[00:24]  * sbeattie looks at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs and cries at all the private bugs.
[00:30] <Pici> jpds: /22
[00:30] <Pici> argh
[00:30] <jpds> Pici: wut?
[00:30] <Pici> jpds: that was me mistyping
[00:31] <jpds> Oh, right.
[00:50] <jcastro> bdmurray, rhetorical question
[00:50] <jcastro> A linked bug mean someone has basically triaged it right?
[00:52] <dtchen> well, someone has bothered to look further. I don't know if that really means Triaged
[00:52] <dtchen> e.g., cross-linking between distributions not involving an upstream bug report
[00:53] <jcastro> yeah, I am just wondering if someone has made a link
[00:53] <jcastro> but the bug stays New
[00:53] <jcastro> is someone looking at it?
[00:54] <jcastro> or is someone flailing "hey, debian fixed this 3 months ago!" or whatever
[00:54] <dtchen> which bug?
[00:54] <jcastro> I mean in general
[00:54] <dtchen> maybe neither. If the Debian bug's status is something other than New, perhaps it has been triaged.
[00:55] <micahg> jcastro: sometimes the reporter will link upstream/to another distro
[00:56] <jcastro> right
[00:57] <hggdh> it may just to point out that some other distro has the same problem
[00:59] <greg-g> jcastro: linked specifically to the upstream project, where it is then confirmed upstream, I would consider triaged
[00:59] <hggdh> greg-g: +1
[00:59]  * micahg also does that, +1
[00:59] <jcastro> ok I will start doing it from now on
[01:00] <micahg> jcastro: that's assuming there's enough info upstream
[01:00] <jcastro> right
[01:00] <micahg> which usually there is
[01:00] <jcastro> assuming there's enough for a maintainer to just pull in a patch or a sync or something
[01:00] <jcastro> make sense?
[01:00] <hggdh> well, yes, this is a point -- but it is a good start
[01:01] <hggdh> jcastro: yes, it does
[01:02] <jcastro> so like "This looks developed enough for you to just pull in, so low hanging fruit vs. sitting there all day trying to figure it out."
[01:02] <micahg> well, who's asking a maintainer or a triager?
[01:04] <jcastro> I guess it depends on the person
[01:04] <micahg> if it's a triager, most certainly, if it's a maintainer, then if they have a quick 5 minute solution, I'd say go for it
[01:04] <micahg> but either way it's triaged
[01:04]  * jcastro nods
[04:02] <dogatemycomputer> I am curious about bug #491181.   Do we troubleshooting Firefox plugins?
[04:02] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 491181 in firefox-3.5 "firefox 3.5.5 icedtea bug java app" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/491181
[04:03] <dogatemycomputer> (I'm new to triaging bugs.)
[05:02] <greg-g> hey dogatemycomputer, sorry I haven't responded to your email yet, but I can help with this question
[05:02] <greg-g> so, yeah, if the plugin is provided in the Ubuntu repositories, we try to find the cause and forward it upstream to the developers of the software
[05:06] <greg-g> first of all, we should assign this to the icedtea plugin package, which, after searching https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/ for a package with "icedtea" in the name gives me https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/icedtea-gcjwebplugin
[05:07] <greg-g> so, you want to change the affected project to that, see if you can reproduce it, if you can, confirm it. Then, the really awesome thing would be to find the upstream for it and report the bug there.
[05:07] <greg-g> awesomely, this reporter has a backtrace attached, making triage for a developer that much easier
[05:08] <greg-g> dogatemycomputer: ^^
[05:08] <greg-g> dogatemycomputer: but now, as it is midnight, I'm headed to bed. I'll look at your email tomorrow. Again, sorry about that.
[06:21] <dogatemycomputer> greg-g:  thanks for the help!   The bug does not include enough information to reproduce it.   I copy/pasted the "Missing Steps to Recreate Bug" canned response.  If he can tell me how to reproduce it then I will try and confirm it.
[06:22] <dogatemycomputer> greg-g:  I am not clear if you are implying I should confirm it simply because the backtrace is attached or if you are saying that will just make it easier for them to track it down?
[06:31] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: bug #?
[06:33] <jmarsden> micahg: <dogatemycomputer> I am curious about bug #491181.   Do we troubleshooting Firefox plugins?
[06:33] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 491181 in icedtea-gcjwebplugin "firefox 3.5.5 icedtea bug java app" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/491181
[06:38] <micahg> first, that's not the right package dogatemycomputer
[06:38] <micahg> the package is icedtea6-plugin
[06:39] <micahg> actually, it's openjdk-6
[06:54] <yoasif> hi, anyone around?
[06:54] <micahg> yoasif: sure :)
[06:55] <yoasif> micahg, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/frozen-bubble/+bug/386104 this seems to be a packaging issue, it's live in karmic and it's an easy fix -- libsdl1.2debian-alsa should be removed from recommends and changed to libsdl1.2debian-pulseaudio
[06:55] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 386104 in libsdl1.2 "[karmic] skipping audio when using libsdl1.2debian-alsa" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[07:00] <micahg> yoasif: let me take a look
[07:00] <yoasif> micahg, awesome
[07:03] <micahg> dtchen: are you around?
[07:08] <micahg> yoasif: the problem is the package depends on a dummy package with 7 options, alsa being the first
[07:08] <yoasif> yeah
[07:08] <yoasif> alsa doesn't work properly... not sure if it's a problem with the package
[07:08] <yoasif> or ubuntu's implementation of pulseaudio
[07:08] <micahg> idk
[07:08] <yoasif> but the pulseaudio package fixes it
[07:46] <bhuvi> my cpu fan speed is not detected in karmic but it worked well in hardy
[07:46] <bhuvi> i get acpi resource conflict message during boot
[07:49] <bhuvi> can anyone help me with this
[07:49] <rza_Sharp> where in boot?
[07:49] <rza_Sharp> @ wat point?
[07:50] <bhuvi> before the splash screen comes up
[07:51] <rza_Sharp> but u can bypass it no prob right?
[07:53] <bhuvi> thats not a problem,the problem is i loaded the modules from the sensor-detect command and there is some conflict in assigning acpi resources
[07:53] <bhuvi> so my cpu fan speed is not shown by sensors command
[07:54] <bhuvi> but it was working well in hardy
[08:08] <dogatemycomputer> michahg:  I found icedtea-gcwebplugin .  Are you saying that it should be openjdk-6 instead?
[08:09] <dogatemycomputer> michahg:  nevermind.  looks like you already made the change.  Thanks!
[08:09] <dogatemycomputer> michahg:  Is there someplace I could find this information or is this just one of those things you learn as you go?
[08:13] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: in the attached plugins file it had the version of the plugin, the one you selected has a version of 1.0, the openjdk-6 package is at 1.6.something
[08:15] <dogatemycomputer> michahg:  Thank you for catching that.   I appreciate it.   greg-g is my mentor.  I'm sure he will see your comment so he also knows in the future.
[08:15] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: it's a simple mixup, I happen to be the main triager for Firefox at the moment, that's how I knew where to look
[08:16] <dogatemycomputer> micahg: ahhh..   this is probably my 5th day of trying to triage bugs.   :-)
[08:17] <dogatemycomputer> micahg: for a translation bug..  I posted the canned response.   Should I mark the bug invalid?
[08:18] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: canned response?  what bug #?
[08:18] <dogatemycomputer> micahg: bug #491248
[08:18] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 491248 in ubuntuone-client "russian translation of share dialog" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/491248
[08:18] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: where does it say to do that?
[08:18] <dogatemycomputer> micahg:   The canned response found here:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#About%20an%20incorrect%20translation
[08:19] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: ugh, I don't think that's right, I'll have to bring it up with someone in the morning
[08:19] <dogatemycomputer> micahg: Thank you for taking the time to report this bug and helping to make Ubuntu better. However, Ubuntu gets its translations from the translations portion of Launchpad (http://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/), where translation teams work on making Ubuntu more useful in their language. If you want to change a translation in Ubuntu there is the right place.
[08:19] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: please don't do that :)
[08:19] <micahg> pastebin is more effective, but the link was fine
[08:20] <dogatemycomputer> micahg: I already did.   What should I do now?
[08:20] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: idk, I have to check if the policy's changed
[08:20] <micahg> I thought we just open an upstream bug task to ubuntu translations
[08:20] <micahg> and mark the package bug triaged until it's done
[08:21] <dogatemycomputer> micahg: well..  I guess  I will leave it alone for now unless some documentation appears that tells me what to do otherwise or someone changes it.   I don't want to start guessing when i'm this new.
[08:21] <micahg> dogatemycomputer: yeah, don't worry about it, I'll check in the morning
[08:23] <dogatemycomputer> micahg:  If you want me to contact someone then just let me know.  I don't mind pinging someone to find out if the wiki should be updated.
[08:24] <dogatemycomputer> micahg: have a good night!!
[08:24] <micahg> night dogatemycomputer
[13:24] <gawdzer> hi hi
[14:42] <bddebian> Boo
[14:45] <pedro_> bbuu!
[15:31] <hggdh> pedro_: I think we can go ahead and create the mentorship group; I will update the wiki to refer to it
[15:32] <pedro_> hggdh, cool, i was waiting for some feedback to create it , will do it
[15:32] <hggdh> yes, we really need to organise this ;-)
[15:33] <pedro_> so true :-)
[15:33] <pedro_> so bugsquad-mentorship  or ubuntu-bugsquad-mentorship ?
[15:34] <pedro_> the bugsquad team is called "bugsquad" on lp
[15:34] <hggdh> bugsquad-mentorship, I guess
[15:37] <pedro_> done -> https://edge.launchpad.net/~bugsquad-mentorship
[15:37] <pedro_> will add the mentors we have on the wiki to it now
[15:45] <mac_v_> hmm , is mentorship right , or is it -mentors?
[15:47] <pedro_> mac_v_, it's mentorship since we are not going to have only mentors on that group
[15:48] <mac_v_> pedro_: ah , got it :)
[15:48] <pedro_> students are going to be added there as well
[15:51] <mac_v_> pedro_: i unable to find the mentorship wiki , has it been written yet or...?
[15:52] <pedro_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/Mentors
[15:52] <pedro_> mac_v_, ^ that one you mean?
[15:53] <mac_v_> pedro_: ah, yup , thanks , i was searching for "mentorship" :(
[15:54] <pedro_> heh no problem :-)
[15:57] <hggdh> mac_v_: just bear in mind we are changing the procedure on mentorship right now
[15:58]  * pedro_ -> lunch
[16:01] <mac_v_> hggdh: hmm , ok. Just one doubt :) ... what would be the difference between bugsquad and the beugsuqd-mentorship , if the members can be both mentors and mentees? do they have higher privileges on lp?
[16:02] <hggdh> mac_v_: mentors will need to be bug-controllers (or very experienced bugsquadders), or maintainers
[16:02] <mac_v_> s/beugsuqd/bugsquad
[16:03] <mac_v_> hggdh: yeah , thats the mentor/mentee difference , but i meant difference between the two groups
[16:03] <hggdh> graduation from the mentorship will land the mentee into bug-control (this is the idea)
[16:03] <mac_v_> ah , ok
[16:04] <hggdh> bugsquad-mentorship is where you apply for mentorship, and where mentors look for mentees
[16:04] <hggdh> bugsquad  is going to be a closed group
[16:04] <WeatherGod> what do you mean by "closed group"?
[16:04] <hggdh> (i.e., you will have to apply, and be accepted)
[16:05] <WeatherGod> does this mean that ORs won't be able to modify statuses on bug reports?
[16:05] <mac_v_> hggdh: then bugsquad/bugcontrol difference? and what will happen to existing bugsquad members?
[16:06] <hggdh> current bugsquad members will receive an email stating their membership is expiring, and will have to reapply
[16:06] <hggdh> we are pretty sure that most of the 1800 current members are not there anymore
[16:07] <maco> why is bugsquad being closed?
[16:07] <WeatherGod> heh
[16:07] <maco> ok thats fair nuff
[16:07] <mac_v_> yup , the members are not active ;)
[16:07] <WeatherGod> so is this more to get a better idea of the active membership?
[16:07] <maco> but what will being approved look like?
[16:07] <maco> because BS isnt supposed to have BC's reqs
[16:08] <hggdh> maco, indeed
[16:09] <hggdh> right now it will be the same
[16:09] <hggdh> but we need to know how many bs's are actually there
[16:10] <maco> so everybody reapplies and then is auto-approved?
[16:10] <maco> or are you saying BS need to fill out form like BC now?
