[12:26] <TheSheep> you can also hold down shift while deleting in thunar -- then it won't use trash
[12:27] <Jester45> i like to keep things untill i need somespace
[12:27] <TheSheep> rm doesn't use trash -- ever
[12:28] <Jester45> thats why i tried it
[12:28] <Scrape> Argh. My mouse is moving way too fast, but the control center settings won't change it... any thoughts?
[12:28] <Jester45> because it wasnt deleting from trash
[12:28] <Jester45> have bettter reflexes
[12:28] <Scrape> hehe
[12:29] <Scrape> Moving the mouse less than an inch puts it all the way across the screen.
[12:29] <Jester45> is there a 125x cd?
[12:30] <Jester45> my burner says it can burn at 125x i would like to see that
[12:30] <k8dd> 7200 rpm burner?
[12:30] <Jester45> idk
[12:31] <cjae> Jester45, I just broke my xorg.conf and did dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg
[12:31] <cjae> Jester45, does this do a fresh reconfigure??
[12:31] <Jester45> yea
[12:31] <cjae> is the wacom thing in everyone??
[12:32] <Jester45> not mine
[12:32] <Jester45> mines a streamlined 300 lines
[12:33] <cjae> I just looked at my xorg and was wondering if ubuntu does the wacom thing by default or if it reloaded a backup
[12:33] <Jester45> it woudnt reload a backup unless you told it to
[12:33] <Jester45> that would defeat the reason to reconfigure
[12:33] <cjae> Jester45, thought so does
[12:34] <cjae> it must be a default thing
[12:34] <cjae> what does -phigh enable
[12:34] <cjae> ??
[12:35] <Jester45> ever used that
[12:36] <cjae> Jester45, and I edited out 15 bit resolution and added some to my tv out and it crashed
[12:36] <h3sp4wn> debconf only ask questions of priority high or critical
[12:36] <q-t> Hey, when i tried to enable the restricted driver manager to use the driver for mye ATI card, xubuntu wouldnt start up again. A big mistake maybe?
[12:36] <Jester45> besides apt
[12:37] <cjae> Jester45, my question is I don't need to have 15 bit for my monitor in there right?? I could just have 1 4 16 and 24 right?
[12:37] <Jester45> just leave it
[12:37] <cjae> ok
[12:38] <Jester45> its not gonna hurt
[12:38] <Jester45> unless you need the diskspace
[12:38] <Jester45> :)
[12:38] <cjae> not at all
[12:38] <Jester45> 1 bit wouldnt that be all white?
[12:39] <Jester45> or all black
[12:39] <h3sp4wn> I think its easier to cut xorg.conf down
[12:39] <cjae> um but can I make it just 640x480, 800x600 and 1024x780 without the other two options like
[12:39] <Jester45> heerrr?
[12:40] <zials> isn't that how it is by default? O.o
[12:40] <cjae> 640x350 and ones like that
[12:40] <h3sp4wn> Ideally I would like it to fit one one screen
[12:40] <h3sp4wn> (it is just a few lines more though)
[12:40] <cjae> Jester45, I am just trying to narrow what I did wrong
[12:41] <cjae> I think tv out can only be 24 bit or was that just an ati thing?
[12:42] <cjae> and can I only have one resolution or one bitrate? for tv out??
[12:42] <Jester45> no it can less
[12:43] <cjae> cause I took out the 15 bit section
[12:43] <Jester45> mine goes from 8bit - 24bit  and 400x300 - 800x600
[12:43] <Jester45> well in windows
[12:43] <Jester45> my cards not supported yet
[12:44] <cjae>  and took out silly resolutions on 640x480, 800x600 and 1024x780
[12:45] <cjae> then I tried to add 800x600 and 640x480 two screen 1 @ 24 bit and boom no more xserver
[12:46] <Jester45> try 640x480 with a smaller bit like 16
[12:46] <cjae> I wanted the other resolutions out for my monitor so when I push ctr +- it only uses 640, 800 and 1024
[12:47] <cjae> I have used 24 1024 on my tv out before just wanted to be able to switch it so I can read it when on the couch
[12:47] <cjae> to 800x600
[12:48] <cjae> I think someone said to me that you can only use one though
[12:48] <cjae> on tv out
[12:48] <Jester45> might wanna check with the ati driver docs
[12:48] <cjae> I have an nvidia
[12:48] <Jester45> what out put? s-video?
[12:48] <Jester45> or nvidia ones
[12:49] <cjae> s video
[12:49] <cjae> you mean dpi
[12:49] <NrbelexUbuntu> How does one change the permission options on multiple files using thunar? I can't even do it as root.
[12:50] <cjae> I gave up on ati awhile ago
[12:50] <Jester45> i love ati
[12:50] <cjae> then tried it again in slackware and should have just punched myself instead
[12:52] <cjae> I don't like either both of their new drivers in windows suck major ------ fill your own blank
[12:52] <Jester45> it would be nice if xorg could detect dual cards
[12:52] <Jester45> and ask if you want to enable output on them
[12:53] <cjae> they are so big that they substantially slow my p4 512mb box down
[12:54] <Jester45> i like rovclock
[12:55] <Jester45> i took out an old card and rovcloked the core to 600mhz
[12:55] <Jester45> didnt even display anything
[12:57] <cjae> I reverted my ati in another box to the old 5.10 catalyst
[12:58] <cjae> and the new super idiot control center driver of m$ my makes my tv flicker and sound snap
[12:59] <cjae> and takes like 2 minutes to load (well not quite)
[01:00] <cjae> of > for
[01:01] <cjae> oh and it should say nvidia
[01:01] <cjae> I need some quality sleep
[01:03] <q-t> If your xserver doesnt work, how do you boot straight into 'just the terminal' ??
[01:04] <cjae> are you at the end of the boot message
[01:05] <cjae> Jester45, that didn't break anything??
[01:06] <q-t> cjae: me?
[01:06] <cjae> q-t y
[01:07] <cjae> q-t, sorry I mean yes cat pulled kb
[01:07] <q-t> ehm not now, but Im doing stuff that always ends up with me not getting into the xserver, it stalls in different places. And I was wondering if someone knew a way to boot without getting into X. I`ve only gotten there by accident before:P
[01:07] <q-t> just typing alot ;P
[01:08] <q-t> its the damn ati card
[01:08] <h3sp4wn> you can stop {k,g,x}dm from running
[01:09] <q-t> how do I do that without entering x?
[01:09] <h3sp4wn> select recovery mode
[01:09] <q-t> so I can configure xorg.conf and so on....
[01:09] <q-t> ok
[01:09] <q-t> I dont get prompted for anything, it just boots in
[01:09] <h3sp4wn> (that should be without x anyway)
[01:09] <h3sp4wn> update-rc.d -f remove gdm
[01:10] <q-t> h3sp4wn: what is that?
[01:10] <h3sp4wn> man update-rc.d
[01:10] <q-t> ok
[01:12] <q-t> it will make my linux not boot into xserver untill i type startx....?
[01:15] <h3sp4wn> yes
[01:15] <q-t> thnx:)
[01:16] <q-t> im reading the man now, im just not very used to all these new commands. Havent used linux that long:)
[01:16] <q-t> Havent the first clue what to do when things go wrong:P
[01:20] <h3sp4wn> update-rc.d -f gdm remove (I got it the wrong way round)
[01:20] <h3sp4wn> you can put back with - update-rc.d gdm defaults
[01:29] <q-t> ok
[01:29] <q-t> Im gonna do that after I re-install xubuntu on my laptop
[01:32] <q-t> ehm, it isnt 'update-rc.d -f xfce remove' or something in xubuntu, instead of gmd??
[01:32] <q-t> afraid I dont understand if gnome and xfce are totally seperate
[01:40] <Pumpernickel> Xubuntu uses gdm.
[01:41] <q-t> thought it used xfce
[01:41] <Pumpernickel> It does.
[01:42] <q-t> okay, so xfce is a function on gnome?
[01:42] <q-t> or gdm
[01:42] <Pumpernickel> No, xfce is a separate desktop environment.
[01:42] <TheSheep> q-t: both gnome and xfce are relly just a set of many applications
[01:43] <q-t> i c
[01:43] <TheSheep> q-t: xfce doesn't have its own desktop manager, so we use gnome's
[01:43] <TheSheep> q-t: because it doesn't use too much parts from gnome
[01:43] <TheSheep> s/we/xubuntu
[01:43] <TheSheep> sorry
[01:43] <brianw> it only uses gdm really
[01:45] <Pumpernickel> GDM is just the display manager.  It manages setting up a graphical prompt from which a user can start a desktop session.
[01:46] <cjae> Jester45, the wacom part must be needed
[01:46] <TheSheep> cjae: why?
