[01:36] <tiagoscd> hello
[01:36] <rww> hi
[01:36] <tiagoscd> i like to request an Ubuntu cloak
[01:36] <nhandler> tiagoscd: Do you have a link to your Launchpad profile handy?
[01:37] <tiagoscd> http://launchpad.net/~tiagohillebrandt
[01:37] <nhandler> jussi, tsimpson, topyli: ^^^
[01:38] <tiagoscd> (:
[01:41] <tiagoscd> nhandler: it's my Launchpad profile ok?
[01:41] <nhandler> tiagoscd: Yep. We just need one of the people I hilighted to ACK the request before I can apply the cloak
[01:42] <tiagoscd> nhandler: fine, thanks!
[01:49] <tiagoscd> nhandler: i need to stay here until ACK back or the request is registered?
[01:50] <nhandler> tiagoscd: You can leave if you need to
[01:52] <tiagoscd> nhandler: tks! i don't know if i can select, but i liked from cloak "ubuntu/member/tiagohillebrandt"
[01:53] <tiagoscd> well, i need to go
[01:53] <tiagoscd> bye (:
[17:41] <DLobanov> Hi
[17:41] <MichealH> Hello, DLobanov
[17:42] <MichealH> Ask your question here and they will soon answer
[17:42] <DLobanov> Where is owners
[17:42] <DLobanov> sks
[17:42] <DLobanov> I create channel, but I can't get rights of owner
[17:42] <DLobanov> Who can help
[17:43] <k1l> which channel?
[17:43] <DLobanov> kubuntu-ru
[17:43] <DLobanov> I create it today
[17:44] <Fuchs> it is owned by freenode staff
[17:45] <Fuchs> you have to fill in a group request form in order to get a single-hash channel
[17:45] <JanC> DLobanov: looks like that channel was registered by someone else in the past, and is in "quarantine" now ?
[17:45] <Pici> No. #kubuntu-* channels are owned by the IRC Council.
[17:46] <DLobanov> No, I create this channel today, 4 hours ago
[17:46] <JanC> Pici: this channel is owned by "freenode staff" according to chanserv ?
[17:46] <Fuchs> Pici: according to chanserv it is freenode staff, therefore the grf would apply there
[17:46] <MichealH> The Staff sent him here
[17:46] <MichealH> FYI
[17:46] <DLobanov> ok
[17:46] <Fuchs> ah
[17:47] <k1l> i think its a protection thing. so its says freenode staff
[17:47] <JanC> IIRC this happens if a channel was registered by someone else in the past
[17:47] <Pici> Fuchs: freenode-staff gets automatic ownership of single hash channels
[17:47] <MichealH> nhandler: It seems freenode staff own the channel?
[17:47] <Fuchs> Pici: and usually you get those with a group registration form, showing that you are affiliated with this project. Didn't know that this is different for #kubuntu-*. Anyway, food.
[17:48] <Pici> MichealH: Yes. And the only way to get it registered to a user would be to have the group contact that owns that namespace to take control.
[17:48] <nhandler> Fuchs: The Ubuntu IRC Council already has a GRF for that namespace
[17:48] <nhandler> DLobanov: Out of curiosity, what did you want this channel for?
[17:48] <MichealH> Pici: But its strange, nhandler sent DLobanov here
[17:48] <MichealH> Saying it belonged to you guys :P
[17:49] <nhandler> MichealH: It does belong to the IRCC, freenode-staff is just the founder to prevent other people from taking the channel
[17:49] <Pici> MichealH: nhandler understands that there are proper places to discuss things. No sense in clogging up #freenode with Ubuntu stuff.
[17:49] <MichealH> Well... yeah
[17:50] <Pici> MichealH: Anyway, I don't have a seat on the IRCC anymore, although nhandler still does.
[17:50] <nhandler> Well, you'll need jussi, tsimpson, or topyli to ack the request. Although an explanation from DLobanov as to what he wants the channel for might help
[17:51] <jussi> yes, I can ack it, but I would like an explanation before I do.
[17:52] <nhandler> jussi: If you scrollback, there was a cloak request from ~12 hours ago. Not sure if it got actioned (I got disconnected)
[17:52] <Pici> DLobanov: nhandler and jussi can help you get control of the channel, but they want to know what the channel is for first.
[17:53] <jussi> nhandler: ok please cloak tiagoscd with an ubuntu/member cloak.
[17:53] <topyli> nhandler: oh yes tiagoscd. i even checked it but soon forgot. go ahead and cloak
[17:54] <DLobanov> I don't understand what you whant to know
[17:54] <DLobanov> ?
[17:54] <nhandler> tiagoscd is now cloaked
[17:54] <AbstractBeliefs> DLobanov: what do you intend to use the channel for?
[17:54] <Pici> I'll leave this up to you folks, /me wanders off
[17:54] <nhandler> Thanks for your help Pici
[17:54] <Pici> nhandler: anytime
[17:55] <DLobanov> To talk
[17:55] <DLobanov> For what more
[17:56] <DLobanov> This is free space
[17:56] <DLobanov> And many peoples are always there
[17:56] <AbstractBeliefs> DLobanov: to talk mainly about kubuntu in the russian language?
[17:56] <DLobanov> yes
[17:57] <DLobanov> ubuntu-ru is there
[17:57] <AbstractBeliefs> ok. youll need to speak to the Ubuntu IRC Council, and explain what you want the channel for, and how you can help make it work
[17:57] <AbstractBeliefs> and then they can properly consider your request
[17:57] <DLobanov> They can't
[17:58] <DLobanov> They send me to ChanServ
[17:58] <DLobanov> Who is this, I don' know
[17:58] <AbstractBeliefs> i dont understand what you mean by that
[17:58] <AbstractBeliefs> what do they request you do?
[17:59] <jussi> DLobanov: topyli and I can help you (we are on the IRCC). Are you part of the russian loco team?
[17:59] <DLobanov> They  said ask chanserv to get rights
[17:59] <DLobanov> No I'm not part of team
[18:00] <AbstractBeliefs> DLobanov: jussi is in a position to help you better than me, ill pass you over to him =]
[18:00] <DLobanov> Ok
[18:00] <DLobanov> Where is he
[18:00] <jussi> DLobanov: Im here :=)
[18:00] <DLobanov> Hi
[18:00] <DLobanov> Can you help?
[18:01] <jussi> DLobanov: Im just considering what  you have said
[18:01] <jussi> DLobanov: are you a kubuntu user?
[18:01] <DLobanov> yes
[18:01] <jussi> and you want to help other kubuntu users in russian?
[18:01] <DLobanov> yes
[18:02] <DLobanov> Some time and I will better talk on english than in russion
[18:02] <DLobanov> :)
[18:02] <jussi> ok, nhandler could you drop rights on the ircc in that channel - we can then grant limited rights to DLobanov ere
[18:02] <DLobanov> How I can to do this?
[18:03] <DLobanov> sry
[18:03] <DLobanov> I understand
[18:03] <JanC> becoming part of the ubuntu-ru locoteam would be a good idea I guess  ☺
[18:03] <DLobanov> Ok
[18:03] <jussi> yes, I agree
[18:04] <DLobanov> When I recive nhandler
[18:05] <DLobanov> How do you talk to me?
[18:05] <jussi> DLobanov: its being handled, just be patient now.
