50] <RoyK> sarnold: but thanks for the update - I generally don't use non-LTS unless I feel lucky or want to test something new in a VM
[18:50] <RoyK> but again - feeling lucky usually has its downsides :þ
[18:51] <sarnold> RoyK: hehe, yeah, most of my machines are on LTS releases too :)
[18:51] <RoyK> honestly, most of mine are debian by now, but that's swearing in church, so I won't bother you ;)
[18:52] <sarnold> yeah, I keep hearing that from friends


[00:06] <elopio> tvoss: ping. Any chance you are still around?
[01:36] <elopio> ping barry.
[01:36] <elopio> I'm testing the silo for system updates.
[01:36] <elopio> I'm wondering how much time do I have to wait on system settings until the message about a new update appears.
[07:24] <dholbach> good morning
[08:09] <dholbach> pitti`, dpm: where do we store the list of packages which get into the touch language packs?
[08:12] <dpm> dholbach, I'm not sure. pitti` might be able to tell you best. I think it's langpack-o-matic which generates the list
[08:13] <dholbach> I was just wondering how to check if a certain package is on there... tvoss: you were after location-service, right?
[08:14] <tvoss> dholbach, yup
[08:17] <tvoss> dpm, do you know how mo file installation works with a debian package?
[08:19] <dpm> tvoss, I think the important thing is that the build system takes care of the installation, then the packaging should just invoke the installation rules. seb128 or pitti`can give you better guidance. Which project is it you're looking to package?
[08:19] <tvoss> dpm, okay
[08:27] <K1773R> how can i resize the root partition which is mounted with loop0?
[08:37] <vitimiti> hi
[08:43] <Mirv> dholbach: could you glance whether you can 'ack' unity8 debian/* changes https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-landing-007-2-publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_unity8_8.00+14.10.20140918.3-0ubuntu1.diff ? basically dependency bupms + using the new unity-schemas package
[08:45] <dholbach> Mirv, looks like "${CMAKE_SOURCE_DIR}/plugins/Unity/Launcher/backend" is being dropped - is that intentional?
[08:49] <Mirv> dholbach: mzanetti can answer to that (based on https://code.launchpad.net/~mzanetti/unity8/rework-launcher-backend/+merge/232921), although strictly speaking those makefile changes are provided only as auxiliary files to evaluate whether the debian/* changes were correct
[08:50] <dholbach> Mirv, what I usually do is run debdiff on the resulting .deb packages
[08:50] <dholbach> that way I know which files were dropped or moved around between versions
[08:50] <dholbach> I normally do this when sponsoring just to make sure that no file is forgotten or dropped by accident
[08:51] <dholbach> in general the changes look fine, but it'd be good if mzanetti could give his go-ahead on the above
[08:51] <mzanetti> dholbach: hi
[08:51] <mzanetti> what's the issue?
[08:52] <dholbach> mzanetti, I was asked to review the packaging diff and "${CMAKE_SOURCE_DIR}/plugins/Unity/Launcher/backend" was being dropped in there, which (without content or having read the entire diff) didn't immediately make sense to me - I just wanted to check if that's all right and intended
[08:52] <Mirv> dholbach: yeah. ci train process is a bit of a hybrid - uploads are decided almost entirely by upstream, but the debian/* change need an ack, kind of like sponsoring, as a middle ground solution to there being some control to what upstreams release
[08:52] <dholbach> Mirv, also libunity-api-dev (>= 7.90) is not in the archive yet
[08:52] <dholbach> sure
[08:52] <mzanetti> DanChapman: yeah, that's fine. the backend has been split into multiple parts, so that folder didn't make much sense any more
[08:52] <mzanetti> dholbach: ^
[08:52] <dholbach> so if mzanetti can confirm that that was intentional, I'm +1
[08:52] <mzanetti> (sorry DanChapman)
[08:52] <Mirv> dholbach: that's part of the same landing https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-007/+packages
[08:53] <dholbach> all right, go ahead then
[08:53] <dholbach> excellent
[08:53] <Mirv> dholbach: thanks!
[08:53] <DanChapman> mzanetti: :-)
[08:59] <nhaines> mzanetti: was just reading about the upcoming launcher setting apocalypse.  I like what happens on the other side.  :)
[09:00] <mzanetti> nhaines: :)
[09:07] <JamesTait> Yo ho ho, 'n' shiver me timbers! 'appy Friday 'n' 'appy Talk Like a Pirate Day!  Yaaarrr! :-D
[09:34] <tsdgeos> pitti`: how often do language-pack-touch get regenerated?
[09:36] <tsdgeos> or anyone else :D
[09:46] <davmor2> tsdgeos: fairly often at the moment I think
[09:47] <tsdgeos> davmor2: last one is from 9-9
[09:47] <tsdgeos> wouldn't say it's "faily often"
[09:48] <tsdgeos> i see strings not translated that are indeed translated
[09:48] <tsdgeos> and makes the whole experience weird
[10:21] <asac> seb128: you remember those black icons you showed me a couple days ago?:
[10:21] <asac> seb128: was that in gallery
[10:21] <asac> ?
[10:21] <asac> or was that someone else?
[10:22] <seb128> asac, it was in any sdk application, including unity8
[10:22] <asac> really
[10:22] <seb128> it fixes itself after a toolkit --reinstall, I wonder if the icon cache was missing or something
[10:22] <asac> seb128: we have that on gallery only now on krillin
[10:22] <asac> hmm. odd
[10:22] <asac> really looks the same, but is just gallery
[10:23] <asac> sil2100: ^
[10:23] <asac> not sure if the --reinstall is here too, but he had black boxes for icons in the dialer iirc
[10:24] <asac> guess most likely a red herring and unrelated/different
[10:33] <sil2100> bzoltan: ^
[10:33] <sil2100> (just in case it's related)
[10:33] <sil2100> But I doubt it
[10:35] <ogra_> unless reinstalling makes a difference to install :)
[10:47] <cjwatson> cwayne: click already prefers things in /custom over things in /usr/share/click/preinstalled
[10:47] <cjwatson> cwayne: I suspect maybe you just haven't registered things properly in the custom database
[11:25] <seb128> bah, my krillin is on a ubuntu-logo-spinning-for-ever since monday, does anyone know how to debug such issues?
[11:25] <seb128> unity8 start/starting
[11:25] <seb128> I guess unity8 fails to properly start
[11:27] <ogra_> seb128, disk full ?
[11:27] <seb128> ogra_, I doubt it, what partition would that be?
[11:27] <ogra_> home
[11:27] <seb128> /dev/mmcblk0p7                               4.1G  360M  3.5G  10% /home
[11:27] <ogra_> writable space is all shared
[11:27] <ogra_> looks fine
[11:28] <seb128> oh
[11:28] <seb128> OH
[11:29] <seb128> file:///usr/share/ubuntu/settings/wizard/qml/main.qml: File not found
[11:29] <seb128> I guess it's trying to run the wizard and failing
[11:29]  * seb128 touch .config/ubuntu-system-settings/wizard-has-run
[11:29] <seb128> yeah, working phone!
