[01:39] <dyfi> Hello; is there anybody here who is familiar with loading a Snappy image on to the Beaglebone Black?
[06:19] <aatchison> Hey guys. Energies severely depleted over here. I just had a crazy idea. Tensor flow on snappy?
[06:20] <aatchison> Also, random question. Does Snappy deploy well with JuJu?
[07:51] <dholbach> good morning
[08:42] <ysionneau> morning
[08:43] <zyga> good morning
[08:57] <noizer> good morning
[08:58] <zyga> hey ysionneau, noizer :)
[08:58] <zyga> have you read about the skills rename?
[08:59] <ysionneau> skills rename ?
[08:59] <noizer> no
[08:59] <noizer> was it send in the mailing?
[09:00] <zyga> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/snappy-devel/2016-February/001501.html
[09:00] <zyga> yep
[09:00] <zyga> it's just a new name, nothing has changed
[09:00] <ysionneau> ah yes I had this email
[09:04] <ysionneau> zyga: would you know what is supposed to be the init= cmdline for the rpi2 snappy 16.04 ?
[09:04] <ysionneau> (image generated with your tool)
[09:05] <ysionneau> ah found it, it's in snappy-system.txt
[09:08] <zyga> ysionneau: no but I guess you just found out :)
[09:09] <ysionneau> yep!
[09:09] <ysionneau> I'm trying to boot your rpi2 image using qemu
[09:09] <ysionneau> so far I'm KO
[09:10] <ysionneau> it boots the kernel, initrd "works", and then "No init found. Try passing init= bootarg."
[09:10] <ysionneau> (I do pass the init=)
[09:10] <zyga> ysionneau: I don't think qemu will boot it
[09:10] <zyga> ysionneau: initrd is the OS snap btw
[09:11] <noizer> zyga are the interface then for sharing libs
[09:11] <noizer> ?
[09:11] <zyga> noizer: nope
[09:11] <noizer> ok
[09:11]  * zyga needs to update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SnappyHackerUsefulLinkCollection
[09:12] <zyga> help wanted ^^
[09:29] <noizer> zyga is snappy an 64bit system?
[09:29] <zyga> noizer: snappy works on 32 and 64 bit systems
[09:29] <zyga> noizer: we have official images for x86, amd64, arm v7 hard float and aarch64 (or arm64)
[09:30] <noizer> do you have images for soft float?
[09:33] <noizer> the image on the rpi is that an 64 bit systme?
[09:33] <noizer> zyga
[09:33] <zyga> noizer: raspberry pi 2 is 32 bit, hard float
[09:33] <noizer> zyga ok thx
[09:33] <zyga> noizer: we don't support ARMv6 (soft float)
[09:34] <noizer> zyga ok
[09:43] <ysionneau> zyga: I was able to boot the rpi2  15.04 image on qemu
[09:43] <ysionneau> but not as a rpi2 board but as a generic arm64 board with my own arm64 kernel
[09:43] <ysionneau> but except the kernel+modules it was the vanilla 15.04 rpi2 image running in my qemu
[09:43] <ysionneau> that's where I do all my tests so far
[09:43] <ysionneau> I'm trying to replicate this setup with your 16.04 image
[09:53] <ysionneau> it seems that the initramfs does not mount the squashfs (the snaps) since the systemd init is not found...
[09:54] <ysionneau> oh, seems I need to put snappy_os= and snappy_kernel= on the cmdline
[09:54] <zyga> ysionneau: I'd suggest, if you want to continue down this path, is to build a new kernel snap
[09:54] <zyga> ysionneau: that's specifically intended to work with qemu
[09:54] <zyga> ysionneau: you can reuse the os snap as-is
[09:54] <zyga> ysionneau: you can fine-tune the kernel snap
[09:54] <zyga> ysionneau: and you will absolutely need a gadget snap that's not pi2
[09:55] <zyga> ysionneau: I think that would be a fanstastic thing to have
[09:55] <zyga> ysionneau: just one question, why aarch64 kerenl rather than armhf?
[09:55] <ysionneau> 10:54 < zyga> ysionneau: I'd suggest, if you want to continue down this path, is to build a new kernel snap < yes I have my own arm64 kernel (which worked fine with 15.04)
[09:56] <ysionneau> not sure if I need a snap since there is no bootloader involved, qemu boots the kernel directly as I pass it to -kernel cmdline arg
[09:56] <ysionneau> (a snap for the kernel I mean)
[09:56] <zyga> ysionneau: 10:43 < ysionneau> but not as a rpi2 board but as a generic arm64 board with my own arm64 kernel
[09:56] <zyga> ysionneau: you used a different kernel
[09:56] <zyga> ysionneau: you really need a different kernel snap
[09:57] <ysionneau> allright, maybe I should start by asking: what's a kernel snap?
