[06:47] <tsimonq2> JustAnotherIdiot<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[06:47] <tsimonq2> ircname  : googolplexking
[06:47] <tsimonq2> he was once in #ubuntu-us-wi and in #wilug (Wisconsin LUG channel)
[06:47] <tsimonq2> he's a teoll
[06:47] <tsimonq2> *troll
[06:48] <Flannel> At least he can spell googolplex correctly.
[06:48] <tsimonq2> I remembered the name Donald-Trump
[06:48] <tsimonq2> here's from #lubuntu:
[06:48] <tsimonq2> 01:45:01 AM < Donald-Trump> I updated my computer and now I'm getting really shitty ping to my wifi router with 19% packet loss. I even rebooted the router
[06:48] <tsimonq2> 01:45:04 AM -!- Donald-Trump is now known as JustAnotherIdiot
[06:48] <tsimonq2> 01:45:37 AM < JustAnotherIdiot> well now it's working
[06:48] <tsimonq2> 01:46:17 AM < tsimonq2> !language | JustAnotherIdiot
[06:48] <tsimonq2> 01:46:17 AM < ubottu> JustAnotherIdiot: The main Ubuntu channels require that you speak in calm, polite English. For other languages, please visit  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList
[06:49] <tsimonq2> as you can see from my timestamps, it's late, I'm up late working on something, so I'll exit IRC, finish that, and go to sleep
[06:49] <tsimonq2> but I just thought I should raise this here :)
[06:49] <tsimonq2> (to keep an eye out)
[06:49] <tsimonq2> o/ all
[13:07] <k1l> !text
[13:07] <k1l> slip309> just for the record: sudo systemctl set-default multi-user.target gets systemd pointed to the text console
[13:07] <k1l> text doesnt work with systemd anymore


[16:37] <jeffrash> The job is located in Charlotte, NC with one of our Fortune 500 direct client. They are looking for a Java Software Developer (Ubuntu) and the following is a more detailed description of the job.
[18:06] <jeffrash> Anyone here a JAVA developer that's looking for work?
[18:39] <BugeyeD> i'm a java drinker ...


[01:56] <quackgyver> Hi. I just installed Lubuntu and already I'm having problems. :-/
[01:56] <quackgyver> How do I scan for nearby WIFI networks?
[01:57] <rosemball> don't you have an wifi icon near the clock?
[01:57] <rosemball> otherwise, post a screenshot of your desktop into an image site and post the link here
[01:58] <ianorlin>  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Networking
[01:58] <quackgyver> I do, but it doens't show a list of networks. It only gives me the following options: Ethernet Network (grayed), disconnected (grayed), VPN Connections (submenu), Enable Networking (checked checkbox), linebreak, Information (grayed), Edit (brings up a manual connection creation wizard)
[01:58] <quackgyver> Frankly, the menu makes no sense.
[01:59] <quackgyver> rosemball: Can't post a screenshot since it doesn't have any networking, unfortunately. :-/ But I think the list of options should suffice.
[01:59] <ianorlin> what kind of card?
[01:59] <rosemball> okay
[01:59] <quackgyver> Built-in wifi laptop card. Haven't had any problems getting it to work on Ubuntu.
[01:59] <rosemball> lspci and post the output in some pastebin
[01:59] <rosemball> also, which ubuntu version was it working
[01:59] <quackgyver> In fact, it worked just fine in Ubuntu before I installed Lubuntu.
[01:59] <rosemball> and which lubuntu version are you trying
[02:00] <quackgyver> 12.04 (I think?). Now I'm using 13.-something. Can't remember which version is the latest one.
[02:00] <quackgyver> Downloaded it today. 32-bit.
[02:00] <quackgyver> 12.04 = Ubuntu. 13.XX = Lubuntu.
[02:00] <quackgyver> Will try lspci, one sec.
[02:02] <quackgyver> rosemball: lspci outputs Broadcom Corporation BCM4311 802.11b/g WLAN (rev 01)
[02:02] <quackgyver> as network controller
[02:02] <quackgyver> So I take it that my experience isn't typical for lubuntu?
[02:03] <quackgyver> or is lubuntu just bad at UX and network management?
[02:04] <phillw> quackgyver: broadcom WiFi is never a lot of fun with linux.
[02:04] <quackgyver> Well, it worked perfectly fine with Ubuntu :-/
[02:04] <quackgyver> So I figured it would in Lubuntu
[02:05] <quackgyver> But
[02:05] <quackgyver> http://ubuntuforums.org/picture.php?albumid=2432&pictureid=8204
[02:05] <quackgyver> Looking at this, I can def. say that my popup menu looks messed u
[02:05] <quackgyver> up*
[02:05] <quackgyver> my menu doesn't make any sense
[02:05] <quackgyver> Ethernet Network / disconnected / VPN Connections > / Enable Networking / Information / Exit
[02:05] <quackgyver> And the first two options are grayed, as well as "Information".
[02:05] <quackgyver> Not very clear. :-/
[02:06] <Unit193> !bcm
[02:08] <quackgyver> Ugh :-/
[02:08] <quackgyver> Aight, well, really appreciate all of you taking the time but I think imma drop Lubuntu.
[02:08] <Unit193> I've not had a lot of problem with mine.
[02:08] <quackgyver> But thanks a lot anyway. Appreciate it.
[02:09] <rosemball> try xubuntu if you want something lighter than ubuntu
[02:09] <rosemball> and a little more robust than lubuntu
[02:09] <rosemball> and lastly, try running 'jockey' from the command line
[02:10] <phillw> quackgyver: If you find ubuntu 13.04 (and 13.10) work, and lubuntu does not, please do let us know. WiFi should be the same across all flavours, but there is always a chance that a file needed is missing from the manifest.
[02:11] <phillw> quackgyver: http://askubuntu.com/questions/315245/broadcom-bcm4311-wireless-not-recognized-in-usb-live-install-of-13-10-on-dell-64 shows that ubuntu 13.10 and ubuntu are still not getting along. This is down to the fact broadcom do not hav ean open source driver for their wifi chips... Of that decision, we can do nothing.
[03:06] <qingluo> hi all, i have build a mini root file system with busybox. i have a problem with starting a shell for serial port.my uboot args is:bootargs console=tty0 root=/dev/mmcblk0p6 init=/linuxrc rootwait the linuxrc file call init(exec /sbin/init), which will parser /etc/init.d/inittab,in inittab. i added mxc0:2345:respawn:/sbin/getty ttys0 115200 vt100. but i still cannot serial port shell.
[06:01] <qingluo>  hi all, how to enable a shell for serial port
[10:00] <leszek> hi
[10:46] <speckmade> ist it still true that my lubuntu (13.04) doesn't use PulseAudio?
[10:46] <bioterror> is it running?
[10:46] <speckmade> ha - could have thought of that myself... :-)
[10:47] <leszek> :)
[10:47] <speckmade> seems like.
[10:47] <speckmade> so the wiki is wrong.
[10:50] <speckmade> "[tested with ... Ubuntu 12.04]" - could've seen that already.
[10:50] <speckmade> I'm not yet fully awake, it seems.
[11:53] <jellow> Hi there dialogues keep popping up telling me pcmanfm has crashed at startup , does it log to any files ? I want to find out why it is crashing.
[14:25] <Wednesday> what is the terminal command to execute the logout menu
[14:28] <Wednesday> nvm, found it
[15:38] <leszek> h
[15:38] <leszek> i
[16:53] <Monday> please add a keyboard shortcuts GUI in the next version, that is like a basic app
[17:00] <leszek> Monday: I am afraid that is not possible for 13.10
[17:02] <leszek> also there seems to be no gui yet for openbox shortcuts
[19:38] <bobobobo> hey guys....how do I boost the headphones?  I have green speaker line going to monitor for speakers....but can barely hear.  I read something about pulseaudio, but that doesn't seem to even be installed.
[19:39] <bobobobo> all sounds are at max that I can set  :)
[19:39] <bobobobo> is it alsa?
[19:40] <bioterror> yes, alsa
[19:42] <Unit193> You could always install pulseaudio (and pavucontrol), just they aren't by default.
[19:42] <Unit193> alsamixer is what we use for levels, but seems you already found it?
[19:42] <bobobobo> I am on alsamixer and they are all at 100...not sure what to do next
[19:42] <bobobobo> I
[19:43] <bobobobo> I've had this monitor on windows and mac laptop and sound was fine.....hrmmmmm
[19:43] <Unit193> So try pavucontrol.
[19:44] <bioterror> with VLC you can go beyond 100% :D
[19:44] <Unit193> 200% in the UI, and 400% with scroll wheel! :D
[19:44] <bobobobo> LOL
[19:44] <bobobobo> k, will try....told I need to restart....fun ;)
[19:48] <bobobobobo> k, restart didn't help, pavucontrol still says Fatal Error: Unable to connect to PulseAudio: Ok
[19:48] <bobobobobo> :(
[19:50] <bobobobobo> of course it can't connect pulseaudio is not even installed
[19:51] <Unit193> ...Yeah, stupid depends with pavucontrol, should have them in there...
[19:51] <bobobobobo> should I install or will that dork alsa up good too :)
[19:52] <Unit193> If it screws with stuff, purge it again.
[21:35] <Csabi33669> hi,i want to set up my default file browser back to pc man,so my problem is example when i click on dropxbux submenu "open dropbox location" it will open in the firefox. so can anybody tell me what should i change in /usr/share/application=defaults.list?


[01:43] <poolie> bug search on launchpad itself seems to be fairly consistently timing out
[01:43] <poolie> but not always
[01:43] <poolie> sorry i refeshed before getting the oops
[01:51] <spiv> I sometimes wish I had a firefox extension that remembered the last 5 OOPSes I'd seen.
[01:52] <spiv> I want to refresh with impunity (to get my work done) *and* take a peek at the OOPS report later to satisfy my curiosity about what broke.
[01:52] <spiv> (Well, by "sometimes" I mean "thought of that just now")
[01:57] <lifeless> poolie: probably yes, search timeouts are sneaking back up the charts
[01:59] <wgrant> lifeless, poolie: But there were only two Product:+bugs timeouts yesterday..
[01:59] <lifeless> tag based searches will be problematic still
[03:36] <poolie> spiv, i was just wondering the other day about doing it on the server side
[03:44] <head_victim> I'm getting a few timeouts on translations just now as well
[03:45] <head_victim> Nothing a few refreshes doesn't fix
[03:49] <spiv> poolie: but what if the OOPS-tracker OOPSes? :)
[04:19] <poolie> thanks bot
[07:39] <bryceh> and of course, what if ubot5 oopses?
[07:39] <bryceh> bah
[08:20] <wgrant> ToyKeeper: Thanks.
[08:22] <ToyKeeper> Fun issue...  resulted in 1 support ticket, 2 internal tickets, and 2 bugs.  :)
[08:22] <wgrant> Yup
[09:14] <jml> I clicked "Build now" on https://code.launchpad.net/~testing-cabal/+recipe/testtools-daily and get what looks to be a JS alert saying "Server error, please contact an administrator"
[09:19] <StevenK> jml: It built the recipe successfully 48 seconds ago?
[09:20] <StevenK> For Lucid at least
[09:20] <jml> StevenK: yeah. doesn't change the fact that I got an error message and was told to consult an administrator.
[09:20] <StevenK> Can haz screenshot?
[09:21] <wgrant> jml: There was no OOPS ID?
[09:22] <jml> wgrant, StevenK: http://people.canonical.com/~jml/recipe-build-now-consult-admin.png
[09:22] <StevenK> And it's *alert* ? WTF?
[09:22] <jml> StevenK: that's what I said.
[09:25] <StevenK> Right, it returned something >= 500
[09:25] <StevenK> (From lib/lp/app/javascript/client.js)
[09:25] <wgrant> Without an OOPS ID.
[09:25] <StevenK> Yes
[09:25] <wgrant> And webapp requests return OOPS IDs as of yesterday.
[09:25] <wgrant> So it probably didn't OOPS.
