[07:18] <mlankhorst> Hello, world!\n
[09:05] <Laney> morning!
[09:20] <sil2100> Morning Laney !
[09:23] <Mirv> is anyone else having problems with trusty + pulseaudio ~today?
[09:24] <sil2100> Mirv: let me upgrade to the todays version and I'll give you a sign
[09:25] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[09:25] <mlankhorst> hey
[09:25] <seb128> hey sil2100 Mirv didrocks Laney
[09:25] <sil2100> seb128: hi! Not sure if you saw, but I released libdbusmenu yesterday and it's in unapproved now
[09:25] <didrocks> salut seb128!
[09:25] <sil2100> Hi everyone!
[09:26] <seb128> sil2100, I noticed, thanks!
[09:26] <Mirv> hey seb128
[09:27] <Laney> hallo
[09:54] <jpds> Who changed indicator-datetime so that the calendar remembers where one left it off instead of reseting to today's month when one clicks on it?
[09:55] <jpds> There's no "Go to today" button either.
[09:59] <seb128> jpds, nobody, it's a bug not a wanted change
[09:59] <seb128> charles knowns about it
[10:53] <sil2100> didrocks: are you ready for some packaging ACKs? ;)
[10:54] <didrocks> sil2100: more than ready!
[10:54] <seb128> Laney, can  dmz-cursor-theme be synced?
[10:55] <Laney> Didn't we change the alternate priority?
[10:55] <Laney> (yes)
[10:55] <Laney> Ignore that merge
[10:55] <seb128> Laney, you changed it in debian as well, but you lowered there when you bumped on our side, so I'm unsure (I've been too lazy to check why those are differentà
[10:55] <Laney> We use a different cursor theme to them
[10:55] <sil2100> didrocks: actually, those changes are made by pitti, so I guess they're 'ACKed by core-dev' already, but anyway some additional eyeballs won't hurt:
[10:55] <Laney> remember the bug where it changed last cycle?
[10:55] <sil2100> http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8080/job/cu2d-phone-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_dialer-app_0.1+14.04.20131104.1-0ubuntu1.diff
[10:55] <didrocks> sil2100: yeah ;)
[10:55] <sil2100> http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8080/job/cu2d-phone-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_messaging-app_0.1+14.04.20131104-0ubuntu1.diff
[10:56] <Laney> https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html ← I added a comment there last week or so, ignore that merge
[10:56] <seb128> Laney, yeah, that rings a bell, I'm unsure about the details (not really interested either, I'm just going through the red lines on versions ...;-)
[10:56] <didrocks> sil2100: if they are made by pitti, you have your implicit +1 ;)
[10:56] <seb128> Laney, ok
[10:56] <sil2100> ;p
[10:56] <Laney> will pick up versions / my merges in a minute after doing some MPs
[10:57] <seb128> ok
[10:57] <didrocks> sil2100: once published, think about pinging upstream :)
[10:57] <pitti> didrocks, sil2100: mostly testing changes, so not *that* urgent to upload, but +1 on the packaging changes from me (although I shouldn't count here :) )
[10:57] <sil2100> didrocks: of course!
[10:57] <pitti> but I'm really happy that these tests landed at last
[10:57] <sil2100> pitti: ;)
[10:58] <seb128> happyaron, hey, do you plan to merge the new ibus from Debian now that the t-cycle started?
[10:58] <seb128> happyaron, they have .4 and we are still on .3
[11:00] <happyaron> seb128: I plan to merge it soon, I'm triaging existing bugs since yesterday.
[11:01] <seb128> happyaron, ok, great, thanks
[12:17] <seb128> Laney, do you have an opinion on updating webkit? the s-c issue that was flagged as blocker seems like it's not specific to the new version (it's already ranking high on e.u.c)
[12:18] <Laney> seb128: I've got it on my list to test stuff against the new one
[12:18] <Laney> seems reasonable to do
[12:18] <Laney> is that bug forwarded?
[12:18] <seb128> Laney, I just noticed I still had the candidate build installed from since before saucy
[12:19] <seb128> Laney, yes, I did it last week
[12:19] <Laney> nice, can't be that bad then
[12:19] <seb128> @candidate build: didn't notice any issue during this time
[12:19] <meetingology> seb128: Error: "candidate" is not a valid command.
[12:19] <seb128> yeah, seems alright
[12:19] <seb128> Laney, do you want to handle it or should I?
[12:20] <seb128> do you want a test round in the desktop ppa before upload or should we just go with it?
[12:20] <Laney> I can do
[12:20] <seb128> thanks
[12:20] <Laney> will do a test build in canonical-arm-dev at least
[12:20] <seb128> good idea
[12:20] <Laney> not sure about the aarch64 patch
[12:20] <Laney> but we'll see
[12:20] <seb128> it built on arm for debian so it's probably ok, but still good to test
[12:21] <Laney> oh that looks super simple
[12:22] <Laney> seb128: can you link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1163886 to the upstream bug?
[12:22] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1163886 in webkit (Ubuntu) "software-center crashed with signal 5 with WebKit 2.0+" [Critical,Confirmed]
[12:23] <seb128> Laney, oh, I used https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1211887
[12:23] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1211887 in software-center (Ubuntu) "software-center crashed with signal 5 in _XReadEvents()" [High,Confirmed]
[12:23] <seb128> Laney, not sure if we should dup, that might lead to lp timeouts
[12:23] <Laney> mmm
[12:23] <Laney> let's link both
[12:23] <seb128> Laney, the one I used is the one e.u.c is listing
[12:24] <seb128> Laney, yeah, that might be easier
[12:25] <seb128> Laney, E'No commit message was specified in the merge proposal.' ;-)
[12:26] <Laney> bah
[12:26] <Laney> done
[12:26] <seb128> Laney, thanks ;-)
[12:27] <seb128> Laney, what is "full country"?
[12:27] <Laney> like "United States" instead of "US"
[12:28] <seb128> hum
[12:28] <Laney> ideally that would be translated
[12:28] <seb128> I've no strong opinion on either, as long as the extra verbose isn't putting the string off screen
[12:29] <Laney> mmm
[12:29]  * seb128 get the new lib to test
[12:29] <Laney> It seemed alright on desktop but I'm not sure about the geometry
[12:29] <seb128> well, it's easy enough to change during the cycle if it turns out to be an issue
[12:29] <Laney> Like, some stuff does overflow but they are still usable AFAICT
[12:30] <Laney> could maybe do something smarter there
[12:30] <Laney> fall back to the shorter one or something
[12:30] <seb128> well, let's first see if that's an issue in practice
[12:31] <Laney> ya
[12:31] <seb128> but I somewhat wish the toolkit would be doing something smart about listitems where the label doesn't fit in the entry
[12:31] <seb128> like scroll when you press the entry and keep your finger on it
[12:34] <darkxst> Laney, seb128: Hi
[12:34] <Laney> hey
[12:35] <seb128> hey
[12:35] <Laney> how's it going?
[12:35] <darkxst> yeh good, just got back from a big long weekend of riding
[12:35] <Laney> nice
[12:35] <seb128> you people and your bikes ;-)
[12:35]  * Laney got some new climbing shoes yesterday
[12:36] <darkxst> seb128, bikes are good!
[12:36]  * darkxst needs to actually go climbing again sometime! been MTB'ing too much
[12:36] <seb128> yeah, I guess they are ... I just find it boring biking for days ;-)
[12:36] <darkxst> seb128, have you ever been Mountain Biking?
[12:36] <seb128> no
[12:36] <seb128> just road biking mostly
[12:37] <darkxst> its a whole different sport ;)
[12:38] <darkxst> Laney, did you try build gjs on debian ppc?
[12:38] <Laney> A bit, then I got stuck in build system blah
[12:38] <Laney> because I had to build mozjs and something else
[12:38] <Laney> then make configure use the local ones
[12:39] <Laney> then it failed to link because of some symbol issue
[12:39] <Laney> and then my plane got called :P
[12:39] <darkxst> I see
[12:39] <Laney> will try again soon
[12:40] <darkxst> I though I saw an email re mozjs 17 landing in debian over the weekend?
[12:40] <Laney> maybe so
[12:40] <Laney> this was friday
[12:40] <Laney> there was gobject-introspection too
[12:40] <Laney> which is also now in experimental!
[12:41] <Laney> those guys :-)
[12:41] <seb128> Laney, I marked your tz change needsfixing, let me know what you think
[12:41] <Laney> k
[12:42] <Laney> so rank by city, state, country?
[12:42] <Laney> I think that should be easy
[12:42] <seb128> that would be my preference
[12:42] <seb128> well, at least "new york" should list new york city at the top of the list
[12:42] <seb128> not in the middle of the lists of that state
[12:43] <seb128> Laney, I'm not even sure if we want to include the state in the search?
[12:44] <Laney> well, the alternative is to only list it if the city is a duplicate
[12:44] <seb128> well, having it on the UI is fine
[12:44] <Laney> oh I see what you mean
[12:44] <Laney> that would be possible
[12:44] <seb128> but can we have the filter to only act on the city and country strings?
[12:45] <seb128> that would avoid having "new york" in the entry leading to list all the cities in the state
[12:49] <darkxst> Laney, are you able to get a backtrace of the gjs ppc failure? 90% sure it will be a seg fault
[12:49] <darkxst> ^test failure
[12:49] <Laney> yeah, give me a minute
[12:53] <Laney> seb128: try that
[12:53] <Laney> not sure if it'll be confusing that the search acts on different text to what's displayed
[12:54] <Laney> also it probably doesn't sort exactly how you want, could fix that by reimplementing sorting somehow
[12:54] <seb128> Laney, our GNOME ui does "City (State, Country)" and only matches on the City
[12:54] <seb128> Laney, but I guess that's a question for mpt
[12:54] <Laney> one way would be to use the population
[12:54] <Laney> which we have
[12:54] <seb128> isn't indicator-datetime doing that?
[12:55] <Laney> dunno
[12:58] <seb128> Laney, ok, that version works fine for me, let's get that in ... we can always adapt later with feedback from design/users if needed
[12:58] <Laney> cool, thanks
[12:59] <Laney> would be nice to get a release of u-s-s at some point
[12:59] <Laney> are dailies ever going to be re-enabled?
[13:01] <seb128> not sure how the workflow is going to change and when
[13:01] <seb128> the plan is to use bugs for tracking features landing and make easier to land bug fixes again, but not sure how we get there
[13:02] <Laney> mmm
[13:02] <seb128> sil2100, Mirv, didrocks: what do we need to do if we want an ubuntu-system-settings landing? use the gdoc to ask for landing still?
[13:02] <didrocks> seb128: for now, yeah
[13:02] <seb128> didrocks, ok, thanks
[13:02] <didrocks> thanks to you :)
[13:03] <seb128> ;-)
[13:03] <seb128> Laney, I'm going to do that today
[13:03] <Laney> cool, thanks
[13:03] <seb128> need to test trunk on the device first though
[13:03] <didrocks> pleaseeee ;)
[13:04] <didrocks> seb128: we'll just fast-track it, if it's in the daily-build ppa, you can publish it yourself
[13:04] <didrocks> (just mention it in the spreadsheet so that we can know what's in)
[13:07] <seb128> didrocks, great, thank you
[13:15] <Laney> darkxst: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6364570/
[13:16] <Laney> installed tests faiiiiiiiillllllllllll
[13:17] <Laney> actually I bet I ran it wrong
[13:21] <jdstrand> seb128: hey, so I get a reliable crash in unity-panel-service, but when I click 'Send an error report to help fix this problem' is checked and I click 'Continue', it seems to upload it, but I don't have a way to report the bug in lp. am I missing something?
[13:21] <jdstrand> seb128: this is on trusty btw
[13:21] <seb128> jdstrand, we turn apport off before release, you are reporting to whoopsie
[13:22] <jdstrand> /etc/default/apport has enabled=1
[13:22] <seb128> jdstrand, right, pitti said some other file is to edit nowadays
[13:22] <seb128> Laney, pitti: ^ what file was it again? (that's confusing, why did we change it from using the default config?)
[13:22] <Laney> apport is on
[13:22] <Laney> you just have to tell it /where/ to report to
[13:23] <Laney> comment out problem_types in /etc/apport/crashdb.conf
[13:23] <seb128> that's the confusing bit ;-)
[13:23] <Laney> I thought we were supposed to be fixing people who want to report their bugs to launchpad
[13:23] <seb128> jdstrand, ^ edit that file (not sure in which way though)
[13:23] <jdstrand> me either
[13:24] <jdstrand> why isn't it already edited for trusty?
[13:24] <seb128> because we just started and nobody turned it on
[13:24] <jdstrand> databases = {
[13:24] <jdstrand>     'ubuntu': {
[13:24] <jdstrand>         'problem_types': ['Bug', 'Package'],
[13:24] <jdstrand> that should be changed to what?
[13:24] <Laney> comment out or delete it
[13:24] <seb128> I'm also wondering if we still benefit from launchpad reporting... looking to bug backlog after saucy, there is lot of noise, and we look mostly at e.u.c
[13:26] <jdstrand> seb128: are you saying I should not report the bug?
