[12:27] <BenC> Hey lp'ers
[12:28] <BenC> I notice that on https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-6.10-beta if you hit Status, it doesn't exactly sort like you would expect
[12:28] <lifeless> hmm, I think theres a bug already
[12:28] <lifeless> but perhaps not
[12:28] <BenC> I'm guessing that it's sorting on some other target for the bug besides the one aimed at the milestone
[12:29] <BenC> actually, no, it isn't
[12:29] <BenC> just isn't right :)
[12:29] <lifeless> can you file a bug please
[12:30] <lifeless> be sure to copy the sorted output from bug 54690 through 59883 in
[12:30] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 54690 in foo2zjs "[Edgy]  Please sync new upstream version" [Medium,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54690
[12:30] <BenC> sure thing
[12:30] <lifeless> as that shows the problem really vividly
[12:30] <lifeless> (fix released, confirmed, fix released)
[12:33] <BenC> bug 62526 filed
[12:33] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62526 in launchpad "Status sorting on milestone listing is wrong" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62526
[12:34] <BenC> thanks guys
[12:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62526 in launchpad "Status sorting on milestone listing is wrong" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62526
[12:53] <WebMaven> SteveA: ping
[01:50] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62532 in launchpad "release pages does not show changelog" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62532
[02:11] <WebMaven> SteveA: ping
[04:10] <mdz> any launchpad developers awake?
[04:11] <jamesh> yes
[04:11] <mdz> jamesh:  do you know if anything big is going on with Rosetta right now?
[04:11] <mdz> I'm having trouble with bug 46559
[04:13] <jamesh> mdz: I don't think anything special has changed
[04:13] <mdz> jamesh: do you have access to look at any of that sort of thing?
[04:14] <mdz> if they are doing a big import, I don't even know where that would run
[04:14] <mdz> this is a huge blocker for ubuntu
[04:14] <jamesh> I think you'll have to wait for stub (who should be up soon)
[04:15] <mdz> jamesh: I'll be in and out; would you pounce on him for me?
[04:15] <jamesh> okay
[04:15] <mdz> have him call or SMS me and I'll explain
[04:16] <jamesh> by the look of that bug, the affected soyuz code would need to be changed to be able to retry the failing transaction
[04:16] <jamesh> (which a lot of the scripts aren't set up to do)
[04:17] <mdz> I've tried it 4 times in a row and it has failed consistently
[04:17] <mdz> a couple of hours ago, it ran successfully
[04:21] <mdz> jamesh: do you know if there has been a production update recently?
[04:21] <jamesh> there was one yesterday
[04:22] <mdz> about what time?
[04:25] <jamesh> mdz: looks like it would have finished around 9:00 UTC
[04:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62545 in soyuz "View all builds for a just published SourcePackage crashes" [Medium,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62545
[04:25] <mdz> so ~17 hours ago
[04:26] <mdz> that doesn't seem consistent
[04:26] <jamesh> ah: <stub> soyuz is still down - I'll wait a tick until malcc shows up and he can confirm it should still be running with the old code.
[04:27] <jamesh> there may be another update time for the soyuz code
[04:27] <mdz> the first failure was around 0038 UTC
[04:27] <lifeless> we dont update soyuz as part of the regular update
[04:27] <lifeless> because its fragile
[04:27] <mdz> malcc won't be up for several hours
[04:28] <spiv> The soyuz code was updated.
[04:28] <lifeless> hmm, I'm going low-blood-sugar, let me grab some food, back in 10 (sorry, I realise this is urgent, but mistakes here would be bad)
[04:28] <mdz> looks like that question was resolved several hours later
[04:29] <mdz> with soyuz being updated as spiv said
[04:29] <mdz> this problem is only a couple of hours old
[04:29] <spiv> Right.  stub talked to malcc ~15 hours ago, and updated soyuz, and Kamion reported that the problem he observed was now fixed.
[04:29] <mdz> I think I just got lucky, the most recent publisher run seems to be succeeding after 7 failures in a row
[04:30] <jamesh> that isn't too surprising given the type of error
[04:40] <lifeless> back
[04:43] <lifeless> looking
[04:43] <lifeless> mdz: poimport is running
[04:44] <lifeless> mdz: please try now
[04:47] <mdz> lifeless: I got lucky and one succeeded; we don't have any more uploads in the queue
[04:48] <lifeless> mdz: what time did it succeed ?
[04:49] <mdz> lifeless: shortly before I said it for the first time in this channel
[04:49] <mdz> which was 1929 local, 0229 UTC
[04:49] <lifeless> thanks
[04:49] <mdz> while you were away
[04:50] <lifeless> well, I have killed poimport anyhow, you should have no further trouble
[04:53] <mdz> lifeless: thank you
[04:53] <mdz> lifeless: is that something which runs automatically?  any idea why things are going badly today in particular?
[04:54] <mdz> lifeless: I sent a message to launchpad@ about the situation; if you could follow up with your findings and actions I'd appreciate it
[04:54] <mdz> meanwhile I'm going to drive the cd image builds
[04:55] <mdz> I've re-enabled the hourly run of the publisher and will let it fall where it may
[04:57] <lifeless> mdz: yes, it runs from cron
[04:57] <lifeless> no idea about what made it unhappy today, the rosetta devs may have more insight.
[04:57] <lifeless> I've already replied to your launchpad@ email, if anything new crops up I shall follow up
[05:19] <mdz> thanks
[05:27] <jamesh> we should really look at how we want scripts to handle retries on aborted transactions
[05:27] <jamesh> so that problems like this could be avoided
[06:00] <mpt_> Goooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders!
[06:36] <stub> lifeless: Did you get any more feedback from the distro team? I'm wondering if the poimport cron job needs to be disabled or run less often, or if it is only the occasional run that causes blockage.
[06:37] <lifeless> 12:53 < mdz> lifeless: thank you
[06:37] <lifeless> 12:53 < mdz> lifeless: is that something which runs automatically?  any idea why things are going badly today in particular?
[06:37] <lifeless> 12:54 < mdz> lifeless: I sent a message to launchpad@ about the situation; if you could follow up with your findings and actions I'd appreciate it
[06:37] <lifeless> 12:54 < mdz> meanwhile I'm going to drive the cd image builds
[06:37] <lifeless> 12:55 < mdz> I've re-enabled the hourly run of the publisher and will let it fall where it may
[06:37] <lifeless> stub: no more feedback no.
[06:38] <mdz> stub: I don't think I can provide any feedback which would help with that decision
[06:38] <mdz> stub: someone needs to find out why that job was causing a problem, when it apparently doesn't usually
[06:38] <mdz> perhaps it was running for an extended period of time
[06:39] <mdz> whatever it was doing differently, it needs to not do that
[06:39] <stub> serialization exceptions are expected when running in serializable transaction isolation level. We either need to handle them, or lower the transaction isolation.
[06:40] <stub> Some runs will be more likely to trigger them (probably big rosetta imports), but they can still happen any time until we fix the problem.
[06:41] <stub> The fix is trivial (and documented in that bug report), but will need to be tested before landing on production.
[06:44] <mdz> stub: that bug report was marked wishlist until a couple of hours ago :-/
[06:44] <stub> I'll leave the cronjob enabled if things are happy now - there is already a new poimport process running - but we can disable it if necessary to keep the release moving (maybe run it once or twice a day manually)
[06:44] <mdz> stub: who do I call to get it stopped and disabled if needed?
[06:45] <stub> mdz: Yeah - I hadn't heard of it causing much besides minor annoyance before and soyuz didn't have a particularly robust test process setup
[06:45] <stub> mdz: Me, lifeless, admins, stevea (I think)
[06:45] <mdz> thanks
[06:45] <stub> poimport process running as launchpad on gangotri, and spawned from launchpad's crontab
[06:46] <stub> Process can be killed without harm - it will recover
[07:50] <mpt> stu1, ping
[07:51] <stu1> mpt: pong
[07:51] <jamesh> the enumvalue:foo TALES expression would be useful if it worked with security wrapped values ...
[07:53] <mpt> stub, do you know why the web stats claim that there has been zero traffic on blueprint.launchpad.net?
[07:54] <stub> Because we moved to features.launchpad.net?
[07:54] <mpt> oh.
[07:54] <lifeless> rotfl
[07:55] <mpt> That's not a blueprint, that's a feature!
[07:55] <mpt> thanks stub
[07:55] <stub> You want to rt a request to get the stats for features.launchpad.net put up and blueprint.launchpad.net removed?
[08:00] <mpt> yeah
[08:47] <sivang> morning
[09:03] <SteveA> good morning
[09:04] <carlos> morning
[09:34] <SteveA> stub: hi
[09:48] <slytherin> Can anyone tell me how can I apply for a mailing list for a l10n team.
[10:17] <mpt> BjornT, ping
[10:17] <BjornT> mpt: pong
[10:18] <mpt> BjornT, I saw you said "I'm working on this" in the enter-URLs-as-bug-watches bug
[10:18] <mpt> Is there an existing spec for that?
[10:18] <mpt> or is it too small to need a spec?
[10:23] <BjornT> mpt: well, i'm planning to do it steps. the first one will be to simply allow an url in the remote bug field, but still keeping the ability to choose a bug tracker manually.
[10:23] <BjornT> mpt: there is a spec at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugForwardingWorkflow, though, with some mock-ups at http://www.async.com.br/~kiko/mockups/bug-forwarding-workflow.html
[10:26] <SteveA> mpt: hello.  I will try calling usman now.
[10:27] <BjornT> mpt: there has also been some discussion about this on the mailing list.
[10:27] <Burgundavia> BjornT: those mockups look really busy to me
[10:28] <Burgundavia> BjornT: I also dislike the term "indicate"
[10:29] <mpt> BjornT, could those mockups be put on the wiki? Last week I went through a bunch of specs that linked to mockups on cprov.gwyddion.com, a host that no longer exists. I'm not saying that async.com.br is going to stop existing, but it would be nice to keep all parts of the spec in one place
[10:31] <BjornT> Burgundavia: yeah, they are quite busy. it could be worth redesigning them, to make the field where you enter the bug url more prominent.
[10:31] <SteveA> mpt: he's in a meeting, but I left a message and he'll call me back when he's available.
[10:32] <mpt> ok
[10:33] <BjornT> Burgundavia: i also don't like the them "indicate", but it's so hard to come up with a good term. this has been discussed before, but no suitable term was found.
[10:35] <jamesh> Burgundavia: it is better than the "request fix in" language
[10:35] <jamesh> but isn't perfect
[10:39] <BjornT> mpt: iirc, we tried to put the mockups on the wiki at first, but there were some problems with linking to images or something, so we did it like this instead.
[10:40] <mpt> wellllll, those ones don't really need images :-)
[10:42] <SteveA> mpt: do you have sometime to talk about the structural object presentation code?
[10:42] <mpt> SteveA, sure
[11:05] <carlos> danilo_: hey dude
[11:05] <danilo_> carlos: hi
[11:05] <carlos> danilo_: is your network link working well today?
[11:06] <danilos> carlos: not really, and I racoon (VPN) packages are broken for my "backup" provider, so I am back at my parents house :(
[11:06] <danilos> s/I racoon/ipsec and racoon/
[11:06] <danilos> i.e. bug 44246
[11:06] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 44246 in ipsec-tools "racoon-0.6.5-4ubuntu1 fails to configure" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/44246
[11:07] <carlos> :-(
[11:07] <carlos> well, at least you can work
[11:07] <danilos> yeah
[11:07] <carlos> did you see my request for help?
[11:07] <danilos> not yet, where? email?
[11:07] <carlos> danilos: yeah, email
[11:07] <carlos> I'm stalled with some tests
[11:07] <carlos> it fail and I don't find why
[11:08] <danilos> I've been setting up ADSL on my new computer, so I still started a bit late
[11:08] <carlos> don't worry
[11:10] <danilos> so, what do you need help with?
