[17:31] <kdub> hmm, network problem?
[17:31] <duflu> kdub: Canonical? Yeah
[17:32] <kdub> duflu, ah, not just me then
[17:32] <duflu> kdub: Also Launchpad git
[17:33] <duflu> And bzr is down too
[21:05] <mariogrip> can i have both mir and xorg running? VT is not working with nvidia drivers
[21:13] <alan_g> mariogrip: depends what you want. E.g. mir will happily run on X.
[21:25] <mariogrip> alan_g: I want to try out the eglstream platform
[21:25] <alan_g> RAOF: you're probably best placed to answer that ^
[21:27] <RAOF> mariogrip: https://code.launchpad.net/~raof/mir/eglstream-platform/+merge/296389 would be worth trying, then.
[21:30] <mariogrip> RAOF: yeah, I already have that builded, but how do I test it? VT is not working
[21:30] <RAOF> (You might need to remove the graphics-mesa-kms.so to get the eglstream platform to autoload)
[21:30] <RAOF> Ah, you'll also need to reload the nvidia drivers with kms enabled.
[21:32] <mariogrip> RAOF: like this right? sudo modprobe -r nvidia-drm ; sudo modprobe nvidia-drm modeset=1
[21:32] <RAOF> That seems about right.
 platform-eglstream: System does not support EGL_EXT_device_base, eglstream platform is unsupported
[21:33] <RAOF> Huh. You've got the right drivers?
[21:34] <mariogrip> 367
[21:34] <mariogrip> from the ppa https://launchpad.net/~graphics-drivers/+archive/ubuntu/ppa
[21:35] <mariogrip> this also give about the same result https://github.com/aritger/eglstreams-kms-example
[21:36] <RAOF> Ah, well then that's obviously not the Mir platform being worng.
[21:36] <RAOF> I don't have my nvidia system with me at this sprint.
[21:36] <mariogrip> can the problem be that i use ppa?
[21:41] <RAOF> Maybe?
[21:42] <RAOF> I've actually forgotten the specific version that I know works.
 platform-eglstream: EGLStream platform is unsupported: Missing required extensions: EGL_EXT_platform_device EGL_EXT_device_base
[21:45] <mariogrip> Now I got that, tried starting server with ssh with --vt
[21:46] <mariogrip> RAOF: ^
[21:46] <RAOF> I think the libEGL you've got is wrong.
[21:49] <mariogrip> What should I install?
[22:05] <RAOF> mariogrip: Sorry, I can't remember what driver version you need.
[22:15] <mariogrip> RAOF: ok, I installed from nvidia.com now I get this: std::exception::what: Failed to acquire DRM master: Bad file descriptor
[22:15] <mariogrip> Btw, now it uses the eglstream platform
[22:21] <mariogrip> something is wrong.... https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/vm3qvJqy/IMG_20160608_002038.jpg
[22:21] <mariogrip> RAOF, it flickers fast
[22:23] <mariogrip> That was running _to_fb
[22:24] <mariogrip> this is running _overlays https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/HaUqIrm0/IMG_20160608_002327.jpg
[22:32] <mariogrip> http://paste.ubuntu.com/17103216/


[12:16] <pleia2> popey: think you can add the https://community.ubuntu.com/help-information/funding/reports/ redirect too?
[12:57] <popey> pleia2: thank you! Done!
[12:58] <pleia2> ty <3
[18:52] <ignoo> Hello,running ubuntu GNOME 16.04, have some issues with ubuntu Artful Aardvark: https://pastebin.com/BgBHExes ; Thank you for your Support.


[22:27] <manzdagratiano> Greetings! Are any of ye exalted Ladies and Gentlemen free for me to bug regarding building documentation?
[22:27] <manzdagratiano> I am taking little steps here - I want to generate the static html from the Oneiric doc sources
[22:28] <manzdagratiano> Herr mdke told me, and I so realized, that pulling a make was not the way to go - that's for the package.
[22:32] <manzdagratiano> May I ask how I should generate the *page files first? I saw the new guidelines that Jeremy had posted to the mailing list (I assume I go into ubuntu-help/es?)
[22:35] <manzdagratiano> Oops - `es' is Spanish :D
[22:37] <manzdagratiano> Wait... The subdirectory 'C' already has *page files...
[22:41] <manzdagratiano> I see that something else needs to be done before I can hit "make" in the subdirectory "html", since the Makefile is looking for files that are not yet present there
[22:41] <manzdagratiano> Anyone?
[23:01] <manzdagratiano> Gotta run... I will be a bugger again later on... This needs to be resolved


libreoffice tests need a libreoffice rebuild in proposed, or some clever sets of triggers to not make autopackage tests fall back to all-proposed
 i.e. trying to test libreoffice in release with the liborcus in proposed breaks the ui tests
 If liborcus had breaking changes then I think it's better to rebuild LO
 sounds like the libreoffice guys will be doing that soon. fingers crossed
 I see in #ubuntu-desktop. Thanks for asking there :)
[12:36] <lisandro> the libqglviewer autopkgtest issue is... weird
[12:38] <lisandro> no it's not
[12:39] <lisandro> the autopkgtest depends upon qt5-default
[12:39] <lisandro> mitya57: ↑ I'll file a bug
[12:39] <mitya57> lisandro: aaaah, thanks for finding that!
[12:40] <mitya57> Please file a bug, yes
[12:40] <mitya57> And block the transition bug with it
[12:40] <lisandro> Sure!
[12:41] <mitya57> It's in science team, so I can do a team upload if Anton doesn't respond quickly enough
[12:48] <lisandro> kind of my mistake, I should have uploaded qtbase to experimental and checked autopkgtests when I removed that package
[12:48] <lisandro> on the other hand having tools to detect that would also become handy
[13:40] <mitya57> I think "reverse-depends -b pkgname" (from ubuntu-dev-tools) can show reverse testsuite triggers (also works on Debian).
[13:43] <lisandro> # reverse-depends -b qt5-default
[13:43] <lisandro> reverse-depends: Error:
Package not published in specified release

[13:43] <lisandro> both on unstable and stable
[13:50] <mitya57> lisandro: "-r testing" works
[13:50] <mitya57> That package is indeed no longer published in unstable
[13:50] <lisandro> and catches our case
[13:50] <lisandro> great!
[13:52] <lisandro> ah, my stable system does not has deb-src entries
[13:52]  * lisandro facepalms
[13:52] <lisandro> mitya57: did you get the bug number (CCed you in the bug report)
[14:16] <mitya57> I didn't get it, but I'm from phone, will look later
[14:31] <mitya57> lisandro: I see it, Debian #973607
[14:32] <lisandro> great!


 Cannot say I am 100% convinced of the effort/benefit equation in making a new CI. I have developed some quite effective strategies for packaging things in advance of actual releases. Hence we have not usually had to wait to get new things out
 The downside it that they require a packager to be able to spare significant time for short periods, rather than spreading out the packaging changes in small bites over longer periods
 For example, using upstream release scripts, I can quite easily make a fake set of tarball for an upcoming release that I can throw at a PPA. Then sort the packing out so when the real release happens, there is a minimal amount of extra work to do. THis is how I have been able to get new plasma beta and .0 releases out very close to or even on the release day
 That sounds like a good strategy, but your the only one doing the work 😞
 That is a different class of problem (re @Rick_Timmis: That sounds like a good strategy, but your the only one doing the work 😞)


[17:32] <ahoneybun> hey pleia2
[17:33] <pleia2> g'day ahoneybun
[17:33] <ahoneybun> pleia2, good day as well
[17:34] <ahoneybun> do you know what package holds the ubuntu help app?
[17:38] <pleia2> I don't know
[17:39] <ahoneybun> I'm thinking of adding some content from that app
[17:39] <ahoneybun> into uBeginner
[17:39] <pleia2> might ask in #ubuntu-doc
[17:39] <ahoneybun> ok I'll check
[17:40] <ahoneybun> I'm looking for things to add to my Touch app
[17:48] <ahoneybun> pleia2, I added Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter to the contribute tab
[17:51] <pleia2> thanks :)
[17:52] <ahoneybun> np :)
[17:53] <ahoneybun> has a nice button that links to the wiki page


[08:38] <NikT> Hello, wanting to create my first app for iOS and android. Any pointers would be much appreciated
[11:47] <kalikiana> bzoltan: The header fix. It seems to build fine locally, as usual we'll need to see if Jenkins agrees with that. https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sdk-team/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/verbatimNamespaces/+merge/298519
[16:14] <ahoneybun> mm I wish it was easy to change names on existing projects
[16:18] <ahoneybun> anyone used github to host from the SDK?
[16:37] <DanChapman> ahoneybun, not sure what you mean by "anyone used github to host from the SDK?" do you mean does anyone use github for their Ubuntu apps kind thing??
[21:48] <NikT> need help with iOS app design
[21:51] <ahoneybun> DanChapman: I mean is there a plugin to host on Github vs LP?


