[13:59] <coz_> cousin_luigi,  mmm   ok did you run update from the terminal?
[13:59] <cousin_luigi> coz_: yes
[13:59] <coz_> cousin_luigi,  it will be a sleeping process if that's what you mean
[13:59] <cousin_luigi> coz_: indeed, but updates stopped showing up
[14:00] <Ventero> cousin_luigi: You're talking about the little red arrow-notifier?
[14:00] <coz_> cousin_luigi,  could be there are none at this time you co uld  try  sudo apt-get update  then  sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[14:00] <cousin_luigi> Ventero: I think so, cant' recall the exact colour atm
[14:00] <cousin_luigi> coz_: why dist-upgrade?
[14:00] <coz_> cousin_luigi,   Apt-get upgrade is useful for general maintenance. It looks at what is installed on your system, and updates it with the latest patches, etc.
[14:01] <coz_> cousin_luigi,   apt-get dist-upgrade will be able to remove packages in favor of other, higher priority packages. Both use the package manager so they both use package dependencies. You can run dist-upgrade for regular server maintenance if you want.
[14:01] <Ventero> Check gconf-editor for apps/update-notifier/ for auto_launch, if it's enabled, the arrow doesn't show up anymore - which is standard behaviour in Jaunty
[14:01] <cousin_luigi> could it be a glitch from this not being a clean install but an upgrade from intrepid?
[14:02] <petsounds> what about my question coz?
[14:02] <cousin_luigi> actually it stopped showing up since that switch
[14:02] <coz_> petsounds,  let me sroll back hold on
[14:02] <Ventero> Yeah, as I said, this is new standard behaviour in Jaunty, cousion_luigi
[14:02] <petsounds> ok
[14:02] <Ventero> See here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-notifier/+bug/332945
[14:02] <cousin_luigi> oh
[14:02] <coz_> petsounds,  let me check dependencies for inkscape hold on
[14:03] <petsounds> okay
[14:03] <Ventero> cousin_luigi: Running "gconftool -s --type bool /apps/update-notifier/auto_launch false"
[14:03] <Ventero> will switch back to the old behaviour.
[14:04] <cousin_luigi> done
[14:04] <coz_> petsounds, ok here's what you do to find the dependencies   open synaptick package manager...hit Search.. type inkscape...when that comes up look below for the "Dependencies"  tab
[14:04] <coz_> petsounds, there is a whole list of them.. many of which are probably already onboard
[14:04] <Lasivian> sigh
[14:04] <Lasivian> the netbook image installs ext3 :S
[14:05] <cousin_luigi> may I inquire how is the update notifier useful in jaunty?
[14:06] <topyli> Lasivian: what's wrong with that?
[14:06] <panaggio> every time I start my computer, I have to go trhu single user netroot, then resume, so that I can use network
[14:06] <petsounds> coz_ : i write it down cause i'm not at her house right now, and after that?
[14:06] <cousin_luigi> bbl
[14:06] <panaggio> and my network manager does not show any network interfaces (and I have two)
[14:06] <Lasivian> topyli: slow SSD drives work much better with ext2
[14:06] <coz_> cousin_luigi,  well to notify you of updates....in all honesty I generally disable update notifications and simply rin ap-get update and dist-upgrade ...especiall on new version
[14:07] <topyli> Lasivian: that's debatable. ext3 happens to be default, you can easily change that
[14:07]  * topyli uses ext4
[14:07] <Lasivian> topyli: didn;t see an option in the image install
[14:07] <coz_> petsounds, well if you satisfy all of the dependencies it should install with no problems
[14:08] <coz_> petsounds, you might also want to download the inkscape deb pacakge to take home with you also
[14:08] <topyli> Lasivian: you have to do the partitioning manually
[14:08] <coz_> petsounds, or any of the applications that did not install from AptonCd
[14:08] <Lasivian> topyli: that's what I didn;t see an option for
[14:08] <Lasivian> retrying, I might have missed it
[14:08] <topyli> oh, that would be a problem then :\
[14:08] <deany> narrowed this wine bug down a little.  any wine type folder browser locks my pc up, not even RSEIUB works.  However, its only when I disable compiz effects, with them on its fine, and its also fine with them off if I disable "let window manager control windows" option in wine.#
[14:13]  * Lasivian lives dangerously and sets no swap partition
[14:13] <shaga> I have no swap either on my netbook
[14:13] <shaga> too scared on using swap on ssd
[14:13] <petsounds> coz_ : as far as i know inkscape is a substitue for corel, and i heard about wine which is can run corel draw on linux machine, she have dual boot computer. is there any different or feature that is not working if she using wine?
[14:14] <coz_> petsounds,  not sure what you mean.... inkscape,,, in my opinion .. is far superior for vector graphics
[14:15] <amikrop> mvo: Hello there. Yesterday, I upgraded to Jaunty RC. I am using nVidia (I was using nvidia-glx-new until Intrepid, when I had to switch to 173 according to a document I read). After my first boot with 9.04 I was forced to low graphics mode. I rebooted in recovery mode and did a xfix, then the screen resolution was OK. But I was using the nv open source driver. I started Hardware Drivers, selected "nvidia 173 driver [Recommended]" and h
[14:15] <amikrop> it "Activate". It siad Downloading and Installing the Driver, reached 100%, but the driver was still not activated.
[14:15] <Lasivian> what is the mount point for a primary partition, \ ?
[14:15] <shaga> /
[14:15] <Lasivian> er / I mean
[14:15] <Lasivian> thanks
[14:15] <deany> There is no accelerated ATI driver in jaunty ?  Its not showing one available
[14:15] <coz_> petsounds,  if she is used to corel  then perhaps..since it is dual boot.. she should just go into windows for that applications.. however  inkscape  does take a bit of time to get used to the interface  but then there are also thousands of tutorials for it online
[14:16] <amikrop> mvo: And everytime I make this attempt to activate the driver, I go to "low graphics mode" after the next boot, so I guess the driver gets partially installed.
[14:16] <shaga> if you have lots of space. it's cool to have /, /boot, /home and swap as a different partitions
[14:16] <shaga> but on my 8gb ssd(netbook), only going for /
[14:16] <amikrop> mvo: I explained my problem here yesterday, and I was told to file a bug report and let you know :-)
[14:16] <deany> ati aint supporting my mobility 9800 no more either, 9.3 is the last driver.. Im now legacy to them :)
[14:17] <Lasivian> shaga: yeah, 8gb aspire one here with 1.5 ram
[14:17] <deany> shame, because ati`s are much much better
[14:17] <shaga> I have only 0.5 ram but it doesnt bother me :)
[14:17] <shaga> but yeah, aspire one here also
[14:17] <Lasivian> damn what is this? Ubuntu is warning me about not making a swap partition
[14:17] <shaga> it sure does
[14:17] <Lasivian> that's soemthing I expect windows to do!
[14:17] <shaga> just press continue
[14:17] <shaga> it's rare that one doesnt want swap partition
[14:18] <deany> shaga, http://tombuntu.com/index.php/2008/09/04/four-tweaks-for-using-linux-with-solid-state-drives/
[14:18] <Lasivian> and that my password is only 6 characters.. geez
[14:18] <Lasivian> shaga: it's the principle of the thing!
[14:18] <petsounds> coz_ : her windows are full with viruses from her campus. anyway i'm going to her house later and do what you teach me with dependacies thing. thanks
[14:18] <Lasivian> shaga: Linux is supposed to say "yes ma'am!" even if it proceeds to shit itself horribly! ;)
[14:18] <shaga> thanks deany didnt know all of those tricks :)
[14:19] <coz_> petsounds, ah ok
[14:19] <shaga> Lasivian: I see your point but it's targeted for masses nowadays ;)
[14:19] <shaga> and mass doesnt even know whats /
[14:19] <coz_> petsounds,  then  I would have her switch to inkscape or  just install over the windows installation
[14:21] <Lasivian> deany: I didn;t know about that 4th one, thanks
[14:21] <amikrop> mvo: that's the bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/jockey/+bug/363872
[14:21] <Lasivian> shaga: I was assuming it was / but well, i'm a chick and I ask for confirmation from humans because *I* might well be wrong. If everyone did that the OS wouldn;t have to ;)
[14:22] <shaga> just for you to know, I wasnt talking about that you dont know.. it just gave me an idea for that example :)
[14:22] <Lasivian> of course, heh
[14:23] <Lasivian> unrelated issue, if one has a linux softraid can you easily add more disks to it?
[14:23] <shaga> but yeah, linux distributions has come a long way
[14:23] <shaga> I still remember that day when I installed my first linux. it was some old redhat. I went to the sound options, there was just text "nothing here, yet :)"
[14:24] <Lasivian> i'm thinking of moving a raid 5 from hardware to software in the near future
[14:24] <shaga> or something similiar
[14:24] <Lasivian> I tried Redhat but LILO and I never got along well
[14:24] <shaga> this happend like 10 years ago or so
[14:25] <shaga> no idea on that raid thing but hope you get some help :)
[14:26] <petsounds> coz_ : it's kinda embarassing but sometimes we doing webcam chat back when i use windows, it's almost one year ago since i migrating to linux and i found that my Creative webcam doesn't work so we can't chat with mebcam anymore. if u don't mind can guide me to make my cam work under linux?
[14:26] <Lasivian> yeah, my redhat attempt was about a decade ago too, after that I had a freebsd web server for about 4 years, but I didn;t try that on my notebook, i'm not masochistic enough
[14:27] <Lasivian> I want my notebook webcam to take a picture every minute and email it to me
[14:27] <shaga> haha, some are :D
[14:27] <Lasivian> so if someone steals my notebook it reports who did it
[14:28] <shaga> would be cool if touchpad could get fingerprints
[14:28] <Lasivian> a keylogger that mails it's data back would be nice too
[14:28] <Lasivian> i'm considering not requiring a login for just that reason
[14:28] <Lasivian> so whoever finds it would use it not knowing it's sending me their data
[14:28] <shaga> :)
[14:28] <coz_> petsounds, not sure guy which cam is it?
[14:29] <petsounds> you mean my webcam brand?
[14:29] <coz_> petsounds,  yes  and model number
[14:30] <petsounds> creative web cam chat
[14:30] <petsounds> sorry, creative live cam chat
[14:30] <coz_> petsounds, hold on
[14:30] <petsounds> sure thing
[14:31] <deany> Looks like im back to intrepid if I cant play a decent 3D game (no driver for my ATI anymore, and the open source one isnt an option as far as 3D performance goes).
[14:33] <mvo> amikrop: if that happend during a intrepid->jaunty upgrade, please attach /var/log/dist-upgrade/main.log as well
[14:33] <coz_> petsounds,  do you have an application to view that cam in chat?  perhaps  pidgin  and to test it you may want to install camorama to see if the system is picking it up
[14:33] <petsounds> i'm using kopete
[14:33] <petsounds> and it say device/generic
[14:33] <coz_> petsounds, oh you are running KDE?
[14:33] <petsounds> yes sir
[14:34] <coz_> petsounds,  and does Kopete have a video window ?
[14:34] <petsounds> yes
[14:34] <coz_> petsounds, does the cam work in that video window?
[14:34] <coz_> do you see a picture
[14:34] <amikrop> mvo: ok
[14:34] <petsounds> no just black screen
[14:35] <coz_> petsounds, was there a waringin when you opened Kopete that the camera could not be found?
[14:35] <coz_> petsounds,  check in the Kopete preferences  you may be able to start it from there howver... i am not up on all of the web cams supported on ubuntu
[14:35] <coz_> but I am googling :)
[14:36] <petsounds> ok wait
[14:37] <amikrop> mvo: done
[14:37] <coz_> petsounds,  the only problem with creative products is that they are created for window use,,, and if it does not work you will have to discuss this with someone more familiar with cam driver installations onubuntu than me.
[14:37] <petsounds> kopete detected that web cam is connected but still no display
[14:38] <coz_> petsounds, mm
[14:39] <coz_> petsounds,  this may help but from what I read it is iffy at best   http://www.rastageeks.org/ov51x-jpeg/index.php/Ov51xJpegHackedInstall
[14:39] <petsounds> well okay, but can u recommend what brand of webcam which is run under linux?
[14:39] <andresmh> after updating my Jaunty installation I cannot longer use Compiz. I get "Desktop effects cannot be enabled". Any ideas?
[14:39] <coz_> petsounds,   logitech  cams seems to work well
[14:39] <coz_> petsounds,  let me see if I can find a list of known cams for ubuntu hold on
[14:39] <DASPRiD> andersk, what does compiz --replace in the console say?
[14:40] <petsounds> ok logitech then
[14:40] <coz_> petsounds,  here is one article  http://www.murrayc.com/blog/permalink/2008/03/28/webcams-that-just-work-with-ubuntu/
[14:40] <petsounds> thanks
[14:41] <coz_> petsounds,  another probably more reliable  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SkypeWebCams
[14:41] <petsounds> i don't know if skype run under linux
[14:41] <petsounds> he..he
[14:41] <coz_> petsounds,  yes skype has a linux version
[14:41] <petsounds> oh thanks god
[14:42] <coz_> petsounds,  you may also want to at least read through this   https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Webcam
[14:42] <wirechief> abdresmh  are you using intel945 graphics ?
[14:42] <andresmh> wirechief, yes
[14:42] <wirechief> andresmh: compiz has been disabled because the intel945 has been blacklisted there is a freeze bug currently being worked on to resolve the issue
[14:43] <coz_> petsounds, if you are unfamiliar with any of the commands  talked about there  dont do them until you can discuss it withj someone... you can also go to #linux   channel in case no one here is avaiable for that particular issue    I am not sure they can help but   mulitiple channels can sometimes be an advantage when troubleshooting
[14:43] <andresmh> wirechief, well, actually this is what lspci returns: 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 0c)
[14:43] <petsounds> yes sir
[14:44] <wirechief> andresmh: ok well if you have any questions on freezes see bug 359392
[14:44] <andresmh> wirechief, is there a way I can revert to the version of compiz that was working?
[14:45] <wirechief> andresmh: its not compiz, its mesa 7.4 that is causing the trouble
[14:45] <wirechief> andresmh check out the link to the bug for more information
[14:45] <petsounds> coz_ : how to install skype is it with sudo apt-get install skype?
[14:45] <DanaG> petsounds: not only does Creative not support Linux... they didn't even support Windows Vista for nearly a full year after its release.  Oh, and they still produce and SELL products that they've "Discontinued" and "Desupported"!
[14:45] <DanaG> So yeah, ditch Creative.
