[17:02] <yao_ziyuan> my kde 4.1.2 just crashed, so i didn't see any replies
[17:02] <Pici> yao_ziyuan: Just use the regular update-manager, no need for -d.
[17:02] <Pici> !final | yao_ziyuan
[17:02] <biberao> i hope ubuntu guys fix nvidia :X
[17:02] <biberao> afflux you around=?
[17:03] <afflux> biberao: yup
[17:03] <biberao> mind if i pm you?
[17:03] <biberao> nothing related with ubuntu
[17:03] <yao_ziyuan> Pici: that also applies to the official final release?
[17:03] <afflux> feel free
[17:04] <biberao> thanks
[17:04] <debfx> is there a way to grab more attention to this bug: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/263543 cause I really would love to be able to boot intrepid
[17:07] <Pensacola> ok the livecd has the same problem so it has to be related to my system config
[17:07] <Pensacola> anyway I can get kde3 on intrepid?
[17:08] <debfx> no
[17:09] <Pensacola> ok
[17:11] <MvG> HappySmileMan: Do you want to subscribe to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/adept/+bug/277669 about adept removing adept? Might be useful if the devs need further information.
[17:13] <HappySmileMan> Yeah will do
[17:14] <Sharav> does the beta have a live cd where you can just test it out for fun?
[17:15] <slanning> when I login to the latest kernel in intrepid, the network doesn't work (e.g.: "ssh: Could not resolve hostname ...: Name or service not known"), but if I go to a previous kernel version it will work
[17:15] <slanning> it's been like that since dist-upgrading - anyone have an idea how to....regenerate whatever needs regenerated or re-defaulted ?
[17:16] <HappySmileMan> Sharav: IAs far as I know the regular desktop CD is a liveCD, just like the final versions
[17:18] <MvG> debfx: Investigating kernel errors, I'd start with a manually compiled plain vanilla kernel, try to see whetehr that boots, and then try to make it incrementally more like the kernel shipped with ubuntu. Requires some knowledge of how to configure kernels, though. Once you had the issue tracked down in this way, you could probably provide the developers with the information needed to fix it.
[17:24] <debfx> ok thanks, I'll try that
[17:38] <frybye> hi - cant find flashplugin-nonfree in adept???
[17:39] <frybye> I have clicked on all the available package sources...
[17:39] <frybye> and tried manually editing the sources.list
[17:39] <frybye> all to no avail so far...
[17:41] <MvG> frybye: It should be there, in multiverse: http://packages.ubuntu.com/intrepid/flashplugin-nonfree
[17:42] <MvG> frybye: Have you updated your package list since you activated package sources?
[17:42] <frybye> imho lots of times.. hang on pse..
[17:43] <MvG> frybye: Hmmm... my adept doesn't show it either, but apt-get install seems to work. Strange.
[17:44] <frybye> whats the full command for apt-get???#
[17:44] <ethana2> frybye: apt-get install?
[17:44] <frybye> apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree    <-- or?
[17:45] <ethana2> ....i think so
[17:45] <MvG> with sudo
[17:45] <ethana2> yeah
[17:45] <MvG> Any maybe add some of the suggested packages as well.
[17:45] <ethana2> i need a window decorator that will put decorations /over/ windows
[17:45] <ethana2> it sounds hackish 'cause it is
[17:45] <ethana2> it also needs to take the minimum window width and add x pixels
[17:46] <ethana2> specifically, I want it to draw window controls over the empty right side of menu bars
[17:46] <frybye> good - that seems to have done it... odd that not possible with gui...#
[17:46] <ethana2> and dragging the menu bar will drag the window
[17:46] <MvG> Strange: When I search in adept for "flash", flashplugin-nonfree is listed, but when I also type the p, i.e. "flashp", the list becomes empty.
[17:46] <biberao> MvG when i do flash and tab nothing appears
[17:46] <biberao> but if i do flashplugin tab it appears
[17:47] <MvG> Looks like the search would only search for package descriptions, not package names.
[17:51] <frybye> next ? - there does not seem to be a source for getting more widgets from the net???
[17:51] <frybye> I would like the weather widget...
[17:51] <MvG> biberao: You pressed tab in the search input field of adept? Does nothing for me.
[17:52] <frybye> i should perhaps go to #kde4 for this stuff...
[17:52] <klos> is there new artwork in interpid
[17:52] <klos> ?
[17:52] <biberao> MvG adept?
[17:52] <biberao> i did this apt-get install flash tab
[17:54] <elupus> hi, i'm trying to find linux-image 2.6.27-5.8, on pakages.ubuntu.com it is mentioned in the changelog, but can't seem to find the binary .deb file
[17:54] <elupus> any ideas?
[17:54] <danbh_intrepid> there is a -5 out?
[17:54] <MvG> biberao: adept = kde package manager, i.e. kubuntu
[17:55] <elupus> yea, should contain fix for the e1000e issue
[17:55] <elupus> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/l/linux/linux_2.6.27-5.8/changelog
[17:55] <frybye> anybody know the name of a package with a load of kde4 widgets...?
[17:56] <elupus> i suspect it just haven't spread to all mirrors, anybody know what is the main host?
[17:56] <JontheEchidna> frybye: kdeplasma-addons
[17:57] <elupus> yes i'm impatient :)
[17:57] <danbh_intrepid> elupus: its not listed on packages.ubuntu.com...
[17:57] <elupus> nope
[17:57] <elupus> but the changelog for current kernel image gives changelog for it
[17:58] <JontheEchidna> frybye: searching for plasmoid in adept should show a list of other installable plasmoids
[17:59] <danbh_intrepid> oooo, yay, fixes for ath9k!!!!
[17:59]  * danbh_intrepid wonders why that kernel didnt make it into beta
[18:00] <danbh_intrepid> !beta
[18:00] <elupus> hehe, yea that would be nice todo if i did have network :)
[18:07] <Novell> hi, does the 2.6.27-4-generic kernel include the patch to make the NVM read-only on e1000 cards ? and why doesn't my ethernet card on my X61s work with that kernel ?
[18:07] <brincade> hi!
[18:07] <Pici> Novell: No, the release notes said that this patch did not make it into the beta.
[18:07] <Novell> Pici: ah ok, didn't see that
[18:09] <Novell> Pici: any kernel update on the way ?
[18:15] <Pici> Novell: I would think so, but I don't have any definitive info on it.
[18:15] <Novell> ok, hopefully before monday hehe
[18:28] <elupus> Novell, http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/l/linux/linux_2.6.27-5.8/changelog
[18:29] <elupus> so obviously someting is on the way, but can't find that release anywhere :)
[18:29] <Novell> elupus: ahhh nice
[18:29] <biberao> oh thx MvG
[18:29] <Novell> should come soonish then
[18:29] <superriker> I have a problem with my bootloader grub
[18:30] <superriker> I have freshly installed 8.10 beta and the grub loader seems not to be installed
[18:30] <superriker> and I cant find the /boot/grub directory. Is there something new
[18:38] <danbh_intrepid> superriker: no, i dont think so
[18:43] <gs> hi
[18:43] <gs> I'm just trying to get compiz to run
[18:43] <gs> but the same problem as before the upgrade
[18:44] <gs> it removes the window-bars and the last statement is "Xgl not present"
[18:44] <danbh_intrepid> gs: did you use the hardware manager to install your drivers?
[18:44] <gs> did it automatically
[18:44] <gs> it offers me 177 and 173
[18:44] <gs> but has activated 177
[18:44] <gs> the other is deactivated
[18:45] <PatrickMello> hi guys...
[18:45] <gs> nvidia btw
[18:46] <danbh_intrepid> hmmm, automatically?  Thats not supposed to happen I thought...   I don't really know.  You could try deactivating, and then reactivating them.  See if the setup does a better job.  If that works, I'd file a bug report or something
[18:46] <biberao> geser
[18:46] <biberao> gs
[18:46] <biberao> wait a second
[18:46] <gs> want to see my xorg.conf or the compiz output?
[18:46] <gs> biberao, ok
[18:46] <gs> geser?
[18:46] <biberao> intrepid has some problems
[18:46] <gs> well it was the same before
[18:46] <biberao> with 96 and other driver
[18:46] <biberao> from nvidia
[18:46] <PatrickMello> I have a problem with reboot. I try to reboot in su mode and ssh terminal, I receive the reboot message on console but system does not appear reboot... reboot only if I use reboot -f now... everybody have any idea from this behavior?
[18:46] <gs> so I thought try it with the new version
[18:47] <gs> what version is 96?
[18:47] <jemark> PatrickMello: I think this is a known bug in the kernel
[18:48] <biberao> gs
[18:48] <biberao> old cards
[18:48] <PatrickMello> thanks jemark.. a kernel update is recommended?
[18:49] <Lynoure> PatrickMello: which one you have now?
[18:49] <Lynoure> PatrickMello: because I'm not sure I'd recommend 27-4 without caution (does not boot on mine, at least reliably)
[18:50] <jemark> PatrickMello: They probably fix it before the final release ;)
[18:50] <PatrickMello> jemark: : my version is 2.6.22-14-generic
[18:50] <danbh_intrepid> PatrickMello: are you running hardy?
[18:50] <PatrickMello> ops.. Lynoure, my version is 2.6.22-14-generic
[18:51] <Pici> That would be Gutsy.
[18:51] <Pici> PatrickMello: What version of Ubuntu are you running?
[18:51] <Lynoure> PatrickMello: I don't think Intrepid comes with that old kernel, and this is #ubuntu+1, the development channel for Intrepid
[18:51] <danbh_intrepid> hehe, it sure aint intrepid  : )
[18:51] <Lynoure> or support channel, or whatever :)
[18:52] <Lynoure> jemark: But there is a know bug like that in which version of the kernel? The one I'm having hassle with?
[18:52] <PatrickMello> ahh sorry danbh_intrepid... you have a suggestion from related channel to support?
[18:52] <jemark> PatrickMello: I run Hardy  2.6.24-19
[18:52] <Lynoure> PatrickMello: #ubuntu would be it, I think
[18:52] <Pici> !version
[18:53] <jemark> Lynoure: let me check on launchpad
[18:53] <gs> biberao, I only see this: http://img356.imageshack.us/my.php?image=drivergm3.png
[18:53] <PatrickMello> Pici: , my version is 7.10
[18:53] <danbh_intrepid> PatrickMello: well, I don't have a specific suggestion, but upgraded versions tend to have lots more fixes than new bugs.  So, I think you should upgrade.  gl
[18:53] <biberao> if i cant install nvidia drivers
[18:53] <Pici> PatrickMello: This channel is only for 8.10, please ask in #ubuntu
[18:53] <biberao> if i cant install nvidia drivers isnt it possible to atleast use any to make my resolution get to 1024 or something?
[18:53] <PatrickMello> ok .. thx!! i try it ...
[18:53] <jemark> PatrickMello: why don't you update to Hardy?
[18:54] <gs> biberao, I usually do that in the xorg.conf
[18:54] <biberao> i cant make it work arr
[18:54] <biberao> :|
[18:54] <biberao> i need some default
[18:54] <biberao> driver right»?
[18:54] <PatrickMello> all my stations are distributed in some places... and this station is a old and stable.. the problem starts a few days ago..
[18:55] <jemark> Lynoure: it's bug number 248677
[18:57] <jemark> Lynoure: and this one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/213260
[18:57] <Scunizi> will the fix for the e1000e ethernet bug be in the official release?
[18:57] <PatrickMello> thanks for any help guys.. regards!!!