[18:05] <nhandler> jussi: Done


[01:55] <lyn||ian> nearly meeting time
[01:55]  * pleia2 nods
[01:59] <pleia2> I wish this diff was less awful
[02:00] <pleia2> but I'm sure nhaines will give us the cliff notes and we can dig in from there :)
[02:00] <nhaines> All diffs are awful.  But that one is particularly pessimal.  :)
[02:01] <pleia2> meeting time :)
[02:01] <nhaines> Yup!  :)
[02:02] <nhaines> #startmeeting
[02:02] <darthrobot`> Meeting started Mon May 15 02:02:02 2017 UTC.  The chair is nhaines. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[02:02] <darthrobot`> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[02:02] <nhaines> #chair pleia2 lyn||ian
[02:02] <darthrobot`> Current chairs: lyn||ian nhaines pleia2
[02:02] <nhaines> Welcome to the May 14th Ubuntu California LoCo meeting!
[02:02] <nhaines> Tonight's agenda is available at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/17May14
[02:02] <darthrobot`> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/17May14 - Ubuntu Wiki]
[02:03] <nhaines> #topic Upcoming events
[02:03] <nhaines> It's May, Ubuntu 17.04 has been released, and summer's coming up.  What's going on?  :)
[02:03] <pleia2> alas, nothing up here so far
[02:04] <nhaines> Nor down here.
[02:04] <nhaines> Although the Ubuntu Hours in Pasadena continue happily, as I understand it.
[02:04] <pleia2> our focus has mostly shifted to LTS for our releases parties
[02:04] <dax> (I'm around but multitasking right now.)
[02:04] <pleia2> we haven't had an Ubuntu Hour in some time either, but there is someone interested in picking up where I left off
[02:05] <nhaines> That's good to hear!
[02:05] <nhaines> Ubuntu Hours are good ways to sort of keep up to date with that's going on in the Ubuntu world.
[02:06] <nhaines> #topic Announcements
[02:06] <nhaines> Are there any other announcements this week?
[02:06]  * lyn||ian does not have any
[02:07] <pleia2> nothing from me either
[02:07] <nhaines> Okay then, moving on to agenda items.
[02:07] <nhaines> #topic Final discussion of leadership document amendments before proceeding to a vote
[02:08] <nhaines> So on February 19th, I proposed an amendment to our leadership document.
[02:08] <nhaines> There's been no discussion on the mailing list and therefore I assume 100% unanimous assent from the LoCo.  :P
[02:09] <lyn||ian> nhaines, link now I do not remember any complaints to it
[02:09] <pleia2> hehe
[02:09] <pleia2> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NathanHaines/CaliforniaLeadershipDocument?action=diff&rev2=2&rev1=1
[02:09] <darthrobot`> Title: [Diff for "NathanHaines/CaliforniaLeadershipDocument" - Ubuntu Wiki]
[02:09] <pleia2> the diff of changes
[02:09] <pleia2> nhaines: care to summarize?
[02:10] <nhaines> Our current document is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Leadership
[02:10] <darthrobot`> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Leadership - Ubuntu Wiki]
[02:10] <nhaines> And the proposed new document is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NathanHaines/CaliforniaLeadershipDocument
[02:10] <darthrobot`> Title: [NathanHaines/CaliforniaLeadershipDocument - Ubuntu Wiki]
[02:10] <pleia2> #link https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2017-February/002782.html
[02:10] <darthrobot`> Title: [[Ubuntu-US-CA] Proposed amendment to the Ubuntu Californialeadership document.]
[02:10] <pleia2> ^ Original email about the proposed changes from February
[02:11] <nhaines> The amendments basically just change references to "leadership council" to "leadership role."
[02:11] <dax> and make that one person instead of a three person council, obviously
[02:11] <nhaines> The intention is to allow a single elected leader rather than an elected triumvirate, but also to allow a group or two or three leaders in the future if needed.
[02:12] <dax> i read the document back in February, am in favor of it
[02:12] <pleia2> I like increasing the flexibility here
[02:12] <lyn||ian> yes increased flexibility sounds good
[02:12] <pleia2> I think the trio served its purpose for a time, but we don't want to be locked into something forever if it's not working for us
[02:12] <nhaines> There's some other silliness in the document, but I haven't changed any of that.  :)
[02:13] <dax> If we had more activity I'd want more pondering of it, but until/unless that happens I think one caretaker/leader is fine.
[02:13] <nhaines> pleia2: yes, and with the lack of leader nominations this last time around, I don't think the group is big enough to support three leaders.
[02:13]  * pleia2 nods
[02:14] <lyn||ian> yes nhaines
[02:14] <nhaines> Which is different from whether or not we *need* three leaders, but I don't think we do, either.  :)
[02:14] <nhaines> In any case, I wanted to give the group a last chance to comment before I called for a vote.
[02:15] <nhaines> Once the vote on the changes is finished, we can make another call for nominations and do a leadership vote.
[02:15] <pleia2> thank you for your work on this, sorry it's taken so long to finally talk about it :)
[02:15] <pleia2> nothing else from me though
[02:16] <nhaines> It's okay.  SCALE and then other things were in the way. :)
[02:16] <nhaines> Let's vote on whether we should vote.
[02:16] <pleia2> hehe
[02:16] <nhaines> #vote Put proposed leadership document amendment to a LoCo-wide vote for ratification.
[02:16] <darthrobot`> Please vote on: Put proposed leadership document amendment to a LoCo-wide vote for ratification.
[02:16] <darthrobot`> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[02:16] <nhaines> +1
[02:16] <darthrobot`> +1 received from nhaines
[02:16] <pleia2> +1
[02:16] <darthrobot`> +1 received from pleia2
[02:16] <dax> +1
[02:16] <darthrobot`> +1 received from dax
[02:17] <lyn||ian> +1
[02:17] <darthrobot`> +1 received from lyn||ian
[02:17] <nhaines> #endvote
[02:17] <darthrobot`> Voting ended on: Put proposed leadership document amendment to a LoCo-wide vote for ratification.
[02:17] <darthrobot`> Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[02:17] <darthrobot`> Motion carried
[02:17] <pleia2> just going to toss a simple poll up in launchpad/
[02:17] <pleia2> ?
[02:17] <nhaines> That or we can send out a condor-seat ballot to the LoCo.
[02:18] <pleia2> collecting emails for that is D:
[02:18] <nhaines> That's okay though, because I'm not the one who has to do it.
[02:18] <pleia2> and it's just a yes/no anyway, right?
[02:18] <nhaines> Right.
[02:19] <pleia2> so condorcet is not so great for it :)
[02:19] <dax> last/only previous amendment was just approved by IRC vote. If you want a non-IRC thing I'd just LP it
[02:19] <pleia2> well, I can set that up
[02:19] <nhaines> dax: that's something I should've looked up then.
[02:19] <nhaines> Do we want to LP it or should we just do an IRC vote next meeting?
[02:20] <dax> pleia2: would LP be easy?
[02:20] <pleia2> lp is easy and open to more people, irc is hard and I'll be on a train during the next meeting
[02:20] <dax> I vote LP then
[02:20] <nhaines> Let's vote on how we should vote for the vote.
[02:20] <nhaines> Nah.  I think LP works.
