[04:28] <Shesh> Hi
[04:29] <Shesh> I have a theme which is clone of Breeze Light. No matter what value I give to the " rectangle ", the splash screen is still black in my custom splash screen
[04:30] <Shesh> It will nice if anyone can tell me what to change. I already change black to blue for " rectangle " in splash.qml, but even in splash screen preview it displays black
[05:05] <user|48956> Hey! I want to install kubuntu 18.04 LTS (32bit) along-side Windows 7. I don't have a CD/USB available. How can I dualboot without CD/USB?
[05:09] <diogenes_> user|48956, your question is not "How can I dualboot without CD/USB?" but "how do i install without CD/USB".
[05:11] <Shesh> Any reason you prefer 18.04 ? 20.04 is available now
[05:11] <Shesh> You can download the ISO ( of your version choice ) and burn it to a DVD. I don't think it will fit in a CD
[05:12] <Shesh> hello :diogenes
[05:16] <user|48956> 20.04 is not available for 32 bit systems
[05:16] <user|48956> diogenes_ you are right.
[05:21] <Shesh> didn't read properly
[05:22] <Shesh> I cannot think anything but network install
[05:22] <Shesh> I haven't tried myself though.
[06:16] <lordievader> Good morning
[08:39] <davidp> hello
[09:31] <punkgeek> when I install nvidia 304 driver on kubuntu 18, the startx does not start. what shoud i do?
[10:52] <BluesKaj> 'Morning all
[12:08] <punkgeek> when I install nvidia 304 driver on kubuntu 18, the startx does not start. what shoud i do?
[12:36] <BluesKaj> !nomodeset
[12:36] <BluesKaj> punkgeek,^
[15:08] <user|67962> how do i install as bios instead of uefi
[15:10] <BluesKaj> user|67962, use legacy mode in BIOS
 Hi!
 Setting up the Kubuntu right now. How do I change the position of Volume-OSD (now it appears in the center of the screen)? And the most important thing - how to replace the appearance of this OSD to show the volume percentage? … I have already set the volume control with LAlt+MouseWheel.
 @Ridbowt, Volume OSD feedback does not have an "easy to configure" location setting.  However, newer versions of plasma (5.19) have reduced it's size.  And the ability to toggle between value and percent was lost in transition from KDE 4 to KDE 5 if memory serves correctly.
 So, if you have any coding background and really want those features, you could "submit a patch".   I too would like to be able to configure such item, but I do not have enough coding experience to fix and submit a patch.
 @DarinMiller, Thank you for the answer! I'm a little upset (okay, not a little 😂) that it's impossible to turn on the percent display when you adjust the volume. If it were possible to change the theme of this OSD to another theme with percentage bar...
 And no, I'm not a coder...
 Volume percents are tricky as max volumes have "hardware max" that can be overridden. So for simplicity of maintenance, I can see why the devs chose to avoid such feedback.  However, so many things are easily configurable in KDE, one would expect similar flexibility in volume feedback.
 Another approach would be to file a bug/feature request.  Many of these interfaces are under active development and may be quickly addressed if brought to the devs attention.
 Also, if you want to "sponsor" a dev to add the feature, I will assist with the sponsorship and participate in the implementation testing and feedback loop.
 @DarinMiller, Once again, thank you for your detailed answers. But I'm a simple user, never been so deeply involved in development. I just like to customize the system. 😄
 Filing a bug report is very easy for us "mortals" (bugs.kde.org).  Unlike big corporations,  we can actually communicate with devs.  As long as we willing the help them help us, they are very receptive.
 Have you seen Nate's website? https://pointieststick.com/
 The KDE devs are awesome and are open to new ideas.  Granted, their resources are limited, so patience is often required when fixing bugs and requesting new features.
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/wkAV7bHY/file_30547.jpg I love kubuntu and KDE
 @DarinMiller, I don't often read developer blogs in English (as you noticed, my English is not exactly native). Usually I read technical articles: put this code in the terminal, enter the sudo password, press Ctrl+X, and so on. 😄 But yes, honor and praise to the developers! It's a good thing they do!
[18:07] <BluesKaj> @Ridbowt , check your system tray>configure system tray>and set the audio volume icon to your prefernce there, it should use the volume % when the cursor is passed over the icon
[18:09] <BluesKaj> and it can be set if clicked on
 @DarinMiller, I find it very lucky that we can communicate with our favourite desktop Devs and they also ask us our opinion.
 @nash_g5, I fully agree!
 @BluesKaj, I did not realize that hover scroll on the  sys tray volume icon showed the percentage.  Good to know.  (my keyboard has a volume "roller" which I use 99% of the time).
 (Photo, 444x390) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/50Zrbbua/file_30548.jpg Another small detail I like about KDE - it displays battery % of my wireless keyboard
 @BluesKaj> @Ridbowt , check your system tray>configure system tray, yes, I can see % when I hover the mouse cursor over the volume-button
 (Photo, 576x144) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/ec070yc3/file_30549.jpg But look, it's possible!
[18:48] <gore31> hi, do you see any issue with KAddressbook while setting up "address book" with vCard File... ? It does not work at my side: Kubuntu 20.04, minimal install (then installed Kontact by apt) << there is created empty folder with "akonadi_vcard_resource_3" name, thx.
[18:51] <wxl> i don't know why but lately i've been having intermittent issues of kwin going to 100% cpu in 18.04. any clues?
[18:52] <wxl> `kwin --replace` has no effect
[18:54] <wxl> err kwin_x11 actually. curious.
[18:55] <wxl> oh well
 wxl, kwin_x11 is the offending process?
 And killing kwin_x11 without restarting fixed the CPU usage, but goes to 100% on when started?
[19:05] <wxl> @DarinMiller yep yep and nope actually
 kwin_x11 is also a bit "flckery"  and requires a restart on 20.04, but has not  exhibited excess cpu usage (yet).
[19:07] <wxl> sigh i should probably just upgrade blah
 Flickering seems to occur when exiting a vulkan game under wine/proton.  kwin_x11 —replace "fixes" it.
[19:13] <wxl> i am using nomachine to connect remotely and i'm also using virtualbox, so those could be culprits
[19:14] <wxl> interestingly a logout/login cycle seems to have helped
[19:14] <wxl> nomachine was never disconnected, admittedly, and restarting virtualbox never helped
[19:14]  * wxl shrugs
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mN09BgMsW8
[19:46] <ThothCastel> this device should work with linux, shouldn't it?
[19:46] <ThothCastel> https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B016MO90GW/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
[19:46] <ThothCastel> bluetooth 4.0
[19:46] <ThothCastel> it works fine with Win10Pro and also with iphone 6 and 6S
[19:47] <ThothCastel> in my linux laptop it won't connect
[19:47] <ThothCastel> it discovers it but not connect
[19:47] <ThothCastel> :S
[19:49] <ThothCastel> between I am able to pair a Bluetooth mouse and it works fine
 Which version of Kubuntu?  All my BT devices work with several of my Kubuntu desktops/laptops.  But I don't have the Anker speaker.
 Perhaps try this solution? https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=249675
[20:13] <ThothCastel> IrcsomeBot: I am using Debian Buster with  KDE Plasma
[20:13] <ThothCastel> but since kubuntu is based debian, ithink it will be roughly the same
[20:15] <ThothCastel> IrcsomeBot: the link you sent me asks me to type a command in
[20:15] <ThothCastel> pactl load-module module-bluetooth-discover
[20:15] <ThothCastel> I did and
[20:16] <ThothCastel> output is:
[20:16] <ThothCastel> Failure: Module initialization failed
[20:16] <ThothCastel> IrcsomeBot: the problem is also with Iphone connections
[20:17] <ThothCastel> as I understand, it should connect fine
[20:17] <ThothCastel> but the connection fails
[20:17] <ThothCastel> just like with the anker speaker
 Without the actual hw to test myself, I don
[21:03] <ThothCastel> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/zsSUDyEn/
[21:03] <ThothCastel> this mac address is the speaker's address
[21:04] <ThothCastel> so it seems that the linux instance doesn't have the right protocol available.


[01:06] <IdleOne> debfan_: what do you need?
[01:06] <IdleOne> debfan_: in the channel please
[01:06] <debfan_> okay
[01:07] <debfan_> I wanted to ask for permission to use the kubuntu channels
[01:08] <debfan_> I'll follow the rules and you'll have no probs from me
[01:09] <IdleOne> !guidelines
[01:09] <IdleOne> Please read the guidelines and I will remove the bans.
[01:09] <debfan_> I use both kubuntu and ubuntu... I don't use the channels often but I would like the option.... it was foolish on my part
[01:09] <debfan_> okay
[01:10] <IdleOne> you should now be able to join #kubuntu
[01:11] <IdleOne> Have a good day and remember to part this channel.
[01:12] <debfan_> thanks
[01:12] <debfan_> I appreciate that
[01:12] <debfan_> I bookedmarked the guidelines also
[01:17] <IdleOne> debfan_: Please part this channel
[08:34] <bazhang> * visualise<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[08:35] <bazhang> very bad news troll detected
[14:30] <GiGaHuRtZ> May I please be unbanned from #ubuntu+1? I am sorry for being offtopic and I was stoppiung the discussion right when I was  banned
[14:30] <ikonia> not at this time
[14:30] <GiGaHuRtZ> I just felt it was the only safe place to ask that question
[14:30] <GiGaHuRtZ> ikonia: I dont want an answer from you. That is the whole point
[14:30] <ikonia> you where told it wasn't the correct place and kept going
[14:31] <AlanBell> indeed
[14:31] <GiGaHuRtZ> And now that you have answered, you are gonna be backed up 100 percent from your higher ups regardless of right or wrong
[14:31] <GiGaHuRtZ> I was ending the discussion
[14:31] <ikonia> "no" "this is the perfect place" doesn't seem like an end
[14:31] <ikonia> it seems like "this it the right place, I'll keep going"
[14:31] <Tm_T> GiGaHuRtZ: it was wrong place even for ending the discussion
[14:31] <GiGaHuRtZ> I am already there under a different nick anyway, so its not a big deal.  I either want someone from the project to tell him to leave me alone. Or hold some sort of mediation between us where we can get over our issues
[14:32] <GiGaHuRtZ> AlanBell: they wont.
[14:32] <GiGaHuRtZ> they really do no care
[14:32] <GiGaHuRtZ> Byut go ahead and try
[14:32] <ikonia> I love the fact that you keep informing us you are evading
[14:32] <GiGaHuRtZ> That isnt the issue I am here to raise
[14:33] <ikonia> yet you seem so eager to get the ban removed.
[14:33] <GiGaHuRtZ> ikonia: I am doing so because it was recommend by you
[14:33] <GiGaHuRtZ> ikonia: nope, I dont care about the bans
[14:33] <ikonia> that's not correct,
[14:33] <ikonia> ok, then bye
[14:33] <ikonia> if you don't care,
[14:33] <GiGaHuRtZ> I care about you
[14:33] <AlanBell> aww, how lovely
[14:33] <GiGaHuRtZ> Harrassing me in non-ubuntu channels
[14:33] <GiGaHuRtZ> AlanBell: lovely?
[14:33] <GiGaHuRtZ> I am being serious here
[14:34] <GiGaHuRtZ> You guys are allowing ikonia to go after me in non ubuntu channels (thye very places you recommend I iuse rather than official ubuntu places)
[14:34] <AlanBell> and you are repeatedly burning bridges and making more trouble for yourself
[14:34] <GiGaHuRtZ> And he is doing so while representing ubuntu project by wearing a poster fpor them on his back
[14:34] <AlanBell> please go and enjoy the rest of the internet and all the possibilities it presents
[14:35] <AlanBell> if you are not here to discuss your behaviour in relation to a ban then you don't need to be in this channel, so please leave if there is nothing else we can assist with today
[14:35] <GiGaHuRtZ> Burning bridges? there are no bridges. Unless you think this is ted stevens version of the internet
[14:35] <ikonia> just so you know, I don't wear an ubuntu cloak
[14:35] <ikonia> so perhaps worth being aware of that
[14:35] <GiGaHuRtZ> AlanBell: I am here to discuss the behavior of your op
[14:35] <GiGaHuRtZ> ikonia: you still openly and publicly represent the project
[14:36] <ikonia> I don't see how, as it's not in any of my information, but "ok"
[14:36] <GiGaHuRtZ> And you pushing my buttons etc in other channels on purpose, is not right.
[14:36] <Tm_T> GiGaHuRtZ: that discussion will not continue in here, you have given the information to continue from here, so please stop now
[14:36] <GiGaHuRtZ> Tm_Tr: then where should it continue?
[14:36] <GiGaHuRtZ> Because it involves the ubuntu-irc project
[14:36] <GiGaHuRtZ> And so far no one wants to listen to it
[14:37] <Tm_T> GiGaHuRtZ: you have given the information, see appeal process if you want to continue that, otherwise use other places for your needs
[14:37] <GiGaHuRtZ> They act like a typical police force or kangaroo court and when it is an issue that actually involves them directly, they put the blinders on
[14:37] <AlanBell> ok, enough
[14:37] <GiGaHuRtZ> You should be embarassed, since you seem to take your postion as council so serious
[14:38] <GiGaHuRtZ> I am not appealing anything
[14:38] <GiGaHuRtZ> I am asking for someones behavior to be dealt with
[14:40] <IdleOne> This is why we drink
[14:40] <Tm_T> IdleOne: drink water? tea? coffee? kool aid?
[14:40] <IdleOne> all of those, yes
[14:41] <ikonia> shock horror, getting random pm's from him - I'm ignoring it, and returning to looking at the udev issue I was earlier
[14:41] <Tm_T> ikonia: no no, you should be looking at me
[14:41] <ikonia> sorry, a udev rule is more interesting.....
[14:42] <ikonia> which is a pretty depressing situation over personality
[14:42] <Tm_T> awww
[18:38] <bazhang> karab pulled this elsewhere as well
[18:42] <AlanBell> @mark Pewp probably an alias for GiGaHuRtZ
 issue is that I feel 12.04 is not supported anyway.
[18:43] <bazhang> complaining about bios, using uefi


