[00:50] <Homefix> ogra: Thank you I now have a #
[04:53] <SaidKLE> Alright, I just rooted my haipad m701 and I'm dieing to see if I can install ubuntu on it.
[04:53] <SaidKLE> Totally new to this, and there isn't much by way of how-to's online.
[11:31] <may_null> Hey I'm following steps here -> http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardUbuntu#Maverick_10.10_2.. But when I boot and see xfce graphical display generally it's not recognize my usb mouse or keyboard
[11:31] <may_null> Do I missing some packages or ?
[14:10] <ian_brasil> ogra: did you get a chance to look at why the kubuntu mobile image is not building ok?
[14:13] <ian_brasil> gabrield is Gabriel Duarte http://w3.impa.br/~gabrield/
[18:35] <rsalveti> GrueMaster: don't know if you noticed, but this new image is already using the latest u-boot that jcrigby updated
[18:35] <rsalveti> and it seems fine, so that's good :-)
[18:36] <jcrigby> woohoo!
[18:41] <GrueMaster> Hadn't noticed (serial issues), but great news.
[20:42] <GrueMaster> ogra: The error I am getting is "Error showing url:  The specifiedlocation is not supported".  I can reproduce it on the cmdline.
[20:43] <ogra> GrueMaster, thx
[22:31] <rsalveti> jcrigby: did the sd card work properly for you?
[22:35] <jcrigby> yes, thanks so much.  All the panda boards worked
[22:46] <rsalveti> jcrigby: awesome!
[23:02] <ogra> NCommander, "Handle modification of jasper-initramfs to use userspace archdetect" from other-arm-n-userland-subarch-detection .... what am i supposed to do with that ? the output of archdetect isnt useful at all to jasper anywhere
[23:03] <NCommander> ogra: if subarch detection isn't userful to jasper, nuke the item
[23:03] <ogra> k
[23:04] <ogra> NCommander, jasper needs to know the actual board it runs on, archdetect only spits out the arch
[23:04] <ogra> (because we install different bits for different boards of the same arch)
[23:04]  * ogra nukes
[23:05] <NCommander> ogra: *groan*, yeah, thats annoying and so shouldn't be necessary but it is :-/
[23:26] <ogra> persia, /usr/bin/devicetype-detect: 123: /bin/true): not found
[23:26] <ogra> persia, fix at http://paste.ubuntu.com/553395/


[07:28] <ducasse> good morning, everyone
[08:51] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[08:54] <ducasse> morning, lotuspsychje - how are you?
[08:55] <lotuspsychje> hey ducasse great and you?
[08:55] <lotuspsychje> trying to fix an old packard bell P3 128ram
[08:56] <ducasse> i'm good, thanks, having a quiet morning here
[08:56] <lotuspsychje> its installing xp right now, but the machine is designed for 2000
[08:57] <lotuspsychje> lubuntu32 bit is next on the list :p
[08:59] <ducasse> it's not going to be a speed monster :)
[09:00] <lotuspsychje> no lol
[09:01] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: the users choice to repair an old machine
[09:01] <lotuspsychje> i mean customer
[09:01] <lotuspsychje> perhaps use as big calculator lol
[09:01] <ducasse> aha, right :)
[09:35] <lotuspsychje> hey TJ-
[09:51] <TJ-> morning :)
[09:52] <lotuspsychje> TJ-: im happy the gods have heared my bug wishlist of systemd we talked about last time
[09:52] <lotuspsychje> canonical promised to speed up :p
[09:57] <lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
[09:57] <EriC^^> hey lotuspsychje
[09:57] <ducasse> hi EriC^^, TJ-
[09:58] <EriC^^> hi ducasse
[10:29] <daftykins> \o
[10:30] <daftykins> lotuspsychje: Pentium III !?
[10:30] <daftykins> surely that's not a clients
[10:30] <daftykins> that system should be dumped though, totally impractical for any modern, updated and secure OS
[10:31] <lotuspsychje> daftykins: hehe, this is not my call mate
[10:31] <lotuspsychje> daftykins: im awaiting his answer
[10:31] <daftykins> mmm, but you can't knowingly work on XP for someone, since it's EOL
[10:31] <lotuspsychje> daftykins: i wont suggest throwing hardware away to users, if they bring it to me
[10:32] <daftykins> well you'll have to - no OS will fix that lemon!
[10:32] <lotuspsychje> daftykins: that thing doesnt has internet lol only modem, no eth and wifi
[10:32] <daftykins> haha dialup days
[10:32] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[10:32] <lotuspsychje> just tested lubuntu live, and runs fine
[10:33] <TJ-> PCMCIA ethernet adapters
[10:33] <lotuspsychje> 128mb ram lol
[10:33] <TJ-> I still have some knocking around somewhere :)
[10:33] <daftykins> it does not run fine :|
[10:33] <lotuspsychje> lubuntu 16.04 is magic daftykins
[10:33] <daftykins> unless all you like to do is see a desktop drawn and nothing besides
[10:34] <lotuspsychje> what else will he do with that machine beside text and calculator
[10:34] <daftykins> no that's utter rubbish, i proved this point a while back when i had a similar spec PII and put it on - it was dipping into swap immediately and was utterly useless
[10:34] <daftykins> replace with a nice notepad and real calculator then :>
[10:34] <lotuspsychje> depends what to compare with it..
[10:34] <daftykins> and a pencil :D
[10:35] <lotuspsychje> hahaha
[10:35] <lotuspsychje> i wouldnt use it, but its his machine from school edu days
[10:35] <lotuspsychje> its not my call here
[10:36] <daftykins> claiming it's usable though, you can't say that
[10:36] <daftykins> lubuntu does not polish a turd
[10:37] <lotuspsychje> depends on wich standards daftykins
[10:37] <lotuspsychje> an old machine is an old machine
[10:37] <lotuspsychje> you have to keep use it as an old machine
[10:37] <daftykins> then giving them a Linux distro will invalidate that most likely
[10:38] <lotuspsychje> i gave him the choice of xp and lubuntu, saying that xp is eol
[10:38] <lotuspsychje> battery broke, ram was missing, hd was broken..
[10:38] <lotuspsychje> i fixxed it, like he asked me to
[10:39] <lotuspsychje> customers choice right
[10:39] <lotuspsychje> its his choice to find it unworkable or not, and buy a new one
[10:40] <daftykins> there are limits imo
[10:40] <EriC^^> howdy gentlemen
[10:40] <daftykins> i'd love to hear the use-case though xD
[10:40] <daftykins> hey EriC^^ \o
[10:40] <EriC^^> hey daftykins o/
[10:40] <lotuspsychje> ill keep you informed on this one daftykins hehe
[10:40] <lotuspsychje> curious also what he will do
[10:42] <lotuspsychje> hmmm that makes me think, i still got an old travelmate i could try lubuntu on!
[10:43] <daftykins> that old PII i tried died after a couple of lubuntu boots xD
[10:45] <lotuspsychje> cool its an amd 3000
[10:46] <daftykins> what generation?
[10:46] <lotuspsychje> acer aspire 1350
[10:48] <daftykins> nah the AMD 3000, is that an Athlon XP or newer?
[10:52] <lotuspsychje> think its athlon xp yeah
[10:57] <daftykins> daym
[10:58] <daftykins> oof scaffolders coming, gotta go clear the decks
[10:58] <lotuspsychje> :p
[11:27] <lotuspsychje> !info lubuntu-tweak-tool
[11:32] <daftykins> haha there's nothing left to turn off ;)
[11:33] <lotuspsychje> lol
[11:33] <lotuspsychje> updating 600mb
[11:53] <daftykins> they're disassembling it now, soon i'll have more light through the windows again :D
[12:03] <lotuspsychje> daftykins: cool
[12:04] <daftykins> and no more drunks climbing it on weekends and signing along to youtube right beside my bed! (that happened :P )
[12:05] <lotuspsychje> uh?
[12:08] <daftykins> (because he got up to the roof which is my bedroom)
[12:14] <lubuntubox>  HexChat: 2.10.2 ** OS: Linux 4.13.0-32-generic i686 ** Distro: Ubuntu´ "xenial´" 16.04u´ ** CPU: 1 x Mobile AMD Athlon(tm) XP 3000+ (AuthenticAMD) @ 796MHz ** RAM: Physical: 490.8MiB, 71.6% free ** Disk: Total: 36.1GiB, 86.1% free ** VGA: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] RV280/M9+ [Mobility Radeon 9200 AGP] ** Sound: VIA8233 - VIA 82351: VIA82XX-MODEM - VIA 82XX modem ** Ethernet
[12:14] <lubuntubox> : VIA Technologies, Inc. VT6102/VT6103 [Rhine-II] ** Uptime: 6m 29s **
[12:15] <lubuntubox> im old :p
[12:21] <daftykins> and rubbish *cough*
[12:21] <daftykins> ;D
[12:21] <lotuspsychje> hahaha
[12:24] <lubuntubox> you mocking my shiny hardware?
[12:24] <lotuspsychje> lol
[12:30] <TJ-> that's impressive, uptime 6 milleniums, 29 senturies :p
[12:30] <lotuspsychje> lol
[12:31] <lotuspsychje> dinosaurs have the permission to survive!
[13:08] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[13:10] <daftykins> \o wb
[13:10] <BluesKaj> Hi daftykins
[13:12] <oerheks> morning :-)
[13:13] <BluesKaj> hey oerheks
[13:18] <BluesKaj> desktop was acting up, had to reboot
[13:20] <BluesKaj> there was a display and monitor upgrade waiting to take effect it seems
[13:24] <daftykins> o0
[14:09] <lotuspsychje> hey oerheks BluesKaj
[14:10] <BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
[14:15] <lotuspsychje> https://www.deviantart.com/customization/screenshots/nix/newest/
[14:15] <lotuspsychje> cool stuff
[14:19] <lotuspsychje> OMG!
[14:19] <lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2018/01/xorg-will-default-display-server-ubuntu-18-04-lts
[14:22] <lotuspsychje> https://insights.ubuntu.com/2018/01/26/bionic-beaver-18-04-lts-to-use-xorg-by-default/
[14:29] <lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-16-04-4-lts-delayed-due-to-meltdown-and-spectre-security-vulnerabilities-519572.shtml
[14:29] <lotuspsychje> hot news today
[14:34] <TJ-> it's been in the works for a while - the PTI patches are breaking all sorts of stuff and there are far too many regressions
[15:06] <tomreyn> wayland would have been nice, but it's just not there, yet.
[15:06] <tomreyn> and... nvidia is not ready
[15:07] <lotuspsychje> good ol xorg to the rescue
[15:07] <tomreyn> and to the much increased attack surface
[15:07] <tomreyn> or rather, not decreased
[15:09] <TJ-> Not much point in reducing attack surface if it prevents users doing common operations from the GUI though. My point of view is reduced functionality or denying users to do something they explicitly could previously do is a Denial of Service
[15:16] <tomreyn> nice POV. :) i'd say that remarkably impacting usability (as this early switch would surely do) would surely make people switch away from ubuntu (as has happened before when new technology was adopted / pushed just a little too early), and i guess that's enough of a reason not to.