[09:26] <StevenK> So it what, ISE'd instead? That's better? :-/
[09:30] <jml> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/812783
[09:31] <wgrant> From what I can see in the trace logs, it returned a 500.
[09:31] <wgrant> Which should have been an OOPS.
[09:32] <wgrant> Indeed, it wasn an OOPS.
[09:32] <wgrant> was an OOPS.
[09:32] <wgrant> jml: The recipe is still trying to build against Karmic.
[09:32] <StevenK> Ah ha!
[09:33] <StevenK> And that throws an exception
[09:33] <jml> wgrant: oh. that kind of sucks.
[09:33] <wgrant> BuildNotAllowedForDistro: A build against this distro is not allowed.
[09:33] <wgrant> That's a lie, of course: the series is the problem.
[09:33] <StevenK> Right
[09:33] <wgrant> And it doesn't describe which series it is or why it's a problem.
[09:33] <jml> ... and it doesn't give the user enough information to report back.
[09:33] <wgrant> Sure.
[09:33] <jml> btw, I'm not a member of the same teams that you are
[09:34] <wgrant> I know, or I would have asked you to get the OOPS ID from the ajax log.
[09:34] <wgrant> I grepped around in OOPSes and appserver traces.
[09:34] <mantiena> wgrant: Hi, could you tell me is it launchpad recipe building bug or not? https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/165193
[09:35] <wgrant> mantiena: Have you tried bzr-builder locally?
[09:35] <wgrant> Ah, yes.
[09:36] <wgrant> I can't look right now, as I need to make dinner. See if henninge can help, otherwise I will have a look in a few hours.
[09:37] <mantiena> Yes, I've tried, but local bzr-builder doesn't like version number # bzr-builder format 0.3 deb-version {debupstream}{date}-0-{revno:packaging}
[09:37] <mantiena> local bzr builder works only when I specify version number without variables, like # bzr-builder format 0.3 deb-version 1.8
[09:37] <mantiena> please answer there: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/165193
[09:37] <mantiena> I've unstable internet connection and often lost messages and get disconnected from IRC :(
[09:39] <mantiena> wgrant: several hours ago I've changed original https://code.launchpad.net/~baltix/+recipe/irrlicht-svn  recipe to build from my personal irrrlicht branch, which actually is the same lp:~stk/stk/irrlicht branch, but with patched Makefile and without quilt patches in debian/patches
[09:41] <mantiena> wgrant: henninge yesterday told me, that only you can help me with this recipe building problem. It would be nice to know if I can use original lp:~stk/stk/irrlicht branch and make quilt patches in debian/patches ir my separate packaging branch or I should use another technology with launchpad recipes
[09:42]  * wgrant doesn't know very much about recipes.
[09:43] <mantiena> wgrant: then who knows?
[09:43] <wgrant> That is a very good question.
[09:47] <mantiena> wgrant: If I don't answer you then please write there: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/165193
[09:47] <mantiena> I've *very* unstable internet connection and often lose messages and get disconnected from IRC :(
[09:47] <mantiena> I don't know if you see all the messages I've wrote to IRC and vice verse :)
[09:50] <bigjools> mantiena: see if you can find jelmer on #bzr, he might be able to help
[09:50] <poolie> mantiena: hi there , i see it
[09:51] <mantiena> bigjools: thanks
[09:51] <poolie> i would guess it hhs to do with patches being committed applied when they shouldn't be
[09:51] <mantiena> poolie: sorry, I don't understand what you see :(
[09:52] <poolie> i see your question
[09:52] <poolie> i don't know a fix off hand
[09:53] <mantiena> hi jelmer
[09:54] <jelmer> hi mantiena
[09:54] <mantiena> jelmer: bigjools told me, that you can help with this launchpad recipe bug: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/165193
[09:55] <jelmer> mantiena: I think Riddell was just looking at answering that one
[09:56] <mantiena> jelmer: Riddel will write answer at https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/165193 ?
[09:56] <jelmer> mantiena: I think so
[09:59] <mantiena> jelmer: ok, I just restored original recipe which cause problem, described https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/165193
[09:59] <jelmer> mantiena: what bzr-builder version are you running locally?
[10:00] <mantiena> jelmer:  dpkg -s bzr-builder |grep Ver
[10:00] <mantiena> Version: 0.6+bzr139+0.0ubuntu51~lucid1
[10:01] <jelmer> mantiena: does "debian/rules clean" perhaps touch one of the files?
[10:02] <mantiena> jelmer: which files?
[10:03] <jelmer> mantiena: the files involved in the quilt patches
[10:06] <mantiena> jelmer: AFAIK debian/rules clean doesn't touch any files in debian/patches - debian/rules clean section has only few lines:
[10:06] <mantiena>  unpatch
[10:06] <mantiena>  dh_testdir
[10:06] <mantiena>  dh_testroot
[10:06] <mantiena>  rm -rf html
[10:06] <mantiena>  $(MAKE) -C source/Irrlicht clean
[10:06] <mantiena>  dh_clean
[10:06] <wgrant> Erm, unpatch?
[10:07] <wgrant> bzr-builder/3.0 (quilt) do that for you.
[10:07] <jelmer> mantiena: yeah, unpatch is most likely the culprit
[10:08] <mantiena> wgrant: I just copied debian folder from original debian irrlicht package :)
[10:11] <mantiena> jelmer: btw, when I uploaded patched sources (with already appled quilt patches, then launchpad recipe failed too, but with very strange error, see https://launchpadlibrarian.net/75436123/buildlog.txt.gz
[10:11] <mantiena> Retrieving 'lp:~baltix/+junk/irrlicht-test' to put at '/home/buildd/build-e448bd6a152da0c689ba50a12f130f389b95c050/chroot-autobuild/home/buildd/work/tree/recipe-{debupstream}20110718-0~{revno}'.
[10:11] <mantiena> Applying quilt patches
[10:11] <mantiena> File series fully applied, ends at patch debian/link-against-needed-libs.diff
[10:11] <mantiena> bzr: ERROR: Failed to apply quilt patches
[10:14] <jelmer> mantiena: that is a known issue with the bzr-builder currently deployed on launchpad
[10:14] <jelmer> it will fail if there are some patches that are not in the series file
[10:15] <mantiena> jelmer: there was only one patch, which was in the series file :) I've found one bugreport, which was fixed about a month ago, wait a minute
[10:17] <mantiena> jelmer:  https://launchpadlibrarian.net/75436123/buildlog.txt.gz is because of this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/727299 ???
[10:18] <jelmer> mantiena:right, that was the bug I had in mind too
[10:54] <mantiena> Maybe someone knows when newly created import branch https://code.launchpad.net/~stk/stk/1.7.2 will be ready for use (code will be imported from SVN) ?
[11:04] <mantiena> Can you speed-up the import of newly created import branch https://code.launchpad.net/~stk/stk/1.7.2 ?
[11:13] <spiv> mantiena: I've approved the import, it's started now
[11:13] <spiv> mantiena: you can monitor the progress at https://code.launchpad.net/~stk/stk/0.7.2
[11:21] <mantiena> spiv: thank you very much. Btw, should we remove old 0.7.2 branch from launchpad ASAP or you have enouch gigabytes ?
[11:27] <nigelb> oh yay, is loggerhead down?
[11:33] <wgrant> nigelb: Works for me.
[11:33] <dpm> hi henninge, could you give me a hand with https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/165307 ?
[11:35] <marvin2> Hi, I have a local version of the branch lp:original-code; I need the some specific changes made to a fork of that branch located at lp:forked-code. What is the most efficient way for me to incorporate those specific changes to my local bzr repo?
[11:37] <wgrant> In your local branch of lp:original-code, just 'bzr merge lp:forked-code'
[11:38] <wgrant> Or do you just want a subset of the changes in lp:forked-code?
[11:39] <nigelb> wgrant: yeah, refresh worked.
[11:40] <henninge> dpm: I don't see an obvious answer to that question.
[11:41] <henninge> dpm: some are shared and some aren't, so we'd have to look at what is different with those
[11:41] <dpm> henninge, where do you see that some are shared?
[11:41] <henninge> dpm: well, at least they have the same translation on both sides.
[11:42] <marvin2> wgrant: Yeah, just a subset of the changes in lp:forked-code.
[11:42] <henninge> dpm: the second one (Ne_xt) here: https://translations.launchpad.net/checkbox/trunk/+pots/checkbox/sl/+translate
[11:42] <henninge> dpm: but I was just heading out. As I said, not a quick solution.
[11:43] <marvin2> wgrant: I'd like to stick to lp:original-code, while incorporating changes from lp:forked-code(s) from time to time. I know I'll have to handle merges from lp:original-code.
[11:43] <henninge> dpm: I think somebody needs to take some time and look at the whole sharing issue, fix known bugs and see if there are more hidden.
[11:44] <dpm> henninge, ok, but don't you think the ones not shared it's just because they've not been marked to be shared somehow? I tried to export Ubuntu translations and import them upstream, as you guys told me some days ago to do as a workaround, but that did not work, since only the template, but not the translations were imported from the tarball. Could that be the real problem?
[11:44] <henninge> oh right, forgot that
[11:44] <henninge> dpm: the translations are in the queue
[11:45] <dpm> henninge, oh, then perhaps it's not an issue at all, so they are just waiting to get imported?
[11:46] <henninge> dpm: I just approved the template an hour ago, so the approver has probably not picked up on the translations yet.
[11:46] <henninge> dpm: why is tere a second template in the project?
[11:47] <henninge> dpm: nm, I have to run. Yeah, you should wait for these to get imported and see what's going on then.
[11:47] <henninge> adeuring: your turn ;-)
[11:47] <dpm> henninge, I don't know, I think the developers put some of the translations exported from their test templates (not pot templates) in a separate POT template
[11:48] <dpm> but shouldn't have to do anything with this, I think
[11:49] <henninge> dpm: yeah, I don't think either. Let's wait.
[12:08] <adeuring> henninge-lunch: ok
[12:41] <rye> hello, people, is it possible to force unsubscribe the user from a bug report, his e-mail autoresponder is extremely eager to talk to launchpad notification service, bug #564596
[12:41] <rye> well, the bug is private
[12:42] <fagan> Hey, when someone has an auto responder on their mail and it bounces back and forth too much what does lp do?
[12:43] <fagan> It seems like the bug got deleted but I thought id ask
[12:43]  * fagan always seems to have weird questions for this channel
[12:45] <rye> fagan, last notification sent was at July 19, 2011 3:21 - 20 minutes ago
[12:46] <rye> if one more comes in then we'll be flooding the bug reporting until... august 7
[12:46] <fagan> rye: yeah thats right
[12:48] <rye> fagan, yeah, annother one @ Tuesday, July 19, 2011 3:36 PM
[12:48] <fagan> rye: yeah so just now
[12:49] <fagan> Really annoying auto reponders are so dumb
[12:51] <fagan> Oh it doesnt delete the page I just opened the page in chrome and wasnt logged in
[12:52] <fagan> Ok lp people could you remove the reporter of this bug from the subscription thing please https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/564596
[12:52] <rye> fagan, well, it should set flag to not send message to Precedence: bulk and Precedence: list
[12:52] <rye> fagan, i have already asked this, nobody from lp team is here apparently
[12:52] <fagan> ah ok
[12:52] <wgrant> I only see one reply there.
[12:53] <fagan> wgrant: well its spamming the email I dont really know why there isnt a reply
[12:53] <wgrant> Oh.
[12:53] <wgrant> It's the dedupe logic.
[12:54] <wgrant> adeuring: Hi.
[12:54] <adeuring> wgrant: yes?
[12:54] <wgrant> adeuring: Could you follow up on the above?
[12:54] <fagan> wgrant: if there is dedupe logic could we stop the emails from being sent out too?
[12:54] <wgrant> I suspect we should suspend the user and email them.
[12:54]  * adeuring starts reading..
[12:54] <wgrant> But it is late here.
[12:55]  * fagan hates infinite loops :)
[12:56] <adeuring> fagan: could you give me again the bug number? 564594 seems to be wrong
[12:56] <wgrant> Ah, of course, you can't see it.