[13:26] <seb128> jdstrand, no, it's fine, you are likely to follow up on questions etc
[13:27] <seb128> jdstrand, but most of the bugs turn out to not be useful, so I'm not sure having it turned on by default makes sense
[13:27] <darkxst> Laney, running lt-jsunit directly should be ok
[13:27] <Laney> darkxst: You have to set GJS_USE_UNINSTALLED_FILES
[13:27] <pitti> Laney, seb128, jdstrand: /e/d/apport is now always enabled=1, we edit /etc/apport/crashdb.conf to disable uploading crashes to LP
[13:28] <seb128> jdstrand, btw I suspect your report might turn out to be https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ido/+bug/1246536 but the stacktrace should tell for sure
[13:28] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1246536 in ido (Ubuntu) "segfault in menu_hidden()" [High,In progress]
[13:28] <Laney> darkxst: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6364646/
[13:28] <Laney> how do I make it give more useful output?
[13:28] <Laney> backtrace is not useful
[13:28] <Laney> hmm, maybe it is actually
[13:29] <Laney> darkxst: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6364651/
[13:29] <jdstrand> seb128: it probably is. it is the second time I launch rhythmbox from the sound indicator. then I get unity-panel-ser[4688]: segfault at 5c ip 00007fd78341e1f4 sp 00007fff62272aa0 error 4 in libido3-0.1.so.0.0.0[7fd783411000+21000]
[13:29] <seb128> sil2100, Mirv, cyphermox: can we get current ido trunk published to trusty? (we already have a SRU to saucy) ... that's not impacting touch since ido is desktop specific, so it should be safe
[13:30]  * Laney shrugs
[13:30] <seb128> jdstrand, yeah, same issue, ^ should fix it
[13:30] <darkxst> Laney, that is not helpful ;(
[13:30] <Laney> yeah ...
[13:30] <seb128> sil2100, Mirv, cyphermox: I could pocket copy the SRU but then you guys are going to complain about the changelog not being commited back to your trunk ;-)
[13:30] <jdstrand> seb128: seems errors.ubuntu.com doesn't have 14.04 yet...
[13:31] <Laney> "oh hey, something failed"
[13:31] <sil2100> seb128: let me check the commit and try doing that ;)
[13:31] <seb128> jdstrand, hum, not sure how that's set up, I guess that's a question for ev
[13:31] <seb128> sil2100, thanks
[13:32] <darkxst> Laney, installed-tests framework was all new for this version
[13:33] <darkxst> can you try run a gjs program against the build (like gnome-documents or gnome-weather or something)
[13:33] <Laney> not really
[13:34] <Mirv> seb128: you're correct, thanks for asking us to do the release :)
[13:34] <Mirv> sil2100: sou you're handing ido?
[13:35] <sil2100> Mirv: yep
[13:35] <sil2100> seb128: looking good, as soon as the indicator stack finishes I'll get it released
[13:36] <darkxst> Laney, try build with --disable-installed-tests, then run gdb on lt-jsunit again?
[13:36] <seb128> sil2100, thanks
[13:39] <Laney> darkxst: same
[13:40] <Laney> also libtool --mode=execute gdb jsunit is the approved™ way to do that
[13:43] <darkxst> same as in it fails of read_all_dir from first trace
[13:43] <darkxst> ?
[13:43] <Laney> no, the second pastebin
[13:45] <Laney> although weirdly it does fail in the same way without GJS_USE_UNINSTALLED_FILES=1 (in read_all_dir_sorted)
[13:47] <Laney> that's probably a red herring though
[13:47] <Laney> make check DTRT
[13:49] <jdstrand> seb128: fyi, I filed a bug, I'll let the retrace handle it, but the fix in your bug seems to fix mine
[13:50]  * jdstrand will keep an eye on both
[13:50] <seb128> jdstrand, ok, thanks, let me know how it goes
[13:50] <darkxst> Laney, huh? make check passes?
[13:52] <Laney> no
[13:52] <Laney> it does the right thing with the installed tests stuff
[13:55] <Laney> darkxst: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6364646/ had the most information, but that's not very much
[13:55] <Laney> if you know how to make gjs/mozjs show more stuff then let me know
[14:04] <darkxst> Laney, will get back to you tomorrow, too tired now ;)
[14:05] <Laney> basically the test runs the simplest js program, and that fails
[14:05] <Laney> so the problem is quite fundamental :-)
[14:06] <darkxst> Laney, yes, I do wonder if its a regression in the new testing framework
[14:06] <Laney> nah
[14:06] <Laney> I get it if I run gjs-console manually on the file
[14:06] <darkxst> hmm ok
[14:07] <Laney> wait
[14:08] <darkxst> normally there is more info when JS_EvaluateScript fails, but I do run debug builds of mozjs, not sure if that makes a difference
[14:08] <darkxst> but really gotta go, will follow up tomorrow ;)
[14:12] <seb128> darkxst, can you upstream your g-s-d suggested fix for that segfault btw?
[15:12] <sil2100> seb128: the ido thing will have to wait an hour or so if you don't mind, as we had a blocker in our stacks and all will be unblocked only in some nearest time
[15:12] <seb128> sil2100, ok, thanks for letting me know
[15:22] <seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, mlankhorst, Laney, tkamppeter, desrt, attente, larsu: the meeting is in 10min (just a reminder since the time changed with DST)
[15:22] <Laney> muhahaha, just back from lunch in time
[15:22] <seb128> Laney, start writing your week summary then ;-)
[15:22] <desrt> seb128: weird!!
[15:23] <Laney> hung around with some strange guys in oakland, done
[15:23] <kenvandine> ?
[15:23] <seb128> desrt, hey, had a good trip back?
[15:23] <seb128> Laney, hehe
[15:23] <desrt> yup
[15:23] <seb128> kenvandine, !
[15:23] <desrt> took a very-much-needed swap day yesterday
[15:23] <desrt> did laundry all day :)
[15:23] <seb128> desrt, nice, I though you would be swapping today as well
[15:23] <seb128> haha
[15:23] <seb128> desrt, did you get your washing machine back? ;-)
[15:23] <desrt> seb128: meh.  i may not be at the peak of my productivity but i have work to do
[15:24] <kenvandine> i was confused... i thought since the meeting was UTC it would be an hour later for me
[15:24] <desrt> so i'd rather get some of it out of the way
[15:24] <seb128> k
[15:24]  * kenvandine still has a mild fever :)
[15:24] <kenvandine> a little fuzzy here :-p
[15:24] <seb128> kenvandine, winter time is one hour closer from UTC
[15:24] <mlankhorst> hey
[15:24] <seb128> e.g for Europe summer time is +2, winter +1
[15:24] <kenvandine> yeah, i did change my clock back an hour... but still was thinking it was an hour later
[15:24] <desrt> kenvandine: the meeting is at a fixed point in (UTC) space.  your clock moved backwards.  therefore your clock has a lower number at the time of the meeting.
[15:25] <Laney> gcal got it right for me
[15:25] <desrt> ie: it's earlier
[15:25] <kenvandine> desrt, yeah yeah... i know... just confused myself earlier when i read the email
[15:25] <Laney> indicator-datetime too :qualitycode:
[15:25] <desrt> you're still reading mails?
[15:25] <desrt> that's your problem!
[15:25] <kenvandine> haha
[15:25]  * desrt just assumes seb will tell him if anything important is about to happen
[15:25] <kenvandine> hey, friday i was at inbox unread 0!
[15:26] <qengho> seb128: I was wrong about that SIGSYS stack overflow bug being fixed in yesterday's release. I was thinking of another bug when I answered.  I put SIGSYS fix in a PPA to get testers, not the security release, but it will be in the next release, which should be end of this week.  Cr31 is due then.
[15:26]  * desrt only has 43 this morning
[15:26] <kenvandine> first time in ages...
[15:26] <Laney> Mark all as read is a great feature
[15:26] <kenvandine> that's cheating :)
[15:26] <seb128> qengho, ok, thanks, shame that it didn't make it this one seeing the number of users hiting it:/
[15:30] <seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, mlankhorst, Laney, tkamppeter, desrt, attente, larsu: hey, it's meeting time!
[15:30] <seb128> I hope everybody travelled back without issue
[15:30] <seb128> lets get started
[15:30] <seb128> qengho, hey
[15:30] <qengho> Hi hi.
[15:30] <qengho> - done: sprint; Cr release 30.0.1599.114.
[15:30] <qengho> - todo: preparing for chromium-browser v31 release.
[15:30] <qengho> - todo: starting work to get multitouch gestures working in chromium-browser. Just acquired APPL (shudder!) touchpad thing to test.
[15:30] <qengho> EOL
[15:31] <seb128> qengho, thanks, good work getting the update one, I'm looking forward the next one with that segfault fix included ;-)
[15:31] <qengho> :(  Me too.
[15:31] <seb128> Sweetshark, there or not? (he emailed earlier saying he was fighting ubuflu and might not be there)
[15:31] <qengho> Also, a tab-text disappearing bug.
[15:31] <qengho> Two big ones.
[15:32] <seb128> great
[15:32] <seb128> no Sweetshark I guess
[15:32] <seb128> mlankhorst, hey
[15:32] <mlankhorst> glamor-egl bugfixing, sru'ing some of it back to saucy. Working on converting android syncpoint to get my own code closer to upstream kernel.
[15:32] <seb128> what is glamor-egl?
[15:33] <mlankhorst> it's used to enable radeonsi support
[15:33] <mlankhorst> a xorg ddx driver based on egl
[15:33] <seb128> ok
[15:33] <seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
[15:33] <seb128> Laney, hey
[15:34] <Laney> one sec
[15:34]  * desrt finishes a 'transaction'
[15:34] <Laney> • Short week; travelling Friday & off Monday but some of this covers the previous week too
[15:34] <Laney> • Take care of a lot of outstanding merges, still a lot to do :(
[15:34] <Laney> • Some desktop updates / sponsoring:
[15:34] <Laney> ∘ Rhythmbox 3.0
[15:34] <Laney> ‣ Tweak rhythmbox-ubuntuone to work with the py3 peas loader
[15:34] <Laney> ∘ vala 0.22
[15:34] <Laney> ∘ gmime
[15:34] <Laney> ∘ gjs (fails on ppc; debugging with Tim a little bit)
[15:35] <Laney> ∘ p11-kit
[15:35] <Laney> • Some users/upstream developers pinged me for help with a texlive issue - dig out a patch and SRU it for them. Failed on ppc; sent back to them for a fix.
[15:35] <Laney> • Tracked packages where trusty < saucy and copied as appropriate
[15:35] <Laney> • Help a bit with sponsoring (queue is huge, please give 30 minutes to it if you can)
[15:35] <Laney> • Some u-s-s fixes
[15:35] <Laney> ∘ Parse click package desktop files to get metadata for Storage subpanel
[15:35] <Laney> ∘ Add API to libtimezonemap to get more data for manual timedatescreen (hereafter known as The Springfield Problem)
[15:35] <Laney> • Ping upstream to get gnome-desktop-testing to exit with a bad exit code on failure(!) & upload this
[15:35] <Laney> • g-c-c bugfixing & more g-s-d keygrabber iterations (still needs re-SRUing to 13.10)
[15:35] <Laney> • Sprint: discussions around the LTS desktop & u-s-s testing; should be good
[15:35] <Laney> • TODO: vUDS planning, webkitgtk update, moar merges
[15:36] <desrt> what?  that's it?
[15:36]  * desrt whips Laney to work harder
[15:36] <seb128> Laney, rhythmbox-ubuntuone? isn't that deprecated?
[15:36] <Laney> we didn't have a meeting last week :P
[15:36] <Laney> haha
[15:36] <Laney> I think it does something like auto-import songs you buy?
[15:36] <desrt> larsu: you used this...
[15:37] <Laney> the webview thing is gone
[15:37] <Laney> but there is still certainly something there
[15:37] <attente> Laney, what's the keygraber stuff you're working on?
[15:37] <larsu> desrt: I used to, yes
[15:37] <Laney> attente: starting it in all sessions, should be fixed in T now
[15:37] <larsu> desrt: stopped after it wasn't supported anymore and crashed rb regularily
[15:37] <Laney> for media keys
[15:37] <attente> oh right
[15:37] <Laney> shouldn't interfere with your stuff
[15:38] <seb128> attente, it's the patch that makes g-s-d not grab keys under gnome-shell (since they do it there)
[15:39] <seb128> Laney, not sure about autoimport, I though that the sync daemon would sync files and that rb would watch the directory simply, but I didn't look into it
[15:39] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[15:39] <seb128> tkamppeter, hey
[15:39] <tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Released 1.0.41 with framework for PPD-/configuration-less printing on mobile devices. cups-browsed automatically creates queues for IPP printers with known page description languages which advertise thenmselves vis Bonjour.
[15:39] <tkamppeter> - cups: Final 1.7.0 release.
