[02:22] <duflu> That's unusual. A Jenkins task appeared on a community-contributed branch. But only after the branch got approved. Is that new?
[02:22] <duflu> It's a pleasant surprise
[14:39] <kdub> camako, with https://code.launchpad.net/~kdub/mir/no-bufferusage-in-rs/+merge/314699, might be good to clarify some plans/comments
[14:40] <kdub> I guess the point that's come up is the mirclient and platform-plugins point and the abis involved
[14:40] <kdub> with loading those plugins
[14:40] <kdub> like, the plugins are c++ abi, and they have access to the interfaces that make up the opaque mir types presented in the client api/abi
[14:43] <camako> kdub, ok I'll take a look today
[14:44] <kdub> camako, thanks, no rush of course


[04:46] <freeflying> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6362769/
[04:46] <freeflying> what could this be
[04:46] <freeflying> node trying to get boot image from maas
[04:53] <bigjools> freeflying: ummmm
[04:53] <bigjools> is the node still defined in maas?
[04:54] <freeflying> bigjools, no, this is a fresh installation of maas
[04:54] <bigjools> is anything actually broken?
[04:54] <freeflying> bigjools, cluster controller on a different server
[04:55] <freeflying> bigjools, not I can see so far besides this
[04:55] <bigjools> sorry I don't know what you mean
[04:55] <bigjools> my point is, this could be normal.  Ignoring the log file, is anything not working as it should?
[04:55] <freeflying> bigjools, the node can't get the boot image then
[04:56] <freeflying> bigjools, from the client console, what we can see after fail to boot is: Cannot locate configuration file
[04:56] <bigjools> well this is before that stage, it's getting pxeconfig
[04:56] <bigjools> right
[04:56] <freeflying> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6362441/
[04:56] <bigjools> so is the MAC correct?
[04:57] <bigjools> check all the detauls from the request in your server
[04:57] <bigjools> details*
[04:58] <jtv> http error?  I guess this'd be the pxeconfig code requesting node metadata from the API...
[05:00] <bigjools> jtv: no, it's asking for pxeconfig
[05:00] <freeflying> bigjools, yes from dhcp's dump, its the same mac addr
[05:00] <bigjools> oh sorry that's what you said, basically
[05:00]  * jtv unconfuses
[05:00] <bigjools> freeflying: is the MAC defined against any node in the database?
[05:01] <bigjools> something is causing a 404....
[05:01] <bigjools> and I suspect you edited something after the node enlisted?
[05:01] <freeflying> bigjools,  i think no
[05:02] <bigjools> freeflying: what are you doing here, enlisting, commissioning or installing?
[05:02] <freeflying> bigjools, we don't have anything enlisted so far, we just had maas configured, and try to enlist this one
[05:02] <freeflying> bigjools, trying to enlisting
[05:02] <bigjools> freeflying: is the cluster accepted ?
[05:03] <freeflying> bigjools, yes, i had it configured in web UI too
[05:03] <bigjools> did you enlist any other nodes yet?
[05:03] <freeflying> not yet
[05:03] <bigjools> so there's zero nodes in maas right now?
[05:03] <freeflying> bigjools, yes
[05:03] <bigjools> ok
[05:04] <bigjools> when the node enlists it should try to grab quite a few different pxeconfigs before finding one that exists
[05:04] <bigjools> it should end up at "default"
[05:04] <bigjools> since we don't know it yet
[05:05] <bigjools> so this output in the pserv log is normal as far as I know.  Can you send the rest of the log please?
[05:10] <bigjools> jtv: actually I think my problem is easy now - the func in maasserver.dns is the single call point I want
[05:10] <bigjools> I can inject more kwargs in there
[05:10] <jtv> Great.
[05:10] <bigjools> it just confused me because it was the same name, of course.
[05:14] <bigjools> freeflying: is your MAAS_URL correct?
[05:16] <freeflying> bigjools, yes
[05:16] <bigjools> freeflying: cam you show me?
[05:16] <bigjools> can*
[05:17] <bigjools> because it looks wrong in your log :)
[05:18] <freeflying> MAAS_URL="http://<IP_ADDRESS>/MAAS"
[05:19] <freeflying> this is from maas_cluster.conf
[05:20] <freeflying> in pserv.conf, its http:///MAAS/api/1.0/pxeconfig/
[05:20] <freeflying> i tried to use the exact ip addr in pserv.conf, but didn't work out
[05:22] <jtv> What about "localhost"?
[05:23] <freeflying> jtv, to me?
[05:25] <jtv> Yes — I don't see it making a big difference, but not having a hostname in that URL does look suspicious.
[05:27] <freeflying> jtv, but the region controller is not on this machine
[05:27] <jtv> Ah
[05:27] <jtv> Right
[05:27] <jtv> But then there definitely has to be a hostname part in that URL.
[05:28] <jtv> I guess the reason for your 404 log output is that the request is going to the wrong server...
[05:29] <freeflying> jtv, i tried with the API address too, didn't work out
[05:29] <jtv> Sounds as if you had a different problem originally, and created a second problem on top of it.
[05:30] <jtv> Do you know anything more than that it didn't work out?
[05:30] <freeflying> jtv, no
[05:30] <freeflying> jtv, weird, this time it works
[05:30] <freeflying> I mean node pxe boot up from maas
[05:30] <jtv> \o/
[05:30] <jtv> Right
[05:34] <bigjools> freeflying: did you fix pserv.conf?
[05:35] <freeflying> bigjools, re-configure it to use exact api url
[05:35] <bigjools> ok
[05:37] <freeflying> bigjools, jtv thanks for help
[05:37] <jtv> np
[05:43] <bigjools> jtv: do you know if we can catch undefined symbols in tempita?
[05:43] <bigjools> short of resorting to :py ...
[05:44] <bigjools> otherwise I am going to have to update all the damn callsites in tests :'(
[05:44] <freeflying> if a node stays commissioning status after doing commissioning, what could the reason be
[05:44] <jtv> Don't know, sorry.  Would be nice if there were a dedicated exception class, but...
[05:44] <freeflying> the server has been powered off
[05:44] <jtv> bigjools: make it default to <IP_ADDRESS>?  ;-)
[05:44] <bigjools> freeflying: it means it failed to contact the server, did you see anything on the console?
[05:44] <freeflying> after a while since we click commissioning from webui
[05:45] <bigjools> freeflying: and what else have you changed in other configs?
[05:45] <freeflying> bigjools, the other part I did was configure maas-dhcp server, add some other subnet into the file
[05:46] <freeflying> bigjools, configured import-pxe-files to only download precise's
[05:48] <jtv> I think commissioning will use Precise...  One thing that may have happened though is a failure while downloading the ephemeral image.  It's huge.
[05:49] <jtv> Any chance of a look at the node's console?
[05:50] <freeflying> jtv, on it, windows xp crashed :)
[05:50] <freeflying> and the kvm works under widows only
[05:51] <jtv> Losing your host will do it...
[05:51] <freeflying> :)
[05:53]  * jtv grabs a break


[00:30] <jnbek> quick question zequence do u know when Ardour 3 will be added to UbuStudio?
[00:31] <zequence> jnbek: 13.10
[00:31] <dlumberg> is anyone else missing the screensaver settings in the manager?
[00:31] <dlumberg> in 13.04
[00:31] <zequence> It was released a bit too late for us to include it with 13.04, which is now almost at beta2, which means no changes but critical bug fixes
[00:32] <holstein> jnbek: i just went to the ardour site, and downloaded it for 12.04 with no issues..
[00:32] <dlumberg> xfce4-settings-manager*
[00:32] <zequence> dlumberg: Did you look through the menus?
[00:33] <jnbek> holstein: ya, I know that, I can do that too. :-P I was just asking when that would have to not happen anymore :D
[00:34] <dlumberg> zequence: I just clicked all of them and didn't see screen saver anywhere
[00:35] <zequence> dlumberg: I have it
[00:35] <dlumberg> hrmmm...
[00:35] <zequence> dlumberg: In Settings Manager, from the "Settings" menu
[00:35] <zequence> This is on the live DVD
[00:35] <zequence> Beta 1
[00:35] <dlumberg> I'm on beta2
[00:36] <zequence> We don't have a beta 2 yet :)
[00:36] <zequence> I think it's building right now
[00:36] <dlumberg> how do I check my flavor of ubu?
[00:37] <zequence> flavor, or milestone? You can't check the milestone. It's really just a snapshot, called by a name
[00:38] <zequence> The flavor is more of a set of packages, that you install from the installation media. Really, all the flavors are Ubuntu
[00:38] <zequence> Just with different set of packages
[00:39] <dlumberg> yeah... I had an xubuntu at some point but I'm pretty sure I installed ubuntustudio
[00:39] <dlumberg> so milestone I guess
[00:40] <dlumberg> README.diskdefines: #define DISKNAME  Ubuntu-Studio 13.04 "Raring Ringtail" - Alpha amd64
[00:40] <zequence> I don't know what would mess up the Settings Manager
[00:40] <zequence> Maybe you uninstalled something?
[00:41] <dlumberg> is there a way to tell form the live usb?
[00:42] <dlumberg> from*
[00:42] <zequence> dlumberg: You could ask about that on #ubuntu-release. I have never tried to find out
[00:42] <zequence> gotta go for a bit. Need to do some bug reporting
[00:42] <dlumberg> kk, thx
[02:34] <len-1304> dlumberg, The screen saver on studio is set to "blank only" by default. However it is possible to change it to a screen saver or have it go through the available ones randomly.
[02:36] <len-1304> The setup is in settings->Settings Manager->Screen saver. There is a button called "Mode" that is defaulted to "Blank Screen Only".
[02:36] <len-1304> Clicking on that will give other options.
[02:41] <len-1304> Be warned, there have been video drivers with memory leaks that the screen saver uses where most other audio SW does not.
[02:42] <dlumberg> I don't have a sceensaver option in setting mgr
[02:42] <len-1304> When I tried to use a non-blank Screen saver,  I found that over night I was into swap hell.
[02:42] <dlumberg> may be something i did when i ported to this build...
[02:42] <len-1304> dlumberg, Really, Hmm, I am using ubuntustudio 13.04 it is here.
[02:46] <len-1304> Do you by chance have xscreensaver-gnome installed?
[02:49] <dlumberg> hang on... I'll to a dpkg list
[02:51] <dlumberg> xscreensaver					deinstall
[02:51] <dlumberg> xscreensaver-data				install
[02:51] <dlumberg> xscreensaver-gl					install
[02:51] <dlumberg> xserver-common					install
[02:52] <dlumberg> and gnome-screensaver				install
[02:53] <dlumberg> I think i get get what's happening... gnome screensaver is pooping on my happiness
[02:53] <len-1304> So it says xscreensaver is installed
[02:53] <len-1304> Ya the two are one or the other
[02:54] <len-1304> the gnome version would put the setup into the gnome setup manager not the xfce one.
[02:54] <dlumberg> yep
[02:54] <len-1304> (that may be about the only difference)
[02:55] <dlumberg> I did a get-selection set-selections when I migrated so that prolly did it
[02:55] <dlumberg> thx
[02:55] <len-1304> No problem.
[03:55] <Alexis> Hola
[03:55] <Alexis> hi
[03:56] <Guest92789> HOla
[03:56] <Guest92789> HI
[03:56] <Guest92789> HOlaaaa
[03:57] <holstein> Guest92789: yes.. hello.. feel free and ask if you have a question
[03:57] <Guest92789> How download themes?