[16:10] <WeatherGod> hggdh, regarding that email... I think we need to be careful not to turn off some of the more casual members
[16:10] <mac_v_> hggdh: that can be done by asking members just re-apply
[16:10] <mac_v_> hggdh: but couldnt the mentor/mentee be done within bugsquad team itself? [/me knows its too many questions , but didnt understand why a separate -mentorship team was needed]
[16:11] <mac_v_> if the members has done good in the BS , then they can go to BC ;)
[16:11] <mac_v_> member*
[16:12] <hggdh> WeatherGod: this wil be the same as what happens now with bc
[16:12] <mac_v_> iirc BC is every 6months , which is quite good
[16:13] <WeatherGod> hggdh, I understand, but usually people involved in BC are much more committed to this
[16:13] <WeatherGod> hggdh, we could use this opportunity to renew interest in BS
[16:14] <WeatherGod> even if we can get back a few members, that would be useful
[16:16] <hggdh> WeatherGod: yes, the pre-reqs for bc are more stricter than bs.
[16:17] <hggdh> there is also a chance that, upon receiving the renewal email, a (currently MIA) bs will come back
[16:17] <hggdh> mac_v_: I do not think mentor/mentee would work within bs
[16:17] <WeatherGod> that is what I am hoping... it will matter by how the email is worded
[16:18] <hggdh> heh
[16:18] <hggdh> yes. I would expect it will be very similar to what we have on bc
[16:21] <mac_v_> hggdh: hmm , most of the members listed as mentors on the wiki are also members of BC , it could have just been mentioned that these members are BC and are available for mentorship at these times , and the BS will have only mentees , who can graduate to BC... [but having both mentors and mentees in - mentorship didnt seem right]
[16:22] <mac_v_> anyways , you probably have a reason for the new team :)
[16:22] <mac_v_> and I'm just not understanding it ;)
[16:23] <WeatherGod> mac_v_'s explanation makes sense to me
[16:23] <hggdh> mac_v_: the bs-mentorship list carries all mentors (permanently); mentees have to apply (the group is closed), and remain members only while being mentored
[16:24] <hggdh> this is easier than to manually list all mentors in the Wiki (we can just link to LP)
[16:24] <hggdh> and the current process (fully manual) was not working
[16:25] <hggdh> so, at any instant, we can find who is a mentee
[16:25] <mac_v_> hehe , easier to pull up by the ear ;p
[16:25] <WeatherGod> also, wouldn't this allow some people to remain members of BS instead of being forced to graduate to BC?
[16:26] <hggdh> yes
[16:26] <hggdh> BRB, gotta drive my wife to the airport
[16:26] <WeatherGod> ok, that makes sense
[16:26] <WeatherGod> ok
[16:28] <hggdh> a parting thought: I would like to continue this discussion when I get back
[16:28] <WeatherGod> np
[18:22] <hggdh> k, I am back
[18:25] <WeatherGod> hiya
[18:26] <hggdh> any new comments or questions on the mentorship?
[18:27] <WeatherGod> actually, I got sidetracked going over old bugs from a few weeks ago
[18:28] <WeatherGod> I think we are largely in agreement, it probably just needs a little bit of polish to make sure everything is clear and well-organized
[18:29] <hggdh> it does. What has happened is we started it with some ideas, and found that it got complex to manage
[18:30] <hggdh> so we are adjusting as we go
[18:30] <WeatherGod> it definitely would be good to streamline and automate the mentoring process
[18:31] <WeatherGod> it just seemed a bit haphazard when I jumped in
[18:31] <hggdh> this is the idea. You got in early -- and helped show the shortcomings ;-)
[18:32] <WeatherGod> one thing that would be nice is that one could see potential mentors and see what areas of expertise
[18:32] <WeatherGod> oh, this mentor this is relatively new?
[18:32] <WeatherGod> s/this/thing/
[18:33] <hggdh> yes, it is. We did have it, but it was completely unstructured (some of us did mentor before, but not formally)
[18:33] <WeatherGod> ah
[18:33] <hggdh> I guess the mentor's areas of interest is one thing that should still be kept in the wiki page
[18:34] <WeatherGod> yeah, but one could see the project areas that a person is involved in through their launchpad page
[18:36] <WeatherGod> we probably also want to make clear what sort of goals need to be achieved to be considered "graduated", maybe?
[18:38] <WeatherGod> the GettingInvolved page still says to email ubuntu-bugcontrol maillist to request a mentor, is that still the case?
[18:40] <WeatherGod> someone here speak French?
[18:40] <WeatherGod> I need this statement made into good French
[18:40] <WeatherGod> which restricted drivers did you end up installing
[18:41] <Pici> WeatherGod: Try ##french
[18:41] <WeatherGod> ok
[18:42] <hggdh> WeatherGod: another channel might be #ubuntu-fr
[18:43] <hggdh> WeatherGod: I will adjust the wiki to state one has to request admission to the bs-mentorship group
[18:44] <WeatherGod> hggdh: that might be better place to go...
[18:45] <WeatherGod> what does it mean when an IRC group has double '#'?
[18:45] <hggdh> etali: wow you were fast ;-)
[18:48] <Pici> WeatherGod: ##channels are topical or unoffical channels. See http://freenode.net/policy.shtml#channelnaming and #freenode for more information
[18:52] <WeatherGod> Pici: thanks
[18:53] <WeatherGod> hggdh: the #ubuntu-fr was very helpful
[18:53] <micahg> hggdh: dogatemycomputer pointed this out to me last night: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#About%20an%20incorrect%20translation
[18:53] <etali> •hggdh• - hehe, was following the discussion, figured I'd apply while I still had the URL handy :)
[18:53] <micahg> hggdh: doesn't seem right
[18:55] <hggdh> micahg: this is sort of weird indeed
[18:56] <micahg> hggdh: I thought we open an upstream task to Ubuntu Translations...
[18:56] <micahg> hggdh: should I add it to the meeting agenda?
[18:56] <micahg> hggdh: I think we need a 2 hr meeting next week :)
[18:56] <hggdh> I think you should -- it is a bug, after all
[18:56] <WeatherGod> micahg: hggdh: also, the wording of that canned response is poor
[18:57] <hggdh> pedro_: ^^^ any comments?
[18:57] <WeatherGod> "If you want to change a translation in Ubuntu there is the right place"?
[18:57] <hggdh> heh
[18:58] <WeatherGod> Probably should be "fix" or "correct" a translation
[18:58] <WeatherGod> and "that" instead of "there"
[18:59] <WeatherGod> with a comma after Ubuntu
[18:59] <hggdh> indeed.
[18:59] <hggdh> But I wonder if we should also clear it up
[18:59] <hggdh> WeatherGod: anyway, these errors justify the corrections you proposed. Care to get it done? ;-)
[19:00] <hggdh> (and please add a comment about what you changed)
[19:00] <WeatherGod> hggdh: sure, I'll clear it up
[19:01] <hggdh> thank you
[19:01] <WeatherGod> s/clear/clean/
[19:01] <WeatherGod> np
[19:01] <greg-g> dogatemycomputer: did everything make sense last night? I see micahg helped out finding the right package (thanks micahg!).
[19:01] <pedro_> hggdh, that sounds weird indeed
[19:01] <hggdh> no, I meant better state what should be done
[19:01] <pedro_> after making that change could you folks ping dpm to comment on that as well?
[19:02] <pedro_> he's coordinating the translations on Ubuntu so he might have a better stock response for that
[19:02] <pedro_> btw tomorrow is the translations bug day so perfect time to raise that with him :-)
[19:02] <hggdh> cool. pedro_, is there a channel for the translators?
[19:04] <pedro_>  #ubuntu-translators IIRC
[19:04] <pedro_> yes, that's the channel
[19:04] <hggdh> thank you
[19:05] <pedro_> np
[19:06] <hggdh> k, put the question to them, waiting on feedback
[19:06] <WeatherGod> ok, why doesn't Ubuntu's wiki system have "edit" links for sections... like wikipedia has?
[19:07] <WeatherGod> it makes it so difficult to find the text you want to edit on a large page like that
[19:07] <hggdh> yes. One way is to use an external editor
[19:07] <WeatherGod> oh?
[19:08] <hggdh> but now I have to remember the command, long time I do not use it
[19:12] <hggdh> WeatherGod: editmoin
[19:13] <WeatherGod> ok, I will look into it
[19:14] <WeatherGod> thanks
[19:32] <hggdh> WeatherGod: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs#Filing%20translation%20bugs
[19:34] <kklimonda> I'd give my right arm if Canonical decided to only support a small number of hardware..
[19:34]  * kklimonda is dying from answering questions about why some weird/obscure hardware doesn't work well/at all..
[19:34] <WeatherGod> welcome to PC hell
[19:35] <WeatherGod> it is certainly better than it was a few years ago (at least, so it seems)
[19:36] <WeatherGod> hggdh, it looks fine to me
[19:36] <WeatherGod> I would probably do without the "if a"
[19:37] <WeatherGod> otherwise, looks informative
[19:37] <WeatherGod> sorry about being in such a grammar mode.... I am in the middle of revising journal articles for submission
[19:38] <hggdh> :-) I have done revisions also
[19:39] <WeatherGod> isn't bug triaging a nice distraction from writing?
[19:39] <WeatherGod> :-P
[19:39] <hggdh> WeatherGod: either you or I can update the stock response linking to the topic above
[19:40] <WeatherGod> ah, update it to point to the correct url?
[19:41] <WeatherGod> oh, wait, no, I see
[19:41] <WeatherGod> well, this is the stock response... what do we want to say?
[19:42] <WeatherGod> I am assuming this would be the response to use when switching the report over to the ubuntu-translations project?
[19:44] <WeatherGod> so, just setting it to a new url isn't right
[19:44] <hggdh> I think it would go like: thank you, etc, etc. Translations bugs should be assigned to the [[ https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-translations|Ubuntu Translations project ]]; as such, we adjusted the package to it
[19:44] <hggdh> so something in this area
[19:45] <hggdh> s/so/or/
[19:45] <hggdh> adiroiban on #ubuntu-translators told me the process there is in flux right now
[19:47] <WeatherGod> "Thank you for taking the time to report this bug and helping to make Ubuntu better.  Translations in Ubuntu are handled by the Ubuntu Translations project, so we are going to push this bug report over to that project"
[19:47] <WeatherGod> heh, still needs something better
[19:48] <WeatherGod> maybe "... so that the correction can be made"?
[19:48] <hggdh> not bad at all
[19:48] <WeatherGod> or be addressed
[19:48] <hggdh> just make the Ubuntu Translations project a link
[19:48] <WeatherGod> of course
[19:48] <fujimitsu> how about "move" instead of "push"
[19:48] <WeatherGod> good idea
[19:48] <hggdh> no "so that corrections can be made" sounds rather stiffy
[19:48] <WeatherGod> probably translate better, too
[19:49] <hggdh> and move instead of push, indeed
[19:49] <WeatherGod> ok
[19:50] <WeatherGod> for the link, can I just do [[ubuntu-translations]]?
[19:50] <hggdh> WeatherGod: thank you very much (and thank you, micahg1, for raising this up)
[19:50] <hggdh> WeatherGod: try it, and see if it resolves
[19:50] <hggdh> kklimonda: heh
[19:51] <kklimonda> hggdh: a big lag? ;)
[19:51] <hggdh> :-D
[19:51] <hggdh> doing some ten different things at the same time...
[20:00] <WeatherGod> ok, done
[20:04] <hggdh> WeatherGod: perfect! Thank you (again)
[20:05] <WeatherGod> np
[20:05] <WeatherGod> maybe I should get back to doing the work I am actually paid to do
[20:05] <WeatherGod> :-P
[20:07] <hggdh> well, I firmly believe I need money. The hell is that this is fun
[20:08] <WeatherGod> heh
[20:15] <WeatherGod> how should bug 464087 get marked
[20:15] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 464087 in update-manager "Upgrade to Kubuntu 9.10 failed because site became unavailable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/464087
[20:15] <WeatherGod> it could be construed as a wishlist for better load-balancing of the servers before the next release
[20:19] <hggdh> hum. Not as much load-balancing, as graceful recovery from TCP errors
[20:19] <WeatherGod> whatever the case... I am not a network engineer
[20:20] <WeatherGod> it is something that we need to be better prepared for the LTS
[20:20] <WeatherGod> I think many of the bugs we encountered were from faulty upgrades
[20:20] <WeatherGod> well, at least some of them
[20:23] <hggdh> I agree, in part: u-m should be able to either recover or fail in a nice way
[20:24] <hggdh> heh. It seems my sound got, er, lost
[20:24] <kklimonda> we should also test all packages with piuparts - there were some problematic updates in 9.04->9.10
[20:25] <WeatherGod> agreed
[20:25] <WeatherGod> hggdh: lost?
[20:25] <hggdh> like no longer here
[20:26] <WeatherGod> ok, let me pull out my debug sheet here...
[20:26] <WeatherGod> is your computer on?
[20:26] <WeatherGod> :-P
[20:26] <hggdh> :-)
[20:27] <kklimonda> have you tried to turn it off and on again? ;)
[20:27] <WeatherGod> no, no... you got to unplug it and reverse the cords
[20:27] <hggdh> ah, polarity issues
[20:28] <WeatherGod> yeah... and be sure to just completely uninstall pulseaudio... because some guy in a Fedora forum said that would work
[20:36] <WeatherGod> hggdh, how should that bug report get marked?
