[04:18] <daddy0> had mce errors daily for a week while using bionic... went back to xenial 7 days now and nothing
[04:18] <daddy0> hmmm
[04:19] <daddy0> any ideas?
[04:19] <daddy0> e6700 8gb ram gts450
[04:22] <lotuspsychje> daddy0: we talked about this before
[04:23] <lotuspsychje> daddy0: nvidia is a no go yet on wayland
[04:27] <daddy0> i was playing steam dota2, and some wine 3d games
[04:28] <daddy0> so it was all thru wayland?
[04:28] <daddy0> thought xorg was default for bionic
[04:28] <daddy0> forgive me im still learing a
[04:29] <lotuspsychje> daddy0: the final plan is xorg by default on 18.04 yes
[04:29] <daddy0> but wayland is the default for the alpha that im using?
[04:29] <lotuspsychje> daddy0: not sure if it changed already in this stage
[04:29] <daddy0> isee
[04:30] <daddy0> the mce errors said cpu fwiw
[09:21] <Ian_Corne> I'm not finding snap installed apps via gnome-shell, anyone else? Feature or bug?
[11:03] <tomreyn> daddy0: maybe be the bionic installation you had came with buggy intel microcode updates, this cuold explain mce's. i'm not sure whetehr those are on the installation media (then it's totally possible) or downloaded live (then i don't think this is what happened since those updates got pulled)
[14:07] <Ian_Corne> any other users of chrome and gmail notifications? It seems they lag hard when hovering over them
[17:29] <jackpot51>  Has anyone noticed delays in the Bionic daily image when running in QEMU?
[17:29] <hggdh> jackpot51: what type of delays?
[17:30] <Odd_Bloke> jackpot51: And by "Bionic daily image" you mean the daily ISO?
[17:30] <jackpot51> Before showing the ubiquity selection, there is a blank screen for about 30 seconds. Yes, I mean the dialy ISO
[17:30] <hggdh> sorry, did not ee that type of delay
[17:31] <jackpot51> bionic-desktop-amd64.iso from yesterday
[17:31] <flocculant> jackpot51: yup - though with xubuntu's daily - been seeing that for weeks though
[17:31] <jackpot51> I run it as follows: kvm -m 2G -vga qxl -hda hda.img -boot d -cdrom bionic-desktop-amd64.iso
[17:32] <jackpot51> -vga std does the same thing, by the way
[17:32] <TJ-> jackpot51: what is the host it's running on?
[17:32] <TJ-> jackpot51: Xenial?
[17:32] <jackpot51> Ubuntu 18.04
[17:32] <TJ-> jackpot51: so 18.04  on 18.04 ?
[17:32] <jackpot51> Yep :)
[17:34] <TJ-> could be related to qemu/kvm patches for PTI - you've got host-kernel+qemu/kvm --> guest-kernel interactions. Did the previous daily behave? Can we narrow down the point at which this began?
[17:39] <jackpot51> I believe this has been an issue for a while. A colleague of mine has the issue with the same ISO but using 17.10 as the host. I have seen it with dailies for at least the past week
[17:40] <powersj> the 30 second comment is interesting as we added a 30 second timeout during language selection
[17:40] <powersj> see: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-server/2017-November/007627.html for background
[17:43]  * powersj tries the desktop iso
[17:43] <flocculant> powersj: that sounds about as long as I've been having long boot times
[17:44] <jackpot51> powersj: jderose will try Ubuntu server 18.04 on 17.10, I will try it on 18.04
[17:44] <flocculant> if in fact it's the issue on desktop
[17:44] <powersj> thanks - that would be good as I am not seeing the issue with server
[17:44] <jackpot51> It may be on desktop, but seeing it in xubuntu is odd. After server, we will try xubuntu and see if it feels like the same issue
[17:45] <flocculant> jackpot51: okey doke
[17:45] <flocculant> could be local to me - but who knows
[17:51]  * powersj sees "A start job is running for Ubuntu live CD installer"
[17:53] <jderose> powersj: in today's bionic server iso, i'm getting stuck at "Select and install software... Installation step failed". but no delay launching DI anyway
[17:54] <powersj> jderose: can you run md5sum on your server ISO so I can check it out
[17:54] <powersj> wanna make sure I'm using the same one as you
[17:56] <jderose> powersj: c302305611be0e0321f3b4fcbc9e53db  bionic-server-amd64.iso
[17:57] <jackpot51> I had success launching the server iso, b5c0b9a1221ac222ccd7cf0681a5984a *bionic-server-amd64.iso
[17:57] <jackpot51> Have not installed yet
[17:57] <powersj> jderose: ah the pending ISO suggest avoiding those as they do break and my CI will prevent bad ones from coming out
[17:57] <powersj> it is good though that all of us seem to be booting the server ISO correctly
[17:58] <jderose> ah right, forgot i'm using pending rather than current, will check current now...
[17:59] <TJ-> It looks like the delay is in syslinux, which implies a BIOS mode boot. Does it also happen for an EFI mode boot (which uses GRUB) ?
[18:02] <jderose> TJ-: yes, the delay is happing for jackpot51 and i in UEFI mode under QEMU also (using ovmf)
[18:02] <jackpot51> I have a delay with the 18.04 ISO on both BIOS and UEFI
[18:02] <TJ-> Just tested that, it doesn't delay for an EFI boot
[18:03] <jackpot51> Let me update my desktop image, I pulled mine yesterday
[18:03] <TJ-> For me it hits the GRUB menu, pauses about 4 seconds then auto-starts the "Try Ubuntu" entry
[18:04] <jackpot51> Does it change with -vga qxl ?
[18:04] <jackpot51> What arguments are you using?
[18:04] <TJ-> qemu-system-x86_64 -name Bionic-Test -m 2G -bios /usr/share/ovmf/OVMF.fd -machine accel=kvm -vga qxl -monitor stdio -serial tcp:<IP_ADDRESS>:9999 -k en-gb -drive file=/dev/sda,if=scsi,format=raw,readonly -cdrom /home/tj/Downloads/bionic-desktop-amd64.iso -boot d
[18:06] <jackpot51> On what host are you running?
[18:07] <jackpot51> For me, the delay occurs after the plymouth splash screen with that same command
[18:09] <jackpot51> I will let you know when I can rerun it with the latest ISO. The one I currently have has this md5sum: 064ab6173bc942d3327098f57748182e *bionic-desktop-amd64.iso
[18:09] <TJ-> jackpot51: I hit Esc to watch what's going on rather than leave splash up
[18:10] <TJ-> startup jobs seem to be trundling along,
[18:10] <jackpot51> I ran without quiet and splash, the screen goes blank before the halt. GNOME shell starting?
[18:13] <powersj> once it boots running `systemd-analyze blame` might be interesting, for me with that slightly modified command line from above I get 20s for plymouth-quit-wait.service
[18:14] <jackpot51> Here is the journal log: https://paste.ubuntu.com/26506933/
[18:15] <jackpot51> systemd-analyze returns 6.489s (kernel) + 1.637s (userspace) = 8.127s
[18:15] <jackpot51> Which is inaccurate
[18:15] <jackpot51> systemd-analyze blame has the hisghest time as dev-sr0.device, 2.224s
[18:16] <jackpot51> In the logs, there is a jump from Feb 02 18:10:29 ubuntu NetworkManager[974]: <info>  [1517595029.9565] manager: rfkill: WWAN hardware radio set enabled
[18:16] <jackpot51> To the next line Feb 02 18:10:40 ubuntu nm-dispatcher[1052]: req:3 'connectivity-change': start running ordered scripts...
[18:17] <jackpot51> That is at line 1384 in the paste. From line 1384 to line 1411, there is a time difference of 30 seconds. At this point, GNOME Shell reports starting
[18:25] <TJ-> From the serial console here it looks like there's the usual network-online.wait delay... graphical.target wants don't kick off until that comepletes
[18:26] <jackpot51> The same thing happens with the latest ISO: 50e3297bebfeea58ff5bd48f1e2d94fe *ubuntu-bionic-desktop-amd64.iso
[18:27] <TJ-> I also edit the kernel command-line before starting, so it has "debug console=tty0 console=ttyS0,115200n8 earlyprintk=serial,ttyS0,115200n8" (and quiet splash removed)
[18:27] <jackpot51> Ah, that would be good
[18:28] <TJ-> The qemu command above redirects the serial console to TCP port 9999, and I have "nc -l -p 9999 | tee /tmp/bionic-daily.log" running too to capture that /and/ be able to interact with the system by logging in at the "login:"
[18:29] <jackpot51> Is there a reason why this wait time wouldn't be in systemd-analyze ?
[18:29] <TJ-> If it occurs /after/ graphical.target is achieved, yes
[18:31] <TJ-> try booting with "systemd.unit=multi-user.target" so the GUI isn't started. Then log-in, and do "systemctl start graphical.target" - see if there's any difference. THat should also separate out the real service bring-up delays from the GUI start-up
[18:32] <jackpot51> Ok, will do
[18:34] <jackpot51> Is there a password?
[18:34] <jackpot51> Ah, it is blank
[18:35] <jackpot51> The delay is after starting graphical.target
[18:35] <TJ-> jackpot51: line 1386 "dbus-daemon[969]: [system] Failed to activate service 'org.bluez': timed out (service_start_timeout=25000ms)" -- 25 seconds --- could be implicated
[18:36] <TJ-> jackpot51: so check the gdm logs, /var/log/gdm/ I think
[18:37] <jackpot51> I think you are right. That happens after systemctl start graphical.target, and right at the delay
[18:37] <jackpot51> The bluez issue
[18:38] <TJ-> jackpot51: good that you've proved that is related to the graphical.target too
[18:39] <jackpot51> Maybe I should disable the bluez dbus service before running graphical.target?
[18:41] <TJ-> bug #1533206 looks to be related, I wonder if the patch got dropped during MIR
[18:41] <TJ-> basically, if there's no BT device the bluez daemon can't be reached on DBus so things calling it end up timing out
[18:42] <TJ-> which might explain why VMs see it but bare-metal often doesnt (for laptops etc.)
[18:43] <jackpot51> After disable dbus-org.bluez.service, I do not get that message any more
[18:43] <jackpot51> But the delay is still there
[18:44] <jackpot51> Instead, I get Feb 02 18:10:53 ubuntu gsd-media-keys[1540]: Failed to grab accelerators: Timeout was reached (24)
[18:44] <jackpot51> Something similar to that
[18:46] <TJ-> jackpot51: right, and I checked - blueman still has the patch (and shouldn't affect a Gnome desktop anyhow)
[18:46] <TJ-> I suspect it's gnome-shell related
[18:47] <TJ-> although ... hmmm... that wouldn't affect xubuntu
[18:51] <TJ-> I'm testing today's amd64 image now
[18:55] <jackpot51> I can test Xubuntu as well
[19:19] <jackpot51> Yes, there is a delay in Xubuntu on my system as well
[19:22] <jackpot51> Logs here: https://paste.ubuntu.com/26509009/
[19:22] <jackpot51> Jump is at line 960
[21:04] <taohansen> when doing an apt update tracking "devel" in my /etc/apt/sources.list i receive this funky warning: https://gist.github.com/7931576c4babb39489b9adc82e226ff0
[21:04] <taohansen> everything appears to be functional but this warning implies to me that Ubuntu intends to remove support for tracking "devel" in the future? is that a corrent supposition?