[03:58] <holstein> Guest92789: i just search "themes" in a package manager.. you can use any XFCE/xubuntu themes.. and the themes will have documentation
[03:58] <Guest92789>  How do I download cute themes?
[03:58] <Guest92789> some subject I recommend
[03:58] <Guest92789> :)
[03:59] <holstein> Guest92789: i would search for whatever you like.. "cute" is a matter of opinion, and i assure you, i have not searched for any "cute" themes for xfce
[04:03] <prompt32> when a make something in hydrogen in lets say 120 bpm, when i use ardour after, it changes my bpm. How can i set this not happen ?
[04:51] <Guest21473> HI
[04:52] <Guest21473> Another emulator faster than Wine?
[04:53] <Guest21473> HI?
[04:54] <Guest21473> hello
[04:55] <prompt32> hi
[04:57] <Guest21473>  Another emulator faster than Wine?
[05:02] <prompt32> ubuntu studio is not to running widows ...
[05:02] <prompt32> what kind of prog to run ?
[12:06] <chesco> hey, Is here anyone who know where I should ask concern microcode problem ? I got failed message with microcode amd-ucode thanks in advance
[12:11] <chesco> just installed amd64-ucode, will now check what ill have to do
[20:10] <gustavo> hello


[06:03] <didrocks> good morning
[07:07] <MacSlow> greetings everybody
[07:18] <htorque> good morning! which component is responsible for drawing (or getting the data for) the progress bar on the nautilus launcher item?
[07:21] <RAOF> htorque: I'm not sure, but I'd guess it'll be the unity compiz plugin, with libunity for the client-side communication.
[07:23] <htorque> RAOF: thanks. it seems to draw the progress bar in the wrong direction, so i guess "unity" is affected anyways: http://img.xrmb2.net/images/149883.png
[07:37] <didrocks> htorque: indeed, it's unity
[07:38] <htorque> didrocks: thanks. no bug report found, so i'll open one. :)
[07:38] <didrocks> sure :)
[08:49] <kamstrup> didrocks: https://launchpad.net/zeitgeist-extensions/trunk/0.0.11 should fix the buggers
[08:50] <didrocks> kamstrup: you are eating versions like buns! Trying to race with chrome? :-)
[08:50] <didrocks> kamstrup: do you have the bug # fixed?
[08:51] <kamstrup> didrocks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/zeitgeist-extensions/+bug/722762
[08:52] <didrocks> kamstrup: only this one? all the rest are duplicates, isn't it?
[08:52] <kamstrup> didrocks: yeah, just dupe hunting right now :-)
[08:52] <didrocks> kamstrup: excellent, trying this and pushing :)
[08:53] <kamstrup> didrocks: hold on I have a handy test script for you...
[08:53] <didrocks> kamstrup: oh nice! :)
[08:54] <kamstrup> didrocks: kill zg and run http://paste.ubuntu.com/682426/ and restart zg... this should trigger a reindex because of missing cjk metadata
[08:55] <kamstrup> and this was one particular place the race is very likely to occur
[08:55] <seif> didrocks, we should have the return of kamstrup celebrated as a ubuntu holiday
[08:55] <didrocks> seif: I agree, less than a week he's back and he already triggered a critical bug! what a score :-)
[08:55] <didrocks> kamstrup: trying trying ;)
[08:57] <didrocks> kamstrup: what should be sys.argv[1]? zeitgeist?
[09:04] <seif> strupday :P
[09:04] <seif> didrocks, sounds good right
[09:09] <didrocks> kamstrup: ok, it worked (no crash), but as I didn't get the issue on Friday… let me push that, thanks!
[09:10] <kamstrup> didrocks: ah, sorry sys.argv[1] should be ~/.local/share/zeitgeist/fts.index, but I also tested it numerous times here; and I could in fact reproduce it before this patch
[09:11] <didrocks> kamstrup: great! ;)
[09:57] <seif> kamstrup, u rock
[09:58] <Andy80> good morning!
[10:02] <Andy80> mardy: hi :)
[10:02] <mardy> Andy80: hi :-)
[10:04] <Andy80> mardy: a little question about your last comment. how do I delete the ref at the end? Using g_object_unref (but please note that m_nautilusIface is a Qt object) or using a "delete" in the destructor?
[10:05] <mardy> Andy80: use delete; or, if the QDBusInterface takes a "QObject *parent" parameter, you can pass "this" to it, so you don't need to worry about deletion
[10:06] <Andy80> mardy: let me check...
[10:07] <Andy80> mardy: yes, it should support it: 	QDBusInterface ( const QString & service, const QString & path, const QString & interface = QString(), const QDBusConnection & connection = QDBusConnection::sessionBus(), QObject * parent = 0 )
[10:08] <mardy> Andy80: good, then just append "this" as last parameter, and that should do the trick
[10:16] <Andy80> mardy: committed/pushed :) p.s: the line is not exactly 80 chars or it would have splitted in 5 lines... there are even longer lines than mine :P anyway I splitted a bit
[10:32] <kamstrup> seif: check twitter, I am on a roll today! ;-)
[10:53] <kamstrup> mhr3: I have fixed a range of races and other oddities in zg fts trunk. Maybe you wont need ForceReindex() after all ;-)
[11:40] <mhr3> kamstrup, now that would be awesome, but let me test that first :)
[11:41] <kamstrup> mhr3: indeed. you probably already have your own ways to trigger this, but if not I posted some hints on how in the two bugs I tweeted
[11:46] <mhr3> kamstrup, btw is the new fts backwards-compatible?
[11:46] <kamstrup> mhr3: yes
[11:46] <mhr3> i mean will it work if i upgrade now without the xapian patches?
[11:47] <mhr3> if it will, we can just package it and throw to synapse users
[12:06] <mhr3> kamstrup, ^^?
[12:09] <Andy80> a quick question: are you aware of this regression in Oneiric: using the dash, once you have found (for example) "Text Editor", you cannot select it using TAB?
[12:13] <kamstrup> mhr3: yes, it should work with and without the xapian patches
[12:13] <kamstrup> Andy80: hmmm don't know - but arrow keys definitely work...
[12:14] <kamstrup> njpatel: ^^ ?
[12:14] <njpatel> gord, ^^^
[12:16] <gord> :(
[12:17] <Andy80> kamstrup: let me try arrows...
[12:17] <gord> looks like a bug with nux, tab is broken
[12:17] <mhr3> kamstrup, and will it upgrade properly if one is to use the new version now and later upgrade to oneiric? :)
[12:18] <kamstrup> mhr3: yes
[12:18] <kamstrup> mhr3: you should be able to ix and match any way you choose
[12:18] <Andy80> kamstrup: uhm... they work (arrows) only if you first press arrow-down then you move with left-right... I think it's a regression.
[12:19] <kamstrup> Andy80: I think gord just volunteered to fix it ;-)
[12:19] <Andy80> kamstrup: perfect :)
[12:20] <Andy80> kamstrup, gord: same thing also happens in Unity-2D, if it's not too hard, I can see how you fix it in Unity and apply the same method to Unity-2d, just let me know :)
[12:20] <mhr3> kamstrup, ok then
[12:52] <njpatel> kamstrup, forgot to ask, did you have any luck with python and libunity? Did the sample port over okay?
[12:54] <kamstrup> njpatel: i've been hunting down bugs in zg-fts ever since I opened my editor to hack on the Python lens sample
[12:54] <kamstrup> njpatel: but I think I have it under control now :-)
[12:54] <kamstrup> so python lens slowly bubbling back up to top prio :-)
[12:55] <njpatel> kamstrup, heh, sweet
[12:55] <njpatel> I might end up playing around with it tonight too, i Need to get something ready for the app devel week thing tomorrow
[12:55] <njpatel> weird capitalisation there
[12:55] <kamstrup> njpatel: hehe :-D
[12:56] <kamstrup> njpatel: i'll grab some tea and then be on it
[13:04] <njpatel> thanks dude
[14:02] <kamstrup> njpatel: there seems to be some magic incantations I miss for unity to pick up my .lens file...
[14:03] <njpatel> kamstrup, do a dance
[14:03] <kamstrup> njpatel: I have /usr/share/unity/lenses/sample/python.lens
[14:03] <kamstrup> njpatel: or must the .lens be names as the parent dir?
[14:03] <njpatel> yep
[14:03] <njpatel> $lens_id/$lens_id.lens
[14:03] <kamstrup> trying
[14:04] <kamstrup> sudo mv /usr/share/unity/lenses/{sample,python}
[14:04] <kamstrup> bracket expressions is TEH awesome
[14:04] <njpatel> heh
[14:19] <kamstrup> njpatel: I have something working here!
[14:19] <njpatel> woohoo!
[14:19] <kamstrup> njpatel: but I also managed to segfault unity ;-)
[14:19] <njpatel> waaaa?
[14:19] <njpatel> :)
[14:19] <kamstrup> njpatel: yeah, I know!? unity is bug free so it must be a bug in g++
[14:20] <njpatel> kamstrup, exactly!
[14:20] <kamstrup> njpatel: on a related note... I can't open files from the files lens
[14:20] <kamstrup> njpatel: nothing happens when I click them
[14:21] <njpatel> kamstrup, the files lens should be getting the activate trigger, is it printing out anything?
[14:21] <njpatel> it seems to work okay here
[14:21] <njpatel> although I do need to upgrade to latest O
[14:22] <kamstrup> njpatel: odd... now it works again
[14:22] <kamstrup> darn gremlins
[14:22] <njpatel> heh
[14:23] <njpatel> maybe input issues?
[14:23] <njpatel> or do you get the prelight square etc?
[14:27] <kamstrup> njpatel: just for ref I am pushing my stuff here as I go along lp:~unity-team/unity-lens-sample/unity-place-python
[14:28] <kamstrup> still some work before it makes sense, but it is "runnable" if you know *exactly* how to deploy it ;-)
[14:29] <njpatel> kamstrup, heh, awesome dude, will check it out after I'm done breaking, er fixing, the dash
[14:31] <davidcalle> njpatel, kamstrup, on a related note, is it possible to activate something like "xdg-open file://somefile" from a python lens?
[14:36] <kamstrup> davidcalle: it should be, but no one has tried it yet :-)
[14:39] <kamstrup> davidcalle: you normally don't want to use xdg-open from a Python program - use something like Gio.AppInfo.launch_default_for_uri("http://google.com", None) instead
[14:39] <kamstrup> it'll "do the right thing"
[14:39] <davidcalle> kamstrup, nice
[14:39] <njpatel> indeed, I was just looking for the pythonic version of that call :)
[14:39] <kamstrup> davidcalle: and the None param can be a Gio.LaunchContext you can use to control which desktop it's spawned on and such, but normally the default is ok
[14:44] <kamstrup> Anyone knows why ewe reject to run 'unity --advanced-debug' from a gnome-terminal and insist on a tty?
[14:45] <kamstrup> it sucks because the nvidia drivers really don't like switching to a tty all that much
[15:19] <oier_> question: in Oneiric should the indicators that want to draw attention turn green or blue?
[15:20] <om26er> njpatel_, Hi there is a bug 839200 where unity will hand and wont start at all on a netbook and maybe other resolutions
[15:21] <om26er> this happens on un-maximing the dash
[15:21] <njpatel_> wow
[15:21] <njpatel_> om26er, will investigate
[15:21] <njpatel_> assigned it to myself
[15:21] <om26er> njpatel_, cool, i'll assign it to you then.
