[12:41] <rmjb> Hey Fujitsu
[12:42] <Fujitsu> Morning rmjb.
[12:42] <rmjb> Evening
[12:44] <keescook> seb128 is too fast for me, and he isn't even logged in to irc.  :)
[02:03] <rmjb> I want to help, just pick something from this list: http://tinyurl.com/n8g6a and get it to build right?
[02:03] <LaserJock> rmjb: sounds good :-)
[02:04] <rmjb> if someone's already commented move on? eg: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/vdr/+bug/65340
[02:04] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 65340 in vdr "[UNMETDEPS]  vdr has unmet dependencies" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[02:04] <LaserJock> well, read what they commented
[02:05] <rmjb> that it depends on dvb-dev... that's left to fix or not fixable?
[02:06] <LaserJock> that just says that's what the unmet dep was
[02:06] <rmjb> cool
[02:06] <LaserJock> the bug is first reported to just say that there was an unmet dep
[02:06] <LaserJock> then Caroline commented and said what the unmet dep is
[02:07] <ajmitch> not always accurately
[02:07] <LaserJock> right
[02:07] <rmjb> gotcha
[02:30] <rmjb> when updating a dependency against kernel headers, is it okay to set the dependency to linux-headers-386? or will that cause problems when building on other archs?
[02:36] <zul> yay laptop searches at the border
[02:45] <rmjb> I figured out my last question, apparently linux-libc-dev works in place of linux-kernel-headers
[03:18] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:38] <rmjb> another question (I am full of them aren't I?) some source packages from http://tinyurl.com/n8g6a fail to build but the dependency is not in main, but in universe... what's the solution in that case?
[03:39] <ajmitch> explain..
[03:39] <ajmitch> dependency not in main?
[03:40] <rmjb> libgpiv https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/libgpiv/+bug/65356 fails to build from source
[03:40] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 65356 in libgpiv "[UNMETDEPS]  libgpiv has unmet dependencies" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[03:40] <rmjb> has unmep deps of fftw-dev and libhdf5-serial-dev
[03:40] <rmjb> fftw-dev is in universe, but fftw3-dev is in main
[03:40] <rmjb> so updating to fftw3-dev solves that
[03:40] <ajmitch> why is that a problem?
[03:41] <rmjb> well... it fails to build and there's an unmet dep entry in malone for it
[03:41] <rmjb> the build servers pull only from main?
[03:42] <ajmitch> no, if that were the case then 95% of universe wouldn't build
[03:42] <Fujitsu> rmjb: No, they pull from everywhere.
[03:42] <Fujitsu> What ajmitch said.
[03:42] <rmjb> and my pbuilder
[03:42] <rmjb> I can too install fftw-dev too
[03:42] <Fujitsu> rmjb: You need to configure your pbuilder to pull from universe and multiverse as well.
[03:44] <rmjb> okay then... will look into that
[03:54] <psusi> I am trying to write a bash script that greps the output of one command to decide something, but the command to the left in the pipeline's status is used to decide truth, rather than the status of the grep to the right in the pipeline
[03:54] <psusi> how could I overcome this?
[03:56] <rmjb> psusi: can you give an example?
[03:57] <psusi> if echo foo | grep -q -e foo ; then ____ ; fi
[03:57] <psusi> echo returns true, so the if evaluates as true.... even though grep returns false... well, not in that example... but if echo wasn't echoing foo but something else
[03:58] <psusi> wait.... nevermind
[03:58] <psusi> I think I just confused myself
[04:02] <psusi> ok.... yea... I just screwed up the test and confused myself.... I thought it was supposed to be the right, not the left status
[04:02] <psusi> that is used from the pipeline
[04:02] <rmjb> sometimes you just need to talk it out
[04:03] <psusi> hehe
[04:18] <rmjb> Something's listed as having unmet deps in the list to work on, but it's listed in the repos with the correct version... that means it was fixed and should be closed on malone?
[04:18] <ajmitch> not necessarily
[04:18] <rmjb> it builds for me
[04:19] <ajmitch> doesn't mean that all binary packages are installable on all architectures
[04:19] <rmjb> ok
[04:32] <rmjb> setting Depends: ${shlibs:Depends} makes the binary package dependent on the version of the libs that are used to compile against?
[04:51] <psusi> what the crap?
[04:52] <psusi> all I have to do is insert a blank line in /usr/share/initramfs-tools/hooks/dmraid and update-initramfs bombs out with:
[04:52] <psusi> eval: 1: array_dmraid~=: not found
[04:52] <rmjb> huh? what are you trying to do?
[04:53] <psusi> udevify dmraid
[04:53] <rmjb> udevify?
[04:53] <psusi> yea... make it scan disks as they are detected by udev rather than in a static boot time script
[04:53] <psusi> so my system can boot newer kernels that scan for the drives in the background
[04:54] <psusi> oh my god.... can it really be so silly?
[04:54] <psusi> emacs made a backup save ending in ~ and it doesn't like that
[04:54] <rmjb> oh, this is to fix the dmraid bug #54246 ?
[04:54] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 54246 in dmraid "DMRAID stopped to work in kernels > 2.6.15" [Undecided,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54246
[04:55] <psusi> oh, I didn't know there was a bug filed for it
[04:55] <rmjb> two
[04:55] <rmjb> other one: #67606
[04:55] <psusi> ohh, that one is a seperate bug
[04:55] <rmjb> yeah
[04:55] <psusi> that is due to dmraid being buggy on via metadata and trying to create a stripe using the ENTIRE drive
[04:56] <rmjb> separate issues
[04:56] <psusi> instead of just the portion of the disk actually used ( not the last few sectors that aren't enough for another whole stripe )
[04:56] <psusi> I have a patch for that one too
[04:56] <psusi> sent it upstream
[04:57] <rmjb> what dmraid package are you using now?
[04:58] <psusi> self build from the latest upstream sources
[04:58] <rmjb> ok
[05:00] <psusi> yea, I made a patch for that bug so the kernel won't refuse the new dmraid table, but now dmraid is run before the kernel detects the disks
[05:00] <psusi> because they now scan for the drives in the backround rather than blocking the modprobe
[05:01] <rmjb> the first bug? it's fixed in versions above rc10
[05:01] <Fujitsu> Heya Hobbsee.
[05:03] <Hobbsee> hey Fujitsu :)
[05:03] <ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
[05:03] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
[05:04] <psusi> not for via
[05:05] <rmjb> o i c
[05:05] <psusi> not sure if they fixed it for nvidia or something
[05:05] <psusi> but I got rc13 and it was still bugged...
[05:05] <psusi> just commented on that but with my 2 line patch to fix it
[05:06] <rmjb> this is to boot a system with / on fakeraid or just get access to fakeraid partitions on a running system?
[05:06] <psusi> root on
[05:06] <psusi> well, either way
[05:07] <rmjb> I was *trying* to help some guy that had his root on fake raid under dapper, and it was working, but upgrading to edgy could not boot into the 2.6.17 kernel
[05:08] <rmjb> after a few hours he booted the live cd, installed dmraid rc13 from the bug report and used that initrd, and his system booted
[05:08] <psusi> yea.... that is because the new kernel will not accept sizes that are not an even multiple of the stripe width, and dmraid has always been bugged and used the entire disk size... at least for via
[05:09] <rmjb> well this guy was on nvidia
[05:09] <psusi> did he have via or nv?
[05:09] <psusi> let me check that module real quick, see if it has the same problem
[05:09] <rmjb> I have nvidia and the rc13 from the bug report works for me to access partitions on a fakeraid array
[05:09] <ajmitch> the Hobbsee_ clones are invading now
[05:10] <rmjb> my root is not on it though
[05:10] <Hobbsee> indeed.  muhahaha
[05:10] <psusi> strange.... looks like nv has the same bug
[05:10] <psusi> it doesn't round down
[05:10] <rmjb> cause it makes us feel like we're running the real thing
[05:11] <psusi> because it is dirt cheap and fast
[05:11] <rmjb> that's weird, cause I can access my partitions on my fakeraid
[05:11] <psusi> can't boot from that or dual boot with windows
[05:12] <psusi> rmjb, are you sure with the earlier version you got the error: device-mapper: dm-stripe: Target length not divisible by chunk size
[05:12] <rmjb> and this guy, when he used the livecd to install rc13, he cause use that generated initrd to boot his regular system
[05:12] <rmjb> yep
[05:13] <psusi> strange....