[09:57] <zyga> ysionneau: a snap that has the kenrel, modules and bootloader
[09:57] <zyga> ysionneau: that snappy mounts from the bootloader
[09:57] <ysionneau> here I don't use any bootloader
[09:57] <zyga> ysionneau: and loads the kernel from the mounted snap
[09:57] <ysionneau> since I boot the kernel directly from qemu
[09:57] <zyga> ysionneau: right but that will break varius snappy interaction
[09:57] <zyga> ysionneau: it'd better to boot a disk image
[09:57] <zyga> ysionneau: with a bootloader
[09:58] <zyga> ysionneau: it's extra work but what you did won't survive a snappy update and reboot
[09:58] <ysionneau> not sure if I can boot a disk image with no -kernel
[09:58] <zyga> ysionneau: depending on what you want, it may not be good or it may be exactly what you need
[09:58] <zyga> ysionneau: no, but you can boot a whole disk image
[09:58] <zyga> ysionneau: er. sorry, yes you can
[09:58] <ysionneau> but yes I agree that booting directly on a kernel will break some snappy stuff
[09:58] <ysionneau> like the system updates and such
[09:58] <zyga> ysionneau: I've done things like that in linaro a while ago
[09:59] <zyga> ysionneau: emulating various beagle board-like hardware
[09:59] <zyga> ysionneau: though I don't know how much work that would be today
[10:00] <ysionneau> for now I only need a qemu environment with basic snappy fonctionality, not 100%, to do some tests of .snap packaging of apps
[10:00] <ysionneau> to package a service, an app etc
[10:00] <ysionneau> and to test my ability to generate cross-compiled apps correctly
[10:00] <zyga> ysionneau: I see, good luck
[10:02] <ysionneau> thanks :)
[10:02] <ysionneau> 10:55 < zyga> ysionneau: just one question, why aarch64 kerenl rather than armhf? < when I'm done playing with qemu, I will prototype on a real board, which is a Tegra X1 board
[10:07] <zyga> ysionneau: I see, cool
[10:07] <zyga> ysionneau: did you use aarch userspace?
[10:07] <zyga> ubuntu-core (os snap) has an aarch64 build as well
[10:08] <ysionneau> for user space on my last prototype (15.04 :p) I used the rpi2 image (armhf)
[10:08] <ysionneau> ok, I have the 16.04 user space booting :)
[10:09] <ysionneau> bottom line is I had to add this to kernel cmdline : snappy_os=ubuntu-core.canonical_16.04.0-10.armhf.snap snappy_kernel=canonical-pi2-linux.canonical_4.3.0-1006-3.snap
[10:11] <ysionneau> ok I'm logged in
[10:11] <zyga> woot, great
[10:11] <ysionneau> now let's try with an arm64 kernel and a qemu-aarch64
[10:12] <zyga> maybe just aarch64 with the same bits as before
[10:12] <zyga> then with different kerenl
[10:12] <zyga> kernel*
[10:13] <ysionneau> not sure I understand ?
[10:14] <zyga> ysionneau: try 64 bit qemu
[10:14] <zyga> ysionneau: with the same set of blobs
[10:14] <zyga> ysionneau: so same old kernel and everything else
[10:14] <zyga> ysionneau: (just suggesting to switch one thing at a time)
[10:16] <ysionneau> yes that's what I'll do
[10:16] <ysionneau> just switch the kernel and qemu and keep all the remaining
[10:16] <ysionneau> that should work
[10:20] <ysionneau> right, I need to reconstruct the kernel snap squashfs to include the arm64 modules
[10:20] <ysionneau> jeez
[11:04] <ysionneau> zyga: ok it boots with arm64 kernel (I had to add the squashfs support in the kernel :p)
[11:04] <ysionneau> I also have network o/
[11:04] <ysionneau> *afk eating*
[11:06] <zyga> ysionneau: \o/
[11:06] <zyga> ysionneau: great
[11:46] <uralbash> Hello all
[11:47] <uralbash> Explain to me please, I want to create a kiosk on ubuntu + mir + qt4 app. Is this ok? Which version of ubuntu (core, snappy-15.04, ..) to use? Where to get mir server (form source or ppa or snap demo)?
[11:51] <ysionneau> snappy search does not exist any moer ?
[11:51] <ysionneau> anymore*
[11:56] <uralbash> on xenial (from there https://people.canonical.com/~mvo/all-snaps/) "snappy search mir"  command out "Unknown command `search'. Please specify one command of: activate, booted, ..."