[20:38] <kklimonda> argh, people who uninstall pulseaudio "just in case" should be burned...
[20:39] <hggdh> heh
[20:39] <hggdh> WeatherGod: search for previous bugs on u-m with requests for nicier erroring out
[20:40] <WeatherGod> ok
[20:40] <hggdh> if none, then re-title this one to something like "update-manger should gracefully error out or recover from Internet failures"
[20:40] <hggdh> and we will mark it triaged/wishlist
[20:41] <WeatherGod> gotcha
[21:04] <elMariachi> hi
[21:05] <elMariachi> I'm having problems with the follwing page giving me timeout since yesterday evening (it's evening now again in my timezone ;) )
[21:05] <elMariachi> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug
[21:07] <mrand> elMariachi: that link works great here... actually much faster than usual.  Having said that, do you know what package/application you are trying to report a bug against?  It would be great  if you could issue a "ubuntu-bug <package>" command in a terminal/shell window.  That collects info and automatically sorts it into the correct bucket.  The main ubuntu bug bucket is overflowing.
[21:08] <elMariachi> mrand: no i cant say which package it is
[21:08] <WeatherGod> elMariachi, I talked to you yesterday, right
[21:08] <elMariachi> right
[21:08] <WeatherGod> what was your bug, again?
[21:09] <elMariachi> the freeze thingy
[21:09] <elMariachi> but with different hardware
[21:09] <WeatherGod> at boot, right?
[21:09] <WeatherGod> right
[21:09] <elMariachi> no, at login to normal gnome session
[21:09] <elMariachi> failsafe works fine
[21:09] <elMariachi> it seeeeems to be connected to the usage of compiz
[21:09] <WeatherGod> mrand, I have no clue exactly what is at fault
[21:10] <WeatherGod> but I am working on untangling a messy bug report
[21:10] <elMariachi> mrand: I'm getting this error message: Error ID: OOPS-1432G2939
[21:10] <ubot4> https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=1432G2939
[21:10] <WeatherGod> I am having them all subscribe me to it, so don't worry about the overflowing Ubuntu bin right now
[21:10] <mrand> gotcha
[21:13] <mrand> elMariachi: can you browse any of launchpad?
[21:13] <elMariachi> yes
[21:13] <WeatherGod> mrand, odd bug, isn't it?
[21:14] <elMariachi> actually the timeout happens, when i hit the continue button
[21:14] <elMariachi> the page itself loads
[21:14] <elMariachi> sorry, forgot to say that :/
[21:15] <mrand> Ok, so it's the next page that has all the fancy "could it be this bug" list that is failing.
[21:16] <elMariachi> if that is the next page ;)
[21:16] <mrand> You could maybe try bugs.edge.launchpad.net.  I don't hold out high hope though, cause it has the same thing.
[21:17] <elMariachi> there is this message box saying, that i can disable redirection for two ours
[21:17] <elMariachi> that doesn't change anything..
[21:17] <elMariachi> hours
[21:18] <mrand> WeatherGod: what do you think about just having elMariachi try to submit it using "ubuntu-bug gnome-session" and then move it as needed?   Oh wait, unfortunately I think that still takes you to that screen on the browser, so it'll likely not work either.
[21:18] <mrand> too bad the cli version of ubuntu-bug isn't released (that I'm aware of)
[21:18] <WeatherGod> I thought it was
[21:18] <WeatherGod> (I don't know, I am using Fedora right now)
[21:20] <WeatherGod> we can file the bug against anything we want, I just want to see it filed
[21:20] <WeatherGod> just a crazy thought....
[21:20] <WeatherGod> could there be issues with Firewalls or Proxies?
[21:21] <elMariachi> sorry, gotta go to bed.. i'm gonna try to file it against compiz tomorrow
[21:21] <mrand> That's what I'm thinking, but that's out of my area of comfortable knowledge.
[21:21] <WeatherGod> sorry for your troubles
[21:21] <WeatherGod> same here
[21:21] <elMariachi> naaa, dont worry
[21:21] <elMariachi> im using the os that we all dislike in the meantime
[21:21] <mrand> WeatherGod: there is apport-cli -p <packagename>, but that only works if there is a crash report pending
[21:22] <WeatherGod> ah, that might be what I am thinking
[21:27] <bdmurray> apport-cli -f -p packagename then K for keep
[21:27] <bdmurray> then you can copy the bug report to another system and file it from there
[21:27] <bdmurray> WeatherGod: ^
[21:27] <WeatherGod> hmmm, good to know... I got another guy who is having network issues
[21:28] <WeatherGod> still, I wonder if the guy in question can access the webpage from anywhere else
[21:28] <WeatherGod> guess we will find out tomorrow
[21:31] <WeatherGod> hggdh, with regards to the u-m bug report
[21:31] <WeatherGod> I am finding some other reports that also stated possible overloaded servers, but are very light on details
[21:31] <WeatherGod> is it ok for now to create a "chain" of dupes?
[21:55] <hggdh> WeatherGod: yes, it is
[21:56] <WeatherGod> ok, I will chain up some of the ones I found to the "meaner" one in the hopes of finding another report to use as the master
[21:57] <hggdh> k
[22:50] <dragon> !info sreadahead
[22:50] <dragon> ubot4: hi
[22:50] <ubot4> Hi! Welcome to #ubuntu-bugs! Feel free to ask questions and help people out. The channel guidelines are at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines. Enjoy your stay!
[22:50] <dragon> ubot4: into sreadahead
[22:50] <ubot4> Factoid 'into sreadahead' not found
[22:51] <dragon> ubot4: info sreadahead
[22:51] <ubot4> dragon: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.
[22:51] <dragon> Is it broken or does it not work at all?
[22:51] <dragon> I wish ubotu were here.
[22:51] <WeatherGod> dunno...
[22:51] <WeatherGod> !info apport
[22:51]  * hggdh kicks ubot4
[22:52] <WeatherGod> don't kick the baby
[22:52] <hggdh> punch is OK?
[22:52] <dragon> Any way, sreadahead is a transitional package in karmic and ubuntu-desktop depends on it. Is that a bug?
[22:52] <WeatherGod> sure
[22:52] <dragon> !who | WeatherGod
[22:52] <ubot4> WeatherGod: As you can see, this is a large channel. If you're speaking to someone in particular, please put their nickname in what you say (use !tab), or else messages get lost and it becomes confusing :)
[22:52] <dragon> :)
[22:53] <dragon> see, the kick helped.
[22:54] <WeatherGod> hggdh, I got to go home now... but I have gotten a lot of bugs marked as dupes of bug 464087
[22:54] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 464087 in update-manager "Upgrade to Kubuntu 9.10 failed because site became unavailable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/464087
[22:54] <WeatherGod> and of bug 489403
[22:54] <dragon> I don't want to !repeat :(
[22:54] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 489403 in update-manager "Update Manager experiences problem upgrading to '9.10'" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/489403
[22:54] <WeatherGod> they might both be related... but I grouped the 404 errors into the second one
[22:54] <dragon> Oh hey, I experienced a problem with update manager last night.
[22:55] <WeatherGod> plus, the second one seemed to happen over the past month
[22:55] <dragon> But no tengo enough time to file a bug for that :(
[22:55] <hggdh> 404 may be a result of mirrors lagging behind
[22:55] <WeatherGod> well, we can still mark one as a dupe of the other, if needed
[22:55] <WeatherGod> I still haven't gotten all the reports marked yet, but those are my two groups
[22:56] <hggdh> k
[22:56] <WeatherGod> ok, ttyl
[22:56] <hggdh> g'night, WeatherGod
[22:56] <dragon> bye WeatherDog
[22:57] <dragon> sreadahead is a transitional package in karmic and ubuntu-desktop depends on it. Is that a bug?
[22:58] <hggdh> dragon: it could be looked as one, but not for karmic (it does work there, does it not?)
[23:01] <dragon> hggdh: not sure what you mean
[23:01] <dragon> karmic is working flawlessly, but this transitional package is present
[23:03] <yofel> dragon: sreadahead was replaced by ureadahead after release, that's why the package is there
[23:04] <dragon> yofel: and ubuntu-desktop depends on it.
[23:04] <yofel> yes
[23:04] <hggdh> dragon: I am not sure I understand what is the issue
[23:04] <yofel> since it depended on sreadahead on release
[23:04] <dragon> yofel: ubuntu-desktop depends on a transitional package.
[23:04] <hggdh> and?
[23:05] <yofel> dragon: yes, but when karmic was released it wasn't a transitional package
[23:05] <dragon> I understand it already dependent on sreadahead at the time of release, but shouldn't it be dependent on ureadahead and not sreadahead now?
[23:05] <dragon> s/it already/it was already
[23:06] <yofel> dragon: yes, and that will be fixed for lucid, but something like that doesn't justify a karmic SRU
[23:06] <yofel> since it doesn't break anything
[23:06] <dragon> yofel: ok, I get it now.
[23:07] <dragon> thanks
[23:07] <yofel> actually it's already fixed in lucid
[23:10] <dragon> i see, cool


[00:01] <Quintasan> PROGRESS
[00:01] <Quintasan> :D
[00:01] <Quintasan> argh, why the hell there is a SEGV in there?
[00:02] <apachelogger> doesnt like you
[00:03] <Quintasan> apachelogger: that's not a reason to spew SEGV's at me :S
[00:03] <Quintasan> apachelogger: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/69524/troll.tar.gz
[00:03] <Quintasan> :P
[00:03]  * Quintasan is going to regret this
[00:04] <apachelogger> hm
[00:04] <apachelogger> valgrind talks about memleaks in X and fontconfig \o/
[00:04] <apachelogger> with a qt hello world app
[00:05] <apachelogger> also still getting loads of possible losses regarding eventdispatcherglib
[00:05] <Quintasan> apachelogger: btw. I've asked this, if I'm doing (inside a constructor) QPushButton *problemButton = new QPushButton(somecraphere, [wtf to put as a parent?]
[00:06] <Quintasan> this?
[00:06] <apachelogger> jefferai: http://people.ubuntu.com/~apachelogger/tmp/valgrind.log should you ever get example files, maybe this helps too :)
[00:06] <apachelogger> it's from a hello world example
[00:06] <apachelogger> http://doc.trolltech.com/4.3/tutorial-t1.html
[00:06] <jefferai> apachelogger: tell thiago this
[00:06] <jefferai> :-)
[00:06] <jefferai> or tzander
[00:06] <Quintasan> apachelogger: 60mb of memory?
[00:07] <apachelogger> Quintasan: yup
[00:07] <jefferai> but don't tell them I told you
[00:07] <Quintasan> wth
[00:07] <jefferai> heh
[00:07] <Quintasan> hey don't tell me that my TrollFace app steals even more @_@
[00:07] <apachelogger> hm
[00:07] <apachelogger> jefferai: you shouldn't have said that
[00:07] <jefferai> heh
[00:07] <jefferai> where do you see 60mb?
[00:08] <Quintasan> megabytes :P
[00:08] <Quintasan> possibly lost: 59,018 bytes in 970 blocks
[00:08] <JontheEchidna> that's 5.9 kb
[00:09] <jefferai> no
[00:09] <Quintasan> 0.45 megabyte
[00:09] <jefferai> that's 59 kb
[00:09] <JontheEchidna> yeah, woops
[00:09] <Quintasan> :O
[00:09] <JontheEchidna> not MB though
[00:09] <jefferai> nobody can do math
[00:10] <Quintasan> okay, everything is fine, apart from the whole app throwing SEGV's all around
[00:12] <Quintasan> omfg, it's not the image's fault that the app i crashing
[00:12] <Quintasan> is*
[00:17] <apachelogger> Quintasan: did I just break it or is the resource file empty?
[00:17] <Quintasan> ...
[00:18] <Quintasan> it's empy here too
[00:18] <Quintasan> wtf
[00:18] <apachelogger> well
[00:19] <apachelogger> need I say more
[00:19] <Quintasan> hah
[00:19] <Quintasan> apachelogger: even if you add the trollface it still fails to display it
[00:19] <Quintasan> dunno why :S
[00:20] <Quintasan> apachelogger: fixed tarball -> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/69524/App1.tar.gz
[00:20] <Quintasan> though it still spews crap at me :(
[00:23] <apachelogger> well
[00:24] <apachelogger> Quintasan: I would use QPixmap to begin with
[00:24] <apachelogger> "The QPicture class is a paint device that records and replays QPainter commands."