[05:13] <psusi> oh wait a second
[05:13] <rmjb> that was before I updated my initrd
[05:13] <psusi> rc13 you say?
[05:13] <psusi> strange... I'm looking at rc12-pre1
[05:13] <psusi> I just pulled it the other day and it was the latest
[05:13] <zul> right im going to bed
[05:14] <Fujitsu> 'night, zul.
[05:14] <psusi> oh, ok... rc13 is there now ;)
[05:14] <rmjb> yes, after installing rc13 and updating my initrd I can get to my partitions, BUT there still seems to be an issue with booting to it
[05:14] <rmjb> g'night zul
[05:14] <psusi> what issue is that?
[05:14] <ajmitch> night zul
[05:14] <Fujitsu> A zul-fabbione tag-team is it? :P
[05:14] <psusi> probably the udev stuff I was working on ;)
[05:14] <rmjb> dunno, it just didn't work, wasn't my system so I couldn't dig deeper
[05:15] <rmjb> I'd be interested to see if you get yours to boot
[05:15] <rmjb> but I gtg
[05:15] <psusi> what is the proper procedure for doing an upstream source upgrade to a package?  so far I just untar the new tarball and copy the debian directory from the old package to the new untared directory and kind of kludge it
[05:15] <Fujitsu> uupdate can do it for you.
[05:16] <psusi> ahh, sweet
[05:16] <Fujitsu> Unpack the existing source package, cd into it, and run `uupdate /path/to/new/source.tar.gz'
[05:16] <psusi> what if the package is .bz2?
[05:17] <Fujitsu> bunzip2 and gzip it first.
[05:17] <psusi> I think I ran into trouble the other day because the deb tools don't like bz2
[05:17] <rmjb> psusi: why repackage rc13? you can use the one in the bug report
[05:17] <Fujitsu> Yeah, you need to turn it into a gzip.
[05:17] <psusi> yea, that's what I did... was hoping there was aw ay to kick the tools into using bz2
[05:17] <psusi> rmjb, ohh, I guess I can now... cool
[05:18] <psusi> wait... only a binary is there
[05:18] <rmjb> here: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3348
[05:18] <rmjb> for source
[05:18] <psusi> ahh, kk
[05:18] <rmjb> still waiting on review
[05:19] <Fujitsu> rmjb: You normally don't use REVU for that sort of thing. REVU is meant to new/rewritten packages.
[05:19] <rmjb> hmm... where should I send my update then?
[05:20] <Fujitsu> rmjb: Attach it to the bug.
[05:20] <rmjb> ohh... a dpatch, a diff or just the changes file?
[05:21] <Fujitsu> Because it's a new upstream version, the entire source package (.dsc, .diff.gz, .orig.tar.gz)
[05:21] <rmjb> actually, the maintainer of dmraid hasn't addressed the bug yet (filed since July)
[05:21] <Fujitsu> If it's not a new upstream version, a debdiff is fine.
[05:22] <rmjb> I guess because the maintainer is Utnubu
[05:22] <psusi> well, that's nice... firefox is using a gig of ram
[05:22] <ajmitch> psusi: is that all?
[05:28] <rmjb> okay, I've uploaded my source package, who do I ping to let them know it's there?
[05:29] <Fujitsu> You need to request a UVF exception, but the chances of such a thing happening now are absolutely minimal.
[05:30] <rmjb> now as in this close to launch or as in after freeze?
[05:30] <Fujitsu> This close to launch.
[05:30] <rmjb> psusi: I just had to reboot because even after I closed everything (firefox, synaptic, bittorrent, etc) I was still using over 400M of RAM
[05:30] <Fujitsu> A few days ago it would probably have been approved, but probably not in the last 24 hours before release...
[05:31] <rmjb> Fujitsu: yeah I figured it wont go in now, it's just frustrating to be broken for so long, I hope it gets fixed in edgy
[05:31] <rmjb> or rather that the fix makes it into edgy
[05:36] <psusi> god damnit
[05:36] <psusi> where do you search the lkml?  I can't find the search box on lkml.org
[05:36] <psusi> I remember seeing something about a module you can probe that will block until all disks have been scanned
[05:36] <psusi> loading that in the boot script should be a quick and simple fix
[05:37] <Fujitsu> Ew ew ew...
[05:37] <psusi> eh?
[05:37] <Fujitsu> RPM stuff.
[05:38] <rmjb> it's done by a redhat guy
[05:38] <Fujitsu> ... WHY are there vim swap files in the upstream source?
[05:39] <psusi> oh... yea
[05:39] <psusi> I noticed that too ;)
[05:39] <psusi> his tarball isn't very distclean
[05:39] <psusi> actually, I pissed off the dh scripts by doing a make distclean, which deleted some files that were in his tarball
[05:40] <psusi> so the dh scripts bitched that I had modified files in the .orig.gz outside /debian
[05:42] <psusi> god damnit, I can't find the mention now of that module to wait on the background scanning
[05:42] <psusi> it is lost somewhere in the massive flow that is lkml
[05:49] <LaserJock> ajmitch & Amaranth: ping
[05:49] <ajmitch> LaserJock: yes?
[05:50] <LaserJock> ajmitch: have you found a place to stay in Mountain View
[05:50] <ajmitch> no idea yet
[06:01] <rmjb> Fujitsu: updated the source package attached to the bug as per your comment
[06:01] <rmjb> thanks for the eyes
[06:04] <Fujitsu> No problem.
[06:10] <LaserJock> anybody know of docs on the Debian release process?
[06:10] <LaserJock> like timeline and what happens
[06:10] <Fujitsu> Timeline? What timeline?
[06:10] <LaserJock> yeah, yeah
[06:11] <LaserJock> it sounds like they really are going to release
[06:11] <LaserJock> I want to make sure I don't miss a freeze or something for the packages I maintain in Debian
[06:11] <Fujitsu> They do say Decembter, but this is Debian, remember.
[06:11] <LaserJock> yes, but this time they have the dunc tank  ;-)
[06:13] <psusi> what was the helper script to take a .dsc and untar the .orig.tar.gz and apply the diff to it?
[06:14] <LaserJock> dpkg-source -x
[06:14] <psusi> ty
[06:17] <rmjb> g'night all
[06:17] <rmjb> good luck psusi
[06:39] <ben_> hey guys, i was just wondering how hard it is to learn how to package
[06:40] <Burgundavia> ben_: not hard, there is a great guide for it
[06:40] <ben_> not hard...considering...i dont know any languages...i just want to help out
[06:40] <ben_> im not a noob, but im no hacker either
[06:41] <ben_> where might i find that guide?
[06:41] <imbrandon> !package guide
[06:41] <ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources
[06:42] <imbrandon> and knowing a lang isnt nessesary, but helpfull
[06:42] <imbrandon> :)
[06:42] <imbrandon> moins all
[06:42] <imbrandon> LaserJock, its pretty close to freeze if not frozen already ( debian testing )
[06:43] <ben_> awesome thanks all
[06:44] <LaserJock> imbrandon: everything is frozen
[06:44] <LaserJock> ?
[06:44] <imbrandon> no just stuff migrating from unstable to testing ( e.g. what will make it into etch )
[06:44] <imbrandon> sid never freezes
[06:45] <LaserJock> hmm, that stinks
[06:46] <LaserJock> I thought just the core was frozen
[06:46] <imbrandon> ummm debian everything is in "main" cept non-free
[06:48] <LaserJock> imbrandon: I know, but I thought they had a list of like the kernel, libc, etc. that were frozen before the others
[06:48] <imbrandon> ahh no idea
[06:50] <imbrandon> hum ajmitch your probably gonna be bringing a lappy right ? http://it.slashdot.org/it/06/10/24/2028215.shtml
[06:50] <imbrandon> thats gonna suck if it happenes to someone
[06:51] <ajmitch> imbrandon: sure
[06:51] <imbrandon> seems a few have been confiscated at the border
[06:52] <imbrandon> :(
[06:52] <ajmitch> though there are probably several million laptops that go through the borders without being confiscated
[06:52] <imbrandon> true
[06:52] <ajmitch> it'd be more of a worry if I carry vegemite ;)
[06:52] <imbrandon> heh
[06:53] <imbrandon> why is that ?
[06:53] <imbrandon> isnt that a food ?
