[00:00] <houkouonchi-home> was libmpich2-3 removed on purpose and any reasoning? The page no longer exists at: http://packages.ubuntu.com/trusty/libmpich2-3 and it disappeared from the repo's a few days ago
[00:02]  * rww takes a look
[00:03] <rww> The last change to its source package was in December :\
[00:03] <rww> oh wait no, I'm looking at the wrong page
[00:04] <rww> houkouonchi-home: "superseded by mpich (3.0.4-6ubuntu1), which has already taken over most of mpich2's binary packages"
[00:04] <rww> per https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mpich2/+publishinghistory
[00:06] <houkouonchi-home> rww: thanks
[00:36] <Mark-Potter> Can I upgrade from 12.04?
[00:44] <rohan> does ubuntu installer support using btrfs in automatic partitioning?
[01:33] <johnjohn101> hard to believe less than 3 days
[01:47] <Arnex> ok cats and kittens, if i have ubuntu 13.10 and do an apt-get dist-upgrade at this very moment, will it take me to the 14.04 beta?
[01:47] <rww> no
[01:47] <rww> !dist-upgrade
[01:47] <rww> You're probably looking for do-release-upgrade -d
[01:47] <Arnex> yeah, that is what i'm looking for
[01:48] <Arnex> same question, but with do-release-upgrade, will it take me to the beta? or will that only be live on the 17th?
[01:48] <rww> Arnex: -d = development version = beta
[01:49] <Arnex> ah, okay!  thanks!
[01:54] <vonsyd0w> rww, ubuntu-server 14.04 questions in here, right?
[01:54] <rww> vonsyd0w: correct
[01:55] <vonsyd0w> I haven't messed w/ ubuntu server versions between 12.04 and 14.04, so I dont know if you cant install linux-image-virtual anymore. Is that correct? Are linux-image-generic and virtual the same now?
[02:39] <owen1> when does systemd going to be part of ubuntu? 14.04 ?
[02:46] <rww> owen1: No, not 14.04. A bunch of stuff needs to be converted from upstart to systemd, so it'll be a while.
[02:46] <rww> It's a major change, and it was only announced halfway through the release cycle, so...
[02:46] <Aki-Thinkpad> hey is anyones rhythmbox crashing when you try to back a song?
[02:48] <Aki-Thinkpad> I'd like to report a bug if this is the case
[02:51] <owen1> rww: got it. thank you!
[03:46] <bandit63> any one succesfully built kernel 3.15rc1?
[03:52] <bandit63> getting cannot create /etc/apt/apt.conf.d//01autoremove-kernels.dpkg-new: Permission denied
[04:05] <Aki-Thinkpad> bandit63, #ubuntu+2 :P
[04:09] <bandit63> :D
[04:09] <bandit63> i will try to build 3.14.1 and see if it builds go from there
[04:11] <sakang> so it's all set this Thursday?
[04:11] <bandit63> or i can stay here untill thursday and it will be +2 kind of
[04:13] <bandit63> ubuntu+2 in invite only and gets you kicked
[04:49] <bandit63> 3.14.1 builds fine so its something with 3.15rc1 oh well its time for sleep
[05:41] <Aki-Thinkpad> bandit63, wait, ubuntu+2 actually exists? lol
[06:07] <scarleo> Hi, the new cool lock screen doesn't work if I enable On Screen Keyboard, which package should I file the bug report against?
[06:11] <scarleo> And, uhm, ubuntu-bug launched Lynx :D
[06:26] <abhra> hi, having a little problem with huawei E355 modem.could use as a wifi hotspot but not working as a wired connection. in ubuntu 12.04 with 3.8 kernel (raring lts backport), it worked. otherwise, the wired connection mode does not work with anyother kernel. any help for xubuntu 14.04 will be appreciated. one way to work it in linux mint, xubuntu 13.10 is mentioned here http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=148990
[06:27] <abhra> neither working in ubuntu
[06:32] <Aki-Thinkpad> abhra, you will probably have more luck in #xubuntu or #mint tbh.
[06:32] <Aki-Thinkpad> abhra, its sort of like going to a redhat channel and asking for centos support (okay Yah they are now the same entity, but you know what I mean :P)
[06:33] <rww> They're asking for help with Xubuntu 14.04. #xubuntu doesn't support 14.04, and Mint's channels don't support Xubuntu
[06:34] <rww> and #ubuntu+1 supports the dev version of what #ubuntu supports, which is #ubuntu and official flavors
[06:43] <abhra> Aki-Thinkpad, though i mentioned about xubuntu 14.04 specifically, but it is not working in ubuntu 14.04 either. moreover, #xubuntu does not support xubuntu 14.04 and i was advised to present the problem here from that channel. and i mentioned linux mint forum, because the  solution was mentioned in that forum. that solution worked in both ubuntu and xubuntu 13.10 with 3.11 kernel series.
[06:44] <Aki-Thinkpad> abhra, Oh fair enough;
[06:45] <Aki-Thinkpad> rww, someone is in a forgiving mood :P
[06:45] <rww> cleaning up our bantracker is easier if there are only four bans to track ;)
[07:00] <Aki-Thinkpad> ah well goodnight
[07:22] <dangelov> hey everyone - i was directed here from the main #ubuntu channel. I'm running 14.04 beta2, on which my internal laptop monitor doesn't work. It worked previously on 13.10, which was unusable because of lack of drivers for my wireless card. I've been looking for solutions online, but haven't found anything yet - i was hoping someone here may be able to help me out
[07:35] <KnownSyntax> Is there any way for you to try to see if it is a missing driver for your monitor? For me this happened after awhile but it was a bad "default" choice Ubuntu set on my graphics card.
[07:38] <dangelov> the display works just before ubuntu starts booting (i get a purple rectangle)
[07:38] <dangelov> xrandr also shows it as connected in output, with the correct resolution/refresh rate
[07:38] <dangelov> and so does Displays in system preferences
[07:39] <dangelov> would a screenshot of Displays, or a paste of the xrandr output help in narrowing down the problem?
[08:34] <efestito> hello, good morning, i'm trying to enable gesture trackpad, (3 or 4 fingers), i have search about it, and the easier way is using a perl-script, but i recieve that -m parameter over synclient is not recognized. (i'm over 14.04). is there other option to do that?
[08:37] <jluc> I pray
[08:38] <jluc> ubuntu god, please correct the nautilus bug that cripple the search tool
[08:38] <k1l_> !bug | jluc
[08:38] <jluc> ubuntu god, please correct the nautilus bug that prevent the correct resizing of columns and prevent the use of "place" column
[08:39] <jluc> ubuntu god, i know thou are good
[08:39] <jluc> please hear me
[08:39] <ikonia> jluc: stop it
[08:39] <ikonia> jluc: if you have a problem ask for help, log a bug so that it can start to get resolved
[08:40] <ikonia> rather than make random complaints to no-mans land
[08:40] <efestito> jluc, enable gestures trackpad
[08:46] <jluc> sorry
[08:46] <jluc> praying is not complaining
[09:20] <tomboy64> do i want for desktop use the lowlatency kernel or the generic one?
[09:28] <ikonia> why would you need low latency ?
[09:35] <zequence> tomboy64: -generic is fine for most things, especially for servers. -lowlatency is fine for most things, but not for servers
[09:35] <zequence> another term used for -lowlatency I sometimes see is -desktop
[09:36] <zequence> there are only a few cases when you would need -lowlatency - whenever you need to monitor something going into the computer with lowlatency
[09:36] <zequence> ..like playing a soft synth with a midi keyboard
[09:37] <zequence> -lowlatency has a bit less data throughput (about 10-20% less), but in return, you get higher preemptiveness
[09:45] <zetheroo> this seems to indicate that 14.04 will be released with libvirt 1.2.2 ... is this correct? http://www.ubuntuupdates.org/package/core/trusty/main/base/libvirt
[09:45] <lotuspsychje> !info libvirt
[09:46] <zetheroo> :P
[09:46] <jpds> zetheroo: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseNotes#Libvirt_1.2.2
[09:46] <lotuspsychje> !find libvirt
[09:46] <zetheroo> jpds: sounds good - thanks!
[09:46] <onca> when I move windows to the edge of my screen gnome tries to resize the window, this is undesirable but I cannot figure out how to turn it off. is there a way?
[09:47] <zetheroo> is anyone using gthumb in 14.04 ? ... it's totally unusable for me!
[09:47] <ikonia> glib error zetheroo ?
[09:48] <dangelov> is anyone having issues with built-in laptop monitors under 10.04 beta2?
[09:48] <ikonia> dangelov: how about just tell us your issue
[09:48] <dangelov> the screen is off, but everything i check indicates that it's on
[09:48] <bekks> !nomodeset | dangelov
[09:48] <dangelov> interesante
[09:48] <dangelov> alright, i'll try that, thanks
[09:49] <dangelov> the screen is off - not black though
[09:49] <zetheroo>  ikonia: yes  - how did you know!?
[09:49] <dangelov> do I still want nomodeset, or should I use
[09:49] <dangelov> acpi_osi=
[09:50] <ikonia> zetheroo: I am all seeing
[09:50] <zetheroo> ;)
[09:50] <ikonia> zetheroo: a bug has been logged for it already
[09:50] <zetheroo> apparently you are :D
[09:50] <zetheroo>  ikonia: yes, I logged one myself ...
[09:50] <bekks> dangelov: for using that parameter, you would have to decode your ACPI DSDT table first, to see the valid values for your specific ACPI implementation.
[09:51] <ikonia> zetheroo: maybe worth finding the other bug then and trying to link to it, rather than have 2 bugs for the same thing
[09:51] <bekks> dangelov: So unless you know how to do that, you want to use nomodeset first.
[09:51] <zetheroo>  ikonia: I have not heard anything back about it ... so I thought I might ask the IRC community ...
[09:51] <ikonia> zetheroo: you won't hear anything back about it - you have to push it
[09:51] <ikonia> zetheroo: it doesn't just get fixed on it's own
[09:51] <zetheroo> ikonia: push it!?
[09:51] <ikonia> zetheroo: yes, work with people to get it fixed
[09:52] <dangelov> bekks: thanks
[09:52] <zetheroo> ikonia: this is my bug ... how do I "push it"!? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gthumb/+bug/1307127
[09:52] <ikonia> zetheroo: ok, so that's a poor bug
[09:53] <ikonia> zetheroo: you need to verify it happens in a clean 14.04 isntall
[09:53] <ikonia> zetheroo: make sure it happens in the current 14.04 patch level
[09:53] <zetheroo> ikonia: why? many people will be upgrading from 13.20 to 14.04 ...
