[14:41] <jck77> hello everyone
[15:57] <itnet7> Hey there jck77 !
[15:58] <itnet7> Heading out to lunch but saw you said hey!! ttyiab


[06:31] <dholbach> good morning
[19:51] <Tuhin> Hello :)
[19:51] <JoseeAntonioR> hey, Tuhin!
[19:51] <paul_mybb> Hallo
[19:52] <Sarger001> Hey :D
[19:52] <Sarger001> This is my first time watching one of these BTW
[19:52] <Tuhin> Chat is live xD
[19:52] <UbuPhillup> JoseeAntonioR: hi
[19:52] <JoseeAntonioR> yep, chat is live!
[19:52] <JoseeAntonioR> hey, UbuPhillup :)
[19:52] <Felowen> Does the video change over automatically?
[19:53] <JoseeAntonioR> Felowen: nope, you need to update the page now
[19:53] <JoseeAntonioR> you guys can update the page now, but don't click the play button until I tell you to so you don't have to reload agian
[19:53] <Tuhin> Guys I updated my 12.10 to 13.04, its perfectly working on aside with windows 8!! I don't get it, why don't they fix WUBI for 13.04
[19:54] <Felowen> thank you. Got it
[19:54] <Sarger001> Right, reloaded.
[19:55] <JoseeAntonioR> don't click play yet!
[19:57] <Sarger001> The guys over at canonical are probably going to see lots of contributions after this xD
[19:57] <UbuPhillup> Sarger001: höhö yea
[20:00] <JoseeAntonioR> Reload now to see the stream!
[20:00] <Sarger001> So we can click play now?
[20:00] <JoseeAntonioR> yes you can click the play button now :)
[20:00] <Sarger001> Yay
[20:01] <JoseeAntonioR> can you hear us ok?
[20:01] <[havoc]> yes
[20:01] <UbuPhillup> JoseeAntonioR: yes
[20:01] <PaulW2U> Yes
[20:01] <Sarger001> WOAH i'm wearing headphones
[20:02] <UbuPhillup> yes
[20:02] <Irish_> We can here both of you fine
[20:02] <Felowen> Can hear you fine
[20:02] <Sarger001> I can hear you, definately.
[20:02] <Sarger001> Yeah, both of you.
[20:02] <Felowen> I can hear both of you very well
[20:02] <pop> hey guys
[20:03] <UbuPhillup> hey pop
[20:04] <Reflectoman> hello
[20:04] <JoseeAntonioR> hey, Reflectoman
[20:04] <kira7006> hey hey
[20:05] <JoseeAntonioR> hey, kira7006 :)
[20:05] <JoseeAntonioR> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/LinkSuggestions
[20:06] <kira7006> but if we want to contribute directly in coding ...
[20:07] <kira7006> or for my case in cloud expertise
[20:07] <JoseeAntonioR> kira7006: this is about the Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter, you can check the Ubuntu OpenWeek in a couple weeks for that :)
[20:08] <JoseeAntonioR> https://docs.google.com/document/edit?id=18ZbtFHQq6uMj7iuRLd11VH8V5Uc_FA0IfgiRUcbMbQk
[20:08] <Sarger001> What sort of news are you looking for?
[20:08] <kira7006> thx Josee :D
[20:09] <JoseeAntonioR> no worries, kira7006 :)
[20:09] <JoseeAntonioR> Sarger001: all kind of news related to Ubuntu, for sure!
[20:09] <Irish_> I have promotional skills how could I help?
[20:11] <JoseeAntonioR> Irish_: I'll ask that on a sec
[20:12] <Irish_> Thanks :-)
[20:16] <Sarger001> ye
[20:18] <JoseeAntonioR> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/StyleGuidelines
[20:19] <Irish_> Thank you :)
[20:26] <JoseeAntonioR> #ubuntu-news
[20:27] <JoseeAntonioR> Hello!
[20:28] <JoseeAntonioR> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-news-team
[20:28] <foxus> if im interested in some kind of ubuntu "plug-ins" like lets say, gnome shell how can i contribute?
[20:29] <JoseeAntonioR> foxus: you'll be able to find that during the Ubuntu OpenWeek :)
[20:30] <foxus> jmm, i saw about this conference on facebook, open week is anounced like this one?
[20:31] <Felowen> thanks for the info both of you
[20:34] <Sarger001> :D
[20:34] <PaulW2U> thanks both
[20:35] <foxus> ?
[20:36] <JoseeAntonioR> foxus: already answered on-air :)
[20:37] <akgraner> Thanks y'all - give me about 30 minutes and I'll be working on the the google doc - fill free to jump into #ubuntu-news to ask questions
[20:38] <JoseeAntonioR> wow, it's been great. really missed being on-air!
[21:04] <ahmednsry> this ahmed nsry from ubuntu sudan team


[07:38] <m0ar> Is this the place to get help with ubuntu one?
[07:43] <m0ar> When trying to reach my files over the web, the pages just load infinitely when clicking a file. Am i missing something?
[07:50] <aquarius> m0ar, that shouldn't happen :)
[07:50] <m0ar> aquarius: Well, it's wierd ,_;
[07:50] <aquarius> let me check whether it's happening for me
[07:50] <m0ar> Any ideas?
[07:50] <aquarius> right, not happening to me. Which web browser are you using?
[07:52] <m0ar> Firefox shiretoko
[07:52] <m0ar> 3,5
[07:52] <m0ar> The files are listed in red text in one.ubuntu.com/files
[07:52] <m0ar> The small cloud-thingie tells me that my folders are up to date
[07:54] <aquarius> ah, so the web interface loads, it's just when actually downloading a file that it doesn't work
[07:54] <aquarius> ?
[07:55] <m0ar> aquarius: Yep
[07:55] <aquarius> working for me in Chromium; let me try FF3.5
[07:56] <m0ar> aquarius: Oh, now it works :s
[07:56] <aquarius> m0ar, there you go then, I fixed it.
[07:56] <aquarius> not really :)
[07:56] <aquarius> Strange.
[07:56] <m0ar> Hasn't been working for three days, now it does :D
[07:56] <aquarius> I'm glad it works now...
[07:56] <m0ar> aquarius: Thanks for keeping me company :D
[07:56] <aquarius> might have been a weird blip
[07:56]  * aquarius laughs
[07:57] <aquarius> Sorry I can't actually tell you what the problem was!
[07:57] <m0ar>  :D
[07:57] <m0ar> I'll have to hit the bus, see you around
[07:57] <aquarius> cheers. later!
[10:22] <rtgz> aquarius, hi, may I ask you about ubuntuone deb package?
[10:22] <aquarius> rtgz, sure
[10:23] <rtgz> aquarius, bzr branch lp:ubuntuone-client; cd ubuntuone-client; echo "How do I build deb properly out of this?"
[10:24] <aquarius> ah, that bit I don't know all that much about :(
[10:24] <aquarius> sorry !
[10:25] <rtgz> aquarius, yep, it looks like it is somewhere near, but I just can't get it :), ~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-client/karmic seems to be somehow related though... but I just want a liiitle tiny deb... :)
[10:25] <aquarius> rtgz, yeah. that branch is the "packaging branch". The process is *something* like merging in the packaging branch and then doing "debuild", but I don't actually know very much about it :(
[10:26] <aquarius> people who will definitely know: kenvandine, dobey, cardinalfang
[10:26] <aquarius> all of whom are in the US and therefore asleep :(
[10:27] <rtgz> so far my workaround was to apply all patches, then take changes and apply on top of sources downloaded from ppa. Which works, but I feel that I am cheating...
[10:27] <rtgz> aquarius, yup, will hunt them here
[10:27] <aquarius> well, the patches should be in the upstream source?
[10:28] <rtgz> aquarius, no, i mean i have several branches now and when I get them all together, then I still need to unpack the sources containing the debian/ directory, stuff my files into these sources and rebuild
[10:29] <aquarius> I *think* the way you're best to do it is:
[10:30] <aquarius> bzr branch lp:~rtgz/ubuntuone/mybranch mybranch; cd mybranch; bzr merge lp:~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-client/karmic; debuild
[10:30] <aquarius> i.e., you merge the packaging branch into your branch locally, and then build
[10:30] <aquarius> but I am not strong on this stuff
[10:30]  * rtgz slaps his forehead
[10:32] <rtgz> but it is still not clear how ppas get built..
[10:33] <aquarius> as I understand it, you check code in and launchpad builds it in a PPA for you?
[10:38] <rtgz> aquarius, yup, but ... no, I am not yet deb-enlightened, need some more time to grasp this. I liked Slackware approach though :)
[11:08] <aquarius> homeasvs_, ping?
[11:09] <aquarius> homeasvs_, have you been looking at pytohn-keyring for desktopcouch?
[11:33] <aquarius> homeasvs_, and...are there instructions around for how to install desktopcouch on fedora and the n900? I'd like to update http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/desktopcouch/Documentation/Installing
[11:56] <rtgz> he-he, max object size for Amazon S3 is 5Gb ATM. Fortunately, most of the users will not notice this with their 2Gb plan. But some paying users might be upset if U1 does not do any object split/merge on their side.