[06:53] <ajmitch> yes
[06:53] <Fujitsu> It's banned due to containing folate.
[06:54] <Fujitsu> (in the US)
[06:54] <imbrandon> ahh
[06:54] <ajmitch> so the rumour goes
[06:54] <imbrandon> that sounds kinda silly
[06:54] <ajmitch> though we're not entirely sure how much of the reporting on it is accurate
[06:55] <imbrandon> how reliable is news.com.au ?
[06:55] <imbrandon> http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,20620744-953,00.html
[06:55] <Fujitsu> I've heard it from many non-Internet-based sources, so it's fairly reliable, I believe.
[06:56] <tritium> Well, crap.  I wanted ajmitch to bring me some vegemite.
[06:59] <imbrandon> hehe
[07:00] <Burgundavia> US has officially denied it
[07:00] <Fujitsu> Where?
[07:01] <lotusleaf> what isn't banned in the U.S.?
[07:01] <Burgundavia> vegemite
[07:01] <Burgundavia> otherwise known as Aussie Road Tar
[07:02] <Fujitsu> Vegemite is good!
[07:02] <Burgundavia> for certain values of good
[07:02] <Burgundavia> that most of the world doesn't share
[07:02] <Fujitsu> For all values of good.
[07:02] <Burgundavia> you are wacked
[07:02] <Fujitsu> As long as you don't put it on too thickly.
[07:02] <Burgundavia> :)
[07:02] <ajmitch> vegemite > *
[07:02] <Burgundavia> s/too thickly/at all/
[07:02] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: yup.
[07:03] <imbrandon> lol
[07:09] <LaserJock> what the heck is vegemite?
[07:09] <LaserJock> I've been seeing that story all over the place lately
[07:09] <Burgundavia> LaserJock: nasty black paste that aussies and south africans put on toast
[07:09] <LaserJock> oh
[07:10] <Burgundavia> vegetable version of marmite, another nasty black paste that aussies and south africans love
[07:10] <LaserJock> they don't have jam?
[07:10] <ajmitch> LaserJock: it's great stuff
[07:10] <_MMA_> "He just smiled an gave me a vegemite sandwich"
[07:10] <ajmitch> LaserJock: this is far better than jam or any of that boring stuff
[07:10] <FunnyLookinHat> sounds like gnutella   (SO GOOD)
[07:10] <Fujitsu> It's very good.
[07:11] <Fujitsu> FunnyLookinHat: Nutella, you mean?
[07:11] <Burgundavia> notice all the aussies are telling us how good it is
[07:11] <Burgundavia> nobody else likes the stuff
[07:11] <_MMA_> LaserJock: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegemite
[07:11] <LaserJock> hmm
[07:11] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: you call me an Aussie?
[07:11] <Fujitsu> Ah, but I'm Canadian!
[07:11] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: close enough...
[07:11] <lotusleaf> crikey, eh?
[07:12] <FunnyLookinHat> Fujitsu, ah right, yes Nutella   : )
[07:12] <Fujitsu> Unless you like putting P2P networks on bread/toast...
[07:13] <FunnyLookinHat> LOL
[08:47] <Kagou> hi
[09:09] <dholbach> good morning
[09:18] <Hobbsee> hey dholbach, when does universe freeze?
[09:19] <dholbach> I have not heard anything about it yet, so go ahead :-)
[09:20] <Hobbsee> heh
[09:20] <Hobbsee> dholbach: mithrandir said you ought to know :P
[09:22] <dholbach> I'm happy to get fixes still in
[09:36] <Amaranth> someone say my name?
[09:37] <lotusleaf> Amaranth: no, but I will if it pleases you. =)
[09:37] <Amaranth> haha
[09:37] <lotusleaf> *<:O)
 dholbach: it's time to stop accepting uploads for anything but a showstopper, including universe.  we should have dedicated access to the publisher if we need to act quickly
[11:00] <Hobbsee> dholbach: awwww
[11:47] <sivang> morning
[03:03] <siretart> mplayer has just been accepted in debian/main! http://incoming.debian.org/mplayer_1.0~rc1~svn20199-1.dsc
[03:05] <TheMuso> WOw.
[03:05] <sivang> siretart: how come?
[03:05] <sivang> license change?
[03:05] <siretart> sivang: no. the maintainer fixed the package
[03:09] <Nafallo> OMG
[03:09] <Nafallo> is it crack? ;-)
[03:09] <jsgotangco> wow
[03:12] <siretart> that's what I call a debian/copyright file!
[03:12] <siretart> we should use it as example for revu! ;)
[03:14] <gnomefreak> does that mean feisty will have mplayer in main?
[03:14] <lophyte> that would rock
[03:14] <gnomefreak> that doesnt sound legit
[03:17] <bhale> mplayer in main? holy crap
[03:17] <bhale> i doubt it
[03:18] <siretart> gnomefreak: we need to reinvestigate several source packages in multiverse, among them mplayer.
[03:18] <siretart> gnomefreak: after feisty opens
[03:18] <siretart> bhale: dget http://incoming.debian.org/mplayer_1.0~rc1~svn20199-1.dsc
[03:19] <gnomefreak> oh i agree. if we can move anything out of multiverse would be a great idea
[03:19] <siretart> gnomefreak: afai see there, mencoder got removed
[03:19] <gnomefreak> for mplayer?
[03:20] <bhale> siretart: for ubuntu, i men
[03:20] <gnomefreak> from*
[03:20] <bhale> siretart: not questioning debian
[03:20] <bhale> debian main != ubuntu main
[03:20] <gnomefreak> bhale: debian just did it
[03:20] <bhale> sigh
[03:20] <bhale> not the same
[03:20] <jsgotangco> well people will rave for ubuntu to do the same i guess
[03:21] <bhale> mplayer has a bad security track record
[03:21] <bhale> and we have xine and gstreamer in main already
[03:21] <sivang> siretart: what was preventing it from entering debian main?
[03:21] <gnomefreak> that doesnt sound right. we have some xine and some gstreamer installed by default
[03:21] <StevenK> A lot of things are preventing mplayer from hitting main.
[03:22] <bhale> are you guys aware what ubuntu main means
[03:22] <StevenK> The formost of them being "the ftpmasters don't like it"
[03:22] <gnomefreak> license would be the biggest thing i would think
[03:22] <StevenK> That's the second. :-)
[03:22] <bhale> bad security track record, many points of entry for ugliness
[03:22] <sivang> gnomefreak: that was the first thing I was wondering if got fixed when siretart said it entered main
[03:22] <sivang> bhale: ah
[03:23] <bhale> ubuntu main means "we support this for security for 18 months (or more)"
[03:24] <bhale> being in debian main means you can be in universe as opposed to multiverse
[03:24] <bhale> not that we will automatically commit to support it
[03:24] <Nafallo> I will probably prefer to stay with out current package.
[03:24] <Nafallo> s/out/our/
[03:25] <Nafallo> we have mencoder and stuff :-)
[03:26] <Ornedan> I seem to have issues with the new Eclipse packages in Edgy (updated yesterday)
[03:27] <Ornedan> Eclipse does not start up. According to log, the workbench plugin fails to load
[03:27] <gnomefreak> license looks like it shouldnt be in multiverse. they give you right to distribute and modify it as long as you make source avilable
[03:27] <Nafallo> gnomefreak: we build against stuff in multiverse.
[03:31] <gnomefreak> Ornedan: what version are you using?
[03:32] <gnomefreak> 3.2.1-0ubuntu1?
[03:32] <Ornedan> Yes
[03:32] <gnomefreak> it opens fine here
[03:33] <siretart> Nafallo: placing mplayer in multiverse does not seem to make much sense to me.
[03:33] <Nafallo> having support for everything the users need seems to be a good idea to me :-)
[03:33] <gnomefreak> siretart: i think since we build mencoder and mencoder is nonfree is why it is in there
[03:34] <siretart> Nafallo: all of mplayer is free software. if there s problems with some parts of it (e.g. libdvdcss or mp3 encoding algorithms), then the same would apply to multiverse as well
[03:34] <gnomefreak> build in mencoder to mplayer
[03:34] <siretart> Nafallo: look, e.g. faad is in multiverse, but as well in debian main. I rather propse to check which packages from multiverse could be promoted
[03:34] <gnomefreak> dont forget w32codecs it has (atleast can play) by default
[03:34] <siretart> gnomefreak: mplayer doesn't have w32codecs built in
[03:35] <gnomefreak> it uses something to play them by default
[03:35] <Nafallo> siretart: ah, right. as long as we don't drop features from what we have now...