[18:57] <jemark> yes, it is fixed already :)
[18:58] <Scunizi> jemark: that's a good thing :)
[19:00] <jemark> Scunizi: yes :)
[19:02] <Scunizi> jemark: yep .. just reading the bug report but it doesn't mention Linux putting the fix in the kernel that will be released on the 5th
[19:02] <Scunizi> jemark: see http://blogs.computerworld.com/when_linux_does_well_the_e1000e_ethernet_bug_fixed
[19:02] <becky_> is there anything we can do to stop that eye-sore of a wallpaper from making final 8.10 release?
[19:02] <Lynoure> jemark: I just have a startup bug, haven't even gotten to shutdown with .27-4
[19:02] <Scunizi> becky_: have someone change it just before you look
[19:03] <becky_> Scunizi:  that's what i'll be doing on installs for sure!
[19:04] <Lynoure> .27-3 however is pretty as much sweet as roses (32bit, though, not 64)
[19:06] <Nakkel> If I do a upgrade to Intrepid thru update-manager, does this install KDE4 side by side with KDE3 or removes KDE3? Also how well do KDE4 progs munch my old KDE3 configs?
[19:06] <jemark> Scunizi: I saw that the Ubuntu testing prepared the latest ubuntu kernel with the fix... we will see if the fix will be there in the final release. I think so...
[19:07] <JontheEchidna> Nakkel: It will remove KDE3. We have been getting some reports of icons getting messed up due to KDE3 configs
[19:07] <becky_> Scunizi: it will be out october 5
[19:07] <Scunizi> yep.. read that..
[19:07] <becky_> lol oh sorry I should read whole history
[19:09] <Nakkel> JontheEchidna: Ok, thanks.
[19:10] <td123> becky_: what will?
[19:10] <becky_> td123: e1000 kernel fix
[19:14] <td123> becky_: oh, ya, well I run it in a vm so IDC :D
[19:14] <becky_> hope you're not virtualizing the e1000 driver!?! :P lol
[19:15] <asdf25> anyone had alsa break with snd_hda_intel in intrepid recently and manage to fix it?
[19:15] <td123> becky, :D
[19:26] <balachmar> Hi, just upgraded one machine and got this error: already reported a bug about it: E: /var/cache/apt/archives/linux-image-2.6.27-4-generic_2.6.27-4.6_amd64.deb: subprocess dpkg-deb --fsys-tarfile returned error exit status 2
[19:26] <balachmar> However fix broken packages in synaptic doesn't work.
[19:28] <vita_> hi all
[19:31] <balachmar> If I do sudo apt-get install -f now, I get: dpkg-deb: subprocess paste killed by signal (Broken pipe)
[19:39] <vita__> Hi all. How can I mount disk via USB on II. It isn't detected by Solid, it doesn't appear in /media. Which device it is? It isn't /dev/sdb?
[19:49] <DGMurdockIII> where would i ask for support to get a non stander network card supported
[19:49] <DGMurdockIII> the killer nic
[19:49] <Pici> DGMurdockIII: What card?
[19:50] <DGMurdockIII> http://www.killernic.com/
[19:50] <DGMurdockIII> they have a linux driver
[19:51] <woogens> lol @ killernic.com -- Could be a reference to the e1000e driver. ;-)
[19:52] <DGMurdockIII> here there link to there driver http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/Support/index.php?_m=downloads&_a=viewdownload&downloaditemid=65&nav=0,2
[19:52] <DGMurdockIII> for linux
[19:53] <Nakkel> Hm, did "do-release-upgrade -d" and now I presume it installed the server version coz its configuring MySQL and Postfix on my desktop upgrade? Er wut?
[19:53] <Pici> DGMurdockIII: Are you asking how to get it to work in Intrepid or how to get it included with Ubuntu?
[19:53] <DGMurdockIII> how to get it included
[19:54] <DGMurdockIII> so when you do a install os ubuntu it dectect it
[19:54] <DGMurdockIII> even if it just basic support then you get the full driver off the restriced drivers installer
[19:55] <Pici> DGMurdockIII: File a bug against the 'linux' package on launchpad, this is for the kernel.
[19:55] <DGMurdockIII> on the launchpad
[19:56] <Pici> Yes.
[19:56] <Pici> !bugs
[19:56] <DGMurdockIII> ok
[19:59] <DGMurdockIII> what package should i choose
[19:59] <Pici> linux
[20:01] <mnemoc> .oO
[20:03] <_Guma> I just reported a bug. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/277744
[20:04] <_Guma> Any one know if there is a fix or if I can help with providing additional information
[20:04] <vita__> Could anybody help me with problem to mount USB disk?
[20:05] <vita__> dmesg | tail says nothing new when I plug it into USB
[20:05] <_Guma> I am running amd64 version
[20:07] <DGMurdockIII> (Pici): https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/277749 how dose that look
[20:14] <Daisuke_Ido> DGMurdockIII: is that the "gamer NIC"?
[20:14] <Daisuke_Ido> the one that makes all sorts of vague promises about lower latency and such
[20:14] <DGMurdockIII> yeah
[20:14] <DGMurdockIII> it actally dose what works
[20:14] <Daisuke_Ido> does it actually work?  or is it just an overpriced piece of niche hardware designed to lure in the gullible?  if it works, i'm interested
[20:15] <Daisuke_Ido> ah.
[20:15] <Daisuke_Ido> neat
[20:15] <DGMurdockIII> i dont play many mmo
[20:16] <DGMurdockIII> but i hear hear it reallyhelp for mmmo like world of warcraft
[20:16] <DGMurdockIII> and others
[20:17] <XVampireX> Okey, Daisuke_Ido if you don't know about pianos then answer me this, why doesn't kubuntu let me upgrade to 8.10 beta?
[20:19] <Daisuke_Ido> i do not know
[20:19] <Daisuke_Ido> i haven't yet tried to upgrade myself
[20:19] <Pici> Why doesn't it let you?
[20:20] <tvakah> so, my intel wireless is worknig wores than it was in hardy so far... ie it's unusable
[20:20] <tvakah> however in hardy I was running compat-wierless compiled replacement all the time to get it to work at all with wpa
[20:20] <skyjumper> tvakah: o
[20:20] <tvakah> iwl3945, any clues?
[20:20] <tvakah> kill switch on after modprobe, can't get the card to activate
[20:21] <skyjumper> i'm not completely sure, but someone in here mentioned before that intrepid is using a different driver for some wifi cards
[20:21] <tvakah> fn-key does nothing... same story as in hardy, except in hardy it was on by default and only died if you hit the fn-key once
[20:21] <Pici> My iwl3945 works fine.
[20:21] <Pici> I've never had any of these issues that I've heard other people report.
[20:22] <tvakah> "iwl3945: Radio disabled by HW RF Kill switch" in dmesg anytime the driver loads
[20:22] <tvakah> notebook's an asus c90s
[20:23] <tvakah> I'm trying to find out what to set debug to for the iwl3945 module to get it to cough up more hints
[20:23] <Daisuke_Ido> tvakah: that's saying it's physically off...  weird
[20:23] <Pici> tvakah: dmesg | grep iwl reports the following for me: http://pastebin.com/f7309bd26   I'm not sure why yours is not working
[20:23] <tvakah> Daisuke_Ido, aye, and it's that way from boot
[20:23] <carl_> did the online update from 8.04/kde4.1. Everything went swimmingly. On reboot, instead of login usr/pwd, there's an error box "No greeter widget plugin loaded. Check the configuration." w/ ok button. OK goes to CLI. Sign in works. Startx doesn't.
[20:24] <Daisuke_Ido> is it actually on?  i hate to ask the dumb questions, but you'd be surprised how many times people (myself included) will run aroud for hours trying to find a solution when the answer is to flip a switch somewhere
[20:24] <tvakah> isn't there some nifty pipe-to-pastebin program?
[20:24] <Daisuke_Ido> there is
[20:24] <skyjumper> tvakah: pastebinit
[20:24] <Pici> !info pastebinit
[20:24] <tvakah> I tried the fn-key, thats' the only switch
[20:24] <tvakah> there's no side thing, just the fn-f2 key
[20:25] <Daisuke_Ido> tvakah: you don't have a hardware switch on the front?  that's absolutely bizarre
[20:25] <tvakah> Daisuke_Ido, nope just the function key
[20:26] <tvakah> dmesg | grep iwl > http://pastebin.com/f2e01de4e
[20:42] <tvakah> hmm I should try rebuilding the kernel and changin this I think "# CONFIG_ACPI_ASUS is not set"
[20:43] <tvakah> since most things are telling me to poke at /proc/acpi/asus
[20:43] <tvakah> I tried the keycode trick mentioned here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=2713567&postcount=14 to no avail
[20:48] <tvakah> so this leads to asking: what is the Ubuntu Way (tm) to recompile the kernel while still coloring within the lines
[20:50] <biberao> bye
[20:50] <biberao> thanks all for your help
[20:51] <fabio> hi I just wanted to try kubuntu intrepid beta on my thinkpad t61p, when i boot the desktop cd, all i get after the screen where i can chose, whether i want to try or to install or boot from hd etc. is a black screen and my laptops pc speaker is beeping like crazy
[20:58] <hmuller> fabio:  Hit F6, and delete 'quiet' and 'splash'
[20:59] <tvakah> well I got the led to turn on, and nm-tool shows an access point, however knetworkmanager doesn't seem to be in on the idea
[21:00] <tvakah> the trick was to echo 1 > /sys/devices/platform/asus-laptop/wlan after loading the asus_laptop module
[21:00] <tvakah> that turned off rf kill
[21:00] <fabio> ok will try
[21:04] <frybye> not been able to run skype on 64bit intrepid - any tips? (I have done the stuff to be found with google - but it seems to not work with the new beta?)
[21:08] <kane77> when was the beta released?
[21:10] <JontheEchidna> kane77: yesterday I think
[21:10] <kane77> JontheEchidna, so then I already am running beta :D
[21:11] <JontheEchidna> yep :)
[21:11] <kane77> I know there will not be much differences but I like to know officially :D
[21:11] <ConstantineXVI> is the guest user broken right now?
[21:20] <kjetil1001> Update from yesterday: I made a bootable pendrive of intrepid (8.10) beta, doesnt boot from that either. back on 8.04 now.  Nice! What part?
[21:25] <debfx> http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=commit;h=1fd6a53ddc75d02ad0f363cb42f2a1cec6b701c2
[21:25] <frybye> re - skype still crashes when I try to login... ah well....
[21:26] <MvG> debfx: Quite an achievement, it seems, tracking that thing down.
[21:27] <debfx> I used git bisect, had to compile like 15 different kernel versions :/
[21:30] <MvG> debfx: Probably faster that bisecting over all config options, as I had in mind. I take it the bug occurred even with the default config?
[21:31] <debfx> MvG: yes, always used the default config to test
[21:31] <MvG> debfx: Are you going to file bugs against upstream kernel and the ubuntu kernel packages?
[21:34] <debfx> MvG: there is already a bug against ubuntu: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/263543
[21:35] <MvG> Oh yes, now I recall that you started by mentioning that. So long ago...
[21:35] <x1250> When accesing my phone via bluetooth (explore device option), I can browse all directories but I can't access, copy, or view any file. Trying to copy or open any file results in a "file not found" message. Nautilus shows "unknown" in permission column. What can this be? I'm trying to access a Sony Ericsson W890i.
[21:42] <_Guma> Is any one here who has two GFX cards in their system? Do you have both working?
[21:43] <td123> _Guma: your asking on ubuntu? pff
[21:44] <_Guma> Yes. I have two Radion HD 3650 and only one is driving two displays. I can't get the other card working 3rd display
[21:44] <_Guma> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/277744
[21:47] <tvakah> so what can I do to get this fixed automatically? where should I post how to fix asus c90s wireless rf kill?
