[07:01] <micahg> can someone set bug 192092 to triaged please?
[07:01] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 192092 in firefox-3.0 "ctrl+shift+pg.up/dn does not move tabs" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192092
[07:15] <micahg> can someone please set 209509 to triaged
[07:15] <micahg> oops
[07:15] <micahg> bug 209509
[07:15] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 209509 in firefox-3.0 "<input type=file> does not accept textual input" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209509
[07:20] <kwall> Do suspend/resume bugs go into the pm-utils package?
[07:21] <micahg> kwall: I think they go into the linux package
[07:21] <micahg> but
[07:22] <micahg> it probably depends on the type of bug
[07:22] <micahg> !bug | kwall
[07:22] <ubot4`> kwall: If you find a bug in Ubuntu or any of its derivatives, please file a bug using the command « ubuntu-bug <package> » If that fails, you can report bugs manually at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug - Bugs in/wishes for the bots can be filed at http://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-bots
[07:23] <micahg> kwall: also try this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
[07:23] <kwall> micahg: Thanks. was triaging some bugs and came across a suspend/resume bug.
[07:23] <DanaG> hmm, I have some bugs that don't seem to have been "officially" replied to at all; anything I can do about them?  Right now, I have just one main one I can think of right now.
[07:24] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/284319
[07:24] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 284319 in linux "mute, brightness buttons on new HP 6930p laptop" [Undecided,New]
[07:26] <micahg> DanaG: generally, it's good practice to open a new bug for a new issue, while the issues themselves were the same, you had different hardware
[07:27] <DanaG> Actually, the base cause is exactly the same.  Same keycode, same product line, same drivers in Windows.
[07:28] <micahg> I would suggest opening a new bug for each issue that you are still experiencing
[07:28] <DanaG> oh, but yeah, there are two actual _behaviors_ described.
[07:28] <DanaG> One's the "keycodes rejected" -- that may only be fixed with xinput 2; the other is the fdi file.
[07:29] <micahg> yes, but aren't the modifications for each piece of Hardware different?
[07:29] <DanaG> Nope, should be able to just match for EliteBook.  All models should have that in the name.
[07:29] <DanaG> oh yeah, and the mute-LED gpio issue is another separate issue.  Right.
[07:30] <micahg> Yes, but the original bug was for HP hardware, is elitebook HP?
[07:30] <DanaG> yeah.
[07:30] <micahg> ok
[07:31] <micahg> well, I'm not familiar with the hardware packages, so I would suggest coming back during the day and asking again
[07:31] <DanaG> EliteBook line has 12" non-tablet 2530p, 12" tablet 2730p, 14" 6930p, 15" 8530{p,w}, and 17" 8730w.
[07:31] <micahg> ah
[07:31] <micahg> so, you might be just fine then, i apologize
[07:31] <micahg> but
[07:32] <micahg> I would suggest coming back when a triager familiar with hardware is in
[07:32] <DanaG> I do have a couple of actual symptoms described, though -- true enough.
[07:32] <DanaG> The list: FDI file needs tweaking, Xorg rejects >255 (has a link to a relevant report), and mute LED.
[07:34] <YoBoY> good morning
[07:34] <kwall> YoBoY: good evening
[07:35] <YoBoY> hi kwall :)
[07:36] <micahg> YoBoY: you familiar with hardware bug triage?
[07:37] <YoBoY> i'm only familiar to annoying posters when the bugs are old in this type of bug ^^"
[07:38] <YoBoY> but i can take a look...
[07:39] <micahg> DanaG was having an issue with bug 284319 not being responded to
[07:39] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 284319 in linux "mute, brightness buttons on new HP 6930p laptop" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/284319
[07:40] <DanaG> take a look at scrollback a bit.
[07:40] <DanaG> I do realize that there are a couple of issues... but the easiest one to fix is the fdi file.
[07:41] <YoBoY> yep
[07:42] <YoBoY> if you want to learn more about it, i have a link : http://people.freedesktop.org/~hughsient/quirk/index.html
[07:43] <DanaG> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/hal-info/tree/fdi/information/10freedesktop/30-keymap-hp.fdi
[07:43] <DanaG> already fixed in git.  yay.
[07:43] <YoBoY> :)
[07:44] <DanaG> heh, lots of duplication between tx2 and business tablet.
[07:44] <kwall> That's all the damage I can do for one night.
[07:45] <DanaG> I've also created my own script to tell me status of ambient light sensor -- it fires that event when you hit the toggle key, but the toggle itself is in firmware or hardware.
[07:46] <YoBoY> i can't help more for this type of bugs :]
[07:46] <YoBoY> if it's related to the bug, put your script on it
[07:47] <YoBoY> to help others
[07:47] <DanaG> eh, that script won't be useful until userspace can actually receive F23.  =þ
[07:47] <DanaG> I tweaked my own fdi file to make it use a reachable keycode.
[07:47] <YoBoY> ok :D
[07:54] <KhaaL> hey all, i'd like to submit a bug regarding the systray widget in kde4, which package is it?
[07:56] <micahg> KhaaL: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage#Find%20the%20program%20executable
[07:57] <KhaaL> micahg, why thank you! =)
[08:01] <micahg> KhaaL: no problem
[08:01] <KhaaL> hmm, i'm having trouble knowing *which* package i should submit the bug against still... using xprop gives me the "Plasma", which is too general. and there seem no package beginning with plasma in the repos that seems relevant
[08:02] <KhaaL> should i just report it against kubuntu-kde4-desktop?
[08:02] <micahg> kdebase-plasma
[08:03] <KhaaL> thank you again micahg
[08:03] <micahg> so you should do ubuntu-bug kdebase-plasma
[08:03] <KhaaL> aye :>
[08:03] <micahg> KhaaL: Please try to be as descriptive as possible
[08:04] <micahg> Here's a link we give people to help them learn how to report bugs: http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/bugs.html
[08:04] <KhaaL> micahg, of course. would be pointless to make more work for you guys by letting you guys do half the work by just guessing
[08:04] <KhaaL> I've submitted bugs before
[08:05] <micahg> KhaaL: You would be surprised how many don't realize that :)
[08:05] <micahg> great :)
[08:05] <micahg> thank you
[08:05] <KhaaL> micahg hehe, i can imagne the frustration it breeds! ;-)
[08:06] <micahg> Would you care to help triage bugs?
[08:07] <KhaaL> I've been seriously considering that, but I don't know how confident I am that I'll do a good job in there..
[08:07] <micahg> Well, the people in here are very helpful
[08:07] <micahg> if you don't know something ask
[08:07] <micahg> and try your best
[08:07] <micahg> that's all that's required
[08:08] <micahg> and this doc: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToTriage :)
[08:08] <micahg> no pressure and no quotas
[08:08] <YoBoY> we never guess, we harass the poster with question :)
[08:08] <micahg> We just appreciate any help we can get :)
[08:10]  * micahg is off to bed
[08:15] <KhaaL> sounds fair enough! I'll look into that again, could be something I could keep myself busy with during the summer
[08:15] <KhaaL> nighty, and thanks for the help micahg
[09:24] <lowkey1979> Hey there, I've got a large problem with some bug on a new Ubuntu install. How can I get it looked at?
[12:18] <xteejx> damn freenode, blocked my ip had to telnet to my router to change the MAC so the IP changed just to get on
[12:19] <xteejx> ps afternoon guys! :)
[12:38] <xteejx> I believe there may be an error in the Wiki, references: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acpi-support/+bug/115060 (Steve states bug should be Fix Released - as a Canonical employee I tend to think he's right ;) ) and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#Bugs%20resolved%20after%20update%20or%20config%20change - did I do that wrong or should there be a note in the wiki about this? Can someone look into it please?
[12:38] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 115060 in acpi-support "Hibernate.sh broken with uswsusp and LVM swapfile" [Undecided,Fix released]
[12:42] <xteejx> leave a message for me i'm going out for lunch ill have a look when i get back if someone woiuldnt mind having a look at the above for me, i'd appreciate it :)
[12:48] <Ampelbein> xteejx: in the case of that report, there was a bug that was fixed. as steve states, the hibernation handling was faulty and removed from acpi-support to pm-utils. so the correct status is "Fix Released". "Invalid" should be used when the user updated and the problem goes away without knowing, what has caused the bug to be fixed.
[12:49] <xteejx> Ampelbein: ok, thanks for clearing that up for me :)
[12:49] <xteejx> now i'm going out for lunch lol
[14:51] <charlie-tca> asac: firefox HugDay
[14:56] <charlie-tca> Question about firefox - we have two bugs, bug 374055 is for the wrong version of ubuntu release notes
[14:56] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 374055 in firefox-3.0 "Firefox goes to the wrong version of ubuntu release notes" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/374055
[14:57] <charlie-tca> bug 274605 is for firefox giving ubuntu release notes
[14:57] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 274605 in ubufox "Firefox release notes show Ubuntu release notes" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274605
[14:57] <charlie-tca> Shouldn't 374055 be invalid since firefox should never show Ubuntu release notes?
[15:04] <YoBoY> charlie-tca: for me it's a bug on a bug, or the release notes sould show the firefox notes (first bug), or it show the releases notes of the installed ubuntu version
[15:05] <charlie-tca> The application should show the application release notes, not the distribution release notes. If it was gedit, would you expect to see Ubuntu release notes?
[15:05] <YoBoY> nop :)
[15:06] <charlie-tca> Firefox is an application. It should show firefox release notes...
[15:06] <YoBoY> i agree
[15:09] <charlie-tca> so, would 374055 be a duplicate of 274605 ?
[15:10] <blueyed> bug 274055, bug 274605
[15:10] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 274055 in gnome-session "gnome-session-save doesn't actually save the session. (dup-of: 249373)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274055
[15:10] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 249373 in gnome-session "gnome-session storing broken since intrepid" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/249373
[15:10] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 274605 in ubufox "Firefox release notes show Ubuntu release notes" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274605
[15:12] <blueyed> woops.. bug 374055
[15:12] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 374055 in firefox-3.0 "Firefox goes to the wrong version of ubuntu release notes" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/374055
[15:12] <YoBoY> charlie-tca: ho.. ok yes it's a duplicate, i don't know why it's not marked as duplicate yet, i have talked this case last week ^^"
[15:12] <YoBoY> sorry
[15:13] <YoBoY> (not realy last week... :p)
[15:13] <charlie-tca> no problem. I thought it was discussed, too. But it was another dup, I think
[15:13] <blueyed> charlie-tca, YoBoY: I don't think so.. the one is about Ubuntu release notes instead of FF ones, the other about the wrong ubuntu release notes.
[15:14] <blueyed> (haven't read everything there though)
[15:14] <charlie-tca> blueyed: if the application shows Ubuntu release notes instead of it's own, is it invalid, then?
[15:14] <charlie-tca> Why shouldn't it show it's own release notes?
[15:15] <YoBoY> blueyed: but the bug is this is not the firefox release notes in the two bugs
[15:15] <blueyed> I don't know how it's intended. but apparently two issues.. 374055 would be invalid, if 274605 is a bug.
[15:15] <blueyed> YoBoY: so I would close 374055 as invalid and refer to 274605 about being the real bug.
[15:16] <charlie-tca> Why should any application show the release notes for the disto? If gedit showed me Ubuntu release notes, I would consider it very wrong
[15:17] <YoBoY> well... the problem here is someone choose to put the ubuntu release notes on firefox, the first step is to find who and why...
[15:17] <blueyed> charlie-tca: yes, you're right.. btw: in karmic it still links to 810 release notes.
[15:17] <charlie-tca> Yes, but it is 810 Ubuntu, still
[15:17] <blueyed> maybe check changelog.Debian.gz about why and when it has been done.
[15:18] <charlie-tca> it was done versions ago
[15:18] <charlie-tca> gutsy did it
[15:19] <brunogirin> when you find a bug that is duplicate of another, what status do you change the duplicate bug to?
[15:19] <blueyed> and it's considered a bug (accepted).
[15:19] <YoBoY> i don't change the status, i mark duplicate only
[15:19] <blueyed> brunogirin: I ususally invalidate the duplicate, but it's not required.
[15:20] <blueyed> charlie-tca: are you triaging 374055 now?
[15:20] <brunogirin> blueyed: thanks, will do
[15:21] <charlie-tca> I am tryinhg to decide what to do with it
[15:21] <charlie-tca> brunogirin: change it to invalid
[15:21] <blueyed> (IMHO, invalid, and add a comment to the other bug; stating that it should not display ubuntu release notes at all). Well, maybe make it a dupe even (so it's linked better).