[12:14] <gary_poster> hey rick_h_ are you looking at huw's branch or shall i?
[12:15] <gary_poster> I'm looking :-)
[12:16] <rick_h_> gary_poster: yea, not looking yet
[12:16] <gary_poster> cool
[12:17] <rick_h_> was spending a few min this morning looking if I could run the selenium tests locally
[12:17] <gary_poster> rick_h_, was thinking last night: after we have inspector done I'll ask two volunteers to go and focus on CI tests for a couple of weeks.  it's time.
[12:18] <gary_poster> we can spare those while we finish up bundle, I think/hope
[12:18] <gary_poster> by CI tests I mean infrastructure.  though I need to coordinate with Curtis to make sure that's not something they are already planning/working on
[12:19] <gary_poster> anyway, goals would be to be able to run selenium tests on lxc, and to be able to have a much more robust CI setup.  tarmac (or similar) would be extra credit.
[12:19] <rick_h_> gary_poster: yea, wit SST being something that we have in house experience with and such seems like it should be easy to get it going locally and some of the bugs we find would be great selenium tests to make sure we don't break anyway
[12:19] <rick_h_> anyway/again
[12:20] <rick_h_> but yea, looking at ci this morning. Found the one failure yesterday but looks like a new one now
[12:21] <rick_h_> I didn't get much qa done yesterday trying to find the cause for the first failure. Takes a while to trace things down via sauce
[12:21] <gary_poster> rick_h_, SST?  Structured Stream Trasport? Spitzer Space Telescope? Serum separating tube? :-)
[12:21] <gary_poster> Samoa standard time?
[12:21] <rick_h_> http://coreygoldberg.blogspot.com/2012/01/officially-introducing-sst-python-web.html
[12:21] <gary_poster> ah right, cool
[12:24] <gary_poster> rick_h_, looks like huw misunderstood style="display: none;" on textvalue checkbox and made it present again.  When I land this I'll add a comment explaining what's going on.
[12:24] <benji> so what's the status of CI?  I got a message after my EOD yesterday that my branch may have caused it to go south.  Looking at the failure it is an exception that says "Unable to complete test run."  Which isn't exactly informative. :)
[12:24] <rick_h_> gary_poster: hah, ok thanks. Yea I commented it in the MP and such but guess an inline one would have been good :/
[12:24] <gary_poster> benji, rick_h_ is looking at it AIUI.  check with him
[12:24] <rick_h_> benji: I'm looking right now. Saucelabs shows a single failed test in IE
[12:25] <rick_h_> benji: I'm trying to get the video to load to see what test failed. I'm on the laptop atm sans IE or I'd just run the tests in IE and look if I could dupe
[12:25] <rick_h_> benji: the screenshots show the failure count, but the failing tests isn't caught in the screenshots during scrolling
[12:25] <rick_h_> benji: it's toward the end of the suite, around 980+
[12:26] <benji> mmm, ok it seems like you have it in hand; let me know if there is anything I can do to help (I wish I had IE set up)
[12:26] <gary_poster> benji, you could get IE set up. ;-)
[12:26] <rick_h_> hmm, fails in FF as well
[12:27] <rick_h_> benji: it's the feature flag check.
[12:27] <rick_h_> benji: the failing test is "parses urls with and without flags" maybe you had a missing teardown step in your tests for your FF branch?
[12:28] <rick_h_> "AssertionError: expected { serviceInspector: true}  to deeply equal {}"
[12:28] <rick_h_> looking to see if I can dupe locally in FF
[12:28] <benji> rick_h_: I'm pretty sure I put a kill-all-the-flags step in my teardown, I'll look
[12:28] <benji> gary_poster: always the voice of reason... stop it
[12:29] <gary_poster> :-)
[12:30] <rick_h_> benji: ah, there's a hard coded addition to the FF in the tests to deal with the way we turned the inspector on without removing the flag
[12:30] <rick_h_> FF being feature flag not Firefox
[12:34] <rick_h_> gary_poster: anything against a branch to remove all traces of the feature flag? I don't get it to fail locally in FF but seems like it should be going away anyway
[12:36] <gary_poster> rick_h_, +.8.  No, scratch that, +1.  The only negative I have is that we only have one true blocker to release, other than the branch that hatch is about to land: we need to get the ghost save button to not be utterly broken, somehow.  But that's one or two people at most and I want to talk through it with hatch, so go for it, and thank you.
[12:36] <rick_h_> gary_poster: k, thanks
[12:42] <gary_poster> rick_h_, turns out he saw what you did with the single line thing and did it with a class.  improvement.  I'll stick with it.
[12:42] <rick_h_> gary_poster: ah, cool then.
[13:13] <hatch> http://bricss.net/post/61487265011/auto-hiding-scrollbars-in-ie10
[13:19] <hatch> #1226905
[13:19] <hatch> bug #1226905
[13:19] <_mup_> Bug #1226905: Inspector ghost "Import config file..." doesn't work unless "Use default configuration?" is toggled off <inspector> <juju-gui:In Progress by huwshimi> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1226905>
[13:19] <gary_poster> morning hatch.  when you are really here and have landed your other branch, please lemme know so we can talk about the save button
[13:20] <hatch> gary_poster: interesting I would have assumed that the proper interaction with 1226905 would be that you need to toggle the switch off then click the configuration upload button
[13:20] <hatch> and sure thing landing right away
[13:21] <hatch> I fell asleep real early last night hah
[13:22] <gary_poster> hatch, yeah, the move to put the upload above the toggle was specifically to try and communicate that the switch only controlled the input fields, not the upload
[13:23] <hatch> ohh gotcha - I suppose that the inputs are removed when you upload a file which indicates that things have definitely changed
[13:24] <gary_poster> ISTR something like that.  checking
[13:30] <gary_poster> bac, did you see the images from luca this morning showing where to put import and export and what images to use?
[13:32] <gary_poster> hatch, yes inputs are removed.
[13:32] <bac> gary_poster: no
[13:32] <bac> gary_poster: i only saw his email about the deploy bundles buttons
[13:33] <gary_poster> bac https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/file/d/0B7XG_QBXNwY1MnVub19KTElmZ2M/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/file/d/0B7XG_QBXNwY1TkNsVVphUnpPVGM/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/file/d/0B7XG_QBXNwY1Ni1Ud0llelFzZFk/edit?usp=sharing
[13:33] <bac> perfect
[13:35] <hatch> jcastro: A guy I know is asking me about charms sharing information or having access to a nfs are there any docs/blogs about this process?
[13:35] <bac> oh you can barely see the little icons there...
[13:35] <gary_poster> benji, approved for...Oakland :-)
[13:35] <jcastro> hatch: yeah
[13:36] <jcastro> we have an nfs charm that does that
[13:36] <jcastro> so the units have like a common place to dump stuff across all units
[13:36] <jcastro> like say, wordpress assets for pictures, etc.
[13:36] <benji> gary_poster: thanks :)  Raleigh coming in hot.
[13:36] <gary_poster> heh
[13:37] <gary_poster> hatch approved swap
[13:37] <jcastro> hatch: http://manage.jujucharms.com/charms/precise/wordpress/hooks/nfs-relation-changed
[13:37] <jcastro> hatch: basically, it's all in the wordpress charm
[13:37] <jcastro> the mediawiki charm might have that too
[13:38] <hatch> jcastro: thanks! I'll pass this on
[13:39] <jcastro> hey
[13:39] <jcastro> also
[13:39] <jcastro> have him check out the glusterfs charm
[13:39] <gary_poster> jcastro, -head links on jujucharms now all redirect to get rid of -head.  please let us know of any related issues, but https://jujucharms.com/charms/precise/juju-gui-HEAD wfm, for instance.  lots of similar variations.  https://jujucharms.com/precise/juju-gui-HEAD also goes to https://jujucharms.com/precise/juju-gui/ for instance
[13:39] <jcastro> hatch: it does everything the NFS charm does but with a proper clustered FS.
[13:40] <jcastro> gary_poster: thanks for that! laura was just pinging me over the weekend that the links were busted
[13:41] <gary_poster> right.  should be good now.  sorry for the slow turn around, but I think we have the tools to do it quicker next time.  'course, hopefully there won't be a next time :-P
[13:41] <hatch> oh boy do we need fuzzy searching bad on the charmsearch :)
[13:41] <gary_poster> yeah
[13:41] <hatch> jcastro: thanks I'll add that to the list
[13:41] <gary_poster> hatch, benji has a card to investigate and estimate cost so we can schedule
[13:42] <hatch> awesome - I knew it had to be done, but I just tried to search for that charm and I had to type it pretty much perfectly for it to work
[13:42]  * hatch needs to dogfood this more :)
[13:43] <benji> gary_poster/hatch: I had an idea on that front: we already do prefix search for the autocomplete, so the infrastructure should be in place to do it
[13:44] <gary_poster> benji, ack.  if that gives us a quick improvement, then +1.  that said, I also think that n-tuple or whatever the name is for that index aggregation by character lengths is the longer term right way forward, as you and others said initially
[13:45] <benji> n-gram
[13:45] <benji> yeah, it will give better results in the long run
[13:53] <hatch> gary_poster: I'm just evaluating the different approaches for the ghost thing right now
[13:56] <gary_poster> hatch, I have a hack idea, which was my first one.  In sum: don't delete ghost inspectors, just hide them, and only delete them when the ghosts are deleted.  That seems to me to be the fastest solution for now.  To actually implement save to env--which your recent code would make much more reasonable IMO btw--then we'd need to switch to databinding.  but databinding feels a lot more annoying than I want to do now.
[13:56] <gary_poster> I want to get this sucker released. :-)
[13:57] <hatch> yeah the fastest would be to change 'save' to 'cancel'
[13:58] <hatch> ok can chat now
[13:59] <gary_poster> hatch https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/40add188253e90b1322b17f14b7d66ea2ea6aeea
[14:07]  * benji finishes emailing reciepts.
[14:33] <hatch> gary_poster: functionally done - now to find the bugs which no doubt are there
[14:33] <gary_poster> hatch :-) cool
[14:50] <hatch> found em
[14:50]  * hatch grabs the bug spray
[14:51] <hatch> wouldn't you know it....it's checkbox code
[14:51]  * hatch points to rick_h_ and laughs
[14:51] <hatch> lol
[14:51] <hatch> 'oh it'll be easy, just....'
[14:51] <hatch> haha
[14:53] <jcastro> gary_poster: I just committed those 5 or so icons luca's team sent along, should make for some pretty updates.
[14:54] <gary_poster> jcastro, awesome thanks
[15:01] <hatch> gary_poster: so... this timebox is going to be blown out :/ labels use id's so all of the label interactions are broken because there are two inspectors on the page, so n inspectors all act on inspector #1 when interacting with labels
[15:01] <hatch> did not expect that one
[15:02] <gary_poster> hatch, ack.  Hey Luca, you have a sec to talk about Save button?  Actually hatch, could you explain situation to luca...who is not here. :-/
[15:03] <hatch> lol
[15:03] <hatch> I can email him?
[15:03] <gary_poster> hatch, how about the cancel button, and email to explain
[15:03] <hatch> I'll fire up another branch and impl that one
[15:04] <gary_poster> thanks hatch
[15:07] <rick_h_> hatch: what's broken now?
[15:08] <rick_h_> hatch: :P you said "I've already done that work, just copy my cool slider for the expose toggle"
[15:08] <hatch> hahaha
[15:09] <hatch> rick_h_: it wasn't actually your fault - I was just laughing because it was the checkbox that exposed it
[15:09] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, all good
[15:23] <bac> jujugui : suggestions for browser extensions for measuring pixels and placement?  chrome has one called MeasureIt but it is broken.
[15:24] <hatch> bac: I use skitch
[15:24] <hatch> but not available for Ubuntu :/
[15:24] <bac> hatch: osx?
[15:24] <hatch> yeah
[15:24] <bac> is it an extension?
[15:24] <hatch> nope it's a standalone app
[15:24] <hatch> so I use it to take a selection screenshot which tells me the dimensions
[15:24] <hatch> it's a hack but I couldn't find a good app like measureit
[15:25] <bac> hatch: i see.  i wish measureit was a good app.  doesn't do squat
[15:25] <rick_h_> bac: does the dev tools telling you the px not work?
[15:26] <bac> rick_h_: i don't understand what you're asking.
[15:26] <rick_h_> bac, sec
[15:26] <hatch> he means highlighting the elements I think
[15:27] <bac> rick_h_: you mean 'inspect element'?  i'm trying to measure placement so i don't know how to do that with those tools.
[15:27] <rick_h_> well I thoght it told you x/y position but now not seeing
[15:27] <bac> intra-element measurements
[15:27] <bac> no, inter-element
[15:28] <rick_h_> yea, ignore me. I was mistaken on what it could do
[15:29] <hatch> bac: just wing it ;)
[15:29] <rick_h_> bac: yea, I'd just end up doing a screen shot and measuring in that or gimp or something
[15:30] <bac> ok
[15:30] <hatch> but skitch does work really well
[15:30] <hatch> it's just windows/osx only
[15:30] <bac> hatch: i was hoping for something in place.
[15:30]  * bac avoids roundtrips
[15:31] <hatch> yeah - well if you find something let me know because I came up empty
[15:34] <benji> wow, I really don't get Windows 8 (but I do have IE 10 up)
[15:35] <hatch> benji: to shut it down, put the mouse to the upper right hand side of the window and then click on settings when the thing slides out
[15:35] <hatch> it's at the bottom of the settings panel (for some reason???)
[15:35] <benji> good to know
[15:35] <hatch> took me forever to find it
[15:38] <rick_h_> hatch: so I think the current CI failings are timeout issues. run-mocha as a 10min timeout set in it. Does that sound about right?
[15:38] <rick_h_> that's run-mocha.js
[15:38] <hatch> yeah it doesn't take 10minutes to run the gui tests
[15:39] <hatch> even on the slowest machine (mine) it only takes 3
[15:39] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, I know but the emails coming back are timeout with 639/etc seconds in there
[15:39] <rick_h_> hatch: the other option is I'm looking for something that tells sauce to die after 10m
[15:40] <hatch> hmm
[15:40] <hatch> well you COULD try and increase the timeout
[15:40] <rick_h_> hatch: but I don't know, none of hte run times are 10m, just the emails back are all in the 600s timing and "unable to complete test run"
[15:40] <hatch> I'm thinking it's hanging
[15:41] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, possible. It's only hanging in IE now though
[15:41] <hatch> well it can only get to IE because it's first
[15:41] <hatch> it fails fast
[15:42] <rick_h_> hatch: hmmm, ok
[15:43] <hatch> do the unit tests fail on your local machine?
[15:43] <bac> hatch: it looks like MeasureIt actually works as a safari extension
[15:44] <hatch> still doesn't help in Ubuntu haha
[15:49] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, nvm. It hangs locally as well. I forgot to try IE when I got back to the house today.
[15:50] <Makyo> jujugui call in 10
[15:50] <Makyo> Kanban now
[15:58] <Makyo> jujugui call in 2
[16:01] <Makyo> gary_poster, starting w/o you
[16:01] <gary_poster> Makyo, +1 sorry trying to finish up :-)
[16:22] <gary_poster> oops benji coming back
[16:22] <benji> heh
[16:32]  * benji looks at his 28 open browser windows and sighs.
[16:32]  * hatch hopes you mean tabs
[16:32] <hatch> and if so.....amature
[16:32] <hatch> :P
[16:37] <benji> hatch: nope 28 windows, most with multiple tabs
[16:37] <hatch> yikes - I have about 40 tabs but only a single window
[16:37]  * benji goes back to browser pruning.
[16:38] <hatch> when I tries to use multiple windows it would never remember them on close
[17:10] <Makyo> OneTab's good for that </belated>
[17:11]  * bac reboots
[17:23] <hatch> Makyo: wow! Thanks!
[17:24]  * hatch wishes bzr commit would run a precommit hook of `make lint`
[17:24] <hatch> that's a lie
[17:24] <Makyo> maybe prepush hook.
[17:25] <hatch> yah I just hate the `bzr commit -m "forgot lint"` commits I need to make before pushing haha
[17:31] <hatch> sorry rick_h_ CI still bustied
[17:32] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, I but saw something, have a sec?
[17:32] <hatch> in a minute
[17:33] <hatch> jujugui lf a review and multi platform qa on https://codereview.appspot.com/13242060/ plz and thanks
[17:33] <hatch> rick_h_:  ok rdy
[17:33] <hatch> call whenever
[17:33] <benji> hatch: I guess I need to put my new IE10 powers to good use, so I'll take a look
[17:35] <hatch> thank yas!
[18:24] <rick_h_> hatch: passed, so yay that. Boo that it takes that long to run
[18:58] <hatch> Makyo: so this extension is pretty nice - but kind of wish clicking the button didn't auto hide :)
[18:58] <hatch> re OneTab
[18:59] <Makyo> Yeah, it's not excellent, but still a reasonable solution.  I use it during research, collecting tabs into windows, then reducing the window.
[19:02] <hatch> do you know if it saves cross instances?
[19:02] <hatch> say I shut it down and open it up again?
[19:12] <hatch> stepping out for lunch
[19:12] <hatch> bbl
[19:28] <rick_h_> success! build passed!
[19:28]  * rick_h_ goes to hit the liquor cabinet now
[19:48] <gary_poster> Makyo do you think your qa is good for release qa?  hatch?  I'm starting to assemble a list of what we've done for the CHANGES file
[19:49] <Makyo> gary_poster, yes.  Like I said, the thing I found was minimal (U1 isn't uploading, I guess?) to the point of non-issue.
[19:49] <gary_poster> Makyo awesome thanks.
[19:49] <gary_poster> jujugui, I think we call this one 1.0 :-)
[19:49] <benji> +1
[19:49] <Makyo> \o/!
[19:49] <gary_poster> :-)
[19:52] <rick_h_> +1 on 1.0
[19:54] <BradCrittenden> gary_poster: export via icon is almost done.  to get the layout correct i added the import icon too.  it is not hooked up to anything.  leave it as tauntware or just comment out the HTML?
[19:54] <gary_poster> BradCrittenden, bac I mean, feature flag it!
[19:54] <bac> gary_poster: the whole thing
[19:55] <bac> import and export?
[19:55] <gary_poster> bac, uh.  well, actually.  either feature flag both or comment out the HTML, I say.
[19:56] <bac> gary_poster: ok.
[19:56] <gary_poster> bac, and I'm making a release, so wait on landing till tomorry, please.
[19:56] <gary_poster> or at least until I say I'm done :-)
[20:02] <Makyo> Oh, u1 crashed.
[20:03] <bac> cruise ship just went by.  they were practicing for talk like a pirate day
[20:03] <hatch> -1 on 1.0 :P It's not feature complete
[20:04] <rick_h_> hatch: bah, it's MVP :P
[20:04] <gary_poster> hatch, really?
[20:04] <gary_poster> hatch, when it is feature complete, we are out of a job :-)
[20:04] <hatch> lol no that's when it gets refactored
[20:04] <hatch> haha
[20:05] <hatch> It still feels incomplete - especially if you hit the notifications button
[20:05] <gary_poster> ok, yeah the notifications still are embarrassing, that's a point. :-/
[20:06]  * hatch drops mic and walks away
[20:06] <gary_poster> heh
[20:06] <hatch> lol
[20:10] <hatch> yeah after running through it I suppose it could be 1.0 but notifications really makes me think not
[20:10] <hatch> click 'view all notifications' when there are none and the whole thing goes bonkers
[20:15] <bac> just got busted by an old lady for not speaking spanish.  :(
[20:17] <hatch> did you tell her that it's ok because English is the international language of business?
[20:17] <hatch> :P
[20:18] <hatch> today is a good day....my truck insurance went down
[20:18] <hatch> it's still $1200/yr but less is better!
[20:20] <bac> hatch: i did not because she didn't speak the english.
[20:21] <hatch> ohh yes then very unfortunate
[20:21] <hatch> I'm not sure who it was who decided that English was the international language of business
[20:21] <hatch> maybe it was a sitcom and I'm full of it
[20:21] <hatch> lol
[20:22] <hatch> rick_h_: was the litle handle for the 'expanded' sidebar removed on purpose or is that a bug?
[20:24] <bac> hatch: this article flew by my feed this morning but i didn't get a chance to read it.  perhaps it addresses your question: http://www.economist.com/blogs/prospero/2013/09/language-diversity?fsrc=scn/fb/wl/bl/justspeakenglish
[20:27] <hatch> nope - just a fluf piece - but intersting none-the-less
[20:29] <gary_poster> jujugui, here's what I've got for CHANGES.  Comments/suggestions/recriminations?
[20:29] <gary_poster> - 0.10.0:
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - New inspector view for deploying and configuring services.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Inspector allows viewing details in full environment context.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Inspector fixes problem losing edits when environment changes.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Inspector shows edit conflicts and allows resolution.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Inspector fixes previously broken per-service charm view.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Worked around fragility in Keystone charm (LP bug 1214087).
[20:29] <_mup_> Bug #1214087: GUI fails to deploy keystone <juju-gui:Fix Committed by hatch> <keystone (Juju Charms Collection):New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1214087>
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - >
[20:29] <gary_poster>       Updated charm token (the token is the small charm visualization in
[20:29] <gary_poster>       browse and search) to show series and owner (or "Recommended") rather
[20:29] <gary_poster>       than summary.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Added missing support for removing units from services in Juju Core.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Added support for alternate Google Analytics keys.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - >
[20:29] <gary_poster>       Remove filters from charm searches.  We will add them back when there is
[20:29] <gary_poster>       more to filter on.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - >
[20:29] <gary_poster>       Inspector has feature-flagged support for upgrading to a new version of
[20:29] <gary_poster>       a charm.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - >
[20:29] <gary_poster>       Added internal support for new charm deployer integration (bundle
[20:29] <gary_poster>       support).
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - >
[20:29] <gary_poster>       Added internal support for sandbox version of deployer integration
[20:29] <gary_poster>       (bundle support).
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Added internal support for charmworld APIv3 (bundle support).
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Added internal support for rendering visual bundle summaries.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Refactored to unify internal charm implementations.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Switch to using Go sandbox by default.
[20:29] <gary_poster>     - Performance and bug fixes.
[20:31] <hatch>  ./kick +b gary_poster "Channel flood"
[20:31] <hatch> :P
[20:31] <gary_poster> I Just made all of those sentences in the past case, fwiw, except for the "Inspector allows/shows/fixes/..." ones
[20:31] <gary_poster> :-P
[20:31] <gary_poster> bah
[20:32] <benji> gary_poster: I don't think the "- >" bits are neccesary for multi-line strings
[20:33] <gary_poster> benji, maybe.  IIRC, they are for the parser we use (as well as the one in my editor).  I've had to fix these up in the past in order for doc gen to work.
[20:33] <hatch> gary_poster: looks good - I may try and make the very first one a little more pronounced - maybe a little more detailed account as it's the most important?
[20:33] <benji> hmm, we must use a sucky parser :)
[20:34] <gary_poster> hatch, ack--tried to do that with the next four bullet points.  I could add...
[20:34] <gary_poster>   - Inspector is really cool
[20:34] <hatch> lol
[20:34] <gary_poster>   - Inspector looks really nice
[20:34] <gary_poster>   - Inspector rocks our world
[20:34] <gary_poster> but concrete suggestions welcome :-)
[20:35] <hatch> Yeah I don't have anything better :)
[20:36] <hatch> I was never very good at the 'fill your paper with fluff text to hit the line minimum' in school
[20:36] <gary_poster> lol
[20:36] <gary_poster> ok
[20:37] <gary_poster> I'm running with it.
[20:37]  * gary_poster likes our release checklist/process
[20:40] <hatch> gary_poster: would you like me to pick off one of the red tickets in inspector?
[20:41] <gary_poster> hatch, good question.  looking.
[20:44] <gary_poster> hatch, I deleted a bunch.  I actually think our "save" work (databinding to model in step 1, and implementing save with env annotations in step 2) is more interesting, but eh.  Do you have enough background to work on bundle model?  benji, are you doing that as part of your branch?
[20:45] <gary_poster> (hatch, I deleted because huw had done them)
[20:45] <benji> gary_poster: I may have gotten there eventually, but its not something I had immediate plans for.
[20:46] <hatch> I know nothing of bundles
[20:46] <gary_poster> benji, is that a pre-requisite for your current effort?  I would have guessed it to be so but I might well be wrong.
[20:46] <hatch> I should probably learn about them though
[20:47] <benji> gary_poster: it might be, but at the moment I'm trying to disentangle the charmness out of charm tokens
[20:48] <hatch> maybe charm tokens are too shared :)
[20:48] <gary_poster> hatch, ack, ok.  so, yeah, choose a red card, or a maintenance-high card, or the databinding-ghost-inspector model
[20:48] <gary_poster> hatch, if you want more direction or explanation, just ask, but if that's good enough direction for you it is good enough for me
[20:49] <hatch> yep that's good I'll find something
[20:49] <gary_poster> cool
[20:50] <hatch> Makyo: in your testing did you notice this? It should be fixed https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-gui/+bug/1220312
[20:50] <_mup_> Bug #1220312: The scale-up UX is broken in juju-core real envs (at least) <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1220312>
[20:50] <Makyo> hatch, No, let me check again, still have the env up.
[20:51] <Makyo> hatch, in the future, can you bring this up before we start?
[20:51] <gary_poster> hatch it was working before I thought
[20:51] <Makyo> hatch, our M-O currently seems to be *start release process* *have a giant crisis* *feel bad about ourselves* *not actually release* and I really, really want to stop it.
[20:51] <gary_poster> hatch, Makyo wfm on lxc juju core
[20:52] <hatch> Makyo: I'm just going through the cards and I was sure it was fixed
[20:52] <hatch> so I am confirming with you
[20:52] <Makyo> wfm on real env EC2
[20:52] <gary_poster> cool
[20:52] <hatch> ok closing
[20:52] <gary_poster> moving on, thanks
[20:52] <Makyo> hatch, Then let's add that to the very top of the list of things to do for release.
[20:52] <hatch> +1
[20:52] <gary_poster> +1
[20:53] <Makyo> I may have been raised by hippies, but really, work should feel good :)
[20:53] <hatch> rofl
[20:56] <rick_h_> hatch: what handle removed?
[20:57] <hatch> the little swirly thing
[20:57] <hatch> it's no longer on the details part of the sidebar
[20:57] <hatch> but it's on the sidebar
[20:57] <rick_h_> where is it gone? I show it in http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com/precise/liferay-1/ for instance
[20:57] <gary_poster> Makyo, fwiw, the daily exploratory qa is also an attempt to improve this.
[20:58] <hatch> rick_h_: woah odd, my branch doesn't have it
[20:58] <Makyo> gary_poster, Yeah, I think it's an excellent idea!
[20:58] <hatch> time to rebuild
[20:58] <hatch> hah
[20:58] <rick_h_> hatch: then yea, your branch broke it, don't commit that :P
[20:59] <hatch> haha
[20:59] <rick_h_> hatch: but yea, not intended to be gone that I know of
[21:01] <hatch> ok going to work on databinding the ghost inspector
[21:07] <gary_poster> we shouldn't show constraints for subordinates
[21:08] <hatch> true
[21:08] <gary_poster> or the units controls
[21:08] <gary_poster> neither of those are showstoppers, but for future
[21:20] <gary_poster> jujugui, eagle has landed: I've pushed out 0.10.0.  Making release messages on blog and mailing list now.  We'll put it up on jujucharms tomorrow morning.
[21:20] <bcsaller> cheers
[21:23] <bac> yay
[21:27] <hatch> yussss
[21:27]  * hatch fires up the blog
[21:52] <hatch> 0.10.0 blogpost up http://fromanegg.com/
[21:58] <Makyo> Similar planned for our WP blog?
[21:58] <Makyo> Oh, oops, guess gary_poster said that.
[21:58]  * Makyo returns from dogwalk, on that note :)
[21:59] <Makyo> Will this be up somewhere we can point people?  Just comingsoon?
[21:59] <hatch> yeah I figured he was going that one
[22:00] <Makyo> And can we say last step before 1.0?
[22:01] <hatch> depends, notifications may take some time to get out
[22:01] <hatch> that's my only real objection to 1.0
[22:02] <gary_poster> Makyo, plans to be up on jujucharms.com tomorrow
[22:02] <Makyo> hatch, Mine too.  Can we think of an intermediate step to get there?  I think it'd be good to have out before SF.  Maybe get rid of the 'view all' link and just show all with scrolling?
[22:02] <Makyo> gary_poster, cool, thanks.
[22:02] <hatch> Makyo: so it would only have the dropdown?
[22:03] <Makyo> hatch, yes. That shows most everything, right?
[22:03] <Makyo> (only version I have up now is real env,  no notifications)
[22:03] <hatch> well when you click on a notification it takes you to the old inspector
[22:03] <hatch> so if we removed the links
[22:03] <hatch> then it's sort of a half-assed fix haha
[22:04] <Makyo> hatch, Yes, of course.  I mean a working version, not something halfway :)
[22:04] <Makyo> hatch, we won't have Luca until after SF.  This is my concern.  A major version would feel like a win.
[22:04] <hatch> ahh, right, and I guess the notification stuff was still a prototype
[22:04] <Makyo> I'm asking: what can we do to buy a quick win.
[22:04] <Makyo> hatch, yes, I have a task to find all notification types for Luca.
[22:05] <gary_poster> Makyo, intermediate step was mission I gave luca at sprint.  What he gave us was more involved than I had hoped.  We can go back to him and see if we can come up with a compromise.  I have a hunch that doing anything not half-assed will take more time than we expect.  Also, we will have luca again starting in 1.5 weeks.
[22:05] <Makyo> gary_poster, Oh? Thought it was until Oct 20.  Maybe nvm then :)
[22:05] <hatch> personally i'd like to see notifications landing be 1.0
[22:07] <gary_poster> If my hunch is correct, I'd be inclined to try and work in the direction that luca gave us, and have an incremental step be in that direction.  That is, the incremental step would be a first cut of the new design, rather than a hack of the existing bits
[22:07] <gary_poster> I need to run
[22:07] <gary_poster> sent email
[22:07] <gary_poster> made blog post
[22:07] <hatch> have a good one
[22:09] <Makyo> That's fair, hatch. I'm just trying to think of publicly visible changes that are of immediate use to our users, and I think both bundles and notifications fit nicely, but we're poised to ignore one.
[22:11] <hatch> well we need some type of 'non-broken' notifications story for 1.0 regardless of whatever else comes down the pipe at the same time
[22:11] <Makyo> I think we're agreeing loudly.
[22:11] <hatch> right haha
[22:11] <Makyo> Just want to know the first step to take.
[22:11] <hatch> I think gary_poster was onto the right thing though that we work towards the prototype direction instead of trying to make the current stuff work
[22:12] <hatch> we have what....5 weeks untill SF?
[22:12] <hatch> that should be enough for a rough cut
[22:12] <hatch> maybe....lol
[22:12] <Makyo> That's fair.  I'm already hunting notifications, and my other stuff relies on Luca too.  Think I should start?
[22:14] <hatch> I'd like to discuss a refactor of the notifications api but I'm not at a point where I'm convincing yet :)
[22:14] <Makyo> hatch, I'm game, lmk if you want to
[22:16] <hatch> can I get back to you tomorrow? I need to come up with some real benefits besides 'personal preference' :D
[22:17] <Makyo> Haha, fair :) I think it's worth it to keep moving forward with this, they've so obviously been stagnant since before inspector
[22:17] <hatch> haha yes, yes they have
[22:23]  * hatch is trying a new colourscheme - looks like I won't be able to find any code for a few days ;)
[23:08] <huwshimi> Morning
[23:10] <hatch> mornin huwshimi
[23:10] <hatch> 0.10.0 was released
[23:11] <huwshimi> :D
[23:12] <gary_poster> Makyo, hatch, let's keep focused on working together.  We finish up upgrade charm; then we all move to bundles next; then quickstart; then ice cream.  These are the things we have agreed to deliver.  1.0 and notifications I want to deliver, but they are not the priority.  In my mind, they are even beneath the priority of improving CI and our testing tools.  I'm hoping we will have time for them, but I hope we can al
[23:12] <gary_poster> l be happy keeping focus on the plan we have agreed on.
[23:12] <Makyo> Sure.
[23:13] <hatch> sure that sounds good
[23:13] <hatch> I thought ice cream was sooner
[23:13] <hatch> I must have missed the important part of that convo :)
[23:13] <Makyo> Upgrade charm's off until luca's back anyway.  Where should I be focusing?
[23:14] <hatch> gary_poster: the YUI community manager reached out to me to see if I would be interested in writing a blog post for yuiblog about how we used YUI - any objection?
[23:14] <gary_poster> Makyo, Luca gave us the necessary details for upgrade charm in Inspector 13 this week, didn't he?
[23:14] <gary_poster> hatch, go for it
[23:15] <hatch> will do!
[23:16] <Makyo> ah, okay.
[23:16] <Makyo> Slipped under the radar.
[23:17] <Makyo> Still no say on what happens with changing config options, but I guess we just delete them or whatever.
[23:18] <gary_poster> Makyo, I think he hoped that the new form validation bits would work.  They are not quite what you need IIUC but I bet you could identify and propose a way to coordinate them
[23:18] <Makyo> gary_poster, Not lucid right now, ping me about it tomorrow.
[23:18] <hatch> oh gary_poster I also came across an issue which will require some refactoring of the ghost config submission system - right now we only store 'changed' values in the ghost settings (as per previous bug) so we can't databind on nothing....which means this 'changed values' thing will need to be done as a parsing step on deploy
[23:18] <gary_poster> Makyo, cool, will do.  ttyl
[23:20] <gary_poster> hatch, we have a service to use--it is what the environment is using
[23:20] <gary_poster> hatch, is that not sufficient
[23:20] <hatch> right, but it's 'options' property is undefined
[23:20] <hatch> and it's only changed when the user alters a setting
[23:21] <gary_poster> hatch but we can set options to {} and we are good to go, yeah?
[23:21] <gary_poster> as an initialization step
[23:21] <hatch> that was my thought, but it didn't work because the databinding then cleared it out
[23:21] <hatch> that's as far as I got to maybe in the am I'll come up with something better
[23:22] <gary_poster> ok cool hatch.  this feels like there's a good answer in there waiting to fall out :-)
[23:22] <hatch> yeah probably a few hours off the computer will help it loose haha
[23:23] <gary_poster> cool
[23:23] <gary_poster> need to run.  thanks all!  congrats jujugui on a great 0.10.0!
[23:23] <hatch> w00t w00t
[23:23] <hatch> cya
[23:23] <huwshimi> gary_poster: Night
[23:24] <gary_poster> have a great day huwshimi--oh I can't be around tomorrow evening.  I'll say hi a little later today, if I can?
[23:24] <huwshimi> gary_poster: Sure!
[23:24] <gary_poster> cool
[23:24] <gary_poster> ttyl
[23:57] <bac> hey huwshimi, just saying hello...
[23:57] <huwshimi> bac: Hello!