[14:46] <coz_> petsounds,  I believe it is yes but let me check hold on
[14:46] <DanaG> didn't support Vista _well_, that is.
[14:46] <coz_> petsounds, oo aparently not hold on
[14:46] <petsounds> DanaG : yes sure, but i can play Creative Prodikeys under linux
[14:47] <petsounds> ok coz
[14:48] <coz_> guys is there a skype package available for jaunty?
[14:50] <coz_> petsounds,  generally skype is in the repository but I am not seeing it here
[14:50] <petsounds> coz, i can download skype for linux on their official site
[14:50] <Ventero> It's in the medibuntu-repository
[14:51] <petsounds> the one with .deb, right?
[14:51] <coz_> petsounds,  yes but you know  pidgin is already installed on ubuntu which is not proprietary and that should work just as well
[14:51] <petsounds> can i install pidgin on kde?
[14:51] <coz_> petsounds,  yes you will need the .deb pacakge unless you want to compile it manually
[14:51] <coz_> petsounds,  oh I for got you are on KDE  I dont know
[14:52] <coz_> petsounds,  hold on let me see if kde has an equivlelant
[14:52] <petsounds> okay
[14:53] <coz_> petsounds, actually go to  #kde   channel they are far better equipped to talk about kde applications
[14:53] <coz_> petsounds,  just   /join #kde
[14:53] <coz_> petsounds, from what I am reading skype for linux has issues right now
[14:53] <icewaterman> did anyone manage to run googleearth on jaunty (amd64)?
[14:54] <Lasivian> I wish we could make the system usage graph the background somehow
[14:54] <Lasivian> certainly would be unobtrusive then
[14:54] <coz_> Lasivian,  graph the backgroun?
[14:54] <coz_> background
[14:55] <Lasivian> coz_: have the background be the graph of cpu/mem usage
[14:55] <petsounds> ok i will coz
[14:55] <Ventero> Lasivian: Try conky :P
[14:55] <coz_> Lasivian,  yikes  wouldnt that be gpu/cpu intensive?
[14:56] <Lasivian> coz_: probably, i'm just brainstorming
[14:56] <coz_> petsounds,  yeah I dont want to sound like I am pushing you away but having #kde   #linux  #ubuntu  #ubuntu+1 # compiz   etc  as regularly visited channels opensmore opportunity to solve issues
[14:56] <coz_> Lasivian, ah I see :)
[14:56] <Lasivian> two tiny colored lines in the panel bar would be cool as well
[14:56] <coz_> Lasivian, so full screen system monitor?
[14:57] <Lasivian> unobtrusive but obvious
[14:57] <petsounds> no its okay coz
[14:57] <Lasivian> giving it a tiny section of the panel bar wastes space to not show much data really
[14:59] <gravityreloaded> can any1 help me get my files to browse again?
[14:59] <gravityreloaded> i click my computer
[14:59] <gravityreloaded> then it tries ... and gives up
[15:00] <andresmh> wirechief, can I just revert the mesa files prior to the blacklisting?
[15:01] <gravityreloaded> not even anerror msg
[15:01] <Ned2> does Jaunty come with the newest version of virtualbox?
[15:02] <ikonia> !info vbox
[15:02] <ikonia> !info virtual-box
[15:02] <ikonia> typical
[15:02] <ikonia> hang on
[15:02] <Ned2> ok
[15:02] <gravityreloaded> it does exist actuallt
[15:02] <ikonia> gravityreloaded: I know it does, the name is wrong
[15:02] <ikonia> !info virtualbox
[15:03] <deany> there is no puel vbox for jaunty yet
[15:03] <Ventero> !info virtualbox-ose
[15:03] <gravityreloaded> I have virtual-box in jkaunty
[15:03] <ikonia> Ventero: thank you !
[15:03] <Ventero> No problem ;)
[15:03] <gravityreloaded> ubotto must be wrong hehe :)
[15:03] <ikonia> gravityreloaded: no, as I said the name I was using was wrong
[15:03] <Ned2> that's cool, thanks for the info guys
[15:03] <petsounds> coz_ : i think i'm gonna buy logitech webcam tomorrow, and i also want to buy tv tuner which is run under linux, can u tel me what brand and series of tv tuner which is run under linux?
[15:04] <ikonia> petsounds: http://www.linuxtv.org/
[15:04] <petsounds> i did googling but it confusing me
[15:04] <petsounds> to many brand
[15:04] <coz_> petsounds,  ooo that one I have no idea  hauphog maybe?? you may want to google    ubutnu tv tuner cards
[15:04] <coz_> haupaug
[15:04] <coz_> not sure how that is spelled
[15:04] <ikonia> petsounds: too many ? that just means you have a selection to chose from
[15:05] <petsounds> i just want to know what people here usually use
[15:05] <ikonia> haupage
[15:05] <gravityreloaded> ikonia can I have a little help in this room? I don't have a lot of time... back to work soon!! - inlunch break
[15:05] <ikonia> petsounds: it doesn't matter what people use
[15:05] <petsounds> haupage
[15:05] <petsounds> okay
[15:05] <ikonia> gravityreloaded: ask, if someone knows, they will answer
[15:05] <coz_> petsounds, thats not a guarantee it will work though
[15:05] <gravityreloaded> i did
[15:05] <ikonia> gravityreloaded: then no-one knows
[15:05] <petsounds> why?
[15:05] <coz_> petsounds,  I did have a haupauge once that worked
[15:05] <gravityreloaded> if you prefer I'll come c~back tomorrow
[15:05] <ikonia> petsounds: read the link I sent you
[15:05] <coz_> petsounds,  but this takes a bit of research hold on
[15:06] <gravityreloaded> try again - I have no hurry
[15:06] <petsounds> ok to you both
[15:06] <petsounds> hmm, how about nvidia?
[15:06] <ikonia> what about it ?
[15:06] <petsounds> is it okay?
[15:07] <ikonia> certain cards are better supported than others
[15:07] <ikonia> !nvidia | petsounds
[15:07] <coz_> petsounds,  there are expensive cards like this   http://pchdtv.com/
[15:07] <coz_> petsounds,   http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815100021
[15:07] <petsounds> $114 out of budget. he..he
[15:08] <ikonia> guys, try ##hardware
[15:08] <petsounds> i am looking for tv tuner for about $50
[15:08] <ikonia> petsounds: try ##hardware - read the links I gave you
[15:08] <coz_> petsounds, yeah :)   but if you keep googling  or take ikonia 's suggestion  you will find one   but I wouldnt rush into it until you are sure it is a good working card
[15:08] <coz_> petsounds, same for the webcams
[15:09] <coz_> ok   I have to break here
[15:09] <kane77> hi
[15:10] <petsounds> ikonia, what tv tuner you have?
[15:10] <ikonia> petsounds: it doesn't matter - read the link I sent you to select what YOU want
[15:11] <kane77> I have problem with tracker.. it always gives me this warning: There was error while performing indexing: Index corrupted, what do I do about it?
[15:11] <petsounds> i mean if you have tv tuner that work, i'll have the same as you
[15:13] <petsounds> i once have telebit with phillips chipset saa713 but seems not work under ubuntu/kubuntu.
[15:15] <ikonia> petsounds: the URL I sent you explains what works and what doesn't and the limitations
[15:18] <deany> whats the state of play with the default ati driver in jaunty and playin a game like ut2004?  or do I need to wait for fglrx to be released (its now considered a legacy card too..)
[15:19] <petsounds> ikonia, i'm going with hauppauge.
[15:19] <petsounds> it's affordable
[15:19] <ikonia> ok
[15:29] <Lasivian> sigh
[15:29] <Lasivian> all that headache for nothing
[15:29] <Lasivian> looks like the webcam issue I upgraded to try and fix was hardware related
[15:30] <Tecna1> I'm noticing a pattern with my system, and I'm wondering if anyone else is experiencing this...
[15:30] <Lasivian> something in the connector for the screen got screwed when I tok the laptop apart
[15:30] <victim> no, I don't have your system ;)
[15:30] <Tecna1> victim: lo- wait that wasn't funny.
[15:32] <Tecna1> anyway... I'm using the 9.04 RC and filesystems appear to be busy when they really aren't
[15:32] <Tecna1> this keeps me from modifying them, including umount
[15:33] <Lasivian> and my bluetooth is still broken
[15:34]  * Lasivian sighs
[15:34] <Tecna1> can anyone else verify this please?
[15:34] <ikonia> Tecna1: keeps you from modifying them ?
[15:34] <ikonia> Tecna1: in what way mofidying ?
[15:36] <atlef> crap, BANKID no longer works in firefox. something broke it. *need to google*
[15:36] <Tecna1> ikonia: for example, truecrypt can't create hidden volumes because it says the filesystem is busy.
[15:37] <saeva> yo
[15:37] <saeva> where the hell is Tor in jaunty?
[15:37] <ikonia> saeva: in the repos ?
[15:37] <amikrop> mvo: If you need some more information, or have any progress, please, let me know. ;-)
[15:37] <ikonia> Tecna1: doesn't truecrypt need exclusive locking ?
[15:37] <Tecna1> but the biggest problem is that i can't umount
[15:38] <saeva> ahem
[15:38] <saeva> ikonia: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=tor&searchon=names&suite=all&section=all
[15:38] <ikonia> Tecna1: what does fuser $mount_point say ?
[15:38] <ikonia> saeva: ok - there is your answer, it's not in jaunty
[15:39] <saeva> ikonia: damn you smartass-and unhelpful-when-wrong-sourpuss!
[15:39] <ikonia> saeva: please control yourself, that's uncalled for
[15:40] <ikonia> I'm looking to see if it's being replaced at the moment for you
[15:41] <Noq> Do I get Dual Boot when I have Windows installed at C:\, and I install Ubuntu on my NTFS D:\ drive?
[15:42] <Ventero> Heh, torbutton-extension recommends the packet tor, which isn't availabe :D
[15:42] <Pici> Noq: Ubuntu does not support being installed on an NTFS partition, you'd need to format to something else (ext3)
[15:42] <ikonia> yup, looks like it's not been packaged yet/at all
[15:42] <Noq> Pici: I understood that one, sorry that I explained it wrong.
[15:43] <Noq> But do I get Dual Boot this way?
[15:43] <histo> ughhh pulseaudio still all buggered up.  Drops audio after playing a few minutes of urban terror.
[15:43] <Lasivian> anyone else find the desktop of the netbook img more like a straightjacket?
[15:44] <Ventero> Any idea why my mouse-cursor is lagging when I'm downloading something and any progress-window (i.e. Firefox' download-window/update-manager) is open?
[15:52] <ghabit> Hello. I need help. I cannot finish download iimage with jigdo because of this http://pastebin.com/d13e0aee9 errors, advise me plese.
[15:52] <ghabit> I am using this http://releases.ubuntu.com/releases/9.04/ubuntu-9.04-rc-alternate-i386.jigdo jigdo file
[15:53] <sdg> Where can I get a Jaunty installer for my 256MB USB drive?
[15:54] <ghabit> http://releases.ubuntu.com/releases/9.04/
[15:55] <sdg> ghabit: I've already looked there.
[15:55] <sdg> ghabit: I don't want UNR.
[15:55] <sdg> ghabit: I want Ubuntu.
[15:55] <ghabit> UNR?
[15:56] <atlef> sdg: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/netboot/jaunty/
[15:56] <sdg> ghabit: Where can I get a Jaunty installer for my 256MB USB drive?
[15:56] <sdg> atlef: Thanks.
[15:56] <atlef> sdg: you are welcome
[15:57] <ghabit> Anyone knows about issue with jigdo?
[15:57] <sdg> Now I just need to figure out how to put the netboot onto my USB...
[15:57] <atlef> sdg: unetbootin
[15:57] <sdg> atlef: I tried that.
[15:58] <sdg> atlef: It doesn't have an option for 9.04 netboot
[15:58] <atlef> sdg: download the right iso from the link i gave you and point unetbootin to that
[15:59] <syockit> sdg: it has an option for custom iso
[15:59] <Raulin> My laptopfan stopped working after a recent upgrade from hardy -> jaunty. Is there any sort of fancontrol in linux?
[16:00] <cellofellow> why is the package "tor" not available in jaunty?
[16:00] <sdg> syockit: Ah yes. :)
[16:01] <cellofellow> !info tor jaunty
[16:01] <syockit> !info tor intrepid
[16:01] <syockit> hmm, probably they messed up the packaging and didn't manage to repair it in time
[16:02] <syockit> probably you have to wait for backports
[16:02] <syockit> i.e. if they ever package one
[16:02] <cellofellow> :(
[16:02] <cellofellow> can they fix it?
[16:02] <drbobb> i'm wondering whether it's possible to downgrade Xorg to a previous version, without downgrading/breaking the rest of jaunty
[16:03] <Skapare> drbobb: I know a way to find out
[16:03] <drbobb> yeah, try it - igues
[16:03] <drbobb> s
[16:03] <ghabit> atlef: netboot iso is 11 mb size? Or I am mistake?
[16:04] <syockit> drbobb: you have to downgrade the whole xorg family, mesa/dri/glx stuff included. that is, if the de (gnome/kde) do not depend on newer xorg, which I think is the case
[16:04] <drbobb> what is the case: that they depend, or that they don't?
[16:04] <Skapare> ghabit: sounds about right
[16:04] <Noqq> Is it usefull to have 50gb with Ubuntu?
[16:05] <Skapare> Noqq: 50GB for package files?  no ... for your own data, maybe ... movies use up space fast
[16:05] <trappist> hey I just did apt-get update; apt-get dist-upgrade and I've got a bunch of updates but it didn't have to download them.  is my box downloading package updates while I'm not looking?
[16:06] <Noqq> What if I put from those 50gb, like 30gb back in C:\ (where Windows is installed)
[16:06] <Noqq> Is there a chance it might get my C:\ corrupted?
