[12:01] <jtaylor> is there a command to print everything related to locale?
[12:01] <jtaylor> e.g. something smarter than: env | grep -E "LC|LANG"
[12:05] <Ampelbein> jtaylor: Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but doesn't the "locale" command print that information?
[12:05] <jtaylor> duh
[12:05] <jtaylor> to obvious for me :)
[12:05] <Ampelbein> heh
[12:09] <jtaylor> hm the parallel package in unstable dropped the --tollef option and added a conflcit with moreutils
[12:09] <jtaylor> I don't like that
[12:09] <jtaylor> how aobut in ubuntu we split moreutils in moreutils with conflict and a moreutils-no-parallel which doesn't?
[12:09] <jtaylor> that allows one to use the useful stuff form moreutils and the awesome parallel program
[18:12] <[0gb_us]> There seems to be an error in the Ubuntu Software Center. Some results (for example, zsnes), show up in search results but are unable to be installed, as the Software Center says they're not in the current software sources.
[22:42] <Noskcaj> What do i do if an existing debian package doesn't have a watch file?
[22:44] <jtaylor> you can write one and send it to the maintainer
[22:44] <jtaylor> though for ubuntu watch files are not important, I don't think we have anything that checks them
[22:44] <Noskcaj> There's one written, but the maintainer seems to be MIA. I've adopted the package
[22:44] <Ampelbein> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/ should query watch files in ubuntu
[22:44] <jtaylor> then you can just add it


[00:35] <nealmcb> re: the ec2 root password/sudo issue - is there a way to not have a password for the ubuntu user, and use the ssh credentials during a sudo to authenticate as root?
[00:35] <nealmcb> or kerberos, or something?
[00:36]  * nealmcb hates being logged out and presented with an auto-generated password to manage
[01:10] <erichammond> nealmcb: Please send your EC2 beta feedback to the mailing list so there is a record of it<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[01:11] <nealmcb> erichammond yeah - probably not enough people around now to chat here...
[01:12] <erichammond> nealmcb: FWIW, I'm not a fan of the current strategy, but it is difficult to be both secure and easy in the EC2 environment especially if you're trying to do things the Ubuntu way.
[01:12] <erichammond> Note that it is (currently) possible to simply ignore the ubuntu user and ssh back in as root :)
[01:14] <erichammond> You could also pass in a startup user-data script which modified sudoers to allow sudo without a password (but don't tell the security guys I said so).
[01:16]  * nealmcb puts on his security hat and looks around with upturned eyes
[01:16] <nealmcb> :)
[01:19] <nealmcb> I think I was just asked for a mysql password no fewer than three times on install - a bit rude....
[01:20] <nealmcb> (I refused to set one each time)
[03:14] <nealmcb> aha - sudo via ssh-agent implemented for openbsd: http://www.usenix.org/event/lisa08/tech/full_papers/burnside/burnside_html/index.html
[03:16] <nealmcb> that's what we need for ec2
[05:34] <antdedyet> deploying a ubuntu server with kvm. :)
[05:35] <antdedyet> I haven't quite convinced the client of using ubuntu in the guests for some clients who are used to Other Distros(tm), but the host is hardy.
[05:36] <antdedyet> pretty plesant experience so far. cheers on kvm gui management tooks shaping up since last winter.
[05:36] <antdedyet> s/tooks/tools
[06:12] <Lokin> Can someone help me?
[06:13] <Lokin> I can't seem to ssh to my server
[06:13] <Lokin> and my website isn't up....
[06:14] <ropetin> Lokin: do you have local access to the box?
[06:16] <Lokin> ya
[06:16] <Lokin> just grabbed a moniter
[06:18] <Lokin> Crap. Ok never mind, How do I make my IP static?
[06:19] <Lokin> ropetin ?
[06:19] <antdedyet> Lokin: did you provide deem the IP static?
[06:19] <jmarsden> Lokin: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/serverguide/C/network-configuration.html
[06:20] <Lokin> When I set up the DNS server I set the old ip but It changed...
[06:22] <jmarsden> Lokin: Do you mean the IP of the Ubuntu server, or your public IP as provided by your ISP?  You may need to use a dynamic DNS client if you want a server on a connection that has a dynamically assigned IP from your provider.
[06:24] <Lokin> curl whatismyip.org, That is my ISP ip right? and then <IP_ADDRESS> would be the server IP?
[06:28] <jmarsden> Probably.  So if the answer you are seeing from whatismyip.org is changing, you have an Internet connection from your ISP with a dynamic Ip address... so you need to use a dynamic DNS type solution.
[06:29] <jmarsden> See http://www.no-ip.org for example.
[06:32] <Lokin> jmarsden: I can't use this because my server is command line. Right?
[06:34] <jmarsden> Are you sure??  I think their linux client doesn't need a GUI... checking...
[06:35] <jmarsden> The clietn is at http://www.no-ip.com/client/linux/noip-duc-linux.tar.gz and does not seem to need a GUI to me...
[06:42] <Lokin> How do I restart apache and ssh again?
[06:44] <jmarsden> sudo service apache2 restart && sudo service ssh restart
[06:46] <Lokin> jmarsden: apache2: Could not reliably determine the server's fully qualified domain name, <IP_ADDRESS> for ServerName
[06:46] <Lokin> Take it thats the dynamic IP messing things up?
[06:47] <jmarsden> Lokin: That's you changing the internal (LAN) IP of the server, probably.
[06:47] <jmarsden> Edit /etc/hosts to sort that out.
[06:47] <Lokin> erg
[06:47] <jmarsden> It will probably "work" OK despite the warning, actually.
[06:48] <Lokin> Doesn't work at all out side of lynx localhost
[06:49] <jmarsden> OK, then edit /etc/hosts and put the actual static local IP of the server in there with the FQDN and hostname of the server and restart apache
[06:50] <Lokin> The static being an IP of the thing I would sign up for?
[06:50] <Lokin> At the moment I didn't think I had a static IP.
[06:51] <jmarsden> No... hmm, I think you need some basic info on IP and NAT and how the Internet works??  Your server has a local and hopefully static IP address on your LAN.  I pointed you to the page of the Ubuntu Server Guide which describes that earlier...
[06:51] <jmarsden> I said: Lokin: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/serverguide/C/network-configuration.html
[06:51] <Lokin> K i'll...
[06:51] <Lokin> ya read that
[06:51] <jmarsden> did you do what that says to get a static IP for your server??
[06:53] <Lokin> I need to get better in Unix....
[06:53] <Lokin> One sec I'm working on it
[06:55] <Lokin> does the Static IP matter? and it has to be local right 192.168.x.x?
[06:57] <jmarsden> It has to be on your LAN.  It has to be unique within your LAN.
[06:57] <jmarsden> Other that that you get to pick what number you want; if it was <IP_ADDRESS> dynamically, you can use that...
[06:58] <Lokin> ok
[06:58] <Lokin> so thats set
[06:58] <Lokin> iface eth1 inet static
[06:59] <jmarsden> OK, so edit /etc/hosts to match that and then restart apache
[06:59] <Lokin> k
[07:00] <Lokin> <IP_ADDRESS>           UbuntuServer
[07:00] <jmarsden> OK, now does apache restart cleanly?
[07:01] <Lokin> same error but instead of 127.0.11 it now uses <IP_ADDRESS>.....
[07:01] <Lokin> What is the fully qualified domain name??
[07:02] <jmarsden>  servername.mydomain.com  (or whatever it really is!)
[07:02] <jmarsden> You write UbuntuServer in /etc/hosts, is that your hostname?
[07:03] <Lokin> I mean I log into to alex@UbuntuServer
[07:03] <Lokin> so yes
[07:04] <jmarsden> OK, so the FQDN is UbuntuServer.yourdomain.com (if your domain name is yourdomain.com)
[07:04] <Lokin> UbuntuServer.truehelix.com
[07:05] <Lokin> Where should the DNS be pointing to from the Domain registrar?
[07:06] <jmarsden> OK.  So now as long as your router has port 80 open from the outside redirected to <IP_ADDRESS>, you should be set.
[07:06] <jmarsden> Lokin: ?  I don't understand your question.  DNS host record for ubuntuserver.truehelix.com should point to whatever whatismyip.com says your public IP is.
[07:07] <jmarsden> But since you can't edit it every time it changs, you can use no-ip.org, sign up, and automatically update the DNS.
[07:07] <Lokin> I set the DNS record from ixwebhosting
[07:07] <jmarsden> OK.  You can do that.  As long as you chaneg ti every time your ISP changes your public IP :)
[07:08] <Lokin> :/ OK well how do I install somthing on a webpage via command line?
[07:09] <Lokin> because no-ip needs a download(of course) and I only have command line on my server
[07:09] <ropetin> Lokin: wget is your friend
[07:09] <ropetin> man wget
[07:09] <Lokin> :)
[07:09] <Lokin> thanks
[07:09] <ropetin> NP!
[07:09] <Lokin> lol
[07:10] <Lokin> OK now on to ssh :(
[07:10] <Lokin> I can't connect anymore
[07:10] <Lokin> even via the new ip
[07:11] <Lokin> used to be able just not anymore
[07:12] <ropetin> if you ssh from the local box can you access?
[07:13] <Lokin> no...
[07:13] <Lokin> but wait
[07:13] <Lokin> the eth1 address is <IP_ADDRESS>
[07:13] <Lokin> whereas the port fowarding is .1.107
[07:13] <Lokin> that may be a problem....
[07:13] <jmarsden> Yes, it would be.
[07:14] <ropetin> You can remove the word may from that
[07:14] <Lokin> indeeed, that be a problem.
[07:14] <Lokin> Better?
[07:15] <jmarsden> More accurate, less gramatically correct ;)
[07:15] <ropetin> :P
[07:18] <Lokin> lol
[07:18] <Lokin> Sorry, needed a scon
[07:18] <Lokin> var hungry
[07:20] <Lokin> Damn this is really starting to piss me off
[07:21] <jmarsden> Then it might be good to stop, do something else, and come back to it later?
[07:22] <Lokin> I would but I need to sleep soon. School in the morning.
[07:23] <jmarsden> Your call.  You could leave it for 24 hours... I doubt your web server is earning you $millions/hour or anything? :)
[07:23] <Lokin> lol
[07:24] <Lokin> This is true
[07:24] <Lokin> http://thar.us/view/1440
[07:24] <jmarsden> Have you edited the Ip addresses so the ones in your server agree with the router regarding your subnet?
[07:24] <Lokin> but I want ssh working at least
[07:24] <Lokin> I do a fair bit on it at school
[07:24] <Lokin> I'm just wondering where else I would have to change then to <IP_ADDRESS>
[07:24] <Lokin> btw, Don't browse thar
[07:25] <Lokin> its Var dangerous.
[07:25] <jmarsden> edit /etc/network/interfaces and /etc/hosts
[07:25] <Lokin> ya got those
[07:25] <Lokin> Is that for ssh also?
[07:25] <jmarsden> Yes.  Now restart networking, ssh and apache
[07:25] <Lokin> networking?
[07:25] <Lokin> ok
[07:25] <jmarsden> (or just reboot the server)
[07:26] <Lokin> k
[07:26] <Lokin> all restarted
[07:26] <Lokin> ssh<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[07:26] <Lokin> and nothin
[07:27] <Lokin> ya just timed out
[07:27] <jmarsden> Are you sure that is your current public IP?
[07:28] <Lokin> Ya...
[07:28] <Lokin> I started iptables with the startup prints
[07:28] <Lokin> how do I disable them?
[07:28] <jmarsden> Turn that back off
[07:29] <jmarsden> Did you use ufw or something else ?
[07:29] <Lokin> service iptables stop?
[07:29] <Lokin> halt?
[07:29] <jmarsden> Sure.
[07:29] <jmarsden> stop
[07:29] <Lokin> k
[07:29] <Lokin> iptables is unrecognized...
[07:30] <jmarsden> How did you start up your firewall on the server?
[07:30] <jmarsden> What did you do?
