[06:00] <queery> hi jy waakker?
[06:01] <queery> oops
[06:01] <queery> bloddy xchat
[07:26] <Kilos> hiys superfly and others
[07:26] <Kilos> hiya as well
[12:01] <magespawn> good day all
[12:11] <nuvolari> o/ magespawn
[12:12] <inetpro> ehlo
[12:12] <nuvolari> Maaz: tell kilos hi oom! Hoop dit gaan goed
[12:12] <Maaz> nuvolari: Okay, I'll tell Kilos on freenode
[12:12] <nuvolari> hi inetpro
[12:12] <inetpro> eh nuvolari
[12:12] <magespawn> how are the kzn folks? getting ready for the storm?
[12:13] <nuvolari> magespawn: it's the typical calm before the storm
[12:13] <nuvolari> nothing yet
[12:14] <magespawn> hmm same here had some rain in Hluhluwe and Richards Bay but nothing else so far.
[12:14] <inetpro> nuvolari: I wonder whether you will be affected down in the South
[12:16]  * inetpro very hot and uncomfortable with a running nose and all in Pretoria
[12:16]  * nuvolari should maybe open the curtains and actually look what the weather's like
[12:16] <magespawn> lol that might work
[12:17] <inetpro> :-)
[13:01] <magespawn> brb
[13:10] <magespawn> Back again.
[13:11] <superfly> hi ki<tab>
[13:11] <superfly> hi magespawn
[13:12] <magespawn> Rain really coming down now
[13:25] <magespawn> Hi superfly
[13:30] <nuvolari> magespawn: how far are you from ballito?
[13:31] <magespawn> About 200 kms north in Hluhluwe
[13:31]  * nuvolari googles
[13:31] <magespawn> Lol
[13:31] <inetpro> magespawn: https://twitter.com/#!/SAWDOS1/status/175936007156404224
[13:32] <inetpro> you have more peeps living in Hluhluwe?
[13:33] <magespawn> Maybe do no know them all.
[13:33] <superfly> magespawn: I've never been to Hluhluwe, but that's one of my most favourite South African names... try getting a foreigner to say it :-D
[13:33] <magespawn> Not
[13:33] <magespawn> Always good for a chuckle
[13:33] <inetpro> iho superfly
[13:34] <superfly> hey inetpro
[13:34] <superfly> inetpro: your nose any better?
[13:34] <inetpro> superfly: to be honest, it's terrible
[13:35] <nuvolari> visibility is not that great in the sea's direction, but no rain yet
[13:35] <superfly> inetpro: you can barely go by 2 minutes without having to blow your nose?
[13:36] <inetpro> superfly: you should tell them it's almost like hula hoop
[13:36] <inetpro> hulu huluwe
[13:37] <inetpro> superfly: 2 minutes? That is a long time.
[13:37] <nuvolari> http://sawdis1.blogspot.com/2012/03/tropical-storm-irina-is-forecast-to_03.html
[13:37] <nuvolari> sho :-/ when did it start inetpro ?
[13:38]  * nuvolari recall winters in the free state...
[13:38] <nuvolari> nose gets so raw from all the blowing :-/
[13:38] <inetpro> nuvolari: I started sneezing yesterday, today really bad
[13:39] <superfly> inetpro: I get exactly the same thing.
[13:39] <magespawn> http://maps.google.co.uk/?source=friendlink&q=G%26C+Net&cid=17180160194643638420
[13:39] <magespawn> This exactly where I am at the moment
[13:39]  * inetpro noticed the throat going somewhere on Thursday already and tried to stop everything in it's tracks
[13:39] <inetpro> I guess I was to late this time
[13:42] <inetpro> magespawn: heh, now we know exactly where to go and find the interwebs in Hluhluwe
[13:43] <magespawn> Yup indeed, about the only place too.
[13:46]  * nuvolari gets high on trance
[13:46]  * nuvolari points to his headphones
[13:46] <magespawn> Brb
[13:49] <magespawn> right back again
[13:51] <magespawn> now on xchat on kubuntu pc
[13:52] <magespawn> just trying it out for one of the shop computers
[13:53] <superfly> magespawn: Quassel is better
[13:54] <magespawn> just went with the xchat because of using it before
[13:55] <inetpro> magespawn: Quassel is better
[13:55] <magespawn> thanks guys, echo?
[13:55] <inetpro> :-)
[13:57] <magespawn> brb again then
[13:57] <inetpro> in fact I think Konversation is better if you're not connecting to quassel-core
[13:58] <magespawn> that one is not installed by default as far as I ca n see
[13:59] <inetpro> magespawn: do you have ADSL?
[13:59] <magespawn> yup
[13:59] <inetpro> what speed?
[13:59] <magespawn> 1m uncapped
[14:00] <inetpro> in that case I would install quassel-core on one of the servers
[14:00] <inetpro> if I was you
[14:00] <magespawn> what server?
[14:00] <inetpro> magespawn: any ubuntu server
[14:01] <magespawn> i am not following
[14:01] <magespawn> make my own or use one on the net/
[14:01] <magespawn> ?
[14:01] <inetpro> magespawn: you don't have a server running as a gateway or any such
[14:01] <inetpro> magespawn: your own
[14:01] <magespawn> no just a router
[14:02] <magespawn> have got a machine for server duty have not had the time to install properly
[14:02] <inetpro> magespawn: all you need is a dedicated machine, no gui needed, that will stay online 24/7
[14:02] <magespawn> bit out of my experinece
[14:03] <inetpro> magespawn: it is very simple
[14:04] <magespawn> perhaps does take time though, put the machine together about 3 months ago.
[14:05] <nuvolari> bah! :(
[14:05] <magespawn> have been trying to get some internet cafe software to work properly
[14:05] <magespawn> too
[14:05] <magespawn> and I still work as a field guide to pay the bills so long
[14:05] <nuvolari> now my friend won't come visit because there were warnings on the radio WRT the storm
[14:06] <magespawn> not that bad yet still just raining here
[14:07] <nuvolari> my point exactly... It's not even raining in Ballito
[14:07] <nuvolari> there's still sunshine
[14:07] <nuvolari> but aparently they have rain
[14:08] <nuvolari> (closer to durban even)
[14:08] <magespawn> was raining there earlier not part of the storm
[14:10] <inetpro> magespawn: I guess you could look at the Ubuntu Server Guide https://help.ubuntu.com/11.04/serverguide/C/index.html
[14:11] <magespawn> yup have been making my way through that and the lpi, and a couple of the ubuntu pock guides and such
[14:13] <inetpro> just get the server cd and start doing the installation, you'll see for yourself it's very easy
[14:14] <inetpro> and if you're unsure just format again and repeat the process
[14:14] <magespawn> the machine has the software installed, need to get an extra network card
[14:16] <magespawn> working at the command line is a learning curve still very used to gui
[14:18] <inetpro> magespawn: why an extra network card?
[14:19] <magespawn> i wanted to try seperate the customers pc from the rest of the network phisically the also add a wireless card so they do not connect straight to the router
[14:20] <magespawn> or am going about it the wrong way
[14:20] <inetpro> magespawn: it makes sense, but don't let that stop you from getting used to a server environment
[14:21] <inetpro> you can run most services without the physical separation
[14:22] <magespawn> well I might wait a bit see how long it will take to get the card
[14:23] <inetpro> Maaz: coffee on
[14:23]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[14:23] <inetpro> where is kilos today?
[14:25] <magespawn> next week is pretty quite so far so maybe then
[14:27] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for inetpro!
[14:27] <inetpro> hmm... Maaz is slower than me daughter
[14:28]  * inetpro sits back and enjoys a hot cup of coffee
[14:31] <magespawn> i read hackaday this guy there hooked up his coffee machine to his router via a ardunio so he could tell to make coffe via the internet or his home network
[14:32] <Tonberry> mmm
[14:32] <Tonberry> sounds like fun
[14:33] <magespawn> got to go wife has just arrived to pick me up, later all.
[14:39] <Kilos> afternoon all
[14:40] <inetpro> hello Kilos, wb
[14:40] <Kilos> hiya inetpro ty
[14:41] <Kilos> have you got bantoms
[14:41] <Kilos> ?