[16:06] <Skapare> Noqq: your choice ... put your space where you need it
[16:06] <drbobb> my problem being that support for my video chip has regressed seriously, and it's not likely to be fixed anytime soon
[16:07] <Skapare> Noqq: if windows formats it, I would not call that corrupted, but just lost data
[16:07] <Skapare> drbobb: so try a backversion .deb for it and see
[16:08] <drbobb> yep that's what I'll do. My point in asking is, maybe it's obvious to someone that can't work, and I would be just wasting my time
[16:08] <atlef> ghabit: yes it is, and you have to install every thing but the base packages yourself. take a look at http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/minimal
[16:09] <syockit> drbobb: I used to downgrade xorg to hardy version when I was on Intrepid. It was a kind of pain, but somehow worked out
[16:09] <syockit> drbobb: about the case, gnome/kde usually won't depend on latest version of xorg from my experience
[16:09] <drbobb> syockit: ok thanks
[16:10] <Tecna1> Noqq: I actually prefer to have a separate partition (better yet, a separate drive) for personal data, so I don't have to backup and restore when changing OSs
[16:10] <syockit> drbobb: you can use aptitude and explore breaking packages. add intrepid as source, and try marking xorg packages to previous version
[16:11] <drbobb> the hardy version worked pretty much ok for me, the current one makes it pretty much impossible to watch videos or movies - too much flicker
[16:11] <Noqq> I shrinked my D:\, now I got some 'unallocated' space, How do I get this free space to my C:\?
[16:11] <zoggy> Noqq: resize the c:\
[16:12] <Tecna1> Noqq: gparted can also grow your "C:\"
[16:13] <Noqq> zoggy: No, I want my C:\ file to be bigger, cause I don't want my D:\ (where I'm gonna install Ubuntu) to be so big.
[16:13] <Tecna1> Noqq: do you know what "resize" means?
[16:13] <Noqq> Techna1: Yes, make it biger/smaller. But somehow I can't see the optino to make it bigger.
[16:13] <syockit> Noqq: depending on where the unalloc space is created, you probably have to move D:\ to the end
[16:15] <Tecna1> Noqq: what partition editor are you using?
[16:15] <Noqq> For your information.. I want C:\ (where Windows is installed) to be bigger. So I shrinked my D:\ (wich is mpty, NTFS, wich is gonna be for Ubuntu) to place that free space to C:\. So my D:\ isn'that big, so I don't leave behind usefull space.
[16:15] <Noqq> Tecna1: The one built-in at live cd from Ubuntu
[16:16] <Tecna1> Noqq: you've already been told once that Ubuntu cannot be installed to NTFS
[16:16] <Noqq> Tecna1: I know, but I make the D:\ .ext3
[16:17] <Noqq> I just first want some space from D:\ to C:\.
[16:17] <Tecna1> and why are you calling them "C:\" and "D:\"?
[16:17] <Noqq> Because they are called like that...
[16:17] <syockit> Noqq: try installing gparted during live cd. it should install the required things for resizing ntfs partition. use that instead of the installer built-in
[16:17] <Tecna1> are you trying to install a wubi?
[16:17] <Noqq> No.
[16:17] <histo> Noqq: use gparted from the live cd
[16:18] <histo> !who | Noqq
[16:18] <Noqq> I got GParted in front of me now.
[16:18] <Noqq> !tab
[16:18] <histo> Noqq: then you should be able to resize the partitions
[16:19] <syockit> Noqq: hmm, on jaunty live, I assume? strange if it won't allow ntfs enlarge...
[16:19] <Noqq> histo: Somehow I can't. I shrinked one disk, that unallocated space I want to be added to C:\.
[16:19] <histo> Noqq: then you would have to expand the parittion to use the unallocated space
[16:19] <Tecna1> Noqq: If you're running a live cd, then there is no "C:\" nor "D:\"
[16:19] <syockit> Noqq: btw, where is the unallocated space located? between C: and D:, or after D:?
[16:19] <Tecna1> I call troll.
[16:19] <histo> Tecna1: there is if he's resizing ntfs
[16:19] <Noqq> After D:\
[16:19] <histo> or fat32
[16:20] <syockit> Noqq: then you have to move the partition. i don't remember if there is an option to move...
[16:20] <histo> Noqq: resize the C: and expand it to use the remaining free space.
[16:20] <Noqq> Tecna1: It's right in front of me. 2 NTFS drives. C:\ and D:\.
[16:20] <sdg> syockit: It complains with "missing operating system" :(
[16:21] <Tecna1> besides, why do you have an NTFS where you're preparing to install Ubuntu?
[16:21] <Noqq> Tecna1: Because I havn't done anything yet. I needed help, so I joined this channel.
[16:21] <syockit> sdg: what, how? what did you install/uninstall? did you make sure aptitude doesn't complain of any breakage?
[16:21] <Noqq> Tecna1: I first want the resizing done, then I format the D:\ to get Ubuntu on it.
[16:22] <sdg> syockit: It won't boot.
[16:22] <Tecna1> Noqq: alright... then lets start from the begining...
[16:22] <Noqq> Tecna1: Thanks.
[16:22] <Tecna1> Noqq: is "D:\" empty, or at least backed up?
[16:22] <Noqq> Tecna1: All empty.
[16:22] <Tecna1> Noqq: Delete it
[16:23] <syockit> sdg: that's very bad indeed. Probably it removed the most essential packages for booting. you have to use live cd for repairing... lots of chrooting
[16:23] <Noqq> Tecna1: Delete? Hm.. u sure?
[16:23] <sdg> syockit: The USB won't boot.
[16:23] <sdg> syockit: So it won't install.
[16:23] <Noqq> Tecna1: Don't get me wrong, I trust you.
[16:23] <syockit> sdg: eh?
[16:23] <syockit> sdg: oh, you're the one with the netboot...
[16:24] <Tecna1> Noqq: If it's empty, then it's just getting in the way while you modify C:\
[16:24] <sdg> syockit: Yes.
[16:24] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok, lemme delete it.
[16:25] <Noqq> Tecna1: Deleted.
[16:25] <Tecna1> Noqq:  then please verify for me that you're using gparted.  what does your title bar say?
[16:26] <Noqq> Tecna1: /dev/sda - GParted
[16:26] <Tecna1> (if you're not using gparted, the next step can mess things up)
[16:26] <Tecna1> alright.
[16:26] <Noqq> Tecna1: :)
[16:26] <Pici> Noqq: Are you using Jaunty?
[16:27] <Noqq> Pici: Yes, just downloaded the .iso from 9.04, booting right now from usb.
[16:27] <syockit> sdg: I suppose you downloaded mini.iso ?
[16:27] <sdg> syockit: Yes.
[16:27] <Tecna1> Noqq: wait a couple minutes while I load up gparted so I'm not leading blindly
[16:28] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok
[16:28] <spanisheyessmile> hello all
[16:28] <Lasivian> hrrm
[16:28] <Lasivian> I booted and all I see is the background
[16:30] <Tecna1> Noqq: is C:\ at the begining of your drive?
[16:30] <syockit> sdg: it seems over these years netboot has become a bit more complex than the one I used to do. I need to look into it further...
[16:31] <spanisheyessmile> I have a question that someone might have some answers to but I must say firstly that I have only just begun to use linux
[16:31] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ye
[16:31] <Lasivian> hrrm, I have no panels
[16:32] <Lasivian> how can I add a panel to gnome via keyboard
[16:32] <Tecna1> Noqq: select it and choose the resize option
[16:33] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ow hey! Now I can see that the bar can be extended!
[16:34] <Noqq> Tecna1: Now were getting somewhere. I want to have 25gb left on the drive that I'm gonna make for Ubuntu.. so lemme calculate how much I need to put on C:\.
[16:34] <Tecna1> Noqq: that's because you deleted "D:\" which was in the way.
[16:34] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ye, too much partitions probably? However, lemme see how mcuh I need to put on C:\ to let D:\ have 25gb left.
[16:35] <PerryArmstrong> this is my sources.list http://paste.ubuntu.com/154774/  i am not able to upgrade to 9.04 beta version..i get errors from the sources.list... can anyone help
[16:35] <Tecna1> Noqq: when you create a new partition for Ubuntu, It will not be called "D:\"
[16:35] <Tecna1> Calling it that is a habit you need to break.
[16:36] <daveDev>  i am in need to reinstall ubuntu with encrypted hard drive. I'm debating if i should install the release candidate of ubuntu9 or should i just wait till the final release. will i be able to just update automatically when the final release comes out without having to reinstall?
[16:36] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok sorry. :( But it's loading the new drives now. Than I guess it's time to format the new drive we made to .ext3/4?
[16:37] <Tecna1> Noqq: we haven't gotten to the step to create the new drive yet until just now.
[16:37] <Tecna1> did you skip ahead?
[16:37] <charlie-tca> daveDev: If you update jaunty, it will be the same as the final by that time. There is no need to reinstall the final version
[16:37] <daveDev> thanks
[16:38] <PerryArmstrong> this is my sources.list http://paste.ubuntu.com/154774/  i am not able to upgrade to 9.04 beta version..i get errors from the sources.list... can anyone help
[16:38] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ow. I don't know. I filled in the amount I wanted to be added to my Windows drive (wich is now 119gb), now I applied that and got 25gb left of unallocated space.
[16:38] <syockit> PerryArmstrong: can you comment out the lines with deb cdrom (by inserting # at the start of the line) and try sudo apt-get update
[16:39] <daveDev> what would be the best way to encrypt your harddrive with jaunty (with dual booth if possiable). if you could point me to a good thread i'd really appricate it
[16:40] <tedcr> Any help would be appreciated.  I have am having trouble running emacs when I login remotely.  I am getting a message "undefined color: black" (this is true even in the gnome terminal).  I saw some threads referring to this, but I didn't see any work around.
[16:40] <Tecna1> Noqq: now create a new partition in the unallocated space
[16:40] <Raulin> Crap, my laptopfan won't start at all, if I echo 0 > /proc/acpi/fan/FAN0/state the return is "ACPI: Device does not support D1"
[16:40] <Tecna1> DON'T format to NTFS
[16:40] <syockit> tedcr: is it in the list of known bugs (on launchpad)?
[16:41] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ye, I'm in the partition menu now.
[16:41] <Tecna1> Noqq: format it to ext3
[16:42] <tedcr> syockit: I am not sure--but there were related issues with x that were listed there
[16:43] <Tecna1> ext4 is not yet completely stable in jaunty, but will be in the final release 3 days from now.  you should be able to convert after updating
[16:43] <Noqq> Tecna1: Will it be a primary partition? And what do fill in at the 'Following MiBs', 'MiBs Used', 'Precending MiBs'?
[16:44] <Tecna1> Noqq: make it primary, and leave "Following MiBs" at "0" and "MiBs Used" at maximum
[16:45] <Noqq> Tecna1: It's now set at: 0 preceding space, 25002 new space, 0 free space following
[16:45] <tedcr> syockit: it is bug #358678
[16:45] <Lasivian> what files do I pull from my old backup to make the gnome desktop look like it used to?
[16:46] <Noqq> Tecna1: Do I need to label it?
[16:46] <Tecna1> Noqq: after creating the partition, format it to ext3 and then continue with your install.  I suspect you'll have some questions about that, so feel free to ask when you get to it.
[16:46] <Tecna1> Noqq: labeling is a good idea
[16:46] <Tecna1> make it unique
[16:46] <spanisheyessmile> sorry, I have a complicated question and it is probably far out of my knowledge so I will need newbie step by step
[16:46] <Tecna1> Noqq: I suggest "Jaunty"
[16:46] <Noqq> Tecna1: Call it something like Udrive (ubuntu-drive) is something normal?
[16:47] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok, I know what you mean.
[16:47]  * Lasivian grovels
[16:47] <mbeierl> spanisheyessmile: !ask
[16:47] <mbeierl> !asl
[16:47] <mbeierl> !ask
[16:47] <Lasivian> I can;t do anything, my desktop is totally blank after I installed Jaunty
[16:48] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok! It's made, starting up installation.
[16:50] <spanisheyessmile> ok, I am running a dual boot system with windows vista and ubuntu. I had no problem the first time I used ubuntu with my wireless card (atheros 5007eg) and the internet worked perfectly but when I went to use it again, it does not connect to internet at all
[16:50] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok, I'm partition part of installation. Now I just highlight the Jaunty I made, and click Forward?
[16:50] <DASPRiD> Lasivian, gtweakui (install if required) -> system -> preferences -> gtweakui - nautilus -> use nautilus to show desktop
[16:50] <DASPRiD> something like that
[16:50] <Tecna1> Noqq: no.  hold on
[16:50] <Lasivian> dashua: I have no panel, so no menus :P
[16:51] <Tecna1> Noqq: it should say something about manual partitioning somewhere
[16:51] <Lasivian> just a blank desktop and a terminal window
[16:51]  * Lasivian sighs
[16:52] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ye, I knew about that option. I'm in the Advanced section, to choose a partition manually.
[16:52] <Tecna1> yes, choose manual.
[16:52] <Tecna1> oh jeeze... we forgot one thing
[16:53] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ye?
[16:53] <Tecna1> Noqq: go back to gparted
[16:53] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok, abort installation I assume?
[16:53] <Tecna1> yes
[16:53] <Tecna1> Noqq: how much RAM do you have?
[16:53] <Noqq> Tecna1: And don't worry mate, youre great help.
[16:53] <Noqq> Tecna1: Only 1gb of RAM, it's on a netbook.
[16:54] <mbeierl> spanisheyessmile: sorry, I am not an expert in the atheros cards
[16:54] <mbeierl> can anyone here help out?
[16:54] <mbeierl> !atheros
[16:54] <Tecna1> Noqq: use gparted to shrink your windows partition by 2 gb
[16:54] <Tecna1> wait
[16:54] <wirechief> spanisheyessmile: i would try useing dhclient eth1 or eth0  and see what happens
[16:54] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok
[16:55] <Tecna1> yeah, shrink it 2 gb
[16:55] <wirechief> spanisheyessmile: but do read the WifiDocs  they are a good read.
[16:55] <spanisheyessmile> wirechief:aren't those for ethernet?? thanks mbeirel and I will look at that ubottu
[16:55] <Tecna1> Noqq: then create a partition in there and format it to linux swap
[16:56] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok, got 2gb of unallocated space again.
[16:56] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok.
[16:56]  * Lasivian finally figures out what can be done
[16:56] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: really?
[16:56] <Noqq> Tecna1: Aaaw damn.. the same error again. Not more than 4 partitions.
[16:56] <wirechief> spanisheyessmile: sometimes it wireless needs a kick ....but read the docs
[16:57] <Tecna1> Noqq: that's weird.  do you have other partitions?
[16:57] <spanisheyessmile> wirechief: I am going to read those but I am so new to ubuntu that sometimes it is like reading french
[16:58] <wirechief> spanisheyessmile: well the command i gave you will give more information about what is going on with your wifi too.
[16:58] <Tecna1> Noqq: what are your other partitions?
[16:58] <wirechief> spanisheyessmile: i suspect your essid is not known and it gives up trying to find it.
