[12:12] <jbailey> mdke: He's in .nz
[01:10] <prawcess> If anyone is active in here, I have a documentation question
[06:04] <Burglaptop> hey all, sorry I missed the meeting, I had not internet at home
[06:05] <ajmitch> hi
[06:07] <Burglaptop> was most frustrating to have to internet at home
[06:07] <ajmitch> how are you, anyway?
[06:07] <Burglaptop> busy, and had a major blowout with my father
[06:07] <ajmitch> ouch
[06:08] <Burglaptop> but now relaxing with my GF at her house
[06:10] <Burglaptop> he just got back from SA, couldn't understand why I wouldn't want to work for a company that has software patents and creates non-free software
[06:28] <jsg_sfd> hey guys
[06:31] <Madpilot> hi all
[06:32] <Madpilot> did the meeting happen this morning?
[06:33] <jsgotangco> sure
[06:33] <jsgotangco> see emails
[06:33] <Madpilot> where are the logs for -meeting kept?
[06:35] <jsgotangco> err
[06:35] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[06:35] <robitaille> http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/
[06:35] <jsgotangco> people.ubuntu.com/~fabionne
[06:35] <Madpilot> thanks
[06:41] <jsgotangco> ahhh
[06:41] <jsgotangco> its nice to be back in school
[06:41] <jsgotangco> (im in an sfd celebration)
[06:42] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[06:42] <jsgotangco> xorg update
[06:42] <jsgotangco> reboot
[06:50] <BurgLaptop> jsgotangco, so I got sponsored
[06:51] <jsgotangco> good for you
[06:51] <Madpilot> BurgLaptop: good to hear! anyone else from DocTeam going to make it?
[06:52] <BurgLaptop> jsgotangco, did you get funded?
[06:52] <jsgotangco> no
[06:52] <BurgLaptop> mdke cannot get time off, robitaille likewise
[06:52] <jsgotangco> me an ajmitch will start swimming tommorow
[06:52] <BurgLaptop> rob didn't apply
[06:52] <BurgLaptop> which leaves it down to me
[06:52] <jsgotangco> you're the only docteam core
[06:52] <jsgotangco> and jbailey
[06:54] <BurgLaptop> jsgotangco, sorry I couldn't make the meeting, no internet at my house
[06:54] <jsgotangco> its ok
[06:54] <jsgotangco> i wasn't really much enthusiastic about the meeting either
[06:54] <jsgotangco> wasn't a good day
[06:54] <BurgLaptop> ya, just read the log
[06:55] <jsgotangco> 2 of my cousins died in new orleans
[06:55] <BurgLaptop> ouch
[06:55] <BurgLaptop> were they able to get out in time?
[06:55] <jsgotangco> they're kids
[06:55] <BurgLaptop> s/not able/
[06:55] <BurgLaptop> that is even worse
[06:55] <jsgotangco> ya
[06:55] <jsgotangco> my uncle is ok but is not speaking
[06:56] <jsgotangco> my dad is with him atm
[06:56] <jsgotangco> well anyways
[06:56] <jsgotangco> i just left last night for some beers and when i came back online, everything was chaos
[06:57] <BurgLaptop> oh?
[06:57] <jsgotangco> yeah
[06:57] <BurgLaptop> I heard about the xml issue
[06:58] <BurgLaptop> what is the web address of the svn repo again?
[06:58] <Madpilot> http://doc.ubuntu.com/gnome/quicktour/quicktour.html  - and back & down from there
[06:58] <BurgLaptop> not the built one, the actual repo
[06:59] <Madpilot> ah, sorry. check the wiki, I set it up once and forgot about it...
[07:01] <Madpilot> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamRepository <-- BurgLaptop
[07:01] <BurgLaptop> ya, got it
[07:02] <BurgLaptop> just figuring out if the latest stuff I did got committed
[07:02] <BurgLaptop> it did, but the rebuild didn't work
[07:02] <BurgLaptop> mdke, for some reason the quicktour is not being rebuilt on doc.ubuntu
[07:03] <BurgLaptop> http://gobby.0x539.de/screenshots.html
[07:03] <BurgLaptop> that is very cool
[07:12] <Madpilot> You know, I just noticed that UserDocumentation has no links to any of the actual hardware pages, or any of the laptop pages...
[07:13] <BurgLaptop> hmm
[07:13] <BurgLaptop> that might be a bug
[07:13] <BurgLaptop> I haven't done anything on the wiki is a month or so
[07:14] <Madpilot> I'm going to do some editing on UserDocs in a minute - which is the best, most newbie-friendly "will my laptop work" page to link to?
[07:16] <BurgLaptop> HardwareSupport
[07:16] <Madpilot> thnx
[07:17] <Madpilot> I'd also forgotten that there is an entire CategoryHardware...
[07:40] <Madpilot> hmmm... half the pages on HardwareSupport don't seem to be listed in CategoryHardware... nice bug...
[08:09] <robitaille> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WhyIDontUbuntu    off course if you are really avoiding Ubuntu, you're most likely not going to discover that wiki page :)
[08:10] <Madpilot> I wondered about that one... ;)
[08:11] <Madpilot> I'm going berzerk thru the Hardware pages - lots of quick fixes & categorization, mostly
[08:34] <Madpilot> OK, berserking thru Hardware is done. firing all that stuff into RecentChanges might get some other ppl working on that stuff!
[08:58] <Madpilot> robitaille: your "help the printers" blog post has been good - there's about twice the # of printers there now, compared to before your post
[09:00] <robitaille> yeah I saw that.....my desktop main hard drive decided to switch to read-only mode a few minutes ago.  Probably not a good sign for the hardware...
[09:04] <Madpilot> robitaille: yikes. Time to start burning backup CDs, or rig a connection to your laptop!
[09:10] <robitaille> that's what I'm doing.  last full backups were 6 days ago.  But I managed to copy home directories to the laptop to get the recent changes.  Now I'm rebooting with thelive Cd to see what's going with that 4-year old HD
[09:15] <robitaille> interesting.  No error on the drive.  kernel bug?  motherboard problem?   humm...
[09:16] <robitaille> I'm a bit paranoid with backups; especially since we gota digital camera, and pictures are going on that computers; multiple backups; off site copies, etc. I don't trust technology
[09:26] <robitaille> nope...my drive seem to have died.  I guess there goes part of my Saturday to rebuild that machine :(
[09:27] <Madpilot> well, that sucketh mightily. how much data have you (likely) lost?
[09:34] <robitaille> none really.  if the backups work of course.  I guess my breezy test partition isn't backup, that's about it.    It's kind of nice to have the laptop has a 2nd computer in the house
[09:45] <robitaille> well, the drive is alive now after a long fsck session.  Ironically, most (all?) errors found where in my svn directory of the ubuntu-docs :)
[09:45] <robitaille> but I'm not sure I really trust it anymore...
[09:46] <Madpilot> yeah, I've got two 4-5yr old drives beside my desk in the same state - I think they work, but no way am I trusting them with data again...
[09:57] <Madpilot> robitaille: did Corey tell you he's giving a talk @ VLUG this coming Tuesday night? On Ubuntu, of course
[09:58] <robitaille> he sent an email to the ubuntu-ca list about it :)
[09:58] <Madpilot> I guess I should get myself on that list sometime soon...
[09:59] <robitaille> very high traffic...3 emails in September
[09:59] <Madpilot> I think I can handle that... ;)
[09:59] <robitaille> including the one by your brother
[10:12] <mdke> hi all
[10:12] <mdke> nice one burgs on sponsorship
[10:12] <jsgotangco> nice
[10:12] <jsgotangco> man i just finished speaking to 200 people
[10:12] <jsgotangco> im still at the avr
[10:13] <jsgotangco> heh
[10:13] <jsgotangco> hey mdke
[10:13] <mdke> :)
[10:13] <mdke> how did it go?
[10:13] <jsgotangco> oh it was fun
[10:14] <jsgotangco> public speaking is a talent of mine
[10:14] <jsgotangco> so far sfd here is going great
[10:15] <ajmitch> hey jsgotangco
[10:15] <ajmitch> good to hear it's going well
[10:16] <mdke> nice one matey
[10:16] <mdke> there are none here
[10:19] <mdke> now then
[10:19] <jsgotangco> thats strange
[10:19] <mdke> should I make some pots for any kubuntu docs?
[10:19] <jsgotangco> mdke, i'm much better now compared last night
[10:20] <jsgotangco> hey ajmitch
[10:20] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: great :)
[10:20] <jsgotangco> ajmitch, want to start swimming tommorow/
[10:20] <mdke> good man
[10:20] <ajmitch> sure
[10:20] <ajmitch> I found it'd cost me $3000NZ to fly to toronto & back
[10:20] <jsgotangco> ackkk
[10:20] <ajmitch> so swimming should get me fit by the time we reach montreal
[10:21] <mdke> my god
[10:21] <ajmitch> through panama & up the east coast, then? ;)
[10:21] <mdke> there must be a cheaper way than that
[10:21] <ajmitch> mdke: hardly
[10:21] <mdke> gosh
[10:21] <ajmitch> I live in New Zealand
[10:21] <Madpilot> ajmitch: and Toronto is still another flight away from Montreal...
[10:21] <ajmitch> Madpilot: I know, but the website didn't let me select montreal
[10:21] <jsgotangco> if we ride a boat, it would be cheaper
[10:21] <mdke> even so, 3000 bucks is a lot
[10:21] <ajmitch> mdke: certainly
[10:21] <ajmitch> that's a months wages, before tax
[10:21] <jsgotangco> oh well...
[10:21] <jsgotangco> yeah
[10:22] <jsgotangco> Corey Burger will uphold the Dokteam kause
[10:22] <mdke> ok so my question?
[10:22] <mdke> should I make some pots for any kubuntu docs?
[10:22] <jsgotangco> no
[10:22] <jsgotangco> its sooo spotty
[10:23] <jsgotangco> i pimped the idea to riddle to  add the doks later
[10:23] <jsgotangco> and let me polish it up first
[10:23] <mdke> k
[10:24] <mdke> bbl
[10:24] <ajmitch> so what can someone like me help with?
[10:24] <jsgotangco> ajmitch, the admin guide
[10:25] <jsgotangco> for breezy +1
[10:25] <ajmitch> ok, has that been started?
[10:25] <jsgotangco> just a draft
[10:25] <jsgotangco> not much content, just a TOC
[10:25] <ajmitch> better than nothing
[10:26] <ajmitch> admin from what perspective? sysadmin & a bunch of desktops, or server admin?
[10:26] <jsgotangco> sure
[10:26] <jsgotangco> sysadmin, server admin
[10:27] <jsgotangco> hmm why is it "Add Applications" in the Applications menu again?
[10:28] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: sabdfl wanted it back in
[10:28] <ajmitch> I saw him asking seb128 for it
[10:28] <jsgotangco> on that area???
[10:28] <jsgotangco> what a sucky place to put it
[10:28] <jsgotangco> although in a new user mind set, that's a wow
[10:28] <ajmitch> the new add applications util does look much nicer, too
[10:29] <ajmitch> a bit of a mess on my box
[10:29] <jsgotangco> hmmm Terminal is an accessory
[10:29] <jsgotangco> oh well
[10:29] <jsgotangco> heh
[10:30] <ajmitch> so much junk in this menu here :)
[10:44] <jsgotangco> mdke, ping?
[02:59] <jsgotangco> hi all
[03:32] <jbailey> jsgotangco: Hi. =)
[03:34] <jsgotangco> hi jbailey sorry about last night
[03:41] <jsgotangco> jbailey: you mind if i add mdz's email announcement on Breezy Preview as part of relase notes?
[03:41] <jsgotangco> (the technical stuff anyways)
[03:46] <mdke> sounds like a plan
[03:46] <jbailey> jsgotangco: No worries.
[03:46] <jbailey> Why would I mind?
[03:46] <jsgotangco> you started the wiki page
[03:47] <jbailey> Sure, but it's intended to be a palce where people can put things, we just didn't have a better forum.
[03:47] <jbailey> Reminds me that it should get announced to ubuntu-devel
[03:47] <mdke> i might do a hoary->breezy this coming week so I'll be happy to help out a bit with releasenotes
[03:47] <jbailey> Sweet.
