[03:38] <nigelb> apachelogger: Its correct. Those newlines make us valid according to spec.
[03:38] <nigelb> And they come from the blueprint page
[07:50] <bambee> hi
[08:21] <apachelogger> nigelb: IIRC the spec suggests either \n or \N but either as plain text, not the escape sequence
[08:22] <nigelb> apachelogger: if there's a new line, there needs to be a space or something. Talk to Mike Hall. He did it
[08:24] <apachelogger> http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2445.txt
[08:24] <apachelogger> 4.3.11 Text
[08:24] <apachelogger>      ESCAPED-CHAR = "\\" / "\;" / "\," / "\N" / "\n")
[08:24] <apachelogger>         ; \\ encodes \, \N or \n encodes newline
[08:24] <apachelogger>         ; \; encodes ;, \, encodes ,
[08:24] <apachelogger>    An intentional formatted text line break MUST only be included in a
[08:24] <apachelogger>    "TEXT" property value by representing the line break with the
[08:24] <apachelogger>    character sequence of BACKSLASH (US-ASCII decimal 92), followed by a
[08:24] <apachelogger>    LATIN SMALL LETTER N (US-ASCII decimal 110) or a LATIN CAPITAL LETTER
[08:24] <apachelogger>    N (US-ASCII decimal 78), that is "\n" or "\N".
[08:24] <apachelogger> example: "Project XYZ Final Review\nConference Room - 3B\nCome Prepared."
[08:25] <apachelogger> using the capital letter makes no sense at all as it breaks shadeslayer's parser
[08:52] <bambee> rrahhhhaaaa !!!!!!   I forgot the "~ppa1" on libkexiv o.O
[08:52]  * bambee blames himself
[09:15] <apachelogger> nigelb: and I am responable certain that the participant specific ical's are broken
[09:15] <apachelogger> they only come back empty
[09:15] <apachelogger> (well, with ical header, but no events)
[10:03] <nigelb> apachelogger: could you file a bug please?
[11:18] <apachelogger> rbelem: new app in store
[11:18] <apachelogger> s/app/version
[11:33] <yofel> bambee: can you sync your kde-workspace 4.7.3 package with the archive please?
[11:46] <bambee> yofel: I synced it with the bzr repository (lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging), assuming it is up-to-date
[11:46] <bambee> I was wrong?
[11:46] <yofel> bambee: agateau uploaded a new lightdm patch to oneiric-proposed - from what I see that's not in bzr
[11:47] <bambee> yofel: mhhh right
[11:48] <bambee> yofel: after dinner, I will sync it with the archive.
[11:48] <yofel> thanks
[12:17] <yofel> bulldog98_: about smokegen: please remove my changelog entry for 4.7.2 as that's unreleased. If the the last changelog entry is unreleased don't add a new one but add your changes to that and change the version
[12:18] <yofel> bulldog98_: and please mention in the changelog that you added not-installed
[12:45] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kdegraphics-strigi-analyzer] Philip Muškovac * 20 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[12:54] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kgamma] Philip Muškovac * 10 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:09] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/smokeqt] Philip Muškovac * 11 * debian/changelog New upstream release
[13:21] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kgeography] Philip Muškovac * 12 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:26] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/khangman] Philip Muškovac * 11 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:27] <nigelb> apachelogger: does the new format break your app?
[13:27] <apachelogger> yes
[13:27] <apachelogger> well
[13:27] <nigelb> completely non-working? :(
[13:27] <apachelogger> newlines show up in descriptions now
[13:27] <apachelogger> which annoys poor ol rbelem
[13:27] <nigelb> Ok, somewhat better :P
[13:28] <nigelb> Next time, I'll keep you informed when we make a change to ical
[13:28] <nigelb> So, you guys can test :)
[13:28] <nigelb> sorry, about this time!
[13:28] <apachelogger> no worries, we'll switch to the api anyway :P
[13:29] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kig] Philip Muškovac * 13 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:35] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kiten] Philip Muškovac * 19 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:37] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/klettres] Philip Muškovac * 13 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:39] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kmplot] Philip Muškovac * 13 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:40] <debfx> yofel, bambee: agateau's lightdm fix is in 4.7.3 so no need to add the patch
[13:40] <yofel> ah ok
[13:40] <bambee> ok, great
[13:40] <yofel> the changelog entry should still go in IMO
[13:43] <bambee> right
[13:46] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kolourpaint] Philip Muškovac * 14 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:49] <bambee> debfx: it's not applied in the tarball
[13:50] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/konsole] Philip Muškovac * 17 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:50] <bambee> the commit was probably after the tag
[13:51] <debfx> ah right, it was pushed too late for 4.7.3
[13:53] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kross-interpreters] Philip Muškovac * 7 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:55] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kruler] Philip Muškovac * 14 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[13:58] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/ksaneplugin] Philip Muškovac * 20 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[14:00] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/ksnapshot] Philip Muškovac * 14 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[14:16] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kstars] Philip Muškovac * 10 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[14:18] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/ktouch] Philip Muškovac * 12 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[14:21] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kturtle] Philip Muškovac * 15 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[14:24] <yofel> bambee: what happened to libexiv2 ?
[14:24] <bambee> this is exactly what I am looking for .... where is it ? I uploaded it this morning o.O
[14:24] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kwordquiz] Philip Muškovac * 11 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[14:24] <yofel> check your mails from launchpad ^^
[14:26] <bambee> already done, there is nothing ^^
[14:27] <yofel> ...
[14:27] <yofel> then again, I got a bunch of issues yesterday related to uploading
[14:27] <yofel> but I *did* get mails there
[14:28] <bambee> probably I jumped accidently into a temporal breach ... and I did not do what I supposed to do...
[14:28] <bambee> well, reuploading
[14:30] <bambee> http://paste.ubuntu.com/725367/
[14:31] <yofel> ignore that, it uploaded fine
[14:31] <bambee> ok
[14:41] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/parley] Philip Muškovac * 21 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[14:44] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/perlqt] Philip Muškovac * 14 * debian/changelog New upstream release
[14:46] <rbelem> apachelogger, :-D
[14:46] <rbelem> apachelogger, i made some changes to uds
[14:46] <rbelem> apachelogger, yesterday night
[14:47] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/rocs] Philip Muškovac * 16 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[15:04] <apachelogger> rbelem: did you push yet?
[15:06] <Riddell> weird e-mail du jour http://paste.kde.org/140618/
[15:08] <apachelogger> y u always get the weird mail :(
[15:08] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/step] Philip Muškovac * 13 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[15:08] <Riddell> I really do
[15:09] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/svgpart] Philip Muškovac * 26 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[15:10] <apachelogger> real fun
[15:13] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kdegraphics-thumbnailers] Philip Muškovac * 13 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[15:14] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/smokekde] Philip Muškovac * 10 * debian/changelog New upstream release
[15:38] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/perlkde] Philip Muškovac * 11 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[15:51] <Quintasan> shadeslayer: ping
[15:52] <Quintasan> shadeslayer: You do happen to have the Ubuntu image for Transformer, don't you?  :P
[17:06] <apachelogger> DarkwingUDS: did you like ping me or something?
[17:12] <yofel> where are the notes from the defaults session?