[04:00] <dsas> congrats popey
[10:44] <ubotu> New bug: #147294 in ubuntu-docs (main) "Visual effects needs documentation/video" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/147294
[03:41] <mpt> http://www.linux.com/feature/119212 -- about licenses for documentation etc generally, and incompatibility between the CC BY-SA and the GPL in particular
[09:42] <mdke> nixternal: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/147186
[09:42] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 147186 in rosetta "Download all translations for a source package" [Undecided,Fix committed]
[09:46] <nixternal> mdke: OK, what am I missing with this? We have been downloading our translations like that since Dapper I thought, or at least Edgy...
[09:46] <mdke> no, it was only possible to download translations for a single template
[09:46] <mdke> with this, you can download all the templates at the same time; avoiding the 20 email feast
[09:48] <nixternal> ohhhhh
[09:48] <nixternal> sweet!
[09:48] <mdke> :)
[09:48] <nixternal> how are the ubuntu-docs translations coming along?
[09:48] <mdke> no idea
[09:48] <nixternal> I am following kubuntu-docs closely, and haven't seen all that much done yet
[09:49] <mdke> ah
[09:49] <nixternal> but then again, kubuntu-docs seem to get the same amount of love every period by the same exact teams
[09:49] <mdke> looks to be some decent progress, but the teams haven't got enough time really
[09:50] <mdke> we need to try and get them started relatively early in the cycle if possible
[09:50] <mdke> now things are getting relatively stable, hopefully that will be possible
[09:51] <nixternal> ya, that is what I am hoping
[09:51] <mdke> ok, bbl
[09:52] <nixternal> have fun
[12:08] <CIA-18> Ubuntu Documentation: lucius * r4404 xubuntu/printing/ (C/printing.xml printing.pot): remove mentioning of gnome-cups-manager, update corresponding POT


