[06:51] <DalekSec> OvenWerks: lingot wasn't so bad, fmit was interesting too.
[07:10] <cub> OvenWerks, I haven't tried any software for tuning since I always use my pedal. I just noticed that Lingot hasn't been updated since 2011. Gxtuner seems to be pulled out fron Guitarix, which is included if I don't remember wrong. I haven't used that either though. Guitarix is at least maintained.
[16:04] <zequence> OvenWerks: We should really try to make additions before feature freeze (and that said, I haven't yet synced us with Xubuntu, as I was supposed to)
[16:04] <zequence> Not a big deal to add a tuner though
[16:04] <zequence> I could do that while I make the other changes to seeds
[16:08] <zequence> Just a thought: how would it be if we just released once every year?
[16:08] <zequence> These 9 month issues don't seem worth putting up, especially when they are so close to a LTS
[16:09] <zequence> Wouldn't save an awful amount of work though. We still need to keep our package up to date
[16:10] <zequence> The only thing we don't need to do is QA on the ISO. And we still need to respect the release schedule.
[16:14] <zequence> Users would still be able to upgrade to a newer version of Ubuntu from which ever release they are on.


[01:24] <valorie> view
[01:25] <valorie> oops
 Hello, All from Me
 @rakibulinux, Hello
 Hi guys! I will change my OS in a few weeks time (Kubuntu18.04 to 20.04). Can I transfer all my syncthing connections to the new install somehow or do I need to reestablish all connections to other computers manually?
[06:32] <diogenes_> Linuxophil, you can copy them from: /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/
[06:33] <diogenes_> the permissions should be: -rw------- 1 root root
[06:38] <valorie> @Linuxophil that isn't changing your OS -- that it upgrading
[06:38] <valorie> keep in mind that 20.04 does not become LTS until the .1 release in May or June
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/SMoIYi2K/file_27304.jpg On clean install... After updating the os KDE is asking for password after every reboot.... What is that ? I have seen this for the first time ..
[06:39] <valorie> you can either do a fresh install or upgraded
[06:39] <valorie> -d
[06:39] <valorie> @Terminator_99 of course you put in your password each reboot!
[06:40] <valorie> that is basic security
[06:40] <valorie> you can set it up not to ask, if you are the only person with access
 @valorie, Yes but in the login screen... Not twice... Once in Login screen and then after logging in it ask agai for something
 This was not in Kubuntu 19.10
[06:41] <valorie> hmmm, sounds like you don't have Kwallet and your login have a different password
[06:41] <valorie> err, that sentence makes no sense, sorry
[06:42] <valorie> set Kwallet and your user to have the same password
 @valorie, Yes same ... I haven't opened kwallet yet ... I don't even use that
[06:42] <valorie> if you type kwallet into krunner (alt+space) you can fix it there
[06:43] <valorie> most people don't notice that kwallet is silently helping
 Okay
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/VAlG7io3/file_27306.jpg What are those ACPI errors.. appears in every boot ?
 @Ankush Gandhi, Thange sddm theme
 Hello everyone, I am a professional Linux System Admin for Cutting-Edge open source Technology. If you need any help for Linux System you can DM ME. … Technology Stack …  @rakibulinux, This is a public support chat. Please keep it that way.
 @RikMills, I am really Sorry for this
 Wow.  A spammer with manners.  I wish more were like that.
 Is the test week for 20.04 ended?
 I've read somewhere the test would last until 8 of april
[09:14] <Abiding_Monkey> hi
[09:16] <Abiding_Monkey> question: Is there like a manual for how to use all the commands in IRC and how to mosey around?
 @Franzpow, Yes, but testing never ends
[09:18] <Abiding_Monkey> Ahh. My bad
[09:54] <kosty> Привет
[09:54] <kosty> ???
[10:17] <mparillo> !ru
[10:20] <Solomka2004> привет
[10:37] <Papa> Привет
[10:57] <Solomka2004> кто там
[10:58] <Solomka2004> Hi
[11:21] <alterjsive> can anyone help me get dual screen working with the the AMD Ryzen™ 9 4900HS integrated vesa graphics gpu? is there a "rugged" distro with linux kernel 5.5? The AMD Ryzen 4000 Mobile Series "Renoir" Graphics are no longer experimental With Linux 5.5. PS my laptop also has a nvidia RTX 2060 max-q on board.
