[15:30] <apw> 15m warning: we will be reviewing rtg's upload right request in 15m.
[15:45]  * apw calls the meeting to order ...
[15:45] <apw> We are meeting today to review rtg's (https://launchpad.net/~timg-tpi) request for upload rights for the Ubuntu kernels: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimGardner/KernelUploadRightsApplication
[15:45] <esembee> o/
[15:45] <apw> o/
[15:45] <xnox> \o
[15:45] <rtg> o/
[15:46] <arighi> o/
[15:47] <rtg> does anyone else have issues with web.libre.chat disconnecting once in awhile ?
[15:47] <esembee> not using that
[15:47] <apw> not noticed that when using it from weechat direct.
[15:47] <esembee> but hexchat has different issues
[15:48] <kms> o/
[15:48] <imay> o/
[15:48] <apw> Ok, lets get started. rtg, could you introduce yourself.
[15:49] <rtg> Hi, I have been with Canonical off and on for 15 years. This is my second stint. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimGardner/KernelUploadRightsApplication fora brief intro.
[15:50] <apw> Sponsors ... what say you ...
[15:50] <klebers> o/
[15:50] <esembee> Well yeah, what I wrote. more or less :)
[15:51] <esembee> To summarize I think there is no reason speaking against
[15:51] <kms> I've reviewed much of Tim's work and believe he is past ready for receiving upload rights. I'm +1
[15:52] <klebers> I have been reviewing rtg's kernels for several months and found no real issues lately, so I believe he's ready to start uploading kernel directly
[15:52] <apw> I've seen a number of his kernels second hand (at sru review) and have seen nothing of concern.
[15:53] <apw> Any other commentary vbefore we vote?
[15:53] <apw> going thrice (or something)
[15:54] <apw> Ok, lets vote. Votes for rtg to be added to ubuntu-kernel-uploaders:
[15:54] <apw> +1
[15:54] <esembee> +1
[15:54] <mhcerri> +1
[15:54] <kms> +1
[15:54] <imay> +1
[15:54] <apw> +1 (kamal by proxy)
[15:54] <klebers> +1
[15:54] <arighi> +1
[15:55] <xnox> +1 (no idea if i am part of the quorum or not)
[15:56] <apw> ok ... under our rules that is sufficient +'s and no -ve's; so rtg is approved.
[15:56] <apw> rtg, welcome to the team,
[15:57] <rtg> thanks
[15:57]  * apw gives apw the job of updating permissions and announcing same.
[15:57] <apw> thanks all!
[15:57] <kms> \o/
[15:57] <kms> congrats @rtg!
[15:58] <arighi> rtg, congrats!
[15:58] <klebers> congrats, rtg !
[15:59] <esembee> congrats rtg
[17:19] <sub526> Hi all, How to specify a build directory(make O=<your build dir) while building ubuntu kernel via "LANG=C fakeroot debian/rules binary-headers binary-generic binary-perarch" (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/BuildYourOwnKernel)
[17:48] <sub526> Is there any other channel\group to reach on ubuntu kernel developers?
[18:09] <sub526> check-config: FAIL (- != n): CONFIG_KCOV policy<{'amd64': 'n', 'arm64': 'n', 'armhf': 'n', 'ppc64el': 'n', 's390x': 'n'}> check-config: 10456/10457 checks passed -- exit 1 - how to resolve it?
[18:10] <xnox> sub526:  we do not support arbitrary build dirs, so cannot do that.
[18:11] <xnox> sub526: update annotations file => clearly some config got changed that doesn't even offer KCOV to you anymore, which is unexpected.
[18:11] <xnox> (annotation says that the option must be offered, and should be turned off, rather than be non-exitant due to i.e. some other options being turned off)
[18:21] <sub526> xnox: thanks for the reply.  What's wrong from https://pastebin.com/hPeNcwa5? I noticed "ERROR: 2 config-check failures detected"
[18:29] <xnox> sub526:  exactly what it says.....
[18:29] <xnox> that CONFIG_KCOV is "-" (does not exist) instead of "n" (deselected)
[18:30] <xnox> sub526:  either your environment missing build-dependencies; or your other config changes causing KCOV to not be offered.
[18:30] <xnox> sub526:  figure out the requirements for KCOV to be offered such that it would be correclty "n", or update annotations file expectation to change that option from "n" to "-".
[18:31] <xnox> sub526:  i'm not sure how else to help you, given i have now explained the same issue to you twice =/
[18:33] <sub526> xnox: I commented CONFIG_KCOV in annotations file and able to start the build process. Later i will try as you suggested i.e. changing the option from "n" to "-"
[18:34] <sub526> xnox: CONFIG_KCOV                                     policy<{'amd64': 'n', 'arm64': 'n', 'armhf': 'n', 'ppc64el': 'n', 's390x': 'n'}>, do i need to change the option from "n" to "-" for the all archs, or only for my system architecture(amd64)?
[19:25] <xnox> depends how many arches you build the kernel for


[00:43] <valorie> @login
[00:44] <valorie> heh, then why won't you let me review my ban?
[00:47] <Unit193> Need to btlogin
[00:50] <valorie> ah
[00:50] <valorie> @btlogin
[00:50] <valorie> ubottu: you should tell me that
[00:51] <Unit193> It should know what you want before you do?
[00:51] <valorie> lol
[00:51] <valorie> it's fine
[00:51] <valorie> obsent is a known spammer, I believe
[00:54] <Unit193> odsent?  Yes.  Though, I believe you set a quiet and a ban, may as well remove the quiet and justleave the ban.
[00:55] <valorie> ah
[01:11] <valorie> done
[01:21] <Unit193> obsent!*@* is the hostmask he used, so it'd seem.  There's a quiet on that at least.
[01:26] <valorie> that's what I just removed
[01:26] <Unit193> That was '*odsent*!*@*'
[01:26] <valorie> [17:11] *** You remove the quiet on *odsent*!*@*.
[01:26] <valorie> ah
[01:26] <valorie> ok
[01:26] <valorie> when I return I'll do the other
[04:58] <valorie> and done
[05:18] <Unit193> juned: Hello, anything we can help you with today?
[07:43] <juned> hi
[07:43] <juned> anyone can help me
[10:22] <HFSPLUS> whats up people how you chillen?
[10:23] <HFSPLUS> noooooooooo waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
[10:27] <HFSPLUS> noooooooooo waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
[10:28] <HFSPLUS> ikonia, waaaaa
[10:31] <HFSPLUS> Yes i will go away but here “There was a rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and who feasted sumptuously every day. 20 And at his gate was laid a poor man named Lazarus, covered with sores, 21 who desired to be fed with what fell from the rich man's table. Moreover, even the dogs came and licked his sores. 22 The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham's side.[a] The rich man also died and wa
[10:31] <HFSPLUS> s buried, 23 and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side. 24 And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in torment in this flame.’ 25 But Abraham said, ‘Child, remember that you in your lifetime received your good things, and Lazarus in like manner bad things; but now
[12:12] <ikonia> ignore it
[13:15] <ikonia> tedious
[18:59] <HFSPLUS> HFSPLUS HAS ARRIVED!
[19:02] <HFSPLUS> And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away.  Matthew 5:30
[19:07] <HFSPLUS> Unit193, nooo waaa
[19:08] <HFSPLUS> ikonia, waaa
[19:08] <HFSPLUS> kline me!
[19:08] <HFSPLUS> waaaa
[19:08] <HFSPLUS> I demand to be banned or klined


[04:21] <wolfger> Happy birthday, brousch
[04:22] <wolfger> and happy new year, everybody
[04:26] <Scary_Guy> not yet, but it soon will be
[05:11] <cmaloney> HNY
[06:54] <goat-g> wee
[12:49] <brousch> Thanks but it wasn’t my birthday, it is in June.
[14:20] <cmaloney> ahoy


[13:09] <cmaloney> morning
[13:22] <rick_h> Morning
[13:24] <_stink__> yo
[13:35] <brousch> mama
[14:49] <jrwren> ~GEM!!!!
[16:03] <cmaloney> I have now taken to saying "it is what it is" as my default catchphrase
[16:03] <cmaloney> please be advised
[16:04] <jrwren> that is pretty bad.
[16:04] <cmaloney> jrwren: Yeah, I remember one publishing program that we had (not sure if it was Envision or what) that used GEM
[16:04] <cmaloney> I want to say it was Envision but I think we had something else that was DR
[16:04] <cmaloney> (Digital Research)
[16:04] <cmaloney> and it surely wasn't Ventura
[16:05] <cmaloney> Had an interview with a company / collective where I would have to invoice my hours
[16:05] <cmaloney> so that was fun
[16:05] <cmaloney> Fully OSS, but very different model than I'm used to for a business
[16:08] <cmaloney> And naturally the whole feasability of the job is whether or not the GOP decides to fuck with healthcare
[16:09] <cmaloney> That's awesome because it put the USA at a competitive disadvantage
[16:09] <cmaloney> But hey: "tax cuts for the rich" - making the USA great since 1980
[20:38] <greg-g> :)
[21:32] <dzho> puts the US at a competitive advantage against countries that have, you know, decent standards of living, a middle class, etc etc
[21:33] <dzho> it improves US competitiveness against countries where life remains substantially more nasty, brutish, and short that the previous set
[21:33] <dzho> it's all about your peer aspirations.
[21:33] <dzho> s/that the/than the/


[01:49] <gnomefreak> rodarvus: ping
[02:48] <rodarvus> gnomefreak, pong
[03:45] <zul> Mithrandir: patch applied
[06:05] <BenC> infinity: ping
[06:06] <infinity> BenC: Yo.
[06:06] <BenC> infinity: Can you explain why dh_strip on the buildd's is acting different from the one I have installed?
[06:06] <BenC> http://librarian.launchpad.net/4139391/buildlog_ubuntu-edgy-sparc.linux-source-2.6.17_2.6.17-7.19_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[06:07] <BenC> the dh_strip error in there that causes it to abort
[06:07] <BenC> looks like this on my local builds:
[06:07] <infinity> BenC: Because pkg-create-dbgsym is installed on the buildds.