[12:09] <aquarius> rtgz, we do, don't worry :)
[12:10] <rtgz> aquarius, then this needs to be called a "feature" :)
[12:10]  * aquarius checks that his understanding is correct :)
[12:25] <rtgz> how exactly a honk should be made if I want a music store?
[12:29] <aquarius> you say to me: I want a music store
[12:29] <aquarius> and then I say: I am working on it :)
[12:52] <rtgz> ah, so these three "honks" I did previously were not registered :)
[13:21] <rtgz> "This bug is released (rev 288) in the Ubuntu One beta PPA":  Bug #488413, don't think I would want to update to PPA after reading this sentence right away...
[13:21] <rtgz> "is fixed" ?
[13:25] <verterok> rtgz: is fixed in trunk
[13:26] <verterok> rtgz: but it's "in progress" in the package, as it's proposed for SRU
[13:26] <rtgz> verterok, yep, it might me, but "This bug is released in the Ubuntu One beta PPA" might be just a typo
[13:27] <verterok> heh, yes
[13:50] <dobey> it's fixed in the stable PPA as well
[13:51] <TimH1> iPhone app would be handy but I guess takes some work. Could the web page be changed to work properly with an iPhone / other mobile browsers instead?
[13:54] <rtgz> TimH1, building Maemo stuff at the moment (Google Android already set up). Will start poking devs about if web site does not work properly soon :)
[13:54] <TimH1> What's maemo? Sorry for ignorance.
[13:55] <rtgz> TimH1, Nokia OS based on Linux for N800 etc. network tablets and N900 Smartphone
[13:59] <TimH1> Good stuff. Thanks for all the work!
[14:39] <statik> hey there greg-g, i'm not sure why your account is jacked up but we're trying to figure it out
[14:39] <aquarius> dobey, ping?
[14:45] <dobey> aquarius: hi
[14:45] <aquarius> dobey, you're working today?
[14:45] <dobey> aquarius: today, tomorrow, and wednesday, yes
[14:45] <aquarius> dobey, if so, you need to change the channel topic :)
[14:45] <aquarius> unless you've swapped Face?
[14:45] <dobey> i can't change the topic :)
[14:46] <aquarius> to daah :)
[14:46] <urbanape> morning, folks
[15:01] <Chipaca> desktop+ meeting begins. aquarius, CardinalFang, dobey, jblount, mandel, rodrigo, rtgz, teknico, urbanape, vds: you know how it works: say "me" to get a turn, then in your turn say your done/todo/blocked status. Weekly planning will follow, one-on-one, so please do not leave.
[15:02] <vds> me
[15:02] <aquarius> me
[15:02] <urbanape> me
[15:02] <rodrigo_> me
[15:02] <vds> teknico is off this week
[15:02] <CardinalFang> me
[15:02] <rtgz> me (though not much to say)
[15:04] <Chipaca> vds: I was about to say :)
[15:04] <Chipaca> dobey: jblount: ping
[15:05] <dobey> me
[15:06] <Chipaca> ok. vds: go!
[15:06] <vds> DONE: started a branch to fix #498324, I'll add also the changes I had to do to field_mapping to this branch. tested SMSes with not much luck so far.
[15:06] <vds> TODO: finish this branch, setup funambol to send sms messages
[15:06] <vds> BLOCKED: no
[15:06] <vds> aquarius, you're up!
[15:06] <aquarius> ⚀ DONE: get documentation on how to sign in to test music store; build example Python music store wrapper widget; tell rodrigo_ about it
[15:06] <aquarius> ⚁ TODO: create music store auth URLs; create fake music store for testing; continue work on desktopcouch developer docs; publish DC HTML API docs somewhere (where?); look at Tomboy xml/html translator; work with rodrigo on Music Store; write up things learned at UDS; step-by-step guide to what happens during contact sync; hand off "pipe" to transfer data between two HTTP connections with twisted 9.0 to lucio's team
[15:06] <aquarius> ; make tomboy first-sync experience nicer
[15:06] <aquarius> ⚂ BLOCKED: not being able to think of where to put DC API docs because I am clearly stupid
[15:06] <aquarius> urbanape, you're in the chair
[15:06] <urbanape> DONE: Kept my ubuntuone-servers branch up to date with trunk, but needs some CSS lovin' from jblount. Bindwood manifest branch is proceeding apace. Had to make some decisions about
[15:06] <urbanape> client-generated _ids.
[15:06] <urbanape> TODO: Get manifest parsing going on, so we can easily track movments and structure.
[15:06] <urbanape> BLOCK: None
[15:06] <urbanape> rodrigo_: go go go
[15:06] <rodrigo_> • DONE: Vacation. Sync with aquarius about music store work. Some tiny fixes in mobile notes web UI
[15:06] <rodrigo_> • TODO: Conflict resolver tool in pair tool. Look at becoming a MOTU (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers). Make sandy's snowy test suite work with our server (http://git.gnome.org/cgit/snowy/tree/api/tests.py). Discuss with jdo and aquarius about oauth token per app, not per machine? Look at Canola. Add envvar to override music store default location
[15:06] <rodrigo_> • BLOCKED: no
[15:07] <rodrigo_> CardinalFang: go!
[15:07] <CardinalFang> DONE: Got source package branch updated and uploaded.
[15:07] <CardinalFang> TODO: Tag it and get it merged.  Give mandel feedback about wrapper branch.
[15:07] <CardinalFang> BLOCKED: The SRU wiki page says things that are impossible.
[15:07] <CardinalFang> rtgz, what do you know?
[15:07] <rtgz> DONE: Found alternative way for #498019 (NautilusGetFileItemsCalledTwice). Posted some idea for NautilusFolderEmblems to #440848.
[15:07] <rtgz> TODO: Update ubuntuone-client-diagnose with the latest bug info. Find more bugs. Test UI on Android and Maemo platforms. Create more feature request tickets. Hack more for "Shared with Me" folder emblem support (if nobody else does this).
[15:07] <rtgz> BLOCK: (null)
[15:07] <rtgz> dobey, you are welcome!
[15:07] <dobey> ☺ DONE: Reviews, Fixed get_metadata to return full paths, More initial new client work
[15:07] <dobey> ☹ TODO: Face day, Reviews, New Client Code, E-mail motu-council
[15:07] <dobey> ☹ BLCK: None.
[15:08] <Chipaca> ok, thank you all
[15:08] <Chipaca> meeting ends
[15:08] <greg-g> statik: hey man, thanks for checking into it.
[15:09] <greg-g> whew, I wasn't looking when I replied, I almost interrupted the meeting :)
[15:10] <Chipaca> greg-g: heh, no problem even if you did :)
[15:10] <Chipaca> aquarius: your TODO looks like a lot of things. Do you think you'll do all that this week?
[15:10] <aquarius> Chipaca, not at all
[15:10] <aquarius> Chipaca, it's my todo basically forever.
[15:11] <aquarius> Chipaca, I can change it to be my todo just for this week, but I don't want to forget about the other stuff.
[15:11] <Chipaca> aquarius: no, no, that's fine
[15:11] <Chipaca> aquarius: can you create bugs for those that don't, and then in the next meetings mention the bug numbers?
[15:11] <Chipaca> aquarius: for those that don't have them already, i mean
[15:12] <Chipaca> aquarius: then a bit of tagging should get them into a few of our burndown charts
[15:12] <aquarius> Chipaca, I can do...things on my to-do list tend to be high-level stuff which I can't time-estimate, though, rather than low-level stuff that's suited to bugs. They're more stories than bugs.
[15:12] <Chipaca> joshuahoover1: do you have suggestions for tagging for taht?
[15:12] <urbanape> ooh, bugs for todos. good idea.
[15:12]  * urbanape goes to makes some bugs
[15:12] <Chipaca> aquarius: I'll take a story-bug until it can be split into task-bugs
[15:13] <joshuahoover1> Chipaca: sorry, catching up on your conversation first
[15:13] <aquarius> Chipaca, OK, no problem, I will do so
[15:13]  * aquarius adds "make bugs for all items in this todo list" to his todo list.:)
[15:13] <rtgz> urbanape, hey, these bugs will be easily discovered, even before the actual commit... So some part of me likes this idea...
[15:14] <Chipaca> is there a way to tie blueprints to bugs?
[15:14] <dobey> Chipaca: i am not sure. you can link branches, not sure about bugs
[15:14]  * Chipaca makes a note to look that up
[15:14] <dobey> Chipaca: yes, you can link bugs also
[15:14] <joshuahoover1> Chipaca, aquarius: all the work on the store should be captured in the blueprint work items...if the daily report is more detailed, that's fine...but we need to make sure that we know what work item in the blueprint we're working towards completing
[15:14] <Chipaca> dobey: ah, great
[15:15] <Chipaca> joshuahoover1: ah, so I should be asking people to add work items to the blueprints, rather than bugs to be tied to the blueprint?
[15:17] <dobey> Chipaca: and we can make sprints in http://blueprints.launchpad.net/sprints and link our blueprints to sprints, too
[15:17] <joshuahoover1> Chipaca: yeah, since that's how the platform team captures the work for the burndown charts...for the web work and mobile sync stuff, we'll need to use bugs with tags...i'm thinking something simple on the tags for those...like if jblount is working on files web ui improvement bugs, we tag those u1-lucid-files-web-ui...i'd like all bugs during lucid like this to start with u1-lucid and then match to the story/project they're a part
[15:17] <dobey> oh, or there's a register meeting button on http://blueprints.launcphad.net/ubuntuone-client also
[15:18] <Chipaca> joshuahoover1: ok, good thing I asked when I asked then :)
[15:18] <Chipaca> aquarius: you read what joshuahoover1 said?
