[12:02] <spikeb> yeah
[12:03] <spikeb> i come from a long history of using macos classic and beos, so nothing feels right in the unix desktop area for me
[12:05] <gilgamesh> hey all
[12:05] <gilgamesh> kezz - you moving from warty to hoary?  nice, good luck
[12:06] <kezz> on an ibook too
[12:06] <kezz> so should be interesting
[12:07] <gilgamesh> yikes, hope you have better luck than I've been having lately.  I've been tinkering with Enigmail all day and I can't get it to work, which is frustrating since I had it just fine in WinXP.
[12:07] <gilgamesh> Any experience with enigmail?
[12:07] <kezz> i played with it briefly a while ago
[12:07] <kezz> but nothing substantial no sorry
[12:08] <gilgamesh> np, I'm sure it's something silly I'm overlooking.
[12:09] <gilgamesh> it's been a pain, since I'm willing to bet that the problem's been addressed in later versions that aren't in the warty repositories yet
[12:09] <gilgamesh> tbird 1.0 is supposed to reach backport soon, and then I'll try it again
[12:10] <gilgamesh> how new is the ibook?
[12:10] <kezz> g4
[12:10] <kezz> relatively new
[12:10] <gilgamesh> sweet
[12:11] <kezz> been using ubuntu long?
[12:12] <gilgamesh> a couple months, so not really.  switched from gentoo.
[12:12] <gilgamesh> switched in early Nov.
[12:12] <kezz> i tried it yesterday
[12:12] <gilgamesh> first linux distro or no?
[12:12] <kezz> nah
[12:12] <kezz> i usually use debian or freebsd
[12:13] <kezz> but they don't port very well to the ibook
[12:13] <kezz> ubuntu's hardware detection is even better than yellowdog in my experience
[12:13] <spikeb> YDL's 4.0 is crap
[12:13] <kezz> it all seems to work which is nice on a laptop, and it uses apt insteady of yucky yum
[12:13] <kezz> instead*
[12:14] <gilgamesh> I used Debian for a while and liked it, but got sick of measuring their release schedule in geological time, switched to gentoo and was okay with portage, but as soon as I found out about Ubuntu I jumped back to the Debian-based fold
[12:14] <TenPlus1> how do I install java and flash ??
[12:14] <kezz> yeah gentoo is nice if you have a few weeks to set it up
[12:15] <gilgamesh> hah, yeah.  The first time I installed it I had to use Windows for a week while I read up on portage.  After a while I got the hang of it, but having to build from src everytime got to be a pain
[12:16] <spikeb> it's a pain, but they seem to have the largest collection of working ppc packages.
[12:16] <spikeb> that aren't from the fourth century
[12:16] <kezz> and on modern cpu's the actual performance gain isn't worth the hassle imho
[12:16] <gilgamesh> TenPlus - You can use synaptic to install Java, and for flash, if you're just looking for a browser plugin, go to Macromedia's site and d/l the linux installer
[12:17] <gilgamesh> search the ubuntu forums for details, it's real easy
[12:17] <gilgamesh> here, read this: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=3713&highlight=java+install
[12:18] <gilgamesh> kezz - yeah, I'm running on a P4 1.8 and honestly Ubuntu feels just as fast, once I got things tweaked a bit
[12:18] <spikeb> i was just thinking the other day that gentoo would rock if there was somethign similar to it, but binary package based
[12:18] <spikeb> heh
[12:18] <gilgamesh> no diff in performance, and software install/management is hell of a lot easier
[12:19] <kezz> well when i go back to uni im going to put it on my desktop and kick slack off
[12:19] <JoePenguin> slack... how quaint :P
[12:19] <kezz> heh
[12:19] <gilgamesh> Wow, giving up slack is a big move.  Slack users are hardcore, lol
[12:19] <drspin> anyone know of a good glade tutorial?
[12:20] <cavediver> Hi all. Can someone link some ubuntu reviews for me to read?
[12:20] <JoePenguin> gilgamesh: so how many does that leave, like 10? ;-)
[12:20] <gilgamesh> lol yeah.
[12:21] <kezz> JoePenguin, don't say that on linuxquestions.org :P
[12:22] <gilgamesh> The way I see it, Slack users are Gentoo users minus the organizational skills, and Ubuntu users are Debian users minus the patience for glacial release schedules.
[12:22] <gilgamesh> ;-)
[12:23] <finn_> hi.  I'm trying to adjust my laptop's synaptic touchpad cos the horizontal and vertical scrolling edges are bugging me... how do i do this? i assume it's in /etc/X11/XF86Config-4
[12:23] <cavediver> :) How many packages are supported by ubuntu. I'm currelnty on sid trying to figure out if I should reinstall ubunto.
[12:23] <spikeb> i have a less kind way of charactorizing the ubuntu/debian relationship
[12:23] <JoePenguin> gilgamesh: With plain Debian it's like, "Would it help if I got out and pushed?"
[12:23] <cavediver> You can't use debian .deb packages on ubuntu right?
[12:24] <spikeb> you can, but its bad.
[12:24] <cavediver> I see.
[12:24] <gilgamesh> cavediver - once you add all the "unofficial" repositories like backports, there's something like 14,000 packages available.
[12:24] <spikeb> gilgamesh, half of which are absolute crap
[12:24] <gilgamesh> There's very little that's missing for 99.99% of users
[12:24] <spikeb> (universe)
[12:24] <cavediver> I see. That's a few :)
[12:24] <gilgamesh> spikeb - well, yeah, I didn't say I had installed them all.  :)
[12:24] <spikeb> hehehe
[12:25] <cavediver> I'm no expert but I guess Ubunto is more suited for my desktop than sid.
[12:25] <gilgamesh> It's more suited for your sanity too.
[12:25] <cavediver> I use woody on my server with great success.
[12:25] <JoePenguin> how about we just call it "Ubu" for short?
[12:25] <cavediver> sanbity?
[12:25] <spikeb> sit, ubu, sit.
[12:25] <setite> ububu
[12:25] <JoePenguin> good dog.  woof!
[12:26] <JoePenguin> sit, ububu, sit.
[12:26] <cavediver> Is it good by the way :)
[12:26] <setite> serendipity?
[12:26] <ubuntu> hi, which application in linux was somewhat similar to quarkexpress?
[12:26] <cavediver> Hey guys, don't use such hard words :)
[12:26] <gilgamesh> cavediver - is what good?  ubuntu?  best distro I've used, and I've used most of the big ones at some point or another
[12:27] <spikeb> just because its better than everything else doesnt mean it doesnt suck
[12:27] <spikeb> heh
[12:27] <gilgamesh> okay mr. ballmer
[12:27] <cavediver> gilgamesh: alright. I'll consider it. Is it possible to install up-to date precompiled kernels. I have no time to compile them myself.
[12:27] <kezz> cavediver, it seems a very nice distro so far
[12:28] <kezz> uses 2.6 out of the box
[12:28] <gilgamesh> cave - just use apt-get or synaptic to grab the kernel package you want, and reboot.
[12:28] <jcspray> Hey!  It's the first of the month, where's my naked-person background?
[12:28] <gilgamesh> It does everything, including inserting an entry for the new kernel into grub
[12:29] <cavediver> Just the way I do now then. Is 2.6.10 available in ubuntu yet?
[12:29] <cavediver> Or does it follow the traditional 2 week delay of sid.
[12:29] <cavediver> :)
[12:29] <JoePenguin> I'm a fan of rolling my own kernel :)
[12:29] <kezz> brb reboot
[12:30] <gilgamesh> 2.6.8 is the latest in warty, I don't know if 2.6.10 is in Hoary or not
[12:30] <cavediver> I'm not. Found it fun in the good old days. Not anymore. Just want to be productive and have no time compiling everything :)
[12:30] <cavediver> Therefore I stay out of gentoo :)
[12:31] <atomcomputer> sorry i am french and i have  a problem
[12:31] <atomcomputer> i have installed some programs for hoary on warty
[12:32] <atomcomputer> and now when i boot my computer i have a lot a messages with 'your X is running' and GDM is not working
[12:32] <atomcomputer> and i have to kill X11 and to relunch with my user
[12:32] <atomcomputer> have you an idea N?
[12:33] <gilgamesh> atom - I'd try removing the Hoary repositories from your sources and try reverting to the prior versions of the affected packages.  You try the forums yet?
[12:34] <rhodan> hello all
[12:34] <atomcomputer> gilgamesh, no, not yet
[12:34] <rhodan> can someone help me wtih gdesklets ? I've got it installed, just need help adding new things to it ?
[12:34] <gilgamesh> Go to the forums and search there, I know this problem has been addressed by others.
[12:34] <atomcomputer> gilgamesh, i have to reverting to the prior version ? it's very bad :( nothing to do to repeae this ?
[12:35] <unperson> I have an mp3 player that mounts as a removeable USB mass storage device.  I'd like to have a piece of software where I can take a playlist and have it copy all the songs from the playlist onto my player.  Anyone know of a piece of software that does this in Linux?  Otherwise, I was thinking of writing a perl script for the job.
[12:35] <atomcomputer> gilgamesh, i'll see the forum
[12:35] <atomcomputer> unperson, apt-get install xmms ?
[12:36] <unperson> atomcomputer, Does xmms have this capability?
[12:36] <gilgamesh> atom - depends on the apps in question.  There are a few intrepid souls in the forums who have taken some packages from Hoary and tested them on Warty, then released them in their own repositories (backports).  This is the safest way to grab updated packages.
[12:36] <atomcomputer> i think so but i am not sure
[12:36] <rhodan> anyone ?
[12:36] <gilgamesh> atom - have you added the multiverse repositories and backports to your sources?
[12:37] <JoePenguin> unperson: I don't know but it sounds like a good idea.
[12:37] <gilgamesh> rhodan - sorry, I'm not familiar with gdesklets, though I plan on trying them eventually.  Have you checked the forums for help?
[12:37] <scoon> rhodan, http://gdesklets.gnomedesktop.org/, that should help you.
[12:37] <atomcomputer> gilgamesh, wait 1sec ;)
[12:38] <scoon> rhodan,  also http://gnomesupport.org/forums/index.php
[12:38] <scoon> rhodan, as well as the ubuntu forums.
[12:38] <JoePenguin> unperson: actually it shouldn't be difficult to open a playlist saved by XMMS and parse it with Perl, like you were thinking.
[12:38] <unperson> atomcomputer, As far as I can tell, it doesn't have this functionality (looking as we speak).
[12:38] <unperson> JoePenguin, Yeah, that's the plan.
[12:38] <unperson> JoePenguin, Of course, I was going to add other features then.  My player can use m3u playlists, so I'd generate a new playlist.
[12:39] <atomcomputer> unperson, sorry
[12:39] <gilgamesh> rhodan - try this thread in the forums - http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=3012&highlight=gdesklets
[12:39] <unperson> JoePenguin, Possibly also randomize, check remaining space etc.
[12:39] <neighborlee> will future versions of ubuntu  have java pre-installed ???
[12:39] <neighborlee> also is there a 'easy' way to install it ? :(
[12:40] <unperson> atomcomputer, Hey, not you're fault.  :-)  I'm just saying I don't find it, so unless you have further info I'll assume it's not there.
[12:40] <neighborlee> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AddingJavaSupport/view?searchterm=java < easier than this crap I mean
[12:40] <notwist> hi all. can i ask what the average time is for y'all to rip a 1hr audio cd to mp3?
[12:40] <notwist> with sound juicer
[12:40] <unperson> neighborlee, I think there are licensing issues.
[12:40] <unperson> or something.
[12:40] <neighborlee> nope can't be
[12:40] <neighborlee> other distros have it preinstalled
[12:40] <neighborlee> i'm sure of it
[12:40] <spikeb> um
[12:41] <neighborlee> suse does..mepis does
[12:41] <spikeb> just because they do it does not mean there aren't licensing problems.
[12:41] <unperson> neighborlee, Different distros have different license standards.
[12:41] <notwist> it's taking about 25 minutes here, on a pretty new dvd-wr drive. going at 2.2 speed
[12:41] <scoon> neighborlee, other distros have some of the free sdk's installed.
[12:41] <gilgamesh> neighborlee - dunno, probably not, since it's not 100% oss, IIRC.  installation is easy enough, try: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=3713&highlight=java+install
[12:41] <gilgamesh> It's not that hard, just follow the instructions and you'll be fine
[12:41] <scoon> neighborlee, i would check and be sure that mepis has sun's.
[12:41] <spikeb> it does
[12:41] <neighborlee> to hell with license issues and being '100% OSS'..its high time we made linux 'easy to use' isn't it?
[12:41] <arctick> is there a way i can mount an iso (or actualy .bin & .cue) like daemon tools on windows
[12:41] <neighborlee> damn this makes me angry
[12:42] <spikeb> no, not the hell with it. that's not what ubuntu is.
[12:42] <neighborlee> and thats stupid
[12:42] <spikeb> you'll have to find somewhere else.
[12:42] <scoon> neighborlee, at what cost is making it easy worth
[12:42] <spikeb> no, it isn't.
[12:42] <unperson> neighborlee, I somewhat agree with that idea.  But I can't say it's someone elses job.
[12:43] <gilgamesh> neighborlee - it isn't as easy as pre-installed, but c'mon, just open a terminal, type sudo -s to get a root console, and copy/paste the commands from the tutorial into the console.  How hard is that?
[12:43] <spikeb> what's stupid is people coming in here, knowing full well (if they can read) that things that aren't OSS aren't supported/packaged, and bitching about it.
[12:43] <neighborlee> unperson, sorry its just a bugg issue for me..ubuntu is SO KEWL and so well done yet issues like this WILL hold it back some
[12:43] <neighborlee> unperson, if linux doesn't make EVERY stride to be easy to use 'everywhere' it WILL FAIL
[12:43] <scoon> neighborlee, what do you mean by fail ?
[12:43] <spikeb> no, it won't. it could not expand any more and it's already a success.
[12:43] <neighborlee> it will fail to share the market share with that stupid M$
[12:43] <scoon> tons of people use it and love it the way it is.
[12:44] <neighborlee> nonsense
[12:44] <neighborlee> mabye l33t'ers
[12:44] <neighborlee> but not suzie homemaker I guarantee it
[12:44] <scoon> neighborlee, i don't think that is what linux is about.  linux is not here trying to takeover winblows.
[12:44] <spikeb> so?
[12:44] <neighborlee> scoon: I never said it was ;-)
[12:44] <scoon> neighborlee, > it will fail to share the market share with that stupid M$
[12:44] <neighborlee> correvt
[12:44] <neighborlee> correct
[12:45] <neighborlee> NOTE my suse of 'share'
[12:45] <spikeb> what would be nice is more support from distros who won't ship java for Free java projects./
[12:45] <neighborlee> not 'takeover'
[12:45] <unperson> neighborlee, I'd like something that had a lot of stuff pre-installed: java, flash, codecs, etc., but I'll take what I can get when others are giving it to me for free.
[12:45] <neighborlee> use
[12:45] <gilgamesh> neighborlee, to my grandmother, WindowsUpdate might as well be a root console, she's just as confused.  There's no love lost for installing apps in Windows.
[12:45] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, installing apps in windows is dead easy
[12:45] <scoon> neighborlee, but it is sharing. look around here tonite, any one of these people could just as easily be running winhell and mirc
[12:45] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, but in ubuntu it is as well mostly....using synaptic ;-)
[12:45] <gilgamesh> perhaps, but how long have you been using Windows?
[12:45] <neighborlee> YEARS
[12:46] <scoon> neighborlee, and god bless the registry, best thing about breaking winblows.
[12:46] <spikeb> i actually used windows for maybe six years - that's about it.
[12:46] <exlt> neighborlee: for what it is worth, I for one, do not want JRE/SDK installed by default, and appreciate those that do not force software on me - never miss not having it installed
[12:46] <spikeb> default installations are not forcing anything upon you.
[12:46] <neighborlee> exlt: not forcing things is GOOD..making things a BITCH to install is NOT ;-)
[12:46] <gilgamesh> exactly.  For people just starting out they don't have to unlearn Windows, so there's still very little difference in difficulty for the new user
[12:46] <spikeb> and if there was a fully working free jre, it'd be installed by default.
[12:46] <neighborlee> exlt: I presume you want linux to succeced as well yes ?
[12:47] <scoon> spikeb, well there is gcj  :)
[12:47] <spikeb> i said fully working
[12:47] <scoon> neighborlee, linux IS succeeding !!!!!!!!!
[12:47] <unperson> I don't really know what Ubuntu's goals are. Frankly, I don't care that much.  Right now it works well for me.  I think you're right if the goal is to take over most of Windows' market share, but I'm not sure that's the goal (or necessarily possible).
[12:47] <exlt> neighborlee: in my opinion, it has - I have been using it since about 1996, and have a nice job supporting it's use on servers
[12:48] <gilgamesh> Okay, evangelism aside, anyone here get Engimal running in Tbird 0.8?
[12:48] <scoon> unperson, that is not the goal of linux.  and i think ubuntu is here to make using linux as easy as it can.
[12:48] <gilgamesh> Engimail that is
[12:48] <unperson> I also think that there isn't a "point of Linux" per se, other than to be useful.  The great think about free software is that different groups can decide what "useful" means to them.