[00:24] <apachelogger> that does not sound like you want that :P
[00:25]  * Quintasan hugs apachelogger
[00:25] <Quintasan> works
[00:25] <Quintasan> :DDD
[00:26] <Quintasan> argh
[00:27] <Quintasan> apachelogger: one more thing
[00:27] <Quintasan> apachelogger: void TrollFace::Troll()
[00:27] <Quintasan> apachelogger: when I put there trollImage->show(); and then click on the button the whole app segfaults
[00:27] <Quintasan> :S
[00:31] <apachelogger> ohm
[00:35] <apachelogger> ah
[00:35] <apachelogger> uh
[00:35] <apachelogger> lol
[00:35] <apachelogger> rofl
[00:35] <apachelogger> hahahha
[00:35]  * apachelogger needs to check something
[00:36] <apachelogger> ^^
[00:36] <apachelogger> well then
[00:36] <apachelogger> how do I put this
[00:36] <apachelogger> Quintasan: what would "QLabel *trollImage = new QLabel(this);" do?
[00:37] <apachelogger> outside the context of your app
[00:37] <apachelogger> in general
[00:37] <apachelogger> what would that line do
[00:37] <Quintasan> create a pointer to QLabel object with...
[00:37] <Quintasan> omfg
[00:37] <apachelogger> ah ^^
[00:37] <apachelogger> what scope does that object have :P
[00:38] <apachelogger> class scope?
[00:38] <Quintasan> :S
[00:38] <Quintasan> so what should I put as a parent in that constructor?
[00:38] <apachelogger> also mind the live time
[00:38] <apachelogger> see
[00:38] <apachelogger> trollImage = new QLabel(this);
[00:38] <apachelogger> !=
[00:38] <apachelogger> QLabel *trollImage = new QLabel(this);
[00:39] <apachelogger> with the former you asign the member pointer trollImage a QLabel object on the heap
[00:39] <apachelogger> with the latter you create an entirely new pointer of local scope and life time
[00:39] <apachelogger> the member however stays untouched
[00:39] <Quintasan> argh
[00:39] <apachelogger> and that is why you get a segfault, because obviously the member will point to some random junk
[00:40] <apachelogger> that said it would be much more sensible to initialize member pointers to 0 IMHO :P
[00:40] <Quintasan> apachelogger: I see it now :S
[00:40] <apachelogger> also makes tracking of the issue easier
[00:40] <apachelogger> if you init to 0
[00:40] <apachelogger> and then you get a segfault because you are trying to access 0
[00:40] <Quintasan> apachelogger: still, what I
[00:40] <apachelogger> well, then obivously the assignment went wrong
[00:41] <apachelogger> btw
[00:41] <apachelogger>     trollImage->setPixmap(QPixmap(":/img/troll.png"));
[00:41] <apachelogger> that is how I would load the pixmap ;)
[00:41] <apachelogger> + problemButton and trollImage need ot be parented
[00:42] <apachelogger> + IMHO you need to revise your member var names ;)
[00:42] <Quintasan> 4th time I ask this
[00:42] <apachelogger> + you will have to update the widget size once the image is shown
[00:42] <Quintasan> hngh
[00:42] <Quintasan> those are minor thng
[00:42] <Quintasan> crap
[00:42] <Quintasan> I'm having problems with typing :S
[00:43] <apachelogger> also, IMHO you should only create the qlable and load the pixmap in Troll()
[00:43] <apachelogger> otherwise it sits in mem for no good reason
[00:43] <Quintasan> apachelogger: Sput told me to parentize my widgets because I will not remember to delete them later, what should I use as the PARENT when I'm declaring things in CONSTRUCTOR?
[00:44] <apachelogger>     trollImage = new QLabel(this);
[00:44] <apachelogger> as per documentation there is this constructor that expects at first arg a pointer to a qwidget
[00:45] <apachelogger> since TrollFace's base class is QWidget, and since this is a builtin pointer you just use this
[00:45] <apachelogger> same for the qpushbutton
[00:45] <apachelogger>     problemButton = new QPushButton(tr("problemButton", "Problem, officer?"),
[00:45] <apachelogger>                                                  this);
[00:45] <apachelogger> oh, actuall
[00:45] <apachelogger> Quintasan: inside a qobject you can use tr() ;)
[00:45] <apachelogger> another intersting thing to remember
[00:46] <Quintasan> awesome
[00:46] <apachelogger> Quintasan: and finally ... you dont necessarily need to parent the members, but if you dont you need to create an appropriate dtor
[00:46] <Quintasan> dtor?
[00:46] <apachelogger> so usually you want to parent them ;)
[00:46] <apachelogger> Quintasan: destructor
[00:46] <Quintasan> oh
[00:46] <apachelogger> ctor = constructor; dtor = destructor
[00:47] <Quintasan> I still don't entirely get the "Trollface::Trollface(QWidget *parent) : QWidget(parent)" line
[00:47] <Quintasan> especially the : QWidget(parent)
[00:47] <apachelogger> you initialize a QWidget using the parent pointer you got
[00:48] <Quintasan> I understood like this
[00:49] <Quintasan> Trollface::Trollface(QWidget *parent) needs a pointer to QWidget, right? So we create a QWidget and pass it to Trollface :P
[00:49] <Quintasan> maybe that's why I don't get it somehow
[00:52] <Quintasan> apachelogger: http://www.cprogramming.com/tutorial/initialization-lists-c++.html is that what I'm looking for?
[00:52] <apachelogger> ehm
[00:52] <apachelogger> how do I put that
[00:53] <apachelogger> well
[00:53] <apachelogger> Quintasan: TrollFace _is a_ QWidget
[00:53] <apachelogger> right?
[00:53] <apachelogger> it is a special kind of QWidget, but still a QWidget
[00:53] <Quintasan> yeah
[00:54] <apachelogger> the idea of polymorphism is that you can address it as QWidget even though it is a specific QWidget
[00:54] <apachelogger> i.e. the QWidget is the base class of TrollFace
[00:54] <ScottK> Polymorphism makes my head hurt.
[00:55] <apachelogger> now the thing is, in order to work with TrollFace as if it were a QWidget (i.e. access it members and all) it needs its very own instance of QWidget
[00:55] <apachelogger> hm
[00:55] <apachelogger> imagine it like a matrjoschka
[00:56] <apachelogger> outside you have TrollFace, and inside is a QWidget
[00:56] <apachelogger> and IIRC inside the QWidget is a QObject
[00:56] <apachelogger> so you create a TrollFace and the TrollFace creates a QWidget and the QWidget creates a QObject
[00:56] <apachelogger> !
[00:56] <apachelogger> but
[00:57] <apachelogger> say you dont define no constructor
[00:57] <apachelogger> then the compiler will make a rather crappy one for you
[00:57] <apachelogger> called default ctor
[00:57] <imbrandon> dont define no :)
[00:57] <apachelogger> that thingy takes absolutely no arguments is the biggest crap evar
[00:58] <apachelogger> additionally that thingy will call the default ctor of QWidget
[00:58] <apachelogger> and so on
[00:58] <apachelogger> until everything is one way or another constructed
[00:58] <Quintasan> apachelogger: so and default constructor for TrollFace would be TrollFace() which calls QWidget() which calls QObject() and each and everyone is empty?
[00:59] <apachelogger> if you define a ctor but do not explictly initialize an instance of the base class as you do with : QWidget(parent) the compiler will still be fancy and automatically use the default ctor of QWidget
[00:59] <apachelogger> we do not want that
[00:59] <apachelogger> we want to allow ourselfs (or maybe a user of our class) to define a parent
[01:00] <apachelogger> i.e. maybe is trollface a child of another QWidget because TrollFace gest embedd in Amarok or something
[01:00] <apachelogger> so you implement a default constructor that can (but doesnt need to) access one argument
[01:00] <apachelogger> of the type QWidget*
[01:01] <apachelogger> now, earlier I said that a default ctor is one that does not accept nor arguments (<= imbrandon :P)
[01:01] <apachelogger> and this is archived by making 0 a default for that QWidget*
[01:02] <apachelogger> so if I want a TrollFace I can do TrollFace() or TrollFace(randomQWidget*)
[01:02] <apachelogger> both will use the same ctor
[01:02]  * Quintasan saves that for later
[01:03] <apachelogger> and in order to pass the latter on to the base of TrollFace (i.e. QWidget) we init QWidget ourselfs
[01:04] <apachelogger> finally please note that, would you not do that, the compiler would call QWidget() and you affectively would end up without parent, because the parent magic is implemented somewhere beyond QWidget, so since the compiler calls QWidget(), your base will not know anything about the parent...
[01:04] <apachelogger> if that makes any sense ^^
[01:04]  * apachelogger should have gone to bed 2 hours ago
[01:04] <apachelogger> o/
[01:04] <apachelogger> nini
[01:04] <Quintasan> nini
[01:04]  * Quintasan goes to bed too
[01:05] <apachelogger> Quintasan: oh, btw, the dtor will thanks to the same magic call the default dtor of the base class, so any memory the base class uses is freed again ;)
[01:05] <apachelogger> unless you use glib :P
[01:08] <Quintasan> apachelogger:  I don't get anything you say to me but it's because lack of sleep :P
[01:33] <ScottK> Tm_T: In ~75 minutes there will be new clamav packages in lucid-proposed.  Could you install them and verify clamav-daemon works (doesn't segfault on start)?
[01:33] <ScottK> It's a powerpc specific fix.
[01:38]  * genii slides Tm_T a super-caffeinated coffee
[01:44] <ScottK> Not a great rush in any case since it has to properly age in -proposed before it can move to -updates.
[02:55] <ScottK> nixternal: Done with powerpc for a while so you can turn it off again if you didn't already.
[03:41] <imbrandon> hum ok so i want to use a gst pipe in pyqt directly instead of phonon, anyone played with that ?
[03:48] <nixternal> http://www.gtmf.us/
[03:49] <nixternal> http://tinyurl.com/2fj6lzv
[03:50] <JontheEchidna> heh
[03:51] <imbrandon> nixternal: bleh
[03:51] <nixternal> I have always wanted to do that to someone
[03:51] <JontheEchidna> This is a personal favorite of mine: http://imagemacros.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/rtfm_noob.jpg
[03:51] <nixternal> finally, and go figure, it is the hillbilly that I get it with :)
[03:51] <nixternal> haha, nice
[03:52] <imbrandon> LOL
[03:53] <nixternal> wish my cycling clothes would hurry up and finish washing...i need sleep!
[04:11] <nixternal> and they are done...good night all!!!
[04:13] <ScottK> nixternal: You should probably 'dent your laundry status before you go to sleep.
[04:15] <imbrandon> lol
[04:48] <JontheEchidna> whoa, these are seriously neat: http://leogg.wordpress.com/2010/05/05/ubuntu-ids-2/
[05:53] <maco> JontheEchidna: ooh shiny
[07:11] <Tm_T> ScottK: will try
[07:12] <Tm_T> apachelogger: no I didn't have that dependency issue, I'm on 386
[07:20] <Tm_T> ScottK: starts just fine
[08:38] <agateau> apachelogger: ping
[08:47] <Tm_T> ScottK: and runs and stops fine
[08:50] <Tm_T> Riddell: http://www.kubuntu.org/news/kde-sc-4.4.3 gives 403
[08:50] <Tm_T> although it's mentioned in http://kde.org/info/4.4.3.php
[09:50] <Riddell> Tm_T: published now
[09:54] <Quintasan> \o
[09:55] <Tm_T> Riddell: thanks (:
[09:59] <Mamarok> hm, I still have 8 kdebase and plasma packages not updating,  do you have a ETOA for those packages?
[09:59] <Tm_T> Mamarok: amd64?
[10:00] <Mamarok> since those are kdebase, workspace and plasma-worksapce packages it seems rather essential...
[10:00] <Mamarok> yes, 64bit
[10:00] <Mamarok> but I have an Intel 64bit, why do you guys insist on calling it amd?
[10:01] <Tm_T> Mamarok: it's the architecture name
[10:01] <Tm_T> Mamarok: I think it's done under one hour now, https://edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/ppa/+build/1717912
[10:02] <Mamarok> finally :)
[10:02] <Riddell> I don't know why the buildds are so busy :(
[10:04] <Tm_T> i386  14 builders  1153 jobs (14 hours)
[10:04] <Tm_T> everybody updating their ppas to lucid era?
[10:05] <Mamarok> yeah, the week after release is usually heavy load
[10:06] <Mamarok> but why does that affect the building process?
[10:06] <Mamarok> and project PPAs should defnitely have higher priority over individual ones
[10:10] <Tm_T> should, yes
[10:18] <Tm_T> Mamarok: some 5 minutes now is my uneducated guess
[10:18] <Tm_T> as it's building docs now, almost done
[10:20] <Tm_T> ...if that log can be trusted
[10:47] <ghostcube> o/
[10:52] <Quintasan> ghostcube: hi there
[10:52]  * Quintasan is installing lucid on KVM to close some bugs
[10:53] <ghostcube> hi Quintasan :)
[11:11] <Quintasan> hey
[11:11] <Quintasan> WTF
[11:11] <Quintasan> Why slideshows on CD are not in Polish? I'm sure I have translated all of them.