[09:53] <ikonia> zetheroo: not link to a pastebin that expires
[09:53] <zetheroo> 13.10
[09:53] <ikonia> zetheroo: yes, but finding out if the problem is a core problem, or cause by an ugprade helps
[09:53] <zetheroo> o
[09:53] <zetheroo> ok
[09:54] <ikonia> so people know where to look and can manage it
[09:54] <zetheroo> " current 14.04 patch level" ?
[09:55] <ikonia> yes, the current distro patch level
[09:55] <ikonia> include the error in the bug report, not a link to a pastebin
[09:56] <ikonia> forget the auto enchance feature, thats a seperate issue/task
[09:56] <zetheroo> ok, well if there is already another similar bug report out there I won't bother re-issuing this one ...
[09:56] <ikonia> basically you've just logged a bug that says "help, stuffs broken and missing"
[09:56] <ikonia> and then seem surprised that nothing is happening
[09:58] <dangelov> just tried nomodeset
[09:58] <dangelov> ubuntu now thinks my external monitor is my built-in one
[09:58] <dangelov> unplugging the external doesn't activate internal monitor
[10:06] <lotuspsychje> check this out for trusty: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/04/cirrus-7-nimbus-1-pc-ubuntu-14-04
[10:07] <ljunggren> yup
[10:07] <ljunggren> it looks awesome
[10:07] <ljunggren> i want one of those
[10:07] <lotuspsychje> :p
[10:08] <dangelov> so - i tried nomodeset and the acpi_osi=, the internal laptop monitor still doesn't want to start
[10:08] <dangelov> when ubuntu is booting, when I set the options, the monitor was working up until "initializing ram disk", after which it turns itself off
[10:23] <tomboy64> thanks zequence
[10:23] <tomboy64> i just finished installing ubuntu 14.04 via https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromLinux   / debootstrap and it finished with 40 packages left unconfigured
[10:24] <tomboy64> is it still likely that ubuntu will boot up fine?
[10:24] <ikonia> depends if you did a good install
[10:25] <tomboy64> heh
[10:25] <tomboy64> let's see
[10:27] <onca> so I just popped this ssd into my netbook from a much faster machine and while it works great what can I do to reduce latency?
[10:29] <onca> who doesn't love big brother? right?
[10:29] <lotuspsychje> onca: there are few settings for ubuntu you can tweak
[10:30] <onca> I think I tweaked them all
[10:30] <lotuspsychje> onca: https://sites.google.com/site/easylinuxtipsproject/ssd
[10:30] <onca> compiz settings are set, init scripts are off
[10:30] <lotuspsychje> onca: swappiness? fstab tweak?
[10:31] <onca> I had to add swap, because the drive came out of a beast with 16gb ram
[10:31] <lotuspsychje> onca: TRIM should be enabled by default in trusty
[10:31] <onca> and now it has only 2gb
[10:31] <bekks> onca: And why did you have to add swap then?
[10:32] <onca> that bigbrother comment was meant for a much sillier channel
[10:32] <onca> and wasn't appropriate in either one. so sorry
[10:32] <lotuspsychje> onca: what ssd brand did you get?
[10:32] <onca> I added swap to get the gimp to render properly
[10:32] <onca> lotuspsychje: I can't remember, but it's been serving me well
[10:34] <onca> I gave two away to friends
[10:34] <onca> I like the patriot one I gave away
[10:43] <onca> lotuspsychje: I discovered it's a 120GB kingston hyperX I bought for under 100$
[10:44] <lotuspsychje> onca: nice!
[10:44] <lotuspsychje> got myself a samsung evo, running on ubuntu 64bit netbook
[10:44] <lotuspsychje> rocketfast
[10:44] <onca> what's great is I took the drive out of a serious machine and put it in a netbook and your os booted right up perfectly
[10:44] <onca> you don't understand what that's worth to me
[10:45] <onca> if I had some money, which I don't, I'd donate
[10:45] <bekks> Donate to Samsung?
[10:46] <lotuspsychje> you can donate to me :p
[10:46] <bekks> Or to me, I'll pass the money to lotuspsychje then :P
[10:46] <lotuspsychje> lol
[10:48] <Koma> trusty daily build server?
[10:49] <bekks> Koma: full question?
[10:49] <Koma> nevermind wrong channel
[10:49] <Koma> but, as I'm here
[10:50] <Koma> using the daily today is near the same of downloading the GM?
[10:50] <Koma> (i mean Release)
[10:50] <lotuspsychje> 2 days remaining for final release
[10:50] <bekks> It is near, yes.
[10:51] <lotuspsychje> can happen alot of fixing in 2 days :p
[10:51] <Koma> I hope not :P
[10:51] <ljunggren> Hope not stuff gets fixed?
[10:51] <Koma> I mean, it's everything freezed righ now
[10:51] <ljunggren> yeah i heard about that
[10:51] <ljunggren> what does that mean?
[10:52] <Koma> ljunggren:  i hoe that there isn't much to be fixed
[10:52] <Koma> \\hope=/=hoe but I'll get used to this
[10:52] <MannerMan> Any chance that this one will be fixed in 14.04: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/1087090
[10:52] <ljunggren> Well, what does this mean? freeze?
[10:53] <Koma> that many of the packages has been freezed to a version so probably are already addressed as stable to release
[10:53] <lotuspsychje> MannerMan: bugs can exist a long time, its best you try to fix it then wait for release
[10:54] <MannerMan> lotuspsychje: Looking at it in launchpad, a fix seems to be committed
[10:55] <lotuspsychje> !info compiz
[10:55] <lotuspsychje> MannerMan: seems same version here
[10:56] <lotuspsychje> MannerMan: can you check your current version?
[10:57] <lotuspsychje> MannerMan: apt-cache show compiz
[10:57] <MannerMan> lotuspsychje: Currently i'm at work, so i'm using Ubuntu 12.04 (where the bug does not exist)
[10:58] <MannerMan> At home i'm running 14.04, so have to check up on it later
[10:58] <lotuspsychje> MannerMan: ok
[10:58] <MannerMan> But thanks for the info
[10:58] <zetheroo> I just installed 14.04 server onto one of our test servers ... and the network configuration is a bit odd ... instead of getting eth0, eth1, and so on, there is "p255p1" ... what's that!?
[10:58] <lotuspsychje> np
[11:06]  * Yelu is away: sorry, but I'm sooo busy with being away ...
[11:06]  * Yelu is back (gone 00:00:41)
[11:20] <jack> help, plz
[11:20] <jack> $ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[11:20] <jack> Paketlisten werden gelesen... Fehler!
[11:20] <jack> E: Encountered a section with no Package: header
[11:24] <zetheroo> jack: have you checked your sources.list /
[11:24] <zetheroo> ?
[11:35] <jack> zetheroo: checked?
[11:35] <jack> i never touched it...
[11:36] <jack> E: Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/de.archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_trusty_multiverse_i18n_Translation-en
[11:36] <jack> E: Die Paketliste oder die Statusdatei konnte nicht eingelesen oder geöffnet werden.
[11:37] <jack> sorry for the german
[11:41] <jack> what can i do now?
[11:44] <zetheroo> is this a fresh install of 14.04 .... or an upgrade?
[11:45] <zetheroo> can you pastebin your sources.list file?
[11:45] <Teduardo> <zetheroo: pxxpx means the pci-e or pci slot and the port number of the card
[11:45] <zetheroo> Teduardo: right, but why is it no longer eth0 etc ... ?
[11:46] <Teduardo> because using eths wasn't predictable
[11:46] <jack> one sec
[11:46] <jack> zetheroo: pretty fresh, no upgrade
[11:46] <Teduardo> im sure there is a way to go back to the old way
[11:47] <Teduardo> on dell hardware it's called em1 and em2, etc
[11:47] <zetheroo> Teduardo: with 14.04?
[11:47] <Teduardo> they did all of this so that the same port on the same box on 10000 machines are all addressed the same way all the time
[11:48] <zetheroo> Teduardo: I have never seen anything other than eth0, eth1, etc ... at least before 14.04
[11:48] <Teduardo> it might only do the em1, em2, thing on redhat, centos.. but the principal is the same; and the p1p2, etc stuff has been happening for a long time at least since 13
[11:49] <Teduardo> it may only do that on add-on ethernet cards though
[11:49] <Teduardo> and not built-in
[11:49] <Teduardo> p255 doesnt sound like a real device
[11:49] <zetheroo> it's doing it with built-in Intel cards
[11:49] <Teduardo> hmm that's not virtualized?
[11:49] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[11:49] <zetheroo> before this we had 12.04.4 and it was always ethx
[11:49] <Teduardo> weird, the only ones i've seen are like p1p1 and p1p2 and p2p1 and normal things like that, i've never seen a p255
[11:50] <Teduardo> anyway, to answer your question that's just the way it is now =)
[11:50] <zetheroo> no - this is not virtualized
[11:51] <zetheroo> I have p255p1 and p255p2 for the onboard NIC's ... and then p3p1 for the addon NIC
[11:51] <ikonia> zetheroo: device names have changed in all distros
[11:51] <ikonia> it's just updated udev rules
[11:51] <zetheroo> ok
[11:52] <zetheroo> I also noticed that "/etc/init.d/networking restart" doesn't seem to work anymore ...
[11:52] <funkyHat> It's related to the heartbleed exploit (it's not, I'm making it up)
[11:52] <Teduardo> funkyHat: crap now thats going to be breaking news on CNN for the next 18 hours
[11:52] <Teduardo> dont make jokes
[11:52] <funkyHat> ⢁D
[11:53] <Teduardo> (they dont get it)
[11:53] <ikonia> zetheroo: sysv init is dead, stop using bad habbits
[11:54] <zetheroo> ikonia: it was the only way that restarting the networking really worked in 12.04.x
[11:54] <ikonia> that's just nonsense
[11:54] <zetheroo> well "service networking restart" did not work nearly as well ...
[11:54] <ikonia> "work nearly as well"
[11:55] <ikonia> sorry - that's just nonsense
[11:55] <zetheroo> whats the "new" way? :P
[11:55] <jack> zetheroo: http://pastebin.com/bMBdH4VY
[11:55] <zetheroo> ikonia: sorry, it just didn't ... not for our networking setup anyhow ...
