[00:00] <Kmos> awen_: i think it should be =)
[00:01] <lifeless> only if it is not references
[00:01] <Kmos> because a new package was there
[00:01] <Kmos> awen_: are you checking that in hardy ? =)
[00:01] <awen_> Kmos: i thought so too... and yes i'm checking it in hardy :)
[00:02] <awen_> libapache-mod-fastcgi
[00:03] <rz1> anyone here bored enough to review some package ?
[00:03] <rz1> hello motu's by the way :)
[00:03] <rz1> I'm on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unicorn/+bug/945
[00:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 945 in unicorn "module-assistant fails to compile unicorn-source" [Low,In progress]
[00:03] <Kmos> rz1: today? don't think so =)
[00:04] <Kmos> maybe on monday
[00:04] <Rz1> no problem
[00:04] <awen_> seems the sparc and powerpc builds still have problems with chroot... suspect it could be the reason?
[00:04] <Kmos> awen_: it says CHROOT WAIT ?
[00:05] <Kmos> that ones will be given back automatically
[00:06] <awen_> Kmos: seems the build have failed on those two platforms... but should it manually be started again?
[00:07] <awen_> "Status: Chroot problem" ... but seems that the log is from 25 dec
[00:10] <Kmos> awen_: only yesterday the buildd machines are fixed.. so this will be fixed next week
[00:10] <Kmos> awen_: check the current build log..
[00:11] <Kmos> what's the package ?
[00:11] <Kmos> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dhel
[00:11] <Kmos> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/package_name_here
[00:11] <awen_> Kmos: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libapache-mod-fastcgi
[00:11] <jwill> can one be sure a package doesn't exist in universe if nothing shows up when searching packages.ubuntu.com (any distribution)?
[00:12] <Amaranth> failed on sparc and powerpc due to chroot problem
[00:12] <awen_> but i should probably just wait for next week then and see then :)
[00:29]  * jonnymind is away: o-furo!
[01:18] <persia> Ng: syncing REVU keyring now.  Takes about 40 minutes
[01:18] <persia> pochu: Are you really sure Section: python is everything interesting?
[01:18] <persia> pochu: U-U-S doesn't process raw patches (although some of the members do)
[01:19] <ion_> Good morning, persia :-)
[01:19] <ion_> I’m about to go to sleep.
[01:19] <persia> Good morning ion_ :)
[01:39] <persia> Ng: keyring sync completed (faster than expected).  You may upload at your leisure.
[02:04] <jscinoz> hey guys.
[02:04] <jscinoz> whats the average time between uploading a package to revu and getting some feedback on it?
[02:05] <CheGuevara> jscinoz: poke people to get feedback otherwise it might take forever
[02:05] <persia> jscinoz: Feedback when it's not REVU day is rare and to be appreciated.
[02:05] <jscinoz> revu day?
[02:06] <persia> The last REVU day (24th December) was cancelled due to hardware issues.  The next is 31st December, but attendance is expected to be light due to New Years celebrations.
[02:06] <jscinoz> ah
[02:06] <jscinoz> is there a page somewhere with more details about this?
[02:07] <persia> jscinoz: Every Monday is REVU day, when the reviewers and packagers commit to spending some time on REVU.  The rest of the week tends to be pretty quiet.  Also, there are no REVU days held between Feature Freeze and the following Developer Summit, as the focus is on bugfixing and determining the goals for the next release.
[02:07] <persia> !revu
[02:07] <ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
[02:08] <jscinoz> ah thank you :)
[02:08] <persia> jscinoz: Apparently not.  I don't see any mention of REVU days on the REVU wiki page.  As CheGuevara said, if you've just uploaded or updated a package, and would like to request a look, asking here is welcome (but please limit to once a day when it's not REVU day)
[02:09] <bddebian> Anyone have wx2.4 installed atm?
[02:09] <CheGuevara> wow thats old :P
[02:09] <bddebian> Well at least 4 packages still build-dep on it
[02:10] <persia> bddebian: I can install it.  What do you need?
[02:10] <bddebian> I just want to know what wx-config --libs puts out in 2.4
[02:11] <jscinoz> I uploaded three packages back on the eighth of december, all related to the GPL version of the urban terror game, packages are "urbanterror" "urbanterror-data" and "urbanterror-server" these are the first packages i've built so if anyone would like to give me some feedback it'd be greatly appreciated :)
[02:11] <persia> jscinoz: You should have received feedback on those already.  Sorry about the delay: if nobody else hits them in the next 8 hours, I'll hit them first at the beginning of REVU day.
[02:13] <jscinoz> thanks :)
[02:17] <persia> bddebian: -pthread -lwx_gtk-2.4 (both hardy & sid)
[02:17] <bddebian> persia: Thank you sir
[02:18] <bddebian> Hmm, interesting. wx-config --libs on 2.6 gives:
[02:18] <bddebian> -pthread   -lwx_gtk2u_xrc-2.6 -lwx_gtk2u_qa-2.6 -lwx_gtk2u_html-2.6 -lwx_gtk2u_adv-2.6 -lwx_gtk2u_core-2.6 -lwx_baseu_xml-2.6 -lwx_baseu_net-2.6 -lwx_baseu-2.6
[02:18] <persia> bddebian: Did I maybe miss something from `wx2.4-doc wx2.4-examples wx2.4-headers wx2.4-i18n python-wxgtk2.4 libwxgtk2.4-dev libwxgtk2.4-contrib-dev libwxbase2.4-dev` ?
[02:22] <bddebian> Hmm, maybe a better question is where the fsck are those libs supposed to be? Hmm
[02:23] <persia> bddebian: I'd really like to see "-bash: wx-config: command not found" as the output of `wx-config --libs` with 2.6 and 2.8 missing.
[02:24]  * StevenK sighs.
[02:24] <StevenK> I think my local shopping centre is having a "Jerk Day", because it was full of them
[02:25] <persia> ls
[02:25] <StevenK> total 0
[02:25] <bddebian> hehe
[02:25] <CheGuevara> lol
[02:25] <persia> bddebian: Do you happen to have your jugglemaster patch somewhere other than an inline email?
[02:26] <slangasek> surely, every day is Jerk Day at a shopping center?
[02:26] <bddebian> persia: Hmm, it shouldn't have been inline
[02:26] <bddebian> persia: Give me a sec
[02:26] <persia> bddebian: Maybe it's just my broken mail client :)  Thanks.
[02:27] <StevenK> slangasek: Today seemed much worse. Like the lady who stood in the middle of the carpark aisle with a full trolley on her cell phone. It took her at least a full minute to realise I was waiting for her since I couldn't get around her
[02:28] <CheGuevara> why didn't you poke her :P
[02:28] <StevenK> Since I was driving
[02:28] <CheGuevara> ah :P
[02:30] <bddebian> persia: http://www.bddebian.com/packages/debian/jugglemaster/   There's also a source package there if you just want to grab and build that instead. (Though it's not "dpatch'd" properly it's just straight source modified.
[02:30] <persia> bddebian: Thanks.  I'll pull the patch :)
[02:31] <persia> bddebian: Apply after the other patches, or before?
[02:32] <bddebian> persia: Apply it last
[02:44] <bddebian> persia: newpki-client isn't being as "easy" as jugglemaster :-(
[02:45] <persia> bddebian: Nope.  I'm really tempted to drop newpki-client completely, but haven't found a good reference for an alternate CA repo.  Maybe we keep newpki-server, and just drop the client (as was done for plucker)?
[02:47] <bddebian> persia: I talked to the maintainer.  There are some users but upstream is pretty dead :-(
[02:48] <persia> Rather, upstream is completely dead.
[02:48] <persia> From what I can tell, the client is mostly for testing the server, and we have a few PKI clients in the repositories.  On the other hand, I haven't found another server.
[02:50] <bddebian> Actually what I'm getting so far seem like simple errors but I can't get through the first one.. :-(
[02:51] <persia> bddebian: That was my experience.  it mixes wx and gettext in strange ways :(
[02:52] <bddebian> Of course I haven't really "fixed" jugglemaster either so I don't even know why I'm looking at it. :-(
[02:52] <persia> bddebian: jugglemaster_0.4-2.dsc FTBFS for me on both sid and hardy :(  Any suggestions?
[02:54] <bddebian> What type of errors?
[02:55] <bddebian> I assume you changed the build-deps? :-)
[02:55] <persia>  /usr/bin/ld: jmdlx.o: relocation R_X86_64_32 against `JMFrame::sm_eventTable' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC
[02:55] <persia> I changed build-deps for jugglemaster_0.4-1ubuntu1.dsc, but jugglemaster_0.4-2.dsc is from your site.
[02:55] <bddebian> Uhm...
[02:56] <bddebian> Hrm
[02:56]  * persia wonders if we can just unimport jugglemaster...
[02:56] <bddebian> It built in my gutsy pbuilder I thought.
[02:56]  * persia tries with gutsy
[02:57] <bddebian> And I know it builds in a sid pbuilder, that's where I've been building it..   Same error.  Oddly enough, jugglemaster_0.4-1.dsc seems to work.
[03:01] <bddebian> Hmm, might help with my segfault
[03:02] <bddebian> But wx-config --ld should be using -fPIC I thought
[03:02] <bddebian> wx-config --ld
[03:02] <bddebian> g++ -shared -fPIC -o
[03:02] <persia> bddebian: Shows that way for me.
[03:02] <bddebian> #$%@#$^
[03:04] <persia> Yep.   jugglemaster_0.4-1.dsc just built clean in sid & hardy for me.