[06:07] <infinity> BenC: In other words, "blame pitti".
[06:07] <BenC> ok
[06:07] <BenC> and of course pitti is on vacation
[06:08] <infinity> No, he got back yesterday.
[06:08] <BenC> ah
[06:08] <infinity> He's just asleep right now, that's all.
[06:08] <infinity> (base)adconrad@cthulhu:~$ TZ=Europe/Berlin date
[06:08] <infinity> Wed Sep  6 06:08:23 CEST 2006
[06:08] <infinity> Should be up in a couple of hours, I suspect.
[06:08] <BenC> I'm surprised you know what sleep is :)
[06:08] <Bertl> btw, that timezone is no excuse for being asleep :)
[06:08] <infinity> I'm familiar with the idea that other people occasionally lay down and rest their eyes.
[06:09] <BenC> infinity: is there a way to blacklist packages from using pkg-create-dbgsym  (considering the kernel doesn't need it)?
[06:10] <Bertl> BenC, infinity: talking about timezones, when would be a good time to have a small chat with you folks about ubuntu and kernel development?
[06:10] <infinity> BenC: Well, it respects the NO_PKG_MANGLE environment variable, but that also turns off striptranslations.  But, I suppose the kernel doesn't ship translations either.
[06:10] <BenC> Bertl: I'm available now
[06:10] <infinity> Bertl: Nowish?
[06:10] <infinity> BenC: OTOH, it looks like a bonafide bug in pkg-create-dbgsym, so fixing it would be nice.
[06:38] <BenC> I'm off to bed
[06:38] <infinity> BenC: G'night.  I'll bug pitti about his breakage.
[06:38] <Bertl> keep up the good work!
[07:52] <Mithrandir> zul: does that mean you've uploaded a new xen-source?
[11:14] <doko> BenC, fabbione: we seem to have some smp problems on sparc; my "testcase" is building OOo on faure, which randomly hangs in the idlc compiler. the current build uses a uniprocessor kernel (elmo rebooted), and it works fine
[11:17] <fabbione> doko: could you please file a bug with faure's specs? i am still vac till next monday
[11:17] <fabbione> doko: it might be some libc optimization code or so
[11:18] <doko> ok, what specs do you want?
[11:20] <fabbione> cpu/ram/kernel toolchain versions.. usual stuff that i can install on my t2000 and test
[11:20] <fabbione> also how do you try to build..
[11:20] <fabbione> make -j 1 or make -j foo
[11:20] <fabbione> and make sure the bug is assigned to me
[12:28] <zul> Mithrandir: no but i am close
[12:29] <Mithrandir> zul: \o/
[12:29] <Mithrandir> zul: I had some weird problems last night with Xen making a debian/-amd64-k8 directory and such.  it also seemed xen-headers suddenly included full kernel source.  Might just be me who'd broken something, but I thought I'd tell you.
[12:31] <zul> ok
[01:52] <gnomefreak> is it possible to add vga=normal to the kernel parameter automagically if a ATI card is detected? or its something that cant be done?
[01:54] <gnomefreak> someone requested that in a bug report as it fixed his issue. i would like to either close it or mark it as a wishlist depending on if it can be done at all
[01:58] <Mithrandir> it's technically possible, yes, but I don't think we'd want it.
[01:59] <gnomefreak> hmmmmm
[02:17] <BenC_> plus it would be something done outside the kernel
[02:32] <zul> heh dmi_blacklist might work but I agree with BenC
[02:49] <rodarvus> BenC, do you have plans to update the vmware-player kernel modules for 2.6.17?
[02:49] <rodarvus> installing vmware-player insists on installing vmware-player-kernel-modules-2.6.15-23
[02:51] <zul> weird
[03:48] <BenC> rodarvus: Yes, they are in the upload
[03:50] <rodarvus> nice, thanks!
[03:51] <zul> so vmplater kernel modules is handle by lrm now?
[04:28] <zul> vmplayer even
[04:32] <BenC> zul: yeah
[04:33] <zul> sweet..
[05:00] <lamont> BenC: you around?
[05:00] <BenC> lamont: yeah
[05:47] <kOpter> Yello :)
[05:48] <kOpter> Since Dapper, I have a strange issue. On cold boot my chipset doesn't get detected. Dmesg just makes no message of it.
[05:49] <kOpter> This means AGP, network etc are not working.. which is not handy. However, rebooting the system solves this 9/10 times.
[05:49] <kOpter> I think it's kernel related.. is there any way to get some more information on what exactly is going wrong?
[05:50] <kOpter> All I have now is dmesg outputs.. which aren't helping much. I think it's kernel related because I did not have these problems on Breezy..
[05:53] <kOpter> Paste of missing dmesg messages at: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/22739
[06:48] <zul> ok this sucks..
[06:50] <Mithrandir> what does?
[06:51] <zul> ndiswrapper looks like it needs a special patch as well
[06:51] <zul> that and my network connection sucks
[06:52] <Mithrandir> I'm trying to find out what's up with my builds going awry.
[06:52] <Mithrandir> you don't have all your stuff in git yet?
[06:52] <zul> no unfortunately ill send you a url tonight
[06:53] <Mithrandir> no worries.
[06:57] <zul> Mithrandir: patches always welcomed of course
[07:09] <Mithrandir> zul: is it correct that debian/build/install-$flavour should include lots of .c files?
[07:10] <zul> i believe so
[07:10] <zul> it just copies the debian/build directory and does kernel-image
[07:11] <Mithrandir> hmm, it doesn't match what's in linux-headers?
[07:11] <zul> hmm...
[07:11] <zul> ill have to look at that closer
[07:12] <Mithrandir> it also installs it to /lib/modules/$(release)/kernel rather than /usr/src/xen-headers-$(release)-$(flavour) which is what l-h seems to do?
[07:13] <zul> damn it...
[07:14] <zul> ill try to fix it tonight
[07:14] <Mithrandir> cheers.
[07:14] <Mithrandir> sorry about poking holes in your packages.
[07:14] <zul> no problem
[07:14] <zul> its the only way ill get better
[07:15] <zul> or the xen-* will get better
[07:17] <zul> besides it is edgy ;)
[09:08] <Mithrandir> zul: I'm getting close to a working debian/rules:xen-headers now.
[09:15] <zul> sweet..
[09:16] <zul> thanks
[09:16] <kimo> Hi, anyone knows if edgy kernel has the sky2 driver fixed?
[09:16] <Mithrandir> zul: http://pastebin.ca/162680
[09:17] <Mithrandir> zul: at least it seems to work for me.
[09:18] <Mithrandir> zul: sorry, that's broken, let me try again
[09:19] <Mithrandir> (a couple of missing $$i-s)
[09:19] <zul> heh
[09:20] <Mithrandir> so it installed junk to /usr/src/xen-headers-2.6.16-9 instead of /u/s/x-h-2.6.16-9-amd64-generic, &c
[09:20] <Mithrandir> this machine is too slow. :-(
[09:20] <zul> doh..
[09:30] <Mithrandir> zul: http://pastebin.ca/162691 should work better
[09:30] <Mithrandir> zul: xrm seems unhappy due to rivafb crack, though
[09:31] <zul> hmmm...ok..ill get this fixed tonight along with a bunch of other stuff
[09:32] <zul> whats wrong with xrm?
[09:32] <Mithrandir> well, for a start I don't think you've uploaded a package of it yet, so I'm using my home-hacked shit.
[09:32] <zul> probably not..
[10:02] <Mithrandir> zul: actually, you might want to add cp -rp .config .extraversion .kernelrelease Makefile Module.symvers $(XEN_HEADERS_DIR)-$$i/usr/src/$(XEN_HEADERS)-$$i/ ; \ to the first for loop in xen-headers to get .config and friends installed.
[10:13] <Mithrandir> (really, actually, there doesn't appear to be a .extraversion there, so maybe drop that)
[10:52] <zul> Mithrandir: will do
[10:54] <Mithrandir> zul: you might want to wait until I have something which works properly, actually.


[00:23] <urbanape> statik: damnation. Looks that way. Don't know what happened. Must have gotten overlooked with the holiday and bindwood push.
[00:38] <urbanape> hmm, wonder what this means: bzr: ERROR: Public branch "bzr+ssh://bazaar.ubunet/~urbanape/ubuntuone-servers/new-folder-inline-edit" lacks revision<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[00:39] <urbanape> ah, nm. Needed to push.
[00:43] <urbanape> statik: submitted
[02:20] <hamlinux> is there a tutorial available for sharing files.  Most notably version control when corroborating work
[05:28] <rico49> hi. i'm running UbuntuOne on Ubuntu 9.10 fully updated. I can see my directory structure under the ~/UbuntuOne "root" folder. None of the file sync. Any help on this would be welcome.
[05:29] <rico49> For example, are any particular file permissions required?
[05:29] <rico49> And does my UbuntuOne name have to match my login name at the Linux level?
[05:29] <rico49> Thanks!!!
[05:29] <mattgriffin> rico49: hi
[05:29] <rico49> mattgriffin: hi
[05:29] <mattgriffin> login names don't need to match
[05:29] <rico49> thanks
[05:30] <mattgriffin> rico49: have you completed the Add a Computer process for the system you are using?
[05:30] <rico49> As far as I know. My computer shows up in the list -- which has only this computer in it.
[05:31] <rico49> I may try deleting it and adding it again. I'm wondering if I reinstalled Ubuntu since my original signup and thus destroyed the certificate
[05:32] <mattgriffin> rico49: if so, you should have an Ubuntu One token under Applications >> Accessories >> Passwords and Encryption Keys
[05:32] <mattgriffin> rico49: are you using the regular Ubuntu One package or have you setup the beta PPA in your Software Sources?
[05:33] <rico49> I have not added beta PPA to my software sources.
[05:33] <rico49> I do see the token
[05:34] <mattgriffin> you can go to one.ubuntu.com/account and remove all of the authenticated machines... this should force your computer to re-authenticate after restarting the ubuntu one sync client. it will also create a new token.
[05:34] <rico49> should i add the PPA to my software sources and upgrade?