[02:20] <pleia2> #action pleia2 to set up lp poll for leadership document amendment radification
[02:20] <darthrobot`> ACTION: pleia2 to set up lp poll for leadership document amendment radification
[02:21] <nhaines> I find that typo especially pleasing and fitting for a California LoCo vote.  :)
[02:21] <nhaines> pleia2: you'll be a California native yet!
[02:21] <pleia2> hahahah
[02:22] <pleia2> raaaad
[02:22] <nhaines> Okay, I think everything's all set for that, then.
[02:22] <nhaines> #topic Other business
[02:22] <nhaines> Any other business this week?
[02:22]  * lyn||ian has none
[02:23] <pleia2> I don't think so
[02:23] <nhaines> Okay, I think that's it for this meeting then.
[02:23] <nhaines> Happy Mother's Day to any mothers and aunts and mentors out there!
[02:23] <pleia2> thanks for chairing \o/
[02:24] <nhaines> Our next meeting will be May 28th.
[02:24] <nhaines> #endmeeting
[02:24] <darthrobot`> Meeting ended Mon May 15 02:24:25 2017 UTC.
[02:24] <darthrobot`> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2017/ubuntu-us-ca.2017-05-15-02.02.moin.txt
[02:24] <nhaines> Now to squint at Jekyll some more.
[02:24] <pleia2> true story: I looked up the proper spelling of amendment and then went to town on radification
[02:24] <nhaines> Haha!
[02:25] <nhaines> I had to double check that "assent" meant what I thought it did.  (It did.)
[02:25] <pleia2> English is tough
[02:25] <pleia2> especially the way we speak it
[02:26] <nhaines> Relevant: http://www.gocomics.com/calvinandhobbes/1993/02/11
[02:26] <darthrobot`> Title: [Calvin and Hobbes by Bill Watterson for Feb 11, 1993 | Read Comic Strips at GoComics.com]
[02:26] <pleia2> hehe
[02:28] <nhaines> I was worried about needing to learn SASS/SCSS to convert my existing hand-made stylesheet to the Jekyll engine.
[02:28] <nhaines> But then I learned that SASS is basically just the way I *think* CSS should work.
[02:30] <nhaines> Also my modus operandus of "I don't have a good justification but I'm going to start writing all my blog posts in Markdown" last year turned out to be totally justified.
[02:31] <nhaines> (Well, the real reason is that I thought I might move to Mezzanine but still had to post to LiveJournal in the meantime.  But in any case, it all worked out.)
[02:32] <pleia2> would be nice if launchpad told me the date/time format it wants in the poll *shakesfist* and googles
[02:33] <pleia2> heh https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/262205
[02:33] <darthrobot`> Title: [Bug #262205 (polls) “Dates in Launchpad polls should be easy to ...” : Bugs : Launchpad itself]
[02:33] <pleia2> Won't Fix, sad
[02:34]  * pleia2 metoos anyway
[02:35] <pleia2> why would I every say something with lp is easy?
[02:37] <pleia2> A poll cannot open less than 12 hours after it's created.
[02:37] <pleia2> fml
[02:37] <nhaines> Can't *open*?
[02:38] <nhaines> I'm totally not going to be around for the June 11th meeting.
[02:39] <dax> lol Launchpad
[02:40] <pleia2> btw, %Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S
[02:40] <dax> so, correct :P?
[02:42] <pleia2> ok, hopefully this works ...in 12 hours when it opens :P https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-california/+poll/2017-leadership-amendment
[02:42] <darthrobot`> Title: [Ratification of the 2017 leadership document amendment : “Ubuntu California” team]
[02:42] <pleia2> I'll send out an email in the AM if it looks sane
[02:45] <nhaines> \o/
[02:45] <nhaines> i tried to vote but I can't vote.
[02:45] <nhaines> Although apparently I can sabotage the voting options, so there's that.
[02:46] <nhaines> pleia2: How do you feel about GNOME Shell?
[02:47] <pleia2> xfce4ever
[02:47] <nhaines> I'm considering downgrading to Ubuntu 16.04 LTS and reevaluating whether or not to run Ubuntu in 2020.
[02:48] <nhaines> Although I do sort of like MATE.
[02:48] <dax> at the risk of being annoying, MATE works fine on Debian :)
[02:49] <pleia2> I've never really used any form of GNOME, and I continue to lack interest in trying it out
[02:49] <dax> i have gnome shell on a laptop right now. it's okay
[02:49] <dax> don't really feel strongly about it one way or another
[02:49] <nhaines> The non-core GNOME apps are great.  The GNOME Project is toxic and the worst thing to happen to Free Software.
[02:50] <nhaines> Maybe that's changed in the past couple of years but I lack time or motivation to find out.
[02:51] <nhaines> Although having spent hours using GNOME Software for the second edition of my book, I can honestly say it's terrible compared to Ubuntu Software Center.
[02:51] <nhaines> When GNOME Software even worked, anyway.  Because it broke a couple times and I had to revert back to a clean-install snapshot to get any listings.
[02:53] <nhaines> But GNOME's position seems to be "People should never install fonts."
[02:53] <nhaines> Or command line apps, unless it's Nethack, in which case only allow the console version to be installed and do not offer the GTK version.
[02:54] <dax> The only software GUI that doesn't annoy me greatly is synaptic
[02:54] <dax> All the "friendlier" ones are not for me.
[02:54] <nhaines> I didn't use Ubuntu Software Center a lot, but at least it worked.
[03:08] <pleia2> alright, email is prepped so I just need to check the poll and hit send before airport in the AM
[03:11] <nhaines> yay!
[03:11] <lyn||ian> I think lubuntu-software-center was better than gnome-software
[03:11] <nhaines> Thanks for doing all that.  :)
[03:11] <lyn||ian> but not maintained anymore


[00:11] <rick_h_> hey, mjc appears up yay
[00:11] <hatch> yup!
[00:11] <hatch> I'd be interested to know what the issue was
[00:23] <hatch> rick_h_: gl on the winter tire search - it's damn near impossible to compare tires because no one has experience with both :) so 'ratings' are essentially worthless
[00:23] <hatch> so flip a coin ;)
[00:25] <rick_h_> hatch: yea, when I got tires on the subaru it seemed I found some really good info. Now I can't seem to find anything
[00:25] <hatch> buy the same ones for the bee dub
[00:25] <rick_h_> then again I got a couple different ones and I was always happy with them.
