[00:01] <ompaul> !alien
[00:01] <ubotu> RPM is the RedHat Package Management system. Ubuntu uses !APT, not RPM. RPM packages are not supported (the package "alien" can allow installing them, but it's quite dangerous)
[00:02]  * ompaul thinks about telling nrrd we won't be adding that
[00:03] <ompaul> >nrrd< I don't see that factoid being altered any time soon
[00:23] <jdong> Do we have a guideline that links from factoids should point towards wiki.ubuntu.com or other Ubuntu sources?
[00:24] <LjL> jdong: no
[00:25] <LjL> jdong: however if there *is* something on the wiki, i'd say it's to be much preferred over third-party links...
[00:26] <LjL> at the end of the day, we don't need a guideline for that, because it's up to us to decide anyway :)
[00:26] <LjL> and i don't see how giving a non-ubuntu link for something that's recommanded against could help anyone so
[00:29] <Pricey> Well all I've got to say is its a good thing jdong doesn't have editors access.
[00:30] <LjL> %addeditor jdong
[00:30] <Pricey> :)
[00:35]  * jdong looks at scrollback in fear
[00:35] <jdong> that's not a real bot command, is it?
[00:35] <LjL> jdong: nah it isn't. are you scared about getting bot access?
[00:36] <jdong> LjL: very :)
[00:36] <LjL> ubotu: addeditor jdong
[00:36] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about addeditor jdong - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[00:36] <LjL> @addeditor jdong
[00:36] <LjL> seems like i don't know the correct syntax anyway :)
[00:36] <LjL> ah wait, i do, you're just not even registered to the bot
[00:37] <jdong> haha :)
[01:07] <anthony> Lordy I'm slow without my scripts...
[01:08]  * LjL refrain from making unwarranted comments
[01:09]  * anthony is killing time in class - using IrssiX on a Mac
[01:13] <mneptok> anthony: why not just use irssi?
[01:15] <anthony> mneptok: Because I found the prebuilt irssix first.  I just installed the GNU coreutils a few minutes ago though, so I could.  Still, my op script is at home.
[01:15] <nalioth> anthony: psssh
[01:15] <nalioth> no need for gnu coreutils
[01:15] <nalioth> irssi compiles just fine with Xcode
[01:16] <jdong> nalioth: how do you live with BSD utils? :)
[01:16] <anthony> nalioth: Well, okay - I actually installed the coreutils for shred, but to do so had to first install Xcode, which I also did today.
[01:16] <jdong> macports/fink coreutils from ground up is the way to go :)
[01:17] <LjL> jdong: he enjoys a less bloated life?
[01:17] <mneptok> anthony: MacPorts is what you want.
[01:17] <jdong> LjL: he wouldn't be using OS X
[01:17] <jdong> LjL: any OS where the instant messaging client is 60MB....
[01:17] <jdong> anyway I'm digressing :)
[01:18] <LjL> jdong: well it's faster than Ubuntu most of the time, if nothing else.
[01:19] <anthony> jdong: I don't use OS X by choice - state-owned laptop.  I have Ubuntu, Fedora, and Solaris is VMware though (which, btw, isn't very stable)
[01:19] <jdong> LjL: it's faster when everything is migrated into cache
[01:19] <jdong> LjL: on first startup, priming all my default apps is a nightmare
[01:20] <jdong> anthony: I'm just joking man, I am the proud owner of a macbook, on which I am typing right now :)
[01:20]  * mneptok whispers "HFS+"
[01:20] <mneptok> *shudder*
[01:20] <anthony> *in
[01:29] <ubotu> In #ubuntu, spudratic0 said: ubotu what is the main chat room to talk to other ubuntu users
[01:31] <mneptok> !offtopic > spudratic0
[01:37] <anthony> mneptok: attempting to install macports...
[01:38]  * nalioth dons the crash clothing and buckles his 5-point safety harness
[01:39] <anthony> I went through the installer doohickey, and it looked successful, but I still don't have the 'port' command
[01:40] <jdong> anthony: /opt/local/bin/port perhaps?
[01:41] <nalioth> did you add /opt/* to your almighty $PATH, anthony ?
[01:41] <anthony> jdong: Yeah - wonder why it didn't update the path
[01:41] <anthony> nalioth: No - I thought it would be done automatically
[01:41] <jdong> anthony: well probably it thinks it shouldn't touch ~/.bashrc or .profile or whatever
[01:43] <anthony> sigh - someone remind me how to add to the path
[01:43] <anthony> my syntax is being misremembered
[01:43] <nalioth> anthony: simple.  look at the $PATH you've got now and monkey-see-monkey-do
[01:44] <anthony> nalioth: I know how it should end up - it's variable assignment I'm forgetting
[01:44] <LjL> export var=val
[01:44]  * anthony needs to get some sleep
[01:44] <anthony> ty
[01:52] <ubotu> In #ubuntu, jjt009 said: ubotu:how is it going?
[01:52] <nalioth> ubotu tell jjt009 about yourself
[02:03] <mneptok> "I was born in a small village in Wallachia, where my father worked herding Jews ..."
[02:03] <mneptok> (This Borat moment brought to you by caffiene and a daunting Inbox)
[02:03] <jdong> haha
[03:17] <ubotu> In #ubuntu-offtopic, recon said: !no, SYN is <reply> ACK
[07:09] <Seveas> !no SYN is <reply> FIN... FIN!!!... GO AWAY!!! FIN.
[07:09] <ubotu> I'll remember that Seveas
[07:09] <Tm_T> fin <3
[07:10] <Madpilot> ???
[07:15]  * tonyyarusso is equally confused Madpilot
[07:16] <Myrtti> SYN Tm_T
[07:21] <Myrtti> I just added to my in house CV the entry on having been TV SMS chat moderator.  Ill mention it to the boss as soon as he gets in
[07:30] <Tm_T> heh
[07:30] <jussi01> Tm_T: its in Oulu ;)
[07:31] <Tm_T> no, I'm not moving, sowwy
[07:32] <jussi01> Myrtti: I have the feeling that its not an _urgent we needed you like yesterday_ position, but a "when the right person comes.../someone in the company has a friend who has the right quals" position
[08:17] <jussi01> hmmm, maybe we want to drop the !kudos factoid?
[08:18] <jussi01> !kudos
[08:18] <ubotu> http://kudos.berlios.de is an extremely extensive and comprehensive guide for Kubuntu *Breezy*. Note some things will be different on dapper.
[08:18] <Myrtti> ehehhheh
[08:21] <Tm_T> jussi01: sure?
[08:21] <jussi01> Tm_T: I dont have bot rights...
[08:21] <Tm_T> %login
[08:22] <Tm_T> ubotu: forget kudos
[08:22] <ubotu> In #ubuntu-ops, Tm_T said: ubotu: forget kudos
[08:22] <Tm_T> bah
[08:22] <Tm_T> ubotu: forget kudos
[08:22] <ubotu> I'll forget that, Tm_T
[08:22] <jussi01> :)
[08:22] <jussi01> thanks
[08:34] <ubotu> In #ubuntuforums-beginners, speeddemon8803 said: Ubotu, caring is sharing
[08:35] <speeddemon8803> cancel that factoid please :)
[08:35] <Tm_T> speeddemon8803: no need to cancel, it doesn't go anywhere ;)
[08:36] <speeddemon8803> you saw the caring is sharing though?
[08:36] <Myrtti> yup
[08:36] <speeddemon8803> ok
[08:36] <jussi01> speeddemon8803: yeah, but we need to manually add it if we want :)
[08:36] <Tm_T> and we do not
[08:36] <Myrtti> but you don't have the rights to adding factoids to the bots so it wasn't added
[08:37] <speeddemon8803> i knew that, was just saying dont get out the whoopin stick ;)
[08:37] <Myrtti> /me puts her pink fluffy pen of poking away
[08:37] <Myrtti> damn.
[08:37] <speeddemon8803> ive been dealing with ubotu for a while now, i think i know its commands and stuff by now.
[08:38] <speeddemon8803> Well, ciao!
[08:39]  * speeddemon8803 sees im using this room a lot here lately :(
[08:53] <ubotu> dgjones called the ops in #ubuntu (butuh_teman)
[09:38] <GPenguin> popey: and then you seriously wonder why people react in a rude way to such violent attitude?
[09:38] <popey> GPenguin is I believe a certain patrick frank
[09:39] <popey> I kickbanned him from #ubuntu-uk
[09:39] <GPenguin> popey: you make up wild guesses about my real name and take violent action based on wild assumptions while there was no need to be massive
[09:39] <GPenguin> popey: thats not just unhealthy attitude, thats abusive
[09:39] <popey> raise it with the irc ops if you have an issue with me
[09:40] <GPenguin> popey: and the irony is that you claim Patrick Frank was rude because of such abuse
[09:40] <tonyyarusso> popey: loco stuff is handled in #ubuntu-irc now - this channel is just for #ubuntu, #kubuntu, et al and their offtopics
[09:40] <popey> oh ok
[09:40] <GPenguin> popey: why would i be interested in further escalation? i follow your invite to this channel to talk to you after you banned me without any reason
[09:40] <popey> GPenguin: take it to #ubuntu-irc :)
[09:40]  * Seeker` fully supports popey if he says that GPenguin should be banned
[09:40] <popey> sorry tonyyarusso
[09:40] <GPenguin> Seeker`: very helpful to be tribal
[09:41] <tonyyarusso> popey: 'tis okay - I'm still getting used to it myself ;)
[09:54] <Tm_T> GPenguin: any further help we can provide for you here?
[10:10] <ubotu> In ubotu, erUSUL said: openwith is <reply>If you want to change the default app to open a specific file type right click on a file choose properties and go to the Open With tab.
[10:25] <ubotu> In #ubuntu-offtopic, Nrrd said: !tea is Four sugars please!
