[00:05] <bradm> are there any decent docs about how to write preseed files and modify them for maas?
[00:06] <bigjools> bradm: it's not a maas-specific thing really
[00:06] <bigjools> https://help.ubuntu.com/12.04/installation-guide/i386/preseed-intro.html
[00:06] <bradm> bigjools: I'm talking about what you can do inside the {{ }} tags
[00:07] <bigjools> that's a templating language called Tempita:  http://pythonpaste.org/tempita/
[00:07] <bigjools> http://pythonpaste.org/tempita/#the-language specifically
[00:08] <bradm> bigjools: and how do we know what variables we have access to in there? apparently I want to access node.tags.all(), but how would I find that out?
[00:08] <bigjools> reading the code, it's not documented :(
[00:08] <bradm> I think what I want is {{ if 'nova-compute' in node.tags.all() }}
[00:09] <bradm> but its a guess based on the examples
[00:09] <bigjools> should work
[00:11] <bradm> cool, thanks
[02:20] <bradm> is there any way to either see the preseed that's used by maas for a node, or maybe to capture the output from syslog of the install?
[02:20] <bigjools> bradm: yeah there's a preview on the node page
[02:21] <bradm> bigjools: aha, sweet.
[02:22] <bradm> oh, haha, thats what happens when you make assumptions about tag names
[02:28]  * bigjools gets annoyed with whatever is stealing the ctrl-space shortcut on the desktop
[02:28] <bigjools> no, I don't ever want to change my keyboard layout once I set it, Unity
[03:50] <roaksoax> bigjools: howdy!! so maas was broken in latest trunk and nobody noticed
[03:50] <roaksoax> :)
[03:51] <roaksoax> bigjools: fixes were really packaging branch but if I hadn't tested, nobody would have noticed :)
[03:53] <bradm> ugh, debugging preseeds is time consuming
[03:54] <roaksoax> bigjools: so something changed on how maas binds ports? or how pserv does? cause now I had to use authbind for pserv too when before wasn't needed
[03:57] <roaksoax> bigjools: uploaded!
[04:03] <bradm> bigjools: any hints on what else it could be to match a tag?  if "compute" in node.tags.all() doesn't seem to do it
[04:33] <bradm> ah, node.tags.all() is empty in the preseed
[04:33] <bradm> and the node definately has a tag
[04:56] <bradm> do I need to be using the curtin installer or something?
[05:43] <bigjools> roaksoax: it's a *really* good idea to wait for a successful qa lab run before uploading anything
[05:44] <bigjools> bradm: it will be returning tag records, not tags, so it will need something like:
[05:44] <bigjools> tag.name for tag in node.tags.all()
[05:45] <bigjools> you might need :py mode, but see if it works
[05:47] <bradm> bigjools: can I assign that to a variable or something?
[05:47] <bigjools> yeah use a define block
[05:53] <bradm> bigjools: so a python define block to create a function?  like {{py: def tagsname(n): return tag.name for tag in node.tags.all() }} or something?
[05:54] <bigjools> no
[05:54] <bigjools> hang on
[05:54] <bradm> bigjools: or the {{def tagsname}} stuff?
[05:55] <bigjools> bradm: http://pythonpaste.org/tempita/#inherit-def
[05:56] <bigjools> you can set python vars as well
[05:58] <bradm> bigjools: hmm, I'll play about with it and see what I can do
[05:58] <bradm> bigjools: I think this is a really important idiom for tweaking preseeds based on tags
[06:05] <bigjools> bradm: yes, sounds reasonable
[06:12] <bradm> bigjools: clearly I suck at this :)
[06:13] <bradm> https://pastebin.canonical.com/104959/ prints out the tags on from the node
[06:24] <bigjools> use public pastebin if you can
[06:25] <bigjools> but glad it worked for you
[06:25] <bradm> yeah, just need to figure out how to turn that into an if statement now
[06:33] <bigjools> {{py: if "mytag" in [tag.name for tag in node.tags.all()] }}
[06:33] <bradm> bigjools: https://pastebin.canonical.com/104960/
[06:33] <bigjools> use public pastebin if you can
[06:33] <bigjools> please
[06:33] <bradm> oh, bah
[06:34] <bradm> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6947342/ - gives me a function I can use later like - if 'mytag' in tagnames(node)
[06:35] <bradm> bigjools: hrm, yours doesn't work for me
[06:35] <bigjools> it was untested :)
[06:36] <bigjools> if yours works then fine
[06:36] <bradm> yours is nicer in terms of using less space
[06:37] <bradm> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6947349/ <- what I'm trying to do - I can have different late_commands based on tags
[06:37] <bradm> I suspect its the endif etc thats there
[06:41] <bradm> bigjools: thanks for the help, this should work out nicely
[06:53] <bigjools> bradm: np
[06:54] <bradm> I don't like maintaining multiple sets of data with most of it duplicated, this will fix that
[07:24]  * jtv just wasted a few hours trying to get his escaping test for a data display working, only to realise the data got neatly un-escaped as part of the extraction from HTML in the test itself.
[08:43] <rvba> I'm still getting 'AttributeError: class Factory has no attribute 'forProtocol'' when running 'make run+webapp' on trunk. (http://paste.ubuntu.com/6947733/)
[08:43] <rvba> Anyone else seeing this?
[09:30] <rvba> bigjools: btw, about lp:~julian-edwards/maas/default-commissioning-series : we're now using Trusty for commissioning but we're still importing *all* the images.  This is such a waste of bandwidth!
[09:31] <jtv> Should be an easy fix!
[09:48] <rvba> bigjools: fixing this will reduce the time it takes to import the images.
[09:49] <bigjools> rvba: +1!
[09:49] <bigjools> silly omission
[09:49] <bigjools> although we may need some more for deployment to other releases
[09:51] <rvba> bigjools: we need to keep all the deployment images indeed.  But the ephemerals take much longer to import.
[09:51] <bigjools> yes
[12:34] <jtv> rvba: I've pushed a change that tests for, and fixes, the QuerySet nastiness.
[12:35] <rvba> jtv: cool, branch approved.
[12:39] <jtv> Thanks!
[12:43] <rvba> jtv: forgot to say, you might want to rename NetworkConnectNodesForm to re-use it verbatim in the method used to remove nodes.
[12:44] <jtv> Might, yes...  small tweak to the help string I guess.
[12:45] <rvba> Right.
[13:40] <jtv> rvba, want to try this one?  https://code.launchpad.net/~jtv/maas/sample-commissioning-data/+merge/206711
[13:46] <rvba> jtv: sure
[13:55] <tomixxx3> hi, does it make sense to set "ip address" equal to "router ip" in maas dashboard?
[13:56] <jtv> Hi tomixxx3.  I think it does, if your maas server is also your gateway.  But we don't really do anything with router_ip; it's just there so you can allocate nodes that are connected to a particular router.
[13:57] <tomixxx3> k i will try - and change it also in "interfaces"
[13:58] <tomixxx3> do i have to re-commission nodes after a change like this?
[13:59] <jtv> Which are you changing?  IP address of a cluster interface?
[13:59] <tomixxx3> no, gateway address of the network interface
[14:00] <jtv> Gateway address is different from router_ip...  The gateway is configuration for MAAS's DHCP server.
[14:00] <jtv> Basically, that's "when I serve DHCP to a node, where should I tell the node its gateway is?"
[14:00] <jtv> If you're not managing DHCP on any interfaces, it's not going to matter.
[14:01] <tomixxx3> puhh... ok, whre can i set the gateway-address then?
[14:01] <jtv> On the DHCP server.  Are you running your own DHCP server for the nodes, or are you letting MAAS serve DHCP?
[14:02] <tomixxx3> MAAS runs DHCP + DNS for the nodes
[14:02] <jtv> Ah OK
[14:03] <jtv> In that case you do need the gateway setting on the cluster interface.
[14:03] <jtv> I don't think you need re-commissioning after a change like that, per se, but the nodes may still have old information.
[14:04] <tomixxx3> k, i should maybe reboot nodes then
[14:04] <jtv> That would make them pick up the settings, yes.
[14:04] <tomixxx3> now is the question what is the gateway address
[14:05] <jtv> Whatever gateway the nodes should use when communicating to the internet.
[14:05] <tomixxx3> my maas server has 2 interfaces. is it the ip of the interface which connects the maas-server to internet?
[14:05] <tomixxx3> would make sense, not? ^^
[14:05] <jtv> Slightly different:
[14:06] <jtv> the gateway setting tells DHCP clients: "if you have a packet that you want to send to a host that's not on the same network, send it to the gateway and it will forward your packet."
[14:07] <jtv> So if your maas server is also the gateway between the nodes and the internet, it should be the IP address of the interface that the nodes can see.
[14:07] <jtv> (I hope.  Rusty!)
[14:08] <tomixxx3> hmm, i have set the gateway equal to ip address, but now my maas-server lost its i-net connection
[14:09] <jtv> The _server_?
[14:09] <jtv> The gateway setting will only affect the nodes.
[14:09] <tomixxx3> yes...
[14:09] <tomixxx3> i swear
[14:09] <tomixxx3> its the server
[14:09] <jtv> Are you sure you edited the cluster interface where you serve DHCP?
[14:09] <jtv> Or it could simply be unrelated...
[14:10] <tomixxx3> i have changed "interfaces" file and i have changed cluster interface settings in maas dashboard
[14:10] <jtv> Ah, then your interfaces file may be broken.
[14:10] <jtv> You could try running "sudo ifup <interface>" in a shell (where <interface> is e.g. eth0 or eth1)
[14:11] <jtv> Just to see if there's an error...
[14:11] <tomixxx3> ifup, ifdown works
[14:11] <jtv> Hmmm
[14:12] <tomixxx3> i dont understand this
[14:13] <jtv> Neither do I!
[14:15] <tomixxx3> i could try the ip of the other interface card as gateway
[14:16] <jtv> Well... gateway setting shouldn't affect the server itself.  Something else is wrong.
[14:17] <jtv> And it sounds as if it's in the system network settings, really, not the MAAS settings.
[14:18] <tomixxx3> server is reachable through <IP_ADDRESS>/MAAS only i-net does not work
[14:19] <jtv> So... the nodes can reach the server and vice versa, but the server cannot reach the internet?
[14:19] <tomixxx3> yes
[14:20] <jtv> And that interface gets its IP address from the uni's DHCP server, right?
[14:20] <tomixxx3> yes
[14:20] <jtv> Does it have one now?  Is the interface up?
[14:20] <tomixxx3> yes
[14:20] <jtv> Can the server reach other hosts on the university network?
[14:21] <tomixxx3> just a moment, iam rebooting the server right now - and i have forgotten to run the NAT-script...
[14:21] <tomixxx3> its a NAT script provided by gmb
[14:21] <jtv> Yes, I remember.
[14:22] <jtv> I hope you don't have one of those weird setups where on some boots, eth0 and eth1 are switched around...
[14:22] <jtv> But probably not.
[14:22] <tomixxx3> hehe, i have tried already inverted ethernet ports in the script :D
[14:23] <jtv> Hope that didn't affect anything...
[14:23] <tomixxx3> schould not
[14:24] <tomixxx3> the server behaves like the nodes now: it can resolve the DNS name of any http-url but it cannot connect...
[14:24] <jtv> That does sound as if some wires got crossed somewhere...
[14:26] <tomixxx3> assume my gateway address is <IP_ADDRESS>, the ip of the other network interface
[14:26] <tomixxx3> what could my ethernet settings look like xP - they should also allow <IP_ADDRESS> as a IP
[14:31] <tomixxx3> sorry wrong question. why iam not able to set the "network" parameter in cluster interface settings
[14:31] <tomixxx3> ?
[14:32] <jtv> Network parameter?  I don't understand what parameter that is... do you mean netmaks?
[14:32] <jtv> *netmask?
[14:34] <tomixxx3> no, i mean "network", the part of the net
[14:35] <jtv> Ohhh
[14:35] <jtv> That's not a parameter.