[03:35] <Ornedan> 'k. Just tested - doesn't seem to be my profile, at least. A brand new test account also fails the same way when trying to load eclipse
[03:35] <siretart> Nafallo: I'd also object to loose freedom.
[03:36] <Nafallo> sure, but for freedom we still have totem, gstreamer and xine.
[03:36] <siretart> Nafallo: but you're right. I'd also love to have mencoder. in universe
[03:36] <Ornedan> Is removing the eclipse packages using Adept "Purge" option and then re-installing enough to get a fully clean installation?
[03:37] <gnomefreak> Ornedan: should be also get rid of your workspace folder by default its in home
[03:37] <siretart> bhale: btw, what happend to your nick, tseng?
[03:37] <Ornedan> gnomefreak: That was why I made the test account
[03:38] <gnomefreak> Ornedan: file a bug and it will be looked at after release (might be best way)
[03:39] <Nafallo> ah, nice. GPLv2 for unrar.
[03:39] <Nafallo> baah, we have to look closer _after_ release :-)
[03:41] <gnomefreak> pick 6-7 or so people to look over the liencses after release and decide if they can be promoted for feisty?
[03:41] <Nafallo> something like that.
[03:42] <lmierzej> do you know if egdy is going to be released on time?
[03:43] <dholbach> you can help testing the cd images to make it be released on time :)
[03:43] <joejaxx> :)
[03:43] <dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Current
[03:44] <lmierzej> right :) I'm just curious...
[03:45] <dholbach> we're just in the process of building new cds - testing much appreciated
[03:45] <jsgotangco> go edgy go
[03:45] <dholbach> tfheen will announce them in #ubuntu-devel
[03:49] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:55] <bhale> siretart: i changed it, shrug
[03:58] <Ornedan> gnomefreak: Ok. I'll attach the Eclipse log to the bug report. Anything else?
[03:59] <gnomefreak> Ornedan: just explain the issue and what you have tried
[04:03] <Ornedan> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/eclipse/+bug/68185 <- Done
[04:03] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 68185 in eclipse "Error on start" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]
[05:04] <joejaxx> Today Is The Big Day
[05:04] <Nafallo> is it? for what?
[05:04] <joejaxx> Edgy
[05:05] <joejaxx> 8 hours left
[05:05] <Nafallo> what about it?
[05:05] <joejaxx> well for the uk rather
[05:05] <Nafallo> edgy have been here for months now :-)
[05:05] <Nafallo> since june or so
[05:05] <jsgotangco> haha
[05:05] <joejaxx> Nafallo: not the final :)
[05:05] <Nafallo> well, that's 6.10 then
[05:06] <jsgotangco> since last week, our builds are pretty much "final"
[05:06] <Nafallo> and that's tomorrow ;-)
[05:06] <Nafallo> probably 24h left or so..
[05:06] <joejaxx> jsgotangco: yeah i know i had to dist-upgrade from rc a couple of days ago
[05:06] <joejaxx> Nafallo: do you all go by GMT?
[05:07] <bhale> it isnt tied to an exact hour
[05:07] <bhale> it will be release roughly on the 26th
[05:07] <joejaxx> oh ok
[05:07] <joejaxx> haha i was just wondering
[05:07] <Nafallo> but they usually are ready around this hour :-)
[05:07] <joejaxx> :)
[05:08] <Nafallo> but then comes to pushing and stuff :-P
[05:11] <Toadstool> good morning
[05:12] <Nafallo> morning Toadstool
[05:12] <imbrandon> heya Toadstool
[05:12] <Toadstool> hi Nafallo & imbrandon
[05:51] <phanatic> !seen ivoks
[05:51] <ubotu> I last saw ivoks (n=ivoks@ubuntu/member/ivoks) 1h 21m 9s ago, quiting: "leaving"
[07:14] <Amaranth> imbrandon: Can I have what you've got so far for beryl packages?
[07:40] <luisbg> hello all, anybody alive?
[07:40] <LaserJock> what's up luisbg ?
[07:40] <luisbg> hey LaserJock
[07:40] <luisbg> are you a motu?
[07:40] <LaserJock> yes
[07:42] <luisbg> great!
[07:42] <luisbg> i'm really interested in being part of the motu community
[07:43] <luisbg> but as a newbie I'm a little bit confused
[07:43] <luisbg> do you know what I can do to help as a starting point to start learning?
[07:43] <luisbg> anything needed to be done you know of
[07:44] <luisbg> suitable for a starter
[07:44] <LaserJock> well, right now is a bit difficult because we are frozen to release Edgy
[07:44] <LaserJock> have you seen the Ubuntu Packaging Guide?
[07:45] <Amaranth> LaserJock: You pinged me or something yesterday, remember why? :)
[07:46] <luisbg> LaserJock, I have taken a look over it... thought I would read it deeply when I do my first package
[07:47] <luisbg> so when the universe is frozen to release a new version... there is no work in packages for the next one?
[07:47] <luisbg> or the work is mainly in getting it to be stable 100%? (which I guess is no task for a newbie)
[07:47] <LaserJock> no, the repositories for feisty aren't open yet
[07:48] <luisbg> when will they be open?
[07:48] <LaserJock> I would think in around a week
[07:48] <luisbg> cool
[07:48] <LaserJock> in the mean time you can look at bugs
[07:48] <LaserJock> that is a very valuable service
[07:49] <LaserJock> and can give you an entry point into packaging
[07:49] <LaserJock> some important bugs we are working on now are at http://tinyurl.com/fgpgy
[07:51] <luisbg> it says there are no open bugs
[07:52] <LaserJock> luisbg: sorry that was the wrong link, you want http://tinyurl.com/n8g6a
[07:52] <luisbg> no problem
[07:53] <luisbg> cool!
[07:53] <luisbg> may I address you if I have any doubts when I'm trying to fix one of the bugs of the list?
[07:53] <LaserJock> sure
[07:54] <LaserJock> #ubuntu-motu in general is pretty helpful too :-)
[07:54] <luisbg> LaserJock, LOL awesome
[07:54] <luisbg> where are you from btw?
[07:55] <luisbg> in 10 minutes I will try to aboard the cinepaint (unmet dependencies) bug
[07:55] <LaserJock> luisbg: Reno, Nevada, USA
[07:55] <luisbg> nice, i'm from spain
[08:40] <cbx33> how to access the latest changelog entry of a pacakge from the net?
[08:40] <cbx33> is it possible?
[08:40] <cbx33> without downloading the entire source pacakge
[08:42] <Nafallo> cbx33: launchpad has it somewhere.
[08:42] <Nafallo> cbx33: also you can use the mailing-list archives.
[08:42] <cbx33> ahh...no way to get it from the apt commands then?
[08:42] <cbx33> presumably it should be in the diff?
[08:42] <Nafallo> don't think so.
[08:43] <Nafallo> you can get it at installtime with apt-listchanges, but that's probably it.
[08:43] <cbx33> apt-listchanges?
[08:43] <cbx33> that's not avaialble on my system
[08:44] <Nafallo> universe
[08:44] <Nafallo> no, main :-)
[08:44] <cbx33> ah i see it
[08:44] <cbx33> thanks Nafallo
[08:44] <Nafallo> np :-)
[08:44] <cbx33> hmm....that's not really what I want
[08:44] <cbx33> but
[08:44] <cbx33> thank you
[08:44] <Nafallo> :-)
[08:44] <Nafallo> better than nothing.
[08:45] <cbx33> I need to get the patest changelog as efficiently as possible...
[08:45] <cbx33> if it's been packages doccrectly
[08:45] <cbx33> diff.tar.gz should provide it
[08:45] <Nafallo> why btw? :-)
[08:45] <cbx33> ahhh
[08:45] <cbx33> you'll find out soon
[08:45] <Nafallo> sounds scary ;-)
[08:46] <cbx33> hehe
[08:46] <cbx33> hopefully will be useful
[08:46] <cbx33> to all MOTU
[08:46] <Nafallo> penalties if package-updates where broken? ;-)
[08:46] <Nafallo> s/where/was/
[08:48] <cbx33> heheh
[08:48] <cbx33> not quite
[08:48] <Nafallo> :-)
[09:27] <ajmitch> morning
[09:27] <phanatic> morning ajmitch
[09:38] <zul> hey ajmitch
[09:39] <ajmitch> well, looks like the fixes I had to do this morning will have to wait :)
[09:39] <ajmitch> hello zul
[09:40] <jelmer> 'morning ajmitch
[09:41] <jelmer> ajmitch: Do you have any plans on uploading krb5-auth-dialog to Debian?