[07:30] <Lokin> Never had...
[07:30] <jmarsden> How did you start up iptables?
[07:30] <Lokin> Well...   Read and learn and take notes, you are now a server admin!
[07:34] <Lokin> *Firewall is not running
[07:34] <Lokin> blurgg
[07:35] <jmarsden> OK.  Try     iptables -L  (and pastebin the output somewhere so I can look at it)
[07:35] <Lokin> I once again need to point out It's command line...
[07:36] <jmarsden> There are command line pastebin scripts...
[07:36] <jmarsden> But never mind... I don't have time for that right now...
[07:37] <Lokin> Chain INPUT (Policy ACCEPT) \n target      prot opt spurce              destination
[07:37] <Lokin> 3 of them but the other 2 instead of INPUT there is FOWARD and OUTPUT
[07:37] <jmarsden> Sounds like youy have no actual rules, so that's unlikely to be the issue.
[07:37] <Lokin> k
[07:38] <jmarsden> CAn you ssh to <IP_ADDRESS> from anotehr PC on your local LAN?
[07:38] <Lokin> mac but I'll try
[07:39] <Lokin> doesn't look like it
[07:39] <Lokin> just timing out...
[07:40] <jmarsden> OK, what does      netstat -ntl | grep :22     output (should be just 2 lines)
[07:40] <Lokin> ... k one sec
[07:41] <Lokin> tcp      0            0 <IP_ADDRESS>:22          <IP_ADDRESS>:*            Listen
[07:41] <Lokin> and
[07:42] <Lokin> tcp6           0           0  :::22                  :::*                Listen
[07:42] <jmarsden> That's all good.
[07:43] <jmarsden> ?
[07:45] <Lokin> ergg comp died
[07:45] <Lokin> my bad
[07:46] <jmarsden> Welcome back... OK.  What does   ifconfig eth1 | grep addr: | head -1   say?
[07:46] <jmarsden> BTW why are you using eth1... what is on eth0?
[07:47] <Lokin> not sure
[07:47] <Lokin> Just said use eth1
[07:47] <Lokin> on that link you sent one sec
[07:48] <jmarsden> OK... we'd better check... you only have one wired network interface on the server, right?
[07:49] <Lokin> ya
[07:49] <Lokin> it's old
[07:49] <Lokin> no wireless either
[07:49] <jmarsden> OK.  So does    ifconfig | grep ^eth    output just one line about eth1 ?  Or a line about eth0 ?
[07:50] <Lokin> one about eth0
[07:50] <jmarsden> Then that is the name of your interface.  So edit your config to to use that, not eth1
[07:50] <Lokin> eth0        Link encap:Ethernet     HWaddr  00:40:ca...
[07:50] <Lokin> k
[07:50] <jmarsden> Most likely just edit /etc/network/interfaces
[07:52] <Lokin> k
[07:53] <jmarsden> Now do service networking restart     and then   see what ifconfig |grep ^eth  says
[07:55] <Lokin> Hrmmmm duplicate files
[07:55] <Lokin> there is now 2 things declaring eth0
[07:55] <Lokin> auto eth0
[07:56] <Lokin> and then iface
[07:56] <Lokin> one sec I'm gogin to comment out the old one
[07:56] <Lokin> k that worked... and ssh....
[07:56] <Lokin> damn
[07:57] <Lokin> still not going
[07:58] <Lokin> Time out
[07:58] <jmarsden> OK.  So now ifconfig eth0 | grep addr:    outputs a line containing   <IP_ADDRESS> ?
[07:58] <Lokin> no...
[07:58] <Lokin> first line is inet addr:<IP_ADDRESS>
[07:59] <Lokin> Bcast is <IP_ADDRESS>
[07:59] <Lokin> and mask is default
[07:59] <Lokin> <IP_ADDRESS>
[07:59] <jmarsden> Then your server is at .100 not .107, so you misconfigured something somewhere!
[07:59]  * Lokin screams
[07:59] <Lokin> !!!
[07:59] <Lokin> ok well should I just change the port fowarding to .1.100
[07:59] <Lokin> for tonight at least
[07:59] <jmarsden> OK, sure...
[08:00] <Lokin> will you be on tomorow?
[08:01] <Lokin> jmarsden: ssh<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[08:01] <jmarsden> Possibly... depends on real life stuff...  OK...
[08:01] <Lokin> lol
[08:01] <Lokin> go for it
[08:02] <Lokin> yay
[08:02] <Lokin> so far everyone has guessed the pass successfully.
[08:03] <jmarsden> You logged out of the server?
[08:03] <jmarsden> OK, well, it works... go to sleep :-)
[08:03] <Lokin> am now I'm goign to bed
[08:04] <Lokin> but just for if your on tomorow you can help me without me copying stuff over
[08:04] <miguel1234> hi
[08:04] <Lokin> HELLO!
[08:04]  * Lokin wanders off to sleep
[08:06] <miguel1234> hello someone who can help me with a problem with my mail server?
[08:07] <jmarsden> miguel1234: Ask the question and find out ;)
[08:07] <miguel1234> thanks jmarsden :)
[08:08] <jmarsden> There's a bot command about that...
[08:08] <jmarsden> !ask | miguel1234
[08:08] <miguel1234> now I have a server with postfix + + sasl2 dovecot postfixadmin + + clamsmtp + spamassasin
[08:09] <miguel1234> sucede q
[08:09] <miguel1234> apparently the smtpd-auth does not work
[08:11] <jmarsden> OK.  Did it work when you first installed postfix?  Are you using postfix virtual domains, or...?
[08:11] <miguel1234> jmarsden, I telnet localhost to 25 and shows me the following
[08:11] <miguel1234> jmarsden, http://pastebin.com/m2cbfee
[08:12] <miguel1234> jmarsden,
[08:12] <miguel1234> No I look at the 250-AUTH PLAIN LOGIN
[08:12] <miguel1234>
[08:12] <miguel1234> apparently I do not support
[08:13] <jmarsden> I think you need to tell postfix to support that... what is your backend user database going to be?
[08:13] <miguel1234> jmarsden,  my config postfix http://pastebin.com/m50f30bb5
[08:15] <jmarsden> So... that's not the Ubuntu default... where did this config come from, and how do you know it works?
[08:16] <miguel1234> jmarsden,
[08:16] <miguel1234> If you already defined in my smtpd.conf here http://pastebin.com/m6b0b12da
[08:17] <miguel1234> jmarsden, here http://doc.ubuntu-es.org/Postfix/configuraci%C3%B3n_de_un_servidor_incluyendo_Postfixadmin,_Mysql,_Spamassassin_y_ClamAv
[08:18] <jmarsden> I can't easily debug a fully tweaked postfix config... you just plucked it off the Internet?  Do you understand it?
[08:19] <miguel1234> mmm
[08:19] <jmarsden> If you follow a guide like that and it fails, you can either get help from the person who wrote that guide, or understand every little detail of what they did...
[08:21] <miguel1234> I can receive emails but my problem is that I can not send them to other destinations such as external servers because the SMTP authentication does not work for me
[08:23] <jmarsden> OK.  The whole way the guide does auth is not one I am familiar with; it would take me too long to debug this... it can probably be made to work... but not by me in any reasonable amount of time.
[08:24] <jmarsden> Do you know someone else who has used this guide and got it fully working?  Maybe they can help you?
[08:30] <miguel1234> no
[09:41] <kinnaz> hello server admins, i was wondering the latest php for ubuntu is 5.2.4 but that seems to be affected by several buffer overflow exploits, does that suhosini patch protect from them or i should compile php from src to get them fixed ?
[09:41] <kinnaz> ( compile from src to get 5.2.5
[09:53] <snek> anybody have experience with setting up a 2 system cluster with a few VPS's on each machine?
[09:54] <snek> curious about how to setup the mysql databases... either we could use a mysql db on each VPS or is it better to have mysql on the main installation instead of each VPS and sharding it to the other machine?
[09:56] <kinnaz> you could do mysql replication
[09:56] <kinnaz> mysql "cluster"
[09:57] <snek> yeah i am aware of that, i plan on replicating between the VPS's as well
[09:57] <kinnaz> ah misread your question
[09:57] <kinnaz> a little
[09:57] <snek> IF each VPS has mysql on it
[09:57] <kinnaz> if you have ip for every vps then why not
[09:57] <kinnaz> have diffrent mysqls
[09:58] <kinnaz> thou running one should be better performance wise i think
[09:58] <snek> dunno, looking at the performance i am not sure what would be better.. that's the problem a bit
[09:58] <kinnaz> thou no real exp talking here, just logic
[09:58] <snek> although i guess having seperate mysql servers on each vps would be a bit more secure in terms of availability & taking care of system load
[09:58] <kinnaz> yeah
[09:59] <kinnaz> in that terms indeed
[09:59] <kinnaz> but i think having alot of mysqls servers wont hurt you much
[09:59] <kinnaz> because the mysql proccess itself doesnot take up much
[09:59] <kinnaz> the load makes it resource hungry
[09:59] <kinnaz> but if you have alot of mysql servers
[10:00] <kinnaz> it's harder/impossible
[10:00] <kinnaz> to replicate them all
[10:00] <snek> hmm ok, will have to look into that before i suggest the new setup
[10:00] <kinnaz> thou i dont know how many mysql servers you would be running
[10:00] <kinnaz> but if you like 10
[10:01] <kinnaz> it will be kind of pain in the ass
[10:01] <kinnaz> to manage them all
[10:01] <snek> hmm i think it would be about 4 or 5 vps's.. mirrored to a 2nd machine
[10:02] <snek> btw, is Xen supported by Hardy? or is another package recommended?
[10:02] <snek> need to be able to give each vps each own amount of ram & cpu cycles
[10:05] <kinnaz> snek you need xen kernel for hardy i think
[10:05] <kinnaz> otherwise it would be running okey
[10:05] <stefg> Hi, i'm planning on setting up a file server in a virtual machine. The question i'm facing is wether to use a simple file or a raw partition for the samba shares. One one hand i#d like to keep it simple and have a simple file (which can easily be backed up by the hosting OS), OTOH i fear the performance hit. Experiences? Opinions?
[10:05] <stefg> ... btw... kvm/qemu
[10:08] <snek> you can use a single file to store all shares? i wasn't even aware of that..
[10:08] <snek> personally i setup a raid5 fileserver for a company which gets backed up each night using rsync to an offsite server.. about 700GB of video files & photoshop files.. works fine!
[10:10] <snek> works with an Areca 8 port sata raid controller, pumps out about 400MB/s now :)
[10:12] <stefg> I plan on simply adding a 300 GB file/partition to the virtual machine as second disk and mount it to serve... pretty straightforward. for rsync/rbackup it would be less hassle to simply use a file which contains all the samba shares, but surfing the net i find opinions that i/o performance is crap for simple file storage. i mean we're talking 30 users here... does it even matter ?
[10:16] <snek> can't say i have much experience with that, but i know that reading from a single file costs you about 10 - 20% performance.. if that's still acceptable (lets say a hdd does 75MB/s in an ideal situation, then you'd do about 55 - 60MB/s but an 100mbit line can only handle 12MB/s) then i wouldn't worry too much about it)
[10:16] <snek> your lan connection will most likely be the bottleneck, not the way you setup the share
[10:17] <frippz> stefg: have you looked at this article? http://www.howtoforge.com/virtualization-with-kvm-on-ubuntu-8.10-p4
[10:17] <stefg> frippz: not yet :-) thx for the link
[10:18] <frippz> stefg: have a look a this one as well. might be interesting regarding backing up LVM Partitions. http://www.howtoforge.com/linux_lvm_snapshots
[10:19] <frippz> I will be doing something similar in january when our new rack server arrives at work, so I've been studying these articles thoroughly :)
[10:19] <stefg> frippz: interesting read, although lvm snapshots are nothing i could use, and actaully i'd try to avoid the extra complexity of lvm... space requiremants are foreseeable, and i'm a fan of the KISS philosophy
[10:20] <frippz> stefg:
[10:20] <frippz> stefg: not familiar with that philosophy
[10:21]  * frippz hits up Google :)
[10:21] <stefg> Keep It Simple Stupid ... don't use fancy things for their own sake
[10:21] <frippz> stefg: heh, it just hit me :)
[10:22] <frippz> well, that article mentions about I/O problems as well, so there might be something to it
[10:24] <stefg> but snek is probably right... even if 5 users from 5 different 100MB segments access the server they'll not hit more than 50-60 MB/s i/o bandwith... the raid-10 can easily handle that, even if i loose 10-20% i/o performance by having a filesystem on a filesystem
[10:24] <UyCaRumBa> hola
[10:24] <UyCaRumBa> alguien que hable español ?