[10:25] <Seeker`> wtf?
[10:26] <Seeker`> why was mc44 klined?
[10:28] <Hobbsee> good question
[10:28] <Seeker`> any way of finding out?
[10:30] <jussi01> could it have been that kline script again?
[10:30] <Seeker`> kline script?
[10:32] <jussi01> well that was quick :)
[10:32] <Seeker`> mc44: ?
[10:32] <Seeker`> mc44: s/ /what happened/
[10:32] <mc44> dunno. yay for random k-lines
[10:33] <Seeker`> hmm, random k-lines are bad
[10:34] <mc44> looks like the shell server I was running on got k-lined
[10:34] <Seeker`> ewww
[10:34] <Seeker`> thats bad
[10:34] <jussi01> ouch
[10:49] <Daviey> 10:25:24 -!- Bassetts [i=bassetts@unaffiliated/bassetts] has quit [K-lined]
[10:49] <Daviey> I assumed it was an unfunny /quit msg @)
[10:51] <Seeker`> is it possible to just k-line nick@host? or does it wipe out the whole *@host?
[11:19] <tonyyarusso> Seeker`: I've only ever heard of it by host, but it might be possible.  Usually if you earn a kline you're changing nicks to get around bans already.
[11:33] <elektronik123> hello
[11:34] <TheSheep> hi elektronik123, how can we help you today? :)
[11:35] <elektronik123> i can`t join on #ubuntu-pl
[11:35] <TheSheep> elektronik123: I think that local channels are now handled on #ubuntu-irc
[11:35] <elektronik123> i am blocked
[11:37] <elektronik123> what i can do ?
[11:38] <jussi01> elektronik123: ask in #ubuntu-irc
[11:40] <elektronik123> ok
[11:57] <elektronik123> on 3ubuntu-irc is nothing
[12:02] <TheSheep> elektronik123: I can see you are there, and I can see quite a lot users there
[12:09] <ubotu> stdin called the ops in #ubuntu (shaiful)
[12:09] <ubotu> dgjones called the ops in #ubuntu (shaiful)
[12:09] <ubotu> shaiful called the ops in #ubuntu ()
 shaiful called the ops in #ubuntu () ? called the ops on themselveS?
[12:13] <Mez> Seveas - ping
[12:35] <Pici> eh?
[12:36] <Pici> Mez: He did call the ops himself:07:09:11 <?shaiful> !op
[12:37] <Mez> Pici, yes, I was wondering why he was
[12:37] <Pici> Mez: Because they don't know any better.
[12:37] <Pici> Its not the first time I've seen it.
[12:58] <pressenter> If user named elektronik321 will be bothering anyone of ubuntu ops please direct him privately to me.
[13:00] <TheSheep> pressenter: he just left about 20 minutes ago :)
[13:00] <pressenter> Yea, Mez already told me that.
[13:00] <pressenter> Hate that troll, should get a kline for the guy. :/
[13:01] <TheSheep> pressenter: hard to kline netia
[13:01] <pressenter> Yea, i know.
[13:01] <pressenter> Half of Poland would go down. ;)
[13:02] <pressenter> But that guy is actually an irc miracle; noone, and i do mean noone, wants him on -pl channel, but he keeps bothering all ops overthere.
[13:03] <Mez> Seveas, would it be worth putting the bantracker in #ubuntu-pl ?
[13:06] <TheSheep> pressenter: I think I know him personally :/
[13:07] <pressenter> Well, what can i say; my condolences. ;)
[13:34] <jpatrick> afternoon all
[15:13] <jpatrick> any staff around that can forward #kubuntu-uk to #ubuntu-uk?
[15:13] <Pici> jpatrick: Do you have operator status there?
[15:14] <jpatrick> Pici: no, that's why I'm asking :)
[15:14] <Pici> Ah.
[15:16] <Seeker`> seems to be pretty quiet in there
[15:31] <Daviey> Pricey's having fun tho
[15:32] <jpatrick> heh
[15:55] <jpatrick> Seveas: ubotu is not talking (bug number) in #ubuntu-classroom
[16:28] <nalioth> jpatrick: #kubuntu-uk exists?
[16:28] <jpatrick> nalioth: yep
[16:28] <Seeker`> nalioth: it is registered
[16:28] <nalioth> hmm
[16:29] <Pici> The owner isnt anyone I recognize
[16:29] <Seeker`> nalioth: never heard of the person that registered it thought
[16:29]  * nalioth can't get to it
[16:29] <Seeker`> nalioth: why not?
[16:29] <nalioth> Seeker`: try it
[16:29] <jpatrick> nalioth: thanks
[16:29] <Pici> It was earlier..
[16:30] <Seeker`> it now forward to ubuntu-uk
[16:31] <Seeker`> +s
[16:31] <Pici> +if
[16:31]  * nalioth thinks y'all need to lay off the booze
[16:34] <jpatrick> nalioth: tea, sir?
[16:35] <nalioth> tea?
[17:04] <Azag> hola
[17:04] <Pici> Darksiteevil, Azag, How can we help you?
[17:04] <Azag> miren, saben que me expulsaron de ubuntu-es, y no tengo idea por q...
[17:04] <Darksiteevil> this help is for azag
[17:04] <Azag> I was banned/expulsed of ubuntu-es with out reason
[17:05] <Darksiteevil> azag es en inglesh
[17:05] <Azag> (si/yes)
[17:05] <Darksiteevil> bueno te dejo azag
[17:05] <Darksiteevil> chao guys
[17:05] <Azag> (gracias/thnx)
[17:05] <Darksiteevil> de nada
[17:05] <Pici> jpatrick: around?
[17:05] <Darksiteevil> i go
[17:06] <jpatrick> Pici: hi
[17:06]  * jpatrick checks #ubuntu-es backlog
[17:08] <Azag> y?
[17:10] <jpatrick> Azag: por favor entra en #ubuntu-irc
[17:17] <jpatrick> solved
[17:32] <Myrtti> if I start to get annoying in the following 1 ½ hrs, feel free to kick my tiny bum from the channels
[17:32] <Gary> can we do it now?
[17:33] <jussi01> hehe
[17:33] <Myrtti> noooooo
[17:33]  * Pici kicks Myrtti
[17:33] <Gary> aww you are no fun
[17:33] <Myrtti> /me enjoys rhubarb liqueur and is planning to open an excellent bottle of french cider
[17:33] <Pici> Oooh
[17:33] <Myrtti> English ones are crap
[17:33] <Pici> Sounds relaxing
[17:33] <Gary> not fair
[17:33] <jussi01> Myrtti: oi, pass me some!!
[17:33] <Myrtti> sorry, but they are
[17:34] <Myrtti> /me pours jussi01 a glass
[17:34] <jussi01> gah... graphics card playing up :(
[17:34] <Myrtti> today is Heroes day
[17:34] <jussi01> stupid freaking ati
[17:34] <Myrtti> so I've got nice booze, pizza and cheetos
[17:34] <Myrtti> partee
[17:34] <jussi01> Myrtti: ahh, yes... heroes
[17:34] <Pici> Very Heroic of you
[17:35] <Myrtti> while waiting I'm singing cheesy songs, crying a bit and cursing all the men to hell ;-)
[17:35] <Myrtti> with a wide grin
[17:35] <TheSheep> crying with a wide grin?
[17:36] <Myrtti> the tears don't end up in my mouth if I smile while crying
[17:36] <Myrtti> we Finns get too much sodium in our diet anyway
[17:36] <jussi01> hahahaha
[17:36] <nalioth> Myrtti: don't forget the cheese bits and some romaine lettuce to round out your salad
[17:36] <TheSheep> must be hard to coordinate
[17:37] <Myrtti> nalioth: I did have blue mold cheese-cottage cheese-ground cheese-cauliflower-spinach-mushroom casserole for lunch...
[17:37] <Myrtti> I'm a bit cheesy today
[17:38]  * jussi01 throws his best wallace and gromit CHEEEESE  out
[17:38] <Myrtti> uuu stilton
[17:39] <Myrtti> I didn't like St. Albans, though
[17:39] <Myrtti> 6 mo matured manchego is nice, 9 is too aged
[17:39] <Myrtti> cheese > chocolate
[17:40] <Seeker`> Myrtti: You prefer french "cider" to english cider??
[17:40] <Myrtti> I had to struggle down my Old Rosie...
[17:40] <Myrtti> La Cidrae goes down nicely
[17:40] <Seeker`> heretic!
[17:41] <Myrtti> well anyway the liquer store didn't have large bottles of stronger English cider in their shelves
[17:41] <Myrtti> so I had no choice, either French or Spanish
[17:41] <Myrtti> or Finnish oversweet junk
[17:41]  * nalioth just figured a nice cheese and lettuce to be complimented by the rhubarb liqueur and cider . . .
[17:42] <Seeker`> nalioth: Doesn't Cider mean something different in the US?
[17:42] <nalioth> Seeker`: lightly fermented juice?
[17:42] <Pici> Apple Cider
[17:43] <Seeker`> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_cider
[17:44] <Seeker`> which is nowhere near as good as http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cider
[17:46] <jussi01> Myrtti: what about that mongrel swedish stuff?
[17:46] <Myrtti> blechhhhh
[17:47] <Myrtti> If I plan to get drunk to the point I can't remember afterwards what I've drank, the nordic stuff suffices
[17:47] <Myrtti> it's cheap and available
[17:47] <Myrtti> but they're not fit for anything else
[18:04] <Moniker42> Seeker`, oh yea... you're right :)
[18:08] <Myrtti> lol, the guinea pigs didn't enjoy the sound of the bottle cork opening
[18:10] <TheSheep> Myrtti: they grind their teeth?
[18:10] <Myrtti> ran away hiding in their hut and then grind their teeth
[18:11] <Gary> microwave solves that
[18:11]  * Gary hides
[18:11] <TheSheep> so human
[18:12] <Myrtti> hello Sapote, nada3, how can we help you today?