[04:30] <vpa1977> Hi, would it be possible to align built architectures of AOM and libwebm? Currently aom does not migrate from the proposed because it requires i386 build of libwebm. Both declare `architecture any` in the control file, so I assume it is some build setting. Thank you!!!
[07:29] <juliank> @pilot in
[14:01] <enr0n> utkarsh2102: I could use a sponsor for bug 2025279 and/or bug 2025166 if you're interested
[14:01] -ubottu:#ubuntu-devel- Bug 2025279 in triton (Ubuntu) "triton 2.0.0.post1-3 FTBFS" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2025279
[14:01] -ubottu:#ubuntu-devel- Bug 2025166 in rdflib-sqlalchemy (Ubuntu) "rdflib-sqlalchemy 0.5.4-1 FTBFS" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2025166
[14:01] <utkarsh2102> enr0n: gotcha, on it..
[14:02] <utkarsh2102> I mean, I'll take 45ish minutes but will do! :)
[14:02] <enr0n> utkarsh2102: no problem, thanks!
[14:14] <danilogondolfo> May I ask someone to run this for me please? https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=mantic&arch=amd64&package=libwww-mechanize-perl&ppa=danilogondolfo/libwww-mechanize-perl&trigger=libwww-mechanize-perl/2.17-1ubuntu2
[14:22] <enr0n> utkarsh2102: Can you also retry this build please? The log suggests a network issue, and it built fine in my PPA: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/git-credential-oauth/0.8.0-1/+build/26297967
[14:22] <utkarsh2102> danilogondolfo: done!
[14:23] <utkarsh2102> enr0n: done!
[14:23] <enr0n> utkarsh2102: thanks!
[14:23] <danilogondolfo> utkarsh2102, thank you!
[14:44] <juliank> @pilot out
[16:52] <danilogondolfo> Can someone run another test for me please? https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=mantic&arch=amd64&package=libwww-mechanize-perl&ppa=danilogondolfo/libwww-mechanize-perl&trigger=libwww-mechanize-perl/2.17-1ubuntu3
[17:01] <dbungert> danilogondolfo: clicking
[17:02] <danilogondolfo> dbungert, thanks!
[20:53] <mitchdz> Is anyone working on getting mdit-py-plugins migrated? If not I'll be looking into that
[21:00] <enr0n> mitchdz: I don't see an update-excuse bug for it, so I think it would be safe to work on.
[21:02] <bdmurray> Was it discussed in the founations meeting this morning?
[21:08] <mitchdz> I wasn't in that meeting, so not sure
[21:31] <bdmurray> mitchdz: It looks like ginggs will be working on it https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2023/06/29/%23ubuntu-meeting.txt
[21:33] <mitchdz> bdmurray ah thanks for finding that!


[12:02] <elacheche> catbus: Hey!
[12:02] <catbus> elacheche: Hi
[12:02] <elacheche> We need 4 persons from the umb to start the meeting, nzoueidi is here
[12:03] <elacheche> so we should wait for 2 otjers at least
[12:04] <popey> o/
[12:18] <catbus> elacheche: it's 18 minutes past the hour. I can continue to wait if there is some chance enough people from the board will join.
[12:30] <nzoueidi> Hello catbus unfortunately, we didn't met the quorum to vote on your application. Thus, we will vote using the maillist of the Ubuntu Board Membership.
[12:30] <catbus> nzoueidi: OK. What do I need to do?
[12:31] <nzoueidi> Nothing, I will open a thread inculding your application and we will vote using the ML, you will be in the CC, so you will got the vote and if there is any questions.
[12:31] <nzoueidi> Sorry for that and good luck :)
[12:31] <catbus> nzoueidi: ok, thanks!
[12:32] <nzoueidi> You are welcome.
[12:32]  * catbus goes back to bed. it's 4:30am.
[12:32] <catbus> bye
[12:32] <nzoueidi> Oups, good night o/
[14:43] <elacheche>  /Q nzoueidi


[06:43] <iToast> why can't i speak in #ubuntu
[06:43] <iToast> im auth'ed
[06:45] <Unit193> iToast: Try asking in #ubuntu-ops, they handle #ubuntu
[06:45] <iToast> ..
[06:45] <iToast> I just did
[17:07] <tomtiger11> Im banned from #ubuntu for some reason?
[17:08] <tomtiger11> And i dont know why.
[17:08] <Pici> tomtiger11: please use #ubuntu-ops to reconcile that.
[17:08] <tomtiger11> Ok
[22:36] <semitones-tail> are my antics too silly for -offtopic???
[22:49] <Pici> eh?


 YAY
 5.9.5 is out.
 I'll start work on it after school.
 So we have a week before final freeze. Nice.
 I would like to see also http://code.qt.io/cgit/qt/qtbase.git/commit/?id=a35c6a49c938fefb in Bionic, it fixes bug 1761708
 @mitya57, "As long as it's in proposed, we're fine."
[11:59] <lubot3> :P
 @mitya57, Awesome!
 @mitya57, Do you want me to commit that patch, or will you better do it yourself?
 @mitya57, I can take care of it.
 Thanks!
 I have a few more patches I need to do and even a few new packages. :)
 @mitya57, Thanks for pointing it out! :)
[21:12] <lubot3> * tsimonq2 starts the Qt transition in Bileto
 Let's see how far I can get tonight.
[21:12] <tsimonq2> I'll be keeping track of things in https://pad.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-qt-transitions which is in the topic.
[21:19] <tsimonq2> Argh, just barely short. :P
[21:20] <tsimonq2> Better.
[21:20] <tsimonq2> There, now the Bileto ticket link is in the topic.
[21:26] <tsimonq2> So with qtbase, the changes are a bit too complex to do a full "git merge" but I'll go through and cherry-pick anything I think is relevant.
[23:26] <tsimonq2> Initial qtbase upload done to the PPA. Assuming I did everything correctly, I can get in a groove, and the rest will be a walk in the park.