[15:22] <davidcalle> oier_, I believe that blue is now being used to indicate a new communication. Red for a warning requesting user action.
[15:22] <njpatel_> done :)
[15:23] <oier_> I maintain an indicator, should the natty version turn green and the oneiric version blue?
[15:23] <davidcalle> oier_, and if I recall correctly, green is for availablity/success
[15:23] <ephan> om26er, I thought you weren't coming to IRC today, but it's good to see you here
[15:23] <davidcalle> oier_, which indicator?
[15:23] <oier_> indicator-bug
[15:24] <om26er> ephan, internet became stable after I knocked their heads on the call ;-)
[15:24] <ephan> cool
[15:24] <davidcalle> oier_, isn't blue being used for the messaging-menu on natty? Don't remember.
[15:25] <oier_> green in natty for messaging menu
[15:25] <oier_> it was changed for oneiric
[15:34] <andyrock> JohnLea, blacklisting a cd-rom makes everything harder to do... but not problem i will find the best solution
[15:34] <andyrock> :)
[15:35] <JohnLea> andyrock; thx!  Btw do you agree that some people may not want their CD rom to appear in the Launcher?
[15:35] <ephan> The Unity source code changed a lot since I last browsed it two weeks ago, time to update myself.
[15:37] <andyrock> JohnLea, of course... But blacklist a cd-rom can mean: "blacklist all the cd-roms" or "blacklist just one cd-rom e.g. Ubuntu 11.10 Beta 1 cd-rom"
[15:37] <jbicha> I prefer to have all mount points (CDs, USB, or just partitions) only show in the Files app
[15:38] <andyrock> and what happens if there are more than one cd-rom readers?
[15:38] <andyrock> jbicha, at the moment you can hide all device icons from ccsm
[15:39] <andyrock> i'm working to remove this option but you can easily blacklist one or more (or all) devices
[15:40] <jbicha> yes, it was just especially annoying in Natty when the default icons would overflow the launcher on netbooks or even laptops
[15:41] <andyrock> jbicha, even it natty you can hide this icons but you should use gsettings (or dconf-editor for a gui)
[15:42] <jbicha> andyrock: I never use ccsm ;-)
[15:42] <JohnLea> andyrock; Per CD as this is more in line with how we treat other removable storage?
[15:43] <JohnLea> andyrock, note the item 3 in the bug description that covers the difference between ejecting storage and removing it from the Launcher
[15:44] <andyrock> JohnLea, so if i blacklist "Ubuntu 11.10 Beta 1" cd-rom and then I insert another cd-rom "Debian..." this cd-rom should be shown?
[15:45] <JohnLea> andyrock; yes, but what are your thoughts on this?
[15:48] <andyrock> JohnLea, well blacklisting per CD is more in line whit the other devices but i'm not sure that exist a method in gio to identify a single cd-rom
[15:48] <andyrock> a single partition has an uuid
[15:49] <andyrock> i'm thinking: do you know /etc/fstab?
[15:50] <JohnLea> andyrock; if you can't identify specific CD roms it's ok to go with the other option of removing the specific CD rom drive.  But it would be better to do it on a CD by CD basis if possible.
[15:51] <andyrock> JohnLea, we can use the device name but is't errors prone... I mean: what happens if there are two different devices with the same name both without an uuid?
[15:51] <andyrock> let me think, btw i will try to do it
[15:52] <JohnLea> andyrock; good luck, thx! ;-)
[15:52] <andyrock> JohnLea, btw i really like this design :)
[15:52] <JohnLea> ;-)
[16:19] <andyrock> JohnLea, we can use the same format of mount command
[16:20] <andyrock> so we can blacklist by LABEL UUID
[16:20] <andyrock> or by name (/dev/sda)
[16:21] <andyrock> using the gui we can blacklist just the label and the uuid
[16:21] <andyrock> something like it: if the device has an uuid blacklist his uuid
[16:22] <andyrock> if a blacklist has not an uuid (e.g. cd-rom) blacklist his label
[16:23] <andyrock> power users can be able to blacklist devices by name
[16:23] <andyrock> e.g. /dev/sdc1 to blacklist all CD-ROMs
[16:23] <andyrock> naturally editing properly the blacklist file
[16:42] <JohnLea> andyrock; sounds good ;-)
[17:42] <jono> RAOF, you working today?
[17:43] <jono> RAOF, oops, wrong nick, sorry
[20:19] <andyrock> JohnLea, ping
[20:34] <andyrock> JohnLea, about https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/841941 i need more info about the correct behavior. The virtual drives should be treated as removable drives or un-removable ones?
[20:35] <andyrock> so a un-removable drives is shown on the launcher otherwise it is blacklisted (read unpinned)
[20:36] <andyrock> a removable drives is shown on the launcher if isn't blacklisted and afterall if it's connected
[20:37] <andyrock> a virtual drive (ftp://...) can be both a un-removable drives and a removable drives
[20:37] <andyrock> *drive
[20:38] <andyrock> i mean
[20:38] <andyrock> it's anun-removable drive becuase it's virtual...
[20:40] <andyrock> but it's alo a removable drives because once it can be umount
[20:40] <andyrock> the problem is:
[20:40] <andyrock> the un-removable drive can be easy listed
[20:41] <andyrock> the virtual drive cannot be easy listed (each uri on the Internet can be a virtual drive =) )
[20:42] <andyrock> finally, i need detailed as possible info or the license to decide :)
[21:05] <Cimi__> andyrock: Trevinho : I think I found a bug in the dropdown menus
[21:05] <Cimi__> Trevinho: do you know where's the code for them?
[21:05] <Cimi__> Trevinho: I think the menu is shifted 1px on the left
[21:06] <andyrock> Cimi, dropdown menus? do you mean launcher quicklists?
[21:06] <Cimi> andyrock: menubar and indicators
[21:06] <Cimi> andyrock: they look aligned, because I added an offset in the menuitem
[21:07] <Cimi> andyrock: but my feeling is that the dropdown menu is shifted 1px on the left
[21:07] <andyrock> Cimi, ok... so do want to know where the dropdown mene is drawn right?
[21:08] <Cimi> andyrock: yep
[21:09] <andyrock> Cimi, i think that it's drawn in unity-panel-service
[21:10] <andyrock> but we decide the postion
[21:10] <andyrock> in PanelInidcatorObjectEntryView.cpp (or something like this)
[21:11] <andyrock> mmm... i've just found this
[21:11] <andyrock>  proxy_->ShowMenu(GetAbsoluteX() + 1, //cairo translation
[21:11] <andyrock>                      GetAbsoluteY() + PANEL_HEIGHT,
[21:11] <andyrock>                      time(NULL),
[21:11] <andyrock>                      nux::GetEventButton(button_flags));
[21:11] <andyrock> the "+1" is weird...
[21:13] <Cimi> andyrock: yep
[21:13] <Cimi> andyrock: without looking at the code, I imagined it
[21:13] <andyrock> you rock we know :)
[21:13] <Cimi> lol
[21:46] <mhr3> Cimi sees the code
[21:46] <mhr3> it's like matrix :)
[21:46] <Cimi> lol
[21:46] <Cimi> in matrix
[21:47] <Cimi> he can see a beautiful blonde girl in a red dress
[21:47] <Cimi> I'm still not able to do that
[21:47] <mhr3> Cimi, just open a browser ;)
[21:47] <Cimi> but that's not code :D
[21:48] <mhr3> the end result is what matters, no? :)


[00:01] <jdub> anyone working on the kernel freeze (possibly related to wireless) issue with hardy? i have a useful petri dish of varying hardware presenting the symptom.
[00:33] <lifeless> jdub: -19 ?
[00:35] <jdub> yeah
[13:56] <rtg> cking: you around? Can you comment on bug #153702 since you have one of the affected machines?
[13:58] <cking> rtg: will do.
[14:01] <cking> rtg: I did the same workaround ida_generic_ide for #153702 - is this classed as a legitimate fix or is this a call for more investigation for a better solution?
[14:02] <rtg> cking: Amit was curious what the parameter actually does. Is there a downside to it?
[14:02] <cking> rtg: These I don't know - I will investigate and comment.
[14:02] <mjg59> Yes, it means that you're driving it as a generic ATA device
[14:04] <cking> mjg59: which could imply some performance hit?  My experience with this hardware is that it can move data to/from the disc reliably and fairly fast
[14:04] <mjg59> Yes, performance hit and reduced functionality
[14:04] <mjg59> What does lspci -n give you when booted with the bios in ide mode?
[14:05] <rtg> mjg59: my fuzzy notion of what that means is that in IDE mode it does not participate in SATA topology discovery, link state, and other stuff.
[14:06] <mjg59> It's probably less of an issue with the chipset in IDE mode to begin with
[14:06] <mjg59> Since ata_piix provides a smaller set of features to begin with
[14:06] <mjg59> You're probably limited to the timings set up by the BIOS, though
[14:11] <mjg59> I'd be interested to know which driver is binding to the chipset
[14:12] <rtg> cking: ^^
[14:14] <cking> mjg59: 00:1f.2 IDE interface: Intel Corporation 82801IR/IO/IH (ICH9R/DO/DH) 4 port SATA IDE Controller (rev 02) (prog-if 8f [Master SecP SecO PriP PriO])
[14:15] <mjg59> cking: Can I have lspci -n as well?
[14:16] <cking> mjg59: I mail you
[14:19] <rtg> cking: I have the same Inspiron 530, but it shows a different controller: 00:1f.2 RAID bus controller: Intel Corporation 82801 SATA RAID Controller (rev 02), 00:1f.2 0104: 8086:2822 (rev 02)
[14:20] <rtg> Perhaps thats why I've not seen this issue.
[14:20] <mjg59> rtg: Yeah, that'll happen if you boot in RAID mode
[14:20] <mjg59> If you flick the switch in the BIOS it should be identical to Colin's
[14:21] <rtg> but the bug report is about _not_ being able to sense the drives in non-RAID mode, but I know this one works both ways.
[14:21] <cking> rtg: I need 5 mins to get a monitor added to the server - it's remotely located at the moment.
[14:22] <cking> rtg: "works" meaning "does not need the all_generic_ide" boot option?
[14:24] <rtg> cking: right. I'm cranking up my laptop cause this session is on the Dell 530 (which will go away when I start messing with BIOS options)
[14:42] <cking> rtg_: IDE mode definitely requires the all_generic_ide option, where as RAID does not
[14:44] <rtg_> cking: switching mine between RAID/IDE seems to have trashed the MBR. Now it can;t find a boot device in either mode. shit, that is my dev box.
[14:44] <cking> as for performance, some quick dd tests show: write: IDE 51.1 MB/s, RAID: 51.4 MB/s,  read: IDE 65.0 MB/s RAID: 64.5 MB/s
[14:45] <cking> rtg_: not good.
[14:45] <cking> rtg_: so there is little difference between RAID and IDE modes - apart from crapping up your system in the process of testing
[14:46] <rtg_> cking: indeed. please add that to the bug report :)
[14:46] <cking> will do
[14:47] <cking> rtg_: hope you get your dev box sorted asap
[14:49] <rtg_> cking: thats just great. all of the ISO's for Hardy on the drives I can't get to. 60 minutes to download...
