[18:02] <mdeslaur> kees, jdstrand, sbeattie: meeting?
[18:03] <kees> mdeslaur: \o
[18:05] <sbeattie> mdeslaur: sure.
[18:08] <jdstrand> o/
[18:09]  * kees starts
[18:10] <kees> did a couple security fake-syncs.
[18:10] <kees> couchdb exploded due to autoconf-hate, so I've skipped it for now on jaunty
[18:10] <kees> been trying to keep up with kernel CVE triage; there have been a lot lately
[18:11] <kees> this week I'll likely spend time rebasing yama and nx-emut o natty's kernel
[18:11] <kees> s/ut o/u to/
[18:11] <kees> I've got 2 things unembargoed this week as well
[18:12] <kees> and I'll be poking at maverick final testing. might even update the colo to RC
[18:12] <kees> that's it from me
[18:12] <mdeslaur> ok, my turn
[18:13] <mdeslaur> So I'm trying to figure out a way of testing the lvm2 cluster daemon
[18:13] <mdeslaur> so I can test my lvm2 updates
[18:13] <mdeslaur> and am on triage
[18:13] <mdeslaur> I'll pick something from the list if I have time
[18:14] <mdeslaur> That's it from me
[18:14]  * sbeattie facepalms as he clearly can't read topic messages and thought he was on triage this week.
[18:15] <mdeslaur> lol
[18:16] <sbeattie> anyway, last week I spent some time on apparmor build issues and coping with copious gpg key changes.
[18:16] <sbeattie> I'm hoping to push out some patches to the apparmor list for review later today.
[18:17] <sbeattie> since I'm *not* triaging, I'll try to pick up some open issues this week.
[18:17] <sbeattie> I think that's it for me, jdstrand?
[18:19] <jdstrand> I'm on community
[18:19] <jdstrand> last week I did quite a bit of install auditing for maverick, and will continue that this week
[18:19] <jdstrand> the rng tests are still churning away
[18:20] <jdstrand> I got back into my libvirt update and am continuing to work on it
[18:20] <jdstrand> there is some upstream feedback that I need to tend to on libvirt not related to that update
[18:20] <jdstrand> I plan to start looking at moodle once libvirt is out the door
[18:20] <kees> oh, that reminds me, I'm happy with the dieharder results. it's got a few sensitive tests, but other than that, it looks good.
[18:20] <jdstrand> I'm not sure that will be this week or next, but that is the plan
[18:21] <jdstrand> kees: were you able to update the qrt test to be less sensitive? I saw some commits go by, but didn't look at them closely
[18:22] <kees> jdstrand: basically it came down to two specific tests complaining, so I set them to XFAIL. I didn't create anything more complex, as that seemed like overkill.
[18:22] <jdstrand> kees: sounds fine
[18:23] <jdstrand> wrt the rng tests, I'm doing collision testing and the kernel passed for both /dev/random and /dev/urandom
[18:23] <jdstrand> it is in the gnupg tests now
[18:23] <kees> excellent
[18:24] <jdstrand> I have one item for the end of the meeting, and stefanlsd may also have something (or may not, it is up to him)
[18:24] <jdstrand> that is it from me (until later)
[18:25] <jdstrand> we could mention that we've all done our gpg migration
[18:25] <kees> indeed!
[18:25] <jdstrand> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/GPGMigration
[18:26] <jdstrand> for those listening at home, we've tested various applications and how they deal with the new secure defaults from upstream gnupg
[18:26] <jdstrand> for lucid and maverick
[18:27] <jdstrand> we determined it was ok to migrate, and have instructions on what to do to migrate keys in that wiki link
[18:27] <jdstrand> (the wiki has the results of the investigations)
[18:27]  * jdstrand is really done, until the end
[18:28] <stefanlsd> I wanted to speak about community uploaded rights to -security for unseeded, but wanted to chat to a few more people, so i'll postpone till i have more info.
[18:29] <kees> sbeattie: oh, btw, can you update your reviews of mutt and gmail to use the review template?
[18:29] <sbeattie> kees: sure thing.
[18:30] <kees> jdstrand: the stuff you added about removing your old key...
[18:30] <kees> jdstrand: why not just specify a numerical id instead of email?
[18:30] <kees> e.g. debsign can use an id
[18:31] <jdstrand> kees: that is indeed the recommended and first method under the NOTE
[18:32] <kees> jdstrand: right, I guess I mean, why should the other method ever be used?
[18:32] <jdstrand> kees: they only (potential) problem with that is if you have several applications to change. you might want to instead change the order of your secret keyring so they all just get the default
[18:33] <jdstrand> kees: ie, what you suggest is for every application. the 2nd method will affect all applications but is a little trickier
[18:33] <kees> jdstrand: okidoky. I found one place in umt where it was using email instead of id, and fixed that. otherwise, everything else I found uses id
[18:33] <kees> right
[18:33] <jdstrand> the third is weird, and could be removed, but is listed for completeness
[18:34] <kees> okidoky. sounds fine; was just curious how it even came up as a need. :) sorry to derail!
[18:34] <jdstrand> I had to change quite a few things, but won't list them
[18:35] <kees> I changed it in 3 places. .devscripts .ubuntu-security-tools.conf .muttrc
[18:35] <jdstrand> kees: it came up because I kept finding stuff and wanted it to be changed in one spot rather than many
[18:35]  * kees nods
[18:35] <jdstrand> kees: it was rather evolutionary
[18:35] <kees> 4, .gnupg/gpg.conf
[18:35] <kees> anyway... you had another topic?
[18:35] <jdstrand> yes, it was for what to include in the lucid apparmor sru
[18:36] <jdstrand> I plan to perform the sru, but wanted to coordinate with jj-afk and sbeattie
[18:36] <jdstrand> jj-afk is still out, so maybe we'll discuss it in #ubuntu-hardened when he is online
[18:37] <jdstrand> (he mentioned he might pop in for the discussion)
[18:37] <sbeattie> okay.
[18:38] <jdstrand> so, that is it from me
[18:38] <kees> will we SRU 2.5.1 final to maverick first?
[18:40] <jdstrand> kees: that is part of the discuss I think
[18:40] <jdstrand> discussion
[18:40] <jdstrand> right now, we know we want 2.5.1, but there are also some attractive testsuite fixes in 2.5.2
[18:41] <jdstrand> maverick has most of 2.5.1 anyway, so... there is a lot to talk about :)
[18:41] <kees> heh
[18:42] <kees> well, getting lucid onto 2.5.1 will fix the kernel instabilities too, iirc.
[18:42]  * sbeattie was hoping someone would ack the rest of the 2.5 testsuite nominations he made. :-)
[18:42] <jdstrand> kees: but iiuc, you want to make sure that lucid isn't ahead of maverick. it won't be-- we will do a maverick SRU first, then lucid, depending on what we want
[18:43] <kees> cool
[18:43] <jdstrand> kees: actually, lucid should be solid now with just the kernel updates
[18:43] <kees> jdstrand: did the kernel updates actually make it into lucid?
[18:43] <jdstrand> kees: but the userspace will still generate some invalid cache entries, but the kernel dtrt
[18:43] <kees> bug 581525 seems to indicate lucid's kernel updates never happened.
[18:44] <jdstrand> kees: that is a good question. I thought so... we need to follow up with jj-afk
[18:44] <jdstrand> oh, indeed
[18:44] <jdstrand> hrm
[18:44] <kees> that's why I was hoping to get the lucid SRU sooner rather than later; that problem has been languishing
[18:44] <jdstrand> well, we need that in lucid regardless. the apparmor userspace would help avoid it, but we really want the kernel side
[18:45] <kees> sure, yeah
[18:45] <kees> okay, anyone have anything else for the security team?
[18:45] <jdstrand> kees: I was not suggesting 2.5.2 for lucid. I was wanting to identify what we want from 2.5.2 if anything, pull it in and then push
[18:45] <jdstrand> sorry if I was unclear
[18:46] <jdstrand> I would like to see the sru done by the end of the month
[18:46] <kees> cool
[18:49] <jdstrand> shall we call it a meeting?
[19:01] <kees> yawp, all done. thanks everyone!
[19:09] <jdstrand> thanks kees! :)


[00:57] <mikal> .
[02:37] <Myk_> can someone help me figure out ssh
[02:37] <Myk_> im trying to work with aws
[02:38] <Myk_> first i download the pubic key, then create rsa key, then i dont know what text i add to what file, I think hosts
[02:38] <Myk_> ???
[17:03] <tyska> guys
[17:03] <tyska> can someone help me with eucalyptus and ubuntu 10.04?


[01:57] <Miranda``> I've added the /etc/init/xbmc.conf upstart job and changed Xwrapper.config, XBMC loaded correctly once. I switched to another terminal and fired up 'startx' to install nvidia-driver, now when I reboot, it goes to the desktop instead of XBMC. Any ideas why?
[01:57] <Miranda``> It's almost like it's trying to start 2 instances of X. I've got an Xorg.0.log as well as an Xorg.1.log, both with the same creation date/time
[22:57] <shawn> hello upstart superheroes
[22:57] <shawn> anyone know if upstart 1.5 should support instance variable names in other stanzas such as setuid?
[22:58] <shawn> if I have instance $user
[22:58] <shawn> can I have a stanza like
[22:58] <shawn> setuid $user
[22:58] <shawn> ?
[22:58] <shawn> it doesn't seem to work on my ubuntu machine
[23:56] <xnox> shawn: setuid stanza accepts either numeric or symbolic name.
[23:56] <xnox> shawn: not variables.


