[02:14] <James_Epp> I'm looking for a software recommendation as well as a guide possibility. I want to get a mail server up and running (preferably smtp/imap) that can host multiple domains. Nothing super fancy. Mailpile would be great for this, but yeah.....it's in dev. My skills are not what they could be. I'm one of those people where if they can't apt-get it or download a .deb, they are lost. GUI would be preferred, but I'm not scared of a lit
[02:37] <tjj> If there's an ubuntu server that I'm rebooting remotely, is there a way to know the very instant that ssh becomes available?
[02:38] <James_Epp> tjj: you could just ping the server. idk about ssh specifically, though.
[02:39] <tjj> James_Epp: Yeah that was my first thought but unfortunately the system responds to pings way before sshd starts
[02:39] <James_Epp> tjj: mmkay
[02:40] <James_Epp> tjj: IDK how well it would work, but you could try "watch ssh user@server"
[02:44] <tjj> James_Epp: Yeah I was hoping for something scriptable...I'll just head over to serverfault
[02:44] <James_Epp> tjj: Good luck!
[02:47] <rostam> HI if i need to modify initramfs (/etc/fstab), are there any references how to do it? thx
[08:07] <jamespage> zul, I pushed and uploaded cinder rc3 fyi
[08:07] <jamespage> keystone rc3 should be out shortly will do the same
[08:07] <jamespage> no neutron rc3 planned as yet
[08:30] <jamespage> zul: both done and pushed
[08:48] <g0tcha> heya guys, i have an ubuntu server VM running, anyone can advice on how to create a full system backups of it?
[08:50] <g0tcha> my ubuntu got compromised some how, i found some commands in the 'history' that i did not run
[08:50] <g0tcha> i rebuilt the OS and now in the process of moving the data over to the new install
[08:50] <g0tcha> but im wondering whats the best way to create weekly backups so incase something like this happens again i just revert back to an older, cleaner backup
[08:51] <g0tcha> right now i cant even be sure of my database for example is compromised or not, so moving that to the new install is an issue
[08:51] <g0tcha> ive read about rsync but thats not what i want
[08:51] <g0tcha> rsync would already have synced the compromised files (if any)
[09:05] <Anomie_work> g0tcha: What VPS provider are you using? Some offer automatic updated (Linode)
[09:05] <Anomie_work> But if you're moving the data over, you're probably moving the malicious code over with it too
[09:05] <Anomie_work> /s/d/s
[09:06] <g0tcha> Anomie_work, its a VM im running from home actually
[09:06] <g0tcha> and yeah, i figured that i might be moving the malicious code over thats why im moving only what i think is necessary for now to minimize the risk
[09:07] <g0tcha> but at the same time i want to future-proof by backups incase this happens or simply if the server just breaks down
[09:07] <rbasak> I use tarsnap with the server having a write-only key. Then if I can be confident about the date/time of compromise I can be confident that older backups are not compromised.
[09:12] <g0tcha> rbasak, how does that work?
[09:13] <rbasak> g0tcha: tarsnap works like tar, but deduplicates, encrypts and writes out to a "cloud" location. The key can be split into separate write and read keys if desired. However, it's proprietary (though client source is available). See the tarsnap page for details.
[09:13] <rbasak> It's very Unix-y
[09:17] <g0tcha> rbasak, ib te gettubg started page it says its required to have a Tarsnap account and to egister my machines with that account
[09:17] <g0tcha> is that done only on the "cloud" ? cant be used without creating an account and backing up localy?
[09:17] <rbasak> Correct. Can't be used locally.
[09:18] <rbasak> I wrote "ddar" which is similar but can be used locally. It doesn't do encryption, though (relies on filesystem/ssh encryption)
[09:18] <rbasak> ddar isn't packaged though. I really should get round to doing that.
[09:18] <rbasak> There's also bup and one or two others.
[09:25] <g0tcha> sounds complicated heheh
[09:28] <zotta> I have one program on my server which has a minor bug. Googling around i came to the conclusion that it was introduced in the very version i have and fixed in the next
[09:29] <zotta> how can i install another version?
[09:33] <hitsujiTMO> zotta: how was it installed?
[09:33] <zotta> apt-get
[09:33] <zotta> official repos
[09:34] <zotta> i have looked in aptitude and only one version seems aviable from there
[09:34] <hitsujiTMO> if the later version is not in the repo, then you may want to look for a ppa for the software ... failing that you would prob have to build the latest version yourself
[09:37] <rbasak> zotta: what is the bug, and in what package? We do fix bugs in stable releases by backporting the fixes, provided that they meet some stability criteria: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[09:45] <zotta> rbasak: The problem is that symbolic links are displayed as files which can not be downloaded or accessed in filezilla
[09:46] <zotta> rbasak: i am using ubuntu 12.04 lts
[09:47] <zotta> rbasak: It worked with 10.04 lts
[09:47] <zotta> rbasak: on google i found this thread: http://forum.directadmin.com/showthread.php?t=42402
[09:47] <zotta> rbasak: but it did not work http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.network.proftpd.devel/21
[09:48] <rbasak> zotta: so a filezilla bug?
[09:49] <zotta> it worked with the old server
[09:50] <zotta> it seems to be the combination of proftpd and filezilla
[09:50] <hitsujiTMO> zotta: have you looked at http://askubuntu.com/questions/32001/need-proftpd-to-follow-symbolic-link
[09:52] <zotta> hitsujiTMO: i tested DefaultRoot / and no effect
[09:53] <zotta> well screw it
[11:19] <BrixSat> Hello
[11:19] <BrixSat> anyone with fluentd experience
[11:22] <hitsujiTMO> !details Z BrixSat
[11:22] <hitsujiTMO> !details | BrixSat
[11:26] <BrixSat> hitsujiTMO:  i wold like to know how to make my machines log to fluentd. Im a beguinner on this.
[11:27] <zul> jamespage:  cool im going to start prepping final branches so they will be ready to go
[11:27] <jamespage> zul, okay
[11:28] <BrixSat> I cant find any info on that, i see fluentd loggers but i want something like loggger connect  to local fluentd with cache and then that fluentd connect to remote central fluentd
[11:29] <BrixSat> like logger ---> fluentd_localmachine ---> internet --->fluentd_central_server
[13:01] <zul> jamespage:  im going to update the boto version patch we are carrying
[13:02] <jamespage> zul, you know it sucks upstream still right?
[13:03] <zul> jamespage:  yeah
[13:03] <smoser> what is this ?
[13:03] <zul> jamespage:  its not in the milestone-proposed tree either
[13:04] <smoser> rbasak, just an fyi, i uploaded a change yesterday to simplestreams filter logic
[13:04] <smoser> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/simplestreams/+bug/1238227
[13:04] <zul> smoser: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1239220
[13:04] <smoser> i was/am moderately concerned that i could have broken someone expecting the old logic (although i think that old logic was quite odd)
[13:48] <johest> does someone may have experiene with dell idrac 7 ? i cant connect to the remote shell
[15:15] <g0tcha> quick noob question, is backing up the '/' directory means backing up the whole OS filesystem?
[16:06] <zul> jamespage:  i got keystone rc4
[16:09] <jamespage> zul, coolio
[16:22] <zul> jamespage: https://code.launchpad.net/~zulcss/keystone/rc4/+merge/191454
[16:23] <jamespage> zul, +1 (conditional) - add full stop at end of changelog line :-)
[16:24] <zul> jamespage:  fixed
[16:28] <zul> jamespage:  uploaded
[16:41] <Thirtysixway> could someone tell me if whoopsie/apport on ubuntu server automatically sends crash reports to canonical?
[16:41] <Level15> Hi, all. Got some big issue here: i have an ibm ts3100 tape library. lsscsi shows me the two drives but no media changer device... any hints?
[16:59] <phillw> Hi good people, anyone know why the 13.10 RC has been marked as disabled on the iso-tracker? http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/305/builds thanks :)
[17:05] <DanielSa> Is there any issue with the update of package procps? I'm getting a error after executing 'sudo apt-get upgrade'
[17:08] <jamespage> DanielSa, under LXC or some sort of VPS hosted instance?
[17:08] <jamespage> bug 1157643
[17:09] <DanielSa> vps
[17:12] <DanielSa> Thank you guys. Next time I'll look at launchpad first.
[17:16] <Level15> hi, all: what kernel driver/module should I use for a FC tape autoloader? So far the modules I have loaded show the drives but not the changer device. Thanks.
[17:56] <smoser> zul, 'ipxe' on the server cd bzr blames in ubuntu seeds to you
[17:57] <smoser> the commit message was 'Add ipxe'
[17:57] <smoser> do you have any more information on that that you could provide me with ?
[17:57] <smoser> server cd is oversized, and that seems like a good candidate for shrinkage
[17:57] <smoser> Daviey, maybe you remember something there?>
[17:57] <zul> smoser:  lemme think
[17:59] <zul> smoser:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ipxe/+bug/800340
[18:50] <adam_g> jamespage, cinder charms test suite is fixed if you'd like to do the honors of mering the last of the redux branches :)
[19:25] <zul> jamespage:  neutron rc3 coming down the pipe in  a minute
[19:25] <zul> adam_g: ^^^
[19:27] <adam_g> zul, yippie
[19:37] <zul> adam_g:  https://code.launchpad.net/~zulcss/neutron/rc3/+merge/191488
[19:45] <zul> adam_g:  thanks
[19:48] <Daviey> smoser: ipxe for qemu, no?
[19:48] <smoser> it was a build dep of xen
[19:48] <smoser> ipxen-qemu was
[19:48] <Daviey> ah
[19:48] <smoser> but that surely doesn' tman it needs to be on the cd
[19:49] <Daviey> no, it could most likely be unseeded
[19:49] <Daviey> smoser: Are we respinning?
[19:49] <Daviey> roaksoax / jamespage: Did the maas upload get in?
[19:50] <smoser> Daviey, maas upload in. yes to respinning to fit on media.
[19:52] <smoser> utlemming, i uploaded cloud-init and walinux for you to precise.
[19:52] <Daviey> smoser: Silly question... but when did it become oversized?
[19:52] <Daviey> zul: neutron accepted into proposed
[19:52] <roaksoax> Daviey: it fid thabkd.
[19:52] <roaksoax> it did*
[19:52] <roaksoax> fid you spprove it?
[19:53] <smoser> i dont know.
 Nobody from the server team is on the server image failure notification list, otherwise you'd have been being mailed about this for some time
[19:53] <smoser> Daviey, ^ "for some time"
[19:55] <Daviey> smoser: Ah, i guess i was removed.
[19:57] <Daviey> smoser: probably worth checking with QA that it should be the most basic of tests. :)
[19:58] <smoser> yeah
[20:00] <Daviey> zul: couldn't rc4 tracker have been the same bug number for all packages? :)
[20:07] <zul> Daviey:  we only had one rc4
[20:08] <zul> Daviey:  but the other rc3 could have probably had one bug number as well
[20:21] <jamespage> smoser, do we need todo anything about size of the iso?
[20:21] <jamespage> I can review the seed list now if need be
[20:21] <smoser> jamespage, fixed.
[20:21] <smoser> droped 48M of ipxe
[20:23] <jamespage> smoser, good-oh
[20:23] <jamespage> we have a smaller subset for kvm/qemu from memory
[20:23] <smoser> well, yeah. ipxe-qemu
[20:23] <smoser> but we didn't add that to the cd.
[20:24] <smoser> i'm not really clear on why we necessarily want any package on the cd
[20:24] <jamespage> smoser, I see lots of stuff that we could drop
[20:24] <jamespage> I don't see iso as much more than something to hang our hat on for release and for small, single server installs anyway
[20:24] <jamespage> drop/move from iso to supported seed
[20:24] <smoser> jamespage, is there some well defined "you put stuff on the cd because..."
[20:25] <smoser> thats my feeling to.
