[02:18] <Zaragon> hi all...looking for info on wireless adapters...first ubuntu box, first problem...so what channel or internet place does one go?  My brand new adapter has no linux drivers available


[03:41] <Xase> Hello ARM unit.
[03:42] <Xase> I'd like to know some information about flashing ubuntu arm onto my nook color if anyone is willing to congregate with me on this topic.
[03:45] <Xase> Or maybe an inexpensive fully usable ARM system with which I can use Ubuntu ARM build.
[03:54] <Xase> I swear.... ARM should stand for  Alive... Really Man?
[03:54] <Xase> ... no one ever lives here -_-
[05:31] <GrueMaster> I kindof do.
[19:19] <Neko> alf, ping


[13:32] <thafreak> Anyone use proxmox before?
[13:33] <thafreak> I've been playing with it...debating on using it for real...


[23:34] <ShapeShifter499> hi
[23:34] <ShapeShifter499> I came across the "ubuntu is spyware" argument today, how do you guys feel about this?
[23:35] <bluefox83> ShapeShifter499: since you can change anything in ubuntu, including the whole amazon search thing and the function that sends your search statistics, it's a BS statement made by someone who clearly has no interest in ubuntu to begin with
[23:36] <bluefox83> they clearly decided that since it comes out of the box with a feature they don't like, it must be bashed. instead of just realizing that you can get rid of it
[23:44] <hrnz> you can get rid of any spyware
[23:44] <hrnz> doesn't make spyware good
[23:45] <bluefox83> doesn't make ubuntu itself spyware either
[23:46] <bluefox83> otherwise windows and OSX would also be spyware
[23:46] <ShapeShifter499> I'm feeling like going to debian due to all this, sure I can remove it now by purging a few packages or toggling it off in settings but could MORE of this be coming?
[23:46] <bluefox83> eh, maybe...you might try mint though
[23:46] <bluefox83> or just use gnome or xfce instead of unity...i use gnome
[23:47] <hrnz> ShapeShifter499: canonical could convert everything into proprietary projects
[23:47] <ShapeShifter499> the thing is I like how unity looks
[23:47] <bluefox83> i don't care for it...
[23:57] <bluefox83> yay for rediscovering how to use basic commands in irssi >.>


[16:00]  * belkinsa pokes skellat (just for fun)
[19:44] <thafreak> jrgifford: you going to the DevOpsCle meetup tonight?
[19:44] <jrgifford> thafreak: where is it?
[19:44] <jrgifford> is this the one at hurricane?
[19:44] <thafreak> hurricane labs, rockside rode
[19:44] <jrgifford> yeah
[19:44] <jrgifford> can't
[19:45] <jrgifford> too far from where i am, at for now, i'm stuck on my bike or a bus.
[19:45] <thafreak> ok, thought I'd check
[19:45] <thafreak> ouch
[19:45] <thafreak> normally I probably can't go, but I'm working from home today so I can head up early


[00:24] <owh> Hiya. I'm installing a samba gutsy-server and the WinXP clients cannot connect as guests. I've manually added the group mappings according to: http://www.samba.org/samba/docs/man/Samba-HOWTO-Collection/groupmapping.html#set-group-map - using local unix groups, but I still cannot connect. Ideas?
[00:25] <owh> BTW, browsing on a gutsy workstation to the server works just fine.
[00:25] <sommer> owh: what's up
[00:25] <owh> Hiya sommer, pulling out my hair.
[00:26] <sommer> heh, I usually go to the barber
[00:26] <sommer> owh: for the samba question did you set a guest password?
[00:27] <owh> I don't even know where to start with this samba thing.
[00:27] <owh> sommer: What do you mean?
[00:27] <sommer> your windows users do they have accounts on your ubuntu box?
[00:28] <sommer> or a guest user with a password?
[00:28] <sommer> also what is your security option set to?
[00:29] <owh> Security is set to user because at some point in the not to distant future there will be actual user accounts, rather than one single guest account.
[00:29] <owh> I'm just wondering something.
[00:29] <mralphabet> does it prompt you for user / pass when you browse to it from the windows machines?
[00:29] <owh> There needs to be a mapping between a unix account and a local account as specified in smbusers right?
[00:29] <owh> mralphabet: Yes.
[00:30] <sommer> smbpasswd -a username
[00:30] <mralphabet> and what user account do you type in?
[00:30] <owh> mralphabet: Well, initially nothing, then I tried "guest".
[00:31] <owh> smbusers contains this line: samba = guest pcguest smbguest
[00:31] <owh> Meaning, the guest account is mapped to the Ubuntu "samba" account.
[00:31] <owh> This account exists.
[00:32] <owh> I've locked the password with passwd -l samba, I'm guessing that I should not have :)
[00:32]  * mralphabet nods
[00:32] <owh> So, how do I create a guest account that does not let free access into the Ubuntu box.
[00:32] <owh> Do I set the shell to false?
[00:33] <sommer> owh: that's what I do
[00:33] <owh> And if that's how its supposed to work, how do I set the guest (samba Ubuntu user) to nothing?
[00:35] <owh> Ah, passwd -d :)
[00:35]  * owh crosses fingers and wanders off to a WinXP box :)
[00:37] <owh> sommer: While I'm waiting for a reboot, is there any reason that the server guide uses /etc/init.d/foo stop as examples, rather than invoke-rc.d foo stop
[00:37] <foo> owh: you have an init script named after me? Aw, you're so sweet
[00:37] <owh> foo: Heh.
[00:38] <foo> :
[00:38] <foo> )
[00:38] <owh> You'll keep :)
[00:38]  * owh starts contemplating tomorrow.
[00:39] <sommer> owh: not really sure, from my experience /etc/init.d/foo stop is more common :)
[00:40] <owh> sommer: Fair enough.
[00:40] <owh> On the samba issue, no change.
[00:40] <owh> So, there is a samba local Ubuntu user, it is unlocked, login shell set to /bin/false, passwd deleted. Any thing else?
[00:42] <owh> Is it possible that the WinXP machines are connecting with a username that I'm not expecting, or am I looking down the wrong path?
[00:42] <sommer> owh: is there any errors in /var/log/syslog or /var/log/auth ?
[00:42] <sommer> or any of the samba logs
[00:42] <JanC> owh: AFAIK invoke-rc.d is only intended to be use by package scripts   ;)
[00:43] <owh> JanC: Ah. I just find it less typing: inv[tab] foo
[00:43] <JanC> well, I use 'wajig'  ;)
[00:43] <owh> sommer: Only the ones about creating users and administrators.
[00:44] <sommer> have you tried setting the samba password with smbpasswd ?
[00:45] <sommer> er the user's samba password that is
[00:45] <owh> sommer: Hmm, for which username?
[00:45] <owh> sommer: The Ubuntu samba username?
[00:45] <sommer> whichever one you're using guest... I think
[00:46] <sommer> the ubuntu samba user is for the service I believe
[00:46] <owh> sommer: You might be on to something there.
[00:47]  * owh goes to check.
[00:47] <owh> BRB
[00:47] <owh> Nop
[00:48] <owh> sommer: The ubuntu "samba" user did not exist. I created it.
[00:48] <sommer> ah, did you then do a smbpasswd -a samba, then try connecting with that user?
[00:49] <owh> Now I've set the passwd for the user "samba" to null in both Ubuntu and Samba.
[00:49] <sommer> the "-a" adds the user to the samba user database
[00:49] <sommer> maybe I'm confused on what you're trying to do?
[00:49] <owh> sommer: Should I add a "guest" user?
[00:49] <owh> Let's start a set back for a moment.
[00:49] <owh> When I browse in WinXP to a share, which "anonymous" username does it use?
[00:49] <sommer> I think I'm just confusing you as well, heh
[00:50] <andguent> sorry to jump in, but this may be of interest smb.conf: guest account = nobody
[00:50] <owh> andguent: Yup. I've got that set to guest account = samba
[00:50] <sommer> owh: and you have a system user named samba?
[00:51] <owh> Yes
[00:51] <sommer> and a samba user named samba?
[00:51] <owh> Yes
[00:51] <sommer> and the samba user's Samba password is valid?
[00:52] <sommer> as in a valid smbpasswd samba
[00:52] <owh> sommer: It's set to null with smbpasswd -n samba
[00:52] <sommer> owh: ya, I think it's going to need an actual password
[00:52] <owh> There is also this mapping in smbusers: samba = guest pcguest smbguest
[00:52] <owh> sommer: Since when does a guest account need a password?
[00:52] <sommer> what is the security = ?
[00:53] <owh> users
[00:53] <sommer> I think for the guest it needs to be security = share
[00:53] <owh> Hmm, I'm just noticing that this is commented out. I wonder what the default is.
[00:53] <sommer> owh: users
[00:54] <sommer> but if your goal is to not have a prompt then you'll need to set it to share
[00:54] <owh> So, can I create a passwordless guest account in a "user" environment? Ultimately we'll need to move to that.
[00:54] <sommer> owh: that I'm not 100% sure of, but I don't think so
[00:54] <owh> We're working on migrating them all to a SOE.
[00:55] <sommer> when you want to migrate you'll just need to create the users and set the security to users
[00:55] <owh> sommer: So, if I login as "guest" on the WinXP box with no password, then it should work?
[00:55] <owh> That is, the mapping in smbusers maps guest to samba which then connects, right?
[00:55] <sommer> owh: that's I'm not sure of, but it's worth a try
[00:56] <owh> It doesn't work.
[00:56] <sommer> did you try security = share?
[00:56] <owh> sommer: No because then the users that do have an account will have issues.
[00:56] <sommer> owh: ah, true
[00:56] <owh> sommer: This is a setup that has been borked by many previous admins. I'm trying to start from scratch.
[00:57] <sommer> so you want some shares to prompt for a password and others to not?
[00:57] <owh> sommer: Yes.
[00:57] <owh> sommer: But it's simpler than that.
[00:58] <owh> sommer: The only ones that prompt are home directories.
[00:58] <owh> Let me ask a different question.
[00:58] <sommer> then I think there are options for the share definitions that can enable that
[00:58] <owh> When I browse the network under Ubuntu Workstation and connect to the server I am not prompted for a password.
[00:59] <sommer> is that on the server itself?
[00:59] <owh> No, from my laptop.
[01:00] <owh> So, there is a guest mechanism working.
[01:01] <owh> And it shows me connecting as the "samba" user in the log for that machine.
[01:01] <owh> Does WinXP have a different "magic" guest username?
[01:03] <andguent> i can stop butting in, but I like this type of share setup: [Shared]; path =/opt/samba/shared; writable = yes; guest ok = yes; create mask = 777; directory mask = 777; force user = nobody
[01:04] <sommer> that sounds reasonable to me
[01:04] <sommer> what andguent said anyway
[01:04] <owh> andguent: Feel free to continue to butt in :)
[01:04] <andguent> that of course, would give wide open perms to that share, and make any new file saved there have wide open security, only recommended for non confidential info
[01:04] <sommer> andguent: definitely feel free to, I'm sort of running out of ideas :-)
[01:05] <owh> Hmm, I wonder if the "force user" is required.
[01:05] <andguent> maybe not, but it will make things easier for authentication
[01:05] <owh> Lemmie try that for a mo.
[01:05] <andguent> if you want an area for important secured info, make another share with different perms
[01:06] <andguent> recommended for that setup: valid users = larry, moe, curly
[01:07] <andguent> or: valid users = @threestoges
[01:07] <owh> Yeah, that's the next step, but today we just want to recreate the environment that the company had on Friday :)
[01:08] <andguent> yup yup
[01:08] <owh> So, the force user=samba didn't work.
[01:08]  * owh checks logs
[01:08] <owh> No change.