[15:21] <bddebian> Boo
[15:21] <charlie-tca> bddebian: hoo
[15:21] <bddebian> :)
[15:21] <micahg> blueyed: Don't change status to invalid on dups, it automatically is removed from searches
[15:22] <micahg> charlie-tca: can you mar some bugs triaged for me?
[15:22] <charlie-tca> micahg: I think that has been changed. The last time I saw a response from bdmurray, he said invalid them
[15:22] <charlie-tca> I can triage, micahg
[15:22] <micahg> charlie-tca: that doesn't make any sense though
[15:22] <micahg> If you dup a bug, LP auto invalidates
[15:23] <charlie-tca> No, it used to invalidate, I think it takes a while for it too, now
[15:23] <micahg> I've done it recently
[15:23] <blueyed> micahg: well.. but it helps when doing more advanced searches, where they might show up as "New" then. it's a controversial topic (the last time I've checked it).
[15:23] <micahg> anyways bug 209509, bug 192092, bug 339772
[15:23] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 209509 in firefox-3.0 "<input type=file> does not accept textual input" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209509
[15:23] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 192092 in firefox-3.0 "ctrl+shift+pg.up/dn does not move tabs" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192092
[15:23] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 339772 in firefox-3.0 "Firefox download manager doesn't handle torrents" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/339772
[15:25] <charlie-tca> 339772 done
[15:25] <micahg> and 209509 should probably be wishlist as well
[15:26] <charlie-tca> 192092 done
[15:28] <charlie-tca> why not medium?
[15:28]  * BUGabundo why does charlie-tca always likes to escalate bugs to medium ?
[15:28] <micahg> It's a wishlist, not a bug
[15:29] <charlie-tca> A cosmetic/usability issue that does not limit the functionality of an application
[15:29] <BUGabundo> btw guud after noon friends
[15:29] <charlie-tca> Why is it wishlist?
[15:29] <charlie-tca> it is usablility, for those who experience it
[15:29] <micahg> It's a feature request
[15:29] <gumpish> it's a bug
[15:29] <micahg> No, a bug is something previously that worked that now doesn't
[15:29] <BUGabundo> ok I want to say something too... what's the bug?
[15:30] <gumpish> that's EXACTLY the case
[15:30] <micahg> or something that is expected to work a certain way by the designers
[15:30] <charlie-tca> It is actually a regression, it worked in FF2
[15:30] <BUGabundo> charlie-tca: try to convince Mozilla of that
[15:30] <charlie-tca> from the report: It should be as easy editable as in firefox 2.
[15:31] <micahg> are we talking about the sasme bug?
[15:31] <charlie-tca> That says it was in ff2
[15:31] <charlie-tca> bug 209509
[15:31] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 209509 in firefox-3.0 "<input type=file> does not accept textual input" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209509
[15:31] <micahg> ah
[15:31] <micahg> you mentioned 192092
[15:31] <charlie-tca> 6th line of the description
[15:31] <charlie-tca> sorry
[15:31] <micahg> yes, that one could be medium I guess
[15:31] <micahg> but, it was changed by design
[15:31] <micahg> if you read upstream
[15:32] <gumpish> BROKEN by design
[15:32] <micahg> gumpish: please read upstream bug before passing judgment
[15:33] <charlie-tca> My mistake. I gave you the wrong number
[15:33] <micahg> :), it's ok charlie-tca
[15:34] <micahg> ah, how wonderful it is to ahve someone else on that wiki page :)
[15:37] <brunogirin> micahg: doing my best to fill it with green :-)
[15:39] <brunogirin> bug 337176 is already filed with Mozilla (https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=436998). How can I link the launchpad bug to the bugzilla one and what state should I change the launchpad bug to??
[15:39] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 337176 in firefox-3.0 "Firefox ignore -app option when i try to load a prism webapp. xulrunner works ok" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/337176
[15:39] <ubot4`> Mozilla bug 436998 in XULRunner "Implement "-app" parameter support for xulrunner-stub" [Major,Resolved: fixed]
[15:39] <micahg> brunogirin: Use Also Affects Project
[15:41] <micahg> and project is xulrunner, not FF
[15:41] <micahg> in this case
[15:41] <brunogirin> ok, will change that too
[15:42] <brunogirin> and considering Mozilla have a patch for it that they intend to include in the next version, what state should I change the launchpad bug to?
[15:43] <micahg> brunogirin: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Status
[15:43] <micahg> Fix Committed
[15:44] <micahg> Also, please add a note linking Bugzilla to the bug in Launchpad
[15:44] <micahg> in Bugzilla
[15:46] <brunogirin> micahg: thanks, will do
[15:50] <micahg> I actually meantu for the upstream project to be Xulrunner as well, brunogirin
[15:51] <micahg> but that should be ok
[15:51] <micahg> brunogirin: can you link Bugzilla to Launchapd?
[15:51] <brunogirin> just did
[15:52] <micahg> Yep:)
[15:52] <micahg> thanks
[15:52] <micahg> you did it just before I refreshed
[15:52] <micahg> or jsut after
[15:52] <micahg> ....
[15:52] <micahg> :)
[15:53] <brunogirin> good, that's one more green line on the wiki page then :-)
[15:53] <charlie-tca> Thanks for helping, micahg and brunogirin
[15:54] <micahg> charlie-tca: can you look at something?
[15:54] <charlie-tca> sure
[15:54] <micahg> bug 274575
[15:54] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 274575 in firefox-3.0 "[intrepid] alpha 6 - Image rendered with border in Firefox" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274575
[15:54] <micahg> I can;t reproduce
[15:55] <micahg> and mozillaforums has a comment about openoffice having a similar issue
[15:56] <xteejx> hey guys
[15:57] <charlie-tca> micahg: it is valid, but I don't how it will ever get fixed. More of a website issue than a firefox issue, I think.
[15:58] <xteejx> hi charlie-tca, micahg
[15:58] <micahg> actually I think I might have found upstream
[15:58] <micahg> it seems like a driver issue
[15:58] <charlie-tca> Hello, xteejx
[15:59] <charlie-tca> driver?
[15:59] <micahg> graphics
[15:59] <charlie-tca> ahh
[15:59] <micahg> does mozilla bug 490997 seem to be the same?
[15:59] <ubot4`> Mozilla bug 490997 in GFX: Thebes "image scaling produces grey line artifacts at some downscaling percentages" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=490997
[16:00] <charlie-tca> Yes
[16:01] <charlie-tca> I believe it is the same issue.
[16:01] <xteejx> How do I get debugging info for ppp - the logs are written up to 4GB of data transfer, and then go "dodgy" for want of a better word? Ref bug 114010
[16:01] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 114010 in ppp "pppd logs incorrect traffic stats" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/114010
[16:01] <xteejx> or is there enough to set triaged?
[16:01] <charlie-tca> Try for a gdb backtrace
[16:02] <charlie-tca> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Backtrace
[16:02] <xteejx> i assume thats for micahg
[16:02] <charlie-tca> No, yours
[16:03] <xteejx> oh right ok
[16:03] <charlie-tca> If the logs are failing, the backtrace should gather the needed info
[16:03] <charlie-tca> But they have to install debug symbols to make it work
[16:03] <xteejx> -dbg packages?
[16:04] <charlie-tca> yes.
[16:04] <charlie-tca> for ppp
[16:04] <charlie-tca> Since the logs are corrupting, we want to try to find out why
[16:04] <xteejx> ok charlie thanks :)
[16:05] <xteejx> i cant see any dbg for ppp in apt
[16:05] <charlie-tca> poor guy been asked enough if it is still a problem. Maybe backtrace will show why it happens
[16:05] <xteejx> i'm still going through all these really old ones
[16:06] <xteejx> theres ppp-dev
[16:07] <micahg> charlie-tca: bug 274575, Low -> Triaged?
[16:07] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 274575 in firefox-3.0 "[intrepid] alpha 6 - Image rendered with border in Firefox" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274575
[16:07] <charlie-tca> What is he using for a driver? It might be ppp-dev
[16:08] <xteejx> hmmmm
[16:08] <charlie-tca> sometimes the debug symbols are hidden in -dev files
[16:09] <charlie-tca> xteejx: I am not seeing enough there to actually resolve his bug, even though I am sure exists and should not happen
[16:09] <charlie-tca> micahg: done
[16:09] <xteejx> ill ask him what driver he's using and if he can try and grab a backtrace with -dv
[16:09] <xteejx> -dev
[16:10] <charlie-tca> worth a try. If he can't get a backtrace, I don't what to suggest except get people to quit asking if it still happens
[16:10] <xteejx> lol
[16:11] <charlie-tca> Perhaps a request to the kernel team to look at it? Isn't that where ppp comes from now?
[16:11] <micahg> charlie-tca: thanks
[16:12] <xteejx> charlie-tca: pass
[16:25] <xteejx> Question: Why does the Bugs/Repsonses wiki page always say "can you try with the latest Ubuntu release"? What about the LTS versions? That's something thats always confused me
[16:26] <charlie-tca> Because if it is fixed in the latest release, the SRU could be done to backport the fix
[16:26] <xteejx> ahh ok makes sense
[16:27] <charlie-tca> LTS normally doesn't get all the fixes, because you can break too much by fixing it
[16:27] <xteejx> i see, like dependencies and stuff
[16:27] <charlie-tca> yeah
[16:28] <xteejx> so LTS means Long Term Support if we can fix it :)
[16:28] <charlie-tca> Yes,
[16:29] <charlie-tca> If I am a normal user, I do not want to have to load a new version every 6 months. I want to use what I have
[16:29] <charlie-tca> and hopefully, I learn to work around the issues with it
[16:30] <xteejx> i thought it would make more sense upgrading.....its 99% safe
[16:30] <charlie-tca> It is that 1% that breaks that makes it hard on the user
[16:31] <micahg> xteejx: I actually changed that to version of Package X
[16:31] <micahg> oops
[16:31] <micahg> change it when I use it
[16:31] <xteejx> huh?
[16:31] <micahg> like if the bug is reported with FF 3.0.1
[16:31] <micahg> I will say can you try the latest version of Firefox
[16:32] <micahg> vs Ca you try the latest Release?
[16:32] <xteejx> i.e. non repo version?
[16:32] <micahg> no, repo version
[16:32] <micahg> FF is backported
[16:32] <micahg> some things aren't
[16:33] <micahg> haha, the confirmed at triaged lines on the hug day page have kissed :)
[16:33] <charlie-tca> That only works with a very few applications. Most of the apps are not updated to latest versions in Ubuntu, so you have to try the latest livecd to get them
[16:33] <micahg> true charlie-tca
[16:34] <micahg> also, some users have upgraded after reporting the bugs
[16:34] <xteejx> ohhh you mean in an LTS version, i understand now, was confused for a sec there
[16:34] <xteejx> micahg, i've noticed about 75 of the old bugs have upgraded from obsolete versions anyway
[16:34] <xteejx> ie 7.04/.10
[16:35] <xteejx> *75%
[16:35] <xteejx> i need a new keyboard.......
[16:35] <micahg> indeed
[16:35] <charlie-tca> I been trying to teach mine to type, too
[16:35] <xteejx> lol
[16:36] <xteejx> its this laptop its been thrown, dropped down stairs....still going
[16:37] <charlie-tca> I never thought of throwing it down the stairs, usually just dropping it works
[16:37] <charlie-tca> lol
[16:37] <xteejx> there was a comma there :P
[16:37] <xteejx> failed insurance attempt at getting a new one lol
[16:38] <xteejx> anyway guys im off for a bit ill catch you all later/tomorrow
[16:45] <brunogirin> how do you handle bugs that are reported in a language other than English? Does it help to translate the report to English and what language should I use to request more info from the user reporting it?
[16:45] <charlie-tca> Normally, if you know the language, translate it, but ask in English
[16:47] <charlie-tca> I have done a couple where I translated the report in a comment, and translated the summary and change it to show both languages
[16:49] <brunogirin> OK thanks
[17:13] <micahg> charlie-tca: can you mark bug 240133 low traiged?
[17:14] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 240133 in firefox-3.0 "MHTML Format - Web Archive Files - not supported in Firefox" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/240133
[17:20] <charlie-tca> looking
[17:23] <charlie-tca> what? MS do another incompatible format? done
[17:23] <micahg> thanks :)
[17:23] <charlie-tca> :-)
[17:24] <micahg> at least there's an rfc for it
[19:20] <AldoTeusc> ???
[19:20] <Pici> AldoTeusc: Is there something you want to ask?