[11:55] <ikonia> zetheroo: it did
[11:55] <jack> seems like it is an upgraded raring
[11:55] <ikonia> zetheroo: it executes the same scripts
[11:55] <jack> sorry ;)
[11:55] <ikonia> it's black or white, the network is either down or up
[11:56] <ikonia> so how can it work "not as good"
[11:56] <zetheroo> ikonia: well we got different results with the two commands ...
[11:56] <ikonia> the network is either up or down - black/white
[11:56] <ikonia> so I don't know how you can get different results
[11:56] <zetheroo> the "restart" command I am talking about
[11:56] <ikonia> yes, it's either started, or stopped
[11:56] <ikonia> so again, I don't know how you can have different results
[11:57] <ikonia> but this is nothing to do with 14.04 - it's your lack of understanding
[11:57] <ikonia> so I suggest reading the admin guide
[11:59] <zetheroo> ikonia: when I made changes to /etc/network/interfaces and then would do "service networking restart" it would fail half the time ... but with "/etc/init.d/networking restart" the network would restart properly (meaning come back up with the updated settings) almost all the time.
[11:59] <ikonia> zetheroo: sure sure, whatever
[12:00] <zetheroo> That has been my experience - so I continued to use the "/etc/init.d/networking restart" command ... but if your saying that there is a better way that actually WORKS as well with bridging and bonding etc ... then by all means do tell ...
[12:00] <zetheroo> ;)
[12:01] <ikonia> read the admin guide
[12:06] <zetheroo> You talking about the Ubuntu Server Guide?
[12:06] <ikonia> that's a good guide
[12:06] <zetheroo> because this is what it says in Chapter 1.4 :
[12:07] <zetheroo> Now restart networking to enable the bridge interface:  sudo /etc/init.d/networking restart
[12:07] <zetheroo> Chapter 1.4 is the chapter on Bridging btw ...
[12:08] <zetheroo> ikonia: cool, looks like I was following the guide afterall ... :D
[12:09] <ikonia> does it really say that in the guide now?
[12:10] <zetheroo> ikonia: and again in section 3.2 :
[12:10] <zetheroo> After changing the config file you have to restart the dhcpd:
[12:10] <ikonia> what's the URL
[12:10] <jack> zetheroo: what should i do now?
[12:10] <ikonia> I only see the 13.10 server guide
[12:10] <zetheroo> sudo /etc/init.d/isc-dhcp-server restart
[12:10] <zetheroo> ikonia: https://help.ubuntu.com/12.04/serverguide/serverguide.pdf
[12:11] <ikonia> zetheroo: 12.04
[12:11] <ikonia> not 14.04
[12:12] <zetheroo> ikonia: yes, and I was saying that is what I WAS doing in 12.04.x and you were calling it "nonsense"! :P
[12:12] <ikonia> no, I didn't say what you where doing was nonsense
[12:12] <ikonia> I said the results you where seeing where nonsense
[12:12] <ikonia> that "one worked better"
[12:12] <zetheroo> well you called it a "bad habit" ...
[12:12] <ikonia> it is a bad habbit
[12:13] <ikonia> as system V is dead
[12:13] <zetheroo> when in fact it was a perfectly good habit as per the documentation
[12:13] <ikonia> the sooner you stop depending on system V scripts the better you'll be
[12:13] <zetheroo> uhm ... not yet ... it's got a few day to go ;)
[12:13] <ikonia> good luck with it then....
[12:13] <zetheroo> well sure, but it's not a "bad" habit mate!
[12:13] <ikonia> it is a bad habbit
[12:13] <zetheroo> rubbish
[12:13] <ikonia> and don't call me "mate"
[12:13] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system V init ?
[12:16] <zetheroo> it's how things were done for the past several years with the latest official Ubuntu LTS release as per the documentation ... so it's not "bad" .... it may be old ... but not "bad"!
[12:16] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system V init - yes / no
[12:16] <ikonia> even in 12.04 - doe it use system v init
[12:16] <ikonia> does
[12:16] <zetheroo> So now the documentation is wrong!?
[12:16] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system v init - yes/no
[12:16] <zetheroo> spinning ... just spinning ... :P
[12:17] <ikonia> you seem either unwilling or unable to answer the question
[12:17] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system v init - yes/no
[12:17] <zetheroo> what use is the documentation if people on IRC know better!?
[12:17] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system v init - yes/no
[12:17] <zetheroo> you yourself pointed to the documentation repeatedly!
[12:17] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system v init - yes/no
[12:18] <zetheroo> and now you want to skip on over to something else because the documentation does not suite your opinion that documented instructions for the latest official LTS release are "bad" - HA!
[12:18] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system v init - yes/no
[12:18] <ikonia> if you answer the question, I can actually explain
[12:18] <ikonia> but you seem unable to answer this question
[12:18] <zetheroo> why don't you just explain?
[12:19] <ikonia> but you seem unable to answer this question
[12:19] <ikonia> does ubuntu use system v init - yes/no
[12:19] <zetheroo> I am not going to answer because I don't know! But I DO know what the docs say ... and if you know better than the docs why then do you refer to them!?
[12:19] <ikonia> ok, that's fair enough, you don't know
[12:20] <ikonia> that's all you had to say
[12:20] <zetheroo> if you know better than the docs why then do you refer to them!?
[12:20] <ikonia> so ubuntu doesn't use system V init - it uses upstart, and there are some legacy links to system v init scripts to call the upstart jobs
[12:20] <ikonia> to depend commands from an init system that is no longer in user and being maintained with hacks - is a "bad habbit"
[12:20] <ikonia> I'm a little dissapointed that the docs seem to reference this still, however I applaud you following them
[12:20] <zetheroo> how is anyone reading the docs supposed to know that... or even what that means!?
[12:21] <ikonia> what what means ?
[12:21] <zetheroo> "ubuntu doesn't use system V init - it uses upstart, and there are some legacy links to system v init scripts to call the upstart jobs"
[12:21] <ikonia> ubuntu not using system V init has been well documented for a while
[12:22] <ikonia> as you rightly point out though, that is the documented way of calling the upstart jobs, so that's the right way to do it
[12:22] <zetheroo> All that is immediately important to me is "how to restart networking"  ... and so I lookup the docs and it say xyz ....
[12:22] <ikonia> so you did the right thing then
[12:22] <zetheroo> ok
[12:23] <zetheroo> so now with 14.04 it's different I am guessing
[12:23] <ikonia> I suggest you follow the same practce
[12:23] <ikonia> practice
[12:23] <zetheroo> or maybe it has been since 13.10 or 13.04 ... ?! We tend to only use LTS releases here so I wouldn't know what's going on with 12.10, 13.04 and 13.10 ...
[12:24] <ikonia> not the 13.10 docs (which appear to be identical to the 12.04 ones) seem to suggest the same thing
[12:24] <zetheroo> in the 13.10 doc I found this under Bridging: sudo service networking restart
[12:26] <zetheroo> 12.10 doc also has "sudo service networking restart" under Bridging ...
[12:27] <ikonia> you're not using 12.10/13.04 are you ?
[12:27] <ikonia> either way it doesn't matter to the 14.04 build
[12:28] <zetheroo> no
[12:28] <zetheroo> oh, I found the 14.04 giude
[12:29] <zetheroo> hmmm .... it says this now: sudo ifup br0
[12:29] <zetheroo> under Bridging ...
[12:29] <zetheroo> so no network restart at all ... !? :P
[12:30] <zetheroo> seems in other parts of the docs to still use the "service servicename restart" command ...
[12:32] <zetheroo> one other thing I could not do like before (with 12.04.x) was ssh into root@hostname ... it will not accept the root password .. so I have to ssh into user@hostname and then su into root ...
[12:32] <k1l_> zetheroo: why dont you use sudo?
[12:32] <k1l_> !sudo | zetheroo
[12:33] <zetheroo> k1l_: yes that is an option ... but I rather be in as root ...
[12:33] <zetheroo> everything I do is as root anyhow ...
[12:33] <Rory> zetheroo: You've set a root password, right?
[12:33] <zetheroo> Rory: yep
[12:33] <k1l_> ubuntu is build around sudo. so that is the proper ubuntu way. is there a need to be always root? besides old habbits?
[12:34] <Rory> zetheroo: If you find yourself always being root, you may want to re-think your linux usage paradigms
[12:34] <Rory> zetheroo: Like when Windows Xp made every account an administrator
[12:34] <zetheroo> put it this way, if I was not logged in as root 100% of my commands would have to start with "sudo" in front of them
[12:35] <zetheroo> so .. is anyone aware of a "new" security feature which prohibits sshing as root on 14.04?
[12:35] <ikonia> it should be blocked by default on all distros
[12:36] <ikonia> 1.) the root account is locked 2.) the sshd config should disable any root login
[12:38] <k1l_> zetheroo: again: "i need to always be root" means there is something wrong at all. but do as you like, its your system. but be aware that ubuntu is build around sudo
[12:38] <k1l_> zetheroo: see the ssh server config if root login is permitted
[12:38] <ikonia> it should be disabled by default, I'm shocked it's not disabled in earlier versions
[12:39] <ikonia> (if it's not)
[12:39] <zetheroo> ok thanks ... checking now
[12:39] <zetheroo> in 12.04.x it was working out of the box ;)
[12:39] <ikonia> enabling it will fail many audits, so be aware of your business has any iso standards, this will void pretty much all of them
[12:39] <k1l_> ikonia: root login was enabled so far, dont know if that changed (which i would prefer)
[12:39] <Rory> ikonia: It 100% isn't blocked in Ubuntu 12.04, you can ssh as root if you can write a malicious authorized_keys file to /root/.ssh/
[12:40] <ikonia> k1l_: Rory poor
[12:40] <Rory> I agree, it's a terrible default to have
[12:40] <zetheroo> ok , I see it as being "PermitRootLogin without-password"
[12:40] <zetheroo> so with a swap of ssh keys it is still possible then by default!?
[12:40] <Rory> zetheroo: Perhaps it disallows password logins, but allows logins with key-based authentication
[12:41] <Rory> zetheroo: Try adding your key to /root/.ssh/authorized_keys
[12:41] <zetheroo> Rory: yep ... sounds like that
[12:42] <zetheroo> Rory: that worked a treat!