[15:18] <dobey> speaking of which
[15:18]  * Chipaca swats ants off of his notebook
[15:18] <dobey> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-client has some stuff we should probably "triage"
[15:19] <joshuahoover1> Chipaca: yeah, it's on my to-do today to help you guys get those tagged up...i'm going through the project tracker sheet and will give recommended tags for each feature that's not a blueprint
[15:19] <aquarius> Chipaca, I do, but I'm not totally sure I understand what joshuahoover1 said. I need to look at everything on my todo list and make it a work item on a blueprint (possibly creating that blueprint)? Work items aren't tracked; they're just words in the description, right? So how does this help with burndown?
[15:20] <joshuahoover1> aquarius: you're working on the music store full time, correct?
[15:20] <aquarius> for the moment, yes
[15:20] <Chipaca> aquarius: blueprints for what you're working on should exist already. Work items are "just" words in the description, following a certain format, that is pulled out by scripts
[15:20] <Chipaca> aquarius: have you seen the burndown charts?\
[15:21] <aquarius> Chipaca, oh, something parses the work items? cool! I didn't know that
[15:21] <Chipaca> aquarius: yes :)
[15:21] <aquarius> blueprints for what I am working on do exist. It's the more ephemeral things in my todo list, like "improve the tomboy first-sync experience", that don't yet have blueprints, because they don't exist anywhere other than my todo list. It's something I added so as not to lose track of it.
[15:21] <joshuahoover1> aquarius: so all music store stuff should be captured in the music store blue print under the work items
[15:22] <Chipaca> joshuahoover1: as I understand it the blueprint work items are more like stories than tasks, right?
[15:22] <joshuahoover1> aquarius: that's the kind of stuff i don't have any visibility into at all
[15:22] <joshuahoover1> Chipaca: correct
[15:23] <Chipaca> aquarius: for work that is not in blueprints then, please create bugs
[15:23] <dobey> hrmm
[15:23] <aquarius> joshuahoover1, yep, because it's not even clear whether we'll be doing it or not, and I have no idea whatsoever how much work it is. I mean, I would like, at some point in the future, to think about deploying couchapps on our infrastructure. Might not happen for 5 years. Do you want that as 100% incomplete in the burndown charts for the next five years?
[15:23] <Chipaca> aquarius: later today we'll work on some kind of tagging system with joshuahoover1 to help us wade through it
[15:23] <dobey> it would be nice to be able to convert blueprints to bugs, since most of these seem like wishlist bugs, and not blueprints
[15:25] <joshuahoover1> aquarius: i understand...no, we only want stuff we plan on doing for lucid showing up in the burn down charts...the other stuff can be captured elsewhere (where? not sure the answer on that right at the moment) but we don't want it affecting burndown charts
[15:25] <dobey> aquarius: work items should ideally be bugs i think
[15:25] <joshuahoover1> dobey: agreed...it's less than ideal imo (the current setup), but we're trying to match what the platform team is doing on lucid so we can track things more consistently there across the board
[15:25] <dobey> joshuahoover1: the burn down charts only deal with blueprints on Ubuntu itself as i understand
[15:25] <aquarius> joshuahoover1, exactly my point; currently, "the other stuff" that I want to do is in my todo list. So, joshuahoover1, Chipaca, you want me to make those items be bugs instead?
[15:25] <joshuahoover1> dobey: no, they have our work there too
[15:26] <dobey> joshuahoover1: yes, all the things from UDS are blueprints on ubuntu
[15:26] <dobey> joshuahoover1: it doesn't have http://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-client things as i understand it
[15:26] <joshuahoover1> aquarius: sure, if it's future work, not necessarily for lucid, then put them in bugs for now and tag them in a way you'll be able to find them later :)
[15:26] <aquarius> ok, no worries.
[15:26] <Chipaca> aquarius: I can't think of an easier way to bring your bus factor down :)
[15:26] <joshuahoover1> dobey: how about this? https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/lucid-ubuntu-one-client-app
[15:26] <aquarius> Chipaca, heh, not a bad point, that one :)
[15:27] <dobey> joshuahoover1: see the /ubuntu/ there
[15:27] <dobey> joshuahoover1: that's not /ubuntuone-client/ :)
[15:27] <urbanape> Where in the blueprints do we create additional work items?
[15:27] <joshuahoover1> dobey: :)
[15:28] <dobey> urbanape: i think the ubuntu stuff gets specified in the whiteboard, in a certain format
[15:28] <dobey> urbanape: but *i* think they should be bugs, and linked to the blueprint
[15:28] <joshuahoover1> urbanape: all the u1 blueprints have workitems so you add them there and follow the same format...i'll send out an email to explain this since i haven't done a good job of letting people know what's going on there :)
[15:28] <dobey> urbanape: or branches, linked to the blueprint
[15:29] <joshuahoover1> dobey: agreed, but that's not how the platform team wants to track them at the moment (as workitems in the blueprint whiteboard)
[15:29] <Chipaca> joshuahoover1: wasn't the format explained in a wiki page somewhere?
[15:29] <urbanape> joshuahoover1: thanks
[15:29] <urbanape> dobey: cool
[15:29] <dobey> it's hard enough trying to follow blueprints as-is
[15:29] <joshuahoover1> Chipaca: yep, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WorkItemsHowto
[15:30] <urbanape> I agree. They seem very hub-ish
[15:30] <dobey> joshuahoover1: yes, i understand that
[15:31] <dobey> joshuahoover1: for future-ish stuff like aquarius is putting into bugs/blueprints though, i think they can be done on the specific projects, and we can use bugs/branches
[15:31] <dobey> well, except for any private projects
[15:31] <dobey> because i don't think blueprints work well for that, yet
[15:31] <Chipaca> dobey: we need the platform team to know where we stand. That means we need to put this information in blueprints.
[15:31] <joshuahoover1> dobey: yes...we don't have "a way" to do that per se so bugs/branches on the projects is fine
[15:32] <Chipaca> dobey: on the plus side, you can think of blueprints' work items as tracking user stories, and bugs for tracking tasks, and you should be ok
[15:33] <dobey> Chipaca: the platform team shouldn't care about what our "futuristic space station" plans are, they care about what we're doing for lucid
[15:33] <dobey> Chipaca: and all that stuff is already in blueprints on the ubuntu distribution (as opposed to on desktopcouch or ubuntuone-client)
[15:34] <Chipaca> dobey: not all of it is yet broken down to work items
[15:35] <dobey> Chipaca: so if we had http://blueprints.launchpad.net/desktopcouch/+spec/giant-laser-on-the-moon it shouldn't affect the platform team's charts or perception of us, while the music store on the other hand, is obviously important for lucid :)
[15:35] <Chipaca> dobey: yes. Suddenly I get the impression you're talking about something different than I am
[15:35] <dobey> Chipaca: yes, but for aquarius's "i want to build a web app thing in the futures" it doesn't belong as work items on the current blueprints i don't think
[15:36] <Chipaca> yes, I agree (hadn't I said that already?)
[15:36] <dobey> Chipaca: i think the discussion got sidetracked a bit, because there was a question about whether having a new blueprint would screw up the burndown charts
[15:37] <dobey> Chipaca: and i was trying to explain that stuff is only based ono blueprints against Ubuntu itself (which the music store, new client app, and user folders specs all are)
[15:37] <Chipaca> ah, I missed that question
[15:37] <Chipaca> we should be creating no new blueprints
[15:37] <Chipaca> all the blueprints we're working on have been signed off by Mark already :)
[15:38] <dobey> no new blueprints against Ubuntu, yes
[15:38] <CardinalFang> My Gnome Notification Area in my top Panel has two slots that are empty-ish.  They're next to each other.  The backgrounds are grey, not the translucent of the rest of the panel and notif-icons.  They contain the contents of the two adjacent slots to the right.  It's like something claimed a slot, and has no onPaint() method (or whatever).  Has anyone else seen this kind of thing?
[15:38] <dobey> but a giant-laser-on-the-moon desktopcouch blueprint on desktopcouch, for aquarius to throw down ideas for future stuff with desktopcouch, i think is fine
[15:39] <Chipaca> dobey: but then we go back to the visibility of stuff in blueprints
[15:39] <dobey> CardinalFang: i've seen evidence that there may be more afoot in the notification area
[15:40] <dobey> Chipaca: yes, but if one is pasting it in one's stand-up TODO in #ubuntuone, it's not really a visibility issue
[15:40] <Chipaca> dobey: point
[15:40] <dobey> Chipaca: we just need to not use blueprints for obviously private things
[15:41] <dobey> Chipaca: granted, that won't stop other users from creating blueprints, either
[15:41] <Chipaca> *sigh* I'm trying to find the easiest way for us all to keep top-down visibility into our dev process, keeping things as lightweight as possible, and am willing to try lots of things until we find something that works
[15:41] <rtgz> CardinalFang, seen that, got 2 volume controls, could not reproduce so far since no extra applets were seem to be running
[15:41] <dobey> as evidenced by https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-servers
[15:42] <dobey> Chipaca: i know. i am just trying to help push that in a direction which i think makes sense for doing so
[15:43] <Chipaca> dobey: I appreciate it
[15:43] <dobey> Chipaca: the big problem is that no matter how we do it, if we do it in some public forum, random people are going to participate in some manner, which can be good, or bad
[15:43] <CardinalFang> A to-do item is hopefully imminent work.  That's too late for someone to steal/corrupt/block our work, I think.   A blueprint may mention work 6 months out, and that's far enough for Evil Corp to mobilize and break it.