[15:39] <tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Review of contributed patch to improve bannertopdf
[15:39] <tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Investigated whether foomatic-rip can be merged into cups-filters after the GSoC changes
[15:39] <tkamppeter> - cups-filters, ghostscript: Applied contributed bug fixes.
[15:39] <tkamppeter> - Bugs.
[15:41] <seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
[15:41] <seb128> desrt, hey
[15:41] <desrt> hey
[15:41] <desrt> just lots of bugfixing
[15:41] <desrt> mostly gsettings
[15:41] <desrt> wrote a new markup parser for rewriting the glib-compile-schemas to fix a lot of more difficult gsettings bugs
[15:42] <desrt> (end)
[15:42] <Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/rhythmbox-ubuntuone/trunk/view/head:/ubuntuone/ubuntuone.py
[15:43] <seb128> desrt, thanks
[15:43] <seb128> attente, hey
[15:43] <attente> seb128, hi
[15:44] <Laney> * played super hexagon
[15:44] <Laney> * eow
[15:44] <larsu> lol
[15:44] <attente> fixes for gnome-screensaver, i-keyboard, maliit settings
[15:44] <attente> lol
[15:44] <attente> writing the unity key grabber right now
[15:45] <attente> (trying to at least...)
[15:45] <seb128> attente, oh, you are doing the work for the unity guys? didn't they say they would do it?
[15:45] <Laney> for?
[15:45] <seb128> Laney, ?
[15:45] <Laney> [what's that] for?
[15:45]  * Laney brevity
[15:45] <seb128> Laney, my understand was that brandon would write the unity side of those changes
[15:45] <attente> the keygrabber for moving the input-source switching into the unity shell
[15:46] <seb128> understanding
[15:46] <seb128> oh
[15:46] <Laney> oh, that, cool
[15:46] <seb128> Laney, do you ask what that's about? basically doing what gnome-shell is doing
[15:46] <Laney> yeah
[15:46] <seb128> the grabbing in the shell
[15:46] <seb128> then talking to g-s-d via dbus
[15:46] <Laney> I was wondering for which bit of functionality
[15:46] <seb128> same as gnome-shell
[15:47] <attente> since we have the legacy key grabber, we want to move away from that
[15:47] <attente> otherwise these keyboard shortcut bugs are not going away :(
[15:47] <larsu> attente: ah, will that fix the problem of many things in the session registering global grabs?
[15:47] <seb128> attente, thanks for working on that, but feel free to bounce that part to bregma's team, they said they would do it
[15:48] <attente> larsu, i think so
[15:48] <attente> i *hope* so
[15:48] <attente> seb128, will do
[15:48] <larsu> attente: cool! Did you tell the unity8 guys about this as well?
[15:48] <attente> larsu, no, i'm not sure what they're doing on their end
[15:48] <seb128> larsu, we don't have g-s-d in unity8 session, so we don't have any key grabbing there atm ... I'm not even sure what input stack we have (the android one afaik)
[15:49] <seb128> that's something we need to discuss/get done at some point
[15:49] <seb128> but I didn't see it on the roadmap yet
[15:49] <larsu> yes, I just wanted to make sure it's on their radar
[15:49] <seb128> the current focus is on touch interactions
[15:49] <larsu> of course
[15:49] <seb128> right, we should check with them
[15:49]  * seb128 makes note to do that
[15:49] <seb128> attente, thanks
[15:49] <larsu> seb128: thanks :)
[15:49] <seb128> larsu, yw
[15:50] <seb128> larsu, your turn ;-)
[15:50] <attente> thanks seb128!
[15:50] <larsu> okay
[15:50] <larsu> - fixed indicators and unity-panel-service to be less verbose in the logs (fixed criticals and removed unnecessary warnings)
[15:50] <larsu> - triaged all indicator-sound bugs and fixed some of them
[15:50] <larsu> eof
[15:50] <larsu> - reviewed a couple of desrt's gsettings patches
[15:50] <larsu> - stopped unity-guys from killing notify-osd from their upstart script
[15:50] <larsu> - started porting gtk 3.8 patches to 3.10; the biggest one (custom menu items) is done; looks like we can drop a couple of other patches
[15:50] <seb128> lol
[15:51] <seb128> larsu, "eof" doesn't goes in middle of summaries :p
[15:51] <larsu> mh?
[15:51] <seb128> larsu, you have 2 items, eof, and 3 items (or my IRC client is acting weird)
[15:52] <seb128> anyway
[15:52] <seb128> larsu, thanks ;-)
[15:52] <seb128> ok, my turn
[15:52] <attente> i see it too...
[15:52] <larsu> seb128: must be your irc client (it looks right on mine, and I typed it _after_ pasting the summary)
[15:52] <larsu> well, maybe it's my irc client then
[15:52] <attente> larsu, we're using the same irc client :P
[15:52] <Laney> nah, your irc client probably buffered the others and inserted that one right away
[15:52] <seb128> larsu, I think irssi in screen acts weirdly when you paste and type then
[15:52] <larsu> ah okay
[15:52] <seb128> like it buffers the copy
[15:53] <larsu> I'll paste the eof with the payload next time ;)
[15:53] <seb128> and you end up with the eof going before the buffer is flushed
[15:53] <seb128> ;-)
[15:53]  * larsu always messes something up at the meeting :(
[15:53]  * seb128 hugs larsu
[15:53] <seb128> ok, my turn
[15:53] <seb128> * discussed desktop LTS TODO with different people (bugs backlog, what to do with GNOME updates, what to do with new GNOME apps where style doesn't fit Unity), need to follow up on list with a summary, but basically:
[15:53] <seb128> - stay on GNOME 3.8
[15:53] <seb128> - bring "classic" menus to some apps (evince, nautilus, rhythmbox), upstream the patches as well (e.g basically use a menubar for "classic desktop" (e.g everything but gnome-shell))
[15:53] <seb128> - look at gtk headerbars to see if we can make those fit in Unity (e.g show decorations from the WM, hide "X")
[15:53] <seb128> - look at how difficult updating gtk would be
[15:53] <seb128> .
[15:53] <seb128> * ubuntu-system-settings:
[15:53] <seb128> - some good discussions about work for next cycle and testing
[15:53] <seb128> - looked at merge request to add autopilot tests
[15:53] <seb128> - some small improvements to the charge graph (colors)
[15:53] <seb128> - some reviews
[15:53] <seb128> .
[15:53] <seb128> * saucy SRUs: gtk+3.0 empathy desktop-files-utils libgpod file-roller
[15:53] <seb128> * looked at errors.ubuntu.com saucy reports, tried to help getting fixes for some of the issues (e.g opened bugs, talked to upstream, filed bugs, asked for landing, etc)
[15:53] <seb128> .
[15:54] <seb128> * tried to help attente with his keyboard work, tested some fixes, landed SRUs
[15:54] <seb128> .
[15:54] <seb128> * started on saucy merges: libisofs libgnomecanvas gnome-power-manager distribute popplerkit.framework desktop-file-utils gmime gcr poppler
[15:54] <seb128> * some bug fixes and upstream backports
[15:54] <seb128> * bug triaging
[15:54] <seb128> </week<

[15:56] <seb128> that's it for the summaries, I've some notes to add though:
[15:56] <seb128> - we start a new cycle, if you are doing packaging, please look at your Debian merges
[15:56] <seb128> - don't forget about sponsoring, as Laney pointed we accumulated some backlog there and we should clean it a bit
[15:57] <seb128> - vUDS is coming soon, if you want a session, please register the blueprints you need this week

[15:57] <seb128> does anyone has other questions/comments?
[15:57] <qengho> Nope.
[15:58] <seb128> ok, seems not
[15:58] <seb128> thanks everyone!
[15:59] <seb128> didrocks, your turn ;-)
[16:01] <Mirv> o/
[16:04] <didrocks> seb128: we'll have it onlin in an hour I guess, I'm not sure it moved in the calendar for various people
[16:04] <didrocks> Mirv: ^
[16:04] <didrocks> online/in a hangout
[16:04] <seb128> didrocks, your call, I mentioned the DST in my reminder email earlier today
[16:05] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, but we didn't discuss that with robru and other guys earlier
[16:05] <seb128> didrocks, well, we discussed it last cycle when we changed for summer time and we agreed to stay on UTC
[16:05] <seb128> didrocks, but I guess people forgot since
[16:05] <didrocks> robru: are you around?
[16:05] <seb128> didrocks, anyway, your meeting, your call
[16:05] <didrocks> if robru is around. i guess the rest of the team is
[16:05] <didrocks> ogra_: around as well? ^
[16:05] <ogra_> didrocks, for what ?
[16:06] <kenvandine> i'm here
[16:06] <ogra_> didrocks, i'll be in the regular meeting, currently i'm in another meeting
[16:06] <didrocks> ok, so stuck
[16:28] <attente> bschaefer, hey
[16:29] <bschaefer> attente, hello!
[16:30] <attente> bschaefer, did you start the unity key grabber yet? because if not, i can give it a shot
[16:31] <bschaefer> attente, ive not, got to finish something else before i can start :(
[16:31] <bschaefer> attente, you're more talking about filtering the events from compiz to unity to g-s-d?
[16:32] <attente> bschaefer, yeah, the dbus service for doing that specifically
[16:32] <bschaefer> attente, on the g-s-d side of things?
[16:32] <attente> i've started looking into the unity side
[16:32] <bschaefer> it should just accept an XEvent I would think
[16:33] <bschaefer> well the unity side of things, we need to know when an event is not used by compiz
[16:33] <bschaefer> as it has to pass that event to all the compiz plugins
[16:33] <bschaefer> then compiz hanldes the event for it self
[16:33] <attente> oh. i see, i guess this is slightly different
[16:34] <bschaefer> at that point, if no plugins use that event and compiz just does an update with it then we need to pass it on through
[16:34] <bschaefer> yeah
[16:34] <bschaefer> i just need to add a post_event_handle function
[16:34] <attente> i mean adding a dbus interface on the unity side that provides GrabAccelerator, GrabAccelerators, etc.
[16:34] <bschaefer> and emit that to all the plugins listening
[16:34] <bschaefer> oo
[16:35] <attente> bschaefer, do we still need that if all we're doing is calling addAction on the CompScreens?
[16:35] <bschaefer> yeah if you can get that working, to check if you're getting the correct stuff you can stick it in
[16:35] <bschaefer> CompScreen::_handleEvent
[16:35] <attente> i'm assuming adding extra calls to addAction won't step on the toes of the other actions that are already there
[16:36] <bschaefer> attente, hmm i would think so...as just because unity didn't handle that event key there might be another plugin that uses it
[16:38] <bschaefer> attente, what would addAction be doing?
[16:39] <attente> bschaefer, it would just be adding a CompAction for every accelerator that needs to be grabbed, and each CompAction has a callback that triggers the AcceleratorActivated signal
[16:39] <attente> bschaefer, i may be misguided, so any advice is appreciated :)
[16:40] <bschaefer> attente, hmm, well that could overwrite actions (possibly), but if you add that in through the unityshell xml file
[16:40] <bschaefer> for compiz to handle
[16:41] <attente> bschaefer, so the way i'm trying to do it is very dynamic i suppose
[16:41] <bschaefer> as a callback, then emit a dbus message for g-s-d that should work
[16:42] <attente> bschaefer, it should be possible to add arbitrary actions at runtime, right?
[16:42] <attente> my thoughts were that this would be possible, and so we could create a CompAction for each key grab that is requested at runtime
[16:43] <bschaefer> attente, yes you can, the switcher use to do that
[16:43] <bschaefer> attente, well lif we do that
[16:43] <bschaefer> we might as well add them all to the unityshell xml file so it can be configured
[16:43] <bschaefer> that way you can just declare a callback function
[16:43] <robru> didrocks, just up now...
[16:44] <bschaefer> and when you compiz hits those actions you'll get a message in the callback function
[16:44] <didrocks> robru: meeting in 15 minutes :)
[16:45] <bschaefer> attente, actually
[16:45] <attente> bschaefer, "so it can be configured" means what exactly?
[16:45] <robru> didrocks, ok, just having breakfast
[16:45] <bschaefer> attente, there shotcuts shouldn't be configure able
[16:45] <bschaefer> yeah
[16:45] <attente> we can leave the configuration of those shortcuts to g-s-d and gsettings
[16:45] <bschaefer> attente, so you can change the shortcut in ccsm :)
[16:45] <bschaefer> but yeah thats not a good idea
[16:45] <attente> i think at least
[16:46] <attente> ah, i see
[16:46] <bschaefer> how would unity get ahold of those?
[16:47] <attente> g-s-d would make dbus calls to unity to tell it what shortcuts to grab
[16:47] <attente> basically in the way that it does now with gnome-shell
[16:47] <bschaefer> cool, that makes sense
[16:48] <bschaefer> attente, the only thing i would be worried about is stomping on another plugins hotkey
[16:48] <bschaefer> but really, i don't think theres any conflicts atm
[16:48] <attente> bschaefer, what other plugins are normally running concurrently with unityshell?