[05:19] <SpamapS> anybody up late charming? :)
[05:27] <ejat> :)
[05:27] <ejat> SpamapS: any plan ?
[05:34] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: You know it
[05:34] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: since you're up
[05:34] <marcoceppi> I've got questions
[05:35] <marcoceppi> relation-set, it works from any hook now right?
[06:06] <ejat> marcoceppi: u at ya room ?
[06:06] <marcoceppi> ejat: no, I'm downstairs
[06:06] <ejat> with ?
[06:06] <ejat> at lobby ?
[06:26] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: yes
[06:26] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: you just have to give it a relation id with -r
[06:26] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: this allows full orchestration now :)
[06:26] <SpamapS> service A changes something, B sees change, reacts by informing C
[06:33] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: working on anything juicy?
[08:17] <_mup_> Bug #995823 was filed: Machines occasionally fail to start the machine agent correctly because of an unhandled ConnectionTimeoutException <juju:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/995823 >
[08:23]  * SpamapS rings the bell
[08:23] <SpamapS> new charm promulgated, mumble-server!
[08:23] <SpamapS> well done Kees Cook. :)
[12:21] <Leseb> hi everyone!
[12:30] <benji> hi Leseb
[12:32] <Leseb> benji: I'm running MAAS + Juju and I have some questions, do u have time to help me a little? pleas
[12:32] <Leseb> +e
[12:33] <benji> Leseb: I will give it a shot, but I don't know anything about MAAS yet.
[12:35] <Leseb> ok, first I just want to be sure about the meaning of "juju bootstrap"
[12:35] <Leseb> It mean setting up a new environment right?
[12:35] <Leseb> does it also mean launching instance?
[12:39] <benji> Leseb: when running in EC2 "juju bootstrap" will start one instance which is used for administrative purposes
[12:39] <benji> then deploying charms will launch more instances
[12:40] <benji> (there are plans to make the control instance shared with other instances so as to reduce the instance count, but that's not ready yet)
[12:41] <Leseb> ok, what do you mean by "for administrative purpose"? the node doesn't run service?
[12:42] <benji> Leseb: exactly
[12:44] <Leseb> ok, thank you that really helpful :)
[12:44] <Leseb> *was
[12:48] <benji> my pleasure
[13:00] <Leseb> benji: so this same command also copy the public ssh keys?
[13:00] <Leseb> in the new created instance?
[13:01] <benji> Leseb: I /think/ temporary ssh keys are generated for instances, you can use the "juju ssh" command to ssh into an instance.
[13:02] <benji> once in you could add your real ssh keys if you so desired
[13:46] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: with -r for relation-set, can i just give it the interface or relation, instead of a unit? like `relation-set -r db foo=bar`
[16:00] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: no, you need a relation id (as given as $JUJU_RELATION_ID in the joined/changed/departed/broken hooks). Thats basically the bucket of information that you want to update. -r db wouldn't have enough context because there might be more than one db relationship
[16:00] <SpamapS> in fact I think relation-id is the wrong term
[16:01] <SpamapS> relations are the things you define, relationships are the things you establish
[16:01] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: so relationship-id is a better descriptor?
[16:01] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: yeah
[16:01] <SpamapS> but thats something we'll have to work out long-term
[16:02] <SpamapS> relation-ids is already part of the vernacular
[16:02] <marcoceppi> sure, np
[16:02] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: I just threw this up too, not sure if it's a good idea for charm-helper-sh
[16:02] <marcoceppi> https://code.launchpad.net/~marcoceppi/charm-tools/unit-parsing/+merge/104929
[16:08] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: +1 , thats nice actually.
[16:09] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: I had some good success moving juju-jitsu to autotools so we can address the path issues btw.
[16:09] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: just wanted to make sure the movement from peer.sh and copyright were okay
[16:09] <marcoceppi> excellent!
[16:09] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: we'll move to autotools and then we can have @scriptdir@ in code and just let 'make install' work that stuff out.
[16:09] <marcoceppi> awesome, I felt dirty hard coding paths ;)
[16:09] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: that does make it hard to test.. the hardcoded path..
[16:10] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: perhaps do . "${CHARMTOOLS_PATH:-/usr/share/charm-tools}/scripts" ?
[16:10] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: just so we can override it
[16:11] <marcoceppi> I was starting to do this weird bash hack to figure out working directory, and decided it would be just best to push the hard code for now
[16:11] <marcoceppi> yeah, I'll go ahead and update that
[16:12] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: . "${CHARM_HELPER_SH_PATH:-/usr/share/charm-helper/sh}/unit.sh"
[16:12] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: yeah that should work. Please make sure there is at least a test that it parses.
[16:12] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: as long as we're touching it.. moar tests!
[16:13] <marcoceppi> test that parses it?
[16:13] <marcoceppi> You mean create a unit test?
[16:13] <marcoceppi> I can do that prior to the merge
[16:14] <SpamapS> Yeah look at the other tests
[16:14] <marcoceppi> seems easy enough
[16:14] <marcoceppi> I'll add that now and push it up
[16:14] <SpamapS> like seriously as long as it does '. ...'
[16:15] <SpamapS> so we don't ship a package that has unparsable shell code :p
[16:18] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: I noticed that unit tests use $HELPERS_HOME, would that be a better env variable than $CHARM_HELPER_SH_PATH ?
[16:19] <marcoceppi> inside peer.sh
[16:21] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: yeah that makes sense
[16:21] <marcoceppi> awesome, just about done
[16:21] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: peer.sh is not always the best thing to copy though :)
[16:21] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: its a bit ambitious :)
[16:22] <marcoceppi> aye it is, I just want to parse unit names/numbers quickly
[16:22] <SpamapS> exactly, that stuff belongs in its own tight lib
[16:24] <marcoceppi> hence unit.sh :)
[16:36] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: something odd is happening with the unit test, it's only running the first test and not carrying on
[16:38] <marcoceppi> dis regard
[16:38] <SpamapS> done
[16:39] <marcoceppi> Unit tests are good indeed
[16:41] <SpamapS> always nice to know it works :)
[16:43] <marcoceppi> Okay, unit test is up, passing, and pushed if you want to take a final look
[16:43]  * SpamapS pulls and plays
[17:59] <SpamapS> FYI, there is a juju related session starting at UDS in Room 201
[17:59] <SpamapS> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20509/servercloud-q-juju-resource-map/
[18:00] <SpamapS> http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/room-201.ogg
[20:44] <ahasenack> I have two environments in my .juju/environments.yaml file, how do I tell juju which one to use without changing "default" in that file all the time?
[20:44] <ahasenack> hm, -e
[20:55] <SpamapS> ahasenack: also $JUJU_ENV
[20:56] <SpamapS> ahasenack: another useful one, $JUJU_REPOSITORY
[21:00] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: is there a way to lower the verbosity of the juju command?
[21:00] <marcoceppi> IE mute the WARNINGS
[21:00] <marcoceppi> wall of warning during a deploy demo is always awkward to explain
[21:00] <marcoceppi> "PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE MAN BEHIND THIS CURTAIN"
[21:08] <SpamapS> juju -l ERROR
[21:09] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: what are the warnings? Bad charms in your repo?
[21:09] <SpamapS> I think we should drop that to INFO actually
[21:09] <SpamapS> having a half-written charm in a repo is a normal, but notable event
[21:09] <SpamapS> not a warning IMO
[21:12] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: http://paste.ubuntu.com/974479/
[21:13] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: add 'ssl-hostname-verification: true' to your environment.
[21:13] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: that *is* a legitimate warning. :)
[21:13] <marcoceppi> I know, i know :)
[21:14] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: we made it a warning, instead of a fail, so you'd have time to make sure all your SSL endpoints verify :)
[21:14] <SpamapS> The 'honolulu' release will make it true by default
[21:24] <koolhead17> SpamapS, sir when can we see you at UDS :)
[21:25] <SpamapS> koolhead17: I arrive in the morning
[21:26] <koolhead17> cool. :)
[21:46] <SpamapS> marcoceppi is about to present charms at UDS http://video.ubuntu.com/live
[21:58] <Tribaal> Hi all
[21:59] <SpamapS> why does everybody want to deploy multiple things to one box.. one box in the cloud == fail
[22:05] <james_w> SpamapS, it's more reliable than multiple boxes :-)
[22:06] <SpamapS> james_w: if by more reliable you mean "fails more reliably", then yes. :)
[22:06] <james_w> lower system failure rate
[22:06] <lifeless> SpamapS: multiple systems multiple their failure rates
[22:06] <lifeless> SpamapS: not everything is single node failure resilient
[22:07] <lifeless> SpamapS: secondly, many things need to exist on the same box to cooperate sanely (e.g. take advantage of local IO, or process local logs) - and making them all tightly bound to another charm doesn't make sense in folks heads.
[22:08] <lifeless> SpamapS: a good question to ask is why folk don't *want* to do it the way the Juju design thinks is best
[22:11] <SpamapS> lifeless: thats exactly what I'm asking. Why are people rejecting the model that juju is selling. I think its the same reason people default to single threaded code... multiple threads, multiple servers, is hard.
[22:13] <james_w> IME it's cost that drives it initially. For a trivial app paying for three machines is far more than is needed to handle the request load
[22:15] <lifeless> SpamapS: thinking of 'threads are for developers that don't understand state machines' ?
[22:16] <lifeless> SpamapS: FWIW I don't think its because there are a wide range of things where coexisting is much easier to reason about (and pay for)
[22:16] <lifeless> SpamapS: where reasoning about includes dealing with network failure modes, avoiding NFS or similar tools
[22:18] <SpamapS> lifeless: could it just be force of habit?
[22:19] <lifeless> SpamapS: I don't think so
[22:19] <lifeless> SpamapS: I've had what, 2 years of Juju exposure, and its still my second most desired feature
[22:20] <lifeless> SpamapS: (the #1 being security)
[22:20] <SpamapS> lifeless: can you explain a deployment that you want to do where m1.small is too big?
[22:21] <SpamapS> or is that the real problem, I think its resource based, but its deeper than that?
[22:21] <lifeless> SpamapS: size isn't the issue for me - james_w brought up size.
[22:21] <lifeless> I acked that paying for things does appear
[22:21] <lifeless> but you could use micro I presume for really really tiny things
[22:22] <SpamapS> Ok, so its a fail rate thing. Hm.
[22:23] <lifeless> fail rate + fail mode
[22:23] <lifeless> if you have a log tailer
[22:23] <lifeless> for instance, trivial thing
[22:23] <lifeless> do you want to do that from a different box ?
[22:23] <lifeless> even a different 'virtual box' using LXC ?
[22:23] <SpamapS> well a log tailer is a subordinate
[22:24] <SpamapS> which goes inside the same container
[22:24] <SpamapS> (which in most cases means inside the same bare VM/machine)
[22:26] <SpamapS> lifeless: subordinates solves the case for anything that you always want deployed at a 1:1 ratio together
[22:26] <lifeless> consider oops-tools UI then
[22:26] <lifeless> let me tell you about oops-tools
[22:27] <lifeless> it has:
[22:27] <lifeless>  - a blob store, which is just a directory on disk where oops files are stored. They get there via an AMQP consumer
[22:28] <lifeless>  - a postgresql DB, which indexes the blob store, it is populated by the same AMQP consumer
[22:28] <lifeless>  - an AMQP consumer, which receives OOPSes in near-realtime, writes them to the blob store and postgresql
[22:28] <lifeless>  - a gc process which removes things from both the postgresql DB and the blob store
[22:29] <lifeless>  - a wsgi web UI that shows things from the blob store + postgresql
[22:29] <lifeless>  - some helper scripts that run out of cron to do reports and the lie
[22:29] <lifeless> like
[22:29] <SpamapS> alright
[22:29] <SpamapS> all sounds good
[22:30] <lifeless> now, thats /nearly/ full distributed
[22:30] <lifeless> if the blob store were e.g. s3
[22:30] <lifeless> but to use juju today, why would I reach for 3 machines vs 1 ?
[22:31] <SpamapS> You would not. And in that case, thats all 1:1
[22:31] <lifeless> perhaps I don't understand subordinates then
[22:31] <lifeless> I wouldn't want every postgresql server to have apache+rabbit+oops-tools-ui etc
[22:32] <SpamapS> right, you just want one, the one that does oops , right?
[22:32] <SpamapS> assuming we convert oops-tools to a subordinate..
[22:32] <SpamapS> juju deploy pgsql
[22:32] <SpamapS> juju deploy oops-tools
[22:32] <lifeless> for this part of the picture yes, but then I also want postgresql for LP :P
[22:32] <SpamapS> juju add-relation oops-tools pgsql
[22:32] <SpamapS> that puts oops-tools on the pgsql service
[22:32] <SpamapS> lifeless: so you want to make *one* server special?
[22:33] <lifeless> SpamapS: I'm not trying to move the goalposts, honestly.
[22:33] <SpamapS> well is the pgsql service one server, or +1 ?
[22:33] <lifeless> one for oops-tools, slony cluster for LP
[22:34] <SpamapS> It sounds like you have an over-powered pgsql server and want to take advantage of that...
[22:34] <lifeless> probably a slony cluster for other ancilliary components of LP once some refactorings get done.
[22:34] <SpamapS> are the pgsql servers for oops and lp the same though?
[22:34] <lifeless> nope
[22:34] <lifeless> different
[22:34] <SpamapS> Ok then yeah, subs solves this nicely *IF* you always want oops-tools to be on the pgsql instance.
[22:34] <SpamapS> thats where I don't like the rigidity of oops-tools
[22:35] <lifeless> don't want to impact production LP behaviour with data-analytics from oops-tools
[22:35] <SpamapS> err
[22:35] <SpamapS> rigidity of usbordinates
[22:36] <lifeless> essentially, LP is headed towards a pattern where each cooperating service is a bundle of (pg, amqp-publishers, amqp-consumers, one or more wsgi apps)
[22:36] <lifeless> and LP as a whole is a group of sunch bundles
[22:36] <lifeless> some bundles will be HA (via slony, haproxy etc), others (like oops-tools) will be best-effort (and the rest of the system handles their absence in some fashion)
[22:37] <lifeless> e.g. gpg key verification - if down, ppa uploads get queued, alerts go off, we bring it back up, but it doesn't have to be up 100% of the time
[22:37] <lifeless> (and bringing it up should be self healable, in fact)
[22:37] <SpamapS> lifeless: we have this problem w/ nova too. Nova can work w/ its own local sqlite, or a remote mysql server.
[22:37] <SpamapS> lifeless: for devs, the local sqlite is the simple case for smoke testing.. but no sane deployment uses it.
[22:38] <lifeless> SpamapS: sure, for clarity though, I'm talking the prod layout; local dev uses test fixtures to bring up transient services
[22:38] <lifeless> like, we want separate pg clusters, to mitigate failures
[22:38] <lifeless> thats a place where we *do* want multiple machines
[22:39] <lifeless> its very unclear to me atm how you run 5 or 6 different slony clusters in one juju environment
[22:39] <SpamapS> lifeless: juju deploy slony slony-1 ; juju deploy slony slony-2   ??
[22:39] <lifeless> the way I'm thinking about juju use today, each environment will be extremely narrowly targeted, and we'll export its public surface and manually inject it into other environments.
[22:40] <SpamapS> lifeless: you can even do this on ec2   juju deploy slony slony-a --constraints ec2-zone=a ; juju deploy slony slony-b --constraints ec2-zone=b
[22:40] <lifeless> https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/user-tutorial.html#deploying-service-units
[22:40] <lifeless> probably wants to mention that optional parameter then ;)
[22:41] <SpamapS> Yeah its a common problem
[22:46] <SpamapS> lifeless: I'm fixing that particular page to be more clear now. Really good suggestion.
[22:46] <lifeless> would that address the subordinates thing?
[22:46] <lifeless> if you do deploy pgsql oops-pg
[22:47] <SpamapS> yes!
[22:47] <lifeless> or would oops-tools still land on all pg server s?
[22:47] <SpamapS> no it would only be on oops-pg
[22:47] <SpamapS> the only bummer about that is that you now always have to deploy oops as a sub
[22:47] <lifeless> presumably because deploy oops-tool does nothing, and add-relation oops-tool oops-pg triggers the actual install
[22:47] <lifeless> ?
[22:47] <SpamapS> I'd really prefer there to be a way to have runtime subordination
[22:48] <lifeless> SpamapS: we have runtime insubordination already :P
[22:48] <SpamapS> lifeless: thats exactly how it works
[22:48] <lifeless> you might like to touch up https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/subordinate-services.html a bit while you are there
[22:48] <lifeless> it reads like an advert for a coming up feature
[22:48] <lifeless> not something that exists
[22:49] <lifeless> it doesn't explain the 1:1 thing, nor the need to name things to get them to be M:N
[22:50] <SpamapS> lifeless: indeed, its basically the original spec. We need to add a subordinate section to the tutorials
[22:51] <lifeless> SpamapS: I hope this is useful feedback
[22:51] <lifeless> I feel as though I've been a bit curmdgeonly
[22:51] <SpamapS> its unbelievably useful
[22:52] <SpamapS> we're all so close to the problem
[22:52] <SpamapS> we don't always see how it relates to the real world
[23:00] <SpamapS> lifeless: https://code.launchpad.net/~clint-fewbar/juju/docs-clarify-service-name/+merge/104994
[23:00] <SpamapS> lifeless: I intend to do more, but that at least will fix the cited page
[23:01] <lifeless> there is a lot in that diff
[23:01] <SpamapS> Yeah I"m not sure why
[23:01] <SpamapS> whoa heh I think I branched the wrong thing :p
[23:02] <lifeless> rather than database-service, perhaps you could say wordpress-db or something
[23:02] <lifeless> I suspect admins will try to name things so they can remember them
[23:02] <SpamapS> lifeless: yeah I am not super happy with that name now that I read it
[23:02] <lifeless> and that will ring truer
[23:02] <SpamapS> ah the merge target is wrong
[23:03] <SpamapS> interesting, I think lp-propose doesn't work right
[23:03] <SpamapS> 'bzr lp-propose lp:juju/docs' merged against the subdir of lp:juju called docs
[23:04] <SpamapS> not the docs series
[23:04] <SpamapS> we really need to delete that dir from lp:juju
[23:05] <SpamapS> lifeless: calling it 'wordpress-db' changes the juxtaposition a bit though.. as now we're suggesting that we couldn't relate non-wp things to it.
[23:05] <lifeless> SpamapS: do you do that in the example ?
[23:05] <lifeless> SpamapS: and wearing your paranoid sysadmin hat - I know you have it somewhere - would you ever do that?
[23:06] <lifeless> one db server, one app
[23:06] <SpamapS> my paranoid sysadmin hat yells at me from its place in my closet..
[23:06] <lifeless> -much- easier to think about query behaviour, caching patterns, db recovery, failover, etc
[23:06] <lifeless> I mean, you are right, yes it changes the slant.
[23:07] <SpamapS> Yes indeed, though I have made multi-tenancy work fine in the past... its a whole different ballgame.
[23:07] <lifeless> and rule #1 of devops is KISS :)
[23:07] <lifeless> this is the same argument juju makes about machines
[23:07] <lifeless> I think the difference is a matter of intent
[23:08] <lifeless> sharing a machine with different components of one usecase -> fair call
[23:08] <lifeless> sharing a machine with components for different usecases -> world of confusion
[23:08] <lifeless> you can s/machine/DB-server/ there with no change in semantics
[23:08] <lifeless> and - ahha moment - this is what I've been trying to get at with juju and multiple machines
[23:09] <lifeless> when you're delivering one use case, it is often (particularly when you aren't gluing full SOA services together, but are homebrewing or whatever), easier to work in a local environment not networked.
[23:10] <SpamapS> alright pushed s/database-service/wordpress-db/g
[23:10] <lifeless> when you're delivering two or more use cases, at that point you definitely want things to not stomp on each other
[23:10] <SpamapS> looks much better
[23:10] <SpamapS> sentences read more clearly
[23:10] <lifeless> so if you come to me and talk about LP + juju, I do want multiple machines, for the things that compete for resources, but I also want single machines, for the bits that really are a single unit (like the librarian with its associated helper code)
[23:11] <SpamapS> lifeless: right, I think a lot of things are well written as a subordinate
[23:11] <lifeless> its not that they won't in future want and need horizontal scaling etc, its a minimum complexity, maximum gain kindof thing
[23:11] <SpamapS> lifeless: btw, we just pushed a new primary service into the charm store, called 'ubuntu' .. so any subordinate can be deployed alone by itself too :)
[23:11] <lifeless> nice hack
[23:12] <SpamapS> its also useful for pre-allocating machines in ec2/maas
[23:24] <gogodoit> hi there, trying to install juju on OSX 10.7 via brew, and getting this error: Error: Failed executing: python setup.py install (juju.rb:31)
[23:24] <gogodoit> (this is with a clean brew installation)
[23:24] <gogodoit> any ideas what I'm missing?
[23:33] <Laney> Hey jujuers. I'm trying to play with juju using canonistack but it appears to want to use the hostname of the servers when doing commands (actually, I only tried 'juju status'). Can I make it use the IP? Or, can you give me a hint to get the dns resolving?
[23:38] <m_3_> Laney: on openstack installs, you need to either configure an ssh proxy into the cloud or assign a public address to the bootstrap node
[23:39] <Laney> m_3_: I can ssh using the IP address, yes
[23:39] <m_3_> Laney: often also need to add patterns into .ssh/config in order for it to use the proxies
[23:39] <Laney> but juju tries to use server-nnnn which I cannot resolve
[23:40] <m_3_> Laney: alias them in .ssh/config
[23:42] <Laney> let me try that
[23:43] <SpamapS> can't you just run juju on the node 0 that gets bootstrapped?
[23:43] <SpamapS> just copy your environments.yaml and ssh key
[23:47] <gogodoit>    sorry, I didn't rtfm, found the osx brew fix here https://github.com/jujutools/homebrew-juju/issues/5
[23:48] <SpamapS> gogodoit: thanks, imbrandon is the author of that, he's at the ubuntu dev summit today and so probably not watching IRC
[23:48] <Laney> SpamapS: yes, but that is more manual than I like
[23:48] <Laney> I got it working with a pattern in .ssh/config
[23:48] <SpamapS> Laney: yeah that usually works
[23:48] <Laney> I think ...
[23:48] <Laney> ERROR SSH forwarding error: nc: getaddrinfo: Name or service not known
[23:48]  * Laney eyes things
[23:57] <Laney> ah, works
[23:57] <Laney> does canonistack have a secure transport?