[15:44] <Chipaca> aquarius: so, going back a little, do you know where and what to do re planning, blueprints and bugs?
[15:44] <dobey> well i think google already has an app server thing, so we're probably safe for putting "coudhdb app engine" as a blueprint :)
[15:45] <aquarius> Chipaca, as I understand it, now, anything that is to be done for Lucid against an existing blueprint goes into that blueprint as a work item, and everything else goes in as a bug. (There should be nothing which is due for Lucid and doesn't already have a blueprint.)
[15:45] <dobey> but if blueprints are ever only going to be used to plan stuff for the next release of ubuntu, they seem pretty useless, and a hindrance, for our per-project planning
[15:45] <Chipaca> aquarius: right. the level of things in the work items are *stories*, not tasks
[15:45] <aquarius> yep
[15:45] <Chipaca> aquarius: so tasks for stories in work items in blueprints are bugs
[15:46] <Chipaca> aquarius: if you understood that far, please explain it to me again because I got lost
[15:46] <aquarius> I reckon I've got it, now. Probably.
[15:46] <aquarius> can't help thinking that "put them in a tomboy note", which is what I've got at the moment, is quite a lot easier ;)
[15:48]  * dobey wonders how one triages blueprints
[15:49] <Chipaca> aquarius: well... python-desktopcouch and python-launchpadlib :)
[15:49] <Chipaca> (or whatever the python couch thing is called)
[15:49] <aquarius> Chipaca, heh. Yes. I should back-end my tomboy note to launchpad :P
[15:50] <rtgz> By posting a note in ubuntuone, you get it posted to blogger, livejournal, twitter, and CNN web site. All from one place. Ubuntu One.
[15:51] <rtgz> ... and launchpad blueprint. After all that's not such a bad idea :)
[15:51] <rtgz> sorry for interrupting, will stare on the enormous amount of letters for some more time...
[15:54] <Chipaca> rtgz: are you working on the CNN plugin?
[15:54] <dobey> hmm
[15:54] <dobey> yeah, that would be great
[15:54] <rtgz> Chipaca, I knew that nobody will ask about blogger and twitter...
[15:54] <dobey> facebook status becomes a launchpad blueprint
[15:55] <dobey> what a lovely world it would be
[15:55] <rtgz> [save as "Breaking News"] from web ui
[15:55] <Chipaca> CardinalFang, dobey, jblount, rodrigo, teknico, urbanape, vds: if you haven't, please follow the conversation since the standup meeting ended. Please get the stories you are working on into the blueprints if they're part of a blueprint, or into a bug if not
[15:56] <urbanape> I like the idea more of making bugs as work items that we tie to blueprints.
[15:56] <Chipaca> urbanape: bugs are for *tasks*, and yes you should do that too
[15:57] <Chipaca> urbanape: and we'll use bugs for stories that don't have blueprints until we can think of someplace better. dobey says (if I understand correctly) that we should put them in blueprints of our own (not in /ubuntu), but he also says that blueprints should die :)
[15:58] <Chipaca> so I don't care if stories not related to ubuntu blueprints are in bugs or tasks in our own blueprints, but they've got to be *some*where, ok?
[16:04] <vds> Chipaca: can blueprints be private?
[16:04] <urbanape> well, I think it's reasonable that bugs/stories/tasks are somewhat intertwined.
[16:05] <Chipaca> vds: I don't know. I'm looking.
[16:06] <Chipaca> vds: my launchpad is terribly slow today, though
[16:06] <Chipaca> must be the clouds or sth
[16:06] <vds> Chipaca: I think can't and that's why we are using bugs to represent stories
[16:07] <Chipaca> vds: but now the stories (for lucid) are no longer secret in any way
[16:10] <dobey> vds: no
[16:11] <dobey> vds: blueprints aren't private, nor are sprints
[16:11] <dobey> vds: and we can't disable blueprints for a project, it seems
[16:31] <rodrigo_> where does python expect modules to be installed? isn't .../share/pyshared enough?
[16:32] <rodrigo_> ah, libdir/python/site-packages
[16:32] <Chipaca> dist-packages
[16:34] <rodrigo_> dist-packages? under libdir/python?
[16:34] <rodrigo_> isn't there a pkg-config like to know where to install it?
[16:35] <rodrigo_> (btw, it's a module of my own, which python doesn't find wherever I install it)
[16:35] <Chipaca> rodrigo_: isn't this taken care of by the dh python stuff?
[16:36]  * Chipaca doesn't know
[16:36] <rodrigo_> dh is for packages, this is a source module, no package yet
[16:38] <Chipaca> ah, my bad
[16:41] <rtgz> Ok, me goes away, if I don't return today then -12 C is really cold :)
[16:44] <rtg|outer_space> i might be mistaking but one.ubuntu.com looks really weird in Maemo... erm.. I mean that on files tab there are no... files..
[16:45]  * rtg|outer_space will happily harvest bugs in Maemo now
[16:46] <rodrigo_> rtg|outer_space: yeah, doesn't show up on my n900 neither
[16:48] <rodrigo_> oh, yes, it does, it's on the n810 that doesn't
[16:49] <rtg|outer_space> rodrigo_, hm, looks like js broke there... aaah... need to go!
[17:20] <dobey> whenever rodrigo gets back, tell him I can help him with the installing python modules stuff after I get back from lunch :)
[17:33] <urbanape> jblount: you around?
[17:34] <Chipaca> urbanape: off sick
[17:37] <urbanape> ah, so.
[17:37] <urbanape> k, well, I'll continue keeping my u-s branch up to date with trunk.
[17:40] <urbanape> aquarius: so, I was thinking of a way to handle the uuid -> _id transition.
[17:41] <aquarius> urbanape, OK
[17:41] <urbanape> I was thinking too much about making them all similar.
[17:41] <urbanape> but I don't think that's necessary.
[17:41] <urbanape> Bindwood (the extension) already knows to update a local bookmark's annotation with an appropriate uuid if it comes from Couch. That being the case, we could just make the local annotation be the Couch record's _id.
[17:42] <urbanape> It'll still be unique.
[17:43] <aquarius> won't that screw you up on a different machine?
[17:43] <aquarius> oh, sorry, you mean "get the couch record's _id and store that on the firefox bookmark", gotcha.
[17:44] <urbanape> correct, exactly
[17:45] <urbanape> And then, when we create new records, we will use a locally-generated uuid
[17:45] <urbanape> et voila! No need for migration, no need for messy conditional code.
[17:46] <urbanape> It will leave behind the application_annotations.Firefox.uuid field, unless we want to opportunistically remove that (which I'd kinda rather not)
[17:57] <aquarius> OK...I have thought that through and I can't see an issue with it. Sweet.
[17:57] <aquarius> good work!
[17:58] <urbanape> yay!
[18:25] <xant> hello everyone
[18:25] <xant> Does ubuntu one synchronize .* files?
[18:26] <CardinalFang> xant, I think it does.  The filename shouldn't matter.
[18:27] <xant> How do I make Ubuntu one to recheck the files for changes?
[18:28] <CardinalFang> xant, Hrm.  It should use the kernel's inotify system so that any change triggers re-inspection.  If the timestamp doesn't matter, you could 'touch' the file.
[18:29] <CardinalFang> xant, confirmed, "> .a-dotfile" created, and it showed up in web UI immediately.
[18:29] <xant> CardinalFang, I'm to trying to use EncFS + Ubuntu One
[18:30] <CardinalFang> xant, fair enough.  I use them both.
[18:30] <CardinalFang> At different mount points, note.
[18:30] <xant> CardinalFang, successfully?
[18:32] <CardinalFang> xant, yes.  Oh, let me guess -- you're putting the encrypted blocks in Ubuntu One, instead of what I'm doing, running an encrypted home with one directory inside, Ubuntu One, that is sync'd up and not encrypted on the 'net.
[18:33] <xant> CardinalFang, your data is not stored encrypted on the ubuntu one servers, is it?
[18:33] <CardinalFang> xant, are you sure that the encfs triggers the same inotify events as writing files normally?
[18:34] <CardinalFang> xant, No.  Everything I have there is not Sekrit.
[18:35] <CardinalFang> so, we're doing different things.  f(g()   g(f())
[18:35] <xant> CardinalFang, I'm not. Regardless of Encfs, my ubuntu one is broken for some reason.
[18:36] <CardinalFang> xant, tell us about it.
[18:37] <xant> https://one.ubuntu.com/files/ gives me 503 Service Unavailable
[18:38] <xant> CardinalFang, do you get the same error?
[18:38] <rtgz> MO NI TO RING! Guys!
[18:38] <CardinalFang> It sure does, xant.