[01:08] <andguent> i assume you already have guest ok = yes
[01:09] <andguent> on that share
[01:09]  * owh checks to make sure.
[01:09] <owh> [Accounts]
[01:09] <owh>         path = /home/samba/Accounts
[01:09] <owh>         writeable = yes
[01:09] <owh>         guest ok = yes
[01:09] <owh>         force user = samba
[01:09] <owh> That's all there is.
[01:10] <andguent> what are the permissions on that directory? ls -lah /home/samba/Accounts
[01:10] <owh> Owned and operated by the user samba.
[01:13] <owh> Hmm, I wonder if it has to do with WINS support?
[01:13] <andguent> can you dump the output of these commands to http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/ ---- ls -lah /home/samba/Accounts; cat /etc/samba/smb.conf; cat /etc/passwd; cat /etc/group; pdbedit -L
[01:13] <owh> andguent: I can give you the Accounts directory itself, not its content.
[01:14] <andguent> thats fine
[01:14] <andguent> cut out what you want
[01:20] <owh> andguent: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m135ac5d4
[01:24] <owh> Hello: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/samba/+bug/32067
[01:24] <andguent> i dont think its a big deal, but i'm grasping at straws too, it all looks fine..... can you change /bin/false to /bin/bash temporarily?
[01:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 32067 in samba "public Samba SMB shares cannot be accessed anonymously from Windows XP, a password prompt appears" [High,Fix released]
[01:26] <owh> map to guest = Bad User
[01:27] <owh> That seems to be the fix for some reason.
[01:27] <andguent> got it working then?
[01:28] <owh> Not yet, still reading, but that looks like the fix from that bug report. I'm going to reload samba shortly.
[01:29]  * owh crosses fingers
[01:30] <owh> Well, under Nautilus I can no longer access the shares.
[01:30]  * owh tries WinXP clients next.
[01:31] <owh> Nope, "the user does not exist"
[01:31] <owh> Hmm
[01:31] <owh> Let me try map to guest = samba
[01:37] <owh> No, but my logs are filling with: sid_to_uid for samba (S-1-5-21-2317322771-484201766-2685857054-501) failed
[01:38] <owh> # net groupmap list
[01:38] <owh> Domain Admins (S-1-5-21-2317322771-484201766-2685857054-512) -> administrator
[01:38] <owh> Domain Guests (S-1-5-21-2317322771-484201766-2685857054-514) -> samba
[01:38] <owh> Domain Users (S-1-5-21-2317322771-484201766-2685857054-513) -> staff
[01:38] <owh> Crap, why is this so hard?
[01:42] <andguent> still stewing it over..... you aren't using smbldap are you?
[01:43] <owh> No
[01:43] <owh> tdbsam
[01:46] <andguent> how many times have you tried deleting the samba user in tdb via smbpasswd -x and then remaking?
[01:47] <owh> Never, but I'm just thinking that the force user is when it went to pot. I'm going to remove that and leave the Bad User mapping.
[01:47] <andguent> go for it
[01:47] <owh> Nautilus is working again. XP is next.
[01:47] <owh> BRB
[01:47] <andguent> i dont have any XP computers to test with right now, otherwise I would try it from here
[01:49] <owh> Whoot!
[01:49] <owh> We have lift off.
[01:49] <owh> Ok, so guest mapping needs to map to a bad user and force user should not be there.
[01:50] <owh> When I'm back in the office I'll see what hardy does by default, but soren was already involved in the bug I mentioned, so I'm hoping this has been addressed :)
[01:51] <owh> sommer: andguent: mralphabet: Thank you all for your assistance.
[01:51]  * owh goes to test printing :)
[01:51] <andguent> np, i just wish i knew how i did it before, its definitely possible
[01:51] <owh> It would be great if my VPN connection worked from the office, then I could test this before coming on-site :)
[01:52] <owh> andguent: Yeah, it's all working now as expected. I'll contact the authenticated users and make sure that they work as expected.
[01:52] <andguent> one difference, I usually do not have low security in a domain master setup
[01:52] <owh> I'm not yet sure that I need the groupmap.
[01:53] <owh> andguent: And as soon as we have moved the environment the way it needs to be then that will change and the guest account will give you access to the Transfer volume :)
[01:54] <owh> Thanks again.
[01:54] <andguent> no prob, good luck, just know that it is possible :)
[01:57] <owh> Yeah
[01:57] <owh> Should I delete the group mappings?
[01:58] <andguent> it shouldn't matter tooo much, if you know how to recreate the mappings, sometimes its nice to reset settings :)
[01:59] <owh> Well, my first thought was that the installer should have taken care of them and because it didn't they were not required. The samba manual talks about them previously being created by default, but that they now need to be manually created, so I'm confused as to what really should happen.
[02:00] <owh> I don't even know if they're needed for actual operation.
[02:00] <andguent> I'm assuming you want to use a domain setup in the long term?
[02:00] <owh> Yes
[02:01] <owh> That makes me think, remove them now while I remember, then when we do this for real, create them properly.
[02:02] <owh> I mapped them to administrator, staff, samba arbitrarily.
[02:02] <owh> Though I think if they're required that it would be good if the installer did this.
[02:02] <andguent> I have a similar setup to what you currently are going for in the short term, no domain master, and net groupmap list is empty, just as an FYI
[02:03] <andguent> i used to have access to 30-40 different servers, so many samples to work from, i miss them greatly now :)
[02:03] <owh> I think I'll delete them for now.
[02:03] <owh> VMware is your friend :)
[02:03] <andguent> definitely
[02:04] <andguent> i just don't have those sample configs in front of me anymore, harder to remember everything off the top of my head
[02:05] <owh> Hey, don't feel too bad, your probing caused me to seek further and find a solution.
[02:05] <owh> Now I have to figure out why LAMP out of the box is serving php pages as text.
[02:06] <andguent> that is odd
[02:07] <owh> Yup, I'll say.
[02:07] <owh> The mime-type mappings seem to be there.
[02:08] <sommer> owh: I'd double check that the php modules is enabled and restart apache
[02:10] <owh> sommer: Nope, but disabling it and re-enabling it and force-reloading in between fixed it. Mine is not to ask :(
[02:11] <sommer> wierd...
[02:15] <owh> sommer: That sums up the last 48 pretty well :(
[02:15] <owh> 300Gb of data with only 40Gb of real stuff. The rest left lying around by previous administrators just for fits and giggles.
[02:17] <andguent> heh
[02:17] <owh> And of course all of it was being backed up each day :(
[02:18] <owh> At least the current disks will handle the load when the organisation ever grows that big :)
[02:25] <andguent> ha, yea, time for a good nas/offline storage system
[02:25] <andguent> shove the stuff out of the way and get on with things
[02:27]  * owh is working on it :)
[02:28] <owh> Isn't the ctrl-alt-del detection in /etc/inittab?
[02:29] <andguent> working on keeping your windows admins from rebooting the server at the console? :)
[02:30] <owh> Yup
[02:30] <owh> I don't seem to have an inittab.
[02:30] <owh> WTF is going on?
[02:32] <owh> Hmm. /etc/event.*
[02:33] <andguent> yea, /etc/event.d/control-alt-delete
[02:33] <owh> Yeah, I was just in the process of adding that as a comment here for future googlers :)
[02:34] <andguent> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=2181001
[02:34] <owh> Well, that just about concludes my pain for this location. Thanks andguent :)
[02:35] <andguent> no prob, good luck
[05:00] <owh> I'm making a generic user backup script. Anyone see any issues with this: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/d75014df5
[05:00] <owh> The idea is that you symlink to it with each username from cron.daily.
[05:03]  * owh realises that the script is pretty trivial. I'm using the same mechanism to backup drives.
[05:03] <owh> s/drives/mount points/
[05:09] <rhineheart_m> hello. may I ask how to remove webmin?
[05:10] <owh> How did you install it?
[05:10] <rhineheart_m> mmm.. manual I guess... webmin is not in the repo right?
[05:10] <ScottK> rhineheart_m: It was terminated with extreme predjudice.
[05:10] <rhineheart_m> so, I believe I installed it manually..
[05:10] <ScottK> rhineheart_m: Didn't you ask this same question recently.
[05:11] <ScottK> The webmin web site (IIRC) provides .debs for it.
[05:11] <rhineheart_m> nope. I asked but nobody answered as far as I could remember
[05:11] <owh> rhineheart_m: So, yes you did ask :)
[05:12] <rhineheart_m> :). Okay. Nope there I meant I asked but I didn't receive a good answer
[05:12] <owh> rhineheart_m: Again, how did you install it?
[05:15] <rhineheart_m> owh, a minute.. m trying to figure out how did I manage to install it
[05:17] <owh> Basically, depending on how you installed it, determines how you remove it.
[05:20] <rhineheart_m> I guess I installed it via wget.. and sudo sh setup.sh
[05:21] <owh> rhineheart_m: Then you'll need to look for the uninstall script included in the package.
[05:21] <rhineheart_m> uninstall script? where to find it owh ?
[05:23] <owh> rhineheart_m: I don't understand the question. If you installed an application, then it would come with an uninstall script. If not, it should come with an install.log, if not, then you may have success re-installing it and looking for the logs, but as I've never installed things that are not packages - which you should also never do, that's all I have.
[05:24] <rhineheart_m> owh, I found this one: uninstall.sh in /etc/webmin directory.. what do you think?
[05:24] <owh> rhineheart_m: I'd look at it before running it.
[05:25] <rhineheart_m> uhuh... are you trying to tell me to read the script first before running it?
[05:25] <owh> Yes
[05:26] <owh> rhineheart_m: Unless of course you have a full system backup in which case it won't matter if the uninstall script hoses your system.
[05:26] <rhineheart_m> uhuh.. this it the content... http://www.pastebin.org/26398
[05:26] <rhineheart_m> *is
[05:28] <rhineheart_m> I just tried to execute: /etc/webmin/stop and it returned stopping...well, can you suggest heading/?
[05:30] <owh> rhineheart_m: I do not know what this means: "well, can you suggest heading/?"
[05:31] <rhineheart_m> owh, I mean.. will I go with this steps: cd ~ ; cd /etc/webmin ; sudo sh uninstall.sh ?
[05:33] <owh> rhineheart_m: I cannot answer that. There is a serious question about liability here. If I were to say yes and you hose your system, there is an implied idea that I'm then going to help you recover your machine. That is not the case. All I can say is: "Did you backup your system first?"
[05:33] <owh> rhineheart_m: I should point out that:
[05:33] <owh> rhineheart_m: This is only the case because you're not using a package that comes from Ubuntu. If it did, then the liability issue becomes even more muddied :)
[05:34] <owh> rhineheart_m: Personally, I'd investigate what the .pl script does and see if you think it's playing in places that it should not.
[05:34] <owh> rhineheart_m: As this is a server channel, I need to assume that you're doing this on a server.
[05:35] <owh> rhineheart_m: So, I'm saying - I don't know. It shouldn't hurt, but I'm not going to tell you that it will not hurt.
[05:35] <owh> rhineheart_m: Do you understand what I'm saying?
[05:36] <rhineheart_m> uhuh.. okay.. this is the case actually.. I just don't know if you've heard this... when I will open the port for webmin.. and will access and using it.. I experienced intermittent connection and I don't know for what reason. I've been observing the performance. For the past 3 days and blocked that port.. and I didn't experience anymore disruption of internet connection..
[05:37] <rhineheart_m> owh, yeah.. the server is live and two sites are hosted there.. :(
[05:37] <owh> rhineheart_m: This is the same computer we spoke about a few days ago with the ADSL issue?
[05:37] <rhineheart_m> owh, yeah.. this is it!