[16:48] <bschaefer> quite a few
[16:49] <attente> are there any you can think of that would take precedence over g-s-d's hotkeys?
[16:50] <bschaefer> core composite opengl decor copytex regex grid gnomecompat place snap mousepoll imgpng wall vpswitch commands resize session move compoztoolbox animation expo fade scale workarounds ezoom unityshell
[16:50] <bschaefer> thats the list
[16:50] <bschaefer> of what im running at lease
[16:50] <bschaefer> attente, i would not
[16:51] <bschaefer> attente, do you have a list of all the hotkeys?
[16:51] <bschaefer> attente, or at lease go through and make sure none of the hotkeys are taken already?
[16:52] <attente> bschaefer, they're all user-configurable, so i guess we shouldn't depend on them being any fixed value
[16:52] <bschaefer> attente, well more about for default
[16:52] <bschaefer> attente, as we should at lease assume our default has no conflicts
[16:53] <bschaefer> there does exist a problem where a user changes its hotkey to that which g-s-d uses, then that would become a race...
[16:53] <bschaefer> (or depending on which plugin is looked at first really)
[16:58] <GunnarHj> seb128: Hi, Seb!
[16:58] <attente> bschaefer, not sure if this is a comprehensive list, but: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6365666/
[16:58] <seb128> GunnarHj, hey
[16:58] <GunnarHj> seb128: What's the status of an interface in g-c-c region for installing/removing languages?
[16:58] <GunnarHj> Will it be ready for 14.04?
[16:59] <GunnarHj> darkxst filed bug 1175499 a while ago, and the idea with making use of existing code in l-s, e.g. parsing pkg_depends, sounds interesting.
[16:59] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1175499 in language-selector (Ubuntu) "dbus interface" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1175499
[16:59] <GunnarHj> How is installation of languages handled in Ubuntu Touch?
[17:00] <qengho> Is anyone here using the APPL Bluetooth wireless Touchpad with Ubuntu?
[17:00] <bschaefer> attente, i know at lease: logout '<Control><Alt>Delete'
[17:00] <bschaefer> has a conflict with what ChrisTownsend was doing
[17:01] <bschaefer> with trying to make it bring up umm
[17:01] <bschaefer> a task manager sort of
[17:01] <seb128> GunnarHj, nobody is working on langpacks for region atm I think, I doubt it's going to be ready for the lts if we don't change that
[17:01] <seb128> GunnarHj, Ubuntu Touch doesn't have langpack installation atm, that's a TBD
[17:01] <bschaefer> attente, but yeah i don't see anything in there that looks like it'll conflict off the top of my head
[17:01] <seb128> GunnarHj, the Ubuntu Touch fs is read-only so you can't install packages there, we need to find a way/create a rw location
[17:02] <seb128> qengho, I'm not, maybe check with cyphermox if you have bt issues
[17:02] <GunnarHj> seb128: Are you saying that l-s will still be there in 14.04?
[17:02] <seb128> GunnarHj, if things don't change it looks like it
[17:02] <attente> bschaefer, the plugins you listed, they're always loaded in that order?
[17:02] <qengho> seb128: it's more of a kernel problem.
[17:02] <seb128> qengho, try asking #ubuntu-kernel then I guess
[17:02] <bschaefer> attente, hmm not sure
[17:03] <bschaefer> attente, but i think so
[17:03] <attente> bschaefer, i'm wondering if we can do it in some way that g-s-d's hotkeys always get overridden if something else wants it
[17:03] <bschaefer> attente, when you do a 'unity' or 'compiz --replace ccp' it'll usually tell you which plugin is being loaded
[17:03] <bschaefer> and i think its alphabetized
[17:04] <bschaefer> well its not alphabetized
[17:04] <bschaefer> attente, its loaded based on needs
[17:04] <GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, so Ubuntu Touch is English only for the time being?
[17:04] <bschaefer> attente, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6365693/
[17:05] <seb128> GunnarHj, no, we install some langpacks on the default image and custom images for countries can be customized to have their language preinstalled
[17:05] <attente> bschaefer, yeah.. your list definitely doesn't match mine
[17:05] <GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, I see.
[17:05] <bschaefer> attente, unityshell plugin looks like its last
[17:05] <bschaefer> soo depending on how the plugins are stored internally, all other plugins that conflict with g-s-d should run first
[17:05] <bschaefer> attente, but we can always test that when the time comes :)
[17:06] <bschaefer> hmm
[17:06] <bschaefer> attente, whats yours?
[17:06] <bschaefer> attente, and is unityshell plugin last?
[17:07] <attente> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6365697/
[17:07] <attente> but yeah, unity-shell is still last there :)
[17:07] <GunnarHj> seb128: As regards the idea with a dbus interface to l-s - do you think you could convince pitti that it would be a good idea to add such a thing? He did some preparations in l-s a couple of years ago that I think were made with a switch to g-c-c region.
[17:07] <GunnarHj> in mind
[17:08] <bschaefer> attente, cool, sooo im hoping the lists of plugins are just stored in a vector
[17:08] <bschaefer> where each one will be pushed on to the back as they come in
[17:08] <seb128> GunnarHj, you can ask him, I don't know ... but currently the focus is on Ubuntu Touch, I doubt we spend much time, this cycle, changing thing that mostly work
[17:09] <bschaefer> attente, to test, just change a hotkey to a one that overrides a g-s-d hotkey test to make sure the plugin gets it
[17:09] <seb128> bschaefer, attente: do you guys are talking about adding a new plugin there?
[17:10] <seb128> sil2100, do you still plan to publish ido today?
[17:10] <bschaefer> seb128, nope, adding g-s-d key handling
[17:10] <sil2100> seb128: yep!
[17:10] <sil2100> seb128: just first I need to push out unity8
[17:10] <sil2100> seb128: then ido is next in the queue
[17:10] <sil2100> (in the meeting right now)
[17:10] <bschaefer> in unity
[17:10] <bschaefer> by adding actions in compiz based off the g-s-d hotkeys
[17:10] <seb128> bschaefer, ok, I was just checking because of the "will be pushed on to the back"
[17:10] <bschaefer> so compiz can shot a callback to unity, then we can send it off to g-s-d
[17:11] <seb128> bschaefer, yeah, I followed a bit that, all fine then ... I was just making sure that no new plugin was involved for that code, changing user config on update is tricky
[17:11] <bschaefer> seb128, :), well we are talking about how the plugins were loaded into compiz and the effects of g-s-d plugins conflicting with other plugins
[17:11] <attente> yeah.. i think it's easiest just to keep it in the unityshell plugin
[17:11] <seb128> +1
[17:11] <seb128> sil2100, thanks
[17:11] <seb128> ok, on that note I'm off for some exercice
[17:11] <Laney> GunnarHj: hey ...
[17:11] <seb128> bbiab
[17:11] <bschaefer> yup
[17:11] <Laney> bye seb128
[17:11] <bschaefer> cya
[17:12] <sil2100> Bye seb128  ;)
[17:12] <GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. Will ask pitti, but i realize that the phone is no. 1 priority.
[17:12] <GunnarHj> Laney: Hi!
[17:12] <seb128> Laney, btw I've a small mr on ubuntu-system-settings to add colors to be charge graph, if you feel like doing a review (I was sort of waiting on that to ask for a landing, but since review doesn't seem to happen I'm doing small nudging ;-)
[17:13] <Laney> seb128: sure, saw it come in
[17:13] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[17:13] <Laney> I thought you asked for landing already
[17:14] <seb128> Laney, no, I said I would test on the device first, and I sort of wanted that change in the landing so I waited a bit on the review...
[17:14] <Laney> I see
[17:14] <Laney> k
[17:14] <bschaefer> attente, but yeah i think that'll work as long as we can provide all the information each dbus interface needs as the params
[17:14] <Laney> GunnarHj: So... I don't really like your solution to that accountsservice problem I'm afraid
[17:14] <bschaefer> attente, if you've any other questions about unity/compiz just ping me :)
[17:14] <attente> bschaefer, ok, i'll let you know if i run into problems :)
[17:14] <Laney> it's really weird for tools to change their behaviour based on things like that
[17:14] <attente> bschaefer, thanks :)
[17:15] <seb128> Laney, well anyway, I'm going to add the landing to the list once I'm back from sport, if it gets in great, otherwise that's just reported to the next one
[17:16] <GunnarHj> Laney: I was afraid you'd say so. But have you really considered what amount of code would be involved to deal with that tiny issue via a separate method?
[17:16] <bschaefer> attente, sounds good, and thank you for doing it :)
[17:16] <GunnarHj> Laney: It really is a l-s specific issue.
[17:22] <Laney> GunnarHj: I don't know, no - but I'm willing to look at writing a patch; I guess you'd try to factor out all of the common code as much as possible
[17:22] <Laney> It means that the stuff will be really unreliable on desktop until l-s goes away
[17:25] <GunnarHj> Laney: The idea is to handle the bits and pieces at one place, yes. But what is it that makes it unreliable? The code works pretty well at this time, with very few related bugs.
[17:25] <Laney> if I try u-s-s on my desktop now I'll get the append behaviour
[17:25] <Laney> prepend
[17:25] <GunnarHj> Laney: With the latest accountsservice?
[17:26] <GunnarHj> Laney: Is language-selector-gnome installed in the phone?
[17:27] <Laney> It's really a proxy for "are we running on a desktop?" when we shouldn't be trying to split behaviour like that - the code should do the same thing everywhere, as far as possible
[17:27] <Laney> Fair enough if it were enabling some optional piece of functionality, but this is making a guess as to what the caller of the function wants to do
[17:28] <sil2100> seb128: ok, pushed ido to trusty, should be in the archives soon!
[17:28]  * sil2100 trusts it doesn't break stuff
[17:32] <GunnarHj> Laney: I understand your objection from a principal POV. Sure, it does make a guess in this single respect. But the "prepend behavior" was implemented in order to not destroy the prio list when other UIs such as User Accounts in g-c-c or lightdm-gtk-greeter submits a single language code. To the prepend behavior should be seen as an exception due to how l-s works.
[17:40] <GunnarHj> Laney: You mentioned trying u-s-s on your desktop - Can you do so easily? I'm asking because I don't own a smart phone yet, but it would be valuable to be able to study the phone UI.
[17:40] <Laney> Yeah, it mostly works there
[17:40] <Laney> The end goal is to use that instead of g-c-c
[17:41] <Laney> It's currently something we keep in mind but not an active target if that makes sense
[17:41] <Laney> i.e. don't file bugs for stuff which is weird on desktop just yet
[17:42] <GunnarHj> Laney: Thanks, then I'll install it and give it a try. No bugs yet, promise. :)
[17:50] <GunnarHj> Laney: It struck me that when you get the prepend behavior now when you try u-s-s on you desktop, it's the expected behavior since language-selector-gnome is present on your desktop (and still the principal tool for dealing with language settings).
[17:54] <Laney> I have an idea
[17:54] <Laney> not sure it'll work, so let me do a patch tomorrow and get back to you
[17:56] <GunnarHj> Laney: Ok, looking forward to study your idea. ;-)
[20:35] <xnox> seb128: ++++++ !!!! \o/ \o\ \o/ /o/ on bringing the menu bars back where they are suppose to be =)
[20:38] <czajkowski> heh
[20:49] <darkxst> seb128, yes, will upstream g-s-d fix today
[21:49] <darkxst> Laney, http://pastebin.com/w3R2RtHc


[14:18] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: what's supposed to be in 0.6?
[14:27] <Keybuk_> 0.5.3, plus a few fixes to the util/ stuff, plus some migration tools Debian want
[14:30] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: hmm. almost doesn't seem worth a minor bump
[14:31] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: side note, I've done the style cleanup on the state transfer patch. It still needs test cases though.
[14:34] <Keybuk_> it's more of a statement of intent
[14:34] <Keybuk_> 0.5 was tagged as a development series, while 0.3 was stable
[14:34] <Keybuk_> calling it 0.6 means it can be labelled stable
[14:35] <sadmac2> woohoo!
[14:36] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: are we still on target for a 1.0/0.10 at LPC?
[14:50] <Keybuk_> sadmac2: yes
[14:51] <sadmac2> cool
[16:06] <sadmac2> notting: petr should probably be in here
[16:09] <Keybuk_> petr?
[16:09] <plautrba> Keybuk_: yes
[16:10] <Keybuk_> ah hi :-)
[16:10] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: since I'm not a dev engineer anymore, petr will be the RHEL 6 Upstart maintainer
[16:10] <Keybuk_> it was more of a "who is Petr?" kind of question, but you pretty much answered that :-)
[16:10] <Keybuk_> plautrba: pleased to meet you!
[16:10] <plautrba> Keybuk_: hi, nice to meet to too
[16:10] <plautrba> *you
[16:11] <Keybuk_> RHEL 6 and Fedora?
[16:12] <plautrba> for now it's for rhel6 but i would like to involve in fedora too
[16:14] <sadmac2> plautrba: where are you out of? I don't think we even met.
[16:15] <Keybuk_> sadmac2: you'll be still doing the Fedora packages?