[11:58] <ysionneau> same here, snappy search does not seem to exist anymore on 16.04
[11:58] <svij> it's "snappy find" afaik
[11:59] <ysionneau> nop, does not work
[12:04] <uralbash> `find` not work too http://paste.ubuntu.com/15196599/
[12:23] <ysionneau> zyga: so now, I have my 16.04 environment ready, I want to make some 16.04 packages, where can I find the documentation on how to do that?
[12:24] <ysionneau> is it still snapcraft? or snappy build? snap.yaml? syntax?
[12:37] <mvo> uralbash: ysionneau: please try "snap find" (not that the command is "snap" not snappy for this). its a bit confusing, sorry for that. this is transitioning currently ,there will be a new snap command for everything
[12:37] <mvo> but its not fully done so you are in this in-between state, again, this is just for a couple of days until the conversion is fully done
[12:37]  * mvo wonder if we should simply make snappy search an alias until the rest has landed and until the docs are updated
[12:38] <ysionneau> oh ... snappy ... now snap
[12:38] <ysionneau> now I understand why I wanted to stay on 15.04 :'
[12:38] <ysionneau> things are documented, now everything changes
[12:38] <uralbash> it's work :)
[12:38] <uralbash> thanks
[12:38] <ysionneau> works great mvo thanks for the intel :)
[12:40] <svij> ah, so I wasn't completely wrong with "snappy find"
[12:41] <ysionneau> :)
[12:44] <ysionneau> where's the source code of "snap" mvo ?
[12:45] <mvo> ysionneau: https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snappy/tree/master/cmd/snap
[12:45] <ysionneau> thx
[12:45] <ysionneau> ah it's just another frontend
[12:49] <uralbash> `sudo snap add mir.mvp-demo` is an error http://paste.ubuntu.com/15196831/
[12:51] <Guest81475> Hi, I want to try snappy but there is only an img file available. When I rename it into an iso file and burn it, then I can still not obtain a bootable system. I would like to have snappy as easy  as the regular ubuntu release.
[13:02] <ysionneau> uralbash: !<arch> means it's an AR archive
[13:02] <ysionneau> but AFAIK the new snap format is squashfs
[13:02] <ysionneau> so you are trying to install old snaps on a new system
[13:03] <ysionneau> and btw, I have the same issue as you =)
[13:03] <ysionneau> error: nethack-armhf.ogra failed to install: can not open /tmp/nethack-armhf061356496: cannot open snap: unknown header: "!<arch>\ndebian-binar"
[13:05] <uralbash> ysionneau:  Ah, got it, I need to try build it with snapcraft
[13:23] <zyga> ysionneau: hey
[13:23] <zyga> ysionneau: sorry for the lag, busy time :)
[13:23] <zyga> ysionneau: so apart from small syntax changes, it's the same, you can also use snapcraft
[13:23] <zyga> ysionneau: you just have to use a xenial host with snapcraft 2.x series
[13:24] <zyga> ysionneau: the syntax is again, in examples, in snapcraft
[13:24] <zyga> ysionneau: changes are minor, it's just easier to express stuff IMHO
[13:24] <zyga> ysionneau: snapcraft CLI is tweaked too but it's again simple to adapt, snapcraft snap makes a snap and there's --help and all that typical stuff
[13:25] <zyga> ysionneau: you can look at an example snap I'm working on https://github.com/zyga/snappy-pi2-piglow/blob/master/snapcraft.yaml
[13:25] <zyga> ysionneau: give it a try
[13:26] <zyga> ysionneau: at runtime there are now "snap" and "snappy" commands, you want to use the snap one, unless it has missing functionality
[13:26] <zyga> ysionneau: as mvo said, we're transitioning, snap is using our public APIs while snappy had everything linked in
[13:27] <zyga> ysionneau: you really want 16.04
[13:27] <zyga> ysionneau: it's trivial to adapt and things work much better than on 15.04
[13:27] <zyga> Guest81475: hey, give this script a try: https://github.com/zyga/devtools/blob/master/ubuntu-image
[13:28] <zyga> Guest81475: the images are not iso images, they are hard drive images (or SD card images), typically a CD image has different structure
[13:28] <zyga> Guest81475: but they are all bootable
[13:32] <Guest81475> zyga: Thank you for your replies. Do you know why ubuntu does not offer a bootable iso image for snappy ? That is what all people expect and are used to. I am using Windows 10 and have a working Arch linux installation.
[13:33] <Guest81475> I do not like APT but I love the idea of packages as in snappy. AFAIK, MacOS has a similar system.