[12:03] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
 Hello
[12:04] <Guest88896> Hi
[12:05] <Guest88896> guys i'm trying to install kunbutu in vmware but all it does it lunch the live version, like it does not shows the installer
 @valorie, I do! So excited for plasma 5.18 though!
[12:08] <Guest88896> I downloaded this iso kubuntu-19.10-desktop-amd64.iso
 Guest88896: i think that you can install kubuntu from the desktop
 @valorie, Well, that is a matter of semantics. Since upgrading is in fact a specific way to change your OS, I am not at fault here. Seeing that I intent to actually do a nuke-and-pave, I am not even upgrading. 😉 Nerd rant over.
[12:10] <Guest88896> do u know how ?
 On the desktop of the live session there is an Icon, If I remember correctly, that says: install kubuntu
[12:10] <Guest88896> ah I'll check again
[12:10] <Guest88896> thank
[12:10] <Guest88896> u
 @Franzpow, Correct. You can install from there.
 Np
[14:25] <gianni> ciao
[14:25] <gianni> !list
[14:50] <ahillio> anyone recommend a screenshot program that streamlines the process to making basic edits like crop etc?  I used Shutter at one point and right now I'm wanting more than what Spectacle seems to offer.
[15:00] <BluesKaj> ahillio, try ImageMagick, it's in the repos
[15:00] <BluesKaj> !ImageMagick
[15:00] <BluesKaj> !info ImageMagick
[15:01] <BluesKaj> ahillio, ^
[15:04] <ahillio> @BluesKaj thanks I've heard of this and will check it out... I wonder if offers any cli options...
 Fwd from GNU Propaganda (Archived): https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-community/2020q2/006098.html … The Qt Company is considering severing ties with KDE. …  Solidarity in Free Software! Long Live KDE (Even if you dont use it!)
[15:10] <BluesKaj> ahillio, yes it does iirc
[15:15] <BluesKaj> salvaconnome, agreed, but using "language" for emphasis is frowned upon and unnecessary
 What are the consequences for kubuntu 20.04?
[15:18] <BluesKaj> Franzpow, that's hard to predict atm, but 20.04 is practically finished development now
 Please keep chat to support, not speculation. There are other groups for such things.
 Ok sorry my bad
 I am just curious, well maybe also worried
 But I an going to read something on web about the topic
[16:19] <user|22958> What are the sys req. for Ubuntu its?
[16:19] <user|22958> lts
 Sys req for the 20.04 release?
[16:55] <user|62242> Hello, anyone an idea for my technical problem: (Thinkpad<EMAIL_ADDRESS>: my bluetooth headset (Jabra Evolve 65) is recognized as playback device but not as recording device...
[16:56] <user|62242> If I use my USB-Cable for the connection everything works just fine
[17:08] <alma_> salve
[17:08] <alma_> "!list"
[17:09] <BluesKaj> !list
[17:10] <BluesKaj> alma_, read above
[17:12] <alma_> !list
[17:22] <BluesKaj> !it | alma_
 Ciao alma cosa cerchi?
[17:28] <BluesKaj> Franzpow, the user left
 oh ok
[17:30] <BluesKaj> we get a lot of italian users looking for media here due to a magazine there advertized ubuntu as a source for mp3s etc
 oh really???
 what's the name of the magazine?
[17:30] <BluesKaj> yeah, and that was many yrs ago
[17:31] <BluesKaj> dunno what magazine
 I don't think that people are still coming here for that magazine after all these years, no?
[17:33] <BluesKaj> well,  seems to be some kind of internet myth in Italy
 I am italian. i can say that I don't know many users that use linux.. but the community is still growing
[17:36] <BluesKaj> good to hear, the more linux users the better :-)
 Sure. But people here still prefer to pirate windows 10 than installing Linux for free... even they just need to visit facebook or watch a movie
 even if*
 The real myth is using Apple machines to "work"
 Here this myth is so strong :/
[17:39] <BluesKaj> Macs used to have that cool factor when Steve Jobs was still alive, but that myth is fading fast now
 A lot of musicians here and music schools still buy a lot of expensive apple machines. Because they're "better". I see, we're very slow to adapt to changes
[17:41] <BluesKaj> the real cool OSs are Linux
 yeah!