[01:32] <wallyworld_> thumper: hi, just taking to dog to the vet. i'm just about to propose the status stuff. took ages to get the new tests passing. i ended up exporting ParentId() and adding a couple of other helpers
[01:32] <wallyworld_> i'll do the watcher stuff next
[01:32] <thumper> wallyworld_: ok
[01:33] <wallyworld_> the status stuff supported arbitary nesting
[01:33] <wallyworld_> bt we don't use it yet but it will be there for when we do
[01:33] <wallyworld_> bbiab
[02:23] <wallyworld_> thumper: found another problem - there are docs ordered by machine id which do an Atoi() but container ids fail that since they are not numbers. so i'll have to find a way around that
[02:24] <thumper> hahaha
[02:24] <thumper> bummer
[02:25] <wallyworld_> yeah, i'll need to split the id and process from left to right
[03:00] <wallyworld_> thumper: we you have a moment https://codereview.appspot.com/10252044
[03:01] <wallyworld_> when
[03:07] <wallyworld_> thumper: question about container watchers - i'll first do a lifecycle watcher. does that suit your needs?
[03:18] <thumper> wallyworld_: hey,
[03:18] <wallyworld_> ho
[03:18] <thumper> wallyworld_: I think that is what I need
[03:18] <wallyworld_> ok, can add an entity watcher later if needed
[03:18] <thumper> what's the difference?
[03:19] <wallyworld_> i think lifecycle is created/deleted etc, entity is state changes and such
[03:19] <wallyworld_> not sure exactly yet
[03:19] <wallyworld_> i'll know once i write some tests
[03:28] <thumper> wallyworld_: I want a watcher like the one that he provisioner watches :)
[03:28] <thumper> don't know what type that is
[03:28] <wallyworld_> ok
[03:58] <wallyworld_> thumper: https://codereview.appspot.com/10250044
[04:06] <thumper> wallyworld_: soon
[04:06] <wallyworld_> thumper: no problem, just wanted to let you know they were there
[04:06] <thumper> kk
[04:48]  * thumper crosses fingers
[04:54]  * thumper waits for ec2 to bootstrap
[05:11] <thumper> wallyworld_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5760381/
[07:29] <rogpeppe1> mornin' all
[07:47] <thumper> hi rogpeppe1
[07:47] <rogpeppe1> thumper: yo!
[07:48] <thumper> rogpeppe1:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/5760381/
[07:48] <thumper> rogpeppe1: manual poking to get to this stage
[07:48] <thumper> but the bits are working
[07:48] <thumper> well, mostly working
[07:49] <rogpeppe1> thumper: why the lack of quotes around the container name?
[07:49] <rogpeppe1> thumper: good stuff  BTW!
[07:49] <thumper> rogpeppe1: yaml output
[07:49] <thumper> needed around 0 so not an int
[07:49] <rogpeppe1> thumper: ah of course. a number needs to be quoted
[07:49] <thumper> but 1/lxc/0 is obviously a string
[07:49] <thumper> so no quotes needed
[07:50] <thumper> still using manual hackery to manually create a provisioner on the machine
[07:50] <thumper> but it is using the provisioner task and lxc broker
[07:50] <thumper> with a real cloud-init to start the machine agent
[07:51]  * thumper jumps into the meeting hangout
[07:55] <wallyworld_> thumper: saw the pastebin earlier, looks nice, eill look even nicer with my juju status branch landed :-)
[08:01] <jam> mgz: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d3f48db1cccf0d24b0573a02f3a46f709af109a6
[08:02] <jam> wallyworld_: ^^
[08:02] <wallyworld_> oh different
[08:02] <wallyworld_> TheMue: ^^^^^^^^^^
[08:03] <jam> wallyworld_: where did you get your link from? (This one was on the calendar)
[08:03] <wallyworld_> jam: the calendar
[08:04] <fwereade__> wallyworld_, jam, I think I'm in the calendar one too... https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/bf3f4cfe715017bf60521d59b0628e5873f2a1d3
[08:04]  * fwereade__ leaves
[08:04] <wallyworld_> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/calendar/bWFyay5yYW1tLWNocmlzdGVuc2VuQGNhbm9uaWNhbC5jb20.mut2dk4mvoj39eq8jqni20ukoc
[08:04] <thumper> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/calendar/bWFyay5yYW1tLWNocmlzdGVuc2VuQGNhbm9uaWNhbC5jb20.mut2dk4mvoj39eq8jqni20ukoc
[08:05] <wallyworld_> fwereade__: yes, thumperstuffed up :-)
[08:07] <wallyworld_> thumper: were you going to chat about containers? perhaps a joint meeting with me too?
[08:07] <thumper> wallyworld_: I wanted to discuss the provisioner refactoring
[08:08] <wallyworld_> ok, i have some questions as well
[08:43] <mramm> hey all,
[08:43] <mramm> sorry I set my alarm wrong
[08:43] <mramm> just went off
[08:43] <mramm> and I realize the team meeting is not starting in 15 min, it started 45 min ago
[08:45] <mgz> mramm: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d3f48db1cccf0d24b0573a02f3a46f709af109a6
[09:05] <mramm> jam: did you guys chat about when tarmac is going to "land"?
[09:06] <jam> today
[09:06] <jam> mramm: I'll be making it live today. Everyone seemed happy with the plan I proposed.
[09:07] <mramm> cool
[09:07] <mramm> sounds good
[09:21] <jam> thumper: quick poke about the "InParallel" test.
[09:22] <jam> What if we change it from sleeping, to having one subprocess block until the other one is started?
[09:22] <thumper> jam: yes...
[09:22] <jam> so it would wait for a file that the other one creates, for example
[09:23] <thumper> I don't really care how it is changed as long as it is testing the parallel gathering
[09:23] <jam> you could have subprocess a creates file a and waits for b
[09:23] <jam> and vice versa
[09:23] <jam> so they must both be called at the same time
[10:15] <TheMue> fwereade__: ping
[10:35] <fwereade__> TheMue, pong
[10:35] <fwereade__> TheMue, still eating lunch
[10:36] <fwereade__> TheMue, I may have failed to communicate that if yur tests depend on some specific number of events they're Doing It Wrong
[10:36] <fwereade__> TheMue, but if the tests just watch for events until there are no more cleanups to perform... then... hmm. there may actually still be a race. bah
[10:37] <fwereade__> TheMue, yeah, there's a race, but it only affects the followup
[10:37] <fwereade__> TheMue, so all you need to do is watch for cleanup events until you get one and there aren't any more cleanups required
[10:38] <fwereade__> TheMue, at that point you can be sure that the cleaner did its job
[10:38] <jam> fwereade__: https://codereview.appspot.com/10234047 makes a test that occassionaly fails due to timing hiccups into a faster and reliable 'event' sort of mode.
[10:38] <jam> Something I'd like to land before switching to tarmac
[10:39] <fwereade__> jam, LGTM
[10:39] <TheMue> fwereade__: Yeah, it does. Only want to talk about the timeout with you.
[10:39] <fwereade__> TheMue, ah, go on
[10:41] <TheMue> fwereade__: You wondered about a "typo", but sadly it is none. The watcher in the test gets the second event (where then no more cleanups are needed, I followed it) after such a long time.
[10:41] <TheMue> fwereade__: Maybe you've any idea for the reason.
[10:41] <TheMue> fwereade__: Because that definitely should not be.
[10:41] <fwereade__> TheMue, ah, are you not syncing in your select loop? StartSync at the start of that loop, sorry I missed it
[10:41] <fwereade__> TheMue, default sync period is 5s
[10:42] <fwereade__> TheMue, ha
[10:42] <TheMue> fwereade__: IMHO I've tested it also with StartSync in the loop, but I'll verify it.
[10:42] <fwereade__> TheMue, no, I know what's going on, sorry
[10:42] <TheMue> fwereade__: Oh *listening*
[10:42] <fwereade__> TheMue, StartSync just at the top of the loop is not good enough
[10:43] <fwereade__> TheMue, because the watcher event could come in after that
[10:43] <fwereade__> TheMue, you need to keep on independently StartSyncing as you go through
[10:43] <fwereade__> TheMue, with StartSync at the top, `case <-time.After(50 * time.Millisecond): continue` should do the trick
[10:44] <jam> mgz: can you look at https://codereview.appspot.com/10234047 so I can land it?
[10:44] <TheMue> fwereade__: ah, push harder, nice idea
[10:44] <TheMue> fwereade__: will add it and come back to you
[10:45] <TheMue> fwereade__: but please don't let me disturb you at lunch, i'm sorry
[10:45] <fwereade__> jam, fwiw, I think there may still be branches approved that aren't necessarily ready to land, please unapprove them before you start tarmaccing ;)
[10:46] <mgz> looking at it
[10:47] <mgz> and ugh, shell
[10:47] <jam> mgz: :)
[10:48] <TheMue> fwereade__: just one last thing: fantastic, it works!
[10:48] <TheMue> fwereade__: thanks
[10:53] <jam> mgz: so have I turned you off so completely ?
[10:53] <mgz> jam: commented
[11:05] <jam> mgz: thanks
[11:13]  * TheMue => lunchtime
[11:30] <danilos> mgz, jam: hey, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/8868e66b07fa02bdc903be4601200d470dae9ee3 :)
[11:31] <mgz> ta
[12:42] <danilos> mgz, I am back, fwiw (and actually already fixing another annoyance I hit)
[12:43] <mgz> likewise
[12:44] <danilos> anybody wants to take a peek at trivial branch: https://codereview.appspot.com/10244044
[12:47] <TheMue> fwereade__: any good idea on how to test the resumer?
[13:09] <danilos> jam: you had a fix for StateSuite.TestOpenDelaysRetryBadAddress failure or was that something else?
[13:22] <fwereade__> TheMue, none whatsoever -- just start it and stop it I reckon
[13:22] <fwereade__> TheMue, (sorry I mised you)
[13:23] <fwereade__> TheMue, we'd have to inflict damage to the transaction log on purpose to test it, and spending time on that in particular seems like a bit of a waste of effort
[13:23] <TheMue> fwereade__: no pro, i'll add this. the rest has been simple. cleaner is also proposed again
[13:24] <TheMue> fwereade__: yep, think so too. i took a look on how ResumeAll() works, and here we would have to do evil stuff under the hood :)
[14:25] <jam> mgz or danilos: the juju cross-team meeting is supposed to happen in about 10 minutes, could one of you make it?
[14:25] <mgz> I can if needed
[14:26] <jam> mgz: thanks, I can't really make it today
[14:26] <jam> (today is my wife's b-day)
[14:26] <jam> mgz: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/calendar/YW50b25pby5yb3NhbGVzQGNhbm9uaWNhbC5jb20.2ijeg1lk8l6gq6d4ilo6jot1j4 is the link from email
[14:26] <mgz> ta
[14:49] <TheMue> tarmac help needed. i've got an "old" branch now with two lgtms (after a final local change). now i've committed and merged it locally. but i'm not sure about the reproposal for launchpad.
[14:50] <mgz> see the instructions in jam's post to the list
[14:51] <TheMue> mgz: i've seen them, but still have problems/questions. if i set my branched to approved now the final changes won't be in there.
[14:52] <mgz> you just go to the branch webpage, and repropose against lp:juju-core
[14:53] <TheMue> with "resubmit proposal"?
[14:53] <mgz> yup
[14:54] <TheMue> and my still local changes? simple bzr push before resubmit?
[14:55] <mgz> yes
[14:56] <TheMue> that sounds good, thanks
[15:04] <TheMue> so, now i'm curious how it will work ;)
[15:08] <fwereade__> TheMue, mramm: ready?
[15:08] <mramm> so, meeting
[15:08] <mramm> yep
[15:08] <mramm> hangout?
[15:08] <TheMue> yep
[15:08] <fwereade__> mramm, TheMue, I'll start one
[15:22] <rogpeppe1> just going to pick up van from MOT test. back in 15 mins.
[15:37] <TheMue> fwereade__: ping => https://codereview.appspot.com/10266043
[15:37] <fwereade__> TheMue, cheers
[16:56] <jamespage> mgz, do you have a release tarball for 1.11.0?
[16:59] <mgz> jamespage: no, but I can make one
[16:59] <mgz> it just won't be what was actually used (as I haven't switched dave onto the new method yet)
[16:59] <jamespage> mgz, great - it would be nice to stuff a new release into saucy as we make it he default
[18:09] <ahasenack> so juju-core trunk now wants a service name in the config yaml file?
[18:09] <ahasenack> https://code.launchpad.net/~fwereade/juju-core/config-5-state-service-config-yaml/+merge/168579
[18:09] <ahasenack> just checking
[18:47] <rogpeppe1> time to stop. g'night all.
[21:34] <thumper> morning folks
[21:49] <thumper> fwereade__: ping
[22:04]  * thumper bootstraps ec2
[22:04] <thumper> geez this takes a while...
[22:13] <thumper> mramm2: ping
[22:15] <thumper> jcastro: ping?
[22:16] <thumper> m_3: ping?
[22:17]  * thumper feels the loneliness of being at utc+12
[22:18] <jcastro> yo thumper
[22:18] <thumper> jcastro: hey man
[22:18] <jcastro> I am in the middle of BBQing, so in and out
[22:18] <jcastro> so keep talking
[22:18] <thumper> jcastro: what is a nice simple charm to deploy?
[22:18] <thumper> jcastro: the first one to be in an lxc container in ec2
[22:19] <m_3> thumper: pong
[22:19] <m_3> what's up?
[22:19] <thumper> m_3: just feeling lonely :)
[22:19] <m_3> ha
[22:19] <thumper> m_3: wanting an easy charm for testing
[22:19] <m_3> mysql
[22:19] <m_3> it's my goto for when I need to precache lxc and stuff like that
[22:19] <thumper> precache?
[22:21] <jcastro> thumper: wordpress is our defacto
[22:21] <jcastro> etherpad-lite has no deps though
[22:21] <jcastro> if you only want a single container with no relations
[22:21] <m_3> thumper: yeah, the juju-0.7 worflow was pretty flawed wrt lxc
[22:22] <m_3> thumper: you'd run juju bootstrap and that'd run zk and prep stuff
[22:22] <m_3> but the lxc template images wouldn't build out (or download cloudimages) until the first time you actually _deployed_ a service
[22:23] <m_3> um... without letting the user know what was going on
[22:23] <thumper> :)
[22:23] <m_3> so it'd just quietly block while downloading
[22:23] <m_3> you'd naturally kill it
[22:23] <m_3> and wind up with a halfway downloaded image in /var/cache/lxc
[22:24] <jcastro> let's not spoil him with how it sucked
[22:24] <m_3> ha
[22:24] <m_3> sorry
[22:24] <m_3> he asked
[22:24] <jcastro> that way he can come up with something awesome without being jaded like we are
[22:24] <m_3> yes, /me will sit on his hands
[22:24] <jcastro> "and then, we asked 10 people to download 450mb of images on conference wireless for this charm school"
[22:24] <jcastro> hahahah
[22:24] <jcastro> <--- what were we thinking
[22:24]  * thumper has some thoughts around that
[22:25] <thumper> jcastro: what if we wrote a simple go http server for you
[22:25] <thumper> jcastro: so at a charm school, you could run this, and it serves just the ubuntu-cloud lxc tempalte
[22:25] <thumper> people could then run wget to grab it locally
[22:25] <m_3> we can cache cloud images lots of ways
[22:25] <m_3> lxc builds nicely from cloud images now
[22:27] <m_3> I also liked having the download happen during package install... i.e., if the local provider is in its own package, it can get the image templates during package install
[22:27] <m_3> peiople are used to waiting on apt
[22:27] <m_3> thumper: but really we're open to whatever makes sense man
[22:28] <thumper> well, I can see how to make the local provider now that I've messed around a lot with lxc
[22:28] <thumper> but containerisation first, then network, then local provicer
[22:28] <thumper> but it is coming
[22:28]  * m_3 loves lxc
[22:30] <jcastro> thumper: that sounds like a plan
[22:40] <wallyworld_> thumper: you happy with the juju status mp now?
[22:40] <thumper> wallyworld_: sorry, not looked at it
[22:41] <thumper> trying to work out why what worked yesterday isn't today
[22:41] <wallyworld_> np. fat chance i'll get a 2nd +1 today :-(
[22:45] <thumper> at least I have worked out why my programs were hanging
[22:48] <wallyworld_> reason?
[22:49] <thumper> hmm...
[22:49] <thumper> lxc isn't nice
[22:49] <thumper> golxc runs lxc-start
[22:50] <thumper> then waits forever for it to be running
[22:50] <thumper> if there is an error in the config somehow...
[22:50] <thumper> then it won't start
[22:50] <thumper> and lxc-start doesn't return non-zero exit
[22:50] <thumper> also found
[22:51] <thumper> that if I pass the lxc.conf file to lxc-create, the mount works
[22:51] <thumper> if I only pass it to lxc-start, the mount fails
[22:51] <thumper> so it doesn't start
[22:55]  * thumper quietly rages
[22:58] <thumper> wallyworld_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5763044/
[22:59] <wallyworld_> thumper: niiiiiice
[22:59] <wallyworld_> would look better with my juju status :-)
[22:59] <thumper> :)
[22:59] <wallyworld_> can we wrap lxc-start somehow?
[22:59] <thumper> that is with --force-machine
[22:59] <thumper> wallyworld_: I am
[22:59] <thumper> twice
[22:59] <wallyworld_> maybe 3 times
[23:00] <thumper> I'm going to ask for some help around that
[23:01]  * thumper continues blindly (well with poor vision)
[23:02] <thumper> wallyworld_: I think part of the reason is that we are asking to start --daemon
[23:02] <thumper> which appears to be fire and forget
[23:02] <wallyworld_> sounds about right
[23:02] <thumper> so, zero rc, all good
[23:02] <wallyworld_> my lxc foo is not excellent
[23:02] <thumper> but the issue appears to be "we wait forever"
[23:03] <wallyworld_> i really wish we had decent progress monitoring
[23:03] <wallyworld_> baked into the cli
[23:03] <thumper> wallyworld_: I am using my logging to trace stuff though
[23:03] <thumper> very nice
[23:03] <wallyworld_> \o/
[23:03] <wallyworld_> but we need to productise stuff for a user
[23:04]  * thumper nods
[23:04] <thumper> yeah
[23:32] <thumper> wallyworld_: lxc containers on the bootstrap node are working fine
[23:32] <wallyworld_> yay
[23:32] <thumper> wallyworld_: got a machine agent up and running on machine 0
[23:32] <thumper> 0/lxc/0 that is
[23:32] <wallyworld_> manually?
[23:32] <thumper> sure...
[23:32] <thumper> I need that container watcher
[23:33] <wallyworld_> thumper: up for review yesterday
[23:33] <thumper> can't automate the provisioner until I get that
[23:33] <mramm2> thumper: pong
[23:33] <thumper> \o/
[23:33] <thumper> hi mramm2
[23:33] <thumper> mramm2: was nothing important, was feeling lonely :)
[23:33] <mramm2> haha
[23:33] <wallyworld_> thumper: i did tell you it was there :-P
[23:33]  * thumper sighs
[23:34] <mramm2> thumper: I don't know when andrew starts
[23:34] <mramm2> but nate the other new hire is now slated to start on the 29th
[23:34] <thumper> mramm2: so... using --force-machine, you can deploy into a running container
[23:34] <thumper> mramm2: but the 29th of july, not june
[23:34] <mramm2> manual network bridging or what
[23:34] <thumper> mramm2: just using the lxc default bridge
[23:35] <mramm2> july
[23:35] <thumper> so no access in, just out
[23:35] <mramm2> wow, I missed that
[23:35] <mramm2> you are of course right
[23:35] <mramm2> that is a long time
[23:35] <mramm2> hopefully andrew will start sooner
[23:35]  * thumper nods
[23:36] <mramm2> so you are bridging out, and everything is working
[23:36] <mramm2> rock and roll