[14:35] <jtv> That's just a network address computed from your cluster interface's IP address and netmask.
[14:36] <tomixxx3> ok
[14:46] <tomixxx3> if i remove the gateway line from the "interfaces" file i have access to i-net on server again
[14:49] <jtv> Oh, did you set your own server's address as its own interface in its own interfaces file!?
[14:49] <jtv> That would create a fun situation.  :)
[14:50] <tomixxx3> yes i guess
[14:50] <tomixxx3> bad?
[14:51] <jtv> Yes — if you set a gateway in your interfaces file, that tells _that same machine_ where it should send its internet packets.
[14:52] <tomixxx3> so it asks only itself?
[14:52] <jtv> As you noticed we have 2 "gateway" settings.
[14:52] <jtv> One is in /etc/network/interfaces.
[14:52] <jtv> The other is in MAAS.
[14:52] <tomixxx3> yep
[14:53] <jtv> The one in /etc/network/interfaces is for configuring your server's own networking.
[14:53] <jtv> But the network interface that goes to the "outside" should just get its gateway from DHCP.
[14:53] <jtv> On the other hand, the gateway setting in MAAS is configuration for the DHCP server.
[14:53] <jtv> It doesn't do anything for your machine, but the nodes are its DHCP clients.
[14:53] <jtv> And it tells the _clients_ where their gateway is.
[14:54] <tomixxx3> ohoh
[14:54] <jtv> For the clients (your nodes), your server is the gateway.  That's fine.
[14:54] <jtv> But you configured your server to use itself (on the other interface) as the gateway.
[14:54] <jtv> And so it was probably just running around in circles.
[14:54] <tomixxx3> i understand
[14:55] <tomixxx3> good point
[14:57] <tomixxx3> so maas takes control over the one ethernet port?
[14:58] <tomixxx3> wow, this could solve a lot of troubles
[15:03] <tomixxx3> jtv: but i have to configure the ehternet port in the "interfaces" file too?
[15:03] <tomixxx3> jtv: just remove the "gateway" to be the same as the ip
[15:03]  * jtv reads backscroll
[15:04] <jtv> MAAS doesn't actually take control of any ethernet interfaces.  But it serves DHCP on the interface that faces your nodes, which is pretty bossy.
[15:04] <tomixxx3> OK, so only the "gateway" line should be replaced in the "interfaces" file?
[15:04] <jtv> I mean good, but it's more "taking control of the network" than "taking control of the ethernet port."
[15:05] <jtv> It's hard for me to imagine what the current state is, and it's getting a bit late to really dive into it... but generally, you set up your system's networking in /etc/networks/interfaces, and then you let MAAS run on top of that as basically just another server application.
[15:07] <jtv> MAAS tries to _detect_ your system setup when you install it, but it doesn't keep track after that and it doesn't change them.
[15:07] <jtv> It only does that sort of "bossy" stuff on the nodes.
[15:07] <tomixxx3> kk
[15:17] <tomixxx3> shit
[15:17] <tomixxx3> sorry, it seems it is working now!
[15:18] <tomixxx3> i have removed the "gateway" line from "interfaces" and set "ip router" in dashbaoard to "<IP_ADDRESS>" - same address like the IP address of the maaas-server
[15:19] <jtv> The "IP router" field in MAAS doesn't matter much — that's just for large setups where you sometimes want to allocate nodes that are connected to specific routers.
[15:19] <tomixxx3> hmmm, or was it the reboot of the nodes?
[15:19] <tomixxx3> i dont know...
[15:20] <jtv> Well the incorrect gateway setting in /etc/networks/interfaces you had earlier definitely sounded like a problem.
[15:20] <tomixxx3> yeah, but before today i had no gateway line configured...
[15:21] <tomixxx3> executed "wget www.orf.at" from ubuntu@cloud1 now and everything seemts to work "index.html" saved...
[15:23] <tomixxx3> i cant believe right now, maybe just a fata morgana
[15:23] <jtv> heh
[15:24] <jtv> Networking can be tough going, but it's useful knowledge in general life.
[15:25] <jtv> And when I say "general," obviously I mean "deeply technical computer-related."  :)
[15:27] <tomixxx3> yeah, quite a good feeling right now, i want to expand my cloud :D *hrhr*
[15:28] <tomixxx3> jtv: but it's definitely the "router ip" setting
[15:28] <tomixxx3> if have tried a different value now, and it is not working anymore
[15:29] <jtv> And if you set it back to the previous value, it works again..?
[15:29] <tomixxx3> jtv: worth a try
[15:29] <tomixxx3> what do u mean with previosu value? "ip address" == "router ip" or "ip address" == the address before today?
[15:30] <tomixxx3> i've tried it with "the address before today" and it does not work
[15:31] <jtv> I mean, if you reset it to the "good" value that worked just now, it works again?
[15:31] <tomixxx3> that's what im trying right now
[15:31] <tomixxx3> would be cool
[15:31] <tomixxx3> ^^
[15:32] <jtv> Let's hope it works!
[15:36] <tomixxx3> yep, working
[15:37] <jtv> Great!  I don't understand it, but maybe tomorrow I can look into it.
[15:37] <jtv> For now, I have to leave.
[15:38] <tomixxx3> kk, ty for help so far!
[15:39] <jtv> np!
[23:13] <chris38home__> just upgrade maas on trusty and got this in pserv.log :
[23:13] <chris38home__> twisted.internet.error.CannotListenError: Couldn't listen on <IP_ADDRESS>:69: [Errno 2] No such file or directory.
[23:14] <chris38home__> any idea ?
[23:14] <bigjools> what version of the package?
[23:14] <chris38home__> 1.5+bzr1951+1951+243~ppa0~ubuntu14.04.1
[23:15] <bigjools> you are better off using the main archive for trusty
[23:15] <chris38home__> go it on 1.5+bzr1951-0ubuntu1 too
[23:15] <bigjools> the daily build packages may be broken at any time
[23:15] <bigjools> ok
[23:16] <bigjools> roaksoax: is that ^^ anything like the authbind error you saw?
[23:18] <roaksoax> bigjools yup. Still need to handle upgradea. Clean inatalls are not affected
[23:18] <bigjools> roaksoax: what's the procedure to handle the upgrade so chris38home__ can be unblocked?
[23:19] <bigjools> and the rest of us :)
[23:19] <chris38home__> ;-)
[23:19] <roaksoax> just edit /etc/authbind/byuid/xyz
[23:20] <roaksoax> and make ghe 68:68 become68:69
[23:20] <bigjools> right
[23:21] <chris38home__> cool, got it fixed
[23:21] <chris38home__> thanks ;-)


 OH HAIL WINDOWS 8
[04:30] <TimAnderson> !ops
[04:30] <TimAnderson> System.out.println("FUCK UBUNTU");
[11:38] <bazhang> kees, hi
[12:27] <Tm_T> hi kees
[16:22] <IdleOne> !details > bobweaver
[16:52] <DJones> !list > alexandra
[20:22] <ikonia> hello phunyguy_t430s
[20:24] <phunyguy_t430s> hello.  Just lurking.
[20:25] <ikonia> the channel has a no idle policy
[20:25] <phunyguy_t430s> oh.  Didn't see that in the /motd.
[20:25] <phunyguy_t430s> apologies.
[20:26] <ikonia> no problem
[20:54] <dontknow> https://www.fsf.org/blogs/rms/ubuntu-spyware-what-to-do
[20:55] <IdleOne> was that all?
[20:55] <ikonia> why are you pasting that in here
[20:57] <dontknow> ikonia, just live with it
[21:09] <ikonia> dontknow: please don't paste any more pointless stuff
[21:09] <ikonia> dontknow: what do you want ?
[21:09] <dontknow> ikonia, all you can do is kicking or banning. you don't discuss
[21:09] <ikonia> dontknow: there is nothing to discuss
[21:09] <ikonia> you joined the ops channel and pasted and RMS blog post
[21:09] <k1l_> dontknow: this is not a discussion channel for that topic
[21:09] <ikonia> it's nothing to do with this channel
[21:10] <ikonia> what do you actually want ?
[21:10] <dontknow> ikonia, you banned me from offtopic and ubuntu because of this subject
[21:10] <ikonia> you where banned a while ago
[21:10] <ikonia> @btlogin
[21:10] <ikonia> I can tell you what for
[21:11] <ikonia> hang on a moment
[21:13] <ikonia> most of the reasons I see you being banned for is bad language or just making stuff up
[21:13] <ikonia> but for example, that post / blog would not be welcome in #ubuntu as it has nothing to do with support
[21:14] <dontknow> ikonia, where should i paste that article then?
[21:15] <ikonia> why do you need to paste it ?
[21:15] <dontknow> because of discussion
[21:15] <dontknow> what shouldn't i?
[21:15] <ikonia> right, #ubuntu-offtopic would be an "ok" place
[21:15] <ikonia> however you are banned because you seem unable to communicate with people
[21:15] <dontknow> ikonia, it is your opinion
[21:16] <ikonia> "talking about fucking google search"
[21:16] <ikonia> that's not my opinion
[21:16] <ikonia> that's you typing rude interactions
[21:16] <ikonia> telling people to "shut up"
[21:16] <ikonia> that's not my opinion - that's you being rude to people
[21:17] <dontknow> ok i will call them my dear
[21:17] <ikonia> no, you won't
[21:17] <ikonia> you seem unable to to interact with people at all
[21:17] <dontknow> ikonia, you are not discussing with me
[21:17] <ikonia> no, I'm not
[21:18] <dontknow> about on subject
[21:18] <ikonia> myself/others have tried to disscuss it with you, and failed
[21:18] <ikonia> so at this time, I'm not discussing it,
[21:19] <dontknow> ikonia, no you didn't try it, not even close. you just told me "stop nonsense" etc... i was talking to other people
[21:19] <dontknow> whatever
[21:19] <ikonia> ok,
[21:19] <ikonia> bye
[21:19] <dontknow> ikonia, you are wrong, just live with it
[21:19] <ikonia> ok
[21:20] <k1l_> dontknow: honestly. you should stop trolling in first place if you want to discuss over your bans
[21:20] <k1l_> …


[07:23] <dholbach> good morning
[08:15] <techguru> hello
[08:16] <JoseeAntonioR> hey, techguru
[08:17] <techguru> how is it going
[08:18] <JoseeAntonioR> techguru: fine, thanks :) how may I help you?
[08:18] <techguru> nothing just hanging out
[08:19] <JoseeAntonioR> oh, ok
[08:26] <techguru> know have I am getting a evolution calender error
[08:27] <JoseeAntonioR> techguru: as the topic and the entrymsg says, for support please go to #ubuntu
[11:41] <Test312> Hello!


[07:22] <dholbach> good morning
[07:24] <MooDoo> morning
[09:08] <Kilos> hi dholbach MooDoo svij
[09:11] <dholbach> hi Kilos
[09:42] <MooDoo> howdy Kilos :)
[09:42] <elacheche> Hey locos! :)
[10:21] <elacheche> dholbach, when the deadline to apply fro the CC membership?
[10:25] <elacheche> I got it dholbach :) →  "please send an email to the
[10:25] <elacheche> Community Council (community-council at lists.ubuntu.com) with the
[10:25] <elacheche> subject “[CC Nomination]” by Friday, October 16th"
[10:25] <elacheche> How many persons applied to that dholbach ?
[11:44] <dholbach> elacheche, I can't quite remember - I think it was 10+
[11:45] <dholbach> and AFAIK the nominations period is over
[11:45] <dholbach> czajkowski, right? ^
[11:45] <dholbach> Mark was reviewing the list of nominations, but got busy with openstack summit and stuff
[11:45] <dholbach> I'll prod him again
[11:45] <dholbach> if you want to nominate yourself, try sending in an email - maybe you'll still be consider
[11:58] <czajkowski> dholbach: correct the names are with Mark rught now for reviewing and as soon as they're reviewed we will have a poll and announcement set up
[12:01] <dholbach> ok
[12:35] <ahoneybun> what about the LC dholbach?
