[18:27] <CrazyLemon> hey guys. where could i get Ubuntu Manual logo in preferably .svg format? :)
[18:35] <CarstenG> Hi CrazyLemon
[18:36] <CrazyLemon> hey CarstenG
[18:37] <CarstenG> Did you had a look to the repository?
[18:37] <CarstenG> I guess there is one?
[18:38] <CrazyLemon> CarstenG you mean on launchpad?
[18:38] <CarstenG> yes
[18:40] <CarstenG> Have a look to the »lulu-en_US.svg« in the directory »titlepage« of the saucy branch.
[18:41] <CrazyLemon> yea..thats the front page.. i'm looking for the logo http://ubuntu-manual.org/images/header.png
[18:42] <CrazyLemon> oh wait..its there but its tiny..  it will do
[18:42] <CrazyLemon> tnx CrazyLemon
[18:42] <CrazyLemon> blah
[18:42] <CarstenG> Yes, and in this file the logo is included.
[18:42] <CrazyLemon> CarstenG *
[18:42] <CrazyLemon> yea.. i didnt see it the first time :)
[18:42] <CarstenG> :-)
[18:43] <CarstenG> What do you want to do with it?
[18:44] <CrazyLemon> CarstenG i wanna include ubuntu manual in a custom localized ubuntu
[18:44] <CarstenG> You are doing a own distro?
[18:45] <CrazyLemon> CarstenG naah.. ubuntu but localized and with some localized stuff in it
[18:46] <CarstenG> ah, ok
[19:09] <CrazyLemon> tnx guys and take care


[00:28] <LjL> Pici: not only it isn't, but "tell" doesn't really work
[03:19] <Mac_Taylor> how long does it take for an email from kline?
[03:30] <nalioth> Mac_Taylor: this is the wrong channel to be asking in
[03:30] <Mac_Taylor> o
[23:05] <Pici> md5
[23:05] <Pici> arg
[23:06] <Pici> I need to move this window away from ubottu, seriously.
[23:09] <LjL> Pici: agreed
[23:09] <LjL> you're becoming a little joke by now


[06:44] <Kilos> o/
[09:44] <ahoneybun> o/
[10:12] <elacheche> o/ ahoneybun
[10:12] <ahoneybun> hey elacheche
[10:14] <ahoneybun> we should have a meeting on 9/8 right?
[10:14] <ahoneybun> for pavlushka ?
[10:16] <elacheche> ahoneybun: this is not the place to talk about that :D
[10:20] <pavlushka> Hello elacheche ahoneybun  :)
[10:21] <elacheche> Hey pavlushka
[10:21] <ahoneybun> opps
[10:21] <ahoneybun> oh well


[09:38] <balgkarbr> Hi
[10:43] <knome> pleia2, so, already remember what time you're landing?
[10:43] <pleia2> 13:55 on sunday
[10:44] <knome> pleia2, mm-hmm, i'm in a few hours later
[10:44] <knome> do you have plans for the first night?
[10:44] <pleia2> nope
[10:44] <knome> maybe we should meet at the hotel and then leave for the city?
[10:45] <pleia2> assuming there aren't any volcanos or anything, sure :)
[10:45] <pleia2> (both european UDSs I went to I got to much later in the day than expected)
[10:46] <knome> lol
[10:47] <knome> there might be some snow (!), but it should be fine
[10:47] <pleia2> I love snow!
[10:47] <knome> yeah, first snow for this winter came last night
[11:14] <knome> pleia2, we got to attend "empowering flavors" on monday (about managing/controlling our own release schedule)
[11:26] <pleia2> k
[11:42] <astraljava> Why is there nothing on "trolling your own release schedule"?
[11:42] <astraljava> Come to think of it, adding 'con' in front, does it make it more positive?
[11:46] <knome> :P
[12:14] <knome> ok, xubuntu uds sessions scheduled!
[12:14] <knome> one is on monday, antoher on thursday
[12:17] <ochosi> uuh, monday is bad for me
[12:17] <ochosi> will there be some way to remotely participate
[12:17] <ochosi> i mean as in: skype conference call or google-hangout?
[12:17] <knome> ochosi, i'm certain there is
[12:17] <knome> ochosi, we can just leave the art stuff for thursday
[12:17] <ochosi> (i mean _participate_, not just watch the feed)
[12:18] <knome> we will set something up.
[12:18] <ochosi> ok
[12:18] <ochosi> actually meh, thursday might also be bad
[12:18] <knome> on thursday, the session is at 10CET
[12:18] <ochosi> depends on the daytime
[12:18] <ochosi> ah
[12:18] <ochosi> that might work
[12:18] <knome> mmh
[12:18] <knome> if you want us to make sure it's at a specified time, please tell me as soon as possible, and i'll try to get the time fixed
[12:19] <ochosi> well yes, my aunt and cousing are coming to visit me that day
[12:19] <ochosi> they'll arrive shortly after noon
[12:19] <ochosi> so i guess before that would be good
[12:19] <knome> right
[12:20] <knome> before noon CET?
[12:20] <ochosi> yup
[12:20] <ochosi> so 10 CET sounds perfect in fact
[12:20] <ochosi> oh wait, will we have dailight-saving time by next week?
[12:21] <knome> yes, sunday
[12:21] <knome> but so does CET, it's not fixed
[12:21] <ochosi> yeah, just wanted to make sure we're talking about the same thing
[12:22] <ochosi> the session lasts 1hr?
[12:22] <knome> 45mins
[12:22] <ochosi> k
[12:22] <knome> the next session starts at 11CET though, so i'm quite sure we can go over a bit
[12:22] <knome> and as long as there are other rooms available, we can move to those
[12:23] <ochosi> mhm
[12:24] <knome> i've asked to fix the session to 10CET
[12:34] <ochosi> thanks
[12:35] <knome> heh, i'm told that's not possible
[12:35] <knome> but if you see it jump around, poke me
[12:35] <knome> we can try to keep a session at that time anywa
[12:35] <knome> +y
[21:14] <ashNOP> Hi, is xfwm4  on xfce-4.10 must restore window geometry after it was tiled? Or this feature present but not working?
[21:15] <ochosi> it should restore the window geometry
[21:15] <ochosi> but i'm not sure it always works


[09:53] <jacekn> hello. I it possible for a subordinate charm to establish 2 relations to its master?
[10:51] <jacekn> are there know problems with juju from ppa:juju/stable ? https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1399606
[10:51] <mup> Bug #1399606: juju bootstrap of local environment failing <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1399606>
[11:24] <ezobn> lazyPower: Not had time yesterday - just create https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1399613
[11:24] <mup> Bug #1399613: juju-core not using constraints when creating KVM  unit on maas machine <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1399613>
[14:08] <lazyPower> jacekn: its certainly possible to have 2 relationships with a sub to a service.
[14:17] <jacekn> lazyPower: thanks, this is good news for me
[15:13] <plars> is there a ?-relation-changed hook that should fire when the config on a subordinate charm is changed? I'm trying to do something like that and someone recommended container-relation-changed, but it's not working for me
[15:19] <lazyPower> plars: only if the relationship name between the service and your sub is 'container'
[15:19] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: do we allow juju-info-relation-changed hooks? i haven't actually tried to do this before.
[15:19] <lazyPower> i'm iffy on if that'll work as juju-info is reserved
[15:19] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: yes, if the relation name is called juju-info
[15:19] <plars> lazyPower: ah, so we have to have an explicit relationship name for it?
[15:19] <marcoceppi> but don't call the relation juju-info
[15:19] <lazyPower> yeah
[15:19] <lazyPower> so if your relationship is like such
[15:19] <lazyPower> relation: foo
[15:19] <marcoceppi> plars: you can use the juju-info interface
[15:19] <lazyPower> interface: bar
[15:20] <lazyPower> its foo-relation-changed
[15:20] <plars> marcoceppi: how do you mean?
[15:20] <marcoceppi> plars: http://paste.ubuntu.com/9383535/
[15:21] <marcoceppi> juju-info, as an interface, is what you really need, but don't use "juju-info" as the releation name, instead name it something more useful
[15:21] <plars> thanks, I'll give it a try
[15:27] <ejat> hi tvansteenburgh
[15:27] <ejat> how r ya ?
[15:29] <tvansteenburgh> hey ejat
[15:30] <ejat> did u already have time to fix and update the limesurvey charm ?
[15:30]  * ejat no worries .. just asking ..
[15:32] <tvansteenburgh> ejat, i got the install fixed but there is still a prob in the db-relation-changed hook
[15:33] <ejat> thanks for the update.
[15:33] <ejat> do u file the bugs ? maybe i can subscribe and follow the bugs :)
[15:34] <tvansteenburgh> ejat, no i haven't
[15:36] <ejat> maybe need to seek Clint Byrum help on this
[15:36] <tvansteenburgh> ejat https://bugs.launchpad.net/charms/+source/limesurvey
[15:36] <tvansteenburgh> looks like bugs already reported
[15:36] <ejat> owh ..
[15:36] <ejat> ok thanks tvansteenburgh
[15:39] <ejat> install hook reported
[15:39] <ejat> but not the db-relation-changed
[15:39] <ejat> right ?
[15:41] <tvansteenburgh> whoever fixes install will see that db- is broken
[15:45] <ejat> :)
[17:15] <ejat> hi ...
[17:15] <ejat> im facing this for hpcloud
[17:15] <ejat> http://paste.ubuntu.com/9384755/
[17:15] <ejat> can someone help me?
[17:16] <jose> ejat: are you sure your credentials are correct?
[17:16] <jose> and all the settings are correctly put on the environments.yaml file?
[17:17] <ejat> yups .. ive checked
[17:18] <ejat> A common mistake is
[17:18] <ejat> to specify the wrong tenant. Use the OpenStack "project" name
[17:18] <ejat> for tenant-name in your environment configuration.
[17:18] <ejat> need to create project name 1st?
[17:18] <ejat> then put that name in .yaml??
[17:19] <jcastro> marcoceppi, can you this this one up? http://askubuntu.com/questions/554246/deploying-openstack-with-just-two-machines-with-juju
[17:21] <marcoceppi> jcastro: following up
[17:23] <ejat> can i use userpass instead of keypair ?
[17:23] <ejat> or best recommend keypair?
[17:23] <jcastro> I've used both but I think they recommend keypair
[17:24] <jose> ejat: when I set up hpcloud a couple months ago, I followed the instructions at jujucharms.com/docs and found no errors
[17:25] <jose> have you checked those?
[17:25] <jcastro> there should be a screenshot pointing to where the exact tebnant name is
[17:25]  * ejat checking and syncing with the docs ..
[17:26] <ejat> jcastro: i already put same as it is
[17:26] <ejat> should i create another project?
[17:26] <jcastro> marcoceppi, I also tossed some bounties on the openstack and maas tags to motivate folks if you want to do the same
[17:26] <marcoceppi> ack
[17:27] <ejat> because xxx-default-tenant
[17:27] <ejat> because mine was xxx-default-tenant
[17:31] <ejat> because last time i use userpass ...
[17:31] <ejat> :(
[17:31] <jcastro> ok so  you want to switch it to userpass?
[17:33] <jcastro> ejat, how about this? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/9385015/
[17:42] <ejat> i think ... im having problem while im using this as my identity https://region-a.geo-1.identity.hpcloudsvc.com:35357/v3/
[17:42] <ejat> is there any problem if i use 2.0 and 3 ?
[17:43] <ejat> jcastro: http://paste.ubuntu.com/9385155/
[17:43] <designate> I am trying to bootstrap an environment using maas/juju (latest stable versions of both) but I'm getting the following error: "401 OK (Authorization Error: 'Expired timestamp: given<PHONE_NUMBER> and now<PHONE_NUMBER> has a greater difference than threshold 300')" despite the fact that I have configured an NTP server in MAAS that is reachable by all servers.