[17:24] <Quintasan> jussi: I demand a ban for him :O
[17:38] <CIA-130> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kdeplasma-addons] Philip Muškovac * 173 * debian/ (changelog control) New upstream release
[18:22] <Riddell> fregl: are you near Qt people?
[18:42] <fregl> Riddell: yes, in the keynote room, at least near two of them
[19:15] <DarkwingUDS> apachelogger: yes I had... we were talking about Starship Troopers
[19:15] <apachelogger> DarkwingUDS: ah, sorry, I am stuck at a friends with unusable internet connection
[19:16] <apachelogger> I'll listen to the recording and drop thoughts when I am home :)
[19:16]  * yofel never noticed the session time changed :(
[19:16] <DarkwingUDS> apachelogger: tis cool. I'll have to sit down with you and let you know what happened with bugs.
[19:17] <DarkwingUDS> More or less, we are going to report 100% of bugs to bugs.kde and then pull the ones we care about/can do something/Kubuntu ones down to launchpad
[19:17] <apachelogger> that is what we did since lucid :P
[19:35] <Riddell> ScottK: do you have pyqt packages for python 3?
[19:35] <Riddell> do you know if anyone has asked upstream about the dbus issue?
[20:12] <Quintasan> apachelogger: When will you have finished your android ui?
[20:12] <DarkwingUDS> apachelogger: Yes, on paper we do that but, in reality... we have TONS of bugs filed in Launchpad.
[20:13] <yofel> DarkwingUDS: problem: talking about it won't really get us further...
[20:36] <DarkwingUDS> yofel: Yeah I know.
[22:20] <apachelogger> DarkwingUDS: that is because we lack people to evaluate whether they are in our stuff or in upstream and process them accordingly


[01:47] <bluesabre> oh darn, elementary-xfce is not in our packageset
[01:56] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xubuntu-default-settings:: Remove enter/leave opacity setting, release 18.10.1 @ http://git.launchpad.net/xubuntu-default-settings/commit/?id=ab91af3ec5fe36ecf9329531908905d4f9f3c3e4 (by Sean Davis)
[02:18] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xubuntu-artwork:: Switch xubuntu branding to support the png theme variant @ http://git.launchpad.net/xubuntu-artwork/commit/?id=876935ac531c36491b7fed8c6399bdaad6ae471b (by Sean Davis)
[03:01] <Unit193> bluesabre: Not really a problem.
[04:50] <Unit193> elementary-xfce 0.13-1 uploaded by Unit 193<EMAIL_ADDRESS>https://tracker.debian.org/elementary-xfce
[04:50] <Unit193> bluesabre: You're good to go.
[04:50] <Unit193> Greybird is all yours though. :>
[09:43] <flocculant> !team | I've been trying to find enough interest to carry on. Seems like an impossible task unfortunately. I commit to getting us through what's required for the Cosmic cycle.
[09:43] <flocculant> I will commit to doing what's needed as a member of council for the foreseeable future.
[09:44] <flocculant> We need to have someone ready to run QA for the DD cycle - I would hope that akxwi-dave will take the baton up
[09:44] <flocculant> I'll be around for that cycle to help whoever does do the QA as required.
[09:45] <flocculant> But after the DD cycle - I will be hanging up my spurs and just being a user.
[09:45] <flocculant> Sorry and all that - but life ;)
[09:50] <flocculant> To be frank - I just haven't got the energy to fight to get a handful of people to test things anymore. And I've beat my head against a wall so much that my face is as blue from bruising as someone from Avatar ...
[10:32] <bluesabre> flocculant: thanks for all the work you've done for us!
[10:32] <bluesabre> ochosi, knome, flocculant, slickymaster... in case any of you want to ack, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/elementary-xfce/+bug/1792555
[10:45] <Unit193> Errr...yeah I'm going to echo bluesabre and say thanks to flocculant.
[10:45] <Unit193> bluesabre: I feel bad making you do all the hard work. :(
[10:46] <bluesabre> Unit193: all I have to do is convince somebody in release to say yes :)
[10:46] <bluesabre> easy
[10:46] <bluesabre> peasy
[10:46] <Unit193> Always make you file all the paperwork.
[10:46] <bluesabre> I don't mind it
[10:46] <bluesabre> Also happy to see elementary-xfce appeared in the packageset overnight, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/packagesets/cosmic/xubuntu
[10:47] <Unit193> Oooh, shiny.  But as I'm MOTU we'd have had access anyway.
[10:47] <bluesabre> oh!
[10:47] <bluesabre> Need to remember that
[10:48] <bluesabre> looks like syncpackage sees the latest version now, so just waiting for release
[10:49] <slickymasterWork> even though it's sad to read your words flocculant, I understand your POV
[10:50] <slickymasterWork> thanks for all the extraordinary work you've done
[10:51] <slickymasterWork> bluesabre, do you want me to ack in the bug report, for paperwork sake?
[10:51] <bluesabre> slickymasterWork: yes please
[11:03] <slickymasterWork> done bluesabre and thanks
[11:05] <Unit193> http://people.canonical.com/~doko/ftbfs-report/test-rebuild-20180911-cosmic.html#main that's a lot of main failures...
[11:15] <bluesabre> and only one xubuntu failure :)
[11:15] <Unit193> And that looked one-off.
[11:16] <bluesabre> very nice
[11:28] <flocculant> bluesabre: acked it
[12:46] <Spass> bluesabre, yesterday ondondil proposed o add "search in catfish" action to Whisker Menu, it seems that it's added to xubuntu-default-settings already (line 50), but I can't see it in newest 18.10, see here - https://git.launchpad.net/xubuntu-default-settings/tree/etc/xdg/xdg-xubuntu/xfce4/whiskermenu/defaults.rc#n50
[12:47] <Spass> I've tested by creating a new user under cosmic, this action isn't visible in the Whisker settings
[12:49] <Spass> also "catfish %s --start" doesn't work in some cases and "catfish %s --start --path=~" works better (when you are searching for "Music" for example, the command without --path fails to search anything, it just opens that folder)
[12:50] <Spass> I guess we need to submit a bug on LP?
[13:27] <brainwash> Spass: and there is "Web Search" entry which isn't listed in the linked defaults.rc
[13:29] <brainwash> https://git.xfce.org/panel-plugins/xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin/tree/panel-plugin/settings.cpp#n182
[13:33] <Spass> hmm, so the xubuntu-default-settings doesn't affect the Whisker Menu?
[13:34] <brainwash> only the search actions, right?
[13:34] <brainwash> or the whole rc config?
[20:08] <knome> flocculant, THANK YOU for everything so far :)


[00:40] <knome> McIntireEvan, if you are interested, i've just pushed an update for the ubuntu community theme that should work with your mobile device too :)
[15:40] <McIntireEvan> knome: I'll have to check that out when I get home :)
[17:56] <knome> McIntireEvan, sure, no hurry


[02:26] <[James]> Does anyone know how I can set custom assignments to my remote buttons?
[09:06] <coolthreads> I installed mythbuntu from disk, and it has permission issues
[09:07] <coolthreads> all the main /var/lib/mythtv folders are locked to the root by default it seems
[09:18] <levander_> I'm installing Mythbuntu Jaunty right now.  I ran the "Check the CD for Defects", the progress bar filled up, then it waits till I hit enter and it reboots.  Does that mean everything went okay?  Does it mean there are problems on the CD?
