[00:09] <Jazzva> asac, sorry for the late message
 Jazzva, if asac shows up, please tell him i'm outside, he can call me if he is needs me, i'm still in the area. I may take the car this afternoon.
[00:13] <Jazzva> yay...new patch for nspluginwrapper... it might be the fix for what was wrong here :)
[00:42] <fta> [reed], I have a car, you can store your stuff in it if you want.
[00:57] <fta> crimsun, ok. the thing is that all my issues with p-a are from my desktops, i barely use my laptop so i have far less issues with it :P
[00:58] <fta> crimsun, meaning i won't be able to show you the troubles i'm experiencing. yet, i can sure talk about them
[01:00] <crimsun> fta: ok, that's fine.  I have plenty of paper and a pen.
[01:08] <asac> Jazzva: hi
[01:09] <Jazzva> asac, hello :)
[01:09] <asac> Jazzva: let me know if nspluginwrapper is the good
[01:09] <Jazzva> sure, I think I'll test this patch tomorrow afternoon, i have to go out in the morning
[01:10] <asac> great :) ... hopefully my hangover will be over tomorrow
[01:10] <Jazzva> haha
[01:11] <crimsun> hopefully by 8:59 AM at least
[01:11] <asac> heh ... imo thats far too early :)
[01:12] <asac> crimsun: are you here yet?
[01:12] <crimsun> I'm down the street at the wild palms, so I'm "here" but not at the domain.
[01:12] <Jazzva> asac, I forgot different time-zones... tomorrow afternoon UTC :)
[01:13] <asac> how far is that away ;)
[01:13] <crimsun> .6 mi or .8 km
[01:13] <asac> oh. thats not that far then
[01:13] <crimsun> I'll probably just walk over in a few minutes
[01:14] <asac> @time los_angeles
[01:23] <Jazzva> asac, blip.fm now works with nspluginwrapper :)
[01:23] <Jazzva> that was mostly the only thing not working when I tested the last time :)
[01:24] <asac> Jazzva: rock on. so ets get this crack p tomorrow ;)
[01:24] <Jazzva> ok
[01:25] <asac> fta: tab mix plus somehow makes my session restore go mad
[01:25] <Jazzva> I'll push now to my nspluginwrapper/ubuntu branch :) (I'll make ubuntu.1.1.10 for that release)
[01:25] <asac> i had a crash and after restarting i have 580 tabs open
[01:25] <asac> seems morelike it opens the complete hhistory of last week or something
[01:25] <Jazzva> and then I could prepare ubiquity extension package... it's really useful, stable and from mozilla lab
[01:25] <asac> Jazzva: is license proper for that?
[01:26] <asac> or do we need to talk to someone?
[01:26] <fta> asac, i dropped tmp long ago, ff3 is far better for tabs than ff2 was.
[01:26] <fta> asac, why do you need tmp for?
[01:26] <Jazzva> asac, I think it is tri-license
[01:26] <fta> whay
[01:26] <fta> what
[01:27] <Jazzva> asac: All of the code underlying the Ubiquity experiment is being released as open source software under the the GPL/MPL/LGPL tri-license.
[01:27] <asac> fta: i dont need it ... i installed it
[01:27] <asac> to test something
[01:27] <asac> fta: thought you used it too?
[01:27] <asac> e.g. to have multi line tabs
[01:29] <fta> i used it for years, i stopped around ff3.0a8 when it became incompatible (ie broke ff)
[01:59] <[reed]> fta: awesome, that'll be great
[01:59] <[reed]> fta: I'll find you on Tuesday and get my suitcase put in your car
[01:59] <[reed]> put my suitcase in your car*
[02:00] <fta> sure
[02:00] <fta> asac, ready?
[02:00] <asac> fta: i will be down in 5 minutes :) ... habe to brush my teeth
[02:02] <fta> ok
[02:02]  * asac puts on his winter clothes :)
[02:05]  * asac goes down
[02:05] <asac> fta: ^^
[06:42] <asac> @time
[06:42] <asac> @time berlin
[07:02] <fta> asac, there's a fridge and it's empty and off. try the drawers on the right
[07:06] <asac> fta: found it ;)
[07:09] <asac> @time los_angeles
[12:58] <gnomefreak> whos here?
[14:11] <gnomefreak> asac: fta_out when you return please see me or see bug 306229 its a request to remove iceweasel packages since they are strictly dependant on iceweasel and we have updated packages for our browsers.
[14:19] <gnomefreak> wikis hate me
[14:19] <gnomefreak> i still cant get foxmarks to conform to rest of page :(
[15:49] <asac> @time
[16:09] <asac> fta: going down now ;)
[16:10] <fta> asac, i'm back from breakfast, packing my stuff now. cu downstairs
[19:27] <asac> @time
[19:55] <emgent> hello
[19:55] <emgent> so, i have little problem about R-Kiosk packaging
[19:56] <emgent> seems build fine, but when i try to install it browser seems dont see plugin.
[19:56] <emgent> yes, yes, i saw wiki.
[19:56] <emgent> :-)
[19:56] <emgent> http://<IP_ADDRESS>/tamtam/result/r-kiosk_0.7.2echolinux1/r-kiosk_0.7.2echolinux1_amd64.build
[19:57] <emgent> source pagage and .deb available here
[19:57] <emgent> http://<IP_ADDRESS>/tamtam/result/r-kiosk_0.7.2echolinux1/
[19:57] <emgent> someone can take a look? this is my first mozilla plugin. and is really wird..
[19:57] <emgent> *weird*
[19:57] <emgent> have .jar included.
[19:57] <jetsaredim> not sure where jar files are supposed to go in the filesystem
[20:00] <jetsaredim> asac: do you know of such things?
[20:17] <emgent> hehehe ;-)
[20:17] <emgent> UDS talk imho
[20:20] <emgent> asac: hi again
[20:21] <emgent> hello dolske
[21:01] <asac> emgent: so whats your issue?
[21:02]  * asac lunchtime
[21:02] <emgent> asac: http://<IP_ADDRESS>/tamtam/result/r-kiosk_0.7.2echolinux1/
[21:02] <emgent> package build fine install fine but firefox cant find extention.
[21:02] <asac> emgent: whats that?
[21:03] <emgent> it`s a test in thi link you can see source and deb
[21:03] <emgent> s/thi/this/
[21:05] <emgent> asac: some idea? this is my first moz package, i saw wiki and other moz-extetion source.. but i'm sure there is some error.
[22:10] <mconnor> asac / fta_out : I'll likely be around on Thursday/Friday this week
[22:10] <mconnor> unless you have a specific timeslot where you're free where we can catch up
[22:14] <asac> mconnor: i have reserved time slots on those days ... so it fits really well
[22:15] <mconnor> sweet
[22:15] <asac> mconnor: http://paste.ubuntu.com/82668/
[22:25] <mconnor> 9:45 AM? boo ;)
[22:28] <mconnor> asac: itym Albor ;)
[22:28] <mconnor> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-jaunty/albor/ not /dia/
[22:28] <asac> mconnor: heh ... first suggestion was 9:00 ;) ... so its an improvement
[22:29] <mconnor> I mean, I can get the limo for whenever, I'm sure
[22:29] <asac> mconnor: strange ... someone moved them
[22:29] <mconnor> (you think I'm kidding, my hotel has a stretch limo for a shuttle, it's slightly bizarre)
[22:30] <asac> mconnor: sounds cool ... 5 star hotel?
[22:30] <mconnor> nah
[22:30] <mconnor> nothing like that
[22:30] <mconnor> it's probably 3.5 at best
[22:31] <mconnor> I figure it's just smart marketing
[22:31] <asac> mconnor: maybe it was cheaper to get a used limo than a new shuttle ;)
[22:36] <sebner> asac: hey, would you mind helping emgent packaging a mozilla addon?
[22:36] <sebner> *package
[22:36] <asac> sebner: sure ... but certainly not today ... he can also ask Jazzva
[22:37] <asac> inf act,  Jazzva is our extension team lead
[22:37] <sebner> asac: I see, thx. afaik he needs it today, that's the problem. I tried to help him but not really successful :(
[22:38] <Jazzva> sebner, I'll be here for few more hours for sure, so I'll try to help you and emgent
[22:38] <sebner> Jazzva: heh, not me. great to see you. thx for your help
[22:38] <sebner> emgent: GO GO GO
[22:38] <Jazzva> asac, I pushed npw last night to my branch, and it should be good to go. Will we backport it to intrepid?
[22:39] <Jazzva> sebner, np :)
[22:39] <sebner> Jazzva: until he is here again take a look at his first try: http://<IP_ADDRESS>/tamtam/result/r-kiosk_0.7.2echolinux1/
[22:39] <Jazzva> ok
[22:40] <emgent> sebner: the second is available too
[22:40] <emgent> http://<IP_ADDRESS>/tamtam/result/r-kiosk_0.7.2echolinux3/
[22:41] <asac> @time los_angelese
[22:41] <asac> @time los_angeles
[22:45] <[reed]> WOO
[22:45] <sebner> emgent: kk
[22:45] <[reed]> EXAMS OVER
[22:45] <sebner> asac: you team freak :P
[22:45]  * asac hugs [reed]
[22:45] <sebner> [reed]: congratulations
[22:45] <asac> [reed]: good or "just good enough"?
[22:46] <[reed]> think I did fine
[22:46] <[reed]> all but physics, which I'm pretty sure I bombed
[22:46] <sebner> gn8 folks =)
[22:46] <[reed]> but I was expecting that
[22:46] <sebner> asac: have a nice UDS
[22:46] <asac> [reed]: so you failed in physics? or still got a D?
[22:47] <[reed]> asac: the former, sadly
[22:47] <[reed]> oh well
[22:47] <[reed]> D isn't enough, either
[22:47] <[reed]> have to have a C
[22:47] <[reed]> to move on
[22:47] <[reed]> which is lame
[22:47] <[reed]> but I think I got 'A's in most everything else
[22:47] <[reed]> we'll see
[22:47] <asac> [reed]: hmmm ... so maybe you should have skipped this in the first place? or did you not learn much for it - knowsin that you will fail?