[01:29] <callmepk> good morning
[01:33] <duflu> Morning callmepk
[01:41] <callmepk> hi duflu
[06:20] <jpnurmi> good morning
[06:21] <callmepk> hi jpnurmi
[06:51] <duflu> Hi jpnurmi
[07:14] <didrocks> good morning
[07:15] <duflu> Hi didrocks
[07:15] <callmepk> hi didrocks
[07:19] <didrocks> hey duflu, callmepk
[07:25] <seb128> goood morning desktopers
[07:26] <callmepk> hi seb128
[07:27] <didrocks> salut seb128
[07:32] <duflu> Hi seb128
[08:03] <laney> \o
[08:14] <duflu> Hi laney
[08:16] <didrocks> hey laney
[08:20] <callmepk> hi laney
[08:30] <seb128> hey again IRC
[08:30] <seb128> hey duflu, callmepk, didrocks, how are you?
[08:31] <duflu> seb128, going well. You?
[08:31] <seb128> I'm alright thanks!
[08:32] <didrocks> seb128: I’m fine, thanks!
[08:39] <laney> hey duflu didrocks callmepk seb128
[08:48] <callmepk> seb128 I am okay, thanks
[09:24] <seb128> hey laney, how are you?
[09:40] <laney> moin seb128
[09:41] <laney> doing alright, having fun with firewalls
[12:40] <laney> mdeslaur: looks like the webkit2gtk merge made component-mismatches explode; -bad needs to be dropped I think
[12:40] <mdeslaur> laney: already done, look in -proposed
[12:42] <laney> ah nice
[12:42] <laney> thanks!
[12:43] <mdeslaur> np!
[14:48] <hellsworth> good morning desktopers
[14:49] <kenvandine> good morning hellsworth
[14:49] <hellsworth> o/ kenvandine
[14:50] <didrocks999> hey hellsworth
[14:51] <hellsworth> hi there didrocks999


[10:36] <slyon> seb128: I'm currently re-considering the libcamera MIR (looking mostly good, bug #1997560). Is it still true that you only need the libcamera0.0.5 package promoted and none of the (new/splitted) libcamera-{ipa,tools,v4l2} or gstreamer1.0-libcamera packages?
[10:36] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 1997560 in libcamera (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libcamera" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1997560
[11:06] <slyon> Well... I guess those split packages are fine anyways (except -tools). So nevermind.
[14:30] <cpaelzer_> o/
[14:30] <slyon> \o
[14:30] <eslerm> o/
[14:30] <dviererbe> o/
[14:30] <cpaelzer> #startmeeting Weekly Main Inclusion Requests status
[14:30] <meetingology> Meeting started at 14:30:40 UTC.  The chair is cpaelzer.  Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
[14:30] <meetingology> Available commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick
[14:30] <cpaelzer> Ping for MIR meeting - didrocks joalif slyon sarnold cpaelzer jamespage ( eslerm dviererbe )
[14:30] <cpaelzer> Hello everyone
[14:30] <cpaelzer> glad to see so many waiting
[14:31] <cpaelzer> so without further ado, jumping on agenda point 1
[14:31] <cpaelzer> #topic current component mismatches
[14:31] <cpaelzer> Mission: Identify required actions and spread the load among the teams
[14:31] <cpaelzer> #link https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.svg
[14:31] <cpaelzer> #link https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.svg
[14:31] <cpaelzer> bryce is still working on that spamassassin case
[14:31] <cpaelzer> it seems we will need it
[14:31] <cpaelzer> and he preps the paperwork
[14:31] <cpaelzer> but as in the past, those perl libs are just structural wrappers around the source
[14:32] <didrocks> o/
[14:32] <cpaelzer> so we have been - and here for efficiency - do some less deep checks
[14:32] <cpaelzer> mostly "is this really such a simple case"
[14:32] <cpaelzer> but, not open for review yet
[14:32] <cpaelzer> just a heads up
[14:32] <joalif> o/
[14:32] <cpaelzer> jamespage: the other never ending story is yourd - jaraco.text
[14:33] <cpaelzer> when you read this later, let us know what the state and expectation on this should be
[14:33] <cpaelzer> we have a new cycle, so everything might be different now :-)
[14:33] <cpaelzer> ruby has gotten stub bugs
[14:33] <cpaelzer> existing, but not yet ready
[14:33] <sarnold> good morning
[14:33] <cpaelzer> I see nothing else new in those files
[14:34] <cpaelzer> hello also to didrocks joalif and sarnold
[14:34] <cpaelzer> and to slyon eslerm and dviererbe who were here before logging started :-)
[14:34] <cpaelzer> ok, going on
[14:34] <cpaelzer> #topic New MIRs
[14:34] <cpaelzer> Mission: ensure to assign all incoming reviews for fast processing
[14:34] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?field.searchtext=&orderby=-date_last_updated&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&assignee_option=none&field.assignee=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[14:35] <sarnold> oof, good luck to bryce
[14:35] <cpaelzer> hehe
[14:35] <cpaelzer> as i said, ruby isn't really ready yet
[14:35] <cpaelzer> so we can ignore that for this week
[14:35] <cpaelzer> I'll mark them incomplete for now
[14:36] <cpaelzer> that leaves https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dotnet6/+bug/2023531
[14:36] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2023531 in dotnet6 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] dotnet6" [Undecided, New]
[14:36] <dviererbe> I filed an MIR for dotnet6. Its a large and complex package but there is no time pressure to get it into main this cycle
[14:36] <cpaelzer> dviererbe: dare you, how could you brind this
[14:36] <cpaelzer> it is huge for sure
[14:36] <slyon> dviererbe: I guess foundations would be the owning team. I can see it subscribed.. do you want me to do that?
[14:36] <slyon> can't*
[14:37] <cpaelzer> dviererbe: any reason to start with dotnet6 and not 7 ?
[14:37] <cpaelzer> or is 7 already up and in some interim state?
[14:37] <dviererbe> We only want to MIR LTS versions
[14:37] <cpaelzer> (maybe I should read the bug)
[14:37] <sarnold>   - This MIR exists in parralel to the MIR for dotnet7
[14:37] <dviererbe> cpaelzer: Waht does "brind mean"
[14:38] <cpaelzer> bring + a typo
[14:38] <cpaelzer> As I understood, dotnet7 is not an LTS, so no MIR for it
[14:38] <dviererbe> ohh... I'm sorry
[14:38] <dviererbe> correct
[14:38] <cpaelzer> dviererbe: what are the target releases for this - only mantic or later?
[14:38] <cpaelzer> dviererbe: or will this be going back in time, as you backport all of it all the time anyway
[14:39] <dviererbe> Including all, back until jammy would be preferred
[14:39] <sarnold> will we have both dotnet6 and dotnet8 in 24.04 LTS ? https://dotnet.microsoft.com/en-us/platform/support/policy/dotnet-core
[14:39] <cpaelzer> or will you make a choice
[14:39] <dviererbe> dotnet8 will be there in 24.04
[14:39] <cpaelzer> which dotnet matches which Ubuntu LTSes
[14:39] <sarnold> "Even numbered releases are LTS releases that get free support and patches for three years." oof that's long, eh? :(
[14:40] <cpaelzer> so will it be dotnet6 18-04->23.10 and then dotnet8 24.04->future ?
[14:40] <dviererbe> only since jammy
[14:41] <cpaelzer> ?
[14:41] <dviererbe> The actual support strategy is a little bit complicated. I will add a comment to the bug
[14:41] <sarnold> thanks
[14:41] <cpaelzer> dotnet8 on >=jammy - is that it
[14:41] <cpaelzer> appreciate that
[14:41] <sarnold> what's our plan for after the end of upstream support?
[14:42] <dviererbe> If I recall correctly dotnet8 will only be needed in >= 24.04 and dotnet6 in >= 22.04
[14:42] <dviererbe> The plan is to provide a transitional package that deinstalls dotnet when it reaches EOL
[14:42] <sarnold> aha, interesting
[14:42] <dviererbe> We already talked with security about that
[14:42] <cpaelzer> wow
[14:43] <cpaelzer> umm, yeah please outline that on the bug :-)
[14:43] <sarnold> it does sound familiar. sigh :( my memory isn't what it was :(
[14:43] <dviererbe> no worries you have a lot to do
[14:43] <cpaelzer> ok, I made a post on the bug
[14:43] <cpaelzer> and I'm waiting for dviererbe to add more details later
[14:43] <cpaelzer> in any case, we need to start a review on it
[14:44] <cpaelzer> and that isn't as special in this case
[14:44] <cpaelzer> as things with daemons and ports are often more complex to review
[14:44] <sarnold> do we have such strong feelings about 'no generated objects / sources' the same way debian does?
[14:44] <cpaelzer> this is more pain for security later on I guess
[14:44] <cpaelzer> sarnold: we do have the opinion to avoid whenever possible, but not strictly forbid them AFAIK
[14:44] <sarnold> this feels likely to be supported via the 'big blog from MS' model
[14:44] <sarnold> s/blog/blob/'
[14:44] <cpaelzer> s/blog/blob/ ?
[14:45] <cpaelzer> yeah :-)
[14:45] <cpaelzer> ok, counting slyon out as he is in the requesting team
[14:45] <sarnold> which I have to say isn't very pleasing when applied to eg mysql
[14:45] <dviererbe> sarnold: Maybe you can talk with Ian about the dotnet package. we work with him for security releases
[14:45]  * slyon nods
[14:45] <cpaelzer> that leaves joalif didrocks or me to review
[14:45] <cpaelzer> volunteers or should I roll a dice
[14:46] <joalif> roll a dice :p
[14:46] <didrocks> if there is no time constraints, I can take it, but we can make it fun too with a dice roll :)
[14:46] <cpaelzer> 1-2 me, 3-4 joalif, 5-6 didrocks
[14:46] <cpaelzer> 1
[14:46] <cpaelzer> = me
[14:46] <sarnold> snake eyes!
