[00:00] <mwhudson> abentley: so previewtree will still need an inventory at some point without more diff refactoring?
[00:05] <abentley> No, I mean I hope that PreviewTree won't need an inventory, but until it's finished, we can't be sure.
[00:07] <lifeless> abentley: so, my diff suggestion, do you think its baked enough ?
[00:10] <abentley> Yeah.  The main thing it's silent on is how to handle kind changes, but I've got my own ideas.
[00:10] <lifeless> abentley: oh, hmm kind isn't in the signature is it?
[00:11] <abentley> Well, I was going to put it there anyhow.
[00:11] <lifeless> though if each Diff is contructed with the trees, at the start of TreeDiffer
[00:12] <lifeless> you don't need to extend the signature; cross-kind diff could just be a wildcard at the end of the [Diff, Diff, Diff..] list
[00:12] <mwhudson> abentley: fair enough
[00:12]  * mwhudson goes to bed
[00:14] <abentley> lifeless: Sure, but the larger issue for me is, what should CrossKindDiffer do?
[00:15] <abentley> My current idea is that it represents it as an add + delete, and uses the existing list of differs to do it.
[00:17] <lifeless> oh, in the UI ?
[00:20] <abentley> Well, the output.
[00:21] <abentley> So if you change a symlink to a file, it shows deletion of a symlink, and a unified diff that adds a file.
[00:21] <lifeless> so here's a corner case
[00:21] <lifeless> wjhat about subtree -> directory
[00:21] <lifeless> (with the same contents under both)
[00:22] <lifeless> but other than that I think it makes sense as you propose; presumably just call diff twice, once as a delete once as an add
[00:22] <abentley> I think the nested-trees code hides tree references from diffs, and presents the referenced directory instead.
[00:23] <lifeless> k
[00:24] <abentley> There's room for improvement, but that's good enough for nested-trees to go beta.
[00:25] <mtaylor> statik: have you actually started programming in erlang? or are you just interested in it?
[00:26] <ubotu> New bug: #164436 in bzr "permissions tests need to be parameterised too" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164436
[00:37] <poolie> lifeless, hi,
[00:51] <lifeless> poolie: oh, had you pung before I rung ?
[00:51] <lifeless> mtaylor: erlang is quite nice
[01:00] <jelmer> that would be the ultimate tool
[01:00] <jelmer> a distributed vcs that can run distributed
[01:04] <Odd_Bloke> :D
[01:10] <jelmer> ah well, g'night
[01:11] <schierbeck> good night :)
[01:30] <warren> hmm, somebody sent me a .patch file that is a bzr bundle
[01:30] <warren> I haven't merged this kind of thing before
[01:30] <warren> any pointer to docs of how to do this?
[01:31] <warren> (can I merge it into my tree keeping his metadata?)
[01:31] <Odd_Bloke> warren: You can, by and large, treat the file as a branch. (i.e. bzr pull bundle.patch, bzr merge bundle.patch)
[01:32] <warren> Odd_Bloke, ah
[01:33] <warren> Odd_Bloke, for future reference how do I create this kind of bundle myself?
[01:33] <Odd_Bloke> warren: 'bzr send' is the command you want to look at.  To create the file, use 'bzr send -o bundle.patch'.
[01:34] <Odd_Bloke> There are craftier ways to use it, but I haven't fully plumbed their depths.
[01:39] <poolie> (lunch)
[01:39] <abentley> warren: what platform are you on?
[01:40] <warren> abentley, Fedora
[01:41] <abentley> if you have xdg-utils installed, bzr send will automatically launch your preferred mail client, with the bundle as an attachment and everything.
[01:42] <warren> cool
[02:32] <poolie> ** launchpad is down for maintenance - upgrade to the next version
[02:32] <pygi> poolie: in this time of night ... :)
[02:34] <poolie> i mean, for an upgrade to the next version
[02:34] <poolie> it's midday here...
[02:34] <poolie> i think it's designed to correspond with the lowest daily usage - US and EU nighttime
[02:35] <abentley> poolie: It's okay.  I'm amazed you aussies can stand on your heads all day...
[02:37] <lifeless> poolie: patch mailed
[02:38] <lifeless> poolie: its not 'done', but this is a reasonable snapshot of progress; I think the vast ermaining bulk is the smart server verb
[03:07] <floam> Is it possible for me to have one file in my repository that sort of mirrors some single file from someone elses repository of a completely separate project?
[03:13] <poolie> floam, sorry, no
[03:13] <poolie> well,
[03:14] <poolie> what i suggest you do is make it a symlink to a file in a checkout of their project
[03:14] <lifeless> poolie: you can set up a branch with that one file merged, and other files will just conflict / could do partial merges all the time
[03:14] <poolie> that too
[03:15] <poolie> reading your patch
[03:15] <lifeless> thanks
[03:15] <lifeless> I'm folding now
[03:15] <abentley> floam: btw, what you're calling a "repository" we call a "working tree".
[03:16] <floam> abentley: sorry, I've used cvs/svn up until three months ago
[03:16] <abentley> We use "repository" more in the CVS sense.
[03:16] <floam> I assume the heart in the right place with the nomenclature wrong is better than the other way around :)
[03:17] <abentley> Sure.
[03:18] <poolie> folding?
[04:03] <mtaylor> lifeless: I've been looking at an erlang project, but I'm looking around for motivation to actually learn erlang :)
[04:05] <mtaylor> lifeless: do you know anything about extending erlang with c libraries? (like if I already had one and wanted to wrap it)
[04:31] <abentley> lifeless: ping
[06:45] <ubotu> New bug: #164443 in bzr "can't branch bzr.dev from codehost over bzr+ssh" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164443
[06:45] <ubotu> New bug: #164447 in bzr "bzrlib.info.describe_format should be a BzrDirFormat method." [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164447
[08:01] <ubotu> New bug: #164450 in bzr "should show a message when pushing(overwriting?) tags" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164450
[08:11] <ubotu> New bug: #164453 in bzr "bzr using way too much memory for large file fetch" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164453
[08:57] <lifeless> abentley: pong
[08:57] <lifeless> abentley: I'm guessing you are asleep at this point, but if it was re Differ's, I've replied - I think it's looking good.
[09:01] <poolie> thumper, ping?
[09:02] <thumper> poolie: pong
[09:02] <poolie> thumper, do you want to come to this call?
[09:02] <thumper> whose number?
[09:02] <poolie> conference centre?
[09:03] <thumper> I'm there
[09:19] <LarstiQ> Acro: I wasn't, and I'm going to class now again, but leave a message and I'll try to get back to you
[09:35] <ubotu> New bug: #164466 in bzr "rename packs from knitpack-experimental " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164466
[10:07] <AfC> Eeek!
[10:07] <AfC> I punched up http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bzr/bzr-gtk/trunk and it says "Not Found The requested URL /00/00/05/32 was not found on this server."
[10:12] <mwhudson> yes, that sucks
[10:14] <fullermd> That'll teach ya.
[10:17] <AfC> fullermd: :)
[10:30] <lifeless> mwhudson: whats the problem? missing / ?
[10:31] <mwhudson> lifeless: yeah, you get internally redirected to a url that you can't access, or something
[10:31] <lifeless> mwhudson: that should be trivial to fix;
[10:31] <lifeless> ... pretty please?
[10:32] <mwhudson> lifeless: it's an apache config issue, and i really don't know much about that
[10:32] <mwhudson> lifeless: file an RT?
[10:40] <theSoftMan> Hello, is Qbzr a complete GUI for bzr ? giving the possibility of add, commit, create branch,... ?
[10:41] <theSoftMan> and other question is : how to lauch it ?
[10:52] <lifeless> mwhudson: you need a redirect that matches the non/ - ...$ -> .../
[10:52] <lifeless> mwhudson: its maintained by the lp-bzr folk as part of the codehosting config
[10:52] <lifeless> theSoftMan: I'm sorry, I haven't used it myself, but yes I understand it to allow those operations
[10:56] <mwhudson> lifeless: so redirect ~blah/blah/blah to ~/blah/blah/blah/ before considering anything else?
[10:58] <AfC> mwhudson: yes
[11:00] <ubotu> New bug: #164476 in bzr "packs should be the default format" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164476
[11:04] <theSoftMan> lifeless : i have made the installation on my windows system but i can launch it ? ( thanks for you previous answer )
[14:26] <VSpike> hi folks - quick question probably.  I tried my first merge (woo!) and it was OK except while resolving some conflicts i had the case where the working tree had deleted the files and the merge source had made changes since the base ...
[14:27] <VSpike> except that I didn't understand what it was trying to tell me and so marked them as resolved because i knew the files had been deleted
[14:28] <VSpike> How can I get the .BASE and .OTHER files back for those items (I can remember which files they were), or how can I check the changes in the merge source against the base that was chosen, given that I don't know what the base chosen was?
[14:37] <fullermd> Maybe something with remerge?
[14:51] <VSpike> fullermd: I was wondering that too, but didn't want to try it without knowing what it might do :)
[14:52] <VSpike> I'm doing it manually and learning how bzr diff and bzr log work properly, so it's all good
[14:52] <fullermd> Well, it's unlikely to make demons fly out of your nose  ;)
[14:52] <VSpike> au contraire :)
[14:52] <VSpike> he
[15:05]  * Peng strangles bzr.