[10:51] <UyCaRumBa> hi
[10:51] <UyCaRumBa> because it shows ubuntu 8.10 non 250 AUTH LOGIN ?
[11:32] <kraut> moin
[12:25] <fevel> an I use iptables instead of ufw?
[12:26] <Deeps> sure
[12:26] <Deeps> ufw is just a frontend for iptables anyway
[12:28] <fevel> ok
[13:30] <Faust-C> i have a failed lvm volume that im trying to repair but when i run a lvm cmd i get a error about I/O
[13:31] <soren> "failed lvm volume"?
[13:34] <Faust-C> hmm how do i explain
[13:34] <Faust-C> the hdd was in another system but atm im using it as a external hdd to get the data off
[13:34] <Faust-C> but i cant due to the damn thing complaining about I/O
[13:43] <Faust-C> brb
[13:44] <frippz> I'm trying to find out how much space BIND is taking up (zone files etc.). is there any other place than /etc/bind that I should look at?
[13:45] <lamont> frippz: /var/cache/bind
[13:46] <lamont> and potentially /var/lib/bind
[13:46] <frippz> lamont: thanks. another 12K there :)
[13:47] <lamont> frippz: the most accurate answer is "see /etc/bind/named.conf et al, and what directories get referenced therein"
[13:48] <frippz> I'm guessing all the essential stuff resides in /etc (will be relocating BIND to another machine next year)
[13:56] <Mal3ko> how do i check if server is having a problem to cope with high cpu demanding process?
[13:59] <soren> Mal3ko: You look outside your office to see if there's a queue of users who are annoyed with your servers. If there isn't, you're fine.
[13:59]  * soren is not kidding
[13:59] <Mal3ko> lol
[13:59] <soren> There's no single metric to check.
[13:59] <Mal3ko> maybe like hard disk load?
[14:00] <soren> If people are happy with the service you're providing, you're fine. That's the only single, useful metric that always applies.
[15:50] <kinnaz_> hello server admins, i was wondering the latest php for ubuntu is 5.2.4 but that seems to be affected by several buffer overflow exploits, does that suhosini patch protect from them or i should compile php from src to get them fixed ?
[15:56] <Deeps> which version of ubuntu are you using?
[15:58] <Deeps> cuz heh, i see 5.2.3 in gutsy and 5.2.6 in intrepid, so i'm not sure where you're getting 5.2.4 from
[16:01] <genii> Deeps: I think 5.2.4 may be in -backports
[16:02] <Deeps> i forgot to look at hardy, heh
[16:02] <Deeps> you've still not mentioned which version you're using though
[16:04] <Deeps> generally, you'd wanna check the changelog or buglist of the package you're concerned about
[16:04] <Deeps> search for it on packages.ubuntu.com
[16:04] <Deeps> e.g., this is the changelog for php5 in hardy: http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/p/php5/php5_5.2.4-2ubuntu5.3/changelog
[16:25] <mgagne> howdy
[16:25] <mgagne> is there anyone here who has experience running Xen 3.3 backport in 8.04.1
[16:26] <mgagne> My networking is borked but I can see a peth0 device with a proper IP addres
[16:26] <mgagne> address*
[16:34] <LordDicranius> simplexio: so, it's working now. I was using an live Ubuntu environment for the workstation. I just installed it to the hard drive and it worked right away haha
[16:44] <amon> hi guys, i have an apparmor questions
[16:45] <amon> *question
[16:46] <amon> its not server specific but the ubuntu homepage sent me here
[16:47] <amon> how can i open links sent to me in skype in firefox, i tried to allow skype access to /usr/bin/xdg-open, but now it wants to access firefox.sh
[17:33] <mib_zp4tvgxc> can anyone help me or point me in the right direction ---> i moved my svn server laptop from college to home. when i try to update or commit, the svn is trying to access the college ip address, is there a way to switch it to point to my home address? --thanks
[17:37] <Deeps> mib_zp4tvgxc: svn switch --relocate
[17:38] <mib_zp4tvgxc> does it take params
[17:38] <mib_zp4tvgxc> or anything
[17:38] <Deeps> mib_zp4tvgxc: svn switch --relocate old-addr new-addr
[17:39] <mib_zp4tvgxc> thanks alot
[17:39] <mib_zp4tvgxc> on server box right
[17:39] <Deeps> on your svn client
[17:39] <mib_zp4tvgxc> ooh ok, thanks
[17:52] <mgagne> anyone here have experience with xen 3.3 and hardy?
[17:52] <mgagne> i have a networking question
[17:52] <_jmedina> mgagne: which one?
[17:53] <mgagne>  _jmedina hardy 8.04.1 with xen 3.3 backport
[17:53] <_jmedina> I mean the networking question
[17:54] <mgagne> well i got the system to boot with the xen kernel, now i have 2 interfaces in ifconfig, lo and peth0
[17:54] <mgagne> i added eth0 back to interfaces and it gets an ip as well as peth0
[17:54] <mgagne> but i cant ping google.com etc from dom0
[17:55] <mgagne> it does work when i run "ip link set peth0 down"
[17:55] <mgagne> but than peth0 grabs an ip again shortly after
[17:55] <mgagne> probably because xend is doing something with it?
[17:56] <_jmedina> using bridge networking?
[17:56] <mgagne> i believe so
[17:57] <mgagne> i changed very little about the xen configuration when i installed it
[17:57] <_jmedina> peth0 is the real interface, eth0 is a virtual interface attached to the bridge port
[17:57] <_jmedina> run
[17:57] <_jmedina> brctl show
[17:58] <mgagne> ok it lists eth8 with an id, stp not enabled, and interfaces are peth0
[17:58] <mgagne> eth0*
[17:58] <_jmedina> mgagne: could you paste bin it?
[17:58] <mgagne> _jmedina: sure
[18:00] <mgagne> jmedina: http://pastebin.com/de79dcbf
[18:01] <mgagne> jmedina: I had to type it out because the system with Xen is not able to get on the network reliably
[18:01] <mgagne> but its character for character what im seeing
[18:02] <mgagne> jmedina: if you need anything else paste binned I can use my usb stick though
[18:05] <jmedina> mgagne: ok, then show your xend-config.sxp
[18:05] <jmedina> egrep -v '^#|^$' /etc/xen/xend-config.xsp
[18:05] <jmedina> your /etc/network/interfaces
[18:05] <jmedina> the output of ethtool eth0 and ethtool peth0
[18:06] <mgagne> ok will do, give me a min
[18:12] <mgagne> jmedina: here it is  http://pastebin.com/m27136fd9
[18:19] <mgagne> jmedina: when i ping google.com it resolves an ip but i get Destination Host Unreachable
[18:20] <jmedina> mgagne: I forgot about ifconfig -a and route -n
[18:21] <Nafallo> DNS and routing is different things :-)
[18:21] <Nafallo> fwiw
[18:21] <jmedina> mgagne: can you ping your default gw?
[18:22] <mgagne> jmedina: ok ill paste bin those, lemme check
[18:22] <slofgren> mgagne: sounds like lack of a default gw being assigned
[18:26] <mgagne> i believe i can ping the gateway
[18:26] <mgagne> lemme get the command output
[18:30] <mgagne> jmedina: http://pastebin.com/m7f722890
[18:31] <jmedina> mgagne: you have two default gateways
[18:31] <jmedina> eth0 and peth0 are in the same segment
[18:31] <jmedina> did you configure peth0 with a IP addr?
[18:31] <jmedina> #
[18:31] <jmedina> <IP_ADDRESS>         <IP_ADDRESS>   <IP_ADDRESS>         UG    0      0        0 peth0
[18:31] <jmedina> #
[18:31] <jmedina> <IP_ADDRESS>         <IP_ADDRESS>   <IP_ADDRESS>         UG    100    0        0 eth0
[18:32] <mgagne> nope, I didn't try to manually configure anything but eth0 in interfaces, I was hoping I could get away with dhcp
[18:34] <jmedina> mgagne: try to remove the IP from peth0
[18:34] <mgagne> jmedina: I am guessing I can't just use ip link set peth0 down right?
[18:35] <jmedina> mgagne: nop, that will disable the interface
[18:35] <jmedina> it is with ip del addr
[18:35] <mgagne> jmedina: just give it the interface than?
[18:37] <mgagne> jmedina: ip addr del peth0 says it needs the inet prefix, where do I get that value
[18:39] <jmedina> mgagne: did you try: ip address del <IP_ADDRESS>/24 dev peth0
[18:40] <mgagne> yeah
[18:40] <mgagne> jmedina: I can ping google now
[18:41] <jmedina> good
[18:41] <jmedina> now you need to resove why peth0 gets that address
[18:41] <mgagne> jmedina: is peth0 half-configured? should it not be pulling its own ip?
[18:41] <jmedina> I dont know if you used dhclient peth0 or something
[18:43] <mgagne> hmmm, the only networking items I might have changed were in the configs I posted
[18:43] <mgagne> this was a fresh install as of about 5 hours ago
[18:45] <mgagne> jmedina: thanks for the help so far, I spent quite a while on Google prior to this with no success :)
[18:45] <mgagne> jmedina: so basically I need to figure out why peth0 is getting an address, and then permanently prevent it?
[18:45] <jmedina> mgagne: I have not used 3.3 only 3.2 not sure if the network-bridge script configs you interfaces automagically
[18:46] <mgagne> ahh
[18:46] <mgagne> is it worth trying to disable it?
[18:48] <mgagne> jmedina: have you dealt with the libc warning you get with Xen in Ubuntu?
[18:48] <mgagne> -> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/DebianTlsLibcDiversion
[18:48] <mgagne> jmedina: just curious
[18:48] <jmedina> mgagne: that doesnt affect ubuntu
[18:48] <jmedina> it is for debian/etch
[18:49] <jmedina> hardy already has a xen-friendly libc
[18:49] <mgagne> ok, even though i get the warning
[18:50] <mgagne> sorry I meant that as a question
[19:01] <Faust-C> hmmm
[19:08] <toehio> hello
[19:08] <toehio> I just installed ubuntu server 8.1 and was wondering how I should set-up my users.
[19:09] <toehio> I currently have a user as my own name, 'toehio'.
[19:09] <toehio> Should I make seperate users for webservers, voip and games?
[19:29] <r00tintheb0x> Anyone using bacula that has email messages working?
[19:49] <Oliber> i've got a minor headache with NFS & Heartbeat, when the NFS server is running on the active node (2 node cluster with drbd/etc) only the primary IP address on the machine has all of the RPC services listed, the virtual IP gets portmapper and status
[19:49] <Oliber> do i need to use another NIC and use IPAddr over IPAddr2?
[19:54] <axisys> how to convert a desktop to a server?
[19:55] <axisys> I dont any of the desktop craps
[19:55] <axisys> i dont want to re-install with a server cd now
[19:55] <Oliber> "apt-get remove" the packages you don't want
[19:55] <axisys> Oliber: is there a bundle pkg that can remove all desktop stuff?
[19:56] <Oliber> i don't know, if you remove X11 it'll probably want to take most of the GUI apps with it
[19:56] <Oliber> i havn't done it personally
[19:58] <refnumzx> I have a bit of a complex question.  I would like to virtualize a couple of samba boxes using the built in KVM tools in ubuntu 8.10.  I am going to buy an external storage box with 4 disks inside each 500 GB and connected with an E-SATA connection. If I want to mount different partitions on the same disk to different virtual machines, will these cause problems?