[14:46] <dviererbe> I'm sorry :/
[14:46] <cpaelzer> there goes my automation of statistics ... o/
[14:47] <didrocks> sorry too for you :/ wonder how you did your dice roll though!
[14:47] <cpaelzer> all fine dviererbe
[14:47] <cpaelzer> didrocks: I have literally dices on my desk for planning and situations like this
[14:47] <sarnold> :D
[14:47] <cpaelzer> benefit of old role players I can cover any team size
[14:47] <cpaelzer> ok, going on
[14:47] <didrocks> waow, that’s orgnanization! :)
[14:47] <cpaelzer> #topic Incomplete bugs / questions
[14:47] <cpaelzer> Mission: Identify required actions and spread the load among the teams
[14:47] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?field.searchtext=&orderby=-date_last_updated&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[14:47] <sarnold> I wanna see that three-sided die
[14:47] <cpaelzer> sarnold: you do realize thet is a D6/2
[14:48] <cpaelzer> primes are hard
[14:48] <sarnold> oh. that's less fun.
[14:48] <cpaelzer> but as manager we can be creative
[14:48] <cpaelzer> two of the recent cases are in here
[14:48] <cpaelzer> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairomm1.16/+bug/2020273
[14:48] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2020273 in cairomm1.16 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] cairomm1.16" [Undecided, Incomplete]
[14:48] <cpaelzer> tasks of slyon for4 jbicha
[14:48] <slyon> I had a question about the symbols handling on this one ^
[14:48] <sarnold> "This does not need a security review"  <3 :)
[14:48] <cpaelzer> state ok for now
[14:48] <slyon> as discussed on the mailinglist
[14:49] <cpaelzer> so we are coming back to symbosl
[14:49] <cpaelzer> symbols
[14:49] <cpaelzer> I haven't seen that, do you have a link slyon?
[14:50] <cpaelzer> is that the continuation of the discussion seb opened a while ago?
[14:50] <sarnold> yeah
[14:50] <slyon> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairomm1.16/+bug/2020273/comments/2 - my normal MIR review
[14:50] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2020273 in cairomm1.16 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] cairomm1.16" [Undecided, Incomplete]
[14:50] <cpaelzer> IIRC last week we said he is writing a PR to clarify the "one should try"
[14:50] <joalif> talking about symbols in my review this week https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtkmm4.0/+bug/2020472 , symbols were missing as well for gtkmm4.0 but I wrote it is ok since gtkmm3.0 are also missing and is already in universe
[14:50] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2020472 in gtkmm4.0 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gtkmm4.0" [Undecided, In Progress]
[14:50] <slyon> essentially, I couldn't find a previous MIR (seems this has been in main forever). So I did a full review
[14:50] <cpaelzer> slyon: yeah, that happened to me as well
[14:51] <slyon> cairomm[1.16] does not ship any .symbols files and I could not find any other attempt at ABI compatibilty testing. Therefore, I asked the questions why it should be skipped for this package (cc jbicha)
[14:51] <cpaelzer> yeah
[14:51] <cpaelzer> and as discussed we want to see it tried and given up for a reason
[14:51] <cpaelzer> instead of giving up generally
[14:51] <didrocks> agreed
[14:51] <slyon> right.
[14:51] <cpaelzer> ok for now
[14:52] <cpaelzer> let us wait what the answer is
[14:52] <cpaelzer> to close out this agenda item - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libhttp-cookiejar-perl/+bug/2024245 - has an open question and therefore is ok to be incomplete for now
[14:52] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2024245 in libhttp-cookiejar-perl (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libhttp-cookiejar-perl" [Undecided, Incomplete]
[14:52] <slyon> And accepting it just because it has been bad before (without any reasoning given) isn't good
[14:52] <slyon> IMHO
[14:52] <cpaelzer> yep
[14:52] <cpaelzer> there is some balance to strike, but yes
[14:52] <cpaelzer> we can keep it at that for now
[14:52] <cpaelzer> #topic Process/Documentation improvements
[14:52] <cpaelzer> Mission: Review pending process/documentation pull-requests or issues
[14:52] <cpaelzer> #link https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/pulls
[14:52] <cpaelzer> #link https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/issues
[14:52] <jbicha> .
[14:53] <cpaelzer> oh, hi jbicha
[14:53] <cpaelzer> do you want to immediately discuss/report about that?
[14:53] <cpaelzer> or only seen the highlights so far
[14:53] <jbicha> for glibmm2.68, I have a draft to force symbols tracking for amd64 on Ubuntu only https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/glibmm2.68/-/merge_requests/2
[14:53] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Merge 2 in gnome-team/glibmm2.68 "Draft: Add symbols tracking" [Opened]
[14:53] <cpaelzer> awesome
[14:53] <cpaelzer> thanks jbicha
[14:53] <jbicha> I can investigate cairomm1.16 then too
[14:54] <cpaelzer> let us know via an update in the bug if you think this lands in time or if you expect this to take ages (more thna you can wait with promotion)
[14:54] <slyon> that'd be great, thanks jbicha
[14:54] <cpaelzer> while we are at it - here we have the aforementioned PR about symbols
[14:54] <cpaelzer> https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/pull/27
[14:54] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Pull 27 in canonical/ubuntu-mir "Document a possible symbols exception for c++ libraries" [Open]
[14:56] <cpaelzer> I think slyon and I commented
[14:56] <jbicha> I'm curious to see how difficult it is to update the symbols for glibmm for the next major release. The Desktop Team may come back to the MIR team if it's just too much of a headache
[14:56] <cpaelzer> we can wait for an answer
[14:56] <cpaelzer> jbicha: that sounds fair to me
[14:56] <jbicha> I expect to have an update for cairomm by next week's meeting
[14:56] <joalif> jbicha: symbols are missing for gtkmm4.0 too could you also take a look at it ?
[14:57] <joalif> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtkmm4.0/+bug/2020472
[14:57] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 2020472 in gtkmm4.0 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gtkmm4.0" [Undecided, Incomplete]
[14:57] <sarnold> jbicha: I really like the sound of that salsa merge request
[14:57] <cpaelzer> while making progress - the other PR up is https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/pull/28
[14:57] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Pull 28 in canonical/ubuntu-mir "Explicitly state that reviews are about source packages" [Open]
[14:57] <jbicha> gtkmm will be like glibmm so I'll aim to complete by next meeting too
[14:57] <cpaelzer> slyon: that is simple enough and I'm +1
[14:58] <cpaelzer> if no one objects I'd merge it as-is
[14:58] <cpaelzer> any -1 here?
[14:58] <sarnold> +1
[14:58] <joalif> +1
[14:58] <cpaelzer> enough for me as it is trivial
[14:58] <cpaelzer> thanks
[14:58] <didrocks> answered +1 on the PR, unsure how useful this is, but ok :)
[14:58] <cpaelzer> the other cases are open
[14:58] <cpaelzer> but not ready
[14:59] <cpaelzer> the only issue worth is https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/issues/26
[14:59] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Issue 26 in canonical/ubuntu-mir "Decide if we get enough value from c++ symbols tracking to keep doing it" [Open]
[14:59] <cpaelzer> sarnold:  given the changes, can we close this now?
[14:59] <cpaelzer> if you are ok, please do so sarnold
[14:59] <cpaelzer> and keeping time in mind, I'm going on ...
[14:59] <sarnold> cpaelzer: I figured we'd close it when we merge in https://github.com/canonical/ubuntu-mir/pull/27
[14:59] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Pull 27 in canonical/ubuntu-mir "Document a possible symbols exception for c++ libraries" [Open]
[14:59] <cpaelzer> ack @sarnold
[14:59] <cpaelzer> #topic MIR related Security Review Queue
[14:59] <cpaelzer> Mission: Check on progress, do deadlines seem doable?
[14:59] <cpaelzer> Some clients can only work with one, some with the other escaping - the URLs point to the same place.
[14:59] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/+bugs?field.searchtext=%5BMIR%5D&assignee_option=choose&field.assignee=ubuntu-security&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[15:00] <cpaelzer> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/+bugs?field.searchtext=[MIR]&assignee_option=choose&field.assignee=ubuntu-security&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-mir
[15:00] <cpaelzer> Internal link
[15:00] <cpaelzer> - ensure your teams items are prioritized among each other as you'd expect
[15:00] <cpaelzer> - ensure community requests do not get stomped by teams calling for favors too much
[15:00] <cpaelzer> #link https://warthogs.atlassian.net/jira/software/c/projects/SEC/boards/594
[15:00] <cpaelzer> That LGTM - any concerns from your side sarnold ?
[15:00] <sarnold> that big pile of perl is worrying ..
[15:00] <sarnold> but right now, things feel pretty good
[15:00] <cpaelzer> it is coming
[15:00] <cpaelzer> but usually those go by mostly without security
[15:00] <cpaelzer> we will see
[15:00] <cpaelzer> thanks sarnold
[15:00] <cpaelzer> #topic Any other business?
[15:00] <cpaelzer> please mind that your other meetings might start now
[15:00] <didrocks> nothing here
[15:01] <cpaelzer> this is done any minute ...
[15:01] <eslerm> cargo and rust dependencies
[15:01] <sarnold> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dh-builtusing ...