[18:38] <rtgz> me is back
[18:39] <xant> After some really long delay, ubuntu one started to synchronize the files
[18:39] <rtgz> The wording is also pretty strange, "No server is available to handle this request"?
[18:39] <CardinalFang> Yah.  Weird.
[18:40] <pfibiger> there is supposed to be a more descriptive error page. we're taking services down for a window to do some hardware upgrades.
[18:40]  * pfibiger looks into it
[18:40] <rtgz> pfibiger, it would be much better if somebody posted a twitter note about this
[18:41] <rtgz> seeing that the service down _after_ end users do notice is pretty scary.
[18:41] <xant> Has anyone managed to set up ubuntu one wih his or her files encrypted on the ubuntu one servers?
[18:44] <CardinalFang> xant, Sorry, I don't know.  It should be possible, but the method is kind of weird.  A future version of Ubuntu One will allow you to pick the targets that are synchronized.  On that day, it will be easy to pick the ciphertext directory.  Right now, there are at least three things that are tricky to set up.
[18:44] <xant> My upload speed is around 45 kB/s
[18:44] <aquarius> xant, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=8517221 may be helpful
[18:45] <CardinalFang> xant, also, there's the cost of uploading blocks instead of diffs.  A single character changes, the block-cipher makes the remaining several kilobytes change, and all of those get uploaded and downloaded.  it's expensive.
[18:46] <rtgz> CardinalFang, erm, I don't think U1 uploads deltas right now
[18:46] <CardinalFang> Oh.  Huh.  So much for if-I-had-designed-it assumptions.
[18:46] <xant> CardinalFang, what are the three tricky things? :-)
[18:47] <xant> aquarius, thanks. But I've already read it. I'm following the poster's method
[18:47] <aquarius> xant, oh, OK :)
[18:48] <CardinalFang> xant, er, I don't know.  Just estimating.  mount path.  order of startup.  U1 passphrase in keyring, but keyring in home directory chicken-and-egg problem. ... perhaps more.
[18:49] <aquarius> xant, are you trying to encrypt the whole contents of your Ubuntu One folder, or are you trying to have an encrypted folder inside your Ubuntu One folder?
[18:50] <xant> aquarius, the latter
[18:50] <aquarius> xant, how have you set it up? Sorry, I know I'm coming in late, here
[18:52] <xant> I've got an encrypted /home/xant/Ubuntu One/private folder with Encfs
[18:52] <aquarius> and that's mounted somewhere else?
[18:52] <rtgz> Guys, someone post something to identi.ca / twitter about server downtime. Otherwise new bug reports will be coming...
[18:52] <xant> It's mounted to /home/xant/documents
[18:52] <xant> with the following command
[18:53] <aquarius> I'll post about it
[18:53] <xant> encfs ~/Ubuntu\ One/private/ ~/documents
[18:54] <xant> I
[18:54] <xant> I'm basically following the steps in http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=8517221
[18:55] <xant> Is ubuntu one down?
[18:55] <rtgz> xant, <pfibiger> there is supposed to be a more descriptive error page. we're taking services down for a window to do some hardware upgrades.
[18:56] <xant> Will I need to unmount the directory or will ubuntu one synchronize it right away?
[18:56] <xant> rtgs, thanks
[18:59] <aquarius> xant, yes, we're down at the moment to upgrade various bits of hardware -- which will not help your testing, I know :)
[19:26] <dobey> what's up?
[19:27] <rtgz> http://voices.canonical.com/ubuntuone/ might be updated as well (I know that you all already hate me) :)
[19:29] <rtgz> dobey, nothing is up, everything is down
[19:37] <dobey> translated: what did i miss?
[19:38] <rtgz> dobey, EncFS over Ubuntu One discussion, sync service is down ATM. To be continued...
[19:45] <xant> hello everyone one more time
[19:45] <xant> Ubuntu one seems to be back
[19:46] <rtgz> xant, file proxy seems to be down
[19:46] <dobey> indeed it does
[19:47] <dobey> rtgz: you mean you can't download/upload files?
[19:47] <rtgz> aquarius, files.one.ubuntu.com/{uuid} gives Service Temporarily Unavailable
[19:49] <rtgz> If i remember it right, aquarius is related to the web service...
[19:49] <dobey> rtgz: it's still off for the moment
[19:49] <dobey> rtgz: should be back in a few minutes though, as the various pieces come back up on the new hardware :)
[19:49] <aquarius> rtgz, it's on its way back :)
[19:53] <rtgz> aquarius, tell me when you think it starts and I check various bits (including sharing, upload/download)
[19:54] <aquarius> rtgz, pfibiger has a clearer picture of when everything comes back up than I do, so I'm waiting to hear from him too :)
[19:54] <aquarius> does anyone know what happened to rodrigo, btw? :)
[19:57] <pfibiger> rtgz, aquarius: i'll let you know when all the pieces are up. the way our sysadmins do the deploy, some parts are staggered. it should only be a couple minutes more
[20:00] <dobey> rtgz: are you using lucid yet?
[20:00] <rtgz> dobey, not yet
[20:00] <dobey> ok
[20:02]  * rtgz went to see the iso images...
[20:03] <dobey> i'm just looking for someone to try running the ubuntuone-client tests on lucid, to see if the twisted tests fail in the same way for others running lucid :)
[20:03] <dobey> i'm not running it yet either
[20:04] <rtgz> dobey, he he he, getting the image (but in VM for now) :)
[20:04] <dobey> heh
[20:14] <rtgz> Maemo: "Could not delete old cached thumbnail [...] Error removing file: No such file or directory" Such error messages are awesome...
[20:38] <faal> is there something wrong with ubuntuone today?
[20:38] <dobey> hi faal
[20:38] <dobey> it's currently down for some maintenence on hardware
[20:38] <faal> okey, any eta?
[20:39] <dobey> the various pieces are coming back up though, and should be in full swing again soon
[20:39] <faal> ok cool, that sounds good
[20:39] <dobey> is there a particular problem you're having?
[20:39] <faal> yeah I can't download my files
[20:39] <faal> Service Temporarily Unavailable
[20:40] <dobey> ok, yes. the file server for upload and download via the web is still down it seems, and is being worked on right now to get it back up.
[20:41] <dobey> should be back up shortly, i would expect. :)
[20:43] <faal> ok cool, need a file so I can start working :-)
[20:51] <rtgz> file sync via client seems to be up now. The Web UI side is down and the relevant bug reports started to appear.
[20:52] <dobey> faal: the software client should work now. just the files access on the web is having some trouble at the moment, but ops are working on it :)
[20:52] <faal> okay yeah I'm on my mac so I can't use the software client unfortunately
[20:56] <dobey> faal: can you try again now? looks like they should be up :)
[20:58] <rtgz> dl up
[20:59] <rtgz> upload up
[20:59] <dobey> thanks rtgz
[21:01] <faal> yeah it's working, thanks!
[21:01] <faal> cu guys
[21:04] <fagan> I dont have a problem but I have a little question about the music store, did anyone suggest using rhythmbox's rating system for anything in the store?
[21:05] <rtgz> ok, everything seems to be ok now with the web ui.
[21:05]  * fagan was at the meeting at the UDS but forgot to ask
[21:06] <dobey> i don't remember if that was suggested or not
[21:06] <dobey> but i'm not sure ratings will be doable for the lucid music store any way
[21:06] <fagan> dobey: well it was just an idea
[21:06] <dobey> the lucid music store is going to be an embedded web page
[21:07] <xant> what music store?
[21:07] <dobey> fagan: sure. i don't know if it was mentioned or not. i agree it would be good to have for the more native store for post-lucid though :)
[21:07] <fagan> xant: there is going to be a music store in rhytmbox for lucid
[21:07] <fagan> dobey: well ill mention it in the next UDS then :)
[21:08] <aquarius> fagan, how are you imagining that ratings would work? You're thinking something along the lines of: I view a song in the Music Store, and I see next to it "Ubuntu One users rated this sing 3.6", where 3.6 is an average of all the ratings given to that song by people who've bought it?
[21:08] <fagan> aquarius: thats it :)
[21:08] <dobey> aquarius: or integrate with $partner's ratings as well
[21:08] <aquarius> fagan, that won't happen for Lucid, but it's worthy of discussion (and it would be possible to implement 90% of it without actually touching the music store, and then you come and talk to me about how to display the resulting value :))
[21:08] <dobey> (assuming they have that)
[21:09] <aquarius> fagan, there are privacy concerns with it, though.
[21:09] <aquarius> dobey, they do not, as far as I can tell; I was just checkig that
[21:09] <aquarius> xant, yep, you'll be able to buy whatever music you want direct from your Ubuntu desktop
[21:10] <dobey> except for Garth Brooks
[21:10]  * fagan loves that its actually happening :)
[21:10] <fagan> dobey: oh no I love a bit of Garth
[21:10] <fagan> heh
[21:10] <aquarius> dobey, and AC/DC. I know. I can't fix that, though
[21:10] <CardinalFang> That's a special case.  assert song.artist != 'Brooks, Garth'
[21:10] <dobey> aquarius: and MC Hawking
[21:10] <aquarius> MC Hawking has an actual record deal??
[21:11] <xant> Who will the music store be operated by?
[21:11] <fagan> have you guys signed with a partner yet?