[11:13] <dpm> Quintasan, did you finish the translations before the non-language-pack deadline -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucidReleaseSchedule? As far as I know, all translations were exported from Launchpad and integrated into the package correctly
[11:15] <Quintasan> dpm: I'm pretty sure that I've done it before the deadline. Maybe I missed it because of timezones :P
[11:16] <Quintasan> dpm: well, it's not someone is going to cry but having the main title in Polish and then the rest in English looks sill
[11:16] <Quintasan> silly*
[11:17] <Quintasan> I'm still missing the words @_@
[11:19] <dpm> Quintasan, I fully agree, but the best thing now would be to investigate why that happened, so that it is not repeated. I'd suggest opening a bug against the Ubuntu Slideshow being as much detailed as possible (i.e. which particular strings are missing translations, if you did the translation before deadline, screenshots, etc.) -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+filebug
[11:31] <Quintasan> dpm: seems it's my fault
[11:31] <Quintasan> dpm: some translations were not accepted somehow in Launchpad
[11:38] <Quintasan> KPK is really useless
[11:46] <dpm> Quintasan, no worries. You might want to contact the Ubiquity Slideshow developers to ask them if they could be added perhaps in 10.04.1 once they are accepted. Btw, don't you have a translation mailing list to coordinate Polish translations and avoid these misunderstandings?
[11:47] <Quintasan> dpm: we have but most of the dudes do Ubuntu things and Kubuntu is left partly untranslated.
[11:47] <dpm> oh, I see :(
[11:47] <Quintasan> dpm: I can accept translations myself but I must've missed them or something went wrong
[11:48] <dpm> Quintasan, bummer. But yeah, get in touch with the Ubiquity Slideshow guys, as I say, perhaps they can be put in Kubuntu 10.04.1, since unfortunately those translations cannot be updated in language packs
[11:51] <apachelogger> agateau: pong
[11:51] <apachelogger> Tm_T: oh, k ^^
[11:51] <Tm_T> apachelogger: what did I do now?
[11:52] <Tm_T> apachelogger: oh, yeah, all is fine now both 386 and 64bit
[11:52] <Tm_T> or atleast should be
[11:57] <agateau> apachelogger: what's the status of the KDE client for U1?
[11:57] <agateau> apachelogger: (oh, and hi!)
[11:57] <apachelogger> agateau: in planing stage
[11:58] <agateau> apachelogger: ok, thanks
[13:30] <ofirk> Riddell: any news about the website?
[13:30] <Riddell> ofirk: no, sigh, I guess the sysadmins are at the UDS location already doing stuff there :(
[13:31] <Riddell> so I'll need to hassle them in person next week
[13:33] <ofirk> I am wondring, what is our relation with canonical? it seems that they don't care about kubuntu public relations
[13:34] <Riddell> to be fair, www.ubuntu.com hasn't changed either
[13:36] <ofirk> yeah, but that is because they weren't ready for the change
[13:37] <ofirk> we are ready
[13:45] <ScottK> Tm_T: Would you please comment in Bug #574906 on clamav working on powerpc.
[13:47] <ScottK> apachelogger: Would you please give us the benefit of your expertise in Bug #571286.
[13:47] <ScottK> Good $TIMEOFDAY everyone.
[13:47]  * apachelogger falls over
[13:47] <Riddell> Good 13:47 to you too ScottK
[13:47] <apachelogger> I should go get something to eat :P
[13:48] <ScottK> Riddell: How goes the battle against tryranny and foreign opression?
[13:49] <Riddell> the polling booths are open I hear, I'm due at the counting centre later tonight to make sure there's no corruption going on
[13:49] <apachelogger> oh my
[13:49] <apachelogger> 7 people want something from me
[13:50] <ScottK> apachelogger: Yes, but I pinged last, so by definition it's the most urgent.
[13:51] <apachelogger> interesting defintion
[13:51] <apachelogger> hm
[13:52] <ScottK> It's correct because it's the one that works best for me.  ;-)
[13:52] <apachelogger> ScottK: akonadi does use free-form addresses IIRC
[13:52] <Sput> and it worked, ScottK!
[13:52] <ScottK> apachelogger: Would you please check and say "It's good, bad, don't care" in the bug as applicable.
[13:52] <apachelogger> well
[13:53]  * apachelogger dislikes the idea of making fdo follow crap someone else invented for no good reason
[13:53] <apachelogger> gotta look into it a bit more though
[13:53] <ScottK> If that SRU goes in we'll be pretty much stuck with it.
[13:53] <ScottK> Thanks.
[13:54]  * ScottK was tempted to write "Web service bought a proprietary thing that's incompatible with FOSS is not on the list of allowed reasons for SRU", but refrained.
[13:55]  * apachelogger finds that sensible though :P
[13:55] <apachelogger> anyhow
[13:55] <apachelogger> just so I get this right
[13:55] <apachelogger> evolution uses free-form street field
[13:55] <apachelogger> so does the fdo spec
[13:55] <apachelogger> so does akonadi
[13:56] <apachelogger> so does legacy KDE stuff, which probably follows what vcd supports
[13:56] <Sput> ah yeah. good old U1 :>
[13:56]  * ScottK thought people would find it's absence in Kubuntu a feature and was a bit suprised to be found wrong.
[13:56] <apachelogger> and they are seriously proposing that we change all of that because they feel that using some prop crap is a viable option for a company that is supposed to make money using floss?
[13:57] <Sput> fwiw, afaik Akonadi's SyncML support use(d|s) Funambol as well
[13:58] <Sput> at least last year's GSoC project for SyncML support required libfunambol
[13:58] <ScottK> apachelogger: I don't mind if they use proprietary stuff in their server.  I do mind if they create a permanent diff between (K)(U)buntu and the rest of the world over it.
[13:58] <Sput> no idea if/hpw that relates :)
[13:59] <apachelogger> Sput: well, looking at akonadi alone it is no problem eitherway
[14:00] <Sput> apachelogger: yeah, but if the real reason for this behavior is phone syncing support...
[14:00] <ScottK> apachelogger: Will kmail consume the data either way?
[14:00] <apachelogger> because especialy in context of the couchdb resource definition @ fdo, the resource needs to map akonadi data to match the spec
[14:00] <apachelogger> ScottK: akonadi abstracts that pretty nicely, yes
[14:00]  * ScottK hopes this is going into the bug.
[14:00] <Tm_T> ScottK: will do
[14:01] <ScottK> Tm_T: Thanks.
[14:01] <apachelogger> Sput: that is reason to disobey an established standard?
[14:01] <freeflying> kmail should provide an option for not using akonadi as backend
[14:01] <apachelogger> maybe we should make ooo default to MS office doc format after all
[14:01] <freeflying> maybe more reasonable
[14:01] <apachelogger> seeing as it improves interoperability
[14:02] <apachelogger> oh oh oh
[14:02] <Sput> apachelogger: from reading the bug, the established standard has already been adapted :)
[14:02] <apachelogger> ScottK: I see trouble emerging eitherway
[14:02] <Tm_T> ScottK: is my comment sufficient?
[14:02] <ScottK> Sput: It's not clear if that's an adopted change or a proposed one.
[14:02] <apachelogger> so
[14:02] <Sput> ah. tenses.
[14:02] <apachelogger> we have address1
[14:02] <apachelogger> and address2
[14:03] <apachelogger> and the user creates an entry using both on a phone
[14:03] <ScottK> Tm_T: Fine.  Thanks.
[14:03] <apachelogger> so that gets synced into U1
[14:03] <apachelogger> from U1 we sync into akonadi
[14:03] <apachelogger> and now!!!
[14:03] <apachelogger> akonadi/kaddressbook uses free-form address data
[14:03] <apachelogger> so, either akonadi/kaddressbook is changing its behaviour
[14:04] <Sput> I was just wondering about how it'll work once Akonadi speaks with phones directly, disregarding U1 (and it'll probably use Funambol as well), in which case maybe adapting the standard to match reality wouldn't be that bad
[14:04] <apachelogger> OR the akonadi-couchdb resource needs to dump address2 (more like not add it to the akonadi entry)
[14:04] <ScottK> Seems to me more sensible for their web app thingy to be smart enough to convert free form address data to the format needed by funabol instead of imposing that on the user.
[14:05] <Sput> ... or that, if it can be done sensibly :)
[14:06] <apachelogger> well
[14:06] <apachelogger> IMHO the only solution here is
[14:06] <apachelogger> a) serverside abstracation, to somehow squeeze the client form-free address into funabol
[14:06] <apachelogger> or
[14:07] <apachelogger> b) get a revised version of vcard spec and implement that across floss to come up with a non-form-free addresss field
[14:07] <apachelogger> making every u1 client implementation follow funabol, just because they are too stupid and ugly to follow a freaking standard is just not sensible
[14:08] <Sput> as long as the standard isn't adapted to what appears to be reality (or not?), it's not
[14:09] <apachelogger> Sput: that funnyball is not reality
[14:09]  * apachelogger thinks vcard is much more established :P
[14:10]  * Sput wonders what SyncML does natively
[14:11] <Sput> "Any client that supports SyncML contact sync, MUST use vCard 2.1 to convey contact information."
[14:11] <Sput> that looks quite clear :)
[14:11] <Sput> that's from an Apple spec though :>
[14:12] <apachelogger> apple only knows the word MUST anyway :P
[14:12] <Sput> in any case, looks like SyncML uses vCard and vCal to exchange data, which is also the only sane thing to do
[14:12] <Sput> most notably is doesn't have address1 and address2
[14:14]  * apachelogger finds the couchdb-glib stuff increidbly confusing -.-
[14:15] <Sput> so yeah, I take back what I've speculated before and agree that the only sane thing to do is honoring existing well-established standards
[14:16] <apachelogger> hm
[14:17] <apachelogger> aha
[14:17] <apachelogger> http://library.gnome.org/devel/libebook/stable/EContact.html
[14:17] <apachelogger> apparently evolution does not use free-form streets
[14:17] <apachelogger> but also uses that street + ext stuff
[14:18] <Sput> that's what the guy said in the bug
[14:18] <apachelogger> oh, must have overread that
[14:18] <apachelogger> hm
[14:19] <apachelogger> interesting is that EContact dervies from EVCard
[14:20]  * apachelogger fires up evo
[14:22] <apachelogger> ehm
[14:22] <apachelogger> I dont get it
[14:23]  * apachelogger also finds that documentation rather useless
[14:23] <apachelogger> but in evo I have a free-form text field for the address
[14:23] <apachelogger> no clue where it gets ext from
[14:24] <Quintasan> wth
[14:24] <Quintasan> I'm getting disconnected all the time :S
[14:28] <ScottK> sebas: Reading kde-devel it seems it's time to have the "What version of Qt will KDE support with KDE SC 4.5" discussion.  I suspect we'll be going to 4.7 and most distros will too, so it'd be nice to have a discussion about it and get everyone in agreement.  I seriously never want to have to deal with the Qt 4.5/KDE 4.2 mismatch we had in Jaunty again.
[14:33] <Tm_T> ScottK: agreed
[14:38] <Tm_T> theres plenty of Qt 4.7 dependencies in trunk already
[14:38] <apachelogger> Sput: http://paste.ubuntu.com/428952/ anything youd add?
[14:40] <Sput> apachelogger: b) is weirdly put, also misses a verb
[14:41] <Sput> b) as far as we (that is me and a KDE gentoo developer) can see, akonadi will support phone sync via syncml (an established standard), and syncml enforces exchange of contact data via vCard (an established standard). (that said I wonder why the fdo spec cant implement vcard to begin with)
[14:41] <Sput> maybe?
[14:41] <apachelogger> bought
[14:42] <Sput> or "an even more established standard" :)
[14:42] <apachelogger> that sounds like fun ^^
[14:44] <Sput> also, all mail clients I know of support exchanging contact data via vCard, so do the groupware servers I know
[14:44] <Tm_T> even phones
[14:45] <sebas> ScottK: good point, let me think about that
[14:45] <ScottK> sebas: Thanks.
[14:45] <Sput> Tm_T: and phones.
[14:48] <Sput> now that I think about it, forcing the street information to be 1-2 fields makes no sense - there's address schemes that require more fields
[14:49] <apachelogger> as I understand it address1 is still free-form
[14:49] <apachelogger> just that ext is somehow supposed to enhance it
[14:49] <apachelogger> no clue how or for what
[14:49] <Sput> O_o
[14:49] <Sput> MAH BRAINZ!1!
[14:50] <apachelogger> kubotu: order brain for Sput
[14:50]  * kubotu shouts: OMG!!!!! RED ALERT! We lost a brain. Get me a medic, NOW!
[14:50] <apachelogger> !!!
[14:50] <apachelogger> omg
[14:50]  * apachelogger posts comment and starts reviewing some C code
[14:50] <ScottK> apachelogger: Thanks.