[03:47] <jsgotangco> i'll do some stuff on BreezyReleaseNotes now
[03:47] <jbailey> jsgotangco: Thanks!
[03:47] <mdke> cool
[03:48] <mdke> jsgotangco, we can integrate it into the xml version at a later stage
[03:48] <jsgotangco> yes of course
[03:48] <jsgotangco> shouldn't be difficult
[03:48] <jbailey> Maybe make a note in the XML as to the date that you've copied the stuff from the wiki page?
[03:48] <jsgotangco> we'll need devel help in a few weeks to get the known issues
[03:48] <jbailey> Then you can use the revision control stuff in the wiki to figure out what  needs to be moved over.
[03:49] <mdke> good plan
[03:49] <jsgotangco> ok i'll just dump stuff first
[03:49] <jsgotangco> and announce to list
[03:49] <mdke> i still have really disappointing fonts on both my breezy systems
[03:49] <jsgotangco> that good?
[03:49] <mdke> yeah
[03:49] <jsgotangco> argghh
[03:50] <jsgotangco> i gave out a copy of breezy preview to some peers this afternoon and they seem to be teary-eyed
[03:50] <jsgotangco> heh
[03:50] <jsgotangco> we gave out a hundred ubuntu cds
[03:50] <jsgotangco> probably twice on the opencd
[03:50] <mdke> nice
[03:51] <jbailey> Is teary-eyed a good thing?
[03:51] <jsgotangco> yeah
[03:51] <jsgotangco> heh
[03:51] <jbailey> Oh good. =)
[03:51] <jsgotangco> i asked a copy of linspire though
[03:54] <mdke> s/asked/burnt?
[03:54] <jsgotangco> yes
[04:42] <jsgotangco> mdke: ping?
[05:19] <jsgotangco> jbailey: ping?
[05:20] <jbailey> jsgotangco: Heya
[05:24] <jsgotangco> jbailey: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BreezyReleaseNotes
[05:24] <jsgotangco> jbailey: just make a quick run through and i'll send to ubuntu-doc and ubuntu-devel later
[05:32] <jbailey> Grammar nit, I think:
[05:32] <jbailey> We hope you enjoy Ubuntu 5.10: The Breezy Badger release.
[05:32] <jbailey> Should probably be:
[05:32] <jbailey> We hope you enjoy the release of Ubuntu 5.10: The Breezy Badger
[05:32] <jbailey> or something like that.
[05:32] <jbailey> I don't think the word 'release' is part of the codename.
[05:32] <jsgotangco> ahh
[05:32] <jsgotangco> right
[05:32] <jsgotangco> everything is still draft anwyays
[05:33] <jbailey> The bug filing should probably  include a note about malone as well as bugzilla.  I don't know how to make that clear, though.
[05:33] <jbailey> (Since I get it wrong on occasion...)
[05:33] <jsgotangco> im told that main bugs go to bugzilla
[05:33] <jsgotangco> (should)
[05:33] <jbailey> Right
[05:33] <jsgotangco> and universe/everything else to malone
[05:33] <jbailey> But does the user know what that means?
[05:34] <jsgotangco> i always subscribe to the thought that we should only limit to main
[05:34] <jbailey> 'k
[05:34] <jbailey> I haven't through it through.
[05:34] <jsgotangco> i'll send to list later and call for help
[05:34] <jsgotangco> i'll limit it to ubuntu-doc first
[05:35] <jsgotangco> then once the others start editing it up, we'll open it to devel'
[05:35] <jsgotangco> what you think
[05:35] <jsgotangco> ?
[05:35] <jbailey> But this generally looks good.  You're awesome. =)
[05:35] <jbailey> Yes.
[05:35] <jsgotangco> nahh
[05:35] <jbailey> We need developers to start making notes soonish.
[05:35] <jbailey> Esp if we want to have any hopes of getting this translated.
[05:36] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[05:37] <jsgotangco> ok i'll announce the draft wiki to devel in 2 days im sure there will be edits by then
[05:37] <jbailey> Cool.
[05:38] <Liz> good job guys
[05:38] <Liz> nite
[05:38] <jsgotangco> nite
[05:38] <jsgotangco> Liz
[05:41] <jsgotangco> heh im just doing a pattern with how luis did the 2.12 notes
[05:41] <jsgotangco> or was it murray
[05:41] <jsgotangco> hmm
[05:51] <_pir> helo
[05:51] <_pir> any one here can help?..
[05:51] <_pir> How do I disable all the support to MS network neighborhood ?
[05:53] <highvoltage>  just use nfs?
[05:53] <jsgotangco> in a pure nix environment, nfs is your answer
[05:54] <_pir> I just need pure TCP-IP , and that's it...
[05:56] <_pir> is ther any "network client " (like in windows ) that is sharing something in my computer?
[05:56] <jsgotangco> none
[05:56] <_pir> or samba client that can be disabled?
[05:56] <jsgotangco> just remove it if you don't need it
[05:56] <jsgotangco> its just added there because most poeple need it
[05:57] <jsgotangco> but nothing is shared by default if you mean like the hidden admin shares of a windows box
[05:57] <_pir> ok, how do I remove the samba client...
[05:58] <jsgotangco> _pir: this isn't a support channel but just remove smb-client or what package is that i don't even remember
[05:58] <_pir> ah...
[05:58] <_pir> is there any support channel?
[05:59] <jsgotangco> better ask #ubuntu
[05:59] <_pir> thanks.
[07:42] <karlheg> initramfs-tools: I've some patches soon; can they get into it in time?
[07:42] <karlheg> One change in particular: the scripts in /etc/mkinitramfs/ are not getting copied to the initramfs right now.  I want to make that happen, plus move them to /etc/mkinitramfs/scripts/*.
[07:43] <karlheg> I've learned a few things by using it and setting up some special stuff for my laptop; it requires 855resolution be run, for instance, to get full resolution from the LCD, since the BIOS does not have the mode it needs and Xorg won't go that high without the hack.  It must be run in initramfs prior to resume from suspend.
[07:44] <karlheg> I've got some WIP that I can email soon; hopefully by the end of the day.
[07:47] <jbailey> karlheg: Sure.  What can be accepted depends on the change.  The only featurish thing I can accept is evms or cryptroot fixes (since those are really regressions against Hoary), and the evms part I have basically done.
[07:47] <jbailey> The scripts not being copied sounds like a bug, I'd love to see that.
[07:47] <jbailey> I don't know what 855resolution is.
[07:47] <karlheg> Another thing is that when a script is named with a '-' character in it, the dependancy stuff bombs with:
[07:48] <karlheg> eval: 1: array_lucgm-mtrr-hack=: not found
[07:48] <karlheg> (etc)
[07:48] <karlheg> PANIC: Circular Dependancy ...   I will try and fix that today.  It's next up.
[07:49] <karlheg> If the scripts are named with '_' instead, it works fine.
[07:50] <karlheg> I think there's got to be a fail-safe like in MSDOS / Windows 98 where you can say yes or no to each of those scripts or something.
[07:50] <karlheg> Maybe I can implement that.
[07:50] <karlheg> Also, I want to s/version/VERSION/g for the exported variable.  I will look at the scripts that are already out there to see if it's used much yet.
[07:51] <jbailey> We can't easily change the variable names at this point.
[07:51] <jbailey> LTSP might depend on it, and it's a maze of stuff.
[07:51] <karlheg> If so, then I'll export both for now or something.  I noticed that at least one script that is there does not use 'copy_exec', but instead uses 'install -D'.  It happens to work since the libc is all it depends on, but really should use the interface function.
[07:52] <jbailey> The failsafe really ought always to work, I'd love to see patches for that.
[07:52] <karlheg> I'll grab a copy and check it, plus network with them to see if they need anything else.
[07:52] <jbailey> Yup, some of the scripts were written as I was developping some of those hooks, so... =)
[07:52] <jbailey> Updates to those would be lovely.
[07:52] <karlheg> :-)
[07:52] <jbailey> I need to write a HACKING document for initramfs-tools.
[07:53] <jbailey> And maximillian said he had a manpage for me for initramfs.conf(8)
[07:53] <jbailey> So I should poke him for that.
[07:53] <karlheg> Well, anything that uses it ought to Depend on initramfs-tools, so I should be able to get a list of packages to be checked over.
[07:53] <jbailey> I've also got a new tool update-initramfs  that's used for updating them when usplash and other things are installed.
[07:53] <karlheg> Great!
[07:54] <karlheg> I reinstalled my laptop to get past the Breezy Xorg breakage.  I installed Hoary and did an upgrade.  It worked perfectly.
[07:54] <jbailey> Nice!
[07:54] <jbailey> I'm just doing my wife's machine atm.
[07:55] <karlheg> ... except for the problems due to hardware eccentricities... this box does not work right with HIGHMEM support enabled; I have to hack the MTRR to get it working, since for some reason it comes up with all caching off.
[07:55] <karlheg> It works fine with the 1GLOWMEM patch; makes the entire first Gb be lowmem.
[07:55] <karlheg> But that's not right in the general case.
[07:57] <sladen> jbailey: excellent!
[07:58] <sladen> jbailey: how does that work btw?  How are you selecting which kernels to rebuild for?
[08:02] <karlheg> It's a simple script that uses 'echo' to reset /proc/mtrr from init-top.
[08:02] <karlheg> I've not rebuilt any kernels yet; the 1glowmem patch is out there; it's ultra simple.
[08:03] <jbailey> sladen: I will by default rebuild the current one, pointed to by the /vmlinu[xz]  symlink
[08:04] <jbailey> sladen: If the symlink is not present, I will rebuild the highest versioned one.
[08:04] <jbailey> sladen: There are two tests:
[08:04] <jbailey> 1) This utilty must have made the initramfs originally.
[08:04] <jbailey> 2) The initramfs must not have changed since.
[08:12] <sladen> yup, that makes sense as long;  as don't have a problem boot-strapping the initramfs in the first place
[08:13] <sladen> jbailey: would it makes sense it allow it to take a parameter;  and check whether stdin is a TTY so that it can warn the user and provider a hint along with available kernels
[08:15] <jbailey> Warn them of what?
[08:15] <jbailey> That it's being regenerated?
[08:18] <karlheg> bbl; girlfriend conversation... Will be free to work again soon.
[09:11] <karlheg> Back.
[09:11] <karlheg> So for test #2 there, perhaps the mkinitramfs ought to put an identifier stamp file into the image?
[09:12] <karlheg> If it's the first file of the cpio somehow, perhaps it can be "magic number", iff gzip will give deterministic result... ?
[09:13] <karlheg> That implies using a library rather than the cpio tool, perhaps, or to generate the cpio via a 'find' command that elides the special file, including it "by hand" as the first file, prior to the 'find' list?
[10:00] <BurgLaptop> mdke, ping
[10:13] <jbailey> karlheg: For test #2, I just store a sha1sum in /var/lib/initramfs-tools
[10:13] <jbailey> karlheg: Far less hassle.
[10:15] <karlheg> Ah, ok, so done at mkinitramfs time; right.
[10:15] <karlheg> Is Matthew Garrett here?
[10:15] <karlheg> Do you know his IRC handle?
[10:16] <jbailey> mjg59, and he's not here.
[10:16] <jbailey> Why?
[10:16] <karlheg> found him in #ubuntu-devel.
[10:16] <karlheg> (see you there)
[10:33] <mdke> BurgLaptop, ?
[10:35] <BurgLaptop> mdke, the doc.ubuntu quicktour doesn
[10:35] <BurgLaptop> 't seem to have built fromt he latest svn
[10:36] <mdke> oh shit yes
[10:36] <mdke> the reason is that the makefile is not properly sorted
[10:36] <mdke> it should remove the build/quicktour files before copying them over
[10:37] <mdke> but I didn't know how to do it so I didn't set that
[10:37] <BurgLaptop> ah, ok
[10:37] <mdke> maybe have a word with jeffsch?