[21:05] <taohansen> correct*
[21:06] <Odd_Bloke> taohansen: I'm not sure I follow your line of reasoning; devel points at bionic at the moment, and apt is making sure you understand that what you're asking for isn't what you're getting (at least, not verbatim).
[21:06] <nacc> taohansen: it might be apt being more verbose
[21:06] <Odd_Bloke> I don't see why you would infer that support is going away. :)
[21:06] <nacc> i'm not sure it's an archive change, reallly, as i thought devel was just a symllink
[21:07] <taohansen> Odd_Bloke: irrational paranoia perhaps. 🙂 thanks for clearing up my confusion
[21:50] <TJ-> How /on earth/ is one supposed to interact with the Gnome network manager applet to configure a connection? There's a mutli-application drop-down, but it just says "Wired Connecting" and no way to influence it. Desktop has "Network Manager 1 new notification" but no way to interact with it, either
[21:51] <nacc> TJ-: on my system if i click up there, each network device has a twisty section (smalll right-facing triangle)
[21:51] <nacc> TJ-: and under each of those i can change settings, disablle, etc
[21:52] <TJ-> nacc: the desktop shows a clock too; is this some form of screen-lock? I don't seem able to get rid of it
[21:52] <nacc> TJ-: i've never had a clock on my desktop :)
[21:52] <nacc> i have a clock in the panel at the top
[21:54] <TJ-> nacc: this is in a qemu VM: http://iam.tj/projects/ubuntu/bionic-daily-desktop.png
[21:54] <nacc> Tah yes, that llooks like th elock screen
[21:54] <nacc> i *think* this is the thing people have talked about, you have to 'swipe up' or something?
[21:55] <nacc> i'm really not sure
[21:55] <TJ-> hmmm, so how does one get rid of it I wonder?
[21:55] <nacc> i have not fresh istnalled in a while, so i don't know :)
[21:55] <nacc> but i would ugess that's why it's grayed out
[21:55] <TJ-> nacc: You're correct! Well I'll go to the foot of our stairs, what a silly non-intuitive behaviour for a desktop and mouse!
[21:56] <nacc> yeah, i think it's somethig inherited from convergence-like bheavior
[21:56] <TJ-> there should at least be a graphic hint there :D
[21:56] <nacc> but i really dont' know, someone else complained about that (possibly here) a while ago
[21:56] <nacc> there used to be like a arrow path at the bottom (and a grabber)
[21:56] <nacc> but y'know, gnome being all modern, maybe they removed that :)

[21:56] <TJ-> :p
[21:57] <TJ-> You know my views ... I'm just trying diagnose this long delay at start-up for the installer
[22:00] <TJ-> I get more utility out of the 115200 baud serial link I've got connected to it's console
[22:03] <nacc> TJ-: :)
[22:04] <TJ-> * except when I forget and press Ctrl+C and kill the entire VM :D doh


[06:34] <Hessam> سلام
[11:22] <anux_> vpn
[14:22] <Parsa> wtf :D
[14:22] <Guest12787> any body hear now?
[14:23] <Guest12787> chera nickname avaz shod ????!:)


[00:09] <jrib> woli: good luck then
[05:16] <woli> hi
[05:16] <woli> ok
[05:16] <Paddy_EIRE> Okay so have you seen the wiki page yet
[05:16] <woli> I have a kde uetbootin and the usb-creator that savvas got for me.
[05:16] <Paddy_EIRE> ok
[05:16] <woli> i want to know if I just need to use either program to set up completely my usb, or if ill have to do other stuff besides that
[05:17] <woli> which software do you recommend me to use?
[05:17] <Paddy_EIRE> https://help.ubuntu.com/8.04/installation-guide/i386/boot-usb-files.html
[05:17] <Paddy_EIRE> and https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromUSBStick
[05:17] <Paddy_EIRE> You will need to reference those
[05:18] <woli> So i will need to do things besides running the usb creation applications?
[05:18] <Paddy_EIRE> Any particular questions about what step you are at.. then just give me a buzz
[05:18] <woli> ok
[05:19] <Paddy_EIRE> woli, are you running from ubuntu at the moment?
[05:19] <Paddy_EIRE> or running ubuntu rather
[05:19] <Paddy_EIRE> :P
[05:19] <persia> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromUSBStick is a little out-of-date.  usb-creator should just work, assuming you have an ISO.
[05:19] <Paddy_EIRE> yes
[05:19] <Paddy_EIRE> usb-creator is all you need
[05:20] <woli> I am
[05:20] <woli> ah ok perfect
[05:20] <woli> I guess I need no more guidance.
[05:20] <Paddy_EIRE> just fire questions as you go
[05:21] <Paddy_EIRE> persia, that page needs updating
[05:21] <Paddy_EIRE> If I get the time I will do it
[05:21] <persia> Paddy_EIRE, Agreed.  You see more of the questions from users than I: perhaps you'd like to take a stab at it?
[05:22] <Paddy_EIRE> yeah no probs
[05:51] <woli> Damn, Paddy left
[05:51] <woli> persia, do you know about this?
[05:51] <woli> I just want to know if which option should I choose...
[05:51] <woli> hold on.
[05:52] <woli> When starting up from this disk, documents and settings will be: a) Stored in reserved extra space; b) Discarded on shutdown, unless you save them elsewhere
[05:53] <persia> Are you planning to install, or use this as a live system on a stick on various machines?
[05:53] <woli> Sorry, I misunderstood what I read before. Now I noticed what it really meant.
[05:54] <woli> I'm using the discard on shutdown, unless saved elsewhere because I'm just going to use it to install ubuntu on a lappy once.
[05:55] <persia> If you're just planning an install, then that's the right choice.
[05:55] <woli> Thanks. Sorry for the disturbance.
[05:56] <persia> If you have a suggestion on how to rephrase that may not lead to this confusion, please file a bug.
[06:04] <woli> persia, also, is it unsafe to rename a boot usb?
[06:04] <persia> How do you mean "rename"?
[06:04] <woli> Like in change the label of the drive.
[06:05] <persia> Shouldn't matter.
[06:06] <woli> Ok.
[06:13] <woli> Thanks persia, my live usb is now created. I just hope it works =D.


[01:10] <wallyworld> sinzui: you available to answer a question?
[02:25]  * wallyworld goes to have lunch with bigjools
[03:21]  * StevenK stabs mail handling
[03:28] <wgrant> StevenK: Oh?
[03:30] <StevenK> Two reasons. 1. Why does LP insist on sending me 5 mails about an MP that I just created and approved, and 2.  You don't get mailed about changes *you yourself* performed
[03:36] <lifeless> StevenK: actually you do
[03:36] <wgrant> Unless you are crazy and ask for them to not be sent.
[03:36] <lifeless> StevenK: unless you have a) a new account or b) have turned the option off
[03:37] <StevenK> Perhaps we want to drop the number from this notification.
[03:38] <wgrant> It's difficult.
[03:38] <StevenK> "** This bug has been marked a duplicate of private bug %d"
[03:38] <lifeless> StevenK: the bug number they cannot see ?
[03:38] <wgrant> Because the notifications are global.
[03:38] <wgrant> For branch links it was solved by not notifying about private linkages.
[03:38] <wgrant> But that can't be done hter.e
[03:38] <lifeless> StevenK: so basically, a) apport is broken, and b) until its fixed we're committed to supporting something insane.
[03:38] <lifeless> StevenK: there is an agreed upon fix for apport that pitti will, sometime, get to.
[03:38] <wgrant> That's what I said on the call this morning :)
[03:38] <wgrant> Anda  few months ago]
[03:39] <lifeless> StevenK: I think tackling this before that fix is just churn, and hard. But we could do the fix ourselves, its retracer side not on-cd-side
[03:39] <StevenK> I'd like to fix this "properly" and not give people links in mail that they can't actually follow.
[03:41] <wgrant> Impossible.
[03:41] <wgrant> Without rewriting the bug notification system.
[03:42] <StevenK> wgrant: Then why didn't you say so on the call this morning? :-)
[03:42] <wgrant> Huh?
[03:42] <wgrant> I said to kick apport.
[03:42] <wgrant> Maybe you discussed this during my fglrx crashes.
[03:43] <wgrant> I never heard discussion about changing notifications.
[03:44] <StevenK> Possibly
[03:44] <StevenK> I said that I'd like to do that on the call and Curtis said it sounded great to him.
[03:45] <StevenK> But that may have been the cold and flu meds talking. :-)
[03:55]  * StevenK ponders calling this new service 'audit system service' ... changing that into an acroymn as an exercise for the reader
[04:01] <timrc> sinzui, Can I be allowed here? https://launchpad.net/launchpad/+sharing :) pleease
[04:02] <StevenK> No, you can't be.
[04:02] <StevenK> Not yet.
[04:03] <StevenK> lifeless: O hai. Any thoughts on a witty name for this audit service? :-)
[04:04] <wgrant> StevenK: Any progress on the AP garbo job tests?
[04:04] <StevenK> wgrant: I'd like some help. You mentioned yesterday it might be transaction boundaries
[04:05] <wgrant> Break into it after garbo runs with pdb and see what's in the DB.
[04:06] <StevenK> I've done printf debugging pulling things from the store
[04:08] <lifeless> StevenK: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/auditor
[04:09] <StevenK> Not found
[04:09] <StevenK> :-P
[04:09] <wgrant> We do like stomping on the global namespace, don't we.
[04:09] <StevenK> Haha
[04:09] <StevenK> Well, like lifeless said, we would like others to use it
[04:10] <wgrant> Sure, but we're not the One True Auditor.
[04:10] <StevenK> my-first-auditor
[04:12] <StevenK> lp-audit-service?
[04:12] <wgrant> It's not LP
[04:13] <StevenK> I don't want to proclaim canonical- either
[04:13] <lifeless> auditord
[04:13] <lifeless> auditd
[04:13] <lifeless> also unused there
[04:13] <wgrant> First fix Python namespacing, then call it lazr.auditd
[04:13] <lifeless> there is an auditd in ubuntu
[04:13] <lifeless> wgrant: deprecated
[04:14] <wgrant> lifeless: Only because Python namespacing is the most awful thing in the world.
[04:14] <StevenK> And it doesn't touch zope
[04:14] <lifeless> wgrant: it is, and also it is awful
[04:14] <lifeless> mcollective-plugins-centralrpclog might be interesting to look at
[04:14] <wgrant> It's the most awful thing in the world, and it's also awful?
[04:14] <lifeless> yes
[04:15] <wgrant> Good good
[04:15] <lifeless> excatly
[04:15] <lifeless> you could call it scientologyd
[04:15] <StevenK> Right. Flights to Christchurch booked.
[04:15] <StevenK> Now lifeless will pay.
[04:16] <lifeless> when do you want the spare bed put up ?
[04:17] <StevenK> Plan is to kick you in the face for that last comment and then fly home. :-P
[04:17] <lifeless> well, it audits
[04:17] <lifeless> seriously, auditord IMNSHO is fine
[04:17] <StevenK> You said auditor first
[04:17] <lifeless> I did
[04:17] <lifeless> thats fine too
[04:18] <lifeless> but the namespace thing is true
[04:18] <lifeless> so auditord for the server, probably auditor-client for the client if you decide it needs one
[04:18] <lifeless> (I don't think it does)
[04:19] <StevenK> I was going to write a module under lp.services that translates a given object into a string represantation of its EID, but I don't think it needs a client, given we can just scream HTTP at it
[04:19] <lifeless> yup yup
 lifeless: Only because Python namespacing is the most awful thing in the world.