[04:06] <RAOF> I see gslnetworks is having another normal one; routing all my packets to various Canonical properties via a lovely Melbourne → Adelaide → (unknown) → Melbourne loop…
[05:57] <amurray> 🙄 - heh with ABB I see ADL -> MEL -> SYD -> PER -> SIN .. -> PARIS -> LONDON .. launchpad.net - but that is IPv6 - if I go with IPv4 then it is a more normal ADL -> SYD ... launchpad.net - much shorter... but total latency is longer for IPv4... go figure?
[08:45] <schopin> If I have a failure in ppc64el and s390x, would it be correct to think it is likely a big-endian related failure?
[09:00] <xypron> I am looking for a sponsor for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/opensbi/+bug/1956362 (Sync opensbi 1.0-1 (main) from Debian sid (main)).
[09:01] <ginggs> schopin: ppc64el is little-endian
[09:01] <schopin> ginggs: damned.
[09:02] <ginggs> xypron: looking at your sync now
[11:43] <rbasak> cpaelzer: not urgent: please could you glance at the fix proposed in https://bugs.launchpad.net/uvtool/+bug/1956366 - https://launchpadlibrarian.net/578427144/uvtool-fix-armhf-failure.debdiff - and ack if it lgty?
[11:43] <rbasak> It's trivial, so if it's good I'll at least just commit it to uvtool upstream.
[11:44] <cpaelzer> I'll have a look rbasak
[12:22] <cpaelzer> rbasak: I answered ont he bug with a verbose +1
[12:30] <rbasak> Thanks!
[13:43] <jdstrand> juliank: ack, thanks! (I responded yesterday)
[15:05] <juliank> jdstrand: I don't understand your analysis in #16 fwiw (it seems to say "I don't see the cycle"), I think the approach in #17 is right though.
[15:32] <jdstrand> juliank: hah, I just wrote "Oh! I missed from the initial report that network-pre was deleted which clears up things considerably on my end (since I wasn't able to reproduce, I didn't see it locally either)". Indeed, I say the cycle but I didn't see that network-pre was deleted
[15:32] <jdstrand> saw*
[15:48] <juliank> jdstrand: yeah it will delete a random job to break a cycle
[15:50] <jdstrand> 0.36.1-3ubuntu1 is building now. hopefully that'll be that. thanks! :)
[15:53] <jdstrand> juliank: iirc, you somehow blocked promotion. does anything special need to be done for this upload so can be promoted, etc?
[15:53] <juliank> jdstrand: if the bug is closed I think it should migrate automatically
[15:53] <juliank> if not, remove block-proposed* tags
[15:53] <jdstrand> cool, I'll just keep an eye on it
[17:25] <ahasenack> schopin: hi, I was checking excuses, and saw that python-cryptography is failing tests
[17:25] <ahasenack> turns out it's failing the build too, which runs tests
[17:25] <ahasenack> the build we have in the jammy archive used openssl 3.0.0. With 3.0.1 (or at least, current jammy), it fails
[17:25] <ahasenack> have you seen that?
[17:26] <ahasenack> `[_OpenSSLErrorWithText(code=50331803, lib=6, reason=155, reason_text=b'error:0300009B:digital envelope routines::buffer too small')])`
[17:26] <schopin> No, that's news to me :/
[17:28] <ahasenack><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:28] <ahasenack> search for "buffer too small"
[17:32] <schopin> ahasenack: this might solve the issue ? https://github.com/pyca/cryptography/commit/753d3e412a341e157e6b55b135b8a4c1efbb5622
[17:32] <ahasenack> let me try
[17:33] <ahasenack> is this one of the changes between openssl 3.0.0 and 3.0.1? https://github.com/openssl/openssl/pull/16789
[17:38] <schopin> ahasenack: it is (wasn't mentioned in their changelog -_- )
[17:41] <ahasenack> ok, I'll apply it and try a build
[17:41] <ahasenack> thanks for finding it
[17:50] <jdstrand> juliank: fyi, it is fully in -proposed now and autopkgtest passed for amd64 (others are still running). looking at https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html it seems I need to remove the tags since the bug can't be closed unless it migrates and it can't migrate cause of the tags (aiui). the known problematic 0.36.1-3 is superceded and shouldn't be able to
[17:50] <jdstrand> migrate any more, so I removed the tags
[18:02] <ahasenack> schopin: build worked \o/
[18:02] <schopin> \o/
[18:21] <juliank> jdstrand: I also upgraded the autopkgtest staging instance with the new ufw and all test instances booted fine, so I guess, hooray
[18:27] <jdstrand> nice! :)
[18:47] <ahasenack> schopin: do you mind doing a quick review? https://code.launchpad.net/~ahasenack/ubuntu/+source/python-cryptography/+git/python-cryptography/+merge/413712
[18:47] <ahasenack> I can create a salsa PR too
[18:50] <schopin> ahasenack: will do, but you'll have to find someone else to do the upload, I'm only a lowly MOTU ;-)
[18:50] <ahasenack> I can upload
[18:51] <ahasenack> we just have this policy of peer review in the team I'm on
[18:52] <ahasenack> just added a slot for you
[19:04] <schopin> ahasenack: I'll get to it first thing tomorrow.