[12:56] <wgrant> The user is dmkaplan
[12:56] <fagan> adeuring: its private
[12:57] <adeuring> fagan: ah... can you subscribe me?
[12:57] <fagan> is adeuring your lp nick?
[12:57] <adeuring> fagan: yes.
[12:57] <fagan> adeuring: done
[12:58] <adeuring> thanks!
[13:01] <Phoenix87> hallo
[13:02] <Phoenix87> i'm seeking developers for a couple of projects. Is this the right place to ask for?
[13:04] <benji> Phoenix87: not really.  What kinds of projects are they?  Maybe you'll get lucky and find someone here or we can point you to a place where those types hang out.
[13:05] <Phoenix87> https://launchpad.net/pygtkplot
[13:06] <Phoenix87> https://launchpad.net/gistiller
[13:06] <adeuring> fagan: fixed
[13:07] <rye> adeuring, thanks!
[13:07] <adeuring> thanks to gnuoy!
[13:07] <fagan> adeuring: thanks :)
[13:08] <Phoenix87> benji, any suggestions for good places where to ask?
[13:09] <benji> for pyGtkPlot I wonder if there is a scientific python SIG or similar; the python list would also be good for either I would think
[13:09] <benji> if you haven't announced them you could also do that on python-announce and include a blurb asking for contributors
[13:09] <benji> there's always #python too
[13:12] <Phoenix87> python-announce?
[13:12] <benji> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-announce-list
[13:15] <Phoenix87> benji, thank you :D
[15:34] <deryck> adeuring, hey, I'll take IRC now.
[15:34] <adeuring> deryck: cool, thanks!
[15:36] <deryck> adeuring, I meant to take it at the top of the hour.  Sorry.
[16:58] <gustoneg1o> launchpad uses openID, right?
[16:58] <deryck> gustoneg1o, we're a provider not a consumer.
[16:59] <gustoneg1o> deryck: hmm, does that mean my openID that I use for lp will not work elsewhere?
[16:59] <deryck> gustoneg1o, no, you're lp open id will work elsewhere.  You can't log into lp with another open id.
[17:01] <gustoneg1o> deryck: thanks.  I'm just trying it out for the first time...seems the other site I'm trying to log into is broken then.
[20:30] <dupondje> Do some people have permissions to remove comments from a bug?
[20:31] <dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/+bug/326555 => See last comment For Example
[20:32] <micahg> dupondje: I'd suggest filing a questions against launchpad
[20:32] <deryck> dupondje, I can hide it if it's spam.  let me look.
[20:34] <deryck> dupondje, I hid the comment
[20:39] <dupondje> thx


[01:17] <Gralco_> bdmurray if you confirm a bug do you assign the bug to no one or should you keep the bug assigned to yourself?
[01:18] <bdmurray> Gralco_: bugs should only be assigned to people when they are In Progress really
[01:19] <greg-g> adding more: assignment is used mainly to show who is working on FIXING the bug, not diagnosing/triaging it
[01:19] <bdmurray> greg-g: hey, how's it going?
[01:19] <Gralco_> bdmurray what will usually happen to a bug after it is confirmed then?
[01:19] <hggdh_> Gralco if you are done with the bug (i.e., confirmed/triaged it, set owner to nobody
[01:19] <hggdh_> the maintainers will eventually look at it
[01:19] <Gralco_> once i unassign it
[01:20] <bdmurray> Or a member of bug control may set it to Triaged
[01:20] <Gralco_> who fixes the bug
[01:21] <hggdh_> it may need forwarding upstream -- in this case upstream will fix it
[01:21] <greg-g> bdmurray: hiya, it is going well, really busy with my internship :) (hence not responding to that email from pedro yet ;) )
[01:21] <hggdh_> or, if it is something under our control, one of the maintainers will fix it (or even you, if you know what to do)
[01:22] <greg-g> bdmurray: how have things been with you?
[01:23] <bdmurray> greg-g: good, working on some exciting stuff
[01:23] <greg-g> bdmurray: was that a question or a statement? :)
[01:24] <bdmurray> That was a statement.
[01:24] <greg-g> because, for me, yes, I am working on some pretty cool stuff.  But, I have also notice some cool/good changes coming from QA
[01:24] <greg-g> s/notice/noticed/
[01:27] <bdmurray> How do you like the west coast?
[01:32] <greg-g> I like it, I'm getting used the crazy weather here in the bay area (it was 100 degrees in Oakland last weekend, and now it is in the 60s).  And, hearing people say that highs in the 60s is like winter weather.
[01:33] <bdmurray> Right not much snow in that area.
[01:33] <greg-g> But, having a great time doing my intern duties; met with some people at Apple yesterday, specifically their Open Source person (kinda like Chris DiBona at Google) (and yes, Apple does have one, honest)
[01:33] <greg-g> he is actually on the board of the Open Souce Initiative
[01:34] <greg-g> so, I've been busy, but fun busy.
[01:34] <bdmurray> That's always good.
[01:34] <greg-g> yeah
[01:38] <Gralco_> where do i find a bugs identification number
[01:39] <Gralco_> is it just the number of the bug?
[01:39] <bdmurray> Gralco_: yes, those numbers are unique
[01:40] <Gralco_> bdmurray: its the number that is in the url correct?
[01:40] <bdmurray> yes, that is correct
[01:40] <Gralco_> okay thanks
[01:42]  * greg-g heads out
[01:42]  * greg-g waves to bdmurray and everyone else
[01:46] <Gralco_> bdmurray when i apply for the bug control team do you want me to show you the bugs that i marked as duplicates for a bug that i triaged
[01:46] <Gralco_> within the application
[01:47] <bdmurray> I'd ideally like to see different types of activities.  So maybe 1 duplicate marking, 1 converting to a question, 3 conversations with reporters.
[01:48] <bdmurray> There are some guidelines at the bug control page as to what I look for.
[01:51] <Gralco_> bdmurray: What do you mean by converting to a question?
[02:00] <hggdh> Gralco_, its when you find a bug that is actually a question, an usage issue, not a package problem
[02:03] <Gralco_> hggdh: Yeah, I just saw it it under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToTriage Special types of bugs.
[02:04] <Gralco_> hggdh: I just don't know whats required of me with triaging them
[02:05] <hggdh> Gralco_, basically: reading the bug description, and checking if (1) you understand the issue; (2) if all necessary data is available; (3) asking for clarification or more specific data, if needed
[02:06] <hggdh> you may not understand what the bug is about -- do not get stressed over it. Leave it alone, and go find another. If you do not know what to do, but would like to learn, you can add yourself as a subscriber
[02:07] <Gralco_> okay
[02:07] <Gralco_> is there a wiki for triaging these
[02:08] <hggdh> it is just using common sense, and reading the wiki pages on how to triage specific packages (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProcedures)
[02:08] <hggdh> and -- of course -- learning ;-)
[02:09] <hggdh> Gralco_, you may feel more confortable, to start, if you find a package you like; then work on bugs for either only, or mostly, this package
[02:11] <hggdh> Gralco_, yes, the HowToTriage is a good introduction to what we do. A priori, I would suggest you to *not* work on the "special" bugs, until you understand what they are about
[02:13] <Gralco_> hggdh: Okay I understand how to triage all other bugs though.
[02:15] <hggdh> cool. The "special" ones are dealt directly by package maintainers (or some of us with a LOT of experience on what they mean). They pretty much deal with packaging
[02:20] <hggdh> Gralco_, one most important point is the difference between package bugs and support issues (which need to be re-routed to https://answers.launchpad.net/ and/or to #ubuntu. For example, "I cannot connect to my email server" is almost certainly a support issue, not a package issue
[02:20] <hggdh> so -->> off to answers.launchpad.net with it (in a nice way)
[02:21] <persia> Except in the rare case where it is because the preferred email client crashes on start, in which case the title ought be altered :)
[02:21] <hggdh> :-)
[02:22] <hggdh> I was just writing about it  -->"on the other hand, "Evolution crashes when connecting to email server" is a real bug
[02:22] <persia> hggdh: Ah.  Sorry then.  I've just seen a few bugs that look like support requests, but have attached stacktraces or the like.
[02:23] <hggdh> persia, np, I undertood you, and you were faster than I was :-)
[02:24] <hggdh> but this is still a good point: one must understand WHAT is the problem before making a decision
[02:24] <persia> Unfortunately, not all submitters understand the distinction between "this software has a defect", and "my use case doesn't work with this software as configured in my environment".  I believe this is due to the large grey area, where something could be solved as support, but may well be a case of missing or incorrect defaults, etc.
[02:25] <hggdh> indeed; this can also be applied here -- sometimes we fail to correctly distinguish them
[02:25] <persia> If we had an infinite number of bug triagers and question answerers, I'd like to have a feature "fork into a question" to handle the difference, but I think both teams have enough work now without such duplication.
[02:26] <hggdh> and we also had the fact that the reporter is free to re-open the bug
[02:26] <hggdh> Gralco_, ^^^
[02:26] <hggdh> s/had/have/
[02:26] <persia> In cases in the grey area, I think I prefer to keep it a bug, and post the workaround in the bug.  Otherwise it might never get the attention it deserves (unfortunately few developers are also question answers, whereas many are also bug triagers)
[02:26] <Gralco_> hggdh what do you mean by re-open
[02:27] <hggdh> I think this is a sane approach, persia: when in doubt keep it
[02:28] <hggdh> Gralco_, when we close a bug, for whatever reason, the reporter (or anyone, in fact) can disagree with our action, and reset the bug status to new
[02:28] <hggdh> (a bug is considered closed when it has "Invalid", "Wont fix", or "Fix released" as status
[02:30] <persia> Thinking about it, it may be useful to alter the recommended template to avoid the term "re-open", as it may cause confusion.  Instead, we could provide those disagreeing with the recommendation to return the status to "New" with an appropriate comment (to signal that new triage is required).
[02:31] <hggdh> huh, if we had an infinite number of bug triagers and question answerers, we might also get the complete works of Shakespeare ;-)
[02:31] <hggdh> bdmurray ^^
[02:31] <persia> Heh.  There is that.
[02:32] <hggdh> see persia's comment, please. I agree -- makes things more consistent
[02:32]  * hggdh must train to say "set to new" instead of "reopen"
[02:34] <hggdh> Gralco_, still. The discussion we just had here points to the fact that one MUST understand what is the issue, before deciding on s course of action
[02:36] <persia> That's the hardest part of bug triage.
[02:37] <persia> On the other hand, it can be the most rewarding.  There are few things that can be as satisfying as truly understanding a problem, understanding a solution that works, and documenting it sufficiently that it benefits all users.
[02:38] <hggdh> yes, I agree -- but then this is what I do for a living (solve problems), so I am biased...
[02:38] <persia> Even just documenting the problem can be very satisfying, if someone else then understands clearly, and can get think of a solution.
[02:39] <hggdh> and this is part of the work -- understanding the issue, and (perhaps) rephrasing it in more consistent way
[02:39] <persia> Yep.  I think that's why I like apport so much.  It provides all the puzzle pieces: with a couple hours, one can usually describe the problem.
[02:40] <hggdh> and I *never* understood why we disable apport on release...
[02:40] <persia> volume.
[02:41] <hggdh> even with the automation we are putting behind it, for duplicates?
[02:41] <persia> Essentially, we have a medium-sized team here triaging bugs, and only 10-15 people watching the new bugs in #ubuntu-bugs-announce.
[02:41] <hggdh> and we will be releasing 8.4.01 soon -- without apport set on?
[02:41] <persia> When 3 million people report a bug because of a crash in a default application, we have an issue.
[02:42] <hggdh> well, yes... if they all report at the same time, we will run out of storage, bandwidth, and bug numbers...
[02:42] <persia> When 1 of those people is sufficiently frustrated to report a bug, and is willing to run apport manually on the crash report (in GNOME, `gnome-open /var/crash/...`), this is often sufficient to prepare a fix.