[12:44] <Rory> zetheroo: I feel dirty
[12:44] <zetheroo> ;)
[12:51] <zetheroo> jack: if it's not an upgrade why does your sources.list file contain this: "# deb cdrom:[Xubuntu 13.04 _Raring Ringtail_ - Release amd64 (20130423.1)]/ raring main multiverse restricted universe" ?
[13:25] <Gamoder_> Hi everyone, I got the following problem: I am using Ubuntu 14.04, 64 bit, XFCE and nm-applet is not shown
[13:25] <Gamoder_> (even if I start it - but it is running and sometimes even shows notifications)
[13:29] <gabmus> hello i have a problem: i dont see the volume popup anymore when pressing volume buttons. I'm using ubuntu gnome 14.04 with the gnome3 ppa.
[13:31] <gabmus> anyone?
[13:43] <gad-zllang> my os no sound now .
[13:43] <gad-zllang> today  i install some upgrade package.
[14:03] <Rory> gad-zllang: Have you tried turning it off and on again?
[14:03] <Rory> (seriously, though)
[14:04] <gad-zllang> Rory: how?
[14:04] <gad-zllang> i try restart
[14:04] <Rory> gad-zllang: in the top-right, click the cog, choose Shut Down
[14:04] <Rory> gad-zllang: Then press the button on your computer which turns it on
[14:05] <gad-zllang> Rory: i see ,i alread restart it .
[14:05] <gad-zllang> Rory: it not work.
[14:05] <Rory> OK. Can you make sure it's set to use the correct output device for sound? Click the volume button, click Sound Settings
[14:06] <Rory> You'll see a list of possible devices on the left, make sure the one you want it selected
[14:06] <gad-zllang> it only a dummy
[14:06] <Rory> That's the only one in the list?
[14:06] <Rory> I'll refer you to this wiki page which has a few more troubleshooting steps to try https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SoundTroubleshooting
[14:07] <Rory> No
[14:07] <Rory> Not that one, my apologies
[14:07] <Rory> This one ----> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingSoundProblems
[14:31] <riverloop> Hi, anyone here? I can't do a DUN using Trusty.
[14:31] <riverloop> Anyone experiencing same issues?
[14:33] <holstein> riverloop: dial up?
[14:33] <riverloop> Btw, I'm talking about bluetooth dialup.
[14:33] <riverloop> holstein, yeah.
[14:33] <hydruid1> Is it the 17th YET? lol
[14:34] <riverloop> It used to work in 12.04. There were issues starting from kernel versions 3.8, however.
[14:34] <holstein> sounds awful, riverloop .. i would test as independently as possible
[14:34] <riverloop> Disconnecting dialup connection caused kernel panics, but I think it is fixed in the later kernel releases. Haven't got a chance to try 3.10, 3.11, etc.
[14:35] <holstein> should be easy to test with live CD's
[14:35] <riverloop> I can confirm it used to work in 13.04 (don't know about 13.10)
[14:35] <riverloop> My laptop is an Acer Aspire 4736z, and the phone I'm using is a Nokia 5230, if that makes any difference.
[14:36] <holstein> riverloop: likely not, unless nokia has promised to support linux for you
[14:37] <riverloop> I'm sorry, I don't have a speedy internet connection. I can't do that right now
[14:37] <holstein> riverloop: i would test things as independently as possible.. does the phone work? is bluetooth working? USB, etc.. i would try those with live CDs, and just look for bug reports (if any), though, ideally, it would be nokia that could "Fix" this
[14:37] <gad-zllang> \Rory
[14:37] <holstein> anytime you say "think", just go in and confirm
[14:38] <Rory> gad-zllang: Hello, yes?
[14:38] <riverloop> If I should test using a live CD, I should download the ISO first, which is impossible with my current connection speed.
[14:41] <riverloop> holstein: yes, it works. I use it in 12.04, it works flawlessly.
[14:41] <riverloop> I installed 14.04 in another partition yesterday. Pairing the phone works okay. But when I tick the "Access Internet using this phone", it takes forever to detect the phone configuration, and ultimately times out.
[14:42] <holstein> riverloop: no need to install anything
[14:42] <riverloop> holstein: thanks for a helping mind. :)
[14:42] <holstein> riverloop: use the live CD's to test
[14:43] <holstein> riverloop: is bluetooth working? if not, the dial up wont
[14:43] <gad-zllang> Rory, i just offline .
[14:43] <holstein> riverloop: is USB? that would be necesssary as well
[14:43] <gad-zllang>  i download a oem-audio-hda-daily-dkms source package from code.launchpad.net . but i cannt built it .
[14:43] <riverloop> Btw, it's just bluetooth DUN that is not working. Right now I'm using USB DUN from the very same phone.
[14:43] <holstein> riverloop: wow.. i know what i would do
[14:44] <gad-zllang> when make , it need unpatched-source.
[14:44] <holstein> riverloop: since im not guaranteed linux support for the device from the device manufacturer, id just use it with USB
[14:45] <holstein> otherwise, i still dont see that you have tested that bluetooth is working.. bluetooth will need to be working for you to use bt DUN
[14:46] <riverloop> holstein: Bluetooth is working.
[14:47] <riverloop> holstein: I can transfer files to and fro. No problem.
[14:48] <riverloop> issue is with dialup only.
[14:48] <holstein> id say, other than letting nokia know you are having a hard time, and troubleshooting with live CD's for different kernel versions, i know i would just use USB tether
[14:49] <riverloop> Yeah. I tested it using live USB yesterday. Same problem persists for 14.04.
[14:49] <holstein> nothing about linux is preventing that from working, but, its also challenging to expect it to facilitate it
[14:49] <riverloop> But I have the option of USB dialup, that's why I installed it rightaway.
[14:50] <riverloop> But it would be nice to have bluetooth DUN working. I'm not sure many people use bluetooth DUN nowadays.
[14:50] <holstein> i think you'll do better finding a user with that actual device
[14:50] <holstein> riverloop: this is not even about bt DUN, as far as we know
[14:51] <holstein> could be more about that specific device
[14:52] <riverloop> holstein: Maybe not. The phone configuration is not detected at all.
[14:53] <riverloop> holstein: Yeah, I better find one person using the same phone to connect to a linux box via bluetooth DUN, to access internet.
[14:53] <holstein> riverloop: i say, a few mailing lists/forums might help you find those users
[14:54] <riverloop> holstein: do you think submitting a bug report would be a better idea?
[14:55] <riverloop> holstein: Yeah. Thanks for guiding. I'll surely look into it.
[14:55] <holstein> riverloop: ideally, nokia would have a bug program, and you could submit that there.. i really feel like the burden is misplace to expect the linux kernel to provide support for it, since, its not doing anything to prevent that support.. as a matter of fact, its totally welcoming said support
[14:55] <holstein> riverloop: but, an official bug support would be a good idea, if there is not already one
[14:56] <holstein> !bug
[14:56] <holstein> riverloop: if you find one, you may find a user there who is at least doing bt DUN.. not many are.. which is a challenge for you
[15:11] <pseubodot> Is the 17 APR release estimate for another RC or for 14.04 proper?
[15:12] <BluesKaj> pseubodot, it's the official release, not an rc
[15:12] <pseubodot> ok
[15:12] <pseubodot> thanks
[15:13] <pseubodot> I'm working with a colleague through an issue with CUPS on the 14.04 rc
[15:14] <pseubodot> intermittant problem when printing from browse. the argument line to gs uses %stdout instead of %stdout% (per docs)
[15:14] <pseubodot> browser, rather
[15:14] <pseubodot> and the print job dies
[15:16] <BluesKaj> pseubodot, hmm, if it's a work machine one has to expect problems with a beta release, not recommended to use on the job yet. It's still bit early days for workplace computing.
[15:17] <pseubodot> BluesKaj: the best way to prevent bugs is to find them early. :)
[15:19] <BluesKaj> pseubodot, agreed, but let the edgy/devel users find the bugs first before committing and that can up to a month after official release IME.
[15:19] <BluesKaj> take up to a month
[15:20] <pseubodot> edgy ~= equivalent of debian/unstable?
[15:20] <darthanubis> window shade broken for anybody?
[15:21] <BluesKaj> edgy = beta releases
[15:21] <darthanubis> double clicking titlebar shades window but leaves a ghost outline. Only way back to program is by clicking it's icon in the taskbar. Unity.
[15:21] <pseubodot> so similar to debian's 'testing' distro then
[15:22] <BluesKaj> pseubodot, I imagine so , haven't used debian testing OS in a while
[15:27] <pseubodot> Hmm
[15:27]  * pseubodot points to al___
[15:27] <al___> hello
[15:29] <pseubodot> so how would we contact the edgy/devel folks?
[15:33] <BluesKaj> pseubodot, join # ubuntu-devel
[15:34] <BluesKaj> err #ubuntu-devel
[15:34] <BluesKaj> ps that's if you use unity/gnome desktop
[15:34] <BluesKaj> pseubodot,^
[15:36] <BluesKaj> pseubodot, but there are users here who could probly help with cups. I'm just not one of them.
[15:39] <al___> the cups problem is on a fresh install unity 14.04. nothing fancy
[15:53] <HorusHorrendus> Hey all ... I'm using Kubuntu 14.04 and had a weird bug in Firefox & Thunderbird (black boxes appearing all over the screen after some time) that didn't go away, even if I disable smooth scrolling & hardware acceleration in firefox
[15:54] <HorusHorrendus> yesterday I found this bug here: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=68410 and I followed the instructions and switched AccelMethod to uxa instead of the standard (sna?)
[15:54] <HorusHorrendus> and it is gone, so it seems like the current beta/rc is affected by this bug (at least on some machines)
[16:04] <module000> is the indicator whitelist (for tray icons from chrome, skype, sylpheed, etc) dead forever in 14.04? or is there a way to get indicator icons working in 14.04's unity?
[17:06] <nonuby> any idea where this redundant icon (same login/logout button almost as far right) has come from?  http://uploadir.com/u/fxe19g0h
[17:06] <mathuin> Noticed the other day that I have two networking icons on my gnome panel thing.  This particular system has wired but no wireless AFAIK.  Why might I have two icons?
[17:09] <k1l_> i had the doubled NM icons, too. but the other one is gone since some days now
[17:10] <mathuin> Okay, I'll reboot when I go home and see if that fixes it.