[15:05] <fullermd> Ack!   Bzr thinks everything in foo was removed and everything in bar is unknown. :(
[15:09] <fullermd> Isn't that what you'd expect?
[15:10] <Peng> Noo.
[15:10] <Peng> The directory was renamed.
[15:10] <dato> but how would bzr know?
[15:10] <Peng> As in 'bzr mv'.
[15:10] <fullermd> Well, yeah.  But if you didn't tell bzr about it...
[15:10] <Peng> Yes I did.
[15:10] <dato> on, `bzr mv`?
[15:11]  * fullermd blinks.
[15:11] <Peng> Well, it wasn't done by 'bzr mv'
[15:11] <Peng> But I ran 'bzr mv' afterwards, and it does know about the rename.
[15:11] <Peng> I think I give up.
[15:11] <dato> maybe you wanted `bzr mv --after`?
[15:11] <Peng> dato: I might've done that.
[15:11] <LeoNerd> Or just manually mv it back, then bzr mv it again
[15:11] <fullermd> Did you have the trailing slash on bar?
[15:12] <LeoNerd> "mv foo bar" oh oops I forgot; "mv bar foo; bzr mv foo bar"
[15:12] <fullermd> Yah.  That can be simpler when you're dealing with dirs.
[15:12] <Peng> @_@
[15:14] <Peng> Okay, I give up.
[15:14] <Peng> How do I bzr rm a directory that I've already rm -rfed?
[15:14] <dato> bzr will mark it as deleted automaticcally
[15:14] <fullermd> I don't think you have to...
[15:14] <Peng> Oh, that's right. I forgot.
[15:14] <Peng> Hmm.
[15:14] <Peng> I think something else is screwy.
[15:15] <fullermd> This would be the week for it.
[15:15] <Peng> Oh, never mind. The something else was user error.
[15:15] <Peng> Forgot I was in a different directory.
[15:16] <Peng> Hmm.
[15:16] <Peng> Part of this whole mess was probably user error because of that. Not all of it, though.
[16:23] <TeTeT> how to remove the changes of a specific revision? I'd like to get rid of rev 83, but this doesn't work: bzr merge . --r-83..-84
[16:24] <dato> bzr merge -r 83..82
[16:25] <TeTeT> says nothing to do
[16:28] <TeTeT> dato: ah, thx, made a mistake!
[16:29] <TeTeT> dato: I tried 83..84 ...
[18:50] <gioele> hello
[18:52] <gioele> is it dangerous to have a directory /a managed as a tree by bzr and another directory /a/b/c managed as another tree by bzr?
[18:53] <gioele> (/a/b/c would be on the ignore list of /a)
[18:53] <Peng> I don't think it's dangerous.
[18:54] <james_w> gioele: no that's fine.
[19:13] <gioele> thanks for the info
[19:28] <TeTeT> i'm currently pushing a 93MB branch to LP, it's running since once hour and I don't see much progress, still at Fetch phase 0/4
[19:28] <TeTeT> how can I check if anything is still happening?
[19:29] <james_w> TeTeT: ~/.bzr.log might have something
[19:31] <TeTeT> james_w: states 'fetch up to rev<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[19:31] <TeTeT> james_w: and before that 'Using fetch logic to copy between KnitRepository(....)'
[19:32] <james_w> I thought it might say what it was doing as it worked, but it doesn't.
[19:32] <TeTeT> james_w: just finished :)
[19:32] <james_w> \o/
[19:32] <james_w> TeTeT: did you ever get bzr-builddeb working for you?
[19:33] <TeTeT> james_w: I honestly haven't tried, the packages I patched were not in bazaar anywhere
[19:33] <TeTeT> james_w: but I'll give it a whirl on a package for training I'm supposed to do
[19:33] <james_w> that's cool. I was being pretty useless trying to help you anyway, so I can't blame you.
[19:35] <TeTeT> you were most helpful, it just took a while to figure out where the problem was
[19:37] <james_w> well, if you need any help you know where to find me.
[19:37] <TeTeT> thanks for the offer :)
[19:39] <lifeless> 'lo
[19:41] <james_w> hi lifeless
[19:49] <woei> hmm, I've merged a branch, it added some revisions, great. How do I get the log message and the diff of the new (but not yet committed) revisions in chronological order ?. Something like svn log|diff -rBASE:HEAD.
[19:50] <james_w> woei: if I understand what you mean 'bzr diff' should give you the diff. 'bzr status' will show a summary of each merged revision.
[19:51] <james_w> If you want the full log then that is a bit harder, one easy way that might not work would be 'bzr missing --theirs-only .../otherbranch'
[19:51] <dato> .oO( bzr commit; poke; bzr uncommit ;)
[19:52] <james_w> There will be a way to get the log with the log command, but my brain fails me once again.
[19:52] <woei> I'm looking for something like gitk, where you can see the log and the diff of what happened at each commit
[19:52] <woei> bzr diff does give me the diff, but it gives me the diff of all the revisions I just merged
[19:54] <woei> when getting revision 3, 4, 5, I'd like to see the log of rev.3, the patch of rev.3, the log of rev.4, patch of rev.4, etc.
[19:55] <dato> woei: after you've committed the merge, it's easy to do that with bzr log and bzr diff, or visually with `bzr viz` (from bzr-gtk)
[19:55] <gioele> woei: maybe you're looking for bzr gtk (olive)
[19:56] <dato> woei: without committing the merge, I don't think you can, at least I wouldn't know how.
[19:56] <woei> ok, so I'd branch a working copy, merge from upstream, use a graphical tool to go over each patch, and then merge that pulled branch back to the real working copy
[19:59] <james_w> woei: that would work.
[19:59] <james_w> woei: there is a bug to allow you to access the merged revisions, but no-one has worked on it yet.
[19:59] <woei> hmm, and is there an easy way to refer to the revision prior to the last merge ? So bzr log and bzr diff only shows that interval ?
[19:59] <james_w> also bzr-gtk doesn't deal with merged in stuff at all.
[20:00] <james_w> woei: the last merge in which direction?
[20:00] <woei> the stuff I pulled from upstream
[20:00] <woei> and then committed
[20:00] <woei> prior to merging it back to the real working area
[20:01] <james_w> so you want to see the stuff that you did in your branch since the last time you merged from the other branch?
[20:01] <woei> after committing, bzr log does show the new revisions indented, but how do I tell it to show only those revisions with bzr log ?
[20:01] <dato> woei: try bzr log -r -1
[20:02] <dato> it will show them still indented, but *only* them. if I understood correctly.
[20:03] <woei> no, I made a branch to merge in changes from upstream. I did a bzr merge. I'd like to see the log and patch for each commit. That's not possible (yet) on the command line. Okay, so I commit that merge (from upstream). How can I get just the log (and diff) from the point where I branched from my working copy (to receive new revisions from upstream), and the head of what's in the (now synchronized) branch ?
[20:04] <woei> dato: excellent, bzr log -r -1 does just that
[20:04] <woei> but bzr diff -r -1 does not
[20:04] <dato> for the diff, bzr diff -c -1 will give you the whole diff
[20:05] <AmanicA> or bzr diff -r -2..-1
[20:05] <woei> dato: ok, great
[20:05] <james_w> woei: bzr-gtk will now be able to give you diff for each commit. For the command line you can use bzr diff -c x.y or bzr diff -c revid:xxx
[20:06] <woei> ok, I'm starting to get the picture on why I needed to commit
[20:08] <dato> woei: also, it's not strictly necessary that you make a separate branch and merge there; you could merge in your branch, commit, and if for some reason you don't like the result, do `bzr uncommit`
[20:08] <woei> and that extra branch to receive new revisions is not really needed, if you use bzr commit; bzr viz; bzr uncommit
[20:08] <woei> dato: exactly :)
[20:08] <dato> :)
[20:09] <woei> ok, thanks all for pointers
[20:15] <ubotu> New bug: #164567 in bzr "FTP push does not work without specifying password" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/164567
[20:56] <jelmer> abentley: ping
[21:00] <jelmer> odd, I seem to be missing emails on<EMAIL_ADDRESS>:-(
[21:40] <keir> is there a way use a GUI of some sort to go through a diff, and accept or reject chunks?
[21:45] <lifeless> keir: at commit time ?
[21:46] <keir> so, what i have done, is checked in an external library into my tree, and made several changes
[21:46] <keir> but now upstream has moved forward
[21:46] <keir> so what i've done is just copied upstream over top of my working tree
[21:46] <keir> when i do diff, my changes show up as -'d
[21:46] <keir> i want to revert just those chunks, then check in the changes
[21:46] <lifeless> do you know of 'bzr shelve' ?
[21:47] <keir> i thought that is just for uncommitted changes?
[21:47] <keir> in my case, i committed my changes ages ago
[21:47] <lifeless> these are uncommitted changes :)
[21:47] <lifeless> you have an uncommitted reversal of your change
[21:47] <keir> oh, i see
[21:47] <keir> now, the slight problem, is that these changes are close in proximity to mine
[21:48] <lifeless> ok
[21:48] <dato> keir: for some other time, why don't you apply the new version in a separate branch, and merge that?
[21:48] <keir> so in multiple places, the hunks show up as a single hunk, with an add and a remove
[21:48] <lifeless> heres a different and more scalable approach
[21:48] <lifeless> branch -r <when you imported the code> upstream
[21:48] <lifeless> cd upstream
[21:48] <keir> ah yes, i see
[21:48] <lifeless> unpack upstream stuff; bzr add; bzr commit
[21:48] <lifeless> cd your-branch
[21:48] <lifeless> bzr merge upstream
[21:48] <keir> yes, ok.