[11:30] <ogra_> great
[11:30] <ogra_> worth a bug against the wizard i guess :)
[11:30] <seb128> ogra_, thanks for trying to help me with it ;-)
[11:30] <ogra_> heh
[11:31] <seb128> yeah, if the wizard fails to start it shouldn't block the boot
[11:42] <cwayne> cjwatson: i have everything unpacked to /custom/click, shouldnt the hooks do the rest?
[11:43] <cjwatson> cwayne: you can't just unpack it by hand - didn't I give a sample command for this a while back?
[11:43] <cjwatson> cwayne: what commands are you using right now?
[11:44] <cwayne> cjwatson: wasn't it just click install --root=/custom/click --all-users --force-missing-framework whatever.click?
[11:44] <cjwatson> cwayne: ah, that should be enough
[11:44] <cwayne> it seems odd that I could be doing it wrong when every other app + all the scopes work as expected...
[11:44] <cjwatson> cwayne: so tell me how to reproduce this (preferably in an emulator)
[11:45] <cjwatson> (I only have one device at the moment and it's dual-booting)
[11:45] <cwayne> cjwatson: hm, not sure if we can manually apply a custom tarball in an emulator.. let me get the propsed-customization bits set up on jenkins so we can just flash that channel
[11:45] <cwayne> which will have the added benefit of testing sergiusens' theory about the version.tar.xz
[11:47] <cjwatson> remind me, does anything in ubuntu-rtm/14.09 care about parted?  because the version there is broken for non-512-sector disks
[11:48] <cwayne> not sure tbh
[11:49] <cjwatson> cwayne: actually if you have the custom tarball somewhere I can wget, that might be helpful too
[11:49] <cwayne> cjwatson: sure, let me put it on chinstrap
[11:49] <cjwatson> just to see if there is any obvious wrongness there
[11:50] <cjwatson> cwayne: also, is this going wrong on a freshly bootstrapped system, or on a flash-upgrade?
[11:50] <cwayne> cjwatson: freshly bootstrapped then installing the custom tar manually
[11:50] <cjwatson> I mean obviously it should work either way but if it breaks on bootstrapping then that lets me rule out some possibilities
[11:50] <cjwatson> cwayne: ok, so you booted the system in between those two steps?
[11:50] <cwayne> cjwatson: yes
[11:51] <cjwatson> right, so hooks would have run then with the /usr/share/click/preinstalled versions being topmost
[11:51] <cwayne> cjwatson: so if it were done all at once, then /custom/click would be properly preferred?
[11:52] <cjwatson> cwayne: yes
[11:52] <cjwatson> cwayne: oh, I think I see
[11:52] <cjwatson>                                 if (get_version (package) == version)
[11:52] <cjwatson>                                         done = true;
[11:53] <cjwatson> cwayne: while a reproduction environment still wouldn't hurt, please file a click bug as I think I understand the cause now
[11:54] <cwayne> cjwatson: ack, a tarball's here: https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~cwayne/custom.tar.xz
[11:57] <cjwatson> ta
[11:58] <cwayne> cjwatson: also https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/click/+bug/1371574
[11:59] <cjwatson> ok, cranking to critical/rtm14
[12:04] <cwayne> cjwatson: thank you sir
[12:12] <Ron__> Is there an Ubuntu install for the Nexus 7 that is not a "trial"?
[12:45] <ogra_> pitti`, would you mind top approving https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/phablet-tools/phablet-tools-fix-phablet-network-spacechar-handling/+merge/235108 for me (sergio isnt around today and i want to land all network related branches in phablet-tools today (including yours))
[13:02] <asac> help! how can i turn off calendar notifications? :)
[13:02] <asac> anyone managed to?
[13:02] <ogra_> asac, in the calendar app
[13:02] <asac> where?
[13:03] <ogra_> asac, which i'm asked to remove from the image today
[13:03] <asac> if i go to "calenadrs"
[13:03] <asac> the app starts hanging
[13:03] <ogra_> top right
[13:03] <asac> and i cannot disable anything there because of that
[13:03] <ogra_> there is also a setting to omit the sync in the acocunts page in system-settings
[13:03] <asac> well, i had calendar app off my phone in the past and it continued to alert me of events :(
[13:03] <asac> right
[13:03] <ogra_> yes, the indicator notifies
[13:03] <asac> that will just forever continue to alert me of events back then
[13:03] <ogra_> the calendar manages them
[13:04] <asac> i want to wipe DB and disable syncs :)
[13:04] <asac> i guess
[13:04] <asac> let me disable syncs in settings as a start
[13:04] <ogra_> well, search for evolution stuff in your home i guess
[13:04] <K1773R> how can i resize the root partition which is mounted with loop0? im running out of space in my root partition...
[13:05] <asac> ogra_: i ams ure its not a nice file called calendar.db?
[13:05] <ogra_> K1773R, with resize2fs from recovery
[13:05] <ogra_> (dont ask me about the exactsteps :) i'll leave that as an exercise for the reader :) )
[13:05] <asac> seb128: any hints/ideas how i can reset EDS database so it forgets about events?
[13:05] <ogra_> asac, it is somewhere in EDS ... might be called calendar.db, sure
[13:05] <seb128> asac, .cache/evolution/calendar I guess?
[13:05] <K1773R> ogra_: ok, il take a look at it :)
[13:05] <asac> well, let me wait now that i stopped synching. maybe it really forgot about them now (i doubt it)
[13:06] <asac> seb128: thanks. will check that out in case that disabling sync doesnt help me
[13:06] <ogra_> disabling sync will just not get you any changes
[13:06] <ogra_> the notifications will still happen
[13:07] <ogra_> for the stuff stored locally
[13:07] <asac> oh i was able to disable my canonical account in the calendar "calendars" dialog
[13:07] <asac> first time it didnt freeze :P
[13:07] <ogra_> always worked for me
[13:07] <asac> guess disabling  the synching helped ... lets see if that stops alarming me
[13:07] <asac> i tried for two days :(
[13:07] <asac> at least 20 times
[13:07] <asac> hehe
[13:08] <ogra_> well, you wont have to care anymore, since calendar will be dropped (teh silliest decision ever imho)
[13:08] <asac> if this is the only way through UI to get rid of events
[13:08] <asac> i dont like the idea taht this gets removed before me managing to get rid of those
[13:08] <ogra_> haha
[13:08] <ogra_> talk to pmcgowan
[13:08] <asac> i had that before
[13:08] <ogra_> he asked for removal
[13:09] <asac> i think it was removed once
[13:09] <ogra_> you will be able to enable sync from the accounts page still
[13:09] <asac> well, i am not against removing it by default. just want to know how to get rid of the events
[13:09] <asac> right and that will start alarms that you will not be able to stop then
[13:09] <ogra_> but once synced you wont have any chance to change a thing in the locally stored calendars
[13:10] <asac> so maybe coupling synching with alarms would be a good bandaid to have a UI mean to disable them :)
[13:10] <ogra_> my alarms always stop fine if i tap them
[13:10] <asac> they stop
[13:10] <asac> but i dont want them
[13:10] <asac> and they are outdated :)
[13:10] <ogra_> mine are on time
[13:10] <asac> so i get accumulated alarms, which kind of means i get alarms every 20 minutes
[13:10] <ogra_> probably 1-2min to late due to clock skew
[13:10] <asac> maybe you dont have much change in your schedule
[13:10] <asac> or at least in your recurring event schedule
[13:10] <asac> if you have that you will see that the changes are not reflected (at least here)
[13:11] <ogra_> it changes once or twice a week
[13:11] <ogra_> not hourly or some such :)
[13:11] <asac> your recurring meetings change every two week?