[17:25] <darthanubis> flash just broke
[18:31] <utusan> done prepping 14.04, and ubuntu installer doesn't offer you anymore choice of what disk to install grub.  just install to sda which is wrong/bad
[18:32] <bekks> how many disks do you have in your system then?
[18:32] <utusan> I have 2 and sda happens to be the usb installer
[18:33] <utusan> and I want it on sdc
[18:33] <HorusHorrendus> anyone knows of a problem with ubuntu 14.04, intel graphic cards, default (sna) acceleration and black boxes in firefox & thunderbird
[18:33] <HorusHorrendus> similar to this bug here: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=68410
[18:33] <HorusHorrendus> switching to uxa acceleration fixes it, but I would like to use sna :)
[18:39] <rberg> HorusHorrendus: I have been seeing the same thing, and also strange white lines in kde once and a while
[18:39] <HorusHorrendus> rberg: yeah white lines or white boxes ... also in KDE
[18:39] <HorusHorrendus> I mean I also use KDE
[18:40] <HorusHorrendus> uxa seems to have no such screen artifcats ... so to me it seems very similar to above bug, but ubuntu 14.04 already has a higher intel driver version than stated in this bug
[18:43] <trism> HorusHorrendus: somebody linked this bug a couple days ago: bug 1282867
[18:46] <trism> HorusHorrendus: the last comment from about 40 minutes ago says the latest mesa (which was updated yesterday) fixes it, have you updated today?
[18:46] <HorusHorrendus> trism: thx for the link, yes I updated but been using uxa since yesterday evening
[18:46] <trism> HorusHorrendus: although the changelog says "fix rendering in unity" so might not help kde
[18:47] <HorusHorrendus> trism: well I can switch back to sna and see ... will follow the bug for the moment
[18:50] <pepee> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_athlon_r3linux&num=1 http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_am1_catalyst&num=2
[18:52] <pepee> isn't it great? many ubuntu users could benefit (now and in the future) from trusty, simply by using the latest stable kernel...
[19:00] <Meerkat> new ubuntu increased the levels of monitor dimming it seems.  What do I do?
[19:10] <Meerkat> ctrl+alt+f2 should be it
[19:11] <beardtree> Meerkat: it's black on F1-F7
[19:11] <Meerkat> if it doesn't work you can do a shutdown by typing alt+sysrq+r,e,i,s,u,b
[19:11] <beardtree> I know, but I am in the middle of an upgrade and that will likely leave my system in a broken state
[19:12] <Meerkat> I had some black screens too after the screen was locked.
[19:12] <Meerkat> oh, fuck.
[19:16] <Meerkat> you can't wait it out either because the installer holds the upgrade when asking to update certain config files. But maybe you knew that. Crappy situation.
[19:20] <beardtree> So what do I do?
[19:21] <quem> hmm, i tried installing the latest daily build (ubuntu server) on an old computer with btrfs for /, but the "installing the system" step failed. now i tried with ext4 instead, and it reached 100%.
[19:21] <quem> was looking forward to using btrfs for /. :(
[19:22] <quem> now i'm a bit discouraged to try it with my NAS server and primary laptop when i install 14.04 on them during the weekend.
[19:23] <quem> or not.. the same error just popped up.
[19:25] <Meerkat> quem, same error on ext4?
[19:26] <quem> yeah.
[19:26] <quem> log is very vague..
[19:26] <quem> a few "Unexpected error; command not executed"
[19:26] <quem> nothing concrete.
[19:27] <quem> i'll try tomorrow's daily build again.
[19:48] <rohan> does anyone know when 13.10 will stop being supported? is it right after 14.04 release, or is there a timeframe to upgrade?
[19:49] <holstein> rohan: 9 months support on 13.10
[19:49] <holstein> !13.10
[19:50] <holstein> so, should be somewhere around 3 months from now
[19:50] <rohan> holstein: so 3 months af
[19:50] <rohan> correct
[19:50] <rohan> thanks, holstein
[19:50] <holstein> cheers
[19:52] <rohan> the 14.04 release notes talk about something called "Oxide" -- anyone have any idea what it is?
[20:14] <trism> rohan: I think it is the new browser widget, for the ubuntu-touch apps, etc: https://launchpad.net/oxide
[20:15] <rohan> trism: interesting, thanks. wonder why they chose to fork chromium -- the chromium browser receives updates in ubuntu anyway
[20:15] <rohan> from the QML api i guess
[20:28] <CrazyZurfer> hi, downloaded an 14.04 iso but cannot install it
[20:28] <CrazyZurfer> right now Ive choosen try it
[20:29] <holstein> CrazyZurfer: cool.. let us konw if you have a question
[20:29] <CrazyZurfer> but when choosing if I want to delete my ubuntu 13.10 and install or upgrade or delete windows and ubuntu and install... I choose the delete ubuntu 13.10 and install 14.04  but then doesnt give me the option to continue, the button continue seems disabled
[20:29] <CrazyZurfer> brb
[20:29] <CrazyZurfer> now works
[20:30] <CrazyZurfer> this thing is weeeird
[20:30] <holstein> CrazyZurfer: you might just not be patient enough for the live media
[20:32] <CrazyZurfer> holstein: might be... lol :)
[20:32] <CrazyZurfer> I've got a question... which nvidia driver should I use?? should I keep using bumblebee?
[20:33] <CrazyZurfer> or ubuntu 14.04 supports nvidia optimus out of the box?
[20:50] <beidl> CrazyZurfer: yes it does, you can apt-get install nvidia-prime nvidia-331-updates
[20:51] <beidl> and in nvidia settings you can switch between those two. the change requires you to re-login though.
[20:51] <beidl> between the two GPUs*
[21:10] <rohan> beidl: do you know if nvidia-prime does power management also? i.e. does it shut off the GPU when it's not in use?
[21:11] <beidl> rohan: when you select the intel GPU and re-login it deactivates the nvidia GPU through ACPI trickery (using bbswitch)
[21:12] <rohan> beidl: so it's still not as seamless as bumblebee, right?
[21:12] <beidl> rohan: you can't run 1 app with the intel GPU and the other with the nvidia GPU, but generally the whole DE uses the nvidia GPU
[21:13] <beidl> rohan: I actually prefer the nvidia-prime way
[21:13] <beidl> rohan: so either you fully run with intel or fully run with nvidia, depending on your setting in nvidia-settings
[21:13] <rohan> beidl: and you keep the nvidia card always powered up?
[21:13] <beidl> rohan: nope, only when gaming
[21:14] <rohan> but you need to logout and back in to start gaming?
[21:14] <beidl> rohan: yup. I actually wrote an indicator that requries no password and automatically logs me out
[21:14] <rohan> beidl: any reason you prefer this method over bumblebee then?
[21:15] <rohan> i am trying to see the advantage :)
[21:15] <beidl> rohan: the whole environment is accelerated, not only one specific app
[21:16] <rohan> beidl: but you generally don't have the whole environment accelerated, right, you said you have it only when gaming?
[21:17] <beidl> rohan: when I'm done gaming, and wanna do something else before shutting down, I notice it :)
[21:17] <rohan> fair enough
[21:17] <beidl> rohan: when I'm at school, I run on the intel GPU, when I'm home I generally run on nvidia
[21:18] <rohan> ah gotcha
[21:19] <beidl> rohan: I agree that more flexibility would be nice but it's not that bad :)
[21:39] <cmars> anyone getting stuck at "Installing new version of config file /etc/init/systemd-logind.conf ..." on apt-get dist-upgrade?
[21:41] <spikebike> nope, what does top show?
[21:41] <spikebike> I've done mostly fresh installs and do_release_upgrades
[21:43] <cmars> spikebike, from pstree, bash───sudo───apt-get───dpkg───libpam-systemd:───invoke-rc.d───start
[21:44] <cmars> sounds like i should open a bug on libpam-systemd
[21:57] <danmarnda> hi installing ppa kernel 3.14 and 3.15 make no control over screen brightnes...
[21:58] <danmarnda> have anyone  any solution?
[21:59] <holstein> danmarnda: dont use the ppa.. or ask the ppa maintainer for maintenance
[21:59] <k1l> danmarnda: make sure the kernels are build to support that
[21:59] <danmarnda> hm I think they are becous it work like one time over 30
[21:59] <danmarnda> just now get back to mineline
[22:01] <danmarnda> I think problem is with intel p-state
[22:01] <danmarnda> becous when I activate p-state on mineline same problem
[22:59] <johnjohn101> is it ready?
[23:05] <ChibaPet> Hello all. I'm wondering if there's a good place to read about changes in the impending 14.04 release. I'm thinking of trying it on a partition on a 13" rMBP/Haswell/Iris. The help wiki talks about 13.10 and while I don't suspect anything huge to have changed, I'm curious.
[23:05] <holstein> !14.04
[23:05] <holstein> just try it live
[23:06] <ChibaPet> Mm, downloading the beta now. I wanted something to read while it comes down, but that seems to be what you linked. Thanks!
[23:06] <holstein> i would get the daily
[23:06] <ChibaPet> hrm
[23:06] <holstein> but, the beta is fine, if you are already getting it
[23:06] <holstein> you'll download it one way or the other
[23:07] <ChibaPet> I can get the daily... I pulled it from release.ubuntu.com/14.04/ - where would I find a daily ISO?
[23:07] <ChibaPet> s/it/the beta/
[23:08] <holstein> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[23:08] <ChibaPet> Oh, hm, yeah - the beta's a bit long in the tooth now I see.
[23:08] <ChibaPet> ty
[23:08] <holstein> unless someone says theres something wrong with it, and i dont think there is
[23:08] <ChibaPet> The web site was noting 14.04 LTS (cloud at least) being released on the 17th - while things can obviously change, historically are desktop/server/cloud released together?
[23:09] <johnjohn101> hopefully not much wrong 2 days before release
[23:09] <ChibaPet> Mm.
[23:09] <holstein> ChibaPet: all the official versions should release the same day
[23:10] <ChibaPet> I'm looking forward to trying it again. It's been a long time since I tried installing Ubuntu on anything.
[23:10] <holstein> no reason to. try it live and see how it works
[23:11] <holstein> by the time im ready to "try ubuntu", i already have a pretty good idea of how exactly the hardware supports linux
[23:11] <ChibaPet> Well. Yeah. I'm happy to do that. I made some space on a disk where it can live, though. :) I'm happy to give it its allotted 50g.