[18:12] <Sapote> hello Myrtti!
[18:13] <jpatrick> Myrtti: nada3 has a bad ident
[18:13] <Sapote> i not need help, only stay here
[18:13] <Myrtti> nada3: change your ident please
[18:13] <Myrtti> Sapote: why?
[18:14] <Sapote> Myrtti: /topic... ok
[18:14] <Sapote> bye for all
[18:18] <jpatrick> hey ompaul
[18:18] <ompaul> that is me
[18:18] <ompaul> ;-)
[18:19] <TheSheep> amazing
[18:21] <ompaul> baaaahhhhhhh baaaahhhhhh sup?
[18:22] <ompaul> why for art thou within the bounds of this forsaken place occupied by the outcasts of IRC, TheSheep?
[18:23]  * ompaul grins
[18:23]  * ompaul welcomes one but rejects all ;-)
[18:24]  * TheSheep bites ompaul's head off
[18:24] <ompaul> mooo
[18:24] <TheSheep> *chew* *chew*
[18:24] <ompaul> you cud do that
[18:24] <TheSheep> anybody have salt?
[18:24] <ompaul> just to rub into the wound?
[18:25] <ompaul> the puns are flying today I can tell ya
[18:25] <ompaul> mostly nose first into the ground none the less
[18:25] <TheSheep> there is nothing like a bad pun in the evening
[18:26] <ompaul> two in the morning?
[18:26] <ompaul> *cough*
[18:28] <nickrud> Intrepid Ibex . No one got it
[18:29] <ompaul> hh ii
[18:29] <nickrud> that I saw, anyway
[18:29] <ompaul> how do you mean?
[18:31] <nickrud> new release name, just announced on the devel list
[18:31] <ompaul> yeap - but what of the "no one got it"
[18:33] <nickrud> ompaul: that's why I added the 'that I saw, anyway' .
[18:43] <ompaul> nickrud, I don't understand "no one got it"
[18:59] <nickrud> ompaul: sorry, away from desk for a bit. No one guessed that one, that I saw I meant
[19:06] <jpatrick> Warning: beheadingpain <- some network troll as before
[19:06] <Pici> jpatrick: yeah, I'm waiting for him to cross the line in -offtopic
[19:06] <jpatrick> Pici: kicked from #kubuntu and #ubuntu-es by me
[19:07] <jpatrick> nalioth: think the guy deserves a kline?
[19:08] <nalioth> jpatrick: which guy?
[19:08] <Pici> Hes just offtopic trolling, not being too disruptive imho.
[19:09] <jpatrick> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/56772/
[19:10] <jpatrick>  /whois beheadingpain - he appears to be on several channels, possibly doing the same thing
[19:13] <nalioth> so long as he's not violating network guidelines, it is channel issues
[19:16] <jpatrick> [!] BARBIE26<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit [Excess Flood]
[19:16] <jpatrick> 13:22:28 < ~ki> like a language of some sort?
[19:16] <Pici> ki...
[19:16] <jpatrick> that guy keeps doing that? spamming bot
[19:17] <Pici> Who?
[19:17] <jpatrick> "BARBIE26"
[19:18] <jpatrick> opps, he's only in #kde, sorry :)
[19:18] <Pici> hehe
[19:19] <jussi01> you know, Ii is a place down the road from here.. about 40km
[19:19] <Pici> Ii or Ki?
[19:20] <jpatrick> Pici: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/56773/ I assumed it was a spambot
[19:20] <jpatrick> ah, just got K-Lined
[19:20] <jussi01> Ii
[19:21] <jussi01> Pici: I was referring to the intrepid bex codename discussion earlier
[19:28] <jussi01> hmmm, how do I switch servers in irssi?
[19:28] <PriceChild> alt+x
[19:28] <PriceChild> i think
[19:28] <jpatrick> jussi01: Ctrl-x?
[19:30] <jussi01> hrm
[19:38] <Gary> meh, there is a user in #ubuntu with the nick gary_ and I keep getting highlighted :-|
[19:39] <jussi01> hehe
[19:40]  * PriceChild pushes the k-stick away from gary
[19:40] <Gary> lol
[19:44] <jussi01> lol at bug 192774
[19:44] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 192774 in avidemux "[FFe request] Avidemux 2.4.1" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192774
[19:46] <jpatrick> jussi01: hehe
[19:47] <jpatrick> bug 192350 - there's a real FFe
[19:47] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 192350 in semantik "[Feature Freeze Exception] New upstream release" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192350
[19:49] <ubotu> In ubotu, DRebellion said: virtualisers is There are several solutions for running other operating systems (or their programs) inside Ubuntu, while using the native CPU as much as possible: !QEmu (with !KQemu), !VirtualBox, !VMWare, as well as !WINE and !Cedega for Windows applications
[19:50] <Pici> virtual
[19:50] <Pici> !virtual
[19:50] <ubotu> There are several solutions for running other operating systems (or their programs) inside Ubuntu, while using the native CPU as much as possible: !QEmu (with !KQemu), !VirtualBox, !VMWare, as well as !WINE and !Cedega for Windows applications
[19:50] <jpatrick> alias it?
[19:50] <Pici> !virtualisers
[19:50] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about virtualisers - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[19:50] <Pici> !virtualiser
[19:50] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about virtualiser - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[19:51] <PriceChild> !search virt
[19:51] <ubotu> Found: virtual machine, virtualisation, virtual desktops-#ubuntu-effects, kqemu, xinerama, xen, box*, virtualizers, vm, virtual
[19:51] <PriceChild> stupid american spellings...
[19:51] <PriceChild> I haven't changed.
[19:52] <Pici> !-virtualizers
[19:52] <ubotu> virtualizers aliases: vm, virtualization, virtualizer, virtual machine, virtual, virtualisation, virtualiser, virtualisers - added by LjL on 2007-01-23 16:27:34
[19:52] <jpatrick> Pici: mate, root-- is repeat *the same thing* on many channels now
[19:58] <Pici> codicealpha: Hello, how can we help you?
[19:58] <codicealpha> hi
[19:58] <codicealpha> no, thanks
[19:59] <jpatrick> codicealpha: please read the /topic
[19:59] <Pici> codicealpha: this channel is only for operator issues, not somewhere to just hang out it.
[19:59] <Pici> s/it/in
[19:59] <codicealpha> someone invite me here..
[19:59] <Myrtti> *bwurp*
[19:59] <codicealpha> never mind.. i'll go out
[20:00] <codicealpha> thanks, have a good time
[20:00] <jpatrick> no0tic: ...^^
[20:06] <Pici> !test
[20:06] <ubotu> Failed.
[20:07] <jpatrick> Pici: you killed Seveas in the process!
[20:07] <Pici> yay
[20:07] <Pici> I mean... aww..
[20:20] <ubotu> Daviey called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[20:21] <ubotu> prince_jammys called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[20:22] <nalioth> nickrud: klined
[20:22] <nickrud> nalioth: nice
[20:23] <nalioth> nickrud: just letting you know so you can keep the banlist clean
[20:28] <ubotu> ph0rensic called the ops in #ubuntu (prot back again)
[20:28] <ubotu> Daviey called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[20:28] <Daviey> nalioth: 20:28:14 -!- prince_jammys<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit [K-lined ?
[20:29] <nalioth> Daviey: yes, y'all are too quick for me
[20:29] <Seeker`> its almost a full moon - all of the weirdos are out
[20:30] <Daviey> Seeker`: talk of the devil
[20:31] <nalioth> prot klined
[20:31] <nalioth> whoever banned him/her/it
[20:31] <nickrud> nalioth: ok
[20:32] <PriceChild> prince been un-k-lined?
[20:32] <nalioth> PriceChild: as soon as it happened
[20:33] <PriceChild> good good
[20:35] <Seeker`> lunar eclipse tonight
[20:36] <anthony> indeed
[20:36] <Pici> yes
[20:36] <anthony> I'd love to get out and see how my new camera does with it, but I'm afraid I'm going to just collapse from exhaustion instead
[20:36] <Pici> I'm going to try to capture it with my camera, but I don't have a telephoto lens :/
[20:37] <Seeker`> Pici: What sort of zoom do you have?
[20:37] <anthony> I don't either, but I'm hoping the resolution will make up for it.
[20:37] <Seeker`> heh
[20:37] <anthony> I can tell you that with a 35mm film camera and a 200mm telephoto lens, with a 4x6" print, the moon comes out approximately the size of a US quarter.
[20:37] <Seeker`> Its cloudy here
[20:38] <anthony> Now I have a digital camera though, with 12.1 megapixels, so I might be able to toy around with blowing it up.
[20:39]  * Seeker` has a 10MP camera that produces decent results
[20:42] <anthony> It's hard though, living in a metro area of 2 or 3 million
[20:43]  * Seeker` lives on the edge of a city
[20:43] <Seeker`> I have a telescope that I never get to use either
[21:20] <ompaul> nickrud, sorry was out at class
[21:24] <nickrud> ompaul: np, as I said, I was away as well
[21:59] <ompaul> PriceChild, kbrooks should be told (that page is not 100% accurate) wep is correct but ehhhhhhhhhh that is not ssl attacking from what I can see
[21:59] <ompaul> PriceChild, however I could crush a grape
[22:04] <jpatrick> ubuntu-irc: check your mail
[22:04] <PriceChild> ompaul, didn't work for me
[22:05] <ompaul> PriceChild, yeap
[22:05] <ompaul> it is based on some false premsis
[22:06] <ompaul> arrr how is that word spelt
[22:09] <Pici> premise
[22:09] <PriceChild> nalioth, LjL, elkbuntu  *ping* about cloak for ubuSecurity
[22:09] <nalioth> PriceChild: first i've heard of it
[22:09] <ompaul> premise
[22:09] <elkbuntu> who/what is ubuSecurity?