[16:58] <Noqq> tecna1: one with 41mb, and some Unknown one.
[16:59] <wirechief> spanisheyessmile: i right click the network icon next to the time and see if it needs it
[16:59] <Noqq> Tecna1: a FAT32 one with 5gbs and a Unknown one with 41mb.
[16:59] <Noqq> Tecna1: And then you got the the main one with windows, and the one we made for ubuntu.
[17:00] <PerryArmstrong> syockit; while upgrading i get an error that some third party sources have not been found...any idea about that
[17:00] <Tecna1> Noqq: this is why I hate preconfigured machines
[17:00] <wirechief> Tecna1: might be a recovery partition for his EE
[17:00] <spanisheyessmile> wirechief:I am assuming iwconfig???
[17:00] <Tecna1> wirechief: I know
[17:00] <Lasivian> shadeslayer: well, I was stuck at a desktop with no panels, so I was just a tad stuck :P
[17:00] <Tecna1> Noqq: I know a way around that
[17:00] <Noqq> wirechief: Ye, someone said something like that before. But I don't know if it's safe to delete it.
[17:01] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: not even alt+F2?
[17:01] <Lasivian> now, let's see if it works
[17:01] <wirechief> Nogg i wouldnt unless i had it fully backed up.
[17:01] <shadeslayer> wirechief: it might be a EISA partition
[17:01] <Tecna1> Noqq: grow your ext3 partition to fill your unallocated space
[17:01] <Lasivian> shadeslayer: I got a terminal window up and copied the .gconf .gconfd and .gnome2 from my backup disk
[17:01] <wirechief> spanisheyessmile: sure you can do that in a terminal ifconfig  and see if you have a ip and a essid
[17:02] <Tecna1> guys, I got this.  I'm just going to have him set up a swap file
[17:02] <shadeslayer> heh,fancy,i would have simply deleted them and let gnome make new ones instead
[17:02] <Noqq> Tecna1: So back to what we first made?
[17:02] <Tecna1> Noqq: no
[17:02] <Lasivian> shadeslayer: alt-f2 ran things, but it's a tad hard to fix gnome from commandline :P
[17:02] <BluesKaj> Howdy
[17:02] <Tecna1> Noqq: the result needs to be 2gb extra space on the ext3 partition
[17:02] <mkulke> hello, i just updated to the rc, and everything seems quite ok, but alt-f2 isn't working any more
[17:02] <Tecna1> oh crap
[17:03] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: true,but not if you know which keys to press ;)
[17:03] <wirechief> shadeslayer: im not familar with EE system pc's and their partitioning  might be a question for google ;)
[17:03] <Tecna1> I have to leave in a few minutes
[17:03] <ienorand> mkulke: for gnome-run?
[17:03] <PerryArmstrong> while upgrading i get an error that some third party sources have not been found...any idea about that
[17:03] <Lasivian> shadeslayer: well I do not :)
[17:03] <Noqq> Tecna1: Ok. :(  Anyoneway, I now got the 25gb .ext3 drive again.
[17:03] <mkulke> ienorand: well for the dialog, where i can enter a line
[17:03] <Noqq> Anyhow*
[17:03] <Tecna1> Noqq: I'm going to PM the rest of the instructions
[17:03] <mkulke> probably gnome-run
[17:03] <Noqq> Tecna1: good, thanks
[17:03] <Lasivian> and it seems moving conf files failed too
[17:04] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: well alt+F2 is a handy command to learn and i have a keybinding to start a terminal too :P
[17:04] <ienorand> mkulke: Try looking at keyboard shortcuts and see if it's set to something else/blanked.
[17:04] <Lasivian> it's not saving my gnome config when I exit
[17:04] <ienorand> By the way... There is no default keycombo to opent terminal is there?
[17:05] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: i mean using : rm -rf .gnome .gnome2 .gconf .gconfd .metacity to reset everything in gnome
[17:05] <mkulke> ienorand: it says: "show the panels run dialog box" on Alt-F2 :/
[17:05] <shadeslayer> ienorand: not that i know of,its disabled from start
[17:05] <Lasivian> shadeslayer: there was a .gnome2 but no .gnome
[17:05] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: that command takes care of everything
[17:06] <shadeslayer> for me that is,it resets everything in gnome
[17:06] <Lasivian> no, I want to move my gnome settings from my backup before I upgraded
[17:06] <Lasivian> and there is no default session file in gnome under 9.04 either
[17:06] <ienorand> shadeslayer: it annoys me greatly, since every livecd I get on has no keycombo for terminal...
[17:06] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: oh ok,no idea then
[17:06] <wirechief> ienorand:  you can use alt f2 then ask for xterm ;)
[17:06] <shadeslayer> ienorand: join the group
[17:06] <mkulke> is this alt-f2 happening to other users?
[17:07] <shadeslayer> use ctrl+alt+F1 for the biggest terminal
[17:07] <mkulke> or not happening rather :/
[17:07] <wirechief> mkulke: it works here..
[17:07] <PerryArmstrong> while upgrading i get an error that some third party sources have not been found...any idea about that
[17:08] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: btw what did you do to start up ubuntu on that mini?
[17:08] <Lasivian> shadeslayer: burned a cd
[17:08] <shadeslayer> Lasivian: ah.....what happened to the USB?
[17:09] <PerryArmstrong> while upgrading i get an error that some third party sources have not been found...any idea about that
[17:09] <Lasivian> after I used 8.04 and dd to copy the img to a thumbdrive correctly
[17:09] <Lasivian> which loaded the notebook which I am currently fighting
[17:09] <ienorand> shadeslayer: Yea, true, but it's not very handy, really :)
[17:09] <Lasivian> am I finally past the newbie stage? heh
[17:09] <PerryArmstrong> can anyone help with upgrading to jaunty
[17:09] <shadeslayer> ienorand: i didnt say it was handy :P
[17:10] <wirechief> seems that usb-creator has been fixed with latest daily-build
[17:10] <shadeslayer> PerryArmstrong: please be patient
[17:10] <hallowname> PerryArmstrong: some repos you had added dont have jaunty repos yet i guess.. wait. or turn them off until after the upgrade.
[17:11] <BluesKaj> !pure gnome
[17:11] <ikonia> PerryArmstrong: if you read the upgrade notes you'd see it tell syou to disable 3rd party repos - how can you expect 3rd party packages to have active repo's for an OS that is not yet released
[17:11] <PerryArmstrong> hallowname; i think its with my settings or sources.list.. canyou check it at http://paste.ubuntu.com/154774/
[17:11] <ikonia> PerryArmstrong: it's nothing to do with your settings -
[17:12] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; so what hallowname has said is the thing??
[17:13] <ikonia> PerryArmstrong: pretty much - it's detailed in the upgrade notes
[17:13] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; thanks... and to you too hallowname
[17:15] <deany> if im wantin to play a 3d game (ut2004) in jaunty with an ati chipset that ati now deems obselete (argh), is there any point me upgrading or just stayin on intrepid with ati 9.3, or will there be a working fglrx?
[17:19] <JustinJoseph> Challenge Me - http://justinjg.mybrute.com :p
[17:20] <xnguard> Can anyone comment on the progress of getting #297213 resolved, or tell me what I can do to work around it in the meantime?
[17:21] <ikonia> xnguard: wait for the bug to be resolved, updates will appear in the bug report
[17:23] <xnguard> ikonia: It's been open kind of a long time now, and it sounds like a real simple fix.  But it still hasn't been touched, and I assume Jaunty GA's going to happen in the next week or so.
[17:23] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; the exact error is third party sources disabled...and it asks me to enable it
[17:23] <ikonia> PerryArmstrong: I've explained the issue
[17:23] <ikonia> PerryArmstrong: and explained where it is detailed/explained
[17:23] <ikonia> xnguard: contact the person the bug is assigned to
[17:24] <ikonia> xnguard: or post for an update in the bug report
[17:24] <xnguard> ikonia: There's still no one assigned, and the last person to attempt to contact anyone involved was ignored.
[17:24] <xnguard> All right.
[17:25] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; okk
[17:25] <cwillu> !328442
[17:25] <cwillu> bug 328442
[17:25] <marcusdavidus> hello
[17:26] <marcusdavidus>  anyone make upgrade from intrepid to rc jaunty ?
[17:26] <marcusdavidus> and dont destroy system
[17:26] <ikonia> !upgrade > marcusdavidus
[17:26] <Noqq> !upgrade > Noq
[17:26] <Noqq> !upgrade > Noqq
[17:26] <KyleK> does thenetbook remix support ext4?
[17:27] <ikonia> KyleK: same as 9.04
[17:28] <marcusdavidus> this gimme nothing imho ikonia im not so n00b to dont restand how it works etc im asking is anyone DID that
[17:29] <ikonia> marcusdavidus: if you are unable to read the instructions I suggest you don't upgrade as it will be too much of a risk using a beta product
[17:29] <marcusdavidus> ikonia im using GENTOO im think im pro im not ask aboute using of beta etc im asking is anyone actually make upgrade to new rc jaunty without problems is so hard to say yes or no jesus
[17:30] <ikonia> marcusdavidus: how can you be a pro - you've just called yourself a n00b
[17:30] <marcusdavidus> i called myslef not so n00b
[17:30] <ikonia> oh, I see
[17:30] <ikonia> marcusdavidus: well read the instructions, it explains how it works
[17:30] <marcusdavidus>  only idiot thinks hes ot n00b no one know everything
[17:31] <ikonia> marcusdavidus: thre are also some interesting reading in the /topic
[17:31] <canen> anyone here experiencing random X crashes using the opensource ati drivers?
[17:32] <ikonia> canen: most people I've seen have had positive things to say about them, however I suspect the card specifics have a lot to do with the stability
[17:32] <marcusdavidus> canen with flash on ?
[17:32] <canen> it goes to the login scree and when logging in i see a brief glimpse of the screen the way it was before it crashed
[17:32] <canen> marcusdavidus: doesn't matter
[17:32] <canen> just crashes randomly
[17:32] <canen> let me put the backtrace somewhere
[17:33] <marcusdavidus> canen:  ati drivers open or closed are hmm obpos
[17:33] <marcusdavidus> obpos > one big piece of sh***
[17:34] <canen> yeah, i know
[17:34] <ikonia> marcusdavidus: please conrol your language
[17:34] <canen> but i can't help it
[17:34] <marcusdavidus> hmm 1 h 35 m to reconnig lets pray to succefull upgrade kids
[17:34] <ikonia> marcusdavidus: if you can't say it without swearing - don't say it please.
[17:34] <canen> http://pastebin.com/m39c8ca0e Xorg.0.log.old
[17:34] <marcusdavidus> ikonia:  wtf is with u u act like 40 years old mac user
[17:36] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; any idea about this http://paste.ubuntu.com/154806/   i didnt find a solution to this is the upgrade manual
[17:37] <canen> any pointers on the X error?
[17:37] <canen> really hard to test
[17:38] <ikonia> PerryArmstrong: don't think there is a backports / proposed repos on that server
[17:38] <ikonia> PerryArmstrong: disable the reops, try again
[17:39] <wirechief> canen https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Backtrace
[17:40] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; reops??
[17:40] <ikonia> repo's sorry
[17:40] <canen> wirechief: the log includes a backtrace by default
[17:40] <wirechief> canen also use RSEIUB if you freeze completely and lock
[17:40] <canen> it doesn't freeze, just restarts
[17:40] <wirechief> canen am looking for another wiki for freeze s brb
[17:41] <phoenixz> Hi there, since the last update of Kubuntu9.04 beta, I have various issues, X won't start normal anymore (complaining about config), sudden computer freezes (only mouse responds), large X CPU usage (>30 percent on average), huge Quassel CPU usage (>60% on average) etc... Anybody here who might know something about these issues?
[17:41] <wirechief> canen oh ok
[17:42] <wirechief> canen do you want to chat in inquery ?
[17:42] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; how do i disab;e the repos??
[17:42] <canen> you mean /msg?
[17:42] <PerryArmstrong> ikonia; how do i *disable the repos??
[17:43] <wirechief> canen see my query box
[17:43] <wirechief> canen see my query tab
[17:43] <canen> nope, hold on
[17:43] <wirechief> canen you might need to be registered ;)
[17:44] <canen> i am registered
[17:45] <BluesKaj> PerryArmstrong, why do want to disable the repos ?
[17:46] <PerryArmstrong> BlusKaj; i get this error while upgrading to 9.04 http://paste.ubuntu.com/154806/  i have commented the backports after pasting this error...
[17:47] <PerryArmstrong> BluesKaj; i get this error while upgrading to 9.04 http://paste.ubuntu.com/154806/  i have commented the backports after pasting this error...
[17:49] <yow|x2> anyone have a solution for the intel video card driver freezing? It's driving me nuts (especially since it was fixed a few package releases back)
[17:55] <BluesKaj> PerryArmstrong, those are the wrong repos ...dunno where you got them but , this is my sources.list and it works . Maybe you should copy and paste it into yours. http://paste.ubuntu.com/154814/
[17:56] <PerryArmstrong> BluesKaj; are you sure that your code will work even for mine
[17:56] <BluesKaj> delete the text in yours , it's all off the main server , no locales to interfere
[17:58] <BluesKaj> our servers here are so slow i don't bother witrh them, hence the "main"
[17:58] <PerryArmstrong> Blueskaj; okk so i'll delete the whole text and place yours....will this be safe
[17:59] <BluesKaj> yes, it's std stuff
[17:59] <GrimmVarg> hi guys, Im  trying to install ubuntu 9.04-64bit on my macbook pro. But now for the second time it has stoppet at a fatal error trying to install grub.. on /dev/sda3, has anybody experienced this before?
[18:00] <CrocoJet> I am getting this message when trying to print "unable to open the initial device, quiting". Any idea to solve this problem ?
[18:03] <PerryArmstrong> Blueskaj; thansk
[18:03] <PerryArmstrong> thanks
[18:26] <SuperQ> While testing Jaunty on my machine I had a frequent random graphics driver lockups with the free NV driver
[18:26] <SuperQ> I booted to single user and installed the nvidia binary driver, no more crashes
[18:29] <mirco0> hat einer erfahrung mit dem soundsystem unter Ubu 9.04? bekomme ums verecken keinen 5.1 sound (bass/center). auch das umstellen auf 6 channels in der /etc/pulse/daemon.conf wie unter 8.1 funzt nicht. der alsa soundcheck in der bash erkennt aber alles.... alsa mixer zeigt nur stereo regler.......