[16:15] <Keybuk_> when is RHEL 6 scheduled for? what kind of timeframe?
[16:15] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: yes
[16:15] <notting> Keybuk_: *cough*
[16:15] <Keybuk_> notting: you can't say? :p
[16:15] <Keybuk_> or you have no idea?
[16:15] <plautrba> sadmac2: i am from brno
[16:16] <sadmac2> plautrba: ah. cool
[16:16] <notting> Keybuk_: the former
[16:16] <plautrba> sadmac2: i'm sure we haven't met yet
[16:16] <Keybuk_> I'd strongly prefer you were able to run 0.6 in RHEL 6
[16:16] <Keybuk_> since that'll be the stable version that Ubuntu and Debian will also be using
[16:16] <sadmac2> notting: ^^yeah, we need to look into this
[16:16] <Keybuk_> and the version I'm trying to bribe SuSE into using
[16:17] <Keybuk_> (instead of using 0.3 or 0.5)
[16:17] <notting> Keybuk_: unlikely as it stands now, given the format changes
[16:17] <Keybuk_> notting: 0.6 is basically compatible
[16:17] <Keybuk_> it's me declaring the 0.5 version "better" than the 0.3 version, and fixing up the last few bits that aren't the same
[16:17] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: you say it'll be compatible with 0.10. Does that mean 0.10 is keeping start/stop on?
[16:17] <notting> ? 0.5 wasn't compatible with 0.3.
[16:18] <Keybuk_> notting: it's mostly compatible, a few bits that aren't will be fixed for 0.6
[16:18] <Keybuk_> sadmac2: 0.10 will read the 0.6 jobs, and apply some logic to making them work
[16:18] <Keybuk_> sadmac2: I may simply still support "stop on" to allow easier transition
[16:18] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: how will it know which one is which? folders? new job_version stanza?
[16:19] <Keybuk_> sadmac2: 0.10 jobs use "while/on", 0.6 jobs use "start on"
[16:19] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: either can use exec foo with no other info in the file
[16:19] <notting> Keybuk_: including file locations, or is that a lost cause?
[16:21] <Keybuk_> sadmac2: and both will behave the same way in that case
[16:21] <sadmac2> notting: shouldn't be hard to make it support the old location as well as the new
[16:21] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: true.
[16:22]  * sadmac2 goes to feed himself
[16:22] <Keybuk_> notting: I'd like to get everyone on broadly the same page
[16:22] <ion_> keybuk: Karmic will get 0.6 instead of 0.10?
[16:22] <notting> Keybuk_: what's your schedule?
[16:23] <Keybuk_> ion_: Karmic will get 0.6, 0.10 is due for plumbers so that's "too late" for Karmic
[16:23] <Keybuk_> and will go into Karmic+1
[16:23] <Keybuk_> Debian will have 0.6 in unstable when it's released
[16:23] <Keybuk_> and will move to 0.10 in September for squeeze (the next release)
[16:23] <ion_> Ok. Will Karmic get a startup based on 0.6 (if that’s even possible) or still sysvrc?
[16:23] <Keybuk_> notting: 0.6.0 this week, 0.10.0 for plumbers
[16:23] <Keybuk_> ion_: yes, partly
[16:24] <notting> Keybuk_: if we don't actually use it for anything native beyond rcS... what does 0.6 buy me? :)
[16:24] <Keybuk_> notting: support
[16:24] <Keybuk_> cf. your recent crasher bug with 0.3.x
[16:24] <Keybuk_> which already didn't effect 0.5
[16:29] <ion_> How are you planning to support 0.6 jobs in 0.10? How about /{etc,lib}/init/$formatversion/ and have separate parsers for both trees (and yet another separate piece of code to yield 0.10-compatible jobs based on the 0.6 parser’s result) in order to not contaminate the 0.10 code with 0.6 stuff? Too idealistic? :-)
[16:30] <ion_> One could then easily rid the codebase of 0.6 stuff in n years when nobody uses 0.6 anymore.
[16:43] <Keybuk_> separate parser code is probably the easiest way
[17:41] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: if you still have a directory change in mind, it might actually simplify things. Folder x for 0.6 jobs, folder y for 0.10
[17:46] <ion_> /lib/init/0.6/jobs, /lib/init/0.10/jobs, /lib/init/42.0/jobs, or call the 0.6 format “0”, the 0.10 format “1” and the 42.0 format “2” and use /lib/init/{0,1,2}/jobs
[17:46] <sadmac2> ion_: I don't think we're doing them in /lib
[17:49] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: why do you have better candy in the UK?!
[17:49]  * sadmac2 eats an aero bar
[17:51] <Keybuk_> a not unreasonable idea might be just to have 0.6 jobs in /etc/event.d <g>
[17:51] <Keybuk_> err
[17:51] <Keybuk_> yeah I do mean that
[17:51] <Keybuk_> sadmac2: you're in the UK?
[17:51] <Keybuk_> ion_: you appear to have misspelled /etc
[17:54] <ion_> keybuk: I thought the distro-supplied jobs were supposed to go to /lib and the user jobs or overrides to /etc at some point.
[18:00] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: no. Friend found them at an import store.
[18:00] <sadmac2> Keybuk_: but I now have one more reason to come.
[18:01] <Keybuk_> ion_: no
[18:01] <sadmac2> ion_: it never felt right to me. If anything I'd say distro jobs would go in /share, if there were such a thing.
[18:01] <Keybuk_> jobs go in /etc
[18:01] <Keybuk_> they're configuration files
[18:01] <ion_> Alright
[21:06] <soren> ion_: Perhaps you're thinking of udev rules?
[21:07] <ion_> No
[21:07] <sadmac2> soren: no, there was discussion of upstart keeping its config in /lib (the reasoning being that job definitions are "like udev rules"), but it was canned
[21:08] <soren> ion_, sadmac2: Oh, I see.
[21:08]  * soren crawls back under his rock


[13:59] <bg2032> hello
[14:00] <bg2032> I am trying to set up a new computer for an old person with rather bad eyesight (but not blind)
[14:00] <bg2032> most DEs I've tried are not very good at enforcing a minimum font size, OR they break down after a certain font size
[14:01] <bg2032> around 16/18pt on 1080p
[14:01] <bg2032> any tips?


[02:12] <akgraner> highvoltage, nhandler - the better solution is to have someone (I haven't looked yet) Just write a story on Xubuntu and say btw if you are interesting in joining in on the planning then join us at this meeting
[02:13] <akgraner> Talk about what Xubuntu is, how it is related to Ubuntu, how to get involved and what are some of the key points/goals coming out of uds, how people can get involved and send the invitation to the community - not just a "meeting announcement"
[02:14] <akgraner> that would be awesome for the Fridge
[02:14] <akgraner> Fridge=ubuntu-news.org
[02:17] <akgraner> nhandler, highvoltage  - if I was rude yesterday not my intent - lets work on the agenda for the next meeting and hash someone this out via the mailing list prior to the meeting - I'll update agenda and send a note to the list in the morning and get this ball rolling
[02:18] <nhandler> akgraner: Yep. An actual story would be fine for a one-off type thing. But we shouldn't do that for every Xubuntu meeting ;)
[02:18] <akgraner> agree - just showing the subtle difference in how to get the same message out
[02:19] <akgraner> but in an informational way that benefits the greater audience
[02:20] <akgraner> nhandler, has anyone added the bug day for tomorrow to the Fridge yet (sorry I haven't looked)
[02:23] <akgraner> nhandler, nm the page finally loaded :-) the answer is no :-)
[02:45] <highvoltage> akgraner: ah, I can't even remember anything yesterday that could come across as you being rude,
[02:46] <highvoltage> nhandler: I didn't suggest we do it for every meeting ;)
[07:12] <alourie> good mornign
[08:58] <akgraner> alourie, good morning!
[09:22] <alourie> akgraner: hi Amber!
[09:22] <alourie> how are you? How's your house?
[09:23] <akgraner> about to be torn the rest of the way down so we can start rebuilding
[09:23] <akgraner> progress is being made daily
[09:33] <alourie> akgraner: oh good
[09:33] <akgraner> nods :-)
[09:34] <alourie> akgraner: I really hope it'll be done as soon as possible
[09:34] <akgraner> alourie, thank you, me too
[09:38] <alourie> akgraner: we all support you here :-)
[09:40] <akgraner> you all rock
[09:45] <alourie> you rock
[11:55] <akgraner> we missed adding bug day to ubuntu-news.org - but IT world picked it up - woo hoo - http://www.itworld.com/open-source/127268/help-improve-ubuntu-bug-day-tomorrow?source=itw_rss
[18:55] <akgraner> awesome - Joe barker is going to cover the translation and loco team interviews this cycle - woo hoo!
[18:56] <akgraner> he will be mentoring a couple folks who are new to the community and contributing as well..
[18:59] <dpm> cool
[19:00] <akgraner> dpm you are everywhere - didn't see you in here :-P
[19:00] <dpm> heya :-)
[19:04] <Pendulum> akgraner: he's stealth like that
[19:04] <akgraner> nods


[00:31] <popey> well!
[06:24] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[06:24] <Myrtti> moin
[06:24] <brobostigon> guten morgen Myrtti
[06:43] <ali1234> remember the old update manager that didn't pop up and steal focus at 7:45 EVERY DAY? it just had an indicator when there were updates
[06:43] <ali1234> is that still available somewhere?
[06:48] <Myrtti> you can change it to notify once a week...
[06:48] <Myrtti> but yeah, that notification icon would be lovely
[06:55] <Myrtti> well. It's a good thing I didn't strip the bed for washing the bedsheets...
[06:56]  * jussi01 waves
[07:51] <DJones> popey: Have you updated your map yet? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-29330265
[07:51] <DJones> 23GB free disk space. The full world is approximately 20GB uncompressed.
[07:55] <DJones> bigcalm: May something your interested in as well ^^
[07:55]  * brobostigon will need to get his external hdd out, for enough space to download it.
[07:56] <Myrtti> aw man
[07:56] <Myrtti> my laptop has a dead bright pixel
[08:08] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Punctuation Day! :-D
[08:14] <brobostigon> morning JamesTait
[08:28] <popey> DJones: download link?
[08:28] <DJones> http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/innovate/developers/minecraft-map-britain.html
[08:28] <foobarry> Myrtti: thats the most annoying thing
[08:29] <Myrtti> foobarry: the dead bug is more annoying - it's bigger
[08:29] <foobarry> :(
[08:29] <foobarry> i've been bitten alive by bugs lately
[08:29] <foobarry> must have 25 bites on me
[08:39] <diddledan> foobarry: you must be tasty
[08:40] <DJones> popey: Just downloaded & tried, there's no readme file in the zip archive, but I just dumped it into my saves folder & unziped & works fine
[08:41] <foobarry> my wife says she doesn't get them because marmite
[08:41] <diddledan> foobarry: yeah they get their feet stuck in marmite if you plaster yourself with it
[08:42] <diddledan> :-p
[08:50] <dutchie> foobarry: :(
[08:50] <dutchie> i have a nice big ulcer on my tongue
[08:51] <foobarry> i'm due some ulcers after eating pringles
[08:51] <foobarry> mouth is too narrow for 5 at once
[08:57] <dutchie> heh
[09:06] <foobarry> http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/23/6834755/samsung-to-end-laptop-sales-in-europe
[09:06] <foobarry> including chromebooks
[09:07] <directhex> weird. i thought chromebooks sold well
[09:07] <diddledan> ALL laptop sales?
[09:07] <diddledan> wow
[09:09] <ujjain> in the UK you can withdraw from most ATM's for free right? I heard in the US sometimes a bank rquires you to use its own ATMs, I just signed up for Nationwide Plus, so just curious if I coud be charged using Lloyds ATms
[09:10] <diplo> ujjain, yes most are free, you get charged for using some third party ones but most banks don't charge now
[09:10] <diplo> It tells you on the ATM anyway
[09:14] <ujjain> ah great
[09:14] <DJones> czajkows1i: You need to get yourself one of the http://goo.gl/SZYlXV
[09:14] <ujjain> right, some atms in clubs charge like 2 pounds
[09:14] <czajkows1i> DJones: oh I do indeed
[09:15] <czajkows1i> DJones: instead I give you https://twitter.com/czajkowski/status/514487093129908225/photo/1
[09:15] <diplo> ujjain, yeah and places like Theme parks etc and some pubs
[09:16] <DJones> czajkows1i: I saw that last night as twitter scrolled past, very worrying
[09:16] <diplo> and events, but places like Supermarkets, banks etc all are free
[09:26] <foobarry> the builder who is quoting our extension says we need to get the party wall agreement sorted...what does that mean?
[09:27] <Myrtti> do you share a wall with a neighbour?
[09:27] <Myrtti> do you plan to share?
[09:27] <DJones> foobarry: http://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/mar/14/home-extensions-plans-party-wall
[09:28] <Myrtti> mmm. or that
[09:28] <foobarry> the extension will go to the boundary
[09:28] <Myrtti> there you go then.