[14:51] <apachelogger> also I find it concerning how quickly they are on changing the spec
[14:51] <apachelogger> ...what if a company internally implemented that couchdb stuff using the spec...
[14:52] <ScottK> Right, well now's your chance to speak up.
[14:52]  * apachelogger adds that comment too
[14:52] <ScottK> Just be glad I decided to review that unaccepted queue yesterday for potential SRUs.
[14:52] <apachelogger> *nod*
[14:53] <apachelogger> kubotu: order cookie for ScottK
[14:53]  * kubotu slides one of world's finest cookies down the bar to ScottK.
[14:53] <ScottK> Thanks.
[14:55] <Sput> order steak for ScottK
[14:55] <Sput> kubotu: order steak for ScottK
[14:55]  * kubotu slides steak down the bar to ScottK
[14:55] <ScottK> hmmmm.  Steak for breakfast.  Wonderful.
[14:55]  * Quintasan hands ScottK a glass of water
[14:55] <Quintasan> You'll need it. :P
[14:56] <ScottK> Thanks, but I've got coffee brewing already (2nd pot)
[15:12] <rgreening> oh my... two more sleeps.. then no sleep for a week.
[15:12] <rgreening> :)
[15:13] <rgreening> I don't know how persia does it all year round. it's hard enough to stay up all night for one week, let alone 52 :P
[15:13]  * persia sleeps sometimes
[15:13] <rgreening> on the odd rare occaision...
[15:13] <rgreening> ;)
[15:18] <ScottK> apachelogger: I read your comments.  Thanks.
[15:28] <jussi> are any of the KC about?
[15:29] <rgreening> jussi: ya
[15:29] <rgreening> sup
[15:30] <jussi> rgreening: pm ->
[17:37]  * ScottK adds up http://design.canonical.com/2010/05/menu-bar/ and the number of Qt people coming to UDS and thinks distro patches for Qt.
[17:38] <Tm_T> hrrr
[17:38] <apachelogger> ohm
[17:38] <apachelogger> ok
[17:38] <apachelogger> it is getting silly
[17:38] <apachelogger> seriously
[17:39] <apachelogger> ubuntu is so innovative
[17:39] <apachelogger> look how they are ahead of windows in copying osx
[17:39] <apachelogger> that is so sad
[17:39]  * maco snorts
[17:39] <ulysses> some people said KDE copying Windows too
[17:39] <apachelogger> ehm
[17:39] <maco> i for one think win7's notifications are better than notify-osd
[17:40] <maco> and knotify
[17:40] <apachelogger> they accidently moved the buttons to the left
[17:40] <maco> because win7's are more like growl :P
[17:40] <apachelogger> and now they accidently make this move they invisioned for 30 years
[17:40] <apachelogger> and their wallpaper does not look like a osx one either
[17:40] <apachelogger> if ubuntu is not becoming one almost free osx clone, then I dont know what is going on
[17:41] <maco> apachelogger: hey does plasma desktop have a "slideshow" wallpaper setting?
[17:42] <apachelogger> maco: not by default I think
[17:42] <maco> i see gnome users in #ubuntu ask for a way to have the wallpaper change automatically. i /thought/ kde had that setting, but i know for-sure that windows does (which probably explains the sudden interest in that feature)
[17:45] <maco> wow, there's an ubuntu mirror at liberty university?
[17:45] <apachelogger> maco: I think that would only make plasma even crashier
[17:45] <apachelogger> so
[17:45] <apachelogger> now that I worked off the highlights I could probably go find something to eat
[17:46] <maco> internet says kde had it in 2005! hehe
[17:51] <ScottK> maco: There are things I like about notify-osd, but no actions and it getting behind make it unusable from my perspective.
[17:51] <ScottK> There are things I think could be better about KDE's too.
[17:51] <maco> win7 notifications come back from fading when you mouseover and they have actions. not multiple-button actions that ive seen but onclick()
[17:52] <maco> the thing i dont like in kde is the GIANT WALL when you get a bunch because they dont queue
[17:53] <ScottK> There needs to be something between the wall and one ... at .... a ... time ... no ... matter ... how ... long ... it ... takes.
[17:54] <ScottK> apachelogger: Don't worry.  Now that Android runs on iPhone, Apple will be busy sueing themselves.
[17:54] <JontheEchidna> the good news is that there's less of a wall in 4.5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Z31MLWMOuU
[17:56] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Nice.  Progress at least.
[17:56] <JontheEchidna> I doubt notify-osd will ever progress much
[17:56] <ScottK> Now if only recently completed jobs wouldn't pop back up with new notifications, we'd be getting somewhere.
[17:57] <JontheEchidna> Help us obi-wan kenobi, you're our only hope
[17:57] <ScottK> BTW, that recent notifications thing is the doom of using persistent notifications for updates availalbe and restart required.  If you cancel it, those go away.
[17:57] <Sput> maco: in KDE trunk, the notifications don't stack up anymore
[17:58] <Sput> generally, the whole notification thing has been muchly improved with the new notifier
[17:58] <ScottK> So the persistent notifications are not at all persistent in the traditional sense.
[17:58] <ScottK> Cool.
[17:58] <JontheEchidna> In that they aren't monoliths constantly presenting themselves, yes
[17:58] <maco> yay!
[17:58] <Sput> hmmm... don't they still hake the (i) show a number?
[17:58] <Sput> and when you click on it, they pop up again?
[17:59] <ScottK> Sput: Nope.  They are gone (at least in 4.4)
[18:01] <ScottK> apachelogger: You got more noise to deal with in that bug.
[18:02] <Sput> ScottK: humm. I need to check that out.
[18:06] <maco> oh wow
[18:06] <maco> installing kubuntu in vmware, vmware asks for user/pass/fullname and then just boots straight to the "installing system" part of the installer O_O
[18:06] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: you got mentioned in a dot.kde.org story
[18:08] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Which one?
[18:09] <JontheEchidna> The choqok one, at the top
[18:09]  * ScottK looks again
[18:10] <ScottK> Right.  There it is.
[18:23] <maco> hm well *this* is problematic
[18:23] <maco> so any of you tried lucid in a vmware vm yet?
[18:24] <maco> kdm is taking no keyboard input whatsoever. text login works fine though
[18:29] <maco> ScottK: check this out 2010
[18:29] <maco> er
[18:29] <maco> copy and paste in windows is weird
[18:29] <maco> http://newcolumbiaheights.blogspot.com/2010/05/scooter-commuter.html
[19:02] <apachelogger> Sput: any opinoins on the noise, Ill not get to reply until tomorrow I suppose
[19:03] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: cool
[19:03]  * apachelogger is famous again ^^
[19:28] <maco> how do i get an onscreen keyboard on kdm?
[19:42] <pascalFR> humm kde SC 4.4.3 works again ;)
[20:08] <apachelogger> maco: I think kvkbd's readme explains
[20:12] <maco> apachelogger: ossi says need 4.5 or to modify Xsetup scripts
[20:12] <maco> however i found http://communities.vmware.com/thread/261454
[20:13] <rgreening> that would be cool. I need Ubuntu with that for my Archos 5it touch screen
[21:08] <maco> goodness, you all weren't kidding about big kubuntu fonts
[21:09] <maco> (at uds barcelona, when someone... a few of you.... were saying theyre huge and that its Riddell's thing to have huge fonts)
[21:09] <maco> first time ive looked at a clean install in a while
[21:11] <JontheEchidna> I always bump all of them down one notch, but I believe we're following upstream in this regard
[21:39] <maco> JontheEchidna: i just changed the dpi and that helped though it seems 96 and 120 are the only options. my screen is 94
[23:11] <ari-tczew> could someone check enforceability of change in package cmake? I want to drop it because this change is involve to upgrading from jaunty to lucid, but we're tracking now maverick development. more info on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cmake/2.8.0-5ubuntu1
[23:19] <JontheEchidna> I don't think I would have personally been so forgiving to people who tried the upgrade :P
[23:23] <ari-tczew> JontheEchidna: so to drop, or not to drop? :>
[23:23] <JontheEchidna> I'd drop it
[23:23] <ari-tczew> I'd like to drop, because I think that this is not necessary change
[23:24] <JontheEchidna> Not worth the diff with debian imo


[00:25] <nealmcb> can anyone compare the diagnostics available for a dell PowerEdge 2850 on ubuntu vs centos?  My buddy wants to switch to centos from a really old ubuntu distro.  I recall hearing that dell had opensourced some management software for their stuff but he seems to think that at least the diagnostics are only rpm-based and the alien stuff didn't seem to work for him
[00:34] <jetsaredim> is there something special that needs to be done to be able to install from scratch with a pppoe connection?  why are these tools not built-in to the install cd
[00:35] <nealmcb> !pppoe
[00:36] <nealmcb> jetsaredim: ^
[00:36] <nealmcb> though I haven't tried it... and I have to run now.....
[00:44] <nealmcb> back to poweredge and diagnostics - as I heard it, the diagnostics are on a cd that came with the system a few years ago.  I don't know if it is part of the omsa/openmanage or the ipmi stuff they're doing
[01:31] <nxvl> nealmcb: around?
[01:31] <nxvl> nealmcb: i think it will be kind of hard for ebox to use augeas
[01:32] <nxvl> nealmcb: ebox is writting in perl, while augeas is a C library with bindings for python and ruby only
[02:22] <ryoohki> anyone seen this when kick starting hardy server 8.04 amd64 "Loading kickseed-common failed for unknown reasons"?
[02:22] <captbaritone> phpmyadmin seems to be stuck running a query and I can't get it to load. Is there a way to have it stop?
[03:13] <zul> nealmcb: ebox written in perl not a good thing
[03:13] <emgent> morning
[03:13] <ScottK> Depends on the Perl.  Lots of good stuff in Perl.  Lots of bad.
[05:12] <Colin_> Hey, how do I get my server to give out internet.  It has three network cards, two are in use atm.  One is internet from the dsl modem, the other goes out to the LAN. The server has internet, but it won't distribute it, although dhcp is working becauseit is distributing ip addresses
[05:18] <nealmcb> nxvl, zul: offhand it seems like adding perl bindings for augeas would be a lot less work than maintaining a backend for all the interesting services, if augeas is indeed useful in that regard.....  I'd prefer python all things being equal, but reinventing things because of language preferences can be a big step backwards.
[05:19] <hads> Colin_: You'll need to setup NAT on the gateway box. This can be done quite a few ways, I'd recommend using something like firehol as it will make your like easier.
[05:20] <hads> If your DSL modem is also doing nat then you'll be behind double nat which isn't so nice but it may not be a problem for you.
[05:21] <Colin_> hads, ah ok so using IPtables
[05:21] <Colin_> i should have known it wouldn't be simple
[05:21] <Colin_> the modem isn't doing NAT though
[05:21] <hads> So your public IP is on the linux box?
[05:21] <Colin_> correct
[05:22] <hads> Nice one
[05:22] <hads> Hope you've got a firewall already then :)
[05:22] <Colin_> no, but I'm working on it right now, haha
[05:22] <hads> I'd really recommend something like firehol, you should be able to setup NAT with one or two lines.
[05:23] <Colin_> ok ill check into that
[05:23] <Colin_> i've heard about others like smoothwall and shorewall, what do you think about those
[05:23] <hads> If you run 'firehol helpme' it will try to guess a config for you even :)
[05:23] <Colin_> oh thats nice
[05:24] <Colin_> well I think i'll try that out then
[05:25] <nxvl> nealmcb: i was talking about ebox using augeas
[05:25] <hads> Colin_: At http://firehol.sourceforge.net/ scroll down there is an example config there, that will show you the jist of it.
[05:25] <nxvl> nealmcb: i've been thinking in writing ucsa in C because of augeas
[05:26] <Colin_> hads, I'm actually looking at that right now =)
[05:33] <nealmcb> nxvl: I was also - and it would seem that ebox could use augeas if there were some perl bindings, which wouldn't be too hard, would it?
[05:56] <Colin_> I set up firehol according to the documentation, and then started it, but I still don't get internet
[05:59] <nxvl> nealmcb: dunno, i don't write perl code for a loooong time
[06:22]  * jetsaredim ponders why the installer would not mark / as bootable
[08:49] <kraut> moin
[12:10] <Kamping_Kaiser> ubottu, ntfs
[14:30] <\sh> whoever is interested: adobe flash media server version 3 runs on ubuntu :)
[14:31] <lukehasnoname> IBM considers open-sourcing DB2
[14:42] <kerberos> hi all
[14:43] <lukehasnoname> hi, network authentication protocol
[14:44] <kerberos> can anybody here help me
[14:45] <kerberos> how can I ssh or ftp my home server from my university
[14:45] <kerberos> how to do all the NAT stuff
[14:46] <lukehasnoname> Is your home server behind a router?
