[00:00] <dmj726> AlanBell: I don't think pure VNC is the best idea actually
[00:00] <AlanBell> a slightly better protocol perhaps
[00:01] <dmj726> In a lot of cases you don't really want to replicate your tablet's screen.
[00:01] <AlanBell> no, I want to replicate the TV screen on the tablet
[00:01] <AlanBell> so I can drag the progress bar with my fingers
[00:01] <AlanBell> so my tablet becomes a touchscreen remote control for the telly
[00:01] <dmj726> Well, that might be *one* good tool, but there are other use cases
[00:02] <dmj726> actually I do think your suggestion is good
[00:02] <AlanBell> possibly scale in memory to 480x270 and vnc that
[00:03] <dmj726> Somebody might want to watch sports, and have their tablet sync with the game to show additional stats for instance
[00:03] <imnichol> What about just replicating the tv controls on your mobile device?
[00:04] <dmj726> imnichol: yeah, a pure remote might be more handy
[00:04] <dmj726> you don't care about having both picture and playback controls duplicated, what you care about is seeing the buttons and the time slider and so forth
[00:04] <imnichol> Yeah
[00:05] <imnichol> And that way we can avoid pushing a bunch of data over the network
[00:05] <dmj726> same for a TV guide app
[00:05] <AlanBell> oh, indeed, TV guide app running locally on a tablet and controlling the TV would be nice
[00:05] <dmj726> would be handy to just keep watching whatever channel, while you switch to the new show.
[00:05] <imnichol> Since the tv would end up sending the picture over the network once for each attached device
[00:06] <AlanBell> ok, I am off to bed, do have a play with pencil and sketch up some concepts!
[00:06] <dmj726> Actually, Novacut would like to have a client running on the TV, but controlled by another client on the tablet.
[00:06] <AlanBell> we should put together a wiki page of concept sketches
[00:06] <imnichol> Doesn't tha tpretty much do exactly what I'm saying?
[00:06] <dmj726> perhaps both tweaked to particular uses
[00:07] <dmj726> yeah, but not vnc style
[00:07] <imnichol> Yeah, ok
[00:07] <imnichol> I got ya.  I'm of the opinion that vnc is not the answer
[00:07] <dmj726> more like the TV guide on tablet style
[00:07] <imnichol> See ya AlanBell
[00:08] <dmj726> I think having VNC as an option is good for when that's actually desired (basically like plugging in a monitor without a physical wire)
[00:08] <imnichol> dmj726: Good point
[00:08] <dmj726> but that shouldn't be the catchall solution
[00:08] <dmj726> since that won't get us great new experiences
[00:17] <dmj726> You know, if you could connect to the TV as a sort of local web server, it might very well be possible to have client GUIs for small apps delivered as websites for a browser or simple client on the tablet's side
[00:17] <dmj726> webkit is actually quite the toolkit these days.
[00:20] <imnichol> Yeah, that actually seems like it would be pretty snazzy
[00:20] <dmj726> ...and easy for developers
[00:38] <dmj726> http://imagebin.org/185388
[00:39] <dmj726> imnichol: ^^
[00:40] <imnichol> What does bfb stand for?
[00:40] <imnichol> Oh, big freaking button
[00:40] <dmj726> big fat buttion
[00:40] <imnichol> Got it
[00:40] <dmj726> the "ubuntu button"
[00:41] <imnichol> So that's like the menu?
[00:41] <dmj726> yeah
[00:41] <dmj726> basically how the dash might look like for tv instead of desktop
[00:41] <imnichol> How does it differ from the dash now?