[14:43] <inetpro> Kilos: yep
[14:43] <inetpro> but they still growin
[14:44] <Kilos> if you want hens to breed out eggs for you cross bantoms with gewone hoenders
[14:44] <Kilos> the basters get broody more often and seem to be better mothers than either pure breed
[14:45] <Kilos> they also bigger so can vreed more eggs out
[14:45] <Kilos> breed
[14:48] <inetpro> Kilos: sounds interesting
[15:00] <Kilos> bb tonight
[16:40] <inetpro> nlsthzn-work, psydroid: wb
[16:40] <nlsthzn-work> greetings inetpro :)
[16:40] <psydroid> hi and ty internetpro
[16:41] <psydroid> hi nlsthzn-work
[16:41] <nlsthzn-work> Hello psydroid :)
[16:42] <psydroid> are you from nl too?
[16:42] <nlsthzn-work> nope... I am from ZA
[16:45] <psydroid> oh, I thought you might be looking at your nick
[16:46] <nlsthzn-work> oh... not sure how you came to that conclussion :p
[16:46] <psydroid> anyway, I don't want to distract you from your work :)
[16:47] <nlsthzn-work> hehe... k thanks :p
[16:47]  * nlsthzn-work might start doing some work in a few minutes...
[16:48]  * psydroid has the same plans as she should finally start programming
[16:48] <psydroid> he*
[16:48] <psydroid> no gender transformation planned as of yet :)
[16:49]  * inetpro lol
[16:50] <inetpro> psydroid: waar val jy uit die bus uit?
[16:52] <psydroid> inetpro, ik ben tot nu toe nog niet uit de bus gevallen, maar vaak genoeg in- en uitgestapt
[16:52] <superfly> psydroid: nlsthzn-work's "nl" is a contraction of his first name :-)
[16:53] <psydroid> superfly, ah, I get it now, thanks :)
[16:53] <nlsthzn-work> ah that is true...
[16:53] <inetpro> superfly, nlsthzn-work: and sthzn?
[16:54] <nlsthzn-work> basically my nick is name and surname devoid of any vowels
[16:54] <inetpro> ahh
[16:54] <nlsthzn-work> and my surname is very dutch :p
[16:54] <inetpro> interesting
[16:54]  * superfly 's surname is very South African... it was made in South Africa
[16:55] <inetpro> superfly: are you sure?
[16:55] <nlsthzn-work> mine came over with some or other Jan fellow or shortly after... but i do think the spelling has changes slightly...
[16:56] <superfly> inetpro: yep, the first person with my surname was the bastard son of a German soldier and a Cape Malay slave girl.
[16:56] <inetpro> hmm
[16:56] <superfly> who was taken in by the slave girl's owners
[16:56] <superfly> and raised in their household, but with a dutch'ed version of the German solidier's surname
[16:57] <nlsthzn-work> epic story :)
[16:57] <superfly> and then became the first "Dutch" man to marry a French woman in SA
[16:58] <superfly> http://www.snymangenealogy.co.za/publication/publication.html
[16:59] <nlsthzn-work> That is cool info...
[16:59] <nuvolari> the only issue is that when I hear snyman I only want to talk Afrikaans :P Or listen to bed-time stories, read by Evert Snyman on RSG :D
[16:59] <nuvolari> he sadly doesn't do that anymore :'(
[16:59] <inetpro> superfly: http://cape-slavery-heritage.iblog.co.za/2009/05/29/answering-queries-about-snyman-anthony-van-bengal-and-angela-van-bengal/
[17:14]  * psydroid has a fully Indian name, his ancestors left India from the port of Kolkata, capital of Bengal ...
[17:16] <psydroid> Afrikaans is so adorable :)
[17:17] <psydroid> webtuis, fooi etc. are words we don't use or in this way
[17:17] <psydroid> or not*
[17:25] <inetpro> superfly: that is quite an interesting story
[17:25] <superfly> inetpro: Indeed
[17:32] <nuvolari> "@SAWDOS1 skies in durban north are unusually red" < same in ballito.


[09:59] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, critters and everything else
[18:09] <naughtypeaches> afternoon


[00:00] <ericsnow> anyone know if we are going to drop the legacy HTTP endpoints for 2.0?
[00:00] <ericsnow> see https://github.com/juju/juju/blob/master/apiserver/apiserver.go#L432
[00:09] <davecheney> perrito666: thanks, fingers crossed this time
[00:09] <perrito666> axw: quick question about cloud credentials schema, have a sec?
[00:10] <axw> perrito666: in 1:1, sorry
[00:10] <perrito666> no worrries
[00:51] <axw> perrito666: had to do school drop off, I'm back now if you're still around
[00:52] <perrito666> axw: solved it :)
[00:52] <perrito666> tx anyway
[00:52] <axw> perrito666: glad to be of service ;)
[00:52] <perrito666> autoload-credentials was ignoring my ~/.novarc but it works with my env variables, will file a bug later
[01:19] <wallyworld> perrito666: i did test it with ~/.novarc
[01:19] <wallyworld> i wonder what went wrong
[01:20] <perrito666> wallyworld: perhaps my novarc lacks the expected format?
[01:20] <wallyworld> you sure the contents are correct?
[01:20] <wallyworld> it looks for the same things as env vars
[01:21] <perrito666> is a bash file full of exports
[01:21] <perrito666> odd
[01:21] <wallyworld> maybe be a problem, not sure
[01:21] <wallyworld> weill have to retest
[01:21] <wallyworld> axw: i'm about to propose the interactive add-credentials with the CredentialSchema ordering fix. but i'm wondering if the password entry should echo * as characters are typed or pasted
[01:21] <perrito666> wallyworld: are you sure your env was clean when you tested?
[01:22] <wallyworld> prtetty sure
[01:22] <wallyworld> i'll have a look ina bit
[01:22]  * perrito666 finally gets a k3 bootstrap
[01:22] <perrito666> with magic auth_url auto discovery :)
[01:22] <wallyworld> yay
[01:23] <axw> wallyworld: no, I don't think so. knowing the length of the password isn't great
[01:23] <axw> wallyworld: you're using readpass, right?
[01:23] <wallyworld> axw: yep
[01:23] <wallyworld> is just a personal preference
[01:23] <wallyworld> i want feedback that i'm typing something
[01:23] <axw> wallyworld: it's nice for visual feedback, but it is a security flaw
[01:24] <wallyworld> a small one
[01:24] <wallyworld> hard to count * :-)
[01:24] <axw> wallyworld: not if it's a short password
[01:24] <wallyworld> and who uses short passwords?
[01:24] <wallyworld> surely everyone uses a pw manager
[01:24] <axw> wallyworld: lol :)
[01:24] <wallyworld> if not they deserve wgat they get
[01:25] <wallyworld> (half joking)
[01:37] <mup> Bug #1558333 opened: juju's logging the literal "$cmd" instead of value of $cmd <juju-log> <logging> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558333>
[01:45] <wallyworld> perrito666: the issue with .novarc is that juju doesn't strip the export bit. my tests didn't have that
[01:45] <perrito666> so the export bit is not valid? it sure seems
[01:46] <wallyworld> the export bit should be supported by juju
[01:46] <anastasiamac_> axw: since u r OCR, could u PTAL http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4193/
[01:46] <wallyworld> ie juju should strip it out
[01:46] <anastasiamac_> axw: it's a critical for 1.25
[01:46] <axw> anastasiamac_: sure, looking
[01:46] <anastasiamac_> axw: thanks :D
[01:47] <perrito666> wallyworld: cant yout source the file into an env and read the env? sounds like you could save a lot of future pains with that
[01:47] <axw> anastasiamac_: were there any changes to the changes required?
[01:48] <wallyworld> perrito666: sourcing the file is a shellism
[01:48] <axw> anastasiamac_: (i.e. did you just cherry pick without having to modify?)
[01:48] <anastasiamac_> axw: ? no cherry-pick was not possible
[01:48] <axw> anastasiamac_: I see, you said re-work
[01:48] <axw> nps
[01:48] <anastasiamac_> axw: the commits have other stuff in them like lxd for eg..
[01:48] <wallyworld> perrito666: i was hoping to avoid execing shell command
[01:49] <axw> right, of course
[01:49] <anastasiamac_> axw: however, the related code is exactly as onmaster
[01:49] <axw> anastasiamac_: okey dokey
[01:49] <anastasiamac_> axw: except for renaming model stuff :P
[01:50] <perrito666> wallyworld: I would expect to be a way to wrap that into go by running a child env and do whatever that env supports as source (but then again, I am guessing, a lot)
[01:50] <wallyworld> i didn't see an obvious way, maybe there is
[01:51] <wallyworld> it's easy enough to tweaks what there already to work
[01:54] <axw> anastasiamac_: LGTM, thanks
[01:54] <anastasiamac_> axw: \o/
[01:58] <perrito666> wallyworld: axw credentials schema fields cannot be made optionals?