[05:38] <owh> rhineheart_m: Then you need to do some serious troubleshooting. It is possible that someone has been using webmin to hack your server, but I cannot answer that. You need to determine what is causing the issue. Do the disconnects happen if the server is not connected etc. As I see it, you're just flailing in the dark at the moment.
[05:38] <rhineheart_m> and based on my investigation.. webmin causing the problem.. mmm.. or might be.. something is wrong with the network that can't handle https requests. It could handle for the few minutes but later it can't
[05:39] <owh> rhineheart_m: Or some script kiddie is running something that connects to webmin and reboots your router - who knows. Unless you investigate you'll not know the answer.
[05:39] <rhineheart_m> I have logs.. and only me (IP) is accessing the port for webmin
[05:40] <owh> rhineheart_m: What about network sniffing logs?
[05:40] <rhineheart_m> network sniffing logs? lemme ask you. is incoming tables not reliable to log incoming requests?
[05:40] <owh> rhineheart_m: Before all that I'd eliminate simple things. You told us on a previous occasion that the Windows machines are also disconnected. This is more likely a router issue or an ADSL issue.
[05:41] <owh> rhineheart_m: Making things more complicated by looking for things that no-one ever heard of are unlikely to solve your problem.
[05:42] <owh> rhineheart_m: I'm not saying the cause is not webmin, just that it is very far down the list of possible causes of intermittent network connectivity for a LAN.
[05:42] <owh> rhineheart_m: Fundamentally you need to eliminate each failure point, one at a time.
[05:43] <owh> rhineheart_m: So, connect a single Windows computer to the ADSL modem. Does it continue to work?
[05:43] <owh> rhineheart_m: Then connect that same machine to the router and the router to the modem, does it continue to work?
[05:43] <rhineheart_m> but for the past almost a month.. tell me why I've been experiencing intermittent connection when webmin is being used? I just used it to transfer/edit some files using its file manager.
[05:44] <rhineheart_m> presently.. I've been doing the same transfer of files using winscp and I didn't experience such..
[05:44] <owh> rhineheart_m: Well, you also said that the Windows computers on the same network fail intermittently. At the same time, or at a different time? Is their failure related to your failure, or are there more than one issue?
[05:44] <rhineheart_m> for the past 3 days.. never the internet connection suffered the same problem which was actually not usuall for the past few weeks
[05:45] <owh> rhineheart_m: You cannot just wave your hands around and point at the last thing you touched. You'll never discover the problem.
[05:45] <owh> rhineheart_m: I understand that you are frustrated, but I suggest you read through the steps I've listed and proceed one step at a time.
[05:46] <rhineheart_m> owh, this is what I see it... adsl and the ISP looses its sync (PPPoE) when I'm using https or maybe webmin..
[05:47] <owh> rhineheart_m: That has very likely nothing to do with https. Losing sync is a layer 2 issue, not able to be influenced by what traffic occurs.
[05:49] <owh> rhineheart_m: Most modems will show you what link quality there is. Perhaps you need to look at that first.
[05:49] <rhineheart_m> BTW, I'm still waiting for the replacement of wrt54g since I believe of its faulty https . Sorry to tell you.. I haven't told you before.. I just forgot
[05:49] <owh> rhineheart_m: I also don't know how the ADSL filters are connected, nor other devices on the telephone network.
[05:49] <rhineheart_m> it only defaults to port 143
[05:50] <owh> rhineheart_m: The problem you are solving does in my opinion have nothing to do with TCP/UDP/HTTP/HTTPS/IP or any "high-level" information. This is a physical link problem from what you have told me.
[05:51] <owh> rhineheart_m: The most often diagnosed problem is that the ADSL filter is incorrectly fitted.
[05:51] <PanzerMKZ_> ok so is there any downside to making dns entry for us.archive.ubuntu.com if I have an apt-get mirror that is local on my network for the different versions of ubuntu I am normally dealing with?
[05:52] <rhineheart_m> owh, I have  it checked already by our ISP techs. In fact, they changed the cabling system ( I mean.. the analog line) already
[05:54] <owh> rhineheart_m: The second most often diagnosed problem is that there are poor internal leads.
[05:54] <rhineheart_m> So I guess. the problem is not more on physical set-up ... but something otherwise.
[05:54] <owh> rhineheart_m: What you are describing does not ring true.
[05:54] <owh> rhineheart_m: Loosing sync is an ADSL level issue, not a IP level issue.
[05:55] <rhineheart_m> if it is more on physical coonection..now.. why is it loses its connectivity when I am connecting to the box and doing some revisions to the live site?
[05:55] <owh> rhineheart_m: I could dream up a scenario where your machine has been hacked and each https connect causes a script to reboot your modem, but I don't buy it.
[05:56] <owh> rhineheart_m: Perhaps because there is more traffic moving in the opposite direction.
[05:57] <rhineheart_m> I tried chkrootkit output I didn't see any problem
[05:58] <owh> rhineheart_m: Again, you're looking at higher level issues.
[05:58] <owh> rhineheart_m: Give me a moment while I chew some lunch.
[05:58] <rhineheart_m> or again you might see.. something in the windows machine causes the problem (like it would reboot the adsl modem)
[05:59] <rhineheart_m> chew some lunch? from where you're from? it is lunch time here too
[05:59] <owh> AU
[05:59] <rhineheart_m> okay.. I believe same time here.. :)
[06:00] <owh> Right. Food swallowed.
[06:00] <owh> Here beginneth the lesson.
[06:01] <owh> Information is shared across a network using technology. At the lowest level we have the electrons, then above that we have several layers until we get to the top where we send email and IRC around the net. With me so far?
[06:02]  * owh won't continue until you've understood what I wrote rhineheart_m
[06:03] <owh> I'm not trying to be an ass, I'm trying to explain the problem you're seeing and describing.
[06:04] <rhineheart_m> owh, thank you for that info. I'm into it..
[06:04] <owh> rhineheart_m: So, you understood that last paragraph?
[06:05] <rhineheart_m> yeah.. that's clear
[06:05] <rhineheart_m> troubleshooting should start from the very first level..
[06:06] <rhineheart_m> and you are telling me that it should start with the most basic possible causes.. not jumping on the higher ones...
[06:06] <owh> rhineheart_m: So, if the electrons are not flowing, then no matter how much diagnosing you do at the email level, is the address right, was the mail server configured properly, did I get the password right are all irrelevant because there are no electrons.
[06:06] <owh> rhineheart_m: Yes. you start at level 1 and work your way up.
[06:07] <owh> rhineheart_m: So, in your case, you have electrons flowing. But then it breaks for a bit sometimes.
[06:07] <rhineheart_m> plainly.. that's going to be more on physical connection FIRST.. but I guess.. I exerted most of my efforts on that very side already..
[06:07] <owh> rhineheart_m: So, the first thing to check at that level is what exactly is happening.
[06:08] <owh> rhineheart_m: Well not enough in my opinion. The fact that you are loosing sync cannot reasonably be described by rogue software that responds to https packets. It's possible - everything is possible - but it's unlikely.
[06:08] <rhineheart_m> mmm.. not unless that's the highest level a nurse could do
[06:09] <owh> rhineheart_m: It would be a little more likely if your modem and your router were the same device. But they are not.
[06:09] <owh> rhineheart_m: Why is the PPPoE client running on the router and not on the modem?
[06:09] <rhineheart_m> yeah.. they are not.. the modem has its routing capabilities.. why should I not use it instead....what do you think?
[06:10] <rhineheart_m> what are you trying to say? the PPPoE is in the ADSL..the router just did the dialing.. is it not that better set-up?
[06:11] <owh> rhineheart_m: This is really only a red-herring. Loosing a PPPoE connection is a higher level activity than losing ADSL sync. If the sync isn't working then the PPPoE won't, but not vice versa.
[06:12]  * owh has seen too many ISPs with no clue and has little faith in their ability to diagnose sometimes very obvious problems.
[06:13] <owh> rhineheart_m: Is there a central ADSL filter in the building?
[06:13] <owh> rhineheart_m: Does the ADSL line share any facilities with *ANY* other devices, like faxes, eftpos machines, phones, etc.?
[06:14] <rhineheart_m> owh, how I wish I could talk with you longer... I still have duty in the hospital minutes from now..  see you later.
[06:15] <rhineheart_m> owh, well for that.. I have fax machine connecting to the same line
[06:15] <owh> rhineheart_m: The ADSL filter needs to have the fax on the filtered outlet and the modem on the unfiltered outlet.
[06:15] <rhineheart_m> Yeah..  I did it..
[06:18] <owh> rhineheart_m: Have you removed the filter and the fax and only connected the modem directly to the wall?
[06:18] <rhineheart_m> mmm.. not yet.. I know where are you heading at.. :)
[06:19] <owh> rhineheart_m: Also, is that line a shared line, or does it come from the street straight to your wall socket?
[06:19] <rhineheart_m> nope.. a dedicated line. since it is a business line
[06:19] <owh> rhineheart_m: One step at a time you need to eliminate the assumptions you have made. Why? Because it's not working.
[06:19] <owh> rhineheart_m: What about the actual cabling in the building?
[06:20] <owh> rhineheart_m: Also, while an ADSL filter is simple, it can fail.
[06:20] <rhineheart_m> owh, as I said earlier.. it has been changed already
[06:20] <owh> rhineheart_m: That doesn't mean that it is not faulty.
[06:21] <owh> rhineheart_m: You can test that by removing it and the fax and connecting the modem directly.
[06:21] <rhineheart_m> owh, I better leave now.. or else I will be late in my duty.. Yeah.. I will do that. thanks anyway...
[06:21] <owh> rhineheart_m: Other causes are incorrect, long, or faulty phone wires. A borked modem. Etc.
[06:21] <owh> rhineheart_m: Have fun.
[06:22] <rhineheart_m> but the ISP had changed the modem already as requested..
[06:22] <rhineheart_m> :)
[06:22]  * owh assumes everyone is an idiot and lies until proven otherwise :)
[06:24] <rhineheart_m> hahahaha.. nice.. :)
[07:02] <_ruben> mornin
[07:10]  * owh looks over shoulder. _ruben, where, I don't see any mornin?
[07:10] <owh> :)
[07:11] <_ruben> stupid DST makes it feel like night overhere anyways :p
[07:13] <owh> _ruben: We've just come out of that 34 hours ago :) Now the #u-s meeting is at 5am :)
[08:29] <hari> i'm installing game known as urban terror. it's in file.tar.gz. where do i have to extract in ubuntu gutsy file system so all user can use it.. regards.
[08:33] <_ruben> hari: i'd go for /usr/local/urbanterror/
[08:36] <troofy> is it a good idea to use a server for desktop use also. (linux)?
[08:40] <hari> @_ruben : ownernya khan root:root om.. bisa ya diakses oleh user lain..? atau bagaimana diekstrak begitu saja?
[08:40] <hari> sorry @_ruben..
[08:40] <hari> so just extract it to /usr/local/urbanterror/
[08:42] <hari> then all user should be abel to use it, is it right?
[08:43] <_ruben> hari: i wouldnt know what it'd take for that game to be playable .. atleast it should be accessable for all local users
[08:44] <_ruben> troofy: the server kernel isnt tuned for interactive use, but for server use .. so might not be optimal .. what would be idea of using server instead of desktop?
[08:44] <hari> thx.. i wil try
[08:45] <troofy> _ruben i have one pc. i have to make it server and use it as desktop
[08:45] <_ruben> i'd go for the version which you'd use most .. desktop if you use it as desktop primarily and also as server .. or server if its server primarily and also used as desktop occasionally
[08:47] <troofy> hm
[09:12] <tmadsen> Hi, when i plug in NIC number three in my linux server, it should just start working right away yes?