[04:24] <mwhudson> wgrant: have you written anything in common lisp?
[04:24] <lifeless> mwhudson: nothing common about it
[04:25] <StevenK> Perl namespacing is pretty good
[04:25] <wgrant> Python namespacing is fine, but packaging of it is a nightmare.
[04:33] <mwhudson> ah yes, no arguments there
[04:45] <StevenK> To be fair, it also omits one of SystemD's greatest strengths: Roman numeral-compliant project naming. System D is obviously way better than System V.
[04:45] <StevenK> -- Steve Langasek
[04:45]  * StevenK cackles
[04:52] <wgrant> StevenK: Distro quotes section of LWN?
[04:52] <StevenK> Yup
[04:55] <StevenK> wgrant: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/864582/
[04:58] <wgrant> StevenK: Diff?
[04:58] <StevenK> wgrant: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/864586/
[05:09] <StevenK> wgrant: Confused yet?
[05:10]  * wgrant tries.
[05:11] <StevenK> wgrant: I can push a branch if you wish
[05:22] <wgrant> StevenK: Sorry, actally looking now.
[05:22] <wgrant> Let's see.
[05:24] <StevenK> Hah
[05:39] <StevenK> wgrant: Did you get distracted again?
[05:44] <wgrant> The tests take about 10 years to run, so yeah.
[05:44] <wgrant> Easy to get distracted
[05:44] <StevenK> Haha
[05:56] <nigelb> Heh
[06:28] <wgrant> StevenK: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/864662/
[06:32] <StevenK> wgrant: It's just the where clause?
[06:33] <StevenK> Hm, it's a different query entirely
[06:37] <wgrant> StevenK: And I used itertools.product instead of the nested list comprehension.
[06:38] <wgrant> I'm not quite sure why the old one wasn't working, and the debug cycle is too slow, so I just rewrote it from scratch instead.
[06:42] <StevenK> Hmm, now I get SilentLaunchpadScriptFailure instead
[06:42] <StevenK> I HATE debugging garbo failures
[06:47] <wgrant> StevenK: make schema to check the security is right?
[06:56] <mabac> huwshimi, thanks for reviewing the workitems-widget branch! I'll switch so we have whiteboard first and then the work items text area. and I'll have a go at adding a edit mode message to the whiteboard
[06:56] <huwshimi> mabac: OK great!
[06:59] <mabac> huwshimi, do you (or anyone else :) have an example of something similar in lp? that is a message that looks or behaves like what you're after?
[06:59] <mabac> rats
[07:13] <StevenK> wgrant: Interdiff between yours and mine: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/864684/
[07:13] <StevenK> wgrant: But DistributionAddition gives SilentLaunchpadScriptFailure :-(
[08:56] <adeuring> good morning
[09:00] <mabac> I'm trying to find a way to show a message on blueprints when the whiteboard is being edited. I think I'm on to something using tal:condition in specification-index.pt. Does anyone know how I can detect the state of a TextAreaWidget?
[09:03] <mabac> If there's a standard way to do something like this, I'd be happy to learn about that instead. :)
[10:59] <czajkowski> salgado: ping
[10:59] <salgado> hi czajkowski
[11:00] <czajkowski> salgado: ready for G+
[11:00] <salgado> czajkowski, yep, will be there in a sec. do you have a URL for the hangout?
[11:01] <czajkowski> salgado: setting up now
[11:02] <mabac> salgado, quick question for you. :) how would you go about displaying a message when the whiteboard is being edited? it's for alerting the user to not put work items in it.
[11:03] <mabac> salgado, I've run into a dead end with tal conditionals in the template.
[11:10] <salgado> mabac, maybe that text widget thing has a way to specify some help text to be shown below it?
[11:10] <czajkowski> salgado: nice to meet you
[11:10] <salgado> czajkowski, nice to meet you too, and thanks for the help! :)
[11:10] <czajkowski> np
[11:11] <czajkowski> once mrevell has the post done I';ll post it to the loco contacts list, add it to my blog so it ends up on the loco radar and then onto jono
[11:11] <rick_h_> morning
[11:13] <mabac> salgado, didn't find anything like that. so I'm going for something simple and dynamic. I got a pointer to the js from danilos so I'll try that
[11:15] <czajkowski> rick_h_: g'day
[11:16] <danilos> mabac, btw, if the JS widget is capable of supporting something, do not hesitate to expose it in the lazrjs.py TextAreaEditorWidget either :)
[11:17] <mabac> danilos, ok let's see what I can find :)
[11:28] <salgado> mabac, ok, good look with that; notice that after you change anything in a .js file you'll need to run 'make jsbuild' to see them on the browser
[11:29] <mabac> salgado, ok thanks. I would have missed that
[11:29] <salgado> that's about everything I know about javascript in LP:  cover your eyes, make changes, run 'make jsbuild' and hope it will work
[11:30] <rick_h_> :) that'll be easier soon
[11:31] <mabac> :)
[11:32] <rick_h_> I've been hacking on tools for that, but a bit complicated to setup atm
[11:37] <mabac> salgado, I did this but hiding it when the whiteboard is not being edited got tricky: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/400334/whiteboardnotice.png
[11:44] <salgado> mabac, yeah, we'd need to have hooks with the widget to do that, I think.  I'm checking the docs of YUI's widget class to see if there's anything there that could be useful
[11:48] <rick_h_> what widget salgado ?
[11:49] <salgado> rick_h_, the base for InlineEdit: http://yuilibrary.com/yui/docs/widget/
[11:49] <rick_h_> ok, so widgets have a ton of events to watch for
[11:51] <rick_h_> looking you *might* be able to watch for the visibleChange attribute?
[11:51] <rick_h_> you're looking to fire something when you click edit right?
[11:52] <mabac> rick_h_, yup that'd be good enough
[11:53] <rick_h_> mabac: I'm just not 100% sure that the visible is following the editor part of the widget or not
[11:53] <mrevell> salgado, Is launchpad.dev the only place I can play with the work items box?
[11:55] <rick_h_> mrevell: yea, it's through testing/pqm, but don't think it's on qastaging yet
[11:55] <rick_h_> so salgado tests passed and such this morning it looks like
[11:55] <mrevell> cheers
[12:05] <salgado> mrevell, rick_h_, yes, only launchpad.dev for now.  mabac is trying to add a warning to let people know they should not enter work items on the whiteboard
[12:05] <mrevell> salgado, Is it not behind a feature flag?
[12:06] <salgado> mrevell, nope. do you think it's worth doing that?
[12:07] <mrevell> salgado, If it's going to end up on production before it's ready for use, then yes.
[12:08] <rick_h_> mrevell: sorry, that's my confusion
[12:08] <rick_h_> I landed a different branch for salgado yesterday
[12:08] <rick_h_> the work items is still in reivew/changes
[12:09] <mrevell> Sorry, I'm confused. So what's landing now?
[12:12] <salgado> mrevell, it will not land before it's ready
[12:13] <salgado> mrevell, the new UI is still under review
[12:13] <mrevell> Gret :)
[12:13] <StevenK> Can someone who isn't me log into carob and look at the pqm logs to see what the heck the buildbot-poller is doing?
[12:13] <mrevell> Or rather, great
[12:16] <rick_h_> StevenK: where do I look to see "what the heck the buildbot-poller is doing?
[12:16] <StevenK> rick_h_: /srv/pqm-logs or some such, there's a log for it
[12:16] <StevenK> You may need to sync logs
[12:18] <rick_h_> StevenK: how often does it poll?
[12:19] <rick_h_> StevenK: https://pastebin.canonical.com/61452/ is last bit from the buildbot log
[12:20] <StevenK> I was trying to *not* think about how crap buildbot and its poller is at 2320 on a Friday night. :-(
[12:21] <StevenK> rick_h_: Sync pqm logs
[12:21] <rick_h_> sorry, someone an expert on buildbot? /me's never used it before until LP so don't know what I'm looking for
[12:21] <StevenK> rick_h_: buildbot and buildbot-poller are distinct systems.
[12:21] <StevenK> And buildbot-poller was written by us.
[12:22] <rick_h_> so am I looking to sync the buildbot system or a different one?
[12:23] <rick_h_> StevenK: and am I supposed to be looking at something other than /srv/lp-pqm-logs/pqm_logs/buildout.log then for the poller logs?
[12:24] <StevenK> rick_h_: That log you pasted is the right one.
[12:24] <rick_h_> ok, requested buildbot sync, not seeing anything new yet
[12:24] <StevenK> It will use 'write' to tell you when the sync is completed
[12:24] <StevenK> IE, you'll notice.
[12:24] <rick_h_> ah ok
[12:29] <salgado> StevenK, does this have anything to do with the fact that devel has not been merged into stable yet?
[12:30] <StevenK> That's one of things the poller does, yes.
[12:37] <rick_h_> StevenK: so sync completed, nothing new in the log
[12:37] <salgado> StevenK, hmm, my changes were actually committed to ~launchpad-pqm/launchpad/stable before they were blessed by buildbot, it seems.  I see them committed ~8h ago
[12:37] <StevenK> No, that's because it merged your revision
[12:37] <salgado> oh, that's because we pull?
[12:37] <StevenK> I'm not sure what the poller does, but it's magical.
[12:37] <salgado> heh, ok
[12:38] <StevenK> It sends a message to PQM, and it does it.
[12:39] <salgado> what's the difference between staging and qastaging?
[12:40] <StevenK> staging runs off db-stable, and qastaging runs off stable
[12:40] <StevenK> Typical staging is used to test DB changes nowdays
[12:40] <StevenK> salgado: production-{devel,stable} from your time are long dead, we deploy to production from stable
[12:41] <rick_h_> Something seems to have kicked, qa bot updated tag/status for my change now
[12:41] <rick_h_> but log still seems same
[12:41] <StevenK> rick_h_: Can you kick that manager of yours to do his two items of QA?
[12:42] <rick_h_> StevenK: will do
[12:42] <salgado> StevenK, right, makes sense :)
[14:35] <deryck> adeuring, abentley, rick_h_ -- hey. firing up hangout.
[14:35] <adeuring> ok
[14:39] <abentley> deryck: I don't see you.
[14:39] <deryck> abentley, hey, are you trying?  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/extras/talk.google.com/orange-standup
[14:44] <czajkowski> sinzui: have you been spring cleaning the licience reviews?
[14:47] <sinzui> I review the all other/* licenses every Friday. I close projects, give canonical project licenses, send out license renewals
[14:48] <czajkowski> sinzui: ah ok, as I was waiting on one to change its status and wondered where it had gotten to .
[14:48] <sinzui> Today I gave out a license and mark a project approved since it changed their license to gpg affero
[14:48] <sinzui> oops
[14:48] <sinzui> sorry
[14:48] <czajkowski> nods that was the one I was wondering about
[14:48] <czajkowski> as you had a note on the whiteboard
[14:49] <sinzui> That note was from 2009 I think
[14:49] <sinzui> czajkowski, You reported a bug about the batching for all /projects...
[14:49] <czajkowski> sinzui: aye as it came via a RT and it does seem rather strange we'd display a negative figure tbh.
[14:50] <sinzui> ...only the pathological user with a historical interest will ever use it...
