[12:16] <toma_> hey allee
[12:16] <allee> hi toma!!
[12:17] <allee> toma: how was your weekend?
[12:18] <toma> great
[12:18] <toma> i went to the zoo on saterday
[12:18] <toma> it was cold, but got some nice pictures
[12:19] <toma> and yours? still stressy?
[12:20] <allee> toma: yeah.  but I hope that this week is the last one
[12:35] <mornfall> good night
[12:36] <toma> night
[12:37] <Lure> good night
[12:37] <toma> night
[01:42] <Riddell> amarok beta 2 testing needed   deb http://kubuntu.org/packages/amarok-14beta2/ dapper main
[02:33] <robotgeek> Riddell: great job on the bootup splash, it looks groovy
[02:34] <robotgeek> Riddell: is amarok available on ppc too??
[07:22] <Hobbsee> freeflying: hey :)
[07:22] <freeflying> Hobbsee: hi
[07:22] <Hobbsee> i got your mail
[07:27] <seaLne> hmm todays daily ppc live is 718Mb even now i have some 700Mb cdrws i don't think i could test that
[07:27] <seaLne> ah its been too big for a few days
[07:28] <seaLne> bah i was wanting to check it
[07:28] <freeflying> seaLne: sure you can
[07:28] <seaLne> how?
[07:30] <robotgeek> 718 mb is burnable, i think
[07:30] <seaLne> weird there seem to be a lack of non ppc dailys
[07:30] <freeflying> seaLne: k3b--> configure k3b -->writeing
[07:30] <seaLne> ok i'll download and see if it fits when i get into work
[07:31] <freeflying> seaLne: -->advance-->allow overburn
[07:33] <seaLne> ta
[07:34] <seaLne> maybe too early in the day for other builds?
[07:37] <seaLne> espresso isn't in the kubuntu dailys yet is it?
[07:38] <freeflying> seaLne: it dose
[07:49] <Hobbsee> darn it!  i'm going to miss the meeting in a few hours!
[07:50] <freeflying> Hobbsee: it's 9:00 UTC , 2 hrs left
[07:50] <Hobbsee> freeflying: yes, i leave in around half an hour, maybe a little more..
[07:52] <seaLne> or wait 11 hours for the second one ;)
[07:52] <Hobbsee> yes, 4am
[07:52] <Hobbsee> oh well
[07:52] <Hobbsee> it's not like it's a kubuntu meeting
[07:53] <seaLne> you are +10?
[07:53] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:53] <Hobbsee> i dunno...might be +11
[07:54] <seaLne> 06:53 < Hobbsee> i dunno...might be +11
[07:54] <Hobbsee> but the 20UTC meetings always start at 7am for me (ouch, hehe!), so therefore 18UTC will be 5am
[07:54] <seaLne> ah
[07:54] <Hobbsee> yeah, i have UTC on kclock
[08:37] <Hobbsee> enjoy the meeting everyone!
[10:14] <AgarFu> hi
[10:18] <seaLne> mornfall: would it be possible in adept when it encounters an error to prompt and try to run apt-get -f install or dpkg-(thing which i can never remember as i only type it when it telle me to)
[10:19] <seaLne> i'm not sure how often when dapper is stable that there will be install problems but atm i'm getting them nearly each day, but they sort them selves easily enough
[10:31] <mornfall> seaLne: dpkg --configure -a
[10:31] <mornfall> seaLne: well, possibly
[10:32] <seaLne> just a thought
[10:47] <seaLne> anyone else tried recent ppc live? it booted without X then since typing startx it has stayed blank and not doing anything
[10:47] <robotgeek> seaLne: i'll try it tomorow
[10:48] <seaLne> i'll try yesterdays
[10:48] <robotgeek> i have slightly slow connection, ittakes a while to download
[10:50] <seaLne> the new usplash actually looks not bad on it
[10:52] <seaLne> original tibook
[10:52] <robotgeek> it looks very nice on my ibook
[11:41] <verwilst> yoyo
[11:43] <mornfall> lala
[12:11] <Hobbsee> crud!!!!!
[12:19] <ubijtsa> Hobbsee: missed the meeting? :)
[12:20] <Hobbsee> ubijtsa: well i did, and i knew that was going to happen - but i just got an email back to say that my assignment didnt compile on the computers at the uni...
[12:20] <ubijtsa> oops
[12:22] <Hobbsee> it compiles here!!!
[12:22] <ubijtsa> Hobbsee: C, ADA, C++, Fortran?
[12:22] <Hobbsee> ubijtsa: c++
[12:23] <ubijtsa> hmm.. different compiler perhaps
[12:23] <ubijtsa> gcc-4.0 vs gcc-3.3
[12:24] <ubijtsa> well, g++ anyways
[12:25] <Hobbsee> i dont know - the other file, which is almost a copy of the first, compiles fine both here and at the uni
[12:27] <ubijtsa> what does diff -b tell you?
[12:32] <Hobbsee> in regards to the file?  no idea
[12:32] <Hobbsee> i'll just have to check if it compiles on the uni computers, and reupload, and ask them to re-auto-mark
[12:32] <Hobbsee> might have to bend their arms a bit :P
[12:33] <Hobbsee> but i'll be really peeved if it doesnt compile on their system for marking, if it compiles on the uni computers
[12:37] <miguev> hi :)
[12:38] <AgarFu> hi
[12:38] <Hobbsee> hey
[01:33] <Hobbsee> we'll see how far i get...
[01:55] <AgarFu> Riddell are you there?
[02:09] <AgarFu> Riddell is there any documentation about dbfilter?
[02:20] <freeflying-ibook> Hobbsee: where is the snapshot ?
[02:20] <Hobbsee> freeflying-ibook: it's on planetsuse
[02:20] <Hobbsee> i couldnt get it to work - it died on makeinstall
[02:20] <Hobbsee> and i'm having trouble grabbing the cvs from kde.org
[02:24] <Hobbsee> freeflying-ibook: you need http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=125150&highlight=network+manager first, Riddell said
[02:24] <Hobbsee> then compile knetworkmanager from there
[02:25] <freeflying-ibook> Hobbsee: thx
[02:33] <Hobbsee> ewww...it's gnome!
[02:42] <Hobbsee__> freeflying-ibook: ping
[02:43] <Hobbsee> hmm
[02:43] <freeflying-ibook> Hobbsee: pong
[02:43] <Hobbsee> freeflying-ibook: on gnome at the moment - networkmanager works quite well on it
[02:44] <Hobbsee> if you figure out knetworkmanager, better still, can create a .tar.bz2 of a working source, then that'd be cool
[02:45] <freeflying-ibook> Hobbsee: I prefer to knetworkmanager  :)
[02:45] <Hobbsee> huh?
[02:45] <Hobbsee> i'd prefer knetworkmanager over networkmanager too
[02:45] <Hobbsee> i might get lucky lol...
[02:46] <freeflying-ibook> Hobbsee: will have a try later
[02:46] <Hobbsee> ok :)
[02:46] <Hobbsee> tell me how it goes - via email or whatever
[02:46] <Hobbsee> i wonder if nm-applet works in kde...
[02:48] <freeflying-ibook> Hobbsee: i have not wifi for test  :)
[02:48] <Hobbsee> ah, i see
[02:48] <Hobbsee> even if you could get it running, that'd be cool
[02:49] <Riddell> jr
[02:49] <Hobbsee> hey Riddell!
[02:51] <Hobbsee> Riddell: hang on...hypothetically, if networkmanager 0.6 makes it into dapper, can we get a separate knetworkmanager repo - just for testing?
[02:54] <Riddell> flight 5 is not being nice to me
[02:55] <Riddell> hmm, no hobbsee
[02:55] <Riddell> hi AgarFu
[02:55] <Riddell> AgarFu: no documentation as far as I know, it's written by Kamion and is his way to get round needing to use debconf gtk/qt bindings
[02:55] <Riddell> "it's a nasty hack, but it works"
[02:57] <Riddell> hi Hobbsee
[02:58] <Riddell> Hobbsee: I'm not sure what version of network manager knetworkmanager needs, but if that version does make it into dapper then we can look at having knetworkmanager in too
[02:59] <Riddell> hi Hobbsee__
[03:00] <Hobbsee__> hey Riddell
[03:00] <Hobbsee> well it sorta works...networkmanager...