[17:46] <marcoceppi> designate: is your local computer also ntpdated?
[17:46] <jcastro> ejat, huh unsure on that one, have you seen that before on hpcloud sinzui?
[17:46] <designate> marcoceppi: if by local computer, you mean the machine I'm running "juju bootstrap" from, then yes...it is also the maas box
[17:47] <marcoceppi> designate: interesting
[17:47] <designate> my "local" computer's time will in no way affect maas or juju as I am SSHd into the box.
[17:48] <marcoceppi> personally, I've never seen that error, it's being generated by maas and not juju
[17:48] <marcoceppi> is that error presented during the bootstrap phase or when you run juju status after bootstrap?
[17:48] <marcoceppi> are you using fastpath installer?
[17:48] <marcoceppi> what version of juju?
[17:49] <designate>  1.20.13-0ubuntu1~14.04.1~juju1
[17:49] <sinzui> ejat, I don't know about auth version, but i can tell you in a few minutes. I have been using v2
[17:49] <designate> it happens during "juju bootstrap"
[17:49] <designate> yes I am using fastpath installer
[17:50] <ejat> sinzui: owh okie ...
[17:50] <ejat> sinzui: http://paste.ubuntu.com/9385155/
[17:50] <sinzui> ejat, my https://horizon.hpcloud.com/project/access_and_security/ doesn't let me use v3, it just permits v2
[17:50]  * sinzui tries anyway
[17:53] <sinzui> ejat, I cannot use v3, but that might be because Hp doesn't list it as my as my identity endpoint
[17:58] <ejat> brb
[19:07] <jumpkick> I'm running on ubuntu 14.10, when I try to deploy my 3rd charm after juju-gui and another charm it is failing with a 1 hook failed "install", what's the best way to troubleshoot this (I
[19:07] <jumpkick> (I'm a juju noob)
[19:08] <jumpkick> I've already destroyed and recreated the environment with juju-quickstart twice
[19:30] <jcastro> jose, yo yo
[19:30] <jose> jcastro: hey!
[19:30] <jcastro> mbruzek, 30 minute warning!
[19:30] <jcastro> jose, ^^
[19:30] <mbruzek> ack
[19:30] <jose> I have to leave real quick (less than 10m) and I'll be back here
[19:30] <jose> don't worry
[19:45] <mbruzek> jose are you going to give me a link
[19:45] <jose> mbruzek: I am, yes
[19:47] <lazyPower> jumpkick: hey sorry about the latent reply
[19:47] <lazyPower> jumpkick: there's a few things you can do 1) would be to investigate the log output - but that can be cumbersome, especially with an hour of log spam piling on top of that
[19:48] <lazyPower> 2) use juju debug-hooks to attach to the unit, run juju resolved --retry in another terminal to enter the hook context and run the hook interactively to find the failure (and optionally correct the broken behavior)
[19:48] <lazyPower> jumpkick: if you've got the time, we did an excellent charm school over this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjERFuBs2S8
[19:53] <jcastro> jose, hangout URL?
[19:54] <jose> I sent you an invite
[19:54] <mbruzek> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYegIWRyr0b1jvjaNiDlQDG_L-JKYd8WtjRoU-pWwUxGVqPDTw
[19:54] <jcastro> ok fellas
[19:54] <jcastro> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYegIWRyr0b1jvjaNiDlQDG_L-JKYd8WtjRoU-pWwUxGVqPDTw
[20:01] <jose> #ubuntu-on-air
[20:02] <cory_fu> ubuntuonair.com still shows the Ubuntu Community Q&A video instead of the charm school
[20:03] <skay> same here
[20:04] <mbruzek> Jorge that is enough
[20:04] <cory_fu> Video is here, though: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17FFAhhHPLI
[20:04] <kwmonroe> :)
[20:04] <mbruzek> I have all this stuff in my script
[20:04] <mbruzek> you are stealing all my best material
[20:04] <skay> cory_fu: thannks :)
[20:04] <kwmonroe> page 2 man!  page 2!
[20:04] <mbruzek> jcastro
[20:05] <jose> huh, let's give it another update
[20:05] <jcastro> is he supposed to be showing slides?
[20:06] <jose> no, there's people saying ubuntuonair is not showing the right video
[20:07] <jcastro> still the old video for me
[20:09] <jose> jcastro: can you try refreshing now, please?
[20:09] <jcastro> works!
[20:10] <jose> \o/
[20:15] <kwmonroe> :)  good lookin out for creds jose
[20:15] <jose> :P
[20:37] <kwmonroe> jcastro: you froze up 1/2 way through the "over arching question" itnro
[20:37] <jcastro> that's ok
[20:37] <skay> uh oh. repeat the question when you come back
[20:37] <jcastro> it's hard locked now
[20:38] <jcastro> it has not been a good hangout week for me
[20:38] <kwmonroe> excellent thumbnail.  you look so happy.
[20:38] <jcastro> jose, QUESTION: Do we have any things in place to allow people to host their own internal charm store?
[20:38] <jose> ack
[20:38] <jose> will ask in a min
[20:39] <jose> jcastro: invited you, try joining again
[20:40] <jcastro> sec, it's a chromebook, trying to figure out how to reboot it
[20:40] <jose> :P
[20:40] <jose> take the battery out?
[20:42] <jose> jcastro: just asked :P
[20:51] <jumpkick> lazyPower: thanks I'll watch that video and give juju resolved --retry a go
[21:02] <jumpkick> I ran juju debug-hooks on my failed charm...   byobu-tmux is going nuts spewing the statusbar all up the screen and "byobu-screen" tells me I can't use it because root doesn't own /home/ubuntu
[21:02] <jumpkick> sigh, I wish gnome terminal would not have this problem
[21:05] <jumpkick> holy crap, I just fixed it by setting the character set to UTF-8
[21:18] <marcoceppi> jumpkick: we experienced that issue elsewhere, it may be worth while mentioning that in the docs
[22:26] <jumpkick> lazyPower: Watching your debugging hooks youtube video - the reason your mediawiki test curl failed to pull up media wiki is because you needed to provide "-L" to follow redirects ...
[22:26] <jumpkick> though I'm guessing somebody already mentioned it by now... lol
[22:32] <lazyPower> jumpkick: i was super excited to be leaving to see my family - so i was going 90mph and not thinking straight - is what i've chalked it up to
[22:35] <whit> anybody here ever wish they could embed a charm in a repository? sort of like how folks embed packaging metadata with the code for an application?
[22:39] <lazyPower> i do
[22:39] <lazyPower> having a metadata.yaml or charm.yaml that handles the details for me would be tops
[22:39] <lazyPower> just point juju @ my repo and let it go


[02:50] <james0r> bought a nvidia geforce 210 card, installed the newest proprietary drivers and although everything runs pretty well the glmark2 rating is a lot lower than what i get if i run it with my integrated intel video.
[03:16] <TruKr> Is there anyone here?
[03:17] <ObrienDave> nope
[03:17] <TruKr> Oh,OK
[03:17] <ObrienDave> greetings & welcome
[03:17] <TruKr> :)
[03:19] <TruKr> I am, well, a noob I guess, I just installed this yesterday, well just because.  I tried to install catlist for my amd gpu, but it says I need to be superuser?
[03:20] <TruKr> I found something about it, in terminal window I can get it to show root, but on the desktop the installer still says I should be this super user.
[03:20] <ObrienDave> add 'sudo' to front. type in your password when prompted
[03:21] <ObrienDave> try not to run terminal in root mode. dangerous for new users
[03:22] <TruKr> only place I found to do so, if I log  out, I can not log in as root
[03:23] <ObrienDave> because there is no root password in Ubuntu
[03:23] <ObrienDave> !root
[03:24] <TruKr> but add sudo to front?  It has been years so I am a windoze dummy now
[03:24] <ObrienDave> yes, sudo apt-get install <package>
[03:25] <ObrienDave> try this, sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[03:25] <ObrienDave> copy and paste to terminal
[03:27] <TruKr> Oh, OK will do
[03:27] <ObrienDave> i run those commands every day to keep system updated
[03:29] <ObrienDave> the && is a logical 'trap' to prevent following commands from executing if the previous one fails
[03:30] <TruKr> OK, uhhh, that did a lot of stuff, too fast to read, what did I do?
[03:31] <ObrienDave> updated repo info and then upgraded all installed packages to latest versions
[04:06] <e87hd> I am still getting weird locked screen issues
[04:07] <e87hd> I have recently changed to a proprietary driver for my nvidia card
[04:07] <e87hd> I did that to try and fix the issue
[04:07] <e87hd> but it is still happening
[04:07] <e87hd> has anyone seen this sort of thing before?
[04:07] <holstein> e87hd: you can try the vesa driver.. but, it could also be hardware related
[04:08] <holstein> e87hd: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1270209 i would just put it in place "as-is" and see if you can make the issue happen
[04:08] <holstein> when you mentioned it before, you made it seem like it happened rarely, and it may be difficult to trigger. i would also be interested in seeing the hardware in an officially supproted operating system, to see that its not malfuctioning
[04:10] <ObrienDave> someone suggested this earlier; mattxtn> followed posts 7 and 16 @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-power-manager/+bug/1357090
[04:10] <ObrienDave> sorry if it's not the correct issue
[04:11] <e87hd> well it seems to be happening almost every time now
[04:11] <e87hd> I will take a picture of it next time with my phone
[04:11] <e87hd> seems that it is different each time what is on the screen
[04:11] <holstein> e87hd: so, worse with the proprietary driver, then? the driver *did* seem to effect the issue?
[04:11] <e87hd> yes
[04:11] <e87hd> not worse, or better
[04:11] <e87hd> just messed up differently
[04:12] <holstein> e87hd: there are other drivers... but, i think it still could be the hardware failing.. how is it with the vesa driver?
[04:12] <e87hd> either way, as soon as I enter my passwd and hit enter, it unlocks and works normally
[04:12] <e87hd> I have not tried the vesa driver
[04:12] <holstein> e87hd: ok.. im not following the issue.. you mean, its *just* on the lock screen?
[04:13] <e87hd> yes
[04:13] <e87hd> ok
[04:13] <e87hd> i just locked my screen
[04:13] <e87hd> and it did it again
[04:13] <e87hd> i took a picture
[04:14] <e87hd> hold on
[04:14] <holstein> e87hd: i would just *not* lock the screen, then
[04:14] <holstein> e87hd: i would keep in mind, you were not promised driver support for linux by the manufacturer of the hardware, and just file a bug report, and work with the issue. i thought it was on the regular desktop
[04:14] <holstein> !bug
[04:15] <holstein> i mean, i see fiddly things like that all the time, on all the devices i run operating systems on that were not promised to support that operating system
[04:15] <e87hd> http://imgur.com/2L5bVOs
[04:16] <e87hd> ok
[04:16] <holstein> right. i would just *not* lock my screen.. i would just remove that locker, and use xtrlock or something else
[04:16] <holstein> !info xtrlock
[04:17] <e87hd> ok
[04:34] <e87hd> holstein, you ever hear from that guy again about backups?
[04:35] <holstein> e87hd: hmm... i dont think so..
[09:17] <james0r> added the xubuntu staging repo and updated yesterday, just noticing now that the power manager no longer has an option to display icon in system tray. where would this be handled?
[09:19] <james0r> ahh i see there is a new power manager plugin now that takes its place. even better. well done.
[09:20] <james0r> consolidates my notebook power and wireless mouse power into one too, very nice.