[23:11] <holstein> trying it live is just an easy step in the process
[23:12] <holstein> no reason not to try it live, and test the audio, wifi, etc.. see what will work how after you install, and if anything will be problematic
[23:12] <ChibaPet> I have little faith in laptops lately. Within the last month I've sent back both a ThinkPad T440 and an ASUS ZenBook, both of which had awful problems with SecureBooting Fedora despite my reading reports to the contrary. I think the MacBook will do okay given that reports of it under 13.10 are positive.
[23:12] <ChibaPet> Mm, I will happily try the LiveCD tonight.
[23:13] <holstein> i have had no luck with macbooks, and i definitely, personally will not get one to run linux on
[23:13] <holstein> if i wanted a machine to run linux on, i would get a system76 that is designed for it
[23:13] <ChibaPet> I was really feeling hopeful about the ZenBook and it crushed my spirit, so I went for the Mac as a safe fallback. If it works well I'll be happy.
[23:13] <holstein> otherwise, its live CD, and careful testing
[23:14] <ChibaPet> The problem there is that I wanted an ultrabook with a backlit keyboard, and those are thin on the ground. I probably should have gotten a Dell XPS Developer Edition, but I was reading horror stories about overheating there.
[23:14] <holstein> basically, you are taking on the responsibility of a reseller.. a team of experts at apple makes sure that machine works with all the hardware its supposed to work with. and you are saying "no thanks, i'll handle all that on my own"
[23:14] <ChibaPet> System76 and (I forget the name) the other popular equivalent both had systems vaguely like what I wanted, but without the backlit keyboard.
[23:15] <ChibaPet> Exactly. Hence, 50g partition shaved off the top, and dual-booting. I keep my fallback. :)
[23:15] <ChibaPet> As long as I don't melt the hardware I can restore from back-ups easily enough.
[23:16] <ChibaPet> Anyway, thanks for the pointers and advice. Heading home, and I'll write out the daily image to a USB stick and give it a run.
[23:16] <holstein> cheers
[23:21] <CrazyZurfer> should I install bumblebee or ubuntu 14.04 suppors nvidia OPTIMUS out of the box? :)
[23:22] <johnjohn101> ChibaPet: i think you'll like 14.04.   rock solid here
[23:22] <holstein> CrazyZurfer: i would just try it and see.. bumblebee didnt work for me, but i mauy have the wrong hardware im testing
[23:25] <CrazyZurfer> I've an nvidia Geforce 650M
[23:26] <holstein> CrazyZurfer: id say, just fire up the live CD and see. if the open driver supports it, you should be able to tell from there
[23:27] <CrazyZurfer> well.. 13.10 didn't find anything in additional controllers, now I see a few options.. it says that now X.org x is being used... I'm affraid that installing any other might have the video card on all the time that's dangerous because of the heat


[23:49] <Aaron> any ircops online?
[23:50] <Aaron> so they can insert my cloak?
[23:50] <Aaron> for ubuntu member


[00:01] <knome> D-MAN, alt+f2 -> xfce4-panel
[00:01] <knome> D-MAN, is that what you meant?
[00:01] <D-MAN> yeah i did that and panel at top came back but with ni menus?
[00:02] <D-MAN> no menus
[00:02] <knome> did you have menus?
[00:02] <knome> did the panel disappear after boot or suddenly?
[00:03] <D-MAN> you know at the top were it says applications oplces and sytem all is missing?
[00:03] <D-MAN> options
[00:03] <knome> yes.
[00:04] <D-MAN> all of that is missing off the window and firefox everything
[00:04] <D-MAN> nrrd to get it back
[00:04] <D-MAN> its not my pc just helping a friend
[00:05] <knome> D-MAN, you can add those panel applets back
[00:05] <D-MAN> knome i run hardy on my pc
[00:05] <D-MAN> do you know how
[00:06] <knome> D-MAN, right click the panel and select "add new item"
[00:06] <D-MAN> knome what distro you run?
[00:06] <knome> D-MAN, xubuntu intrepid
[00:06] <knome> D-MAN, but it is the same in hardy
[00:07] <D-MAN> also is there a way to add persons name in chat without typing it in every time?
[00:07] <knome> D-MAN, you can try pressing the first letter(s) and then tab
[00:07] <D-MAN> seems like xubuntu uses less system resources is that true>
[00:08] <knome> yes
[00:08] <D-MAN> kool thinking bou putting it on my pc
[00:08] <retour> Anybody using DVD-RAMs?
[00:08] <D-MAN> so does that mean it runs faster?
[00:09] <knome> D-MAN, yes..
[00:09] <knome> D-MAN, most possibly yes.
[00:10] <D-MAN> knome: kool man thanks allot
[00:10] <knome> np.
[00:13] <D-MAN> knome: one more question is xubuntu gnome or kde?
[00:13] <knome> D-MAN, xfce
[00:13] <D-MAN> knome: oh what is that?
[00:14] <knome> D-MAN, it's an alternative for gnome and kde.
[00:14] <D-MAN> knome: or what exactly does it mean?
[00:14] <D-MAN> knome: just different code source or what?
[00:14] <knome> D-MAN, it's just a difference desktop environment.
[00:14] <knome> D-MAN, different source yes and a bit different way to work
[00:15] <knome> D-MAN, and maybe a bit different feature-wise
[00:15] <D-MAN> knome: sorry im new to linux and trying to figure it all out but im enjoying the challenge
[00:16] <knome> D-MAN, np. have fun :)
[00:17] <D-MAN> knome: yeah im never going back to windows !!!!!
[00:17] <knome> :)
[00:18] <D-MAN> knome: peace out
[00:24] <robert__> how do i connect my palm treo to my laptop?
[01:53] <wes> is there a lock screen in xubuntu
[01:53] <wes> ?
[02:35] <R1cochet> i think so yes
[02:35] <R1cochet> think its the same as in gnome
[02:47] <R1cochet> !screenlock
[04:01] <KlrSpz> hey guys, need some help.. i have upgraded to Intrepid (8.10) and now my nVidia drivers don't work.. According to nVidia's README, my card (Go 7300) should be supported, but GDM always says it can't load the nvidia driver... the restricted drivers manager doesn't ever enable the driver either.. any ideas?  http://pastebin.ca/1278498
[04:31] <jmichaelx> !xkb
[04:31] <jmichaelx> !keyboard layout
[04:31] <jmichaelx> of course you don't
[04:46] <mjec> hi guys, I'm having an issue where the Task List panel item is just showing one task labeled "??" at all times, regardless of properties or what's running
[04:46] <mjec> suggestions?
[06:09] <dnyy> After installing the xubuntu-desktop package, and playing with it for a while, my USB stick stopped being recognized in both it and gnome.  I was going to do a fresh install of xubuntu, but I need it working first. Any idea why it wouldn't be showing up? :(
[06:39] <Guest32999> Hello.
[08:24] <blankthemuffin_> Hey, I'm wondering how well you think xubuntu would go on a P2, with limited ( about 256MB ) ram.
[15:49] <raderack> good morning
[15:50] <charlie-tca> good morning, raderack
[15:52] <raderack> anyone knowns where i can find a description of xubuntu(or ubuntu) services? i need to remove some of then,so my notebook(p3 800,178mb),can gain more memory to work with..(yes,im new to it)
[15:57] <sevenseeker> considering partnership with arm (http://www.ubuntu.com/news/arm-linux) I would think xfce would be even better for these solutions, what do you guys think?
[15:58] <charlie-tca> raderack: you could search at https://help.ubuntu.com/ for each one. That will get some explanations for you.
[16:02] <raderack> charlie-tca, an description of the boot-scripts is the same?
[16:02] <charlie-tca> What boot scripts?
[16:03] <charlie-tca> are you looking in /etc/init.d or /etc/rc?.d
[16:03] <raderack> yes
[16:04] <charlie-tca> Scripts in /etc/rc?.d are for different run-levels which Xubuntu does not use except 1 and 2, to the best of my knowledge.
[16:05] <charlie-tca> Most scripts in /etc/init.d can be researched in https://help.ubuntu.com/ . Turning off the item in Applications -> System -> Services will deactivate the script
[16:06] <raderack> thanks charlie-tca
[16:06] <charlie-tca> no problem.
[16:06] <raderack> in a search in ubuntu forums,people said that enlightenment is lighter to run,thats truth?
[16:16] <knome> raderack, yeah that's the case but it isn't so easy to configure and has less or different features
[16:16] <whileimhere> Hi how is xfce doing on 8.10 these days?
[16:17] <knome> whileimhere, great afaik
[16:17] <raderack> so  for a beginner like me,is easier to keep using xfce?
[16:17] <knome> raderack, compared to what?
[16:17] <raderack> compared to using enlightenment
[16:17] <knome> raderack, enlightenment?
[16:17] <whileimhere> Has there been any major improvments? I used to use it but was switched to GNOME and now was thinking about switiching back on my new laptop.
[16:18] <knome> raderack, well i suppose so
[16:18] <knome> whileimhere, not really anything BIG, but imho the xubuntu release was the most impressive of the 8.10 series
[16:18] <whileimhere> I use it mostly for MAME and for Photos anymore.
[16:19] <whileimhere> I do a lot of graphics work for people.
[16:19] <knome> raderack, you can also install enlightenment and on gdm just select which one you want to use
[16:19] <knome> whileimhere, http://xubuntu.org/contribute ;)
[16:19] <slinkeey> Hey All!
[16:19] <knome> hello slinkeey
[16:20] <slinkeey> Quick Qustion.. Not really a problem but....
[16:20] <slinkeey> I replaced the video card in my PC.. Di I need to reinstall Xubuntu 8.04 so that it regognises everything correctly?
[16:20] <knome> slinkeey, you shouldn't have to.
[16:20] <raderack> thanks,i tried to install e16 using a tuto that i found on ubuntu forum,but it didnt work
[16:20] <slinkeey> ok
[16:20] <raderack> so i will try e16
[16:21] <slinkeey> How did it find the different video cards drivers?
[16:21] <knome> raderack, you can get enlightenment from the repos
[16:21] <knome> slinkeey, magic
[16:21] <slinkeey> be quiet, hehehe
[16:22] <knome> well the system will look for any devices and they are recognised by their output
[16:22] <slinkeey> ahh ok
[16:22] <slinkeey> and then it see the ATI video card and then is there a database of drivers?  OR does it not use drivers?