[17:42] <BluesKaj> my daughter had an Imac , took 16 seperate steps to replace a hard drive...
 I nearly changed almost every computer os at my home with linux. I am ready to replace my work machine os with linux or doing at least dual boot to replace winzozz
 I can only imagine. I never bought a mac
[17:46] <BluesKaj> I always thought they were very overpriced for what you got, especially in terms of hardware
[17:48] <BluesKaj> I found Kubuntu after trying several linux OSs and never looked back
 I love it
 But I think that on some older machines I must stick with lubuntu
 That is very light and fast
[17:52] <BluesKaj> dunno, never ran it
[17:55] <BluesKaj> I've read some good things about it as being a good starter system for older machines alright
 yeah. better than xubuntu
 in my opinion
 I 've tried all the ubuntu flavors in this year. I am still curious about trying Debian the "original" distro from every ubuntu distro came
 btw now I am using i3 wm, I find it very fast and easy to use
[18:08] <BluesKaj> yeah, i tried i3wm for a while, but being a home user yakuake suits my needs better
 what's yakuake?
[18:08] <BluesKaj> it's a drop down terminal
[18:09] <BluesKaj> uses the F12 key
 oh that's more radical than i3?
[18:10] <BluesKaj> not really, it's simpler
[18:10] <BluesKaj> drops down over everything on the desktop
[18:11] <BluesKaj> !yakuake
[18:11] <BluesKaj> !info yakuake
 I am reading something about it
[18:26] <BluesKaj> bbiab
[19:12] <valorie> yakuake <3
 that's cool! Can I install it also on i3?
[19:25] <kaj> Franzpow, install on kubuntu, it's a kde app
[19:26] <kaj> i3wm is a separate thing
 Well it is an app but theorically it should work on i3, no?
[19:34] <AssociateX> Hello people. I did a fresh install of Kubuntu 18.04, it's updated. I did the minimal install. I could not get files off of my phone, specifically photos. I created a udev rule in /etc/udev/rules.d/ "SUBSYSTEM=="usb", ATTR{idVendor}=="1004", ATTR{idProduct}=="633e", MODE="0666"" then restarted udev. This worked last night, but not this morning. So,
[19:34] <AssociateX> I did "sudo chmod 777 /dev/bus/usb/001/*" and now I have access to the files on my phone. I think that what I am doing is a little reckless, but proves the point that I have a permissions problem. There is probably a completely sane solution to better accomplish what I need here, and I hope that someone here knows what that solution is.
[19:36] <kaj> AssociateX:  yeah it's called kdeconnect
[19:37] <kaj> works over wifi as well
[19:37] <AssociateX> kaj I do have that installed
[19:37] <kaj> install it on your phone too
[19:39] <AssociateX> kaj previous to the new installation that was not needed, I could connect just fine. I'm not saying that your solution isn't valid or appreciated, I'm just wondering how do get it working like it was two days ago before I broke my previous install.
[19:40] <AssociateX> kaj meh, I will just try installing kde connect on my phone and see how that works. Thank you.
[19:41] <kaj> AssociateX:  well, I'm not familiar with udev rules
[19:42] <AssociateX> kaj fair enough, and I don't need to be stuck in the past if I want to embrace progress and new solutions.
[19:42] <AssociateX> working* new solutions
[19:44] <kaj> some users prefer less dependence on the cli than others i guess, I'm kind of in the middle
[19:47] <AssociateX> kaj I'm in the middle with that as well, although previously I would just plug in my USB cord and be connected and be able to open Dolphin to access files without prompts or trouble. Anyway, setting up KDE Connect right now.
[19:48] <kaj> cool
[19:51] <AssociateX> Right out of the gate the part where I can remotely make my phone ring even with the ringer off is very cool!
 Why I have so many dev/loops? Up to 25 dev/loops
[20:02] <professor_mad_do> hey i just installed two app from snap then i have Different cursor theme over apps from snap how can i set the same cursor theme??