[20:25] <jamespage> smoser, for example all of the cluster stack is on the iso
[20:25]  * jamespage does not understand why
[20:26] <jamespage> smoser, I think there may have been confusion about supported == on the iso
[20:26] <jamespage> which is not the case
[20:26] <smoser> right.
[20:26] <jamespage> munin is on the iso as well
[20:26] <smoser> and coupled with "look at all the space the server iso has empty!"
[20:27] <smoser> which, over time, turned into -30M
[20:27] <jamespage> agreed
[20:27] <jamespage> I think it should really be stuff you can install from the menus
[20:27] <jamespage> tasksel + the boot menu for maas etc..
[20:33] <phillw> excellent. Just as I got told why the ISO's on http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/305/builds had been disabled with no bug reported :)
[20:53] <harushimo> openstack question
[20:53] <harushimo> its more use on the IAAS side right?
[21:21] <Daviey> smoser / zul / jamespage: Does this make sense to you? https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-neutron/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/48/consoleFull
[21:21] <Daviey> (i386 was successful)
[21:22] <jamespage> Daviey, I was just looking at that
[21:23] <jamespage> Daviey, i suspect something racey - I've re-run the test - its executing now
[21:25] <jamespage> Daviey, yeah - the lbaas agent starts but then exist due to missing base configuration
[21:26] <Daviey> jamespage: it certainly doesn't sound right...
[21:26] <jamespage> I guess the check sometimes runs quick enough to catch it OK
[21:26] <jamespage> but not in this case
[21:27] <jamespage> Daviey: that test passed this time round - I'll raise a bug and we can address early next release
[21:30] <jamespage> Daviey: bug 1240712
[21:30] <Daviey> jamespage: thanks
[21:30] <savid> What program controls messages such as "The program foobar is not currently installed. You can install it by typing: apt-get install foobar."? I'm getting an erroneous error message from this when running a command that exists.
[21:35] <savid> There's something ubuntu does to bash that does this. I'm not sure where to find it.
[21:46] <shauno> savid: /usr/lib/command-not-found, from the package 'command-not-found'  (and the hook should be planted in /etc/bash.bashrc)
[21:47] <savid> shauno, awesome, thanks
[21:51] <zul> jamespage:  ill get rc3 horizon tonight as well
[22:11] <Daviey> zul: Did you see horizon rc3 posted? The only change is, https://github.com/openstack/horizon/commit/d3e8e29f1e252e7bffc836056b52c8e4e5a0307c
[22:12] <phillw> 13.10 iso images for server have now been re-built and should be CD sized. http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/305/builds
[22:24] <zul> Daviey:  yeah i saw it


[00:37] <zequence> len-dt: We might as well get email adresses for everyone at this point, since perhaps only one or two would have any doubts about it
[01:34] <len-dt> zequence, I have nothing against it, just that I am not a PR kind of person and so don't "need" it.
[21:51] <holstein> zequence: you think A3 adding midi will kill off any of the other midi sequencers?
[21:51] <holstein> i dont think anyone will stop doing what they are doing. personally
[21:53] <zequence> holstein: I'm sure some people will start using Ardour3 for both audio and midi, but the way it's now, I don't think everyone will find it full featured and stable enough for their needs
[21:54] <zequence> Probably depends on how much one uses midi
[21:54] <holstein> i mean, the little projects.. you think they will just give up?
[21:54] <zequence> like muse? Don't think so
[21:54] <len-dt> What little bit of midi I have done holstein, I have preferred to have separate from audio though sync-able. But then I am not really a "synth" person... or maybe I am, perhaps I should say I am not a KB replaces things person.
[21:55] <holstein> len-dt: im not a synth guy either... i usually route it in ardour like an audio channel and track it live
[21:56] <zequence> I do some midi sometimes. I actually don't find any of the sequencers adequate
[21:56] <zequence> As soon as you start doing anything else than straight forward 4/4, you start hitting problems
[21:56] <len-dt> That is, I enjoy synth as a lead synth sounding instrument.... Played by a KB player in real time :)
[21:56] <zequence> The worst one was notes not being played
[21:57] <zequence> It's funny that all of the sequncers were somewhat similar in the bugginess.  Didn't play them
[21:57] <zequence> And I was doing tempo changes, etc
[21:58] <zequence> Needed click for recording audio too
[21:58] <len-dt> zequence, that is beyond me... or maybe just feels laborious because I don't even read music well let alone write it.
[21:59] <zequence> The point is, none of the applications did what they were supposed to do
[21:59] <zequence> The were supposed to play back all of the notes, not just most of them
[22:00] <len-dt> Yup. I agree with that, and I would find it more frustrating because I find it hard already.
[22:01] <zequence> jack midi is a lot more solid, but I'm not sure the midi implementation in Ardour, at least editing it, is either efficient or solid. I would expect playback to be though
[22:05] <len-dt> The last sequencer I really used was a shareware thing on my Atari years ago. It was really solid time wise and easy to use, though it probably lacked a lot things considered normal now. None of the windows stuff at the time (pre 90s) was stable enough time wise to make music IMO


[01:31] <jjesse> nothing goes better w/ working on kubuntu-docs then a good glass of wine
[01:49] <nixternal> hehe
[01:50] <nixternal> wine has never been my cup of tea
[01:50] <jjesse> but it is sooo good
[01:50] <jjesse> when you get a good cup
[01:50] <jjesse> or good bottle
[01:50] <nixternal> I will stick to water, tea, and Dr. Pepper :)
[01:50] <nixternal> heh, starts out as a glass and ends with the bottle
[01:51] <nixternal> are you working on the docs, or the book?
[01:51] <jjesse> book right now
[01:51] <jjesse> trying to get that done so i can hammer docs
[01:51] <nixternal> I need to do some doc work myself, but the Grammy's are coming on
[01:52] <nixternal> did you get my note yesterday about it being KMenu ?
[01:52] <jjesse> yeah i did
[01:52] <nixternal> good
[01:52] <nixternal> that was the main thing I was going to document for changes we had previously talked about
[01:52] <nixternal> I should have the wireless stuff done this week for you
[01:52] <jjesse> yeah i've been working on changing it
[01:52] <jjesse> can you aim for wednesday if possible/
[01:52] <nixternal> darn, I need to do the MIR for Edubuntu docs yet
[01:53] <jjesse> i would like to try to get it to db by friday?
[01:53] <nixternal> Wednesday, I can try
[01:54] <nixternal> would you like a couple screen shots with the wireless section? KNetworkManager that is, or are you getting those shots for a general network section?
[01:54] <jjesse> no that would be perfect, i'll renumber if i need to
[01:54] <nixternal> are you using Polyester with your screenshots now that we know that will be the new style
[01:55] <nixternal> brb, I need to eat some beans :)
[05:11] <j1mc> hello, i'm looking to install a gui frontend to subversion, and wondered what some of you might recommend.  i'm running this on my P3-900mhz laptop w/ 256mb of ram.
[05:11] <j1mc> i'm looking to use subversion to assist w/ working on the doc files.
[05:11] <Burgundavia> hmm, gui frontend
[05:12] <Burgundavia> gcvs might be able to do svn
[05:12] <Laser_away> esvn is one I know of
[05:12] <Laser_away> but on a P3 I'd probably just learn how to do it from the command line
[05:13] <Laser_away> I've never been very impressed with GUI revision control tools
[05:13] <j1mc> do you all just use the command line?
[05:13] <Laser_away> I think so
[05:13] <Laser_away> we have very few commands
[05:14] <Laser_away> it's not very difficult to learn
[05:14] <j1mc> ok . . .
[05:14] <j1mc> i'm just checking through the doc repository info here:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Repository
[05:16] <j1mc> would i be able to get the Xubuntu-doc files from the same repository location?
[05:16] <Laser_away> yep
[05:16] <Laser_away> we have 1 repo
[05:17] <j1mc> thanks, Laser_away
[05:17] <Laser_away> np
[06:02] <cpk1> hello
[06:03] <Laser_away> hi
[06:03] <cpk1> just noticed that https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/kubuntu/desktopguide/C/hardware.html appears to have an error; I am pretty sure that 'sudo nvidia-glx-config enable' in the "3D Graphics Cards" section should actually be sudo nvidia-xconfig
[06:03] <cpk1> If you are running an earlier version, type the follow
[06:04] <cpk1> oops sorry for that second line dunno how that got there
[06:04] <Laser_away> hmm, it *used* to be that line
[06:05] <cpk1> and at help.ubuntu.com/community they use the correct line which is sudo nvidia-xconfig but just now I got someone who was only reading the kubuntu docs and so was getting an error
[06:08] <cpk1> so yeah, dunno if you need people to verify to change and stuff, just letting you guys know especially since help.ubuntu.com/community has different instructions
[06:09] <LaserJock> cpk1: actually, the best thing to do for the shipped docs is to file a bug
[06:15] <cpk1> LaserJock: my first bug report we'll see how it goes =P
[06:18] <LaserJock> do you know what to file it against?
[06:26] <Ubugtu> New bug: #84666 in ubuntu-doc "https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/kubuntu/desktopguide/C/hardware.html has incorrect instructions for nvidia configuration." [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84666
[06:30] <LaserJock> cpk1: do you see that bug in the Ubuntu desktop guide to?
[06:30] <LaserJock> I imagine so
[06:45] <cpk1> LaserJock: hmm?
[06:46] <cpk1> LaserJock: damn looks like you are right
[06:48] <LaserJock> cpk1: well, I can't even find any nvidia/ati info in the Feisty docs
[06:48] <cpk1> i edited my original
[06:49] <cpk1> i havent even tried installing nvidia on my fiesty install yet
[06:49] <cpk1> guess I can check that out later
[06:51] <LaserJock> well, I'm guessing the bug won't be fixed in Edgy
[06:51] <cpk1> the online documentation should be fixed at least?
[06:52] <LaserJock> it is the same as the shipped docs
[06:52] <cpk1> oh
[07:12] <popey> er: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/Flash states "Note the package flashplugin-nonfree does not work if you are behind a proxy server:". That's not true. What does that actually mean?
[07:13] <popey> also no entry for Edgy
[08:45] <poningru> :(
[09:51] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: philbull * r3794 ubuntu/programming/C/programming.xml: Large reworking of programming.xml
[11:24] <bhuvan> mdke: ping
[11:24] <mdke> bhuvan: (In case I'm not around at the moment, please provide a bit of information about what you want and I will respond when I get back)
[11:25] <jsgotangco> ohh nice script
[12:24] <popey> hehe
[12:35] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: bhuvan * r3795 ubuntu/misc/ (3 files):
[12:35] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: * ubuntu/misc/partitionsandbooting.xml
[12:35] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: * ubuntu/misc/config-desktop.xml
[12:35] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: * ubuntu/misc/basic-concepts.xml
[12:35] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation:  Fix the path for entities.
[12:40] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: bhuvan * r3796 ubuntu/keeping-safe/C/keeping-safe.xml:
[12:40] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: * ubuntu/keeping-safe/C/keeping-safe.xml
[12:40] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation:  Minor fix for validating the document.
[02:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #51057 in kubuntu-docs "Link to RealPlayer 10 .deb is broken" [High,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/51057
[03:03] <jenda> mdke: you around?
[03:04] <jenda> mdke: is there a reason why the search box on ubuntu.com sometimes says 'buscar', sometimes 'suchen' and probably other variations?
[03:04] <jenda> (is that spanish and german for search BTW?)
[03:04] <jenda> If the idea is to cycle through the languages, hoping someone will notice how international we are... I like it :)
[08:03] <nixternal> are there log files to tell me why the Kubuntu docs aren't building on d.u.c?