[21:49] <keir> wait, but i only want to merge the particular changes to the extern/ lib; not the other changes
[21:49] <keir> so isn't this a cherry pick?
[21:49] <lifeless> no
[21:50] <lifeless> what other changes will be in that branch than those to lib from upstrea?
[21:50] <keir> hmm
[21:50] <keir> sorry, thinko, i got it
[21:54] <keir> dist vc is so nice :)
[21:59] <keir> i'm itching to implement the faster index layer... stupid RL
[21:59] <lifeless> yah
[21:59] <lifeless> same
[21:59] <lifeless> :)
[22:00] <keir> an aside: why is it that bzr 'detects' deletions?
[22:00] <lifeless> there is a bug
[22:00] <keir> rather than svn's behaviour
[22:00] <lifeless> it should be a flag like -A to automatically add and delete new paths
[22:00] <lifeless> and by default error on deletes
[22:01] <keir> yeah, i totally agree. though there is a case that it is the 'wrong' way to use a vc, i like in svn that if i do something silly, i can just delete and svn up
[22:01] <keir> i know that's what revert is for
[22:01] <keir> yet somehow i prefer delet and update
[22:02] <lifeless> its really very strange for me that svn update restores files rather than preserving your changes - its inconsistent.
[22:03] <keir> on a completely logical level, i agree
[22:03] <keir> yet somehow, i feel like the vc is my 'barrier against stupidity'... if i go and delete stuff, without informing bzr, i probably didn't mean it
[22:03] <AfC> And lord knows preserving the broken behaviour of previous generations of tools is not the primary goal around here
[22:04] <fullermd> On the other hand, if I delete stuff, I do mean it...
[22:04] <dato> fullermd: alias commit=commit -A ;)
[22:05] <dato> (when that exists)
[22:05] <fullermd> But just because a file exists, doesn't mean I want to add it.
[22:05] <keir> fullermd, i feel the same way about deletes :)
[22:05] <dato> yeah, I'm not sure why lifeless mentioned additions for commit -A
[22:05] <keir> perhaps commit -D
[22:05] <dato> yeah
[22:06] <keir> or bzr delete --missing
[22:06] <lifeless> A for automatic
[22:06] <lifeless> commit --automatic
[22:06] <keir> lifeless, but it may be the case that you want to delete missing files, but not add unversioned files
[22:07] <lifeless> keir: so the question is
[22:07] <lifeless> is it worth having two flags
[22:08] <lifeless> the main use case for commit --automatic is automated scripts
[22:08] <keir> lifeless, aah, i see
[22:08] <lifeless> but bzr rm --missing/--gone etc is a good way to have the equivalent of 'bzr add'
[22:08] <lifeless> OTOH why not have 'bzr rm' do what bzr add does :)
[22:09] <lifeless> but in reverse - rm everything that is not here
[22:09] <keir> lifeless, exactly, that's what i meant by bzr delete --missing. i guess there is no bzr delete. heh
[22:09] <lifeless> abentley: patch reviewed
[22:10] <keir> does bzr internally support a status which is 'file is missing from WT' without having the 'delete at commit' bit set?
[22:11] <fullermd> I don't think the delete bit is set until commit runs.
[22:11] <keir> so status just shows it as a pending delete?
[22:11] <fullermd> Yah.  Put a file back on that name, and it'll just show up changed (or unchanged, if the file's the same).
[22:12] <keir> but it would involve extending WT model to allow a new 'state' for deleted files which is missing, but not deleted?
[22:12] <fullermd> You lost me...
[22:13] <keir> i'm trying to think of how hard it is to implement the following:
[22:13] <keir> 1) deleting a file in local repo does not mean it will be deleted at commit
[22:13] <keir> 2) files which are to be deleted must be explicitcly bzr rm'd
[22:14] <keir> 3) bzr st supports showing either explicitly deleted, or missing but not deleted, states
[22:14] <keir> 4) bzr rm --missing does what you expect
[22:15] <keir> i don't know anything about the WT's data model so that's why i'm asking these qns
[22:15] <fullermd> I imagine 1/2 are just changes in commit, and 3 is just a change in status.  The file isn't _deleted_, as putting it back will show.  It just says it's deleted.
[22:16] <keir> this would make rm consistent with add
[22:17] <keir> would a patch to do this be rejected immediately because it changes behaviour?
[22:17] <fullermd> Rejected?  Doubt it.  But it probably calls for a list discussion.
[22:18] <keir> alrighty.
[22:27] <lifeless> keir: 1) I would not like unless you mean 'will error at commit'; 2) would be good as long as there is an option for ocommit to get deletes back. 3) is already done I thought, 4) would be nice
[22:27] <lifeless> I'd send an RFC, get some consensus, then patch
[22:27] <lifeless> there is a bug already as I mentioned
[22:34] <lifeless> abentley: ping, is there a inventory delta to iter_changes adapter around somewhere ?
[22:35] <lifeless> abentley: I'd like to make bzr-email use the inventory delta generated by commit
[22:40] <cbx33> hi guys
[22:41] <cbx33> I've been happily push changes to my branch on LP
[22:41] <keir> lifeless, ok. i'll probably wait.. realistically, if i'm going to do bzr hacking i should write the index layer
[22:41] <cbx33> today I merged with someone, did some chages, pushed them successfuly, did some more changes....now I get an error that the branch has DIVERGED?
[22:41] <cbx33> what is going on?
[22:42] <cbx33> it suggests trying a merge then a push
[22:42] <cbx33> but who do i merge with....my own older branch?
[22:42] <cbx33> it doesnt make sense
[22:43] <lifeless> cbx33: did you do the second set of changes in your branch ?
[22:43] <cbx33> yes
[22:43] <lifeless> what command gives you the error ?
[22:43] <cbx33> bzr push
[22:43]  * fullermd suggests checking 'missing'.
[22:43] <cbx33> it committed fine
[22:45] <lifeless> cbx33: as fullermd says, what does 'bzr missing URLYOUPUSHTO' do ?
[22:45] <cbx33> i was missing a merge
[22:45] <cbx33> with myself
[22:45] <cbx33> ok fixed
[22:46] <cbx33> but not sure why;)
[22:46] <lifeless> did you push there from more than one place ?
[22:46] <cbx33> hmmm
[22:46] <cbx33> possibly
[22:46] <cbx33> yes that may have been it
[22:46] <cbx33> thanks lifeless
[22:56] <igc> morning all
[22:57] <lifeless> hi
[22:58] <poolie> hi
[22:58] <poolie> call in 2m?
[22:58] <igc> yes
[23:00] <poolie> lifeless, igc: ping
[23:04] <abentley> lifeless: I don't think we have an adaptor like that.
[23:06] <abentley> jelmer: pong
[23:12] <lifeless> abentley: ok


[09:26] <MTecknology> Sorry for taking up so much of the planet.... I tried to split it but it didn't want to listen.
[09:34] <MTecknology> and it's going away for the night....
[10:03] <popey> holy cow thats a long post
[15:02] <cody-somerville> MTecknology, I'm not able to view the entry on your blog - I get permission denied.
[18:17] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: somebody said I should disable it until they can proof-read it
[18:41] <tyche> MTecknology: your article is a little "over the top".
[19:16] <cody-somerville> It is but it is also certainly an eye opener.
[19:18] <tyche> It was that.
[19:18] <MTecknology> thanks :)
[19:18] <MTecknology> gotta run though
[19:28] <nixternal> what's the deal with the fridge calendar? is it naturally off by 1 hour?
[19:28] <nixternal> I show the CC meeting at 22:00 on the fridge cal, but according to our agenda, it is to be at 21:00
[19:29] <nixternal> and the EMEA shows up for 20:00, but should have 19:00 according to their agenda
[19:30] <cody-somerville> It might be GMT instead of UTC
[19:30] <cody-somerville> (or vice-versa)
[19:32] <nixternal> GMT == UTC at this time
[19:32] <tyche> nixternal: The calendar is set up for (GMT+00:00) GMT (no daylight saving), at least in my Calendar Settings.
[19:33] <nixternal> odd...
[19:34] <nixternal> at least I can use it as an excuse if I miss the meeting :)
[19:34] <tyche> It's possible that the information was entered by someone who was in daylight savings time
[19:35] <tyche> I know Nick is in GA, and he may not have made the distinction in his calendar when he entered the information.
[19:35] <tyche> It's a problem when we have various people adding information, and they don't realize the effects of daylight savings time.
[21:44] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: so overall would you say it was a pretty nice read?
[21:46] <cody-somerville> I didn't read the entire thing because it started to just rehash the same stuff but for a different document
[21:46] <MTecknology> ya.. pretty much; by the end of it I just said (dead horse) a few times
[21:46] <cody-somerville> If it was pruned up and made less inflammatory then I think it could be a very powerful opinion piece.
[21:48] <MTecknology> thanks, I should probably do that - someday when I'm less irritated about them :P


[21:50] <TheLordOfTime> orudie, otherwise you'll have to create individualized aliases for eafch SSH command (such as ssh-to-work or ssh-to-home, etc.)
