[05:55] <mup> Bug #1445717 was opened: 180b3 - mark broken is broken <uosci> <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1445717>


[09:18] <JamesTait> Good morning all, happy World Haemophilia Day!
[12:44] <dobey> JamesTait: here's to not bleeding out!
[13:06] <JamesTait> dobey, I'll drink to that!
[13:11] <davmor2> JamesTait: no don't drink to it, it'll thin your blood


[18:38] <hggdh> weird. I am trying to install a 11.04 under Oneiric's KVM, and it is failing. I know it worked before (already used the ISO)
[18:39] <hggdh> trying again with DEB_DEBUG=developer to see if the debian-installer log gives any more data


[14:56] <jmss> hi, do you know which "graphical" mode is used in runlevel 3 after some console messages appear?
[14:57] <jmss> my screen goes blank (because it is a cedarview graphical card, not supported, but text mode should not trigger this, I hoped)


[05:19] <pitti_> Good morning
[05:22] <darkxst_> pitti_, good morning
[05:23] <darkxst_> pitti_, any chance you take a look at the retracer sometime
[05:25] <pitti_> darkxst: ah, sorry; I guess at some point it'll be easier if you run it somewhere..
[05:27] <pitti_> still on my list
[05:31] <darkxst> pitti_, that would be fine, but I have no idea how to actually set it up ;)
[06:13] <RAOF> pitti: Hey, say I was running adt-run locally with adt-virt-schroot and the autopkgtest was failing with no useful error, how would I log in to the schroot it's using to diagnose?
[06:14] <pitti> RAOF: I suggest you schroot into the target manually, and within that, run adt-run with adt-virt-null
[06:43] <jibel> good morning
[06:54] <darkxst> pitti, any idea why the list of installed languages from accountsservice is much smaller, than 'locale -a'?
[07:12] <pitti> darkxst: locale -a has lots of locales for the same lang
[07:13] <pitti> darkxst: there are some 10 English locales (UK, US, New Zealand, and so on)
[07:13] <darkxst> pitti, yes I saw 10+ english from locale -a (and SUPPORTED) but only about 5 from accountsservice
[07:14] <darkxst> and I have no way to filter those dupes out of the SUPPORTED list, however I guess other languages mostly shouldnt be too bad.
[07:15] <pitti> why not? just split at the first _ ?
[07:15] <darkxst> pitti, really doesnt fit the current UI
[07:15] <darkxst> although I have considered making a seperate dialog that just list that bit
[08:07] <Laney> morning
[08:10] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[08:10] <seb128> Laney, hey, had a good w.e?
[08:10] <Laney> yeah, three day one, was very fine thanks :-)
[08:10] <Laney> what about you? good mini holiday?
[08:11] <seb128> yeah, I was planning to still check emails and do some stuff but I finally didn't and it was good to have some days off work ;-)
[08:11] <mlankhorst> hehe mini holiday was great :)
[08:11] <seb128> the weather was also ok for most of the w.e (though with some rains in between and wind yesterday)
[08:12] <seb128> hey mlankhorst
[08:12] <mlankhorst> a little, I was lucky, when I was outside it was dry the entire time
[08:12] <mlankhorst> except thursday, I got stuck in a lightning storm on my bike
[08:12] <Laney> exciting
[08:12] <mlankhorst> a great way to get soaked to the bone in a random village
[08:12] <mlankhorst> :D
[08:13] <Laney> we had lots of quite strong showers over the weekend
[08:13] <Laney> hid out in the library for a couple of hours
[08:13] <mlankhorst> I just crossed a canal, I could suddenly see beyond some homes
[08:13] <mlankhorst> and I was like.. best do the next 10 km real fast even if it's against the wind..
[08:14] <Laney> heh
[08:14] <mlankhorst> then after it was gone, the wind was gone too!
[08:14] <mlankhorst> which made me sad, if it stayed I would have made it home a lot faster
[08:17] <Mirv> sil2100: morning!
[08:19] <mlankhorst> sunday was great though, I enjoyed my ride outside a lot. 2.5 hours :)
[08:20]  * Laney has been doing short ones to figure out how to not fall off when stopping
[08:20] <Laney> getting used to unclipping now
[08:20] <mlankhorst> heheheh
[08:21] <mlankhorst> I did some canters like that yesterday, except it was to learn how to not fall off when going fast ;)
[08:32] <geser> given a package (razorqt) synced from Debian which build-depends on liblightdm-qt-dev (doesn't exist in Ubuntu): is replacing this build-dependency with liblightdm-qt-3-dev and have pkg-config check for liblightdm-qt-3 (instead of liblightdem-qt-2) the right "fix" to let the package build?
[08:34] <Laney> geser: perhaps make it check for both, as a more upstreamable fix
[08:34] <Laney> assuming it works with both, that is
[08:36] <geser> Laney: it builds at least with those changes
[08:36]  * Laney nods
[08:37] <Laney> should be easy to change it to build with either
[08:38] <geser> yes, my patch to CMakefile checks fist for -qt-3 now and falls back to -qt-2 if the first isn't found (like it already does with -qt-1 if -qt-2 isn't found)
[08:40] <Laney> great
[08:42] <geser> Laney: thanks, will send my changes to the DD for comment/review
[08:53] <mlankhorst> derp, when testing something, make sure you install it first..
[08:56] <Laney> hmm
[09:02] <dbarth> hi; i'm looking into a dependency issue with flashplugin-nonfree; although the control file doesn't mention it, the i386 build depends on update-notifier-common...
