[07:07] <jdub> hey, if cliff's splash is good, that might be a worth bg for the xss lock dialogue
[07:08] <seb128> infinity: like 1 week ago
[07:08] <ogra> infinity, when sabdfl asked for it
[07:08] <infinity> Wow, I'm observant.
[07:08] <infinity> The clutter annoys me.  Oh well.
[07:08] <jdub> infinity: pay close attention! i'll take your brain to another dimension!
[07:08] <mvo> infinity: what ogra said
[07:08] <zyga> mvo: hey, did you get my message about synaptic?
[07:08] <mvo> zyga: which one?
[07:08] <ogra> jdub, its black... not a good iea for the lock dialogue
[07:08] <seb128> infinity: edit /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu if you want to drop it
[07:09] <ogra> idea even
[07:09] <jdub> ogra: the gnome splash
[07:09] <zyga> mvo: about missing 'restricted' section
[07:09] <ogra> oh, we have a new one ?
[07:09] <jdub> we will
[07:09] <mx|gone> is there a reason that "search & indexing" is in "Accessories" and "Preferences"?
[07:09] <infinity> seb128 : Yeah, I know how to move it, I just disagree with the default.  Oh well, can't please everyone.
[07:09] <mvo> zyga: hm, no. when did you send it?
[07:10] <ogra> jdub, actually the gss discussion started with sabdfl saying that cliff should put the lock pic on his todo list
[07:10] <zyga> mvo: ah, it was here on #u-d
[07:10] <jdub> ah, ok, no one told me :)
[07:10] <zyga> mvo: the short story: missing 'restricted' section
[07:10] <zyga> mvo: the long story: string-freeze ;]
[07:10] <mvo> zyga: can you /msg me the details?
[07:10] <ogra> jdub, so we should forward that request to him once sabdfl approved the switch back
[07:10] <zyga> sure
[07:11] <jdub> ogra: i'll mention it anyway (mdz switched u-m anyway)
[07:11] <ogra> yup
[07:11] <mdz> Kamion: no, I do not update it in a commit hook
[07:11] <ogra> oh, that reminds me, i need to switch edubuntu-meta...
[07:11] <mdz> morning all
[07:11] <ogra> morning mdz
[07:12] <WaterSevenUb> mvo, will u be able tu upload the .desktop files I sent you soon? :-)
[07:12] <mx|gone> is there a "Ubuntu Weekly News"?
[07:12] <mdz> Kamion: I prefer not to have commits to a local archive be dependent on ssh connections to rookery
[07:12] <jdub> mx|gone: not atm
[07:12] <ogra> mx|gone, ubuntu taraffic ... but thats rather monthly and far behind
[07:13] <ogra> traffic too...
[07:13] <mvo> WaterSevenUb: I think so :)
[07:13] <jdub> meanwhile
[07:13] <jdub> *cough*
[07:13] <jdub> http://fridge.ubuntu.com/
[07:13] <jdub> *cough*
[07:13] <jdub> ssshhh :-)
[07:13] <ogra> FRIDGE !
[07:13] <seb128> hi mdz
[07:13] <jdub> mx|gone: keep your eye on that site :)
[07:13] <ogra> whaa, how do i get rid of the fish on my desktop now ?
[07:14] <mx|gone> jdub: thanks :)
[07:14] <ogra> jdub, where is the coke logo ?
[07:14] <jdub> heh
[07:14] <ogra> :)
[07:14] <jdub> that site was so annoying to see :-)
[07:14] <ogra> yup... they advertise it on tv every night here
[07:15] <ogra> hahaha, if you click the fish it flees :)
[07:15] <Kamion> mdz: commit hooks do not have that effect
[07:16] <mdz> Kamion: can you give me the one-liner?
[07:16] <Kamion> mdz: I do basically 'case $1 in commit|import|tag) baz archive-mirror -a "$ARCH_ARCHIVE" "$(baz parse-package-name --package-version "$ARCH_REVISION")" ;; esac' in .arch-params/hook, and it just gives me an error when it can't talk to rookery, but otherwise commits fine
[07:17] <mdz> Kamion: an error, or a timeout followed by an error?
[07:17] <mdz> I suppose I could fork it into the background
[07:17] <Kamion> oh, it might timeout. easy enough to ctrl-c though, baz doesn't care at that point
[07:17] <Kamion> it's already done the actual commit
[07:17] <mdz> I don't want it to block
[07:18] <Kamion> hmm, I generally don't care
[07:18] <pitti> mdz: you could do a ping -c 1 before
[07:18] <Kamion> I'll ctrl-c it if it bothers me
[07:19] <mdz> Kamion: anyway, mirror updated now
[07:19] <mdz> updating, even
[07:19] <Kamion> ta
[07:19] <Kamion> I have a quick gnome-screensaver fix for you - not that it matters for breezy now, but it'll matter later
[07:20] <ogra> Kamion, ?
[07:20] <Kamion> ogra: for casper. gconftool-2 needs to be run as the ubuntu user not as root
[07:20] <ogra> yup
[07:20] <ogra> since its for the session...
[07:20] <ogra> didnt i mention that ?
[07:21] <Kamion> in fact that also applies to gnome-panel-data
[07:22] <Amaranth> "In addition, some regressions introduced by previous 1.0.x security updates have been resolved."
[07:22] <Amaranth> 1.0.7 looks useful if anyone is still having problems
[07:22] <Amaranth> with firefox, that is
[07:22] <pitti> Amaranth: we will get it soon, I hope
[07:23] <infinity> pitti : Did I just hear you volunteering?
[07:23] <pitti> infinity: I hoped to bribe Diziet somehow
[07:23] <Kamion> mdz<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[07:24] <pitti> infinity: I can do it of course, but that will mean another day of updates
[07:24] <infinity> pitti : Does 1.0.7 have any security updates you haven't already backported?
[07:24] <mdz> Kamion: what broke this?
[07:24] <mdz> it used to work
[07:25] <Kamion> mdz: really? strange, I don't think it's new behaviour on gconftool-2's part, and the behaviour makes perfect sense
[07:25] <Kamion> I haven't tested the gnome-panel-data change; I have tested the gnome-screensaver change (since today's live CD happens to have gnome-screensaver on it still)
[07:25] <ogra> Kamion, it depends _where_ you set it...
[07:25] <Kamion>     su ubuntu 'gconftool-2 -t bool -s /apps/panel/global/disable_lock_screen true'
[07:25] <ogra> you can set it in a global schema dir as root
[07:25] <Kamion> hmm
[07:26] <Kamion> maybe that change was wrong then
[07:26] <ogra> or set it with no schema dir as the user
[07:26] <mdz> Kamion: oh, I thought you were talking about the gnome-panel-data bit
[07:26] <ogra> mdz, same prob
[07:27] <jdub> it's probably worthwhile doing those as schema changes
[07:27] <Kamion> ok, gnome-panel-data bit reverted, it's already dealing with a schema change
[07:27] <Kamion>     su ubuntu 'gconftool-2 -t bool -s /apps/gnome-screensaver/lock false'
[07:27] <ogra> jdub, and have no loc icon in the menu ?
[07:27] <Kamion> so should that be gconftool-2 -t bool -s /apps/gnome-screensaver/global/lock false?
[07:27] <ogra> lock
[07:27] <ogra> nope, wait a sec
[07:29] <ogra> gconftool-2 --direct --config-source xml:readwrite:/usr/share/gconf/local.default --type bool --set /apps/gnome-screensaver/global/lock false > /dev/null
[07:29] <ogra> err
[07:29] <ogra> local.defaults
[07:29] <ogra> run that as root...
[07:30] <Kamion> ew
[07:31] <ogra> and kill -HUP `pidof gconfd-2` afterwards if gconfd is alredy running
[07:32] <jdub> night all :-)
[07:32] <ogra> nigh jdub
[07:32] <Kamion> seems like we might as well just run gconftool-2 as the user and then we can just leave the gconfd around
[07:33] <Kamion> as well as not having the nasty path hardcoding
[07:33] <ogra> i'm not sure if you can go without the HUP... seb128 `
[07:33] <ogra> ?
[07:33] <Kamion> this is running in casper, gconfd won't be running yet
[07:33] <ogra> ah, ok
[07:33] <ogra> then you can ignore it anyway
[07:34] <ogra> but thats the default location for sysadmin settings
[07:34] <ogra> so the right place to do such things
[07:34] <Kamion> gconftool doesn't start gconfd itself, does it?
[07:34] <ogra> it shouldnt...
[07:34] <Kamion> ok
[07:35] <Kamion> so how does 'gconftool-2 -t bool -s /apps/panel/global/disable_lock_screen true' work without the --config-source stuff?
[07:35] <seb128> ogra: what?
[07:35] <Kamion> and without --direct for that matter
[07:35] <ogra> seb128, do you need the -HUP for gconfd as a user ?
[07:35] <dholbach> seb128: you wrote me some emails - that's SOOOO nice of you :)
[07:36] <seb128> SIGHUP reload the base if you change some schema
[07:36] <seb128> dholbach: yeah :)
[07:36] <ogra> Kamion, it uses the .gconfd dir in the users home
[07:37] <Kamion> that being root in this case
[07:37] <ogra> hmm...
[07:37] <ogra> so rather set it in the sysadmin schema dir...
[07:39] <ogra> Kamion, see the contents of /etc/gconf/2/path
[07:46] <mvo> Keybuk: now that you told us how to get wanda the fish, do you also know how to get rid of it again :P?
[07:47] <Keybuk> mvo: pkill gnome-panel
[07:47] <Keybuk> :p
[07:47] <mvo> Keybuk: lol
[07:51] <Kamion> hmm, well something broke there, a bunch of stuff died on desktop startup
[07:51] <Kamion> I give up, don't have time for this
[07:53] <ogra> Kamion, my first command didnt work for you ?
[07:56] <Kamion> ogra: I don't know exactly what broke, and I don't have time to debug it
[07:56] <Kamion> since it was only for when we're using gnome-screensaver in the future
[07:57] <ogra> Kamion, the command i gave you should work out of the box, its the way to set gconf keys... you will also need it for the lock entry in the panel menu (thats not gss dependant)
[07:58] <Kamion> like I say, I don't have time. sorry. if you want to debug it, feel free
[07:59] <ogra> oki
[08:04] <jbailey> Is there a reasonable way to ask debuild to wrap all calls in linux32 from a configuration file?
[08:05] <infinity> Just call debuild with linux32, all subprocesses of linux32 should remain linux32'd (if the kernel is correct and sane)
[08:06] <jbailey> Right, but I keep forgetting and then having to track down why things suddenly broke on me.
[08:06] <jbailey> debulid is kind enouhg to call fakeroot for me, I'm hoping I can overload the mechanism to call linux32 as well
[08:07] <Kamion> that mechanism only applies to gain-root stuff at the moment
[08:07] <Kamion> I don't think it's there for all external commands
[08:08] <infinity> alias debuild='linux32 debuild' :)
[08:08] <jbailey> Ooo, good call.
[08:08] <infinity> (Might make it hard to linux64 it again later, but whatever)
[08:08] <jbailey> I use 'db' for my one with ccache, I'll just tweak that one.
[08:09] <jbailey> much better, thanks. =)
[08:09] <infinity> You have an alias to use ccache?
[08:10] <infinity> I just toss gcc* links in ~/bin
[08:10] <jbailey> I add a -e PATH=
[08:10] <jbailey> I don't keep ~/bin in my path
[08:10] <infinity> Which works great, as they're followed in chroots where ccache is installed, ignored in ones where they're dead links.
[08:10] <infinity> Ahh.
[08:11] <fabbione> mdz: ping?
[08:11] <elmo> I just export PATH=/usr/lib/ccache:$PATH
[08:11] <mdz> fabbione: ?
[08:11] <infinity> elmo : Oh, neat, I didn't know that link farm existed.