[00:25] <hatch> vee*
[00:25] <rick_h_> well, they're not around any more
[00:25] <hatch> oh boo
[00:26] <hatch> I think I have the x-ice on my truck
[00:26] <rick_h_> and the subie tires were all season with decent winter tread. I'm just getting straight winter since I need to get 17" wheels anyway (19'
[00:26] <rick_h_> s on there now)
[00:26] <rick_h_> so first time doing the full swap of wheel and all for seasons
[00:26] <hatch> I think I'm going to go with something with some more tread next time though for deeper snow
[00:26] <rick_h_> yea, the blizzak has a little more tread
[00:27] <rick_h_> I'm leaning that route atm
[00:28] <hatch> yeah - the ice performance of either will probably be neglegable
[00:29] <rick_h_> yea, but ice ice is rare. I more want to go play when 6" falls
[00:29] <hatch> ohh haha
[00:29] <rick_h_> I don't like getting trapped in the house. I always need to prove I can go out and get a coffee :)
[00:29] <rick_h_> 12" came down during the day, we need to get some milk from the farthest store for the morning hehe
[00:30] <rick_h_> but it's the whole family safety thing.  More so than a lot of vehicle/traction control systems
[00:32] <hatch> well it's the only thing connecting those couple tonnes to the road :)
[00:32] <hatch> holy smokes winter tires have gone up in price
[00:32] <hatch> ohhhh nm heh
[00:32] <hatch> I was reading it wrong
[00:32] <rick_h_> yea, tires + wheels are going to run me close to 1500-2000 :/
[00:32] <hatch> ahh - yeah I already have another set of wheels so I'm lucky that way
[00:32] <rick_h_> though getting the 17" tires will save a chunk. Started out looking at 18" ones
[00:33] <hatch> also saves me from having to pay to switch them over
[00:34] <rick_h_> yea, bell tire will do storage for $60 ish a season
[00:34] <hatch> don't you have a huge yard?
[00:34] <hatch> lol
[00:34] <rick_h_> so that's worth it to me to just swap the wheels out, put them into storage, and I'll see you in 6mo
[00:34] <rick_h_> no, not really. My garage is full of woodworking gear
[00:34] <rick_h_> if I had built my dream shed I'd be cool, but didn't do that this year.
[00:35] <hatch> yeah ours goes into the shed
[00:35] <rick_h_> I've got a baby plastic shed full of lawn gear. At least that's out of the woodshop now.
[00:35] <hatch> ohhh - yeah a couple years ago I picked up a nice big tin one
[00:36] <hatch> used
[00:36] <rick_h_> nice
[00:36] <hatch> yeah it was a steal, but we had to take it apart
[00:36] <hatch> but I think I saved like $800 from new
[00:36] <hatch> so I was ok with that :)
[00:39] <rick_h_> yea, that's good stuff. You put it on dirt or pour a pad down?
[00:40] <hatch> built a 2x6 floor and put it on that so if I need to I can just drag it wherever I want
[00:40] <hatch> and I had the spare 2x6's
[00:40] <hatch> haha
[00:40] <rick_h_> nice!
[00:40] <hatch> honestly though, it'll probably never move
[00:42] <hatch> my $/km that I spent on that truck is just nuts lol
[00:42] <hatch> I need to get in it every morning and drive it around or something
[00:42] <hatch> haha
[11:09] <rick_h_> thanks frankban
[11:10] <frankban> rick_h_: thanks for QA and suggestions.  /login/data/wordpress-api-response.json 404 is very annoying
[11:25] <rick_h_> frankban: the /test/data?
[11:27] <frankban> rick_h_: make test-prod (and therefore lbox propose/submit) fails intermittently here with this error: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6183447/
[11:28] <rick_h_> frankban: hmmm, usually when I would get that there'd be some error where a navigate would occur breaking the loading of test data. I'm guessing some /login test is doing something bad
[11:28] <rick_h_> strange that it's intermittent
[11:28] <frankban> rick_h_: yeah
[12:59] <gary_poster> I'm going to take my "lunch" early.  back in about an hour.
[13:00] <rick_h_> gary_poster: have fun
[13:52] <hatch> mornin
[13:53] <rick_h_> morn
[14:02] <rick_h_> is the design meeting on? No one's there? luca__ gary_poster ?
[14:02] <luca__> rick_h_: yup, coming now
[15:10] <gary_poster> aiiiie!
[15:10] <gary_poster> I closed the thing and lost my chat!
[15:10] <gary_poster> boohoo hoo
[15:10] <benji> ???
[15:11] <gary_poster> I had info I wanted n the google hangout chat
[15:11] <gary_poster> and forgot to copy it out
[15:11] <gary_poster> :-(
[15:11] <benji> yeah, info in hangout chat is so easy to loose
[15:11] <benji> IRC logging for the win
[15:11] <gary_poster> yeah, that or a google doc.  hopefully I will learn my lesson :-(
[15:12] <hatch> they finally added a 'do not mute' button when typing
[15:12] <hatch> so that's cool
[15:12] <hatch> no more js console hacks
[15:16] <hatch> To solve this issue I create an ssh tunnel to it, but I'm guessing that's not the real story for this guy...or is it?  http://askubuntu.com/questions/346991/juju-gui-public-ip
[15:16] <hatch> I'll reply in kind if it is
[15:23] <hatch> rick_h_: looks like you can upgrade your favourite tech toy http://www.engadget.com/2013/10/02/fitbit-force-wristband-watch/?utm_medium=feed&utm_source=feedly lol
[15:26] <rick_h_> hatch: ugh, stupid thing.
[15:26] <rick_h_> hatch: pebble > fitbit
[15:27] <rick_h_> not going to go that route
[15:27] <rick_h_> hatch: as to the SO question, check with jcastro but I think you can configure lxc to not use nat, but bridged networking? Maybe they can tweak a config to get the IP to be exposed naturually. Otherwise, yea it needs a tunnel
[15:31] <jcastro> we need a Best Practice for LXC networking with Juju
[15:31] <hatch> jcastro: sounds good
[15:32] <hatch> in the meantime....? shall I reply with the tunnel instructions?
[15:32] <hatch> :)
[15:32] <jcastro> sure
[15:32] <jcastro> I need to do a call on the list for common workflows
[15:32] <rick_h_> hatch: there's a question on the bridge side here with an accepted answer http://askubuntu.com/questions/231666/how-do-i-setup-an-lxc-guest-so-that-it-gets-a-dhcp-address-so-i-can-access-it-on
[15:32] <rick_h_> hatch: might at least link to it as a potential method to follow up on
[15:33] <hatch> sure thanks
[15:33] <rick_h_> which links to http://askubuntu.com/questions/256304/public-ip-address-for-lxc-container/311003#311003
[15:33] <_mup_> Bug #311003: [Patch] Fix linking when with --as-needed --no-undefined <HPLIP:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/311003>
[15:33] <rick_h_> lol, welcome to the internet
[15:33] <rick_h_> link -> link -> ...which one do I want!!!
[15:35] <hatch> so the UK is censoring the internet, our city is trying to zone for the newly allowed strip clubs...man people are afraid of nekkid ppl!!
[15:35] <adeuring> abentley, benji: could one of you have a look at this MP: https://code.launchpad.net/~adeuring/charmworld/proof-lib-path/+merge/188871 ? (tiny diff)
[15:36] <benji> adeuring: sure
[15:36] <adeuring> thanks!
[15:41] <hatch> replied http://askubuntu.com/questions/346991/juju-gui-public-ip/352764#352764
[15:41] <_mup_> Bug #352764: If kwallet is disabled, network manager plasma widget does not connect to wirelessly <knetworkmanager:Fix Released> <plasma-widget-networkmanagement (Ubuntu):Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/352764>
[15:41] <hatch> thanks mup but that wasn't a bug
[15:48] <gary_poster> hey frankban what happened to https://codereview.appspot.com/13900044/ ?  looks like it never landed?
[15:48] <gary_poster> but I thought this was fixed
[15:48] <benji> adeuring: your branch looks good
[15:48] <frankban> gary_poster: looking
[15:48] <adeuring> benji: thanks!