[22:34] <wingarmac> I've seen an error on this page, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FakeRaidHowto - I would like to know how to help change it. I've found the solution to my dmraid problem at the same time.
[22:36] <wingarmac> This point to a folder echo "dmraid -ay" >> /etc/initramfs-tools/scripts/local-top - It should point to the dmraid file specified in the line before.
[22:36] <wingarmac> in order to make it compatible with chip metadata you should add -f isw - where isw stands for intel Raid metadata
[22:37] <wingarmac> see my post on https://askubuntu.com/questions/1411118/rst-raid-0-ntfs-partitions-not-available-to-mount/1413582#1413582
[22:37] <wingarmac> I'll be glad to help
[22:51] <guiverc> thanks wingarmac, i maybe able to look at it later (can't currently sorry).   Its best though if done by someone who can verify it (I can't for now anyway)
[22:52] <wingarmac> Ok, i understand. I hope it helps, Cheers


[05:44] <Badm4n> hello
[05:44] <Badm4n> any one can tell me about the screensaver timeout command on console ? so it will display on my putty
[06:43] <dabaR> a screensaver on the console? in channel ubuntu-artwork?
[11:35] <lapo> hi
[10:30] <dborg> ah, great


[11:34] <theadmin> Hello everyone. I have a problem, the client refuses to sync anything. It simply shows "File Sync is disconnected", the connect button shortly changes it to "File Sync in progress..." but then it just goes back to how it was.
[11:34] <theadmin> Running on Ubuntu 12.04.
[11:36] <theadmin> I can access the files via the web ui though
[14:46] <ahayzen> Hi, is it just me that is seeing the UbuntuOneFiles sync state it is 'paused' on the desktop or are others seeing this as well? Thanks in advance
[17:56] <Wobbo> Ubuntu One is for a yard!   Even more people today?  "Disconnected"  All computers I have the problem.
[17:56] <Wobbo>   Online it still works.
[17:57] <Wobbo> Any tips?
[17:58] <Wobbo> I pay enough for good quality and design support. This kind of error One should support 7 days 24 hours! This is not acceptable. This has to do with research for my thesis University! Yesterday everything worked! Now all my computers refuse to connection with One. Any tips?
[21:30] <straemer> Hey, ubuntu-one doesn't seem to be working on my computer right now. When I open up the control panel, it says "File Sync is disconnected" at the top right. If I hit the "Connect" button, it displays "Loading...", followed by "File Sync in Progress" for about half a second before going back to saying that it's disconnected. Any idea what might be going on here? I'm running Ubuntu 13.10.
[22:58] <elky> is file sync having difficulties? status says no, but i can't seem to keep a connection long enough for a 33kb file to actually sync
[22:59] <dobey> yes there is an issue with file sync from clients at the moment. uploading via web seemed to work ok for me though.
[23:00] <dobey> developers are aware of the problem and looking into it
[23:00] <elky> ok thanks. mine's something happening on cron. at least i know i didn't break anything my end now though
[23:53] <kikjezrous> this thing alive at all?


[05:38] <Kilos> Morning everyone
[05:39] <svij> morning Kilos
[07:46] <MooDoo> morning
[07:46] <Kilos> hi MooDoo :)
[09:42] <dholbach> nhaines, looks like my forwarded mail to you was rejected
[09:42] <dholbach> I tried again forwarding in a different way... no dice
[09:43] <dholbach> I have no idea if there are other mails you don't get - just thought I'd bring it up
[09:43] <dholbach> it was the mail I sent to ubuntu-community-team list
[19:47] <wxl> !lococouncil meetin' time
[19:47] <wxl> !lococouncil | meetin' time
[19:48]  * genii makes coffee
[19:55] <PabloRubianes> hi wxl
[19:55] <PabloRubianes> do we have agenda?
[19:57] <toddcnb> the meeting will be at #ubuntu-meeting correct?
[19:57] <wxl> PabloRubianes: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/Agenda
[19:58] <wxl> yes toddcnb
[19:58] <toddcnb> thank you
[20:00] <PabloRubianes> wxl: Internal Server Error
[20:00] <wxl> PabloRubianes: tl;dr yes. we have the Re-Verification of azloco
[20:01] <wxl> and also it works fine here
[20:01] <PabloRubianes> wxl we need two more for the meeting
[20:02] <DalekSec> wxl: I'm here!
[20:03] <wxl> DalekSec: well, that's good. :)
[20:32] <elacheche_anis> wxl, I just send that email :)


[09:40] <master5o1> hi
[09:41] <master5o1> I just edited https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LaptopTestingTeam/Dell/DellInspiron1720 page
[09:42] <master5o1> I think my current userid on the wiki is "https://login.launchpad.net/+id/HmCCDrD" ... Does anyone know how to change this?
[13:25] <march> Maybe I've overread something but how can I use http://omnibook.sourceforge.net in *buntu?