[19:23] <AldoTeusc> I registered with BugSquad and tried the chat. Thanks for asking.
[20:03] <exco> man am I ***** ... it clearly states on the brainstorm login page to enter your username ... still I was trying with my Email for quite some time now :-(
[20:03] <exco> I think I found a bug with the alternate cd ... where do I report that?
[20:04] <maxb> With the alternate cd's installer system? I think that's the debian-installer package
[20:06] <exco> I just installed to a USB drive and the installer detects my swap partition on the hdd drive and selects it automatically
[20:06] <kklimonda> exco: brainstorm doesn't use LP openid?
[20:06] <exco> when telling the installer not to use it ... it wants to write changes to that hdd's ?mbr
[20:08] <exco> kklimonda: don't think so: http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/user
[20:13] <xteejx> Hey guys, anyone about?
[20:13] <charlie-tca> no
[20:13]  * xteejx giggles
[20:13] <micahg> about what xteejx?
[20:13] <charlie-tca> everybody is hiding now
[20:13] <xteejx> where did you all go??
[20:13] <xteejx> lol
[20:13] <charlie-tca> not sure
[20:14] <xteejx> micahg: Are you Micah Cowan on LP?
[20:14] <micahg> no
[20:14] <xteejx> ahh ok
[20:14] <micahg> https://launchpad.net/~micahg
[20:14] <xteejx> anyone know anything about less?
[20:14] <micahg> less is more :)
[20:15] <charlie-tca> I know less
[20:15] <xteejx> thats such a bot-like response lol
[20:15] <charlie-tca> I use pager
[20:15] <xteejx> bug 8103
[20:15] <micahg> !less
[20:15] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 8103 in synaptic "Human readable repositories in synaptic" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/8103
[20:15] <ubot4`> Factoid 'less' not found
[20:15] <xteejx> wrong one
[20:15] <xteejx> bug 58103
[20:15] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 58103 in less "/etc/skel/.bashrc - lesspipe problem" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/58103
[20:15] <charlie-tca> !info less
[20:15] <ubot4`> charlie-tca: less (source: less): Pager program similar to more. In component main, is important. Version 418-1 (jaunty), package size 120 kB, installed size 300 kB
[20:15] <Pici> !info most
[20:15] <ubot4`> Pici: most (source: most): Pager program similar to more and less. In component universe, is optional. Version 5.0.0a-1 (jaunty), package size 50 kB, installed size 184 kB
[20:15] <Pici> <.<
[20:15] <xteejx> !info lots
[20:15] <ubot4`> xteejx: Package lots does not exist in jaunty
[20:16] <xteejx> anyone any ideas for bug 58103?
[20:16] <xteejx> keep up ubotu.....
[20:16] <Pici> You just said it, it won't do it again.
[20:16] <xteejx> pici what if i want it to? :) heh
[20:17] <xteejx> if users upgrade from whatever to 8.04 onwards, the less errors are still a problem, but not from a fresh install
[20:18] <charlie-tca> What about it?
[20:18] <xteejx> what do i do?
[20:18] <xteejx> its obv a problem
[20:18] <charlie-tca> it's confirmed, got an importance. Can you fix it?
[20:19] <charlie-tca> OTherwise, it can be left alone.
[20:19] <xteejx> nope i'm no dev
[20:19] <xteejx> what about setting it to triaged?
[20:19] <charlie-tca> eventually, it will be resolved.
[20:19] <charlie-tca> sure, it can be triaged
[20:19] <xteejx> can be triaged, or can be set to triaged?
[20:20] <xteejx> personally it explains the problem, any less dev should understand it
[20:20] <charlie-tca> The only thing left that should trigger it is 6.06 to 8.04
[20:20] <charlie-tca> mark it triaged
[20:20] <xteejx> thought so
[20:20] <xteejx> thx charlie
[20:20] <charlie-tca> 7.10 is already eol, so it should be gone in a year or two
[20:22] <micahg> charlie-tca: what should be gone?
[20:22] <xteejx> lol, so much for the Ubuntu spirit :P
[20:22] <xteejx> dont let brian hear u say tht lol
[20:22] <charlie-tca> the less bug.
[20:23] <micahg> ah, yeah, dapper is supported till 6/2011
[20:23] <charlie-tca> say what?
[20:23] <xteejx> only on server
[20:23] <micahg> yep
[20:23] <xteejx> desktop in 2 months
[20:23] <micahg> but servers can have bugs :)
[20:23] <xteejx> 1 month*
[20:23] <charlie-tca> Yeah, by then, it will really be a mess, since 8.04 is the upgrade path, but the next LTS will be out, too
[20:24] <xteejx> of course but text based consoles are usually "LESS" problematic haha
[20:24] <charlie-tca> Wouldn't you use "less" more on a server?
[20:24] <Pici> I use most more
[20:24] <xteejx> less more than what lots?
[20:24] <micahg> indeed no gui
[20:25] <charlie-tca> lol
[20:25] <charlie-tca> this is confusing
[20:25] <charlie-tca> so more is used more than less?
[20:25] <micahg> no
[20:25] <micahg> more you have to apge
[20:25] <xteejx> telling me, be glad you're native english (it seems you are)
[20:25] <micahg> less can search
[20:25] <xteejx> less can search more
[20:25] <xteejx> ?
[20:25] <hggdh> less is more than more
[20:26] <xteejx> hggdh, dont u start
[20:26] <xteejx> lol
[20:26] <hggdh> :-D
[20:26] <charlie-tca> thanks, hggdh
[20:26] <charlie-tca> that clears it up... ;-)
[20:26] <xteejx> bunch of 14 yr olds in here lol :P
[20:26] <hggdh> the fact is, you have less options with more
[20:26] <xteejx> and more with less...
[20:26] <hggdh> indeed
[20:27] <micahg> hi hggdh
[20:27] <hggdh> hi micahg
[20:27] <xteejx> so there's more or less more options on less than there is in more?
[20:27] <hggdh> the more we chat this way, the less others will understand
[20:27] <hggdh> even us, in the long run
[20:27] <xteejx> eventually yeah
[20:28] <hggdh> sic tempora gloria mundi, I guess
[20:28] <xteejx> i dont speak latin
[20:28] <xteejx> only english and german
[20:28] <micahg> guten tag
[20:29] <hggdh> the (er) wordly glory passes
[20:29] <hggdh> the mundane glory ends
[20:29] <xteejx> micahg: Guten tag micahg, wie gehts dir heute?
[20:30] <xteejx> hggdh, you've lost me now
[20:30] <hggdh> xteejx, the translation from Latin
[20:30] <xteejx> hggdh, yeah it doesnt really make any sense
[20:31] <xteejx> !info acpid
[20:31] <ubot4`> xteejx: acpid (source: acpid): Utilities for using ACPI power management. In component main, is optional. Version 1.0.6-9ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS> (jaunty), package size 33 kB, installed size 192 kB (Only available for i386 ia64 amd64 lpia)
[20:32] <xteejx> ty ubotu
[20:32] <micahg> xteejx: I don't know much german
[20:33] <xteejx> oh it just said, hi how are you, basically
[20:33] <xteejx> whats ur native language then?
[20:33] <micahg> English :)
[20:33] <micahg> I know some Spanish, hebrew, and Yiddish
[20:34] <xteejx> thats some collection lol
[20:34] <xteejx> im only fluent in 2 :(
[20:34] <charlie-tca> me too. English and Korean
[20:35] <exco> maxb: well I hope this is right then: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/debian-installer/+bug/379169
[20:35] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 379169 in debian-installer "when installing with the alternate cd the swap partition gets selected automatically in manual partitioning" [Undecided,New]
[20:35] <xteejx> thats a very naughty bug
[20:35] <charlie-tca> But very accurate\
[20:36] <xteejx> anyone in the UK?
[20:36] <xteejx> or is it just me
[20:36] <charlie-tca> That is the only way to prevent existing swap from being used
[20:36] <exco> so you already knew ;-)
[20:38] <xteejx> was everyone asleep during most of 2007?? there are SOOOOOOOOOO many untriaged bugs just sitting there with packages assigned but in New status from June 2007 onwards
[20:39] <charlie-tca> I did
[20:39] <charlie-tca> Maybe a lack of triagers?
[20:40] <xteejx> maybe we should advertise? have some sort of test?
[20:40] <charlie-tca> or 7.04 came out
[20:40] <charlie-tca> and it was not the best release yet, even if it was better than 6.10
[20:41] <xteejx> or 2-3 levels of triaging? level 1 : say hi, ask what versions, get apport-collect and arch data, level 2, debugging procedures, level 3, more specialised packages
[20:41] <charlie-tca> exco: it just never occurred to me to file that bug
[20:41] <xteejx> 7.04 was crap, 9.04 is much better
[20:41] <charlie-tca> Keeping in mind that apport-collect is new, and so is apport if you are looking at 7.04
[20:42] <xteejx> i know, 9.04+
[20:42] <xteejx> for apport-collect anyway
[20:42] <exco> also for someone new to linux has no idea that "/" is root, but then again someone coming from the MS world might not use manual partitioning?
[20:43] <charlie-tca> All true, exco. I do so many installs, it is automatic to tell manual partitioning not to use the existing files
[20:43] <xteejx> MS doesnt use partitioning at all, most PCs/laptops are preinstalled
[20:44] <xteejx> !info debconf
[20:44] <ubot4`> xteejx: debconf (source: debconf): Debian configuration management system. In component main, is required. Version 1.5.26ubuntu3 (jaunty), package size 146 kB, installed size 984 kB
[20:47] <captivus> Hello!  I would like to help out triaging bugs for the Hug Day today, but I've not done this before.  Is there anything I should read -- other than the "Triagers Handbook" from Mozilla -- to get started?
[20:47] <micahg> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToTriage
[20:47] <micahg> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Status
[20:48] <xteejx> Also https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProcedures there are standards procedures for getting the information that developers need to start fixing
[20:49] <xteejx> theres a hug day? oops forgot is it the firefox one?
[20:49] <micahg> yep xteejx
[20:49] <captivus> xteejx: Yessir
[20:49] <charlie-tca> Welcome to Ubuntu-bugs, captivus
[20:49] <captivus> charlie-tca: Cheers!  Thanks mate.
[20:49] <xteejx> captivus, have you signed the Code of Conduct, and applied for the Bug Squad?
[20:49] <charlie-tca> If you have questions, feel free to ask. We try our best to help here
[20:50] <captivus> xteejx: Hmm ... I've signed the code, but I've not applied for the Squad.
[20:50] <captivus> Is that a prerequisite?
[20:50] <micahg> captivus: nope
[20:50] <charlie-tca> not a prerequisite to start helping
[20:50] <captivus> charlie-tca: Good to know!  I imagine I'll have a few, so stay tuned!
[20:51] <xteejx> Its not, no. But if you want to start helping part/full time I'd suggest joining
[20:51] <captivus> xteejx: That sounds like a good idea.  How do I join?
[20:51] <exco> hug day today hasn't even been announced on http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/
[20:51] <xteejx> Ermmm.. hang on I'll link you
[20:52] <xteejx> captivus, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/GettingInvolved
[20:52] <charlie-tca> Won't be, either, since I can't even get an announcement in
[20:53] <charlie-tca> I have to try to get the messages announcing the next one, too
[20:53] <xteejx> I didn't see it on the ML
[20:54] <charlie-tca> I got the bugsquad and user mailing lists, but announce won't accept the message until it is approved by the moderators
[20:54] <charlie-tca> Happens every time I send them a message
[20:55] <charlie-tca> I'll try to get the newletter in, too, for next week
[20:57] <xteejx> charlie-tca, send it a week early, if everyone gets it early big deal
[20:57] <charlie-tca> Won't help if the message gets hung waiting approval
[20:57] <xteejx> for a whole week??
[20:58] <charlie-tca> Until after UDS is my guess
[20:58] <xteejx> whens that finish
[20:58] <xteejx> ?
[20:58] <charlie-tca> end of next week
[20:58] <xteejx> 2 weeks it takes? god
[20:59] <charlie-tca> No, it is just that everybody that can approve it is in Spain for two weeks
[20:59] <xteejx> like the way we got an inviter and free tickets lol
[21:00] <charlie-tca> some one has to stay and work the bugs
[21:00] <xteejx> why they all still logged into irc then? lol
[21:00] <xteejx> brians still here
[21:00] <xteejx> he should be at uds
[21:00] <charlie-tca> no, brian is at all-hands for cannonical, then on to UDS
[21:01] <xteejx> whats all hands?