[01:15] <Alan_M> hello everyone! :)
 Hmm, anybody else notice how far off-center (vertically) the progress bar is on the usplash theme?
[05:50] <troy_s> DanaG: You mean horizontally?
[05:54] <DanaG> Nope, vertically.
[05:54] <DanaG> Between the textbox and the logo.
[05:54] <DanaG> If you boot without 'quiet'
[06:22] <troy_s> DanaG: What do you mean off-center?  Center punching isn't exactly good composition, so I would need you to explain.
[06:23] <DanaG> Do you use the usplash with 'quiet' disabled?
[06:23] <troy_s> DanaG: In general, center punching _anything_ is a good reason so suspect that the person doing it is drunk.
[06:23] <troy_s> DanaG: Yes...
[06:23] <troy_s> DanaG: Where is the center of gravity for the two components -- the graphical progress bar and the wordmark?
[06:23] <DanaG> On a line between either the logo bottom OR the text-in-logo bottom, and the top of the messages, is way offcenter.
[06:23] <DanaG> I'm not sure, but it somehow seems visually off to me.
[06:24] <DanaG> It may also be looking odd because I don't have native-res framebuffer.
[06:24] <DanaG> LCD: 1440x900.  VESA mode: 1024x768.  Stretched.
[06:24] <DanaG> To counteract that: usplash.conf is 1024x853
[06:24] <DanaG> So it goes low.
[06:25] <DanaG> How do you get usplash to use the fake-widescreeen images?
[06:25] <troy_s> DanaG: Well, I don't know where it is... there are some technological limitations to perfect composition of course -- namely that the text area wasn't laid out by someone with a clue so the logo and the progress bars are often composed in avoidance of that area.
[06:25] <troy_s> DanaG: Widescreen and usplash has always been awful.
[06:25] <troy_s> DanaG: But it shouldn't affect the vertical compostion.
[06:26] <DanaG> I made it look not-squished, but the vertical composition is like this:
[06:26] <DanaG> From bottom of logo text to top of box, the progress bar is 2/3 of the way down.
[06:26] <DanaG> Measured to bottom of progress bar.
[06:27] <DanaG> At least it's circular, though.  I had to reverse-compensate:  1024*(4/3)/(16/10)
[06:27] <troy_s> DanaG: 2/3rds for the progress bar is probably high... as your eye will be drawn to the center of gravity of the two sources
[06:28] <troy_s> DanaG: Which in this case would be about probably say, 2/3rds of the way from the top of the logo to the bottom of the progress bar.
[06:28] <troy_s> DanaG: Needless to say, it is close.
[06:28] <DanaG> It's one of those "just close enough that it's hard to tell" things.
[06:29] <troy_s> DanaG: Well it is pretty simple more or less -- you just locate a centre of gravity and make sure that it abides more or less by the rule of thirds.
[06:29] <troy_s> DanaG: In this case, the centre of gravity of the logo is around that guess, and _that_ margin line would be located approximately at 2/3.
[06:29] <troy_s> DanaG: But... no one gives a shit.
[06:32] <troy_s> DanaG: Well... 61.8% to be far more accurate in terms of classical composition.
[06:32] <DanaG> Whatever it is... it's off by just enough to be odd.
[06:32] <DanaG> Either that, or my sense of balance is screwy.
[06:32] <troy_s> DanaG: Have a look at the default KDE wallpaper if you want to see odd composition.
[06:33] <DanaG> Oh, that one from vladstudio.com?
[06:33] <troy_s> DanaG: Yes.
[06:33] <troy_s> DanaG: It's just asstastic.
[06:33] <DanaG> That guy has sooo many other better wallpapers -- actually, the kde4 default is one of his worst ones,  I think.
[06:33] <troy_s> DanaG: The composition is horrific (aside from some of the other more often cited issues with walls / concepts / etc.)
[06:34] <DanaG> SOme of his other wallpapers actually work reasonably well with that changes-over-time thingy.
[06:35] <DanaG> But I'd rather have good static artwork than crappy dynamic artwork.
[06:40] <DanaG> I'm using the transparent svg from just above the "gdm theme" concept.
[12:53] <_MMA_> Oh ffs. "Zoom" view for widescreen wallpapers in Hardy now justifies the pic to the left side and everything off the right on a 4:3 screen instead of centering and cropping both sides. Asstastic.
[13:01] <kwwii> _MMA_: that is nasty
[16:48] <thorwil> if "adjustment.upper" returns 204.0, "adjustment.set_value(204.0)" should cause the scrolledwindow to scroll to the end, right?
[16:49] <thorwil> but it only scrolls a few lines down :(
[16:58] <troy_s> _MMA_: What is the net effect?
[16:58]  * thorwil only now notices it's the wrong channel
[16:58] <troy_s> thorwil: Lol.
[16:59] <_MMA_> troy_s: Instead of cropping both sides equally, it takes it all from 1 side.
[16:59] <troy_s> _MMA_: Woop.  Center punchy mook hell!
[17:01] <troy_s> _MMA_: It's pulling it off the left too yes -- which is sort of a worst case scenario.
[17:06] <_MMA_> troy_s: Indeed.
[22:33] <psyke83> hi
[22:38] <kwwii> hi psyke83
[22:39] <psyke83> hey kwwii
[22:39] <_MMA_> psyke83: We're trying to get a theme to use specific icons in the panel.
[22:39] <kwwii> you don't happen to know how to set a different icon theme for just the panel, do you?
[22:39] <kwwii> :-/
[22:39] <_MMA_> Something like "gtk-icon-theme-name = "gnome" is supposed to work.
[22:40] <psyke83> _MMA_, what theme is this for?
[22:40] <_MMA_> psyke83: Goes somewhere in the "style "panel" section.
[22:41] <psyke83> you need to use an absolute path for the icon theme, btw
[22:42] <kwwii> psyke83: do you know how to set a gtkrc just for the panel?
[22:43] <_MMA_> I do.
[22:58] <psyke83> kwwii, ok, I don't think it's possible to do that, as the gtk-icon-theme-name is a global variable that can't be defined within a style
[23:04] <_MMA_> psyke83: So then what we need to find is a way to set an icon theme or a set of images within the "panel" style.
[23:04] <psyke83> _MMA_, it's not possible, and the icon theme seems to be overridden anyway
[23:05] <_MMA_> psyke83: With that "gtk-icon-theme-name" sure. Im looking for another way.
[23:06] <_MMA_> I was tinkering with setting the panel icon size to a particular size and editing those icons to suit.
[23:07] <_MMA_> But, while i can get that to kinda work it still grabs images from outside the set size. ie: 20x20.
[23:08] <psyke83> _MMA_, if you're including the menu icons (i.e. Applications, Places, System), that's the menu icons, not exclusively panel...
[23:09] <_MMA_> See, here's where Skype is good.
[23:09] <_MMA_> No. "panel" not "panel-menu"
[23:09] <kwwii> psyke83: actually, we only want to theme the things that show up on the panel, not in any of the menus
[23:10] <psyke83> I don't think it's possible to change the icon set for different widget sets anyway, but maybe it's possible to set individual icons somehow like here: http://roscidus.com/desktop/book/export/html/98
[23:10] <psyke83> see "How can I theme the toolbar icons?"
[23:11] <_MMA_> psyke83: Hmm... That might work.
[23:12] <psyke83> just bear in mind that's ROX-Filer, and there may not be defined names you can edit in the same way
[23:13] <_MMA_> psyke83: So you think that will work in style "panel"?
[23:13] <psyke83> nope
[23:13] <_MMA_>   stock["gtk-close"] = {{"close-icon.png"}}
[23:13] <_MMA_> grr...
[23:15] <kwwii> psyke83: thanks for the link, lots of good info there
[23:19] <psyke83> hold on a sec...
[23:20] <psyke83> look at this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/baltix/+source/gnome-panel/+bug/134144
[23:20] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 134144 in gnome-panel "Main menu icons blurred using alternate theme controls" [Undecided,New]
[23:20] <psyke83> comment 3
[23:20] <psyke83> is it possible that we can define: gtk-icon-theme-name = "panel=gnome", for example?
[23:20] <psyke83> it's a long shot, though
[23:23]  * _MMA_ tries.
[23:26] <psyke83> doesn't seem to work here
[23:26] <psyke83> it seems to be completely ignored, in fact (as a global setting)
[23:27] <_MMA_> :(
[23:37] <psyke83> bear with me, look at this: gtk-icon-sizes = "panel-menu=24,24:gtk-menu=24,24:panel=24,24"
[23:37] <psyke83> the panel-menu and gtk-menu entries work (try setting them to 16 to see), but the panel doesn't
[23:37] <psyke83> maybe it has a different name, so if we can find out the name, we can use the same format to change the icons
[23:38] <psyke83> damn, gtk-menu doesn't work either
[23:39] <_MMA_> gtk-menu should. As that effects the applications and sytem menus.
[23:39] <psyke83> it should, but it doesn't when you actually try it
[23:40] <_MMA_> Logout/in.
[23:40] <_MMA_> Or restart the panel.
[23:41] <kwwii> gtk-menu only does app menus and the places and system menu in the panel
[23:41] <psyke83> that's panel-menu
[23:41] <kwwii> panel-menu only effects the applications menu in the panel
[23:41] <psyke83> (replying to _mma)
[23:41] <kwwii> oops, sorry
[23:41] <psyke83> kwwii, gtk-menu doesn't work
[23:42] <psyke83> I'm looking at e.g. gedit's menu
[23:42] <psyke83> kwwii, nope, panel-menu does the applications places and system menus on the panel, try it yourself
[23:43] <kwwii> psyke83: freaky, earlier I got it to only effect the applications menu...perhaps I did not restart the panel or such
[23:44] <psyke83> it seems that gtk-icon-theme-name is completely broken
[23:44] <psyke83> yeah, that's weird... but on my system it affects all the panel menus
[23:45] <kwwii> yeah, it does here too now
[23:46] <psyke83> that seems very weird that the icon theme can't be changed... hmm
[23:49] <kwwii> hrm, I can set a custom icon for all the applets and objects in the panel in gconf
[23:49] <kwwii> the custom_icon key
[23:51] <kwwii> but then I guess people would complain that they cannot change those icons when changing themes
[23:55] <psyke83> kwwii, hmm, is that what's overriding the gtkrc in the first place?
[23:57] <_MMA_> kwwii: Yes. I would kill you.
[23:58] <kwwii> psyke83: no, those keys are not set
[23:58] <kwwii> I would have mentioned that :p
[23:59] <kwwii> the panel seems to be freaky anyway...my firefox icon is 24x24
[23:59] <kwwii> it fills up the whole height of the panel
[23:59] <kwwii> and the only firefox icons I can find are, at the smallest 48x48
[23:59] <kwwii> the other icons in the panel are 22x22