[21:11] <dobey> http://www.buyswag.com/brashmusic/product.aspx?id=554
[21:11] <CardinalFang> fagan, that's kind of sensitive.
[21:11] <fagan> CardinalFang: awh
[21:12] <dobey> aquarius: MC Hawking is buyable on amazon and lala though :)
[21:12] <aquarius> dobey, orly? How does that work, then?
[21:12] <dobey> aquarius: not sure. i guess he gets a penny for every song sold or something :)
[21:13] <aquarius> dobey, I understand how the concept of royalties works :)
[21:13] <dobey> aquarius: i don't know how the underlying deal with those stores works for independent artists, no :)
[21:13] <aquarius> AC/DC aren't on Amazon, so it's not just Some Mystic Amazon Magic
[21:13] <dobey> well
[21:14] <dobey> AC/DC are pwned by the same anti-MP3 label as Garth
[21:14] <aquarius> oh, didn't know that
[21:14] <rtgz> I have only one question regarding music store so far, btw. Will there be restrictions on the countries where the store would be available? I mean, I am unable to BUY audio/video files from Amazon just because "This media file is not available in your country"...
[21:15] <aquarius> I should send them an email saying "last month I wanted to buy an AC/DC record but couldn't so I bought an Airbourne one instead, since they are basically the same anyway"
[21:15] <aquarius> rtgz, there will be country-specific stores, yes.
[21:15] <aquarius> rtgz, I don't know the exact detail, I'm afraid
[21:15] <aquarius> rtgz, that's how music works, it seems :(
[21:15]  * rtgz goes to bang his head against the wall
[21:16] <fagan> aquarius: all I want is not to be shown the songs I cant buy
[21:16] <aquarius> I don't believe we will be taunting people by showing them songs they can't buy
[21:16] <fagan> Oh and localised currency too
[21:17] <fagan> Like im in ireland and I have to use the amazon store using the english pound instead of the euro
[21:17] <aquarius> I am pretty sure that there will be localised currency, yes.
[21:17] <dobey> the whole concept of trying to block people from buying certain songs because they live in certain coutries... on the internet... is a bit contrite anyway :)
[21:17] <aquarius> fagan, I reserve the right to be wrong about that, though :)
[21:17] <fagan> aquarius: I wouldnt expect anything concrete
[21:18] <fagan> oh and are ye going to use gecko or webkit?
[21:19] <fagan> For the plugin
[21:19] <aquarius> webkit.
[21:19] <fagan> Thats going to be really weird shipping 2 different engines
[21:19] <aquarius> we're already shipping both engines
[21:20] <fagan> For what?
[21:20] <dobey> yelp
[21:20] <dobey> empathy
[21:20] <fagan> Oh hmmm
[21:20] <aquarius> gwibber
[21:20] <dobey> gwibber's not on the cd (yet)
[21:20] <aquarius> (is gwibber in the default install?)
[21:20] <aquarius> heh
[21:20] <fagan> oh yeah gwibber is in lucid too
[21:21] <dobey> but should be for lucid
[21:21] <dobey> well, if we switch to chromium or epiphany or something... :)
[21:21] <aquarius> chromium bundles its own webkit.
[21:21] <fagan> dobey: thats not happening in lucid
[21:22] <fagan> it does but there is a bug report about that
[21:22] <dobey> chromikit
[21:22] <fagan> so they are going to unbundle it soonish apparently
[21:22] <dobey> aquarius: yes, but it doesn't require gecko
[21:22] <aquarius> dobey, oh, I see what you mean :)
[21:22] <aquarius> do we ship anything on the CD that requires gecko other than firefox?
[21:22] <fagan> Gnome-shell requires gecko too
[21:22] <aquarius> TB's not on the CD
[21:23] <aquarius> gnome-shell isn't on the cd either :P
[21:23] <dobey> gnome-shell requires libmozjs
[21:23] <dobey> and again, not on the cd :)
[21:23] <aquarius> and...I think gnome-shell requires spidermonkey, not all of geco
[21:23] <fagan> For the next release
[21:23] <dobey> i am pretty sure lucid still won't have gnome-shell on the cd :)
[21:23] <aquarius> isn't the UI clutter?
[21:23] <fagan> Yep spidermonkey
[21:23] <fagan> but they use js for the display hacking
[21:23] <dobey> aquarius: it's a bunch of JS crap :)
[21:24] <aquarius> dobey, much as I love JavaScript (and you do not), it is not a rendering engine :P
[21:24] <dobey> aquarius: neither is clutter
[21:24] <dobey> :)
[21:24]  * aquarius waves hands in the air...you know what I mean :)
[21:24] <fagan> they are using it as a dev language clutter is the rendering engine
[21:25] <fagan> I would have used python but its slow
[21:25] <dobey> because javascript is so much faster?
[21:25] <dobey> *blink* :)
[21:26] <fagan> its faster than python isnt it?
[21:26] <fagan> more mature too
[21:26] <aquarius> nope
[21:26] <dobey> it's certainly less robust
[21:27]  * fagan loves python just because its loose
[21:27] <fagan> Speed is secondary to me
[21:27] <dobey> they should have written it with vala
[21:27] <aquarius> Python's older than JS; Python's got a bigger stdlib. Raw "fastness" of the language...they're probably roughly the same. I disagree that JavaScript, qua JavaScript, is less robust than Python, but I'm happy to admit that the stuff that gets thrown in for JS to interact with is less robust than the Python stdlib.
[21:27] <fagan> vala is supposed to be nice
[21:27] <dobey> python is fast to write, but i am not a fan of it :)
[21:28] <dobey> aquarius: well i meant robust in that it was designed to make it so you can't do some specific things, which you can in python :)
[21:28] <aquarius> oh, right, gotcha :)
[21:28] <dobey> mainly because JS was designed to run in a browser, not to write large software infrastructures with
[21:28] <fagan> thats what they wanted
[21:29] <fagan> plus it allows new devs from the web world
[21:29] <aquarius> there's almost nothing that you can do in Python that you can't do in JS, except complicated introspection. And it is not clear to me that exposing introspection to application developers is actually a good idea. :)
[21:29] <dobey> i don't want new devs from "the web world"
[21:29] <dobey> i've seen how inconsistently bad they make "web apps' already :)
[21:29] <fagan> Well the web is starting to look insanely nice
[21:30] <dobey> aquarius: fopen() sys.exec() :)
[21:30] <fagan> Like imagine evolution looking more like gmail
[21:30] <aquarius> sys.exec?
[21:30] <dobey> aquarius: at least, unless you completely break the security model of js and add custom things
[21:30] <aquarius> wtf?
[21:31] <aquarius> JavaScript doesn't have a security model. JavaScript *in a browser* does, sure.
[21:31] <dobey> eh?
[21:31] <aquarius> I can fopen from JS in rhino or spidermonkey perfectly happily
[21:31] <fagan> aquarius: ecma script does though
[21:31] <dobey> fagan: gmail is awful (and so is evolution) :)
[21:32] <dobey> gmail might be prettier, but it's a pain to use
[21:32] <fagan> Pretty is all I want :)
[21:32] <aquarius> hm, I lie, spidermonkey doesn't compile in File() by default. Rhino does, though :)
[21:33] <dobey> aquarius: it's like c++ in the 90s, all over again :)
[21:33] <dobey> no 2 compilers do the same thing
[21:33] <dobey> fagan: if pretty is all you want, there are better things to look at than gmail :)
[21:33] <fagan> dobey: like?
[21:34] <dobey> fagan: like the squirrels rummaging for acorns in my backyard
[21:34] <dobey> and the bamboo growing along the fenceline :)
[21:35] <fagan> but still the squirrels wont show me my emails :)
[21:36] <dobey> fagan: they will if you train them well enough
[21:36] <marenostrum> dobey: Are there some problems related with ubuntuone servers or is something wrong on my side?
[21:37] <dobey> marenostrum: not sure. what problem are you having?
[21:37] <marenostrum> dobey: does not connect. seeems to try connecting but thats all.
[21:38] <dobey> marenostrum: and it was working fine before today?
[21:38] <marenostrum> yes.
[21:38] <rtgz> marenostrum, are you talking about the web interface or the client?
[21:38] <dobey> marenostrum: can you right click on the applet and choose "Quit" and then run it again from Programs->Internet->Ubuntu One ?
[21:39] <marenostrum> dobey: here is Turkish local and in the past we had problems with Turkish locale. I domt remember when I got last update,maybe an update messed it.
[21:40] <rtgz> bug #467397
[21:40] <marenostrum> dobey: ok, i will do.thanks.
[21:40] <dobey> oh
[21:40] <dobey> it's probably that bug that rtgz just linked to
[21:41] <marenostrum> rtgz: Thanks a lo
[21:42] <dobey> fagan: i guess i need to do a mock-up for a better messaging client as well
[21:47] <fagan> dobey: that would be interesting
[21:48] <dobey> fagan: i want an interface that combines e-mail, web services, and forums, all in the same place. so i can see group/page disucssions and private messages on facebook, as well as e-mail, and ubuntuforums and such as well (granted, I don't think many forums have APIs to do it)
[21:49] <aquarius> closest thing at the moment is raindrop
[21:49] <dobey> s/interface/interface that's consistent with all the other interfaces i use/
[21:49] <dobey> :)
[21:49] <rtgz> marenostrum, the workaround will make it possible to run ubuntuone client, but it is still a python bug affecting Turkish locale :(
[21:50] <aquarius> dobey, then you are SOL :)
[21:50] <dobey> aquarius: a long time ago, i got used to the fact that i'm probably going to have to write a lot of software myself :)
[21:51] <marenostrum> rtgz: I see. I just applied the workaround and now rebooting. But problem is: Why didit working yesterday?