[21:01] <charlie-tca> some group meeting in Spain
[21:01] <xteejx> oh ok
[21:02] <xteejx> will they be doing highlights on youtube again for karmic like they did with jaunty?
[21:02] <charlie-tca> should be.
[21:02] <xteejx> kool
[21:02] <xteejx> we can be nosey then hehe
[21:03] <charlie-tca> Also discussions for some of it will be in gobby
[21:03] <xteejx> gobby?
[21:04] <charlie-tca> gobby is a group discussion application, you can install and sometimes take part in the meetings
[21:04] <charlie-tca> !gobby
[21:04] <ubot4`> gobby is multiplayer gedit
[21:04] <xteejx> wtf? lol
[21:05] <xteejx> like a mass editor?
[21:05] <charlie-tca> sort of.
[21:05] <xteejx> i think i get what it is
[21:06] <charlie-tca> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDSKarmic/RemoteParticipation
[21:29] <xteejx> !info dia
[21:29] <ubot4`> xteejx: dia (source: dia): Diagram editor. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.96.1-7.1 (jaunty), package size 204 kB, installed size 596 kB
[21:31] <xteejx> !info kernel
[21:31] <ubot4`> xteejx: Package kernel does not exist in jaunty
[21:31] <xteejx> !info linux-image-generic
[21:31] <ubot4`> xteejx: linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version <IP_ADDRESS>.15 (jaunty), package size 3 kB, installed size 32 kB
[21:35] <micahg> what are you looking for xteejx
[21:44] <xteejx> nothing micahg, was just seeing what the current kernel was, thought I was behind :)
[21:45] <dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/+bug/326555
[21:45] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 326555 in flashplugin-nonfree "Please package flashplugin 64bit" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
[21:45] <dupondje> the 64bit plugin should really be used
[21:45] <dupondje> 32bit is broken :(
[21:45] <xteejx> usually the other way round
[21:46] <xteejx> bug 123293, is this implemented yet?
[21:46] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 123293 in iptables "Support for netfilter-log (libipt_nflog.so)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/123293
[21:47] <dupondje> when I use flashplugin from repo's, then connections to remote hosts in flash are broken it seems
[21:47] <dupondje> native 64bit plugin @ adobe works perfect
[21:50] <xteejx> https://bugs.launchpad.net/~srl-icu-project who is this?? Bug 122567
[21:50] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 122567 in icu "Invalid ELF Header" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/122567
[21:50] <BUGabundo> guud evening
[21:50] <xteejx> hey hey BUGabundo
[21:51] <charlie-tca> Hello, BUGabundo
[21:52] <xteejx> Anyone? And I'm right in putting that in the bug report right, as it's reached EOL.
[21:52] <charlie-tca> Who is who? loomis? He has only commented on one bug, 122567
[21:53] <xteejx> That's what i mean, whats he doing?
[21:53] <charlie-tca> Hard to tell. See if he responds to you or not.
[21:54] <xteejx> He's not subscribed so he won't see it
[21:54] <xteejx> not immediately anyway
[21:54] <charlie-tca> then it won't matter.
[21:54] <charlie-tca> He might be trying to learn how to triage
[21:55] <xteejx> What's icu got to do with an oowriter crash though?
[21:55] <xteejx> !info icu
[21:55] <ubot4`> xteejx: Package icu does not exist in jaunty
[21:55] <xteejx> ^^ enough said
[21:56] <charlie-tca> I don't know, but that is what the reporters error was in
[21:56] <kklimonda> xteejx: hmm.. rmadison says that there is icu for 9.04 and 9.10
[21:56] <xteejx> what is icu anyway?
[21:56] <kklimonda> so package is supported - but 7.04 isn't ;)
[21:57] <xteejx> good enough for me ;)
[21:57] <micahg> xteejx: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/icu
[21:57] <kklimonda> xteejx: Unicode library for C/C++
[21:57] <xteejx> the apport says Package: gnome-panel 1:2.18.1-0ubuntu3.1 ......... ?
[21:58] <xteejx> hang on, that says hardy versin is 3.8-6 ..... why is jaunty 3.8.1-3 ?? thats lower
[21:59] <xteejx> oh no its not dont worry
[21:59] <xteejx> didnt see the dot :D
[22:00] <xteejx> another thing i learned about launchpad....version control :)
[22:00] <xteejx> thanks micahg
[22:00] <micahg> np
[22:04] <xteejx> I think people are gonna get annoyed keep seeing ""Thank you for taking the time to report this bug and helping to make Ubuntu better. You reported this bug a while ago and there hasn't been any activity in it recently. We were wondering if this is still an issue for you. Can you try with lieve so many bugs were missedthe latest Ubuntu release? Thanks in advance.""  soon....cant be
[22:04] <xteejx> ...cant believe so many bugs were missed
[22:05] <micahg> well
[22:05] <micahg> actually probably not too many were actually missed
[22:05] <micahg> the reports just haven't been updates xteejx
[22:05] <xteejx> i've done about 200 in the past week or 2
[22:05] <micahg> bugs were missed?
[22:05] <micahg> or not updated?
[22:06] <charlie-tca> Are you trying to reproduce the issues?
[22:06] <micahg> there are tons not updated
[22:06] <xteejx> well of the 200, prob about 40-50 completely missed
[22:06] <micahg> well
[22:06] <micahg> did you check upstream?
[22:06] <kklimonda> xteejx: well - there are only so many of us..
[22:06] <micahg> maybe they are open issues
[22:06] <xteejx> i'm getting them to check it themselves if i cant reproduce
[22:07] <xteejx> if they've replied and said its an open issue, i triage it :)
[22:08] <xteejx> !info screen
[22:08] <ubot4`> xteejx: screen (source: screen): terminal multiplexor with VT100/ANSI terminal emulation. In component main, is optional. Version 4.0.3-11ubuntu4 (jaunty), package size 611 kB, installed size 1040 kB
[22:50] <captivus> Hello again.  I've read through the material that you (xteejx, micahg) linked me to.  I've just pulled up my first bug to triage, and I believe that it's incomplete, but before I run off marking bugs "Incomplete" I would welcome any guidance that you can offer.  Would one of you mind chatting with me to validate my thought process?
[22:50] <xteejx> sure
[22:51] <xteejx> what bug is it?
[22:51] <captivus> 379219
[22:51] <captivus> It occurs to me that I haven't searched to see if this is a dupe.
[22:52] <captivus> ...so I should probably do that first, right?
[22:52] <charlie-tca> bug 379219
[22:52] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 379219 in network-manager "After upgrade to 9.10 Network Manager failed to connect" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/379219
[22:52] <charlie-tca> Are you running karmic, captivus ?
[22:52]  * captivus notes the semantics for interacting with ubot4`
[22:52] <xteejx> yes, first thing, dupe check if possible
[22:52] <xteejx> ubotu has many functions:
[22:52] <captivus> charlie-tca: Negative.  I see why you've asked, though, and I realize that this is probably not the bug for me.
[22:52] <xteejx> !bug
[22:52] <ubot4`> If you find a bug in Ubuntu or any of its derivatives, please file a bug using the command « ubuntu-bug <package> » If that fails, you can report bugs manually at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug - Bugs in/wishes for the bots can be filed at http://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-bots
[22:53] <xteejx> !info firefox
[22:53] <ubot4`> xteejx: firefox (source: firefox-3.0): meta package for the popular mozilla web browser. In component main, is optional. Version 3.0.10+nobinonly-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS> (jaunty), package size 67 kB, installed size 124 kB
[22:53] <xteejx> etc...
[22:53] <captivus> xteejx: That is quite useful to know.
[22:53]  * captivus contemplates installing karmic for this purpose ...
[22:54] <xteejx> no need it stoo bleeding edge at the mo
[22:54] <BUGabundo> captivus: there are VMs for something
[22:54] <captivus> How do you all do it?  Do you guys dual-boot development releases or dedicate boxen to them?
[22:54] <xteejx> i only use jaunty
[22:54] <BUGabundo> I install in on hw
[22:54] <charlie-tca> I would pick a different bug. Karmic will have a lot of things not working for another month.
[22:54] <xteejx> i normally wait until alpha 3 until i bother with it
[22:55]  * captivus takes mental note of the advice rendered.
[22:55] <captivus> I'll look for another bug, I think.
[22:55] <xteejx> i think thats wise lol :)
[22:55] <BUGabundo> charlie-tca: for another 6 months eheh
[22:55] <xteejx> you could help me by going through old untriaged bugs, i.e. package assigned, new status
[22:55] <charlie-tca> Yeah, but a lot of the bugs disappear after UDS
[22:56] <xteejx> charlie-tca, i think thats a hopeful statement lol
[22:56] <captivus> xteejx: Sure.  I'd be thrilled to help.
[22:57] <xteejx> most of them are long gone, i.e. 7.04/7.10, they just need testing on 9.04 if they can be reproduced
[22:57] <xteejx> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-datecreated&field.status%3Alist=Unconfirmed&field.importance%3Alist=Undecided&assignee_option=none&field.assignee=&field.owner=&field.component=1&field.component=2&field.component-empty-marker=1&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_no_package.used=&search=Search
[22:57] <captivus> Well, I'm sitting next to two boxes running 9.04, so I'd be happy to help -- provided that you don't mind a few questions (some of which are bound to be a bit daft) along the way.
[22:57] <captivus> ;)
[22:58] <xteejx> lol don't worry about daft questions, most of us here are daft anyway ;)
[22:58] <captivus> Whew! ;)
[22:58] <xteejx> hggdh, charlie-tca and micahg were confusing everyone with a package called "less" earlier, more has more functions than less, more or less
[22:58] <xteejx> hehe
[22:59] <charlie-tca> But it was true!
[22:59] <charlie-tca> :-)
[22:59] <xteejx> i know thats whats funny!!
[22:59] <captivus> Hmm ... that URL y ou gave me doesn't seem to lead to anything different than I had pulled-up via the BugSquad wiki ...
[22:59] <BUGabundo> xteejx: ROFL
[22:59] <captivus> xteejx: HA!
[22:59] <BUGabundo> I'll RT that
[22:59] <hggdh> no, less is more than more, no questions!
[22:59] <xteejx> what have i said??
[23:00] <BUGabundo> do you guys concent me to post your nicks online ?
[23:00] <xteejx> depends where bug
[23:00] <charlie-tca> personally, I think more is less!
[23:00] <BUGabundo> xteejx: EVERYWHERE
[23:00] <hggdh> BUGabundo, fell free. This is already logged
[23:00] <xteejx> murr - go for it BUGabundo, doesn't bother me, just link us later :)
[23:00] <captivus> xteejx: Was the URL you gave a moment ago intended for me?
[23:00] <charlie-tca> I thought this was all public already?
[23:00] <hggdh> personaly, I agree with charlie-tca, more or less
[23:00] <xteejx> yes captivus
[23:01] <xteejx> hggdh, lol
[23:01] <xteejx> started you all off again havent i? :P
[23:01] <hggdh> heh
[23:01] <charlie-tca> That this is more less or less more
[23:01] <xteejx> BUGabundo, i got no probs with posting us, just link us with it :)
[23:01] <hggdh> let's stop, lest the newbies here get utterly confused and lost
[23:01] <captivus> xteejx: It doesn't seem to yield anything different to the link (to LP) from the BugSquad wiki page I was linked to earlier.  Is that expected?
[23:01] <xteejx> i'm not new but i still get confused
[23:01] <hggdh> oops, visitors.
[23:04] <xteejx> captivus, hehe
[23:04] <bcurtiswx> bdmurray: may I PM you?
[23:04] <BUGabundo> bcurtiswx: still not built
[23:04] <xteejx> bdmurray is in spain
[23:04] <bcurtiswx> i thought that was next week
[23:04] <micahg> I missed another round of more is less apparently
[23:04] <xteejx> micahg, yeah you did more or less ;)
[23:05] <charlie-tca> It's more or less, though :-)
[23:05] <xteejx> bcurtiswx, theres a conference meeting or something which i believe he's attending this week before UDS
[23:05] <micahg> too bad I didn't get paged...:P
[23:05] <xteejx> you did
[23:05] <bcurtiswx> im just reading his away.. all-hands meeting apparently
[23:05] <xteejx> thats the one
[23:06] <bcurtiswx> hmm, who else can i ping for bog control membership extension
[23:06] <bcurtiswx> eek bug*
[23:06] <xteejx> i havent seen your application yet, hggdh, charlie-tca?