[22:47] <[reed]> it's required, sadly
[22:48] <[reed]> Physics I and II
[22:48] <[reed]> :(
[22:48] <asac> congrats anyway
[22:48] <[reed]> anyway
[22:48] <[reed]> I'm DONE
[22:48] <asac> one cant be perfect
[22:48] <[reed]> so, I don't care about school anymore until January
[22:48] <[reed]> :)
[22:48] <asac> especially when you work on more exciting stuff ;)
[22:49] <[reed]> yep, now I can do cool Mozilla stuff
[22:50] <Jazzva> asac, the only way to let software know of extension's components is by using chrome.manifest, right?
[22:51] <asac> Jazzva: no .l.. chrom.manifest is for chrome ... components get loaded automatically if they are in the compooents/ directory
[22:51] <asac> sorry ... laggy network here right now
[22:52] <asac> Jazzva: but i guess your question was about registering chrome (and you mixed up the words)
[22:52] <Jazzva> asac, thanks. no components directory in this case... guess it's the case of missing chrome.manifest then...
[22:52] <Jazzva> asac, I guess that is the case :)
[22:52] <asac> Jazzva: if there is anything in chrome/ they need a chrome.manifest ... yes.
[22:53] <Jazzva> good
[22:53] <emgent> found issue
[22:53] <asac> ok ... have to run to a networkmanager session
[22:53] <emgent> \o/
[22:53] <emgent> danke asac
[22:53]  * asac wonders why folks schedule me all monday ... and then nothing
[22:53] <emgent> haha


[06:21] <Kilos> hellooo africa
[07:42] <craigbrash> hi Kilos
[07:43] <Kilos> my baby hit the top http://www.soundclick.com/genres/default.cfm?genre=Country
[07:43] <Kilos> hi there craig
[07:43] <Kilos> oh my forgot tab
[07:50] <craigbrash> Congrats to your baby :)
[08:01] <Kilos> ty craigbrash
[19:35]  * QA wbb in a jiffy
[19:39] <Kilos> QA wb
[19:39] <QA> Thank you so much Kilos my good friend


[00:00] <akgraner> woo hoo meeting time
[00:00] <akgraner> #startmeeting
[00:00] <Mootbot-UK> Meeting started at 00:00. The chair is akgraner.
[00:00] <Mootbot-UK> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [PROGRESS REPORT], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[00:01] <akgraner> Welcome to the NC LoCo Team Meeting!
[00:01] <internalkernel> o/
[00:01] <akgraner> who is here to participate
[00:01] <akgraner> o/
[00:01] <akgraner> anyone else?  I'll give it a few more minutes - nudge or remind someone if ya need too :-)
[00:02] <akgraner> _marx_, alreadt said he wouldn't be able to attend but I am not sure about anyone else
[00:02] <akgraner> holstein, was here a minute ago
[00:03] <akgraner> anyone else?
[00:03] <holstein> o/
[00:03] <internalkernel> lol...
[00:04] <akgraner> Here is the agenda page - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NorthCarolinaTeam/Meeting/Agenda
[00:04] <akgraner> [LINK] - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NorthCarolinaTeam/Meeting/Agenda
[00:04] <Mootbot-UK> LINK received:  - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NorthCarolinaTeam/Meeting/Agenda
[00:04] <holstein> SO we need to do something to get this loco happenin
[00:04] <holstein> maybe a meet up in the middle somewhere
[00:04] <akgraner> however the information listed seems out of date or overcome by events
[00:04] <akgraner> do we need to discuss anything there?
[00:05] <holstein> not that i see
[00:05] <internalkernel> We're kinda limpin along as a loco here...
[00:05] <akgraner> alrighty then I'll clear the agenda then
[00:06] <akgraner> [topic] increasing loco participation in 2011
[00:06] <Mootbot-UK> New Topic:  increasing loco participation in 2011
[00:06] <akgraner> ideas?
[00:06] <holstein> yeah, i was hoping spreading the meeting chair around would be a way to get new folk involved
[00:06] <holstein> maybe that has been a bad idea
[00:06] <holstein> NM
[00:06] <holstein> all that should be fine
[00:06] <internalkernel> I dont think its been a bad idea...
[00:06] <holstein> if we had something to do as a group
[00:07] <akgraner> I don't think it's a bad idea at all
[00:07] <holstein> you want to just plan something simple like a meet-up?
[00:07] <akgraner> I think we are missing major segments of the team
[00:07] <holstein> maybe in charlotte
[00:07] <akgraner> those who don't use IRC
[00:07] <internalkernel> we have firestorm, and a monthly LUG where Ubuntu is heavily represented...
[00:07] <internalkernel> I dont know what else to do aside from paying people
[00:08] <akgraner> nah what I mean is  - forums, mailing list and finding out who the contacts in the pocket locations are and making sure we are in contact with them
[00:08] <internalkernel> maybe there is a large user base in Charlotte, I would guess that is so - but how do we reach them...
[00:08] <holstein> the list is all i can handle
[00:09] <holstein> and we should all be subscribed if interested
[00:09] <internalkernel> I think for the most part Asheville seems to be the hub of the NC Loco - that and Raleigh/Durham out by Marx and Bugeyed
[00:09] <akgraner> holstein, so the mailing list can be your area for example
[00:09] <holstein> maybe we need a newletter? or something
[00:09] <akgraner> so ideas are
[00:09] <akgraner> [idea] - newsletter
[00:09] <Mootbot-UK> IDEA received:  - newsletter
[00:09] <akgraner> [idea] website
[00:09] <Mootbot-UK> IDEA received:  website
[00:10] <akgraner> [idea] - social media
[00:10] <Mootbot-UK> IDEA received:  - social media
[00:10] <holstein> we are way past making a new FB page
[00:10] <akgraner> [idea] - lug meetings
[00:10] <Mootbot-UK> IDEA received:  - lug meetings
[00:10] <holstein> i think we're good to go for that
[00:10] <akgraner> holstein, just listing all the options
[00:10] <holstein> just making a new one
[00:10] <holstein> right...
[00:10] <akgraner> crap that was my action item oops
[00:11] <akgraner> I'll just make one  :-/
[00:11] <akgraner> who used to come to the meetings from Charlotte?
[00:12] <holstein> Tronyx was for a bit
[00:12] <holstein> he's back in chicago though
[00:12] <akgraner> ahh ok
[00:12] <holstein> i see him around
[00:13] <akgraner> I think we are trying to be to fancy tight now - KIS method is what I am thinking
[00:13] <holstein> right
[00:13] <holstein> im with you
[00:13] <holstein> how about we do a FB page
[00:13] <holstein> after this meeting
[00:13] <akgraner> alrighty
[00:13] <holstein> and we email the list about it
[00:13] <internalkernel> works for me... I'll "Like it"
[00:13] <holstein> make some admins
[00:13] <akgraner> [ACTION] - holstein and akgraner to make a new FB page after meeting
[00:13] <Mootbot-UK> ACTION received:  - holstein and akgraner to make a new FB page after meeting
[00:13] <holstein> FB or twitter
[00:13] <holstein> whatever
[00:14] <holstein> not both though i think
[00:14] <internalkernel> I think also maybe creating some mroe traffic on the list... I like the idea of a newsletter - but something that creates conversation...
[00:14] <akgraner> we have a twitter and identi.ca account
[00:14] <holstein> internalkernel: maybe tech segments?
[00:14] <holstein> something easy
[00:14] <holstein> we just try and fire out there
[00:14] <holstein> even if its just a link
[00:14] <holstein> "check this out"
[00:14] <akgraner> but really all someone needs to so is use #ubuntunc
[00:14] <internalkernel> yeah I was thinking along those lines...
[00:15] <internalkernel> somethign small and easy, of course - one or two topics at a time or several articles around the same topic...
[00:15] <holstein> whats ubuntunc?
[00:15] <akgraner> a one page newsletter (once a month to start) would be easy
[00:15] <holstein> #ubuntunc?
[00:15] <internalkernel> ?
[00:15] <holstein> you mean here?
[00:15] <akgraner> the team hashtag for twitter and identi.ca
[00:15] <holstein> if theres YA irc channel i might cry :/
[00:15] <holstein> AH
[00:15] <holstein> ok :)
[00:16] <akgraner> make sense?
[00:16] <holstein> yup
[00:16] <akgraner> so that's taken care of
[00:16] <holstein> OK
[00:16] <holstein> i think the newsletter might be a bit much right now
[00:16] <holstein> we'd need an orginanizer and all that
[00:16] <holstein> and content finders
[00:16] <akgraner> internalkernel, we can use mailchimp (I have an account) and do a simple one page newsletter if you want
[00:17] <holstein> maybe put that in the 'for later' catagory?
[00:17] <akgraner> people who subscribe can choose the format as well - mobile, html, or text only
[00:17] <holstein> im with you guys though..
[00:17] <internalkernel> sounds good to me, let's plan to have a newsletter format put together by the next release?
[00:17] <holstein> no need to put it to a vote
[00:17] <akgraner> alrighty!  we can just get the template etc all in place and ready to roll out in April
[00:18] <holstein> i like it
[00:18] <akgraner> [ACTION] internalkernel, holstein, akgraner (and whoever else wants to help) roll out Team Newsletter in April
[00:18] <Mootbot-UK> ACTION received:  internalkernel, holstein, akgraner (and whoever else wants to help) roll out Team Newsletter in April
[00:18] <internalkernel> sweet... we have purpose!
[00:19] <akgraner> hey guys - if someone else is doing something bigger and better in their area we don't want them to stop we just want to be able to tell people what they are doing
[00:19] <internalkernel> absolutely...
[00:20] <akgraner> so if you hear of something make sure we let the ML, forums, and IRC folks know - we can come up with where on the wiki's to add that content later
[00:20] <akgraner> the wiki's need a facelift as well - but we can set that as a goal for the next Ubuntu Global Jam
[00:20] <holstein> cool
[00:20] <akgraner> (whenever that is  - I don't know off the top of my head)
[00:21] <internalkernel> didnt we determine we had a "wiki maintainer"
[00:21] <akgraner> [ACTION] - team wiki clean up next Ubuntu Global Jam weekend
[00:21] <Mootbot-UK> ACTION received:  - team wiki clean up next Ubuntu Global Jam weekend
[00:21] <internalkernel> or wiki team
[00:21] <internalkernel> I have to say gnight to the little one - brb
[00:21] <holstein> prolly the 3 of us ;)
[00:22] <akgraner> internalkernel, yeah - but you know life happens lets not hold a hard line to that  - whomever wants to contribute and can well  - let's encourage them
[00:24] <akgraner> holstein, does that make sense to you?