[11:10] <danilos> (until all of my email gets downloaded, which goes a bit slower at 256kbps)
[11:12] <carlos> danilos: sftp://devpad.canonical.com/home/warthogs/archives/carlos/launchpad/bug-44214/
[11:12] <carlos> that branch
[11:12] <carlos> and test translationimportqueue.txt
[11:14] <danilos> sure, I'm checking it out right now
[11:15] <danilos> I got so used to 1-2mbps connection, that all this is now terribly slow ;)
[11:15] <carlos> :-P
[11:31] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62584 in soyuz "Deathrow executioner doesn't guarantee stay of execution time" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62584
[11:40] <jordi> 123
[11:40] <carlos> jordi: 456
[11:40] <carlos> :-)
[11:47] <danilos> btw, I should probably filter translation imports into another account on the server directly, since I am only at 1200/1600 messages now
[11:50] <carlos> danilos: well, I think we should disable those emails if there are no errors with the imports
[11:50] <danilos> carlos: yeah, most likely, is there a bug about it, or should I report it?
[11:51] <carlos> report it, please
[12:10] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62595 in launchpad "Timeout to low for ISO images?" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62595
[12:20] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62598 in rosetta "Successful imports should not send email to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[Wishlist,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62598
[12:26] <carlos> bug #62598 a.k.a. stop spamming admins!!
[12:26] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62598 in rosetta "Successful imports should not send email to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[Wishlist,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62598
[12:26] <carlos> :-P
[12:27] <danilos[brb] > ;)
[01:16] <jamesh> ddaa: I've done a bit more work untangling the $series/+source form.  I'd appreciate if you could take a quick look over the action button implementations for the sourceadmin functionality.
[01:17] <ddaa> URL?
[01:17] <jamesh> https://devpad.canonical.com/~jamesh/pending-reviews/jamesh/launchpad/bug-50569/full-diff
[01:18] <ddaa> bah, okay, I'll figure out the branch from that
[01:18] <jamesh> the changes in lib/canonical/launchpad/browser/productseries.py are the interesting ones as far as this goes
[01:19] <jamesh> I got rid of IProductSeriesSourceSet and IProductSeriesSource while doing this too ...
[01:19] <ddaa> I was hardly making sense at all of that code before, so I am mostly interested in the UI result
[01:19] <ddaa> jamesh: there's a bug open on merging those classes, you can take it
[01:19] <jamesh> yep
[01:20] <jamesh> the ProductSeriesView class is down to 170 lines after pulling the +source/+sourceadmin stuff out
[01:21] <jamesh> ddaa: the "FTP details" bit will be moved from the +source form soon, so pretend it isn't there when looking at the changes.
[01:28] <ddaa> jamesh: maybe remove the "# DEPRECATED" in browser.bazaar, it's just confusing and has not enough information to be useful.
[01:29] <jamesh> both, or just for /bazaar/series ?
[01:30] <ddaa> I was thinking of /bazaar/series
[01:30] <ddaa> I dunno which other one you're thinking of
[01:30] <jamesh> done.
[01:30] <jamesh> ddaa: in that class, there are two occurences of "# DEPRECATED"
[01:31] <ddaa> hu?
[01:31] <ddaa> products?
[01:31] <ddaa> WTF is that for
[01:31] <jamesh> ddaa: I can traverse like this: https://launchpad.net/bazaar/products/launchpad
[01:31] <ddaa> ???
[01:32] <ddaa> there's a problem with cruft in launchpad
[01:32] <jamesh> it changes the layer, so I suppose it might have been intended that "/bazaar/products/foo would display the same as "/products/foo/+branches" does
[01:32] <jamesh> but it can probably go completely
[01:33] <jamesh> of course, 'series' could probably just be a view on /bazaaar
[01:34] <jamesh> rather than using IProductSeriesSet as a context
[01:34] <ddaa> that page is also quite crufty
[01:34] <ddaa> for example the "Ready" checkbox is no longer useful
[01:34] <ddaa> it appears to ignore disabled products
[01:34] <ddaa> I mean, not ignore
[01:35] <ddaa> it has the old crazy js hack from plone that prevent keyboard navigation of the table
[01:36] <jamesh> I updated/simplified that template a little, btw
[01:36] <ddaa> but since it's only for admin use, it's not a biggie
[01:36] <jamesh> so you can navigate with the keyboard
[01:39] <ddaa> jamesh: FYI, I think the ProductSeries.syncCertified is buggy: it checks for a non-null timestamp instead of looking for the value of the importstatus
[01:39] <ddaa> well... which makes senses in the context it is used in allowCertify...
[01:40] <ddaa> I also sometimes need to put an import into production without going through autotest first, like the python import
[01:40] <ddaa> to short out the double import
[01:42] <ddaa> In the current design, an import should allowCertify if it's DONTSYNC, TESTING, TESTFAILED or AUTOTESTED
[01:43] <ddaa> eventually, I want to redesign importstatus, but it's not yet clear how.
[01:43] <ddaa> that would probably take the value of import_branch into account
[01:43] <cprov> carlos: ping
[01:44] <carlos> cprov: pong
[01:44] <carlos> did you see the bug report and the mail thread about buildd vs Rosetta?
[01:45] <cprov> carlos: hi dude, yep, process-accepted isn't using READ_COMMITED yet
[01:45] <cprov> carlos: I'll request stub quick review and get it done
[01:46] <carlos> cprov: Oh, I thought you tried it and failed...
[01:47] <carlos> cprov: ok, thanks
[01:47] <stub> There was a bug where the setting was not taking effect which might have blocked the fix - I don't remember.
[01:48] <jamesh> ddaa: thanks.  We probably want to disallow these options if the rcstype isn't one of CVS or SVN too, right?
[01:49] <ddaa> Well...
[01:50] <ddaa> Actually, there should be a constraint, (rcstype = 0) = (importstatus is NULL)
[01:50] <ddaa> if the rcstype is any of the deprecated type, the behaviour is undefined :)
[01:51] <jamesh> in the state my branch is in, it'll set rcstype = BAZAAR if that checkbox gets checked
[01:51] <jamesh> s/checkbox/radio button/
[01:51] <ddaa> hu?
[01:51] <ddaa> which checkbox?
[01:51] <jamesh> the "Bazaar" radio button
[01:52] <ddaa> please do not use that
[01:52] <ddaa> it would get in the way of separating ExternalBranch from ProductSeries
[01:53] <jamesh> okay.  I'll look at refactoring how I do that part of the code.
[01:55] <elmo> cprov/malcc: drescher:
[01:56] <elmo>  /dev/cciss/c0d0p1     533G  481G   26G  95% /
[01:56] <malcc> elmo: Argh
[01:57] <malcc> elmo: Did we ever resolve for you whether or not that bunch of stuff could be deleted?
[01:57] <elmo> malcc: we did it and it was
[02:01] <stub> cprov: r=stub on the transaction isolation fix
[02:02] <cprov> stub: thank you !
[02:02] <stub> Done a test run anywhere, or is the test suite enough now?
[02:07] <ddaa> jamesh: in your branch, http://launchpad.dev/products/firefox/1.0 is broken
[02:07] <ddaa> as in oops
[02:07] <jamesh> gar.  I was probably a bit over-eager in cleaning things up
[02:08] <ddaa> the hct-status stuff is used in a lot of places
[02:09] <ddaa> jamesh: I think the Bazaar branch thing should be independent from the CVS/SVN stuff
[02:09] <ddaa> as it is actually in the underlying database
[02:10] <ddaa> It's initial value should be something like:
[02:10] <ddaa> empty if user_branch and import_branch are both null
[02:10] <ddaa> user_branch if user_branch is set
[02:10] <ddaa> import_branch if user_branch is null and import_branch is set
[02:11] <ddaa> setting it to a value != from import_branch sets user_branch
[02:11] <ddaa> setting it to a value == import_branch clears user_branch
[02:12] <jamesh> The alternative would be to just point people at +edit
[02:12] <jamesh> might be easier than the alternatives
[02:13] <ddaa> I cannot speak about implementation, but I think what I described would be quite intuitive to use
[02:13] <ddaa> but I'm very strongly biased...
[02:13] <jamesh> ddaa: ignoring the "bazaar branch" option on the form for now, it is possible to submit the form with no details entered.  The action buttons will need to handle that situation
[02:14] <ddaa> mh... I am not sure, are you asking a question?
[02:16] <jamesh> yeah: how should the buttons act if rcstype == NONE?
[02:17] <ddaa> it should be allowed in some circumstances
[02:18] <ddaa> allowed to Edit (owner) if importstatus < PROCESSING (not in production)
[02:18] <ddaa> allowed to Admin (vcs-import and admin) in all cases
[02:21] <ddaa> Then, it should clear import_branch, import_status, datelastsynced, syncinterval, rcstype, cvsroot, cvsmodule, cvsbranch, cvstarfileurl, svnrepository, dateautotested, dateprocessapproved, datesyncapproved, datestarted, datefinished
[02:21] <jamesh> what I mean is that if the form has "No RCS details" selected, we don't want you to be able to put the import into production
[02:21] <ddaa> the bkrepository and targetarch* fields will be deleted when the current remove-gnuarch lands
[02:22] <ddaa> jamesh: successfully posting that form should remove all the vcs-import information
[02:22] <ddaa> so, yes, you do not want to put that into production
[02:23] <ddaa> actually, you should not even be allowed because of db constraints
[02:24] <ddaa> in ForeignBranch terms, that would be the action equivalent to deleting a ForeignBranch
[02:24] <ddaa> jamesh: I am not sure I am answering your question
[02:25] <jamesh> ddaa: I think you have explained it okay.
[02:30] <ddaa> note that the importstatus-based access restriction can lead to some interesting race conditions
[02:30] <ddaa> for example, an Edit loads the form and clears the details, an Admin posts the form to approve the import for production, and the Edit posts the form.
[02:31] <ddaa> The second post should fail. It's probably a unlikely enough race that it's okay to oops.
[02:33] <jamesh> ddaa: they should get an unauthorised exception, right?
[02:33] <jamesh> since they no longer have launchpad.EditSource permission when they post
[02:34] <ddaa> jamesh: right
[02:43] <salgado> stub, BjornT, around?
[02:43] <stub> salgado: yes
[02:44] <BjornT> salgado: i'm around, but i'm about to leave for a while
[02:45] <salgado> BjornT, stub, I'd like to discuss quickly if we should or not make Person.creation_rationale a NOT NULL and set a rationale for accounts created through the web UI
[02:45] <salgado> this is what I had in mind initially, and I actually implemented it
[02:45] <stub> What prompted the change?
[02:45] <salgado> but then at some point I thought that the rationale would only make sense for automatically created accounts
[02:46] <salgado> that is, we don't actually need a rationale for accounts created by their owners
[02:46] <stub> NULL generally means 'this hasn't been set', so it is a bit ambiguous given that the field can be NULL or rationale.UNKNOWN
[02:47] <BjornT> salgado: i think that it should be NOT NULL. that makes you think about what the rationale should be when creating new persons automatically. it's much easier to pass None, than to pass an incorrect rationale to createPerson()
[02:47] <stub> If we have a status for accounts created by their owners, then we actually know that this account was created by their owner.
[02:47] <salgado> on the other hand, having the rationale NOT NULL would make things simpler, and we could have a special rationale (something like rationale.OWNER_CREATED) for accounts created through the web
[02:47] <stub> Rather than some screwup
[02:48] <salgado> yeah, this is what I had initially
[02:48] <sabdfl> we should try to ensure that new people all have a rationale, even if that's "registered when ordering shipit CD's".
[02:48] <sabdfl> we often have people say "launchpad has an account for me and i don't know why"
[02:48] <sabdfl> when often they created those themselves!
[02:48] <stub> We can even use it to store more information. For example, OWNER_CREATED_LAUNCHPAD and OWNER_CREATED_SHIPIT etc. But that might be overkill.
[02:49] <sabdfl> this is especially true if we create the account when parsing the real world (mailing lists, po files, bug reports etc)
[02:49] <salgado> sabdfl, that, specifically, we can't tell. because from shipit we simply direct people to launchpad and ask them to create an account
[02:49] <sabdfl> salgado: trivial to fix and necessary to do so
[02:49] <jamesh> salgado: we know a URL to send people back to after they register their account though, right?
[02:49] <stub> salgado: There is a URL referencing shipit that is used to send the user back after sighup.