[14:46] <kerberos> yaa
[14:46] <kerberos> I got 1 modem and 1 wireless router
[14:46] <lukehasnoname> You'll have to login to your router's config for port forwarding
[14:47] <kerberos> my local home server connected to my wireless router
[14:47] <lukehasnoname> get your server's internal IP and forward port 22 to that IP
[14:47] <kerberos> that is the part that I dont understand
[14:47] <lukehasnoname> so when you connect to your home's public IP through port 22, your router will send traffic to your server
[14:47] <lukehasnoname> well
[14:48] <kerberos> hold on let me try
[14:49] <lukehasnoname> your router's IP on your LAN will be 192.168.x.x
[14:49] <lukehasnoname> 0.1 usually
[14:49] <kerberos> ya correct
[14:50] <kerberos> I already login to my router
[14:50] <lukehasnoname> k there will be a tab or link to port forwarding, "special apps" or something like that
[14:50] <kerberos> I used level one router
[14:51] <kerberos> yaa
[14:51] <kerberos> forwding rules
[14:51] <kerberos> from there I have virtual server/special AP/MISC
[14:51] <lukehasnoname> right, find your server's LAN IP and use that, then say forward "port 22" to that LAN IP
[14:53] <kerberos> ok done
[14:54] <lukehasnoname> now when you connect to your home's public IP using SSH/port 22, your router will send traffic to your server
[14:54] <lukehasnoname> if you did it rihgt
[14:55] <kerberos> I can try to connect to my  public IP from my home
[14:55] <kerberos> how about ubuntu server
[14:56] <kerberos> do I need to modify the iptables
[14:56] <kerberos> do I need to activate the NAT
[14:56] <lukehasnoname> I'm not that experienced, but I think you should be fine.
[14:56] <lukehasnoname> make sure sshd is running
[14:56] <lukehasnoname> (your ssh server)
[14:56] <kerberos> yaa
[14:56] <kerberos> ssh and ftp is running
[14:57] <kerberos> cant connect
[15:01] <lukehasnoname> hm
[15:16] <the_messenger> have you verified that you can connect to it from inside first?
[15:21] <kerberos> yaa
[15:22] <kerberos> the_messenger --> can connect from inside
[15:22] <the_messenger> k
[15:23] <kerberos> connection closed when try to connect to my public IP
[15:23] <kerberos> I nmap to my public IP
[15:23] <kerberos> all the services are there
[15:23] <lukehasnoname> either you configured it wrong, or your ISP blocks incomeing traffice on that port
[15:23] <kerberos> port 21 and port 22
[15:23] <the_messenger> are you testing the public address from behind or infront of your router?
[15:23] <kerberos> hold on
[15:24] <kerberos> let me verify
[15:24] <kerberos> behind the router
[15:24] <the_messenger> some routers won't route that back in
[15:24] <the_messenger> try it from outside
[15:25] <kerberos> any extra setting
[15:27] <the_messenger> i don't know of any setting to allow it
[15:28] <the_messenger> when you are inside use the internal address when you are outside use the public address
[15:29] <kerberos> how about the ubunter server itself
[15:29] <kerberos> any iptables setting
[15:32] <the_messenger> from how I understand it it's a limitation of the device routing your nat, so i don't think the routing on the server would be able to do anything
[15:33] <the_messenger> it doesn't know how to go out and nat back in
[15:34] <the_messenger> there may be a way to make the router understand it but I haven't found it yet (i'm using a cisco for my router)
[15:35] <kerberos> ic
[15:35] <the_messenger> but if you have the port forwarded properly and the service works from inside then it should work fine externally
[15:36] <kerberos> when I nmap
[15:38] <kerberos> sorry
[15:38] <kerberos> when I try to nslookup
[15:39] <kerberos> can't find server name
[15:39] <kerberos> ...
[15:39] <LMJ> Did anyone made his homework : download firefox 3 and crontibute to the world largest amount of download in 24h ? http://www.mozilla-europe.org  ;)
[15:39] <the_messenger> nslookup is checking dns registration, not service availability
[15:39] <kerberos> ic
[15:39] <kerberos> nmap
[15:40] <kerberos> and I'm using dynamic ip
[15:48] <the_messenger> there are several services for doing dynamic dns. I've used www.dyndns.com in the past
[15:48] <zul> emgent: how does rapache handle it if you modify the configuration files directly and then use rapache again
[16:47]  * jetsaredim is really getting torqued off at the installer
[16:48] <jetsaredim> tried to install ubuntu-server twice - both times I've had to force detection of ide_generic to get the cdrom drive recognized and also after the reboot the system fails to boot
[16:49] <jetsaredim> anyone have an idea as to why this would be?
[16:49] <nijaba> jetsaredim: file a bug with details about your hardware if you have not done so already
[16:50] <jetsaredim> nijaba: on my way there
[16:54] <jetsaredim> nijaba: any suggestion about which specific package to file against?
[17:07] <nijaba> jetsaredim: kernel ?
[17:08] <lukehasnoname> Guys, I have some bad news. My bosses a few levels up have decided to make me do work at my job, so I might not be able to sit on the IRC all day and read the mailing list as it trickles in. I'll still be around a little....sometimes.
[17:09] <mathiaz> nijaba: yeah -pulp looks interesting
[17:09] <mathiaz> nijaba: have you looked at the interface ?
[17:10] <nijaba> yes, that's the cool part
[17:10] <mathiaz> nijaba: it uses turbogears IIRC
[17:10] <nijaba> mathiaz: but I looked a bit at the code and I trying to see if the backend could be ok for debian packages
[17:11] <nijaba> mathiaz: yes turbogears it is
[17:14] <nijaba> Koon: https://fedorahosted.org/pulp/
[17:21]  * delcoyote hi
[17:37]  * nijaba takes a break
[17:51] <mathiaz> zul: re bug 240519 - is that a regression from gutsy ?
[17:55] <mathiaz> Koon: re bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dnsmasq/+bug/192643 - I'd assign the bug to the network-manager package
[17:56] <Koon> mathiaz: yes, I was considering doin g it but I'm not sure it is a bug... like I said it's a missing feature, except if the reporter can find his expected behavior documented somewhere...
[17:57] <mathiaz> Koon: if it's a missing feature, then you can set the importance to whishlist
[17:58] <Koon> mathiaz: I need bug-Control power for that ;)
[17:59] <mathiaz> Koon: you can ask for membership in #ubuntu-bugs
[17:59] <mathiaz> Koon: or bdmurray
[18:00] <Koon> mathiaz: ok, will do
[18:00] <mathiaz> Koon: and even if you don't have bug-control power, assigning to the NetworkManager package doesn't hurt
[18:00] <mathiaz> Koon: it seems that it's a legitimate request
[18:00] <mathiaz> Koon: so bringing this up to the network-manager packager is a good thing
[18:01] <Koon> doing it right now.
[18:06] <zul> mathiaz: yep
[18:06] <zul> looks like it
[18:06] <mathiaz> zul: ok - then it qualifies for an SRU
[18:06] <zul> mathiaz: ok i was going to split the sybase and mssql into their own seperate package
[18:07] <zul> intrepid suffers from the same regression but the build system has changed from what it looks like
[18:14] <mathiaz> zul: splitting the packages would probably work for intrepid
[18:14] <mathiaz> zul: for hardy, you'd have to keep the same package in place
[18:14] <zul> mathiaz: thats a bit difficult :)
[18:15] <zul> but ill try
[18:15] <mathiaz> zul: has the hardy packaging changed a lot from gutsy É
[18:15] <mathiaz> zul: ?
[18:16] <zul> mathiaz: no but in hardy it uses sed to change the librabry from sybase to mssql
[18:22] <zul> mathiaz: basically the extension has been changed from sybase to mssql if the version is lessed that 5.2.3-2
[18:26] <nxvl> i having problems packaging augeas
[18:26] <nxvl> it ships with gnulib
[18:26] <nxvl> so i'm trying to remove it from the source and have it as build-depend
[18:27] <nxvl> but it's kind of hard coded on the Makefile and configure script
[18:27] <nxvl> did anyone can point me to the best way to deal with this?
[18:28] <mathiaz> nxvl: try to ask in ubuntu-motu or ubuntu-devel - there is more packaging expertise there
[18:28] <nxvl> mathiaz: ok, thnks
[18:32] <zul> mathiaz: can the php5-sybase package have both the mssql.ini files and sybase files
[18:34] <cbeckley> I have a ubuntu-server machine and I need it to be able to accept 2 separate dsl lines, and output to the LAN.  Would balanceNG help me accomplish load balancing with multiple connections? And also, does anyone know of any good tutorials for setting up systems with two internet connections?
[20:38] <[diablo]> evening guys
[20:38] <[diablo]> is there no 64 bit version of JeOS?
[20:40] <JanC> no
[20:40] <[diablo]> ok
[20:40] <lukehasnoname> [diablo]: I know, it's sad
[20:41] <sommer_> [diablo]: you can create a KVM/Qemu image using ubuntu-vm-builder... it'll take a few minutes, but probably less time than downloading an ISO
[20:41] <[diablo]> atm I have KVM-70 in my Ubuntu 8.04 x64 desktop ... with a Ubuntu 8.04 Server x64 guest
[20:41] <JanC> you need a VM with more than 4 GiB RAM?
[20:41] <sommer_> [diablo]: https://help.ubuntu.com/8.04/serverguide/C/ubuntu-vm-builder.html
[20:41] <[diablo]> well, the box has a Q6600 and 4GB of DDR
[20:42] <sommer_> JanC: not necessarily, I've seen it work great with 2G
[20:42] <[diablo]> I give my kvm guests 1GB or less
[20:42] <sommer_> heh, you should be good to go :)
[20:43] <JanC> why would you want a 64-bit guest kernel if your host system is only 4 GiB RAM?
[20:43] <lukehasnoname> JanC: Consistency
[20:43] <sommer_> isn't more always better?  heeh
[20:44] <[diablo]> I like the idea of a pimped kernel for the virtual server
[20:44] <[diablo]> sounds nice
[20:44] <JanC> 64-bit will use more memory in most cases, and might even be slower in some cases...
[20:44] <[diablo]> JanC, you referring to KVM guests?
[20:45] <JanC> kvm or vmware or whatever (I use kvm)
[20:46] <[diablo]> I have not heard of any preformance  loss using a x64 guest on a x64 host
[20:46] <JanC> 64-bit software uses 64-bit pointers, which are double the size of 32-bit pointers...   ;)
[20:47] <[diablo]> yes
[20:47] <[diablo]> but your said might be slower
[20:48] <JanC> this also means that less of them fit into the CPU caches, so more cache misses & more memory fetches _might_ be the result..
[20:48] <lukehasnoname> can ubuntu-vm-builder be used to create an ISO? I mean, what is the output?
[20:49] <sommer_> lukehasnoname: the output is a vm disk (not sure of the exact terminology), basically what you'd use a jeos iso to create
[20:49] <jjesse> vmdk?
[20:49] <sommer_> virtual disk file
[20:50] <sommer_> jjesse: heh, ya
[20:50] <JanC> .vmdk or .img or .qcow or whatever you prefer, I suppose
[20:51] <lukehasnoname> sommer_: Hmmm. Ok. I haven't had a chance to throw up a virtual environment because apt-mirror SUCKS
[20:51] <sommer_> not sure what virtual environment has to do with apt-mirror?
[20:51] <lukehasnoname> I tried to tell it to only download certain 64-bit repos, not an entire mirror, and it still told me it was a 44GB download when I know it should have been like 20
[20:52] <lukehasnoname> and I have no internet at home so I can't get files for my server so I was tryingto download a mirror onto my laptop at a friend's house
[20:52] <lukehasnoname> but I didn't have time
[20:52] <sommer_> ah gotcha, ya the internets comes in handy when usign u-v-m
[20:52] <[diablo]> this JeOS idea is very niffty indeed
[20:52] <[diablo]> installing a guest now
[20:53] <lukehasnoname> What does JeOS have going for it against ubuntu-vm-builder?
[20:53] <lukehasnoname> I mean, how is it tweaked for VM usage?
[20:53] <sommer_> ubuntu-vm-builder was originally created to make the jeos iso files, but then they releazied it was a great tool
[20:53] <[diablo]> from what I read the kernel only contains what is required
[20:54] <sommer_> so using u-v-m or downloading a jeos iso basically gets you to the same place, a stripped down ubuntu vm :)
[20:55] <mgsmx> i suppose there are some people who write the server guide here, I have a suggestion for the Samba-section: rewrite it from scratch! I think it's a strange-written, unclear document with a lot of superflues information, it cost me ages to get my samba working, while i know see it was just typing two lines in de CLI... :(
[20:55] <jjesse> mgsmx: thanks for your feedback, could you report a bug with suggestions against ubuntu-doc?