[21:48] <_Guma> td123: Where should I be asking such question. I am testing 8.10 beta
[21:48] <tvakah> I'm guessing it's two parts, asus_laptop needs to be loaded, not sure where the detection for this goeus... and then networkmanager or something nedes to twiddle the sysfs file to enable/disable wirelses
[21:49] <td123> _Guma: google if it works with other distros or are they experiencing the same thing
[21:49] <x1250> how can I restart the sound system without restarting X ? Intrepid is leaving me without audio from time to time here :/
[21:50] <hardcore> is there a way to install 8.10 beta with the terminal?
[21:50] <x1250> the usual $ pkill pulseaudio doesn't work
[21:50] <tvakah> hardcore, sure, s/hardy/intrepid in /etc/apt/sources.list then use aptitude
[21:50] <tvakah> hardcore, or apt-get dist-upgrade
[21:50] <tvakah> but aptitued's likely your best friend
[21:50] <tvakah> aptitude* even
[21:51] <jaxdahl2> diff apt-get aptitude ?
[21:51] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: please suggest the supported method, update-manager -d
[21:51] <x1250> diff apt-get aptitude < google.com :P
[21:51] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, oh hmm, I had never seen that before heh
[21:52] <hardcore> it says nothing was upgraded when i did apt-get dist-upgrade
[21:52] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: yeah, someone asked me to do the same.  Its for the bugs.
[21:52] <l337ingDisorder> hey folks, having a weird keybinding problem ever since updating to intrepid alpha...
[21:52] <danbh_intrepid> hardcore: try update-manager -d
[21:52] <l337ingDisorder> like... PARTICULARLY weird.
[21:52] <l337ingDisorder> here's the link to my post in the ubu forums describing the problem, in case anyone has time to help debug: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=934444
[21:53] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, hmm what pulls in update-manager, I seem to not have it
[21:53] <sourcemaker> can I upgrade to kubuntu 8.10 using cryptoLUKS (whole encrypted file system) in hardy???
[21:53] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: its under ubuntu-desktop somewhere, what distro are you using?
[21:53] <danbh_intrepid> !upgrade
[21:53] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, ahh that'd do it, kubuntu-desktop doesn't
[21:53] <hardcore> i tried update manager, nothing about beta
[21:54] <jaxdahl2> hardcore, you ran it with -d?
[21:54] <hardcore> i'm using 8.04
[21:54] <hardcore> whats -d?
[21:54] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: then you should use adept_manager
[21:54] <jaxdahl2> it checks for a dist upgrade
[21:54] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: officially: kdesu "adept_manager --dist-upgrade-devel"
[21:54] <l337ingDisorder> brb
[21:54] <jaxdahl2> -d, --devel-release
[21:55] <jaxdahl2> intrepid is still in beta
[21:55] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, hmm so what might I be missing from doing a natural aptitude upgrade then? just worried if I may have old packages or be missing something important
[21:55] <hardcore> is downloading the only way to get beta?
[21:56] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: yeah, apt-get will fail to do the whole install sometimes, and leave old packages behind.  The devs take care of those problems in the other update tools...
[21:56] <kulight> any way installing skype on x64 system (i get alsa error) when trying to run from terminal
[21:56] <danbh_intrepid> hardcore: well, you can download the alternate cd
[21:57] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, yeah I had lots of dependency circles to untangle, but that's why I use aptitude usually since it lest me manage all that
[21:57] <sourcemaker> there are no upgrade notes regarding to encrypted file system using crypto luks...
[21:57] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, but then I'm new to doing things the Ubuntu Way, rather than the Debian Unstable/Experimental Way ;)
[21:57] <danbh_intrepid> : )
[21:58] <l337ingDisorder> kulight: did you install from synaptic or compile from source?
[21:58] <tvakah> however kdesu's missing kdesudo instead? or should I have kdesu instaled still?
[21:58] <l337ingDisorder> kulight: i don't think the 64 ver is in synaptic..
[21:58] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: I dunno, I know on gnome, we have both gksu and gksudo.
[21:58] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, adept_manager also seems to be outmoded in intrepid, only adept
[21:58] <kulight> i used medibuntu packegs
[21:59] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, adept_manager is old kde3, conflicts with the kde4 adept
[21:59] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: hmmm, well, then thats a bug, eh?  at least in the documentation
[21:59] <tvakah> and there is no kdesu anymore it seems
[21:59] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: if you give me the correct command, I'll change it
[21:59] <tvakah> aye, but the kde4 stuff is all still new, networkmanager's not v4 yet
[22:00] <danbh_intrepid> but Im gona check packages.ubuntu.com to see whats happening
[22:01] <x1250> gnome-volume-control dies with message "No volume control GStreamer plugins and/or devices found". I tried sudo /etc/init.d/alsa-utils restart && sudo /etc/init.d/pulseaudio restart, but this doesn't work. Any ideas? Generally to fix this issue I must restart X, but I don't want to keep o doing that :(
[22:01] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: looks like you are correct on adept_manager being depreciated
[22:01] <XVampireX> Why doesn't intrepid have nvidia 177.78 yet?
[22:01] <tvakah> XVampireX, it does, install envyng
[22:01] <XVampireX> Ah
[22:01] <XVampireX> Well not as an official binary for ubuntu though
[22:02] <danbh_intrepid> !envyng
[22:02] <XVampireX> I'm just finishing the upgrade :)
[22:02] <arnath02> hi, how is 8.10 shaping up? i mean in respect to the ... trouble ... encountered with the 8.04 release? :p
[22:02] <tvakah> what's the official nvidia driver in intrepid then? restricted-modules no longer has it?
[22:03] <XVampireX> 177.76
[22:03] <XVampireX> instead of 177.78
[22:03] <XVampireX> Which does improve in some respect
[22:03] <hardcore> i'm upgradingright now :)
[22:03] <sourcemaker> are you having problems on you webpage?
[22:03] <kulight> i only got 173
[22:03] <tvakah> XVampireX, not sure then I'm running 173.14.12-1-0ubuntu3 installed by envyng-qt
[22:04] <XVampireX> You're using older hardware then
[22:04] <arnath02> o btw, is there any hope for better multiscreen support in 8.10?
[22:04] <arnath02> got 2 nvidia computers and 1 ati and never did manage to get dual screen to work properly on either of em :(
[22:04] <tvakah> XVampireX, nope it's just what envy reccomended
[22:04] <XVampireX> what card do you have?
[22:05] <tvakah> XVampireX, 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation GeForce 8600M GT (rev a1)
[22:05] <XVampireX> Ah okey :)
[22:05] <tvakah> however I'm very seriously looking to get an ati module for my notebook instead of nvidia after all the driver crap with kde4 and etc
[22:05] <hardcore> i noticed they made the new distro a little smaller so it can fit on a cd-r. i always use dvd+rw anyway
[22:05] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: can you test this command for me (if you have kubuntu)?  I'm just curious if it suggests any packages to install: sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop^                                         dont forget the ^carrot
[22:06] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, what's the '^' do to apt-get?
[22:06] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: it makes it a tasksel
[22:06] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: but doing it with apt-get instead of tasksel, you get to see everything thats happening, and you can say 'no' if you want to cancel out
[22:07] <tuxice> Hello?
[22:07] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, I already had that package installed, but when I ran that apt-get it's suggesting a handfull of upgrades, mostly a bunch of kde4 packages that look to still be at a ppa version
[22:08] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: so you already have those packages?
[22:08] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, actually scratch that, the upgrades are there anyhow due to updating a few minutes ago, kde4's still in flux
[22:09] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: ah, actually, I just figured it, adept_manager IS the correct command, because thats whats on Hardy
[22:09] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, ahhh that makes sense
[22:10] <tuxice> How about this for a wallpaper https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/BrownOrange_Wallpaper
[22:10] <tvakah> so back to about my wireless, where can I file a bug to get it fixed for everyone else too?
[22:11] <tvakah> I'm not sure what package to file against rath er
[22:11] <danbh_intrepid> whats wrong with your wireless?
[22:11] <tvakah> nothing now heh, but I want it to get automagically fixed to Just Work for others ;)
[22:11] <tvakah> I have no hardware kill switch, it's a software kill switch
[22:11]  * danbh_intrepid looks for his favorite bug
[22:12] <tvakah> to turn the kill switch off, I had to load a module for my notebook that wasn't automatically loaded, then poke sysfs
[22:12] <x1250> I'm having a really strange keyboard problem. I can't do "`" and "^" characters with my keyboard, except in yakuake terminal (they work there). In other gnome apps, trying to get those characters results in no output. I'm using spanish - spanish keyboard, but I've tried other ones, and the same thing happens.
[22:12] <danbh_intrepid> bug 259157 is the bug I'm waiting on
[22:12] <x1250> any help?
[22:12] <tvakah> just google for iwl3945 rf kill switch ubuntu and you'll see how common this issue is, I've at least figured it out for asus c90s notebooks
[22:13] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: so, it turns the wifi card on and off?
[22:13] <tvakah> yes
[22:13] <tvakah> the function-key doesn't work under ubuntu, that bit I've still not figured out, but I can poke it through sysfs
[22:13] <tvakah> some fedora guy apparently can get his fn-key to work with a setkeycodes call
[22:14] <danbh_intrepid> where do you think the functionality should go?  network manager?
[22:14] <tvakah> network manager should poke sysfs if it's there for sure, but as to how to get asus_laptop loaded, I'm not sure what should do that detection
[22:15] <danbh_intrepid> bug 267875   how about this one?
[22:16] <tvakah> danbh_intrepid, hmm that seems to be a generic iwl3945 bug, my fix is asus specific afaik
[22:17] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: well, then definitely file a bug
[22:18] <danbh_intrepid> tvakah: and it sounds like you are talking about a problem with the drivers, which AFAIK go under the linux package
[22:18] <EvilDaemon> Guess what's way too cool?
[22:18] <asdf25> anyone had alsa stop working with snd_hda_alsa recently and manage to fix it?
[22:18] <EvilDaemon> I booted up without my ethernet cable, and my wireless works!
[22:18] <EvilDaemon> Now I'm happy.
[22:19] <danbh_intrepid> asdf25: I have sound problems with pulseudio, which kinda relates
[22:20] <asdf25> alsa doesn't work at all for me, and a few other people who filed bugs on launchpad, apparantly started a few days ago... no fix yet that i've found
[22:21] <kimus> hi, I have a problem with compiz when i do the login. compiz does not load
[22:21] <kimus> if I go to appearance, visual effects and enable them then works fine
[22:22] <asdf25> with visual effects disabled i believe it uses metacity as the WM
[22:22] <kimus> when I do my login (after a reboot) it does the same problem...
[22:22] <kimus> no WM is loaded
[22:23] <asdf25> ah well that's not supposed to happen =) no idea
[22:23] <kimus> not loading the compiz with effects enabled every time i login should also not happen
[22:24] <kimus> I'll go to LP then
[22:28] <danbh_intrepid> asdf25: try this, killall pulseaudio             and then run pulseaudio
[22:29] <danbh_intrepid> asdf25: or pulseaudio &
[22:29] <Darfe> pulseaudio -D :)
[22:30] <danbh_intrepid> Darfe: good call!
[22:30] <_Guma> If I install 8.10 beta can I update online when final release is available without re-installing again?
[22:31] <Darfe> is the ctrl+alt+f1 terminal bye bye in 8.10 ? i can't see it :(
[22:32] <danbh_intrepid> Darfe: I can still get it
[22:32] <danbh_intrepid> though, it took a couple tries
[22:32] <Darfe> oki..
[22:33] <platius> !final
[22:37] <jaxdahl> Darfe, my c+a+f1 stopped working when i enabled the nvidia drivers
[22:37] <jaxdahl> it changes to a blank screen, and i can't bring X back, have to ctrl+alt+backspace.. using nvidia 177 and uvesafb
[22:38] <asdf25> danbh_intrepid: hey that did it! thanks
[22:38] <Darfe> jaxdahl, ok i use nvidia to..