[00:26] <akgraner> agenda page is clear and ready for next meeting! woo hoo!
[00:26] <akgraner> you guys back yet?
[00:27] <holstein> sorry
[00:27] <holstein> phone
[00:27] <holstein> yeah
[00:27] <holstein> im ing
[00:27] <holstein> in*
[00:28] <holstein> might be nice to have a wiki overlord though
[00:28] <akgraner> :-)
[00:28] <holstein> someone to crack the whip a bit if needed
[00:28] <holstein> and just make it known that anyone can contribute
[00:28] <holstein> which that should already be known
[00:28] <holstein> WELL, ideally, will just get more traffic
[00:28] <holstein> and none of this will matter anways
[00:29] <holstein> it'll just work itself out
[00:29] <holstein> :)
[00:29] <akgraner> :-)
[00:29] <holstein> akgraner: you want to set up the FB?
[00:29] <akgraner> just wanted to plant the idea that we need to update the pages - I know I'll do what I can when I can
[00:30] <holstein> akgraner: i do 'create group' right?
[00:30] <akgraner> yeppers
[00:30] <holstein> i'll get it going
[00:30] <akgraner> just add a couple more people than you as admin
[00:30] <holstein> akgraner: what do we call it?
[00:30] <holstein> akgraner: i'll add you in a minute
[00:30] <akgraner> holstein, what is the other one called
[00:31] <holstein> LoCo Ubuntu NorthCarolina
[00:31] <holstein> Ubuntu NC LoCo
[00:31] <akgraner> crap there are a lot of people signed up for that one
[00:32] <holstein> yup
[00:32] <holstein> we can put this one on the front page there though several times
[00:33] <holstein> akgraner: we almost have to now
[00:33] <holstein> we voted :/
[00:33] <akgraner> yep we'll figure it out
[00:33] <akgraner> I remember
[00:33] <holstein> privacy open?
[00:33] <holstein> members are public
[00:33] <holstein> thats what we want right?
[00:33] <akgraner> yep - Do Ubuntu NC LoCo Team
[00:33] <akgraner> open yes
[00:34] <akgraner> thanks holstein - one less action item on the list!
[00:36] <akgraner> So for those who are here in the meeting - what expectations do you have of the LoCo team?  Doesn't matter what the idea is let's add it to the list of goals and see how we can meet those expectations and goals
[00:37] <holstein> this look right?http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_182815061748094
[00:37] <holstein> http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_182815061748094
[00:37] <Mootbot-UK> LINK received:  http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_182815061748094
[00:38] <akgraner> cool - just grab the logo and stuff and make it a page you want to send people to
[00:38] <akgraner> to find out about the team and Ubuntu and all that stuffs
[00:39] <holstein> akgraner: make you an admin so you can do what?
[00:39] <holstein> ;)
[00:39] <holstein> i'll get some admins going
[00:39] <holstein> and make it happen
[00:39] <akgraner> cause trouble and stir up stuff :-)
[00:40] <holstein> there we go
[00:40] <holstein> akgraner and internalkernel powered up :)
[00:40] <akgraner> I don't need to be - just wanted to make sure there were 2 or 3 people instead of just one
[00:40] <holstein> i think since the last issue
[00:40] <holstein> the more the merrier
[00:40] <holstein> i'll catch _marx_ later
[00:41] <holstein> and whoever else
[00:41] <akgraner> holstein, did you see my question  - when you mentioned brainstorming earlier...
[00:41]  * internalkernel catching up... sorry...
[00:41] <akgraner> what would you like to see the LoCo team become
[00:41] <akgraner> What kinds of things make you want to participate - not just you but anyone following along
[00:42] <holstein> just more connected i think
[00:42] <internalkernel> sweet...
[00:42] <holstein> maybe some activities in the name of the LoCo
[00:42] <holstein> put that banner to use
[00:42] <akgraner> without some kinda goals we are out in Limbo
[00:43] <akgraner> not end all be all goals - just what you'd like to get out of the group but aren't at them moment
[00:44] <internalkernel> thats a good point... and I like the developing of community aspect of it...
[00:44] <internalkernel> and its always a good time to turn someone onto Ubuntu...
[00:44] <akgraner> I know for me - If I am not excited about participating in something, or I don't feel connect, I know I won't represent a team or project well
[00:45] <internalkernel> yeah, exactly... and I like that excitement...
[00:45] <akgraner> connected even (sorry I can't spell tonight)
[00:45] <internalkernel> for some reaason my irc client refuses to autocomplete anyones name...
[00:45] <internalkernel> I know the feeling...
[00:46] <akgraner> so how about an action item/survey about what people want from teams - what is their motivation paycheck they get from being part of it etc
[00:46] <akgraner> I can create the survey this weekend - can one of you all send it out etc
[00:47] <internalkernel> Yeah I can send it out, we can post the results and maybe start a conversation going...
[00:47] <akgraner> I'd just like to see what people's expectations are, and what we are doing well, and what we need to improve upon etc
[00:47] <akgraner> internalkernel, exactly
[00:48] <holstein> w00t
[00:48] <akgraner> So I think we have some solid goals to build upon now?  Thoughts
[00:49] <internalkernel> I need an emoticon for a thumbs up...
[00:49] <internalkernel> that would be useful...
[00:49] <akgraner> I hope I don't sound bossy... or anything
[00:50] <internalkernel> not at all, i think we're on teh same page here
[00:50] <akgraner> great
[00:50] <internalkernel> I think we need to check in with the community at large - the community being the people that respond to the survey...
[00:50] <holstein> nah
[00:50] <akgraner> so _marx_ is set to chair the next meeting right?
[00:50]  * holstein +1
[00:50] <internalkernel> and we'll go from there...
[00:50] <holstein> :)
[00:50] <holstein> yup
[00:50] <holstein> _marx_ is next
[00:51] <akgraner> anything else before we end the meeting?
[00:51] <internalkernel> ::thumbs up::
[00:51] <internalkernel> thats all I got...
[00:51] <holstein> nope
[00:51] <akgraner> Thanks everyone and if there is nothing else...
[00:51] <akgraner> #endmeeting
[00:51] <Mootbot-UK> Meeting finished at 00:51.
[00:52] <akgraner> I've missed you all!
[00:52] <holstein> very PRO-ductive
[00:52] <akgraner> I am so glad I could make it tonight!
[00:52]  * holstein hugs akgraner
[00:52] <holstein> me too
[00:53] <akgraner> alrighty  - I have some work to do now - but I'll try to get everything added and sent to the list by tomorrow evening
[00:53] <akgraner> is that ok with you all?
[00:54] <holstein> akgraner: works for me
[00:54] <holstein> ping me if i can help
[00:54] <akgraner> holstein, internalkernel  - I have to go to VA (oteen) next week so I'll plan on spending the whole day in the area
[00:54] <internalkernel> sounds good...
[00:54] <internalkernel> wheres oteen?
[00:54] <internalkernel> lol
[00:54] <akgraner> :-P
[00:55] <internalkernel> I'll figure it out, just email... I have plenty of time - but with one car I have limited range...
[00:55] <akgraner> so hopefully I'll be in and out of there before lunch on Thursday
[00:55] <akgraner> no worries - if I need to I'll play taxi and pick ya up
[00:55] <internalkernel> we can work something out... thanks...
[00:55] <akgraner> on that sounds horrible you know what I meant right?
[00:57] <internalkernel> lol... why would you go there...
[00:57] <internalkernel> I didnt get much sleep last night...
[00:58] <internalkernel> Im relatively delirious
[01:03] <akgraner> Veterans Hospital is there
[01:03] <akgraner> and I need to get re-evaluated and all that good stuffs
[01:04] <akgraner> I have a couple service related injuries that they need to take care of
[12:50] <ShootEmUp> Hello Everyone!
[14:43] <JackWat> hi ShootEmUp


[12:04] <lu|away> ATM it has a big-ass old MS natural keyboard
[12:04] <lu|away> with a wire
[12:04] <tseng> well
[12:04] <tseng> i have a similar setup in my parents basement for mythtv
[12:05] <tseng> i find that the normal "cordless" rf keyboards dont have a really great range
[12:05] <tseng> sitting on the couch its hard to get a signal across
[12:05] <tseng> if i had an unlimited budget id try ir, bluetooth etc
[12:06] <lu|away> w00t
[12:09] <seb128> lu|away: gtk 2.7.2 announce
[12:10] <chrissturm> wasabi, what would be the correct way to package eclipse plugins?
[12:10] <chrissturm> damn
[12:10] <chrissturm> tseng, bluetooth has a really wiiiideee range
[12:10] <tseng> chrissturm: well, it can
[12:11] <lu|away> seb128: yeah, couple of hours ago, I told you :)
[12:11] <tseng> some stuff cuts out at 10m
[12:11] <seb128> gtk?
[12:11] <lu|away> yeah
[12:11] <tseng> (by design)
[12:11] <seb128> lu|away: is the ftp list b0rked or something?
[12:11] <lu|away> oh, maybe
[12:11] <seb128> I use it to know what to package
[12:11] <lu|away> commits-list is borked
[12:11] <seb128> and I don't get mails
[12:11] <seb128> bah
[12:11] <lu|away> I was looking at dtk-devel
[12:11] <seb128> k
[12:11] <lu|away> which had it 2 1/2 hours ago ;)
[12:11] <seb128> anyway time to sleep
[12:11] <seb128> I'll package it tomorrow
[12:12] <lu|away> yeah
[12:12] <lu|away> hopefully i'll just use it from CVS soon
[12:12] <lu|away> night!
[12:12] <seb128> thanks
[12:12] <seb128> later
[12:46] <chrissturm> does eclipse run with gcj or does it need a sun jdk?
[12:47] <Speedy2> chrissturm: I think they make both versions
[12:47] <Speedy2> chrissturm:  Some has compiled with Eclipse with gcj, but it may not be the latest version
[12:48] <chrissturm> ok, but the version in breezy needs a sun jdk?
[12:48] <Speedy2> chrissturm:  I think that is correct
[12:49] <chrissturm> i would really like to package some eclipse plugins as debs
[12:49] <whiprush> tseng: welcome to the hhk2 club!