[15:17] <tomreyn> the really good thing is: we'll have a choice on what to use. :)
[15:17] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[15:20] <daftykins> given the lack of common features like that article refers to, it's more proof Wayland is just "new and shiny" and not ready imo
[15:20] <daftykins> i say that firmly on the outside :D
[15:21] <daftykins> definitely handy to make it easier to test with to provoke progress though i imagine
[15:21] <lotuspsychje> fedora is on wayland, do they also occur such issues?
[15:22] <daftykins> well that whole distro is the experimental one :D
[15:23] <TJ-> lotuspsychje: see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_debug_Wayland_problems#Known_issues.2C_frequent_complaints.2C_fundamental_changes
[15:23] <lotuspsychje> !alis | Fint
[15:23] <lotuspsychje> tnx TJ-
[15:24] <lotuspsychje> alot of issues..
[15:25] <TJ-> The biggest issue re privileges is forcing applications to be re-written to use policy-kit ... what happens when that loses favour and something else comes along...? We've seen that so many times. Whereas running an application as root makes it portable
[15:26] <oerheks> lotuspsychje, bor3 got finally silenced
[15:27] <Fint> So what are you want to tell me ,at all
[15:27] <lotuspsychje> Fint: start with a question?
[15:28] <Fint> que stion
[15:28] <Fint> how to do it
[15:28] <lotuspsychje> Fint: you seem not to understand #ubuntu is for ubuntu support
[15:28] <lotuspsychje> so lets discuss here what you want?
[15:29] <Fint> I'm a newcomer
[15:29] <lotuspsychje> Fint: hi, im fint and i need...
[15:30] <Fint> I'm Fint and i need knowledge
[15:30] <daftykins> not specific enough.
[15:30] <lotuspsychje> Fint: knowlegde of...?
[15:30] <Fint> to know more
[15:30] <Fint> the web
[15:31] <daftykins> wrong place then
[15:32] <TJ-> Fint: for more about Ubuntu maybe this will help? http://cn.ubuntu.com/desktop/
[15:32] <Fint> thankyou
[15:36] <BluesKaj> TJ-:  that desu guy seems to think the linux suppoert chat is his personal blog..i don't understand why he hasn't been warned ,,filling up the chat offtopic crap, altho he does helo, occassionally
[15:37] <TJ-> BluesKaj: I don't notice it
[15:38] <BluesKaj> i have him on ignore, maybe he backed off some
[15:55] <lotuspsychje> bbl
[16:37] <immu> hi friends
[16:53] <immu> hi eric


[14:10] <highvoltage> good morning everyone
[14:42] <mgariepy> good morning everyone.
[18:24] <highvoltage> Edubuntu meeting in minus 26 minutes!
[18:36] <highvoltage> oop, I got the time wrong, it's /in/ 23 minutes from now
[18:36]  * highvoltage pastes what happened...
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:26 < highvoltage> Anybody around for an Edubuntu meeting?
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:27  * highvoltage goes ahead and spews out random updates for anyone who's willing to read then
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:27 < highvoltage> Stéphane finished the application selector so that users can choose what to remove from their final installation:  http://www.stgraber.org/2011/02/22/edubuntus-installer-ready-for-11-04/
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:28 < highvoltage> that's pretty much the last of what we need for Natty feature-wise
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:28 -!- jamespage<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:28 < highvoltage> LTSP Live is in a pretty bad state at the moment, but that's bugs and isn't directly affected by the feature freeze on Thursday.
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:28 -!- e-jat<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:29 -!- ripple<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:30 < highvoltage> I propose a bug day for 16 March, this page will be published to the frontpage if no one has a problem with the date (or the lolbug):  http://edubuntu.org/2011-02-23/edubuntu-bug-day-16-march
[18:36] <highvoltage> 13:30 < czajkowski> highvoltage: would you not tie in with UGJ ?
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:31 < highvoltage> czajkowski: admittingly, I haven't been following the UGJ stuff recently, is there one planned for that week?
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:31 < highvoltage> czajkowski: I'd prefer it if it could tie in somehow with that
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:31 < czajkowski> highvoltage: 2 weeks later
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:32 < czajkowski> highvoltage: http://www.lczajkowski.com/2011/02/23/ubuntu-global-jam-coming-soon/
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:32 -!- cyphermox<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:32 -!- chrisccoulson [~chr1s@ubuntu/member/chrisccoulson] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:33 < highvoltage> czajkowski: that would've been nice, but it's after beta freeze, ideally we should do it before beta freeze imho
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:33 < highvoltage> (beta freeze is also UI freeze this time round)
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:34 -!- davmor2<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit [Quit: I'm outta here]
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:34 < czajkowski> :s
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:36 < highvoltage> I think we should do something for UGJ anyway, it would be good for documentation, website/wiki updates and other close-to-release stuff
[18:37] <highvoltage> 13:37  * stgraber waves
[18:38] <mhall119> did I miss something
[18:38] <highvoltage> nothing more than what's pasted above
[18:38] <highvoltage> and that we'll more or less resume at the right time
[18:38] <highvoltage> not that I have a lot more to say :)
[18:38] <alkisg> :) ty for the update :)
[18:39] <highvoltage> (but someone else might)
[18:39] <highvoltage> (*might*)
[18:52] <highvoltage> real edubuntu meeting in 5 minutes


[00:00] <ali1234> someone reported test results for it already :)
[00:08] <TJ-> The mailing list said Thursday
[00:09] <TJ-> haha, I thought I had a bright idea to stop the Xorg on :1 being spawned. "chmod -x /usr/bin/Xorg" -- that killed the Xorg on :0 !! I thought once a program was mapped and running that shouldn't affect it
[00:09] <TJ-> Interesing denial of service avenue :)
[00:21] <ali1234> hmm
[00:22] <ali1234> you might find this useful
[00:23] <ali1234> sometimes when i am debugging system components that you can't run directly, what i do is replace the binary with a shim that logs when it is started and the arguments and then runs the real binary
[00:23] <ali1234> this can help find race conditions if eg something is run twice accidentally
[00:23] <TJ-> yeah, I use the method sometimes
[00:24] <TJ-> I usually use a --bind mount over the original
[00:33] <ali1234> hmm i am confused
[00:33] <ali1234> alt-f1 on the login screen makes the font bigger?
[00:33] <ali1234> and alt-f2 switches to high contrast?
[00:34] <ali1234> alt-f3 = osk?
[00:34] <ali1234> but how do i get to a console?
[00:38] <TJ-> On an X server it's Ctrl+Alt+F1-Fx
[00:39] <TJ-> But when on a console VT it only needs Alt+Fx
[00:39] <ali1234> yeah, but it doesn't seem to work on the xubunut login screen
[00:39] <ali1234> it works after login
[00:39] <TJ-> works here on 3 laptops, just tested. You have to release the Alt key and re-press it though, you can't sit your finger on it
[00:40] <ali1234> not for me
[00:40] <TJ-> I've got 3 very different laotops here all are OK
[00:40] <ali1234> probably vbox being weird
[00:41] <TJ-> ahhh, yes
[00:43] <ali1234> i tried your dbus line, it just prints usage :(
[00:44] <ali1234> oh, there should be a space between / and org
[00:45] <TJ-> yeah, DBus is a pain with it's replication of naming in service, interface, and path
[00:46] <TJ-> If you ever want to understand it better, install and run the GUI d-feet which allows you to browse the system and session trees as well as execute methods with or without arguments. Great aid in figuring out how to use the dbus-send CLI
[00:47] <ali1234> so i noticed that during first login, xfsettingsd uses 100% CPU for several seconds
[00:47] <ali1234> that is something that does not happen on subsequent logins
[00:48] <ali1234> exit
[00:51] <ali1234> hmmmm
[00:51] <ali1234> got a thread to pull on...
[00:52] <ali1234> log out -> delete ~/.cache -> login - the delay comes back
[00:53] <TJ-> is it the thumbnailer ?
[00:53] <ali1234> that doesn't appear to generate anything in .cache
[00:53] <ali1234> or hasn't yet anyway
[00:53] <ali1234> oh, it could be
[00:54] <ali1234> nope
[00:54] <TJ-> does 'top' reveal what's running? or you could start "inotifywait -rm $HOME/.cache/" from a tty then login the GUI, see what files/paths are accessed/written
[00:55] <ali1234> it's the fontconfig subdirectory that triggers it
[00:55] <ali1234> or rather the absense of it
[00:56] <ali1234> i will keep pulling :)
[00:56] <ali1234> top doesn't reveal as much as i thought it might... seems like everything is running at once
[00:58] <TJ-> ahhh, yes, GUI font cache.. prerenders the glyphs first time
[00:58] <ali1234> but why so slow?
[00:59] <TJ-> takes a while if it generates bitmaps for all glyphs on all fonts and sizes configured by the theme, etc.
[00:59] <TJ-> I'm guessing but it makes sense
[00:59] <ali1234> so what you're saying is... it's ochosi's fault? ;)
[01:00] <TJ-> haha no... it could be something entirely different
[01:00] <knome> that's very likely though
[01:00] <knome> ;)
[01:01] <knome> anyway, nighty :)
[01:01] <ali1234> we had a missing icon cache before, maybe there is some font cache missing too
[01:03] <ali1234> all of the cache files in fontconfig are generated within 1 second of each other
[01:03] <ali1234> or... wait, that's minutes
[01:05] <ali1234> hmmmm
[01:08] <ali1234> remember these numbers: d0972 6333f
[01:08] <ali1234> TJ-: is there a way to make inotifywait print timestamps?
[01:10] <TJ-> yes, use the --format xxxxxxxx option (see "man inotifywait" )
[01:13] <ali1234> it seems to be tied to a specific cache file
[01:13] <ali1234> it better not be noto sans. i hate noto sans
[01:14] <TJ-> at least you've got a good lead now
[01:15] <ali1234> i'm deleting half the files and re-logging
[01:15] <ali1234> down to [89ab]* now
[01:20] <ali1234> down to 3 files now
[01:22] <ali1234> hmmmmmm... got you
[01:22] <ali1234> deleting just one font cache file delays login by 60 seconds... it's the one that starts 9b...
[01:23] <TJ->  9b89f8e3dae116d678bbf48e5f21f69b-le32d4.cache-7 ?
[01:23] <ali1234> yes
[01:23] <ali1234> NotoSerif
[01:23] <ali1234> argh
[01:23] <ali1234> and also NotoSans
[01:24] <ali1234> i knew it :(
[01:24] <ali1234> Noto is google's replacement for Droid font. it supports ALL OF UNICODE, so it is absolutely enourmous
[01:26] <TJ-> Yes
[01:26] <ali1234> 9b* is specifically the CJK variants
[01:26] <ali1234> even with how big it is, 1 minute still seems excessive
[01:26] <TJ-> how big is it though?