[12:37] <dholbach> ahoneybun, I don't know
[12:37] <dholbach> but jose and others on the LC should
[12:37] <ahoneybun> thx
[12:37] <jose> dholbach: I expired before nominations ended - wxl, awake?
[12:37] <jose> s/ended/started/
[12:38] <dholbach> jose, that's no problem - I we can extend the term for a couple of weeks if necessary
[12:38] <dholbach> until the new LC is not in place, I'd consider everyone's term to still be ongoing :)
[12:39] <jose> well, I've applied for the CC and would prefer to not be in the LC + CC voting. but the guys know I can help if they need me :)
[12:40] <dholbach> jose, I think ahoneybun's question was more about the state of the LC nomination process
[12:40] <jose> yeah. /me knows 0
[12:41] <jose> I believe it closes on the 5th though
[12:54] <ahoneybun> mm
[12:54]  * ahoneybun is still thinking of joining it
[12:55] <ahoneybun> or putting my name forward I mean
[13:07] <jose> you should :)
[16:46] <wxl> yes i'm here jose
[16:46] <wxl> afaik we didn't get any nominations.
[16:47] <wxl> elacheche: do you know where lunapersa has run off to as of late?
[16:48] <jose> ahoneybun: mind a quick PM
[19:48] <ahoneybun> jose: sure?


 Not the unreliable forecast.
[06:24] <ducasse> yup. got surge protector, but... i still sort of like thunderstorms, though :)
[06:40] <lotuspsychje> morning guys
[06:40] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: check this: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/09/kde-plasma-mobile-coming-purism-librem-5
[06:43] <lotuspsychje> https://puri.sm/shop/librem-5/
[06:43] <ducasse> on $290000 now, with one more month to reach $1.5 mill - i doubt this will happen.
[06:43] <lotuspsychje> 21%
[06:46] <ducasse> i suspect most of the backing happens early
[06:46] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[06:46] <lotuspsychje> but its good that this project exists
[06:46] <ducasse> absolutely, i'd love a fully open linux-based phone
[06:47] <lotuspsychje> with a with full access
[06:47] <lotuspsychje> terminal
[06:47] <lotuspsychje> would be awesome
[06:48] <lordievader> Rooting an Android phone also gives you full access with a terminal.
[06:48] <lordievader> Termux is quite nice for that.
[06:48] <lotuspsychje> yeah but i dont like android
[06:48] <ducasse> yes, but rooting certain phones can be a hassle
[06:51] <lordievader> For my Nexus 5x it was rather simple.
[06:51] <lotuspsychje> hmm whats this https://postmarketos.org/
[06:51] <ducasse> it can be, but it varies
[06:51] <lordievader> The only 'problem' was unlocking the bootloader wiping the phone. The advice of the internet for this phone, unlock the bootloader when you get it.
[06:57] <ducasse> i have a phone here, sony totally refuses to give me the code to unlock it.
[07:03] <lordievader> Bastards -.-
[07:04] <ducasse> yep. i have a strong hunch that's illegal here, but haven't really looked into it.
[07:05] <immu> hi amigos
[07:05] <ducasse> signed bootloaders = work of the devil
[07:05] <lotuspsychje> and preinstalled OS when buy too
[07:06] <lotuspsychje> freedom of choice, zero
[07:06] <lotuspsychje> when schools start in september, theres a new iphone..
[07:07] <lotuspsychje> how convinient
[07:07] <lotuspsychje> hi davidcalle
[07:07] <lotuspsychje> hi immu
[07:07] <davidcalle> o/
[10:11] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[10:12] <brunch> Good morning, BluesKaj
[10:12] <BluesKaj> 'Morning brunch
[10:16] <BluesKaj> or should i say 'Afternoon brunch :-)
[16:48] <immu> EriC^^, ducasse lordievader BluesKaj hi & did i miss someone?
[16:48] <EriC^^> hey immu
[16:48] <immu> hi EriC^^
[16:49] <EriC^^> how's it going?
[17:02] <immu> cool eric
[17:02] <immu> hows it in lebanon?
[17:18] <immu> how many are running Ubuntu daily builds?
[17:29] <lotuspsychje> good evening guys
[17:31] <lotuspsychje> lets c whats new in ubuntu land
[17:32] <lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/canonical-and-nec-will-work-on-new-digital-signage-solution-based-on-ubuntu-core-517740.shtml
[18:02] <immu> coool
[18:12] <immu> where do i talk about ubuntu daily builds for issues?
[18:12] <lotuspsychje> immu: 17.10?
[18:13] <ducasse> !artful
[18:13] <lotuspsychje> found a bug immu ?
[18:17] <immu> yup
[18:17] <immu> not sure but i get this message in software center that search took a long time
[18:17] <lotuspsychje> share url in other channel plz
[18:18] <immu> timeout was reached as snap took too long to return results
[18:19] <immu> https://imgur.com/a/KC8mP
[18:20] <lotuspsychje> immu: ducasse showed you wich channel artful belongs
[18:20] <lotuspsychje> not in #ubuntu plz
[18:20] <immu> sure didn't see that
[18:21] <immu> lotuspsychje, can some one sanitize ;)
[18:21] <immu> brb i am going to listen to latest ubuntupod casts :)
[18:22] <immu> http://ubuntupodcast.org/ i hope posting this here is not blasphemous :)
[18:22] <immu> tnx folks
[18:24] <immu> so what else ?
[18:27] <ducasse> what else what?
[18:28] <EriC^^> anyone good with routers here?
[18:29] <daftykins> what's up? :)
[18:29] <lotuspsychje> whats going on EriC^^
[18:29] <daftykins> also hey all :>
[18:29] <EriC^^> i have an issue with my router, it was working fine all day then it drops the connection on the wifi, if i run ping <IP_ADDRESS> in the terminal it gives "ping <IP_ADDRESS> host not reachable, then later it works
[18:29] <EriC^^> hey daftykins
[18:29] <daftykins> ah yeah response from 2.237 so that'd be your machines IP
[18:30] <EriC^^> yeah it is
[18:30] <daftykins> is the router on the newest firmware?
[18:30] <lotuspsychje> hey daftykins :p
[18:30] <EriC^^> not sure i didnt connect to it or anything
[18:30] <EriC^^> the isp just installed it 2 days ago, it was working ok til tonight
[18:30] <lotuspsychje> so nice to see you
[18:30] <EriC^^> it's a technicolor
[18:31] <daftykins> ah ISP supplied will be locked to itself then
[18:31] <daftykins> no firmware updates typically, that's the brand mine puts out too
[18:31] <ikonia> daftykins: where have you been ?
[18:31] <EriC^^> oh
[18:31] <daftykins> ikonia: eh? i'm always here
[18:31] <lotuspsychje> daftykins: is still banned in main, remove his ban?
[18:32] <ikonia> oh,
[18:32] <daftykins> haha nah you don't have to do that, all is well as-is
[18:32] <ikonia> explains why I've not seen him active
[18:33] <daftykins> i'd like to imagine the resolved-issues percentage took a hit, but then so did the users confirmed as idiots :)
[18:33] <lotuspsychje> lol
[18:33] <daftykins> EriC^^: i can only imagine checking there's no WPA1+2 mixed mode on, (have WPA2 with AES only) and have a different SSID for 2.4 and 5GHz if the router is dual-band
[18:34] <EriC^^> daftykins: could working on the channel as other routers affect it?
[18:34] <daftykins> yeah but only really speeds, nothing near drops of that severity
[18:35] <EriC^^> i see 2 other ssid that have the same channel
[18:35] <EriC^^> oh
[18:35] <daftykins> most are configured 'auto' these days and just pick channels that don't conflict
[18:35] <lotuspsychje> EriC^^: did you try a good ol router reset too?
[18:35] <EriC^^> daftykins: it does have WPA1 WPA2 for the security
[18:35] <EriC^^> Blink163507     Infra  11    54 Mbit/s  45      ▂▄__  WPA1 WPA2
[18:36] <daftykins> mmm so mixed mode, better if it were forced on WPA2 with AES only
[18:36] <EriC^^> oh god, 2 of my neighbors have WEP xD
[18:36] <lotuspsychje> lol
[18:37] <EriC^^> i'll give it a go tomorrow, i've never hooked up a pc to a router
[18:37] <daftykins> they must still be rocking the ol' Nintendo DSs ;)
[18:37] <EriC^^> so kind of excited :D
[18:37] <daftykins> ikonia: thanks for noticing though, btw :)
[18:37] <ikonia> not a problem,
[18:39] <lotuspsychje> bbl
[18:45] <daftykins> i set up Nextcloud on my VM here today, after an update to 16.04 from 14.04 to make life easier :)
[18:45] <daftykins> quite neat to have LAN-speed transfers onto a 'cloud backup' now and have it accessible when i'm out and about on laptop or phone
[18:55] <pauljw> Hi everyone
[19:09] <EriC^^> hi pauljw :)
[19:10] <pauljw> hey EriC^^ :)
[19:17] <ccat> ok -- thanks all.  Will still try #ubuntu-discuss though, since issue is both about linux in general and ubuntu in specific
[19:18] <ccat> oops!
[19:18] <ccat> q: this is to refute vendor claims that a stable linux install is too hard to achieve...
[19:20] <ccat> -- need documented reliability on general success rate for stable ubuntu installs
[19:22] <ccat> -- maybe like: picking N pc-models of various kinds (desk, lap, etc) at random from various mfg, where is documentation showing %-probability ubuntu will run stable with pc-hw ~90% supported?
[19:22] <oerheks> oh no, not that FUD again..
[19:22] <oerheks> answer: 0 > nosuch manual exist
[19:23] <ccat> oerheks: now.. i AM in right chan...
[19:23] <ccat> oerheks: what do you mean "manual" ?
[19:24] <oerheks>  "where is documentation showing %-probability ubuntu will run stable" ... show us 1 example please?
[19:24] <oerheks> "vendor claims" ... change vendor :-D
[19:25] <daftykins> ccat: when you say refute vendor claims, why are you taking on this query and for what benefit?
[19:25] <oerheks> if you *dont* believe it, see https://certification.ubuntu.com/  lots of hardware that works fine
[19:27] <ccat> daftykins: have repeatedly tried to order certain spec and been denied despite "numerous" vendor claims of offering customized systems
[19:27] <daftykins> ccat: such as what, from who?
[19:28] <daftykins> surely in most cases you just order a Windows based machine and then you wipe it with what you want
[19:28] <ccat> oerheks: y, saw that, but that is to help spec a given system, not why such system was not included in that list
[19:29] <daftykins> are you saying you want to see a lit of components that don't work well? o0
[19:29] <oerheks> are you drunk or something? this makes no sense..
[19:29] <daftykins> yeah i'm having issues with this use of English too
[19:29] <ccat> daftykins: large vendor, so such claims should especially matter legally
[19:30] <daftykins> ccat: you're not answering my questions. who? what did you ask for? what was refused? no answer, no more replies
[19:30] <ccat> daftykins: sorry, hard to keep up :)  -- still reading above
[19:31] <daftykins> oh dear you're on webchat, explains all
[19:32] <ccat> daftykins: well it IS a bit hard to follow with no per-nick hilited lines --- but keep forgetting about kiwi (iirc)
[19:32] <ccat> daftykins: plus eyes are blurry
[19:32] <daftykins> yeah still no responses, goodbye
[19:33] <ccat> daftykins: please be patient -- said i was reading
[19:34] <ccat> daftykins: best not disclose mfg right now -- but just want certain spec (i.e custom) linux laptop
[19:35] <ccat> daftykins: basically (large vendor) 17in touchscreen linux laptop and 24.7 sw/hw support
[19:35] <ccat> oerheks: what have i said that makes no sense?