[13:11]  * asac looks at ogras calendar
[13:11] <ogra_> no, but i get the occasional spontaneous meeting once/twoice a week
[13:11] <asac> right
[13:11] <asac> thats not a recurring meeting
[13:12] <ogra_> no, but i get notified
[13:12] <asac> one time meetings wont have the problem because they wont recurr
[13:12] <asac> yes i am not complaining about lack of notification
[13:12] <ogra_> and my phone is my only enabled notification mechanism ...
[13:12] <asac> but rather about constant notifications from recurring events that are not even happening anymore
[13:12] <asac> ogra_: so i could inviet you now to 20 recurring meetings, wait a day, then delete them and you will expereince the pain i have as well :P)
[13:12] <ogra_> asac, i'm complaining about losing the ability to manage them
[13:13] <ogra_> the only app that can will be removed
[13:13] <asac> i cannot use them if they continue to accumulate. so what i need first is ability to wipe the db
[13:13] <asac> :)
[13:13] <asac> then i can think about something more sophisticated
[13:13] <ogra_> well, just wipe the evo dir
[13:14] <asac> yeah that i will do if the disable in the calendar app didnt do the trick
[13:14] <asac> lets see
[13:26] <barry> elopio: morning pong
[13:44] <vitimiti> hi
[14:14] <pitti> dholbach, dpm: list of touch packages> that's calculated from the touch seeds with the "update-touch-packages" script in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-langpack/langpack-o-matic/main/files/
[14:15] <pitti> dholbach, dpm: result is in maps/ pkglist-touch-utopic
[14:16] <dholbach> tvoss, ^
[14:18] <alecu> popey: dbarth_: there are some apps uploaded to the store that don't have a nice 256px icon, and this bug is exposing that: https://bugs.launchpad.net/software-center-agent/+bug/1371381
[14:18] <dpm> thanks pitti
[14:18] <alecu> popey: dbarth_: I can see that the twitter app shown in the landing page of the app store has no icon now: that means that the store very likely has a 64px icon
[14:29] <dobey> alecu: oh my, lots of apps missing icons
[14:29] <alecu> dobey: it's a server bug
[14:30] <dobey> alecu: well, i'd say icons that aren't 256px are bugs in the app too
[14:31] <alecu> dobey: the apps may have nicer icons in the click package; but they didn't upload a 256px icon when being submitted to the store
[14:31] <alecu> probably because they were submitted before the 256px was enforced
[14:32] <dobey> alecu: right. though twitter has been updated since then, because it has a different icon in the .click now. i think part of the problem is that people have been bad about updating the icons in the store when they get updated in the .click package
[14:32] <dobey> also, some apps have had icons in the store that don't match the icon on the app, since time of upload, afaict
[14:33] <alecu> dobey: right: so I think that ideally the store should take the icons from the click
[14:33] <alecu> each time it's uploaded
[14:33] <dobey> indeed
[14:33] <dobey> (well, i think the store should take *everything* from the click)
[14:39] <tedg> tsdgeos, So the reason people were so confused on your autostart MRs is because there are two MRs that should have landed for 14.04 but didn't. They're queued now and should fix your issues.
[14:40] <tsdgeos> tedg: ok, thanks
[14:41] <dbarth_> alecu: ah, ok noted
[15:03] <elopio> hy barry. Just wanted to tell you that I found two problems while running your system image test plan.
[15:03] <elopio> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1371404
[15:03] <elopio> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-system-image/+bug/1371400
[15:05] <barry> elopio: hi.  LP: #1371400 is a system settings bug afaict.  i just updated that bug report
[15:06] <elopio> barry: but for me it's not just a UI issue. The download starts automatically even after I change the value from the command line.
[15:07] <barry> elopio: hmm. i haven't seen this.  let me see if i can reproduce it.
[15:08] <elopio> with --get I do get the new value.
[15:08] <barry> interesting
[15:08] <elopio> anyway, your silo was looking good. But those two bugs are affecting the test plan. I had to work them around.
[15:09] <barry> elopio: thanks.  when i tested manual updates it worked as expected, but i'm now in #49 w/s-i 2.4 so let me test that combination
[15:09] <cwayne> jdstrand: btw our customization-hooks fix has landed :)
[15:11] <jdstrand> cwayne: nice! I'm looking at the issue I mentioned before. I don't want to push what is in the silo unless I understand it fully
[15:12] <barry> elopio: just tried it.  i made sure system-settings and system-image processes were killed, then --set auto_download=0 and tweaked channel.ini, then fired up system-settings while tailing the client.log file
[15:12] <cwayne> jdstrand: fair, so once what's in that silo lands will I have to change anything in /custom?
[15:13] <barry> elopio: i of course see the download of index.json* but *not* the data files
[15:13] <barry> elopio: and now Updates says version 49 is ready for download with a Download button (10.1 MiB)
[15:13] <barry> elopio: which is what i'd expect
[15:13] <elopio> barry: um, myabe I didn't kill everything.
[15:14] <elopio> let me retry.
[15:14] <barry> elopio: that's my guess
[15:14] <barry> elopio: system-image-dbus is the critical thing
[15:15] <jdstrand> cwayne: I may have to undo something in the silo, which is why I am hesitating. the plan is I understand this issue, do something if needed, then ping you with that and the apparmor-easyprof-ubuntu change
[15:16] <jdstrand> cwayne: fyi, we also did pull requests for the kernel, so when krillin gets that, the features file will change and you'll want a new tarball
[15:16] <jdstrand> rsalveti: fyi ^
[15:17] <rsalveti> yeah, indeed
[15:22] <elopio> barry: I don't get it. I killed system-image-dbus, I didn't have system-settings running.
[15:22] <elopio> --get returns 0
[15:22] <elopio> and yet when I open the updates page, it says on wi-fi, and starts the download.
[15:23] <elopio> I'm on 48. I'll get 49.