[08:04] <nixternal> I can build them locally w/o any issues, but they will not build on the server
[08:06] <mdke> jenda: a known bug
[08:06] <mdke> nixternal: not sure
[08:06] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: nixternal * r3797 kubuntu/Makefile: cleaning up nasty spaces in hope this will fix the building issue with Kubuntu docs on the server
[08:06] <nixternal> well, maybe that could be a problem. There were some bogus tabs/spaces in the Makefile
[08:07] <nixternal> and I think in the past we experienced and issue with that
[08:07] <mdke> if it works locally, it should work on the server though
[08:07] <nixternal> I would think so
[08:07] <nixternal> all of the Makefiles work, I just built them all out, and none of them crashed
[08:08] <mdke> doesn't seem to have worked since 27 Jan
[08:08] <mdke> trying a build now
[08:10] <mdke> nixternal: is "make all" what you are trying? It's giving an error
[08:10] <mdke> on the index target
[08:11] <mdke> http://pastebin.ca/352317
[08:12] <nixternal> ahhh
[08:13] <nixternal> thanks for that, it builds here, so that is odd. but now I know how to fix it :)
[08:14] <mdke> cool
[08:19] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: nixternal * r3798 kubuntu/Makefile: this should fix it
[08:19] <nixternal> OK, that should work
[08:20] <mdke> I'll try a build
[08:20] <nixternal> thank you sir
[08:21] <nixternal> I should strip the index part out and create index: seperately anyways
[08:22] <mdke> nixternal: works.
[08:22] <mdke> btw, newtokubuntu/C/about-kubuntu/kubuntu-committment.html
[08:22] <nixternal> woohoo!
[08:22] <mdke> one t in commitment
[08:22] <nixternal> heh, thanks for catching that :0
[08:22] <mdke> ;)
[08:22] <mdke> cya later
[08:22] <nixternal> later
[08:24] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: nixternal * r3799 kubuntu/newtokubuntu/C/about-kubuntu/about-kubuntu.xml: 1 T in Commitment :)
[08:24] <nixternal> ;p
[09:02] <crimsun> (I'm actually in another meeting atm, so I won't be able to make the screencast one)
[09:02] <popey> ok
[09:03] <willvdl> what time is it again?
[09:08] <CIA-4> Ubuntu Documentation: nixternal * r3800 kubuntu/ (6 files in 2 dirs): makefile cleaning and index seperation, created tmplibs for the index.xml to build conforming to other pages
[11:39] <poningru> in the svn where can I find the server guide?
[11:39] <LaserJock> under generic/ I think
[11:40] <poningru> ah thanks


[03:04] <jdub> given that upstart doesn't natively support kicking off a process as a particular uid/gid, is it still sane/recommended to use start-stop-daemon?
[03:05] <jdub> at least if you have that particular requirement
[03:08] <ion> sadmac: I don’t remember.
[03:08] <ion> jdub: How about su?
[03:08] <jdub> ion: i do *not* want to run su in my init script :-)
[15:44] <Keybuk> ya know what I also want
[15:44] <Keybuk> on the interactive "start this service y/n" boot thingy
[15:44] <Keybuk> the ability to start a shell, there and then, so you can see what state the machine is in right now
[15:44] <Keybuk> then, when you exit the shell, ask again whether to start the service
[16:38] <sadmac> Keybuk: did we kill logd because it SIGPIPEd all its clients when you killed it?
[16:45] <Keybuk> yes
[16:51] <sadmac> Keybuk: one liner fix
[16:51] <sadmac> Keybuk: man sendmsg. search for MSG_NOSIGNAL
[16:52] <Keybuk> yes, let's rewrite everything that writes to standard output to use sendmsg() instead of printf() and add that to it :p
[16:52] <sadmac> Keybuk: when I read it the first time it looked like it'd turn it off for subsequent calls.
[16:54] <sadmac> Keybuk: shit, yeah they mean for this call.
[16:55] <sadmac> I think...
[16:55] <sadmac> yeah, that's probably it
[22:53] <mbiebl> Keybuk: seen that: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.suse.opensuse.devel/26237


[02:13] <mup> PR operator#479 opened: Update Pebble container socket path <Created by benhoyt> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/479>
[03:00] <mup> PR operator#480 opened: Run tests on Python 3.9 <Created by benhoyt> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/480>
[15:04] <LukeMarsden[m]> Ken are you free now? or should we reschedule?
[15:10]  * LukeMarsden[m] sent a long message:  < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/wQRkwfhnbePaSJbblHHxZrjE/message.txt >


[08:05] <mterry> tsdgeos, I made a thing you'll like: https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity8/test-greeter-dbus-fixes/+merge/292677
[08:06] <tsdgeos> :)
[08:09] <tsdgeos> mterry: why the > 0? is this something that would get fixed in future branches?
[08:10] <mterry> tsdgeos, that's because there are two PropertiesChanged signals sent out -- for two separate properties.  And the previous code was racy if both came in before spy.wait() finished
[08:10] <mterry> tsdgeos, so I think >0 is fine as is, even in future
[08:10] <tsdgeos> mterry: if there's two of them, should be > 1 ?
[08:11] <mterry> tsdgeos, we only care about the first one -- we know the order they come in, and the test is only interested in the first
[08:11] <tsdgeos> ok
[08:11] <mterry> tsdgeos, good points though -- that check does *look* flaky  :)
[08:13] <tsdgeos> mterry: so shall i approve it or you'll have another look?
[08:13] <mterry> tsdgeos, no I was just saying they were good questions.  I'm +1 for code as is.  I think there are comments already in that function that explain what's going on
[08:13] <tsdgeos> ok :)
[09:27] <Mirv> I give silo 19 "Timo's seal of approval" on my frieza that Bq shipped to me on Friday
[09:28] <Saviq> +1
[10:02] <cimi> tsdgeos hey albert, any reason why we didnt add qml tests for the expandable filter? https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity8/expandable_filter/+merge/288957
[10:30] <tsdgeos> cimi: hmmm
[10:31] <tsdgeos> cimi: i guess i forgot :D
[10:31] <tsdgeos> cimi: can you comment asking for it in the MR?
[10:32] <cimi> tsdgeos I asked a need information
[10:32] <tsdgeos> oki
[10:44] <davmor2> Saviq: I wouldn't pay too much attention to that though we fail Mirv silos all the time ;)
[10:57] <Mirv> haha
[12:27] <tsdgeos> cimi: added the test
[13:34] <dandrader> tsdgeos, no apps scope when I run unity8-dash in my laptop. any idea why?
[13:34] <tsdgeos> dandrader: not installed?
[13:34] <tsdgeos> unity-scope-click
[13:35] <dandrader> tsdgeos, right. installing now. do you know which package brings this one in?
[13:35] <dandrader> tsdgeos, wow, unity8-dash loads it on the fly
[13:35] <tsdgeos> dandrader: ubuntu-touch is the dependency that brings it in
[14:33] <ChrisTownsend> Hey all!  If I pair a keyboard with say an N4 or Frieza, how does it figure out what keyboard is being used.  I know if you explicitly set the hardware keyboard in System Settings->Language & Text->External Keyboad->Layouts and other sources", then it is saved in org.freedesktop.Accounts.User$UID.InputSources property.  But if I just pair it and not set it in there, that property is blank.
[14:36] <ChrisTownsend> Does U8 assume it's a US(?) keyboard and the user has to go in there to set it to their particular keyboard layout?  Or is there some sort of probing to figure out the keyboard layout when pairing?
[14:44] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: Any ideas? ^^^^
[14:52] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, no probing possible
[14:52] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, we'll default to the default one for the language
[14:52] <Saviq> or have it in OOBE for desktops
[14:53] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: Ok.  Background is that I need to set the same keyboard for X apps, so the best approach would be if InputSources is blank, then use the language that is set.  But if InputSources is set, then use the first one that is set.
[14:54] <Saviq> ltinkl, comment ↑?
[14:54] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: In The Future, I will plan on dynamic keyboard selection for X apps, but this will have to due for now.
[14:55] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, define dynamic? you mean applied on the fly?
[14:56] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: Yes, on the fly.  Like if someone changes the keyboard layout in System Settings, that can also be applied to any running X apps.  But that is much more complicated, so that will be done the line.
[14:56] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: So I would need some sort of something to catch the change property signal and see if it changed...or somethin'.
[14:56] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: But right now, X apps are US keyboard only and that is bad.
[14:57] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: So if I can at least set the current layout when an X app launches, that will satisfy most use cases.
[15:04]  * ltinkl reads the backlog
[15:07] <ltinkl> ChrisTownsend, so what's known is the user's preferred keymap but you can't currently ask U8 which is the current one
[15:07] <ltinkl> ChrisTownsend, so that's something I could expose to you to fix this
[15:09] <ltinkl> if the user hasn't configured any keymaps, I don't think we should get too smart and try to guess from the language (which is also technically wrong, some keymaps don't match the language code)
[15:09] <ChrisTownsend> ltinkl: Well, that would certainly be a good thing.  It looks like System Settings queries org.freedesktop.Accounts.User$UID.InputSources property for the selected maps.
[15:09] <ltinkl> ChrisTownsend, yes, we do the same in u8 (that's our common "storage")
[15:10] <ltinkl> ChrisTownsend, but the current keymap is only known to u8 atm
[15:10] <ChrisTownsend> ltinkl: Ok, then it's easy enough for me to query that too.  But my question is, if I just pair a keyboard, that property is blank, so how is the keymap determined in that case.
[15:11] <ChrisTownsend> ltinkl: Oh, ok, if U8 only knows, then having some way to query U8 would probably be best.
[15:11] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, ltinkl, I think when changing language, we should set the default keymap, too (at least if it's empty?)
[15:11] <ChrisTownsend> ltinkl: Would it be some Dbus interface you would expose?
[15:12] <Saviq> please no
[15:12] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, can't you access accountsservice?
[15:14] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: Via DBus?
[15:14] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: I guess I'm asking if it provides a dbus service.
[15:15] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, AS does
[15:15] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, org.freedesktop.Accounts
[15:15] <Saviq> it's a property there
[15:15] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: Yes, actually I do that in the code I'm developing now.  It's the InputSources property, right?
[15:16] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, yes, that's the "official" API
[15:17] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: Ok, sure.  Well, my question goes back to this: InputSources is blank when pairing a keyboard, so how is the keyboard layout chosen in that case?
[15:17] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, today we assume US
[15:18] <Saviq> so you should do the same IMO
[15:18] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: lol, ok.  Then it's the responsibility of the user to set it correctly after pairing.
[15:18] <Saviq> ltinkl, would you say that we should fill InputSources when changing language or should we default to the default language keyboard based on the current language?
[15:19] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: Sure, I can assume that too.  Well, currently, I always assume that:)
[15:19] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, not necessarily ↑
[15:19] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, but doing that you'd be on par with unity8 ;)
[15:24] <ltinkl> Saviq, not sure... we could certainly do this in the Wizard, to set the default HW keymaps (as we do wirth OSK)
[15:25] <ltinkl> Saviq, still I need to expose the current keymap somewhere, InputSources in AS/DBUS isn't what Chris needs
[15:26] <Saviq> ltinkl, oh you mean when we're switching it
[15:26] <ltinkl> Saviq, exactly
[15:26] <Saviq> ltinkl, can't he take it from the surface?
[15:27] <ltinkl> Saviq, ah right, but onky MirSurface (from qtmir) has it, the getter is missing in Mir itself :/
[15:28] <ltinkl> Saviq, the correct way imho would be for Mir to provide the getter (besides the setter it has), then anyone can read it
[15:29] <Saviq> ltinkl, think it's on purpose clients don't know?
[15:29] <ltinkl> Saviq, hmm in theory, Mir has a surface observer so you at least get a signal when the keymap gets changed, that might be a way too
[15:29] <ltinkl> ChrisTownsend, ^^
[15:31] <ChrisTownsend> ltinkl: Hmm, maybe Xmir would be the one that should handle keyboard mapping since it's the thing that interfaces with Mir.