[08:12] <fabbione> mdz: yo.. out of curiosity,, do you have any plan to uplaod mythplugins to breezy? (0.18)
[08:12] <fabbione> mdz: as it is now they are not installable
[08:12] <infinity> fabbione : I asked the same thing a while ago, and he tried to rope me into comaintenance to fix it. :)
[08:12] <fabbione> infinity: i am ok with that :)
[08:13] <fabbione> mdz: i don't mind to spend time to understand how it works
[08:13] <fabbione> mdz: i started installing my first mythtv box today :)
[08:13] <fabbione> ogra: mdz maintains them officially :)
[08:13] <ogra> yup
[08:13] <ogra> thats what i told the guy
[08:13] <fabbione> ogra: why -motu when you can bitch^Wask the real guy :)
[08:14] <dholbach> fabbione: i'm working on the apt-get.org review - i will simply skip your repository, right? :)
[08:14] <ogra> fabbione, the guy wanting them came there :)
[08:14] <fabbione> dholbach: yes skip it 100%
[08:14] <dholbach> done
[08:14] <fabbione> dholbach: including mirrors
[08:14] <fabbione> i hope to get the archive running again for dapper/sid
[08:16] <mjg59> Keybuk: #15979?
[08:17] <Keybuk> mjg59: yup?
[08:17] <Keybuk> probably fixed by 14
[08:17] <mjg59> Keybuk: Ok
[08:17] <mjg59> Keybuk: Can you take it off me?
[08:18] <Keybuk> done
[08:19] <mjg59> Ta
[08:22] <fabbione> elmo: ping?
[08:22] <Mithrandir> doko: no, they second ubuntu is needed too
[08:25] <elmo> fabbione: ?
[08:27] <pitti> mjg59: btw, did you get my /msg about the pbbuttonsd patch?
[08:30] <mjg59> pitti: Yes, but I can't /msg you back because freenode is stupid
[08:31] <ogra> mjg59, youre not registered ?
[08:34] <guerby> jbailey, hi (again :) I can't find the thread about openssh-server install choice on ubuntu-devel, do you remember the subject line?
[08:34] <jbailey> guerby: Oh, hmm.  Maybe I'm confused and am thinking of the xscreensaver post instead.
[08:35] <guerby> jbailey, are the minutes of TB meeting somewhere on the web? (I'm new to ubuntu process :)
[08:35] <jbailey> guerby: The verbatum log from the channel is.  It's held in #ubuntu-meeting every other Tuesday.
[08:35] <jbailey> I'm just looking for them right now. =)
[08:36] <jcohen85> does anyone else notice that Breezy takes 10-15 seconds longer than hoary to boot up to a useable gnome screen? Before going to the splash screen there's a 15 second delay v. perhaps 5 seconds in hoary before it continued in the boot process. I'm running on an AMD 3000+ with 512 MB of PC3200 DDR. Hoary took 55 seconds to boot up to a useable state and Breezy takes 1:08 or so
[08:36] <jbailey> guerby: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/ubuntu-meeting-2005-09-20.html
[08:37] <jbailey> Now I just need to find the right part.
[08:37] <jbailey> jcohen85: 15 seconds before the splash screen comes up seems a bit high.
[08:37] <ogra> guerby, the meeting was yesterday, the log url is in the topic of #ubunut-meeting
[08:37] <jbailey> jcohen85: Do you mean from when grub stops counting?
[08:37] <ogra> oh... to slow :)
[08:37] <jcohen85> jbailey, no, from the time i select 2.6.12-8-686 in grub to the time the splash screen comes up
[08:38] <jcohen85> jbailey, i'm running on a AMD 64 3000+
[08:38] <jbailey> jcohen85: That really seems way high
[08:38] <jbailey> On an amd64 here, it's more like 1 second or two tops.
[08:38] <jcohen85> that's basically why it takes 15 seconds longer to boot up
[08:38] <dholbach> ogra: you don't restart your box twice in a year
[08:38] <jbailey> guerby: Hmm. I see mdz mentioning a web poll, I thought that it got posted to ubuntu-devel, but I'm clearly wrong. =)
[08:38] <guerby> jbailey, "10:30	pitti	maybe default packages in server install? (openssh-server) 10:31	Keybuk	let's wait until jeff's customer turns up to defend that"
[08:39] <ogra> dholbach, i did this morning :)
[08:39] <dholbach> oh wow
[08:39] <jbailey> guerby: The discussion continues from there, though.
[08:39] <jcohen85> jbailey, i also can't use 2.6.12-8-386 yet because of the /init 0x kernel panic which i posted as a bug on bugzilla
[08:39] <jbailey> jcohen85: that bug is fixed now.
[08:39] <jbailey> jcohen85: Are you still seeing it?
[08:40] <guerby> jbailey, yes thanks (looks like I'm not alone "sivang	I always get annoyed seeing it was not already installed when installing a new server")
[08:40] <mjg59> ogra: No
[08:40] <jcohen85> jbailey, i posted that i ran dpkg-reconfigure linux-image-2.6.12-3-386 TWICE and the problem is still there
[08:40] <jbailey> Did you mean -8-386 ?
[08:40] <jcohen85> jbailey, i just tried purging the kernel and re-installing it
[08:40] <jcohen85> jbailey, yeah, 2.6.12-8-386...and it showed the new .img files being created etc.
[08:41] <ogra> mjg59, thast your prob then :) freenode had a heavy spambot attack that made IRC lients explode due to opened PM windows...
[08:41] <jcohen85> jbailey, so, what would cause the long delay?
[08:41] <jbailey> jcohen85: Can you put your /boot/initrd.img-2.6.12-8-386 somewhere I can find it?
[08:41] <mjg59> ogra: Yes, I know. Hence "I can't /msg you back because freenode is stupid"
[08:41] <ogra> mjg59, just register :)
[08:41] <jcohen85> jbailey, sure- but first let me try to restart and see if the purge & re-install worked
[08:41] <jbailey> jcohen85: I'd love to work with you on checking out the delay after, too.
[08:42] <jcohen85> great- i'll be right back
[08:42] <jbailey> guerby: Right.  So it's in the 'need more info to decide this' phase.
[08:42] <guerby> jbailey, ok I'll wait for the poll :)
[08:43] <mjg59> ogra: No
[08:43] <guerby> jbailey, BTW I don't mind if it's not done in breezy because of freeze issues, etc... as long as it's considered for long term
[08:43] <guerby> jbailey, thanks for your help :)
[08:44] <jbailey> guerby: Cool.  The best bet is probably to poke your head in for the TB meeting in a couple weeks (assuming it happens. Sometimes they got dropped around freeze/release times)
[08:45] <jbailey> jcohen85: and? =)
[08:45] <jcohen85> jbailey, the purge & re-install worked
[08:45] <jbailey> 'kay
[08:45] <jcohen85> so my 386 kernel works fine
[08:45] <jbailey> \o/
[08:45] <jcohen85> but i'm still having the 15 sec delay
[08:46] <jbailey> On both of them?
[08:46] <jcohen85> yup
[08:46] <jbailey> What type of HDD (ide, scsi, sata, usb, etc?)
[08:46] <jcohen85> IDE seagate 160 GB
[08:46] <jbailey> locally connected?
[08:47] <jcohen85> yes
[08:47] <jbailey> One harddrive, so no md?
[08:47] <jcohen85> md?
[08:47] <infinity> RAID.
[08:48] <ogra> ... software driven
[08:48] <jcohen85> yeah- no. it's a locally connected internal IDE drive
[08:48] <jcohen85> and no RAID or LVM
[08:48] <jbailey> jcohen85: evms?
[08:48] <jbailey> (If you don't know what it is, then probably no. *g*)
[08:48] <jcohen85> no, heh
[08:49] <jcohen85> enterprise volume management system?
[08:49] <jbailey> Yup
[08:49] <infinity> You get a cookie.
[08:49] <jbailey> Pitty it's an HTTP one...
[08:49] <jcohen85> just plain ext3 partitions
[08:49] <jcohen85> one for / and one for /home
[08:49] <jbailey> Well, there go all the things that usually slow the boot down.
[08:49] <jbailey> After that the only that that runs is the depmod.
[08:49] <jcohen85> the rest of the boot process is fast
[08:50] <jbailey> Is this your only computer?
[08:50] <jcohen85> no
[08:50] <jbailey> Or is there another one you can IRC from handy?
[08:50] <infinity> Some driver/module that's taking forever to insert?
[08:50] <jbailey> infinity: Do they do that?
[08:50] <jcohen85> i also turned off bluez-utils, fetchmail, hplip, postfix, ppp, rsync, and webmin
[08:50] <ogra> did our kernel image grow this much that it takes longer to decompress now ?
[08:50] <infinity> I don't know.  Does modprobe block?
[08:50] <jbailey> I didn't think insmod heald for driver initialisation.
[08:50] <infinity> Err, insmod, right, you're low-level.
[08:50] <infinity> (ish)
[08:51] <jbailey> Well, modprobe I think just calls out to insmod.
[08:51] <jbailey> I wind up using both in places.
[08:51] <jbailey> modprobe is shiny.
[08:51] <jbailey> It handles deps for me.
[08:51] <infinity> Indeed. :
[08:51] <infinity> )
[08:51] <pitti> mjg59: ah, I suspected something like this; yay IRC
[08:51] <jcohen85> unfortunately my debian system isn't booting up...problably a hardware issue caused from shipping. it just sits at some point in the boot process with no error
[08:52] <jbailey> jcohen85: Y'know, we have a solution for other OSs that won't start up here...
[08:52] <ogra> err, is modprobe run before usplash appears ? i thought thats only the uncompression of the image that happens at this stage
[08:52] <jbailey> =)
[08:52] <jbailey> ogra: depmod -a is run.
[08:52] <ogra> ah, ok
[08:52] <jbailey> Hmm.
[08:52] <jbailey> We might actually walk the bus first too, I don't remember.
[08:52] <jcohen85> jbailey, so, what should i do?
[08:53] <jbailey> format the debian box^UWell, I need to be able to talk you through walkinmg thruogh the initramfs.
[08:53] <jbailey> Or you'll be staring at information without me able to get it from you.
[08:53] <mpt> Does anyone know the status of the new icons scheduled for Breezy, and/or the status of AndyFitz?
[08:53] <jcohen85> jbailey, i spent days setting up the debian box with mythtv and a 500 GB LVM with 2 tv tuners...i don't want to format it
[08:53] <jbailey> Ah =)
[08:54] <jbailey> I keep hearing about mythtv, one day I should spend some time with google to figure out what it is.
[08:54] <jcohen85> mythtv.org
[08:54] <infinity> jbailey : It's looking for new comaintainers in Debian/Ubuntu, that's what it is.
[08:54] <Keybuk> mpt: I think he's available, didn't realise he was your type <g>
[08:54] <jcohen85> the problem is that i have no way to fix the problem since it silently fails- it just stops after setting up bttv
[08:55] <carl> is bugzilla.ubuntu.com mia, or did I forget the URL?
[08:55] <jcohen85> jbailey, would you like to know how long it takes to get by the decompression stage in 2.6.10?
[08:55] <jbailey> decompression stage?
[08:55] <Keybuk> carl: wfm
[08:56] <jbailey> If you're using 2.6.10, there was nothing to decompress.  grub did it for you.
[08:56] <jcohen85> oh, ok
[08:56] <carl> Wait a Fine Minute?
[08:56] <jbailey> Is it pausing on a line that mentions decompression?
[08:56] <Keybuk> carl: works for me
[08:56] <Kamion> carl: "works for me"
[08:56] <ogra> carl, "works for me"
[08:56] <carl> oh yeah...
[08:57] <carl> ping: unknown host bugzilla.ubuntu.com
[08:57] <carl> #@$@#
[08:57] <ogra> fix your dns :)
[08:57] <jcohen85> jbailey, i'm saying there's 15 seconds between grub and the splash screen whereas in hoary there was only a very short delay before loading modules & processes...maybe 2-3 seconds
[08:57] <jbailey> jcohen85: Right, and during those 15 seconds, what's happening on your screen?
[08:58] <jbailey> Is it sitting on one line?  Walking through them slowly
[08:58] <jbailey> ?
[08:58] <jbailey> It is probably best to remove the wrod 'quiet' from the kernel command line for that test.
[08:58] <jcohen85> jbailey, nothing...it just sits there saying "decompresisng kernel" i think
[08:58] <jcohen85> i would have to go back and check for sure
[08:58] <jbailey> If you could please.