[01:27] <ali1234> 85MB for the stff referenced in 9b*
[01:27] <TJ-> I've got the same font selected and that file is only 44KB
[01:28] <ali1234> Noto is like 50 different font files though
[01:28] <ali1234> /usr/share/fonts/truetype/noto and /usr/share/fonts/opentype/noto
[01:29] <ali1234> hmm something is messed up here
[01:29] <ali1234> all the other fonts in opentype/ are otfs
[01:29] <ali1234> noto is .ttc files... what even are those?
[01:30] <ali1234> a "font collection" apparently
[01:30] <TJ-> treutype-collection /
[01:31] <ali1234> well, time to add my findings on the bug
[01:33] <TJ-> I wonder why it's doing that. I've just deleted the .cache/fontconfig/ directory and logged in again and it's not being recreated
[01:39] <TJ-> OK, I've found out how to run it: "fc-cache -f" ... and the cache is taken a long time to build
[01:39] <TJ-> only 1.1M but took about 30 seconds
[01:40] <TJ-> "fc-cache -vf" is more helpful
[01:40] <ali1234> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=845058
[01:40] <TJ-> and it is sitting on /usr/share/fonts/opentype/noto
[01:41] <TJ-> says there's only 24 fonts in there
[01:42] <ali1234> yeah. the four collections have 8, 8, 4, and 4 fonts
[01:42] <ali1234> according to file
[01:42] <ali1234> but each one has all of the CJK unicode
[01:42] <TJ-> the source is 85MB
[01:43] <ali1234> the installed files are 85MB too
[01:45] <ali1234> the non-CJK part of Noto is at /usr/share/fonts/truetype/noto and is 26MB but it is 156 fonts
[01:45] <TJ-> fc-list -v | less  helps to see the extend of the Noto* faces
[01:46] <TJ-> What language is that system set to? Mine are set to en_GB-UTF-8
[01:46] <ali1234> same
[01:46] <TJ-> I don't see those big files being generated
[01:46] <ali1234> what big files?
[01:47] <TJ-> oh, thought you said the cache files were large, but you were talking about the file referenced
[01:47] <TJ-> as in the /usr/share/opentype/oto
[01:47] <ali1234> right. the cache is like 50kb
[01:47] <ali1234> it just takes a really long time to generate it when you log in
[01:48] <TJ-> right, so the delay is worse on slower CPUs presumably, and/or slow I/O
[01:48] <ali1234> fc-cache -vf takes 12 seconds
[01:48] <ali1234> most of which is spent on noto cjk
[01:48] <TJ-> is yours generating a system cache in /var/cache/fontconfig/ too?
[01:49] <ali1234> i didn't run it as root, so i guess not
[01:49] <TJ-> no, I'm wondering if any system job is also run first time, that adds to the delay
[01:50] <ali1234> deleting user's cache causes 60 seconds of delay
[01:51] <TJ-> aha, postinst
[01:51] <TJ-> /var/lib/dpkg/info/fontconfig.postinst:  fc-cache -s -f -v 1>/var/log/fontconfig.log 2>&1 || (printf "failed.\nSee /var/log/fontconfig.log for more information.\n"; exit 1)
[01:51] <TJ-> how about if you only remove the content of $HOME/.cache/fontconfig/ rather than the entire .cache directory?
[01:51] <TJ-> maybe it's several tasks doing a similar thing?
[01:51] <ali1234> that's what i did
[01:52] <TJ-> oh, thought you meant you were removing the entire .cache
[01:52] <ali1234> i only delete the file 9b89f8e3dae116d678bbf48e5f21f69b-le32d4.cache-7 - nothing else
[01:52] <ali1234> this delays login by 60 seconds
[01:52] <TJ-> so the slowness is accessing /usr/share/font/opentype/noto/*
[01:52] <ali1234> seems like it
[01:53] <TJ-> you could monitor that with inotifywait
[01:56] <ali1234> hmmmmmmmmm
[01:57] <ali1234> i uninstalled fonts-noto-hinted (listed in the "differences" file) and the problem goes away
[01:57] <ali1234> not sure what that actually removed
[01:59] <ali1234> hmmmmmmmmmm... with that package removed... nothing is generated in ~/.cache/fontconfig
[01:59] <ali1234> it also removed xubuntu-default-settings
[02:00] <ali1234> hmmmmmmmm
[02:01] <ali1234> i reinstalled all the packages and still nothing gets generated in the cache on login
[02:08] <ali1234> time to reinstall i guess
[02:10] <Unit193> donofrio: software-properties (<IP_ADDRESS>) may help your issue.
[02:17] <ali1234> hmm
[02:19] <ali1234> there is some kind of problem with /var/cache/fontconfig
[02:28] <Woowoo678> How/where should I report a bug related to upgrading the distro from version 16.04?
[02:29] <ali1234> depends on the bug
[02:31] <Woowoo678> it looks like some residual upstart configurations break lightdm after the switch to systemd
[02:32] <Woowoo678> prevented me from logging into any sessions
[02:32] <ali1234> not sure about that
[03:05] <ali1234> oh no
[03:06] <ali1234> it isnt the mtime
[03:07] <ali1234> the cache files are corrupt
[04:48] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xubuntu-default-settings:: [trunk] r677 Launchpad automatic translations update. (by Launchpad Translations on behalf of xubuntu-dev)
[07:29] <knome> blog article prepared for announcing the results but don't go wild before we have a confirmation from all winners
[09:58]  * bluesabre tries being less wild
[10:01] <Unit193> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=, bluesabre.
[10:02] <bluesabre> Unit193: woohoo numlockx fix
[10:02] <Unit193> Sort of.
[10:03] <bluesabre> ?
[10:03] <Unit193> Not accepted.
[14:08] <TJ-> My issue with a resume-time greeter vt8 Xorg constant restart - on upgrade to 18.04 nvidia-340 had replaced nouveau. Rid the system of nvidia and it works fine.
[16:17] <slickymasterWork> willem, Im almost sure you're aware of https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2018-April/011634.html but in all cases here it is
[16:19] <willem> ochosi, yesterday you said "willem: thats not default adwaita, by default it has a bright panel" and asked "did you use something like gtk-theme-config?"
[16:21] <willem> I didn't. Not knowingly that is. Trying to run gtk-theme-config in terminal says "Command 'gtk-theme-config' not found, but can be installed with:"
[16:22] <willem> Still... you've got more important things to do. I thought this would be a simple fix...
[16:23] <willem> rebooting now to start testing the final beta...
[16:49] <willem> slickymasterWork, I had sort of gotten the message ;-) Testing live session now. Does not go to plan unfortunately... will report on the tracker
[16:58] <flocculant> ali1234: thanks for the font cache stuff - I did read most of it this morning - also saw you pinging in -desktop
[16:58] <flocculant> Unit193: does the numlock script definitely check for laptops with seperate kbd and turn it on in those cases? if it does could you comment on the bug for me please :
[16:59] <flocculant> I wondered why I couldn't tab to Unit in here
[17:11] <willem> testing live session final beta, quick question: shouldn't the live session, after building up the desktop, when it finds wifi networks, pop up a message in the right top corner telling me about wifi networks being present?
[18:08] <willem> disregard my question... remembered I had another laptop I could use to test; so I found the answer myself
[20:09] <flocculant> bluesabre: I assume that we'll release this beta with the issues?
[20:10] <flocculant> don't particularly want to do that - but guessing I'll not have a choice - also don't mean that to sound like it does, but I'm too tired now to dig out the thesauraus :)
[20:11] <flocculant> read replies at stupid o'clock tomorrow
[20:43] <Unit193> flocculant: Hah, and yes it's certainly *supposed* to at least.
[20:57] <bluesabre> flocculant: I don't think we have a beta release blocker bug
[20:58] <bluesabre> Unless there's one I've missed. Seems like everything is hunky dory once you login once
[21:05] <ali1234> flocculant: will cooke mentioned wanting to get it fixed for the beta, but i think the problem is a little bit tricky due to it being an interaction with the livecd
[21:06] <ali1234> the good news is we know exactly the cause of the problem now. someone just needs to figure out the right way to fix it
[21:39] <bluesabre> ali1234: that's in relation to the bluetooth bug?
[21:40] <ali1234> yeah. bluetooth timeout is a red herring
[21:40] <ali1234> it was fontconfig all alon
[21:40] <bluesabre> wowza
[21:40] <TJ-> hehehe, ali1234 did some great debugging last night
[21:41] <bluesabre> And it's because we carry the monstrous noto font library?
[21:41] <ali1234> i just posted this complete description of the full problem: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=103652#c6
[21:41] <ali1234> noto makes it slow but the rebuild should not run at all
[21:43] <ali1234> and it seems like fontconfig taking ~1 minute to rebuild the cache delays all other processes from starting, so they all time out too. bluez, and ubuntu has a similar problem with g-s-d
[21:45] <bluesabre> ali1234: excellent work figuring that all out
[21:46] <bluesabre> and TJ- too, I saw you also poking at it
[21:46] <ali1234> a lot of people have been poking this one because it's so widespread
[21:46] <ali1234> someone noticed it happening in debian in november :)
[21:47] <bluesabre> wowza
[21:48] <TJ-> could we use a sneaky fix? just 'touch ...' the files to stop fc rebuilding the cache?
[21:48] <ali1234> no, touch doesn't work because the timestamps are embedded in the cache files
[21:48] <ali1234> and also they have to exactly match, not just be newer
[21:48] <ali1234> we could do what ubuntu does and force a font cache rebuild inside the installed system during install
[21:49] <ali1234> then only the live desktop will be delayed
[21:49] <ali1234> first login on install will not
[21:50] <TJ-> read the file's internal timestamp and apply it ?
[21:50] <ali1234> teres a bunch of different ways to work around it. i'm sure laney will come up with something good :)
[21:54] <TJ-> the timestamp is at offset 0x30 in the cache file, it's a standard time_t
[21:55] <ali1234> yes
[21:56] <ali1234> but then there is a second timestamp at 0x38 which is nanosecond accurate. that is the problem
[21:56] <ali1234> squashfs doesn't support that, so that part of the timestamp gets zeroed
[21:56] <ali1234> (the second field is just the nanoseconds)
[21:57] <ali1234> squashfs wipes it from the actual files, but because it is embedded in the cache file, it survives there
[21:59] <TJ-> ali1234: right, I get that, but for the installed system a .postinst script could use touch to set the correct timestamp on each cache file by reading the internal timestamp
[21:59] <ali1234> could do, or it could just rerun fc-cache which is simpler :)
[22:00] <TJ-> Because the .postinst already has a stanza to trigger an fc-cache if needed
[22:00] <ali1234> that will happen anyway as soon as you update any font package
[22:00] <TJ-> but that is what we're trying to prevent isn't it? the fc-cache run
[22:00] <ali1234> well, not ubuntu
[22:01] <ali1234> they want to fix it for the live cd, because they already rebuild the cache during install, so they are not affected on first login
[22:01] <ali1234> but if it's fixed in the live cd, that will fix it for us as well
[22:01] <TJ-> the /postinst fc-cache run is ignored because the cache files are copied in but then when fontconfig is called on it sees wrong timestamps and calls fc-cache - do I have that correct?