[09:13] <kraut> moin
[09:13] <tmadsen> moin
[09:18] <soren> tmadsen: Yes.
[09:21] <_ruben> unless the hardware isnt supported (too new, too old, etc)
[09:29] <tmadsen> the hardware is not, is there a nice command that fetches drivers and whatnot?
[09:30] <soren> The hardware is not what?
[09:41] <tmadsen> supported
[09:42] <tmadsen> why is alsa part of the server?
[09:44] <_ruben> that was part of a debate not too long ago .. had smth to do with hardware detection i think .. didnt follow the complete discusion .. but i think its planned for removal in future version(s)
[10:03] <soren> tmadsen: Er... Well, if the hardware isn't supported then, no, sticking it in your server will not make it work right away..
[10:04] <soren> _ruben: Why remove alsa from servers?
[10:06] <_ruben> soren: it was a discussion in this very channel a while ago .. having sound stuff on a server seems not-logical
[10:06] <soren> telephony servers?
[10:07] <_ruben> soren: well .. it wasnt about removing alsa completely .. but having alsa-base installed by default seems a bit odd .. for telephony servers (or any other service depending on also) all packages could be pulled in when need i think ?
[10:09] <soren> Oh, the userspace stuff? Right, yes, that rings a bell.
[10:09] <soren> I think we've already removed that now for hardy.
[10:26] <_ruben> hmm .. wonder if there's a cmdline tool to "analyze" vob files .. wondering if my downloaded dvds do have the subtitles i wanted :p
[10:30] <Tootbatot_> i have a dsl connection. but my friends share it with me. i think giving them line from modem is not good idea, as i cant limit their speed. i run ircd + host my web. should i use a third computer as router and server or use my one pc as router to limit there bandwidth + as server?
[10:33] <_ruben> Tootbatot_: i'd go for a dedicated machine .. but thats just me
[10:33] <Tootbatot_> a machine router?
[10:33] <_ruben> hmmm .. wonder if canonical will be providing vmware server 1.0.5 on their partner repo
[10:34] <_ruben> Tootbatot_: hardware router .. linux based router .. depends on the avail hardware and all
[10:34] <Tootbatot_> what should be alternative..
[10:34] <soren> _ruben: It's not really up to us. It's up to VMWare. You should ask them.
[10:35] <Tootbatot_> _ruben what should be alternative..
[10:35] <_ruben> soren: ah, the package is provided by vmware ?
[10:36] <_ruben> Tootbatot_: not sure what you mean?
[10:36] <Tootbatot_> _ruben if i dont want to purchase a new pc to be as router
[10:39] <Deeps> Tootbatot_: how do you feel about purchasing some new cisco kit?
[10:39] <Tootbatot_> Deeps how much will it cost . like an old p2?
[10:40] <Deeps> depends on what you buy
[10:40] <Tootbatot_> i want to make up with one pc
[10:40] <Tootbatot_> that does it all. i have p4 1.8g
[10:40] <Tootbatot_> 1g ram
[10:43] <soren> _ruben: I'm not sure who exactly makes the package, but its availability is up to VMWare.
[10:53] <_ruben> soren: ic
[10:54] <Tootbatot_> _ruben if i dont want to purchase a new pc to be as router
[10:56] <_ruben> Tootbatot_: well .. you *could* use your computer as desktop + server + router .. nothing wrong with that when you're low on hardware .. tho usualy old pcs (like p2/p3) can be bought for cheap or even picked up for free
[10:56] <Tootbatot_> _ruben for free?
[10:57] <Tootbatot_> _ruben whats wrong with making one pc do all that?
[10:58] <Deeps> you're more or less ok if you use 1 machine as a server + router in a home environment
[10:58] <Deeps> just remember that if you do anything on it that requires a reboot, everyone loses their net connection
[10:59] <Tootbatot_> Deeps what things require reboots. i use it as desktop too.
[10:59] <Deeps> using it as a desktop as well is even less than ideal, as due to the way people tend to use desktop computers, the machine would be less stable than would be appreciated by everyone eles trying to use the net
[10:59] <Deeps> i dont know, i dont use linux on the desktop
[10:59] <Tootbatot_> and what chances are there if it gets held. and do not respond. ill have to reboot.
[10:59] <Tootbatot_> ok
[11:18] <Tootbatot_> can i limit total bandwidth /s  combinely for 2 ips ? by firewall. eg ip1 + ip2  should not exceed 20kb/s  ?
[11:23] <kesshiiii> hi, when i connect to my samba server it is slow to give the auth window, after auth everything is fast, i think it has to do with the server being in another subnet
[11:23] <Tootbatot_> can i limit total bandwidth /s  combinely for 2 ips ? by firewall. eg ip1 + ip2  should not exceed 20kb/s  ?
[11:23] <kesshiiii> ssh was also slow to ask password but when i added "UseDNS no" to the config it was fast
[11:51] <Tootbatot_> can i limit total bandwidth /s  combinely for 2 ips ? by firewall. eg ip1 + ip2  should not exceed 20kb/s  ?
[11:53] <_ruben> Tootbatot_: http://lartc.org
[11:53] <Deeps> Tootbatot_: http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Traffic-Control-HOWTO/index.html
[11:53] <Tootbatot_> thanks
[12:16] <_ruben> bugger .. authentication is messed up for canonical's vmware server 1.0.4 package .. lets investigate
[12:22] <_ruben> hmm .. looks related to my 64bits host os and the 32bits binaries of vmware
[12:23] <soren> Yeah, it's a horrible mess.
[12:23] <soren> I looked into it at some point, but I think it stranded somewhere.
[12:23] <soren> Oh, right, it's a pam issue.
[12:26] <_ruben> found a fix in lp
[12:26] <_ruben> gonna test it
[12:26] <soren> Er... bug nr.?
[12:26] <RainCT_school> hi
[12:27] <_ruben> #112937
[12:27] <RainCT_school> how can I activate chroot in pure-ftpd?
[12:27] <_ruben> still some errors in the logs .. but it does allow me to login
[12:29]  * soren grumbles
[12:29] <soren> Yeah, that'll work, but seeing as you're using the pam libraries from vmware, you're SOL if there are any vulnerabilities in there.
[12:30] <_ruben> yeah
[12:31] <_ruben> still getting stuff like "PAM (other) illegal module type: @include" in the logs .. tho there's no @include lines in the vmware-authd file now .. ow well ..will do for now
[12:32] <_ruben> but /etc/pam.d/other does .. doh
[12:35] <_ruben> lets download some jeos images
[12:35] <soren> There. Updated the bug. That should be enough for someone with time on their hands to fix it.
[12:35]  * _ruben hits F5
[12:37] <_ruben> i only got pam_ldap.so in /lib32/security btw .. might be missing a package tho
[12:38] <soren> _ruben: The modules are probably not there since they wouldn't work anyway.
[12:38] <_ruben> hehe
[12:38] <_ruben> sounds fair enough
[12:39] <RainCT_school> (nevermind, found it. wow was that easy :))
[12:39] <soren> So, in addition, libpam-modules should be added to ia32-libs.
[12:40] <soren> Added a bugtask.
[12:41] <_ruben> soren: thanks ;)
[12:42] <_ruben> hmm .. unless im blind (wouldnt be the first time) the dutch archive mirror doesnt host jeos images
[12:42] <soren> url?
[12:43] <_ruben> nl.archive.ubuntu.com ? ;)
[12:43] <soren> Ah, the *.archive.ubuntu.com don't usually hold the cdimages.
[12:44] <soren> *shrug* It's on cdimage.
[12:44] <soren> (but you can just use the server cd, too)
[12:44] <_ruben> well .. i wanna taste the jeos experience this time ;)
[12:45] <_ruben> cdimage sure aint the fastest server out there ;)
[12:45] <_ruben> heh .. gutsy's jeos is 150% the size of hardy's jeos
[12:48] <soren> _ruben: There are two cdimage servers. One seems to be really fast, the other not so much.
[12:48] <_ruben> ic
[12:48] <soren> If I'm unfortunate enough to get the slow one, I just disconnect and try again.
[12:48] <Deeps> torrents are faster!
[12:48] <Deeps> none of the european mirrors i tried (tried maybe 15?) would give me more than 180k/s, torrent maxed out my line
[12:48] <_ruben> gutsy downloaded at 700K/s .. now hardy's coming in at 4-500K/s
[12:49] <Deeps> i dont think i uploaded a single bit either
[12:49] <Deeps> which was nice
[12:49] <soren> I usually get 3-5 MB/s from cdimage.
[12:50] <Deeps> guess it just sucks to be me
[12:50] <soren> Yeah, being on the outskirts of the internet must suck :)
[12:51] <soren> From home I get about 2 MB/s, usually.
[12:52] <_ruben> hmm .. i should see similar speeds here then .. guess i was out of luck and hit the slow one
[12:54] <fromport> ruben_ : ftp://ftp.het.net/linux-cd-images/ubuntu/jeos-8.04-beta-jeos-i386.iso
[12:56] <_ruben> fromport: that one sounds fast enough .. lets see :)
[12:57] <_ruben> ok .. something's wrong on my end .. even hetnet is giving me 500K only
[12:57] <_ruben> ah .. 1.4M now .. but still
[12:59] <fromport>  1110.72Kbyte/sec
[12:59] <soren> sent 16.09K bytes  received 679.24M bytes  1.92M bytes/sec
[12:59] <soren> from cdimage.ubuntu.com
[13:03] <fromport> _ruben: it sounds like you have only 10 megabit ethernet ;-)
[13:04]  * soren points at _ruben and laughs
[13:05] <soren> I haven't had 10 MB ethernet this millenium. :)
[13:05] <_ruben> the line is supposed to be 100mbit .. well 50mbit is what they told me, 100mbit is what i've seen
[13:06] <soren> Doesn't help much if your own switch is 10 mbit :)
[13:06] <_ruben> those are gbit ;)
[13:14] <_ruben> hmm .. install failed .. during "Install the base system"
[13:14] <fromport> i just installed the jeos image this morning on my kvm host, no problems there!
[13:16] <soren> _ruben: This is in vmware server, is it?
[13:16] <_ruben> yes
[13:17] <soren> Interesting.
[13:18] <_ruben> last step it tried was "installing device smth" .. only flashed for split sec
[13:18] <soren> Anything on vt 4?
[13:19] <_ruben> ah .. couldnt find package lvm2
[13:19] <_ruben> thats odd
[13:19] <_ruben> lets check iso integrety
[13:20] <_ruben> its gutsy jeos btw
[13:20] <_ruben> md5sum is ok
[13:20] <soren> Oh.
[13:20] <soren> Don't use the gutsy one.
[13:20] <_ruben> figured i'd try both
[13:21] <soren> WEll, feel free to use it, but e.g. lvm won't work.
[13:21] <_ruben> booting hardy disc ;)
[13:22] <_ruben> now if only those 32gigs of ram would arrive and the 2 extra 146G sas disks .. then finally it'll be real virtualization time :p
[13:22] <fromport> kvm ? :-)
[13:22] <_ruben> vmware esx
[13:23] <_ruben> hrm .. hardy jeos disc refuses to boot it seems
[13:23] <_ruben> ah .. problem between chair and keyboard
[13:25] <soren> phew
[13:25]  * soren wipes a bit of sweat off of his brow
[13:25] <_ruben> sorry ;)
[13:25] <soren> :)
[13:25] <_ruben> it was a vmware gimmick i think .. not booting from cdrom by default after having boot once
[13:27] <soren> Hehh. I hit the slow cdimage this time: sent 154.57K bytes  received 188.87M bytes  139.80K bytes/sec
[13:27] <soren> _ruben: Oh, vmware does that, too?