[01:59] <wallyworld> perrito666: they can as of recently
[01:59] <perrito666> wallyworld: is that on master?
[01:59] <wallyworld> Optional: true
[01:59] <wallyworld> yes
[01:59] <wallyworld> perrito666: i did it just for you
[02:00] <wallyworld> to support keystone 3
[02:00] <perrito666> you are wonderful, pint me to plz?
[02:00] <wallyworld> EPARSEERROR
[02:01] <wallyworld> if you grab master tip, you can use Optiona: true in credential schema
[02:01] <perrito666> grrrreat
[02:19] <wallyworld> axw: fyi, ignore the charm-minvers feature branch pr, that's s merge into master i'm landing now
[02:19] <axw> wallyworld: ok, thanks
[02:25] <perrito666> k I have it working and almost fixed the joyous openstack live tests to reflect that, my brain is out of order for the day, see you all tomorrow
[02:26] <perrito666> wallyworld: axw anastasiamac_ I would love  a review of https://github.com/go-goose/goose/pull/19 during the night
[02:26] <perrito666> cheers
[02:26] <wallyworld> our night or yours?
[02:27] <axw> perrito666: will see how I go, got lots to review today
[02:27] <wallyworld> i can look
[02:27] <anastasiamac_> perrito666: nite \o/
[02:28] <perrito666> wallyworld: yours I need to et all this merged tomorrow
[02:28] <perrito666> no sorry mine
[02:28] <perrito666> mybrain is dead
[02:28] <wallyworld> perrito666: i was being facecious :-)
[02:29] <wallyworld> i knew what you meant :-)
[03:38] <natefinch> axw: can I get one more quick review on the stringmap thing?  realized I was missing handling an error case: https://github.com/juju/cmd/pull/32
[03:40] <axw> natefinch: looking
[03:40] <natefinch> axw: thanks
[03:41] <axw> natefinch: done
[03:42] <natefinch> axw: thanks!
[04:05] <natefinch> and now to figure out how to finagle these full stack tests to succeed when the server doesn't actually support this endpoint...
[04:23] <davecheney>   /win12
[04:30] <menn0> axw: this is pretty horrible but necessary: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/4766 PTAL
[04:31]  * axw braces
[04:33] <natefinch> menn0: is there a bug filed for that on go-yaml?
[04:34] <menn0> natefinch: not yet, but I've just created a card for myself on our board to do that
[04:34] <anastasiamac_> menn0: is it worthwhile back porting to 1.25... I think that the bug would be awesome too \o/
[04:34] <natefinch> anastasiamac_: are we supporting go 1.6 for 1.25?
[04:35] <mup> Bug # changed: 1499781, 1504578, 1526926, 1529126
[04:35] <menn0> natefinch: it's an involved bug report to write up so I'll do it next week
[04:35] <menn0> anastasiamac_: the code that was relying on private embedded types only exists in Juju 2.0
[04:35] <menn0> anastasiamac_: we'd know about it if we were relying on this elsewhere
[04:35] <anastasiamac_> menn0: then no need for 1.25 :D
[04:36]  * menn0 has lost hours on this
[04:36] <axw> menn0: what's the deal with all the trailing underscores?
[04:36] <anastasiamac_> menn0: but for reference, I can see CI tests that run against 1.25 with go 1.6
[04:36] <natefinch> axw: they give you a place to rest your mouse when your arm gets tired
[04:37] <axw> nani
[04:37] <menn0> axw: Tim came up with that as a way to avoid collisions between field names and the method names he wanted to use
[04:37] <anastasiamac_> natefinch: such small mouse tho :D
[04:37] <axw> menn0: ah, right, ok
[04:38] <menn0> axw: i've continued with the trend
[04:39] <axw> menn0: reviewed
[04:39] <menn0> axw: thanks
[04:40] <menn0> axw: I clearly didn't re-run the tests after removing that debugging Dump method :)
[04:40] <axw> :)
[05:59] <jam> axw: davecheney: I pushed a small update because of a case I found in Juju (we were calling AddCleanup during SetUpSuite()), can you give it one more quick look?
[06:02] <axw> jam: LGTM. there's a bug somewhere (I think rogpeppe filed it) suggesting that we should just have AddCleanup, and DTRT whether we're in SetUpSuite or in/after SetUpTest
[06:02] <axw> jam: probably need to change tests to do that tho
[06:02] <jam> axw: I could do that here, with just checking if s.testSuite is nil
[06:03] <jam> axw: does that sound sane?
[06:03] <axw> jam: yeah, I'm just not sure if anything is relying on current behaviour
[06:03] <jam> axw: if it is, its broken
[06:03] <jam> assuming AddCleanup during a Suite level operation will be cleaned up after the first test run...
[06:03] <jam> we could keep AddSuiteCleanup as an explicit thing
[06:04] <jam> but calling it in a Test context and assuming it will last the rest of the Suite is also broken behavior
[06:04] <jam> One test should not set global state for another test to expect
[06:04] <jam> axw: then again, if the Juju test suite *does* have those bugs, I don't know how many I can fix :)
[06:04] <axw> jam: indeed :)
[06:05] <axw> jam: I'd be happy to drop AddSuiteCleanup and have AddCleanup add suite-level things when called in SetUpSuite, and test-level things otherwise
[06:05] <axw> it's just a sed command to rename AddSuiteCleanup to AddCleanup after that
[06:06] <axw> jam: if you want to defer removing/renaming, that's fine though. we can do that later
[06:06] <jam> axw: trying to think how to write the tests for it.
[06:06] <jam> I think making it safe and easy to use is best
[06:07] <jam> so users don't have to think "Can I call it now"?
[06:07] <jam> (heirarchy of good API, "make the obvious thing correct" vs "make the wrong thing hard to do"
[06:07] <jam> )
[06:07] <jam> axw: it also leads to helpers like PatchValue where you can't control whether it is Suite level or Test level.
[06:07] <axw> jam: just read your latest email; the bug I was thinking of was actually about PatchValue. same sort of deal though
[06:08] <jam> axw: yeah, the fact that BaseSuite itself had this bug
[06:08] <jam> means we can *easily* have lots of tests that are actually doing Outbound tests
[06:08] <axw> :\
[06:08] <jam> and we didn't notice because we thought we were protected by BaseSUite
[06:18] <axw> wallyworld: we're still using CompatSalt in cloudconfig/instancecfg, and I don't think there's any reason to. The hash is a temporary, derived password - we shouldn't need to use a fixed salt
[06:19] <wallyworld> axw: yeah, i figured that change was a separate pr
[06:19] <axw> wallyworld: ok
[06:42] <jam> axw: can you look at the pull?
[06:42] <jam> http://github.com/juju/testing/pull/92
[06:42] <axw> jam: looking
[06:42] <jam> thx
[06:42] <jam> or davecheney^^
[06:44] <jam> axw: interestingly "home_test" was a case where we were setting up another test suite, and calling SetUpTest but not SetUpSuite
[06:50] <axw> jam: LGTM, thanks. there's a couple of odd SetUpTest calls in home_test, but just style issues really
[06:50] <axw> and preexisting at that
[06:51] <jam> home_test is trying to test the test itself by creating another test object.
[06:51] <jam> but it is calling SetUpTest without ever calling SetUpSuite
[06:51] <axw> jam: ah, I see.
[06:51] <jam> and we're now at... a whole lot of failures in Juju proper...
[06:51] <axw> :/
[06:52] <jam> FakeHomeSuite is doing something bad.
[06:52] <axw> jam: because they were swept under the rug?
[06:52] <jam> lots of tests use it
[06:52] <axw> lots of outbound connections? :)
[06:52] <axw> oh home suite
[06:53] <jam> investigating, because I don't see anything bad yet
[06:53] <jam> FakeJujuXDGDataHomeSuite calls SetUpTest during TearDownSuite ?
[06:54] <jam> axw: testing/environ.go line 107
[06:54] <jam> why is TearDownSuite calling Suite.SetUpTest() ?
[06:55] <jam> I think that's just a copy&paste typo
[06:55] <axw> jam: heh, yep, I'd say so
[06:56] <axw> jam: since 2014 :)
[06:56] <jam> axw: love it when our base infrastructure has some weird bugs in it.