[23:06] <bcurtiswx> xteejx: im already a member :P
[23:07] <xteejx> ohhh an extension
[23:07] <xteejx> ermmm hang on
[23:07] <charlie-tca> To extend membership. Needs an administrator from bug-control in launchpad
[23:07] <charlie-tca> bcurtiswx: might have to email brian
[23:08] <bcurtiswx> charlie-tca: does LP send an e-mail when its about to expire (i just marked an estimate when i got accepted)
[23:08] <charlie-tca> Sends it to you, but I don't think it sends it to him
[23:08] <bcurtiswx> i meant me, but ok.. i will wait for that
[23:08] <xteejx> Brian Murray, Henrik Nilsen, Jorge O. Castro, and Leann Ogasawara are admins in LP Bug Control, if you can get in touch with any of them, they can extend your app
[23:09] <bcurtiswx> i imagine they're all at all-hands though
[23:09] <xteejx> BM is
[23:09] <charlie-tca> I would expect that
[23:09] <xteejx> and if they're not, they're prob packing for next week
[23:09] <captivus> xteejx: Ok -- I think I've found one that is Invalid.
[23:09] <captivus> bug 124936
[23:09] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 124936 in netkit-ftp "Use LFTP instead of FTP" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/124936
[23:09] <captivus> This is just a recommendation, apparently.
[23:09] <ogasawara_> bcurtiswx: lp should send you reminder approx 2 weeks I think before your membership expires
[23:10] <ogasawara_> bcurtiswx: what's your lp id?
[23:10] <captivus> xteejx: "Binary package hint: ftp
[23:10] <captivus> LFTP has better support for everything, for example reading from fifo that ftp is unable to. lftp should be included instead of ftp by default."
[23:10] <xteejx> captivus, i believe that is a wishlist bug, if its not already implemeted
[23:10] <bcurtiswx> i must suck at guestimations then.. lol its this name bcurtiswx
[23:10] <captivus> "Wishlist bug"?
[23:10] <xteejx> captivus, ubotu puts all that info into IRC anyway ;)
[23:10] <captivus> d'oh!
[23:10] <kklimonda> yeah, it's a wishlist imo
[23:10] <captivus> My apologies.
[23:10] <captivus> Yes -- that was my opinion.
[23:10] <xteejx> it's a request for something to be implemented or changed
[23:10] <captivus> ...does it belong in the bug tracker, then?
[23:10] <xteejx> only bug control can change that, ill do it
[23:11] <captivus> I'd have thought not
[23:11] <xteejx> yes
[23:11] <captivus> Oh ... well, what do I know!
[23:11] <captivus> ;)
[23:11] <xteejx> done
[23:11] <charlie-tca> you know enough to ask! :-)
[23:11] <captivus> Cheers!
[23:11] <xteejx> very ture
[23:11] <captivus> charlie-tca: LOL.  Fair enough.
[23:11] <xteejx> *true
[23:11] <bcurtiswx> ogasawara_: bcurtiswx
[23:11] <xteejx> really, if you don't know, ask :)
[23:11] <micahg> captivus: you might want to direct user with this comment https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#An%20idea%20to%20improve%20Ubuntu
[23:12] <xteejx> no-one here will think any less of you, or more or less, but yeah, helpful bunch here
[23:12] <micahg> brainstorm would be the place to propose such a thing
[23:12] <captivus> xteejx: Thrilled to learn that.
[23:12] <captivus> micahg: I'll do so.  Thanks!
[23:13] <charlie-tca> Yup, everytime I think I know what I'm doing, someone straightens me out, more or less ;-)
[23:13] <xteejx> lmao
[23:13] <captivus> charlie-tca: I've heard that less is, in actual fact, more in some cases.
[23:14] <xteejx> depends how you use it lol
[23:14] <xteejx> more or less
[23:14]  * BUGabundo is getting tired of more less...
[23:14] <captivus> LOL
[23:14] <charlie-tca> I heard that, too, except when more is actually les
[23:14] <bcurtiswx> i think the cup is more or less full
[23:15] <xteejx> anyway guys im off for the night its after 11pm ill be back on tomorrow
[23:15] <captivus> xteejx: Cheers, mate!  Thanks for the help!
[23:15] <bcurtiswx> xteejx: GMT +1 ?
[23:15] <xteejx> captivus, You're very welcome mate
[23:15] <xteejx> yeah BST
[23:15] <xteejx> United kingdom
[23:16] <charlie-tca> good night, xteejx
[23:16] <bcurtiswx> cheers then, gnite
[23:16] <xteejx> hehe no probs night guys
[23:16] <ogasawara_> bcurtiswx: ok, I extended your membership another 6 months
[23:17] <bcurtiswx> ogasawara_: much appreciated, thanks
[23:26] <micahg> ugh
[23:26] <micahg> well the bug day had some impact
[23:28] <charlie-tca> Yes it did. You played a big part in that, too. Thanks
[23:28] <micahg> Is there any point in continuing to log ot the hugday page after 30 minutes
[23:29] <micahg> charlie-tca: the thing is, I would have done it anyways
[23:29] <charlie-tca> sure. It is still thursday here for another 8 hours
[23:29] <micahg> ok
[23:29] <micahg> 8 hours? You on PDT?
[23:29] <charlie-tca> MDT
[23:29] <micahg> ah
[23:29] <micahg> ok
[23:30] <micahg> is this considered a succesful bugday?
[23:30] <charlie-tca> Bug day is always calculated to local times, anywhere you are
[23:30] <charlie-tca> yes, I think it is.
[23:30] <micahg> with 4 people helping?
[23:31] <micahg> this is only the second one I've done so I don't know
[23:31] <charlie-tca> Every bit helps. With so many gone and getting ready to go, it counts!
[23:31] <micahg> it just seems like last week had a lot more people helping
[23:31] <charlie-tca> We did more than would have been done if we cancelled the hugday
[23:31] <micahg> true :)
[23:32] <micahg> BTW, how do I make cool graphs like the one at the bottom of the hugday page
[23:32] <charlie-tca> I don't know. I just fill in the blanks.
[23:32] <micahg> what do you mean?
[23:32] <charlie-tca> {{http://people.ubuntu.com/~brian/complete-graphs/firefox-3.0/plots/firefox-3.0-1day-triaging.png}}
[23:33] <micahg> it's a generated file
[23:33] <charlie-tca> yeah. Brian did it
[23:33] <micahg> so I guess I have to ask him
[23:33] <charlie-tca> Yeah, he will know how to do it.
[23:33] <micahg> what's the next hugday for?
[23:34] <charlie-tca> Thunderbird
[23:35] <micahg> ah
[23:35] <micahg> I can do that :)
[23:35] <captivus> Are these held weekly?
[23:35] <captivus> ...monthly?
[23:35] <charlie-tca> Yes, every Thursday
[23:36] <captivus> I see
[23:36] <charlie-tca> And there are special ones for the kernel team, too


[02:13] <superm1> blkorpheus, were you talking about the broken weather applet?
[02:13] <superm1> its part of the clock now from what i just noticed
[02:13] <superm1> right click your clock and you can check and uncheck to have it show you weather
[02:14] <blkorpheus> thats different than the weather applet from gnome
[02:14] <blkorpheus> it still exists, and is now fixed as of today
[02:15] <blkorpheus> I should not have to click the time, calender, etc, just to see weather, nd thankfully, I don't have to now:)
[02:15] <blkorpheus> I like the change to the time/calender feature
[02:15] <blkorpheus> but please don't remove the weather applet
[02:15] <blkorpheus> sadly, its what pulled me to gnome to begin with
[02:15] <blkorpheus> lol
[02:16] <blkorpheus> kweather was a joke by comparison
[02:18] <superm1> haha
[02:19] <superm1> well once you check/uncheck the box in the preferences, it shows up in your panel
[02:19] <superm1> that's all i ever needed from it
[02:19] <superm1> the temperature
[02:19] <superm1> anything else i can look out the window and see
[02:24] <blkorpheus> lol
[02:46] <superm1> OpenMedia, never got to ask you, did you end up switching?
[02:47] <OpenMedia> To Mythbuntu?
[02:47] <OpenMedia> Lab box is running it, but we have big issues with supporting DTT in NZ before we can release.
[02:47] <OpenMedia> Likely to release on Hardy.
[02:47] <OpenMedia> superm1: Hows things? I'm at LCA in Melbourne this week
[02:51] <superm1> OpenMedia, pretty well right now
[02:51] <superm1> i've just finished moving to TX myself
[02:51] <superm1> what's LCA?
[02:51] <tritium> superm1: you did?  You're only one state away now...
[02:51] <OpenMedia> Linux.Conf.AU
[02:51] <superm1> tritium, where are you at?
[02:51] <tritium> superm1: NM
[02:51] <superm1> ah
[02:52] <OpenMedia> I had a speaker slot.
[02:52] <superm1> neat, what about?
[02:52] <OpenMedia> Currently in Keith Packards Talk on X changes
[02:52] <OpenMedia> I talked on developing products for Consumers.
[02:52] <superm1> pretty broad topic
[02:52] <superm1> go well?
[02:52] <OpenMedia> http://linux.conf.au/programme/wednesday
[02:52] <OpenMedia> See session 5
[02:52] <OpenMedia> Yeah went down well.
[02:53] <OpenMedia> You can grab an OGG.
[02:53] <OpenMedia> Take a look at the Wednesday keynote as well
[02:53] <superm1> how was attendance?  I would imagine with competing to X acceleration that finally works was rough :)
[02:55] <OpenMedia> There are 700 people at the conference. I got about 70-80
[02:55] <OpenMedia> possibly a bit more.
[02:55] <OpenMedia> My miniconf session on Tuesday was about 140 in the same room
[02:56] <OpenMedia> superm1: I take it that Hardy is keeping you busy
[02:57] <superm1> yeah about what i would expect for attendance i suppose.
[02:57] <superm1> OpenMedia, oh yeah it has
[02:57] <superm1> i was finishing up my last term at the end of last year, so a lot was on hold
[02:57] <OpenMedia> I was more than happy with my numbers.
[02:57] <superm1> from now before I start my job i've been doing Ubuntu stuff non stop
[02:57] <tritium> superm1: were you in Iowa?
[02:57] <superm1> tritium, yeah I was
[02:57] <tritium> But you were from the Chicago area, right?
[02:57] <OpenMedia> So have you started at Dell?
[02:57] <superm1> yeah
[02:57] <superm1> tritium, ^
[02:58] <tritium> Oh, Dell?
[02:58] <superm1> OpenMedia, i don't start until the start of next month
[02:58] <tritium> Sweet, superm1.  Will you hook up the NM LoCo with an official tour if you can?  :D
[02:59] <superm1> tritium, maybe some discounts, i dont know about a tour though :)
[02:59] <tritium> superm1: thanks :)
[02:59] <superm1> we can come up with some sort of deal, patches for discounts.....
[02:59] <superm1> hehe
[02:59] <tritium> Nice!  I definitely intend to order a laptop once they offer preinstalls with 8.04 on them.
[02:59] <blkorpheus> one problem with myth
[03:00] <blkorpheus> I have no time to watch all the sheet I record
[03:00] <tritium> superm1: maybe you can make sure the TV tuners Dell uses in their laptops (and desktops) work with mythtv ;)
[03:00] <superm1> tritium, well i'll see what influence I have within the company, but you can believe that will be something on my mind either way
[03:01] <tritium> I'm glad to hear it.  Congratulations on your job!
[03:01] <superm1> thx :)
[03:01] <superm1> OpenMedia, you coming to ULive again this year?
[03:01] <superm1> haha blkorpheus yeah i know that feeling
[03:02] <blkorpheus> :)
[03:04] <OpenMedia> superm1: Only if I get a speaker slot at OSCON.
[03:05] <superm1> OpenMedia, ah yeah.  i'm not sure yet this year for myself either
[03:05] <superm1> did you submit any proposals?
[03:06] <superm1> OpenMedia, ah its a little lengthy, i'll have to watch this sometime tomorrow
[03:07] <OpenMedia> I just need to hit send. I had problems with my login, and I wanted to see how well they went here this week.
[03:09] <superm1> OpenMedia, as for hardy though, i just switched everything over to trunk yesterday
[03:09] <superm1> they are freezing upstream in preparation for 0.21 by the end of the week
[03:09] <superm1> so things will be happening all together very shortly
[03:09] <OpenMedia> Gotta go.. Session change coming up.
[03:09] <superm1> okay cu
[03:30] <mythtv_> hi when my setup launches the application bar of X stays on top , how can i fix this ?