[12:49] <jon__> Hello, is anyone able to get TwinView to work properly under Hoary with an nVidia card using the binary drivers?
[12:49] <scoon> and i think ubuntu has done a fine job of that as well.
[12:49] <scoon> jon__, have you had it working before ?
[12:49] <jon__> It's displaying to both monitors, but Xinerama isn't working, so it maximises to the width of both monitors, instead of just one
[12:49] <naim> i cant find any cd burning software, any advice ??
[12:49] <scoon> naim, cdrecord.
[12:49] <setite> anyone familiar with game servers
[12:49] <neighborlee> exlt: you said it -)..'servers'..desktop wize its still sucking back burner because of silly things like java not preinstalled....ask suzie to install java 'that way' and I guarantee you she will say: ' oh george get that POC off my hd right now and put windows back I'm not dealing with it' << why?..because windows makes it so easy: download: double click and play..you see my point ?
[12:49] <jon__> scoon, I had working under Warty earlier today, then I upgraded to Hoary and it stopped working
[12:50] <unperson> scoon, Well, I think neighborlee it correct in that ubuntu is not just about being easy.  They have other priorities two, some of which conflict with ease of use.  Tradeoffs.
[12:50] <spikeb> java is preinstalled on plenty of other distros that don't care about OSS/closed
[12:50] <setite> i need to know what is the minimum or a good base system for a gameserver... along with how to set one up
[12:50] <neighborlee> unperson, agreed
[12:50] <naim> scoon, i know that one .. i need something like k3b ..
[12:50] <gilgamesh> I've run into a wall, searched google and the forums and come up with no answers.  I installed Enigmail via synaptic and configured it, but when trying to encrypt an email it errors: "Enigmime not available."
[12:50] <scoon> naim, xcdroast then.
[12:50] <jon__> setite, that depends on lots of things - what game, how many players, etc.
[12:50] <scoon> jon__, check bugzilla or the forums for some broke info
[12:50] <unperson> scoon, naim?  The n-curses AIM client?
[12:50] <atomcomputer> gilgamesh, ok i'll disable the X at start
[12:51] <setite> jon_ - its not for me but a friend wants to create a 20person cs:source server
[12:51] <neighborlee> unperson, I find ubuntu like the best there is or dain close ( not counting suse which rocks but is also great for 'ease of use') but it could be SO MUCH MORE I think ;-))..I LOVE the philosophy but I fear it is held back by some out dated notions of making sure its always 100% OSS
[12:51] <setite> he knows nothing... the only thing i suggested is that he use linux instead of windows
[12:51] <jon__> scoon, will do
[12:51] <spikeb> um
[12:51] <scoon> spikeb, can you list one or 2 of them.
[12:51] <spikeb> scoon, suse, mepis, xandros, linspire, RHEL
[12:51] <naim> unperson, no in my case, my name is naim
[12:51] <spikeb> slackware.
[12:51] <gilgamesh> atom - can't get into X at all?  Just ctrl-alt-f2 into a new console and login, then edit the sources.
[12:52] <scoon> spikeb, slackware ? pre-installed
[12:52] <exlt> neighborlee: and the 500 people that I work with, primarily use Linux on the desktop, right along with our secretaries, HR people, etc - you just don't seem to be working with the right enterprise-level-minded IT folks  ;)
[12:52] <notwist> does oggenc have the alternative to lames --preset fast standard?
[12:52] <spikeb> scoon, it's on the disks, all you have to do is select it during the install - it's selected by default for the d section
[12:52] <scoon> one other thing are we just talking about the plugin or the SDK ?
[12:52] <scoon> there is a huge difference
[12:52] <neighborlee> exlt: you said it...IT FOLKS
[12:52] <spikeb> slackware has the whole sdk
[12:53] <setite> neighborlee - what os is held back the the 100% oss thing
[12:53] <scoon> spikeb, really.
[12:53] <spikeb> the others i listed have a plugin and iether jre or sdk, dont know
[12:53] <neighborlee> exlt: no offense and i'm happy for 'your office'..but IT folks are NOT suze homemaker ;-))
[12:53] <gilgamesh> scoon's right.  the sdk require one or two more hoops to get running
[12:53] <setite> suze?
[12:53] <neighborlee> suzie
[12:53] <setite> susie
[12:53] <spikeb> suze homemaker doesn't care about OSS and shouldn't use ubuntu until OSS can meet her needs.
[12:53] <atomcomputer> gilgamesh, i'll do that
[12:53] <spikeb> period.
[12:53] <scoon> spikeb, agreed to that.  good point.
[12:54] <naim> scoon, thnx ,.. i am reading the cdrecord docs anyway'
[12:54] <neighborlee> spikeb, is it a goal of ubuntu to be easy to use as windows ..or only for sophisticated l33t linux  users
[12:54] <scoon> naim, xcdroast is a goody.  I like it the best.  but in the end they are all just "front ends" to cdrecord.  Even k3b ( i think )
[12:54] <spikeb> neighborlee, the goal is to have an easy to use OPEN SOURCE OS
[12:55] <spikeb> neighborlee, note the capital words.
[12:55] <naim> root@test:/home/nad # apt-get install xcdroast
[12:55] <naim> Reading Package Lists... Done
[12:55] <naim> Building Dependency Tree... Done
[12:55] <naim> Package xcdroast is not available, but is referred to by another package.
[12:55] <naim> This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
[12:55] <naim> is only available from another source
[12:55] <naim> exlt: Package xcdroast has no installation candidate
[12:55] <neighborlee> yea  just like fedora core.and look how messy that is
[12:55] <Cloudchaser> isn't there an open source java?
[12:55] <naim> pfft
[12:55] <sensebend> yes Cloudchaser
[12:55] <sensebend> Kaffe
[12:55] <exlt> neighborlee: well, my wife, parents, brother, several 70-80+ year old neighbors which I have donated desktops - ALL non-technical people and using linux, don't seem to hold the same opinions that you are voicing so loudly...
[12:55] <sensebend> I believe it is called
[12:55] <gilgamesh> atom - once you get to a console, edit /etc/sources.list and make sure you get rid of the Hoary repositories and add the multiverse.  Then try apt-get update && apt-get upgrade
[12:55] <Cloudchaser> but thats not in ubuntu is it?
[12:55] <spikeb> Cloudchaser, a few, and they suck
[12:55] <setite> nvm i found a good site that explains cs servers
[12:55] <spikeb> not ready for the big time
[12:55] <neighborlee> blacksometing or other
[12:55] <scoon> neighborlee,  http://www.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/philosophy/document_view
[12:56] <spikeb> blackdown isn't OSS.
[12:56] <neighborlee> blackdown
[12:56] <neighborlee> oh ic..I was thinking maybe it was
[12:56] <naim> scoon, yes k3b is a frontend for cdrecord
[12:56] <neighborlee> sigh
[12:56] <spikeb> yeah blackdown is just a repackaging of sun's stuff.
[12:56] <gilgamesh> I'd try k3b if I didn't have to accept all the rest of the kde libs to run it.  I like my gnome clean, please. :)
[12:56] <spikeb> yeah i would like to see more rapid development of kaffe so another issue is dead (including java - no problme if a free JRE that worked great existed)
[12:56] <scoon> neighborlee, how hard is it for you to get the java plugin from SUN and copy it into $HOME/.mozilla/plugins ?
[12:57] <scoon> neighborlee, I am assuming that is all you want.
[12:57] <spikeb> thats not all you have to do, unfortunately.
[12:57] <neighborlee> scoon, not what im referring to
[12:57] <gilgamesh> That's one of two things that keeps WinXP on a second hard drive, DVD burning and games.
[12:57] <naim> scoon, is xcdroast available in restricted ??
[12:57] <sensebend> http://www.ubuntuguide.org - has step by step instructions on how to do this
[12:57] <scoon> spikeb, bs.  that is all that I have done before.
[12:57] <neighborlee> scoon: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AddingJavaSupport/view?searchterm=java < is what im referring to
[12:58] <drspin> aside from using apt or synapse, how can I tell if I have libgnomeui-2.0 installed?? I keep getting error messages when trying to compile my Glade application
[12:58] <scoon> neighborlee, that is for installing the SDK ? is that what you want ?
[12:58] <carajean> i need a little help mounting a ipod!
[12:58] <scoon> neighborlee, are you developing w/ java.  commercially ?
[12:58] <squeegy> drspin: you might need libgnomeui-2.0-dev
[12:59] <sensebend> neighborlee, how is that hard?
[12:59] <drspin> squeegy: according to synapse, it's not installed and when I try to install it I get this : (please check in #flood)
[12:59] <spikeb> scoon, that's bs - the plugin needs a working JRE, and there's more to setting it up than copying the plugin
[12:59] <scoon> spikeb, i am not going to argue w/ you.  I have done it that way and it works.
[12:59] <gilgamesh> I could have installed java using the forum instructions in the time it's taken since you entered the chat, neighborlee.  Grab a console and start cut/pasting the commands from the recipe, it's not difficult.
[01:00] <scoon> naim, try dpkg -p xcdroast
[01:00] <squeegy> drspin: hmm weird, so don't know what to tell ya
[01:00] <scoon> naim, that will show you all about that deb
[01:00] <drspin> squeegy: thanks anyway ;)
[01:00] <spikeb> you can go ahead and think that all you want, but it ain't possible unless you use an rpm or a deb of it.
[01:00] <sensebend> if it's too hard, talk to Sun and ask them to make it easier :P
[01:00] <scoon> spikeb, me ?
[01:01] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, thats not the point and you know it
[01:02] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, and atm i'm unable to even find the directions to install java for browsers..its supposedly on a 'wiki' but i'm not finding it
[01:02] <spikeb> you don't have a valid point right now, so who cares what it is?
[01:02] <scoon> whew there are a cranky bunch in here this eve.  everyone must still be hungover and pissed off.
[01:02] <gilgamesh> Well, what is the point?  Surely your time is valuable enough that you didn't come here simply to vent about how java wasn't pre-installed, right?
[01:02] <exlt> and when you download the JRE, neighborlee, you will notice that you will need to agree to Sun's licensing terms - if you wish to read them carefully, it will become quite clear why the software is not included in the distribution, and also will raise questions as to the legalities of others including this bundled in by default
[01:02] <gilgamesh> neighborlee, I posted this twice already, read: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=3713&highlight=java+install
[01:03] <sensebend> neighborlee, check this http://www.ubuntuguide.org/
[01:03] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, thats part of it yes
[01:03] <gilgamesh> The instructions tell you how to get systemwide java support and support for firefox
[01:03] <nde> hi
[01:03] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, 'some' form of java yes should be ready to rock ( at least for web browsing)
[01:03] <nde> happy 2005 everyone
[01:03] <neighborlee> firefox 'trys' to get java installed but it fails..
[01:03] <sensebend> that goes against the philosophy of being 100% OSS
[01:04] <neighborlee> sensebend, oh you mean like nvidia right ?LOL
[01:04] <neighborlee> my heart so bleeds
[01:04] <gilgamesh> neighborlee - then post it in the development mailing list, maybe you can convince someone who matters. :)
[01:04] <spikeb> still think that gcj and kaffe should get more help from distro makers
[01:04] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, I surely will
[01:04] <[oZaR] > what distro can i use to mount a web server?
[01:04] <mjg59> Historically, the Sun JRE can't be shipped if you include any other java environments
[01:04] <sensebend> agreed spikeb
[01:04] <Cloudchaser> i think the philosphy is OSS, not easy mostly
[01:05] <spikeb> i mean, this whole issue would be dead if they were mature.
[01:05] <spikeb> and everyone would be happy
[01:05] <Cloudchaser> but its not only that really
[01:05] <[oZaR] > which distro do you think is better for a webserver?
[01:05] <spikeb> that's a good point - shipping a JRE in restricted is an idea.
[01:05] <gilgamesh> ozar - OpenBSD.
[01:05] <sensebend> OpenBSD, [oZaR]
[01:06] <[oZaR] > ok
[01:06] <[oZaR] > thank u
[01:06] <mjg59> Ah, it's still the case
[01:06] <[oZaR] > BSD is lik elinux?
[01:06] <gilgamesh> sorta/kinda.
[01:06] <mjg59> The JRE license doesn't allow redistribution if you include any other Java compilers
[01:06] <spikeb> then dont use sun's JRE.
[01:06] <gilgamesh> www.openbsd.org
[01:06] <sensebend> similar, and different
[01:06] <Cloudchaser> on one hand, there's no services gui and i read someone said its because "The reason has been
[01:06] <Cloudchaser> mentioned here before - simply that desktop end-users shouldn't need
[01:06] <Cloudchaser> to be starting and stopping services."
[01:06] <mjg59> Well, quite
[01:07] <spikeb> Cloudchaser, wonder who the brilliant mind behind that was.
[01:07] <Cloudchaser> but yet...its ok for desktop end users to muck around in config files that can hose their system
[01:07] <mjg59> Cloudchaser: There is no services gui because upstream does not provide a services gui
[01:07] <spikeb> if gnome system tools can include it, then desktop users can do it.
[01:07] <[oZaR] > ill try openbsd, but which linux distro is the better?
[01:07] <Cloudchaser> rather than fill in some blanks of a gui
[01:07] <sensebend> OpenBSD is not a GNU/Linux distro
[01:07] <nde> FreeBSD might be a little easier to begin with..
[01:08] <spikeb> yes it does - GST has a runlevel editor.
[01:08] <gilgamesh> ozar - personal preference really, you can run a webserver on any distro.  OpenBSD is a good alternative to linux because it's design philosophy is centered around security
[01:08] <gilgamesh> Hence, aimed at server applications.
[01:08] <[oZaR] > ok
[01:08] <mjg59> Oh, that's interesting. I thought that was one of the ones that was disabled pre-2.8.
[01:08] <[oZaR] > and what about other bsd distributions?
[01:08] <sensebend> and the reason the code forked is a rather interesting story too
[01:08] <Cloudchaser> checkpoint firewalls run over bsd i think
[01:08] <sensebend> (refering to OpenBSD)
[01:09] <siretart> I installed OpenBSD this week on my lovely UltraSparc. Well, you don't know how much I love ubtuntu/debian installer since then :)
[01:09] <Cloudchaser> hehe i've never tried to install bsd
[01:09] <Cloudchaser> ubuntu is a nice distro, there's no doubt about it
[01:09] <[oZaR] > siretart: its very difficult to install?
[01:09] <gilgamesh> ozar - NetBSD is tricky, Free is easiest to use.  Honestly any BSD or linux will serve up pages just fine once you get things running, it's a matter of how secure you need to be and how much time you want to invest in admin'ing the box.
[01:09] <[oZaR] > (openbsd)
[01:09] <Cloudchaser> but its not "easy"
[01:10] <crimsun> [oZaR] : the install process does not hold your hand, that's for certain. But it is by no means "difficult."
[01:10] <[oZaR] > ok
[01:10] <spikeb> Cloudchaser, the parts that work properly are easy.
[01:10] <scoon> wow
[01:10] <sensebend> yeah, it's a bit more awkward
[01:10] <crimsun> [oZaR] : there are plenty of solid docs on the OpenBSD web site. One just needs to read up.
[01:10] <scoon> slack even has java 5
[01:10] <scoon> nice
[01:10] <nuOpus> Hey whats up?
[01:10] <[oZaR] > crimsun: ok
[01:10] <[oZaR] > ill do it
[01:11] <[oZaR] > thank you
[01:11] <gilgamesh> Cloudchaser - I see "easy" as a relative term.  I've run Slack, RH, Debian, Mandrake, Gentoo and Ubuntu, and Ubuntu is the easiest general-purpose desktop distro I've used.  As easy as Windows, not quite, but it's a good evolutionary step
[01:11] <siretart> [oZaR] : not too difficult, but that shellscript won't give you much options in installing it :)
[01:11] <nuOpus> gilamesh: That is also relative to your experience. I find the console much easier to use than navigating around windows
[01:11] <siretart> [oZaR] : no debconf, no fancy partitioner, no selection of packages, no anything :)
[01:11] <nuOpus> gilamesh: Mainly because that is how I grew up
[01:12] <spikeb> i grew up on a mac
[01:12] <spikeb> then had a beos box
[01:12] <spikeb> is it any wonder i can't get comfortable in a *nix DE yet
[01:12] <Cloudchaser> nuOpus, and linux gives you the freedom to do that
[01:12] <Cloudchaser> but it doesn't give the freedom to do it all by gui if one so chose
[01:12] <nuOpus> People say Windows is intuitive which is completely wrong. Intuitive is of intuition meaning you can do it withou ANY prior experience. The ONLY way you know to click on the X to close is prior experience
[01:12] <Cloudchaser> more so than previously for sure
[01:12] <gilgamesh> Nu0pus - you're a rare breed then.  I've done my share of time as a code-jockey before going to law school and I still prefer gui to console when the gui is intelligent enough
[01:13] <nuOpus> so windows is in no way intuitive
[01:13] <nuOpus> if you grew up without the x on the upper right you would have no concept
[01:13] <nuOpus> more to the point .... if you have never grown up with an operating system with the CONCEPT of Windows .... all of those squares mix and it gets confusing to pick which one you are working on.