[15:50] <Makyo> jujugui call in 10 kanban now
[15:50] <gary_poster> jujugui call in 10
[15:50] <gary_poster> darn!  :-P
[15:50] <Makyo> \o/
[15:50] <gary_poster> lol
[15:51] <frankban> gary_poster: ah, do you remember that we discussed the switching to the ServiceUpdate call and realized it was not backward compatible? I created and landed another branch to fix that bug: https://codereview.appspot.com/13917043/
[15:51] <gary_poster> frankban, ah right!  could you mark those (MP and RV) as dead so future generations are not confused? :-)
[15:52] <frankban> gary_poster: sure :-), sorry for the confusion
[15:52] <gary_poster> np
[15:52] <gary_poster> ooh, someone soon will be able to have the bug number 1234567
[15:52]  * gary_poster starts filing bugs...
[15:53] <frankban> :-)
[15:58] <Makyo> jujugui call in 2
[16:00] <gary_poster> Makyo, wassup?
[16:01] <Makyo> gary_poster, juju is eating my machine
[16:01] <hatch> nom nom nom
[16:15] <Makyo> Going to run a quick errand so we actually have food for lunch besides eggs, won't be long.
[16:28] <hatch> mmm foood
[16:28] <hatch> i forgot breakfast again
[16:28] <hatch> damn
[16:30] <hatch> I love it when auth fails while lboxing AFTER it's run lint and tests...ugh lol
[16:41] <hatch> jujugui anyone else having issues lboxing?
[16:41] <hatch> error: use of closed network connection
[16:41] <hatch> 3 times in a row now?
[16:42] <rick_h_> hatch: not an issue early this morning when I landed mine, but that sounds like LP issues.
[16:44] <hatch> yeah, well will try again I guess!!
[16:44] <benji> hatch: I've gotten that error recently (but it cleared up when re-run); I too suspect an LP issue (probably a timeout)
[16:48] <hatch> here it goes
[16:48] <hatch> 5th time is the charm :)
[16:49] <hatch> does anyone know how to copy text in the terminal with the mouse in tmux when you have `setw -g mose-mouse on` ?
[16:52] <hatch> btw gary_poster using `bzr mv` worked properly this time - not sure what happened last time
[16:52] <rick_h_> hatch: middle-click is what I use to copy all text into the terminal
[16:52] <hatch> hmm no middle click
[16:53] <hatch> oh into the terminal
[16:53] <rick_h_> shift-insert then I think?
[16:53] <gary_poster> hatch, good.  yeah, has always worked for me
[16:53] <hatch> I need out of the terminal
[16:53] <hatch> tmux now captures the mouse highlight it seems
[16:53] <rick_h_> hatch: then highlight with the mouse and then middle-click it where you want it to go
[16:53] <hatch> as soon as I release the highlight is gone
[16:54] <rick_h_> not sure
[16:54] <hatch> yeah it's pretty odd
[16:55] <hatch> rick_h_: would ya mind? https://codereview.appspot.com/14175046/
[16:55] <rick_h_> hatch: sure ting
[16:55] <rick_h_> thing
[16:55] <hatch> coolio
[17:08] <rick_h_> hatch: comments and qa issue inbound
[17:10] <hatch> rick_h_: reading thanks
[17:37] <hatch> rick_h_: fixed - reproposing
[17:38] <rick_h_> hatch: k, sec and will relook
[17:39] <hatch> rick_h_: sorry have test failures again
[17:46] <hatch> lboxing again
[17:47] <hatch> gary_poster: thought you would want to know that Dell just upgraded the XPS 15 laptops.... :P
[17:47]  * hatch ducks
[17:49] <gary_poster> hatch, heh :-P
[17:49] <hatch> rick_h_: ok reitveld has the new stuff
[17:51] <rick_h_> hatch: k, looking
[17:51] <rick_h_> hatch: so then did you bzr grep all BrowserCharmView and look for the data passed in?
[17:52] <hatch> yeah did I miss one?
[17:53] <rick_h_> hatch: no, just asking
[17:53] <hatch> doesn't look like it
[17:53] <hatch> oh ok
[17:53] <hatch> but I also use `ack-grep` :)
[17:53] <hatch> does bzr grep work better?
[17:53] <rick_h_> hatch: cool, sorry. My review is to ask questions and prod thinking vs just "here's my list"
[17:53] <rick_h_> hatch: bzr grep just makes sure to only limit to files in the bzr content
[17:54] <hatch> oh ok - that might be better because then it'll skip any of the built files
[17:54] <rick_h_> git has the same thing. Handy for ignoring files you don't care about easily
[17:54] <rick_h_> yep
[17:54] <hatch> I'll try and remember to use that
[17:54] <hatch> I used to have 'ack' (OSX) set up to ignore anything in the .gitignore so I guess that just stuck :)
[17:59] <hatch> rick_h_: found out how to copy in tmux with my settings hold 'shift' or in iterm(OSX) hold 'option'
[17:59] <hatch> just fyi
[17:59] <rick_h_> bah, I want to bank my bug credit for my next QA day :P
[17:59] <rick_h_> hatch: cool, not a problem here so must be some mac-ism or something. Good to know I guess
[18:00] <rick_h_> hatch: and LGTM thanks for the updates
[18:00] <hatch> thanks!
[18:00] <hatch> rick_h_: do you have tmux capturing your mouse scroll?
[18:00] <hatch> so you can scroll up/down in tmux with the mouse?
[18:00] <rick_h_> hatch: hmm, I do that in my terminal I think.
[18:00] <hatch> that setting appears to trigger the issue
[18:00] <rick_h_> so no, guess I don't
[19:02] <rick_h_> benji: ping, got a sec?
[19:02] <benji> rick_h_: sure
[19:02] <benji> rick_h_: video chat or here?
[19:02] <rick_h_> benji: video please, sec will set up
[19:02] <benji> rick_h_: try this benjiyork.com/chat
[19:03] <rick_h_> connecting
[19:14] <benji> rick_h_: you were my first chat using that thing, other than not having a mute it worked well
[19:14] <hatch> what is it?
[19:15] <rick_h_> benji: yea, worked fine. Backgroud noise on the road there but other than that sounded good and loaded up quick
[19:16] <rick_h_> <3 the nice url
[19:17] <benji> heh
[19:17] <benji> yeah, me too
[19:21] <rick_h_> https://code.launchpad.net/~rharding/charmworld/bundle-metadata/+merge/188905 for a WIP with notes on why some stuff is changed. Feel free to smack my hands with the rule where I'm going against the new grain
[19:21] <rick_h_> appreciate the time to peek at it
[19:24] <benji> rick_h_: looking
[19:25] <rick_h_> heh, there's some silly stuff in the mid-mode. #185 for instance is meant to be the upcoming icon helper method but it looks just like the next block in the if
[19:33] <benji> rick_h_: why the new constant empty dict being returned from _extract_charm_id?
[19:34] <rick_h_> benji: confusion. Typo going back/forth between methods since I added the third param to the bundle things to help find bundles
[19:34] <rick_h_> benji: chalk it up to mid-work
[19:34] <benji> k
[19:35] <rick_h_> benji: so get_file returns the bytes, but none of the extra info for serving the file like content_type and such?