[03:20] <persia> bddebian: Found it.  wx-config --ld uses -fPIC, but previous calls just use g++ -Wall -g -O2 -Wall -fsigned-char `wx-config --cppflags` (-I/usr/lib/wx/include/gtk2-unicode-release-2.6 -I/usr/include/wx-2.6 -DGTK_NO_CHECK_CASTS -D__WXGTK__ -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=64 -D_LARGE_FILES -DNO_GCC_PRAGMA), which likely causes the confusion.
[03:26] <bddebian> persia: ugh
[03:37] <porthose> !#179275
[03:37] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about 179275 - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[03:38] <awen_> bug 179275
[03:38] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 179275 in ampache "Please sync ampache-<IP_ADDRESS>-dfsg1-1 from Debian sid main" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/179275
[03:38] <awen_> :)
[03:39]  * persia notes that it's not ideal to join, spit a URL (or pointer to a URL), and leave, even when it's a topical URL.
[03:41]  * awen_ just came back from being afk...
[03:42] <bddebian> persia: Does it run now? ;-)
[03:42] <awen_> tried starting a conversation... but after sending the url i couldn't tab-complete on the name :/
[03:43] <persia> bddebian: I'm still trying to learn enough about the linux memory model to understand when it needs -fPIC, and when it doesn't.  I doubt I'll understand before your day ends.
[03:44] <bddebian> :-)
[04:46]  * StevenK kicks Rails.
[04:47] <StevenK> If I have a bunch of checkboxes checked, please give me all of the values. Preferably as an array
[04:53] <persia> StevenK: Avoid checkboxes.  There's a little helper that makes sure that anything not touched always gets a value sent anyway :)
[04:55] <imbrandon> when someone notes the key ALT-Gr do they mean the win/apple/super key ?
[04:55] <imbrandon> but moins all
[04:55] <imbrandon> err btw
[04:56] <imbrandon> or is ALT-Gr == ALT ?
[04:56] <persia> imbrandon: On some keyboards, the right-alt key sends a slightly different symbol (ALT-Gr).  Unless your keyboard is odd, you should be able to force it with a keymap.
[04:56] <imbrandon> ahh ok, waseent sure, just seen it in a tut
[04:56] <nixternal> imbrandon: did I say how much I hate kdebindings-kde4?
[04:57] <imbrandon> nixternal: hahah wanna pass it back? where you at with it, yea i got frustrated too
[04:57] <nixternal> python-kde4-dev is being a biznatch
[04:57] <imbrandon> qyoto was a pita too, i think they all suck and like dont need to be touched unless broken hehe
[04:57] <nixternal> I have it building, added qscintilla2 support, have the new cdbs in place, updated rules file, updated control file
[04:58] <nixternal> qyoto needs the mono stuff, and seeing as mono is broken in the repos, qyoto will have to wait
[04:58] <imbrandon> k
[04:58] <nixternal> I will zip up the debian/ directory and put on p.uw.com
[04:58] <imbrandon> kk
[04:58] <imbrandon> i'll take the torch back, maybe this should be one we put in VCS early
[04:58] <imbrandon> since its so big
[04:58] <imbrandon> ( the debian/ )
[04:59] <imbrandon> if you want i'll bzr it to ~kubuntu-members ( thats where most others are correct ? )
[05:00] <imbrandon> i dont think any of the kde4 stuff is on alioth yet
[05:00] <nixternal> http://people.ubuntuwire.com/~nixternal/KDE4/bindings/
[05:00] <nixternal> there you go
[05:00] <imbrandon> killer
[05:00] <nixternal> all of the kde4 stuff is in alioth
[05:01] <imbrandon> ok well , would you rather me push it to alioth or LP ?
[05:01] <nixternal><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[05:01] <nixternal> LP
[05:01] <imbrandon> rockin, ok
[05:01] <nixternal> they have just created the kdebindings dir in alioth
[05:01] <nixternal> no work to it yet )
[05:02] <imbrandon> i guess i should jump bak on oftc, i need to set that to auto in my client
[05:02] <nixternal> ya, much easier stealing from debian
[05:03] <nixternal> I mean borrowing :)
[05:03] <imbrandon> lol
[05:03] <nixternal> their new fixes to cdbs were a biznatch, but after some tinkering I figured out the work for Kubuntu...so I have added that to the debian tarball already for you
[05:04] <imbrandon> ahh well when i started it they dident have anything yet, i was on my own
[05:04] <imbrandon> guess i should check back every few days heh
[05:04] <nixternal> the only kicker that I am overlooking is the python-kde4-dev
[05:04] <nixternal> it isn't placing anything in debian/tmp
[05:04] <imbrandon> kk i'll look at that first
[05:04] <nixternal> I have the sourcedir set in kde.mk as debian/tmp and everything else is installing it there
[05:06] <imbrandon> did you get a new snapshot ?
[05:07] <nixternal> I tried the new snapshot today, and it is changes to python bindings for the new kdelibs
[05:07] <nixternal> otherwise your snapshot was the latest until earlier today
[05:07] <imbrandon> kk
[05:08] <imbrandon> i'll just stay with minew for now then
[05:08] <imbrandon> mine*
[05:08] <nixternal> ya, probably won't have to do anything until release day for KDE 4 anyways with it
[05:08] <nixternal> once it gets built and what not
[05:09] <imbrandon> right
[05:09] <nixternal> I have to admit, kdebindings is the crappiest thing i have worked with for some odd reason
[05:09] <imbrandon> well its so many hodge podge stuff in one project
[05:09] <nixternal> right now though, it is just some debian/ tweaks honestly..it builds fine
[05:10] <nixternal> whatever you do, don't add libqwt5 support...leave that out, because who ever packaged that, needs to be disbarred from computers
[05:10] <imbrandon> its not like one develop[er or one team even, so coding conventions etc are all out the dor
[05:10] <imbrandon> door
[05:10] <nixternal> ya, everyone pitches in whatever binding they want to add
[05:10] <imbrandon> and i dident even touch playground/bindings yet
[05:10] <imbrandon> ugh heh
[05:10] <nixternal> oh lord
[05:11] <nixternal> ya, definitely ugh in the playground
[05:11] <nixternal> keg isn't all that great right now either...I have only been able to build amarok, k3b, and kaudiocreator
[05:11] <imbrandon> well eventualy i'll get it for phpqt / phpkde , it just hit 1.0
[05:11] <imbrandon> if someone in debian doesnt do it first
[05:11] <nixternal> seeing if keg/network will build in svn now
[05:12] <nixternal> are those bindings in playground?
[05:12] <imbrandon> yea
[05:12] <nixternal> I found a website the other day that was phpqt
[05:12] <imbrandon> yup
[05:12] <nixternal> I love how easy I can whip up a plasmoid with javascript, c++, python (if I knew it)
[05:12] <imbrandon> http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/playground/bindings/phpqt/
[05:13] <nixternal> in like 5 minutes I had a webcam plasmoid up and running
[05:13] <nixternal> and like a dumb arse, I blew out ~/kde and not ~/.kde today on my lappy :p
[05:13] <imbrandon> hehe
[05:14] <nixternal> so I had to rebuild kde4 from scratch...it was nice just doing 'svn up && cb && make -j2 VERBOSE=12 && make install'
[05:14] <imbrandon> i keep most important configs in bzr on my fileserver, but .kde isnt one of them
[05:14] <nixternal> only thing in .kde that I backup is mail
[05:14] <imbrandon> dont you have dualcore
[05:14] <nixternal> on my desktop I do
[05:14] <imbrandon> -j4 :)
[05:14] <nixternal> oh, well I am building this on my laptop which is just a cerly m
[05:14] <nixternal> celery m
[05:15] <imbrandon> ahh
[05:15] <imbrandon> one of these days , i'd like to get a icecream cluster going, likely wont be soon
[05:16] <nixternal> I have been trying here
[05:16] <imbrandon> StevenK: btw apt-mirror is in the PPA for dapper if you havent noticed already
[05:16] <nixternal> I can see them so far
[05:17] <imbrandon> well i have so many diffrent version of OS's runing and each with its own gcc version, dosent make it easy
[05:17]  * Hobbsee wins.  muhahaha
[05:17] <nixternal> ya
[05:17] <imbrandon> i'll have to get some dedicated hardware running for it someday but thats 8+ months away
[05:17]  * nixternal wonders what GCC is running on Fedora 8
[05:17] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: ?
[05:17] <nixternal> I see the latest gcc in fl:2-devel for foresight
[05:18] <nixternal> wasabi Hobbsee
[05:18] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: scenario of wesnoth.
[05:18] <nixternal> hahahahahaha
[05:18] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: a game that i usually tend to suck at
[05:18] <imbrandon> :)
[05:18] <nixternal> you are playing again
[05:18] <nixternal> I have gotten addicted to writing plasmoid applets
[05:18] <imbrandon> leaste it isnt WoW, someone gave me a walmart giftcard and i almost purchased it today /me is glad i dident
[05:18] <nixternal> but like a moron, I didn't upload to kdesvn nor did I even back them up locally
[05:19] <nixternal> I got the Green PC with my Wal-Mart gift card
[05:19] <nixternal> my buddy knows I hate Wal-Mart, yet he gave me one
[05:19] <imbrandon> they dont have the greenpc here localy yet, they DO have dell's though, i was really supoised
[05:19] <nixternal> I was just gonna buy dogfood with it, but I decided to see what they had
[05:19] <nixternal> they didn't have them on the shelves at our wal-mart
[05:20] <nixternal> but I asked the guy if they were coming in, and he said they had some in the back
[05:20] <nixternal> so I got one
[05:20] <imbrandon> nice
[05:20] <nixternal> ya, but it came home DOA
[05:20] <imbrandon> i probably wont get one, my webserver ( for imbrandon.com ) is the same MB and chip
[05:20] <nixternal> I took it back to exchange it, and the store manager told me they aren't even allowed to sell them right now
[05:20] <imbrandon> so i kinda have one
[05:21] <nixternal> I was thinking of picking up the board and cpu from the gos website
[05:21] <imbrandon> you can get them at microcenter
[05:21] <imbrandon> for $65
[05:21] <imbrandon> add a $20 Gb of cheap ram and it makes a nice web/fileserver
[05:21] <nixternal> damn, I keep forgetting I live 10 miles from microcenter
[05:22] <nixternal> I live right in between Frys (15 minutes), Tiger Direct (15 minutes), and Micro Center (about 20+ minutes actually)
[05:22] <nixternal> I went to Frys to buy the FreeBSD system, but they have been sold out of the damn thing
[05:23] <imbrandon> http://www.imbrandon.com/phpsysinfo/
[05:23] <imbrandon> my via board specs ^^ ( since it runs my website )
[05:24] <nixternal> damn, where did you pickup and old 20gb maxtor from?