[05:35] <mattgriffin> rico49: you shouldn't have to if you are running a pretty standard Ubuntu installation
[05:35] <mattgriffin> are you behind a firewall?
[05:35] <mattgriffin> rico49: sorry... i meant proxy server
[05:35] <rico49> well, i'm running on my home wireless system. i didn't setup a firewall but I didn't go look to see if it was filtering anything due to not running into issues before
[05:36] <rico49> i could check that too.
[05:36] <rico49> do you happen to know the ports and protocol that UbuntuOne uses?
[05:36] <rico49> yup... proxy....
[05:36] <rico49> no proxy server active
[05:36] <rico49> beyond the wireless router
[05:37] <mattgriffin> rico49: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOne/#u1storage
[05:37] <mattgriffin> rico49: ports
[05:37] <rico49> Thanks!!!
[05:38] <rico49> this page is very helpful....
[05:39] <mattgriffin> rico49: np. i'm not really a technical member of the team. i recommend reviewing that wiki page as well as these (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOne/Tutorials/ and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOne/Bugs) if you want to work on fixing it tonight. members of the development team will join the channel tomorrow morning so they can help with deeper diagnostics if needed.
[05:40] <rico49> mattgriffin: I appreciate your help and will follow the links you provide.  The information looks like its just what I need.
[05:49] <rico49> mattgriffin: After I deleted the machine from the list of active machines and then rebooted everything appears to be working.  Thank you very much!!!
[05:50] <mattgriffin> rico49: awesome! no problem. have fun!
[05:50] <rico49> :-)
[11:41] <jussi01> honk!
[11:41] <jussi01> :D
[11:42] <drbobb> hello, my "Ubuntu One" folder is a mess, with *.u1conflict files all over the place
[11:42] <drbobb> including a subfolder that i can't fix in any way
[11:43] <drbobb> this service is simply not working correctly for me
[11:43] <jussi01> drbobb: perhaps its a good idea to start from the beginning, what you did, how you installed, your version of ubuntu etc
[11:44] <drbobb> ubuntu karmic
[11:44] <drbobb> I have only 2 pc's hooked up to my ubuntuone account
[11:44] <drbobb> my laptop and my office desktop
[11:45] <aquarius> jussi01, heh. I'm working on it :)
[11:45]  * jussi01 hi5's aquarius
[11:45] <drbobb> since I never use both at once, there is no reason for anu *.u1conflict files to appear in the first place
[11:45] <jussi01> drbobb: and how did you install it?
[11:46] <drbobb> jussi01: I don't recall whether I used apt-get, aptitude or synaptic, does it make much of a difference?
[11:46] <jussi01> (or is it installed by default on ubuntu?)
[11:46] <jussi01> drbobb: ok, just checking it was from the repos, not from some other download
[11:47] <drbobb> in any case it's official deb packages
[11:47] <jussi01> drbobb: so, when did thes files appear?
[11:47] <jussi01> drbobb: yes, but sometimes official packages can be old, beta, etc.
[11:48] <drbobb> jussi01: the ones I installed were from karmic/main
[11:48] <jussi01> right. so when di the files appear?
[11:48] <drbobb> uh let me see
[11:49] <drbobb> I'm getting them all the time, since late november or so
[11:49] <jussi01> ok, and could you tell your use case? ie. how you use the service?
[11:49] <drbobb> in one case I have a subfolder called L1, that gets renamed to L1.u1conflict whenever I sync
[11:50] <drbobb> and doesn't appear in the web interface no matter what
[11:50] <drbobb> although it is present on both my client machines
[11:50] <jussi01> argh, I need to disappear for a time, back in a little while. meantime, I hope someone here can help
[11:50] <jussi01> (work... just lovely)
[11:51] <drbobb> generally I create or edit a file on either of the machines, and sync ie. connect when I'm done
[11:52] <drbobb> then after a while I'm at the other machine, and I see that file is there except it has .u1conflict appended to its name
[11:54] <jussi01> drbobb: oh, and Ive still like 1 sec, but take a look here: https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-client/+faq/677
[11:55] <drbobb> jussi01: I read that, but it doesn't seem to work for me
[11:55] <drbobb> for instance, i rename the folder L1.u1conflict back to L1 manually
[11:56] <drbobb> as soon as I connect it gets renamed back
[11:57] <drbobb> now I have L1.u1conflict on both client machines, even though their contents are the same
[11:57] <drbobb> and no L1 on either
[11:58] <rtgz> drbobb, hi. In case you put new file to the directory, does it get synced or it is immediately renamed to .u1conflict?
[11:59] <rtgz> drbobb, I mean if you are connected to the server
[11:59] <drbobb> rtgz: I just did that yesterday, put a new file in on one client
[11:59] <drbobb> now on the other client I see only a .u1conflict file
[12:00] <drbobb> and none with the original's name
[12:00] <rtgz> drbobb, ok, say, you put the file to computerA. Does it get synced?
[12:00] <drbobb> supposedly yes, I get a notification that says 1 file updated
[12:01] <rtgz> drbobb, okay, then computerB tries to sync, downloads something that is immediately renamed to conflict file, right?
[12:01] <drbobb> so it seems
[12:01] <rtgz> drbobb, okay, do you have the access to both machines at this time?
[12:01] <drbobb> right now only one of them
[12:01] <drbobb> the other is at home and switched off
[12:02] <rtgz> drbobb, ok. Does computerA synces u1conflict files if you put them to computerB?
[12:02] <drbobb> oh and one more thing
[12:02] <drbobb> I tried to fix the L1 folder by moving it out of Ubuntu One on both machines
[12:03] <drbobb> and copying it to the server via the web interface
[12:03] <drbobb> but that doesn't work
[12:03] <drbobb> I click on create new folder, provide a name and confirm
[12:03] <drbobb> but nothing happens - no folder is created
[12:04] <rtgz> drbobb, hm... Is there anything special with the file name (aka, could you provide it here for me to test the web ui and client) ?
[12:05] <rtgz> drbobb, I mean the path name, etc.
[12:05] <drbobb> the (sub)folder name is L1
[12:06] <rtgz> drbobb, anyway, here's how that can be diagnosed - first create a new folder, say 'testing' on ComputerA and create the directory structure mimicking the one that you already have. This will allow us to get info faster when browsing for relevant log entries.
[12:07] <drbobb> ok, I guess I should come back when I'm able to contract both computers at once
[12:07] <rtgz> drbobb, then it would be good to start ubuntuone-syncdaemon with debug enabled on the computerB ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOne/Bugs#Temporary%20debug%20mode ).
[12:07] <drbobb> now I gotta get working, c.u. again
[12:08] <drbobb> ok, thx for that suggestion
[12:08] <rtgz> drbobb, then try connecting via applet and check whether files in testing dir get u1conflict
[12:09] <drbobb> rtgz: some files do get u1conflict
[12:09] <drbobb> but in the case at hand it's the folder itself
[12:09] <rtgz> afterwards post your computerB's ~/.cache/ubuntuone/log/syncdaemon.log to the ticket (or paste.ubuntu.com if you get to IRC from computerB as well)
[12:09] <drbobb> ok will do
[12:09] <rtgz> drbobb, thanks
[12:10] <rtgz> grrr, we need better conflict notification, i.e. "This file is considered to be conflicting because there appears to be newer file in the web interface and local copy was changed"
[12:12] <rtgz> and the ability to chose whether to resolve conflicts manually (there appears some file conflicts in your U1 directory. How do you want to handle them? [Rename my to u1conflict], [Examine all files]... etc.
[13:18] <rtgz> tomboy note web ui greates uuids w/o dashes. Is it ok?
[13:23] <verterok> dobey, Chipaca: ping
[13:24] <verterok> dobey, Chipaca: I know we already defined the UDFs DBus API, but was wondering if you guys needs something specific for the Shares/d bits
[13:35] <rtgz> verterok, is support to obtain info on directory planned? I.e whether all files / folder under it are synced or not. Maybe it is better described as qecursive query for a path info.
[13:36] <rtgz> i missed several days here being sick, breaking/fixing router and now I am back to ask weird questions and provide weird solutions to nonexistent issues :)
[13:36] <verterok> rtgz: not for the time frame of the UDFs feature, but it should be simple to add such method
[13:37] <verterok> rtgz: :)
[13:39] <rtgz> verterok, since nautilus cannot be told to gather dbus requests this may mean a lot of metadata querying. ATM the only thing I know about metadata is something somewhere is slow...
[13:39] <rtgz> verterok, I mean these requests will need to be sent for every folder and file. every folder request should trigger recursive internal checks.
[13:40] <rtgz> Btw, applet is going away for Lucid, what's going to replace it?
[13:40] <verterok> rtgz: I think the problem with doing a lot of dbus requests to get the metadtata of each file/dir is the cost of the dbus call itself
[13:41] <verterok> rtgz: querying the metadata should be fast in the order of ~100 objects (files/dirs)
[13:41] <verterok> s/100/1000/
[13:41] <rtgz> verterok, this is done in the nautilus extension at the moment, so we cannot speed up this part.
[13:41] <verterok> but don't have any benchmark :)
[13:41] <rtgz> verterok, really need to see how that magical metadata looks like.
[13:42] <rtgz> Btw, one.ubuntu.com is not yet IPv6-ready :-P
[13:42] <verterok> rtgz: this is a very simple way to get all the metadtata of a tree: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/355495/
[13:43] <verterok> rtgz: the metadata it's just a bunch of pickled python dicts
[13:43] <verterok> rtgz: ls -R ~/.local/share/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/fsm
[13:44] <rtgz> verterok, every file has its own corresponding medatada file?
[13:44] <verterok> pfibiger: do you know if there are any plans to make one.ubuntu.com IPV6-friendly? ^
[13:44] <verterok> rtgz: yes
[13:45] <rtgz> verterok, I am already prepared to test IPv6 connections :), that's why I am poking everyone everywhere and it seems that not much people out there are excited as much as I am with this :)
[13:50] <pfibiger> verterok: i wouldn't say there are specific plans, but we ought to. file a bug? :)
[13:50] <verterok> pfibiger: ok, thanks! :)
[13:51] <verterok> rtgz: ^
[13:51] <rtgz> verterok, he he... bug bug bug
[13:58] <urbanape> jamesh: ping
[13:58] <urbanape> or jblount: ping
[14:00] <urbanape> jamesh, jblount: nm, found it
[14:17] <joshuahoover1> dobey: ping
[14:25] <dobey> hi joshuahoover1
[14:26] <dobey> verterok: i don't know that it needs any changes? and chipaca is on holiday this week
[14:26] <joshuahoover1> dobey: hi! do have any ideas on bug 395483?