[22:10] <PriceChild> elkbuntu, see latest email to ubuntu-irc
[22:10] <jpatrick> elkbuntu: /whois ubuSecurity
[22:10] <PriceChild> elkbuntu, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-irc/2008-February/000398.html
[22:11] <Pici> rolleyes
[22:11] <elkbuntu> ok.. looks fine to me
[22:12] <Pici> A bit silly though, since ubotu can do those things
[22:12]  * PriceChild wonders if we made a policy that cloaked bots should be operated by members
[22:12] <Pici> At least I think it can
[22:13] <elkbuntu> PriceChild, that's unfair on people who are working hard and are valuable contributors... but just havent got around for going for member yet
[22:13] <PriceChild> indeed, isn't on the list of requirements
[22:14] <PriceChild> ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/Cloaks )
[22:15] <ompaul> !bug 1
[22:15] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
[22:15] <jpatrick> bug #1
[22:15] <ubotu> For discussion and help with Microsoft Windows, please visit ##windows. See http://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/1 http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm and /msg ubotu equivalents
[22:15] <ompaul> bug 66
[22:15] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 66 in malone "+upstreamtask and +packagetask need to become context-aware" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/66
[22:17] <elkbuntu> bug 666
[22:17] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 666 in malone "can't file a bug on Ubuntu" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/666
[22:17] <elkbuntu> rofl
[23:03] <ubotu> In ubotu, bluefoxx said: !squid is !info squid
[23:06]  * PriceChild wonders what the point in that is
[23:06] <PriceChild> even if it did work
[23:13] <Seeker`> PriceChild: pfft, why do you need a reason for everything :P
[23:24] <PriceChild> I just got an xbox live newletter...
[23:25] <PriceChild> and at the top is the following
[23:25] <PriceChild> "Read this issue online if you can't see the images or are using Outlook 2007" which was linkified
[23:28] <PriceChild> I think its quite ironic that they are sending out emails which their own email clients won't display properly for w/e reason.
[23:30] <Seeker`> hah


[01:47] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Ubuntu Kylin Desktop amd64 [Yakkety Final] has been updated (20161011)
[01:47] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Ubuntu Kylin Desktop i386 [Yakkety Final] has been updated (20161011)
[02:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Netboot amd64 [Yakkety Final] (20101020ubuntu482) has been added
[02:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Netboot armhf [Yakkety Final] (20101020ubuntu482) has been added
[02:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Netboot powerpc [Yakkety Final] (20101020ubuntu482) has been added
[02:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Netboot s390x [Yakkety Final] (20101020ubuntu482) has been added
[02:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Netboot arm64 [Yakkety Final] (20101020ubuntu482) has been added
[02:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Netboot ppc64el [Yakkety Final] (20101020ubuntu482) has been added
[02:31] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Netboot i386 [Yakkety Final] (20101020ubuntu482) has been added
[09:52] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Ubuntu MATE Desktop amd64 [Yakkety Final] has been updated (20161011)
[09:52] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Ubuntu MATE Desktop powerpc [Yakkety Final] has been updated (20161011)
[09:52] -queuebot:#ubuntu-quality- Builds: Ubuntu MATE Desktop i386 [Yakkety Final] has been updated (20161011)
[18:40] <bdmurray> nuclearbob: what kind of package sets are installed on these systems being upgraded to Yakkety?  https://platform-qa-jenkins.ubuntu.com/view/Upgrade/
[19:19] <nuclearbob> bdmurray: the basic tests are a default install, the desktop ones have ^ubuntu-desktop
[19:58] <bdmurray> nuclearbob: is there any capacity for other desktop environments?
[20:02] <nuclearbob> bdmurray: yes! mostly we'll need to manually build images for them, but that can be done. If that's something you want before yakkety, I think it'll be a bit difficult, but having that in place for y->z would be relatively easy
[20:04] <bdmurray> nuclearbob: While not necessarily related to other desktop enviornments I'd like to catch things like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/backuppc/+bug/1610756
[20:06] <nuclearbob> bdmurray: yeah, that would be good. Adding the tests is easy, I've just been having trouble getting desktop installed automatically when building images via autopkgtest (cloud-init times out) so I need to build the images manually, which takes a few hours to get them implemented and tested and copied over. Should be easy for the next release
[20:09] <bdmurray> nuclearbob: okay, do you know what's wrong with the trusty to xenial tests?
[20:10] <bdmurray> some are disabled?
[20:11] <bdmurray> Oh, its all the lxc ones. Is there a reason to still have them listed?
[21:14] <nuclearbob> bdmurray: I intend to re-enable them at some point, I just haven't had time yet
[21:15] <nuclearbob> bdmurray: all issues I'm currently aware of will be listed here: https://wiki.canonical.com/UbuntuEngineering/QA/JenkinsJobs/UpgradeTesting/Issues presently it's just lxc not working


[14:41] <nik90> hey guys
[14:46] <dpm> nik90, o/ :)
[14:46] <nik90> what is the ubuntu orange hash code?
[14:48] <i_need_a_nick> nik90: u r nikelesh right?
[14:48] <nik90> i_need_a_nick: yeah that's right :)
[14:49] <justCarakas> maybe we can brainstorm on a nick for i_need_a_nick while we wait :p
[14:49] <rpadovani> o/ guys
[14:50] <rpadovani> I just finished my second exam for today, I'm a bit tired :-)
[14:50] <i_need_a_nick> hmm... how did u get into ubuntu devel?... i mean what were ur qualifications? i wanna contribute to ubuntu some day... (curious too.. being an indian.. :))
[14:50] <i_need_a_nick> nik90: ^
[14:50] <ahayzen> rpadovani, how many you got left?
[14:51] <mhall119> i_need_a_nick: "i wanna contribute" is usually the biggest qualification needed :)
[14:51] <nik90> guys if you want to join us for the Ubuntu SDK Feedback session hangout, join https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeYuOhk1FZk0TkSoBqAWEgV-PaIxhScdNtDLWeGf-FadSo52Q
[14:51] <rpadovani> ahayzen, 3 spoken and 1 write! Hope to finish soon, but since today I have more free time, worst is gone!
[14:51] <justCarakas> I wish I could but I'm following this on my second screen at work
[14:51] <nik90> manu: hey, I am just an app dev. I wanted to contribute to ubuntu and started working on the clock core app for ubuntu touch.
[14:51] <justCarakas> I have some feedback, but I'll just type it
[14:51] <nik90> manu: You need to be familiar with QML, QT, Javascript and you are golden :)
[14:52] <ahayzen> rpadovani, yey good luck, i just got my results back so i'm done until next year :)
[14:52] <nik90> rpadovani, ahayzen: hey guys
[14:52] <justCarakas> or html and css
[14:52] <rpadovani> ahayzen, wow, congrats :-) So now do you have 3 months of holiday? Awesome!
[14:52] <justCarakas> I made my app in html and css
[14:52] <ahayzen> nik90, o/ i expect you have a list? ... or is that getting old now...
[14:52] <nik90> ahayzen: getting old :P
[14:52] <ahayzen> rpadovani, yeah until mid-september
[14:52] <nik90> ahayzen: I want other people's list
[14:52] <i_need_a_nick> i_need_a_nick: none i know till now... just C/C++.. nik90
[14:52] <ahayzen> nik90, hehe
[14:52] <ahayzen> nik90, yeah we do :)
[14:53] <nik90> i_need_a_nick: they are quite easy to pick up. so no worries
[14:53] <rpadovani> ahayzen, you lucky boy :-) Now you have to do some wonderful apps for u touch :P
[14:53] <nik90> i_need_a_nick: also we could do with the people who know C++ for the clock app
[14:53] <i_need_a_nick> when can i start? :)
[14:53] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, now :D
[14:53] <ahayzen> i_need_a_nick, i had only done HTML/javascript/php/python ebfore and it was really easy to pick up
[14:53] <nik90> iBelieve: hey
[14:53] <zyga> mhall119: hey, would you mind if I joined to talk about pyotherside?
[14:54] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, only javascript here and no problem to start to contribute ;)
[14:54] <nik90> rpadovani:, ahayzen: Join the hangout?
[14:54] <mhall119> zyga: sure
[14:54] <zyga> mhall119: or do you think I should leave that for another session?
[14:54] <nik90> guys if you want to join us for the Ubuntu SDK Feedback session hangout, join https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeYuOhk1FZk0TkSoBqAWEgV-PaIxhScdNtDLWeGf-FadSo52Q
[14:54] <mhall119> zyga: do you have a session to talk about it?
[14:54] <bzoltan1> hello all
[14:54] <nik90> bzoltan1: hello
[14:54] <bzoltan1> mhall119:  I am here
[14:54] <ahayzen> nik90, haven't got much/anything to complain about at the moment i don't think...
[14:54] <i_need_a_nick> rpadovani: sorry... I'm still a student.. gotta learn some more programming in years to come..
[14:54] <mhall119> bzoltan1: want to join the hangout?
[14:55] <justCarakas> will there be something like FEEDBACK instead of QUESTION ? :p
[14:55] <nik90> well neither do I
[14:55] <nik90> bzoltan1: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeYuOhk1FZk0TkSoBqAWEgV-PaIxhScdNtDLWeGf-FadSo52Q
[14:55] <nik90> bzoltan1: if you want to join the hangotu
[14:55] <bzoltan1> The SDK feedback. That is why I am here :)
[14:55] <i_need_a_nick> lol me too
[14:55] <Mirv> hey nik90 :)
[14:56] <nik90> Mirv: hey
[14:56] <mhall119> justCarakas: either, both
[14:56] <CodePulsar> y
[14:56] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, also I am a student, develop for Ubuntu is a very good way to learn something new!