[05:24] <imbrandon> pull from some old PC here, i have tons of old parts arround, new ones are my issue :)
[05:24] <nixternal> hehe
[05:24] <imbrandon> i probably have enough parts for 20 old >1ghz systems
[05:24] <nixternal> I need a new heatsink for my dual-core, but I can't find one that I can say "ya, that is the one I want"
[05:25] <nixternal> I hate the LGA775 heatsink clips
[05:25] <nixternal> brb, let me see if I can boot back into kde 4 w/o implosion
[05:27] <imbrandon> hrm i guess i only have 512MB Ram in that box, thought i had a GB
[05:30] <nixternal> there we go
[05:40] <imbrandon> nixternal: ahh it seems what ana has in svn is just a stub
[05:40] <imbrandon> dh_make template
[05:40] <nixternal> ya
[05:41] <nixternal> hopefully she will attack it soon though
[05:41] <imbrandon> okies, i was worried aobut dupe offorts
[05:41] <nixternal> I would be surprised if she has something local already
[05:41] <imbrandon> yea i'll ping her later to make sure not
[05:41] <awalton__> nixternal: as far as heatsinks go, I just bought this one from newegg and can't say I've ever been happier with a hsf: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835200015
[05:42] <nixternal> awalton__: which cpu are you using?
[05:42] <nixternal> I have actually found a couple of rosewill's on ebay and amazon that I am watching
[05:42] <pwnguin> awalton__: how about quiet replacement fans for a 6600gt ?
[05:42] <awalton__> core 2 duo 6600
[05:43] <nixternal> groovy
[05:43] <awalton__> heh, can't help you with the replacement gpu fan
[05:43] <nixternal> I am using a Pentium D 8xx so it is toasty as it is
[05:43]  * pwnguin finds his video card is the noisiest part
[05:43] <nixternal> and that has a 120mm fan
[05:43] <awalton__> I've had integrated video for longer than I can remember
[05:43] <awalton__> oh yeah, it's really nice
[05:43] <awalton__> you can barely hear it if you turn it down with the pwm, and it still moves a ton of air
[05:44] <nixternal> I have some cheapy masscool that flat out sucks
[05:44] <pwnguin> my PSU has a 120mm fan on a sensor
[05:44] <pwnguin> the only time it gets loud is when im playing games, and ive got the headphones on then
[05:44] <nixternal> same with mine
[05:44] <imbrandon> heh fan noise has never bothered me in computers
[05:44] <pwnguin> imbrandon: you work in a datacenter :P
[05:44] <nixternal> I have 3 120mm fans in this small case and I can barely hear it
[05:44] <imbrandon> pwnguin: :)
[05:45] <pwnguin> imbrandon: we have an old cluster machine as a workstation in our lab
[05:45] <pwnguin> HELLA LOUD
[05:45] <nixternal> fan noise never bothered me when I worked for HardOCP and Virtual Hideout back in 2000
[05:45] <nixternal> I used a YS-Tech and a Delta 60x60x38
[05:45] <awalton__> blarg, my old athlon pc had 4 90mm fans and it sounded like a vacuum cleaner
[05:45] <nixternal> no fan pushed the cfm as those 2 did, and it sounded louder than a hair dryer
[05:46] <awalton__> my new core 2 box has the cpu and psu fans and you can't hear it normally
[05:46] <nixternal> my lian-li server has 8 80mm fans in it, but I bought a fan controller and have them all turned now, so it is actually fairly quiet right now
[05:46] <pwnguin> well, my desktop functions as a desktop computer, server and bedroom entertainment center
[05:46] <pwnguin> quiet is a plus
[05:46] <awalton__> yiiikes.
[05:46] <nixternal> I can't hear my laptop :)
[05:46] <imbrandon> pwnguin: hehe
[05:46] <pwnguin> i can hear mine. I blame ubuntu ;)
[05:46] <nixternal> then again, all I hear is the humm of my desktop, server and 4 other turd boxes
[05:47] <nixternal> the other turd boxes don't even have one fan in them :)
[05:47] <nixternal> not even the killer 250w power supply from the 80s :p
[05:47] <pwnguin> anyone use lmsensors to actually throttle fans?
[05:47] <nixternal> I tried it, and it didn't work for me
[05:47] <awalton__> same
[05:48] <nixternal> it did work flawlessly on a via kt333 mobo I had die this year though
[05:48] <nixternal> abit at7 max
[05:48] <pwnguin> i dont think any of my fans or fan ports even have a control line =(
[05:48] <nixternal> my server is using a biostar mobo, and I rather not even mess with that testy little piece of garbage
[05:48] <nixternal> everytime I think about looking at the bios I have to RMA it :)
[05:49] <nixternal> I have fan control on my msi pm8m3-v, but lmsensors isn't its biggest fan (excuse the pun)
[05:49] <nixternal> I wonder if I can get that Rosewill at Tiger Direct or Frys
[05:50] <nixternal> maybe I will go look tomorrow if I stop being lazy
[05:50] <pwnguin> tiger direct has retail stores?
[05:50] <nixternal> ya
[05:50] <awalton__> probably, it seems pretty common
[05:50] <pwnguin> that seems, indirect
[05:50] <nixternal> we have tiger direct, frys, and micro center right here in chicago
[05:50] <nixternal> we actually have 2 frys now
[05:50] <nixternal> and 2 micro centers
[05:50] <pwnguin> well, microcenter and frys were both stores before the www i think
[05:50] <nixternal> and cdw
[05:50] <nixternal> frys was in cali
[05:51] <nixternal> micro center as well
[05:51] <nixternal> I worked behind microcenter in like 1999/2000, definitely before their internet presence
[05:51] <imbrandon> microcenter is all we have here
[05:51] <nixternal> back then, their website sucked
[05:51] <imbrandon> it still does
[05:51] <pwnguin> pretty sure tiger direct got its legs as an e Commerce site
[05:51] <imbrandon> pwnguin: mailorder ( mag )
[05:52] <imbrandon> is how tiger started
[05:52] <nixternal> tiger direct was actually a retail store here long before e Commerce as well
[05:52] <nixternal> it was called something else then
[05:52] <pwnguin> hmm
[05:52] <imbrandon> its been in mailorder for a long long time
[05:52] <nixternal> we bought our first x86 computer from there in the late 80s
[05:52] <imbrandon> early 90's
[05:52] <imbrandon> or earlier
[05:52] <nixternal> but it was called something else before tiger direct
[05:52] <pwnguin> heh
[05:52] <nixternal> my old man and I were trying to remember that earlier this week actually
[05:53] <pwnguin> is naperville near chicago?
[05:53] <nixternal> yup
[05:53] <nixternal> I live 2 towns over from it
[05:53] <nixternal> 3 towns
[05:53] <nixternal> no, 2 towns :)
[05:53] <nixternal> wheaton then naperville
[05:53] <pwnguin> their hq is there
[05:53] <nixternal> that is their super huge warehouse
[05:53] <pwnguin> tiger direct has like 4 retail stores
[05:54] <nixternal> texas, florida, chicago and I can't remember
[05:54] <imbrandon> microcenter only has like 10
[05:54] <imbrandon> we happen to have one
[05:54] <nixternal> lucky you
[05:54] <pwnguin> huh
[05:54] <pwnguin> bah
[05:54] <nixternal> I haven't been in that store since the pc133 days
[05:54] <pwnguin> newegg ships plenty of places
[05:54] <nixternal> I walked in there one night and they had IWill PC133 mobos mispriced for $39.99 each
[05:55] <nixternal> I bought all 4 that they had
[05:55] <imbrandon> pwnguin: yea but retail is nic, you get to touch / feel /use the stuff :)
[05:55] <nixternal> and bought 4 AMD T-Bird 1GHz AXIA CPUs
[05:55] <awalton__> heh, I get in trouble with retail stores
[05:55] <awalton__> go in there and buy too much..
[05:55] <pwnguin> indeed. i'll never buy a case online again
[05:55] <nixternal> overclocked them to 1.8GHz with Swiftech MC460s
[05:55] <pwnguin> that was a mess. usb and audio all seperated by wire
[05:55] <awalton__> much easier to stay under control with the point and click method
[05:55] <pwnguin> cant get at the left side of the drive bays for screws =(
[05:55] <nixternal> I bought my last case at Tiger Direct just a couple of months ago
[05:56] <nixternal> $50 w/ 500w psu
[05:56] <awalton__> then again, the closest thing to a computer store we have is a compusa 40 miles away...