[09:38] <akis> hi all. does anyone know why panel's software reminder is missing on 14.04?
[09:42] <akis> i mean panel's update software reminder. This one which under 12.04 was like an orange star.
[09:43] <akis> no pop-up reminder also for update software when updates are available.
[09:43] <akis> any opinion or solution on this?
[09:50] <koegs> akis: did you check the autostart-settings?
[09:51] <akis> koegs: where can i find this?
[09:51] <koegs> Settings > Session and Startup > App Autostart
[09:51] <koegs> name should be something like "Update Notifier"
[09:52] <akis> koegs, i am looking to...
[09:54] <akis> koegs: it is already enabled (by default)!
[09:55] <koegs> then i am already out of ideas :)
[09:57] <akis> koegs: but it seems that it doesnt work. righti now while we are chating the system asked for an update (menu editor) and doesnt open any pop-up, either showed the orange star on notification area but only opened a new window button next to other open applications windows.
[10:09] <akis> koegs: hmmm have a look here, they report the problem since 13.10 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-notifier/+bug/1246364
[10:12] <akis> why the 'update-notifier' remains ticked in 'app-autostart' in current version (14.04) if it doesn't work since 13.10 was out?
[10:26] <brainwash> akis: don't you get update notifications (popup window)?
[10:27] <akis> brainwash: no. either the icon on panel. only minimize windows, as it is described on bug's report. under 12.04 everything worked excellent.
[10:28] <brainwash> so the update-notifier autostart entry most likely triggers the minimized windows then
[10:28] <akis> brainwash: nand if it is a decision to stop notification why it is left the 'update-notifier' ticked by default inside 'app-autostart'?
[10:29] <akis> brainwash: maybe it is an explanation. i didn't understand it like this.
[10:31] <brainwash> only the tray icon is gone
[10:33] <brainwash> now you get a window instead
[10:34] <brainwash> the update-notifier is maintained by the ubuntu/unity devs, sadly it does not look like they will bring back the old tray icon functionality
[10:38] <akis> brainwash: thank you for this explanation. i will miss the tray icon!
[11:36] <cfhowlett> where are the sound files located in xubuntu???
[11:36] <cfhowlett> i.e. system sounds
[11:37] <slickymasterWork> cfhowlett, do you mean for event sounds?
[11:41] <cfhowlett> slickymasterWork, yeah, just found them.  thanks
[11:41] <slickymasterWork> np cfhowlett
[11:46] <AlexRussia> hi folks.I have problem with mount 3Q external hard drive to my system(its not display as device).What i could to do?
[11:47] <bazhang> !blkid
[11:49] <AlexRussia> bazhang, http://paste.ubuntu.com/8259031/plain/
[11:56] <AlexRussia> bazhang, something new? @_@
[11:56] <bazhang> patience AlexRussia
[11:57] <AlexRussia> bazhang, this is not my better part ;)
[11:57] <bazhang> AlexRussia, wait for someone who can help, you may also post on askubuntu.com and ubuntuforums
[11:59] <AlexRussia> bazhang, so, you just do not know why its do not exist as device?
[12:00] <bazhang> AlexRussia, please ask the channel every 10-15 minutes, and wait patiently for a response
[12:01] <AlexRussia> bazhang, this is your exclusive way to do nothing? @_@
[12:02] <knome> AlexRussia, please remember we are all volunteers here and please adjustyour attitude accordingly.
[12:04] <AlexRussia> knome, please remember i am are not you
[12:06] <knome> AlexRussia, if you can't follow the channel guidelines, you should leave the channel and use other methods to get help.
[12:07] <AlexRussia> knome, my help methods is move my drive with your iso in start to my external hd which can't be mount.and after it all i'll never come back to here
[12:11] <knome> AlexRussia, okay... have fun.
[12:11] <AlexRussia> knome, do you think is fun? you are crazy.
[12:12] <cfhowlett> !patience | AlexRussia, for instant answers, purchase a support package from canonical.  otherwise, please wait PATIENTLY.
[12:13] <AlexRussia> >purchase a support package from canonical
[12:14] <AlexRussia> yes, probability if i had arch iso, support may be better....
[12:14] <knome> AlexRussia, you are free to use arch. please do not let us stop you from doing so
[12:15] <AlexRussia> knome, i free.but i am not sure i don't rewrite my mbr again :(
[12:15] <cfhowlett> AlexRussia, www.archlinux.org
[12:15] <AlexRussia> cfhowlett, #archlinux ;)
[12:15] <knome> AlexRussia, maybe there's a language barrier, you can ask in a local channel:
[12:15] <knome> !ru | AlexRussia
[12:16] <AlexRussia> knome, ...and???
[12:16] <AlexRussia> knome, nothing happen ;)
[12:17] <knome> AlexRussia, #ubuntu-ru
[12:17] <AlexRussia> ah
[12:17] <AlexRussia> knome, ubottu are your bot?
[12:17] <knome> AlexRussia, ubottu is a bot, i am not.
[12:18] <AlexRussia> knome, its too slow bot ;)
[12:18] <knome> it's lagging right now. now please let's stay with the support questions.
[12:27] <AlexRussia> knome, i am sorry, problem probability not in  system, but in device.My friend check it use him window(8) and its do not even seen as device :(
[12:28] <cfhowlett> efi / uefi issues is my bet
[13:23] <garandil> Is there any quick way to change to runlevel 3 and ommitt the startup of GUI in Xubuntu 14.04?
[13:27] <brainwash> http://askubuntu.com/questions/228402/boot-to-runlevel-3
[13:27] <brainwash> and http://askubuntu.com/questions/16371/how-do-i-disable-x-at-boot-time-so-that-the-system-boots-in-text-mode
[13:27] <brainwash> ^ garandil
[13:28] <garandil> brainwash, sweet!
[13:32] <e87hd> I had a similar issue AlexRussia
[13:33] <e87hd> if you are still having an issue
[13:33] <AlexRussia> e87hd, i still have issue
[13:33] <e87hd> were you having issues with dual boot/efi/windows 8?
[13:33] <AlexRussia> e87hd, i even have drive which i returb back tomorrow
[13:33] <AlexRussia> return*
[13:33] <AlexRussia> e87hd, no, windows 8 was from my friend
[13:33] <e87hd> oh, its a bad drive?  Western Digital?
[13:44] <AlexRussia> e87hd, i guess, 3Q
[13:45] <e87hd> hmm, I have not heard of them before
[13:45] <AlexRussia> e87hd, same here
[14:02] <AlexRussia> e87hd, do you think, toshiba is good choise?
[14:02] <AlexRussia> choice*
[14:02] <e87hd> I don't know. I have not used them before
[14:02] <e87hd> I can tell you, do not get Maxtor
[14:02] <e87hd> those are the worst hard drives!
[14:02] <e87hd> I believe the best hard drives are Hitatchi, Seagate and Western Digital
[14:02] <e87hd> I have had great success with those
[14:02] <AlexRussia> e87hd, what about seagate?(i've seen one)
[14:02] <e87hd> I have this drive http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Barracuda-3-5-Inch-Internal-ST2000DM001/dp/B005T3GRN2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1409924732&sr=8-1&keywords=seagate+2tb
[14:02] <e87hd> been a great drive for me
[14:16] <AlexRussia> e87hd, what about this one? www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBb17OS-dws&list=PL715D058C40B8E9FE&index=5
[14:17] <AlexRussia> daaaaaaaaammit
[14:17] <AlexRussia> e87hd, http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Expansion-Portable-External-STBX1000101/dp/B008R7FC74/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1409925018&sr=8-1&keywords=Seagate+Expansion+portable+drive
[14:29] <AlexRussia> e87hd, man?
[15:23] <xubuntu087> is there a way to access my xubuntu machine remotely like RDP or VNC or something?
[15:24] <Hedgework> of course.  Set up VNC or SSH or whatever you like.
[15:24] <xubuntu087> I want to be able to access my thunderbird and stuff
[15:24] <xubuntu087> I have heard of X11, would that work for thunderbird over SSH?
[15:26] <Hedgework> I don't know why X11 forwarding wouldn't work, but I don't have personal experience with it.  I use ssh for everyday stuff and VNC for demos.
[15:27] <xubuntu087> I need to learn more about that
[15:27] <xubuntu087> I would imagine that there are certain programs that would not work with X11
[15:29] <Hedgework> It's called X11 forwarding because it was a feature of Xorg's predecessor, which probably existis in Xorg...given that you are using an Xorg-based gui (xfce4), I'd be shocked if any of your gui apps don't work with it.
[15:38] <xubuntu087> such an awesome feature
[15:39] <Hedgework> :)
[15:39] <xubuntu087> I don't know why Windows would not use something like that
[15:40] <Hedgework> They have one, they just charge you hundreds if not thousands of dollars for the privilege.  I used theirs when I worked for a military contractor circa 2003.
[15:40] <Hedgework> (Mind you, it's nearly impossible to secure their version...but that's another argument for another day, and for all they know it may have improved in the last decade.)
[15:41] <xubuntu087> I did not know that
[15:41] <xubuntu087> what is it called in Windows?
[15:41] <Hedgework> ummm...I forget...that was ages ago
[16:25] <threedaymonk> I'm tearing my hair out over power management with 14.04, logind, and xfce4-power-manager. What I'd like is to have suspend on lid close if (and only if) I'm on battery. What's the correct combination of logind and xfce4-power-manager settings to get this to actually work (as I've configured it within the power manager)?
[16:36] <brainwash> threedaymonk: this comment may be helpful https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-power-manager/+bug/1349056/comments/5
[16:38] <threedaymonk> brainwash: thanks! I'll try that.
[16:42] <xubuntu087> i am trying to get help with an issue with play on linux, but their support is non responsive atm. Does anyone in here know anything about play on linux?
[16:42] <brainwash> xubuntu087: well, describe your problem
[16:43] <brainwash> there is also #winehq
[16:43] <brainwash> the wine channel
[16:44] <xubuntu087> oh, I can try that
[16:44] <threedaymonk> brainwash: well, that's solved that problem, so thank you. But now I have another one: lock screen on suspend doesn't!
[16:44] <xubuntu087> getting this error when I try to install mp3tag
[16:44] <xubuntu087> http://imgur.com/tYXze3c
[16:46] <brainwash> xubuntu087: I guess you have to contact the PoL devs, there should be some form of bug tracker or dev forum
[16:46] <xubuntu087> I figured as much
[16:47] <brainwash> threedaymonk: that's odd, is locking enabled in the power manager settings window?
[16:47] <holstein> !info mp4tag
[16:47] <holstein> !info mp3tag
[16:48] <brainwash> that's a window program I think
[16:48] <brainwash> windows
[16:48] <holstein> xubuntu087: have you tried a native linux mp3 tagging application?
[16:48] <holstein> i suggest trying as much native code as possible.. especially for simpler tasks like that..
[16:49] <holstein> !info easytag
[16:49] <threedaymonk> brainwash: yes: [x] Lock screen when going for suspend/hibernate
[16:50] <threedaymonk> Doesn't lock if I use the suspend option from the power manager menu, either.
[16:50] <brainwash> threedaymonk: is the light-locker process still running the background?
[16:51] <threedaymonk> brainwash: yes
[16:51] <brainwash> actually, this can be easily tested if you manually trigger the screen lock
[16:51] <brainwash> does that work?