[10:37] <BurgLaptop> ok
[10:37] <mdke> sorry about that :/
[10:38] <BurgLaptop> not a major issue right now
[10:39] <mdke> k
[10:39] <mdke> i'll do it manually whenever i can
[10:39] <mdke> gtg
[10:40] <BurgLaptop> ok
[10:54] <BurgLaptop> salut robitaille
[10:56] <robitaille> bonjour BurgLaptop


[18:36] <cmaloney> Good morning
[18:50] <brousch> No
[18:57] <jrwren> Good afternoon
[19:02] <notlikethesoup> afternoon
[19:08] <cmaloney> where?
[22:10] <Scary_Guy> evening?
[22:32] <cmaloney> maybe


[00:18] <mup> Bug #1605794 changed: [2.0] migration error <MAAS:Fix Released by andreserl> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1605794>
[00:24] <mup> Bug #1605794 opened: [2.0] migration error <MAAS:Fix Released by andreserl> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1605794>
[00:30] <mup> Bug #1605794 changed: [2.0] migration error <MAAS:Fix Released by andreserl> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1605794>
[02:03] <AK> Heyllo
[03:48] <godleon> Hi all, is there any way to flush maas's DHCP address pool, I found the ip range I configured on maas was almost run out of after deploying OpenStack many times.
[05:08] <x58> godleon: When you destroy your openstack (I assume a JuJu charm installation) it should automatically clear out all of the entries and start back over from the beginning.
[05:41] <siva> roaksoax: Thank you Roaksoax
[07:31] <godleon> x58: no.... actually maas(I am using version 1.93) did not do that. So once the ip  was ran out of, I have to reinstall maas for my next deployment.
[07:56] <jo__> Hello, does anyone know if maas can be used for deploying Ubuntu desktops? I'm looking for something to do what PXE/kickstart does nicely for building CentOS desktops. I'm looking into maas and fai as options.


[00:03] <ChmEarl> to build qemu-7 in focal, I plan to backport meson-0.61.x from Jammy
[00:08] <ChmEarl> need meson >= v0.59.3
[19:52] <sdeziel> open-vm-tools is normally in main, except for the focal-updates version that comes from universe. Anyone knows why that is?


[01:31] <Hellow> Could someone mark bug #543851 as wishlist, please?
[01:31] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 543851 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-173 (Ubuntu) "New upstream 173.14.25 available (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543851
[02:28] <nigelb> micahg: got any new mails on bug squad ML?
[02:28] <micahg> nigelb: yours
[02:29] <nigelb> micahg: phew :)  I didnt get the confirmation mail.  got worried it got lost
[05:45] <mwhudson> apologies if this is not the place to ask this
[05:45] <mwhudson> but this bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/377598 is still affecting me in lucid
[05:45] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 377598 in linux (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "[i945gm] Video corruption when disabling internal monitor (affects: 5)" [High,Confirmed]
[05:46] <mwhudson> even though it's fix released for xf86-video-intel
[05:46] <Damascene> hello, I wonder why mozilla-plugins-gnash isn't a dependences of gnash?
[05:46] <kklimonda> Damascene: because gnash can be used as a standalone application afair
[05:48] <Damascene> so someone thinks that people installing gnash may not use it with firefox?!!
[05:48] <Damascene> is there a bug about that or I might file one?
[05:51] <kklimonda> Damascene: people who want to use it with firefox should install firefox plugin
[05:52] <Damascene> what if some one doens't think so? might he file a bug?
[05:53] <kklimonda> Damascene: and what is your reasoning?
[05:54] <persia> mwhudson: There's two tasks in that bug: looks like the kernel portion isn't resolved yet.  Are you sure you're still seeing issues in the X driver?
[05:54] <mwhudson> persia: i'm running a kernel newer than that linked in the freedesktop.org bug report
[05:54] <mwhudson> i thnk
[05:54] <Damascene> I think 99% of people download flash player is for web
[05:55] <mwhudson> hm, maybe not
[05:55] <persia> mwhudson: Ah, you reopened it (I've just gotten through the log).
[05:56] <mwhudson> i don't think i touched the status did i?
[05:57] <persia> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/377598/+activity claims you did (about 6 weeks ago) or else I'm confused.
[05:57] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 377598 in linux (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "[i945gm] Video corruption when disabling internal monitor (affects: 5)" [High,Confirmed]
[05:58] <mwhudson> persia: oh yeah, so i did
[05:58] <mwhudson> i'm not sure i meant to though...
[05:59] <Damascene> kklimonda, ?
[06:00] <persia> mwhudson: I think the change was correct.  Try catching someone in #ubuntu-kernel (early in your morning Tues-Sat is likely best), and see what information you can provide to help them investigate further.
[06:00] <mwhudson> persia: ok
[06:00] <mwhudson> persia: thanks
[06:00] <kklimonda> Damascene: you may fill the bug but I don't think it's something that should be fixed - there are two plugins and gnash is the name of the standalone application
[06:01]  * persia would support wontfixing that : the firefox plugins *should* be installed separately.
[06:01] <persia> I believe there's even a helper tool installed by default that tries to install packaged plugins by preference (although this may be buggy)
[06:02] <Damascene> if we install adobe flash player doesn't it comes with a plugin in firefox or people are using it for other perpse
[06:02] <Damascene> *purpose
[06:03] <Damascene> I think then we should file a bug against adobe flash player installing a plug in firefox by default. right?
[06:03] <persia> I think that Adobe sticks everything in one package (standalone and plugin).  I don't happen to think this is best practice.  As the Adobe packages aren't controlled by us, we can't fix that bug.
[06:03] <persia> Damascene: We can't : there's no bug tracker for the Adobe packages, but I agree it would be nice to do so.
[06:06] <Damascene> if some one reported that to Adobe. they well think he is mad without doubt
[06:09] <persia> Why?
[06:09] <persia> Adobe certainly endorses the use of flash in contexts other than browsers.
[06:10] <Damascene> do you know any one who do so? me. no
[06:11] <persia> Actually, I do.
[06:12] <persia> Lots of folks use flash for demos of various sorts.
[06:12] <persia> I even use flash as the default interface for my smallest handheld.
[06:12] <Damascene> but not the majority for sure
[06:13] <persia> But is that because of this bug, or is this bug not important because of that?
[06:16] <Damascene> why we don't file it against gnash and ask them to include it in their package as adobe do?
[06:17] <Damascene> persia, it's a bug for me
[06:17] <persia> I believe gnash has the correct behaviour and adobe doesn't.
[06:17] <persia> I believe filing a bug against gnash would be precisely the wrong thing to do.
[06:18] <Damascene> I heard "it's ubuntu's choice to package them separately"
[06:20] <Damascene> you might install vlc without needing to use it with firefox but not a flash player for most user. any way I've had enough of that. maybe I'll file a bug or I might not. I'll think about it later
[06:21] <kklimonda> Damascene: but as there are valid use cases for having a standalone flash player and not plugin you would have to rename gnash -> gnash-player and mozilla-plugin-gnash -> gnash. and then what about konqueror plugin?
[06:21] <persia> Damascene: I don't see any supporting evidence of that being an Ubuntu-specific choice.  The lack of recommends or depends matches Debian.
[06:24] <Damascene> maybe this attitude against gnash because it has many weaknesses and it is not used by many people. I agree on that
[06:26] <kklimonda> right, we believe that it's unsuitable for users and are making it hard to install both gnash and swfdec on purpose. That's why we use alternatives system so people can have all 3 plugins installed at the same time.. oh, wait..
[06:27] <Damascene> good you mentioned swfdec. I've installed the "swfdec-mozilla" but there was no change in firefox. is it a bug?
[06:27] <kklimonda> no idea
[06:28] <kklimonda> well, it's probably a bug if it doesn't work
[06:28] <Damascene> thanks for letting me have this nice conversation
[06:30] <Damascene> we are serving the community. trying to find what is the best. and I agree gnash doesn't look like a flash player for web browser right now
[06:30] <persia> On the other hand, gnash is *way better* as an integrated component.  Adobe doesn't expose their libraries well without special licensing.
[08:32] <BUGabundo_remote> morning
[09:17] <Akos> hi everyone
[09:19] <Akos> is there a channel for ubuntu-server specific bugs, or this is the right place for it?
[09:22] <andol> Akos: Well, there is the channel #ubuntu-server, even if it's not really specific to handling bugs. I guess this channel is a good general choice no matter, but with #ubuntu-server as a second choice in case the bugs involves som rather techinal server issues. kind of.
[09:24] <Akos> i dropped this question beacause i'd triage some bugs, just so i know where to bring the discussion (:
[09:25] <andol> Akos: Well, feel free to begin here then :)
[09:26] <Akos> andol: thank you (:
[09:31] <persia> Akos: Just to add another opinion: this is the correct channel for triaging bugs: #ubuntu-server for coordinating development and support.
[09:32] <Akos> okay, this makes more sence then. I shall stick around here. Too many channels confuse me (parting from #ubuntu-server )
[11:00] <chrisccoulson> does anyone speak czech here?
[12:17] <cjwatson> can anyone reproduce the infinite loop in bug 540579?
[12:35] <bcurtiswx_> hmm.. my computer has a light that comes on when my computer sees it's plugged in.. yet right now ubuntu shows my battery is discharging....??
[12:36] <bcurtiswx_> computer = laptop
[13:26] <vish> pedro_: hi.. got a min? could you have a look at Bug #527569 ? I have evolution frozen atm , i'v tried to attach and got a backtrace
[13:26] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 527569 in evolution (Ubuntu) "Evolution freezes often [evolution crashed with SIGSEGV in __kernel_vsyscall() ] (affects: 2)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/527569
[13:27] <pedro_> vish, yup, let me have a look , one sec
[13:27] <vish> it already has a backtrace the first one i started evolution /in/ gdb
[13:29] <vish> the second one i used (gdb) attach , but when i tried the Ctrl+c it doesnt seem to work if the program was already running , so i just skipped the option and retrieved the bt
[13:30] <vish> wasnt sure if that was the right way [to skip continue], hence checking :)
[13:33] <greg-g> ugh
[13:35] <pedro_> vish, could you get another one? the first one seems better but is missing a few symbols
[13:35] <Pici> again
[13:36] <pedro_> vish, install the dbg packages for the libraries which are having a ?? as a symbol like:
[13:36] <pedro_> ?? () from /usr/lib/evolution-data-server-1.2/camel-providers/libcamelpop3.so
[13:36] <BlackZ> hey pedro_ ! how are you ?
[13:36] <vish> pedro_: evolution is frozen now , so i can use the attach , but would an install now help?
[13:37] <pedro_> vish, nope, you need to run the program again if you installed the dbg packages after the execution of that program
[13:37] <vish> pedro_: ok , will do that..  thanks
[13:38] <pedro_> vish, you're welcome, just ping me if you need help with the backtrace
[13:39] <vish> pedro_: the only problem is , if i try to do a (gdb) continue and then try Ctrl+c  for an already frozen program , it doesnt end the program , is skipping the continue ok [if the program is already frozen]?
[13:42] <pedro_> vish, if the process is hanged and you attach gdb to it, it should (the vast majority of the programs) show you  the backtrace and there's no need to use continue/ctr+c method
[13:43] <pedro_> vish, but since you can reproduce it easily, run it under gdb and wait for the issue to appear then attach that log
[13:43] <vish> ok. neat , thanks..
[13:44] <pedro_> vish, also , are you getting any evolution-data-server crash/hang ?
[13:44] <pedro_> vish, could you check using the same method and attach that output to the report as well?
[13:45] <vish> pedro_: havent noticed the evo-data-sever causing problems , only the evolution is frozen
[14:16] <nigelb> chrisccoulson: I had pinged you about 2 bugs last night, did you see them?
[14:17] <chrisccoulson> nigelb - yes, thanks
[14:17] <nigelb> chrisccoulson: gpm upstream comments were a bit harsh :(
[14:18] <chrisccoulson> nigelb - yeah, they were fair though
[14:18] <nigelb> chrisccoulson: ubuntu had agreed to use their convention, but we have deviated this time though
[14:18] <chrisccoulson> we have a habit of making changes like this without discussing them with anyone, and GNOME has been string-frozen for ages too
[14:19] <nigelb> chrisccoulson: we'll be undoing?