[15:23] <cwayne> jdstrand: right, so we'll definitely need to coordinate with qa on that so we can land at the same time
[15:24] <jdstrand> cwayne: I'm not sure how qa is involved with kernel updates, which is why I fyi'd rsalveti
[15:25] <cwayne> jdstrand: well qa is also involved in the custom tarball now too
[15:25] <jdstrand> cwayne: (he or janimo` will be pulling in our changes to the krillin kernel)
[15:25] <rsalveti> yeah, we'll have a separated process for our archive and krillin
[15:25] <cwayne> so wed need to land one with the proper precompiled stuff
[15:25] <rsalveti> krillin will follow the same procedure done when pushing a new device tarball
[15:25] <ogra_> point is that we cant land custom and device tarballs in the same iamge yet
[15:26] <ogra_> *image
[15:26] <jdstrand> oh, hrmm
[15:26] <ogra_> in case they need to go together, there will be onee broken image
[15:26] <barry> elopio: how very odd
[15:26] <cwayne> hmm, i didnt know you ouldnt land both in one image
[15:27] <ogra_> each of them triggers a system-image import
[15:27] <jdstrand> if they don't happen at the same time, the features file will be out of sync
[15:27] <ogra_> if you dont land them the exact same second one of them gets queued
[15:27] <jdstrand> and only until they are in sync, will the custom-apparmor-cache job do anything
[15:27] <jdstrand> I see
[15:28] <ogra_> we can probably manually circumvent that somehow
[15:28] <rsalveti> it's fine to not land both at the same time
[15:28] <ogra_> if we know in advance
[15:28] <ogra_> rsalveti, ah, didnt sound like that above
[15:28] <rsalveti> while the cache will be done again when booting, that will only happen at that image
[15:28] <jdstrand> right, so, that is what this conversation is about-- making sure all the parties know it needs to be coordinated
[15:28] <rsalveti> once we land the other pieces, it should be back to normal again
[15:28] <ogra_> yeah
[15:29] <jdstrand> rsalveti: yep
[15:29] <jdstrand> I was just saying, people need to know the out of sync image will appear to regress
[15:29] <ogra_> rsalveti, i think we could perhaps manually stop the auto importer and only re-start it once both are in place though
[15:29] <rsalveti> sure
[15:30] <ogra_> to avoid this out-of-sync-ness
[15:31] <barry> elopio: another thing to check is /var/log/system-image/client.log.  you should see something like this (note specifically auto-download: 0): http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/8380579/
[15:32]  * mpt scowls at another symptom of bug 1289404
[15:34] <mpt> tedg, so about “Messages on welcome screen” … That would be a simple filter of notifications from the Messaging app, right?
[15:35] <tedg> mpt, Well the question is what happens in the menu, is that all messages out of the menu as well?
[15:35] <mpt> True, that too
[15:36] <mpt> So it’s like a general “Notifications on welcome screen” setting is/would be, affecting both notification bubbles and the Notification Centre … but specific to Messaging
[15:36] <tedg> mpt, Its complicated because we don't know what the entry is. It could be an SMS or a narcissistic system update message.
[15:36] <mpt> tedg, you know which app it’s from.
[15:37] <mpt> (and Chipaca told me the system updates will become less narcissistic RSN:-)
[15:37] <tedg> mpt, Sure, but I don't know if "foo.bar.com_bar_1.2.3" is a messaging app or a system one.
[15:37] <mpt> tedg, oh, I was thinking specifically of the built-in Messaging app
[15:37] <mpt> Not WhatsApp or Skype or whatever else
[15:37] <tedg> Shouldn't they be handled the same/
[15:37] <tedg> ?
[15:38]  * tedg likes Telegram ;-)
[15:38] <mpt> Well, ideally, yes…
[15:38] <tedg> I guess this is the problem with turning the messaging menu into a junk drawer.
[15:39] <mpt> So, which is greater: the usefulness of a Messaging-with-a-capital-M-only setting, or the confusion of it not applying to other messaging-with-a-small-m apps
[15:40] <tedg> mpt, I'd go with one setting today. It's easier to add configuration options than to take them away.
[15:40] <Chipaca> mpt: system updates should be less narcissistic already, afaik
[15:41] <mpt> excellent
[15:43] <Chipaca> mpt: and iffen we get the new launcher that displays apps with counters even when not pinned nor recent, then they get even closer to spec :)
[15:43] <mpt> barry, the reminds me of something I’ve been wondering … Do we have a fallback mechanism at all for system updates? Let’s say that one of our OTA updates, completely accidentally, includes something that makes System Settings crash on launch for everyone in the Spanish locale. We fix the bug, and put the fix into the next OTA update. How would the update get installed?
[15:44] <Chipaca> mpt: thinks crashing at random in the turkish locale would be very very much believable btw
[15:47] <alecu> dbarth_: popey: the full list of apps that don't have a 256px icon in the store is this: https://pastebin.canonical.com/117287/
[15:47] <doflaherty> any time I send a picture MMS it fails immediately - is there a log I can look at for more information?
[15:47] <alecu> dbarth_: seems like all of the webapps don't have a 256px icon in the store
[15:50] <mpt> barry, compare Ubuntu for PC, where the #2 most common error for all Ubuntu users right now is a crash in update-manager
[15:52] <dbarth_> alecu: most were uploaded when it was not a req yes
[15:52] <elopio> barry: I have now: Auto download: Never.
[15:53] <elopio> I will mark as invalid the bug. And will keep trying to understand what I did wrong.
[15:54] <dbarth_> alecu: checking now
[15:56] <alecu> thanks
[15:58] <popey> alecu: it would be way more efficient to mail the phone list telling everyone to update their app icons, and we can share socially, rather than go through manually contacting those ~30 developers.
[15:59] <dbarth_> alecu: all fixed now (amazon, ebay, facebook, twitter, gmail)
[15:59] <alecu> dbarth_: great
[15:59] <alecu> popey: sounds like a good plan
[16:02] <barry> mpt: system-image-cli is the fallback, but that's probably suboptimal for the general public.  it's a very good thing to think about and we should probably discuss it at the device sprint, but i don't have a good answer.
[16:03] <popey> alecu: well volunteered
[16:03] <barry> elopio: cool, thanks.
[17:06] <robotfuel> bfiller: ping, did you see the last comment in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/camera-app/+bug/1368436
[17:07] <bfiller> robotfuel: yes
[17:09] <mpt> barry, ok, I reported bug 1371703
[17:21] <pindonga> hi jdstrand ... maybe you want/can review an mp of click-reviewers-tools?
[17:21] <pindonga> https://code.launchpad.net/~ricardokirkner/click-reviewers-tools/frameworks-from-api/+merge/235029
[17:38] <dbarth_> quick question: is there any way to reset/remove date in ~/.local/share/<app id> from the interface?
[18:03] <ogra_> anpok, if you feel like, the phablet-tools in https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-007 should fix your fritzbox issue
[18:03] <ogra_> (woulld be nice to get feedback from someone affected  (i tested with fake network files only here))
[18:04] <Wellark> memories..