[00:42] <dmj726> look at it in 11.10
[00:42] <imnichol> I am
[00:42] <dmj726> much more remote friendly
[00:42] <imnichol> ONly thing I see that's different is that the icons are moved
[00:42] <dmj726> and shows things important on a tv
[00:43] <dmj726> like recommendations for TV shows
[00:43] <imnichol> Oh got ya
[00:43] <imnichol> It looks pretty sweet
[01:03] <imnichol> The nice thing about having web-based guis is that it allows people on non-ubuntu devices to integrate with the ubuntu tv
[07:31] <AlanBell> BFB is the "Big Friendly Button" I think
[07:31] <dmj726> hey AlanBell
[07:31] <AlanBell> morning
[07:32] <dmj726> http://imagebin.org/185405
[07:38] <AlanBell> nice
[07:41] <dmj726> So I tried to keep in mind navigating with a remote for the layout
[07:47] <dmj726> AlanBell: pencil is pretty cool
[07:58] <AlanBell> yeah, it is nice
[07:58] <AlanBell> and it is Free software
[07:58] <dmj726> which is good
[07:58] <dmj726> I think the availability of open tools for FOSS development is important
[07:59] <AlanBell> I think the #ubuntu-design team is about assembling open tools for design
[07:59] <AlanBell> so that the canonical design team give up using illustrator and the like
[07:59] <dmj726> Hmm...I hadn't realized they were developing tools for this, nice
[08:00] <AlanBell> so they can collaborate with people
[08:00] <dmj726> Eventually Novacut would like to help with that.
[08:00] <dmj726> Though right now there just aren't enough developer hours to give that much focus at all
[08:01] <AlanBell> indeed
[08:01] <dmj726> We have to achieve many other targets before we can devote resources to that.
[08:02] <dmj726> However, we've done a lot of work as separate components that other projects should be able to benefit from
[08:04] <dmj726> For instance, with dmedia, which handles importing media files from cards and other sources and makes keeping backups and replicating data wherever it's needed easy.  It's obviously important for a collaborative video editor, but it could be useful for other applications with demanding media storage needs.
[08:06] <dmj726> (My intent isn't to brag here, just saying what we're trying to do and where Novacut's focus has to be)
[08:08] <dmj726> Which is basically providing the best collaborative editing experience we can, and helping artists distribute their films on as wide a player base as possible.
[08:09] <dmj726> anyway, The launcher would work basically the same as on desktop, except with arrow key friendliness, and fullscreen only
[08:10] <dmj726> It might make sense down the line to support split screen as well, but that's a thought for later
[08:12] <dmj726> The idea with "view all" would be sort of a grid view thumbnailing all the open applications.
[08:14] <dmj726> Basically letting you see exactly what's running, see what it's doing, and switch to or end any of them.  I suspect this would be a useful feature, when switching between apps.
[08:33] <dmj726> hi willcooke
[08:35] <dmj726> willcooke: http://imagebin.org/185405
[08:35] <dmj726> plus possible window dashboard view: http://imagebin.org/185417
[08:54] <willcooke> dmj726, morning!  Love it!!  I'll forward to the design team
[08:54] <dmj726> sweet
[08:59] <dmj726> willcooke: I just pasted those up for being quick and easy
[09:00] <dmj726> ...if you want a permanent reference, just copy and host them somewhere else
[09:00] <dmj726> I need to sleep atm
[09:03] <AlanBell> willcooke: do you have all the backscroll from last night?
[09:08] <AlanBell> 22:25 < AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/programlens.png
[09:08] <AlanBell> 22:25 < AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/controlsinpanel.png
[09:08] <AlanBell> 22:25 < AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/progresspanel.png
[09:08] <AlanBell> 22:29 < AlanBell> the .ep files that open in pencil are in that folder too
[09:22] <willcooke> AlanBell, I'll review the logs
[09:22] <willcooke> Love the designs - it looks like unity should work well on the 10ft UI
[09:25] <willcooke> I appreciate I'm beginning to sound like a stuck record, but I'm really amazed by how quickly you guys have got moving on this.
[10:31] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/
[10:33] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles/#
[17:29] <AlanBell> ok, I am liking pencil now :) http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly
[22:54] <MrChrisDruif> AlanBell; you on?
[23:02] <AlanBell> yus
[23:02] <AlanBell> wassup MrChrisDruif?
[23:03] <MrChrisDruif> Nothing much, you?
[23:04] <AlanBell> see my wireframe stuff?
[23:04] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly
[23:04] <MrChrisDruif> Now I do =)
[23:04] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles for the pencil source images and unity.zip is a pencil output theme for ubuntu
[23:04] <MrChrisDruif> What is that BFB?
[23:05] <AlanBell> ubuntu.zip even
[23:05] <AlanBell> big friendly button
[23:05] <MrChrisDruif> Ahh, the Dash button (that thing to open up the dash?)