[19:36] <ccat> daftykins: oh, wiping os means no tech-support
[19:37] <daftykins> there aren't even many manufacturers who sell Linux machines to worry about the support angle, but really it's puzzling what the purpose is you have in coming here with this query
[19:42] <ccat> daftykins: because if mfg claims it was just too hard to get ubuntu to work on certain laptops (or desktops) then i can give the doc that shows that was not likely the reason
[19:43] <ccat> -- and what better place to get ubuntu-install success-rate info but #ubuntu
[19:44] <daftykins> sounds a lot like you want someone to go to a lot of work so you can buy some specific machine and not just accept the models offered
[19:45] <daftykins> it's pretty common knowledge it's a pain to get builds where everything works 100% out of the box
[19:47] <ccat> daftykins: #1. not supposed to be a lot (ok a LOT then) of work for ubuntu install is it? - especially for professional installers, #2 when you claim custom systems, it should mean something
[19:48] <ccat> daftykins: oh, #3 -  would accept touchscreen NOT working with ubuntu, so long as it did work (eg, with windows)
[19:53] <ccat> daftykins: sorry, seemed like such a simple issue to ask about
[19:54] <daftykins> there is no issue i see
[19:54] <ccat> daftykins: they are big, they claim to customize, they will not == issue
[19:55] <daftykins> and still you haven't named a single brand.
[19:55] <immu> ducasse, what else?
[19:55] <ccat> daftykins: that would not be prudent atm i think
[19:56] <daftykins> then you have no point to make
[19:56] <daftykins> bye
[19:56] <ccat> daftykins: unless you have the same issue -- but it seems by your responses you would not
[19:57] <immu> does anyone has NAS setup with ubuntu
[19:57] <ccat> daftykins: y, and i made it already
[20:04] <daftykins> yeah i run a file server for a client with ubuntu server
[20:05] <immu> can we run plex on it to store and stream media around the home
[20:06] <daftykins> yep but plex is only necessary when you have a player device that requires transcoding, otherwise just NFS/samba shares and Kodi is fine
[20:21] <immu> i run plex on my latop and stream it from xbox plex app
[20:22] <daftykins> ah yeah, so you have to stick to Plex to make use of the xbox, mmm
[20:22] <daftykins> come to think of it there's talk that Kodi is coming to the xbox one eventually
[20:22] <immu> xbox360
[20:22] <immu> heard a lot about kodi
[20:24] <daftykins> ah my 360 is retired now
[20:24] <immu> i use to flung my video to google chrome cast
[20:24] <immu> but my kids killed my google chrome
[20:24] <immu> my bending the hdmi connector
[20:24] <immu> errrr
[20:24] <daftykins> ah yeah, i'm thinking a chromecast is the best choice for a client i'm going to tomorrow
[20:24] <daftykins> ah nasty, kids ruin all :P
[20:24] <immu> get the latest one preferably the 4k version
[20:25] <daftykins> i'll see if it fits for them first, they said they didn't want to use laptops they already own as they're too slow, but i might be able to do something about that :D i'm popping over to fit an SSD in their desktop PC
[20:27] <immu> will that work SSD?
[20:29] <daftykins> it'll work in their desktop sure :D
[20:29] <daftykins> i wouldn't use a PC without an SSD now
[20:31] <immu> don't SSD burn out quick?
[20:31] <Bashing-om> daftykins: Too slow, my go-to recommendation for my people is /X/U buntu . ( better more ram !)
[20:31] <immu> hey Bashing-om
[20:32] <Bashing-om> immu: SSD Technology has gotten to the point that the SSDD will pitlove a traditional spinning drive .
[20:32] <Bashing-om> outlive*
[20:33] <immu> okie
[20:34] <daftykins> immu: nah i've still got my first one going fine
[20:34] <immu> samsung has released a good speedy one and cheaper also
[20:34] <daftykins> that said, i avoid ones using TLC NAND memory which is inferior, life span wise
[20:41] <immu> okie
[20:54] <immu> do snaps work in 17.10 daily builds
[21:06] <immu> good nite all
[21:54] <Bashing-om> Gonna go have the lawn mower beat up on me . Back soonest .
[23:56] <Bashing-om> OK. mower done enough damage for one session .


[08:57] <apw> moin
[09:24] <ppisati> :(
[09:25] <ppisati> the dnsmasq instance in my router, this morning stopped working
[09:25] <ppisati> for some still unknown reason
[09:25] <ppisati> maybe it's on strike...
[10:08] <apw> ppisati, i had total admin interface "what interface" behaviour from mine over night
[10:09] <apw> ppisati, it got a poke in the eye this morning for its trouble
[10:09] <ogra_> geez, you are so mean to your machines
[10:09] <ppisati> apw: well, in my case it was my cock up
[10:10] <ppisati> apw: i modified the config file but forgot to reload
[10:10] <ppisati> apw: so when i restarted it for the first time it sucked in the modification
[10:10] <ppisati> apw: and that screwed it up
[10:10] <ppisati> :P
[10:11] <apw> hehe ... oops
[10:11] <ppisati> apw: btw, do you have a script/way/$something to detect that there is a new kernel available for a specific release?
[10:12] <ppisati> apw: i would like something that i can use in a script
[10:13] <smb> ppisati, beside of dist-upgrade on the system I assume. :-P
[10:13] <ppisati> smb: yeah
[10:13] <ppisati> smb: i'm running precise on this board, but i can shave a *LOT* of stuff from the config
[10:14] <ppisati> smb: so i would like some sort of tool that detects that a new kernel is available, git fetch it, applies my config diff and kicks a build
[10:15] <smb> ppisati, I guess you could either directly check the latest commit of a master branch in git or rmadison output
[10:15] <apw> ppisati, recipe build in a PPA ?
[10:15] <ppisati> apw: yeah
[10:15] <ppisati> smb: rmadison? uhm
[10:15] <apw> rmadison -a source linux
[10:15] <smb> Though I think the mainline builds mostly would do what you need
[10:16] <smb> ppisati, or the line from apw, probably excluding the proposed lines
[10:17] <apw> rmadison -a source linux | grep precise-updates | awk '{print $3}'
[10:18] <infinity> -s precise-updates... Querying all dists and grepping is abusive to the remote end. :P
[10:18] <infinity> (Plus, 'rmadison -s precise-updates -a source linux' should generally return much more quickly)
[10:19] <apw> heh, indeed, i guess i should read the manual page more often
[10:19] <ppisati> nice, that's what i was looking for
[10:19] <smb> infinity, True. It became a bit better after moving lots of other things from that machine
[10:20] <infinity> smb: Other way around, rmadison itself moved to snakefruit with the other archive stuff.
[10:20] <infinity> (But yes, splitting lillypilly's load almost exactly in half was a pleasant side-effect of us moving off)
[10:21] <smb> infinity, Ah... ok, something moved and I did not care for the details except that it stopped taking ages
[10:21] <infinity> smb: All of ~ubuntu-archive moved.  Anything you see at people.c.c/~ubuntu-archive is actually a transparent proxy to our new machine.
[10:22] <infinity> And that includes rmadison, but that was just a nice side-effect of the deal.  The real motivation was to get permission-sensitive stuff like proposed-migration off a massively shared machine.
[10:24] <smb> Quite sensible. And at least it felt like some of that got more or more complicated because the responsiveness of lillipilly really went down a lot at some point
[10:24] <infinity> Yeah, lillypilly wasn't in a happy place.
[10:25] <infinity> I used to spend a lot of time running around neutering ~desktop and ~kernel processes on lillypilly so the archive scripts wouldn't be starved for I/O and cycles.
[10:25] <infinity> Now I don't care, and you guys can battle it out. :P
[10:26] <infinity> (But it seems much better in general with archive off there anyway)
[10:26] <smb> Heh, yeah I guess shanky is running from there, too
[10:26] <infinity> Is it?  I thought shankbot ran from one of bjf's home machines.
[10:27] <smb> Hm, maybe I am wrong
[10:27] <infinity> I actually kinda hope it does, since it has his LP creds.
[10:27] <infinity> Which really shouldn't be sitting on a shared account on lillypilly. :P
[10:27] <smb> But kinda would add a lot to the "bus problem" if it does...
[10:28] <infinity> It probably *should* be run with a role account from a tightly-controlled kernel team machine somewhere.
[10:28] <infinity> Or something cloudy.
[10:28] <apw> infinity, yep, we even have a role account, the problem is getting that account the creds it needed, like nominate rights
[10:29] <infinity> Actually, a role account would reduce the scariness a lot, since it wouldn't need to have much in the way of permissions.
[10:29] <infinity> Where as bjf's account is actually a bit scary to share.
[10:29] <smb> Yeah, that would be best... hm... not sure I would trust cloudy stuff with that
[10:29] <infinity> apw: I can give it series nomination privs.
[10:29] <apw> infinity, but we do have one, and it should be sorted out
[10:29] <infinity> smb: When I say "cloudy", I mean "prodstack", which should be quite trustable.
[10:29] <apw> we have the kernel robot or something which was intended for that
[10:30] <infinity> apw: Point me at said robot, and I'll give it the same nomination privs I gave bjf.
[10:30] <smb> infinity, ok less cloudy in the whereabouts
[10:30] <apw> infinity, whne i can remember its name :)
[10:32] <infinity> apw: ~kernel-ppa perhaps, or something else?
[10:32] <infinity> Probably a bad choice, if that's what you were planning on anyway.
[10:33] <infinity> A "Kernel Team Bug Robot" that *only* has permissions to mangle bugs would be ideal for privsep.
[10:33]  * smb thought that was one older approach and as scary in getting shared
[10:33] <smb> (the kernel-ppa one)
[10:35] <apw> infinity, something else ubuntu-kernel-bot i am pretty sure
[10:35] <smb> infinity, Something named like that would also have the advantage of stopping people to reason with the robot in bug reports
[10:35] <apw> i should check that belongs to us still
[10:36] <infinity><EMAIL_ADDRESS>...
[10:37] <infinity> The email address doesn't inspire confidence. :P
[10:37] <infinity> But then again, the archive robot isn't any better.
[10:59] <apw> infinity, heheh that i believe we own, it was one of those things you cannot have two accounts with the same addy, so you have to make a new address, then add the mailing list as a second one, and make it a preferred one
[10:59] <apw> infinity, but before you give it any privs let me find the password and confirm
[11:00] <infinity> apw: I hope by "mailing list" you mean "private alias expansion" or something.
[11:01] <infinity> apw: Cause having an LP account with a public mailing list as the owner is obviously very bad. :)
[11:02] <apw> infinity, heh who knows any more, ... but i think the one we made was kernel-janitor ... confirming now
[11:03] <apw> well i would be if compiz handn't just crashed when it opened the dash, something i didn't want it to do i would add
[11:03] <apw> 200% cpu it is managing to use, ARRRG
[11:03] <infinity> https://launchpad.net/~kernel-janitor is<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[11:04] <infinity> So, looks like you have two bots.  Maybe cause someone forgot and made a second. :P
[11:05]  * infinity breaks down and orders a Nexus 5.
[11:05] <apw> heh yeah likely so ... that is leann's way but i have the password for the second according to my records, and if i could run firefox i could confirm
[11:05] <apw> infinity, a 5?  for what
[11:05] <infinity> apw: To replace my ancient phone.
[11:05] <infinity> I played with my friend's 5 last night and it's... Really nice.
[11:06] <apw> oh dear .... trusty X sucks ass
[11:06] <apw> i have nice shiney display corruption
[11:11] <davmor2> apw: I don't believe you, it can't be a shiny display if it's corrupted it can only be a broken display :P
[11:18] <apw> davmor2, heh ... it is a good job i only speak in sarcasm
[11:20] <davmor2> apw: damn did I forget the sarcasm tabs again "My bag"
[11:20] <ogra_> use your babelfish ;)
[11:29] <apw> bablefish don't speak sarcasm either :)
[11:37] <davmor2> apw: you must still be using bablefish 1.0 (US version)  You need to update to bablefish 2.0 (UK version) It assumes sarcasm at all times and is terribly shocked when there is none
[11:56]  * ppisati -> out for lunch
[11:58] <apw> davmor2, heh point indeed
[12:25] <apw> RAOF, yo, who do i whine at if on saucy i am getting character corruptions
[12:25] <apw> RAOF, on intel kit
[12:30] <infinity> apw: I'd try mlankhorst or tjaalton.