[21:50] <TheLordOfTime> !info putty | orudie, putty exists in the ubuntu repos:
[21:50] <orudie> TheLordOfTime: I did install putty. I can't even run two putty windows at the same time. There is no option in linux version of putty to "duplicate session" when you right click the top bar.
[21:50] <TheLordOfTime> probably not as up to date as your windows version but...
[21:50] <orudie> ubottu: ^^
[21:51] <TheLordOfTime> orudie, don't ping ubottu, she's a bot.
[21:51] <TheLordOfTime> orudie, as i said, that may be in a newer version than is on linux
[21:51] <TheLordOfTime> s/linux/ubuntu/
[21:51] <orudie> i installed putty from the package manager
[21:52] <orudie> the problem that I have with putty on ubuntu 12.04 is that I can't run more than one putty session at the same time.
[21:53] <orudie> and putty doesn't work the same way it works in windows for copy+pasting
[21:54] <daftykins> welcome to OS != Windows.
[21:54] <unreal82> need recommendation for xubuntu 12.04 proprietary driver. GPU is Geforce 620. I have options in jockey of the NVIDIA accelerated graphics driver (post-release updates), or experimental versions 304 and 310.
[21:55] <daftykins> unreal82: whichever you have the nerve to try. more recent if you're gaming would be best
[21:55] <jgodbout> My laptop is failing to boot after trying to hibernate, with the error ¨resume: could not stat resume device file /dev/dm-0¨  (12.04). I have tried booting in recovery mode and reformatting my swap space.
[21:56] <unreal82> daftykins: thanks, I don't game. I want better resolution.
[21:56] <jgodbout> Any ideas?
[21:56] <Eagleman> I am unable to reach mail.FQDN.tld ( using a mail client ) from inside my network ( the fqdn is also in my network ), however outside my network this works fine. nslookup on both hosts shows the same ip address. I can also ping and do tracert, everything works fine except on my mail client. Any idea what could be the issue ?
[21:56] <IOmegaZ> hi
[21:57] <guntbert> alami: support for virtualbox is to be found in #vbox
[21:57] <daftykins> jgodbout: if you hold down left shift at boot to get the GRUB menu stuffs, do you see anything relevant?
[21:58] <IOmegaZ> ubuntu installer An Error occured list index out of range for more information,please see the log file
[21:58] <IOmegaZ> i keep getting
[21:58] <orudie> I mean what do you guys do when you have to connect to many differet servers via ssh all the time?
[21:58] <escott> orudie, ~/.ssh/config
[21:59] <bekks> orudie: I just use ssh hostname :)
[21:59] <daftykins> orudie: edit my /etc/hosts file to add IPs to friendly hostnames (if i can't ssh via hostname) then just type ssh user@host in terminals
[21:59] <IOmegaZ> hi
[21:59] <IOmegaZ> i got a probllem
[22:00] <daftykins> IOmegaZ: please don't repeat it too often as it'll anger me and kill small kittens in the process
[22:00] <orudie> yeah but i don't want to even type ssh user@host that's too much work
[22:00] <daftykins> IOmegaZ: your best first step is to work out how to access the install log and post it online for someone to read
[22:01] <orudie> securecrt is a paid ssh client which has very nice ssh sessions management
[22:01] <jgodbout> daftykins: Nothing interesting. Left shift just shows the grub menu right?
[22:01] <machicola> running Ubuntu 12.10, what is the preferred way to have a startup script, which launches some programs and performs some file operations, initialize after GDM is loaded regardless of the session I've chosen at the login screen
[22:01] <daftykins> orudie: then it sounds like you need to either get googling for an alternative, consider creating aliases, or give up.
[22:01] <orudie> you can store hundreds of ssh connections there
[22:01] <jhutchins> orudie: Create a config file.
[22:01] <jhutchins> orudie: You can install putty.
[22:01] <daftykins> jgodbout: yeah, i wondered if maybe the boot options on the default had some extra fields that tell it to look for the resume image that you could delete to make it ignore that
[22:02] <ubuntu-tester> orudie: so you came here to advertise securecrt?
[22:02] <bekks> orudie: You can do the same using putty, e.g.
[22:02] <machicola> I would like it to run on top of all of the normal boot processes, it seems like using .xsession is requiring me to initialize other basic processes
[22:02] <escott> orudie, just modify your ssh config file. really not that hard. ~/.ssh/config
[22:02] <orudie> can't run two putty sessions at the same time in ubuntu is my biggest problem with putty for ubuntu
[22:02] <jhutchins> orudie: With the conf file you still have to do ssh foo, but you can also configure icons as ssh links.
[22:02] <escott> orudie, http://linux.die.net/man/5/ssh_config
[22:02] <jhutchins> orudie: ?
[22:02] <jrib> machicola: what sort of things do you want to run?
[22:02] <jhutchins> orudie: Why not?
[22:03] <Miebster> how do the mount commands and adding things to fstab differ?
[22:03] <IOmegaZ> ok
[22:03] <jgodbout> daftykins: I tried adding no_console_suspend to the boot options, but that didnt seem to do anything either
[22:03] <IOmegaZ> how can i post my log file?
[22:03] <orudie> because it doesn't start
[22:03] <orudie> only one starts
[22:03] <IOmegaZ> how can i post my log file?
[22:03] <daftykins> Miebster: fstab is permanent, mount is single user one time mount
[22:03] <jrib> Miebster: one is a command and the other is a file with settings in it?
[22:03] <orudie> can't right click - duplicate session
[22:03] <machicola> jrib: just some applications, start up the terminal, move some files around and do a little clean up
[22:03] <bekks> !paste | IOmegaZ
[22:03] <orudie> like you can in putty for windows
[22:03] <escott> Miebster, fstab allows unpriv users to mount entries in the fstab otherwise unpriv users cannot mount
[22:03] <jhutchins> Miebster: THe syntax is different; items in fstab can be made to mount automatically at boot.
[22:03] <Miebster> how can I make mounts permanent, without putting them in fstab, since you have to put your password in the command
[22:03] <daftykins> jgodbout: that sounds more like 'don't suspent in future'. can you boot to CLI access?
[22:04] <jhutchins> orudie: So just launch another one.
[22:04] <Bjarte> okay, um, I actually got a simple beginner-level C question. What's the difference between alignof and sizeof? I feel like they're the same but for structs they're not. for unions, they are.
[22:04] <jgodbout> daftykins: Nope, it stops with the error message before then.
[22:04] <escott> Miebster, you mean a password for something like samba?
[22:04] <daftykins> Miebster: you can't. did you look into the GUI 'connect to server' i mentioned?
[22:04] <jrib> machicola: if you can use the Startup Applications gui, I would suggest that.  It creates .desktop files in ~/.config/autostart.  You can also use ~/.xprofile or ~/.xsessionrc instead.
[22:04] <Miebster> escott: yeah
[22:04] <daftykins> jgodbout: ah :(
[22:04] <MonkeyDust> Miebster  fstab is the way to make mounts permanent
[22:04] <jhutchins> IOmegaZ: You can READ the log file and see why it's stopping.
[22:04] <Miebster> daftykins: no i missed that
[22:05] <escott> Miebster, you could see if you can specify the password not in fstab but by reference to a file in /etc and then restrict permissions on that file
[22:05] <guntbert> Bjarte: this channel is for ubuntu support - you might get answers in ##c
[22:05] <alami> why i get this error after run apt-get update http://pastebin.com/dW2DcvS3
[22:05] <daftykins> jgodbout: in google results people refer to removing the package 'uswusp' - you could do that in your current install by chroot'ing from a livecd
[22:05] <jgodbout> daftykins: Sweet, i
[22:05] <Bjarte> guntbert: I asked there. Nobody answered xD. Plus I usually come here since I do use #ubuntu so I gave this channel a try.
[22:05] <Bjarte> :|
[22:05] <z_Chanshark> yea daftykins  i went to both irc's and litterer they are both dead silent
[22:05] <jgodbout> daftykins: ill try that. also, this seems to be the exact problem: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1997933
[22:05] <bekks> alami: Because you added duplicates of sources?
[22:05] <Miebster> Can't I just run the mount command when the user logs in?
[22:06] <bekks> Miebster: Only using pam_mount
[22:06] <daftykins> Miebster: you're still gonna need to pass a password.
[22:06] <MonkeyDust> alami  a mix of i386 and amd64 sources may be conflicting
[22:06] <Miebster> I'm just blown away there isn't a way to do this, this seems like a very common thing
[22:07] <daftykins> jgodbout: do you also have another Linux install present, so there's another swap partition somewhere else?
[22:07] <alami> bekks: i havn't add any one i thing ubuntu software Center is dowing that
[22:07] <bekks> Miebster: In the last 10 years, I've only seen 3 people using it.
[22:07] <coldguatemalan> hi all, so i got a sever with one ip set yet i just discovered that it responds to another ip i had no idea about. i'm baffled has anyone experienced such a thing?
[22:07] <jgodbout> daftykins: I made the swap partition that iḿ using now from a previous install, then i installed 12.04 over that previous install partition, keeping the old swap partition.
[22:07] <bekks> coldguatemalan: Just take a look at ifconfig -a
[22:07] <daftykins> coldguatemalan: yes, if IP forwarding is enabled, a host can reply from a second IP if it has another network interface.
[22:07] <alami> bekks: how can i delate it?
[22:07] <jgodbout> daftykins: i have already tried formatting that swap partition again, though.