[02:50] <salgado> yeah, we could use the redirection url
[02:50] <sabdfl> salgado: in the case of direct person creation we absolutely must ask the person doing the creation to leave some comment on why they created the record. ideally we also get permission to email the newly-registered person, quoting that reason AND the registrant's name
[02:51] <malcc> elmo: The space all goes into our endless archive of everything ever uploaded, which grew around 40GB in August. We need an infinite disk, or a plan for when to archive/delete these. I've raised https://launchpad.net/products/soyuz/+bug/62612 as a home for discussion on what to do.
[02:51] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62612 in soyuz "Need a drescher disk space strategy" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]
[02:52] <salgado> sabdfl, that is what I had in mind
[02:54] <stub> salgado: Based on this discussion, I think the column should become NOT NULL and a value stored for all users.
[02:55] <salgado> stub, agreed. I'm already changing it. :)
[02:55] <salgado> stub, btw, should the UPDATE statements be moved to a separate sql script and moved to the pending/ directory?
[02:56] <ddaa> jamesh: clearing vcs import details appeared to work with your branch, but then setting them back again causes an oops
[02:56] <stub> UPDATES are fine in the database patches provided they don't modify the sample data, and are required if you are setting the column to NOT NULL.
[02:57] <salgado> I see
[02:57] <ddaa> jamesh: actually, just posting the form w/o change causes an oops: http://launchpad.dev/products/a52dec/failedbranch/+source
[02:57] <ddaa> as Foo Bar
[02:58] <ddaa> jamesh: test coverage for +source/+sourceadmin is seriously lacking, so do not assume that not breaking tests means it's good.
[02:58] <salgado> stub, how about teams; what rationale do you think we should use for them?
[02:59] <stub> Hmm... I guess the field makes no sense for teams, so the column should be NULLable but with a check constraint CHECK (creation_reason IS NULL = teamowner IS NULL). Sound reasonable?
[03:00] <salgado> yeah, I think so
[03:00] <ddaa> stub: hey, can you give some love to the db patch in sftp://devpad.canonical.com/home/warthogs/archives/david/launchpad/remove-gnuarch? It's in the DBA review queue and has r=SteveA already
[03:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62612 in soyuz "Need a drescher disk space strategy" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62612
[03:01] <sabdfl> stub: is it a text field, or a combination reason int not null, comment text nullable?
[03:02] <stub> sabdfl: combination int and comment text
[03:02] <sabdfl> cool
[03:02] <salgado> stub, shouldn't it be CHECK (creation_rationale IS NULL = teamowner IS NOT NULL)?
[03:03] <stub> salgado: yes
[03:04] <salgado> stub, https://devpad.canonical.com/~andrew/paste/file0TTwYT.html ; I'm adding the comments now, btw
[03:10] <stub> salgado: Will those updates mess with your sample data, or will it just reset the values?
[03:12] <salgado> stub, no, the branch includes a patch to the sampledata too
[03:13] <stub> salgado: See if make sampledata still works after building a fresh database with your patch and the updated sample data.
[03:14] <salgado> stub, the current sampledata doesn't have the rationale for validated accounts, but I'll add them and it should pass, I think
[03:16] <SteveA> ddaa: ping
[03:16] <stub> If the patch screws the sampledata rebuilding, then we need to move the UPDATES to a post rollout data migration script and delay adding the CHECK constraint until a future rollout.
[03:17] <ddaa> SteveA: I'm about to go out to the photographer
[03:17] <ddaa> back in < 1h
[03:17] <salgado> stub, hmmm. I don't see what you mean. isn't it enough to just update the sampledata to not break the new constraint?
[03:18] <stub> salgado: There is a catch-22 situation in how the sample data is rebuilt. I can't quite recall the details unfortunately :-(
[03:20] <bradb> stub: If I \e'd a query, then quit postgres, how can I get the whole query back? \e'ing again brings up an empty editor, and line-by-line copy-and-pasting the readline history is against my religion.
[03:20] <stub> bradb: Dunno if you can.
[03:21] <bradb> hrm. blasphemy it is.
[03:23] <stub> ddaa: Huh. I missed that earlier because it is flagged merge-approved
[03:26] <salgado> stub, updated sampledata works fine with this patch: https://devpad.canonical.com/~andrew/paste/file6i8b5C.html
[03:26] <salgado> (same as the previous one, but added a name to the constraint)
[03:27] <stub> salgado: So rebuilding the sample data again works, and the diff between current.sql and newsampledata.sql does not show anything alarming? If so, r=stub
[03:28] <stub> salgado: patch-67-21-0.sql
[03:28] <salgado> stub, actually, I didn't try rebuilding the sampledata... I changed it manually. I'll see if I can rebuild it
[03:29] <salgado> yeah, it rebuilt just fine
[03:29] <salgado> thanks stub
[04:22] <kiko-zzz> hello hello
[04:30] <malcc> Morning kiko. Any thoughts on https://launchpad.net/products/soyuz/+bug/62612 ?
[04:30] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62612 in soyuz "Need a drescher disk space strategy" [Critical,Confirmed]
[04:30] <kiko> let's see.
[04:33] <kiko> malcc, I think that's something the distro team is best equipped to give consel on, but why don't we just throw away anything that's more than a month old?
[04:34] <malcc> kiko: Doesn't sound unreasonable
[04:35] <kiko> malcc, historically, have uploads from before that period been useful?
[04:36] <malcc> kiko: Sometimes useful, but not usually vital. A couple of times when builds have gone missing or other odd data artifacts have turned up, it's been useful to check what was originally uploaded
[04:36] <kiko> malcc, even for builds that are more than a month old?
[04:36] <malcc> kiko: I can think of one time I looked at something at least that old, but it wasn't vital that it was still there.
[04:36] <malcc> kiko: We could go for three months, we've got space for that and at least it's finite
[04:37] <kiko> malcc, fine by me as well. how much would that save today?
[04:37] <malcc> kiko: Probably around 100 gigs, don't know exactly
[04:37] <kiko> wow
[04:38] <kiko> malcc, should we chat a bit now about effects of the rollout?
[04:38] <malcc> kiko: Sure
[04:39] <kiko> malcc, privmsg or ##soyuz1.0?
[04:39] <malcc> kiko: How about ##soyuz1.0?
[04:39] <jgi> hi everyone
[04:39] <kiko> y not
[04:39] <kiko> yo jgi
[04:39] <jgi> I'm trying to upload a new template for the WengoPhone project, but I don't see anything in the import queue
[04:40] <jgi> Could you please tell me where I should check if I've done something wrong?
[04:40] <kiko> jgi, sounds odd. matsubara can you give him a hand?
[04:41] <carlos> kiko: I can take care of that, don't worry
[04:41] <carlos> jgi: hi
[04:41] <kiko> cool
[04:41] <jgi> carlos, hi
[04:41] <carlos> jgi: where did you upload it?
[04:41] <jgi> kiko, thanks!
[04:41] <jgi> carlos, here: https://launchpad.net/products/wengophone/trunk/+pots/qtwengophone/+upload
[04:42] <carlos> jgi: that's the right place
[04:42] <carlos> let me check...
[04:46] <carlos> jgi: hmmm, I guess it's not this file: http://librarian.launchpad.net/4519061/qtwengophone_en.po (I think our system changed the filename, so don't pay attention to it)
[04:48] <carlos> jgi: I don't see any other entry that failed or was imported recently for wengophone
[04:49] <carlos> jgi: if that's the file you uploaded.... it looks broken
[04:49] <carlos> it contains translations and the file format seems like is not completely correct...
[04:52] <jgi> carlos, hmmm...
[04:53] <jgi> carlos, the file I uploaded does not contain any translation
[04:54] <carlos> jgi: this one contains just one string as translation and a lot of "              " for the other strings:
[04:54] <carlos> #:
[04:54] <carlos>             AIMSettings
[04:54] <carlos>         #2
[04:54] <carlos> msgid ""
[04:54] <carlos> ""
[04:54] <carlos> "                Password:"
[04:54] <carlos> "            "
[04:54] <carlos> msgstr ""
[04:54] <carlos> "                Pasvorto:"
[04:54] <carlos> "            "
[04:54] <carlos> it's the second message
[04:54] <carlos> our system says that that file was imported by wengo launchpad bot
[04:55] <jgi> ok, it must have been imported a while ago
[04:55] <carlos> and the date when it was generated was on 2006-09-27 12:05+0200
[04:55] <carlos> that's today
[04:55] <jgi> ok, indeed, this file may well be wrong
[04:55] <jgi> but the last one I uploaded is probably fine, and it's different
[04:56] <jgi> for example
[04:56] <jgi> here's the entry for Password:
[04:56] <jgi> #: AIMSettings#2 GoogleTalkSettings#2 JabberSettings#2 LoginWindow#5
[04:56] <jgi> #: MSNSettings#2 SimpleIMAccountManager#1 SubscribeWengo1#9 SubscribeWengo2#4
[04:56] <jgi> #: YahooSettings#1
[04:56] <jgi> msgid "Password:"
[04:56] <jgi> msgstr ""
[04:56] <carlos> that looks better
[04:56] <carlos> let me check again...
[04:57] <WebMaven> SteveA: ping
[04:57] <carlos> jgi: could you tell me what do you have in the header of that file for 'POT-Creation-Date' ?
[04:57] <jgi> carlos, 2006-09-27 14:06
[05:00] <carlos> jgi: I don't see any trace of that file in our system
[05:00] <carlos> neither as failed, imported or waiting for being approved
[05:00] <carlos> did you see the confirmation message?
[05:00] <jgi> yes, this is what I found in the import queue
[05:00] <jgi> yep, I got the confirmation message
[05:01] <carlos> could you try again?
[05:01] <jgi> sure
[05:01] <jgi> done
[05:01] <carlos> thanks
[05:01] <carlos> jgi: I see it now
[05:01] <carlos> https://launchpad.net/rosetta/imports/+index?target=products&status=NEEDS_REVIEW&type=pot
[05:02] <carlos> hmm
[05:02] <carlos> I don't know what happened the first time...
[05:02] <carlos> jgi: did you tried it more than once?
[05:02] <jgi> carlos, yes
[05:02] <jgi> weird
[05:02] <jgi> anyway
[05:03] <jgi> thank  you very much, I'll drop you a line if the problem reappear
[05:03] <carlos> kiko, SteveA: Is there anyway to debug a file upload based on our system logs?
[05:03] <carlos> jgi: thanks
[05:03] <carlos> kiko, SteveA: either apache or zope ones
[05:05] <kiko> carlos, no, though it depends on what you mean by debug.
[05:06] <carlos> kiko: well, know whether a file upload was actually done
[05:06] <carlos> without errors
[05:07] <kiko> carlos, hmmm, not entirely sure. I guess the apache log would log a 200 versus a 500 maybe?
[05:07] <carlos> no idea
[05:26] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62632 in launchpad "Jabber account should be obsfucated like email addresses" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62632
[05:27] <ddaa> Is someone here willing to have a pre-impl chat with me about some interesting bit of cscvs (yes, there are some).
[05:27] <ddaa> ?
[05:30] <stub> bradb: Do you think Ian's problem is common? I was wondering if we need a data migration script that unsubscribes anyone from a bug they are explicitly subscribed to if they are implicitly subscribe to it.
[05:31] <bradb> stub: His filter seems somewhat specific.
[05:31] <stub> (not that this will help Ian, so I'll check and run that migration tomorrow when my brain is working)
[05:31] <bradb> stub: We could consider doing that explicit -> implicit migration though...
[05:33] <stub> something to sleep on. Might do some possible harm as well as possible good.
[05:37] <matsubara> cprov-lunch, malcc: time for a quick review (40 lines) that fixes OOPS-269C298?
[05:37] <Ubugtu> https://devpad.canonical.com/~jamesh/oops.cgi/269C298
[05:38] <malcc> matsubara: Yes
[05:38] <matsubara> malcc: https://sodium.ubuntu.com/~andrew/paste/fileKK72c1.html
[05:41] <malcc> matsubara: Yes, looks fine to me
[05:45] <matsubara> malcc: sending to pqm. thanks!
[05:47] <jordi> danilos: hey man
[05:54] <jordi> danilos: ping?
[05:55] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62634 in launchpad "Tags returned by find_tags_by_class have unexpected .string value when tag contains another tag" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62634
[06:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62635 in rosetta "Feature request: Template categorization" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62635
[06:18] <kiko-afk> carlos, almost finished the refactoring!