[14:57] <i_need_a_nick> nik90: is there a chance i can meet u personally... I stay in bangalore..
[14:57] <ahayzen> rpadovani, +1
[14:57] <nik90> i_need_a_nick: not this year I am afraid :/
[14:58] <i_need_a_nick> rpadovani: so how do i get started? where r the resources?
[14:58] <zyga> mhall119: no but I can do one
[14:58] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, all apps are hosted on Launchpad
[14:58] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone-coreapps
[14:59] <nik90> one final call before going live..want to join the hangout, join us at https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeYuOhk1FZk0TkSoBqAWEgV-PaIxhScdNtDLWeGf-FadSo52Q
[14:59] <i_need_a_nick> umm... not too familiar with launchpad.. rpadovani
[14:59] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, for example, a good way to start is to fix a trivial bug, like these: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone-coreapps/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize
[15:00] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, well, do you know github?
[15:00] <i_need_a_nick> yep... i host a website...
[15:00] <mdeslaur> FEEDBACK: it's awesome! :)
[15:00] <ahayzen> nik90, i can see you :)
[15:00] <Max_Tither> rpadovani: If I want to contribute, do I just send a merge request? Also I assume I need to sign the Ubuntu Code of Conduct?
[15:01] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, basically the same thing, but launchpad uses bazaar
[15:01] <i_need_a_nick> how do i get access to code?
[15:01] <rpadovani> Max_Tither, yap and also Canonical License Agreement
[15:01] <justCarakas> you are live
[15:01] <rickspencer3> o/
[15:01] <Max_Tither> rpadovani: Thanks!
[15:01] <bzoltan1> thanks mdeslaur :)
[15:01] <bmullan> I can hear/see you
[15:02] <i_need_a_nick> nik90: that's alright... mail me when u do find time.. want my mail id?
[15:02] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, install bzr on your machine, then use bzr branch lp:app, like bzr branch lp:ubuntu-calculator-app
[15:02] <rpadovani> Max_Tither, yw, if you have any other question, feel free to ask here or on #ubuntu-app-devel
[15:03] <i_need_a_nick> rpadovani: package not found... is there a ppa?
[15:03] <justCarakas> FEEDBACK: it actually isn't that nice to work in if you make HTML5 apps, I miss a lot of functionallity that I get in PhpStrom or Sublime Text
[15:04] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, sudo apt-get install bzr
[15:04] <Max_Tither> rpadovani: Ok will do.
[15:04] <rpadovani> :-)
[15:05] <i_need_a_nick> rpadovani: not found... I have a messy system ryt now... will do it on a fresh install later..
[15:05] <Max_Tither> i_need_a_nick: Here is  good resource for getting up to speed with bzr: http://doc.bazaar.canonical.com/latest/en/mini-tutorial/
[15:05] <mdeslaur> QUESTION: can the default project please include a sample icon, along with scripts to generate the proper icon names and sizes from a svg file perhaps?
[15:06] <balloons> justCarakas, you mean from an IDE?
[15:07] <justCarakas> yes it is
[15:07] <justCarakas> balloons
[15:07] <Max_Tither> QUESTION: Is the ability to change the header text color in the work for the SDK?
[15:07] <i_need_a_nick> Max_Tither: thanq.. :) I needa start on QML and QT too...
[15:07] <balloons> justCarakas, ahh right..
[15:07]  * ogra_ listens in ...
[15:07] <zsombi> Max_Tither: yes :)
[15:08] <balloons> I would echo mhall119.. I wonder if using something else makes sense
[15:08] <balloons> justCarakas, ^^
[15:08] <mdeslaur> QUESTION: any plans on making a better QML grid? One that you can set cell sizes and properties, etc?
[15:08] <Max_Tither> developer.ubuntu.com if found to be very well done. It can help you get familiar with vanilla qml, as well as integrating it with Ubuntu. http://developer.ubuntu.com/apps/qml/api/
[15:09] <Max_Tither> i_need_a_nick ^
[15:09] <i_need_a_nick> Max_Tither: +1
[15:09] <Max_Tither> zsombi: Yey. I am very excited for that.
[15:10] <mhall119> Max_Tither: do you want to join the hangout?
[15:10] <i_need_a_nick> Max_Tither: should I start with the Devel API?
[15:12] <zsombi> Max_Tither: ;)
[15:13] <Max_Tither> i_need_a_nick. I would say yes, but if you are on 14.04, make sure you have the sdk ppa installed.
[15:14] <i_need_a_nick> is there a blog or something.. like a guide to start with?
[15:14] <rpadovani> i_need_a_nick, http://developer.ubuntu.com/apps/qml/tutorial/building_your_first_qml_app/
[15:14] <mdeslaur> QUESTION: any plans on expanding UbuntuColors? Some of the default greys aren't in there, and the core apps hardcode the values everywhere...
[15:16] <Max_Tither> mhall: I have to hit the road at the moment, but I'll return. Thank you for the invite though.
[15:18] <balloons> we talked about bundling python and depends for having test packages
[15:18] <balloons> the issue with python is we can't assume python will be there
[15:19] <i_need_a_nick> QUESTION: Are there plans to bring the SDK to other platforms?
[15:20] <jdstrand> if we were going to support python apps on the device, we would need to add a python framework (eg, ubuntu-sdk-python-dev1) and apparmor templates for it
[15:20] <balloons> everyone would end up bundling python and it's depends
[15:20] <jdstrand> UAL would handle making sure a python app ran under the proper profile
[15:21] <jdstrand> (and the click desktop hook would make that work with legacy desktop files)
[15:21] <jdstrand> the apparmor confinement would likely be significantly different
[15:22] <jdstrand> ie, rather than 'ubuntu-sdk' or 'ubuntu-webapp' as templates, we would need a 'ubuntu-sdk-python' template
[15:23] <jdstrand> mhall119: ^
[15:23] <jdstrand> it woud not have run under confinement
[15:23] <balloons> :-)
[15:23] <jdstrand> I can guarantee it
[15:23] <balloons> yep no template, no confinemnt
[15:24] <jdstrand> *unless* the python interpreter was bundled in the app
[15:24] <nik90> jdstrand: like to join https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeYuOhk1FZk0TkSoBqAWEgV-PaIxhScdNtDLWeGf-FadSo52Q ?
[15:24] <mdeslaur> it's not a security problem, it's a maintenance and on-going support problem
[15:24] <bzoltan1>  i_need_a_nick:  I know about teams who made very exciting prototyping on porting SDK to OSX
[15:25] <balloons> the biggest issue is keeping python on the image
[15:25] <zyga> jdstrand: hey, how can I know more about how to check confinment?
[15:25] <balloons> so you would end up bundling the interperter
[15:25] <mdeslaur> and at the same version so existing apps don't break, etc.
[15:25] <Elleo> one other point in pyotherside's favour is that sailfish are making it a core part of their platform, so there might well be a number of sailfish python apps in the future that could be ported
[15:25] <kenvandine> someone bundled java :)
[15:25] <balloons> which makes it.. interesting
[15:25] <balloons> kenvandine, is correct.. someone bundling a jvm ;-)
[15:25] <zyga> Elleo: good point
[15:27] <zyga> jdstrand: and I'd love to know how work with confinment, if you have some time later on I'd like to talk to you about that
[15:27]  * jdstrand is having trouble getting on to the hangout
[15:27] <jdstrand> I think I answered everything though
[15:27] <jdstrand> zyga: sure
[15:28] <Elleo> zyga: when you ran your pyotherside app was it built in a click package or were you running it directly from a terminal?
[15:28] <jdstrand> the steps aren't difficult, but the maintenance story is
[15:28] <zyga> jdstrand: so how do I make it work under confinment? all it needs to do is to dlopen python (and let python read typical import paths for source code it needs)
[15:28] <jdstrand> (ie, define the framework you need, define the apparmor templates
[15:28] <jdstrand> )
[15:29] <zyga> Elleo: with click package though on 14.10 I had issues running anything (including hello world apps) on my nexus 7
[15:29] <jdstrand> but maintaining that python framework would be difficult
[15:29] <mdeslaur> grid
[15:29] <zyga> jdstrand: what falls under maintenance?
[15:30] <zyga> jdstrand: and can you point me to an example framework so that I can see how to add anything necessary
[15:30] <jdstrand> zyga: if you define a python framework in the sdk and ship it on the device, the platform has to define the apis amd make sure that the apis, etc all work together in that framework.
[15:31] <jdstrand> zyga: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Click/Frameworks
[15:31] <zyga> jdstrand: hmm
[15:31] <zyga> jdstrand: I think I'm missing something
[15:31] <zyga> jdstrand: this is a QML component
[15:31] <zyga> jdstrand: and python is still a part of each of those
[15:32] <jdstrand> zyga: well, it may be a qml component, but it surely depends on a stack of python to work, no?
[15:32] <zyga> jdstrand: sure and as I said python is probably a part of each ubuntu-sdk-* listed there (or am I mistaken?)
[15:33] <mhall119> zyga: I think that's where you're mistaken
[15:33] <jdstrand> I'm assuing the way this works is you have a python app that uses QML (akin to a C++/Qt app that uses QML) instead of a pure QML app that happens to also use python in some manner
[15:33] <zyga> jdstrand: you're wrong
[15:33] <jdstrand> zyga: you are mistaken. python is not part of the defined sdk
[15:33] <nik90> any other questions guys?
[15:33] <zyga> jdstrand: it's actually a QML app that uses python like javascript
[15:33] <zyga> jdstrand: ok
[15:33] <zsombi> ah, back :)
[15:33] <zyga> jdstrand: so it'd definitely want to have all of the normal framework stuff available
[15:34] <zyga> jdstrand: just have one more .so file (pyotherside) that can dlopen libpython*.so under apparmor
[15:34] <zyga> jdstrand: I don't know how that maps to frameworks
[15:35] <jdstrand> zyga: that .so isn't the problem. the .so is going to pull in the entire python stack, no? ie, you can import various libraries, correct?