[12:49] <tseng> whiprush: woo
[12:53] <siretart> chrissturm: the eclipse package in breezy is running with gcj
[12:58] <chrissturm> siretart, how do i configure it to use gcj?
[12:58] <siretart> chrissturm: just apt-get install it
[12:59] <chrissturm> i have it installed, and running
[12:59] <chrissturm> and in about / config i see that it used the sun jdk
[12:59] <siretart> hm then you should ask wasabi about this. I don't know how to switch
[12:59] <siretart> gn8
[01:00] <chrissturm> thx
[01:04] <chrissturm> ah /etc/jvm.d/eclipse
[01:04] <sabdfl> hey lamont - just got back from beers with bdale :-)
[01:05] <Mez> sabdfl, any news on backports?
[01:05] <sabdfl> Mez: incoming
[01:05] <Mez> ..?
[01:06] <Mez> incoming?
[01:06] <dmk> just asked this question in ubuntu-motu and no one answer - I think everyone is asleep. maybe you guys can help
[01:06] <dmk> I have been trying to build a few deb packages but I am not sure if I have done them right
[01:06] <sabdfl> thought we would have it this week, i guess it just needs a little love from infinity and lamont
[01:06] <dmk> they install fine, but just wanted to be sure
[01:06] <dmk> when I was doing packages for Slackware we used to have a script that verified everything
[01:06] <Mez> ah fair enough... I'm just wondering how we're going to get the thing to build the packages thats all
[01:06] <dmk> sorry if this is the wrong place to ask
[01:07] <lamont> evening sabdfl
[01:07] <Mez> I'm just not sure how the process would go if we're not making the source uploads (plus apparently the sbuild doesnt like ~'s in the version)
[01:07] <Mez> lamont, hows backports going on your bit of it?
[01:07] <lamont> backports is there, btw
[01:07] <lamont> see archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/d/dpkg
[01:08] <Mez> I noticed the repository was there...
[01:08] <lamont> having said that.  wanna-build needs a little bit more love, and then i think all should just be happy
[01:08] <lamont> (I can't give things back, because wanna-build gets confused about that ~)
[01:09] <sabdfl> hi lamont
[01:10] <lamont> sabdfl: I'll hammer on wanna-build some more this evening, and then we should be good to go.  (all the buildd's are currently trying to build it, etc.)
[01:10] <sabdfl> lamont: cool. how's the bandwidth holding up at home these days?
[01:11] <lamont> sucky
[01:11] <lamont> I've taken to freshening a USB drive at work from time to time, from the local mirror here in fort collins
[01:12] <lamont> sabdfl: and otherwise, I'm running right around my quota for high-bw usage
[01:13] <sabdfl> lamont: wimax?
[01:13] <lamont> sabdfl: I get all I want if the average is < 56kbps.  for >= 56kbps, I get ~100MB/day
[01:14] <lamont> max is around 400-500kbps
[01:14] <lamont> which isn't terribly bad, given everything
 #ubuntu
 (I didn't knowingly make any changes to network-admin)
 this is development chan
[01:19] <Speedy2> err, sorry
[01:23] <chrissturm> wasabi, are there instructions how to package eclipse plugins as debs for ubuntu?
[01:25] <Mez> lol @ lamont
[01:25] <wasabi_> chrissturm, no, but there needs to be
[01:25] <wasabi_> I am trying to figure it out for CDT currently.
[01:25] <chrissturm> wasabi, i would like to try webtools
[01:25] <wasabi_> Please give it a go.
[01:25] <chrissturm> webtools rock big time
[01:26] <wasabi_> I really want to see it take off.
[01:26] <wasabi_> I am making some big changes to Eclipse right now, which will probably effect you in the long term.
[01:26] <chrissturm> does it work well with gcj? i am running eclipse with gcj for the first time today
[01:26] <wasabi_> Does web tools? Don't know.
[01:26] <wasabi_> Eclipse works for the most part. Debugging doesn't.
[01:27] <wasabi_> But Eclipse launches an external VM to run.
[01:27] <chrissturm> how does the performance compare?
[01:27] <wasabi_> It's slower than Sun's, but better than interpreted.
[01:27] <chrissturm> thats very good news for non intel platforms
[01:27] <wasabi_> chrissturm, I am preparing to move Eclipse to /usr/lib/eclipse from /usr/sahre/eclipse.
[01:27] <lamont> fabbione: somehow I expect you're not around?
[01:27] <wasabi_> Most stuff will be in /usr/share, with symlinks in /usr/lib pointing to it.
[01:28] <wasabi_> Basically it's the only way I can get FHS compatibility out of it.
[01:28] <chrissturm> wasabi_, is there also a per-user plugin directory?
[01:28] <wasabi_> chrissturm, there will be.
[01:28] <wasabi_> chrissturm, RedHat has a nice patch for that I will be applying.
[01:28] <chrissturm> eclipse had always supported that
[01:28] <wasabi_> RedHat has some mods.
[01:28] <wasabi_> bbl =)
[01:29] <wasabi_> please help
[01:30] <Speedy2> Is there any benefit to putting eth0 in the "hotplug" interface on /etc/network/interfaces ?
[01:31] <Speedy2> (why does Ubuntu do it that way?)
[01:32] <lamont> Speedy2: lets you auto-up interfaces without always trying to bring them up (and failing when the PC card isn't plugged in)
[01:33] <Speedy2> lamont: Ok .  For some odd reason, with my own kernel hotplug fails to bring eth0 up.  Does hotplug use hal ?
[01:33] <Speedy2> lamont: I'm using a PCI NIC.  The only thing I can think of is that PCI hotplug wasn't compiled in
[01:34] <chrissturm> how does that compare to network manager?
[02:30] <jasoncohen> where are breezy's packages stored after they are built by the automated build system but before they enter the pool directory? is their an incoming server like incoming.debian.org?
[02:30] <jasoncohen> *is there
[02:43] <jsgotangco> j #ubuntu-motu
[02:44] <jsgotangco> salut
[02:44] <tseng> hi jsgotangco
[03:43] <daniels> Kamion: yeah
[03:56] <davyd> daniels: does X work yet?
[03:57] <daniels> davyd: of course it does
[03:57] <davyd> mine stopped working with -34
[03:57] <daniels> i810?
[03:57] <davyd> i915
[03:57] <daniels> will be fixed in -35
[03:58] <davyd> daniels: what broke?
[03:58] <davyd> also, how long till -35?
[03:58] <tseng> davyd: when daniels blesses you with it
[03:59] <davyd> tseng: well, this biatch left me without a working X server
[03:59] <tseng> :/
[04:00] <davyd> I also couldn't see how one would obviously downgrade X, I know it's meant to be modular, but there are things like xserver-common and x-common and such
[04:00] <davyd> and I just don't know the dependancy tree
[04:02] <lamont> "Ubuntu is calling it a 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G] /GE Chipset Integrated Graphics Device" - any clues daniels?
[04:02] <lamont> (actually, iz driver on intel's site)
[04:02] <daniels> lamont: i845, which uses the i810 driver
[04:02] <daniels> davyd: code which made it start segfaulting in breezy
[04:02] <daniels> davyd: downgrading xserver-xorg alone from -34 to -33 should be safe
[04:02] <lamont> daniels: ah, ok.  should hoary correctly detect that, or does one have to force i810, and if so, how?
[04:03] <davyd> daniels: ok... it seems that gdm doesn't correctly relay that there was a segv
[04:03] <daniels> davyd: sounds about right
[04:03] <davyd> that's why I was feeling confused
[04:04] <daniels> lamont: um, hoary will detect and use it fine.  but is this a desktop where the resolution is capped at 640x480?
[04:04] <davyd> also, startx didn't seem to work
[04:04] <lamont> yes
[04:04] <daniels> lamont: if so, XORG_SYNC_RANGES=yes sudo dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg
[04:04] <daniels> will be fixed in a hoary-update
[04:05] <lamont> daniels: thanks - that'll get my brother off my back... and then there's my _other_ question.....  but you know what that is.
[04:05] <daniels> lamont: yeah, the answer to that is in your other IRC client
[04:05] <daniels> i'm still trying to work out a way to plug in and meaningfully use my desktop
[04:21] <squinn> welcome back, mgalvin
[04:24] <mgalvin> :)
[04:24] <mgalvin> had to restart gnome a few time after install new apps to refresh menus
[04:24] <mgalvin> working on the gnome docs
[04:26] <squinn> what gnome doc in particular?
[04:29] <mgalvin> well, mostly the gnome faq guide, but i am modify the menu entities to reflect the breezy menus
[05:15] <Mitario> hello everyone
[05:16] <bddebian> Hello Mitario
[05:17] <Mitario> little question here.. i'm finishing update manager for a new release and since i'm not a native english speaker.. is it 'There are x  packages available for updating.'?
[05:18] <bddebian> Sounds correct to me
[06:11] <|QuaD-> anyone around?
[06:32] <lamont> emacs21: error while loading shared libraries: libXaw3d.so.6: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[06:32] <lamont> hrmpf
[07:07] <mgalvin> are direct upgrades from wary to breezy supported or at least possible?
[07:21] <jasoncohen> mgalvin, it's recommended that you upgrade incrementally
[07:22] <jasoncohen> mgalvin, each release has changes in dependencies (pacakges with new names, new dependencies, removal of old dependencies etc.). to resolve this, there are virtual dummy packages to aid in the upgrade process.
[07:23] <jasoncohen> however, this is meant to work between releases - from warty to hoary- not from warty to breezy
[07:23] <jasoncohen> anyways, breezy is in no shape to be used as a stable distribution. if you didn't want to upgrade to hoary, your surely not going to want to use breezy at this time. why not upgrade to hoary now and wait until breezy is released in october?
[07:31] <mgalvin> jasoncohen, i ask b/c i am working on the ubuntu documentation, i was just wondered if it was possible and worth putting in the docs
[07:32] <mgalvin> its not a good idea, i figured as much, but wanted other opinions
[07:32] <jasoncohen> it'll probably lead to upgrade problems
[07:32] <mgalvin> right
[07:33] <mgalvin> it's just that people asks those kinds of questions :)
[07:34] <rob^> been buisy mgalvin?
[07:34] <rob^> busy^
[07:34] <mgalvin> rob^, yea :)
[07:34] <rob^> :)
[07:34] <rob^> I've been trying to figure out lufs ftpfs all day..