[03:33] <mythtv_> hello?
[03:35] <mythtv_> must be sleepy for most part of the channel
[03:44] <blkorpheus> most channels you just ask your question
[03:44] <blkorpheus> geez
[03:45]  * blkorpheus "hello?", wait 2mins and leave..ppl baffle me
[04:22] <galileo> I may be in the wrong room, so feel free to point me in another direction.  I need some assistance setting up my tuner card.
[09:34] <martymoose> msg /motd
[09:54] <Guest18265> hello.
[09:55] <tom___> is anyone here?
[12:00] <baal> i have installed myhtbuntu but cant seem to get mythweb is there something i need to do to enable it
[12:00] <laga> is it installed?
[12:00] <laga> how do you want to access it?
[12:01] <baal> lags via a browser is the norm
[12:01] <laga> well
[12:02] <laga> and what do you type in your browser?
[12:02] <baal> laga the ip of the machine
[12:02] <laga> and what do you get?
[12:03] <baal> just an apache defaut page
[12:03] <stowaway2> hey whats a file browser in mythubuntu
[12:03] <stowaway2> ?
[12:03] <laga> baal: try <ip>/mythweb
[12:03] <baal> notfound
[12:04] <laga> baal: did you replace <ip> with the actual IP address?
[12:04] <baal> yes of cource
[12:05] <laga> then mythweb is not installed or not enabled properly
[12:05] <baal> is there a way to reinstall the mythweb
[12:05] <laga> sudo dpkg-reconfigure mythweb
[12:05] <laga> to reconfigure
[12:06] <baal> it says "mythweb is broken or not fully installed"
[12:06] <baal> how do i reinstall that package ?
[12:07] <laga> sudo aptitude reinstall mythweb
[12:07] <laga> probably
[12:11] <baal> ok great mythweb seems to be working but has errors
[12:12] <baal> Error at /usr/share/mythtv/mythweb/includes/init.php, line 301:
[12:12] <baal> unlink(data/cache/9.png) [function.unlink]: Operation not permitted
[12:13] <baal> any idea what that means ?
[12:17] <baal> ok thats my fault i havent reset the user and group on the images
[12:20] <baal> maybe not
[12:21] <baal> its talking about the channel icons but I cant find any directory structure like its having issues with
[12:21] <baal> theres no data/cache/9.png
[12:22] <laga> i'd suggest you purge mythweb, remove anything else that's left including your modifications and reinstall.
[12:22] <laga> mythweb, that is.
[12:23] <baal> i might just reboot see if this cache issue can fix it self
[12:28] <baal> thanks for the help laga much aprecieated !
[12:29] <laga> :)
[13:48] <kiwi_uk> Hi all, I'm having trouble finding out how to enable MPEG 2 encoding for Live TV
[13:48] <kiwi_uk> Myth only has options for RTjpeg and MPEG-4
[13:48] <laga> there's no such thing unless you use DVB/hardware encoder cards
[13:48] <kiwi_uk> Oh :(
[13:49] <kiwi_uk> Well, thanks for answering :)
[13:50] <kiwi_uk> I'm trying to use a MediaMVP as my front end and it only plays MPEG or MPEG2 you see
[13:59] <laga> a mediamvp with the original software?
[16:22] <Shred00> i'm wondering why ubuntu-mythtv-frontend needs gdm
[16:23] <Shred00> also, wondering what level of lirc support is in mythbuntu currrently?  can the frontend be stopped/started from the remote (i.e. irexec)
[16:23] <Shred00> i'm trying to decide if i want to "upgrade" my ubuntu custom rolled fe/be to a mythbuntu (proper) system and ubuntu-mythtv-frontend seems to want to add a lot to what is already a working installation for me.
[16:24] <Shred00> gnome-screensaver... why do i need/want that too?
[16:25] <rhpot1991_laptop> ubuntu-mythtv-frontend does automagic logins and stuff, which is why it requires gdm IIRC
[16:25] <rhpot1991_laptop> the rest of those are prob gdm requirements
[16:25] <Shred00> oh my, it seems mythbuntu uses a window manager (openbox) too.  why is a window manager necessary?  mythfrontend is a single X application.  there are no windows that need managing.
[16:25] <laga> not true
[16:25] <Shred00> why go through gdm though?  just start X and start mythfrontend on it
[16:26] <Shred00> laga: what's not true?
[16:26] <laga> you'll quickly run into focus issues if you use mplayer or xine
[16:26] <laga> w/o a window manager, that is
[16:26] <laga> might even happen with po-ups
[16:26] <laga> pop-ups*
[16:27] <laga> and we use gdm so the user can swith between different sessions, eg mythtv and gnome
[16:27] <laga> ubuntu-mythtv-frontend is deprecated in mythbuntu and not used, FYI
[16:27] <Shred00> why would i use mplayer or xine?
[16:27] <Shred00> as for popups, i've been running a windowless mythfrontend since 0.18 and not had any popup focus issues.  i even ran mplayer with mythvideo before the internal player was supported with no window manager and never had focus issues
[16:27] <laga> Shred00: you're lucky then
[16:27] <laga> anyways.
[16:28] <rhpot1991_laptop> laga its still used if you built on top of an existing ubuntu system I think
[16:28] <rhpot1991_laptop> well I still use it at least
[16:28] <laga> i dont know why you would use mplayer or xine :)
[16:28] <laga> rhpot1991_laptop: i use it, too
[16:28] <Shred00> different sessions?  this is a standalone pvr!  why would i want to switch anything?
[16:28] <rhpot1991_laptop> xine works good for dvd/iso playback with menus
[16:28] <laga> Shred00: dude.
[16:29] <Shred00> maybe i should start from a different pov.
[16:29] <laga> Shred00: if you don't like the way we do things and if your current setup is working fine, then don't use mythbuntu
[16:29] <laga> not everyone has your exact needs and setup
[16:29] <Shred00> what meta package(s) should i install on a dedicated standalone FE/BE machine to make it a bona fide mythbuntu system?
[16:29] <Daviey> Many people have had focus issues, hence our current design
[16:29] <laga> people might want to use mplayer or xine for exotic formats
[16:30] <laga> Shred00: mythbuntu-desktop
[16:30] <laga> Shred00: that'll give you even more dependencies
[16:31] <Shred00> laga: sorry, don't mean to bash.  trying to be constructive.  apologies for not coming across that way.
[16:31] <laga> Shred00: you're right about gdm, though, it slows down booting by a few seconds. shouldn't be too much
[16:31] <laga> Shred00: yeah, sorry, i'm being a bit on the edge today
[16:32] <laga> Shred00: ubuntu-mythtv-frontend is the old way of doing thing. openbox is a minimal window manager and shouldn't hurt.
[16:32] <Shred00> mythbuntu-desktop?  is that really for a standalone pvr?  the name hints that it's a for a login-to-a-desktop-and-also-use-mythfrontend type of set up.
[16:32] <laga> Shred00: mythbuntu-desktop is a meta package that will pull in gdm and our configuration app, mythbuntu-desktop
[16:33] <Shred00> i don't see mythbuntu-desktop in the Packages file
[16:33] <laga> Shred00: are you running gutsy?
[16:33] <Shred00> for gutsy anyway
[16:33] <Shred00> http://uk.weeklybuilds.mythbuntu.org/mythbuntu/ubuntu/dists/gutsy/main/binary-i386/Packages
[16:33] <laga> Shred00: it's in universe or multiverse
[16:33] <laga> oh.
[16:33] <laga> those builds
[16:33] <laga> yes, it's in the multiverse or universe section of the main mirrors
[16:33] <Shred00> ahh.  is in my apt cache though
[16:33] <Shred00> ahhh.  got it.
[16:34] <laga> Shred00: maybe you want to go to www.mythbuntu.org and look at some screenshots. that'll clarify what mythbuntu-desktop is going to give you
[16:34] <laga> eg a light-weight xfce desktop and mythbuntu-control-centre.
[16:35] <Daviey> It used to be an even lighter vm, but demand wanted xfce
[16:35] <laga> makes things easier even for hardcore mythtv users. unless you need total control, but there have to be trade-offs when doing a ready-made mythtv distro
[16:35] <laga> Daviey: i don't mind xfce that much
[16:35] <laga> it justs means i won't upgrade my frontends which are low on memory
[16:35] <Shred00> i wonder if the use of a WM can be made easily optional
[16:36] <Daviey> Shred00: do you use framebuffer with myth?
[16:36] <Shred00> Daviey: no, X on an nvidia 5200.  i'd love to use a direct framebuffer and kick X but myth just don't do that
[16:37] <Daviey> it _can_ do that
[16:37] <laga> Shred00: not with mythbuntu-desktop. ubuntu-mythtv-frontend: maybe.
[16:37] <Shred00> i used to do that with directfb and that other pvr project
[16:37] <laga> freevo
[16:37] <laga> :)
[16:37] <Shred00> yeah
[16:37] <Shred00> how can you get myth on a framebuffer?
[16:37] <laga> directfb
[16:37] <Daviey> Shred00: spend a weekend getting directfb to work
[16:37] <laga> you'll have to build it yourself.
[16:37] <Shred00> 'cause really, X is waaaaay overkill for a set-top-box
[16:37] <laga> Daviey: i spent two weeks
[16:37] <Daviey> heh
[16:38]  * laga does not recommend mythtv with directfb.
[16:38] <Shred00> and what toolkits sit between myth and the framebuffer?
[16:38] <laga> directfb and qt embedded.
[16:38] <Shred00> afaik qt doesn't support directfb
[16:38] <Shred00> ahhh.  embedded
[16:38] <Shred00> i tried that when i came over from freevo
[16:39] <Shred00> was a lot of pain back then.  around myth 0.18 days iirc
[16:40] <Shred00> i have a g400 which directfb has amazing support for
[16:40] <Shred00> the tv-out is impeccable.
[16:41] <Shred00> supports real interlace, unlike the nvidia 5200
[16:42] <laga> got one, too.
[16:43] <laga> tv-out is awesome, even over composite
[16:44] <Shred00> laga: indeed.  did you build .debs or did you do a much of make installs?
[16:44] <laga> it was three years ago. i don't use it anymore
[16:45] <laga> never got it working right
[16:45] <Shred00> oh.  lol.  i thought you were talking about a recent, good, experience
[16:45] <laga> the directfb code is mostly unmaintained, too
[16:45] <laga> no
[16:45] <laga> mplayer worked well :)
[16:45] <Shred00> really?  it was pretty well maintained a few years ago when i was using it.
[16:46] <laga> in mythtv?
[16:46] <Shred00> laga: no, with freevo
[16:46] <Shred00> oh.  i misuderstood
[16:46] <laga> never tried it with freevo :)
[16:46] <laga> heh
[16:46] <Shred00> you mean the myth directfb code
[16:46] <laga> yes
[16:46] <Shred00> i thought you meant directfb itself
[16:49] <Shred00> i'd love to see a more lightweight meta package that dispenses with gdm and gnome-screensaver, powers mythfrontend from the power button on the remote and boots directly to a running mythfrontend.
[16:51] <Shred00> i suppose even better would be to make the use of a WM and gdm optional in mcc.
[16:51] <laga> gdm: maybe
[16:51] <laga> WM: not gonna happen
[16:52] <laga> at least i won't do it
[16:52] <laga> gnome-screensaver is kinda important, too.
[16:52] <Shred00> perhaps even make the option of a WM "hidden" in that it is (de-)selected automatically based on whether mplayer or xine (or any other applications) are being configured
[16:52] <Shred00> why is g-s important?
[16:53] <laga> burn-in on plasmas etc. we patched mythtv to support gnome-screensaver instead of xscreensaver.
[16:53] <laga> WM: it's not gonna happen. mythbuntu uses a complete desktop environment which won't work without a WM
[16:53] <Shred00> interestingly though, my FE machine actually "blacks" out after inactivity which of course saves the screen.
[16:54] <Daviey> Shred00: I really don't think mythbuntu is suitable for you
[16:54] <laga> mythbuntu is not a set top box :)
[16:55] <Shred00> Daviey: why not?  all i want is a "no-frills" ubuntu myth machine
[16:55] <Shred00> the mcc is nice.
[16:55] <Daviey> Shred00: you seem unhappy with every aspect so far :)
[16:56] <Shred00> what makes mythbuntu so well poised to be a no-frills installation is that doing less is a lot easier than doing more.  :-)
[16:56] <laga> because mythbuntu is not a "no-frills" ubuntu mythtv machine
[16:58] <laga> Shred00: you want to remove gnome-screensaver and the WM. those are pretty essential to a mythbuntu box
[17:01] <Shred00> laga: i agree completely with you on g-s iff X didn't have it's own built-in "don't burn the screen" mode which seems to work just fine.  and really, in the case where you run no other apps but the mythfrontend, i don't see why a WM is necessary.