[05:56] <imbrandon> pluss the apple department , i take my ipod in and hook it to their "try before you buy" systems and drap MS Office to it :)
[05:56] <nixternal> we don't even have that anymore here
[05:56] <imbrandon> pwnguin: ^
[05:56] <nixternal> which sucks, cuz I wanted to exploit their store closings
[05:56] <imbrandon> drag*
[05:56] <awalton__> yeah, the sales weren't that great
[05:56] <nixternal> that stinks
[05:57] <nixternal> I just returned my iPod I got for xmas
[05:57] <pwnguin> imbrandon: pirate!
[05:57] <nixternal> hahahaha
[05:57] <awalton__> arrr
[05:57] <imbrandon> heh i never use it, but its an easy way to get OSX software :)
[05:57] <nixternal> awalton__: I am glad you like that rosewill though, I was looking at it, but couldn't make up my mind
[05:57] <imbrandon> drag installs make that too easy
[05:57] <nixternal> I take my 4gb memory stick everywhere with me
[05:57] <pwnguin> i can imagine that actually works
[05:58] <pwnguin> can't
[05:58] <nixternal> if you all have a local frys, hit it every sunday 1 hour before they close
[05:58] <nixternal> they put all of their clearance stuff out
[05:58] <pwnguin> nope
[05:58] <imbrandon> pwnguin: OSX software is all self contained, works like a charm
[05:58] <awalton__> nixternal, it's really nice, I was pretty impressed myself
[05:58] <pwnguin> imbrandon: surely there's a key hidden somewhere off the bundle
[05:58] <nixternal> couple of weeks ago after our LUG event, which is 2 miles from Frys, we hit it up and I bought 4gb usb sticks for $9.99 each
[05:58] <awalton__> it was sort of an impulse buy with the new cpu
[05:58] <imbrandon> pwnguin: it sotores it back in the .pkg bundle
[05:58] <nixternal> ya, I wish I wouldn't have been so cheap when I built my other system truthfully
[05:59] <pwnguin> nixternal: our LUG hits up the Denny's specials instead ;)
[05:59] <nixternal> but I got a dual-core cpu, mobo, and heatsink for $75 at tiger direct
[05:59] <nixternal> hahahaha
[05:59] <awalton__> very nice
[05:59] <pwnguin> I wish i was lying
[05:59] <imbrandon> nixternal: 4GB usb sticks are $10 bux here everyday at Microcenter, i have like 3
[05:59] <nixternal> after a Chicago LUG event we hit up Goose Island and usually get so drunk we forget our names
[05:59] <awalton__> I just did the motherboard-cpu-heatsink thing myself for xmas.
[05:59] <pwnguin> but i hear several people skip the meeting and go straight to denny's
[05:59] <nixternal> damn, and I thought I was getting a steal
[05:59] <nixternal> I so need to get over to microcenter then
[06:00] <imbrandon> sd cards, cf cards and usb sticks are super cheap at microcenter
[06:00] <pwnguin> i have their ad
[06:00] <pwnguin> came in the mail today
[06:00] <imbrandon> they are impulse buys at the checkouts
[06:00] <pwnguin> 8GB USB for 30
[06:00] <pwnguin> 4 for 20
[06:00] <nixternal> damn
[06:01] <awalton__> jaw, meet floor.
[06:01] <imbrandon> i think they make them so cheap to attract customers because i've never seen them as cheap anywhwere else
[06:01] <nixternal> I will go buy an 8gb tomorrow...like I will ever use it
[06:01] <pwnguin> im sure the speed is ass
[06:01] <pwnguin> 2gb microsd for 20
[06:01] <imbrandon> pwnguin: no actualy the cf cards i buy ther run at full ata speed
[06:01] <pwnguin> regular sd for 14
[06:01] <pwnguin> well
[06:01] <nixternal> but that is how I got a full blows Vista, Office 2007 super duper edition, VS.NET 2005, Dreamweaver, and Photoshop absolutely free
[06:02] <pwnguin> cf if is comparatively huge
[06:02] <nixternal> bbiaf...gonna catch some tv
[06:02] <imbrandon> and my camera dosent complain about the 2gb sd cards :)
[06:02] <pwnguin> my ds complains about cheap media
[06:02] <imbrandon> :)
[06:03] <pwnguin> hmm
[06:03] <pwnguin> i didnt know microcenter carried batteries
[06:03] <imbrandon> yea , they carry EVERYTHING
[06:03] <imbrandon> heh
[06:03] <pwnguin> right, but everyone seems to have their own battery standard
[06:04] <imbrandon> they have this belkin netwrok usb think i want, to drop some usb hdd's on the netwrok
[06:04] <imbrandon> but that will have to wait
[06:04] <pwnguin> also, i think microcenter raised prices on the eee
[06:05] <imbrandon> well i noticed their ad's and website are always higher then if you walk into the store, no idea why, normaly its the other way arround
[06:06] <imbrandon> yea our store sold out of the eeepc's in like a week
[06:06] <imbrandon> i got to play with the white one like ~10 minutes
[06:06] <pwnguin> looks like the old vaio
[06:06] <imbrandon> they said they wont have more till mid-jan
[06:07] <pwnguin> a former coworker had this vaio about the same size
[06:08] <imbrandon> and the apple dude ( the apple Microcenter dept has more than the apple store 3 blocks away ) said apple will have an flash based small " probably the 12'' " notebook after ADC this year
[06:08] <imbrandon> no idea if he even knows though
[06:08] <imbrandon> 12" still bigger than 7" :)
[06:09] <pwnguin> still havent seen it in person
[06:09] <pwnguin> 7 seems kinda small
[06:09] <imbrandon> yea its tiny but totaly useable
[06:09] <pwnguin> hilarious idea: docking station
[06:09] <imbrandon> i havent ever seen any thing that small with a full keyboard, even the sony ones
[06:10] <pwnguin> well, if i need an ultra lite, the DS usually has me covered ;)
[06:25] <imbrandon> wow any qualms i might have had about downloading music are gone
[06:25] <imbrandon> http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/29/riaa-suing-citizen-for-copying-legally-purchased-cds-to-pc/
[06:27] <persia> imbrandon: Just because the people from whom you might steal are annoying and corrupt doesn't make the theft correct.  While I'm not opposed to downloading, I suggest you consider either following artists that encourage that, or finding other ways to purchase the music for the artists you do prefer.
[06:29] <imbrandon> :)
[06:29]  * ScottK2 hasn't bought must from RIAA artists for years.
[06:29] <ScottK2> I do buy it for gifts, but not for myself.
[06:29] <ScottK2> Magnatune is good.
[06:30] <imbrandon> i like mainstream pop music though sooo ... heh
[06:30] <ScottK2> The legatlity of analogue taping off the air is well established.
[06:30] <persia> There's also lots of indies labels that will sell you a CD (internet, mail order, etc.) without RIAA kickback.
[06:30]  * ScottK2 is partly deaf anyway, so recording quality isn't a major issue.
[06:30] <persia> imbrandon: Collect from the airwaves.
[06:30] <imbrandon> persia: right but not from the artists i want
[06:31] <imbrandon> i do
[06:31]  * imbrandon has a FM card
[06:32] <minghua> One big disadvantage of not living in your home country is that buying music you like is hard. :-(
[06:32] <persia> imbrandon: Still, I hope you either go to shows or buy goods: good to support the artists if you're enjoying their music.
[06:32] <imbrandon> yea , concerts i do quite often
[06:32] <imbrandon> ( and other memorbilia )
[06:33] <persia> minghua: Not sure about that.  We get a fair number of music tourists here, who come to buy things not available overseas, and see some shows, and go home.
[06:35] <minghua> persia: Right.  I could fly back to China and buy music too, though there are quite some complexities and is probably not worth it...
[06:35] <persia> minghua: Right.  My point is that the issue isn't "not living in your home country", but living somewhere other than where your favorite music is produced. :)
[06:36] <minghua> persia: I mean, it's good if you happen to like western music and go to study in US, but I don't like western music.
[06:36] <minghua> Heh.  Pedantic persia.
[06:37] <ScottK2> minghua: That's redundant.
[06:37] <ScottK2> ;-)
[06:37] <persia>  :)
[06:39] <minghua> Actually, I believe it's much easier to buy US/European music in China than to buy Chinese music in US.
[06:40] <persia> minghua: Well, not really.  China is a special case, where one has to be careful about how one purchases music.  It's definitely easier in most of east Asia.
[06:40]  * minghua has bought it on internet and had it shipped over Pacific Ocean, but the shipping fee is a bit prohibitive.
[06:41] <persia> At least for movies, when I worked for a hollywood film distributor, we had a really hard time making a product that could sell in the Chinese market, as the cost of inferior reproductions was often less than our manufacturing costs, and retailers wouldn't carry official goods.
[06:42] <minghua> persia: But shouldn't that make buying US/European music harder in China, instead of easier?
[06:42] <imbrandon> maybe china needs an *IAA hehe
[06:43]  * minghua admits that he has never seen an authorized hollywood movie DVD in China, though.
[06:43] <persia> minghua: Well, US imports are just pointlessly expensive.  For China, I'd say it's equally difficult.  For the rest of east Asia, imports to Asia are easier to find than exports.
[06:45] <persia> imbrandon: The MPAA is very active in China, but the main issue is that you can't force a retailer to stock something that won't sell, and more laws don't really help.  As VCD hardware support is getting better, there's starting to be some official product, but it's hard because the imitations make CDs that last 2-3 months, with 10% bad burn rate, which is unacceptable from a official perspective.
[06:46] <persia> minghua: They are only available wholesale (or were a few years back, when I cared) :)
[06:47] <minghua> persia: I know they sell copies to cinemas, and many people go to see those Hollywood movies.  But I don't think anyone buys authorized DVDs.