[15:01] <cpaelzer> yeah you wanted to bring those up last time
[15:01] <cpaelzer> we might lose qorum, but you should bring up the question for awareness
[15:01] <slyon> I think we'd need didrocks opinion on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cargo/+bug/1993819/comments/5 to move forward the cargo MIR
[15:01] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Launchpad bug 1993819 in dh-cargo (Ubuntu) "MIR: cargo, dh-cargo" [High, In Progress]
[15:01] <sarnold> is ^^ this thing Good Enough? please skim it :)
[15:01] <cpaelzer> and if we can not close it out bring it up as first item next time
[15:02] <didrocks> yeah, as I didn’t "win" any MIR this week, I can have another look at this
[15:02] <cpaelzer> thank you didrocks
[15:02] <eslerm> at the Rust Support in Main meeting in Prague, other teams agreed to define a policy for tracking rebuild-dependencies
[15:02] <eslerm> this is important to the Security Team, as we need to rebuild Rust packages when vulnerabilities in their dependencies are patched
[15:02] <eslerm> i.e., patching a package should trigger rebuilding all statically linked reverse-dependencies, and rebuilds of their reverse-dependencies, and so on
[15:02] <cpaelzer> yeah, that is driven by foundations IIRC
[15:02] <eslerm> at the meeting we agreed that this new policy should apply to all packages, not just Rust
[15:03] <didrocks> I think as foundation has toolchains maintainer, this is rather something between security and them, no?
[15:03] <cpaelzer> yes didrocks
[15:03] <didrocks> (I'm happy to give a hand on Go, and explaining how this works out for it as I think I might be the one with the most awareness of govulncheck and so on…)
[15:03] <cpaelzer> slyon: would you chase down internally if this was lost or net even meant to be on foundations plate?
[15:04] <slyon> Yes, will do
[15:04] <cpaelzer> thanks
[15:04] <cpaelzer> we are good for today
[15:04] <cpaelzer> sorry to have kept you so long
[15:04] <cpaelzer> but it is important, all the time
[15:04] <cpaelzer> o/
[15:04] <sarnold> thanks cpaelzer, all
[15:04] <cpaelzer> #endmeeting
[15:04] <eslerm> thanks everyone
[15:04] <meetingology> Meeting ended at 15:04:45 UTC.  Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2023/ubuntu-meeting.2023-06-27-14.30.moin.txt
[15:04] <eslerm> o/
[15:04] <didrocks> thanks!
[15:04] <dviererbe> Thanks!
[15:05] <slyon> thanks. I'll try to get back to eslerm about the rebuild-tracking policy
[15:07] <eslerm> thank you slyon
[19:00] <sil2100> o/
[19:00] <rbasak> o/
[19:00] <amurray> o/
[19:00] <rbasak> I don't have any progress to report this meeting unfortunately. But I'm around now.
[19:00] <seb128> hey
[19:00] <sil2100> Hello!
[19:01] <sil2100> #startmeeting Technical Board Meeting
[19:01] <meetingology> Meeting started at 19:01:26 UTC.  The chair is sil2100.  Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
[19:01] <meetingology> Available commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick
[19:01] <sil2100> #topic Apologies
[19:01] <sil2100> I don't think there were any explicit apologies sent beforehand
[19:02] <sil2100> #topic Action review
[19:03] <sil2100> Since rbasak said there's no progress on his tasks, I'll carry them over. It's sadly the same for me, so I'll do that as well
[19:03] <sil2100> #action rbasak to get agreed backporter charter https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/technical-board/2023-June/002740.html documented under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoard/
[19:03] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to get agreed backporter charter https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/technical-board/2023-June/002740.html documented under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoard/
[19:03]  * sil2100 seb128/amurray/sil200 to help drafting the snap-store Ubuntu-specific tracks usage
[19:03] <sil2100> amurray, seb128: any news on this from your side?
[19:04] <amurray> I had proposed something a while ago but I think the doc still shows it as a suggestion - so I guess that is awaiting feedback?
[19:05] <amurray> oh I see - seb128 and ken provided some comments - i guess I need to go read those - righto - let me take that as a carry-over then
[19:05] <sil2100> amurray: thanks!
[19:06] <sil2100> #action seb128/amurray/sil200 to help drafting the snap-store Ubuntu-specific tracks usage
[19:06] <meetingology> ACTION: seb128/amurray/sil200 to help drafting the snap-store Ubuntu-specific tracks usage
[19:06] <sil2100> Ok, mine is carry-over
[19:06] <sil2100> #action sil2100 to start a draft summarizing the OEM archive portion of the meeting which x-nox and TB will review, edit, and ratify before we move on to figuring out the next step
[19:06] <meetingology> ACTION: sil2100 to start a draft summarizing the OEM archive portion of the meeting which x-nox and TB will review, edit, and ratify before we move on to figuring out the next step
[19:06] <sil2100> #action rbasak to draft a proposal of the DMB-proposed inactivity expiration policy for TB ratification
[19:06] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to draft a proposal of the DMB-proposed inactivity expiration policy for TB ratification
[19:06] <sil2100> #action rbasak to follow up on finding consensus on question of test plans for third party apps
[19:06] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to follow up on finding consensus on question of test plans for third party apps
[19:06] <sil2100> #action rbasak to restructure the third-party repo doc to make the status clearer
[19:06] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to restructure the third-party repo doc to make the status clearer
[19:07] <sil2100> #action rbasak to open wider discussion on third-party repo policy
[19:07] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to open wider discussion on third-party repo policy
[19:07] <sil2100> Now it's this one:
[19:07]  * sil2100 rbasak, vorlon, amurray to replay their responses to Key Ubuntu teams discussion
[19:07] <seb128> sil2100, we are missing your input on that discussion! :-)
[19:08] <sil2100> seb128: I know! I think I need an action item for that too :(
[19:08] <seb128> but the 'reply' part is done
[19:08] <seb128> replay
[19:08] <sil2100> Ok, so I'll add this as done and add an action item for me
[19:08] <seb128> though I think my main concern wasn't address and there was no reply to my most recent email
[19:08] <sil2100> #done rbasak, vorlon, amurray to replay their responses to Key Ubuntu teams discussion
[19:08] <seb128> but maybe others aren't interested in addressing that part, hard to say
[19:09] <sil2100> #action sil2100 to follow up on the Key Ubuntu teams discussion
[19:09] <meetingology> ACTION: sil2100 to follow up on the Key Ubuntu teams discussion
[19:10] <sil2100> seb128: I'll really try hard to find a slot to address this, maybe my reply will help things moving forward
[19:10] <sil2100> Anyway, let's move on
[19:10] <sil2100> #topic Scan the mailing list archive for anything we missed (standing item)
[19:10] <sil2100> #link https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/technical-board/2023-June/thread.html
[19:11] <sil2100> Nothing here, just the Key Ubuntu teams discussion which I'm really bad at following up on...
[19:11] <sil2100> #topic Check up on community bugs and techboard bugs
[19:11] <sil2100> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-community/+bugs?field.assignee=techboard
[19:11] <sil2100> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/techboard
[19:11] <sil2100> No new bugs open besides the ones we already know about
[19:12] <sil2100> #topic Select a chair for the next meeting (next from https://launchpad.net/~techboard/+members)
[19:12] <sil2100> #agreed next meeting chair: amurray, backup: rbasak
[19:12] <meetingology> AGREED: next meeting chair: amurray, backup: rbasak
[19:12] <sil2100> #topic AOB
[19:12] <sil2100> Any other business?
[19:12] <sil2100> The floor is open
[19:12] <seb128> not from me
[19:13] <amurray> nothing from me
[19:13] <sil2100> There was a potential new item via the ML re: the adsys MRE, but I think that was resolved without requiring input from the TB
[19:14] <rbasak> Yeah I think that's now an SRU team item to figure out.
[19:14] <sil2100> Okay then, it's a quick meeting then. Maybe I can find time to start gathering time for the Key Ubuntu teams discussion for the reminder of the meeting
[19:14] <seb128> that would be nice indeed :)
[19:14] <sil2100> #endmeeting
[19:14] <meetingology> Meeting ended at 19:14:32 UTC.  Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2023/ubuntu-meeting.2023-06-27-19.01.moin.txt
[19:14] <sil2100> Thank you everyone o/
[19:14] <amurray> thanks sil2100
[19:14] <seb128> thanks sil2100 for chairing!
[19:14] <seb128> efficient meetings are the best :p


[00:42] <CarlFK> https://git.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cloud-initramfs-tools/tree/overlayroot
[00:42] <CarlFK> how can I see all the commits to files under overlayroot ?
[00:43] <CarlFK> I am trying to catch up https://salsa.debian.org/cloud-team/cloud-initramfs-tools/-/tree/debian/unstable/overlayroot
[01:20] <cjwatson> CarlFK: follow the "log" link to https://git.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cloud-initramfs-tools/log/overlayroot - that lists only the commits that touched files under that directory
[01:21] <cjwatson> And the commit messages link to commit diffs limited to that part of the tree
[01:21] <CarlFK> got it - yes, that's what I wanted.  thank you!


[00:10] <andylockran> heya
[00:15] <s-fox> Hello andylockran
[00:55] <jimmie> Im not sure if anyone else uses Deluge, but does it always have to re-check files after a reboot, or is there a way to turn that off?
[01:01] <ujjain> How many cities have subways in the UK?
[01:02] <jimmie> As in, a station for trains underground
[01:02] <jimmie> Or the overpriced, shite sandwich shop?
[01:04] <jimmie> Also how is that relevant?
[01:04] <jimmie> Even if it was noone here would know.
[01:05] <ujjain> hehe.
[01:05] <ujjain> I know for Holland.
[01:05] <ujjain> we have 3 cities with a subway system.