[07:35] <rob^> it wont mount my xbox
[07:35] <rob^> :(
[07:35] <mgalvin> i never tried that, no xbox
[07:36] <rob^> I have about 45gig of mp3s on it I want to access from my pc
[07:36] <bob2> why not just use a real network filesystem?
[07:36] <rob^> without copying them across
[07:36] <rob^> on the xbox?
[07:36] <rob^> what like?
[07:37] <bob2> ?
[07:37] <bob2> smb, nfs, afs, coda ...
[07:37] <rob^> the xbox has a smb server without running one of the various Linux distros for it?
[07:38] <rob^> whats it called?
[07:40] <rob^> pfft.. kernel module?
[07:41] <bob2> you want to continue running windows on it? ah
[07:43] <rob^> well..
[07:44] <rob^> I want to be able to still play games on it
[07:45] <rob^> it IS an xbox after all
[08:28] <mdz> morning
[08:41] <whiprush> mdz: far from home?
[08:51] <daniels> so, while there are arguments over how to behave on, say, 5 minutes of idle time:
[08:51] <daniels> a) do nothing
[08:51] <daniels> b) throw up a screen saver
[08:51] <daniels> c) blank the screen
[08:51] <daniels> d) go into S3
[08:51] <daniels> i think we can all agree that D is completely wrong
[08:52] <davyd> daniels: yes, I think so too
[08:52] <davyd> daniels: you could always do what the mac does
[08:52] <daniels> screen saver after 5, S3 after 50?
[08:52] <daniels> er, 60
[08:53] <Mithrandir> daniels: on battery or in general?
[08:53] <davyd> it also dulls the screen after 5 or so minutes
[08:53] <daniels> Mithrandir: in general
[08:54] <daniels> davyd: right, dimming the backlight is a top plan
[08:54] <Mithrandir> daniels: I would be majorly pissed off if a machine I left off suddenly went to sleep for no apparent reason.
[08:54] <daniels> Mithrandir: you too, hey?
[08:54] <daniels> never mind the SSH session you had running, or the huge downloads you had going
[08:54] <daniels> fascists
[08:54] <davyd> daniels: some of the power management stuff in ubuntu is crack
[08:54] <Mithrandir> so S3 after 60 minutes is just crackful.
[08:54] <davyd> I rewrote a lot of mine today
[08:55] <daniels> davyd: acpi-support?
[08:55] <daniels> Mithrandir: it does that on desktops, dude
[08:55] <davyd> daniels: yeah
[08:55] <davyd> it might be worth considering acpi-support-ibm and acpi-support-toshiba
[08:55] <davyd> and lots of that stuff
[08:55] <daniels> davyd: file a bug :)
[08:55] <daniels> mmm, we used to have acpi-support-x40
[08:55] <daniels> then we realised everything in the x40 is fine
[08:55] <davyd> because I have non-shit ACPI
[08:55] <Mithrandir> daniels: uh.  So it crashes any desktop with SATA and other niceties like that?
[08:55] <daniels> what we really need to do is have portable interfaces for 'dim the backlight', 'enable bluetooth', 'disable the wireless radio', et al
[08:55] <davyd> all the workarounds break my machine
[08:56] <daniels> and then have system-specific binaries, where we autodetect which one to use
[08:56] <daniels> Mithrandir: dunno, this was in the 10.1 days
[08:56] <daniels> haven't used OS X since
[08:56] <davyd> daniels: sounds like a similar solution
[08:56] <Mithrandir> daniels: oh, OS X.  I thought this was about what we were doing/going to do.
[08:56] <davyd> daniels: I think you still can configure it to sleep
[08:56] <daniels> Mithrandir: shit no
[08:56] <davyd> from memory it doesn't with mounted external disks
[08:56] <davyd> it's an interesting feature
[09:00] <davyd> also, I only have one Squire left
[09:01] <davyd> and I haven't managed to read chapters 2, 3 or 5 of the story
[09:01] <davyd> I knew I should have bought a case
[09:35] <ogami1972> HEY DEVELOPERS! thank you!
[10:09] <daniels> sladen: any word on usplash?
[10:11] <siretart> wasabi: ping
[10:36] <sivang> bah, source only packages, anyone has any idea how I increment patch such package?
[10:38] <daniels> what do you want to do?
[10:38] <daniels> if you need a rebuild, just bump the version number and add 'no changes' or such to the changelog
[10:40] <sivang> daniels: I need to patch it bits, and then test build
[10:41] <sivang> daniels: where do I drop the diffs? :-)
[10:41] <daniels> oh, you mean DBS?
[10:41] <sivang> daniels: (I'm used to working with dpatch enabled packags)
[10:41] <daniels> where you dpkg-source -x something, and it has a tarball in the root directory?
[10:42] <daniels> fakeroot debian/rules setup is the generally-accepted way to unpack it, although source.make might be used intsead
[10:42] <sivang> daniels: I think so...not sure :-)
[10:42] <daniels> then put your patches in debian/patches
[10:42] <sivang> daniels: it's gedit package, let me look again, I may be wrong wrt the source pkg thingy
[10:43] <sivang> daniels: I have a /debian folder under the root, however it contains no "patches" dir
[10:43] <daniels> sivang: might vary
[10:44] <sivang> daniels: so that's not a source based pakcage? (the one with only the source tarball and a path tarball )
[10:44] <sivang> s/path/patch/
[10:46] <sivang> daniels: it's using cdbs, and simple-patchsys , but I can't see the pathces dir
[10:50] <daniels> sivang: then it probably doesn't have any patches being applied
[10:50] <sivang> daniels: oh, so it's a new upstream release maybe?
[10:52] <sivang> weird, it has a -2 modifier, so it can't be new upstream
[10:53] <daniels> maybe it just has no source patches?
[10:54] <vedran> hello
[10:54] <vedran> who is packager for icewm?
[10:54] <sivang> daniels: right, only chnages to the debian portions. silly me
[10:55] <vedran> i'd like to ask them something :)
[10:57] <vedran> ah sorry - there's name in deb - ignore :o
[10:58] <Duck_Happy> ogra: coin ?
[11:48] <doko> ubuntu on www.spiegel.de: http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/technologie/0,1518,364354,00.html
[12:01] <vedran> q: is it possible to do a network install of ubuntu?
[12:01] <vedran> i have a computer with no cd...
[12:02] <tseng> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LocalNetInstall
[12:02] <tseng> you can do it with netboot
[12:02] <tseng> next time you want to ask #ubuntu, see topic.
[12:03] <vedran> ok tnx... sorry
[12:03] <JanC> you can do it from an existing linux install too
[12:03] <JanC> read the ubuntu/debian installer manual
[12:05] <JanC> apt-get install debian-installer-manual
[12:08] <vedran> tnx to all
[01:10] <zyga> is there any ubuntu-translators # ?
[01:12] <mdke> zyga, there is a mailing list if that helps
[01:12] <mdke> zyga, if your problem is launchpad related, you can try #launchpad
[01:12] <mdke> or rosetta-users@lists
[01:25] <zyga> I'm trying to import my gpg key
[01:25] <zyga> but rosetta crashes
[01:56] <mdke> zyga, that is not rosetta, its launchpad, you can file a bug or ask in #launchpad
[01:56] <mdke> zyga, btw is your key on the keyservers?
[02:10] <zyga> mdke: no ;)
[02:10] <zyga> mdke: but It shouldn't have borked on me
[02:10] <mdke> zyga, yeah i know, i think that is a known issue
[02:10] <siretart> jbailey: ping
[02:22] <Gandalfar> hello, can anyone hint me how to build ubuntu cdimage?
[02:34] <zyga> Gandalfar: search the wiki AFAIR there is some info on this topic there
[02:38] <Treenaks> HWolf: Oh noes!
[02:40] <HWolf> nice, isn't it.
[02:40] <Treenaks> ja :)
[02:40] <Treenaks> uh.. wrong channel.. "yeah" :)
[02:42] <mxpxpod> daniels: ping
[02:43] <Kamion> Gandalfar: the scripts we use are in arch<EMAIL_ADDRESS><EMAIL_ADDRESS>baz build-config configs/devel
[02:44] <Gandalfar> thank you :)
[02:44] <Kamion> Gandalfar: that's probably too brief for you to actually build images from, but I'm about to go out to a wedding
[02:44] <Gandalfar> it's a start, creating a derivate will be a long term task anyway
[02:44] <mxpxpod> Kamion: heh, I have a wedding this morning too :)
[02:55] <mxpxpod> jdub: ping
[03:04] <Mez> lamont: ping
[03:05] <lamont> Mez: sup?
[03:05] <Mez> PM
[03:06] <lamont> PM?
[03:06] <Mez>  /query :P
[03:06] <Mez> wondering why http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/s/sdlperl/1.20.3-1ubuntu5/ is bombing out even though all dependencies are there
[03:09] <siretart> there is something weird going on with gl and glu in xorg
[03:09] <siretart> I dont get it either
[03:09] <Treenaks> Let's all poke daniels to ask!
[03:13] <siretart> is it possible/allowed to build depend on a virtual package?
[03:13] <infinity> siretart : Yes, but if you want to be sure you get a specific version on the buildds, use "real | virtual"
[03:13] <lamont> siretart: it's real simple... anything that build-depends xlibmesa-glu-dev is b0rked
[03:14] <siretart> lamont: its about sdlperl, yes
[03:14] <lamont> siretart: also note that if you build-dep on a virtual package, and it's not in the archive, then it requires a manual whack by infinity or I to clear the depwait...
[03:14] <siretart> ok, will upload then a package build depending on libgl-dev-xorg and libglu-dev-xorg, then. ok?
[03:15] <jdub> mxpxpod: pong
[03:15] <lamont> well, given that libgl-dev-xorg doesn't seem to exist yet.....
[03:15] <siretart> oh
[03:15] <lamont> O
[03:15] <siretart> :/
[03:15] <lamont> I'd probably just use libglu-dev-xorg. :-)
[03:16] <siretart> ok. testing that in pbuilder now
[03:16] <lamont> daniels: updating the binaries line or such to make xlibmesa-glu-dev go away would be a good thing...
[03:17] <mxpxpod> jdub: did gnome-gpg change? it used to be that I could call gnome-gpg and it would pop up a dialog asking me for a password... now it tells me it can't determine the key id to use
[03:18] <jdub> no changes to gnome-gpg; perhaps you've added a key and aren't defining it? i don't know the answer.