[14:50] <czajkowski> ok
[14:50] <sinzui> eg me because I read the license info of 5,000 projects when we decided all projects had to have a license
[14:51] <czajkowski> heh ok
[15:16] <abentley> adeuring: chat?
[15:24] <adeuring> abentley: sure. mumble?
[15:24] <abentley> adeuring: sure.
[15:31] <adeuring> abentley: still there?
[15:33] <mabac> rick_h_, salgado I changed the workitems-widget branch a little so it displays a message when editing the whiteboard. I suspect it might be considered somewhat hackish so if you guys would like to have another look, it'd be great. :) https://code.launchpad.net/~linaro-infrastructure/launchpad/workitems-widget/+merge/94790
[15:36] <salgado> mabac, on a call now, will check in a minute
[15:37] <mabac> salgado, thanks. going afk now. might be able to check in again later. maybe ping huw if he comes online to have a look too?
[15:37] <rick_h_> mabac: peeking
[15:38] <mabac> rick_h_, thanks. if it's to hideous, comment on the mp and I'll deal with it as soon as I can.
[15:41] <sinzui> amI online?
[15:42] <rick_h_> yes
[15:42] <sinzui> thanks
[15:44] <nigelb> sinzui: No :D
[15:46] <abentley> adeuring: Internet is back.  Shall we try again?
[15:46] <adeuring> abentley: sure
[15:50] <sinzui> nigelb, :)
[15:51] <nigelb> :D
[16:17] <mabac> rick_h_, salgado just wanted to check back in. is there a verdict? :)
[16:18] <rick_h_> mabac: not a huge fan of the hook at the moment. I'm going to propose an alternative. I need to get a checkout and play with it a little bit.
[16:18] <jelmer> abentley: btw, nice to see ec2 moved
[16:18] <jelmer> I was wondering if we should put lp-dev-utils in the launchpad PPA
[16:19] <salgado> mabac, I'll defer to rick_h_ on this one as I know close to nothing about YUI and LP's widgets
[16:19] <rick_h_> mabac: personally the editor needs to provide an event you can just listen for. It seems it doesn't right now, so I want to add it
[16:19] <mabac> rick_h_, thanks, that'd be great. any help is very welcome on this.
[16:20] <rick_h_> mabac: thanks for your patience
[16:20] <mabac> salgado, it's obvious from my patch that I have no clue. :)
[16:21] <mabac> rick_h_, no problem. I spent too much time to get that hack working so I'm happy you want to assist me. I'll pop out for the weekend then.
[16:21] <abentley> jelmer: I guess that gives it a better install story, but I think there's a bunch of packaging needed.
[16:44] <salgado> mrevell, you didn't forget that text for the help popup, did you? ;)
[16:44] <mrevell> I did not salgado :)
[16:44] <salgado> mrevell, if we could get it by Monday it'd be great; no need to hurry too much
[16:44] <mrevell> I started later on it that I'd have liked but it's under way.
[16:44] <mrevell> No prob
[16:45] <salgado> mrevell, great, thanks!
[17:13] <salgado> hmm. I've got a job on the garbo hourly script and it doesn't seem to be running enough iterations of it for the whole work to be done
[17:13] <salgado> my job runs for only a couple minutes
[17:14] <salgado> is there a limit on the time or number of iterations that I'm not seeing?
[17:18] <salgado> lifeless, around?
[17:32] <salgado> anybody up for a quick review? https://code.launchpad.net/~salgado/launchpad/workitem-migration-allow-inactive-milestones/+merge/95624
[17:56] <sinzui> salgado, what happens the work items when I make their active milestone deactivated (untargetable)
[17:57] <salgado> sinzui, there should be no milestones to which a WI cannot be targeted
[17:58] <salgado> that's what I'm changing, so that they can be targeted to inactive milestones
[17:58]  * sinzui looks again
[17:58] <sinzui> ah
[17:58] <salgado> sinzui, the UI/DB allows that (I confirmed a few minutes ago); it's just the migrator script that was broken
[17:59] <sinzui> Right. Lp UI often does not permit it, but the API will let you do it
[18:00] <sinzui> salgado, r=me
[18:00] <salgado> sinzui, also, I'm thinking of moving the migrator script from garbo-hourly to garbo-frequent as it takes a couple minutes on the first 2 or 3 runs and then will run much faster than that.  does that sound ok to you?
[18:01] <sinzui> yes
[18:01] <salgado> sinzui, do you mind if I sneak that change in this same branch?
[18:01] <sinzui> no
[18:02] <salgado> sinzui, great, if you could have another look there  ;)
[18:03] <salgado> come on, LP, update my diff
[18:04] <sinzui> still looks okay
[18:04] <sinzui> I'll just add a comment to the review
[18:05] <salgado> sinzui, great! can you land it for me as well?
[18:05] <sinzui> yes
[18:05] <salgado> sinzui, superb, thanks a bunch!
[18:17] <rick_h_> salgado-lunch: ping when you get back
[18:59] <lifeless> salgado-lunch: hi
[19:22] <salgado> rick_h_, hi
[19:22] <rick_h_> salgado: howdy, so I replied to mabac's MP
[19:22] <rick_h_> salgado: I just wanted ot make sure it made sense, and since it seems we're off on TZ, wasn't sure if I should ping/update you on it to help with him
[19:26] <salgado> rick_h_, I agree with you that it's probably better to do it in specification-index.pt instead of trying to generalize it at this point
[19:27] <rick_h_> salgado: ok cool. Sorry to make trouble/more work
[19:27] <rick_h_> salgado: totally not against adding a generate notification to the editor, but want ot be more thorough on it as a longer term thing
[19:28] <salgado> rick_h_, I completely understand that :)
[19:29] <rick_h_> cool, so hopefully that diff helps makes the fix simple, that's working and tested from his branch
[19:29] <rick_h_> just have to undo the other stuff
[19:31] <salgado> rick_h_, you're giving us code that's simple and documented; it's a huge help!
[19:31] <salgado> I'm sure mabac will be thankful, and so am I :)
[19:59] <jcsackett> abentley (or anyone): you know that thing where lp-propose stops using the template from lpreview body? how does one go about fixing that? :-P
[20:00] <abentley> jcsackett: first, run "bzr plugins -v" to ensure lpreview body is installed, and running from where you expect.
[20:02] <jcsackett> abentley: confirmed; it's installed and running from my .bazaar/plugins
[20:03] <abentley> jcsackett: now try running lp-propose and see if the target branch matches "lp:(~launchpad-pqm/)?launchpad(/(db-)?devel)?"
[20:04] <jcsackett> target is lp:launchpad
[20:04] <jcsackett> hrm. that's the same branch, but not a mach for that format.
[20:05] <jcsackett> oh, wait, i may have misread that regex. i think that is a match.
[20:06] <abentley> jcsackett: Hrm.  I think the displayed target branch is not what it checks against.
[20:08] <jcsackett> abentley: ah.
[20:10] <abentley> jcsackett: So the submit branch's public URL should match 'bzr\+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~launchpad-pqm/launchpad/(db-)?devel'
[20:10] <jcsackett> abentley: ok.
[20:10] <jcsackett> abentley: as in the setting in locations.conf?
[20:11] <abentley> jcsackett: Yes, though bzr info will tell you what bzr thinks the setting is.
[20:14] <jcsackett> abentley: ok, the submit branch had gotten borked when i mucked with my locations the other day. stuff works now.
[20:14] <jcsackett> thanks!
[20:14] <abentley> jcsackett: np
[21:18] <sinzui> jcsackett, r=me


[12:22] <dolson> raphink: ping
[12:22] <raphink> dolson: pong
[12:22] <dolson> raphink: wrt meterbridge, I just uploaded a patched .desktop file... I have to make all those other changes too?
[12:23] <raphink> dolson: I'm not the one who made the comments, I just published them. Ask the reviewer :)
[12:23] <raphink> ;)
[12:24] <raphink> dolson: in this case, freeflying is the reviewer
[12:25] <freeflying-ibook> raphink: which one ?
[12:25] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: meterbridge, you commented on this one
[12:25] <dolson> I thought we wanted to keep deltas as small as possible
[12:26] <raphink> dolson: if this is a sync/merge, then the policy is to keep the delta as small as possible, yes
[12:26] <raphink> all changes will have to be maintained, so the policy is to have as few as possible
[12:27] <dolson> raphink: it's just adding a .desktop file
[12:27] <freeflying-ibook> dolson: no changes in your copyright file
[12:27] <dolson> to a debian pkg
[12:28] <raphink> dolson: however this seems to only be a fix, so I'd say go no further than fixing if nothing else is required
[12:28] <raphink> dolson: and send the patch upstream (to Debian) if it's useful to them, so we don't have to maintain this diff
[12:28] <dolson> raphink: exactly what I thought I was supposed to do, but freeflying-ibook says otherwise...
[12:28] <raphink> dolson: well freeflying-ibook can make mistakes :)
[12:28] <raphink> wel all do
[12:29] <dolson> we all can, I just want to get the fixes into dapper and so if I have to make the changes he says, then I will
[12:29] <raphink> ok
[12:29] <raphink> I'll upload your package :)
[12:29] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: please check the status of the package before commenting next time
[12:29] <freeflying-ibook> dolson: after all , your package shall match the debian's policy imo
[12:29] <dolson> I've been asked to work on debian directly now, so I will send them any diffs like this
[12:29] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: if the package is a sync/merge or a fix, the requirements are not the same as for a new package
[12:29] <dolson> freeflying-ibook: this IS from debian
[12:30] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: right, except that keeping the diff as small as possible is important, cause our manpower doesn't allow us to maintain this
[12:30] <freeflying-ibook> raphink: but it dosen't meet with debian's policy
[12:30] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: I know many Debian packages don't meet Debian's policy
[12:30] <raphink> this is a shame
[12:30] <raphink> but unless this package gets into main
[12:30] <raphink> we're not to add too much diff to it
[12:31] <raphink> this is sad, but that's it
[12:31] <raphink> unless you're ready to maintain this package
[12:31] <raphink> and apply this patch to all versions synced from Debian
[12:31] <raphink> manually
[12:31] <freeflying-ibook> raphink: so we shall have as little changes as we can when we do sync or merge
[12:31] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: exactly
[12:32] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: try to imagine if we have one small change like this on each universe package
[12:32] <raphink> there are about 16000 universe packages
[12:32] <freeflying-ibook> raphink: then how can these packagee upload to debian ?
[12:32] <raphink> so that's 16000 diffs to maintain and apply for each package synced from Debian
[12:32] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: Debian doesn't have a REVU system like us
[12:32] <ajmitch_> lots of fun for all
[12:32] <raphink> only one DD is required to upload
[12:32] <raphink> so sometimes very bad packages get into Debian
[12:33] <raphink> and so far we have to deal with it
[12:33] <freeflying-ibook> raphink: that's unfair
[12:33] <raphink> cause we can't do anything in Universe without Debian as upstream
[12:33] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: it is
[12:33] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: you're free to go help in Debian and improve the packaging quality
[12:33] <raphink> if you feel like it ;)
[12:33] <freeflying-ibook> I found some package is more bad than mine , but they can be upload
[12:33] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: try and get your packages uploaded to Debian, then come again ;)
[12:34] <dolson> haha, yeah
[12:34] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: it is sad but it is hard to get a DD to upload your work, although there are DDs that upload just very bad packages sometimes
[12:34] <freeflying-ibook> raphink: I just tell a truth
[12:34] <tseng> ajmitch_: does debian have new beagle yet?