[18:33] <zash_> why is tor not in repos?
[18:39] <cwillu> zash_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/328442
[18:39] <cwillu> zash_, feel free to complain there
[18:39] <zash_> cwillu: thanks
[18:39] <cwillu> zash_, it's marked as "Fix Released" for jaunty, which is... special...
[18:39] <wirechief> cwillu no crash running the test script for 45 min
[18:41] <cwillu> wirechief, fancy :)
[18:41] <wirechief> cwillu amazing the first time i ran it , it crashed immediately
[18:42]  * wirechief has bug net in hand
[18:43] <deany> Am i gonna be able to play 3D games in jaunty with my, now unsupported ati 9800?  or is open source good enough to play ut2004
[18:45] <wirechief> deany ask in #phoronix  someone there might know
[18:46] <Twigathy> What on earth is pulseaudio doing chewing up 1/3rd of a CPU!?
[18:47] <Twigathy> (vlc using alsa output (pulse out just freezes vlc :|) + ubuntu+1)
[18:52]  * deany would like to buy a time machine to stop himself buying ati bs 6 yrs ago
[18:54] <jchamm> Hi. I need python2.4-imaging for Plone/Zope but there is no installation candidate? :(
[18:54] <jchamm> Other than that, I love Jaunty!
[18:54] <jchamm> Jaded Jackass would have been a good name too, though.
[19:02] <logophobia> hi, I was wondering. I have a setup with an encrypted HD with cryptsetup/LUKS. I just upgraded, it works almost perfectly. The only issue is that, after I typed my password it gets echod plain text to the console, this didn't happen before. I wonder if this is a security issue?
[19:05] <mbeierl> !de | mirco0
[19:06] <j00bar> howdy -- i've seen a lot of posts regarding it but no solutions yet -- are problems with ath9k just crapping out after several minutes on jaunty as widespread as it seems?
[19:07] <j00bar> i said 9k i meant 5k
[19:10] <pucko-> Hello. Since I upgraded to jaunty beta, I cannot print anything. how would one troubleshoot printing?
[19:10] <j00bar> pucko: contents of /var/log/cups/
[19:12] <pucko-> ah
[19:13] <pucko-> not very helpful message: "SpliX Invalid PPD file version: SpliX V. 2.0.0 but the PPD file is designedfor SpliX V. 2.0.0"
[19:13] <Pici> heh
[19:14] <pucko-> but now that I know what I'm looking for I think I found the relevant bug reports...
[19:16] <archivator> Is it just my configuration or is it by design that the "Device is safe to remove" dialog is no longer a notification?
[19:16] <awkorama> anybody know something about the press conference with mark shuttleworth today?
[19:17] <dust> hello, why can't i hear surround in "just only vlc" no other audio/movie players work surround
[19:18] <dust> cat .asoundrc
[19:18] <dust> i modified that so i got vlc working surroundly
[19:18] <dust> did i miss something?
[19:21] <xb414>  Hello everybody, i just install ubuntu 9.04 on my desktop, but i didn't get the resolution i had under windows (1440x900), can only choose between 4 resolutions ("1280x1024" "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480") --- http://pastebin.com/m63758de2
[19:22] <a931bw> Is there way to get early beta?
[19:22] <Pici> a931bw: See topic, we are on the RC now.
[19:25] <Dougshell> hey guys...the repos that are disabled in the jaunty upgrade will then reenable themselves when the time is right, or do i have to manauly do that
[19:27] <hallowname> Dougshell: manually :) u added the repos.
[19:28] <Dougshell> well i mean there already there...
[19:28] <Dougshell> but they ust say disabled on upgrade to jaunty
[19:28] <ikus060> Hi, I'm using Jaunty with ext4 and i'm looking for a way to 'ghost' my disk. Anybody have a solution ?
[19:29] <Dougshell> ghost?
[19:29] <hallowname> Dougshell: yea, bc there is no jaunty repo for them yet. dont want intrepid packages in ur jaunty install, lol
[19:29] <deany> clonezilla, but make sure its experimental version, for ext4
[19:29] <hallowname> ikus060: backup? i use mksquashfs. and rsync sometimes.
[19:29] <Dougshell> so once the software has a jaunty repo then that will go away on it sokwn
[19:29] <ikus060> wep, ghost. you don't know ghost ? it's a Disk cloning
[19:30] <Dougshell> ok i just use dd if/then
[19:30] <Dougshell> er if/of
[19:30] <ikus060> hallowname: it's not for backup. I want to change my hdd (from a 80gig to a 250Gig)
[19:30] <Dougshell> dude use if/of then resize patition
[19:31] <neorab> If I were to install the RC, will it update to the release (provided I don't do much with it) when it comes or would I have to fiddle around with setting repos and what-not?
[19:31] <ikus060> Dougshell: well .. isn't there any 'user friendly' application to do it ? I'm not really into dd, if, of ..
[19:32] <Pici> !final | neorab
[19:32] <xb414> Hello everybody, i just install ubuntu 9.04 on my desktop, but i didn't get the resolution i had under windows (1440x900), i can only choose between 4 resolutions ("1280x1024" "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480") --- http://pastebin.com/m63758de2
[19:32] <nemo> xb414: your other resolution does seem non-standard
[19:32] <lymeca> Hey, are there the 4 other repos for jaunty yet?
[19:32] <ikus060> exept if there isn't any other solution
[19:32] <Pici> neorab: i.e: yes, it will just update to release.
[19:32] <nemo> xb414: do you use dual monitors?
[19:32] <neorab> thank you
[19:32] <Pici> lymeca: other 4?
[19:32] <xb414> yes
[19:32] <lymeca> jaunty-proposed, jaunty-backports, jaunty-security, and jaunty-updates
[19:32] <php_penguin> Hi, I'm using a fully updated version of 9.04 on amd64 and my processor usage is idling at about 50-55%. there are no programs using anything like that in the system monitor, and the sum of all processes isnt even close to that. is this a common/known problem, any solutions?
[19:32] <Pici> lymeca: I believe so, I'm not on my Jaunty system to check though.
[19:33] <deany> ikus060, http://clonezilla.org/download/sourceforge/experimental/iso-zip-files.php
[19:33] <nemo> xb414: try plugging in the second monitor and firing up System->Administration->Screen Resolution
[19:33] <nemo> xb414: it'll probably add the virtual screen size necessary
[19:33] <nemo> assuming your driver supports
[19:33] <Dougshell> its very user friendly
[19:33] <Dougshell> do a dd then output to a sr1 error
[19:33] <deany> use it via usb boot for both my laptops
[19:34] <nemo> xb414: personally I had the problem that with the virtual screen size, my stupid stupid intel card had horrible performance - couldn't handle the doubling of screen space :-/
[19:34] <Dougshell> it will take like an hour tops
[19:34] <xb414> :s sis's stupid too
[19:35] <nemo> xb414: also.  since I do some dev on hedgewars, we had a user offer this info on setting monitor resolutions manually if gnome doesn't do it for you
[19:35] <nemo> http://hedgewars.org/faq.html#n1304
[19:35] <nemo> xb414: FWIW
[19:35] <nemo> xb414: it should be automatic though
[19:36] <xb414> thx man ;)
[19:36] <a931bw> Shiz i'll better wait becausei wana direct update
[19:37] <php_penguin> Yes, I know, doublepost very naughty, but this is getting annoying: Hi, I'm using a fully updated version of 9.04 on amd64 and my processor usage is idling at about 50-55%. there are no programs using anything like that in the system monitor, and the sum of all processes isnt even close to that. is this a common/known problem, any solutions?
[19:38] <dust> can someone tell me how to enable surrround to banshee/xine/rythmbox
[19:38] <dust> vlc has only surround, i edited a file .asoundrc or something.
[19:39] <Roberth1> hello, uhm I have a pulseaudio issue, I got no sound and pulseaudio volume control shows that pulseaudio is using null
[19:39] <archivator> php_penguin: what about console tools (e.g., top)? Gnome System Monitor can be confusing at times..
[19:39] <php_penguin> archivator: already tried, gnoem system monitor shows the same results at top and ps
[19:39] <php_penguin> top is shoinwg Xorg at 10% as the highest
[19:40] <archivator> How do you get that 50% figure then?
[19:40] <php_penguin> the system monitor panel app
[19:40] <cwillu> php_penguin, what does top show for sys and wait?
[19:41] <php_penguin> 21.1% sy, 0.0%wa
[19:41] <andresmh> since a few updates ago my Jaunty machine graphics feel sluggish.
[19:41] <andresmh> with or without compiz
[19:41] <andresmh> ugh
[19:42] <kernco> flashplugin-nonfree has been a blocked update for a week now.  Is there a reason to not install this update?
[19:43] <cwillu> php_penguin, and user%?
[19:43] <php_penguin> 35% ish
[19:43] <php_penguin> those numbers add up I suppose
[19:43] <cwillu> so there's your 50% :)
[19:43] <cwillu> what's the process using 35% ish?
[19:44] <php_penguin> xorg is using the most, between 10 and 15 avg
[19:44] <php_penguin> everything below that is < 5%
[19:44] <cwillu> is there any animation showing right now?
[19:44] <php_penguin> nope
[19:44] <cwillu> close the process monitor (not top) if it's open
[19:44] <php_penguin> its shut
[19:44] <php_penguin> but the panel app is open
[19:44] <cwillu> any flash open?
[19:44] <cwillu> hmm
[19:44] <php_penguin> no flash
[19:44] <cwillu> try removing that applet temporarily
[19:44] <php_penguin> removed
[19:45] <php_penguin> xorg still at 10-15, 35%us, 19.7%sy
[19:45] <cwillu> what video chipset?
[19:45] <php_penguin> nvidia onboard
[19:45] <archivator> php_penguin: Are you running compiz? Also, are you using any wm other than metacity?
[19:45] <php_penguin> I am using the Dust theme
[19:45] <php_penguin> and yes, effects are on normal
[19:46] <archivator> Try disabling them.
[19:46] <php_penguin> but, my CPU usage was averaging maybe 5% under 8.10
[19:46] <php_penguin> and 8.04
[19:46] <php_penguin> and 7.10
[19:46] <php_penguin> with effects, and dust since 8.10
[19:46] <cwillu> php_penguin, that's nice.  Try disabling them.
[19:46] <cwillu> php_penguin, still need to know if it's compiz that has the new issue or not :p
[19:47] <php_penguin> using human and no effffects
[19:47] <cwillu> php_penguin, normal == compiz
[19:47] <php_penguin> yes, i know
[19:47] <cwillu> needs to be none to disable compiz
[19:47] <cwillu> okay
[19:47] <php_penguin> and its now on "none"
[19:47] <php_penguin> xorg at 9%
[19:47] <php_penguin> 34.2%us, 20.3%sy
[19:48] <cwillu> php_penguin, can you upload a screenshot to imgur?
[19:48] <php_penguin> i'll upload to my own server, quicker
[19:48] <cwillu> k
[19:48] <archivator> php_penguin: out of curiosity, what's the load average?
[19:48] <php_penguin> http://richardlyon.co.uk/uploadr/uploads/ubuntu-test.png
[19:49] <andresmh> is human less CPU intensive than other themes?!
[19:49] <php_penguin> archivator - find out by uptime?
[19:49] <php_penguin> andresmh - just the default theme so most tested
[19:49] <archivator> nah, top has it.
[19:49] <cwillu> andresmh, not really
[19:49] <php_penguin> so it does
[19:49] <php_penguin> 2.69, 2.96, 2.85
[19:50] <andresmh> i hate how after a few weeks of using Ubuntu I always feel the graphics sluggier
[19:50]  * cwillu pokes BUGabundo with a stick
[19:51] <BluesKaj> andresmh, could be the powernowd/cpu power saver app at work
[19:52] <andresmh> BluesKaj, how do I check that? I'm not running with batteries.
[19:53] <andresmh> I actually wouldn't mind overclocking my CPU for faster performance as most of the time I am running connected to the AC
[19:53] <BluesKaj> scaling back power so the cpu frq is halved  , cat /proc/cpuinfo | grep MHz
[19:53] <BUGabundo> cwillu poing back
[19:54] <dust> Roberth1: there?
[19:54]  * BUGabundo confesses this is one of the nicest releases ever, but is a bit buggy!
[19:54] <andresmh> cpuinfo says I'm 800Mhz
[19:54] <cwillu> BUGabundo, just means 9.10 will be nice :)
[19:54] <cwillu> feisty was like that too
[19:54] <andresmh> how can I increase the cpu MHz BluesKaj ?
[19:55] <BUGabundo> eeh
[19:55] <BUGabundo> cwillu everyone always thinks that current is worse then previous
[19:56] <BUGabundo> but general view, testers are reporting jaunty better the ibex.... just a bit of GPU buggy
[19:56] <php_penguin> BUGabundo: I'm pretty sure someone did a comparison and found that the releases have been getting slower
[19:56] <BUGabundo> luckly most audio bugs are iron out
[19:56] <BUGabundo> php_penguin: I don't feel that
[19:57] <cwillu> php_penguin, compiz is actually a huge perceived performance win, as means applications don't have to redraw on every expose event
[19:57] <andresmh> I do feel things are slower
[19:57] <BUGabundo> and have had many other users telling me the same: jaunty is faster, even on older HW
[19:57] <php_penguin> BUGabundo: I couldn't say for sure seeing as I started off with 7.04 on a laptop after moving from Fedora and then 8.04 on this desktop
[19:58] <php_penguin> BUGabundo: and I am using Ext4 on the system partition of this system now, and boot times are up by around 10 seconds on all 3 computers
[19:58] <php_penguin> sorry, I mean they are faster by 10 seconds
[19:58] <BluesKaj> andresmh, install cpufreq-utils and cpufreqd
[19:58] <BUGabundo> hehe
[19:58] <BUGabundo> boots of 10 secs would be nice
[19:58] <php_penguin> BUGbaundo: this machine boots in 30, from power button Firefox
[19:59] <andresmh> BluesKaj, from what I'm reading, cpufreq-utils help you slow down to get more battery life?
[20:00] <cwillu> php_penguin, screenshot still coming?
[20:00] <php_penguin> http://richardlyon.co.uk/uploadr/uploads/ubuntu-test.png
[20:00] <BluesKaj> well. not sure what kind of setup you're using
[20:00] <php_penguin> i posted it ages ago?
[20:00] <cwillu> php_penguin, that'll teach you to not highlight people
[20:00] <BluesKaj> BBl
[20:00]  * cwillu starts hunting for an http://
[20:00] <BUGabundo> php_penguin: can you isntall bootchart and bootchart-java, hack the rc script and post it for us?