[12:31] <infinity> The former never idles in this channel, which is irritating.
[12:34] <tjaalton> apw: there are some bugs about it (still), like lp#1222871
[12:50] <apw> bug #1222871
[12:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1222871 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "[gm45] Corrupted painting of window surfaces (L-shape tiling corruption?)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1222871
[12:51] <apw> ubot2, can't you learn lp# format please
[12:51] <ubot2> apw: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
[12:51] <apw> no s*it
[12:51] <apw> tjaalton, that souds remarkably like mine
[13:00] <tjaalton> you can also just open bug strings formatted like that on terminator ;)
[13:00] <tjaalton> hmm I thought g-t supported those too, but no
[13:01] <apw> i think its lp:1222871
[13:05] <apw> they are all inconsistant for sure
[13:31] <apw> tjaalton, is there an upstream bug on ths L thing, that should be linked to the lP bug ?
[13:36] <tjaalton> apw: i'm not sure.. perhaps not but ickle is on lp
[13:36] <apw> tjaalton, yeah i noticed that with supprise
[19:24] <trevorj> Sorry, I don't mean to spam across multiple channels, I just realised #ubuntu-kernel existed.
[19:24] <trevorj> Hi guys, I compile a custom flavor of the Ubuntu kernel for our boxen here based on Ubuntu's kernel git. I've been trying to figure out the proper way to create a source package that I can upload to an apt repo. Anyone have any experience with this?
[19:52] <melodie> hello
[19:53] <melodie> I would like to know wether the 3.8.x-generic series for Precise have PAE enabled or not enabled. Does someone know about that?
[19:55] <melodie> I have seen the 3.11 does, and the 3.2.x don't. But the latest 3.2.0-55 and -56 don't support zram-config (bug #1246664)
[19:55] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1246664 in linux (Ubuntu Precise) ""Buffer I/O error on device zram0, logical block 515067"" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1246664
[20:35] <melodie> Will the kernel series 3.2.0-x for Precise always be PAE free until 2017?
[20:48] <melodie> I got the answer
[20:48] <melodie> which is "yes, that is the idea"
[20:49] <melodie> does someone know when the fix done by henrix as per #1246664 will be integrated in the kernel?
[22:59] <melodie> hi again
[23:00] <melodie> is there someone here who is in charge of the kernel 3.2.0-x for Precise, and who could say when the patch for zram will be integrated?
[23:00] <melodie> #1246664
[23:00] <melodie> bug #1246664
[23:00] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1246664 in linux (Ubuntu Precise) ""Buffer I/O error on device zram0, logical block 515067"" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1246664


[08:20] <ducasse> hi all
[08:30] <daftykins> good morning \o
[08:31] <ducasse> hiya daftykins - how are you today?
[08:31] <ducasse> "where do you want to go today?"
[08:31] <daftykins> Microsoft :O
[08:32] <daftykins> not bad here thanks, i watched 'The BFG' earlier - it was great :D
[08:32] <daftykins> most British folk of my gen grew up reading Roald Dahl novels :>
[08:32] <daftykins> how be thee?
[08:32] <ducasse> saw that at the cinema with my nephew - he loved it :)
[08:33] <ducasse> i grew up reading roald dahl myself. i'm fine, thanks, drinking tea and taking it easy.
[08:33] <daftykins> \o/
[08:33] <daftykins> buttered scones and coffee here :D
[08:35] <ducasse> sounds good :) plans for the day?
[08:36] <daftykins> i've been looking up options for wall mounting that expensive new TV, plus dealing with the old
[08:36] <daftykins> so may pop up there later
[08:37] <ducasse> ah, how big is the new one?
[08:37] <daftykins> 65" using a 300x200 VESA mount - whilst the current one uses some annoying Pioneer own bracket
[08:39] <ducasse> nice. i wish all tv's/monitors could use vesa mounts...
[08:39] <daftykins> even when they do, they keep changing size XD
[08:40] <daftykins> oh i need to return some shoes to amazon too, as they sent me the wrong ones
[08:41] <ducasse> i'm going to look online for a wider desk, kind of want a third screen.
[08:43] <daftykins> :D
[08:44] <ducasse> someime today i'm also going to decide whether or not to buy that receiver, need to check a few other options first.
[08:45] <daftykins> ah exciting times!
[08:46] <daftykins> i wonder if it's worth me popping in a shop or two to look at deals going on
[08:46] <daftykins> not really anything i want right now though :)
[08:46] <ducasse> there's always stuff i _want_, but little i actually _need_...
[08:47] <daftykins> :D
[08:50] <ducasse> seems like there's still deals going on here, just after a brief look online...
[08:51] <daftykins> ah har
[08:51] <daftykins> yeah cyber monday now ;)
[08:55] <ducasse> aha, ic. can't find anything very interesting, though.
[08:57] <daftykins> seems to be a 5 bluray for £30 deal going on
[08:59] <daftykins> not really my scene...
[09:00] <ducasse> me neither. found an ok'ish tv, but the one i have is still functional.
[09:01] <ducasse> besides, i don't need uhd.
[09:01] <daftykins> you have to spend a fair chunk to get a 10-bit panel in one, the budget ones use an 8-bit so HDR is going to suffer
[09:01] <daftykins> i was tempted but yeah, maybe in the new year - or later still
[09:01] <daftykins> CES is January so maybe 2017 models will reinvent the wheel ;)
[09:02] <ducasse> :) did you see the zen naming style?
[09:03] <daftykins> ooh no as in AMD CPUs have been announced?
[09:03] <ducasse> sr3, sr5, sr7. wonder where they got that idea.
[09:03] <daftykins> wowzer
[09:05] <daftykins> hmm January 17th rumour too
[09:06] <ducasse> i really hope zen will be good, but i'm not holding my breath. they can't keep this up forever.
[09:07] <daftykins> indeed
[09:07] <ducasse> how long has it been since they made something decent? 7-8-9 years or so?
[09:08] <daftykins> especially after all the talk about the RX 480 and it ended up being yawn
[09:09] <ducasse> i hear people complaining about the performance of their latest gpu models all the time, but i'm not familiar with them.
[09:09] <daftykins> hmm can't imagine what that's about
[09:09] <daftykins> my nvidia 1070 is lovely :D
[09:10] <ducasse> i can imagine :)
[09:10] <ducasse> how many outputs does it have?
[09:10] <daftykins> now it's winter i don't even think the fans spin under game load
[09:11] <daftykins> 3 x DP, 1 x HDMI and 1 x DVI
[09:11] <ducasse> wow. can it use all at once?
[09:14] <daftykins> 4 at once apparently
[09:14] <ducasse> still good, most are limited to 3.
[09:15] <daftykins> yeah although there's displayport daisy chaining
[09:15] <daftykins> only seems to be on premium displays though
[09:18] <ducasse> i've noticed, you need to spend a little to get that.
[09:18] <daftykins> my ol' 1920x1200 displays will keep going for ages probably :) even have DP input
[09:20] <daftykins> haven't even used the office in a bit since i brought the PC downstairs to try out on the TV
[09:20] <daftykins> oof 20 past already, i best go do something :D
[09:20] <ducasse> ok, have a nice day!
[09:20] <ducasse> ttyl
[09:21] <daftykins> and you :) \o
[09:21] <daftykins> p.s. http://go.linuxfoundation.org/cyber-monday-2016 hmm
[09:22] <ducasse> hmm...
[11:54] <OerHeks> not bad pricing ..
[11:56] <ducasse> not at all... AND you get a t-shirt! :D
[11:56] <OerHeks> ... yay
[13:27] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[13:28] <ducasse> hi, how are you BluesKaj?
[13:35] <BluesKaj> hi ducasse, ok here, and you?
[13:36] <ducasse> good thanks, playing with arch in a chroot. the installation is *ridiculously* labor-intensive...
[13:44] <BluesKaj> yup, installed arch as few yrs ago, but I was disappointed in the OS , it was pretty ordinary for all the work needed to install, anticlimactic comes to mind
[13:54] <ducasse> hehe :) i'm just trying it out in search of something for my desktop, and it's a more attractive proposition than gentoo for example.
[13:55] <ducasse> in the end i'll probably stick to ubuntu, but it's interesting to look at how other distros do things from time to time.
[14:06] <BluesKaj> I'm thinking about sparky linux for fun, seems like an interesting OS with the Deepin desktop
[14:08] <BluesKaj> I'm not a gnome/unity or even mate fan and I'm tired of the restrictions plasma5 has put on KDE...I'd like to explore something new
[14:09] <BluesKaj> I'll stick with yakkety as my main OS of course
[14:12] <ducasse> i really wish there were as meny things available through ppas as through the aur, there's a lot of stuff i need to build myself now. that's mainly the reason i'm looking at arch for the desktop.
[20:23] <ducasse> Bashing-om: hiya Bashing-om - good morning to you :)
[20:24] <Bashing-om> ducasse: And A fine day it is .. Hope your's goes as well .
[20:26] <ducasse> Bashing-om: yup, been playing with arch today, setting it up on my desktop as a test. need to play with new toys now and then :)
[20:29] <Bashing-om> ducasse: welp, will get a new perspective on things, huh .. Change can be good . Nawwww .. I am old and set in my ways . I *like* it steady; LOL
[20:31] <ducasse> Bashing-om: for 99.999% of things i use computers for, i want something that's quick to get going and just works™ - ubuntu is great for that. for this machine, though, i need a lot of personal customization etc, so it's worth a look. worst case, i drop it but have learned something new.
[20:34] <Bashing-om> Well. You know my takes on fast and easy . I am fortunate in my needs that thus far the software repo meets all .
[20:37] <ducasse> me too, so i might end up just compiling the rest in a container on ubuntu or somthing, right now i'm really just evaluating options. as i said, at least i will learn something :)
[20:37] <ducasse> btw; bought the humble bundle unix books bundle today, lots of goodies there.
[20:40] <NoImNotNineVolt> i was merely saying that "supported flavors are those flavors which are supported" is circular reasoning.
[20:40] <NoImNotNineVolt> the reason i said this is because the class "Supported flavors" is defined in terms of itself.
[20:42] <tgm4883> NoImNotNineVolt: Yea I suppose that would be circular, but where does it say that?
[20:42] <tgm4883> !ubuntu
[20:42] <ubot5`> Ubuntu is a complete Linux-based operating system, freely available with both community and professional support. It is developed by a large community and we invite you to participate too! - Also see http://www.ubuntu.com
[20:42] <tgm4883> !flavors
[20:42] <ubot5`> Recognized Ubuntu flavors build on Ubuntu and provide a different user experience out of the box. They are supported both in #ubuntu and in their flavor channel. The current list is: !Edubuntu, !Ubuntu-GNOME, !Kubuntu, Ubuntu !Kylin, !Lubuntu, !Mythbuntu, Ubuntu !Studio, !Xubuntu, and Ubuntu !MATE
[20:42] <popey> There's no circular logic there. It just lists what's supported
[20:42] <tgm4883> NoImNotNineVolt: unless someone else said that, I don't see what you quoted anywhere
[20:43] <NoImNotNineVolt> 20:34 < NoImNotNineVolt> so then it's not accurate that only ubuntu is  supported here?
[20:43] <NoImNotNineVolt> 20:34 < nicomachus> NoImNotNineVolt: ubuntu and supported flavors.