[09:02] <dbarth> is there any reason for that automatic dependency, or is a build error somewhere?
[09:02] <mlankhorst> remove it and find out?
[09:04] <dbarth> well, i can try rebuilding the package, yes
[09:04] <dbarth> with the current control file,ie http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/raring/flashplugin-nonfree/raring/view/head:/debian/control
[09:07] <mlankhorst> and back to raining here
[10:00] <sil2100> fginther: ping
[10:01] <seb128> pitti, hey, how are you?
[10:01] <pitti> hey seb128! I'm fine, how are you?
[10:01] <seb128> pitti, was your pending g-s-d change (drop lock_scree_on_suspend) ready for upload?
[10:02] <seb128> pitti, I'm good thanks, I had a long and relaxing w.e (got lucky with the weather for most of it, it's not great but at least it was not raining too much in the afternoons)
[10:02] <pitti> seb128: yes, it is; it just wasn't important enough to upload by itself (as that code path isn't taken any more)
[10:03] <seb128> pitti, ok, I've another patch to upload, I was just double checking, danke ;-)
[13:14] <fginther> sil2100, ping
[13:16] <seb128> Laney, the clutter-gst-2.0 cogl 1.10 b-d, was it needed or did you just want to force a recent enough cogl version? (that's our only diff with debian atm)
[13:27] <sil2100> fginther: ping
[13:28] <fginther> sil2100, pong
[13:57] <Laney> seb128: well it's in configure.ac, I was probably following that
[13:58] <Laney> weird that they don't have this build-dep in Debian though but if it's pull in some other way you can sync I suppose
[13:58] <Laney> probably best to add it back in svn
[14:06] <seb128> sil2100, cyphermox_, Mirv: hey, do you guys know why we didn't have daily landing of the indicator stack recently?
[14:07] <sil2100> seb128: you mean raring or head?
[14:07] <seb128> sil2100, saucy
[14:07] <seb128> so trunk I guess
[14:07] <sil2100> seb128: would have to check, as cyphermox_ is the maintainer of the indicator stack
[14:08] <Laney> cyphermox told me it would be disabled for some time until something gets merged
[14:08] <sil2100> Maybe it's the same as with unity, i.e. UTAH problems with autopilo ttesting
[14:08] <Laney> forgot what though ...
[14:08] <sil2100> Ah, right, maybe we already have disabled the indicator stack
[14:08] <sil2100> Laney might be right
[14:08] <Laney> I was hassling him in Oak to do a release and he did a manual one for me
[14:10] <sil2100> seb128: since there were plans to disable daily-build of indicators until the /phablet branches are not merged in
[14:10] <seb128> sil2100, is overlay-scrollbar in the indicator stack?
[14:11] <sil2100> seb128: I think it was in the misc stack when I last seen it
[14:11] <sil2100> cyphermox_: you re-enabled the unity-gtk-module for the unity stack already btw.?
[14:12] <sil2100> cyphermox_: I see you did, ok
[14:12] <sil2100> cyphermox_: since currently as things are the integration tests for unity-gtk-module won't test unity-gtk-module at all
[14:13] <sil2100> seb128: yep, it's in the misc stack in head
[14:13] <Laney> bzr branch lp:cupstream2distro-config is helpful for questions like that
[14:14] <sil2100> cyphermox_: I didn't want to re-enable it yet because the integration tests don't test what they need to right now, they just test the standard appmenu-gtk features - but no worries, at least it shouldn't block anything
[14:16] <seb128> Laney, I admit I'm just being lazy there, I was trying to have an answer to "why aren't the stack landing in saucy" without having to spend 15 minutes browsing jenkins and logs ;-)
[14:16] <Laney> heh
[14:17] <seb128> I though sil2100 or cyphermox_ would know ;-)
[14:17] <seb128> cyphermox_, we need that overlay-scrollbar fix you did in saucy to unblock gtk 3.8
[14:17] <sil2100> Yep, you can use us as much as you want while we're here ;)
[14:18] <sil2100> seb128: what fix is that?
[14:18] <sil2100> seb128: as I am maintaining the misc stack, I could maybe push it further
[14:18] <Laney> just looked at that MP, says there's still issues
[14:18] <seb128> sil2100, https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/overlay-scrollbar/fix-second-use/+merge/162507
[14:18] <seb128> Laney, oh, right
[14:19] <seb128> I only tested the vertical scrolling (I'm not even sure where to find something that scroll horizontally)
[14:19]  * seb128 tries
[14:19] <seb128> Laney, btw did you see my glib ping before? I just got disconnected from IRC after, not sure if it went through (I didn't see your reply if you added one)
[14:19] <Laney> no, didn't get one
[14:19] <seb128> Laney, the clutter-gst-2.0 cogl 1.10 b-d, was it needed or did you just want to force a recent enough cogl version? (that's our only diff with debian atm)
[14:19] <seb128> dah
[14:19] <seb128> wrong history pick
[14:20] <Laney> if it's "want to do the update?" then the answer is that it's on my list :-)
[14:20] <seb128> Laney, btw upstream just rolled out a tarball for glib 2.36.2, can you take care of it (or ask if pochu wants to do it ... do we still need that small diff over debian?)
[14:20] <Laney> pitti was pinging about the diff earlier though, so maybe he is doing it
[14:20] <Laney> and yes it is still necessary
[14:20] <pitti> yeah, we still need that diff
[14:20] <seb128> pitti, ^
[14:20] <seb128> pitti, are you doing the update?
