[00:24] <jphilips> testing week has begun - https://xubuntu.org/news/xubuntu-21-04-testing-week/
[00:25] <jphilips> join us in the #ubuntu-quality IRC channel or the telegram group - https://t.me/XubuntuDevelopment
[08:42] <Arseniev> Hello. Is there any way to create a launcher in the menu editor so a terminal with an specifc command opens?
[08:46] <gnrp> Arseniev: You want xfce-terminal?
[08:46] <gnrp> Arseniev: Anyway, just call `xfce4-terminal -x $COMMAND`
[08:47] <gnrp> so make a starter with the terminal icon and this as the command to execute
[08:48] <Arseniev> ok, let me check. xfce-terminal is ok
[08:48] <gnrp> I have e.g. a command that starts `xfce4-terminal -x tmux` so I get a terminal window with tmux already inside
[08:57] <Arseniev> oh not working
[08:57] <Arseniev> upsc salicru
[08:58] <Arseniev> ths is the command I need to run very often in a terminal so I would better create a launcher for everyday use :)
[08:59] <gnrp> Arseniev: not working? What is not working?
[09:04] <Arseniev> xfce4-terminal -x $upsc salicru
[09:04] <gnrp> without the dollar sign
[09:04] <gnrp> sorry
[09:04] <Arseniev> did not show any terminal
[09:04] <gnrp> that was meant ot indicate the variable ;)
[09:04] <Arseniev> ooop ok :)
[09:05] <gnrp> just     xfce4-terminal -x upsc salicru
[09:05] <Arseniev> ok, a terminal flashed very quickly and dissapeared
[09:06] <gnrp> yeah. Becuase this command is run instead of a shell
[09:07] <gnrp> what is your goal? You could make something like    xfce4-terminal -x "upsc salicru; read" if you want to close the window only when you press enter
[09:07] <gnrp> or you want to have a regular shell afterwards?
[09:07] <gnrp> so what happens right now: A terminal will run, execute upsc salicru and when the command is over, closes again
[09:08] <Arseniev> I need it to stay as I need to read the result of such command
[09:09] <Arseniev> I can't read it in a milisecond haha
[09:09] <gnrp> then try this:     xfce4-terminal -x "upsc salicru; read"
[09:09] <gnrp> then it will wait till you press enter
[09:09] <gnrp> or try this:     xfce4-terminal -x "upsc salicru; sleep N"
[09:09] <gnrp> where you replace N by the amount of seconds that you want to see the terminal
[09:17] <Arseniev> error with both of them :S
[09:17] <gnrp> Arseniev: What's the error?
[09:19] <Arseniev> well i'll translate it because it is in spanish.
[09:21] <Arseniev> an error happened while running the son process. "upsc salicru; read" there is no such file or directory
[09:21] <gnrp> Arseniev: I'm offline in five minutes, so rather be quick if there's not somebody else jumping in ;)
[09:21] <gnrp> Arseniev: Aaah, I see
[09:21] <gnrp> with sleep it should owrk
[09:21] <gnrp> read is a shell built-in
[09:21] <Arseniev> ok
[09:21] <gnrp> you could start a shell to run that command ,but I'd recommend the tim hting
[09:22] <Arseniev> the same error
[09:22] <gnrp> Arseniev: Try "upsc salicru; /bin/sleep 5"
[09:23] <gnrp> Arseniev: Could also be you have to give the whole path for upsc
[09:24] <gnrp> you can find out with `which upsc` (just run in terminal to get the full path)
[09:25] <Arseniev> nothing seems to work hahah. Bad day. I'll try another day. Thank yo anyway gnrp
[13:17] <readid> hello i install xubuntu 18.04
[13:19] <Maik> readid: xubuntu 18.04 will go EOL (End Of Life) this months and won't be supported anymore
[13:22] <remline> Yes, 20.04 is the current long term release.
[13:23] <Maik> he's goneanyway
[13:24] <Maik> i would like to have known if he has a 32bit machine or a 64bit one
[13:24] <Maik> most people install 18.04 because it's the only and last release with 32bit support
[13:25] <remline> Maik: I very much wonder, what percentage of 32bit installs are simply because the person didn't know whether to download 32 or 64?
[13:25] <remline> I've got pretty ancient hardware, but still it is 64 bit!
[13:28] <Maik> remline: also true. But there was a user in kubuntu yesterday who had a 32bit only machine so we had to tell him to switch to Debian.
[13:40] <fyrri> I've got a couple 32-bit systems still running :)
[13:40] <fyrri> theyre impractically slow for any real use, but still
[13:43] <remline> fyrri: Neat! What CPUs are they?
[13:45] <fyrri> AMD k6-2, thunderbird and one Mac Mini
[13:45] <fyrri> PPC Mac Mini
[13:46] <fyrri> I've kept them for nostalgia's sake all these years :)
[17:49] <jphilips> testing week has begun - https://xubuntu.org/news/xubuntu-21-04-testing-week/
[17:49] <jphilips> join us in the #ubuntu-quality IRC channel or the telegram group - https://t.me/XubuntuDevelopment


[00:28] <smspillaz> desrt: we don't grab all possible keycombos
[00:29] <smspillaz> desrt: we only grab keycodes that we have actions bound do
[00:30] <smspillaz> unfortunately, XGrabKey on a modifier key has some nasty side effects. namely that the grab activates when you press the modifier key and doesn't deactivate until its released
[00:30] <jbicha> "we don't grab all possible keycombos yet" << fixed it for you ;)
[00:31] <smspillaz> desrt: so the reality is that the grab will remain when you press another key in addition to an already grabbed key
[00:31] <desrt> smspillaz: i have a workaround for that
[00:31] <smspillaz> that being said in compiz we use some trickery to ensure that the grab is released when you do that
[00:31] <desrt> when you get the first unexpected key you XAllowEvents ReplayKeyboard and drop the grab
[00:31] <smspillaz> yep
[00:32] <desrt> then the app that would have seen it in the first place gets to see it
[00:32] <smspillaz> yep
[00:32] <desrt> with the original timestamp, even
[00:32] <desrt> it ends up just looking like a processing delay
[00:32] <smspillaz> there is a race condition though
[00:32] <desrt> if you use Sync grabs there shouldn't be...
[00:32] <smspillaz> where the passive grab activates
[00:32] <desrt> the server is supposed to freeze the queue
[00:32] <smspillaz> hmm maybe that's been fixed
[00:32] <smspillaz> I'm not really the one who works on it
[00:33] <desrt> i have some sample code that i'm going to try to hammer into something meaningful over the next day or two
[00:33] <desrt> reviewing ted's dbusmenu work just now though
[00:34] <smspillaz> desrt: ok, we're using GrabModeSync for keyboard mode
[00:34] <smspillaz> in XGrabKey
[00:34] <smspillaz> that makes sense
[00:34] <desrt> should be fine, then
[00:34] <desrt> the x server freezes the keyboard event queue until you tell it what to do with XAllowEvents
[00:34] <desrt> you only see the very first keystroke
[00:34] <smspillaz> indeed
[00:35] <smspillaz> I hate grabs
[00:35] <desrt> (ie: the one that caused the establishment of the passive grab)
[00:35] <desrt> the X grabbing infrastructure is actually pretty sensible if you understand it
[00:35] <smspillaz> its sensible but like
[00:35] <desrt> my biggest gripe with it is that it chooses to solve a problem that's entirely too complicated
[00:35] <smspillaz> just the entire concept
[00:35] <desrt> and some different engineering/design choices could have resulted in a *much* easier to understand system
[00:36] <smspillaz> indeed
[00:36] <smspillaz> desrt: oh I found a funny problem with gnome-keyring the other day
[00:36] <smspillaz> speaking of grabs
[00:36] <smspillaz> desrt: it was a bug that happened in compiz and
[00:36] <smspillaz> *gasp*
[00:36] <smspillaz> gnome-shell but not
[00:36] <smspillaz> *gaps*
[00:36] <smspillaz> mutter
[00:37] <smspillaz> because gnome-keyring would establish a grab
[00:37] <smspillaz> on its input window
[00:37] <desrt> time to port unity-2d to mutter, clearly
[00:37] <smspillaz> errm
[00:37] <desrt> ah, well
[00:37] <smspillaz> s/mutter/metacity/
[00:37] <smspillaz> well
[00:37] <smspillaz> no sorry
[00:37] <desrt> you should know that that's not a bug that happens in gnome-shell either
[00:37] <smspillaz> it would establish teh grab
[00:37] <desrt> it happens in canonical's patched version of gnome-shell
[00:37] <smspillaz> when the window became unfocused
[00:37] <smspillaz> desrt: only happens because
[00:38] <smspillaz> gnome-shell and compiz support _NET_WM_STATE_FOCUSED
[00:38] <smspillaz> and there was this bitshift bug
[00:38] <smspillaz> XD
[00:38] <smspillaz> drove me a bit nuts
[00:38] <smspillaz> spent ages thinking
[00:38] <smspillaz> "there has to be something we're doing wrong"
[00:38] <smspillaz> then it broke in g-s and then I instantly thought "nope, application must be broken"
[00:40] <smspillaz> its always hard to tell these things unfortunately, at the boundary of the application and wm, who is actually doing weird things
[01:02] <jbicha> desrt: are we stuck with gnome-control-center not being able to write gsettings keyboard shortcuts for precise?
[01:17] <desrt> jbicha: unless you want to run the upstream ppa
[01:19] <jbicha> ok, just checking
[01:22] <jbicha> desrt: now I have to figure out whether to make the gnome-shell keyboard shortcuts match unity's new ones from bug 969235
[01:22] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 969235 in metacity "Keyboard shortcuts - Update some window management shortcuts to use "Ctrl + Super" instead of just "Super" " [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/969235
[01:23] <jbicha> it's that whole "do people want upstream or do they want better integrated with Ubuntu" question again
[01:24] <kklimonda> smspillaz: hey, do you have a moment?
[01:24] <smspillaz> how long is a moment ?
[01:25] <kklimonda> smspillaz: could you take a look at bug 970932? I wonder if it's compiz related issue
[01:25] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 970932 in unity "unity treats windows as belonging to multiple workspaces at the same time" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/970932
[01:25] <smspillaz> kklimonda: you need to get it added to the priority list
[01:25] <smspillaz> talk to either didrocks or seb128
[01:26] <smspillaz> sorry, I get told off if I work on stuff that's not on the priority list
[01:26] <smspillaz> (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/PrecisePriorities
[01:27] <kklimonda> wow, this list is big for that close to the release :(
[01:27] <smspillaz> which is why getting new stuff on to it requires a process :)
[01:32] <kklimonda> damn beaurecracy, seb128 definitely told me to ping you. I'll ask him tomorrow to get it on the list ;)
[04:36] <BigWhale> Good Moring.
[04:36] <BigWhale> moring
[04:36] <BigWhale> whatever.
[04:49] <RAOF> BigWhale: Good mooring :)
[04:50] <BigWhale> RAOF, I'm just pretending to be awake. :)
[05:23] <TheMuso> pitti: Just to make sure I understand you completely re at-spi2-atk and pyatspi and transitional packages, could you please tell me whether what I've done in these diffs is correct to solve the problem? Note other changes from debian are included as well: http://people.canonical.com/~themuso/at-spi2-atk.diff and http://people.canonical.com/~themuso/pyatspi.diff.
[05:51] <pitti> Good morning
[05:51] <pitti> TheMuso: hey
[05:51] <pitti> TheMuso: not quite -- you need to make the C/R/P versioned, not drop them completely
[05:52] <pitti> TheMuso: i. e. (<< your_new_version_that_introduces_the_transitionals)
[05:54] <TheMuso> pitti: ah right, makes sense, thanks.
[05:56] <micahg> shouldn't that be B/R/P since it's versioned?
[05:58] <TheMuso> Not sure about now for the transitional stuff, but these newer packages contain the same filenames and paths as the older at-spi stack packages.
[05:58] <TheMuso> Hense why they currently have conflicts.
[05:58] <micahg> TheMuso: that should be breaks for file moves
[05:58] <TheMuso> There are no file moves.
[05:58] <TheMuso> 2 packages have the same paths/files.
[05:58] <micahg> TheMuso: oh, ok
[06:04] <pitti> TheMuso: "newer packages" == the at-spi2 stuff, you mean?