[03:00] <Riddell> 13:58 < Riddell> Hobbsee: I'm not sure what version of network manager knetworkmanager needs, but if that
[03:00] <Hobbsee> couldnt figure out knetworkmanager though
[03:00] <Riddell>                  version does make it into dapper then we can look at having knetworkmanager in too
[03:00] <Hobbsee> yep
[03:01] <Hobbsee> well that's what everyone's asking about, it seems
[03:01] <Hobbsee> thanks for that - i timed out before getting that
[03:03] <AgarFu> Riddell I've done it
[03:04] <Riddell> AgarFu: done what?
[03:04] <AgarFu> I'm using it for language component and I already have the treeview loaded with the differente languages
[03:05] <AgarFu> I need to write some methods more (copy & paste) but I think I finally understood it
[03:06] <AgarFu> I've realized a little bit later that my component's name are colliding with the backend one's but that is easy to fix
[03:07] <AgarFu> now the language component is working and all the others are shown
[03:08] <Riddell> I had some strange issue where it wouldn't work with unicode strings
[03:09] <Hobbsee> anyway, i'm going to bed...night all...
[03:09] <Hobbsee> seeing as it's 1am here
[03:10] <Riddell> night Hobbsee
[03:29] <miguev> Riddell: new notes about our kde-ui: https://wiki.ssl.ull.es/doku.php?id=ubuntu-espresso
[03:29] <miguev> not fully functional, but AgarFu seems to have working it out
[03:29] <miguev> bye
[04:00] <Lure> Riddell: what are the plans with Flight5? any way we can help (testing)?
[04:01] <Lure> people are already making noise on ML and forums...
[04:01] <mornfall> what's up with flight5
[04:01] <Lure> mornfall: was not released for Kubuntu (just Ubuntu and Edubuntu)
[04:01] <mornfall> well, worse things happen
[04:02] <Lure> not sure if the case was wait for espresso for Kubuntu or just overload of Riddell (which I can understand)
[04:07] <Riddell> Lure: the candidates are up if you want to download and test
[04:07] <Riddell> for some reason they didn't build last night so it's taking a while
[04:08] <Riddell> and now rsync doesn't want to work
[04:13] <Lure> Riddell: is tjis just daily build? Because daily build (at least from 12.3.) hangs on my machine
[04:13] <Lure> I suspect that new kernel is the issue (also broke hibernate)
[04:13] <Lure> s/tjis/this/
[04:13] <Lure> but I may try espresso on my desktop - just to get used to
[04:14] <Riddell> 20060314.1/ live and install is what I'm aiming for
[04:14] <Riddell> but I haven't tested them yet, so it could well have a broken linux build for all I know
[04:14] <Riddell> Lure: don't use espresso on a machine you care about!
[04:14] <Riddell> only use it if you don't mind your hard disk being wiped
[04:16] <Lure> Riddell: Ok, thanks for note - will maybe one older system from playing around...
[04:20] <mornfall> Riddell: is it that bad (this close to release)?
[04:21] <Riddell> mornfall: it's still not had much testing, especially the KDE side
[04:23] <mornfall> ouch
[04:34] <raphink> hi
[04:44] <raphink> Riddell: ping
[04:46] <Riddell> raphink: hi
[04:46] <raphink> hi Riddell:)
[04:46] <raphink> how are you?
[04:46] <Riddell> somewhat fed up with flight 5 in multiple ways
[04:46] <Riddell> but otherwise lovely
[04:46] <raphink> :( argh
[04:46] <raphink> ok
[04:46] <raphink> :)
[04:46] <raphink> well i've got a major issue with kwin-crystal
[04:46] <raphink> it looks very nice
[04:47] <raphink> but it uses 95% of my CPU
[04:47] <raphink> so KDE takes 5 minutes to load
[04:47] <raphink> and each window takes 1 minute to render when opened
[04:47] <Riddell> that's quite strange
[04:47] <Riddell> I've not had any problems with it
[04:47] <raphink> although I'm on a 1GHz G4
[04:47] <raphink> well I've tested to be sre that was it
[04:47] <raphink> I changed the window deco
[04:47] <raphink> and it fixed it
[04:47] <raphink> I've tracked the process with top when loading windows
[04:48] <raphink> that it's kwin taking up to 95% of the CPU
[04:48] <Riddell> is it only a problem when starting KDE?
[04:48] <Riddell> or all the time
[04:48] <raphink> no
[04:48] <raphink> all the time
[04:48] <raphink> when opening a new window
[04:48] <raphink> a new box
[04:48] <Riddell> hmm
[04:48] <raphink> whatever has a title bar
[04:49] <raphink> [16:43]  <kwwii> I think it is doing too much blending of the root window
[04:49] <raphink> kwwii's comment on this ;)
[04:49] <Riddell> well we can see if other people have problems if flight 5 ever gets released
[04:51] <raphink> hehe
[04:51] <raphink> is crystal in df 5 ?
[04:51] <raphink> I mean as default
[04:55] <Riddell> should be yes
[05:02] <uniq> is that the crystal currently in dapper?
[05:03] <seaLne> is crystal the current non kubuntu kde deafult?
[05:05] <uniq> i can confirm the problem on ppc with dapper kwin-crystal. kwin eats cpu.
[05:11] <Riddell> seaLne: no
[05:11] <Riddell> strange, runs fine on my powerpc
[06:00] <raphink> hmmm
[06:00] <raphink> transparency in konsole is broken
[06:01] <Tm_T> it's not
[06:02] <Tm_T> 4 Konsole with 10 tabs can't be wrong
[06:15] <uniq> .----
[06:17] <uniq> ~~~ll?e33~7dfgggggg1azzzzzzzzz|AZZ>;2~&~ ~~9?AEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAE
[06:17] <uniq> aeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeaeae                                                                                '
[06:27] <nlindblad> thanks for approving me
[06:32] <Tonio_> hello all
[06:36] <robotgeek> hey Tonio_
[06:42] <Tm_T> uniq: wtf
[06:43] <robotgeek> Tm_T: i almost kicked him out, until i realised i was not an op here  :)
[06:46] <Tm_T> robotgeek: iirc I'm not either
[06:46] <Tm_T> yup
[06:47] <robotgeek> Tm_T: /msg nickserv info Tm_T
[06:47] <Tm_T> yup
[06:48] <Tm_T> this pain is killing me...
[06:49] <Tm_T> sauna and more drugs, eyes are moving ->
[06:51] <Tonio_> kwwii: ping ?
[06:51] <Tonio_> kwwii: when you're available, I just noticed a little visibility issue with the new color sheme...
[06:52] <raphink> Tonio_: yop
[06:52] <Tonio_> raphink: hi ;)
[06:52] <Tonio_> raphink: did yo play with openoffice since yesterday ?
[06:52] <raphink> anyone noticed kwin w/ crystal using all CPU ?