[21:51] <aquarius> dobey, the #usability channel used to have the topic "There is not such thing as an 'average user'...and if there was...it wouldn't be you". It should probably have continued "...and it CERTAINLY isn't dobey" :-)
[21:51] <fagan> dobey: thats good im starting development on something along those lines but its bigger than raindrop although I may use raindrop in some way
[21:52] <fagan> I just need an email client to use so raindrop may do but its not mature
[21:52] <dobey> aquarius: "it's most like dobey" you mean
[21:52] <aquarius> :)
[21:53] <dobey> aquarius: after all, i do have the best birth day ever :)
[21:54] <marenostrum> rtgz: My story was like this: For the first time I had run ubunruone in English mode,then each timeI want to syncronize I started it manually. And it worked but today isdiffrent.
[21:54] <rtgz> marenostrum, reauthorization
[21:54] <dobey> marenostrum: it still fails with using the english locale?
[21:54] <rtgz> got it
[21:55] <marenostrum> rtgz: I am going to try now.Waiting for chatting here. I will restart gnome or reboot.
[21:56] <dobey> marenostrum: just restarting the applet should be enough. if there's still a problem, please let me know
[21:56] <marenostrum> let me do it. sorry for leaving.
[21:57] <marenostrum> dobey: I willin ten minutes. Thanks again.
[21:57] <rtgz> the servers were down for some period and OAuth might decide that you don't have the authorization and attempted to obtain one. applet OAuth can not work properly with Turkish locale therefore you might have gotten such kind of behavior
[22:14] <dobey> wb marenostrum
[22:15] <marenostrum> dobey: It worked but there was some weird situation. 1- It worked alsoin Turkish locale but start command for Ubuntu One EN. means: env LC_ALL=en_US.UTF-8 ubuntuone-client-applet
[22:16] <marenostrum> dobey: It worked like a charm. No need to start it manually. Started, syncronized and quit.
[22:16] <dobey> marenostrum: ok, wonderful. glad that it's working for you again :)
[22:17] <marenostrum> dobey: But weird thing was: It didn't syncronize one file (Ichecked from web) and its name was chanded as: programlarim_9_04_seçme.u1conflict
[22:17] <dobey> marenostrum: what version of ubuntuone-client do you have installed?
[22:18] <marenostrum> dobey: I dont know what that added ulconflict means.I renamed the file omiting that Turkish charecter ç. and it worked. Lookng for the client version.
[22:20] <dobey> marenostrum: it means that syncdaemon for some reason thought that the file was conflicting because perhaps you independently placed it on that machine, and the u1 server somehow
[22:20] <dobey> marenostrum: it may be a bug that might already be fixed
[22:20] <marenostrum> dobey: synaptic says,1.1.0+r294
[22:20] <dobey> hrmm
[22:21] <marenostrum> dobey: should I file a bug? I am not even sure what is wrong.
[22:21] <dobey> marenostrum: can you please file a bug, and attach the syncdaemon.log from the time that u1conflict file was created?
[22:21] <dobey> marenostrum: i'm not sure what's wrong either :)
[22:21] <marenostrum> dobey: How will I create that syncdaemon file?
[22:22] <dobey> marenostrum: you don't need to create it. there are logs in ~/.cache/ubuntuone/log/ named syncdaemon.log
[22:23] <dobey> marenostrum: there should be one which mentions the conflict
[22:23] <marenostrum> ok. let me see.
[22:23] <dobey> marenostrum: probably the latest one (syncdaemon.log) has it
[22:23] <dobey> marenostrum: and mark the bug as private if there are any private filenames in the log file please :)
[22:25] <marenostrum> dobey: there are 6 syncdeamon.log.xxxxxx files and 6 syncdeamon.exception.xxxxx files
[22:26] <marenostrum> dobey: nothing privaye or nothing hidden from Ubuntu!
[22:26] <dobey> marenostrum: grep u1conflict syncdaemon.log* :)
[22:26] <marenostrum> let me check
[22:30] <rtgz> Late hours over there, good night to everybody!
[22:33] <rocky|raccoon> i'm unable to connect the ubuntu one "folder" in 9.10 at all, is there a server outage? :/
[22:33] <marenostrum> dobey: Seems there is no line as u1conflict Do you want me to send those 6 log files toyou?
[22:34] <dobey> marenostrum: hrmm, interesting
[22:34] <dobey> marenostrum: grep for the filename without the .u1conflict part
[22:34] <marenostrum> ok
[22:34] <dobey> rocky|raccoon: there was earlier. try quitting the applet and starting again
[22:37] <rocky|raccoon> dobey: Hmm, it appears to be connecting this time :> The initial problem was that every time I'd click "connect" in the nautilus folder it'd immediately disconnect...restarting the client that time seemed to do the trick
[22:37] <dobey> rocky|raccoon: glad it's working again. :)
[22:39] <rocky|raccoon> dobey: Same here, although it's technically in beta I've been using it a lot just for casually backing up things lately ;> Hopefully the remaining bugs will be rolled out soon
[22:39] <dobey> rocky|raccoon: what version are you using btw?
[22:39] <rocky|raccoon> dobey: Hmm...well I'm using whatever version comes with 9.10 by default? :>
[22:40] <dobey> rocky|raccoon: ok, great
[22:41] <marenostrum> dobey: I can't find. Do you want me to send them to you?
[22:41] <rocky|raccoon> dobey: Oddly enough though, although I'm sure I set everything up for 9.10 initially, nothing that I upload to One shows up in the web interface :<
[22:41] <dobey> rocky|raccoon: if you enable the proposed packages in System->Administration->Software Sources, there is a slightly newer version with a lot of bug fixes, which we're trying to get tested, and verify the fixes work for people, if you wouldn't mind testing
[22:42] <rocky|raccoon> dobey: Hmm I might have to give that a try, thanks
[22:44] <dobey> rocky|raccoon: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntuone-client/+bugs?field.tag=verification-needed
[22:44] <dobey> rocky|raccoon: that's a list of bugs needing verification in the proposed update :)
[22:45] <TimH11> Having a bit of trouble syncing Tomboy notes
[22:45] <TimH11> Was working fine. Now saying Failed to synchronise
[22:46] <TimH11> Showing some notes as updated others "Uploaded changes to server"
[22:47] <marenostrum> dobey: http://rapidshare.com/files/324120070/my_log.tar.gz.html
[22:48] <dobey> marenostrum: i suppose just attach them all to the bug you file please. sorry for slow reply there, helping multiple people and all :)
[22:49] <dobey> TimH11: can you file a bug please? i'm not sure how to debug that myself, and i'm about to run off for the day ;)
[22:49] <marenostrum> dobey: so I will attach all and the bug will bw related with u1conflict.OK?
[22:50] <TimH11> Fair enough! Is there a log or something I need to include?
[22:50] <dobey> marenostrum: yes. please file a bug about the u1conflict issue, and attach the logs. thanks!
[22:50] <marenostrum> dobey: Thank you. I am doing now. Thanks for your patience.
[22:51] <dobey> TimH11: i'm not sure if there is or not. i think there is also a --debug option to tomboy that might help. but it might contain private data too.
[22:51] <dobey> TimH11: but if you file the bug, we'll assign it to the appropriate developer and he can ask you for exactly what's needed :)
[22:51] <TimH11> Great. Thanks.
[22:51] <dobey> ok, i need to run off and do other things now
[22:51] <dobey> later all! thanks for using ubuntu one!
[22:52] <marenostrum> dobey: :)


[00:59] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- sil2100, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4779 Pending binary packages
[01:39] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- sil2100, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4779 Diff missing
[06:53] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- paelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4753 Diff missing (jammy/libvirt). Needs rebuild due to higher version at destination (jammy/ipxe, jammy/qemu, jammy/xen)
[07:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- paelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4760 Needs rebuild due to higher version at destination
[17:36] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- xnox, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4775 Diff missing (jammy/linux-uc22). Failed to build (jammy/linux-signed-uc22). Needs rebuild due to burned version number (jammy/nvidia-graphics-drivers-470)
[19:58] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- sergiodj, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4778 Needs rebuild due to higher version at destination
[22:05] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- sil2100, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4544 Needs rebuild due to higher version at destination


[21:52] <Helmut73> How to install Presonus Studio one in ubuntustudio?
[21:53] <arraybolt3> Helmut73: I'm fairly certain that's third-party proprietary software. Your best bet would be to follow the isntructions provided by Presonus.
[21:54] <arraybolt3> You may need to log in to the Wayland session in order for it to work, as I believe Presonus Studio One requires Wayland. Depending on your Ubuntu Studio version, you might need to install the Wayland session first.
[21:54] <Helmut73> thanks ;) i tried that, but it didn't work
[21:55] <arraybolt3> Not sure what else to try then sadly. We don't use Studio One (or at least if we do, I certainly haven't seen anyone who does), and so we don't know what to do to make it work either.