[06:04] <TheMuso> pitti: yes
[06:04] <pitti> TheMuso: becasue the transitional at-spi and python-pyatspi packages should be empty (except changelog, etc.)
[06:05] <TheMuso> pitti: and I was referring to libatk-adaptor/python-pyatspi2 having the same filenames as the at-spi and python-pyatspi packages that we currently have in the archive.
[06:07] <pitti> TheMuso: right, hence we need the B/R/P
[06:07] <TheMuso> right
[06:11] <didrocks> good morning
[06:11] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[06:11] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti, how are you?
[06:19] <TheMuso> pitti: I thought you couldn't have versioned provides...
[06:19] <pitti> TheMuso: right, just versioned B/R I mean; sorry
[06:19] <TheMuso> Right, just checking.
[06:19] <pitti> didrocks: quite fine, thanks!
[06:19] <pitti> didrocks: how about yourself?
[06:34] <didrocks> pitti: seems everything's fine. Answering emails and the world didn't fall apart. Also, the QA labs is back on shape :)
[06:35] <pitti> ooh, is it?
[06:35] <pitti> indeed, nice!
[06:35] <didrocks> pitti: was blocking all merge requests yesterday, wasn't fun ;)
[06:44] <TheMuso> pitti: Ok, if you wouldn't mind having a look at those above linked diffs once again just to make sure I've not msised anything, that would be appreciated. If all looks ok, I'll upload.
[06:45] <pitti> TheMuso: not (<< ${binary:Version}) please
[06:45] <pitti> TheMuso: just whichever version you are about to upload
[06:45] <pitti> TheMuso: it does not contain a changelog, so I can't say
[06:46] <pitti> TheMuso: that (fixed, static) version is from which on at-spi will be transitional; it does not change any more
[06:50] <TheMuso> ah ok now I'm with you.
[06:54] <TheMuso> pitti: Ok please check again. I don't want to have to upload and have it not work. :)
[06:55] <pitti> TheMuso: looks fine now; you should just add (LP: #966845) to the changleog
[06:55] <pitti> TheMuso: thanks!
[06:57] <TheMuso> that was the plan, I just want to get the important bits right. :)
[06:57] <TheMuso> s/was/is/
[07:00] <TheMuso> Ok uploaded, and hopefully fixed.
[07:00] <pitti> didrocks: do you think it would be ok to move the privacy settings from "system" to the "personal" category in control-center?
[07:01] <pitti> didrocks: I think that would be appropriate, and fix the UI overflow introduced by the new landscape applet
[07:01] <pitti> didrocks: I didn't find an existing bug, will create one, but wanted to get your thoughts first
[07:01] <didrocks> pitti: would make sense I guess. Let's do it then!
[07:01] <didrocks> pitti: do you want me to change this?
[07:02] <pitti> didrocks: hang on, need an UIFE bug and some signoff first
[07:02] <didrocks> you have an overlow on de?
[07:02] <didrocks> I don't have any in fr
[07:04] <pitti> didrocks: bug 973130, has a screenshot
[07:04] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 973130 in gnome-control-center "[UIFE] Adding landscape installer caused UI overflow" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/973130
[07:04] <pitti> didrocks: odd, what is missing for you in the "system" category?
[07:05] <didrocks> pitti: ah, it's because of landscape. It seems I don't have installed
[07:06] <pitti> I guess we need to wait for jbicha to come online
[07:06] <didrocks> right
[07:21] <jasoncwarner_> pitti and didrocks on the landscape thing, I upgraded a test system today and I didn't get landscape in the system settings. I have it on my two main systems, but not sure why I didn't get it on the test system
[07:25] <didrocks> landscape-client-ui-install is seeded and a recommends of ubuntu-desktop
[07:26] <didrocks> I didn't get it on upgrade as well
[07:29] <pitti> strange; ordinarily updates should get new recommends
[07:29] <didrocks> ah, I got the new package on 2012-03-23
[07:29] <didrocks> with an apt-get upgrade
[07:29] <didrocks> (well new "ubuntu-desktop")
[07:29] <didrocks> that's why the new recommends wasn't installed, as it wasn't in a dist-upgrade
[07:30] <didrocks> I tend to apt-get upgrade first
[07:30] <didrocks> then, apt-get dist-upgrade and look the output
[07:30] <didrocks> thinking of it, it's an issue with all the new recommends, like, in this case, you get the package recommending a new one on upgrade and not dist-upgrade
[07:31] <jasoncwarner_> hmm...so that means we wouldn't get it if we did just an upgrade for that particular one?
[07:34] <pitti> sudo apt-get install --fix-policy
[07:34] <pitti> jasoncwarner_, didrocks: that will install all the recommends you skipped during "upgrade"
[07:35] <didrocks> pitti: already did that and confirms it did it :)
[07:48] <seb128> hey
[07:48] <pitti> it's a seb!
[07:48] <pitti> aisleriot FTBFS fix uploaded
[07:53] <didrocks> salut seb128 :)
[07:53] <seb128> hey pitti didrocks, how are you?
[07:53] <pitti> seb128: quite fine, thanks!
[07:53] <didrocks> seb128: I'm fine, thanks, you?
[07:53] <pitti> seb128: would you be able to create a desktop team status page tomorrow evening, and send it to u-release@?
[07:57] <seb128> didrocks, I'm good thanks (busy reading @tech discussions)
[07:57] <seb128> pitti, yes, I can do that, I don't work friday by tomorrow night is fine ;-)
[08:12] <kklimonda> seb128: smspillaz told me that my bug has to go to the http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/PrecisePriorities before he can take a look at it ;)
[08:12] <seb128> kklimonda, ok, fat chance then
[08:12] <seb128> kklimonda, that's really a corner case issue for multiple workspaces users and you are the first to complain, I doubt it lands on any priority list ;-)
[08:15] <kklimonda> seb128: huh, am I really the only person to use super+left with multiple workspaces? because that's how I hit the bug :(
[08:15] <kklimonda> (well, that's one of the ways)
[08:16] <seb128> pitti, bug #973130 I reassigned to the activity-log-manager, nothing we can do from the control center side
[08:16] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 973130 in activity-log-manager "[UIFE] Adding landscape installer caused UI overflow" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/973130
[08:17] <seb128> kklimonda, can you describe your bug? using super-left doesn't make the left pinned dialog show on the next ws or in its alt tab here
[08:17] <kklimonda> seb128: yeah, I think I was describing two bugs at the time
[08:17] <kklimonda> seb128: I've went to rewrite the report yesterday evening
[08:18] <seb128> kklimonda, what's the number again?
[08:18] <kklimonda> https://launchpad.net/bugs/970932
[08:18] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 970932 in unity "unity moves windows between workspaces when you try switching to them" [Undecided,New]
[08:20] <seb128> kklimonda, I can't confirm, I did that:
[08:20] <seb128> - open gedit on ws
[08:20] <seb128> - open nautilus on ws2
[08:20] <seb128> - go to ws1, focus gedit, super-left
[08:20] <seb128> click on nautilus in the change, it moves me to ws2
[08:20] <seb128> click on something running ws1
[08:20] <seb128> it brings me back to ws1
[08:21] <seb128> gedit didn't move nor anything else
[08:21] <kklimonda> seb128: do you use super+left to move gedit to the left part of the screen?
[08:22] <seb128> kklimonda, " - go to ws1, focus gedit, super-left"
[08:22] <kklimonda> ah
[08:22] <kklimonda> sorry, still drank my first coffee yet ;)
[08:23] <seb128> kklimonda, you will need to come with as exact sequence to reproduce the bug on a guest session
[08:23] <seb128> your description is not good enough, or it's specific to something on your config
[08:31] <kklimonda> seb128: is your launcher set to hide? I've written steps I took to reproduce it in the guest session in the bug 970932
[08:31] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 970932 in unity "unity moves windows between workspaces when you try switching to them" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/970932
[08:31] <seb128> kklimonda, no, it's always on (which is the default)
[08:35] <seb128> kklimonda, no, I can't reproduce in a guest session using your steps but I use unity staging ppa so maybe it's already fixed in trunk
[08:37] <kklimonda> ok, I'll update to the staging and see if it's fixed for me :)
[08:43] <Sweetshark> micahg: I cannot exclude the possibility, that they might also work with breaks. But if that is changed, it would need to be changed at debian to keep the delta small. And debian is less than convinced of giving this a try.
[08:43] <Sweetshark> micahg: And conflicts->breaks would be of theortical gain only as we already have conflicts to 3.4 for essential libreoffice packages inplace, so the limitations on the upgrade order are already inplace.
[08:44] <Sweetshark> micahg: Also there is a good chance that conflicts: are actually needed and breaks: isnt enough. The whole layout of the libreoffice binaries (libraries paths etc.) got simplified a lot between 3.4 and 3.5 (moving libs around) and there are quite a few maintainer scripts to cope with that. So lowering the requirement to Breaks: might introduce problems in cornercases -- something I dont want to risk this short before the release.
[08:53] <kklimonda> damn, still happening on a guest account.. I'll test it on a netbook later, maybe it has something to do with nvidia driver (which is a very long shot) :/
[09:28] <pitti> didrocks: do you know about a bug report that opening dash and typing does not type into teh dash, but the nautilus desktop readahead search?
[09:29] <didrocks> pitti: not that I noticed. Is that the first time you open the dash?
[09:29] <didrocks> or everytime?
[09:30] <pitti> didrocks: hm, could be
[09:30] <pitti> I don't use it that often
[09:30] <didrocks> pitti: as the first time you open it, there is the lenses loading, that can impact some race on focusing maybe?
[09:53] <pitti> didrocks: re (sorry, had 1-on-1)
[09:53] <didrocks> no worry :)
[09:54] <pitti> didrocks: so, it's plausible that it only happens the first time
[09:54] <pitti> didrocks: anyway, seems you aren't aware of it, so I'll just file it if I can reproduce it more reliably
[09:54] <didrocks> pitti: I restarted my session and didn't get it, but if it's racy, can be related to computer speed
[09:54] <didrocks> yes please :)
[10:27] <popey> pitti / didrocks clean boot on my machine. pressed "Super" then typed "hello". The "h" is on my desktop in a nautilus thing in the bottom right, the "ello" is in the dash
[10:27] <didrocks> gord: ^
[10:27] <popey> machine was idle, some time after boot up, core i7, fast ssd, so not a 'slow' machine
[10:27] <didrocks> gord loves this kind of focus dealing, he did it for the HUD and dash already :)
[10:28] <popey> haha
[10:28] <popey> tbh I was pretty quick at typing 'hello', but it is certainly possible to trigger it
[10:29] <didrocks> popey: also please file a bug and add that to the bug list we are waiting for (upstream tests regressions)
[10:29] <popey> mostly does it the first time, less so if you "super"+wait a fraction of a second+ type
[10:29] <didrocks> popey: can you cook that list with sil2100's results, please?
[10:29] <popey> I can't today, on holiday
[10:29] <popey> about to go afk all day
[10:29] <didrocks> popey: ok, I'll ask sil2100 directly then :)
[10:29] <popey> please do!
[10:49] <Sweetshark> grmbl. update-manager ignored my ppa during the upgrade. why?
[10:54] <pitti> didrocks: we got an ack for bug 973130
[10:54] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 973130 in activity-log-manager "[UIFE] Adding landscape installer caused UI overflow" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/973130
[10:54] <pitti> didrocks: do you know what to change, and want to/can handle it?
[10:54] <didrocks> pitti: can do, sure :)
[10:54] <didrocks> will report it upstream then
[10:55] <pitti> didrocks: merci beaucoup
[10:55] <didrocks> pitti: mais de rien ;)
[10:55] <didrocks> you were quick to assign it (just got spamm by the email) ;)
[10:55] <pitti> so long, need to leave
[10:55] <didrocks> ttyl pitti!
[10:56] <pitti> working offline in the train this afternoon, and holiday tomorrow
[10:56] <pitti> see you all next Tuesday, enjoy your Easter holidays!
[10:56] <didrocks> pitti: oh, enjoy your long week-end then ;)
[11:00] <Sweetshark> pitti: what was the way to simulate a do release upgrade with a ppa enabled all the time? The AllowThirdParty=yes doesnt seem to cut it
[11:00] <didrocks> Sweetshark: 12:57:33           <-- | pitti<EMAIL_ADDRESS>a quitté (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
[11:00] <didrocks> Sweetshark: too late ;)
[11:02] <Sweetshark> *grmbl*
[11:02]  * Sweetshark weakly shakes angry old man fist.