[01:06] <ujjain> oh 2
[01:07] <jimmie> OK
[01:07] <jimmie> But I still dont see the relevance of that fact
[01:07] <jimmie> Are you a subway enthusiast?
[01:07] <jimmie> Or just a common trainspotter?
[01:08] <jimmie> Or a trainspotter dealing exclusively in subterranean trains?
[01:24] <JGJones> ujjain, Newcastle have the Metro, parts of which is underground in the centre
[01:25] <JGJones> Can't think of anywhere else that have an underground in UK (most use buses and trams sometimes)
[01:26] <JGJones> Oh yeah...Glasgow have an underground too, 2nd in UK after London
[01:26] <ujjain> JGJones: ah k :) London has.
[01:26] <ujjain> ah ok.
[01:27] <JGJones> Yeah London does have one (it's the first underground rail system in world)
[01:27] <JGJones> and I think the largest too.
[01:28] <JGJones> London even had an underground Post Office railways - small trains that hail letters etc, but that closed down
[01:30] <JGJones> that's all I can think of...Newcastle, London and Glasgow.
[01:31] <JGJones> any others I wouldn't know but I doubt it (the largest cities in UK is London followed by Glasgow then B'ham (which doesn't have an underground I think?)
[01:32] <JGJones> Ah, just been informed Liverpool have one too - that make 4.
[01:32] <JGJones> Any reason you're keen on underground systems? :-) (although if you want a BUSY one, go to Moscow)
[01:35] <jimmie> He didnt tell me why he was interested in trains either
[01:35] <jimmie> I can only assume hes gathering intelligence for the Dutch, and stage 1 of their invasion is to hit us where it hurts
[01:35] <jimmie> Cheap public transport
[01:36] <jimmie> Actually it must be stage two, stage one was sending in operatives disguised as tramps to piss everywhere.
[01:36] <JGJones> they're more than welcome - there probably is a strike on the London Underground anyway :)
[01:37] <JGJones> so all invasion would ground to a halt until it's sorted
[01:37] <JGJones> by which there'll be another strike for some other little reason (and more pay of course)
[01:38] <jimmie> Heh yeah
[01:39] <JGJones> but on the plus side...don't the Dutch happen to brew decent beer?
[01:46] <ujjain> right.
[01:46] <ujjain> although Belgians are good too, but special beers.
[04:21] <jimmie> Im not sure if anyone else uses Deluge, but does it always have to re-check files after a reboot, or is there a way to turn that off?
[04:34] <Azelphur> jimmie: it only does that for me if something weird has happened
[04:34] <jimmie> Oh
[04:34] <jimmie> Well I just rebooted and that doesnt strike me as too odd so I dont know why it irks Deluge
[04:35] <jimmie> erks?
[04:35] <jimmie> No it must be irk
[04:35] <jimmie> Erk is just plain silly.
[04:37] <Azelphur> \o/
[08:25] <DJones> Morning all
[08:36] <hoover> morning all
[08:37] <diplo> Morning all
[08:37] <AlanBell> morning all
[08:39] <JGJones> Top of the morning all!
[08:40] <hoover> same to you Sir ;-)
[08:46] <daubers_> Morning!
[09:00] <MooDoo> hello all
[09:04] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[09:08] <hoover> mornin biggie, MooDoo
[09:10] <bigcalm> Hi hoovie. Having a fun week?
[09:16] <oimon> hi MooDoo, how was your desire custom rom exercise?
[09:16] <MooDoo> oimon: success :D
[09:17] <oimon> CM7?
[09:17] <MooDoo> yeah :D
[09:17] <oimon> does sense provide anything worthwhile?
[09:17] <MooDoo> oimon: not tested everything though but at the moment it's all ok
[09:18] <MooDoo> oimon: all i've noticed really is that's it's a lot quicker
[09:18] <MooDoo> not really had time to play
[09:18] <oimon> oh :)
[09:18] <oimon> will prob do the CM7 despite htc's u-turn
[09:18] <MooDoo> seriously?  they have decided to put it on?
[09:18] <oimon> yep lol
[09:19] <MooDoo> *sigh*
[09:19] <bigcalm> By reducing some apps in sence aparently
[09:19] <MooDoo> url?
[09:19] <oimon> http://www.androidauthority.com/htc-plays-indian-giver-with-gingerbread-update-for-htc-desire-16910/
[09:20] <MooDoo> ah well :D
[09:22] <JGJones> CM7's worth it, it's at least faster to use :)
[09:22] <JGJones> MooDoo, you can use gestures on the lockscreen to unlock directly into the app of your choice btw with CM7
[09:23] <MooDoo> JGJones: oooooo :)
[09:23] <JGJones> (ie I use S as a gesture to unlock straight to Shazam
[09:23] <oimon> i like that idea JGJones
[09:25] <MooDoo> czajkowski: you ok, just seen your tweet.....
[09:36] <popey> oimon: "indian giver"!? I thought that was one of those phrases that was deemed somewhat offensive to native americans :S
[09:36] <oimon> popey: huh?
[09:36] <popey> 09:19:45 < oimon> http://www.androidauthority.com/htc-plays-indian-giver-with-gingerbread-update-for-htc-desire-16910/
[09:36]  * popey shrugs
[09:36] <oimon> ah lol no idea
[09:37] <oimon> jsut copy and pasted from a tinyurl i was sent
[09:37] <oimon> nobody checks url nowadays :D
[09:37] <popey> heh
[09:39] <oimon> unfortuantely htc may have already damaged their reputation a little
[09:39] <MartijnVdS> With Sense?
[09:39] <oimon> with the fiasco surrounding the GB for Desire, and previous phone support too
[09:40] <oimon> Android phone makers promise to update new devices up to 18 months after initial release
[09:40] <popey> hahaha
[09:41] <popey> they blew their reputation ages ago for me
[09:41] <MartijnVdS> Guess why I only buy Google's own android phones
[09:41] <JGJones> MartijnVdS, same here :)
[09:41] <oimon> i think they make great handsets, like nokia used to
[09:41] <MartijnVdS> (Magic, N1, next one will be NS or its replacement)
[09:41] <JGJones> yeah but at least HTC is attempting to undo what they did - bootloader to be unlocked from now on etc.
[09:42] <MartijnVdS> JGJones: sure but they still have this "Sense" poo on their devices
[09:42] <MartijnVdS> I want stock android, like my N1 has
[09:42] <JGJones> MartijnVdS, yup, but Virgin mobile (I think USA only) is now planning to sell Android phones, but all manfacturer skins to be removed.
[09:43] <JGJones> ie no Sense.
[09:43] <MartijnVdS> JGJones: My N1 works fine for the moment ;)
[09:43] <JGJones> so you get a choice of whatever they sell, in stock Android.
[09:44] <JGJones> same here...N1 nice enough so that there's really no need whatsoever for dual core or whatever really...
[09:44] <JGJones> The only thing the N1 lack for me is a front camera.
[09:44] <MartijnVdS> My touchscreen is getting a bit flaky
[09:45] <MartijnVdS> (might be related to me holding it in my hand while running)
[09:45] <JGJones> N1 does have a inferior touchscreen - doesn't do multitouch that well at all.
[09:48] <oimon> MartijnVdS: i think sense was ahead of android for quite a while
[09:48] <MartijnVdS> oimon: Sense is bad.
[09:48] <oimon> then google added more features
[09:48] <JGJones> I replace the stock launcher with LauncherPro
[09:53] <shauno> feeling much better about my iphone reading this ;)
[09:53]  * daubers really wants a galaxy s 2 :(
[09:53] <oimon> shauno: what happens when apple release an ios update and don't include your phone?
[09:53] <oimon> at least android owners can use custom mods
[09:53] <daubers> oimon: Already happening. Some features of IOS5 not available to iPhone 3/3GS
[09:54] <shauno> about the same as after android's promised 18 months, I assume.  you're on your own :)
[09:54] <oimon> shauno: android owners can fall back on custom roms though
[09:55] <oimon> whicih are often better than the real thing
[09:55] <JGJones> I've got a HTC Magic - it's pretty old - it runs CM6
[09:55] <wintellect> Mornin all
[09:55] <shauno> there's not much stopping you installing mods on ios either
[09:55] <oimon> i didn't realise that was possible
[09:56] <oimon> due to closed source nature of ios
[09:56] <JGJones> CM6 is based on Froyo (2.2) while the Android on the HTC Magic by default was 1.6 with no upgrades so there's benefit to custom roms.
[09:56] <shauno> the OS itself isn't closed.  just the UI layer
[09:57] <shauno> darwin sources show up about as timely as google's source releases.  which isn't setting a very high bar
[09:57] <JGJones> There's a source for the iOS kernel?
[09:57] <shauno> bizarely, it's the same sourcetree as the desktop kernel
[09:57] <daubers> JGJones: _some_ of the iOS kernel
[09:57] <DJones> JGJones: How do you find CM6 on the magic, I was tempted to try that on an old Magic I've got at home but thought the processor/memory might limit it quite a bit
[09:58] <JGJones> DJones, Mine is actually the Vodafone model, which have half the memory of a standard HTC Magic actually I think.
[09:58] <JGJones> It's not fast
[09:58] <JGJones> but it works :)
[09:58] <DJones> JGJones: Mine would be the same vodaphone model
[09:59] <JGJones> not much difference speed-wise from Android 1.6 though...it's a slow phone.
[09:59] <JGJones> DJones, however I *think* Vodafone now have an upgrade for the HTC Magic?
[10:00] <JGJones> I'm sure I could look for a more optimised faster kernel for the HTC Magic, but I don't use the phone - my son does so I'm not fussy.