[09:19] <coolthreads> seems so
[09:19] <coolthreads> Man I have that installed aswell
[09:21] <levander_> coolthreads: What's it supposed to do at the end of the CD check?  It doesn't say nothing when the progress bar fills up, it just sits there, brain dead.
[09:22] <coolthreads> Im sorry that I dont have a answer for you, I didnt bother to do a cd check
[09:22] <coolthreads> I just installed it
[09:22] <coolthreads> im still trying to get my head around it
[09:23] <levander_> Yeah, it's confusing when you start 1st time, just keep playing with it.
[09:23] <levander_> Can you watch TV yet?
[09:23] <coolthreads> I havent even managed to get my satellite card going, very hard to get support from people on this topic
[09:23] <levander_> You have a satellite card?  I didn't even know they had those.
[09:24] <coolthreads> Yeah DVB-S
[09:24] <levander_> Have you got satellite TV working, not through Myth, through like a regular satellite set top box?
[09:24] <levander_> Oh, I thought DVB-S was just the European standard for cable.
[09:24] <levander_> You are USA or Europe?
[09:24] <coolthreads> Well not yet, I am going to use one hopefully tomorrow
[09:25] <coolthreads> New Zealand
[09:25] <levander_> Ha, I knew I was being naive only saying USA and Europe
[09:25] <levander_> A guy came from Australia to work with us one time...
[09:25] <levander_> The world map we had up on the wall, didn't even include the Australian continent.
[09:25] <levander_> We never noticed it till he pointed it out.
[09:26] <levander_> So, when he got back to Australia, he emailed us a better one
[09:26] <levander_> And, we had it printed and put it up.
[09:26] <levander_> coolthreads: Have you heard this joke?
[09:26] <levander_> Hello how are ya for 10p?
[09:26] <coolthreads> The dish on the roof, was set already to one of the satellites that i want to use
[09:26] <levander_> It'll be easier if you make sure satellite is working without Myth involved.
[09:27] <coolthreads> haven't heard that joke
[09:27] <levander_> Myth is messy till you understand it.
[09:27] <levander_> Really?
[09:27] <coolthreads> never been to aussie aswell
[09:27] <levander_> I peed my pants the 1st time the Australian guy told me
[09:27] <levander_> that
[09:27] <levander_> Do they use it in New Zealand too?
[09:28] <coolthreads> yeah, seems to be a few people getting mythtv to work
[09:28] <levander_> Oh damn, you said "haven't", my bad.
[09:28] <Zinn> levander_: Please watch your language.
[09:29] <coolthreads> did you swear?
[09:29] <levander_> That hello how are you thing, that's what gypsies will say to you in Australia when they are begging for money.
[09:29] <coolthreads> this channel is pretty quiet
[09:29] <levander_> coolthreads: I think it's because I said "damn".
[09:29] <Zinn> levander_: Please watch your language.
[09:29] <levander_> Yeah, see
[09:30] <coolthreads> it must be on auto or something when you say the d*mn word?
[09:30] <levander_> Ubuntu channels are wussies.    It's annoying.    Really don't think I could help anyway.  But, I'd really just put the keyboard down until you're sure satellite is working without Myth.
[09:31] <coolthreads> no body ever really answers any questions
[09:31] <levander_> coolthreads: You know about #mythtv-users?
[09:32] <levander_> It's weird nobody answers questions considering how many are in here.  I've never seen that on a channel before.
[09:32] <levander_> No answers usually means only like 6 people are in the room.
[09:32] <coolthreads> yeah
[09:32] <levander_> You've tried #mythtv-users?
[09:32] <coolthreads> not yet, didnt know until now lol
[09:33] <coolthreads> I hardly use IRC's these days
[09:34] <coolthreads> looks more healthy in there actually thanks for the tip
[09:35] <levander_> good luck!
[12:25] <rek> hi
[12:25] <rek> i need help
[12:29] <coolthreads> rek: I found this channel to be very quiet
[12:29] <coolthreads> what you trying to do
[12:38] <rek> installing mythtv
[12:38] <rek> did it in the wrong way
[12:39] <rek> deleted some mysql txt
[12:43] <coolthreads> I installed mythtv by using mythbuntu, Im still trying to find my way around. How did you install mythtv? did you already have a linux distro installed? and install mythtv on top of that?
[12:43] <coolthreads> rek: ?
[12:45] <coolthreads> Im am starting to learn that #mythtv-users is more active than this channel
[13:30] <unimaginative> coolthreads, It is, but you really need to be on the ball as far as research into your question
[13:30] <unimaginative> coolthreads, the guys over in #mythtv-users have no problem insulting you for your lack of research.
[13:34] <coolthreads> ok
[14:21] <rek> help
[19:17] <levander> Has anyone gotten a Hauppage HVR 1250 to work in Mythbuntu Jaunty, or previous versions?
[19:21] <Shadow__X> levander: many people have you just need to follow the instructions on the mythtv wiki


[01:17] <xubuntu91> a
[03:16] <itai_michaelson> hi, i can connect to my vpn with the terminal ,but when i try to use xubuntu's built in GUI (network manager) it gives up after 30 seconds (cannot establish connection) , is there a way i can change network manager's settings to wait longer ?
[03:28] <holstein> itai_michaelson: is that the issue? it needs to wait longer?
[03:34] <itai_michaelson> holstein, yes, the terminal waits for about 2 minutes , the gui gives up after 30 sec
[03:34] <holstein> i would probably just connect with the terminal.. thats not do-able?
[03:34] <itai_michaelson> not for my wife,,,,
[03:35] <itai_michaelson> if there's another GUI i can use , which allows tweaking its settings..
[03:36] <holstein> itai_michaelson: i would probably launch the GUI from the command line.. see if i could learn how to change it
[03:36] <holstein> i might just make a shortcut for the wife that runs the command that is working in the terminal
[03:37] <itai_michaelson> i can do that ,
[03:37] <itai_michaelson> but does that mean that i can't change the settings for 'network monitor ' (or whatever they call it)?
[03:38] <holstein> itai_michaelson: its all open, so in theory, you can do anything
[03:39] <genii-around> If it connects every time to the vpn, might want to just do a post-up directive in the interfaces
[03:40] <itai_michaelson> genii-around, you see , i'm in china and i have a list of servers, china usually blocks some of them , so i need an easy tool to switch between servers, the GUI is ideal ,except that it gives up too early, i wonder if anyone can point me to some config files or something where i can change these parameters
[03:45] <itai_michaelson> just a quick question - the network monitor in xubuntu is the same as ubuntu?
[04:43] <chromeprob> i installed the latest chrome  Version 23.0.1271.64 on 12.04 and the macromedia flash does not appear in plugins! what gives?
[04:52] <genii-around> http://askubuntu.com/questions/129534/flash-player-not-present-in-chrome
[04:56] <genii-around> chromeprob: ^
[05:04] <chromeprob> it is not the solution for  a 32 bit system. moreover, 11.2 is the latest version for gnu/linux  from adobe. chrome comes with version 11.5  built-in which is what i need for livemocha
[05:05] <chromeprob> http://livemocha.uservoice.com/forums/2163-feature-requests/suggestions/136875-increase-linux-compatibilty
[05:18] <c2tarun> Hi friends, I am not able to set chromium as my default browser for Xubuntu, I tried from Settings and also from inside of chromium settings. But whenever I click any link anywhere it gets open in Firefox :( can anyone please help?