[06:57] <jam> axw: SetUpSuite is *also* calling SetUpTest instead of SetUpSuite
[06:58] <axw> lol
[06:58] <jam> and JujuOSSuite doesn't implement either SetUpSuite or TearDownSuite, so we don't need to write our own anymay
[06:58] <jam> anyway
[06:59] <jam> axw: or is it better to have one and just a line that says "this other one doesn't need to be called cause it doesn't exist" ?
[07:00] <axw> jam: I've not found one way or the other to be much better
[07:00] <axw> leaving it out is probably OK
[07:00] <axw> jam: I'd love to write a static analyser one of these days to check that they're all wired up correctly
[07:00] <jam> axw: yeah, the main problem is that once someone does introduce a SetUpSuite then we should call it, but neither way is going to catch that on its own
[07:01]  * axw nods
[07:19] <jam> so it looks like we do have at least 1 failure in Provisioning suite
[07:19] <jam> where it is actually reading cloud-images somehow
[07:21] <jam> though it is failing in the opposite way I was expecting
[07:22] <jam> maybe FakeXDGHome was accidentally making it harder to get outside access by calling SetUpTest all the time?
[07:32] <wallyworld> axw: i'm off to soccer soonish, i've reposnded to some of the comments on the add credentials review. i'll finish the interactive prompt for replace when i get back
[07:33] <axw> wallyworld: thanks, I'm just responding now
[07:33] <axw> enjoy
[07:33] <wallyworld> leaving in 20 minutes r so
[07:33] <wallyworld> will do
[07:34] <jam> axw: ugh. we have test suites that want to call PatchValue before they call their Base type's SetUpTest because SetUp does work that they want to patch out
[07:36] <axw> jam: ugh indeed
[07:36] <axw> jam: example?
[07:36] <jam> provider/lxd/
[07:37] <jam> testing_test.go
[07:37] <jam> there is a BaseSuiteUnpatched and a BaseSuite
[07:37] <jam> and BaseSuite embeds BaseSuiteUnpatched which embeds IsolationSuite
[07:37] <jam> so BaseSuite patches an object, then calls BaseSuiteUnpatched.SetUp
[07:38] <jam> line 277
[07:38] <jam> axw: ^^
[07:39] <jam> provider/joyent/joyent_test.go calls envtesting.PatchAttemptStrategies() before calling base .SetUpSiet()
[07:39] <jam> SetUpSuite()
[07:39] <axw> jam: yup. I think in the lxd case it could be moved to BaseSuite.SetUpSuite
[07:40] <axw> jam: that one's a bit different, it's not involving the suite
[07:40] <jam> axw: provider/joyent/local_test.go line 155
[07:40] <jam> calls PatchValue for 2 things before calling providerSuite.SetUpSuite()
[07:42] <axw> jam: AFAICT, it doesn't need to
[07:42] <jam> that also looks like it was honestly broken because the lifetime of that PatchValue should be wrong
[07:42]  * axw digs
[07:42] <axw> true
[07:42] <jam> my "go test ./...." is 5000 lines with this change to AddCleanup...
[07:44] <axw> jam: yeah, those 2 patches can come after SetUpSuite
[07:44] <axw> jam: 5000 lines? huh?
[07:45] <jam> panic tends to create a fair bit of traceback
[07:45] <jam> and SetUp failures fail on all the associated tests
[07:45] <jam> so it is bigger than probably it seems
[07:45] <jam> but its a fair bit to dig through
[07:47] <jam> axw: provider/joyent/local_test.go adds a *AddSuiteCleanup* that patches the attempt strategies to ShortAttempt
[07:47] <jam> I don't see it patch them to something longer first.
[07:48] <jam> my rabbit hole has gotten too deep, I think
[07:48] <axw> :)
[07:49] <axw> jam: probably just cruft, but I don't know for sure
[07:50] <jam> axw: I *did* finally hit tests that are going to cloud-images
[07:50] <jam> and failing now because they can't
[07:50] <jam> localLiveSuite.TestStartStop for provider/ec2
[07:51] <jam> "signature made by unknown entity"
[07:52] <axw> jam: yep, SetUpSuite calls PatchOfficialDataSources which calls PatchValue
[07:53]  * axw has to go feed children
[07:54] <jam> axw: have a good evening
[07:55] <jam> need to get out a swear jar...
[08:57]  * frobware wakes up to find maas-spaces2 has merged. \o/
[09:31] <frobware> dimitern: about to push your branch as upstream/maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers
[09:33] <dimitern> frobware, great! and I've seen maas-spaces2 get merged! cheers
[09:33] <frobware> dimitern: if we don't do lxc then CI tests will fail. How do we not do this for the moment is not clear (to me at least).
[09:34] <dimitern> frobware, well lxc-broker is still there, so ..
[09:35] <frobware> dimitern: we need to bung this branch (@ 07693b816c207bc6e3fa9d7dd3f76784a695908e) to the OS folks for testing...
[09:36] <frobware> dimitern, voidspace: upstream/maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers is now soliciting commits... :)
[09:38] <frobware> mgz, sinzui: please can we add upstream/maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers to the CI jobs (assuming something explicitly needs to be setup). thanks!
[09:40] <voidspace> frobware: cool
[09:40] <dimitern> frobware, I have some commits in mind to add :)
[09:41] <dimitern> voidspace, frobware, we should also delete maas-spaces2 from upstream soon
[09:45] <mgz> frobware: pushing it into the juju namespace is all that's needed
[09:46] <frobware> mgz: thanks
[09:47] <dimitern> frobware, about that fancycheck - it was temporary, now it can be dropped
[09:47] <dimitern> frobware, and we should do that before the CI run right?
[09:48] <frobware> dimitern: submit a PR, we can now review, commit in the usual way. ;)
[09:49] <dimitern> frobware, on it
[09:52] <voidspace> dimitern: frobware: is maas-spaces2 landing on master today then?
[09:52] <dimitern> voidspace, it already landed yesterday
[09:53] <voidspace> dimitern: hah, cool
[09:58] <TheMue> morning saphires o/ *yawn*
[09:58] <dimitern> TheMue, hey o/ morning
[10:00] <voidspace> TheMue: 0/
[10:01] <dimitern> voidspace, frobware, http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4210/
[10:03] <natefinch>  team meeting anyone?
[10:04]  * TheMue currently not *lol*
[10:10] <voidspace> dimitern: frobware: I'm down to 11 failures on my branch (from 33 yesterday) - several of them about to be fixed by a change to gomaasapi
[10:11] <voidspace> (gomaasapi test server)
[10:13] <perrito666> morning all
[10:14] <perrito666> natefinch: is there anyone in the tm?
[10:15] <natefinch> perrito666:  a efw people
[10:16] <natefinch> perrito666: me, william, michael, and dimiter
[10:17] <frobware> dimitern, voidspace: sorry, was otp. Want to do a quick standup?
[10:17] <voidspace> frobware: in team meeting
[10:28] <fwereade> jam, I would love to help you with IsolationSuite horrors, but... probably not today
[10:29] <voidspace> dimitern: want to drop back in for standup?
[10:29] <dimitern> voidspace, sure
[10:30] <dimitern> voidspace, frobware, I'm the only one there though
[10:31] <voidspace> dimitern: we stayed in the team meeting room...
[10:31] <voidspace> dimitern: as we were there already
[10:31] <dimitern> ah
[10:31] <voidspace> hence "drop back in"
[10:56] <TheMue> Btw, Happy St Patricks Day
[11:20] <voidspace> down to 7 failures and deleted more code
[11:21] <voidspace> some unused production code some unused test helpers
[11:37] <jam> thanks fwereade. I'm going to try and get some more of my LXD stuff done, but I did make a bit more progress on the Isolation stuff. Its actually closer than I was worried it would be.
[12:41] <fwereade> before I go spelunking... can anyone suggest a foolproof way of inducing a StartSync on... whatever *state.State in the background is *actually* driving events for a hosted model running under a jujud test?
[12:42] <fwereade> jam, dimitern, axw, wallyworld perhaps? ^^
[12:42] <icey> juju's PPA needs to be updated, currently throwing warnings on Xenial due to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1558331
[12:42] <mup> Bug #1558331: After upgrading to apt 1.2.7 in Xenial, PPAs and most other third-party repositories become unusable with "The repository is insufficiently signed by key  (weak digest)" <xenial> <apt (Ubuntu):Confirmed> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558331>
[12:42] <wallyworld> fwereade: isn't there a StartSync() method or something to trigger a sync?