[14:19] <chrisccoulson> i understand why hughsie is a bit annoyed with us
[14:19] <chrisccoulson> i think one of the changes was already undone
[14:19] <nigelb> oh, great :)
[14:19] <chrisccoulson> i think people proposing these changes at a distro-level often don't appreciate the effort involved
[14:20] <chrisccoulson> especially at this stage of the cycle. every time we change a string, it has to be translated again in every language
[14:20] <nigelb> I know, I was surprised that the change got uploaded (urm, you did I think)
[14:23] <Damascene> any one using vlc on lucid?   http://www.khayma.com/tajweed/taha/lameyatebnalqayem.mp3 causing white noise
[14:30] <cjwatson> chrisccoulson: I've been banging that drum at the installer level for years
[14:30] <cjwatson> so now I'm just really hard-arsed
[14:31] <chrisccoulson> cjwatson - yeah, it wouldn't have been so bad if the people proposing the changes did so a little bit earlier in the cycle
[14:31] <chrisccoulson> but they all landed on the day of UI freeze
[14:31] <cjwatson> freezes are like speed limits - they're a limit, not a target
[14:32] <chrisccoulson> and our UI freeze is already way past the GNOME string freeze
[14:32] <nigelb> cjwatson: the gpm upstream pretty much blasted me :(
[14:33] <chrisccoulson> nigelb, don't take it personally
[14:33] <chrisccoulson> i think he's upset with us in general
[14:33] <nigelb> chrisccoulson: I was in shock for like first few minutes ;)
[14:33] <nigelb> then I realized, I represented Ubuntu there, so he's just taking it out at Ubuntu
[14:46] <vish> pedro_: for > ?? () from /lib/libglib-2.0.so.0  which dbygsym should i install , i installed all these http://paste.ubuntu.com/399326/ , these were the ones i found having ?? in the last bt
[14:47] <vish> btw , this is the bt now> http://paste.ubuntu.com/399325/ , it only has ?? for  /lib/libglib-2.0.so.0
[14:48] <pedro_> vish, you installed the -cli (C# binding) instead of the one for that symbol
[14:48] <nigelb> vish: I think I figured out the solution to our troubles in the hook.  Should get some time to fix those today :)
[14:48] <pedro_> vish, the easier way to know which package to install is doing a : dpkg -S /lib/libglib-2.0.so.0
[14:48] <pedro_> vish, then install the -dbgsym package for the package the command returns to you
[14:48] <vish> pedro_: yeah , that[-cli] was the closest glib had , it didn have any other dbgsym
[14:49]  * vish looks again
[14:49] <vish> rather is was -cil-
[14:51] <pedro_> vish, if the -dbgsym is not available for you just install the -dbg one: libglib2.0-0-dbg
[14:52] <vish> right , thanks
[14:52] <pedro_> np
[14:57] <vish> heh , evo is being quite the prankster :/   now that i have the -dbg installed it doesnt want to crash :s
[15:28] <nigelb> vish: got some time for testing ;)
[15:30] <nigelb> vish: I think I have ironed out all the troubles.  ping me if you got the time
[15:47] <vish> nigelb: heading out now, will be back in a bit.. i'll ping you asap
[15:47] <nigelb> vish: k
[16:20] <nigelb> pedro_: how do we get the list of bugs for the hugday into the wiki? is there a tool?
[16:27] <yofel> nigelb: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/Organizing#Generate%20the%20bug%20list ?
[16:27] <nigelb> yofel: thank you :)
[17:01] <nigelb> bdmurray: is there a place I could see the source for the script that does the patch tagging and subscribing?
[17:02] <bdmurray> nigelb: No, not yet
[17:03] <nigelb> bdmurray: seems to subscribe reviewers when release team is subscribed for FFE
[17:03] <bdmurray> nigelb: what's the exact team name?
[17:04] <nigelb> bdmurray: ubuntu-release
[17:04] <bdmurray> nigelb: that's in there what is the bug number?
[17:04] <nigelb> bug 221332
[17:04] <ubot4`> nigelb: Bug 221332 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/221332 is private
[17:04]  * nigelb kicks ubot4`
[17:07] <bdmurray> nigelb: I'll have to do some digging to find out when ubuntu-release was subscribed vs when my script hit it.
[17:07] <nigelb> bdmurray: ah.  a small gap and the script hit it :)
[17:08] <bdmurray> nigelb: I'm not positive but if that is the case I think I'll increase the amount of time between script runs
[17:08] <bdmurray> since this has happened more than 1x
[17:08] <nigelb> we've been fighting against an active script :)
[17:09] <nigelb> never stays below 200 :D
[17:12] <alex_mayorga> hi! Just wondering if there's anything I can contribute to bug 543114
[17:12] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 543114 in gnome-screensaver (Ubuntu) "gnome-screensaver-gl-helper crashed with SIGSEGV in _fini() (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543114
[17:13] <alex_mayorga> or bug 94494
[17:13] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 94494 in debian (and 2 other projects) "[needs-packaging] Songbird (affects: 34) (dups: 3)" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/94494
[17:13] <nigelb> bdmurray: I need a merge of lp-gm-scripts some time this week to add a reviewers team icon, working on getting it done
[17:14] <bdmurray> nigelb: cool, that should be no problem
[17:14] <nigelb> bdmurray: thank you :)
[17:14] <nigelb> alex_mayorga: looking
[17:15] <alex_mayorga> nigelb: thanks!
[17:20] <nigelb> alex_mayorga: I made that bug private earlier, why did you make it public?
[17:21] <alex_mayorga> nigelb: why should it be private?
[17:21] <alex_mayorga> nigelb: out of ignorance I guess :(
[17:21] <nigelb> alex_mayorga: it has a coredump.gz, which can contain confidential information
[17:22] <alex_mayorga> nigelb: oh! sorry then
[17:22] <nigelb> alex_mayorga: apport retracer will remove it automatically and provide stack trace
[17:22] <nigelb> and then make it public
[17:22] <micahg> nigelb: no, the retracer will not necessarily make it public
[17:23] <nigelb> micahg: oh.  Didn't know.
[17:26] <hggdh> because the expanded backtrace *may* contain private data. A triager still has to go through it, and make the decision
[17:27] <nigelb> ah.
[17:29] <hggdh> what happens is the retracer does a 'bt full' -- the 'full' means dump variable contents
[17:31] <nigelb> which might contain private information
[17:38] <persia`> skihero: Hey.  Welcome to the bug coordination channel.
[17:38] <persia`> Lots of good links in the /topic here, and if you've any questions, just ask, and someone will likely be happy to answer.
[17:38] <skihero> persia`: thnx, really need to learn somethig
[17:39]  * bjwebb wonders if there is any more he can do about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/542237
[17:39] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 542237 in xkeyboard-config (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "UK Colemak Layout has bottom row offset (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New]
[17:40] <alex_mayorga> so there's nothing else needed from this end on those?
[17:42] <hggdh> alex_mayorga, those which?
[17:42] <hggdh> ;-)
[17:43] <hggdh> or, better stating, which 'those'?
[17:43] <persia`> bjwebb: Looks in a good state to me.  Marking Triaged/Low
[17:43] <bjwebb> persia`: okay
[17:43] <bjwebb> persia`: i'd just really like to see it fixed in release, but i guess its unlikely
[17:44] <bjwebb> its annoying, it'll be a major pain for anyone that uses colemak in a uk, and it was literally patched in by someone who thought the right way was wrong :/
[17:45] <persia`> bjwebb: Just needs a developer to push the change.
[17:45] <alex_mayorga> 543114 and 194494
[17:45] <bjwebb> persia`: okay
[17:45] <hggdh> bug 543114
[17:46]  * hggdh kicks ubot4`
[17:47]  * BUGabundo_remote helps pushing it of the clif
[17:47] <hggdh> alex_mayorga, for ug 543114 we need to wait for apport to do its magiv
[17:47] <hggdh> magic
[17:47] <alex_mayorga> BUGabundo_remote: LOL
[17:49] <hggdh> alex_mayorga, bug 194494 will start getting some attention now (pedro just set it assigned)
[17:49] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 194494 in telepathy-butterfly (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 5 other projects) "telepathy-butterfly crashed with NotImplementedError in _on_error() (affects: 257) (dups: 32)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/194494
[17:49] <hggdh> BUGabundo_remote, thank you, it helped
[17:49] <alex_mayorga> thanks, just saw that on my mailbox
[17:50] <BUGabundo_remote> hggdh: it's a question of how hard you push them
[17:51] <hggdh> BUGabundo_remote, I see. I need to get more, er, assertive ;-)
[17:53] <BUGabundo_remote> or violent
[17:54] <BUGabundo_remote> this bots only know one way
[17:54] <BUGabundo_remote> until someone passes laws forbiding it
[17:54] <BUGabundo_remote> enjoy kinking bots arse, instead humans
[21:09] <cactaur> Hey I have a question. So I've found duplicate bug reports. One has been recently filed by apport and has a status as "New", and the other was done by hand, but has already been triaged. Which one should I mark as the duplicate, since the former looks more complete, but apparently the latter was complete enough.
[21:12] <cactaur> I'm talking about bug #345387 vs. #522102
[21:12] <hggdh> bug<PHONE_NUMBER>02
[21:12] <ubot4`> hggdh: Bug 345387 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/345387 is private
[21:13] <cactaur> bug 522102
[21:13] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 522102 in compiz (Ubuntu) "Unable to set 4 horizontal desktops (affects: 2)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522102
[21:14] <cactaur> Not to mention the latter is in the wrong category.
[21:14] <hggdh> cactaur, go ahead and set 522102 as a dup of 345287
[21:15] <cactaur> All right, thanks!
[21:17] <hggdh> cactaur, and thank you for helping ;-)
[21:24] <Linux000> Does anyone know how to downgrade a package in terminal?
[21:28] <jibel> who manage the package status page http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/qapkgstatus/ ?
[21:28] <hggdh> Linux000, if you have the .deb, just sudo dpkg -i <deb>
[21:29] <Linux000> hggdh: Thanks, I will try to find the deb's
[21:29] <hggdh> jibel, what is the issue there?
[21:30] <hggdh> (and, probably, #ubuntu-quality or #ubuntu-testing is a better place to ask)
[21:31] <jibel> It would be nice to add grub2 in lowlovel
[21:31] <micahg> jibel: ubuntu-qa-website
[21:31] <hggdh> Linux000, also, with apt-get -- apt-get --reinstall install xpto =<IP_ADDRESS>-0ubuntu27
[21:31] <jibel> micahg, thanks
[21:31] <micahg> jibel: project on LP :)
[21:32] <jibel> Yes, I'll file a bug,
[21:32] <hggdh> of course, there is the micahg bot to answer ;-)
[21:32] <Linux000> Hmm, will try that :)
[21:32]  * micahg goes hunting for factoids
[21:32] <hggdh> Linux000, when in doubt... man apt-get ;-)
[21:33] <Linux000> I tried, that couldn't find anything
[21:34] <hggdh> Linux000, heh. In the SYNOPSIS...
[21:34] <Linux000> Ahh
[21:38] <hggdh> Linux000, no prob. This is an UNIX man page, after all, not expected to be easy to use ;-)
[21:38] <vish> hmm , i'm having a weird problem ,the system slows down and everything is slow to react[random]. the mouse pointer has no lag though... earlier i used to SAK/logout of session and return to session and everything would be fine.. ..  now , i seem to have a workaround of sorts.. when i switch to a guest session and return , everything is normal and works fine... anyone heard of such a bug?