[15:31] <Saviq> ChrisTownsend, totally
[15:32] <ltinkl> yeah, you could listen to the keymap_changed signal from Mir observer
[15:32] <ltinkl> and propagate it into the container
[15:33] <ChrisTownsend> ltinkl: Yeah, ok, I guess I need to talk to duflu(?) about how to implement something in Xmir to do something like that.
[15:33] <ltinkl> ChrisTownsend, yup
[15:33] <ChrisTownsend> ltinkl: Saviq: Thanks guys!
[15:33] <ltinkl> ChrisTownsend, duflu or anpok
[15:33] <anpok> hm?
[15:34] <anpok> keyboard mapping?
[15:34] <anpok> not keymapping?
[15:35] <Saviq> anpok, keyboard layout
[15:35] <ChrisTownsend> Right, layout
[15:35] <anpok> do you need to know which layout?
[15:36] <anpok> or is it enough to know that it changed? /me hasnt read the scrollback yet.
[15:36] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: Well ,however we accomplish it, we need to set the correct layout in the libertine container for X apps that matches the currnt layout in U8.
[15:36] <anpok> ah ok.. we could forward the keymap itself
[15:37] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: Ideally, we would want "xkb:de" set in X for the container if U8 is using "de".
[15:37] <Saviq> anpok, I just wonder if there's a reason not to tell the client?
[15:38] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: So one idea is that Xmir could get the layout from Mir and set it appropriately for that X session.  And could even possible listen for signal when it changes in U8 and change it for the running X instance.
[15:39] <anpok> there is none.. we just dont provide the xkb settings to the client.. just the keymap itself..
[15:50] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: Hmm, so it's not possible with the way Mir is currently implemented?
[15:52] <anpok> no. we just have to eihter also send the credentials used to assemble the keymap or forward the keymap that we received from the server..
[15:53] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: Ok, looks like that is a dead end.  Saviq, ltinkl^^^^
[15:53] <anpok> the latter xmir could already do .. the former ... needs a mir change
[15:56] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: After reading your last statement, so there is a way to do it via forwarding the keymap received from the server to Xmir?
[15:56] <anpok> yes
[15:57] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: So Xmir would just need to be modified to do that, right?
[15:57] <anpok> i assume so yes
[15:57] <ChrisTownsend> anpok: Ok, thanks
[16:15] <ChrisTownsend> Saviq: So just to confirm, I set the language to German and the keyboard layout stays US.  So currently, it seems that the user has to explicitly set the keyboard layout they want, which is kind of what I expected, but wanted to chack.


[21:00] <jono> jose, all set?
[21:02] <jose> jono: yep, joining
[21:13] <jose> mhall119: ping
[21:24] <mhall119> jose: pong
[21:24] <jose> mhall119: hey, are we still having the engineering update on Wednesday?
[21:26] <mhall119> jose: as far as I know, why?
[21:27] <mhall119> 1400 UTC
[21:27] <jose> I was just wondering
[21:27] <mhall119> ok
[22:42] <bkerensa> jono: the struggle https://twitter.com/AthIeteProdigy/status/458241413289762816/photo/1
[22:51] <jono> bkerensa, lol


[00:32] <guiverc> Bashing-om, two minor suggestions made, s/release// & s/QT/Qt/, read thru complete
[00:37] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Fixing :D
[00:54] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Done ^^ :D
[00:54] <guiverc> ack, fighting with iso.qa & bug blahblah.. will finish reporting first
[00:57] <Bashing-om> guiverc: No hury - see the edited Uco summary, that you accept.
[01:28] <guiverc> thanks Bashing-om :)
[01:41] <Bashing-om> guiverc: We do good work - "It's a wrap" .
[01:41] <guiverc> :)
[19:10] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::OMG!Ubuntu:: Linux Kernel 5.9 Released, Here’s What’s New @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2020/10/linux-5-9-kernel-featureske (by Joey Sneddon)
[19:16] <Bashing-om> UWN: Pulling "WIP"; Checked logs, no further edits are known - time to push 20:00 UTC :D
[20:00] <Bashing-om> UWN: ubuntu-news@lists is away - doing the Forum post next :D
[20:09] <Bashing-om> UWN: Forum post done - no issues. Doing the re-directs next. :D
[20:19] <Bashing-om> UWN: Re-directs completed - Pending is release to the Social Medias :D
[21:29] <guiverc> Bashing-om, clear to push #652 to fridge?
[21:31] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Yup - no issues known - push when you are awake and willing :P
[21:33] <guiverc> http://fridge.ubuntu.com/2020/10/12/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-652/    (I had issue with one line for some reason)
[21:34] <Bashing-om> checking ^ .
[21:36] <Bashing-om> Gridge: Spot check - checks good :)
[21:37] <Bashing-om> Away for a bit - @20 minutes .
[21:51] <guiverc> I can't tweet, for some reason an issue exists between me & site
[21:59] <guiverc> tweeted now (accessed via tor)
[22:04] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Back :D faceBook ?
[22:05] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: The Fridge: Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter Issue 652 @ http://fridge.ubuntu.com/2020/10/12/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-652/
[22:05] <guiverc> waiting for 2fa to arrive on my phone to complete login... (it won't accept the one that's there; 6-oct-2020's)
[22:08] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Yukkie poo - Blame it on that 10% that make it so tough on the rest of us :(
[23:11] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Still alive and able to kick ?
[23:11] <guiverc> me yeah, phone isn't get text messages; occurs every few weeks..
[23:13] <guiverc> phone is working though, just got a text message reminding me to pay credit card bill
[23:13] <Bashing-om> guiverc: A 1st world problem ? ( reasserts my aversion to these new fangled gadgets )
[23:15] <Wild_Man> guiverc, did you get facebook published too?
[23:15] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Wifey got a new Andriod phone - "Honey fix it !" - I run out the back door, quickly :P
[23:15] <guiverc> nope, if you can please do fb Wild_Man :)
[23:16] <Wild_Man> guiverc, I think I can but can you send send me what needs to be posted I can not get the script to work
[23:16] <guiverc> running out the back door is a safer move than my instant reaction of wanting to flush the thing down the toilet...
[23:16] <guiverc> Issue 652 of the Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter is here! Covering the week of October 4 - 10, 2020 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue652
[23:16] <Bashing-om> Wild_Man: Did you ever update your uwn bash scripts for python3 ?
[23:17] <Wild_Man> I only had a little time late last night to try again but the script still failed to
[23:17] <Wild_Man> Bashing-om, not sure
[23:17] <guiverc> Wild_Man, ^
[23:17] <Wild_Man> guiverc, thanks
[23:19] <Bashing-om> Wild_Man: As in " #!/usr/bin/env python3 ".
[23:21] <Wild_Man> It's published to facebook
[23:21] <guiverc> thanks Wild_Man :)
[23:21] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Wild_Man: Great - 652 all done ? Clear now to wipe Gdoc ?
[23:21] <Wild_Man> Bashing-om, no, I will do it in a little while my wife wants me to cook a meal tonight instead of just microwave
[23:21] <guiverc> yep
[23:23] <Bashing-om> Wild_Man: Ack - will need to go through all your bash scrips and change to use "python3".
[23:23] <Wild_Man> guiverc, you're welcome, I am sorry I have not been around to publish more I am just very busy and I have to get this laptop working properly it is a lame duck at the moment
[23:23] <Wild_Man> All?
[23:23] <Wild_Man> For the newsletter?
[23:24] <Wild_Man> I have some not working with tampermonkey too
[23:24] <guiverc> I believe so, I do fridge, then twitter.. fb was what I hadn't done
[23:24] <Bashing-om> 20.04 - uses python3 - old pythons take jumping through hoops to use.
[23:24] <Wild_Man> biab
[23:25] <Wild_Man> My wife is hungry
[23:39] <Bashing-om> Gdoc: set to do  653 :D


[08:37] <TheMuso> Is it known that multi-touch is broken for MacBook Pro 4,1 and up? I don't know if others are working, but mine isn't.
[08:38] <TheMuso> To be more precise, I can do 2-finger scrolling, but I can't put two fingers on the pad, click the button and perform a right click.
[08:43] <TheMuso> It also appears that the evdev and synaptics input drivers are loaded. Not sure what happens in Intrepid, would need to reboot to check.
[08:48] <mnemo> anyone else seeing this on jaunty? --> http://files.minimum.se/bug_attachments/xorg_intel/opengl_surface_leaves_dirt_trail_when_moved/opengl_surface_leaves_dirt_when_moved.png
[08:48] <mnemo> i've had that problem on my machine since 2.6.28 kernel landed (at which time a bunch of intel packages where updated as well)
[08:49] <mnemo> hardware is intel g45
[08:54] <tjaalton> mnemo: nope, works fine on my i965
[08:54] <tjaalton> TheMuso: sorry, don't have a touchpad..
[08:58] <TheMuso> tjaalton: Ok appart from the X logs, is there anthing else I can check?
[09:02] <tjaalton> TheMuso: check if some of the recent patches for the driver broke something
[09:03] <TheMuso> tjaalton: Kernel level, or X/Userspace level?
[09:03] <TheMuso> never mind, I'll try with an intrepid kernel and see what happens.
[10:37] <ziroday`> Hi, I have an odd bug where my left click sometimes acts as a middle click. Would that be a X bug?
[10:43] <tseliot> mvo: just FYI Update Manager should migrate users who have nvidia-glx-177 installed to whatever nvidia-common recommends (since 177 is no longer in jaunty)
[10:50] <mvo> tseliot: thanks, I will do that (or just we just run the nvidia detector again and install whatever package is recommended for the given hardware by it)?
[10:51] <tseliot> mvo: nvidia-detector was triggered only if a driver with the old name scheme was detected
[10:51] <tseliot> I could make it catch 177 too (for upgrades from the command line)
[11:03] <mvo> tseliot: it sounds like it should go there, yes. if it does update-manager should pick the right driver for -177 automatically
[11:04] <mvo> tseliot: it build-depends on nvidia-common so a rebuild of u-m should be enough :)
[11:04] <tseliot> mvo: ok, great, I'll let you know when it's ready
[11:05] <mvo> tseliot: it looks like its enough to add the name to old_drivers, right?
[11:06] <tseliot> I can't remember :-P
[11:06] <tseliot> but yes, that should be the way it's donw
[11:06] <tseliot> done
[11:07] <tseliot> mvo: aah, yes, it's sufficient to add it to the "oldPackages" list
[11:07] <mvo> :)
[11:08] <mvo> thanks
[11:08] <mvo> nice
[11:08] <mvo> the code is still active in u-m so we should be fine
[11:08] <tjaalton> shouldn't -180 just replace -177?
[11:08]  * mvo needs to reboot
[11:14] <tjaalton> hmm
[11:14] <tjaalton> tseliot: did you see my comment?
[11:15] <tseliot> tjaalton: yes, in part. 173 should replace 177 too
[11:15] <tseliot> some cards will use 173 others will use 180
[11:15] <tjaalton> tseliot: did 180 drop support for some cards?
[11:16] <tseliot> tjaalton: geforce 5
[11:17] <tseliot> http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=122606
[11:17] <tjaalton> I thought 173 was the last releae that supported it
[11:18] <tjaalton> can' read links now
[11:18] <tjaalton> +t
[11:18] <tseliot> yes, you're right
[11:19] <tseliot> I guess 177 was just a transitional driver
[11:19] <tjaalton> well it was the stable one, now replaced by 180
[11:20] <bryce_> can 177 be dropped then?
[11:20] <tseliot> bryce_: pitti removed it from jaunty
[11:20] <bryce_> ok
[11:30] <tseliot> mvo: I have just pushed my changes but I haven't had the time to test them: https://code.launchpad.net/~albertomilone/nvidia-common/main
[11:30] <tseliot> the diff is very small
[15:42] <tseliot> tjaalton, jcristau: do you know what's the username of Peter Hutterer on IRC?