[20:12] <jmedina> refnumzx: nop, that is a normal situation
[20:12] <jmedina> just make sure you dont use the same partition on more than 2 guests
[21:55] <Faust-C> finally i got something accomplised
[21:55] <antdedyet> and there was much rejoicing. ;)
[22:11] <Faust-C> lol
[22:11] <Faust-C> got gallery2 working (just need to figure out how to play movies thru it), nagios working, and soon RT
[22:27] <jmedina> RT?
[22:28] <Faust-C> request-tracker
[22:28] <Faust-C> hmm im assuming that pkg 'net-snmp' will get me Net::SNMP
[22:28] <Faust-C> trying to get everything i need to centreon
[22:29] <_45h_> hi. my ubuntu+xen everytime crashes into kernel panic with hard filesystem errors. its bug or easter egg?
[22:30] <_45h_> i cant find any error messages in logs about it
[22:31] <_45h_> after 1-2 days of work FS crashes fully
[22:32] <_45h_> Superblock is corrupt and cannot be repaired
[22:32] <_45h_> since both primary and secondary copies are corrupt.
[22:33] <_45h_> its fsck log after first day of work
[22:33] <jmedina> _45h_: I have about 5 xen servers running hardy without problemas, each host with about 10 guests
[22:33] <jmedina> _45h_: you can recover the super block, I doubt you only have 2 copies of the superblock
[22:34] <jmedina> but that could be a hardware problem
[22:35] <_45h_> raid1 fully functional
[22:35] <_45h_> and tested many times
[22:35] <jmedina> hardy? intrepid?
[22:36] <_45h_> tryed both. now i have debian 4.0 + jfs
[22:36] <jmedina> probably jfs i the problem
[22:36] <jmedina> :D
[22:36] <_45h_> first time it was ext3
[22:36] <jmedina> never had such problems
[22:36] <_45h_> jfs works fine
[22:36] <jmedina> and I have been working with xen since dapper
[22:37] <_45h_> show me your manual
[22:37] <jmedina> my manual?
[22:37] <_45h_> documentation
[22:37] <_45h_> man
[22:37] <_45h_> howto :)
[22:37] <jmedina> I dont have manual, only apt-get install ubuntu-xen-server xen-tools
[22:38] <jmedina> guest runing on image files, partitions, lvm
[22:38] <jmedina> all the machines created with xen-tools
[22:38] <_45h_> are you using image files or partitions?
[22:39] <_45h_> for guest systems
[22:39] <jmedina> image files, partitions and LVM
[22:39] <_45h_> hm
[22:39] <jmedina> only ext3
[22:39] <_45h_> ext3 sucks. first crash after 14 hours of work
[22:40] <_45h_> jfs work more 24 hours )
[22:40] <jmedina> _45h_: that is a serious problem
[22:41] <jmedina> _45h_: did you try fat32?
[22:41] <jmedina> just kidding
[22:41] <_45h_> haha )
[22:41] <jmedina> _45h_: so have you tried with another hardware?
[22:41] <_45h_> fat12 ))))))
[22:41] <_45h_> and partition for each file )
[22:41] <jmedina> fat12 longs 12 hours
[22:41] <jmedina> :D
[22:42] <_45h_> hardware works fine
[22:43] <_45h_> before i used this serv about 1 year
[22:43] <_45h_> best hardware that i have
[22:43] <hads> So "it used to work fine"
[22:43] <jmedina> hardware fails
[22:44] <jmedina> _45h_: and what about with a normal kernel? not the xen
[22:44] <_45h_> hardware errors with empty logs?
[22:44] <_45h_> em...
[22:45] <_45h_> not tested
[22:46] <_45h_> jmedina, are you using generic kernel? or xen?
[22:46] <jmedina> xen
[22:49] <_45h_> i found this bug on ubuntuforums
[22:52] <jmedina> ?
[22:52] <_45h_> some peoples reporting this problem
[22:52] <_45h_> kernel panic
[22:53] <jmedina> which bug?
[22:53] <_45h_> kernel crash )
[22:54] <jmedina> is it a registred bug?
[22:55] <_45h_> only some forum messages
[22:59] <_45h_> 2.6.18-xen is too old? )
[22:59] <jmedina> yeap
[23:00] <jmedina> even dapper has 2.6.19
[23:00] <jmedina> hardy
[23:00] <jmedina> # uname -r
[23:00] <jmedina> 2.6.24-21-xen
[23:00] <_45h_> anyway 810 also died as this debian
[23:01] <ScottK> No, Dapper is 2.6.15
[23:03] <jmedina> true
[23:03] <jmedina> :D
[23:03] <jmedina> this is gutsy
[23:03] <jmedina> running dapper as guest
[23:03] <jmedina> ohh, it is feisty


[12:12] <lamont> libgcrypt7 build-depends: libgcrypt-dev (>= 1.1.12-5), but libgcrypt-dev is a virtual package... --> ftbfs
[12:12] <lamont> hrm... or maybe there's a newer libgcrypt-dev and it's just not built yet... nm
[06:58] <HostingGeek> Sorry
[06:59] <HostingGeek> that was someone else abusing my open session
[08:55] <DanielN_atw> hmm
[08:57] <\sh> hmm?
[08:57] <crimsun> hmm!
[08:58] <\sh> right
[09:47] <DanielN_atw> hmm
[09:47] <\sh> hmm?
[09:47] <DanielN_atw> is there an uml patch for kernel 2.4?
[09:47] <mort> DanielN_atw: howdy
[09:47] <crimsun> yes, DanielN_atw
[09:47] <mort> you allright?
[09:47] <DanielN_atw> howdy mort
[09:48] <DanielN_atw> mort, yep i am :)
[09:48] <DanielN_atw> crimsun, in debian sarge?
[09:48] <DanielN_atw> hrmpf
[09:48] <DanielN_atw> nothing found
[09:48] <mort>          (__)
[09:48] <mort>          (oo)
[09:48] <mort>    /------\/
[09:48] <mort>   / |    ||
[09:48] <mort>  *  /\---/\
[09:48] <mort>     ~~   ~~
[09:48] <mort> ...."Have you mooed today?"...
[09:48] <mort> (little motivation in the morning)
[09:49] <DanielN_atw> mort, not yet.. but there are too meetings today, so.. i will moo ;>
[09:49] <DanielN_atw> two
[09:50] <mort> DanielN_atw: meetings? with laptops?
[09:50] <mort> without it's just plain boring
[09:50] <\sh> DanielN_atw, two meetings?
[09:50] <DanielN_atw> mort, without :)
[09:50] <mort> DanielN_atw is a busy businessman guy
[09:50] <DanielN_atw> ^^
[09:51] <crimsun> DanielN_atw, http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/k/kernel-patch-uml/ ?
[09:51] <DanielN_atw> crimsun, hrmpf....
[09:51] <DanielN_atw> but thanks ;>
[09:51] <crimsun> doesn't appear to be in "stable" according to packages.d.o, though
[10:01] <DanielN_atw> damn
[10:01] <DanielN_atw> no patch for 2.4.27
[10:01] <DanielN_atw> only 2.4.26 and there are no sources :/
[10:04] <mort> DanielN_atw: kernel.org
[10:05] <mort> DanielN_atw: why not a fresh tasty 2.6 burger?
[10:06] <jsgotangco> its probably full of cholesterol *grin*
[10:39] <ivoks> i don't know for you, but i have non working X in breezy :)
[10:39] <mort> who needs X anyway?
[10:40] <jsgotangco> right just do everything in emacs *grin*
[10:40] <Amaranth> I know someone like that
[10:40] <Amaranth> he does run X, but only because he uses firefox from time to time
[10:41] <Amaranth> otherwise it's just ratpoison (screen for X minus detaching) and emacs
[10:41] <jsgotangco> i use ion
[10:46] <ivoks> X is good
[10:47] <ivoks> it enables you to have more terminals and it's much nicer then screen
[10:47] <ivoks> :)
[10:52] <ivoks> time to go...
[11:13] <Amaranth> \sh: Having fun? :)
[11:19] <\sh> Amaranth, yes..gnome is not working as expected
[11:20] <\sh> and I wonder why kontact works faster running gnome then directly in kde
[11:20] <\sh> strange behaviour
[11:21] <Amaranth> oh, it does that when it loses it's controlling terminal?
[11:22] <Amaranth> GNOME has less baggage? :)
[11:23] <\sh> haha...
[11:23] <Amaranth> those KDE guys are drawing me in though
[11:23] <\sh> normally it loads the full bloat of kde
[11:23] <Amaranth> they lured me in with hot chicks who can code and kick my ass
[11:23] <Amaranth> i can't say no, she might hurt me
[11:24] <\sh> Amaranth, which chick can code and kick ass?
[11:26] <Amaranth> canllaith?
[11:26] <\sh> ah u mean this aussie girl
[11:26] <\sh> I thought she didn't code, she is more the webmistress or something
[11:27] <Amaranth> *shrug*
[11:27] <sivang> Amaranth: aussie girls? where? :-)
[11:27] <Amaranth> sivang: #kde-devel
[11:27] <Amaranth> :)
[11:27] <sivang> Amaranth: :-)
[11:28] <Amaranth> ugh
[11:28] <Amaranth> i have to clean this mouse out every other day
[11:29] <Amaranth> i wish i had my mouse :/
[11:30] <\sh> sivang, http://www.kdedevelopers.org/user/view/808
[11:30] <mitsuhiko> Amaranth: not good: http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/view/900
[11:30] <mitsuhiko> ^^
[11:31] <\sh> but this new girl on da debian planet looks nice
[11:31] <\sh> actually too young for me,
[11:31] <mitsuhiko> \sh Christine Spang?
[11:31] <\sh> yep...thought she was german...
[11:32] <mitsuhiko> ivoks: moin
[11:33] <\sh> *rotfl*
[11:33] <\sh> our security chief comes right now into the noc, talking to my teamleader...
[11:34] <\sh> sounds like: "Hey, you security man, why do u write in german, use more abbreviations...nobody understand german at all, but everybody know the abbr."
[11:38] <ivoks> wow! new icons :)
[11:42] <Amaranth> for what?
[11:43] <ivoks> clearlook theme
[11:43] <ivoks> firefox finally has it's own icon
[11:43] <ivoks> :)
[11:44] <ivoks> imho, clearlooks shold be default
[11:45] <jsgotangco> but we're using human :(
[11:46] <Amaranth> err, 'clearlooks' doesn't have icons
[11:46] <ivoks> it does
[11:46] <Amaranth> you mean andy made some new icons?
[11:47] <Amaranth> clearlooks is an engine
[11:47] <Amaranth> the icons are/were etiquette
[11:47] <ivoks> well, i have clearlooks there
[11:47] <jsgotangco> its probably andy's etiquette stuff
[11:48] <mitsuhiko> ivoks: screenshot?
[11:48] <ivoks> doh..
[11:48] <ivoks> it's just few icons
[11:48] <mitsuhiko> i think its the etiquette theme
[11:49] <ivoks> nope
[11:49] <ivoks> but icons are very similar
[11:49] <Amaranth> then it's his new one
[12:08] <ivoks> lol
[12:08] <ivoks> After unpacking 2935MB disk space will be freed.
[12:14] <ivoks> http://www.koncar-inem.hr/racunala/racunala/niko.htm - this is laptop :)
[12:16] <ivoks> 2x DVD DL burner :)
[12:18] <Gervystar> 5.8kg...
[12:20] <ivoks> yep.. this is desktop replacment
[12:23] <jsgotangco> does anyone here have a live account with the hula-project.org?
[12:58] <mort> DanielN_atw: I'm sure you want a debian/rules tshirt
[12:58] <mort> DanielN_atw: I CCed you
[01:39] <DanielN_atw> mort, ping
[01:39] <mort> oi DanielN_atw
[01:40] <DanielN_atw> what kind of tshirt?