[14:50] <cking> rtg_: 60 minutes - that's lame speed
[15:09] <rtg> cking: stupid BIOS. some futzing around restored the boot.
[15:10] <cking> rtg: it's kinda worrying that a BIOS can be so flakey
[15:11] <rtg> cking: I could boot if I chose F12 and went through the boot menu. I ended up having to change boot device  priority settings
[15:37] <rtg> smb_tp: are you taking care of adding the HVR950Q driver for LUM ?
[15:38] <smb_tp> rtg: yes
[15:38] <smb_tp> rtg: I opened bug 231628 for tracking
[15:38] <smb_tp> bug 241628
[15:39] <mkrufky> thanks for that :-)
[15:39] <rtg> smb_tp: thanks. I'm just going through the kernel team mailing list requests to make sure I don't forget something.
[15:39] <smb_tp> rtg: Np, I am also on the AC-BAT stuff from Yong
[15:40] <rtg> smb_tp: great, thanks.
[15:40] <mkrufky> there was another driver to be added also -- i sent it to mike frey and asked him if i should also send to kernel-team ... he said he'd just commit it and ask you guys to pull ...  but if you want to take a look, it is at: http://linuxtv.org/~mkrufky/lum/add-sms1xxx-to-lum.patch
[15:41] <rtg> mkrufky: is it of general use to the distro kernel? Or just MID style devioces?
[15:41] <mkrufky> general use
[15:41] <smb_tp> mkrufky: at the moment it would be better to post on the list. just to have a better reminder
[15:41] <mkrufky> ok, no prob
[15:44] <rtg> mkrufky: if these drivers are not already in 2.6.26 you should hassle BenC to put them in the Intrepid package.
[15:44] <smb_tp> rtg: I just pushed the changes for bug241229 but since the nomination seems to be pending I am not sure where to place the progress
[15:45] <mkrufky> rtg they are not in 2.6.26 ....  the hvr950q driver *is* in 2.6.26, but its missing some usb ids and some performance tweaks
[15:45] <rtg> smb_tp: mark it "Fix committed", subscribe ubuntu-sru, nominate it for Hardy, and write up the SRU justification in a comment.
[15:45] <mkrufky> rtg: when it comes to intrepid, i think it would be easier for me to send in patches against upstream to sync intrepid kernel -- is that cool?
[15:46] <mkrufky> er, came out wrong... ie:  the hvr950q fixes for intrepid would be easier for me if i could just patch the kernel, rather than LUM
[15:46] <rtg> mkrufky: you're too late for that. 2.6.26 is the kernel Intrepid will settle on. right now you'll be pressed to get your drivers into 2.6.27.
[15:46] <mkrufky> ok, no prob
[15:47] <mkrufky> i'll get them into 2.6.27.  and i can probably get the performance tweaks and usb vid:pid updates into 2.6.26.y -stable
[15:47] <rtg> mkrufky: as for patching the kernel, we prefer to keep the kernel as close to upstream as possible. wholesale changes (like new drivers) are going into a different directory.
[15:47] <BenC> mkrufky: If you are adding drivers to intrepid, we don't want them in the same place as upstream would have them
[15:48] <BenC> mkrufky: we'll have them in the ubuntu/ subdirectory
[15:48] <rtg> mkrufky: for Intrepid, the ubuntu/ subdirectory is the equivalent of Hardy LUM.
[15:50] <mkrufky> to clarify:
[15:51] <mkrufky> in 2.6.26, the au0828 xc5000 and au8522 drivers are already merged
[15:51] <mkrufky> but, the 2.6.26 versions are missing some patches, such as usb id's and some small performance tweaks
[15:52] <mkrufky> so, i will try to get those into 2.6.26.y -stable ... if that doesnt work out, then we'll have to do LUM ....  however, LUM poses a problem in this case, since 2.6.26 has OTHER drivers that also depend on xc5000.ko
[15:52] <mkrufky> we'll have linking problems if we provide a new xc5000.ko
[15:52] <rtg> mkrufky: patching an existing driver is much less of an issue.
[15:52] <mkrufky> ....and ^^ that is what i meant.
[15:52] <mkrufky> :-)  ok, cool then
[16:01] <mkrufky> sms1xxx patch email sent
[16:04] <BenC> mkrufky: patching an existing driver should be limited though...large amounts of patching would mean instead, putting the patched driver in ubuntu/ and disabling the in-kernel one
[16:05] <mkrufky> BenC: so far the delta is very small
[16:05] <rtg> mkrufky: perf tweaks and PCI ID updates should be OK.
[16:06] <mkrufky> BenC: if it gets larger, we can move the au8522 / au0828 to ubuntu/  but we cant do that to xc5000 in intrepid.  actually, right now the xc5000 sumbitted for LUM is identical to upstream, but I plan to rev it over the weekend with some power management fixes.
[16:07] <mkrufky> ...and it will probably be about a week or so before I submit those patches -- the power management stuff will need good testing here first before i submit anywhere :-)
[17:06] <BenC> cjwatson: were you able to look at makedumpfile? I need it in main because linux-meta deps on it, and I'll also need it as a build-dep for linux
[17:13] <cjwatson> BenC: I'll have to do a main inclusion review on the spot for it - need to take Benedict over to his dad's now though
[17:15] <BenC> cjwatson: ok, no rush, since this is all post-alpha-1
[17:32] <BenC> yet another time I wish dpkg diversions supported directories
[17:33] <rtg> BenC: would your fix your permissions in /srv/kernel.ubuntu.com/git/ubuntu/ubuntu-dapper.git ?
[17:34] <rtg> the usual BS
[17:45] <BenC> rtg: done
[17:45] <rtg> BenC: thanks. dapper abi's pushed
[17:45] <BenC> rtg: maybe a good idea to copy that pre-receive hook to the rest of our trees
[17:46] <BenC> it's in ubuntu-intrepid.git/hooks/
[17:46] <rtg> BenC: yep
[17:46] <rtg> BenC: I'll do it as long as I'm messing with the ABI uploads.
[18:01] <lamont> dear linux-meta.  why does ppc not get linux-image-server love?
[18:01] <lamont> :-)
[18:28] <rtg> BenC: and again for /srv/kernel.ubuntu.com/git/ubuntu/ubuntu-gutsy.git
[18:36]  * lamont grumbles at bug 241726
[18:36] <lamont> full dmesg output is at davis:~lamont/dmesg
[18:43] <rtg> lamont: what's a windfarm?
[18:45] <elmo> rtg: the thermal/fan subsystem for Xserves
[18:46] <elmo> at least in the powerpc era - I don't know if the Xeon based ones still use it
[18:46] <rtg> elmo: yeah, I figured it out as soon as I looked at dmesg
[18:47] <rtg> elmo, lamont: looks like it might be a macintosh specific driver.
[18:47] <elmo> it is
[18:47] <rtg> elmo: which might be incompatible with powerpc64-smp ?
[18:47] <elmo> rtg: nope
[18:48] <elmo> rtg: or, rather, it use to work
[18:48] <elmo> in dapper + edgy
[18:48] <rtg> elmo: I'm checking. I seem to remember some issues with smp-64
[18:51] <mjg59> It's used in the G5s, as well
[18:51] <mjg59> It's certainly meant to be SMP-compatible
[18:54] <rtg> mjg59: right - I'm looking at moduels.dep. It looks like its not loading one of the sensor modules correctly, e.g., PM81, PM91, or PM112.
[18:54] <rtg> which would pull in windfarm_core
[18:55] <rtg> elmo: do you know which of those sensor modules davis is supposed to use?
[18:57] <elmo> therm_pm72
[18:57] <elmo> I guess
[18:57] <elmo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/21645/
[18:57] <elmo> ^-- same machine, running dapper
[18:58] <rtg> elmo: well davis has therm_pm72 as well
[18:58] <elmo> yeah
[18:59] <elmo> I've no idea if the output is a problem or not, it just stood out
[18:59] <rtg> elmo: hmm, there is also no winfoarm module installed on ross.
[19:00] <elmo> hmm
[19:00] <elmo> the temperature sensors also claim the cpu is running at 11 degrees
[19:00] <elmo> which seems unlikely
[19:01] <mjg59> My recollection is that the fans will run full-on without windfarm loaded
[19:01] <elmo> that sounds entirely plausible
[19:01] <elmo> 'cos those xserves are probably the loudest piece of equipment we have
[19:02] <mjg59> And beahve more sanely if it is
[19:04] <elmo> fwiw
[19:04] <elmo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/21648/
[19:05] <elmo> I was able to modprobe those on ross
[19:05] <rtg> elmo, mjg59: here's the deal. therm_pm72 is adding i2c drivers at load time, but none of the i2c drivers seem to depend on windfarm_core (which has the missing symbols wf_register_control, etc);
[19:05] <elmo> whether or not they actually helped with the fans is harder to tell
[19:05] <elmo> the others said 'ha ha no such hardware'
[19:07] <rtg> elmo: can you try 'modprobe -r therm_pm72; modprobe windfarm_core; modprobe therm_pm72'
[19:08] <elmo> on davis?
[19:08] <rtg> elmo: sure
[19:08] <elmo> FATAL: Error inserting windfarm_core (/lib/modules/2.6.24-19-powerpc64-smp/kernel/drivers/macintosh/windfarm_core.ko): No such device
[19:09] <rtg> elmo: but no missing symbols. It just couldn't find the i2c device that it liked.
[19:10] <elmo> rtg: it could on ross though
[19:10] <rtg> elmo: lemme figure out what windfarm_core is bitching about.
[19:12] <elmo> k
[19:12] <elmo> it's not super important btw, I'm pretty sure it's not melting the hw
[19:12] <rtg> elomo: how about this comment in windfarm_core: '/* Don't register on old machines that use therm_pm72 for now */'
[19:12] <elmo> and if it did; I'm definitely not sure if I'd care ;-)
[19:13] <elmo> rtg: hmm, could be I guess
[19:13] <elmo> benh would know for sure
[19:13] <rtg> you mean BenC ?
[19:13] <elmo> no, benh
[19:14] <rtg> don't know him
[19:14] <elmo> Benjamin Herrenschmidt
[19:14] <rtg> oh, he the author :)
[19:15] <rtg> elmo: so aside from the annoyance in dmesg, it looks like the default is OK since the fans come on full?
[19:15] <elmo> rtg: assuming they are on full yes
[19:15] <elmo> rtg: but I can't easily tell that from here.  but I'll let you know if the machine explodes over the weekend ;-)
[19:16] <rtg> elmo: no problem, then I'm back to what I was doing.
[20:21] <BenC> rtg: You've done this before...how do you upload to a ppa?
[20:22] <rtg> I use dput with a .dput.cf file
[20:22] <BenC> what's the stanza in  your .dupt.cf?
[20:22] <rtg> [my-ppa]
[20:22] <rtg> fqdn = ppa.launchpad.net
[20:22] <rtg> method = ftp
[20:22] <rtg> incoming = ~timg-tpi/ubuntu/
[20:22] <rtg> login = anonymous
[20:22] <rtg> allow_unsigned_uploads = 0
[20:22] <BenC> rtg: thanks
[20:28] <ChickenCutlass> rtg: were you able to find the DVB driver commit in the netbook tree?
[20:29] <rtg> ChickenCutlass: after some pain, yes. I just pushed it to the LUM repo.