[03:19] <mxpxpod> jdub: not defining it?
[03:19] <Treenaks> mxpxpod: usually it means that either you have no secret keys, or you have more than one
[03:19] <mxpxpod> hmm
[03:20] <siretart> ok. libglu-dev-xorg seems to work. uploading package now
[03:21] <mxpxpod> Treenaks: aw man, something is messed up in my keyring
[03:22] <mxpxpod> Treenaks: I get invalid packets
[03:22] <jsgotangco> mxpxpod: probably your secret key
[03:23] <mxpxpod> jsgotangco: what do you mean?
[03:26] <mxpxpod> Treenaks: is there a way to rebuild my keyring?
[03:28] <mdke> backup?
[03:28] <Treenaks> mxpxpod: I have those too. I _think_ it's Alexander Schmehl and/or Andreas Mueller
[03:28] <Treenaks> gpg: buffer shorter than subpacket
[03:28] <Treenaks> gpg: signature packet without timestamp
[03:28] <Treenaks> that stuff right?
[03:28] <mxpxpod> no
[03:29] <Treenaks> mxpxpod: then there's gpg --rebuild
[03:29] <mxpxpod> gpg: checking the trustdb
[03:29] <mxpxpod> gpg: [don't know] : invalid packet (ctb=00)
[03:29] <mxpxpod> gpg: keyring_search failed: invalid packet
[03:29] <mxpxpod> gpg: failed to rebuild keyring cache: invalid packet
[03:29] <Treenaks> mxpxpod: but that's for rebuilding the signature caches
[03:29] <Treenaks> mxpxpod: try #gnupg
[03:40] <mxpxpod> Treenaks: ok, so why can't gnome-gpg determine the key to use?
[03:40] <Treenaks> mxpxpod: can gnupg?
[03:40] <mxpxpod> I think so
[03:40] <mxpxpod> I don't get that message when using gpg
[03:41] <Treenaks> then I don't know, as I don't use gnome-gpg
[03:41] <mxpxpod> hrmm
[03:41] <mxpxpod> Treenaks: yeah gpg finds my key just fine
[03:42] <Treenaks> you fixed your ring?
[03:42] <mxpxpod> yeah, there was a pubring.gpg~ that I copied into pubring.gpg
[03:42] <Treenaks> ah ok
[03:42] <mxpxpod> pubring.gpg was full of junk
[03:43] <mxpxpod> oh, you know what...
[03:43] <Treenaks> how did it get that way?
[03:43] <mxpxpod> no clue
[03:49] <mxpxpod> Treenaks: this is strange
[03:56] <mxpxpod> jdub: it's strange... I have to specify --local-user now with gnome-gpg
[04:18] <Mithrandir> lamont: since elephants are easier to choke than lamonts?
[04:18] <lamont> they have much bigger mouths
[04:18] <lamont> 195812895 bytes of orig.tar.gz is a bit excessive
[04:19] <lamont> and the 14741694 byte diff.gz doesn't really help matters....
[04:19] <Mithrandir> oh, I'll need to put more stuff into ia32-libs, then?
[04:19] <lamont> yeah - you're not even in the same ballpark there... :)
[04:22] <lamont> 3 hours into the download, only 172e6 bytes to go. :-(
[04:23] <lamont> but I have over 12% of the file
[04:25] <davyd> who mirrors?
[04:25] <davyd> isn't caching the cool new thing?
[04:25] <lamont> not when you have to shape your bandwidth
[04:26] <lamont> caching at 30kbps sucks.  mirroring a partial mirror doesn't suck quite so much
[04:26] <lamont> that's kbits/sec
[05:00] <wasabi> =( X move broke eclipse
[05:06] <wasabi> Actually that was pretty damned weird. I was missing /usr/include/X11/X.h
[05:06] <wasabi> But I *reinstalled* x11proto-core-dev and now I have it
[05:06] <Jhair> running apt-get --purge remove python2.3 leaves two symbolic links which triggers:
[05:06] <Jhair> dpkg - warning: while removing python2.3, directory `/usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages' not empty so not removed.
[05:06] <Jhair> system: breezy
[05:06] <Jhair> is this a bug?
[05:17] <Mithrandir> arrrr
[05:17] <Mithrandir> evo crashes when trying to add a new (http) calendar.
[05:21] <Nafallo> Mithrandir: evo crashes on LOTS of things ;-).
[05:21] <Nafallo> Mithrandir: like trying to add another account ;-).
[05:28] <Lathiat> yeh
[05:28] <Lathiat> mutt++ :)
[05:29] <Nafallo> hehe
[05:34] <Mithrandir> Lathiat: mutt doesn't do ical feeds.
[05:35] <Lathiat> ical sucsk
[05:35] <Lathiat> ;p
[05:35] <Mithrandir> Lathiat: got any better alternative?
[05:35] <Mithrandir> why do people assume that I want to use evo as a mail client?  I have a way better mail client already.
[05:35] <Lathiat> read it with vim
[05:36] <Mithrandir> I don't use vim, 'cept once in a while to edit my .emacs. ;-P
[05:36] <Mithrandir> and vim is really shitty about giving notfications of events and stuff. :-P
[05:42] <Lathiat> your just not trying nhard enough
[06:37] <thierry> when I start breezy that I installed, I get to the login and after gnome start, and all the panel are blank and I only see the wallpaper...
[06:38] <thierry> is it that way with ebery computer or is it just mine?
[06:38] <wasabi> just yours
[06:38] <wasabi> today
[06:38] <thierry> oh ok...
[06:38] <wasabi> you're not going to get much help
[06:38] <thierry> and with the live-cd, it doesn't recognize any ethernet device
[06:39] <wasabi> what type of device do you have?
[06:39] <thierry> wasabi, is there a way to fix thoses thing for a newbie like me?
[06:39] <wasabi> thierry, no. WHy are you using breezy again?
[06:39] <thierry> well I have a nvidia (inside my mother board) and an other with a strange company name but that works with hoary
[06:40] <thierry> wasabi, I just was curious... I don't want support, I want to help
[06:40] <wasabi> Well, the best I can tell you is that you need to figure out hte model of your nic, make sure the module loads and that it works right.
[06:40] <wasabi> Then determine if the issue is with teh installer or the drivers. ;)
[06:41] <wasabi> I don' thave any familiarity with the nvidia nics, so I can't be of much assistance with that
[06:41] <thierry> ok... how can I make sure the module loads ? wich modules are needed?
[06:42] <wasabi> Make sure that the module is listed in lsmod. I don't know what module
[06:42] <thierry> k...
[06:42] <thierry> thanks
[06:45] <daniels> lamont: erm?
[07:38] <Hieronymus> Why are the icons in Breezy for Firefox and Evolution different from those in Hoary?
[07:47] <tseng> Hieronymus: because gnome-icon-theme includes new ones?
[07:47] <Hieronymus> tseng: okay, but I thought there was an issue with the Firefox logo
[07:47] <tseng> there is
[07:47] <Hieronymus> it can only be used for official Mozilla releases
[07:48] <Hieronymus> so, has Ubuntu gotten permission?
[07:48] <tseng> go file a bug at bugzilla.gnome.org if you are concerned
[07:48] <Hieronymus> tseng: I'm not concerned, but curious
[07:48] <tseng> i told you where the icon came from, it was an intentional change by ubuntu
[07:52] <hmh> I am going to start some groundlaying work for dependency-based initscripts here at debconf5. Anyone from ubuntu also working in this?
[07:53] <hmh> (i.e. integrate stuff like serel/runit with the system)
[09:18] <bronson> Why on earth is php4 compiled --without-pgsql?
[09:19] <bronson> And since it is, why does Ubuntu include the apparently useless php4-pgsql package?
[09:19] <bronson> Very, very strange.  This is on Hoary of course.
[09:20] <KaiL> maybe there's php4-pgsql?
[09:20] <Treenaks> bronson: sounds like a bug?
[09:20] <KaiL> as there's php4-mysql afaik...
[09:21] <bronson> KaiL: there is a php4-pgsql package.
[09:21] <bronson> But it's useless because the Ubuntu php4 package disables all postgres support.
[09:21] <bronson> Treenaks: I sure think so.  Should I file one?
[09:31] <sivang> bronson: we should probably have php5 packages already...
[09:31] <sivang> bronson: too bad it's delaying alot
[09:33] <bronson> sivang: i agree.  :)
[09:52] <infinity> bronson : Did you try installing php4-pgsql before reporting a bug?
[10:03] <bronson> infinity: of course.
[10:04] <bronson> infinity: I downloaded the php4 source package and verified that --without-pgsql is in debain/rules.
[10:04] <infinity> bronson : It DOES work, despite the configure line.
[10:04] <bronson> Really?  Not for me.
[10:04] <bronson> phppgadmin complains that php has no pg support.
[10:04] <infinity> bronson : Yes, it is in debian/rules.  All that means is that pgsql isn't built with the php4 source.
[10:04] <infinity> bronson : Is pgsql.so in your php.ini?
[10:05] <infinity> bronson : dpkg-reconfigure php4-pgsql
[10:06] <bronson> infinity: that was it.
[10:06] <bronson> Weird!  I just installed it.
[10:07] <bronson> Dunno why it works after the reconfigure, but it does.
[10:07] <bronson> infinity: thanks!
[10:07] <infinity> I already closed it NOTABUG half an hour ago.
[10:08] <bronson> Ah.  Thanks, Adam Conrad.  :)
[10:14] <bronson> I added a quick note in case anyone else is stranded where i was.
[10:14] <bronson> infinity: thanks again.
[10:27] <comadreja> I'm looking for any of the members of the ubuntu/gnome team
[10:33] <lu|away> comadreja: quite a few are around/in channel, if you have a specific question you should just ask and wait and see if anyone can answer
[10:34] <comadreja> oh, thanks, I just thought there was a specific channel/mailling-list for them alone
[10:35] <comadreja> bug 627, what is the dbus transition ?
[10:36] <lu|away> probably refers to the transition from dbus 0.2x to dbus 0.3x
[10:36] <lu|away> and I presume you mean some other bug #?
[10:36] <comadreja> malone
[10:37] <comadreja> it doesn't say too much more...