[20:43] <CruX|> hello okular for showing pdf files is single threaded ?
[22:09] <AssociateX> I'm on a fresh install of Kubuntu 18.04, it's all updated. How do I get the a scroll click to lower a window/program?
[23:45] <Thr0r> Hi! So I just updated from 19.04 to Distro: Ubuntu 19.10 (Eoan Ermine). I had hoped you had solved the problems with using a second monitor (HDMI). Before the screen suddenly went crazy and had to hard reboot to fix it. Now The first thing I stumbled upon was when I tried to switch user - the screen split into 4 and was completely unreadable - had to hard reboot.. Are you having problems with the handeling og a second screen - in 2020 - still?
[23:45] <Thr0r> *of
[23:52] <AssociateX> To answer my earlier question about clicking the scroll wheel to lower windows, I figured that out. https://ibb.co/k1YZLbf


[00:09] <wallyworld_> fwereade__: hey, thanks for the reviews now go to bed!
[00:11] <thumper> fwereade__: are you up again?
[00:31] <thumper> wallyworld_: want to do an old fashioned review? https://code.launchpad.net/~thumper/golxc/mockable/+merge/169317
[00:31] <wallyworld_> sure
[00:31] <thumper> diff still updating
[00:31] <wallyworld_> i really don't like roetveld
[00:31] <thumper> for latest additions
[00:32] <thumper> you're all good now
[00:33] <thumper> wallyworld_: also, can I have a hangout with out to teddy-bear some design ideas?
[00:35] <wallyworld_> sure
[00:41] <thumper> hmm...
[00:42]  * thumper needs a recursive find and replace
[01:07] <thumper> wallyworld_: thanks for the golxc review, will get to those
[01:07] <thumper> just doing a massive move branch
[01:07] <wallyworld_> np
[01:08] <wallyworld_> i wish we used interfaces more in juju
[01:08] <thumper> wallyworld_: fwereade__ asked to have environs.Instance moved to instance.Instance
[01:08] <thumper> so container.Container doesn't need environs.Instance
[01:08] <wallyworld_> ok, sounds good
[01:08]  * thumper goes to make lunch
[01:33] <thumper> wallyworld_: chat?
[01:34] <wallyworld_> sure
[01:34] <thumper> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/3fc078d1d8dacd2c85f1f72fb71d3ed67d97b9c1?hl=en
[02:08] <thumper> wallyworld_: you have two reviews
[02:12] <thumper> wallyworld_: trivial review for you Rietveld: https://codereview.appspot.com/10253053
[02:15]  * wallyworld_ looks
[02:18] <thumper> wallyworld_: happy for a trivial on that?
[02:18] <wallyworld_> yep
[02:18]  * wallyworld_ looks for the other review
[02:18]  * thumper woners
[02:18] <thumper> woners
[02:18] <wallyworld_> try again
[02:19] <thumper> wonders?
[02:19] <wallyworld_> wonders perhaps why the D key is broken?
[02:19] <thumper> I typed woners again first tiem
[02:19] <wallyworld_> tiem?
[02:19] <thumper> our tarmac lander checks for two LGTMs
[02:19] <wallyworld_> :-P
[02:19] <thumper> time
[02:19] <thumper> pierce off fuck knuckle
[02:20] <wallyworld_> now, now. public forum :-P
[02:20] <wallyworld_> i forgot about the tarmac thing
[02:20] <wallyworld_> maybe we need to patch it to allow "LGTM trivial" through
[02:21] <thumper> wallyworld_: yeah, or perhaps we should just get people to review in lp :)
[02:21] <thumper> to get the two reviews from the merge propose
[02:21] <wallyworld_> PLEASE YES
[02:21] <thumper> proposal
[02:21] <thumper> that way we can check for a trivial tag
[02:25] <wallyworld_> thumper: i'm sure i didn't merge your branch - only trunk. i last merge late yesterday i think. i normally merge one last time anyway prior to submitting
[02:25] <thumper> wallyworld_: that change wasn't in trunk
[02:25] <wallyworld_> hmmmm.