[19:36] <rick_h_> or nvm, that's the gridfs object so should have the content-type in there
[19:36] <benji> ok
[19:43] <gary_poster> need to get kids from school.  back soon
[19:53] <benji> rick_h_: your branch looks fine to me
[19:53] <rick_h_> benji: cool
[19:53] <rick_h_> benji: the file hashes in the basket db can be yaml?
[19:55] <benji> rick_h_: I don't understand the question.
[19:56] <rick_h_> benji: I'm looking at how the files are getched and noticed in the unquote_yaml. nvm, that's the period escaping stuff. Ignore me
[19:56] <rick_h_> man, is today monday or something?
[19:56] <benji> heh
[19:56] <benji> It's Monday somewhere.
[19:57] <rick_h_> that and I keep typing backet vs basket
[19:57] <rick_h_> I can't seem to hit 'as' in a row
[20:02]  * gary_poster here
[20:03] <gary_poster> oh rick_h_...you available to talk in 5?  you are probably past your EoD, yeah?
[20:04] <rick_h_> gary_poster: I can talk in 5
[20:04] <gary_poster> cool thanks
[20:15] <gary_poster> rick_h_, uh "five minutes"... https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d909f7c1b9c8db56be05af4887e38eef6587a85c?hl=en if you are still ok :-)
[20:42] <rick_h_> benji: still around?
[20:42] <benji> rick_h_: yep
[20:42] <rick_h_> does fs.put(content, contentType=content_type)
[20:42] <rick_h_> *** TypeError: must specify an encoding for file in order to write unicode
[20:43] <rick_h_> ring a bell? Trying to manually put a file into fs. Looks like all we do is shove a string of content in but getting this when trying to do it via pdb
[20:43] <rick_h_> the code is currently just silently passing without any files added to the gridfs
[20:43] <rick_h_> content is just a u'Test Content' for a test file
[20:44] <benji> rick_h_: I don't think I've seen that error in that context, but the problem is that it wants a string and it doesn't know what encoding it hould use.  de-unicode your string and you should be fine.
[20:44] <rick_h_> hmm, guess it just doesn't like the unicode. I see it in the docs now. Ignore me some more
[20:45] <rick_h_> but still isn't there...ugh. after an fs.put() and then an fs.list() is empty
[20:46] <rick_h_> hmm, there it goes. Ok. maybe I just timed it wrong. Stupid 'eventually consistent' not liking my pdb points
[20:48] <benji> heh
[20:48] <rick_h_> yay! test passes.
[20:50] <rick_h_> thanks for the help today benji.
[20:50] <benji> my pleasure
[20:58] <rick_h_> benji: #1190944 is the orig of your markdown bug
[20:58] <_mup_> Bug #1190944: The copyright header of README.md in the charm is shown <charm> <charmbrowser> <juju-gui:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1190944>
[20:59] <benji> rick_h_: thanks, I'll mark mine as a duplicate
[21:01] <benji> I changed 1190944 to "Low", it was "Medium"
[21:30] <hatch> jujugui I'm investigating the bug -re gary_poster email
[21:31]  * hatch wishes everyone replied to emails from the top :D
[21:37] <hatch> gary_poster: I'm a little confused here - it appears that it -works- in the gui but does not in the console....
[21:37] <hatch> the email conflicts itself
[21:58] <hatch> nm I was able to reproduce
[22:09] <hatch> bcsaller: ping
[22:09] <bcsaller> whats up?
[22:09] <hatch> avail for a quick call?
[22:09] <hatch> re this email
[22:10] <hatch> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/4cec75a250f0b68cdf45f3c060a997dbdccb9c3b?hl=en
[22:30] <hatch> bcsaller: hangout is not working lol
[22:31] <bcsaller> nope
[22:31] <bcsaller> hatch: happy to say its a charm issue if we can get away with it, but we should make an attempt to detect it somewhere in the pipeline then
[22:32] <bcsaller> and update the docs
[22:32] <bcsaller> its a bit sad that there isn't an easy fix on our side though
[22:32] <hatch> go javascript? ;)
[22:43] <hatch> bcsaller: so can you think of any other ideas besides formatting the keys?
[22:44] <hatch> we could restrict to a single level of recusion?
[22:44] <hatch> nah that could still break the YUI ones
[22:44] <hatch> so basically only formatting the keys will help
[22:45] <bcsaller> hatch: I think we detect the case and inform the user. I would like to test that you can actually get/set those keys in a core env though
[22:45] <hatch> yeah i'm spinning up one right now
[22:45] <bcsaller> in which case its really matter of enforcing proper policy that it doesn't work
[22:45] <hatch> takes a long time :)
[22:45] <bcsaller> yeah
[22:51] <bcsaller> hatch: I suppose we could fork, fix and offer up the charm with s/\./\-/ in the key access
[22:52] <hatch> heh - yeah that would probably be the best way
[22:53] <hatch> bcsaller: although I wonder if it requires the keys in that format
[22:53] <hatch> so we would need to format them again in the charm
[22:53] <hatch> hah
[22:53] <bcsaller> we'd have to change config.yaml and the hooks
[22:53] <hatch> right - I mean, I wonder if it uses the same keys to set the values in Hadoop
[22:53] <hatch> I Know nothing of how Hadoop works to know if those are valid keys
[22:55] <hatch> and of course launchpad is showing the files are empty...
[22:56] <bcsaller> http://manage.jujucharms.com/charms/precise/hadoop/hooks/config-changed ::170 ish
[22:56] <hatch> so yes
[22:56] <hatch> heh
[22:57] <hatch> :/
[22:57] <bcsaller> hatch: well, it looks like it uses the name twice, once in the dot form and once to lookup the juju value, which could change
[22:58] <hatch> right, we could change the key value in juju
[22:58] <hatch> ok I'll update the ticket with this
[22:58] <hatch> see where we are going with this
[22:58] <hatch> mostly because it's STILL starting
[22:58] <hatch> lol
[23:00] <hatch> bcsaller: yuss it breaks on juju-core
[23:00] <hatch> :)
[23:00]  * hatch does a happy dance
[23:00] <bcsaller> ha, good
[23:01] <huwshimi> Morning
[23:01] <bcsaller> at least my understanding of the world is correct. So we can do a number of things now. Warn in the GUI, warn on the CLI, and warn when we proof/ingest the charm
[23:01] <bcsaller> well, on ingest it would be a fail
[23:02] <hatch> yeah ok I'll write this all up in the ticket
[23:02] <bcsaller> hatch: it does look simple enough to fix in the wild, but still a pain
[23:02] <hatch> yep
[23:03] <bcsaller> moring huwshimi
[23:03] <bcsaller> if I could type
[23:03] <hatch> morning huwshimi
[23:03] <huwshimi> heh
[23:03] <hatch> ahh just call him sashimi
[23:03] <hatch> :P
[23:06] <hatch> I probably spelt that wrong
[23:19] <rick_h_> hatch: what's up? What bug? You working around '.' in something? Charmworld does the escaping/dealing with that usually
[23:20]  * rick_h_ doesn't see a gary email/bug at the top of the email
[23:20] <hatch> rick_h_: ttps://bugs.launchpad.net/charms/+source/hadoop/+bug/1234365
[23:20] <_mup_> Bug #1234365: juju-gui does not give option to pass configure paramter <hadoop (Juju Charms Collection):Confirmed> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1234365>
[23:21] <rick_h_> hatch: ah, so this is purely on the gui talking to juju side and not around charmworld
[23:21] <rick_h_> hatch: nvm, ignore me then
[23:21] <hatch> already done
[23:21] <hatch> :P
[23:21] <hatch> jk
[23:21] <rick_h_> :P
[23:22] <hatch> rick_h_: honestly though, shouldn't charmworld have seen the config options using .'s and failed the injest?