[01:41] <mort> DanielN_atw: debian tshirt, described in log
[01:41] <mort> with the debian swirl
[01:41] <DanielN_atw> debian/rules?
[01:41] <DanielN_atw> ahhh
[01:41] <DanielN_atw> now i understand :)
[01:42] <DanielN_atw> it's a joke.. that debian rules...
[01:42] <DanielN_atw> damn UML
[01:43] <DanielN_atw> my server's down.... no ssh connection anymore :/
[01:45] <comadreja> hello, motus
[01:46] <DanielN_atw> uehh comadreja :)
[01:46] <comadreja> I was here yesterday
[01:46] <comadreja> hello DanielN_atw :)
[01:46] <comadreja> I intent to help on ubuntu, would there be any way to get into the community ?
[01:52] <tseng> is ssh-askpass-gnome broken?
[01:52] <tseng> as it, there is no executable
[01:52] <tseng> no its in /usr/lib
[01:56] <DanielN_atw> comadreja, what sort of contribution?
[01:58] <DanielN_atw> i know, i asked this already.. but is someone working on PHP5 packages for breezy?
[01:58] <DanielN_atw> it's a must, if we want to be at fedoras state ;)
[01:59] <DanielN_atw> mort, what about the shirt now?
[02:02] <\sh> DanielN_atw, the debian guys? ,-)
[02:02] <comadreja> DanielN_atw coding, maintaining
[02:05] <DanielN_atw> \sh, in would prefer an ubuntu shirt too
[02:05] <DanielN_atw> ;)
[02:15] <comadreja> DanielN_atw : you think I could help with some coding ?
[02:22] <tseng> \sh: did you have to remind us of the jmaynard costume?
[02:25] <\sh> tseng, hehe ;)
[02:26] <tseng> \sh: probably a good reason not to use gentoo
[02:26] <\sh> tseng, bug mako...he reminds me of that ,-)
[02:27] <\sh> DanielN_atw, believe me, since I got my original redhat fedora everybody wanted to have this gimmick...so an ubuntu shirt is not what I want to have ;)
[02:34] <comadreja> how could I assign myself a bug ?
[02:50] <ivoks> hi all
[04:20] <ivoks> did anyone of you tried human theme for firefox?
[04:20] <ivoks> it's so good, it should be default in firefox
[04:25] <tseng> ivoks: is it based on the industrial theme?
[04:25] <tseng> by garrett
[04:26] <ivoks> basicly, it just adds icons
[04:26] <tseng> well try industrial
[04:27] <tseng> its the best
[04:27] <ivoks> industrial for firefox?
[04:27] <tseng> yes
[04:27] <ivoks> ok, found it
[04:28] <ivoks> hm, big N
[04:28] <tseng> yes
[04:29] <ivoks> they are very smiliar
[04:29] <ivoks> they have same icons, but this one has nicer icons for bookmarks
[04:31] <ivoks> nice
[07:38] <siretart> Riddell: you just made an upload to revu, did you?
[07:38] <siretart> hi folks!
[07:38] <tseng> hi siretart
[07:38] <ivoks> :))
[07:38] <Riddell> siretart: yes, was wondering what would happen
[07:38] <ivoks> siretart: you record every upload?
[07:38] <Riddell> siretart: I also just sent you an e-mail asking for an account
[07:38] <Riddell> at least I think I did, mutt was a bit weird with gpg
[07:39] <siretart> Riddell: you did everything all right, but I'm currently debugging some scripts here. the fault is on my side
[07:39] <siretart> Riddell: you don't need to reupload, I will fix it from here
[07:40] <siretart> ivoks: yes, the register_upload.py script is run by a cron job, and I get every run via email. For debugging reasons
[07:41] <siretart> btw, sistpoty improved the query for the index.py, the result can be seen here: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/index_new.py
[07:41] <ivoks> :)) ok
[07:41] <ivoks> check it out: http://master.grad.hr/~ivoks/breezy.jpg
[07:41] <siretart> after debugging my stuff here I will integrate this into index.py
[07:42] <siretart> ivoks: whoooo! that looks great! what graphics card and driver do you use for that?
[07:42] <ivoks> siretart: that's with nv driver :)
[07:42] <ivoks> not nvidia, but nv
[07:42] <ivoks> the Free one :)
[07:42] <siretart> ivoks: which card do you use?
[07:42] <ivoks> nvidia
[07:42] <siretart> which model
[07:43] <ivoks> it's irrelevant
[07:43] <ivoks> with nv driver you don't get 3D :)
[07:43] <siretart> hm. I don't assume my 6600gt works with nv
[07:43] <ivoks> does it work with nvidia?
[07:44] <siretart> sure. I'm currently using it in a twinview setup
[07:45] <ivoks> then you could make this work! :)
[07:45] <ivoks> but, it's buggy
[07:46] <siretart> hm
[07:46] <ivoks> crashes
[07:46] <siretart> I'd rather spend my time on revu ;)
[07:47] <ivoks> i agree :)
[07:47] <ivoks> see you soon
[07:47] <ivoks> bye
[07:47] <siretart> cu ivoks
[08:12] <\sh> ok..doing some motu work...
[08:14] <\sh> whois frode?
[08:16] <\sh> siretart: putting the irc nick next to the uploader would be nice ;)
[08:16] <siretart> \sh: uff. hm.
[08:17] <siretart> we would need a page where users could adjust their userdata for that.
[08:17] <siretart> putting on the todo list
[08:19] <Burgundavia> the idea that I mentioned to tseng was the following
[08:19] <Burgundavia> Name (ircnick)
[08:19] <Burgundavia> ala p.g.o
[08:20] <\sh> i would like to see it also on p.u.c
[08:21] <siretart> p.g.o?
[08:21] <\sh> planet.gentoo.org
[08:22] <siretart> ah. ok
[08:23] <Burgundavia> p.g.o planet.gnome
[08:23] <\sh> oh ;)
[08:23] <\sh> but it's the same on gentoo.org
[08:34] <siretart> Burgundavia: any comments on the current revu index.py? We (sistopty mostly) implemented your suggenstions with the icons
[08:34] <siretart> hi `crimsun
[08:36] <`crimsun> hi siretart
[08:38] <Burgundavia> just checking it out
[08:38] <Burgundavia> my idea was for just one icon
[08:39] <Burgundavia> for status
[08:39] <Burgundavia> because new automatically means needs work
[08:40] <siretart> no
[08:40] <Burgundavia> ok
[08:40] <Burgundavia> do I misunderstand the work flow?
[08:40] <siretart> NEW means that 3 motus need to sign-off the package, because its NEW in ubuntu
[08:40] <Burgundavia> ok
[08:41] <Burgundavia> there is New status and new vs updated packages
[08:41] <Burgundavia> which is confusing
[08:41] <siretart> not NEW packages mean "normal" package updates, and require only one motu agreeing
[08:41] <Burgundavia> in my terminology, that would be a updated package, that is New on Revu
[08:41] <Burgundavia> and thus would get the lightbulb icon and the updated icon
[08:41] <siretart> I tried to solve this by separating the sort order, first not NEW packages
[08:42] <Burgundavia> ok
[08:42] <siretart> Burgundavia: I use the word "NEW" for packages in the ubuntu NEW queue, and "new" for new in revu. You see the difference? ;)
[08:43] <Burgundavia> ugly
[08:43] <siretart> sweet! eclipse from multiverse with gcj in GTK2 look
[08:43] <Burgundavia> I don't see an elegant solution to this, not yet at least
[08:43] <Burgundavia> tseng and I talked about splitting the tables
[08:45] <Burgundavia> currently, I have no icon for packagetype=New but I have an icon for status=new
[08:45] <Burgundavia> I think you are using the same icon for both?
[08:45] <Lathiat> siretart: what package do i need to install to get that going?
[08:45] <siretart> no, i use the lamp icon for NEW package
[08:45] <siretart> Lathiat: for what going?
[08:45] <Lathiat> eclipse
[08:46] <siretart> Lathiat: I apt-get install'ed eclipse-jdt
[08:46] <Lathiat> cheers
[08:46] <Lathiat> 70M of packages, <3 java
[08:46] <siretart> jupp
[08:47] <siretart> but it's nice GTK! wooh! :)
[08:47] <siretart> and it's free. no need for that stinking sun jre anymore!
[08:48] <Riddell> siretart: do I have an account on revu?
[08:49] <Lathiat> wonder if i can get azureus runnign on free java stuff
[08:49] <Lathiat> it almost runs on ikvm except that doesnt ahve network operations implemented :)
[08:50] <siretart> Riddell: in a sec, mom
[08:50] <Burgundavia> siretart, another comment, from looking at the package page, it is not clear whether someone is merely commenting (and thus advocating No), or downchecking (and thus advoctating NO)
[08:51] <siretart> Riddell: try to login with<EMAIL_ADDRESS>and press the "recover" password link
[08:51] <Burgundavia> do you want to keep the comments and advocates in one section, or split them out?
[08:51] <siretart> Riddell: btw, are you working for canonical?
[08:52] <Riddell> siretart: contracted
[08:52] <siretart> Burgundavia: do you really think we need to seperate "downchecking" and "merely commenting"?
[08:52] <Burgundavia> yes
[08:52] <Burgundavia> because it not clear what status the package is at
[08:52] <Burgundavia> and who can downcheck and who can't
[08:52] <Burgundavia> ie, if I make a comment, it has no weight
[08:53] <siretart> hm
[08:53] <Burgundavia> tseng and I mocked up a new package page
[08:53] <Burgundavia> showing the status and package type
[08:53] <siretart> atm, only reviewers can comment anyway. uploaders can comment only on their own packages
[08:53] <Burgundavia> my issue still stands
[08:54] <siretart> I see. hm
[08:54] <Burgundavia> my idea was to change the words to a checkmark and an X
[08:54] <Burgundavia> and nothing for a straight comment
[08:54] <Burgundavia> so the uploader can quickly see where they are at
[08:55] <siretart> this would require schema changes in the database... hmhmm
[08:55] <Burgundavia> did you see all the talk that tseng and I did about status icons?
[08:55] <siretart> I think it would be least painfull to implement this when moving to the new home
[08:55] <Burgundavia> the current system is going to scale very badly, due to excess time to figure out what is happening
[08:58] <herve> hello
[08:59] <Burgundavia> siretart, minor further note, the icons should have tooltips, showing the word for the status
[09:00] <siretart> Burgundavia: how do they work? alt tag?
[09:01] <Burgundavia> alt tag
[09:01] <herve> no, title tag
[09:01] <siretart> but the icons do have alt tag
[09:01] <Burgundavia> oh
[09:01] <siretart> ah
[09:01] <herve> alt is a text-only alternative
[09:02] <Burgundavia> tseng was working on completely redoing the front page
[09:02] <Burgundavia> don't know where he got with that
[09:03] <Burgundavia> siretart, you got something odd going on with ordering of uploads
[09:03] <Burgundavia> looks like it might be ordering by upload time
[09:03] <Burgundavia> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=52
[09:03] <Burgundavia> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=47
[09:04] <siretart> yeah, the ordering is quite tricky now, I am experimenting with a usefull one ;)
[09:04] <Burgundavia> ok
[09:05] <Burgundavia> relating to icons, my idea was to clearly define which needed to be commented on
[09:05] <Burgundavia> thus any package, either packagetype=new or updated, would get the status=new when first uploaded
[09:05] <siretart> first, there are uploads concerning non NEW uploads, because they should be handeld quickly. then NEW Packages, then done packages
[09:06] <Burgundavia> and any pacakge that was status=needswork and got a new upload would revert to status=new
[09:07] <Burgundavia> and any package that had a downcheck would change to status=needworks, regardless of any upchecks on it
[09:07] <siretart> I think I understand what you want to acheive, but that currently nontrivial to implement
[09:07] <Burgundavia> yes
[09:12] <tseng> Burgundavia: eh
[09:12] <ivoks> shouldn't objects in notification area be background free
[09:12] <Burgundavia> yes
[09:12] <tseng> Burgundavia: i sort of gave up on that for now
[09:13] <tseng> Burgundavia: im not motivated to duplicate the setup for development
[09:13] <Burgundavia> ah
[09:13] <Burgundavia> the world is not going to end if you don't love my ideas
[09:14] <Burgundavia> or implement them right away
[09:14] <tseng> :/
[09:14] <tseng> i thought most of them were fine
[09:14] <tseng> if i didnt, i beat you into liking my way
[09:15] <Burgundavia> anybody know if any gnome company is hiring in the usablity/UI area?