[06:47] <minghua> Thing may be a bit different now, though.
[06:47] <persia> minghua: DVDs in Chinese cinemas?  It used to be reels.  Maybe something changed recently.
[06:48] <minghua> persia: No, whatever they use to show the movie in cinema.  I don't know what it is, I assume still reels.
[06:49] <imbrandon> amrican cinemas ( atleaste AMC ) gets all their moves from hollywood in mpeg-2 electronicly , i konw i work on the systems at work to keep it running :)
[06:49] <persia> minghua: Yep.  Reel rental in China is good business.  There's also a big market for VCDs, but it's too saturated at the low end for the official product to be profitable.
[06:50] <minghua> No wonder people get high-quality pirate version of current movies so easily. :-P
[06:50] <imbrandon> heh
[06:51] <persia> minghua: The only issue is that 5-10% of the movies are bad burns, but as they cost so little, it's not a huge problem for the average consumer: just considered one of the little annoyances of life.
[06:52] <imbrandon> dvd's here run on avg $20 USD, not sure how that compares
[06:52] <minghua> persia: VCDs are harder to burn than DVDs?
[06:53] <imbrandon> i would think burning anything has a bad rate vs stamping
[06:53] <persia> minghua: No, but mass-produced blanks in China have a well deserved reputation for poor quality control.
[06:53] <minghua> imbrandon: USD 20 would be about one week's salary for a small town in China.
[06:53] <imbrandon> wow
[06:54] <minghua> persia: Right.  Mass-produced anything in China, I'm afraid. :-(
[06:54] <persia> imbrandon: The distributor I worked for was trying to make a product that could sell for ~ $1.25 US.  Even that was considered expensive, but at least it began to compete.  Cheap street copies are ~ 50 cents US.
[06:54] <imbrandon> yea i mean the hollywood movies, not blanks
[06:55] <persia> imbrandon: I'm talking about official hollywood movies.
[06:55] <minghua> Yeah, USD 1.25 sounds about right.  Although with the dollars falling, I think they are aim at USD 1.50 now. :-P
[06:55] <imbrandon> blanks are arround $0.50 USD avg at the consumer level, not mass ordered
[06:55] <imbrandon> oh wow
[06:55] <imbrandon> 1.50 usd hollwood movies ? jesus
[06:55] <minghua> s/they are/they can/
[06:55] <persia> minghua: Wouldn't surprise me.  Cost limits were mostly based on local labor and sourcing, so it's fairly independent of the slide of the dollar.
[06:56] <minghua> persia: Do the distributors pay anything to the movie studios?
[06:56] <imbrandon> if music / movies , were that cheap here i would never pirate anything
[06:56] <persia> imbrandon: The trick with content distribution is that the creation is a sunk cost, so any further sale one can make at a profit amortises the creation, so is a good thing.
[06:57] <persia> minghua: The official distributors (~$1.50) would.  The unofficial ones don't.  Kickback to US headquarters was to be something like 12 cents a copy, but there's a huge market for product, so volume was expected to make it worthwhile.
[06:58] <persia> imbrandon: Given the nature of the US market, it's really hard to sell a CD for less than around $7, due to local promotion, manufacturing, and distribution charges.  Still, at $7-$10, you'd likely not pirate as much :)
[06:58] <minghua> persia: I see.  Glad to see that studios are willing to accept prices like 12 cents/copy to fight piracy in China. :-)
[06:59] <imbrandon> persia: exactly, honestly , if i could "buy" a electronic copy, not just rent it i would be happy
[06:59] <minghua> $10 a CD, I can't say for sure; but $1 for a song (non-DRM) is definitely fair.
[07:00] <imbrandon> yea minghua music ( non-DRM ) from amazon and iTunes i buy regularly
[07:00] <imbrandon> now i cant say for Movies, i dont wanna advocate piracy a ton, but i dont think i've bought a "real" movie in years
[07:00]  * minghua would if there are songs that he likes...
[07:01] <imbrandon> the problem with iTunes movies and tv shows is they are drm'd to hell, only watchable on iPods or via iTunes
[07:01] <imbrandon> not on my tv or burnable to dvd
[07:01] <imbrandon> if i could burn them to dvd i would buy them too
[07:02] <minghua> Music and movies are different.  There is plainly no MP3-equivalent for movie.
[07:02] <imbrandon> mpeg-X
[07:02] <persia> minghua: mp4
[07:02] <imbrandon> mpeg-4
[07:02] <minghua> Is mpeg-4 well supported on many devices?
[07:03] <minghua> Those portable DVD players, for example?
[07:03] <imbrandon> yes, its the default iTunes format
[07:03] <imbrandon> and most new hardware plays use it
[07:03] <persia> minghua: Fairly.  Everything at least supports mpeg-2 (from which mp3's are derived)
[07:03] <imbrandon> if not all
[07:03] <persia> DVD is stuck at mpeg-2
[07:04] <imbrandon> yea but dvd players play mpeg-4 and vcd and jpeg and others :)
[07:04] <imbrandon> well most do, except really cheap ones
[07:04] <imbrandon> but even most of the cheap ones tdo
[07:04] <persia> (although it's permissible to have code in a DVD cell, so if someone wanted to write a mpeg-4 decoder for the DVD generic DSP, they could make a mpeg-4 DVD, but nobody will ever do this).
[07:04] <minghua> So, uhm, we can have non-DRMed mpeg-4 files that are playable on almost anything?
[07:05] <imbrandon> minghua: yes if anything == 75% of current hardware on the US market
[07:05] <persia> minghua: Sure.  There's of course open video codecs as well (Theora)
[07:05] <imbrandon> or better
[07:05] <minghua> Nah.  Theora won't work, like Vorbis won't work.
[07:06] <minghua> Now if iPod can support Vorbis or FLAC...
[07:06] <imbrandon> heh , with iPod linux they do ... heheh ( i know , just playing devils advocate here )
[07:07] <imbrandon> actualy FLAC playback sucks because of the limited dual 75mhz arm proc
[07:07] <imbrandon> but vorbis is good
[07:07] <imbrandon> the newer gen iPods might have beefed up the proc's though, i'm talking 5th gen
[07:08] <minghua> imbrandon: So FLAC decoding is significantly more CPU-hungry than Apple lossless (whatever that format is)?
[07:08] <persia> minghua: Both the MP3 players I've had, as well as the video-HD box support .ogg out of the box.  It's not as uncommon as you think, especially as there are free implementations available for most common hardware.
[07:08] <imbrandon> its always suprised me they used a second arm proc as a dsp instead of a real dsp, but that also means they can add formats with firmware updates ( not that they will )
[07:08] <minghua> persia: Do they advertise Vorbis support?
[07:09] <minghua> Also, in US the portable music player market is pretty dominated by Apple.
[07:09] <persia> minghua: Yes (iRiver (note that this 'i' predates iPod))
[07:09] <imbrandon> minghua: also accorging to the vorbis site i read a few weeks ago, they said 100% of all "mp4" players improted from china play vorbis ootb but only 10% of them say it on the packaging
[07:10]  * minghua knows that iRiver supports Vorbis, but hasn't seen one in local stores.
[07:10] <persia> minghua: Everywhere outside China is dominated by Apple, and China is mix of Apple and Apple clones.
[07:11] <imbrandon> yea apple went from broke to killer in 10 years
[07:11] <persia> Yes.  China has very strong support for free formats, in large part because of strong support for free code (in part because copyright is odd in China)
[07:12] <minghua> persia: Heh.  I would rather say its "fight against proprietary format that China doesn't own" than "support free format". :-P
[07:12] <imbrandon> you got to admit , they might still be evil and not 100% ideal, but they do give some* back to FL/OSS and have opened up the market somewhat, if Jobs hadent done the anti-drm thing, we wouldent have 3 of the 4 big music companies shipping non-drm music this fast
[07:12] <imbrandon> they == apple
[07:12]  * minghua wonders if anyone has heard about the wireless network protocol war in China.
[07:13] <persia> minghua: I disagree.  I don't believe most of the manufacturers have such an ideological basis.  I think they use free code so that they don't get sued by foreign manufacturing consortiums (note that this only applies to exporters: the internal market is not so constrained)
[07:13] <minghua> Yeah, Jobs is definitely a hero on anti-DRM front.
[07:13] <imbrandon> <fanboi mode> and apple hardware is just sexy</fanboi mode>
[07:14] <minghua> persia: The thing is, in China, on such big things like format choice, manufacturers' opinion don't matter much (IMHO).
[07:15] <persia> minghua: I agree with you on that.  It's all contract manufacturing.
[07:17] <minghua> I think two things make that quite evident: the wireless network protocol war, and the Loongson CPU instruction set choice.
[07:17] <imbrandon> is that , that RISC proc ?
[07:17] <minghua> A MIPS-like one, IIRC.
[07:17] <pwnguin> yea
[07:18]  * minghua doesn't know much about CPU stuff.
[07:18] <imbrandon> i know very little, only enough to get myself in trubble
[07:18] <imbrandon> :)
[07:19] <imbrandon> btw persia i got your PM about the comp
[07:19]  * imbrandon just rembered
[07:19] <minghua> I just heard that Loongson designers deliberately avoided/worked around/hacked around the part of MIPS instruction set that needs a license fee.
[07:19] <imbrandon> haha a -devel thread hasent made me laugh in a while https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2007-December/002782.html
[07:19] <pwnguin> minghua: you mean the part that makes it fast
[07:19] <persia> imbrandon: Want one?  I don't think 玄人志向 has export products.