[09:29] <Myrtti> "You need to serve notice on all the owners of every neighbouring property affected by the works, both freeholders and leaseholders."
[09:29] <foobarry> seems confusing as i thought the planning permission covers this
[09:29] <DJones> https://www.gov.uk/party-wall-etc-act-1996-guidance "The act covers new building on or at the boundary of 2 properties"
[09:29] <foobarry> since the council write to the neighbours
[09:51] <aquarius> that "cat" in the topic looks like a koala. :)
[10:17] <foobarry> http://www.net-security.org/secworld.php?id=17392
[10:17] <foobarry> replacement for truecrypt
[10:25] <diddledan> foobarry: too late for me - I've moved to encfs
[10:25] <directhex> i just keep all my naked selfies on iCloud, so i don't have any false sense of security from using an encrypted filesystem
[10:27] <diddledan> directhex: this isn't for naked selfies - those I don't encrypt
[10:27] <diddledan> directhex: this is for things like ssh certs
[10:29] <diddledan> I need them on all my systems but there's no reasonable way of doing that without a third-party involved (that I've found)
[10:32] <directhex> just store it on github. use quadruple-rot13 for encryption
[10:43] <diddledan> yey http://www.geek.com/apple/iphone-6s-are-being-bent-in-peoples-pockets-including-mine-1605177/
[10:58] <foobarry> meh
[10:59] <foobarry> "pressure of fabric against your skin"
[10:59] <foobarry> = being sat on?
[10:59] <Myrtti> tight jeans and front pocket
[10:59] <foobarry> lots of forces applying pressure
[10:59] <Myrtti> bend to sit, the fabric goes taught
[11:07] <shauno> doesn't this happen every year?  every time there's a new iphone, people suddenly re-discover that when you bend things, they bend
[11:09] <zmoylan-pi> apple will have to give all users a free titanium non bendy case :-)
[11:09] <zmoylan-pi> or are they going to say that they're meant to bend?
[11:10] <diddledan> they're not meant to not bend
[11:12] <foobarry> they aren't meant to be subjected to warping forces
[11:16] <zmoylan-pi> what % put their phone in their pocket?
[11:16] <diddledan> the majority?
[11:17] <zmoylan-pi> probably for teenagers and those in 20s maybe but i suspect it falls after that
[11:18] <directhex> chances are, when field-testing the phone, everyone had it in a bulky case designed to hide its true shape
[11:19] <directhex> also, all apple staff wear tan-colored cargo trousers, which have deep loose pockets
[11:19] <zmoylan-pi> and they didn't have it going through enough bars in hipsters pockets this release :-)
[11:19] <shauno> mine lives in my pocket.  I just don't extend that to sitting on them
[11:19] <Azelphur> My coat has a phone pocket, I put it in there
[11:20] <zmoylan-pi> i reckon my nokia dumbphone will be safe in my back pocket when i occasionly stick it there it i'm not wearing a fleece/jacket with pockets
[11:21] <shauno> lol.  your nokia dumbphone will be safe when only cockroaches rule the world
[11:21] <Azelphur> nothing wrong with nokia dumb phones if it's all you want :)
[11:21] <Azelphur> http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/226/893/tumblr_lwve5bG5781qewacoo1_r1_500.jpg :P
[11:21] <zmoylan-pi> i did use one of it's predecessors a nokia n70 to bang a nail into a door frame to make a point to my boss about how a crappy nokia was better than his shiny new ruggedised pocket pc
[11:23] <shauno> I had a friend with a 'ruggedised' phone a good 7-8 years ago.  chocolate-block style but dressed up so it looked like it was a car tyre
[11:23] <shauno> he dropped it in a pint to prove it was waterproof.  it never worked again
[11:23] <zmoylan-pi> my boss dropped his pocket pc onto carpet and battery shook lose.  i threw the n70 at ceiling knocking out tile and let it bounce off floor on way down and it was grand
[11:24] <Azelphur> I've tipped a bottle of water over my LG G Watch :D
[11:24] <Azelphur> and taken it in the shower once
[11:25] <shauno> this kinda stuff cracks me up though; http://forums.androidcentral.com/htc-one-m8/381873-bent-m8.html
[11:25] <shauno> bend your android phone, it's a "curiousity".  bend an iphone, and it's bend-gate!
[11:25] <Azelphur> shauno: I'm sure you could find similar posts about the iphone 5 ;)
[11:26] <shauno> oh I know you can
[11:26] <directhex> www.lg.com/us/mobile-phones/gflex !
[11:27] <Azelphur> hehe
[11:28] <directhex> shauno: "bendghazi"
[13:46] <Azelphur> I'm trying to find out what power supply a Mad Catz Strike 7 keyboard takes, nowhere seems to mention it, frustrating.
[13:54] <daftykins> Azelphur: no power specs written on the device?
[13:54] <Azelphur> daftykins: it says "Operating voltage 5V" but that could mean practically anything since it's not the input.
[13:55] <daftykins> :/
[13:55] <daftykins> weird
[13:55] <daftykins> nothing beside the socket at all?
[13:56] <Azelphur> daftykins: nope, the socket is just a wire
[13:57] <Azelphur> ie there's a wire that comes out of the keyboard with a female socket for you to plug the power into
[13:58] <daftykins> oh that's weird
[13:58] <Azelphur> the G19 does the same thing
[13:59] <diddledan> what does it say on the wall-wart they provided?
[13:59] <Azelphur> wall-wart?
[13:59] <daftykins> mains adapter
[13:59] <Azelphur> I don't have it, if I had it that'd make life a whole lot easier ;)
[13:59] <daftykins> i suspect Azelphur has been without from the start
[13:59] <Azelphur> indeed
[14:00] <diddledan> seems odd to me to provide a powered keyboard without an adapter
[14:00] <daftykins> i suspect it's second hand ;)
[14:00] <Azelphur> indeed
[14:01] <diddledan> you could get a multivolt adapter and try your luck
[14:01] <Azelphur> diddledan: well was hoping to know without trying my luck and destroying it :P
[14:01] <Azelphur> although, I think it's broken already tbh.
[14:01] <diddledan> but if it's 5v internally then I suspect it'll be 5v input
[14:01] <foobarry> wow. #muslimapologies is the oddest hashtag i ever read
[14:02] <diddledan> foobarry: is it bad?
[14:02] <foobarry> its weird. supposed to be ironic messages from muslims "aplogising" for things they shouldn't have to apologise for
[14:03] <diddledan> Azelphur: it won't be less than 5v because that's what it uses internally, so assuming it's 5v input your only concern is the polarity
[14:03] <Azelphur> indeed, that was my thinking
[14:04] <diddledan> I get the impression that most DC adapters these days are + on the inner-pole
[14:04]  * zmoylan-pi sees diddledan in immediate future holding smoking piece of hardware cursing that assumption :-)
[14:05] <diddledan> zmoylan-pi: I tend to check like Azelphur is doing
[14:05] <Azelphur> hehe
[14:05] <diddledan> if it's unclear then I'll only use the same brand of adapter
[14:06] <diddledan> e.g. most netgear boxes for consumerland tend to be the same power requirements
[14:06] <Azelphur> oh well, I gotta go for now, if anyone happens to find it let me know :)
[14:14] <popey> Azelphur: open it up and see where the wire goes, will be very easy to see which is +ve and which is -ve
[14:15] <popey> -ve will go to some ground plane, +ve may well even be marked on the board, and will go to the power pins of whatever ICs are in it
[14:22] <Myrtti> Dear Agony Aunt, am I normal? I'm a 34 years old nerd and I'm considering making the information leaflet to be included with the wedding invitations with LaTeX. PLZ REPLY SOON!!!111 xxx Myrtti xxx
[14:23] <directhex> using LaTeX makes you a fetishist
[14:23] <diddledan> some people have allergies. you gotta remember that
[14:24] <diddledan> so for them you'll have to use something other than LaTeX
[14:25] <zmoylan-pi> putting the details in a qr code so guests can scan the info directly into their phones makes you a nerd
[14:25] <diddledan> zmoylan-pi: don't give her ideas!
[14:25] <zmoylan-pi> with klingon translation... :-p
[14:25] <directhex> QR code confetti
[14:27] <Myrtti> QR is already a given, I'm marrying this man https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/mobile-barcoder/?src=userprofile
[14:28] <diddledan> Duncan Sample? that's a rare surname.
[14:29] <foobarry> saw a brochure the other day that had a page full of QR codes in such low res that none of them worked. obviously the people putting it together had no clue what a QR code was and how to test it
[14:29] <directhex> http://picturesofpeoplescanningqrcodes.tumblr.com/
[14:30] <diddledan> lmao
[14:30] <diddledan> is that indicative that nobody scans qr codes?
[14:30] <foobarry> i scanned one at oggcamp once
[14:30] <foobarry> because the url was so long
[14:30] <directhex> diddledan: yes
[14:30] <zmoylan-pi> i take pics of them and scan them when i get home :-)
[14:35] <popey> i know someone who has a qr code for their wifi
[14:35] <popey> so you just scan it and you're connected without having to type the pw in
[14:36] <foobarry> how does that work?
[14:36] <foobarry> oh cool
[14:36] <popey> standard feature on android
[14:36] <popey> she has it hanging in her lounge
[14:36] <daftykins> i was gonna do that for mine
[14:36] <popey> she also but an nfc tag behind the picture
[14:36] <daftykins> but really i don't want everyone jumping on mine :D
[14:36] <popey> well, it's on the inside of her house
[14:36] <foobarry> good if you have multiple SSID
[14:36] <diplo> I like that idea popey, may have to look at doing that!
[14:36] <popey> if strangers are in her lounge, she has bigger things to worry about
[14:36] <foobarry> visitors SSID
[14:36] <popey> yeah
[14:37] <popey> shame ubuntu phone doesn't do that yet
[14:37] <popey> i have to type the silly long key in
[14:37] <daftykins> i have friends of friends pop by sometimes, wouldn't necessarily want them all :)
[14:37] <foobarry> what phones will ubuntu phone work on?
[14:37] <popey> it currently works on nexus 4
[14:37] <popey> new phone will be available very soon
[14:38] <foobarry> i was hoping my next phone would be ubuntu but i ran out of waiting time
[14:38] <zmoylan-pi> i just tell people i'll email them the wifi key :-)
[14:38] <popey> is the wifi key your email address? ☻
[14:39] <diplo> And done!
[14:39] <diplo> Will test it when I get home :)
[14:39]  * popey needs to finish his talk for xda developer conf
[14:41]  * dutchie needs to finish oggcamp talk
[14:41]  * popey is re-using his xda talk for oggcamp ☻
[14:56] <davmor2> popey: cheapskate, we'll start calling you jono ;)
[15:13] <arsen> anyone have virgin's 152Mb cable?
[15:13] <arsen> theoretically i've had it a few days - but i cant say ive seen speed change at all.
[15:14] <awilkins> I have the 60 and rarely get above ~ 25-30Mbit/s
[15:14] <awilkins> Because this is mostly OK for my needs, I haven't bothered complaining
[15:15] <awilkins> But "speed" is a vague definition
[15:15] <arsen> i "had" 60, and usually got 60ish
[15:15] <awilkins> Latency? You're unlikely to see improvements
[15:15] <arsen> i now "have" 152, apparently... and i'm getting 50-60 still :D
[15:15] <awilkins> Yeah, but is the limit at your end, or the server?
[15:42] <davmor2> I had the 60 it got upgraded so now I'm on 100 I get between 80-100 normally but it can be fairly low sometimes depending on the site
[15:50] <popey> i ave 100 now...
[15:50] <popey> well ~105
[15:52]  * foobarry installing MAAS
[15:52] <popey> MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAS
[15:55] <awilkins> Monkeys As A Service?
[15:56] <Laney> MAAS as a service
[15:56] <diddledan> yey monkeys!
[15:56] <diddledan> I expect shakespear in a week
[15:56] <foobarry> http://i.imgur.com/MzdbQSj.jpg
[15:57] <diddledan> what you doing?
[15:57] <diddledan> lotsa putes
[15:57] <foobarry> we haz 20 computers
[15:57] <diddledan> \o/
[15:57] <foobarry> for running openstack testing
[15:57] <diddledan> aah
[15:58] <diddledan> not for bitcoining then ? :-p
[15:58] <foobarry> nah, not my thing
[15:58] <diddledan> dual network? red + blue?
[16:00] <diddledan> it's annoying that switch vendors are shoving extra fibre ports on them to justify keeping the price high
[16:00] <diddledan> I see 4 on that unit?
[16:01] <foobarry> AFAIK u need dual homed nodes
[16:08] <NET||abuse> anyone try gnome alongside unity here?
[16:08] <NET||abuse> i'm dying to try it again, been 2 years since i've looked
[16:08] <NET||abuse> but i can't risk my unity environment.
[16:09] <NET||abuse> is 13.10 or 13.12 stable enought to install and run in tandem with unity?
[16:09] <NET||abuse> i'm on 14.04..