[18:04] <Wellark> http://tetragrammaton.fixme.fi/tmp/kaiverrus_konsepti.png
[18:05] <Wellark> Mirv: --^
[18:19] <anpok> ogra_: cool
[19:22] <jdstrand> pindonga: fyi, it is on my todo, likely not today, but definitely next week
[19:22] <jdstrand> cwayne: fyi, I will be doing a new apparmor upload and updating the silo
[19:23] <pindonga> jdstrand, thx
[19:24] <jdstrand> cwayne: there was non-reproducible anomalous behavior that unconvered bug #1371771. I want that fixed before pushing apparmor to rtm
[19:24] <cwayne> jdstrand: ok, this isnt the one i need a new features for though correct?
[19:24] <jdstrand> cwayne: that will give us the performance improvement for profile loads that is in the silo now, but with the same level of robustness that is in the rtm now
[19:25] <jdstrand> cwayne: no
[19:25] <jdstrand> cwayne: that is the krillin kernel
[19:25] <jdstrand> cwayne: fyi, we will increase our robustness by fixing bug #1371765
[19:26] <jdstrand> cwayne: but that is for ota-1
[19:27] <jdstrand> cwayne: probably more info than you need, but I realize I was a bit evasive on details before, so now you get them all :)
[19:27] <cwayne> jdstrand:  :) thanks
[20:10] <Springbank> Hello


[05:24] <bmg505> good morning :)
[05:59] <sakhi> Morning
[06:19] <Kilos> morning superfly and others
[06:19] <superfly> morning Kilos
[06:19] <superfly> and sakhi and bmg505
[06:32] <Kilos> superfly, how do you see what graphics card is in your pc without removing the cover and looking at the card please
[06:33] <superfly> lspci
[06:33] <Kilos> ty
[06:44] <Kilos> hiya maiatoday
[06:45] <maiatoday> hi Kilos
[07:05] <superfly> môre maiatoday
[07:24] <maiatoday> hi superfly
[07:25] <superfly> meh. typical.
[07:25] <superfly> Why hire one senior developer, when you can hire two juniors for the same price?
[07:26] <superfly> Because you think you'll get twice the output, when in fact you'll only get half the output.
[07:42] <zeref> true
[09:07] <Kilos> guys where is the graphics card here please
[09:07] <Kilos> http://slexy.org/view/s21xaBrzfN
[09:07] <Kilos> am i totally blind
[09:08] <Kerbero> 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82G33/G31 Express
[09:08] <Kerbero> Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 10)
[09:09] <Kilos> oh is that onboard?
[09:09] <Kerbero> ek aanvaar so ja
[09:09] <Kilos> not a plugin one
[09:09] <Kilos> hi jan
[09:09] <Langjan> Hi Kilos
[09:09] <Kilos> Langjan,
[09:10] <Kilos> do you have a graphics card or are you using the onboard grahics
[09:10] <Kilos> dankie Kerbero
[09:10] <Kerbero> plesier
[09:11] <Langjan> How do I find out?
[09:11] <Kilos> lol you look where your screen is plugged in
[09:11] <Langjan> Kilos, as far as I know its on board
[09:12] <Kilos> your lspci shows 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82G33/G31 Express
[09:13] <Langjan> What does that imply?
[09:14] <Kilos> i am not sure why
[09:14] <Kilos> um
[09:14] <Kilos> why its got all nvidia drivers if there isnt a nvidia card plugged in
[09:15] <Langjan> Must I open up and have a look?
[09:16] <Langjan> But seems like its not using nvidia?
[09:17] <Kilos> look at the back and see if screen plugged in at the motherboard level
[09:17] <Kilos> or in one of the slots right angled from the motherboard
[09:23] <Langjan> Difficult to say like that, its in the same area where all the sound, mouse, ethernet etc. cables are connected.
[09:25] <Kilos> ok look inside and see if the screen is plugged into a connection on the motherboard or if its in another card plugged into the motherboard
[09:25] <Langjan> I opened up, its directly into the motherboard
[09:25] <Kilos> ok
[09:25] <Kilos> now we need help from clever guys
[09:26] <Langjan> that's why I'm talking to you...
[09:26] <Kilos> i dont know if intel uses the nvidia drivers
[09:26] <Kilos> nee man
[09:26] <Langjan> ja man
[09:27] <Kilos> lets first make a backup so you dont lose everything
[09:27] <tumbleweed> intel graphics smost certainly doesn't need nvidia drivers. Neither does an nvidia graphics card, nouveau is fine for non-gaming
[09:27] <Kilos> you have a spare partition somewhere hey?
[09:27] <Langjan> the only thing that's not backed up is my emails
[09:28] <Kilos> tumbleweed, can we purge all nvidia stuff then
[09:28] <Langjan> everything else is on 11.04 on the other hard drive, oh except my firefox passwords
[09:29] <Langjan> passwords are not major issue, but emails is
[09:29] <Kilos> where do you have the spare partition Langjan
[09:29] <tumbleweed> Kilos: just don't even care about it
[09:30] <tumbleweed> Kilos: standard ubuntu intalls include drivers for all sorts of things you don't have
[09:30] <Kilos> tumbleweed, its giving hassles with dpkg configuring
[09:30] <tumbleweed> right, get rid of it :)
[09:31] <Langjan> tumbleweed, I like your drift
[09:31] <Kilos> im scared he ends up with a blank screen
[09:31] <Kilos> hehe
[09:31] <Langjan> me too, nervous hehe
[09:31] <tumbleweed> Langjan: have you checked lspci?
[09:31] <Kilos> ok Langjan
[09:31] <tumbleweed> one does get onboard nvidia graphics
[09:32] <Kilos> first we gotta work out how to make email backup with thunderbird
[09:32] <Langjan> tumbleweed, kilos made me check lspci
[09:32] <Kerbero> maak 'n copy van /home/*/.thunderbird
[09:34] <Kilos> Kerbero, gee asb die vole command
[09:34] <Kilos> volle
[09:34] <Kerbero> wel
[09:34] <Kilos> Langjan, have you got a usb stick
[09:34] <Langjan> yes
[09:34] <Kerbero> gaan in nautilus in, show hidden files bo in die view menu, en copy daai directory erens heen
[09:35] <Kilos> ok Langjan lets see if we get this right
[09:35] <Langjan> nautilus? onthou eks die oudste op die skinderkanaal...