[12:44] <fwereade> wallyworld, yeah... but you need to call it on the right *State
[12:44] <wallyworld> that is correct, it can be confusing
[12:44] <fwereade> wallyworld, we have access to .BackingState
[12:45] <fwereade> wallyworld, but I have a horrible feeling that the state that's backing the apiserver we talk to is hidden away in a statepool somewhere out of reach
[12:45] <wallyworld> i haven't looked at that stuff in ages. i do recall it being somewhat funky. i have not good answer for you
[12:45] <fwereade> wallyworld, (.BackingState is the one for the controller model, but it doesn't cause hosted models to get events
[12:45] <fwereade> )
[12:46] <fwereade> wallyworld, no worries, looks like I need to go hunting
[12:46] <wallyworld> yeah, sorry
[13:30] <alexisb> frobware, ping
[13:38] <natefinch> I am sad that juju controllers is not an alias for juju show-controllers
[13:38] <rick_h__> natefinch: list-controllers?
[13:38] <natefinch> ty
[13:39] <natefinch> it's show-controllers
[13:39] <natefinch> oh, I guess it's both
[13:39] <rick_h__> show-controller is against once controller?
[13:39] <rick_h__> it gives metadata for one, the other is the listing
[13:39] <natefinch> oh that is confusing
[13:40] <rick_h__> show-X is "give me details of one" and list- "give me a table of them"
[13:40] <frobware> alexisb: pong
[13:40] <alexisb> heya frobware see private chat
[13:40] <natefinch> rick_h__: but then why is there a show-controllers (note plural)?
[13:40] <rick_h__> natefinch: not sure on that one
[13:41] <alexisb> natefinch, it may be that the alias still exists on that one
[13:41] <alexisb> I owuld have to go look
[13:41] <natefinch> rick_h__: looks like you can pass in multiple controller names and it'll show you details for all
[13:41] <alexisb> at first we were doing both the single and plural case for everything
[13:41] <natefinch> s/all/each
[13:42] <natefinch> if you pass in 0 controller names, it shows you details for just the current
[13:42] <natefinch> show vs. list is very confusing IMO.
[13:42] <natefinch> but it looks like we have a lot of each
[13:43] <rick_h__> yes, it's one of the base principles of it. Very common across all nouns can be shown or listed
[14:13] <dimitern> frobware, voidspace, http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4212/ fixes an issue found with multi-nic support
[14:18] <natefinch> I swear I am never ever ever going to get used to bootstrap having the name first
[14:18] <rick_h__> natefinch: don't get used to it, branch changing that lands soon hopefully
[14:18] <natefinch> rick_h__: oh thank goodness
[14:19] <rick_h__> natefinch: oh, sorry you mean the cli
[14:19] <rick_h__> that's not changing, though tyou meant the name of the first model
[14:19] <rick_h__> lol, in which case sorry
[14:19] <natefinch> aww!
[14:20] <natefinch> how come when I juju bootstrap mylocal lxd ... it creates a juju controller named local.mylocal?
[14:21] <rick_h__> the local is for multi-user situation. You might add controllers from other users that already have that name
[14:22] <natefinch> rick_h__: but if I don't... then you've just munged my namespace for no reason
[14:22] <rick_h__> natefinch: you should be able to leave it off and we can visit ways of streamlining
[14:22] <rick_h__> but had to design for the big case and work backwards
[14:30] <dimitern> voidspace, frobware, we should get it in to have a chance of a blessed ci run
[14:30] <dimitern> ^^
[14:30] <frobware> dimitern: looking now
[14:30] <dimitern> frobware, cheers
[14:48] <frobware> dimitern: reviewed
[14:48] <dimitern> frobware, thanks - updated, pushed, and set to merge
[14:48] <frobware> dimitern: did you see the ci results of the first one?
[14:49]  * natefinch needs to make an auto-dependencies.tsv merge tool
[14:49] <dimitern> frobware, yeah - as expected pretty much - the fancycheck
[14:49] <dimitern> frobware, and most of the other issues should be resolved by the last fix
[14:50] <dimitern> frobware, btw I managed to repro the empty mac address at setInstanceInfo for containers, looking into it
[14:50] <frobware> dimitern: I was in 2 minds about whether to push the branch this morning; I didn't think the CI run would happen that quickly given all the other feature branches that are being tested.
[14:50] <frobware> dimitern: oooh. And, btw, the reason the attach <pid> failed is I didn't start the remote end as root.
[14:50] <dimitern> frobware, they made some changes recently - there was a mail about it
[14:51] <dimitern> frobware, ah! :)
[14:51] <frobware> dimitern: what was the macaddr issue?
[14:51] <dimitern> frobware, I have a suspicion why it might be happening
[14:52] <frobware> dimitern: ok, going to ignore that and look at profiles again
[14:52] <dimitern> frobware, the MACAddress coming from PrepareContainerInterfaceInfo gets lost when trying to set the container devices in state
[14:52] <dimitern> frobware, +1
[15:03] <mup> Bug #1558608 opened: maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers cannot bootstrap <block-ci-testing> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558608>
[15:06] <mup> Bug #1558608 changed: maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers cannot bootstrap <block-ci-testing> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558608>
[15:15] <mup> Bug #1558608 opened: maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers cannot bootstrap <block-ci-testing> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers:In Progress by dimitern> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558608>
[15:15] <mup> Bug #1558612 opened: creating hosted model config: maas-agent-name is already set; this should not be set by hand <bootstrap> <ci> <maas-provider> <test-failure> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core admin-controller-model:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558612>
[15:45] <mup> Bug #1558608 changed: maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers cannot bootstrap <block-ci-testing> <juju-core:Invalid> <juju-core maas-spaces-multi-nic-containers:Fix Released by dimitern> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558608>
[16:15] <mup> Bug #1558087 changed: TestInvalidFileFormat fails on windows because of / <blocker> <ci> <regression> <test-failure> <windows> <juju-core:Fix Released by cmars> <juju-core model-acls:Fix Released by cmars> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558087>
[16:31] <dimitern> voidspace, btw I've found out the main reason why discoverspaces worker seems to make a lot of calls
[16:31] <dimitern> voidspace, it does call CreateSpaces and AddSubnets once for each space / subnet
[16:32] <dimitern> voidspace, I'm testing a patch now which takes advantage of the bulk nature of both api methods, so calls each of them once per handleSubnets() call
[16:33] <dimitern> should make the discovery much quicker hopefully, and resolve some issues where subnets might be missing when trying to use them (e.g. for machine devices' addresses)
[16:38] <voidspace> frobware: that test passes"
[16:38] <voidspace> I meant !
[16:38] <voidspace> dimitern: I didn't know it seemed to make a lot of calls
[16:38] <voidspace> dimitern: but cool
[16:39] <voidspace> dimitern: I'm down to 1 failing test on drop-maas-1.8
[16:39] <dimitern> voidspace, great!
[16:42] <frobware> dimitern: is that "resolve some issues where subnets might be missing" at all related to the mac address we were looking at earlier? (surprised if so, but...)
[16:43] <dimitern> frobware, not clear yet
[16:43] <dimitern> frobware, I did discover an issue with that fix though
[16:43] <frobware> dimitern: from the is not alive?
[16:44] <frobware> dimitern: might want to make sure that bulk method is in 2.0 before getting too far
[16:44] <dimitern> frobware, because the machiner starts before discoverspaces, it will not set the subnetID for yet-undiscovered subnets
[16:44] <voidspace> dimitern: will the bulk calls take into account that discovery might have already run and some of the spaces / subnets might already exist? (but some might not)
[16:44] <dimitern> frobware, it's already bulk
[16:44] <dimitern> voidspace, it does I think - at least it works idempotently
[16:44] <voidspace> frobware: the bulk api calls are our code
[16:44] <frobware> voidspace: ok
[16:44] <voidspace> dimitern: there were some tests for that
[16:45] <mup> Bug #1558657 opened: many workers still don't use clocks <tech-debt> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558657>
[16:45] <dimitern> voidspace, I didn't have to change the tests after changing CreateSpaces and AddSubnets calls to be done once in bulk
[16:45] <mup> Bug #1558668 opened: api_undertaker_test is not a feature test <tech-debt> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558668>
[16:45] <dimitern> they still passed ok
[16:46] <dimitern> and a quick live tests showed the difference: in a few seconds the discovery was done (a lot less log spam around "caching subnets.." and also 2 vs 3 messages at bootstrap saying Spaces discovert still in progress)
[17:01] <dimitern> that wasn't enough apparently - the machiner manages to call SetObservedNetworkConfig a couple of seconds before spaces discovery completes :/
[17:01] <dimitern> so I'm thinking that we should block MA logins until discovery completes... testing this live now
[17:09] <fwereade> I'm pretty sure we shouldn't be blocking MA logins for anything, a huge amount of our functionality depends on it
[17:09] <fwereade> dimitern, ^^
[17:09] <fwereade> dimitern, I think this is another reason to set space-discovery-completed in state persistently
[17:10] <fwereade> dimitern, and expose getter/watcher for whatever things need to wait on it?