[14:26] <verterok> dobey: oh, ok.
[14:27] <verterok> dobey: just wondering if there are any plans to handle shares in the UI and you guys might need something extra from the API
[14:27] <verterok> dobey: we can't take a look to it next week
[14:27] <verterok> s/can't/can/ :p
[14:27] <dobey> ok
[14:28] <adiroiban> rodrigo__: hi, do we still need to provide the unnamed main couchdb and desktopcouch classes / headers?
[14:32] <dobey> joshuahoover1: commented + Incomplete :)
[14:34] <joshuahoover1> dobey: thanks!
[14:35] <dobey> i guess i do have to do bug 'day' today, since i'm not in a meeting room somewhere :)
[14:48] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, no, we are breaking the API like crazies on the unstable branch (CouchDB->Couchdb), so no need to, I think
[14:48] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, well, maybe we could add a couchdb-compat.h file that #define's all the new stuff to match the old one
[14:48] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, but since only evolution-couchdb uses it that I know, I don't think we need it
[14:49] <adiroiban> rodrigo__: yes. same opinion here
[14:49] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, but if you want, write that file, if evolution-couchdb from gnome-2-28 branch in git compiles with it, then it's working
[14:49] <adiroiban> I think it should be better to fix evolution-couchdb
[14:49] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, unstable branch of evo-couchdb now compiles fine with unstable coucjdb-glib
[14:50] <adiroiban> job done :)
[14:50] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, it fails to run on my system because I've by mistake installed e-d-s 2.30, which has some corba->dbus changes
[14:50] <rodrigo__> but I should be fixing it soon to work with both 2.28 and 2.30
[14:50] <adiroiban> ok
[14:50] <diverse_izzue> hey all! is there (other than hanging out on irc) a way of knowing what's going on in the ubuntuone-world, such as a blog?
[14:51] <rodrigo__> diverse_izzue, there is a twitter and a blog yeah
[14:51]  * rodrigo__ looks for the blog
[14:51] <dobey> there is a blog, and twitter/identi.ca accounts, and a facebook page
[14:51] <rodrigo__> http://voices.canonical.com/ubuntuone/?feed=rss2
[14:51] <adiroiban> I build the source package for the latest couchd-db. works fine for me https://edge.launchpad.net/~adiroiban/+archive/ppa/+packages
[14:51] <rodrigo__> ah, and facebook, yeah
[14:52] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, cool!
[14:52] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, works fine, as it installs fine, or the API really works fine?
[14:52] <adiroiban> both
[14:52] <rodrigo__> woohoo!
[14:53] <rodrigo__> ok, so as soon as evo-couchdb is fixed for the 2.28/2.30 issue, I'll submit it for lucid
[14:53] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, well, or you can submit it yourself, if you want
[14:53] <adiroiban> yep. my packaging changes are here https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~adiroiban/couchdb-glib/ubuntu-0-5-99
[14:53] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, but I'll do a 0.6.0 release before that
[14:54] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, you haven't pushed the branch
[14:56] <adiroiban> rodrigo__: true, it looks like there were some error durring the push
[14:57] <adiroiban> solved
[14:58] <adiroiban> rodrigo__: what about the disable-debug merge proposal?
[14:58] <adiroiban> is it ok?
[14:58] <adiroiban> or you would like some other changes
[14:58] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, yeah, sorry, it's in my queue, just busy with some other stuff
[14:58] <adiroiban> ah. np
[14:59] <rodrigo__> haven't looked at your last change, so don't worry for now, I'll add a comment as soon as I review it
[14:59] <diverse_izzue> rodrigo__ & co: thanks. what are you planning for lucid?
[15:00] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, the package branch looks great, so keep it around, and we'll submit that for lucid once we release 0.6.0 and evo-couchdb is fixed
[15:01] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, oh, working on vala bindings?? -> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~adiroiban/couchdb-glib/vala-bindings
[15:01] <rodrigo__> adiroiban rocks :D
[15:01] <adiroiban> well, I need to do that work for building my vala app
[15:02] <adiroiban> and I will plan to maintain them
[15:02] <adiroiban> so I pushed that branch in case someone else find them useful
[15:02] <adiroiban> if I have time, maybe I will write some vala tests for the vapi files
[15:03] <rodrigo__> adiroiban, a friend of mine started writing vala bindings a long time ago, maybe you can get in touch with him, not for his code, which is out of date now, but for his plans, which I think were to be part of the vala bindings project/package
[15:03]  * rodrigo__ looks for his email
[15:05] <jblount> Desktop+ MEETING BEGINS
[15:05] <jblount> Say "me", document status, etc
[15:05] <jblount> me
[15:06] <teknico> me
[15:06] <rodrigo__> me, document status, etc :)
[15:06] <CardinalFang> me
[15:06] <teknico> oh right, sorry: "document status, etc"
[15:07] <urbanape> me
[15:08] <jblount> DONE: Worked on layout issues tagged gd in launchpad
[15:08] <jblount> TODO: FACE
[15:08] <jblount> BLOCKED: Nope
[15:08] <jblount> teknico: tag!
[15:09] <teknico> DONE: finished fighting for net access, situation stable now; more work on two branches for configuring funambol for sending sms messages (#418048); dealt with a dormant branch, waiting for desktopcouch's new version
[15:09] <teknico> TODO: propose and land two branches for configuring funambol for sending sms messages (#418048); finish setting up a development environment in a virtual machine; start implementing the mobile sync REST API for client app (#504689)
[15:09] <teknico> BLOCK: none
[15:09] <teknico> next: CardinalFang
[15:09] <teknico> uff, gnome slows me down ;-P
[15:09] <rodrigo__> eh, I'm next!
[15:10] <rodrigo__> • DONE: Submitted latest stable couchdb-glib/evo-couchdb for Lucid. Changed DBus's create_share to accept more than one user/email. Looked at tomboy syncing problems. Some renaming of classes in couchdb-glib unstable. Almost got new XML<->HTML note converter
[15:10] <rodrigo__> • TODO: Conflict resolver tool in pair tool. Look at becoming a MOTU (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers). Make sandy's snowy test suite work with our server (http://git.gnome.org/cgit/snowy/tree/api/tests.py). Discuss with jdo and aquarius about oauth token per app, not per machine? Send Otto<EMAIL_ADDRESS>a screencast of contacts picker. Retrieve OAuth tokens from keyring in music store widget. Ch
[15:10] <rodrigo__> eck with Ken status of music store packages
[15:10] <rodrigo__> next: CardinalFang
[15:11] <teknico> rodrigo__, oops, sorry
[15:11] <teknico> I blame gnome once again ;-)
[15:12] <rodrigo__> teknico, yeah, sure, gnome's fault :D
[15:12] <teknico> :-D
[15:13] <urbanape> CardinalFang?
[15:13] <CardinalFang> sorry -- got distracted.  urbanape, you first.
[15:13] <urbanape> DONE: Bindwood's default operation is now complete. Local client understands and performs changes in location - moves happen! Submitted and landed new-folder-inline-edit branch.
[15:13] <urbanape> Started helping jblount with the public URLs branch for web UI.
[15:14] <urbanape> TODO: On-call review today, finish up public URLs branch, get migration and subsequent client code paths done for Bindwood.
[15:14] <urbanape> BLOCK: None.
[15:14] <urbanape> eom?
[15:14] <urbanape> oops, had that last one on the clipboard.
[15:14] <urbanape> CardinalFang is next
[15:15] <teknico> glipper, klipper, it's all a dripper
[15:17] <CardinalFang> DONE: slept off some of cold.  got sprint travel booked.  tomboy/snowy bug defense.
[15:17] <CardinalFang> TODO: reviews. triage. coffee. desktopcouch update into karmic.
[15:17] <CardinalFang> BLOCKED: None.
[15:17] <CardinalFang> Sorry for delay.
[15:17] <CardinalFang> EOM.
[15:17] <urbanape> jblount: should we maybe put the "make public" stuff on the info overlay?
[15:21] <jblount> urbanape: Yep. It should already be there in that branch I sent you.
[15:27] <dobey> oh i thought we didn't do the standup on tuesdays
[15:27] <dobey> because of the bug day thing
[15:28] <urbanape> oh, hey look, it is.
[15:29] <jblount> urbanape: :)
[15:29] <voytech> Hi people, what do You think about synchronizing akonadi in DesktopCouch/ UbuntuOne ? I'm trying to find a topic for my master thesis and I've found out that Aconadi is server for storing PIM data. In my opinion it could be nicely integrated with ubuntuOne. But as for now I don't have a knowledge how it works exactly. So I'm asking You If my idea id good
[15:30] <dobey> voytech: someone was working on an akonadi backend to store contacts in desktopcouch, but i don't know if that's gone anywhere or not yet
[15:30] <dobey> rodrigo__: do you know anything about that?
[15:30] <rodrigo__> I know the kdeab people were working on it, not sure about the status though
[15:31] <rodrigo__> statik should know, I think
[16:00] <voytech> statik: Do You know something about synchronizing akonadi in ubuntuone/desktopcouch ? If there is someone working on it ?
[16:02] <jblount> voytech: statik 's laptop is not working atm, so he might take a long time getting back to you
[16:06] <aquarius> voytech, there's already been some work done by Till Adam and the KDAB team to provide a CouchDB back end to Akonadi
[16:06] <aquarius> voytech, that code's in the upstream akonadi codebase, as I understand it
[16:06] <aquarius> I don't know if anyone's still working on it and keeping it up to date with current desktopcouch, though
[16:07] <aquarius> voytech, if you wanted to pick that code up and bring it up to date and provide really good Akonadi integration, that'd be great! We'd be happy to give advice about how to talk to desktopcouch
[16:08] <till> I've not kept up with desktop couch, lateluy, no.