[23:23] <rick_h_> hatch: no, we escape the . in storage of mongo and unescape during api calls
[23:23] <rick_h_> hatch: as you say in your note, it's valid from the cli and such
[23:23] <rick_h_> hatch: it's up to the client to deal with the issue once we've worked around the '.' not being able to be stored in mongodb itself
[23:23] <hatch> rick_h_: well no the CLI throws an error if you try to access/set that config option
[23:24] <rick_h_> huwshimi: https://code.launchpad.net/~jcsackett/juju-gui/charm-slider/+merge/152418 is the branch that initially added it. I'd search for a branch afterwards that removed the widget from the codebase for the final version
[23:24] <rick_h_> huwshimi: well then yea, I'd talk to marcoceppi about having proof blow up in that case and then charmworld would have rejected it
[23:24] <rick_h_> huwshimi: and the proof tool will tell the author when they write the charm not to do it before they ever submit/get through any review process
[23:24] <rick_h_> sorry hatch ^^
[23:25] <huwshimi> rick_h_: Thanks for that
[23:25] <marcoceppi> rick_h_ huwshimi: if proof is missing functionality (hatch ?) feel free to open up a bug against charm-tools with a description. I'm gearing up for a 1.1 release before the cloud sprint and will try to include anything you guys need
[23:25] <rick_h_> huwshimi: np, it was in the code for at least a few weeks I think
[23:25] <huwshimi> rick_h_: haha
[23:25] <marcoceppi> (also patches accepted)
[23:25] <rick_h_> marcoceppi: so does it sound reasonable/is it known that having config options in the charm with a '.' in the name is bad?
[23:25] <hatch> marcoceppi: ok I will do that, thanks https://bugs.launchpad.net/charms/+source/hadoop/+bug/1234365 to see the issue in question
[23:26] <_mup_> Bug #1234365: juju-gui does not give option to pass configure paramter <hadoop (Juju Charms Collection):Confirmed> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1234365>
[23:26] <marcoceppi> rick_h_: I'm not awayre of an issue with a .
[23:26] <marcoceppi> rick_h_: I know that's a problem with charm names
[23:26] <rick_h_> yea, that's the rub I guess. hatch so we should dupe that the cli hates charms with a . in a config name, maybe even email the juju list about it, then update proof to check and erorr on it
[23:26] <rick_h_> problem goes away :)
[23:28] <hatch> oh charmtools is written in python
[23:28] <hatch> yeah you wouldn't want me to issue a pr
[23:28] <hatch> :D
[23:46] <gary_poster> hey hatch thanks a lot.  I read backlog and bug.  looks like you have it in hand.  if you have to go, send me an email to hand off.  If you end up staying up late on this to resolve, send me an email and then take some corresponding time tomorrow
[23:46] <gary_poster> I have to go take care of kids and house meanwhile :-)
[23:46] <gary_poster> ttyl
[23:46] <hatch> gary_poster: waiiiiit
[23:46] <hatch> see your email
[23:46] <gary_poster> hatch here
[23:47] <hatch> i JUST sent a follow-up with Narinder
[23:47] <hatch> would you like me to do the mechanical change and 'hope' it works? or wait for Kapil?
[23:49] <hatch> I'm ok with either options
[23:49] <gary_poster> hatch ack.  so the mechanical change would be to change the values in config and then try to figure out where the charm consumes the config values and change them?
[23:49] <gary_poster> hatch did you verify that juju set fails?
[23:49] <hatch> right - it does a sort-of mapping to build the XML config file
[23:50] <hatch> yes, it does fail
[23:51] <hatch> so I could change the hook to use the new config values and hope that it still works - but like I mentioned in the email, I don't even know what constitutes 'running' for Hadoop so I wouldn't know how to test it beyond a basic juju deploy
[23:51] <hatch> I'm sure I could learn, but not in a couple hours haha
[23:52] <gary_poster> cool.  we should clarify that.  I'll shoot a quick email reply to confirm that.  hatch, how quick would it be for you to make that change?  easy?  or easier for Ben if he is around?  If it's a matter of 30 minutes, you could simply offer a mechanical branch and let Kapil or Narinder know its existence.  They would then see the issue
[23:52] <hatch> I could probably do it in <1H if it's simply a case of doing a mechanical change and pushing it back up for someone else to take from there
[23:54] <gary_poster> hatch do it, if you are willing.  Thank you.  I will have a reply for you to review in just a sec.  then I really need to run
[23:54] <hatch> sure - I'll just need to find where the source is kept
[23:54] <hatch> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~charmers/charms/precise/hadoop/trunk/files/head:/hooks/
[23:55] <hatch> all the files are empty?
[23:55] <hatch> jcastro: are you around?
[23:55] <gary_poster> hatch they are all symlinks
[23:55] <gary_poster> its a common pattern
[23:56] <gary_poster> hatch see hadoop-common and ganglia-common
[23:56] <hatch> ohhhhh
[23:56] <hatch> interesting pattern
[23:56] <hatch> ok I'll do the mechanical change and then push it up
[23:56] <gary_poster> cool thabnks
[23:57] <hatch> have a good night


[00:47] <cmaloney> Got this in the mail today: http://cloudkickermusic.com/album/live-with-intronaut
[00:47] <cmaloney> *swooooon*
[00:49] <rick_h_> lol
[00:53] <cmaloney> They parallel released it with Century Media
[01:45] <cmaloney> http://www.metalinjection.net/video/carcass-goatwhore-hilariously-featured-on-cbs-elementary
[01:45] <cmaloney> (OK this is hilarious)
[01:45] <cmaloney> Also explains my day most days.
[02:27] <cmaloney> rick_h_: I've heard that walking desks can decrease concentration
[02:30] <rick_h_> cmaloney: that's a good thing for me :)
[02:30] <cmaloney> Then go with my blessing
[02:30] <cmaloney> concentration /focus
[16:36] <cmaloney> Good morning
[18:56] <mrgoodcat> anybody see this article yet? http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-30191218
[18:57] <mrgoodcat> its pretty much the british intel services complaining because american companies don't make it easy to spy
[18:57] <mrgoodcat> its nice and refreshing to see these companies not being awful for once
[18:59] <akelling> About time they did not roll over.
[19:01] <mrgoodcat> the complaints make me feel warm and fuzzy inside
[19:01] <mrgoodcat> they complain about "complex encryption techniques" that make it hard to spy on content
[19:01] <mrgoodcat> and such things that i'm wholly in favor of
[19:02] <akelling> lol right!
[19:03] <mrgoodcat> "Where there is a possibility that a terrorist atrocity is being planned, that argument should not be allowed to prevail,"
[19:04] <mrgoodcat> in reference to companies saying they need to protect their users' privacy
[19:06] <akelling> The possibility of X are crazy arguments.