[22:02] <ali1234> yes but you're missing one part - when fontconfig gets called it doesn't have root so it rebuilds it only for one user
[22:02] <TJ-> for squashs I wonder if an overlayfs would help ... not sure we can do metadata only though
[22:02] <ali1234> that's why it happens again on first login
[22:02] <ali1234> during the live desktop it rebuilds it for the live user and that's wiped on reboot
[22:04] <TJ-> yeah, the patch is the way to go I think. I was just thinking for the Thursday deadline for the beta ISOs, depending on what time tomorrow. I read earlier the ISO gen started this morning
[22:08] <ali1234> the ultimate fix would be to add nanos support to squashfs but of course that would be a huge change during beta
[22:09] <TJ-> and ultimately not very useful
[22:09] <TJ-> the assumption by fontconfig is the problem
[22:09] <ali1234> the assumption is only that files will never be moved between a filesystem that supports nanos and one that doesn't
[22:09] <ali1234> another possible fix would be to strip the nanos before building the iso cache
[22:10] <ali1234> they are going to disappear anyway, that would just mean doing it slightly earlier
[22:11] <TJ-> yeah, it's a weird one though, worrying about the nanoseconds for a font cache
[22:11] <ali1234> it looks like fontconfig can be built entirely without support for nanos so that would be another option
[22:11] <TJ-> I wish I could build a system entirely without support for bugs :D
[22:25] <TJ-> We could also build the ISO images on ext4 without the extra_isize feature to disable nanosecond  timestamps :)
[22:25] <ali1234> yes
[22:26] <ali1234> that would mean big changes to LP builders though


[03:19] <fbond> crimsun, BTW usbdevfs was not enabled by default in edgy
[03:20] <fbond> so users of midisport-firmware must mount it to use their devices
[03:21] <fbond> not sure if I should file a bug ... ?
[03:33] <lastnode> crimsun, ping
[04:17] <LaserJock> hi minghua
[04:32] <crimsun> fbond: no, not a bug
[04:32] <crimsun> gah.
[05:39] <LaserJock> hmm, does anybody know if network manager has issues with reporting signal strength?
[05:39] <Burgundavia> which chipset?
[05:44] <LaserJock> Burgundavia: Atheros R5212
[05:45] <LaserJock> my internet seems a bit slow
[05:45] <Burgundavia> madwifi has known issues, LaserJock
[05:45] <Burgundavia> it reports bogus numbers
[05:45] <LaserJock> but the router is not very far away at all
[05:45] <crimsun> have you explicitly set it to 11M?
[05:45] <Burgundavia> it is the driver
[05:45] <LaserJock> when I was just using the gnome thingy it reported large number
[05:46] <crimsun> "the gnome thingy" being...?
[05:46] <LaserJock> the applet
[05:46] <Burgundavia> the default one?
[05:46] <LaserJock> yeah
[05:47] <LaserJock> I'm just trying to figure out if it's n-m
[05:47] <LaserJock> or if my wireless needs to be reset or something
[05:47] <crimsun> if it's edgy, and it's madwifi*, then it's edgy.
[05:47] <crimsun> for many people, madwifi* is broken in 2.6.17
[05:48] <LaserJock> the gnome applet "Network Monitor" reports 79% for the signal strength
[05:48] <LaserJock> n-m show 35%
[05:48] <Burgundavia> gnome applet may be special casing the madwifi driver
[05:48] <Fujitsu> Iiiinteresting.
[05:49] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: What does iwconfig say?
[05:49] <Burgundavia> I know danw has refused patches to special case the madwifi driver in nm
[05:49] <minghua> maybe n-m just uses 5-base or something
[05:49] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: oh geeze, what am I looking for?
[05:49] <Fujitsu> Link Quality=72/100
[05:49] <LaserJock> oh yeah, 35/94
[05:50] <Fujitsu> Erm, out of 94!?
[05:50] <LaserJock> so that's what n-m is reporting
[05:50] <Fujitsu> madwifi does seem rather stuffed.
[05:50] <Burgundavia> the driver lies
[05:50] <Fujitsu> And GNOME's thingy is special casing.
[05:50] <LaserJock> ok, well I was just wondering if I was going nuts or something ;-)
[05:51] <LaserJock> Mt. View was the first time I've really done anything with wireless
[05:51] <LaserJock> at home I just now the SSID and don't have to mess with anything
[05:51] <LaserJock> s/now/know//
[05:52] <LaserJock> I felt rather dumb sitting next to mako
[05:52] <LaserJock> and I was struggling with n-m
[05:53] <Fujitsu> That is a side-effect of being around almighty Ubuntu people.
[05:53] <LaserJock> heh, well he was always dropping his laptop
[05:54] <LaserJock> so at least I didn't pick that habit up
[05:54] <crimsun> you won't be able to tell until your fifth macbook anyhow.
[05:54] <crimsun> by that point we'll all be mocking you anyhow.
[05:54] <LaserJock> heh
[05:54] <LaserJock> I don't know if I'll be getting a macbook anytime soon
[05:55] <LaserJock> I did get a anti-drm sticker from mako at that BOF though
[05:55] <Fujitsu> Was anybody there running {Windows,OS X,[insert other Linux distributions here] } on their laops?
[05:55] <LaserJock> so it was worth it ;-)
[05:55] <Fujitsu> *laptops
[05:55] <Burgundavia> some OS X I imagine
[05:55] <Burgundavia> mpt ran it last year
[05:55] <LaserJock> well, there were certainly dual boots
[05:56] <LaserJock> the K12LTSP guys were running K12LTSP (no way!)
[05:56] <Burgundavia> stunning
[05:56] <LaserJock> the Sun guys had a nice Ubuntu machine
[05:57] <LaserJock> I wasn't around long enough to see what the ATI and Nvidia people brought ;-)
[05:57] <LaserJock> I was really amazed by the Sun Looking Glass demo
[05:57] <LaserJock> I had seen a demo early on
[05:58] <LaserJock> but never really bothered since it was Java
[05:58] <LaserJock> but there were some interesting things they are doing that I think are usable
[05:59] <LaserJock> the "map a window onto a flag" one was purely crack ;-)
[05:59] <LaserJock> but things like flipping a window and on the back side you have notes
[05:59] <Fujitsu> Mm, nice.
[05:59] <LaserJock> and panoramic views of the desktops seemed more practical
[06:00] <LaserJock> heh, at the end somebody asked "Does it work on a free Java?" :-)
[06:00] <Fujitsu> Hahah.
[06:01] <LaserJock> but I don't think I'm quite there yet
[06:01] <LaserJock> the blingy stuff seems like it has some potential, but I don't really see using it for everyday use yet
[06:02] <minghua> hmm, so when I close the window do I lose my notes?
[06:02] <LaserJock> good question
[06:02] <LaserJock> I imagine they take care of that somehow
[06:03] <LaserJock> to me it looked more usable then the whole AIGLX/beryl thing I tried
[06:03] <LaserJock> but in the end I mostly just use terminals and firefox
[06:04] <LaserJock> I got to see one of the OLPC laptops, Ivan had one
[06:04] <LaserJock> pretty sweet
[06:04] <Fujitsu> How was it?
[06:04] <Fujitsu> Aha.
[06:04] <LaserJock> green :-)
[06:04] <LaserJock> mhm
[06:04] <Fujitsu> Or it might actually be 128kbps at the moment...
[06:05] <LaserJock> I generally have 128kbps I think
[06:05] <LaserJock> it really stinks
[06:05] <Fujitsu> 10Mbps down, 256kbps up... Not nice when you have to upload stuff frequently, but better than most connections here.
[06:06] <LaserJock> did you guys see the Council Greyskull planet post of mako's
[06:06] <LaserJock> 10Mbps is cool
[06:06] <LaserJock> I've only got 1.5
[06:06] <Fujitsu> 10Mbps isn't so great when you live in Oz.
[06:06] <Fujitsu> Because the international connection is... pathetic?
[06:06] <LaserJock> ah
[06:07] <LaserJock> I still don't get the AU/NZ internet situation
[06:07] <Fujitsu> Basically, any international connectivity sucks.
[06:07] <Fujitsu> Generally fairly high latency, and slow.
[06:07] <LaserJock> local stuff is really good though?
[06:08] <Fujitsu> I always hit my theoretical bandwidth maximum when downloading from Australian mirrors like UWA, so yes.
[06:08] <minghua> I saw mako's blog post, but had no idea what greyskull is, even after reading the wikipedia article :-(
[06:09] <LaserJock> oh
[06:10] <LaserJock> well MOTU comes from the He-Man cartoon show
[06:10] <Fujitsu> Does it?
[06:10] <LaserJock> Castle Greyskull was a part of that cartoon
[06:10] <minghua> oh okay, then I have been missing that reference too
[06:10] <LaserJock> yeah, I suppose it's a cultural reference
[06:10] <crimsun> Fujitsu: as a codename, yes.
[06:11] <Fujitsu> Interesting.
[06:11] <crimsun> we weren't always known as MOTU
[06:14] <bddebian> "Bye the power of Greyskull..."
[06:14] <bddebian> "I HAVE THE POWER!!"
[06:14] <Fujitsu> I've never seen anything else (other the just `Ubuntu developers' or something like that)
[06:16] <Fujitsu> Any ideas on who I attack for that?
[06:17] <LaserJock> what do you need?
[06:17] <crimsun> probably no one at this point, since everyone's tied up at UDS
[06:17] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: you need an archive admin?
[06:17] <crimsun> I don't expect any movement on that front until next week
[06:17] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: the gcl upload is currently `awaiting approval by a distro manager'
[06:17] <LaserJock> ah
[06:18] <LaserJock> yes, that might take a bit
[06:18] <LaserJock> as the distro manager is having to put up with a bunch of people bugging him :-)
[06:19] <Fujitsu> I suppose so.
[06:22] <minghua> LaserJock, Fujitsu: heard of Scibuntu?  http://urban.it.hik.se/scibuntu/
[06:23] <Fujitsu> Eek.
[06:23] <LaserJock> darn it
[06:23] <Fujitsu> Sounds bad.
[06:23] <Burgundavia> very very bad
[06:23] <Burgundavia> I love bash scripts in the morning
[06:23] <Fujitsu> What is included
[06:23] <Fujitsu>  Tools for reading and writing scientific text: [snip]
[06:23] <Fujitsu> Acroread.
[06:24] <Fujitsu> Acroread included... Yuck.
[06:24] <crimsun> ooh, sweet!
[06:24] <crimsun> I'll just make them the bug contact for acroread...