[08:58] <jcohen85> it's sitting on one line..doing nothing
[08:58] <jcohen85> once the splash screen comes up everything goes by quickly
[08:58] <jbailey> But do it without the 'quiet' line on the command line.
[08:59] <jbailey> Then I need the last couple of lines before it pauses.
[08:59] <jcohen85> oh, and btw- after i install a kernel, it removes my xp grub entry
[08:59] <jcohen85> ok, i'll brb
[08:59] <jbailey> jcohen85: Make sure you're not adding it between the lines that say "Don't touch anything between these lines" =)
[09:01] <ogra> to late
[09:01] <jbailey> up-arrow, enter is my friend. =)
[09:01] <ogra> if he comes back ;)
[09:02] <ogra> mdz, sorry for the flint noise, i told him he'd have no luck :)
[09:02] <mdz> ogra: he tried to call me 3 times this morning
[09:03] <mdz> the first time at 0800
[09:03] <ogra> gah
[09:03] <ogra> mdz, opinions on 15706 ?
[09:05] <jcohen85> it actually only takes about 10.5 seconds to go to the splash screen. in that time it looks like it's detecting hardware
[09:05] <jcohen85> it doesn't sit anywhere for too long- the longest is on the dvd drive i believe
[09:06] <jcohen85> and hoary took about 8 seconds doing the same thing- i guess i didnt notice before
[09:06] <jbailey> Hmm.
[09:07] <jbailey> Mostly now you just feel it because of how long the splash takes to come up, I guess?
[09:07] <jcohen85> yeah
[09:07] <jcohen85> it still does take 2-3 seconds longer for the same step
[09:07] <jcohen85> but what's noticeable is how long it takes for the splash screen to come up
[09:08] <jcohen85> actually- let me time the startup once more
[09:12] <jcohen85> yeah, there's definitely a difference
[09:12] <doko> Riddell: ping
[09:12] <Riddell> doko: hi
[09:12] <jcohen85> this time it took 14 seconds to get to the splash screen
[09:12] <jbailey> From hitting enter in grub, right?
[09:13] <jcohen85> jbailey, in 2.6.10 it takes 31 seconds to go from pressing enter on grub to the brown screen that starts when gnome starts loading
[09:13] <jbailey> I have to run off to a doctors appt in a moment.
[09:13] <jcohen85> and in total it takes 57 seconds to go from pressing enter in grub to a fully useable gnome desktop with icons and menu/clock loaded
[09:14] <jcohen85> in 2.6.12 it takes 40 seconds to the brown gnome load screen and 1:06 for gnome to completely finish loading
[09:14] <jbailey> jcohen85: I will give you a new initramfs-tools tomorrow to test with that should collect information for me.
[09:14] <jcohen85> ok
[09:14] <jcohen85> going from 30 to 40 seconds seems pretty substantial especially when most of the delay is in the beginning
[09:15] <jcohen85> by 15 seconds, 2.6.10 is well into the bootup process
[09:15] <jbailey> Right, it's probably just modprobe blocking on something for some reason.
[09:15] <jbailey> I'll be able to tell what it is.
[09:15] <jcohen85> isn't it strange that no one before me posted a bug report for the kernel panic i was getting
[09:16] <jbailey> Gotta run, back shortly.
[09:16] <jcohen85> it affected all kernels and apparently affected amd 64 chips- i just upgraded to breezy on the 17th
[09:16] <jcohen85> thanks for your help
[09:19] <smurf> I haven't heard from silbs WRT today's locoteam meeting. Can somebody ping her (SMS?) and find out if she'll be there?
[09:34] <thesaltydog> is someone working on a graphical bluetooth configuration editor?
[09:36] <mjg59> thesaltydog: Yes
[09:36] <mpt> Keybuk: ha ha ... I only want him for his icons
[09:37] <thesaltydog> mjg59, ok.. is it available? maybe an alpha-release?
[09:37] <mjg59> thesaltydog: Not that I know of
[09:37] <mjg59> Bastien Nocera is working on one
[09:38] <thesaltydog> mjg59, thanks.
[09:41] <elmo> Riddell: ?
[09:41] <Riddell> elmo: hi
[09:41] <elmo> Riddell: you know about kdelibs?
[09:41] <Riddell> elmo: I should do
[09:42] <elmo> Riddell: the FTBFS I mean
[09:42] <Riddell> on i386?  fixing that just now
[09:43] <mjg59> elmo: Did amd64 ndiswrapper builds get fixed?
[09:43] <mjg59> Userspace builds, rather - the kernel's been sorted now
[09:43] <elmo> ndiswrapper-utils | 1.1-4ubuntu1 |        breezy | amd64, i386
[09:43] <elmo> Riddell: yeah - ok, thanks
[09:43] <mjg59> elmo: Thanks!
[09:44] <Mithrandir> elmo: somebody claims it doesn't work, though.
[09:44] <mjg59> elmo: Also, as of tomorrow's kernel, nx6125 should be pretty decent out of the box
[09:44] <elmo> Mithrandir: dude talk to the mjg59
[09:44] <elmo> mjg59: sweet
[09:44] <Mithrandir> mjg59: somebody claims it doesn't work, though.
[09:44] <mjg59> Mithrandir: In what way?
[09:44] <mjg59> Mithrandir: We don't yet ship an amd64 kernel with an ndiswrapper module
[09:46] <Mithrandir> mjg59: hmm, indeed we don't.
[09:46] <mjg59> But we will do from tomorrow
[09:46] <ogra> Mithrandir, and even with selfcompiled ndiswrapper it works fine here...
[09:47] <ogra> i use it since hoary for my linksys pcmcia card
[09:47] <ogra> Mithrandir, are you sure the guy who complains uses 64bit drivers for his card ?
[09:48] <Mithrandir> ogra: it appears he had a version mismatch
[09:48] <Mithrandir> 15052
[09:50] <ogra> Mithrandir, indeed, we only ship 1.1
[09:56] <mdke_> anyone got an acx_111 pcmcia card which works ootb with breezy?
[09:57] <CarlK> im on a Sep something Breezy, trying to file a bug report about fstab.  how can I get the date or something that will identify what version of the installer was used?
[09:59] <CarlK> uname -a ?
[09:59] <CarlK> Aug 30... good enough
[10:00] <smurf> Hmmm... nobody here can ping silbs?? I find that somewhat hard to believe ...
[10:00] <Kamion> CarlK: /cdrom/.disk/info
[10:00] <CarlK> thanks
[10:00] <CarlK> now if I can just remember my bz pw...
[10:00] <jbailey> smurf: Wha?  She's not online atm acc to /wii
[10:00] <Kamion> smurf: she more or less works UK working hours
[10:01] <Kamion> unfortunately my phone is out of credit or I'd try SMSing
[10:01] <smurf> Kamion: we have some locoteamMeeting topics she's mostly responsible for
[10:02] <CarlK> wait... I don't have the CD.  I had an ISO but that got overwritten the next morning
[10:02] <CarlK> I was looking for a someting on the box
[10:02] <Kamion> you might find it in /var/log/installer/syslog
[10:02] <Kamion> grep for cdrom-detect
[10:03] <CarlK> /var/log/installer/syslog
[10:03] <CarlK> er..
[10:03] <CarlK> Sep  7 14:15:42 anna[6189] : DEBUG: ask for cdrom-detect, is menu item
[10:04] <CarlK> is that useful?
[10:04] <Kamion> CarlK: no, try not just the first match
[10:04] <CarlK> thats all the matchs
[10:04] <Kamion> er, one sec
[10:05] <Kamion> should be something like "Oct 20 00:43:53 (none) user.notice cdrom-detect: Detected CD 'Ubuntu 4.10 "Warty Warthog" - Preview amd64 Binary-1 (20041020)'"
[10:05] <Kamion> obviously that's ancient but the relevant code hasn't changed
[10:08] <CarlK> Kamion, pxe booty stuff, so no CDrom... but I think the Aug30/Sep7 will be good enough.  plus I am going to confirm it all once I get back to my crash-n-burn box
[10:08] <CarlK> and I am having to email my well constructed bug anyway cuz I can't figure out my bz password.... duh.
[10:08] <Kamion> CarlK: ah, ok, I don't think it's stored anywhere else then
[10:11] <CarlK> but hey, on the good side, a friends Win98 box got all hosed, so I thew a breezy box in the car and drove it over so her kids could type/print there homeowrk, and it has been running fine
[10:11] <CarlK> so go breezy.
[10:21] <CarlK> how come "detect printer" never sees anything I hookup?
[10:22] <CarlK> shouldn't it at least figure out from lsusb what the printer is and tell me it isn't in the database?
[10:25] <moyogo> hi, i was wondering if people can contribute to the ubuntu font?
[10:26] <CarlK> or is this a bug: there is a 812c driver,  "find printer" didn't find it, lsusb shows: ID 03f0:0304 Hewlett-Packard DeskJet 810c/812c
[10:33] <pablof> hi, whe i raise synaptic i get error  art_render_gradient.c:338: art_render_gradient_linear_render_8: Assertiva `offset_fraction <= stops[ix] .offset'
[10:35] <pablof> somebody know this problem ?
[10:35] <spayne> jdub: ping
[10:38] <mvo> pablof: breezy?
[10:38] <mvo> pablof: never seen/heard of that error
[10:38] <pablof> mvo: yes, breezy
[10:40] <camilotelles__> pablof: this error was happening before?
[10:40] <pablof> no, this starting after dist-upgrade
[10:41] <camilotelles__> pablof: what is the breezy version?
[10:42] <pablof> camilotelles__: 20/09
[10:43] <camilotelles__> if you try this version without the dist-upgrade the error occurs?
[10:43] <pablof> camilotelles__: one moment... i will test
[10:44] <camilotelles__> pablof: you have to reinstall...
[10:44] <pablof> camilotelles__: ok, i reboot the pc. :)
[10:44] <pablof> camilotelles__: and test
[10:44] <camilotelles__> pablof: you have to reinstall the 20/09 version, test, do the dist-upgrade - test again.
[10:44] <pablof> camilotelles__: with live cd
[10:45] <camilotelles__> pablof: thats ok.
[10:46] <lamont> pitti: hrm... langpacks and SCC archs...
[10:46] <lamont> should SCC archs be stripping, and since we do, what about packages that are only built on that architecture?
[10:46] <lamont> (since I _know_ you're not harvesting the translations...
[10:46] <lamont> )
[10:47] <pitti> lamont: as long as these arches export tarballs to your directory, that should be fine
[10:47] <lamont> pitti: yeah, they don't yet...
[10:47] <pitti> lamont: of course this means some overhead in the langpacks, but oh well...
[10:47] <lamont> maybe I'll add at least one of them...
[10:47] <lamont> pitti: that was really my question...
[10:47] <pitti> lamont: we import all arches now
[10:48] <pitti> lamont: so if there is an ia64 specific package, we will get its translations
[10:48] <camilotelles__> pablof: if the error persists create a minimal python script to submit with the bug
[10:48] <dholbach> the joy of apt-get.org: another funny debian/copyright file:
[10:48] <dholbach> And SPICE3f5 (not installer) is distributed under the following licence.
[10:48] <dholbach> "Free for people friendly to the U.S.A."
[10:48] <dholbach> :)
[10:49] <pitti> lol
[10:49] <bddebian> hehe
[10:49] <bddebian> Are there any left?? ;-)
[10:49] <pitti> bddebian: hi
[10:49] <bddebian> Heya pitti
[10:49] <pitti> bddebian: enjoyed pctcl and pgaccess? :-)
[10:49] <pitti> pgtcl, even
[10:49] <bddebian> pitti: Were you able to get it in?
[10:49] <pitti> bddebian: it's in breezy, and in Debian's NEW queue
[10:50] <bddebian> Awesome, good work! :-)
[10:50] <pitti> bddebian: so in breezy everything is fine
[10:50] <bddebian> I'll have to try rhdb-admin now :-)
[10:51] <pablof> camilotelles__: the error persit
[10:51] <lamont> pitti: 171MB of translations incoming in about 10 minutes....
[10:51] <pitti> bddebian: that also needs tweaks, at least the dependency
[10:51] <pitti> lamont: carlos will love you :-)
[10:51] <lamont> yeah, well, that dates back to jun 30. :-)
[10:51] <pablof> camilotelles__: and not only with synaptic
[10:51] <lamont> fabbione: you want sparc translations?