[10:19] <slashtommy> morning all, myself and the ebel had a lovely relaxed Ubuntu Hour
[10:43] <ebel> yarp.
[10:43] <ebel> no-one else turned up, alas.
[10:43] <ebel> But still, tis good to try new things etc. etc.
[10:49] <slashtommy> exactly, and we got out into town for lunch
[11:08] <BenChapman> Sorry guys :)
[12:30] <czajkowski> aww hugs
[12:30] <czajkowski> at least ye tried something new
[12:32] <slashtommy> twas fine, it was unfortunate timing for many peoples
[12:32] <moylan1> weather was... biblical unfortunately.  still raining heavily now.  hasn't stopped.
[12:32] <slashtommy> and we didn't mind, the café is nice enough and ebel got a full irish
[12:33] <slashtommy> will try another one, maybe a saturday lunch time
[12:36] <slashtommy> maybe we could run another ubuntu hour after the CDs are received
[12:36] <slashtommy> does anyone know where they are going?
[12:36] <moylan1> i'd be game if it's a weekend i'm not gaming
[12:37] <slashtommy> i would like to do weekend, otherwise it's quite inconvenient if you don't happen to work in Dublin 2
[12:38] <slashtommy> and most evening city-centre venues are either too busy or too shite
[12:46] <czajkowski> cds have started to be shipped since last week
[12:47] <czajkowski> so if ordered are due out soon to ireland
[12:47] <czajkowski> UK got theirs already
[12:52] <ebel> cool
[12:53] <slashtommy> ebel: are they coming to us?
[12:53] <ebel> yep
[12:53] <slashtommy> deadly, when they arrive will have to call another Ubuntu Hour
[13:09] <BenChapman> Hey does anyone here know anywhere that might be receptive to hosting CoderDojo for a few weeks? All we need is network access and a few tables/chairs.
[13:09] <BenChapman> Sadly our current space has no network connectivity since Oracle decided they were taking over one of the rooms we use
[13:19] <airurando> afternoon
[13:20] <slashtommy> hey airurando
[13:20] <slashtommy> BenChapman: shame that Tog cannot allow under 18s in
[13:20] <airurando> i slashtommy
[13:21] <airurando> slashtommy: sorry I didn't make in up yesterday
[13:21] <slashtommy> BenChapman: how much room do you require?
[13:22] <slashtommy> no worries, we had a nice lunch in town and ebel got a full irish :P
[13:23] <BenChapman> Pretty much just sorted a space in UCD
[13:23] <BenChapman> some hoops to jump through
[13:23] <BenChapman> but it should be good
[13:24] <slashtommy> good good
[13:25] <BenChapman> Thanks for the help though. :)
[13:39] <airurando> slashtommy: as you said. we should call another UH when the CDs are in.
[13:39] <airurando> we discussed this at the last meeting.
[13:39] <slashtommy> well, you did
[13:39] <slashtommy> i was busy drinking
[13:39] <airurando> groups should collect there CDs at a UH where possible.
[13:39] <airurando> aye you were!
[13:39] <airurando> :)
[13:40] <airurando> ebel is supposed to mail the list about the CDs
[13:42] <airurando> slashtommy: I got my network access bridge thingy worked out finally
[13:46] <slashtommy> good good
[13:52] <ebel> oh yeah
[13:52] <ebel> I'll do that this evening
[15:50] <BenChapman> slashtommy: enjoy your testing tomorrow :P
[21:03] <ebel> I think something is odd with the mailing list. It looks like I'm no longer a member and cannot post to the list
[21:08] <ebel> no, it turns out mailman is being silly
[21:08] <ebel> since I had the word "who" in it