[10:00] <DJones> JGJones: I'd be surprised at that, last I heard, they had no plans to upgrade it to persuade people to upgrade to other phones
[10:00] <JGJones> DJones, yeah...hence why I slapped on CM6 :)
[10:01] <czajkowski> moodoo yup bf in hospital not me
[10:02] <JGJones> czajkowski, hope he's OK
[10:02] <czajkowski> yup tonsil out
[10:03] <AlanBell> so the tonsil is now free to persue a life of it's own
[10:03] <AlanBell> having had a jonectomy
[10:03] <JGJones> heh
[10:04] <wintellect> czajkowski: just the one tonsil out? I thought they'd take both out?!?
[10:05] <MooDoo> czajkowski: ok thanks, hope he's ok
[10:05] <MooDoo> as much as you can be having tonsils out
[10:05] <JGJones> wintellect, maybe they both didn't get on so one had to leave ;)
[10:09] <AlanBell> I am pretty hopeless with biology, wrong kind of scale for me
[10:09] <popey> and there's no man page
[10:10] <AlanBell> physics OK, Chemistry - OK if I can work it out using physics, biology - too big
[10:10] <wintellect> JGJones: lol
[10:10] <AlanBell> anything between the size of an atom and a star isn't really my thing
[10:16] <JGJones> AlanBell, them new-fangled TV with a lettered board and something called Interweb is damn confusing, but you're doing well ;-)
[10:17] <AlanBell> JGJones: it is all just a bunch of electrons
[10:19] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: and semiconductors
[10:20] <AlanBell> yup, good solid physics there (with a dash of yummy quantum)
[10:20] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: so.. you're subscribed to sixtysymbols and periodicvideos on youtube? :)
[10:33] <DJones> Unusual design choice from SOny for the S2 model http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMp-48J88FA&feature=player_embedded
[11:02] <oimon> DJones: reminds me of the litl netbook. litl.com
[11:03] <davmor2> morning all
[11:10] <oimon> saw a new message on facebook about a new uupc podcast...got excited, then realised it was last weeks uupc :(
[11:12] <popey> yeah
[11:12] <popey> for some reason facebook is rubbish at picking up the rss feed
[11:14] <oimon> weird
[11:15] <MooDoo> for some reason faceboko is rubbish :D
[11:15] <oimon> doesn't affect other people though :P
[11:16] <oimon> hmm. spent ages shoehorning lubuntu onto my eee and a week later i'm tempted to put mint 11 on it
[11:17] <popey> http://identi.ca/notice/76519429   /    http://twitter.com/#!/uupc/status/81666594174017536
[11:17] <popey> :D
[11:21] <oimon> woo
[11:22] <popey> yes. Woo!
[11:23] <MooDoo> awesome
[11:29] <dwatkins> wow, minedroid too, whatever next?
[11:34] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[11:34] <MooDoo> mornoing brobostigon
[11:34] <dwatkins> hiya brobostigon
[11:34] <brobostigon> morning MooDoo and dwatkins
[12:43] <BigRedS> quiet today
[12:43]  * BigRedS hears an echo
[12:43] <popey>  ____
[12:43] <popey> | __ )  ___   ___
[12:43] <popey> |  _ \ / _ \ / _ \
[12:44] <bigcalm> Baa?
[12:44] <BigRedS> Rnn?
[12:44] <bigcalm> Ah
[12:44] <MooDoo> Boo
[12:44] <MooDoo> ?
[12:44] <BigRedS> Perhaps
[12:45] <bigcalm> iain@revo:~$ figlet Boo
[12:45] <bigcalm> The program 'figlet' can be found in the following packages:
[12:45] <bigcalm>  * toilet
[12:45] <bigcalm>  * figlet
[12:45] <bigcalm> What the heck is toilet?
[12:45] <BigRedS> : Unable to locate package toilet :(
[12:45] <BigRedS> Oh. this is a sarge box
[12:45] <bigcalm> Heh
[12:46] <bigcalm> http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/toilet
[12:47] <bigcalm> OH MY!
[12:47] <bigcalm> http://screenshots.debian.net/package/toilet
[12:47] <bigcalm> The rainbow colour option is --gay
[12:47] <popey> it is
[12:47] <BigRedS> haha!
[12:47] <bigcalm> It's very happy
[12:51] <davmor2> bigcalm, BigRedS, MooDoo: all wrong the correct answer isn't baa, rnn or boo, it's simply Fail!
[12:57] <hoover> lol
[13:02] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Andy Loughran] Birmigham and Solihull Rugby [Sponsorship Opportunity] - http://zrmt.com/2011/06/17/birmigham-and-solihull-rugby-sponsorship-opportunity/
[13:29] <Myrtti> lol-moment of the day: http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/5841726906/
[13:29] <Myrtti> *boggle*
[13:33] <Myrtti> was just walking from the trainstation to the doctors and happened to look at jewellers window
[13:33] <Myrtti> I can only assume there is some purpose in the world for that ring, but I've not figured it out
[13:36] <DJones> Myrtti: Is that a sterling price? I've lost track of which country you're in
[13:37] <DJones> Although, whether its sterling/dollars/euros, its still silly money
[13:37] <popey> does it rule them all?
[13:38] <popey> Jabber \o/
[13:39] <MattJ> Jabber \o/
[13:58] <JGJones> That ring doesn't seem as bad as being informed that a single person is buying a 91 million dollar house just for herself. https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/The_Manor_(Los_Angeles,_California)
[13:58] <JGJones> space for 100 cars. For a person.
[13:58] <JGJones> daft.
[13:58] <MooDoo> JGJones: f1 ownswers gaughter?
[13:58] <MooDoo> JGJones: owners daughter
[13:58] <JGJones> same surname so I assume so.
[13:59] <MooDoo> yeah it's her
[14:00] <Myrtti> DJones: euros
[14:01] <Myrtti> JGJones: a house you can live in, you can't accidentally misplace it or put it through a garbage disposal, or wave your hand and it goes just like that
[14:01] <Myrtti> even if the house burns, the lot is still there
[14:02] <JGJones> Myrtti, aye that's true. A fool and his money are soon parted...
[14:02] <popey> nice house
[14:03] <JGJones> Not my style.
[14:03] <JGJones> But it'll be great for epic parties for sure ;-)
[14:04] <Myrtti> and I thought my first engagement ring was expensive, was about 100€ back in 1999
[14:04] <Myrtti> (Finns have plain bands, for both)
[14:12] <daubers> Myrtti: The engagement ring I got my wife was £35 off ebay.....
[14:13] <Myrtti> looks like the retail price of the ring is 316€ now
[14:16] <DJones> JGJones: This sounds almost as bad as that house http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1346857/Britains-expensive-caravan-Which-550-000-includes-kitchen-Italy-iPhone-controlled-heating-Jacuzzi-just-dont-try-taking-anywhere.html
[14:22] <Myrtti> I've come to the conclusion that money is the root of all evil
[14:24] <AlanBell> I always thought it was cats
[14:24] <DJones> Myrtti: Its not so much money that is the root of all evil, I find its the love of money that is more the problem
[14:25] <JGJones> no...it's brussels sprout
[14:25] <AlanBell> cats eating sprouts
[14:25] <JGJones> AlanBell, +1
[14:26] <webpigeon> DJones: when a link takes up three lines, you need to rethink your url naming scheme :P
[14:26] <webpigeon> oh it's daily mail, makes sense then :P
[14:26] <JGJones> webpigeon, it was 6 lines for me :)
[14:26] <JGJones> 1078x768 screen
[14:26] <webpigeon> even worse :P
[14:26] <AlanBell> fits on one line
[14:27] <DJones> Its only 3/4 of a line for me (1920x1024) screen
[14:27] <popey> 80x25 \o/
[14:27] <webpigeon> popey: phone?
[14:27] <popey> nope, pc
[14:27] <popey> just keeping irc over here, nice and quietly
[14:27] <JGJones> DOS terminal :P
[14:27] <popey> black chat
[14:28] <popey> as some call it
[14:29] <davmor2> Myrtti: No surely Evil is the root of all evil and money just manifests it
[14:30] <JGJones> availablity of resource is the root of money
[14:30] <Myrtti> I reiterate
[14:30] <Myrtti> humans are root of all evil
[14:30] <JGJones> But as AlanBell point out, let's not forget the cats.
[14:31] <davmor2> Myrtti: No I've seen evil animals out in the wild they are not at all pleasant :D
[14:31] <gord> cats are the root of all cuddly
[14:31] <bigcalm> \o/
[14:31] <JGJones> The Egyptians knew what they was about
[14:32] <davmor2> gord: that's why they are evil,  you can't stay mad at a cat
[14:32] <webpigeon> I can't find the "evil" button on the calcuator so can't calucate it's root.
[14:33] <webpigeon> gord++
[14:33] <gord> davmor2, no thats just a facet of their amazingness
[14:33] <davmor2> gord: haha
[14:33] <shauno> a rather cunning defence mechanism
[14:34] <davmor2> gord: we can't have pets so we pay for a Cat cabiin at the cats protection center :)  Oh that and pay for some big puddy tats at the WHF too
[14:35] <gord> davmor2, awesome :D
[14:37] <oimon> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/8582051/SOCA-warns-broadband-users-over-spy-virus-infections.html
[14:38] <oimon> i wonder if they will be any difference 1 month later
[14:39] <MooDoo> davmor2: howdy
[14:39] <davmor2> oimon: I'm miffed now I'm not one of the 1500
[14:40] <MooDoo> davmor2: i might be, i've not been home yet
[14:40] <davmor2> MooDoo: Howdo lad
[14:40] <diplo> Wrong place to ask but worth a shot, anyone recommend any free windows backup software
[14:41] <diplo> Think my work lappy hdd is failing
[14:42] <MooDoo> diplo: can't you use synctool?