[10:51] <carlos> pitti, lamont ;-)
[10:52] <pablof> open a bug ?
[10:53] <CarlK> how do I debug this:  prop sheet says "status: printer not connected" and yet lsusb shows Bus 001 Device 005: ID 03f0:0304 Hewlett-Packard DeskJet 810c/812c
[10:53] <martinhj> anyone of you knows how I can reach this "j@bootlap" guy who have created this NetworkManager repository for breezy?
[10:53] <martinhj> I suppose that is not the version which is going to be in breezy?
[10:53] <camilotelles__> pablof: submit the bug with the minimal script.
[10:54] <ogra> martinhj, its already in since a week or so
[10:54] <camilotelles__> pablof: I dont know what package you have to submit.
[10:55] <martinhj> ogra: the vpnc plugin for nm too?
[10:56] <ogra> pablof, the function art_render_gradient_linear_render is in libart (dunno if the bug is in libart or caused by something else though)
[10:56] <ogra> martinhj, not as far as i know
[10:57] <martinhj> ogra: and it wont be included?
[10:57] <sladen> ogra / pablof: is synaptic using SVG icons containing gradients
[10:57] <ogra> martinhj, depends if there is time left to review it for MOTU, we are currently focusing on fixing the remaining bugs
[10:57] <pablof> ogra: ok, i will open the bug for libart
[10:58] <martinhj> ogra: ok, thanks
[10:58] <pablof> sladen: maybe the is librsvg2-2
[10:58] <pablof> ??
[10:58] <ogra> could be
[10:58] <pablof> ok
[10:58] <ogra> are the other apps causing the error using svg icons ?
[10:59] <sladen> pablof: when exactly do you see this error.  What action in synaptic do you have to perform to see it?
[10:59] <pablof> yes, but app wiht jpg icons occur
[11:00] <pablof> sladen: whe i raise synaptic in shell
[11:00] <pablof> sladen: i just execute synaptic
[11:01] <sladen> pablof: yes. not error I get
[11:01] <sladen> not an error
[11:02] <mvo> pablof: any special theme or something? (sorry if that was asked before)
[11:04] <pablof> mvo: a custom them for my "distribution ubuntu"
[11:07] <pablof> ok, i change to original them and the problem solved.
[11:07] <pablof> mvo: but, do you have any idea for this problem are happening ?
[11:09] <mvo> pablof: not right now. is synaptic the only application that dosn't cope with that theme?
[11:11] <bddebian> Dunno if you folks know but synaptics is on the list to be merged
[11:11] <pablof> mvo: no, but with some applications. i can't identify a common behavior
[11:11] <mvo> pablof: I'm off to bed now, please ping me about this issue tomorrow or file a bugreport with some more information about the used theme
[11:11] <pablof> mvo: ok, i meet you here
[11:13] <pablof> bye
[11:13] <mvo> pablof: bye :)
[11:16] <Kamion> bddebian: you mean synaptic or synaptics? they're totally different things
[11:17] <Kamion> (synaptic is a package management frontend, synaptics is a touchpad driver)
[11:18] <bddebian> Hmm, let me look, it's probably synaptics :-)
[11:19] <bddebian> Doh, I am on crack, it's synopsis
[11:19] <Kamion> synaptic is very definitely in main
[11:19] <Kamion> ah
[11:19] <Keybuk> mjg59: I don't think #15979 is a udev-related bug after all
[11:21] <mjg59> Keybuk: Ok
[11:21] <mjg59> I'm pretty certain it's not a usplash one
[11:22] <Keybuk> for what reasons does usplash go away and give back the console?
[11:27] <mjg59> After a VT switch or after 15 seconds of not being esnt a message
[11:28] <dholbach> seb128: how was soccer? who won?
[11:29] <seb128> dholbach: was fine, Auxerre won (2-1)
[11:30] <seb128> mdz: I don't agree with #15372 beeing normal, it makes quite easy to get a crasher g-s-d due to it for a lot of locales, which means error messages, no icon, no theme, etc
[11:40] <daniels> sladen: don't get me started
[11:58] <Riddell> seb128: did you hear back from the gstreamer-misc guy?
[11:59] <seb128> Riddell: he said that's probably fine to split to create a -gtk, but not sure than that many people have no gtk installed on a desktop
[12:00] <seb128> Riddell: is that a real issue for some users?
[12:01] <Riddell> seb128: yes, it takes up space on the CD which we don't have


[08:58] <jamespage> gnuoy, hows the barbican charm looking?
[08:59] <gnuoy> jamespage, well, from a using layers to build a charm perspective: great! from a functioning service pov: less great
[08:59] <jamespage> gnuoy, packaging issues?
[08:59] <gnuoy>  5 barbican package bugs so far ( http://paste.ubuntu.com/14047472/ )
[08:59] <gnuoy> and even working around those the token from keystone is still be rejected by barbican
[09:01] <gnuoy> jamespage, tbh, I'm conflicted on how much time to spend working on barbican itself as opposed to charm/layers stuff
[09:04] <jamespage> gnuoy, I can have that lot fixed in two shakes of a stick...
[09:04] <gnuoy> jamespage, they are not blocking me, they are easy to work around
[09:04] <jamespage> gnuoy, what's the right way to run barbican then?
[09:06] <gnuoy> jamespage, Using the previous version of barbican (2014.2) the charm works and you can retrieve and store secrets. With the liberty package I'm still trying to get it to work at all
[09:07] <gnuoy> jamespage, https://github.com/cloudkeep/barbican/wiki/Integration-with-Apache2 is what the charm should probably do eventually but right now I'm trying to get it to work at all
[09:32] <jamespage> gnuoy, https://launchpad.net/~james-page/+archive/ubuntu/liberty-testing
[09:32] <jamespage> updates for liberty will appear here once they build
[09:35] <gnuoy> jamespage, fantastic, thanks
[09:54] <jamespage> gnuoy, btw I'd add python-pymysql to the package list for barbican
[09:54] <gnuoy> yep, I wont rely on recommends
[09:56] <jamespage> gnuoy, that's a nice example of release specific behaviour - python-mysqldb -> python-pymysql
[09:57] <jamespage> kilo -> liberty
[10:07] <jamespage> gnuoy, ok prep done for sru as well; once we're ok with my ppa package I'll upload
[10:19] <jamespage> okay all built
[10:19] <jamespage> gnuoy, ^^
[10:20] <gnuoy> jamespage, yep, I'm giving it a spin at the moment, thanks for all your fixes
[10:20] <jamespage> gnuoy, np we'd have todo them anyway for the MIR
[13:23] <gnuoy> jamespage, barbican  charm is now functional with liberty rc1, thanks
[13:24] <jamespage> gnuoy, oooo
[13:24] <jamespage> awesome
[13:50] <icezimm> a quick question, how do I create a database on juju mysql? I've searched but found nothing… is it possible to create only via charms relationships?
[13:51] <rick_h_> icezimm: it's setup to do that automatically on the charm relations.
[13:51] <marcoceppi> icezimm: at the moment, yes. the MySQL charm will only create database schemas when a realtion is made
[13:51] <rick_h_> icezimm: you could juju ssh to it and run normal mysql commands
[13:51] <marcoceppi> icezimm: however, the root password is available if you wish to use it out of band of Juju
[13:51] <icezimm> I understand I can juju ssh mysql/0 then mysql -u root -p `sudo cat …`
[13:51] <icezimm> hummmm
[13:52] <icezimm> so I'd never find how to create using juju heheh
[13:52] <icezimm> thank you very much rick_h_ and marcoceppi :)
[13:52] <rick_h_> icezimm: it might make an interesting juju action to support creating on the fly dbs
[13:52] <marcoceppi> icezimm: well, it's not available yet, but you could add an action to do this
[13:52] <marcoceppi> rick_h_: man, I'm slow today ;)
[13:52] <icezimm> hahahha
[13:52] <icezimm> rick_h_ is fast like bullets flying ;)
[13:52] <rick_h_> marcoceppi: :P
[13:53] <icezimm> just to make sure, you're talking about this:  https://jujucharms.com/docs/1.25/actions right?
[13:54] <Icey> icezimm yes
[13:54] <icezimm> hummm great, I'm new to juju… just started this week, getting used heheh
[13:54] <icezimm> Icey: thank you
[13:55] <marcoceppi> icezimm: yes, so ideally you'd do something like this `juju action do mysql/0 create-db name=<name-you-want>` and it would reply back with all the details you need
[13:55] <marcoceppi> icezimm: welcome!
[13:55] <Icey> marcoceppi another use case for synchronous actions :)
[13:55] <marcoceppi> icezimm: however, someone would have to create that action and add it to the charm
[13:55] <icezimm> I deployed a mysql, but running `juju action defined mysql` as described on documentation shows `No actions defined for mysql`
[13:55] <icezimm> marcoceppi: thank you :)
[13:55] <marcoceppi> icezimm: yeah, so the action doesn't exist yet, someone would have to create it, but that's the mechanism you'd use
[13:55] <icezimm> I mean
[13:56] <icezimm> not the create db action
[13:56] <icezimm> https://jujucharms.com/docs/1.25/actions#action-commands
[13:56] <marcoceppi> icezimm: yes, mysql doesn't have any actions defined at the moment
[13:56] <icezimm> `juju action defined mysql` was supposed to return backup, benchmark, dump, restart… no?
[13:56] <icezimm> hummmm…
[13:57] <marcoceppi> icezimm: hum, maybe
[13:57] <marcoceppi> icezimm: looking at the charm, there are no actions
[13:58] <marcoceppi> icezimm: I see how this is confusing, since the documentatoin says so
[13:58] <icezimm> hahahah no problem
[13:58] <marcoceppi> icezimm: those are theoretical responses, not actually what is reality.
[13:58] <icezimm> i understand
[13:58]  * marcoceppi opens a bug
[13:59] <icezimm> where are you opening so I can follow?
[13:59] <bloodearnest> marcoceppi, hey there. So, I want a charm to use the python cryptography library, which wraps openssl, but trying to figure out how to install in the charms virtualenv
[13:59] <bloodearnest> . The latest charm build does source only wheels, so I can't include in wheelhouse.txt, as it won't install correctly.
[13:59] <marcoceppi> icezimm: https://github.com/juju/docs/issues/759
[13:59] <icezimm> I have a background on debian and puppet… no evaluating ubuntu/autopilot/juju so I'm really lost atm heheheh
[13:59] <icezimm> GH workflow… great!
[14:00] <marcoceppi> icezimm: yeah, most of the Juju stuff is on github, with everything making it's way over slowly
[14:00] <marcoceppi> icezimm: if you have any questions please feel free to let us know here :)
[14:01] <bloodearnest> marcoceppi, Ideally, I'd like to install from archives and use that (to support multiple arch). Is there a way to do that with the charm virtualenv (i.e. include system site packages)
[14:01] <marcoceppi> bloodearnest: the source wheel should be unpacked and installed on the remote unit, you'll just need to make sure openssl-dev, etc are installed
[14:01] <bloodearnest> marcoceppi, ah, k
[14:01] <marcoceppi> bloodearnest: well, no, but you don't need to include it in the wheel at all
[14:01] <marcoceppi> bloodearnest: the wheel is just charms hook deps, tbh
[14:01] <marcoceppi> bloodearnest: you can just, in the method you've wrapped with @hook('install') call out to charmhelpers.fetch.apt_install('yo-pkg')
[14:02] <bloodearnest> marcoceppi, my charm hooks use cryptography to generate a self signed certificate
[14:02] <icezimm> marcoceppi: I'd like to add another provider to juju deploy, could you point me on the direction? a documentation link, github link to code… anything can help ;)
[14:02] <lazypower> bloodearnest - wait
[14:02] <lazypower> bloodearnest - we have a layer to help you with that
[14:02] <marcoceppi> icezimm: I'll dig up some docs, wwitzel3 might be able to help while I look. Providers are written in Golang. Which are you looking to add (for curiosity)
[14:03] <icezimm> hummm great
[14:03] <lazypower> bloodearnest - give this a look and see if its what you're looking for. we have the interface impl for peering, which sets up a CA and does PKI / CSR for a service pool https://github.com/mbruzek/layer-tls
[14:04] <marcoceppi> icezimm: https://github.com/juju/juju/wiki/Implementing-environment-providers
[14:04] <lazypower> https://github.com/mbruzek/interface-tls - and this is the interface repository
[14:04] <icezimm> I found the implementations
[14:04] <icezimm> https://github.com/juju/juju/tree/master/provider/ec2
[14:05] <icezimm> this doc is amazing… thank you very much marcoceppi
[14:05] <wwitzel3> icezimm: don't use ec2 as a reference, use gce https://github.com/juju/juju/tree/master/provider/gce
[14:05] <wwitzel3> icezimm: also hi :)
[14:06] <icezimm> hello wwitzel3!