[20:01] <php_penguin> if you give me some instructions re hacking the rc script?
[20:01] <BUGabundo> sure
[20:01] <BUGabundo> just add a sleep 60 on line 41
[20:01] <php_penguin> sure
[20:01] <php_penguin> where is this file I am editing?
[20:01] <BUGabundo> file is /etc/rc2.d/S99stop-bootchart
[20:01] <php_penguin> k
[20:02] <php_penguin> richardlyon.co.uk/uploadr/uploads/ubuntu-test.png
[20:02] <BUGabundo> that will make bootchart ONLY stop after gdm
[20:02] <php_penguin> no http ther
[20:02] <php_penguin> okk
[20:02] <cwillu> php_penguin, I'm kinda concerned that x-session-manager, dbus-daemon, gconfd-2 and gnome-settings-daemon are all showing up there
[20:02] <php_penguin> should they not be?
[20:02] <cwillu> actively using cpu time?  no
[20:02] <BUGabundo> php_penguin: don't change like 43... let that sleep be
[20:02] <php_penguin> k
[20:03] <cwillu> they're all daemons, responding to requests, not doing anything at idle
[20:03] <php_penguin> right
[20:03] <php_penguin> this is technically a fresh install last night
[20:03] <php_penguin> although I kept a bunch of stuff from the previous install
[20:03] <php_penguin> only reinstalled cos i borked grub :s
[20:03] <cwillu> php_penguin, you don't have another user logged in do you?
[20:03] <php_penguin> not as far as I know
[20:04] <php_penguin> ok, bootchart installed and file hacked
[20:04] <cwillu> can you put up ~/.xsession-errors?
[20:04] <BUGabundo> php_penguin: when ever you can, please reboot
[20:04] <php_penguin> ok wil do in a sec
[20:04] <BUGabundo> you can also on a 2nd boot profile boot
[20:05] <BUGabundo> and reboot a 3rd time to compare bootcharts
[20:05] <php_penguin> http://richardlyon.co.uk/uploadr/uploads/xsession-errors.txt
[20:05] <php_penguin> gt that link?
[20:06] <cwillu> yep
[20:06] <cwillu> php_penguin, just type cw<tab> on the line and I'll see it
[20:06] <php_penguin> kk
[20:06] <cwillu> php_penguin, another notable thing is that all of those processes are in the hundreds of megs of virtual
[20:06] <php_penguin> which is bad?
[20:06] <cwillu> gnome-panel should not be using 400mb of swap
[20:07] <php_penguin> mhm
[20:07] <cwillu> my desktop's been on for a week, and gnome panel is under 100mb
[20:07]  * BUGabundo checks own for comparion
[20:07] <cwillu> and gnome-settings doesn't even show up on my top sorted by virt
[20:08] <php_penguin> ill reboot, back in a minute - start counting now
[20:08] <BUGabundo> cwillu I have 430 miB in VM for it too
[20:08] <cwillu> ** (vino-server:4439): WARNING **: Remote Desktop server already running; exiting ...
[20:08] <cwillu> you have that over and over again
[20:09] <cwillu> bah, he missed that
[20:09] <cwillu> BUGabundo, check out his xsession
[20:09] <cwillu> near the bottom'ish
[20:09] <cwillu> I think vino-server is getting restarted as fast as it dies
[20:10] <cwillu> causing that load, and potentially exposing a small memory leak
[20:10] <php_penguin> back
[20:10] <cwillu> php_penguin, <cwillu> ** (vino-server:4439): WARNING **: Remote Desktop server already running; exiting ...
 you have that over and over again
[20:10] <php_penguin> yep
[20:10] <sporkboy> just went to jaunty. gps was on /dev/ttyUSB0. no clue where it is now.
[20:11] <cwillu> I think vino-server is getting restarted as fast as it dies, causing that load, and potentially exposing a small memory leak
[20:11] <php_penguin> right
[20:11] <cwillu> php_penguin, you're freshly rebooted?
[20:11] <php_penguin> yep
[20:11] <php_penguin> hard reboot as well
[20:11] <cwillu> php_penguin, does vino-server still show up in top?
[20:11] <php_penguin> as in shutdown, power off, power on
[20:11] <cwillu> and more importantly, does it show up with a changing pid?
[20:11] <php_penguin> yes
[20:11] <php_penguin> and yes
[20:12] <cwillu> there's your problem
[20:12] <php_penguin> its showing in top and the PID is changing
[20:12] <php_penguin> how to resolve then?
[20:12] <cwillu> does the process ring a bell?
[20:12] <php_penguin> nope, I have no clue what it does or why its there
[20:12] <cwillu> have you worked with the gnome vnc server before?
[20:12] <php_penguin> once or twice to view a windows box from afar
[20:12] <cwillu> fresh install, like a wipe and reinstall, right?
[20:12] <cwillu> php_penguin, so not the server then
[20:13] <php_penguin> yes, but I kept most of my folders backed up and reinstated
[20:13] <php_penguin> probably stupidly
[20:13] <cwillu> php_penguin, system | preferences | remote desktop -> is allow other users enabled?
[20:13] <php_penguin> it is
[20:13] <php_penguin> untick?
[20:13] <cwillu> php_penguin, well, not really stupid, it should work, but I think that's probably the cause
[20:13] <cwillu> yes
[20:13] <php_penguin> ahah unticked and proc usage has dropped like a brick
[20:13] <cwillu> okay
[20:14] <cwillu> I'm still curious about something
[20:14] <cwillu> are you behind a firewall?
[20:14] <php_penguin> down to 18%
[20:14] <php_penguin> a router
[20:14] <php_penguin> which has a hardware firewall
[20:14] <cwillu> php_penguin, in a terminal, run ps aux|grep -i vnc
[20:14] <BUGabundo> php_penguin: see /var/log/bootchart/
[20:15] <php_penguin> ok its sayig:
[20:15] <php_penguin> rich      7999  0.0  0.0   7528   920 pts/0    R+   20:14   0:00 grep -i vnc
[20:15] <cwillu> okay, that's fine then
[20:15] <cwillu> php_penguin, can you give me another screenshot of top?
[20:15] <php_penguin> sure
[20:15] <php_penguin> and what am I doing with this bootchart?
[20:15] <php_penguin> upload?
[20:15] <php_penguin> http://richardlyon.co.uk/uploadr/uploads/top2.png
[20:16] <cwillu> php_penguin, yes
[20:16] <php_penguin> got that firs link?
[20:16] <cwillu> php_penguin, you've got some flash open I believe, which is murder on cpu usage :p
[20:16] <cwillu> yep
[20:16] <php_penguin> yes it is... eurogamer ads :@
[20:16] <cwillu> php_penguin, flashblock
[20:16] <php_penguin> http://richardlyon.co.uk/uploadr/uploads/rich-desktop-jaunty-20090420-1.png
[20:17] <marcreichelt> hi there
[20:17] <php_penguin> installing...
[20:17] <php_penguin> thanks for your help guys!
[20:17] <marcreichelt> is Kubuntu 9.04 RC proposed to be final?
[20:17]  * cwillu wins again :)
[20:17]  * BUGabundo pads cwillu back
[20:17] <marcreichelt> because Plasma seems to be _really_ unstable (hanged up 2 times today during normal use), and the translations are ugly
[20:17] <BUGabundo> marcreichelt: what do you mean?
[20:17] <cwillu> php_penguin, if you have any lingering weirdness, make a new user with a nice fresh profile and see if you can duplicate it there
[20:18] <php_penguin> ok (y)
[20:18] <cwillu> marcreichelt, what video chipset?
[20:18] <marcreichelt> Intel
[20:18] <php_penguin> cpu usage now at 0% :D *hugs* for you
[20:18] <cwillu> intel has issues :(
[20:18] <marcreichelt> oh :/
[20:19] <marcreichelt> nice, the best open 3D drivers available at the moment, and than _that_---
[20:19] <cwillu> marcreichelt, yep, I know
[20:19] <BUGabundo> we all know
[20:19] <rom1v> hi
[20:19] <cwillu> marcreichelt, perfect storm of xorg 1.6, intel moving to uxa, and us not getting the debugging tools we needed to fix issues until like 2 weeks ago
[20:19] <BUGabundo> rom1v: hi
[20:19] <rom1v> it seems that there is a critical bug in linux kernel in jaunty since an upgrade between alpha 4 and alpha 6
[20:19] <rom1v> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/350268
[20:20] <cwillu> marcreichelt, pastebin your /var/log/xorg.0.log and /etc/X11/xorg.conf and I'll see if I can point you in a good direction
[20:20] <rom1v> (my last comments)
[20:20] <marcreichelt> cwillu: am I right that this is not going to be fixed during 9.04?
[20:20] <marcreichelt> cwillu: too late, already switched back to my backup of Kubuntu 8.04 :/
[20:20] <marcreichelt> but it also happend on the live cd, maybe I can get you some information later
[20:20] <BUGabundo> rom1v: hum new? lean usually tackles linux bugs quite fast
[20:21] <rom1v> It was modified to "incomplete" since I thought it was an hardware problem
[20:21] <rom1v> but after several people have the same problem, I tested with intrepid
[20:21] <rom1v> and it works !
[20:21] <rom1v> not an hardware problem
[20:21] <cwillu> rom1v, need to give an unabridged syslog
[20:21] <cwillu> the whole thing
[20:22] <rom1v> "unabridged"?
[20:22] <rom1v> (I'm not english)
[20:22] <cwillu> rom1v, the whole thing, not just pieces of it
[20:22] <rom1v> ok, so you want me to reinstall jaunty, then ?
[20:22] <rom1v> attach the whole syslog?
[20:22] <cwillu> rom1v, ...
[20:23] <cwillu> rom1v, a reported bug is almost useless if the reporter isn't around
[20:23] <BUGabundo> dtchen: humm nice cloak
[20:23] <bertodsera> Hi! I was installing nfs and got this: http://pastebin.com/m660104a2 Now dpkg seems to be dead. Is there any way out of this?
[20:24] <cwillu> rom1v, the syslog you posted to the bug is missing alot of vital data
[20:24] <rom1v> cwillu, I just reinstalled intrepid, that's why I have no jaunty anymore, so I will reinstall and attach syslog. other logs are needed?
[20:24] <cwillu> rom1v, leave it as a dual boot if you can afford the space and can't just run jaunty exclusively.
[20:24] <rom1v> no, no problem, I will install a new jaunty
[20:24] <BUGabundo> php_penguin: boot in 18 secs? not bad!
[20:24] <cwillu> rom1v, yes, the output of lspci -vvnn, the contents of /var/log/kern.log, and your /etc/fstab
[20:25] <BUGabundo> and with lot of services
[20:25] <php_penguin> BUGabundo: yep its quite nice
[20:25] <cwillu> rom1v, attach those to the bug report, and ping me
[20:25] <rom1v> ok
[20:25] <BUGabundo> humm php_penguin you run update-notifier
[20:26] <drbobb> has anyone noticed bluetooth working only one way?
[20:26] <php_penguin> BUGabundo: is that bad?
[20:26] <BUGabundo> 55sec until you can use FF and pidgin
[20:26] <cwillu> drbobb, I've never noticed bluetooth working at all :p
[20:26] <BUGabundo> very wellm
[20:26] <BUGabundo> mine take much longer
[20:26] <drbobb> ie. i can download stuff from my phone, but can't upload anything to it
[20:26] <BUGabundo> drbobb: maybe! I ve had trouble 2ways too
[20:26] <drbobb> cwillu: it worked near perfectly in hardy, at least for file exchange with phones
[20:27] <BUGabundo> drbobb: now.. I can upload and download...
[20:27] <BUGabundo> I just can't send from phone to PC
[20:27] <BUGabundo> aka receive
[20:28] <cwillu> BUGabundo, I like that band that is vino-server :)
[20:28] <drbobb> BUGabundo: well that's the function that works just fine for me, both now and in hardy
[20:28] <drbobb> but i can't upload anything at all, it just fails to work, silently
[20:30] <BUGabundo> not me
[20:30] <BUGabundo> so we have oposite limitaions
[20:30] <peace> ath5k suck a lot
[20:31] <drbobb> (and I must say I had much more trouble getting bluetooth to work under windows than under kubuntu hardy)
[20:32] <drbobb> ok I looked up the logs, bluetoothd reports a pin_code_request, but seems unable to find an agent to handle it
[20:32] <drbobb> suggestions?
[20:39] <syke> I don't suppose that gcc-snapshot will be updated to 4.4.0-rc1 before jaunty is released?
[20:48] <dust> i want my surround speakers to work in other applications aswell thanin vlc !!!!
[20:52] <BUGabundo> TIP: if you want to write an .img !ubuntu image to #USB from !windows, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Mobile/HowTo/ImageWriting#Writing%20a%20usb%20image%20in%20Windows
[20:55] <ppd> hi. is there anything known about nautilus freezing when opening just about anything in jaunty RC?
[20:57] <alemani> hello, it seems that after upgrade to 9.04 from 8.10 the system got slower... compiz, gnome-do and etc. htop shows 'normal' behavior...
[20:57] <alemani> does anyone know if the intel video drivers are ready to go?
[20:58] <calc> alemani: read phoronix
[20:58] <calc> alemani: intel decided to break their driver... but there are people working on trying to fix it for Ubuntu
[20:59] <alemani> calc: ouch!
[20:59] <alemani> calc: is't under phoronix forums ?
[21:00] <alemani> *it's
[21:00] <calc> alemani: phoronix has written articles about it several times actually
[21:01] <calc> alemani: comparing old intel driver to the new one, and then with greedy option on the new one enabled as well
[21:01] <icewaterman> jaunty works damn good on amd64
[21:03] <yoasif> icewaterman: how much ram do you have?
[21:03] <icewaterman> yoasif: 4GB and i am planning to expand it
[21:03] <icewaterman> plus i do a lot of scientific computing
[21:04] <yoasif> ah nice... only 4gb here so i'm still on 32 :)
[21:04] <icewaterman> its about 25% faster with my cpu on amd64
[21:04] <yoasif> nice :)
[21:04] <yoasif> whaaaaaat
[21:04] <yoasif> where are you getting that stat
[21:04] <calc> yoasif: 64bit could potentially buy you up to 1GB of usable ram if you already have 4GB on it
[21:04] <icewaterman> yoasif: i wrote a program for scientific purposes and benchmarked it
[21:04] <calc> and yes amd64 is faster as well on certain applications
[21:04] <calc> since amd64 arch has many more usable registers than ia32
[21:05] <yoasif> calc: how about speed? i read that /most/ apps won't see a speedup, and can even see a slowdown
[21:05] <calc> yoasif: the number that slow down is probably much less than the number that speed up
[21:05] <calc> aiui the normal speed up is ~ 10-15% averaged across apps
[21:06] <icewaterman> calc: besides, it does no longer hurt to use amd64 distro, flash, java-plugin all available
[21:06] <Tecna> umm...