[22:39] <Darfe> but i can switch back to f7
[22:40] <jaxdahl> sometimes i can't even switch back. like now
[22:48] <ConstantineXVI> after upgrading, ive noticed some fuzzy lines on window borders and etc.  is that bad?
[22:49] <Teisei> Why does aMSN not start in system tray if it is set to launch on startup ?
[22:50] <_Guma> Is it possible to put 8.10 to sleep? or Hibernate? I am running LiveCD and such option is not available. It is becouse LiveCD?
[22:52] <ConstantineXVI> _Guma: yes
[22:53] <isleshocky771>  I upgraded from Kubuntu 8.04 - kde 4.1 to the new 8.10 beta. I now get an error on login "Could not start kstartupconfig4, Check your installation".  Any direction would help.  Couldn't find anything on the forums.
[22:59] <hardcore> i figured out how to install beta without downloading the cd
[23:05] <_Guma> ConstantineXVI: Is there a way to pull ati driver like you can with nvidia (none open source). Or do you have to download it from ATI site and install it manually?
[23:09] <amon_> hi guys
[23:11] <OsamaK> Will Ubuntu 8.10 includes Python 2.6 and GIMP 2.6?
[23:11] <danbh_intrepid> OsamaK: packages.ubuntu.com
[23:23] <hmuller> crimsun: Are you still working sound related issues?
[23:27] <tacosarecool> hello
[23:31] <tacosarecool> Hello
[23:35] <becky_> ok so I figured out how to get tags displayed in my templates (finally) but when I iterate over the tags it is iterating over all of the tags not just the ones for self: tags_for_model client.Client as btags with counts
[23:36] <becky_> oops: {% tags_for_model client.Client as btags with counts %}
[23:36] <becky_> LOL wrong channel heh
[23:46] <arakthor> howdy, any one know how to create a key ring manually? I can't seem to find any information on it through google.


[00:00] <lifeless> wgrant: whats driving this; I thought we were happy with the owner/admin/member system
[00:01] <wgrant> lifeless: Owners are awkward, because they're an easily forgotten special case and they need to be queried for specially when reporting on access.
[00:02] <wgrant> And admins-can't-promote-admins confuses everyone, so needs to be abolished. And conflating admin+member is a bit silly and hard to display. Which means that ownership doesn't really have a purpose.
[00:02] <lifeless> wgrant: but owners don't get access, so they don't need special handling
[00:02] <wgrant> lifeless: Huh?
[00:03] <lifeless> wgrant: we stomped that out 6 months ago
[00:03] <wgrant> lifeless: My OEM project grants access to a project team.
[00:03] <lifeless> owners no longer get benefits granted to the team
[00:03] <wgrant> The project team's owner has resigned :(
[00:03] <lifeless> the team owner doesn't get access to the project
[00:03] <wgrant> But my disclosure reporting views don't show the owner.
[00:03] <lifeless> and they don't need to.
[00:03] <wgrant> Despite they fact that they can add themselves or others to the team.
[00:04] <wgrant> The reports are pretty damn useless if they don't tell me that Joe Random Former Employee can do whatever he wants.
[00:06] <lifeless> Joe Random could be in a private subteam with a legit sounding name and wouldn't be shown either
[00:07] <wgrant> Sure, and that's the price we pay for supporting unstructured private teams.
[00:07] <wgrant> But that can at least be detected.
[00:07] <wgrant> If you hide the owner, it can't be.
[00:07] <lifeless> so, if admin doesn't imply membership you need the same special case for admins
[00:07] <wgrant> If you have an invisible private team in your access list, you have to trust the team. We know that.
[00:08] <wgrant> Yes.
[00:08] <lifeless> so, I don't think that removing owner is a good idea at the moment
[00:08] <lifeless> I acknowledge it may make sense
[00:09] <lifeless> but it needs some thought, reasoning and consultatoin
[00:09] <lifeless> right now, my brain is full of u1 stuff, and its late for the folk I'm talking to about that, so I'm going to stay focused on that for nw.
[00:09] <wgrant> What have they broken now?
[00:10] <lifeless> as far as admin promoting admins; I think we need to check with our users there as well; particularly losa/gsa etc
[00:10] <lifeless> wgrant: they have a growing userbase
[00:19] <huwshimi> wallyworld_, wgrant: Have you guys managed to have a chat about whether the manage-disclosure pages will need to be changed again due to the changes you were talking about yestereday?
[00:19] <wgrant> We probably won't know for weeks.
[00:20] <huwshimi> wgrant: Thanks, I won't worry about it unless I hear something then
[00:43] <StevenK> Bleh. I think these failing tests assume that nominations created by admins are not automatically approved.
[00:57] <sladen> poolie: no idea if that's the way to go:  lp:~sladen/launchpad/launchpad-microdata-bug-person  the way in which the data is dumped out doesn't immediately match up;  ask you've got eg.  _makeLink used around .unique_displayname
[01:29] <wallyworld_> huwshimi: looking at your mp now. been having some stupid router issues
[01:30] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: Ah, awesome :)
[01:46] <lifeless> wallyworld_: how hard do you think it would be to adapt https://github.com/marcello3d/node-buffalo to run (just the serializer) in chrome+ff
[01:46] <lifeless> ?
[01:46] <StevenK> loltpg
[01:46]  * wallyworld_ looks
[01:47] <wallyworld_> StevenK: why loltpg? it's been hardware issues at my end :-(
[01:47] <wgrant> lifeless: You haven't been turned off BSON yet?
[01:48] <StevenK> wallyworld_: I saw 'router issues' and assumed.
[01:48] <wallyworld_> StevenK: you know what they say about assuming :-)
[01:48] <lifeless> wgrant: a bug in one implementation isn't sufficient to scare me off :P
[01:48] <wgrant> Does anybody else use BSON?
[01:48] <wgrant> At all?
[01:48] <wgrant> Apart from in MongoDB?
[01:48] <wallyworld_> we had a power outage last night and the router has been flakey ever since :-(
[01:48] <rick_h_> mongo folks :)
[01:49] <rick_h_> sourceforge uses it a bunch with their mongo stuff
[01:49] <wallyworld_> lifeless: i've not seen that project before. i can't give you an immediate answer
[01:49] <rick_h_> lifeless: what breaks? should just be able to inline the bson.js with the extern/xx files for their long support
[01:50] <lifeless> rick_h_: cool
[01:50] <wgrant> The only benefits it seems to provide are obfuscation and storing binary data so our applications can crash.
[01:50] <lifeless> rick_h_: I haven't tried yet
[01:50] <rick_h_> the only node parts are the require/packaging stuff
[01:51] <rick_h_> wgrant: I'm with you, clarity/debuggable ftw
[01:53] <wgrant> We've reinvented about 20 square wheels already, and used another 15 or so triangular wheels from other places.
[01:53] <wgrant> Let's not add more...
[01:53] <lifeless> wgrant: speaking of crashes, did you file a bug for that oops you ofund yesterday in +filebug ?
[01:53] <lifeless> .
[01:53] <lifeless> adfreakingsl
[01:53] <lifeless> ...
[01:53] <wgrant> lifeless: No, but matsubara id overnight.
[01:53] <wgrant> did
[01:54] <rick_h_> wtf, this thing will serialize code?
[01:54] <rick_h_> heh, that's got to be interesting
[01:58] <lifeless> rick_h_: I'd like to hook up an oops like thing in our js
[01:59] <lifeless> rick_h_: to catch errors and report them immediately
[02:00] <rick_h_> lifeless: cool
[02:01] <rick_h_> I had something like that once for ajax requests in an app
[02:01] <rick_h_> glboal error handler that would then fire off an api request to log and notify of the error with a load of client info
[02:02] <wallyworld_> huwshimi: on the new screenshot, the affected project is not shown. where is it displayed now?
[02:02] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: It's not
[02:02] <wallyworld_> is that an issue?
[02:03] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: Well, my branch doesn't address that. The intention is that we revert to not showing the affected branch/project like we had previously except on pages that previously displayed it
[02:03] <wallyworld_> ah ok. i didn't recall that we previously did not show it
[02:04] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad
[02:04] <wallyworld_> out of curiousity, if the user selects to show extra data like the project, it's in two lines then, right?
[02:04] <huwshimi> lifeless: Can we really catch all our js errors while we have in page scripts?
[02:05] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: Yeah, that's right
[02:05] <wallyworld_> cool
[02:05] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: There's some helpful comments from Matthew on the bug about that
[02:05] <wallyworld_> ok
[02:05] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: Pages like this show a package: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu'
[02:06] <wallyworld_> so they do
[02:07] <huwshimi> wallyworld_: So those will hopefully still show a package (although I doubt the functionality exists yet as I believe the customisation of the columns is site wide)
[02:07] <wallyworld_> it's hard looking at those pages when the new bug listings look sooo much nicer
[02:12] <lifeless> rick_h_: exactly
[02:13] <lifeless> huwshimi: all of? maybe not. More than we do today? Definitely.
[02:13] <rick_h_> lifeless: ok, I lied. It uses node buffers, which now needs node assert
[02:13] <rick_h_> wheee, dependency chaining here we go
[02:13] <lifeless> rick_h_: yah :(
[02:13] <lifeless> rick_h_: so I imagine there is some porting needed
[02:14] <rick_h_> lifeless: yea, and that needs util to do some inheritence binding
[02:34] <huwshimi> wallyworld__: Thanks heaps for the review
[02:35] <huwshimi> wallyworld__: I've been having router issues this week too, so I was gone for a sec then
[02:36] <huwshimi> lifeless: Will the js errors be logged in the oops database? I'm just asking cause I want to set up a service for logging a/b test results (via ajax) and am interested to know if the architecture would be similar
[02:36] <lifeless> huwshimi: yes
[02:36] <huwshimi> lifeless: Ah ok
[02:37] <huwshimi> lifeless: I was hoping to steal some code :)
[02:37] <huwshimi> but this will have to be different
[02:37] <lifeless> huwshimi: generic wsgi microservice that listens on http, sanitises some fields and forwards over amqp to the oops db
[02:37] <lifeless> huwshimi: AIUI most a/b test frameworks use log files rather than actual services, but I am probably wrong
[02:37] <lifeless> huwshimi: what do you want to have happen?
[02:39] <huwshimi> lifeless: To record the results of the test we'll need some js to test that a link has been clicked etc. The results need to be stored somewhere. I had imagined we would send off an ajax request to some kind of service and it would dump it in a db.
[02:40] <huwshimi> lifeless: And a tool that returns the results would be needed too
[02:40] <lifeless> well, when the link is clicked, LP gets the request doesn't it ?
[02:41] <huwshimi> lifeless: We won't necessarily just be testing links, it could be that someone uses a bit of js interaction, or scrolls to the bottom of a page, the possibilities are endless
[02:42] <lifeless> sure
[02:42] <lifeless> the easiest to deploy thing is just to make a GET request to <current-site>/+abtests/test/value with no referrer
[02:42] <lifeless> this will go into our logs, and we can grep for it very easily
[02:43] <lifeless> you can certainly do a service if you want
[02:44] <huwshimi> lifeless: OK, that seems simple
[02:44] <rick_h_> yea, just make things small enough to json/add to request
[02:45] <lifeless> the no referrer will stop it oopsing
[02:45] <lifeless> it will just be a random foreign request the appserveres and haproxy etc ignore
[02:45] <rick_h_> could almost just do something like dynamically add an image to the page and go through apache logs or something
[02:45] <rick_h_> are there real request logs out there?