[09:35] <Kilos> open home
[09:35] <Kilos> lol
[09:37] <Kilos> scroll through all the files in home and you should see .thunderbird
[09:38] <Langjan> I have been looking hard for that file for a few days, cannot find it
[09:38] <Kilos> do you see lots of files in home Langjan
[09:39] <Langjan> Not too many, mostly my documents
[09:39] <Kilos> ok go to view and
[09:39] <Kilos> um
[09:39] <Kilos> view hidden
[09:39] <Kilos> tick it
[09:39] <Langjan> and some msf files that I put there
[09:40] <Langjan> shows the same files
[09:40] <Kilos> if you tick view at the top you will see an option show hidden files
[09:41] <Langjan> it is ticked, still shows the same files
[09:41] <Kilos> i see over 60 folders and files
[09:41] <Langjan> and sbd files
[09:42]  * inetpro wonder of Langjan in die 'home' vouer is
[09:42] <Kilos> lots of files with a . in front
[09:42] <Langjan> not here
[09:42] <Kilos> are you in home Langjan
[09:43] <Kilos> places home
[09:43] <Langjan> It says jan/home
[09:43] <Kilos> then scroll
[09:43] <Kilos> open again
[09:43] <Langjan> home/jan/home again
[09:43] <Kilos> should be /home first then only jan
[09:43] <Kilos> you must be in first home
[09:43] <Kilos> before jan
[09:44] <inetpro> Kilos: nee, in home/jan
[09:44] <Langjan> that one has one folder in it named jan
[09:44] <Kilos> sec i just look again
[09:44] <inetpro> maar jan is die sogenaamde 'home' vouer
[09:45] <Kilos> o ja skuus man
[09:45] <inetpro> daarin lê al die verskuilde vouers wat met 'n . begin
[09:46] <Kilos> now if you scroll there there must be lotsa files
[09:46] <Kilos> maar hoekom sien hy hulle nie
[09:46] <inetpro> Kilos: omdat hy in /home/jan/home was
[09:46] <Langjan> ok nou is ek daar
[09:46] <Kilos> sjoe ek was bekommerd
[09:47] <Kilos> sien jy nou .thunderbird
[09:47] <Langjan> .thunderbird ja
[09:47] <Kilos> ek dink dis die een wat jy moet copy na ander plek toe
[09:47] <Kilos> is dit reg inetpro ?
[09:48] <inetpro> Langjan: just make sure that when you copy thunderbird files that you have closed the application
[09:48] <Kilos> ek dof met thunderbird
[09:48] <Langjan> dis 2,1 gig, te veel vir my drive
[09:48] <inetpro> Kilos: ja alles vir thunderbird is daarbinne
[09:48] <Kilos> mooi dankie
[09:48] <Kilos> evolution has a backup facility
[09:49] <Kilos> saves all settings and existing mails
[09:50] <Langjan> so must  I install evolution?
[09:50] <Kilos> we need info from a thunderbird man to know how to make thunderbird backups
[09:51] <superfly> Langjan: no, just backup your .thunderbird directory
[09:51] <Kilos> no we must save all thunderbird info so you dont lose it if we purge nvidia and you got a black screen
[09:52] <Langjan> preferably on my other hard drive?
[09:52] <superfly> Kilos: ^^
[09:52] <Kilos> save it to your usb stick Langjan
[09:52] <Langjan> its too much for my little stick, lol
[09:52] <superfly> Langjan: anywhere where you won't overwrite it, even accidentally
[09:52] <Kilos> ok onto another drive or cd
[09:53] <Kilos> ty superfly
[09:53] <Langjan> CD is also too small, dvd?
[09:53] <Kilos> ja dvd fine
[09:53] <superfly> if you can write to dvd, go ahead
[09:54] <Langjan> I think my spare hard drive will be better?
[09:55] <inetpro> Kilos: getting a blank screen does not mean that your files will be lost
[09:55] <Kilos> anywhere you wont lose it if you need to reinstall
[09:55] <Kilos> ja inetpro but he wont know how to get back here to get help
[09:56] <inetpro> ok
[09:56] <Kilos> im scared it goes blank and he must reinstall maverick
[09:57] <inetpro> Langjan: don't install evolution just so you can make a backup
[09:57] <inetpro> backing up a folder is peanuts if you just know how
[09:58] <Langjan> ok, how do I access the spare drive to backup onto, it does not seem to give me an option to create a folder
[10:00] <Kilos> dont you see the spare drive when you go places Langjan
[10:00] <Langjan> yes I do
[10:00] <Kilos> open it there
[10:01] <Kilos> then drag and drop what you want to save to a folder in it
[10:01] <inetpro> Langjan: make sure you can create a folder first
[10:01] <Langjan> any folder?
[10:01] <Kilos> or make a folder on your desktop and name it backup
[10:02] <inetpro> yes, in other words, test whether the partition is writable
[10:02] <Kilos> then drag that to the spare drive
[10:02] <Langjan> ok its backing up 2,8 gigs
[10:02] <Kilos> skuus inetpro ek tik nog en sien nie jy't klaar gese wat om te doen nie
[10:02] <inetpro> always make sure that you COPY and not MOVE
[10:02] <Kilos> sjoe so much
[10:03] <Langjan> I can see the drives but am not sure which is which and where the partition is
[10:03] <inetpro> when you move data and run into errors you stand a chance to loose data
[10:04] <Kilos> should be the option of right clicking on it and go copy to
[10:05] <inetpro> Langjan: open two windows with the files and folders
[10:05] <Kilos> i think drag and drop copies to other drives but moves on its own drive
[10:05] <inetpro> one window with the source folder and the other you make sure that you're in the destination
[10:06] <inetpro> in the source folder you rightclick the folder you want to copy and choose copy
[10:06] <inetpro> in the destination window you right-click in an open space and choose paste
[10:07] <inetpro> Langjan: how much diskspace do you have on the backup device?
[10:08] <Langjan> inetpro, what do you mean by "open two windows with the files and folders"?
[10:08] <Langjan> 1 gig
[10:09] <inetpro> eish
[10:09] <Kilos> no man
[10:09] <inetpro> Langjan: you open nautilus twice
[10:09] <Kilos> that drive is big isnt it
[10:09] <inetpro> or what are you using as the file manager?
[10:09] <Langjan> thats my flash drive, my soare hard drive is 160 gig
[10:10] <Langjan> spare
[10:10] <inetpro> Langjan: so copy it to the spare hdd
[10:10] <Langjan> thats what I think, only getting totally confused now
[10:11] <inetpro> Langjan: take it slow and make sure you understand each step before you do it
[10:12] <Langjan> I copied the files to my desktop and also to the desktop on what I think is the spare hard drive
[10:12] <Kilos> slow down take a deep breathe
[10:12] <Kilos> hehe
[10:12] <Kilos> all yours inetpro
[10:12] <inetpro> hmm...
[10:14] <inetpro> Langjan: have you ever used the terminal
[10:14] <inetpro> ?