[07:20] <pwnguin> if they intend to export it, it's pretty much nessecary
[07:20] <minghua> pwnguin: No idea what that part does. :-P
[07:20] <pwnguin> minghua: they're instructions, basically
[07:20] <imbrandon> persia: yea 玄人志向 , btw whats 19,000 yen convert to USD ?
[07:20]  * persia asks google, as imbrandon is clearly too lazy
[07:21] <imbrandon> heh i dident know google did conversions
[07:21] <pwnguin> hmm. i think my gnome-term is lacking unicode or something
[07:21] <imbrandon> pwnguin: ?
[07:21] <persia> imbrandon: "19000 yen in US Dollars" tells me 167.86500 U.S. dollars, with a disclaimer.
[07:21] <pwnguin> yen should be about 100 to the dollar, depending on the day
[07:21] <imbrandon> persia: wow, thats cheap
[07:21] <pwnguin> imbrandon: all i get are ????s on something
[07:22] <persia> imbrandon: barebones.  Case, MB, RAM, flash, and CPU.  You supply disks, video card, etc.
[07:22] <imbrandon> yea is the PCIe the samll one or the 16x ?
[07:22] <persia> pwnguin: KUROUTO SHIKOU
[07:22] <imbrandon> 16x video cards are easy to come by
[07:23] <persia> imbrandon: Yes, but can you find an ARM driver?  I'd probably use a Kairen USB video card.
[07:23] <minghua> pwnguin: Those are CJK characters.  Gnome-terminal should be able to handle it...
[07:23] <pwnguin> persia: origato ^)^
[07:23] <imbrandon> nv would compile on arm just fine, i'm sure it wouldent be running compiz or anything
[07:23] <pwnguin> minghua: im assuming i have that locale purged or something
[07:24] <minghua> pwnguin: en_US.UTF-8 locale should suffice (which is what I am using).
[07:24] <minghua> Although the ???s may be just pwnguin's "can't find glyph" characters, in that case it's a font issue.
[07:24] <imbrandon> pwnguin: likely your irc client instead of the term
[07:25] <imbrandon> or term font
[07:25] <pwnguin> irssi?
[07:25] <imbrandon> hrm i'm on irrssi too
[07:25] <imbrandon> works here, but i'm useing .... ummm ( looks at what font my term is )
[07:25] <minghua> irssi has a separate encoding setting IIRC.
[07:25] <imbrandon> Deja Vu Sans Mono 12
[07:26] <imbrandon> on gnome-term with irssi
[07:26] <imbrandon> ( gutsy )
[07:26] <minghua> imbrandon: That doesn't help, DejaVu doesn't have CJK glyphs.
[07:26] <imbrandon> minghua: hrm, shows fine here
[07:26] <imbrandon> maybe whatever the fallback font is then
[07:27] <pwnguin> i dont think it really matters
[07:27] <pwnguin> as i can't read cjk glyphs
[07:27] <imbrandon> hehe :)
[07:27] <pwnguin> too many of em
[07:27] <imbrandon> i cant type them ( that i know of ) i just copy and paste when i need to
[07:27] <imbrandon> which is rarely
[07:27] <pwnguin> nobody types them
[07:28] <minghua> imbrandon: Yeah, fall back fonts.  You probably can use "fc-match :lang=ja" to see what is.
[07:28] <minghua> Though I'm not sure "fc-match :lang=ja" uses the same fallback rule as you English locale...
[07:28] <imbrandon> imbrandon@hood:~$ fc-match :lang=ja
[07:28] <imbrandon> KochiGothic-Regular.ttf: "Kochi Gothic" "Regular"
[07:30] <minghua> That's a Japanese font, yes.
[07:30] <minghua> Although using the defoma filename, it seems.
[07:30] <pwnguin> the current gnome-term locale for me is UTF-8
[07:31] <pwnguin> there's a package called locale-purge that i sometimes use to save space, that i may have installed here...
[07:31] <imbrandon> persia: http://packages.debian.org/sid/xserver-xorg-video-nv  , seems to work on arm too ( thats the PCIe video i have access too cheap , less than $25 USD )
[07:32] <pwnguin> what arm are you using to test that?
[07:33] <imbrandon> pwnguin: persia was telling me about a new arm box in jp ( not avail here )
[07:33] <persia> There you go.  I doubt you can get a Kairen box for less than ~60 USD.  I'll see if I can find some specs on the internet to make sure that the card will fit.
[07:33] <imbrandon> k
[07:34] <persia> imbrandon: http://kuroutoshikou.com/products/kuro_box_pro/
[07:34] <pwnguin> oh
[07:34] <pwnguin> the kurobox
[07:34] <pwnguin> i didnt know it had pcie slots
[07:35] <persia> pwnguin: Only one :)
[07:35] <pwnguin> just a 1x
[07:35] <imbrandon> 1x not 16x
[07:35] <pwnguin> thats the new box
[07:35] <imbrandon> hrm
[07:35] <persia> pwnguin: Also, it's a new one.  The old ones were all powerpc (currently ~ 10,000 yen)
[07:35] <pwnguin> i recall seeing the old box some time ago
[07:35] <imbrandon> the PCIe video i have is 16x /me looks for a 1x video
[07:36]  * persia still thinks http://www.kairen.co.jp/english/usbvga/index.html is the ideal video adapter for that box
[07:36] <pwnguin> hmm. well, as i don't speak japanese well enough, i think i'd pass on the kurobox pro
[07:37] <imbrandon> persia: oh wow, those look nice
[07:37] <imbrandon> perfect for headless later
[07:37] <persia> imbrandon: Yep.  And handy to have around for all sorts of things :)
[07:38] <imbrandon> kernel support for it ?
[07:38] <persia> imbrandon: Works with Gutsy for AMD64, so I guess it should work for Debian ARM.
[07:38] <imbrandon> nice
[07:39] <imbrandon> the only problem i see is *some* boxes wont boot without a internal video card
[07:39] <imbrandon> wonder if that arm will
[07:39] <pwnguin> i dont see why an ARM would care
[07:39] <pwnguin> they're intended for headless use
[07:39] <persia> imbrandon: It comes out of the box booting linux headless :)
[07:40] <imbrandon> yea , most x86 , even x86 servers need atleaste a pci card , apple xserv is the only x86 i know of that boots headless ootb
[07:40] <imbrandon> without a video card
[07:40] <imbrandon> xserve*
[07:41] <imbrandon> and those its like pulling teeth just to put a video card in it even if you do want to , makes for nice DC security though
[07:41] <imbrandon> cant hook a head to something that dosent have a video card
[07:41] <imbrandon> :)
[07:41] <persia> imbrandon: I used to carry a Kairen and 13" foldable head around :)
[07:42] <imbrandon> heh
[07:42] <imbrandon> yea but if your colo'ing a box it keeps the DC monkeys out of your cabnet
[07:43] <imbrandon> or if your in a DC without lockable cabnets ( not that i know of any )
[07:45] <nenolod> i have rackspace at equinix
[07:45] <nenolod> they're going to have to pluck an eyeball to get into my equipment
[07:45] <nenolod> and i might notice :P
[07:45] <pwnguin> retinal scanners?
[07:45] <nenolod> yeah
[07:46] <pwnguin> i wonder how secure those really are
[07:46] <nenolod> probably not secure at all
[07:46] <pwnguin> the problem i have with the bio stuff is i cant unlock keyrings with them
[07:58] <imbrandon> hum
[08:10] <imbrandon> nixternal: is there a reason you added quilt.mk to kde.mk even there there is no patches or patchsystem ?
[08:10] <imbrandon> or was that just form ana's kde.mk
[08:10] <nixternal> ahh, forgot to remove it
[08:10] <nixternal> I am playing around with KDE 4
[08:10] <imbrandon> ahh ok
[08:10] <nixternal> Amarok2 totally kicks ass, when it works of course
[08:10] <imbrandon> what about utils etc
[08:10] <nixternal> it automatically recognizes and connects to daapd servers
[08:11] <nixternal> utils is gone in kde4 packages
[08:11] <nixternal> utils.mk was only used because of a prior bug that has since been fixed
[08:11] <imbrandon> include debian/cdbs/cmake.mk
[08:11] <imbrandon> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk
[08:11] <imbrandon> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/patchsys-quilt.mk
[08:11] <imbrandon> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/utils.mk
[08:11] <imbrandon> is what you had
[08:11] <nixternal> that is in kde.mk right?
[08:11] <imbrandon> yea
[08:11] <nixternal> ya, that is how it is now with the kde4 packages
[08:12] <nixternal> well the packages we are merging from debian
[08:12] <imbrandon> k, very strange they dont just add these to the rules, makes it complicated
[08:12] <imbrandon> heh
[08:13] <nixternal> ya, don't know why it was all moved into there either
[08:13] <nixternal> keeps the rules file cleaner I guess
[08:13] <imbrandon> as long as every kde maintainer agrees to use quilt , heh
[08:16] <nixternal> oh well, time for some sleeeeeep
[08:16] <nixternal> k'nite :)
[08:16] <imbrandon> gnight
[11:11] <Ng> persia: thanks :)
[11:11]  * Ng dputs
[11:11] <hellboy195> hoi, does anybody knows what happened to bluekuja? haven't seen him for a while here
[11:14] <ion_> Anyone up for reviewing? :-)
[11:36] <persia> ion_: Best to make a small advertisement.  Personally, I like the form: Please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=hardware-connected, a small utility to determine if given hardware is attached to a system.  The comments of the last reviewer have been addressed, and it is waiting for it's first advocate.
[11:38] <persia> hellboy195: He's been around now and then.  This tends to be a quiet time of year.