[06:19] <kiko-afk> wooo!
[06:19] <carlos> that's good news!!!
[06:19] <carlos> do you need help with test fixes?
[06:21] <kiko-afk> carlos, I may. I still need to get form posting to work again
[06:21] <kiko-afk> my work dropped about 300 lines in total!
[06:21] <carlos> cool
[06:21] <kiko-afk> carlos, do you know if there are any alt language suggestions for evolution?
[06:22] <carlos> as long as we don't miss any feature :-P
[06:22] <kiko-afk> in sampledata?
[06:22] <kiko-afk> or is there a url where I can test alt language?
[06:22] <carlos> kiko-afk: any language with translations is enough
[06:22] <kiko-afk> I'm currently testing using
[06:22] <kiko-afk> http://localhost:8089/products/evolution/trunk/+pots/evolution-2.2/es/+translate?start=0&alt=ab
[06:22] <kiko-afk> but because form posting is broken I can't add any :-(
[06:24] <carlos> kiko-afk: that template doesn't have any other translation
[06:24] <trappist> I've just noticed a doc on an xmlrpc interface for filing bugs.  are there plans for similar interfaces for finding, updating, modifying etc. existing bugs?  or does such a thing already exist?
[06:25] <kiko-afk> carlos, do any template have?
[06:25] <kiko-afk> trappist, there are plans but no implementation yet.
[06:26] <carlos> kiko-afk: http://launchpad.dev/distros/ubuntu/hoary/+source/pmount/+pots/pmount/
[06:27] <carlos> kiko-afk: chose any language there and use as alt= any other language code from that list
[06:27] <kiko-afk> woo, awesome
[06:27] <kiko-afk> thanks
[06:31] <kiko-afk> carlos, can I replace:
[06:31] <kiko-afk> Croatian (Alternate Language):
[06:31] <kiko-afk> with just
[06:31] <kiko-afk> Croatian:
[06:31] <kiko-afk> ?
[06:31] <kiko-afk> the parenthesized text doesn't really add much
[06:31] <kiko-afk> even if the user is confused as to why it's there
[06:32] <kiko-afk> the text doesn't really tell him
[06:32] <carlos> Well, Mark choose that label. It adds from where it comes
[06:32] <carlos> but I see your point
[06:32] <kiko-afk> from where it comes is great
[06:32] <carlos> anyway, we need to improve those labels
[06:32] <kiko-afk> yeah.
[06:33] <kiko-afk> I'm all for keeping Croatian
[06:33] <carlos> to note 'Comes from upstream' and things like that
[06:33] <kiko-afk> sure
[06:33] <kiko-afk> but that could be added to the string or as a note
[06:33] <cprov> matsubara: ping
[06:33] <kiko-afk> not the bold title
[06:33] <kiko-afk> okay, I'll do it, complain later :)
[06:33] <carlos> ;-)
[06:33] <matsubara> cprov: pong
[06:34] <cprov> matsubara: a similar fix is in my `buildd-ui`, see https://devpad.canonical.com/~jamesh/pending-reviews/cprov/launchpad/buildd-ui/full-diff
[06:36] <cprov> matsubara: can you merge them, the use of ID for the <div> is very interesting because you can use pagetest-helpers, which makes the tests more robust, IMO.
[06:37] <cprov> matsubara: what do you think ?
[06:37] <matsubara> cprov: indeed, but I already sent to pqm with r=malcc
[06:38] <carlos> danilos: hi, around?
[06:38] <cprov> matsubara: no problem, I will wait and merge into mine.
[06:39] <cprov> matsubara: please, request the cherrypick
[06:41] <kiko-afk> right please do so
[06:42] <matsubara> cprov: ok.
[06:42] <cprov> matsubara: thanks
[06:44] <jordi> danilos: ping?
[06:49] <matsubara> cprov: btw, I don't think you need to import the pagetest helper functions. they're available in the pagetest namespace.
[06:49] <cprov> matsubara: yes, just figured it out (exactly this minute), thank you ;)
[07:16] <carlos> kiko-fud: I need to leave now, please, mail me if I should do anything with your branch or if you merge it so I can resume TranslationReview
[07:27] <danilos> jordi: pong
[07:27] <kiko-afk> BjornT, are you around?
[07:28] <BjornT> hi kiko-afk
[07:28] <kiko-afk> BjornT, quick question. you know setupWidgets(), right? are the form elements' names always prefixed by "field."? is there a way around that?
[07:30] <BjornT> kiko-afk: i don't think there is any easy way around it. it's possible to changed 'field.' to something else, but if you pass in an empty prefix, you'll get the field names prefixed with '.' (e.g. '.fieldname')
[07:30] <kiko-afk> BjornT, okay, never mind then. I'll adapt the client code.
[07:33] <danilos> anyway, going out now
[08:47] <zeeeee> hi all, how do i get the code for a project, eg https://launchpad.net/products/newt/? can i see the src using my web browser, or do i need bazaar? (what command(s) should i use on baz to check out the files?)
[08:51] <matsubara> zeeeee: $ bzr branch http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/newt/main should work
[08:56] <zeeeee> thanks matsubara
[09:05] <Ubugtu> New bug: #62663 in malone "Subscribed bug does not show on subscribed bugs list" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62663
[10:30] <kiko-afk> whew
[10:30] <kiko-afk> I think form posting now works.
[10:39] <salgado> BjornT, still around?
[10:39] <BjornT> salgado: yeah
[10:40] <salgado> BjornT, about the issue with urls_and_rationales and registered_origins, I was thinking about a simple test to check that all values of the latter are keys of the former, but I'm not sure where to place it
[10:41] <salgado> BjornT, would a test like that be okay and, if so, do you have any suggestion on where to place it?
[10:44] <Mez> hey - I've had a think. Wouldnt it be possible for rosetta to sync *.pot/*.po files from KDE's SVN ...
[10:44] <Mez> solving a major "political" issue between the 2 projects ?
[10:45] <BjornT> salgado: it was such a test i was looking for, so yes, it'd be ok. if you can't find a suitable place to put it, maybe put it in the view class' docstring?
[10:47] <salgado> BjornT, yeah, I thought about the view docstring too. guess it's okay for now
[10:52] <seb128> Mez: the political issue being that changes don't go back upstream?
[11:03] <kiko-afk> WOO! IT WORKS!
[11:03] <Mez> seb128, that and when it's changed in KDE it doesnt change in ubuntu
[11:03] <kiko-afk> man
[11:03] <kiko-afk> this SO COOL
[11:03] <seb128> Mez: an import from the SVN will not change that
[11:04] <Mez> seb128, but it could be sorted so it adds the stuff back to SVN - surely ?
[11:04] <seb128> if upstream accept to have rosetta commiting to the SVN
[11:04] <seb128> dunno about KDE but GNOME translator would not like that for sure
[11:05] <Mez> lol
[11:05] <seb128> they have some proof-reading, etc
[11:05] <Mez> well I'll have words ;)
[11:05] <seb128> rosetta quality is usually lower
[11:06] <Mez> seb128, probably ;) but it could even just email out the translations to mailing lists or something something would be nice
[11:06] <Mez> rather than nothing
[11:06] <seb128> right
[11:06] <lifeless> SteveA: who is richard wilbur ?
[11:06] <seb128> I've already discussed about that with carlos too
[11:06] <Mez> and what was said ?
[11:06] <Mez> if you dont mind me being nosy
[11:06] <seb128> Mez: it has nothing to do with sync from SVN though
[11:07] <seb128> it was said they are working on it
[11:07] <Mez> fair enough... but a sync from svn would be nice aswell ;)
[11:07] <seb128> they just have lot to do and not many people
[11:07] <seb128> sync from svn is nice
[11:07] <Mez> you already have it ?
[11:07] <seb128> it just doesn't fix the diff with upstream issue, nor the quality issue
[11:07] <seb128> no
[11:07] <seb128> "would be nice" rather
[11:07] <Mez> ;)
[11:08] <Mez> seb128, true but it's a step in the right direction - surely?
[11:08] <Mez> anyways - I tg to work :(
[11:12] <ddaa> hi lifeless
[11:12] <ddaa> I'm redesigning svn_oo.ChangesIterator, and I'd like your input to be sure I'm not being over complicated
[11:13] <ddaa> lifeless: can we have a preimpl chat on that?
[11:27] <lifeless> ddaa: yes, tonight
[11:28] <ddaa> okay, that is my tomorrow morning then
[11:29] <lifeless> you have skype ?
[11:30] <lifeless> (asterisk is still unspeakable quality for me)
[11:30] <ddaa> yes
[11:30] <lifeless> I'm rbtcollins
[11:30] <ddaa> though I'd prefer a text chat for that, since it's a seriously hairy matter
[11:30] <lifeless> we can do both
[11:40] <Docta> hey
[11:41] <Docta> i have a problem
[11:41] <Docta> can anyone tell me how i would install a program on ubuntu
[11:42] <matthewrevell> Docta: Hello - you're most likely to get a good answer in #ubuntu
[11:42] <matthewrevell> Docta: This channel is for launchpad.net
[11:43] <Docta> oh ok
[11:43] <Docta> what OS do you use
[11:44] <ddaa> lifeless: okay, I asked for your authorization
[11:44] <LarstiQ> ddaa: lifeless just went to aikido
[11:45] <ddaa> hrm
[11:46] <ddaa> s/heel/hell/
[11:47] <ddaa> LarstiQ: changeset processing is probably the most tricky problem I had to tackle
[11:47] <LarstiQ> I feel I'm missing context here?
[11:48] <ddaa> I'm just talking generally, I'm rewriting the bit of cscvs that interprets svn log entries to apply changes to a bzr tree
[11:48] <ddaa> and doing it right becomes quite hairy very quickly
[11:49] <ddaa> I have some consolation knowing that TreeTransform is one of the most voodoo parts of bzr
[11:49] <ddaa> and that generating changesets from cvs is MAJOR voodoo
[11:50] <ddaa> so it seems that anything that deals with creating or applying changeset just has to be complicated
[11:51] <LarstiQ> but patch and diff are so simple! *curses at hunks failing to apply*
[11:51] <ddaa> hum hum
[11:52] <ddaa> there was some discussion on bzr some time ago about diff implementation, and it looked far from simple
[11:52] <ddaa> not talking of patch, which AFAIK is just utterly non-correct, but has the right heuristics that make it work most of the time
[11:53] <ddaa> and there is indeed something out there that applies patch whenever possible, it's called "darcs" and very little people really understand what it actually does...
[11:54] <LarstiQ> so I understand you're having fun?
[11:54] <ddaa> some sort if highly geeky fun
[11:55] <ddaa> the sort that sends you to a padded room when you abuse it
[12:00] <mpt> Gooooooooooooooooood morning Launchpadders!


[05:19] <pragomer1> would you say 18.04 daily is "nearly" ready to use as semi-produtive system for an more experi. user or not?
[05:43] <pragomer1> will have 18.04 a better hidpi support or will this take some releases?
[05:58] <flocculant> pragomer1: as far as 'nearly ready' I've been using it more months, nothing major has happened to break it in all that time - ymmv, not sure about hidpi though


[04:12] <orbisvicis> I've added this ppa, and I'm wondering why I can't see "binutils-2.24-5ubuntu6", which according to launchpad is [1] successfully built [2] published last month [3] for trusty (my version) [4] built on i386 (my arch)
[04:12] <orbisvicis> ppa:ubuntu-toolchain-r/test
[04:13] <orbisvicis> according to https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-toolchain-r/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+sourcepub/4281528/+listing-archive-extra
[04:49] <cjwatson> orbisvicis: ubuntu-toolchain-r/test ~= ubuntu-toolchain-r/ppa
[04:49] <cjwatson> er !=
[04:50] <cjwatson> if you added only the former then you aren't going to see packages only published in the latter
[04:57] <orbisvicis> oh
[05:06] <orbisvicis> didn't realize they were different ppas
[05:06] <orbisvicis> cjwatson: these are semi-official repositories. Do you know if it would be ok to mix test/ppa ?
[05:07] <cjwatson> No idea.  doko might.