[11:03] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you should conflicts on non compatible locale binaries or something, it's not the first time I upgrade tb and get it in english because I didn't pick the locale-fr binary in update-manager ;-)
[11:03] <chrisccoulson> who wouldn't want to use english? ;)
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> actually, i should correct myself
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> it defaults to "american" rather than "english" ;)
[11:04] <seb128> ;-)
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> we should fix that
[11:04] <seb128> default to french with an hard depends you mean?
[11:04] <seb128> yeah, I agree!
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> heh
[11:04]  * didrocks prepares a French version of Unity for chrisccoulson :)
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> thanks!
[11:05] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well, ignore me, I guess I'm the only one too lazy to download 150mb updates a day and who picks up partial upgrades in update-manager ;-)
[11:06] <didrocks> seb128: stop cherry-picking the love, takes all of the delivery :)
[11:06] <seb128> didrocks, I would if Sweetshark stopped pushing 90mb of libreoffice binaries to download only to fix a control typo
[11:06] <chrisccoulson> lol
[11:07] <chrisccoulson> i should do the same for firefox and thunderbird too!
[11:07] <chrisccoulson> ;)
[11:07] <didrocks> seb128: I would love as well, it's not a download speed issue here, but install one with high level i/o :)
[11:07] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you do but yours are "only" 23mb ;-)
[11:08] <seb128> wououh, french tb again! ;-)
[11:09] <seb128> chrisccoulson, on the good new side still no tb hand on sent since 11.0.1
[11:09] <Sweetshark> seb128: hey, that wasnt only fo the typo!
[11:09] <chrisccoulson> that's good :)
[11:10] <Sweetshark> seb128: although it was more than 90MB, so the contribution of the typo might be roughly 90MB
[11:10] <seb128> Sweetshark, lol
[11:10] <Sweetshark> seb128: but I hear, you want to review my next upload.
[11:10] <seb128> where is mvo? we really need delta downloads
[11:10]  * Sweetshark makes notes.
[11:11] <seb128> waouh, ajmitch is still active ;-)
[11:12] <seb128> didrocks, did you get other people to complain about the unity staging ppa being seen as an untrusted source by update-manager?
[11:12] <ajmitch> seb128: hm what?
[11:12] <seb128> it's 3 times I try to desactivate, reactivate the ppa or refresh the index
[11:12] <seb128> ajmitch, nothing, just good to see you doing uploads ;-)
[11:12] <ajmitch> heh
[11:12] <didrocks> seb128: no. Well, it's really an untrusted source in fact :)
[11:12]  * ajmitch has done a few for precise :)
[11:13] <didrocks> seb128: I think people using the ppa are more using the CLI
[11:13] <didrocks> seb128: you do have the ppa keys?
[11:13] <seb128> ajmitch, yeah, I just noticed looking to my changes box, I skipped all the haskell stuff :p
[11:13] <seb128> didrocks, I guess so, I've the ppa configured for some months, it usually works fine ... I guess it's rather a mvo issue
[11:14] <ajmitch> all the haskell stuff was boring syncs anyway :)
[11:15] <didrocks> seb128: either that or a ppa one
[11:15] <didrocks> like launchpad not signing well the Release file
[11:17] <Sweetshark> seb128: I was only half kidding, reviewing the upload is greatly appreciated
[11:17] <seb128> Sweetshark, what upload? you mean looking to your diff to see if I spot errors? I don't think I know enough about lo for that ;-)
[11:20] <Laney> ajmitch crossed back over from the other side last Halloween
[11:21] <seb128> Laney, hey, how are you? thanks for the "default app selection" UDS topic email ;-)
[11:22]  * ajmitch was so looking forward to another round of banshee vs rhythmbox at UDS, too :)
[11:23] <Sweetshark> seb128: you still might spot typos like "libreofficeu-core" that I miss because I autocomplete after libreo...
[11:23] <seb128> hehe
[11:24] <Laney> seb128: good thanks. no worries - i promised to raise it at the time :-)
[11:24] <jbicha_> isn't it about time for another Firefox vs. Chromium debate or have people just got bored?
[11:25] <seb128> jbicha_, hey ;-)
[11:25] <jbicha_> seb128: good morning
[11:25] <seb128> jbicha_, how are you?
[11:25] <chrisccoulson> jbicha_, have you seen the plans for the chrome UI? ;)
[11:25] <chrisccoulson> ie, drop gtk
[11:25] <seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, they copy firefox then :p
[11:25] <chrisccoulson> seb128, no, they are switching to their new aura framework
[11:26] <chrisccoulson> http://www.chromium.org/developers/design-documents/aura-desktop-window-manager
[11:26] <seb128> isn't firefox having its own rendering stuff as well anyway?
[11:26] <seb128> like aren't they moving away from cairo?
[11:26] <Sweetshark> seb128: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/99774571/libreoffice_1%3A3.5.1-1ubuntu2~ppa1_1%3A3.5.1-1ubuntu5~ppa1.diff.gz <- thats the debdiff
[11:26] <chrisccoulson> seb128, the only thing they don't use cairo for is the 2d canvas atm
[11:27] <chrisccoulson> although, i think the plan is to stop using cairo for all content
[11:28] <Sweetshark> seb128: ah, forget that, the debdiff is against ubuntu1, not ubuntu4. :/
[11:28] <seb128> chrisccoulson, "The goal is to produce a new desktop window manager and shell environment with modern capabilities" <- wth, isn't chromium a web browser?
[11:28] <seb128> chrisccoulson, is that chrome os stuff?
[11:29] <jbicha_> Why's Chrome got to be a GTK3 hater?! ;)
[11:29] <seb128> jbicha_, who isn't :p
[11:30] <seb128> I think I'm slightly a GTK3 hater as well when they say stuff "nobody use GTK out of GNOME so we don't care about keeping compatible behaviours"
[11:40] <didrocks> seb128: it's the base for their future OS
[11:41] <seb128> didrocks, is that different from Chrome OS?
[11:41] <didrocks> seb128: no, from my readings the past few days it's the new architecture for Chrome OS
[11:41] <didrocks> seb128: it's just called "Chromium OS"
[11:41] <didrocks> (not sure if they will have one based on FLOSS and another with extra content as with the browser)
[11:42] <seb128> didrocks, ok
[11:42] <seb128> "interesting"
[12:17] <mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: whoops: http://www.linuxuser.co.uk/opinion/5-problems-with-ubuntu-12-04-part-1-unity-dash-usability-issues/
[12:18] <mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: is it too late to add "email" somewhere in the thunderbird desktop file or what not? :P
[12:19] <chrisccoulson> do people really type "email" rather than "mail"?
[12:19] <chrisccoulson> i can't believe that nobody has reported that, even though it's been the case for a while
[12:19] <chrisccoulson> it was the same in oneiric too
[12:20] <mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: you type "mail" for "email"?
[12:21] <mdeslaur> heck, I probably would have typed "e-mail"
[12:21] <chrisccoulson> well, i don't typue anything. i already know what to look for. but i'm just surprised that nobody has ever mentioned this as an issue before
[12:22] <mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: there used to be a big "email" icon in the default dash...that went away not too long ago
[12:22] <jbicha_> chrisccoulson: not many people knew about keywords until it was posted on the planet
[12:25] <seb128> chrisccoulson, firefox not using gettext is a pain though, it means it's not easy to translate the .desktop or keywords :-(
[12:25] <seb128> well firefox or tb
[12:26] <jbicha_> did the dash in 11.10 even support keywords? I know I added some to gnome-games but that was more intended for Software Center searching
[12:26] <seb128> jbicha_, it did
[12:26] <seb128> jbicha_, X-GNOME-Keywords by then
[12:26] <seb128> but only gnome-control-center was using some
[12:54] <Sweetshark> seb128: 3.5.1-1ubuntu5 uploaded to chinstrap. please review and sponsor.
[13:00] <seb128> Sweetshark, did I sign for that? ;-)
[13:02] <Sweetshark> seb128: oh, apropos sign ...
[13:03] <seb128> Sweetshark, you will ask me to write on your wikipage next? ;-)
[13:03] <Sweetshark> seb128: you disclosed my evil plan!
[13:04] <Sweetshark> seb128: now they are signed too.
[13:04] <seb128> Sweetshark, what are signed?
[13:04] <Sweetshark> seb128: the *.changes file and the *.dsc ;)
[13:05] <seb128> Sweetshark, oh, I didn't ask you to sign the chinstrap, I was wondering if I said I would review,upload lo, but I guess since pitti is not around I've to do it ;-)
[13:05] <seb128> Sweetshark, I will do that in a minute
[13:05] <desrt_> happy wednesday
[13:05] <Sweetshark> seb128: unless didrocks gets cocky like last time ;)
[13:05] <seb128> desrt, happy thursday
[13:06] <desrt> seriously?  awesome!!
[13:06] <didrocks> happy friday? :)
[13:06] <desrt> happy april 1st?
[13:06] <seb128> desrt, well it's good friday (is that how you call it?) this week so tomorrow is friday, i.e end of work week :p
[13:06] <desrt> ya.  i guess that makes sense.
[13:06] <desrt> as for didrocks... i don't know what he's on about
[13:07] <seb128> I start hating vcses or didrocks dunno
[13:07]  * didrocks looks seb128 in an angry way :)
[13:07] <seb128> each time I want to push a change to gnome-control-center I get a
[13:07] <seb128> bzr: ERROR: These branches have diverged.  See "bzr help diverged-branches" for more information.
[13:07] <seb128> i.e people keep commiting to g-c-c while I'm working on it :p
[13:07] <didrocks> seb128: bzr rebase FTW!
[13:08] <didrocks> seb128: but I got it, I'll stop working then ;)
[13:08] <didrocks> and will write "as required by seb128…" :p
[13:08] <jbicha> didrocks: happy Friday then!
[13:08] <didrocks> jbicha: \o/
[13:08] <seb128> graaaa, I screwed up my work totally
[13:09] <seb128> it was jbicha not didrocks who commiting to gcc under my feet
[13:09] <desrt> if it's thursday, i wonder if that means we get to not have the team meeting
[13:09] <desrt> jbicha: good job!
[13:10] <didrocks> seb128: tell me once you rebased, so that I can push before you do for more fun ;)
[13:10] <seb128> didrocks, I will rebase on friday
[13:10] <seb128> :-p
[13:10] <jbicha> how about we reassign all g-c-c bugs to seb128?
[13:11] <chrisccoulson> how about we reassign all bugs to seb128?
[13:11] <didrocks> seb128: well, remember? I'm here on Friday AND Monday, so you will have to work on week-ends to avoid that! :p
[13:11] <jbicha> chrisccoulson: +1
[13:11] <chrisccoulson> heh
[13:11]  * seb128 hides
[13:11] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: I have a handy script for that if needed ;)
[13:11] <chrisccoulson> nice :)
[13:13] <dupondje> Brasero is broken? Gives me the 2,76MB free for a CDR ...
[13:14] <seb128> dupondje, could well be, it's a buggy software without a maintainer upstream for over a year
[13:15] <bcurtiswx> good morning
[13:38] <chrisccoulson> nice, https://areweslimyet.com/ !
[13:55] <seb128> desrt, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/99845092/Stacktrace.txt does it make any sense to you? or is that again schemas install issues?
[13:58] <desrt> sure wish i knew what the ?? was :)
[13:58] <desrt> what process is this?
[13:59] <seb128> desrt, hud-service
[13:59] <seb128> desrt, bug #972868 sorry
[13:59] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 972868 in indicator-appmenu "hud-service crashed with signal 5 in g_settings_get_value()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/972868
[13:59] <seb128> desrt, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/99926744/Stacktrace.txt is similar
[13:59] <desrt> so i changed the name of a key in the schema
[14:00] <seb128> or not
[14:00] <desrt> will we get a retrace on this?
[14:00] <seb128> desrt, oh, so maybe old process still running
[14:00] <desrt> seb128: shouldn't matter
[14:00] <desrt> the compiled schemas db is opened when the process starts
[14:00] <seb128> desrt, we got a retrace
[14:00] <seb128> desrt, g_settings_schema_key_init (key=0x7fff7a05a930, schema=0x1a6bd00, name=0x40d220 "end-drop-penalty")
[14:00] <seb128> end-drop-penalty
[14:00] <desrt> yup
[14:00] <desrt> so the only way that could happen is if the new hud-service gets started in the middle of an upgrade
[14:00] <Sweetshark> ricotz: ping?