[02:26]  * wallyworld_ is confused
[02:26] <thumper> however, I have done things like this with this workflow
[02:26] <thumper> switch to someone elses branch to look
[02:26] <thumper> create a new brack with "switch -b new-work" for something new
[02:26] <wallyworld_> nah, didn't do that
[02:26] <thumper> however since I wasn't on trunk, it starts with the last revision of the other branch
[02:26] <wallyworld_> anyways, i'll sort it out
[02:26] <wallyworld_> after lunch :-)
[02:28] <thumper> kk
[04:41]  * thumper off early due to late work last night
[04:41] <thumper> ciao everyone
[07:24] <TheMue> morning
[07:34] <TheMue> fwereade__: thx ;) the resumer is indeed not very complex.
[07:34] <fwereade__> TheMue, haha, yeah :)
[07:38] <TheMue> fwereade__: hmm, somehow rogers and my branch merge proposals of yesterday don't go into trunk but they have status Approved
[07:38] <TheMue> fwereade__: any idea as an old launchpad user?
[07:38] <jam> TheMue: https://code.launchpad.net/~themue/juju-core/025-cleaner-worker/+merge/169228 ?
[07:38] <jam> As I warned, it doesn't have a Commit Message
[07:39] <jam> you can copy the description into "Set Commit Message"
[07:39] <fwereade__> jam, btw, thank you ever so much for doing all that work
[07:39] <jam> (its probably the biggest case where things fail for people with Tarmac, I tried to be upfront that it is a failure mode)
[07:39] <jam> I've had that problem as well
[07:40] <jam> there is a patch somewhere that has tarmac set it back to Needs Review with a note that it needs a commit message, which at least avoids the black-hole of 'why isn't this working'
[07:40] <jam> but I haven't tracked it down yet.
[07:40] <TheMue> jam: Hmm, I thought I have something in the commit message. *wonder*
[07:40] <jam> TheMue: https://code.launchpad.net/~themue/juju-core/025-cleaner-worker/+merge/169228 you have a Description set, but not a Commit Message
[07:40] <jam> separate fields
[07:41] <jam> (Launchpad models it as one is the conversation you want to have, vs the thing you want saved for posterity)
[07:41] <TheMue> jam: *aaargh* have to learn this first, thanks
[07:42] <jam> TheMue: as an added bonus, I believe LP's resubmit actually removes a commit message if it was set in the original proposal. And *that* is pretty stupid. :)
[07:42] <TheMue> *drumroll* will see now
[07:43] <jam> TheMue: no proposals for your prerequisite branch
[07:43] <jam> TheMue: I'm cheating by looking at the tarmac log
[07:44] <jam> your 024-cleanup-watcher is marked as 'this must land before I can land 025' but you don't have '024' proposed for merging (and approved)
[07:44] <TheMue> jam: that is already merged. do i have to resubmit it too?
[07:44] <jam> TheMue: I think it is just tarmac confused because of the resubmit
[07:44]  * TheMue is sometimes really astonished
[07:44] <jam> the old proposal was against a different branch, so it isn't seeing it.
[07:45] <TheMue> jam: yes, it has been before the switch
[07:45] <jam> Because you used 'resubmit' things got copied across that aren't relevant (It is no longer a prerequisit)
[07:45] <jam> TheMue: fortunately most of this irons itself out naturally with time, I'll unstick it in a sec
[07:46] <TheMue> jam: thankfully my next branch is one of the post-switch-era
[07:46] <TheMue> jam: great, thanks. otherwise i would have resubmitted and approved it (with commit message)
[07:47] <jam> TheMue: fortunately for prerequisite requirements, Tarmac *does* post to the request: https://code.launchpad.net/~themue/juju-core/025-cleaner-worker/+merge/169228/comments/376486
[07:48] <jam> TheMue: what other branch is affected?
[07:48] <TheMue> jam: nice guy ;)
[07:49] <jam> TheMue: pre-commit hook is now running. It failed to merge, though.
[07:49] <TheMue> jam: aha?
[07:49] <jam> TheMue: my fault
[07:50] <jam> I made a change which broke the tarmac config
[07:50] <jam> will fix now
[07:51] <TheMue> jam: and i'll change my "Getting started" document with our usage of the tools and the procedures
[07:52] <jam> TheMue: precommit now firing again
[07:52]  * jam crosses fingers
[07:54] <jam> TheMue: it is currently on cmd/juju tests, so looks pretty good. We'll find out in about 15min.