[22:07] <Miebster> Okay, what do people normaly do when they need to connect to a smba share, and they want it to be connected when they log in?
[22:08] <syncsys> cannot set JAVA_HOME in /etc/enviroment  with JAVA_HOME="/home/syncsys/bin/jdk1.7.0_10/"    echo give me that but its not a correct java home or i need something else?
[22:08] <machicola> jrib, I was trying to do it via the command line only or without actually using the startup apps gui...I've tried it with .xsession and some weird thing is happening, it seems like basic processes aren't coming up which is making me wonder whether with .xsession GDM and some other things need to be started manually
[22:08] <bekks> alami: By editing the sources.
[22:08] <alami> okay
[22:08] <jgodbout> daftykins: im booting off a live CD now, and ill try to remove that package
[22:08] <coldguatemalan> bekks i have two interfaces bonded with only one ip
[22:08] <jrib> machicola: so try the two files I suggested?  You can use them and log-in with gdm
[22:08] <daftykins> jgodbout: it might be that your install's /etc/fstab is referring to the swap drive wrong, seems to be thoughts i get from google results too
[22:08] <limpc> daftykins, i got my livedcd (usb), but ubuntu doesn't load when i boot to it
[22:08] <limpc> usb does not work on it either
[22:08] <machicola> ok, thanks jrib
[22:09] <machicola> jrib: so all of these files are configured to work differently?
[22:09] <daftykins> limpc: if you're sure those boot devices work, could be your hardware has an issue with the version of the kernel on the liveCD/USB
[22:09] <Niyakun> can the newest ubuntu run under windows 8 using wubi?
[22:09] <jrib> machicola: what do you mean?
[22:09] <bekks> Miebster: They use LDAP and pam_mount
[22:09] <daftykins> Niyakun: i would highly recommend never even thinking of using WUBI
[22:09] <limpc> its ubuntu 12.10, and isn't the kernel supposed to be generic?
[22:09] <machicola> i mean, the way .xsession is running the script/code will be different from the way .xsessionrc or .xprofile will?
[22:10] <daftykins> limpc: sure but kernels have bugs sometimes. try googling with your motherboard model / chipset
[22:10] <jrib> machicola: yes.
[22:10] <machicola> ok, thanks
[22:10] <jhutchins> Strange. something is blocking ad-block
[22:10] <daftykins> limpc: the other option is trying to get logs from your boot, try an older ubuntu perhaps? to see if that boots
[22:10] <Miebster> bekks: Im reading pam_mounts about and it sounds like it was made for odd cases, how is a generic somba mount require this 3rd party tool?
[22:10] <jgodbout> daftykins: ill look at my fstab and see if anything looks funny
[22:10] <jrib> machicola: you usually use .xsession as your actual session.  .xprofile and .xsessionrc just get executed sometime after you login with whatever session you are using
[22:10] <limpc> i can't even get to shell
[22:10] <limpc> usb keyboard dies when ubuntu initializes
[22:11] <bekks> Miebster: It isnt a 3rd party tool :)
[22:11] <limpc> ill see if i can find an old ps2 keyboard :/
[22:11] <daftykins> jgodbout: ja if it doesn't use UUIDs, perhaps the disk 'letters' have changed
[22:11] <daftykins> PS/2 for the win.
[22:11] <machicola> jrib, ahh very helpful, ok thanks
[22:11] <Niyakun> daftykins: it is a laptop and i cannot afford to partition the current ntfs partition
[22:11] <Niyakun> which has data*
[22:12] <diparikh> doublehelix
[22:12] <daftykins> Niyakun: how come?
[22:12] <Miebster> bekks: how is it not 3rd party?
[22:13] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: why not to put it to fstab?
[22:13] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: that would put password in plain text
[22:13] <escott> Miebster, pam is the core authentication/permission tool in linux
[22:13] <Miebster> escott: I'm lost this conversation is going in circles, everyone says this is easy but no one has given a solution
[22:13] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: and where do you expect to store it?
[22:14] <Miebster> I have a central server with shared samba drives.  How can I get users to mount to the drive, without putting their password in plain text, and having the mount persist through restart?
[22:14] <escott> Miebster, is it possible to specify the password in a file. something like mount -t cifs -permission-file /some/path/to/file/with/username_and_password
[22:15] <daftykins> escott: he knows but doesn't want to do that
[22:15] <bekks> Miebster: Because the package is named libpam-mount and is provided by the stock ubuntu repos?
[22:15] <daftykins> bekks: what is the method you're suggesting Miebster try? i'm curious.
[22:15] <jrib> Miebster: just out of curiousity, what is the reason to not want the password in plaintext?
[22:15] <Quest> cannot set JAVA_HOME in /etc/enviroment  with JAVA_HOME="/home/syncsys/bin/jdk1.7.0_10/"    echo give me that but its not a correct java home or i need something else?
[22:15] <bekks> daftykins: Using LDAP and pam_mount
[22:16] <Miebster> jrib: because then anyone with access to the machine (Every employee) can find anyones password
[22:16] <daftykins> bekks: does that assume there's an LDAP backend?
[22:16] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: I see, but you have to put it somewhere. Windows also put it somewhere, obfuscated though
[22:16] <bekks> daftykins: Of course.
[22:16] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: puts it somewhere, not in plain text though
[22:16] <jrib> Miebster: why?
[22:16] <escott> Miebster, if you can put the password in a file and lockdown the file thats not a problem
[22:16] <jrib> Miebster: you can just use regular permissions to solve that problem, no?
[22:16] <daftykins> Miebster: what is the host that you're authenticating these users to running, windows AD?
[22:16] <Miebster> jrib: live cd?
[22:17] <jrib> Miebster: that's a different concern.
[22:17] <Miebster> daftykins: just windows server? not sure what are you asking?
[22:17] <jrib> Miebster: but ok, carry on :)
[22:17] <Miebster> jrib: pretty normal concern to not put passwords in plaintext
[22:17] <daftykins> Miebster: i'm asking if it's a Windows domain or just file server role
[22:17] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: do you want to hide it from *that* user, who uses it?
[22:18] <daftykins> jrib: i tried to say the standard course of action is to hide the smbpass file from the users but apparently Miebster's users all boot alternative OS's and read each others passwords for fun
[22:18] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: the user is the one that types it in, I want to hide it from everyone else, and in general, a password should never be on screen
[22:18] <Quest> ow to eliminate the need to restart again and again after /etc/enviroment updations
[22:18] <blami> Quest: just logout and login
[22:19] <Quest> blami,  any other way?
[22:19] <blami> Quest: /etc/environment gets sourced every time you run login shell
[22:19] <Quest> blami,  hm is there any other way?
[22:19] <blami> Quest: not for whole graphical session
[22:19] <escott> Quest, you cannot (easily) change the environment of a running process
[22:19] <Miebster> daftykins: I'm blown away that I'm being treated odd for this, linux has always been about superior security, and now we store password in plain text
[22:19] <Quest> escott,  i did that once. i just lost the tutorial
[22:19] <jrib> Miebster: you could also just encrypt the drive ubuntu is on.  Which you probably should be doing if you're concerned about people fetching data from the drive using a live cd
[22:20] <blami> Quest: because only running process can change it's own environment
[22:20] <jrib> Miebster: I think you're asking a fair question.  I just wanted to make sure I understood your needs
[22:20] <Miebster> jrib: there is no data on the machines we care about, everything is on a server, so I could care 2 cents if you hacked into the machine, until you can auth with the server you dont have anythign
[22:20] <blami> Quest: if you need your changes being sourced only in single terminal window you can do . /etc/environment
[22:20] <blami> hm
[22:20] <jgodbout> daftykins: http://pastebin.com/MTZjycRS  - my fstab file. gparted lists /dev/sda5 as a 4GB linux-swap
[22:20] <Quest> back
[22:21] <daftykins> Miebster: Linux users don't tend to be mounting from a windows box sadly.
[22:21] <jrib> Miebster: was pam_mount not suitable?  I'm not familiar with it myself
[22:21] <Miebster> jrib: not sure how to use it
[22:21] <daftykins> jgodbout: oh it's encrypted? 0o
[22:21] <blami> Miebster: that's why /etc/shadow is there
[22:21] <jgodbout> daftykins: Oh, I didnt know. that would explain why hibernation failed huh
[22:22] <daftykins> jgodbout: i'm only really assuming. can you pastebin 'sudo fdisk -l' too?
[22:22] <Miebster> blami: can I use that do accomplish this?
[22:22] <riderplus> i have no sound in 13.04...i saw that bug, but couldn't fix it
[22:22] <daftykins> jgodbout: since the fstab there uses /dev/mapper/cryptswap1 as the mount location
[22:22] <riderplus> how can i restore the sound?
[22:22] <escott> jgodbout, daftykins if you selected encrypted home at install you get encrypted swap which probably breaks hibernation
[22:23] <daftykins> riderplus: distros that haven't been released yet are talked about in #ubuntu+1
[22:23] <Slart> riderplus: isn't there a channel dedicated to 13.04, #ubuntu+1 perhaps?
[22:23] <blami> Miebster: sorry I havent read backlog ... just your complaint about fulltext password
[22:23] <jgodbout> escott: Yeah,i encrypted myhome dir.
[22:23] <jrib> Miebster: one alternative is to just give the users an encrypted directory and put the credentials file in there, no?