[01:46] <cjae> cause it s the only part I deleted again it d\broke the server
[01:47] <TheSheep> cjae: aaah, you need to remove the wacom parts form the servelayout section too
[01:47] <q-t> So xfce isnt a desktop manager
[01:47] <TheSheep> cjae: sorry, forgot about that
[01:47] <TheSheep> q-t: display manager
[01:47] <q-t> aaaah, i c
[01:47] <cjae> ill try
[01:47] <Pumpernickel> q-t: You're mixing your terms.
[01:47] <q-t> so xubuntu is running xfce as display manager and gnome as desktop manager...
[01:47] <q-t> right ?:P
[01:47] <Pumpernickel> Nope. :)
[01:48] <TheSheep> Pumpernickel: that was me, sorry
[01:48] <q-t> hehe
[01:48] <q-t> okay
[01:48] <q-t> hmmmm
[01:48] <Pumpernickel> GDM is just the login portion.
[01:48] <Pumpernickel> From there, xfwm4 is the window manager, and the various parts of the desktop environment are all provided by parts of xfce.
[01:48] <q-t> I wish I had a friend that knew linux from the inside out, so someone could show me in person the basics + +
[01:49] <Pumpernickel> e.g, the panels, menus, desktop background + icons, etc.
[01:49] <q-t> okay, so gnome logs you into the xserver, and then xfce takes over....
[01:49] <Pumpernickel> No, GDM, does that.
[01:49] <q-t> argh
[01:49] <q-t> :P
[01:49] <TheSheep> q-t: that message about starting GNOME is just wrong
[01:50] <TheSheep> I think I'm going to file a bug
[01:50] <brianw> gdm is the only part of gnome involved
[01:50] <q-t> TheSheep: ok
[01:50] <brianw> if you have gnome services, you can use the session manager to start gnome services on login
[01:50] <brianw> like if you install gnome-keyring-manager or something
[01:51] <q-t> ok
[01:51] <cjae_> you mean "CorePointer" and "Corekeyboard"
[01:51] <cjae_> TheSheep,
[01:52] <TheSheep> cjae_: no, the other ones
[01:52] <TheSheep> cjae_: I don't have an xorg.cong handy
[01:52] <TheSheep> conf
[01:52] <q-t> When I use the 'https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto/ATI' explanation for installing ATI drivers on xubuntu, the 6.10 (Edgy) explanation. This is better than just adding the driver to the restricted driver manager, or is it just the same???
[01:52] <cjae_> I am going to pastebin both conf k
[01:52] <cjae_> confs
[01:53] <TheSheep> q-t: depends
[01:53] <cjae_> Is nt the restricted 96xx driver?
[01:54] <q-t> cjae_: yes:P
[01:54] <cjae_> and the edgy way 8xxx
[01:54] <TheSheep> q-t: you get newver driver, but it's not tested so well and supported by ubuntu team
[01:54] <cjae_> it seemed to be stable with beryl installed
[01:55] <q-t> TheSheep: Ok, because I have had nothing but trouble with that graph card....ati mobility radeon 9600
[01:55] <cjae_> I think the old driver is a little old
[01:55] <q-t> I was wondering about tuning down the graphics, running it simple or something
[01:57] <q-t> cjae_: it said that if the feisty 7.04 way didnt work you should try the edgy way....
[02:00] <unikon> anyone know how to install pidgin 2.0 NOT pidgin beta
[02:04] <cjae> ok I have almost destroyed my desktop
[02:04] <cjae> here is the one that works http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20557/
[02:05] <cjae> and the one that doesn't http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20558/
[02:06] <cjae> TheSheep,
[02:06] <cjae> Jester45,
[02:13] <cjae> hi
[02:16] <TheSheep> cjae: looks good
[02:16] <cjae> doesn't work
[02:16] <TheSheep> cjae: what's the error?
[02:16] <cjae> trying again hang on
[02:17] <cjae> the whole server is broke would you like to see ... but I selected no and got thrown to $
[02:17] <cjae> will try again think I saw typo
[02:18] <TheSheep> cjae: you have one EndSection toot many in line 60
[02:18] <cjae> think so
[02:18] <TheSheep> good luck
[02:21] <cjae> should I have this sorry for no pastebin desktop is whack
[02:21] <cjae> Section "ServerLayout"
[02:21] <cjae>    Identifier  "Simple Layout"
[02:21] <cjae>        Screen 0 "Screen[0] "
[02:21] <cjae>        Screen 1 "Screen[1] " RightOf "Screen[0] "
[02:21] <cjae>    InputDevice "Configured Mouse" "CorePointer"
[02:21] <cjae>    InputDevice "Generic Keyboard" "CoreKeyboard"
[02:22] <cjae> EndSection
[02:22] <cjae> TheSheep,
[02:22] <cjae> the core pointer part
[02:22] <cjae> and kb
[02:24] <ouz> i have a xubuntu display question
[02:25] <ouz> the top task bar - Applications has disappeared, what is the best way to get it back?
[02:27] <zials> x.x
[02:28] <zials> right click on an empty spot on the top task bar
[02:28] <zials> and select "Add new item"
[02:28] <ouz> there is no top task bar, that is what disappeared
[02:28] <zials> a new window should open, scroll all the way down and pick the "XFCE menu"
[02:28] <zials> O.o
[02:31] <zials> well, do you want to restore the bar or just access the applications menu?
[02:31] <unikon> how can i upgrade from 6.06 to 7.04 Xubuntu
[02:32] <unikon> zials my applications tab is missing as well
[02:32] <zials> is it the whole bar or just the tab?
[02:32] <ouz> i am able to access the applications menu now by right clicking the desktop
[02:33] <ouz> i enabled it through desktop settings
[02:33] <ouz> i would like to know how to restore the bar though
[02:33] <zials> well, if you want to add a new panel
[02:33] <zials> theres a pannel on the bottom right?
[02:34] <zials> right click it and select "Customize panel"
[02:34] <Jester45> unikon: you have to upgrade from 6.06 to 6.10 to 7.04
[02:34] <Jester45> !upgrade
[02:34] <ubotu> For upgrading, see the instructions at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpgradeNotes
[02:35] <unikon> jester45, ubotu if i upgrade will all my settings and logs remain unchanged
[02:35] <Jester45> yes
[02:36] <unikon> thanks
[02:36] <Jester45> but... upgrading can cause trobles
[02:36] <unikon> how so
[02:36] <Jester45> diffrent things go wrong
[02:36] <unikon> so its best to do a fresh install with the latest  version
[02:37] <Jester45> it is best to use apt-get dist-upgrade from a ttyl(alt + ctrl + F1) and kill the xserver while upgrading
[02:37] <ouz> to get the entire panel or taskbar back i used this command "xfce4-panel &"
[02:37] <Jester45> ouz: yes you dont have to put the &
[02:38] <Jester45> ouz: unless your in a terminal
[02:38] <ouz> i was in a terminal and wanted it in the background
[02:38] <ouz> guess i need to make sure i save settings on exit to keep panel
[02:39] <Jester45> unikon: its safer to do a fresh install, you can burn things you need to a cd and do a dist-upgrade and if it breaks something then do a fresh install and use the cd to restore things
[02:39] <Jester45> ouz: or add it to the auto  started applications
[02:41] <unikon> jester45 have you by chance installed pidgin 2.0 yet NOT  the beta?
[02:42] <Jester45> nope
[02:42] <Jester45> is that the firefox like music player?
[02:42] <unikon> ahh
[02:42] <ouz> thanks, did not know about the autostarted applications
[02:43] <unikon>  how long do you think ittakes from product release to availability on synaptic?
[02:43] <unikon> pidgin new version of gaim
[02:43] <pRrp> i installed it.
[02:43] <Jester45> o yea
[02:44] <pRrp> it seems the same to me.. just diff look.. to avoid their copyright troubles on the logo/name
[02:44] <unikon> prrp did you install from source
[02:44] <Jester45> its in synaptic i think it just under the name of gaim so people know what it is
[02:44] <pRrp> i think so.. holdon.. lemme see
[02:44] <pRrp> it was either source or a .deb
[02:45] <Jester45> ok its not just renamed in the repos
[02:45] <Jester45> it depends on the maintaners activity on it and how many people wnat it
[02:46] <pRrp> is there a deb on the pidgin site unikon?
[02:46] <Jester45> no there isnt
[02:46] <pRrp> then i used the src i guess
[02:46] <pRrp> can't remember.. it was only 3 days ago or so too.. how sad.
[02:47] <unikon> just the source in tar.bz2
[02:47] <pRrp> yeah. i remember that
[02:47] <pRrp> i did compile it.