[14:06] <marcoceppi> icezimm: no worries, you may want to join the juju and juju-devel mailing lists (https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/juju and https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/juju-dev) if you haven't already
[14:06] <wwitzel3> icezimm: that overview doc covers most of what you'll need, you should be able to fill in the holes referecing the gce provider. You'll also want to join the juju-devel list as marcoceppi mentioned.
[14:07] <bloodearnest> lazypower, so, that looks like a different tools from what I'm working on. AIUI, it's for distributing a cert between service units, so they can tls there traffic to each other, right?
[14:07] <icezimm> marcoceppi: now I'm in
[14:07] <icezimm> :)
[14:07] <bloodearnest> I'm working on public facing tls certs
[14:07] <bloodearnest> the kind you put in apache
[14:08] <lazypower> bloodearnest: this works for that as well, as they are self signed either way they are going to raise an issue w/ a browser.
[14:08] <lazypower> bloodearnest: and these certs generated here will work in an apache vhost
[14:08] <icezimm> just curiosity, why gce and not ec2? (using deprecated api, code not so clear?)
[14:08] <bloodearnest> lazypower, one particular use case I'm trying to solve is multiple tls certs, doesn't look like this supports that?
[14:08] <marcoceppi> icezimm: the ec2 was one of the first providers we wrote, since then we've gotten better at coding them, so it kind of uses a lot of older, outdated environment designs
[14:09] <icezimm> ahhhh what I suspected heheh
[14:09] <lazypower> bloodearnest: lets hop on a hangout and riff over your use cases
[14:09] <marcoceppi> icezimm: GCE was written against that document so it'll line up better
[14:09] <bloodearnest> lazypower, plus, it git clones easyrsa, which means we can't use it atm
[14:09] <bloodearnest> lazypower, sure
[14:09] <icezimm> my idea is to work on softlayer provider
[14:10] <icezimm> but I know zero of go lang hahah (a good reason to start learning)
[14:10] <icezimm> ;)
[14:10] <lazypower> bloodearnest:  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/canonical.com/container-cats
[14:10] <marcoceppi> icezimm: I was under the impression that softlayer was moving to OpenStack?
[14:11] <bloodearnest> 434644
[14:11] <icezimm> marcoceppi: no
[14:12] <icezimm> ibm acquired blue box to provide "openstack as a service" for hybrid workloads
[14:12] <icezimm> but softlayer public cloud has its own api, and no intention to change on near future (afaik)
[14:13] <marcoceppi> icezimm: ah, that's where I'm confused. Well it looks like there's a few golang softlayer APIs already, so at least that work is already done
[14:13] <icezimm> I'm the maintainer for fog-softlayer and have my own softlayer client… but in ruby hahah
[14:14] <marcoceppi> icezimm: awesome!
[14:14] <icezimm> at least I'm very used to the api
[14:15] <marcoceppi> icezimm: yeah, so you only just need to wrap your head around golang and marry the two ;)
[14:15] <icezimm> yeah hahah
[14:16] <icezimm> https://github.com/sudorandom/softlayer-go
[14:16] <icezimm> sudorandom is softlayer staff
[14:16] <icezimm> I'm gonna check this, play a little then check how to marry with juju heheh
[14:17] <marcoceppi> icezimm: awesome, well if you have any questions or need help, feel free to ping in here!
[14:17] <icezimm> awesome.. thank you very much
[14:18] <icezimm> too many information/new stuff, need to study and learn a little bit more to come with new questions… hehehe
[14:18] <icezimm> marcoceppi rick_h_ wwitzel3 lazypower thank you for the help
[14:18] <bloodearnest> lazypower, lp:~bloodearnest/charms/trusty/x509-cert
[14:19] <icezimm> lazypower: I work arounded in the network problem
[14:19] <icezimm> but juju is still only configuring and up the private network on machines
[14:20] <icezimm> going lunch… brb
[14:24] <marcoceppi> cory_fu kwmonroe admcleod1 bigdata-devs apache-hadoop-plugin, that's just a charm we created, it's not really a apache/hadoop service, right?
[14:25] <cory_fu> Correct
[14:25] <admcleod1> right
[14:25] <marcoceppi> cool, thanks guys
[14:25] <cory_fu> Why do you ask?
[14:25] <marcoceppi> cory_fu: I'm documenting the benchmarking in apache-hadoop-plugin and am trying to get a description for it
[14:26] <cory_fu> marcoceppi: Also, we're going to be phasing it out with the conversion to layers, because layers provide a better solution to the problem it was addressing
[14:26] <cory_fu> Though that does mean we'll need a new home for the benchmark actions, hrm.
[14:26] <admcleod> client
[14:27] <marcoceppi> cory_fu: http://8e421f99.ngrok.io/benchmarks/#apache-hadoop-plugin that's fine, I'm just trying to fill this in like the other examples
[14:27] <cory_fu> admcleod: Yeah, probably.  Though I could also see them living on ResourceManager
[14:27] <marcoceppi> cory_fu: we can updtae the page when it finds a new home
[14:27] <admcleod> cory_fu: hm yes that would be better actually, that is more intuitive
[14:27] <marcoceppi> cory_fu admcleod I'd also love to put spark-bench on here :)
[14:29] <cory_fu> marcoceppi: "Apache Hadoop Plugin subordinate is provides both a connection point for the Apache Hadoop cluster as well as installation and management of the Apache Hadoop libraries and configuration for its principal service."
[14:30] <cory_fu> s/is//
[14:30] <marcoceppi> cory_fu: awesome, thanks!
[14:30] <marcoceppi> way better than what I was cobbling together
[14:30] <cory_fu> :)
[14:36] <bloodearnest> lazypower, https://github.com/bloodearnest/plugins/tree/juju-local-dns
[14:54] <Muntaner> hello to everyone!
[14:54] <Muntaner> I had a juju bootstraped openstack environment, amazingly working.
[14:54] <icezimm> Muntaner: I know how is this sensation… just got mine working today ;)
[14:55] <Muntaner> I bootstraped it from my laptop, and I cloud do "juju status", "juju deploy" and so on without problems. By the way, I was forced to format my laptop... now I don't have an ubuntu distro anymore, and I need to "talk" with the juju client with that environment another time
[14:55] <Muntaner> I backupped all the .juju folder - with all the ssh stuff, .jenv and so on - in order to do this on another VM which runs an Ubuntu distro
[14:56] <Muntaner> what should I do? simply install the juju client on this new virtual machine and then copy the .juju folder content which I backupped and should I see the environment again?
[14:57] <icezimm> about networking with juju, I have a MAAS with eth0 <IP_ADDRESS>/24 (public unmanaged) and eth1 <IP_ADDRESS>/24 (private managed), when deploy a new node it configures the private network and juju-br0 on eth1, but I can access my services because they should be accessible via eth0 and juju is not handling it… is it ok?
[15:13] <marcoceppi> Muntaner: basically
[15:17] <lazypower> Icey https://github.com/juju-solutions/charms.reactive/issues/32
[15:18] <lazypower> Muntaner: the .juju directory is portable, so you should be able to just drop that in on any system, osx, ubuntu, et-al. and it should "just work"
[15:19] <Muntaner> lazypower, great!
[15:19] <Muntaner> you gave me a great new
[18:38] <icezimm> I got landscape server running, but juju is exposing the service via my private network interface hahaha
[18:39] <icezimm> any suggestion on how handle to expose or via both, or via public one?
[18:53] <lazypower> dpb1 - ^
[18:56] <dpb1> lazypower: you would probably know more than me there. :(
[18:56] <lazypower> last i saw the landscape server doesn't bind to any specific ip
[18:58] <lazypower> icezimm: did you juju expose the servie?
[18:58] <lazypower> *service
[19:12] <icezimm> lazypower: no… I'm following the instructions
[19:12] <icezimm> theres nothing about exposing heheh
[19:12] <icezimm> lazypower: you can see my juju status
[19:12] <icezimm> https://gist.github.com/fernandes/71e36bb897d348b2f0b1
[19:13] <icezimm> exposed: false
[19:13] <icezimm> hummmm
[19:13] <icezimm> makes sense
[19:13] <icezimm> its not exposed
[19:13] <lazypower> icezimm: yeah, def juju expose landscape
[19:13] <lazypower> then give it a go
[19:17] <icezimm> lazypower: should I expose landscape-server or haproxy?
[19:18] <lazypower> icezimm: haproxy
[19:18] <lazypower> sorry this is off the cuff, i haven't looked @ the status output
[19:18] <lazypower> but iirc, landscape runs behind haproxy so you can scale it
[19:18] <icezimm> yeah
[19:18] <icezimm> here we go
[19:19] <icezimm> now I have haproxy as exposed
[19:19] <icezimm> but still public-address: <IP_ADDRESS> is what maas provided from its dhcp (private network)
[19:19] <icezimm> I entered on machine-0 and enabled eth0 (public network)
[19:20] <lazypower> icezimm: i'm headed out for lunch, i can help troubleshoot in an hour when i get back.
[19:20] <icezimm> but I think juju-br0 that connect to containers is only set on private
[19:20] <icezimm> lazypower: perfect… I do really appreciate, enjoy your lunch ;)
[19:20] <lazypower> well, juju-br0 isn't accessable outside the host unless the newer networking code landed
[19:21] <lazypower> i know that dimitern has done work here, and i'm sketchy on the details of whats landed and what hasnt
[19:21] <icezimm> no problem, atm I put a ethernet cable from my machine to private switch (nasty work around hahahaha)
[19:21] <lazypower> but container networking, if its still in the state that i last checked, is only accessable on the host unless you use some SDN charm(s) to modify that. if the HAProxy node is deployed on a principal unit, and not a container, that is co-located with landscape, connectivity shouldn't be an issue.
[19:21] <icezimm> I can work next hour while you lunch… I'm pretty well
[19:22] <lazypower> sounds good icezimm, see you in a bit o/
[19:22] <icezimm> thank you! \o
[19:28] <cory_fu> Question for anyone.  The way reactive decorators work, @when(true, true) fires, but @when(true, false) and of course @when(false, false) do not.  @when_not(true, true) clearly should not fire, and @when_not(false, false) clearly should.  What do you expect @when_not(true, false) to do?
[19:29] <jhobbs> when_all and when_not_all would be clearer
[19:30] <jhobbs> maybe :)
[19:32] <jhobbs> python has all() and any(), and you can negate those. that makes sense.  when_all(), when_any(), when_not_all() and when_not_any(). when just when_not() there isn't enough information
[19:32] <cory_fu> So you would expect @when_not(true, false) to fire, because at least one is false?
[19:33] <jhobbs> i would have to look it up
[19:33] <mbruzek> tvansteenburgh: is there a way to find the leader in Amulet code?
[20:11] <marcoceppi> icezimm: I think you need to enable a new feature, let me check
[20:11] <marcoceppi> icezimm: since you're on MAAS, expose has no real affect since MAAs doesn't have a firewaller
[20:13] <icezimm> hummm interesting
[20:13] <icezimm> expose if just a iptables accept?
[20:13] <icezimm> expose is just like a iptables accept?
[20:14] <marcoceppi> icezimm: yes, but we don't use local iptables, instead we use the providers firewaller, ie security groups
[20:15] <marcoceppi> icezimm: I think you need to enable a special networking feature for MAAS which makes containers addressable
[20:17] <marcoceppi> icezimm: yeah, it's "EXPERIMENTAL" in 1.25, but check out the 1.25.0 section here https://jujucharms.com/docs/devel/reference-release-notes specifically "Support "devices" on MAAS 1.8+"
[20:17] <marcoceppi> icezimm: that's what you need
[20:37] <lazypower> marcoceppi: ta, i was looking for that and didn't find it
[20:56] <jrwren> mbruzek: thanks for the merge.