[09:41] <zul> keescook: got any idea what is up with kernel.org it seems slow
[09:41] <ajmitch> jelmer: yeah, I probably will, as well as some other stuff I've done lately
[09:41] <keescook> zul: we're getting pounded from the FC6 release
[09:42] <zul> keescook: ah...stupid fedora
[09:42] <ajmitch> keescook: simple, just remove it from the mirror
[09:42] <keescook> and we also share bandwidth with a firefox mirror too
[09:42] <keescook> ajmitch: heh.  :)
[09:43] <keescook> zul: the main issue is we're likely out of apache child slots what with all the long-running http connections for isos and stuff.  :(
[09:44] <ajmitch> I wish I could grab a cd image or two to keep dholbach happy :)
[09:44] <dholbach> hehe
[09:46] <zul> secrets and lies
[09:49] <ajmitch> hm
[09:50] <ajmitch> I ought to be on the faster DSL plan now
[09:50] <ajmitch> but no...
[09:51] <Plug> not yet
[09:52] <Plug> you ought to be on it "sometime after 26 Oct"
[09:52] <ajmitch> Plug: figures
[09:52] <ajmitch> probably waiting on telecom to move on it
[09:52] <ajmitch> I should know not to trust the original mail maxnet sent me
[10:34] <beligum> Hi all, anyone care to review ScreenKast (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3140) and libinstrudeo (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3125) ??
[10:53] <Amaranth> beligum: universe is frozen for edgy
[10:53] <crimsun> (everything's frozen, tbh)
[10:53] <beligum> I know
[10:54] <LaserJock> crimsun: do you know the actual time for the freeze?
[10:55] <crimsun> it froze a while ago
[10:55] <LaserJock> no, like frozen frozen
[10:55] <LaserJock> for the release
[10:55] <dholbach> it's -243C frozen now
[10:55] <LaserJock> my email isn't working so I can't see if I got an email from katie
[10:56] <crimsun> you should have gotten a deferred accept.
[10:56] <dholbach> or the server formerly known as katie :-)
[10:56] <dholbach> service
[10:56] <crimsun> meaning ACCEPTED but required distro manager approval
[10:56] <LaserJock> dholbach: heh
[10:56] <ajmitch> LaserJock: 'actual time' for release is when the scripts to publish the images are run
[10:57] <ajmitch> & edgy is flicked to released in LP
[10:57] <crimsun> "the button"
[10:57] <ajmitch> LaserJock: universe is really really frozen now
[10:58] <ajmitch> & has been for ~12 hours, since mdz said "no more!"
[10:58] <LaserJock> ok :(
[10:58] <ajmitch> sorry
[10:59] <luisbg> hey LaserJock, had to stop reading the package guide to make dinner
[11:00] <ajmitch> dholbach: we need to agree soon on proper procedures for SRU - I think the current suggestions may be hard
[11:00] <dholbach> it's still in the "suggestions" stage
[11:01] <dholbach> but nobody stepped up to formalize a suggestion since our meeting
[11:02] <ajmitch> dholbach: that's what I mean - either another meeting or we can discuss it on the list now that we have nothing better to do ;)
[11:02] <luisbg> when there is a bug of "unmet dependencies" does the package has to be redone, or just changed the dependencies?
[11:02] <ajmitch> luisbg: it means it can't be installed for some reason - reasons vary from needing rebuilt, to having stuff changed
[11:02] <dholbach> ajmitch: we need more suggestions and plans before we have a meeting again
[11:03] <dholbach> ajmitch: discussing a procedure without having concrete proposals doesn't hepl
[11:03] <ajmitch> dholbach: hence why I said I'd write up some proposal
[11:03] <dholbach> ahhh! :-(
[11:03] <dholbach> :-)
[11:03] <dholbach> sorry - I've been testing too many cds today
[11:04] <ajmitch> it's ok
[11:44] <dholbach> you guys ROCK
[11:46] <ajmitch> dholbach: not that I did much :)
[11:48] <dholbach> you did :)
[12:02] <LaserJock> oh man
[12:02] <LaserJock> my department server is currently running in a Knoppix CD
[12:03] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: Why!?
[12:04] <ajmitch> LaserJock: impressive
[12:04] <LaserJock> hard drive crashed or something
[12:04] <LaserJock> it's been down for 1 1/2 days
[12:04] <Fujitsu> Hah.
[12:04] <LaserJock> the poor sysadmin is working hard to figure out what happened
[12:04] <LaserJock> but grub no longer works
[12:05] <LaserJock> so he shifted the department website to another server
[12:05] <LaserJock> and is using knoppix to get at his backup tapes
[12:05] <LaserJock> but this stinks not having any email


[16:21] <arosales> Hello, any folks noticing any odd charm store API responses
[16:21] <arosales> we are seeing this more that once in our charm testing:
[16:21] <arosales> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23456776/
[16:21] <arosales> I also tried to just load jujucharms.com/openstack-base and got a 404. I retried and got the page, but it did 404 on initial load.
[16:32] <rick_h> uiteam ^
[16:42] <hatch> arosales: hmm I haven't noticed any issues
[16:43] <hatch> but will keep an eye on it
[16:43] <hatch> it's working well here
[16:45] <arosales> hatch seeing quite a few of them
[16:46] <arosales> hatch: if you click through on any "yellow triangles" at http://data.vapour.ws/cwr-tests/results/index.html
[16:46] <arosales> you'll see the juju charm store api time'ing out
[16:46] <arosales> hatch: is there any web logs that log these ?
[16:47] <hatch> there are, yeah there are quite a few triangles there
[16:47] <hatch> hmm
[16:47] <arosales> well most "yellow triangles" are for time outs
[16:47] <arosales> some are ssh errors
[16:50] <hatch> sure no problem, I'll get in touch with the right people to investigate, thanks for bringing this up


[01:06] <lukacu> good night
[07:17] <klepas> what a dreary afternoon
[08:20] <artnay> good morning :)
[09:50] <artnay> hey, any new ideas concerning wiki pages?
[09:52] <artnay> what if /*buntuArtwork would be just one long page without subcategory links? we could split sections using headings and place links directly to projects. that way it wouldn't be a link mess
[09:53] <artnay> hi lukacu
[09:53] <artnay> let me repeat myself:
[09:53] <artnay> what if /*buntuArtwork would be just one long page without subcategory links? we could split sections using headings and place links directly to projects. that way it wouldn't be a link mess
[09:54] <artnay> if /*buntuArtwork would consist of Projects, Resources and Guides, it wouldn't be too hard to split it that way
[09:55] <lukacu> hello artnay
[09:55] <artnay> but if it gets any bigger than that, /*buntuArtwork should use subcategory links and short summaries
[09:56] <artnay> what do you think?
[09:56] <artnay> it would be about time to renew the wiki :)
[09:57] <lukacu> that is what i had in mind yesterday... but i was not very clear about it i know
[09:57] <artnay>  /Artwork = links to UbuntuArtwork, KubuntuArtwork, EdubuntuArtwork, XubuntuArtwork, FAQ, Licensing, Contact
[09:58] <artnay> in order of appearance
[09:58] <artnay> lukacu: why? what's on your mind?
[09:59] <lukacu> subtitles and that :)
[09:59] <artnay> are you translating something?
[10:00] <lukacu> translating what?
[10:00] <artnay> some subtitles? :)
[10:01] <artnay> nevermind, I guess you meant wiki subtitles
[10:01] <lukacu> yes :)
[10:02] <artnay> lukacu: more specific titles?
[10:02] <artnay> that's what I've been thinking, and the structure of /*buntuArtwork pages
[10:03] <artnay> but what should be done with older projects? it would be nice to have some history as well so we could learn from past
[10:04] <artnay> Goals for Breezy, Goals for Dapper (when we're at Dapper+1)
[10:04] <lukacu> i think titles listed above are just fine ... projects, resources, guides etc.
[10:04] <lukacu> we can have section "past projects"? :)
[10:04] <artnay> sure, why not. let's just dump them somewhere :)
[10:05] <klepas> sounds like a good idea
[10:05] <klepas> but it would become quite a lengthy page...