[12:53] <\sh> morgen ogra
[12:53] <ogra> morning
[12:53] <\sh> time to go to bed
[12:53] <\sh> after a nice coding session between me and python/qt3
[12:54] <\sh> and hacking python-apt_pkg
[12:56] <herve> hi ogra !
[12:59] <ogra> hey herve
[12:59] <herve> how's Australia?
[01:03] <whip|udu> hey ogra are you here?
[01:04] <\sh> G'night all....have fun down under :)
[01:05] <ogra_> herve, nice
[01:05] <herve> \sh, night!
[01:05] <ogra_> herve, but crappy network :)
[01:06] <herve> I can see :-)
[01:15] <dholbach> hey
[01:15] <herve> hi Daniel!
[01:16] <dholbach> hey herve
[01:39] <dholbac1> re
[02:25] <herve> night all!
[02:51] <Amaranth> no matter what i do, with more than one package, i never get a diff.gz
[02:54] <thom> Amaranth: you're just ending up with a tar.gz and a .dsc?
[02:55] <Amaranth> and a changes file
[02:55] <thom> yeah, you've not got an orig.tar.gz, so you're building native packages rather than upstream ones
[02:55] <crimsun> if you intentionally built it without an .orig.tar.gz in .., you'll create a debian-native package
[02:56] <Amaranth> I have an orig.tar.gz
[02:56] <Amaranth> dh_make made that
[02:57] <thom> and what version number are you using?
[02:57] <Amaranth> I run dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot from ~/bittorrent-4.0.1/ and end up with bittorrent_4.0.1.orig.tar.gz, bittorrent_4.0.1ubuntu1_all.deb, bittorrent_4.0.1ubuntu1.dsc, bittorrent_4.0.1ubuntu1_i386.changes, and bittorrent_4.0.1ubuntu1.tar.gz in ~
[02:58] <thom> you've got a native version number
[02:58] <Amaranth> ?
[02:58] <thom> you need 4.0.1-1
[02:58] <thom> in your debian/changelog
[02:58] <Amaranth> *groan*
[02:58] <thom> the -1 being the debian version
[02:59] <Amaranth> 4.0.1-1ubuntu1?
[02:59] <thom> yeah
[03:00] <crimsun> except I don't think debian has v4, so you'd have to make it 4.0.1-0ubuntu1
[03:02] <Amaranth> dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
[03:02] <Amaranth> *headdesk*
[03:06] <Amaranth> yay, finally
[03:07] <Amaranth> now to watch lintian puke all over me
[03:08] <Amaranth> or not
[03:40] <fabbione> hey guys
[05:43] <nmorse> aby members of the XFCE team in here?
[05:44] <nmorse> any*
[05:44] <nmorse> Nevermind, I see one now
[05:45] <nmorse> Crimsun, are there any more themes for XFCE available at all?
[05:45] <nmorse> The ones I used on Debian Unstable and on Gentoo just aren't there
[05:46] <crimsun> nmorse: which one(s)?
[05:46] <nmorse> Aguelemon, Agua, stuff like that
[05:47] <nmorse> It occurs to me now in a moment of clarity they may be GTK themes from another WM
[05:48] <crimsun> hmm, afaik there're there
[05:49] <crimsun> http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_contents.pl?searchmode=filelist&word=xfwm4-themes&version=hoary&arch=all
[05:49] <crimsun> they're there, rather
[05:50] <nmorse> why don't they show up in the Settings > User Interface > Themes menu?
[05:51] <crimsun> they don't?
[05:52] <crimsun> I'm not in front of my Xfce install
[05:52] <nmorse> Just those preface by xfce- and those that came with GNOME
[05:53] <crimsun> file a bug in malone for it, the package is xfwm4-themes
[05:53] <crimsun> I'll look when I get home in a few hours
[05:53] <nmorse> the files are all listed in /usr/share/themes though
[05:53] <nmorse> I'll file the bug then
[05:54] <crimsun> is this on a fresh install of Hoary?
[05:54] <crimsun> or were you using os-works sources before?
[05:54] <nmorse> Fresh install of Hoary
[05:55] <nmorse> so file the bug in the Ubuntu Universe section?
[05:55] <crimsun> yep
[05:55] <crimsun> when I need more info (I will), I'll simply reply with the request
[05:55] <crimsun> gotta get back to work now
[06:17] <nmorse> crimsun, I think I figured out the problem
[06:18] <nmorse> The menu only shows themes in the gtk-2.0 style with gtkrc files
[06:18] <nmorse> the ones done with xfwm4 directories and themerc files don't show up
[09:05] <colombus> bonjour
[09:06] <colombus> hello world
[11:12] <dholbach> hey
[11:30] <siretart> hi folks
[11:36] <\sh> moins dholbach
[12:23] <ajmitch_> evening all
[01:15] <\sh> hey ajmitch, now at udu? :)
[01:17] <ajmitch_> in sydney
[01:17] <ajmitch_> at a friend's place
[01:18] <ajmitch_> will turn up at the hotel tomorrow :)
[01:35] <\sh> :)
[03:48] <herve> hi!
[04:05] <\sh> http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/11-Pynaptiq-A-Kynaptic-Replacement.html
[04:06] <\sh> played a bit more with pyqt and python-apt
[04:07] <ogra> \sh, wow, show that to riddell next wwek
[04:07] <herve> hey ogra!
[04:07] <ogra> hey herve...
[04:10] <\sh> ogra: :) it's far from complete :) only an hour of work..there is no documentation for python-apt so i had to hack it
[04:10] <ogra> \sh, which version did you use ?
[04:11] <\sh> ogra: the versions on hoary :)
[04:11] <\sh> but i used a different eric3 version ;)
[04:11] <\sh> the one in hoary doesn't work
[04:11] <ogra> \sh, you cant install anything with this version
[04:11] <ogra> \sh, the whole commit/update interface is still missing....says mvo
[04:13] <\sh> ogra: what about 0.6.x?
[04:13] <ogra> \sh, look at update managers source
[04:14] <ogra> \sh, there is a unstable tree (arch) with the start of commit/update/progress interface
[04:14] <\sh> well...
[04:14] <\sh> this is chaos
[04:14] <\sh> http://packages.debian.org/experimental/python/python-apt
[04:14] <\sh> this is on experimental
[04:14] <\sh> unstable is 0.5.4.x
[04:15] <ogra> \sh, totally outdated.... mvo will give me the arch url next week, i'll post it to you then...
[04:16] <\sh> txh
[04:16] <\sh> thx
[04:16] <ogra> \sh, or mail<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[04:16] <ogra> :)
[04:16] <\sh> but i don#t think that those functions are outdated in the next version which I used right now ;)
[04:16] <ogra> \sh, he likes the idea of someone working on it
[04:16] <\sh> ogra: he is standing next to you? ;)
[04:17] <ogra> \sh, lets do that lkater, its terrible late here and i only have some minutes left to talk to susus....
[04:17] <\sh> sure :) have fun and a good night...have to go and wash my clothes in troisdorf
[04:17] <susus> talk to me please ...
[04:17] <susus> ;o))
[04:27] <\sh> ;)
[07:43] <\sh> hmm
[07:43] <\sh> the universe packages, do they have all in the Section: universe/<group>?
[07:47] <herve> this is overridden in the pool
[07:48] <\sh> but from control file view, it should have it
[07:49] <herve> I never heard about it
[07:51] <\sh> well all universe packages have Section: universe/<package group> in the control
[07:51] <\sh> anyway..
[07:51] <herve> this is the effect of the override, isn't it?
[07:52] <\sh> no
[07:52] <\sh> oh yes
[07:52] <\sh> sorry
[07:52] <herve> :-)
[07:53] <\sh> and how can I determin a "meta package"
[07:54] <herve> there is an official list in debian
[07:55] <\sh> so there's no flag or something
[07:56] <herve> what do you want to do?
[07:56] <\sh> I'm playing with python-apt ;)
[07:56] <\sh> and I have to determine what are "normal" packages and "meta" packages, which are providing only deps and nothing else
[07:56] <\sh> http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/11-Pynaptiq-A-Kynaptic-Replacement.html
[07:57] <herve> ha ok
[07:57] <herve> I don't know of a flag
[07:58] <herve> but such packages only have files in /usr/share/doc/<package> ?
[07:58] <herve> but quite hard to check on 10.000+ packages :-)
[07:59] <\sh> no
[08:05] <zul> oi its quiet
[08:16] <herve> I may have found the cause of my locale issues with dia...
[08:16] <\sh> what was it?
[08:17] <herve> dia writing the PS file with some locale-aware printf function
[08:18] <\sh> uh
[08:20] <\sh> how can u get a workaround?
[08:21] <herve> one of the authors have commited his fixes
[08:21] <herve> I'm making dpatches of them
[08:25] <\sh> good :)
[08:31] <herve> I'm also fixing endianess issues
[08:42] <herve> \sh, ping
[08:44] <\sh> pong
[08:44] <herve> you already had to cope with gcc 4 build issues, as I remember?
[08:44] <\sh> a bit yes
[08:45] <herve> when the .c declares a static function but the .h don't say it's static
[08:46] <herve> how to know which one is right?
[08:46] <\sh> well...do what the .h says
[08:46] <herve> thanks
[08:47] <herve> that's what another patch for tla did too
[08:47] <herve> and the series of functions this one belongs too don't have any other "static"
[08:47] <\sh> well...I don't know if i'm correct, but .h is the declaration, and this must be true ;)
[08:47] <herve> my previous patch added it to the .h :-)
[08:49] <\sh> :)
[08:57] <\sh> hmm
[09:03] <\sh> herve: do u know something about qt?
[09:05] <herve> ask me about python but not qt :)
[09:06] <\sh> hehe
[09:06] <\sh> python+qt ;)
[09:06] <\sh> this is one of my question
[09:07] <\sh> or better python
[09:07] <\sh> i have one function..
[09:07] <\sh> it returns a global object instance
[09:07] <\sh> now I have a subclass of this object, with a couple of more functions
[09:07] <\sh> how can I make a type casting?
[09:08] <\sh> lets say: QWidget to QBla
[09:08] <\sh> QBla(QWidget) is wrong ;)
[09:08] <herve> hmm...
[09:08] <herve> let me experiment something
[09:08] <herve> python 2.4?
[09:09] <\sh> yepp
[09:09] <herve> I guess you wouldn't know if it uses the new object model?
[09:09] <\sh> well u know: c++: (QBla *)QWidget instance
[09:09] <Amaranth> Why would you have to cast?
[09:10] <Amaranth> If it supports the same API you should be fine.
[09:10] <\sh> ok..QBla is a inherit QWidget, so it's compatible..but I have a function which is returning QWidget only but I need the adds of QBla
[09:10] <Amaranth> o_O
[09:10] <Amaranth> How did you get in that mess? :)
[09:10] <\sh> well..qt
[09:11] <Amaranth> Someone in #python-gilliam was asking a similar question for the DOM, no one had an answer.
[09:11] <\sh> QWidget *QTabWidget.currentPage()
[09:11] <\sh> returns a qwidget
[09:11] <herve> \sh, that syntax isn't pythonic :-)
[09:11] <\sh> herve: yeah, this is c++ ;)
[09:11] <\sh> but i'm playing with pyqt ;)
[09:14] <herve> I don't see a hack to do so
[09:15] <herve> unless inheriting from your factory in turn and override that code :-)
[09:16] <Amaranth> herve: Do you by any chance use twisted? :)
[09:16] <herve> Amaranth, not yet, but it's too promising to ignore
[09:17] <\sh> hmmm....another idea...let me try
[09:17] <Amaranth> Well, that factory subclassing bit will come in handy. :)
[09:18] <herve> I remember some <instance>.__of__(class) syntax
[09:19] <herve> but it's a zope hack I guess
[09:20] <Amaranth> I spent an hour last night trying various hacks to make this work
[09:21] <herve> another idea may be to write a wrapper instead of a subclass
[09:21] <herve> that wrapper picks a QWidget
[09:21] <herve> and provides extra methods computed by calling the QWidget instance
[09:22] <Amaranth> w00t, got it
[09:22] <Amaranth> qwidgetinstance.__class__ = QBlah
[09:23] <Amaranth> As long as QBlah subclasses QWidget it should be fine
[09:24] <\sh> ahhh...let me try :)
[09:24] <herve> hu no :-)
[09:25] <herve> you need to patch __dict__ too
[09:25] <Amaranth> herve: That only works for old-style classes
[09:25] <herve> the name resolution is dynamic?
[09:26] <\sh> sip
[09:26] <\sh> but it's not working
[09:26] <herve> hey!
[09:26] <herve> Amaranth, it seems to work!
[09:26] <Amaranth> http://rafb.net/paste/results/Ojy0Fv32.html
[09:27] <herve> works with it without inheriting from object
[09:27] <herve> s/it/or
[09:28] <herve> ;)
[09:31] <Amaranth> http://rafb.net/paste/results/9OAyi817.html <--works too
[09:32] <herve> now do the same with C++ code :-)
[09:32] <Amaranth> ha
[09:33] <Amaranth> This is why I don't do C or C++. :)
[09:39] <\sh> but i have this one:
[09:39] <\sh> class foo: and class bar(foo):
[09:40] <herve> it's ok
[09:40] <\sh> and a class third: def __init__(self,instanceOfFoo).. def returnInstanceFoo(): return instanceOfFoo
[09:40] <herve> that's the case I tested
[09:41] <herve> you're using the wrapper or the subclass model?
[09:41] <\sh> subclass
[09:42] <herve> hmm...
[09:42] <herve> Amaranth,
[09:42] <herve> you sure the resolution is still dynamic with byte-code?
[09:42] <Amaranth> ?
[09:43] <Amaranth> You mean it doesn't work in a pyc?
[09:43] <\sh> thats right
[09:43] <herve> I wonder
[09:43] <herve> haven't tested
[10:07] <\sh> hehe
[10:07] <\sh> i worked around
[10:11] <herve> me too
[10:12] <herve> I have all the patches to make dia exports independant of the locale
[10:49] <\sh> nice...
[10:49] <\sh> working
[10:50] <herve> I am compiling dia to see if the patches are good :-)
[10:50] <herve> I saw lamont filed a bug in debian about dia not compiling with gcc 4.0
[10:50] <herve> the DD replied "heh, gcc 4 isn't even in debian!"
[11:01] <\sh> herve: u have a flashplayer?
[11:03] <herve> \sh, yes
[11:04] <\sh> herve...ok stay here don't run away
[11:04] <herve> :-)
[11:06] <\sh> ok..just finished ;) publishing
[11:07] <\sh> http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/12-More-from-Pynaptiq.html
[11:08] <herve> nice video :-)
[11:09] <\sh> yeah :)
[11:09] <\sh> vnc2swf:)
[11:10] <\sh> and I found another bug in the package...have to patch it, and rebuild it for breezy
[11:10] <herve> woohoo! dia now ROCKS!
[11:12] <\sh> well...we're working while the others shaking their balls ;)
[11:34] <herve> I guess we have no kind uploader here?
[11:46] <\sh> sureley not
[11:46] <\sh> hmmm
[11:46] <\sh> thinking about a qtbittorrent client ;)
[11:47] <ajmitch_> morning all
[11:47] <crimsun> herve: sure, url?
[11:47] <crimsun> morning ajmitch_
[11:48] <\sh> oh :)
[11:48] <\sh> a couple of packages have to be uploaded and/or reviewed ;)
[11:50] <herve> crimsun, http://deb.oursours.net/motu/pending
[11:50] <herve> morning ajmitch
[11:50] <crimsun> herve: k
[11:50] <herve> thanks in advance
[11:51] <crimsun> herve: (need source.changes, too)
[11:52] <crimsun> (unless you wanted me to pbuild them?)
[11:53] <herve> I'll upload them
[11:53] <crimsun> thanks
[11:53] <herve> you'll upload them straight, without review,
[11:53] <herve> ?
[11:53] <crimsun> I'll review them in a bit if you'd like review
[11:53] <crimsun> (I only saw a request for an uploader)
[11:53] <herve> I was used to it with dholbach :-)
[11:54] <herve> changes uploaded
[11:56] <crimsun> ah, I guess I'll have to pbuild regardless, because you uploaded i386.changes :)
[11:56] <herve> argh...
[11:56] <crimsun> unless you built using pdebuild, in which case the source.changes will be in ../
[11:57] <herve> uploaded


[11:37] <robjh> the last time i used ubuntu touch, it was a canonical thing on a meizu mx4. that phone no longer boots and when i bought a replacement, i found that i couldnt unlock the bootloader to flash ubports onto it. So now i have a pinephone, and ubports was the first thing i put on it and ... youve removed scopes?!
[11:39] <robjh> scopes were a great idea, i dont know what you were thinking
[11:48] <Phruis`> robjh, what scope did you like to use?
[11:48] <robjh> Phruis`, I liked the news one as a homescreen, and the music one
[11:50] <Phruis`> ahh i see.  I will see if I can help with that when i get back home.
[11:53] <robjh> i'm interested to see what you'll do now xD
[12:31] <robjh> does the music app play audio by itsself or does it leverage a system service to do it? I'm browsing the source tree but im not seeing the relevent part; https://gitlab.com/ubports/apps/music-app/-/tree/master/
[12:32] <robjh> i imagine is has to be using a system service because all i see here is javascript
[12:40] <robjh> if it isnt, i want to know how it works. and if it is, i want to see the service's api :)
[14:11] <robjh> does the dialer app support sip? i see an option in the settings to add an online account, but it is greyed out?


[03:18] <zippydo> I have a usb grabber based on the CX23012 chipset and is not been recognised. CX23012 is supported but I guess the device Id is the issue. Do I need to compile a custom kernel module to get it to work
[03:45] <Decorater> did you try unplugging it and plugging it back in?
[03:45] <Decorater> sometimes I have to do that even in Windows.
[03:45] <tsimonq2> !support
[09:18] <zippydo> hi I have a usb grabber with chip cx23102. I checked the linuxtv wiki and my device type is not listed under the cx2310x driver page. Can anyone help on getting my device to recognised by this driver. I am guessing I will need to configure and compile the driver for the particular device, but notsure where to start


[17:50] <phillip> hi, what should I do to get #ubuntu-translators-de deleted? Its an old channel that is not in use anymore.
[17:57] <Pici> phillip: I can request to have it closed.  Do you know who owns it currently?
[17:57] <phillip> Pici: no
[17:58] <phillip> and would be good if you can do that
[18:00] <phillip> thanks
[18:02] <Pici> phillip: I'll take a look.  Is there another channel that replaced this?
[18:02] <phillip> yes, #ubuntu-de-l10n
[18:03] <Pici> phillip: good. I'll set it up to forward to that location.
[18:05] <phillip> great, thanks a lot Pici!
[18:05] <Pici> np :)