[02:46] <lifeless> yes, but restricted access (ip address is personal information)
[02:46] <lifeless> however getting a script etc run on them is easy
[03:01] <huwshimi> Anyone know how to turn on the beta banner locally?
[03:04] <rick_h_> huwshimi: you need a feature flag with it limited in some way
[03:04] <rick_h_> deryck showed me today
[03:04] <rick_h_> set the buglisting flag for just your user, for instance
[03:04] <rick_h_> and that would trigger the beta banner
[03:04] <huwshimi> rick_h_: Ah right!
[03:04] <lifeless> or just default 0 on
[03:05] <lifeless> show it everywhere
[03:05] <rick_h_> right, but if it's default I think it doesn't show the banner right?
[03:05] <lifeless> it should, it just checks on some pages/templates for the flag evaluating
[03:05] <lifeless> to on/off
[03:06] <huwshimi> rick_h_: That worked
[03:06] <rick_h_> huwshimi: cool
[03:06] <huwshimi> lifeless: Wasn't working with default btw
[03:06] <lifeless> ahm interesting
[03:08] <huwshimi> lifeless: Which means we can't have features in beta for everyone, or at least have a notification for it
[03:08] <lifeless> hmm, it just means there is a small bug somewhere :)
[03:09] <lifeless> -or
[03:09] <lifeless> IIRC the theory is that 'when feature X is enabled for everyone it is out of beta'
[03:10] <rick_h_> yea, that's what I figured
[03:10] <huwshimi> hmmm
[03:46] <huwshimi> wgrant: In regards to the download-cache stuff we were talking about the other day, how do I actually commit changes? Do I do a bzr checkout of lp:lp-source-dependencies and just push the changes?
[03:47] <wgrant> huwshimi: ~/launchpad/lp-sourcedeps/download-cache should be a bound checkout by default. You can commit straight to there, and it will push automatically.
[03:47] <huwshimi> wgrant: Oh right, thanks :)
[03:57] <huwshimi> A couple of reviews if someone wants them:
[03:57] <huwshimi> https://code.launchpad.net/~huwshimi/launchpad/update-cssutils-version/+merge/84199
[03:58] <huwshimi> https://code.launchpad.net/~huwshimi/launchpad/beta-banner-design/+merge/84198
[04:02] <wgrant> huwshimi: Where'd you get that tarball?
[04:02] <wgrant> They don't seem to distribute one, AFAICT.
[04:02] <huwshimi> wgrant: you're right
[04:02] <huwshimi> wgrant: I grabbed the tarball from the tagged branch
[04:03] <lifeless> fwiw lp-land is the bomb
[04:04] <wgrant> lifeless: Oh?
[04:04] <huwshimi> wgrant: Is there a problem with that tarball?
[04:04] <lifeless> wgrant: handles prodconfigs ok
[04:04] <lifeless> wgrant: I'd forgotten to use it :P
[04:05] <wgrant> huwshimi: Doesn't match the 0.9.7 tag tarball that I got from bitbucket. We might be better off using the official 0.9.7 zip.
[04:05] <wgrant> There's nothing wrong with it, besides not being official to being unreproducable and thoroughly confusing.
[04:05] <wgrant> s/to being/so being/
[04:05] <huwshimi> wgrant: Oh, I couldn't find an offical one. I got mine from bitbucket, but the only place I could find was from the tagged branches
[04:06] <wgrant> huwshimi: Yeah, odd that its hash doesn't match. There's no official tar.gz, but there is an official zip which we can use.
[04:06] <huwshimi> oh and I removed the double containing folder
[04:06] <wgrant> Ah
[04:06] <huwshimi> wgrant: Oh right, should we just use the zip?
[04:06] <wgrant> That would do it.
[04:06] <wgrant> Probably, yes.
[04:06] <huwshimi> wgrant: I actually didn't see the zip either
[04:06] <wgrant> modifying upstream tarballs without labeling them as modified is a good way to get people upset :)
[04:07] <wgrant> http://code.google.com/p/cssutils/downloads/detail?name=cssutils-0.9.7.zip&can=2&q= is one
[04:07] <wgrant> I thought there was one on pypi too.
[04:07] <wgrant> Although pypi makes it rather challenging to obtain a stable version...
[04:07] <huwshimi> wgrant: Oh right, I didn't look at the google code page
[04:08] <wgrant> Looks like they moved to bitbucket recently, and didn't bring across the old downloads.
[04:08] <lifeless> .
[04:08] <huwshimi> wgrant: Yeah ok, do you want me to replace it with the zip?
[04:09] <wgrant> huwshimi: That would be cleaner, I think.
[04:09] <wgrant> And sort of trivial.
[04:09] <huwshimi> wgrant: No problems
[04:09] <wgrant> Thanks.
[04:12] <wgrant> huwshimi: Ahhhhh CSS3 gradients.
[04:12] <wgrant> That is wonderful.
[04:13] <huwshimi> :D
[04:14] <huwshimi> wgrant: OK that file should be replaced
[04:15] <wgrant> huwshimi: Indeed, thanks.
[04:21] <huwshimi> wgrant: Thanks for the approve
[04:22] <huwshimi> wgrant: Is there any reason to not just lp-land the change to versions.cfg?
[04:22] <huwshimi> wgrant: Or should I be just as paranoid as I normally am
[04:24] <wgrant> huwshimi: It's late on Friday, so we can't deploy for three days anyway... might as well just land.
[04:24] <wgrant> It works fine here.
[04:24] <huwshimi> wgrant: OK :)
[04:25] <huwshimi> argh!
[04:25] <wgrant> Uhoh.
[04:25] <huwshimi> wgrant: Any ideas? http://paste.ubuntu.com/756731/
[04:26] <wgrant> Hmm, that's pretty awesome.
[04:26] <wgrant> Not one I've seen before.
[04:27] <huwshimi> wgrant: I seem to have a knack of coming across pretty awesome bugs
[04:28] <huwshimi> wgrant: Usually when it's friday afternoon and I want to land a few things :)
[04:40] <wgrant> Hmm.
[04:41] <wgrant> The beta banner doesn't seem to appear at all in IE9.
[04:41] <wgrant> The page just sits there loading eternally.
[04:41] <wgrant> Despite apparently having completely rendered otherwise.
[04:41] <StevenK> Do we care?
[04:44] <huwshimi> wgrant: Is that a js thing then?
[04:44] <wgrant> huwshimi: Probably. Other pages finish loading.
[04:44] <wgrant> It's the same on prod.
[04:45] <huwshimi> wgrant: Strange
[04:45] <wgrant> Unsurprisingly.
[04:45] <wgrant> Yeash
[04:45] <wgrant> yeah
[04:45] <huwshimi> oh, I have no idea about this lp-land thing
[04:45] <wgrant> pqm-submit, I guess.
[04:46] <rick_h_> wgrant: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/894797
[04:46] <_mup_> Bug #894797: bug portlet ajax calls break in IE and break js for other features <bugs> <ie> <javascript> <markup> <ui> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/894797 >
[04:46] <rick_h_> wgrant: I tried to test some IE stuff and hit that
[04:47] <wgrant> rick_h_: Aha.
[04:47] <wgrant> Thanks.
[04:47] <rick_h_> as soon as it hits an error it stops all other JS and the portlet stuff is pretty up there
[04:47] <rick_h_> might be what you're hitting, so other pages without the portlets are ok
[04:48] <wgrant> StevenK, wallyworld__: Could one of you review https://code.launchpad.net/~wgrant/launchpad/bug-728673/+merge/84205?
[04:48] <huwshimi> wgrant: oh, does that do a similar thing?
[04:48] <wallyworld__> wgrant: sure
[04:48] <wgrant> huwshimi: lp-land is a wrapper around pqm-submit.
[04:48] <wgrant> huwshimi: lp-land grabs the details from the MP and invokes pqm-submit the right way.
[04:48] <huwshimi> wgrant: oh right
[04:49] <wgrant> But normally if you're submitting to devel you can just say 'bzr pqm-submit -m '[r=wgrant] Blah blah blah I am a commit message'
[04:49] <huwshimi> wgrant: Should I just ec2 land this? :)
[04:50] <wgrant> That might fail the same way as lp-land.
[04:50] <wgrant> But maybe not.
[04:50] <huwshimi> wgrant: I'll give it a go
[04:51] <rick_h_> ec2 land will run ec2 test first
[04:51] <rick_h_> so beware it'll run for a bit if you were trying to avoid the test run
[04:51] <huwshimi> rick_h_: Yeah, but I'd rather that than accidentally screw something up :)
[05:09] <wallyworld__> wgrant: why remove the sprb formatter instead of just adding the permission check?
[05:09] <wgrant> wallyworld__: Because the only other difference between the two is that in one the archive was linked, while in the other it wasn't.
[05:10] <wgrant> wallyworld__: Which I've wanted to fix for a while anyway.
[05:10] <wgrant> wallyworld__: There's no reason for the SPRB one to exist separately.
[05:10] <wallyworld__> but the sprb formatter displays different text
[05:10] <wgrant> Does it?
[05:10] <wallyworld__> it appears to from my reading of the code
[05:10] <wgrant> If you look at the tests I changed, only the closing tag is differnt.
[05:11] <wallyworld__> ah, i think you are right
[05:11] <wallyworld__> i've misread the code i think
[05:11] <wgrant> It's easy to do with some of the formatters we have :/
[05:12] <wallyworld__> yeah. thanks for humouring my question. i thought it best to double check
[05:13] <wallyworld__> wgrant: r=me. also, did you see my email in reply to sinzui's email?
[05:13] <wgrant> wallyworld__: I replied to it like 2 minutes later.
[05:13] <wgrant> Thanks.
[05:14]  * wallyworld__ hits refresh on thunderbird
[05:15] <wallyworld__> wgrant: ah, i see the problem now.
[05:16] <wgrant> The private team implementation looks to have been a little lazy :)
[05:16] <wgrant> That's interesting, actually.
[05:16] <wallyworld__> wgrant: i think we have a hole in that the only protection is via travsrsal, no?
[05:16] <wgrant> Person searches may be a little revealing.
[05:16] <wgrant> Yes.
[05:16] <StevenK> wgrant: So how will SPRBs show up with your change?
[05:16] <wallyworld__> since my dicking with a test allowed me to see attrs
[05:17] <wallyworld__> StevenK: the same as now afaiui
[05:17] <wgrant> StevenK: Same as BPBs. Building _$title_ [$person/$archive]
[05:17] <wgrant> Or 'Building private job'
[05:17] <StevenK> Right, then the formatter was buggy and useless
[05:17] <wgrant> Rather than the current 'Building _$title [$person/$archive]_' and crash.
[05:18] <wallyworld__> wgrant: so if i fix this security issue, it will restore the current traversal protection and plug an access hole
[05:18] <wgrant> wallyworld__: Well.
[05:19] <wgrant> wallyworld__: You need to restrict all attributes to launchpad.View or launchpad.LimitedView rather than zope.Public.
[05:19] <wgrant> This may cause a lot of fallout.
[05:19] <wgrant> It remains to be seen.
[05:21] <wallyworld__> it does. but in theory, moving the IpersonPublic stuff behind a security adaptor which allows full access for public teams and delegates to the limitedview security adaptor for private teams should be the right thing to do
[05:21] <wgrant> It's certainly the right thing to do.
[05:21] <wgrant> I just think it may well break stuff.
[05:21] <wgrant> But we have to do it.
[05:22] <wallyworld__> yes. i'll do it and see what breaks in ec2 :-)
[05:22] <wgrant> Unlikely to catch everything, but not much more we can do.
[05:22] <wallyworld__> IPersonPublic is not really the correct name anymore either
[05:22] <wgrant> Indeed.
[05:22] <wgrant> It hasn't been for a while.