[15:35] <zyga> jdstrand: well, just pure python
[15:35] <zyga> jdstrand: not every python-* package from ubuntu
[15:35] <zyga> jdstrand: then you can bundle those that you want in your app
[15:35] <zyga> jdstrand: but you have the runtime and you don't need to keep a stale copy with security exploits in each app
[15:36] <zyga> jdstrand: I'm willing to do the work needed but I want to see where to start
[15:37] <jdstrand> the framework currently doesn't cover python, so a new framework would have to be added like I said before, or the existing ones expanded to include the python that is in the archive
[15:37] <zyga> jdstrand: so if I wanted to try that locally, where do I start,
[15:37] <zyga> jdstrand: which source packages, which trees to get and patch
[15:38] <jdstrand> zyga: you can test the app under confinement easily. write the app, package it as click, then run it in the emulator or on the device. look in /var/log/syslog for apparmor denials
[15:38] <zyga> jdstrand: ok
[15:39] <jdstrand> you can then update the profile in /var/lib/apparmor/profiles/click_<your_app_profile> to add policy changes, then do 'apparmor_parser -r /var/lib/apparmor/profiles/click_<your_app_profile> to iterate
[15:39] <zyga> jdstrand: so should I add pyotherside to the base image myself first or should I bundle it with my app?
[15:39] <jdstrand> note: doing the above updates the profile but the changes will be overwritten
[15:40] <zyga> jdstrand: right now I just made the filesystem writable
[15:40] <jdstrand> zyga: if you are trying to see what it would take to add a framework, you need to put it on the image
[15:40] <zyga> jdstrand: and apt-get installed it
[15:40] <zyga> jdstrand: how can I rebuild the SDK locally and deploy it?
[15:41] <jdstrand> (the frameworks in part make sure all the deps are satisified and that they work correctly)
[15:41] <jdstrand> zyga: no idea
[15:41] <jdstrand> I mean, apt-get source and patch
[15:41] <zyga> jdstrand: ok, but just installing it globally on the device is good enough wrt having it "in the framework" so that I can work on the apparmor template
[15:41] <zyga> jdstrand: which packages? I don't know much about the whole architecture yet
[15:42] <jdstrand> zyga: yes. note, I think this is an interesting experiment, but I really think there is significant work in incorporating/maintaining python into the frameworks
[15:42] <zyga> jdstrand: I still don't see where but maybe I'm missing something
[15:43] <zyga> jdstrand: python is maintained, if this is about having a list of apparmor things the apps are allowed to do this sounds like a one time effort
[15:43] <jdstrand> we ship a python now. it is only guaranteed to work with what uses it in the archive
[15:43] <zyga> jdstrand: I don't understand what you are trying to say by that
[15:43] <jdstrand> expanding that out to pyotherside, a specific version of python, the sdk, qml, etc, etc would be a lot of work in and of itself
[15:44] <zyga> jdstrand: pyotherside has one component, is versioned, has tiny api (a few methods exposed to javascript), I see that as the added work, I don't understand what work is needed for python
[15:44] <jdstrand> I think you should read the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Click/Frameworks to understand what all is involved in maintaining the current frameworks. all that would have to be done for python too
[15:44] <zyga> jdstrand: only python3.4 as that's what we support now (and 3.5 is years away)
[15:44] <zyga> jdstrand: ok, let me read that
[15:45] <dpm_> zsombi, rickspencer3, seems that showing the icons in the gallery app is Fix Committed, but hasn't made it yet to a release? -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1312710
[15:45] <udsbotu> Launchpad bug 1312710 in ubuntu-ui-toolkit (Ubuntu) "Add all mobile theme icons to UI toolkit gallery" [Undecided,New]
[15:46] <jdstrand> zyga: also note, I am the security guy. I don't make decisions on what frameworks should be supported. however, I have seen how much work and pain has gone in to what we currently have. adding a whole new language to the mix... I just can't see how it would be simple
[15:46] <zyga> jdstrand: thanks
[15:48] <zsombi> dpm_: it could be in the staging or in landing phase...
[15:48] <zyga> jdstrand: is it correct to say that current approach is to have lots of mini frameworks instead of one mega framework?
[15:48] <micah2> Even just a best practices section in the dev site would be helpful. I didn't even know there was an UbuntuListView.
[15:49] <jdstrand> zyga: basically. we had a big one for 13.10, but it didn't work great. that said, aiui, we will have a 'mega framework' too. eg, ubuntu-sdk-14.10-dev1
[15:49] <jdstrand> that one would include everything
[15:49] <zyga> jdstrand: but is that just temporary or intended?
[15:49] <jdstrand> I should say, it didn't work great only having the mega framework
[15:49] <zyga> jdstrand: and is it an aggregation of smaller frameoworks or a standalone framework?
[15:49] <jdstrand> aiui, that is intended
[15:50] <jdstrand> zyga: aggregation
[15:50] <zyga> ok
[15:50] <zyga> jdstrand: can you give me any source package name to look what makes a framework?
[15:50] <zyga> jdstrand: that wiki page assumes you know how stuff works and I don't really know what we mean by framework (in concrete terms)
[15:51] <jdstrand> zyga: I think it is the ubuntu-sdk package. you can create a new one for your testing by copying an existing one. I don't think there is anything that programmtically tells you what is in the framework yet
[15:51] <dholbach> the lint tool would be great!
[15:51] <zyga> jdstrand: ok, thanks
[15:51] <jdstrand> zyga: look in /usr/share/click/frameworks
[15:52]  * mhall119 wants a Florian in a Can :)
[15:52] <zyga> jdstrand: hmm, lots of two-line files
[15:52] <nik90> :)
[15:52] <jdstrand> zyga: yes, that's it for now. the definition of what is in all of those is somewhere else and not in a package
[15:53] <jdstrand> there are ongoing discussions for all of that, aiui
[15:53] <zyga> jdstrand: so it looks like 'ubuntu-sdk' is the real framework
[15:53] <zyga> jdstrand: where can I learn about that?
[15:53] <jdstrand> zyga: I don't understand
[15:54] <zyga> jdstrand: about sdk development
[15:54] <lool> zyga: SDK development?
[15:54] <zyga> lool: well, anything I practically need to know to proceed on pyotherside
[15:54] <lool> zyga: there is the UI toolkit (QML bits specific to the Ubuntu QML apps SDK), various QML and Qt bindings for specific services we have (e.g. content-hub. download-manager) and then curation of other libs and bindigns
[15:54] <jdstrand> zyga: like I said, what those two lines files represent is a list of libraries, etc maintained outside of the system
[15:55] <jdstrand> (while it is all being defined)
[15:55] <lool> the framework is just the name of the contract between apps and platform
[15:55] <zyga> lool: right I get that
[15:56] <dpm> nice job nik90!
[15:56] <nik90> dpm: thnx
[15:56] <pmcgowan> thanks good session
[15:56] <nik90> thanks you all for the session
[15:56] <elopio> thanks!
[15:56] <Debaru> Thanks
[15:56] <ahayzen> thanks nik90
[15:58] <nik90> ahayzen: can you start the next hangout or do you need someone to do it for you?
[15:58] <zyga> ogra_: hey
[15:58] <ahayzen> nik90, i need someone else to do it
[15:58] <ogra_> zyga, yo
[15:58] <nik90> ahayzen: okay. I will do it then
[15:58] <zyga> ogra_: looking at the changelog of ubuntu-touch-meta it seems I could talk to you to know how to bite this stuff
[15:58] <ogra_> changing seeds ? sure
[15:59]  * ahayzen wonders where popey has disappeared to
[15:59] <zyga> ogra_: so I quickly added pyotherside to sdk-libs-{amd64,i386,armhf}
[15:59] <zyga> ogra_: and I wonder if I should just run update now
[15:59] <nik90> ahayzen: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeQcRIzFTDeB8MW01XYpBXyFMWTa6yAWNPqOngPkFMVIN0CmQ
[15:59] <ogra_> zyga, no, that is not how it works
[15:59] <zyga> ogra_: second thing I want to understand is where apparmor policy files are kept (source packages)
[15:59] <zyga> ogra_: ok
[15:59] <ogra_> zyga, update runs germinate against the seeds
[15:59] <zyga> ogra_: btw, we can move somewhere else (better channel?)
[15:59] <ogra_> you need to make the change in the seed
[16:00] <ogra_> zyga, yeah, #ubuntu-touch
[16:00] <zyga> ogra_: let's move
[16:02] <nik90> http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1406-music-app-development
[16:02] <nik90> Guys if you want to join the hangout pls do at https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeQcRIzFTDeB8MW01XYpBXyFMWTa6yAWNPqOngPkFMVIN0CmQ
[16:02] <nik90> love to hear you feedback
[16:07] <ahayzen> nik90, https://trello.com/c/0Dwezdvi/225-music-implement-background-playlists-support-wth-media-hub
[16:09] <ahayzen> nik90, https://trello.com/c/JhAf0Oli/223-music-migrate-to-using-u1db-instead-of-localstorage
[16:18] <dpm> nik90, https://code.launchpad.net/~andrew-hayzen/music-app/make-files-visible-in-qtcreator/+merge/220997
[16:27] <ahayzen> nik90, https://code.launchpad.net/~andrew-hayzen/ubuntu-seeds/music-app-remove-grilo
[16:46] <dpm> as usual, thanks nik90 and ahayzen, and popey!
[16:51] <ahayzen> dpm, nik90, popey, thanks all :)
[18:01] <nik90> Anybody who want to join the hangout -> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcIbRQNpp6--Uo0JcSxNkHBHut36C0-4lOU_NVUEojee_WLCA
[18:01] <dpm> ok!