[19:06] <akelling> http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/11/beefed-up-iphone-crypto-will-lead-to-a-child-dying-doj-warned-apple-execs/ - This artical comes to my mind also.
[19:10] <mrgoodcat> what a misleading title
[19:10] <mrgoodcat> wow
[19:12] <cmaloney> Well, if it's only one child I'm OK with that.
[19:13] <cmaloney> Just as long as the DOJ lets me choose
[19:13] <cmaloney> I have a list
[19:13] <cmaloney> (note: not really)
[19:14] <mrgoodcat> lol
[19:15] <akelling> hahahaha cmaloney
[19:19] <jrwren> i do. really. its historical. hitler, 100 yrs ago. that sort of thing.
[20:45] <cmaloney> https://gear.mozilla.org/products/mozilla-heroes-lithograph
[20:45] <cmaloney> Such a deal
[22:40] <rick_h_> such a good deal? famous work? /me doesn't know what it is


[00:07] <OvenWerks> build qued...
[00:21] <OvenWerks> built waiting publish...
[00:37] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: re:devices that jack can not start. I was wrong it is zita-ajbridge that is having trouble. Interesting thing that if I set jack master to hw:AudioPCI,1,0 that works and adding hw:AudioPCI,0,0 just works fine.
[00:38] <OvenWerks> I think the problem is that for some reason zita does not detect the fact that hw:*,1,0 needs the -L flag (force 16bits little endian)
[00:40] <OvenWerks> I need to figure out how to detect that I guess.
[00:41] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: -controls published... ready to wreck and rot...
[00:41] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Ok
[00:42] <OvenWerks> No changes to autojack this time.
[00:43] <Eickmeyer> Good to know
[00:47] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: I thought we wanted the app buttons below the jack control buttons?
[00:50] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: does that make more sense? I can do that.
[00:50] <Eickmeyer> Ok
[00:56] <OvenWerks> build queued
[00:59] <OvenWerks> we don't have drmr do we?
[01:01] <OvenWerks> I wonder if we can get AVLdrums in.
[01:16] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: does this look better?
[01:16] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: I'll know in a vew. I'm eating dinner.
[01:16] <Eickmeyer> *few
[01:16] <OvenWerks> well then ignor me...
[01:17] <Eickmeyer> hehehe
[01:28] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: That looks much better.
[01:28] <Eickmeyer> Also, drmr? We have hydrogen...
[01:31] <Eickmeyer> I see drmr and AVLdrums are both in kxstudio, so it should be relatively easy.
[01:37] <Eickmeyer> Yikes. Drmr is something like 7 years old without a commit.
[01:42] <Eickmeyer> And it looks like Robin just released a new version of AVLDrums < 1 week ago.
[02:15] <OvenWerks> Ya, I just DL from his site.
[02:15] <OvenWerks> quite nice
[02:15] <OvenWerks> I am just thinking that one of the holes in what we have is a drum player/synth
[02:17] <OvenWerks> drum gizmo comes without sounds
[02:21] <OvenWerks> avldrums comes as red zeppelin and the black pearl with all the sounds
[02:26] <Eickmeyer> Oh nice.
[02:26] <Eickmeyer> Well, I've got drmr building on my own ppa to see if anything goes wrong. If nothing does I'm moving it to the autobuilds.
[02:58] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: drmr is now in autobuilds for you to try out.
[06:05] <OvenWerks> I didn't realize drmr was so old. It may be more of a liability
[06:05] <OvenWerks> Having said that, how old is hydrogen? When was it last updated?
[06:07] <OvenWerks> Hydrogen has a number of commits even in the last two days.
[14:35] <Eickmeyer> Yeah, Hydrogen is very much active.
[14:35] <Eickmeyer> I'm having the worst time getting AVLDrums to build.
[15:16] <OvenWerks> I think robtk has to actually be included in the src.
[15:17] <OvenWerks> To make a src package
[15:20] <OvenWerks> In other words, the local git needs to include robtk not just a link to it because the builder will not just add random code from the internet.
[15:21] <OvenWerks> "Makefile:132: This plugin needs https://github.com/x42/robtk"
[15:21] <OvenWerks> The make file may need to be changed too.
[15:23] <OvenWerks> The version of robtk to use is the commit embeded in the git link.
[15:29] <OvenWerks> The makefile calls Makefile.git a number of times. That will need to be removed
[15:45] <OvenWerks> WRT -controls: Right now, we frequently create a jack client and if successful call jack running. I am not sure this is the best way of doing things.
[15:48] <OvenWerks> I was going to leave -controls for a while to work on menu-add... but I think we should if creating a client is successful, give jack a callback for shutting down or use some other test with the client we have.
[15:49] <OvenWerks> because right now we have a lot of jackdbus log lines like:
[15:49] <OvenWerks> Mon May 13 17:27:51 2019: New client 'controls' with PID 12545
[15:49] <OvenWerks> Mon May 13 17:27:51 2019: Client 'controls' with PID 12545 is out
[15:49] <OvenWerks> This is growing the log file to fast.
[15:53] <Eickmeyer> Yeah, I agree. There has to be a more efficinet way.
[15:56] <Eickmeyer> WRT AVLDrums: I saw that, it's just a matter of pointing the "RW" variable to the right directory. I downloaded robtk manually to the directory, and since there's no actual modification of code, it's completely fine to do. In fact, git acted like it had been there the entire time.
[15:57] <OvenWerks> The problem is not with git but with the build system which builds in a chroot with no inet access
[15:58] <OvenWerks> (or should)
[15:58] <Eickmeyer> When I looked at the makefile, it looked like the RW could be specified /or/ you could use make submodules.
[16:02] <OvenWerks> The https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/+git/avldrums.lv2/+ref/master shows that the robtk directory is empty
[16:03] <OvenWerks> so it may build on your system, but was not uploaded.
[16:03] <OvenWerks> you may have to git -a robtk or something
[16:04] <OvenWerks> (you may need to remove any .git file in that directory too)
[16:04] <Eickmeyer> I just removed the entire directory
[16:11] <Eickmeyer> had to remove .gitmodules as well.
[16:30] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: I finally got past the robtk issue, but now I'm getting other issues.
[16:38]  * Eickmeyer is going back to the drawing board, will clone falktx's build
[17:02]  * Eickmeyer is giving up on AVLDrums
[17:02] <Eickmeyer> Can't get launchpad to build it.
[17:23] <Eickmeyer> tsimonq2: Did you ever look at lsp-plugins?
[18:40]  * Eickmeyer got dpf-plugins to build
[18:55]  * OvenWerks has gotten leaving client open to work.... but gets seg fault in some cases.
[20:33] <tsimonq2> Eickmeyer: Sorry, I haven't.
[20:33] <tsimonq2> I'm absolutely swamped the next week.
[21:03] <Eickmeyer> tsimonq2: All good, I understand. My biggest hurdle is the shared library it installs in /usr/lib which vorlon objected to, but doesn't seem to be out of the ordinary, so I didn't understand the problem.
[21:03] <tsimonq2> Yeah.
[21:03] <tsimonq2> Eickmeyer: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/GFnXmk4DJd/
[21:57] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: dpf-plugins has a libjack-dev build dependency. Will that cause an issue when installed, meaning, will it pull-in Jack1 instead of Jack2? If so, then is swapping that dep a 1:1?