[07:55] <TheMue> jam: great, fantastic work
[07:55] <jam> TheMue: sorry it didn't work first time right away, but thanks for being patient
[07:55] <TheMue> jam: no problem, typical migration time experience
[07:56] <TheMue> jam: i'm more happy about your effort for tarmac
[07:56] <TheMue> hmm, sound somehow wrong
[07:56] <TheMue> sounds
[07:57] <TheMue> jam: happy about the work you did :)
[07:57] <jam> thanks
[07:58] <TheMue> jam: so to get sure: if it fails the status will be set to "Needs review" again, but currently no mail notification?
[07:58] <jam> TheMue: it should set the status, and post the failure to the Launchpad proposal, which should generate an email for you
[07:58] <jam> the only thing it doesn't send the email for (but should) is missing a commit message.
[07:59] <TheMue> jam: ok, thanks
[08:00] <jam> TheMue: I certainly see emails from earlier, check if you got them as well
[08:00]  * TheMue now also has an eye on the video stream from Toulouse, where the A350XWB starts for its first flight
[08:01] <TheMue> Ah, just took of, great!
[08:10] <jam> TheMue: and it has landed
[08:12] <TheMue> jam: yep, just seen, fantastic. great job!
[10:26]  * TheMue is at lunch
[12:15] <mgz> danilo, laaaging, you take over for a sec :)
[12:15] <mgz> you can also install a different editor if you  like :P
[12:46] <danilos> mgz, I just tried '-not -name' on find and it works (though -exec seems harder since it doesn't return the subprocess return code, so I am leaving that as xargs :))
[13:43] <TheMue> *pinDrop*
[13:44] <mgz> ping drop? :)
[13:45] <TheMue> mgz: no, just a pin drop, it's so quiet here
[13:46] <TheMue> mgz: but ping drop sound better on irc, indeed
[13:46] <TheMue> sounds
[15:05] <Makyo> fwereade__, chance I could get another look at https://codereview.appspot.com/10237043/ SetCharm soon?
[15:06] <fwereade__> Makyo, sorry, ofc
[15:06] <Makyo> fwereade__, thanks, much appreciated :)
[15:21] <fwereade__> Makyo, LGTM, someone else review it too please :)
[15:21] <Makyo> fwereade__, thanks.
[15:29] <TheMue> Makyo: 2nd LGTM ;)
[15:29] <Makyo> TheMue, Thanks \o/
[15:29] <TheMue> Makyo: yw
[15:46] <rogpeppe1> TheMue: you have a review
[15:47] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: yust seen the mail, thanks
[15:50] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: the non-fatal error is simply due to the fact that it may happen during a short network problem but shall be automatically retried later (currently each minute).
[15:51] <rogpeppe1> TheMue: how is that different from any other error we encounter in the other workers when talking to the state?
[15:51] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: if the resume fails what would we win if we let the worker crash?
[15:51] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: the cleaner also only logs and doesn't crash
[15:51] <rogpeppe1> TheMue: if the state is borked because its connection is broken, won't we need to reconnect to it?
[15:52]  * rogpeppe1 wishes he had a better understanding of mgo failure-modes
[15:52] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: me too
[15:53] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: imo both, cleaner and resumer, don't have an own state that me be confused by an error beside their connection to mongo
[15:54] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: so assuming that the connection is able to reconnect they can repeat their work
[15:54] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: but indeed, i'm right now not sure with this connection
[15:55] <rogpeppe1> TheMue: yeah, i dunno
[15:55] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: ping
[15:57] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: Hea
[15:57] <niemeyer> heya
[15:58] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: yo!
[15:58] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: how's tricks?
[15:59] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: Going :)
[15:59] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: a couple of questions
[16:00] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: Shoot.. I may not be able to answer them right now because lunch is waiting for me, but perhaps I can think over lunch.
[16:00] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: just hoping to avoid delving into the source of mgo and wondering: if you get an error, is it necessary to reconnect to mongo, or will it happen automatically?
[16:01] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: It will reconnect by itself, but!