[05:54] <ruien> hello all, can someone point me to documentation on how xfce handles alsa and pulseaudio, or explain a bit? I'm pretty much lost: I've noticed that 'audacity' has a lot of input options for microphone and one of them works ("HD Audio Generic ALC887-VD Analog: Rear Mic:1"). There's also a "default: Rear Mic 1" that does not work, which makes me think that the default isn't set correctly. I've also noticed that "arecord -d 5 test.wav" doesn't do anything..
[06:26] <ruien> okay, for future reference, fixed by setting "PlaybackBuiltinAudioAnalogStereoPulseAudioMixer" for '/active-card' key in xfce Settings Editor. Anyone know where that name "PlaybackBuiltinAudioAnalogStereoPulseAudioMixer" would have been listed?
[06:51] <raytray> Under available sound cards afaik
[08:34] <topper4125> !info tmux
[09:48] <marosh> Hi @ all. I have problems to activate the TV out without using the nvidia-current driver. Is anyone around who might help me there?
[09:55] <marosh> To be more precise, there is no TV-1 or similar in the xrandr output list
[09:58] <marosh> anyone?
[09:58] <well_laid_lawn> marosh: paste the xrandr output
[09:58] <well_laid_lawn> !paste
[10:00] <well_laid_lawn> you can check if nouveau supports tv out on your card here - http://nouveau.freedesktop.org/wiki/FeatureMatrix
[10:01] <marosh> well_laid_lawn: Thank you. Okay, in that listing TV out is marked as TODO
[10:02] <marosh> xrandr output: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1381595/
[10:02] <well_laid_lawn> so it seems you'll need nvidia's driver then
[10:02] <marosh> …Unfortunately. Thanks for your help!
[10:02] <well_laid_lawn> cheers
[10:20] <xubuntu972> anyone here?
[10:36] <xubuntu016> hi all
[10:36] <xubuntu016> any russian where?
[10:38] <Unit193> !ru | xubuntu016
[10:38] <xubuntu016> У меня grub не ставится :(
[10:38] <xubuntu016> thanks)
[10:39] <Unit193> Sure.
[10:42] <Inoki> Hi lads. Is there a way to associate everything web related to Chrome instead of FF in Ubuntu Studio 12.10? When I e.g. use Kupfer to open a link to a website it always opens Firefox instead of Chrome.
[10:49] <Unit193> update-alternatives --config x-www-browser  and   update-alternatives --config gnome-www-browser   and set it through that.
[10:49] <Unit193> Also check "Preferred Applications" in settings manager.
[10:57] <Inoki> Unit193: I've checked via galternatives and Chrome's priority is set to 200 and Firefox's 40 under both commands.
[10:58] <Inoki> Unit193: You think it'd be good to erase FF's config via Galternatives and re-add it if necessary?
[10:59] <Unit193> Does kupfer have a browser setting?
[11:02] <Inoki> Unit193: nope.
[11:03] <Inoki> Unit193: too bad there ain't an option in settings manager to bulk edit file options and how files are open. I see a lot of files still being attached to FF.
[11:06] <Unit193> Inoki: Did you happen to check the minetype editor?
[11:07] <Inoki> Unit193: nope. I'm trying to edit files in settings manager to be opened with Chrome instead of FF.
[11:17] <Inoki> Unit193: I've changed every file in the settings manager to be opened with Chrome instead of Firefox and still nothing.
[11:20] <Unit193> Then other than hacks, I do not know.
[17:09] <juan__> hi. a got a xubuntu 11.04. how can i change him to 11.10?  is it difficult?
[17:09] <baizon> juan__: run update-manager
[17:09] <baizon> and it should show you that an update is avaiable
[17:10] <baizon> *available
[17:11] <juan__> said that is no update to do
[17:12] <baizon> then update-manager -d
[17:12] <juan__> baizon, happens the same thing. but its okay
[17:46] <xubuntu859> looking for help please... installed xubuntu 12.10 earlier today and have messed up lost panels. any ideas how to restore to default please? many thanks.
[18:01] <TheSheep> xubuntu859: you can try renaming the directory .config/xfce4/panel/
[18:01] <TheSheep> xubuntu859: and reloging
[18:01] <xubuntu859> thx will try that
[19:15] <subman> Does xubuntu support opengl?
[19:16] <raytray> Should
[19:16] <subman> hmmmm
[19:17] <subman> Trying to get flightgear to work and cannot.  Also, the default screen savers run very, very, very slowly.  makes me think something is wrong
[19:18] <subman> Is there some kind of test?
[19:19] <subman> glxgears show 2.3 fps
[19:21] <AndreeeCZ> hi. Can someone help me install a soundMAX integrated sound card on xubuntu12.10? It is not even present in lspci. Thank you :)
[19:24] <raytray> subman, see if you have the latest drivers/etc.
[19:31] <subman> raytray, I have no idea how to do that
[19:35] <subman> Anyone know how to check to see if I have the latest NVidia drivers?
[19:36] <subman> My current driver is 304.51
[19:36] <TheSheep> subman: just install nvidia-current?
[19:37] <subman> TheSheep, won't that mess the system up if already installed?
[19:37] <TheSheep> subman: how did you install it originally?
[19:37] <subman> TheSheep, I don't recall
[19:38] <TheSheep> subman: if you installed it from the ubuntu repository, then it won't break
[19:38] <subman> TheSheep, should it not be updated automatically?
[19:39] <TheSheep> that's why it's the recommended way -- you get automatic updates and all
[19:39] <TheSheep> yes
[19:39] <TheSheep> actually, you can check
[19:39] <TheSheep> do 'dpkg -l | grep nvidia'
[19:39] <TheSheep> that will show you what packages with 'nvidia' in name you have installed
[19:40] <TheSheep> if you already have nvidia-current, then you are good
[19:41] <subman> nvidia-current is installed.  But why the crazy slow framerate?
[19:41] <TheSheep> check /var/log/Xorg.0.log to see if it actually gets loaded
[19:48] <subman> Well here it is:  http://pastebin.com/TGFknjpJ
[19:52] <TheSheep> subman: looks good
[19:53] <TheSheep> as far as I can tell, at least
[19:53] <subman> I assume then that this card is just not supported?
[19:54] <TheSheep> no, why, it loads the glx extension and all
[19:58] <subman> right but the frame rate is insanely slow
[19:58] <subman> 2 fps in glxgears
[20:00] <TheSheep> did you look for your card's name on the forums?
[20:00] <TheSheep> you are probably not the first person to have this problem
[20:01] <subman> No, tons of problems it seems
[20:02] <subman> It seems the latest nvidia drivers and 64 bit is broken
[20:03] <TheSheep> gotta love binary drivers
[20:03] <subman> AMD was no better
[20:04] <subman> I've never had any luck on my machines with opengl and linux
[20:15] <TheSheep> I can't complain about my intel
[20:21] <subman> Is there an 'additional drivers' gui program for xubuntu like there is in Ubuntu?
[20:22] <TheSheep> should be in 'system'
[20:22] <TheSheep> it's the same as in ubuntu
[20:22] <TheSheep> !info jockey
[20:22] <TheSheep> :/
[20:23] <TheSheep> !info jockey-gtk
[20:23] <subman> They are making things very difficult
[20:23] <TheSheep> hm, why is it optional? :(
[20:24] <Unit193> Check in software sources, iirc.