[02:48] <Jester45> i will make one if you want
[02:48] <unikon> pRrp it may sound weird but is it easy to compile
[02:48] <pRrp> yeah, if you have errors and dont know what to apt-get to remedy it just ask
[02:48] <Jester45> and just so you know its only in beta stage even tho the version is 2.0
[02:49] <Jester45> hold on a min
[02:49] <unikon> pidgin isnt available in apt-get and the guys in pidgin are saying that 2.0 IS out
[02:49] <Jester45> i allmost got the deb done
[02:50] <pRrp> yeah i know unikon
[02:50] <Jester45> 2.0 IS out but it IS STILL BETA
[02:50] <pRrp> im saying get the tar.bz2 and uncompress it.. attempt to compile
[02:50] <pRrp> and if it wont.. i can help you get it to
[02:50] <unikon> i installed perfectly on xp
[02:50] <pRrp> it's a learning process
[02:50] <pRrp> it works fine. :)
[02:50] <unikon> cool
[02:51] <Jester45> unikon: ok i have the .deb do you want me to try to send it to you?
[02:51] <unikon> please
[02:52] <Jester45> its i386
[02:52] <ferret_0567> Does anybody know how to use Nautilus with XFCE?
[02:52] <unikon> i see
[02:52] <Jester45> ferret install it and run it?
[02:53] <ferret_0567> nvm
[02:53] <pRrp> what's nautilus.. a newsreader?
[02:53] <crimsun> it's gnome's default file manager.
[02:53] <Jester45> file manager
[02:53] <pRrp> ah
[02:53] <ferret_0567> I think I know...just gotta disable xf4desktop from running, and make a startup script
[02:53] <Jester45> dang crimsun you just jump in a beat me
[02:54] <pRrp> i'm kde / fluxbox / xfce .. mostly
[02:54] <pRrp> i always have shitty computers
[02:54] <pRrp> ;)
[02:54] <ferret_0567> fluxbox? Try openbox
[02:54] <pRrp> cool. im using xf on here right now
[02:55] <pRrp> openbox better?
[02:55] <ferret_0567> yes
[02:55] <pRrp> less resources?
[02:55] <ouz> quit
[02:55] <ouz> exit
[02:55] <Jester45> unikon: is it going
[02:55] <ferret_0567> I'm not so sure about that
[02:55] <ferret_0567> Maybe a bit more...nothing much
[02:55] <unikon> its trying to
[02:55] <pRrp> word. this laptop is shitty.
[02:55] <ferret_0567> Or a bit less...
[02:55] <pRrp> i have 128mb ram. 550Mhz processor
[02:56] <unikon> prrp lolv im running Xubuntu on a 650mhz desktop w/192 ram
[02:56] <pRrp> but at least i can browse.. listen to mp3s.. stream vids.. etc.
[02:56] <unikon> lol*
[02:56] <pRrp> unikon; works good too huh
[02:56] <unikon> yep
[02:56] <pRrp> i'd smash this laptop if i had to run xp on it
[02:56] <unikon> but i bet others are using slower pc's than me
[02:57] <ferret_0567> I'd smash mine too, and it's not slow
[02:57] <pRrp> i thought about gentoo.. cause i had that on my old laptop and loved it.. but i didnt wanna spend a year compiling everything so i tried xubuntu..
[02:57] <Jester45> unikon: here -> http://rapidshare.com/files/28813389/pidgin_2.0.0beta7-1_i386.deb.html
[02:57] <unikon> pRrp win2k would work good on your lappy
[02:57] <Jester45> no no. 95
[02:58] <ferret_0567> Win 98
[02:58] <pRrp> word.. no thanks ahha
[02:58] <Jester45> 95 would run fast but you have the possiblity of crashing by pressing the start bar
[02:58] <ferret_0567> lol
[02:58] <pRrp> win 98se was on this thing when i got it.. only 64mb ram too.. i had an old compaq laptop i gutted a chip from and a harddrive to replace the dead one in here
[02:58] <pRrp> so im rockn out with 128mb ram and xubuntu on a 6gb hdd
[02:59] <Jester45> i still like notepad for simple html (98 version of notepad)
[02:59] <unikon> notepad was VERY usefull IMO
[03:00] <unikon> jester45 how long will that rapidshare page be up
[03:01] <unikon>  ill have to go there  later tonight
[03:01] <pRrp> damn. my balls got stank quick. i just showered like a day ago
[03:02] <pRrp> sorry.. wrong chan.. that was meant for #letstalkaboutthehygeineofourballs.. or something :/
[03:02] <Jester45> for at least  of 90 days
[03:02] <unikon> cool
[03:03] <unikon>   for rapidshare whats the largest file size allowed
[03:03] <Jester45> not sure
[03:04] <Jester45> well none if you use split archives
[03:04] <Jester45> but its 100mb
[03:04] <Jester45> no its 300
[03:10] <Jester45> hey vidd
[03:10] <Jester45> you can remove me from ssh if you want im not gonna be using it
[03:14] <cjae> yea
[03:14] <cjae> works
[03:14] <cjae> thanks to all that helped
[03:15] <Jester45> what working
[03:15] <cjae> xserver again
[03:15] <Jester45> o
[03:15] <cjae> gonna try mouse now
[03:15] <cjae> and the screen 1 desktop
[03:15] <cjae> Jester45, thanks
[03:16] <cjae> Jester45, can  get more resolutions on the tv out? more than one?
[03:17] <Jester45> the tv can
[03:18] <Jester45> and your card most likley can , its up to the driver
[03:18] <Jester45> give it a new res and if it dies
[03:18] <Jester45> run sudo nano /etc/X11/xorg.conf and remove it
[03:18] <cjae> gonna try
[03:19] <cjae> anyone else tried avast for linux
[03:19] <cjae> ??
[03:19] <cjae> it 's freakin sweet
[03:19] <cjae> does it have a dl daemon
[03:19] <Jester45> avast is cool but useless on linux
[03:20] <Jester45> unless your parnoid about windows comps on your networ
[03:20] <Jester45> k
[03:20] <cjae> wine app's and winblows shares
[03:21] <Jester45> dont run wine in sudo
[03:21] <Jester45> thats one step
[03:23] <cjae> I guess
[03:23] <Jester45> and 2nd dont run windows :)
[03:24] <vidd> (and 4...and 5...and...)
[03:24] <unikon> http://www.thisweeknews.com/?sec=home&story=sites/twn/content/pool/exclusives/051107-News-Bexley.html
[03:33] <cjae> keep it around case of linux breaking that I manage to do frequently
[03:33] <cjae> and to stay on top of what s new there for relatives and such
[03:34] <Jester45> cjae: run "sudo rm -r /" to fix the breaking :)
[03:34] <Jester45> dont run it
[03:34] <cjae> yeah i know
[03:34] <ksi> having trouble with screen resolution on 7.04
[03:34] <vidd> ha...i dont let the relatives NEAR my windows boxes...
[03:34] <cjae> heard about someone doing it
[03:35] <Jester45> it would be a good virus with that command plus a password guesser
[03:35] <vidd> Jester45, dont put that kind of command in a support channel...
[03:35] <vidd> there are ppl that might do it thinking that you were talking to them
[03:37] <Jester45> i bet there is only 5 people tops lookingat the irc window
[03:39] <cjae> right.... three
[03:40] <vidd> sorry...mi9ssed that...wasnt looking....
[03:40] <vidd> lol
[03:41] <cjae> their windows boxes
[03:42] <Jester45> you got me + vidd + cjae + crimsun + ChanServ
[03:42] <Jester45> crimsun allways watches
[03:42] <Jester45> and ChanServ is to quite to say anything
[03:46] <tonyyarusso> Jester45: BOO
[03:46] <Jester45> darn
[03:46] <Jester45> one more
[03:53] <aro> Are there advantages to using a non-generic kernel?
[03:54] <crimsun> depends on the non-generic kernel.
[03:54] <crimsun> -386 works with a wider range of hardware but sacrifices performance.
[03:54] <Jester45> aro: yes depending on your cpu you can get a better preforming one
[03:54] <crimsun> -lowlatency works with a smaller subset of hardware but has better responsiveness for desktop apps.
[03:55] <crimsun> -server* are better tuned for i/o transactions but sacrifice interactivity.
[03:55] <aro> Thanks, sounds like something I should probably read up on
[03:56] <ksi> can anyone help me find/install radeon x200m drivers
[04:39] <Jester45> im trying to link the directory /home/ryan/Desktop/Media to /var/www/Media but i get this error
[04:39] <Jester45> ln: creating hard link `/home/ryan/Desktop/Media' to `/var/www/Media': Invalid cross-device link
[04:39] <Jester45> what does that mean
[04:40] <Jester45> or better yet
[04:40] <Jester45> how do you fix it
[04:41] <hitmanWilly> Jester45: try a symlink
[04:41] <hitmanWilly> Jester45: ie ln -s
[04:41] <Jester45> ok i will try
[04:44] <Jester45> does apache not fallow symlink by defualt?