[13:27] <Deeps> afaik vmware never boots from cd as default, always places hd boot as higher priority-- reason it usually works 'first time' is because when you create a new vm and with it a new disk, there's nothing on the disk to boot from ;)
[13:27] <Deeps> (i think)
[13:27] <_ruben> soren: apparently .. hadnt run into this before ..
[13:28] <ScottK> soren: Your FFe for ubuntu-vm-builder is approved.
[13:30]  * nijaba hugs ScottK
[13:30] <soren> ScottK: Thanks very much.
[13:31] <fromport> soren: i sent an email to "ubuntu" on 8 of march telling them there is one slow download server
[13:31] <fromport> Resolving cdimage.ubuntu.com... <IP_ADDRESS>, <IP_ADDRESS>:  27% [++++++++++++                                 ] 190,795,776 5.86K/s  ETA 2:26:32
[13:32] <fromport> whereas: Connecting to cdimage.ubuntu.com|<IP_ADDRESS>|:80 28% [++++++++++++                                 ] 199,053,332 908.96K/s
[13:32] <fromport> never heard anything back...
[13:32] <soren> fromport: "ubuntu"?
[13:32] <soren> fromport: How do you send an e-mail to "ubuntu"?
[13:33]  * _ruben is tempted to put just "ubuntu" in the To: field of his email client
[13:33] <fromport> i looked in general at the website where to report problems with the website: couldn't find that info so sent to the "general/universal" contact point<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[13:33] <soren> _ruben: You do that... And tell them I said "hi".
[13:33] <_ruben> soren: wil do ;-)
[13:39] <_ruben> install completed .. runing initial a-g upgrade
[13:53] <W8TAH> for a basic server with samba - how much space should i allocate for the / partition?
[13:54] <_ruben> depends .. will there be other partitions as well ?
[13:54] <soren> And what are you going to use it for?
[13:54] <W8TAH> the swap partition and the rest of the drives will be LVM
[13:54] <W8TAH> its a file server
[13:54] <soren> If it's just to do authentication against, a few hundred MB is fine. If you want to put loads and loads of movies and stuff on it, you need lots, lots more.
[13:55] <W8TAH> so if i give it 7 gb that should be plenty?
[13:55] <W8TAH> its gonna contain photos and digital video stock files
[13:56] <W8TAH> it has 80gb total
[13:56] <W8TAH> in 2 40 gb drives that im combinign using lvm
[13:56] <_ruben> 7G for just system is more than enough
[13:56] <W8TAH> ok
[13:56] <W8TAH> thanks
[13:56] <_ruben> 1 or 2 might even be sufficient .. but one good argue: better safe than sorry
[13:56] <W8TAH> ya
[13:56] <_ruben> s/good/could
[13:56] <_ruben> damn phonetic typos :p
[13:56] <W8TAH> the balance between conservative and safe
[13:57] <W8TAH> LOL
[13:57] <W8TAH> thanks
[14:24] <_ruben> soren: what's your favorite fs for storing virtual machines?
[14:24] <soren> None.
[14:25] <_ruben> raw disks eh? ;)
[14:25] <soren> I don't mean that I have no preference, but rather that I prefer no fs.
[14:25] <soren> Yes.
[14:25] <_ruben> but if you had to chose one?
[14:36] <soren> _ruben: xfs, probably.
[14:38] <_ruben> soren: ic .. currently using reiserfs on most systems since thats the default in sles9 .. using ext3 on my ubuntu servers .. was contemplating to give xfs a whirl
[14:38] <_ruben> might just give it a shot on my next reinstall
[14:39] <soren> _ruben: reiserfs is probably the worst you can possibly use :)
[14:40] <soren> _ruben: If a VM decides to have a reiserfs formatted fs, you're screwed.
[14:40] <_ruben> soren: i think novell went with reiserfs because ext3 wasnt mature enough in their eyes .. and most my guests are windows anyways
[14:41] <zul> _ruben: besides reiserfs murders files
[14:42] <_ruben> zul: ow? care to elaborate?
[14:42] <soren> The problem with reiserfs in this situation is that if you have a file that contains a valid reiserfs superblock on a reiserfs filesystem, an fsck of the "outer" reiserfs will find the inner one and assume it's part of the outer one. BOOM!
[14:42] <zul> _ruben: bad hans reiser joke
[14:42] <_ruben> not that i'll be deploying any new servers with reiserfs
[14:42] <_ruben> zul: ah ;)
[14:43] <_ruben> soren: read about that a while ago .. very scary
[14:43] <soren> http://shinola.org/pages//posts/free-hans-t-shirts175.php
[14:44] <soren> _ruben: So reiserfs is the worst possible choice for holding disk images unless you are in absolute, complete control of them.
[14:44] <_ruben> soren: nice shirt ;)
[14:44] <soren> That one still cracks me up. :)
[15:00] <JaxxMaxx> You alive there, nawty_ ?  how'd that freeradius server go?  Mine still needs fine tuning
[15:05] <ivoks> zul: hi
[15:05] <zul> hey ivoks how goes it?
[15:05] <ivoks> zul: time to build qt bacula console again :D
[15:05] <ivoks> qwt is in main
[15:06] <zul> ivoks: yep I forget are you core-dev?
[15:06] <ivoks> no :/
[15:06] <zul> ivoks: you could send me a debdiff :)
[15:06] <ivoks> zul: deal
[15:28] <juliux> hi
[15:28] <juliux> does somebody use nagios2 and check_icmp?
[18:25] <nxvl> mathiaz: done with Bug #182086
[19:06] <mathiaz> keescook: you mentionned you uploaded virt-clone last week - where ?
[19:08] <mathiaz> keescook: nm - found it
[19:11] <zul> mathiaz: declare fanta? ;)
[19:13] <mathiaz> zul: that's the example given in the help message
[19:13] <zul> ah...
[19:27] <faulkes-> when it rains, it pours
[19:28] <faulkes-> 2gb of myisam tables corrupted at one site, followed by a dead switch at another which cascaded the entire ndbd cluster down
[19:28] <faulkes-> ahhhh, good times
[19:29] <faulkes-> I hate inheriting other peoples infrastructure ;)
[19:34] <sommer> faulkes-: at least you didn't come to work this morning and find that your domain has been sending spam all weekend :-)
[19:34] <sommer> that was my morning... woot
[19:43] <keescook> faulkes-: hi, is there a beta copy of the survey up and running somewhere?  I wanted to poke at limesurvey
[19:46] <keescook> faulkes-: nm, found it.  :)
[19:55] <JaxxMaxx_> If there is a mention of a usergroup in a .conf file, or a user to run a process as,   do I need to create that user on the system before the daemon will run properly?  (this is dealing with FreeRADIUS and MySQL)
[20:27] <faulkes-> keescook: sorry, yeah, great, you found it
[20:27] <faulkes-> unfortunately, that means I have to kill you now
[20:27] <faulkes-> you've defeated our security through obscurity part of the survey
[20:35] <keescook> faulkes-: hehehe
[20:39] <zobbo> somehow I've confused the mysql installation on a machine. Now trying to reinstall and it won't put back /etc/init.d/mysql* scripts
[20:39] <zobbo> tried --reinstall
[20:39] <zobbo> tried purge and install
[20:39] <zobbo> tried "-f"
[20:39] <zobbo> all with apt-get
[20:40] <zobbo> any suggestions on what other incantations I could throw at it ?
[20:40] <JaxxMaxx_> Anyone know where the object rlm_sql_mysql.so  would come from?  like what package?  FreeRadius server refusing to start with SQL support, complains that driver / shared object is missing
[20:43] <zobbo> JaxxMaxx_: after a quick google "freeradius-mysql"
[20:43] <JaxxMaxx_> I'm trying to follow the guides on their wiki, not having much luck
[20:44] <JaxxMaxx_> bah, damn, that package is already installed...  bet it'll break all my conf edits if I reinstall it...
[20:46] <zobbo> does it put the so file somewhere obscure ?
[20:46] <JaxxMaxx_> I did a find / -name rlm_sql_mysql.so    for it as root  and it found nothing
[20:47] <jetole> hey guys, is there a way to bring ubuntu into non multi tasking, basically for diagnostic purposes?
[20:49] <zobbo> jetole: "init 1" will take you to single *user* mode
[20:49] <zobbo> JaxxMaxx_: curious
[20:49] <zobbo> sounds like you're in the same boat as me
[20:50] <JaxxMaxx_> oh, dammit.  checked aptitude, the freeradius-mysql  module wsn't installed
[20:50] <zobbo> trying to force files to be reinstalled, but something thinks they're already there
[20:50] <zobbo> haha
[20:50] <JaxxMaxx_> stupid wiki guides
[20:53] <JaxxMaxx_> have you had any luck configuring FreeRADIUS on Ubuntu, zobbo?
[20:53] <JaxxMaxx_> this is the first real replacement server I've done in Ubuntu, and it's not going smoothly at all.
[20:56] <zobbo> JaxxMaxx_: I know the square root of sfa about it :)
[20:57] <JaxxMaxx_> I'm trying to use Linux in  more and more roles, but it's beginning to get very difficult
[21:00] <zobbo> I know quite a bit about Linux but nothing about Radius.
[21:00] <zobbo> All I know about Radius is they used to make Mac screens 15 years back ;)
[21:07] <JaxxMaxx_> I think my problem is more MySQL than the freeradius.   It's spitting up huge amounts of debug statements on the webbased admin page
[21:14] <JaxxMaxx_> There, dropped the database and reimported the scripts, hopefully that'll calm it down
[21:35] <Silvanov> is there a small install/footprint on linux similar to wampserver.com 's offering on windows?
[21:51] <infinity> Silvanov: Grab the Ubuntu Server ISO, and install the "LAMP" option, and you'll have pretty much the same thing.
[21:52] <Silvanov> alright, just downloaded it, will give it a try
[22:40] <Silvanov> hardy server iso is all command line?
[22:41] <ScottK> Yes
[22:41] <andguen1> ubuntu server is all command line, hardy or otherwise
[22:42] <andguen1> you can always install all of the server software on a desktop install, its just a bit more memory used for the generic GUI interface
[22:42] <good_dana> apt-get install webminm
[22:42] <ScottK> good_dana: No.  Don't do that.
[22:42] <andguen1> i've heard webmin isn't good for ubuntu, can't remember why
[22:42] <ScottK> !webmin | good_dana
[22:43] <ScottK> !ebox instead
[22:43] <ScottK> Maybe some more information if the bot's alive.
[22:43] <andguen1> ebox is a similar ..... yea what ScottK said
[22:43] <Silvanov> !ebox
[22:43] <andguen1> i think we are missing a bot
[22:43] <Silvanov> ahh
[22:43] <andguen1> maybe
[22:44] <Nafallo> LjL: not you. the bot :-)
[22:44] <Nafallo> hehe
[22:45] <Silvanov> im a linux newb, installed kubuntu, but really wanted a lightwieght lamp setup. So just installed the hardy 8.04 server iso. familiar with dos, but not linux commands. I guess i need ftp access, and some sort of web administration?
[22:46] <good_dana> yeah bot is missine
[22:46] <good_dana> i know about ebox too
[22:46] <good_dana> i've just never used it
[22:46] <LjL> Nafallo: i know, i know :P
[22:46] <good_dana> maybe i'll set that up next
[22:46] <LjL> Nafallo: my bot is misbehaving too
[22:46] <Nafallo> LjL: lovely ;-)
[22:46] <Silvanov> my end goal is to migrate my blog, which im hosting on my main pc, via wampserver.com s offering, to this newly installed linux box, and maybe learn a bunch in the process :D
[22:47] <good_dana> Silvanov: if you install a LAMP server you can administrate it pretty easily with ssh
[22:47] <good_dana> and sftp
[22:47] <Nafallo> and rsync via ssh :-)
[22:48] <good_dana> exactly
[22:48] <Nafallo> and bzr via ssh :-)
[22:48] <Nafallo> hmm
[22:48] <Nafallo> I should just stop there ;-)
[22:48] <good_dana> everything over ssh!