[06:24] <crimsun> please convince them to include flashplugin-nonfree, too, and my life will be complete
[06:24] <LaserJock> what the... they don't get acroread from the repos
[06:25] <LaserJock> but by wget'ing from adobe
[06:25] <minghua> I don't think they have any repo
[06:25] <LaserJock> well, I *have* to have acroread
[06:25] <LaserJock> minghua: no, but acroread is in Ubuntu so you don't need to get it from adobe like that
[06:25] <Fujitsu> Last updated 5 days ago...
[06:25] <minghua> oh I see what you mean
[06:25] <LaserJock> now now guys
[06:26] <crimsun> someone should gently remind them that they are breaking Adobe's EULA.
[06:26] <LaserJock> we don't need to go off on a rampage... yet ;-)
[06:26] <Fujitsu> `scibuntu - scientific extensions for Ubuntu 6.04 LTS'
[06:27] <Fujitsu> Erm, they're trying to install treewiewx... I presume they mean treeviewx, and that's only in Edgy...
[06:27] <Fujitsu> What crack.
[06:27] <LaserJock> that reminds me
[06:27] <LaserJock> I need to talk with the guys wanting to do Biobuntu
[06:28] <Fujitsu> Are these guys sane?
[06:28] <minghua> they have -q in apt-get, so maybe there are no error messages for wrong package name
[06:28] <LaserJock> Scibuntu or Biobuntu?
[06:29] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: Biobuntu, we've already ascertained the Scibuntu guy is insane.
[06:29] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: he's not insane
[06:29] <Fujitsu> Launchpad generates some really nice HTML: <tr class="">
[06:29] <LaserJock> he's simply a user wanting to help others out
[06:29] <minghua> apt-get should be patched to not accept -y in non-interactive mode :-)
[06:29] <LaserJock> we just need to focus such efforts in the right direction
[06:29] <LaserJock> rather then calling them insane
[06:30] <Fujitsu> But but but... It's yet another crackful bash script.
[06:30] <LaserJock> sure
[06:30] <LaserJock> but I'm more interested in the intent
[06:30] <LaserJock> rather then the implementation
[06:30] <LaserJock> we can easily fix (relatively)  the implementation
[06:32] <LaserJock> the hard part is focusing people's efforts in the right direction
[06:32] <LaserJock> "rather then work on a hackish script, maybe you can help us set up sane scientific tasks that all Ubuntu users can use"
[06:32] <Fujitsu> That might be an idea...
[06:33] <LaserJock> these are the things we'll be trying to do for Edubuntu anyway
[06:34] <LaserJock> I just wish people would contact us before they launch into these projects
[06:34] <LaserJock> and put some *buntu all over the web for Google and the forums to pick up on
[06:34] <Fujitsu> That'd be nice, rather than us finding about them later...
[06:35] <Fujitsu> If we had nice forum communication, we might be able to find out about these things earlier. :/
[06:35] <Fujitsu> And get in contact with the authors early on to do things right...
[06:35] <Burgundavia> *cough* ubuntustudio *cough*
[06:35] <Fujitsu> Heheh.
[06:36] <LaserJock> I don't think either Scibuntu or Biobuntu were thought of on the forums though
[06:36] <Fujitsu> Re: [ubuntu-uk]  Project Proposal - ?Biobuntu?
[06:36] <LaserJock> mhm
[06:36] <Mez> why is there never the person you want around when you want them
[06:36] <Mez> lol
[06:36] <Mez> oh, btw, if anyone wants to review ;)
[06:36] <LaserJock> Mez: because that would be too easy
[06:37] <Mez> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3379
[06:37] <LaserJock> Burgundavia: I was talking with joejaxx and _MMA_ at Mt. View
[06:37] <Burgundavia> excellent
[06:37] <Burgundavia> and
[06:37] <Burgundavia> ?
[06:37] <Fujitsu> Eek... That Biobuntu idea is bad.
[06:37] <LaserJock> Burgundavia: and we were kinda thinking about the idea of having some sort of derivative guidelines
[06:37] <Burgundavia> that would be good
[06:37] <LaserJock> maybe a spec or something
[06:38] <Burgundavia> and a contact for that
[06:38] <LaserJock> just outlining, this is the way to do it right, these are the roadblocks, etc.
[06:38] <Burgundavia> somebody to go to and say "I want to deriv ubuntu"
[06:38] <LaserJock> exactly
[06:39] <Fujitsu> It would be reeeally nice to have a list of derivatives... And a list of hackish scripts to install crack.. But that's never going to happen.
[06:39] <LaserJock> what do you mean?
[06:39] <LaserJock> just a listing of them?
[06:39] <joejaxx> LaserJock:
[06:39] <LaserJock> joejaxx: hello
[06:40] <joejaxx> LaserJock: hello
[06:40] <LaserJock> heh, have fun with that :-)
[06:40] <joejaxx> :D
[06:40] <Fujitsu> Well, I mean... Having a listing of what they are, what they're for, who's running them, etc... So we can keep track of them and advise people if they should be doing it differently.
[06:40] <joejaxx> i just started so it is on abiword right now
[06:41] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: I don't think that'd be entirely insane to do :-)
[06:43] <LaserJock> there are 3 derivative that are working towards being in the Ubuntu repos
[06:43] <Fujitsu> Which are these?
[06:43] <LaserJock> I can think of a few scripted ones
[06:43] <LaserJock> Ichthux, UbuntuStudio, and Fluxbuntu
[06:43] <minghua> I don't fancy tracking crackful scripts...
[06:43] <LaserJock> minghua: sure, but it might be better to track then to find out later
[06:43] <Fujitsu> minghua: It would be a good idea to track them.
[06:43] <minghua> having a list of derivative distros would be good though
[06:44] <LaserJock> but then there are derivatives like Guadalinex that is done entirely outside of Ubuntu
[06:44] <Mez> joejaxx, Seventeen Days later .... "openoffice... still? gah!"
[06:44] <LaserJock> but aren't hacky
[06:45] <Fujitsu> Unhacky ones aren't too bad...
[06:45] <LaserJock> just difficult to keep track of
[06:49] <lotusleaf> why does gurlchecker depend on libclamav1? So when I compile ClamAV 0.88.6 myself (because 0.88.4 is in the repos) and uninstall 0.88.4 from the repos, gurlchecker must be removed, and when I try to install it again, it wants to install libclamav1 but I don't want that because I've already built 0.88.6 for myself.
[06:50] <lotusleaf> why does gurlchecker need libclamav1?
[06:50] <Fujitsu> lotusleaf: I'm sure it has a good reason to.
[06:50] <LaserJock> I don't know, but it's a dependency
[06:51] <jdong> configure:  --with-clamav=DIR        use CLAMAV library virii scan (located in directory DIR, if supplied).   default=yes, if present
[06:51] <lotusleaf> Fujitsu: thanks, I know it's a dep, but I'm curious as to why it's not just an option
[06:51] <jdong> ^^ because it's the upstream default in ./configure
[06:51] <lotusleaf> jdong: so I should build gurlchecker from source?
[06:52] <LaserJock> lotusleaf: but you should be able to install a 0.88.6 and gurlchecker will be fine
[06:52] <lotusleaf> LaserJock: very well, thanks =)
[06:52] <Fujitsu> Wouldn't it be a better idea to use a packaged 0.88.6?
[06:52] <lotusleaf> jdong: thx for joining & detailing
[06:52] <jdong> lotusleaf: if you build 0.88.6 using ubuntu/debian packages, it'll still work with the new clamav
[06:52] <Fujitsu> Or update the 0.88.4 package?
[06:52] <jdong> in theory :D
[06:52] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: that's what I'm saying
[06:53] <lotusleaf> jdong: no, I haven't tried, I build it from the clamav sources @ sf
[06:53] <Fujitsu> lotusleaf: Try grabbing the Debian package and building that, it'll likely work properly.
[06:53] <jdong> lotusleaf: build http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/c/clamav/clamav_0.88.5-2.dsc
[06:54] <lotusleaf> Fujitsu: roger that, and thanks for your (and other people who) response(ed).
[06:54] <Fujitsu> jdong: 0.88.6 has been in unstable since the 6th.
[06:54] <jdong> that contains the security fixes backported from 0.88.6 too
[06:54] <jdong> Fujitsu: oh, I wasn't aware
[06:54] <Fujitsu> packages.qa.debian.org is your friend :)
[06:54] <jdong> oh btw, out of curiousity...
[06:54] <jdong> is there an "apt-get source" like script that can allow me to specify more channels than apt?
[06:55] <jdong> i.e. I'd like to be able to choose to fetch a source package from sid OR feisty....
[06:55] <Fujitsu> jdong: You can use dget and specify the URL to a .dsc, that'll grab and extra things.
[06:55] <jdong> I guess, yeah
[06:55] <Fujitsu> *that and
[06:55] <jdong> then use packages.qa.d.o
[06:55] <jdong> which is more up to date
[06:55] <Fujitsu> Yep.
[06:56] <jdong> thanks
[06:56] <Fujitsu> No problem.
[06:56] <lotusleaf> && again, thanks! =)
[06:56] <LaserJock> jdong: I know what you mean though
[06:56] <LaserJock> I'd like that too
[06:56] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: Same, it'd be rather useful...
[06:57] <jdong> yeah, I'd rather just say "dget clamav/sid" and not go combing through packages.qa
[06:57] <jdong> but I'm just being too lazy
[06:57] <Mez> jdong: plans for prevu ?
[06:57] <LaserJock> it'd be nice to have a CLI that you just give the package name and it gives you Debian and Ubuntu versions
[06:58] <jdong> Mez: I pushed a rewrite (0.4.1) into dev...
[06:58] <jdong> Mez: testing it right now, looks good....
[06:58] <jdong> Mez: I'd like it eventually in universe :D
[06:58] <Fujitsu> Something like apt-cache madison, but for more than is in sources.list
[06:58] <LaserJock> exactly
[06:58] <jdong> Fujitsu: madison-lite?
[06:58] <Fujitsu> Wouldn't be difficult to write.
[06:58] <Mez> jdong: I know - :D whichis why I have it in revu
[06:58] <LaserJock> and then dget in a similar fashion
[06:59] <Fujitsu> jdong: Seems to require a local mirror.
[06:59] <Mez> jdong: btw: you should make the branch in ubuntu-backporters so we can all work on it - not just yours
[07:00] <jdong> Fujitsu: adapt http://pastebin.com/819521
[07:00] <jdong> :)
[07:00] <jdong> it just doesn't dget
[07:00] <jdong> that's the last damn piece of the puzzle
[07:00] <jdong> Mez: yeah yeah details details :D
[07:00] <Fujitsu> Nice...
[07:00] <jdong> Mez: is there any obvious way of moving branches to a new owner that I'm missing, or should I just re-push?
[07:01] <jdong> Fujitsu: backporters have been using it since Warty :D
[07:01] <Mez> jdong: launchpad/url/to/branch/+reassign
[07:01] <jdong> Mez: ah
[07:02] <jdong> Mez: reassigned
[07:04] <jdong> Mez: also reassigned debian-dir
[07:04] <Mez> jdong ... didnt know you;d done that yourself
[07:05] <jdong> Mez: did what?