[16:01] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: The error on a session, after a connection is abruptly broken, won't go away until you either: 1) discard the session and create a new one; or 2) call Refresh on it
[16:01] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: second: how easy would it be to add non-authorized s3 access to public-access buckets to goamz? and would you accept a patch that does that?
[16:02] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: Can't parse the second question
[16:02] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: I'd be very much against adding non-authorized access to public buckets.. (!? :-)
[16:02] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: ok. even though they're open access?
[16:03] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: Sorry, I jokingly meant the question makes no sense
[16:03] <TheMue> niemeyer: open read access, to be more specific
[16:03] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: currently you need amazon credentials to access them even though amazon doesn't require them, i think
[16:03] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: when using goamz, that is
[16:04] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: so... when does mgo reconnect by itself?
[16:04] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: i'm not helping here by mixing the two questions up together :-) let's deal with the first one first, shall we?
[16:04] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: I think it'd be okay to accept empty credentials for s3, yeah
[16:05] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: I haven't thought about the implications of that in the code base, but I'd be happy to analyze with you a patch that does that
[16:05] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: mgo reconnects whenever necessary
[16:06] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: our existing plan was to just talk directly to s3 and parse the xml ourselves, but i thought that if it's easy to do in goamz we should probably do that
[16:06] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: and once every few seconds either way, to keep the cluster state up-to-date
[16:06] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: but "after a connection is abruptly broken" it's not necessary?
[16:07] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: maybe i'm not getting the terminology - a "session" is a single connection? or a set of connections?
[16:07] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: A session is an *mgo.Session
[16:07] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: If you see a connection error on a session, that error doesn't go away until (1) or (2), as stated
[16:08] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: You don't have to reconnect manually, you just need to ack the error via closing and recreating, or via the Refresh method
[16:08] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: This is just because Bad Stuff could happen if a connection was recreated behind your bakc
[16:08] <niemeyer> back
[16:10] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: i think i need to be refreshed on the terminology here.
[16:10] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: a Session corresponds to... a single TCP connection?
[16:11] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: http://godoc.org/labix.org/v2/mgo#Session.SetMode
[16:11] <niemeyer> I'll have lunch while you read this
[16:11] <niemeyer> biab
[16:12] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: ah, perhaps you mean that once you've got a *Session it always automatically reconnects?
[16:13] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: enjoy
[16:14] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: btw, List() and URL() already work of the reader, have been trivial, like Get() will be too ;)
[16:15] <rogpeppe1> TheMue: ok, cool
[16:16] <TheMue> rogpeppe1: http get, unmarshalling the two nested structs, iterate of contents, fetch key field, strings.HasPrefix(), simple
[16:16] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: for when you come back: when can you see a connection error on a session? only at Dial time? or can you get a connection error at any later point? (in which case, how can you tell if it's a connection error so you know to call Refresh or discard the session?)
[16:17] <TheMue> so, me has to leave for today, we'll continue on Monday morning
[16:17] <TheMue> have a nice weekend
[16:34] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: i've also got to go unfortunately. i'd like to continue the conversation though, as my understanding of this area is lamentably poor and it affects how we will approach some things.
[16:34] <rogpeppe1> niemeyer: have a great weekend
[16:34] <rogpeppe1> and good weekends to all!
[16:40] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: You can get a socket error at any point
[16:40] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: It's a normal network connection we're talking about
[16:41] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: Supposedly, you won't want to continue doing whatever was being done on any unknown error
[16:41] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: Re-establishing a connection may happen to a different primary, and a pretty different state from what was being accessed before
[16:42] <niemeyer> rogpeppe1: That's why we cannot simply transparently re-establish the connection
[19:13] <FunnyLookinHat> So - I think this might be one of the last few issues barring Rackspace OpenStack support for JUJU: https://bugs.launchpad.net/goose/+bug/1124561
[19:13] <_mup_> Bug #1124561: the Content-Length header is missing <Go OpenStack Exchange:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1124561>
[19:14] <FunnyLookinHat> I can't imagine why the requests wouldn't have the correct Content-Length value
[19:14] <FunnyLookinHat> Even adding Content-Length: 0 seems to be a fix ?