[15:42] <tjaalton> tseliot: whot
[15:43] <tseliot> tjaalton: thanks
[15:43] <tjaalton> but he's in a funny timezone, so it's early morning down there
[15:43] <tjaalton> too early
[15:46] <tseliot> oh
[15:48] <tjaalton> something like GMT+10
[15:49] <tseliot> Australia?
[15:50] <jcristau> yeah
[20:20] <federico1> tseliot: the tablet stuff - http://mail.gnome.org/archives/distributor-list/2009-February/msg00000.html
[20:22] <tseliot> federico1: ah, ok so it just allows users to decide whether screen rotations affect tablets too
[20:22] <federico1> tseliot: yeah - it's an evil hack, but works for now
[20:24] <tseliot> federico1: I'm working on a daemon (in C) which should make tablets hotplugging just work (Alexia_Death did it in Python)
[20:25] <tseliot> and I thought that you were referring to something like that


[12:22] <ubuntu_>  /nick Daskreech
[12:31] <manchicken> !seen tonio_
[12:31] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen tonio_ - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[12:33] <manchicken> seen tonio_
[12:33] <manchicken> @seen tonio_
[12:33] <manchicken> Damned bot!  Anticipate the meaning of my request~!
[12:33] <Hobbsee> blerg
[12:33] <Hobbsee> manchicken: /msg seenserv seen tonio_
[12:33] <manchicken> Aww, weak.
[12:36] <manchicken> I wonder if he's having connection trouble.
[12:36] <manchicken> Well, it's late in the EU, isn't it?
[12:37] <mhb> yes it is
[12:37] <mhb> 00:37 is not *that* late, but it is
[12:37] <manchicken> You'd think by now that I'd have this timezone thing figured out.
[01:36] <ryanakca> hmmm... How do I know if this KMail bug is KDE4 or 3.5.6, or even just my messed up system
[01:37] <ScottK> ryanakca: If it involves IMAP It's a safe bet it's kmail's fault.
[01:38] <ScottK> Not tha I'm bitter or anything....
[01:38] <ScottK> tha/that
[01:38] <ryanakca> I click on a message in KMail, and it erases the message... well, the message is still in the list, just that it says "Subject: No Subject, Sender: Unknown, Date: unknown"
[01:38] <ryanakca> nah, POP
[01:38] <ScottK> ryanakca: Sounds like index corruption.
[01:38] <ryanakca> hmm....
[01:39] <ScottK> IIRC you look in ~/.kde/share/apps/kmail and delete the indexes and let kmail regenerate them.
[01:39] <ryanakca> how do I fix it?
[01:39] <ryanakca> kk
[01:39] <ryanakca> thanks
[01:39] <ScottK> ryanakca: I don't recall the exact procedure, Google probably has details.
[01:42] <ryanakca> hmmm... KDE keeps krashing
[01:44] <ryanakca> I installed KDE4 as per the directions on kubuntu.org, but it seems to have mingled with my stable KDE
[02:01] <jjesse> why does hotel wireless always suck
[02:03] <Tm_T> jjesse: I have only gprs connection at home, wanna switch?
[02:03] <ScottK> Because by the time you know it sucks they already have your money.
[02:03] <jjesse> Tm_T: i'll pass
[02:03] <Tm_T> hah, I knew it
[02:03] <jjesse> ScottK: agreed
[02:04] <Tm_T> its fun to type line thru ssh and wait minute or two to it appear
[02:04] <jjesse> seriously whether its a marriott hotel, hilton hotle or others, they are always slower then my dsl connection at home
[02:06] <Tm_T> =)
[02:06] <Tm_T> I would love to get one of those free net connections now
[02:06] <jjesse> i've done that before, the hotel i was at was charge 9.95/night and there was a neighbor hotel that was free
[02:09] <Tm_T> actually there's one open wlan in neighbourhood but I fail to manage to connect with my usb stick
[02:09] <Tm_T> + weak signal
[02:09] <jjesse> that's a bummer
[02:10] <Tm_T> also I don't find it right to use one's wlan
[02:10] <Tm_T> without permission that is
[02:10] <jjesse> there was one hotel where the only place i could decent signel was in the bathroom, resting my laptop on the toliet seat
[02:10] <Tm_T> but oh, now if someone call to me, I lose connection =)
[02:11] <Tm_T> but then again, no one call me =)
[02:14] <Tm_T> bah, time to give up and take painkillers
[02:19] <Tm_T> one thing can make my body hurt like this and that is: sports
[02:26] <jjesse> a particular sport?
[02:27] <Tm_T> well, in this case it was han moo do
[02:27] <Tm_T> you know taekwondo?
[02:27] <jjesse> yes
[02:28] <Tm_T> well similar but "newer"
[02:28] <jjesse> interesting
[02:28] <Tm_T> and no, it wasn't my idea to use 4 hours breaking my body
[02:29] <jjesse> i just do crazy things like try and run half marathons
[02:29] <jjesse> nothing like running for 3 hours
[02:30] <Tm_T> haha, apparently I can still run 100 meters in 14 seconds
[02:30] <jjesse> wow congrats, were you running away from the police?
[02:30] <Tm_T> and I thought I'm in slow condition
[02:30] <jjesse> i do about 12 minute miles
[02:30] <jjesse> and my wife is faster then me
[02:30] <Tm_T> :)
[02:30] <jjesse> she does 11 minute miles
[02:39] <Tm_T> nice, 9 minute cutout
[02:39] <Tm_T> and you whine about crappy wlan
[02:40] <jjesse> wow
[02:40] <jjesse> sorry dude
[02:40] <Tm_T> ;--P
[02:40] <Tm_T> atleast I'm getting fullspeed gprs again
[02:40] <Tm_T> "wow, 5 kb/s !"
[02:41] <jjesse> oooo a mcdonalds in chicago served a happy meal with pot, a pipe, and a lighter
[02:41] <jjesse> that is awesome
[02:41] <Tm_T> awesome? howcome?
[02:41] <jjesse> its funny, awesome was sarcastic
[02:41] <Tm_T> ah ok
[02:42] <Tm_T> wow, I can get ping lower than 1000 ms
[02:42] <jjesse> i feel sorry for you
[02:42] <Tm_T> haha
[02:43] <jjesse> is internet really expensive for you then?
[02:43] <jjesse> sorry i forget where you are from
[02:43] <Tm_T> you know, at times this is the only connection I get for months =)
[02:43] <Tm_T> from Finland, and I'm with gprs because of moving, no adsl yet here, but coming I hope
[02:44] <Tm_T> slowest adsl they offer me is 5/2 I think, so it might be slightly faster than this
[02:45] <Tm_T> no, that's not slowest, but cheapest apparently
[02:45] <jjesse> oh 5 meg down/2 meg up?
[02:46] <Tm_T> yes
[02:53] <Tm_T> you're yankee, right?
[02:53] <jjesse> i'm from the us
[02:53] <Tm_T> that's what I meant (:
[02:53] <jjesse> no problem i understood
[02:54] <Tm_T> heh, that reminds me, we have chewing cum brand Jenkki (yankee)
[02:55] <jjesse> thats funny
[02:55] <jjesse> if you are in finland, aren't you up aweful later?
[02:55] <Tm_T> yes
[02:56] <Tm_T> remember me mentioning sports'n'stuff? ;)
[02:56] <jjesse> yup is that why you are up late then?
[02:56] <Tm_T> yes
[02:59] <Tm_T> let's see how well sshfs works over ppp =)
[03:04] <jjesse> hello longpointystick
[03:04] <Tm_T> guess what, it works just fine
[03:05] <jjesse> awesome
[03:09] <Tm_T> let's see how long it takes to upload a screenshot (sshfs)
[03:09] <Tm_T> hi Jucato-san
[03:10] <jjesse> hello Jucato
[03:10] <Jucato> hello Tm_T-sensei :)
[03:10] <Jucato> hi jjesse :)
[03:11] <Jucato> lol
[03:12] <Jucato> jjesse (or nixternal): btw, will there be an online Kubuntu 7.04 documentation
[03:12] <Jucato> I mean, on help.ubuntu.com
[03:13] <Tm_T> gotta love kppp <3
[03:13] <jjesse> Jucato: i don't remeember exactly how that is working since the change to topic based help, but i know there should be
[03:13] <Jucato> ah
[03:14] <jjesse> i trying to remember how that discussion is going
[03:15] <Jucato> ok. no biggie. just curious :)
[03:16] <Jucato> the important thing is that there's an offline version available :)
[03:16] <jjesse> yeah
[03:25] <Tm_T> aww
[03:26] <jjesse> aw what now?
[03:26] <Tm_T> looks like sshfs doesn't handle very well 10 min cuts between reconnection
[03:27] <Tm_T> and haven't timed out even
[03:27] <Tm_T> or, it's more ssh issue
[03:28] <Tm_T> http://www.tm-travolta.net/shots/current-temp4.png <- rest of image is still in this end waiting
[03:29] <Tm_T> I wonder why I need to reboot my phone often today
[03:32] <Tm_T> I wonder why ssh fails to time out properly
[03:40] <Tm_T> aah, finally
[04:03] <jjesse> Tm_T: do you do a lot of work locally and then upload via ssh?
[05:38] <nixternal> Jucato: we need to transfer the Kubuntu docs over to kubuntu.org, as it seems h.u.c has no love for us
[05:39] <Jucato> nixternal: aw... :(
[05:39] <nixternal> go figure
[05:39] <Jucato> then we can probably just link to the kubuntu.org page in h.u.c.
[05:39] <nixternal> I have no control of h.u.c so I can't say
[05:39] <Jucato> that... is... :(
[05:40] <Jucato> Hobbsee!!!!
[05:41] <Hobbsee> hiya
[05:41] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
[09:54] <Tonio_> yop
[09:58] <Tonio_> fine Jucato ?
[09:59] <Jucato> barely... still having mild asthma attacks here and there :)
[09:59] <Jucato> btw, do you remember who was it who wondered if it were possible to change the KMilo OSD appearance?
[09:59] <Jucato> and of course, how are you? :)
[10:00] <Jucato> (lol my brain isn't in order apparently)
[10:00] <Tonio_> Jucato: can you print a pdf file via konqueror for example ?
[10:00] <Tonio_> crashes here
[10:00] <Tonio_> Jucato: I don't remember no...... but to what I know, that's not possible without touching the code
[10:01] <Jucato> yeah, someone from kde-apps seems to have made a patch to do just that
[10:01] <Tonio_> Jucato: and about the pdf printing ?
[10:01] <Jucato> oh I can't check Konqueror on Kubuntu right now. sorry
[10:02] <Tonio_> gs just seems to crash
[10:02] <Tonio_> Jucato: okay ;) np
[12:15] <mhb> good afternoon
[12:17] <Jucato> hi mhb
[12:17] <Jucato> mhb: were you the one who suggested changing the appearance of the KMilo OSD a few months ago?
[12:19] <mhb> Jucato: that's me
[12:19] <Jucato> mhb: might be interested in this: http://www.kde-apps.org/content/show.php/KMilo+-+Customizable+DefaultSkin?content=56287
[12:20] <Jucato> just saw it from my feeds
[12:20] <mhb> lovely
[12:21] <mhb> Jucato: I really love when people think the same things I do :o)
[12:21] <Jucato> hehehe :)
[12:22] <mhb> Jucato: have you tried it yet?
[12:22] <Jucato> nope. just saw it this afternoon
[12:26] <mhb> Jucato: do you plan to try it?
[12:26] <Jucato> hm... I can't. I haven't even seen KMilo's shadow in a long time... never got around to finding out why
[12:27] <mhb> okay, no problem
[01:49] <\sh> Riddell, I read something about providing something like gnomes update-notifier for kde/kubuntu...is it planned to integrate it into the update-notifier source?