[06:52] <Tonio_> the new color sheme causes a little problem in the menus
[06:52] <raphink> didn't play with that
[06:52] <Tonio_> cause in the menus the text color doesn't change from black to white
[06:52] <raphink> i'm playing with powerpc trackpad settings
[06:53] <Tonio_> then when you use your mouse in them, you get black text on darkblue bg
[06:53] <Tonio_> which makes it quite unreadable
[06:53] <raphink> I'd like to discuss the defualt settings for it since there's the option to activate the tap-click by default for it
[06:54] <robotgeek> raphink: is there a gui way or do we have to change in /etc/pbbuttonsd.conf
[06:54] <Tonio_> raphink: http://planetemu.net/temp/capture4.png
[06:54] <Tonio_> here is an example
[06:54] <raphink> robotgeek: man trackpad
[06:55] <robotgeek> raphink: awesome, better than /etc/pbb.. old habits die hard :)
[06:55] <raphink> robotgeek: use 'sudo trackpad tap' to activate tap-click for example
[06:55] <raphink> trackpad drag
[06:55] <raphink> and trackpad lock
[06:55] <raphink> respectively to allow dragging with the trackpad
[06:56] <raphink> and locking the drag until you tap again
[06:56] <raphink> so this is very useful
[06:56] <raphink> and this app is in powerpc-utils, so installed by default on ppc
[06:56] <raphink> it could be very nice to have a gui using it though
[06:57] <Lure> Tonio_: that bothers me too, but do you suggest to change text color to black when highlighted
[06:57] <robotgeek> raphink: beats changing it in a conf file :)
[06:57] <raphink> robotgeek: also found something great : nvsetvol
[06:57] <Lure> I would like more to just make blue a bith lighter
[06:57] <Tonio_> Lure: I don't think that is possible
[06:57] <Tonio_> cause openoffice doesn't really use QT directly
[06:57] <raphink> robotgeek: sudo "nvsetvol 0" and you don't have this annoying sound when booting the mac :)
[06:57] <Tonio_> my point of view would be a color which is not too clear and too dark
[06:58] <Tonio_> unless there is a way to patch openoffice
[06:58] <robotgeek> raphink: i don't have that installed, i think. plus i don't reboot my ibook :)
[06:58] <Lure> Tonio_: but which color does OOo choose then?
[06:58] <raphink> robotgeek: you have it installed for sure as it's part of powerpc-utils which is installed by default on ppc I think
[06:58] <raphink> iirc at least
[06:58] <Tonio_> Lure: OOo uses the standard qt color
[06:58] <Tonio_> Lure: but doesn't seem to manage the texte color changing in the menus
[06:59] <jjesse> if the 6 wweek delay occurs it will affect kuubntu correct?
[06:59] <Tonio_> and I don't think patching this is easy ;)
[06:59] <raphink> what is man 8 ?
[06:59] <raphink> how does it differ from man 1 ?
[06:59] <Lure> Tonio_: another point to make those defaults (blue) more light ;-)
[06:59] <raphink> ah! time for second CC today
[07:00] <Tonio_> Lure: note that we have the problem in all gtk apps too
[07:00] <Tonio_> ;)
[07:00] <Lure> raphink: man 8 is admin command, 1 is regular commands
[07:00] <Tonio_> because of gtk_qt_engine
[07:00] <Tonio_> which means problem in firefox for example
[07:00] <Tonio_> which is widely used by kubuntu users
[07:00] <raphink> Lure: so /[s] bin/*  have .8 and /usr/* have .1 ?
[07:00] <Lure> raphink: something like that
[07:00] <raphink> ok thanks :)
[07:00] <Lure> (but not always the case)
[07:01] <Lure> ;-)
[07:01] <Lure> 5 is config files, 2 is sytem calls and 3 is library calls (AFAIR)
[07:01] <raphink> ok let's move to #ubuntu-meeting
[07:01] <Lure> ok
[07:08] <jjesse> Riddell: how much would a delay benifit kubuntu, the same amount?
[07:13] <Riddell> jjesse: more I'd say, since kde 3.5.2 release is just before and kde espresso needs work
[07:14] <jjesse> then i would vote for it, if it makes things better
[08:21] <Tm_T> any meetings I _must_ be this week?
[08:26] <Tonio_> Riddell: http://wlassistant.sourceforge.net/
[08:26] <Tonio_> testing if the bugs are gone
[08:26] <Tonio_> Riddell: any chance to get it in if that works ?
[08:26] <jjesse> anythings gotta be better then kwifimanger :(
[08:30] <Tonio_> allee: ready to test ? ;)
[08:38] <Lure> Tonio_: what about knetworkmanager - on delay meetings it was noted that some forum people have working version
[08:39] <Lure> 0.6, which I think is needed for KDE frontend
[08:39] <Lure> Mark was also saying that they might consider if community provided workable version
[08:41] <Tonio_> Lure: hum, dunno
[08:41] <Tonio_> Lure: Riddell only can status on this...
[08:42] <Tonio_> Lure: I heard (but maybe I'm wrong) that knetworkmanager works only with cvs version on networkmanager
[08:42] <Tonio_> Riddell: can you confirm ?
[08:42] <Lure> I plan to install forum stuff and try GNOME applet - if it work, I may look for knetworkmanager
[08:42] <Tonio_> Lure: sure !
[08:42] <Lure> Tonio_: I think CVS version was pre-0.6 at the time
[08:42] <Lure> but Riddell can probably confirm
[08:42] <Tonio_> Lure: this is a major, major, major issue for kubuntu
[08:43] <Tonio_> especially considering that laptop is a great priority for ubuntu
[08:43] <Lure> I can fix wpasupplicant for my needs (WPA), but I would like to have something better for others. ;-)
[08:43] <Tonio_> Lure: the best tool I've seen actually for kde is wlassistant, although it had 2 little, but really annoying bugs
[08:43] <Lure> But I have also powersave/kpowersave on my secret agenda...
[08:44] <Tonio_> Lure: that as already been discussed I think
[08:44] <Tonio_> the problem is that kpowerslave is duplicating the canonical stuff somehow
[08:44] <Lure> Tonio_: benefit of networkmanager is one base, two front-ends and this help (k)ubuntu
[08:45] <Tonio_> Lure: I must say I agreee that kpowersave is really, really better than klaptop
[08:45] <Lure> This is why poversave/kpowersave has issue (as base is different: acpi-support+powernowd vs. powersaved)
[08:45] <Lure> but I doubt that g-p-m people will switch to powersaved soon (as main developer do not want to)
[08:45] <Tonio_> yes but as ubuntu is developped with the best gnome apps, it is a bit sad removing kde killer appps because of that.....
[08:45] <Lure> This is why we need to make powersaved to "work-with" ubuntu infrastructure
[08:46] <Riddell> Tonio_: yes, needs a CVS network manager
[08:46] <Tonio_> kpowersave is actually in the top 3 appications in kde-apps
[08:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: okay, that confirms :)
[08:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: what about wlassistant if the new version works quite correctly ?
[08:46] <Lure> Riddell: but what does "CVS version" mean - I though this was pre-0.6 (major rewrite)
[08:46] <Lure> and 0.6 is now released (with full WPA/WPA2 support)
[08:47] <Tonio_> Lure: is it ? didn't look at that........ interesting !
[08:47] <Riddell> Tonio_: it's been a while since I've used it, I'd need to look at it again
[08:47] <Lure> forum people took 0.6 and polished it for ubuntu
[08:48] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm testing wlassistant for bugs and let you know ;)
[08:48] <Lure> major work was also on wpa_supplicant (which is used by 0,6) to respect /etc/network/interfaces
[08:51] <Lure> [19:32]  <siretart> sabdfl: re wpa: I have prepared with crimsun and kel modderman a new wpasupplicant package which integrates nicely in /etc/network/interfaces. I think it shouldn't be hard to integrate that to gnome-system-tools
[08:54] <Tonio_> Lure: even without wpa, a simply network tool is really needed :)
[08:54] <Tonio_> Riddell: isn't knetworkmanager okay with 0.6 new stable version ?
[08:55] <Lure> Tonio_: agree and I think you should push wlassistant - do we need just UVF exception?
[08:56] <Riddell> Tonio_: possibly, I don't know about network manager versioning
[08:56] <Tonio_> Riddell: okay
[08:56] <Tonio_> Lure: ready to investigate ?
[08:56] <Riddell> but if it is, then great
[08:56] <Tonio_> I'm installing ndiswrapper on my laptop, let's go !
[08:57] <nlindblad> WLAN management on Linux sucks in general
[08:57] <Tonio_> nlindblad: not with networkmanager
[08:57] <nlindblad> Tonio_: really?