[20:43] <popey> I think you're being needlessly nit-picky
[20:43] <tgm4883> wow
[20:43] <tgm4883> popey: +1
[20:43] <NoImNotNineVolt> to rephrase with context, nicomachus was claiming that the supported flavors of ubuntu are "supported flavors".
[20:43] <popey> they probably meant "valid flavours"
[20:44] <popey> this is quite possibly the best waste of time discussion I've had today. Congratulations.
[20:44] <tgm4883> NoImNotNineVolt: also, that's out of context
[20:44] <popey> (not everyone has En-US or En-GB as their first language)
[20:44] <NoImNotNineVolt> perhaps i'm mistaken, then.
[20:44] <NoImNotNineVolt> indeed, english isn't my first language either.
[20:45] <tgm4883> Since the previous thing that nicomachus said was the query for ubottu to state the suported flavors
[20:45] <popey> technicall you could use "supported flavours" in two ways
[20:45] <popey> 1) supported in #ubuntu (the context the bot used)
[20:45] <popey> 2) supported by canonical (in that they are official flavours)
[20:46] <NoImNotNineVolt> i wasn't aware of any distinction there.
[20:46] <NoImNotNineVolt> is there one?
[20:46] <popey> so saying "ubuntu and supported flavours (definition 2) are supported (definition 1) in #ubuntu" :)
[20:46] <popey> sure
[20:46] <popey> mint is not a supported flavour
[20:46] <popey> nor elementary
[20:46] <NoImNotNineVolt> by the channel or by canonical?
[20:46] <popey> but Ubuntu MATE and Kubuntu are, because they're built using software from the Ubuntu archive only.
[20:47] <popey> by both
[20:47] <popey> one begats the other
[20:47] <NoImNotNineVolt> ...
[20:47] <NoImNotNineVolt> let me rephrase my question.
[20:47] <tgm4883> to rephrase what nicomachus said, "The supported flavors are ubuntu, kubuntu, edubuntu <lists all>" NoImNotNineVolt: 'So then not only Ubuntu is supported here'  nicomachus "Ubuntu and supported flavors are supported here".    It seems obvious that the previous list of supported flavors doesn't need repeating a second time in < 5 minutes
[20:47] <popey> mine is not supported by canonical, and thus is not supported by #ubuntu
[20:47] <popey> *mint
[20:47] <NoImNotNineVolt> i wasn't aware of any distinction between the two classes you noted. are their elements that belong to one set and not the other?
[20:47] <Bashing-om> ducasse: Now If I were real die-hard and really wanted it fast(er) .. there is LFS . Nothing can replace a made-from-scratch, compile-your-own kernel .
[20:47] <NoImNotNineVolt> (note: things which belong to neither set do not satisfy the requirements stated)
[20:47] <popey> no
[20:47] <popey> however
[20:48] <NoImNotNineVolt> so there is no practical distinction?
[20:48] <popey> there are flavours which aren't _well_ supported
[20:48] <popey> (in #ubuntu)
[20:48] <NoImNotNineVolt> fair enough.
[20:48] <popey> so we throw users at flavour specific channels
[20:48] <popey> e.g. kubuntu, ubuntu server
[20:48] <NoImNotNineVolt> also, while i'm here, i'd say that "derivative distribution" is a generally more precise than "flavor"
[20:48] <popey> No
[20:48] <popey> Incorrect
[20:48] <tgm4883> popey: well if that's the definition, there is a 3rd level of 'supported'
[20:48] <popey> Flavour is a very specific term
[20:48] <popey> Derivative distro is another specific term
[20:48] <NoImNotNineVolt> indeed, maybe that's where i'm getting confused.
[20:48] <popey> they have different meanings
[20:49] <tgm4883> 3) supported by canonical, via a support contract (ubuntu advantage)
[20:49] <\9> derivative distro is something that's based on ubuntu
[20:49] <\9> not necessarily supported
[20:49] <popey> exactly, like mint or elementary
[20:49] <NoImNotNineVolt> are flavors necessarily supported?
[20:49] <popey> flavour = built from the archive
[20:49] <popey> derivative = might not be
[20:49] <popey> !flavor
[20:49] <ubot5`> Recognized Ubuntu flavors build on Ubuntu and provide a different user experience out of the box. They are supported both in #ubuntu and in their flavor channel. The current list is: !Edubuntu, !Ubuntu-GNOME, !Kubuntu, Ubuntu !Kylin, !Lubuntu, !Mythbuntu, Ubuntu !Studio, !Xubuntu, and Ubuntu !MATE
[20:49] <tgm4883> flavors are supported in #ubuntu
[20:49] <tgm4883> and their own channels too
[20:50] <NoImNotNineVolt> so an 'unsupported flavor' is inherently contradictory?
[20:50] <popey> yes
[20:50] <popey> there is no such thing
[20:50] <\9> well you could build your own flavor.. that's not going to be supported
[20:50] <popey> no
[20:50] <\9> and wasn't mythbuntu dropped?
[20:50] <popey> you could build a remix
[20:50] <tgm4883> \9: no you can't
[20:50] <popey> or a derivative
[20:50] <popey> but it wouldn't be a flavour until blessed by the tech board
[20:50] <\9> ah right
[20:50] <\9> so it'll be a derivative even though it only uses the ubuntu core
[20:50] <tgm4883> flavor means it was blessed by tech board and built on canonical hardware
[20:51] <popey> yes
[20:51] <NoImNotNineVolt> coming from a non-ubuntu background, i must admit that i wasn't aware of this usage of 'flavor'.
[20:51] <tgm4883> mythbuntu still exists until 2019 or 2021
[20:51] <tgm4883> I'd have to verify
[20:51] <tgm4883> AFAIK
[20:51] <NoImNotNineVolt> previously, i had only heard it used in a sense to distinguish different families of distributions.
[20:52] <\9> mythbuntu appears to not have seen a 16.10 release
[20:52] <\9> 16.04 seems to be last
[20:52] <NoImNotNineVolt> the perils of noun overloading :P
[20:52] <popey> \9: tgm4883 works on it :)
[20:52] <tgm4883> \9: mythbuntu hasn't done non-LTS releases since 14.04
[20:52] <tgm4883> or possibly 12.04
[20:52] <tgm4883> I'd have to look back
[20:52] <NoImNotNineVolt> regardless, thanks for the clarification, and apologies for the pedantry.
[20:52] <popey> hehe
[20:52] <popey> np
[20:52] <popey> fun times
[20:52] <NoImNotNineVolt> in my experience, the devil is in the details :P
[20:52] <popey> sorry for being grouchy
[20:53] <\9> ah right
[20:53] <tgm4883> popey: blame the mate guys for being grouchy, that's what I do ;)
[20:53] <\9> it indeed hasn't
[20:56] <ducasse> tgm4883: did you get any better performance out of the amd driver thingy?
[20:56] <tgm4883> ducasse!
[20:56] <ducasse> \o
[20:57] <tgm4883> ducasse: not really, but kinda. I'm getting worse performance in Dying Light, but I'm getting decent performance when I run through benchmarks
[20:57] <tgm4883> I've reverted back to mesa 12 and tried AMDGPU and AMDGPU-PRO
[20:58] <tgm4883> and by worse performance, I've turned all the graphics settings all the way down and I'm getting about 25FPS
[20:59] <ducasse> odd. did you try the amd forums?
[21:01] <tgm4883> Not yet, I finished setting up GPU passthrough on my old card and was looking for someone else with DL to test
[21:02] <ducasse> right. i don't really do gaming anymore, i'm afraid. personally i think amd retired fglrx a bit too early...
[21:04] <ducasse> a lot of the people with amd cards who come into #ubuntu report they had decent performance with fglrx, now they get bad performance or only radeon works at all...
[21:07] <tgm4883> Yea, unfortunately, I don't think this card was ever supported on fglrx
[21:09] <ducasse> no, but it might have been easier to add that support and get good performance than start from scratch with amdgpu. but they might not have had resources to do both, i guess.
[21:12] <tgm4883> ducasse: yea I see what you're saying, there should have been a transition period
[21:14] <ducasse> i think that would have been better for users, but linux users are probably such a small part of their customer base there are strict limits on resources for driver development.
[21:31] <ducasse> Bashing-om: i was actually considering gentoo and compiling everything, but thought that would be too time-consuming. this machine is a 4ghz i7 with 32gb ram and all ssd's, but still...
[21:32] <dax> "it might have been easier to add that support and get good performance than start from scratch with amdgpu" => fglrx was an absolute mess from both a user and developer side, it would not have been easier
[21:33] <dax> "linux users are probably such a small part of their customer base there are strict limits on resources for driver development" => i track git HEAD on the repository they're doing amdgpu development in. they're doing quite a lot of excellent work on it
[21:34] <Bashing-om> ducasse: One thing for sure, with specs like that,  conserving resources is not a high priority ( trash-80 !) - lots of elbow room .
[21:34] <dax> I have an AMD RX480. With DAL enabled, I get equivalent performance to Windows.
[21:34] <dax> and that's on amdgpu, not amdgpu-pro
[21:34] <dax> the main blocker right now is getting DAL into mainline Linux, which is proving to be rather Fun
[21:34] <ducasse> dal?
[21:35] <dax> Display Abstraction Layer. It's used for HDMI audio on Polaris, HDMI 2.0 in general, and future GPU compat in general.
[21:36] <ducasse> ic, thanks.
[21:37] <dax> but yeah, #radeon on freenode, amd-gfx@ on the FDO listserver, and https://cgit.freedesktop.org/~agd5f/linux/ for actual code
[21:37] <tgm4883> dax: 16.10?
[21:37] <dax> tgm4883: no, gentoo for this. significantly easier to get mesa and friends to the latest version
[21:38] <dax> probably doable on ubuntu though, i didn't look too hard
[21:38] <tgm4883> ah
[21:38] <tgm4883> dax: there's a PPA someone has with mesa 13, but it didn't provide much better results for me
[21:38] <tgm4883> so I'm probably missing something
[21:39] <dax> probably kernel from that git link above, if you have the rest of the stack up to date
[21:39] <dax> as far as I can tell all the DAL work is on amd-staging-4.7 right now, which is a bit unfortunately not-new, but i need HDMI audio so
[21:40] <tgm4883> dax: ah probably, i was just running the 4.8 kernel in 16.10
[21:41] <dax> yeah, none of DAL is in mainline yet
[21:42] <dax> which annoys me to no end, but it's a whole heap of code so i'm not really surprised
[21:46] <ducasse> Bashing-om: no, not really. i might still try gentoo on this machine, it has a spare ssd for things like that.
[21:47] <ducasse> Bashing-om: i better get some sleep, you keep up the good work!
[21:51] <Bashing-om> ducasse: K; Thanks, sleep well . instead of 'sugar-plums' dancing through the head .,. well it be OSs :)
[21:51] <ducasse> Bashing-om: i'll be counting distros to get to sleep :)
[21:52] <Bashing-om> har !


[00:13] <fibz_> http://pastebin.com/YwNUrt4f   http://pastebin.com/TaPEpuPy
[00:44] <fibz_> looks like im going to need to make a custom xorg.conf but i dont know how
[01:22] <fibz_> tried running Xorg -configure in as root without X and get "Xorg crashed with SIGABRT in DoConfigure()"
[03:33] <sgo11> is that possible to fix bug #1296020 before 14.04 trusty release? thanks. it's critical to me because I can not use gdm and gnome-shell because of this.
[05:48] <alex_> hi
[05:53] <fibz_> hi
[06:44] <fibz_> oh my god
[06:45] <fibz_> it just started working correctly in-explicatively
[06:51] <fibz_> disregard
[06:52] <fibz_> everything is all good. thanks ppl! ^_^
[07:13] <alkisg> kvm is crashing for at least a month in trusty for me, does it also crash for someone else?
[07:14] <sandGorgon> alkisg, did you try virtualbox ? wanted to see if both crash which means some kernel level stuff is borked
[07:16] <alkisg> sandGorgon: virtualbox works fine
[07:49] <alkisg> It works with accel=tcg... but it's unusably slow...