[14:00] <desrt> ie: before the new schema database gets compiled
[14:01] <seb128> desrt, sorry I gave the wrong url first
[14:01] <seb128> desrt, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/99859391/Stacktrace.txt
[14:01] <seb128> desrt, that's the retraced version
[14:01] <desrt> seb128: so this would happen 100% reliably if you did a hud search in the middle of an upgrade between those two versions
[14:01] <seb128> ok
[14:01] <desrt> and would otherwise be impossible
[14:01] <seb128> desrt, did I tell you how much I hate gsettings for such issues :p
[14:02] <desrt> seb128: or apt/dpkg?
[14:02] <desrt> when will we have our atomic upgrades?
[14:02] <seb128> desrt, well gsettings for not being robust to any real world issues
[14:02] <seb128> but yeah, better upgrades would be nice
[14:02] <desrt> seb128: like using your system in the middle of an upgrade?
[14:02] <seb128> desrt, anyway, thanks
[14:02] <desrt> if you do that, you're gonna have a bad time :p
[14:03] <seb128> desrt, right
[14:03] <seb128> desrt, the other one seems a real bug, I assigned it to you
[14:03] <seb128> bug #973203
[14:03] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 973203 in indicator-appmenu "hud-service crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/973203
[14:03] <desrt> uh oh
[14:03] <seb128> #0  0x000000000040b7e0 in hud_token_list_distance (haystack=0x7f6a2c0013a0, needle=0x1584520, matches=0x0) at /build/buildd/indicator-appmenu-0.3.96/./src/hudtoken.c:319
[14:04] <desrt> uh oh
[14:04] <desrt>     cost = hud_token_distance (haystack->tokens[0], needle->tokens[0]);
[14:05] <desrt> SegvReason: reading NULL VMA
[14:05] <desrt> that's a NULL dereference, right?
[14:05] <seb128> desrt, I think it is yes
[14:06] <desrt> so i think that could be caused by an application that has a menu item with no label...
[14:06] <desrt> like, a label of ""
[14:06] <desrt> oh.  shit.
[14:07] <desrt> i think that might be caused by typing a single space character into the hud, actually
[14:07] <desrt> you'd end up with zero needles that way...
[14:07] <seb128> desrt, indeed, typing space segfault the hud-service :p
[14:07] <didrocks> confirmed here ;)
[14:07] <desrt> NICE
[14:07] <seb128> desrt, archive testing for the win ;-)
[14:08] <desrt> okay.  that's a pretty obvious fix :)
[14:08]  * desrt will have something in a few minutes
[14:15] <desrt> https://code.launchpad.net/~desrt/indicator-appmenu/no-search-tokens/+merge/100801
[14:16] <desrt> seb128: looks like a did a bit too good a job of stripping spaces :)
[14:16] <desrt> anyway -- testing appreciated, of course
[14:16] <seb128> desrt, please make sure that get into today's tarball ;-)
[14:17] <seb128> desrt, I will test to confirm it fixes the bug for me
[14:17] <Sweetshark> should I assume, neon 0.29.6-2 to be synced to precise still? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/neon27
[14:17] <Sweetshark> because I assume that would break libreoffice http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=667043
[14:17] <ubot2> Debian bug 667043 in libneon27-gnutls "libneon27-gnutls: Breaks bzr-svn (via subvertpy): undefined symbol ne_ssl_context_get_flag" [Serious,Open]
[14:17] <ricotz> Sweetshark, pong
[14:19] <Sweetshark> ricotz: sooo, just wanted to ponder if you would join the Hackfest in Hmaburg, AFAIK there is still some travel budget available ...
[14:22] <ricotz> Sweetshark, hi, this sounds really nice, but i think i cant :\ -- i am getting busier lately
[14:27] <desrt> hamburg hackfest?  sounds delicious!
[14:27] <Sweetshark> ricotz: oh, bummer.
[14:27] <ricotz> Sweetshark, yeah, sorry
[14:28] <Sweetshark> desrt: heh
[14:28] <Sweetshark> ricotz: np, just would have been nice ;)
[14:31] <seb128> Sweetshark, libreoffice uploaded, the debdiff seemed fine to me (but doh, slow to download lo and debdiff versions :p)
[14:34] <Sweetshark> seb128: well, you are in training now, and 3.5.2 final will be out tommorrow if no natural desaster strikes our mirrors, so guess what I will ask of you tommorrow ;)
[14:34] <seb128> ;-)
[14:36] <seb128> desrt, your fix works for me confirmed
[14:39] <desrt> seb128: i gotta say... thanks for managing my interaction with launchpad :)
[14:39] <seb128> desrt, lol, yw ;-)
[15:07] <seb128> mterry, hey
[15:08] <mterry> seb128, hello!
[15:08] <seb128> mterry, good work on the unity-greeter 3 confirmations that the bug is fixed on the bug and another one who had the greeter segfaulting in loop confirmed the update bring it back to a working state
[15:08] <mterry> seb128, yar glad to see, especially as reporters on that bug were starting to suggest outlandish fix scenarios  :)
[15:09] <seb128> ;-)
[15:29]  * chrisccoulson legs feel like jelly
[15:31] <seb128> chrisccoulson, doing exercice?
[15:31] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, finished now though
[15:31] <seb128> chrisccoulson, what do you do? running?
[15:31] <chrisccoulson> seb128, biking. i think my knees would break if i ran
[15:47] <mterry> kenvandine, that gwibber merge this morning... is that a bug in vala?
[15:48] <kenvandine> i think it is a gee bug
[15:48] <kenvandine> which i am working around
[15:48] <kenvandine> i want to debug that a bit more
[15:49] <kenvandine> could be a vala bug, but looking at the generated C i think it is right
[15:49] <didrocks> jbicha_: please think about unreffing the gsettings settings object when adding one :)
[15:49] <kenvandine> mterry, i also want to look at gee 0.7.2 and see if it is affected
[15:49] <kenvandine> might be fixed already
[15:53] <mterry> kenvandine, well, change seems harmless, assuming it fixes the issue.  Might warrant a comment in code, because otherwise that coding pattern is odd and liable to be removed accidentally in future.
[15:54] <kenvandine> mterry, ok, i'll add a comment along with the bug i file against libgee
[15:54] <kenvandine> i plan to do that today
[15:54] <kenvandine> this was a bandaid :)
[15:54] <mterry> kenvandine, sure.  marked the merge approved
[15:54] <kenvandine> it does seem to work around it
[15:54] <kenvandine> it never tries to use the iterator if it is empty
[15:55] <mterry> kenvandine, I've never used libgee.  How do you find it?
[15:55] <chrisccoulson> right, time to make apport attach crash ID's to firefox bugs now
[15:55] <chrisccoulson> i'm fed up with asking people for them :)
[15:55] <mterry> chrisccoulson, heh
[15:55] <kenvandine> mterry, what do you mean? find libgee?
[15:55] <mterry> kenvandine, how do you like it?
[15:56] <kenvandine> love it
[15:56] <kenvandine> much better than the built in support for lists and stuff
[15:56] <mterry> I was always wary of adding another random library depends.  But maybe if it's awesome...
[15:56] <kenvandine> it is a must imo
[15:56] <kenvandine> and we already have stuff using it
[15:57] <kenvandine> unity used to, when it was vala
[15:57] <kenvandine> libunity does
[15:57] <mterry> kenvandine, sure, in Ubuntu it's not a random library dep.  But as an upstream it is a bit.  I wonder if any GNOME apps use it
[15:58] <kenvandine> ah, true
[15:58] <kenvandine> well fedora and opensuse never complained about it as a dep for gwibber
[15:58]  * mterry waits for glib to get containers
[15:59]  * mterry goes afk for a bit
[16:16] <chrisccoulson> hmmmm, https://crash-stats.mozilla.com/report/index/33a6191e-99ab-4acc-a889-0660c2120404 :(
[16:16] <chrisccoulson> i hope that's the same issue i fixed yesterday
[16:25] <cnd> seb128, I need to debug something in nautilus, so I started checking out lp:ubuntu/nautilus
[16:26] <cnd> it says the branch is out of date
[16:26] <cnd> I don't know if that's something you have control over
[16:26] <cnd> I realize now that debcheckout is what I really want to use, so it grabs the desktop team's repo
[16:26] <cnd> but I thought you would be interested to know about lp:ubuntu/nautilus
[16:28] <seb128> cnd, thanks, you can open a bug against "udd" if you want on launchpad, those keep happening which is one of the reasons we don't use lp:ubuntu for desktop packaging
[16:28] <cnd> ok
[16:29] <seb128> cnd, I'm sure there are several other ones, I'm not interested enough to chase them down to have them break again next week though
[16:29] <cnd> ok
[16:29] <seb128> cnd, what issue do you work on? (just curious)
[16:29] <cnd> seb128, when I use a touchscreen and touch on the desktop, nautilus is grabbing the core pointer and not ungrabbing
[16:29] <cnd> which locks up the desktop
[16:30] <seb128> cnd, ok
[16:47] <micahg> Sweetshark: the problem is versioned conflicts makes dpkg work harded and as libreoffice is a core package, that might complicate upgrades, if it all works, great, but it's something to keep in mind
[16:47] <micahg> s/harded/harder/
[17:00]  * didrocks waves good evening
[17:08] <cnd> desrt, if I wanted to log messages from somewhere within nautilus, how should I do it?
[17:08] <cnd> I tried adding g_critical()s
[17:08] <cnd> and hoping stuff would appear in ~/.xsession-errors
[17:11] <cnd> nm, I'll ask in #gtk
[17:20] <Sweetshark> micahg: well, the conflicts are only against outdated oneiric packages for which a newer version is known to exist in precise (from the same source package that is), so it is pretty safe. and yeah, I did full dist-upgrade test runs with the new upload in a ppa.
[17:20] <micahg> Sweetshark: release upgrades are usually the most difficult
[17:27] <Laney> Sweetshark: Wasn't the Conflicts added to (attempt to) make sync_extensions work? If so, I don't understand why those calls were removed from the preinst.
[17:28] <micahg> Sweetshark: dist-upgrade isn't a release upgrade
[17:28]  * Laney braves the downpour
[19:01] <chrisccoulson> seb128, so, i need a "Keywords" field in the desktop file, right?
[19:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, oh yes you do ;-)
[19:02] <chrisccoulson> seb128, and before precise, it used to be "X-GNOME-Keywords"?
[19:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I wouldn't bother before precise, it was added as X-GNOME-Keywords in oneiric and nothing used it (unity supported it though)
[19:03] <seb128> chrisccoulson, http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/desktop-entry-spec-1.1.html if you need a reference
[19:03] <seb128> Keywords "A list of strings which may be used in addition to other metadata to describe this entry. This can be useful e.g. to facilitate searching through entries. The values are not meant for display, and should not be redundant with the values of Name or GenericName. "
[19:04] <chrisccoulson> thanks
[19:04] <seb128> chrisccoulson, while you are at it, can you update the unity list stuff to be spec compliant?
[19:06] <chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, whats wrong with it?
[19:07] <seb128> chrisccoulson, spec is http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/ar01s08.html it got approved this cycle as official as well
[19:07] <seb128> chrisccoulson,
[19:07] <seb128> X-Ayatana-Desktop-Shortcuts=Compose;Contacts
[19:07] <seb128> [Compose Shortcut Group]
[19:07] <seb128> Name=Compose New Message
[19:07] <seb128> TargetEnvironment=Messaging Menu;Unity
[19:07] <seb128> Actions=Compose;
[19:07] <seb128> [Desktop Action Compose]
[19:07] <seb128> Name=Compose New Message
[19:07] <seb128> OnlyShowIn=Unity;
[19:07] <seb128> ups
[19:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/915015/
[19:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, basically
[19:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the pastebin is easier to read ;-)
[19:08] <chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, thanks
[19:09] <seb128> chrisccoulson, thank you for fixing those ;-)
[19:26] <seb128> kenvandine, hey
[19:28] <kenvandine> hey seb128
[19:29] <seb128> kenvandine, ocrete was mentioning that our pidgin farsight,farstream patch might need to be updated
[19:29] <seb128> kenvandine, can you look at it?