[21:39] <vish> no errors in logs or .xsession-errors either :s
[22:01] <baptistemm_> hello
[22:01] <baptistemm_> can someone raise importance of bug 544434 (I guess uninstallable software is quite important)
[22:01] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 544434 in ufraw (Ubuntu) "ufraw not installable due to dependency libexiv2-5 not installable (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544434
[22:38] <zerwas> I hope this channel is okay to ask my question: I don't know where to file a request for having a suitable theme in Chromium package by default
[22:40] <jcastro> zerwas: I've filed one, it's not so simple
[22:40] <micahg> bug 543619
[22:40] <ubot4`> Launchpad bug 543619 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "Ship ambiance/radiance themes by default (affects: 2)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543619
[22:40] <jcastro> chromium doesn't have a system place to put themes
[22:41] <zerwas> I see. That fact might make it quite difficult
[23:06]  * hggdh should know better than to try fglrx again :-(
[23:08] <nigelb> hggdh: hey, wrote my next apport hook :)
[23:10] <hggdh> nigelb, cool! There are now only about 9,637 packages to get a hook ;-)
[23:10] <hggdh> (give or take a few thousands)
[23:11] <nigelb> hggdh: one at a time
[23:11] <hggdh> heh


[12:28] <Ally_> Hello, hope everyone is well. I don't suppose anyone can advise if there's a way to set the order of packages to be installed when specifying them in the YAML custom script? I want to install 'ansible' but I need to install 'oracle-epel-release-el7' first, putting it first still seems to get ignored, I imagine it does it alphabetically or similar?
[12:29] <Ally_> Or, should I just do it with a runcmd instead?
[12:42] <aciba> Ally: There is an undocumented (atm) way to do that using https://cloudinit.readthedocs.io/en/latest/topics/merging.html. Maybe falcojr could help you.
[13:21] <Ally_> Thanks aciba, much appreciated!
[14:33] <falcojr> Ally_: when you say order of packages to be installed, are you referring to using the 'packages' key in cloud-init userdata? E.g., packages: ['oracle-epel-release-el7', 'ansible']
[14:33] <falcojr> or something else?
[15:19] <Ally_> Hi falcojr, yep
[15:20] <falcojr> Ally_: that behavior is distro-dependent. Which distro?
[15:20] <Ally_> We're using OEL 7.9
[15:22] <Ally_> I've worked around it by doing it via runcmd, but I assumed there was a 'smarter' way by using the native package command
[15:22] <falcojr> hmmm, do you know if that gets identified as RHEL by cloud-init, or do you have some custom code for identifying that?
[15:22] <Ally_> It should identify as RHEL (it's a clone)
[15:23] <Ally_> Is there a quick way to determine how cloud-init sees it?
[15:24] <blackboxsw> Ally_: I think cloud-init query distro
[15:25] <falcojr> blackboxsw: TIL! I would've said search the logs
[15:25] <Ally_> thanks blackboxsw
[15:25] <blackboxsw> otherwise grep "Using distro class" /var/;log/cloud-init.log would cofirm
[15:25] <blackboxsw> right
[15:25] <Ally_> # cloud-init query distro
[15:25] <Ally_> ERROR: Undefined instance-data key distro
[15:26] <blackboxsw> ahh OEL 7.9 ... older cloud-init based on version 19.3 or something right
[15:26] <Ally_> # grep "Using distro class" //var/log/cloud-init.log
[15:26] <Ally_> 2022-09-09 13:19:43,979 - stages.py[DEBUG]: Using distro class <class 'cloudinit.distros.rhel.Distro'>
[15:26] <blackboxsw> cool that worksthx
[15:26] <Ally_> Cloud-init v. 19.4
[15:27] <falcojr> Ally_: so actually, it looks like regardless of distro it orders them in the way they were specified. But it does it with a single command. Are you looking for multiple, independent commands for installation?
[15:29] <Ally_> Umm, no, not really. To install 'ansible' package it needs the EPEL repo enabled, and that's an RPM install on OEL. So I specified the epel package first in the list of packages and 'ansible' second, but when it ran it tried to install the 'ansible' package first.
[15:31] <Ally_> https://pastebin.com/UVrFbJFj
[15:31] <Ally_> That's what I was trying to get to work
[15:33] <Ally_> I kinda assumed it was doing like a hoist in JS and running things alphabetically or something
[15:34] <waldi> Ally_: you are looking for yum_repos, which asks cloud-init to add repos
[15:34] <waldi> cloud-init will of course not install packages one after one, but everything in one go
[15:35] <Ally_> Ah, ok, I think I see what you mean. So if I enable the EPEL using the yum_repos command I can skip the epel package part altogether.
[15:35] <waldi> yes
[15:35] <Ally_> I will test that now, thank you waldi (and everyone else!)
[16:12] <blackboxsw> note Ally_ you are specifying `ansible:` config in cloud-init but you are running cloud-init version 19.4 on OEL.... `ansible:`  support in cloud-init was only added after cloud-init version 22.2 so you'll probably have to use individual `runcmd:`declarations to perform that setup of ansible in your distro.
[16:13] <blackboxsw> as I recall, python version on OEL is python2.7 right? which means that OEL systems won't be able to install and run anything beyond 19.4 unless they also happen to have python3 configured
[16:18] <Ally_> Ah, that's good to know, thank you!
[16:24] <blackboxsw> note we have a copr build repo https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/g/cloud-init/el-testing/ that may help wih EL8-based images if you have them
[16:24] <blackboxsw> it contains cloud-init 22.3
[17:57] <cjp256> blackboxsw/falcojr: any thoughts what may be happening here? https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/kDc5ZKRZVs/
[17:57] <cjp256> holman^
[17:58] <cjp256> (search for first hit of iid-datasource)
[18:01] <blackboxsw> looking
[18:02] <cjp256> get_data() is also called twice, init-local and init
[18:03] <blackboxsw> strange mid-init stage iid-datasource shows up
[18:05] <cjp256> this is on upgrade from 22.2 -> 22.3 in proposed
[18:05] <cjp256> thought maybe it was that recent cache change but I reverted it and didn't seem to change that
[18:07] <blackboxsw> cjp256: so iid-datasource comes into play when cloud-init no longer sees "instance-id" in the cached metadata that was read
[18:08] <blackboxsw> I'd be curious if something between init-local and init stage blew away self.metadata on the obj.pkl
[18:08] <cjp256> yeah, it should be there - i lost a debug log, i'll retry
[18:38]  * blackboxsw takes a break from internal work and starts plugging away at Azure upgrade path on -proposed to see what's up there
[18:40] <falcojr> ^ I would normally jump in to help, but I'm guessing it's a welcome break :P
[18:40] <holman> cjp256: what's puzzling me is that you said building from tag 22.3.1 didn't cause the same issue
[18:41] <holman> otherwise I'd guess that the self._reported_ready_marker_file addition not being unpickled as a likely cause
[18:46] <cjp256> I take that back, I think it may have been because I went from the proposed deb to the custom one?
[18:46] <cjp256> i retried that today and it did repro
[18:46] <cjp256> from a fresh 22.2
[18:47] <holman> 22.2->22.3.1 repro'd the issue?
[18:47] <cjp256> yeah the current image 22.2-0ubuntu1~22.04.3
[18:47] <holman> gotcha
[18:48] <cjp256> i'll resume looking into it monday, have a good weekend! :D
[18:48] <holman> yeah I'm pretty sure there's an issue on unpickle here, since _reported_ready_marker_file won't exist in 22.2 pickles,
[18:48] <holman> cjp256: You too!
[19:31] <falcojr> holman: we should figure out why the upgrade integration test didn't catch this. Do you need help digging into that?
[19:32] <holman> @falcojr: Saw your comment on the PR, I'm looking at that now. I should be more familiar with this and I've never touched it, so I'll reach out if I need help.
[19:47] <holman> @falcojr: looks like test_upgrade in SRU testing used an image_id: Canonical:0001-com-ubuntu-server-jammy-daily:22_04-daily-lts
[19:47] <holman> Daily images would have compatible pickles I think.
[19:50] <falcojr> holman: it's not the daily ppa. It's the daily cloud image. I wouldn't expect it to launch with that property, so it shouldn't be in the pickle at upgrade
[19:51] <falcojr> i.e., I would expect Canonical:0001-com-ubuntu-server-jammy-daily:22_04-daily-lts to be providing 22.2, then the upgrade test upgrades to 22.3 proposed
[19:57] <holman> falcojr: I see, thanks.
[19:58] <holman> tangentially related, I see that the ubuntu cloud-image locator website isn't aware of the existence of Jammy images.
[19:59]  * holman goes back to digging into the test
[19:59] <holman> s/Jammy images/Jammy images on Azure/g
[21:26] <CorvetteZR1> hello.  how do i edit an existing cloud-init config?
[21:27] <CorvetteZR1> i set up a mount with noexec option.  i removed it manually from fstab and remount; but when i reboot the server, i see noexec in fstab again.  how can i modify it in cloudinit, so when it overwrites fstab, it no longer applies noexec ?
[21:27] <CorvetteZR1> without reprovisioning whole server i mean
[21:59] <holman> @falcojr - not sure if you're still around, but I did a brain-dump of my working theory in that PR.
[22:00] <falcojr> holman: cool. I'll take a look (maybe Monday)
[22:00] <holman> @falcojr sweet, no rush
[22:02] <holman> CorvetteZR1: What's your config look like? cc_mounts runs once per instance, so running every boot is not expected. More information in general about your setup would help a lot :)
[23:31] <blackboxsw> holman: you are totally right on cjp256's Azure upgrade bug. it is unpickling problem across upgrade given that the obj.pkl doesn't have the _. the following patch fixes it https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/4yybCvHgvp/
[23:32] <blackboxsw> I'll put up a PR and set you both as reviewers
[23:32] <blackboxsw> this will block SRU


[12:07] <kwwii> time for bed, see you all tomorrow
[01:11] <troy_s> AndyFitz, greetings.
[01:11] <AndyFitz> g'day troy_s
[01:11] <troy_s> how are things with you?
[01:12] <AndyFitz> pretty good.  its been a full weekend.
[01:12] <troy_s> have you been busy?  we could probably use your help as soon as Frank culls the various directions for production.
[01:12] <troy_s> Hopefully everyone will engage in the 'mix and match' of production, but I fear we will really need everyone to step up if they can.
[01:18] <mhz> hi there
[01:18] <mhz> anyone here at this hour?
[01:20] <AndyFitz> troy_s  ,  I don't have the time free id like to have.  but I'll be helping out here and there
[01:21] <troy_s> AndyFitz, anything is helpful.
[01:21] <troy_s> limited resources on all of our parts...
[01:21] <troy_s> mhz, north americans :)
[01:48] <mhz> What do you guys use to print CD labels?
[01:48] <mhz> I desgin them on Inkscape
[01:48] <mhz> but i do not print from it
[01:49] <mhz> I set the letter size page according to the paper size I'll use for cd labels, but when I print, both CD label sizes get reduced and so do margins :(
[02:03] <troy_s> mhz, you will need to set your page constraints properly
[02:03] <troy_s> so that your printer prints accurately
[05:06] <mhz> troy_s: and is it normal that page constraints reduce the CD lable sizes ?
[05:37] <troy_s> mhz, to the best of my knowledge, yes.
[05:37] <troy_s> your printer has built in page constraints in addition to those... there is a test somewhere.
[05:38] <mhz> puf!
[06:09] <mhz> troy_s: any other app to make cd lables than inkscape and that lets me organize the measures between the 2 CD lables on letter size page? (that has no constraints)?
[06:14] <Madpilot> mhz, there's gLabels, but it's got fairly limited drawing tools. Excellent printing support, though
[06:25] <mhz> Madpilot: yeah..but not good enough :(
[06:25] <mhz> how do professionals do when they use inkscape?
[06:25] <mhz> or gimp?
[06:34] <Madpilot> not sure
[06:43] <troy_s> mhz there is some label prog out there
[06:43] <troy_s> glabel maybe?
[06:44] <troy_s> can't remember... do an apt-cache search label
[06:44] <troy_s> and it would probably work.
[06:44] <mhz> hehehe, I already did
[06:44] <mhz> long ago, on friday
[06:44] <troy_s> was it glable mhz?
[06:44] <mhz> I even installed some perl based program
[06:44] <mhz> glables
[06:44] <troy_s> and it didn't work?
[06:45] <troy_s> mhz what type of printer do you have?
[06:45] <mhz> troy_s: it works to print lables
[06:45] <mhz> howver, you can't do what gimp or inkscape does
[06:45] <troy_s> because i know there is a way to set your printer size so that cd labels come out 1:1
[06:45] <troy_s> hrm... can't you import a
[06:45] <troy_s> file into it and print them to cd?
[06:46] <mhz> so, you gotta import a png or jpg from glables
[06:46] <mhz> and then it sucks
[06:47] <mhz> so, my question is... There must be a FLOSS way to get professional work print
[06:47] <mhz> or Canonical makes and sends non-FLOSS professional artwork to print?