[16:51] <threedaymonk> that works
[16:51] <brainwash> mmh :/
[16:52] <threedaymonk> I feel like I'm at the intersection of at least three different bugs here :-)
[16:52] <threedaymonk> and I can get at least two of the things I want to work
[16:52] <brainwash> you just cannot solve all of them :>
[16:53] <holstein> i would probably just disable automatic everything, and just sleep manually when i want.. or lock manually.. etc
[16:53] <threedaymonk> I will forget and cook my laptop in short order
[16:53] <holstein> sure.. thats why i just have it sleep regardless.. and even then, used to be, sometimes they wouldnt sleep
[16:54] <holstein> its actually not a good idea, for air flow, to have the machine on with the lid closed.. some apple machines simply dont allow that from a hardware perspective
[16:54] <threedaymonk> I had everything working fine with 13.10, though (after changing logind.conf ...) though, so this is a painful regression
[16:55] <brainwash> there might be something messed up in the code after the last power manager update
[16:55] <threedaymonk> apple machines are designed at (or often beyond) the parameters of sane thermal design, though :-)
[16:56] <threedaymonk> brainwash: I fear that
[16:56] <holstein> threedaymonk: sure. but, the idea of having the machine on, and when plugged in, shutting the lid, and it doesnt sleep is, as i see it, not a good idea
[16:56] <threedaymonk> well, that's your opinion, and that's fine, but it's been working for me.
[16:56] <threedaymonk> and it's what I want to do
[16:56] <holstein> well, thats the opinion of many manufacturers, as well
[16:57] <brainwash> threedaymonk: feel free to file a bug report against xfce4-power-manager, simply run the terminal command "ubuntu-bug xfce4-power-manager"
[16:58] <threedaymonk> will do
[16:58] <brainwash> don't forget to mention all the settings which were changed
[16:58] <brainwash> like logind.conf
[21:35] <xebra> hi, does xubuntu accept icon sets made up of svg images? I see every icon set is just a bunch of png
[21:36] <xebra> I wonder if you can just use one svg for each icon, which will then be scaled to the appropriate sizes
[21:55] <SenorSenpai> Hello wondered if someone can help me. I'm trying to install Xubuntu onto my 2013 iMac 14,2. Booted a USB pen and installed the system to an external drive, however when I reboot the drive doesnt show up as bootable in the boot chooser. Any idea what I can do to boot into my newly installed system? Thanks


[00:00] <shauno> it's rather weak in places, but I decided re-recording it forwarned would lose the effect
[05:03] <harry_> Hey is there any channel for the InstallJammer's help???
[05:54] <AlanBell> http://www.thisisthecountdown.com/
[06:11] <Girly-Girl> Morning
[06:46] <czajkowski> aloha
[06:58] <popey> morning all
[07:09] <MartijnVdS> \o popey
[07:10] <MooDoo> morning all
[07:12] <GirlyGirl> MooDoo: Mooooooooo
[07:13]  * MartijnVdS likes the Ubuntu monospace (terminal) font
[07:13] <MartijnVdS> popey: http://xkcd.com/963/
[07:15] <MooDoo> GirlyGirl: mooooooooo back :)
[07:16] <GirlyGirl> MooDoo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_EsxukdNXM
[07:18] <popey> heh MartijnVdS
[07:19] <DJones> Morning all
[07:19] <MooDoo> GirlyGirl: ok ok you win :)
[07:22] <dwatkins> mornin ubuntu-uk
[07:22] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: I completely agree with that graph :D
[07:54] <AlanBell> morning all
[08:05] <Joeb454> morning AlanBell
[08:14] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[08:16] <czajkowski> Aloha
[08:16] <bigcalm> Hi cz
[08:17] <bigcalm> ajkowski
[08:18]  * czajkowski hands bigcalm a tab key
[08:18] <oimon> man i hate those self-serve tills in sainsbury's." unexpected item in bagging area ,remove item" : remove item, "please replace item". repeat ad nauseum. cannot cancel or proceed
[08:19]  * MooDoo need a caffine drip and a punch bag :)
[08:20] <Joeb454> oimon: I had a self-serve till where the card machine didn't recognise my card 3 times in a row
[08:20] <Joeb454> that was fun
[08:20] <Joeb454> couldn't find a way to cancel and pay by cash either
[08:20] <oimon> you know they run windows, right? :)
[08:22] <gord> so just press random buttons until it bsod's?
[08:24] <Joeb454> oimon: I vaguely remember seeing one on a windows screen once. Shame there's no proper keyboard
[08:25] <oimon> at my local shop there is always 1/6 terminals showing a windows screen and unknown exception error or similar
[08:25] <Joeb454> that's pretty impressive
[08:25] <oimon> bad software on top of bad software :D
[08:30] <JamesTait> Good morning, all!
[08:31] <BigRedS> g'morning!
[08:32]  * oimon wonders if JamesTait's regular morning greetings are produced by a script ;)
[08:32] <BigRedS> It's how I'd do it :)
[08:34] <oimon> is there any way to disable the "top story" thing on facebook?
[08:35] <DJones> oimon: I just clicked on the option to "Sort by recency" that seems to have put it back mostly like normal
[08:36] <oimon> where? where? !!
[08:36] <DJones> Just above the 1st story
[08:36] <DJones> Underneath the whats on your mind box on the right if of the centre section
[08:37] <oimon> doesn't show on mine?
[08:38] <DJones> Underneath the whats on your mind box, I get "x recent stories, x matked as top", then just to the right, "Top stories first:Sort by recency"
[08:38]  * oimon tries on firefox instead
[08:40] <DJones> This is on Chrome
[08:41] <DJones> oimon: http://imagebin.org/178617
[08:41] <oimon> wow, definitely don't get that
[08:41]  * DJones feels "special"
[08:42] <oimon> http://ubuntuone.com/2GFiTN7NKOThjSlhH1wpCQ
[08:43] <oimon> chromium and firefox are the same
[08:45] <DJones> I have seen people suggesting betterfacebook is a good add on to use, but I'm wary of letting facebook apps/addons have access to login details
[08:45] <DJones> http://betterfacebook.net/#wwbfd
[08:46] <ali1234> haha so facebook completely copied google+
[08:46] <DJones> ali1234: You mean the betterfacebook? Its not anything to do with facebook, 3rd party addon
[08:46] <ali1234> no i mean facebook.com
[08:46] <DJones> I have seen people suggesting betterfacebook is a good add on to use, but I'm wary of letting facebook apps/addons have access to login details
[08:47] <DJones> ali1234: ok, I misunderstood
[08:47] <ali1234> i have never heard of betterfacebook but it sounds a bit like polishing a turd
[08:47] <DJones> oimon: http://betterfacebook.net/#wwbfd (Hadn't noticed you'd disconnected)
[08:48]  * oimon wonders if better facebook is always the previous version :)
[08:48] <DJones> oimon: Looking at the screenshots, it does look quite useful for reducing the amount of junk on there
[08:48] <oimon> does anyone else get djones option my my (lack of) option
[08:51] <czajkowski> oimon: nope
[08:51] <oimon> czajkowski: your view looks like mine or djones?
[08:51] <czajkowski> mine looks perfect
[08:52] <oimon> :-\ is that 1 or 2?
[08:53]  * oimon thinks djones has written his own app in his sleep.
[08:54] <DJones> Heh
[08:55] <DJones> Maybe my facebook hasn't been upgraded yet
[08:56] <oimon> "upgraded"
[08:57] <MooDoo> DJones: upgrade it yourself :)
[08:57] <DJones> oimon: ok spamgraded
[08:58] <oimon> just found an ubuntu 8.10 CD in my cd, complete with ubuntu stickers :D
[08:59] <bigcalm> CD in your CD?
[08:59] <oimon> s/cd/drawer/
[08:59] <bigcalm> Ah
[08:59] <DJones> drawer or drive?
[08:59] <oimon> my brain is broken today
[08:59] <TheOpenSourcerer> lol: http://puffbox.com/2011/03/22/testing-hmrcs-open-source-claims/
[08:59] <popey> ey'up all
[08:59] <czajkowski> you havea drawer full of cds
[08:59] <bigcalm> Hello mr cake man
[08:59] <popey> i need to find somewhere to crash tomorrow night
[09:00] <bigcalm> Have you upset the wifey?
[09:00] <popey> or check times of last trains home
[09:00] <popey> nope
[09:00] <popey> she's out tonight, I'm out tomorrow
[09:01]  * DJones goes one better, my wife is out tonight and won't be back until Monday evening
[09:01] <TheOpenSourcerer> The Farnborough mainline trains run quite late don't they popey?
[09:01] <bigcalm> Hayley is at work all day, not sure how I will cope
[09:02] <popey> not sure TheOpenSourcerer
[09:05] <MooDoo> my wife is p***d off she can't go out, rosie won't let her :) lol
[09:05] <popey> who is rosie?
[09:05] <popey> and how old is she
[09:05] <bigcalm> What's the current prescription charge per item?
[09:05] <popey> 7 pound sommat?
[09:05] <bigcalm> Is it 7.40?
[09:06]  * bigcalm pokes TheOpenSourcerer
[09:06] <TheOpenSourcerer> Ouch
[09:06] <MooDoo> popey: rosie is my daughter who it 4 weeks, yeah 7 pound sommat
[09:07] <TheOpenSourcerer> bigcalm: Any particular reason for that abusive prod?
[09:07] <bigcalm> Sorry, guess I got the wrong nick :)
[09:07] <popey> ahhh
[09:07] <popey> quite young then
[09:07] <bigcalm> Who is the medical type person in here?
[09:07] <MooDoo> popey: very, she doesn't like to sleep unless held :S
[09:08]  * bigcalm gives TheOpenSourcerer a plaster and a lollypop
[09:08] <oimon> babies are overrated.. toddlers are great though
[09:09] <Myrtti> popey: are you encouraging people to flood the u-r-p? :-D :-D
[09:09] <bigcalm> I was right with 7.40
[09:09] <popey> Myrtti: moi!?
[09:09] <Myrtti> yes, you!!!
[09:10] <DJones> Has anybody had any issues with 11.10 not shutting down properly, mine just sticks at a point with the 5 dots on it
[09:10] <bigcalm> DJones: not on 11.10 yet, but do you have any network shares?
[09:10] <DJones> bigcalm: NFS shares, yes
[09:11] <gord> the network share problem was fixed a few releases back (or at least, significantly reduced)
[09:11] <DJones> Hadn't had any issues with 11.04 with shares
[09:11] <bigcalm> DJones: next time you go to shut down, try unmounting them before you shutdown
[09:11]  * bigcalm shrugs
[09:11] <bigcalm> Just an idea :)
[09:12] <gord> DJones, iv had it take a long time, but never just hang, let it be for a bit more?
[09:12] <AlanBell> I would like to see a non-negotiable suspend or shutdown based on laptop lid
[09:12] <gord> hrm?
[09:12] <bigcalm> Works on my laptop in 11.04
[09:12] <TheOpenSourcerer> Seems like I need to practice drinking more: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-15265317
[09:13] <MartijnVdS> Suspend on lid-close works on my laptop
[09:13] <DJones> Will have to look at bug reports, the longest I've left it is 10 minutes before pressing the power button, it starts up with no errors afterwards
[09:13] <AlanBell> bigcalm: yes, but applications can block it, transmission for one
[09:13] <MartijnVdS> But only after suspending manually once
[09:13] <bigcalm> I see
[09:13] <bigcalm> Guess I'm not using such apps :)
[09:13] <gord> suspend shouldn't be blockable
[09:13] <AlanBell> pops up a dialog saying "do you really want to suspend, I am doing something really important" or something like that
[09:13] <DJones> May also try a command line shutdown to see if that has the same problem
[09:15] <gord> AlanBell, file a bug in transmission telling them that its an extremely dumb thing to do :)
[09:15] <gord> i understand for shutdown, but on suspend its just stupid
[09:16] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[09:16] <AlanBell> actually it might not be doing that, there is a checkbox for "inhibit hibernate"
[09:16] <MooDoo> morning
[09:17] <brobostigon> morning MooDoo
[09:20] <gord> so the countdown was a countdown to the start of a countdown thats counting down to the actual release?