[10:06] <lukacu> it that case we can still split it
[10:06] <artnay> so instead of a long page, should we use just a few links to subcategories at /*buntuArtwork pages?
[10:07] <klepas> yea, sounds alrighty
[10:07] <klepas> -y
[10:07] <artnay> type wiki ubuntu into fx, type artwork into search box, end up to /Artwork, click UbuntuArtwork, click Projects, click the desired project
[10:07] <lukacu> i am more of a long-page-guy ... but no problem :)
[10:07] <artnay> isn't that a way too, umh, difficult way?
[10:08] <klepas> one long page is fine
[10:08] <klepas> but you might want to talk to the edubuntu/xubuntu/kubunut art people then too
[10:08] <artnay> of course, they might have some great ideas
[10:08] <artnay> that we're missing here
[10:09] <lukacu> yup ... more people
[10:09] <artnay> how do we contact them? they don't have an IRC channel
[10:09] <artnay> should we invite them here?
[10:09] <artnay> or should we just have the meeting that we've been planning for last two or three months? :)
[10:09] <lukacu> :D
[10:10] <lukacu> i it like some kind of master plan to conquer the world ;)
[10:10] <lukacu> s/it/is
[10:11] <klepas> i think dropping off a message for a few days to the kubuntu-users mailing list ought to do for the kubuntu people
[10:12] <klepas> organise a massive general k/ed/x/ubuntu artwork IRC meeting
[10:12] <klepas> and discuss this
[10:12] <klepas> we can write up an agenda
[10:12] <artnay> https://launchpad.net/people/kubuntu-team
[10:12] <klepas> and get this over with
[10:12] <klepas> yea, but there aren't many people part of that team
[10:13] <klepas> addressing the kubuntu ML would be better
[10:13] <klepas> and we could get other people interested too :)
[10:13] <artnay> that's why we need /ArtworkContact page or something
[10:13] <klepas> check the ArtTeam page
[10:14] <klepas> I added a contact and joining section
[10:14] <artnay> you know what's wrong with that? it's full of data that the user isn't looking for
[10:14] <artnay> it doesn't separate people by projects
[10:15] <artnay> it should say clearly who are participating to Ubuntu, Kubuntu etc.
[10:15] <artnay> so yes, there's some info we could use when we build the contact page
[10:17] <lukacu> how about having a PR guy :)
[10:17] <artnay> now we should find (or know) who are members of non-Ubuntu projects and then contact them
[10:17] <artnay> because that page doesn't state that clearly
[10:18] <klepas> but generally we agree that a lage page of /Artwork would be good
[10:18] <artnay> it would be just the main page and has to bee minimalistic
[10:18] <artnay> it would contain links to /*buntuArtwork pages that might be built as we've planned
[10:19] <klepas> which has various sub-pages (this is possible, no?) which address various other areas of the Artwork, such as the different types (k/edu/x/ubuntu)
[10:19] <artnay> hmm
[10:20] <artnay> lukacu: are you volunteering? :D
[10:20] <lukacu> lol
[10:20] <klepas> I'm happy to help out
[10:21] <artnay> "me too" :>
[10:21] <artnay> brb, I have to smoke a ciggie
[10:21] <lukacu> i will help (but not with the pr thing if you had that in mind ;) )
[10:22] <lukacu> i ll be back in an hour or so ... bye
[10:23] <klepas> lukacu: bye :)
[10:25] <artnay> mhz is already unifying the artwork syntax
[10:26] <artnay> klepas: oh, so probably already read that as you're online 24/7 :>
[10:27] <artnay> s/so/you, typos here, there and everywhere
[10:29] <artnay> so how should we deal with dupe pages? for example UsplashArtwork would be used in every project but only with different splash screens
[10:29] <klepas> make one page for them all
[10:30] <klepas> for stuff like that
[10:30] <klepas> or /KubuntuUsplashArtwork
[10:30] <klepas> for example
[10:30] <klepas> artnay: yea, i'm online 24/7 :P
[10:30] <artnay> and that would include a link to all Usplash pages
[10:30] <klepas> http://wombat.nuxified.com/node/101
[10:30] <artnay> links
[10:30] <klepas> :)
[10:33] <artnay> it's broken
[10:33] <artnay> you're restaring the daemon or what? I can't connect atm :|
[10:34] <klepas> huh?
[10:35] <artnay> Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at wombat.nuxified.com.
[10:36] <artnay> now it's working although SQL is broken
[10:36] <klepas> damnit
[10:36] <klepas> using Firefox?
[10:36] <artnay> yep
[10:36] <klepas> why not Konqueror?
[10:37] <klepas> try again now, btw
[10:37] <artnay> because I'm at work and using win XP
[10:37] <klepas> ah, rightio
[10:37] <artnay> well I do use FX on every computer
[10:37] <klepas> SQL connection is being shitty
[10:37] <artnay> one word: extensions
[10:39] <artnay> it's only the about page that has DB problems
[10:39] <klepas> just reload a few times
[10:39] <klepas> i know, the server and SQL have been annoying me today
[10:39] <klepas> not my fault though
[10:40] <artnay> cool, it's working
[10:41] <artnay> no, /101 isn't working :|
[10:44] <klepas> =\
[10:44] <klepas> try again in 5 or so minutes
[10:44] <artnay> sure, just let us know when you're ready
[10:45] <klepas> i'm not going to touch it
[10:45] <klepas> i don't have access to the CPanel.
[10:45] <klepas> can't even make an SQL dump
[10:46] <klepas> so i'll let it fix itself or let the admin see it and fix it
[10:46] <klepas> s/admin/host
[10:53] <artnay> ok, it doesn't work. what's in there? :o
[11:16] <klepas> loads for me
[11:17] <artnay> Access denied
[11:17] <artnay> You are not authorized to access this page.
[11:17] <artnay> and lots of SQL errors
[11:43] <klepas> it's happened before
[11:43] <klepas> and it fixed itself
[11:43] <klepas> nothing i can do, even if i wanted to because i don't have access
[11:44] <lukacu> im back :)
[11:44] <artnay> no problem. if it's necessary information, you could always tell it here
[11:44] <artnay> instead of blogging it :)
[11:45] <klepas> yea
[11:45] <klepas> basically i wanted to show a screenshot
[11:45] <klepas> which is independent of the DB
[11:45] <klepas> so here's the link
[11:45] <klepas> btw, it seems to be working
[11:46] <klepas> the actuall site
[11:46] <klepas> http://wombat.nuxified.com/gallery/file/Screenshots/2005-12-09-uptime.png
[11:46] <artnay> why doesn't XP have a world clock, dammit... what time would it be in chile?
[11:46] <artnay> gmt -8?
[11:46] <artnay> klepas: are you able to change the geometry of yakuake in KDE 3.5?
[11:47] <artnay> yakuake --geometry blabla
[11:47] <klepas> what's the capital of Chile
[11:47] <klepas> yea, iirc
[11:47] <artnay> santiago
[11:48] <klepas> in Santiago, it's 07:48 right now
[11:48] <artnay> umh, I must have messed up something with the compilation then
[11:49] <artnay> let's just hope that there's no long queues so mhz could make it here :)
[11:49] <klepas> :)
[11:50] <klepas> what icon set do you use for KDE?
[11:50] <klepas> i can't seem to find a complete/near to complete good one... =[
[11:51] <artnay> are you serious? a heavy mix of human, humility, nuove xt, vista look-a-like
[11:52] <klepas> nuove xt isn't complete enough
[11:52] <klepas> and the K icon looks like trash, imho
[11:52] <artnay> klepas: where does yakuake store its config data?
[11:53] <klepas> ~/.kde/share/config/yakuakerc
[11:53] <artnay> klepas: I haven't found so good icon set that I wouldn't have modified it
[11:53] <artnay> oh yeah, how could I forgot tango...
[11:53] <klepas> Tango sucked last time i tried it
[11:53] <klepas> which was 0.5.1
[11:53] <klepas> iirc
[11:54] <klepas> It wouldn't create icons for my small panels
[11:54] <klepas> all PNGs were all 48x and up.
[11:54] <klepas> My panel uses 32x
[11:54] <artnay> hey, when you set the geometry information, what does it write to yakuakerc?