[01:58] <\sh> moins kwwii
[01:59] <kwwii> howdy \sh
[01:59] <raxiv> hiya kwwii.
[02:02] <kwwii> hi raxiv
[02:27] <_StefanS_> kwiii
[02:28] <_StefanS_> \sh: the restricted drivers manager was going to be ported
[02:28] <_StefanS_> \sh: dont know about the update notifier
[02:29] <Jucato> hi _StefanS_!
[02:29] <_StefanS_> hey Jucatoowww
[02:29] <_StefanS_> Ju-cow
[02:29] <_StefanS_> :D
[02:29] <_StefanS_> anything happening?
[02:30] <Jucato> hm.. nothing much
[02:30] <Jucato> just distro-touring, sort of... :)
[02:30] <Jucato> and of course, still learning C++ lol
[02:32] <_StefanS_> how is the c++ coming?
[02:32] <_StefanS_> good progress?
[02:32] <Jucato> slow progress.
[02:32] <Jucato> procrastination++
[02:33] <Jucato> but still progressing. that's the good news :)
[02:34] <Jucato> unfortunately, my MOTU ambitions seems to be the one that's regressing...
[02:34] <_StefanS_> oh, so you're opting for being able to put packages in universe, or is it multiverse also ?
[02:35] <Jucato> the *verses :)
[02:35] <Jucato> actually I wanted to study packaging
[02:36] <mhb> Jucato: thanks for that link earlier
[02:36] <_StefanS_> uhm cool, I gotta be employed full time for canonical soon, so I can do some stuff that interests me ;)
[02:36] <mhb> you will be?
[02:37] <_StefanS_> no :)
[02:37] <Jucato> hehe :)
[02:37] <_StefanS_> just thinking that it would be cool to spend full time on kubuntu
[02:37] <Jucato> mhb: no problem. the moment I saw that announcement, I immediately thought of you heheh
[02:37] <Jucato> _StefanS_: you think? just ask Riddell :D
[02:37] <mhb> Jucato: I've compiled it and it's really nice
[02:37] <kwwii> :-)
[02:38] <Jucato> it must be uber nice to work on Kubuntu :)
[02:38] <Jucato> mhb: now you can poke kwwii to make a theme for KMilo :D
[02:38] <raxiv> kwwii: hows the progress on the site? : )
[02:38] <_StefanS_> Jucato: yes I imagine.. unfortunately the job(s) require international travel which I not very fond of.
[02:38] <mhb> Jucato: no reason to
[02:38] <Jucato> mhb: oh? ok :)
[02:38] <_StefanS_> Jucato: cant really leave the family behind for weeks, you know
[02:39] <kwwii> raxiv: well, we have decided to use something like my new design, and basically use similar pieces as seen in the ubuntu website to create the front page
[02:39] <Jucato> _StefanS_: ditto. I have a "job" here at church too...
[02:39] <mhb> Jucato: actually the "compact widget patch" seems to be enough
[02:39] <raxiv> yep, thats what You wrote in the e-mail I recieved kwwii ; )
[02:39] <kwwii> raxiv: I am busy working on the mobile edition atm, but if you want to start working on the site, feel free
[02:39] <raxiv> kwwii : redfish huh? ; )
[02:40] <Jucato> mhb: ah ok. I was thinking of maybe something that would fit in with the general Kubuntu theme. maybe it already fits in nicely
[02:40] <mhb> Jucato: do you have a meeting agenda point yet? :o))
[02:40] <Jucato> oh not yet lol
[02:40] <kwwii> raxiv: ;-)
[02:40] <mhb> Jucato: well you are getting close to having one
[02:41] <raxiv> kwwii: As I don't want to INTERRUPT, but HELP, i'll wait for You - if You need , i have a PDA to test the site if needed.
[02:41] <Jucato> lol you mean I should be the one to bring this kmilo patch up in the meeting? :)
[02:41] <mhb> Jucato: how did you know ? :O)
[02:41] <raxiv> kwwii: the mobile one of course.
[02:41] <Jucato> mhb: hehe I was hoping you'd be the one, since you have tested it :P
[02:42] <kwwii> raxiv: actually, I am working on the actual interface for it :-)
[02:42] <kwwii> making the Uphone, as it were
[02:42] <mhb> Jucato: the only reason why I don't want to do it is because I have so little free time
[02:42] <raxiv> kwwii: oh, if You need feedback, illbe more then glade to assist.
[02:43] <kwwii> cool
[02:43] <Jucato> ok. I'll try asking around who'll be free to do it. I don't have technical knowledge to bring it forward myself
[02:43] <mhb> Jucato: and I already have an agenda point, the only one that is on the Kubuntu/Meetings ...
[02:43] <raxiv> kwwii : I just finished doing my last project so I'm kinda idle atm : p
[02:44] <raxiv> kwwii: http://kyou.eu <- Though aint sugar, its worth a look.
[02:44] <Jucato> mhb: I don't have an agenda point, but more of a question/suggestion... but I'll probably ask about it informally first in here :)
[02:44] <_StefanS_> what kind of device is usable for the ubuntu mobile edition ?
[02:44] <_StefanS_> and can you buy them now ?
[02:45] <mhb> Jucato: one thing I wonder about is what is the performance loss with having kmilo configurable
[02:46] <Jucato> well, I think we already had a bit of performance loss with the activation animation thingy anyway :)
[02:46] <mhb> Jucato: the "compact" theme with some hardcoded tweaks could be sufficient, if the performance loss is too big
[02:47] <mhb> Jucato: it would be great if you found a person who can look into that and comment on that at the meeting
[02:48] <mhb> Jucato: pretty please :o)
[02:48] <Jucato> hehe I'll add it to the agenda. but I kinda feel uneasy about doing that because I don't really know much about it.
[02:53] <mhb> Jucato: you rock! :o)
[02:53] <Jucato> :)
[02:59] <kwwii> raxiv: cool
[02:59] <raxiv> kwwii: indeed.
[04:03] <freeflying> anyone use gutsy now? can confirm a problem for me? knm can not start up, due to some file lack in networkstatus
[04:23] <mhb> here comes another of my dim-witted questions
[04:24] <mhb> why does guidance-powermanager have a pop-up about the power cord being unplugged?
[04:24] <gnomefreak> cant be any worse than the one i just heard :(
[04:24] <gnomefreak> ok i take that back
[04:25] <mhb> gnomefreak: I knew you would :o)
[04:25] <gnomefreak> i heard how do you make an ntfs partition inside a ext3 partition and get grub to boot to it
[04:25] <gnomefreak> but he was troll
[04:26] <mhb> gnomefreak: that's a nice one, too :o) No, I don't intend to troll
[04:26] <gnomefreak> no i know
[04:26] <mhb> I completely understand that the user should be bothered when the bettery goes low
[04:26] <mhb> battery
[04:26] <gnomefreak> i meant the guy with question
[04:27] <mhb> but why should he be bothered (pop-up is one of the most violent ways to get attention) of an action he did himself?
[04:27] <mhb> he knows the battery is being used because the tray icon has changed
[04:28] <mhb> and he disconnects the power cord himself in 99%
[04:28] <mhb> of the cases
[04:29] <mhb> take for example knetworkmanager - when the network goes down he doesn't say anything - well the user either did it himself or he'll notice soon enough
[04:30] <mhb> (I believe he can notify you if you want, it's just not on by default)
[04:32] <mhb> sebas: ^^ can you tell me if there's any reason for bothering the user that much, please? Sorry if I'm so dumb that I can't figure it out myself :o)
[04:39] <sebas> mhb: The notification is not "You unplugged the cable", it's "You unplugged the cable therefore I'm switching to lower powerstate"
[04:40] <mhb> sebas: isn't that what the user expects you to do?
[04:40] <mhb> sebas: I mean - you just inform him, there's no way he can avoid that
[04:42] <mhb> sebas: it has little to do with the discussion, but from my personal experience I'm seeing this pop-up way too often ... that made me thinking how useful it is
[04:42] <sebas> Sure there is, open config dialogue, do things.
[04:43] <sebas> I think it's useful though =)
[04:43] <sebas> I've got to leave now, btw.
[04:43] <mhb> sebas: sorry
[04:44] <sebas> No problem ;-)
[04:44] <mhb> sebas: I wonder what other people think though
[04:44] <sebas> Maybe post it on the devel list, I'm not married to this kind of things, but I'm also not inclined to change it for only one person.
[04:45] <ScottK> mhb: Have you got a suggestion for a less intrusive approach?
[04:45] <mhb> sebas: me neither
[04:45] <sebas> I'm reading the list, maybe someone comes up with a nicer solution.
[04:45] <sebas> Maybe also the Qt4 dialogue will be less distracting
[04:45] <mhb> sebas: just wanted to bring it up
[04:45] <sebas> Sure, that's cool :)
[04:45] <sebas> powermanager should be ported to Qt4 shortly, then we can do it differently anyway
[04:45] <sebas> Running out now!
[04:45] <sebas> Love!
[04:45] <mhb> sebas: see you & thanks
[04:46] <mhb> ScottK: well I had doubts whether it is useful for common people or not
[04:47] <ScottK> Dunno.  I think see if it can be done smarter in qt4 is the right approach.
[04:47] <mhb> ScottK: perhaps, yes
[04:48] <mhb> ScottK: I'll ask about opinions on the ML
[04:53] <jjesse> morning
[05:10] <mhb> ScottK: mail sent, feel free to comment on it if you own a laptop
[05:10] <mhb> everyone else:^^
[05:11] <mhb> thanks folks, see you later
[05:28] <nixternal> jjesse: I will be at Union Station tomorrow at about 4:45/5:00
[05:29] <nixternal> boo
[05:30] <bddebian> Heya
[05:30] <bddebian> Hi nixternal :-)
[05:30] <nixternal> how is Philly this morning?
[05:31] <bddebian> Warm and humid :-(
[05:31] <nixternal> ya, we cooled down here today, yesterday was warm and humid...so prepare for the storms then
[05:31] <jjesse> nixternal: ok, i'll have to find that
[05:32] <nixternal> jjesse: walk out of 111 W. Adams, turn left, right across the river from the Sears Tower
[05:32] <jjesse> nixternal: cool
[05:32] <nixternal> oh shat, today's is mums b-day and I haven't gotten her a gift
[05:32] <jjesse> bummer
[05:32] <nixternal> I will have to go get one here in a bit
[05:33] <Jucato> nixternal: did you get her a gift on mother's day? :)
[05:33] <nixternal> yup
[05:34] <Jucato> tell her that's her advanced birthday gift too :)
[05:34] <Jucato> we usually have that "economy of gifts" over here hehehe :)
[05:35] <bddebian> nixternal: Yeah, we are supposed to get t-storms tonight I think
[05:35] <raxiv> i always buy flowers. Am I creative?
[05:35] <jjesse> nixternal: i'll just head that way after class tomorrow
[05:36] <bddebian> ScottK: :-(
[05:36] <jjesse> somone in class takes the train from union station so i'll just follow him
[05:37] <Jucato> some how, because of economy of gifts, I don't get gifts on christmas.. but usually 2 months before or after :D
[05:39] <nixternal> sounds good to me
[07:29] <Hobbsee> morning all!
[07:29] <bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
[08:02] <Riddell> \sh_away: update-notifier funtionality would be in adept-notifier (which does most of what update-notifier does already)
[08:02] <Hobbsee> hiya Riddell
[08:17] <Riddell> hi Hobbsee
[08:17] <Riddell> Hobbsee: flight back ok?
[08:17] <Hobbsee> :)
[08:18] <Hobbsee> Riddell: 36 hours, 4 and a bit planes, 3 trains, 1 car and 1 taxi.
[08:18] <Hobbsee> and i'm not quite so jetlagged today, but that's been evil too.