[18:03] <balloons> hi nik90 :-)
[18:04] <dpm> hey all, so post all your questions about convergence here :)
[18:11] <mhall119> I never get tired of watching Flashback change to fit it's size, it's so darn slick!
[18:11] <ahayzen> +1
[18:11] <popey> +2
[18:19] <dobey> note: you're looking at aspect of the app's window, not the screen it's on (as evidenced in the demo)
[18:27] <mhall119> QUESTION: do you have to define a 'default' layout inline, or can all of your layouts live in separate QML files?
[18:29] <mhall119> thanks :)
[18:33] <mhall119> nest conditional layouts looks very powerful
[18:36] <mhall119> QUESTION: where do you define things like Actions and ToolbarItems when the components they'll be used in might change between layouts?
[18:36] <zyga2> QUESTION: can we expect to have pre-made conditions that say "10 inch tablet, 7 inch tabet, 4 inch phone", etc?
[18:36] <mhall119> for example, if I have a pagestack I'll put toolbar items per page, but if I have the width I'll post those side-by-side and would want to combine multiple sets of toolbar items
[18:38] <zyga2> I'll gladly help you with github
[18:38] <dobey> QUESTION: can you add the links, and a link to the slides, to the description on YouTube?
[18:38] <mhall119> QUESTION: extending/modifying zyga2's, how about pre-made layouts like "Sidebar and Content", "Pagestack to Row of Columns", etc
[18:38] <ElVerma> Looks like you are live
[18:38] <mhall119> ElVerma: been live for a while now :)
[18:39] <dobey> someone's 40 minutes late :)
[18:39] <ElVerma> ah, I'm late :-)
[18:40] <zyga2> sure but it'd be silly if everyone would have to come up with that (and get different conditions)
[18:41] <dobey> zyga2: i don't see why physical size of the screen matters
[18:42] <mhall119> QUESTION: I'm thinking more about pre-defined conditional layouts, something like MainView that would give specific properties for sidebarItem: and contentItem:
[18:42] <mhall119> which does the conditional stuff for you
[18:42] <mhall119> thanks, I'll check with zsombi
[18:43] <dobey> don't try to make the apps too smart. make them more dumb. eg, if you need to show a scrollbar, always show it, not only when a mouse is plugged in, but not when it's just a touch device
[18:44] <Max_Tither> QUESTION:Currently, Can I integrate a textfield in the header? I am thinking of showing it in the header based on the formfactor.
[18:44] <nik90> https://plus.google.com/communities/111350780270925540549
[18:46] <Max_Tither> Thank You! I don't mind modifying it.
[18:51] <Debaru> Thanks
[18:52] <cray> hey people...
[18:56] <nik90> Join the hangout at https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYc2AosVOiyz53fhGyVwyuLWH7wpSP2Cwv-KMKDPRYrfHlcwFQ
[18:56] <nik90> Clock App Reboot
[19:03] <fossterer> Link for the presentation? shared? I'm late here :(
[19:03] <rpadovani> https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1JvDyhsW17d1-Mz8OY1YMBKwfRI2z9qgyRjbujEsxEMk/edit#slide=id.g3420c61fa_0202
[19:04] <fossterer> rpadovani: Thanks!
[19:09]  * charles likes the new alarm design
[19:10] <nik90> https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B55Gs35e-jxxNzRzOHVxbmNDbFU&usp=sharing
[19:13] <i_need_a_nick> nik90: impressive
[19:14] <pmcgowan> nik90, I assume we are also keeping the old clock on the side?
[19:18] <pmcgowan> sounds good
[19:18] <pmcgowan> old clock has other features too, so maybe keep in store
[19:19] <pmcgowan> heh
[19:20] <pmcgowan> clock-classic ;)
[19:21] <pmcgowan> lol
[19:21] <ahayzen> hah
[19:26] <nik90> https://trello.com/b/Ie2rAS3W/core-apps-management
[19:27] <dpm> any more questions about the clock reboot?
[19:28] <ahayzen> nik90, let me know of any reviews you need doing :)
[19:36] <ahayzen> yeah should be awesome :)
[19:38] <nik90> thnx guys for participating in the session
[19:39] <ahayzen> nik90, have fun creating the new clock its gonna be awesome :) ping me if u need help/reviews etc


[06:51] <duflu> camako: I'm kind of hoping we can add more fixes and performance improvements to RTM yet. You can see them targeted for a "0.5.1": https://launchpad.net/mir/+milestone/0.5.1
[06:52] <duflu> (it's the same set as is tagged rtm14)
[06:56] <camako> duflu, sounds good.. Though #1345533 is about hwc which tends to be device specific.
[06:57] <duflu> camako: *shrug* I don't have one of them to test with
[06:57] <camako> duflu, me neither :-)...
[06:59] <camako> duflu, also I wasn't sure about #1316867 since it has to do with DRM and rtm is android...
[06:59] <duflu> camako: Oh, yes. Worth having in a stable branch but not relevant to Android
[06:59] <duflu> Kinda.. It's relevant to all platforms. Just starting with DRM
[07:00] <duflu> But that one in 0.6 in time for utopic is enough
[07:00] <camako> duflu, also it has to do with the fatal_error branch which is causing controversy... :-)
[07:07] <camako> duflu, #1240909 would be nice but would like to see a solution in devel first.. Don't wanna hold up rtm for it... We can always backport...
[07:09] <duflu> camako: Well if you think there will be a 0.5.2 then no problem. Otherwise double buffering offers potentially the biggest performance improvement yet to land, so it's worth trying to get in ASAP
[07:09] <duflu> I mean the biggest improvement in responsiveness
[07:10] <camako> duflu, yeah +1 on the responsiveness!
[07:10] <camako> ... #1343074 has already been committed.
[07:11] <duflu> Because Ubuntu touch is 8-buffered (3 in the client + 3 in the nested server + 2 in the native server). The double branch will get that down to 6-ish
[07:11] <duflu> Minus 1 to calculate best case input lag. It's still not great
[07:12] <duflu> Hmm, could even be more. I'm not familiar with the Android page flipping we use
[07:13] <duflu> Actually, I confused the numbers. Lag is 2 + 2 + 1 = 5 right now.  The double branch gets that down to 1+1+1 = 3
[07:13] <duflu> Almost halved
[07:13] <duflu> Delay between client and screen will be at least 32ms less
[07:14] <camako> It's pretty significant.. No doubt..
[07:14] <duflu> And hopefully there are other unrelated improvements coming soon
[07:16] <duflu> Actually, I think we might be weeks away from out-performing Android on the same hardware
[07:16] <duflu> Just got to tweak some things
[07:17] <camako> duflu, @ releasing 0.5.2 and even beyond, I fully expect that to happen.... until the device receives a final image which is weeks away.
[07:17] <camako> the rtm device that is
[09:08] <alan_g> any more review comments for this? https://code.launchpad.net/~mir-team/mir/cursor-spike-phase-7-name-some-cursors/+merge/225242
[09:32] <alf_> duflu: @double, Could you elaborate on 115+ if (used_buffers > min_buffers() && max_buffers > 1), I am not sure I get the intent.
[09:33] <duflu> alf_: That's when the minimum requirement drops (framedropping turned off). That code pre-dates the same check now present in the framedropping toggle.
[09:33] <duflu> Might be redundant now
[09:33] <duflu> But still good to keep
[09:38] <alf_> duflu: wait, I think I may have completely misunderstood the MP... isn't this MP's goal to change the queue size depending on client demand? Or does it only change the queue when changing between non-framedropping and framedropping?
[09:38] <duflu> alf_: That is now the only indicator of demand
[09:38] <duflu> ... which is pretty new yes
[09:40] <alf_> duflu: so it just switches between a fixed size of 2 buffers for non-framedropping and 3 buffers when allow_framedropping(true) ?
[09:40] <duflu> alf_: Yes. Much simpler than earlier versions
[09:56] <alf_> duflu: Simpler, yes, but is it sufficient? The fixed 2 buffer queue reduces latency, but it also uncoditionally drops all the benefits triple buffering brings (like the ability to deal with frames occasional missing the frame time limit)
[09:57] <duflu> alf_: Yes, it is sufficient in all testing so far. There is an argument to make it configurable sure
[09:57] <duflu> alf_: Forgive me for preparing to go offline soon
[09:59] <alf_> duflu: Enjoy!
[10:25] <alan_g> camako: we've three MPs for 0.5 failing "mysteriously" in CI - is this something you're looking into?
[10:26]  * alan_g hopes to make 0.5 "someone else's problem"
[10:27] <camako> alan_g, yea I saw that... Sure I can look into it.
[10:28] <camako> alan_g, or more like ask fginther who recently prepared the jenkins config for 0.5
[10:30] <alan_g> camako: you can also try cihelp on #ubuntu-ci-eng (which will probably end up at fginther too)
[10:56] <ogra_> did you guys test the latest Mir and sysstem-compositor uploads on manta ? seems it is unbootable ...
[10:56] <ogra_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7829641/
[10:57] <ogra_> I/hwcomposer( 2071): Using 2560x1600 60Hz resolution for 'fb0' from modes list
[10:57] <ogra_> I/hwcomposer( 2071): unblank ioctl failed (display already unblanked)
[10:57] <ogra_> W/libEGL  ( 2071): eglTerminate() called w/ 1 objects remaining
[10:57] <ogra_> E/libEGL  ( 2071): validate_display:263 error 3001 (EGL_NOT_INITIALIZED)
[13:57] <davmor2> kgunn: you about?  Manta is broken since the landing of 0.5.0 by the look of it.  It gets to the google logo and no further.
[13:58] <kgunn> davmor2: i'm here, hmmm, is that news? i experienced that last week during our testing and i was told that was due to something else
[13:58] <kgunn> davmor2: it was on irc, i think i recall someone saying it had to do with telephony stuff (?)