[16:08] <till> The resource still worked, though, last time I tried.
[16:08] <aquarius> till, that's what I thought, on both those points :)
[16:08] <till> voytech: we (KDAB and the Akonadi team) will be happy to help
[16:08] <aquarius> excellent!
[16:08] <till> voytech: we just don't have the bandwidth to push it, atm
[16:08] <till> (and desktopcouch was a bit of amoving target)
[16:09] <aquarius> it's moving more slowly now than it was now that it's a stable API :)
[16:09] <till> voytech: please to meet you, btw, I'm Till, I coordinate the KDE and Maemo work at KDAB, and I wrote the akonadi/couch resource :).
[17:13] <voytech> I was disconnected for some time
[17:14] <aquarius> voytech, http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/01/12/%23ubuntuone.html#t16:06 might be useful then :)
[17:14] <voytech> But I see my idea isn't bad :)
[17:18] <aquarius> jolly good idea, is what it is.
[17:37] <voytech> till: So you wrote the resource.. Where can I get some information about it ? I have to understand many thing fisrtly, becouse as I said before I'm new to ubuntuone/desktopcouch
[17:51] <voytech> till: And I would like to know how your resource exactly works ? Maybe I could download it to become familiar with it ?
[19:10] <gourgi> gourgi: hi jblount, hi all, for days now i'm seeing a "Something has gone wrong (500) Server Error" when trying to view my contacts from the webUI.  http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/4572/screenshotwv.jpg  . what i have to do now ?
[19:13] <jblount> gourgi: Hi! I think something is temporarily wrong with the contacts web ui. Let me ask around and see what the progress is on it.
[19:14] <gourgi> thanks jblount
[19:18] <jblount> gourgi: So that error page should have had a number on it that would help us track down the problem. I'm going to get this fixed, but I don't have any good way to track down your error.
[19:18] <jblount> gourgi: How long have you been seeing this?
[19:18] <gourgi> about 6-8 days now
[19:19] <jblount> gourgi: Wow, that's a long time. Thanks for letting us know.
[19:20] <gourgi> it is the 3rd day i'm coming here reporting this
[19:20] <gourgi> :)
[19:21] <rtgz> jblount, looks fine from here :-/
[19:21] <jblount> gourgi: Do you see the same problem here? https://edge.one.ubuntu.com/contacts/
[19:21] <jblount> rtgz: Yeah, it works for me, but I've only got a few contacts in.
[19:21] <gourgi> jblount yes
[19:24] <gourgi> same problem on the edge too.. jblount do you need to see my ~/.cache logs ?
[19:25] <rtgz> shot in the dark: gourgi, do you have some non-latin1 characters in the first/last name of at least one of your contacts?
[19:26] <jblount> gourgi: While I can't fix this for you now, I can make that number I mentioned show up on edge in a few hours so we can track down the problem. Have you submitted a bug about this yet?
[19:27] <gourgi> rtgz i have almost all my contacts in my native language (greek). jblount i haven't yet, but i will if needed.
[19:27] <rtgz> gourgi, good. will try with greek symbols
[19:27] <jblount> gourgi: It would be very helpful if you could submit a bug, that way we could track the progress of the fix.
[19:28] <gourgi> ok , i 'm filling it now
[19:28] <jblount> gourgi: Thanks!
[19:30]  * rtgz inserted an entry, waiting for replication...
[19:40] <rtgz> hm.. how does desktopcouch use Avahi?
[19:41] <aquarius> rtgz, for LAN sharing
[19:41] <rtgz> aquarius, and if there is no Avahi running?
[19:41] <rtgz> aquarius, 2010-01-12 21:41:16,446 - We seem to be running already, or can't publish our zeroconf advert.  org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name org.freedesktop.Avahi was not provided by any .service files
[19:42] <aquarius> then it'll throw an error saying that we can't publish our zeroconf advert
[19:42] <aquarius> as you have discovered :)
[19:42] <rtgz> aquarius, will this error prevent, say, replication ?
[19:42] <gourgi> rtgz jblount thanks for looking into this!  bug filed  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-servers/+bug/506584
[19:42] <aquarius> we only publish a zeroconf advert if LAN sharing has been set up, so it doesn't affect most people
[19:42] <rtgz> aquarius, hm.. I have LAN sharing set up? O_O
[19:42] <aquarius> erm. I'm not sure whether replication as a whole is killed by that happening. CardinalFang would know better.
[19:43] <aquarius> rtgz, there is a non-zero chance that I am lying about that. If I am lying, though, and we publish zeroconf regardless, then it's a bug. :)
[19:43] <rtgz> aquarius, my ISP started to use .local domain (yep, will fight with them... SOON).  But...it might do.
[19:44] <aquarius> wish cardinalfang was around, he knows more about that sharing bit than I do. I'd have to grovel through the code and work it out
[19:46] <dobey> so
[19:46] <dobey> publish != search
[19:46] <rtgz> aquarius, desktopcouch-service does not seem to return me the terminal prompt...
[19:46] <dobey> and searching for other shared things still requires working avahi
[19:46] <dobey> even if you aren't publishing anything over it
[19:47] <rtgz> the problem that it looks like my replication is now broken due to this :-/
[19:47] <aquarius> dobey, yeah, the point is that we only use avahi to detect the current location of already-paired LAN desktopcouches (well, and to actually *do* pairing). We know whether we are paired with LAN desktopcouches or not by looking in the management database, so *if* we are not paired with anything, we shouldn't publish a zeroconf advert (because it'll never be used. also, security.)
[19:48] <aquarius> rtgz, run desktopcouch-pair
[19:48] <aquarius> rtgz, to see if you're already LAN paired.
[19:48] <aquarius> I think that you're not, though, which suggests that we're doing zeroconf advertising when we don't need to be, and if that fails we're crashing. Thus, epic fail
[19:49] <rtgz> aquarius, it used to work, yet the last time i got replication worked was on 2010-01-04. Since then - ERRORs related to avahi and nothing went to U1... Scaaary
[19:49] <aquarius> rtgz, yeah. I think (a) we're publishing zeroconf when we shouldn't, and (b) failing to publish zeroconf stops replication, which is two separate bugs. If you could file those bugs that'd be really nice
[19:50]  * rtgz  - yeah, right - tried to test 1 bug, got 2 separate issues... yeah, right...
[19:52] <dobey> aquarius: if i buy a new laptop with ubuntu on it, and i bring it hope, and start up some ubuntu one thing (which in turn starts up desktopcouch), how does it know whether or not it should be paired with things on the LAN that are already shared?
[19:52] <aquarius> dobey, it is not paired. DC doesn't do LAN pairing unless you specifically ask it to, with the desktopcouch-pair tool
[19:52] <dobey> aquarius: it doesn't check to see if something's already published, and try to connect to it if so?
[19:52] <aquarius> it doesn't magically set up a mesh network
[19:52] <dobey> boo.
[19:52] <dobey> so why are we using zeroconf? :)
[19:52] <dobey> (maybe we should call it oneconf)
[19:53] <rtgz> aquarius, http://paste.ubuntu.com/355670/
[19:53] <aquarius> how else do you propose that paired machines A and B find one another again?
[19:53] <rtgz> dobey, noconf in my case
[19:53] <aquarius> hahaha. So desktopcouch-pair *and* desktopcouch itself both assume that avahi works.  I have, now, another task on my list: create a bzr lp-new-project command that creates a project.
[19:56] <dobey> (and make the user experience better)
[19:57] <aquarius> dobey, you don't know the host (DHCP changes IPs, foo.local names don't work on Windows), and you don't know the port (DC randomly generates it every time it starts).
[19:57] <aquarius> we can't ship Ubuntu with a CouchDB exposed to the universe listening by default. pitti would have me boiled alive.
[19:57] <dobey> huh?
[19:58] <dobey> i never said anything about having couchdb listening remotely by default
[19:58] <aquarius> so how do you get your magic mesh network started, then?
[19:58] <aquarius> well, OK, our little daemon listening by default, not couch itself
[19:58] <aquarius> but it's still listening by default, which is a no-no.
[19:59] <rtgz> aquarius, ubuntuone-client or desktopcouch - who is going to be the unfortunate owner of the bug?
[19:59] <dobey> there's policy that apps can't find stuff shared by zeroconf from other machines, by default?
[19:59] <jblount> gourgi: That fix is on it's way to edge now, is it ok if I ping you in a few hours (if you are around) to try to get us a erorr number?
[19:59] <aquarius> rtgz, desktopcouch. assign it to cmiller, if you would, which he will give me a fishy look for but he's not here :)
[19:59] <dobey> aquarius: i was saying we should let the user see "Oh, these are being shared on your network, pick one if it's yours, or ignore"
[20:00] <dobey> and then let the user authenticate and pair if one of them is theirs
[20:00] <aquarius> yeah, but if we don't listen by default then there will never be any listening!
[20:00] <dobey> what are you talking about listening?
[20:00] <gourgi> jblount thanks! yes, ping me please , i'll be around and i hope not in bed :)
[20:00] <dobey> avahi is doing the listening, not us
[20:00] <dobey> it's ALRADY doing it
[20:00] <dobey> we're just not doing anything with the info
[20:00] <aquarius> dobey, yeah, but avahi needs to advertise a port that we can connect to
[20:00] <dobey> aquarius: no it doesn't
[20:00] <gourgi> jblount if i don't reply please add a comment on my bug report
[20:01] <aquarius> avahi has remote service activation?
[20:01] <dobey> aquarius: you're conflating SERVING and PAIRING
[20:01] <jblount> gourgi: Will do, it'll take some time, but I'll catch up with you here or there. Thanks again for your persistence :)
[20:01] <dobey> aquarius: i'm only talking about the client side discovery part
[20:01] <aquarius> dobey, so what does avahi advertise, then?
[20:01] <dobey> aquarius: we should obviously only ever publish if the user enables the "[ ] Publish" checkbox
[20:01] <gourgi> jblount no problem , i wish i can help more and solve this
[20:01] <dobey> aquarius: why do you think it's advertising something?