[14:20] <Laney> unless we want to fix wanna-build
[14:21] <pitti> I still need to roll a new pygobject tarball today and have a meeting, so not today
[14:21] <seb128> no hurry, anyway between you and Laney to sort out
[14:21] <seb128> thanks guys ;-)
[14:21] <Laney> I think pochu was planning something around glib anyways
[14:21] <Laney> making tests fatal on all arches
[14:21] <pitti> yay bsd and hurt
[14:22] <Laney> ah, already in svn
[14:22] <pitti> err, hurd, but "hurt" is rather descriptive, too
[14:22] <Laney> doesn't affect us for ubuntu of course, but it does make me reluctant to update in debian ...
[14:35] <Laney> seb128: synced clutter-gst-2.0
[14:35] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[14:35] <Laney> np
[14:35] <Laney> added the bd in svn so it'll come back next time
[14:36] <seb128> great
[14:36] <seb128> brb, reboot
[14:37] <cyphermox> sil2100: reenabled only to get the autolanding actually. isn't there a daily_release: False?
[14:39] <cyphermox> actually, nevermind that, I thought attente told me the tests were ready
[14:42] <seb128> pitti, your ppa works fine on laptop with saucy, though I've a "boring" config to test that (no lvm, no disk encryption, etc) ... standard plugging usb key or tablet works and display icons in the launcher, etc
[14:42] <seb128> on my laptop*
[14:42] <pitti> seb128: thanks for confirming
[14:42] <seb128> yw!
[14:48] <attente> cyphermox, hey, the tests should be good now
[14:58] <sil2100> cyphermox: they're ready, but they're not testing what needs to be tested in the current phase
[14:59] <sil2100> cyphermox: but I'll work on that, since it's anyway my task as per the spreadsheet
[14:59] <cyphermox> ok
[14:59] <sil2100> cyphermox: please update it once you do anything specific ;)
[14:59] <sil2100> In the future, so that we don't duplicate too much!
[15:03] <dobey_> dpm: ping
[15:04] <dpm> hey dobey_, about to enter a call, but shoot if I can help with anything
[15:05] <dobey> dpm: was just wondering about what to use for translations in qt. if we should use the native qt stuff (and how that fits into the ubuntu translations magic stuff), or if we should just use gettext, or what. or if there's plans to change that going forward, to fit in more with the qt way
[15:06] <cyphermox> seb128: anytime now: https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/overlay-scrollbar/fix-second-use/+merge/162507
[15:07] <cyphermox> desrt: want to review that? ^
[15:07] <desrt> cyphermox: get cimi
[15:07] <dpm> dobey, in summary: gettext because that's what Launchpad supports, and that is not expected to change. We already use gettext in the SDK, we just don't have a story for pure qt apps
[15:08] <desrt> he'll be happy to spend the 5 minutes to review and i honestly have no idea what i'd be looking at
[15:08] <dobey> dpm: hmm, ok
[15:09] <pitti> chrisccoulson: hey
[15:10] <pitti> chrisccoulson: do you have an 1-minute recipe how to fix hangouts on today's firefox?
[15:10] <pitti> they were working last week still, but now ffox says the plugin isn't installed (but it is)
[15:10] <pitti> (meeting going on for 10 mins already..)
[15:10] <chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, i've not tried it. where is the plugin installed?
[15:11] <pitti> /usr/lib/firefox/plugins/, plus a dozen symlinks
[15:12] <chrisccoulson> pitti, oh, that's not going to work
[15:12] <pitti> it was until last week
[15:13] <chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, it won't work with the new version, as it's moved to /usr/lib/firefox/browser/plugins
[15:13] <chrisccoulson> nobody should be using that directory
[15:13] <chrisccoulson> it should be in /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins
[15:16] <pitti> chrisccoulson: that's one of the locations it's symlinked to
[15:18] <chrisccoulson> pitti, is it google plus or firefox that says the plugin isn't installed? (ie, is it listed in about:plugins)
[15:18] <chrisccoulson> it's listed here
[15:18] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I don't see it in about:plugins
[15:20] <chrisccoulson> pitti - what about if you enter "Components.classes["@mozilla.org/plugin/host;1"] .getService(Components.interfaces.nsIPluginHost).reloadPlugins(false)" in to the error console and then restart?
[15:21] <chrisccoulson> actually, the restart should be unnecessary
[15:21] <pitti> chrisccoulson: how do I get the error console?
[15:22] <chrisccoulson> pitti, is it not in the Tools -> Web Developer menu?
[15:22] <pitti> ah, it is (I never used it)
[15:23] <pitti> chrisccoulson: if I do that and click "Evaluate", nothing happens at all
[15:23] <chrisccoulson> it's not in the plugin list now?
[15:24] <pitti> no
[15:24] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm not sure then atm
[15:24] <pitti> I already tried to purge and reinstall google-talkplugin, restarting firefox several times, etc.
[15:24] <pitti> ok, so after meeting/tomorrow I'll try with a new profile
[15:26] <chrisccoulson> oh, wow, my session is totally messed up. launcher and dash appearing beneath all of my windows :(
[15:36] <chrisccoulson> desrt, is it a bug to call g_object_new from within a class_init function?
[15:38] <desrt> yesish
[15:42] <chrisccoulson> desrt, heh, i thought as much (see bug 1179554) ;)
[15:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1179554 in ibus (Ubuntu) "Firefox hang on start because ibus calls g_object_new inside a class_init function" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1179554
[15:43] <desrt> it's not strictly a bug
[15:43] <desrt> but you should only be doing a very limited number of things in class_init
[15:43] <desrt> properties, signals, vfunc overrides
[15:44] <desrt> ooo
[15:44] <desrt> this looks like the fun gobject deadlock
[15:44] <chrisccoulson> desrt, oh, should i reassign it to glib?