[20:29] <ChickenCutlass> rtg: sorry -- did I not do the commit correctly
[20:30] <rtg> ChickenCutlass: who is to say, I'm not really a git expert. Was origin/abi-18 a branch name?
[20:31] <ChickenCutlass> rtg: yes
[20:31] <rtg> ChickenCutlass: I kind of fumbled my way through it.
[20:32] <ChickenCutlass> rtg: I typically create a new branch based on an ubuntu kernel tag then make my changes
[20:32] <rtg> ChickenCutlass: exposing the SHA1 commit ID so I could cherry-pick was the hard part. I couldn't seem to get that syntax right.
[20:32] <ChickenCutlass> rtg: ah ok
[20:34] <rtg> ChickenCutlass: I finally had to create a branch in my local tree with the same name, fetch from the remote, cherry-pick, switch back to master, then rebase against abi-18
[20:34] <ChickenCutlass> rtg: ugly
[20:35] <rtg> ChickenCutlass: it seems that a lot of git stuff is done the ugly way :)
[20:35] <ChickenCutlass> rtg: right -- only the strong survive
[20:37]  * BenC stares in wonder at the ppa
[20:37] <BenC> You guys are gonna love this shit
[20:37]  * BenC implemented a last-good-boot infrastructure so you will always have a safe kernel to boot into
[20:38] <rtg> never again will I boot to a blank screen?
[20:38] <BenC> rtg: well, never again will you upgrade to a new kernel, and not have a known good one to reboot to if that one fails
[20:39] <BenC> e.g. if you have only one kernel installed, and you upgrade to a same ABI kernel...you still have one kernel, and it might not boot
[20:39] <BenC> this mechanism will make sure that doesn't happen
[20:39] <rtg> BenC: does the user have to make a grub choice?
[20:40] <BenC> I'm not sure it can guarantee that things like same-upgrade nvidia breakage wont keep it broken (e.g. userspace libraries mixed with wrong version of kernel modules)
[20:40] <BenC> rtg: For now, yes...but I'm hoping to add some magic to detect a failed boot, boot to last-good, and pop up something on the desktop saying "Blah blah, you failed last time, you are in a safe mode now"
[20:41] <BenC> but with something better than "safe mode" to call it
[20:41] <rtg> BenC: won't that depend on being able to mount a file system?
[20:42] <BenC> what do you mean?
[20:42] <rtg> I was just thinking about the detection for a failed boot.
[20:42] <BenC> well, it will require at least mucking with a boot record for grub to notice it
[20:43] <BenC> I'm not sure how it will come together, but I'm going on the assumption that I can make it work
[20:43] <rtg> isn't Colin training to be a grub expert?
[20:43] <BenC> for now, just the ability to keep a last booted kernel around is golden
[20:43] <BenC> rtg: yeah, this may be a good task for him
[20:48] <BenC> Anyone want to add: "deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/ben-collins/ubuntu intrepid main" to their apt sources.list, install and let me know if it works for them
[20:48] <BenC> I've only tested on one machine :)
[20:49] <BenC> you will have to do a reboot to get the first last-good-boot setup, but then it should work after that
[20:49] <BenC> unfortunately, grub fails to build on amd64, so it will only work for i386 for now
[21:09] <BenC> pgraner: ping
[21:39] <munckfish> BenC: I'm running the misc/getabis script in the ports source. It's failing. I've updated it so it builds the correct URL (was using 'linux' instead of 'linux-ports')
[21:39] <munckfish> BenC: but now I notice there are no linux-image-* packages in their for the 1.2 upload
[21:39] <munckfish> there are kernel-image-*di*
[21:40] <munckfish> Any idea what's wrong there?
[21:43] <munckfish> BenC: this is my patch for it so far http://paste.ubuntu.com/21667/
[21:43] <munckfish> here's where I'm hoping it'll find em http://ports.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-ports/pool/main/l/linux-ports/
[21:44] <BenC> munckfish: are you looking on ports.ubuntu.com?
[21:44] <munckfish> yes
[21:44] <munckfish> see url above
[21:45] <BenC> munckfish: hmm...for some reason, someone put them in universe
[21:45] <BenC> which makes zero sense
[21:46] <BenC> http://ports.ubuntu.com/pool/universe/l/linux-ports/
[21:46] <munckfish> hmmm
[21:46] <munckfish> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/powerpc/linux-image-2.6.25-1-powerpc64-smp/2.6.25-1.2
[21:46] <munckfish> yep it says universe there
[21:46] <munckfish> weird
[21:46] <munckfish> :S
[21:47] <munckfish> oh, or is that a sarcastic way of saying that's deliberate?
[21:48] <trainpic> I have a question about madwifi drivers
[21:49] <trainpic> I was under the impression that they are included in restricted-modules, but someone told me that they aren't included at all
[21:49] <trainpic> I'm fairly sure they are, and I'm sure someone here knows
[21:49] <rtg> trainpic: they are in LRM as of feisty.
[21:49] <trainpic> If they are, when will the latest version be in?
[21:49] <trainpic> OK
[21:50] <munckfish> BenC: so shall I just update the getabis script to look there as well as the other 3 urls it already does? Cause I presume they aren't going to move now.
[21:50] <trainpic> When will the version with support for the AR242x be in?
[21:50] <trainpic> I have to manually compile it for each kernel
[21:51] <rtg> trainpic: have the madwifi folks released a mainstream version that supports it?
[21:51] <trainpic> Yes, that is what I downloaded and compiled.
[21:51] <trainpic> I'm not sure what version it is, and madwifi.org is having problems right now
[21:52] <rtg> if I remember correctly, the last version was 0.9.4
[21:52] <rtg> what have you built?
[21:52] <trainpic> The version in Ubuntu supports the chipset under 32bit, but I run 64bit and need the latest
[21:52] <trainpic> let me check
[21:53] <munckfish> BenC: I've just realised I don't actually know how to specify whether something should go into universe or main. I presume it's about which ftp site the package source is uploaded to.
[21:53] <munckfish> BenC: if so, how can half of the packages from the same source end up in the wrong section
[21:54]  * munckfish is utterly confused :S
[21:54] <rtg> munckfish: each package is defined in debian/control under its own 'Section:'
[21:54] <trainpic> I think it was 0.9.4
[21:54] <trainpic> Whatever it was had AR242x support under 64bit, and was mainstream
[21:55] <trainpic> I would check the website but it isn't responding
[21:55] <munckfish> rtg: yep, says 'devel', or 'base' etc
[21:55] <munckfish> rtg: but not 'main' or 'universe'
[21:55] <rtg> trainpic: 0.9.4 is what is in LRM.
[21:56] <trainpic> Hm... maybe it wasn't mainstream yet then. Again, wish the site was up so I could be sure. I know for a fact that what's in LRM doesn't support the AR242x under 64bit :-(
[21:56] <rtg> munckfish: thats the root of your problem. I'd help, but I'm late already. gotta go.
[21:56] <munckfish> rtg: ok np c ya
[22:00] <pgraner> BenC: pong
[22:03] <munckfish> BenC: patched to look in that location too now (http://paste.ubuntu.com/21674/)
[22:03] <munckfish> I'll send this into the mailing list if you like


[19:52] <gsilvapt> hello all
[19:53] <kyrofa> Hey there gsilvapt
[19:59]  * kenvandine waves
[20:00] <kenvandine> time for this month's loco council meeting
[20:00] <gsilvapt> hey kyrofa and kenvandine
[20:01] <kenvandine> rollcall: Letozaf_ gsilvapt kenvandine krofa kyrofa nhaines
[20:01] <nhaines> _o/
[20:01] <kyrofa> Hey folks
[20:02] <wagafo> Here wagafo from Catalan Loco Team
[20:02]  * kenvandine wonders who krofa is :)
[20:02] <kenvandine> #startmeeting 20181210
[20:02] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Dec 10 20:02:25 2018 UTC.  The chair is kenvandine. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[20:02] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[20:02] <kenvandine> kyrofa: i had that in my meeting script...
[20:02] <gsilvapt> howdy!
[20:02] <kenvandine> hi wagafo!
[20:03] <nhaines> wagafo: thanks for coming.  :)
[20:04] <kenvandine> Letozaf_ hey
[20:05] <kenvandine> #chairs Letozaf_ gsilvapt kenvandine kyrofa nhaines
[20:05] <Letozaf_> hi everyone :)
[20:05] <kenvandine> #topic CatalanTeam
[20:06] <gsilvapt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CatalanTeam/ReVerificationApplication2018
[20:07] <kenvandine> wagafo: looks like your team has been pretty active
[20:07] <kenvandine> at least you love to party :)
[20:07] <gsilvapt> indeed, I'm happy to see an application like this
[20:07] <kyrofa> Agreed, I'm impressed
[20:08] <wagafo> We haven't missed a release since 2006 I believe
[20:08] <wagafo> Our record was 18.04, we had it in Barcelona, Palma (Mallorca) and Foios (Valencia)
[20:09] <nhaines> That impressed me!  :)
[20:09] <wagafo> It wa a nice tour, I was in all three places
[20:09] <kenvandine> awesome!
[20:10] <wagafo> Actually it was not in Barcelona, but Tarrega, a small city about 120 km from Barcelona
[20:10] <wagafo> The other two are right
[20:10] <kenvandine> great to see such an active loco
[20:11] <nhaines> I like that you are plannng a Free Software with Ubuntu course at a university.
[20:11] <wagafo> Our forum I think is one of the most active ones of the ones for Loco hosted in Ubuntu Forums
[20:11] <gsilvapt> This is hard to have anything against to say :P
[20:12] <Letozaf_> you are doing a great job, indeed
[20:12] <kenvandine> active mailing list and forum as well
[20:13] <wagafo> It's nice also because we had some young people joining recently, like aniolgarcia who is around here
[20:14] <wagafo> I want to thank the hard work of our Loco contact and coordinator, rafael_carreras
[20:15] <nhaines> His hard work is clearly paying off, along with the work of everyone else in your LoCo.
[20:15] <nhaines> Do you see any issues for the LoCo in the upcoming year?
[20:15] <kenvandine> we're sorry we couldn't review this last month
[20:16] <wagafo> The main problem I guess is to keep interest in Ubuntu and assistance to our actiivities, but this must be the case for all Loco teams. We usualy don't have problems to get venues for our install parties, there is always interest somewhere
[20:18] <nhaines> Well, the best cure for that, I think, is active events, and you are surely doing a good job there.
[20:19] <wagafo> I guess so, but we always discussing how to get more and better difussion to our activities
[20:20] <wagafo> We have also a Telegram group to coordinate, and we have bridged it tou our IRC channel, so now there is also more activity there
[20:20] <kenvandine> #vote CatalanTeam re-verification
[20:20] <meetingology> Please vote on: CatalanTeam re-verification
[20:20] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname)
[20:20] <Letozaf_> +1
[20:20] <meetingology> +1 received from Letozaf_
[20:20] <kenvandine> #voters Letozaf_ gsilvapt kenvandine kyrofa nhaines
[20:20] <meetingology> Current voters: Letozaf_ gsilvapt kenvandine kyrofa nhaines
[20:20] <kenvandine> +1
[20:20] <meetingology> +1 received from kenvandine
[20:20] <kyrofa> =1
[20:20] <kyrofa> Uh
[20:21] <kyrofa> +1
[20:21] <meetingology> +1 received from kyrofa
[20:21] <nhaines> +1 Please keep up the incredible work.