[12:34] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: I know and I agree
[12:34] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: now there are about 1000 DDs in Debian and you won't change that some upload horrible stuff
[12:34] <ajmitch_> tseng: I haven't been watching
[12:35] <raphink> freeflying-ibook: you won't change either that we're very far from being 1000 MOTUs and can't maitain what Debian maintains
[12:35] <ajmitch_> raphink: I didn't find it hard to get DDs to upload for me
[12:35] <raphink> ajmitch_: :
[12:35] <raphink> cheater :p
[12:35] <raphink> hehe
[12:35] <ajmitch_> how so?
[12:35] <dolson> I was asked by a DD to upload my packages :D
[12:36] <raphink> well you're a DD yourself
[12:36] <raphink> dolson: great :)
[12:36] <ajmitch_> I meant when I wasn't a DD
[12:36] <ajmitch_> obviously
[12:36] <raphink> ajmitch_: ah ok ;)
[12:36] <raphink> ajmitch_: well I don't search too much, too I guess
[12:36] <ajmitch_> which is why I stated it in the past tense
[12:36] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: but after I sent out RFS, their is no reply at all , and my package have been reviewed times on REVU at all
[12:36] <ajmitch_> freeflying-ibook: I just got people I knew on irc, or my AM
[12:37] <ajmitch_> now I just sponsor uploads for others, when I have time
[12:37] <siretart> ah, ajmitch is offering to sponsor debian uploads for motus? *G* (j/k)
[12:37] <siretart> ah
[12:37] <raphink> dolson: I'd like a better desktop file if you have to add one
[12:37] <siretart> ok. anyway, hi ajmitch_
[12:37] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: so would you mind review my package :)
[12:37] <raphink> dolson: give it a real GenericName and Comment please
[12:38] <ajmitch_> freeflying-ibook: see the part about having time
[12:38] <ajmitch_> hey siretart
[12:38] <dolson> raphink: ok. I didn't create it, persia did... but I'll fix it
[12:38] <raphink> thanks
[12:38] <ajmitch_> so submit your debian sponsorship requests & I'll add them to my list ;)
[12:38] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: then I mail you my package on mentors ?
[12:39] <siretart> ajmitch_: must have been a hard time for you
[12:39] <ajmitch_> siretart: which?
[12:39] <siretart> ajmitch_: having to stay in .au for such long time ;)
[12:39] <ajmitch_> yeah
[12:39] <ajmitch_> too many australians ;)
[12:39] <siretart> :)
[12:39] <ajmitch_> siretart: how's your NM process going? got an AM yet?
[12:41] <ajmitch_> freeflying-ibook: I don't mind how you do it, I'd just need packages & you willing to fix any mistakes :)
[12:41] <siretart> ajmitch_: nah, in the meantime, I have a dozen package under my fingers, but I'm still waiting for FD to assign me an AM :(
[12:41] <siretart> ajmitch_: you don't know a way to speed this up, do you? ;)
[12:41] <ajmitch_> no I don't, sorry
[12:41] <ajmitch_> and I was told that volunteering as an AM wouldn't help much either
[12:42] <siretart> this weekend, I was told having birthday could help
[12:42] <ajmitch_> hehe
[12:42] <ajmitch_> what birthday is it?
[12:42] <siretart> well, of the applicant, I assume
[12:42] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: recently , I have about 3-4 package RFS
[12:42] <ajmitch_> so you're not having a birthday soon? :)
[12:43] <siretart> no, I have in august
[12:43] <ajmitch_> freeflying-ibook: ok, but I don't regularly read the -mentors list
[12:43] <siretart> and looking at the queue and its progress, this seems to be a realistic date for my AM assignment *sigh*
[12:44] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: then I poke you here ? or mail you ?
[12:44] <ajmitch_> mail me
[12:44] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: would you mind msg your mail address ?
[12:44] <ajmitch_> freeflying-ibook<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[12:45] <ajmitch_> it's public enough anyway
[12:45] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: got it .thx
[12:45] <ajmitch_> put something in the subject so I don't miss it :)
[12:45] <freeflying-ibook> ajmitch_: sure , hehe
[01:06] <netzmeister> hm
[01:07] <netzmeister> Copying source file
[01:07] <netzmeister>     -> copying [codeblocks_1.0+svn2160-0ubuntu1_source.changes]
[01:07] <netzmeister>     -> copying [./devel]
[01:07] <netzmeister> cp: cannot stat `./devel': No such file or directory
[01:07] <netzmeister> pbuilder build .........
[01:07] <netzmeister> why think pbuilder that "devel" is a directory??
[01:07] <netzmeister> "devel" is the Section Value in the control file..
[01:08] <siretart> netzmeister: use pbuilder on a .dsc, not a .changes file
[01:08] <netzmeister> uhhh
[01:08] <netzmeister> omg thx siretart
[01:12] <ajmitch_> siretart: so what have you been up to lately? I've seen you active in main & getting into development :)
[01:14] <netzmeister> siretart:  it's one oclock.. time to sleep ;-)
[01:14] <ajmitch_> netzmeister: but that's early
[01:15] <netzmeister> ajmitch_:  one o'clock at night..
[01:15] <ajmitch_> yeah
[01:15] <ajmitch_> if the suns' not about to rise, it's not time for sleep
[01:17] <netzmeister> ajmitch_:  hmm, but when you must go to work at nine o'clock it's better if you go to bed at night.. ;-)
[01:19] <ajmitch_> sure
[01:19] <siretart> ajmitch_: oh, I'm currently busy learning for my last exam for university. in debian, I've been working on wpasupplicant and libopenal/freealut, and in ubuntu I'm reviewing UVF requests and fixing bugs here and there
[01:20] <ajmitch_> siretart: ah yes, you're in the UVF team :)
[01:20] <siretart> currently I wanted to upload the latest wine release but gcc hates me: it just ICEes :/
[01:20] <ajmitch_> that's nasty
[01:20] <ajmitch_> how's the new UVF scheme working out?
[01:21] <ajmitch_> nearly all bugfixes this time
[01:22] <siretart> ajmitch_: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html documents the current workflow
[01:22] <ajmitch_> yeah I made the first request, remember :)
[01:22] <siretart> argl, sure
[01:23] <siretart> looking at https://launchpad.net/people/motu-uvf/+assignedbugs I'd say it works better than the solution we had before
[01:25] <siretart> ah, upload finished finally
[01:25] <ajmitch_> yeah, no more waiting for a week
[01:25] <ajmitch_> they are painful
[01:25] <ajmitch_> nice & fast
[01:25] <ajmitch_> I had to scp the files there though :)
[01:29] <siretart> anyway, need to get some sleep
[01:29] <siretart> gn8 folks!
[01:29] <ajmitch_> night siretart
[01:29] <ajmitch_> sleep well
[01:29] <siretart> thanks
[01:30] <netzmeister> n8 siretart
[01:39] <raphink> gn siretart
[02:20] <crimsun> wow. so ipw2200 1.1.1 is a complete no-go on this X41-2527.
[02:20] <crimsun> new ieee80211+ipw2200 == hard freeze on boot
[02:22] <ajmitch_> crimsun: really? that's surprising
[02:22] <crimsun> quite
[03:11] <ajmitch_> aha, question on ubuntu-devel about those acer laptops & alsa :)
[03:12] <ajmitch_> sounds like a job for crimsun
[03:15] <crimsun> oh boy :)
[03:15] <crimsun> I haven't even checked mail in the past couple hours, been fighting with ipw2200
[03:17] <ajmitch_> just a request in include the ALC260 patches
[03:17] <crimsun> yep, it's queued
[03:17] <crimsun> got a thinkpad jack sense fix, some hda-intel alc* updates
[03:20] <ajmitch_> very nice
[04:25] <LaserJock> dolson: ping?
[04:25] <dolson> LaserJock: hey
[04:25] <LaserJock> dolson: looks like the meterbridge diff didn't get any smaller
[04:26] <dolson> LaserJock: well I don't know what I'm supposed to do... I didn't change anything but the rules & changelog files and added the .desktop file
[04:26] <dolson> I even deleted the source tree and started from scratch
[04:26] <LaserJock> right, it is all in the autotools stuff
[04:27] <LaserJock> when you run debuild or whatever that stuff get created, I think
[04:27] <LaserJock> you might try using filterdiff
[04:29] <dolson> I guess I have a lot to learn.
[04:29] <LaserJock> your doing good, I just lurk around in here and pick up some times now and then ;-)
[04:29] <LaserJock> s/times/tips/
[04:30] <dolson> I never even heard of filterdiff before
[04:34] <LaserJock> dolson: I actually picked that filterdiff tip up from crimsun
[04:34] <LaserJock> I haven't used it yet but I wrote it down so I could put it in the Ubuntu Packaging Guide
[04:35] <LaserJock> ajmitch_: get flamed?
[04:35] <ajmitch_> it's great fun being told I obviously don't know what I'm talking about
[04:35] <dolson> you should put it in the packaging guide so I can read it
[04:35] <dolson> ajmitch_: link? :)
[04:36] <LaserJock> ajmitch_: I'm glad I'm not the only one that doesn't know what they are talking about
[04:37] <ajmitch_> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=141718
[04:38] <ajmitch_> just replying to it now, trying to be nice :)
[04:39] <LaserJock> ah, that isn't even very bad
[04:41] <LaserJock> I got flamed for daring to describe the Ubuntu release process to people who were ranting why dapper wasn't more stable than breezy and sid when the dapper repos opened
[04:41] <ajmitch_> no, it's not bad, but annoying
[04:43] <LaserJock> ajmitch_: yeah, I started my Ubuntu experience in the forums because I was used to the Gentoo forums. Now I can't even hardly bare to go there. I just get so mad.
[04:44] <ajmitch_> LaserJock: it's only useful for me to get bugreports that people don't bother to file in malone
[04:48] <ajmitch_> I really shouldn't post to the forums
[04:49] <dolson> is it hard to get a UVF exception?
[04:50] <LaserJock> seems quite easy to me, much easier than I thought in fact
[04:50] <dolson> I should file for a couple
[04:50] <LaserJock> although it might be harder now that we are almost at UI Freeze
[04:51] <ajmitch_> I don't think UI freeze applies too much to universe
[04:52] <LaserJock> man vnc is a mess
[04:52] <LaserJock> I sure wish I could figure it out
[04:52] <ajmitch_> but file a request anyway
[04:52] <LaserJock> yeah, it certainly doesn't hurt to try
[04:55] <crimsun_> well, we're definitely at the point where we need to shoehorn stability over new features
[04:56] <LaserJock> hmm, like a working vnc server :/
[04:56] <ajmitch_> crimsun_: yes, and that's mainly why we want UVF exceptions
[04:56] <crimsun_> if an uvf exception fixes that, I'm all for it
[05:53] <LaserJock> any tetex guru's about?
[05:55] <crimsun_> 2 out of 3 hunks FAILED
[05:55] <crimsun_> this is going to be a looong night
[05:57] <ajmitch_> crimsun_: much pain with patches?
[06:00] <ajmitch_> backwards..