 Hey everyone ! I hope you're all enjoying this end of year 😁 … I need your help on my brand new Dell Inspiron I bought few weeks ago. I've been trying to install Kubuntu but facing issue. Even if the drivers of my graphic card are installed, I still cannot change the brightness and the resolution (only one is available in settings). Also, the TouchPad is not recognized and after searching it seems like it is detected as a regular
 Merry Christmas 🎄🎅
[09:09] <ciuiga_> Buon Natale
[10:35] <user|49382> anyone printer loading smart on kubuntu
[15:25] <BluesKaj> Merry Christmas all
 Merry Christmas to you too & all the devs & kubuntians :D
[16:12] <ciuiga> buon natale a tutti
[16:16] <BluesKaj> @murdock86, Merry Christmas
 Hello everyone &Merry Christmas  … How can I choose different languages input for different windows?
[17:20] <Metamorphosis> Hello. Merry Christmas, how can I get rid of Kmail and its related stuff (Akonadi etc) without breaking my system?
[17:54] <rajl> hi
[17:57] <Maik> hi rajl
[17:57] <Maik> !ask | rajl
[17:57] <Maik> offtopic chat takes place in #kubuntu-offtopic :)
 #kubuntu-offtopic
 @kubuntu-offtopic
[20:13] <Timmy> IrcsomeBot: dns over tls does not provide you better performance but it gives you privacy
[20:14] <Timmy> you can use stubby, it's very easy
[20:15] <Timmy> Install it using apt, then set dns address in network manager to <IP_ADDRESS>
[20:15] <Timmy> that's all
[20:15] <Timmy> of course you must restart network manager daemon as well
[20:19] <Timmy> network manager does not provide you dns over tls, you must use stubby as a provider for this purpose. you must tell network manager to send dns requests to <IP_ADDRESS> which is stubby daemon listening to and then stubby will resolve them for you
[20:20] <Timmy> stubby has a configuration file which you don't need to edit and is configured by default but if you need to change address of dns server you can edit /etc/stubby/stubby.yml but don't forget to restart stubby daemon after editing
[20:21] <Timmy> IrcsomeBot: it's more than two decades that people are using plain text dns requests and they're still  alive
[20:23] <Timmy> IrcsomeBot: By using plain text dns requests, ISP can observe what website you are going to visit but nothing else
[20:26] <Timmy> Anyone who can sniff your private network can see your requests, also ISP, and your government and whoever is routing your request in network path. your data is plain text
[20:41] <os-dave> Good evening folk
 Until the paragon commits land in the latest kernel (https://linuxconfig.org/how-to-mount-partition-with-ntfs-file-system-and-read-write-access), only limited ntfs support is available.  You can use a command such as the following for ntfw rw:  mount -o rw,mount,rw -t ntfs /dev/sdc3 /mnt/ntfs/
 replace sdc3 and /mnt/ntfs with your respective configuration.
[20:45] <os-dave> Is anyone in here versed in Kate highlighting?  Or able to direct me to a more appropriate IRC?
 @nelands, Sorry to insist. Anyone have an idea of solution for this ? I am really stuck now and don't really know what to do
 @nelands, Which version of Kubuntu did you install?
 @DarinMiller, 20.04.1
 Possibly a newer kernel will fix the issues you encountered.  Create a live 20.10 usb and see if any of your issues are solved.
 Just boot to the live USB but don't install.
 Okay so just trying Kubutu 20.10 will show me if the brightness and touchpad will be correctly recognized ? I'll try in an hour or two and will tell you if it's okay
 Thanks ! 🙏
 Yes, that's where I would start.
[21:56] <Metamorphosis> Hello. I need someone with a freshly installed Kubuntu 20.04 to do a dpkg --get-selections for me.
[21:57] <Metamorphosis> I would appreciate it
 I don't have a fresh install of 20.04.  I would have to create a KVM session to generate the list.
[22:08] <Metamorphosis> DarinMiller I want to know if Kontact,Kmail and their related stuff were preinstalled or I installed them.
 I just did a Install, and didnt begin the 20.10 one. You want me to send you the result of the command ?