[07:05] <Mez> nvm
[07:05] <Mez> jdong: btw I have a suggestion
[07:05] <Mez> in your shell's RC add
[07:05] <Mez> export DEBFULLNAME="John Dong";
[07:06] <Mez> export<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[07:06] <Mez> ;0
[07:07] <jdong> Mez: oh, lovely :)
[07:07] <Mez> I did notice a lot of jdong@jdong-laptop ;)
[07:08] <jdong> Mez: yeah :D
[07:09] <Mez> jdong: surely you dont need to keep bumping the version numbers?
[07:09] <Mez> well not like that
[07:09] <jdong> Mez: you know that feeling when you see a bug and want to release a fix for it?
[07:09] <Mez> then push it to the branch ;)
[07:09] <crimsun> resist that feeling.
[07:10] <jdong> lol
[07:10] <crimsun> killing bugs is good, but it often leads to hasty measures
[07:10] <Mez> jdong, RE,RO ?
[07:11] <Mez> jdong, are you actually making these releases proper ?
[07:11] <LaserJock> crimsun: wise words, teacher
[07:11] <jdong> Mez: what do you mean?
[07:11] <Mez> or just saying "ooh, this is a bug fix, lets bump the version number"?
[07:11] <Mez> jdong, RE,RO = release early, release often
[07:11] <jdong> Mez: well, how else would you release a bugfix?
[07:12] <jdong> if you mean is there a deb for each one of those, yes
[07:12] <jdong> http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=125877&package_id=206140
[07:12] <jdong> I've been pushing them to SF for now
[07:12] <Mez> jdong, just release patches ...
[07:12] <jdong> Mez: hush you :)
[07:13] <jdong> yeah but that doesn't install as easily as dpkg -i :)
[07:13] <Mez> patch -p0 < patch
[07:13] <Mez> remember you're just using text files
[07:13] <jdong> yeah, that works, release as a patch against /....
[07:14] <Mez> and put it this way, If I'm going to be maintaining this in ubuntu, I dont want to have to review and upload a new set of code changes every day ;)
[07:14] <jdong> well, either way, I'm running out of things to do to prevu :)
[07:14] <jdong> Mez: I don't think there's much more to come honestly
[07:14] <jdong> the tool does its job the way it is :)
[07:15] <jdong> I had one last itch to rewrite it OOP and I just scratched that
[07:16] <Mez> let me know when you're done and I'll trawl through the debian dir then
[07:16] <Mez> what else needs doing now
[07:16] <jdong> I have a version that disregards version constraints on build deps, but if that went into the main program I'd be the next automatix guy :D
[07:16] <Mez> jdong... what the heck..
[07:17] <Mez> Wed,  8 Nov 2006 00:28:47 -0500 = * New upstream release
[07:17] <Mez> Wed,  8 Nov 2006 00:02:50 -0500 = * New upstream release
[07:17] <jdong> Mez: one last bug slipped out?
[07:17] <Mez> if you'r releasing a new verison every 25 mins you can get it away from me ? :P
[07:18] <jdong> Mez: would you rather me leave the bug there for 2 days, have 10 users ask "what does this error mean", then fix it? :D
[07:18] <Mez> jdong: then send those users a patch
[07:18] <Mez> or give them instructions on how to get the branch
[07:19] <jdong> Mez: well, at this point I don't see anything that needs to be done anymore
[07:19] <jdong> I promise :)
[07:20] <jdong> I just tested it with 10 packages using all 4 source methods
[07:31] <crimsun> jdong: are you mad?
[07:31] <crimsun> (RE: FF 2)
[07:32] <Fujitsu> Erm...
[07:36] <joejaxx> fluxbuntu is not a crackful script :\
[07:37] <crimsun> what's the context for that?
[07:38] <jdong> crimsun: they freakin won't take my no as an answer!
[07:38] <jdong> :)
[07:38] <joejaxx> crimsun: someone called it crackful script
[07:40] <minghua> joejaxx: in this channel?
[07:40] <joejaxx> i think so
[08:10] <joejaxx> woohoo i hit the b's
[08:10] <joejaxx> i had to start it over
[10:17] <Burgundavia> Fujitsu: likely one of mdz, tfheen or kamion who can't sleep and thus flushed the held queue
[10:18] <Fujitsu> No, it's unfrozen.
[10:18] <Burgundavia> afaik, the only people that can unfreeze it are in mTV
[10:19] <Burgundavia> my explanation stands about insomnia
[10:19] <Fujitsu> Maybe, but it's now unfrozen.
[10:19] <Fujitsu> Probably :P
[10:19] <Fujitsu> `I can't sleep. I'm going to unfreeze Feisty.'
[10:19] <Burgundavia> however, the new epiphany means I am updating tomorrow
[10:21] <Hobbsee> Burgundavia: to feisty already?
[10:21] <Burgundavia> yep
[10:21] <Fujitsu> I was planning to do so after midnight tonight.
[10:22] <Fujitsu> (due to offpeak download allowance being twice as high as on-peak)
[10:22] <Burgundavia> Fujitsu: you funny aussies and your "allowances"
[10:22] <Burgundavia> three months ago I pulled down 30 gig
[10:22] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: it's been unfrozen for a day or two
[10:22] <Hobbsee> Burgundavia: yup.  i dont have that problem - i just have a capped limit
[10:23] <Gloubiboulga> ajmitch: universe is unfrozen too?
[10:23] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: So people just uploaded a gazillion things?
[10:23] <Fujitsu> Gloubiboulga: The components aren't seperate, they're either all or none.
[10:23] <ajmitch> Gloubiboulga: of course, I've uploaded stuff through NEW already as well
[10:23] <Gloubiboulga> great
[10:23] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: I see libvirt, which means that the virtmanager is soonish?
[10:23] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: yes, people have had piles of stuff waiting to be uploaded, I've got a few
[10:24] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: maybe
[10:24] <Hobbsee> much
[10:26] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: heh
[10:27] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: worst way to get me to do something is to nag me about it :)
[10:27] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: are you coming down at all in these last few days?
[10:27] <Burgundavia> no, sadly not
[10:28] <animimotus> hi
[10:29] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: worst part is, work is not even busy
[10:29] <Fujitsu> Hi animimotus.
[10:29] <animimotus> a stupid question perhaps... why is it there no gnome-latest deposit like kde-latest like on kubuntu.org ?
[10:29] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: that's pretty ridiculous
[10:29] <Hobbsee> animimotus: because each release, ubuntu releases with the latest gnome anyway
[10:29] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: network-auth spec is up for discussion tomorrow, I talked with mdz to get it scheduled
[10:30] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: and it is a 5 hour flight. I could leave early tomorrow morning and be there by 11am
[10:30] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: excellent
[10:30] <Hobbsee> animimotus: the ubuntu release cycles are centred around gnome release schedules
[10:30] <ajmitch> anyway, I need to get to bed so I can get up early
[10:31] <animimotus> Hobbsee, ok so we are sure to have always the latest gnome's development in our system ?
[10:31] <Burgundavia> animimotus: yes
[10:31] <Hobbsee> animimotus: yes
[10:31] <animimotus> life is so good :)
[10:32] <Burgundavia> yes, we treat you right
[10:32] <Burgundavia> you develop on GNOME?
[10:33] <animimotus> Burgundavia, not al all, I'm a simple user
[10:33] <Burgundavia> ah
[10:35] <animimotus> I have just notice some bugs on Evolution, I thought it was already declared on Launchpad but the bug is still here til several month now
[10:35] <Burgundavia> animimotus: evo has the 2nd highest bug count of any part of GNOME, afaik
[10:36] <Hobbsee> Burgundavia: what's the first?
[10:36] <Burgundavia> gtk or nautilus, I think
[10:36] <Hobbsee> ah
[10:36] <Burgundavia> bringing up the stats now
[10:36] <Burgundavia> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/reports/weekly-bug-summary.cgi
[10:37] <Burgundavia> sorry, evo is now #1
[10:37] <animimotus> it's horrible :o :p the mail pages don't renderer pretty good like in Thunderbird, text sort from boxes and so on
[10:37] <Burgundavia> mails not rendering is another issue entirely
[10:38] <Burgundavia> due to the html rendering engine they use
[10:38] <animimotus> frightened ^^
[10:40] <Burgundavia> basically, gtkhtml doesn't understand css
[10:40] <animimotus> Burgundavia, I thought it was the priority because it makes not really serious : the mailbox is the first we can see when we test Gnome for the first time... Newbie should jump out their chair :D
[10:40] <Burgundavia> evo is bieng worked on
[10:40] <animimotus> Burgundavia, like Internet Explorer ? :p
[10:41] <Burgundavia> novell has several people working on it from their Indian office
[10:41] <Burgundavia> no, there is real working being done
[10:41] <Burgundavia> but look at those bugs/opened closed numbers
[10:41] <animimotus> so it a good novel :)
[10:42] <Burgundavia> the huge numbers are mostly related to GNOME shipping a new crash tool that reports the bug to the gnome bugzilla
[10:47] <animimotus> sorry, I'm back :)
[10:48] <Burgundavia> animimotus: did you see my last line, about the huge numbers of bugs?
[10:49] <animimotus> ctrl + W... lol
[10:49] <animimotus> erf
[10:49] <Burgundavia> animimotus: did you see my last line, about the huge bug numbers?
[10:49] <animimotus> yes I have seen the line, this bugreported can be integrated in Edgy .
[10:50] <animimotus> bugreporter
[10:50] <animimotus> ?
[10:50] <animimotus> mr_pouit, hi dear :p
[10:50] <mr_pouit> hi animimotus ;)
[10:51] <animimotus> Burgundavia, it a friend I have, mr_pouit :p
[10:51] <animimotus> * it's
[10:51] <Burgundavia> hello
[10:51] <Burgundavia> sadly I need to sleep
[10:52] <animimotus> Burgundavia, nice night, thanks for your respons
[10:52] <Fujitsu> Goodnight, Burgundavia.
[10:53] <animimotus> well I hope that Novell can always feel free working on Evolution... now they work with (for ?) Microsoft...
[10:56] <animimotus> I ask myselft if Evolution could be the Outlook killer :\
[11:58] <fernando> moin all
[12:00] <crimsun> Gloubiboulga: hi, if you or jani are going to take care of the gxine merge, I've already pushed it to bzr. I'm away for two days.
[12:00] <Gloubiboulga> crimsun: great, thanks :)
[12:01] <crimsun> [https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-core-dev/+branch/gxine/ubuntu , that is]
[12:01] <crimsun> ->airport
[12:05] <gnomefreak> are we able to start merging for feisty yet?
[12:06] <crimsun> yes
[12:06] <gnomefreak> ok ty i guess nows a good time to try my hand at it again
[12:44] <tarzeau> where can i find a person who maintains the ubuntu package that i get bug reports about?