[08:57] <Tonio_> yes
[08:57] <Tonio_> networkmanager is GREAT
[08:58] <Lure> Tonio_: will look into this - first need to get through forum stuff to understand pros/cons and have working nm-applet on my system
[08:58] <Tonio_> Lure: okay, keep in touch ;)
[08:59] <nlindblad> Tonio_: screenshots?
[09:00] <nlindblad> GNOME project??
[09:02] <raphink> Riddell: are you coming to the TB ?
[09:02] <Lure> nlindblad: yes, GNOME project but with light-weigh front-end which was rewritten for KDE - knetworkmanager
[09:02] <Riddell> raphink: yep
[09:02] <raphink> ok :)
[09:02] <Riddell> raphink: anything I should look out for?
[09:02] <raphink> I might need your support :)
[09:02] <nlindblad> Lure: currently on Breezy, might be why I can't find it
[09:02] <Riddell> raphink: oh, you're going for main?
[09:03] <raphink> yes
[09:03] <Riddell> groovy
[09:03] <nlindblad> oh, something I probably should mention
[09:03] <Lure> raphink: good luck!
[09:03] <raphink> thanks
[09:03] <nlindblad> when trying Dapper out a few weeks ago, all programs using glibc segfaulted all the time and eventually the whole system refused to function
[09:04] <Lure> raphink: we really need more KDE guys in core-dev and similar...
[09:04] <raphink> Lure: which is why I'm going
[09:05] <nlindblad> might be nothing...
[09:08] <Riddell> nlindblad: all?  or just gnome programmes?
[09:10] <nlindblad> Riddell: all programs
[09:10] <freeflying-ibook> Riddell: I need your support and recommend too
[09:10] <nlindblad> Riddell: fresh Breezy install => Dapper
[09:11] <Riddell> nlindblad: sounds nasty, let me know if you have the same issues with flight 5
[09:11] <nlindblad> Riddell: yeah
[09:12] <nlindblad> Lure: not available for Breezy?
[09:13] <Lure> nlindblad: I don't think so - but if you are hanging on kubuntu-devel, you should run Dapper anyhow ;-)
[09:13] <nlindblad> hmm
[09:13] <nlindblad> really want my laptop stable
[09:14] <nlindblad> but workstation would be alright
[09:14] <nlindblad> sed -ie 's/breezy/dapper/g' /etc/apt/sources.list
[09:14] <Riddell> freeflying-ibook: yep, I'm here :)
[09:14] <Lure> nlindblad: I understand - I am also on Breezy for my work time, but will switch with Flight5
[09:15] <freeflying-ibook> Riddell: thx
[09:16] <nlindblad> upgrading now
[09:16] <nlindblad> Lure: yeah
[09:20] <nlindblad> I want something stopping me from wasting the enourmus amount of time I sit in front of my computer
[09:20] <nlindblad> Kubuntu development is a good candidate for that
[09:23] <Tm_T> heh
[09:23] <Lure> raphink: congrats!
[09:24] <robotgeek> Riddell: congrats!
[09:24] <jjesse> raphink: congrats :)
[09:24] <Tm_T> ?
[09:24] <raphink> w00t!!!!!!!!
[09:24] <raphink> thanks :)
[09:25] <robotgeek> damn, raphink congrats!
[09:25] <raphink> :D
[09:25] <OculusAquilae> raphink: congrats
[09:25] <Tm_T> raphink get laid?
[09:25] <raphink> :) :) :)
[09:25] <Tm_T> ;--P
[09:26] <Tm_T> raphink: congrats
[09:26] <raphink> ty
[09:26] <Tm_T> cong-rats..
[09:26] <nlindblad> something I miss in apt is the ability to process several operations at once
[09:26] <Tm_T> nah
[09:27] <nlindblad> if you start a major dist-upgrade and need another package quickly you'd still have to either wait or interrupt
[09:27] <nlindblad> pretty clumsy
[09:28] <Tm_T> true
[09:28] <Tm_T> but safe
[09:28] <nlindblad> yeah
[09:28] <nlindblad> I guess I'd complain if it was the other way around
[09:28] <Tm_T> indeed
[09:28] <Riddell> raphink: you heard mjg59, he'll be expecting top kubuntu laptop support now you're in main :)
[09:29] <raphink> hehe
[09:29] <raphink> :)
[09:29] <raphink> and now that i bought my first laptop this morning :)
[09:29] <nlindblad> is it just my crappy laptop or isn't suspend2 working what well?
[09:29] <nlindblad> that's a feature that would make my life alot easier
[09:32] <Lure> raphink: I also expect top laptop from you ;-)
[09:32] <raphink> don't expect my lap though :p
[09:32] <raphink> just the top
[09:33] <Lure> raphink: if you can push powersave in, that is more than enough ;-)
[09:33] <raphink> Lure: just got my first laptop today officially
[09:33] <Lure> kpowersave will be easy then ;-)
[09:33] <raphink> so I'm nto used to laptop stuff yet
[09:33] <raphink> I'll be doing my best ;)
[09:33] <mbiebl> I can only second that. If you need help or more information, ask lure or myself.
[09:34] <Lure> hi mbiebl
[09:34] <raphink> :)
[09:34] <mbiebl> Hi
[09:35] <Lure> mbiebl: I was thinking if it would not be easier for inclusion if we do not reroute acpid
[09:35] <Lure> but rather change apci-support upstream to respect powersaved properly (as it does for g-p-m)
[09:35] <mbiebl> Lure, filed a bug report for cpufrequtils, hopefully it gets rebuilt soon.
[09:35] <mbiebl> Lure, this solution is fine, too.
[09:36] <Lure> mbiebl: great - is this upstream (Debian) first or jsut Ubuntu?
[09:36] <mbiebl> The Debian package is already fixed, it's a Dapper issue
[09:36] <Lure> I plan to start some discussion with laptop team just to get some buy-in before we start major push
[09:37] <mbiebl> Good idea. Try to make a list, what they think is still missing and needs to be fixed or has to be done.
[09:38] <Lure> exactly - I just do not want that we get ther wih big suprise
[09:38] <Lure> I am shooting to at least get support for kpowersave into universe (UVF exception)
[09:39] <Lure> then we can discuss what is default for kubuntu-desktop
[09:39] <Lure> ;-)
[09:39] <mbiebl> But wouldn't it have to be main to become default for kubuntu-desktop?
[09:39] <Lure> Riddell, raphink: can kubuntu-desktop depend on something from universe?
[09:39] <Riddell> Lure: no
[09:39] <Lure> I suspect not...
[09:40] <raphink> Lure: no
[09:40] <Lure> I am not sure how hard is to get universe -> main approval
[09:40] <nlindblad> I think I can follow the code of conduct
[09:40] <Lure> but I do not want to get too excited - let's do step by step and do it right
[09:41] <Lure> I will try to put up a wiki page with some info on that
[09:42] <mbiebl> What are the steps that need to be taken to get kpowersave into main? Who do we have to convince ;-)
[09:44] <Lure> mbiebl: I would suspect prerequisite is laptop-devel people - which means working nicely with GNOME first
[09:44] <Lure> then probably many others to get formal approval...
[09:47] <nlindblad> I signed it
[09:47] <nlindblad> what's next?
[09:48] <mbiebl> I'm coming from the Debian world, so I don't know the policies and procedures of (k)ubuntu.
[09:48] <Riddell> mbiebl: you need to convince me
[09:48] <Riddell> mbiebl: and I need mjg59 convinced since he does the power stuff in ubuntu
[09:50] <Riddell> mbiebl: I don't know enough about power stuff to understand all the issues, and I haven't had time to investigate
[09:50] <mbiebl> Riddell, do you have an overview how powersaved+kpowersave work?
[09:51] <Riddell> mbiebl: not really, nor how the ubuntu power stuff works
[09:52] <mbiebl> Should I write you an email or do you prefer to discuss it on IRC?
[09:53] <Riddell> freeflying-ibook: keep doing fixes and testing and we'll try for MOTU again in a couple of months
[09:53] <freeflying-ibook> Riddell: thx, i will
[09:54] <nlindblad> what's next after signing?
[09:55] <Riddell> nlindblad: next after what?