[21:56] <arraybolt3> you might need a newer version of Ubuntu.
[21:57] <Helmut73> well, have the newest installed, but thanks anyway


[13:07] <vinzv> hi... this channel's topic still points to gitter.im. maybe someone could change it to discourse?


[02:22] <philipballew> http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/State-of-New-Hampshire-votes-for-open-source-1431454.html
[02:22] <philipballew> this puts a new meaning to their moto "live free or die"
[02:29] <akk> That's great! Wonder if CA will ever follow suit?
[02:32] <philipballew> maybe we as a LoCo should protest the capitol.
[02:33] <philipballew> but ms has so many lobbyists, thet'd say floss is more expensive probably
[02:34] <jbermudes> What does the Bay Area use? electronic touch screen voting?
[02:34] <jbermudes> LA County uses basically stamped ink bubbles that are sort of like SAT-style answer sheets
[02:35] <jbermudes> But I suppose the machines reading it could be hiding some tricks so FOSS would be cool to have for even those
[02:36] <jtatum> santa clara county uses optical reader types - connect these two boxes with a line to vote
[02:36] <jtatum> same as they had in florida. dunno about the rest of the bay.
[02:36] <philipballew> placer county uses punch cards...
[02:37] <jbermudes> So at least there's a paper trail in all of these instances, right?
[02:46] <akk> I thought the florida problem was all about the chads (punchcards), not optical scan.
[02:47] <akk> My district (in San Jose) is all mail-in, optical scan. We had touchscreen for a year or two.
[02:47] <jtatum> ah, good point akk. Let me revise my blanket statement to say orange county, florida :)
[03:02]  * jledbetter1 waves.
[03:02] <Darkwing> Oi!
[03:02] <jtatum> o/
[03:02] <Darkwing> How is everyone tonight?
[03:02] <Darkwing> Gimme a sec to bring up the agenda
[03:02] <MarkDude> There we go
[03:03] <eps> So, short meeting?
[03:03]  * MarkDude is in meeting with Oregon at moment also. Let me know if I need to ramble some crazy stuff about things....
[03:03] <MarkDude> :)
[03:03] <Darkwing> Okay, there seems to be one item on the agenda. The Ubuntu Global Jam is around the corner for 12.04 LTS
[03:03] <Darkwing> Anyone have any plans for a Global Jam?
[03:04] <Darkwing> North or south?
[03:04] <jledbetter1> I think there was some talk about one in SF
[03:05] <Darkwing> Anyone have any info on that?
[03:05] <MarkDude> Lets assign agenda item to Jono and move on...
[03:05] <MarkDude> :D
[03:05] <jledbetter1> +1
[03:05] <Darkwing> LOL
[03:06] <Darkwing> I don't have anything planned in house for San Diego.
[03:06] <Darkwing> I have not heard about LA or Bay...
[03:06] <Darkwing> Greetings
[03:06] <locodir-user> hi guys, i have aproblem
[03:06] <Darkwing> Yes?
[03:07]  * MarkDude has all sorts of problems....
[03:07]  * Darkwing kicks MarkDude
[03:07] <Darkwing> Hush you. :P:P
[03:07]  * MarkDude sits and up and bites his tongue
[03:07] <Darkwing> locodir-user: a problem?
[03:07] <locodir-user> i have a" The package system is broken" notice when i try to install anything
[03:08] <locodir-user> and i want to remove a game
[03:09] <locodir-user> how can i force ubuntu to remove it
[03:09] <Darkwing> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SynapticHowto#How_to_fix_broken_packages
[03:09] <Darkwing> locodir-user: ^^^
[03:09] <Darkwing> locodir-user: That will help you fix brokem packages.
[03:09] <Darkwing> *broken
[03:10] <Darkwing> Or, you can open a terminal and type: sudo dpkg --configure -a
[03:10] <Darkwing> either one should help you out locodir-user
[03:11] <Darkwing> Anyway, back to the meeting... anyone have anything to add about global jams?
[03:11] <MarkDude> They are fun.
[03:12] <Darkwing> Anyone have any announcements, comments, quips, gripes, complaints?
[03:12] <MarkDude> Rent is too damn high
[03:12] <jledbetter1> Mountain View UH this week :)
[03:12] <Darkwing> you have it in the loco.u.c?
[03:12] <MarkDude> Things are pretty good with the Cali Team
[03:12]  * philipballew just got the email
[03:13] <jledbetter1> Coolio
[03:13] <jtatum> Darkwing: just added it :)
[03:14] <Darkwing> Woot!
[03:14] <Darkwing> San Diego UH is coming up next week.
[03:15] <Darkwing> on the 21st
[03:15] <jledbetter1> Yay!
[03:15] <epikvision>  question: where is the global jam held at?
[03:15]  * philipballew has stickers to bring thanks to jtatum
[03:16] <Darkwing> They are all over... Keep checking http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-california for information on it.
[03:16] <Darkwing> epikvision: ^^
[03:16] <eps> We don't even have it listed on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects
[03:16] <jtatum> or the mailing list hopefully
[03:16] <philipballew> would it be possible as a loco to do a online global jam?
[03:16] <epikvision> haha
[03:16] <epikvision> :D
[03:16] <Darkwing> As long as someone organizes it.
[03:16] <Darkwing> I normally do some Kubuntu Jams
[03:16] <Darkwing> online
[03:16] <jledbetter1> philipballew: Yes.
[03:17] <philipballew> since were such a big state, we just find a few bugs and all work on them.
[03:17] <jbermudes> So what would that look like besides just people talking in the IRC channel like usual?
[03:17] <jledbetter1> And be here for those that get stuck on how to fix.
[03:17] <jledbetter1> organized time we're at the keyboard?
[03:18] <philipballew> maybe, or we just find say 5 bugs as a loco is different levels of difficulty and maybe 2 or 3 work on one together.
[03:19] <Darkwing> Anyone have anything else to add? If you are doing a Jam, please add it to the wiki and to loco.u.c
[03:20] <Darkwing> If not I have to get ready for an interview tomorrow.
[03:20] <Darkwing> Cheers!
[03:21] <akk> Good luck, Darkwing!
[03:22] <jledbetter1> Hope it goes well, Darkwing :)
[03:44] <eps>  /leave #ubuntu-us-ca G'nite
[03:46] <izdubar> take 2....
[13:07] <Faqtotum> [Sun 2012-02-12 06:32:03 PM PST] <philipballew> maybe we as a LoCo should protest the capitol. <----- maybe you should have thought of that before you moved to SD
[20:07] <broder> since we were discussing flag files for identifying a chroot's distribution recently, http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/os-release.html
[20:08] <broder> (or, under an alternative headline, "Lennart once again tells us what's best for the rest of us")
[23:37] <pleia2> boo, rain
[23:38] <nhaines> yay rain!
[23:38] <nhaines> It sprinkled this morning on and off but I think it's gone now.
[23:40] <akk> It's been raining quite a bit here, off and on all day.
[23:40] <pleia2> it sprinkled this morning, let up for me to get lunch, now it's quite rainy again
[23:47] <akk> That was nice of it!


[00:06] <yofel> Hi, am I doing somthing wrong here? https://code.launchpad.net/~yofel/+recipe/kubuntu-kdelibs-stable bzr builder is crashing
[03:23] <smartboyhw> Hello. May I ask who has the power to propose to series in a Ubuntu bug?
[03:27] <wgrant> smartboyhw: ~ubuntu-bugcontrol
[03:27] <smartboyhw> wgrant, thx
[03:27] <wgrant> smartboyhw: #ubuntu-bugs is probably a better channel for Ubuntu bug management questions
[03:28] <smartboyhw> wgrant, just went there. Thx!
[16:56] <yofel_> another try: am I doing somthing wrong here? https://code.launchpad.net/~yofel/+recipe/kubuntu-kdelibs-stable bzr builder is crashing. My fault or should I file a bug?
[17:37] <mpt> "If you want to change any of your account's details, you can do so by logging in using the form beside."
[17:37] <mpt> beside.
[17:39] <czajkowski> mpt: good evening
[17:39] <mpt> Good evening czajkowski :-)
[17:40] <czajkowski> mpt: where is that text
[17:41] <mpt> czajkowski, https://login.launchpad.net/+login
[17:43] <mpt> When I wrote <https://dev.launchpad.net/UserInterfaceWording#Common_mistakes> I didn't think I'd need to include "beside" as well as "above" and "below" :-)
[17:50] <czajkowski> ah yes
[17:50] <czajkowski> will file a bug
[17:50] <czajkowski> and see if I can get it fixed
[19:04] <achiang> hello, is it possible to hide your email addresses from being displayed?
[19:04] <mwhudson> yes
[19:05] <achiang> trying to find the way to do that, but it wasn't obvious from the web ui
[19:05] <achiang> oh, i see it now
[19:05] <achiang> it's not under the "edit emails" page
[19:05] <mwhudson> on launchpad.net/~/+edit maybe?
[19:06] <achiang> but rather, it's under the "change details" page
[19:06] <mwhudson> yeah
[21:39] <evillyEvil> Does launchpad offer a place for putting up wikis related to a project?
[21:40] <Guest21826> Does launchpad offer a place for putting up wikis related to a project?