[20:24] <subman> I seem to be having more and more problems with Ubuntu ever since 10.04
[20:27] <nyRednek> subman: clean install or upgrades?
[20:27] <subman> Both
[20:28] <subman> It is not a single machine issue
[20:30] <subman> I think this is the related bug:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers/+bug/982485
[20:34] <knome> TheSheep, transitional
[20:34] <knome> "jockey" should be under "software sources" in quantal
[20:47] <subman> hmmm, I have jockey-gtk installed but cannot run it.  When I try it says that it is not installed
[20:55] <TheSheep> subman: see what knome said
[20:58] <subman> I don't understand what 'software sources' is
[21:00] <subman> Ah, I see now!
[21:35] <subman> There, open source driver seems to be working much better than the nvidia ones


[03:36] <bbradley> hello
[03:37] <bbradley> i'm having trouble with cloud config apt_sources working. anyone spare some help?
[03:37] <bbradley> i am using debian's cloud-init 0.7.6.
[03:40] <bbradley> i'm not going anywhere so just ping me.
[03:40] <bbradley> expect to bed but back after
[03:52] <bbradley> it seems i'm experiencing this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cloud-init/+bug/1355343
[06:44] <smoser> bbradley, can you give exmaple of cloud-config ?
[14:45] <bbradley> smoser: indeed
[14:45] <bbradley> http://pastebin.com/4uDjfG77
[14:46] <bbradley> and, everything else in the cloud config file works except for apt_sources.
[14:54] <bbradley> i may not be experienced that exact bug. but my sources.list is not being created by cloud-init and my sources.list.d is empty.
[14:55] <bbradley> experiencing
[16:11] <bbradley> i am going to attempt to try using a new version and see if that helps. but it seems hard at best since the only way i see to use cloud-init is install by package.
[17:28] <bbradley> meaning i have to create a package from the codebase to try.


[07:05] <zequence> Let's look at the possibility of supporting ardour4 in the same fashion as firefox is being supported. This will work fine as long as we don't need to SRU required libraries also
[07:06] <zequence> We just sync the latest tested version from Debian testing
[12:50] <zequence> Ny email might not be working for a little while
[13:04] <astraljava> zequence: That ardour thingie sounds good. I might get a nice external sound card from a friend for this laptop, so I could in fact be able to record my guitars ran through a Behringer preamp/effects with that setup. Ardour should be the key to that, I believe.
[13:14] <OvenWerks> zequence: I am able to run ardour 4.0.0 and the nightlies with no problem on 14.04. So it should be doable.
[13:18] <zequence> At the most we would be able to backport to trusty, but perhaps we can change the update model for that particular application for release X
[13:20] <OvenWerks> The download from the ardour site is about 10 times the size of the ubuntu package  :)
[14:15] <astraljava> How can that be?
[15:01] <OvenWerks> astraljava: the DL from ardour includes any libs a distro might not have. It will work anywhere. They install their own local directory tree in /opt
[15:02] <OvenWerks> astraljava: That is why most distros want to roll their own version of ardour.
[15:04] <OvenWerks> astraljava: one would think this would use a lot of extra memory too, but the whole Ardour tree is only 150M which is actually pretty small is even a 4Gram system
[15:07] <OvenWerks> A lot of the package size concerns are not so much the installed size, but the DL/ISO size.
[15:10] <OvenWerks> Our ISO is 2.4G (vivid release) so our limit becomes 4G (next up USB thumb drive size) which will also fit a DVD.
[15:11] <OvenWerks> I don't know if it is wise, but it is probably possible to incluse the packages needed to select any DE without extra downloads and still be within that.
[15:19] <OvenWerks> It may even be possible to choose which DE to use as the live session DE... but again I don't think it is a good idea. The testing alone is beyond our manpower  :)
[15:23] <micahg> zequence: OvenWerks: you can certainly use the backports pocket to keep updating ardour for trusty, Firefox has it's special exception mainly for security reasons
[15:25] <OvenWerks> micahg: I would certainly prefer that to pointing people to the kxstudio PPAs
[17:17] <zequence> micahg: Most or all of the updates have security fixes. I'd rather update the whole thing than cherry pick single commits
[17:17] <zequence> Might get really hard to do fixes after a while too, if ardour has changed a lot in the mean time
[17:18] <micahg> only 1 CVE in the past 5 years: https://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvekey.cgi?keyword=ardour
[17:19] <zequence> micahg: Well, that is truly a security issue, but I was thinking of things like losing data, etc
[17:20] <zequence> TBH, I haven't followed ardour updates very cosely. And it doesn't move as quickly as Firefox, or say the kernel
[17:20] <micahg> well, data loss is certainly critical, but not security, if there's constant data loss issues, it might be better to look to another software package
[17:21] <micahg> MREs aren't so easy to get either, upstream needs a good track record: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates/MicroReleaseExceptions/
[17:22] <zequence> micahg: Thanks for looking at the bug btw. I wasn't sure how to go forward
[17:22] <zequence> I'm sure I could do something better there
[17:22] <micahg> major issues like bug 1450992 almost certainly warrant updates of some type, whether or not that's a full update I would think would be a case by case basis (jessie will have similar issues after this update, so we can follow their lead)
[17:23] <micahg> zequence: BTW, I'd suggest trying a full backport SRU since the packaging changes are very minimal for consistency sake, I can upload that a bit later
[17:23] <micahg> (I didn't look at the changelog for your merge request, so you might have proposed that as well..)
[17:24] <micahg> that'll also have the benefit of having trusty and jessie in sync
[17:24] <zequence> No, I didn't, but I thought that might be the best
[17:26] <zequence> JUst didn't know how to request that, actually
[17:26] <micahg> Probably a comment in the bug is easiest, since we have requestbackport, it's not really worth a debdiff or merge request IMHO
[17:27] <micahg> errr...backportpackage
[17:27] <micahg> I'm test building trusty now
[17:27] <zequence> ok. I made a comment just now
[17:30] <micahg> I closed out the merge requests as well, if the SRU team rejects it, I can revert the one packaging change and reupload
[17:30] <zequence> ok, thanks
[17:30] <micahg> can you fill out the SRU paperwork in the bug description?
[17:30] <zequence> micahg: Will do
[17:31] <micahg> thanks
[17:39] <zequence> micahg: I hope that is ok. Let me know if there's anything more I can do.
[17:40] <micahg> ok, I added a note about the backport SRU
[17:41] <micahg> looks good
[17:42] <zequence> alright
[17:47] <micahg> oops, I forgot there were 2 more patches in the packaging changes, but they should both be ok as well
[17:47] <micahg> I updated the description
[17:49] <zequence> Ah, right
[18:12] <astraljava> OvenWerks: Ok nice, didn't think of that. :)
[19:25] <micahg> zequence: do you care about your name in the changelog, current tools don't make that easy for a backport
[19:43] <zequence> micahg: Not at all. I assume it will look like in vivid
[19:46] <micahg> pretty much, ok, I'll upload shortly


[00:02] <pcjc2> I've got 945GM here, and haven't seen it... although have seen a few lockups resuming from suspend. (Which I'd attributed to doing testing on new driver patches)
[00:12] <bdmurray> pcjc2: I tried it with glxgears running and had no problem
[00:12] <bdmurray> However, suspend is tough to test on my system as I can only do it 1x
[00:15] <pcjc2> I'm sure this X11 testing is doing no favours for my HDD's power off retract count
[00:16] <pcjc2> (they don't like being hard-powered off too many times)
[00:17] <bdmurray> You can't even use sysrq?