[16:12] <diddledan> and this is an example of why version numbers on their own are useless - try being more explicit :-)
[16:13] <diddledan> 13.10 == saucy. 13.12 == beta of trusty?
[16:13] <NET||abuse> blurg, sorry, haha, no, Gnome versions 13.10 and 13.12.. not ubuntu versions
[16:13] <diddledan> >.<
[16:13] <NET||abuse> :)
[16:13] <popey> i think you mean 3.10 and 3.12
[16:14] <NET||abuse> ..... arrg
[16:14] <NET||abuse> i want to stab my own face through the internet now
[16:14] <diddledan> here, let me do that for you
[16:14] <diddledan> *pokity poke poke*
[16:14] <NET||abuse> so back to the question,, has anyone installed Gnome 3.10 or 3.12 alongside unity on ubuntu 14.04?
[16:15] <NET||abuse> any experience on the install proceedure, or making sure your unity doesn't 'splode on you:?
[16:16] <diddledan> if you have the space to spare I'd suggest dual-booting with ubuntu-gnome (is that the right name?)
[16:17] <diddledan> http://ubuntugnome.org/
[16:22] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[16:22] <bigcalm> Is there a utility to test the health of an SSD?
[16:23] <awilkins> Standard disk utility?
[16:23] <awilkins> The cogwheely thing has a SMART / selftest menu
[16:23] <bigcalm> The what?
[16:24] <awilkins> For each disk, there is a button with a cogwheel when you select it
[16:24] <bigcalm> Okay
[16:25] <awilkins> Mine says 1 bad sector
[16:25] <bigcalm> I'll reboot into Ubuntu and hope the system stays stable long enough to run a test
[16:25] <awilkins> Not sure eSata supports full SMART
[16:25] <awilkins> Or maybe SSD doesn't support it
[16:26] <awilkins> Lots more stats on my spinning rust
[16:26] <diddledan> usb doesn't support smart usually afaict
[16:26] <diddledan> esata should be just as capable as internal sata - it's only a different connector otherwise the same
[16:27] <awilkins> Nope... not sure if this eSATA port is just a USB one mounted on a header inside the case or not
[16:27] <awilkins> But some SMART
[16:27] <awilkins> So I guess it's just that the disk doesn't support some metrics
[16:27] <awilkins> 841 power cycles!
[16:27] <awilkins> 1 failed sector
[16:28] <diddledan> a lot of the standard hdd smart stuff is not needed on ssd so they just don't expose it
[16:28] <ali1234> NET||abuse: ubuntu heavily patches gtk which causes a lot of problems in gnome
[16:29] <ali1234> but the patches are only active if unity is installed
[16:29] <ali1234> installing gnome along side unity is unlikely to break unity and very likely to break gnome
[16:30] <diddledan> yey?
[16:30] <diddledan> :-p
[16:30]  * bigcalm drums fingers
[16:32] <bigcalm> Self-test in progress -- 90% remaining
[16:32] <bigcalm> It's been like that for a while
[16:32] <bigcalm> Air temp has increased from 37C to 42C
[16:33] <bigcalm> Is there any need for swap these days?
[16:39] <bigcalm> Oo, 20% done
[16:47] <popey> bigcalm: depends what you do with the computer
[16:55] <bigcalm> popey: what's it good for?
[16:55] <bigcalm> I don't use sleep or hibinate
[16:58] <NET||abuse> so nobobdy tried gnome 3.xx in tandem with unity on 14.04?
[16:58] <NET||abuse> i know you suggested using gnome respin, but I don't have the disk space.
[16:59] <NET||abuse> certainly not the will to repartition :)
[17:44] <intrbiz> bigcalm: I generally don't bother with swap
[17:44] <bigcalm> intrbiz: collecting the keys to our new house on Monday. Unlikely that I'll be attending badminton :S
[17:45] <intrbiz> bigcalm: no worries, seems like an important excuse
[17:45] <bigcalm> Contracts were exchanged today. Flipping stressful time
[17:45] <bigcalm> Ta
[17:48] <intrbiz> bigcalm: and then you've got to move
[17:48] <bigcalm> intrbiz: We gave our 1 month notice to our landlady today. So we have a little time
[17:49] <bigcalm> But the sooner we're out, the less I have to spend on bills for 2 properties
[17:51] <intrbiz> sure
[17:52] <intrbiz> bigcalm: how is the ssd?
[17:52] <bigcalm> intrbiz: still running the SMART test
[17:53] <bigcalm> The machine hasn't frozen yet
[17:53] <intrbiz> bigcalm: right, is it hanging or panicing?
[17:53] <bigcalm> I'm going to reinstall Ubuntu later just to be on the safe side and see how it copes tomorrow
[17:54] <bigcalm> intrbiz: the system appears to slow down over about 10 seconds and then freezes. Have to do a hard reset to use the machine again
[17:54] <bigcalm> Thing is, once I've done a hard reset, it works for the rest of the day without problem
[17:54] <intrbiz> bigcalm: got swap? how much ram?
[17:56] <bigcalm> 8gb ram. Swap is 4.3gb, but swap is off
[17:56] <bigcalm> intrbiz: the freezing happens even if I do nothing with the system
[18:00] <bigcalm> What should I look for in syslog?
[18:00] <bigcalm> I assume that syslog is where kernel panics go
[18:01] <davmor2> bigcalm: oh nice on the house keys dude :)
[18:01] <intrbiz> bigcalm: often a panic only get logged to the console
[18:02] <DJones> bigcalm: Whats the issue with the SSD? Its not a silly boot issue where half the time it fails to boot & goes into a text loop is it?
[18:02] <intrbiz> bigcalm: the last thing in messages before the report might be of interest
[18:03] <bigcalm> DJones: I don't know if there's a problem with the SSD. Just something worth checking
[18:04] <intrbiz> bigcalm: have you tried running memtest, might be worth ruling out dodgy memory
[18:04] <bigcalm> intrbiz: yep, left it running for 2 passes (that takes a long time). No errors
[18:06] <intrbiz> bigcalm: hmm, ok
[18:07] <bigcalm> syslog - http://paste.ubuntu.com/8419845/
[18:08] <bigcalm> There's not /var/log/messages in Ubuntu :| Does it all get sent to syslog instead?
[18:11] <bigcalm> lastlog and faillog are just full of ^@
[18:12] <intrbiz> bigcalm: /var/log/syslog is essentially /var/log/messages, different files names in different distros
[18:13] <bigcalm> Right
[18:13] <bigcalm> SSD check just finished and it passed okay from what I can see
[18:14] <bigcalm> dmesg.0 doesn't show anything helpful that I can see
[18:15] <bigcalm> Xorg.0.log.old - http://paste.ubuntu.com/8419888/
[18:16] <bigcalm> It's not included at the bottom of that paste, but it's full of ^@ when I view the file with less
[18:17] <bigcalm> What other logs might I look at?
[18:20] <daftykins> what's the SMART data on the SSD? smartctl -a /dev/sdX
[18:23] <bigcalm> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8419943/
[18:24] <intrbiz> bigcalm: smart looks fine
[18:25] <popey> \o/ six giffgaff SIMs active!
[18:25] <popey> thats 8 total in this house
[18:25] <popey> ETOOMANYPHONENUMBERS
[18:26] <daftykins> bigcalm: ah have you read about the firmware bug with them, it was meant to only be causing poor read speeds after 6+ months of use, but there may well be an update available
[18:54] <daftykins> ah they must not have released it yet
[18:57] <davmor2> popey: thanks god for addressbooks right ;)
[18:58] <popey> heh
[19:03] <davmor2> popey: it's the best quiz in the world http://www.buzzfeed.com/hannahjewell/can-you-guess-how-old-these-kittens-are?bffbuk#4g9h0q8
[19:07] <popey> 15 out of 15
[19:46] <foobarry> haven't got any cashback  on Gigggaff in yonks
[19:50] <foobarry> i fear my new phone results in requiring new data plan cos i'm browsingn faster now
[19:50] <daftykins> haha
[19:57] <popey> my father in law just bought iphone for him and m-i-l
[19:57] <popey> i sent him a couple of giffgaff sims for them
[19:57] <daftykins> another pair lost ;)
[19:59] <foobarry> my gg sim was old as not a push-out microsim option, so i had to cut with scissors
[19:59] <foobarry> just roughly cut round another micro sim. seems to work ok
[20:00] <daftykins> i was in a similar situation when i bought my Nexus 4. i popped along the high-street here, my telco didn't offer any help but a mate works in a rival telco and chopped it down with a glorified holepunch for me \o/
[20:00] <popey> yeah, i cut my first sim manually when i switched from htc hero to iphone
[20:01] <foobarry> htc hero AKA jimmy hill
[21:12] <diddledan> joy. amazon aws/ec2 two days' notice of reboot
[21:13] <zmoylan-pi> what, are they running windows or something? :-)
[21:14] <diddledan> amazon?
[21:14] <diddledan> I would figure they're running amazon linux
[21:14] <intrbiz> diddledan: I got about 1 months notice for a reboot on mine
[21:15] <diddledan> intrbiz: we did on another machine but this is specifically highlighted as short-notice
[21:15] <intrbiz> diddledan: does it have local storage?
[21:15] <diddledan> the email is subjectified: "Near-term AWS maintenance event notice"
[21:17] <diddledan> they also state "You will not be able to stop/start or re-launch instances in order to avoid this maintenance update."
[21:18] <intrbiz> right
[21:21] <intrbiz> where do ubuntu folk tend to put there server ssl certs / keys?
[21:26] <diddledan> intrbiz: I believe we're moving to /srv/domain.example.com/ssl with the related website at .../htdocs
[21:26] <diddledan> but that's just my co
[21:27] <diddledan> not an official word
[21:27] <intrbiz> diddledan: ok
[21:28] <intrbiz> diddledan: I personally do /etc/apache2/ssl.key and /etc/apache2/ssl.crt
[21:28] <diddledan> the problem with that is you're then limited to one cert
[21:28] <diddledan> so you can't vhost
[21:28] <intrbiz> they are folders containing domain.name.crt or domain.name.key
[21:29] <diddledan> aah
[21:29] <diddledan> I figured files
[21:29] <intrbiz> sorry, I should have been clearer
[21:29] <diddledan> I shouldn't have assumed - "assumption is the mother of all flip-ups"
[21:31] <intrbiz> diddledan: it sure is, but I'm fairly sure life without assumptions is impossible
[21:31] <intrbiz> or at least rather impractical
[21:31] <diddledan> and now I need to find somewhere that has that movie
[21:31] <diddledan> :-p
[21:32] <diddledan> (Under Siege 2: Dark Territory)
[21:32] <diddledan> and yes that is from memory
[21:32] <diddledan> :-p
[21:33] <intrbiz> diddledan: I have a copy here
[21:34] <diddledan> I think I've got a copy on DVD but that's sooo last millenium
[21:34] <intrbiz> shamefully along with a few other Seagal films
[21:55] <bigcalm> intrbiz: /etc/ssl/private for the key & csr /etc/ssl/certs for the cert
[21:55] <bigcalm> I think that might be a debian thing as well
[21:56]  * bigcalm backs up stuff before reinstalling
[21:56] <bigcalm> Going to be a fun evening
[21:56] <intrbiz> bigcalm: yeh, but I really dislike sticking server cers in with a bunch of other certs
[21:56] <intrbiz> certs*
[21:56] <bigcalm> intrbiz: don't put them in the certs dir then, make your own
[21:57] <intrbiz> :)
[21:57] <bigcalm> The private dir will only have snake oil in it
[21:57] <intrbiz> yeh
[22:18] <directhex> intrbiz, i use /etc/ssl/certs/hostname.pem and /etc/ssl/private/hostname.key
[22:34] <diddledan> yeah we like to keep the cert/key on the same filesystem as the website so that in the cloud we can just spin up a new ubuntu machine with our filesystem attached and have everything magically work


[00:12] <bjf> any of the mailinsg list admins about?
[00:12] <pleia2> yep
[00:12] <pleia2> if it's about the spam, I just re-enabled full moderation for non-members
[00:12] <bjf> i'm on the ubuntu kernel team and i run the weekly irc meeting
[00:12] <bjf> pleia2, could be, i'll try resending
[00:13] <nhandler> bjf: Where were you trying to send to?
[00:13] <pleia2> bjf: sorry, what's the trouble?
[00:13] <bjf> pleia2, i just tried to send meeting minutes to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>and it came back
[00:13] <pleia2> you'll want to send to ubuntu-news-team
[00:14] <pleia2> ubuntu-news is announce only
[00:14] <nhandler> bjf: ubuntu-news is locked down now
[00:14] <pleia2> for the ubuntu weekly news exclusively
[00:14] <bjf> ok :-)
[00:16] <bjf> thanks, it's now waiting for moderator approval
[00:16] <pleia2> bjf: accepted and added you to the accept filter
[00:16] <pleia2> interesting that it didn't auto-accept from your canonical address though, hm
[00:16] <bjf> thanks, updating my instructions on where to send
[00:17] <pleia2> ah, I think I see the problem
[00:19] <pleia2> the accept thing was listed as<EMAIL_ADDRESS>rather than<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[00:39] <Pici> Hi! A user in #ubuntu just asked why the UWN wasn't syndicating on planet ubuntu anymore.  I did some digging around and it looks like the UWN posts on the Fridge aren't being tagged with 'PlanetUbuntu', which would put them on the rss feed that gets syndicated to the planet.