[20:02] <aquarius> dobey, I don't get what shows up in the list of "these machines are being shared on your network"
[20:02] <dobey> aquarius: nothing, if nothing is publhsing stuff on your network
[20:02] <aquarius> right. Then, that's what we currently do.
[20:02] <dobey> *sigh*
[20:03] <dobey> you're conflating SERVING and DISCOVERING, which are separate things :)
[20:03] <dobey> stop it :)
[20:04] <aquarius> I don't get what's supposed to happen once I've DISCOVERed that machine2 is sharing. What do I do then?
[20:04] <dobey> aquarius: well if we discover something, then we let the user pair with it
[20:04] <aquarius> how?
[20:04] <dobey> uhm, how do we pair with it now?
[20:05] <aquarius> by connecting to the advertised port on that machine
[20:05] <aquarius> which means that it's SERVING.
[20:05] <dobey> aquarius: it doesn't mean the lcoal machine is serving
[20:05] <dobey> it means some other machine is serving
[20:06] <dobey> avahi doesn't need to be serving anything to discover other machines which are
[20:06] <aquarius> yeah, I agree. What you're describing is basically what we do, except that we don't give machines the ability to serve unless they need to be, in the same way that you turn off bluetooth discovery after a minute or so
[20:08] <dobey> i was saying we should make it easier to pair with other machines that are already publishing
[20:08] <dobey> you were saying that we should "only ever use avahi if we intend to publish"
[20:08] <dobey> which doesn't make sense to me :)
[20:09] <dobey> aquarius: and https://edge.launchpad.net/groundcontrol might have stuff to create projects... i don't remember if it does or not :)
[20:09] <aquarius> ah. What I meant was: since we don't allow machines to be publishing unless they're already paired, we only need to serve if we already have pairings. If we do not have pairings, we don't need to serve, and thus we don't need avahi.
[20:10] <aquarius> your disagreement is because you want machines to be able to serve even when they're not paired, and I don't.
[20:16] <rtgz> OK, asked ISP to bring the zone down, since this is only used for BitTorrent retracker
[20:17] <dobey> aquarius: and how do you pair two machines, if neither of them are serving?
[20:18] <aquarius> dobey, you run desktopcouch-pair on machine 1, it tells you to run desktopcouch-pair on machine2, they then find one another.
[20:19] <dobey> ugh :)
[20:19] <aquarius> you have to do something on machine2, otherwise I can just pair with your shared DB without your consent and steal all your data.
[20:20] <dobey> i wonder how well couchdb deals with > 2 machines paired together
[20:20] <aquarius> if your answer is: don't turn on publishing if you will ever, ever be on the same LAN as any untrusted computer ever, then, well, fail.
[20:20] <dobey> so if i pair with my machine at home, and then go to a coffee shop, my couchdb can be violated by anyone?
[20:21] <dobey> there's no authentication at all?
[20:21] <aquarius> No, because you don't have the oauth tokens.
[20:21] <aquarius> The pairing process exchanges them.
[20:21] <dobey> but after i pair, and i go to another network, any machine there can run desktopcouch-pair, and it'll see my couch?
[20:22] <dobey> and can try to exchange tokens with it?
[20:27] <rtgz> since there are many ISPs that have bad .local habit I wonder why people did not complain earlier...
[20:27] <dobey> there probably aren't that many?
[20:27] <rtgz> and since there is no info from replication thread that something is not working we give false hope... again
[20:31] <rtgz> Bug #327362
[20:38] <rtgz> Ok, fixed that on the router...
[20:43] <aquarius> dobey, no. we advertise like this: if we are paired with another machine, we advertise couch itself (protected by oauth). If we are currently *in the process of pairing*, we also advertise the pairing daemon.
[20:45] <rtgz> ok, greek letters went through fine
[20:51] <dobey> hmm
[21:11] <dobey> anyone seeing http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/355715/ when running make test in ubuntuone-client trunk?
[21:15] <rtgz> dobey, checking...
[21:28] <rtgz> dobey, you are not alone
[21:34] <dobey> indeed
[21:37] <dobey> hmm
[21:45] <dobey> well at least I already filed the bug for it... in September...
[22:05] <urbanape> jblount: made some good progress today on the branch. I think things will work now, but still want to add some niceties.
[22:13]  * rtgz oO( this is the first time I ran `make test` on ubuntuone-client )


[04:49] <Kenb> Anybody out there?
[04:49] <holstein> yes
[13:15] <dust> what is the button or key which brings the keyboard into handicapped mode?
[13:16] <dust> for example all keys are upper case... no its not the shift or the above shift key and also the led dosnt glow which shows the alternate works
[13:17] <dust> when i clicked in chat client at a channel it didnt select it but deleted it
[13:17] <dust> now after reboot it works as normal again
[13:18] <dust> its at lubuntu 14.10
[20:20] <ianorlin> dust: Are you still having keyboard troubles?
[20:21] <dust> the reboot fixed it
[20:21] <dust> but wasnt the 1st time that it happened
[20:22] <dust> and wont be the last time i think
[20:24] <ianorlin> argh the problem would be hard to use anything in the command line to fix anything with everything all caps
[20:25] <ianorlin> unless you knew how to fix it and did something clever with an alias
[20:26] <dust> i was in a game at full screen... and suddenly it happened... i dont remember after which keys and how long i did press em
[20:27] <dust> but at least its not as bad as: http://www.networkworld.com/article/2906983/security0/massachusetts-police-department-pays-500-cryptolocker-ransom.html
[20:33] <ianorlin> dust might be wise to save anything you are working on before playing that game
[20:34] <dust> imho its not the game but a key combination... sometimes it happens
[20:34] <ianorlin> dust have you tried pressing control alt f1 and switching to tty when this happens and is it all caps in the tty
[20:35] <dust> didnt try
[20:35] <ianorlin> could be X thinks all things are all caps and then running sudo service lightdm restart might make you  be able to get back to normal operation without restarting
[20:35] <ianorlin> but you will be logged out of you x session
[20:35] <wxl> which game is this?
[20:35] <dust> but i had the upper case here in chat programm too... thats the reason i rebooted
[20:36] <dust> this game https://springrts.com/
[20:36] <dust> is also in the repo
[20:39] <wxl> seems like it's all in C unless you're using optional AIs
[20:39] <wxl> and it seems like it does a good job of providing lots of linux help
[20:39] <wxl> i'd be surprised if this didn't work well
[20:39] <wxl> and also if it didn't, if it couldn't be fixed easily
[20:39] <wxl> dust: you're using the upstream version/
[20:40] <wxl> man i like their wiki layout
[20:40] <dust> i use the version which gets downloaded from the lobby
[20:40] <wxl> dust: you tried in #taspring already?
[20:40] <dust> and as lobby i use this http://www.playdeb.net/game/SpringLobby
[20:41] <dust> nope didnt... but asked in the internal dev channel and they had no idea why it happens
[20:42] <dust> and yes the game runs good at linux... also with the open source amd drivers from 14.10
[20:43] <wxl> they should be able to solve it
[20:43] <wxl> for that matter they should be able to replicate it with your same version
[20:45] <dust> the problem is i dont know at which keys it happened... im busy in game and pressing various keys at various length and suddenly it happened... its seldom so nothing which happens usually... i always try a lot of keys after and once i got it back working... not remembering which key it was...
[20:45] <wxl> that's why you need to do some more testing before seeking help
[20:46] <wxl> "i don't know how it happens" is a problem no one can fix
[20:46] <dust> the problem with f11 key and full screen while its ingame also a menu key i solved with super f11... after trying out some stuff
[20:47] <dust> wxl if i would know which key to get into the situation or out of it i wouldnt ask here :)
[20:47] <holstein> i'll use live iso's, and run the live iso's on other hardware to help reduce variables with the specific hardware..
[20:47] <dust> i would just look into the key config and change that key for example or to avoid it or so
[20:48] <wxl> dust: i have no intention of downloading a whole game engine just to see if i can figure something out that you already have the tools to do so
[20:48] <wxl> dust: also holstein gives sage advice
[20:48] <wxl> of course if you can't replicate it, it's hard to test
[20:48] <holstein> its just an easy way to see whats happening on other hardware, when collecting information and troubleshooting.. relatively easy, at least
[20:48] <wxl> and if it's hard to test, it's hard to solve
[20:49] <wxl> and if it's hard to solve, we're not going to be of much assistance
[20:49] <wxl> so back to you, dust: figure out how to replicate it
[20:50] <dust> wxl, is there something like a handicapped setting in lxde/lubuntu? to me it seems as such
[20:51] <wxl> dust: just comment out the whole openbox configuration :)
[20:53] <dust> with handicapped setting i mean something like for ppl with only 1 hand that they set a key modifier and that holds they key while they operate with the mouse
[20:53] <holstein> for disabled users?
[20:53] <dust> yes
[20:54] <holstein> if you implement something like that, it can have an effect
[20:54] <holstein> or, if your hardware implements something like that, in the bios, or system, before the OS
[20:54] <dust> i didnt but a lot of os and desktops have such
[20:56] <dust> thats the reason i ask here as i didnt find soemthing if and where lubuntu / lxde has such
[20:56] <holstein> dust: so, you are running a game? thats not in the repos? does this happen any other time?
[20:57] <holstein> have you tried running the game on a live iso with another UI?
[20:57] <dust> the game is in the repo
[20:57] <holstein> sure, but, you are not using that version, correct?
[20:57] <dust> and i press keys in that way only at that game
[20:57] <holstein> have you tried/can you replicate that issue in the repo version?
[20:58] <dust> it also happens not all the time but sometimes
[20:58] <dust> it is the repo version
[20:58] <holstein> 16:40 < dust> i use the version which gets downloaded from the lobby
[20:59] <holstein> thats why im asking.. regardless, if it were me, i would just be trying as many versions as possible.. and on different iso's and live systems, to track down what is causing what to happen
[21:00] <holstein> you can also ask in #ubuntu since its not a lubuntu or lxde package, and you may find someone else using the software..