[02:43] <hggdh> (on my case, I run it manually when I feel the need)
[02:46] <persia> Right.  When a user reports a non-apport crash, and the triager is able to open an apport report, verify it is complete (clean trace, etc.), and link the original report as a duplicate of the new, complete, report, we get a good bug, and we don't get lots of extra apport bugs.
[02:47] <persia> One of the classes of apport bugs that annoys me is the appoort prompt on startup, after an environmental system crash (loss of power, etc.).  The user may be told to file 5 or more bugs, when there was no actual problem other than that the system state was corrupt.
[02:47] <persia> Restricting use to volunteer testers and those who understand the tool helps reduce the invalid bug reports generated in this sort of situation.
[02:47] <persia> Of course, with an infinite number of triagers, turning it on makes sense :)
[02:52] <hggdh> and the infinite storage and bandwidth :-)
[02:53] <hggdh> sigh... just found that upstream is not going to backport to stable a fix to Evolution...
[05:45] <LaserLine> Can someone help me file a bug... I'm trying to file a bug for gnome-about-me, but it's saying the package doesn't exist in launchpad
[05:48] <crimsun_> the name of the source package is gnome-control-center
[05:49] <crimsun_> dpkg -S $(/bin/which gnome-about-me)
[05:51] <LaserLine> crimsun:  Thanks.  Hopefully I did everything correctly... it's filed here https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/243429
[06:04] <EverettgM1819> is the file tranfer problem in Pidgin 2.4.1 for the AIM client a bug?
[06:10] <EverettgM1819> Is the file tranfer problem in Pidgin 2.4.1 for the AIM client a bug?
[06:10] <EverettgM1819> Is the file tranfer problem in Pidgin 2.4.1 for the AIM client a bug?
[06:10] <EverettgM1819> Is the file tranfer problem in Pidgin 2.4.1 for the AIM client a bug?
[06:11] <EverettgM1819> oops bad key
[06:12] <persia> The answer is a firm "maybe".  You likely need to specify "the file transfer problem" in more detail, as others may not be familar with that which you are experiencing.
[06:12] <RAOF> persia: Too slow, he's gone. :(
[06:13] <persia> Such is ever the case with the new ones.  Like fresh fish, they must be hooked sharply at the first bite.
[06:14] <RAOF> But not too sharply, lest the hook simply cut through the lip.
[06:15] <persia> Right.  There's an art to it.
[06:34] <bliZZardz> persia : am getting bored now :) .. someone debug me
[06:59] <Gralco> how do i report an upstream for rhythmbox
[06:59] <bliZZardz> Gralco : create a bug there and report it in launchpad as part of the comment. Change the status to 'confirmed' (if you find that there is indeed a bug upstream)
[07:00] <techno_freak> interesting bug #243431, as far as i enquired around you can use only the space available in the source FS and the size of local FS becomes invalid
[07:01] <Gralco> where do i go to report one that i have confirmed
[07:01] <techno_freak> Gralco, check "also affects project" link  n the left
[07:01] <techno_freak> on*
[07:01] <Gralco> does that send it upstream
[07:01] <techno_freak> Gralco, you have to check upstream bugs, if you dont find a similar one, report upstream and link it here
[07:02] <Gralco> yes there are no duplicates
[07:02] <techno_freak> Gralco, then, if my knowledge is right, create a bug in upstream and link it here
[07:04] <Gralco> what is the url for upstream bug to send to rhythmbox
[07:07] <techno_freak> Gralco, think it's the GNOME bugzilla
[07:37] <Iulian> Gralco: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=rhythmbox
[14:49] <qense> persia: I'm creating a Blueprint for the Ubuntu Wanted site and to make the links to previous discussion complete I'd like to upload our conversation about it and link to it. Do you mind if I'd upload the email you sent me?
[14:57] <persia> qense: Firstly, my apologies for the delay in responding to your last message about it: I've not yet gelled a response.
[14:57] <qense> no point :) persons tend to be busy
[14:58] <persia> That said, I think it may make more sense to distill the concepts from the discussion for the wiki, rather than pointing to them as some historical document.
[14:58] <qense> ok
[14:58] <qense> I'm creating a detailed specification at the wiki anyway, so if you'd wait a few minutes you'll have something mroe to response
[14:59] <qense> and if I'd forget something you've said you can always edit the page
[14:59] <persia> qense: With luck, I'll have some time to think on this more on Sunday, so even if you find a delay, it shan't likely have significant impact.
[14:59] <qense> ok
[15:01] <qense> Sunday isn't that far away, but I don't know what shan't means :D
[15:02] <persia> Oh, and in terms of nomenclature, I think I prefer "role" to "task", in the hopes of generating repeat activity and empowering people, rather than just listing all the stuff that isn't done yet.
[15:02] <persia> Anyway, more when I'm less distracted :)
[15:02] <qense> ok
[15:02] <qense> it's indeed better, I've already been doubting what to use
[15:03] <persia> james_w: Have you confirmed that the new upstream nicotine still expresses bug #180363?  Despite my explanation of the trace, I'm not sure it's triaged.
[15:07] <persia> If nothing else, if verified, it would benefit from an updated title and description.
[15:08] <james_w> persia: ah, I forgot it was an older version
[15:10] <james_w> I've got an intrepid box upstairs, I'll try it later.
[15:14] <persia> james_w: Even confirming on Hardy has value: that was a hardy development snapshot issue.
[15:15] <persia> Also, I'm not sure it's "Medium".  It only happens for hu_HU.UTF-8, and only if python-pyvorbis (in Recommends:) is not installed.  Isn't that "Low"?
[15:16] <persia> (assuming it still happens at all)
[15:16] <james_w> oh, yeah, I forgot you had to have that package missing as well.
[15:17] <james_w> not my finest bug triage :-)
[15:18] <persia> james_w: No worries.  Leaving a testcase comment and not triaging the bug likely wasn't the best example of my work either :)
[15:57] <vhaarr> persia: http://pastey.net/90123
[15:58] <vhaarr> that's what I got when I followed https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Backtrace
[15:59] <persia> Yeah.  That's why I want an apport trace.  There's some symbols missing (I don't know why), and they are missing at the interface between audacious and the libraries, which is likely the source of the bug.
[16:00] <vhaarr> I thought apport was supposed to magically pop up when something crashed, but I'm not getting anything.
[16:00] <persia> It might be a vfs bug also, but I'd be more interested in fixing audacios, as it's probably easier to understand the problem there.
[16:00] <persia> vhaarr: It needs to be forcibly enabled to automatically pop up.
[16:02] <persia> On the other hand, by being installed, you should get something in /var/crash/ which you can open directly (e.g. apport-cli -c /var/crash/$(thiscrashreport) )
[16:02] <vhaarr> yeah it doesn't create any logs there
[16:02] <vhaarr> unless I need to reboot after installing the apport daemon
[16:02] <persia> Hmm..  I don't know enough about how apport works to direct you then: I'm more of an apport consumer.
[16:03] <vhaarr> but I don't think so
[16:08] <vhaarr> perhaps it would be an idea for me to jump on audacious' IRC channel, if they have one, and relay the bug report there
[16:08]  * vhaarr checks
[16:12] <bdmurray> apport is only enabled for development releases
[16:14] <primes2h> Hi all. Since Edgy reached end of life, can I set 2.6.17 kernel version bugs as Invalid?
[16:15] <bdmurray> primes2h: just a second let me check something
[16:16] <bdmurray> primes2h: this wiki page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20080425 has some guidelines for what to do with them
[16:16] <persia> bdmurray: Is there a way to generate an apport trace on a stable release, or is it impossible?
[16:17] <bdmurray> the 2.6.17 task should be "Won't Fixed" but we'd really like to find out what happens with Hardy if they can test or already running it
[16:18] <bdmurray> persia: yes, I'm looking for the relevant documentation
[16:18] <persia> bdmurray: Excellent news.  Thank you.
[16:18] <bdmurray> persia: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/EnableProposed
[16:19] <persia> vhaarr: That' it: `gconftool -s /apps/update-notifier/show_apport_crashes --type bool true` and set true in /etc/default/apport  You'll need to restart /etc/initi.d/apport or reboot.
[16:21] <primes2h> bdmurray: Thank you very much. Just a question, I'm using launchpad beta and 'won't fix' is not listed anymore.
[16:21] <primes2h> ?!
[16:22] <vhaarr> persia: that didn't make it generate a log or pop up a dialog either, but it seems the bug has gotten some more debug info now, and I talked to some audacious person and pasted my conversation with him in the bug as well
[16:22] <bdmurray> primes2h: Right, sorry that is an ACL'd status so using Won't Fix will be fine.
[16:22] <vhaarr> well, 'sudo /etc/init.d/apport restart' didn't make it work, I won't reboot now, leaving for work anyway
[16:22] <persia> vhaarr: Hmm.  Maybe there's something else stripping the symbol then.  Thanks for trying.
[16:22] <vhaarr> thanks for your help, I have to go :)
[16:23] <primes2h> bdmurray: what do you mean? I can't set it as 'won't fix'
[16:23] <bdmurray> primes2h: that's correct only members of a certain team can so using Invalid will be fine.  sorry about that.
[16:24] <primes2h> bdmurray: Ok, thank you very much indeed.
[16:24] <Hobbsee> !ping
[16:30] <bdmurray> pedro_: where does $line come from?
[16:30] <pedro_> bdmurray: a cat file | while read line
[16:31] <bdmurray> okay, what I'm really curious about is the the contents of that file
[16:32] <pedro_> bdmurray: i'll send it to you if you want to
[16:33] <bdmurray> pedro_: that'd be great
[16:33] <sbeattie> pastebin perhaps?
[16:33] <pedro_> sure, it's just a list of packages anyways
[16:35] <pedro_> bdmurray: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/23329/
[16:40] <bdmurray> pedro_: are you using a packaged version or a bzr version?
[16:41] <pedro_> bdmurray: the packaged version 0.2.14
[16:41] <bdmurray> okay, I'll see what I can find out
[16:42] <pedro_> rock, thanks you ;-)
[17:39] <norsetto> pedro_: re. bug 243522, what makes you think that gmplayer is in the gnome-mplayer package?
[17:39] <pedro_> norsetto: the search list on LP returns me that, if is not feel free to re assign it
[17:40] <norsetto> pedro_: the search list on LP returns a list of packages, they have nothing to do (ok, some do) with the binaries they contain
[17:41] <norsetto> pedro_: you can use apt-file, or p.u.c. for that
[17:42] <pedro_> norsetto: sure, next time
[17:42] <norsetto> pedro_: thx
[17:42] <LimCore> hello
[17:42] <LimCore> another day, another EPIC failure of ubuntu
[17:43] <LimCore> it seems that recently in 8.04 amd64 kwallet suddenly stoped working?  I cant open wallets, dont see any wallets, I even can not create new walles. No messages, no nothing, it just dont show up
[18:39] <yjwong> Hi, I would like to bring attention to bug #208750 (regarding GVFS), which I think can be fixed right now with any GVFS/GNOME (or even just C programmers) hackers. I have traced the bug down to code level. Anyone willing to help?
[18:39] <yjwong> Upstream has not confirmed the bug; as they said that "Unconfirmed" has essentially the same status as "New" (:
[18:40] <yjwong> Oh, and if this should not be here, I would appreciate if someone direct me to the right channel
[18:41] <pochu> #nautilus on irc.gimp.net is a better place, if you're sure that's an upstream bug
[18:41] <pochu> otherwise, this is ok
[18:42] <pochu> explaining what you have found in the bug report is a good start though
[18:42] <yjwong> It's upstream, in GVFSD. But GVFS is a subproject of Nautilus?
[18:43] <pochu> no, but there's is no #gvfs channel and gvfs hackers are in #nautilus
[18:43] <yjwong> Ah, I see. Thanks for your information (:
[18:43] <pochu> np
[18:43] <pochu> (and gvfs discussion is on-topic there)
[18:44] <yjwong> Alright, thanks. I was afraid it wasn't on topic, and talking about that, I still feel the Ubuntu community is more friendly (:
[18:45] <pochu> GNOME folks are nice :)
[18:45] <bdmurray> pochu: there is some packaging python documentation that you've written or worked on right?