[09:55] <nlindblad> Riddell: signing the code of conduct
[09:56] <Riddell> mbiebl: there is already an e-mail thread on the topic I'm yet to read
[09:56] <Riddell> mbiebl: if you camake your case here briefly then go ahead
[09:56] <Riddell> mbiebl: what's your relationship to kpowersave first?
[09:57] <mbiebl> Good, I will write up a description of (k)powersave and make a comparison to klaptopdaemon and g-p-m and post it to the kubuntu-devel m-l.
[09:58] <mbiebl> I'm the Debian maintainer of the powersaved/kpowersave packages.
[09:58] <Lure> mbiebl: maybe better to wiki.ubuntu.com
[09:58] <Lure> (much easier to keep up-to-date than mail thread)
[09:58] <Riddell> mbiebl: yeah, wiki page might be good
[09:58] <nlindblad> I'd love to focus on security issues
[09:58] <nlindblad> help out in that way
[09:58] <Lure> mbiebl: or I can do wiki based on your input
[09:59] <mbiebl> That's fine for me too.
[10:00] <Lure> Riddell: KubuntuLaptop or KubuntuPowersave?
[10:00] <Riddell> Lure: second is less generic
[10:00] <Lure> Riddell: will do
[10:01] <mbiebl> Riddell, and about my relationship to kpowersave: I'm also contributing upstream where possible. The project is very active and open.
[10:02] <nlindblad> is there a specific Ubuntu security team?
[10:02] <Lure> Riddell: I would add that mbiebel actually pushed lot's of upstream changes
[10:02] <Riddell> nlindblad: yes, he's called pitti
[10:02] <Lure> kpowersave was very SuSE before...
[10:02] <nlindblad> Riddell: do they need help?
[10:02] <mbiebl> I talked to the (k)powersave devs and they were very interested in getting (k)powersave into Dapper. They even offered there help.
[10:03] <Lure> I think we have support from upstream and debian maintainer
[10:03] <Lure> key is GNOME cooperation, and here I can anticipate some issues
[10:03] <Riddell> nlindblad: I suspect not, security fixes are difficult and canonical needs to make sure they are done properly, but you can certainly ask
[10:03] <mbiebl> Yes, it was SuSE only previously. But now moved to sf.net and we worked hard to make (k)powersave distribution agnostic.
[10:04] <nlindblad> Riddell: well, the plain text password really indicates things are not perfect
[10:04] <Lure> due to the fact that g-p-m and powersave strategies are slightly different
[10:04] <Riddell> nlindblad: how would you have stoped that happening?
[10:05] <Lure> but nothing that we could overcome (becase we really have to, otherwise we are stuck with bad laptop support in Kubuntu)
[10:05] <nlindblad> Riddell: I'm not a security guru, but I'm just saying, if somone would play with security and really take things to it's edge
[10:05] <nlindblad> Riddell: someone would likely have found that
[10:06] <nlindblad> Riddell: not accusing anyone of being bad at what they do
[10:07] <mbiebl> As said, I will write up a short description of (k)powersave and its design goals and give a comparison to g-p-m with it's pros and cons. Then Jonathan can make a better decision.
[10:08] <Riddell> mbiebl: I feel pretty bad that I haven't been able to give this much time so far, thank for poking me :)
[10:08] <mbiebl> I guess you are pretty busy atm ;-)
[10:15] <nlindblad> good night
[10:46] <Tonio_> okay, let's trying latest networkmanager :)
[10:50] <Tonio_> Lure: ping ?
[10:50] <Lure> Tonio_: pong
[10:51] <Tonio_> Lure: what are the changes done on the topic you talked about for kubuntu ?
[10:51] <Tonio_> I was simply trying to uupdate the actual source package
[10:51] <Tonio_> are there things you heard about ?
[10:52] <Lure> there is effort on forums to make packages for 0.6, some already reporting success, other still having problems
[10:52] <Lure> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=139334
[10:53] <Lure> then siretart is working on wpasupplicant update that has improved support for NM
[10:53] <Lure> [19:32]  <siretart> sabdfl: re wpa: I have prepared with crimsun and kel modderman a new wpasupplicant package which integrates nicely in /etc/network/interfaces. I think it shouldn't be hard to integrate that to gnome-system-tools
[10:54] <Lure> (this was on meeting regarding dapper delay)
[10:56] <Lure> I have seen reluctance from keybuk (maintainer of NM 0.5.1 for ubuntu) and Mark saying that he might support community provided stuff inclusion if it works
[10:56] <Lure> Tonio_: what do you mean with "actual source code"?
[10:56] <Tonio_> Lure: are there patches to provide or something ?
[10:57] <Lure> patches are key issue for keybuk
[10:57] <Lure> 0.5.1 has many patches for ubuntu integration, these are harder to port due to major changes in 0.6
[10:57] <Lure> :(
[10:58] <Lure> I would say with so much interest, the issue is only in working together (too many cooks issue)
[11:00] <Lure> Tonio_: I still like your wlassitant idea - but not sure if new packages are accepted in universe
[11:00] <Tonio_> Lure: well, because it is a major missing, there could maybe be an exception
[11:00] <Tonio_> we have time to test now
[11:00] <Lure> I suppose it is easier to get in than new NM still (NM has many dependacies, like VPN...)
[11:00] <Lure> Tonio_: exactly
[11:01] <Tonio_> Riddell: if wlassistant or knetworkmanager are working *perfectly*, do you think an exceptionnal execption to feature freeze could be possible ?
[11:01] <Riddell> Tonio_: knetworkmanager will follow network manager.  wlassistant could be possible
[11:01] <Lure> Tonio_: perfectly is hard with so bad foundation (differences between WiFi drivers)
[11:02] <Tonio_> Riddell: the problem is that knetworkmanager requires an update of networkmanager in main.........
[11:02] <Lure> this is is why NM is in my opinion harder to polish
[11:02] <Riddell> Tonio_: exactly, and that's not going to happen
[11:02] <Tonio_> Riddell: would canonical do that for kubuntu ? I'm not sure......
[11:02] <Riddell> no
[11:02] <Riddell> well, keybuk wouldn't do it for kubuntu anyway
[11:02] <Tonio_> Riddell: okay, so let's focus on wlassistant
[11:03] <Lure> Tonio_: will you work on packages - I am more than willing to test
[11:03] <Tonio_> and.... (sorry for that last question), if wlassistant is really "perfect", is main integration possible ?
[11:04] <Lure> BTW, I just droped knemo (again) - CPU load on batteries is just too high (5%)
[11:04] <Lure> I hope wlassistant is better
[11:04] <Riddell> Lure: really?
[11:04] <Tonio_> Lure:  ?
[11:05] <Lure> Yes, just searching for bug...
[11:05] <Tonio_> Lure: how do you get the cpu load ?
[11:06] <Lure> top
[11:06] <Tonio_> cause knemo isn't a binary but a kde service
[11:06] <Tonio_> I don't have knemo appareing in it
[11:06] <Lure> it is shown on kded
[11:06] <Lure> turn knemo off and you see difference.
[11:06] <Tonio_> that's what I thought, but do you think knemo is the responsible ?
[11:06] <Tonio_> Lure: testing
[11:06] <Lure> when my laptop is on 2.1GHz it is 2%, on 800Mhz is around 5%
[11:07] <Lure> bug 32981
[11:07] <Ubugtu> malone bug 32981 in knemo "kded eats CPU continuously due to KNemo" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32981
[11:07] <Tonio_> Lure: with my laptop (celeron D 1.5 ghz), it is arround 1.5%
[11:07] <Lure> interesting...
[11:08] <Lure> I need to ack for new laptop... ;-)
[11:08] <Lure> s/ack/ask/
[11:08] <allee> Lure: FWIW as soon as knemo 0.4 will be released, Percy will work on use a lib instead of if/iwconfig route
[11:08] <Lure> Tonio_: this is on full speed?