[21:06] <yoasif> eh maybe i'll give it a shot for karmic once the toolchain goes live
[21:06] <Tecna> I'm having problems unmounting my drives again
[21:07] <yoasif> is flash64 in the repos yet?
[21:07] <Tecna> $ sudo fuser -k /media/Storage
[21:07] <Tecna> Cannot stat /media/Storage: Transport endpoint is not connected
[21:07] <Tecna> I can't even kill the processes
[21:09] <calc> yoasif: no, but 32bit flash is available and works
[21:09] <yoasif> ah i had a ton of bugs with that on intrepid on 64
[21:10] <yoasif> i would have to killall npviewer.bin
[21:10] <yoasif> soured me on 64 for the time
[21:10] <calc> hmm well it still breaks occasionaly... of course even on Windows XP I was always having to restart my browser because flash would crash
[21:11] <calc> from syslog it seems when i have problems with flash it is because it has crashed, it logs the crash messages
[21:11] <Idespnnr> anyone have info on the severe regressions of xorg-intel video drivers with the new jaunty?
[21:11] <kklimonda> Idespnnr: nope
[21:12] <Idespnnr> ok, just thought i would ask.
[21:12] <calc> yoasif: it also seems that the reason firefox seems to eat so much ram is due to flash, when i turned on flashblock firefox started using much less ram
[21:12] <icewaterman> Idespnnr: only that because of the regression i didnt install it on my other box :-)
[21:12] <Idespnnr> haha
[21:12] <Idespnnr> your referring to the drop in performance right?
[21:12] <jeiworth> Idespnnr: aha! i knew that that behaviour was not normal, i am getting 35-50% cpu drain from xorg
[21:13] <jeiworth> xserver, even ;)
[21:13] <Idespnnr> Switching to UXA fixes it but causes hard locks in xorg every so often...
[21:13] <yoasif> calc: yeah, understood, i just experienced far more crashes in 64 than with 32
[21:13] <yoasif> yeah, i already have flashblock and adblock plus installed ;)
[21:13] <calc> Idespnnr: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Troubleshooting/IntelPerformance
[21:13] <jeiworth> well, you could just deactivate desktop effects for now, at least that works on kde
[21:13]  * calc wishes Adobe and Flash would both die
[21:14] <Idespnnr> I ran Kubuntu for a while, without desktop effects. Didnt cut it
[21:14] <icewaterman> jeiworth: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/jaunty/beta#Known issues you could have known in advance :-)
[21:14] <calc> even silverlight would be better than the current situation
[21:14] <BUGabundo> yoasif: not yet #flash64
[21:14] <yoasif> haha... don't use it ;)
[21:14] <Idespnnr> calc: thanks. that seems to be exactly what I need
[21:15] <calc> Idespnnr: basically intel broke their drivers and haven't gotten around to fixing them again yet
[21:15] <yoasif> i have to find that weird bug with the scrolling/blinking black overlay on youtube videos on jaunty
[21:15] <Noq> What's the 'sudo...' command to update to Netbook Remix version? I'm running 9.04 of course.
[21:15] <bronson> Hm, my touchpad supports two-finger and three-finger gestures.
[21:15] <bronson> (II) SynPS/2 Synaptics TouchPad: buttons: left right middle double triple
[21:16] <bronson> Didn't I read somewhere that Jaunty was supposed to use this by default?
[21:16] <yoasif> another annoying bug
[21:16] <yoasif> calc: how good are you with tracking down bugs?
[21:16] <yoasif> or anyone really
[21:16] <yoasif> trying to provide a better bug report for an obconf error i'm having
[21:16]  * calc is actually pretty busy and should be getting back to work already :\
[21:18] <kklimonda> yoasif: what error?
[21:18] <BUGabundo> Noq: $ update-manager
[21:18] <BUGabundo> no sudo
[21:19] <BUGabundo> yoasif: shoot us with extra info
[21:19] <jeiworth> flash64 works fine here btw
[21:20] <BUGabundo> here too
[21:20] <BUGabundo> I just need to remember to manually upgrade every month
[21:21] <yoasif> BUGabundo: error with obconf?
[21:22] <BUGabundo> obconf? what's that?
[21:22] <yoasif> sorry, obmenu, openbox menu configuration tool
[21:23] <BUGabundo> ahhh don't know anything about that WM
[21:23] <yoasif> worked fine in intrepid, broken in jaunty
[21:23] <yoasif> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/obmenu/+bug/336256
[21:23] <BUGabundo> just that it is light
[21:23] <Noq> BUGabundo: Ow, someone told me yesterday that some sort of 'sudo...' could do it. With the command you send I can choose the update from Netbook/
[21:23] <BUGabundo> Noq: upgrade from 8.10 ? or just normal updates already on jaunty?
[21:23] <yoasif> it just doesn't start... i think it's a python error, but i don't know how to troubleshoot it
[21:24] <kklimonda> yoasif: I'll work on that
[21:24] <BUGabundo> yoasif: does .xsessionerros contain anyting ?
[21:24] <BUGabundo> kklimonda: can you let me know more a bit your self?
[21:24] <BUGabundo> actually, pvt is better
[21:26] <yoasif> BUGabundo: yes, a ton
[21:26] <yoasif> should i grep for something
[21:27] <BUGabundo> yoasif: get kklimonda to help you ... you seem to be in great hands for it!
[21:27] <yoasif> BUGabundo: thanks!
[21:28] <yoasif> kklimonda: what should i do? :)
[21:28] <kklimonda> yoasif: I'll ping you at private.
[21:31] <guntbert> !bot
[21:32] <Tecna> so, does anyone know why my umount and fuser aren't working??
[21:33] <Tecna> Anyone?
[21:34] <Tecna> *crickets*
[21:34] <BUGabundo> money?
[21:34] <Tecna> wut
[21:34] <thiebaude> !topic
[21:34] <Zxcvb> will you be able to upgrade to 9.04 final from 9.04 rc1?
[21:35] <Tekno> of course
[21:35] <Tecna> so... no ideas?
[21:35] <Tekno> just sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[21:35] <Zxcvb> there is no netbook version of rc1, right?
[21:36] <BUGabundo> Zxcvb: sure there is
[21:36] <BUGabundo> Tekno: better recommend $ update-manager
[21:37] <thiebaude> wassup BUGabundo
[21:37] <BUGabundo> dinner thiebaude
[21:37] <BUGabundo> bbl
[21:37] <thiebaude> yup, almost
[21:38] <thiebaude> enjoy
[21:38] <thiebaude> BUGabundo: im having fish and chips in a little while
[21:39] <Zxcvb> all I see are the desktop and alternate images
[21:40] <Zxcvb> though I would assume the netbook version just sets some flags so things like the openoffice preloader don't run by default
[21:40] <Definitely> Hey All :)
[21:41] <JMFTheVCI> zxcvb: I have a netbook (Samsung NC10) but I don't bother with a netbook variant of Ubuntu. I just tailor things to give more screenspace on my 1024x600 res.
[21:42] <Zxcvb> JMFTheVCI: and set the preloaders not to run automatically, right?
[21:42] <Zxcvb> JMFTheVCI: preloader/quickloader/etc
[21:43] <JMFTheVCI> I have open office quick start and gnome-do as my only startups
[21:43] <JMFTheVCI> the oo-quickstart does make doc opening quicker.
[21:43] <Zxcvb> JMFTheVCI: and it works ok on only 512mb of ram?
[21:43] <JMFTheVCI> I have 2GB in my NC10.
[21:43] <JMFTheVCI> perhaps that the key difference
[21:44] <Zxcvb> was going to stick kubuntu 9.04 on this old dell
[21:44] <JMFTheVCI> can't stand the interface on kubuntu.
[21:45] <cwillu> Zxcvb, openoffice preloader doesn't run by default on any install
[21:45] <JMFTheVCI> gnome wins hands-down for me.
[21:45] <JMFTheVCI> xubuntu might be better for you
[21:45] <cwillu> livecd isn't usable on 256mb, but the installed desktop should work fine on 256mb
[21:45] <JMFTheVCI> cwillu: yup. you turn this on if needed.
[21:46] <Zxcvb> can it be any worse than kde 2.x on a p233 with 128mb ram?
[21:46] <cwillu> I doubt it
[21:46]  * cwillu pokes the bouncing kde icon with a stick
[21:47] <rom1v> in qtconfig (jaunty gnome), none of the changes which can be made have any effect on kde4 applications
[21:47] <rom1v> font size change is not persistent when closing/reopening qtconfig
[21:47] <rom1v> gui style is saved (I chose GTK+), but have no effect on digikam for example
[21:48] <Zxcvb> also, is all the stuff necessary to handle dvd playing and such available in the repositories, or is it necessary to compile it yourself?
[21:50] <calc> Zxcvb: ouch p233 w/128mb ram, reminds me of 1997 :)
[21:50] <Zxcvb> calc: 4gb hdd
[21:50] <rom1v> can somebody help me with qtconfig?
[21:51] <JMFTheVCI> ZX81 & 16K plugin RAM
[21:51] <Zxcvb> calc: still have it laying around somewhere, along with a thinkpad 755cd (486/100, 40mb ram max, the 32mb ram expansion looks kind of like a pcmcia card)
[21:51]  * calc likes his thinkpad x200 :)
[21:52]  * wirechief like his lenovo r61e
[21:52] <calc> Ubuntu runs fine on it, c2d 2.4ghz, 4gb ram, 500gb hd :)
[21:52] <eternal_p> hey all..anyone get USB to work with Virtualbox and Jaunty?
[21:52] <wirechief> calc 500gb drive ?
[21:52] <Definitely> calc: It also runs fine on my Core2Quad Q6600 2,4 Ghz :)
[21:53] <calc> wirechief: seagate momentus 7200.4
[21:53] <calc> wirechief: the thinkpad x200 doesn't come with that, i added it myself
[21:53] <ienorand> Flash crashes, what bug should I be following for latest info? Does Bug #192888 still apply in jaunty?
[21:53] <Zxcvb> going to try booting from a usb stick via a dos floppy and loadlin for the dell
[21:53] <calc> wirechief: the does ~ 100MB/s
[21:53] <calc> er the drive does
[21:53] <wirechief> calc yes im looking at getting another but 320gb
[21:53] <Zxcvb> hopefully the usb drivers (which run in 32 bit real mode, I think) won't interfere
[21:54] <ValentineX> hello any ubuntu jaunty user there?
[21:54] <wirechief> calc i am probably going to trash vista if i run into room problems
[21:54] <JMFTheVCI> Val: this is the place
[21:55] <ValentineX> wirechief: hi u dont use ubuntu?
[21:55] <wirechief> calc might try it in a vm but only if i can limit its size .
[21:55] <wirechief> ValentineX: yes, dual boot
[21:55] <aapzak> ValentineX: most of us probably run Jaunty
[21:55] <bertodsera> where do I fill a bug for 9.04?
[21:56] <calc> wirechief: i stick to xp in a vm since it uses much less memory
[21:56] <ValentineX> JMFTheVCI: oh i have one problem, i am trying to install jaunty from usb but i get error unable to detect cd rom, where i am installing from usb :( jaunty alternate
[21:56] <calc> wirechief: putting vista in a vm sounds painful
[21:56] <ValentineX> aapzak: i also want to run :(
[21:56] <wirechief> calc yes, your right vista is pure pain.
[21:56] <calc> iirc my xp vm only has 512MB allocated for it and it runs fine, for Vista you really need ~ 2GB :\
[21:56] <wirechief> calc i have winxp but the disk is scratched :(
[21:57] <JMFTheVCI> Valentine: Are you sure your BIOS support boot from USB?
[21:57] <calc> wirechief: there are ways to get a xp cd if you already have a license
[21:57] <aapzak> ValentineX: I had that problem on an older laptop too, I guess not all machines can boot and install from usb
[21:57] <BUGabundo> eternal_p: only SUN version supports it... community one doesn't
[21:57] <ValentineX> JMFTheVCI: yes, i run some steps of installation too keyboard detection etc
[21:57] <wirechief> calc yes i have a license not sure i can reuse it on a lappy though.
[21:57] <ValentineX> aapzak: i installed ubuntu 8.10 on my this old pc with usb :(
[21:57] <ienorand> bertodsera: http://launchpad.net what kind of bug
[21:57] <ienorand> ?
[21:58] <calc> wirechief: ah yea depends on what kind of xp license you got
[21:58] <aapzak> ValentineX: ok, thats weird then
[21:58] <BUGabundo> ValentineX: its more like, who doesn't! eheh
[21:58]  * calc has a legitimate VLK
[21:58] <wirechief> calc yes, well it was a upgrade from win98.. and win3.1
[21:58] <aapzak> ValentineX: your solution then is to install 8.10 and upgrade to 9.04
[21:58] <ValentineX> But in third or fourth step... where it tries to copy files from cd rom gives error .. i wonder why it goes to cd rom when i am installing from usb
[21:58] <JMFTheVCI> valentine: I booted to live version and when ubuntu was running ran the install program. I did not install direct from the USB.
[21:59] <eternal_p> BUGabundo: that is what I am running..right from the website
[21:59] <BUGabundo> calc: wirechief OT , ok?
[21:59] <wirechief> calc the computer it was originally used on is sleeping.
[21:59] <calc> wirechief: oh if it wasn't a oem install then you can probably wipe it from wherever it is currently installed and install it on the VM legally
[21:59] <ValentineX> BUGabundo: hey u :D you people introduced linux to me :D
[21:59] <wirechief> hi BUGabundo
[21:59] <bertodsera> initramfs-tools breaks dpkg on installing the nfs packages
[21:59]  * calc hushes about licensing stuff
[22:00] <BUGabundo> ValentineX: ehehe
[22:00] <BUGabundo> nice to know
[22:00] <wirechief> BUGabundo:  OT ?
[22:00] <bertodsera> ienorand: but I'm seeing quite a lot of stuff already there about initramfs-tools
[22:00] <BUGabundo> off topic
[22:00] <BUGabundo>  ! ot | wirechief
[22:00] <wirechief> k
[22:00] <BUGabundo> ValentineX: your nick is not strange to me! where do I know you from '?