[00:18] <pcjc2> is that built in by default on Gutsy kernels?
[00:18] <pcjc2> I've never made it work on either of the laptops I've had
[00:19] <bdmurray> It works for me, just reaching all the keys is hard
[00:19] <pcjc2> Figured it might be because its not got a native Sysrq key... its FN + delete  (its been so long since I used it, I've forgotten what the magic key combo is)
[00:19] <bdmurray> Ctrl+Alt+SysRq then U for umount S for sync and B for boot
[00:19] <bdmurray> or really maybe B for reBoot
[00:19] <pcjc2> It won't work for most of the intel crashes anyhow...
[00:20] <pcjc2> the graphics chip physically hard locks the machine
[00:21] <pcjc2> when you poke a register which isn't enabled. It seems that many register writes are locked into a hardware state machine which is clocked of one of the various internal video clocks. If you program such a register with the clock off / unstable, it can hang the chip
[00:21] <pcjc2> ok, so the key combo works ;)
[00:24] <pcjc2> oops... thats one FN key away from Ctrl-alt-del
[00:25] <bryce> heh
[00:31] <pcjc2> Bryce: Does opengl play nice with compiz in general?
[00:32] <pcjc2> A screenshot running glxgears... http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~pcjc2/Screenshot.png
[00:32] <bryce> pcjc2: yes it should
[00:32] <bryce> I think many bugs harbor there tho
[00:32] <pcjc2> it doesn't "expose" (I know that's not technically what it does) the window underneath
[00:32] <pcjc2> so if I drag the GL window around, it leaves prints
[00:33] <pcjc2> I'm trying to go back to basics on the 855 bug, and understand how windows get from applications to the screen with compiz
[00:34] <pcjc2> Rendering via GL textures, so does a GL bug mean a compiz bug?
[00:34] <bryce> I don't know enough about compiz internals to say, but it seems that there's not a 1:1 relationship there
[00:35] <pcjc2> I started to read up about how it works, and got lost very quickly
[00:35] <bryce> Amaranth and mvo are good contact points for it
[00:36] <pcjc2> its bad enough with the one physical intel chip,  AGP drivers for the bridge device, DRM drivers, X11 graphics drivers, Mesa DRI Libraries .... framebuffer drivers...
[00:36] <bryce> yeah it's another area where I need better education.  Since mvo, Amaranth and others seemed to have it under control, I ended up mostly focusing on other areas of X.
[00:37] <bryce> but we have a number of underlying issues that need solving at the X level
[00:37] <bryce> yup
[00:37] <pcjc2> Gutsy is going to be a bad trip for people with Intel hardware unless some fixes can get backported
[00:38] <pcjc2> Hopefully (ever the optimist) the newer Xorg and drivers in Hardy will be more stable
[00:39] <bryce> yeah, I'm a bit worried about this too
[00:40] <bryce> I think we should shoot for getting a fixed up new -intel out in -updates
[00:40] <pcjc2> Jesse Barnes was going to read up some 855 docs for me.. but I've not heard back
[00:41] <pcjc2> On a personal note, I'm annoyed.. I've not used compiz until recently, and I discovered the electronic cad software I'm a contributor for (gEDA) really really breaks redrawing with compiz
[00:41] <pcjc2> (gEDA has a rubbish "canvas", and I'm _trying_ to fix it, but still)
[00:44] <bryce> you might want to follow up with Jesse again in a few days; he is great at answering questions but I think he has many distractions so doesn't always follow up on things
[00:45] <pcjc2> I'm keen to get hands on some 855 hardware, I'll keep asking around if anyone has any
[00:45] <bryce> pcjc2: one thing I think we should do is compile a listing of the worst -intel bugs, perhaps with commentary about the seriousness of the issue and/or what's needed to fix them
[00:46] <bryce> I talked with shuttleworth about -intel and he said we have good high-up connections with Intel, and they really want to make their hardware solid with Ubuntu, so I think if we got a good way to summarize the main issues we need help with, I might be able to work on it from a top-down direction in Intel
[00:46] <pcjc2> sounds good
[00:46] <pcjc2> Keith Packard has been fairly helpful answer questions
[00:47] <pcjc2> he even told me he's "working on" getting some docs which mortals without NDA can have
[00:47]  * bryce nods
[00:48] <jcristau> he's been saying that for a while :)
[00:48] <bryce> he's been working on that for quite some time though; I don't know how soon we can expect to see them
[00:48] <pcjc2> Reading between the lines
[00:49] <pcjc2> KP: "
[00:49] <pcjc2> We don't have any documentation available for publication at this point,
[00:49] <pcjc2> although I am trying to make this happen."
[00:49] <pcjc2> The documentation details too many bugs / workarounds / technical details we don't want to release for scrutiny. I'm fighting internal politics"
[00:49] <pcjc2> (The latter being my reading of the former)
[00:50] <bryce> mm, I doubt it's that
[00:50] <jcristau> i'm sure internal politics are part of it :)
[00:51] <bryce> no I mean, I doubt it's that the docs describe too many bugs / workarounds
[00:51] <pcjc2> Its kindof come to my realisation that graphics drivers make or break the product
[00:51] <bryce> certainly internal politics can be expected here; I think he's said as much
[00:52] <bryce> but I think it's more about worry about exposing "crown jewels" or opening the company to litigation, enabling competitors, etc.
[00:52] <pcjc2> I've found some datasheets they do publish very very useful for debugging (e.g. this cruddy HP laptop BIOS)
[00:52] <bryce> ultimately I suspect the issue boils down to trying to identify a tangible benefit to the company, to offset the risks
[00:53] <pcjc2> I guess
[00:53] <pcjc2> I wonder how hard it is to get an NDA... (or whether its sensible)
[00:53] <bryce> ATI put out their stuff not because of goodwill or because they valued the community, but rather because if they hadn't, they were worried they'd lose some of their big corporate/government customers that were demanding availability of open source drivers in their bid requirements
[00:54] <bryce> (ATI/AMD was very clear on this point at XDS)
[00:56] <pcjc2> All companies are in it for the money
[00:56] <pcjc2> Even Canonical presumably has to make some ;)
[00:57] <pcjc2> (Dumb question... where are Canonical based (globally?)
[00:58] <bryce> UK basically
[00:58] <bryce> employees are scattered hither and thither.  I'm in Portland Oregon
[00:58] <pcjc2> I thought UK, but didn't know why
[00:59] <bryce> the main offices and the data center are there in London
[00:59] <bryce> most of management is in england.
[00:59] <bryce> the official business address is Isle of Man
[00:59] <pcjc2> tax reasons probably ;)
[00:59]  * bryce nods
[01:00] <pcjc2> I wonder if anyone has any 855 based hardware sitting available for testing (or do Canonical not have "central" hardware available for testing
[01:00] <bryce> canonical is for profit, but the business model centers around service rather than product sales
[01:00] <pcjc2> seems eminently sensible... shame we're all SuSE at the University
[01:00] <bryce> if you can do the testing remotely, we can probably get you hooked up with a machien with 855 in it
[01:01] <pcjc2> would much rather not have to package two sets of all the electronics packages we do!