[00:01] <fta> problem is i can't reproduce that: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/seamonkey/+bug/190845/comments/4
[00:01] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 190845 in seamonkey "seamonkey has no Help > Report Problem in Help Menu" [Medium,Confirmed]
[00:02] <fta> seems it's a broken perl-base
[00:28] <fta> Fujitsu, bug 207461
[00:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 207461 in seamonkey "Please sponsor seamonkey 1.1.9" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/207461
[00:29] <fta> i have the debdiff ready to be uploaded
[00:29] <fta> you can already get the tarball
[00:29] <fta> it will not change
[00:29] <Fujitsu> fta: Grabbing it now.
[00:54] <fta> Fujitsu, i'm done
[00:54] <fta> enjoy
[09:23] <asac> Fujitsu: fta: not sure if want to roll a sec update for stable xulrunners. in case we want mike has pushed http://people.debian.org/~glandium/xulrunner_<IP_ADDRESS>~pre080323b-0etch1_amd64.changes
[09:23] <carlos> asac: hi, from where could I fetch all Firefox translations?
[09:24] <asac> carlos: from the ftp server :)
[09:24] <asac> just kidding
[09:24] <asac> let me look
[09:24] <carlos> asac: I'm going to do a full import/export test in our development server as requested by kiko to get all changes deployed with today's rollout
[09:25] <asac> carlos: http://releases.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/3.0b3/linux-i686/xpi/
[09:25] <carlos> asac: that means that I will provide you with a language pack tarball so you can do your part of the testing
[09:25] <carlos> asac: ok, thanks
[09:25] <asac> thats all beta3 translations (for which the en-US.xpis is)
[09:25] <asac> http://releases.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/3.0b4/linux-i686/xpi/
[09:25] <asac> thats beta 4
[09:26] <carlos> what should I upload then?
[09:26] <asac> but i think you need a new en-US.xpi too ... i think we should do that afterwards
[09:26] <asac> carlos: beta 3
[09:26] <carlos> do you have an updated en-US.xpi file?
[09:26] <carlos> ok
[09:29] <asac> i have to produce them first.
[10:23] <tester> test
[10:23] <tester> good
[10:29] <carlos> asac: https://translations.staging.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/firefox-3.0/
[10:29] <carlos> asac: I'm importing everything there
[10:29] <asac> and xulrunner-1.9 ?
[10:29] <carlos> once I finish with the import process, I will be ready to produce the export
[10:30] <carlos> asac: is xulrunner in its own source package?
[10:30] <carlos> isn't it part of firefox-3.0 source package?
[10:30] <asac> did you wipe your brain while on holiday ?
[10:30] <asac> yes it is
[10:30] <carlos> I forgot it ;-)
[10:30] <asac> we have two en-US.xpi ... but only one translation for all
[10:30] <asac> so the idea is that you import the translation twice
[10:30] <carlos> I know that ;-)
[10:30] <asac> ah
[10:30] <asac> ok
[10:31] <carlos> but I thought both come from the same firefox-3.0 source package
[10:31] <asac> yes ... the reason why we have two en-US.xpi is that we have two source packages
[10:31] <asac> no
[10:31] <carlos> ok
[10:31] <carlos> let me move xulrunner then...
[10:31] <asac> if that was the case we wouldn't need to the split
[10:31] <asac> one source package will always provide exactly one en-US.xpi
[10:31] <asac> carlos: the source package is xulrunner-1.9
[10:32] <carlos> https://translations.staging.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/xulrunner-1.9/
[10:32] <asac> (xulrunner is outdated ... as is firefox)
[10:32] <asac> right
[10:32] <asac> carlos: has the import finished?
[10:32] <asac> why are there so many untranslated strings? accesskeys?
[10:32] <carlos> the templates, yes, the translations, are still being imported
[10:32] <asac> ah ok
[10:33] <asac> was just confused by the count of German untranslated
[10:33] <carlos> it takes a while given the size of the files and given that is the first time we import them in that database
[10:33] <asac> thats ok
[10:34] <carlos> asac: hmm German is already imported for both templates
[10:34] <carlos> 216 and 230 strings are untranslated
[10:34] <asac> let me filter the untranslated
[10:34]  * asac using that webpage for the first time
[10:35] <asac> en-US.xpi/en-US.jar!/locale/browser/appstrings.properties:2(malformedURI)
[10:35] <asac> is not translated
[10:35] <asac> lets see
[10:35] <asac> (the suggestion is good though)
[10:35] <asac> carlos: why are there good suggestions for everything?
[10:35] <asac> Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at %S.
[10:35] <carlos> yeah, I just saw that problem
[10:35] <asac> Firefox kann keine Verbindung zu dem Server unter %S aufbauen.
[10:36] <asac> its a bug?
[10:36] <carlos> seems like we have  a bug
[10:36] <carlos> yes
[10:36] <asac> i mean those most likely come from the de.xpi
[10:36] <asac> good
[10:36] <asac> well not so good, but good that we notice
[10:36] <carlos> however, I guess is not a huge one, given that it still appears as a suggestion...
[10:36] <asac> looks like its all .properties
[10:36] <carlos> not huge == not really an stopper to start using Launchpad
[10:37] <carlos> we will prepare a fix to get it cherry picked as soon as possible
[10:37] <asac> well ... how will this be in the export?
[10:37] <asac> (we could manually approve them of course i guess)
[10:38] <asac> but maybe suggestions are already in the .po ?
[10:38] <asac> approving 200+ strings for 20 translations is pretty much work i guess :)
[10:38] <carlos> no, that will be missed in the export
[10:38] <asac> unless you have a script ;)
[10:38] <asac> can we improve them efficiently somehow?
[10:38] <asac> aeh approve i mean
[10:39] <asac> so we can use the exports for real?
[10:39] <carlos> asac: using Ubuntu translators work ? :-P
[10:39] <asac> ha ;)
[10:39] <carlos> let me talk with Jeroen about it
[10:39] <asac> yeah
[10:40] <asac> all properties missing might cause some UI pain :)
[10:41] <carlos> asac: the 'beauty' of language packs is that translators would fix it after release...
[10:42] <carlos> but yeah, I agree that is better if everything is workin since day 0
[10:42] <asac> well ... fixing is good, but fixing half of the UI is not so good .)
[10:43] <asac> anyway ... a way to autoapprove the initial imports would be good
[10:48] <asac> carlos: ok i talked to pitti. translations _after_ release have the same policies as package updates after the release.
[10:48] <asac> (in theory) ... so lets better get all translations at least approved ;)
[10:49] <carlos> what do you mean by the same policies?
[10:50] <asac> specifially this mean: you cannot change translations (except for typos). you can only add new translations ... and no new languages
[10:50] <asac> carlos: SRU procedure: first upload to -proposed ... get testing/review ... then roll it to -updates
[10:50] <asac> carlos: but indeed, updates are rolled once a month that way
[10:51] <asac> so its somehow different
[10:51] <carlos> asac: well, is not 'change translations' but 'strings to translate'
[10:51] <carlos> you can change translations, that's the whole idea behind language packs
[10:52] <asac> carlos: our policy is to not change the UI after release ... changing translations (except for typos) would change UI and thus should not qualify.
[10:52] <asac> pitti said that there has been no precedence yet of radical translation changes (i think you say strings for that)
[10:52] <asac> anyway ... doesn't matter in our case
[10:53] <carlos> asac: If that's true... we are not following that procedure in any released version, at least we are not forcing that
[10:53] <carlos> asac: and even in that case, is not translation changes, but actually fix untranslated strings
[10:53] <carlos> so it would still be considered as 'fixes'
[10:55] <asac_> carlos: sorry ... reconnect
[10:55] <asac_> 11:53 < carlos> asac: If that's true... we are not following that procedure in any released version, at least we are
[10:55] <asac_>                 not forcing that
[10:55] <asac_> 11:53 < asac> carlos: yes, he said there was no need to enforce that yet, because he didn't encounter any radical
[10:55] <asac_>               changes so far
[10:55] <asac_> 11:53 < asac> just for your interest.
[10:55] <asac_> 11:54 < asac> carlos: just let me know how i can get all suggestions approved efficiently so we get a fully translated
[10:55] <asac_>               firefox for release
[10:55] <carlos>  asac: and even in that case, is not translation changes, but actually fix untranslated strings
[10:55] <carlos>  so it would still be considered as 'fixes'
[10:55] <asac_> carlos: yes ... fixing untranslated strings is ok
[10:56] <asac_> but in our case it would be half of the UI
[10:56] <asac_> we should definitly find a way to get them translated before a release
[10:56] <carlos> I'm talking with jtv, maybe we could just fix it easily
[10:56] <asac_> ok thanks
[10:56] <carlos> asac_: anyway, we have a bit less than a month before release, right?
[10:56] <carlos> a proper patch should be landed next week
[10:56] <carlos> so it's not even an issue for release
[10:57] <asac_> i am fine with everything: 1. automated script that approves initial imports, 2. call for approving to translation owners
[10:57] <carlos> after that, I will do a full import again and everything should be 'fixed'
[10:57] <asac_> carlos: ok
[10:57] <asac_> don't know anything about the release procedures for launchpad
[10:57] <asac_> if its just a week, then its certainly fine :)
[10:58] <carlos> well, next launchpad release is post Hardy release
[10:58] <asac_> carlos: i initially understood that there was no way to fix this for hardy release
[10:58] <asac_> thanks for clarifying
[10:58] <carlos> however, we are able to do cherry picks for critical bugs
[10:58] <asac_> ok great.
[10:58] <carlos> and this qualifies for it
[10:58] <asac_> my concerns are suddently gone :-D
[10:58] <asac_> we can definitly start with that bug
[10:59] <carlos> asac_: there are two options, go ahead and open Firefox in Launchpad tomorrow and wait for a fix next week
[10:59] <asac_> (and maybe manually approve a few .properties so we can test if the .properties creation actually works
[10:59] <carlos> or wait until the fix landed
[10:59] <asac_> carlos: if thats the choice, go ahead
[10:59] <carlos> to publish firefox
[10:59] <carlos> asac_: I will need to confirm it with kiko, but I'm all for that first option
[10:59] <asac_> we could manually approve one language so we can see if the distro side works well
[10:59] <asac_> carlos: thanks.
[10:59] <asac_> let me know!
[11:01] <carlos> ok
[11:08] <asac_> carlos: ok, we have one more thing to clarify: auto import.
[11:08] <carlos> jtv: did a script to do the upload automatically
[11:09] <asac_> where does that script the en-US.xpi to be?
[11:09] <asac_> does it need any parameters (like source package name + path to xpi)?
[11:09] <carlos> so I guess is just a matter of using a cron job for it or give it to you so you can execute it manually when you want to
[11:09] <asac_> carlos: pitti wants to integrate that during package build
[11:09] <asac_> like what we do for the other translations
[11:09] <asac_> if we have a script thats fine. just need to know which parameters that script takes
[11:10] <carlos> asac_: for the en-US.xpi, you don't need to do anything, we will get it from the package build automatically
[11:10] <carlos> asac: he just need to extract the xpi files like he does with .po and .pot files
[11:10] <asac> carlos: i doubt that. at least i have to put it somewhere
[11:10] <carlos> asac: leave it in the source tree
[11:10] <carlos> after the build, there is a script that all packages execute
[11:10] <carlos> to extract .po and .pot files
[11:11] <carlos> it should be extended by pitti to take care of xpi files too
[11:12] <carlos> asac: it doesn't matter the path where you leave it, but don't change it or we will need to approve it manually with each upload
[11:12] <asac> carlos: ok, but pitti doesn't need to use the upload script?
[11:12] <asac> (e.g. you can change that?)
[11:13] <carlos> no, I misunderstood you
[11:13] <carlos> the script will be used to upload translations
[11:13] <carlos> which are not in your packages
[11:13] <carlos> and thus, not part of the build process
[11:13] <asac> carlos: of course its not in the build process. its about the binary package mangler that - from what i understood - does the uploads
[11:14] <asac> or is that in the build process for you as well?
[11:14] <asac> carlos: anyway, i think once this is done, pitti should probably talk directly to you
[11:14] <carlos> asac: sorry, I call it part of the build process :-)
[11:15] <carlos> asac: sure, however, as I said, just tell him to extract .xpi files just like he extracts .po and .pot files
[11:15] <carlos> and that's all the work he needs to do
[11:15] <asac> carlos: yes. did that
[11:15] <asac> he appears to have understood :)
[11:15] <carlos> :-)
[11:16]  * asac still completely blind on how all this works ... e.g. how is the source package name found?
[11:18] <asac> carlos: ok. i think all is clear now
[11:18] <asac> now go back to work :)
[11:19] <carlos> asac: that's done from the buildd hook that provides us the files after the package build
[11:19] <carlos> it knows the package that is being built
[11:19] <carlos> so we get it from there
[11:20] <asac> ah ok.
[11:21] <asac> carlos: one more thing: there is not yet any other language than german on https://translations.staging.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/firefox-3.0 ... is the import still running?
[11:22] <carlos> yeah, the import is slow and I need to execute the script several times on that server (on production is a cron script)
[11:23] <asac> ok
[11:23] <carlos> asac: oh, also, you are looking to the partial view
[11:23] <asac> hmm
[11:23] <asac> ah ... i hit "view translations & all languages"
[11:23] <carlos> click on 'View Template & All languages...' link
[11:23] <asac> now i have more
[11:23] <carlos> :-)
[11:24] <asac> what qualifies en_GB and de to appear on that other page?
[11:24] <jt1> carlos: you can edit SECONDS_TO_RUN in the cron script so it doesn't stop so often.
[11:24] <jt1> asac: your preferred languages settings IIRC
[11:24] <asac> carlos: can we see why finnish has 2 more untranslated strings than the others (217 vs 215) ?
[11:25] <asac> would be good to verify that its really a missing translation and not another bug
[11:25] <asac> jt1: ok.
[11:26] <jt1> carlos: did you see any "Duplicate message ID" output while running the script?  Those now only happen if the duplication is in the same file, but if there's a bug there, the messages would fail to be imported.
[11:28] <carlos> jtv: no, there is no such output
[11:28] <carlos> asac: I think I found the problem anyway, so it should be somehow easy to fix...
[11:28] <jtv> carlos: tell us!  tell us!
[11:28] <asac> which problem?
[11:29] <asac> the ones that they are not approved? or the 217-215 (finnish vs. german) missing translations=
[11:32] <carlos> asac: btw, I 'lied' to you, the strings that are not translated now in launchpad but that were translated in xpi file will appear in the exported .po file
[11:32] <carlos> but with the #~ prefix
[11:33] <asac> carlos: you have one example?
[11:35] <carlos> no, but once everything is imported, I will be able to show you it