[20:21] <meetingology> +1 Please keep up the incredible work. received from nhaines
[20:22] <kyrofa> Did we lose gsilvapt?
[20:22] <kenvandine> gsilvapt?
[20:23] <kenvandine> gsilvapt: welcome back, mind voting?
[20:24] <gsilvapt__> sorry about that. Too many things plugged in :)
[20:24] <gsilvapt__> Are we voting already?
[20:24] <kenvandine> gsilvapt__: yes
[20:24] <gsilvapt__> +1 for me
[20:24] <kyrofa> Yes, but you might want to change your nick
[20:25] <gsilvapt> +1
[20:25] <meetingology> +1 received from gsilvapt
[20:25] <gsilvapt> Daium :P
[20:25] <kenvandine> #endvote
[20:25] <meetingology> Voting ended on: CatalanTeam re-verification
[20:25] <meetingology> Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[20:25] <meetingology> Motion carried
[20:25] <nhaines> Congratulations, Catalan Team.  And thank you, rafael_carreras, for a month's worth of patience!
[20:25] <kenvandine> keep up the excellent work!
[20:25] <kyrofa> Thanks wagafo, congratulations!
[20:25] <wagafo> Thanks guys and gals, keep up the wonderful job you do!
[20:25] <gsilvapt> Thank you for all your work
[20:26] <wagafo> Thanks
[20:26] <Letozaf_> Thank you for your good work
[20:28] <kyrofa> I think that's it for the agenda, any open items?
[20:29] <nhaines> I don't believe so.
[20:30] <kenvandine> nope
[20:30] <kenvandine> i think we're done
[20:31] <kenvandine> thanks everyone!
[20:31] <gsilvapt> Thank you everyone
[20:31] <Letozaf_> yw
[20:31] <kenvandine> i'll update the wiki for next meeting as well as the launchpad team for catalan
[20:31] <gsilvapt> ok, thanks kenvandine
[20:31] <kenvandine> #endmeeting
[20:31] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Dec 10 20:31:44 2018 UTC.
[20:31] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2018/ubuntu-meeting.2018-12-10-20.02.moin.txt


[00:01] <penguin42> ah
[00:01] <penguin42> vintage videos
[00:09] <diddledan> o_O citizens' advice are moaning about line rental charges for broadband service - they say it's a hidden cost not mentioned in advertising.
[00:10] <diddledan> surely it's accepted that if you have a phone line then you pay for it
[00:10] <ali1234> it is a hidden cost tho
[00:10] <ali1234> i don't want to make or receive phone calls
[00:10] <diddledan> not really. I can get sky broadband without paying them for line rental
[00:11] <diddledan> if I get my phone line from someone else then I pay them not sky
[00:11] <diddledan> so sky's advertising would be correct in it's costs
[00:11] <ali1234> for example zen internet
[00:12] <ali1234> £27* monthly charge for Unlimited Fibre 1 + £16.99* monthly charge for line rental
[00:12] <ali1234> OR £32.40* monthly charge, when Unlimited Fibre 1 is ordered without line rental (and then you also pay BT 16.99 line rental)
[00:12] <ali1234> guess what price they advertise
[00:13] <diddledan> well surely the hidden cost there is not the line rental but having it without paying the line rental to them
[00:13] <penguin42> diddledan: I'm on virgin cable; I have a flat monthly fee for brroadband, I don't have a separate line rental
[00:13] <diddledan> penguin42: I think you're highlighting the wrong person :-p
[00:14] <diddledan> penguin42: I was moaning that CAB were complaining about something which I don't think is accurate
[00:14] <penguin42> diddledan: I think it's a valid moan
[00:15] <penguin42> diddledan: EE have big signs up in their shop for 'Free broadband for EE customers' - and then you ask and they say 'ah yes, you need to pay the line rental'
[00:15] <diddledan> but you'd have to pay line rental to have broadband with any bt-bourne supplier
[00:16] <diddledan> having a fixed-line phone costs money
[00:16] <penguin42> diddledan: Why does it?
[00:16] <diddledan> because someone has to supply the service
[00:16] <penguin42> diddledan: and so how do you split the broadband cost and the line rental cost - to the consumer they don't need to worry about who is supplying each part; they worry about the bill at the end of the day
[00:16] <diddledan> your virgin is case in point - you don't pay line rental for a phone because your broadband isn't phone-cable-bourne
[00:17] <penguin42> diddledan: But there's a cable involved and infrastructure, I don't pay a separate cable fee and then broadband cost
[00:17] <diddledan> no, but you also don't have a phone service
[00:17] <ali1234> you used to when it was NTL
[00:17] <penguin42> diddledan: I could get a phone service from them if I wanted to
[00:18] <diddledan> no phone service, no charge. have a phone service have a charge. simple.
[00:18] <diddledan> the problem isn't about "hidden costs" as the CAB claim - it's that you are required to have a voice service to be connected into the broadband network
[00:18] <penguin42> diddledan: But Sky/etc's total costs have many components - why do they call out just the line entry?
[00:19] <penguin42> diddledan: No you are NOT required to have a voice service to have broadband
[00:19] <diddledan> penguin42: only if you get virgin
[00:19] <penguin42> diddledan: No
[00:20] <penguin42> diddledan: There are ISPs who on BT equipment make the voice separate; BT charge them separately
[00:20] <diddledan> my point is for a bt line you need to pay a line-rental. moaning that is pointless
[00:21] <diddledan> it doesn't matter who makes the final bill out, someone has to pay bt for the line. the fact you have broadband on-top of that line isn't BT's fault.
[00:21] <penguin42> diddledan: but it's just one wholesale component - like the cost to run a call centre or the bandwidth they buy off anyone else, and the line rental charges aren't all the same
[00:23] <diddledan> I fail to see what you're trying to argue
[00:23] <penguin42> diddledan: I'm saying that the price they advertise should be the bottom line figure that a customer has to pay to get it
[00:23] <penguin42> diddledan: including everything
[00:23] <diddledan> I'm moaning that the CAB are moaning about line rental being a "hidden cost" when it isn't
[00:23] <penguin42> I'm saying that they it is being hidden
[00:23] <diddledan> but it isn't
[00:23] <penguin42> it is
[00:24] <diddledan> you don't have to pay sky for your line rental to have sky broadband
[00:24] <penguin42> you see these big banners with 'only £... a month' and then you have to compare everything else
[00:24] <diddledan> sky list the charges they will make
[00:24] <diddledan> sky don't care what your line rental costs when you're paying BT directly
[00:24] <penguin42> diddledan: but the amount each company charges for BT line rental isn't the same
[00:25] <penguin42> diddledan: Oh hang on, not all these companies expect you to pay BT for a BT line, some of them it all goes through the ISP
[00:25] <diddledan> so you shop around for the cheapest BT line. then you shop around for a broadband to go on-top
[00:25] <penguin42> diddledan: No, it doesn't work like that
[00:26] <penguin42> diddledan: You can't mix line rentals from different companies with broadband from different companies
[00:26] <diddledan> yes you can
[00:26] <penguin42> diddledan: If you could then I'd agree
[00:26] <diddledan> simplest example is BT phone line paid to BT and AAISP as your broadband
[00:27] <penguin42> diddledan: OK, but what about AA supplied BT copper pair and AA as your ISP
[00:27] <penguin42> diddledan: No voice
[00:28] <penguin42> diddledan: I'm pretty sure you can't order that off AA and then get sky to do the broadband
[00:29] <diddledan> eww @ huge moth
[00:29]  * penguin42 hands diddledan a huge slipper
[00:31] <diddledan> lol @ how that can be read: 'Satya Nadella, chief executive, said: "Our approach to investing in areas where we have differentiation and opportunity is paying off with Surface, Xbox, Bing, Office 365, Azure and Dynamics CRM Online all growing by at least double-digits."' <-- double digits - they've got 10 new customers
[00:33] <penguin42> diddledan: http://aaisp.net/broadband-prices.html says 'You can pay us for a phone line, per phone line, or pay someone else, e.g. BT, if you prefer.   / " You can get rid of it but the service is still the same price"   / "Isn't that illegal under EU law?"
[00:42] <diddledan> awilkins: yeah virgin have a weird pricing scheme
[00:43] <diddledan> hmm
[00:43] <diddledan> he done died?
[00:43] <penguin42> nod
[00:43]  * penguin42 just has the virgin broadband
[00:43]  * diddledan hides mr stabby
[00:43] <diddledan> ditto
[00:43] <diddledan> I moved from sky phone + sky broadband + sky tv + sky movies to just virgin broadbent
[00:44] <diddledan> 152Mbit ftw
[00:44]  * penguin42 is on the bottom notch
[00:44] <penguin42> 50Mbitish
[00:44] <diddledan> yeah - that's still faster than standard fttc on a bt line
[00:45] <diddledan> 40 is the base model there
[00:45] <penguin42> I think they advertise 70Mbps fttc on some - but I can't get fttc here
[00:45] <diddledan> and for some reason they top out at 76 when the carrier is actually capable of 80
[00:46] <penguin42> perhaps you have slightly wider bits down there
[00:46] <diddledan> lol
[00:48] <penguin42> diddledan: Down at the 50Mbps rate the cost to get the TV is quite a bit
[00:52] <diddledan> the twitter I posted just now - internet-connected infotainment system in jeeps can be used to remotely control the vehicle, but to fix it an owner needs to download a patch and manually apply it - why can't it download the patch itself?!
[00:53] <diddledan> it's connected to the net so it is capable
[00:53] <diddledan> I'm still waiting for the day when you're driving along the motorway at 70 and the car decides to reboot for a patchfix
[00:53] <penguin42> good question, perhaps it's not supposed to be able to get to any of the firmware via the net
[00:55] <diddledan> well the hackers can steer the car from the internet. I hardly see it as a big leap to suggest that the thing can use that connection to update itself
[00:55] <diddledan> the big question is why the infotainment system is even connected to the steering wheel and brakes
[00:56] <diddledan> (they can disable the brakes)
[00:56] <penguin42> because they share a CANbus
[00:57] <penguin42> diddledan: It's pretty common, people have been warning about it for many years
[00:57] <diddledan> I don't know what one of those is
[00:57]  * diddledan googles
[00:57] <penguin42> diddledan: Digital bus for cars and other control systems
[00:57] <penguin42> diddledan: so they dont have to run a separate wire for every item
[00:58] <diddledan> don't you love this sentence?: "The software security update, provided at no cost to customers"
[00:58] <diddledan> I bleeding well would hope it is free!
[00:58] <penguin42> yeh look how greatful you should be
[00:59] <diddledan> "do you care about your family? are you worried that hackers can kill you? dial 1-800-DONT-HACK and our helpful advisors will guide you through the payment and installation of the required security patch"
[01:00] <diddledan> "note, failure to apply the patch may result in your death."