[15:44] <desrt> it's already known
[15:44] <desrt> assuming it's the same one (which it appears to be)
[15:48] <chrisccoulson> desrt, got a bug number?
[15:49] <desrt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=674885
[15:49] <ubot2> Gnome bug 674885 in gobject "type initialisation deadlock in GObject" [Normal,New]
[15:50] <chrisccoulson> desrt, excellent, thanks
[15:53] <seb128> re
[15:53] <seb128> pitti, some people mentioned earlier getting hangouts back after upgrading the plugin from google
[15:53] <seb128> pitti, you might want to try that
[15:53] <seb128> I should try hangouts before tomorrow
[15:54] <ogra_> that takes out all excitement
[17:44] <chrisccoulson> desrt, oh, i've just noticed the date on that bug. so, this issue isn't actually a recent one?
[17:45] <chrisccoulson> i wonder why i've only just started seeing it :/
[19:48] <pitti> seb128: hm, upgrade how?
[19:48] <pitti> seb128: I purged the package and clicked on "install" in the hangout window, and it gave me the very same deb
[19:49] <seb128> pitti, https://tools.google.com/dlpage/hangoutplugin/download.html
[19:49] <seb128> ?
[19:52] <pitti> seb128: yes, that very
[19:52] <chrisccoulson> perhaps i should upgrade to saucy and test it
[19:53] <seb128> works for me (on 32 bits)
[19:53] <chrisccoulson> pitti, or just switch to chromium ;)
[19:53] <pitti> chrisccoulson: that's the very thing I tried to avoid :)
[19:54] <chrisccoulson> pitti, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-1305-chromium-default-browser ;)
[19:55] <Laney> Chromium has matured to being as good or better than Firefox
[19:55] <Laney> cheeky git!
[19:55] <Laney> :P
[19:55] <pitti> oh noes
[19:56] <pitti> so when MS tried to get everywhere, the FOSS world was raging
[19:56] <chrisccoulson> Laney, you might change your mind once all of our customizations are dropped from firefox ;)
[19:56] <pitti> when Google does it, everyone loves it
[19:56] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i know
[19:56] <Laney> why would they be dropped?!
[19:57] <Laney> I'm blissfully unaware of what they are :-)
[19:57] <seb128> google is nice though
[19:57] <seb128> ms is a crappy capitalist company
[19:57] <chrisccoulson> Laney, because nobody has the time to maintain them anymore. i'm hoping to get the important ones upstream, but that is happening slowly
[19:57] <chrisccoulson> or not at all
[19:58] <chrisccoulson> Laney, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-trunk.head/files/head:/debian/patches/ ;)
[19:58] <pitti> seb128: </irony>, right?  I've not needed to flip back to vimperator so far..
[20:00] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm not saying i like microsoft ;)
[20:01] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you say google is worth than ms though
[20:01] <seb128> I don't agree
[20:01] <pitti> right now, for the software market they are
[20:01] <seb128> because they are smarter...
[20:01] <seb128> if $ms was to lead they wouldn't be any better
[20:02] <chrisccoulson> i don't disagree with that
[20:03] <pitti> yeah, neither do I
[20:03] <pitti> google is basically today what MS was 10 years ago
[20:03] <seb128> it's a result of the market/society/business as it is today
[20:04] <seb128> whoever is in the leading position will deserve hate for the things they did/are doing to be there
[20:04] <pitti> yeah, winner's curse
[20:04] <mlankhorst> not really, microsoft is still doing the same thing, just more behind the curtains
[20:04] <pitti> I still like Mozilla more, and I rather trust their products with my data than chromium
[20:05] <mlankhorst> I don't 'trust' anyone with my data, that's what verification is for
[20:05] <pitti> anyway, time for TB meeting, that was an unexpected flamefest :)
[20:11] <dobey> ick chromium. i hope not
[21:21] <LeartS> Anyone who can review and approve / disapprove branches? https://code.launchpad.net/~vandersonmr/gnome-screenshot/bugfix1169904/+merge/161262 and https://code.launchpad.net/~andyrock/unity/fix-dnd-alttab/+merge/158182
[22:33] <TheMuso> Chromium also introduces accessibility implications, like not working out of teh box with Orca. It has its own extension for screen reading, but totally different keystrokes and doesn't integrate with Orca either.
[22:35] <TheMuso> I am also considering moving my data away from Google. I haven't been liking what they have been up to recently.


 ?
 I was in Orlando for a hacker conference, same times as sans security certifications training is going on.
 was?
 Am. I'm driving up tomorrow morning
 Down I should say
 What about this Ubuntu membership in Merritt island?
 Just got to work, can't stay awake - ergghhh
 Oh yeah, I heard about that conference through pbsc, but didn't really look into it until the day before... That and I really dont want to travel right now
 I'll have to look into it for next year


[09:47] <arif-ali> Hey BedMan, you shifting from xCAT to MAAS?
[09:49] <arif-ali> also, you may get better response if you head over to discourse (https://discourse.maas.io/)
[10:39] <BedMan> arif-ali: Figured. Yes, moving to MAAS from xcat.  It's a lot easier for ubuntu boxes, and they've really streamlined the process.