[20:55] <sommer_> mgsmx: that's in progress actually :), should have drafts up next week probably
[20:55] <jjesse> that way it deosn't get lost in the channel
[20:56] <mgsmx> oh :) alright
[20:56] <jjesse> mgsmx: thanks, soemtimes the people who work on the guide forget what is said in the channel and work better against a bug
[20:56] <mgsmx> ah, i see
[20:57] <[diablo]> damn that boots quick as hell, and it's a qcow2 image
[21:04] <lukehasnoname> sommer_: For Samba or for the entire guide?
[21:06] <sommer_> lukehasnoname: here's the spec: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidServerGuide
[21:07] <sommer_> lukehasnoname: most of the sections were update/expanded for hardy, but there wasn't time for the windows networking section
[21:08] <lukehasnoname> Come later in the year (September?) I wouldn't mind QA testing those docs
[21:09] <sommer_> lukehasnoname: that'd be awesome... the more feedback the better
[21:10] <lukehasnoname> oh my freaking GOD there is a beautiful woman standing at the cubicle next to me
[21:14] <lukehasnoname> Some of the sexiest outfits a woman can wear are business pants and a white shirt
[21:14] <lukehasnoname> Not at the same time, though. <_< </offtopic>
[21:15] <[diablo]> lol
[21:28] <tekteen> anyone know how to find out what program is listening on a port? like port 80?
[21:29] <daanemanz> does anyone know why my browser is trying to download a php file from my webserver when I'd like to see a php page?
[21:29] <sommer_> tekteen: netstat can, but I'm not sure of the exact switches
[21:30] <tekteen> you do not have the apache pgp mod
[21:30] <tekteen> php*
[21:30] <sommer_> daanemanz: did you restart apache
[21:30] <daanemanz> I did, but still to no avail
[21:30] <JanC> tekteen: lsof or netstat ?
[21:30] <tekteen> thanks
[21:30] <daanemanz> it's borked since I accidentally removed LAMP server with tasksel
[21:30] <gatewayer> tekteen: netstat -plutn does the job ^^
[21:31] <ScottK> netstat -a|less is a good place to start.
[21:31] <tekteen> thanks again
[21:31] <sommer_> daanemanz: make sure you have the libapache2-mod-php5 package
[21:31] <tekteen> gatewayer: it does not tell me what program
[21:31] <gatewayer> of course?
[21:31] <gatewayer> it tells you pid?
[21:32] <daanemanz> already installed...
[21:32] <gatewayer> and program name
[21:32] <tekteen> where?
[21:32] <JanC> netstat might need root rights to find the program name
[21:32] <gatewayer> last column
[21:32] <tekteen> ok
[21:32] <JanC> so put sudo before it  ;)
[21:32] <gatewayer> jepp sorry
[21:32] <gatewayer> ^^
[21:32] <tekteen> I will run as root
[21:32] <gatewayer> root of course ^^
[21:33] <daanemanz> wait... it works!
[21:34] <tekteen> :-\ what I wanted to was running. But lighttpd is giving me a 500
[21:39] <daanemanz> thanks anyway for the hints
[21:40] <JanC> tekteen: configuration error maybe?
[21:40] <JanC> or if you use fastcgi, there might be an issue with that...
[21:41] <tekteen> ok
[21:41] <tekteen> how about scgi?
[21:41] <JanC> well, I guess it can go wrong too?  ツ
[21:41] <tekteen> :-(
[21:41] <JanC> check the log files...
[21:41] <tekteen> I did
[21:42] <JanC> I'm sure lighttpd will tell you something?
[21:43] <tekteen> oh
[21:43] <tekteen> I feel stupid right now
[21:43] <tekteen> You would think I would look at this stuff by now
[21:43] <tekteen> I need to install php5-cgi
[21:44] <tekteen> g2g
[21:44] <tekteen> thanks janC
[22:29] <DustWolf> I have configured a HTTP proxy durring setup, how do I change this setting?
[22:30]  * kees loves rebooting 6 kvms simultaneously.  *thrash*
[22:37] <mathiaz> kees: do you have intrepid vms ?
[22:40] <kees> mathiaz: I don't have intrepid as kvm yet (I have schroots).  I was going to set them up soon so I could start playing with apparmor updates
[22:43] <mathiaz> kees: ok - I've updated my intrepid vm to 2.6.26 and it doesn't boot anymore :/
[22:45] <kees> mathiaz: lvm?
[22:46] <kees> mathiaz: I fixed a devmapper regression last night, so you might need to boot with root=/dev/mapper/$VG-$ROOTLV (fill in your $VG and $ROOTLV) to avoid the broken UUID symlinks
[22:46] <kees> then grab the new dmsetup and initramfs should regen
[22:49] <mathiaz> kees: yes - I'm using lvs for the root disk
[22:49] <mathiaz> kees: but the host is running hardy
[22:52] <kees> mathiaz: ... I'm confused... your _host_ doesn't boot any more after the client was upgraded to intrepid?
[22:52] <mathiaz> kees: my intrepid guest/vm doesn't boot anymore
[22:53] <mathiaz> kees: but I'm running hardy on the host server
[22:53] <kees> mathiaz: but the intrepid guest uses lvm for its rootfs?
[22:53] <mathiaz> kees: nope
[22:53] <kees> okay, then I'm not sure-- probably a kernel issue?  I saw a mess of things failing when I booted intrepid on bare metal
[22:54] <mathiaz> kees: ok - I'll check with soren when he is back
[23:51] <RabidLockerGnome> Hey guys, I just installed ubuntu server, but it won't see my wireless access point, any ideas?


[08:55] <onebitxajax> hi to all
[08:55] <onebitxajax> how can i add the repo to my ubuntu?
[08:56] <onebitxajax> it give me error readerng https://launchpad.net/api/1.0/..... HTTP error 404
[22:39] <tjaalton> RAOF: hey, opinions on bug 652467 before I decline it?
[22:39] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 652467 in xorg (Ubuntu) "xerver-xorg-video-ati dependancies need changing (affects: 1) (heat: 28)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/652467
[22:39] <tjaalton> 1) is not possible, -ati is just a wrapper
[22:40] <tjaalton> 2) would mean (AIUI) bigger static mappings to the server, which is pointless
[22:40] <tjaalton> 3) then reveals the true nature of the bug (micro-management), so it's just silly
[22:40] <tjaalton> mach and r128 add 400kB to the install
[22:41] <tjaalton> in total
[22:41] <RAOF> Yeah.  I don't think that's worth doing.
[22:41] <tjaalton> thanks, I'll close it as wontfix
[22:43] <RAOF> That micro-management *is* possible, too - it just requries an xorg.conf
[22:43] <tjaalton> yeah
[22:45] <RAOF> Hm.  Is there any reason we shouldn't follow Debian in removing a bunch of unmaintained drivers from the archive?
[22:45] <tjaalton> no
[22:45] <tjaalton> there was some talk about it on #debian-x earlier today
[22:46] <tjaalton> I've yet to re-joing the ml so haven't been following what's going on there
[22:48] <RAOF> The list of removed drivers is: xserver-xorg-video-v4l, xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd, xserver-xorg-video-nv, xserver-xorg-input-hyperpen, xserver-xorg-input-fpit, xserver-xorg-input-evtouch, xserver-xorg-input-citron
[22:49] <tjaalton> all good to go
[22:49] <RAOF> I think the only one we might possibly want out of that is -nv.
[22:49] <tjaalton> :)
[22:49] <RAOF> Heh.  We're well ahead on -citron.
[22:49] <tjaalton> right, I'm not quite uptodate on that, at some point nouveau didn't support all of -nv
[22:50] <tjaalton> but I guess the devices in question are either very rare or old, or both
[22:50] <RAOF> I think TNT and riva128 cards aren't supported by nouveau, and nv supports at least one of them.
[22:50] <RAOF> Of course, so does -vesa :)
[22:50] <tjaalton> heh, right
[22:50] <RAOF> We should also remove -gevdev, since the gestures stuff is in evdev now.
[22:51] <RAOF> Also, it's uninstallable :)
[22:51] <tjaalton> I've so much to catch on..
[22:51] <tjaalton> +up
[22:51] <RAOF> :)
[22:52] <RAOF> Managed to get all the adminy stuff out of the way yet?
[22:52] <tjaalton> most of it yeah
[22:52] <tjaalton> i hope
[22:53] <RAOF> There'll be some lingering tentacles :)
[22:53] <tjaalton> I bet..
[23:37] <RAOF> tjaalton: Incidentally, are you subscribed to mesa-dev?  If so, have you seen my dricore patches appear there?
[23:38] <RAOF> They seem to have made it to the mailing list archives, but I'd just like to be sure, given the lack of response.
[23:41] <tjaalton> RAOF: when did you send them?
[23:42] <tjaalton> I only have the archive since Jan 31st
[23:42] <tjaalton> ah got it
[23:42] <tjaalton> v3
[23:43] <RAOF> Yeah, there it is.
[23:43] <RAOF> Actually, that seems to have only been Thursday.  I thought it was longer.
[23:43] <tjaalton> doesn't fedora have something similar? you could try poking ajax/airlied to review and ack
[23:44] <RAOF> Fedora had something similar in the dim distant past.  I might start prodding soon, yeah.
[23:45] <tjaalton> are gallium drivers smaller than the classic ones (one could assume so..)?
[23:45] <RAOF> They're actually of comparable size.
[23:45] <tjaalton> ah, ok
[23:46] <RAOF> But it's more of a pain to make a dricore for gallium.
[23:46] <RAOF> Quite a lot more of a pain, and we only install 2 gallium drivers.
[23:47] <tjaalton> yeah now that I think of it the shared parts are probably built in the drivers?
[23:48] <tjaalton> just like before, only that the code is more modular
[23:48] <tjaalton> or the functionality
[23:48] <tjaalton> bah, too late to function myself :)
[23:48] <RAOF> mesa, and gallium even more, create a whole bunch of static libraries which the dri drivers link in.  That's why each DRI driver goes from ~3MiB to ~400KiB when you factor out dricore.
[23:50] <tjaalton> yeah
[23:50] <RAOF> If I wanted to be really invasive I could do better, but the patch as written is, I think, the sweetspot for time spent/size opimisation.


[00:06] <dmj_s76> cyphermox: Your patch actually improves the appearance when the panel is the correct size.
[00:07] <xevious> Only about 20% of custom.iso has downloaded so far, in case you're wondering why I haven't given any feedback yet.
[00:23] <cyphermox> that's fine, I knew it would take long, nothing I can do about it
[00:33] <dmj_s76> cyphermox: I've added my results to the bug report
[00:36] <dmj_s76> cyphermox: Notice the small little band of incongruous pixels?
[00:36] <cyphermox> heh, that's PAD; I was afraid that might be a side-effect of trying to fix things that way
[00:37] <dmj_s76> Afraid?
[00:37] <dmj_s76> That bright little line has been commented on as a potential bug by a few people here.
[00:42] <dmj_s76> cyphermox: So PAD isn't perfect (this right thing would be to make the gradient actually match the height of the panel), but it looks better to my eyes than repeat.
[00:43] <cyphermox> there are only two options, what this means is that there ought to be a different way to fix the height to be correct, but I don't know what it is
[00:43] <dmj_s76> me neither
[00:43] <dmj_s76> Also, humanity @2x should fix the double height
[00:44] <dmj_s76> will get on that tomorrow
[16:38] <xnox> cyphermox, when launching manual partitioner would you expect to see all LVM volumes that are present on the visible devices or not?
[16:38] <xnox> at the moment i have a strange mix of in "Configure LVM" i see 4 logical volumes; yet none are present in the "manual partitioning menu" to e.g. pick some existing logical volume to be for example /srv
[16:44] <xnox> aha
[16:44] <cyphermox> maybe LVM only probes when you first run into Configure LVM?
[16:44] <xnox> did "rm /var/lib/partman/lvm" rerun detect disks again, and they appear
[16:44] <cyphermox> hrm
[16:44] <cyphermox> that sounds all wrong
[16:45] <xnox> so it keeps a flag to run "pvscan/vgscan" only ones.
[16:45] <cyphermox> that is possible, yeah
[16:45] <xnox> deffinately. Trying to reproduce and troubleshoot this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/debian-installer/+bug/1570580
[16:45] <cyphermox> that said, usually if you don't see things you go configure LVM/iSCSI/whatnot and when you get back to the main partitioning menu they show
[16:45] <xnox> which kind of boils down to: i can see volumes on normal drives; but not on the multipath assembled drives
[16:46] <xnox> and i think lvm re-detection is not done after multipath is assembled.
[16:46] <cyphermox> right
[16:46] <xnox> well that's what i did here, and in that menu they _were_ visible. I even tried to make a change (e.g. remove one volume) and "finish" and yet the other one did not show =(
[16:46] <cyphermox> look at the hysterical data for partman-multipath, we may have changed that when mauricio did other multipath changes
[16:47] <cyphermox> I think we removed it because scanning the way it was being done might find LVM first and keep you from activating multipath?
[16:47] <cyphermox> but that doesn't make sense now that I think of it
[16:58] <xnox>  /o\