[01:14] <gilgamesh> nu0pus - well, going back far enough I grew up on CP/m and DOS, then Windows, then linux.  I'm not a newbie to a command-line
[01:14] <nuOpus> Take the elderly ... its not that they are stupid ... its that they have no prior experience into the desktop
[01:14] <gilgamesh> agreed
[01:14] <gilgamesh> that's a good time to get them into linux, so they don't have to unlearn Windows
[01:14] <Cloudchaser> and most people wnat to accomplish a task, not rip into the guts of an OS
[01:14] <nuOpus> I went DOS ... found Win 3.11 sucked for my multi-node BBS then I went to BSD
[01:15] <drspin> why can't anything but nautilus-cd-burnere write to my burner?
[01:15] <nuOpus> and then ended up with falcoln on Linux before BBSs died .... so I have not really been in Windows growing up
[01:15] <drspin> correction... why can't anything but nautilus cd burner find my burner?
[01:15] <spikeb> yeah i ddint use windows all that much myself
[01:16] <[oZaR] > how will openbsd work in a p 166?
[01:16] <gilgamesh> Cloud - I don't see Ubuntu as having forced us to "rip into the guts" very often.  I've had to edit txt config files a handful of times, but virtually everything is administerable via gui
[01:16] <nuOpus> ya that is why I think Linux has a better chance with the new generation so that they can grow up without the windows "laziness" effect
[01:17] <nuOpus> I mean .... have you EVERN known a good programmer that is a COMPLETE Windows user?
[01:17] <nuOpus> They cannot function without ANY form of IDE
[01:17] <gilgamesh> ozar - p166?  how much ram and what's the size of your pipe?
[01:17] <[oZaR] > not much
[01:17] <nuOpus> I mean ... get them to use just a text editor and a good compiler like gcc and they freak out
[01:17] <drspin> how can I make cdrecord and cdrtools run as root?
[01:17] <[oZaR] > 16mb or ram
[01:17] <gilgamesh> nu0pus - heh, true.  I learned on Solaris with vi, XEmacs and gcc.
[01:17] <[oZaR] > and 8 gb of hd
[01:17] <vladster> I have a small question.....
[01:17] <nuOpus> LOL
[01:18] <[oZaR] > *of ram
[01:18] <vladster> I just put it on 60
[01:18] <sensebend> 166mhz Pentium is plenty fast for a webserver
[01:18] <nuOpus> Windows user: "Its impossible to write a program without a GUI IDE and pre-made objects"
[01:18] <nuOpus> Linux user: "Just do it already!"
[01:18] <gilgamesh> ozar - that box is one hurtin' puppy for any *nix, but you should be able to get bsd to run, no X of course.
[01:18] <vladster> The install did not prompt me for a root password
[01:18] <[oZaR] > i didnt want x
[01:19] <nuOpus> gilamesh: Never really tried Solaris
[01:19] <nuOpus> gilamesh: but I hear they are re-vamping the x86 version of it
[01:19] <drspin> sensebend: so long as you're not generating lots of traffic, doing heavy calculations, or running a moderately sized database... even still it should have LOTS of RAM
[01:19] <vladster> supposed to be open code or so what I hear
[01:19] <mjg59> Oh, no, hang on. I was right.
[01:19] <nuOpus> vladster: I heard only some of it is open
[01:19] <mjg59> gnome-system-tools doesn't build a services GUI now.
[01:19] <nuOpus> but I could be wrong
[01:19] <vladster> Parts of it
[01:20] <spikeb> hmm
[01:20] <gilgamesh> At undergrad I used Sun boxen in the CS lab, USparcIIIs.  Fast.  x86 always lagged, but now they're revamping it and ditching CDE.
[01:20] <nuOpus> I actually liked CDE
[01:20] <spikeb> only reason i want to use solaris x86 is for a free copy of cde
[01:20] <nuOpus> got it running on the BSD box
[01:20] <mjg59> Sun needed to ditch CDE to meet US government accessibility requirements
[01:20] <vladster> I need to get to my root password, ubuntu intaller did not prompt me for one
[01:20] <nuOpus> a long time ago
[01:20] <sensebend> vladster, there isn't one
[01:21] <sensebend> all root stuff is acomplished through sudo
[01:21] <nuOpus> vladster: there is root but it is disabled.   Hell, KDE is lighter.
[01:21] <gilgamesh> It's really a pig.
[01:21] <nuOpus> gilamesh: I liked the feel ... but then again ... it was a long time ago. I am an XFCE fan now
[01:21] <gilgamesh> Solaris 10 is using the new JDE, Java Desktop
[01:22] <sensebend> the Java Desktop is pretty :)
[01:22] <nuOpus> gilamesh: Doesnt that make it heavy?
[01:22] <mjg59> vladster: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/RootSudo
[01:22] <mjg59> Java Desktop is just Gnome
[01:22] <gilgamesh> Haven't tried it, since I don't run Slowaris
[01:22] <mjg59> There's almost no java in it
[01:22] <nuOpus> There are some things I couldnt do without enabling the actual root account
[01:22] <gilgamesh> nu0pus - such as?  I haven't touched root
[01:22] <nuOpus> I am interrested in trying it after they fix their driver availability issue
[01:22] <vladster> normally I have to setr up my sudoers list manually
[01:22] <nuOpus> like setting up the web based stuff
[01:23] <nuOpus> you cannot set up driverloader for example
[01:23] <nuOpus> unless you enable root
[01:23] <nuOpus> has no command like interface for setting up the drivers
[01:23] <nuOpus> and it wants to log in as root
[01:23] <gilgamesh> driverloader?
[01:23] <vladster> how do you chek if the NVidia driver is correctly loaded and acceleration is enabled
[01:23] <nuOpus> gilgamesh: Yes ... it lets you use Windows wireless drivers
[01:23] <gilgamesh> ahh
[01:23] <crimsun> vladster: glxinfo
[01:24] <gilgamesh> I'm running on a wired desktop, so I haven't had that difficulty
[01:24] <nuOpus> Linux does not yet have native broadcom modules available and ndiswrapper has issues sometimes
[01:24] <nuOpus> all of my desktops are wireless
[01:24] <mjg59> Because Broadcom won't ship them, which is strange
[01:24] <mjg59> They've got drivers internally
[01:25] <nuOpus> so they only way they work is using ndiswrapper or driverloader
[01:25] <gilgamesh> My laptop is still WinXP, unfortunately, since my law school's exam software is strictly Win only.  I tried running it emulated but it crashed constantly... not something I want in the middle of an exam
[01:26] <nuOpus> gilgamesh: I need WinXP at work too ... thats why I run in a VMware session
[01:26] <gilgamesh> But I've been thinking about grabbing a second laptop off eBay, something cheap to run Ubuntu on
[01:26] <nuOpus> works great
[01:26] <nuOpus> lap is completely Linux with a VMware XP install just for work
[01:26] <nuOpus> currently Gentoo Linux though
[01:26] <nuOpus> thinking of putting ubuntu on it
[01:26] <nuOpus> since hoary is turning out good
[01:27] <gilgamesh> Yeah, this exam software preempts a lot of the Windows core junk at boot time, to lock out Windows explorer access so you can't open files during the exam.  VMW didn't play nice with it last time I tried, and the company that makes it doesn't care about linux users
[01:27] <vladster> Xlib:  extension "XFree86-DRI" missing on display ":0.0". what does this line mean
[01:28] <nuOpus> that doesnt sound good for the OS. You gonna be able to get it off after the courses? LOL
[01:28] <nuOpus> it means the DRI modules did not load on X startup
[01:28] <nuOpus> either because the module is not there (or installed right) or the module does not detect the device
[01:29] <gilgamesh> Probably not actually.  A friend who just graduated had to take hers to the campus techs and they just burned her data to CD and wiped it
[01:29] <neighborlee> gilgamesh, okay I have been VERY busy..anyway..your time spent finding URL IS appreciated do not mistake that...however if I have to go through that just to get java working...i'll have to think about if i'm using the right distro or not which is sad because i'm come to love ubuntu and its philosophies ( some of them anyway)...I just hope someday soon they consider making java for browsing preinstalled like other distros do
[01:29] <nuOpus> you should look in the /var/log directory to see what the logs say
[01:29] <gilgamesh> reinstalled xp and handed it back to her
[01:29] <nuOpus> ya thats what I figured
[01:29] <crimsun> neighborlee: there is a licensing issue, too
[01:29] <nuOpus> when you start messing with windows like that it is hard to take it off
[01:29] <nuOpus> in Linux I just remove the files
[01:29] <crimsun> neighborlee: until debian-legal sorts it out, I doubt the sun jre/jdk will be distributed in-distro
[01:29] <nuOpus> and re-configure some things
[01:30] <neighborlee> crimsun, well then maybe they should consider blackdown assuming it too doesn't  have licensing issues
[01:30] <usual> will gstreamer in hoary support playing dvd's?
[01:30] <gilgamesh> neighborlee - your thanks are appreciated, you're welcome.  however, I would advise that you stick with Ubuntu for a couple weeks and see if it meets most of your expectations before jumping to another distro.
[01:30] <nuOpus> neighborlee: Just make your own sun java debs
[01:30] <crimsun> neighborlee: it's already available blackdown's repositories
[01:30] <nuOpus> use make-jpkg
[01:30] <gilgamesh> I sincerely doubt there's any distro that meets 100% of your desires.
[01:30] <neighborlee> crimsun, sigh yet another hastle
[01:30] <nde> LFS ;)
[01:30] <neighborlee> i'm trying to avoid hastles <G>
[01:30] <nuOpus> gilgamesh: Gentoo does a good job for me meeting 100% except for install times! LOL
[01:31] <kezz> then get mandrake
[01:31] <crimsun> neighborlee: it's not at all a hassle
[01:31] <nuOpus> neighborlee its easy
[01:31] <kezz> and live in purpleness forever :P
[01:31] <vladster> the system has it listed on the pci bus even though it is plugged into an AGP slot
[01:31] <nuOpus> just type make-jpkg sun-blahblahblah.bin
[01:31] <nuOpus> and it does it automagically
[01:31] <sensebend> the amount of time neighborlee has been here, he could have installed Java
[01:31] <neighborlee> crimsun, any idea what the deal is with sun and licensing for us ?
[01:31] <mjg59> neighborlee: Blackdown JRE is under the same license as the Sun one
[01:31] <neighborlee> sensebend, and you severly fail to see the point..but thats ok
[01:31] <nuOpus> ya. They want to control its distribution
[01:32] <neighborlee> mjg59, oh ok well I thought someone mentioned in with idea that it wasn't or something..sigh
[01:32] <kezz> which is fair enough nuOpus
[01:32] <nde> http://lfs.pagefault.net/lfs/whatislfs.html
[01:32] <nuOpus> kezz: Yes I know
[01:33] <mjg59> To the best of my knowledge, there is no full-featured JRE that can be distributed alongside any other java runtimes
[01:33] <nuOpus> kezz: just like I perfectly understand why broadcom wouldnt release code for linux programmers to write modules
[01:33] <ubuntu> does fglrx have support for Radeon RV100 QY [Radeon 7000/VE] ?
[01:33] <mjg59> classpath is getting better, though, so in the not very distant future life should be better
[01:33] <mjg59> ubuntu: No
[01:33] <mjg59> It's supported by the open drivers
[01:33] <nuOpus> ubuntu: no. because they are not the catalyst drivers that ATI PROMISED IN DECEMBER!!
[01:34] <neighborlee> nuOpus, of course..its 'their' code and they aint sharing..just like nvidia..and who could blame them :_))
[01:34] <ubuntu> mjg59, which open drivers?
[01:34] <gilgamesh> ubuntu - if at all possible, if you want serious 3d support in linux you need to switch cards and get an nvidia chipset.
[01:34] <usual> will gstreamer in hoary support playing dvd's?
[01:34] <mjg59> ubuntu: The ones included in the distribution by default
[01:34] <sensebend> usual, maybe with libcss2
[01:34] <usual> sensebend, no, it's a gstreamer issue
[01:34] <usual> sensebend, yes you need libdvdcss2 or whatever
[01:34] <usual> but gstreamer wont play them anyway
[01:34] <nuOpus> ubuntu: They were supposed to release the actual catalyst drivers in December but I dont see them yet .. but any rate ... the 7000 works with the internal radeon module
[01:35] <ubuntu> I should just modprobe radeon?
[01:35] <sensebend> I use XINE, so I can't comment on gstreamer
[01:35] <nuOpus> usual: I use mplayer to play some dvd movies
[01:35] <nuOpus> it didnt just detect it during the install?
[01:35] <spikeb> i dont even have a dvd drive :)
[01:35] <gilgamesh> sensebend - same here, totem-xine for me.  Ironically, everything plays except DVDs
[01:35] <usual> nuOpus, yea me too, gstreamer does support dvd's in cvs i heard but not in the versions currently in hoary
[01:36] <usual> nuOpus, xine plays them as well
[01:36] <nuOpus> yes
[01:36] <nuOpus> does anyone know the link to get the hoary test CDs?
[01:36] <usual> cdimage.ubuntulinux.org
[01:36] <usual> i just used one today
[01:36] <usual> works great
[01:36] <gilgamesh> nu0pus - would be faster to just grab a .torrent, no?
[01:36] <drspin> would someone please help me with burning on my system...
[01:36] <benjanet> anyone uses Xcin here ?
[01:37] <sensebend> dist-upgrade from Hoary after usual: worked out the issues for me :)
[01:37] <usual> sensebend, nice
[01:37] <nuOpus> ya I dist-upgraded to hoary on a test box .. works great! thats why I am thinking of replacing my Gentoo for the laptop
[01:37] <sensebend> err warty
[01:37] <spikeb> hmm
[01:37] <nuOpus> gilgamesh: ya ... probably right
[01:37] <spikeb> i dont like headaches so i might stay away from hoary
[01:37] <spikeb> besides, i have an ATI card and use their drivers.....heh
[01:37] <nuOpus> I do well with problems in Linux ... it works great on the test box
[01:38] <gilgamesh> spikeb - ATI?   I am about to switch to nvidia
[01:38] <spikeb> yaeh so i have a fx5200 sitting here doing nothing
[01:38] <spikeb> because of my mobo
[01:39] <gilgamesh> I've had my GF4 ti4600 for a couple years now, and the way I see it, this card will have to last a few years longer.
[01:39] <nuOpus> im not a big pc gamer anyway. that is what my XBOX and XBOX live is for
[01:39] <nuOpus> even though my main PC could serve as a kick butt gaming machine
[01:39] <gilgamesh> same here, I have a PS2 for gaming, and I plan on getting an Xbox2
[01:39] <ctd> Isn't xbox for running linux on? :>
[01:40] <nuOpus> LOL I would do it if there was no risk of banning me from xbox live
[01:40] <gilgamesh> ctd - no, it's for running netBSD on.  ;-)
[01:40] <nuOpus> xbox live is the best. I just love the service
[01:40] <spikeb> i want to upgrade just my motherboard, but this one doesnt use ddr
[01:40] <spikeb> and it's a PITA to find a non ddr board for a 1ghz+ processor
[01:40] <nuOpus> I just feel bad because I pay money to microsoft every year for it
[01:40] <nuOpus> :-(
[01:40] <nuOpus> but im hooked
[01:40] <gilgamesh> well, ram is cheaper now, might want to burn some xmas cash
[01:41] <vladster> Is there a reason stream tuner is not in the repository?
[01:41] <gilgamesh> I've been thinking about going from 512 to a gig
[01:41] <nuOpus> I have 2 gig in main PC. :-)
[01:41] <crimsun> gilgamesh: it's an excellent investment
[01:41] <nuOpus> And ATI Radeon 9800
[01:41] <gilgamesh> then again, since I don't program anymore, and don't do 3d, I hardly need it
[01:42] <spikeb> i have 640 heh
[01:42] <crimsun> I did away with swap completely when I moved from 512->1024
[01:42] <nuOpus> but I dont like using that PC
[01:42] <drspin> whoa -
[01:42] <drspin> I don't like k3b
[01:42] <drspin> :(
[01:42] <drspin> but its' the only program that will work
[01:42] <nuOpus> wife likes it cuz it has a cheezy 17" flatscreen. I much prefer this slower machine and its 21" monitor
[01:42] <vladster> does warty use xfree or xorg
[01:42] <nuOpus> xorg
[01:43] <spikeb> warty uses xfree
[01:43] <Cervantes_> Hello all.  I was wondering if anyone knows any place, OTHER than www.linuxant.org, to download linux drivers for comexant style modems
[01:43] <spikeb> hoary uses xorg
[01:43] <nuOpus> oh
[01:43] <nuOpus> ya sorry
[01:43] <nuOpus> didnt read it
[01:43] <gilgamesh> k3b is crap simply because you need to load all those kde libs on top of gnome... unfortunately dvd burning apps for gnome are nonexistent
[01:43] <vladster> then the NVidia binary should find it then
[01:43] <spikeb> audio burning programs for gnome are almost nonexistant as well
[01:43] <nuOpus> Cervantes_: Two ways to get it to work .... Driverloader or ndiswrapper
[01:43] <Cervantes_> both are websites?
[01:43] <nuOpus> just go to http://ndiswrapper.sourceforge.net
[01:44] <nuOpus> download the source ... I have had problems with the debs
[01:44] <spikeb> friend of mine used ndiswrapper with success the other day
[01:44] <grepper>  for a connexant winmodem ?