[17:01] <Shred00> i'm just trying to reduce bloat a bit for lower end systems.  i run myth on an athlon 800, and that's a recent upgrade from the PIII i used to run it on.  sadly it has 512MB in it.  that's overkill for what should be an STB.
[17:02] <laga> um
[17:02] <laga> ok
[17:02] <laga> let's try it again.
[17:02] <laga> mythbuntu is not a STB.
[17:03] <laga> http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Window_Managers
[17:04] <Shred00> laga: yeah
[17:05] <laga> Shred00: you obviously want a STB
[17:06] <laga> Shred00: mythbuntu is not a STB
[17:06] <laga> can you see a pattern there? :)
[17:06] <laga> mythbuntu implies: desktop environment. no DE without a WM.
[17:06] <Shred00> why does mythbuntu imply desktop?
[17:06] <laga> Shred00: ubuntu-mythtv-frontend could be tailored to your needs.
[17:07] <laga> Shred00: because we did it that way.
[17:07] <Shred00> regarding the myth wiki Window_Managers link you sent... the first paragraph says it all
[17:07] <laga> sigh.
[17:08] <laga> i give up
[17:08] <laga> you refuse to understand
[17:08] <Shred00> wow.  that was mature.
[17:08] <Shred00> i'm simply trying to expand the functionality of mythbuntu
[17:10] <Shred00> i don't refuse to understand what laga was saying.  i'm simply trying to expand on what mythbuntu has been so far.
[17:12] <rhpot1991_laptop> mythbuntu is meant for people who want to throw a cd in their computer install and have a working mythtv box without needing to configure everything by hand, you should just do it yourself if you want it that customized
[17:13] <Shred00> rhpot1991_laptop: i agree exactly with your first statement.  nothing about that statement implies that you need gdm, gnome-screensaver, a window manager, etc.
[17:14] <Shred00> what laga describes sounds more like it's meant for people who want a mythtv box with all sort of other "desktop switching" stuff too.
[17:15] <rhpot1991_laptop> its what users want, has developed into that over time
[17:15] <rhpot1991_laptop> a bit late to go back and change all that now
[17:15] <Shred00> more like what i have in the bedroom than the living room.  bedroom is a desktop pc with e-mail, browsing, etc. and is also a myth FE.  living room is a FE only
[17:15] <rhpot1991_laptop> if it was your way then it would be a pain for me to go and use xine or mplayer for my movies
[17:15] <Shred00> rhpot1991_laptop: ahhh.  but i don't think there is any need to "go back" and undo anything.  nothing that has be done so far precludes the "dedicated FE" type set up
[17:16] <Shred00> rhpot1991_laptop: indeed, i'm not looking to make that any more difficult.  i just want to reduce the bloat for those who don't want any of that.
[17:17] <Shred00> if users want to switch to a desktop, i don't want to prevent that, nor do i want to prevent using xine or mplayer.  i just want them all to be choices and the required extra bloat needed to support them only added if they make those choices.
[17:18] <rhpot1991_laptop> thats beyond most users, so its easier for you to just go and do that for your box on your own
[17:19] <Shred00> clicking checkboxes is beyond most users?  you must have had to choose to use xine or mplayer didn't you?
[17:20] <rhpot1991_laptop> well its meant for an average user, so its a lot easier to have it ready to add xine to than have to instruct them as to how to do so in a more complicated process at a later point
[17:21] <rhpot1991_laptop> I don't understand why you don't just go make your setup how you want it, instead of complaining how mythbuntu does it in here?
[17:21] <Shred00> ahhh.  perhaps that's where the confusion is coming from. i think what i propose is more behind the scenes stuff
[17:22] <Shred00> i don't think the user should have to choose whether to use a wm or gdm, etc.  the users choices to use xine or mplayer or have a switchable desktop, etc. should make those choices for them.
[17:23] <Shred00> sure, i could just make some changes, but i'm trying to contribute.  i am sure i'm not the first person to want a strictly-stb type of ubuntu based mythbox and probably won't be the last.  i'm just trying to make it easier for the next guy.
[17:27] <rhpot1991_laptop> the problem with that methodology is its a lot harder for them to add xine support at a later point to their system
[17:27] <rhpot1991_laptop> if someone shows up in here and says "my dvd menus don't work"
[17:27] <rhpot1991_laptop> I am gonna point them at a wiki for how to setup xine in mythvideo
[17:27] <rhpot1991_laptop> with your method then I have to get them a working WM first, or some other way of controlling xine properly
[17:28] <rhpot1991_laptop> its really a case of supply and demand, what you want has a lower demand, so you get a WM if you use mythbuntu
[17:28] <Shred00> ahhh.  i would see a choice to use xine as an mcc thing, that then configured a wm for them as well as configuring myth to use xine.
[18:42] <jawil> any reason why I can't download the Mythbuntu iso or the torrent from the website?
[18:43] <superm1> jawil, of 7.10?
[18:43] <superm1> not working?
[18:43] <jawil> yeah
[18:43] <superm1> that's not good.
[18:43] <jawil> none of the links of the downloads page work for me
[18:43] <superm1> try a second time and you should be given another mirror
[18:43] <superm1> do you know which one wasn't working?
[18:44] <superm1> yeah works for me (tm)
[18:44] <jawil> I get to here: http://mythbuntu.org/download/?file=mythbuntu-7.10-i386.iso and nothing happens, blank page...
[18:44] <superm1> turn off adblock plus if you've got it on
[18:44] <superm1> it may filter the javascript
[18:45] <jawil> there we go
[18:45] <jawil> NoScript was the problem
[18:45] <superm1> maybe a warning is appropriate on that page
[18:45] <superm1> i'll add one in
[18:45] <jawil> for some reason google-analytics.com is necessary...
[18:45] <superm1> yes
[18:45] <superm1> we need to track bandwidth usage on the mirrors
[18:45] <jawil> because mythbuntu.org was already allowed
[18:45] <jawil> oh, ok gotchya
[18:46] <superm1> that's how we do our load balancing
[18:46] <jawil> I'm a security freak, so don't like tracking ;)
[18:46] <jawil> but that makes sense
[18:47] <superm1> there we go added a warning
[18:47] <MythbuntuGuest93> Hi, I just got an HD Cable box and I was wondering how to configure the firewire to record the content off of the box.
[18:47] <MythbuntuGuest93> is the info in the manual?
[18:47] <jawil> looks good
[18:47] <superm1> there's a howto on help.ubuntu.com
[18:48] <superm1> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MythTV_Firewire?highlight=%28firewire%29
[18:48] <MythbuntuGuest93> thanks superm1, i'll take a read.  Is there anyway to tell if your firewire port is disabled before you configure everything?
[18:48] <superm1> yeah but it depends on the cable box
[18:49] <superm1> most motorola ones you can hit the power button (to turn it off ), followed by select/ok
[18:49] <superm1> on the remote
[18:49] <superm1> and then its in one of the menus that show up
[18:49] <MythbuntuGuest93> i have comcast with a motorola DCH 3200
[18:49] <superm1> other cable boxes you'll have to Google
[18:51] <MythbuntuGuest93> the online documentation is only for the Motorola DCT-62xx and Scientific Atlanta SA3250HD/SA4200HD
[18:51] <MythbuntuGuest93> can i use the same information for the DCH 3200?
[18:51] <superm1> most likely yeah
[18:52] <MythbuntuGuest93> ok, sweet, thanks for the info.
[18:55] <jawil> damn, I'm going to have to use ndiswrapper for my wireless card, how depressing
[18:56] <superm1> well at least functional though
[18:57] <jawil> true
[18:57] <MythbuntuGuest93> superm1; right now i have a SD lineup that I use with my pvr-500 connection.  Should i make a new lineup, that has all the channels for the STB?  or should i just add it to the existing old one?
[18:58] <superm1> MythbuntuGuest93, before doing anything with a line up, see if it works
[18:58] <superm1> just set it to "no lineup"
[18:58] <superm1> you will eventually need another one though
[18:59] <MythbuntuGuest93> k. thanks
[19:59] <MythbuntuGuest64> hello i want to know how shutdown the pc with the remote control
[20:00] <Shred00> MythbuntuGuest64: the whole PC or the mythfrontend?
[20:00] <superm1> autogen
[20:00] <superm1> oops my bad, wrong window
[20:01] <superm1> MythbuntuGuest64, there is a thread on the forums that talks about it i believe
[20:01] <MythbuntuGuest64> in with forum?
[20:02] <MythbuntuGuest64> where is the dorum? i mean
[20:02] <superm1> see /t
[20:02] <superm1> mythbuntu.org/support has a link to the forums
[20:02] <Daviey> MythbuntuGuest64: Use the thread for guidance, otherwise you'll need to SUID "halt" (ie, allow any user to exec a command root normally needs to execute), then have lirc execute halt
[20:02] <MythbuntuGuest64> ok thanks i search fr it
[20:02] <Shred00> MythbuntuGuest64: the tool you want is irexec.  i'd be interested in seeing how/if mythbuntu use it
[20:03] <superm1> Shred00, there is nothing that we have automated for it, but some users have written a howto
[20:03] <Shred00> superm1: ahhh.  i'd like to see irexec used in mythbunutu, and perhaps configurable to either restart the whole machine or mythfrontend
[20:04] <Shred00> i use it for the latter quite successfully, but i don't have the whole mythbuntu desktop stuff on my FE
[20:04] <Shred00> i launch X and then put mythfrontend directly on top of that.  nothing else.
[20:04] <superm1> well our scripts do check for irexec in lircrc
[20:04] <superm1> if it is mentioned in there, irexec -d gets started
[20:05] <superm1> so it would just be a matter of properly adding support to mythbuntu lirc generator
[20:05] <superm1> which can be feasibly done
[20:05] <Shred00> so irexec just calls a script that checks if mythfrontend is running and stops it if it is and starts it if it's not
[20:05] <superm1> well what irexec does is configured in your lircrc
[20:05] <Shred00> superm1: which package does the script that does that checking live in?
[20:05] <superm1> but to at least start the daemon is automatically done
[20:06] <Shred00> i'd like to inherit that start daemon from mythbuntu
[20:06] <superm1> mythbuntu-default-settings
[20:06] <Shred00> superm1: thanx!
[20:07] <superm1> Shred00, if you have any improvements to it, i'm very open to patches
[20:07] <superm1> just let me know
[20:07] <Shred00> ugh.  depends on xfce4-utils
[20:07] <superm1> its the xfce4 session startup script
[20:08] <superm1> *we use xfce4 for a balance with usability to people and lightweight)
[20:08] <Shred00> yeah, this goes back to the earlier discussion of wm or no-wm
[20:08] <superm1> ah.
[20:10] <superm1> ubuntu-mythtv-frontend (the even more lightweight  and less usable route) has a similar way of starting irexec
[20:11] <Shred00> (without having looked at the mythbuntu-default-settings package) would you be open to separating out the lirc bits and depending on a new package?  i don't think ubuntu-proper's lirc package(s) have irexec support
[20:11] <Shred00> i understand ubuntu-mythtv-frontend is deprecated
[20:11] <superm1> yeah
[20:11] <superm1> the lirc packages are where irexec comes from
[20:11] <superm1> this is just a way of starting it for the user at login
[20:12] <Shred00> do you repackage the lirc packages in any way or use them from ubuntu as is?
[20:12] <superm1> the same packages are used for both
[20:12] <superm1> i've improved the lirc packages in the interest of ubuntu and mythbuntu
[20:12] <Daviey> Which is the ethos of the mythbuntu project :)
[20:12] <Shred00> nice.
[20:12] <Shred00> i do see that the lirc startup script does start irexec
[20:13] <Shred00> yes, i like that goal
[20:22] <Cygnet> I just moved, and now I'm only getting static on my mythtv box (cable is on and working, and I had the mythtv box working in a different apartment in the same building)
[20:23] <Cygnet> I've tried switching out the coax cable I'm using, and restarting mythtv
[20:29] <LT_Tuvok> Possible that wall outlet is damaged
[20:31] <Cygnet> I have a TV and a cable modem plugged into the same outlet (with splitters) and they both work
[20:32] <LT_Tuvok> splitters degrade the signal, perhaps try another outlet?