[11:36] <asac> ok. its not that important. i currently assume that we get those exported properly for final
[11:36] <asac> for now we can test with a english-LANGUAGE mix :)
[11:36] <asac> at least we get testing of the fallback mechanism that way :)
[11:38] <carlos> ;-)
[12:09]  * asac hospital
[12:09] <asac> visit
[15:48] <saivann> asac : Hi, you asked me to recall you this : bug 194970
[15:48] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 194970 in firefox-3.0 "[Hardy] Incorrect .desktop files" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/194970
[15:48] <saivann> asac : my branches are ready to merge with the main branches, and all linked to the bug report
[15:50] <asac> saivann: if you don't see an ack from me in 1h ping me again. i am into something right now which might wipe all my memory :)
[15:51] <saivann> asac : Ok I will wait for your running process to terminate then :)
[15:57] <asac> carlos: can we get the newly imported translations today?
[15:57] <jtv> asac: unfortunately we can't fix those contexts.
[15:57] <asac> jtv: huh?
[15:57] <carlos> asac: yes, once all imports are done (still running....)
[15:57] <jtv> asac: the translation data is just structured too differently from the template.  :-(
[15:57] <asac> ah ok
[15:57] <carlos> asac: but as jtv tried to point, without the strings fixed
[15:58] <asac> jtv: so this means that we have to manually approve the suggestions?
[15:58] <jtv> asac: right
[15:58] <asac> i jsut find it interesting that its only .properties files
[15:58] <asac> that reveal this bug
[15:59] <jtv> asac: is it!?  I'm sure I saw dtd files as well.
[15:59] <asac> jtv: i only saw .dtd for branding
[15:59] <asac> which might be indeed missing
[15:59] <asac> however, if there are .dtds then they are really rare ... which is why i thought this is a real bug
[16:00] <asac> jtv: can you show me an example?
[16:00] <asac> (for which the context is too different)
[16:01] <carlos> asac: the problem comes with locales
[16:01] <carlos> like German that has the same IDs twice in the .xpi file
[16:01] <jtv> asac: the problem in most cases seems to be that the template doesn't have the clashing message identifiers that the translation does.
[16:01] <carlos> which mixed with the fact that we don't read yet manifest files... it produces us to see conflicts when there shouldn't be any
[16:01] <jtv> asac: Because we have two "half templates" but complete translations.
[16:02] <asac> Located in en-US.xpi/en-US.jar!/locale/browser/appstrings.properties:9(redirectLoop)
[16:02] <asac> thats a translation with only suggestion
[16:02] <asac> its in de.xpi/de.jar!/locale/browser/appstrings.properties
[16:02] <asac> ok i understand about the clashing a bit
[16:03] <asac> jtv: can we somehow automize the approval of initial imports?
[16:03] <jtv> asac: the German will have some clashes that you've basically removed from the template by splitting it into two.
[16:03] <asac> ok. i see.
[16:03] <asac> so we might even see the wrong translation as suggestions?
[16:04] <jtv> asac: yes, though the right ones should also be included.
[16:04] <jtv> asac: which is exactly why it's hard to automate this.
[16:04] <asac> jtv: let me think.
[16:05] <asac> jtv: can't you use the current context algorithm if the dtd and .properties are not in a jar
[16:05] <asac> and otherwise use at least the full path in the jar as context?
[16:05] <asac> that should give us enough context for most
[16:05] <asac> if not all
[16:06] <jtv> asac: problem is, the translators have rearranged files.  Do we know that this won't give us any bad matches?
[16:07] <asac> jtv: i would say no ... but i have to chew a bit about that.
[16:08] <jtv> asac: you may have to look inside a lot of them to be sure.
[16:08] <asac> jtv: i only need to look at the chrome.manifest files
[16:09] <asac> jtv: but we have to live with this this week anyway.
[16:09] <asac> so we have a few more days to figure this i guess
[16:09] <jtv> asac: guess so.  And we're on a sprint next week.
[16:11] <fta2> [reed], why rc2 ?
[16:39] <fta2> [reed], b5~rc1 freezes and goes 100% cpu when i tell it to remember a password, reproduced 3 times out of 3 tries
[16:40] <asac> sounds like a nss issue
[17:20] <fta2> damn, i can't commit to the ubufox branch
[17:21] <fta2> it's in ~ubuntu-core-dev
[17:35] <[reed]> fta2: rc2 because of some plugin code
[17:35] <[reed]> that regressed
[17:42] <fta2> ok, I'll have a look later
[18:13] <asac> saivann: you should remember to close the LP bugs in changelog ;)
[18:14] <saivann> asac : Oh right.. sorry I did think about it, but forgot :), I can update my branch if you want
[18:17] <saivann> asac : Do you want me to update the branches, it would take few minutes
[18:26] <saivann> asac : I'm ready to push for firefox and thunderbird if you want it
[18:37] <asac> saivann: the tbird branch is not based on the right branch
[18:38] <asac> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/thunderbird/thunderbird.dev
[18:38] <asac> thats the right one
[18:38] <asac> saivann: you did base it on the gutsy branch :)
[18:39] <saivann> asac : Oh...
[18:40] <saivann> asac : Ah right.. Sorry, that's very bad, I can fix this in some minutes if you want
[18:42] <asac> would be good
[18:42] <asac> i could do it manually, but would prefer to not :)
[18:47] <saivann> asac : https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~saivann/thunderbird/fix_desktop_file
[18:52] <saivann> asac : also updated firefox branch https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~saivann/firefox/fix_desktop_file
[19:09] <asac> saivann: updated?
[19:09] <asac> i already merged that ;)
[19:09] <asac> (firefox)
[19:09] <asac> let me try tbird
[19:11] <asac> ah LP :)
[19:13] <saivann> asac : I don't see any branch for firefox 2.0 that has firefox.desktop fixed, firefox 3.0 should be already merged
[19:13] <asac> no its not yet pushed :)
[19:13] <asac> but i merged all locally already
[19:14] <asac> anyway ... will see if i can get it
[19:15] <saivann> asac : Ok that's fine, thanks :) And sorry for my mistakes
[19:17] <saivann> asac : In case you also have time for this in the next days, I did not get translations from the mongolian translator for sunbird and lightning-extension. He answers my mail but I believe that his job won't be ready for Hardy
[19:17] <saivann> bug 174290
[19:17] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 174290 in sunbird-locales "[hardy] new upstream release 0.7" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174290
[19:18] <asac> saivann: well ... the mistakes were more of cosmetic nature :)
[19:18] <asac> except maybe for the tbird branch ... but the branch naming is not yet really consistant
[19:19] <asac> so i see the fault on my side :)
[19:19] <asac> saivann: don
[19:19] <asac> t we jave 0.7?
[19:19] <asac> man
[19:19] <asac> don't we have 0.7 :(
[19:19] <asac> typing is hard
[19:19] <asac> ?
[19:19] <asac> at least the merge was done on top of 0.7 here
[19:20] <saivann> asac : No, only 0.5 for mk. However, all other locales are ready for 0.7
[19:22] <saivann> asac : The links to download my packages are on the bug report, it's exactly the same packages that you reviewed few months ago
[19:22] <asac> saivann: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightning-sunbird/0.7+nobinonly-0ubuntu2
[19:23] <asac> oh you say just the locales are not there yet?
[19:24] <saivann> asac : Yes, I only speak about the locales packages
[19:27] <saivann> asac : I just updated the links on the bug report because the lightning-extension-locales was dead. I don't know about your opinion, but I think that we should upload them to repositories and update them if we get locales for mongolian
[19:28] <asac> saivann: mongolian is missing?
[19:29] <asac> *sigh* hopefully this will all be history in hardy+1 :)
[19:29] <asac> when we get our locales from launchpad
[19:29] <asac> for all moz apps
[19:29] <saivann> asac : Yes, that's what I was speaking about, mongolian locale only exist in 0.5. You asked me few months ago to contact the translator to ask him to provide translations, the translator did not did the job yet.
[19:29] <asac> did he reply?
[19:30] <asac> saivann: http://releases.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/calendar/sunbird/releases/0.7/langpacks/mk.xpi
[19:30] <asac> that exists
[19:31] <saivann> asac : Yes, I cc you but you maybe missed the mail. He said that he would work on this but he did not specify a deadline, there is a lot of chances that the locales are not ready for Hardy
[19:31] <saivann> asac : Since when?? It did not exist recently!
[19:31] <asac> well ... right now it exists :) ... better grab it before its gone ;)
[19:31] <saivann> asac : I agree :D
[19:32] <asac> cool
[19:32] <asac> let me know when thats integrated
[19:32] <asac> and sorry for the delay on that
[19:32] <asac> after all we will have a translated sunbird in final release.
[19:32] <asac> ;)
[19:33] <saivann> asac : wait, I'm wrong, the iso code is not mk, but mn
[19:33] <saivann> mn is the missing one
[19:33] <asac> oh
[19:33] <saivann> asac : Anyway it would not make sense, the mk locales is on the server since october :)
[19:34] <saivann> asac : Hehe, sorry to break the party :P
[19:34] <asac> you never know ;)
[19:34] <asac> ok fine. do you currently ship no package or an empty package?
[19:34] <asac> for mn?
[19:34] <saivann> asac : Currently no package is build from the source package
[19:35] <saivann> asac : I suggest to upload and keep in touch with the mn translator. If he gives some translation, I will take care to include them very fast so we can update the package
[19:35] <saivann> asac : Curretly no *mn* package is built from the source package
[19:38] <asac> saivann: you should build an empty one
[19:38] <asac> look at the bottom of the mozilla-firefox-locales-all
[19:39] <asac> package control file to get examples
[19:40] <saivann> asac : No problem, I can fix this. Is there any other things that should be fixed/added to my packages? The last time you reviewed them, you said that you would probably upload them as they are now
[19:40] <asac> yeah. then there is probably no other issue :)
[19:40] <asac> whats the bug id?
[19:41] <asac> have it
[19:41] <saivann> bug 174290
[19:41] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 174290 in sunbird-locales "[hardy] new upstream release 0.7" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174290
[19:42] <saivann> asac : ( I know, the LP: field is missing here too ) :)
[19:42] <saivann> asac : I will add it now
[19:42] <asac> cool
[19:43] <asac> please create an empty package for non existing locales
[19:43] <asac> thats all for now :)
[19:43] <saivann> asac : I will do it in the next hours and keep you updated about this
[19:43] <asac> (given that the resulting translations work of course)
[19:43] <asac> great
[19:43] <saivann> asac : Of course, all tested multiple times
[19:44] <saivann> asac : I did not get answers from the translator mailing list about ubufox translation but I got multiples additionnal translations, all in my ubufox branch.
[19:48] <asac> good
[19:49] <saivann> asac : This will not be like rosetta, but still the translations looks good, and some translator reviewed their own translations and asked me to fix additionnal strings, so that sounds good
[19:49] <asac> good
[20:59] <saivann> asac : sunbird-locales and lightning-extension-locales package are now fixed, bug 174290
[20:59] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 174290 in sunbird-locales "[hardy] new upstream release 0.7" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174290
[20:59] <saivann> asac : http://upload.leservicetechnique.com/bugs/lightning-extension-locales_0.7.tar.gz   http://upload.leservicetechnique.com/bugs/sunbird-locales_0.7.tar.gz
[21:00] <saivann> asac : (empty debian binary package for mn locales are built and changelog have the (LP: ) field.)
[21:01]  * saivann out for ~60 minutes
[21:18] <asac> saivann: the LP bug is still not named in sunbird-locales package
[21:19] <saivann> asac : Are you sure? "  * new upstream release 0.7 (LP: #174290)"
[21:22] <asac> thats in lightning yes
[21:22] <asac> btw, you need to use an ubuntu address in Maintainer: field if you use 0ubuntuX version
[21:22] <saivann> asac : Also sunbird, I just looked and I re-uploaded the same package to my server
[21:22] <asac> otherwise dpkg-source fails
[21:22] <asac> either use MOTU or Mozillateam
[21:22] <asac> you can set yourself as XSBC-Original-Maintainer if you want
[21:23] <asac> i can fix the maintainer field if you want
[21:24] <Jazzva> evening... :)
[21:24] <asac> ill use mozillateam in maintainer for now
[21:24] <asac> Jazzva: hi
[21:24] <Jazzva> Hello, asac :)...
[21:24] <asac> saivann: please ack that its ok for oyu
[21:24] <saivann> asac : You're right, I didn't know this when I built the package for the first time
[21:24] <asac> thats ok
[21:24] <saivann> asac : Thank you
[21:24] <asac> i can change it
[21:24] <saivann> Ok, you'll take care of the missing LP field also?
[21:27] <saivann> asac : Now that I packaged simdock with cdbs and all brother printer drivers package, I believe that I will be able to do better packages next time :) (If they are still needed in Intrepid of course)
[21:28] <saivann> asac : Concerning mozilla projects and rosetta, is there something I can do to help the process of switching all locales to rosetta?
[21:31] <asac> saivann: no ... not in hardy
[21:31] <asac> we will do it for xulrunner and firefox in hardy
[21:31] <saivann> asac : For Intrepid, I know that Hardy BetaFreeze is already passed
[21:31] <asac> the others will follow in intrepid
[21:32] <asac> basically it will only require one to add one include to the rules file
[21:32] <asac> the rest should happen automagically
[21:32] <saivann> asac : Ok, well if you think that I might be useful in that project, don't hesitate to ask
[21:32] <asac> but as you know there will be issues when the time has come :)
[21:32] <asac> sure
[21:32] <asac> ill come back
[21:32] <saivann> asac : Of course :)
[21:34] <saivann> asac : Well thank you for this rush on all projects/bugs I had with the mozillateam.
[21:37]  * saivann is out (suppertime, humm)
[21:44] <asac> saivann: ok uploaded
[21:59] <Jazzva> what was the policy on xpi packaging? Should we unzip them, and then package the source?
[22:00] <asac> if there is no upstream source, yes.
[22:00] <asac> Jazzva: but its important that the .xpi has a license file in top level
[22:01] <asac> otherwise we need to ask author to add one (unless every single file has license header)
[22:02] <Jazzva> Hmm... the license is available in the old package, so I just downloaded the new version... I don't think that the license has changed. But there is no license file in both versions...
[22:06] <Jazzva> I sound a bit confusing :)... So, the license is available in debian/copyright in the old package. The old source doesn't contain the license in top level directory... The new one doesn't contain it, too...
[22:08]  * saivann is still away
[22:08] <saivann> asac : Thank you
[22:34] <Jazzva> asac, fta: I think there's a little typo in XPI.TEMPLATE. In debian/changelog "(Closes: #...)" is used to close the bug, but isn't that debian's notation? Aren't we supposed to use "(LP: #...)"?