[10:14] <Langjan> yes
[10:14]  * inetpro feels much more at home with the terminal
[10:15] <inetpro> Langjan: df -h
[10:15] <inetpro> please paste the output of that ^^
[10:16] <Langjan> jan@jan-System-Product-Name:~$ df -h
[10:16] <Langjan> Filesystem            Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
[10:16] <Langjan> /dev/sdb6              55G   46G  6.4G  88% /
[10:16] <Langjan> none                  491M  264K  491M   1% /dev
[10:16] <Langjan> none                  497M  6.3M  490M   2% /dev/shm
[10:16] <Langjan> none                  497M  120K  496M   1% /var/run
[10:16] <Langjan> none                  497M     0  497M   0% /var/lock
[10:16] <Langjan> /dev/sdb1              87G  9.2G   74G  12% /media/7602f1e5-f372-44fc-8fdd-34965ac12073
[10:16] <Langjan> /dev/sda1             144G   19G  118G  14% /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:17] <inetpro> sjoe
[10:17] <inetpro> funny names
[10:19] <Langjan> inetpro, if it helps, I have copied that file in 2 places onto the spare hard drive
[10:19] <Kilos> inetpro, can i just ask you something
[10:19] <inetpro> ok so /dev/sdb1 is 87GB and /dev/sda1 is 144 GB both seem to have more than enough space available
[10:19] <inetpro> Kilos: sure
[10:20] <inetpro> Langjan: du -hs /home/jan/.thunderbird
[10:20] <Kilos> we tried sudo chown -R jan:jan /home/jan/
[10:20] <Kilos> it said permission denied
[10:20] <Kilos> even from root
[10:21] <inetpro> Kilos: why, that should never be necessary
[10:21] <Kilos> its one config file causing all the probs
[10:21] <inetpro> ls -ld /home/jan/
[10:21] <Kilos> mixed with bumblebee and nvidia
[10:22] <inetpro> everything in your home folder should always have the permissions of the logged in user
[10:22] <Kilos> Langjan, paste bin that to http://slexy.org
[10:22] <Langjan> 2.4G	/home/jan/.thunderbird
[10:23] <inetpro> ok Langjan which folder did you copy it to on /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424 ?
[10:24] <inetpro> Langjan: ls -ld ~/
[10:24] <Langjan> just closed it, will have to get back
[10:25] <inetpro> Kilos: 'ls -ld /home/jan/' is the same as 'ls -ld ~/'
[10:25] <inetpro> and that shoudl just give you one line of output
[10:25] <inetpro> should*
[10:25] <Kilos> ah sorry
[10:25] <inetpro> no need to be sorry
[10:26] <Langjan> drwxr-xr-x 57 jan jan 12288 2011-11-30 10:51 /home/jan/
[10:26] <Kilos> i remeber some ls commands that were miles long
[10:26] <inetpro> ok the home folder is still perfect
[10:27] <inetpro> ok now let's do this
[10:27] <inetpro> ls -ld /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:28] <Langjan> drwxr-xr-x 22 root root 4096 2011-11-27 23:48 /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:29] <inetpro> hmm... there's a problem
[10:29] <inetpro> why is it mounted a root?
[10:29] <inetpro> as root*
[10:29] <Kilos> expain as you go please
[10:30] <Kilos> explain as well
[10:30] <inetpro> then again, is that an internal disk?
[10:30] <Kilos> forgotten all those read write things
[10:30] <Langjan> yes
[10:30] <inetpro> ah
[10:30] <inetpro> ok Langjan, please pastebin the following if it's longer than 3 lines
[10:31] <inetpro> ls -la drwxr-xr-x 22 root root 4096 2011-11-27 23:48 /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:31] <inetpro> hmm... there's a problem
[10:31] <inetpro> eish
[10:31] <inetpro> ls -la /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:32]  * inetpro copied and pasted accidentally... just do the last line
[10:32] <inetpro> ls -la /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:33] <Langjan> drwxr-xr-x 22 root root 4096 2011-11-27 23:48 /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:33] <inetpro> hmm...
[10:33] <inetpro> ls -la /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424/
[10:33] <inetpro> hang on
[10:34] <inetpro> please do: ls -la /media
[10:34] <inetpro> I'm sure those long names are just soft links
[10:34] <Langjan> total 16
[10:34] <Langjan> drwxr-xr-x  4 root root 4096 2011-11-30 11:01 .
[10:34] <Langjan> drwxr-xr-x 22 root root 4096 2011-11-22 12:55 ..
[10:34] <Langjan> drwxr-xr-x 22 root root 4096 2011-06-19 16:25 7602f1e5-f372-44fc-8fdd-34965ac12073
[10:34] <Langjan> drwxr-xr-x 22 root root 4096 2011-11-27 23:48 fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424
[10:35] <inetpro> hmm... not?
[10:35] <inetpro> ok
[10:35] <inetpro> ls -la /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424/
[10:36] <inetpro> note the slash at the back
[10:36] <Langjan> Big outcome, must I paste it here?
[10:37] <inetpro> pastebin please
[10:37] <Kilos> http://slexy.org please Langjan
[10:37] <inetpro> of http://pastebin.com/ .... maak nie saak waar nie
[10:37] <Kilos> the ubuntu one hangs my machine for some reason
[10:39] <Kilos> i think slexy is a lightweight one
[10:39] <inetpro> np
[10:41] <Langjan> http://pastebin.com/VFA9rdKK
[10:42] <inetpro> Langjan: sorry if I sometimes take a while before responding... getting interrupted by work
[10:43] <Langjan> Fine thanks inetpro grateful for the help.
[10:44] <inetpro> Langjan: hmm... that looks like a previous or a new installation. Do you still plan to use it as that?
[10:45] <Langjan> Are you refering to my other hard drive?
[10:46] <inetpro> Langjan: this is /media/fd52e2ba-e2dc-4ece-a831-c64dc69c8424/ which is mounted on /dev/sda1
[10:47] <Langjan> Sorry, I have no idea what that means.
[10:49] <Kilos> that was natty i think inetpro
[10:49] <inetpro> hmm... when you installed you must have skipped this partition unknowingly or on purpose and it's now just mounted as if it's an external drive
[10:49] <Kilos> 11.04 hey Langjan ?
[10:50] <Langjan> probably
[10:51] <inetpro> /dev/sda is typically your first physical drive
[10:51] <inetpro> /des/sda1 is the first partition on that drive
[10:51] <inetpro> /dev/sdb is the 2nd physical drive
[10:52] <inetpro> oops... /dev/sdb1 is the first partition on that drive
[10:52] <inetpro> then you get /dev/sda1, /dev/sda2, /dev/sda3....