[01:01] <bryce> which uni?
[01:01] <pcjc2> I'll keep it in mind.. although really, I'd be wanting to watch the screen and poke with GDB
[01:01] <pcjc2> Cambridge, (sorry, assumed you'd see from my email address)
[01:02] <bryce> well, tell you what - Chris Jones, who reported bug 13311, is one of Canonical's system administrators
[01:02] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 13311 in gftp "FTBFS: compile errors" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/13311
[01:02] <pcjc2> I'm a 2nd yr Electronic Engineering student
[01:02] <bryce> he would be the key guy to get you access to an 855 machine, particularly if you would be working to get a fix for that bug
[01:02] <bryce> ahh awesome
[01:03] <pcjc2> I chat to Matthew Garrett often (usually when I find a bug... its almost always some area he knows about ;), althoug
[01:03] <pcjc2> h we've never met
[01:03] <bryce> cambridge england or mass?
[01:04] <bryce> oh duh, nevermind :-)
[01:04] <bryce> I was at cambridge a few weeks ago myself for XDS
[01:04] <pcjc2> (England's same as Garrett). I'm a 2nd year PhD student working on marine renewables.. and secretly wondering if a job in programming would be better
[01:04] <bryce> beautiful town
[01:04] <pcjc2> I was kicking myself that I missed that. Saw the info on the xorg page, then saw it had already passed
[01:04] <bryce> yeah he's a huge resource
[01:05] <bryce> Colin Watson (my supervisor) is also in the Cambridge area
[01:05] <pcjc2> so Canonical is quite distributed ;)
[01:06] <pcjc2> How did you come to Canonical? (If you're the same Bryce... you founded Inkscape?)
[01:06] <bryce> yup, that's I
[01:07] <pcjc2> cool (I'm not artistic, but Inkscape is a tool I keep handy for vector graphics)
[01:07] <bryce> I used to work for a company called OSDL in Portland, doing kernel and nfsv4 testing, and working on Inkscape and tinkering with X/Cairo on the side
[01:07] <bryce> Kees Cook and Brian Murray also worked there with me
[01:07] <pcjc2> Do you do the VNC packages as part of X in Ubuntu?
[01:07] <bryce> Kees was in IT there, but was much more interested in security work, and he was absolutely enamoured with ubuntu (brian and I were into gentoo at the time)
[01:07] <pcjc2> That was my first dive into the X code, trying to fix some horrid bugs in that. RealVNC were very unhelpful
[01:08] <bryce> so when a security position opened with canonical he went for it
[01:08] <bryce> I heard such good things that I converted to ubuntu as well, liked it, and also followed him over to Canonical
[01:08] <bryce> I haven't touched any of the VNC stuff myself
[01:09] <bryce> it's possible that's an area I need to get into, but haven't had any pulls to work on it so far
[01:09] <pcjc2> I wanted to setup thin clienting nicely, and got looking at the GDM work done by various people
[01:10] <pcjc2> Either using VNC + some extensions (hacks) to allow re-negotiation and hot swapping of the server after authentication..
[01:11] <pcjc2> hit lots of VNC bugs (mostly all solved, or worked around now), I looked at XDMX and various X forwarding (but got stuck with XLib insisting on aborting if the client disconnects uncleanly)
[01:12] <pcjc2> XCB was mentioned as a possible way around it, but in the end.. no time.
[01:14]  * bryce nods
[01:16] <bryce> hmm, when I was at OSDL we had a nice collection remotely accessible test machines that OS devs could log into and do stuff.  I wonder how hard it'd be for me to recreate that.
[01:18] <pcjc2> would have to have gutsy like environment
[01:18] <pcjc2> and a remote poking switch for when the GPU locks up
[01:19] <pcjc2> Unfortunately, its not really clear how to test this most effectivey... the machines are usable when they corrupt the display - just you have to guess where things are.
[01:19] <bryce> yeah, we had remotely addressable power control bars that worked wonderfully for restarting after kernel lockups
[01:19] <bryce> also since they were servers we had good serial consoles for capturing oops and the like
[01:19] <bryce> but not X so much
[01:19] <pcjc2> So without a webcam pointing at the screen, its probably not all that useful
[01:20] <pcjc2> Also... if you get nasty timings to an LCD panel, it can destroy it
[01:20] <bryce> mmm, a webcam would be doable
[01:20] <pcjc2> many of the driver chips seem to have some protection in them, but I've managed to get this machine here into a state which I was very unhappy until I'd pulled the plug
[01:21] <pcjc2> (You get a creeping propogation of green across the LCD which seems more a manifestation of very bad drive signals to the LCD its self, rather than just display corruption).
[01:25] <pcjc2> Is Chris Jones based in London?
[01:26] <bryce> yeah i think so
[01:26] <pcjc2> ok, so if necessary, not too far away
[01:26] <pcjc2> I'm sure I'll be able to find some hardware
[01:26] <bryce> yup, hes in Catford Bridge, London
[01:26] <pcjc2> I already dug through a pile of old laptops here (mostly broken some way or other), and have been round obvious friends
[02:28] <pcjc2> night!
[03:16] <ubotu> New bug: #153782 in xorg (main) "[Gutsy] screen doesn't resume after suspend" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153782
[05:01] <ubotu> New bug: #153797 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.22 (restricted) "Fails to resume when using Nvidia-glx or Nvidia-glx-new" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153797
[11:32] <ubotu> New bug: #153818 in xorg (main) "Visual Effects can not be enabled on Santa Rosa" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153818
[13:10] <ubotu> New bug: #153873 in xserver-xorg-driver-savage (main) "Freeze on visuals in Rhythmbox with savage drivver" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153873
[14:17] <ubotu> New bug: #151439 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.22 (restricted) "Constant "banding" and other visual artifacts in gusty on nvidia GeForce 4 MX" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/151439
[16:16] <ubotu> New bug: #153936 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (main) "Bad screen size using external monitor" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153936
[17:16] <ubotu> New bug: #118808 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.22 "Unable to reach C3/C4 states while wireless is up." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/118808
[17:23] <pcjc2> Question.... anyone know why the Intel X driver isn't appearing to see suspend events from ACPI?
[17:23] <pcjc2> It has a hook, but output I've added there doesn't print to the log
[17:35] <ubotu> New bug: #153971 in xserver-xorg-video-ati (main) "Black Screen: Radeon X1300, Gutsy, AMD64, and fglrx." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153971
[17:36] <pcjc2> never mind... I see those are only had via APM, we don't have hooks for suspend / resume with ACPI
[18:25] <ubotu> New bug: #153986 in xorg (main) "GL screensavers crash the X server" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153986
[19:05] <bryce> morning
[19:07] <tepsipakki> bryce: morning? you've slept well, eh? :)
[19:08] <bryce> yup.  was up late triaging bugs last night
[19:08] <bryce> and a little docs writing
[19:30] <ubotu> New bug: #154007 in xorg (main) "(bulletproofX) failsafe X doesn't work very well on my Thinkpad T61p laptop with an Nvidia chipset" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/154007
[19:50] <tepsipakki> bryce: oh, didn't notice the post on the ml before
[19:50] <tepsipakki> I'll check it out later
[19:57] <bryce> thanks
[19:58] <bryce> I hope it's not so long that no one reads it...  maybe it could be condensed better
[20:20] <Q-FUNK> yippee!