[01:44] <Cervantes_> aweomse.  I was about to resort to switching modems :/
[01:44] <nuOpus> spikeb: ndiswrapper is good software ... I paid for driverloader though
[01:44] <drspin> gilgamesh: there are many started gnomebaker, gcombust, graveman -- but they're all in early stages...
[01:45] <ubuntu> do I have to edit XF86Config-4 as well in order to have advantage of radeon kernel module?
[01:45] <spikeb> has anyone used a sempron? any better than an xp?
[01:45] <gilgamesh> $82 for another 512MB from crucial... hmm, tempting
[01:45] <crimsun> ubuntu: no
[01:45] <grepper> ubuntu: I just use Driver  "ati"
[01:45] <justdave> anyone familiar with FileMerge on Mac OS X?  I'm pretty sure there's an equivalent program in Linux, but I forget what it's called to look for it...
[01:46] <spikeb> shouldn't dvd burning (at least data) be nautilus' responsibility
[01:46] <ubuntu>  i did ati however when I try to run armagetron for example:
[01:46] <justdave> visual side-by-side diff/merge utility
[01:46] <ubuntu> Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0".
[01:46] <ubuntu> I get this
[01:46] <nuOpus> sdiff and diff
[01:46] <gilgamesh> spikeb - it should, but Naut only handles CDs at the moment
[01:46] <grepper> ubuntu: did you modprobe radeon ?
[01:46] <nuOpus> oh you want merging too
[01:46] <ubuntu> yes I did
[01:46] <nuOpus> sorry justdave .... have never had to do that
[01:46] <spikeb> ahh future release then
[01:47] <mantas> do anyone use nicotine in hoary?
[01:47] <crimsun> mantas: yes
[01:47] <ubuntu> ubuntu@ubuntu:~ $ lsmod | grep rad
[01:47] <ubuntu> radeon                115236  0
[01:47] <grepper> ubuntu: do you have xlibmesa-dri  xlibmesa-gl* installed ?
[01:47] <gilgamesh> spikeb - ideally, Naut would handle data recording to cd and dvd+/-r/rw, and there would be a nice gnome app for cd/dvd a/v authoring... that second part isn't anywhere on the horizon though
[01:48] <ubuntu> grepper, they are already the newest version however:
[01:48] <spikeb> yeah
[01:48] <mantas> crimsun, did you have problems installing it?
[01:48] <grepper> do you have a Load "dri" line ?
[01:49] <Cervantes_> nu0pus, that site isn't just wireless modems, right?
[01:49] <gilgamesh> Someone ought to talk to the guys who write DVDShrink and DVDDecrypter to get them to port to linux
[01:49] <gilgamesh> those are fantastic Windows apps for handling DVDs
[01:49] <gilgamesh> and they're already freeware, IIRC
[01:49] <gilgamesh> just need to gpl it
[01:49] <ubuntu> My XF86Config-4 was generated for an nvidia card then I replaced the card with a ati one just editing the driver "nv" part.
[01:50] <crimsun> mantas: none, though I installed it over a month ago
[01:50] <ubuntu> can that be a reason
[01:50] <grepper> ubuntu: is that a yes ?
[01:50] <ubuntu> they are installed yes
[01:50] <grepper> ubuntu: <grepper> do you have a Load "dri" line ?
[01:51] <ubuntu> grepper, I have that line yes
[01:51] <mantas> crimsun, i think now nicotine's dependencies are wrong
[01:51] <ubuntu> have Load "glx" as well
[01:51] <grepper> ubuntu: ati agpgart is loaded ?
[01:52] <mantas> it should depend on python2.3 not python
[01:53] <ubuntu> agpgart kernel module is loaded but I do not know what you mean by ati
[01:53] <ubuntu> Driver "ati" line is in XF86Config-4
[01:53] <grepper> no, I mean the kernel module
[01:54] <ubuntu> ati module is not loaded let me try
[01:54] <grepper> er, its not ati
[01:54] <ubuntu> ubuntu@ubuntu:~ $ sudo modprobe ati
[01:54] <ubuntu> FATAL: Module ati not found.
[01:54] <grepper> its agpgart
[01:54] <grepper> more specifically the agpgart for your chipset
[01:54] <kezz> ubuntu if i remember a debian howto on ati dri the modules have to be loaded in a certain order
[01:55] <grepper> ubuntu: agpgart, then radeon, then load X
[01:55] <ubuntu> /lib/modules/<IP_ADDRESS>-4-386/kernel/drivers/char/agp/ati-agp.ko what about this one grepper?
[01:55] <grepper> its not going to work if you load the radeon module while in X
[01:55] <grepper> ubuntu: depends
[01:56] <grepper> dmesg|grep agp
[01:56] <ubuntu> Linux agpgart interface v0.100 (c) Dave Jones
[01:56] <ubuntu> agpgart: Detected NVIDIA nForce2 chipset
[01:56] <ubuntu> agpgart: Maximum main memory to use for agp memory: 439M
[01:56] <ubuntu> agpgart: AGP aperture is 64M @ 0xf8000000
[01:57] <grepper> CONFIG_AGP_NVIDIA  I would assume
[01:58] <spikeb> heh
[01:58] <spikeb> this mockup.org thing excites me
[01:58] <grepper> modprobe -l | grep agp  -> see if there is an nvidia specific one
[01:59] <Cervantes_> nuOpus, ndiswrapper isn't just for wireless modems, is it?  And also, how do I do this: "Make sure you have started compiling the kernel sources, so needed header files are present."
[01:59] <ubuntu> /lib/modules/<IP_ADDRESS>-4-386/kernel/drivers/char/agp/nvidia-agp.ko
[01:59] <grepper> is it loaded ?
[01:59] <ubuntu> yes
[02:00] <ubuntu> remove?
[02:00] <ubuntu> :)
[02:00] <grepper> heh, no, just want to make sure it was loaded
[02:01] <vladster> are there additional repositiries that I can use for apt-get
[02:02] <neighborlee> nuOpus, LOL>.yeah gentoo at install time ..RRRRRRRROFL
[02:02] <grepper> ubuntu: what does "glxinfo|grep rendering" say ?
[02:02] <neighborlee> nuOpus, however even that can be circumvented with stage3 etc. <G>
[02:03] <ubuntu> Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0".
[02:03] <ubuntu> Error: couldn't find RGB GLX visual
[02:03] <ubuntu> first repeated several times
[02:03] <grepper> that's from the command above ?
[02:04] <ubuntu> yep
[02:04] <ubuntu> ubuntu@ubuntu:~ $ glxinfo|grep rendering
[02:05] <grepper> ubuntu: what radeon version is it ?
[02:05] <ubuntu> youe mean the hardware?
[02:05] <grepper> yeah
[02:06] <ubuntu> 0000:02:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc Radeon RV100 QY [Radeon 7000/VE]
[02:06] <ArCHoNKoG> ubuntu, i get the same error with glx did you fix it ?
[02:06] <ubuntu> grepper, is trying to help, not solved yet
[02:10] <ArCHoNKoG> any one knows the irc port range
[02:11] <kezz> 6667 onwards usually
[02:11] <kezz> upto about 6670
[02:15] <vladster> are there additional repositiries that I can use for apt-get
[02:15] <kezz> probably
[02:15] <ArCHoNKoG> is anyone gett that error in hoary Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0".
[02:15] <kezz> theres a breakmyubuntu link in the wiki
[02:15] <kezz> that lists some
[02:16] <joujou> anyone using software mixing for sound in FC3 instead of ALSA?
[02:19] <vladster> where is the faq for setting up the NVidia driver
[02:20] <ArCHoNKoG> vladster, http://ubuntuguide.org/#installnvidiadriver
[02:22] <vladster> Now if I can just get the printer working, I would be fines
[02:22] <ArCHoNKoG> how come i can't install icons it tell me about permission deined
[02:25] <ArCHoNKoG> Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0".
[02:25] <ArCHoNKoG> glxgears: Error: couldn't get an RGB, Double-buffered visual.
[02:25] <ArCHoNKoG>  what does that mean anyone ?
[02:26] <siretart> ArCHoNKoG: glx is the opengl extension. You dont have 3d acceleration enabled
[02:26] <lnxduk_> how do I install ubuntu without a cd drive?
[02:26] <ArCHoNKoG> siretart, how do i enable
[02:27] <lnxduk_> I have like 3 floppy disks I can use.. how do I install ubuntu?
[02:27] <siretart> ArCHoNKoG: that depends on your card and its driver
[02:27] <ArCHoNKoG> siretart, 6800 UT
[02:27] <ArCHoNKoG> and the lastest hoary drivers
[02:27] <lnxduk_> no one knows how to do it?
[02:28] <ArCHoNKoG> lnxduk_, sorry i don't
[02:28] <jivera> lnxduk_: You might be able to install Debian and then update to Ubuntu.
[02:28] <siretart> ArCHoNKoG: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/BinaryDriverHowto
[02:28] <ArCHoNKoG> lnxduk_, google it
[02:28] <lnxduk_> I did
[02:29] <lnxduk_> that is a serious problem if you guys require cds...
[02:29] <lnxduk_> can I netboot it?
[02:29] <lnxduk_> I have a wireless laptop on the same network with fbsd
[02:29] <lnxduk_> that I could boot off
[02:30] <lnxduk_> basically I ran out of cd-r's
[02:30] <lnxduk_> I have a cd-rw, but it fails to load vmlinuz
[02:30] <lnxduk_> can I burn the iso on a dvd-r?
[02:31] <siretart> lnxduk_: you could try this one: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hoary/main/daily-installer-i386/current/images/netboot/
[02:32] <siretart> lnxduk_: or for warty, better try this one first: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/warty/main/installer-i386/release/images/netboot/
[02:32] <benjanet> my evolution dosent forget passwords...can i fix it ?
[02:33] <lnxduk_> unfortunately
[02:33] <lnxduk_> I have no clue what to do :(
[02:33] <lnxduk_> I'm reburing to the cd-rw, I just hope that works
[02:34] <lnxduk_> is there a way to do loadlin from dos?
[02:34] <jivera> benjanet: Isn't there an option in the menus somewhere?
[02:34] <jivera> lnxduk_: What's running on the machine right now?
[02:35] <lnxduk_> windows xp
[02:35] <lnxduk_> but I can do a dos floppy boot
[02:36] <lnxduk_> actually... can I just download a tar for the root filesystem then extract it?
[02:36] <lnxduk_> I have tomsrtbt linux on floppy...
[02:36] <jivera> It has a CD-ROM, right?
[02:36] <jivera> It just fails when booting from a CD-RW?
[02:37] <lnxduk_> yes
[02:37] <lnxduk_> can I burn the iso on a dvd?\
[02:38] <jivera> Dunno, I've never used a DVD burner.
[02:38] <lnxduk_> what about a tar?
[02:38] <siretart> lnxduk_: I think that would work, but I think you should better setup a tftp server and do a network installation
[02:38] <lnxduk_> can I download a tar.gz of the root filesystem
[02:38] <lnxduk_> I don't really know how to netboot so easily
[02:38] <lnxduk_> the dhcp server is a router
[02:39] <lnxduk_> and the netboot has no options
[02:39] <lnxduk_> I netbooted a sun once, but those are great, they let your specify the ip address and image to use
[02:40] <siretart> lnxduk_: http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/en.i386/ch04s06.html, and the rest of the manual
[02:40] <siretart> lnxduk_: ubuntu is using debian installer, so the documentation applies mostly for ubuntu too
[02:41] <nde> hmm
[02:41] <steve__> cd /etc/sysconfig
[02:42] <nde> how can i tell what packages i have installed ?
[02:42] <benjanet> jivera, fixed, thanks
[02:42] <siretart> lnxduk_: if your network card's having problems with netbooting, create a floppy for it at http://rom-o-matic.org
[02:42] <lnxduk_> hmm ok, I'll bookmark it, I have to go try the cdrw again now.. I hope it works
[02:42] <nde> pkginfo and rpm -qa dont work ;)
[02:42] <steve__> oops, wrong window
[02:42] <siretart> steve__: obviously ;)
[02:42] <lnxduk_> siretart: ah that is a good idea, the dhcp server is a router, so it can't run tftp though
[02:43] <siretart> lnxduk_: ?
[02:43] <setite> anyone here listen to country music?
[02:43] <vladster> xmms just broke
[02:43] <vladster> 'libmikmod.so.2: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[02:43] <vladster> Inconsistency detected by ld.so: ../sysdeps/generic/dl-tls.c: 72: _dl_next_tls_modid: Assertion `result <= _rtld_local._dl_tls_max_dtv_idx' failed!
[02:43] <lnxduk_> I don't know how I would boot off a computer running tftp that is not running dhcp
[02:43] <lnxduk_> since the computer I need to boot only net boots off dhcp
[02:44] <nde> guys ?
[02:44] <steve__> Ubanto detected my centrino wireless just fine and hooked me up to the neighbors wap.  Mine doesnt broadcat its ssid, where do I need to set it?
[02:44] <setite> i think all the gurus went to bed
[02:44] <siretart> vladster: do you use the nvidia binary driver?
[02:44] <nde> can anyone what i can use instead of rpm -qa or pkginfo ?
[02:44] <crimsun> nde: dpkg?
[02:44] <setite> whats wrong with your neighbors wap
[02:44] <crimsun> nde: what are you attempting to accomplish?
[02:44] <setite> hehe sounds good to me
[02:45] <nde> i wanna see what version of gnome i have
[02:45] <nde> well
[02:45] <nde> i wanna be able to see whatever version whatever piece of software i have is :)
 dont mind using it till I figure it out but at some point I want access to my other boxen inside my net.
[02:46] <crimsun> nde: COLUMNS=200 dpkg -l $package|grep ^ii|awk -F' ' '{print $3}'
[02:46] <crimsun> nde: ...or use apt-cache policy or Synaptic or aptitude or dselect or ...
[02:46] <siretart> vladster: seriously, do you use the nvidia binary driver on your machine?
[02:46] <nde> heh
[02:47] <nde> still a lot to learn
[02:47] <nde> whoever said all *nix was alike!
[02:47] <nde> ;)
[02:48] <nde> thx crimsun
[02:48] <crimsun> np
[02:50] <setite> siretart - is there any other kind of nvidia driver?
[02:50] <siretart> setite: yes, there are to: one is called nv and the other one nvidia
[02:50] <siretart> s/to/two/
[02:51] <setite> ahhh... is nv the default one not made by nvidia
[02:51] <siretart> setite: yes, nv is developed by xorg/xfree. opensource and supported by the community
[02:55] <vladster_> I tried running the open drivers and the games get way too choppy to play
[02:56] <vladster_> got sick once
[02:56] <vladster_> the binaries help me keep my lunch down
[02:58] <vladster_> is there an alternative to gnome?>
[02:59] <|rufius|> vladster_: many.... fluxbox, blackbox, kde, icewm
[02:59] <vladster_> what is a good fast alternative
[02:59] <crimsun> xfce
[02:59] <siretart> wmaker
[02:59] <crimsun> icewm
[03:00] <siretart> fluxbox
[03:01] <ArCHoNKoG> gnome > kde
[03:01] <jivera> ArCHoNKoG: Wrong.
[03:01] <jivera> Gnome >> KDE. ;-)
[03:01] <siretart> vladster_: for your xmms problem, see https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1724
[03:01] <ArCHoNKoG> ok ok
[03:06] <makhand> Hey everybody! I'm trying to install the multisync package and am having trouble with the usual ./configure, make, make install . Is something different in Ubuntu?
[03:07] <GoneBoB> did you install build-essential
[03:07] <crimsun> makhand: warty?
[03:07] <GoneBoB> that has the compiler, make, etc in it
[03:07] <El_Che> quick question: is it a known problem that you can not connect to server (mount) over sftp with nautilus (i remember the same problem in debian unstable with 2.6)
[03:07] <makhand> yes, warty
[03:07] <makhand> gonebob, was that for me?
[03:07] <GoneBoB> makhand: yes
[03:07] <makhand> no, I guess not. let me try
[03:07] <crimsun> hmm, 'multisync' is in 'hoary/universe'
[03:08] <crimsun> unfortunately not in 'warty' at all
[03:08] <crimsun> should be relatively simple to grab the source from 'hoary' and create a deb, however.
[03:09] <makhand> crimsun, i'm pretty new and wouldnt even know where to start
[03:09] <crimsun> makhand: it's up to you.
[03:10] <crimsun> I can build a deb for you if you'd like
[03:11] <makhand> wow, that would be very nice, crimsun
[03:12] <makhand> here's what i'm gettting: mak@linux:~/src/multisync $ sudo make install
[03:12] <crimsun> makhand: I'll need about 10 mins
[03:12] <makhand> make: *** No rule to make target `install'.  Stop.
[03:12] <crimsun> makhand: did you run ./configure ?
[03:12] <makhand> yes, i did
[03:12] <makhand> and I'm trying to do the next step
[03:13] <crimsun> did ./configure finish successfully?
[03:13] <gilgamesh> back... got enigmail running, now I'm just trying to figure out why GPA doesn't allow me to search keyservers... piece of shit
[03:13] <jivera> gpa?
[03:13] <gilgamesh> GNU Privacy Assistant == gnome front-end for gpg
[03:13] <makhand> crimsun, i guess i didnt run it after i got build-essential
[03:13] <jivera> Ah.