[16:23] <knome> it's the same way windows or any other OS will recognise them
[16:23] <slinkeey> i know but windows will prompt me for what drivers to use
[16:23] <raderack> only e16..and people said that version e16 need more work to be suitable for a new user..but e17(development version),already have something in default install
[16:23] <knome> i don't know exactly, but i suppose it then just knows which drivers to use
[16:23] <slinkeey> ok
[16:23] <raderack> but doing a cvs install,isnt that easy..:(
[16:24] <knome> raderack, suppose you should still try e16 first
[16:24] <knome> raderack, and see if it suits you at all
[16:24] <slinkeey> thanks
[16:24] <knome> raderack, enlightenment really is something which is powerful only if you can use it, imho
[16:25] <knome> *know how to...
[16:25] <raderack> knome im still looking for a good tuto about configuring e16..when i get one,i will try e16(using synaptic package manager)
[16:25] <knome> !enlightenment
[16:25] <knome> duh
[16:25] <raderack> ah there is no rush,i have time to read.
[16:26] <knome> raderack, http://www.enlightenment.org/p.php?p=support&l=en
[16:27] <raderack> hmm..and the dumb heare was searching in ubuntu forums,lol
[16:27] <raderack> thanks knome
[16:27] <knome> np
[16:45] <eichi> hello, where are the firewall settings?
[16:45] <eichi> i installed cups server and want to access it from lan
[17:03] <Aquina> hello
[17:26] <oim> hi
[17:26] <oim> ı am using kubuntu 8.10. ı want to use xfce. how can ı do that?
[17:29] <Myrtti> install xubuntu-desktop
[17:31] <oim> Myrtti: there arent any package like that
[17:32] <Myrtti> are you sure?
[17:32] <oim> ı look at it with adept
[17:33] <Myrtti> you do have universe enabled?
[17:34] <oim> i do in with terminal. it is realy there :)
[17:34] <Myrtti> so there, install that
[17:34] <oim> i do it. thanks
[23:13] <dnyy> How can i tell what version of xfce is installed?
[23:39] <teear> Is it possible to set 4:3 as the default aspect ratio in VLC?
[23:40] <Twili> They have a Ultra-mobile PC USB image for Ubuntu 8.10, is there one for Xubuntu?


[16:03] <slashd> o/
[16:03] <andreas> o/
[16:04] <rbasak> o/
[16:07] <smb> ½o/
[16:08] <nacc> o/
[16:08] <nacc> sorry about that!
[16:08] <nacc> #startmeeting ubuntu-server-team
[16:08] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Oct 10 16:08:15 2017 UTC.  The chair is nacc. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:08] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[16:08] <nacc> #topic Review ACTION points from previous meeting
[16:08] <nacc> rbasak: smoser: did y9ou get to yours?
[16:08] <rbasak> No, sorry. Please carry again.
[16:08] <nacc> #action nacc to write a release notes entry on ipv6 netboot (carried over)
[16:08] <meetingology> ACTION: nacc to write a release notes entry on ipv6 netboot (carried over)
[16:08] <nacc> #action nacc to write a server guide entry on ipv6 netboot (carried over)
[16:08] <meetingology> ACTION: nacc to write a server guide entry on ipv6 netboot (carried over)
[16:09] <smoser> nacc, no. sorry.
[16:09] <nacc> #action rbasak to add maintainership info to mysql triage page (carried over)
[16:09] <meetingology> ACTION: rbasak to add maintainership info to mysql triage page (carried over)
[16:09] <smoser> :-(
[16:09] <nacc> rbasak: smoser: np, thanks
[16:09] <nacc> #action nacc to consider http2 info in artful release notes (carried over)
[16:09] <meetingology> ACTION: nacc to consider http2 info in artful release notes (carried over)
[16:09] <nacc> #action smoser to add a cloud init (and if there is something curtin) release notes entry for artful (carried over)
[16:09] <meetingology> ACTION: smoser to add a cloud init (and if there is something curtin) release notes entry for artful (carried over)
[16:09] <nacc> #topic Artful Development
[16:09] <nacc> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtfulAardvark/ReleaseSchedule
[16:09] <nacc> #subtopic Current Work
[16:09] <nacc> #link https://trello.com/b/U9HhWyT0/daily-ubuntu-server
[16:09] <nacc> anything to highlight?
[16:10] <nacc> #subtopic Release Bugs
[16:10] <smoser> bug 1722566 will have an upload today for a fix
[16:10] <nacc> smoser: great, thanks
[16:10] <nacc> #info bug 1722566 will have an upload today for a fix
[16:10] <nacc> #link http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-aa-tracking-bug-tasks.html#ubuntu-server
[16:11] <andreas> I've been working on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lighttpd/+bug/1707312
[16:11] <andreas> and I think the fix will introduce a change in behavior
[16:11] <andreas> so I'm not sure it's sru worthy
[16:11] <nacc> #info andreas is working on 1707312, for which the fix might be a behavior change, which might not be SRU-able
[16:11] <andreas> the change is that it changes any action involving "stop" into a graceful-stop, meaning that any stop could take up to 60s (that's the timeout)
[16:12] <andreas> I've prepared test packages for the reporter to try, but in parallel I'm thinking about declaring it a wontfix
[16:12] <nacc> andreas: does it need fixing in artful?
[16:12] <andreas> yes
[16:12] <andreas> well
[16:12] <andreas> sort of
[16:13] <andreas> I can't elaborate now
[16:13] <andreas> a new upstream will make this easier, but it's not released yet
[16:14] <nacc> ok
[16:14] <nacc> shall we move on?
[16:14] <nacc> #topic Server & Cloud Bugs & SRU/Pending Uploads (slashd, ddstreet)
[16:15] <slashd> Everything is under control for us this week. Here's the list of things we are currently working on : http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/25714583/
[16:15] <nacc> #link http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-z-tracking-bug-tasks.html#ubuntu-server
[16:15] <nacc> #link http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-x-tracking-bug-tasks.html#ubuntu-server
[16:15] <nacc> #link http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-t-tracking-bug-tasks.html#ubuntu-server
[16:15] <nacc> slashd: thanks!
[16:15] <slashd> thanks nacc
[16:15] <nacc> #info everything under control for SRU/Pending. List of things currently being worked on is at: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/25714583/
[16:16] <nacc> #topic Weekly Updates & Questions for the QA Team (powersj)
[16:16] <powersj> oh boy lost track of time
[16:16] <nacc> powersj: np
[16:16] <powersj> last week I worked on cloud-init integration tests and making small modifications that we agreed to during the rally
[16:16] <powersj> Getting all test cases setup with KVM working, however having discussions about the use of /tmp
[16:17] <powersj> This week continuing that work and starting work on aws/gce backend
[16:17] <powersj> (hopefully)
[16:17] <powersj> will probably also need to look at ISO results
[16:17] <powersj> and make sure we are still green for release
[16:17] <powersj> questions?
[16:18] <nacc> #info QA update: last week cloud-init integration tests and rally feedback; getting all tests working with KVM (with discussions ongoing on use of /tmp)
[16:18] <nacc> #info QA update: this week: continuing the same; starting on aws/gce backend; looking at ISO results (for artful release)
[16:18] <nacc> powersj: thanks!
[16:18] <powersj> nacc: thx
[16:18] <nacc> #link https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/
[16:18] <nacc> #topic Weekly Updates & Questions for the Kernel Team (smb, sforshee)
[16:18] <smb> Not much to report. 4.13.0-12.13 should be the artful release kernel, pending no last minute issues. If there are any issues found, make sure to ping the kernel team directly and not rely on us noticing bugs.
[16:19] <nacc> #info 4.13.0-12.13 should be the artful release kernel; if any issues are found, ping the kernel team directly
[16:19] <nacc> smoser: thanks!
[16:19] <nacc> smb: rather
[16:19] <nacc> #topic Upcoming Call For Papers
[16:19] <nacc> #link https://lwn.net/Calendar/Monthly/cfp/
[16:20] <andreas> I have nothing new
[16:21] <nacc> #topic Ubuntu Server Team Events
[16:21] <nacc> nothing new there
[16:21] <nacc> #topic askubuntu.com questions (teward) - Better communication with community.
[16:21] <nacc> teward: around?
[16:22] <nacc> #topic Open Discussion
[16:22]  * nacc wonders if teward's entry should be removed from the agenda
[16:23] <andreas> do you remember why it's about hikm?
[16:23] <andreas> him*
[16:23] <nacc> andreas: no
[16:23] <rbasak> He's an askubuntu.com moderator
[16:23] <rbasak> And active in ~ubuntu-server
[16:24] <rbasak> But I haven't seen him around recently. Perhaps he's busy with other things right now.
[16:24] <nacc> rbasak: right, but the agenda entry doesn't idicate that, or why that needs to be on the weekly meetinng
[16:25] <rbasak> I think someone suggested that we could discuss the proposal with him at the meeting.
[16:25] <rbasak> (possibly me)
[16:25] <nacc> rbasak: what proposal?
[16:25] <rbasak> I think I've summarised it in a previous ping to him in this meeting. One moment, I'll find that.
[16:26] <rbasak> Here we are
[16:27] <rbasak> https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2017/ubuntu-meeting.2017-09-26-16.02.log.html
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:16
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:16 <rharper> #topic askubuntu.com questions (teward) - Better communication with community.
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:17 <rbasak> teward: if you're around, we were wondering about expanding bug triage to watching relevant askubuntu.com questions.
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:17 <rbasak> We were thinking about watching a tag, and it would be nice if moderators and other editors knew that it could be used to get our attention by adding the tag.
[16:27] <nacc> #action nacc to add clarification to agenda entry for AU topic
[16:27] <meetingology> ACTION: nacc to add clarification to agenda entry for AU topic
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:18 <rbasak> Thought about communicating with relevant askubuntu.com people early to discuss this idea, and your name came up.
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:18 <rbasak> If you're not about, we can defer to a future meeting.
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:18 <rharper> #info discussion about expanding bug triage for ubuntu-server by watching relevant askubuntu.com questions, deferring to another irc meeting
[16:27] <rbasak> 16:19 <rharper> #action re-raise askubuntu.com questions (teward) - Better communication with community discussion
[16:28] <rbasak> 16:19 * meetingology re-raise askubuntu.com questions (teward) - Better communication with community discussion
[16:28] <rbasak> Thanks nacc
[16:28] <nacc> AOB?