[10:40] <BedMan> when it works :)
[10:41] <arif-ali> BedMan: it works really well, and have a lab env with everything there. MAAS is a Canonical product, and Ubuntu, so you would expect these 2 things to work seamlessly together :)
[10:42] <BedMan> it seems to smile on RHEL too tho.
[10:42] <BedMan> so my env moving forward should be well covered
[10:42] <arif-ali> Indeed, all via packer-maas you can do these. rocky was added recently too
[10:42] <BedMan> we're moving away from centos
[10:43] <BedMan> but that works with MAAS as well... so
[10:43] <BedMan> now I just need to figure out how to remove xcat from the mix and take all it's dns / hosts / features along with it
[10:45] <BedMan> I'll have to make a script for xdsh
[11:19] <arif-ali> BedMan: best way to integrete xdsh type feature is to use juju + MAAS
[11:19] <arif-ali> Then you can use the likes of juju ssh <machine>, and there are various things you can do
[11:20] <arif-ali> also, MAAS has a maas cli, which you can do various things around automation if your happy to go through that route ;)
[11:25] <BedMan> ya, both are of interest
[11:25] <BedMan> It's hard to take a command like juju seriously at first tho
[15:40] <mup> Bug #1983392 opened: Connection refused from kvm after compose <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1983392>
[15:43] <mup> Bug #1983392 changed: Connection refused from kvm after compose <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1983392>
[15:46] <mup> Bug #1983392 opened: Connection refused from kvm after compose <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1983392>
[17:58] <mup> Bug #1963284 opened: GPGPU devices not fully named in the PCI Devices tab <MAAS:New> <lxd (Ubuntu):Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1963284>


[08:07] <smoser> anyone know where skaet is ? i need here in http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-o/meeting/server-o-cloud-images-release/
[08:07] <smoser> Jokai 07
[08:50] <cjwatson> smoser: I came in at :40 or so but you'd all left
[08:51] <smoser> yeah. i'll just work off line with kate.
[08:51]  * cjwatson nods
[10:50] <slangasek> cjwatson, ev: does wubi in lucid ever use grub1 by default instead of grub2, or is bug #781628 just the classic user error?
[10:50] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 781628 in grub (Ubuntu) "package linux-image-2.6.32-31-generic 2.6.32-31.61 failed to install/upgrade: el subproceso instalado el script post-installation devolvió el código de salida de error 1 (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/781628
[10:52] <cjwatson> slangasek: never by default, we switched to GRUB 2 in Karmic
[10:53] <cjwatson> installing GRUB Legacy on Wubi is certainly an amusing way to break your system
[11:11] <slangasek> cjwatson: and a sadly frequent one - would love to talk to you about a path to dropping grub1 from the archive entirely
[11:56] <cjwatson> slangasek: *nod* I'm getting more comfortable with the possibility of migration; one thing I want to do is to review the process of migration that was documented in the latest Debian release notes, since I've read criticism of it as overcomplex
[12:02] <slangasek> cjwatson: I would love for us to be able to automatically rewrite the MBR on first successful boot following a chainload :)


[00:17] <remline> Marzatha, I saw that too. Quite a few compliments about Xfce in the comments, and also a few flamewars about GTK+ vs. Qt.
[01:07] <natuz> Anyone is using gimp here ?
[01:10] <ObrienDave> a bit
[01:13] <natuz> ObrienDave: do you use gimp-gap ?
[01:13] <natuz> I have an issue I think it's linked with xubuntu
[01:14] <ObrienDave> gimp-gap? i have used GIMP for images. is that what you're asking about?
[01:16] <ObrienDave> oooo, i see, no, I have never used gimp-gap
[01:20] <natuz> ObrienDave: yes the thing to extract images from a video
[01:42] <Demon_Jester> Hey guys, I have a question I am wanting to work on an android app, and I want it to communicate with my xubuntu desktop (remote connection) what would be common way to do that? I know about SSH, but I am not sure if using ssh connection in android app is common or what
[01:49] <bcowan> anyone know of any good power saving laptop scripts
[02:41] <holstein> Demon_Jester: i have used ssh to and from android/xubuntu
[02:42] <holstein> !info laptop-mode-tools
[02:42] <holstein> bcowan: ^
[02:42] <holstein> though, i have never done much software wise to address power.. i'll just turn off hardware im not using, and make sure i have the "best" driver for GPU, etc
[02:43] <bcowan> holstein, darn thing wants to install a ton of QT crap
[02:44] <holstein> bcowan: unless there is something particular you want to address, you really shoudnt need anything
[02:45] <bcowan> holstein, just trying to get the most out of this old macbook
[02:45] <bcowan> OSX gets like 4 hours...lucky to get an hour in linux
[02:45] <holstein> id say, you can "piddle" about for hours and days testing and probably find a way to get a few more minutes
[02:46] <holstein> bcowan: sure. thats common.. apple worked, and hired a team of professionals to write drivers and test.. ubuntu is not preventing that level of support for that hardware, but, you wont find a "script" that will improve that support
[02:46] <holstein> its a compromise, for sure.. but, i say, just make sure you have the "best" GPU drivers, etc..
[02:47] <holstein> !macbook
[02:48] <holstein> you can look for and read guides that may or may not address your specific hardware.. you can look on support forums and mailing lists or in a larger support channel like #ubuntu or a main linux channel for someone with that exact hardware
[02:48] <holstein> you can ask them if they address the battery life, and if so, how
[02:49] <bcowan> was a nightmare trying to install...32 bit EFI with 64 bit userland
[02:49] <holstein> you can buy hardware with linux already on it, and with promised/guaranteed linux support.. such as from system76
[02:50] <holstein> i am aquring a uefi dell.. so far, worked "out of the box" by changing a setting in the bios.. and on my macbook, i used reFit
[02:51] <bcowan> Im using refit the 32 bit EFI isnt in any distro install medium
[02:51] <cfhowlett> holstein, I've got the Dell precision m3800
[02:54] <bcowan> grub has to be the most unfriendly program in all of *nix
[02:55] <holstein> !grub
[02:55] <holstein> works "as advertised" here..