[11:40] <RainCT> Hi
[11:40] <RainCT> does anyone know how I can force an application to not use any audio device? (to check if it fails without it)
[11:43] <fdoving> RainCT: i guess that largely depends on the application.
[11:43] <RainCT> it's python + pygame
[11:44] <persia> RainCT: Which audio library?
[11:45] <RainCT> ALSA I think
[11:46] <persia> RainCT: You're linking directly against libalsa?  Which package?
[11:46] <RainCT> no, pygame uses SDL
[11:46] <RainCT> and I've libsdl1.2debian-alsa installed
[11:48] <geser> RainCT: either try unloading the alsa modules or install libsdl1.2debian-oss and don't load the alsa oss emulation
[11:49] <persia> (or install libsdl1.2debian-pulseaudio and disable the pulseaudio daemon)
[11:50] <RainCT> ok, thanks
[11:51] <warp10> If a package ships an icon in .xpm format, can it be used in .desktop or should it be converted in png (or something else)?
[11:52] <persia> warp10: xpm works.
[11:53] <persia> More generally, the .desktop file doesn't care about the icon format: ideally the tag is just a name, which name then collects the icon from the active icon cache.  Popular icon cache systems support .xpm, .png, and .svg.  Other formats also sometimes work (most notably .gif, although this is deprecated).
[11:54] <warp10> persia: thank you. So should I forget Mario Bonino's comment in bug #179352?
[11:54] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 179352 in torus-trooper "Needs Icon" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/179352
[11:55] <persia> warp10: No.  The Icon= key should not contain either a path or an extension.  When these are included, it looks for a specific file instead of using the icon cache, which breaks theming.
[11:55] <persia> In this case, you want "Icon=torus-trooper"
[11:56] <warp10> persia: Ouch! I was thinking to .xpm as the kind-of-file category, not just the extension. Ok, I'll fix that.
[11:57] <persia> warp10: Thanks :)
[11:58] <warp10> persia: apart from that, I saw you reviewd my package tennix. Thanks for that. I would like to ask something about your review. In query if you prefer
[11:58] <persia> warp10: I prefer in-channel.  It allows others to correct me when I make mistakes :)
[12:00] <warp10> persia: I agree. Well, about the icon for menu, can I use the icon shipped with the package?
[12:01] <persia> warp10: Unlike .desktop files, menu files require one or both of a 16x16 and 32x32 xpm.  The menu system doesn't use the icon cache (which makes it work for desktop environments that don't have one, but tends to result in less pretty icons).
[12:03] <warp10> persia: So .xpm is mandatory for menu files... Ok, good to know. Now, about ./SDLMain.* who haven't licensing headers: should I fix that? If so, how?
[12:03] <persia> warp10: Just for reference, 1 is a non-blocking warning, 3, 4, & 5 are commentary, and 2 & 6 are the blockers.
[12:03] <KIRMIZI___> hi i need e help about pardus
[12:03] <KIRMIZI___> who can help me ?
[12:03] <persia> KIRMIZI___: This isn't a support channel.  You might have some luck in #ubuntu or #ubuntu-xx where xx is your local country code.
[12:04] <KIRMIZI___> persia : thnx a lot for your interest
[12:04] <persia> warp10: You need to either find evidence that the files are public domain, discover the licensing somewhere and report it in debian/copyright, or get upstream to put the licensing in the tarball.  This last is best.
[12:05] <persia> warp10: There's also a tennix candidate in the Debian Games SVN.  I don't know if any or all of that work might be useful, but it may be worth matching some of it to make the merge later easier.
[12:06] <warp10> Fortunately upstream is very responsive to my requests. This could be of help for the changelog issue too. But in case he doesn't provide a changelog, how could I fix that?
[12:07] <persia> warp10: If upstream keeps the code in a VCS, it may be easy enough for them to pull the VCS log as a changelog in the distributed tarball.  If upstream really doesn't want to ship a changelog, that's not a blocking issue, but it does make chasing down in which version some forgotten bug was closed easier.
[12:10] <warp10> persia: ok, great. Thank you so much for your answers, they helped me better understanding my mistakes :)
[12:15] <persia> warp10: No problem.  Thanks for helping.
[12:18] <Kmos> persia: do you also check debdiff today ? :)
[12:20] <ion_> persia: Ok, will do that in the future, thanks. :-)
[12:28] <persia> Kmos: A couple.  Do you mean one in particular?
[12:29] <Kmos> bug 179296
[12:29] <Kmos> this one
[12:30] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 179296 in gnome-chemistry-utils "Please merge gnome-chemistry-utils 0.8.4-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/179296
[12:36] <persia> Kmos: I haven't looked at that one.  Neither I nor any of the teams to which I belong are subscribed.
[12:37] <Kmos> persia: ok =)
[12:41] <persia> Kmos: That debdiff contains config.sub & config.guess, which is typically discouraged.  Also, why should the package be merged?
[12:43] <Kmos> persia: because of the "firefox" in Depends..
[12:43] <Kmos> i'll remove stuff from config.*
[12:45] <persia> Kmos: Let me ask that differently.  Since the Ubuntu package already has firefox in the Depends:, why is it worth granting a Debian Import Freeze exception to update this package?
[12:47] <Kmos> persia: because of the last changed things on Debian.. like add -dbg package, missing .glade files, add one patch, ...
[12:47] <Kmos> like you can see in their last changelog
[12:49] <Kmos> and it doesn't have so many changes, like in code.. so it's only bug fixing
[12:51] <persia> Kmos: Which of the changes are important enough to grant a freeze exception?  We can't merge all the Debian changes in time for release :(
[12:54] <Kmos> persia: I know.. but i think the change of -dbg is important for future crash reports (apport), the patch added to fix a crash from, missing .glade file. and until february is a long time..
[12:54] <Kmos> for me their important for an exception in this time.. two months from FF
[12:54] <Kmos> *they're
[12:55] <Kmos> - the patch added to fix a crash from video cards.
[12:55] <persia> Kmos: -dbg doesn't make any difference.  -dbgsym is pulled by a dh_strip wrapper in pkg-create-dbgsym.
[12:56] <persia> The crash fix would be a good reason for a freeze exception.  It might be worth mentioning this in the description, no?
[12:56] <Kmos> persia: yes.. i will put it their
[12:56] <Kmos> do you think the glade file isn't important ?
[12:57] <Kmos> without it the executable should not open
[12:57] <Kmos> *.glade files i mean
[12:58] <LucidFox> Will KDE be demoted to universe, or will remain in main but be non-LTS-eligible?
[12:59] <fdoving> remain in main.
[13:00] <fdoving> supported for 18 months like regular releases.
[13:01] <persia> Kmos: If the new .glade files make a non-working package work, they are certainly DIFe worthy.  That wasn't clear to me from the debian changelog (no bug closure reference)
[13:02] <dsop> Hi. I'm still searching for some MOTU to review my package gcutils (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=gcutils). It's a small set of script that help people to deal with cvs and git and interact between both RCS.
[13:03] <persia> LucidFox: As I understand it (and this is very much not official), the only difference is that Canonical isn't selling 3-year support contracts for KDS desktops.  As long as the release is identified, I can't imagine it wouldn't get the same -updates and -security treatment universe gets (although the components may actually be in main).
[13:03] <persia> s/KDS/KDE/
[13:06] <Kmos> persia: I'll check if there is one..
[13:06] <persia> Kmos: There isn't one (or it would be in the changelog)
[13:07] <LucidFox> persia> Also, regarding amrnb... it's out of question, the COPYING file flat-out states that the code is proprietary
[13:08] <LucidFox> so we'll have to build avidemux without libamrnb, as we did before
[13:08] <Kmos> persia: there isn't.. :-(
[13:09] <jonnymind> Hello to everyone.
[13:17] <persia> LucidFox: Meaning we can't distribute it at all?  Not even in multiverse?
[13:17] <LucidFox> Here are the contents of COPYING:
[13:17] <LucidFox> The 3GPP TS 26.104 V 7.0.0 reference code has a commercial license.
[13:17] <LucidFox> To use package compiled by this code, you may need a license from 3GPP.
[13:17] <LucidFox> The wrapper code is released under GNU Library General Public License.
[13:18]  * persia isn't sure how that is different than mencoder, but isn't an expert
[13:18] <LucidFox> mplayer/mencoder is itself free software, but codecs are encumbered by patents
[13:19] <LucidFox> and amrnb isn't even free software
[13:19] <persia> Ah.  So you need a patent license to use mencoder, but you need a code license to use amrnb.  Thanks for the explanation.
[13:27] <jonnymind> Hello all; I am waiting for revisions on bug 174470
[13:27] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 174470 in ubuntu "Package for the Falcon Programming Language" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174470
[13:27] <jonnymind> In the meanwhile, we have gathered developers, and we'll be probably able to release a DBI system.
[13:28] <jonnymind> I'd like to know if you have suggestion for the packaging of DBI with its drivers.
[13:28] <jonnymind> As every driver requires a different dev package to build, what would be the better way to parcelize source and binary packages?
[13:35] <persia> jonnymind: Depends on your convenience, and the amount of shared code.  If it's mostly the same code, you might have one source package with lots of DBI-$database packages, an arch-specific DBI package with the glue code, and an arch-independent DBI-common with the data.
[13:35] <jonnymind> Yes, the point is that we have quite a novel DBI architecture.
[13:35] <jonnymind> I.e. you may load the mysql module, and then it would load the DBI.
[13:36] <jonnymind> Or you could load DBI, and it may load mysql module.