[05:22] <wgrant> Move stuff onto IPersonView/IPersonLimitedView
[05:23] <wallyworld__> not limited view - we only want access to name, url, displayname for linited view
[05:23] <wallyworld__> should be moved to IPersonRestrictedView perhaps
[05:24] <wgrant> Well, yes, clearly only move the appropriate stuff onto LimitedView.
[05:24] <wallyworld__> IPersonRestrictedView required launchpad.View permissions
[05:24] <wallyworld__> which is what we want
[05:24] <wgrant> Right.
[05:24] <wallyworld__> and the security adaptor for that permission allows public teams unfetted access
[05:24] <wallyworld__> which is what we want
[05:25] <wallyworld__> here's hoping.... that not too much breaks
[07:18] <micahg> is it known the distro selection widget is broken?
[07:18] <micahg> on bugs that is
[07:19] <micahg> it shows the first one in the list as selected when trying to modify multiple values at once
[07:21] <jtv> micahg: I'll have a look in the open bugs.
[07:21] <micahg> jtv: thanks, I can file a bug if one doesn't exist
[07:22] <jtv> micahg: doesn't look like we have one open for this.  So yes, please do file one!
[07:24] <micahg> jtv: stale page cache on my end, everything's fine :)
[07:24] <jtv> Heh
[07:24] <jtv> Unless the next person is going to have exactly the same problem, of course, in which case it doesn't really matter that things are fine in theory.  :-)
[07:26] <micahg> well, my use case was old bugs open in my session for quite a while, refresh still showed the issue, forced refresh shift+f5 fixed it
[07:27] <micahg> wallyworld__: trying to scare people :)
[07:27] <wallyworld__> micahg: no?
[07:27] <wallyworld__> you mean the bug count?
[07:27] <jtv> hi wallyworld__ — on your way to the weekend?
[07:27] <micahg> wallyworld__: heh, yeah :)
[07:27] <wallyworld__> jtv: i wish :-( I have to finish some coding
[07:28] <jtv> Oh well
[07:28] <wallyworld__> micahg: it was already like that. i just changed the reviewer :-)
[07:28] <micahg> wallyworld__: ah, ok, I must have missed that :)
[07:28] <wallyworld__> jtv: but i plan on popping a cork to help :-)
[07:28] <wallyworld__> micahg: but when it's written in that notation, it is scary for sure
[07:29] <micahg> wallyworld__: sorry, it's been like that for a while and I missed it :), yeah, I did a double take
[07:30] <wallyworld__> np :-)
[08:57] <bigjools> morning
[09:44] <adeuring> good morning
[09:45] <jtv> bigjools: I have two callback chains that I need to interleave just so for my test.  I would expect to have to orchestrate the events somehow.
[09:45] <jtv> hi adeuring
[09:45] <adeuring> hi jtv
[09:46] <jtv> adeuring: are you reviewing today?  If so, could you review one for me?  It's https://code.launchpad.net/~jtv/launchpad/bug-849683-cloner/+merge/84222
[09:46] <bigjools> jtv: let me just check the API
[09:46] <adeuring> jtv: I'll look
[09:46] <jtv> thanks
[09:48] <bigjools> jtv: so you can call d.callback() to manually run the callbacks
[09:49] <jtv> And that will stop at the point where the callback chain makes another async request, I take it.
[09:49] <jtv> Do I then proceed with the new callback returned from the original callback?
[09:49] <bigjools> if there are new Deferreds created then it gets harder, yes
[09:51] <bigjools> jtv: I can't remember if Deferreds are processed in the order they are created in the reactor.  It's probably best not to depend on that anyway
[09:51] <jtv> Right. ISTM any way I'm going to do this will be brittle: the interleaving will happen at the wrong point, and the test will either break in a mysterious way or become meaningless.
[09:52] <bigjools> jtv: we can avoid that, we just need to make sure we fire Deferreds in a certain order
[09:52] <jtv> But the order will be tightly coupled to internals that may change.
[09:53] <bigjools> jtv: no, I mean that you have a 2 deferreds in the test, the rest are incidental
[09:54] <jtv> The problem is that nothing interesting happens in the original deferreds.  They return new deferreds, and so on.
[09:54] <bigjools> but it would help if we could construct it such that there are no other deferreds created
[09:54] <jtv> I think we'd have to un-nest some functions.
[09:55] <jtv> A bit annoying given how they rely on local variables of the surrounding functions.
[09:55] <bigjools> jtv: the other option is to just keep calling the Deferred until None is returned
[09:55] <bigjools> see http://twistedmatrix.com/documents/current/api/twisted.internet.defer.Deferred.html
[09:55] <jtv> That's fine for one, but I need to get the interleaving right.
[09:56] <bigjools> runCallbacks()
[09:56] <jtv> Thanks.
[09:56] <bigjools> it will be file
[09:56] <bigjools> fine
[09:56] <bigjools> the chain of Deferreds only applies to a single builder
[09:56] <jtv> _runCallbacks?
[09:56] <bigjools> yes
[09:57] <bigjools> it stops when you get to a Deferred with no result, you'd just need to call _runCallbacks() on it
[09:57] <jtv> I guess we could follow the chain with a single builder, but it'll be less like the integration test you were hoping for.
[09:57] <bigjools> jtv: slightly less, but still valid
[09:57] <bigjools> the interleaving we want is still there
[09:58] <jtv> Then what exactly do we test for?  Abort after every step and see that the changes are still there?
[09:58] <jtv> Or conversely, commit after every step, trigger a failure, and see that the changes are aborted?
[09:58] <bigjools> we are testing the scenario I explained
[09:59] <bigjools> storeBuildInfo() defers to a communication with the builder
[09:59] <bigjools> in the meantime, another Deferred fires and aborts the txn
[09:59] <jtv> But how do we get it to just that stage?
[09:59] <bigjools> where "another" is in a different builder chain
[10:00] <bigjools> we make a fake builder than doesn't return the results that the storeBuildInfo() wants
[10:01] <bigjools> we can make it do nothing so the deferred does not return right away
[10:01] <bigjools> hmmm do we even need to do that
[10:02] <jtv> That's the question.  The problem is, we have to dig through at least some closures to get to a state where anything like the bug can happen.
[10:02] <bigjools> yes yes, I have it
[10:03] <jtv> then give it to me!
[10:03] <bigjools> we use a fake builder that will sleep for a while when asked for the build info
[10:04] <jtv> Argh!
[10:04] <bigjools> not a real sleep
[10:04] <bigjools> it's a callback-based one
[10:04] <bigjools> bear with me
[10:04] <bigjools> then we set up the other builder that will abort
[10:05] <bigjools> we can use a special reactor were you can wind the clock forwards but less than the sleep interval
[10:05] <bigjools> it'll make the 2nd builder abort
[10:05] <bigjools> but the first is still "waiting"
[10:05] <bigjools> ok?
[10:05] <bigjools> I can show you an example
[10:06] <jtv> Actually the part where the other builder fails can be simpler: we can call _scanFailed.
[10:06] <bigjools> or that
[10:06] <bigjools> it's easier to poke in a BrokenSlave
[10:06] <jtv> Already have that, but it saves some reactoring.
[10:07] <jtv> If we can just make the reactor return to us while storeBuildInfo is waiting to run, the rest should be easy.
[10:07] <bigjools> look in lib/lp/buildmaster/tests/test_manager.py
[10:07] <bigjools> search for Clock
[10:08] <bigjools> it's a reactor that you can use instead of the testing one
[10:08] <bigjools> let's you control how Deferreds are fired
[10:08] <bigjools> by winding time forwards
[10:08] <jtv> task.Clock?
[10:09] <bigjools> yes
[10:10] <jtv> I guess I need to adapt SlaveScanner.__init__ to accept a clock argument for testing, similar to the other scanners?
[10:11] <bigjools> yes
[10:11] <jtv> Hmm… actually that only exists on NewBuildersScanner, which passes it to its LoopingCall.
[10:12] <bigjools> it's to override the LoopingCall
[10:12] <jtv> The SlaveScanner has some equivalent to that?
[10:12] <bigjools> yes
[10:12] <jtv> Ah, it has one too
[10:12] <bigjools> it sets the clock on the LoopingCall
[10:13] <bigjools> this allows you to wind forwards one scanner but not another
[10:21] <jtv> bigjools: I can see how the clock would let me force the LoopingCall into action, but why not just do that by calling scan()?  The trouble is getting a simulated chain of interaction going and stopping it at the right point.
[10:24] <adeuring> jtv: the changes look good, and thanks a lot for the nice reformatting. just one question: what about a test?
[10:24] <jtv> adeuring: good point — we know that the column is initialized, but it'd be nice to check it for correctness.  Let me just see what the existing tests do.
[10:25] <adeuring> jtv: great, thanks!
[10:27] <bigjools> jtv: you need to set up a FakeBuilder so it pauses in the right place
[10:27] <bigjools> then you advance it to the pause point
[10:27] <bigjools> then run the other builder scan to completion
[10:28] <bigjools> jtv: you need a callLater() in the FakeBuilder to make it wait a bit
[10:28] <jtv> That means that the _runCallbacks will stop at that point?
[10:28] <bigjools> don't use runCallbacks
[10:29] <jtv> Oh
[10:29] <bigjools> use the Clock() as the reactor
[10:29] <jtv> And I guess I need a FakeSlave?
[10:29] <bigjools> yes
[10:29] <jtv> Not a FakeBuilder?
[10:29] <bigjools> sorry, yes
[10:35]  * gmb just realised that there's no TLA equivalent of "OTP" for "Having a conversation with another human being in real life"
[10:36] <jtv> How on Earth did we get by all this time?
[10:37] <nigelb> full sentences I guess ;)
[10:37]  * gmb -> real life
[10:38] <jtv> gmr irl omg
[10:48] <allenap> bigjools, anyone: Do you think mbp will get miffed if I change the trunk branch of txfixtures (to one owned by ~launchpad instead of ~mbp)?
[10:49] <wgrant> ~canonical-launchpad-branches, not ~launchpad
[10:49] <jtv> allenap: knowing him, no, as long as it's (1) well thought-out and (2) clearly documented and notified.
[10:49] <bigjools> I would not think so
[10:49] <bigjools> probably just an oversight
[10:49] <allenap> wgrant, jtv, bigjools: Cool, thanks all :)
[10:50] <jtv> bigjools: meanwhile, back on the broad and twisted path to hell, I just discovered that the triggering event just before the simulated problem comes from the Librarian, not from the slave.
[10:50] <wgrant> allenap: https://dev.launchpad.net/CreatingNewProjects has setup instructions
[10:50] <allenap> Ta.
[10:51] <bigjools> jtv: really?  I thought it was "        d = build.getLogFromSlave(build)"
[10:52] <jtv> bigjools: and you were right.  But, and this is exactly why I went with those narrow read-write policies, that call hides async calls to both slave and librarian.
[10:53] <jtv> Or maybe that's synchronous…  I'm not really seeing things clearly.
[10:54] <jtv> Ahhh no, I think that's synchronous.
[10:55] <bigjools> jtv: it calls getFile() on the slave first and then does a blocking upload to the librarian.    But the SA-80 probably more so, since it's a bullpup.
[11:04]  * jtv has a particular thing against people who don't mind where they point their assault rifles, especially when he ends up in front of them.
[11:05] <jtv> That's enough ramblings from my overheated brain.  I must go.
[11:08] <bigjools> jtv: sounds like you need a good dose of paracetamol and bedrest
[11:08] <jtv> bigjools: unfortunately I have a train to catch.  Promised to take care of my friends' house.
[11:08] <jtv> On the bright side, I sleep better on those night trains.
[11:08] <bigjools> I remember thoes
[11:09] <bigjools> those
[11:09] <bigjools> no station stop announcements!