[09:20] <AlanBell> estimated, yes
[09:21] <AlanBell> decrypting the transmission from chi saggitari
[09:28] <bigcalm> This makes me think they copied the idea from the Portal 2 release
[09:30] <sebsebseb> hi
[09:35] <Joeb454> hi sebsebseb
[09:35] <sebsebseb> Joeb454: hi
[09:54] <davmor2> morning all
[09:56] <MooDoo> morning davmor2
[09:56] <bigcalm> Afternoon
[09:57] <bigcalm> (I wish it was)
[09:58] <bigcalm> davmor2: I'm only on the ubuntu-uk mailing list and haven't seen any responses. Have you had any more feedback elsewhere?
[10:00] <smittix> Moaning all
[10:00] <bigcalm> Morning
[10:01] <smittix> Anyone know what they are doing about the mailing list admin position?
[10:01] <Laney> IS IT OUT YET?
[10:01] <DJones> Anybody with Virgin cable tv, http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/42491/sky-anytime-on-virgin-media
[10:02] <bigcalm> Sweet
[10:02] <bigcalm> Not that we bother to watch any of the Sky channels
[10:04] <AlanBell> smittix: the ubuntu-users one?
[10:04] <jaymeskeller> Why would you want to do that? It's like tying your breakfast onto a plauge rat.
[10:04] <smittix> AlanBell: Yeah
[10:04] <AlanBell> popey might know about that, are you stepping forward?
[10:05] <oimon> isn't that the one that turned popey into a bitter and twisted old man? ;)
[10:05] <smittix> Yeah I emailed but have not recieved anything back yet? That was quite a few weeks ago now.
[10:05] <oimon> perhaps it got moderated :)
[10:05] <AlanBell> oimon: no, popey has always been bitter and twisted
[10:06] <AlanBell> like a slice of lime in a G&T
[10:06] <oimon> he's more machine now than man
[10:06] <smittix> heh
[10:08]  * AlanBell slaps youtube with a support ogv properly stick
[10:12] <davmor2> AlanBell: it might support webm more realistically
[10:12] <gord> i use webm when sending to youtube these days
[10:14] <AlanBell> I have an ogv made with gtk-recordmydesktop
[10:15] <AlanBell> ffmpeg and mencoder are arguing with me
[10:17] <AlanBell> openshot saves the day I think
[10:18] <popey> i have uploaded to youtube by renaming .ogv to .avi before now
[10:18] <gord> i have a command somewhere in my bash history i refer back to that gets me things from <whatever> in to webm :)
[10:18] <gord> chances are it uses non free stuff for audio though
[10:34] <DJones> Ok, Evidence that intelligence levels of the human race are dropping, just noticed this question from a friend on twitter "What date is halloween" (and it was asked in all seriousness)
[10:36] <MooDoo> oh dear lord
[10:36] <MooDoo> DJones: i hope you're still taking the mickey
[10:37] <DJones> MooDoo: Nah, can't be bothered with that
[10:37] <BigRedS> man. Ctrl-A, Backspace is a _really_ bad thing to have in muscle-memory :(
[10:37] <davmor2> bigcalm: nope me neither only gord, alex has it in his diary for next month, Ron has been made aware again and will try and make the afternoon again and mrevell will hopefully be there so there should be more than us this time :)
[10:38] <davmor2> MooDoo: me owld mukka how's things dude
[10:38] <mrevell> davmor2, I'm hoping to be there, yeah
[10:38] <MooDoo> davmor2: i need lots of beer at the moment, day it's not going well
[10:39] <davmor2> mrevell: 17th put it in your calendar ;)
[10:39] <davmor2> MooDoo: Oh dear what did you break?
[10:39] <MooDoo> davmor2: lol nothing, it's just well busy
[10:40] <davmor2> MooDoo: we're not, not with a release tomorrow on no we're not busy at all oh wait.........
[10:41] <MooDoo> davmor2: oh it's only a release, stop whining, you'd think hundreds of thousands of people are looking forward to it or something
[10:41] <MooDoo> davmor2: oh wait.....
[10:41] <davmor2> MooDoo: :D
[10:42] <davmor2> gord: have you tried out ryzom yet?
[10:42] <gord> davmor2, rywah?
[10:43] <davmor2> gord: look at USC ryzom mmorpg for Ubuntu
[10:43] <davmor2> gord: it's not terrible either :)
[10:44] <gord> davmor2, not in my sc
[10:45] <davmor2> gord: oh you're on oneiric right
[10:45] <gord> yup
[10:45] <davmor2> gord: it will be latter today I think
[10:45] <davmor2> we are porting the for purchase games across steadily
[10:46] <gord> aha
[10:46] <gord> still think most of them are priced too high in the sc
[10:46] <bigcalm> davmor2: goodo :)
[10:47] <davmor2> gord this is free
[10:47] <gord> so why is it "for purchase" :P
[10:48] <davmor2> gord: non free license, and at some point I'm assuming they will have some sort of subscription system to fund the hardware and bandwidth
[10:48] <popey> Lunchtime seems like a good time to release a podcast episode to me.
[10:48] <popey> Agreed?
[10:48] <bigcalm> Yep
[10:48] <davmor2> popey: +1
[10:48] <bigcalm> Gimmie gimmie :)
[10:49] <gord> i disagree, for unspecified reasons that may be made up
[10:49] <popey> http://podcast.ubuntu-uk.org/2011/10/11/s04e17-chains-of-misery/
[10:49] <popey> done
[10:49] <ali1234> davmor2: do they have a website?
[10:49] <davmor2> ali1234: yeap
[10:49] <bigcalm> gpodder to the rescue!
[10:49] <bigcalm> :(
[10:49] <gord> why isn't quake 3 arena in the software centre :(
[10:49] <bigcalm> gpodder says no new episodes
[10:49] <davmor2> http://www.ryzom.com/en/
[10:50]  * bigcalm goes to lunch. Maybe it'll work later
[10:50] <oimon> davmor2: how is it funded?
[10:50] <davmor2> gord: they would have to novitiate it
[10:50] <davmor2> oimon: magic
[10:51] <gord> its free to play
[10:51] <gord> so the same way all other free to play games. hats.
[10:51] <oimon> what's this page? http://www.ryzom.com/en/mmorpg-rpg-mmo-subscription-options.html
[10:51] <ali1234> the video says "21 day free trial"
[10:51] <popey> bigcalm: blame feedburner
[10:51]  * bigcalm blames with fire
[10:51] <davmor2> oimon: as I say I think they will be implementing a subscription system
[10:52]  * oimon scrolls up and nods
[10:52] <gord> davmor2, there is no one outreaching to people who have made games?
[10:53] <davmor2> gord: there is
[10:53] <gord> then tell them to talk to ID about quake 3, because i want it. its the most important thing
[10:54] <ali1234> you need to get that legend of grimdark ported. if i see another mmorpg or fps i might actually lose it
[10:54] <davmor2> gord: you're wrong rage is the most import thing linux client scheduled for next year ;)
[10:54] <gord> how is it supposed to be the year of the linux desktop if we don't even have quake 3 :(
[10:59] <BigRedS> I'm sure I've got quake3 working under linux before
[10:59] <BigRedS> openarena's way easier and basically the same, though
[10:59] <BigRedS> it's like quake 3 but with the lights on
[10:59] <gord> *no* its not
[10:59] <gord> its stupid and i hate it
[10:59] <gord> its *slightly* different in every way, which means its unplayable
[11:00] <DJones> Oh dear, its that time, sony accounts accessed http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/10/11/an-important-message-from-sonys-chief-information-security-officer/
[11:00] <davmor2> BigRedS: I'm pretty sure I got it playing although it may of been Doom3 it's been a long time
[11:00] <BigRedS> hm, maybe it's just been too long since I played Q3 proper, then
[11:01] <BigRedS> either way, it is pretty doable. Basically you need a Q3 disc for the images and the for-linux version of the engine off id's ftp server
[11:01] <davmor2> Rage looks nice though
[11:01] <gord> yeah i don't have my q3 disks anymore
[11:01] <BigRedS> ah, Im sure I've one somewhere which I could stick somewhere accessible to you?
[11:01] <gord> i want to buy it again :) on the software centre, you can play it for free at quakelive.com anyway
[11:01] <davmor2> and I hate fps
[11:02] <BigRedS> yeah, I've bought it several times now. In fact, I think I've got it on steam
[11:02] <gord> but the plugin for quakelive breaks every time firefox updates, which given their new version schedule of a new major version every day, means it breaks a lot.
[11:02] <BigRedS> wonder if that's at all usable as far as extracting he media
[11:03] <gord> should be, you only need one file or so
[11:03] <BigRedS> yeah, just wondered if steam did silly things to it
[11:04] <BigRedS> I have a distrust of anything that makes things that easy. Something must be up there somewhere
[11:04] <gord> yeah there is a wrapper around the exe file that forces authentication with steam, but everything else should be fine
[11:06] <ali1234> sony hacked again? lulz
[11:08] <gord> i think its just people who, when told by sony to choose a new password, put in their old one again =\
[11:08] <BigRedS> oh, gord, have you faffed around getting old id games working on new ubuntus and debians at all?
[11:08] <davmor2> I may have to install neverwinter nights again at some point
[11:09] <BigRedS> the sdl-sound hack appears to have stopped working in oneiric & experimental and I don't know enough about sound in linux to know why :(
[11:09] <ali1234> gord: so ioquake3 with q3a datafiles is not acceptable to you?
[11:10] <gord> BigRedS, they all have open source replacements, up until doom 3, doom 3 source should be out already though i think
[11:10] <gord> ali1234, sure, ioquake3 is great
[11:10] <gord> why wouldn't it be acceptable?
[11:10] <ali1234> i dunno
[11:10] <ali1234> it's in the repositories so what is the problem?
[11:10] <gord> i don't have the datafiles?
[11:11] <davmor2> man upgrades are slow
[11:11] <ali1234> how do you know it's a good game then?
[11:11] <gord> because i used to 12 years ago?
[11:11] <ali1234> is it really that old :|
[11:11] <BigRedS> gord: yeah, they're open, it's just that I'm playing old games that are unawre of the, uh, developments of linux sound recently
[11:12] <BigRedS> I'm playing Enemy Territory mostly
[11:12] <gord> i think 1999
[11:13] <gord> BigRedS, ah, that one never got open source code, sorry :) - maybe remove pulseaudio?
[11:14] <davmor2> BigRedS: it might be that you need the 32 bit lib if you're on 64bit
[11:15] <BigRedS> davmor2: yeah, I've got that from whenever it used to work (Maverick?) so I think that's all there. Every couple of releases something changes to keep me on my toes
[11:15] <BigRedS> gord: I did wonder that. I'm sure it used to work on pulse, but it's probably simplest to just do without it and it'll keep just working
[11:15] <BigRedS> or install a Lenny VM and play in that...
[11:16] <davmor2> BigRedS: don't forget the new naming version in oneiric for the apps is now :i386 other wise it will install the 64bit version that might not be any cop to you
[11:16] <BigRedS> Ahh, I'd not noticed that (Is *that* what these release notes are for? :)
[11:17] <BigRedS> I'll have a poke next time I'm at home
[11:17] <BigRedS> ta
[11:17] <jaymeskeller> Wait. They're changing the naming version in oneriric?
[11:17] <Laney> whawt?
[11:17] <Laney> -w
[11:17] <gord> hawt?