[08:19] <Hobbsee> and far too much uni work to contemplate
[08:31] <ubuntu> Not many people helping out in #kubuntu :(


[15:34] <micahg> fta: sorry, I don't think I'll get to openarena until next week
[15:35] <fta> micahg, n-p, i'll downgrade (and i'm off this w-e)
[16:01] <fta> what's happening with the builders, seems they are building stuff from 12h+ ago
[16:01] <micahg> fta: some were repurposed it seems
[16:24] <LLStarks> new theme is sexy
[17:15] <fta> chrisccoulson, did you say that evo is crashing a lot now?
[17:15] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it's unusable
[17:16] <fta> just got the nvidia driver which unblocked X, i want to reboot but if it's unstable...
[17:16] <fta> do you know what's making it crash?
[17:16] <fta> if it's the globalmenu, i should be fine, i don't use ut
[17:16] <fta> it
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> fta - not sure, i've not had a chance to look at it yet
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> it's unlikely to be the global menu, as it's only evo that crashes
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> i'm guessing it's evo-indicator ;)
[17:17] <fta> i have bug 722491
[17:17] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 722491 in evolution "evolution crashed with SIGSEGV in send_dbus_message()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/722491
[17:18] <fta> but yours is probably different
[17:19] <fta> oh, a new nvidia-current, good i didn't reboot just yet
[17:21] <fta> new indicator-application fixing a crash
[17:21] <fta> doh, i guess i'll wait a bit
[19:50] <asac> chrisccoulson: fta_: did you remember to enable GLES for webGL on browsers this cycle for arm?
[19:50] <asac> please!!!
[19:50] <asac> we want to work on the drivers for that ;)
[19:59] <asac> nobody remember us :(
[19:59] <asac> remembered
[20:00] <micahg> there's still time to rebuild
[20:00] <fta> asac, it's dlopened, if you have the libs installed, it should work
[20:00] <fta> i didn't add those to depends though
[20:02] <asac> fta: could you do that? e.g. depend on the gles mesa packages rather than gl?
[20:02] <asac> for armel
[20:02] <asac> i dont see a build-depends on it
[20:02] <fta> it broken almost everywhere
[20:02] <asac> do they copy they ship all GLES headers in chromium?
[20:02] <fta> 's
[20:02] <asac> webgl?
[20:03] <fta> no copy, just dlopen(): http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~chromium-team/chromium-browser/chromium-browser.head/view/head:/debian/patches/dlopen_sonamed_gl.patch
[20:03] <asac> well. they need headers during ubild
[20:03] <asac> build
[20:03] <asac> and typically the GL headers are not 100% proper for GLES ... but could be that they used a good subset
[20:04] <asac> seems they do at least from the one symbol resolve i see there
[20:04] <asac> 63
[20:04] <asac>        GLGetProcAddressProc get_proc_address =
[20:04] <asac> 64
[20:04] <asac>            reinterpret_cast<GLGetProcAddressProc>(
[20:04] <asac> 65
[20:04] <asac>                base::GetFunctionPointerFromNativeLibrary(
[20:04] <asac> 66
[20:04] <asac>                    egl_library, "eglGetProcAddress"));
[20:04] <asac> oops
[20:05] <asac> fta: do you have a demo webpage somewhere bookmarked?
[20:05]  * asac tries google
[20:05] <asac> in firefox example page tells me that webgl is not supported in browser
[20:05] <asac> http://www.ibiblio.org/e-notes/webgl/webgl.htm
[20:05] <asac> (at least for somethere)
[20:06] <fta> chromium beta & stable blacklist some gpus: http://src.chromium.org/svn/branches/648/src/chrome/browser/resources/gpu_blacklist.json
[20:06] <asac> in chromium i see it, but no dragging
[20:06] <asac> guess thats because i have GLESv2 installed with soft rendering
[20:07] <asac> i think i have your daily
[20:07] <asac> chromium
[20:10] <fta> https://cvs.khronos.org/svn/repos/registry/trunk/public/webgl/sdk/demos/google/san-angeles/index.html wfm
[20:11] <fta> http://khronos.org/webgl/wiki/Demo_Repository
[20:13] <asac> cool one works
[20:13] <asac> i wonder if its GLES now ;)
[20:14] <asac> fta: any idea how to best find out?
[20:15] <fta> hm, not sure. search for the gpu process and lsof it
[20:17] <fta> i remember that grasshoper demo worked in chromium some weeks ago, now i can't drag it
[20:23] <asac> fta: do you have the libgles2-mesa package installed
[20:23] <asac> ?
[20:23] <asac> if you have that i "might" use GLES2 software rendering now
[20:23] <asac> instead of fully fluffy accell
[20:24] <fta> i have libgles2-mesa installed
[20:25] <asac> yeah
[20:26] <asac> so if that code is always taking gles2 if fund then you use GLES2
[20:26] <asac> which is most likely soft rendering for you
[20:26] <asac> (just a few chipsets have gallium support)
[20:36] <asac> fta: thats also in natty i guess (minus the blacklist)?
[20:37] <fta> asac, what?
[20:37] <asac> fta: GLESv2.so dlopen
[20:37] <fta> asac, it's everywhere
[20:37] <asac> ok great
[20:37] <asac> let me check something
[20:38] <asac> how can i dumb loaded libs of running proc?
[20:43] <fta> asac, sorry, i'm busy debugging an X startup crash
[20:45] <asac> yeah fine


[10:15] <Chipaca> hello all
[10:15] <Chipaca> is it known that the maas snap dumps core on install on 16.04?
[10:16] <Chipaca> https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/26415649/
[10:19] <roaksoax> Chipaca: did you install with --devmode ?
[10:20] <Chipaca> roaksoax: no
[10:22] <roaksoax> Chipaca: https://docs.ubuntu.com/maas/2.3/en/installconfig-snap-install
[10:22] <Chipaca> why are we telling people to install stuff with --devmode :-(
[10:23] <Chipaca> but, anyway, that answers my question; it's known broken. onwards.
[11:09] <roaksoax> Chipaca: because otherwise maas woudldn't work
[11:10] <roaksoax> there are blockers that prevent the maas snap (not in maas) from working in fully confined mode
[11:10] <roaksoax> so we have to use devmode
[13:17] <vogelc> roaksoax: We upgraded our prod to 2.3.0 last night and now we get out of memory errors on the region controller when someone restarts the region controller or does a refresh on the ui.  Thoughts?
[13:17] <vogelc> roaksoax: builtins.OSError: [Errno 12] Cannot allocate memory
[13:21] <roaksoax> vogelc: do you have more details than that ? e.g. regiond.log and process list, etc
[13:21] <vogelc> roaksoax: sure, I will get them posted to a paste bin
[13:33] <vogelc> roaksoax: https://pastebin.com/sBG42Grk
[13:34] <vogelc> roaksoax: We increased the memory on the vm to 24GB and it would still consume all the memory and kill the process.
[14:05] <roaksoax> vogelc: does a top or similar show what is utilizing cpu/memory ?
[14:16] <vogelc> roaksoax: https://pastebin.com/97cchLQ8
[14:16] <vogelc> roaksoax: that is top and syslog output.  I just issued a refresh in the web ui
[15:38] <xygnal> roaksoax: would appreciate what actions we can take to debug why vogelc and I are seeing this.   It's as if the system is queueing up load until memory runs out.  How do we see what 'load' is going on internally?
[16:25] <xygnal> roaksoax: listing nodes in webui takes a long time, and seems to stall at 500.  never finishes 'loading' status.
[16:27] <xygnal> roaksoax: if i refresh the page,  shortly thereafter twistd3 consumes all memory and is killed by kernel.
[16:27] <xygnal> within minutes
[17:42] <bladernr> is there a way to query maas via cli and determine what kernel version is available for each option in maas? (something that does "Show me the kernel verision installed by 16.04-hwe")
[18:00] <bladernr> ^^ I'd like to be able to easily determine exactly what version MAAS will install if I choose hwe vs hwe-edge (currently BOTH seem to be 4.13, but they often don't match up)
[18:07] <gunix> bladernr: what is the difference between hwe and hwe edge?
[18:07] <gunix> i know kvm vms work only with hwe ... but no idea what edge is
[18:08] <bladernr> hwe is the current supported HWE kernel, -edge is the NEXT one coming
[18:43] <ltrager> bladernr: there isn't a way to do it with MAAS however you could query apt which is where the kernel comes from
[18:43] <ltrager> bladernr: e.g apt-cache policy linux-image-generic-hwe-16.04-edge shows its 4.13
[19:53] <bladernr> ltrager, thanks, that'll work.  I was hoping for a MAAS Cli way to ask it about the things it's going to install, but that too works
[21:05] <mup> Bug #1532286 changed: Postgresql-9.5 breaks MAAS <MAAS:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532286>
[21:38] <klj1218> I'm trying to create a custom curtin preseed file and I've noticed that if I include "system_id" for the {node} it fails to pick the file up... I have to use the "hostname" instead. This doesn't match the documentation.
[21:39] <klj1218> fail --> curtin_userdata_centos_amd64_generic_centos70_q6g3hd
[21:39] <klj1218> work --> curtin_userdata_centos_amd64_generic_centos70_dell01-srv01
[21:41] <klj1218> The template naming doc is here: https://docs.ubuntu.com/maas/devel/en/nodes-custom


[18:20] <ibeardslee> morning
[18:41] <pikiora> Morning!
[18:45] <ibeardslee> and how is your wee one?
[19:13] <olly> morning
[19:40] <ajmitch> morning
[20:25] <chilts> morning


[04:44] <plain-user> Hello all!
[04:46] <plain-user> Can anyone tell if there is some analogs of guitar pro, transcribe and guitar rig in ubuntustudio, or where can i read about the packages that are included in the distro?
[04:49] <Technicus> Hello . . . does Ubuntu Studio have a seperate repository?
[04:53] <holstein> plain-user: hey
[04:53] <holstein> what functionality are you looking for?
[04:53] <holstein> Technicus: the ubuntustudio metapackages are in the main buntu repos
[04:53] <holstein> theres not really an official seperate ubuntustudio repo
[04:54] <holstein> plenty of PPA's
[04:54] <holstein> community PPA's
[05:03] <plain-user> holstein: 1) work with guitar pro format and midi files. 2) work with audio formats in a fashion that transcribe! does: play slowly, shift pitch, etc. 3) play electric guitar/or mike up the cabinet and record into pc through my m-audio card. that's pretty much it.
[05:03] <holstein> im not sure what guitar pro is
[05:04] <holstein> you can check winehq though
[05:04] <holstein> see about running it in wine
[05:04] <plain-user> holstein: midi based guitar tab editor software.
[05:04] <holstein> plain-user: check out #opensourcemusicians
[05:04] <holstein> theres tuxguitar
[05:04] <holstein> lots of other stuff
[05:04] <holstein> i dont do any of that
[05:04] <holstein> and havent really explored them
[05:05] <plain-user> holstein: i'm doing that in my current installation in another distro, i just thought ubuntustudio would be like everything at once and everything handy - isn't it the idea of it? instead of having lots of configs of this and taht through emulators
[05:05] <holstein> but, i see folk discussing them occasionally in that channel
[05:05] <plain-user> thank you, i will visit that channel.
[05:05] <holstein> plain-user: sure
[05:05] <holstein> you should ask whoever makes guitar pro to support linux
[05:05] <holstein> and im sure ubuntustudio and other distros will be happ to include it
[05:06] <plain-user> holstein: they do, but for a fee))
[05:06] <holstein> if its something a lot of users would like
[05:06] <holstein> plain-user: theres a linux version?