[12:44] <tarzeau> i maintain it in debian, and it works perfect for me, but ubuntu removes files and makes the software not work anymore
[12:44] <tarzeau> this is really annoying to me, because i have no chance to fix bugs in ubuntu
[12:45] <Gloubiboulga> tarzeau: which package is it?
[12:46] <tarzeau> Gloubiboulga: gtamsanalyzer.app
[12:46] <tarzeau> the bug reporter says there's no binaries in the package
[12:46] <tarzeau> but there is for me in mine
[12:46] <tarzeau> guess i'll just tell him to use debian and this url: http://people.debian.org/~daniel//documents/ubuntu.html
[12:47] <tarzeau> i have no shell account on any ubuntu systems, nor do i know a person i can redirect him to
[12:47] <Gloubiboulga> strange, because we use your package
[12:47] <Gloubiboulga> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/g/gtamsanalyzer.app/gtamsanalyzer.app_0.42-3/changelog
[12:47] <tarzeau> dpkg -L gtamsanalyzer.app | wc -l
[12:47] <tarzeau> can you tell me what that gives to you?
[12:47] <Gloubiboulga> sure, let me install it
[12:47] <tarzeau> then it must be this users problem
[12:48] <tarzeau> he says he has 0.42-3
[12:48] <Gloubiboulga> gauvain@joe:~/dev/paquets/pyxfce$ dpkg -L gtamsanalyzer.app | wc -l
[12:48] <Gloubiboulga> 26
[12:48] <tarzeau> but wait
[12:49] <tarzeau> looking at dpkg -L gtamsanalyzer.app , it has no Application folder anymore
[12:50] <Gloubiboulga> I'm really not familiar with all these .app apps
[12:50] <tarzeau> Gloubiboulga: that's fine, there really is a problem, i'm checking it
[12:50] <Gloubiboulga> ok
[12:51] <tarzeau> yeah -2 had the files, -3 doesn't anymore
[12:53] <tarzeau> haha i know what's wrong
[12:54] <tarzeau> my sponsor would tells me how to do things, then i do it, but of course he doesn't check if the changes HE wanted so much would break anything (oh well, i'll fix this)
[12:55] <tarzeau> sorry to bother
[12:57] <Gloubiboulga> no problem
[01:32] <sivang> re motus
[01:32] <Hobbsee> hey sivang!
[01:33] <sivang> Hobbsee: how's it going ?
[01:33] <Hobbsee> :)
[01:33] <Hobbsee> sivang: good, assignments and the like
[01:33] <sivang> Hobbsee: assignemnets?
[01:33] <Hobbsee> siu
[01:33] <Hobbsee> sivang: uni
[01:33] <Hobbsee> sivang: exams next week
[01:33] <sivang> Hobbsee: ah :)
[01:33] <sivang> Hobbsee: good
[01:34] <sivang> (on -devel)
[01:34] <Hobbsee> i've finished the last assignmetn, and am wondering what to do nwo :P
[01:34] <sivang> heh
[01:35] <sivang> Hobbsee: wanna help a rocking desktop backup solution ? ;)
[01:35] <Hobbsee> maybe
[01:35] <Hobbsee> sivang: i can tell you what files you need to remove for a restore for kde to work :)
[01:35] <sivang> and get your hands dirty with some cool yet highly readable and understandable python code? :)
[01:35] <Hobbsee> my python skills arent good
[01:35] <sivang> Hobbsee: feel free to add this on the wiki page, or else it'll get los t:)
[01:35] <Hobbsee> however, i'd like a look
[01:36] <sivang> Hobbsee: please, do, if you have ANY questions, you know I'm more then happy to answer you
[01:36] <Gloubiboulga> hello sivang
[01:36] <sivang> hi Gloubiboulga !
[01:36] <sivang> Gloubiboulga: how you benen doing mate?
[01:36] <sivang> Gloubiboulga: are you in uds-mtv ?
[01:36] <Gloubiboulga> sivang: unfortunately no
[01:37] <Gloubiboulga> sivang: someone on a -fr chan seems interested in hubackup and would know if it will we able to backup /etc at some point
[01:38] <Gloubiboulga> sivang: are you in uds-mtv by the way ?
[01:38] <sivang> Gloubiboulga: it would, yes, the fesity+1 goal for is to be able to do systeam area backups
[01:39] <Hobbsee> sivang: where is this wiki?
[01:40] <sivang> Hobbsee: wiki.ubuntu.com/HomeUserBackup?
[01:40] <sivang> ;-)
[01:40] <Hobbsee> ah
[01:40] <Gloubiboulga> sivang: ok, great :)
[01:41] <sivang> Hobbsee: if you plan to get dirty with PyQT, then you already know that my dear dear friend Jonathan would be exciting to see QT frontend
[01:41] <Hobbsee> hehe
[01:41] <Hobbsee> sivang: i know almost *none* of python, so...
[01:42] <Hobbsee> then again, i do have uni break soon...
[01:42] <sivang> Hobbsee: python is nothiing to be known :)
[01:42] <Hobbsee> well, yeah, but still
[01:42] <sivang> Hobbsee: you just start talking to it and it will flow, trust me ;)
[01:43] <jsgotangco> hey guys
[01:43] <sivang> Hobbsee: really, this is not joke
[01:44] <sivang> Hobbsee: it's like the nicest going language I've put my hands on to
[01:44] <sivang> hey jsgotangco :)
[01:44] <Hobbsee> sivang: yes, so i've seen, from the little i've played with it
[01:44] <jsgotangco> python?
[01:45] <Hobbsee> sivang: found the first bug
[01:45] <Hobbsee> jsgotangco: yes
[01:45] <sivang> Hobbsee: ?
[01:45] <Hobbsee> sivang: "otherwise you could loose " in one of the screenshots - should be "lose"
[01:45] <Hobbsee> and s/an/a/
[01:45] <Hobbsee> in that same screenshot
[01:46] <sivang> Hobbsee: well, sudo apt-get hubackup, see if the error is there as well, if you can't find the error there, then just open a typo bug.
[01:46] <Hobbsee> sivang: you've not got english as a first language, right?
[01:46] <Hobbsee> yep
[01:46] <Hobbsee> i've only got edgy on here, will that do?
[01:46] <sivang> Hobbsee: no, I have not :)
[01:46] <Hobbsee> didnt think so
[01:46] <sivang> Hobbsee: sure! edgy has the latest development in it
[01:47] <sivang> Hobbsee: but the screenshots were not made by me
[01:47] <sivang> Hobbsee: so you can't blame me for this :p
[01:47] <Hobbsee> yep
[01:47] <Hobbsee> haha
[01:48] <sivang> Hobbsee: also, I think I'm far from considering typo bugs to be real bugs yet ! :-p
[01:48] <Hobbsee> hehe
[01:49] <Hobbsee> yeah, that's true
[01:49] <Hobbsee> i just noticed them - it's a pet peeve of mine
[01:49] <Hobbsee> work's terrible with them
[01:52] <sivang> Hobbsee: it's a good thing you notice them, file respective bugs :) I almost didn't touch any of the widgets since glatzor provided them to me, so most probably the bug is apparent in the software itself.
[01:52] <Hobbsee> sivang: right
[02:27] <kiko> hey there
[02:27] <kiko> ajmitch, can you rescue me from bug 30701 again?
[02:27] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30701 in zodb "python2.4-zodb should depend on python2.4-zopeinterface?" [High,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30701
[02:27] <Hobbsee> kiko: he's asleep
[02:45] <xopher> Hi! Could someone tell me how I can sign packages when building with pbuilder? Is there an option I can add to pbuilderrc?
[02:54] <Adri2000> xopher: you have to sign during the debuild -S (source package)
[02:58] <xopher> so extending DEBBUILDOPTS="-sa" to DEBBUILDOPTS="-sa --debsign-k<EMAIL_ADDRESS>?
[03:19] <gnomefreak> xopher: i think i had to do that once. i cant remember if i set it in ~/.pbuilderrc or ~/.gnupg though
[03:19] <jonh_wendell> geser, what does SRU mean?
[03:19] <xopher> hmm, ok, what about the DEBSIGN= option?
[03:20] <geser> (S)table (R)elease (U)pdate
[03:21] <geser> jonh_wendell: see also https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Acronyms for some other used acronyms
[03:24] <jonh_wendell> geser: if you want, you can put the new .deb for octplot in somewhere so that a friend of mine can test it
[03:24] <geser> the one for AMD64?
[03:26] <jonh_wendell> geser: hummm i guess he uses 386...
[03:27] <geser> I will see I can rebuild it for i386 also
[03:29] <jonh_wendell> geser: no chance of new version (from debian) enter in edgy-updates, right?
[03:30] <geser> hard to say, it depends how the MOTU-SRU team decides
[03:31] <bersace> Hi all !!!!
[03:32] <geser> as octplot is currently uninstallable in edgy and if the new version works (and the rebuild one not) it might get in
[03:33] <jonh_wendell> geser: that's great
[03:36] <bersace> i've just uploaded enblend, with enable image blending in hugin
[03:36] <bersace> please review
[03:37] <bersace> oh
[03:37] <bersace> f***
[03:37] <bersace> dput automatically upload to ubuntu
[03:37] <bersace> not revu
[03:37] <bersace> :|
[03:39] <bersace> ok
[03:39] <bersace> i uploaded enblend 2.5 to revu
[03:39] <bersace> seems its not shown at revu.tauware.de
[03:40] <bersace> siretart: ping
[03:40] <siretart> bersace: You sent me a contentless ping.  This is a contentless pong.  Please provide a bit of information about what you want and I'll respond when I am around.
[03:41] <bersace> siretart: ?
[03:41] <Adri2000> bersace: your package is currently in incoming
[03:41] <bersace> Adri2000: any url ?
[03:42] <Adri2000> ftp://revu.tauware.de/incoming/ but it is not anymore
[03:42] <bersace> got it
[03:42] <Adri2000> :)
[03:42] <bersace> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3388
[03:43] <bersace> oh
[03:44] <bersace> seems that enblend had already package candidate :\
[03:45] <bersace> but very old
[04:11] <ajmitch> morning all
[04:17] <xerxas> Hi ajmitch
[04:17] <jsgotangco> hey
[04:17] <xerxas> fesity is accepting new packages already ?
[04:17] <jsgotangco> got dist-upgrade itch? heh
[04:18] <ajmitch> yes, new packages are being accepted
[04:19] <superm1> ajmitch, did the MOTU/SRU process get defined the last few days?  I remember seeing chatter that it was supposed to be finished over the weekend, but I haven't looked into it yet
[04:19] <ajmitch> superm1: I believe so, I'm not entirely sure since I'm not in the sru team
[04:19] <superm1> do you know who was put on it?
[04:20] <ajmitch> yes, look at https://launchpad.net/people/motu-sru
[04:21] <xerxas> ajmitch,  so I can start packaging some new stuff
[04:21] <xerxas> didn't knew about it !
[04:21] <xerxas> :)
[04:25] <bddebian> Heya gang
[04:26] <lfittl> hey bddebian
[04:26] <bddebian> Hi lfittl
[04:44] <animimotus> test
[04:53] <siretart> bersace: yes?