[04:45] <hitmanWilly> Jester45: don't know much about apache...
[04:45] <Jester45> i will just search the conf for symlink
[04:45] <hitmanWilly> good idea
[04:46] <Jester45> symlink and symbolic link didnt work
[04:46] <hitmanWilly> did it link them?
[04:46] <Jester45> in thunar yes
[04:46] <hitmanWilly> or is apache just not seeing them?
[04:46] <Jester45> thunar sees it links
[04:47] <Jester45> apache probly doesnt follow the link
[04:47] <hitmanWilly> that would be my guess as well
[04:47] <hitmanWilly> you can symlink just about anything
[04:51] <Jester45> what about null to /
[04:51] <Jester45> that would get jumbed up quick
[04:56] <Jester45> ftp also works
[04:57] <ToHellWithGA> Jester45: hacker
[04:57] <ToHellWithGA> why are you in my computer?
[04:57] <ToHellWithGA> /home/ryan is mine
[04:58] <ToHellWithGA> Jester45: i have apache symlinked and it works fine
[04:58] <ToHellWithGA> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 32 2007-04-04 20:48 /var/www/files/Packages.txt -> /home/ryan/settings/Packages.txt
[04:59] <ToHellWithGA> i reckon if you can symlink files you can symlink directories as well
[04:59] <hitmanWilly> yes, dir symlinks work well
[05:00] <hitmanWilly> and /dev/null to / would be quite funny
[05:00] <ToHellWithGA> i wonder why homeboy was having problems with that
[05:00] <ToHellWithGA> what happens if you symlink to /dev/null?
[05:01] <hitmanWilly> it wouldn't work normally cuz / would read as already existing
[05:01] <hitmanWilly> but links to null work just like any other link
[05:02] <ToHellWithGA> i'm thoroughly impressed with the battery performance of this 8 year old laptop
[05:02] <ToHellWithGA> i got the thing to run roughly 2 hours from 90% to 10% battery reading
[05:02] <hitmanWilly> not bad
[05:02] <ToHellWithGA> lots less power is used when there is no networking :)
[05:02] <ToHellWithGA> s/lots/much/
[05:02] <ToHellWithGA> it has no ethernet/wireless, and its modem isn't found by ubuntu
[05:03] <hitmanWilly> softmodem probably
[05:03] <ToHellWithGA> i kinda wish i could update it some way other than using usb stick/hdd
[05:03] <cjae> why do ppl s/
[05:03] <ToHellWithGA> but it is ok
[05:03] <ToHellWithGA> cjae: regular expression
[05:03] <hitmanWilly> bash hacker thing
[05:03] <cjae> what does it mean
[05:03] <cjae> ahh
[05:03] <ToHellWithGA> s/this/that/ changes the first instance of "this" to "that" in several programs
[05:03] <ToHellWithGA> s/this/that/g changes all instances
[05:04] <ToHellWithGA> it is fun
[05:04] <ToHellWithGA> s/fun/your mom/
[05:04] <hitmanWilly> lol
[05:04] <cjae> I am told she was fun
[05:04] <cjae> back in the day
[05:05] <cjae> !info too much
[05:05] <ToHellWithGA> i haven't made "your mom" jokes in forever and suddenly two of my coworkers, both approaching 30 years old, make them all the time
[05:05] <ubotu> Package too does not exist in feisty
[05:05] <cjae> sorry not really dennis leary
[05:05] <hitmanWilly> !toomuchinfo
[05:05] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about toomuchinfo - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[05:06] <hitmanWilly> oh well...
[05:06] <hitmanWilly> !bug #1
[05:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in Ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
[05:07] <hitmanWilly> hellooooo netsplit
[06:11] <cjae> ok was trying to setup a logitech mx700 cordless optical mouse
[06:12] <Jester45> have fun
[06:12] <cjae> here is what I put in and I commented out the other mouse info
[06:12] <cjae> not at all pullin hair
[06:12] <cjae> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20578/
[06:13] <emdash> waaaah! i miss linux
[06:13] <emdash> i've outgrown os x
[06:13] <cjae> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=65471 this is what  was following
[06:13] <cjae> crashed my xserver luckily could just uncomment
[06:14] <cjae> is evdev in xubuntu actually isn't it in the kernel?
[06:15] <emdash> evdev is a kernel module
[06:16] <emdash> and as such, isn't really "in" the distribution so much as it is part of the kernel
[06:16] <cjae> it is in the xubuntu 7.04 right
[06:16] <cjae> or must I load it
[06:17] <cjae> I thought it was there as of edgy or dapper emdash
[06:18] <emdash> do you know how to use modutils? (modprobe, lsmod, rmmod?)
[06:18] <cjae> /lib/modules/2.6.20-15-generic/kernel/drivers/input/evdev.ko
[06:18] <emdash> whenever i want to know if i have a kernel module loaded i used lsmod
[06:19] <emdash> that lists all the kernel modules
[06:19] <emdash> that are LOADED
[06:19] <cjae> is loaded
[06:20] <emdash> you see it in the output of lsmod?
[06:20] <cjae> yes
[06:20] <cjae> has a size and everything
[06:20] <emdash> hint: you can pipe it to less if you have many lines of output
[06:20] <cjae> just scrolled
[06:20] <cjae> but thanks
[06:21] <cjae> had some success @ slackware but is much different than ubuntu
[06:21] <cjae> have read the entire slackware essentials
[06:21] <emdash> ubuntu is typically far less work
[06:21] <cjae> yes
[06:21] <emdash> the package maintainers do the hard stuff that you would have to do with slackware yourself
[06:22] <emdash> anyways
[06:22] <cjae> right
[06:22] <emdash> i can't really help you without some output from your crashed x-server
[06:22] <cjae> I know about insmod
[06:22] <emdash> don't use insmod (deprecated)
[06:22] <emdash> modprobe!
[06:22] <cjae> right as it solves dependancies
[06:23] <cjae> my problem is typing and syntax
[06:23] <emdash> how do you start X11? do you use startx?
[06:23] <emdash> or do you use GDM or KDM?
[06:23] <cjae> want the xorg log??
[06:23] <Jester46> yes
[06:23] <cjae> gdm
[06:23] <Jester46> startx :0
[06:23] <emdash> well it's not the same thing...
[06:24] <cjae> who emdash
[06:24] <Jester46> it doent matter gdm will help log you in
[06:24] <emdash> yeah, i forget where that is
[06:24] <emdash> which is sad, because i use gdm too
[06:24] <cjae> I am lost who is talking to me or not
[06:25] <emdash> we are both talking to you, and to each other
[06:25] <cjae> ahh
[06:25] <Jester46> i will shut up
[06:25] <cjae> want the xorg log??
[06:25] <emdash> yes
[06:25] <cjae> where is again
[06:25] <emdash> pry /var/log/...
[06:26] <emdash> i don't know off-hand, and am not running linux currently so i can't find out
[06:26] <emdash> but usually logs end up in /var/log
[06:26] <emdash> if we can't find it we'll just disable gdm temporarily
[06:26] <cjae> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20579/
[06:28] <cjae> I have a receiver that does both wireless keyboard and mouse
[06:28] <emdash> hm
[06:28] <emdash> i'm somewhat confused
[06:28] <emdash> could you also paste your xorg.conf file
[06:28] <cjae> and I have a generic keyboard at ps/2
[06:28] <emdash> it appears that the mouse configured properly
[06:29] <emdash> oh
[06:29] <emdash> hm
[06:29] <cjae> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20580/
[06:30] <cjae> that is xorg
[06:30] <cjae> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20578/ this is what I changed in xorg.conf
[06:31] <cjae> and it crashed the server so I commented it out and uncommented  the normal mouse
[06:32] <emdash> oh
[06:32] <emdash> okay
[06:32] <emdash> i need to see the crash log
[06:32] <emdash> the log i'm looking at doesn't have any errors in it
[06:32] <cjae> I have to logitech entries when I check /proc/bus/input/devices
[06:33] <cjae> that should say two
[06:33] <emdash> gotcha
[06:33] <emdash> do you do much programming, cjae?
[06:33] <cjae> absolutely none
[06:33] <emdash> okay never mind
[06:33] <emdash> what i was going to say won't help you
[06:33] <cjae> starting to read c++ for dummies lol
[06:34] <emdash> typically programs that read config files don't do a very good job of finding errors
[06:34] <emdash> so you have to infer what the syntax error was by looking at the error output
[06:35] <emdash> typically when X fails to load because of a config file error, the last line says something like "no screens found"
[06:36] <cjae> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20581/ is xorg.0.log.old
[06:37] <emdash> here's a clue:
[06:37] <emdash>  10 Out Of 10 Democrats Hate Freedom
[06:37] <emdash> San Francisco, California - A new poll has shown conclusively that Democrats, Independents, Libertarians and Green Party voters hate freedom.