[20:57] <mbruzek> jrwren: Yeah it was a net gain, but the tests still appear to suffer from race conditions
[20:58] <jrwren> mbruzek: indeed. I never set out to fix that or any of those tests ;_;
[20:59] <tvansteenburgh> mbruzek: re amulet and leadership, not directly, although it would be a simple add. for now you could use something like this http://paste.ubuntu.com/14056416/
[20:59] <tvansteenburgh> (not tested)
[20:59] <mbruzek> tvansteenburgh: thank you
[21:02] <icezimm> marcoceppi lazypower interesting…I'm gonna try this
[21:02] <icezimm> a little question… if I order bare metal machines on a provider, they have static ip address, is it possible to use under maas?
[21:03] <icezimm> wondering because on this container stuff I need to add a subnet routable to vlan on maas, so I can access the containers
[21:04] <icezimm> but thanks for pointing me in this direction, I can make more tests here
[21:04] <icezimm> and btw, now I'm running openstack :) amazing!
[21:13] <marcoceppi> icezimm: not sure about the baremetal providers, you "should" be able to, but I think you'll still need them to set up a vlan, it might be easier to instead use the "manual" provider which would allow you to just "add" machines to juju by doing `juju add-machine ssh:user@ip` and then you can deploy to that machine
[21:13] <marcoceppi> icezimm: also, not sure where you're located, but we're having a Juju Charmer Summit the first week of February where a bunch of us, the community, and core developers will be http://summit.juju.solutions/ registration is free and is colocated with FOSDEM and cfgmgmtcamp
[21:14] <marcoceppi> icezimm: here's the Manual Provider: https://jujucharms.com/docs/stable/config-manual
[21:15] <marcoceppi> icezimm: ie: juju bootstrap -e manual; juju add-machine ssh:user@machine; juju deploy mysql --to lxc:1; since the user@machine will now be machine 1
[21:15] <marcoceppi> not nearly as smooth as using a cloud provider, but it allows you to use "any old host" and as many or little servers as you want
[21:42] <ancaemanuel> Hi
[21:43] <marcoceppi> ancaemanuel hello, welcome!
[21:43] <ancaemanuel> do you have any plan for the next version of go ?
[21:43] <marcoceppi> ancaemanuel: great question, I know we're discussing moving to 1.5 of golang, but there are some considerations there
[21:43] <ancaemanuel> like an ppa for testing ?
[21:44] <marcoceppi> ancaemanuel: was there anything in particular you were looking for?
[21:44] <ancaemanuel> go 1.6 beta 1 will be released tomorrow, https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/golang-dev/6Ga5o2Ao2WM
[21:46] <marcoceppi> ancaemanuel: I don't think we're tracking that at all, so juju is being targeted for the golang version in Xenial, which is 1.5
[21:46] <ancaemanuel> it will be nice to test it and report bugs, if any
[21:46] <marcoceppi> ancaemanuel: well, we're not really responsible for golang packaging, I imagine someone will upload it somewhere though
[22:09] <ancaemanuel> then who is responsible ? Michael Hudson-Doyle ?
[22:18] <ancaemanuel> ok, I found him on twitter: https://twitter.com/ancaemanuel7/status/677250522701778945
[22:34] <marcoceppi> ancaemanuel: yeah, we really just make use of golang, but we target whatever is in the stable LTS for Ubuntu, not really bleeding edge


[01:36] <CIA-33> casper: cjwatson * r698 trunk/ (debian/changelog scripts/casper-bottom/19keyboard):
[01:36] <CIA-33> casper: Extend our hack that arranges to run setupcon after usplash exits to
[01:36] <CIA-33> casper: cover the new Upstartified usplash as well.
[01:37] <CIA-33> casper: cjwatson * r699 trunk/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.196
[05:59] <CarlFK> box PXE boots, can load both ibex and karmic installers, run them, but can't get a dhcp response.  I just installed karmic from cd, it booted and got a dhcp response
[06:01] <CarlFK> Intel  82557 Ethernet pro 100mb nic
[06:04] <CarlFK> 03:04.0 Ethernet controller: Intel Corporation 82557/8/9/0/1 Ethernet Pro 100 (rev 08)
[09:32] <mpt> evand, hi, where is your gallery of Ubiquity screenshots of each stage?
[09:33] <evand> mpt: http://people.canonical.com/~evand/screenshots/
[09:34] <evand> I should probably update some of those (the slideshow especially).  I'll pull down the latest daily-live and do that now.
[09:34] <mpt> evand, yes, I see 8.10 there, I think the text has changed a bit since then
[09:35] <evand> http://people.canonical.com/~evand/screenshots/ubiquity/1.12.3/ is Jaunty, but the point still stands.
[09:35] <mpt> ah, thanks
[09:36] <ogra> cjwatson, d-i is quite unhappy on armel (imx51, vfat image) due to the fact that there is no dist/stable symlink to dist/karmic, ghiven that vfat doesnt support symlinking, is there any way around that ? i tried moving karmic -> stable which gets me through partman but then debootstrap cant find the codename for the release
[09:37] <cjwatson> ogra: are you using cdrom-detect?
[09:37] <ogra> i thought lool added that recently
[09:38] <cjwatson> it's a question suggesting a yes or no answer ;-)
[09:38] <cjwatson> actually, not sure that's relevant. could I please have a full syslog
[09:41] <mpt> evand, sorry for the silly question, but is Wubi on the live CD?
[09:41] <cjwatson> yes
[09:41] <evand> mpt: indeed it is.  In the root of the CD.
[09:42] <mpt> thanks
[09:42] <ogra> cjwatson, i see cdrom-detect in the log and indeed its the part that fails when looking for dist/stable, i'll save the log somewhere, d-i installs are not a high prio on armel atm
[09:43] <cjwatson> well, it was my memory that cdrom-detect would be the relevant bit, but on looking at the code I can't see exactly which bit might fail. that's why I asked for the log
[09:46] <lool> cjwatson: Do you remember that weird missing font issue I had a while ago on lpia?  I just hit the same on armel alternates: black squares when prompted by to type some keys to detect my layout
[09:46] <lool> bug #357630
[09:48] <ogra> cjwatson, http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/syslog dont handle it as high prio though, armel alternate is just a nice to have
[09:51] <cjwatson> ogra: why did you say that cdrom-detect is the part that fails? (it isn't)
[09:51] <ogra> in the UI it seems to be the part that fails
[09:51] <cjwatson> it fails due to something else
[09:51] <ogra> i have to mount /dev/mmcblk0p2 manually and move the dir
[09:51] <cjwatson> at least so the log suggests?
[09:51] <cjwatson> what is the error message in the UI?
[09:52]  * lool managed to load components from CDROM with the latest dove alternate, yeah!
[09:52] <lool> Just need a preseed fix for cdrom-detext
[09:52] <ogra> well, that it could not detect a cd i then get offered to load cd drivers from removable media
[09:53] <cjwatson> please don't paraphrase error messages
[09:53] <ogra> sorry, i dont recall the exact text and already overwrote my SD
[09:53] <cjwatson> ok, can't help then, sorry
[09:53] <cjwatson> feel free to come back when you have the exact text
[09:53] <ogra> i'll do it again later
[09:53] <cjwatson> and then I can grep for the relevant code paths
[09:54] <cjwatson> I'd like to fix this but since you say it's not high-priority I don't want to spend too much time investigating something that might turn out to be a red herring
[09:54] <ogra> right
[09:55] <ogra> i'll test again after the live test
[09:55] <ogra> which is the actual image we care about
[10:06] <dpm> cjwatson: good morning, I've just been pointed out by translators that there is something wrong with the ubiquity templates, now both 'ubiquity-desktop' and 'ubiquity' are the same templates. It seems that the wrong template was uploaded for 'ubiquity' -> https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+source/ubiquity
[10:06] <cjwatson> how could that have happened?
[10:06] <cjwatson> do you mean I did a wrong manual upload or something?
[10:06] <dpm> I don't know, it seems to have happened 13 hours ago. Was there an upload at about that time?
[10:07] <cjwatson> a package upload yes, but I didn't do anything manual
[10:07] <cjwatson> if the package upload caused something bad to happen, then metadata in Launchpad must be wrong
[10:07] <dpm> let me grab some launchpadders...
[10:08] <cjwatson> and it wasn't the first package upload since I was last aware of the metadata being changed around
[10:10] <jtv> dpm, you called?
[10:10] <dpm> yes, thanks for coming, jtv, here's the issue:
[10:10] <dpm> https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+source/ubiquity
[10:11] <dpm> has 2 templates
[10:11] <dpm> which are now identical
[10:11] <dpm> the 'ubiquity' one is wrong
[10:11] <dpm> it used to be a much bigger template
[10:12] <dpm> and we don't know what has caused to change it
[10:12] <dpm> there was a package upload about 13 hours ago
[10:12] <dpm> but cjwatson hadn't done any manual uploads
[10:13] <jtv> The configuration is pretty weird.
[10:14] <jtv> The ubiquity-desktop template has domain "ubiquity"
[10:14] <jtv> whereas the ubiquity template has domain "debconf"
[10:14] <jtv> The ubiquity-desktop template also has filename po/ubiquity.pot
[10:16] <cjwatson> so somebody screwed up the rename
[10:16] <cjwatson> po/ubiquity.pot is correct for ubiquity-desktop
[10:16] <jtv> I see two uploads, both approved to be imported into the ubiquity template.
[10:16] <cjwatson> the ubiquity template should come from debian/real-po/templates.pot
[10:17] <cjwatson> I have no idea what its domain should be, domains aren't significant to debconf translations so it would be an artificial construction
[10:17] <jtv> I'm editing the entry.
[10:18] <cjwatson> jtv: how do we avoid losing translation data here?
[10:18] <cjwatson> can we revert that part of the db to before the incorrect import?
[10:18] <jtv> cjwatson: the translation data should come back instantly when the templates are set right again.
[10:33] <dpm> jtv: I just got disconnected. Just to make sure, did you get my previous messages with the description of the issue?
[10:33] <cjwatson> dpm: I'll paste you the relevant bits in /msg
[10:33] <jtv> dpm: no
[10:34] <jtv> dpm: unless you mean the one 22 minutes ago
[10:34] <jtv> nothing after that
[10:34] <cjwatson> we got everything up to "but cjwatson hadn't done any manual uploads"
[10:34] <cjwatson> to clarify, I did manual uploads *ages* ago
[10:34] <jtv> Meanwhile I've approved the new uploads to go into the right templates.
[10:34] <dpm> jtv: any ideas on what could have happened here?
[10:34] <dpm>  I see that https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+source/ubiquity/+imports?field.filter_status=all&field.filter_extension=pot shows two approved templates
[10:34] <dpm>  To further confuse matters, it seems that debian/real-po/templates.pot will be imported into 'ubiquity' (which would be the correct template)
[10:34] <dpm>  whereas po/ubiquity.pot seems that will _also_ be imported into 'ubiquity' <- that might be the problem. That template should be imported into 'ubiquity-desktop'
[10:34] <cjwatson> weeks, I think
[10:35] <jtv> dpm: I thought I just fixed that!?
[10:35] <cjwatson> I *think* I did check after that and observed sane output, though I don't remember for sure
[10:35] <dpm> jtv: what did you fix and what needed fixing?
[10:35] <cjwatson> jtv: he's pasting what he said between being disconnected and realising he was disconnected
[10:35] <jtv> phew, still fixed
[10:36] <jtv> cjwatson: silly me!  thanks
[10:36] <jtv> dpm: somehow, both templates got approved for the same template.  I can't think why, but given the strange configuration it's not entirely unthinkable
[10:38] <jtv> Figuring this out could take some effort.  Normally template approvals are based on paths, which in this case shouldn't present a problem (even if they are weird).
[10:38] <jtv> So _if_ this was an auto-approval, why was it not based on paths?
[10:38] <jtv> Or was it based on paths, and have the paths changed since?