[06:48] <mhz> (maybe the latter) :(
[06:49] <troy_s> well most of the official stuff is merely calibrated to page size
[06:49] <troy_s> your printer has adjustable output margins (all relative) and you can set those
[06:50] <troy_s> so if you align your crosshatches, you are good to go
[06:50] <troy_s> but you do need to calibrate your printer so that 1 inch in gimp/inkscape == one inch of print.
[06:50] <troy_s> i remember this because i got into dabbling with that a little bit when i was trying to calibrate my printer a while back.
[06:55] <mhz> troy_s: thx
[06:55] <mhz> troy_s: so you print from inkscape ?
[06:55] <troy_s> basically, your calibrations are your weak link in every tech gap
[06:56] <troy_s> whether you want your visual 'blue' to be blue on print/screen/whatever
[06:56] <troy_s> or your x size to be x size -- all comes down to calibration
[06:56] <troy_s> and there just isn't a magic bullet (despite what a lot of commercial tools would like you to believe)
[06:56] <troy_s> generally, i always take my target and compare direct results
[06:56] <mhz> troy_s: please clarify this to me.... If I make a PDF from my SVG, should this PDF still keep CD label size? or the constraints will always play a role there?
[06:57] <troy_s> mhz:  who is printing it?  target?
[06:57] <mhz> target
[06:57] <troy_s> target?
[06:57] <troy_s> as in the company?  what is your printing target?
[06:57] <mhz> If I make a PDF from my SVG, should this PDF still keep CD label size while printing?
[06:58] <mhz> oh, I am printing
[06:58] <troy_s> mhz:  once the program says 'print x inches' to your printer it is out of its hands
[06:58] <mhz> :(
[06:58] <troy_s> now you COULD kludge it, and fix the source so that it matches dest
[06:58] <mhz> hehehe
[06:58] <troy_s> or you could set your printer details
[06:58] <troy_s> so that it works.
[06:59] <troy_s> let me see if i can dig up the links on page constraints
[06:59] <mhz> thx
[07:00] <mhz> troy_s: well, my main concern is that if I made this SVG (Cd label) for the LoCo, and they all use diff printers and diff CD paper brands
[07:00] <mhz> then, we'd all get crazy
[07:01] <mhz> One excellent thing about inkscape is that it has very detailed rule to use and measure paper layout of elements on page
[07:01] <troy_s> indeed.
[07:01] <mhz> so, all LoCo memebers could easily adapt such file to specific needs
[07:01] <troy_s> basically, if your printer is calibrated and you have set ink or gimp to the proper sizes, all is well.
[07:01] <troy_s> yep.
[07:01] <troy_s> but you need to calibrate your local printer to make sure one inch is one inch
[07:01] <troy_s> and there is a way to do that...
[07:01] <mhz> okis
[07:02] <mhz> anohter thing I noticed is that default paper for CD labels is usally ONLY or mostly, the Avery brand. Why would that be so?
[07:03] <mhz> is that really so typical?
[07:05] <troy_s> what make of printer is it?
[07:05] <troy_s> the sizes are sort of set by the mainstream -- for example if you go to staples you can get the no-name version of avery brand labels...
[07:05] <mhz> HP
[07:05] <troy_s> hp has a raw format for precise printing...
[07:05] <troy_s> pbm2ppm has more info
[07:06] <mhz> troy_s: ok, i'll google for pbm2ppm
[07:07] <troy_s> http://www.shallowsky.com/software/cdplugins/
[07:09] <troy_s> mhz, try that page too... it has gimp specific plugins.
[10:58] <msikma> Hey all
[02:07] <msikma> Where is Frank Schoep? He on vacation?
[02:08] <msikma> I sent him a mail but haven't heard from him.
[03:31] <lapo> hi
[03:32] <troy_s> greetings lapo
[03:33] <troy_s> msikma, Frank is darn busy.
[03:34] <troy_s> msikma, I am sure he will get back to you when he can.
[03:37] <lapo> yo troy_s
[04:41] <newz2000> Anyone here good at making icons for Windows programs? (ico files)
[04:41] <newz2000> Bazaar is having troubles.
[04:51] <msikma_> If all you want is an ICO file as simple as possible, you can just make a BMP and rename it. The top-left pixel is the transparency value.
[04:51] <msikma_> At least, that worked back in Windows 95...
[05:00] <andreasn> newz2000: I think you can create ico-files with gimp, otherwise I would recommend microangelo
[08:16] <cbx33> ping troy_s
[08:17] <cbx33> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuSounds
[09:59] <lapo> hi
[10:41] <FiberOptics> Hello


[00:13] <doko> xnox, do you already have an updated boost-defaults package?
[00:14] <xnox> doko: not yet, working on it. i didn't do a -defaults update yet before =)
[00:14] <xnox> doko: where would you want it uploaded?
[00:19] <doko> xnox, ubuntu-toolchain-r/test ppa (but you can't upload there)
[00:20] <xnox> doko: i'll give .changes url.
[00:57] <xnox> doko: http://people.canonical.com/~xnox/repo/boost-defaults_<IP_ADDRESS>ubuntu1.dsc
[00:57] <xnox> changes are near by as well.
[00:57] <xnox> http://people.canonical.com/~xnox/repo/boost-defaults_<IP_ADDRESS>ubuntu1_source.changes
[00:57] <xnox> i think it's correct & includes newly added modules, et al.
[03:15] <ScottK> xnox: Please let's not update boost-defaults.
[03:16] <ScottK> xnox: Don't you think changing the default boost version is some that ought not be done after feature freeze without some discussion, particularly when we picked at the START of the release cycle what boost we would use?
[03:18] <ScottK> xnox: Also, if you're introducing 1.53, please take care to get rid of 1.50 at the same time.  We don't want more boost in the archive than we can help.
[03:23] <infinity> ScottK: He's changing the boost defaults in the toolchain archive for the opening of 13.10.
[03:24] <ScottK> infinity: changes says Distribution: raring
[03:24] <infinity> Yes, because there's no Distribution: s-series yes.
[03:24] <infinity> The toolchain PPA is all built against raring, but will be used to open the next release.
[03:25] <ScottK> Also, that still should have some discussion as historically getting ahead of Debian on boost is fraught with pain.
[03:25] <ScottK> Chasing version numbers is not a good reason to change.
[03:26] <infinity> I won't disagree with those statements.
[03:26] <infinity> xnox: Is there a valid reason for wanting to skip ahead of Debian with boost-defaults, or is it just shiny new versionitis?
[03:27] <ScottK> I am considerably less panicked now that I know it's for S though.
[10:33] <xnox> infinity: ScottK: doko, boost debian maintainers and I are discussing this. Indeed we are currently proposing a rebuild against boost1.53 and patches to debian & do it for s-series. Boost1.53 is in unstable already and the plan is to start boost transition as soon as new debian opens.
[10:36] <xnox> infinity: it's shiny, new, non-borked C++11 which we need/want across the board in time for gcc-4.8 (with improved C++11 is due soonish http://gcc.gnu.org/ml/gcc/2013-03/msg00036.html )
[10:36] <ubot2> gcc.gnu.org bug 2013 in c++ "g++ 2.96: typedefs + namespaces + inheritance == problem" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
[10:36] <xnox> ubot2: that was unhelpful =)
[10:36] <ubot2> xnox: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
[10:36] <xnox> ta
[15:26] <infinity> xnox: Fair enough.
[18:04] <Daviey> bdmurray: hey, there is a 3rd (!) upload for ubuntu-geoip.. Would you mind taking a look at it?
[18:14] <bdmurray> Daviey: sure
[18:53] <xnox> infinity: please remove boost1.50 from raring, as we have 1.53 instead.
[18:53] <xnox> bug 1158458
[18:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158458 in boost1.50 (Ubuntu) "[RM] please remove boost1.50 from raring" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1158458
[18:54] <infinity> xnox: Has no rdeps?
[18:54] <infinity> I guess I can look for myself.
[18:54] <xnox> infinity: i couldn't find any....
[19:31] <xnox> infinity: maybe remove these two as well? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/guile-1.6/+bug/1154491
[19:31] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1154491 in guile-db "Please remove guile-1.6 from the archive" [Low,Confirmed]
[21:02] <dobey> hopefully the uploads i just managed to squeeze in aren't rejected :)
[21:24] <xnox> i think at FF we did something like 1.5h of grace time =)
[21:24] <dobey> yay


[00:01] <wallyworld> agprado: you dropped out?
[01:11] <axw> thumper: I don't know if you already saw, but wgrant is still seeing performance issues with 2.2.9 - still seing saslStart
[01:11] <axw> see backscroll
[01:42] <axw> thumper: also, I couldn't repro that intermittent test failure. tried it a couple hundred times
[01:42] <thumper> :(
[01:42] <thumper> ok
[01:46] <wallyworld> axw: if you had 5, just wanted a quick chat RE: the status PR. easier than typing into a PR
[01:47] <axw> wallyworld: sure
[01:47] <wallyworld> standup
[02:11] <wallyworld> axw: thumper has a theory that api rate limiting is broken - that could explain the SASl overhead
[02:11] <wallyworld> as the server / mongo is getting hammered
[02:11] <axw> okey dokey
[02:11] <wallyworld> he says prodstack retstart showed a thundering herd
[02:12] <wallyworld> all agents reconnected within a few seconds
[02:12] <wallyworld> maybe if we address rate limiting issue that will help alleviate the SASL symptoms
[02:42] <axw> thumper: do you have some logs to share?
[02:42] <axw> or were you looking at a screenshare
[02:42] <thumper> axw: no
[02:42] <thumper> I was watching the prodstack grafana instance
[02:43] <thumper> just noticed that the connection count for the controllers jumped back to full very quickly
[02:45] <axw> thumper: looks to me like the connection count is incremented before rate-limiting kicks in
[02:46] <axw> rate limiting happens in the Login handler, which is after we update teh conn count (which is what feeds the prometheus metric)
[02:55]  * thumper nods
[10:46] <tasdomas> balloons, ping?
[11:43] <tasdomas> how do I trigger a test build on a juju PR?
[11:54] <anastasiamac> tasdomas: !!build!!
[11:55] <tasdomas> anastasiamac, thanks
[11:55] <anastasiamac> nws :)
[11:58] <tasdomas> anastasiamac, could I get a review of https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/8262 ?
[12:20] <anastasiamac> tasdomas: it's past my eod but tomorrow for sure ;)
[12:20] <tasdomas> anastasiamac, ah, sorry - enjoy your evening
[14:45] <tasdomas> balloons, ping?
[14:45] <balloons> good day tasdomas
[14:45] <tasdomas> balloons, are juju acceptance tests actually being run?
[14:46] <balloons> tasdomas, not during the PR. They run post-commit
[14:47] <tasdomas> balloons, why is it looking into .juju/environments.yaml ( https://github.com/juju/juju/blob/develop/acceptancetests/jujupy/configuration.py#L44 ) ?
[14:48] <balloons> tasdomas, it looks for JUJU_HOME first as you can see
[14:49] <balloons> tasdomas, that should be JUJU_DATA, but JUJU_HOME is a juju 1ish that is still present
[14:51] <tasdomas> balloons, still, on l67 it looks for a file called environments.yaml
[14:52] <balloons> tasdomas, yes that file defines the cloud credentials
[14:53] <balloons> tasdomas, are you wanting to run your test?
[14:54] <balloons> tasdomas, typically we export JUJU_HOME which has the environments.yaml with our CI creds in it, and the tests go from there
[14:54] <balloons> that means we don't have to juju add-credentials everytime
[14:54] <tasdomas> balloons, so that is not the old-style environments.yaml that juju used to use
[14:55] <balloons> tasdomas, no.. it's a weird combination of juju1 and juju2
[14:55] <balloons> tasdomas, we have a plan to eliminate all the juju 1ism's from the test framework, but the work is only about halfway done
[14:56] <balloons> the use of JUJU_HOME and environments.yaml is some of the last holdouts
[15:44] <balloons> tasdomas, if you like I can run your test changes through jenkins manually to ensure it passes
[15:44] <tasdomas> balloons, is there a way for me to do that myself?