[06:37] <emdash> oops
[06:37] <emdash> that is totally not what i meant to paste
[06:37] <emdash> Parse error on line 51 of section InputDevice in file /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[06:40] <cjae> lost still
[06:41] <cjae> emdash,
[06:41] <emdash> sorry, i pasted the wrong thing
[06:41] <emdash> but the answer is staring you right in the face
[06:41] <emdash> the error log indicates a syntax error on line 51 of the config file
[06:45] <emdash> although i admit i'm at a loss to see the error
[06:45] <cjae> what editor opens (besides vi or emacs) telling you what line you are on
[06:45] <emdash> got me
[06:45] <emdash> i juse vim
[06:45] <emdash> *use
[06:45] <emdash> i think gedit will, if you turn it on
[06:45] <emdash> plus i've seen newer versions of it do syntax hilighting
[06:45] <skyde> does xfce need less memory thant kde
[06:46] <emdash> it appears that line 51 i the line that says
[06:46] <skyde> i only have 64mb of memory
[06:46] <hitmanWilly> emdash: a LOT less
[06:46] <emdash> Identifier "Configured Mouse"
[06:46] <hitmanWilly> err, skydash
[06:47] <cjae> is gedit on xubuntu?
[06:47] <hitmanWilly> anyway, xfce uses a lot less memory than most other desktops
[06:48] <cjae> skyde, use xubuntu or xfce you'l never look back
[06:48] <cjae> emdash, what is wrong with the line
[06:49] <skyde> what about
[06:49] <skyde> Fluxbuntu
[06:49] <cjae> Don't know but I think xubuntu has more support
[06:49] <emdash> skyde: you'll have to ask them
[06:50] <emdash> skyde: the question is: do you like fluxbox? do you like xfce?
[06:50] <emdash> you'll never know until you try
[06:51] <emdash> cjae: i don't really see anything wrong. i suggest you try it again, and pay special attention to how you comment out the lines
[06:51] <emdash> if the xserver crashes again, paste the log and the xorg.conf file that produced the error
[06:51] <cjae> ok
[06:52] <cjae> like arnold says .....
[06:58] <emdash> oh well, starbucks is closing
[06:58] <emdash> have to go soon
[07:13] <dsmith_> how many ppl actually are using xubuntu?
[07:15] <cjae> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20587/ emdash
[07:15] <cjae> me
[07:18] <cjae> emdash, uanvle to initialize the xInt10 module: the console may not be restored correctly to you tv
[07:18] <cjae> that should say unable
[07:18] <cjae> emdash, unknown protocol "evdev"
[07:22] <cjae> Preinit failed for input device  failed to initialize core devices screen 0 shares mem & I/O resources screen 1 shares mem & I/0 resources
[07:24] <cjae> emdash, you there??
[07:37] <cjae> anybody ??
[07:38] <kalikiana> !anybody
[07:38] <ubotu> A large amount of the first questions asked in this channel start with "Does anyone/anybody..."  Why not ask your next question (the real one) and find out?
[07:39] <cjae> already asked my question just wondering if anyone followed along
[07:39] <cjae> kalikiana, that was directed to me??
[07:40] <kalikiana> cjae, To me it was not clear that/ what you were asking. Maybe you should clarify that and have some patience.
[07:42] <cjae> kalikiana, I had an xserver crash and was being helped with it before I restarted X
[07:43] <cjae> kalikiana, sorry
[07:44] <kalikiana> cjae, Ah, ok. I just wanted to hint you that this was not obvious to everyone.
[07:44] <cjae> ok
[07:47] <BFTD> what the heck? Do they not make motherboards with 5 PCI slots anymore?
[08:00] <crabgrass> help, my panels are gone and i dont know how to get them back
[08:01] <crabgrass> clicking on "panel" in the settings manager gets me nowhere
[08:03] <crabgrass> and if i run xfce4-panel in term, it dies again after a few seconds
[08:04] <crabgrass> okay, can anyone tell me where the panel configs are stored?
[08:43] <Z0DIAK> I'm trying to backup my CD audio collection with the flac format, can anyone recommend a good flac encoder?
[08:44] <crimsun> um, well, the reference implementation is good...
[08:45] <crimsun> did you really mean to ask something else?
[08:46] <Z0DIAK> I'm confused ... I'm a total n00b, I just was wondering if there was a good point and click encoder for flac
[08:46] <cjae> is there an updated way to enable all buttons in mx700 duo mouse (keyboard and mouse)
[08:47] <cjae> there is like 5 different ways in the ubuntu forums none are the same or for feisty
[08:48] <cjae> I have tried a lot of things nothing?
[08:49] <cjae> can even get xserver to load after editing xorg.conf
[08:49] <cjae> is there an issue with evdev in feisty??
[09:05] <blkcamarozr28> Is there any problems upgrading via YUM from 6.10 to ver 7?
[09:07] <crimsun> ...via YUM?
[09:07] <crimsun> what the...
[09:07] <crimsun> why would you use YUM (for RPMS) to update a dpkg-based distro?
[09:15] <blkcamarozr28> whoops...i mean apt-get
[09:16] <crimsun> using apt-get?  I didn't encounter any.
[09:46] <cjae> hello all
[09:51] <kalikiana_> hi cjae
[09:53] <cjae> anyone know what the file that directs how my wm acts
[10:03] <Gerro> how can I get xubuntu to do /sbin/ipw3945 as root during bootup yet before wifi radar starts
[10:13] <brianw> Gerro: when the module loads, it should start the deamon
[10:13] <brianw> Gerro: that being said, wifi-radar sucks
[10:14] <brianw> Gerro: you may want to use networkmanager
[10:16] <Gerro> the module doesn't start the daemon
[10:17] <Gerro> and I might try both out some see how it goes
[10:17] <Gerro> I forget which is which
[10:17] <brianw> wifi-radar does not support wpa at all
[10:18] <brianw> so it is pretty much useless if you ask me
[10:18] <brianw> The only box I have an intel 3945 card is on my gentoo laptop. And on that, when the module gets loaded, it starts the ipw3945d
[10:19] <Gerro> already marked deleted before aboyousif joined :)
[10:19] <Gerro> well mine loads the module but doesn't start the daemon
[10:19] <brianw> hmmn
[10:19] <brianw> Well I doubt the ubuntu folks overlooked it.
[10:19] <brianw> There must be an init if nothing else
[10:20] <brianw> did you go into the services gui?
[10:21] <Gerro> do you have ipw3945 listed under services perhaps?
[10:21] <Gerro> well restricted modules screw my graphics so I copied ipw3945d and named it so I could remove restricted modules and use wireless
[10:21] <Gerro> why is it even marked under restricted!?
[10:21] <Gerro> yeah
[10:21] <Gerro> can I custom add services some how?
[10:21] <Myrtti> brianw: say what?
[10:21] <Myrtti> it does support wpa
[10:22] <Gerro> wifi radar does?
[10:22] <Gerro> okay then
[10:22] <Myrtti> yes.
[10:22] <Myrtti> atleast my madwifi works 100% with it
[10:22] <Myrtti> better than network manager
[10:23] <brianw> Myrtti: it does now?
[10:23] <brianw> Myrtti: as of ~6 months ago it did not
[10:23] <Myrtti> in feisty yes
[10:24] <Gerro> think there was some reason people liked to use network manager something about system tray or such
[10:24] <Myrtti> I was so happy to be able to ditch NM away
[10:24] <brianw> yeah nm and madwifi do not work too good
[10:24] <brianw> nm and ipw3945 works fine though
[10:25] <brianw> that being said, wifi-radar may be a better choice now that it supports wpa
[10:25] <Myrtti> but I'm off, I'm on gprs dialup now
[10:25] <Gerro> I like kismet for when I'm in text mode
[10:25] <brianw> I just use wpa_supplicant myself
[02:48] <h3sp4wn> Myrtti: If madwifi works 100% with wifi radar - then does it support all features of madwifi (i.e vif's , ap mode, wds) ?
[03:54] <dondong> hi,all
[04:06] <Daemonik> I've just installed xubuntu on an AMD Duron 1600+ with 768m of RAM. Firefox starts fine. But when I close Firefox then try to start it up again it segfaults. Only apparent remedy is to restart the machine. Why would this happen?
[04:13] <pleia2> Daemonik: it might be that it thinks it's closing uncleanly and tries to save a sessionstore.js (in ~/.mozilla/firefox/randomlettersnumbers/sessionstore.js) and when it tries to relaunch it somehow can't read this file and fails
[04:14] <pleia2> so when it breaks, you might want to look and see if the sessionstore.js exists, and delete it
[04:14] <Daemonik> Will do
[04:21] <xjkx> Ubuntu, Kubuntu and Xubuntu LOGOS are free to put anywhere, right? Please don't answer if you ain't sure
[04:25] <Jester45> im going to start installing non-generic kernals. but i dont know what a cerlron (pentium 2) would use
[04:33] <Daemonik> xjkx, If you sell a system with Ubuntu pre-installed you can put a Ubuntu logo on the case or on your website like system76 does.