[10:39] <cjwatson> they haven't changed since the last time we worked on the configuration here; they have certainly not *exchanged*
[10:40] <jtv> Evan Dandrea also uploaded a template btw
[10:41] <jtv> That was on Friday.  It was po/ubiquity.pot but it went into the ubiquity template, not the ubiquity-desktop one.
[10:43] <cjwatson> that would have been a package upload
[10:43] <cjwatson> so that just means we know the configuration was broken at least back to Friday
[10:43] <cjwatson> Evan's package upload was actually on Thursday but I guess it took a while to get through the queue
[10:45] <jtv> May be timezones as well.  The time I see is localized for me and says Friday 01:03 ICT, so that's Thursday for you.
[10:45] <evand> Yeah, I was in PDT on Thursday.
[10:46] <jtv> So that was a package upload?
[10:47] <evand> yes
[10:48] <CIA-33> tasksel: cjwatson * r1422 ubuntu/ (6 files in 3 dirs):
[10:48] <CIA-33> tasksel: Omit tasks with no descriptions (namely ubuntu-edu-preschool,
[10:48] <CIA-33> tasksel: ubuntu-edu-primary, ubuntu-edu-secondary, and ubuntu-edu-tertiary;
[10:48] <CIA-33> tasksel: LP: #438546).
[10:50] <jtv> I'm digging through the templates approval logic a bit
[10:51] <CIA-33> tasksel: cjwatson * r1423 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 2.73ubuntu22
[10:53] <jtv> Nope, no way that could have gotten auto-approved without a path match
[10:55] <jtv> Which leaves 2 possibilities: manual approval, or an upload to a page for the wrong template.
[10:55] <jtv> cjwatson: do you still use the lp translations tools for uploading these files?
[10:56] <cjwatson> yes
[10:56] <dpm> jtv: is there a way to track if it was manually approved? I'm not concerned about who did it, I'm only interested to see if we'll have to keep an eye on this template
[10:56] <cjwatson> I no longer have the command lines to hand
[10:56] <jtv> dpm: we'd have to ask the sysadmins to dig through access logs.  Ugly.
[10:56] <jtv> Anyway, what if the confusion happened because a translation domain got confused with a template name?
[10:56] <dpm> jtv: don't worry, I'll ask at the u-t-c list
[10:57] <jtv> One template is name ubiquity and the other has domain ubiquity, that's bound to cause trouble somewhere.
[10:58] <jtv> What do we know about when this template started being wrong?
[10:58] <ogra> cjwatson, mind if i make the "debian/genbuilddeps" instructions more explicit when i actully do the missing run for my last b-d change from yesterday ?
[10:58] <ogra> "Note that this comment can also be used to generate a Build-Depends line, by running the debian/genbuilddeps program." makes it sound very optional and i always forget it
[10:59] <cjwatson> jtv: the template was renamed from "debconf" to "ubiquity" a while back because "debconf" was 'confusing'.
[10:59] <cjwatson> I think that was not clearly the best possible decision
[11:00] <cjwatson> ogra: I'd prefer you didn't introduce another thing to make that file more complicated to merge
[11:00] <jtv> cjwatson: ubiquity-debconf might have been safer
[11:00] <cjwatson> ogra: if you want it changed, mail me improved text and I'll look at changing it upstream
[11:00] <cjwatson> dpm: ^-
[11:00] <ogra> ok, couldnt debian/genbuilddeps be run automatically ?
[11:00] <cjwatson> no.
[11:00] <cjwatson> leave that alone please :)
[11:00] <ogra> ok
[11:01] <cjwatson> generating build-deps entirely automatically tends to be bad and wrong; I expect people to read comments
[11:01] <ogra> i wasnt planning to :)
[11:01] <cjwatson> (it causes problems with timestamp ordering in builds)
[11:01] <cjwatson> cf. why that cdbs debian/control generation option is generally considered forbidden
[11:03] <ogra> ah
[11:04] <dpm> cjwatson: jtv, I still believe that 'debconf' alone might be confusing to translators when it appears in the global list of templates to translate, as there is no connection to the ubiquity source package there. jtv: I'd be more than happy to have 'ubiquity-debconf' and 'ubiquity-desktop' if necessary, but I don't see the problem in the previous name. What is confusing right now is the domain name, but if I understand it correctly, it is not releva
[11:04] <dpm> nt in those particular templates, so we could change the domain names to match the template names
[11:04] <jtv> dpm: having them match would be best from my perspective, yes.
[11:07] <dpm> so, jtv, cjwatson, would you agree if I do the following changes?
[11:07] <dpm> Template name: ubiquity-debconf (renamed from ubiquity)
[11:07] <dpm> Domain name: ubiquity-debconf (renamed from debconf)
[11:07] <dpm> Template name: ubiquity-desktop (stays the same)
[11:07] <dpm> Domain name: ubiquity-desktop (renamed from ubiquity)
[11:08] <jtv> dpm: wonderful
[11:08] <jtv> molt bé
[11:08] <dpm> thanks :)
[11:09] <cjwatson> hang on, what's the effect of changing the ubiquity -> ubiquity-desktop domain in Launchpad?
[11:09] <cjwatson> BTW I think it's a bug that 'debconf' is displayed to translators on its own without the context of the package name as well
[11:09] <cjwatson> s/is/was/
[11:10] <cjwatson> I mean, no wonder they were confused if they weren't told what package it was in :)
[11:13] <jtv> Changing the domain means that the MO files will be installed with a different name.
[11:14] <jtv> But if this is apparently an installer thing, does that matter?
[11:14] <cjwatson> this isn't in language packs
[11:14] <cjwatson> so I assume the answer to that is roughly "what MO files?"
[11:14] <cjwatson> right, in this case they just get merged into a .desktop file
[11:14] <cjwatson> or files
[11:18] <dpm> oh dear my connection is flaky today, too much rain, I guess. jtv, I'm not trying to be annoying, just checking if you had the chance to answer the last question :)
[11:18] <jtv> dpm: last I saw from you was "thanks"
[11:19] <jtv> Then from cjwatson, what's the effect of changing the domain?
[11:19] <dpm> yes, then I said
[11:19] <dpm> jtv: in that particular case, since ubiquity-desktop is not exported in language packs, there will be no effect in that, I guess?
[11:19] <jtv> dpm: missed that, but based on what colin says, that's right.
[11:21] <dpm> ok, thanks.
[11:21] <cjwatson> so those changes sound fine then; presumably translators will need to be notified again
[11:22] <dpm> cjwatson: yes, I have to respond the e-mail in which they were wondering about the duplicate templates, so I'll announce that there
[11:23] <dpm> I can do the domain name changes straight away, but for the template name changes do you think it's better if I wait until the templates have been imported, jtv?
[11:24] <jtv> dpm: doesn't matter.  The uploads are attached to templates.  They don't remember domain names as such.
[11:25] <dpm> jtv: that's what I meant, the domain name changes are ok, but the template name changes, can I do them straight away or better wait until the approved templates in the queue have been imported?
[11:26] <jtv> dpm: no need to wait.
[11:26] <dpm> great, thanks
[11:32]  * jtv goes hunter-gathering
[11:35] <dpm> cjwatson: and the last question on this: in the e-mail where the duplicate template was pointed out, Timo was also mentioning that there are some untranslated items. Is the next translation export scheduled, so that I could tell translators to test them?  (once the templates issue has been sorted). Or would you rather prefer to have a bug filed for all untranslated strings?
[11:35] <dpm> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-translators/2009-September/002784.html
[11:37] <cjwatson> dpm: I *hate* *hate* *hate* combined bugs for translation issues
[11:37] <cjwatson> they're abysmally painful to deal with
[11:37] <dpm> good that I asked :)
[11:37] <cjwatson> one bug per problem would be easier, after somebody has confirmed that they aren't just missing translations - i.e. that the string in question is actually not translatable
[11:38] <cjwatson> we have lots of old translation bugs lying around because we haven't quite fixed one out of seven issues reported or something
[11:38] <cjwatson> it's just hopeless
[11:39] <dpm> ok, I'll recommend that, then
[11:39] <cjwatson> thanks
[11:41] <dpm> np, just so I or the other translators can figure out whether the translations do not appear simply because they haven't been exported, where is the best place to quickly track the dates in which there were translation exports? The package changelogs?
[11:41] <cjwatson> yes
[11:41] <dpm> great, thanks
[11:41] <cjwatson> I'd look now but I'm doing wubi testing
[11:45] <cjwatson> hmm, wubi just sits there at the end of partman for me
[11:46]  * cjwatson tries it not in verbose mode
[11:47] <cjwatson> ah, there we go
[11:48] <evand> cjwatson: thanks for unbreaking oem-config (whereby it would go straight into oem-config rather than the preparation desktop).  That one had me scratching my head a bit.
[11:50] <cjwatson> yeah, I screwed up the job a bit
[11:58] <cjwatson> evand: could you upload a new wubi soonest, please?
[11:58] <cjwatson> the current image still has grub 1.97~beta2
[11:59] <cjwatson> ubiquity shutdown is still messy :-/
[11:59] <davmor2> cjwatson: very
[11:59] <evand> weird.  I uploaded a new one this morning
[11:59] <evand> I guess it didn't pick it up
[11:59] <evand> or something is still pulling the wrong version
[11:59]  * evand digs
[12:00] <davmor2> flickering between desktop and shutdown text.  Should xsplash take over on shutdown cjwatson
[12:00] <cjwatson> no the problem is that gdm keeps respawning
[12:00] <cjwatson> evand: was the last desktop CD build since then?
[12:03] <evand> cjwatson: 20090929.1 was, yes
[12:04] <cjwatson> I don't think that's the sole cause of the problems here though
[12:04] <cjwatson> though it would impede a fix
[12:29] <evand> hrm, using wubi from rookery shows grub 1.97~beta3
[12:29]  * evand grabs the actual cd image
[12:32] <cjwatson> oh, I have 20090929 here
[12:32] <cjwatson> not .1
[12:32] <evand> ah, that would do it
[12:34] <cjwatson> I guess I'll rsync that quickly then
[13:00] <evand1> hrm, automatic-ubiquity is broken
[13:01] <davmor2> evand1: is that what wubi uses?
[13:01] <evand1> yes
[13:10] <evand> ah, maybe it's not broken after all
[13:10] <evand> ignore me for the time being :)
[13:13] <lool> I think we're using g-i for amd64 netboots, it there a way to disable it?
[13:13] <evand> mpt: http://people.canonical.com/~evand/screenshots/ubiquity/9.10-beta-candidate/
[13:16] <CIA-33> ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu: evand * r157 ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/debian/changelog: Use correct version number in the changelog.
[13:47] <mpt> evand, thanks -- why does <http://people.canonical.com/~evand/screenshots/ubiquity/9.10-beta-candidate/4-automatic-partitioning.png> not include the side-by-side option?
[13:52] <lool> Ah, I know why I get the issue with the fonts
[13:52] <lool> It happens in non-fb mode
[13:52] <ogra> non fb defaults to vt102
[13:53] <ogra> (for TERM)
[13:57] <lool> ogra: Funny, it's in that piece of code you quoted the otherday
[13:58] <lool> readlink /proc/self/fd/0 returns /dev/console which d-i understands as a serial console
[13:58] <ogra> yeah
[13:58] <ogra> whyevery though
[13:58] <ogra> *ever
[13:58] <lool> Hmm no, that's only if I break with init=/bin/sh
[13:58] <lool> Bah
[14:08] <davmor2> mpt: I'm assuming that the partition is too small to fit 2 installs side-by-side
[14:09] <davmor2> mpt: if you would like I can take a shot that shows up as many different install methods as possible for you?
[14:16] <superm1> ate
[14:16] <superm1> oops, sorry
[14:16] <mpt> davmor2, thanks but no, I was just wondering why it is missing
[14:17] <mpt> davmor2, if it's hidden for that reason, probably there should be an explicit explanation of why it's not there
[14:17] <mpt> otherwise people who are expecting it will wonder why
[14:18] <davmor2> mpt: that's what I'm assuming the issue is.  But I'll be running a whole heap of installs so I can take a quick screenshot if you change your mind
[14:25] <evand> mpt: I didn't have enough space on the existing partition for both.