[22:23] <daftykins> Slart: ^5
[22:23] <daftykins> escott: ah-ha. thanks
[22:23] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: see http://askubuntu.com/questions/157128/proper-fstab-entry-to-mount-a-samba-share-on-boot
[22:23] <Slart> daftykins: I have to oil my keyboard if I'm going to keep up with you guys =)
[22:23] <escott> jgodbout, you are going to have to pick one of the other. suspend is fine, but hibernate is not going to support encryption
[22:23] <level> hi
[22:23] <level> :)
[22:24] <z_Chanshark> daftykins: i think i figured it out for mint users / ubuntu users :D
[22:24] <blami> escott: why?
[22:24] <daftykins> z_Chanshark: :O
[22:24] <daftykins> z_Chanshark: do tell
[22:24] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: answer from russnash
[22:24] <escott> blami, no secure location for the key when the cpu halts
[22:24] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: it wont load
[22:24] <blami> escott: I have lvm on luks and hibernates just fine
[22:24] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: ?
[22:24] <jgodbout> escott: I dont need to hibernate. I just cant boot after i tried to hibernate.
[22:24] <blami> escott: yes, that's correct. I have passphrase stored in laptop's tpm store
[22:24] <escott> blami, thats full disk. and you presumably give the key to the bootloader
[22:24] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: that hyperlink doens't load
[22:25] <apfor> i
[22:25] <jgodbout> escott: I dont need to be able to hibernate in the future, i usually just suspend to ram
[22:25] <blami> escott: no I just unlock tpm store using smartcard token
[22:25] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: hmm, works for me...
[22:25] <z_Chanshark> ok so apparently broadcom package drivers work with the netgear thingy adapter only v2 tho so all i need to do is go into the package manager and download the broadcom package
[22:25] <escott> blami, effectively the same
[22:25] <blami> escott: then my random passphrase is passed to cryptsetup
[22:25] <blami> escott: yes
[22:26] <daftykins> jgodbout: if i were you i'd try the sadistic approach of removing the swap mount and seeing if boot cries about something else / doesn't error :D
[22:26] <escott> jgodbout, i would see if there is a way you can direct the system to boot without using the hibernate image
[22:26] <blami> jgodbout: suspending to ram isn't very wise with encrypted harddrive
[22:26] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: that uses a plain text password
[22:26] <jgodbout> daftykins: escott: http://pastebin.com/CsjRbD91  sudo fdisk -l
[22:27] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: i've copied the main part: http://pastebin.com/tVX7U84s
[22:27] <daftykins> jgodbout: did you select an enctypted /home as escott mentioned?
[22:27] <daftykins> *encrypted
[22:27] <mdel> hey all - how can I re-evaluate the rules in /etc/security/access.conf?
[22:27] <jgodbout> escott: i tried finding grub options to boot without resuming. daftykins also suggested removing uswsusp from a live cd
[22:27] <escott> daftykins, he indicated he had
[22:27] <jgodbout> daftykins: yes i encrypted my /home
[22:27] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: password is hidden from anyone but root
[22:27] <escott> jgodbout, when you say it doesnt boot what exactly happens on boot
[22:28] <jgodbout> daftykins: when i tried hibernating, i didn realise that it didnt work if you encrypted it. ill know for the future
[22:28] <z_Chanshark> daftykins:  but apparently linux drivers will never be built for it because they are working on ones that are more advanced
[22:28] <escott> jgodbout, i dont think it should even be able to see the hibernation image and should just boot fresh
[22:29] <jgodbout> escott: it shows the ubuntu loading screen (with the 5 dots), and stays there. if i boot in recovery mode, it has the error shown here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1997933
[22:29] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: its still stored in plaintext, livecd = password stolen
[22:29] <daftykins> jgodbout: probably buried in their release notes :S
[22:29] <daftykins> escott: ah my bad, i'm channel hopping too much
[22:29] <bekks> Miebster: It isnt.
[22:29] <ogist> hi
[22:29] <bekks> Miebster: Encrypt your box -> livecd useless.
[22:30] <Miebster> bekks: the boxes are not encrypted
[22:30] <jgodbout> escott: i dont get a command line or anything when i ctrlalt+f1
[22:30] <escott> jgodbout, i wonder if the hibernation write did something nasty to the cryptswap device
[22:30] <bekks> Miebster: Then encrypt them when fearing someone can use a livecd.
[22:30] <Miebster> The main point here is I can do this with NFS, but not SAMBA?
[22:31] <bekks> Miebster: Only using pam_mount and an LDAP backend.
[22:31] <jrib> Miebster: how do you do it with nfs?
[22:31] <Miebster> bekks: your suggestion is useless, you are telling me to reinstall the OS on everymachine because of a limitation in samba mounts
[22:31] <bekks> Miebster: It is no limitation of samba mounts when YOU are fearing someone can use a livecd to steal your data.
[22:31] <Miebster> jrib: for NFS I just put it in the fstab, no password, no username, and it works since it auths automatically
[22:31] <Miebster> bekks: wrong, it is a limitation with SAMBA mounts in linux, this works in windows (no passwords entered) and works with NFS in linux (no passwords entered)
[22:31] <bekks> Miebster: Since WHEN does NFS auths itself automagically against what?
[22:31] <Rienzilla> hmm
[22:31] <jgodbout> escott: shall i try creating a new swap partition and using that?
[22:32] <z_Chanshark> well im off, bye
[22:32] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: same on win, i should note. then go the way shown by bekks (LDAP etc,)
[22:32] <escott> jgodbout, i would try to boot a livecd and create the cryptswap device and then mkswap that device (if you can) alternately zero out the underlying swap device partition and try to recreate the swap device when booting
[22:32] <bekks> NFS3 implements NO security auth at all, and NFS4 requires a kerberos backend.
[22:32] <Miebster> bekks: for NFS I put this in my fstab server.local:/home/nfs/foo /opt/foo nfs user,exec,nolock 0 0
[22:32] <escott> jgodbout, this should explain how to do it http://hydra.geht.net/tino/howto/linux/cryptswap/
[22:33] <bekks> Thats NFS3 without any authentication.,
[22:33] <bekks> Everyone could access that share.
[22:33] <jgodbout> escott: ok thanks, iĺl try thatand report back
[22:33] <Miebster> bekks: if the user doens't have auth they get denied
[22:33] <bekks> Miebster: Using NFS3, there is no auth at all.
[22:34] <bekks> Miebster: Do you have a kerberos server for authentication? If no, you are using NFS3 and NO auth at all.
[22:37] <bekks> Miebster: So I take this as you should redesign your entire non-existing security concept.
[22:38] <Miebster> bekks: you have this asusmption that I have anything to do with the backend, I'm not sure how it works, I know that in windows it uses your credentials you used when you logged in to the domain
[22:38] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: put it simple: if password is stored somewhere locally, it can be stolen. you have only two other options: a) enter it every time; and b) store it in some TRUSTED place (that means strong auth etc.)
[22:39] <ubuntu-tester> Miebster: yes, domain is that same trusted third party
[22:39] <Miebster> ubuntu-tester: on windows the password isn't stored, you auth to the domain and then when you access the drives the server checks if you are authed to the domain
[22:39] <bekks> Miebster: Which is a local authentication and it requires to have the SAME credentials on ALL computers. Using an Active Directory, you have a CENTRAL administration, which eases up administration heavily in terms of security.
[22:39] <bekks> And the password IS stored, in Windows.
[22:40] <nineteensixty> is there a 12.10 for i7 the download only seems to to amd64
[22:40] <bekks> NTSAM.DAT or something like that contains all local accounts and can be easily hacked.
[22:40] <jgodbout> escott: That page is a bit too complicated for me to follow. Is there a simpler way to do that? Can we just delete the swap file to get rid of the hibernation data?
[22:40] <escott> jgodbout, thats basically what im suggesting. but if you have encrypted home so you should have encrypted swap
[22:41] <xangua> !amd64 | nineteensixty
[22:42] <escott> nineteensixty, amd64 is the name for the 64bit arch made by intel b/c amd came up with it first
[22:43] <OerHeks> intel made ia64, wich wasn't succesfull, because it was not compatible with 32 bit instructions
[22:44] <nineteensixty> I'm getting: This kernel requires an x86-64 CPU but only detected an i686 CPU
[22:44] <escott> then either it is not an i7 or you are running in a virtual environment
[22:44] <bekks> nineteensixty: Thats pretty clear. You need a 32bit kernel or a 64bit CPU.
[22:45] <nineteensixty> you'd think so wouldn't you!
[22:45] <blkadder> And if you are running in a virtual make sure you have support enabled in BIOS.
[22:45] <bekks> nineteensixty: Ensure you created a 64bit VM, not a 32bit one.
[22:46] <nineteensixty> Ah that may be why
[22:47] <nineteensixty> Which I probably can't do with the free Microsoft Virtual PC
[22:47] <bekks> Which you can do.
[22:47] <blkadder> Dunno but Virtualbox works fine.
[22:47] <demonio1> hi all, can anyone tell me where are source files write in c about program as "rm" "mv" ls etc
[22:47] <blkadder> I am using it now.
[22:47] <demonio1> ?
[22:47] <bekks> demonio1: You have to install the source packages.
[22:47] <escott> !info coreutils-dev
[22:48] <wolftune> Anybody know if there exists a KDE plasma panel widget to do something like the Unity thing where the active window's title bar and buttons are shown in the panel?