[19:29] <kenvandine> just talked to him :)
[19:29] <seb128> kenvandine, yeah, he went for the query it seems and I was waiting on a channel discussion ;-)
[19:29] <seb128> kenvandine, you are on it then, all good
[19:29] <seb128> kenvandine, ocrete: thanks
[19:30] <kenvandine> i don't like touching pidgin :)
[19:31] <seb128> kenvandine, you touch it you maintain it!
[19:32] <kenvandine> i gotta stop touching packages :)
[19:32] <seb128> kenvandine, no no, we like it this way ;-)
[19:33] <kenvandine> mterry, that gwibber merge you reviewed turns out doesn't really work around the problem and it has been fixed in the 0.7 series
[19:33] <kenvandine> i need yet another work around :)
[19:33] <mterry> kenvandine, :)
[19:33] <kenvandine> i don't want to backport that fix to 0.6.x
[19:33] <mterry> kenvandine, ok
[19:34] <cnd> I can't remember who it is that develops lightdm
[19:34] <cnd> can someone remind me?
[19:35] <kenvandine> cnd, robert_ancell
[19:35] <cnd> kenvandine, ahh, thanks
[19:35] <kenvandine> and probably the one with the most knowledge about it that is actually awake right now is mterry
[19:35] <kenvandine> mterry, i assume you have touched lightdm in your unity-greeter adventures :)
[19:35] <seb128> cnd, robert_ancell is .au based, should be only in a couple of hours
[19:36] <seb128> kenvandine, you should make you fix a lightdm bug, I got told you are getting short of sources to maintain :p
[19:36] <mterry> kenvandine, sure
[19:36] <seb128> we should*
[19:36]  * mterry agrees with seb128
[19:36]  * kenvandine hides
[19:36] <mterry> cnd, did you have a question? I might be able to help
[19:37] <cnd> mterry, we think we see some memory corruption in the X server
[19:37] <mterry> :(
[19:37] <cnd> it would be handy if we could start lightdm with a pre-started X server running under valgrind
[19:37] <cnd> or something like that
[19:38] <mterry> k, let me see how that might be done
[19:38]  * mterry looks at code
[19:38] <seb128> cnd, can't you just rename X to X.real and create a shell wrapper X calling valgrind X.real?
[19:38] <seb128> cnd, that's what I do usually for system services
[19:38] <cnd> seb128, hmm... yeah, that might work
[19:38] <cnd> I'll give it a go
[19:41] <mterry> cnd, you should also be able to set the seat property xserver-command in lightdm.conf
[19:41] <cnd> mterry, ahh, that sounds like exactly what I want to do
[19:48] <chrisccoulson> seb128, updating the desktop file for the fd.o spec whilst ensuring that it still works on older releases is a pain ;)
[19:49] <seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, right, you always have that fun job with firefox
[19:50] <chrisccoulson> i managed it though :)
[19:50] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well you made me read the automake documentation to fix your totem bug so it's just fair :p
[19:50] <chrisccoulson> heh
[19:53] <chrisccoulson> do i need to add "e-mail" as a keyword, in addition to "email", or is unity clever about that?
[19:53] <chrisccoulson> seeing as mdeslaur would search for the former, just to be awkward ;)
[19:53] <seb128> chrisccoulson, unity is not clever
[19:53] <seb128> well for that
[19:54] <chrisccoulson> :(
[19:54] <seb128> the hud is, but the dash isn't
[19:54] <mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: also add "interwebs" and "googles"
[19:54] <seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, and add "free porn" to firefox.desktop
[19:54] <mdeslaur> hehe
[19:54] <chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, i was thinking of adding "google" to firefox actually
[19:54] <chrisccoulson> do you think i should?
[19:54] <mdeslaur> hahaha
[19:54] <seb128> chrisccoulson, would google be unhappy about that?
[19:55] <chrisccoulson> i'm not sure. i can't see why not
[19:55] <chrisccoulson> i like the "free porn" idea though
[19:55] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it's like "should we add "word" to libreoffice writer"
[19:55] <seb128> but not quite :p
[19:55] <seb128> because I think microsoft might not like this one
[19:55] <chrisccoulson> i'll add "Chrome" to the firefox one
[19:55] <seb128> well word is a word, "excel" is an interesting one
[19:55] <chrisccoulson> :-)
[19:55] <mdeslaur> meh, just add "word processor, word, processor" :)
[19:55] <seb128> hehe
[19:56] <mdeslaur> "libreoffice, is made to, excel"
[19:56] <seb128> ;-)
[20:07] <jbicha> mdeslaur: the Dash, Software Center, etc. should be smart enough to show you word and/or processor without Keywords needing to comma separate the terms
[20:08] <mdeslaur> jbicha: oh, hehe, that was just a tongue-in-cheek example...I'm not aware of how that works
[20:09] <mdeslaur> jbicha: so just having word processor in the description would be enough for "word" to come up?
[20:09] <jbicha> I think translators should definitely keep some English words in there too, for instance typing Help into the Dash in localized Ubuntu installs should show yelp but probably doesn't
[20:09] <jbicha> mdeslaur: I don't deal with Unity more than I have to, but I think it does :)
[20:11] <mdeslaur> cool
[23:29] <aquarius> If I have an app which would like to schedule a task to run regularly, as a user, how should my app set that up? Editing the user's crontab programmatically seems a bit clunky, but running a daemon all the time to schedule the tasks itself seems like overkill
[23:49] <micahg> aquarius: /etc/cron.* entries?
[23:50] <aquarius> micahg, that's running as root, not as the user, which means my app would need to be suid root to do it :(
[23:51] <micahg> aquarius: ah, is it just one non-root user or any real user on the system could use it?
[23:51] <aquarius> micahg, any user on the system might run the app, and that app should then run something regularly for that user


[05:18] <pitti> Good morning
[06:05] <didrocks> good morning
[06:36] <larsu> bonjour!
[06:38] <didrocks> hey larsu
[06:38] <larsu> hi didrocks! How are you?
[06:38] <didrocks> I'm good, thanks, yourself?
[06:38]  * larsu searches for that gsettings session seb128 wanted to schedule
[06:39] <larsu> didrocks: great :)
[06:39]  * larsu has tea
[07:14] <willcooke> morning
[07:15] <didrocks> hey willcooke! optical experiments over?
[07:15] <willcooke> he!
[07:15] <willcooke> yeah
[07:16] <willcooke> Took me all day Sunday to recover
[07:16] <didrocks> :)
[07:16] <larsu> morning willcooke
[07:17] <willcooke> Argh
[07:17] <willcooke> Just realised
[07:17] <willcooke> UOS means I'll be here until 9 tonight
[07:17] <willcooke> hmm
[07:18] <willcooke> I might carry on now and take Friday off
[07:18] <willcooke> Do you guys want to do the weekly meeting today?  I will /probably/ be in sessions
[07:18] <willcooke> seb128,  ^
[07:26] <didrocks> first kernel uploaded to wily, time to push the track! :)
[07:26] <didrocks> crack*
[07:29]  * larsu waits for Laney to do that :D
[07:41] <seb128> hey willcooke
[07:42] <seb128> willcooke, I'm probably going to be in sessions as well
[07:42] <seb128> so unsure
[07:42] <seb128> I guess most of the team is not going to be, so if we find somebody who wants to lead we can probably have the meeting
[07:43] <larsu> seb128: we could have a quick one? Without pasting notes, just "is there anything of importance to talk ab
[07:43] <larsu> out"
[07:43]  * larsu wonders if that would be helpful though
[07:44] <seb128> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1505/2015-05-05/
[07:44] <seb128> there is a snappy desktop session at the meeting time
[07:44] <larsu> so that's our meeting!
[07:44] <seb128> willcooke, what about doing the meeting at 2utc with those who are here/get the change?
[07:45] <seb128> or do we want to listen to the plenary?
[07:45] <seb128> we can probably do 2:30pm and keep it to half an hour
[07:48] <willcooke> oki, let's do 1430 UTC and keep it short...
[07:49] <willcooke> I'll email
[07:49] <seb128> thanks
[08:03] <Laney> hullo
[08:04] <larsu> guten Tag Laney!
[08:04] <Laney> good day to you sir
[08:04] <didrocks> morning Laney
[08:05] <Laney> hello didrocks!
[08:05] <Laney> how are you all?
[08:05] <Laney> it's been four days of pain that we have been apart
[08:05] <larsu> painful
[08:08]  * Laney ws the w
[08:08] <Laney> NO, must patch pilot before looking at anything and getting distracted
[08:13] <seb128> hey Laney, wie gehts?
[08:16] <Laney> hey seb128, doing good thanks!
[08:16] <Laney> family at the weekend, climbing yesterday, all good fun
[08:16] <Laney> you?
[08:17] <seb128> nice w.e as well, bbq with friends, spa, relaxing, and played tennis after work yesterday
[08:17] <seb128> ready for UOS and w opening this week!
[08:37] <Laney> thanks willcooke!
[08:38] <willcooke> Laney, np
[08:38]  * Laney sends out the bat signal
[08:43] <davmor2> Laney: is now swamped in bats
[08:45]  * Laney hangs davmor2 upside down from the church rafters
[08:45] <Laney> one of ussss
[08:46] <davmor2> Laney: how do you know my back stretch routine?
[08:46]  * Laney has root
[09:11]  * Laney is going to merge the oldest sponsoring request
[09:11] <Laney> muhahaha
[09:15] <seb128> Laney, which one was that?
[09:16] <Laney> oneconf
[09:16] <Laney> 2013-12-10
[09:16] <seb128> nice
[09:17]  * didrocks hopes that Laney will test if it still works, I heared it didn't since the python3 switch
[09:17] <Laney> that's why it has taken me 45 minutes to review one thing :)
[09:17] <Laney> I got my laptop to show up!
[09:18] <didrocks> nice :p
[09:18] <Laney> does it communicate via the server?
[09:18] <Laney> no avahi or anything right
[09:18] <didrocks> yeah, it's using apps.ubuntu.com
[09:18]  * Laney nods
[09:25] <Laney> bzr push :parent #take that!
[10:15] <Laney> tjaalton: hiya, do you think you could maybe self verify bug #1447143? there's another fix in the queue that could probably go in after this one
[10:16] <tjaalton> Laney: oh right
[10:17] <tjaalton> yeah it needs skl hw so I'd better :)
[10:17] <tjaalton> the kernel bits are missing still though, but I'll verify with what I've built
[10:17] <Laney> whatever that is :P
[10:18] <tjaalton> skylake
[10:18] <Laney> ah
[10:19] <Laney> oh wait, I meant to poke you about the utopic sru
[10:19]  * Laney clicked the wrong link
[10:19] <tjaalton> this was fine too
[10:20] <Laney> bug #1444436
[10:20] <tjaalton> yep
[10:20] <Laney> please to fiddle the tags then :)
[12:35] <Sweet5hark> hmmm, someone said at the london sprint that clicking mail merge was a noop in libreoffice if libreoffice-base wasnt installed ... anyone remembering that? because I cant reproduce here ...
[12:35] <Laney> me
[12:36] <Laney> it's after you get to selecting the document containing the addresses (or whatever)
[12:36] <Laney> 3-4 stages into the wizard iirc
[12:38] <Laney> biab
[12:42] <Sweet5hark> Laney: ah, ok -- will recheck ..l
[13:33] <willcooke> hrm
[13:33] <willcooke> I think I might have got the time wrong for the meeting today
[13:33] <willcooke> we should do it now right?
[13:33] <willcooke> before the plenary?
[13:33] <willcooke> seb128, ^
[13:34] <seb128> willcooke, I was assuming that the time was correct and that we would do it during the second half of the plenary slot, not sure if the plenary is going to be a full hour and how useful it is
[13:34] <willcooke> oki, let's do it in 1 hr then
[13:35] <willcooke> I will be listening to the plenary I hink
[13:35] <willcooke> *think
[13:35] <willcooke> but I can do both :)
[13:38] <willcooke> seb128, http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1505/meeting/22513/convergence-1505-gsettings-confinement/
[13:38] <willcooke> it had to go in the community room because we are full in Convergence
[13:38] <willcooke> desrt, ^^
[13:39] <seb128> oh, it's today?!