[11:08] <Tonio_> Lure: yes, I never decrese the cpu speed ;)
[11:08] <allee> Lure: I tried to convience him to do it for 0.4.  But he said he's too busy to do it right now
[11:08] <Tonio_> Lure: without knemo, I get 0.1%
[11:08] <Tonio_> you're right
[11:09] <Tonio_> there is a replacement we can suggest for knemo
[11:09] <Lure> CPU usage also means battery time for notebooks and I do not lake to trade that for one icon ;-)
[11:09] <Tonio_> called knetdockapp
[11:09] <Tonio_> Lure: you should test, it is quite nice
[11:10] <Lure> but I do not object for knemo to be started by default in Dapper - I can turn it off by myself
[11:10] <Tonio_> I did a package for dapper
[11:10] <Tonio_> and mostly, knetdockapp is maintained, when knemo isn't
[11:11] <Tonio_> allee: already tested it ?
[11:11] <Tonio_> allee: I saw you in the changelog for wlassistant;)
[11:11] <Tonio_> allee: any news concerning the dhclient bug ?
[11:13] <Tonio_> Lure: the problem with knetdockapp is that it can't monitor several cards at the same time........
[11:13] <Lure> Tonio_: I just noticed... ;-(
[11:13] <Tonio_> Lure: but cpu usage is about 0 :)
[11:13] <Tonio_> we are not up to date
[11:13] <Tonio_> and I am in contact with upstream
[11:13] <Lure> and Setting window does not come nice on my screen (some elements overlap)
[11:13] <Tonio_> I could ask for feature
[11:14] <Lure> CPU is 0% - really!
[11:14] <Tonio_> Lure: no app is perfect ;)
[11:14] <Lure> With graph ploting it goes to 3%
[11:14] <Tonio_> but todor is working hard on knetdockapp :)
[11:14] <Tonio_> Lure: ah ?.........
[11:15] <Tonio_> Lure: well it is correct I think
[11:15] <Lure> Tonio_: if you open Settings window and select active interface
[11:15] <Lure> but that is normal for ploting graph online
[11:15] <Tonio_> Lure: yes and to me it is okay
[11:15] <Tonio_> Lure: can you provide a screenshot ?
[11:18] <Tonio_> 0.67.3 - combined update. allow multiple instances, chart drawing and tooltip cleanups/updates
[11:18] <Tonio_> Lure: look at that
[11:18] <Tonio_> Lure: we should update and make uvfe request don't you think ?
[11:19] <Lure> looks good
[11:19] <Tonio_> Lure: there is still a problem
[11:20] <Tonio_> knemo can display your interfaces automatically
[11:20] <Tonio_> if you have an ath0, it will be shown
[11:20] <Tonio_> knetdockapp requires way more config........
[11:20] <allee> Tonio_: I made a wlassistant deb after the release but could not try because all AP were is use.  So I don't know if it's fixed
[11:20] <Tonio_> allee: can you give me the deb ?
[11:20] <Tonio_> I'm gonna test right now
[11:20] <allee> wait ...
[11:21] <Tonio_> allee: I saw upstream switched to scons..............
[11:21] <Lure> Tonio_: screenshot: http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/1726/knetdock5bo.png
[11:22] <Tonio_> Lure: I can see yes
[11:22] <Tonio_> Lure: you have big fonts :)
[11:22] <Lure> I think the issue is DPI - fonts are just what you set me in k-d-s
[11:22] <Lure> ;-)
[11:22] <Tonio_> Lure: hu ?
[11:23] <Tonio_> you *should* have default ones ?
[11:23] <Lure> 9 pt
[11:23] <Tonio_> what is the size you set in kde settings ?
[11:23] <Tonio_> Lure: amazing.........;
[11:23] <Tonio_> Lure: breezy updated or native ?
[11:24] <Tonio_> Lure: you are the first personn I see that has different fonts to what it is supposed to be
[11:24] <Lure> clean install Flight4+dist-upgrade (from two days agou, as daily CD did not work)
[11:24] <Lure> I thought they are supposed to be 9pt
[11:24] <allee> Tonio_: http://www.mpe.mpg.de/~ach/tmp/
[11:25] <Lure> (I have same on desktop with 17"LCD with 96DPI)
[11:25] <Tonio_> allee: thanks :)
[11:25] <Tonio_> Lure: urgh ?
[11:25] <Tonio_> I have installed dapper about 30 times on 20 machines
[11:26] <Tonio_> never saw something like that.......
[11:26] <Tonio_> allee: did you saw that bug already ?
[11:26] <Lure> Tonio_: you did not see my initial Breezy ;-)
[11:26] <allee> Lure: what gives: xrdb -query | grep dpi
[11:26] <Lure> Xft.dpi:        146
[11:27] <Lure> which is average of two DPI
[11:27] <Lure> xdpyinfo says:
[11:27] <allee> Lure: and you have a 146 dpi display?
[11:27] <Lure> resolution:    147x145 dots per inch
[11:27] <Lure> dimensions:    1920x1200 pixels (332x210 millimeters)
[11:27] <Lure> and this is all correct
[11:27] <Tonio_> allee: isn't that supposed to be set to 96 instead of 146 ?
[11:27] <allee> Lure: then the fonts are correct. And that we see huge fonts is just because we have DPI << 146 :)
[11:28] <Tonio_> Lure: the problem is that xft.dpi is supposed to be set, and fixed
[11:28] <Tonio_> not DPI but xft.dpi
[11:28] <allee> Tonio_: no for dpi > 140 dpi the real resolution is used
[11:28] <Tonio_> allee: ah ? didn't knew that :)
[11:28] <Lure> allee: true (I have debugged displayconfig)
[11:28] <Tonio_> allee: sounds logic :)
[11:28] <Lure> ;-)
[11:29] <Lure> Tonio_: but fonts do not look bad elsewhere (including Firefox/GTK)
[11:29] <Lure> Only here and there there is some dialog that could look better - like knetdock
[11:30] <Tonio_> allee: my wifi adapter is set to eth1
[11:30] <Tonio_> wlassistant doesn't like that.........
[11:30] <Tonio_> Lure: okay kool :)
[11:30] <Lure> really? I think ipw2200 is always ethX
[11:30] <Tonio_> :'(
[11:31] <Tonio_> Lure: wlassistant tells me that it doesn't see any wireless adapter
[11:31] <allee> Lure: fonts looks fine.  I get the same with 10pt or was it 11 pt fonts
[11:32] <allee> Lure: with hires screens there's a switch from 1 to 2 pixels used for line width.  This makes the fonts look bold
[11:33] <Lure> allee: true - this is why I have turned some to 8pt on Breezy (I may do sameon Dapper)
[11:33] <allee> Lure: looks like you're a perfect tester for hackish layouts are on sees in your screenshot :)
[11:33] <Lure> allee: you have not seen my login screen...
[11:34] <allee> Lure: I was first 'shocked' to by the boldness.  But with some time one gets used to it
[11:35] <allee> Lure: ah, yeah, same here too.  Icons where totally off from login window
[11:35] <Lure> http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=kdm1920x12002gr.jpg
[11:36] <Lure> that will wake you up for sure ;-)
[11:37] <allee> Tonio_: wlassistant 0.5.5-1 has no problems with eth1, at least it finds the WPA encrypted networks here
[11:37] <allee> I have ips2200 in my laptop too.
[11:38] <Lure> allee: is wlassistant deb for dapper or should I build from source?
[11:38] <allee> Tonio_: what does iwconfig detect your wireless extentions
[11:38] <Tonio_> allee: yup
[11:38] <allee> Lure: is dapper deb
[11:38] <Tonio_> let me pastebin
[11:39] <Tonio_> allee: http://pastebin.com/602560
[11:39] <Tonio_> looking at the soruces to understant
[11:39] <Tonio_> but yes, no pb with my wifi actually
[11:40] <Lure> Tonio_: works here (active WPA2 on ipw2200 on eth1)
[11:40] <Tonio_> Lure: if that works for you, something you can try is connect
[11:40] <Tonio_> then disconnect and reconnect
[11:41] <Tonio_> old bug was wasn't working on the second connection without performing a manual "dhclient" command
[11:41] <Tonio_> Lure: okay thanks :)
[11:41] <allee> Tonio_: http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/602564 is what I get on startup.  But I can't try to connect because AP uses WPA
[11:42] <Tonio_> allee: http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/602574
[11:42] <Tonio_> seems that the iwconfig output isn't parsed correctly
[11:43] <Tonio_> strange issue.........