[05:07] <orbisvicis> doko: ping
[05:07] <orbisvicis> my hunch is probably
[05:07] <cjwatson> I wouldn't have thought that it was really safe to use ubuntu-toolchain-r/test at all, though.
[05:08] <cjwatson> You know, test builds and all.  Could be arbitrarily broken.
[05:09] <orbisvicis> true but ubuntu-toolchain-r/test only updates gcc. afaik gcc is user-only, so it couldn't break the system or any packages
[05:10] <orbisvicis> maybe dkms ?
[05:10] <cjwatson> libgcc1 is used by practically every binary on the system.
[05:11] <orbisvicis> hmm
[05:11] <cjwatson> And there's no guarantee that the set of packages in a test PPA will remain constant
[05:11] <cjwatson> Those are generally meant for build tests, not for people not familiar with the test in question to use
[05:11] <cjwatson> Well, build and does-it-work tests
[05:15] <orbisvicis> looks like I laready jumped off the deep end / no harm mixing in ppa as well.
[05:16] <orbisvicis> I need a version of gcc that fixes a bug in 4.8.2 (trusty) and is compiled with cloog/isl support (test)
[05:18] <orbisvicis> and I need a version of binutils that works with LTO (2.24.5ubuntu6), I think. autoconf is being dumb and ignoring AR=
[05:36] <orbisvicis> ah well thanks
[05:36] <orbisvicis> see how it goes after a reboot
[07:30] <Ghost1227> quick question... in 14.04, the places sidebar was moved from nautilus to gtk, does anyone know what actual package that was moved to?
[09:49] <Noskcaj> charles, Is there any chance of you porting indicator-power to upower 0.99 this cycle?
[09:50] <Noskcaj> It's the only thing blocking the transition
[10:06] <melodie> hi
[10:09] <melodie> I would like to request a mentor for a remix project (Bento, aka Ubuntu Openbox Remix). I was wondering if an Ubuntu developer would accept this hard task? :D
[10:10] <melodie> I just had the idea to jump here to ask, while filling a list of packages and default configuration files to be put into packages
[10:14] <darkxst> melodie, hi
[10:14] <melodie> the goal is to switch from doing remixes with end user tools such as Ubuntu builder to tools on build server
[10:15] <darkxst> I suspect you might get more help here, asking about very specific problems that you are stuck on ;)
[10:15] <melodie> darkxst you here! hello!
[10:15] <darkxst> melodie, I am everywhere!
[10:15] <melodie> darkxst will do eventuelly, later, for now I am working on the files which contain the lists
[10:15] <darkxst> well if ~10 channels counts
[10:16] <darkxst> melodie, you should be working on your seeds ;)
[10:16] <melodie> yes it counts :)
[10:16] <melodie> darkxst the lists come before seeds, I can't do seeds as long as I don't have everything packaged and I need to do packages starting from something: that's the lists
[10:17] <melodie> the lists are online, I'll just update them now
[10:19] <melodie> darkxst within a week or so I'll create a new account on the LP for the project and the ppa
[10:20] <melodie> darkxst can we discuss in private for a few minutes?
[10:23] <darkxst> melodie, ok, but ping me in 15mins
[10:23] <melodie> done :D
[11:03] <JEEB> I guess this is the utopic channel. I wonder if anyone else has a 1st gen macbook (the intel core duo one) around - I'm seeing various issues with the 3.16 kernel with it and I'd like to check if I'm the only one
[11:04] <JEEB> basically I think it's a single issue (probably related to the intel video driver), and it happens during boot
[11:04] <melodie> JEEB the Lubuntu team just asked for testers with Mac machines, you might want to check the qa-lubuntu ml
[11:04] <melodie> ?
[11:05] <melodie> https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-qa
[11:05] <JEEB> melodie, that seems to be PPC
[11:06] <JEEB> at least looking at the thread name
[11:06] <JEEB> > *** NEED PPC TESTERS URGENTLY *** (?)
[11:06] <JEEB> and then there's ppc and amd64+ mac testers call
[11:06] <JEEB> and I'm neither
[11:06] <JEEB> core duo is IA32-only
[11:06] <JEEB> :D
[11:06] <melodie> possible, though my guess is that all users of machines having MAC are probably very welcome (and here is not specifically Unicorn so, you could also join #lubuntu on freenode)
[11:07] <JEEB> ok
[11:07] <JEEB> I just noticed #ubuntu-next was empty
[11:07] <JEEB> so I looked at the InternetRelayChat wiki article linked @ #ubuntu's topic
[11:07] <JEEB> so which is the utopic channel?
[11:09] <JEEB> oh right
[11:09] <JEEB> ubuntu+1
[11:09] <JEEB> pardon me for the intrusion :)
[11:11] <melodie> JEEB I am 100%, no 200% sure that at #lubuntu (and you can also join #phillw) your input will be used
[11:11] <melodie> and that you will be very welcome
[11:14]  * darkxst thinks most intel macs do not need a special build anymore
[11:14] <darkxst> just use the amd64 images
[11:34] <melodie> bye
[13:35] <ricotz> cjwatson, hello, i hope you could take a look at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/utopic/+source/granite/2014.2~b2-0ubuntu1 which is a rouge upload imo and overrides the original granite package
[13:35] <ricotz> cjwatson, i would appreciate if this proposed package gets removed
[13:38] <ricotz> zul, hi, please get your granite in utopic/proposed removed
[14:35] <cjwatson> ricotz: oh goodness, yes.  done
[14:35] <cjwatson> zul: ^- please use a package name that doesn't hijack something already in the archive
[14:40] <ricotz> cjwatson, thanks!
[20:37] <P-NuT> Hey all,
[20:39] <P-NuT> Is there an article describing how to make status icons in the top bar?
[21:29] <Sven_vB> i'm installing Ubuntu trusty from Live USB, and near "reticulating splines" i chroot into the target file system in order to adjust grub menu settings. my distribution name is generated by an expression that contains $(hostname -s), which currently yields "ubuntu". is there a way to change my invocation of ubdate-grub so that its lookup will yield the target hostname instead of the live session hostname, or do i absolutely have to chang
[21:29] <Sven_vB> e the distribution lookup command?


[00:05] <Guest76> does anyone know how i take the xubuntu thing off a computer
[00:09] <Guest18> does anyone know how to take the xubuntu thing off a chromebook
[00:09] <guiverc> you don't need any special tools to remove xubuntu; you just install over it
[00:14] <Guest18> how do i do that
[00:16] <guiverc> you can boot whatever other OS you have on your box; ensure it has ownership of the boot process then delete the partition previously used by xubuntu.  Xubuntu ISOs also provide tools to remove partitions (download from https://xubuntu.org/download) allowing you to delete; but ensure the other OS owns the boot process first or you risk the system not booting
[00:17] <guiverc> If you didn't use a Xubuntu install process; you'll have to check with whatever process you used to install Xubuntu; which provides support for only some architectures
[00:17] <Guest18> ok thankyou ill try to do that
[00:47] <Guest18> what is a boot proccess i could download
[19:54] <dreamon> hello. "systemctl suspend" only logs out, so I can login again. but no suspend happens
[19:56] <diogenes_> dreamon, it's systemd not Xubuntu.
[19:57] <dreamon> diogenes_, how can I debug?
[19:57] <diogenes_> dreamon, for suspend do: xfce4-session-logout --suspend
[20:01] <dreamon> diogenes_, dont work. its a little bit differnt. seeing wallpaper. Pressing strg+alt+f1 and strg+alt+f7 shows login.. but same behavior it dont supsends.
[20:03] <dreamon> I use a thinkpad notebook it went to repair. and used hdd images on a hp notebook. there I installed a hwe kernel and a nvidia driver. and my supend got lost.
[20:04] <dreamon> now I have my thinkpad back and, remove hwe stack kernel. but suspend not works anymore.
[20:04] <diogenes_> dreamon, try this:
[20:04] <diogenes_> !acpi_osi
[20:34] <dreamon> diogenes_, no luck. but one thin -> pm-suspend works .. but it dont locks screen at wakeup


[12:16] <fschoep> troy_s: ping
[12:18] <joejaxx> :(
[12:18] <fschoep> joejaxx: do you want to chat?
[12:18] <joejaxx> sure
[12:18] <joejaxx> about what?
[12:18] <fschoep> No idea
[12:19] <joejaxx> lol
[12:19] <joejaxx> think of something lol
[12:19] <fschoep> I just said something because you posted that smiley
[12:20] <joejaxx> oh :\
[12:20] <fschoep> I don't necessarily want to chat, I'm waiting for troy_s
[12:20] <fschoep> :)
[12:21] <joejaxx> oh ok :)
[12:21] <fschoep> You go and find some entertainment in another channel ;)
[12:21] <fschoep> I'm going to do some stuff
[12:21] <fschoep> :)
[12:25] <fschoep> troy_s: I'm sitting, waiting, wishing
[12:37] <fschoep> troy_s: ping
[12:39] <fschoep> troy_s: I'll be back in about twenty minutes, at the changing of the hour
[12:43] <Viper550> Does anyone here have SVG source code for the "close" button in the Human icon set?
[01:02] <fschoep> troy_s: ping
[01:17] <fschoep> troy_s: last ping probably, it's about 1:15 here and I'm thinking of sleeping
[01:30] <fschoep> troy_s: really
[01:32] <joejaxx> maybe he is just afk
[01:32] <fschoep> Really?
[01:32] <fschoep> I didn't think of that ;)
[01:32] <joejaxx> lol ;)
[01:32] <fschoep> troy_s uses a bouncer so he's always online
[01:33] <joejaxx> ah
[01:33] <fschoep> And I'm in the Netherlands and he's in Canada or so so we don't meet a lot on IRC
[01:33] <fschoep> but I could use his advice right now
[01:38] <fschoep> troy_s: last try, then I'm off to bed
[01:51] <fschoep> troy_s: ?
[01:53] <fschoep> troy_s: hope to catch you tomorrow, good night though (it's 02:00 now)
[02:58] <Viper550> Does anyone have an SVG of the Human close icon?
[11:55] <fschoep> troy_s: ping
[01:33] <effraie> hello
[02:09] <fschoep> troy_s: ping
[02:09] <fschoep> effraie: hello
[02:09] <troy_s> fschoep
[02:09] <troy_s> here for  second
[02:10] <fschoep> troy_s: OK a second is enough
[02:21] <klepas> good evening
[02:21] <klepas> or morning/afternoon as the case might be :)
[03:05] <lapo> hi
[07:24] <effraie> hello
[07:25] <effraie> is the wiki accessible for you? (not for me, but FF talk me about psm, so maybe it's a bug in edgy)
[07:31] <effraie> is somebody here?
[09:01] <effraie> is somebody here?
[09:18] <joejaxx> i am here
[09:20] <joejaxx> effraie: ping?
[09:21] <effraie> hello
[09:21] <joejaxx> hello
[09:21] <effraie> can browse the wiki now?
[09:21] <joejaxx> can i have your opinion on something
[09:21] <joejaxx> what wiki?
[09:21] <effraie> wiki.ubuntu.com
[09:22] <effraie> yes, you can ;)
[09:22] <joejaxx> yes it works for me
[09:23] <joejaxx> effraie: what do you think of this ?
[09:23] <joejaxx> http://fluxbuntu.usplash.png
[09:23] <effraie> the url is wrong
[09:24] <joejaxx> whoops lol
[09:24] <joejaxx> http://fluxbuntu.org/usplash.png
[09:24] <effraie> look good
[09:25] <effraie> but, why do you not use new usplash capabilities?
[09:25] <joejaxx> effraie: i have not upgraded fluxbuntu to dapper yet
[09:25] <joejaxx> i mean
[09:25] <joejaxx> edgy
[09:25] <joejaxx> since there is still a month before it releases
[09:25] <effraie> of course
[09:26] <effraie> would fluxbuntu be available for ppc?
[09:27] <effraie> can browse the wiki now?
[09:28] <joejaxx> effraie: we are developing a PowerPC version
[09:28] <effraie> cool
[09:28] <joejaxx> effraie: what browser are you using?
[09:28] <joejaxx> mozilla?
[09:28] <effraie> firefox 2.02 (on edgy)
[09:30] <joejaxx> effraie: oh i have no idea about that
[09:30] <joejaxx> effraie: i do not use edgy as of the moment
[09:30] <effraie> but can you browse it, or not?