[02:55] <holstein> can be problematic, if the hardware requires special attention to force it to do what you want it todo
[02:57] <bcowan> Ive used grub for years...just think its been hacked together trying to do too much anymore
[03:06] <bcowan> I really like the look/feel/theme of this 4.12 and 15.04
[03:12] <holstein> bcowan: you might want to try something officially supported.. though, i think what your issue is is hardware support for linux..
[03:18] <bcowan> just trying to get back into linux...was a gentoo dev for years and maintained xfce but real life got in the way
[06:07] <gulzar> I have executable of tor browser, but thunar opens that executable in text editor. pcmanfm, nautilus executes it. How to set thuanr to execute such scripts?
[06:08] <holstein> !tor
[06:08] <holstein> gulzar: ^
[06:08] <holstein> gulzar: otherwise, you ask the party that provided you with "executable for tor browser" how you are to use the tool they provided you
[06:09] <gulzar> holstein: that was horrible.. my question is regarding running executable scripts.. like for Discovery studio, matlab, tor, etc
[06:09] <gulzar> holstein: pcmanfm, natutilus run them only thunar cannot
[06:09] <holstein> gulzar: one can right-click on icons, and find, in the GUI menu, a tickbox for making executablel
[06:09] <holstein> executable*
[06:09] <gulzar> holstein: it is
[06:10] <holstein> gulzar: if what you have is "broken", then, it wont work.. you'll have to ask who made it why its not working.. we cant support it since its not ours.. you can use the one in the default repos referenced ^
[06:10] <gulzar> holstein: I repeat, pcmanfm can execute only thunar cannot
[06:11] <gulzar> holstein: tipical ubuntu reply,, that's why I left ubuntu
[08:08] <sorinello> Hello. Does anyone know if Xfce 4.12 will be available for Xubuntu 14.10 ?
[08:08] <sorinello> i mean using official channels, not the xubuntu-dev ppa
[08:10] <cfhowlett> sorinello, doubtfull since 14.10 is only supported for 9 months.
[08:10] <elfy> anything for 14.10 is likely to be a PPA
[08:11] <elfy> cfhowlett: exactly :)
[08:11] <elfy> and there's only 5 months left
[08:12] <cfhowlett> elfy, I am hopeful it will be backported to 14.04.  I only do LTS
[08:12] <elfy> sorinello: given that 14.10 is EOL in July, I'd install 15.04 in April
[08:12] <sorinello> so either wait for 15.04 or use PPA's
[08:12] <elfy> cfhowlett: the plan afaik is "vivid > xfce-412 ppa for utopic > ppa for trusty > trusty SRUs as needed"
[08:12] <sorinello> elfy, yeah, I'll install 15.04, but I am eager to try the new Xfce :)
[08:13] <Luyin> is 15.04 going to be an LTS release again?
[08:14] <cfhowlett> Luyin, no.  next LTS = 16.05
[08:14] <Luyin> ok
[08:14] <cfhowlett> 16.04
[08:14] <cfhowlett> every 2 years
[08:14] <cfhowlett> elfy, thanks.
[08:14]  * Luyin is thinking about installing arch with xfce 4.12
[08:16] <sorinello> elfy, cfhowlett : so xfce 4.12 is out, but https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xfce-4.12 states that "Please note that these are pre-release versions". I am confused
[08:17] <elfy> sorinello: that's an old PPA - perhaps people have had other things to look at lately :)
[08:17] <sorinello> so what is the ppa for getting the released version of 4.12 ?
[08:18] <elfy> by old I mean we've not looked at that for a few months - descriptions were updated a while back
[08:18] <sorinello> ah ok, so it's only the descriptions which are outdated
[08:19] <elfy> yes - but the contents haven't been looked at lately either
[08:19] <elfy> if it was up to date it would show very recent dates
[08:19] <elfy> atm - the way to get 4.12 is use vivid
[08:20] <elfy> so my advice to you is to wait :)
[08:20] <sorinello> elfy, seems that they are not advertising the proper way: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/03/xfce-4-12-released-after-almost-three-years
[08:20] <Luyin> by the way, thanks so much for the development of 4.12. I'm really looking forward to it :)
[08:20] <elfy> sorinello: or you can test vivid
[08:21] <sorinello> elfy, I don't quite know what vivid is
[08:21] <elfy> sorinello: umm - that is NOT us - that is them
[08:21] <elfy> sorinello: vivid is 15.04
[08:21] <sorinello> ah
[08:21] <sorinello> elfy, yes, that is THEM :)
[08:22] <sorinello> brb, reboot
[08:25] <sorinello> elfy, : funny thing about that tutorial is that it doesn't work. I'm still on 4.10. At least xfce4-about tell me so
[08:27] <Luyin> sorinello: if you open a terminal and enter "dpkg -l xfce*", you will be given a list of your installed (or not installed) apps with their respective versions. you should see there that many applications are already from 4.11, at least that's with xubuntu 14.04.