[11:43] <allee> Tonio_: ah, you have a brodcom wlan.  So you have to use use ndiswrapper?
[11:43] <Tonio_> allee: no
[11:43] <Lure> Tonio_: first, I had to run with kdesu, then it only supports wep connect
[11:43] <Lure> :-(
[11:43] <Tonio_> allee: detected from scratch, but I have to extract the firmware from the windows drvier......
[11:44] <allee> Tonio_: ah the nickname is the one of your AP :)
[11:44] <Tonio_> allee: really worse than simple ndiswrapper.........
[11:44] <Tonio_> allee: yes ;)
[11:53] <Tonio_> hu ????????
[11:53] <Tonio_> allee: master please !!!!!!!!
[11:53] <Tonio_> allee: how can you explain this :
[11:53] <Tonio_> my wifi card doesn't work
[11:53] <Tonio_> but when I install network-manager, it does ;)
[11:54] <Tonio_> amazing issue
[11:54] <robotgeek> Tonio_: dapper broadcom driver?
[11:54] <Tonio_> robotgeek: yes
[11:54] <Tonio_> with firmware extacted from the windows driver and placed in /lib/firmwares
[11:54] <robotgeek> Tonio_: look for the words "link becomes ready" in /var/log/syslog
[11:54] <Tonio_> robotgeek: k
[11:55] <robotgeek> Tonio_: basically, it is good to have some kind of a delay in there
[11:56] <Tonio_> robotgeek: nothing concerning eth1
[11:56] <Tonio_> only eth0.........
[11:57] <Tonio_> Mar 14 23:52:55 kubuntu kernel: [4294980.918000]  ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): eth1: link is not ready
[11:57] <Tonio_> robotgeek: okay I can see
[11:58] <Tonio_> robotgeek: any way to set a little delay ?
[11:58] <robotgeek> Tonio_: weird, try this script. http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/10247
[11:59] <robotgeek> Tonio_: i use this on a daily basis, so it should work for you too :)
[12:00] <Tonio_> this driver is a pain, really..........
[12:03] <Tonio_> robotgeek: rebooting and testing ;)


[07:12] <pitti> Good morning
[08:16] <flexiondotorg> Morning pitti
[08:16] <pitti> hey flexiondotorg, how is it going?
[08:16] <flexiondotorg> All good thanks. Yourself?
[08:28] <hikiko> hey all :
[08:28] <hikiko> :)
[08:28]  * hikiko forgot to be social today :/
[08:29] <hikiko> :p
[08:55] <pitti> hey hikiko, how are you?
[08:56] <pitti> flexiondotorg: good, thanks! (sorry, phone rang, then I forgot)
[08:58] <hikiko> hi pitti and flexiondotorg :)
[08:59] <hikiko> i am good, well tired... :) you?
[09:02] <Laney> hey!
[09:02] <pitti> good morning Laney!
[09:04] <Laney> bonjour pitti
[09:04] <Laney> how are you?
[09:04] <flexiondotorg> Morning Laney, hikiko
[09:04] <pitti> Laney: I'm great, thanks! a little groggy from basketball, but again the good kind
[09:08] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[09:08] <flexiondotorg> seb128, o/
[09:09] <seb128> hey flexiondotorg, how are you?
[09:09] <pitti> ça va seb128
[09:09] <hikiko> hi Laney seb128 :)
[09:09] <seb128> hey pitti hikiko Laney
[09:09] <seb128> pitti, oui, et toi ?
[09:09] <flexiondotorg> seb128, Coping. Although off to the hospital for an hour or so later.
[09:09] <flexiondotorg> Much pain :-(
[09:10] <hikiko> :/
[09:10] <Laney> pitti: indeed - feeling the same from climbing last night :-)
[09:10] <Laney> hi seb128 flexiondotorg & hikiko
[09:10]  * Laney gives flexiondotorg a sports massage
[09:10] <seb128> flexiondotorg, get better!
[09:11] <seb128> Laney, climbing night ftw!
[09:11] <Laney> seb128: the best nights!
[09:11] <flexiondotorg> I'm sure I be fine in a few days.
[09:13] <pitti> flexiondotorg: urgh, all the best!
[09:14] <flexiondotorg> seb128, Have you start on the GTK platform snap?
[09:17] <desrt> things that GDBus subtree dispatching was not designed for:
[09:17] <desrt>  - security
[09:17] <desrt> (eof)
[09:17] <flexiondotorg> That's unfortuante.
[09:18] <desrt> preventing apps about finding out about other apps in the most natural way may not be possible
[09:18] <desrt> (but in this case "finding out" means only "can see that they exist")
[09:19] <seb128> flexiondotorg, not really, I started played with building snap using debs from another serie and looking at what should be included and at the launcher script, but I didn't try to build one yet
[09:19] <seb128> flexiondotorg, likely for next week
[09:19] <seb128> why?
[09:19] <flexiondotorg> I've been reflecting on what we discussed at the sprint.
[09:20] <flexiondotorg> Specifically build it from debs.
[09:21] <flexiondotorg> I've taken another look at what robert started, which builds entire from source.
[09:21] <flexiondotorg> IIRC we opted for building from debs because we inherit the distro patches, correct?
[09:21] <seb128> yes
[09:22] <seb128> it's also easier to iterate
[09:22] <flexiondotorg> In what sense?
[09:22] <desrt> in the sense that we have to do the deb anyway, and all that infra is already there
[09:23] <flexiondotorg> OK
[09:23] <desrt> vs. figuring out a way to pull/configure/rebuild the tarball from upstream
[09:23] <flexiondotorg> desrt, Well that is largely solved.
[09:23] <desrt> it is solved for largely trivial projects :p
[09:23] <desrt> gtk is a beast
[09:24] <Laney>
[09:24] <desrt> morning laney
[09:24] <Laney> that was the first 0 characters of "hi desrt"
[09:26] <flexiondotorg> seb128, Ping me when you make a start.
[09:26] <flexiondotorg> I'd like to help.
[09:27] <flexiondotorg> I just wanted to discuss the approach again before we start.
[09:31] <seb128> flexiondotorg, k, it might be tomorrow or next week
[09:31] <flexiondotorg> Cool.
[10:10] <willcooke> hi all.  Here, but not here.
[10:10] <Laney> the ghost of willcooke
[10:10] <willcooke> indeed!
[10:11] <willcooke> It's odd, when you're sick but work from home.  Like, where do you go?
[10:11] <willcooke> Figured I might as well sit in from of the compuiter for a bit
[10:12] <Laney> my mum just sent me a picture of her day off activity
[10:12] <Laney> ...
[10:12] <Laney> watching jeremy kyle
[10:13] <willcooke> \o/
[10:14] <willcooke> Followed by Homes Under The Hammer?
[10:18] <Laney> that guy that eats loads of food
[10:19] <Laney> i think she's actually going out
[10:19] <Laney> hopefully /o\
[10:59] <FJKong_> when I tried to upload some package to mentors.debian.net, due to bad network, sometimes it will broken and next when I tried to upload it will show some error like
[10:59] <FJKong_> This existing file may have been previously uploaded partially.
[10:59] <FJKong_>        For official Debian upload queues, the dcut(1) utility can be
[10:59] <FJKong_>        used to remove this file, and after an acknowledgement mail is
[10:59] <FJKong_>        received in response to dcut, the upload can be re-initiated.
[11:00] <FJKong_> how to delete privious broken file?