[18:45] <yjwong> Haha sure. But I've never really participated in GNOME, so yeah. I'm copying and pasting my sentence there (:
[20:29] <pochu> bdmurray: yup
[20:31] <pochu> bdmurray: I gave a session on OpenWeek, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/openweekhardy/PythonPackaging, which somebody then converted to a tutorial, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Python
[20:31] <pochu> I haven't reviewed it yet though
[20:38] <emgent> heya pochu :)
[20:43] <pochu> hey emgent!
[20:43] <pochu> how are you :)
[20:43] <emgent> fine, but it`s very hot.. :(
[20:43] <emgent> and you?
[20:44] <pochu> fine, thanks :)
[20:44] <emgent> nice
[22:53] <Majost> Hello
[23:05] <bdmurray> Majost: hi there
[23:11] <Majost> I submitted a case which I think should be looked at with a bit of seriousness
[23:12] <Majost> 243630
[23:12] <Majost> It'
[23:12] <Majost> Not really a security hole... but still pretty important. ;P
[23:13] <bdmurray> bug 243630
[23:21] <bdmurray> Majost: thanks for bringing it up we are looking into it
[23:25] <Majost> np
[23:25] <Majost> =)
[23:25] <Majost> I didn't check any other releases, but it probably would be wise. heh


[03:00] <ianorlyn> I am starting to hot like my dad asking to ask me a question
[03:11] <nhaines> What?
[03:14] <ianorlyn> I mean he keeps talking to me in ways that would get the !ask factoid in a support channel
[03:17] <nhaines> Ah.
[04:46] <DonkeyHotei> my standard answer is "you just did"
[18:50] <philipballew> In a month, in June I am going to be doing some live demos of Ubuntu at a week long book fair in Tijuana at the Linux Users Group's booth there. We/ mostly me will be giving live talks multiple times during the week and mainly on the weekend, and if anyone wants to join, I would always love the help.
[18:57] <blitz> Mexico trip?
[18:58] <blitz> wow tijuana has a lot more people than SF
[23:01] <ianorlyn> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9TnZhw2bt0 this could be useful for how to get non technical volunteers
[23:01] <darthrobot> Title: [2014 SouthEast LinuxFest - Deb Nicholson - How to Get and Keep Non Technical Volunteers - YouTube]


[08:28] <kbingham> Hi all, I raised a launchpad bug a month ago requesting CONFIG_VIDEO_VIMC be added as a module to the ubuntu kernel configs. (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1831482) but it's seen no updates since I created it on the 3rd of June. Is there anything I can do to progress this topic?
[08:34] <apw> klebers, ^
[08:38] <klebers> kbingham, hi! I have added it to our list of bugs to investigate, thanks.
[08:43] <kbingham> klebers, Thanks :) Not really much to investigate. It's just a kernel module that doesn't currently get built.
[08:44] <kbingham> And secure-boot makes compiling my own modules such a pain now adays (just registered my own key, and done a self sign)
[08:44] <apw> and it might be a heap of insecure code which is off for a reason, or it might be an oversight
[08:45] <apw> hense it needs investigating to understand how it happened
[08:45]  * kbingham works in linux-media so if you have any concerns about the quality of that code please do report it


[00:19] <lpotter> pngo_: Settings->Cellular->Carrier->APN->
[00:24] <pngo_> lpotter: I can not find APN option
[00:31] <pngo_> I read this: http://askubuntu.com/questions/413438/no-mobile-data-on-nexus-4-ubuntu-touch
[00:31] <pngo_> but I'm not sure how to change options
[00:38] <strigoi818303> Hello room, anyone here worked with the droid incredible 2?
[00:42] <hardtail> does anyone know how to install ubuntu on an asus transformerbook t100?
[00:45] <pngo_> my cellular data has stopped working. can someone tell me what is device name ex: wlan0 to activate it.
[03:40] <pngo_> I would like to back up my txt messages.
[04:14] <Azh> Hey   y'all
[06:23] <Puneet> Hi
[06:23] <Puneet> I have some issues with my Ubuntu 14.04
[06:24] <Puneet> Recently I bought new HP laptop with Ubuntu 12.04 as default OS
[06:24] <Puneet> and upgraded it to 14.04 but post upgrade, I am facing some issues
[06:25] <Puneet> like touchpad stopped working
[06:25] <Puneet> can someone guide me how to fix this?
[06:25] <Puneet> I goggled and try to fix it but could not find the solution
[06:28] <tbr> that's a general #ubuntu thing though
[06:36] <Puneet> Can someone guide me to resolve this issue?
[06:37] <tbr> go to the #ubuntu channel. this channel is about phones.
[07:27] <dholbach> good morning
[09:40] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Animation Day! :-D
[11:40] <asac> pitti: can you confirm that our retracers for rtm distro use the right symbol in general nowadays?
[11:40] <asac> ogra was wonderingf if thats the case
[11:41] <asac> ogra_: so i dont have a crash of unity at all  in /var/crash that is newer than oct 24
[11:41] <ogra_> asac, as long as we dont have errors.u.c for rtm having thr retracers doesnt help much ... we also need to get the info somehoe
[11:41]  * asac removes all files
[11:41] <asac> ogra_: we have afaik
[11:41] <asac> bdmurray: ^^
[11:41] <ogra_> i do have a crash right after reboot usually
[11:42] <asac> ogra_: do you have a oops id?
[11:42] <ogra_> unity8, mediascanner-service-2.0, ubuntu-app-launch_desktop-hook
[11:42] <pitti> asac: unsure, I don't run errors.u.c., that's bdmurray's territory; Brian? ^
[11:42] <ogra_> these three are crashing rather reliable here
[11:43] <asac> pitti: right, but the retracing machinary is supposed to do its job, right?
[11:43] <ogra_> ubuntu-app-launch is a recoverable error though ..
[11:43] <asac> ogra_: do you have oops for your crashes?
[11:43] <ogra_> i have a .crash file
[11:43] <pitti> asac: yes, it should; the pieces (ddebs, apt sources, logic etc.) are all there
[11:44] <asac> ogra_: can you paste /var/log/upstart/whoopsie.log ?
[11:45] <asac> so right after reboot i get https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/b1bc3df0-5e97-11e4-abd6-fa163e373683
[11:45] <ogra_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8718395/
[11:46] <ogra_> asac, yeah, thats a recoverable error
[11:46] <asac> ogra_: https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/3f6b473c-5e83-11e4-a8bb-fa163e373683
[11:46] <ogra_> ignore that ... doesnt do harm (apart from producing noise ... cwayne is aware of it)
[11:46] <asac> ogra_: https://errors.ubuntu.com/bucket/?id=/usr/bin/unity8%3A6%3A__assert_fail_base%3A__GI___assert_fail%3A__GI___pthread_mutex_lock%3A__gthread_mutex_lock%3Astd%3A%3Amutex%3A%3Alock
[11:47] <asac> thats the crash you see
[11:47] <asac> looks reasonably ok from retracing pov
[11:47] <asac> playbackstatus
[11:48] <asac> started on oct 10
[11:53] <asac> pitti: any hope that https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/47162672-5e98-11e4-a34f-fa163e22e467 might get retraced etc.?
[11:53] <asac> or is that fail?
[11:54] <pitti> asac: I don't know what's wrong; I can't look in the errors.u.c. logs
[11:55] <pitti> but it was reported just now, and I think bdmurray said that the retracers have quite some backlog
[11:55] <ogra_> asac, that only has 9 failures in rtm ...
[11:55] <ogra_> (see the "derivatives" column in the table)
[11:56] <ogra_> the actual thing must be way higher
[11:59] <asac> pitti: kk. guess showing retracing status would help figuring if this is going to get better
[11:59] <ogra_> we're looking for a unity8 crash with at least two, if not three digit occurence in rtm
[11:59] <asac> ogra_: well, might be there are various variants
[11:59] <asac> this one surely is real and made my phone screen go black
[11:59] <asac> hehe
[11:59] <ogra_> sure, youre might just be a side effect
[12:00] <asac> might be we get various random ones, instead of just one big one
[12:00] <ogra_> but many people see it often ... the occurence must be really high
[12:00] <ogra_> smoke tests also see constant ones during unity8 tests
[12:01] <asac> really?
[12:01] <asac> then lets go for those
[12:01] <asac> no question asked
[12:01] <asac> fix those and world will be at least more stable :P
[12:02] <ogra_> scoperunner and unity8 itself
[12:02] <sergiusens> asac: ogra_ try this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-scope-scopes/+bug/1386653
[12:02] <ogra_> and media-hub-server at times
[12:02] <sergiusens> ogra_: I know you complained about it at least ;-)
[12:03] <ogra_> sergiusens, nice one
[12:03] <asac> sil2100: ogra_: can we file a bug about the unity8 automation crashers?
[12:03] <ogra_> sergiusens, we are researching unity8 restarts atm though ...
[12:03] <asac> maybe there is something in that?
[12:03] <ogra_> asac, yes
[12:03] <asac> you got it already?
[12:03] <ogra_> asac, i talked to Saviq about it during the sprint ...
[12:04] <sergiusens> ogra_: yeah, I can't triage the bug but should go into the list
[12:04] <asac> do we have a bug?
[12:04] <ogra_> and he was saying he had some ideas but no solution yet
[12:04] <ogra_> no, no bug filed yet
[12:04] <asac> i am sure this will become a big prio
[12:04] <asac> ogra_: sil2100: can you file one so we can track this?
[12:04] <asac> thanks
[12:04] <asac> just post a bug about super crashy RTM phone and point to the automation crashes we see
[12:11] <sil2100> asac: we have one bug for overall smoketesting automation failures, but I guess one separate for this issue might be good
[12:11] <ogra_> so going bachwards through the images i see unity8 crashes in about every second image ... also media-hub ... what i see *constantly* though is unity-scopes_scoperunner
[12:12] <ogra_> (during the uniry8 tests that is)
[12:12] <ogra_> so we shoulld perhaps rather forcus on scoperunner since unity8 and media-hub might just be fallout
[12:24] <JStalin> hi, why I cannot add a contact from recent calls list
[12:24] <JStalin> clicking on a number instantly starts dial
[12:26] <tbr> JStalin: tap and hold
[12:26] <popey> JStalin: i see two ways to do that
[12:27] <popey> JStalin: swipe up recent, swipe number left and tap "add contact"
[12:27] <popey> JStalin: or, swipe up recent, tap number, tap "add contact"
[12:28] <JStalin> when i tap and hold it switches to select mode, when the only thing i can do is remove items from the list
[12:29] <JStalin> but swipe left
[12:29] <tbr> for me that opens a context menu
[12:29] <JStalin> amazing
[12:29] <JStalin> :P
[12:29] <JStalin> it works
[12:29] <JStalin> thanks
[12:29] <JStalin> i don't know how i couldn't noticed it
[12:30] <JStalin> thank you, poor battery life on nexus5 though
[12:30] <popey> how poor?
[12:40] <JStalin> well, i suppose it was fully powered up in the morning or almost fully, although it was powered only by usb connected to computer
[12:40] <JStalin> and now, after 8 hours its almost dead
[12:40] <JStalin> and i didn't do much, just used some wifi at work, answered few calls
[12:40] <ogra_> well, in the recent rtm images there were a good bunch of power related fixes
[12:41] <ogra_> but no idea how much of that was actually driver related for the supported devices and how much was generic
[12:41] <ogra_> (you would indeed only benefit from the generic fixes on N5)
[12:41] <JStalin> afaik it should update automatically, right?
[12:42] <ogra_> if you are on the rtm-proposed channel you would have gotten tzhem with one of the latest images
[12:54] <pngo_> I got new sim card and cellular data stopped working since than. How can I fix it?
[12:58] <jgdx> pngo_, what device are you using? What build of ut?
[12:59] <pngo_> nexus 4. ubuntu 14.10(r243)
[13:00] <zhsj> hi, anyone uses Meizu MX3? is there any available img to flash?