[23:05] <MrChrisDruif> ?
[23:05] <AlanBell> yes, the big friendly button :)
[23:10] <AlanBell> don't pay too much attention to my scribbles
[23:11] <AlanBell> the point is that if you use pencil and start with http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles/BaseDesignFrame.ep
[23:11] <AlanBell> then you can create actual sketches and storyboards for the design concept
[23:14] <MrChrisDruif> Ahh, you're back =)
[23:14] <MrChrisDruif> I was just planning on calling it a night =)
[23:14] <MrChrisDruif> But what does the BFB do?
[23:15] <AlanBell> I don't know
[23:15] <MrChrisDruif> AlanBell; ^
[23:15] <AlanBell> does what you want it to do,
[23:16] <AlanBell> I haven't really given it that much thought, I have been working on a wireframing and storyboarding framework
[23:16] <AlanBell> so that other people can do design concepts
[23:16] <MrChrisDruif> Alright
[23:16] <MrChrisDruif> It's just a placeholder =)
[23:17] <AlanBell> yeah, the only reason I did so many pages was to get a scrollbar to happen
[23:17] <MrChrisDruif> (I love working on this project)
[23:17] <MrChrisDruif> Haha
[23:17] <AlanBell> and I wanted to do one with a remote by the side of the TV
[23:18] <AlanBell> BaseDesignFrame.ep is a blank template, basically just the first frame of the concept series
[23:18] <MrChrisDruif> Yup, a nice flair would have been a "big" Ubuntu button on that remote. But that's just for lolz
[23:18] <AlanBell> it gives you an empty telly of the right proportions on which to draw your design
[23:19] <AlanBell> slap one on, I hate the orange remote
[23:19] <MrChrisDruif> Haha
[23:19] <AlanBell> Just wanted the shape to show where people should do remote design
[23:19] <MrChrisDruif> You made the screen part 1/4 of the resolution of 1080p I gather from your earlier mockups?
[23:20] <AlanBell> yes, the coordinates are at the bottom of the first slide
[23:20] <MrChrisDruif> Btw, what about strange resolutions?
[23:20] <AlanBell> you can add page description text
[23:21] <AlanBell> what strange resolutions?
[23:21] <MrChrisDruif> Like the CinemaTV from Philips
[23:21] <MrChrisDruif> It's got 2560x1080 if I'm not mistaken
[23:22] <MrChrisDruif> 21:9 format that is
[23:22] <AlanBell> so it is
[23:22] <AlanBell> well that would probably work fine, vertical height is 1080 still
[23:22] <AlanBell> high res stuff would just work
[23:23] <AlanBell> but I think we have to design for 1920x1080
[23:23] <MrChrisDruif> Yes, but "TV" broadcasts are 16:9 (in full color) while movies are 21:9 (hence the weird format for it, there are two black bars in movies to fill the screen nonetheless)
[23:23] <AlanBell> like mercedes design their cars in silver
[23:24] <AlanBell> they come out in different colours, but the design models are always silver
[23:24] <MrChrisDruif> I meant more of: will we be able to support it and maybe even saide-by-side viewing?
[23:25] <AlanBell> dunno
[23:25] <MrChrisDruif> Something to think about I think =)
[23:29] <MrChrisDruif> I'd have to use pencil to use those files?
[23:29] <AlanBell> yes
[23:30] <MrChrisDruif> Did anyone speak with the design team and OEM team already? So we don't do work that has been done already
[23:31] <AlanBell> willcooke was going to talk to the design team
[23:31] <MrChrisDruif> Hmm, we didn't assign actions on those items *mental note for next time*
[23:32] <MrChrisDruif> Alright, great and the OEM team?
[23:32] <AlanBell> I am talking to them about using pencil for wireframing and storyboarding, this is an example for that
[23:33] <AlanBell> dunno if anyone asked the OEM team, I saw Chris Kenyon joined the launchpad group
[23:36] <MrChrisDruif> The OEM team was about deciding for what kind of hardware we would be developing this (part of the) system for right?
[23:42] <MrChrisDruif> Alright, that's it. I'm off =) Talk to ya later AlanBell =)
[23:42] <AlanBell> o/