[22:48] <escott> demonio1, it would be coreutils package, source can be got from gnu.org
[22:48] <jrib> demonio1: or just « apt-get source coreutils »
[22:49] <Steven4242> Hello I have managed to boot into 12.10 however now I have no internet access via wifi.. can anyone help me? (I have tried googling solutions but I cant get anything to work)
[22:50] <demonio1> sorry maybe i did wrong i want se files system write in c
[22:50] <jgodbout> daftykins: escott: ok i just deleted my swap partition, and now running boot-repair
[22:50] <Steven4242> my wireless network just says "device not ready"
[22:50] <jrib> demonio1: you want to see the C source code, yes?
[22:50] <demonio1> jrib yes
[22:51] <jrib> demonio1: so did you run « apt-get source coreutils » ?  It will place a directory in your current directory
[22:51] <blkadder> Steven4242: Are you certain you are running a supported device?
[22:51] <demonio1> jrib and then ?
[22:51] <jrib> demonio1: and then you read it
[22:52] <Steven4242> blkadder:  how do I find that out? when I was running 12.04 I was connected and had no problems.. just 12.10 is causing problems
[22:52] <Quest>  please see this http://stackoverflow.com/questions/14287501/java-home-in-etc-enviroment-in-ubuntu    any help?
[22:53] <demonio1> jrib ok i'll try thanks :)
[22:53] <blkadder> If it was running previously then it is likely to be supported. What type of device is it?
[22:53] <jrib> Quest: why don't you install java through the repositories?
[22:53] <Steven4242> how do you enable a network device?
[22:54] <Quest> jrib,  i will still need to setup home
[22:54] <Quest> java home *
[22:54] <escott> Quest, its inappropriate for /etc/env to reference the home dir of a user
[22:54] <Steven4242> in my network settings it just says Wireless then underneath it Unavailable
[22:54] <Quest> escott, despite it says $ echo $JAVA_HOME
[22:54] <Quest> /home/syncsys/bin/jdk1.7.0_10
[22:55] <jrib> Quest: if you need to setup JAVA_HOME you can do that
[22:55] <Quest> jrib, how
[22:55] <jrib> Quest: the way you're doing it now
[22:55] <jrib> Quest: well some of it anyway.
[22:55] <escott> Quest, i didnt say it wouldnt work. i said it was inappropriate
[22:55] <blkadder> ifup but the drivers need to be loaded for it to work.
[22:55] <Quest> jrib,  if you read the link i gave. it says. $ java -version
[22:55] <Quest> The program 'java' can be found in the following packages:
[22:55] <Quest>  * default-jre
[22:55] <jrib> Quest: I read it
[22:55] <Quest> then why it says like that
[22:56] <Quest> escott,  ok.
[22:56] <blkadder> What specific wifi device are you running?
[22:56] <jrib> Quest: I recommend you install java through the repositories.  Then return here if you still have issues.
[22:56] <Quest> escott,  so whats wrong . why its not working
[22:56] <jrib> !java | Quest
[22:56] <ChrisWere> I've come accross yet another bug in ubuntu, surprise surprise, we logitech c15 webcam doesn't work with guvcview. Anyone know how to fix this?
[22:56] <Quest> jrib,  escott  i have done it before. repos also need to setup java home. its the same.
[22:56] <escott> Quest, if you installed java to a users home folder you should specify that in their ~/.profile or ~/.bashrc
[22:56] <Steven4242> Is there a command I can type in terminal to tell me what wifi card I have?
[22:57] <jrib> Quest: well you haven't installed it through the repositories this time, it looks like.
[22:57] <ubuntu-tester> Steven4242: try lspci |grep -i wireless
[22:57] <blkadder> Try lspci
[22:58] <Quest> jrib,  trust me. its the same
[22:58] <Steven4242> 03:00.0 Network controller: Atheros Communications Inc. AR9287 Wireless Network Adapter (PCI-Express) (rev 01)
[22:58] <jrib> Quest: it's not :/
[23:00] <blkadder> Steven4242: Now go google that card + Ubuntu. :-)
[23:00] <blkadder> Looks like support is a bit flaky for it.
[23:00] <jrib> Quest: for one, if you use a nice package from the repositories, you won't have to deal with java not being in your path.  I don't use java and I don't know if you still need to set JAVA_HOME.  But you can do that if you want (use /etc/environment like you are now)
[23:01] <disharmonic> New card? i thought atheros is more or less a safe bet
[23:02] <stueng> hi, where do I change the default session to unity-2d ?
[23:02] <stueng> !unity2d
[23:02] <blkadder> Steven4242: Perhaps this one will help: http://www.ossdoc.com/2012/10/how-to-fxx-atheros-ar9285ar9287.html
[23:02] <disharmonic> stueng, on the login screen
[23:02] <disharmonic> stueng, it alway remembers yor last choice
[23:04] <Steven4242> hello
[23:04] <stueng> I want to make anyone that ever uses the machine only have the ability to use unity-2d
[23:04] <stueng> no choice
[23:04] <stueng> forced
[23:05] <Steven4242> YAY wireless works!!
[23:05] <jgodbout> daftykins: I think that im ready to try deleting uswsusp, can you please help me with that?
[23:05] <stueng> ive removed the sessions from /usr/share/xsessions to see what happens
[23:05] <blkadder> Feel free to send me money. :-)
[23:05] <jgodbout> daftykins: fiddling around with and deleting my swap didnt do much
[23:05] <Steven4242> thank you so much! :D
[23:05] <blkadder> You are welcome.
[23:05] <uponatree> Hi there, any radius-expert out there?
[23:05] <jgodbout> daftykins: or maybe i should just reinstall ubuntu.
[23:07] <ogist> lol
[23:07] <ogist> root has joined
[23:07] <ogist> woa
[23:07] <ogist> theroot joined as i typed that
[23:07] <ogist> root
[23:07] <ogist> orot
[23:07] <ogist> troo
[23:08] <blkadder> rot
[23:08] <k1l_> !ot | ogist
[23:08] <ogist> !ot | k1l_
[23:09] <guest-sgkIwQ> hi
[23:09] <uponatree> I want to set up device authentification on a lan with a radius server on ubuntu, but i can't find any howtos. do you have some hints how to do that?
[23:11] <escott> stueng, you might try uninstalling compiz
[23:11] <daftykins> jgodbout: sorry went to cook. where are you at?
[23:11] <Guest94829> using linux os first time and it rock
[23:12] <wildphp-bot>  Chat Logging has been [Enabled]
[23:12] <blkadder> uponatree: I dunno a google search seems to reveal some info
[23:12] <blkadder> http://www.mydeveloperblog.com/linux-tutorial/radius/radius-servers-installation-guide-freeradius-ubuntu-mysql/
[23:13] <wildphp-bot>  Chat Logging has been [Enabled]
[23:13] <lhavelund> !bot | wildc4rd
[23:13] <lhavelund> please don't use other bots, wildc4rd
[23:14] <uponatree> blkadder: i found these too. but i want device authentification based on certificates
[23:14] <lhavelund> wildc4rd: apologies. he left quickly. and my tabcomplete is derp.
[23:14] <unreal82> Anyone here familiar with encrypted lvm?
[23:15] <blkadder> You mean like this? http://deployingradius.com/documents/configuration/certificates.html
[23:15] <escott> unreal82, yes i've heard of it
[23:15] <marnix> hi
[23:16] <daftykins> !hi
[23:16] <daftykins> !hello
[23:16] <marnix> I have got a pysdm problem
[23:16] <daftykins> !ask | marnix
[23:16] <stueng> this might be a dumb question.. but how do I know if I am running unity2d or 3d?
[23:17] <marnix> my PC  will not boot anymore after using pysdm - HELP
[23:17] <unreal82> escott: I want to dual boot windows xp and xubuntu. I have attempted to install xubuntu using the alternate download, to no avail. I can only use the desktop image. I was wondering if there's some conflict with dual booting and encrypted lvm. I am using two separate hard drives, one for each os.
[23:17] <uponatree> blkadder: guess your link is how to create a new server certificat, but i want to authentificate devices with their own certificates
[23:17] <jgodbout> daftykins: im just going to back up my files from my encrypted home and reinstall. thanks for the help!
[23:17] <uponatree> blkadder: like in windows network policy server
[23:17] <daftykins> jgodbout: sounds good! my pleasure, sorry we couldn't get there.
[23:18] <escott> unreal82, the only issue i can think of is if /boot is inside the lvm then you would need to provide the password to see the menu item to boot windows
[23:18] <diverdude> Is there an edsitor that can access a file via ftp, and edit it and save it directly to the ftp location again?
[23:18] <unreal82> no, it's outside. I wouldn't encrypt the /boot.
[23:19] <escott> diverdude, there is probably a fuse ftp filesystem module you can use and then use any editor you want
[23:19] <blkadder> uponatree: You need to create the cert then install them on the client systems in order to auth.
[23:19] <jgodbout> daftykins: :)
[23:20] <unreal82> escott: the install fails consistently at "select and install software", not sure if that means anything.
[23:20] <diverdude> escott, i tried mounting via curlftpfs...but its extremely slow
[23:20] <stueng> this might be a dumb question.. but how do I know if I am running unity2d or 3d?
[23:20] <ubuntu-tester> diverdude: mc for ex.