[06:00] <LaserJock> lol
[06:00] <ajmitch_> it's rather depressing
[06:00] <ajmitch_> since this has to be done by tomorrow
[06:00] <ajmitch_> at this rate there's not a hope
[06:01] <LaserJock> I just noticed that we have tetex-bin and tetex-base 3.0 but tetex-src 2.0.2 because Debian updated it on Jan. 31st
[06:02] <ajmitch_> wonderful
[06:02] <LaserJock> so should I do a an UVF request?
[06:03] <ajmitch_> if you feel it's warranted
[06:05] <LaserJock> they thing is I don't know it enough but the description says says that it is useful for developers but not users necessarily
[06:05] <ajmitch_> right
[06:05] <ajmitch_> the UVF team will decide
[06:05] <LaserJock> however, if we have the wrong version of the source...
[06:05] <LaserJock> ok, I'll try to write something up
[06:09] <LaserJock> hi Gloubiboulga
[06:10] <Gloubiboulga> hey LaserJock
[06:10] <ajmitch_> hello Gloubiboulga, highvoltage
[06:11] <highvoltage> hi ajmitch_
[06:11] <Gloubiboulga> hi ajmitch_
[06:21] <minghua> LaserJock: well, an old tetex-src should hurt nobody, in my opinion
[06:21] <LaserJock> minghua: think so, what would it be used for?
[06:22] <minghua> LaserJock: that's just some extra stuff to satisfy lincense of some files in tetex distribution
[06:22] <LaserJock> ah, makes sense
[06:22] <minghua> LaserJock: imagine like a piece of software written in C, but with a license saying "you must ship the original C file with the compiled binary"
[06:23] <minghua> LaserJock: and this tetex-src is the "C source file" part, which no user will need
[06:23] <minghua> LaserJock: it won't hurt to sync it, of course, but I wouldn't put my time into it
[06:23] <LaserJock> ok
[06:23] <minghua> looking at the log, maybe LaserJock already wrote the mail?
[06:24] <LaserJock> ?
[06:25] <minghua> LaserJock: I mean "<LaserJock> ok, I'll try to write something up", which is 20 minutes ago
[06:26] <LaserJock> oh, I haven't yet, I was working on diffstats, changelogs, etc
[06:26] <Amaranth> if that's the case we _have_ to have the new version
[06:26] <LaserJock> I'm still trying to download the source package ;-)
[06:26] <Amaranth> otherwise we're in violation of the license
[06:28] <LaserJock> think so?
[06:33] <minghua> Hmm, Amaranth is right, but do we have tetex-src in main?
[06:33] <LaserJock> no Universe
[06:34] <minghua> I really don't know how this is supposed to work, it's not as if we don't provide source pacakges
[06:34] <minghua> maybe asking<EMAIL_ADDRESS>list is a good idea...
[06:35] <LaserJock> perhaps
[06:45] <LaserJock> jeeze, the change in orig.tar.gz is 33MB :(
[06:45] <minghua> LaserJock: I remember tetex 3 is a rewrite, so that won't surprise me
[06:46] <LaserJock> it is more than double the current
[06:47] <LaserJock> but it doesn't apper that the packaging has changed at all
[06:49] <LaserJock> hmm, maybe not. the changelog says that they added a new package latex-source2e-doc that has pdf version of the latex documentation
[06:58] <minghua> bash doesn't have <= comparison for strings?  this is annoying
[07:09] <G0SUB> dolson
[07:28] <crimsun_> yay, patch 1 of zillions done
[07:29] <ajmitch_> crimsun_: good work
[08:26] <Gloubiboulga> could somebody tell me what exactly means 'fix commited' and 'fix released' on LP
[08:26] <ajmitch_> fix released means it's in the archive
[08:26] <ajmitch_> fix committed generally means it's ready for uploa
[08:26] <ajmitch_> upload
[08:26] <Gloubiboulga> ok, thanks ajmitch_
[08:28] <freeflying> looking for review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2127
[08:34] <ajmitch_> freeflying: really, you should have cleaned it up a fair bit before asking for review - debian/rules is full of commented out & unneeded cruft
[08:34] <freeflying> ajmitch_:  :) , thx
[08:37] <ajmitch_> & did you mention that docs are under the GFDL?
[08:37] <ajmitch_> http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/quarry-0603090220/quarry-0.1.17/README has a lot more info than debian/copyright does
[08:39] <minghua> ajmitch_: how did you vote to the GFDL GR (assuming you want to say, but I think it's public vote anyway)
[09:07] <freeflying> ajmitch_: then I'd put all of the author's in README to th debian/copyright ?
[09:40] <ajmitch_> siretart: selinux is no kernel patch - it's been in the kernel for a long time now :)
[09:43] <siretart> ajmitch_: oh, interesting
[09:43] <siretart> morning, btw ;)
[09:45] <ajmitch_> hi :)
[09:45] <ajmitch_> how are you?
[09:45] <siretart> still a bit dizzy, but I'm fine
[09:46] <siretart> should really get to learning, but software engineering is so boring :(
[09:46] <ajmitch_> yeah..
[09:50] <dholbach> poor siretart - good luck with that!
[09:51] <siretart> its just 2 weeks, but them I promise to focus on revu2
[09:51] <siretart> sometimes life just sucks
[09:51] <ajmitch_> siretart: I'm back at uni on monday (I hope!)
[09:52] <siretart> dholbach: is wiesbaden now official?  :-D
[09:54] <ogra> lol
[09:54] <ajmitch_> dholbach: I imagine the desktop team is overloaded with work, is there somewhere we can jump in & help?
[09:54] <dholbach> ajmitch_: bug triage
[09:54] <dholbach> ajmitch_: bug triage
[09:54] <dholbach> ajmitch_: bug triage
[09:54] <dholbach> *whine*
[09:54] <ajmitch_> aha
[09:55] <ajmitch_> the long, boring part of your job :)
[09:55] <siretart> ogra: I was quite surprised and a bit confused about that news entry. are there similar announcements elsewhere?
[09:55] <dholbach> siretart: I think not, it's the first I read
[09:55] <ajmitch_> when is linuxtag?
[09:55] <ogra> siretart, nope, i dont think so
[09:56] <siretart> interesting.
[09:57] <siretart> ajmitch_: linuxtag is from 3.may to 6. may
[09:58] <ajmitch_> ok
[09:58] <ajmitch_> so maybe around the time of the next ubuntu conf :)
[10:02] <Tonio_> hello
[11:59] <netzmeister> re
[12:04] <Hobbsee> ajmitch_: you around?
[12:04] <Hobbsee> you handled the person on the forums very delicately lol
[12:05] <ajmitch_> yes
[12:05] <ajmitch_> delicate? like with a hammer?
[12:05] <Hobbsee> haha
[12:05] <Hobbsee> particularly as the orig poster obviously doesnt realise that you're a dev yourself hehe...
[12:05] <ajmitch_> sure
[12:06] <ajmitch_> but I'm not going to advertise I'm a wannabe developer :)
[12:06] <Hobbsee> hehe
[12:06] <Hobbsee> good point
[12:06] <ajmitch_> my main contributions to the forums are telling people to FILE BUGS! ;)
[12:07] <Hobbsee> hehe!
[12:07] <Hobbsee> yeah
[12:07] <Hobbsee> hey StevenK
[12:07] <ajmitch_> and as a developer I should never be blasting someone across the room :)
[12:07] <ajmitch_> evening StevenK
[12:07] <Hobbsee> hehe
[12:07] <Mithrandir> ajmitch_: unless you're playing ET, UT or quake, that is.
[12:07] <ajmitch_> true
[12:08] <ajmitch_> then it's certainly warranted
[12:08] <Mithrandir> almost encouraged.
[12:08] <StevenK> Mmmmmmmmmm, UT
[12:08] <Mithrandir> :-)
[12:08] <ajmitch_> neither have I
[12:10] <ajmitch_> yay, flight back to NZ is booked
[12:11] <StevenK> ajmitch_: You're finally done in Brissy?
[12:11] <ajmitch_> StevenK: almost
[12:12] <ajmitch_> sadly I won't get down to sydney to visit all the ubuntu fans down there ;)
[12:12] <Hobbsee> then you can go back to NZ and freeze
[12:12] <StevenK> Blah
[12:13] <StevenK> Look ajmitch_, you've got a fangirl
[12:13] <ajmitch_> not likely
[12:13] <StevenK> I'd fangirl you, but my wife would object.
[12:14] <Hobbsee> if you were here in person, you'd have a very sore arm right about now...
[12:15] <tseng> you know ajmitch_ isnt really that nice a guy in person
[12:15] <tseng> http://flickr.com/photos/whiprush/13477862/
[12:15] <ajmitch_> tseng knows
[12:15] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Which one? :-P
[12:15] <ajmitch_> that was in sydney, too
[12:15] <tseng> indeed.
[12:16] <Hobbsee> i was actually meaning in reference to you, StevenK :P
[12:16] <Hobbsee> haha
[12:16] <StevenK> Hobbsee: I know, I was refering to which arm. :-)
[12:17] <ajmitch_> ah sweet memories..
[12:17] <StevenK> "[22:16]  < Hobbsee> if you were here in person, you'd have a very sore arm right about now..."
[12:17] <tseng> i upgraded a dev sever to dapper yesterday
[12:17] <tseng> to make sure all my software still runs smoothly (or fix it)
[12:17] <tseng> not a bad showing so far
[12:18] <Hobbsee> StevenK: yes, but does it matter which arm was now sore?  presumably the one i was closer to, to hit you with
[12:18] <tseng> some manual futzing with mysql-server-5.0 and rrdtool-tcl
[12:18] <ajmitch_> dapper seems to be shaping up
[12:18] <StevenK> Hobbsee: You'd hit me with my own arm?
[12:19] <StevenK> Hopefully, I can bait Hobbsee into running her and getting me in person ...
[12:19] <Hobbsee> i knew that didnt make sense when i hit enter!
[12:19] <tseng> thats the same time i went back to bzr
[12:19] <Hobbsee> you could try
[12:19] <StevenK> Could be fun
[12:19] <ajmitch_> depends where in sydney you are
[12:19] <StevenK> Not that far from her, actually
[12:19] <StevenK> I could drive there in 25 minutes
[12:20] <Hobbsee> i warn you, just dont come to my house...
[12:20] <StevenK> Awwww, why not?
[12:20] <Hobbsee> meet me at uni, fine, but not at my house
[12:20] <Hobbsee> those weird people called my parents, you know
[12:20] <ajmitch_> heh
[12:20] <StevenK> Oh, I solved that problem.
[12:20] <Mithrandir> that's ok, SK's weird too. ;-)
[12:20] <StevenK> I moved out
[12:21] <StevenK> Mithrandir: You are shorter than me, you'd need a step-ladder
[12:21] <Mithrandir> StevenK: I could jump
[12:22] <StevenK> Heh
[12:22] <Mithrandir> or climb you, or kick you in the knees.  The last option would be mean, though
[12:22] <StevenK> Hobbsee: You want to skip the awkward, "So, who was that guy?"  blah blah blah
[12:23] <ajmitch_> heh
[12:23] <Hobbsee> haha - they think i'm nuts anyway, for working on open source stuff
[12:23] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Tell them it's a secret sect.
[12:24] <tseng> or tell them you meet him at uni
[12:24] <ajmitch_> sure, my parents thought I was at least a little nuts for flying over to sydney & then to montreal
[12:24] <Hobbsee> hehe
[12:24] <tseng> done and done
[12:24] <StevenK> ajmitch_: My mother begged me not to go to Finland
[12:24] <Mithrandir> I guess I'm weird whose parents think that's perfectly reasonable.