[13:00] <pngo_> jgdx: nexus4, ubuntu 14.10 (r243)
[13:00] <ogra_> pngo_, thats dead beef ...
[13:00] <ogra_> you should really use ubuntu-rtm instead
[13:01] <pngo_> ogra_: can I get a link?
[13:01] <ogra_> just use the rtm or rtm-proposed channel with ubuntu-device-flash
[13:02] <pngo_> ok thank you
[13:02] <ogra_> the --list-channels option should show all rtm channels and the right syntax to use
[13:02] <jgdx> pngo_, and while you're at it, install ofono-scripts
[13:03] <jgdx> pngo_, if the upgrade doesn't fix it, the output from list-modems is very helpful (remember to redact any personal information)
[13:03] <ogra_> also refrain from using versioned channels (14.09 in case of rtm or 14.10 or utopic or vivid ... ) better use devel or devel-proposed ... these are aliases and get moved to the next release automatically ... while all versioned ones (or the ones with release names) stop being updated at some point
[13:05] <ogra_> jgdx, ofono-scripts is preinstalled ;)
[13:05] <jdstrand> barry: hello again. trying to use 'sudo system-image-cli -b 0 -c ubuntu-touch/ubuntu-rtm/14.09-proposed -vvv' on a device to change channels from promoted to proposed, but it is just hanging: http://paste.ubuntu.com/8719192/
[13:06] <jdstrand> barry: (mako)
[13:06] <jdstrand> E1028 07:35:23.824100 25217 apparmor.cpp:112]  org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.Disconnected:Not connected to D-Bus server
[13:06] <jdstrand> that came up a couple of times
[13:06] <jdstrand> so did: W1028 07:35:23.826511 25217 manager.cpp:140]  bc951ef547fc49faa52fe0ba891aaca8could not be stored in the db
[13:06]  * ogra_ blames dbus-cpp :)
[13:07] <ogra_> our constant blame target recently
[13:07] <jgdx> ogra_, k, thanks
[13:07] <jgdx> :)
[13:20] <jdstrand> barry: ah, it finally timed out: http://paste.ubuntu.com/8719334/
[13:38] <barry> jdstrand: that assertion error *should* be fixed by the udm fix that's in flight
[13:39] <jdstrand> barry: so, I need to install that silo to change channels?
[13:40] <jgdx> seb128, titles that are the text properties of some listelements, shoulnd't they also benefit from the new title element you created (in uss)?
[13:40] <barry> jdstrand: doesn't look like udm is in a silo yet
[13:41] <seb128> jgdx, do you have an example?
[13:41] <jdstrand> hmm
[13:41] <filmee24> hi, ive installed ubuntu on my wetab tablet, but i would upgrade to ubuntu touch, how can i install it?
[13:41] <jdstrand> I guess I'll just need to test my stuff in the emulator
[13:41] <jdstrand> barry: thanks
[13:41]  * jdstrand wonders if the emulator fix for rtm landed yet
[13:42] <jdstrand> barry: thanks
[13:42] <barry> jdstrand: yeah.  i'll keep watching it
[13:43] <jgdx> seb128, time and date -> set time and date
[13:44] <jgdx> huuuge problem for my guerilla testers
[13:44] <filmee24> i would install ubuntu touch on ubuntu tablet
[13:44] <popey> filmee24: i dont think we have a build for the wetab
[13:44] <popey> filmee24: but that's an x86 tablet?
[13:44] <filmee24> yes
[13:44] <seb128> jgdx, that's an ItemSelector
[13:45] <seb128> jgdx, but I changed that one in my mps
[13:45] <seb128> jgdx, but using a Title followed by a selector without text:
[13:45] <popey> filmee24: then perhaps you can apt-get install some of the necessary bits from the repo, but no guarantees it'll work. We don't test on x86 tablets yet
[13:45] <popey> filmee24: what GPU is it?
[13:45] <seb128> jgdx, which is a workaround but does the correct result
[13:45] <jgdx> seb128, oh right, excellent. I saw a bunch of those not changed in cellular, so I figured you left them alone.
[13:45] <jgdx> seb128, can I propose a branch against yours fixing those?
[13:46] <filmee24> idk, ubuntu works on it
[13:46] <seb128> jgdx, sure, please do
[13:46] <popey> filmee24: intel atom cpu?
[13:46] <seb128> jgdx, I put up mine to have a deb to test, I was expecting it to miss some cases, I want to give it a round of testing still before proposing for merging
[13:46] <alexabreu> pitti, hey, quick question about language packs ... the name of the .po file corresponding to a project contained in a given lang LC_MESSAGES (thinking oxide for instance), is picked up from the name of the imported .pot file in the project right?
[13:46] <filmee24> i think intel
[13:47] <jgdx> seb128, makes sense.
[13:47] <popey> filmee24: you could certainly try unity8 on it...
[13:48] <pitti> alexabreu: that confuses several unrelated things
[13:48] <alexabreu> pitti, I thought it would :)
[13:48] <pitti> alexabreu: the .pot file should have the exact same name as the project's translation domain
[13:49] <alexabreu> pitti, right ...
[13:49] <pitti> alexabreu: that's not a strict requirement (the build system might spit out different .mo file names during build), but it avoids confusion
[13:50] <pitti> alexabreu: the .po file names are named ll.po or ll_CC.po, i. e. a locale name or just a language code
[13:50] <alexabreu> pitti, yup ...
[13:50] <pitti> alexabreu: and finally, LC_MESSAGES always specifies a complete locale name (like en_US.UTF_8)
[13:52] <filmee24> im installing unity8 now
[13:52] <pitti> alexabreu: finally at runtie, gettext looks up /usr/share/locale/<LC_MESSAGES prefix>/LC_MESSAGES/<domain>.mo
[13:53] <alexabreu> pitti, my question was not entirely clear hence the confusion I guess ... what I mean is that in the current lang packs the oxide mo file has the wrong name, I have the branches that fixes it and wanted to make sure where the name of the ./mo file in the final langpack was coming from
[13:53] <alexabreu> pitti, you answered my question ..
[13:53] <pitti> alexabreu: ok, good :)
[13:54] <alexabreu> pitti, the domain for oxide should be oxide-qt and afaik it is now oxide ... https://code.launchpad.net/~abreu-alexandre/oxide/fix-pt-BR-po-msgid/+merge/239755
[13:54] <filmee24> i did install unity8, so what should i do now to use it?
[13:57] <filmee24> ?
[14:00] <jgdx> seb128, ListItem.Header / the new element. When to use what?
[14:04] <seb128> jgdx, I'm unsure, I don't understand the distinction, I guess "ping mpt to know"
[14:04] <seb128> jgdx, I went for "use the title element when there is a ':' at the end of the label" mostly
[14:04] <mpt> Except that I answer questions but never pings ;-)
[14:05] <jgdx> seb128, good rule
[14:05] <jgdx> mpt, good rule
[14:05] <seb128> :-)
[14:13]  * mpt compares <https://code.launchpad.net/~jonas-drange/ubuntu-system-settings/security-allow-acceptance-of-here-terms-fixes-1375322/+merge/238419> vs. <https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/ubuntu-system-settings/location-three-options/+merge/239274>
[14:15] <mpt> kemmko, ^ this is wasting a bit of time … We should have a single design and a single implementation of that block, I think (though the bits around them are different in setup vs. System Settings)
[14:16] <mpt> kemmko, this is similar to how the list of Wi-Fi networks appears both in setup and in System Settings
[14:17] <jgdx> mpt, we implemented "radio buttons" in USS as per the spec. https://launchpadlibrarian.net/187010904/location.phone.png
[14:17] <jgdx> mpt, this means HERE without location detection would make no sense. Looks like you could choose that scenario in the wizard design.
[14:18] <mpt> jgdx, in the setup they look like checkboxes but mterry made them behave like radio buttons
[14:18] <mpt> I’m just wiping my phone so I can see the results :-)
[14:18] <mterry> mpt, that was per the design I was given, don't blame me  :)
[14:18] <jgdx> mpt, to get to the wizard quicly do $ phablet-config welcome-wizard --enable
[14:18] <popey> mterry: you dont need to wipe - just "phablet-config welcome-wi....
[14:18] <mterry> mpt, you don't have to wipe your phone to see the wizard
[14:18] <popey> see^ ☻
[14:19] <jgdx> :p
[14:19] <popey> also, sorry mterry ☻
[14:19] <mpt> mterry, I said I reported the bug on the toolkit, you know I’m not blaming you ;-)
[14:19] <mterry> mpt, I know  :)
[14:19] <mpt> kemmko and I are going to nag gventuri until he agrees
[14:20] <jgdx> just make the ubuntu shape rounder
[14:21] <mpt> That is a drawback of rounded checkboxes, yes … They look needlessly similar to radio buttons
[14:22] <jgdx> mpt, why can't both designs use a boolean plus a checkbox? Boolean for location detection, then a sensistive/insensitive checkbox for HERE?
[14:23] <jgdx> s/boolean/switch
[14:24] <mpt> jgdx, that was my initial design. But even if we managed to avoid it here, there are other cases where radio selection makes much more sense.
[14:25] <jgdx> mpt, as in only one click to enable both loc. det. and HERE?
[14:25] <jgdx> yes, radio is a good, conventional design pattern
[14:28] <dobey> it would be nice if the setting actually stuck after reboot, and the indicator didn't disappear when turning the buttons off in the indicator (because it looks like it just crashed)
[14:28] <dobey> then again, i wonder why the location stuff isn't in the radios indicator
[14:30] <mpt> dobey, what’s the “radios indicator”?
[14:30] <jgdx> dobey, former is by design
[14:31] <jgdx> or was at least..
[14:31] <mpt> jgdx, eh? All settings should persist after restart
[14:31] <dobey> mpt: network indicator. and confusing why those settings aren't connected to the airplane mode
[14:32] <jgdx> mpt, indicator disappearing
[14:32] <dobey> since location detecton is a feature of network connectivity, it seems appropriate there
[14:32] <jgdx> seb128, https://code.launchpad.net/~jonas-drange/ubuntu-system-settings/titles-uis-tweaks/+merge/239858
[14:32] <mpt> dobey, ah … Because while engineers may think of location detection as a networking feature, most people would not
[14:33] <mpt> Even Bluetooth isn’t in there, and that’s much more network-y than location is
[14:33] <dobey> bluetooth doesn't depend on a data connection to be functional
[14:33] <dobey> HERE does
[14:35] <dobey> ironically, enabling airplane mode though, does turn off bt and cause that indicator to disappear, while location and GPS are both still enabled, and indicator is still there
[14:35] <mpt> So does automatic time zone detection (clock), or streaming audio (sound)
[14:36] <mpt> That something depends on a data connection isn’t really interesting … The network menu is primarily for “I don’t have Internet/cellular connection and I want to fix it”
[14:37] <tsdgeos> seb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/ubuntu-system-settings/missingi18n/+merge/239862
[14:37] <tsdgeos> dobey: ↑
[14:38] <kemmko> mpt: mterry it should look similar indeed but I don't think the option selector is a good solution for the WiFi screen in the oobe
[14:39] <mpt> kemmko, is that because the setup should be less “list-y” in general than System Settings?
[14:39] <tsdgeos> damn this is pretty bad
[14:40] <tsdgeos> "<b>%1:</b> %2".arg(i18n.tr("From"))
[14:40] <tsdgeos> we are assuming all languages use : and that structure :/
[14:40] <dobey> tsdgeos: that is indeed awful
[14:41] <dobey> tsdgeos: especially in hebrew or arabic
[14:41] <tsdgeos> yeah
[14:41] <tsdgeos> let me open a bug
[14:41] <tsdgeos> or just fix it...
[14:42] <dobey> tsdgeos: i think you need a bug, and get it identified as critical, and on the list :)
[14:42] <tsdgeos> arg
[14:42] <tsdgeos> dobey: for https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/ubuntu-system-settings/missingi18n/+merge/239862  too?