[13:36] <ysionneau> zyga: ok :)
[13:37] <zyga> Guest81475: http://developer.ubuntu.com/en/snappy/start/
[13:38] <zyga> Guest81475: http://www.ubuntu.com/internet-of-things/developers
[13:38] <zyga> Guest81475: https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/snappy/start/raspberry-pi-2/
[13:38] <ysionneau> zyga: isn't it weird that the snap tool seems to be downloading old snap packages?
[13:38] <zyga> Guest81475: https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/snappy/start/intel-nuc/
[13:38] <zyga> everything is there :)
[13:38] <Guest81475> zyga: ok. Thanks again.
[13:38] <ysionneau> it downloads .snap which are AR (old format) instead of squashfs, and then fails to install them
[13:39] <zyga> ysionneau: it's a one-off issue, when we made the transition the store didn't have enough information to filter this out
[13:39] <zyga> ysionneau: we're well aware of the problem
[13:39] <ysionneau> oh right
[13:39] <zyga> ysionneau: and I suspect there's going to be a fix that mass-removes click-based snaps from the 16.04 distribution channel
[13:39] <ysionneau> because at the beginning of 16.04 it was still using AR files?
[13:39] <zyga> ysionneau: yep
[13:39] <ysionneau> arggg
[13:39] <zyga> ysionneau: tons of moving pieces to make this work on time :)
[13:39] <zyga> ysionneau: you just see it live
[13:40] <ysionneau> the magic of live :)
[13:40] <zyga> the magic of open
[13:45]  * ysionneau generates a new docker image -> xenial
[13:55] <ysionneau> there's no "snappy-tools" package in the PPA for Xenial ?
[13:58] <ysionneau> that's just a meta package ... but that can be handy
[13:59] <beuno> ysionneau, I think it's part of the Xenial archive now instead of the PPA
[14:33] <sergiusens> elopio, joining?
[14:58] <sergiusens> ysionneau, beuno just apt install snapcraft
[14:59] <ysionneau> yep that's what I've done
[15:02] <sergiusens> beuno, are we going to have the store treat each release as different pockets?
[15:03] <beuno> sergiusens, maybe!  what do you mean by that?
[15:04] <sergiusens> beuno, that I can upload one snap for 16.04 and another for 18.04 during the overlapping support period
[15:04] <beuno> sergiusens, yes, it works like that right now
[15:05] <sergiusens> beuno, o really? so no more checkboxes?
[15:05] <sergiusens> or is it checkbox driven per revision?
[15:05] <sergiusens> that explains why I have to check those boxes on every upload
[15:06] <beuno> sergiusens, yeah, it should really be radio buttons at this point
[15:06] <beuno> it is per revision
[15:06] <beuno> so you can upload one for 15.04 and one for 16.04
[15:06] <beuno> and target them differently
[15:06] <beuno> so yes, that's why you pick each time
[15:07] <beuno> we'll get better at that UI
[15:07] <beuno> sergiusens, you even have history in the store now  :)
[15:07] <beuno> we've essentially created 3 dimensions: release, architecture and channel
[15:07] <beuno> you can targe different binaries to each of those
[15:08] <sergiusens> beuno, nice; we should have snapcraft semantics for upload (among others, the 'release' key in the yaml)
[15:08] <beuno> sergiusens, indeed
[15:08] <beuno> I think that's part of our UX story overall
[15:09] <beuno> which I'll find a volunteer to go and play with you soon
[15:09] <kyrofa> Good morning!
[15:10] <kyrofa> jdstrand, nooo https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1467595/comments/28
[15:18] <sergiusens> kyrofa, joining?
[15:19] <kyrofa> Haha, just saw that you guys were meeting
[15:19] <kyrofa> Grabbing headphones
[15:26] <elopio> stgraber: ping. Our lxc in travis is timing out waiting for eth0. This used to work great for the past weeks.
[15:26] <elopio> any change on your side?
[15:33] <stgraber> elopio: what lxc version, what lxd version, what kernel version and what Ubuntu version in the container?
[15:38] <sergiusens> stgraber, host is trusty; here's the full of it, it's a small log https://travis-ci.org/ubuntu-core/snapcraft/jobs/111744184
[15:38] <kyrofa> stgraber, 2.0.0~beta4-0ubuntu4~ubuntu14.04.1~ppa1
[15:38] <stgraber> sergiusens: oh, the output of lxc info changed slightly, you'll need to change that grep, sorry
[15:39] <kyrofa> stgraber, whew, easy fix though
[15:39] <sergiusens> stgraber, we are using a beta, all good :-)
[15:39] <stgraber> "IPV4" now shows up as "inet" (the actual name of the network family)
[15:39] <sergiusens> stgraber, thanks for spotting it quickly
[15:39] <stgraber> yeah, had a similar problem here with one of my scripts
[15:58] <jdstrand> kyrofa: I know, right? there is still hope for 4.4
[15:59] <jdstrand> kyrofa: and 4.3 is *way* better
[16:01] <kyrofa> jdstrand, alright, good deal
[16:46] <noizer> Hi guys is it even possible to communicate with usb devices on snappyN?