[10:38] <lu|away> ah
[10:38] <lu|away> presumably screem depends on dbus 0.2
[10:38] <lu|away> and they want/need a patch to make screem build against dbus 0.3
[10:38] <lu|away> though admittedly it is sort of hard to tell from the page that it is against screem
[10:38] <comadreja> ok, I'll work on that
[10:48] <thierry> I'd like to fix ubuntu bug 9145 . How do I get the source of rsync?
[10:49] <carstenh_> apt-get source $package
[10:49] <thierry> ok and to create a patch?
[10:50] <carstenh_> apt-get install diff?
[10:51] <thierry> k thanks
[10:51] <ivoks> diff -ur
[10:55] <comadreja> could it be that bug 627 talks about using dbus-glib instead of dbus ?
[11:00] <ivoks> 627?
[11:01] <comadreja> ivoks : in malone
[11:03] <thierry> ok I have the rsync folder where I made my changes on the rsync packages... now how can I get the patch?
[11:04] <ivoks> err...
[11:04] <comadreja> thierry : I'm not at all the person to tell you, but I think you have to do an dpkg-buildpackage -S *.dsc and send the source package to revu
[11:05] <comadreja> thierry : what I mean is that I don't really know the procedure
[11:05] <ivoks> thierry: #ubuntu-motu for revu
[11:05] <thierry> ok but all I want is a patch to send on the ubuntu bugzilla
[11:05] <ivoks> comadreja: 627 is screem
[11:06] <ivoks> thierry: diff -ur new-source old-source
[11:06] <comadreja> ivoks : yes, and screem uses libdbus-1
[11:06] <thierry> k thanks
[11:06] <thierry> and the old source is the orig.tar.gz file?
[11:06] <ivoks> uh...
[11:07] <comadreja> thierry : I think thats the upstream source
[11:07] <ivoks> comadreja: i don't understand this bug at all :))
[11:07] <thierry> k
[11:07] <comadreja> ivoks : neither do I :). I just know that screem uses dbus
[11:07] <comadreja> and that problably should be using dbus_glib
[11:08] <comadreja> I thought that could be the transition...
[11:09] <infinity> thierry : As rsync is in main, it'll need a main uploader to fix it anyway.
[11:10] <infinity> thierry : And as the bug is a) very simple, and b) already assigned, you can assume it'll probably get fixed before breezy.
[11:10] <infinity> thierry : (By the guy it's assigned to, even, which is me)
[11:11] <cmatheson> hey we got a bunch of friends here and we're wanting to work on the ubuntu-express stuff... what work has been done already?
[11:11] <ivoks> :)
[11:12] <thierry> infinity : so I can forget it?
[11:13] <thierry> infinity : or sending my patch would a good idea?
[11:14] <infinity> thierry : It's a one-line patch, and the bug already has the fix in it (though not in patch format)
[11:14] <infinity> thierry : Also, in the time it took you to ask me that, I fixed it and uploaded the fixed package.  And closed the bug.
[11:15] <thierry> thanks :) anyway I've learned something!
[11:15] <infinity> thierry : Learning is always good.
[11:16] <thierry> yep
[11:16] <infinity> thierry : The cleanest way to get your aptch, btw, would be to "dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us -S", then in .., you'll see you now have two source packages.  The old and new.
[11:16] <infinity> thierry : debdiff *.dsc will give you a nice diff of the pair.
[11:17] <thierry> cool
[11:17] <ivoks> :))
[11:19] <thierry> infinity : I'll try it on bug 11459, don't steal it this time ;)
[11:20] <infinity> thierry : I didn't steal it, it was assigned to me. :)
[11:20] <infinity> thierry : Try to pick bugs that are assigned to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[11:21] <thierry> infinity : ho ok! yeah I'll try
[11:24] <thierry> infinity : I don't have the debdiff command and sudo apt-get install debdiff doesn't work
[11:28] <infinity> thierry : devscripts.
[11:40] <thierry> infinity : thierry@modemcable050:~/dev/ubun$ debdiff irssi-text_0.8.9-1ubuntu3.dsc > 11459.patch
[11:40] <thierry> debdiff: fatal error at line 205:
[11:40] <thierry> Need exactly two deb files or changes files to compare
[11:46] <seb128> hi
[11:46] <seb128> is<EMAIL_ADDRESS>on IRC?
[11:47] <infinity> thierry : debdiff old.dsc new.dsc
[11:47] <infinity> thierry : Though the error message seems pretty self-explanatory there.
[11:47] <thierry> infinity : ho! I didn't know I needed a .dsc before and after the changes! thanks
[11:48] <lamont> daniels: ??
[11:48] <infinity> thierry : Your new one would have overwritten the old if you didn't update the changelog before building.  You did update the changelog, right? :)
[11:49] <infinity> thierry : (hint: "dch -i" in the source directory.  hint2: read the debian new maintainer's guide)
[11:49] <seb128> is there somebody around with the sync from Debian magic? :)
[11:51] <thierry> infinity : do I need to change the package version number? If so to what?
[11:51] <seb128> is there any bugzilla master than can stop somebody to make changes?
[12:03] <carstenh_> thierry: 23:49:10 < infinity> thierry : (hint: "dch -i" in the source directory.  hint2:
[12:03] <carstenh_>           read the debian new maintainer's guide)
[12:04] <carstenh_> you should read hint 2 :)


[09:48] <poptisse> This the development team - because I have a really annoying bug that I have found which is not present on 10.10
[09:48] <poptisse> only on Natty
[09:49] <Ampelbein> poptisse: what is the bug number?
[09:49] <poptisse> 600178
[09:50] <poptisse> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers/+bug/600178
[09:50] <poptisse> It is extremely irritating - as some of the fixes I just don't understand as I am brand new to Ubuntu.
[09:50] <poptisse> It just appears to be an on-going issue that needs a fix
[09:54] <poptisse> Ampelbein: You part of the development team?
[09:55] <Ampelbein> poptisse: not of the core development team, no. but that issue seems to be with the closed source nvidia drivers anyway so the development team will most likely not be able to do anything about it.
[09:56] <poptisse> Workarounds are mention on the bug - just one of the workarounds is confusing me lol
[09:56] <poptisse> If you could help me understand it that, would be perfect
[09:57] <Ampelbein> poptisse: user support is better placed in #ubuntu
[09:58] <poptisse> I have tried ubuntu and no one understands what i am asking so cant help
[09:58] <poptisse> Enable Workarounds -> Force full screen redrews (buffer swap) on repaint - Its just this
[09:58] <poptisse> and
[09:58] <poptisse> Disable Workarounds -> Don't wait for video sync
[09:59] <poptisse> Does that mean I tick force full screen and untick don't want for video sync
[09:59] <poptisse> Because in compizconfig don't wait for video sync is alreayd unticked..
[10:00] <Ampelbein> poptisse: i don't know. have you tried it?
[10:00] <poptisse> Yes/No because
[10:01] <poptisse> In compizconfig there is an option to disable workarounds
[10:01] <poptisse> so am not sure if i disable workarounds and than tick the don't wait for video sync
[10:01] <poptisse> :l
[10:02] <poptisse> I am just going to downgrade to 10.10
[12:20] <bdrung> tumbleweed: around?
[12:21] <wibblymat> Does anyone have a moment to point a packaging newbie in the right direction?
[12:21] <bdrung> wibblymat: shoot
[12:22] <wibblymat> I have downloaded a package using bzr and copied in the latest upstream source
[12:22] <wibblymat> But when I try yo bzr build, I get 'Looking for a way to retrieve the upstream tarball' and some errors
[12:22] <wibblymat> Why is it trying to download the source?
[12:24] <wibblymat> Hmm, tried to keep it short, hopefully that is still intelligible :)
[12:24] <bdrung> the file is in the wrong directory or named wrongly
[12:24] <wibblymat> Which file?
[12:25] <bdrung> the upstream source tarball
[12:25] <bdrung> it should be ../package_version.orig.tar.gz (or .bz2)
[12:25] <wibblymat> But... why does it need the upstream tarball at all?
[12:25] <Laney> so that it can tell which parts are your modifications to upstream's source
[12:26] <bdrung> it's needed for the source package build (if you build only the binary .deb package, it's not needed)
[12:27] <wibblymat> Ok, I can see that I have got the wrong end of the stick somewhere :) I downloaded the upstream source and then copied the files from in the tarball over the top of the source in the package. Was that wrong?
[12:27] <Laney> did you add a new changelog entry with the new version number?
[12:27] <wibblymat> Yep
[12:28] <Laney> should be fine if you have the file in .. then, as bdrung said
[12:30] <wibblymat> I'm still a bit confused about why the build requires the original source tarball
[12:31] <Ampelbein> wibblymat: did you use 'bzr merge-upstream' to include the changes?
[12:31] <wibblymat> No
[12:31] <wibblymat> Should I have done?
[12:32] <Ampelbein> wibblymat: that's the recommended way when using bzr
[12:34] <Ampelbein> wibblymat: see http://people.canonical.com/~dholbach/packaging-guide/html/udd-merging.html#merging-a-new-upstream-version
[12:34] <wibblymat> Ah, thanks!
[12:35] <Laney> a source package usually consists of some upstream code (orig.tar.gz/bz2) and the Debian modifications (diff.gz/debian.tar.gz), as well as a control file (dsc)
[12:36] <wibblymat> Ah, ok. Was thinking of it as just a way to get the binary deb so couldn't understand why it needed the tarball when I had already included the code.  I'll revert and start again :)
[13:15] <frafu> Hi, I need some advice about what version of a dependency to use in debian/control because of a bug in the dependency.
[13:15] <frafu> In fact, the package named Onboard needs python-distutils-extra >= 2.10. But distutils-extra 2.26 has a bug that breaks the building of Onboard. The bug is fixed in distutils-extra 2.28. Thus, I am wondering if I should use 2.10 or 2.28 in debian/control. Could anybody please give me any advice? Thanks in advance.
[14:02] <bdrung> frafu: use 2.10
[14:02] <bdrung> frafu: bumping the version if only one version has a bug
[14:03] <bdrung> it would make backporting harder
[14:04] <frafu> bdrung: Thanks for the answer and the explanation. I will leave it to 2.10.
[14:51] <mirak_> hi
[14:52] <mirak_> is there a way to run the alternate installer from within an ubuntu install ?
[14:53] <maxb> any of the various virtual machine systems
[14:53] <maxb> but as a plain chroot builder, no
[16:06] <vish> anyone have an idea where the bug could be ? Bug #792085  the bug has three tasks and no debugging..