[12:24] <ajmitch_> StevenK: the way some users carry on, you wouldn't be far off from thinking it's a religion
[12:25] <ajmitch_> Mithrandir: sure, my parents didn't think it was unreasonable, just a little surprising
[12:25] <tseng> yeah my parents think the trips are cool
[12:25] <ajmitch_> they're perfectly happy for me to travel the world
[12:25] <tseng> always ask me where I am going next
[12:25] <Hobbsee> haha - again?
[12:26] <Mithrandir> ajmitch_: it'd kinda suck if you suddenly ended up in .ch without a ticket, wouldn't it? :-)
[12:26] <ajmitch_> 5th trip in just over a year to .au
[12:26] <ajmitch_> Mithrandir: a little
[12:26] <ajmitch_> though I've got friends in .ch :)
[12:27] <ajmitch_> oh dear
[12:27] <ajmitch_> just saw the latest wiki edit for the scim page
[12:28] <ajmitch_> some of the suggestions on the wiki & the forums are almost guaranteed to break someone's box
[12:30] <minghua> ajmitch_: which wiki page?
[12:31] <ajmitch_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SCIM
[12:31] <ajmitch_> when people are installed openoffice from rpms converted by alien
[12:32] <ajmitch_> there are a lot of these sort of pages around
[12:33] <minghua> and now scim is going to be shipped in ubuntu-desktop by default
[12:34] <ajmitch_> yep
[12:34] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Was that again directed at me?
[12:34] <minghua> glad we have 1.4.4 now, at least
[12:34] <ajmitch_> the worst part is handling those bugreports, and finding out a few days into debugging that they broke their system with this stuff
[12:35] <ajmitch_> tseng can tell you of his experiences with that..
[12:35] <minghua> by the way does ubuntu has a usability team?
[12:35] <ogra> someone should fix reportbug finally ...
[12:35] <Hobbsee> StevenK: ah, yeah, dont worry - brain is quickly dying tonight
[12:35] <Hobbsee> been fighting with my wireless, and doing a 4 hour chem prac
[12:35] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Like last night? :-)
[12:35] <ogra> so you get package versions and lists at least
[12:35] <Hobbsee> yeah
[12:36] <ajmitch_> time for me to go offline for the night, see you tomorrow
[12:36] <ogra> night ajmitch_
[12:36] <ogra> minghua, write a nicer one for dapper+1 :)
[12:36] <minghua> ajmitch_: bye
[12:36] <highvoltage> night ajmitch_
[12:36] <Hobbsee> night ajmitch_
[12:36] <StevenK> If anyone can tell me how to use FormatMessage() from the Win32 API, that'd be great. ;-)
[12:36] <StevenK> Night ajmitch_
[12:36] <minghua> ogra: hey, I don't know programming, especially not c++
[12:37] <ogra> i bet you could do it in python instead of c++ ...
[12:37] <ogra> :)
[12:38] <ogra> :))
[12:38] <minghua> ogra: does writing a python GUI program based on a C++ library mean writing a binding for the library first?
[12:38] <highvoltage> ogra: is martin schulze also involved with ubuntu in any way?
[12:39] <ogra> i never did such a thing ... i just write the stuff in python ....
[12:39] <tseng> highvoltage: not that ive ever heard of
[12:39] <ogra> highvoltage, not directly, no
[12:39] <highvoltage> ok.
[12:39] <ogra> he's a debian celebrity
[12:39] <highvoltage> perhaps more like was. he posted a big hissy fit (and it seems justified) to debian-devel-announce. seems like he's left.
[12:40] <ogra> url ?
[12:40] <highvoltage> just sec...
[12:40] <tseng> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/
[12:40] <ogra> tseng, haha :P
[12:41] <highvoltage> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/03/msg00008.html
[12:41] <ogra> highvoltage, thanks
[12:42] <StevenK> He hasn't left.
[12:42] <StevenK> He is giving up on being SRM
[12:42] <highvoltage> ah, ok.
[12:42] <StevenK> (That's how I read it, anyway)
[12:43] <tseng> thats how i read it, also
[12:43] <ogra> yup
[12:43] <tseng> it was fairly specific.
[12:44] <highvoltage> minghua: no, there wasn
[12:44] <highvoltage> 't.
[12:44] <azeem> highvoltage: he's still debian-press, debian-system-administration and debian-security, at least
[12:44] <minghua> this is really sad.  not very surprising though
[12:45] <azeem> and really, this isn't the right chan
[12:45] <highvoltage> yeah, sorry about that, killall -9 joey-email-discussion
[04:26] <raphink> ok here is a game for you guys
[04:26] <raphink> I'm trying to guess what language is this : http://raphink.net/13_Track_13.ogg
[04:26] <raphink> anyone has got an idea ?
[04:30] <raphink> (nothing to do with MOTU though ;))
[04:30] <G0SUB> raphink sounds like some european lang.
[04:30] <raphink> G0SUB: the music sounds european, but not the language to me
[04:30] <raphink> to me it sounds more asian
[04:30] <raphink> it has very nasal sounds
[04:30] <G0SUB> raphink I am an asian ... it's not asian
[04:30] <raphink> that could be in portuguese or french if I didn't know both of these languages
[04:30] <raphink> what languages do you speak G0SUB?
[04:31] <G0SUB> raphink may be fr or pt
[04:31] <raphink> G0SUB: no I'm french and I speak pt ;)
[04:31] <G0SUB> raphink I speak 3 indic languages and can recognise all
[04:31] <LarstiQ> doesn't sound like a real language to me
[04:31] <G0SUB> esperanto?
[04:31] <raphink> yes but when I mean asian I don't mean indian
[04:31] <LarstiQ> G0SUB: hell no :)
[04:31] <raphink> G0SUB: no I know esperanto
[04:32] <LarstiQ> ah, here it does sounds like a language
[04:32] <raphink> it is an existing language I'm sure
[04:32] <raphink> and to me it sounds like an asian language
[04:32] <LarstiQ> raphink: it reminds me a bit of german at places
[04:32] <raphink> like vietnamese or chinese
[04:32] <raphink> LarstiQ: where are you from?
[04:32] <LarstiQ> raphink: .nl
[04:33] <raphink> ok
[04:33] <raphink> it's not dutch for sure ;)
[04:33] <G0SUB> raphink asian can be thai, chinese, japanese, sinhalese, burmese, malay, etc. and i can recognise them
[04:33] <LarstiQ> raphink: does not sound asian to me
[04:33] <raphink> oik
[04:33] <raphink> hmm
[04:33] <raphink> maybe east european then
[04:33] <raphink> turkish?
[04:33] <raphink> anyone knows turkish?
[04:33] <G0SUB> raphink possible ... possibly east european
[04:34] <Yagisan> raphink: I also don't think it is asian. Definitely not Japanese, or Korean
[04:34] <raphink> yep
[04:34] <raphink> well it's all about these nasal sounds
[04:34] <raphink> not a lot of languages have sounds like this
[04:34] <raphink> and funnily enough there are these "mutz" and "futz" ending words
[04:35] <raphink> that make it sound like germanic language at times
[04:35] <raphink> to me at least
[04:37] <LarstiQ> raphink: Its not Turkish as I know it.
[04:37] <raphink> ok
[04:37] <G0SUB> Romanian?
[04:37] <LarstiQ> raphink: could it be retoromanic? Or however it is called in English
[04:38] <raphink> retoromanic ?
[04:38] <raphink> what is that?
[04:38] <raphink> G0SUB: romanian is a latin language, doesn't sound like this
[04:38] <G0SUB> i see
[04:38] <raphink> imo
[04:39] <LarstiQ> raphink: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romansh
[04:39] <raphink> ah
[04:39] <raphink> romanche
[04:39] <raphink> I doubt so
[04:39] <LarstiQ> raphink: Retoromaans in Dutch
[04:39] <tseng> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romance_language
[04:39] <tseng> is this what you mean by retromanic
[04:40] <LarstiQ> tseng: no :)
[04:40] <LarstiQ> raphink: I really think I hear snippets of German in there
[04:41] <raphink> really?
[04:41] <raphink> it doesn't sound like a germanic language all in all to me
[04:41] <LarstiQ> raphink: at 0:33 and 0:40 for instance
[04:42] <LarstiQ> so tzech perhaps?
[04:42] <raphink> hmmm
[04:42] <raphink> doubt so
[04:45] <raphink> hard guess ...
[04:46] <raphink> icelandic?
[04:50] <raphink> any more guess?
[04:54] <Jeds> its swedish
[04:54] <raphink> Jeds: you're kidding
[04:54] <Jeds> no
[04:54] <raphink> ?
[04:55] <Jeds> im not kidding
[04:55] <raphink> oooh ok
[04:55] <raphink> lol
[04:56] <Jeds> well obviously not :P
[04:56] <raphink> hehe :)
[04:56] <raphink> I understand it when it's written
[04:56] <raphink> but not sung at least ;)
[04:56] <raphink> obviously
[04:56] <raphink> :)
[04:56] <Jeds> http://www.lyricsdownload.com/ekdahl-lisa-vem-vet-lyrics.html
[04:56] <Jeds> there's the lyrics'
[04:57] <raphink> thanks
[04:57] <freeflying> raphink: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2129
[06:51] <sladen> WRT http://lwn.net/Articles/174930/ is anyone else waiting on Debian syncs
[06:54] <G0SUB> sladen hah, everybody is talking about this
[07:15] <sladen> crimsun, ogra: ping regarding syncs
[07:16] <ogra> sladen, ?
[07:19] <phanatic> hi people
[07:23] <Gloubiboulga> wb phanatic
[07:23] <phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga
[07:42] <LaserJock> dholbach: ping?
[07:43] <dholbach> LaserJock: pong
[07:43] <toma_> ..nick toma
[07:44] <LaserJock> dholbach: I wanted to ask you about a possible UVF exception for tetex-src
[07:45] <LaserJock> dholbach: I was looking at it last night. I saw that tetex-bin and tetex-base are 3.0 but Debian didn't get tetex-src 3.0 out until Jan. 31st
[07:45] <dholbach> LaserJock: what exactly do you want to know?
[07:45] <dholbach> LaserJock: you could just file a bug report as the process says?
[07:47] <LaserJock> dholbach: well, I was sort wondering if it was even worth it. For one, it isn't actually useful for users and the diff is huge (it source packages has more than doubled in size), however, I was a little concerned about a licensing issue
[07:47] <dholbach> LaserJock: just file the bug
[07:47] <dholbach> siretart slomo and I will reply to it
[07:47] <LaserJock> ok, thanks
[07:49] <slomo> hm, isn't tetex-src in main?
[07:50] <slomo> ah ok...
[07:52] <LaserJock> slomo: no, it isn't. I'm really not sure if it is a big deal. The only thing I was worried about was complying with the license
[07:53] <LaserJock> if we are distributing the wrong version of the source that probably isn't good. I don't know that anybody would care though.
[07:58] <LaserJock> hmm, we might want to sync tetex-base too, looks like they fixed some RC bugs
[07:59] <slomo> tetex-base is main... hm, you could talk to pitti about tetex-base, he cares for it iirc
[08:02] <LaserJock> slomo: ok, thanks
[08:04] <LaserJock> netzmeister: Guten Abend?
[08:41] <siretart> LaserJock: nabend!