[10:53] <inetpro> and /dev/sdb1, /dev/sdb2, /dev/sdb3.... and so on
[10:54] <inetpro> your system root folder is always mounted as /
[10:55] <inetpro> in your case Langjan your root folder is mounted on /dev/sdb6
[10:55] <inetpro> that seems to be the 6th partition on your 2nd physical drive
[10:55] <Langjan> inetpro, when I installed 11.04 I selected a partition, I think about 4 gigs but I have to learn about identifying what is where
[10:56] <inetpro> it does not really matter which partition you choose, what is important is that you know what is where
[10:56] <Langjan> these partitions seem to multiply uncontrollably every time a new upgrade is instakled
[10:57] <Langjan> it's a bit of a nightmare to me, I have no idea where what is
[10:57] <inetpro> Langjan: that's why it's best to take control and choose the partition scheme yourself
[10:57] <inetpro> during the installation you can choose auto or manual at some point
[10:58] <Kilos> in my honest opinion its safer to install with only one hdd plugged in at a time
[10:58] <Kilos> for us dom mense anyway
[10:58] <Langjan> inetpro, I have to be rude and ask if we can take this further at a later stage when convenient for you
[10:59] <inetpro> Langjan: hehe, I would not call that rude
[10:59] <inetpro> I'd apreciate that :-)
[10:59] <Kilos> later Langjan i see more on bumblebee and nvidia
[10:59] <Kilos> we will discuss it later
[11:00] <Langjan> many thanks, will try to identify what's where meanwhile
[11:00] <inetpro> Langjan: before you go
[11:00] <Langjan> yes?
[11:00] <inetpro> perhaps some reading will help you understand things
[11:00] <Langjan> ok
[11:00] <inetpro> hang on while I look for it
[11:01] <Langjan> thanks
[11:01] <Kilos> just and idea here. looks like bumblebee makes nvidia graphics better
[11:01] <Kilos> but there is no nvidia card so maybe thats the start of the problem
[11:02] <Kilos> how can you configure  nvidia graphics  without a nvidia graphics card
[11:03] <Langjan> vra jy my?
[11:03] <Kilos> nee ek se ek dink daar kom die probleem in
[11:03] <Langjan> ok, ek dog net jy dink ek is so slim...
[11:04] <Kilos> you should just be using ubuntu stuff and intel
[11:04] <Langjan> lmga
[11:04] <Kilos> lol
[11:04] <Kilos> ha ha
[11:04] <Langjan>  learnt that a long time ago
[11:04] <Kilos> lyk my as jy bumblebee kan kry om te werk is jy baie slim
[11:05] <Langjan> dis hoekom my BB nie werk nie
[11:05] <inetpro> Langjan: the following doc should give you lots of the background http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Partition/
[11:05] <Langjan> Many thanks inetpro
[11:06] <Langjan> Ons gesels weer later
[11:06] <inetpro> even if it may be a bit old and not very specific to ubuntu it's still very valid
[11:06] <Langjan> thanks, will have a look
[11:06] <Langjan> take care, until next time
[11:06] <Kilos> cheers Langjan
[11:06] <Kilos> dankie inetpro
[11:06] <Langjan> bye kilos
[11:07] <inetpro> Kilos: np
[11:07] <inetpro> Langjan: jy's welkom
[11:07] <Langjan> baie dankie
[11:08] <Kilos> eks seker nou sy prob kom van bumblebee en nvidia
[11:08] <Kilos> en hy het nie eers n nvidia kart in nie
[11:09] <inetpro> Kilos: don't make assumptions
[11:09] <superfly> Kilos: I don't even know what this bumblebee is
[11:09] <inetpro> Maaz: define assumption
[11:09] <Maaz> inetpro: Assumption \As*sump"tion\ (?; 215), n. [OE. assumpcioun a taking up into heaven, L. assumptio a taking, fr. assumere: cf. F. assomption. See {Assume}.] 1. The act of assuming, or taking to or upon one's self; the act of taking up or adopting. [1913 Webster]  The assumption of authority.          --Whewell. [1913 Webster]  2.  Bring your mugs and have a cuppa with us
[18:25] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[18:26] <Kilos> Maaz, thank you
[18:26] <Maaz> Kilos: Okay :-)
[18:47]  * Kilos wonders if neil is home yet
[18:47] <Kilos> thats like 12 hours flying time
[18:56] <Kilos> hi BOB with a pipe
[18:56] <Kerbero> lol
[18:57] <Kilos> 2 pipes sorry
[19:23] <zeref> hmmm, how much would a pent 3 cost?
[19:24] <Tonberry> if you pay more than a good meal then reconsider it
[19:24] <Tonberry> imho
[19:24] <zeref> :O
[19:25] <Tonberry> p3 is 5 or 6 cpu generations ago?
[19:25] <zeref> yeah
[19:25] <Tonberry> fancy phones can outrun them
[19:26] <zeref> so roughly less than a happy meal
[19:26] <zeref> :P
[19:27] <zeref> but seriously
[19:27] <zeref> cost +-
[19:40] <Kerbero> p3 is throwaway
[19:40] <Kerbero> p4 i'll take for free
[19:40] <Kerbero> core 2 i might pay for
[19:44] <drubin> lol!
[19:45] <drubin> LOL
[19:45] <Kilos> hi drubin
[19:45] <Kerbero> you seem bored drubin
[19:45] <Kilos> you enjoying that
[19:47] <Kilos> zeref, you will find that trying to get ram for a P3 is difficult and expensive
[19:48] <Kilos> i paid nearly a rand a meg 2 years ago
[19:48] <Kilos> R200 for 250m ram
[19:48] <Kilos> luckily my P4 uses same ram
[19:50] <Kilos> i dunno what happy meals cost
[20:02] <Kilos> http://slexy.org/view/s21F67hc2q
[20:02] <Kilos> thats for the clever younguns
[20:03] <Kerbero> yeah, did that happen to you?
[20:04] <Kilos> at times i feel everyone here is saying the same things about me
[20:04] <Kilos> i make lotsa I D ten T errors
[20:04] <Kerbero> well, you use ubuntu
[20:04] <Kerbero> which makes it ok
[20:05] <Kilos> yay ty
[20:06] <Kilos> i have even had school kids help me here
[20:06] <Kilos> ha ha ask squirm
[20:07] <Kerbero> o
[20:07] <Squirm> hello
[20:07] <Kilos> hiya squirm you well lad
[20:07] <Squirm> ah I'm doing ok hey. yourself?
[20:08] <Kilos> just telling Kerbero first time you helped me you were still in school
[20:08] <Kilos> im good ty
[20:08] <drubin> Kerbero: Not really
[20:12] <Squirm> I don't really help people here unfortunately. I would if I could but my knowledge is limited
[20:15] <Kilos> im still thankful for the help you gave me when i still thought pcs were only for very clever people
[20:15] <Kilos> night all of you sleep tight
[20:15] <Kilos> see yas tomorrow
[20:16] <Kerbero> nag
[20:25] <drubin> Maaz: tell Kilos it is always a pleasure!
[20:25] <Maaz> drubin: Sure, I'll tell Kilos on freenode
[20:27] <Kerbero> if i want to put a date selector in a form on a webpage
[20:27] <Kerbero> what is the best/easiest way to do it?
[20:29] <drubin> Kerbero: Jquery date plugin
[20:29] <Kerbero> ok
[20:36] <zeref> hmmm
[20:52] <inetpro> zeref: and what's that all about?
[21:11] <zeref> inetpro: ?
[23:25] <Guest6161> anybody here?