[01:00] <diddledan> "the company can not be held liable for defects in the patch"
[01:00] <diddledan> "or your death"
[01:00] <penguin42> you see the demo I'd do with it would be to get 50 of them doing a choreographed routine in a huge parking lot somewhere
[01:00] <diddledan> lol
[01:00] <penguin42> or maybe 500
[01:01] <diddledan> hijack randoms off the road to do so
[01:01] <penguin42> well, personally I wouldn't
[01:01] <diddledan> (as they're innocently driving past)
[01:03] <diddledan> "here comes one now. penetrate it's firewall and tag the driver so we can follow his porn"
[01:03] <diddledan> or some other hollywoodism
[01:04] <diddledan> speaky of which, I've got some csi:cyb0r to watch
[01:05] <diddledan> oh, and apparently hacking an adultary website is deemed cyber-terrorism now
[01:05] <diddledan> (well the adultery site seems to think so)
[01:12] <shauno> that's a weird one.  they're easy to laugh at due to the nature of the site, but if you ignore that part, it's starts sounding pretty evil
[01:14] <diddledan> seems they had a sevice that you could pay them $20 to have your data deleted, but they didn't do the deletion?
[01:15] <diddledan> I wonder if they comply with EU data-protection law that requires businesses to delete data when requested (I don't know whether the EU requires this service to be free, but I would expect so)?
[01:17] <diddledan> I seen some funny comments about the possibility of it being an inside job - to the effect that they are complaining about someone violating their trust when that's their entire premise
[05:52] <mappps> hi all
[06:58] <diplo_> Morning
[06:58] <bashrc_> morning
[07:16] <MooDoo> morning all
[07:48] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[07:48] <MooDoo> morning mate
[07:49] <brobostigon> morning MooDoo
[07:50]  * brobostigon walks around the room showing everyone proudly his new pebble.
[08:10] <davmor2> Morning all
[08:12] <brobostigon> morning davmor2
[08:13] <davmor2> diddledan, MooDoo: An oldie today for Some reason I couldn't shake the YMCA out of my head this morning :)
[08:38] <foobarry> android 5 stock doesn't have a call blocker :(
[08:48] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Hammock Day! 😃
[08:48] <bashrc> ZZZzzz
[08:58] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[08:58] <bigcalm> A hammock would be nice
[09:03] <davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o28LTvbyiT4
[09:04] <davmor2> A song for all occasions, that's me :)
[09:10] <MooDoo> howdy bigcalm davmor2
[09:11] <davmor2> MooDoo: Morning me owld mucka did you sort out your ssh issue?
[09:18] <zmoylan-pi> we need a new hammock with facilities for keyboard and charge point :-)
[09:20] <popey> bigcalm: pebble time?
[09:20] <popey> er, brobostigon pebble time?
[09:21] <MooDoo> davmor2: nah, still can't login, not to worry it's a vm i can rebuild it only had a MC server on it, had a gluster problem last night deleted everything glad I just backed up my qcow2 files :D
[09:22] <brobostigon> popey: pebble steel, and my gf is getting my original red pebble, we decided when she offered to get me a new one, pebble time was too expensive.
[09:23] <popey> steel has longer battery life than time, righT?
[09:24] <brobostigon> time has a digger battery than the older og/steel pebble.
[09:24] <brobostigon> bigger*
[09:24] <popey> oh, you didnt get a pebble time steel?
[09:24] <popey> you got an old pebble?
[09:25] <brobostigon> time steel is even more expensive, than the plain time,
[09:25] <popey> sure, it's newer :)
[09:25] <popey> and colour \o/
[09:26] <brobostigon> my theory is, i think she wanted me to have a smarter watch, hence og steel, rather than the 80's throwback as it has been described the plain og pebble.
[09:29] <bashrc> apparently, pebbles don't contain heart monitors
[09:29] <brobostigon> that they dont.
[09:30] <bashrc> I was reading a while ago that if you combine heart rate and motion it might be possible to detect sleep phases
[09:30] <brobostigon> a haeart monitor is a gimmick, all examples i have seen, dont work properly, if you want something with that function, get something more specialised for the job/
[09:31] <shauno> mine seems to work fine
[09:31] <brobostigon> which smartwatch and OS?
[09:32] <shauno> apple on os2beta4
[09:32] <bashrc> it would be nice to do things like having clothing or jewelry change colour or pattern depending on your temperature and heart rate
[09:32] <brobostigon> shauno: i see.
[09:33] <bashrc> and I suppose the logical site to measure heart rate is on a watch (pulse)
[09:33] <popey> the pebble time has a port that additional bits can be added to, such as this
[09:35] <brobostigon> i have been thinking about ideas, to do with that port on pebble time.
[10:04]  * zmoylan-pi pictures some sort of sensor attached to gloves to count the punches required in hand to hand combat on public transport... :-p
[10:05] <brobostigon> lolz.
[10:06] <zmoylan-pi> though you could do that with just the acceleramoter if it has one...
[10:07] <brobostigon> which most do, yes.
[10:07] <zmoylan-pi> you'd only need it for the arm not wearing a watch... :-)
[10:08] <brobostigon> a wii controller in the right hand.?
[10:09] <zmoylan-pi> those are expspensive to replace and the straps may not prevent it leaving you hand if all those pics of broken tvs are to be believed :-)
[10:10] <brobostigon> good points.
[10:11] <zmoylan-pi> cheaper to use a  prepay android phone in your fist linked to the pebble...
[10:11] <zmoylan-pi> just make a bubble wrap case :-)
[10:12] <brobostigon> bounce, bounce.
[10:12] <brobostigon> bounce,
[10:12] <brobostigon> splat.
[10:13] <shauno> http://www.knucklecase.com  ?
[10:13] <zmoylan-pi> if only the pebble could talk to nokia dumbphone.  that might qualify as a weapon though if used in fist during fight... :-)
[10:14] <brobostigon> zmoylan-pi: the basics of communicating with the pebble is fairly straightforward, i am sure if someone wanted, sw could be designed for it.
[10:14] <zmoylan-pi> problem is that the nokia dumbphones don't multitask so you'd need a very low level program written for it.  could be done but so expensive it never will
[10:16] <intrbiz> well, that was a PITA, en_gb not existing by default "to save disk space"
[10:19] <davmor2> intrbiz: on what?
[10:20] <intrbiz> ubuntu 14.04 LTS, having to run 'locale-gen' was somewhat unexpected
[10:20] <intrbiz> coupled with the error message not being logged
[10:22] <davmor2> intrbiz: anything in /var/crash/
[10:23] <intrbiz> nah, wasn't a crash, merely the init scripts not logging the output of pg_ctl, so had to manually start to find the problem
[10:24] <davmor2> intrbiz: it should log it somewhere, I've no idea where like but it should :)
[10:36] <shauno> ugh.  someone keeps jumping on my name the moment I disconnect.  utter pain.
[10:37] <ujjain> Password is expired, but I can log in via private key, but another user can't?
[10:44] <ujjain> The users don't even have a password set and are said their password is expired, errr.
[10:45] <shauno> they're often the same thing
[10:45] <shauno> "no password" can be either a blank password, or a locked account.  locked usually just means putting the expiry date in the past
[10:46] <davmor2> shauno: or locking the account
[10:49] <shauno> sometimes I forget why I don't like helping with flossy stuff.
[11:34] <zmoylan-pi> but if you have a problem with an 8" floppy drive shauno is your mammal :-p
[11:57] <ujjain> alcohol is probably bad when you are recovering from a cold, right? there's this nice thing, but I have to be in shape for a festival Friday too
[11:57] <ujjain> shauno, it's not locked, it's expired,
[11:57] <ujjain> i'll try to figure it out later, I thought if yo uuse private keys, shouldn't be affected,
[12:54] <davmor2> popey: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQC7dweRTKU
[13:01] <mappps> fun
[13:01] <mappps> apartment viewing
[13:01] <mappps> 2 apartments ..hopefully be able to get it done quickly
[13:13] <ujjain> chage says Password expires: Jul 07, 2015 ... but there is no password even in /etc/shadow... aaargh
[13:13] <ujjain> then why "You are required to change your password immediately (password aged)"...
[13:23] <dwatkins> ujjain: booze will probably impede the immune system
[13:24] <ujjain> yeah, I guess bettter to recover, although some days get a bit boring
[13:27] <daftykins> if you find days are boring without drinking, you may have bigger problems than a cold ;)
[13:34] <shauno> well, we were all thinking it, so someone had to
[13:39] <ujjain> uh, we have a team outing today
[13:39] <ujjain> it's always a lot of fun
[13:39] <ujjain> staying home many days in a row is less fun, for a few days is fine though
[13:42] <dwatkins> our team outing is in the middle of my holiday, so I can't go :'(
[13:43] <daftykins> oops!
[13:51] <zmoylan-pi> take a holiday during your holiday to meet up with them on their outing... :-)
[13:51] <dwatkins> there's no way I'm coming back from France just to go to see a play and have a couple drinks on my boss ;)
[13:54] <penguin42> being around 200 miles from my nearest other team member, I don't have that problem
[13:59] <daftykins> aww you should meet up :)
[14:00] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/gs1mrdfqvrikf64/Mischief.jpg?dl=0
[14:00] <daftykins> my cat is enjoying the sun greatly today
[14:01] <zmoylan-pi> recharging
[14:01] <daftykins> yip :)
[14:01] <zmoylan-pi> cats are solar powered
[14:04] <daftykins> unless it's the competitive kind of doping cats, high on catnip
[14:07] <penguin42> daftykins: You could paint a few black splodges on that wall so it could camoflage itself
[14:08] <daftykins> haha
[14:09] <zmoylan-pi> cats don't need assistance to stealth.  i've seen a tortishell hide in plain sight lying in the sun
[14:38] <penguin42> how bizarre; Amazon are listing a b&w laser for £16.61 - and £76.69 delivery (from Italy)
[14:39] <penguin42> I guess that might not be an insane cost from Italy for delivery
[14:40] <zmoylan-pi> they have to sneak it by roman galley past the carthaginians hence the cost :-)
[14:41] <penguin42> nod, the last 3 were eaten by lions
[14:42] <zmoylan-pi> well lasers... cats...
[14:42] <penguin42> hmm a few of this thing showing up - I wonder if this is an effect of a low euro, so we're seeing a lot of European products show up in price sorts
[14:58] <davmor2> zmoylan-pi, penguin42: everyone in europe has to send things through Greece to help them pay off their debt
[14:58] <davmor2> would of €5 otherwise
[14:58] <davmor2> s/of/of benn
[14:59] <davmor2> been even
[15:46] <shauno> I'd be tempted to have a holiday there, but they cranked the VAT up
[15:47] <daftykins> would have been (:
[15:48] <shauno> I've been looking at boat rentals, and spain is cheaper atm.  quite counter-intuitive
[16:08] <TwistedLucidity> shauno: Didn't think the VAT increase had had a *huge* effect. Seemed to just be the odd euro here or there.
[16:08] <TwistedLucidity> Although I guess boat rental is a high-ticket item, so could hurt.
[16:10] <shauno> a 10% increase adds up quickly
[16:11] <shauno> (on the other hand, I find it unfathomable that it was previously 13%.  no wonder the coffers are dry)
[16:12] <penguin42> shauno: Well at one point not that long ago our VAT was down at that level; but I don't have much sympathy if they're that broke that they don't put it up
[16:14] <TwistedLucidity> 13% is OK if you have enough money moving and people aren't siphoning it off into secret accounts....
[16:15] <penguin42> there was an interesting article I saw saying that the £60/day limit didn't extend to credit and debit cards, so there was a lot of buying of high value goods
[16:15] <daftykins> i enjoy being VAT free (:
[16:16] <daftykins> just a shame Google, Microsoft and Apple typically don't like to acknowledge we exist
[16:16] <TwistedLucidity> You can bet that, despite the rhetoric, large amounts of the money passed through the City of London unchecked.