[09:15] <tseng> yeah
[09:15] <ivoks> heh, they should
[09:15] <tseng> mediweb or something
[09:15] <tseng> hang on
[09:15] <ivoks> Burgundavia: what are your ideas?
[09:15] <ivoks> sorry, i wasn't arround to listen to you
[09:16] <tseng> Burgundavia: read http://off.net/~tberman/diary/
[09:16] <Burgundavia> ivoks, ok, just throwing ideas around to make it easy to review stuff
[09:16] <Burgundavia> tseng, I think I saw that one, but cheers
[09:35] <ivoks> siretart: hi, i will abuse your revu now :)
[09:35] <ivoks> wow! icons! :))
[09:35] <siretart> ivoks: :)
[09:36] <ivoks> ok, explain icons :)
[09:36] <ivoks> and resizing would be nice :)
[09:36] <siretart> just give me resized pictures ;)
[09:36] <Burgundavia> indeed
[09:36] <Burgundavia> there are more icons coming
[09:36] <ivoks> heart is for uploaded packages?
[09:36] <Burgundavia> I am doing some to show how many successful reviews a package has
[09:36] <Burgundavia> heart is for ready to upload
[09:37] <ivoks> ok, hammer is for not apporved yet
[09:37] <ivoks> and lamp?
[09:37] <ivoks> i adore my gnome desktop right now :)
[09:38] <Burgundavia> lamp is for packages not in Ubuntu
[09:38] <Burgundavia> supposed to be an up arrow
[09:38] <Burgundavia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/REVUDevelopment
[09:38] <siretart> tooltipps implemented
[09:38] <Burgundavia> cool
[09:39] <ivoks> :)
[09:39] <ivoks> man, you have too much free time :)
[09:39] <ivoks> ok, i'll do some reviewing now
[09:39] <siretart> nah, unfortunatly not :(
[09:40] <ivoks> you know what would be good to have?
[09:40] <ivoks> easier download
[09:40] <ivoks> now we have to download file by file
[09:40] <ivoks> it would be great to have one bzip or gz to dowload
[09:40] <ivoks> or even tar
[09:40] <ivoks> no need for compress
[09:40] <siretart> hm
[09:41] <siretart> after the move, that should be no problem
[09:41] <ivoks> just with .dsc .diff.gz and .tar.gz
[09:41] <ivoks> great!
[09:46] <ivoks> ok, why wifi-radar isn't ready for upload?
[09:47] <ivoks> (it's not complaining, I'm interested in procedure)
[09:48] <sistpoty> ivoks: it's a new package and afaik new packages should have 3 motu's advocating
[09:48] <sistpoty> (at least this way the images are displayed)
[09:49] <ivoks> ok
[09:49] <ivoks> and for packages that aren't new, only one motu advocate is needed?
[09:50] <sistpoty> afaik yes
[09:50] <ivoks> ok, thanx
[09:50] <sistpoty> np
[11:01] <siretart> does anyone know if sh uploaded kio-locate? it has now 3 sign-offs and should be ok to go in..
[11:07] <ajmitch> morning
[11:09] <siretart> hi ajmitch


[00:07] <kyrofa> ogra_, I suppose you're long gone into the night?
[00:26] <kyrofa> ogra_, when you get in tomorrow: how hard would it be to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1650207 ? No ROS stuff will build in classic mode
[00:44] <kyrofa> Oh, it's writable in classic, handy
[02:43] <stokachu> if i have an additional top level command 'conjure-down' for this do i need to register with the store to have that alias created?
[02:44] <mhall119> ahoneybun: it would be better off with a Qt5 part, it doesn't need all of KDE
[08:43] <mup> PR snapd#2666 closed: interfaces: add ability to set system time zone to timeserver_control interface <Created by justincan> <Closed by justincan> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2666>
[08:43] <mup> PR snapd#2679 opened: Ubuntu/14.04 <Created by vosst> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2679>
[08:43] <mup> PR snapd#2585 closed: debian: move systemd files out of ./debian and into ./data/systemd <Created by mvo5> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2585>
[08:43] <mup> PR snapd#2680 opened: interfaces: shutdown: also allow shutdown/reboot/suspend via logind <Created by morphis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2680>
[08:43] <mup> PR snapd#2681 opened: tests: only build test binaries if they are not present <Created by fgimenez> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2681>
[09:06] <diddledan> jdstrand: I may have an idea why other snaps than my own corebird-diddledan aren't able to launch URLs via xdg-open. I need to test it, but I did NOT build my snap with the snapd-glib interface but bundled glib into my snap directly
[09:14] <zyga> o/
[09:14] <zyga> diddledan: hey, I think this part is broken/needs love
[09:14] <zyga> diddledan: it's on our roadmap but always has low priority and gets postponed
[09:14] <zyga> mvo: ^^ FYI
[09:14] <zyga> (snapd-xdg-open)
[09:16] <diddledan> zyga: the confusing bit was my own snap works as it should, but jdstrand had noticed other snaps not working correctly which prompted questions as to what was different about my snap that made mine work
[09:16] <zyga> diddledan: so to make it work you need two pieces
[09:16] <zyga> diddledan: and because it has been a bit neglected we don't have a well designed responsiblity as to who owns them
[09:17] <zyga> diddledan: on the desktop side you need snapd-xdg-open installed, in theory snapd should recommend that on the destkop
[09:17] <zyga> diddledan: on the othoer hand, core snap (or ubuntu-core) should ship the shim xdg-open from snapd-xdg-open
[09:17] <zyga> diddledan: AFAIK neither are true now
[09:17] <zyga> diddledan: if you install snapd-xdg-open on your desktop manually
[09:17] <zyga> diddledan: and build and install the shim in your snap manually
[09:18] <zyga> diddledan: then I believe, apart from bugs in the actual shim, it should work
[09:18] <zyga> diddledan: it's just not what we want people to have to go through :/
[09:18] <diddledan> zyga: I only installed snapd-xdg-open. jdstrand tested on his system so it's not something specific to my system
[09:19] <diddledan> zyga: as I say, corebird-diddledan WORKS CORRECTLY. it is OTHER snaps ON THE SAME SYSTEM WHERE MINE WORKS that fail
[09:20] <diddledan> I wasn't shouting there, but wanted to highlight the important bits, sorry if it appears aggressive - wasn't meant to be
[09:21] <zyga> diddledan: no, that's fine
[09:21] <zyga> diddledan: if corebird works ok but others don't then I suspect they don't ship the shim
[09:21] <diddledan> I don't ship the shim in mine
[09:22] <diddledan> I did absolutely nothing special apart from installing snapd-xdg-open on the host
[09:23] <zyga> diddledan: feels like magic, is there xdg-open in the core/ubuntu-core snap?
[09:24] <diddledan> but even if it is in the core snap, that would suggest that other snaps should also work when they currently do not ON THE SAME SYSTEM
[09:26] <diddledan> ok, the xdg-open shim is NOT in core NOR is it in corebird-diddledan
[09:26] <diddledan> it doesn't exist
[09:26] <diddledan> at all
[09:26] <zyga> diddledan: as I said, this story is neglected, I may be missing something, those other snaps may have tried to make it work but did something that made it more roken
[09:26] <zyga> *broken
[09:27] <diddledan> yeah that's what we want to understand. the WHY
[09:28] <diddledan> personally I'm happy that mine works. for the project it needs to be understood what is different
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: hmm
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: is your snap classic?
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: (it should never work then)
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: how do you observe it working?
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: (in any case, there's a well-known list of things to do to fix this)
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: do hello-xdg-open snap
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: I bet it won't work if you run xdg-open
[09:31] <zyga> diddledan: maybe there's a dbus service that also opens URLs that is somehow allowed via unity
[09:31]  * zyga has huge lag to IRC network
[09:31] <diddledan> my snap is strict confinement
[09:32] <diddledan> I observe it working by clicking links or other actions that open a url directly from corebird
[09:34] <zyga> diddledan: and then your browser opens?
[09:34] <zyga> diddledan: I don't have time to investigate this now
[09:34] <zyga> diddledan: if you want to do that, I suggest stracing your application to see if it fork/execs something
[09:34] <diddledan> yes it does
[09:39] <diddledan> well blow me down. it's _stopped_ working now
[09:40] <diddledan> I've not changed _anything_ and now it no longer works
[09:41] <zyga> well, at least that is good
[09:41] <zyga> it should not have worked
[09:41] <zyga> did you run the app outside of confinement / sandbox by any chance
[09:41] <zyga> e.g. running it directly from /snap/$SNAP_NAME/current/...
[09:42] <diddledan> I'm unsure now
[09:43] <zyga> well,
[09:43] <zyga> do what I suggested
[09:43] <zyga> you may get it to work for real then
[09:47] <ogra_> hmm, still all bots gone
[11:19] <niemeyer> mup: you ok?
[11:19] <mup> niemeyer: I really wish I understood what you're trying to do.
[11:19] <ogra_> bug 12345
[11:19] <mup> Bug #12345: isdn does not work, fritz avm (pnp?) <isdnutils (Ubuntu):Fix Released by doko> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/12345>
[11:19] <niemeyer> ogra_: mup back with its usual mood
[11:19] <ogra_> yeah, looks fine
[11:53] <mup> PR snapd#2724 opened: overlord,tests: have enable/disable affect security profiles <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2724>
[12:09] <mup> PR snapd#2725 opened: overlord/ifacestate: use ParseConnRef <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2725>
[12:24] <mup> PR snapcraft#1079 opened: Add snapcraft plugin for Qt Build Suite (qbs) <Created by dpniel> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1079>
[12:29] <mup> Bug #1659534 opened: userdel doesn't supports extrausers <Snappy:New> <shadow (Ubuntu):New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1659534>
[13:26] <mup> PR snapd#2726 opened: interfaces: core-support: also allow enable/disable of a systemd unit <Created by morphis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2726>
[13:33] <mup> PR snapd#2725 closed: overlord/ifacestate: use ParseConnRef <Critical> <Created by zyga> <Merged by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2725>
[13:39] <zyga> kirkland: hey, any update on that bug?
[13:39] <zyga> er
[13:39] <zyga> kissiel: ^
[13:39] <zyga> (sorry kirkland)
[13:41] <kissiel> zyga: https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1659272; nope; @ mtg
[13:41] <mup> Bug #1659272: dbus access denied in nested python  <snapd:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1659272>
[13:41] <zyga> kissiel: thanks
[13:44] <jdstrand> kyrofa: hi! remember the ca-certificates-java thing? I have an extra clue. if I build a snap that stage-packages openjdk-8-jre-headless and ca-certificates-java but doesn't have either of those installed on the system as debs, I get snapcraft creating a dangling symlink:
[13:44] <jdstrand> /home/ubuntu/snappy-apps/minecraft-snap/parts/minecraft/install/usr/lib/jvm/java-8-openjdk-amd64/jre/lib/security/cacerts will be a dangling symlink
[13:45] <zyga> jdstrand: hey, morning :)
[13:45] <jdstrand> kyrofa: if I use the same stage-packages but install the debs on the system, snapcraft finds it and uses the system one and the snap is fine:
[13:45] <jdstrand> Copying needed target link from the system /etc/ssl/certs/java/cacerts
[13:46] <jdstrand> hey zyga :) fyi 2718 and 2658 are at the top of my list today
[13:46] <zyga> jdstrand: no worries, we're busy with a release :)
[13:46] <zyga> jdstrand: the update-ns PR is does not need a deep review now (it should not land yet), I just wanted to get first impression
[13:46] <zyga> *impressions
[13:46] <jdstrand> ok
[14:06]  * kirkland waves at zyga
[14:21] <stokachu> slangasek, what day does the SRU team normally process verification-done bugs?