[09:32] <joejaxx> yes i can
[09:32] <effraie> thanx
[09:32] <joejaxx> you are most welcome
[11:55] <fschoep> cbx33: ping
[11:55] <cbx33> fschoep, pong pong pong
[11:55] <cbx33> got some new ol buddy
[11:56] <fschoep> cbx33: I sent off an e-mail to Mark
[11:56] <cbx33> fschoep, recall it
[11:56] <fschoep> cbx33: oh dear
[11:56] <fschoep> cbx33: that's unfortunate
[11:56] <cbx33> see my pm
[11:57] <cbx33> for the reason
[11:57] <fschoep> in pm
[12:03] <fschoep> troy_s: are you around by chance?


[04:22] <oerheks> yay dungeons2 giveaway @ gog https://www.reddit.com/r/linux_gaming/
[04:32] <oerheks> and DalekSec is back \0/
[07:13] <ducasse> good morning, all
[11:23] <BluesKaj> Hi folks
[12:26] <oerheks> hi gals & girls & bots
[12:29] <BluesKaj> Hey oerheks
[12:30] <oerheks> hi BluesKaj :-D
[12:33] <oerheks> leaving google-chrome running overnight, gives 10 zombies
[12:33] <BluesKaj> really?
[12:34] <oerheks> yeah, i wasn't able to paste one line.. then checked top
[12:37] <BluesKaj> chrome has been acting up here , slow to show bookmarks in the drop downs etc 0
[12:52] <oerheks> ahh, it got a build-in user-blocker
[12:52] <oerheks> .. and an add-blocker
[12:56] <BluesKaj> yup
[13:00] <BluesKaj> my son is cming to visit and we're gona install a new mobo with i5 cpu, just trying to figure out the best method to convert from BIOS/MS DOS to UEFI/GPT '''saving my home dir to the outboard drive to start, then we'll go from there


[08:22] <niluje> thanks smoser :) let's review your review
[10:34]  * Putti got added to the contributor agreement group! :)
[10:37] <niluje> smoser: I still don't understand anything to the launchpad interface, but all your comments have been addressed :)
[10:38] <niluje> I cant rebase my commits into one if you want me to
[11:12] <Putti> oh, the tox tests take like 5-10 min to run :/
[11:12] <Putti> they are contacting the outside world?
[11:39] <Putti> whee, first merge request done. Was kinda tedious – I have to look up if I can integrate it somehow with my command-line flow.
[11:51] <niluje> Putti: if you are doing some hacking/debugging
[11:51] <niluje> run tox -e <env>
[11:51] <niluje> like tox -e py27
[11:51] <niluje> or to run a single test tox -e py27 -- cloudinit/unittest/xxx.py
[11:52] <niluje> or tox -e py27 -- cloudinit/unittest/xxx.py:Classname or Classname:test_name
[11:52] <Putti> ok
[11:52] <niluje> or call nose directly: .tox/py27/bin/python -m nose --tests cloudinit/unittest/xxx/.py -x -s
[11:53] <niluje> tox has always been super slow for me for everything
[11:54] <Putti> niluje, but maybe huge part of the slowness is just that it contacts all the web servers?
[11:56] <Putti> for me the test tries to contact google but fails
[11:57] <Putti> maybe the slowness is because of this: "FAIL: test_get_data_returns_false_if_not_on_gce (tests.unittests.test_datasource.test_gce.TestDataSourceGCE)"
[11:58] <Putti> I will link the full log, a minute...
[11:58] <Putti> http://paste.debian.net/plain/976118
[12:03] <Putti> The ISP I am currently connected redirects to their own web page if the resource is not found, maybe the unit test gets confused by this?
[12:08] <niluje> lol
[12:08] <niluje> anyway IMO a unittest should never hit a network resource
[12:09]  * Putti agrees with that
[12:09] <niluje> but I'm pretty sure they don't
[12:09] <Putti> I guess a temporary fix is for me to use different dns.
[12:09] <niluje> which env is it? py27?
[12:09] <Putti> correct
[12:09] <Putti> py27
[12:10] <niluje> sec
[12:11] <niluje> yeah nevermind
[12:13] <niluje> but I guess if you find the place where a network resource is hit, cloud init maintainers will be interested in a fix
[12:15] <Putti> not too hard to find: cloud-init/tests/unittests/test_datasource/test_gce.py :)
[12:15] <Putti> I might look into how to fix it
[14:51] <powersj> Putti: if you find a test is escaping out to the network please file a bug. However, I am fairly certain nothing attempts to get out.
[14:51] <powersj> Those calls should be mocked, as those metadata services should not available outside the cloud providers network
[14:58] <Putti> it seems like the GCE test mocks the request but somehow it lets the dns request pass through.
[15:01] <blackboxsw> Putti: I can peek at that today too if you don't end up tackling it
[15:04] <Putti> blackboxsw, thanks, I'm pretty new to cloud-init and also I have very minimal experience with unit tests in python so if you just have time it would be nice. Though, I'm so curious about this problem, so we will see if I figure out the fix (in case one is needed) for this before you.
[15:24] <blackboxsw> Putti: +1 and welcome to the club, I'm relatively new to cloud-init too.  Putti appreciate your efforts fire off any questions you might have and we can field them. to speed unit test debug cycles you can put a pdb.set_strace() over in the unit test you care about and tox -e py3 -- --tests tests.unittests.test_datasource.test_gce.TestOpenStackDataSource -s
[15:24] <blackboxsw> Putti: +1 and welcome to the club, I'm relatively new to cloud-init too.  Putti appreciate your efforts fire off any questions you might have and we can field them. to speed unit test debug cycles you can put a pdb.set_strace() over in the unit test you care about and tox -e py3 -- --tests tests.unittests.test_datasource.test_gce.TestDataSourceGCE -s
[15:25] <blackboxsw> put you probably already know that
[15:25] <Putti> I actually didn't know that, thanks :)
[15:25] <blackboxsw> *but...   I need to go find my typo-free keyboad
[15:25] <blackboxsw> :)
[15:32] <Putti> blackboxsw, I have some ideas for a possible fix. 1. We could mock cloudinit/url_helper.py's readurl() in the test_gce.py so that "allow_redirects=True" will be changed to False. Or the metadata.google.internal domain could be changed to <IP_ADDRESS> (this seems to be some sort of special ip) like some other datasource tests already do.
[15:37] <blackboxsw> Putti: checking that unit test now to see exactly what you mean.
[15:40] <Putti> Here is some information about the magic ip address: https://askleo.com/why_cant_i_connect_with_a_169254xx_ip_address/
[15:46] <blackboxsw> right that address, <IP_ADDRESS>, is link local, which means those packets (if they hit your network) shouldn't be forwarded beyond your router. so expectation is that link-local ips will timeout on your local  network. But in the interest of expedience in unit tests, instead of long timeouts we should cut those tests off to avoid lengthy timeout waits. (or we should ensure that our timeout length is as
[15:46] <blackboxsw> small as possible.
[15:47] <blackboxsw> s/cut those tests off/mock those external queries to 169.254.*.* so that the expected response is immediate/
[15:48] <Putti> the question is: how do we do that?
[15:48] <Putti> ooh, I see, mocking them
[15:48] <Putti> mhm, but aren't they already mocked? It is just dns that is slowing down, and now there is no dns
[15:49] <Putti> I mean if we use ip address
[15:54] <Putti> Hmm, I wonder if this is something that should be fixed in one of those http request mocking python modules we use. But as a temporary fix for us would be removing host names and use ip addresses instead.
[15:56] <blackboxsw> Putti yeah strange about your pastebin. Since that unit test is mocking platform_reports_gce() to return False, I'm not certain why your env is attempting to access metadata.google.internal hostname
[16:02] <blackboxsw> hmm Putti that mock doesn't really work it seems. If I put a pdb.set_trace() in  cloudinit/sources/DataSourceGCE.py get_data():
[16:02] <Putti> yes it doesn't ... I got a new idea why, a minute!
[16:02] <blackboxsw> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/1xAbn5DV/
[16:02] <blackboxsw> we shouldn't get there if we .tox/py3/bin/python3 -m nose --tests tests/unittests/test_datasource/test_gce.py:TestDataSourceGCE.test_get_data_returns_false_if_not_on_gce -x -s
[16:02] <blackboxsw> but we do
[16:03] <blackboxsw> yeah that mock setup in that test is broken
[16:04] <Putti> I'm trying now adding "_set_mock_metadata" to the test
[16:04] <Putti> erm "_set_mock_metadata()"
[16:06] <Putti> mhm, I guess there is no point in adding that... I guess I need to focus on reading the code for a minute :P
[16:09] <blackboxsw> Putti: can you test this patch? http://paste.ubuntu.com/25076047/
[16:09] <Putti> yes, a moment
[16:12] <blackboxsw> yeah I don't like mocks, they don't always behave as you'd expect them. In the case of this unit test the setUp() declared the mocked return_value for cloudinit.sources.DataSourceGCE.platform_reports_gce as True. Then the subsequent unit test tried to override that return value incorrectly to False.
[16:12] <blackboxsw> using the patch decorator on the specific unit test we can ensure that the unit test has properly overridden that return_value to False instead of setUp's "True".
[16:14] <blackboxsw> the problem with our tests was that our broken mock as actually still returning True for platform_reports_gce() so get_data() was attempting to perform all those queries against metadata.google.internal which it never should have gotten to
[16:15] <Putti> paste.ubuntu.com requires you to login (which doesn't work without javascript) if you want to see the plaintext without javascript. Another moment.
[16:16] <blackboxsw> oops
[16:18] <Putti> git doesn't seem to like the patch
[16:18]  * Putti does the changes manually
[16:22] <Putti> blackboxsw, the patch works, though no idea what it does :D
[16:23] <Putti> aha, ok, I read your explanation now, and it makes sense
[16:23] <Putti> thanks!
[16:24] <blackboxsw> Putti: awesome. So that @mock.patch is me telling the specific unit test to mock the  DataSourceGCE.platform_reports_gce  within our unit test only. Then I set return_value = False there to the mocked method. This ensures the unit tests overrides the mock which was established in setUp()
[16:24] <blackboxsw> yeah no prob
[16:24] <blackboxsw> thanks for finding the bug and working through it w/ me
[16:24] <Putti> :)
[16:24] <blackboxsw> you can file a merge proposal if you want with that patch and I'll approve and land it if you'd like to go through the process. Or I can, either way
[16:25] <Putti> blackboxsw, you should do it, you're the author
[16:26] <blackboxsw> Putti could  you please file a bug against and link your initial problem paste then :) gotta get you some karma for finding this issue and bringing it to us. (and we need bugs associated w/ any cloud-init fix)  https://login.launchpad.net/08ubw7bY4m0DWmsi/+decide
[16:27] <Putti> sure, bug report coming soon
[16:27] <blackboxsw> https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+filebug rather
[16:27] <blackboxsw> thanks again
[16:30] <powersj> blackboxsw: can you send me a pastebin of the mount image callback stuff
[16:30] <Putti> blackboxsw, https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+bug/1703935
[16:31] <blackboxsw> awesome thank you again
[16:32] <Putti> not very nice view: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/328486103/error .. Maybe I should have added .txt extension.
[16:33] <nacc> Putti: is that for the bug attachment?
[16:33] <nacc> Putti: edit it and mark it as text/plain instead?
[16:33] <Putti> nacc, yes
[16:33] <Putti> doign that :)
[16:33] <nacc> Putti: it's currently text/html which is probably wrong :)
[16:33]  * nacc has an open self-bug for lp-attach to fix that in that particular tool :)
[16:51] <Putti> do you know if I can file somewhere a bug against paste.ubuntu.com ?
[16:54] <Putti> nvm, https://launchpad.net/canonical-pastebin ... but it seems that it is not under a free license :(
[17:20] <blackboxsw> smoser: still working on ipv6 support. scaly implementation looks easy on an already configured interface with a valid broadcast over UDP was easy with scaly http://paste.ubuntu.com/25064349/.
[17:20] <smoser> blackboxsw, i think that the dhclient paht is probably sane as a first pass.
[17:20] <smoser> freebsd is affected too though and need to think about that.