[23:20] <diverdude> ubuntu-tester, ???
[23:20] <uponatree> blkadder: do i create the client certs like the server cert? where can i tell radius to except certs instead of user/password?
[23:20] <unreal82> stueng: when you log in, you select 2d or 3d at the splash screen.
[23:21] <ubuntu-tester> Midnight Commander
[23:21] <stueng> unreal82 once I am IN the session how would I know which session I am in
[23:21] <daftykins> stueng: there's all kinda fancy 3D effects going on
[23:22] <stueng> im in a remote VNC session is its difficult to tell
[23:22] <stueng> ive removed all the sessions from /user/share/xsessions and also changed lightdm.conf to load the 2d session but Im not convinced I am in a 2d session
[23:22] <unreal82> stueng: daftkins is right http://askubuntu.com/questions/62001/am-i-using-unity-or-unity-2d
[23:22] <stueng> the menus dissapear when I click on them and stuff
[23:23] <stueng> the trash icon does not seem transparent
[23:23] <blkadder> uponatree: Take a look at the docs in freeradius.org. I haven't touched radius since the days of dial-up.
[23:24] <uponatree> blkadder: i'll have a look, thanks!
[23:25] <ubuntu-tester> stueng: see the last answer there
[23:25] <blkadder> uponatree: You are welcome. Here's another link that might be helpful regarding the certs/install http://www.dartmouth.edu/~pkilab/pages/EAP-TLSwFreeRadius.html
[23:26] <blkadder> Assuming you understand how TLS works, etc.
[23:26] <stueng> ah yes thanks ubuntu-tester last answer is great
[23:29] <marnix> my PC  will not boot anymore after using pysdm - HELP
[23:30] <Feedhurley> is there someone who is good at fstab?
[23:30] <Feedhurley> i got partition problems
[23:32] <ubuntu-tester> Feedhurley: ask away
[23:32] <marnix> for pysdm?
[23:35] <dr_willis> !fstab
[23:35] <ZombiePox> Witam :)
[23:35] <dr_willis> psydm MIGHT make a backup of the fstab file it changes.. check in /etc/ and hope for the best. ;)
[23:35] <stueng> if I wanted to startx with session unity-2d what would the command be ?
[23:35] <dr_willis> stueng:  you are on 12.04 correct?
[23:35] <Feedhurley> ubuntu-tester okey, i have done this post http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2103960 but I do not really understand his answer
[23:36] <stueng> dr_willis yeah
[23:36] <dr_willis> stueng:  i belive if you select uinity 2d at the login screen it changes your .dmrc and after that startx will default to unity2d
[23:36] <dr_willis> stueng:  you can check the unity-2d.desktop filein the x sessions directory to see what command it runs also
[23:37] <stueng> ok thats great but unfortuenly I need to know how to do it from the command line
[23:37] <Feedhurley> ubuntu-tester i have read the first link ubottu gave me but do not know really what i should do with folders like /media/windows
[23:37] <marnix> will look thx
[23:37] <stueng> ok thnks will look at that
[23:37] <stueng> Exec=gnome-session --session=ubuntu-2d
[23:37] <stueng> ^ thanks
[23:38] <stueng> woh lol that didnt work.. back to gnokme fallback
[23:39] <dr_willis> stueng:  theres no longer a unity2d in 12.10 :) just in case you ever try this in 12.10
[23:40] <Feedhurley> !Partitions
[23:40] <ubuntu-tester> Feedhurley: which partitions do you have problems with?
[23:40] <stueng> im busy setting up freenx.. messing with different sessions
[23:40] <ubuntu-tester> *partition, of the two
[23:40] <dr_willis> stueng:  whats the exact lines you put in your .xinitrc? actially its .Xsession i think these days
[23:40] <Feedhurley> ubuntu-tester did you see the link? (a photo there of my new formated disk, holding ext4 and ntfs).
[23:41] <zykotick9> dr_willis: .xinitrc only works with "startx"... so for DMed systems, not too helpful ;)
[23:41] <stueng> not sure, that doesnt really affect what im doing as freenx runs the command
[23:41] <dr_willis> stueng:  with remote desktops - i find the lightest is bestest.. :) somthing like openbox  with perhaps a simple file manager.
[23:41] <dr_willis> Ive seen lightdm have options to run the users .xinitrc session
[23:41] <stueng> it needs to be somewhat pretty
[23:41] <stueng> its for users
[23:41] <ubuntu-tester> Feedhurley: yes, which of the two you can't use?
[23:41] <Feedhurley> ubuntu-tester i have problem with both. The ntfs partition cant be opened and the ext4 cant create or paste any files or folders into
[23:42] <dr_willis> actually i thoght freenx was supposed to run lightdm.. i never was able to get freenx working right
[23:42] <stueng> it runs gnome-fallback fine
[23:42] <ubuntu-tester> Feedhurley: are they mentioned in fstab?
[23:42] <Feedhurley> "sudo blkid" gives me the UUID, if that was what you ment?
[23:43] <Feedhurley> for both
[23:43] <ubuntu-tester> Feedhurley: yes, and pastebin your fstab
[23:44] <marnix> I have found 3 files fstab / fstab.BAK and fstab.d    How to restore the original file?
[23:44] <dr_willis> marnix:  i would double check the .BAK file's date and contents. then compare it to your current fstab. and if it looks ok.. copy it over
[23:44] <Feedhurley> ubuntu-tester http://paste.ubuntu.com/1521394/
[23:44] <Duality> hi
[23:44] <dr_willis> ive never noticed a fstab.d befor.
[23:45] <Duality> i got a firewire --> usb cable and was wondering if i can use usb port for firewire ?
[23:45] <jcao219> Does anybody know if it's possible to run testdisk and photorec both at the same time in parallel?
[23:45] <jcao219> meaning, possible and safe?
[23:46] <marnix> thx dr_willis, a newbie here, could you give me a link where I can find how to do that?
[23:46] <dr_willis> marnix:  bash basics guides. use the cp command to copy files
[23:47] <dr_willis> ive never seen a usb to firewire adaptor.
[23:47] <dr_willis> !bash
[23:47] <ubuntu-tester> Feedhurley: remove /dev/sdb* lines from fstab, umount, reformat with gparted, add lines to fstab with parameters as suggested by oldfred.
[23:48] <ubuntu-tester> Feedhurley: for ntfs you can also install ntfs-config and control mounting from GUI
[23:49] <ubuntu-tester> jcao219: what media are you recovering? it may be not safe
[23:50] <jcao219> ubuntu-tester: external hard drive connected to the motherboard
[23:51] <rundata> hi
[23:52] <psychopathic> hi guys
[23:54] <ubuntu-tester> jcao219: if hdd is really falling, every extra read/write opreations can sometimes add damage. it is recommended to take image of the whole disk with ddrescue (it does it clever way, while dd dumb way) and make any recovery on the image. in this case parallel ops are safe. this way requires a lot of space though.
[23:55] <stueng> !flash
[23:55] <ogist> he
[23:56] <jcao219> ubuntu-tester: thanks for the info
[23:58] <machicola> will 'gnome-session' or whichever windows session I have set up have the same PID every time I boot up?
[23:59] <machicola> i'm trying to tell a script to wait for the windows session to finish loading before running any applications
[23:59] <syncsys> my java home path is not working. $ cat /etc/environment
[23:59] <syncsys> JAVA_HOME="/home/syncsys/bin/jdk1.7.0_10"
[23:59] <syncsys> PATH="$JAVA_HOME/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/games:/usr/local/games"
[23:59] <syncsys> syncsys@sync-pc:~$ java -version
[23:59] <syncsys> The program 'java' can be found in the following packages:
[23:59] <FloodBot1> syncsys: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.


[12:17] <doko> mdz: hppa NPTL: IMO doing nothing, but just naming the problem is some kind of implementation status as well. I did move it now to outstanding issues
[12:28] <jbailey> doko: hmm?
[12:29] <doko> jbailey: IIRC we did acknowledge the problem, and put it aside at the devmeeting
[12:30] <jbailey> doko: I just saw nptl, and don't have context.
[12:30] <jbailey> So I'm trying to figure out what you're talking about and how I can help. =)
[12:32] <doko> jbailey: the toolchain-roadmap, see mdz's comment on the whiteboard. (although I already removed the inline comment)
[12:37] <jbailey> Right, I see it.
[12:37] <jbailey> FWIW, Carlos is going to commit his current NPTL stuff this week.
[12:38] <jbailey> I had a chance to get some face time with him last weekend.
[12:38] <jbailey> And I now have parisc gear.
[12:38] <jbailey> So I can't see the end of the tunnel, but I'm definetly in it now. =)
[01:37] <jbailey> Keybuk: You willing to do a couple reviews?
[01:37] <Keybuk> sure
[01:37] <jbailey> I wound up editting a bunch of the toolchain specs, so I'm not comfortable saying I reviewed them too. =P
[01:39] <jbailey> Keybuk: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/edgyplusone-toolchain-roadmap
[01:39] <jbailey> Keybuk: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/java-roadmap
[01:44] <doko> Keybuk: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/native-java-gcj
[01:45] <jbailey> I need to grab food, I'll check in a bit later on the status.
[01:45] <jbailey> (text message if there's something urgent you need answered)
[01:46] <Keybuk> I might get you to voip phone me when you're home ... need to check whether this headset is useful or not