[08:28] <sorinello> indeed. but I don't see any 4.12, so omgubuntu's tutorial is wrong or that ppa is not updated
[08:31] <elfy> https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xfce-4.12?field.series_filter=utopic
[08:31] <elfy> as I said - not updated
[08:31] <elfy> patience will be key :)
[08:33] <sorinello> I purged that PPA and downgraded to the system defaults
[08:49] <DoomBoom> hey, on Xubuntu using the Chinese Pinyin keyboard layout(ibus-pinyin) in Firefox I noticed that whenever I select text it immediately deletes it
[08:50] <DoomBoom> I thought it was a bug in Firefox first but I noticed it's not in Lubuntu, which I've noticed has an updated ibus(1.5.8 vs 1.5.5 on Xubuntu)
[08:51] <DoomBoom> I made a bug report at Firefox but seems like if Xubuntu can update this it would be fixed https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/process_bug.cgi
[08:52] <cfhowlett> DoomBoom, might want to check the ubuntu-cn channel ... also, check out ubuntukylin!
[08:52] <DoomBoom> note that it only happens in Firefox for me, no other applications on Xubuntu
[08:52] <cfhowlett> !cn | DoomBoom
[08:52] <DoomBoom> I actually can't speak Chinese though
[08:53] <DoomBoom> I'm just learning it when I found out about this
[09:57] <Alftand> hello?
[09:57] <Alftand> does anyone here know how to configure xubuntu so that the whisker menu opens upon pressing the super key?
[10:00] <baizon> Alftand: http://thinkonbytes.blogspot.de/2014/04/xubuntu-open-whisker-menu-with-windows.html
[10:01]  * Luyin guesses the topic might need a little update concerning 4.12...
[10:02] <Alftand> cheers. this channel is much better than other channels
[10:02] <Alftand> (linuxmint irc is like a ghost town)
[10:02] <lops> Alftand, that's because official linuxmint irc is not on freenode
[10:03] <Alftand> oh
[10:03] <Alftand> kk
[10:19] <Alftand> how would i change the default window manager to compiz
[10:20] <Alftand> nevermind
[11:59] <innocent> Hello! After making a clean 14.04 install on a new machine (laptop with hybrid intel/ati graphic cards) there where a few thin blinking pink lines on my native screen(also using a duplicated external vga connected screen).After trying (mostly blindly)varius stuff and guides switching to kernel 3.18.8 (instead of the older 3.13.something) seemed to have solved the problem.The big question now is : Is there any related reading on
[11:59] <innocent>  how to troubleshoot graphic issues in linux? And also related reading on how graphics/drivers/w.e are rendered and used? Just trying to build a knowledge base here ;D Thanks in advance !
[11:59] <innocent> (holly crap , sorry for the text-wall)
[12:01] <bazhang> how was that kernel upgraded/installed and from where
[12:04] <innocent> downloaded the 3 files from kernel website and installed them through konsole
[12:05] <bazhang> going outside package management, especially for the kernel is not a good idea at all
[12:06] <innocent> Actually also the 3.13...39 solved the issue but then the external screen and the usb peripherals stoped working
[12:06] <bazhang> and you have tried a bunch of guides blindly, so its going to be very hard to troubleshoot, with the custom kernel and what not
[12:07] <innocent> Its a clean install so i was planning to do a re-install and just use the one that worked , so thats not an issue for now
[12:07] <bazhang> !info linux-generic
[12:08] <innocent> So 3.16 is the latest i can safelly try?
[12:08] <bazhang> this clean install is with the standard package manager kernel , absent the guides following "fixes"?
[12:08] <innocent> yes
[12:09] <bazhang> the latest kernel has no connection to the latest stable
[12:10] <bazhang> while it's tempting to follow the higher number of everything that comes out for the purported new features, unless you are running a rolling release like arch, it's something you really would be better off avoiding
[12:11] <bazhang> !mainline
[12:12] <bazhang> you could look into that ^, but thats entirely at your own risk, you realize, and of course have backups of *all* important data at a ll times
[12:12] <bazhang> and all
[12:12] <innocent> So , to get it right : Up/down-grading kernel is it a 'valid' way of troubleshooting issues?
[12:12] <lops> well you can try 3.16 from 14.10 via the Hardware Enablement Stack
[12:13] <lops> which is designed for backporting kernel to LTS 14.04.
[12:13] <bazhang> valid if you are really well-versed at coming back from completely broken systems that often result, otherwise not at all
[12:14] <innocent> I dont really mind that :D
[12:15] <innocent> And what about the 2 questions in the beggining?Related reading on how to troubleshoot graphic issues and how drivers etc work in linux?
[12:22] <innocent> Thanks a lot for your time and answers lops and bazhang !
[12:22] <bazhang> :)
[16:39] <TheXenith> hello! I am using a converted Ubuntu to Xubuntu, and the only panel indicator (volume, battery, etc.) is from Unity; it crashes often and looks ugly. xfce4-indicator-plugin is reported as installed, but I don't know if that's the Unity plugin or something else; regardless, I need an indicator panel plugin that works
[18:06] <DoomBoom> where's the configuration file for xdg-open or exo-open?
[18:06] <DoomBoom> I apparently have to remove the '-remote' argument when opening an URL in Firefox, because in Firefox 36 this argument was removed
[18:07] <DoomBoom> and that might be a reason why all my programs that open links in my default browser(firefox) are broken
[18:07] <Unit193> DoomBoom: /usr/share/xfce4/helpers/firefox.desktop
[18:08] <DoomBoom> ey thanks
[18:08] <DoomBoom> I see the -remote thing
[18:09] <DoomBoom> Unit193, but will my changes be overriden when I upgrade after changing a file in /usr/share?