[17:21] <blackboxsw> but, this requires that the interface is already up and configured. using dhclient  and cleaning up after seems the lowest hanging fruit as unicast packet sending on a raw socket requires a bit more reading for me (couple days probably()
[17:22] <blackboxsw> smoser: +1 and centos dhclient supports a slightly different set of cmdline options that we'd have to account for (minimally "-I" is interpreted differently )
[17:24] <dpb1> blackboxsw, smoser: first pass making dhclient-capable distros work seems sane.  This isn't working anywhere that I know of?
[17:24] <dpb1> (on aws)
[18:25] <smoser> blackboxsw, powersj i guess we could/should run c-i 'tox' at least with networking taken down.
[18:28] <Putti> +1
[20:30] <jhodapp> I'm curious if there's any special way of loading certain kernel modules via cloud-init or if I might simply use modprobe to do so in the free form command run section of the yaml config file?
[20:31] <larsks> jhodapp: that should work (using runcmds, or just submitting a /bin/sh script in place of or in addition to the YAML file)
[20:32] <jhodapp> larsks, ok, so there's really not any special provision for doing so
[20:32] <larsks> Right.
[20:32] <jhodapp> ok
[22:15] <smoser> blackboxsw, https://code.launchpad.net/~chad.smith/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/327325 you can push that if you want.
[22:16] <blackboxsw> thx smoser, I have a working dhclient client run using your WIP branch on aws + a new dhcp_request_clean() function in cloudinit/net/_init_.py.
[22:17] <smoser> nice
[22:17] <blackboxsw> just polishing off a simple dhclient-script that could-init would deliver to ensure no other side-effects come from run-hookos
[22:17] <blackboxsw> just polishing off a simple dhclient-script that could-init would deliver to ensure no other side-effects come from run-hooks
[22:17] <blackboxsw> s/polish/pollish?
[22:32] <smoser> blackboxsw, do you have something pushe d?
[22:32] <blackboxsw> smoser will pull it down from my aws instance and push in a min
[22:33] <smoser> yeah
[22:37] <blackboxsw> smoser: a junker WIP for the moment https://code.launchpad.net/~chad.smith/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+ref/aws-dhclient
[22:38] <blackboxsw> I hacked up  the assign_ipv4_link_local context manager to call the dhcp_request_clean()


[17:55] <pleia2> AlanBell: is there some wiki settings you need to be able to select a preferred theme?
[22:54] <AlanBell> pleia2: good point, there is a setting somewhere, and yes, I can't flip themes on the u-w wiki either
[22:55] <pleia2> AlanBell: maybe in the /etc configuration file? I could just go back to them and say "we can't pick our theme" but I fear such a vague response will lead them into research mode and we won't hear back, better to give them a solution if we can
[22:58] <AlanBell> I agree, and it is somewhere in the /etc/moin bit


[00:03] <gnumbknuts> ali1234: re: gmb. Would putting a symlink in the /home/user/music folder that pointed to other places that media may be stored, allow gmb to follow that link ?
[00:03] <ali1234> no idea
[00:03] <ali1234> gmb allows you to set multiple scan directories
[00:04] <gnumbknuts> Oh, I thought that was the problem, that gmb would only scan one directory.
[00:04] <ali1234> no
[00:21] <Unit193> Remastering isn't too hard.
[00:38] <gnumbknuts> Unit193: It may not be for Devs, but looking at the Ubuntu-wiki, it is way over the top for me :{
[00:43] <gnumbknuts> Ali1234: I put a symlink in the music folder that points to the video folder, Exaile has no problem with that. I will need to install gmb to see if it, too, will follow the link.
[00:43] <ali1234> i expect it would
[00:43] <ali1234> you'd have to go out of your way to make it not
[00:43] <Unit193> Well, not precisely the deviest dev.
[00:47] <gnumbknuts> BTW... who does the packaging for Xubuntu-daily.iso(s)? Is this done by Canonical ?
[00:47] <Unit193> Building the ISOs?  That's the Canonical/Ubuntu build system, yes.
[00:47] <Unit193> !info livecd-rootfs
[00:48] <gnumbknuts> So pretty much I, and everyone else, will need for them to update the daily with the sylinux files ?
[00:49] <ali1234> everything is built on canonical infrastructure, that is what it means to be an official flavour vs an unofficial respin
[00:50] <ali1234> two more tests done: rhythmbox: 12 minutes, quod libet: 11 minutes
[00:50] <ali1234> and i rebooted between each test so this is not the effect of disk cache
[01:17] <gnumbknuts> ali1234: installed gmb, it too, can follow the symlink ; however it will only show audio files that it supports ; and thus, if a folder contains none, then the folder will not appear. Decibel-player has not problem either ; but something I did not know about Decibel, is that it can play the audio from mp4 video files. :)
[01:18] <ali1234> gmb shows files it can't play on my system
[01:18] <ali1234> weirdly they play fine in rhythmbox, even though they both use gstreamer
[01:18] <ali1234> i do not understand this, i'll be investigating it further in a later test
[01:19] <Unit193> ali1234: Try Aqualung! :-----D
[01:20] <gnumbknuts> I'm using, in gmb, the Exaile layout with the files tab open. gmb version is the one from staging.
[01:21] <ali1234> banshee just finished importing. 11 minutes
[01:23] <ali1234> Unit193: Package aqualung is not available, but is referred to by another package.
[01:24] <Unit193> Partially why I was joking, I have it in a staging PPA but it does not seem like the greatest client IMO.
[01:39] <gnumbknuts> Unit123: re: livecd-rootfs, is the package able to rebuild an iso with the extra files ? I can not find much info about it, nor those other packages like "live-image-xfce-desktop" .
[01:40] <ali1234> exaile: 6 minutes!
[01:40] <Unit193> ali1234: If you're really bored, ppa:unit193/staging and try aqualung from there, see if it can do faster.
[01:41] <Unit193> If you aren't, no real need to I suppose.
[02:02] <ali1234> audacious: 4 minutes. they are getting faster... weird
[02:38] <gnumbknuts> "they are getting faster... weird" . If you have ever wondered about artificial intelligence, then look no further that an "ant trail". Notices how over time how the trail corrects its self. Obviously, the music players are following each other, but slithly correcting them selves every time. That's my theory...
[06:39] <ochosi> morning folks
[06:40] <elfy> morning ochosi
[06:50] <gnumbknuts> It's alive!, it lives! I managed to repackage the xubuntu-daily.iso with the syslinux packages; fired up usb-creator-gtk to make a bootable usbstick; and guess what? It works :)
[06:51] <Noskcaj> Do we know what xfce packages are getting another point release soon? I'd like to start backporting git patches from things that aren't
[06:54] <gnumbknuts> Unit193: the convoluted method wasn't so bad after all. Once the image is mounted as a live system on the host system, it is just a matter of using the apt-get package commands.
[07:16] <ochosi> Noskcaj: what git patches are you thinking of specifically?
[07:17] <Noskcaj> Nothing specific really, but i've heard of fairly important fixes in thunar and xfdesktop, and i doubt that's all
[07:50] <ochosi> not sure what's planned wrt those two
[07:51] <ochosi> for thunar i thought that bluesabre already included the patch (or at least he was looking into that) that fixed the crashes on moving/copying files
[07:52] <Unit193> 1.6.6-1ubuntu2 in staging, I presume.
[08:54] <ochosi> Unit193: yes, not sure it's the latest rev though
[10:48] <bluesabre> ochosi, Unit193: yes, thats the latest revision of that patch
[10:52] <ochosi> bluesabre: was that the one that worked or the one you reported some issues against?
[11:08] <bluesabre> ochosi: the issue I reported is a different bug it seems
[11:08] <bluesabre> many different bugs causing copy/move/paste to segfault
[11:08] <bluesabre> elfy: Do you know if https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-panel/+bug/1385624 has been resolved?
[11:14] <knome> hey bluesabre, ochosi
[11:15] <knome> let's fix the website :]
[11:15] <knome> the development subteams at http://xubuntu.org/contribute/ are broken now
[11:15] <knome> in the sense that they do not make sense for some part; documentation and translation should be in one page
[11:16] <knome> artwork should probably be its own page
[11:16] <knome> and marketing and promotion mashed up with the website team, unless we consider that the subteam of those
[11:16] <bluesabre> and we can finish the lp descriptions as well
[11:16] <knome> or maybe the promotion part should be renamed...
[11:17] <bluesabre> but I gotta go get ready for work now, bbl
[11:17] <knome> it basically says that the promotion is telling your friends about xubuntu
[11:17] <knome> it is *not* a xubuntu subteam as is
[11:17] <knome> so maybe it should go with support, as it originally was, iirc
[11:17] <knome> originally being... around 2008-2009
[11:17] <knome> http://xubuntu.org/?page_id=3076
[11:18] <knome> ^ for those of you who are logged in
[11:18]  * slickymasterWork logs in
[11:19] <ochosi> sorry folks, same here, gotta run
[11:19] <knome> duh :P
[11:20] <slickymasterWork> knome, if I'm understanding it correctly http://xubuntu.org/?page_id=3076 isn't live presently
[11:20] <knome> yes, that's right
[11:21] <slickymasterWork> yeah, I agree with you, doc and translation should on a page of its own
[11:22] <slickymasterWork> and it would be just a matter of refreshing that page content
[11:22] <knome> i don't think that the page content necessarily needs a big refresh
[11:22] <knome> but if you feel like it, feel free to poke it
[11:24] <slickymasterWork> by refreshing it I mean, check how accurate/up-to-date is the content and correct it if need knome
[11:24] <knome> yep
[11:24] <knome> iirc, we relatively lately updated it
[11:24] <slickymasterWork> I just read it diagonally
[11:25] <slickymasterWork> screencasts
[11:25] <knome> hm?
[11:26] <slickymasterWork> never thought of those as potentially being part of the -docs tasks/actions/work
[11:26] <knome> i don't think that is exactly realistic for any team to do
[11:26]  * knome shrugs
[11:26] <slickymasterWork> yes, realistic would be the key word here
[11:28] <slickymasterWork> knome, you have fiddle with that page for sure, all the links are pointing to the right pages
[11:28] <slickymasterWork> including to the latest changes to our process page
[11:29] <slickymasterWork> IMO, the page content is right as it is, and I can't see any issues preventing it from going live´
[11:30] <knome> yep ;)
[11:30] <slickymasterWork> lol, here's a prove of your hand on it -> Xubuntu 15.04   Xubuntu Vivid Vervet Beta 2
[11:30] <knome> that's the website footer :P
[11:31] <knome> what would you feel about of this:
[11:31] <knome> in addition to the subteam listing
[11:31] <knome> make another subsection
[11:31] <knome> which said
[11:31] <slickymasterWork> I know, I just didn't want to disclose Last edited by Pasi Lallinaho on .....
[11:32] <knome> "Even if you couldn't contribute *to* Xubuntu, you can help us by doing one of the following things:"
[11:32] <knome> then proceed with a list of support places people can help at and mention they can promote xubuntu as much as they can
[11:32] <knome> last can==want
[11:33] <slickymasterWork> why the past tense at the beginning of the sentence knome: even if you couldn't...?
[11:33]  * knome shrugs
[11:34] <knome> don't stick to the irrelevant things
[11:35] <slickymasterWork> I try not to, thing is it seems paradoxal withing the sense of the rest of it
[11:35] <knome> huhu
[11:36] <slickymasterWork> it's like we're assuming that someone hasn't yet been able to contribute yet, but they can then do something from the list
[11:37] <slickymasterWork> and could be prone to be misread, or misinterpreted
[11:37]  * knome shrugs
[11:37] <knome> yes mister language police
[11:37] <knome> my main point was
[11:37] <slickymasterWork> nah
[11:37] <knome> what if we separated the support and promotion stuff from the main list
[11:37] <slickymasterWork> yes, I do agree with your underlying point
[11:38] <slickymasterWork> but by separating do you mean to have another distinct page?
[11:38] <knome> no
[11:38] <knome> just another subsection on the main page
[11:39] <slickymasterWork> ok I was going to say that in the main page would be preferable
[11:39] <slickymasterWork> not to lose readers/users attention by having to navifate to yet another page
[11:40] <slickymasterWork> * navigate
[11:40] <knome> http://xubuntu.org/?page_id=3081
[11:41] <slickymasterWork> exactly
[11:42] <slickymasterWork> knome, can we continue after lunch?