[04:34] <Pumpernickel> xjkx: http://www.ubuntu.com/aboutus/trademarkpolicy
[05:00] <Gerro> tried installing beryl on xubuntu but I used compiz option on beryl manager and now get constant white screen. help plz
[05:01] <Jester45> try #ubuntu-effects
[05:01] <Gerro> its not really a beryl issue
[05:01] <Gerro> more so a fact I keep reloading the same glitched up session
[05:02] <Gerro> that had compiz running with white screen
[05:02] <Jester45> then dont load the seesion
[05:02] <Gerro> how?
[05:02] <Jester45> do you have auto login enabled?
[05:02] <Gerro> nope
[05:03] <Jester45> when you login in select a diffrent session
[05:03] <Jester45> at the bottom
[05:03] <Gerro> brb think I over looked something
[05:06] <Gerro> jester I checked and default login for xubuntu doesn't have session choice option
[05:06] <Gerro> it just shows xclient, xfce, failsafe, failsafe gnome
[05:06] <Gerro> and last session
[05:07] <Gerro> all give either white error or display text mode
[05:07] <Gerro> wait I'll just kill compiz duh, sorry I'm just freaking out trying to get settings going on this
[05:07] <Gerro> thx for help
[06:03] <imon9> hi, can someone tell me how to get rid of the "software uninstaller" made bu xubuntu 4.4.1 installer files? coz the so-called uninstaller doesnt work when i try it anyway
[06:05] <imon9> haloo? isnt anyone here at all?
[06:06] <imon9> hi, can someone tell me how to get rid of the "software uninstaller" made bu xubuntu 4.4.1 installer files? coz the so-called uninstaller doesnt work when i try it anyway
[06:08] <Pumpernickel> Do you mean the xfce installer from xfce.org?
[06:08] <imon9> yes
[06:08] <imon9> haha...finally someone replied..i started to think my chatzilla setting is wrong
[06:08] <imon9> yes, i meant the xfce installer from xfce.org
[06:09] <imon9> after i run that installer according to the instruction given, it sucessfully install the new xfce on my machine and everything work well. NOw that i update my repositories to gutsy, the new xfce is already there
[06:10] <Pumpernickel> The #xfce guys would likely know more about their installer's quirks.
[06:10] <imon9> so 3 reason why i dont need the uninstaller (1) the uninstaller doesnt let me uninstall them anyway (2) i dont plan to uninstall the xfce (3) gutsy has them in repositories, so i dont need the manual installer anymore
[06:10] <imon9> ok..i will try #xfce
[06:12] <pilibeen> hi...i'm struggling here trying to connect to an unsecured wireless network. I can see it in iwlist, and i enter the ESSID under network, leave the WEP blank...but still can't connect. Any ideas?
[06:12] <pilibeen> I've been able to connect in the past
[06:12] <pilibeen> just seems to be something w/ the upgrade
[06:39] <slow-motion> hallo
[08:14] <Riot777> which user group in ubuntu is for usb devices ?
[08:18] <Pumpernickel> Root, on the one device I have here to test with.
[09:03] <cjae> what is the message output I should get from dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/hda bs=1M  ??
[09:04] <atarinox> is there a reason I can't save diff network location configs in Feisty?
[09:05] <cjae> dd: /dev/hda: No Space left on device
[09:05] <cjae> sorry had phone call
[09:06] <cjae> cause it filled it with zero,s right of once it was full it should give this message right
[09:07] <cjae>  first time using dd
[09:08] <cjae> like it though cause I is easier than finding the manufacturers utility
[09:08] <cjae> I should be it
[09:13] <cjae> I think WD is serving out bad .iso images from their site the diag504cCD.iso and the .zip fail in both drives on my Sony box when I burn them to a maxell cdr
[09:14] <cjae> i don't think they have a md5 either
[09:21] <cjae> emdash, you around?
[09:24] <TTT_Travis> I have an LVM install of xubuntu feisty, I am almost out of disk space, I would like to add another drive to expand my overall storage, how do I go about formatting and adding the new drive?
[09:28] <cjae> does feisty do LVM by default??
[09:29] <TTT_Travis> no
[09:29] <TTT_Travis> I used the alternative installer cd and did it manually
[09:34] <cjae> can I remap my caps lock key?
[09:56] <adam0509> how do you change the panel color ?
[09:57] <Merchelo> any ever tried installing windows server pro 2003 on a machine after installing xu/ubuntu ?
[09:59] <TTT_Travis> Merchelo shouldn't have a problem as long as you left extra space on the drive for the windows server 2003 partition
[10:00] <TTT_Travis> when you boot from the W2k3 server cd, create a new partition, making sure not to overwrite or delete any partitions
[10:00] <Merchelo> ah ok
[10:00] <Merchelo> cool
[10:01] <Merchelo> wasn't too hip to the way my system was partitioned, and was wondering if windows would mess up grub
[10:04] <cjae> how do I get the application list from kb again
[10:06] <kalikiana__> cjae, xfdesktop --menu
[10:06] <cjae> alt f1 right
[10:06] <cjae> hi again btw
[10:08] <cjae> cause I am just launching help instead of application window meaning I have the wrong keyboard map right
[10:08] <cjae> the other alt does work either
[10:09] <cjae> damn m$
[10:09] <cjae> kalikiana_, are you there?
[10:11] <cjae> my mouse just died and I am going to throw it out
[10:11] <cjae> cause it is junk
[10:12] <Merchelo> bury it at least
[10:12] <cjae> fut that, it has taken more than it fair share of my hair
[10:13] <cjae> I was telling someone here yesterday how nutz it has made me
[10:13] <kalikiana__> cjae, So what'S wrong with your keyboard?
[10:13] <cjae> it acts like it is possessed
[10:13] <kalikiana__> MAybe you set it to emacs style?
[10:13] <cjae> kalikiana__, my alts don't seem to work
[10:14] <cjae> I think I have the wrong map
[10:14] <kalikiana__> So you should 'sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg' :)
[10:14] <cjae> I have a standard qwerty kb but with the two ms buttons
[10:15] <cjae> that is pc105 right
[10:18] <cjae> I counted 104 twice
[10:42] <mads-> Are there any pros when choosing xubuntu over normal ubuntu?
[10:44] <mads-> none? =)
[10:44] <Merchelo> you get to chat with us?
[10:45] <Merchelo> you get to chat with us?
[10:45] <Zeqfreed> mads-, smaller size and lesser memory usage i guess
[10:46] <Merchelo> also it uses less memory, and comes packed with cool splash screens
[10:46] <mads-> Have you tried 7.04 ? I'm using 6.10 right now, and have heard 6.10 is nicer...
[10:47] <Zeqfreed> i'm using gentoo :)
[10:47] <Merchelo> well i use 6.10 because 7.04 doesn't like my gfx card, and i'm too lazy to properly fix it
[10:48] <mads-> What gfx do you have?
[10:48] <Merchelo> ati 9200
[10:48] <mads-> aaah, ati
[10:49] <mads-> Think I will try xfce4 - looks nice :)
[10:50] <Zeqfreed> mads-, good choice
[10:51] <cjae> ok I did a xserver recompile and my kb but's still don't work
[10:52] <cjae> I selected pc104 as pc105 was in my xorg and that I counted them twice
[10:52] <cjae> still pressing alt f1 does nothing
[10:53] <cjae> it is a logitech wireless kb with the volume and easy but's @ the top
[10:55] <TTT_Travis> I just did a clean install of xubuntu 7.04 last night
[10:55] <TTT_Travis> so far I don't have problems
[10:55] <Zeqfreed> cjae, run xev and try pressing the keys. does it produce any output?
[10:56] <Zeqfreed> i should run it inside the terminal surely
[10:56] <Zeqfreed> *you
[10:56] <cjae> yes alt L and alt
[10:56] <cjae> R
[10:57] <cjae> and the ms but work to
[10:57] <Merchelo> there's alt and then there's altgr
[10:58] <cjae> crt alt f1 put me to a real console
[10:58] <cjae> that is alt L
[10:58] <Zeqfreed> and alt+f1 not working?
[10:58] <cjae> ff xfce documentattion
[10:59] <cjae> just when I just hit f1
[10:59] <Zeqfreed> so what is your particular problem?
[10:59] <cjae> cannot select application menu from kb
[11:00] <Zeqfreed> hm
[11:01] <cjae> does just changing the pc10X part in xorg.conf use a different kb rule??