[02:46]  * bschaefer smspillaz hey, are you around?
[02:46] <bschaefer> opps
[02:46]  * bschaefer ments msg haha
[09:16] <smspillaz> jrr: might be worth giving my branch a try later today
[09:17]  * smspillaz just got regional updates working again for unity
[09:18] <sil2100> \o/
[09:45] <smspillaz> sil2100: these numbers are basically meaningless, but I've seen a 1000fps boost in glxgears
[09:46] <sil2100> Well, that makes sense, now it finally doesn't redraw everything as it goes meaninglessly again
[09:57] <davidcalle> sil2100, hi
[09:57] <larsu> sil2100, hi, sorry for not getting back to you on Friday - I was crazy busy
[09:58] <larsu> I did try the package with my indicator-appmenu patch, and it works as expected
[09:58] <larsu> can you tell me again how you're able to still reproduce this?
[09:58] <larsu> I used this package: lp:ubuntu/raring-proposed/indicator-appmenu
[09:59] <sil2100> larsu: hello!
[10:00] <sil2100> larsu: hm, ok, let me try building this specific package - since I was testing on a locally compiled version of  indicator-appmenu  from the staging PPA
[10:00] <davidcalle> sil2100, nevermind, found my answer :)
[10:00] <sil2100> larsu: also, it seems to fail on the autopilot testing machines for raring, when using the latest package (i.e. 12.10.4daily12.12.14-0ubuntu1)
[10:01] <sil2100> davidcalle: hello! Good :)
[10:02] <larsu> sil2100, hm, that's exactly the one I built... which staging ppa do you mean? I can try the package from there as well
[10:04] <sil2100> larsu: https://launchpad.net/~unity-team/+archive/staging
[10:04] <sil2100> larsu: which is strange, since I remember it working before too!
[10:05] <sil2100> larsu: btw. would you mind trying to run an autopilot tests with your package?
[10:05] <sil2100> And tell me if it works or not?
[10:06] <sil2100> larsu: could you add the ppa:autopilot/ppa, install python-autopilot from it, then, bzr branch lp:unity; cd unity/tests/autopilot
[10:06] <larsu> sil2100, sure
[10:06] <sil2100> larsu: and finally: autopilot run unity.tests.test_panel.PanelHoverTests.test_hovering_indicators_open_menus
[10:07] <sil2100> And check if the test fails or not - since if with your package the cursor suddenly goes to some strange position while hovering over the menus, it means there have to still be some hidden indicator entries
[10:07] <sil2100> larsu: thanks!
[10:10] <larsu> sil2100, that ppa is not enough, apt-get complains about missing deps:  python-junitxml, python-testscenarios, python-testtools, python-xlib
[10:12] <sil2100> larsu: hm, those should be in main I think?
[10:12] <sil2100> In main and universe
[10:13] <larsu> sil2100, ah sorry, I messed up earlier when force-install indicator-appmenu-tools. Nevermind :)
[10:13] <sil2100> ;)
[10:17] <larsu> sil2100, haha watching those tests is awesome!
[10:17] <larsu> sil2100, it fails though
[10:23] <larsu> sil2100, so gedit is opened and the cursor moves to open the File, Edit, View, Search, Tools menus, and then it suddenly goes to 0,0
[10:24] <larsu> then it times out
[10:24] <larsu> and considers the test failed
[10:24] <larsu> is this the same failure you were talking about=
[10:24] <larsu> ?
[10:25] <sil2100> larsu: yes :|
[10:25] <sil2100> larsu: when the mouse moves to 0,0, it means that it encountered an empty indicator in-between menu entries, which has some broken x,y coordinates
[10:26] <sil2100> When you edit unity/tests/test_panel.py, go to test_hovering_indicators_open_menus and simply paste 'print entries' after the list of entries is fetched, you'll get a print-out of the indicators u-p-s is getting through DBus
[10:27] <sil2100> And there are still those strange empty entries inbetween those proper menu indicators
[10:28] <larsu> sil2100, ah, that's a different issue from the one I solved, though
[10:29] <larsu> I mean, the reason those empty indicators are there is different
[10:33] <sil2100> larsu: any idea why? Since when I dbus-monitor, I also see them being sent through DBus
[10:34] <sil2100> By one of the libappmenu.so's ;p
[10:34] <larsu> sil2100, I'm trying to find out right now, but it looks like gedit itself creates those empty menu items
[10:34] <larsu> and indicator-appmenu doesn't filter those
[10:34] <larsu> my patch only makes sure that indicator-appmenu doesn't create empty items by itself
[10:35] <sil2100> larsu: charmap also suffers from this problem
[10:35] <sil2100> Ah, ok ;)
[10:36] <larsu> sil2100, really, I don't see empty items in charmap
[10:36] <sil2100> larsu: since I remember browsing through the sources of gedit and gucharmap and didn't notice any of them adding such empty indicator/menu entries, but maybe those are not planned
[10:37] <larsu> sil2100, how can I test gucharmap with autopilot?
[10:38] <sil2100> larsu: uh oh! Wait!
[10:38] <sil2100> larsu: you're right!
[10:38] <sil2100> charmap is no longer affected!
[10:38] <larsu> sil2100, and gedit is affected because it inserts a separator itself. WTF?
[10:38] <sil2100> So maybe indeed gedit is doing something strange - but this means that your previous patch worked fine
[10:38] <larsu> why would it do thaT?
[10:39] <larsu> sil2100, so I could filter out GtkSeparatorMenuItems, but that still wouldn't fix all the cases because apps could still insert normal menu items with a "" label
[10:39] <sil2100> larsu: anyway, if you would liek to see it in action for charmap, simply edit the test_panel.py I mentioned earlier, search for test_hovering_indicators_open_menus and simply replace "Text Editor" with "Character Map"
[10:39] <larsu> I think the safest bet is to handle this case in autopilot
[10:40] <sil2100> larsu: true, I think I will have to simply fix the autopilot tests to filter those out
[10:40] <sil2100> Yes
[10:40] <larsu> sil2100, okay, thanks. This won't be a problem anymore once all applications are using GMenuModel
[10:40] <sil2100> Big thanks! At least now I know why it worked before, since it seems when I was testing your patch, I was using charmap instead of gedit for testing
[10:40] <larsu> (which might take some time :P)
[10:40]  * sil2100 feels a bit stupid now ;)
[10:41] <larsu> sil2100, well, I honestly wouldn't have thought that any app puts separators in its menu bar...
[10:42] <larsu> sil2100, I could watch those tests all day :)
[10:42] <sil2100> larsu: just in case you know - is there a way in which the seperators are 'differenciated' from normal menu entries in DBus?
[10:42] <sil2100> hehe
[10:43] <larsu> sil2100, sadly not. I'd filter out everything that has a label with an empty string
[10:43] <larsu> sil2100, and no icon!
[10:43] <larsu> (otherwise you'll miss the indicators)
[10:43] <sil2100> Indeed! Ok, thanks again, going to fix all those things now
[10:44] <larsu> sil2100, very cool. Thanks for all the great testing work you guys are doing!
[10:52] <MCR1> @all: Hi :)
[10:56] <MCR1> Top job. Since ages I was suffering from bug 1047232. I do not know which commit exactly fixed it, but it is fixed since I updated Unity today. Great \o/
[10:58] <MCR1> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1047232 -> this is a video showing the bug, which is now fixed, in action: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1047232/+attachment/3297777/+files/launcherhide.mp4
[10:59] <MCR1> Also all click-through and minimize/restore bugs, which were recently introduced in lp:compiz (r3513) are fixed. Great !
[11:00] <MCR1> Place plugin also worx perfectly.
[11:00] <sil2100> \o/
[11:04] <MCR1> sil2100: Many people (including myself) mostly come here to complain, but this time I am here to honor you and thank you 4 your top work. Keep it up that way ;)
[15:04] <gatis> hello, i have this problem, when i use xcb_grab_keyboard on my client i still get Unity "run command" (on Alt) and  seach window (on Windows key)
[15:05] <gatis> can somebody tell me more, how those parts are implemented in the unity?
[15:06] <gatis> if i do xcb_grab_keyboard on the screen's root window then i dont get all those unity extras..
[17:04] <fginther> Trevinho, bschaefer, Can you please take a look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/1447957/? It looks like recent bamf merge broke unity
[17:05]  * bschaefer swore he compiled unity with that branch MP
[17:05] <bschaefer> fginther, I can take a look
[17:06] <fginther> bschaefer, thanks. found your name on the review :-)
[17:06] <bschaefer> fginther, yup :)
[17:06] <bschaefer> though it should have just been cleaning up dead code....maybe it wasn't completely dead
[17:17] <bschaefer> fginther, hmm it looks like that function is used in unity ApplicationLauncherIcon....which im not sure if its needed... Trevinho would know more about this
[17:17] <bschaefer> fginther, soo im thinking if unity needs it, then we might have to revert that change in bamf
[17:18] <bschaefer> and re propose the correct fixes in bamf
[17:24] <fginther> bschaefer, I'm glad to help if I can.
[17:24] <fginther> bschaefer, thanks for investigating so quickly
[17:24] <bschaefer> fginther, np, I just got on :)
[17:24] <bschaefer> fginther, mostly im hoping for Trevinho to magically appear
[17:25] <bschaefer> but he stayed up late
[17:26] <bschaefer> fginther, let me prepare a branch to revert that change
[17:27] <bschaefer> fginther, wait...it didn't merge
[17:27] <bschaefer> fginther, sorry, I thought it was in trunk bamf merged, and unity was failing to build :)
[17:28] <bschaefer> fginther, just let Trevinho fix his branch now :)
[17:28] <fginther> bschaefer, my mistake. I thought the branch had merged also
[17:28] <bschaefer> no worries :), jenkins caught it
[17:28] <bschaefer> \o/
[17:29] <Trevinho> bschaefer, fginther: sorry I was busy
[17:29] <bschaefer> Trevinho, your branch needs a fixing!
[17:29] <Trevinho> bschaefer: Oh, that functionality was added recently... I don't think that we need it in unity
[17:29] <Trevinho> bschaefer: do we need indicators in unity?
[17:29] <bschaefer> well its used in ApplicationLauncherIcon
[17:30] <bschaefer> Trevinho, that is what I wanted to ask you :)
[17:30] <fginther> bschaefer, Trevinho, I'll be afk for a bit. if you need me, just leave a message
[17:30] <bschaefer> fginther, will do, thanks for pointing that out!
[17:30] <bschaefer> Trevinho, I just built my unity with it removed and am about to test it
[17:31] <Trevinho> bschaefer: I think that functionality is in libunity now
[17:31] <Trevinho> bschaefer: I'll fix unity and all will be fine again
[17:32] <bschaefer> Trevinho, o really? That would be nice, it just looked like ApplicationLauncherIcon was using that list for that array ...
[17:33] <Trevinho> bschaefer: yeah... But that was to control the dynamic quicklist that are handled by libunity nowadays
[17:33] <bschaefer> Trevinho, sweet, I haven't touched those things in a while :)
[17:33] <bschaefer> ping me when you have a branch that needs a review, then we can get your bamf branch merged!
[17:34] <Trevinho> bschaefer: ok
[17:34] <Trevinho> bschaefer: sorry for breackage, I acually tought that the code in unity was removed
[17:35] <bschaefer> Trevinho, no worries, and I thought I tested unity with that bamf branch!
[17:35] <bschaefer> Trevinho, jenkins caught it :)
[17:35] <Trevinho> bschaefer: yeah, nice thing
[18:23] <Trevinho> bschaefer: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/remove-bamf-indicators/+merge/140519 I'm also looking to remove something from indicator-application
[18:24] <bschaefer> Trevinho, cool
[18:24]  * bschaefer looks at branch
[18:24] <bschaefer> Trevinho, also your working full time now?
[18:25] <Trevinho> bschaefer: no, still part-time... But I've changed contract
[18:25] <bschaefer> Trevinho, o, cool, I just saw you in that email
[18:33] <bschaefer> Trevinho, well it seems andyrock beat me to the review
[18:33] <bschaefer> but it compiled here :)
[18:33] <andyrock> ;)


[10:22] <emamdouh> hi, i'd like to know where user-admin tool write its configuration
[10:22] <emamdouh> i checked /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf but it seems not the right file
[10:24] <emamdouh> i wanna check exactly the effect of checking autologin from users-admin tool
[22:08] <HazRPG> anyone here use xbmc? Or at least know how to get arabic subs to work, or even arabic in the menus?