[14:42] <davmor2> diplo: you can use clonzilla to back up the whole drive
[14:42] <MooDoo> diplo: sorry synctoy
[14:42] <diplo> I was debating clonezilla, will look at synctoy MooDoo forgot about that
[14:43] <diplo> Suppose I'll take a little backup of files and then image it
[14:43] <diplo> Work won't buy me a new drive till it fails :/
[14:44] <davmor2> diplo: hahaha standard operating procedure I've lost all my work so you can't have the report
[14:45] <diplo> I'm just committing more often than I normally do at the moment
[14:45] <diplo> :)
[14:46] <diplo> Like to replace the current with an ssd, will have to wait and see I guess
[14:46] <popey> \o/ ssd
[14:46] <MooDoo> o/ ssd :)
[14:47] <webpigeon> \o/ jab.. ssd
[14:50] <Myrtti> does anyone know if Nintendo 3DS power supplies are sold separately at all? I'm trying to look for one (with Euro prods, but that's irrelevant because I seem to fail google-fu even without mentioning euro on the search)
[14:52] <JGJones> I'm just playing with the cherokee webserver...it look pretty good actually
[14:52] <DJones> Myrtti: This type of thing (but you want the 2 pin prongs) http://www.amazon.co.uk/Products-Nintendo-Supply-Charger-Adapter/dp/B004TKPI6I
[14:52] <gord> Myrtti, they use the same as the dsi
[14:52] <bigcalm> Myrtti: http://www.google.co.uk/search?aq=2&oq=nintendo+3ds+power&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=nintendo+3ds+power+supply#q=nintendo+3ds+power+supply&hl=en&safe=off&prmd=ivns&source=lnms&tbm=shop&ei=_lv7TdbiC4SXhQew1IC1Aw&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=5&ved=0CB0Q_AUoBA&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=7b2359ad80d94401&biw=1282&bih=848
[14:52] <gord> Myrtti, so just look for dsi ones
[14:52] <Myrtti> gord: oh? well that's good
[14:52] <Myrtti> I was getting worried I've lost my touch
[14:53] <DJones> Myrtti: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nintendo-Mains-Supply-Charger-Adapter/dp/B0027PA2EA
[14:53] <bigcalm> Myrtti: http://www.gamersgear.com/nintendo_dsi_&_dsi_xl_&_3ds_mains_ac_power_supply_charger_adapter
[14:54] <DJones> bigcalm: I suspect thats the same product I'd just picked on, the amazon page I linked goes to gamesgear
[14:54] <JGJones> Myrtti, you should search for Chuck Norris Nintendo 3DS instead. It powers the sun. Therefore no worries about power supplies.
[14:54] <Myrtti> JGJones: :-D
[14:54] <bigcalm> Hehe
[14:55] <gord> i should pick up a second dock for my 3ds. i love that thing
[14:55] <Myrtti> well if the DSi one fits then it's ok, I can go grab one from the shelf
[14:55] <gord> sooo convenient to just throw the 3ds in to the dock
[14:55] <Myrtti> yeah it is nice
[14:55] <Myrtti> I don't really need 3DS but my old device was pink and huge
[14:56] <Myrtti> the original DS, could clob small animals to death with it
[14:56] <Myrtti> not that I tried
[14:56] <diplo> Want to get a 3DS for my son for his birthday
[14:56] <Myrtti> nicer to play Layton on smaller device :->
[14:56] <gord> my cat is obsessed with my 3ds, she just stares at anything thats 3d on it
[14:56] <diplo> Hope they have come down by then
[14:56] <diplo> A little at least :)
[14:57] <Myrtti> I got mine from Stansted airport :->
[14:57] <Myrtti> 158£
[14:57] <gord> not bad, they go for £170-180 normally
[14:57] <gord> price is supposed to rise at some point
[14:58] <davmor2> gord: haha
[14:58] <Myrtti> well I got it 80€ cheaper than I would have here
[14:58] <shauno> speaking of stanstead, what's the easiest airport to fly into to reach oxford by public transport?
[15:00] <AlanBell> heathrow I should think
[15:00] <AlanBell> but there is probably a coach from oxford to other airports
[15:00] <Laney> london oxford airport!
[15:01] <shauno> heh, have a friend who did his training there
[15:02] <JGJones> bugger...what's the quick way to reset the root password of a mysql server?
[15:02] <JGJones> on ubuntu
[15:05] <webpigeon> JGJones: you might be able to do it using dpkg-reconfigure or there is a guide on the mysql site http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.5/en/resetting-permissions.html
[15:06] <webpigeon> JGJones: even better, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MysqlPasswordReset
[15:06] <JGJones> webpigeon, thanks
[15:10] <Catbuskris_> anyone able to offer wisdom on why my internal speaker does not want to play nice?
[15:11] <Catbuskris_> i can't get a whisper out of it
[15:11] <Catbuskris_> with echo -e "\a"
[15:12] <Catbuskris_> i had wanted to make a fortran95 beep, but let alone that...
[15:13] <andylockran> howdy
[15:14] <andylockran> I'm running a server-server vpn.. that works great.. connecting a <IP_ADDRESS>/8 subnet to a <IP_ADDRESS>/8 subnet.. that works fine.  however, every machine also connects to their own
[15:14] <gord> Catbuskris_, are you sure you have one?
[15:15] <Catbuskris_> urm yes, i just heard a beep with the program "beep", but why would echo not work?
[15:16] <andylockran> argh.. I can;t even explain my problem
[15:16] <andylockran> is there a way to detect traffic passing through a server on a subnet.. and block it?
[15:16] <andylockran> rather than interface
[15:18] <gord> Catbuskris_, because echo just produces a character, which has to be interpreted by your terminal emulator, which may or may not support talking to your internal speaker
[15:18] <Catbuskris_> aha! reassuring, thanks a lot
[15:26] <shauno> isn't \a a null? I thought the bell was ^g
[15:27] <shauno> oh, apparently \a is the same thing.  didn't know that
[15:28] <shauno> ^a is a null.  silly me expected some correlation
[15:28] <Catbuskris_> how can i get my speaker to listen to terminal, is that possible?
[15:29] <shauno> it's the other way around.  the terminal has to handle the bell
[15:29] <shauno> is it gnome-terminal?  it should be in preferences->sound->system bell
[15:31] <HarryHaaren> Catbuskris: If it should be making noise but isn't perhaps check that "beep" isn't muted in "alsamixer". I always make sure it is :D
[15:31] <Catbuskris_> i'm in ubuntu 11.04, so i guess it's gnome, or unity... i don't really know if they are mutually exclusive
[15:34] <Catbuskris_> but as you might know, "preferences" isn't so easy to find, and alsamixer wasn't installed...
[15:35] <shauno> heh, yeah.  preferences has been cunningly disguised as an off button
[15:39] <Catbuskris_> odd eh?  anyway there is no system bell to be found in sound
[15:41] <shauno> hm.  there used to be :(
[15:44] <Catbuskris_> 11.04 is horrible¬
[16:08] <AlanBell> Catbuskris_: when you log in you can select classic mode using the menu at the bottom of the screen if you are not keen on unity
[16:10] <Catbuskris> it worked :) thanks
[16:10] <AlanBell> try padsp echo -e "\a"
[16:10] <AlanBell> which should route it through pulse audio
[16:11] <shauno> it sends it thru the soundcard rather than the feeper?
[16:12] <AlanBell> ah, yeah, it might do
[16:13] <AlanBell> so the beeper isn't attached to a soundcard as such?
[16:13] <shauno> usually the internal beep is a bios function.  which is why the bios likes to use it when it needs to complain about life at power-on
[16:14] <shauno> that said, I've no idea if XBell() still uses the internal one anymore
[16:14] <AlanBell> that is done with the pcspkr kernel module
[16:18] <Catbuskris> AlanBell, your suggestion gives silence as well :(
[16:43] <DJones> Hmmh, walking on a glass floor, hanging off the side extending the floor over thin air on the 8th floor as dusk falls isn't a good idea
[16:43] <DJones> Wrong channel
[16:43]  * davmor2 prods czajkowski for not being online
[16:45] <Catbuskris> ...mc? defintely wrong channel
[16:45] <ali1234> has anyone got a cheat sheet for writing office macros in vba?
[16:46] <BigRedS> the record button? :)
[16:46] <ali1234> no
[16:46] <ali1234> just no
[16:46] <ali1234> i need to know how to define functions, arrays etc
[16:46] <DJones> Catbuskris: Yep
[16:46] <ali1234> vba has the weirdest syntax i have ever seen
[16:46] <ali1234> it makes perl look good
[16:52] <HarryHaaren> DJones: I read that twice to see if I could make sense of it! :D
[16:52] <BigRedS> perl has awesome syntax. It's everyone else who gets it wrong
[16:54] <HarryHaaren> BigRedS: Is that Larry Wall's nick? :P
[16:55] <dogmatic69> how can i change the host name? ive done sudo hostname <new>
[16:55] <dogmatic69> and rebooted, what is the place to change it
[16:55] <DJones> !hostname
[16:56] <DJones> dogmatic69: Does that info help
[16:56] <dogmatic69> DJones: done
[16:56] <dogmatic69> but not working, ive done this many times before
[16:57] <BigRedS> when you reboot, does /etc/hostname still show the old hostname?
[16:57] <BigRedS> or still contain, rather
[16:57] <dogmatic69> hold on...