[16:50] <kyrofa> noizer, yes, but you need to give snaps permission to use them
[16:52] <noizer> ok what skill is it?
[16:52] <kyrofa> noizer, in 15.04 you had to hw-assign it. jdstrand has that gone away in 16.04?
[16:59] <jdstrand> kyrofa: hw-assign currently exists. it won't once zyga and niemeyer have their way :)
[16:59] <jdstrand> but it is still there
[16:59] <noizer> ok
[17:15] <zyga> noizer, kyrofa: interfaces (renamed skills)
[17:15] <zyga> kyrofa: hw-assign is still in 16.04 daily but I'll remove it when interfaces go live
[17:15] <zyga> and I should read backlogs backwards ;)
[17:15] <kyrofa> zyga, yeah that's kinda tough-- you never know how far back they go :P
[17:16] <zyga> kyrofa: eleven years ;)
[17:16] <zyga> not in this channel though
[17:16] <kyrofa> zyga, haha, yeah exactly
[17:17] <zyga> I'm tired with all the rename I did today
[17:18] <zyga> I'd love to land this but there are Ks of diffs and everyone is busy
[17:18] <zyga> if someone can have a look at https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snappy/pull/524/files
[17:18] <zyga> that would help me out
[17:18] <zyga> or https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snappy/pull/523/files for a shorter pull request
[19:03] <plars> ev:  I got this when trying to create a spec, which I think might be interesting to you.... it doesn't let me re-run it because it says the spec already exists: "message": "Oops! Something bad happened server side (id=Vs9PuwoZwIwAAGe9IgMAAAAl)"
[19:04] <beuno> plars, the cloud is being messed with
[19:04] <beuno> good to know, though
[19:04] <beuno> just not surprising  :)
[19:04] <ev> 😢 🎺
[19:04] <plars> ev: a sad trumpet? as a trombone player, I'm deeply offended by that
[19:05] <ev> hahaha, there’s no trombone in unicode
[19:05] <plars> a major flaw imho, let's dump unicode
[19:05] <ev> we probably should
[19:06] <plars> back to ebcdic until further notice
[19:06] <ev> LOL
[19:06] <ev> nearly lost my tea there
[19:07] <plars> ev in all seriousness though, I guess I should hold off on messing with this while it's in this state? any idea how long?
[19:07] <ev> depends on IS
[19:07] <ev> I’d give it another go next week
[19:07] <plars> ack
[19:07] <plars> hah, ok
[19:26] <kyrofa> sergiusens, say I have a 15.04 snap that depends on the docker framework. If I upload a version of the snap that doesn't depend upon docker, will the previously-installed docker snap still get automatically updated?
[19:26] <kyrofa> sergiusens, I'm not quite sure how the frameworks thing plays into that
[19:34] <sergiusens> kyrofa, yes it will
[19:35] <kyrofa> sergiusens, alright thanks :)
[19:39] <kyrofa> sergiusens, you okay waiting a bit on that pkg-config PR? I'm giving it some good testing, but might take a while
[19:39] <sergiusens> kyrofa, no rush
[19:39] <kyrofa> sergiusens, good deal
[20:13] <kyrofa> sergiusens, in 16.04 snappy, the .service files still have restart on failure, but it seems the snap installation itself fails if the service fails to start. Do you know anything about that?
[20:14] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I have no idea; the right person to ask this is Chipaca
[20:14] <kyrofa> sergiusens, alright thanks :)
[20:14] <kyrofa> Chipaca, I suppose you're eating
[20:14] <sergiusens> kyrofa, I am really outdated these days :-)
[20:14] <sergiusens> lol
[20:14] <sergiusens> risotto?
[20:14] <kyrofa> Hahaha
[21:03] <pindonga> jdstrand, hey, crt @ 596 on prod now
[21:07] <sergiusens> elopio, can we apt update the jenkins instances before test run?
[21:32] <jdstrand> pindonga: thanks!
[21:33] <jdstrand> mvo: note, with that ^ on prod, we are going to start getting a warning that the store can't verify resquashing until bug #1548988 is srud to trusty
[21:34] <jdstrand> mvo: however, that bug is in hand so next week that'll just work itself out
[21:35] <mvo> jdstrand: nice, thanks for the update


[11:39] <tjaalton> 1.19.3 uploaded to ppa:canonical-x/x-staging
[16:04] <michael-vb> Hello, wondering if someone can give me a hint about the following.