[03:13] <crimsun> makhand :)
[03:14] <makhand> looks like I need to get some other stuff.
[03:14] <gilgamesh> It's really quite dreadful... but since gpgkeys and seahorse are worse, there really is a lack of good gui tools for key management
[03:14] <crimsun> makhand: let me know whether you want to build the package manually using ./configure && make install
[03:15] <makhand> crimsun, thank you for the offer, I'll try to build it for a while. if it doenst work, I guess i'll be needing your assistance :)
[03:15] <crimsun> makhand: ok.
[03:17] <El_Che> no nautilus gurus around?
[03:17] <Adrenal> how do i install a .deb
[03:17] <Adrenal> ?
[03:17] <jivera> Adrenal: 'sudo dpkg -i foo.deb'.
[03:17] <Adrenal> cheers
[03:17] <nde> dpkg -i pkg.deb
[03:17] <nde> im so slow :P
[03:17] <nde> need sleep
[03:21] <setite> whats dpkg...
[03:21] <setite> compared to apt-get
[03:21] <crimsun> apt-get uses dpkg
[03:21] <setite> dpkg... debian package?
[03:21] <crimsun> dpkg is the actual package manager; apt-get resolves dependencies
[03:21] <crimsun> yep
[03:21] <setite> ahhhh
[03:22] <setite> anyone using 32bit chroot or whatever its called
[03:22] <crimsun> rather, apt-get uses apt which uses dpkg.
[03:22] <setite> i think that was why opera wouldnt work when i was using fedora
[03:22] <setite> i will have my ubuntu rig next week
[03:22] <crimsun> you're on amd64?
[03:22] <setite> whenever the watercoolign comes
[03:22] <setite> i will be
[03:23] <setite> my harddrive crapped out when i was using fedora
[03:23] <setite> i didnt like fedora though
[03:23] <crimsun> yeah, unless opera provides a 32-bit version, you'll have to run it in a 32-bit chroot
[03:23] <setite> you meant 64-bit version... but yea they dont have one
[03:23] <setite> i was wondering who had 32bit chroot... because i was wondering how hard it is
[03:24] <makhand> crimsun, its asking for a libgnomeui-2.0. cant seem to locate it
[03:24] <setite> too bad ubuntu 64 doesnt install it by default
[03:24] <kleedrac> Anyone have experience with running WineX under Ubuntu?
[03:24] <crimsun> kleedrac: only cedega
[03:24] <ArCHoNKoG> kleedrac, yes
[03:24] <crimsun> kleedrac: though I ran winex under sid for ages
[03:25] <setite> sid
[03:25] <kleedrac> ArCHoNKoG, crimsun: Anything interesting I should know about
[03:25] <setite> no surround sound
[03:25] <setite> thats interesting to me
[03:25] <setite> which is why i have to dual boot
[03:25] <ArCHoNKoG> kleedrac, nope don't do in hoary just in warty
[03:25] <setite> im addicted to surround sound FPS
[03:26] <kleedrac> ArCHoNKoG: I'm only running hoary ... mebbe that's why I'm running into problems
[03:26] <setite> yup
[03:26] <ArCHoNKoG> kleedrac, yes its a headers and glibc error
[03:26] <setite> archonkog - you a whitewolf guy?
[03:26] <makhand> crimsun, its asking for a libgnomeui-2.0. cant seem to locate it
[03:26] <ArCHoNKoG> setite, whitewolf ?
[03:26] <crimsun> makhand: sorry, lemme chroot. sec.
[03:26] <setite> the pen and paper rpg
[03:26] <kleedrac> ArCHoNKoG: Any easy fix?  I don't want to downgrade back to warty if I don't have to
[03:26] <makhand> ok
[03:27] <crimsun> oh wait
[03:27] <crimsun> makhand: install 'libgnomeui-dev'
[03:27] <setite> archon is a vampire thing... i assumed thats where you got it from
[03:27] <ArCHoNKoG> kleedrac, so far no
[03:27] <kleedrac> ArCHoNKoG: I've got winex3 installed properly ... it just won't run the Diablo II installer
[03:27] <makhand> ok
[03:27] <sophacles> hi all. new to ubuntu. just want to say, nice installer y'all got
[03:27] <setite> kleedrac... try cedega cvs perhaps?
[03:28] <setite> whats cvs stand for
[03:28] <crimsun> cvs - Concurrent Versions System
[03:28] <kleedrac> setite: Concurrent Versioning System
[03:28] <kleedrac> lol
[03:28] <kleedrac> crimsun: You owe me a coke :)
[03:28] <setite> hmmm... slightly different answers
[03:28] <crimsun> kleedrac: mine obviously appeared before yours on my screen ;)
[03:28] <setite> version, versions or versioning
[03:29] <kleedrac> Mine too actually :)
[03:29] <setite> i saw crimsun first
[03:29] <zenrox> kleedrac,  on my screen first
[03:29] <setite> odd... screwy irc
[03:29] <lnxduk_> I got it to work\
[03:29] <setite> awesome
[03:29] <lnxduk_> stupid cdrw was bad
[03:29] <setite> got what to work
[03:29] <lnxduk_> used a different one
[03:29] <setite> haha
[03:29] <lnxduk_> ubuntu
[03:30] <lnxduk_> arg
[03:30] <setite> that would be a problem
[03:30] <lnxduk_> and the dvdr wouldn't allow me to burn the iso
[03:30] <setite> so lemme guess
[03:30] <lnxduk_> so I don't have x yet
[03:30] <setite> you tried several progs and all that
[03:30] <setite> to find it was bad media?
[03:30] <lnxduk_> and I'm a little pissed that it didn't let me select the packages
[03:30] <setite> wah wah
[03:30] <setite> :)
[03:30] <lnxduk_> no, only one program
[03:30] <lnxduk_> 3 tries
[03:30] <lnxduk_> at 4x burn speed
[03:31] <lnxduk_> so x isn't on it by default?
[03:31] <setite> is k3b or xcdroast or somethign as featured as the programs for windows
[03:31] <setite> is there an mp3cd burner prog that converts on the fly?
[03:31] <lnxduk_> used nero
[03:31] <setite> nero for linux?
[03:31] <lnxduk_> no, windows...
[03:31] <lnxduk_> I'm installing linux
[03:31] <setite> wtf
[03:31] <setite> ok
[03:32] <lnxduk_> yeah
[03:32] <setite> oh
[03:32] <setite> haha
[03:32] <setite> i see
[03:32] <setite> your having trouble burnin the ubuntu installer?
[03:32] <lnxduk_> I did, was a bad disk
[03:32] <setite> haha... i had that problem with fedora
[03:32] <setite> wasted five dvdrs
[03:32] <lnxduk_> it works now I'm in ubuntu now
[03:32] <lnxduk_> haha 5
[03:32] <setite> turned out my mobo was missing a resistor
[03:32] <lnxduk_> that's a lot of money
[03:32] <setite> screwed up all my ide processes
[03:32] <makhand> ok, crimsun, if you're still there and up for helping me, here's where i am now: mak@linux:~/src/multisync $ sudo make install
[03:32] <makhand> Making install in src
[03:32] <makhand> make[1] : Entering directory `/home/mak/src/multisync/src'
[03:32] <makhand> Makefile:270: *** missing separator.   We use it for debugging.
[03:37] <GoneBoB> you can't change the size of files or add the
[03:37] <GoneBoB> m
[03:37] <lnxduk_> I'm running 2.6.8
[03:38] <setite> why is ntfs writing such a taboo
[03:38] <zenrox> lnxduk_,  i am usingthe hoary branch
[03:38] <lnxduk_> what branch is good?
[03:38] <GoneBoB> setite: it's not a taboo it's just not supported
[03:38] <setite> cancel out the taboo word
[03:38] <zenrox> micho owns the pattit on ntfs
[03:38] <lifeless> setite: because its so easy to get wrong.
[03:38] <lnxduk_> I have warty
[03:38] <setite> its taboo for the fedora folks
[03:38] <lifeless> setite: the current code corrupts the ntfs database.
[03:38] <lnxduk_> fedora sucks
[03:38] <makhand> crimsun, so for name, who's do i put? and what exactly goes in the 'code'?
[03:38] <setite> i dont know if it sucks.. but the people in its channel do
[03:38] <crimsun> makhand: you put your own nick for name, and the code is the error.
[03:39] <lnxduk_> I can't stand it
[03:39] <lnxduk_> I like debian though
[03:39] <lnxduk_> so I figured I would try this
[03:39] <setite> i didnt like having to redownload my mp3s
[03:39] <lnxduk_> so use fat32
[03:39] <setite> why
[03:39] <setite> ubuntu reads ntfs
[03:39] <setite> no need
[03:39] <lifeless> http://linux-ntfs.sourceforge.net/status.html
[03:39] <lnxduk_> well any distro can
[03:39] <zenrox> http://www.jankratochvil.net/project/captive/ <check this out
[03:39] <setite> and having to figure out how to use yum just to get xmms-mp3
[03:39] <nde> windows must die :P
[03:39] <lifeless> setite: also NT can read ext3
[03:40] <setite> lnx - can but dont
[03:40] <lnxduk_> they can though...
[03:40] <lnxduk_> I did it on redhat 8
[03:40] <setite> but they dont
[03:40] <lifeless> http://uranus.it.swin.edu.au/~jn/linux/ext2ifs.htm
[03:40] <setite> see i like when the developers make smart choices
[03:40] <setite> the less i have to do to get started the better
[03:40] <makhand> crimsun, i pasted and pushed send, now what?
[03:40] <lnxduk_> it's not like you can't recompile the kernel with ntfs read support though
[03:41] <setite> you seem to forget... some people dont get a thrill out of havign to make it all work themselves
[03:41] <setite> i like things to just work whenever possible
[03:41] <lnxduk_> my monitor can do 800x600 at 60hz
[03:41] <lnxduk_> that is its best
[03:41] <setite> wow
[03:41] <crimsun> makhand: let me look over it.
[03:41] <lnxduk_> it's 14in
[03:41] <lnxduk_> but the picture is only 11
[03:41] <setite> the livecd made me stick to 640x480 at 100hz
[03:42] <setite> i couldnt even see the whole synaptic window
[03:42] <zenrox> biger montors help
[03:42] <crimsun> makhand: the first thing I recommend you do is `rm -rf ~/src/multisync'
[03:42] <lnxduk_> I have dual 17" at school though
[03:42] <setite> my monitor is fine... livecd cant handle this shitty emachines onboard graphics
[03:42] <zenrox> setite,  did fine with mine
[03:42] <setite> suse livecd was fine
[03:42] <crimsun> makhand: you might have to `sudo rm -rf ~mak/src/multisync'
[03:42] <setite> well zenrox... your lucky
[03:42] <setite> i couldnt
[03:42] <zenrox> emachine d2040
[03:43] <occy> nomasteryoda, w00p, excited about using your lappie to get my lappie working with ubuntu :)
[03:43] <setite> t2682
[03:43] <zenrox> i846gl mobo made buy FIC
[03:43] <crimsun> makhand: then untar the source again, run `./configure', and `make' as normal user instead of under sudo
[03:43] <setite> all i knwo is i have intel extreme graphics
[03:43] <lnxduk_> I was on a 120mhz computer before I got this one though...
[03:43] <lnxduk_> at least the computer is fast
[03:43] <crimsun> sup occy, how was New Year's?
[03:43] <makhand> ok
[03:43] <occy> crimsun, heyaz bud.  It was pretty good.  We played a private party.
[03:43] <zenrox> setite,  the live cd makes it use drive i810
[03:43] <occy> crimsun, our band that is.
[03:44] <crimsun> occy: cool :)
[03:44] <zenrox> thats why
[03:44] <occy> My throat is dead now though :(
[03:44] <occy> sang too much
[03:44] <crimsun> all in the name of celebration :)
[03:44] <occy> hehe
[03:44] <zenrox> sweet
[03:44] <setite> i819?
[03:44] <setite> i810*
[03:44] <setite> drive?
[03:44] <zenrox> i810
[03:44] <briareus> hey all, i have a problem in ubuntu. sudo apt-get install anything prompts me for password, user password. I am not in a root terminal. thoughts?
[03:44] <setite> do you mean driver
[03:44] <occy> crimsun, nomasteryoda <-- lives near me and has the same laptop.  Going to either swap hard drives for an install, or use his cd.
[03:44] <zenrox> yep
[03:44] <lnxduk_> ooh got x working got to go
[03:45] <crimsun> occy: excellent :)
[03:45] <setite> yea well mine just says something abotu vesa when starting
[03:45] <xed_work> Hello!  I am requiring assitance installint Ubuntu!
[03:45] <setite> and it finds all the proper modes
[03:45] <xed_work> the Live CD works fine on my laptop
[03:45] <occy> yeah, I'm bummed about the cd... but happy to have an option to get it working.
[03:45] <setite> it just boots to 640x480 and wont let me switch
[03:45] <xed_work> now I wish to install it.
[03:45] <xed_work> ANy help sirs?
[03:46] <occy> crimsun, does apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade keep your kernel up-to-date.... or do you have to manually do that?
[03:46] <setite> can livecd be used to install?
[03:46] <zenrox> setite,  for me it find my montor and i845gl vid card (i845g/gl) and only gives me 1186x700something
[03:46] <setite> i was under the impression that the ubuntu livecd doesnt have that option
[03:46] <setite> however i know very little
[03:46] <setite>  Intel 845GV is what i have
[03:46] <crimsun> occy: update & upgrade will do fine
[03:46] <crimsun> occy: you're running warty, correct?
[03:46] <setite> so mine should work damnit
[03:47] <occy> crimsun, ahh ok.
[03:47] <occy> crimsun, yah... I should probably stick with it instead of hoary.
[03:47] <setite> well it doesnt
[03:47] <zenrox> SysInfo: uname: Linux 2.6.9-1-686 CPU: Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU 2.00GHz 1993.016 MHz Bogomips: 3948.54 Mem: 190/497M [||||||||||]  Diskspace: 36.86G Free: 29.71G Procs: 80 Uptime: 1 day 21 hrs 1 min 26 secs Load: 1.02 1.42 1.83  Screen: Intel Corp. 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G] /GE Chipset Integrated Graphics Device (rev 03) Screen Resolution: 1600x1200 (24 bpp) eth0: In: 3.75G Out: 408.16M
[03:47] <setite> thats all i know
[03:47] <setite> so im stuck on windwos until i can get my other rig working
[03:47] <makhand> crimsun, i have a new error output in pastebin
[03:47] <xed_work> has anyone installed Ubuntu on to their hardrive somehow?   This is for a laptop
[03:47] <occy> crimsun, or do you feel it might be stable enough?
[03:47] <occy> I had an idea for debian a long time ago...
[03:47] <xed_work> has anyone installed Ubuntu on to their hardrive somehow?   This is for a laptop
[03:47] <setite> yea keep showing off
[03:48] <occy> There should be a web page... that gives you a "Green LIght" or "Red Light" or "Yellow Light"  for apt-get dist-upgrade with unstable.
[03:48] <setite> i understand that it worked for you... but im tellign you that it doesnt for me
[03:48] <crimsun> occy: not quite stable enough yet
[03:48] <crimsun> occy: it tends to be even more bleeding-edge than sid+experimental, which is impressive
[03:48] <occy> crimsun, the cool thing would be... You could have people do voting to say how they feel things are working for them at present.
[03:48] <setite> perhaps there is a command i can boot with that will work better... perhaps force it into another mode.... but i wouldnt know it
[03:48] <briareus> does ubuntu have a default root password? it never prompted me for one during install, only for user name and user password.
[03:48] <occy> crimsun, hehe
[03:48] <crimsun> briareus: no. It uses `sudo' by default.
[03:48] <occy> crimsun, did that make sense?
[03:49] <briareus> crimsun, so there is no going root?
[03:49] <crimsun> occy: sure.
[03:49] <setite> sudo is root
[03:49] <occy> briareus, sudo su -
[03:49] <occy> briareus, and you can get full root access
[03:49] <briareus> ok
[03:49] <setite> wtf
[03:49] <crimsun> briareus: sudo -s, passwd foo, exit, su
[03:49] <setite> now im confuzzled
[03:49] <setite> ah well what else is new
[03:50] <occy> yeah, I like how ubuntu does that... I've not logged in as root in ages on a box anyway.
[03:50] <xed_work> Is there any particular reason for the lack of operators in this channel?
[03:50] <maikhai> tui ne!  Seems fine.
[03:52] <setite> verr.... fdisk perhaps?
[03:52] <lifeless> xed_work: perhaps you could describe your symptoms, so that folk can help.
[03:52] <Verr-> fdisk?
[03:52] <kleedrac> Verr: re-install and tell Ubuntu to take the whole hard drive
[03:52] <occy> crimsun, ubuntu has me feeling like I'm back in the Linux community again. :)
[03:52] <setite> oh you mean that grub lost it?
[03:52] <xed_work> lifeless: I just did that, should I type it in again...?
[03:52] <Verr-> So no any other ways to format c: ?
[03:52] <cavediver> However. I can't find midnight commander. Is it not availible?
[03:52] <setite> occy?
[03:53] <setite> how so
[03:53] <Verr-> My boot doesnt use grub anymore :/
[03:53] <occy> setite, sorry?