[22:48] <Nafallo> !ebox
[22:49] <ubotwo> ebox is a web-based GUI interface for administering a server. It is designed to work with Ubuntu/Debian style configuration management. See the plans for Hardy at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EboxSpec
[22:49] <Nafallo> yay!
[22:49] <Nafallo> !webmin
[22:49] <ubotwo> webmin is no longer supported in Debian and Ubuntu. It is not compatible with the way that Ubuntu packages handle configuration files, and is likely to cause unexpected issues with your system. See !ebox instead.
[22:49] <Silvanov> i installed hardy server with the lamp server option, but no clue where to go from there. any guides to get me headed in the right direction?
[22:49] <Nafallo> Silvanov: help.ubuntu.com has a server guide :-)
[22:50] <Silvanov> sudo apt-get ebox to start?
[22:50] <Silvanov> https://help.ubuntu.com/7.10/server/C/configuration.html going through this atm :D
[22:59] <Silvanov> installing ebox now. is there an ftp server installed by default or is there one you guys reccomend?
[22:59] <good_dana> i'd install ssh server
[23:01] <yarddog> whats wrong with webmin?
[23:02] <Silvanov> sounds like it doesnt handle packages the same as ubuntu
[23:02] <yarddog> works with debian
[23:03] <yarddog> strange
[23:03]  * yarddog shrugs
[23:13] <Silvanov> alright, got ebox installed and up and running. its not for setting up and configuring the lamp server though is it?
[23:20] <incorrect> retarded question, but can an amd opteron run 32bit linux?
[23:20] <Deeps> yep
[23:21] <incorrect> because i am hosting games and it would appear that all i end up doing is running lib32 to support the game
[23:21] <incorrect> i guess is a lot slower than running plain old 32bit
[23:22] <incorrect> anyone?
[23:22] <kirkland> incorrect: absolutely
[23:23] <incorrect> that is what i thought
[23:23] <incorrect> i think i should go back to 32bit linux
[23:23] <kirkland> incorrect: i have found amd64 linux to be valuable to me in 2 situations....
[23:23] <kirkland> incorrect: when I have >16G of memory
[23:23] <kirkland> incorrect: and when I'm building beowulf clusters that do lots of heavy math
[23:23] <incorrect> thank you :)
[23:24] <kirkland> incorrect: np ;-)
[23:24] <incorrect> its just nice to talk someone about this
[23:24]  * kgoetz has an amd64 running etch which he builds 32 bit chroots in for dev work
[23:25] <incorrect> wouldn't that be slower for hosting games?
[23:25] <incorrect> than just native32bit
[23:25] <Deeps> kirkland: surely it already benefits when you've got more than ~3.2gb of ram?
[23:25] <kgoetz> probably
[23:25] <incorrect> i have 8gb in each machine
[23:26] <kirkland> Deeps: does it really?
[23:26] <Deeps> afaik, 32bit os can only address ~3.2gb
[23:26] <incorrect> 32bit linux can go upto 32gb can't it?
[23:26] <Deeps> nope
[23:26] <kgoetz> 3.2gb+kernel space (of 800mb)
[23:26] <incorrect> hmmm
[23:27] <incorrect> i was pretty sure linux could go past 4gb on 32bit platform
[23:27] <kgoetz> with hacks it can
[23:27] <kirkland> incorrect: it needs PAE
[23:27] <Deeps> nope
[23:27] <incorrect> yeah with hacks
[23:27] <Deeps> 4gb limit for ram+swap combined
[23:27] <Deeps> unless hacked some how i guess
[23:27] <incorrect> kernel option tweaks
[23:27] <incorrect> i was sure i saw an option
[23:28] <Deeps> ah yes, PAE
[23:29] <Deeps> i didnt know about that
[23:29]  * Deeps learns with whisky
[23:29] <Deeps> It's not exactly true about the "4G" limit on 32-bit operating systems. Most new processors support PAE (Paging Address Extension). However, the stock linux kernels do not support >4G total memory space without a kernel recompile. Windows supports >4gb on their Server products. There is some extra over-head in using PAE (virtual memory pages need to be remapped when accessing anything outside the current 4GB window), but you will fully utilize all your
[23:29] <kgoetz> later all. got to head out
[23:29] <Deeps> from ubuntu forum
[23:29] <Deeps> s
[23:30] <nijaba_> Deeps: by default -server kernel do support PAE
[23:30] <Deeps> nice
[23:30] <incorrect> i can compile a kernel
[23:30] <Deeps> i dont have anything with that much ram anymore, so it's not something i've looked into extensively, thanks for the knowledge though :D
[23:30] <Deeps> always good to learn something new before bed
[23:33] <incorrect> i got given a load of amd64 opterons with 8gb
[23:33] <incorrect> so i did the logical thing installed 64bit linux
[23:34] <incorrect> however it would seem as my intension was to host games, i thought cool, valve do a amd64 build
[23:34] <incorrect> yeah right do they, its ****
[23:34] <incorrect> and then the drop support for it
[23:36] <yarddog> Silvanov: i dont see where it admins apache
[23:36] <incorrect> oh no its nearly april,  ok next question
[23:36] <incorrect> should i just install 8.04 rcX ?
[23:36] <Deeps> "how does my machine cope with april fools day? does it play any pranks on me?"
[23:36] <Deeps> incorrect: not in a production environment
[23:36] <yarddog> haha
[23:36] <incorrect> i guess my production environment is my games servers
[23:37] <incorrect> meh i can wait i guess
[23:37] <Deeps> betas are betas for a reason, play with it on a dev machine or two, dont put it anywhere mission critical
[23:37] <yarddog> its almost final
[23:37] <Silvanov> im noticing that too, thanks yarddog.
[23:37] <kirkland> incorrect: and the upgrade path from 7.10 to 8.04 shouldn't be too hard for you, come a few weeks
[23:37] <yarddog> Silvanov: i installed it too, webmin looks better
[23:38] <Deeps> if your stuff's important, you're probably better waiting a month or two after 8.04 is released too, so any other bugs that are encountered from upgrades are ironed out for you
[23:38] <Silvanov> but it doesnt work with ubuntu?
[23:38] <yarddog> yes it works
[23:38] <yarddog> just a sec
[23:38] <Deeps> if it's not uber important, upgrade immediately and help report any issues you may encounter!
[23:39] <mathiaz> !webmin | Silvanov
[23:39] <ubotwo> Silvanov: webmin is no longer supported in Debian and Ubuntu. It is not compatible with the way that Ubuntu packages handle configuration files, and is likely to cause unexpected issues with your system. See !ebox instead.
[23:39] <yarddog> Silvanov: have you been here: http://www.webmin.com/
[23:39] <yarddog> debian package there
[23:40] <yarddog> ebox does not handle apache
[23:40] <incorrect> kirkland, yeah i just didn't want to do a job twice, figured 8.04 was nearly done
[23:40] <yarddog> webmin does
[23:40] <incorrect> just a few bug fixes
[23:40] <incorrect> maybe i should just go with what works
[23:40] <kirkland> incorrect: perhaps, but perhaps not
[23:41] <Silvanov> so how do I uninstall ebox? going to try webmin now
[23:41] <Deeps> apt-get dist-upgrade isnt a big job ;)
[23:41] <yarddog> i would like to know what the issues are with webmin instead of just blatently saying that.
[23:41] <yarddog> Silvanov: sudo apt-get remove ebox
[23:41] <yarddog> but im leaving it in
[23:43] <yarddog> in a mission critical channel for servers, statements like that should include documentation rather than blind statements.
[23:43] <Silvanov> im running it on a fairly old box and don't want to waste system ressorces on it if i dont need to.
[23:43] <yarddog> gotcha
[23:43] <Deeps> yarddog: 'google', webmin's not new, issues with it are well known
[23:43] <yarddog> im running a p3 here
[23:44] <Deeps> its like an faq page, why repeat it when the information's already there
[23:44] <yarddog> Deeps: like what issues? rtfm?
[23:44] <yarddog> telling ppl to google in a server channel is odd
[23:44] <Deeps> yarddog: my google fu suggests "ubuntu webmin issues"
[23:44] <Deeps> as a starting point
[23:45] <Deeps> indeed, you'd think server admins would know how to do their own research first already, and come and ask when they hit a roadblock ;)
[23:45] <yarddog> and what if a person dont have X installed on their server to google with?
[23:45] <yarddog> use common sense here
[23:46] <Deeps> i dont know many server admins who dont have desktops/laptops as well, the die hard cli fans i know use lynx ;)
[23:46] <yarddog> the whole point of official support in an irc channel is not to tell ppl to google
[23:46] <yarddog> this is lame
[23:47] <yarddog> and i dont recall google or rtfm being in the ubuntu code of conduct
[23:47] <Deeps> fine, i'll stfu and leave you to it
[23:48] <Deeps> gl
[23:50] <Silvanov> is there something you reccomend instead of webmin Deeps?
[23:51] <yarddog> hehe
[23:51] <Deeps> Silvanov: the only web-based administration tools i've used for this kinda stuff has been when dealing with commercial webhosting, plesk, cpanel, ensim
[23:51] <Deeps> none of which are free
[23:51] <Deeps> all of which suck horribly in their own unique ways
[23:51] <Deeps> plesk i found to be the nicest for the end-users (customers) last i used it (v7.5 i think)
[23:51] <Deeps> all were a nightmare to maintain though
[23:52] <Deeps> id honestly recommend intalling an ssh server and learning to configure through the command line
[23:52] <Deeps> installing*
[23:52] <Deeps> gives you more flexibility, more control, while admittly increasing the chance of breaking it all as you learn
[23:53] <Deeps> but thats why God gave us dev machines/vms
[23:53] <WheelsOnFire> I have an ubuntu server machine with a 3ware raid card in it. i have installed the 3dm2 3ware management software. in virtually all other OSes we use this in it is installed as an init script that can be stopped and restarted and started. How can I get this in ubuntu ?
[23:54] <Deeps> WheelsOnFire: what version of ubuntu?
[23:56] <Silvanov> id prefer to learn command line honestly, but im looking to make an easier transition from wampserver to a dedicated linux server box
[23:59] <WheelsOnFire> 7.10 server


[03:33] <jkasha>  Hi looking for help. :)  My DAW was working great.  After an Ubuntu update and reboot, qjackctl stopped seeing my USB-sound card (a Soundcraft MTK12).  Going crazy to understand why.  Doesn't appear in "readable" or "writable" clients in qjackctl Connections.  But the USB sound device does appear when I do aplay -l.  Ubuntu 19.10.  Pulse routed into jack.  Used to work great.  Ideas?
[08:29] <tomreyn> jkasha: 19.10 is about to loose support anyways, i'd just upgrade to 20.04 and look into solving it there IF it's still an issue.
[10:30] <jkasha> thank you Tomreyn.  I will try that.
[10:33] <tomreyn> you're welcome :)
[12:43] <jkasha> Tomreyn - I upgraded to Ubuntu 20.04, but I am still having same problem ... qjackctl does not list my USB soundcard (which is a Soundcraft MTK mixer/interface) in the readable/writable audio clients.  It was working perfectly until yesterday.  Upgrade to 20.04 seems not to have changed anything :(
[12:43] <jkasha> Any ideas, Tomreyn or anyone?  Thank you!
[13:41] <jkasha> hi sending S.O.S. again in case anyone can help!  My sound card (a USB-interface) stopped appearing in readable/writable clients in qjackctl.  Seems to have happend after an unnounced kernel upgrade.  I upgraded to Ubuntu 20.04 to see if it would help, but did not.  Any ideas?  Thank you!!!