[16:06] <vish> .. and I'm able to reproduce it too on two separate WD drives
[16:37] <bdrung> broder: bug #801945
[20:05] <broder> bdrung: in find_package, just change SourcePackage to UbuntuSourcePackage
[20:08] <bdrung> broder: that doesn't seem to be the right solution
[20:08] <broder> the code used to use UbuntuSourcePackage. i changed it because i didn't see any reason i couldn't but forgot to test
[20:25] <bdrung> bug #801945 look more like a bug in tumbleweed's archive.py
[20:57] <broder> bdrung: maybe, or maybe we just shouldn't be using SourcePackage
[20:57] <broder> (and only using the subclasses)
[20:58] <bdrung> tumbleweed: your opinion to ^?
[23:35] <sveinse> I'm trying to make a debian package, and the files within this package can be installed without compilation. dh_make seems to be centric around building a source package, then a binary package. What is the easiest way to create a binary package without building. (I'm a n00b on this)


[00:23] <_schulte_> anyone have pointers to information on configuring lightdm?  I'm trying it out as my display manger, and I'd like to try different (e.g., webkit) themes.  thanks
[00:28] <bdrung> cjwatson: thanks
[01:30] <dpolehn> has the debian import freeze already started?
[01:32] <bryceh> _schulte_, /etc/lightdm/
[01:34] <charlie-tca> dpolehn: according the schedule, yesterday - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule
[01:34] <dpolehn> thanks
[01:35] <dpolehn> charlie-tca: so bugs need to be filed to import packages from debian correct?
[01:35] <charlie-tca> yes, I think so
[01:37] <dpolehn> thanks again
[01:41] <_schulte_> bryceh: beautiful, thanks, I should have thought to look there...
[07:40] <evfool> has someone ever used auto-upgrade-tester? can I get a bit of help with it?
[10:09] <euroford> hi all
[10:10] <euroford> i want to update gmp and gcc in lucid
[10:11] <euroford> gmp can be built without any problem
[10:11] <euroford> bug it break gcc when i upgrade gmp
[10:12] <euroford> and i just link libgmp.so.3 -> libgmp.so.10.0.2
[10:12] <euroford> gcc works again
[10:13] <euroford> and works well
[10:15] <euroford> my question is what shall i do if i want put new gmp into ppa,  to build other packages?
[10:18] <euroford> how can i install both version of gmp in pbuilder env?
[18:18] <nh2_> cnd: is there an application that displays all fingers on a touchpad as dots to show where they are?
[18:19] <cnd> nh2_, would a fingerpaint application work?
[18:19] <nh2_> cnd: I think so
[18:20] <cnd> nh2_, install qt4-demos and run /usr/lib/qt4/examples/touch/fingerpaint/fingerpaint
[18:20] <cnd> that path is off the top of my head, so you may need to fiddle with it
[18:25] <nh2_> cnd: it start a program "Finger Paint"; it does nothing, though
[18:25] <nh2_> *starts
[18:25] <cnd> nh2_, what do you mean by "it does nothing"?
[18:26] <cnd> what device are you using?
[18:26] <nh2_> cnd: Synaptics Touchpad in a Thinkpad
[18:26] <cnd> oh
[18:26] <cnd> synaptics doesn't provide full multitouch information
[18:26] <cnd> so we can get some gestures out of it
[18:26] <cnd> but you can't see the location of the touches, for example
[18:28] <nh2_> cnd: actually, I wanted to find a program to find exactly that kind of information :D (what information touchpads deliver), so I better ask you
[18:28] <cnd> ahh
[18:28] <cnd> let me think
[18:29] <cnd> I don't think we have any visual tools for semi-mt trackpads
[18:29] <nh2_> so synaptics tells you where one finger is? what does it tell for this value when you put more fingers on it?
[18:29] <cnd> all our visual tools are for fully multitouch devices
[18:29] <cnd> it gives you a bounding box of all the touches
[18:30] <cnd> unless you have a really new device, in which case it gives you the location of the first and the last touch
[18:30] <cnd> in both cases you also know how many touches there are
[18:30] <nh2_> cnd: how can I find out? I think I once had some kind of terminal app. that told me the numbers of fingers currently on the pad
[18:34] <cnd> I don't know how you can tell between the two right now; someone posted a series of patches for the new devices just last week, but I haven't had a chance to review them
[18:37] <nh2_> cnd: what is also weird is that cat and evtest don't show any output for /dev/input/event7 (which is my touchpad); both work fine on event6 though (which is the trackpoint)
[18:40] <cnd> nh2_, the synaptics X input module grabs the evdev device node
[18:40] <cnd> so you would need to change VTs and run evtest there
[18:41] <nh2_> ahaaa :) it works
[18:42] <nh2_> is there a tool for X that outputs what it grabs?
[18:42] <nh2_> or something lower-level than xev that shows me what actually happens in the hardware from the X side?
[18:45] <nh2_> cnd: and I guess synaptics does not support "quadtap"?
[18:48] <cnd> nh2_, I don't know of any tool that visualizes evdev data
[18:48] <cnd> and X does not generate any multitouch events for these devices
[18:49] <cnd> I also don't know of anything in synaptics that does something for qaudtaps :)
[19:07] <nh2_> cnd: When I use a synaptics device, should I get output from geistest?
[19:14] <cnd> nh2_, yes, you should be able to get 1-3 touch gestures, everything except rotate
[19:15] <nh2_> cnd: hmm, I don't get any output. What for example should generate output? 2-finger-move?
[19:16] <cnd> yeah
[19:16] <nh2_> hmm
[19:16] <cnd> well, geistest doesn't subscribe to one finger gestures
[19:16] <cnd> so two and three finger gestures
[19:16] <nh2_> I guess this is also the reason why touchegg doesn't wokr
[19:16] <cnd> probably :)
[19:16] <cnd> are you sure your device is multitouch?
[19:16] <cnd> it has to be semi-multitouch, not just multi-finger
[19:18] <nh2_> ugh, what is the difference between semi-mt and multi-finger?
[19:19] <nh2_> (btw scrolling up/down here in empathy works fine with 2 fingers, but I don't know if that tells anything)
[19:19] <cnd> multi-finger is when the trackpad gives one coordinate (X,Y) and says how many fingers are on the touchpad
[19:20] <cnd> semi-multitouch is when the trackpad gives two coordinates forming the bounding box of all touches, and how many touches are on the trackpad
[19:20] <cnd> btw, touches == fingers :)
[19:20] <cnd> multi-finger could provide drag gestures through uTouch, but we haven't added support
[19:21] <cnd> we tried adding it at one point, which broke people's trackpads during the natty cycle, so we reverted the change and haven't tried again yet
[19:22] <nh2_> how can I find out which type this Synaptics is?
[19:26] <nh2_> cnd: ahh. I think this is my problem: https://answers.launchpad.net/utouch/+question/157563
[19:26] <nh2_> the change you referenced to, is that already in Oneiric by now?
[19:42] <tlp> Hi. Latest alpha release/kernel will not boot on my 2007 iMac at work. Known issue? I've been using the previous kernel via grub.
[19:43] <tlp> I think there's a panic or something. Not sure if it's logged somewhere -- couldn't find it.
[19:52] <penguin42> tlp: What happens ?
[19:56] <tlp> system begins to boot as normal, then freezes. If I do the recovery mode, I see a normal dmesg boot combined with some errors (which I don't have with me unfortunately.)
[19:57] <tlp> I'm thinking not having 3.x might be screwing up the r300g video driver as well, since Unity doesn't render.
[19:59] <penguin42> bryceh: Ping
[20:00] <penguin42> bryceh: bug 803610 looks like a continuation of your fight with synaptics
[20:11] <bryceh> penguin42, you able to repro it?  you know the drill... collect a full backtrace
[20:11] <penguin42> bryceh: No I'm not, just thought it worth pointing out given the work you'd done on that one
[20:11]  * penguin42 is just triaging bugs at the moment
[20:19] <bryceh> penguin42, ah thanks
[20:20] <bryceh> penguin42, in general when you run across bugs reporting crashes without full backtraces, have them collect a full backtrace
[20:20] <bryceh> crash bugs without backtraces are about as useful as freeze bugs without gpu dumps :-)
[20:22] <penguin42> bryceh: By full do you mean a 'bt' from gdb or is the xorg.0.log ok if the debug packages are installed?
[20:23] <bryceh> 'bt full'
[20:24] <penguin42> ok
[20:24] <bryceh> Xorg.0.log never includes the state of variables and such that you get with full backtraces
[20:25] <bryceh> full backtrace also indicates what line number the failure was on
[20:25] <penguin42> sounds like it could do with triggering gdb itself if it was installed
[20:27] <bryceh> penguin42, now you understand what apport does :-)
[20:29] <bryceh> X just uses the libc backtrace routine.  It'd be nice if libc had a routine that printed gdb like full traces
[20:30] <bryceh> but for most purposes our apport hook does the trick
[20:30] <bryceh> however it isn't turned on post-release
[20:31] <penguin42> yeh, that's a shame really; it would be nice to turn it on for particularly problematic things like X
[20:32] <bryceh> it'd be ok for X crashes, those are rare enough.  but in general we'd probably be innundated with too many bug reports
[20:32] <bryceh> I mean, more than we already are :-P
[20:33] <penguin42> nod
[20:33] <bryceh> if we had a proper crash database for the post-release ones to go to, rather than filing them as bugs directly, that'd make it worth collecting them
[20:38] <bryceh> https://dev.launchpad.net/LEP/ApportOnStable


[10:42] <luis220413> Please reopen bug 1980806. Sebastian Bacher closed it linking to the version in Kinetic, but the bug does not apply to Kinetic.
[10:44] <rbasak> luis220413: no, that's not how Launchpad bugs work.
[10:44] <rbasak> What you want are separate tasks for the stable series.
[10:44] <rbasak> I'm sure Olivier will take care of that as he's working on it
[10:44] <luis220413> rbasak: The importance should also be raised given that this is a security issue.
[10:44] <luis220413> rbasak: Please create them
[10:45] <rbasak> luis220413: speak to oSoMoN please. He's not in this channel though. Try #ubuntu-devel
[10:46] <rbasak> As he's actively working on the bug, I'm not going to start changing the bug metadata under his feet.