[16:29] <nacc> #topic Announce next meeting date, time and chair
[16:29] <nacc> dpb is up next, 2017-10-17 at 1600 UTC
[16:29] <nacc> #info dpb is up next, 2017-10-17 at 1600 UTC
[16:29] <nacc> #endmeeting
[16:29] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Oct 10 16:29:37 2017 UTC.
[16:29] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2017/ubuntu-meeting.2017-10-10-16.08.moin.txt
[16:29] <nacc> thanks everyone and sorry again for being late
[16:30] <andreas> thanks nacc


[02:33] <dax> meeting in 30 minutes
[02:58] <nhaines> 2, actually.
[02:58] <pleia2> o/
[02:59] <nhaines> Hiya, pleia2!  :)
[03:00] <nhaines> #startmeeting
[03:00] <darthrobot> Meeting started Mon Jan  9 03:00:08 2017 UTC.  The chair is nhaines. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[03:00] <darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[03:00] <nhaines> #chair lynorian pleia2
[03:00] <darthrobot> Current chairs: lynorian nhaines pleia2
[03:00] <dax> o/
[03:00] <lynorian> o/
[03:00] <pleia2> o/
[03:00] <nhaines> Hi everyone, and welcome to the January 8th meeting of the California Ubuntu Local Community Team!
[03:00] <nhaines> Happy new year to everyone, of course.  :)
[03:00] <pleia2> happy new year :)
[03:01] <nhaines> I hope everyone had a great holiday season and is currently making peace with their normal work schedule again.  :)
[03:01] <nhaines> Tonight's agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/17January08
[03:01] <darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/17January08 - Ubuntu Wiki]
[03:02] <nhaines> #topic Upcoming events
[03:02] <nhaines> Are there any upcoming events happening in the next couple of weeks?
[03:03] <pleia2> https://www.meetup.com/Ubuntu-California/events/236431693/
[03:03] <darthrobot> [403] Title: [Attention Required! | CloudFlare]
[03:03] <pleia2> heh, that's for an Ubuntu Hour in Pasadena on the 12th
[03:03] <nhaines> They have great Ubuntu Hours.  :)
[03:04] <nhaines> I'd go more if the traffic timing was better!
[03:05] <nhaines> Okay, that's one to keep an eye on.  And if anyone's sad that there are no Ubuntu Hours near them, it's never a wrong time to start a new one.  :)
[03:05] <nhaines> #topic Announcements
[03:05] <nhaines> Before we go on to our agenda items does anyone have any announcements?
[03:06] <pleia2> nothing from me
[03:07] <nhaines> Alrighty.  We should be ramping up SCALE planning full-speed ahead.  Next meeting is Thursday, so I suspect there will be more to talk about next meeting.
[03:07] <nhaines> #topic Agenda
[03:07] <lynorian> ok nhaines
[03:07] <nhaines> The topic of tonight's agenda is the Ubuntu California leadership elections.
[03:08] <nhaines> There was only one nomination offered during the nomination period, for three seats.
[03:08] <lynorian> oops I forgot
[03:09] <nhaines> We've had trouble finding enough people for an actual election for years.  Last year there were only 3 nominees.
[03:10] <nhaines> There are a couple of possible explanations, but I want to put two forward.
[03:11] <nhaines> 1. Running the nomination and voting period through December and the various winter holidays is a terribad time to run leadership elections.
[03:11] <nhaines> 2. There may not be enough LoCo activity to support a three-person leadership council--this was an experiment that was externally imposed on the LoCo some years ago.
[03:12] <nhaines> I'm open to other possibilities, too.  And we should try to decide how we're going to move forward for the short-term future.
[03:13] <pleia2> since this happens every year and we've done them earlier (november) I'm inclined to think it's mostly #2
[03:13] <pleia2> if you look at the number of active people in the LoCo hosting events, it's quite low
[03:14] <pleia2> and the folks who do the ones in SD and Pasadena aren't super involved with day to day running of things (though they do great work in running what they do)
[03:14] <lynorian> Yeah I think it might be #2
[03:14] <nhaines> I'm inclined to agree.
[03:14] <dax> my impression is #2 also, as someone who hasn't really been involved in the day-to-day but has been watching from afar
[03:15] <dax> (mailing list archive, irclogs, etc.)
[03:15] <nhaines> And a good LoCo exists to let people be super awesome at day-to-day running of things and not necessarily have to worry about the entire state.
[03:16] <nhaines> Before the leadership council, the single leadership position was there to sort of coordinate or moderate as necessary, and any member was free to step up if they wanted.  Run a meeting, run an event, etc.
[03:17] <nhaines> That hasn't changed with a leadership council.
[03:17] <lynorian> Yes nhaines
[03:17] <lynorian> what happens if someone ends up just suddenly having no time
[03:18] <pleia2> maybe we just need a vice president ;)
[03:18] <lynorian> that is what I would worry about with only one person
[03:18] <nhaines> Then per the Ubuntu Code of Conduct, they let others know, and others can step in temporarily or more permanently, as needed.
[03:18] <dax> add a process to call an election midyear due to inactivity?
[03:18] <dax> or lack-of-time-ity
[03:20] <nhaines> If there were a serious problem, the LoCo Council could assist.
[03:20] <nhaines> But since anyone can update the wiki and the LoCo contact handles requests for event supplies via Canonical, the impact would be pretty minimal.
[03:20] <pleia2> yeah, I'm inclined away from too many processes
[03:21] <pleia2> right
[03:22] <nhaines> Me too.  Processes can be added as needed.
[03:23] <pleia2> so, shall we draft a single leader adjustment to our leadership doc and put it to the list for discussion?
[03:23] <nhaines> I like that idea.
[03:23] <dax> i note that the election process could be adjusted to pick one to three leaders based on how many get above a "no confidence" line
[03:23] <dax> i don't care between 1-3 and 1 tho
[03:24] <nhaines> I propose that the current leadership team remain in place until we draft an adjustment to the leadership doc and timely elections are completed.
[03:25] <lynorian> nhaines, makes sense
[03:25] <pleia2> wfm
[03:25] <pleia2> dax: that could work too
[03:26] <nhaines> I'd also like to not make things too crazy before SCALE, but elections have never had an impact on that anyway.
[03:26] <pleia2> yeah
[03:26] <nhaines> Okay, let's make it official.
[03:26] <nhaines> #vote Draft a single leader adjustment to our leadership doc and put the amendment to the mailing list for discussion.
[03:26] <darthrobot> Please vote on: Draft a single leader adjustment to our leadership doc and put the amendment to the mailing list for discussion.
[03:26] <darthrobot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[03:27] <nhaines> +1
[03:27] <darthrobot> +1 received from nhaines
[03:27] <pleia2> +1
[03:27] <darthrobot> +1 received from pleia2
[03:28] <pleia2> lynorian?
[03:28] <pleia2> dax?
[03:29] <lynorian> +1
[03:29] <darthrobot> +1 received from lynorian
[03:29] <dax> +1
[03:29] <darthrobot> +1 received from dax
[03:31] <pleia2> I think that's everyone who is around :)
[03:31] <nhaines> #endvote
[03:31] <darthrobot> Voting ended on: Draft a single leader adjustment to our leadership doc and put the amendment to the mailing list for discussion.
[03:31] <darthrobot> Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[03:31] <darthrobot> Motion carried
[03:32] <nhaines> Okay, so that's what we'll do.  We'll figure out a voting schedule once we have something that the LoCo likes.
[03:32]  * pleia2 nods
[03:32] <nhaines> Any other thoughts on the situation?
[03:33]  * lynorian does not have anything
[03:33] <pleia2> I will say I probably can't work on this much, just started a new job last week (yay, eek) and I'm off to linux.conf.au on wednesday for 10 days, busy busy
[03:33] <nhaines> Ooh, exciting!
[03:33] <dax> probably should start the whole process over (including nominations) once amendment is all sorted out
[03:33] <nhaines> dax: +1
[03:33] <pleia2> dax: nods
[03:33] <lynorian> +1
[03:35] <nhaines> Okay, there's no sense in *rushing* things, but we should have some substantial progress by next meeting.
[03:35] <nhaines> #topic Other business
[03:35] <pleia2> I know you said you'll have more news about scale later, but any word on whether we're doing an ubucon?
[03:36] <nhaines> Yes, Richard and I are working with Canonical and the SCALE team and we will be putting out a call for speakers pretty quickly.
[03:36] <nhaines> We're finishing up the conference format logistics.
[03:37] <pleia2> will it be thursday?
[03:37] <pleia2> the ubucon, not the cfp ;)
[03:38] <nhaines> Thursday and Friday, as before,  :)
[03:38]  * pleia2 nods
[03:38] <pleia2> thanks for your work on it
[03:38] <lynorian> yes last time was good
[03:38] <nhaines> Thanks!  It was a bit more of a push-start this year but we've got some forward momentum now.  :)
[03:39] <nhaines> All right, it's a new year!  Snaps are the thing!  Unity 8s are the thing.  Phones are not the thing, but once snaps hit them, then they'll be the thing again!
[03:39] <pleia2> hehe
[03:40] <nhaines> So here's to the start of a fascinating new year for Ubuntu and for the LoCo.
[03:40] <pleia2> :)
[03:40] <nhaines> The next meeting is January 22nd, 2017.  Take care everyone.  :)
[03:40] <nhaines> #endmeeting
[03:40] <darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon Jan  9 03:40:22 2017 UTC.
[03:40] <darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2017/ubuntu-us-ca.2017-01-09-03.00.moin.txt
[03:40] <pleia2> thanks nhaines
[03:42] <nhaines> thanks everyone and dax.


[00:00] <micahg> can you please file a bug with 2 attachments, the previous email and the one that quotes it as .eml files?
[00:01] <micahg> upstream likes test cases :)
[00:01] <micahg> you can edit the .eml to remove your email address if you like
[15:33] <BUGabundo> boas o/
[18:51] <hackel> Is anyone here able to use Prism from the mozilla-daily PPA with, say, gmail?  For me it stopped working several months ago and just gives a jumbled mess (on karmic).
[18:51] <micahg> hackel: I think there's an open bug
[18:51] <micahg> I haven't had time to look into it yet
[18:51] <micahg> I suggest using the version from karmic repos
[18:52] <hackel> Oh okay, just wanted to be sure I wasn't the only one.
[18:53] <micahg> bug 487128
[18:53] <hackel> Yeah on there now. :)
[18:53] <micahg> bug 492965