[11:42] <slickymasterWork> I have a medical appointment at 13:00
[11:42] <knome> not sure i'm around then, but you can surely poke the stuff then
[11:43] <slickymasterWork> ok
[11:43] <slickymasterWork> gotta run now
[11:43] <slickymasterWork> ->
[11:45] <elfy> bluesabre: I guess I'm not seeing it when I boot livesessions - and it used to show up there
[11:59] <elfy> knome: http://xubuntu.org/?page_id=3076 ... our guidelines and good conventions for Xubuntu translations page
[11:59] <knome> yes?
[11:59] <elfy> implies that we also have some bad conventions to me :)
[11:59] <knome> lol
[11:59] <knome> maybe we do...
[12:00] <elfy> then please make sure to document them and link on the same page :D
[12:00] <knome> i will
[12:00] <elfy> should lose the good in the meantime
[12:01] <knome> mhm
[14:17] <ochosi> Unit193: just a reminder to schedule the next meeting
[14:17] <elfy> irony :p
[14:17]  * ochosi will be mostly offline for the next week btw (easter holidays so very little computarrrs)
[14:17] <ochosi> elfy: ;)
[14:21] <elfy> ochosi: btw - since last xfpm upgrade - not complaining about crashes
[14:21] <ochosi> so things are fine again?
[14:22] <ochosi> havent had much chance to play with anything lately tbh
[14:23] <ochosi> only noticed that eric fixed one bug stemming from upower not delivering any device info
[14:23] <elfy> seems to come back from suspend and lock ok now
[14:24] <ochosi> nice
[14:24] <ochosi> and weird
[14:24] <ochosi> no xfpm changes related to that
[14:24] <ochosi> so maybe a kernel bug to begin with?
[14:24] <ochosi> or systemd
[14:25] <elfy> possible systemd
[14:25] <elfy> not kernel - or if kernel intermittent
[14:27] <elfy> last systemd update here saturday not sure when I spoke to eric
[18:11] <ali1234> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/W/DefaultMediaPlayer <- i've rotated the table so it fits better and added the import test results
[18:57] <Unit193> Meh...
[20:36] <Unit193> If that's all that is on the agenda, no need to have it right now.
[20:43] <elfy> so last meeting then ... what's " updating the team/subteam descriptions on Launchpad shortly to conform to a standard layout" even about - only thing I've seen about that is a line or two in the logs and a link to a pad
[20:45] <Unit193> https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev for example has a description of the team, they want to update them or at least look at them and make sure they all make sense.
[20:45] <elfy> the 'they' again
[20:45] <knome> elfy, see https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-website
[20:46] <knome> that was something i put up, and something i worked on with bluesabre
[20:46] <knome> basically just to make everything more usable and point people to resources where they can get started with contributing
[20:47] <elfy> mmm
[20:48] <elfy> I love the decision making processes here lately
[20:48] <knome> lol
[20:48] <Unit193> LP isn't really the place to have that information, though.
[20:48] <knome> Unit193, noo, it's just a place to point people to that information
[20:48] <elfy> no - a meeting and/or mailing list is
[20:49] <elfy> otherwise 2 or 3 of us could just ditch stuff like gmb that probably no-one uses
[20:49] <Unit193> Still, don't think LP is the right place to point to.
[20:50] <knome> Unit193, that has the new information.
[20:50] <knome> elfy, this isn't something like a default application change, this is something that reads on our website or a related page
[20:50] <Unit193> Good for it.  < Unit193> Still, don't think LP is the right place to point to.
[20:50] <elfy> I assume that's just an example knome pointed me at
[20:50] <knome> elfy, it's also acked by ochosi if you mean you'd rather have seen a team discussion
[20:51] <knome> i mean i don't consider it a biggie, and if somebody else wanted to improve stuff like that, i wouldn't mind them just going at it
[20:51] <elfy> knome: there just appears to be a lot of 'a couple of people and ochosi' talked in some other place about something - so we're going to do it like that now
[20:52] <elfy> we're either a community or we're not
[20:52] <knome> surely.
[20:52] <Unit193> So it's more of where it was discussed.
[20:52] <elfy> what's the point in having xubuntu-team
[20:52] <Unit193> Or, wasn't.
[20:52] <elfy> well - wqasn't
[20:53] <knome> Lastlog:
[20:53] <knome> 13:14  bluesabre: http://pad.ubuntu.com/xubuntu-subteams Let us know if you  have any feedback for the proposed layout
[20:53] <knome> and yes, i noted you said meeting/ML
[20:53] <knome> but i don't think every small thing should be clogged up that path
[20:53] <knome> if you do, then we disagree here
[20:54] <knome> my best intentions are to improve stuff and *get it done*
[20:54] <knome> this is comparable to the qa team updating a testcase
[20:55] <knome> no need to let everybody weigh in on every discussion
[20:55] <elfy> I hardly think so
[20:55] <Unit193> FWIW, I dislike LP pages with long "descriptions."
[20:55] <knome> Unit193, right, having seen that description in use, i can probably agree it's a tad long. that said, it's revertable, so...
[20:55] <elfy> unless the QA team had a testcase had a testcase that listed how teams do things then globally changed them without saying anything
[20:55] <slickymaster> well, qa always do ping someone when they fiddle with a testcase knome
[20:56] <knome> slickymaster, and we pinged "someone" too when working on the LP description updates
[20:56] <Unit193> knome: Right, but the first appearance of the whole thing is a pad link in a meeting.  And sure, but..
[20:56] <slickymaster> not saying you didn't
[20:56] <knome> Unit193, so do you think it would have been better to not do anything before the meeting?
[20:57] <knome> i mean, if nothing was done, we could have started that only after the meeting, which would have meant the work would have been postponed to at least the next meeting
[20:57] <Unit193> elfy: To be fair, that's a "How to get involved with QA" type of thing, not changing how it's done but "correcting" documentation on how it's currently being handled.
[20:57] <knome> where we would have asked for comments in the same way...
[20:57] <elfy> knome: my issue is that all of these are presented to the rest of us as a fait accompli
[20:58] <Unit193> knome: Didn't say meeting, but many people idle in here, if I somehow missed it, fine then, but I don't think I did.
[20:58] <elfy> you even go so far as to say ochosi acked it - which is just like saying - we're doing this this way
[20:58] <knome> elfy, i hardly see it as such
[20:58] <knome> we worked on it and had a proposal; then we asked for comments
[20:59] <knome> there was "this is what we are going to do without your consent" type of thing
[20:59] <Unit193> So you'd say, rather than acked, agreed or liked it?
[21:01] <Unit193> http://xubuntu.org/contribute/ would be a better page, IMO.
[21:01] <knome> Unit193, i don't understand that.
[21:01] <knome> Unit193, we aren't replacing anything with the launchpad descriptions
[21:02] <knome> it's just an additional source of information.
[21:02] <Unit193> Fine, well be that as it may, -1.
[21:03] <knome> i've landed this to the website team for two reasons 1) it's the team i'm leading and can edit the branding 2) this will let me see how it looks in action
[21:03] <Unit193> Sure.
[21:04] <knome> and as i said, this probably isn't as good as i thought it was
[21:04] <knome> i think we need to cut it down to probably just the basic tasks and a link to the contribution page
[21:05] <knome> we can go through more or less bureaucratical processes to get something like this decided, or then just see how it looks
[21:05] <knome> i guess the logical question for the future is: do we need the team to approve all content changes in the website in the future?
[21:06] <elfy> as I said, it's not so much the detail, but the way it's put across, maybe the way you write and I read
[21:06] <elfy> knome: if it makes a difference to how we as a whole are perceived then I'd say yes
[21:07] <elfy> anyway - another day for me
[21:07] <knome> elfy, i don't mean to surpass the teams influence in any way
[21:08] <knome> elfy, but i try to avoid too much bureaucracy on things
[21:08] <knome> elfy, it depends on the status quo too; if the descriptions were consistent already, then of course it would have needed more thorough investigating (unless it was a minor fix)
[21:09] <elfy> a launchpad page is the last place I would look for detail on something like this
[21:09] <knome> elfy, but currently, the descriptions are "what they are", they date far or not so far in the history, but afaui, they have never really been considered as an entirety
[21:10] <elfy> it's the wronn place
[21:10] <knome> elfy, what if somebody lands on that page, for what ever reason, first?
[21:10] <knome> do we just not tell them how to contribute? (or what the team does)
[21:10] <elfy> then the same information needs to be available on wiki, lp, mailing list, irc
[21:10] <elfy> or the argument is false
[21:10] <knome> the same information is available in the website
[21:11] <knome> where we have intentionally focused this
[21:11] <knome> eg. the one place to read how to start contributing
[21:11] <elfy> so why switch focus?
[21:11] <knome> and this LP page links there
[21:11] <knome> we aren't switching focus
[21:11] <knome> we are adding one more outlet where we link to that information
[21:12] <elfy> wanting to add
[21:12] <elfy> anyway - night all
[21:12] <Unit193> Why not *just* link to the website?
[21:12] <knome> i think it's sane to have short descriptions of the teams in LP, since LP memberships are the ones that decide what you *can do* in many cases
[21:12] <knome> Unit193, that's a fair comment, and one that i also said to be probably wiser than what we proposed
[21:13] <knome> Unit193, ....which is why we asked for feedback
[21:13] <knome> night elfy
[21:13] <Unit193> Alright.  If for no other reason, then if something changes less places to change it.
[21:14] <knome> artwork currently says:
[21:14] <knome> The Xubuntu Artwork Team is responsible for creating the custom themes, graphics, splashes, and branding for the Xubuntu project. The artwork team wiki is located at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Artwork
[21:14] <knome> Please note that only users who have contributed to Xubuntu perpetually will be approved to the team.
[21:14] <knome> To start contributing, join us at #xubuntu-devel or the Xubuntu development mailing list and introduce yourself as well as your skill set. Thanks for your interest and understanding.
[21:15] <slickymaster> I'm also of the opinion that it's a bit too much knome
[21:15] <knome> slickymaster, yep.
[21:16] <knome> see the website team now
[21:16] <Unit193> Maybe more like  This team does foo  To get involved with this team, seehttp://xubuntu.org/contribute/
[21:17] <knome> Unit193, or maybe see the website team now? (:
[21:17] <slickymaster> yeah, the website team option is a more sane one
[21:17] <knome> but "to this team" sounds good
[21:17] <Unit193> Works for me™
[21:18] <slickymaster> ditto Unit193
[21:18] <knome> i approve.
[21:18] <knome> :P
[21:19] <knome> updated pad
[21:19] <knome> ochosi, comments...
[21:19] <knome> ochosi, @ http://pad.ubuntu.com/xubuntu-subteams
[21:19] <knome> ochosi, see how it looks @ https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-website
[21:20] <knome> btw, we should get the empty marathon-rs project dropped
[21:20] <knome> (why i asked if anybody saw nick lately)
[22:41] <bluesabre> Folks got chatty around here :)


[14:39] <holmanb> minimal: I was out the last couple of days, I'll catch up on the conversation later today
[14:54] <holmanb> eb3095-Vultr: it sounds like you maybe got a resolution to your issue, but in case you wanted to test out pr 2060, what should prevent falling back to DataSourceNone with that change is to make sure that your datasource_list has only [DataSourceVultr], if None is in the list, it will fall back to None
[14:58] <eb3095-Vultr> Yeah, I built off of main and gave it a shot and it was the same behavior, even saw the changed message about being the only configured datasource.
[15:00] <holmanb> eb3095-Vultr: that pr isn't in main, though it probably will be soon
[15:01] <eb3095-Vultr> ah my mistake then, thanks for the info
[15:02] <holmanb> welcom
[15:02] <holmanb> welcome


[12:38] <Questioneer> hellow
[12:39] <Questioneer> [07/15/12 14:28] <Questioneer> hello, I'm having a problem with the mount privileges
[12:39] <Questioneer> [07/15/12 14:28] <Questioneer> I can mount using sudo but I can not mount/unmount using nautilus
[12:39] <Questioneer> [07/15/12 14:28] <Questioneer> I am added to the FUSE group