[14:43] <dobey> tsdgeos: probably
[14:43] <tsdgeos> arg
[14:43] <kemmko> mpt. yes, the idea was to make it look different but still Ubuntu because in the end users won't see it again
[14:43] <tsdgeos> dobey: ok ^_^
[14:43] <dobey> tsdgeos: i'm not sure how system-settings manages the pot file, but i'd say you should ensure it's updated in the tree with your branch too, when changing strings like that
[14:43] <dobey> or adding new i18n.tr() calls
[14:44] <tsdgeos> dobey: i've been told we just push to it
[14:44] <tsdgeos> after
[14:44] <tsdgeos> the MR
[14:44] <kemmko> mpt:  where you are right though is that a certain recognition from users end should happen, therefor similarity is a good call
[14:44] <tsdgeos> but what do i know in this world of changing things
[14:45] <mpt> kemmko, I just saw the new “Lock security” screen in the setup, and I can see why you don’t want the same widget for Location ;-)
[14:45] <kemmko> hahaha
[14:45] <kemmko> mpt: exactly
[14:46] <kemmko> mpt: we need radio buttons
[14:46] <mpt> As Tufte might put it, the data-ink ratio is a bit low
[14:47] <kemmko> mpt:  mterry did the right thing to implement the checkboxes behave like radio buttons for now, it is an interim solution until we (hopefully) have radio buttons
[14:47] <mpt> yeah
[14:48]  * mpt runs into bug 1379381 again
[15:02] <dobey> mpt: aside from "make things start faster or prevent unlock until dash is started" i'm not sure how one would fix that; and forcing the screen to be locked would seem a bit frustrating
[15:04] <mpt> dobey, Unity already has a system for customizing the splash screen per-app. So I imagine it would be easy to special-case the splash screen of the Dash. I could be wrong.
[15:07] <dobey> mpt: well, it's the splash screen for unity. it used to say "Dash" but i'm not sure adding an icon or changing the name would be particularly helpful to the user experience at that point. as a user my expectation when i unlock the screen, is that i can access my apps
[15:09] <mpt> dobey, naturally. But if we can’t just show the apps instantly, showing just the header (so it looked like a momentarily-empty Dash) would be less distracting.
[15:10] <mpt> Like we do for System Settings, though it would be a little more complicated since the Dash uses a logo in its header.
[15:11] <dobey> oh, huh. how does system settings do that
[15:18] <mpt> dobey, http://developer.ubuntu.com/apps/platform/guides/splash-screens/
[15:18] <bdmurray> asac: that one is waiting to retrace possibly due to a corrupt core dump
[15:18] <bdmurray> pitti: fyi, there is not a backlog for armhf (only i386 and amd64)
[15:19] <pitti> bdmurray: ah thanks, good to know
[15:19] <asac> bdmurray: waiting for a new, potential better core submission?
[15:19] <asac> gotcha
[15:19] <dobey> oh
[15:28] <cwayne> ogra_: so how do we run autopilot tests now that autopilot is removed from the seed?
[15:28] <ogra_> cwayne, like you always did
[15:28] <pitti> phablet-test-run should just install it
[15:29] <ogra_> right
[15:29] <ogra_> it will magically pulled in as dep
[15:29] <pitti> ogra_: related to that, I taught autopkgtest enough now; it happily runs AP tests with AP being uninstalled, and without r/w
[15:29] <ogra_> (it would have before ... just that this wasnt necessary because it was seeded)
[15:29] <ogra_> pitti, yay !!
[15:30] <cwayne> pitti: ooh, im interested in using autopkgtest as well (as i hear that's going to be CI standard soon)
[15:32] <ogra_> cwayne, phablet-test-run will soon be switched
[15:32] <ogra_> so you can just use the default test procedures as documented
[15:32] <ogra_> (it will become a wrapper for autopkgtest ... (indeed you can also use it directly without wrapping if you want))
[15:33] <cwayne> ogra_: right, so I'd just need to add stuff to the click manifest to use it then?
[15:34] <ogra_> Saviq, mterry, do you guys know if the fix for "cant properly type on most left column in the keyboard" is supposed to be fully final ? or are there still bits missing ?
[15:34] <ogra_> my kbd is still very hard to use on the left side
[15:34] <Saviq> ogra_, not there on rtm
[15:34] <Saviq> ogra_, in silo 15
[15:34] <ogra_> ah
[15:34] <ogra_> phew
[15:34]  * ogra_ is happy then
[15:35]  * ogra_ was scared it was supposed to be fixed already
[16:50] <pramod> i tried to install ubuntu touch on my Nokia X mobile
[16:50] <pramod> which is A dual core mobile
[16:51] <pramod> But on using cmd "$ adb devices " it shows "List of devices attached 025d138e2f521413 offline"
[16:59] <barry> stgraber: ping
[17:00] <stgraber> barry: pong
[17:01] <barry> stgraber: hi.  i'm working on the test plan for the phased updates, using phablet.stgraber.org.  i grab your archive-master keys, but then i get an error because i think the image-signing.tar.xz (and possibly other keyrings) have expired timestamps.  can you update and regen the sigs for the ubuntu-touch/test channel, mako?
[17:01] <barry> stgraber: keeping the same phased update values
[17:01] <stgraber> barry: oh, yeah, that server may very well be more than a year old :)
[17:01] <barry> :)
[17:01] <stgraber> barry: I'll re-gen all the keys after lunch+TB meeting
[17:02] <barry> stgraber: awesome, thanks.  i'll be out for a bit soon, but ping me when it's updated and i'll retest this afternoon
[17:17]  * dobey wonders what the deal with ubuntu-touch/vivid-proposed channel is
[17:18] <ogra_> not building yet
[17:19] <Tassadar> dobey: I noticed it too, I'll switch to it on tasemnice once devel(-proposed) starts pointing to it on s-i.u.com
[17:19] <dobey> ogra_: any idea when it will be? it didn't even exist yesterday, but now it does and is empty. and i really need a vivd mako image to test on :)
[17:19] <ogra_> once it works
[17:20] <ogra_> dobey, you are only the 244675th pinging me about it today ... :P
[17:23] <dobey> ogra_: actually i haven't pinged you about it today. you just happeend to appear when i asked. i did ping yesterday though. ;)
[17:24] <ogra_> heh
[17:24] <ogra_> dobey, well, infinity is on it, trying to find out why debootstrap doesnt work on the armhf build machines ... just be patient ... images will pop out as soon as possible
[17:26] <dobey> ogra_: yeah, being as patient as i can. just trying to see visible status that's not just me re-running ubuntu-device-flash constantly and having it fail. and i'm feeling a bit useless at the moment :)
[17:27] <ogra_> but why do you care about vivid ... you need to land in rtm
[17:27] <ogra_> vivid will likely be completely wonky for weeks anyway
[17:27] <davmor2> ogra_: so about ubuntu-touch/vivid-proposed /me only asking to see how many pings count as a ddos on ogra_ ;)
[17:27] <dobey> ogra_: i already landed in rtm. i have to sync it to vivid now.
[17:27] <ogra_> just do it then
[17:27] <davmor2> ogra_: no wonky is 15.10
[17:28] <dobey> ogra_: so just lie and say the tests passed and let ci train sync it anyway? :)
[17:28] <dobey> i don't have a problem with that, but i would like to make sure it doesn't crash on vivid; as it does crash on utopic when built on vivid (possibly due to some change that's in a lower level vivid lib)
[17:29] <dobey> davmor2: wonky wombat ?
[17:30] <davmor2> dobey: that or wobbly weeble :)
[17:30] <dobey> heh
[17:30] <dobey> wittle weevil
[17:34]  * popey pokes davmor2 with a hangout from 30 mins ago.
[17:34] <popey> slacker
[18:18] <kgunn> brendand: hey on bug 1386803, are you saying image #126 is when it started ? or image #126 was good ...then it started
[18:20] <brendand> kgunn, we're not 100% sure yet but i couldn't make #125 crash
[18:21] <brendand> kgunn, nobody has found a reliable test case yet
[18:21] <kgunn> brendand: also, what is the experience exactly ?....screen flashes to black and you get the spinner ? or something else ?
[18:21] <ogra_> kgunn, thats exactly it
[18:21] <dobey> hmm, is it just me or does rtm-proposed #113 have issues with rotation?
[18:22] <brendand> kgunn, usually there is a long hang, followed by the u-s-c spinner
[18:22]  * ogra_ always gets the spinner right after boot/reboot
[18:22] <dobey> 113 mako i guess, since apparently the build numbers are not synced across devices
[18:23] <dobey> ogra_: spinner on boot is just dash taking longer to start and query the few scopes, than it takes you to unlock the screen, i think
[18:24] <ogra_> dobey, you mean after i entered my sim pin it should show me the session and then restart ? ;)
[18:24] <dobey> ogra_: you see the list of apps and *then* you see the spinner?
[18:24] <ogra_> (irt is clearly a crash and many of us see it)
[18:24] <ogra_> yes
[18:25] <dobey> ok, yeah that's a crash
[18:25] <ogra_> i enter my sim pin, then my pin about 20sec later with the session running the whole thing crashes
[18:25] <ogra_> others seem to catch it differently but nearly everyone i talked to today has seen it once
[18:26] <dobey> if i unlock the phone as soon as possible after reboot, i get the spinner, but it's because the dash is still starting, not because of a crash
[18:26] <ogra_> well, then it also says "Scopes" above the spinner
[18:26] <ogra_> (or at least should say)
[18:27] <dobey> when i tried to flash 14.09 instead of 14.09-proposed though, on my n5, the dash was crashing constantly; so i flashed to 14.09-proposed instead
[18:27] <ogra_> well, it wasnt crashing it was "lifecycle managed" ;)
[18:27] <dobey> ogra_: yeah, it does say "Scopes" there. when i've seen the dash crash before, it did as well. but anyway
[18:27] <ogra_> (with a way to high oom score ... just like any app)
[18:28] <dobey> ogra_: lifecycle management was causing apport to keep collecting crashes?
[18:29] <ogra_> dobey, no, but restarting the dash all the time
[18:29] <ogra_> dash had the same score as apps ... and was SIGKILLed
[18:29] <dobey> ogra_: yeah, for me apport kept getting started whenever the dash crashed. so was definitely crashing (at least on my n5 on 14.09) :)
[18:29] <ogra_> today the score is a lot woer but still not 100% perfect ... next iteration of the fix is supposed to land soon though
[18:35] <ogra_> kgunn, fyi, i seem to have mediascanner and media-hub crashing alongside unity8 (according to /var/crash timestamps) not sure thats any valuable as a hint
[18:35] <kgunn> ogra_: yeah, for sure....looking at commits #126 fwd
[18:35] <kgunn> seems media hub might be the suspicion
[18:35] <kgunn> no unity8 change in there
[18:36] <ogra_> well, we were suspecting the hud dropping
[18:36] <ogra_> since that pulled so many unseeded additional packages
[18:36] <ogra_> but according to unity8 devs nothing of these packages should be used by it
[18:42] <kgunn> ogra_: i've been testing with version 133 today...quite a bit, and haven't seen it....
[18:42] <ogra_> i have had it at least three times
[18:42] <kgunn> ogra_: what are your steps ?
[18:42] <ogra_> and i actually did a fresh bootstrap today
[18:43] <kgunn> mmm
[18:43] <ogra_> well, i did a bootstrap, went through the wizard ... punched in my sim pin ... then my pin... then opened system settings and got the spinner
[18:43] <ogra_> so i thought i better reboot ...
[18:44] <ogra_> did that  ... spinner after pin again ... then it stopped doing that
[18:44] <ogra_> at some point a webapp hung ... spinner again ...