[11:01] <Zeqfreed> only after restarting the xserver
[11:01] <cjae> cause I counted them twice which btw means nothing
[11:02] <cjae> and I got 104 but I was 105 in my xorg
[11:02] <Zeqfreed> or you can use xmodmap which can change the settings on the fly
[11:02] <Zeqfreed> are you sure alt+f1 should open the menu?
[11:03] <cjae> does xfce use something else than alt f1 for menu
[11:03] <Zeqfreed> i have no idea
[11:04] <cjae> I went to a different workspace and tried alt(L) f1 and it opened ffox with the xfce doc
[11:04] <Zeqfreed> as far as i can remember i've bound some command to the super key for opening the menu when i used xubuntu
[11:05] <jrabbit> hi
[11:05] <Zeqfreed> jrabbit, hey
[11:05] <jrabbit> I was installing ubuntu on seperate drive and now brub sends back error 21
[11:05] <jrabbit> *grub
[11:05] <jrabbit> any way to reinstall grub from live CD?
[11:06] <jrabbit> or alt Cd but I have the live CD here
[11:06] <Zeqfreed> jrabbit, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub/+bug/8978 is this the issue you have?
[11:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 8978 in grub "Grub - Error 21 returned" [Medium,Confirmed]
[11:06] <cjae> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-24113.html
[11:07] <jrabbit> Zeqfreed,  seems right
[11:07] <Zeqfreed> jrabbit, i hope it'll be helpful
[11:07] <jrabbit> I have a second bios for loading a pci/ata card that I can't edit
[11:07] <jrabbit> soo
[11:09] <cjae> I hate xorg
[11:09] <jrabbit> oh
[11:09] <jrabbit> ok
[11:09] <Zeqfreed> cjae, try binding "xfdesktop -menu" command to some key and pressing it
[11:09] <jrabbit> instructions for doing it from commandline
[11:09] <jrabbit> great :D
[11:09] <jrabbit> I knew you did something from terminal -> grub
[11:09] <Zeqfreed> cjae, you can even try to bind it to alt+f1 keys :)
[11:10] <Pumpernickel> You can use `xev` if you're curious as to what keycode your alt keys are currently generating.
[11:11] <cjae> I don't understand why it does just work
[11:11] <cjae> the meta keys don't work w/f1 either and I don't know how to make them bind
[11:12] <Zeqfreed> somewhere in the menu there's a keyboard configuration launcher ;)
[11:15] <Aar0n444> Hi
[11:17] <Zeqfreed> well.. i need some sleep. bye
[11:25] <Aar0n444> How can I get this kernal mod working in any version of Xubuntu >6.06? It worked in 6.06 http://guillermoesteves.com/blog/2006/06/08/how-to-get-a-d-link-dwl-g650-wi-fi-adapter-to-work-in-ubuntu-linux-6-06
[11:40] <mcscruff> i installed a kde app, but it keeps saying cannot talk to klauncher
[11:40] <mcscruff> help pls
[11:40] <Aar0n444> Xubuntu uses XFCE
[11:40] <Aar0n444> Not KDE
[11:40] <mcscruff> i know, i have the kde libs tho
[11:41] <Aar0n444> No idea then
[11:41] <Aar0n444> Sorry
[11:41] <mcscruff> the app runs but when i do file-open i get that error
[12:05] <cjae> ok I think maybe some should have spoke up about crt esc I know I probably should have looked at keyboard settings too
[12:06] <cjae> before I reconfig my xserver
[12:07] <Merchelo> backup your old xerver.conf
[12:07] <cjae> yes I had so I just cp it over
[12:08] <cjae> anyone know what Load	"i2c" is for in xorg
[12:09] <cjae> was missing when I reconfigured


[00:49] <tomreyn> the "green bar" requires EV (class 2), which LE doesn't provide
[00:50] <tomreyn> also, chrome plans to remove all indications of "secure" anyways, since their take is that (properly done) HTTPS must be the default, anything else is insecure.
[00:51] <tomreyn> and in te past mozilla has usually followed up on their lead with some delay. often IE, too, but that's no longer relevant since they'll use chromium anyways.
[00:51] <tomreyn> https://blog.chromium.org/2018/05/evolving-chromes-security-indicators.html
[01:07] <tomreyn> Checkmate, mybalzitch: ^
[10:21] <bindi> is it possible to create encrypted raid1 for system disk with the installer?
[11:26] <tomreyn> bindi: yes, but you need to use the alternative server installer or mini.iso.
[11:27] <bindi> yeah i got that far
[11:27] <bindi> now i'm not sure how I should continue, testing out in a VM atm
[11:28] <tomreyn> bindi: dpends a bit on whether you're UEFI or BIOS booting. also the order of crypt layer and raid (and maybe lvm) is something to consider
[11:28] <bindi> bios
[11:28] <bindi> well my test failed :P
[11:29] <tomreyn> in the end it all boils down to how many crypto containers you want to end up with (and how many passwords / keys you'll want to have to provide)
[11:29] <bindi> https://i.imgur.com/GNOZ0pK.png
[11:29] <tomreyn> for a desktop like computer you probably want just one, maximum 2 crypto containers.
[11:29] <bindi> ideally 1 key for all of it
[11:29] <tomreyn> then you want raid, then crypto on top, then lvm on top.
[11:30] <tomreyn> you may want to have another, smaller raid, just for boot
[11:31] <bindi> x_x
[11:31] <tomreyn> how large are you storages?
[11:31] <bindi> 2x 120GB
[11:31] <tomreyn> on the final system, too?
[11:31] <bindi> hmm? 2x 20GB i'm testing with in the VM, the final system has two 120GB SSDs I want the system to be installed on
[11:32] <tomreyn> i assume lack of separate /boot is what caused your failure here, but i can only guess since i dont know how you partitioned
[11:32] <bindi> yeah probably
[11:34] <tomreyn> in case you have more than just those two disks on this computer (i.e. separate storages for data), now is the time to think about whether you want 1 crypto container for everything, or one for the Os, and maybe another later for data (or unencrypted there)
[11:34] <bindi> I have 8x 2TB but I'm gonna use zfs for those
[11:34] <bindi> and I don't feel like zfs on root :P
[11:34] <tomreyn> okay, then its just the OS now.
[11:35] <tomreyn> take a screen shot of how you partitioned on the next go.
[11:35] <bindi> you want me to try and fail again? :D
[11:36] <TJ-> bindi: you've got access to the shell haven't you?
[11:36] <bindi> sure
[11:37] <tomreyn> in the end it's my more and more my impression that you are actually faster if you boot from a live system, do the parititoning with gparted, create and mount all block storage layers (raid and crypto and lvm), then debootstrap, chroot into it, install the kernel.
[11:37] <TJ-> bindi: so you can fix-up manually. What layout are you using?
[11:38] <bindi> i don't understand the question, i don't know how I should mix lvm+mdadm+whatever to make this work :P
[11:39] <bindi> previously I just used the guided FDE with LVM, but now I'd raid1 as well so it can survive a disk failure
[11:41] <TJ-> Why not use LVM's own RAID support rather than adding it on top of MD RAID?
[11:41] <bindi> I read that that's just mdadm in disguise, but sure
[11:41] <bindi> anything that works and anything that *I* can get to work :D
[11:42] <bindi> if you could point me to a guide or perhaps do some handholding and guide me through this :P
[11:43] <TJ-> You want LUKS to protect the OS root file-system?
[11:43] <bindi> yes
[11:43] <TJ-> Do you also want LUKS to protect GRUB's /boot/ file-system (prevents someone tampering with the kernel and initrd.img)
[11:43] <bindi> nah
[11:44] <TJ-> So that leave it vulnerable to a man-in-the-middle attack, you realise?
[11:44] <bindi> if its not too complex, could use it
[11:44] <bindi> i'm just mostly interested protecting my data against physical attacks
[11:47] <TJ-> right, but if you're needing encryption you need to be clear about the attack scenarios you're protecting against. If someone could get physical access to the system, even when powered off, without /boot/ being encrypted they could trivially install a MITM that could log the LUKS passphrase/key-file
[11:48] <bindi> sure, encrypted /boot/ it is then, if it doesn't get too complex (in terms of stability and surviving updates :D)
[11:49] <TJ-> There's a single setting added to /etc/default/grub "GRUB_ENABLE_CRYPTODISK=y"
[11:50] <TJ-> Because of your mirrors I'm trying to figure out the simplest way to arrange things. Are you going to have some LVs/file-systems that won't be encrypted?