[03:53] <lifeless> xed_work: no, that crossed on the wire.
[03:53] <kleedrac> Verr: Sure you can boot from a windows boot disk and fdisk the windows partition to oblivion
[03:53] <Verr-> windws outted its own boot sys there
[03:53] <xed_work> lifeless: What does that mean?
[03:53] <setite> verr- just like that... it stopped starting via grub
[03:53] <crimsun> occy: are you familiar with apt-listbugs(1) ?
[03:53] <nomasteryoda> occy, hey ya
[03:53] <xed_work> lifeless: 'crossed on the wire' what does that exactly mean?
[03:53] <Verr-> :/
[03:53] <setite> haha damn windows
[03:53] <occy> crimsun, I reckon not buddy.
[03:53] <setite> its taking over!!!!
[03:53] <occy> nomasteryoda, ;)
[03:53] <lifeless> xed_work: what is the last screen you see before it goes blank ?
[03:53] <Verr-> yeah. :D
[03:53] <Verr-> Greedy winXP
[03:53] <setite> hmmm well can you just pop the ubuntu installer back it...
[03:53] <setite> in*
[03:53] <Verr-> Wants to be the only one
[03:53] <lifeless> xed_work: and if you press the CTRL key, does it stop being blank ?
[03:54] <crimsun> occy: it does something in the vein of what you seek for upgrades
[03:54] <setite> perhaps a rescue would fix grub?
[03:54] <occy> crimsun, ahhh
[03:54] <Verr-> grub is okay
[03:54] <crimsun> occy: highly, highly recommended in addition to apt-listchanges(8)
[03:54] <setite> it is?
[03:54] <setite> i thought you said it was gone
[03:54] <crimsun> err, apt-listchanges(1)
[03:54] <xed_work> lifeless: I press the CTRL key nothing happens.  Prior to this blank screen, is the BOOT menu.  I just press enter and it echos some stuff...then it goes blank.
[03:54] <lifeless> xed_work: 'cross on the wire' - IRC lets me type something and hit enter, before you I see what you had already typed
[03:54] <occy> crimsun what does the (1) signify?
[03:54] <xed_work> Look above.
[03:54] <lifeless> xed_work: so its after the reboot ?
[03:54] <Verr-> its replaced by windows own.. :/
[03:54] <Verr-> So i cant choose linux
[03:54] <setite> so grub isnt working
[03:54] <xed_work> lifeless: Yes, after the reboot, the CD is activated and the Ubuntu splash screen appears.
[03:55] <crimsun> occy: I just use it to denote what type of program it is; sometimes I use it to denote a man page.
[03:55] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, there is a way
[03:55] <Verr-> cd is somewhere in my room :/
[03:55] <occy> crimsun, ahhh, nice.
[03:55] <xed_work> lifeless: I press the enter key, I see some stuff and then the screen goes blank.  I am on a laptop, btw.
[03:55] <occy> crimsun, figured that was what you were hinting at ;)
[03:55] <lifeless> xed_work: what is the stuff you see ?
[03:55] <setite> nomasteryoda - you take it.. hehe i have no idea what to do... i still havent been able to use ubuntu so i dont know what its installer can do
[03:56] <xed_work> lifeless: Like, loading balh blah .z stuff, I can't really remember, it scrolls by fast.
[03:56] <nomasteryoda> lol
[03:56] <xed_work> lifeless: But when I hit CTRL + ALT + DEL, it restarts.
[03:56] <setite> i know that fedora could, in such a case, fix the MBT or whatever that thing is... so that GRUB could regain control
[03:56] <lifeless> xed_work: what happens if you hit CTRL-ALT-BACKSPACE ?
[03:56] <kleedrac> setite: MBR and I don't recommend Fedora anymore :)
[03:56] <xed_work> lifeless: Also note that the Live CD boots and runs fine.
[03:56] <setite> MBR yea thats it
[03:56] <setite> i dont recommend fedora either
[03:56] <Verr-> Gaah
[03:57] <Verr-> Cant find cd :/
[03:57] <xed_work> lifeless: NOthing happens...
[03:57] <setite> it had a really nice installer... but thats where it ended
[03:57] <xed_work> lifeless: ...when I press CTRL + ALT + BACKSPACE
[03:57] <setite> hmmmm well there are windows progs that might work
[03:57] <Verr-> Internet doesnt work with winxp :/
[03:57] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, let me understand the problem
[03:57] <setite> lemme see if one of the progs i have can fix the MBR
[03:57] <Quest-Master> I'd be willing to do the graphics if the developers began to do a graphical installer similar to SuSE or Mandrake's.
[03:57] <Verr-> So i want format my c:
[03:57] <Quest-Master> I must say-- a distribution is almost ALWAYS judged by how the installer works/looks.
[03:57] <xed_work> Verr-: you are THE man.
[03:57] <Verr-> But windows is in it and doesnt let me do that
[03:57] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, did you install winxp after ubuntu>
[03:58] <Verr-> Yeah
[03:58] <Quest-Master> Ubuntu's gets lots of points since it works awesomely.
[03:58] <lifeless> xed_work: ok, I'm not sure whats up here, maybe someone else can help more.. sorry.
[03:58] <Quest-Master> :)
[03:58] <setite> verr... right click the a: drive with a floppy in it
[03:58] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, so the windows drive is NTFS?
[03:58] <nomasteryoda> by default
[03:58] <Verr-> yeah
[03:58] <setite> and format it selected the boot disk feature
[03:58] <xed_work> lifeless: Do you know of any compatability issue with any laptops?
[03:58] <nomasteryoda> 2 partitions?
[03:58] <setite> i believe with that you can format the drive... btu you would still
[03:59] <setite> you want to format
[03:59] <setite> that wouldnt fix the problem though right
[03:59] <Verr-> That would
[03:59] <Verr-> It would boot with grub again and tada
[03:59] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, if you have them both, wait
[03:59] <nomasteryoda> yea
[03:59] <nomasteryoda> that would work.. but you can use winxp boot loader
[03:59] <lifeless> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HardwareSupportMachinesLaptops
[03:59] <Verr-> boot loader?
[03:59] <nomasteryoda> looking for the link
[03:59] <nomasteryoda> yea
[03:59] <setite> yea...
[04:00] <setite> i want to use the damn ubuntu livecd
[04:00] <setite> now im thinking abotu it again im kinda mad
[04:00] <xed_work> setite: You can order it for free, that's what i did.
[04:00] <setite> order what for free
[04:00] <Verr-> so where can i use bootloader?
[04:00] <nomasteryoda> k
[04:00] <nomasteryoda> here
[04:00] <nomasteryoda> http://mgalug.org/blog/2?from=30
[04:01] <setite> i have the ubuntu installer on a cd... and the livecd... but i cant install ubuntu on this pc as i dont own it...
[04:01] <nomasteryoda> Not ubuntu, but it works
[04:01] <lifeless> xed_work: ^^that wiki page lists compatability with toshibas
[04:01] <setite> there is a lug here in vegas
[04:01] <nomasteryoda> http://jaeger.morpheus.net/linux/ntldr.php
[04:01] <setite> but it looks like a bunch of 50 year old white guys
[04:01] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, I have done this .. that is my blog
[04:01] <setite> no offense but thats not my scene
[04:01] <nomasteryoda> setite, lol
[04:02] <Verr-> nomasteryoda ?
[04:02] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, yea
[04:02] <Verr-> Cant anyone tell how to format my windows :/
[04:02] <Verr-> shouldnt be that hard
[04:02] <setite> any bootloader would work right
[04:02] <Verr-> yeah
[04:02] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, do you have the Ultimate Boot CD?
[04:02] <setite> does ubuntu start as slow as fedora
[04:02] <nomasteryoda> no
[04:02] <lifeless> Verr-: the ubuntu install will wipe windows by default
[04:02] <setite> see i love linux... but that shit took forever to load
[04:03] <setite> like 10 times longer than windows
[04:03] <xed_work> lifeless: Thanks, I got it =)
[04:03] <setite> literally
[04:03] <Verr-> I hjavent the cd again...
[04:03] <lifeless> Verr-: ah.
[04:03] <JoePenguin> setite: windows still takes time to load after the GUI comes up
[04:03] <lifeless> Verr-: are you running ubuntu ?
[04:03] <briareus> whats the command to restart the network in ubuntu?
[04:03] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, if yo setup the bootloader like Jaeger says...
[04:03] <Verr-> bootloader?
[04:03] <setite> well it may still be loading but at least i can get on and start chatting and surfing the web
[04:04] <Verr-> Where do i use it?
[04:04] <setite> on this pc it takes forever to load
[04:04] <setite> but my other rig it was like 30 seconds
[04:04] <briareus> hello - whats the command to restart the network in ubuntu?
[04:04] <Verr-> i just need advice where to get partitionprogram or console to write format c:
[04:05] <crimsun> briareus: invoke-rc.d networking restart
[04:05] <setite> verr- why do you want to format
[04:05] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, look at the bottom section of Jaeger's site
[04:05] <setite> are you trying to get rid of windows?
[04:05] <Verr-> yeah
[04:05] <setite> oh!
[04:05] <setite> well shit i didnt know that
[04:05] <Verr-> I reinstall it after some hard thinking
[04:05] <nomasteryoda> auh, man we though you wanted to keep it as dual boot
[04:05] <setite> yea
[04:05] <nomasteryoda> excellent
[04:05] <Verr-> Not this time
[04:05] <setite> thats what i thought
[04:06] <nomasteryoda> so you have Ubuntu disk
[04:06] <Verr-> This is pirate windows
[04:06] <Verr-> no i still havent :/
[04:06] <nomasteryoda> lol
[04:06] <nomasteryoda> you mean demo
[04:06] <nomasteryoda> hehe
[04:06] <setite> verr - i havent owned windows since win95
[04:06] <setite> not legally i mean
[04:06] <nomasteryoda> i just found win98 with key in dumpster tonight
[04:06] <Verr-> My original win lost when i "started trying to do partitions"
[04:06] <setite> i believe that anything that i HAVE to use should be free
[04:06] <Verr-> I have still product key.
[04:07] <setite> hmmmm lemem see if i can create a partition magic floppy for you
[04:07] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, yes... Ubuntu will wipe it out for you
[04:07] <Verr-> But...
[04:07] <setite> oh yea the installer can do it
[04:07] <Verr-> i havent the CD!
[04:07] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, you can download Ultimate BootCD
[04:07] <setite> then your fucked anyway
[04:07] <Verr-> Can realize?
[04:07] <Verr-> And havent internet
[04:07] <nomasteryoda> LOL
[04:07] <Verr-> ...
[04:07] <nomasteryoda> crap
[04:07] <Verr-> This windows sucks!
[04:07] <nomasteryoda> where are you man?
[04:08] <Verr-> I scratch it from my HD with NAILS!
[04:08] <Verr-> at home
[04:08] <setite> hehe i mean if you format the first partition i dont know if DOS can find ubuntu on the second partition
[04:08] <Verr-> It can
[04:08] <Verr-> If not then i search for the cd
[04:08] <Verr-> its somewhere here
[04:08] <setite> thats what id suggest
[04:09] <Verr-> so no other ways to format C:?
[04:09] <setite> well yea
[04:09] <setite> you can get a bootable floppy that can format
[04:09] <drspin> I can't login!
[04:09] <Verr-> :/
[04:09] <drspin> something about.Xiceauthority or something like that :/ what do I do?
[04:09] <setite> hmmmm....
[04:10] <setite> i have a warez proggie i found yesterday for a buddy to install ubuntu
[04:10] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, you need discs man
[04:10] <crimsun> drspin: have you rebooted?
[04:10] <setite> he used it to partition
[04:10] <Verr-> :D
[04:10] <setite> it has a thing for modifying the MBR
[04:10] <nomasteryoda> setite, no warz man
[04:10] <setite> shit nvm i have partition magic
[04:10] <nomasteryoda> Ultimate Boot CD will allow him to wipe the drive
[04:10] <setite> hey man when you need something to format you do what you have to
[04:10] <nomasteryoda> then reinstall
[04:10] <setite> but how does he get that
[04:10] <spikeb> i have this system rescue cd :)
[04:11] <nomasteryoda> well, find a friend who can download it
[04:11] <IBOIC> hiya
[04:11] <nomasteryoda> less than 50mb
[04:11] <IBOIC> any of u familiar with pgp or gnupg?
[04:11] <Verr-> Crap
[04:11] <crimsun> IBOIC: yes. What do you need?
[04:11] <Verr-> Where the heck did i put it :/
[04:11] <IBOIC> crimsun:  does gnupg work fine with ubuntu and is it available in apt-get ?
[04:11] <IBOIC> i take it, it may be in the universe packages?
[04:11] <lifeless> IBOIC: yes and yes
[04:12] <crimsun> IBOIC: it's in 'main'
[04:12] <IBOIC> ok great :) will get hoary when its in final :)
[04:12] <setite> imma see if i can create a partitionmagic floppy
[04:12] <IBOIC> i have warty but it doesnt work so i use windows xp for the time being
[04:12] <IBOIC> anyways
[04:12] <jivera> IBOIC: What do you need encryption for?
[04:12] <crimsun> *** 1.2.4-4ubuntu2 0 500 http://archive.ubuntu.com warty/main Packages
[04:12] <setite> man i think im just gonna clear some space and install ubuntu on this rig
[04:12] <setite> im tired of waiting
[04:12] <drspin> could someone help me, I can't login to Gnome!!
[04:13] <Verr-> Crap i remember how i said to bro : "this is important CD dun touch this"
[04:13] <setite> how many gigs should i clear for it
[04:13] <Verr-> And put it to somewhere -.-
[04:13] <Verr-> CRAP
[04:13] <crimsun> drspin: you never answered my question.
[04:13] <drspin> crimsun: sorry - what was the question?
[04:13] <setite> can you really spin doctor?
[04:13] <crimsun> drspin: have you rebooted?
[04:14] <setite> anyone... how many gigs should i clear for ubuntu
[04:14] <drspin> crimsun: I just did reboot and I got this message when I tried to login (#flood please)
[04:14] <Verr-> do i really have to re download the whole OS :/
[04:15] <drspin> setite: wipe the whole thing and just use Ubuntu!! :) LOL
[04:15] <Verr-> ubuntu doesnt support flash mx :/
[04:15] <setite> drspin its not my computer... cant do that
[04:16] <crimsun> drspin: does the file exist? if so, is it readable and writeable by your user?
[04:16] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, you mean Macromedia Flash MX?
[04:16] <Verr-> yeah
[04:16] <setite> its my dads... and he is paranoid... i cant even reinstall windows to regain a little speed
[04:16] <drspin> Verr:  yes it does
[04:16] <Verr-> haha lol doesnt
[04:16] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, i have loaded it with Crossover office if you mean for editing
[04:16] <Verr-> You can do flash movies with linux? o_O?
[04:16] <drspin> crimsun: the file does not exist... isn't .ICEauthority a lock file of somekind?
[04:16] <setite> verr- imma create a partitionmagic rescue disk
[04:17] <setite> i think it can format
[04:17] <briareus> OK ubuntu users whats the deal with this:  shutdown -h now   ... you must be root to do that!!!  sudo shutdown -h now  .. Password:    ...THATS RETARDED, defeats the entire purpose of sudo
[04:17] <Verr-> -.-
[04:17] <setite> but i still suggest finding or downloading ubuntu
[04:17] <setite> so you can clean the whole thing and reinstall
[04:17] <briareus> WHY do i have to enter mypassowrd ofr every system command when its supposedly FREEING me from having to do that, its ridiculous
[04:17] <Verr-> Why to reinstall
[04:17] <Verr-> I have configured it a lot
[04:17] <setite> i dunno... i just like having my main os at the start of the drive
[04:18] <Verr-> gaah
[04:18] <Verr-> can i do boot floppy?
[04:18] <drspin> Crimsun: correction, the file exists... it's readable and writedable by root only
[04:18] <jivera> briareus: How do you figure that defeats the purpose of sudo?
[04:19] <crimsun> drspin: that's the source of the problem.
[04:19] <nomasteryoda> briareus, just open a Root Terminal
[04:19] <jivera> And why don't you think you should need to be root to shut down?
[04:19] <nomasteryoda> briareus, then just do it once
[04:19] <setite> ??
[04:19] <briareus> jivera, if it prompts me for password at EVERY system command, then i am entering my password MORE
[04:19] <drspin> crimsun: sudo chmod 0660 ?
[04:19] <setite> boot floppy?
[04:19] <setite> to get into linux
[04:19] <setite> or to format
[04:19] <crimsun> drspin: no, just erase it.
[04:19] <jivera> briareus: Who ever said the point of sudo was to enter your password less often?
[04:19] <briareus> well, then whats the point
[04:19] <setite> like i said im making a bootable floppy from partition magic... i think you can use it to format your C
[04:19] <jivera> Also, it should only ask for it if you haven't entered it in the past 5 minutes.
[04:19] <setite> with the command "format c:"
[04:20] <setite> but im not sure
[04:20] <jivera> briareus: The point is it eliminates the need for a root account, and allows more fine grained root permissions.
[04:20] <jivera> If you don't like it, use 'sudo -s' to get a root shell.