[14:24] <stokachu> slangasek, or if you could flip the bit on snapd 2.21 so it'll make it into xenial-updates today that would be even better :)
[14:27] <mhall119> rmescandon: ping, I saw that you have a Solr snap in the store, have you been in contact with the upstream to see if they will adopt it?
[14:28] <rmescandon> mhall119, nope
[14:45] <rmescandon> mhall119, https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-10044
[14:46] <jdstrand> mhall119: hey, fyi, I issued snap declarations for dbus for two kde snaps and approved them, but they still need to be released (btw, why isn't apachelogger here?)
[14:46] <rmescandon> mhall119, no problem in moving code to another organization/place if needed
[15:29] <slangasek> stokachu: the SRU team releases SRUs Mon-Thu; I'll look at snapd now
[15:29] <stokachu> slangasek, awesome ty!
[15:32] <morphis> ogra_: how do I do a let n=n+1 with /bin/sh?
[15:33] <ogra_> morphis, n=$((n+1))
[15:33] <morphis> ok!
[15:33] <morphis> ogra_: thanks
[15:33] <ogra_> np :)
[15:40] <mhall119> thanks rmescandon
[15:40] <mhall119> thanks jdstrand
[15:53] <ogra_> morphis, you kept "let n=n+1" in the upper function ...
[15:53] <morphis> uups
[15:54] <ogra_> also check if it works with non-integers ... i'm not sure it does
[15:54] <ogra_> (or probably set wait_time=1 instead)
[15:55] <ogra_> ogra@localhost:~$ n=$((n+0.1))
[15:55] <ogra_> -bash: n+0.1: syntax error: invalid arithmetic operator (error token is ".1")
[15:55] <ogra_> yeah
[15:58] <morphis> ogra_: can you comment that in the MP?
[15:58] <mup> PR snapd#2727 opened: overlord/ifacestate: register all security backends with the repository <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2727>
[15:59] <ogra_> morphis, oh, sorry, i mis-took wait_time for wait_attempts ... all good
[15:59] <morphis> ok :-)
[16:02] <ogra_> morphis, btw, probably good to bookmark this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DashAsBinSh has all the POSIX vs bashism bits
[16:03] <ogra_> (including let)
[16:03] <morphis> ogra_: thanks
[16:05] <Chipaca> morphis, o/
[16:05] <Chipaca> morphis, dunno if my review made sense
[16:05] <Chipaca> the `while $n -lt 10 $wait_attempts ! is_ssh_unit_enabled` line is fairly borked :-)
[16:07] <morphis> Chipaca: thanks
[16:19] <kyrofa> jdstrand, interesting-- the broken symlink is an absolute one, I assume?
[16:20] <jdstrand> kyrofa: it points to /etc/ssl/certs/java, yes
[16:20] <jdstrand> which doesn't exist in core
[16:21] <jdstrand> the review tools notice that, but a locally installed snap user might not
[16:21] <kyrofa> jdstrand, indeed... hmm. Perhaps the repo should be rewriting stage package symlinks
[16:23] <mup> PR snapd#2728 opened: tests: add extra debugging to security-setuid-root test <Created by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2728>
[16:49] <kyrofa> Hey ogra_, how hard of a bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1650207 ?
[16:50] <ogra_> kyrofa, i landed a potential fix for it today ... not sure if mvo did re-build the edge core snap already since
[16:50] <ogra_> there was a release going on today to i didnt touch the build button
[16:50] <kyrofa> And will the fix mean that /etc/lsb-release is different in the core snap, or only in the classic shell?
[16:51] <kyrofa> ogra_, awesome, thanks for working on that :)
[16:51] <ogra_> kyrofa, in the classic shell
[16:52] <kyrofa> ogra_, will it be exactly xenial's, then?
[16:52] <ogra_> but the classic shell tarball is created during build of the core snap ;)
[16:52] <ogra_> the classic snap just unpacks it
[16:52] <ogra_> so the fix is in the core snap build itself
[16:52] <kyrofa> I suppose that does make sense. So they're intrinsically tied, eh?
[16:52] <ogra_> yes
[16:53] <ryebot> Are there docs for the snapd-control interface?
[16:53] <ogra_> the tarball contains all bits that we rip out during build :)
[16:53] <ryebot> not a pressing thing, just curious about it
[16:53] <kyrofa> ogra_, heh. So the /etc/lsb-release in the classic shell will be exactly xenial's?
[16:54] <ogra_> if the fix works, yes
[16:54] <kyrofa> ogra_, excellent, thanks for the update!
[16:54] <ogra_> havent tested it yet ... i simply "dpkg -i" the original base-files package
[16:54] <kyrofa> ryebot, what kind of documentation are you looking for?
[16:55] <ogra_> (but i'm not 100% sure it will overwrite the modified lsb-release file ... thats up for testing still)
[16:55] <ryebot> I just want to know what it can do, more or less
[16:55] <kyrofa> ryebot, we have an Interfaces wiki: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/wiki/Interfaces#snapd-control
[16:55] <kyrofa> But it doesn't say much
[16:55] <ryebot> Does it allow you to launch other snap's apps?
[16:55] <kyrofa> ryebot, it allows the snap to talk to the snapd socket (install/update/remove snaps over REST API)
[16:55] <kyrofa> ryebot, no
[16:56] <mup> PR snapd#2729 opened: tests: use test snap <Created by fgimenez> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2729>
[16:56] <ryebot> okay, understood; thanks for the typically quick response :)
[16:56] <kyrofa> ryebot, that interface is used for example by snapweb. Have you used that?
[16:56] <ryebot> I have, yes
[16:57] <ryebot> I was toying with the idea of writing a snap that hooked into custom urls to install/launch other snaps
[16:57] <kyrofa> ryebot, that's a confined snap, but it allows you to search for/install snaps by talking to snapd. The only way it can talk to snapd like that is via the snapd-control interface
[16:57] <ryebot> makes sense
[16:58] <kyrofa> ryebot, I think such a utility would need to be outside confinement. It sounds like the snap-xdg-run utility that supports opening URLs from snaps
[16:58] <kyrofa> (not sure that's actually what it's called... but it's something like that :P )
[16:58] <ryebot> oh cool, thanks, I'll look into that
[16:58] <kyrofa> ryebot, talk to jdstrand, he knows all
[16:58] <ryebot> :D
[17:01] <jdstrand> ryebot: snapd-control does not allow launching other snaps. nothing does in strict confinement atm. snapd-xdg-open allows running a url handler, but that isn't tied into snaps yet
[17:02] <ryebot> that's understandable
[17:02] <mvo> ogra_: not rebuild anything yet, feel free to do that
[17:02] <jdstrand> ryebot: you are probably interested in https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1639746
[17:02] <mup> Bug #1639746: Snap launching other snaps <snapd-interface> <Snappy:Triaged by zyga> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1639746>
[17:03] <ryebot> jdstrand: yep! just signed up, thanks :)
[17:05] <jdstrand> ryebot: the point of confinement is that snaps can't interfere with each other. transitioning from one confinement to another while honoring that requirement is tricky
[17:05] <kyrofa> ogra_, if you happen to get a new classic into edge, I'd be happy to test it
[17:05] <ogra_> kyrofa, core you mean :)
[17:06] <ogra_> it is all in core
[17:06] <kyrofa> ogra_, well, both, right? :P
[17:06] <ogra_> nope
[17:06] <ryebot> jdstrand: yeah, no doubt
[17:06] <kyrofa> ogra_, wait... how does the classic snap update?
[17:06] <kyrofa> ogra_, so the classic snap literally installs and then unpacks something that core is holding onto?
[17:06] <kyrofa> I thought you extracted that from core and put it into the classic snap, they were just released in lockstep
[17:07] <ogra_> the classic snap unsquashes core ... then unpacks the tarball (from insiode core) on top
[17:07] <ogra_> if classic gets updated nothing happens
[17:07] <kyrofa> ogra_, what if I've already run that step? Will classic notice it's out of date?
[17:07] <ogra_> no, we dont fiddle with developer chroots once they are created
[17:07] <ogra_> its up to you to apt update/upgrade it then
[17:08] <kyrofa> ogra_, ah interesting. So if I've already created that chroot, will an apt upgrade get me a new /etc/lsb-release?
[17:08] <ogra_> nope
[17:08] <kyrofa> ogra_, can I kill the chroot and re-create it, then?
[17:08] <ogra_> apt-get install --reinstall base-files perhaps
[17:09] <ogra_> yeah
[17:09] <ogra_> that should work
[17:09] <kyrofa> ogra_, where is it, so that I can kill it?
[17:09] <ogra_> snap remove classic
[17:09] <ogra_> ;)
[17:09] <kyrofa> Oh, well.
[17:09] <ogra_> its in the common dir of the classic snap
[17:11] <kyrofa> ogra_, perfect, thank you. Okay so then: if you happen to publish a new core snap with this change, please let me know, I've got a dragonboard setup I can use to test it
[17:11] <ogra_> ok
[17:11] <kyrofa> ogra_, thanks for the explanation, I understand classic mode quite a lot more now
[17:12] <ogra_> i just triggered a new core build ... in ~30min there should be a new one in edge
[17:19] <stokachu> slangasek, thanks for the push to updates
[17:21] <stokachu> question, I'm about to upload a new revision of my conjure-up snap that has a new binary called 'conjure-down' do I need to ask someone to register an alias to conjure-down?
[17:21] <kyrofa> stokachu, good question. Do you already have an alias?
[17:21] <kyrofa> stokachu, I mean, do your aliases already auto-connect?
[17:22] <stokachu> kyrofa, not that i know of
[17:22] <stokachu> so i have https://github.com/conjure-up/conjure-up-snap/blob/master/snapcraft.yaml
[17:22] <kyrofa> Ah, then you don't need to talk to anyone. You can declare interfaces all day long, but snapd won't automatically enable them for you (or your users) without someone flipping a switch in the assertion store-side
[17:22] <jdstrand> stokachu: you can have as many aliases as you want to declare. users manullay add them to the system so there is nothing to worry about on the store end. only if you weant the alias auto-added do you need to ask a reviewer to grant that to you
[17:22] <kyrofa> Argh, not interfaces-- aliases
[17:22] <kyrofa> I type that word too much
[17:23] <jdstrand> man, I can't type
[17:23] <stokachu> so i would like to have them auto connected, do i need to upload the snap with the alias defined beforehand?
[17:23] <kyrofa> jdstrand, you always make me feel better
[17:23] <jdstrand> kyrofa: thanks? :P
[17:23] <kyrofa> jdstrand, :P
[17:23] <jdstrand> stokachu: it doesn't matter
[17:24] <kyrofa> I suspect just uploaded PERIOD so it has an ID
[17:24] <stokachu> jdstrand, so i want to create the conjure-down alias for https://github.com/conjure-up/conjure-up-snap/blob/master/snapcraft.yaml#L15
[17:24] <stokachu> my snap is already uploaded it just doesn't have that latest build
[17:25] <jdstrand> stokachu: done
[17:25] <stokachu> jdstrand, awesome ty!
[17:25] <stokachu> now that 2.21 is in xenial-updates i can finally flip the switch to pure snap of conjure-up
[17:25] <stokachu> well classic snap anyway
[17:26] <stokachu> jdstrand, do i still need to add the aliases: [conjure-down] in my snapcraft?
[17:26] <stokachu> snapcraft.yaml*
[17:27] <jdstrand> stokachu: yes
[17:27] <kyrofa> jdstrand, are aliases individually granted? Or do you just say "yes, this snap can automatically have any aliases it declares"?