[18:44] <ogra_> thats the tree cases i had
[18:44] <ogra_> i know popey, davmor2 and brendand saw it more often than me
[18:45] <kgunn> popey: davmor2 brendand ....was it at a similar moment ? ^
[18:47] <davmor2> kgunn: I have it all over the place, so notify osd pops up crash, open and app crash, create an account crash, close and app crash, unlock the sim before you unlock the phone crash
[18:47] <brendand> kgunn, most commonly for me it's when i unlock the second of my two locked sims
[18:47] <brendand> kgunn, but it happens in a lot of places
[18:47] <kgunn> davmor2: curious if you --bootstrap 'd
[18:47] <davmor2> kgunn: --wipes
[18:48]  * kgunn still wonders if the delta between --wipe & --bootstrap is documented :)
[18:48] <davmor2> kgunn: no idea
[18:49] <pmcgowan> ogra_, do you often see adb not work to krillin, seems the case after ever update/reboot
[18:49] <kgunn> pmcgowan: i've seen that alot myself
[18:49] <ogra_> pmcgowan, nope, always works fine for me ...
[18:49] <davmor2> kgunn: the worst one by far was when I got back to the uk my wife called me to see how I was getting home from the airport and the popup for the call crashed the phone so I couldn't answer it
[18:50] <kgunn> davmor2: mmm, do you agree that #126 is the stinker ?
[18:50] <ogra_> pmcgowan, but as i said above i did a fresh bootstrap of my krillin today for the first time since re-partitioning ... lest see how it goes after my foorst OTA
[18:50] <kgunn> pre 126 seemed fine?
[18:50] <ogra_> *first
[18:51] <davmor2> kgunn: whatever was out on Saturday, Friday seemed fine I was testing on it all day
[18:51] <pmcgowan> ogra_, ok, pretty consistent for me for some time, I should log a bug finally
[18:51] <pmcgowan> ogra_, which package?
[18:51] <ogra_> pmcgowan, no idea, android-tools perhaps ...
[18:51] <kgunn> davmor2: this is the one of suspicion...
[18:51] <kgunn> http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-rtm/126.commitlog
[18:52] <kgunn> not sure if you can tell whether or not you were on that?
[18:52] <ogra_> pmcgowan, so you mean adb is offline after the session is up on screen ?
[18:52] <pmcgowan> ogra_, yes
[18:52] <ogra_> (before session is expected behavior)
[18:52] <pmcgowan> ogra_, after I log in to phone
[18:52] <kgunn> davmor2: so brendan kind of thinks that's it based on testing...i thikn that's it based on contents
[18:52] <pmcgowan> ogra_, I need to reboot then it works
[18:52] <ogra_> strange
[18:52] <ogra_> and you are sure thats not the PC side ?
[18:52] <pmcgowan> seems after an update only
[18:52]  * ogra_ has never seen such issues
[18:53] <pmcgowan> I just reboot the phone
[18:53] <ogra_> i do that plenty ... no issues here
[18:53] <pmcgowan> I have tried unplug/replug etc when in that state and doesnt work
[18:53] <davmor2> kgunn: yeah he has been looking into it I think so I would go with that, but it seems odd that it didn't start crashing a lot till saturday
[18:54] <ogra_> kgunn, this is my main phone ... i dont run tests on it and see the issue a lot ...
[18:54] <ogra_> i guess testing simply triggers it more easily
[18:54] <davmor2> kgunn: I'm wondering if this was the initial trigger and something else made it worse
[18:54] <kgunn> ogra_: sure, no prob...not saying it's not witnessed
[18:54] <kgunn> just trying to discern best info
[18:55] <kgunn> davmor2: so you're saying you flashed friday or sat...then haven't updated....and suddenly today it started acting up ?
[18:55] <kgunn> pmcgowan: don't forget on host "adb kill-server"
[18:55] <john-mcaleely> kgunn, so we (well, joc, but he's away) saw it a lot during our PES QA run yesterday/today
[18:56] <john-mcaleely> kgunn, none of that is with test harnesses - just manual use of the phone UI
[18:56] <kgunn> john-mcaleely: ack
[18:56] <davmor2> kgunn: no it started playing up for me a lot on saturday after upgrading to the revert for apt which broke installing apps
[18:56] <pmcgowan> kgunn, I tried to add silo 1 and it complains about a path to a vivid ppa
[18:56] <davmor2> kgunn: up until then it was working okay with occasional glitches
[18:57] <john-mcaleely> kgunn, as another data point, he would have exclusively used r128
[18:57] <pmcgowan> mhy did that heppen
[18:57] <pmcgowan> bah
[18:57] <ogra_> must be the jetlag
[18:57] <pmcgowan> ogra_, I added a silo ppa and it added it as vivid?
[18:58] <ogra_> pmcgowan, did you use citrain for that ? (the script from phablet-tools-citrain)
[18:58] <pmcgowan> no
[18:58] <pmcgowan> just add-apt-repo
[18:58] <ogra_> well, if you dont, you need to use the right url with "ubuntu-rtm" in it
[18:58] <davmor2> kgunn: okay so 126 looks like it might be this build http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-image-stats/rtm/20141025.changes and the 25 was saturday so that sounds correct
[18:58] <pmcgowan> ogra_, ok but why? I am on rtm
[18:59] <pmcgowan> oh
[18:59] <kgunn> thanks for the cross check davmor2 & john-mcaleely
[18:59] <pmcgowan> silo is not rtm
[18:59] <ogra_> ah
[18:59] <pmcgowan> not even sure how to do this
[18:59] <kgunn> looking more and more like media hub
[18:59] <john-mcaleely> you're welcome kgunn
[18:59] <davmor2> kgunn: so yes 126 is most likely the cause I just thought that 126 landed friday not saturday :)
[19:00] <ogra_> pmcgowan, by hand ... which means adding an /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ file and manually adding the key ... and even then deps might fall over etc
[19:00] <ogra_> pmcgowan, rtm is a derivative ... thats a bit like adding a debian jessie archive to your utopic install
[19:01] <ogra_> might work, but can also break in heavy ways
[19:02] <pmcgowan> ogra_, yeah I am backing away, was trying to help oh well
[19:03] <kurt___> should I have installed the SDK with a PPA and not the app store?
[19:03] <ogra_> mixing distros is a quite advanced task :)  not impossible though
[19:03] <ogra_> kurt___, i think thats what the documentation says, yes
[19:04] <kurt___> ogra, thanks!
[19:04] <ogra_> (else you will be on an old SDK, the PPA constantly moves forward, releases do not)
[19:04] <AlbertA> so what do the crashes look like? is there a stacktracetop somewhere?
[19:05] <ogra_> AlbertA, i think asac had a link to a traceback on errors.u.c for his
[19:07] <AlbertA> ogra_: is it the mutex lock assert?
[19:08] <ogra_> oh, i dont know
[19:09] <ogra_> i had two on my own here though ... 3f6b473c-5e83-11e4-a8bb-fa163e373683 and 6a680838-5e85-11e4-9625-fa163e339c81
[19:09] <kgunn> asac: so AlbertA had a good point, that likely there's a audio service create/destroy for every notification...
[19:09] <ogra_> they werent processed this morning when we checked
[19:09] <kgunn> and that's what we're using for all the prompting....that seems to be a common thread in what the guys are seeing too...
[19:09] <kgunn> crash just as their being prompted for something
[19:09] <ogra_> https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/3f6b473c-5e83-11e4-a8bb-fa163e373683
[19:10] <ogra_> yeah, looks like muutex_lock
[19:10] <ogra_> -u
[19:10] <ogra_> https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/6a680838-5e85-11e4-9625-fa163e339c81
[19:10] <AlbertA> ogra_: ok that should be addressed by the dbus-cpp branch in line 57 in the silo....
[19:10] <ogra_> the medis-hub one
[19:10] <kgunn> yeah...last line on the report is mutex lock
[19:11] <kgunn> AlbertA: i take it that's b/c there's some racyness going on wrt previous dead obj on the bus ?
[19:12] <ogra_> it is because it is dbus-cpp
[19:12] <ogra_> :P
[19:12] <kgunn> lol
[19:12] <kgunn> man harsh
[19:12] <AlbertA> kgunn: yeah there could be accesses to dead objects which is fixed in the dbus-cpp branches listed in line 57
[19:12] <ogra_> kgunn, common meme among all devs though
[19:13] <ogra_> just say dbus-cpp in a room full of ubuntu touch devs and you will see them running for a pub ... to get really drunk
[19:15] <AlbertA> so it kind of makes sense...
[19:15] <ogra_> getting drunk ?
[19:15] <ogra_> yeah, surely does
[19:15] <ogra_> :)
[19:15] <AlbertA> the fix I added friday let's the client player instances receive EOS...so they end up destroying the player instances
[19:16] <AlbertA> so the probability of hitting the dead object access bug increases
[19:16] <AlbertA> just speculating....
[19:42] <hardtail> anyone install ubuntu on an asus transformerbook t100 can help me with install please/
[19:44] <dobey> hardtail: are you trying to install the phone/tablet image on it?
[19:45] <hardtail> @dobey I am trying to install the desktop version but I have been having issues for 3 days now
[19:46] <dobey> hardtail: you would be better off asking in #ubuntu this channel is about the development of the phone/tablet interface
[19:47] <hardtail> @dobey been out of luck in there for days...i guess i will try again...is it possible to get a tablet image though?
[19:48] <dobey> hardtail: i have no idea what you can install on that hardware. but i suspect not many people have one.
[19:49] <hardtail> dobey well thanks..ill see what i can do
[19:57] <barry> stgraber: hi.  back now.  any update on test server?
[20:02] <stgraber> barry: just finished resetting the whole server, importing an image now
[20:02] <barry> stgraber: cool, thanks
[20:05] <stgraber> barry: try now
[20:06] <stgraber> barry: note that the channel contains a single image at the moment since I reset the server. If that's a problem, I can probably figure out a way to get you a second image in there
[20:24] <barry> stgraber: nope, it's okay as long as there's a phase
[20:51] <hardtail> anyone have an asus t100
[20:59] <asac> AlbertA: dunno, is garbled too much i think: https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/47162672-5e98-11e4-a34f-fa163e22e467
[20:59] <hardtail> does anyone know why this returns an error? linux (hd2,gpt5)/boot/vmlinuz-3.13-xxxx root=/dev/mmcblk0p5 video=VGA-1:1368x768e reboot=pci,force
[21:03] <dobey> hardtail: because the screen is 1366 pixels wide, not 1368 maybe?
[21:03] <dobey> though i don't know what error you are getting
[21:05] <hardtail> dobey the error I am getting is error: missing ')' symbol
[21:15] <dobey> hardtail: oh ok. anyway, #ubuntu is the right channel to ask general support questions about ubuntu. please ask in there. #ubuntu-kernel might be able to help you to, as it seems you might be having kernel issues with that machine


[02:23] <lifeless> the tl;dr is interesting itself
[02:36] <wgrant> It's got a typo, though.
[02:36] <wgrant> Says 68% are legacy, but it's really 58%.


[00:20] <arraybolt3> I just learned that the development release doesn't get the same security fix reliability as stable releases, for good reasons. I'm wondering, is there any similar preference for LTS releases over interim releases? Would it theoretically be more secure for me to run Jammy rather than Kinetic?
[00:27] <amurray> we treat all stable releases the same so it should not be more secure to run say jammy than kinetic from a unpatched known vulns perspective
[00:28] <arraybolt3> +1, thanks for your help!
[00:28] <amurray> but since CVEs tend to affect newer software (in general), an argument could be made that it is perhaps more secure to run an older release since in general they have less CVEs affecting them over time
[00:29] <amurray> fwiw I run kinetic and will probably upgrade to lunar in the next month or two - but that is to help with devel tasks etc
[00:29] <arraybolt3> Eh, I generally don't worry about zero-days. As long as known vulns are patched, I'm happy - for the times when zero-days are important, QEMU to the rescue.
[00:30] <arraybolt3> Anyway I guess now it's just a matter of what flavor to jump to if I'm going to do a clean installation anyway. /me distrohops quite a bit :P
[00:30] <arraybolt3> (I guess jumping between different Ubuntu flavors isn't really a distrohop but you get what I mean.)
[00:37] <sarnold> I've personally got a variety of LTS machines ranging from "oh he really should upgrade that" to "yeah that's a good choice" :)