[04:20] <nomasteryoda> briareus, if you use the Root Terminal, then you just do it once
[04:20] <nicedreams> sudo -s is the bomb
[04:20] <briareus> jivera, so that means i have to go through and take every system command i can ever think of and add it to visudo? thats ridiculous
[04:20] <nicedreams> i don't like sudo too much
[04:20] <Verr-> youre making?
[04:20] <IBOIC> ubuntu comes standard with evolution for email right?
[04:20] <Verr-> what?
[04:20] <IBOIC> i fergot already
[04:20] <jivera> briareus: Get over it.
[04:20] <briareus> nomasteryoda, yeah i suppose
[04:20] <lifeless> briareus: have you used ubuntu?
[04:20] <jivera> IBOIC: Yes.
[04:21] <briareus> jivera, i will, i will uninstall this crapper and go straight debian
[04:21] <briareus> lifeless, yeah i think ists wasting space on my laptop at the moment
[04:21] <drspin> crimsun: thanks :) all logged in now ;)
[04:21] <nomasteryoda> lifeless, it is a pure pain in the arse to have to enter sudo each and every time for a coomand
[04:21] <jivera> briareus: If something as small as using sudo by default makes you not like the OS, you'll never be happy.
[04:21] <nomasteryoda> i agree
[04:21] <lifeless> briareus: the sudo setup allows you to use all the commands.
[04:21] <lifeless> nomasteryoda: 'sudo bash'
[04:21] <drspin> crimsun: why didn't it get removed when Irestarted?
[04:21] <nomasteryoda> that is y i use the root terminal
[04:22] <jivera> You sudo-haters are all so winey.
[04:22] <jivera> 'alias su="sudo -s"'
[04:22] <setite> i love sudo
[04:22] <setite> root sounds so oldschool
[04:22] <spikeb> you missed the java troll earlier
[04:22] <jivera> That's different, java really does suck. ;)
[04:22] <briareus> yeah, cuz its so fun to type password for everything, Im whiney. OK, I'll whine my ass away from ubuntu. :) thanks and have a great night :)
[04:22] <setite> verr im looking into how you can format c from a floppy disk
[04:22] <Verr-> :S
[04:23] <spikeb> jivera, no it was another "java should be included and who cares about OSS" troll
[04:23] <crimsun> drspin: because it can't?
[04:23] <jivera> spikeb: Oh.
[04:23] <crimsun> drspin: your user has no permission to modify root-owned files
[04:23] <jivera> Yeah, that's bogus.
[04:23] <drspin> crimsun... hmmm - K
[04:23] <drspin> crimsun: Thanks for the help!
[04:23] <setite> ok verr
[04:23] <setite> try this
[04:23] <setite> put a floppy in your drive
[04:23] <setite> open my computer
[04:23] <spikeb> i think a plugin should be included -but first, we need a working OSS jre :)
[04:24] <IBOIC> my windows froze
[04:24] <IBOIC> weird
[04:24] <Verr-> to which computer?
[04:24] <IBOIC> well not weird, its windows :)
[04:24] <Verr-> wroking or not working?
[04:24] <jivera> IBOIC: Actually, that sounds pretty common.
[04:24] <drspin> IBOIC: it's Windows ;)
[04:24] <IBOIC> cant wait for hoary
[04:24] <setite> huh?
[04:24] <nomasteryoda> setite, verr doesn't have the ubuntu media...or the windows media
[04:24] <nomasteryoda> right?
[04:24] <setite> just some windows pc
[04:24] <Verr-> okay
[04:24] <setite> well he has ubuntu and windows on a pc
[04:24] <crimsun> drspin: np
[04:24] <IBOIC> any ubuntu gurus here who can help me custom my system with remote access? :)
[04:24] <setite> and from what i gather he can get into windows... but not ubuntu
[04:25] <Verr-> wait
[04:25] <setite> and he wants to format c and get into ubuntu
[04:25] <IBOIC> yummy, 5 hacker volunteers :)
[04:25] <IBOIC> hehe
[04:25] <Verr-> this laptop hasnt floppy disk? :D
[04:25] <setite> wtf
[04:25] <drspin> setite: tell him to use the liveCD
[04:25] <setite> damnit
[04:25] <setite> i dont think he has the means ot download a livecd
[04:25] <IBOIC> setite:  Can i mail him one?
[04:25] <IBOIC> FREE
[04:25] <setite> either he's on dialup or hes lazy
[04:25] <jivera> I would like to see Ubuntu with packages to more easily install java, flash, etc. (like I think I heard SuSE did once), but I'd still like emphasis to be put on F/OSS alternatives.
[04:25] <IBOIC> setite:  you can get free cd's directly from ubuntu
[04:25] <Verr-> :D
[04:25] <nomasteryoda> setite, open separate dialog for verr man
[04:25] <IBOIC> if they arent ill ship you one for free
[04:26] <setite> he said he didnt have internet earlier so i wasnt sure
[04:26] <IBOIC> if they stopped it
[04:26] <spikeb> sure you can mail him one
[04:26] <nomasteryoda> to cut the side chatter
[04:26] <setite> yoda?
[04:26] <Verr-> I have with laptop
[04:26] <setite> oh ok
[04:26] <Verr-> But the ubuntu/linux comp hasnt
[04:26] <setite> i skipped the word seperate
[04:26] <spikeb> heh
[04:26] <setite> IBOIC - that takes like 10 years
[04:26] <Verr-> okay theres now floppy
[04:26] <spikeb> IBOIC, you're more than welcome to send him a cd or ten :)
[04:26] <drspin> jivera: the problem is not Ubuntu or Linux in general -- the views about software, from the Governement's perspective, suck ass --
[04:27] <setite> ok well in my computer right-click A: and click format
[04:27] <jivera> drspin: Huh?
[04:27] <Verr-> yeah.
[04:27] <sophacles> so how do i get multiheaded working in ubuntu?
[04:27] <spikeb>  yeah
[04:27] <Verr-> Takes time
[04:27] <Verr-> this is not in so good condition
[04:27] <setite> select create ms-dos startup disk
[04:27] <spikeb> jivera, the paid version of mandrake also includes all that stuff
[04:27] <setite> andformat
[04:27] <miggumike> does yaboot have an option for a loader screen?
[04:27] <mjr> sophacles, google for xinerama-howto
[04:27] <jivera> spikeb: Does it include the flash/java packages themselves, or just the auto-downloader/installer?
[04:27] <Verr-> ...
[04:27] <spikeb> jivera, includes the packages themselves i believe.
[04:28] <drspin> jivera: I'm referring to your interest in seeing ... java, mp3, divX... more easially installed..
[04:28] <Verr-> nomasteryoda
[04:28] <jivera> drspin: I didn't say anything about mp3 or divx.
[04:28] <Verr-> so can you do flash movies with linux huh?
[04:28] <spikeb> drspin, java and flash are merely a problem of not having a mature OSS version :)
[04:28] <jivera> Verr-: You can watch them.
[04:28] <spikeb> flash is in multiverse btw
[04:28] <Verr-> i know
[04:28] <drspin> when I installed suse 8 it had JAVA, Flash, Mp3, DivX packages :)
[04:28] <sophacles> mjr do you know which repository xinerama is in?
[04:28] <drspin> that was convenient
[04:28] <spikeb> i have suse 8.2 pro, it has all that
[04:28] <Verr-> But he said something like you could do them as well
[04:28] <drspin> Verr: yes... hang ong
[04:29] <Verr-> setite
[04:29] <Verr-> done...
[04:29] <spikeb> there IS a free flash project - swfdec
[04:29] <spikeb> help them out
[04:29] <spikeb> IIRC, flash is a documented format
[04:29] <setite> ok afaik... with that disk you can boot to a dos prompt
[04:29] <setite> and type
[04:29] <drspin> Verr-: http://www.codeweavers.com/site/products/cxoffice/
[04:29] <setite> "format c:"
[04:29] <jivera> spikeb: Is it?
[04:29] <Verr-> okay setite
[04:29] <setite> but like i said i dont know how you will get to linux from ther
[04:29] <Verr-> Thx a lot!
[04:30] <setite> does the MBR fix itself
[04:30] <Verr-> Then i do another ubuntu cd
[04:30] <setite> huh?
[04:30] <drspin> Xover Office will run Flash MX -- almost perfectly...
[04:30] <spikeb> jivera, yes, but i'm not sure what the latest documented version is - might be the latest release, might not
[04:30] <setite> now your losing me
[04:30] <Verr-> just takes time :/
[04:30] <setite> you on broadband or dialup
[04:30] <Verr-> broadband
[04:30] <setite> then just download it
[04:30] <setite> get flashget
[04:30] <setite> itll take 20mins
[04:30] <kleedrac> Anyone ever get a "wine client perror:3: sendmsg: Bad file descriptor" error from cedega?
[04:31] <Verr-> The ubuntu install?
[04:31] <setite> yea
[04:31] <Verr-> its 500 mb!
[04:31] <setite> so
[04:31] <Verr-> Takes like 4 hours
[04:31] <drspin> kleedrac: I use cvscedega and no ;)
[04:31] <jivera> spikeb: Ah, I think I found it...
[04:31] <setite> flashget can get you 500k or more
[04:31] <Verr-> in finland...
[04:31] <nomasteryoda> yes
[04:31] <spikeb> jivera, http://www.schleef.org/swfdec/ is the project im talkin about :)
[04:31] <setite> it opens several connections
[04:31] <setite> so instead of one at like 80k
[04:31] <setite> you can open like 8 and get around 500k
[04:31] <Verr-> wht?
[04:31] <setite> it will cut the time down
[04:31] <setite> ok download flashget
[04:31] <Verr-> Isnt possble in finland man
[04:32] <spikeb> what?
[04:32] <setite> if you have broadband you cna use flashget to cut the time down
[04:32] <spikeb> scandanavia is supposed to have l33t bandwidth
[04:32] <joujou> omg somebody help me setup gxmame for one game!
[04:32] <Verr-> when you open 2 downloads the speed drops
[04:32] <setite> nope
[04:32] <setite> its different
[04:32] <setite> its like p2p
[04:32] <regeya> ohboy
[04:32] <setite> it opens several connections and downloads the file in parts
[04:32] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, i download from Finland or from another Netherlands country and get 500+ on Getright or flashget
[04:33] <spikeb> Verr-, if you open different downloads of different segments at the same time, the end result is faster
[04:33] <regeya> gxmame, first pry the ROMs out of your console.
[04:33] <spikeb> Verr-, that's what things like flashget do
[04:33] <setite> so even though each download slows down the combined speed is fast as hell
[04:33] <regeya> joujou, first pry the ROMs out of your console.
[04:33] <setite> verr - just believe me ok
[04:33] <Verr-> Disk 1/0 error replace the disk and then press any key... :/
[04:33] <setite> get flashget or getright
[04:33] <vladster_> did they come up with a fix for that bug?
[04:33] <setite> and download the installer with it
[04:33] <setite> verr - then yout floppy must not work so well
[04:34] <spikeb> jivera, might be a combo of both if swf isn't still open
[04:34] <nomasteryoda> vladster_, which bug
[04:34] <Verr-> setite i said ;)
[04:34] <nomasteryoda> lol
[04:34] <setite> ok then do as i say please
[04:34] <setite> get flashget... use it to download the installer
[04:34] <setite> i promise you it wont take 4 hours
[04:34] <Verr-> where to get flashget?
[04:34] <setite> google it
[04:35] <setite> ill google it for you
[04:35] <setite> amazesoft.com
[04:35] <vladster_> libmikmod.so.2: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[04:35] <setite> speaking of which i need to download the 32bit installer for this pc
[04:35] <setite> is 7 gigs sufficient for an ubuntu installation?
[04:35] <joujou> regaya: do they have to be in zip format or extracted for xmame to play them?
[04:36] <Verr-> IRONIC :D
[04:36] <setite> 6.93 to be exact
[04:36] <joujou> regeya
[04:36] <vladster_> Inconsistency detected by ld.so: ../sysdeps/generic/dl-tls.c: 72: _dl_next_tls_modid: Assertion `result <= _rtld_local._dl_tls_max_dtv_idx' failed!
[04:36] <setite> well to be nice more like 6 gigs
[04:36] <Verr-> I dload that flashget prog 2.3/kt per second
[04:36] <joujou> regeya: do they have to be in zip format or extracted for xmame to play them?
[04:36] <setite> wow... are you sure you have broadband
[04:36] <nomasteryoda> joujou, zipped man
[04:36] <setite> verr what speed do you usually get when downloading from a fast source
[04:36] <Verr-> setite usually i get like 50kt/sec
[04:36] <Seabook> hi guys
[04:37] <vladster_> nomasteryoda: this is a fresh ubuntu install after suse started going south
[04:37] <setite> on broadband?
[04:37] <Seabook> I'm gonna install Ubuntu.
[04:37] <Verr-> yeah
[04:37] <nomasteryoda> vladster, wow
[04:37] <Seabook> I freed up some space to create Linux partitions.
[04:37] <setite> wow.... maybe it doesn matter that your in finland or whereever....
[04:37] <setite> regardless flashget will get you a few hundred kbps
[04:37] <nomasteryoda> setite, proxy server maybe
[04:37] <Verr-> huhx?
[04:37] <Verr-> setite lets see
[04:37] <Seabook> Do I need a ext2 or ext3 partition?
[04:38] <setite> well the only thing that limits it is a really bad pc
[04:38] <setite> ext3
[04:38] <vladster> stream tunewr is working and ripping but I can't tune in to listem, XMMS is broken for some strange reason
[04:38] <nuOpus> depends on what you need
[04:38] <setite> yea
[04:38] <Verr-> this is fresh laptop :)
[04:38] <setite> someone answer me
[04:38] <nuOpus> ext2 is better for drivers with smaller space
[04:38] <setite> is 6 gigs good
[04:38] <joujou> nomasteryoda: that must be it then... trying again
[04:38] <Verr-> My dads working machine
[04:38] <nuOpus> ext3 on a small partition takes too much space
[04:38] <vladster> I put ubuntu into a 60 gig hard drive
[04:38] <setite> i want to throw ubuntu on this rig for the next week or two
[04:38] <setite> until i get my pc working
[04:39] <setite> i know this is a simple question...
[04:39] <Verr-> Well soon that comp will be widowsed :/
[04:39] <nomasteryoda> vladster, yes... i found that a problem on ubuntu... i was using oss on suse for xmms
[04:39] <Verr-> windowsed
[04:39] <nuOpus> I use ubuntu as my main os now
[04:39] <setite> so simple no one wants to answered?
[04:39] <Verr-> Gonna unistall ubuntu from it
[04:39] <nuOpus> setite what is question?
[04:39] <Verr-> Cos i have 2 ubuntu laptops soon
[04:39] <setite> is 5 or 6 gigs enough for ubuntu
[04:39] <nuOpus> yes
[04:39] <spikeb> yeah setite
[04:39] <spikeb> plenty
[04:39] <setite> ok thank you
[04:39] <Verr-> i gave 15 gigs
[04:39] <spikeb> i gave 60 :)
[04:39] <setite> ok now you answer spike
[04:39] <Verr-> spikeb :D
[04:39] <Seabook> setite: that was answer to my question?
[04:39] <setite> well my other rig... when it works has 400
[04:39] <nomasteryoda> Verr-, make one home partition
[04:39] <setite> thatll be enough right
[04:40] <setite> hehe
[04:40] <spikeb> heh
[04:40] <setite> ok now from a friends bad experience
[04:40] <vladster> is there a fix of do I have to use something else until a patch comes throught
[04:40] <Verr-> havent admin rights :/
[04:40] <setite> i need to defrag first right
[04:40] <Verr-> niicee
[04:40] <setite> then set aside the ext3 partition
[04:40] <spikeb> if you plan on partitioning, yes, defrag
[04:40] <setite> yea my friend didnt do that
[04:40] <spikeb> heh
[04:40] <nomasteryoda> vladster, you can do it... looking at wiki
[04:40] <setite> really bad experience
[04:41] <spikeb> that'll cause problems sometimes
[04:41] <vladster> which wiki
[04:41] <setite> its what i did when i tried to install rh6 a few years back
[04:41] <nomasteryoda> ubuntulinux.org/wiki
[04:41] <nomasteryoda> also look at ubuntuforums
[04:42] <vladster> I found a very long bug report on that exact fault
[04:42] <setite> ok imma download ubuntu 32 and lets see what speed the amazing flashget gives me
[04:42] <spikeb> heh
[04:42] <Verr-> Dual os will never work :/
[04:42] <Verr-> Cant even use one :/
[04:42] <kebac> i use windows only for counter-strike :)
[04:43] <Verr-> :)
[04:43] <vladster> I am running dual boot now, on seperate hard drives
[04:43] <setite> kebac same here
[04:43] <setite> it makes me mad though
[04:43] <nomasteryoda> best way vladster
[04:43] <setite> its because no surround sound on linux
[04:43] <setite> does surround sound at least work on dvds?
[04:43] <setite> i know cedega doesnt have i
[04:43] <setite> t
[04:43] <kebac> setite: if only they had good ati drivers, i guess i could have CS working on freebsd also...
[04:43] <setite> well i use nvidia
[04:43] <kebac> setite: or ati drivers at all...