[11:18]  * Laney sews sides back together
[11:20] <davmor2> jaymeskeller: only on packages, it's using multiarch now so you can install any i386 only app
[11:20] <MartijnVdS> not any
[11:20] <MartijnVdS> but lots of them yes
[11:22] <davmor2> MartijnVdS: well the bulk of them then :)
[11:30] <gord> reason #1351 why this is not the year of the linux desktop, we don't have this application ported to ubuntu; http://bitboost.com/pawsense/
[11:31] <BigRedS> oh!
[11:31]  * BigRedS wants
[11:32] <Laney> one of my passwords is cat generated
[11:32] <BigRedS> haha
[11:33] <Pendulum> Laney: how'd you memorize it?
[11:33] <Laney> i just take the cat with me everywhere
[11:33] <Laney> he knows it
[11:33] <Pendulum> heh
[11:33] <Laney> he is also immune to social engineering
[11:33] <Laney> but not tuna engineering :(
[11:34] <davmor2> gord: when you get to reason 1337 is it then cause linux is too leet?
[11:34] <davmor2> got not get
[11:35] <gord> reason #1337 is that linux users think saying 1337 instead of using letters is cool :(
[11:36] <davmor2> gord: haha
[11:36] <davmor2> gord: you mean it isn't cool?
[11:38] <gord> no sir
[11:38] <BigRedS> he lies!
[11:39] <davmor2> BigRedS: gord just isn't 1337 :D
[11:42] <BigRedS> haha, we r t3h 1337 h4xx0rz
[11:42] <BigRedS> I'll stop now
[11:43]  * gord puts more easter eggs into unity to make all text be leetzorized for davmor2
[11:43] <davmor2> gord: Yay it's you that has to read it though with all the bugs I'll report so I don't care :P
[12:20] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Ubuntu UK Podcast] S04E17  Chains of Misery - http://podcast.ubuntu-uk.org/2011/10/11/s04e17-chains-of-misery/
[12:20] <bigcalm> Encoding fail
[12:24] <Myrtti> next naming scheme should be Take That
[12:24] <Myrtti> or Oasis or Blur, just for lulz
[12:28] <dwatkins> !samba
[12:28] <dwatkins> I need to reinstall a server, so this documentation should be useful.
[13:03] <sagaci> is there an en_GB team for the Launchpad-hosted packages, or only the en_GB team for the main Ubuntu package set?
[13:05] <bigcalm> Bloody hell
[13:05] <bigcalm> I got mentioned in the podcast
[13:05] <bigcalm> Meep
[13:07] <MooDoo> bigcalm: yeah they like mentioning stalkers nowadays
[13:07] <Laney> "be aware, strange man spotted wearing a suit made entirely of bacon and bees"
[13:08] <Laney> beer fans, help me choose which ones to try http://www.beerfestival.nottinghamcamra.org/Assets_pdf/Beer_2011_List.pdf
[13:10] <MooDoo> Laney: you going?
[13:10] <MooDoo> er obviously
[13:10] <MooDoo> Laney: i should of asked, what day you going lol
[13:10] <Laney> thursday + saturday
[13:11] <MooDoo> cool
[13:12] <Laney> Dark porter style beer with a ginger infusion
[13:12] <Laney> interesting...
[13:14] <hamitron> WineHQ App DB hacked? :/
[13:14] <MartijnVdS> "a ginger infusion" sounds dirty
[13:14] <Laney> sounds tasty
[13:14] <MartijnVdS> hamitron: hacked? how?
[13:14] <hamitron> just got an email, saying the user database has been stolen
[13:14] <Monsterwizard> :O
[13:14] <oimon> via phpmyadmin
[13:15] <oimon> easily done
[13:15]  * hamitron spits
[13:15] <oimon> i got an email about it
[13:15] <oimon> fortunately have not used that passwd anywhere else
[13:15] <hamitron> all this stuff is just annoying
[13:15] <oimon> even more fortunate that firefox still remembered the password
[13:16] <hamitron> well, I had done.... only I've changed all important passwords since sony and codemasters
[13:16] <hamitron> ;)
[13:16] <oimon> go for low hanging fruit and hope that users use simple passwords across sites
[13:16] <hamitron> database leaks appears to be the norm :/
[13:17] <oimon> wonder if i can transfer my firefox saved passwds into chromium?
[13:18] <ali1234> yeah so the recent sony breach... done with winehq passwords?
[13:19] <gord> first time i have listened to the u-uk podcast in a while, things i have learnt; popey things a warthog is a type of aardvark
[13:20] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Chris Oattes] How to improve on ARGs - http://www.cjo20.net/blog/?p=33
[13:20] <oimon> the other thing is that when the wing commander comes on it's the end of the show
[13:33] <popey> :D gord
[13:33] <MartijnVdS> oimon: the wing commander rocks :)
[13:57] <gord> hamitron, i just noticed onboard works with unity dash now :)
[13:57] <gord> erm
[13:58] <gord> sorry, not hamitron, i meant "ha" but i tried to tab complete it i guess
[13:58] <hamitron> onboard?
[13:58] <hamitron> haha
[13:59] <Pendulum> gord: yes :)
[14:00] <_janen>   /join #edinhacklab
[14:00] <Seeker`> wow, I['m still on the planet
[14:01] <hamitron> Seeker`, which one?
[14:01] <Seeker`> ubuntu-uk
[14:01] <Laney> earth
[14:01] <hamitron> ah
[14:01] <hamitron> :)
[14:20] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Andy Loughran] Health and Exercise - http://zrmt.com/2011/10/12/health-and-exercise/
[14:30] <bigcalm> So, when does uupc get renamed to the Popey Show?
[14:31] <popey> :D
[14:32] <gord> "Popey and friends"
[14:32] <popey> s/P/p/
[15:25] <popey> WAKEY WAKEY!
[15:26] <oimon> ssshhhhh
[15:27] <DJones> zzzzzz's
[15:28] <bigcalm> Bed please
[15:28] <DJones> Hang on, isn't this the wrong channel for that
[15:28] <hamitron> haha
[15:28] <hamitron> yeh, take it into private ;)
[15:29] <DJones> I was thinking more of the minecraft channel :)
[15:29] <ascenseur> hey :)
[15:29] <hamitron> yeh, but no harm in misleading those not aware ;)
[15:29] <kirrus> There's a minecraft channel?
[15:29] <kirrus> hello ascenseur
[15:30]  * DJones erases my last comment
[15:30] <ascenseur> howdy kirrus :)
[15:30] <gord> huh, intel have shut down their Digital Home Group - looks like arm is gonna power tv's and media devices for the foreseeable future
[15:31] <gord> wonder what that means for atoms
[15:32] <DJones> I wonder if you made a "supercomputer" using atom processors, could you call it a molecule computer (I know, bad joke)
[15:32] <hamitron> :D
[15:32]  * hamitron kinda liked it
[15:32] <hamitron> ;/
[15:32] <DJones> gord: Probably the share price will go up
[15:32] <gord> you could network up a bunch of atom computers, each of them simulating a virtual atom
[15:33] <hamitron> that work done at intel with old i586 cpu recently sounded interesting
[15:34] <hamitron> used a lot less power, hope that is the direction they are moving towards
[15:38] <ujjain> What is the children game called when children have to run away from eachother and the 'catcher' has to touch them, them the touched person becomes 'catcher'
[15:38] <ujjain> sorry for bad explanation
[15:38] <hamitron> think it has a few different names
[15:38] <gord> tic-a-nic?
[15:39] <gord> americans like to call it tag i think
[15:39] <popey> "it"
[15:39] <popey> (is what we call it)
[15:39] <DJones> ujjain: We called it "Tic"
[15:39] <ali1234> we called it dobby
[15:39] <popey> ujjain: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tag_(game)
[15:39] <popey> explains it best
[15:39] <davmor2> that's Tig surely
[15:40] <bigcalm> It goes by many names
[15:40] <bigcalm> I was always it :(
[15:40] <popey> heh
[15:41] <Pendulum> bigcalm: that's because you were loved :)
[15:41] <davmor2> bigcalm: you still are muppet boy ;)
[15:41] <hamitron> we mostly played British Bulldogs iirc
[15:41] <gord> i was really really fast and there was a girl who was really really fast so we both used to only chase each other, ahh to be 8 again
[15:41] <popey> we used to play "1, 2, 3 and out" where you ran hid and had to get back to the base before you were caught
[15:42] <bigcalm> popey: I knew that as 40/40 home
[15:42] <bigcalm> Why, dunno
[15:42] <bigcalm> davmor2: wakka wakka
[15:42] <bigcalm> Pendulum: sweet :)
[15:43] <davmor2> bulldogs and pile-on when they got banned tagdogs bugdogs without the aggression
[15:43] <davmor2> then we realise that if you went to the field and held a rugby ball you could still play pile-on and bulldogs :)
[15:44] <bigcalm> Hahaha
[15:44] <hamitron> banned? :|
[15:55] <ujjain> DJones, popey, thanks! :)
[16:32] <Diogo> #webdetails
[16:45] <marcushaslam> hi
[17:36] <gord> cool, if you buy "dungeons of dreadmore" on steam, they put the linux binaries in the download :)
[18:49] <Girly-Girl> bye
[18:50] <bigcalm> Hi?
[18:52] <popey> YES!
[18:52] <MartijnVdS> Howdy!
[18:53] <bigcalm> Fish fingers!
[18:54] <davmor2> Rupert the Bear
[18:54] <christel> and custard?
[18:59] <Azelphur> fish fingers and custard \o/
[18:59] <Azelphur> I should try that sometime, I wonder how it actually tastes
[19:00] <mgdm> boggin', I'd suspect
[19:01] <Azelphur> apparently it tastes good, http://www.alananna.co.uk/blog/2011/fish-fingers-and-custard/
[19:14] <christel> Azelphur: yeah, you and i both!
[19:14] <christel> i am all for trying it
[19:14] <Azelphur> I've tried more daring things
[19:14] <Azelphur> The other day I cooked a recipe someone pulled off 4chan \o/
[19:15] <MartijnVdS> Azelphur: Dead baby stew?
[19:15] <Azelphur> MartijnVdS: 2 minute brownies :D
[19:15] <MartijnVdS> ah the microwave one
[19:15] <Azelphur> yep, it was good \o/
[19:31] <davmor2> http://instantrimshot.com/index.php?sound=crickets  :D nice
[20:01] <brobostigon> bbc4 10pm, brazil, :)
[20:07] <brobostigon> get-iplayer :)
[20:09] <MartijnVdS> I don't think that'll work on movies
[20:09] <Patch230> Evening !
[20:10] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: :'(
[20:17] <Patch230> Anyone from the north east ?
[20:22] <davmor2> AlanBell: well looking at the workload I have left I don't think I'll be coming down tomorrow :(  still midst application migration testing for the paid for apps :(
[20:27] <davmor2> oneiric new multiarch is being a pain for us :(
[20:49] <AlanBell> aww
[20:53] <andres-kain> does anyone have gnumeric? if so could you try something simple like adding two columns?
[20:54] <andres-kain> does it work or does it give you #Value!
[20:56] <jacobw> andres-kain: gnumeric is a bit outdated
[20:57] <andres-kain> Ah! found it! it was that I was using decimals like 0.1 and not 0,1
[20:57] <andres-kain> jacobw how is it updated?
[20:57] <andres-kain> outdated?*
[20:59] <andres-kain> last update was in july according to wikipedia... it is what is recomended for lighter distros (or so it seemed)
[21:00]  * jacobw is wrong
[21:13] <BigRedS> andres-kain: does that mean you don't need it testing?
[21:14] <andres-kain> yes sorry
[21:14]  * BigRedS is as fond of gnumeric as he'll allow himself to become fond of any spreadsheet app
[21:14] <BigRedS> ah, it's fine!