[18:09] <DoomBoom> I guess it doesn't matter as the next time it it updates it'll probably be fixed
[18:09] <Unit193> DoomBoom: Yep, but the next upgrade will be the fix. :P
[18:10] <DoomBoom> hehe figured
[18:10] <DoomBoom> thanks
[18:12] <DoomBoom> that fixed it
[18:12] <DoomBoom> finally
[18:22] <l3robot> Hi everyone
[18:22] <l3robot> I need help
[18:39] <eikon81g> I am trying to do some quick updates using the software updater and I am getting: "The upgrade needs a total of 159 M free space on disk '/boot'. Please free at least an additional 24.3 M of disk space on '/boot'. Empty your trash and remove temporary packages of former installations using 'sudo apt-get clean'." can I go to the folder and just empty out the contents my self? I ran the clean command and I still get the error mes
[18:39] <eikon81g> sage and my trash is empty.
[18:40] <xubuntu84w> Whenever I click  on help in thunar and choose contents - read online I get the browser but no  help files. Also when I right click on a html file and select open  with Web Browser I just get Firefox and not the html  file. Is there a way to fix this please.
[18:41] <eikon81g> My boot folder contains a "grub" folder and a "lost+found" folder as well as several packages and some files that are owned by root so I am not sure what can go and what can be deleted without causing issues.
[18:41] <knome> xubuntu84w, it's a known bug and the fix is about to land soon
[18:46] <xubuntu84w> Thanks!
[19:15] <funrep_> hi, may i ask how i can ignore the fixed width/height of the terminal (ie resize it freely)? is it a setting in my emulator (gnome-terminal) or in the window manager of xfce?
[19:18] <drc> funrep_: Terminal Preferences>Appearance>Default Geometry.  You can also just grab a corner and drag it to any size you want.
[19:20] <funrep_> well, that's my problem
[19:20] <funrep_> i dont want it as collums and rows, i want to the terminal to be able to utilize my whole left-side resolution
[19:20] <funrep_> lest me take a screenshot
[19:21] <brainvvash> funrep_, konsole supports free resizing
[19:23] <funrep_> https://i.imgur.com/Nk5wIH6.png
[19:23] <funrep_> i want the terminal to fill the whole screen, i dont mind that some stuff shows incorrectly inside the terminal
[19:23] <funrep_> just it fills up all the space
[19:24] <knome> funrep_, most terminals will not show half rows, so if there isn't space for another full one, they'll just not expand over that
[19:25] <funrep_> well, in dwm you can disable resize-hints to overcome this issue, can you do that with xfce's wm?
[19:25] <eikon81g> Back.. http://paste.ubuntu.com/10505286/
[19:25] <eikon81g> Thats my boot folder ^
[19:26] <brainvvash> funrep_, yes, you'll have to change the source code
[19:26] <funrep_> so there's no settings?
[19:26] <brainvvash> does not look like there is one
[19:26] <eikon81g> so I can do this sudo apt-get remove linux-image-3.16.0-30-generic
[19:26] <eikon81g> correct?
[19:26] <funrep_> is there an easy way to use same wm as ubuntu (unity) in xfce?
[19:28] <eikon81g> Ok I am removing the .30 kernal because I used uname -r to confirm I am now on .31
[19:28]  * eikon81g learns a little bit at a time
[19:28] <eikon81g> LOL
[19:31] <eikon81g> thanks so much to everyone who chipped in especially daftykins! I will continue along and WHEN I get stuck again I'll be back, have a great week everyone!
[22:11] <bynarie> hi guys
[22:12] <klopsi-u3> hi bynarie
[22:12] <xubuntu754> i have a question
[22:12] <xubuntu754> does 14.04.2 comes with xfce 14.12?
[22:13] <xubuntu754> or should I update xfce after i install?
[22:13] <knome> xubuntu754, no, it doesn't
[22:13] <xubuntu754> manual update?
[22:14] <knome> you can update manually if you insist, but that will not be supported
[22:15] <xubuntu754> should I encounter any incompatibillities?
[22:15] <knome> that's always possible
[22:15] <xangua> You could just wait for 15.04
[22:15] <holstein> you can.. since, its not supported..
[22:15] <holstein> !ppa
[22:16] <holstein> could work *great*.. you'll just have to try it and see..
[22:16] <knome> holstein, not sure if there is a complete 4.12 ppa yet
[22:16] <knome> but then again, i haven't looked after saturday (the release...)
[22:16] <xubuntu754> will give it a try
[22:16] <holstein> knome: i thought i found one the other day.. but, i surely havent tried one "first-hand"
[22:17] <xubuntu754> thanks, and have a good night
[22:17] <xangua> You waited 2 years, you can wait another two months
[22:17] <knome> holstein, well there has been this "4.12" PPA for ages already
[22:17] <knome> but it has basically been 4.11 versions
[22:18] <knome> and still seems to be
[22:18] <knome> https://launchpad.net/~xubuntu-dev/+archive/ubuntu/xfce-4.12
[22:18] <holstein> knome: that could be the one i saw, for sure..
[22:18] <knome> for trusty at least
[22:18] <knome> utopic seems to have 4.12 versions too
[22:19] <xangua> It has 4.11, not 4.12
[22:19] <knome> the utopic versions seem to be more or less 4.12 (uploaded today)
[22:19] <knome> the trusty ones are 4.11
[22:20] <xangua> Oh you mean the PPA
[22:20] <knome> what else would i mean if i link to the PPA? :)