[11:09] <jtv> I think they do announce them _sometimes_…
[11:09] <jtv> …probably to lull you into a false sense of security.
[11:11] <nigelb> heh
[11:12] <bigjools> well it lulled me into a sense of no sleep
[11:12] <nigelb> bigjools: You've visited India yet?
[11:12] <bigjools> I have no plans
[11:13] <nigelb> aww :(
[11:14] <bigjools> wgrant: yay you are fixing bug 728673
[11:14] <_mup_> Bug #728673: BuilderSet:+index crash (/builders) <oops> <Launchpad itself:In Progress by wgrant> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/728673 >
[11:18] <stub> jtv: Good luck with the train. Its a long weekend so will be packed!
[11:21] <jtv> stub: I booked ahead, thanks
[11:22] <jtv> good weekend everyone
[13:16] <rick_h_> morning
[13:17] <bac> morning rick_h_
[14:10] <jcsackett> morning, all.
[14:11] <rick_h_> morning jcsackett
[15:03] <sinzui> gmb, deryck, allenap: Do either of you have time to talk about renaming BugTaskSearchParams.bug_supervisor or structural_subscriber ?
[15:05] <deryck> sinzui, I'm sprinting and have two calls already this morning....
[15:05] <deryck> sinzui, but if no one else can help, I can try.
[15:06] <gmb> sinzui: I have a little time. What do you need to know?
[15:07] <sinzui> gmb, I think I cannot remove  BugTaskSearchParams.bug_supervisor because it is in the api. I probably need to add structural_subscriber to support older api
[15:07]  * gmb refreshes his memory
[15:07] <sinzui> gmb. search is actually looking at structural subscriptions, not bug supervisor in *most* cases
[15:09] <sinzui> gmb. The only case that may be interesting to search bug_supervisor is if you search from  team/user advanced search page and want to see all the bugs in all the projects the person supervises...
[15:09] <gmb> sinzui: Right, I'm with you.
[15:09] <gmb> I think you're right; I don't think bug_supervisor can be removed.
[15:09] <gmb> (At least until version 2.0)
[15:10] <sinzui> gmb: I can add a new param, and then fall back to the bug_supervisor is it was provided
[15:10] <sinzui> *if* it is provided
[15:11] <gmb> sinzui: Yes, I think that would work.
[15:12] <jml> random fact: 1.2GB of space on my system was being taken up by postgresql logs in a hardy chroot that I made for LP hacking and then forgot about
[15:12] <sinzui> gmb: bug_supervisor search will fail in many current cases because the default supervisor is the maintainer; the supervisor field is null. I think we should drop this case. We want to search for structural subscriptions on projects instead
[15:13] <gmb> sinzui: I agree.
[15:13] <sinzui> gmb: dropping the bug_supervisor column clause will make most searches faster because we already search ubuntu.bug_supervisor when the user is only looking for package subscriptions
[15:14] <gmb> Nice
[15:14] <sinzui> okay. I am going to try this and hope the api tests like me
[15:16] <gmb> sinzui: Best of luck to you :)....
[15:16] <sinzui> thank you very much
[15:16]  * gmb can't take the feeling that he's managed to let sinzui talk himself into a footcannon
[15:17] <sinzui> s/footcannon/disclosure/
[15:17] <rvba> adeuring, bac, could one of you guys please have a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~rvb/launchpad/authorize-bug-898237/+merge/84269 ?
[15:17] <adeuring> rvba: sure, i'll look
[15:18] <rvba> ta
[15:31] <deryck> abentley, standup time now ok?
[15:31] <deryck> adeuring, can you hear me on mumble?
[15:32] <adeuring> deryck: seems that mmle does use the tright sound output. just a second...
[15:34] <deryck> adeuring, still no sound luck?
[15:34] <deryck> adeuring, we hear you fine, FWIW.
[15:34] <adeuring> deryck: right...
[15:34] <adeuring> deryck: let me try another machine...,
[15:35] <deryck> adeuring, ok
[15:38] <deryck> adeuring, now we don't hear you at all.
[15:38] <adeuring> deryck: wierd... on this machine, all sounds goes to the headset -- only mumble does not use it...
[15:38] <deryck> adeuring, we need to start, so we'll go ahead.  we can chat with you via irc.  sorry.
[15:39] <adeuring> deryck: ok, sorry for the mess...
[15:47] <deryck> adeuring, we did hear you that time though.
[15:48] <deryck> adeuring, right.
[15:48] <deryck> adeuring, is mumble audio going to the right device?
[15:49] <adeuring> deryck: yes...
[15:50] <deryck> adeuring, I guess we lost you again?
[15:53] <deryck> mrevell, my entire team will join for the check point.  will we skype or conf call in?
[15:55] <mrevell> deryck, Hey, I'm happy with Skype but I can also do the conference call. Is Skype okay for the Orange squad?
[15:55] <deryck> mrevell, yup, skype works for us.
[15:56] <mrevell> Great
[15:57] <dobey> deryck: i'm surprised you're not meeting on PSN Home ;)
[15:58] <deryck> dobey, dude, if I could! :)
[16:00] <mrevell> Okay, calling now. I don't have adeuring or rick_h_ in my Skype contacts.
[16:01] <adeuring> mrevell: try "adeuring"
[16:01] <rick_h_> mrevell: mitechie
[16:01] <bigjools> HALP.  Running tests here and it gets as far as "Set up canonical.testing.layers.AppServerLayer" and then hangs.... anyone else seen that?
[16:02] <mrevell> Sorry jcsackett, accident.
[16:03] <jcsackett> mrevell: what was an accident?
[16:03] <mrevell> jcsackett, I thought I added you to a Skype conference.
[16:03] <jcsackett> mrevell: huh; i'm not on skype right now, so now worries. :-)
[16:04] <jcsackett> s/now worries/no worries/
[16:04] <mrevell> ok :)
[16:20] <mrevell> deryck, abentley flacoste danhg rick_h_ adeuring matsubara https://launchpadlibrarian.net/86370773/single_line_bugs.png
[16:27] <rvba> Hi gary_poster, the branch that refactors LaunchpadSecurityPolicy to have it cache sub checks performed by classes inheriting from DelegatedAuthorization is up for review! (that's the one we talked about a few days ago).  Gavin is reviewing it but maybe you will be willing to have a look, out of curiosity if nothing else ;).
[16:27] <rvba> https://code.launchpad.net/~rvb/launchpad/private-ppa-bug-890927-2/+merge/84243
[16:30] <mrevell> matsubara, "A way to specify the information displayed and ordering via the URL (bug 124342)"
[16:30] <_mup_> Bug #124342: It should be possible to specify bug list sort order via the URL <bug-columns> <lp-bugs> <Launchpad itself:Fix Released> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/124342 >
[16:31] <matsubara> thanks mer
[16:31] <matsubara> thanks mrevell
[16:38] <mrevell> deryck, https://dev.launchpad.net/Projects/CustomBugListings/Design
[16:55] <adeuring> rvba: r=me (sorry for the delay)
[16:55] <rvba> no worries, thanks for the review adeuring.
[16:56] <bigjools> can I bug one of you guys for a review please
[16:56] <gary_poster> rvba, awesome! what kind of performance improvement to you expect?
[16:58] <rvba> gary_poster: well, the page ~canonical-isd-hackers/+archive/ppa/+index spends 8 sec doing the checks that will be cached now…
[16:59] <rvba> So I expect it the performance improvement to be pretty serious in this case, and hopefully it will help else were as well.
[16:59] <rvba> s/expect it/expect/
[17:00]  * bigjools hi-fives rvba
[17:00] <rvba> bigjools: you should wait till this passes QA ;)
[17:01] <gary_poster> rvba, cool, me too.  I was hoping for hard (& exciting) numbers and I will look forward to them soon :-) ... have you timed this on qastaging so that you can get a relatively accurate comparison?
[17:01] <bigjools> I can merge it on DF right now if you want to test
[17:02] <rvba> gary_poster: well, this will fix repeated statements so it's pretty easy to guess what the gain will be (that is if everything does well).
[17:02] <gary_poster> right
[17:03] <gary_poster> I just like hard numbers :-)
[17:03] <gary_poster> (so bigjools' offer sounds good to me, but I'm a bystander)
[17:04] <rvba> gary_poster: hard numbers: https://launchpad.net/~canonical-isd-hackers/+archive/ppa spends ~6000 doing the repeated checks that will now hopefully be cached.
[17:05] <rvba> 6000ms that is.
[17:05] <rvba> bigjools: why not… but I'll have to go in ~30 minutes.
[17:06] <bigjools> ok, doing a load test on DF pre-patch
[17:06] <bigjools> rvba: which branch?
[17:07] <rvba> bigjools: lp:~rvb/launchpad/private-ppa-bug-890927-2
[17:07] <bigjools> that private PPA you posted *cough* takes 1.5 seconds pre-patch
[17:08] <rvba> bigjools: on df yes.
[17:08] <rvba> bigjools: https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=OOPS-d84aaa754e954254c44f803f45871daf  https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=OOPS-1baf5eff75609f641e53992c0023acb6
[17:09] <rvba> bigjools: can you access https://launchpad.net/~canonical-isd-hackers/+archive/ppa/+index ?
[17:09] <rvba> (Not on df that is)
[17:09] <bigjools> yes
[17:09] <bigjools> v quick, because I am commercial admin
[17:10] <rvba> bigjools: hum, also, on DF, we are admins so unless I'm mistaken the security checks are by passed…
[17:10] <rvba> Am I right?
[17:11] <bigjools> rvba: not bypassed, just different
[17:12] <rvba> bigjools: right, so it's not a good test.
[17:15] <gary_poster> https://qastaging.launchpad.net/~canonical-isd-hackers/+archive/ppa takes 8 secs once it loads at all
[17:15] <gary_poster> s 7.63 seconds
[17:15] <rvba> Right.
[17:16] <bigjools> gary_poster: can you try https://dogfood.launchpad.net/~canonical-isd-hackers/+archive/ppa
[17:18] <gary_poster> trying
[17:18] <gary_poster> bigjools, 1.57 s
[17:18] <bigjools> woo :)
[17:19] <gary_poster> so that is post-patch bigjools?
[17:19]  * bigjools hi-fives rvba
[17:19] <rvba> That's without the patch?
[17:19] <bigjools> with patch
[17:19] <bigjools> I can remove it to compare
[17:19] <rvba> I'd like to see how it goes without the patch
[17:19] <gary_poster> yeah
[17:20] <bigjools> ok try now
[17:20] <gary_poster> k
[17:21] <bigjools> unfortunately puppet is hammering DF
[17:21] <gary_poster> 2.77 s, 1.71 s, 1.51 s
[17:21] <gary_poster> so no proof yet
[17:21] <bigjools> there must be something else going on here
[17:21] <bigjools> need to find a slow one
[17:22] <rvba> Any private ppa with lots of different packages in it.
[17:24] <bigjools> that you are a member of
[17:27]  * deryck lunches with rick_h_
[17:42] <tumbleweed> bigjools: re sponsor-syncs-bug-827555: I assume "UI changes" includes visibility in source_package_publishing_history API objects?
[17:42] <bigjools> tumbleweed: no, web UI
[17:42] <bigjools> the API will be good
[17:43] <tumbleweed> Laney had a look at it and thought this merge wouldn't cover API visibility
[17:43] <bigjools> oh bugger actually I forgot one thing
[17:43] <bigjools> well then he's wrong :)
[17:44] <tumbleweed> :)
[17:44] <bigjools> I forgot to make the syncer known in the spph... darn.  Will fix that Monday.