[21:14] <BigRedS> I don't mind not doing something :)
[21:15] <andres-kain> gnumeric is awesome.
[21:18] <BigRedS> I wouldn't go that far, but it's preferable to all the alternatives
[21:20] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Andy Loughran] iPhone4S or Galaxy S2? - http://zrmt.com/2011/10/12/iphone4-or-galaxy-s2/
[21:20] <AlanBell> Galaxy S2
[21:21] <andres-kain> samsung tizen
[21:21] <andres-kain> with flexible screen display thanks to grafene.
[21:23] <BigRedS> Despite the goodness of the S2, I'm having trouble liking Samsung again after what they did to the S
[21:24] <Monsterwizard> I need help from you guys
[21:24] <Monsterwizard> Ok when I look at a problem..yano a software or logic one
[21:24] <Monsterwizard> I pannic
[21:25] <Monsterwizard> anixiety
[21:25] <Monsterwizard> kicks in
[21:25] <andres-kain> what is the problem?
[21:25] <Monsterwizard> any problem
[21:25] <Monsterwizard> :P
[21:25] <andres-kain> in what do you need help now..?
[21:27] <zleap> hi
[21:27] <popey> hello
[21:28] <zleap> looks like 10.10 is released friday or very late thursday
[21:28] <popey> i think you mean 11.10
[21:28]  * zleap is going by the counter (yheah 11.10)
[21:28] <popey> i wouldn't go by the counter
[21:29] <popey> that has pretty much no bearing
[21:29] <zleap> okj
[21:30] <AlanBell> zleap: the release manager is coming to the party in London
[21:30] <zleap> ok
[21:31] <AlanBell> that is a much more sensible upper bound on the release time
[21:32] <zleap> i have a countdown banner on my website showing 1 day
[21:34] <zleap> i would have organised a release party but no one on the linux user group ever seems interested
[21:34] <zleap> plus lack of suitable venues
[21:37] <YaManicKill> wow that was a lot of typing
[21:38] <YaManicKill> my ubuntu reviews always end up being so big...
[21:39] <popey> yay
[21:39] <popey> YaManicKill: url?
[21:39] <popey> is it on G+?
[21:39] <YaManicKill> its not posted yet...i'm waiting till the release
[21:39] <popey> ah ok
[21:40] <BigRedS> YaManicKill: but by then it'll be out of date! :)
[21:40] <YaManicKill> ;-)
[21:40] <YaManicKill> it seems premature releasing it when people can't get the stable version
[21:40] <popey> hahah you said stable
[21:40] <YaManicKill> i know, i know, its not much different...but that tag makes a huge difference to people
[21:41]  * BigRedS spots another oneiric user
[21:41] <popey> i had a bit of a rant
[21:41] <YaManicKill> i saw :-P
[21:43] <YaManicKill> i dont think its "broke" its just a rubbish rubbish design tbh...
[21:43] <BigRedS> wonder if ubuntu can beat apple tomorrow: http://www.lonap.net/bandwidth.shtml
[21:45] <AlanBell> no, sudo apt-get install compizconfig-settings-manager was *not* what I wanted to do in an SSH session to a customer server
[21:45] <YaManicKill> haha
[21:45] <BigRedS> hah. oops
[21:45] <BigRedS> I apt-get installed mongodb once and got half of X...
[21:46] <AlanBell> saved by a broken proxy :)
[21:47] <zleap> hmm how do I fix a package in an inconsistant state
[21:48] <zleap> does dpkg -p purge a package
[21:48] <zleap> so i can remove it
[21:48] <zleap> still got problems with apt being in an inconsistant state with this printer driver
[21:49] <ali1234> why are you all hating on oneiric?
[21:49] <ali1234> it isn't worse than natty
[21:49] <ali1234> it certainly crashes a lot less
[21:50] <BigRedS> it's more surprising for me
[21:50] <BigRedS> alt-tab in particular seems to go out of its way to not do what I meant
[21:50] <BigRedS> and I can't quite work out whether that's what it's supposed to do
[21:50] <ali1234> i prefer the new alt-tab to the old alt-tab, which was useless
[21:50] <ali1234> now it is only mostly useless
[21:51] <BigRedS> it makes the same assumptions as gnome3 - that I don't necessarily not want another window of the current app - but gnome3 is easier to correct
[21:51] <ali1234> there's too many double negatives in that, i can't parse it
[21:51] <YaManicKill> ali1234: why is it that pointing out a problem is immediately "hating on" something?
[21:51] <BigRedS> haha
[21:51] <zleap> ok if I wanted to search /var/lib/dpkg/status for a specific package how do i do that
[21:52] <zleap> grep /var/lib/dpkg/status <what i want to search for >
[21:52] <ali1234> YaManicKill: i just wonder why so many people seem to have /only just/ noticed that unity sucks
[21:52] <YaManicKill> it doesnt
[21:52] <BigRedS> when I alt-tab in an app with two windows open (say firefox and firefox downloads) the hardest window to get at is the other window of that app
[21:52] <BigRedS> which is completely contrary to how I work
[21:52] <YaManicKill> thats a stupid crap generlisation
[21:52] <ali1234> well, we'll see
[21:52] <BigRedS> I don't think it sucks necessarily. I think it's just made for people with different tastes to me
[21:53] <BigRedS> though I don't find it *hard* to use, I did prefer Gnome2
[21:54]  * TheOpenSourcerer will be sticking to 10.10 on his work machines for *another* round by the sound of things...
[21:54] <BigRedS> Hah. I'm still postponing my shift from Debian
[21:54] <BigRedS> I've been doing that for about five years now
[21:55] <TheOpenSourcerer> Oneric on my netbook is ludicrously slow to boot... And sometimes I just get the nautilus menu in the top bar and nothing else. Anywhere. CTL+ALT+F1 the login and reboot. Yawn.
[21:55] <popey> takes ages to boot on my 8 core i7 on SSD
[21:55] <BigRedS> surely you could just restart gdm?
[21:55] <ali1234> TheOpenSourcerer: that means unity failed to start due to graphics driver bugs
[21:55] <BigRedS> not a lot more elegant, granted
[21:55] <popey> I dont quite get why its so slow to get to the logon screen
[21:55] <ali1234> or rather compiz
[21:55] <popey> my 1.6GHz atom is faster
[21:56] <TheOpenSourcerer> oh crumbs popey - an i7 should be quite quick.
[21:56] <popey> indeed
[21:56] <TheOpenSourcerer> s\quite\very
[21:56] <popey> 3.4GHz quick
[21:56]  * popey looks for a bootchart
[21:56] <TheOpenSourcerer> :-)
[21:56] <mgdm> about half an hour of going "Cor, that's quite a lot of cores you've got"?
[21:57] <popey> hmm, i installed bootchart and now its gone
[21:57] <TheOpenSourcerer> BigRedS: it doesn't seem to have gdm anymore. Something else I found I could restart but it didn't help much.  I had to login as a guest and copy some .gnome2/.gconf dirs from the /tmp/guest to my home dir so it would start properly ;-)
[21:58] <popey> lightdm
[21:58] <BigRedS> TheOpenSourcerer: it's got *something* gdm3? lightdm?
[21:58] <TheOpenSourcerer> that's it.
[21:58] <BigRedS> ah, lightdm
[21:58] <TheOpenSourcerer> that is a lie.
[21:58] <ali1234> where is the lightdm theme stored?
[21:58]  * popey shrugs
[21:58] <TheOpenSourcerer> *light*dm my bottom.
[21:58] <BigRedS> Well, it's nice in some perverse way to know that someone else is having more trouble than me...
[21:58] <ali1234> yeah, it has a whole html engine built in, doesn't it?
[21:58] <TheOpenSourcerer> should be slowdm
[21:59] <TheOpenSourcerer> you are kidding ali1234?
[21:59] <ali1234> no, that's the point of it
[21:59] <BigRedS> oh, is that where this write-a-wm-in-javascript thing comes from?
[21:59] <ali1234> the theme is done in html
[21:59] <TheOpenSourcerer> wft?
[21:59] <AlanBell> lighter than GDM
[22:00] <ali1234> anyway i want to get rid of all traces of that ugly purple wallpaper, even though i only see it after a kernel upgrade
[22:02] <popey> my pc boots to a black screen
[22:02] <popey> with a flashing cursor
[22:02] <popey> _and_ a mouse cursor
[22:03] <BigRedS> oooh
[22:03] <ali1234> nice
[22:03] <YaManicKill> haha
[22:03] <ali1234> sounds like KMS fail
[22:03]  * popey videos this madness
[22:03] <popey> its intel
[22:03] <ali1234> yeah, there you go then
[22:03] <popey> if i press enter lightdm starts
[22:03] <ali1234> the only way to escape the insanity is to use a driver that doesn't support KMS
[22:03] <zleap> ohh i think i may have fixed this issue
[22:05] <TheOpenSourcerer> On  a lighter note: https://plus.google.com/u/0/104060033182234025482/posts/CTKqTsrFyVF
[22:05] <BigRedS> TheOpenSourcerer: looks painful
[22:05] <TheOpenSourcerer> Had all three on my Beans last night ;-)
[22:05] <TheOpenSourcerer> lol
[22:05] <popey> http://popey.com/~alan/bootcharts/wopr-oneiric-20111012-1.png
[22:06] <popey> hows that for lolworthy
[22:07] <TheOpenSourcerer> Today I got some new seeds for next year: Trinidad Scorpion "Butch T" (Current world record holder for hottest chillie at ~1.4m scovilles) and the Naga Viper(R) (The 2nd hottest at ~1.3m scovilles)
[22:07] <BigRedS> you freak :)
[22:07] <mgdm> popey: wow
[22:07] <zleap> what do i need to install to connect to another computer on the same network i am on running Windows XP ?
[22:08] <gordonjcp> popey: comedy cold
[22:08] <ali1234> popey: that looks like the weird IRQ bug again
[22:08] <BigRedS> zleap: define 'connect to'
[22:08] <gordonjcp> or even gold
[22:08] <ali1234> 20 seconds of nothing, then you hit enter and it comes to life
[22:08] <BigRedS> but probably smbclient
[22:08] <gordonjcp> TheOpenSourcerer: interesting
[22:08] <zleap> ok
[22:08] <zleap> if I want to actually control the other computer
[22:08] <YaManicKill> 1:15 for a core i7???
[22:08] <BigRedS> for various windows services (filesharing, wins, netbios)
[22:08] <BigRedS> zleap: aha, there's a terminal services client
[22:08] <YaManicKill> mine booted in about 30...
[22:08] <BigRedS> I can't remember what it's called
[22:08] <zleap> ok
[22:08] <BigRedS> but you don't need smb for it
[22:09] <zleap> so what do i need to run on the windows box ?
[22:09] <BigRedS> 'terminal services' is what windows calls remote desktop
[22:09] <BigRedS> you need to enable terminal services. I can't remember where.
[22:09] <TheOpenSourcerer> zleap - you can browse to an existing Windows share without having to install anything IIRC.
[22:09] <TheOpenSourcerer> On 10.10 Places->Network and wait a mo.