[21:05] <dust> i did install the spring version from repo but the lobby is also able to download other game versions
[21:06] <dust> and the actual version now is there since half a year so i think its the same version as in the official repo
[21:31] <wxl> holstein: he doesn't even know how to replicate it, so…
[21:44] <qpqpqp> hello
[21:44] <wxl> word
[21:44] <qpqpqp> a friend of mine have a problem with his lubuntu i installed on his system
[21:45] <qpqpqp> the build in updater hangs in an endless mode
[21:45] <wxl> define build in updater and what version
[21:46] <qpqpqp> it always report the same amount of updates available. It also reports the same amount of updates after an "apt-get update && apt-get upgrade && reboot"
[21:46] <wxl> what version?
[21:47] <qpqpqp> and that simply cant be. how can i help him to fix this problem? Its ubuntu 14.10 final
[21:47] <qpqpqp> i mean lubuntu 14.10
[21:47] <wxl> so what happens with apt-get update && apt-get upgrade??
[21:47] <qpqpqp> wxl: everything works perfectly with apt-get
[21:47] <wxl> so the issue is with lubuntu software center or hwat?
[21:48] <qpqpqp> the updating tool seems to hang somewhere
[21:48] <qpqpqp> i dont know what software reports automaticly on default installation that there are updates. but that is the software i am talking about
[21:49] <wxl> so you mean the update tool just stays open forever/
[21:50] <qpqpqp> wxl: the update tool repots the same file-size of available updates just atfer having them already updated before some minutes with apt-get update and apt-get upgrade
[21:50] <qpqpqp> and this since 2 weeks or more
[21:50] <wxl> i'm having a little trouble following you
[21:50] <wxl> so the update tool finishes without problem?
[21:50] <qpqpqp> okay. i explain again
[21:53] <qpqpqp> default installation of lubuntu 14.10. Used normally and it automaticly repots the updates from time to time and have worked for a while. Before maybe 2 weeks it have report an error the user does not understand and called me. i told him how to use the terminal and he made "apt-get update && apt-get update && reboot". The system got updated fine without any errors.
[21:53] <wxl> what error?
[21:55] <qpqpqp> After that he run again "apt-get update && apt-get upgrade" and nothing got updated. so the system was updated. and now the strange thing: The updater still reports every day the same amount of downloadable updates every time.
[21:55] <wxl> so the updater thinks there are updates to be had?
[21:56] <qpqpqp> also after an "apt-get update && apt-get upgrade" it reports the same amount of updates available. the whole time.
[21:56] <qpqpqp> wxl: yes
[21:56] <wxl> let's verify this again:
[21:56] <wxl> update-manger: some updates
[21:56] <wxl> apt-get: no updates
[21:56] <wxl> right?
[21:56] <qpqpqp> right
[21:57] <wxl> which updates?
[21:58] <qpqpqp> he cant explain because of low understanding about all of that and i was not at his home since the updates came. i just told him over the telephone to update with command line and that works
[21:59] <qpqpqp> i would like to know how to help him when i am next time at his home. with such a problem. i never had something like that.
[21:59] <wxl> it's possible that the software updater is looking for proposed updates
[22:00] <wxl> see if apt-get dist-upgrade fixes things
[22:01] <wxl> beyond that we'd want to look at how you have software sources set up
[22:01] <wxl> also, i should be clear, this is not a freeze or a hang
[22:01] <qpqpqp> wxl: Does dist-upgrade updates also to an new release when it gets out? for example in this case when 15.04 came out, would an dist-upgrade update an 14.10 to 15.04?
[22:01] <wxl> dist-upgrade is not for changing mielstone versions
[22:02] <qpqpqp> so its not "distribution-upgrade"?
[22:02] <wxl> nope, cli milestone upgrades are handled by do-release-upgrade
[22:03] <qpqpqp> i have read somewhere in the net that someone had a problem because of failing updates on his system because his boot partition got full
[22:04] <qpqpqp> he told lubuntu would keep too many old kernels
[22:04] <qpqpqp> if this is the case, how can that get fixed?
[22:04] <qpqpqp> so that it does not come again
[22:04] <qpqpqp> can i setup somewhere how many old kernels should be kept?
[22:05] <wxl> that's a problem with installing updates
[22:05] <wxl> totally different thing
[22:05] <wxl> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Documentation/RemoveOldKernels
[22:05] <wxl> note: BE CAREFUL WITH THAT
[22:06] <qpqpqp> how many old kernels does lubuntu save before starting to remove the oldest ones?
[22:07] <wxl> ubuntu saves them all afaik
[22:07] <qpqpqp> when using just the update-manager
[22:07] <qpqpqp> wxl: ?? but at some point the boot partition would get full
[22:07] <wxl> yep
[22:08] <qpqpqp> an normal user does not know what a boot partition is
[22:08] <Kamilion> yep.
[22:09] <Kamilion> That's why the standard installer won't create a boot partition.
[22:09] <qpqpqp> I read always that lubuntu should be user friendly
[22:09] <Kamilion> one ext4 partition is all you need for modern systems.
[22:09] <Kamilion> So if you decided to create a boot partition, you get to keep both peices if it breaks. :)
[22:09] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: ah, so there is no boot partition on a default installation?
[22:10] <Kamilion> Nope, just a single ext4 volume is the normal default.
[22:10] <Kamilion> if the user chose LVM, it might create a boot partition, I'm not sure offhand, I don't use or trust LVM2
[22:10] <qpqpqp> also no swap partition?
[22:10] <qpqpqp> yes, the user have LVM chosen
[22:11] <Kamilion> then there ya go.
[22:11] <Kamilion> LVM's never been user friendly (for me) nor paticularly stable (for me).
[22:12] <qpqpqp> but its not listed as unstable
[22:12] <Kamilion> Neither is using an EISA network card; but apparently it broke last year and only one person complained.
[22:13] <qpqpqp> so an lvm based installation ALWAYS break after some time because of keeping every kernel and because there exists an tiny boot partition
[22:13] <Kamilion> no, not always.
[22:13] <Kamilion> only if the user's totally anal about updating every time they're prompted.
[22:13] <Kamilion> and various other tasks try to run 'apt-get autoremove' on occasion
[22:13] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: yes, he always updates when he gets an report about updates available
[22:14] <Kamilion> which does tend to purge down to two or three kernels (depends if you've reboot after updating or not)
[22:15] <Kamilion> if you're on .20 and .23 is released and installed and .24 is released and installed, and .25 is released and installed, it will pick .23 to remove, but not .20 (if it's still running)
[22:16] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: Does autoremove been run automaticly every time when update-manager made an update?
[22:16] <Kamilion> in some cases, yes.
[22:16] <Kamilion> it seems it does on my 14.04 and 14.10 systems in some cases
[22:17] <Kamilion> but i also have the unattended-upgrades package installed
[22:17] <qpqpqp> can it be set somewhere how many kernel versions autoremove should keep?
[22:17] <Kamilion> it will keep "the last two, plus the running kernel"
[22:17] <Kamilion> I do not know where it's source of configuration is.
[22:17] <qpqpqp> by default. ok. and how can i set it to keep for example the last one plus the running kernel?
[22:17] <Kamilion> write a script?
[22:18] <Kamilion> I dunno, I'm more of a server admin these days than a desktop tweaker
[22:18] <Kamilion> i'm also just a user. Just like you.
[22:19] <Kamilion> I'm not part of canonical or the lubuntu project (at least, not yet)
[22:19] <qpqpqp> and what does "some time" mean? can that mean it does not remove 10 old kernels, then it removes every time there are 4 old kernels, then it again dont remove 12 kernels, and so on?
[22:20] <Kamilion> i don't know what triggers the behavior. I've only observed it.
[22:21] <Kamilion> looks like it may be part of the unattended-upgrades settings
[22:24] <qpqpqp> i have tested the nightly of 15.04. there are two bugs. when it say that i can remove now the installation media and press enter, pressing enter does not do anything
[22:24] <qpqpqp> the secong thing is an X-error i have to click away at every boot. it starts after that LXDE
[22:27] <qpqpqp> are those errors known?
[22:31] <wxl> qpqpqp: yes, but you can confirm that yourself by searching for them on launchpad
[22:31] <wxl> well the former is
[22:32] <qpqpqp> wxl: did you know an solution for this "boot partition when using LVM & killing systems with boot partition by not removing the old kernels"?
[22:32] <wxl> qpqpqp: huh?
[22:33] <qpqpqp> wxl: does lubuntu remove the old kernels?
[22:33] <qpqpqp> or does it keep them for ever?
[22:33] <wxl> qpqpqp: there is a rare linux that does
[22:34] <qpqpqp> wxl: what did you mean with rare linux that does?
[22:35] <wxl> qpqpqp: this is not necessarily "lubuntu" behavior. it's fairly common in the linux world.
[22:35] <wxl> qpqpqp: here's some more info for you https://askubuntu.com/questions/563483/why-doesnt-apt-get-autoremove-remove-my-old-kernels
[22:41] <qpqpqp> wxl: when /etc/kernel/postinst.d/apt-auto-removal is been edit, how can /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/01autoremove-kernels be automaticly generated again? Does that really happen at for example the next reboot?
[22:42] <wxl> qpqpqp: if you read the whole thing it will save up to 3 if you make sure to autoremove. not sure about the behavior if you don't.
[22:43] <qpqpqp> wxl: does the update-manager run autoremove automaticly?
[22:43] <wxl> qpqpqp: it can, but not necessarily
[22:44] <qpqpqp> wxl: but when the /boot partition get full, that breaks the updater
[22:45] <wxl> qpqpqp: you're worrying about a non-problem
[22:45] <qpqpqp> i think thats critical when its not been done automaticly at every update
[22:45] <qpqpqp> why non-problem?
[22:45] <wxl> qpqpqp: have you filled up boot?
[22:47] <qpqpqp> i have the hard feeling that is the reason of the broken update-manager
[22:47] <wxl> you're describing two unrelated issues
[22:48] <qpqpqp> does the size of the /boot partition always have the same size (for example 100mb /boot, everything else of the HDD normal / partition) or is the size of /boot partition been made based on the size of the drive?