[17:10] <dimitern> fwereade, I know it shouldn't, I'm just trying to see if it might help as an experiment
[17:10] <voidspace> dimitern: hah, the repeated building of the subnet cache is still a bug in the cache code though right?
[17:10] <dimitern> fwereade, I agree it needs to be recored in state once done
[17:10] <fwereade> dimitern, fair enough
[17:11] <dimitern> voidspace, it is, but the cache was done with the assumption it will be used for bulk-style calls
[17:11] <voidspace> dimitern: so it's cache once per call by design
[17:11] <voidspace> dimitern: fwereade: yeah, I can't think of another reliable way other than storing in state when discovery is completed
[17:12] <voidspace> not an alternative that meets all the use cases we have (HA, multiple models etc)
[17:12] <dimitern> voidspace, fwereade, and we have another case already - the peergrouper needs to know the spaces discovery is done before deciding the common space all controllers are in
[17:13] <voidspace> dimitern: right
[17:14] <dimitern> voidspace, why did we decide not to block until the discovery has started? in case the worker does not start at all?
[17:14] <voidspace> dimitern: because it blocks access for all models when you start discovery for one model
[17:14] <mgz> dimitern: should container networking on master work with kvm on maas?
[17:14] <fwereade> dimitern, voidspace: I think we probably should block, it's just that you can't do it safely without a persistent flag
[17:15] <dimitern> mgz, not really
[17:15] <voidspace> fwereade: dimitern: agreed, we need to do it right
[17:15] <mup> Bug #1558678 opened: manual bootstrap: PrepareForCreateEnvironment not implemented <bootstrap> <ci> <manual-provider> <regression> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core admin-controller-model:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558678>
[17:15] <dimitern> mgz, is the the addressable containers job?
[17:15] <voidspace> fwereade: dimitern: we disabled it because it was broken in several ways
[17:15] <mgz> dimitern: yeah
[17:16] <voidspace> dimitern: it also didn't block access *until* discovery started - which meant bootstrap could complete before the block was in place
[17:16] <fwereade> voidspace, dimitern: see RB4110 for how the discoverspaces worker will shortly be invoked
[17:16] <dimitern> mgz, I wouldn't care too much about it - addressable containers are dying, just haven't died yet
[17:16] <dimitern> fwereade, will check that
[17:17] <dimitern> fwereade, what I'm currently seeing is that the machiner is consistently starting 2 seconds before discoverspaces
[17:17] <fwereade> dimitern, I would expect the machiner to start beforehand usually, yeah, that's top-level whereas discoverspaces is only triggered once we've got a modelworkermanager looking for models to manage
[17:18] <dimitern> fwereade, which messes up setting the observed network config - I guess that must be done in a periodic worker instead of the machiner
[17:18] <fwereade> dimitern, I can well believe it wants to be split out of the machiner, yeah
[17:18] <mgz> dimitern: well, the problem is we don't have a good working spaces/new networking functional test
[17:18] <dimitern> as it currently does not retry / update the observed config later
[17:18] <fwereade> dimitern, yeah, and running a worker with multiple watchers is generally painful, even with catacomb
[17:19] <dimitern> mgz, how about the bundle-based one?
[17:19] <fwereade> dimitern, far better to separate the responsibilities completely
[17:19] <dimitern> fwereade, indeed, I'll look into that
[17:20] <mgz> dimitern: point me at it!
[17:21] <dimitern> mgz, let me have a look
[17:22] <dimitern> mgz, this one for example http://reports.vapour.ws/releases/3771/job/maas-1_9-OS-deployer/attempt/496
[17:22] <mgz> right, we do exercise a bunch of stuff with that, but not kvm (or fancy subnet stuff)
[17:23] <perrito666> dimitern: could you $$merge$$ -> https://github.com/go-goose/goose/pull/19 and tell me who else is in the merge team so I dont pick on you all the time?
[17:23] <dimitern> mgz, kvm won't work with multi-nic, but it should still work with a single nic
[17:24] <dimitern> perrito666, done
[17:24] <perrito666> tx
[17:25]  * dimitern needs to step out for ~1h
[17:36] <frobware> dimitern: you still there.
[17:36] <frobware> ah ^^ - nope
[17:38] <mgz> frobware: are you capturable atm?
[17:45] <mup> Bug #1558703 opened: PatchValue unsafe for SetUpSuite <testing> <unit-tests> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558703>
[18:06] <voidspace> frobware: dimitern: https://github.com/juju/gomaasapi/pull/10/files
[18:13] <voidspace> frobware: dimitern: all tests now pass on my branch
[18:13] <voidspace> all *maas* tests  - need to do a full test run
[18:13] <voidspace> frobware: dimitern: I need that gomaasapi branch to land so I can update dependencies.tsv
[18:18] <frobware> voidspace: looking
[18:18] <dimitern> voidspace, looks good
[18:20] <dimitern> frobware, hey, I just got back, but I'm thinking of declaring EOD
[18:20] <frobware> dimitern: ok, me too. too many distractions since our lxd investigation earlier.
[18:21] <dimitern> frobware, I've found out that last fix I did was not sufficient
[18:21] <frobware> voidspace: I'll hang around for your branch and push that upstream so we can get a CI run
[18:21] <frobware> dimitern: fresh thinking comes in the morning. :)
[18:21] <dimitern> frobware, i.e. it will likely cause most failing jobs to pass, but it will break network-get
[18:21] <dimitern> frobware, but I have a fix in mind that will take care of that - but as you said - morning :)
[18:21] <frobware> dimitern: that's ok isn't it? (apart from unit test failures)
[18:22] <dimitern> frobware, it's ok for tonight I guess
[18:25] <frobware> dimitern: push it - we wake up to a CI run
[18:26] <dimitern> frobware, will do - it'll take a couple of hours to implement and test, so that's my plan for tomorrow first thing
[18:27] <frobware> dimitern: sounds good
[18:40] <voidspace> frobware: I have a provisioner unit test failure on wrong number of network.InterfaceInfo returned
[18:40] <voidspace> frobware: I'll look at it in the morning, should be able to get it done first thing
[18:41] <voidspace> frobware: oh wait
[18:41] <voidspace> frobware: that fails due to missing lxcbr0, that may fail on master for me as well
[18:42] <voidspace> frobware: and indeed it does fail in the same way
[18:43] <voidspace> frobware: my gomaasapi branch has landed, I'll fix dependencies.tsv and push
[18:47] <voidspace> frobware: right branch pushed
[18:47] <voidspace> frobware: ready for a CI run
[18:47] <arosales> hello juju core folks :-)
[18:47] <voidspace> frobware: *requires* maas 1.9
[18:47] <voidspace> and that's me EOD
[18:47] <arosales> Need some help on a power8 stack trace
[18:47] <voidspace> g'night all
[18:47] <arosales> https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1558734
[18:47] <mup> Bug #1558734: POWER8 agent stacktraces and refuses to boot <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558734>
[19:03] <rick_h__> natefinch: quick check, if I update my charm with a min-version, and I do attempt to deploy it on older Juju what happens?
[19:03] <natefinch> rick_h__: it deploys
[19:03] <rick_h__> natefinch: ok, so Juju doesn't freak about the unknown attribute?
[19:04] <natefinch> rick_h__: nope... one of the nice things about the way we deserialize the data in there... anything we don't recognize we ignore
[19:05] <natefinch> rick_h__: in this particular case, it would kind of be nice if we got a "error, can't deploy, unrecogized data in metadata: min-juju-version"  .... but, alas, it'll just ignore it and deploy.
[19:05] <rick_h__> natefinch: ok
[19:09] <mup> Bug #1558734 opened: POWER8 agent stacktraces and refuses to boot <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558734>
[19:28] <frobware> mgz: still about?