[11:00] <Laney> FJKong_: ask in #debian-mentors on OFTC
[11:00] <Laney> don't know if dcut works there
[11:00] <FJKong_> seems no
[11:00] <FJKong_> I can't connect to irc.debian.org
[11:03] <Laney> try irc.oftc.net
[11:12] <FJKong_> Laney: found the reason, Great f*re w*ll block it
[11:17] <Laney> FJKong_: no chinese gimpnet servers?
[11:17] <Laney> try tor, if that works for you
[11:21] <desrt> now for something nice about GDBus: if you structure your program in a nice way, you can avoid ever having to call g_bus_get()
[11:41] <flexiondotorg> Laney, any chance you can take a look at the debdiffs I've added to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/1576424
[11:41] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1576424 in gtk+2.0 (Ubuntu) "Gimp crashes with text tool & caps lock" [High,In progress]
[11:48] <flexiondotorg> Laney if you're insterested in testing the fixes for scrolled windows in update-manager and aptdaemon, you can use Yakkety.
[11:49] <flexiondotorg> Enable yakkety-proposed to get the patched update-manager.
[11:49] <flexiondotorg> Patch aptdaemon is in this PPA - https://launchpad.net/~flexiondotorg/+archive/ubuntu/sru
[11:50] <flexiondotorg> I've just tested on a clean install, all seems good to me.
[11:50] <flexiondotorg> Also in that PPA is a patch Deja Dup, also working fine.
[11:50] <flexiondotorg> Just going to submit the merge proposal for that.
[11:53] <desrt> i take it back: there is a small detail in the way subtrees are implemented that solves the security issue.  nice.
[11:53] <desrt> returning NULL vs. returning an empty array has two different meanings.
[11:56] <Laney> flexiondotorg: k, will look
[11:56] <Laney> desrt: having fun?
[11:56] <desrt> yup.
[11:57] <desrt> things are starting to come together in a nice and completely half-baked way
[11:57] <desrt> the proxy will work first for flatpak, but not securely (since their dbus filtering is primitive) and not at all for snaps (since the apparmor patches are still missing)
[11:58] <desrt> but at least it will be enough to convince the security team that the apparmor patches are really the only thing standing in the way
[12:47] <flexiondotorg> willcooke, Laney I'm off the to the hospital. Back a bit later...
[12:47] <Laney> gl
[12:49] <willcooke> flexiondotorg, tata
[12:49] <flexiondotorg> Laney, bug updated and MP submitted for deja-dup - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deja-dup/+bug/1623835
[12:49] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1623835 in deja-dup (Ubuntu) "Scrolled Windows in backup/restore progress are too small to read" [Low,In progress]
[12:51]  * davmor2 hugs flexiondotorg
[12:52] <davmor2> it's only a minor issue but it is so annoying :)
[14:21] <andyrock> good afternoon
[14:35] <seb128> good afternoon desktopers
[14:43]  * Laney nods seb128
[14:43] <seb128> hey Laney ;-)
[14:44] <Laney> home still there?
[14:56]  * flexiondotorg returns
[14:56] <Laney> seb128: want to play a fun game of "archive admin"? :-)
[14:56]  * Laney nods flexiondotorg
[14:56] <Laney> are you healed?
[14:57] <Laney> & that you survived the NHS death panel
[14:57] <flexiondotorg> Laney, nope but I have been given the magic healing potions.
[14:57] <Laney> & hope
[14:57] <Laney> *
[14:57]  * Laney IRC bad
[14:57] <Laney> http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Phoenix_Down
[14:58] <seb128> Laney, what do you want to do the archive now? ;-)
[14:58] <Laney> seb128: I want to get http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#ldc to migrate
[14:59] <Laney> needs some arch removals
[14:59] <Laney> ximion will be happy, he's been nagging me for ages
[14:59]  * Laney rebootstrapped it yesterday
[15:08] <attente> don't understand why my test is so flaky :(
[15:10] <ogra_> attente, donald trump ...
[15:11] <attente> make testing flake again
[15:13] <seb128> Laney, just removing the ldc binaries from zesty release pocket on ppc and ppc64el?
[15:22] <Laney> seb128: checking for rdeps, second
[15:22] <Laney> got distracted...
[15:22]  * Laney coughs
[15:22] <seb128> Laney, k, I was about to delete those, but good idea to check those ;-)
[15:27] <seb128> need to go for some small errands, deleting those once I'm back
[15:29] <Laney> seb128: I think it's ldc (all arch-specific binaries) powerpc + ppc64el and libmustache-d-dev ppc64el
[15:46] <attente> kenvandine: hi, i'm running into some problems with content-hub's testing framework and i'm not sure what to do
[15:50] <attente> kenvandine: http://paste.debian.net/plain/894344 with this diff on current trunk i get: https://paste.debian.net/plain/894345
[15:51] <attente> the duplicate test fails sometimes but i can't tell why. there doesn't seem to be any missing teardown from what i can tell
[15:59] <kenvandine> attente, any other output from the test?
[16:00] <kenvandine> attente, try commenting out the handler test
[16:03] <kenvandine> attente, i'm wondering why this is in the log
[16:03] <kenvandine> Activating service name='com.ubuntu.content.dbus.Service'
[16:03] <kenvandine> shouldn't be activating that during the tests
[16:03] <kenvandine> and isn't for me
[16:06] <attente> yeah... i am very confused
[16:06] <attente> also, realized i forgot to set the CONTENT_HUB_TESTING variable for the second test, but that didn't affect the outcome
[16:12] <kenvandine> attente, this is a local build right?
[16:13] <attente> kenvandine: yes. i wonder if maybe my ccache is configured wrong or something
[16:13] <attente> going to try again making sure everything is clean
[16:14] <kenvandine> attente, ok
[16:18] <kenvandine> attente, it passes locally for me in your branch
[16:18] <kenvandine> the qml test fails... which shouldn't be related to your branch
[16:18] <kenvandine> oh... i don't have your new test :)
[16:20] <attente> kenvandine: yeah the new test is supposed to match what you're already doing for the other ones instead of dbus activating the installed service
[17:04] <Laney> flexiondotorg: http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/small.png <- still small
[17:04] <Laney> I added your SRU PPA, dist-upgraded and then rebooted
[17:05] <flexiondotorg> Laney, OK. Does the VTE size increase as output is displayed?
[17:06] <Laney> Nope
[17:06] <flexiondotorg> Hmm, well I'm not seeing that here :-/
[17:07] <flexiondotorg> If I expand the details during the download the vte behaves correctly.
[17:07] <flexiondotorg> I'll setup a complete clean VM, rather than from my snapshot and test again.
[17:10] <Laney> flexiondotorg: the ./gtk3-demo in src:aptdaemon works
[17:10] <Laney> (I copied it out of the source tree so that it used the system's aptdaemon)
[17:23] <attente> kenvandine: when you have time, could you please upload the content-hub-glib branch again to the silo and see if the tests run? i'm having a hard time getting any of them to run on my machine since i upgraded, even locally outside of sbuild
[17:23] <kenvandine> attente, sure, so you've pushed your changes?
[17:24] <attente> kenvandine: yes
[17:25] <kenvandine> attente, done
[17:25] <attente> kenvandine: thanks!
[17:46] <seb128> hum, irc timeouted it seems
[17:46] <seb128> Laney, did you get my msg asking for the confirmation of the binaries to delete?
[17:47] <Laney> no
[17:48] <seb128> bah
[17:49] <Laney> :(
[17:50] <seb128> anyway
[17:51] <seb128> Laney, "ldc libphobos2-ldc-debug68 libphobos2-ldc-dev libphobos2-ldc68" on power/ppc64el and libmustache-d-dev on ppc64el?
[17:53] <Laney> seb128: looks right to me
[17:53] <Laney> thanks!
[17:53] <seb128> k, done
[17:53] <seb128> yw!
[17:53] <seb128> let's see how that works out
[17:59]  * willcooke -> dinner -> bed
[17:59] <willcooke> l8r all
[18:13] <Laney> nighty night
[18:18] <seb128> night Laney
[19:52] <flexiondotorg> Night.
[19:56] <qengho> o/
[23:59] <FJKong> morning desktop