[13:39] <willcooke> I can move it
[13:39] <willcooke> if you want
[13:39] <seb128> desrt, larsu ^
[13:40] <willcooke> I could ask to borrow "Cloud 2" tomorrow at 1400 UTC
[13:40] <willcooke> or 1900 UTC
[13:40] <willcooke> tomorrow
[13:40] <willcooke> or 1400 or 1500 Thursday
[13:40] <willcooke> other than that - we are full up
[13:40] <willcooke> we = UOS sessions in all
[14:00]  * Laney screams
[14:01]  * Laney had the plenary youtube video open in a background tab
[14:10] <larsu> seb128: I already have plans for tonight. Let me check if I can move them
[14:11] <seb128> larsu, don't worry, willcooke said he can move
[14:11] <seb128> larsu, like tomorrow 2pm utc or 7p,
[14:11] <willcooke> larsu, please let me know asap the other available slots are up there ^^
[14:11] <larsu> willcooke: I prefer tomorrow
[14:11] <seb128> thursday 2pm and 3pm seem free as well
[14:11] <larsu> (any time)
[14:12] <larsu> thursday works as well
[14:12]  * willcooke checks
[14:12] <larsu> thanks
[14:12]  * larsu thought it was going to be Thu night, but I guess everything always changes at uos
[14:13] <seb128> larsu, mhall119 said he would put it there but he didn't and the slot got claimed it seems
[14:13] <mhall119> seb128: the gsettings one?
[14:13] <seb128> mhall119, yes
[14:14] <mhall119> it's at 1900 today
[14:14] <seb128> mhall119, right, and that doesn't work for us
[14:14] <mhall119> I thought I scheduled it when you asked for it, maybe another lead moved it
[14:14] <mhall119> seb128: when would work for you?
[14:14] <seb128> mhall119, I though we said thursday 7pm
[14:14] <seb128> mhall119, willcooke is moving it to tomorrow or thursday
[14:14] <mhall119> yeah, that's when I originally scheduled it I thought
[14:14] <mhall119> ok
[14:15] <larsu> is that 7 utc or cet?
[14:15] <willcooke> mhall119, timezones on summit look a bit broken
[14:15] <willcooke> or maybe its just me
[14:16] <mhall119> willcooke: there aren't timezones, everything is UTC
[14:16] <seb128> larsu, utc
[14:16] <seb128> larsu, better to do 2 or 3 utc
[14:17] <larsu> seb128: yes
[14:17] <desrt> uh
[14:17] <mdeslaur> seb128, mhall119, willcooke: would be better tomorrow, I won't be able to attend on thurs
[14:17] <desrt> what?
[14:18] <seb128> desrt, would tomorrow 2pm utc work for you for the settings session?
[14:19] <desrt> 14 UTC = 10 for me
[14:19] <desrt> sure
[14:19] <desrt> as long as it doesn't get moved again :)
[14:19] <seb128> willcooke, ^ can we get that?
[14:19] <willcooke> seb128, that clashes with "U8 as default desktop" - but I think that's more the U8 guys than ius
[14:19] <willcooke> us
[14:20] <seb128> willcooke, I'm probably going to go to the U8 default desktop but I don't think I would be much useful to the gsettings one
[14:20] <willcooke> ok, mdeslaur seb128 desrt larsu mhall119  - scheduled for 1400 UTC tomorrow in the "Cloud 2"  room
[14:20] <seb128> as long as mdeslaur larsu and desrt can be at the settings one we are good
[14:20] <willcooke> cool
[14:20] <larsu> thanks!
[14:20] <mdeslaur> great, thanks
[14:20] <mhall119> thanks willcooke
[14:20] <desrt> thanks
[14:20] <desrt> and sorry for missing it today
[14:21] <willcooke> nw
[14:31] <seb128> willcooke, having the short meeting now?
[14:31]  * Sweet5hark sneaks in
[14:31]  * didrocks same
[14:32] <tkamppeter> hi
[14:34]  * Sweet5hark starts shuffling a deck of cards under the table and distributes a hand to didrocks and tkamppeter. like in the old days at school.
[14:34]  * didrocks takes his hp49 calculator and starts a game
[14:34] <willcooke> seb128, argh
[14:34] <willcooke> oki, let's do it
[14:34] <willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Meeting 2015-05-05
[14:34] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue May  5 14:34:58 2015 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[14:34] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[14:37] <willcooke> attente, desrt, didrocks, FJKong, happyaron, Laney, larsu, qengho, seb128, Sweet5hark, tkamppeter, Sweet5hark
[14:37] <qengho> yo
[14:37] <willcooke> anyone else I forgot ^^
[14:37] <willcooke> ok, gotta be quick...
[14:37] <willcooke> #topic attente
[14:37] <willcooke> GO!
[14:37] <attente> packaged input method framework switcher and uploaded to a ppa, but it won't be as useful for us now that the plan seems to be to replace maliit with fcitx and add osk support there instead
[14:37] <attente> fixed gdk mir build from master due to mir api break
[14:37] <attente> debugging the qt5 port of fcitx-qimpanel; problem lies somewhere between qt5 and libdbusmenu-qt
[14:38] <willcooke> attente, eof?
[14:38] <attente> right, yes :)
[14:38] <willcooke> :)
[14:38] <willcooke> thanks attente
[14:38] <willcooke> #topic desrt
[14:38] <desrt> got the reader-side of the gsettings proxy service working.  need to work on the writer side and getting the client packaged up as a proper gsettings backend.  need to figure out how to get a list of which keys an app is allowed to read/write -- have UDS session on that tomorrow
[14:39] <desrt> will continue work during this week
[14:39] <desrt> eof
[14:39] <willcooke> #topic didrocks
[14:39] <didrocks> short week (Friday was a bank holiday)
[14:39] <didrocks> ubuntu make:
[14:39] <didrocks>  - release ubuntu make 0.7 with visual studio code support
[14:39] <didrocks>  - enable removing deprecated frameworks without letting user to reinstall them or listing them once removed (dedicated to popey)
[14:39] <didrocks>  - add non interactive installation mode
[14:39] <didrocks>  - add more tests for the new use case. However, the i386 VM is broken in the CI system since yesterday. CI Team is looking at it now.
[14:39] <didrocks>  - bugs triaging
[14:39] <didrocks> eof
[14:39] <willcooke> #topic FJKong
[14:39] <willcooke> timeout in 1m
[14:39] <popey> \o/
[14:39] <desrt> tsk tsk tsk
[14:40] <willcooke> #topic happyaron
[14:40] <willcooke> timeout in 1m
[14:40] <happyaron> hey
[14:41] <happyaron> I've just back from holidays, and reading emails & backlogs
[14:41] <willcooke> thx happyaron
[14:41] <happyaron> wonders if we can switch fcitx to default early in this cycle?
[14:41] <desrt> happyaron: we need to talk.....
[14:41] <seb128> default for what langages?
[14:41] <willcooke> lets pick that up after the meeting
[14:41] <happyaron>  /eol
[14:41] <willcooke> #topic laney
[14:41] <happyaron> seb128: for all languages
[14:42]  * happyaron let's talk about it after meeting
[14:42] <seb128> happyaron, did we decide to do that? but yeah, out of meeting topic
[14:42] <FJKong> willcooke: my turn?
[14:42] <willcooke> FJKong, laney is up, let's give him a moment and then we'll come bacl
[14:42] <willcooke> back
[14:42] <Laney> aah
[14:43]  * desrt watches Laney strugle with gucharmap
[14:43] <Laney> actually http://unicode-table.com/en/sets/social-symbols/
[14:43] <Laney> PHEW
[14:43] <Laney> HERE GOES:
[14:43] <Laney> • short week due to May bank holiday
[14:43] <Laney> • Worked some more on preparing gtk, o-s & some others for W opening, sitting in ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ww ~ready to go
[14:43] <Laney> • Filed some initial bugs tag 'gtk316' and assigned them, still some more to go
[14:43] <Laney> • Patch piloted (uploaded the longest standing item in the queue, woo)
[14:43] <Laney> • SRUs
[14:43] <Laney> ∘ gtk: column resizing (T & U), 3.14.13 (V)
[14:43] <Laney> ∘ gnome-session: Start compiz from upstart, fixes unity --replace
[14:43] <Laney> ∘ empathy/account-plugins: Kill off FB and MSN messengers, no longer supported by their providers
[14:43] <Laney> ∘ totem: Don't play videos twice if you start them from the commandline
[14:43] <Laney> ♞
[14:44] <willcooke> #topic FJKong
[14:44] <FJKong> not much to update due to the Holiday of Labors Day
[14:44] <FJKong> finish Dash pinyin search and preview in Unity.
[14:44] <FJKong> need more test and work on it
[14:44] <FJKong> that's all
[14:44] <willcooke> #topic larsu
[14:44] <larsu> - short week due to May 1
[14:44] <larsu> - reviewed and tested an indicator-messages MR and found a bug in the process
[14:44] <larsu> - libsoup bug
[14:45] <larsu> - investigated treeview column resizing problem for 14.04, backported patches and filed SRU
[14:45] <larsu> - some bug triage (also upstream)
[14:45] <larsu> - started testing gtk 3.16

[14:45] <willcooke> #topic qengho
[14:45] <qengho> Sorry! Not ready.
[14:46] <qengho> Dazzled by the video.
[14:46] <willcooke> will come back
[14:46] <willcooke> #topic seb128
[14:46] <seb128> * 4 days week, friday was 1st of may
[14:46] <seb128> * some preparation for UOS
[14:46] <seb128> * worked on w-blueprints
[14:46] <seb128> * quite some bugs triage/review of e.u.c top issues after vivid
[14:46] <seb128> * looked at SRUing some bugfixes
[14:46] <seb128> * u-s-s reviews

[14:46] <willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> - day off due to may day holiday (which is needed in Hamburg and Berlin to defend your home in the riots)
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> - prepared a 4.4.3~rc2 build for vivid/ppa
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> - tried updating breeze from bug 1448508 SRU -> unfortunately the breeze snapshot seems to be broken
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> - looked into the top crasher on errors.ubuntu.com
[14:46] <Sweet5hark>   - identified offending commit
[14:46] <Sweet5hark>   - lifecycle issue on shutdown
[14:46] <Sweet5hark>   - unfortunately the commit causing the regression also fixed a lifecycle issue crash (simplified version)
[14:46] <Sweet5hark>   - not quite sure yet if this can be reverted without making things worse
[14:46] <Sweet5hark>   -> ongoing
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> - caught up with missed out upstream mail and developments after sprint
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> - some more work on another lifecycle issue upstream
[14:46] <Sweet5hark>   - ended up in a maze of corridors all looking the same
[14:46] <Sweet5hark>   -> punted
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> - looked into Laneys 'mail merge is trolling me, when libreoffice-base is not installed' issue
[14:46] <Sweet5hark> eh, got throttled ...
[14:47] <desrt> last: 10:46 < Sweet5hark> - looked into Laneys 'mail merge is trolling me, when libreoffice-base is not installed' issue
[14:47] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, eof?
[14:47] <Sweet5hark>   - can reproduce now, should be reasonably easy to fix
[14:47] <Sweet5hark>   -> ongoing
[14:47] <Sweet5hark> EOF
[14:47] <willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
[14:48] <willcooke> 1m timeout
[14:49] <Laney> Sweet5hark: I should tell you about my other issues :)
[14:49] <Sweet5hark> Laney: not your personal army
[14:49] <Laney> the worst one was that all lists lost their formatting so I had to manually type them
[14:49]  * Laney giggles and runs off
[14:49] <willcooke> #topic qengho
[14:49] <qengho> * Done: tested Cr 42.0.2311.135, including a new Flash update test and warning.
[14:49] <qengho> * To-do: Re-sync Ozone/Mir patches after v42 breakage. Start hacking mir in again.
[14:49] <qengho> EOF
[14:50] <qengho> Will get v42 Cr in today, including wily
[14:50] <willcooke> #endmeeting
[14:50] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue May  5 14:50:24 2015 UTC.
[14:50] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-05-05-14.34.moin.txt
[14:50] <willcooke> thanks all
[14:50] <willcooke> maybe next week we'll be back to normal
[14:50] <desrt> happyaron: so about fcitx...
[14:50] <happyaron> desrt: huh?
[14:50] <desrt> i think there is some bad communication here
[14:50] <seb128> thanks
[14:51] <Laney> thanks!
[14:51] <desrt> last i heard is that we won't even have sogou at all
[14:51] <seb128> desrt, speaking about phone or desktop?
[14:51] <desrt> both
[14:51] <happyaron> desrt: I meant desktop...