[11:55] <klepas> i'll post my config to one-on-one
[11:55] <artnay> klepas: yeah, but take the best parts of CC-SA 2.5 sets, tweak them and combine :)
[03:36] <artnay> hi guys
[03:36] <artnay> mhz: you were unifying syntax, how?
[03:36] <artnay> mhz: and have you voted already? :)
[03:37] <mhz> artnay: moin
[03:37] <omeg> Voted?
[03:37] <mhz> not voted yet (about 28 C degrees.. too hot)
[03:38] <mhz> omeg: Chilean elections for president 2day
[03:38] <mhz> artnay: unifiying sytax... nope. Using moin syntax to give pages a better look
[03:38] <artnay> ah, ok.
[03:39] <omeg> Ah
[06:02] <klepas> i'm off
[06:02] <klepas> cheers all
[10:43] <AndyFitz> someone has to package synfig!!!!  .  I'm going to #motu


[01:03] <darkxst> writing_novel, when you log in, what session do you have selected from the gear menu?
[03:13] <writing_novel> darkxst - I am not sure, but that is a good question. I know I didn't select Unity! That I know!?! I will have to logoff and back in and check out if any of them give me the kind of menus I am looking for.
[10:56] <rommel> where is the gnome version located... i can only find the ubuntu 13.10 version number
[12:48] <ricotz> darkxst, hi


[10:24] <sveinse> I have a natty system which locks up during boot. My suspicions goes to mountall as previously discussed on  here.
[10:25] <sveinse> I've created an early login with getty on ttyO2. I notice that echo foobar >/dev/console does not print anything on my console, yet the kernel is setup with console=ttyO2,115200n8
[10:26] <sveinse> Why could that be? Does ubuntu initramfs do anything special to the console?
[10:34] <sveinse> I.e. where does /dev/console go if not to the console i've specified on the kernel command line
[10:58] <ogra_> sveinse, do you have devtmpfs enabled ? thats usually mounted by initramfs as first thing
[11:02] <mik1> cd
[11:02] <mik1> ll
[11:03] <ogra_> file not found
[11:08] <sveinse> ogra_ yes I think so. When logged into the system devtmpfs is mounted.
[11:13] <sveinse>  /dev/console has another major/minor number than ttyO2, so I presume the kernel handles this redirection?
[11:14] <ogra_> if your console= args are right
[11:21] <sveinse> ogra_ I wouldn't get the initial demesg output from kernel without it. However I have observed for a long time that when the initramfs takes over, any output to the console is stopped
[11:21] <ogra_> you would get the initial dmesg oputput
[11:22] <ogra_> for a console on ttySX you need two console args
[11:22] <sveinse> I have console=ttyO2,115200n8
[11:23] <ogra_> (forst is for kernel, second for userspace)
[11:23] <ogra_> *first
[11:23] <sveinse> aha. so console=ttyO2,115200n8 console=ttyO2
[11:25] <ogra_> try that and see if you get more
[11:25] <ogra_> also make sure to not have "quiet" set
[11:25] <ogra_> this will definitely suppress all msgs from initrd
[11:25] <sveinse> thanks, I'll certainly try
[11:41] <sveinse> ...and all of the sudden I cant binfmt armel exec's (e.g. debootstrap) on my natty host (amd64). Has something changed recently in respect of kernel
[11:42] <sveinse> I notice binfmt_misc.ko is not loaded automatically any longer, and modprobing it does not help the issue :(
[11:46] <mik1> guys is anyone of you playing audio from the beagleboard? if yes could you please advice which distro to use?
[11:53] <sveinse> All binfmts were apparently set to disabled. update-binfmts --enable qemu-arm did the trick. Wonder why though
[12:06] <ayaka> could i let second-stage bootloader don't anything in  a android mobile to boot a linux kernel
[12:55] <sveinse> ogra_ I worked by doubling console=, thanks! It also reveals why mountall is apparently locked up, see http://paste.ubuntu.com/881794/
[12:55] <sveinse> Note that I'm not using fixrtc in this setup
[12:56] <ogra_> apparently :)
[12:56] <ayaka> could i let second-stage bootloader don't anything in  a android mobile to boot a linux kernel
[12:58] <sveinse> ogra_ I have basically two options: Either run with fixrtc but then I need the patch you made (haven't checked if the patch has made into natty-update though)
[12:59] <sveinse> Or without fixrtc, but then I need to get past this interactive part which I pasted
[13:00] <sveinse> We had a discussion internally, and we prefer not using fixrtc as it has unexpected sideeffects if the user (for some reason) needs to set the time backwards
[13:03] <ogra_> well, make your installer remove fixrtc from the cmdline after its clear the clock is right, thats the only sane option
[13:03] <ogra_> imho
[13:05] <sveinse> yes, I partly agree. Since the product has no interactive way of dealing with questions from mountall, its not an acceptable option either. The RTC battery will expire within the lifetime of the product
[13:08] <sveinse> Unless other simpler options I am considering making a plymouth theme which can respond to such messages and supply keystrokes to allow it to continue
[13:14] <danboid> Would anyone know of any newer kernel packages for 11.10 armel Panda as the repo ones don't have ALSA sequencer support compiled in it seems
[13:15] <ogra_> danboid, you could ask linaro or check the TI PPA
[13:17] <danboid> ogra_, I've tried 3.1.0 from the PPA but that had the same issue- I presume I can use the linaro 11.10 PPA with canonical Ubuntu right?
[13:17] <danboid> ogra_, 3.1.0 from the ti ppa
[13:17] <ogra_> for just the kernel that should be fine
[13:21] <danboid> So what does Linaro offer over the canonical builds/distros?
[13:22] <danboid> Whats the relationship between Linaro and Canonical?
[13:26] <gildean> danboid: http://www.linaro.org/engineering/
[14:44] <sveinse> ogra_ , does initramfs honor/bring along /etc/e2fsck.conf ?
[14:45] <sveinse> I.e at the time of mountall and e2fsck, /etc is inside the initramfs, right
[14:45] <ogra_> well, if its in place it should be used
[14:45]  * ogra_ hasnt tried it ever
[14:45] <sveinse> ok, thanks
[15:45] <sveinse> Has ureadahead any improving features on armel (natty)? On my system it just reports ureadahead terminated with status 5
[15:45] <sveinse> ..running off a sdcard
[15:46] <ogra_> its in two parts, one improves the loading at boottime, the other runs in userspace and preloads libs etc
[15:46] <ogra_> even if the first part terminates, the second will still gain you improvements
[15:47] <sveinse> I also have two accounts of "init: ureadahead-other main process (829) terminated with status 4"
[15:48] <sveinse> I have no problems leaving it as-is, just OOI
[15:48] <ogra_> hmm, might be that your kernel is missing options
[15:49] <sveinse> That is what crossed my mind as well. Where can I find these options?
[15:49] <ogra_> no idea :)
[15:49] <ogra_> i would compare your config with an equivalent one of an ubuntu kernel
[15:52] <sveinse> Well I did that some time ago, and there's a ton of differences. Ubuntu kernel = generic. Our kernel = specific. But I'll start looking.
[15:54] <sveinse> ogra_ if you care at all: Adding /etc/fsck.conf fixed the problem with using the broken_system_clock option. This will ensure e2fsck never fails due to missing or clock in the past.
[15:54] <ogra_> yeah, i know
[15:54] <ogra_> it was added upstream a cycle after fixrtc was added
[15:55] <ogra_> we had some discussions with ted about it
[16:59] <HokieTux> Hey all - Does Ubuntu-ARM support the NEON instruction set?  The top comment in this bug (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/848154) seems to indicate that NEON is disabled in Ubuntu builds for non-v7 support?
[16:59] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 848154 in ubuntu "ARM version not supporting V6 RaspPi" [Undecided,Invalid]
[17:01] <GrueMaster> HokieTux: Neon support and V6 Raspberry Pi support are two separate issues.  By default, the main packages do not use neon, as there are several v7 SOC's that do not use neon (nVidia Tegra series, Marvell Armada series, etc).
[17:02] <HokieTux> GrueMaster, yeah, I know they are separate issues - that is just one of the threads that came up when I was searching for details, and the top comment seemed relevant to non-Pi platforms.
[17:02] <infinity> HokieTux: We "support" NEON, we don't build with it enabled by default, except in packages where run-time selection can be done.
[17:02] <GrueMaster> Raspberry Pi uses armv6 which means no thumb2 support.  All of our packages are currently compiled for thumb2 since Lucid.