[23:22] <axw> thumper: with the "too many open files" thing, forget what I said about state objects being open during upgrade. that's still a problem for upgrades from 2.1, but 2.2.8 to 2.2.9 wouldn't have run any upgrade steps
[23:22] <thumper> right


[01:18] <kenvandine> RAOF, thanks
[01:24]  * bschaefer goes to eat dinner
[02:05]  * RAOF would quite like to be able to build mir :/
[02:13] <bschaefer> RAOF, it would help :(
[02:14] <bschaefer> RAOF, looks like the branch if failing on some protobuf stuff
[02:14] <RAOF> Yeah, things built wrong.
[02:14] <bschaefer> RAOF, hmm my error?
[02:14]  * bschaefer compiles fine on his machine
[02:15] <RAOF> Is your machine running wily? :)
[02:15] <RAOF> Slash wily-proposed?
[02:16] <bschaefer> RAOF, yes :)
[02:16]  * bschaefer wishes he wasnt
[02:16] <duflu> bschaefer: Workaround on mir-devel
[02:16] <bschaefer> duflu, for the proto issue?
[02:17] <duflu> Yep
[02:17] <bschaefer> duflu, do i just need to wait for it to merge into lp:mir?
[02:17] <duflu> bschaefer: I think we're waiting for protobuf to get rebuilt and re-released against the new C++ ABI of GCC5
[02:17] <bschaefer> duflu, cool i can just wait a little
[02:18] <bschaefer> people can still look at the code :)
[02:18] <duflu> bschaefer: You can still build it too. Just cmake .. -DCMAKE_CXX_COMPILER=g++-4.9 -DCMAKE_C_COMPILER=gcc-4.9
[02:18] <bschaefer> duflu, im building fine locally
[02:18]  * bschaefer is on proposed
[02:19] <bschaefer> duflu, just want to make jenkins happy :)
[02:19] <RAOF> Yeah, that needs to wait for the archive to work :)
[02:19] <duflu> Jenkins will be grumpy for some time yet. That's why I landed as much as possible by hand yesterday
[02:19] <bschaefer> haha, well that attestable cookie branch isnt a MUST LAND ASAP
[02:19] <bschaefer> soo i think it can wait
[02:20] <bschaefer> plus its ~3.9k in changes
[02:28] <duflu> bschaefer: Seems the list of unfinished ongoing transitions is now shorter, but still includes protobuf: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/
[02:29]  * bschaefer has never seen that site
[02:29] <duflu> New to me too
[02:29] <bschaefer> duflu, hopefully that means soon :)
[03:06] <duflu> RAOF: What's your regular deb build command (that conveniently avoided the test failure I was getting for so long)?
[04:37] <RAOF> duflu: Probably DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS="notest nocheck" sbuild -d wily --arch=armhf -j9
[05:11] <duflu> RAOF: notest nocheck sounds like a reasonable explanation. So I wasn't the only one seeing the failure, just the only one looking :)
[05:12] <RAOF> If it's what I'm thinking, the test fails because of a qemu deficiency, so it's not very useful to run.
[05:12] <RAOF> That's what the mako/arale is for.
[05:21] <duflu> RAOF: No, different (desktop) issue
[05:21] <RAOF> Oh, I think just debuild works for me, theer.
[05:22] <duflu> RAOF: Yes, it works, now. Didn't for quite a while; https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1483097
[05:23] <RAOF> Ah, it's possible that I've only ever built it with real root (in a sbuild chroot)
[05:53] <duflu> alf: Hello
[05:53] <alf> duflu: Hi!
[05:54] <duflu> alf: No exciting news to report other than wily doesn't build Mir right now :)
[05:57] <alf> duflu: Thanks. Has 0.14 landed for vivid+overlay? :P
[05:58] <duflu> alf: Not sure actually
[05:58] <duflu> I think it did. It was on arale. But mine might have been hacked
[06:00] <duflu> alf: Umm, yes seems to be on arale (which is running vivid)
[08:36] <alan_g> alf: welcome back. Hope you had a good break.
[08:43] <alf> alan_g: Thanks. I didn't manage to forget keyboard shortcuts, but it was good nonetheless :)
[08:56] <alan_g> You have to try harder (or longer) next time. ;)
[09:54] <alf> alan_g: @hack-mir_input-Thread-run-implementation, doesn't the proposed code only enable run() for benchmarks and unit-tests? Is that what we want?
[09:56] <alan_g> alf: Mmm. I guess that's everywhere we use it. (Which suggests there may be a more elegant solution.)
[09:59] <alan_g> Can you accept this version this while I look into that as a follow-up (to the series)?
[10:28] <alf> alan_g: Sure. It actually seems CommonInputThread is not used any more.
[10:28] <alan_g> alf: thanks for that observation - it lead me to a much better solution.
[10:29] <alf> alan_g: yw
[10:37] <greyback_> alf: hey, welcome back. When you get a chance, could you have a look over this doc and see if you agree with the premise: https://docs.google.com/document/d/10_Y04_TrmA_UV9BrObVGLm71jPlFKifBCt6v7YyMU7Q/edit
[10:37] <alf> greyback_: will do
[10:39] <alan_g> alf: @hack-mir_input-Thread-run-implementation - I've pushed the "better solution"
[11:23] <kdub> welcome back alf
[11:23] <alf> kdub: Thanks!
[11:32] <alf> greyback_: Is "scale" something that can be calculated from resolution and real display dimensions (which are already present in what Mir publishes), or something different?
[11:32] <greyback_> alf: different. It's user-configurable UI scaling
[11:34] <alf> greyback_: how does it affect Mir?
[11:34] <greyback_> alf: not at all
[11:34] <greyback_> well, it's probably a per-display setting
[11:35] <greyback_> so would be /nice/ if it was set & stored with the other per-display configurations
[11:35] <greyback_> but far from required
[11:35] <greyback_> it can be saved in gsettings too
[11:35] <alf> greyback_: so the idea is that whoever sets the display resolution will set it and then clients can access it from there
[11:35] <greyback_> right
[11:38] <alf> greyback_: do you see this as a unity8 specific setting or something more generally useful?
[11:39] <greyback_> alf: I think it's unity8 that would be the main consumer
[11:40] <greyback_> while most shells have to deal with HiDPI screen issues
[11:40] <greyback_> I think most have their own way
[11:40] <greyback_> but one thing I that might go hand-in-hand with this is: unity8 needs to know what scale each client is drawing at.
[11:41] <greyback_> as example, say I've a retina screen, and so gave set scale to "x2"
[11:42] <greyback_> I launch 2 apps, one is clever and reads the scale setting and scales its UI. Other app is old, unaware of scale, so draws at x1
[11:42] <greyback_> then it is the compositor's job to do (ugly) scale up of the old unscaled app
[11:42] <greyback_> so it's consistently sized
[11:42] <kdub> and input stack's job to map the input?
[11:43] <greyback_> kdub: yeah (Qt will manage it easily enough)
[11:43] <greyback_> with multimonitor, things get more complex
[11:44] <kdub> things always get more complex with multimonitor :)
[11:44] <greyback_> if I need mir clients to tell the server the scale they're drawing at, then it makes sense to add mir api for clients to read scale of the display
[11:45] <greyback_> that's my motivation, but I'm unity8 :)
[11:49]  * alan_g wonders if he can delete 10KLOC this week
[11:54] <greyback_> alf: do client API's need to be extended, or does unity8/qtmir need to extra code so that if the display configuration is changed by SystemSettings, that unity8 sets it's own base config to be the same?
[11:54] <greyback_> -'
[12:19] <alf> greyback_: both could work, since unity8/qtmir have the pid from Mir's auth mechanism, but changing the API is the cleanest approach. Otherwise, you have a Mir client API call that acts differently depending on Unity8 internals.
[12:20] <greyback_> alf: well my concern is for non-system-settings apps using that api
[12:20] <greyback_> but you have a point
[12:21] <alf> greyback_: Well, the auth mechanism can deny all "change base config" requests that are not coming from system-settings
[12:22] <greyback_> yep
[12:25] <alf> alan_g|lunch: @deleting 10KLOC, a worthy goal :)
[14:09] <kgunn> greyback_: silo 0 still hanging, expected ?
[14:10] <greyback_> kgunn: it just finished building, I've not checked yet
[14:13] <kgunn> greyback_: hmmm....apt cache policy showing older libmir*s
[14:13] <kgunn> will tinker a little
[14:13] <kgunn> oh wait, wrong term
[14:14] <kgunn> but yes...still unexpected libmircommon's installed
[14:15] <kgunn> and wrong u-s-c
[14:15] <kgunn> i used citrain
[14:15] <greyback_> did it actually do anything? Because it didn't for me, ubuntu-touch-session in the way
[14:16] <kgunn> greyback_: well, it downloaded them....
[14:16] <kgunn> is that what this means "E: There are problems and -y was used without --force-yes"
[14:16] <kgunn> it did say u-t-s would be downgraded
[14:16] <kgunn> at any rate, gonna use a hammer
[14:17] <greyback_> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/12071338/ is my output, which results in no updates actualy installing
[14:18] <kgunn> same
[14:19] <greyback_> sigh
[14:19] <greyback_> damn thing crashing still
[14:24] <alan_g> alf: @10KLOC - I have MPs the deletes, now they just have to land.
[14:49] <greyback_> kdub: hey, I'm still having no luck with the external display being rotated on my N7 in silo0. Can you help?
[14:50] <greyback_> USC is resizing the surfaces to suit
[14:51] <greyback_> nothing is locking up (but unity8 is crashing for some reason)
[14:52] <kdub> wasn't n7's rotation strange somehow?
[14:56] <kgunn> greyback_: and do we need to rebuild u-t-s ?
[14:56] <greyback_> kgunn: probably
[14:56] <greyback_> kdub: nope
[14:57] <greyback_> same code used to work in n4 & n7 - unity8 did the rest just fine
[14:58] <kdub> i have a hazy memory that we had to rotate the n7 by 90deg or something
[14:58] <greyback_> kdub: yep, unity8 is looking after that
[14:59] <greyback_> kdub: if you can test silo0, I recommend you stop unity8, and see how USC looks on other display
[15:02] <greyback_> dumbass, no wonder qtmir was crashing, I forgot to merge the multimonitor handling code
[15:26] <kdub> greyback_, so wait for that to merge in then?
[15:27] <greyback_> kdub: if you stop unity8, you can still repro the issue just by looking at the spinner graphic
[15:27] <kdub> okay
[15:29] <greyback_> thanks. Sorry to have to pester you, but I've dug a bit and was unable to see why it's not happening
[15:36] <kdub> greyback_, sure, will look this afternoon
[19:06] <popey> kgunn: is it possible to use a nexus 7 with a slimport and latest mir/unity etc, like the nexus 4?
[19:06] <kgunn> popey: in theory, if silo 0 wasn't still busted :)
[19:07] <popey> oh, its busted?
[19:07] <popey> that'll be why I have a black screen on my nexus 7 then
[19:07] <popey> is it fixable? I mean, downgrade something?
[19:07] <kgunn> popey: "fixable" ? like don't install it in the first place
[19:08] <kgunn> popey: black screen only when you plug it into slimport right ?
[19:08] <popey> heh
[19:08] <popey> no, it's black on internal display
[19:09] <popey> i had a devel image on it from ages ago (because we don't have newer ones on flo), added silo 0 and the overlay ppa
[19:09] <popey> dist-upgrade, reboot, black screen
[19:10] <kgunn> popey: huh....no hadn't seen  that
[19:10] <kgunn> popey: but i hand't tried n7 and i think kdub was gonna poke around on n7 today
[19:10] <popey> okay
[19:10] <popey> no worries, just wanted to play before the n4 arrived.
[19:12] <kdub> afaik, u8 needs to pull in a branch to stop that crash, and I sent a mir-fix to greyback__ that hopefully fixes the rotation issue
[19:15] <kgunn> kdub: what's the branch, just in case i can merge with lp:~mir-team/mir/silo0
[19:15] <kgunn> gerry might be off for the evening
[19:16] <greyback__> kgunn: I am, I can push current state which prevents the crash, but apps aren't drawing currently
[19:16] <greyback__> so it's not really worth rebuilding until I fugure that out tomorrow
[19:16] <kgunn> k


[01:47] <penth> 10.5 hours of dd later... =)
[10:52] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, critters and everything else


[14:44] <crysaz> hi
[14:44] <crysaz> any comments on m-audio pre-amps?