[14:51] <Sweet5hark> thanks
[14:52] <seb128> desrt, we have sogou for desktop afaik
[14:52] <seb128> going to be in the partner or restricted archive
[14:52] <happyaron> that's what Fanjun and I did for the last year, desktop version of Sogou
[14:52] <desrt> on account of maliit not being an issue on desktop....
[14:53] <desrt> even still -- what is the advantage of using fcitx for all languages always?
[14:55] <happyaron> desrt: well, personally I don't see the necessary of maintaining two stacks of input method
[14:55] <desrt> except that some users clearly prefer ibus
[14:56] <desrt> (we could apply the same argument otherwise to "let's just use ibus for all languages")
[14:56] <happyaron> fcitx is architecturely more advanced
[14:56] <desrt> also: attente just finished the switching code and it's working quite well now
[14:57] <happyaron> that's why Sogou has chosen fcitx
[14:57] <attente> my main concern is who's going to end up doing the osk work for fcitx
[14:57] <happyaron> we shouldn't stick on 2000s user experience since it's one and a half decade already, right?
[14:58]  * happyaron I'm purely talking about desktop, not phone, so not relevant to osk atm
[14:58] <didrocks> well, it clearly is
[14:58] <desrt> happyaron: well, then we still need to maintain two stacks anyway, then...
[14:58] <happyaron> if we whant to have Sogou, we must do the OSK work
[14:58] <didrocks> we are aiming for convergence, remember?
[14:58] <desrt> happyaron: i don't think maliit is going anywhere....
[14:58] <happyaron> * want
[14:58] <desrt> (i mean... i don't think it's going away)
[14:59] <happyaron> desrt: then let's wait for sogou plan
[14:59] <happyaron> in real world commercial cooperations, if we don't have Sogou on phone, we can hardly to work with Tencent.
[15:00] <happyaron> this means our phone can't probably sale in China
[15:00] <happyaron> but that's up to phone poeple to decide, and to work it out
[15:00]  * happyaron sell
[15:01] <didrocks> there is no "phone people", and this cycle, some people will work to have one image for phone and desktop, so we all have to work it out this cycle
[15:01] <happyaron> I mean the business guys
[15:02] <didrocks> let's just focus on the technical part, our part
[15:02] <happyaron> I tend to switch to fcitx on desktop, and keep maliit on phone for the moment, and wait business guys to sort out the mess of cooperations
[15:03] <happyaron> this means we'll support up to 2 frameworks (fcitx, maliit), not 3 (+ ibus)
[15:03] <happyaron> what do you think?
[15:03] <didrocks> happyaron: what are you going to do for the common image then?
[15:04] <happyaron> didrocks: have both of the two, we can't use maliit on desktop anyway
[15:04] <didrocks> and so, when we have the ubuntu phone booted, plugged to a screen + keyboard, what happens?
[15:05] <happyaron> if the coming result is "desktop mode" like a full featured desktop, fcitx should run
[15:05] <didrocks> but the session was already running
[15:05] <attente> we can probably use the input method switcher for that, at least for now
[15:05] <didrocks> with maliit I follow you
[15:06] <happyaron> attente did the online switching stuff
[15:06] <didrocks> so we need to install both
[15:06] <happyaron> yes
[15:06] <didrocks> and it will still be good to have some real user feedback for non chinese input method usage
[15:07] <happyaron> mobile input methods doesn't work that well on desktop, actually, people use different engines on mobile /desktop, a less powerful one for mobile to save battery.
[15:08] <attente> isn't that an argument against using fcitx for osk?
[15:08] <happyaron> didrocks: what language do you mean then, Japanese or non-engine users?
[15:08] <happyaron> attente: not it isn't
[15:08] <happyaron> fcitx/maliit are just framework, treat it like system API/service
[15:08] <happyaron> OSK is a standalone part
[15:08] <happyaron> neither of these parts have the power thing to worry
[15:09] <happyaron> but the computing library needs to be dealt with
[15:09] <didrocks> happyaron: Japanese, Thai…
[15:09] <attente> ok, it just seemed like we're taking fcitx which is a desktop one and using it for mobile
[15:10] <didrocks> arabic…
[15:10] <happyaron> the only mobile-targeted pinyin engine in our archive is libgooglepinyin
[15:10] <happyaron> using libpinyin will, waste power, and destroy SD cards
[15:10] <cyphermox> hey all, it would be nice if someone from the desktop team wanted to join my installer session at 18:00 UTC; since eventually there might be a need to mix Snappy convergence on desktop with the installer.
[15:10] <happyaron> didrocks: I can find real user for Japanese to comment, at least
[15:11] <cyphermox> (just thinking aloud right now, of course)
[15:14] <happyaron> attente: the advantage of using maliit, is that it has a OSK implementation that adresses some of the needs
[15:15] <happyaron> but please treat the stuff as two parts, Part 1 is a framework, which is fcitx's role, Part 2 is the OSK, which is what all the benefits it have
[15:16] <happyaron> we need a good framework, because OSKs and engines should be done by 3rd party, we just need a ok-to-go OSK/panel on mobile/desktop as os vendor.
[15:16] <happyaron> guess this time I've made myself a bit clearer?
[15:22] <attente> happyaron: yes, that makes sense
[15:24] <cyphermox> Laney: willcooke: could you's be there later for the installer session?
[15:24] <cyphermox> seb128 suggested I ping ;)
[15:28] <ricotz> Sweet5hark, hi, I am going to copy the 4.4.3~rc2 builds when they are ready, ~vivid1  runs fine here afaics -- to avoid waiting for the breeze-update
[15:29] <Sweet5hark> ricotz: hmm, k. do you copy the vivid1 to vivid too?
[15:29] <Laney> cyphermox: I could maybe make the first half, but I'm not sure I'll be helpful
[15:29] <Laney> what did you want to talk about?
[15:29] <Sweet5hark> ricotz: because, as it turns out the breeze icons in vivid2 are b0rked ...
[15:29] <ricotz> Sweet5hark, yes, all these https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+packages?field.name_filter=libreoffice&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=
[15:29] <cyphermox> installer in general, but since there's discussion right now about snappy desktop convergence magic
[15:30] <cyphermox> Laney: I'm thinking somehow we'll need to install snappy on metal :)
[15:30] <ricotz> Sweet5hark, yeah, I noticed that is why I mentioned to copy them ;)
[15:30] <Sweet5hark> ricotz: great, sure go ahead! ;)
[15:30] <ricotz> Sweet5hark, when trusty/amd64 is finished ;)
[15:31] <Sweet5hark> ricotz: kk
[15:32] <ricotz> Sweet5hark, as a note, please push 4.4.x updates to wily as long there is no 5.x package
[15:35] <Laney> cyphermox: I'm pretty far from understanding what's wanted there
[15:35] <cyphermox> ok
[15:35] <Laney> Unless the outcome is going to be "what do we need to know?"
[15:36] <Laney> In which case maybe I could be mildly helpful
[15:36]  * Laney engages in expectations management
[15:37] <Laney> cyphermox: I'll hang around on IRC and jump on the hangout if you need me
[15:37] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[15:37] <cyphermox> cool.
[15:37] <cyphermox> I don't know what I need to know for snappy installs.
[15:38] <Laney> then maybe "who do we need to talk to and about what?" would be an okay outcome
[15:54] <willcooke> cyphermox, Laney - I can try and be in the session, but track lead duties are all consuming
[15:54] <willcooke> cyphermox, I guess it boils down to:  We can live without a live session for now, but at least a CLI "installer" would be needed
[15:58] <Laney> like: plug in USB stick, have some way of installing?
[16:02] <cyphermox> Laney: kind of. :)
[17:24] <willcooke> cyphermox, I have to host the convergence track HO, so I can't be in another one
[17:24] <willcooke> cyphermox, what sort of thing do you need?
[17:25] <cyphermox> willcooke: I think I have everything I need. I got the high-level summary from slangasek earlier
[17:25] <cyphermox> so I guess I will mention it, but not spend much time on that aspect given that it seems more like a JDFI thing than anything else
[17:26] <cyphermox> rearrange these letters how it makes sense :)
[17:38] <willcooke> thx cyphermox
[17:38] <willcooke> ping me if you need anything, I'll be around, but hosting a session
[17:38] <cyphermox> ack. I'm not worried, I just wanted to make sure things didn't become surprises
[17:45] <willcooke> :)
[17:51] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, new under water vacuum cleaner eh? ;)
[17:52] <Sweet5hark> willcooke: should have bought a scooba instead of a roomba in the first place.
[17:52] <willcooke> LOL
[17:52] <Sweet5hark> willcooke: although I shouldnt complain. the roomba really is an awesome device.
[17:52] <willcooke> sooo tempted to get one
[17:53] <willcooke> but $$$$$$$
[17:53] <willcooke> oh
[17:53] <willcooke> amazon says < 300 GBP
[17:53] <willcooke> which is about 1/10th what I thought they cost
[18:03] <attente> sil2100: hi, in appmenu-qt5, is there a reason createPlatformMenu() returns 0 for both the GnomeAppMenuPlatformTheme and KdeAppMenuPlatformTheme?
[18:05] <sil2100> attente: in a meeting right now, would have to think about that for a moment to remember the reasons for that
[18:06] <sil2100> attente: if you could remind me of that through e-mail I would probably be able to answer tomorrow, since it's anyway way past my normal OED
[18:06] <sil2100> *EOD
[18:10] <attente> sil2100: sure, thanks
[18:11] <Sweet5hark> willcooke: get one. they are awesome. ... as long as they dont eat all your cables.
[18:12] <mitya57> attente: that is to avoid the endless loop in QMenu constructor
[18:13] <mitya57> QMenu constructs a QPlatformMenu internally (via createPlatformMenu()), which constructs a QMenu again, ...
[18:14] <attente> mitya57: is there a way to avoid it and still provide a QPlatformMenu?
[18:15] <attente> because returning 0 seems to be problematic for creating submenus in QSystemTrayIcon
[18:16] <mitya57> attente: http://code.qt.io/cgit/qt/qtbase.git/commit/?id=03dc2b2e82750d1c531cf00a406368cde4a8928b
[18:17] <mitya57> That will be in Qt 5.4.2
[18:17] <attente> mitya57: oh! thanks!
[18:18] <mitya57> You are welcome! We can also SRU it to Vivid if you want.
[18:21] <attente> mitya57: does this require changes to appmenu-qt5 as well?
[18:21] <mitya57> No
[18:26] <attente> mitya57: so the indicator in vivid doesn't require the SRU because it moved its submenus into the top-level menu, and i'm unaware of others that might need it
[18:26] <attente> so i guess we don't need to SRU to vivid
[18:26] <attente> (this is fcitx-qimpanel/fcitx-ui-qimpanel)
[18:29] <mitya57> Ok
[18:31] <seb128> would that fix bug #1435348?
[18:32] <mitya57> seb128: no, my fix is only for tray icons
[18:33] <seb128> k


[00:22] <joe-chat> Hi is anyone out there?
[00:22] <joe-chat> I am new to Ubuntu and am looking for installation help.  I don't know if this is the correct chat room.
[20:25] <newz2000> mdke: around? re: search on help.ubuntu.com
[20:26] <newz2000> I wonder if we could just re-use the search engine on search.ubuntu.com. I set up a filter so that a person can limit their search results to just documentation.
[20:26] <newz2000> Hi thorwil
[20:27] <thorwil> hi newz2000
[20:27] <newz2000> I have some feedback for you
[20:27] <newz2000> do you have a min?
[20:27] <thorwil> i'll brb, then i will
[20:28] <newz2000> ok
[20:32] <thorwil> newz2000: back
[20:33] <newz2000> hey thorwil
[20:33] <newz2000> funny story for you...
[20:33] <newz2000> so you know how sometimes you give a person two pieces of art to consider and you're sure they're going to pick A because its' the obvious choice but instead they pick B?
[20:34] <newz2000> Well, regarding the countdown banner we want the one with the coloured logo. :-)
[20:34] <thorwil> some designers use tricks like less nice backgrounds to make things like that less likely :)
[20:34] <newz2000> sorry
[20:34] <newz2000> They're asking for the logo text to be white
[20:35] <thorwil> who's they?