[14:26] <davmor2> Yay assumption correct :)
[14:29] <mpt> evand, would you like a bug report for explaining that in Lucid then?
[14:30] <evand> mpt: please
[14:30] <mpt> k
[14:32] <evand> ah, looks like "splash" breaks the ubiquity upstart job somehow.
[14:54] <mpt> evand, reported bug 438709
[14:55] <evand> mpt: thanks!
[15:05] <CIA-33> casper: cjwatson * r700 trunk/ (debian/changelog scripts/casper-bottom/25configure_init): Fix tty device name construction to work with new upstart (LP: #438678).
[15:07] <cjwatson> evand: maybe ubiquity's upstart job needs to emit starting-dm
[15:07] <cjwatson> cf. recent gdm change
[15:07] <cjwatson> same for oem-config I suppose
[15:09] <cjwatson> something like http://paste.ubuntu.com/281338/ maybe?
[15:09] <evand> cjwatson: cool, I'll look into that.  Thanks
[15:09] <cjwatson> maybe we should turn off splash for the beta
[15:09] <cjwatson> for the live CD
[15:10] <evand> yeah, ugly, but I agree
[15:11] <evand> actually, let me see if this really fixes it
[15:11] <evand> oddly, using break=bottom also makes it disappear
[15:11] <evand> so I'll have to repack the squashfs
[15:13] <cjwatson> break=bottom kills usplash I think
[15:13] <cjwatson> so if my speculation is right, that the problem is that usplash doesn't get killed at the right time ...
[15:13] <evand> ahhh
[15:20]  * cjwatson wonders why c-a-f1 doesn't work in wubi
[15:21] <cjwatson> while installing, I mean
[15:27] <evand> it doesn't work anywhere
[15:27] <evand> ogra posted a bug
[15:27] <evand> bug 438678
[15:27] <ogra> cjwatson fixed it already :)
[15:28] <cjwatson> that wasn't quite what I meant though, I don't think
[15:28] <cjwatson> in this case, it simply doesn't switch away from X at all
[15:28] <cjwatson> it's not that it switches away but the command that's running is broken
[15:29] <cjwatson> which is what I'd expect from a bogus upstart job - unless upstart is taking the trouble to notice the failure and actively tear down the termianl
[15:29] <evand> oh, my apologies
[15:31]  * ogra is confused ...
[15:31] <ogra> /usr/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/casper-bottom/22serialtty is clearly in the package ... buildlog and dpkg -L both agree
[15:31] <ogra> but i dont see it in my livefs
[15:31] <ogra> nor in initramfs
[15:32] <rgreening> evand: bug 438316
[15:32] <ogra> and i definately have the right casper version
[15:33] <rgreening> evand: that's the info we discussed the other day regarding my usb issue.. if you have any other suggestions... or ideas
[15:41] <evand> cjwatson: that indeed fixes it
[15:42] <evand> rgreening: cool, I'll take a look in a bit
[15:42] <rgreening> evand: much appreciated. you'll likely have a better idea where to go next.... more so than I
[15:42]  * rgreening is stumped!
[15:43] <cjwatson> ogra: lool made it executable recently in bzr; I can't immediately see a mechanism by which that would cause that particular failure, but I suppose it's possible
[15:43] <cjwatson> lool: could you do the CIA stuff in http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Installer/Development to your casper branch so that commits show up here, please?
[15:43] <rgreening> evand: on another note, this Acer issue prompted me to buy a Dell... hahah
[15:43] <ogra> cjwatson, yeah, and not seeing it atm was just my stipidity
[15:44] <evand> heh
[15:44] <ogra> *stupidity
[15:44] <ogra> cjwatson, i did /usr/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/casper-bottom/<tab><tab> ... which indeed doesnt show nonexecutable files (do'h)
[15:47] <CIA-33> ubiquity: evand * r3489 ubiquity/debian/ (3 files):
[15:47] <CIA-33> ubiquity: Emit starting-dm in the ubiquity and oem-config upstart jobs.
[15:47] <CIA-33> ubiquity: Thanks Colin Watson!
[16:07] <cjwatson> evand: can you confirm that simply removing splash makes it work ok?
[16:07] <evand> cjwatson: already have
[16:07] <evand> I can double-double check though :)
[16:08] <cjwatson> ok, good - slangasek sounded like he didn't want to rebuild the livefs if possible
[16:08] <cjwatson> nah, that's ok :)
[16:08] <evand> okay
[16:08] <cjwatson> any idea why wubi installations often seem to hang on "Checking the installation..."?
[16:09] <evand> should I upload this change to ubiquity just in case we need to rebuild anyway?
[16:09] <evand> not sure offhand.
[16:09] <davmor2> cjwatson: is that about the 7% mark?
[16:09] <evand> I didn't notice it in my testing
[16:10] <cjwatson> davmor2: no
[16:10] <cjwatson> evand: might as well get it into the queue, yes
[16:11] <evand> okay
[16:11] <cjwatson> it's immediately after "Computing the new partitions..." as a secondary progress message, and that progress message isn't cleared, but the progress bar sits at 100% and it says "Checking the installation..." as a primary progress message
[16:11] <cjwatson> BTW, as a general rule, progress percentages aren't necessarily all that useful - they often aren't quite the same between systems. The text of the message is more useful
[16:12] <cjwatson> you can't easily get from a percentage to the place in the code that's responsible
[16:13] <davmor2> cjwatson: cool remember that for future reference
[16:14] <cjwatson> evand: I'm not sure it's entirely reproducible, as I've been seeing it intermittently, although more often than not
[16:17] <cjwatson> of course "Checking the installation..." is a fairly long set of steps at the start - perhaps more informative to say that it happens after guided partitioning
[16:18] <cjwatson> ah, now after rebooting into Windows and back, it works. maybe a filesystem needed checking? ugh
[16:18] <evand> I imagine the lack of a vt doesn't help here
[16:20] <cjwatson> that may have been why I was pondering this, yes :)
[16:20] <cjwatson> oh well, let's see if it manages to comprehend my hacked cd
[16:33] <cjwatson> j,,
[16:33] <cjwatson> oops
[16:33] <cjwatson> hmm. I see the wubi bug. now I wonder how I fix it
[16:34] <evand1> oh?
[16:34] <cjwatson> when lupin-support is installed, /host isn't bind-mounted onto /target
[16:34] <cjwatson> onto /target/host that is
[16:35] <cjwatson> and so /etc/grub.d/10_lupin ignores the device
[16:37] <CIA-33> ubiquity: evand * r3490 ubiquity/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.99.27
[16:40] <evand1> ah
[16:41] <cjwatson> if I'm very lucky, it's a one-liner
[16:41] <cjwatson> but a livefs rebuild, sadly
[17:23] <lool> cjwatson: Sure; is there a list of packages for which we use CIA?
[17:23] <lool> cjwatson: I now realize casper is an installer-ish package
[17:23] <cjwatson> there isn't
[17:23] <cjwatson> sorry
[17:23] <lool> cjwatson: (You're aware we cant rebuild the armel livefses?)
[17:23] <cjwatson> yes
[17:23] <cjwatson> wubi is not used on armel, last I checked :)
[17:24] <CIA-33> casper: lool * r701 trunk/ (debian/changelog scripts/casper-bottom/22serialtty): scripts/casper-bottom/22serialtty: pass -L to getty and set term to vt100.
[17:24] <CIA-33> casper: lool * r702 trunk/ (debian/changelog scripts/casper-bottom/22serialtty): scripts/casper-bottom/22serialtty: set +x...
[17:24] <lool> cjwatson: Ok; just making sure you dont rebuild all livefses or something
[17:25] <lool> cjwatson: Not something you'd do, but I wasn't sure there werent other changes  :)
[18:12] <CIA-33> partman-auto-loop: cjwatson * r53 ubuntu/ (debian/changelog finish.d/create_host_mountpoint):
[18:12] <CIA-33> partman-auto-loop: Bind-mount /host on /target/host during installation, to match the
[18:12] <CIA-33> partman-auto-loop: installed system after reboot (LP: #435153).
[18:13] <CIA-33> partman-auto-loop: cjwatson * r54 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 0ubuntu18
[18:15] <CIA-33> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3491 ubiquity/ (d-i/manifest debian/changelog):
[18:15] <CIA-33> ubiquity: Automatic update of included source packages: partman-auto-loop
[18:15] <CIA-33> ubiquity: 0ubuntu18.
[18:19] <ogra> lool, there is a list in the filter on the cia website
[18:20] <ogra> (in the custom filter, not the one you get on the first page)
[18:21] <CIA-33> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3492 ubiquity/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.99.28
[18:26] <lool> ogra: Oh right
[18:26]  * lool would love colours
[18:27]  * ogra hands lool some pots with paint
[18:28] <lool> I remember playing with setting up my own cia server when it was regularly going down and setting up some cute colours for committer/project etc.; it's certainly nice to have so much time on one's hands  :-)
[21:16] <rgreening> evand1: hey
[21:17] <rgreening> evand1: you know that USB issue I have?  But I must insert a CD device first.. that is bizarre.
[21:31] <rgreening> evand1: I've updated the bug 438316 with newer narrowed down info. Im so stumped .. haha
[22:41] <cjwatson> davmor2: and grub.cfg?
[22:43] <davmor2> cjwatson: that should be in the disks/boot/grub folder right?
[22:44] <cjwatson> no, it's inside root.disk
[22:44] <cjwatson> ignore disks/boot/grub, I know it's an empty directory and it's a minor wubi bug that it's still being created
[22:45] <davmor2> under boot/grub on root.disk there is only grubenv
[22:46] <cjwatson> wuh
[22:46] <cjwatson> well that would explain the problem, but it didn't happen to me
[22:46] <cjwatson> I wonder if you have filesystem corruption
[22:47] <cjwatson> *is* there anything in /ubuntu/disks/boot/grub/ ?
[22:47] <davmor2> no
[22:47] <cjwatson> ok, I don't know what the problem might be :(
[22:48] <cjwatson> there's no indication in the logs
[22:48] <davmor2> I'll wipe wubi run a check on the vista fs and reinstall and see if it was just a glitch
[22:49] <cjwatson> what size is your installation?
[22:49] <cjwatson> just in case I can reproduce it with a larger installation or something
[22:49] <cjwatson> although that'll be tomorrow at this point, not today
[22:50] <davmor2> whatever the default is I think it's 16gig
[22:50] <davmor2> 2 ticks and I'll tell you
[22:50] <cjwatson> hmm, I won't be able to manage that here
[22:51] <cjwatson> I can do up to about 8GB
[22:52] <davmor2> 17 gb infact
[22:52] <cjwatson> but mine is 5GB right now, and there shouldn't be any intrinsic difference ther
[22:52] <cjwatson> e
[23:22] <cjwatson> davmor2: hmm, also you can't have been seeing this problem last time because you *did* have a grub.cfg then
[23:22] <cjwatson> I dunno, wubi just anecdotally seems not very stable to me - I suspect there's some underlying kernel issue
[23:22] <cjwatson> I'll do another test with a non-hacked-up image tomorrow
[23:23] <davmor2> cjwatson: vista sack of crap disk check utility is just finishing off after hmm 30 minutes of running so I'll be able to re run the install maybe today :(
[23:37] <ramvi> I don't understand why it doesn't say anywhere what's needed to compile wubi
[23:37] <ramvi> On the wiki it says to do: make prerequisites, but it doesnt work
[23:37] <evand1> ramvi: that's out of date documentation
[23:37] <ramvi> What's needed? mingw32..
[23:38] <ramvi> I'm still getting errors
[23:38] <evand1> build-essential, grub-pc
[23:39] <ramvi> evand1: thank you
[23:40] <ramvi> evand1: Sorry to bother you, but I'm still getting the error:
[23:40] <ramvi> sh: msgfmt: not found
[23:41] <ramvi> make: *** [translations] Error 127
[23:41] <evand1> evan@bunny:~$ dpkg -S /usr/bin/msgfmt
[23:41] <evand1> gettext: /usr/bin/msgfmt
[23:41] <evand1> so gettext as well
[23:43] <ramvi> evand1: thank you! I'll update the wiki
[23:43] <evand1> thanks