[17:03] <HokieTux> infinity, GrueMaster - I'm specifically working on OMAP3 platforms, on the moment, and using Angstrom.
[17:03] <HokieTux> I am investigating using Ubuntu, and that comment just made me suspicious.  So it is possible to build Ubuntu-ARM with NEON support, then?
[17:03] <GrueMaster> We fully support omap3 (see our omap3 images - they work on beagle systems).
[17:03] <infinity> HokieTux: You could rebuild the whole archive with neon enabled by default, it would buy you very little.
[17:04] <infinity> HokieTux: The packages that have hand-tuned NEON routines tend to have those enabled at runtime already.
[17:04] <infinity> HokieTux: libjpeg-turbo being a good example.
[17:04] <infinity> HokieTux: "turning on NEON optimisation" does very little without special consideration in the code, from what I've seen, so I wouldn't worry too much about it. :P
[17:05] <HokieTux> infinity, aha - so the packages that have them auto-detect support at runtime?
[17:05] <HokieTux> That more or less answers my question.
[17:05] <infinity> HokieTux: Certainly not every single package that could have NEON support does run-time autodetection, but a good many do.
[17:06] <HokieTux> Ah - so it isn't disabled in the kernel, then; it's just that not all packages are necessarily built with it?
[17:07] <infinity> HokieTux: Anyhow, I'd recommend trying out the precise armhf/omap images and just seeing how it all works for you.
[17:07] <infinity> HokieTux: The kernel couldn't care less.  And the compiler and assembler are more than capable of doing NEONy things.  As you surmise, we just don't build with it on by default (except where it can be done at runtime).
[17:08] <infinity> Because, as GrueMaster says, we support v7 SoCs that don't have NEON.
[17:08] <infinity> So, the world would explode for them. :P
[17:08] <HokieTux> Great =)
[17:08] <infinity> One could argue that ARM oopsed a bit by not requiring NEON in the ARMv7 spec, but a bit late now. ;)
[17:08] <HokieTux> infinity, I almost certainly will try it, then.  If that comment about NEON being disabled at the kernel level in all Ubuntu-ARM builds were true, it wouldn't be worth my time at all since NEON is 100% required for my application.
[17:08] <HokieTux> That's why I was asking-before-trying
[17:08] <HokieTux> Thanks for clearing up my confusion, though =)
[17:09] <infinity> HokieTux: Did Oli mention kernels in that comment?  If so, he was typing faster than he was thinking.
[17:10] <infinity> HokieTux: Anyhow, in your specific case, yeah, life's good.  The toolchain will happily compile your NEON-needing application, and the userspace and kernel will happily run it.
[17:10] <HokieTux> Hah, no, he didn't specifically mention kernels - he said "... NEON which we forbid to be build-time enabled by default due to teh fact that we support non NEON armv7 devices"
[17:10] <infinity> Yeah, that's fairly accurate.
[17:10] <infinity> If a bit awkwardly-worded. ;)
[17:10] <HokieTux> Yeah, it sounds scary to people that require it, hah.
[17:11] <infinity> Well, "forbid" probably needed a caveat of "for distro packages".
[17:11] <infinity> The toolchain will let you do whatever you want to your own stuff. ;)
[17:11] <HokieTux> Aha
[17:12] <HokieTux> infinity, so the short version is that distro-wide packages are built WITHOUT NEON support for compatibility, and  most libraries that have hand-tuned NEON assembler will auto-detect compatibility at run-time?
[17:12] <infinity> Roughly that, yes.
[17:13] <HokieTux> and if we wanted to add hand-tuned NEON to distro packages, we would need to use the toolchain to build our own packages
[17:13] <infinity> Or, rather, things that can auto-detect, we let them.  Things that are compile-time "on or off", it's off.
[17:13] <infinity> So, if you want to add hand-tuned NEON to distro packages, make it a run-time detection, not a compile-time option.
[17:13] <infinity> And everyone wins.
[17:16] <HokieTux> infinity, great
[17:18] <HokieTux> I really appreciate your time and help =)
[17:34] <ogra_> grmbl
[17:34] <ogra_> so no initrdless boot for now :(
[17:38]  * ogra_ wonders if CONFIG_UNIX98_PTYS is set to M in the panda config
[17:39] <ogra_> else i dont get why i see bug 954243
[17:39] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 954243 in linux-ti-omap4 "booting pandaboard without initrd dies with "init: no available ptys"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/954243
[17:40] <sveinse> Is double usage of console= in kernel commandline mutually exclusive with plymouth? My splash went away when I started using console=...
[17:40] <ogra_> plymouth shuts down the splash if it detects a serial console option
[17:41] <ogra_> silly upstream decision, was discussed at lenght a while ago
[17:42] <sveinse> Hmm ok. Doesn't work too well when the [serial] console != display unit
[17:43] <ogra_> it omits the splash as soon as you set "console=" iirc
[17:44] <sveinse> omit = not starting plymouth
[17:45] <ogra_> well, at least not showing a splash, i'm not sure how the plymouth daemon acts
[17:47] <ogra_> crap ... so i guess we need to drop the idea of initrdless boot ...
[17:47] <ogra_> doesnt look like the kernel can mount devpts automatically
[17:47] <ogra_> and without it upstart will fall flat on its face
[17:48] <sveinse> in which you need to do mountall / fstab...
[17:49] <GrueMaster> ogra_: Was this even tested on x86?  Seems to me it would fail there as well.
[17:49] <ogra_> yes, it would, it used to work in oneiric
[17:50]  * ogra_ tries with fstab entry but i doubt that saves me
[17:50] <ogra_> since upstart will likely fail before
[17:52] <ogra_> nope, fails the same way as expected
[17:53] <infinity> ogra_: perhaps upstart changed to require UNIX98 ptys, and it used to fallback to /dev/tty* or something?
[17:54] <ogra_> something like that i guess
[17:58] <ogra_> the kernel config (which i suspected first) is definitely fine
[17:58]  * ogra_ gives up for the day
[18:01] <GrueMaster> I'd double check the kernel config.  We were bitten by these changes when cooloney copied the omap4 kernel config for the armadaxp kernel.  He reverted some of these omap4 specific changes lst night and it runs fine now.
[18:11] <ogra_> GrueMaster, i did before haking up fstab
[18:24] <sveinse> oh joy! AFAICS the splash-off feature in plymouth when using serial console is hardcoded into plymouth
[21:36] <dpcrespo> hi
[21:37] <dpcrespo> i try booting ubuntu 11.10 on igepv2
[21:37] <dpcrespo> and not working
[21:38] <dpcrespo> i read this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM/OmapNetbook
[21:39] <dpcrespo> but the last message i have is "Uncompressing Linux... done, booting the kernel."
[21:40] <GrueMaster> What image are you trying?
[21:41] <dpcrespo> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/11.10/release/
[21:41] <dpcrespo> this
[21:41] <GrueMaster> Desktop or server?
[21:42] <dpcrespo> Desktop
[21:42] <GrueMaster> Do you have a keyboard, mouse, and monitor hooked up to your system?
[21:42] <dpcrespo> keyboard and mouse
[21:42] <dpcrespo> no
[21:42] <dpcrespo> i have only monitor
[21:43] <GrueMaster> And nothing shows up on the monitor?
[21:43] <dpcrespo> no
[21:43] <dpcrespo> when it is booting
[21:44] <dpcrespo> the monitor change to orange color
[21:44] <dpcrespo> and after without signal
[21:44] <GrueMaster> Try the server image to see if it gets further.  Unfortunately, that platform is untested by us, so may not work with our image.
[21:44] <GrueMaster> I assume the message you are getting is via serial console.
[21:45] <dpcrespo> yes with minicom
[21:45] <dpcrespo> you know stable version
[21:45] <dpcrespo> with igepv2
[21:46] <GrueMaster> We do not actively test on that platform.  I'm told it should work, but I have no way of knowing.  I recommend trying the server image, because it is designed to do all of the installation steps through the serial console.
[21:46] <dpcrespo> ok
[21:47] <dpcrespo> i try this
[21:47] <dpcrespo> thx for your help
[21:48] <dpcrespo> when i test
[21:49] <dpcrespo> i tell you
[21:49] <dpcrespo> thx
[23:57] <jbicha> hi, I need some help figuring out how to get cogl to build on arm