[22:10] <zleap> 11.04
[22:10] <TheOpenSourcerer> Christ knows on anything later than that though
[22:10] <TheOpenSourcerer> ;-)
[22:10] <zleap> but yeah,  i havce tried to install what is needed but don't seem to be able to see the other computer
[22:11] <TheOpenSourcerer> open a terminal and (if it isn't installed install it) run smbtree
[22:11] <popey> you can get to that menu in 11.04
[22:11] <popey> just go to the top of the screen
[22:11] <popey> where the menu is
[22:11] <TheOpenSourcerer> With sudo if you need to  - it will browse the LAN for any Windows shares
[22:12] <zleap> ok
[22:13] <TheOpenSourcerer> like that:
[22:13] <TheOpenSourcerer> http://paste.ubuntu.com/707019/
[22:13] <zleap> that sees my windows box
[22:13] <TheOpenSourcerer> Not much else on now - everyone else in bed
[22:15] <zleap> hmm
[22:15] <ali1234> /etc/lightdm/unity-greeter.conf to change the wallpaper on the login screen (or replace it with a solid colour like i just did)
[22:15]  * TheOpenSourcerer decides to (just for a laugh) update his netbook to Oneric released -1day
[22:15] <zleap> i think i need to change the domain  name or what ever on the windows box to WORKGROUP so its the same as for the computer I am on now
[22:16] <TheOpenSourcerer> Does anyone else get a message on startup about a sparse file not allowed?
[22:16] <ali1234> no
[22:16] <ali1234> did you install on ntfs or something?
[22:17] <TheOpenSourcerer> I *think* I might have selected btrfs just for fun :-[
[22:17] <BigRedS> haha
[22:17] <ali1234> oops
[22:17] <BigRedS> 'just for fun' about a filesystem choice?
[22:18] <YaManicKill> popey: your weird alt-tab stuff doesn't happen in unity2d
[22:18] <TheOpenSourcerer> It's my netbook. Not a "production" machine. Well - it has Unity on it so definitely not production.
[22:19] <popey> YaManicKill: colour me unsurprised
[22:19] <popey> friend of mine laments that Ubuntu dont put big warnings in the installer about btrfs
[22:19] <popey> its proper grolsch
[22:20] <ali1234> popey: i've been complaining about the inability to switch to a single window without revealing all of them for 6 months
[22:20] <ubuntuuk-planet> [iain woz ere] Robin Hood beer festival 2011 - http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/blog/posts/2011/10/beer-festival/
[22:20] <ali1234> how did you not notice this before?
[22:20] <popey> pass
[22:20] <ali1234> i just don't get it :|
[22:20] <popey> I used OSX for a fair chunk of this cycle
[22:20] <popey> but wiped that out completely recently
[22:21] <Laney> man that kernel bug looks annoying
[22:21] <Laney> not even the bug itself, but the automated ping pong
[22:21] <popey> which bug?
[22:22] <TheOpenSourcerer> Oooh no updates for the last day or two... Don't say this is final. Perrrrlease
[22:22] <popey> TheOpenSourcerer: enable -proposed :D
[22:22] <popey> there's loads of updates
[22:22] <TheOpenSourcerer> Ah OK.
[22:22] <popey> get them now, while you can :D
[22:22] <alexcockell> I was thinking - when I do a major upgrade next year, the learnign curve could be a bit big.. as other LTS-LTS users like me will find...
[22:23] <popey> nah, we'll have the documentatino done by then :D
[22:23] <alexcockell> HArdy to Lucid was pretty seamless...
[22:23] <popey> there will be a new Ubuntu manual out by then
[22:23] <Laney> popey: the one you twote
[22:23] <popey> ..for maverick
[22:23] <Laney> but kernel bugs in general
[22:23] <popey> Laney: the ralink one?
[22:23] <ali1234> popey: is that the italian localization?
[22:23] <alexcockell> but considering my muscle memory was XP Classic - to GNOME2...
[22:23] <Laney> i don't even remember what it was
[22:23] <popey> Laney: i believe it's just that the driver is shit
[22:23] <Laney> i just saw the automated responses and got annoyed
[22:23] <popey> it seems to work if you power down completely
[22:24] <TheOpenSourcerer> popey: Only 43 packages
[22:24] <TheOpenSourcerer> About 11MB
[22:24]  * Laney upgrades to precise
[22:24] <Laney> oneiric? pfft, who uses that?
[22:24] <zleap> i can now see my ubuntu box from windows
[22:24]  * popey smells Laney's breath
[22:24] <alexcockell> I also found out the hard way ( as there was a second partition on my netbook) that it's always best on lappies to have nothign connected and battery in - and on mains - to do the full dist-upgrade..
[22:25]  * popey puts a pint of water next to Laney's bedside for rehydration
[22:25] <alexcockell> You lot been following the whole RIM debacle and giggling?
[22:25] <ali1234> popey: point about full shutdown. i *always* do that. half the time this machine wont even post if i warm reboot. bioses these days...
[22:26] <alexcockell> Unless of course you have Blackberries...
[22:26] <popey> i only know about the RIM stuff because a) my nieces are moaning about it and b) people keep posting steve jobs jokes about it
[22:27] <alexcockell> Core switch in Slough went bang and took the whole bloody network with it.
[22:27] <shauno> if a bug has been milestoned for oneiric-updates, does that mean it won't be oneiric at release?
[22:27] <popey> no
[22:27] <popey> it will go to -updates
[22:27] <ali1234> their whole operation was routed through slough?
[22:27] <ali1234> lol
[22:27] <alexcockell> Europe, North Africa etc was..
[22:28] <alexcockell> And BBMs stacking up in their queues then rolled over to their datacentre in Canada and started affecting everything over there as well.
[22:28] <TheOpenSourcerer> On the R4 news this eve. they said it was affecting North America too
[22:29] <alexcockell> Apparently there was a network change going in.. and no disrec or backout plans..
[22:29] <alexcockell> And auto-failover didn't.
[22:29] <alexcockell> One fuckin' massive SPOF waiting to happen.
[22:29] <ali1234> it's still going on? jeez
[22:29] <alexcockell> Apparently no major net upgrades had happened since 2007..
[22:29] <popey> 3 days I think
[22:30] <alexcockell> Oh - and it was *since* then that they decided to add all the consumer traffic.
[22:31] <TheOpenSourcerer> Right reboot Oneric and then time for bed.
[22:31] <TheOpenSourcerer> Well, breakfast proly
[22:31] <AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: this samsung is running oneiric
[22:32] <alexcockell> So - Cisco 9000 goes bang... and took down all the proxies with it..
[22:33] <TheOpenSourcerer> "error: sparse file not allowed" It's a grub thing.
[22:33] <TheOpenSourcerer> bug 464743
[22:34] <TheOpenSourcerer> Notice "New"... Reported 2009-10-30
[22:34] <popey> TheOpenSourcerer: you have one partition and it's btrfs?
[22:34] <TheOpenSourcerer> :-)
[22:34] <popey> you need /boot
[22:35] <popey> AIUI
[22:35] <AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: new in grub, fix released in grub2
[22:35] <TheOpenSourcerer> The installer didn't tell me that
[22:35] <TheOpenSourcerer> It boots OK - Just pauses to tell me about sparse files
[22:37] <alexcockell> Oh - re the RIM debacle, I run a Nokia N900... so I'm sitting back with popcorn..
[22:39] <shauno> I thought that was kinda ironic timing.  the same day apple's take on bbm goes live, bbm's nowhere to be seen
[22:39] <AlanBell> wonder if matti is very busy right now
[22:40] <popey> i thought he left
[22:40] <popey> i like that I can send animated gifs over apple imessage :D
[22:40] <AlanBell> ah, I see, matti moves on and the whole infrastructure falls apart!
[22:41] <popey> typical
[22:41] <wintellect> Anyone else having issues with Virgin media?
[22:41] <TheOpenSourcerer> Right time for bed. nn all.
[22:41] <wintellect> Seems I can do anything except access port 80 on other servers :(
[22:42] <shauno> popey, I'm told imessage becomes bbm-compatible if you turn airplane mode on
[22:42] <AlanBell> o/ TheOpenSourcerer
[22:42] <popey> haha
[22:42] <popey> wintellect: no
[22:44] <wintellect> :'(
[22:44] <wintellect> thanks popey
[22:48] <alexcockell> Shauno> LOL
[22:57] <alexcockell> RIM report msg - as quoted by the Grauniad - "The messaging and browsing delays being experienced by BlackBerry users in Europe, the Middle East, Africa, India, Brazil, Chile and Argentina were caused by a core switch failure within RIM's infrastructure. Although the system is designed to failover to a back-up switch, the failover did not function as previously tested. As a result, a large backlog of data was generated and we are now working to clear
[22:57] <alexcockell> that backlog and restore normal service as quickly as possible. We apologise for any inconvenience and we will continue to keep you informed."
[23:07] <shauno> argh .. NTL can't do anything right :/  dvr decided to record exactly 60 seconds of billy connolly
[23:08] <BigRedS> alexcockell: yeah, I'm still skeptical that it's *a* core switch failure. That's one hell of a SPOF
[23:09] <alexcockell> If the whole *frame* went phut...
[23:09] <alexcockell> Cards to each of the related areas... possible?
[23:10] <alexcockell> But no mesh implemented?  No MPLS infrastructure?  or just PVCs to the related centres?
[23:10] <BigRedS> what, and no plan for if the DC had gone away?
[23:11] <alexcockell> Sounds fucking stupid..
[23:11] <BigRedS> well, yeah
[23:11] <Seeker`> alexcockell: language
[23:11] <BigRedS> and, oddly, now doesn't seem to be the time for people to realise that relying on someone else to run a 'free' service for you doesn't always work out well
[23:11]  * BigRedS pats xmpp server
[23:11] <MattJ> XMPP \o/
[23:11] <BigRedS> haha
[23:12] <BigRedS> I'm sure that's a script
[23:12] <MattJ> It's not, I assure you
[23:12] <alexcockell> Apparently, North America was badly affected - as probably BBNs were being rerouted...
[23:13] <alexcockell> The problem is - they seem to have very few interlinks to the rest of the Net - and they rely on push servers to interrogate remote mailfiles run at external IMAP and POP servers...
[23:13] <alexcockell> ... on behalf of their users..
[23:13] <BigRedS> MattJ: ah, I think that proved it.
[23:13] <alexcockell> Same witht he interlinks to Facebook etc.. and their proxy servers..
[23:13] <MattJ> BigRedS, or I'm a good scripter
[23:13] <BigRedS> either it's not a script, or it's a good one :)
[23:13] <MattJ> ;)
[23:39] <doad> hi room im currently using ubuntu 11.04 and im finding it rather slow but when i try to download ubuntu 9.10 and try burning it using ubuntus cd burning software it keeps coming up with error when burning disk, i have tried downloading it from several different sites but no good can anyone help me please
[23:44] <AlanBell> doad: older versions are not neccessarily faster
[23:44] <AlanBell> what processor and ram size do you have?
[23:44] <popey> doad: have you tried installing unity-2d on your 11.04 system?
[23:44] <doad> yeah but my comps quite old and i found using 9.10 faster than 11.04
[23:45] <popey> its quite a bit faster then unity 3d
[23:46] <doad> any ideas people?
[23:46] <doad> 11.04 wont let me burn 9.10 to disk and im stuck :(
[23:49] <doad> any ideas peeps
[23:52] <doad> popey << where can i obtain unity -2d
[23:55] <AlanBell> sudo apt-get install unity2d
[23:55] <doad> do i do that in a terminal?>
[23:56] <AlanBell> yes
[23:56]  * AlanBell heads off to bed
[23:56] <doad> can i ask what does it do?
[23:57] <AlanBell> happy 11.10 release day everyone, see you at the party later
[23:57] <hamitron> 12.04 is next :D
[23:57] <AlanBell> doad: from the login screen you can choose unity2d, it does exactly the same as unity3d, but with less bling (slightly)
[23:58] <doad> and is it a bit faster like for my firefox  internet and loading other programs
[23:59] <AlanBell> not much
[23:59] <AlanBell> what spec  is your computer?