[20:30] <mup> Bug #1558769 opened: unable to create-model in azure <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558769>
[21:52] <perrito666> I broke restore? :( that  is ironic
[21:55] <mup> Bug #1558803 opened: Manual deploy on ppc64el wants wrong package and agents <ci> <manual-provider> <ppc64el> <regression> <juju-core:Incomplete> <juju-core admin-controller-model:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558803>
[23:38] <arosales> mwhudson: marcoceppi still seeing juju peg the cpu on power8, any suggestions?
[23:38] <mwhudson> arosales: is this a power8 where c programs like dpkg actually work?
[23:38] <mwhudson> because debugging firmware issues via juju seems insane
[23:39] <arosales> they have been working, I am not sure if they have tested lately
[23:39] <arosales> mwhudson: ack I am not asking you to debug firmware via Juju
[23:39] <arosales> mwhudson: I am dumb, but not that dumb
[23:40] <arosales> mwhudson: just asking if you had any suggestion for marcoceppi given juju was pegging the cpu
[23:40] <mwhudson> arosales: basically, no
[23:40] <mwhudson> if you can give me access, i can poke around
[23:40] <mwhudson> but as i said in other mail, testing something built with golang-go rather than gccgo would probably be more useful overall
[23:41] <menn0> wallyworld: would you be able to look at http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4218/ pls?
[23:41] <wallyworld> sure
[23:41] <arosales> mwhudson: marcoceppi may chime with access here in bit, but it is dinner time for him
[23:42] <arosales> mwhudson: juju 2.0 built any different than 1.25?
[23:42] <mwhudson> arosales: not entirely my department, but, gosh, i certainly hope so
[23:42] <mwhudson> arosales: you are testing trusty, i assume?
[23:42] <arosales> ok so perhaps we try juju 2.0 on that machine
[23:42] <arosales> mwhudson: yes trusty atm
[23:43] <wallyworld> arosales: we are moving to use golang 1.6 for building but afaik are not quite there yet
[23:45] <arosales> ah so testing 2.0 doesn't help there -- gotcha
[23:46] <arosales> mwhudson: fyi golang-go is indeed the problem and not recommended, and we build juju 2.0 GA with go-lang and we run into these issues we will be in a world of hurt
[23:46] <arosales> mwhudson: something to be aware of
[23:46] <arosales> wallyworld: thanks
[23:47] <mwhudson> arosales: i don't understand
[23:48] <arosales> mwhudson: there is no current juju (stable or dev) that is build with golang 1.6
[23:48] <arosales> if 2.0 ends up being built wiwth gcc-go 4.9 it seems like we would be in world of hurt for juju 2.0 ga
[23:48] <mwhudson> arosales: juju for xenial for amd64 is built with go 1.6
[23:50] <arosales> mwhudson: that is counter to wallyworld's statement
[23:50] <arosales> mwhudson: pehaps wallyworld was saying for ppc64el
[23:50] <wallyworld> arosales: mwhudson: the aim is we will be using golang 1.6 to build for all architectures for 2.0 is my understanding
[23:50] <arosales> mwhudson: which having amdb64 built with go 1.6 doesn't help much with the known issues on power8le
[23:52] <mwhudson> arosales: many axes of variation :/
[23:53] <arosales> indeed, but in the end power8le seems broken on 1.25 built with gcc-go 4.9


[00:18] <ZenM> hi sry to bother... but whats teh recommended way to obtain plasma 5.8.1 on Kubuntu 16.04?
[01:06] <ZenM> No one =,(
[01:21] <valorie> people keep asking, but unless ubuntu bumps the qt version up on the LTS, we can't provide the newest Plasma
[01:22] <valorie> so contact the ubuntu devels
[02:09] <Hoffman> how do I upgrade to yakkity?
[02:15] <FreeFog> hi im looking to test Plasma 5.8 , how should I isntall it?
[02:18] <valorie> Hoffman: what are you running now?
[02:19] <valorie> free
[02:19] <valorie> oops, FreeFog -- you can't in Kubuntu -- yet
[02:19] <valorie> soon
[02:19] <valorie> if you want to in neon, see neon.org
[02:20] <Arcaire> https://neon.kde.org/
[02:20] <valorie> ooops, thanks Arcaire
[02:20] <Arcaire> ^^
[02:21] <FreeFog> Multi monitor support =,(
[02:24] <valorie> we're getting to it as quickly as wel can, FreeFog
[02:24] <valorie> the new archive isn't open yet
[02:25] <valorie> we're hoping for -updates for 16.10
[02:25] <valorie> and possibly backports for 16.04
[02:25] <FreeFog> so when it comes i will have to erase my 16.04 install?
[02:25] <FreeFog> ah
[02:25] <valorie> if they bump qt versions up for the LTS
[02:26] <FreeFog> what are the inherit problems of using backports in 16.04
[02:26] <valorie> no, either we'll be able to do it, or we won't
[02:26] <FreeFog> coz the main reason to switch to 16.10 is new plasma right?
[02:26] <valorie> I dunno, lots of updates
[02:26] <valorie> some value stability over cool new stuff
[02:26] <FreeFog> do u think 16.10 will be more stable than 16.04?
[02:26] <valorie> some the opposite
[02:27] <FreeFog> I go for stability
[02:27] <valorie> I've been running 16.10 since the archive opened
[02:27] <FreeFog> whats ur oppinion between 04 and 10?
[02:28] <valorie> I love the bleeding edge
[02:28] <valorie> and can't wait for the latest....well, actually I test and wait
[02:28] <valorie> imo you should install a nice 16.10 VM and do some testing for us
[02:29] <valorie> and then if you can, a 16.04 VM and do some testing too
[02:29] <valorie> once we have stuff to test
[02:29] <valorie> soon
[02:29] <valorie> soon
[04:56] <user|43518> Hi I have problem with time
[07:39] <bigbrovar> Hi guys. I am wondering if the latest release of plasma is available for kubuntu 16.04
[07:44] <soee_> bigbrovar: hi, no not yet
[07:44] <bigbrovar> ok I think I will just install kde neon which seem to be just what the doctor recommend
[08:05] <bigbrovar> Quick question. There a way to reduce the size of things like menu and plasma network plasmoid. I find they take sizable screen space. On plasma 4 series it was possible to remove their size
[08:25] <viewer|20112> can anyone help me? ... I upgraded my kubuntu to 16.10 and now I can't play any mp3 in qmmp... I can't even add mp3 to playlist
[08:28] <hateball> !info qmmp
[08:28] <hateball> hmmm, not familiar with that
[08:29] <hateball> geosup: installing ubuntu-restricted-extras should pull in most codecs, unless qmmp uses something else
[08:29] <geosup> will try
[08:32] <geosup> didn't help
[08:34] <hateball> geosup: can you play a file in say... Dragon?
[08:37] <geosup> in Amarok yes
[08:45] <acheronuk> geosup: a quick google suggests maybe a bug with the ffmpeg plugin, such that you may need http://qmmp.ylsoftware.com/plugins.php and use the MPG123 one instead
[08:48] <acheronuk> geosup: or possibly a new taglib version required? https://sourceforge.net/p/qmmp-dev/tickets/878/
[08:49] <acheronuk> !info libtag1v5
[08:51] <geosup> I have libtag 1.9.1-2.4ubuntu1
[08:53] <acheronuk> so possibly too old
[08:57] <acheronuk> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/taglib/+bug/1546373
[09:02] <geosup> YES ... libtag was the problem
[09:03] <geosup> I had to compile it and then remove and install again qmmp from https://launchpad.net/~forkotov02/+archive/ubuntu/ppa
[09:04] <geosup> thanks a lot :)
[09:21] <steve-_-1> so any system updates are coming to users via discover in kubuntu 16.10?
[09:39] <Mihaly> any quassel users out there?
[11:03] <Not_a_Robot> Guys, I need to hibernate my pc. But for that, it seems I need Swap. Creating Swap is not a problem (I don't have Swap because I just don't need it). The issue here is that I only have an SSD. Is there a way I could use Swap JUST for hibernation, please?
[11:50] <Smurphy> Yes. You configure the SWAP Space >= RAM size, and configure the swappiness to happen only in case of emergency.
[12:25] <Mihaly> thank you nickserv
 nickserv is a bot
[12:43] <looping_> Hello. I've been trying to find intel on the minimum system requirements for Kubuntu 16.10. Can someone can point me to the page I obviously missed?