[16:57] <dogmatic69> ive never changed hostname
[16:58] <dogmatic69>  /etc/hostname that is
[16:58] <BigRedS> oh, you need to do that
[16:58] <BigRedS> otherwise on boot it'll have the old hostname
[16:58] <BigRedS> :)
[16:58] <dogmatic69> but ive never done it :S and ive got 5 boxes with different hostnames all cloned from one
[16:58] <BigRedS> that's the file the system asks to find out the hostname.
[16:58] <BigRedS> ooh, that's a bit weird
[16:58] <BigRedS> dd-style clone or someting more intelligent?
[16:59] <dogmatic69> because /etc/hostname has ip-x.x.x.x
[16:59] <dogmatic69> i just cloned it from something that does not have hostname ip-x.x.x.x
[16:59] <BigRedS> the downside of dd-style cloning is that the hostname and ip are preserved, I'd expect more intelligent things to automagically account for these
[16:59] <BigRedS> yeah, but how did you clone thenm?
[17:00] <dogmatic69> :S i dont think you want to know
[17:00] <dogmatic69> tar.gz / with a few excludes
[17:00] <BigRedS> ah, cool
[17:00] <madlatvian> hello pome
[17:00] <dogmatic69> and then untar'ed it to /
[17:00] <BigRedS> I'm a fan of hackish solutions :)
[17:00] <dogmatic69> hehe
[17:00] <dogmatic69> got it off the ubuntu forums, works a charm
[17:00] <BigRedS> that is weird, if you included /etc/hostname
[17:00] <madlatvian> hello from Aus
[17:00] <dogmatic69> ye, let me find my notes...
[17:01] <BigRedS> (and it's really not that bad a way of doing it. It's a common way to do dr backups)
[17:03] <dogmatic69> BigRedS: /etc/rc.local :)
[17:03] <dogmatic69> found my notes
[17:05] <dogmatic69> BigRedS: is that the wrong way? it works fine like that
[17:05] <BigRedS> oh, you put a change-hostname script in there?
[17:05] <dogmatic69> adding <IP_ADDRESS> <hostname> in /etc/hosts fixes the sudo errors mentioned in the bot tell thing
[17:05] <dogmatic69> just hostname <name
[17:05] <dogmatic69> >
[17:09] <gord> really wish websites had a "remember me" option after you log in, that would be nice
[17:11] <brobostigon> gord: some do, identi.ca does, so does FB, so does twitter, so does sixxs.net,
[17:11] <gord> websites i go to then
[17:11] <brobostigon>  iamsure, many more do, aswell.
[17:12] <BigRedS> Doesn't firefox let you effectively do that?
[17:13] <brobostigon> so does chromium,
[17:14] <popey> AlanBell: tuxradar podcast are doing the "you dare us" thing I suggested to them :D
[17:14] <popey> they're going to attempt to install Linux with their eyes shut
[17:19] <Azelphur> popey: nothing special, I know a blind lady who uses Linux and android :)
[17:19] <popey> did she install linux herself?
[17:19] <Azelphur> not sure
[17:20] <Azelphur> probably had aid, I know she makes heavy use of screen readers so I'd guess they wasn't installed early on
[17:20] <Azelphur> although she does have a brail display too, could have used that + an ncurses installer or something
[17:20] <BigRedS> I do wonder with that - might they miss normal mechanisms blind people have come to expect, and instead fail to use whatever they perceive as more sensible?
[17:20] <BigRedS> I've no idea if that'd be a problem
[17:20] <popey> there's quite a few bugs in the gui installer
[17:20] <popey> which would make it near impossible to install for a blind person alone
[17:21] <popey> (on Ubuntu)
[17:29] <AlanBell> there is a plan to fix that for oneiric
[17:30] <AlanBell> Azelphur: try it
[17:31] <AlanBell> there is an Accessibility Q&A session in #ubuntu-classroom and #ubuntu-classroom-chat in 30 minutes or so
[17:31] <AlanBell> with Pendulum
[17:32] <Pendulum> AlanBell: actually, now
[17:32] <AlanBell> oh, right now then
[17:32]  * AlanBell nearly missed it
[17:44] <AlanBell> it would be great if more people could pile over to #ubuntu-classroom and #ubuntu-classroom-chat to ask questions about accessibility
[17:44]  * AlanBell has to go do kids stuff
[17:48] <shauno> with their eyes shut?  just turn off the monitor.  no cheating :)
[18:04] <AlanBell> shauno: http://www.theopensourcerer.com/2010/08/13/going-headless/
[18:04] <AlanBell> http://www.theopensourcerer.com/2011/04/03/jamming-in-the-uk/
[18:14] <shauno> AlanBell: yeah, remember talking about that before, when I managed to install osx without a screen
[18:15] <shauno> I still think it's a bug that their 'use the external screen' button doesn't work until the OS is up, but that's way OT here.  it was an enlightening experience tho
[18:20] <GentileBen> shauno: it's a feature, not a bug.
[18:21] <GentileBen> External monitors done right.
[18:21] <shauno> no it's not :/  the button should do what it claims to
[18:23] <shauno> the one thing I did notice (doing the same 'experiment' on osx) was that the page that just gives you a progress bar, was completely nonsensical
[18:23] <shauno> I rebooted several times at that point to figure out what I'd missed.  I hadn't.  it was just speaking gobeldygook
[18:24] <shauno> interesting to see how the smallest hiccup like that can render the whole process frustrating.  it'd be like if the installer just turned the screen off for half of the gui install
[18:25] <shauno> not even slackware would ship that :/
[18:35] <hamitron> leave slackware alone ;/
[18:36] <gord> you just can't say that anymore without looking like that guy from youtube
[18:52] <czajkowski> davmor2: meh
[19:00] <AlanBell> o/ czajkowski
[19:00] <davmor2> czajkowski: Meh back atcha
[19:01]  * nigelb waves to davmor2
[19:01] <davmor2> hello nigelb
[19:04] <czajkowski> AlanBell: bumped into the other alan on the tube
[19:05] <bigcalm> Davis?
[19:10] <AlanBell> bigcalm: Lord
[19:10] <AlanBell> czajkowski: London is a small place
[19:10] <davmor2> bigcalm: you really need to direct that at czajkowski hers not hot on the uptake today bless.
[19:11] <AlanBell> czajkowski: all back at home now?
[19:11] <davmor2> czajkowski: was it a Popey?
[19:11] <czajkowski> no or I'd have tabbed popey
[19:12] <czajkowski> but cant tab the other alan
[19:12] <AlanBell> davmor2: my partner in crime
[19:12] <czajkowski> AlanBell: in E&C aye
[19:12] <davmor2> czajkowski: it was Alan Sugar
[19:12]  * czajkowski kicks davmor2
[19:12] <czajkowski> not
[19:12] <czajkowski> today
[19:12] <czajkowski> davmor2:
[19:13] <davmor2> czajkowski: :( here have a hug
[19:27] <XenoPhoenix> If KMS is enabled, I have green output on HDMI till I unplug and replug the TV (goes green again if i turn off and on the TV again), disabling modesetting using i915.modeset=0 fixes this issue however it is not a solution as it also disables graphical acceleration. This only occured with natty, no problems before upgrading, Any ideas?
[19:43] <AlanBell> XenoPhoenix: maybe try asking in #ubuntu-x (and wait, it isn't a very active channel)
[19:43] <XenoPhoenix> AlanBell: Ah ok thanks, I didn't know that channel existed :)
[20:05] <pete_> hey guys
[20:05] <cbx33> howz it all going?
[20:06] <cbx33> anyone used vmware on ubuntu11.04?
[20:40] <ali1234> iron python \o/
[20:40] <Azelphur> WHO ARE YOU AND WHAT DID YOU DO WITH ALI1234
[20:40] <ali1234> "how to script excel without going insane"
[20:41] <Azelphur> that's better :p
[20:41] <ali1234> watching excel churn away while running a script on multiple workbooks with multiple worksheets is quite amusing
[20:42] <MattJ> Anyone know a good PPA for up-to-date ffmpeg builds? (for 10.04)
[21:13] <wintellect> anyone use choqok?
[21:22] <cbx33> so ali1234 what advantages do i get with ironpython?
[23:44] <DeathSling> I really, really need some help with a virtio disk for a ubuntu guest, is there anybody about who can help?
[23:44] <DeathSling> Oh, and 'Hi all'    :)
[23:45] <BigRedS> DeathSling: I probably can't, but we'll never know who can if you don't tell us what the problem is :)
[23:48] <DeathSling> I created it using virt-install and it wasn't using virtio drivers so I've changed them in the guests /etc/fstab to vda and changed the guest xml to virtio. It's runs but disk speed seems even slower and I can make it crash by doing task intensive stuff
[23:49] <DeathSling> without the virtio method i was getting io disk speed of about 5Mbs/5MBs (not sure what it's measued in!)
[23:52] <DeathSling> These are sata disks in a 1+0 raid array. SHOULD be much faster. The really anoying thing is I've managed to get a windows guest running with virtio drivers and it works better than my lovely ubuntu server.  And that should NEVER happen!
[23:53] <DeathSling> I'm guessing that I can't/shouldn't swear here so.... ARRRRGGG feel my sweary rage!!
[23:54] <DeathSling> I feel a bit better now. Thank you for letting me get that of my chest.
[23:56] <DeathSling> I'm also signed into a libvirt chat, but nobody ever responds.  Admittedly I've only tried a fw times now but... it's really quiet there
[23:56] <DeathSling> ...and here
[23:57] <BigRedS> It *is* almost midnight....
[23:57] <BigRedS> :)
[23:57] <DeathSling> ah yes, that is true
[23:59] <BigRedS> but, rather predictably. I'm afrid i'm of little use
[23:59] <BigRedS> I almost exclusively do real hardware...