[20:35] <newz2000> I've not seen the artwork in question but I guess this is going to make it very harmonious with the cd covers
[20:35] <newz2000> sorry, I went to Julian, design lead, and Kat, corporate identity
[20:35] <newz2000> They have to sign off on anything that is deemed "official"
[20:36] <newz2000> They both liked your work
[20:36] <thorwil> i ask because i wondered if it could be escalated
[20:36] <newz2000> There's no one higher that you'd want to talk to. :-)
[20:38] <thorwil> newz2000: colored logo and white logo text is so awful i have to consider to withdraw my work
[20:39] <newz2000> oh, please don't
[20:39] <newz2000> I know it's a compromise but it really is great and it's well liked
[20:40] <thorwil> it leads to a disconnection. i would have a problem putting it into my portfolio like that
[20:40] <knome> i agree with thorwil
[20:40] <knome> white text on that banner wouldn't look good.
[20:40] <newz2000> thorwil: have you met Julian yet?
[20:40] <knome> it might work with the cd covers, but not a web banner.
[20:40] <thorwil> newz2000: we said hi in the artwork channel, that's all
[20:41] <thorwil> newz2000: guess i have to see if i can catch him tomorrow
[20:41] <thorwil> newz2000: he's in london these days, right?
[20:41] <newz2000> yes
[20:41] <newz2000> he idles here often but recently left for the day
[20:42] <thorwil> i really don't want to be a diva, but my test in front of me causes almost physical pain
[20:43] <thorwil> newz2000: the only other way i see would be to make the numbers and text in the 3d graphics also white/close-to
[20:44] <newz2000> thorwil: I also have some feedback on the stuff for the animated banner
[20:44] <thorwil> good
[20:45] <newz2000> basically the only request is for the first slide
[20:45] <newz2000> people aren't liking the desk
[20:45] <newz2000> the best suggestion is to do an LCD monitor and keyboard
[20:45] <newz2000> Do you think that would be possible?
[20:46] <thorwil> yes. boring, but yes
[20:46] <newz2000> It's interesting the range of emotions I got on this particular work.
[20:47] <newz2000> Julian actually went from strongly disliking it to thinking you were brilliant as I explained how it was going to work.
[20:47] <thorwil> newz2000: heh. what did he think initially how it would work?
[20:47] <newz2000> He didn't understand how it was animated and how quick the transitions will be
[20:48] <thorwil> newz2000: and where does he see brilliance? ;)
[20:48] <newz2000> Communicating a message clearly and quickly I guess.
[20:48] <newz2000> The problem is if you stare at them closely you can pick them to pieces, but no one will be staring at them. They'll only be there for a moment.
[20:49] <newz2000> Except for the first one that is...
[20:49] <newz2000> which is a key point
[20:49] <newz2000> because the animation shouldn't start until the images are loaded, so the first one has to be really good stand alone
[20:49] <thorwil> i see
[20:50] <thorwil> newz2000: will we have a no-javascript solution for bloggers this time?
[20:50] <newz2000> I think we'll just use a static of the last frame
[20:50] <newz2000> but yes
[20:51] <thorwil> good. otherwise i would have to think of something entirely different, remembering the requests from last time
[20:51] <MadsRH> thorwil: Sorry for interrupting, but where can I see your slide images? Is there a public link?
[20:51] <newz2000> MadsRH: they're on the wiki...
[20:51] <knome> MadsRH, it's the countdown banners wiki page
[20:51] <newz2000> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Website/JauntyCountdownBanners
[20:52] <MadsRH> of course :-[ thanks
[20:52] <knome> newz2000, http://<IP_ADDRESS>/rime/jscript/rotator/test2.html
[20:52] <knome> newz2000, is that any better?
[20:53] <newz2000> knome: a little, but not quite
[20:53] <newz2000> Why don't you stick the images in there that thorwill made
[20:53] <knome> newz2000, any direction to point to?
[20:53] <knome> right.
[20:53] <newz2000> well, the actual slide needs to be quick
[20:53] <newz2000> .25 seconds or so
[20:53] <newz2000> and about 2 seconds between transitions
[20:53] <knome> .25 secs but smooth?
[20:53] <newz2000> maybe .4 seconds
[20:54] <newz2000> but yes
[20:54] <newz2000> look at the one by Pierre and see how his is timed
[20:54] <newz2000> I haven't looked closely at the code yet http://code.bearfruit.org/~matt/tmp/PierreCarousel
[20:55] <newz2000> http://code.bearfruit.org/~matt/tmp/PierreCarousel/countdown.html is the frame
[20:55] <knome> newz2000, it uses mootools.
[20:55] <newz2000> knome: yours does?
[20:55] <newz2000> the other is jquery I think
[20:56] <knome> newz2000, no, his onw.
[20:56] <knome> one
[20:56] <knome> newz2000, and it's not mine, it's my codemonkeys ;)
[20:56] <newz2000>   google.load('jquery', '1');
[20:56] <newz2000> jquery via the google ajax api
[20:56] <knome> we don't use google nor something like that. only js
[20:57] <newz2000> I saw that. Clever.
[20:57] <newz2000> Don't be afraid to stand on the shoulders of giants.
[20:57] <newz2000> ;-)
[20:57] <knome> he is a clever codemonkey.
[20:57] <knome> he doesn't want bananas, he wants beer.
[20:57] <newz2000> You get two free cookies if he can do it with YUI3
[20:57] <knome> (and money, occasionally)
[20:57] <newz2000> (virtual cookies)
[20:58] <knome> i'm seriously thinking whether i should possess him this challenge.
[20:58] <knome> but i think i won't :P
[20:58] <newz2000> Well, I don't really care what is used
[20:58] <newz2000> The end result is the important part
[20:59] <knome> right. what i care is about is that it's really non-dependant on heavy libs.
[20:59] <newz2000> that's fine too. The smoothness and the timing of the transition on Pierrre's is quite good. I'm not sure what makes the difference.
[21:00] <knome> it's something mootools does. it does some slide transition tweaking.
[21:00] <newz2000> maybe. (it's jquery btw) ;-)
[21:02] <newz2000> wow, how clever... look at this:
[21:02] <newz2000>     $.get("http://developer.yahooapis.com/TimeService/V1/getTime", {
[21:03] <knome> http://<IP_ADDRESS>/rime/jscript/rotator/test3.html
[21:03] <knome> yes, i wouldn't want to refer to yahooapis.com
[21:03] <knome> is that better ^
[21:04] <newz2000> there's somethign wrong with the dimensions
[21:04] <thorwil> newz2000: 9.04 white, too?
[21:05] <knome> newz2000, dimensions? what  could that be?
[21:05] <newz2000> thorwil: let me check my chat history
[21:05] <newz2000> knome: I don't know, big white gaps
[21:05] <knome> newz2000, right. refresh
[21:05] <knome> it's cached css.
[21:06] <newz2000> knome: better. The delay between transitions is good, the actual transition could be quicker
[21:06] <newz2000> thorwil: still looking, sorry for delay
[21:06] <mdke> newz2000: hi
[21:06] <newz2000> hey mdke
[21:07] <newz2000> thorwil: the exact words are "with white Ubuntu"
[21:07] <newz2000> so I'd say leave the version number as it is
[21:09] <knome> newz2000, http://<IP_ADDRESS>/rime/jscript/rotator/test3.html
[21:09] <knome> newz2000, (again) - better?
[21:09] <newz2000> knome: looking sharp!
[21:10] <knome> is that good or bad? :P
[21:10] <newz2000> it's good
[21:10] <thorwil> it does weird things here
[21:10] <knome> right. anything else to tweak?
[21:10] <knome> thorwil, like what?
[21:11] <thorwil> knome: it left gaps between the slides and stopped in the middle of 2 slides on first load
[21:11] <thorwil> knome: but now it works after F5
[21:11] <newz2000> thorwil: shift+reload
[21:11] <knome> thorwil, refresh css.
[21:11] <thorwil> ah, ok
[21:11] <knome> thorwil, that was just cached css.
[21:11] <thorwil> all hail caching
[21:12] <newz2000> knome: only one more change for now, add one more frame, use this image: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Website/JauntyCountdownBanners?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=tw_ring_colored_24_days.png
[21:12] <newz2000> actually, maybe decrease the delay between the transitions. If it's 2.0s now then try 1.8s
[21:12] <knome> right :P
[21:12] <thorwil> knome, newz2000 it would be better to have the 1 px black border left in place, instead of having it as part of the slides
[21:13] <newz2000> yes, I agree
[21:13] <knome> thorwil, i thought that cam from your images...
[21:13] <thorwil> knome: yes, because i didn't think of sliding
[21:14] <thorwil> if the border can be added on top, i can remove it from my images
[21:14] <thorwil> but now i have to go, good night! :)
[21:14] <newz2000> don't sweat it for now thorwil
[21:14] <newz2000> ok, good night thorwil, thanks for your help
[21:15] <newz2000> mdke: what do you think about the search engine suggestion, should we try to make it work with search.ubuntu.com so we only need to maintain one?
[21:15] <mdke> newz2000: is there an email about this that I missed?
[21:15] <newz2000> no, just mentioned it above
[21:15] <newz2000> basically
[21:15] <mdke> newz2000: ah, scrolling up
[21:15] <newz2000> search.ubuntu.com already has a filter for limiting searches to documentation
[21:15] <newz2000> (which is help.ubuntu.com)
[21:16] <mdke> as long as the results cover the same sites as the current website and are weighted in the same way, i think that would work
[21:16] <mdke> although I guess the header might be inconsistent with the help website
[21:17] <newz2000> lets see if it's technically feasable
[21:17] <newz2000> if so we can have a different search results page
[21:18] <mdke> ok. Dustin has been very good at google search so he can probably help answer any technical questions
[21:18] <mdke> and he has access to the config with the weighting rules
[21:18] <newz2000> oh, you've already started building another one?
[21:18] <mdke> basically we weight the latest stable release docs higher than others, and then the community ones below that, broadly
[21:18] <mdke> newz2000: we've had one since October, but it has adverts
[21:18] <newz2000> oh, I see
[21:19] <newz2000> well, what you describe is actually a good idea
[21:19] <newz2000> I'll talk to Dustin about it, see if he knows a way to send a parameter in with the search to automatically use the documentation filter. If so we'll put your weighting into ours (since it seems logical)
[21:19] <mdke> that's great
[21:21] <mdke> feel free to check out help.ubuntu.com/search.html for the search we have now
[21:35] <knome> newz2000, http://emonk.fi/open/ubuntu/Feature%20Carousel/
[21:35] <knome> newz2000, fallbacks to frame 6 if no JS
[21:35] <knome> newz2000, slides are now showed 1.8s
[21:35] <newz2000> looks good
[21:36] <newz2000> I'll show it off to a few people and get some feedback
[21:36] <knome> sure, no problem.
[21:36] <newz2000> You may want to hide frame 6 using js until after frame 1 loads
[21:37] <newz2000> it seems to be loading quicker than frame 1
[21:37] <newz2000> but that is a good idea
[21:39] <knome> that might be a bit of a problem. i don't know.
[21:40] <knome> the fallback frame is defined in css, which will obviously load before js, is the js script is included after.
[21:40] <knome> i shall ask what we can do
[21:41] <knome> ok, the thing is investigated.
[21:42] <newz2000> one thing you can do is just use an img tag in a noscript tag
[21:43] <newz2000> and if you put that last then it will load afterwards
[21:43] <knome> right..
[21:43] <newz2000> well, technically it won't load at all unless js is off
[21:43] <knome> the noscript?
[21:44] <newz2000> if js is turned on the <noscript><img ...></noscript> is ignored
[21:46] <knome> right.
[21:54] <knome> newz2000, http://emonk.fi/open/ubuntu/Feature%20Carousel/
[21:54] <newz2000> knome: awesome, good work
[21:55] <knome> i'll forward your thanks to the author :)
[21:55] <knome> though he might just pop in himself..:P
[21:56] <newz2000> I'll send it to people and get feedback. I can't wait to see it with the final image
[21:56] <knome> yeah.
[21:56] <knome> it's highly possible we will use it with xubuntu as well :)
[21:57] <knome> newz2000, meet rime, the author of the JS
[21:57] <newz2000> hi rime!
[21:57] <rime> hi newz2000!
[21:58] <newz2000> ah, this is nice:
[21:58] <newz2000> frameDelays[0] = 1000 * 1.8;
[21:58] <knome> yes.
[21:58] <knome> that was the original spec, wasn't it?
[21:58] <newz2000> that will make it very easy to tweak when it comes time to do final adjustments
[22:07] <newz2000> see you later, gonna upgrade to jaunty
[22:07] <knome> see you newz2000