[16:16] <TwistedLucidity> daftykins: Where's "we"?
[16:16]  * penguin42 hopes some of it stopped here so it can pay our taxes...
[16:16] <daftykins> Channel Islands
[16:16] <daftykins> or rather the Bailiwick of Guernsey specifically, as i think Jersey has a 5% GST
[16:17] <TwistedLucidity> So..."daftykins Trust LLC" :-D
[16:18] <shauno> does that mean that if I buy something in guernsey, I'd be due import duty here?
[16:23] <TwistedLucidity> shauno: Not 100% sure, wiki implies not https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VAT-free_imports_from_the_Channel_Islands#Channel_Islands
[16:24]  * penguin42 can't remember the trick they used to stop all the CD/DVDs being delivered from there
[16:25] <TwistedLucidity> shauno: When I was importing bike parts from the USA, the HMRC phoneline was actually really helpful.
[16:25] <TwistedLucidity> penguin42: I think it was "Oi! Just gonnae no?"
[16:25] <penguin42> TwistedLucidity/shauno: For a long time a lot of the discount CD/DVD vendors were based there
[16:25] <TwistedLucidity> penguin42: Yeah, I think Amazon or someone was involved. Trading name of "Blackstar" ISTRC
[16:26] <penguin42> TwistedLucidity: Oh yeh, as was Play.com and a few others
[16:27] <shauno> I think being in the republic would complicate that, since we have no relationship with the smaller islands
[16:27] <penguin42> shauno: I'm not sure, it's an odd setup, because they're members of the EU
[16:27] <TwistedLucidity> If they are considered part of the EU for duty purposes; I doubt there's much the South can do.
[16:27] <TwistedLucidity> And sorry, I assumed you were UK.
[16:28] <shauno> no worries, it's a fair enough assumption in here :)
[16:28] <popey> Asus Nvidia GeForce GTX 750 Ti - worth getting over my current 460?
[16:29] <popey> http://gpuboss.com/gpus/GeForce-GTX-750-Ti-vs-GeForce-GTX-460
[16:29] <popey> hmmm
[16:31] <davmor2> MooDoo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQC7dweRTKU :)
[16:42] <daftykins> popey: nah
[16:42] <popey> nah?
[16:43] <daftykins> i don't think it's enough of a step up
[16:43] <daftykins> maybe if it were free :>
[16:58] <awilkins> I'm contemplating a 980Ti
[16:58] <awilkins> Of course, that's an absurd death machine of a GPU
[16:59] <bigcalm> For a moment I thought you were talking about a calculator
[16:59] <awilkins> If excellent graphics kills people, it's probably the Hitler of GPUs.
[16:59] <awilkins> With the Titan X being the current Ghengis Khan or whoever killed more people as a fraction of the human population than Hitler
[18:44] <brobostigon> how much do roses cost these days?
[18:44] <penguin42> the packs have got smaller over the years, but it's not great chocolate....
[18:46] <brobostigon> its my and my gf's two year anniversary this weekend, sortof.
[18:46] <davmor2> brobostigon: more than a pound and less than a million
[18:46] <brobostigon> eeeek, :(
[18:47] <davmor2> brobostigon: I guess it depends on where you live, how many and type
[18:47] <penguin42> and whether you nick them from the neighbours garden
[18:47] <brobostigon> north oxfordshire.
[18:48] <davmor2> I wolves I can get Velvet Crush at £3 a rose so a dozen would be £36
[18:48] <davmor2> In wolves even
[18:50] <brobostigon> better queston being, are flowers still an appropriate thing.?
[18:51] <directhex> IME girls want RAM.
[18:51] <directhex> http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2000/12/22/i-mean-who-doesnt
[18:52] <brobostigon> RAM ?
[18:53] <shauno> I never saw the value in finding some living organisms, beheading them and presenting their corpses to rot before you as a gift.  but disclaimer, I don't understand women at all.
[18:54] <brobostigon> i think i have that advantage, of better memory, my aspieness remebers almost every moment of most days, :(
[18:54] <davmor2> brobostigon: Flowers/Chocolate/Perfume/Jewellery/Evening Out always with a card, I think are all valid
[18:54] <brobostigon> are you aspie shauno ?
[18:54] <brobostigon> davmor2: ok cool, ty.
[18:54] <shauno> not that I know of
[18:56] <brobostigon> shauno: most NT people wouldnt have analysed it how you just did in my experience.
[18:57] <davmor2> brobostigon: Note the Always with a CARD! bit otherwise you get the 3rd degree,  with a card it's a special occasion so allowed :)
[18:58] <brobostigon> davmor2: i see, so i get her a special card, like something handmade?
[18:59] <davmor2> brobostigon: Yeah or just a standard Anniversary card, just not a numbered one :)
[19:00] <brobostigon> davmor2: of course not a numbered one, they wont exist. got you, i think i understand.
[19:41] <diddledan> ello
[21:08]  * brobostigon is sad, he is listening to ELO.
[21:09] <penguin42> Mr Blue Skies?
[21:09] <shauno> how could that possibly make him sad?
[21:10] <brobostigon> its something thats bad music, but is also strangly likable.
[21:10] <shauno> bad?!
[21:11] <brobostigon> POv, yes.
[21:58] <penguin42> bad music ?! Tsk - I like ELO


[13:08] <Jmlocodir-user> Sample
[13:09] <Jmlocodir-user> ipad annoying
[13:09] <belkinsa> Do you need help?
[13:10] <Jmlocodir-user> No just trying to get chat working in
[13:10] <Jmlocodir-user> Now ok
[13:10] <belkinsa> Okay.
[20:12] <locodir-user> oi
[20:13] <jose> o/
[20:13] <jose> hi!


[07:57] <dholbach> good morning
[13:08] <amit> hi....i needed a help...
[13:09] <Guest28852> hi...i needed a help
[13:09] <cjohnston> Guest28852: with
[13:09] <Guest28852> i am new to ubuntu...
[13:10] <Guest28852> so i dont know how to burn a dvd....
[13:10] <Guest28852> please suggest
[13:10] <cjohnston> Guest28852: try #ubuntu for support
[13:10] <Guest28852> kk...
[13:11] <Guest28852> one more thing...I don't have a great Internet connection, so can I ask Ubuntu to ship installation DVDs for free...
[13:11] <cjohnston> Guest28852: where do you live?
[13:12] <Guest28852> Jorhat, Assam, India
[13:14] <cjohnston> Guest28852: try joining #ubuntu-in and see if anyone that is in India could help you with that
[13:14] <Guest28852> K... any other alternative.....
[13:15] <cjohnston> to my knowledge, CDs are no longer sent out to people.
[13:16] <paultag> cjohnston: that is correct :)
[13:16] <paultag> mhall119: Nope, what's up with that?
[13:17] <Guest28852> k...so what should i do?
[13:17] <cjohnston> Guest28852: talk to the people in #ubuntu-in  they live in India, so hopefully someone could help you with getting a CD
[13:17] <paultag> Or I think you can buy one
[13:18] <Guest28852> kk...what is the cost?
[13:18] <mhall119> paultag: it's an essay he wrote, where he basically describes the nature of "currency" in open source communities
[13:18] <paultag> mhall119: interesting.
[13:19] <mhall119> very interesting, and he did a much better job of researching it than I would have
[13:19] <paultag> I'm not so sure the idea of currency is really, well, valid
[13:19] <mhall119> it'll make my post a lot easier to write
[13:19] <mhall119> not specifically, no, and he's clear on that
[13:20] <mhall119> but "currency" is a lot easier for me to type than "implicity value exchanged in a gift-economy"
[13:20] <paultag> I'll have to give it a read tonight
[13:20] <paultag> gift-economy
[13:21] <paultag> you relize that's just anarcho-communism
[13:21] <mhall119> not quite the same, but closer to that than capitalism, yes
[13:21] <paultag> interesting
[13:22] <paultag> I'll have to read it before I judge it more
[13:22] <mhall119> ya, it's not too long, and well worth it
[13:22] <paultag> totes
[13:22] <paultag> mhall119: so how was your bbq?
[13:23] <mhall119> paultag: excellent: https://picasaweb.google.com/116288560091326227763/LoCoBBQ?authkey=Gv1sRgCL2KscWez-C0SA#
[13:25] <mhall119> I have to get the one's from my camera uploaded somewhere besides facebook
[13:25] <paultag> mhall119: damn it feels good to be a gangsta' :)
[13:25] <mhall119> lol
[13:26] <paultag> mhall119: no food-porn shots though
[13:26] <mhall119> these are itnet7's
[13:27] <mhall119> I'm pretty sure I have some food-porn shots
[13:27] <paultag> ah, gotcha
[13:27] <mhall119> there are some gratuitous s'more pictures in there though
[13:27] <paultag> saw those :)
[13:28] <mhall119> evidently s'mores are a very distinctly American thing
[13:28] <paultag> yeah, I'd imagine so
[13:28] <mhall119> makes me proud to be an American :)
[13:29] <paultag> 'murica - land of horse hoofs, chocolate and stale pie-crust
[13:30] <mhall119> horse hoofs?
[13:30] <paultag> mhall119: gelatin, which at one point was horse hoof, I seem to recall
[13:31] <paultag> now I think it has more bone marrow
[13:31] <mhall119> it's probably all artificial chemicals now
[13:31] <paultag> true
[13:33] <paultag> alright, time to check on some code that's in the oven
[13:33] <paultag> one love
[16:30] <czajkowski> well worth following this discussion https://lists.launchpad.net/launchpad-dev/msg08271.html especially the latest email
[22:31]  * EgyParadox is away: I'm busy


[16:57] <dije> Just got a couple of errors about 'no such file' and 'no such file or directory'
[16:57] <dije> Referencing file/dirnames ending '.tix'
[16:57] <dije> In paths containing 'repository/indices'
[16:58] <dije> Am I hosed?
[16:59] <dije> Also includes '[Errno 2]'
[17:00] <dije> Pathnames look like Python unicode strings
[17:00] <mgz> dije: probably not, is that the *only* place you have the branch? otherwise, just copy again from upstream
[17:01] <dije> I'm trying to merge from a checkout into a branch on the same machine, same filesystem
[17:02] <dije> Errors are for the branch, not the checkout
[17:02] <dije> This is one of the spokes of a hub-and-spoke setup
[17:03] <dije> So the hub should have everything that this branch has/should have
[17:03] <dije> What do I copy over? Or do I nuke the local branch and make a new one?
[17:10] <dije> OK, I *think* I understand that the thing to do is to delete (move aside, backup) my existing branch, do a new 'bzr branch', and hope that my checkout doesn't realize anything has changed.


[22:46] <maggotbrain> On the login accounts list dropdown, my user names have been replaced with the word "Comment" for multiple accounts.
[22:47] <maggotbrain> Am running lightdm 1.28 xfce 4.13 pre3
[22:47] <maggotbrain> Where can I look to troubleshoot this?
[22:49] <Unit193> Neither accountsservice nor lightdm have seen any uploads in Eoan recently..Hrm.
[22:51] <maggotbrain> screenshot: https://imgur.com/Jnz0Hag
[22:57] <Unit193> Ah so it's just using 'real names'
[23:09] <maggotbrain> How can I change that back? Or, why is it using 'Comment' instead of falling back to the account name?