[20:32] <LT_Tuvok> depends how many times its split of course
[20:33] <Cygnet> we only have the one cable jack, unfortunately
[20:33] <Cygnet> I'll try plugging it in directly to the jack and see if that works
[20:33] <Cygnet> that will take me offline, so brb :p
[20:33] <LT_Tuvok> I await the results
[20:34] <LT_Tuvok> understood
[20:37] <Cygnet> no joy, I get noisy static instead of silent static :p
[20:38] <Cygnet> (well, I guess that would be partial joy)
[20:40] <Shred00> Cygnet: have you tried simply moving the coax cable from your mythbox to a tv to "see" for yourself what the tuner in the mythbox is seeing?
[20:41] <Cygnet> I did try switching the cables for the TV and the mythbox to see if the cable was bad, but I'll try switching the cable again
[20:42] <Shred00> Cygnet: no, i don't mean swapping cables.  i mean taking the connection off the tuner and moving it to the tv.  so that the tv is exactly where the myth tuner was in the cable equation
[20:43] <Cygnet> I just did that
[20:43] <Shred00> did the tv see snow?
[20:44] <Cygnet> I had only been looking at the one channel on the TV, I just tried channel surfing and got a whole lot of nothing
[20:44] <Cygnet> so looks like the problem is with the cable
[20:44] <Shred00> or jack, or anything downstream from the tv
[20:45] <Cygnet> I'm going to try plugging the tv in directly to the wall, I might go offline
[20:47] <Cygnet> TV still gets nothing
[20:48] <Cygnet> we just moved in and we had trouble getting the (cable) internet turned on, so we may be having problems with the cable TV too :p
[20:51] <Cygnet> well, I'm off -- thanks for your help, guys.
[21:01] <LT_Tuvok> illogical
[22:23] <astyler> how would I unstinstall mythtv?
[22:23] <astyler> sudo apt-get remove  mythtv did something, but I can still run mythtv
[23:00] <LT_Tuvok> RTDP
[23:01] <LT_Tuvok> Read the documentation please
[23:01] <LT_Tuvok> there have been hard work to comppile documentation, that some don't bother to read
[23:01] <LT_Tuvok> most curious
[23:01] <LT_Tuvok> more than likely a FAQ
[23:02] <LT_Tuvok> but at the elast, you should know how to install and remove software
[23:12] <superm1> astyler, apt-get remove mythtv-*
[23:12] <superm1> will take it all out
[23:14] <astyler> thanks superm1
[23:15] <astyler> couldn't find anything in the documentation
[23:47] <stowaway2> hello.. I dont suppose there is some sort of device manager program i can install for ubuntu ?
[23:48] <Stowaway> cant seem to get my damn dvico dvb tuner to work
[23:49] <superm1> best to check dmesg and see if its just missing firmware
[23:49] <superm1> or if there are any drivers loading for it whatsoever


[06:24] <thatgraemeguy> mornings
[06:24] <pavlushka> Morning thatgraemeguy :)
[06:25]  * pavlushka yawns
[06:55] <Kilos> morning all
[06:58] <inetpro> good mornings
[06:59] <Kilos> lo my pro
[06:59] <inetpro> hoe gaan dit oom Kilos?
[07:00] <Kilos> nie te sleg nie dankie en self? inetpro
[07:03] <inetpro> always good as well, thanks
[07:03] <inetpro> superfly: talk to us, how's things going there?
[07:03] <Kilos> yeah
[07:04] <inetpro> busy is not an excuse
[07:04] <Kilos> hahahaha
[07:04] <inetpro> Kilos: sshhh
[07:04] <Kilos> ooops
[07:04] <inetpro> :-)
[07:10] <inetpro> oh and happy mailman day to everyone!
[07:14] <Kilos> hi thatgraemeguy superfly paddatrapper nlsthzn dlPhreak
[07:14] <paddatrapper> Hey Kilos
[07:17] <thatgraemeguy> morning Kilos
[07:23] <Kilos> inetpro ons gaan hom bietjie moet kort knip
[12:02] <kulelu88> superfly: how is the debconf planning coming along?
[12:02] <superfly> kulelu88: it's coming along. t-2 days to DC16
[12:03] <superfly> I'm not doing a lot of the big things, so mostly just helping others out
[12:04] <superfly> kulelu88: we will be live-streaming everything, so you can watch from the comfort of your own couch, or desk ;-)
[12:04] <kulelu88> live-stream with periscope or something more reliable?
[12:05] <kulelu88> where is oom Kilos ? this place is quiet these days
[12:08] <superfly> kulelu88: no, for reals.
[12:08] <kulelu88> I look forward to watching. will be exciting
[12:10] <superfly> https://debconf16.debconf.org/schedule/
[12:11] <superfly> if you click on the venue at the top (e.g. Menzies 9), there will be a live stream on that page (when the cameras and everything is set up)
[12:11] <kulelu88> will our ZA bandwidth handle a live-stream?
[12:12] <superfly> we did a test run yesterday, and everything worked fine
[12:12] <superfly> the biggest problem will be UCT outbound.
[12:14] <kulelu88> tested with how many streamers? A few thousand would be the best test
[12:16] <superfly> kulelu88: no, it was just trying to see if we *could* stream :-)
[12:17] <kulelu88> superfly: maybe having a 15 minute stream delay might be a good idea?
[12:17] <kulelu88> that way you can load it onto youtube as it streams and let their servers handle the load
[12:18] <superfly> kulelu88: this is Debian, we do not YouTube
[12:18] <superfly> we only WeTube
[12:19] <kulelu88> heh, wetube has no SSL :/
[12:23] <superfly> not in my hands
[12:24] <superfly> and besides, there's nothing actually going over that connection other than the video
[12:24] <kulelu88> so you guys prefer wetube over archive.org?
[12:38] <kulelu88> theblazehen: you around?
[13:29] <inetpro> superfly: I get "Video format or MIME type is not supported", what would I have to install to get it working?
[13:32] <superfly> inetpro: nothing. it's not streaming at the moment,
[13:33] <inetpro> ok cool, thanks
[13:33] <superfly> kulelu88: yes, because our own infrastructure
[13:33] <superfly> kulelu88: where I am not really "we"
[13:34] <inetpro> I hope there will be an option to select a low quality stream in order to reduce bandwidth usage
[13:35] <kulelu88> so many slots are empty though. is this by design? superfly
[13:36] <superfly> kulelu88: content team will fill them
[13:37] <superfly> DC16 proper only starts on Sunday
[13:38] <kulelu88> superfly: does there exist a FLOSS alternative to github?
[13:38] <superfly> kulelu88: gitlab
[13:50] <kulelu88> superfly: but that's running behind a paid-for company. I'm talking something equivalent to the PSF
[13:56] <inetpro> kulelu88: PSF = Python Software Foundation?
[13:57] <kulelu88> yes, correct inetpro
[13:57] <inetpro> thanks
[15:21] <Kilos> hi Squirm
[16:25] <Kilos--> hmm...
[16:26] <Kilos> cyrilb are you winning?
[16:26] <cyrilb> winning what?
[16:26] <Kilos> with whatever you are doing here man
[16:27] <Kilos> hehe
[16:27] <Kilos> like making progress
[16:34] <inetpro> cyrilb: are you in Cape Town or still in JHB?
[16:34] <cyrilb> CT
[16:34] <cyrilb> debugging Rsyslog at the moment
[16:35] <inetpro> you here for DC16 as well?
[16:35] <inetpro> there*
[16:36] <cyrilb> of course
[16:36] <cyrilb> I'm here for the Debconf
[16:37] <inetpro> who's car is that with the Debian registration?
[16:37] <cyrilb> https://twitter.com/cyb_bo/status/748856473464307712
[16:37] <cyrilb> no idea
[16:37] <cyrilb> probably one of the orgs
[16:37] <inetpro> for those who haven't seen it: https://twitter.com/cyb_bo/status/748856473464307712
[16:38] <cyrilb> someone from SA, for sure
[16:38] <cyrilb> love it
[16:39] <inetpro> oops...  High: 21° C., Friday Night: Clear. Low: 7° C., Saturday: Clear. High: 20° C., Saturday Night: Clear. Low: 4° C., Sunday: Partly Cloudy. High: 17° C., Sunday Night: Clear. Low: 3° C., Monday: Clear. High: 18° C., Monday Night: Clear. Low: 3° C., Tuesday: Clear. High: 18° C., Tuesday Night: Clear. Low: 4° C., Wednesday: Clear. High:
[18:35] <Maaz> 18° C., Wednesday Night: Clear. Low: 4° C., Thursday: Clear.


[02:37] <nhaines> ianorlin: sorry to hear that!
[02:37]  * ianorlin knows but now have a phone interview tommorow and in person interview Friday
[02:37] <nhaines> Same place?
[02:38] <ianorlin> no
[02:38] <ianorlin> different place
[02:39] <nhaines> That's good too.
[06:36] <nhaines> Hopefully tha'ts better.
[06:36] <nhaines_> Yay I reconnected for some reason?
[06:37]  * nhaines shrugs.
[08:19] <raevol> https://openmw.org/2014/openmw-0-31-0/
[08:19] <darthrobot`> Title: [OpenMW 0.31.0 | OpenMW, Open source Elderscrolls III: Morrowind reimplementation, Morrowind remake, Morrowind remade,]
[08:20] <pleia2> :)
[08:21] <nhaines> I gotta play that some day.  :)
[08:21] <nhaines> pleia2: Did you find Döner Kebab yet?
[08:21] <pleia2> nhaines: alas, no, but I did have goulash last night, yum yum
[08:22] <pleia2> (my father used to make it growing up, brings back memories)
[08:22] <nhaines> That's a pretty good consolation prize.  :)
[08:23] <nhaines> I just can't remember if the Kebab I had was in Frankfurt or Marburg.  Anyway, should be some somewhere.  Gyros are not the same, so don't be afraid to ask someone if you're curious about it!
[08:23] <nhaines> "Entschuldigung bitte, wo möchte ich Döner Kebab finden?" ought to do it.
[08:23] <pleia2> I've not been feeling the best, so I'm probably sticking close to the hotel for the rest of the week (gallbladder out in a week, yaaay)
[08:24] <pleia2> I'll come back to germany some day when I'm not sick :)
[08:24] <nhaines> Aww, I thought that might have been temporary.  Hope it goes well!
[08:24] <pleia2> thanks
[08:24] <nhaines> You could also tell the hotel concierge, "Wenn ich kein Döner Kebab esse, dann sterbe ich!"  ("If I don't eat Döner Kebab then I'll die!")
[08:25] <nhaines> Which I might try next time I'm over there.
[08:25] <pleia2> lol
[08:26] <nhaines> But if you're still fond of chocolate, try Kinder Schokolade (which you can get here) or Kinder Schoko-Bons (which are almost impossible to find here).
[08:26] <nhaines> Oh, or Kinder Überraschung eggs!  They have plastic capsules with little toys inside.
[08:26] <nhaines> Those are downright illegal here.  :)
[08:26] <pleia2> ah yes, I remember those from when they were legal
[08:27] <nhaines> They haven't been legal since the 30's.  The FDA simply cracked down.
[08:27] <nhaines> But yeah, when I found Schoko-Bons here I bought a case of them.  The store gave me a 15% discount so they were only $80.
[08:30] <nhaines> Not sure how I managed to eat 3.3 pounds of chocolate, but I survived.  (Actually a lot went to family, friends, and their kids.)
[08:30] <pleia2> hehe
[08:30] <pleia2> yeah, in the 90s I got a bunch with disney toys in them
[08:31] <nhaines> If I still have them somewhere, mine have little farm vehicles in them.  Old-timey cars, anyway.
[16:05] <Roguehorse> Good Morning
[16:23] <Roguehorse> Good Morning
[16:31] <ianorlin> good morning
[17:11] <Roguehorse> So what's the exciting news today? BALUG needs help finding a new home in SF, anyone have contacts that can help them?
[17:25]  * ianorlin lives in socal so doesn't know about that
[17:27] <Roguehorse> I just heard about it from one of my mailing lists.....it sucks, but I told them I would do whatever I could to help them out
[18:14]  * MarkDude can help, but most of my suitable contacts are likely in Oakland. /me is pretty sure a space can be found in SF :D
[18:21] <Roguehorse> MarkDude: That's great! I figured it wouldn't take too long to find them a new home if enough people got involved. : )
[18:23] <MarkDude> True. Balug is cool
[18:44] <Roguehorse> Agreed! I think it's good to have enough LUGs spreads around so it's easy for people to get to one : )