[14:03] <alf_> kgunn: good to hear it's not just me, I though I had broken the device
[14:05] <davmor2> kgunn: it works fine in 136 pre 0.5.0 and then breaks in 137 http://paste.ubuntu.com/7829641/ and http://davmor2.co.uk/~davmor2/syslog  is the only info I have from it which seems according to ogra_ to point to egl
[14:06] <davmor2> kgunn: I only got back today so hit it testing something else.
[14:06] <davmor2> kgunn: also wouldn't the flo play up too if it was the telephony stack?
[14:06] <ogra_> kgunn, seems hammerhead broke at the same time ... i think they use the same driver
[14:06] <ogra_> (at least thats what rsalveti claimed (the brokeness))
[14:07] <kgunn> ogra_: not the same driver....in fact N7==N4 on driver
[14:07] <rsalveti> not the same driver, but could be broken the same way
[14:07] <ogra_> ok
[14:07] <rsalveti> bug 1345533 for hammerhead
[14:08] <rsalveti> no bots anywhere
[14:08] <ogra_> yeah, they went on a group vacation it seems
[14:08] <ogra_> super special group offer
[14:08] <rsalveti> davmor2: can you check /var/log/lightdm/unity-system-compositor.log
[14:08] <rsalveti> on the broken image
[14:08] <rsalveti> hahah
[14:09] <davmor2> rsalveti: sure give me a few
[14:09] <kgunn> interesting before egl failure in that log i see "I/hwcomposer( 1015): unblank ioctl failed (display already unblanked)"
[14:09] <kgunn> oh...that's just unblanking
[14:09] <kgunn> nvmd
[14:10] <ogra_> the next lines are more worrying
[14:11] <kgunn> ogra_: yeah, but it looks like egl succeeded...then its bailing subsequent
[14:11] <ogra_> right ... but we had no android changes during that time
[14:12] <ogra_> image 136 had an android update ...
[14:12] <ogra_> 137 had the new Mir ...
[14:12] <ogra_> the former image works flawless ... the latter doesnt
[14:13] <rsalveti>  /var/log/lightdm/unity-system-compositor.log will tell any mir specific error
[14:13] <davmor2> right guys back with you now
[14:17] <davmor2> rsalveti, kgunn: http://davmor2.co.uk/~davmor2/unity-system-compositor.log
[14:18] <rsalveti> right, similar but different
[14:18] <rsalveti> a bunch of calls are now triggering an exception in case of errors
[14:18] <rsalveti> in this case it's  display_on
[14:19] <rsalveti> on nexus 5 it was vsync_on
[14:19] <kgunn> camako: ^ you following?
[14:19] <rsalveti> so yeah, indeed mir causing the issue
[14:20] <camako> yeah
[14:20] <camako> kgunn
[14:22] <kdub_> hmm
[14:24] <davmor2> kgunn: if you and your team need info from a broken device just ping me as this manta now no longer turns off it will be available for logs etc if you need any that rsalveti didn't cover :)
[14:25]  * kdub_ can look, seems more important than the optimization stuff i was looking at this morning
[14:25] <kgunn> kdub_: thanks
[14:25] <kdub_> also though, I have to whine that we don't have a nexus 5, and only test the nexus 4 in CI
[14:25] <kdub_> :)
[14:25] <kdub_> so I'll poke around the n10
[14:25] <kgunn> kdub_: i keep forgetting your on CST now :)
[14:26] <kgunn> i was waiting to bother you cali time :)
[14:26] <kgunn> camako: i distinctly recall testing on manta....for mir0.5...did you ?
[14:27] <kgunn> camako: altho...not sure i tested post alan's add
[14:28] <camako> kgunn, not on manta
[14:29] <kdub_> MI is EST, I now get the jump on the texans!
[14:29] <kgunn> kdub_: oh wow...didn't realize that
[14:29] <kgunn> EST
[14:52] <kdub_> the problem is only on startup?
[14:52] <rsalveti> yes
[14:53] <rsalveti> hart to know if it'll happen later on though, as it's not even able to start
[14:53] <kdub_> I have an idea of what's going on
[14:53] <rsalveti> from what I saw in the diff the difference is that now those errors are critical
[14:53] <kdub_> working on confirming
[14:53] <rsalveti> which wasn't the case before
[14:53] <rsalveti> but they were always there
[14:54] <kdub_> right, I think that some restructuring changed it
[14:54] <rsalveti> right
[14:55] <kdub_> does the n4 have the problem?
[14:56] <AlbertA> kdub_: no it works fine here with mir 0.5.0
[14:56] <kdub_> ah, I have a very good idea then
[14:56] <rsalveti> nops
[14:58] <kdub_> bug yet too?
[14:58] <kdub_> if not i'll file one
[14:58] <kdub_> oh 1345533
[15:01] <rsalveti> that's for n5
[15:01] <rsalveti> for manta I'm not sure we have one
[15:01] <kdub_> probably same issue
[15:20] <davmor2> kdub_: n4 and n7 both work fine n10 and n5 seem to be hit by it
[17:12] <greyback> racarr__: hey quick confirmation form you: there's no api for a client to know its position on screen is there?
[17:20] <racarr__> greyback: Nope
[17:20] <greyback> racarr__: thanks
[17:23] <racarr__> np :)
[17:27] <racarr__> lunch
[17:37] <kdub_> davmor2, rsalveti : lp:~mir-team/mir/fix-1345533-0.5 has been checked on the nexus10, and will likely fix the n5 too
[17:38] <kdub_> but I don't think the mir team has a n5
[18:09] <davmor2> kdub_: nor do I over to rsalveti for that I think
[18:10] <kdub_> davmor2, ah, thought you had one, sorry
[18:11] <davmor2> kdub_: I have the n10
[18:18] <rsalveti> kdub_: will check n5 later today
[18:18] <rsalveti> do we have it in a silo or similar already?
[18:19] <rsalveti> just to be easier to grab the packages :-)
[18:20] <rsalveti> kdub_: not sure if that will fix n5 though
[18:20] <rsalveti> as the exception was a different one
[18:21] <rsalveti> or is display_on also triggering the vsync_signal_on?
[18:21] <rsalveti> if so, then yeah
[18:26] <AlbertA> rsalveti: right turn_screen_on() calls hwc->blank(...) and hwc->eventControl(..., HWC_EVENT_VSYNC,...)
[18:27] <rsalveti> great then :-)
[18:38] <davmor2> back to the are there packages available?
[18:43] <davmor2> kdub_: ^
[18:53] <AlbertA> davmor2: no not yet...
[18:53] <AlbertA> camako will probably set up the silo when he comes online
[18:58] <davmor2> AlbertA: ah cool thanks
[20:54] <kdub_> rsalveti, right, the fix should catch/ignore either problem (vsync/blank)
[20:57] <AlbertA> racarr__: ping
[20:58] <racarr__> AlbertA: pong
[20:59] <AlbertA> racarr__: is there a way to know if an input event has been handled on the nested case?
[20:59] <AlbertA> basically if I install a eventfilter
[20:59] <AlbertA> in the server
[20:59] <AlbertA> can a client in a nested scenario consume the event so that my filter doesn't run?
[21:00] <racarr__> sorry not quite parsing
[21:00] <racarr__> whhere is the filter? where is the client?
[21:00] <racarr__> (host/nested)
[21:00] <AlbertA> so imagine unity system compositor
[21:00] <racarr__> ok
[21:00] <AlbertA> installs an event filter
[21:00] <AlbertA> i.e. an append to the composite_filter
[21:01] <racarr__> ok that will be like the first thing ever
[21:01] <racarr__> to see events basically
[21:01] <AlbertA> ok
[21:01] <racarr__> before shell
[21:01] <racarr__> etc
[21:01] <AlbertA> so it's there a way for me to know if the a client like unity8, consumed a key event?
[21:01] <racarr__> except...lol I wonder if
[21:01] <racarr__> unity8
[21:01] <racarr__> input filters probably dont work in unity8 right now
[21:02] <racarr__> but not an urgent problem
[21:02] <racarr__> um no.
[21:02] <AlbertA> ok
[21:02] <racarr__> currently all events are handled
[21:02] <racarr__> there is some infrastructure for handling/not handling events
[21:02] <racarr__> but not on the client side
[21:02] <racarr__> there is also some design documentation that...we should one day have an accept/reject model
[21:02] <racarr__> do we need it?
[21:03] <AlbertA> well
[21:03] <AlbertA> it's for a minor thing
[21:03] <AlbertA> there's this power dialog
[21:04] <AlbertA> that shows up if you hold up the power key for 2s
[21:04] <AlbertA> but USC has policies
[21:04] <AlbertA> to shutoff display on power key up (after a power key down)
[21:04] <AlbertA> so we had to add hacks to ignore that if hits the 2s...etc
[21:04] <AlbertA> so that USC does not shut off display
[21:04] <racarr__> ah
[21:04] <AlbertA> and instead unity8 can show the power off dialog
[21:05] <racarr__> yeah
[21:05] <AlbertA> basically I would want an ack or something
[21:05] <AlbertA> that unity8 consumed power key up
[21:26] <racarr__> robert_ancell: wanted to let you know header with mir cursor names landed so you should be able to add gtk cursor support
[21:26] <racarr__> when...the fancy strikes you :)
[21:26] <robert_ancell> racarr__, nice. Are there plans for custom cursors too?
[22:06] <racarr__> robert_ancell: Yeah. it just needs protocol + add mir_cursor_configuration_from_rgba_pixels_function_names_are_so_long_:(
[22:06] <racarr__> etc
[22:07] <racarr__> next time I get bored + don't feel bad doing something that has no upcoming deadline lol


[20:14] <sakrecoer> luisbg: buenas noches! would you be able to grant the IRCC access to #ubuntustudio-es ? :)