[00:40] <nhandler> akgraner: ^^^
[00:41] <Pici> Also, I'm not sure if this is under your control, but the list of tags for each post on the fridge is under each story in such a place where it looks like they actually belong to the next story.
[00:41] <nhandler> Pici: We are moving to Wordpress shortly, so that should get fixed in the transition
[00:42] <Pici> nhandler: great.  I usually read stuff from my feed reader, so I hadn't noticed it until now.
[00:47] <pleia2> the PlanetUbuntu thing is an oversight on some recent posts, thanks for mentioning it, Pici
[00:47] <Pici> pleia2: sure thing
[00:48] <pleia2> and it looks like the latest issue hasn't made it to planet yet at all (it was just published 3 hours ago)
[00:48] <pleia2> s/planet/fridge
[02:09] <zkriesse> akgraner: ping
[02:13] <nhandler> akgraner: Can you s/Freenode/freenode/ in the ~ubuntu-fridge team description?
[02:57] <scott_ev> akgraner: after I do upcomming meetins and evenrs should I be learning somthing else?  Or do you have everything covered?
[02:59] <scott_ev> nhandler: do you have a min or two to look at my wiki to give me any pointers if it needs any changes> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/j.scott.gwin
[03:00] <scott_ev> I would really like to make it past committee the first time if at all possible.
[03:00] <zkriesse> scott_ev: hey i don't think she's there...this for ubuntu membership?
[03:01] <scott_ev> yes
[03:01] <zkriesse> I'll take a look...wiki is my big thing
[03:01] <zkriesse> if you'd like of course
[03:01] <nhandler> scott_ev: Nice wiki. Remember for the Team Memberships area that it is quality, not quantity
[03:01] <scott_ev> I think it's looking good, but another set of eyes is always good
[03:01] <scott_ev> true enough
[03:01] <nhandler> scott_ev: Focus on emphasizing the quality of the contributions you make on those teams instead of the number of teams
[03:02] <scott_ev> nh, OK, I see, there's plenty of stuff I can asdd
[03:02] <scott_ev> thanks for thie time
[03:02] <zkriesse> scott_ev: I agree with nhandler in the fact that you need a bit more description while thinning down the list of actual memberships
[03:03] <zkriesse> If they want to know more they can always ask...which gives you the opportunity to talk about what you do...if you put it all up front then they probably wont ask you a thing...
[03:03] <scott_ev> ok, I actually don't do much if anything tangible with some of those teams because of time restraints
[03:03] <zkriesse> scott_ev: I just went through the process myself so memories are still fresh
[03:03] <nhandler> scott_ev: Also try and diversify the testimonials you have. Maybe add one from someone who can talk about your bug work
[03:03] <scott_ev> great pointws
[03:04] <zkriesse> Also I'd try and get a couple more testimonials for other areas in which you're involved...
[03:04] <scott_ev> nhandler: I used to do tona og bug work and had !6500 karma and dropped out to focus more on my LoCo
[03:04] <scott_ev> ok, makes sense
[03:06] <scott_ev> a problem of mine is I have a a hard time saying no ans get streatched out too fqat
[15:49] <newz2000> Hi, is there still a drive to switch to wordpress? I'm just curious how things are progressing
[17:55] <pleia2> newz2000: yes, but I'm not sure where things are with that
[17:56] <newz2000> pleia2: ok. There's a draft of the new community wordpress theme with the new branding
[17:56] <newz2000> maybe later this week we'll have something usable
[17:56] <newz2000> then we can built a prototype site and begin testing imports
[17:56] <pleia2> great :)
[17:56] <newz2000> should we aim for the end of the month going live?
[17:57] <pleia2> I think at UDS it was proposed that canonical deliver a test fridge system in july, we get to try it out, and launch for real sometime after that
[17:57] <pleia2> but the time table may have changed, I am not sure
[17:58] <newz2000> I*'ll talk to my boss to confirm the times I mentioned. He's interested in gettign this moving though
[17:59] <pleia2> good, we are too :)
[18:02] <pleia2> akgraner: is someone working on the fridge post? I can take a stab at it if not, Pici was in here yesterday ask about it
[18:02] <pleia2> for UWN
[18:26] <akgraner> pleia2, hey!
[18:26] <pleia2> hello :)
[18:26] <akgraner> hey newz2000
[18:26] <akgraner> pleia2, I meant to get up early and post to the Fridge - but as you can see
[18:26] <akgraner> so if no-one has I'll go ahead
[18:27] <pleia2> akgraner: nope, no one has
[18:27] <newz2000> hey akgraner
[18:27] <akgraner> I'll do that now... :-)
[18:27] <akgraner> pleia2, yep those timetables are the ones that were set at UDS
[18:28] <akgraner> mid-july with a 3 week test
[18:28] <pleia2> akgraner: so we're just waiting on canonical to set things up, right?
[18:28] <akgraner> nods
[18:29] <akgraner> we want to post to it  - and allow original content (peer reviewed) to also be allowed
[19:37] <pleia2> akgraner: don't mean to be a nag, but can you add the PlanetUbuntu tag to that fridge post?
[19:39] <akgraner> pleia2, we send it out on personal blogs - about to send it now
[19:39] <pleia2> it's been somewhat inconsistant, and Pici's comment yesterday was from someone who was disappointed in not seeing it hit planet
[19:39] <akgraner> one sec and I will give you the reason behind it
[19:39] <pleia2> ah, any reason we do it that way?
[19:39] <pleia2> k
[19:39] <pleia2> some of the fridge posts have PlanetUbuntu tag, some don't
[19:40] <akgraner> I'm also going to blog about the changes
[19:40] <pleia2> s/fridge/UWN fridge
[19:40] <akgraner> nods
[19:58] <akgraner> ok it's on the fridge and planet putting on the the Forums next
[19:58] <akgraner> I am going to record some howto's this week
[19:59] <akgraner> pleia2, we can tag it with the planet and it will go there  - it already gets added in two places on the Forums when we send it out - which is fine
[20:00] <akgraner> however, letting the Editor-In-Chief add it to the planet seems to have been the tradition to let people know both who the editor is and just a perk.. but I could be wrong and have nothing against changing it and letting it come from The Fridge...
[20:07] <pleia2> ah, it's no big deal, it's just that personal blogs go away over time, fridge links stick around and helps prevent hit-by-a-bus access problems
[20:29] <nhandler> akgraner: I believe John used to do both: post it to the planet via the fridge and via his blog.
[20:42] <zkriesse> scott_ev: ping
[22:22] <akgraner> nhandler, no worries :-) that's an easy fix to do then from now on :-)
[22:22] <nhandler> :)
[22:24] <akgraner> I am working on getting all the howtos to the wikis this week as well as making a couple of videos...
[23:01] <akgraner> scott_ev, per your question earlier - yep I'd like to show you a couple more things  - if you don't mind


[19:05] <meena> holman: have you had a chance to look at my tests
[19:13] <minimal> meena: lol, I've spent the past 2 days solid working on failing growpart tests for my own code changes
[19:15] <minimal> I currently have 9 tests failing :-(
[19:31] <holman> minimal: fyi https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/5204
[19:31] -ubottu:#cloud-init- Pull 5204 in canonical/cloud-init "doc(nocloud): Document network-config file" [Open]
[19:31] <holman> meena: getting to that just now :-)
[19:37] <minimal> holman: Thanks. Will "seedfrom" in /etc/cloud/ config files be mentioned in a separate PR?
[19:38] <holman> no I just missed that comment
[19:38] <holman> one moment
[20:23] <holman> minimal: okay done
[20:24] <holman> minimal: also I added a comment discouraging setting hostname and instance id via commandline
[20:25] <holman> minimal: since those are redundant with the files loaded by seedfrom
[20:30] <minimal> holman: seedfrom doesn't use a "s=" prefix to the URI/URL
[20:30] <minimal> in a /etc/cloud/* file
[20:32] <holman> ahh, copy pasta
[20:34] <holman> fixed, thanks minimal
[20:48] <holman> meena: the exception agregation code is making it a little more difficult to debug
[21:04] <minimal> holman: agreed, that's the problem I've been having for some time with my own changes as well, I've added a fair bit of new stuff and I'm getting exceptions causing testcases to fail when those testcases are supposed to create those exceptions :-(
[21:06] <minimal> woo hoo! I'm down from 9 failed tests to 7 and I don't know exactly what I did to "fix" that lol
[21:06] <Odd_Bloke> Hey folks!  We've just tried to import Fedora 40 as a customer image, and we've hit https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/issues/4911.  Does anyone have a connection with the Fedora maintainer to let them know?
[21:06] -ubottu:#cloud-init- Issue 4911 in canonical/cloud-init "Cloud config schema errors: config.0.subnets.1: Additional properties are not allowed ('ipv6' was unexpected)" [Closed]
[21:07] <Odd_Bloke> (Please don't make me use Bugzilla. Please. :p)
[21:17] <meena> I know people who work for Redhat…
[21:22] <Odd_Bloke> Oh, actually, my bad, I think I misinterpreted the warning messages as more serious than they are, I think there's something else going on.
[21:38] <falcojr> Odd_Bloke: https://github.com/canonical/cloud-init/pull/5191
[21:38] -ubottu:#cloud-init- Pull 5191 in canonical/cloud-init "fix: Add subnet ipv4/ipv6  to network schema" [Merged]


[00:01] <wallyworld> i've not really used the operator framework, but the doc says to use Model.get_binding
[00:01] <wallyworld> the docstring for the Network class
[00:02] <erik_elox> Right... I'm maybe to tired atm. Its kind of late... I'll try more later.
[00:03] <erik_elox> thanx though
[00:04] <wallyworld> do post a question to https://discourse.charmhub.io/ under juju and people can provide a better answer
[00:08] <erik_elox> totally.
[05:13] <erik_elox> https://discourse.charmhub.io/t/how-to-get-dns-address-from-aws-machine-in-my-iaas-charm-code/3789
[09:14] <achilleasa> stickupkid: my yest PR accidentally targeted develop instead of 2.8. Can you take a quick look at the 2.8 backport? https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/12260
[09:40] <manadart> stickupkid or achilleasa, small one: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/12261
[10:44] <manadart> stickupkid or achilleasa, another simple one for juju/description: https://github.com/juju/description/pull/92
[12:20] <achilleasa> manadart: sorry for the delay; looking at the description PR. How is "IsSecondary" meant to be used?
[12:29] <manadart> achilleasa: Ultimately, in conjunction with https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/12195. See https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju/+bug/1863916.
[12:29] <mup> Bug #1863916: network-get does not guarantee that a primary address of an interface will be the first one in bind-addresses <network> <network-get> <sts> <juju:Triaged by manadart> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1863916>
[12:54] <achilleasa> manadart: wouldn't 'IsPrimary' make more sense in this case?
[12:55] <achilleasa> because you might conceivably have a secondary, tertiary (i.e. prioritized) address?
[13:07] <manadart> achilleasa: As I understand it, you only have a primary and 0+ secondaries. This is the short path for compatibility too, because the default will be false.
[13:12] <achilleasa> manadart: wouldn't you still have some logic like 'return !isPrimary()' anyway? So basically, if you do it via IsSecondary, you assume that all addresses are initially primary and you can flag the ones that aren't (if detected) as secondaries?
[13:26] <manadart> I think it's better this way - no migration or upgrade steps are necessary.
[14:46] <stickupkid> achilleasa, hml - fixes the issue with kubeflow on microk8s https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/12262
[16:40] <stickupkid> achilleasa, updated my PR


[04:38] <Tronic> 'lo
[15:44] <mgarces> hi all
[15:44] <mgarces> any experience using daemontools with upstart?
[15:44] <mgarces> and djbdns
[15:45] <suihkulokki> upstart should kinda substite daemontools I thnk
[15:48] <mgarces> oh
[15:48] <mgarces> ok
[15:48] <mgarces> but I'm trying to use djbdns with fedora9 which uses upstart
[15:48] <mgarces> any idea?
[15:51] <sadmac2> mgarces: you could just put it in as a regular sysvinit script
[15:51] <sadmac2> sysv emulation is still the major workhorse in fedora
[15:51] <mgarces> but djbdns need daemontools to work
[15:52] <sadmac2> mgarces: that you could also simply run as a sysvinit script
[15:52] <mgarces> im very confused :P
[15:54] <sadmac2> mgarces: I don't really see how upstart effects you here. Just do it the way you would have done it under sysvinit
[15:55] <mgarces> daemontools does not understand upstart
[15:56] <mgarces> and in order to install it, i need sysviinit
[15:56] <mgarces> nevermind
[15:56] <mgarces> going to try in another way
[15:56] <mgarces> tanx