[11:50] <bindi> no, full disk encryption
[11:50] <TJ-> e.g. I have an LV for SourceCode (F/OSS projects I clone/pull in) so I don't bother encrypting that
[11:53] <TJ-> bindi: considering easiest first, it'd be LVM first, encryption second so there is only one set of logical volumes to unlock. If it were encryption first, you'd need to arrange for each disk to be unlocked before gaining access to the LVM
[11:53] <TJ-> bindi: but that exposes the LVM metadata so is not strictly FDE
[11:54] <TJ-> bindi: but if you're only after protecting data (in LVs) then it doesn't sound like you need FDE in its fullest sense
[11:54] <TJ-> I'd describe it as needing F.BD.E (Full Block-Device Encryption)
[11:55] <bindi> how does the metadata look like?
[11:55] <bindi> i probably don't care if anyone sees that :P
[11:56] <TJ-> it's the stuff needed by GRUB/OS to discover the LVM PVs VGs and LVs
[11:57] <bindi> well as long as it doesnt expose directory structures, i guess its ok
[11:57] <bindi> other than maybe /home and / and so on
[11:58] <bindi> if you're not 100% sure about how to do this I have a VM I can test everything in before
[11:58] <TJ-> so, thinking about OS only (not data)  you could do minimal partitioning ( 3 partitions = BIOS Boot, /boot/ file-system, and LVM PV)
[11:59] <TJ-> bindi: I've been doing this stuff for 10 years :) It's just a case of thinking of the simplest way to do it including the RAID-1
[12:00] <bindi> btw I don't even necessarily need LVM. I just want raid-1 and FDE :p I never used the features that LVM gives you
[12:00] <bindi> if it makes things simpler :D
[12:00] <bindi> not 100% sure if its possible without LVM
[12:01] <TJ-> I've got a diagram for an arragement like this I wrote 10 years ago, for RAID-5, but it's on a domain I no longer operate; Trying to see if I can jury-rig it so you can see it
[12:18] <TJ-> Too much trouble to get that accessible.
[12:18] <bindi> :p
[12:20] <TJ-> There are pros and cons to using mdadm or pure LVM for the mirror facility. In terms of ease of management if something goes wrong I /think/ mdadm is probably the way to go
[12:34] <bindi> so what's next
[12:53] <TJ-> I think what you need is something like disks > GPT > partitions (3 of:  1=BIOS Boot, 2=/boot/ for GRUB, 3=LVM) > 3 x RAID-1 (md0=sda1+sdb1, md1=sda2+sdb2, md2=sda3+sdb3), then LUKS encrypt: md1=LUKS_BOOT, md2=LUKS_LVM, then create the LVM with 'pvcreate /dev/mapper/LUKS_LVM' and 'vgcreate VG_OS /dev/mapper/LUKS_LVM' then e.g. 'lvcreate -L 12G -n rootfs VG_OS'
[12:56] <bindi> GPT? isn't that related to EFI
[12:56] <TJ-> once those are configured and ready the installer partitioner can be used to select the /dev/mapper/LUKS_BOOT for /boot/ FS and /dev/mapper/VG_OS-rootfs for /  and at the boot-loader stage dpkg configure step should pop up a dialog asking which devices to install GRUB to, and you choose the two native disk partitions (/dev/sda1, /dev/sdb1)
[12:56] <TJ-> GPT makes sense since for your larger disks you'll likely need it anyhow
[12:56] <TJ-> so may as well use it across all disks
[12:56] <bindi> 120GB? :P
[12:56] <TJ-> So?
[12:57] <TJ-> I thought you had a bunch of other disks?
[12:57] <bindi> they're handled by ZFS
[12:58] <TJ-> OK, well still, no reason not to use GPT
[12:59] <bindi> but can my BIOS system use that to boot?
[13:00] <TJ-> I've not met any that don't in the last decade but you can obviously easily test that with a quick GPT partitioning and grub-install to a USB storage device, for example - doesn't need any OS, just prove BIOS loads GRUB
[13:01] <TJ-> benefit of GPT is the secondary back-up table, and you can also create a hybrid MBR if necessary
[13:02] <bindi> ok well I don't know how to translate everything you said into actual commands :P
[13:05] <TJ-> I have to go out now, if you're still wondering when I get back I can drop a script into a pastebin to help
[13:24] <bindi> ok then
[15:23] <bindi> TJ-: got my VM to install without errors
[15:25] <TJ-> bindi: oh, great, you don't need me then :)
[15:25] <bindi> im not just sure if i did it "right". one thing that caused confusion was that "bios boot" partition, as it seems to be a GPT only thing
[15:26] <bindi> my VM was Gen1 (BIOS) so there's no such option
[15:26] <bindi> I checked an Gen2 VMs have that
[15:26] <bindi> but I won't see that in the ubuntu installer then anyway on my bios pc
[15:26] <bindi> https://imgur.com/a/7c8DmuC
[15:26] <TJ-> Yes, it is where GRUB writes its core image, instead of in the possibly-spare sectors before partition #1 for msdos/MBR partitioning
[15:27] <bindi> not sure how I should have named the LV and VG :D
[15:27] <bindi> i'm gonna see if this survives a disk failure
[15:27] <TJ-> bindi: any way you prefer :)
[15:28] <bindi> hm
[15:29] <TJ-> bindi: I use LVM extensively so typically I have at least 2 VGs, VG_OS and VG_DATA. VG_OS will have LVs for rootfs, /var/ and /usr/local/, VG_DATA will have an LV for /home/ + several others (I have a generalised mount-point at /home/all/ for things like SourceCode, Projects, Hacking all in their own LVs and with their own /home/all/XXXX mountppoint
[15:29] <bindi> looks like it doesnt survive a reboot
[15:29] <bindi> err
[15:29] <bindi> disk failure
[15:29] <bindi> https://i.imgur.com/AewxMlE.png
[15:29] <bindi> so my process was flawed :p
[15:30] <TJ-> you many not have configured mdadm for boot-degraded, assuming you've got LVM inside MD RAID
[15:31] <bindi> check my first imgur link album, 2nd picture 'lsblk'
[15:32] <bindi> well I reattached the disk but its not happy
[15:32] <bindi> :-D
[15:34] <bindi> not sure what went wrong
[15:50] <bindi> yeah i think my process is wrong, i dunno how but just removing the disk = no go
[15:53] <bindi> i added boot_degraded=true if it even is supported anymore
[15:53] <bindi> in /etc/initramfs-tools/conf.d/mdadm
[15:53] <bindi> https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2401615
[15:55] <TJ-> Thinking hard about that, I seem to recall it was supposedly made the default, although reading /usr/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/local-block/mdadm the initial assemble command there uses --no-degraded
[16:03] <bindi> i just tried to remove --no-degraded from there and update-initramfs, no go
[16:03] <bindi> sigh :P
[16:03] <bindi> guess i'm not gonna use raid1 then
[16:22] <TJ-> bindi: I have servers with mdadm RAID-1 by default and they boot degraded fine, so it's not a general problem.
[16:23] <bindi> its the encrypted part
[16:24] <TJ-> Yes, LUKS encrypted
[16:25] <bindi> well if you can tell me how to get this working it would be neat
[16:25] <bindi> if not, im gonna start configuring the server with single disk install
[19:28] <TJ-> bindi: well, I have a script that is building a test/demo but just started getting cryptic I/O errors for a non-existent device :s


[08:52] <dholbach> good morning
[09:22] <quaketo> hi
[09:23] <quaketo> what?
[12:12] <dholbach> can somebody have a look at http://pad.lv/mps/ubuntu-packaging-guide? if there's a more elegant/better way to do it, I'm all ears :)
[14:53] <dholbach> can somebody please check out http://pad.lv/mps/ubuntu-packaging-guide?
[14:57] <Laney> I don't like it
[14:57] <Laney> can't the makefile do cleverness to find out what it can build given the current sphinx version?
[14:57] <Laney> or can't sphinx 1.0 be backported to the ppa?
[14:59] <dholbach> Laney, that could work, but it's not automatic, as something's wrong with the mercurial imports
[15:00] <Laney> does the natty package not backport?
[15:00] <dholbach> Laney, the makefile is generated by sphinx-project or whatever the command is called
[15:01] <Laney> or you could generate that as part of the build instead?
[15:01] <Laney> I don't know if that would need more BDs though
[15:01] <dholbach> I guess we can just backport natty sphinx for now
[15:02] <Laney> hardcoding 'natty' is definitely a bad idea anyway, as that would break for future releases
[15:07] <dholbach> Laney, I'll backport then
[15:07] <Laney> cool, hope it works
[15:08] <dholbach> *cross fingers*
[15:33] <dholbach> Laney, "python-jinja2 (>= 2.2)" for karmic - do you want to do that one? :)
[15:38] <dholbach> nm, done
[15:45] <dholbach> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/70016187/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.jinja2_2.3.1-1~karmic1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz - ok, let'S forget karmic for now - if anyone is passionate about it, file a bug :)