[17:45] <bigjools> good night all, have a nice weekend
[17:45] <tumbleweed> bigjools: thanks
[17:56] <jcsackett> bac: you free to review https://code.launchpad.net/~jcsackett/launchpad/redundant-message-is-redundant/+merge/84308 by any chance?
[18:03] <bac> jcsackett: sure
[18:20] <bac> jcsackett: done
[18:21] <cjwatson> real    3m23.752s
[18:21] <cjwatson> ^- first cut at replacement for most of cron.germinate
[18:21] <cjwatson> running on my laptop with some stuff involving networking, so I expect cocoplum will be able to do it faster
[18:37] <jcsackett> thanks, bac.
[18:38] <cjwatson> 3m9s once I ensure everything's mirrored locally
[18:39] <cjwatson> that's with the major structural optimisations; there's surely still room for profiling
[18:57] <deryck> bac, hi.  rick_h_ and I have a branch for review if you have the time.
[18:57] <bac> deryck: sure do
[18:57] <deryck> bac, Thanks!  https://code.launchpad.net/~deryck/launchpad/buglists-loading-885272-final/+merge/84183
[18:59] <deryck> bac, and sorry for the length, but it's new js code, so not as much there as the line number indicates.
[18:59] <bac> yowzer!  :)
[18:59] <deryck> heh :)
[19:01] <deryck> rick_h_, https://dev.launchpad.net/Orange/NewStarter
[19:14] <deryck> rick_h_, https://dev.launchpad.net/MaintenanceRotationSchedule
[19:42] <bac> rick_h_, deryck: i don't understand this sentence:
[19:42] <bac> This is using the YUI concept of class extensions to get us min-in like
[19:42] <bac> 225	+     * features from the Widget classes.
[19:42] <bac> "min-in like" ??
[19:42] <rick_h_> max-in
[19:42] <rick_h_> mix
[19:43] <rick_h_> that's me, meant mix-in
[19:43] <rick_h_> typo, but we actually ripped that out
[19:43] <bac> oh, ok
[19:43] <rick_h_> so that comment shold go away
[19:43] <rick_h_> should...if I could type
[19:43] <bac> :)
[19:47] <abentley> rick_h_: Nobody's prefect.
[19:48] <abentley> deryck: AFAICT person/+portlet-otherpackages is completely unused, but would be accessible via URL hacking.    "// Mess with the position of target div."
[19:56] <deryck> heh
[19:56] <rick_h_> bac: lol, I don't know, it is late in the week and I've been hearing too much twang this week
[19:56] <deryck> I think I wrote that, bac
[19:56] <flacoste> bac: there is https://code.launchpad.net/~flacoste/launchpad/self-hosted-3rd-party-js/+merge/84319 in needs of a reviewer when you are free
[19:57] <bac> flacoste: ok.
[19:58] <bac> deryck: I see this a few times:  Assert.isFalse(this.indicator.get('visible'), 'visible is not set');
[19:58] <bac> Isn't the error message backwards?  The assert fails because visible is set.
[19:58] <rick_h_> the message was more a helper for us to see in the log that it came back wrong
[19:58] <rick_h_> because that onlyshows when it failed
[19:59] <bac> rick_h_: right, but it seems the message is backwards
[19:59] <rick_h_> so "what we did wrong" vs "what is the actual check"
[19:59] <deryck> bac, yeah, what rick_h_ says. I'd prefer to drop the message.  It is backwards, but it was meant more has "did the visible check fail or the other assert fail"
[19:59] <deryck> s/has/as/
[20:06] <bac> flacoste: is the diff correct?  1921 lines?  (i suspect it is)
[20:08] <flacoste> bac: probably, i haven't checked the number of lines, but most is ignorable, unless you want to review obfuscate Google GS code ;-)
[20:09] <flacoste> JS
[20:09] <bac> GoogleScript -- its coming
[20:16] <jcsackett> bac: isn't it called Dart? :-P
[20:18] <bac> flacoste: what is this doing, in the CSS?
[20:18] <bac> src: local('Ubuntu Italic'), local('Ubuntu-Italic'), url('https://themes.googleusercontent.com/static/fonts/ubuntu/v3/kbP_6ONYVgE-bLa9ZRbvvvesZW2xOQ-xsNqO47m55DA.woff') format('woff');
[20:18] <bac> flacoste: it is still loading from google, no?
[20:18] <flacoste> bac: is is, but that's the web font specification
[20:18] <bac> but just the font file, so it is ok?
[20:18] <flacoste> which shouldn't be a problem
[20:18] <flacoste> right
[20:18] <flacoste> only the font file
[20:19] <bac> ok, that was the only suspect thing i saw
[20:19] <flacoste> CSS can be used to load JS extensions
[20:19] <flacoste> so that's why we removed the external CSS loading
[20:19] <bac> right
[20:19] <flacoste> but i'm not aware of any such vulnerability in woff
[20:20] <flacoste> so there have been a bunch of vulnerability in woff decoders over the years
[20:20] <flacoste> but that's usually in the form of a local exploit, rather than an attack against the site linking to it
[20:21] <flacoste> although one could say that if I root your browser, it's as good as if I could execute JS in it
[20:21] <flacoste> but i don't think we should care about that
[20:28] <rick_h_> flacoste: did we look at caja or adsafe for running 3rd party JS safely?
[20:28] <rick_h_> flacoste: or just mandate it's not friendly regardless of method of inclusion?
[20:30] <flacoste> rick_h_: we haven't
[20:32] <nigelb> jml: Can you turn off the logging to errors only?
[20:32] <nigelb> jml: Nevermind, stale scrollback :/
[20:32] <flacoste> rick_h_: caja looks nice
[20:33] <rick_h_> flacoste: yea, watched a yui video from crockford that mentioned those last night
[20:33] <rick_h_> and wondered if they might help us keep some 3rd party js in a safe manner
[20:38] <flacoste> i think it does
[20:38] <flacoste> since you can deny the contained JS access to the user cookies
[20:38] <flacoste> which is what we are protecting for
[20:39] <flacoste> because if you have the user's cookie, you can basically do anything you can over the API or web as that user
[20:39] <flacoste> which is a lot
[21:06] <sinzui> If we had a charm to setup caja scripts, we could call it cajajuju. I would put a Kajagoogoo easter egg on the page. The "Too shy" song would play when your mouse crossed the 3rd party cookies text the description
[21:09] <abentley> bac: could you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~abentley/launchpad/packagebugs/+merge/84329 ?
[21:10] <bac> abentley: yes
[21:10] <abentley> bac: thanks.
[21:48] <bac> abentley: done,  thanks.
[21:49] <deryck> bac, FWIW img is a naturally self closing tag. ;)
[21:49] <bac> deryck: :)
[21:49] <deryck> bac, but I changed div to match.  I'm actually not that strongly opinionated about that, despite any past statements of mine. :)
[21:50] <bac> deryck: it is not something to get too worked up about!
[21:50] <deryck> indeed
[21:50] <deryck> YUI itself uses both forms.
[21:51] <abentley> bac: thanks.
[21:52] <abentley> bac: I extracted that code with minimal changes, but I'm happy to tweak its handling of "advanced".
[21:52] <bac> abentley: your call.
[21:53] <abentley> bac: I think it actually makes more sense to do that by doing params['advanced'] = '1'
[21:53] <bac> abentley: +1
[23:18] <wgrant> flacoste: I don't believe you can do that.
[23:18] <wgrant> flacoste: The font names are not meant to be staitc.
[23:21] <wgrant> I'm glad we're going to send all our private URLs and other data to Google again :)
[23:32] <lifeless> wgrant: you know we have google dcs etc
[23:32] <lifeless> *docs*
[23:32] <lifeless> wgrant: ga getting our data wasn't ever an issue; the risks around site compromise were
[23:33] <wgrant> Sure, but I still don't like it at all :)


[04:57] <InHisName> morning again
[09:34] <rmg51> Morning
[12:13] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, dogs, turkeys, hamsters and everything else
[12:39] <ChinnoDog> morning
[12:40] <teddy-dbear> o/
[13:16] <lazyPower> O/
[18:33] <MutantTurkey> just ran into amir after the first time in like 3 years...
[18:34] <MutantTurkey> wait not sure if he's in this irc circle.
[18:50] <ChinnoDog> oh noes. Worlds colliding.
[18:50] <MutantTurkey> lol
[20:03] <adom> Don't get why my nick keeps changing to adom_
[20:03] <adom> I don't know how to IRC right.
[20:03] <adom> :/


[12:25] <cmn> hi, what would be the best tool for moving a bunch of commits to a branch in a different repository? would that still be replay from bzr-rewrite?
[13:23] <jelmer> cmn: pull/push?
[13:25] <cmn> jelmer: that would work even for disconnected branches?
[13:25] <cmn> presumably through -r?
[13:25] <jelmer> cmn: no, it wouldn't work for disconnected branches
[13:25] <jelmer> replay wouldn't work either ,though
[13:26] <cmn> there's a thing in the bug tracker that at least makes it look like it does
[13:26] <cmn> though I haven't checked too deeply
[14:47] <jelmer> cmn: it works based on fileids, and the file ids will be different if you have two disconnected branches
[14:48] <jelmer> cmn: (replay also has other issues)
[14:48] <cmn> jelmer: yeah, it turns out it ends up removing a ton of stuff
[15:01] <jelmer> cmn: I think fastexport/fastimport is probably the best thing available at this point
[15:02] <cmn> yes, that's what it looks like
[15:03] <cmn> though the docs say it wants to create the branch itself
[15:03] <cmn> I'll have to dig deeper
[15:11] <jelmer> cmn: it supports applying changes to an existing branches
[15:11] <jelmer> s/branches/branch/
[15:13] <cmn> excellent


[21:42] <feneco> hi, my laptop turned off while running a make check, and after that I could not start X anymore, any ideas what I could do? here are the logs: http://termbin.com/vftf


[00:01] <SebastianTCL> what do you mean?    Sure, good that you've got it.  Just remember patience and the people here are all volunteers.
[00:16] <wxl> SebastianTCL: example of antisocial behavior http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/12/17/%23lubuntu.html#t22:01
[00:19] <SebastianTCL> I appreciate your understanding.
[00:19] <SebastianTCL> Unit193
[00:27] <wxl> SebastianTCL: i'm sure you mean well. just make it sound like you do, ok? :)
[02:10] <SebastianTCL> I installed lubuntu 15.10, trying to run a live cd but it's not being detected on boot up
[02:10] <SebastianTCL> also i am having to of fctix everytime to get my keyboard layout in english, it defaults to spanish after reboot
[03:48] <nemo_> someone's kidnapped my name
[05:20] <SebastianTCL> How can I make it so that my file manager shows all folders in compact view persistently after boot up?
[14:46] <SebastianTCL> ok skpe is not picking up my mic
[14:46] <SebastianTCL> neither is google hangouts
[14:46] <SebastianTCL> nor facebool calls
[14:46] <SebastianTCL> i installed pulseaudio
[14:46] <SebastianTCL> am i supposed to get rid of alsa?
[14:49] <SebastianTCL> pulseaudio is not showing my laptops mic
[14:56] <SebastianTCL> now there's no sound at all
[14:58] <SebastianTCL> do i have to get rid of alsa?
[14:58] <ianorlinqt> no don't get rid of alsa
[16:18] <Bendr> hello
[16:18] <Bendr> Can anyone help me reset my default lubuntu desktop?
[16:21] <leszek> Bendr: user settings ? Just create a new user
[16:22] <Bendr> leszek, can revert the changes on the current user?
[16:22] <Bendr> leszek, i have some files on the desktop
[16:22] <leszek> Bendr: if you didn't any backups no. What you can do is remove all configs and theoretically it should restore the default ones
[16:23] <Bendr> yes, that's true, i'll copy my files, thank you