[22:49] <wxl> they're two unrelated issues
[22:49] <wxl> i have never filled up my /boot after years of using ubuntu
[22:49] <wxl> so this is really a non-problem
[22:49] <qpqpqp> wxl: how big is your boot partition?
[22:52] <Kamilion> when I partition my own systems, I normally make a 256MB /boot If I'm using something like a raid array or something that grub can't look inside of directly.
[22:52] <Kamilion> looking through the installer's config at the moment to find it's default for LVM
[22:53] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: yes, that would be perfect to know whats the default and if there is a hard default or the installer just make a big /boot for big drives and small /boot for small droves
[22:55] <Kamilion> as far as I know, the lvm partition map uses a static size for /boot
[22:57] <qpqpqp> in some seconds we will know that for shure. thanks for looking that up
[23:03] <Kamilion> makes a 256MB partition.
[23:03] <Kamilion> enough for about 8 kernel+initrds
[23:03] <Kamilion> (at the initrd sizes I get)
[23:03] <Unit193> ~30M per initrd is average.
[23:04] <Unit193> Just don't use grml-rescueboot. :P
[23:04] <Kamilion> yeah, that was my estimate
[23:04] <Kamilion> 256/30=8.5
[23:05] <Unit193> 4.0M Apr  9 17:59 /boot/initrd.img-3.19.3-u193 :D
[23:06] <Kamilion> nice, you must not need much during boot.
[23:08] <qpqpqp> i have seen 100MB boot partition with an 14.10 installation. It should be always 256MB, right?
[23:09] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: can you show me a link to the place where i can read that it should be always 256mb?
[23:09] <genii> It should be large enough to hold how many previous kernels you want to hold onto
[23:09] <Kamilion> qpqpqp: depends on which installer option you've chosen. 14.10 AMD64 Desktop ISO?
[23:10] <qpqpqp> yes, 14.10 64bit desktop iso
[23:10] <Kamilion> I just ran through a virtual machine install
[23:10] <Kamilion> on virtualbox
[23:10] <Kamilion> it made a 256MB /boot when I selected "use LVM"
[23:11] <qpqpqp> how big was the HDD you made in virtualbox?
[23:12] <Kamilion> 8GB, the default.
[23:12] <Kamilion> so it's not scaling by device size.
[23:13] <wxl> considering 8192 % 256 = 0, it may be
[23:13] <Kamilion> well, i can try again with a sparse 250GB image
[23:13] <wxl> but only if a 16 gig gives you 512 :)
[23:13] <wxl> or if you're really interested, just go hunt through the ubiquity code and figure it out :/
[23:14] <wxl> i believe it's not worth my time to fix when it's not broken :)
[23:15] <Kamilion> mhm
[23:15] <Kamilion> i'll find the exact file it's defined in in a few minutes
[23:15] <Kamilion> vbox is busy right now
[23:16] <Kamilion> also, unattended-upgrades will try to remove kernels
[23:21] <qpqpqp> wxl: in the recent 15.04 nightly i have to change to command line and run "swapoff" by hand after knowing that the username is "lubuntu" and password is NONE. I dont think that that is a bug and not the normal way
[23:21] <Kamilion> argh, so that's what changed
[23:22] <wxl> you think?!
[23:22]  * Kamilion tries the username 'lubuntu' instead of 'ubuntu'
[23:22] <wxl> oh
[23:22] <wxl> derp
[23:22] <wxl> that's old hat :)
[23:22] <Kamilion> uh, last I knew the livecd user was 'ubuntu'.
[23:23] <Unit193> lubuntu for Lubuntu isos.
[23:23] <qpqpqp> wxl: that is the normal-user way of the installation of lubuntu with lvm and cryptsetup?! really?
[23:23] <Unit193> $flavor for $flavor
[23:23] <Kamilion> how odd...
[23:23] <Kamilion> i could have sworn it was 'ubuntu' password 'ubuntu' for 14.04
[23:23] <Kamilion> I must be crazy, lol
[23:24] <Kamilion> or ubuntu-builder is broken/crazy
[23:26] <wxl> qpqpqp: would you like to learn more about testing and how to report bugs?
[23:26] <qpqpqp> wxl: the installation of 15.04 nightly is broken with lvm and cryptsetup.
[23:26] <qpqpqp> it does not boot
[23:29] <wxl> Kamilion: 256 is not speecified anywhere in ubiquity fwiw
[23:29] <qpqpqp> also the buttons in the installation for configuring the installation are missing. For example i just know where to press to set the functionality to on/off. When pressing on an empty space, the circle come (its choosen now).
[23:29] <Kamilion> the outlines are missing, yes.
[23:29] <wxl> qpqpqp: i can tell you where to report this and how you can help with testing
[23:29] <Kamilion> bugged the hell out of me too.
[23:29] <qpqpqp> outlines is the world for that. thanks Kamilion
[23:30] <qpqpqp> wxl: can i just tell you here where the bugs are?
[23:30] <wxl> qpqpqp: i wish i had time to be your secretary
[23:32] <qpqpqp> wxl: my? i report bugs on "our" software. not on "my" software. So i also make "your" software you use a better ;)
[23:33] <wxl> qpqpqp: if you choose not to actually report the bugs in a way that will lead to some sort of solution, chances are no one will hear you screaming :)
[23:34] <Kamilion> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/cnr.png
[23:34] <qpqpqp> you hear me and you are a dev. just tell if you dont like to know about them. then i would not describe them to you
[23:35] <wxl> qpqpqp: i do not have time to write down your issues for you. if you have time to complain about them here, you have time to file bug reports.
[23:35] <Kamilion> Status: closed. Reason: Could not reproduce.
[23:35] <wxl> thanks for repeating the punchline Kamilion :)
[23:36] <Kamilion> Some people are too lazy to click.
[23:36] <Kamilion> Besides, there's no easy way to reference an individual xkcd comic pane.
[23:36] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: thats why i would like to report here on an active talk. If the dev cant reproduce that, i can test on other computer and find an other way to reproduce the error and so on.
[23:39] <Kamilion> Wish I were a developer.
[23:39] <Kamilion> sadly, I'm just a lil' ol lazy scripter
[23:39] <qpqpqp> then when i report the bug and a known dev answers directly to the bug that he also have it on his system, that would be fully clear
[23:39] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: i mean wxl
[23:39] <wxl> don't have to be a developer to write bug reports
[23:39] <wxl> qpqpqp: if you want me to get involved with it, you can always write the bug report and subscribe me to it
[23:40] <wxl> (although there's better ways of dealing with it that involves the whole team rather than one person)
[23:40] <wxl> (which makes a lot more sense)
[23:41] <qpqpqp> wxl: after reported some bugs that was every time fully blocking everything here on two systems and those bugs just get closed because of http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/cnr.png , i like to create the bug together with the dev itself
[23:41] <wxl> qpqpqp: why did they get closed?
[23:41] <wxl> because of a pregnancy test failing?
[23:42] <qpqpqp> no answer, just closed with "cant reproduce". Should i make an youtube video to prove that the bug was there? :(
[23:43] <Kamilion> i asked that same question earlier yesterday! :D
[23:43] <wxl> show me the bug that got closed
[23:43] <Kamilion> re: "should I just make a video?"
[23:43] <qpqpqp> Kamilion: :)
[23:45] <qpqpqp> wxl: i stopped using that software. it was not lubuntu.
[23:45] <wxl> qpqpqp: doesn't sound relevant then
[23:45] <qpqpqp> that was just a short story why i want to work on the bugs together with the devs and dont report them alone any more
[23:46] <Kamilion> i still havn't reported the VM GUI bug yet, because I'm still trying to figure out what circumstances it's reproducable under.
[23:48] <wxl> qpqpqp: you're doing what's called local optimization. making something work for you, despite the process that exists
[23:48] <wxl> qpqpqp: you're also taking some other situation and trying to necessarily apply it to this situation
[23:49] <qpqpqp> wxl: but again about the installation with LVM and cryptsetup. I dont think that changing to an ttyX and turning off swap by hand is what you mean how the installation should look like, right?
[23:49] <Kamilion> anyway, I don't think anybody's getting paid to work on lubuntu. AFAIK it's not a canonical-sponsored project, even though they kindly provide launchpad space for it
[23:49] <Kamilion> I havn't paid much attention to that stuff in a while
[23:50] <wxl> qpqpqp: sounds like it should be reported on the iso tracker
[23:50] <Kamilion> So for the most part; we're all volunteers, subject to real-world jobs outside of our <3 for lubuntu
[23:52] <qpqpqp> wxl: as i remember its also like that on stable 14.10.
[23:52] <qpqpqp> its nice to know that a dev now know about that :)
[23:52] <wxl> right, Kamilion
[23:52] <wxl> like i'm at my regular paying job now
[23:53] <qpqpqp> thanks so far. hopefully we get an stable 15.04. Is the release date the same as on ubuntu?
[23:53] <wxl> so if you want something to happen, i'd suggest doing something better than just complaining here, qpqpqp
[23:54] <qpqpqp> thanks so far. bye
[23:55]  * Kamilion geoips that
[23:55] <Kamilion> No wonder. German fellow.
[23:56] <Kamilion> Cultural differences. *nods sagely*


[08:45] <bombastick> Hi. Will Kubuntu 24 release at the same time as Ubuntu 24, or does it come a few days/weeks later?
[08:48] <bombastick> also, did they fix that ridiculous Konsole behavior where trying to open a new tab requires you to make a 2nd click and select a profile , even if you only have a single profile?
[08:48] <bombastick> That kept me on Kubuntu 20.04 for 2 years
[08:52] <bombastick> boy, I sure hope somebody got fired over that blunder
[12:37] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[15:47] <Konqi> irc://irc.tomsk.net:9996/#rosa
[16:14] <Konqi> https://vk.com/nasa.club
[16:20] <oerheks> Konqi, how is that spam related to kubuntu support? https://vk.com/kubuntu is totally in russian
[16:23] <Konqi> خمي سفخقغ
[16:23] <Konqi> ըգվ բփվգ
[16:24] <Konqi> old story
[18:20] <Konqi> http://explorer.net.ru/share/AirDC++.png