[16:04] <michael-vb> In the VirtualBox Guest Additions we install a drm driver into /lib/modules which should get auto-loaded at boot time.  A user is claiming that in a Debian Sid virtual machine, X.Org often starts before the module is loaded.
[16:04] <michael-vb> Is this expected?  Not sure what else the user might have done of course.  And if it is expected, should I be doing something to prevent it?
[16:07] <tjaalton> the driver probably isn't in the initrd image
[16:07] <tjaalton> ?
[16:07] <alkisg> Kernel 4.8 broke 16bpp modes in virtualbox for me (I see two smaller broken images of the screen instead of one large one), while in 4.4 it worked, would that be related to the vbox code? Should i report that to the vbox bug tracker or to the kernel or to xorg?
[16:09] <michael-vb> tjaalton: don't think so.  I tried putting it into initrd's on various systems (though it is only Debian that puts graphics drivers there), but it felt too fragile for me.  For me it works without.  Am I just lucky?
[16:09] <michael-vb> I assumed that the initrd graphics drivers were for the boot splash.
[16:09] <tjaalton> kms drivers
[16:09] <tjaalton> if you put it in /lib/modules it's a kms driver?
[16:10] <michael-vb> Exactly.
[16:10] <tjaalton> so it belongs there
[16:10] <michael-vb> Of course, I usually test Ubuntu which ships it by default.
[16:10] <tjaalton> ships what?
[16:10] <michael-vb> So that is probably why I am not noticing.
[16:10] <michael-vb> vboxvideo.ko
[16:10] <tjaalton> ah
[16:10] <michael-vb> And if it is in the initrd would that be expected to work?
[16:11] <tjaalton> I'd say so
[16:11] <tjaalton> otherwise X might start before the driver has a chance of loading
[16:11] <tjaalton> I guess
[16:11] <michael-vb> Oh dear, back to initrd fun then.  It seems to go wrong in so many different ways when you try to add something from outside.
[16:12] <michael-vb> Actually, remembering, with Ubuntu one could just drop a file into some directory and ask to have the initrd rebuilt.
[16:12] <michael-vb> Thanks.
[16:13] <tjaalton> should be the same trickery
[16:13] <tjaalton> unless there's some ubuntu'ism
[16:13] <tjaalton> in initramfs-tools
[16:14] <michael-vb> Hopefully not.
[16:15] <tjaalton> you can check the diff to be sure :)
[16:16] <tjaalton> /usr/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/init-top/framebuffer
[16:16] <tjaalton> nope
[16:16] <tjaalton> /usr/share/initramfs-tools/hooks/framebuffer
[16:16] <tjaalton> copy_modules_dir kernel/drivers/gpu
[16:17] <tjaalton> so install a new hook
[16:20] <michael-vb> Ahem.  That file exists in 0.125ubuntu9 but not in 0.127 from Sid.
[16:20] <alkisg> Here's what I'm seeing with kernel 4.8: https://snag.gy/H3FeMW.jpg
[16:21] <michael-vb> alkisg: if you are using Guest Additions then probably yes.
[16:21] <alkisg> michael-vb: ubuntu 16.04.2, I think it has some video module preinstalled?
[16:21] <alkisg> I didn't install anything manually
[16:23] <michael-vb> Can't remember what Ubuntu 16.04 provides.  Especially not .2.  Could you pnopaste your Xorg.0.log from the guest for reference?
[16:24] <michael-vb> In any case, the Ubuntu maintainer for the VirtualBox drivers is not in this channel, so perhaps we should not be troubling other people with this.
[16:25] <michael-vb> We could switch to #vbox for now with it.
[16:25] <alkisg> michael-vb: if it's a vbox issue, of course, I'll come there, thank you
[16:27] <michael-vb> tjaalton: so it looks like Debian (Sid at least) does not do kms drivers in the initrd.
[16:51] <tjaalton> michael-vb: then I don't understand the original bug
[16:51] <tjaalton> why it happens
[16:51] <michael-vb> Should Xorg wait for udev to finish loading drm drivers before starting?  (It is udev, isn't it?)
[16:52] <tjaalton> whatever starts xorg
[16:53] <tjaalton> lightdm has
[16:53] <tjaalton> After=systemd-user-sessions.service<EMAIL_ADDRESS>plymouth-quit.service
[16:54] <michael-vb> And in Sid that is probably gdm.  So I should probably be asking whoever takes care of that.
[16:55] <tjaalton> look at it's service file
[16:57] <michael-vb> Thanks.