[05:06] <plain-user> they have support but not oss
[05:06] <holstein> interesting
[05:07] <holstein> im sure there is some grey area then
[05:07] <holstein> that will prevent its inclusion by default
[05:07] <holstein> but, feel free and join #ubuntustudio-devel
[05:07] <holstein> and bring it up
[05:07] <plain-user> yep, you download a deb package, buy the activation code and play. but that's not good enough - has to be free, so that people can stuff it up with random skins ))
[05:08] <holstein> plain-user: if it can be in the software store
[05:08] <holstein> the ubuntu software store
[05:08] <holstein> i would think that would be a step in the right direction
[05:09] <plain-user> holstein: what about other 2 functions - recording live sound and posibly putting on a vst plugin on top of that signal?
[05:09] <holstein> sure
[05:09] <holstein> rakkarack too
[05:09] <holstein> guitarix
[05:10] <plain-user> thank you
[05:10] <holstein> JACK is what you will want to read about
[05:10] <holstein> and learn
[05:10] <holstein> after you get JACK running stable
[05:10] <holstein> most other things are much easier
[05:11] <plain-user> ok, thanks for the hint, i go and rtm. =)
[05:11] <holstein> plain-user: we'll help you get it started sometime too :)
[05:13] <holstein> plain-user: does guitar pro have jack support?
[05:15] <plain-user> not sure
[05:15] <holstein> well, tuxguitar does
[05:16] <plain-user> what about watching SAT TV - is that considered as multimedia too?
[05:17] <plain-user> obviously, running the dish trhought the card and the pc...
[05:17] <holstein> satelite?
[05:17] <plain-user> yes
[05:17] <holstein> for the most part
[05:17] <holstein> ubuntustudio is about creating media
[05:18] <holstein> i would look at mythbuntu for what you are talking about
[05:18] <plain-user> so it must have good suport for a variety of weird hardware internals that are aimed at specific task, right?
[05:19] <holstein> it = ?
[05:20] <plain-user> ubuntustudio*
[05:20] <plain-user> myth thing is probably the right appliance, thanks again for the hint
[05:20] <holstein> ubuntustudio = ubuntu
[05:21] <holstein> mythbuntu = all of that to
[05:21] <holstein> its all the same repos
[05:21] <holstein> same kernels too usually
[05:21] <holstein> for the most part
[05:21] <holstein> its more about the vendors who make the hardware
[05:21] <holstein> and those cable cards are tricky i hear
[05:22] <plain-user> =\
[05:22] <plain-user> ok, well, i go and explore some of this new info you gave me. !
[05:22] <holstein> sure
[06:08] <Stryker> any1 know how to install 10.10 from usb? the installer tells me it is unable to mount the disk, which doesn't exist, as i am using USB
[06:08] <holstein> Stryker: hey
[06:09] <holstein> the easy way to do that is to just get the vanilla buntu live disc and check out
[06:09] <holstein> !vanilla
[06:09] <holstein> let me find a link though...
[06:09] <Stryker> what does it do
[06:10] <holstein> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntustudio/+bug/697774
[06:10] <Stryker> sounds delicious
[06:10] <holstein> Stryker: add yourself to that bug if you dont mind
[06:10] <Stryker> k
[06:10] <holstein> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuServerFlashDriveInstaller
[06:11] <holstein> thats the link that talks about how to make the ubuntustudio installer disc work
[06:11] <holstein> with unetbootin
[06:11] <holstein> still, easier to just to vanilla
[06:11] <holstein> and add what you want
[06:12] <holstein> i usually install ubuntustudio-audio and ubuntustudio-audio-plugins
[06:12] <holstein> Stryker: im heading out
[06:12] <Stryker> what is vanilla
[06:12] <holstein> vanilla = just plain old ubuntu
[06:12] <holstein> ubuntustudio is ubuntu
[06:12] <Stryker> without all the bulk?
[06:12] <holstein> just with some packages added
[06:12] <holstein> and some taken out
[06:12] <holstein> and customized
[06:13] <Stryker> how can i get all that is in ubuntu studio?
[06:13] <holstein> Stryker: its all in the repos
[06:13] <Stryker> what package(s)
[06:13] <holstein> you just add the metapackages
[06:14] <holstein> ubuntustudio-audio and ubuntustudio-audio-plugins are the ones i use
[06:14] <holstein> mostly only those
[06:14] <holstein> you dont have to do it that way though
[06:14] <holstein> you can just add the packages you want
[06:14] <Stryker> okay, i don't care about video, is that all i need to get all the audio stuff
[06:14] <holstein> pretty much
[06:14] <Stryker> thks holstein
[06:14] <holstein> Stryker: im heading out for the nite
[06:14] <holstein> check out
[06:14] <holstein> #opensourcemusicians
[06:15] <holstein> if you need more info tonite
[06:15] <holstein> Stryker: enjoy :)
[06:16] <Stryker> okay, thx
[10:51] <plain-user> yes, you were right, holstein, i need some help getting it started )
[12:01] <Strayfolk> hello!
[12:02] <Strayfolk> I'm on kernel 2.6.31-11-rt and I'd like help running the rtirq script
[12:26] <ScottL> Strayfolk, ailo has expereience with the rtirq script, maybe he can help you
[12:28] <Strayfolk> nice...
[12:28] <ailo> ScottL: I don't need help with it. Just pointed out, it isn't uninstalling.
[12:28] <ailo> When you do apt-get remove rtirq-init it isn't removed
[12:28] <ScottL> ailo, Strayfolk asked for help with rtirq script
[12:28] <ailo> Oh, sorry
[12:29] <ScottL> :)
[12:29] <ailo> Strayfolk, what's up?
[12:29] <Strayfolk> yes, I downloaded the .sh from http://www.rncbc.org/jack/
[12:29] <Strayfolk> can't run it...
[12:29] <ailo> What system are you on?
[12:30] <ailo> The rtirq script is a startup job that should be run at bootup. Not as a user.
[12:30] <Strayfolk> I'm on ubuntu studio 10.04 64 bit
[12:30] <Strayfolk> trying out the 2.6.31-11-rt for the first time
[12:31] <Strayfolk> sony vaio f12 + edirol fa66
[12:31] <ailo> Strayfolk: You have rtirq in the repo. Just install the package rtirq-init
[12:31] <Strayfolk> I've done that
[12:31] <Strayfolk> should I be set?
[12:32] <ailo> It's automatic, so no need to tune it. Are you using firewire?
[12:32] <Strayfolk> what if I've been fiddling with the /etc/default/rtirq manually?
[12:32] <Strayfolk> I am.
[12:32] <ailo> But is Lucid running the juju stack?
[12:32] <Strayfolk> ohci1394
[12:33] <ailo> What is it you want to adjust in the rtirq?
[12:33] <Strayfolk> I want to make the magic happen :)
[12:33] <ailo> It's already set to do that. No need to adjust it
[12:34] <ailo> The script in /etc/init.d/rtirq will detect your sound devices and add priority to them
[12:34] <Strayfolk> ok
[12:34] <ailo> I'm not sure if you need to have firewire plugged in during startup or not, though.
[12:35] <ailo> Haven't investigated. I use pci cards, so they are always plugged in
[12:35] <Strayfolk> okay! I'll try to reboot with the firewire on. I didn't do that
[12:35] <Strayfolk> bb in 5
[12:40] <Strayfolk> same amout of xruns
[12:40] <Strayfolk> ...
[12:40] <Strayfolk> I'm never getting this to work
[12:40] <ailo> What's your latency setting?
[12:40] <Strayfolk> I've tried them all
[12:41] <Strayfolk> I just ran 3x128 for testing
[12:41] <Strayfolk> normally I have to use 3x256 for normal use
[12:41] <Strayfolk> and 3x512 for mixing
[12:41] <Strayfolk> but always with random xruns
[12:41] <Strayfolk> regardless of everything
[12:42] <ailo> Could be network-manager is doing that.
[12:42] <ailo> It used to cause problems.
[12:42] <Strayfolk> I don't have network manager
[12:42] <Strayfolk> I use wicd
[12:43] <Strayfolk> even at 3x1024 I get xruns
[12:44] <Strayfolk> and I don't want to work at that latency
[12:45] <ailo> Do you know what is sharing the firewire irq?
[12:46] <Strayfolk> usb and graphics
[12:46] <Strayfolk> since I've tried everything else, I'll try getting an expresscard firewire controller
[12:47] <ailo> Strayfolk: I cant vouch for that the rtirq is working for you, so it would be nice to find that out first, I think
[12:47] <ailo> What firewire chip do you have, btw?
[12:47] <Strayfolk> it's a ricoh something, deemed to work by some
[12:48] <Strayfolk> this is my thread: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1665701&highlight=vaio+edirol
[12:48] <Strayfolk> how do I check whether the irq prios are in order?
[12:50] <ailo> Strayfolk: Try #opensourcemusicians. I'm know too little about both firewire and rtirq to give you any real help. I've never had any problems myself, so i've had no reason to find out.
[12:51] <Strayfolk> ok, thanks anyway!
[12:52] <ailo> tertl3 probably knows something about rtprio, and the guy who wrote the script is sometimes logged in too.
[12:52] <Strayfolk> now it's working ok for a few seconds @ 3x128...
[12:52] <Strayfolk> let's see for how long :)
[12:52] <Strayfolk> I'm fiddling with jack settings now
[12:54] <ailo> AutoStatic: Do you have experience with -rt firewire and rtirqinit?
[12:54] <AutoStatic> Yes
[12:54] <Strayfolk> AutoStatic, you helped me @ the forumm
[12:54] <Strayfolk> I'm trying the realtime kernel now... I got something going now :)
[12:55] <AutoStatic> I´ m rereading the thread Strayfolk
[12:56] <AutoStatic> Martin Trulan is a knowledgeable user so it's not your FireWire controller
[12:56] <Strayfolk> I'm sort of inclined to think that my system Should work! since now I've been running ardour + renoise for five minutes @ 3x128 without xruns
[12:57] <AutoStatic> Cool! If you do get some xruns every now and then try the Tango Studio real-time kernel
[12:57] <Strayfolk> AutoStatic, on your advice I installed the tango ppa
[12:57] <Strayfolk> and afterwards the rt kernel
[12:57] <AutoStatic> The 2.6.31--11-rt?
[12:58] <Strayfolk> jes
[12:58] <AutoStatic> 2.6.31-11-rt
[12:58] <AutoStatic> Try the one from Tango Studio
[12:58] <AutoStatic> 2.6.33-30-real-time
[12:58] <AutoStatic> Performs better on all my systems
[12:58] <AutoStatic> And significantly better on my notebook and netbook
[12:59] <AutoStatic> The Tango Studio real-time kernel is in the lucid-lowlatency repository
[13:00] <AutoStatic> But if 2.6.31-11-rt works for you, then stick with that one :)
[13:00] <Strayfolk> okay! I can't find it though
[13:00] <Strayfolk> 33-29 I find
[13:00] <AutoStatic> http://tangostudio.tuxfamily.org/en/kernel-rt
[13:01] <Strayfolk> I'll be back for more tweaking later! I'm late for an appointment
[13:01] <Strayfolk> thanks for your help!!
[13:01] <Strayfolk> cu
[13:01] <AutoStatic> Ok :)
[13:01] <AutoStatic> You're welocme
[13:01] <AutoStatic> welcome
[14:13] <tertl3> hello
[14:16] <holstein> tertl3: lol
[14:16] <holstein> what do you want ;)
[14:16] <AutoStatic> Hello tertl3!
[14:16] <holstein> AutoStatic: o/
[14:16] <tertl3> :P
[14:16] <AutoStatic> Hello holstein
[14:19] <holstein> tertl3: are you using ubuntustudio?
[14:20] <tertl3> no, but I go to ubuntustudio preperation page to get all of the things I need after a fresh install
[14:20] <holstein> cool
[14:29] <tertl3> the only reason i dont use the ubuntustudio iso is because I dont use all the extra programs
[14:29] <tertl3> but I think I heard ScottL saying he was keeping it up now