[14:44] <holstein> morning :)
[14:45] <holstein> crysaz: i have one gernal observation
[14:45] <holstein> when your in the studio
[14:45] <holstein> paying $100+/per hour
[14:45] <holstein> they are *not* using m-audio preamps
[14:45] <crysaz> wonder why :)
[14:45] <holstein> does that mean those preamps arent worth what you pay?
[14:46] <crysaz> i'm going to record live gigs, so i'm not going to be in studio
[14:46] <holstein> crysaz: doesnt matter if your on the surface of the moon
[14:46] <holstein> IF you hire a guy
[14:46] <holstein> from a studio
[14:46] <holstein> to come a record a gig
[14:46] <holstein> and your paying him $100+/per hour
[14:47] <holstein> he wont have anything maudio n the rack ;)
[14:47] <crysaz> hmmm.
[14:47] <crysaz> so do you have suggestions for a usb interface?
[14:47] <holstein> maybe the zoom H4
[14:48] <holstein> because the pres are nice
[14:48] <crysaz> i'm going to be the guy doing stuff for free for local bands, so highest quality isn't required
[14:48] <holstein> built in mics are OK
[14:48] <holstein> stand alone recording mode
[14:48] <crysaz> that's on option, but there is no output options
[14:48] <holstein> you can use it as an interface
[14:49] <holstein> try over in #opensourcemusicians as well
[14:49] <holstein> personally
[14:49] <holstein> i think if your just going to buy some cheap USB thing
[14:49] <holstein> just use the internal card
[14:49] <holstein> with some stereo mic
[14:55] <crysaz> maybe you are right. i should try internal card first


[03:26] <wallyworld_> axw: i'm taking an early mark today, got stuff to do before xmas. have a good xmas and new year etc :-)
[03:27] <axw> wallyworld_: thanks :)  you too, merry christmas!


[06:36] <mac_v> is nautilus supposed to constantly increase memory usage? this is a behavior is notice only in karmic
[06:36] <mac_v> s/is/I
[06:45] <scream> Could be a memory leak... have you filed a bug against it?
[07:18] <mac_v> scream: no , will do :)
[07:19] <mac_v> scream: do you know which package sticky notes bug has to be assigned?
[11:08] <alourie|work> hello
[11:08] <alourie|work> I need an advice please
[11:09] <alourie|work> I just marked a bug as duplicate, and would like someone to take a look that I was right.
[11:09] <alourie|work> bug #417626 as duplicate of #366491
[11:09] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 417626 in update-manager "tripwire cannot be installed during upgrade to kubuntu 9.04 (dup-of: 366491)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/417626
[11:09] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 366491 in tripwire "tripwire failed to install during upgrade to 9.04" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/366491
[12:38] <SignedAdam> Hello, i have a bug with my computers drives, I Fix it by opening Terminal, and typing "sudo modprobe acerhk" with out the ""
[12:38] <SignedAdam> Then enter your password, you was ask for your password at install,
[12:38] <SignedAdam> then type : "echo on > /proc/driver/acerhk/wirelessled" with out the ""
[12:38] <SignedAdam> For Wifi ON
[12:38] <SignedAdam> or type : "echo off > /proc/driver/acerhk/wirelessled" with out the ""
[12:38] <SignedAdam> For Wifi OFF,
[12:39] <SignedAdam> my computer is a Fujitsu Siemens Amilo Li 1718
[15:07] <xax> hi. ever since Ubuntu 9.04, kernel 2.6.28-13-generic, I only see noise on my screen right after the splash screen. I can hear sound and I can even log in (blindly), but the whole screen is filled with garbage. this problem didn't come up 2.6.28-11-generic. I have an ATI card. is this a known problem?
[15:07] <xax> didn't come up in*
[15:50] <matti> ;]
[16:28] <qense> bdmurray: I've restructured the Bugs/HowToTriage page and rewritten some sections. I don't think it's a good idea to submit such a vital page right away, so I'd like to ask you first. The draft is located here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/258120/
[18:19] <BUGabundo> boas
[18:59] <funkja> Can anyone help me debug why my dvd drive won't open on my Dell Vostro 1400? It will open prior to Ubuntu starting and I can boot from it, but once ubuntu starts it won't open.
[19:00] <micahg> funkja: try #ubuntu for support
[19:00] <funkja> micahg: they told me to come here :P
[19:00] <micahg> ugh
[19:00] <micahg> ok
[19:00] <micahg> how are you trying to open it?
[19:01] <funkja> By pushing the button
[19:01] <funkja> also the eject command says ""tried to use `/dev/scd0' as device name but it is no block device"
[19:01] <micahg> ok, if the disk is mounted, you will not be able to eject by pushing the button
[19:01] <BUGabundo> micahg: hehh I always feel like a ping ping ball in this situations
[19:01] <micahg> funkja: which flavor of ubunut?
[19:01] <funkja> 9.04
[19:01] <BUGabundo> funkja: is this after suspend/hibernate?
[19:02] <micahg> ubuntu, kubuntu, xubuntu?
[19:02] <funkja> Ubuntu
[19:02] <funkja> No, right after cold booting
[19:02] <micahg> can you try to eject from the places menu?
[19:02] <BUGabundo> I always get that after hibernation :(
[19:02] <BUGabundo> long old bug
[19:03] <funkja> The DVD drive doesn't show up in my list of places
[19:03] <micahg> is there a disk in there?
[19:03] <funkja> no, I want to put one in :)
[19:03] <micahg> wow
[19:03] <micahg> that's really weird then
[19:04] <funkja> Which is why I think they told me to come here
[19:04] <micahg> I hate to ping pong, but maybe the kernel channel would be better?
[19:04] <BUGabundo> yeah as I said, I get that too
[19:04] <micahg> unless someone else has an idea
[19:04] <funkja> perhaps
[19:04] <BUGabundo> most times only works if I have a cd on the drive after boot
[19:04] <BUGabundo> :(
[19:04] <BUGabundo> !ping
[19:04] <ubot4> ping yourself ;-) really the diodes all down my left side are sore
[19:05] <funkja> maybe I will put the cd in before boot and then start ubuntu
[19:05] <funkja> just want to rip some music
[19:05] <BUGabundo> eheh
[19:05] <BUGabundo> funkja: laptop?
[19:05] <funkja> yes
[19:06] <funkja> Thanks for you help anyways.
[19:06] <BUGabundo> you could file a bug,
[19:07] <BUGabundo> but I suspect it will be just there waitung
[19:07] <funkja> Right
[19:07] <funkja> Maybe, if it comes to it, I'll just reinstall
[19:07] <BUGabundo> no need
[19:07] <BUGabundo> I guess it will just happen again
[19:07] <funkja> Maybe
[19:07] <micahg> yeah, you can file a bug
[19:07] <BUGabundo> you could try karmic from liveusb
[19:07] <micahg> that seems weird
[19:07] <BUGabundo> and test the cd eject
[19:08] <funkja> okay
[19:08] <micahg> funkja: which kernel?
[19:08] <BUGabundo> micahg: I've had it for ever
[19:08] <funkja> Linux niniel 2.6.28-15-generic
[19:08] <BUGabundo> on all releases
[19:08] <micahg> yes but you said after suspend
[19:08] <micahg> his is at cold boot
[19:09] <funkja> Okay, thanks for the information
[19:10] <BUGabundo> micahg: from time to time it also happens on clod boot
[19:10] <BUGabundo> just not so often
[19:10] <micahg> ok
[19:10] <micahg> I've never seen this
[19:10] <BUGabundo> but I don't use the drive much either
[19:10] <micahg> maybe hardware related
[19:11] <BUGabundo> prob
[19:44] <kaddi> hi, I'm trying to report a bug in karmic, that crashes kbuildsycoca4. However this crash also crashe DrKonqui which should report the bug. I'm considering filing the bug with ubuntu-bug, but am wondering which parameters I should give so the bug will get the right tags. Could you help with that?
[20:28] <Ethers0n> i'm trying to figure out if this bug i'm experiencing has been documented
[20:28] <Ethers0n> can some one help?
[20:38] <andresmujica> Ethers0n, explain your bug, maybe anyone here knows it
[20:39] <Ethers0n> I have a laptop with a usb keyboard and mouse attached
[20:39] <Ethers0n> the external keyboard and mouse layouts are the default
[20:39] <Ethers0n> however
[20:39] <Ethers0n> the internal (to the laptop) keyboard's layout has been changed
[20:40] <Ethers0n> so that the keys
[20:40] <Ethers0n> jkl and so on are mapped to 123
[20:41] <Ethers0n> holding down the "fn" key changes the mapping to the letters as they should be
[20:41] <Ethers0n> this persisted from Hardy Heron to Jaunty
[20:41] <Ethers0n> after an upgrade
[20:41] <andresmujica> hmm like the fn key is activated by default. ??
[20:42] <Ethers0n> it SEEMS similar to https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/295990
[20:42] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 295990 in xkeyboard-config "Keyboard layout reset after attaching USB keyboard" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[20:42] <Ethers0n> but is not
[20:42] <Ethers0n> right
[20:42] <Ethers0n> but i can't seem to switch back
[20:42] <Ethers0n> after unplugging the usb keyboard
[20:43] <Ethers0n> andresmujica: maybe?
[20:44] <andresmujica> i recall something with an acer laptop...
[20:44] <andresmujica> something like that ...
[20:44] <Ethers0n> this is a "Great Quality" laptop
[20:44] <Ethers0n> a Fry's special
[20:45] <Ethers0n> (Fry's is an electronics store)
[20:45] <Ethers0n> it's always felt like an HP clone to me
[20:47] <andresmujica> i'll recommend you to fill a bug following this two guides  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LaptopTestingTeam/HotkeyResearch    https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hotkeys/Troubleshooting
[20:47] <Ethers0n> thanks
[20:47] <Ethers0n> will do
[20:47] <andresmujica> it can be against linux kernel or against xserver-xorg-input-evdev
[20:48] <andresmujica> you must find if xev is mapping the wrong key or if it's a kernel level...
[20:48] <Ethers0n> those guides have walkthroughs for that?
[20:48] <andresmujica> i would bet something with fn key..  yeap,
[20:49] <Ethers0n> groovy
[20:49] <andresmujica> those guides can help you
[20:49] <Ethers0n> will check them out
[20:56] <andresmujica> anyone knows how can i test an apport hook against staging?
[20:58] <BUGabundo> not sure you can!
[20:58] <BUGabundo> :(
[20:59] <andresmujica> yeaa.. that's what i've found up to now...
[21:25] <BUGabundo> great
[21:25] <BUGabundo> why the heck did gnome had to change their BTS?
[21:25] <BUGabundo> now I can't find anything :(
[22:47] <kklimonda> probably because their old bts was... old ;P
[22:48] <BUGabundo> eheh
[23:02] <andre__> BUGabundo, what the heck do you think is the reason that this was done?
[23:03] <andre__> Bugzilla 2.20 was a dead-end and does not even receive security fixes. Also, the server was very slow.
[23:06] <BUGabundo> andre__: someone must tell that to mozilla too ehehe
[23:07] <andre__> BUGabundo, what?
[23:07] <andre__> "that"?
[23:07] <BUGabundo> to upgrade
[23:07] <BUGabundo> they still have a similar version to old gnome one
[23:08] <andre__> are you joking?
[23:08] <andre__> you can read, right? upper right corner of  https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/ ?
[23:08] <BUGabundo> eheh
[23:09] <andre__> 3.2.4 is a huge difference to 2.20 i'd say.
[23:09] <BUGabundo> ok ok
[23:09] <BUGabundo> didn't match the version
[23:09] <BUGabundo> don't kill the bug summiter
[23:09] <BUGabundo> or else you will lose one )
[23:10] <andre__> i don't kill. i only prefer facts to fiction when discussing something :)