[12:50] <Not_a_Robot> Smurphy: can you please point me to a guide for that? It would help me a lot :)
[12:53] <Smurphy> Not_a_Robot: Check out https://sites.google.com/site/easylinuxtipsproject/ssd
[12:53] <user|5060> Hi! Kubuntu 14.04.4 32bit and server HPE ML30 - RAID 1 will be works, there is B140i controller
[12:53] <Smurphy> On that page, look for vm.swappiness
[13:49] <Karl_> KWallet doesn't see my Gpg key. It's very frustrating.
[13:49] <Karl_> Any ideas how to fix?
[13:51] <Karl_> I'm rapidly getting a very negative view of KDE5 :(
[13:52] <Karl_> Nothing works as it should, and all the interesting settings are difficult to find
[13:52] <hateball> For starters, no one even knows which version you are using
[13:53] <Karl_> Something above 5
[13:53] <Karl_> Default that came with Kubuntu 16.04.1
[13:54] <Karl_> Fresh install
[13:54] <Karl_> Hard to get good data: --version flag does nothing in most cases
[13:55] <Smurphy> Karl_: console konsole --version
[13:55] <Smurphy>  konsole --version
[13:55] <Smurphy> Sorry ;) second line.
[13:56] <Smurphy> Karl_: After that, add the ppa, and install latest available plasma. After that you can rant.
[13:56] <hateball> Karl_: default 16.04 isnt very stable or awesome.. I'd suggest going for 16.10 or using kubuntu ppa
[13:56] <Karl_> Ok
[13:56] <Karl_> thanks for the tips --- there may still be hope then
[13:56] <hateball> 16.04 PPA:  sudo add-apt-repository ppa:kubuntu-ppa/backports && sudo apt update && sudo apt full-upgrade
[13:57] <hateball> also "plasmashell -v" is handy for version
[13:57] <Karl_> good to know
[13:57] <Smurphy> yep :)
[14:09] <Karl__> Does anybody know why KWallet can't find my GPG key while KGpg can?
[14:09] <Karl__> It's tremendously frustrating
[14:13] <Karl__> Especially since a guy had the same problem in April and nobody got back to him on Askubuntu
[14:13] <Karl__> Nothing more disheartened than unanswered questions abpit an issue you have yourself
[14:17] <Karl__> I'm going back to XCFE, this was a mistake --- KDE is not for me
[14:35] <mcox> can anyone recommend a way of pasting a bash script complete with colors into a libreoffice document ?
[14:35] <mcox> i.e I want the colours to remain..
[14:42] <_thelion_> Hi - is it possible to set up the calendar in the control panel to show my appointements, dates, etc?
[15:32] <Kubuntu_LTM> Hi, I'm attempting to install Kubuntu and it hangs at "Preparing to install Kubuntu"
[15:33] <Kubuntu_LTM> I can't click the Continue button to continue installing.
[15:35] <Kubuntu_LTM> Nevermind. It seems to be because it wasn't detecting my storage.
[15:48] <lucky_leo> Good afternoon! On newly installed Kubuntu 16.10 is not working akonadi server. Here, the output of the console - http://paste.ubuntu.com/23344067/
[15:48] <lucky_leo> I would be grateful for your help.
[16:01] <addtru> hello everybody
[16:02] <addtru> what do you think about kubuntu 16.04?  I had some issues with networking.  I wonder is 16.10 is better than 16.04?
[17:26] <trytry> hi all
[17:27] <trytry> I try to get kde 5.8 in my kubuntu 16.10 that I just installed
[17:27] <trytry> I can't see the new option of this version
[17:27] <trytry> like calendar for example
[17:32] <kuSuSE> what is the default behavior of dist-upgrade in xenial? it is not supposed to offer me 16.10, is it?
 @j-b-m-, Check if update mánager suggest normal versions
 So no, it is not supposed to, bit thats configurable
 @Kai Sen, Almost unchanged - http://paste.ubuntu.com/23344842/
[17:51] <marco-parillo> kuSuSE: No, dist-upgrade on 16.04 should not offer you 16.10. THey are in different repos.
[17:51] <Meodudlye> The upgrade from 16.04 to 16.10 is so far, and by a very large margin the worst upgrade of any kind of distro I have ever had. So many things are broken : graphic driver does not upgrade properly, switch to the fallback solution (nouveau) which is even more broken and fails to load most of the times, KDE can´ t understand accentuated characters wit
[17:51] <Meodudlye> hout some serious tweaking...
[17:51] <kuSuSE> ah ok then I've been spamming dist-upgrade like an idiot
[17:52] <kuSuSE> btw, do you know what version of kde I have?
[17:52] <Meodudlye> kuSuSE: it´ s on the help menu of all k apps
[17:53] <kuSuSE> kde framework 5.18.0 got it thanks
[17:53] <Meodudlye> Help-> about KDE
[17:53] <kuSuSE> wait isn't 5.18 newer than 5.8? how come pressing meta/ windows key on my keyboard not open the k menu?
[17:53] <kuSuSE> the folks at #kde said that kde has that since 5.8
[17:55] <marco-parillo> There is KDE the community that supports KDE Plasma. You do not have Plasma 5.8, and 16.04 will not have it available through the backports until it is packaged.
[17:56] <kuSuSE> it does say plasma on my log in screen but it is probably an older version
[18:01] <marco-parillo> Can you invoke krunner (usually <alt> F2) and run kinfocenter?
[18:02] <kuSuSE> marco-parillo: thank you kde plasma version 5.5.5 qt version 5.5.1
[18:02] <kuSuSE> so indeed I don't have 5.8+
[18:02] <marco-parillo> So if you were to upgrade to 16.10 you would have Plasma 5.7.5
[18:02] <kuSuSE> ahaha still not 5.8?
[18:12] <marco-parillo> No. The development team is working on a plan. I am not qualified to explain it (but here I go). THey need to get it tested in ZZ, then they can land it in 16.10 and backport it to 16.04. You will need to enable the backports PPA for 16.04 when it lands there.
[18:23] <Meodudlye> anyone knows how to install pepperflash for 16.10 ? It´ s broken and flash videos don´ t play
[18:39] <marco-parillo> Meodudlye: I know this is not the best answer, but my strategy is to simply install Google Chrome. Then, for sites that I trust, where I really want to see flash, I just open them in Chrome. I actually prefer that flash does not load for 99% of my web browsing.
 @Kai Sen, I rebooted and now everything works fine. thx!
[18:47] <Meodudlye> marco-parillo: true, that´ s probably the best solution
[19:14] <est31> after the update to 16.10 my firefox looks weird
[19:14] <est31> any ideas why that is the case?
[19:28] <acheronuk> est31: Firefox 49 doesn't have complete support for GTK 3.20 theming. Firefox 50 will sort that when it's released
[19:28] <est31> awesome.
[19:29] <est31> acheronuk, in the past I could play around with GTK themes in the settings dialog, was that removed or just moved?
[19:35] <acheronuk> est31: if you have kde-config-gtk-style installed it should show in the systemsettings under application style
[19:38] <est31> acheronuk, yes thank you that did it
[19:39] <user|23921> Hello there! I have a little Problem ... my kubunt still is on 16.04 and i do not know how to update it manually !
[19:41] <user|23921> also it wont update by itself
[19:42] <est31> user|23921, edit /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades
[19:43] <est31> change lts to normal
[19:43] <user|23921> And what will i edit ?
[19:43] <user|23921> ok
[19:45] <acheronuk> update 16.04 or upgrade to 16.10? big difference between those two
[19:45] <user|23921> This is show to me
[19:45] <user|23921> # Default behavior for the release upgrader.
[19:45] <user|23921> [DEFAULT]
[19:45] <user|23921> # Default prompting behavior, valid options:
[19:45] <user|23921> #
[19:45] <user|23921> I want to update to 16.10 and have 16.04
[19:46] <acheronuk> user|23921: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/YakketyUpgrades/Kubuntu
[19:46] <user|23921> My Pc is lagging...
[19:46] <user|23921> bye
 @Kai Sen, Was left off the iso as it's kde4 dependancies messed up the iso building
[20:06] <Guest4395> can kubuntu do audio over bluetooth say from my phone?
 @Kai Sen, By default? when the okukar KDE maintainers finsih their kf5/Qt5 port, yes. they are just being slow on the progress with that
 @Kai Sen, okular should work if installed after you have installed the main system
[21:24] <honeybadger13_> Is there a way to make plasma use the default pidgin systray icons? I'm not sure if it's just me but those new ones (green silouette for online, purple for new message etc...) don't really work for me as I'm used to something _very_ orange in systray when new message comes ...