[20:23] <bryce> heya
[20:24] <bryce> Q-FUNK: I don't know if you're on the ubuntu-x@ list, but I posted a new "Bug Research Guide" doc to it this morning.  Love to get some feedback on it.
[20:24] <Q-FUNK> ah, no, i'm not
[20:28] <Q-FUNK> hmm... is anybody here available for a short paying gig to upgrade -amd to sync with the current X core (including RandR 1.2)?
[20:30] <bryce> Have you thought about asking Alex Deucher?
[20:33] <Q-FUNK> you think he could be interested?
[20:42] <bryce> dunno, but it's possible
[20:43] <bryce> his day job is not X related, so I think he might like gigs to work on X stuff.  I think he's done it in the past
[20:43] <bryce> in any case, he and Jesse are the two with the most experience adding xrandr 1.2 support to drivers
[20:43] <bryce> and jesse probably can't do it since he's working for Intel
[20:44] <bryce> alex might prefer to wait until -ati 6.8 is out or something, but couldn't hurt to ask
[20:44] <bryce> heya tormod!
[20:47] <bryce> tormod, I don't remember if you're on ubuntu-x but I posted a first draft of a 'Bug Research Guide' doc.  Would love to get feedback.
[20:47] <bryce> I'm planning on doing some major update of X resources on our wiki.
[20:47] <bryce> we didn't have much about how to research bugs, which is why I started there.
[21:08] <tormod> hi bryce! yes I saw the posting but didn't read in detail.
[21:08] <bryce> ah, too long?
[21:08] <tormod> yes :)
[21:09] <tormod> I feel there's a need for a step-by-step guide for people submitting bugs.
[21:10] <bryce> I also have a "Reporting Bugs" section that precedes this one, but decided to post just this one for comments first, to avoid posting too much reading material at once
[21:10] <tormod> Like: we need to know what card: lspci -vvnn. Which driver (file right). log files. etc
[21:10]  * bryce nods
[21:11] <tormod> I guess people actually triaging have good debugging knowledge anyway. But of course documentation is always good.
[21:11] <bryce> I break it down by problem class.  i.e., bad resolution bugs need these files, crashes need these, bad dpi issues need these, video playback need ...
[21:11]  * tormod looks up that post
[21:12] <bryce> I'm thinking more about people who are new to triaging, to help them get up to speed
[21:12] <jcristau> for pretty much everything you need config and log anyway; hence the stuff in /usr/share/bug.
[21:12] <bryce> but I want to make sure I have the right info (and not too much of it, that makes their eyes just glaze over *grin*)
[21:12] <jcristau> hi, congrats on the release btw :)
[21:13] <bryce> heya jcristau, thanks
[21:13] <bryce> yeah I thought about setting up a bittorrent to help with the bandwidth, but I couldn't even download the .torrent!
[21:15] <tormod> bryce, yeah I found your Bug Research a little word-heavy. started reading and thought: this is just common sense. then I see there are good pieces in there. But will people read it? :)
[21:16] <tormod> I don't want to sound discouraging :)
[21:18] <tormod> we really need a little check list for bug submitters, that pops up automatically when they file bugs on *xorg*
[21:19] <tormod> I am getting bored by asking the same questions when triaging bugs, even if I cut and paste.
[21:19] <tormod> launchpad should refuse bug reports without Xorg.0.log :)
[21:20]  * bryce nods
[21:27] <tepsipakki> launchpad really should tell the reporter to attach those files, or could it do it on behalf of the reporter (like bug-buddy does)?
[21:28] <bryce> many of our bugs come initially filed against ubuntu, and triagers move them to xorg, so that wouldn't help
[21:36] <tepsipakki> right
[21:46] <bryce> I've posted the list of required files/data I came up with
[21:48] <tepsipakki> looks good
[21:49] <tepsipakki> also, one of the first things upstream tends to ask people to test is disabling DRI
[21:49] <bryce> ok
[21:49] <tepsipakki> maybe that could be mentioned on the display corruption class?
[21:50] <bryce> or should I have a separate section (preliminary things to try out)?
[21:50] <tepsipakki> perhaps yes
[21:50] <bryce> I'll do both
[22:06] <tormod> bryce: I wrote a Bugs page for ati once, now outdated: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/AtiDriver maybe there are some ideas
[22:07] <ubotu> New bug: #40667 in xserver-xorg-video-trident (main) "Doesn't correctly support dpms" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/40667
[22:07] <ubotu> New bug: #46796 in xserver-xorg-video-trident (main) "Totem-xine uses 100% cpu" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/46796
[22:09] <tormod> suggestion re your new post: paste in lspci --vvnn|grep "VGA comp" and attach as file the output of lspci --vvnn
[22:11] <immoT-> Ubuntu gutsy xserver donesn't start (trident). No errors in log file.!
[22:12] <tepsipakki> immoT-: still no bug report ;)
[22:21] <tormod> http://wiki.debian.org/XStrikeForce is getting some nice documentation, for instance xrandr12 and debugging-server-crash. Maybe we should coordinate better the documentation between Debian and Ubuntu? Of course the launchpad and triaging stuff would be Ubuntu specific, but debugging and bug report contents would be the same.
[22:22] <immoT-> tepsipakki: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-trident/+bug/154069
[22:22] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 154069 in xserver-xorg-video-trident "Ubuntu freezing with toshiba laptop" [Undecided,New]
[22:23] <tormod> I started contributing to Ubuntu docs because it was more anarchistic and easy to just do it in Ubuntu, but I have heard rumours that Debian is gonna be fun again?
[22:23] <tepsipakki> immoT-: you could attach xorg.conf and Xorg.0.log to that bug
[22:23] <tepsipakki> s/could/should/
[22:25] <immoT-> I can't use copypaste with lynx/commandline
[22:26] <tormod> there used to be a thing to use mouse and copy/paste in a text console - gpt (?)
[22:27] <tormod> anyway, you can attach files with lynx as far as I can remember.
[22:28] <immoT-> ok, trying tomorrow
[22:28] <tepsipakki> hm, I was just testing lynx
[22:29] <tepsipakki> I wonder if mail attachments are now added to the bug
[22:30] <ubotu> New bug: #154069 in xserver-xorg-video-trident (main) "Ubuntu freezing with toshiba laptop" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/154069
[22:38] <bryce> tormod: ok I'll take a look
[22:39] <jcristau> tormod: debian? fun? that can't be true!
[22:39] <tepsipakki> :)
[22:40] <tormod> jcristau: yeah I was hoping you would comment on that :)
[22:40] <ubotu> New bug: #154046 in xorg (main) "black screen after upgrade to gutsy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/154046
[23:03] <ubotu> New bug: #153977 in xorg (main) "Unable to use external monitor on laptop" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153977
[23:12] <ubotu> New bug: #153952 in xserver-xorg-video-nv (main) "Gutsy boot failure" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153952
[23:21] <tormod> good night


[01:14] <smoser> hey, wonder if someone could take a look: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1628336
[01:14] <smoser> seems regression in 4.8