[04:53] <bersace> siretart: i've uploaded another debianisation of enblend
[04:53] <bersace> i didn't saw it where already uploaded
[04:53] <bersace> would be nice to have it included universe
[04:54] <siretart> bersace: yes
[05:25] <jonh_wendell> geser: should i test the 0.3.5 or 0.3.9 ?
[05:39] <geser> jonh_wendell: if possible both
[05:41] <geser> if you can verify that 0.3.5 is broken and 0.3.9 works, the motu-sru team has more reasons to accept it into edgy-updates
[05:43] <jonh_wendell> geser: ok, i've invited my friend to test both; i'll inform you the results
[05:43] <jonh_wendell> geser: thanks
[05:44] <geser> please add the results also to the bug report
[05:45] <jonh_wendell> geser: ok
[06:51] <martijn> Hello, I'd like to get my hands dirty building some packages :) I'm trying to follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PackagingBasics, But I have troubles setting up pbuilder.
[06:52] <martijn> I get "E: debootstrap does not exist, install or change DEBOOTSTRAP option"
[06:52] <Mez> martijn, sudo apt-get install pbuilder
[06:52] <martijn> I did that already
[06:53] <martijn> Oh wait, I didn't install debootstrap :)
[06:53] <Mez> ;)
[06:53] <Mez> it should be a dependency I though
[06:53] <kiko> ei ajmitch
[06:53] <martijn> Maybe a bug?
[06:54] <Mez> Depends: debootstrap | cdebootstrap, wget, gcc, debianutils (>= 1.13.1), coreutils (>= 4.5.8-1)
[06:54] <martijn> Does setting up a pbuilder environment require a lot of downloading? I'm not on a great internet connection
[06:54] <Mez> martijn, not much - but a bit, as does using it
[06:54] <Mez> martijn, how did you install pbuildeR?
[06:55] <martijn> sudo apt-get install pbuilder. I just repeated that command when you mentioned it before, and it reported "pbuilder is already the newest version"
[06:55] <geser> martijn: the base.tgz has about 80 MB
[06:55] <martijn> then I did "sudo apt-get install debuilder", just for good measure, and it started installing that.
[06:56] <martijn> I mean debootstrap
[06:57] <martijn> fdoving: thanks, but I think I'll start by following the Packagingbasics tutorial step by step
[07:02] <ajmitch> hey kiko
[07:04] <luisbg> hey ajmitch
[07:12] <martijn> Mez, I just checked: I had cdebootstrap installed, so that is why it didn't install debootstrap
[07:13] <kiko> ajmitch!
[07:14] <kiko> was wondering if I could interest you in bug 30701
[07:14] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30701 in zodb "python2.4-zodb should depend on python2.4-zopeinterface?" [High,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30701
[07:16] <martijn> question: after pbuilder finished, the result is in base.tgz, right? Can I copy this file around between systems so I don't have to download everything again?
[07:28] <amarillion> If I want to get a package into REVU, does it matter for which ubuntu version I build it? Only feisty, or also edgy/dapper?
[07:32] <Gloubiboulga> it needs to be built for feisty
[08:02] <Zdra> is universe open for upload in feisty ?
[08:03] <Adri2000> Zdra: yes
[08:03] <LaserJock> I don't think so yet
[08:03] <LaserJock> it is?
[08:03] <LaserJock> hmm, could be, I hadn't noticed
[08:03] <Adri2000> I think yes, Gloubiboulga have just uploaded a package in universe for me
[08:03] <LaserJock> it's kinda pointless at the moment, IMO
[08:04] <LaserJock> Zdra: what do you mean?
[08:04] <Zdra> now that universe is open we can upload new telepathy-* updates :)
[08:05] <LaserJock> sure, but I don't think it's of much use right now
[08:05] <LaserJock> I don't know if the tool chain is stable yet
[08:06] <Zdra> LaserJock: main has many uploads now so I guess the toolchain is ok ...
[08:06] <LaserJock> well
[08:06] <Adri2000> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/feisty/+source/brasero/0.5.0-0ubuntu1 < that's universe :)
[08:06] <LaserJock> Adri2000: ah, I did see that one roll by today
[08:07] <LaserJock> I'm just waiting until after the UDS is over
[08:07] <LaserJock> the archive admins are so very busy right now I don't want to put any load on them
[08:12] <amarillion> question: after pbuilder finished, the result is in base.tgz, right? Can I copy this file around between systems so I don't have to download everything again?
[08:12] <geser> yes
[08:12] <LaserJock> well, the base.tgz is the pbuilder
[08:13] <amarillion> ok great.
[08:13] <amarillion> For me, it takes quite a while to set up.
[08:13] <LaserJock> yep
[08:13] <amarillion> It's running for over an hour now
[08:14] <LaserJock> it's making a minimal Ubuntu install so it can take a while
[08:14] <joejaxx> Hello Everyone
[08:14] <LaserJock> hi joejaxx
[08:14] <amarillion> I'm going to try to package a few allegro plugins. I think they will make useful packages.
[08:14] <joejaxx> i hope you all are doing well
[08:14] <joejaxx> :D
[08:14] <joejaxx> LaserJock: hello
[08:14] <LaserJock> joejaxx: how's the BOFs today?
[08:15] <joejaxx> they are well
[08:15] <amarillion> Allegro is a game programming library
[08:15] <joejaxx> i just came from the ubuntustudio bof
[08:15] <LaserJock> joejaxx: there was one scheduled?
[08:15] <LaserJock> cool
[08:15] <joejaxx> yeah
[08:15] <joejaxx> 10am
[08:17] <joejaxx> well the mirror stopped at kdenetworkconf
[08:17] <joejaxx> failed:Unkown command.
[08:17] <kiko> hey joejaxx, got my mail?
[08:18] <joejaxx> kiko: i might have i have to go through the 63 new emails i just received
[08:20] <joejaxx> kiko: yes i have
[08:20] <LaserJock> argg, there's a MOTU BOF right now?
[08:20] <joejaxx> kiko: thank you :)
[08:20] <kiko> joejaxx, good!
[08:20] <joejaxx> kiko: :D
[09:41] <giskard> Zdra: i'm doing it right now
[09:49] <LaserJock> crappy
[09:49] <LaserJock> Scibuntu hit the forums
[09:49] <kiko> the forums are merciless
[09:50] <zul> ubuntu science?
[09:53] <LaserJock> zul: it's a nifty little script that just does a bit apt-get install ...
[09:53] <LaserJock> plus install acroread straight from Adobe
[09:53] <LaserJock> and 1 other app that I have no idea what it is
[09:53] <fernando> hi joejaxx
[09:57] <zul> cool...lunch time
[10:01] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: Our forums?
[10:03] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: ubuntuforums.org
[10:03] <LaserJock> Education and Science subforum
[10:03] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: I just found the thread :(
[10:03] <LaserJock> I'm writing a reply right now
[10:03] <Fujitsu> Oh god.
[10:03] <Fujitsu> Somebody suggested adding it to the wiki.
[10:03] <Fujitsu> We're doomed now.
[10:04] <Fujitsu> How nice of it to break Beryl.
[10:04] <Fujitsu> It's crack vs. crack!
[10:04] <bhale> what is the "reaction to the burn effect"
[10:04] <bhale> that whiprush just blogged
[10:05] <gnomefreak> what broke beryl?
[10:06] <Fujitsu> gnomefreak: That Scibuntu script.
[10:06] <LaserJock> scibuntu
[10:06] <Fujitsu> Grrreat. Somebody complaining that texmacs won't install, because they've compiled emacs from CVS.
[10:06] <gnomefreak> i didnt know there was one
[10:06] <Fujitsu> gnomefreak: Neither did we until yesterday.
[10:07] <LaserJock> well, it looks like it got started on the 4th
[10:08] <LaserJock> so not a lot of time for people to hear about it ;-)
[10:08] <Fujitsu> Have you replied to that thread?
[10:08] <Fujitsu> And should we run off an email to Mr. Scibuntu himself?
[10:08] <LaserJock> working on it
[10:08] <LaserJock> trying to figure out how to politely say "This is insane"
[10:10] <gnomefreak> other than the child education science stuff i didnt know there was science apps. are they all written by 3rd parties?
[10:10] <Fujitsu> gnomefreak: Check https://launchpad.net/people/motuscience.
[10:10] <Fujitsu> That's a list of all science stuff.
[10:10] <gnomefreak> ty
[10:10] <Fujitsu> Oops, add a /+packagebugs to the end of that.
[10:11] <Fujitsu> Also:
[10:11] <Fujitsu> http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/motuscience/feisty/all.html
[10:11] <Fujitsu> That's probably a better list.
[10:11] <LaserJock> ok, replied
[10:11] <gnomefreak> i hope so theres nothing on the first page after hitting packages :)
[10:11] <LaserJock> gnomefreak: MOTU Science looks after > 450 science related packages
[10:12] <gnomefreak> omg
[10:12] <LaserJock> we could include more
[10:13] <LaserJock> but we have quite enough as it is
[10:13] <Fujitsu> We do.
[10:13] <Fujitsu> 165 open bugs... :(
[10:26] <giskard> who is working on beryl?
[10:28] <LaserJock> several people I think
[10:29] <LaserJock> quinn storm is the main one I think
[10:31] <Fujitsu> How odd... The BeautifulSoup on my server in the US seems to have decided it wants to return Null for everything.
[10:31] <giskard> LaserJock: also for Ubuntu? i was wondering if a motu wanted upload it.
[10:32] <LaserJock> giskard: I believe quinn has been working with several people here
[10:32] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: excellent :(
[10:32] <Fujitsu> So I can't run my bug page parser there, to get the statuses etc. of science bugs :(
[10:33] <giskard> LaserJock: i know that reggaemanu and Amaranth are working on it, but they are not motu afaik :( i'd be happy to sponsor it.
[10:33] <LaserJock> any motu can sponsor it
[10:34] <giskard> LaserJock: yes :)
[10:36] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: edgy, feisty, and bug list updated
[10:37] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: Why not put it on a cron job or three?
[10:38] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: at the moment I'm still transferring it from my box
[10:38] <LaserJock> and I haven't gotten passwordless ssh
[10:38] <LaserJock> yet
[10:39] <LaserJock> I can at least do a cron to create the lists here
[10:39] <LaserJock> I've just never cronned anything so I just never thing to do it ;-)
[10:39] <Fujitsu> Why don't you create the lists on tiber, rather than transferring them to there?
[10:40] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: because tiber doesn't have the mdt we need
[10:40] <Fujitsu> Ah.
[10:40] <Fujitsu> I run a private version in my home directory, in fact.
[10:41] <LaserJock> hmm, that's a thought
[10:41] <Fujitsu> You just need to reconfigure it to point to the correct module directory.
[10:41] <LaserJock> right
[11:39] <jdong> what are the ramifications of using --use-pdebuild-internal in pdebuild?