[08:22] <prainworker_> good morning!
[08:22] <prainworker_> can someone help me for a sec
[08:22] <prainworker_> i was send from the ubuntu channel to this one because i have problem to get my nvidia driver aktive in 14.04
[08:22] <lordievader> prainworker_: Ask your question, perhaps someone can help.
[08:22] <elfy> !ask
[08:23] <prainworker_> if i am under software sources and the driver tap
[08:24] <prainworker_> click on the driver for my card 331.38 it sourdly try to download something and than jumps back to the open source driver
[08:24] <prainworker_> fresh out of the box install
[08:24] <prainworker_> only thing done in ubuntu channel was
[08:24] <prainworker_> apt-get install updates
[08:25] <prainworker_> and apt-get install upgrates
[08:25] <Wnt> those commands make no sense
[08:26] <lordievader> I think he means: apt-get update&&apt-get upgrade.
[08:26] <elfy> apt-get update and upgrade makes no sense?
[08:26] <elfy> lordievader: I'm going to wait till you post before I type anything :p
[08:26] <sgo11> prainworker_, hi, I am using nvidia-driver here. what is your problem?
[08:26] <lordievader> elfy: Hihi ;)
[08:26] <prainworker_> ok what i have to to
[08:27] <prainworker_> sgo11 hey good morning
[08:27] <prainworker_> i fresh installed 14.04 to get some support for new wacom
[08:27] <prainworker_> when i try to install the latest driver from nv
[08:27] <prainworker_> over the software sources it allways jumps back to open source
[08:28] <Wnt> how can one install the nvidia binary driver via the command line? maybe that's something you might want to try?
[08:28] <Wnt> at least then you should get an error message
[08:28] <sgo11> prainworker_, for me, I never use GUI to install nvidia driver. you can try it in command line.
[08:28] <Wnt> if the GUI does'nt handle errors that well
[08:28] <prainworker_> sgo11 can you guid me on that
[08:29] <sgo11> prainworker_, first, "sudo apt-get purge <your nvidia packages>". and then "sudo apt-get install nvidia-331"
[08:30] <prainworker_> where to i find the info for your pkg full name i mean
[08:30] <sgo11> prainworker_, I don't know what nvidia packages you installed. check it with "dpkg -l | grep nvidia"
[08:31] <sgo11> prainworker_, remove or purge them. and then use "sudo apt-get install nvidia-331"
[08:31] <prainworker_> sgo11
[08:31] <prainworker_> no output only >
[08:32] <sgo11> prainworker_, no output of "dpkg -l | grep nvidia" ?
[08:32] <prainworker_> yes
[08:32] <sgo11> prainworker_, if there is no output, that means you haven't installed any nvidia packages.
[08:33] <sgo11> prainworker_, just run "sudo apt-get install nvidia-331"
[08:33] <sgo11> prainworker_, after it completes, reboots your system. hopefully, it will work. :)
[08:33] <prainworker_> ok wait here is something fish i dont get output at all
[08:34] <prainworker_> will kill xserver be back in a mom
[08:39] <elfy> sgo11: wouldn't it be an idea to find out what card they have, -331 might not be the right package for them
[08:40] <sgo11> elfy, oh. you might be right. I always installed the latest driver. :)
[08:41] <elfy> :)
[08:49] <gnumdk> Hello
[08:50] <gnumdk> Instant messaging is broken since Ubuntu 13.10 (13.04?): https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-messages/+bug/1261060
[08:50] <gnumdk> will this be fixed in LTS 14.04?
[09:00] <prainworker> sgo11 hey thx a lot for help ! nvidia settings start fine from comand line
[09:00] <prainworker> will go and install blender and krita and finally get to work
[09:01] <prainworker> my new wacom
[09:01] <sgo11> prainworker, cool. enjoy your nvidia driver. :)
[09:01] <prainworker> sgo11 to you know if there is a way to controll nvidia fan speed somehow
[09:02] <sgo11> prainworker, sorry. I don't know. never try that.
[09:03] <prainworker> sgo11 how about multilib support in 14.04  64  bit
[09:03] <prainworker> will it work allready
[09:03] <prainworker> because yesterday when i try to install steam i came up with unsolved depentency errors ! and as far i know steam is only 32 bit jet
[09:04] <prainworker> right know i have lol and steam running on slackware! but there is no support jet for my wacom
[09:07] <sgo11> I never play games in ubuntu. I don't know. unsolved dependencies might because of your bad repos again.
[09:08] <prainworker> have a nice on sgo11
[10:55] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[11:04] <SuperLag> Anyone else have issues with your system making you login twice? When I log in, after the system has been on screensaver and then sent to the login, screen... it will log in, then I use the system for a few seconds, then it kicks me back to the login screen again.
[11:04] <SuperLag> and after I log in the second time, everything works as expected
[11:07] <SuperLag> I'm not sure what description I'd use to describe that, for searching for an existing bug.
[11:07] <Wnt> SuperLag: which desktop environment and loging manager are you using?
[11:13] <SuperLag> Plain old vanilla Ubuntu... so Unity and LightDM.
[11:17] <SuperLag> another question... why won't Ubuntu let me set Chrome as the default browser? It has no issue with Firefox Nightly being the default, but Chrome won't stick
[11:42] <maxb> SuperLag: Your "login twice" issue - do you have two monitors?
[12:32] <SuperLag> maxb: nope
[12:32] <maxb> SuperLag: Oh. I have the problem you describe on *one* of three machines running Trusty. I was wondering if the dual monitors could somehow be realted
[12:33] <maxb> *related
[12:33] <SuperLag> maxb: actually... not on the affected system. I have a nearly identical install at work, with two monitors, and it doesn't exhibit this issue.
[12:33] <SuperLag> maxb: the affected machine is a laptop. Lenovo ThinkPad W530.
[12:35] <BluesKaj> SuperLag, what's the cpu and gpu in the W530? Just curious because I'm using a G500
[12:36] <SuperLag> model name      : Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3740QM CPU @ 2.70GHz
[12:37] <SuperLag> and GPU is an Nvidia Quadro K1000M w/2GB
[12:38] <SuperLag> BluesKaj: and with enough bad experiences, I've learned just to stick with the nouveau driver. Trying to get the closed binary *working* and *well*... it's like a house of cards
[12:39] <SuperLag> i.e. you might be able to get it up, and working, but the slightest wind can knock it over again.
[12:39] <SuperLag> Hopefully with Nvidia extending the "olive branch" and providing more code, nouveau will only get better.
[12:40] <BluesKaj> SuperLag, nice machine :)
[12:40] <SuperLag> BluesKaj: this laptop seriously kicks ass. Too bad the W540 came out shortly thereafter. :)
[12:41] <SuperLag> BluesKaj: 32GB of RAM and 3x SSDs, too. It's really nice to not have to worry about RAM.
[12:41]  * SuperLag will shut up now. :)
[12:43] <SuperLag> I think what I might start doing is rather than separating out /home into its own partition, is doing the ~user/{Desktop,Documents,Downloads,Music,Pictures,Videos} on their own partition and bindmounting them. Is that a crazy idea?
[12:43] <SuperLag> the idea being that an upgrade is still like a fresh install, but all the data is still there
[12:50] <progers> Hello
[12:51] <BluesKaj> SuperLag, dunno, never tried that, a separate /home was all I ever used in the last few yrs and without any problems. I've done clean installs to / while retaining the data in /home without anty effects
[12:51] <progers> Hehe don't know what happend but the printer is working :)
[12:53] <BluesKaj> sometimes loaded modules don't stick until after a reboot
[12:54] <BluesKaj> getting to be like windows :(
[12:58] <mamarley> SuperLag: A K1000M with nouveau?  That's like buying a Mustang and only ever driving it at 20MPH...
[13:00] <mamarley> What version of the blob did you try?  Did you install it using the Ubuntu package?
[13:10] <progers> Who know where i can find some good (apt) documentation? So i can use apt well
[13:11] <BluesKaj> yes SuperLag with that gpu the nvidia-331 driver should work like a charm
[13:11] <k1l_> !apt | progers
[13:12] <progers> ubottu: Thanks
[13:12] <progers> ubottu: -_-
[13:13] <progers> So thats guy is a bot?
[13:13] <Pici> !bot
[13:13] <DJones> progers: Yep
[13:14] <progers> Ok i am just new with those irc channels did not know that there is bots too :)
[13:15] <DJones> progers: Only a couple of bots, ubottu for factoids, a logbot and an anti-paste bot in some channels, other than that, not many bots in the channels
[13:16] <progers> DJones: thanks
[13:28] <BLZbubba> i saw a few posts about Mate going into the default Ubuntu repos, but how do I get it to work?
[13:28] <BLZbubba> I didn't see any packages containing mate-session
[13:29] <BLZbubba> this is on a Tahr install that I'm playing with
[13:46] <SuperLag> maxb: back to your earlier question. I was incorrect. I *am* experiencing that same issue on my work machine.
[13:46] <SuperLag> mamarley: I didn't get that machine for the video power. I got it for the expandibility. I have 32GB of RAM in that laptop, and *3* SSDs.
[13:47] <mamarley> SuperLag: Yeah, but you will also get better battery life with the blob.
[13:47] <SuperLag> mamarley: you think?
[13:47] <mamarley> Have you tried installing nvidia-331?  It should work just fine.
[13:47] <mamarley> I know.
[13:48] <mamarley> Nouveau doesn't support any kind of power scaling yet.
[13:48] <SuperLag> mamarley: not since 13.04.   I still think you should try it again though.
[13:50] <SuperLag> that was another lesson I learned along the way... don't *ever* do it from the plain installer you get from nvidia.com
[13:50] <mamarley> I have a similar system (Thinkpad T530) and it worked out-of-the-box here.
[13:50] <mamarley> That's definitely true.  Ubuntu (and probably Debian too) do some screwy stuff with GL libs, and nvidia's .run installer can't handle that very well.
[13:50] <SuperLag> mamarley: if the Intel driver would work on anything other than the VGA output, I'd just use it.
[13:51] <mamarley> Oh, that's another thing.  Do you have Optimus disabled in the BIOS?
[13:51] <SuperLag> yes
[13:51] <mamarley> OK, that's what I do too.
[13:51] <SuperLag> I don't do the switching.
[13:51] <SuperLag> I tell it to use the Discrete card.
[13:52] <mamarley> I would recommend giving nvidia-331 another shot.  If it breaks X, you can always remove it again and it should go back to Nouveau without any trouble.
[13:53] <SuperLag> mamarley: that wasn't always so cut & dry either.
[13:53] <SuperLag> (going back to nouveau)
[13:53] <mamarley> But you should save the dmesg log and the /var/log/Xorg.0.log for postmortem examination.
[13:53] <mamarley> So maybe somebody can figure out why it doesn't work.
[13:54] <SuperLag> mamarley: one of the issues, I'm sure, was that the then-current Nvidia driver didn't want to play nice with VMware. And as I use that *daily*, I didn't have time/desire/patience to drill down and figure out what was the root cause of the issue.
[13:55]  * mamarley doesn't know anything about vmware, sorry.
[14:10] <SuperLag> one of the reasons I got a beefy laptop with LOTS of RAM.... I'm running a minimum of 4 VMs at any given time. :)
[14:10] <SuperLag> I was looking for one that could do 64GB of RAM... but no dice. Yet.
[14:15] <mamarley> It just seems a shame to neuter such a powerful system by running a driver that won't let you take advantage of the GPU.
[14:20] <sgo11> hi, I am using nvidia driver. I remembered xorg.conf is not required before. the configuration can be detected and setup at runtime somehow. but today, when I remove xorg.conf, it just doesn't work. why? is xorg.conf required in trusty? thanks.
[14:29] <SuperLag> mamarley: no neutering, really... nothing I do even requires anything more powerful than the Intel. It's all Java, and a web browser. So the CPU, RAM and storage for the VMs are more than adequate.