[08:41] <siretart> (colloq. for "g'evening")
[08:42] <LaserJock> siretart: ahh, I kinda figured that. I'm trying to learn a little bit more of the informal language/slang
[08:42] <LaserJock> I'm learning a bit of the more formal stuff online
[08:46] <siretart> klare sache (== 'sure thing')
[08:47] <LaserJock> what is "di rein" or something similar, I can't remember the exact spelling
[08:47] <siretart> you mean the french 'de rien'?
[08:47] <siretart> I think 'gern geschehen' comes close
[08:48] <LaserJock> ah, is it French? I think that is it. Doesn't dholbach say it all the time
[08:48] <ogra> he is french  ....
[08:48] <ogra> (in sprit)
[08:48] <ogra> ;)
[08:49] <LaserJock> lol
[08:49] <LaserJock> that must be why he is always hugging people ;-)
[08:50] <ogra> heh
[08:51] <siretart> hehe
[08:52] <LaserJock> so is 'gern geschehen' like np ?
[08:53] <LaserJock> lol, I tried getting on #ubuntu-de the other day. I was able to get some of it through the Google translator but there is too much slang and computer talk
[09:11] <siretart> LaserJock: right
[09:12] <LaserJock> cool, I wrote it down so I'll remember ;-)
[09:27] <LaserJock> I think it has a --help
[11:16] <ajmitch_>  morning all
[11:16] <ajmitch_> quiet channel today
[11:18] <LaserJock> hi ajmitch_
[11:19] <LaserJock> I suppose it's only us lazy people who have time to IRC ;-)
[11:20] <ajmitch_> everyone else is off fixing bugs :)
[11:28] <dolson> well.. I'm going to have a nap :)
[11:30] <ajmitch_> oh dear
[11:31] <ajmitch_> someone claiming that linux 2.6.12 sources aren't available in ubuntu & it breaches the GPL
[11:31] <ajmitch_> someone please educate him :)
[11:31] <Mithrandir> uh, they aren't?
[11:31] <ajmitch_> oh good, dolson did
[11:31] <ajmitch_> Mithrandir: he claims they aren't (ie he doesn't know where to find them)
[11:43] <LaserJock> hi crimsun and bmonty
[11:43] <bmonty> hi LaserJock
[11:43] <crimsun> hi LaserJock & bmonty
[11:43] <ajmitch_> crimsun: how'd the patch mangling go?
[11:44] <crimsun> ajmitch_: 3/8 have been merged in 18.28 already
[11:44] <crimsun> I should have the majority of hda-intel done tonight
[11:45] <ajmitch_> great
[11:45] <ajmitch_> it'll make quite a few people happy
[11:45] <crimsun> :)
[11:46] <ajmitch_> I noticed quite a few people on the forums with this one
[11:52] <Seveas> ajmitch_, lol@soap opera
[11:57] <LaserJock> ajmitch_: man, I wonder if that GPL violation guy will try mailing -devel any time soon ;-)
[11:58] <ajmitch_> haha
[11:58] <hub> who?
[12:02] <LaserJock> what does "archive processing" mean? syncs and uploads, etc. ?


[00:49] <kavurt> http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/forms/IMM1344E.PDF i can't open this pdf. how can i install adobe reader 64bit?
[12:52] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[18:55]  * KombuchaKip sadly informs everyone that Jack Layton just passed away. http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Read+Jack+Layton+final+letter+Canadians/5289270/story.html


[11:05] <CIA-18> Ubuntu Documentation: philbull * r4455 ubuntu/hardware/C/hardware.xml: Correct touchpad instructions (patch by Mads Peter Rommedahl, closes #150136)
[11:21] <CIA-18> Ubuntu Documentation: philbull * r4456 /trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Corrections to basic-commands (patch by Niall Jackson, closes #138891)
[02:16] <|logo|> leave
[03:15] <ubotu> New bug: #150563 in ubuntu-docs (main) "package ubuntu-docs 7.10.3 failed to install/upgrade: subprocesso post-installation script morto por sinal (Interromper)" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/150563
[07:16] <CIA-18> Ubuntu Documentation: philbull * r4457 ubuntu/libs/gnome-menus-C.ent: Corrected menu item (patch by Robert Bowman, closes #150001
[07:26] <CIA-18> Ubuntu Documentation: philbull * r4458 common/C/contributors.xml: Updated contributor list
[07:32] <CIA-18> Ubuntu Documentation: philbull * r4459 ubuntu/internet/C/wireless.xml: Cor
[07:46] <ubotu> New bug: #150641 in ubuntu-docs (main) "Desktop Effects settings UI has changed" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/150641
[08:22] <Lhademmo1> Why don't anyone edit the topic to remove the MeetingAgenda?
[08:29] <Lhademmo1> afk
[09:14] <LaserJock> mdke: man, I'm glad you guys had to do all that translation stuff
[09:15] <LaserJock> I spent like 3 hrs on Saturday getting the translations put into edubuntu-docs
[09:46] <mdke> LaserJock: not bad!
[09:49] <LaserJock> I made more commits this weekend than I have in probably the last year ;-)
[09:49] <mdke> :)
[09:49] <mdke> LaserJock: thanks for sorting that out
[09:51] <LaserJock> well for some reason I hadn't realized that we branched already
[09:51] <LaserJock> so I synced stuff up
[09:51] <LaserJock> then tried to figure out how to do translations
[09:51] <mdke> LaserJock: I discovered what "some reason" is... I forgot to put the mailing list in the to: address when sending the email saying I'd branched
[09:52] <LaserJock> heh
[09:52] <LaserJock> well, it seems like everybody else figured it out
[09:52] <mdke> nope...
[09:54] <LaserJock> mdke: when you download the .pos from Rosetta do they come as <doc>-<lang>.po?
[09:54] <mdke> yeah, unfortunately
[09:54] <LaserJock> that was my big fight
[09:54] <mdke> to rename them I used a bit of a hack
[09:54] <LaserJock> I was using the Ubuntu translate.sh script
[09:54] <mdke> ah, guess I should have added the hack to the repository
[09:55] <LaserJock> so in the end I just renamed them
[09:55] <mdke> yes, that's what the hack does too
[09:55] <mdke> I got it from lamont
[09:55] <mdke> for i in `cat libs/shipped-docs` ; do cd $i/po ; for x in $i-*.po ; do echo $x ; mv $x ${x#$i-} ; done ; cd ../../ ; done
[09:55] <mdke> at least, the mv bit I got from him
[09:56] <LaserJock> ah
[09:56] <LaserJock> I did it a little differently
[09:56] <LaserJock> but same kinda thing
[11:22] <ScorpKing> hi guys. i want to add a howto on https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ on using dd over nfs for backups. what should i call it?
[11:23] <ScorpKing> in https://help.ubuntu.com/community/TitleIndex there are a few on BackupPC and so on but that won't be to descriptive. any ideas?
[11:27] <ScorpKing> will ddToNFS be ok?
[11:34] <ScorpKing> !guide
[11:34] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about guide - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[11:34] <ScorpKing> heh
[11:35] <ScorpKing> oh well. i think i'll make it DDtoNFS. that looks ok to me. now to choose the right template.
[11:42] <Lhademmo1> mdke: How's work coming along on bug 123963 ?
[11:42] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 123963 in ubuntu-docs "Ubuntu 7.04 documentation updates have not been done" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/123963
[11:56] <mdke> Lhademmo1: actually, not bad
[11:59] <Lhademmo1> Good :)
[11:59] <Lhademmo1> And sorry if I keep bugging you people. My guess is that most noobs do that
[11:59] <mdke> no, it's absolutely fine
[11:59] <mdke> quite helpful, actually
[12:02] <mdke> as for the topic, did you already try changing it?
[12:02] <Lhademmo1> okay, then I'll just keep doing it.
[12:02] <Lhademmo1> I think I must have sent ~50 mails to Phil Bull the last two days alone ;)
[12:02] <mdke> wow, keen
[12:02] <Lhademmo1> Nope. I dont know how to do that from Pidgin
[12:02] <mdke> asking questions is definitely the best way to learn; if you aren't sure, ask
[12:03] <Lhademmo1> Yes, but mentoring during string freeze could be hard, I reckon?
[12:04] <mdke> Lhademmo1: well, it can be a quiet time in documentation; except for those of us dealing with translations
[12:04] <mdke> and last minute bug fixing
[12:23] <Lhademmo1> Yeah, , I was thinking about the bugfices
[12:34] <Lhademmo1> well, off to bed


[04:59] <ScottL> TheMuso, my first proof-of-concept video using blender:  http://fossmusicproject.org/public/video-test-final.mp4
[04:59] <ScottL> there's two of me...or is that me's ?
[05:03] <ScottL> TheMuso, the music isn't all the spectacular, just two first takes but they were the vehicle to show something of what blender is capable of
[05:25] <holstein> ScottL: lol
[05:25] <holstein> thats great man :)
[05:26] <TheMuso> ScottL: thanks will take a peak now.
[05:30] <TheMuso> Nice work.
[12:55] <ScottL> holstein, TheMuso :  thanks, i could have looked better if i spent more time (and money) on lighting and a better green screen but it gets the point across


[00:00] <jjohansen> bjf: yeah looking
[00:08] <jsalisbury> bjf, jjohansen, this one sticks out from a quick look:
[00:08] <jsalisbury> d6d69ebc5b3f UBUNTU: SAUCE: apparmor: Fix no_new_privs blocking change_onexec when using stacked namespaces
[00:11] <jjohansen> jsalisbury: well thats a big nasty one but by the call trace it actually looks more likely to do with
[00:11] <jjohansen>   UBUNTU: SAUCE: apparmor: fix lock ordering for mkdir
[00:11] <jjohansen> or
[00:11] <jjohansen>   UBUNTU: SAUCE: apparmor: fix leak on securityfs pin count
[00:11] <jjohansen> or
[00:11] <jjohansen>   UBUNTU: SAUCE: apparmor: fix reference count leak when securityfs_setup_d_inode() fails
[00:11] <jjohansen> or
[00:11] <jjohansen>   UBUNTU: SAUCE: apparmor: fix not handling error case when securityfs_pin_fs() fails
[00:12] <jsalisbury> ugg
[16:56] <JokesOnYou77> Hi all
[16:57] <JokesOnYou77> I'm trying to understand the difference between the *-edge kernels and those that don't have that designation.  Based on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/RollingLTSEnablementStack I thought the *-edge kernels should be newer, but from what I can see in pat it looks like linux-generic-hwe-16.04 is <IP_ADDRESS>.10 while *-edge is <IP_ADDRESS>.6
[17:09] <apw> JokesOnYou77, -edge is typically newer, the whole -hwe -hwe-edge is new and we're just getting -edge rebased to 4.10 atm
[17:10] <JokesOnYou77> apw: Thanks!  I'll go with the regular one for now and see if it fixes my issues.


[21:42] <smallfoot-> hey everyone
[21:43] <smallfoot-> can i be unbanned from #ubuntu+1
[21:43] <smallfoot-> i was banned from there when i was little
[22:06] <el> let me take a look
[22:09] <JackFrost> smallfoot-: Have you read and do you agree to follow the Ubuntu guidelines?
[22:09] <JackFrost> !guidelines
[22:13] <JackFrost> Provided that you can adhear to them, you're welcome to rejoin #ubuntu+1.
[22:43] <smallfoot-> thanks!