[13:37] <jonnymind> Having one source package will be extremely comfortable to us, but it would requires all the devel packages for all the databases to be intalled at build process.
[13:37] <jonnymind> Is it ok?
[13:38] <persia> jonnymind: It is OK, and better than having code in two places.
[13:38] <jonnymind> Fantastic.
[13:38] <jonnymind> This will save us tons of work.
[13:38] <persia> Just make sure to split the binary packages so that people don't need to install things they don't have on their local systems.
[13:39] <jonnymind> Ok. I can set different binary dependencies for each dbi binary driver, right?
[13:39] <persia> jonnymind: Exactly.
[13:40] <jonnymind> Excellent, thanks for the answer.
[13:59] <liri> persia: I've put under package/debian the control file and the rest and under package/usr the directory tree with the actual source package (scripts) to be populated on the machine it's installing on.
[14:25] <jwill> I see that requestsync sends an email to the bug server, does it automatically create the bug or is there some sort of review queue before the bug is viewable on launchpad?
[14:26] <geser> jwill: the bug gets created automatically
[14:41] <jwill> the package I'm interested in is libxstream-java 1.2.2-1, I wanna make sure the original requestsync didn't work before doing another
[14:44] <persia> jwill: Sometimes it takes 5-10 minutes.  Try searching for the bug again: if it's still not there by now, it's worth trying again.
[14:45] <jwill> persia: I did it last night. will try again
[14:45] <geser> jwill: does LP know your gpg key as the mail is signed?
[14:46] <jwill> persia: yeah, the gpg pass it prompts for is the same one registered in LP
[14:46] <jwill> oops
[14:52] <jwill> it's there now, I guess it was because the first attempt used the same GPG key but not the primary email from LP, thx
[15:38] <geser> jwill: have you looked at the generated mail from requestsync?
[15:40] <jwill> geser: yeah, it just looks the same, like HTML output, the only diff was the DEBEMAIL address
[15:41] <geser> jwill: that's the problem: there should be the Debian changelog instead of a HTML page
[15:46] <jwill> geser: so should I go and find it then attach it to the bug?
[15:48] <geser> yes please
[15:48] <persia> jwill: Just add the updated debian changelog as text to the description, rather than as an attachment please.
[15:50] <jwill> ok, it's been added.
[16:23]  * emgent heya
[16:38] <bddebian> Heya gang
[16:40] <shonen> hey everyone ^_^
[16:47] <bddebian> Hello shonen
[16:47] <shonen> hey bddebian :)
[16:48] <ion_> Howdy
[16:48] <bddebian> Hello ion_
[17:10] <blueyed> Is there a good tool to ease comparing and editing marked conflicts in a file? e.g. when there are build-depend lines filling the whole screen..
[17:55] <imbrandon> blueyed: not that i'm aware , just $fav_editor
[17:56] <blueyed> imbrandon: yes, but it's ugly quite fast, if most are different because we have lpia therein.
[17:57] <imbrandon> why would lpia build depends be any diffrent ?
[17:57] <blueyed> I've wrote a quick python script, but have given up, because I see not much sense in doing the ooo merge, if chris should look at it anyway.
[17:57] <blueyed> we have lpia in the build-depends, debian not.
[17:57] <blueyed> then it
[17:58] <blueyed> 's difficult to scan the lines with your eyes only.
[17:58] <imbrandon> ... lpia is an arch not a package iirc
[17:58] <blueyed> yes
[17:58] <imbrandon> ok that makes no sense then
[17:58] <blueyed> and we have it with every package (nearly probably)
[17:58] <imbrandon> blueyed: what ? your not making sense
[17:59] <imbrandon> please rephrase
[17:59] <imbrandon> do you mean something like [!lpia] in a package build depends
[17:59] <imbrandon> ?
[17:59] <imbrandon> if so that wont be in many if any packages
[18:00] <blueyed> imbrandon: http://pastebin.ca/838821
[18:01] <blueyed> Where Debian has "[i386 powerpc sparc amd64 ppc64]" we have the same with "lpia" additionally.
[18:01] <imbrandon> wow see you have a special package there, very few packages are so arch specific
[18:01] <blueyed> ooo
[18:01] <imbrandon> right, but your talking a one package deal, not "most" packages in the archive
[18:02] <blueyed> yes, so the python script ignored the archs when looking for new/different depends
[18:02] <imbrandon> infact thats kinda stupid how its done imho, they should use [!arm] etc instead of being inclusive
[18:03] <imbrandon> wow, what a mess
[18:03] <blueyed> You mean the "we have lpia in the b-d" from above? I've meant the ubuntu specific part of this specific package, sorry.
[18:03] <imbrandon> yea thats an exception , not the common
[18:04] <blueyed> luckily.
[18:04] <imbrandon> no i mean debian maintainers should have s/[i386 powerpc sparc amd64 ppc64]/[!arm !armel !mips !mipsel]/g instead
[18:04] <imbrandon> then there wouldent be this problem
[18:05] <blueyed> imbrandon: gotcha, yes. Makes sense for me, too.
[18:06] <imbrandon> hell for that matter build instead of an arch any package just make it those
[18:07] <imbrandon> then you wouldent need to do it at all
[18:07] <blueyed> Just for reference, this should be the difference of the b-d listed above: http://pastebin.ca/838827 - but don't count on it.
[18:07] <blueyed> "just make it those"?
[18:10] <imbrandon> Architecture: powerpc i386 sparc amd64 ppc64
[18:11] <imbrandon> in the debian control
[18:11] <imbrandon> then it would only need the exceptions in the build depnds
[18:11] <imbrandon> in other words i'm bitching aobut how bad that package is and i wouldent use it as a "rule" to go by making a tool
[18:12] <imbrandon> or anything for that matter
[18:15] <blueyed> I see. I've just thought that there may be some script for this already anyway. It wasn't the first time that I was scanning Build-Depends by eye, although that it wasn't so bad until now. Thanks for bitching ;)
[18:18] <imbrandon> heh , food time, bbiab
[19:50] <TheMuso> Hey folks.
[19:51] <pochu> heya TheMuso
[19:52] <zul> hey TheMuso
[20:31] <imbrandon> heya fellas
[20:31] <pochu> heya imbrandon
[20:40] <Ubulette> could someone please nuke mozilla-devscripts on REVU ?
[20:40] <Ubulette> I give up
[20:45] <imbrandon> Ubulette: i will but will you make a comment asking to be nuked ( just to CYA )
[20:50] <Ubulette> done
[20:53] <imbrandon> Ubulette: your asking for a nuke because no one has reviewed it yet? do you realize what time of year it is? anyhow i wont nuke it for that reason, i will however archive it for you
[20:53] <imbrandon> done
[20:55] <Ubulette> imbrandon, that's the 5th time i'm stuck in 3 months, each time with a good reason, i'm giving up moving to something different.
[20:56] <imbrandon> looks like the upload was done on the 16th, but as you wish, i dont want to bicker but i would like to help you get past what seems to be a overwelming frsutration with how slow things are moving right now
[20:56] <imbrandon> if i'm out of place just tell me so and i'll shush, but if i can help let me know how
[20:58] <imbrandon> ( and it is archived btw now, so if you do wish to change your mind it can easly be "un-archived" by a new upload or a REVU admin )
[20:58] <imbrandon> just FYI
[20:58] <Ubulette> i've lost at least 6 weeks in the last 3 months waiting for things to be reviewed, acked, sponsored or pushed. i find that ineffective.
[20:59] <crimsun> well, do you have anything that needs uploading?
[21:45] <cyberix> Be the first one to spot a bug in my new package malbolge! Now at R-E-V-U! http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=malbolge
[22:16] <cyberix> :-/
[22:26] <hellboy195> cyberix: be patient ;) someone will look at it.
[22:31] <TheMuso> Morning Hobbsee.
[22:31] <Hobbsee> heya TheMuso!
[22:44] <bluefoxicy> Is there a mechanism to request things enter gutsy partner?
[22:45] <bluefoxicy> (I'm specifically thinking VMware Server 2.0 Beta 2)
[22:45] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: bug fabbione
[22:45] <bluefoxicy> k
[22:45] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee have you moved back to KDE yet or are you still digging around in GNOME
[22:45] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: gnome still
[22:46] <bluefoxicy> interesting.
[22:46] <bluefoxicy> Does Gnome have a Hearts game with network play?
[22:46] <hellboy195> bluefoxicy: well gnome rocks ;)
[22:47] <bluefoxicy> hellboy195:  I stopped touching KDE when it started eating 4 times as much ram as gnome was
[22:47] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: apparently not.  still, gnome-hearts does actuallyw ork nwo
[22:47] <hellboy195> bluefoxicy: nice :) but I'll have a look at kde4
[22:48] <bluefoxicy> (see, reading someone's PPA contents lets you make yourself sound like a creepy stalker by talking about the specific applications they use)
[22:49] <bluefoxicy> anyway I'm out for a bit, was just wondering about gutsy partner
[23:11] <cyberix> "Have a problem with the package malbolge? I'm here to help. Just tell me your woe. Right here on #ubuntu-motu!" http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=malbolge


[19:00] <cmaloney> Afternoon
[19:01] <_stink_> yo
[19:02] <cmaloney> How goes?
[19:09] <_stink_> in toronto
[19:09] <_stink_> hockey tournament
[19:10] <_stink_> so reasonably sore :P
[19:10] <_stink_> you?
[20:21] <cmaloney> free rpg day today
[20:21] <cmaloney> and visited a newborn
[20:32] <_stink_> did you get pooped on
[20:32] <cmaloney> nope. Not yet.
[22:01] <dzho> there's still time
[22:01] <dzho> that, and puked on