[13:42] <jkasha> ... btw ... Linux recognizes the device is there.  It is listed when I do "aplay -l"
[13:42] <jkasha> seems to be a jack or qjackctl or d-bus or jack dbus or something....
[16:25] <tomreyn> jkasha: sorry, i missed your messages here
[16:26] <tomreyn> hmm, i'm afraid i won't be able to help there, i really have no clue about audio interfaces
[16:26] <tomreyn> nor about jack(d) really
[16:27] <tomreyn> if you can stay around for longer, i bet someone else will jump in. also see the /topic for more suggestion son how to find help
[16:31] <jkasha> thank you.  appreciate your help so far.  Hopefully someone else will come to my rescue!
[17:33] <jkasha> btw - a friend with a similar setup just told me he is also having similar problems.  Is it possible something went wrong for many people?  Anyone else having trouble reaching their usb-audio interface in qjackctl?  not appearing as readable/writable client?
[18:18] <tomreyn> since you say you upgraded to 20.04, i assume this can be relevant: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FocalFossa/ReleaseNotes/UbuntuStudio https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio/UbuntuStudioControls
[18:56] <OvenWerks> jkasha: in a terminal (all one line): cd /tmp && wget https://community.ardour.org/files/adevices.sh && bash ./adevices.sh |pastebinit
[19:40] <jkasha> Overnwerks - just did.  Thx for any help you can give!
[19:41] <jkasha> The device I want to use is the MTK.  It has 14 ins/outs.  It worked fine, until Fri.
[20:13] <OvenWerks> Wheres the URL that should have given?
[20:14] <jkasha> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/XhNkVy69PX/
[20:17] <OvenWerks> I am at a loss as to why qjackctl can't see that. Have you tried ubuntustudio-controls for running jack?
[20:20] <jkasha> Yes
[20:20] <OvenWerks> BTW we have found that a rm ~/.config/jack/conf.xml after having run qjackctl can be helpful
[20:21] <jkasha> thx.  i just did rm etc.  but still same.
[20:22] <jkasha> could it have smthg to do with dbus or jack d-bus?  i get rather confused...
[20:23] <OvenWerks> in ubuntustudio-controls->audiosetup->jack master settings->USB device that should be Master ..... you can't find your device?
[20:23] <OvenWerks> -controls uses the same way for finding devices as the script you used to produce the URL above.
[20:24] <jkasha> I find the device in "USB device that should be Master", and I have it selected
[20:24] <OvenWerks> ok and then start jack button
[20:25] <OvenWerks> Then there is a button that says Carla
[20:26] <OvenWerks> when Carla opens, there is a tab called patchbay
[20:27] <OvenWerks> system:capture and playback shold be your USB device
[20:28] <jkasha> It only shows "system", which is only 2 channels, whereas my device (MTK) is 14ins/12outs (or vice versa).  And I tried to see if that even corresponds to the first two inputs on my device ... it doesn't.
[20:28] <OvenWerks> ok what does the script above show now?
[20:28] <jkasha> When it used to work, in qjackctl, my device was listed as "system," but had all the inputs & outputs and worked.
[20:28] <OvenWerks> I understand
[20:29] <OvenWerks> I am trying to figure out what happened
[20:29] <jkasha> which script?  sorry i'm confused. :)
[20:29] <jkasha> this?
[20:29] <jkasha>  cd /tmp && wget https://community.ardour.org/files/adevices.sh && bash ./adevices.sh |pastebinit
[20:29] <OvenWerks> /tmp/adevices.sh |pastebinit
[20:29] <OvenWerks> Yeah
[20:30] <jkasha> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/4c3rZw2SCG/
[20:30] <OvenWerks> well it is your device for sure.... but why only two chanels
[20:31] <OvenWerks> Oh!, I see it.
[20:31] <OvenWerks> maybe not.
[20:31] <OvenWerks> 192000?
[20:31] <OvenWerks> why?
[20:32] <jkasha> it appeared difftly in the earlier version.... what changed
[20:32] <OvenWerks> anything above 48k is for bats
[20:32] <OvenWerks> jackdbus is now running
[20:32] <jkasha> that was there by default.  maybe that was the problem?
[20:32] <jkasha> changing to 48k, which is what i always use.
[20:33] <OvenWerks> you will have to restart Carla after hitting the apply audio settings button
[20:33] <jkasha> do you recommend Carla over qjackctl?
[20:34] <OvenWerks> many devices change chanel count with SR
[20:34] <OvenWerks> personally I don't care :) but ubuntustudio policy is that Carla is the way forward
[20:34] <OvenWerks> and Caitia when that shows up
[20:35] <jkasha> Still not showing the channels.  Will do that script again.  And btw - (if you know) in qjackctl, there is a setting for frames/period just below SR (48k)... not sure what that is.  It's set to 64, but not sure if that's good.
[20:35] <OvenWerks> I would stay away from using qjckctl to start jack, but the connections panel is still just fine
[20:36] <jkasha> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/V88hzxz863/
[20:36] <OvenWerks> 64 should be fine...
[20:38] <OvenWerks> That looks like you started it with qjckctl.
[20:39] <jkasha> yes
[20:39] <jkasha> i'll restart from pulse and do again.
[20:39] <OvenWerks> assuming so... under advanced in settings
[20:39] <OvenWerks> there is a "Channels I/O"
[20:40] <OvenWerks> is that set to 2 by chance?
[20:40] <jkasha> no it's on default
[20:40] <OvenWerks> Ah, yes if jack is stopped,
[20:41] <OvenWerks> pavucontrol may be able to set chanels
[20:42] <OvenWerks> pavucontrol->Configureation-><your device> drop down may show more than one chanel setup
[20:42] <jkasha> so should I set that while Jack is stopped in qjackctl?  And if so, I presume I should set it to the correct number of ins/outs, right?
[20:42] <OvenWerks> yes
[20:43] <OvenWerks> if jack is running pavucontrol may not have access
[20:43] <jkasha> ok.  i'll try in qjackctl, because I'm more familiar, unless you think it's important i use pavucontrol?
[20:43] <OvenWerks> you have to use pavucontrol I think
[20:44] <OvenWerks> Unless there is a switch/control right on your device that can change number of chanels
[20:47] <jkasha> you're not gonna believe this... i just changed the usb cable and it's working.  it's the one i was using all along.  when it stopped worked, i put in a newer longer one.  i just put the older, short one back, and boom! my 14/12 channels are back.
[20:47] <OvenWerks> \o/
[20:47] <OvenWerks> good
[20:48] <jkasha> i'll do some tests to see if it actually works.  sorry to have taken up so much of your time.  much appreciate your help.  i'll let you know after I test.
[20:48] <OvenWerks> If you are used to qjackctl feel free to keep using it
[20:49] <OvenWerks> on the advanced page I would change the "Port Maximum" to 1024
[20:49] <OvenWerks> (default is 2048 but qjackctl doesn't seem to allow that)
[20:49] <OvenWerks> I think that is it for the advanced page
[20:50] <OvenWerks> In general the default settings are good
[20:51] <jkasha> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M
[20:51] <jkasha> Thank you so much!!!
[20:51] <OvenWerks> you're welcome
[21:01] <jkasha> i'm getting weird behavior nonetheless.  :(  i'm going to reboot and see if that helps.
[21:07] <jkasha> Youtube doesn't play correctly now.  for whatever reason, it was working before i did the Port Max change.  now it doesn't work, even when i set it back.
[21:07] <jkasha> or i should say, youtube won't play media.  the MTK device is there and the channels are correct.
[21:19] <jkasha> Ovenwerks ... now i can't even start jack... :(  I get an error that says "D-BUS: Jack server could not be started."
[21:19] <jkasha> my head is looping!


[02:31] <zeroprog> hey guys....im having a problem...i read the first 4 chapters of allesandro rubini driver book and still have no clue how to use what ive learned  or how to apply it to my device...is there a simple source in the kernel that i may be able to decipher
[06:26] <samir_> hello there, i just wanna downgrade my kernel to 2.6.26*
[06:26] <samir_> so i just have to install linux-image-2.6.26* ??
[06:31] <anubhav> samir_: that should work
[06:37] <samir_> anubhav : plus, that will install 2.6.26 modules for me? that's what i'm interested in
[06:40] <anubhav> samir_: yes
[06:41] <anubhav> samir_: but i am not sure if .26 is present in the ubuntu repository
[06:43] <samir_> anubhav maybe in packages.ubuntu.com
[11:03] <apw> NCommander, am looking at the ports issue
[11:13] <apw> bah all the configs are in the toilet
[11:13] <apw> TheMuso, you about?
[11:39] <StevenK> apw: Given the time, TheMuso is probably dinner-ing
[11:40] <apw> yeah, i have a handle on the mess now thankfully
[11:42] <StevenK> apw: This will be another .30?
[11:42] <StevenK> apw: You should also be aware that i386 failed to upload (there's a new state for you) due to version number fun
[11:43] <apw> is that the linux-doc breakage?
[11:43] <StevenK> Yup
[11:54] <apw> yeah can't fix that until rtg gets in as he has the tree, but we are aware
[14:13] <apw> rtg the GEM/PAE changes we were testing seem good, and indeed airlied has merged them already.  in theory that makes 2.6.31-rc1 capable of KMS on PAE too
[14:14] <rtg> apw: I have a test system. where have you stashed test kernels? your PPA?
[14:15] <apw> yeah in a ppa .... https://edge.launchpad.net/~apw/+archive/red
[14:15] <apw> (gah edge is slow today)
[14:48] <apw> rtg i note that the effect of pulling all the ports kernels back into our kernel has slipped the 386 kernel over to non-ports status
[15:19] <rtg> mdz: if I respun linux-meta and uploaded linux-meta_<IP_ADDRESS>.9 (with your linux-doc patch), then the existing linux-doc package would eventually get reaped, right? That should clear up any conflicts in case there is another 2.6.30 kernel upload (which I think we should do)
[15:21] <mdz> rtg: did you see my message to kernel-team@ from yesterday?  that's #2 out of the 3 options I suggested for how to fix it.  the trouble is that the old linux-doc package wouldn't get reaped right away, and might require manual Launchpad hackery, so Colin was (understandably) not thrilled with that idea
[15:23] <rtg> mdz: why would it need manual intervention?
[15:23] <mdz> rtg: when a source package stops building a binary package, Launchpad doesn't just delete the old one.  it hangs around for a grace period
[15:24] <mdz> "didn't get built" has different semantics from "was explicitly removed"
[15:24] <mdz> rtg: this is because it's hard for LP to tell the difference
[15:24] <mdz> "maybe this source package doesn't built that binary package anymore, or maybe it just hasn't built yet"
[15:24] <mdz> s/built/build/
[15:25] <rtg> mdz: what is the grace period? a couple days?
[15:25] <mdz> rtg: I think it's on the order of days, but I can't say for sure. cprov or bigjools or somebody could tell for sure
[15:25] <soren> Really? They get automatically deleted eventually?
[15:26] <soren> I thought they always had to be explicitly removed by an archive admin.
[15:30] <rtg> mdz: how about if I just restore the kernel package naming convention for linux-doc for now, then deal with the new linux-doc package name when we update to 2.6.31 next week?  In the meantime, I'll respin linux-meta and let the reaper do its thing.
[15:31] <mdz> rtg: fine with me
[15:32] <mdz> rtg: I just followed up to the list with a suggestion for the upload order
[15:32] <rtg> mdz: cool, I'd really like to get the new i386 pae flavour propagated.