[14:56] <SuperLag> Interesting. Just updated my work machine, and now none of my VMs think there is enough swap.
[15:03] <progers> Is there any difference beetween the kde compositing type with opengl 2.0 or opengl3.1?
[15:05] <BluesKaj> progers, i haven't seen much diff , perhaps 2.0 is somewhat more stable with fewer effects , but I haven't seen much diff
[15:06] <progers> Ok will keep it at 2.0 but my video card is powerfull so i think it can handle the opengl3.1
[15:13] <S466531257BOSS> hi : has anyone an idea how to fix a trusty install from live-system (succesful until 2nd reboot ) that was booted live to test and install by using forcepae on a pentium mobile
[15:14] <S466531257BOSS> even the recovery option from grub hangs with a 20 to 25secs timeout of the cpu
[15:14] <S466531257BOSS> all went well first boot live and flawlessly on 2nd boot into the installed system
[15:14] <S466531257BOSS> forcepae is set in grub
[15:24] <aljosa> anybody experiencing system/gui blocked for couple of seconds and then everything works normally in 14.04/dev? intel hw/mb air
[16:19] <mar_dan> hello
[16:47] <darklight_> I made the horrible mistake of opening the ubuntu one application, now it's worse than spyware I just can't get it to stop running
[16:51] <k1l_> of course its spyware m(
[16:51] <BLZbubba> did you try cat /dev/urandom > /dev/sda  yet?
[16:53] <darklight_> BLZbubba, no I did try dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda bs=8m though
[16:54] <BLZbubba> trading one problem for a different one :P
[16:54] <darklight_> jokes aside it should just stop autostarting when I tell him to not sync automatically, or when I remove my computer as a ubuntu one device
[16:56] <darklight_> apparently it looks for the ubuntu-one folder in $HOME, once that's gone it stops autostarting
[17:00] <BLZbubba> how do you define "it"
[17:00] <BLZbubba> you mean the unity wm always wants to run it?
[17:03] <darklight_> BLZbubba, I mean the daemon stops being autostarted, I don't know what starts it since it's not a upstart daemon I guess it's unity yes
[17:13] <darklight_> couple of unrelated issues: hotcorners randomly stop working, launcher autohide randomly leaves a ghost
[17:25] <cojack> yo guy
[17:25] <cojack> s*
[17:25] <cojack> Im testing new kubuntu 14.04 beta, and I would like to test it on laptop with efi and ssd + hdd
[17:25] <cojack> but I have no idea how to prepare partitions, there is efi boot partition, wtf?
[17:26] <cojack> how to properly set up those things?
[17:26] <cojack> where set up which mount point?
[17:33] <Alex_> cojack: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EFI_System_partition
[17:33] <cojack> Alex_: won't help
[17:34] <Alex_> cojack: so what is your question then?
[17:34] <Alex_> cojack: I thought you don't know what if efi partition ;)
[17:35] <cojack> Alex_: the question is
[17:36] <cojack> how to prepare partitions with ssd + hdd with efi, where efi partition should be, on ssd or hdd? Where install grub on ssd or hdd, where set up /boot on ssd or hdd?
[18:17] <cojack> uhm
[18:18] <cojack> modify /etc/default/grub no effect
[18:18] <cojack> yes, yes I do after this sudo update-grub
[18:28] <cojack> /etc/grub.d/30_os-prober override settings
[18:28] <cojack> if you set up grub to hide menu
[18:30] <cojack> set timeout_style=menu, this override setting from /etc/default/grub
[19:04] <starrats> hello everyone, I have a problem when I logon onto xubuntu 14.04LTS pre-release, I was sent over here by one of their devel nicks.  My cursor has been 'freezing/locking up' on me when I whjen i'm at the little password window at start-up I have tried many things and most have failed, i end up doing a hard shtudown to reboot, can someone help me here, please.
[19:05] <starrats> besides my spelling, lol
[19:22] <starrats> just curious if any of you might be able to help me?
[19:23] <Progers___> Try gentoo, it has less bugs :)
[19:24] <starrats> hahaha not the answer I'm looking for
[19:25] <rww> Progers___: one would hope that Gentoo has fewer bugs than a pre-release development version of Ubuntu :P
[19:25] <Progers___> :D
[19:25] <starrats> this might be true but gentoo is not my bag at the moment
[19:26] <starrats> and why are you pressing gentoo when you're on a ubuntu page?
[19:26] <darthanubis> coming up on beta freeze
[19:27] <starrats> I'm truly asking for help and don't need the funny stuff
[19:27] <darthanubis> lots of activity in repos today
[19:27] <darthanubis> I love it!
[19:28] <Progers___> starrats: Because i am not using gentoo at this moment :)
[19:28] <rww> (I think in general, joking around in a support channel with people trying to get help is a dicey way to do things. Tends to cause unhappiness.)
[19:30] <jack> true that
[19:31] <starrats> thank you rww I'm frustrated as hell, all was going 'smooth as silk for days and the last two have been bad for me the start=up window aka password window my cursor locks up/freezes and i have to do a hard shutdown on my comp, not good!
[19:31] <Progers___> If no one is answering then 1- the person who know the answer is sleeping 2- he is watching a tv
[19:31] <starrats> ok that makes more sense than go try gentoo
[19:31] <Progers___> But gentoo is good too:)
[19:32] <jack> ...
[19:33] <jack> i'm just downloading bodhilinux-3.0-alpha.iso
[19:33] <Progers___> jack: based on ubuntu?
[19:33] <jack> let's see how cool this ubuntu-clone is :)
[19:33] <jack> yep
[19:34] <jack> 3.0 is based on trusty
[19:34] <Progers___> LInuxMInt is cool
[19:34] <jack> i know
[19:34] <jack> tried it already
[19:34] <Progers___> freebsd cool too
[19:35] <jack> different though :)
[19:35] <jack> i love dpkg+apt
[19:35] <Progers___> and portage
[19:35] <jack> = gentoo
[19:35] <Progers___> :)
[19:36] <Progers___> jack: What do u use now?
[19:42] <jack> Progers___, ubuntu saucy
[19:43] <jack> just upgrading to trusty
[19:43] <Progers___> jack: Oh i am using Kubuntu 14.04
[19:44] <jack> nice
[19:44] <jack> any drawbacks?
[19:45] <Progers___> jack: Sorry i cant understand all the english, but you mean errors or bugs?
[19:45] <jack> anything like that, yeah
[19:46] <Progers___> jack: There was some bugs with kde, but i saw this bug just 1 time
[19:46] <jack> oh, you're from .ru
[19:47] <jack> sorry...
[19:47] <Progers___> I have kde 4.12.95 yasterday it was 4.12.90
[19:47] <jack> yeah, lots of updates atm
[19:47] <Progers___> Hate unity :D
[19:48] <Progers___> Stable unity has more bugs than pre-release KDE :)
[19:48] <jack> hehe
[19:48] <jack> might be true :P
[19:49] <Progers___> I still must learn more commands to better use Linux, gentoo helped me with that, but i need more :D
[19:51] <jack> as long as you know cat+man, you're good to go
[19:51] <Progers___> :)
[19:52] <jack> dmesg can be helpful too
[19:52] <Progers___> Yes
[19:52] <Progers___> But i consentrate more at programming now
[19:53] <jack> c? cpp?
[19:53] <Progers___> C++
[19:53] <Progers___> cpp
[19:53] <Progers___> qt and C++
[19:54] <jack> nice
[19:55] <Progers___> jack: Do u programm?
[19:57] <jack> Progers___, i did
[19:57] <jack> long ago
[19:58] <Progers___> jack: Programming on linux is good? So i used to programm at windows all the time
[19:58] <jack> linux is lots better :P
[19:59] <Progers___> jack: Emacs or Vim
[20:00] <jack> if i need to choose: vim
[20:00] <Progers___> jack: Hehe i am using emacs right now :D so i can play tetris :D
[20:00] <jack> :P
[20:06] <Progers___> jack: Do u know how to connect gimp forms to one form?
[20:53] <starrats> maybe now there will be someone that can answer me on my problem about a logon problem I am having with xubuntu 14.04 (trusty Tahr), problem is as follows;  When i turn on my laptop and go to the xubuntu screen and then it goes to the logon screen where my password is to be  used to logon on the cursor/pointer freezes/locks up on me and nothing works to unfreeze the cursor other than a hard shutdown, not good and i don't like doing it.
[20:53] <starrats>   So is there anyone here that can give me a solution to this problem I'm having.
[20:54] <lordievader> SorenHolm: It's currently not running... But I supose one. PA refuses to start another if one is already running.
[20:56] <SorenHolm> lordievader: Not anymore - try firering up the latest cdimage in virtualbox or something.
[20:57] <lordievader> If I finish reading these sheets I'll fire up my netboot.
[21:14] <lordievader> SorenHolm: Hehe, you're right, here are also two instances of PA. Strange.
[21:14] <lordievader> Hehe, killing it didn't do much good, now there are four.
[21:14] <aljosa> soundcard not working on MacBookAir5,2 after i've upgraded to 14.04/dev. any suggestions?
[21:14] <SorenHolm> lordievader: It started happening around a week ago. Problably the same time the kde 4.13 upgrade began.
[21:15] <SorenHolm> lordievader: rm /etc/xdg/autostart/puleaudio* does not help.
[21:16] <lordievader> SorenHolm: Have you checked if Ubuntu shows the same behaviour by any chance?
[21:17] <SorenHolm> lordievader: no - but that might be a good test.
[21:20] <lordievader> SorenHolm: Disabling the autospawn and manually starting PA only creates one instance.
[21:20] <lordievader> Then trying to create another fails with PA complaining that "Daemon already running"
[21:21] <lordievader> SorenHolm: I suppose you reported bug 1296425
[21:22] <SorenHolm> lordievader: correct. That's me.
[21:22] <lordievader> Now it's confirmed ;)
[21:22] <SorenHolm> lordievader: thanks :D


[13:52] <mup> PR operator#615 closed: Added docs for __init__ method of Object base class <Created by petevg> <Closed by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/615>
[14:00] <mup> PR operator#650 opened: Addresses discussion in issues #610 <Created by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/650>
[14:08] <mup> PR operator#544 closed: [DRAFT] - Spike lifecycle events <Created by ycliuhw> <Closed by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/544>
[14:51] <mup> Issue operator#649 closed: Persist the previous configuration values <Created by hatched> <Closed by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/649>
[15:12] <mup> Issue operator#388 closed: give BoundStoreState an update method to set multiple things <Created by chipaca> <Closed by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/388>
[15:12] <mup> PR operator#629 closed: Implement a basic update method on BoundStoredState <Created by jnsgruk> <Merged by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/629>
[16:54] <mup> Issue operator#608 closed: Error "metric value is too large" when adding floating point metrics with CollectMetricsEvent.add_metrics <bug> <Created by umtdg> <Closed by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/608>
[16:54] <mup> PR operator#609 closed: Do not try to convert metric value to decimal in _ModelBackendValidator.format_metric_value <Created by umtdg> <Merged by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/609>
[17:01] <mup> PR operator#651 opened: Revert "Implement a basic update method on BoundStoredState" <Created by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/651>
[17:03] <mup> PR operator#651 closed: Revert "Implement a basic update method on BoundStoredState" <Created by petevg> <Merged by jnsgruk> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/651>
[17:09] <mup> Issue operator#506 closed: autodetection of storage incorrect for sidecar charms <Created by jameinel> <Closed by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/506>
[17:13] <mup> Issue operator#484 closed: Reuse existing Kubernetes manifests in K8s charms <Created by knkski> <Closed by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/484>
[17:30] <mup> Issue operator#652 opened: Flow for promoting code in a given charm library to the core codebase <documentation> <🧠 big brain> <community> <Created by petevg> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/652>
[18:44] <mup> Issue operator#506 opened: autodetection of storage incorrect for sidecar charms <Created by jameinel> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/issues/506>