[16:57] <michael-vb> Have to be moving, children to feed...
[16:58] <tjaalton> After=rc-local.service plymouth-start.service systemd-user-sessions.service
[16:58] <tjaalton> dunno what happens if there is no plymouth
[16:59] <tjaalton> hmm nothing


[12:34] <reinaldo> Sorry! It was just a test.
[13:27] <bazeee> hy
[13:28] <bazeee> somebody, or just bot/bnc?
[13:30] <cfhowlett> want answers?  ask questions.
[13:31] <bazeee> tnx
[13:31] <bazeee> my ubuntu 16.4, wont start, just the blank screen i can see
[13:32] <bazeee> start just with the systemd grup option
[13:32] <bazeee> can i fix, to start the normal mode? :)
[13:33] <bazeee> its not comfortable to enter the group menu evry single start :/
[15:30] <OvenWerks> bazeee: I am not sure what the group menu is that you are refering to.
[15:31] <OvenWerks> bazeee: what I see here is grub which lists my OS partitions (because I have more than one, my wifes computer does not have this)
[15:32] <OvenWerks> bazeee: Then eventually I get to the login screen that has the same background as the session and just requires my password. I see no other "menus". Are you seeing one of those or something else?
[17:49] <bazeee> OvenWerks: no, if I start normal, with out entering groub, no, just blank screen, no ubuntu logo, no loading ubuntu studio logo. :( if I pres Ctrl+Alt+Del, My computer is going to restart, I can se now the animated Ubuntu studio logo :) intresting...
[17:50] <zequence> bazeee: Perhaps it's a graphics driver problem?
[17:50] <zequence> bazeee: Do you have nvidia, or amd, or something else than Intel graphics?
[17:53] <gantengbanget> hi
[17:53] <gantengbanget> everone
[17:53] <bazeee> Ati i have. but i dont think the graphics card is the problem, Ubuntu starting ok, if i choise in the groub menu the other Ubuntu option... -start with sistemd
[17:53] <gantengbanget> *everyone
[17:53] <bazeee> hi gantengbanget
[17:54] <gantengbanget> I'm new here
[17:54] <gantengbanget> I just installed ubuntu studio
[17:54] <zequence> bazeee: So, Ubuntu starts, but not Ubuntu Studio?
[17:55] <zequence> gantengbanget: Hello. New user?
[17:55] <bazeee> no, same. i have just one op. sistem
[17:55] <bazeee> :)
[17:56] <gantengbanget> zequence: yep
[17:56] <zequence> gantengbanget: Music, graphics, what's your interest?
[17:56] <gantengbanget> i'm a videographer
[17:57] <zequence> gantengbanget: Cool. So, kdenlive?
[17:57] <gantengbanget> i dunno
[17:57] <gantengbanget> i just started
[17:57] <zequence> bazeee: It sounds like the system boots
[17:57] <gantengbanget> and...still dont know what I should use
[17:57] <zequence> bazeee: Try booting, and after a while do Ctrl + Alt + F1
[17:58] <zequence> gantengbanget: For video, kdenlive is probably a good option. There's also blender, pitivi and openshot.
[17:58] <zequence> Lightworks too, but not installable from the system
[17:58] <bazeee> hmm, the terminal
[17:58] <zequence> bazeee: Yes, do you see it?
[17:59] <bazeee> yes, working.. :P i already tryed
[17:59] <gantengbanget> im used to play with premiere
[17:59] <zequence> bazeee: Ok, so the system is in fact booting, but you have no graphics - so again, probably a graphics driver problem
[17:59] <gantengbanget> whats wrong with graphic driver?
[17:59] <zequence> bazeee: fglrx doesn't work on 16.04, yet. So, you may want to uninstall that
[18:00] <gantengbanget> do i need update graphic driver?
[18:00] <zequence> gantengbanget: No, this is for bazeee, who has a ATI card
[18:00] <bazeee> hmmm. ok.  zequence.
[18:00] <zequence> ATI/AMD cards won't work with propritery drivers on 16.04, as of yet
[18:00] <zequence> But, the free drivers work ok
[18:00] <gantengbanget> im using nvidia
[18:01] <zequence> nvidia will work with both free and proprietary drivers
[18:01] <gantengbanget> i just updated graphic driver
[18:01] <gantengbanget> need to restart
[18:01] <gantengbanget> ill be back
[18:01] <zequence> gantengbanget: See you later
[18:01] <bazeee> hmmm zequence : A(z) „fglrx” csomag nincs telepítve, így nem lett törölve
[18:01] <bazeee> ehem.: it is not installed
[18:02] <zequence> Is that Latvian, or something?