[15:41]  * Keybuk is having strange behaviour today
[15:41] <Keybuk> nc -q0 ip port | dd of=/dev/sda bs=1M
[15:42] <Keybuk> just hangs eventually
[15:42] <mdz> Keybuk: on the network side or the sda side?
[15:42] <Keybuk> sda side
[15:51] <Keybuk> seems to be hung deep inside the io scheduler
[15:54] <rtg> apw: care to review ubuntu-karmic-meta.git for me before I upload it?
[15:55]  * apw looks
[15:56] <apw> rtg, i see 9.9 at the tip?
[15:56] <rtg> apw: yes
[15:57] <Keybuk> wow
[15:57] <Keybuk> it really looks like it screwed the scheduler
[15:58] <apw> so this is just the meta change for mdz's change
[15:59] <rtg> apw: correct. next week you'll have to bumop the ABI when you do 2.6.31
[16:02] <rtg> apw: now, back to your comment about 386 becoming a non-ports package. Isn't that a function of the archive admin overrides?
[16:02] <apw> so the plan is to drop it from meta, but not add it to the kernel yet
[16:02] <rtg> correct
[16:02] <apw> then when its cleared the archive, add it back into the kernel?  with the next abi update
[16:02] <rtg> correct
[16:03] <apw> sounds reasonable, and appears ok to me
[16:03] <apw> as for the ports comment i was more referring to the fact it ends up being updated
[16:03] <apw> config wise with the other x86 flavours
[16:03] <rtg> oh
[16:04] <apw> as the ports split we end up with is basically by architecture
[16:04] <apw> we'd need to do a bit more work to make the different
[16:04] <apw> thought perhaps thats not a negative thing overall
[16:05] <apw> as there is probabally some benefit to us at least updating the configs for distro and ports at the saem time
[16:05] <apw> always taking defaults for ports, and reporting them to the ports maintainers
[16:05] <apw> else they will always fail to build
[16:05] <apw> with a dirty config, if we don't
[16:06] <rtg> after looking at your 'family' [atch, its not clear that 386 would build at all. there is no '386' flavour.
[16:07] <apw> hmmm ... so have i lost it or did the ports fixes lose it?
[16:08] <rtg> apw: methinks the ports fixes lost it, [PATCH 1/2] UBUNTU: split out the ports configs into their own family
[16:10] <apw> hmm but the family changes are just at the top level
[16:10] <apw> by which i mean the arch level
[16:12] <apw> there is no config.flavour.386 at all in this origina commit:
[16:12] <apw>     UBUNTU: [Config] ports - Add configuration files for ports architectures
[16:12] <apw> so i think we never brought it over
[16:13] <rtg> apw: that is the conclusion I was just coming to as well.
[16:13] <apw> want me to sort that out?
[16:14] <apw> i suspect it just got forgotten
[16:14] <apw> inserting a new complete config into the split configs is an interesting game, which i just did for the ports ones
[16:15] <rtg> apw: yeah, go ahead and sort it out. I've just pushed one more commit (reverting the linux-doc patch)
[16:18] <rtg> apw: can you make 386 it's own arch?
[16:18] <apw> it does appear the kernel arches are not the same as build arches right?
[16:19] <rtg> apw: hmm, I think 386 gets built on an i386 chroot
[16:19] <apw> will have a play
[16:26] <apw> rtg what we care about is keeping 386 merging with ports configs
[16:26] <apw> otherwise its fine?
[16:28] <rtg> apw: I dunno if its fine, but yeah, 386 should be part of the ports family of configs.
[16:30] <mvo> hello! I noticed that there is a linux-image-debug-`uname -r` package on ddebs.ubuntu.com - but it appears to be not part of the Packages.gz file - is that intentional (the deb is pretty big)
[16:31] <rtg> mvo: I believe so. It keeps the mirrors from picking it up.
[16:32] <mvo> ok, thanks
[16:32] <rtg> apw: the original patch set from Luke simply didn't contain a 386 config
[16:32] <apw> yeah or indeed anything about 386 at all
[16:33] <rtg> apw: ok, I'd say just drop him a note about it and lets move on with other work
[16:34] <apw> can do that, i feel the 386 ports port is the one that is worth a tiny bit of our attention just cause its an x86.  but you are likely sensible there
[16:36] <apw> i t
[16:37] <apw> rtg ok one question, if its a flavour of x86 and it gets built on i386, i suspect that will make it part of the common i386 build and therefore that one can have greater dammage to our build process than the other builds
[16:37] <rtg> apw: it could, but I'm gonna let Luke figure it out
[16:37] <apw> ok
[16:43] <apw> rtg ok, i've emailed him and copied u-k-t
[16:49] <rtg> apw: so, to test the KMS/PAE combination with your test kernels, I want https://edge.launchpad.net/~apw/+archive/red/+files/linux-image-2.6.30-9-server_2.6.30-9.10kms9_i386.deb, right?
[16:49] <apw> rtg yeah thats the one that should exhibit it
[16:50] <apw> i've personally tested some of the other combinations, which still work at least but would never have been affected
[16:51] <rtg> apw: I take it these are upstream cherry-picks?
[16:56] <apw> rtg, the patches on that kernel, one was direct from lkml from airlied and the other was mine.  since the equivalent of both has merged into what will be .31-rc1
[16:56] <apw> i think dave got sick of them and just merged them
[16:57] <rtg> apw: well, can we easily cherry-pick from Linus tree, or should we just ignore the PAE problem until 2.6.31 ?
[16:58] <apw> the only urgency is if we are pushing people to -pae at all during upgrades, if not then there is none
[16:59] <apw> i saw the whole testing of gem and pae and these two patches as a response to the 'blocker' if we were pushing people to -pae by default.  i cannot recall the outcome, or indeed if there was an outcome without this infrmation
[16:59] <rtg> apw: fresh installs will have the problem if > 4GB RAM. Otherwise, upgrades ought to be OK.
[16:59] <apw> so i think ... they can sensibly fall into the 'will wait for upstream to have them' bucket to my eye
[17:00] <rtg> apw: works for me. I'm gonna package and upload then.
[17:00] <apw> ok
[17:03] <apw> that should get us at least an upload with the new flavours me thinks
[17:03] <rtg> thats my goal
[17:08] <Keybuk> rtg: can I ask a question?
[17:09] <rtg> Keybuk: always
[17:09] <rtg> whether I can answer...
[17:09] <Keybuk> rtg: I have an image file
[17:09] <Keybuk> and I'm trying to write it to the disk
[17:09] <Keybuk> but every time, the kernel hangs inside the I/O scheduler
[17:09] <Keybuk> is there a simple way to change that so I can use a different I/O scheduler
[17:09] <Keybuk> (and worry about filing the bug later :p)
[17:10] <rtg> Keybuk: yeah, there is a way to change the I/O scheduler dynamically. just need to remember how.
[17:10] <Keybuk> rtg: what's a good "just do it" I/O scheduler?
[17:10] <rtg> deadline?
[17:13] <rtg> Keybuk: find /sys|grep sched
[17:13] <rtg> cat /sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1f.1/host0/target0:0:0/0:0:0:0/block/sda/queue/scheduler
[17:13] <rtg> This is a server install, so the default is deadline.
[17:13] <Keybuk> ok
[17:13] <Keybuk> great
[17:13]  * Keybuk tries that
[17:14] <rtg> Keybuk: try noop also, which is the simplest
[17:14] <rtg> IIRC
[17:19] <noptys> anyone familiar with recent changes to the e1000 driver?  It seems that in gutsy (2.6.22-14-generic), the 82573 wouldn't support jumbo frames, but with jaunty (2.6.28-11-generic), it lets you enable jumbo frames, but gets swapper allocation failures under network load
[17:22] <rtg> noptys: perhaps you should email Jesse Brandenburg about that
[17:22] <noptys> can do
[17:29] <Keybuk> rtg: the deadline scheduler worked
[17:29] <rtg> Keybuk: is Ingo the I/O scheduler dude?
[17:32] <rtg> Keybuk: maybe Jens Axboe<EMAIL_ADDRESS>(block/cfq-iosched.c)
[17:32] <apw> ingo is cpu scheduler to my mind
[17:33] <rtg> apw: Jens did the CFQ scheduler
[17:34] <apw> rtg he is also the maintainer of BLOCK in general, so a good starting point
[20:27] <wjblack> Hello!
[20:29] <wjblack> So I recently backported the 2.6.30 version of the r8169 driver to 2.6.28 and am wondering how to go about packaging it for e.g. a PPA.  The actual "how to put it in a package" details aside, I want to make sure I don't step on anyone's toes.  Should I just call it "r8169-backport-driver-2.6.28....*" or similar?
[20:30] <wjblack> Am I going about this the wrong way entirely?
[20:31] <rtg> wjblack: is it a DKMS based package?
[20:31] <wjblack> Nope.  Modified vanilla kernel.org.
[20:32] <wjblack> Literally, it's a patch to the 2.6.30 r8169.c that allows it to compile/run on 2.6.28
[20:32] <wjblack> (the 2.6.30 version has a slightly different api but a fix for a rather nasty MSI bug)
[20:33] <rtg> wjblack: the best way to package it so that you don't have to deal with ABI dependencies is to use DKMS
[20:34] <wjblack> Hmm.  Okie-dokie.  Is there an Ubuntuish way to do that, or do I do generic dkms stuff?
[20:34] <wjblack> (never used DKMS before, obviously ;-) )
[20:35] <rtg> wjblack: there is a bit of a learning curve, but its not too bad once you grok things. here are some good example driver packages, e.g., bcmwl.
[20:35] <rtg> s/here/there/
[20:35] <wjblack> Aah, so the bcmwl package that's available via apt-get somewhere uses dkms?  Excellent.
[20:35]  * wjblack learns best by example ;-)
[20:36] <rtg> wjblack: yes, the maintainer is Alberto Milone (tseliot)
[20:36] <rtg> wjblack: in Karmic its called bcmwl-kernel-source
[20:37] <wjblack> I'm thinking this particular backport will have an effective lifespan of, er, rather short since >=2.6.30 should be in the main distro at some point...
[20:37] <wjblack> Right on.  I'll give it a looksee.  Thanks!
[20:37] <rtg> wjblack: 2.6.30 is in the Karmic archive right now, 2.6.31-rc1 soonish
[20:39] <wjblack> Hmm.  Still might be nice to have a PPA for Jaunty.  I'll check out this rabbit hole and see if I can handle its depth. ;-)
[21:29] <bullgard4> Update Manager differentiates 'distriution updates' and 'security updates'. What is the difference? Does every single DE program package have a flag for that?
[21:30] <bullgard4> s/DE/DEB/
[21:30] <_ruben> not every bugfix relates to security issues
[21:32] <bullgard4> _ruben: Yes. --  So it depends solely on the maintainer's judgement?
[21:39] <zeroprog> hey guys im a little confused as to what a module can do other than a device driver(which i cant figure out either)...could somebody explain to me some of the more useful modules
[21:43] <johanbr> a module can do pretty much anything
[21:43] <johanbr> think of it as a plugin for the kernel
[21:50] <zeroprog> johanbr: i get that but....i dunno im having trouble understanding what modules do what....like i want to look at specific device drivers(webcam, audio, anything i can find) but i dont know which source does what
[21:50] <zeroprog> in the module programming guide they said we can write a module that says "Hey that tickles" everytime i delete something....but how would i do that you know what i mean?
[21:51] <johanbr> look at the kernel source for sth simple
[21:51] <zeroprog> ok
[21:53] <zeroprog> do you know where thats located?
[23:29] <dtchen> zeroprog: www.kernel.org, git.kernel.org, kernelnewbies.org, kernel.ubuntu.com/git
[23:29] <dtchen> zeroprog: see also #kernelnewbies on irc.oftc.net