[04:43] <setite> so drivers arent so bad
[04:44] <kebac> i am thinking of upgrading to nvidia as well
[04:44] <setite> ati's linux support is abysmal at best
[04:44] <setite> IMO at least
[04:44] <kebac> i dont want to know about ati's freebsd support...
[04:44] <kebac> i guess there is no support
[04:45] <setite> oh yea... yoru talking freebsd... why not tru linux
[04:45] <kebac> setite: i like freebsd
[04:45] <setite> but you'll like linux too
[04:45] <setite> they have open source drivers?
[04:45] <bluefoxicy> somebody complained that there's no good games in Ubuntu
[04:45] <bluefoxicy> I have one thing to say
[04:45] <mjr> me too
[04:45] <bluefoxicy> Armagetron.
[04:46] <setite> armagetron
[04:46] <setite> ok when people say tuxracer is a game... they scare me
[04:46] <mjr> setite, up to radeon 9250 only, ati has joined nvidia in the bad guys camp
[04:46] <setite> the only one of those level games that i like is tetris
[04:46] <bluefoxicy> setite:  have you played armagetron?
[04:46] <tux> tuxracer is shit
[04:46] <tux> lets face it
[04:46] <Verr-> :D
[04:46] <nuOpus> ati was supposed to release actual catalyst drivers in december
[04:46] <nomasteryoda> tux, but kids love tuxracer man
[04:46] <nuOpus> looks like its late
[04:46] <Verr-> heheahah
[04:46] <spikeb> i love tuxracer
[04:46] <nuOpus> ya my kid loves tuxracer
[04:46] <spikeb> heh
[04:46] <tux> im sure if it was a fat italian plumber it would make billions but its not
[04:47] <spikeb> im more interested in tuxkart though
[04:47] <kebac> nuOpus: i thought that ati's not going to support linux/freebsd at all
[04:47] <mjr> and if tuxracer is not a game, what is it then? A utility?
[04:47] <nomasteryoda> Get them early, they will always LOVE Linux
[04:47] <kebac> it's a tool
[04:47] <setite> nomasteryoda - but some adults try to pass it off as a real game
[04:47] <nomasteryoda> hehe
[04:47] <Verr-> well
[04:47] <tux> its a gfx card tester
[04:47] <kebac> a tool with what you can check if 3D is working
[04:47] <Verr-> I think i keep this windows
[04:47] <nomasteryoda> setite, i like it =)
[04:47] <bluefoxicy> uh
[04:47] <Verr-> if i can use grub,,,
[04:47] <nomasteryoda> kebac, yea
[04:47] <bluefoxicy> can anyone ping archive.ubuntu.com
[04:47] <tux> see how well it can handle bitmapping
[04:47] <Verr-> but how to?
[04:48] <kebac> bluefoxicy: i can
[04:48] <nuOpus> kebac: no
[04:48] <nomasteryoda> no
[04:48] <bluefoxicy> oh wow
[04:48] <bluefoxicy> it took like
[04:48] <nomasteryoda> no pingy here
[04:48] <bluefoxicy> 40 seconds to resolve it
[04:48] <nuOpus> kebac: They has a press release stating that they were going to support linux
[04:48] <nuOpus> a few months back
[04:48] <joujou> greaaaaaaaaaaat i got metal slug working!   now how can I play full screen?
[04:48] <nomasteryoda> my suck ISP is blocking pings
[04:48] <kebac> nuOpus: right... i hope they are going to support freebsd as well
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> eh screw bsd
[04:49] <sobralense> well.. anyone using brand new hoary upgrade and using "gdesklets"
[04:49] <kebac> my resolving took about 0.1s
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> I tried to install open
[04:49] <sobralense> ?
[04:49] <nuOpus> kebac: I doubt it
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> and free
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> and they confused me
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> :)
[04:49] <spikeb> um
[04:49] <nuOpus> kebac: I think the only reason they are doing it is there is a demand for it for linux now
[04:49] <mjr> they support a subset
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> Linux is [can be]  more secure anyway.
[04:49] <vladster> this just cheese me out, is there an alternate player I can use?
[04:49] <spikeb> nvidia updates their drivers on a consistant basis.
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> and it's just better :>
[04:49] <nuOpus> there is not a real demand for freebsd
[04:50] <nuOpus> so as a corporation why spend the money to write drivers without demand/
[04:50] <bluefoxicy> nuOpus: exactly
[04:50] <kebac> nuOpus: of course
[04:50] <Verr-> I cant add LAN to my crappy windows
[04:50] <nomasteryoda> a real reason to use KDE... Kompose
[04:50] <bluefoxicy> only significant markets get past marketting.
[04:50] <bluefoxicy> correction
[04:50] <kebac> but i guess it wouldnt be too awkward to write drivers for BSD as well
[04:50] <Crane> yeeee haawwww
[04:50] <nuOpus> Only reason to use KDE .. to waste the unused memory you have
[04:50] <bluefoxicy> only a fair subset of significant markets and a tiny tiny subset of insignificant markets get past marketting.
[04:50] <nomasteryoda> nuOpus, well i have 1GB
[04:51] <nuOpus> LOL
[04:51] <nomasteryoda> hehe
[04:51] <spikeb> as opposed to gnome, which wastes processor cycles :)
[04:51] <nuOpus> then use kde
[04:51] <Crane> lol
[04:51] <kebac> better to waste memory than CPU
[04:51] <nuOpus> I have 3.06 GHZ. :-)
[04:51] <nomasteryoda> lol
[04:51] <bluefoxicy> kde is worse
[04:51] <drspin> has anyone played "The Guild" ??
[04:51] <bluefoxicy> it wastes disk cycles
[04:51] <bluefoxicy> :)
[04:51] <nuOpus> plenty to spare since I dont game on the PC
[04:51] <Verr-> gtg
[04:51] <Crane> i'm thinking of trying something different
[04:51] <bluefoxicy> when it reaches 1.5G ram usage with no running applications
[04:51] <Verr-> brb after sleeping
[04:51] <nomasteryoda> bye Verr-
[04:51] <bluefoxicy> then you will understand what starting firefox is about.
[04:51] <nomasteryoda> bluefoxicy, huh?
[04:51] <kebac> bluefoxicy: you will never reach 1.5G usage in normal use...
[04:52] <bluefoxicy> kebac:  bullshit.
[04:52] <kebac> bluefoxicy: how come
[04:52] <nomasteryoda> runnaway process or something
[04:52] <vladster> nomasteryoda: is there an alternate player I can use for this?
[04:52] <bluefoxicy> I've had KDE running and gotten into my swap by 600M
[04:52] <nomasteryoda> yea
[04:52] <bluefoxicy> and I have 768M of ram
[04:52] <nomasteryoda> let me ss
[04:52] <nomasteryoda> see
[04:52] <bluefoxicy> I had like 200M of disk cache at the time
[04:52] <Crane> anyone one use Xfrce
[04:52] <nuOpus> bluefoxicy: I believe it. My main PC has 2gb and I have seen it go up there with KDE
[04:52] <Crane> or flux
[04:52] <bluefoxicy> so I closed everything I was running and it freed up like 150M of memory
[04:52] <bluefoxicy> this was after running KDE for a week straight mind you; I never log out.
[04:52] <kebac> well KDE is the ass
[04:53] <nuOpus> with that much memory and no swap utilization you can sort of tell that KDE is slower
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> kde 3.2 something.
[04:53] <nuOpus> and if you can tell on a fast machine you must definately tell on something slower with less ram
[04:53] <setite> my rig... that is not working because i think i killed the mobo has 1gig or ram... 2.7 ghz... on a amd64 3200 dtr... meanign 700mhz overclock... and 400 gigs... is that enough for ubuntu?
[04:53] <nomasteryoda> fluxbox is great too
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> nuOpus: i'm convinced there's a leak
[04:53] <nuOpus> ya
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> nuOpus:  or that kde is just ass
[04:53] <nuOpus> I am in love with XFCE 4.2
[04:53] <nuOpus> or the RC
[04:54] <vladster> You need another 7 gigs of ram,Tee Hee
[04:54] <bluefoxicy> it may just be KDE making 8 billion "kdeinit" processes
[04:54] <nomasteryoda> vladster, lol
[04:54] <nuOpus> bluefoxicy: I think that KDE tries to offer too much that is not needed
[04:54] <bluefoxicy> it seems to want to start ~9-15 of them per task, and close about 3 when a task ends.
[04:54] <setite> i dont see a real difference between KDE and GNOME
[04:54] <regeya> users of certain distributions tend to hate kde
[04:54] <nuOpus> I like GNOME because it is clean
[04:54] <nicedreams> xfce eh
[04:54] <regeya> users of other distributions tend to hate gnome
[04:55] <bluefoxicy> regeya:  I like Mandrake, SuSE, and Gentoo.  :)
[04:55] <regeya> some people just tend to hate both.
[04:55] <Crane> nuOpus: me
[04:55] <nomasteryoda> nicedreams, the latest one is very nice
[04:55] <Crane> too
[04:55] <bluefoxicy> Debian is ok
[04:55] <bluefoxicy> but Debian is kind of a middle grounder.
[04:55] <nicedreams> nomasteryoda: is it in hoary?
[04:55] <nuOpus> xfce 4.2 is GREAT!
[04:55] <Crane> OS: Linux <IP_ADDRESS>-3-386 | CPU: AMD Athlon(TM) @ 1662.752 MHz | MemTotal: 906736 kB | Audio:  | Video:  | (eth0) Data Sent: 2978774 (2.8 MiB) | (eth0) Data Recivied: 51662812 (49.2 MiB)
[04:55] <Crane> | Uptime: 8:55 | Load Average (15 Mins.): 0%
[04:55] <Crane> oops
[04:55] <vladster> and three more procs :0
[04:55] <nomasteryoda> nicedreams, not sure
[04:55] <nuOpus> nicedreams: Have you tried the new hoary test CDs?
[04:55] <bluefoxicy> Ubuntu is closer to Mandrake and SuSE than Debian. . . it's actually more user friendly :)
[04:55] <regeya> I for one tolerate GNOME, and chose Ubuntu for that reason, because they saved me the headache of getting GNOME working properly.
[04:55] <vladster> ;)
[04:55] <nicedreams> nuOpus: test cds?
[04:55] <regeya> GNOME is a flaming pile of garbage, but a darn usable flaming pile of garbage.
[04:55] <setite> blue - blasphemer!
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> redhat i dislike
[04:56] <setite> hehe
[04:56] <etorix> ha ha
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> slack is ass
[04:56] <nuOpus> nicedreams: Ya .... I got the daily hoary CDs ... the one released today.   The package manager didn't exist.
[04:56] <nicedreams> nuOpus: I'm using the hoary repositories
[04:56] <setite> ubuntu is what happens when you pick a damn good distro... and make it better
[04:56] <setite> or different if you prefer
[04:56] <nicedreams> setite, for sure
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> its "packages" were .tgz files that got extracted to /
[04:57] <setite> damn ubuntu 32bit download wont break 250kb
[04:57] <bluefoxicy> its package manager was basically zcat $i | tar x -C /
[04:57] <regeya> linux didn't exist 14 years ago
[04:57] <setite> this is annoying me
[04:57] <nuOpus> setite: Uhhh noo ... Ubuntu is what happens when you take a distro with no funding and fund them
[04:57] <setite> the 64bit went 500kb
[04:57] <drspin> setite: yes, Ubuntu is definately more desktop-ready then any of the other distros that I have tried ;)
[04:57] <setite> nu0pus... it didnt have funding before?
[04:57] <WeedVender> I got a question
[04:57] <nomasteryoda> Kompose .. cool screenshot - http://developer.berlios.de/dbimage.php?id=861
[04:57] <bluefoxicy> drspin: it needs an installer like Mandrake's :)
[04:58] <nuOpus> Not like ubuntu has
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> a very pretty and nice looking installer
[04:58] <setite> i thought it started as a freely available funded project
[04:58] <nomasteryoda> go WeedVender
[04:58] <etorix> im using xfce4
[04:58] <nicedreams> once debian gets good mplayer and codec support then it will be much better
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> that you can click on buttons to use
[04:58] <Crane> installing xfce4 from synamptic
[04:58] <WeedVender> I mounted a vfat drive and I can't see the files that ive added through Linux in Windows
[04:58] <daniels> nicedreams: that cannot happen for legal reasons.
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> because normal users are afraid of the tab key
[04:58] <nomasteryoda> bluefoxicy, progeny has a nice installer
[04:58] <nuOpus> Ubuntu is being funded by conical and one of the richest capital investors
[04:58] <Crane> is Xfce4 the only package I need
[04:58] <daniels> nicedreams: if you ship wmv codecs, you will get sued into oblivion.
[04:58] <nomasteryoda> bluefoxicy, and it is debian
[04:58] <drspin> bluefoxicy: yes ;) and easier ways to install the necessities (java, mp3, divx)
[04:58] <daniels> nuOpus: ('canonical')
[04:58] <nuOpus> daniels: thank you
[04:58] <regeya> vladster: you claim to have used slackware in 1991?
[04:58] <setite> daniels - picky picky
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> drspin:  hehe
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> mpg123
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> nomasteryoda:  screenies?
[04:59] <etorix> hmm .. i use the os-cillation debs on 32-bit or weberas on 64-bit
[04:59] <setite> mpg123 gives mp3 support right
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> mpg321 too
[04:59] <WeedVender> I mounted a vfat drive and I can't see the files that ive added through Linux in Windows
[04:59] <drspin> setite: for some programs...
[04:59] <nuOpus> nicedreams: mplayer works great in universe ... but no codecs
[04:59] <setite> for xmms?
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> WeedVender: you mounted it read only  :)
[04:59] <drspin> nuOpus: install w32codecs
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> setite: oh  :)
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> xmms uses mpg123's core
[04:59] <setite> so yes?
[04:59] <nuOpus> drspin: you can get ALL of the codecs from the mplayer web site and just extract it to /usr/lib/win32
[04:59] <nicedreams> bluefoxicy: really?
[05:00] <WeedVender> Linux can write on it..
[05:00] <WeedVender> Ive added files..
[05:00] <nuOpus> drspin: w32codecs does not work as well ... it is bare in comparison
[05:00] <nicedreams> nuOpus: hoary has them in the repositories
[05:00] <WeedVender> but yet I dont see it on WIndows...
[05:00] <bluefoxicy> nicedreams:  mine did, then i replaced it with beep-media-player
[05:00] <drspin> nuOpus: yes ;) I was telling you the same just making you look for them
[05:00] <WeedVender> I dont see how thats read only.
[05:00] <nicedreams> lol...i like BMP
[05:00] <setite> when i get over to ubuntu sometime in the hour... i need to figure out how to get xmms working with mp3s... but without download xmms-mp3 if possible
[05:00] <bluefoxicy> WeedVender:  it was a joke.
[05:00] <regeya> okay, okay...since I can't remember what year the kernel was begun, and since I can't find the original usenet post anywhere handy, I'll just shut up. :-}
[05:00] <vladster> nomasteryoda: where do I change the file association for streamtuner
[05:00] <lifeless> WeedVender: vfat & ntfs are quite different
[05:00] <nuOpus> nicedreams: no not all. It only has like 9 megs of them. THe pack from mplayer site called all ... is 19 megs worth
[05:01] <spikeb> yes
[05:01] <setite> ntfs is evil
[05:01] <WeedVender> vfat is anything in FAT
[05:01] <WeedVender> Windows should see FAT.
[05:01] <WeedVender> even if its on NTFS.
[05:01] <vladster> I think it was 93
[05:01] <setite> yea it can
[05:01] <setite> floppies are fat
[05:01] <nuOpus> Good example .... I cannot go to xbox.com and view trailers with the outdated w32codecs deb ... but getting the newest myself from mplayer site I can
[05:01] <regeya> I was thinking 92, but 93 sounds good, I guess
[05:01] <setite> and some usb stick drives
[05:01] <vladster> I remeber because I was still in the dos world at the time
[05:01] <nuOpus> setite: No ... floppies are skinny :-0
[05:01] <setite> my mp3 player is a fat16 stick drive
[05:02] <nuOpus> :-)
[05:02] <setite> smart -ass
[05:02] <WeedVender> fat16 eh?
[05:02] <vladster> My first computer used punch cards
[05:02] <nuOpus> setite: lol
[05:02] <setite> yes fat16
[05:02] <setite> not fat8
[05:02] <WeedVender> *shudders
[05:02] <setite> not fat32
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> my first computer hooked to my TV
[05:02] <setite> but fat16
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> and contained a SID chip
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> and 64KiB of memory.
[05:02] <nuOpus> setite: I have a floppy I use with the driverloader debs ... it is ext2
[05:02] <WeedVender> so any ideas?
[05:02] <regeya> I was in high school in a really rural area.  I shouldn't use that as an excuse since someone from my town was one of the first people in the linux counter project.
[05:02] <nuOpus> even though a good portion of it is used by the file system
[05:02] <setite> well arent you special
[05:03] <nuOpus> lol
[05:03] <vladster> Mione was the size of three fridges and my college
[05:03] <setite> damnit why wont this download break 250k
[05:04] <WeedVender> anyone with ideas?
[05:04] <nuOpus> what are you trying to download?
[05:04] <setite> ooh there we go
[05:04] <setite> 557
[05:04] <setite> 4 jets beats 5 for once
[05:04] <setite> downloading ubuntu