[18:02] <bazeee> hungrarian :)
[18:02] <zequence> Anyway, not sure what the package is called
[18:02] <bazeee> hungarian. sorry.
[18:02] <zequence> Ah, I'm Finnish myself, so it seemed somewhat familiar
[18:04] <zequence> bazeee: Try doing 'apt-cache search fglrx'
[18:04] <zequence> Not sure what the package is called currently
[18:05] <bazeee> now everyting os ok with: Ubuntu, with Linux 4.4.0-21-lowlatency (systemd) ...
[18:05] <bazeee> ok I can try
[18:05] <bazeee> fglrx-pxpress - transitional package for ubuntu-drivers-common ubuntu-drivers-common - Detect and install additional Ubuntu driver packages boinc-client-fglrx - metapackage for AMD/ATI fglrx-savvy BOINC client and manager kubuntu-driver-manager - Driver Manager for Kubuntu kubuntu-driver-manager-dbg - Driver Manager for Kubuntu -- debug symbols
[18:05] <zequence> bazeee: Ok, so you were able to get graphics now?
[18:05] <gantengbanget> hi there
[18:06] <zequence> gantengbanget: Hi
[18:06] <gantengbanget> updated successed
[18:06] <gantengbanget> btw, what app for monitoring connection
[18:08] <zequence> gantengbanget: internet connection?
[18:08] <zequence> What kind of monitoring, exactly?
[18:08] <gantengbanget> yup
[18:08] <gantengbanget> internet connection
[18:08] <zequence> You mean upload/download bit rates?
[18:08] <gantengbanget> so we know usage of our PC
[18:08] <gantengbanget> yap
[18:09] <zequence> there should be an applet for that, which you can to the panel, but right clicking on it, and selecting -> Panel -> Add new items
[18:09] <gantengbanget> sometimes ubuntu updater did not showing what it do
[18:09] <zequence> One of the applets is called "Network Monitor". Think that's what you want
[18:10] <bazeee> bmon?
[18:10] <zequence> gantengbanget: If you want to update manually, do this 'sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade' and you will see everything
[18:10] <zequence> && means AND
[18:11] <gantengbanget> I've searched, theres no network monitor app in ubuntu studio
[18:12] <zequence> gantengbanget: Just right click on the top panel, and select "Panel" -> "Add new items"
[18:12] <zequence> Then, select "Network Mointor"
[18:12] <zequence> There are also lots of internet monitorin applications available in the repos, but the "applet" should do for you
[18:13] <gantengbanget> ahh yes
[18:13] <gantengbanget> it works
[18:13] <gantengbanget> thanks zequence
[18:13] <zequence> np
[18:14] <gantengbanget> but the bars did not fluctuate
[18:15] <zequence> No, seems like it's not working
[18:16] <zequence> There could be some other variant that works as a systray application
[18:16] <gantengbanget> what app?
[18:17] <zequence> This one perhas
[18:17] <zequence> nagstamon
[18:18] <zequence> If you do 'apt-cache search network monitor' you will see a lot of options
[18:18] <zequence> Going to install nagstamon, with the command 'sudo apt-get install nagstamon'
[18:18] <zequence> Software may have some problems finding applications right now. It's being fixed. There's a bug
[18:19] <zequence> No nagstamon was not the one for you :)
[18:19] <zequence> It's for monitoring servers
[18:19] <gantengbanget> nagstamon didnt work
[18:19] <gantengbanget> its for server
[18:20] <zequence> All desktop environments usually have a way to monitor network, but it seems the one XFCE has is borken
[18:20] <zequence> Yes, like I said :)
[18:20] <gantengbanget> i mean for internet usage for my UbuntuStudio
[18:21] <gantengbanget> I need to know quota I've been used
[18:21] <gantengbanget> ah unfortunately
[18:21] <zequence> quota? Ok, then you need something a bit more advanced anyway
[18:22] <gantengbanget> for close internet connection if limit has reached?
[18:23] <zequence> There's this gantengbanget http://askubuntu.com/questions/103634/any-good-application-for-data-usage-monitor/354056
[18:23] <zequence> But, if you just google, you may find something better
[18:24] <zequence> Usually, use the keywoard "ubuntu" in the mix, and you should find results
[18:24] <zequence> Like "ubuntu network usage application"
[18:25] <zequence> That gives me this link, for example http://askubuntu.com/questions/532424/how-to-monitor-bandwidth-usage
[18:25] <zequence> Both tools I've seen are terminal based, but I'm sure there's a GUI equivalent too
[18:31] <bazeee> ..aaand ping time out. :P
[18:52] <bazeee> bytheway, tnx, and good day/or night