[17:27] <stokachu> perfect thanks
[17:28] <mup> PR snapd#2730 opened: snap: be more helpful in the `snap install <already-installed>` error message <Created by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2730>
[17:28] <jdstrand> stokachu: you have to let snapd know what the aliases are. once it knows what they are, it looks at the snap declaration to see what to auto add
[17:28] <stokachu> jdstrand, ack, makes sense ty
[17:34] <niemeyer> jdstrand: ping
[17:34] <jdstrand> niemeyer: hey
[17:35] <niemeyer> jdstrand: Heya
[17:35] <niemeyer> jdstrand: Today we've been having a long debate about the configure script for core
[17:36] <niemeyer> jdstrand: Lot's of back and forth on several details
[17:36] <niemeyer> jdstrand: By now it's getting pretty obvious that we want direct systemctl access on it
[17:36] <jdstrand> niemeyer: morphis let me in a few of those details
[17:37] <jdstrand> niemeyer: I thought he was able to use dbus-send fine?
[17:37] <niemeyer> jdstrand: I know you were against that, and I could see why.. wondering if some of your worries are relieved by having the interface as core-support
[17:37] <niemeyer> jdstrand: No, that was the first impression, but it's actually very messy
[17:37]  * jdstrand notes he say later commits to his hook
[17:38] <niemeyer> jdstrand: We can't easily tell the result of the call.. the original hook was doing stop, but we really want stop+disable
[17:38] <niemeyer> jdstrand: So there's a loop in there, which isn't nice because it's waiting regardless of knowing why
[17:38] <niemeyer> etc etc
[17:38] <niemeyer> jdstrand: So the proper thing to do was to wait for the job, as systemctl does, ...
[17:39] <niemeyer> jdstrand: This is getting unwise to pursue, IMO
[17:39] <jdstrand> niemeyer: from my perspective, the security policy is clean right now with core-support, and that was my primary concern. the fact that only core can use it is important, yes, but systemctl isn't written with mediation in mind, so I didn't like all the extra unrelated security policy
[17:39] <jdstrand> niemeyer: if you want systemctl, then just put systemctl Uxr, in the policy
[17:40] <jdstrand> niemeyer: then we aren't pretending anything with the confinement
[17:40] <niemeyer> jdstrand: +1
[17:40] <niemeyer> jdstrand: Given this is just an extension of snapd, I think that's okay
[17:40] <jdstrand> 'Uxr' says systemctl can run unconfined
[17:40] <niemeyer> jdstrand: It's not quite ideal, but an excellent start IMO
[17:41] <niemeyer> jdstrand: The high-level goal of that one setting is precisely to have a properly abstracted way to enable and disable ssh in pure snap systems
[17:41] <jdstrand> niemeyer: it is good for the configure hook. it is poor from a security policy perspecitve. it is acceptable based on base declaration restrictions
[17:42] <niemeyer> jdstrand: If we render it technically flaky, or end up giving up altogether and putting the logic into the snapd binary proper, it won't be any better
[17:42] <jdstrand> niemeyer: this achieves that goal, but does not restrict it to only that goal
[17:42] <jdstrand> which is what I really didn't like
[17:43] <niemeyer> jdstrand: It doesn't on itself, but arguably the configure of core, specifically, is bound to be doing system-level configuration on behalf of the user and of other snapd that have snapd access
[17:43] <jdstrand> there are ways to do stopping/starting/disabling/enabling services properly, but that couldn't be implemented today
[17:43] <jdstrand> niemeyer: that's why I said the base declaration makes it 'acceptable'
[17:44] <niemeyer> jdstrand: Ok, thanks
[17:44] <niemeyer> jdstrand: Let's move on with this then, and learn our lessons on the way
[17:44] <jdstrand> niemeyer: can someone ping me on the updated PR if this is time-sensitive?
[17:46] <niemeyer> jdstrand: It is time sensitive, and morphis plans to be doing work on it tomorrow morning
[17:46] <niemeyer> (his)
[17:46] <niemeyer> jdstrand: I'll mail him with the outcome of our conversation and one more detail today
[17:49] <jdstrand> roadmr: hi! would you mind pulling r833 of the review tools. it isn't terribly urgent (next week would be 'ok'). sonner is better, but don't feel like you have to do extraordinary measures
[17:50] <jdstrand> roadmr: also, I had the idea of shipping the review tools as a snap and floated that out to cprov. He loved it. that would allow staging to point at edge and prod stable and then no more pulls
[17:51] <jdstrand> sergiusens: this also means snapcraft could call the review tools if the command was available (ie, the snap installed) and we'd never have to worry about an out of date deb
[17:51] <jdstrand> sergiusens: ^
[17:53] <jdstrand> sergiusens: you could finally run the review tools and have confidence that what they and the store report was the same
[17:57] <roadmr> jdstrand: awesome idea on the snap!!!!
[17:58] <cprov> jdstrand: yup, instead of channels we we actually need refresh-control server side, but having the review-tools as a snap will be definitely an improvement
[17:59] <roadmr> jdstrand: having the service be mutable and update some component out-of-release-cycle sounds a bit scary, we try not to have mutable services, but totally worth a think. cprov this would be my main concern
[17:59] <roadmr> (so don't think I'm opposed, on the contrary, but we need to consider implications)
[17:59] <roadmr> jdstrand: also... sure, r833 coming up in a sec !
[17:59] <jdstrand> roadmr: a nice property is that the review tools run confined
[18:00] <jdstrand> moving to a snap is not super soon in the queue, but I'll let you guys know when it is then you can start using it whenever you want
[18:05] <roadmr> thanks jdstrand ! yes, because it'll have implications on how the service is deployed and hosted. Weighing immutability vs. confination will make for a fun exercise
[18:07] <jdstrand> roadmr: I was mostly saying that it is a benefit. wasn't arguing immutability
[18:08] <roadmr> jdstrand: yes, I absolutely agree on the benefit of confination
[18:09] <roadmr> jdstrand: hehe so again please don't take my ramblings as any sort of pushback, I think it's an awesome idea and once the snap is available I'm happy to push for that to be the way we use the tools. I'll find a way to deal with any other concerns
[18:09] <jdstrand> sounds great :)
[18:17] <mup> PR snapd#2717 closed: interfaces: builtin: mir: allow recv and send <Created by albaguirre> <Merged by jdstrand> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2717>
[18:36] <mup> PR snapcraft#1076 closed: autotools: extend Make plugin instead of repeating code <Created by 3v1n0> <Merged by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1076>
[18:38] <KristijanZic> Hello, got one question
[18:38] <kyrofa> Hey there KristijanZic, fire away :)
[18:38] <KristijanZic> Does snappy hard depend on Systemd? Could it be ported one day to BSD?
[18:44] <KristijanZic> kyrofa: ^
[18:44] <kyrofa> KristijanZic, at the moment yes, systemd is a hard dependency. But the spec doesn't require it
[18:45] <kyrofa> KristijanZic, when one writes a snap that declares a service, the keys one uses to describe the service behavior (simple daemon, forking, etc.) would need to be satisfiable by the given system, and snapd would need to support it
[18:45] <mup> PR snapcraft#1080 opened: python plugin: avoid the use of PYTHON* env vars <Created by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1080>
[18:45] <kyrofa> KristijanZic, as of right now, the only system supported is systemd
[18:46] <kyrofa> KristijanZic, but that may be refactored at some point
[18:46] <dstolfa> kyrofa, it would be beneficial to make it extensible so that other service management systems could easily be hooked in with a form of a plugin or something. Once they're stable enough, potentially upstreamed
[18:46] <KristijanZic> kyrofa: ah, not what I was hoping for but I hope that gets redesigned.
[18:47] <sergiusens> jamespage, stokachu, marcoceppi_ hey, mind testing this branch https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1080 ? It sort of solves the PYTHON* env var leaking but want to be sure it still works for you
[18:47] <mup> PR snapcraft#1080: python plugin: avoid the use of PYTHON* env vars <Created by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1080>
[18:47] <KristijanZic> kyrofa, thanks! :)
[18:47] <kyrofa> dstolfa, I wholeheartedly agree, but there's always work to be done. The question is the priority that should be associated to such work
[18:49] <marcoceppi_> sergiusens: how do I test that branch? you got a snap ;)
[18:49] <dstolfa> kyrofa, well, it could be done in a privsep way, that is separating the actual plugin that does it into different components, such as systemd, launchd, SMF, ..., and then have the standard functionality that it needs to provide. Somewhat similar to what the MAC framework does in FreeBSD. Now, that's probably not so much of an urgency, but I would be willing to write such a plugin once we have a service management system in place in FreeBSD(current w
[18:50] <dstolfa> I believe that people would find use of it on Apple systems though, through launchd which can provide such behaviour
[18:50] <sergiusens> marcoceppi_, from source right now; I intend to have a solid snap on classic thing going soon but this branch needs to get in first
[18:50] <kyrofa> dstolfa, well, you're assuming that the REST of snapd's dependencies are available on such systems as well
[18:50] <kyrofa> Which isn't necessarily the case
[18:50] <marcoceppi_> sergiusens: I'll add it to my todo, won't have much time today
[18:50] <kyrofa> dstolfa, I'm really talking about apparmor here
[18:50] <dstolfa> kyrofa, I'm not aware of all the dependencies, is there a list somewhere?
[18:50] <sergiusens> marcoceppi_, no problem, thanks
[18:51] <kyrofa> dstolfa, the confinement tech isn't available everywhere
[18:51] <kyrofa> dstolfa, in fedora they have selinux, for example
[18:51] <dstolfa> Ah, well that's really just a form of access control, couldn't it be extensible?
[18:51] <sergiusens> marcoceppi_, if not, give me your branch and tell me what to run to ensure it all works ok (to smoke it a bit)
[18:51] <kyrofa> dstolfa, indeed, but you see how this blossoms
[18:51] <dstolfa> That way, if someone wanted to, one could apply even things like grsec RSBAC to it
[18:51] <dstolfa> kyrofa, well, it does. There is work to be done, but imo would be useful to do eventually, as the need arises :)
[18:52] <kyrofa> dstolfa, right, I completely agree
[18:52] <marcoceppi_> sergiusens: https://github.com/juju-solutions/charm-pkg it's here for now, need to move the snapcraft yaml into the project root now that I've removed all the weird workaround files
[18:52] <marcoceppi_> sergiusens: once built and installed, try `charm version; charm create foobar; cd foobar; charm build`
[18:52] <kyrofa> dstolfa, don't get me wrong, I think we can all agree we'd like to see snapd everywhere. But I'd rather have a good product in less places than a bad product everywhere because we devoted all our time to that
[18:53] <marcoceppi_> sergiusens: if you get tracebacks, you know something went wonky
[18:53] <dstolfa> The only requirement in doing so really, is just keeping the dependencies in check -- that is, not allowing dependencies to branch out too much, rather wrapping them so that it's an easier job later on.
[18:53] <dstolfa> kyrofa, agreed there.
[18:54] <marcoceppi_> sergiusens: just pushed up the latest changes
[18:54] <dstolfa> Either way, be right back. Food :)
[19:00] <sergiusens> marcoceppi_, thanks!
[20:45] <mup> PR snapcraft#1081 opened: local source: preserve symlinks to directories <Created by kyrofa> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1081>
[20:46] <mup> PR snapd#2697 closed: cmd,snap,wrappers: systemd reload command support <Created by cyberb> <Merged by niemeyer> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2697>
[20:49] <mup> PR snapd#2728 closed: tests: add extra debugging to security-setuid-root test <Created by zyga> <Merged by zyga> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2728>
[21:00] <mup> PR snapd#2696 closed: spread: set SNAPD_DEBUG=1 in the core snap as well <Created by mvo5> <Merged by niemeyer> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2696>
[21:08] <mup> PR snapd#2690 closed: daemon: add location header to reply for snap operations like install/remove <Created by mvo5> <Closed by niemeyer> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/2690>
[21:18] <mup> PR snapcraft#1073 closed: project: snapcraft.yaml in a snap directory <Created by sergiusens> <Merged by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1073>
[22:35] <sabdfl> evening
[22:39] <qengho> o/
[23:09] <mup> PR snapcraft#1082 opened: project: new plugin directory location <Created by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1082>