[22:00] <bertodsera> anyway, nothing a "sudo dpkg --remove -a" won't cure
[22:00] <wirechief> j #unbuntu-offtopic
[22:01] <wirechief> oop
[22:01] <JMFTheVCI> calc: the windows xp license allows you to run one instance of XP. If you run it in a VM then that is OK. As long as you do not run it somewhere else at the same time
[22:01]  * BUGabundo hands a / to wirechief
[22:01] <ValentineX> aapzak: i have slow net these days otherwise that was my option too, to upgrade from 8.10 to jaunty, but i want to try ext4 :)
[22:01] <ValentineX> BUGabundo: jaiku :D
[22:01] <calc> JMFTheVCI: iirc the licensing for OEM installs on computers is more restrictive than that, but it is OT, so i'm not going to discuss it any further :)
[22:02] <calc> plus the key that is on the bottom of computers/laptops is not the same key as is used to actually install, you have to use magic jelly bean to get that one
[22:02] <calc> and iirc the key on the label isn't even valid
[22:02]  * calc hushes now
[22:02] <JMFTheVCI> calc; now you're in dodgy time.
[22:03] <BUGabundo> ValentineX: ahhh eehe
[22:03] <BUGabundo> calc: again ? :)
[22:03] <drbobb> OK... I tried to solve my issues with Jaunty's video driver by downgrading xserver-xorg + dependencies to the hardy versions.. And it's almost worked, except that now my keyboard is acting funny ;-/
[22:03] <BUGabundo> JMFTheVCI: don't pull by him....
[22:03] <JMFTheVCI> ?
[22:03]  * calc just told JMFTheVCI the rest via privmsg
[22:04] <BUGabundo> eeheh
[22:04] <BUGabundo> thanks
[22:04] <BUGabundo> not that I don't like it, I do, but its OT
[22:04] <BUGabundo> don't want to see "you know you" start issuing more kicks
[22:04] <drbobb> AltGR seems to be sending enter, arrow keys, Home/End etc are not being read correctly either
[22:04] <aapzak> drbobb: which video vdriver do you use?
[22:04] <drbobb> SiS
[22:05] <drbobb> Now broken keyboard handling is rather unexpected.. any ideas?
[22:06] <aapzak> didn't know there was anything else besides ati, nvidia and intel
[22:06] <thiebaude> i was waiting for an intel
[22:06] <BUGabundo> SiS ??? does it even work?
[22:06] <drbobb> aapzak: you must be very young
[22:06] <thiebaude> intel doesn't either
[22:06] <aapzak> drbobb: or very old :)
[22:06] <BUGabundo> drbobb: did you have to disable ACPI for it to work?
[22:06] <drbobb> aapzak: too youg to have bought a laptop 4 ys ago
[22:06] <calc> intel usually works except when they decide to break their driver for 2.5/2.6
[22:06] <drbobb> BUGabundo: no I didn't
[22:07] <calc> it probably still works better than SiS though :\
[22:07] <BUGabundo> eheh calc
[22:07] <thiebaude> i dont know been using this intel since 6.06
[22:07] <aapzak> drbobb: I'm rather old, owned a voodoo once :)
[22:07] <calc> thiebaude: intel on 9.04 is broken to varying extent depending on your chipset
[22:07] <drbobb> BUGabundo: I use noapic on the kernel command line, but I forgot what issue that solves
[22:07] <JMFTheVCI> I have intel graphics and I am up-to-date with all fixes. No graphics crashes. Is there something particular that is causing your issues.
[22:07] <voss> Im so happy I got WOW 3.1 working with wine and I found out ubuntu 9.04 automagically detected my samsung printer!
[22:08] <thiebaude> x freezes
[22:08] <calc> JMFTheVCI: not always crashes, it also is much slower than 8.10 for many users
[22:08] <aapzak> JMFTheVCI: how up-to-date are you? I have many issues with G965
[22:08] <thiebaude> im using 9.04 now but only through blackbox
[22:08] <BUGabundo> see my master bug 348626
[22:08] <calc> i think most of the crashing issues for intel 9.04 have been resolved but there are probably others still being worked on
[22:08] <drbobb> SiS worked pretty well back in Hardy.. dunno about Intrepid, skipped that release.. in Jaunty, it works but the screen flickers too much
[22:09] <voss> Whats even funnier, Wow works better in WINE once you get it working than it does in vista!
[22:09] <victim> how do I install the ATI 9.4 drivers (or are they already installed)?
[22:09] <calc> a few weeks ago it would crash every resume for me on intel 4500
[22:09] <histo> pulseaudio still jacked up
[22:09] <thiebaude> calc: i ordered the 9.04 cd, so i'll do a fresh install
[22:09] <JMFTheVCI> I have  Display controller: Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/GMS/GME, 943/940GML Express Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 03). I don't think I have seen any slowdown.
[22:09] <histo> this will be a big issue when release comes
[22:09] <aapzak> I just cannot run KDE on 9.04 with my G965]
[22:09] <calc> thiebaude: ok
[22:09] <Zxcvb> voss: many apps work in wine but not at all in vista
[22:09]  * calc probably has the 9.04 iso on his desktop already
[22:10] <calc> as the call for testing already went out
[22:10] <BUGabundo> I forgot to make my special CD request
[22:10] <drbobb> But what about the keyboard issue? still waiting for ideas.. If I can fix that, I'll be happy for a good while
[22:10] <thiebaude> calc: im pretty sure ubuntu will reconize the intel out of the box
[22:10] <BUGabundo> now marilize will never ship mine in time :(
[22:10] <aapzak> JMFTheVCI: gnome wihout compiz on EXA works fine
[22:10] <calc> thiebaude: yes it recogonizes the intel video cards but they don't work very well... due to intel themselves breaking their driver
[22:10] <thiebaude> BUGabundo: i've been ordering the cd's since 6.06
[22:10] <BUGabundo> me 2
[22:10] <calc> thiebaude: read phoronix articles about the situation if you want to know details
[22:11] <aapzak> calc: multiple problems on intels
[22:11] <JMFTheVCI> aapzak: I have gnome with compiz and it works fine.
[22:11] <calc> i just grab the cd's at UDS each time :)
[22:11] <BUGabundo> I spend more CDs then our LoCoTeam
[22:11] <aapzak> JMFTheVCI: no huge memload after a while?
[22:11] <JMFTheVCI> aapzak, not that I have noticed.
[22:11] <BUGabundo> calc: if you pass along North of Portugal leave me a few
[22:11] <voss> Can you use a amd quad-core with 533 memory?
[22:11] <JMFTheVCI> I only have 2GB and it rarely swaps.
[22:12] <aapzak> JMFTheVCI: gnome seems to run alright, KDE however, swapping starts within half an hour of KDEing
[22:12] <calc> BUGabundo: i'll be flying over it but i doubt they will open the door for me :)
[22:12] <BUGabundo> JMFTheVCI: want me to lend you my email client and inbox?
[22:12] <aapzak> JMFTheVCI: and it will be X which is huge then
[22:12] <thiebaude> haha
[22:12] <calc> BUGabundo: UDS in may is in Barcelona :)
[22:12] <BUGabundo> Mem:          3895       3635        260          0         69       1340
[22:13] <BUGabundo> calc: I know! if it was cheaper, I would go
[22:13] <JMFTheVCI> apzak: KDE was total pants for me. chucked it after 15 mins.
[22:13] <BUGabundo> but out of a job is hard to pay for 5 days in (expensive) barcelona
[22:13] <BUGabundo> JMFTheVCI: I really wish you stop putting down KDE4
[22:13] <aapzak> JMFTheVCI: I'm always switching between Gnome and KDE, they both have things I like
 Sorry.
[22:14] <thiebaude> lol
[22:14] <calc> BUGabundo: yea :\
[22:14]  * Twigathy waves his little xfce4 flag c-c
[22:14] <Zxcvb> not sure about 4.2, but kde 4.x used to require hand editing config files for lots of stuff you could easily do in kcontrol in 3.x
[22:14] <thiebaude> and i wave my blackbox flag,lol
[22:15] <yoasif> KDE4 is slower than GNOME right?
[22:15] <Twigathy> I use ratpoison on the machines up at uni because they have somewhat limited screen real estate :)
[22:15] <aapzak> yoasif: not neccesairy
[22:15] <Zxcvb> yoasif: for now mabye, but gnome will be slower once the .net rewrite is finished
[22:15] <thiebaude> yoasif: i think it is
[22:15] <aapzak> kde4 is pretty fast
[22:16] <aapzak> depending on you videocard :)
[22:16] <Zxcvb> yoasif: assuming they actually go ahead and rewrite all of gnome in .net/C#
[22:16] <yoasif> heh well i just use gnome-panel in openbox
[22:16] <yoasif> and gtk apps otherwise
[22:16] <yoasif> so KDE looks a lot slower than what im doing now
[22:16] <aapzak> :)
[22:17] <aapzak> you might be right, building of the screen takes a lot of time, konsole doesn't scroll as high speed as gnome-terminal
[22:17] <calc> Zxcvb: what .net rewrite?
[22:17] <aapzak> konqueror scrolls slower than firefox
[22:17] <yoasif> aapzak: i'm not a huge fan of compositing, seems to be buggy and slower
[22:18] <aapzak> kate is a fantastic editor but again, scolls slow
[22:18] <aapzak> yoasif: me neither
[22:18] <calc> Zxcvb: only a couple of pieces of gnome are written in .net and i haven't heard of any plans for anything else to be
[22:18] <yoasif> calc: he means mono
[22:18] <aapzak> yeah
[22:18] <Zxcvb> calc: they were talking about rewriting gnome to be based on mono/.net/c#
[22:18] <calc> yoasif: i know
[22:18] <Zxcvb> calc: no C or C++ at all
[22:18] <calc> Zxcvb: where?
[22:18] <aapzak> bad idea
[22:18]  * calc thinks maybe some non-developer crackpot talked about it perhaps ;-)
[22:18] <yoasif> isnt that just gnome 3, and even then, just the "desktop" portion?
[22:19] <olaf-vom> hi everyone -- just upgraded to 9.04-rc, but it seems my nvidia geforce 6150 is broken. (only rather basic graphics-driver.) not sure on how to configure xorg.conf-less X ... any idea you could give me?
[22:19] <BUGabundo> I think you guys are confusing WMs
[22:19] <calc> gnome 3 is definitely not a rewrite in MONO
[22:19] <yoasif> i still doubt that kde will be faster, mono is not horribly slow or anythng
[22:19] <BUGabundo> KWIN is much lighter then COMPIZ
[22:19] <aapzak> I dislike building a ground for .net
[22:19] <Zxcvb> calc: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2002/02/01/gnome_to_be_based/
[22:19] <calc> gnome 3.0 is for the most part just a deprecation of old bad libraries not used any more or that shouldn't be being used anymore
[22:19] <yoasif> is kwin less buggy than compiz?
[22:19] <aapzak> BUGabundo: kwin != compiz?
[22:19] <calc> Zxcvb: quoting a 7 year old article, eh?
[22:19] <yoasif> xfce's composition seems pretty stable to me
[22:20] <BUGabundo> aapzak: of course
[22:20] <calc> Zxcvb: perhaps the article is wrong? ;-)
[22:20] <Zxcvb> or they decided against it
[22:20] <BUGabundo> gnome 3.0 will try to rewrite system libs, that are still in ANSI C
[22:20] <calc> Zxcvb: i think miguel wanted it but no one else did so it never happened
[22:20] <aapzak> BUGabundo: then I think kwin is much slower, at least on my intel
[22:20] <BUGabundo> aapzak: shouldn't! kwin is supposed to take advanted of QT
[22:21] <Zxcvb> calc: yeah, rewriting gnome from scratch would be a pain
[22:21] <calc> Zxcvb: iirc it took 4+ years from that article before the first bit was added that used mono (tomboy)
[22:21] <aapzak> kwin compositing is much more clasier though
[22:21] <BUGabundo> Zxcvb: KDE did that! the rewrote everything and ported apps
[22:21] <badfish69> 3 days right?
[22:21] <aapzak> BUGabundo: I cannot run kwin+candy on EXA
[22:21] <calc> Zxcvb: and rewriting a desktop into something slow like java, .net, or python is insane
[22:21] <aapzak> compiz runs very smooth on EXA
[22:21] <BUGabundo> badfish69: around that, yes
[22:22] <calc> BUGabundo: and KDE still hasn't gotten back to the functional level of kde 3.5 several years later
[22:22] <Zxcvb> calc: like emacs, nice (if slow) OS but needs a text editor
[22:22] <BUGabundo> 2 years, 4 cycles
[22:22] <BUGabundo> 4.3 and 4.5 are expected to be Stable
[22:23] <aapzak> BUGabundo: I really like the KDE progress but its far from good enough to use at work
[22:23] <aapzak> and I am/was a KDE fanboy :)
[22:23] <yoasif> QT is so ugly by default though :(
[22:24] <aapzak> noway
[22:24] <yoasif> never really managed to make it look nice
[22:24] <BUGabundo> QT you are talking about SKIN... QT is much more then that
[22:24] <aapzak> taste , lets discuss taste :)
[22:24] <aapzak> besides, I think QT apps look very good
[22:24] <mphill> qt and gtk both make my eyes bleed
[22:24] <BUGabundo> aapzak: lets not!
[22:24] <yoasif> hehe
[22:24]  * BUGabundo renames +1 to offtopic
[22:25] <aapzak> :)
[22:25] <calc> BUGabundo: well it goes away in 4 days anyway :)
[22:25] <aapzak> its a bit on-topic
[22:25] <mphill> they both look like motif to me
[22:25] <Yakibeef> How can i update to jaunty?  I have my software sources set to normal, but I do not get an option to upgrade
[22:25] <BUGabundo> Yakibeef: $ update-manager -d
[22:25] <BUGabundo> please READ the release notes
[22:26] <BUGabundo> Yakibeef: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/904
[22:26] <Yakibeef> Thank you much
[22:27] <aapzak> seems to me reading a releasenote should be easier than droppin into irc channel, fubby
[22:27] <aapzak> funny
[22:27] <yoasif> so when is ubuntu going to look better than osx? ;)
[22:27] <aapzak> hehehe
[22:27] <mphill> soon
[22:27] <aapzak> never
[22:27] <mphill> no way
[22:27] <mphill> gtk 3.0
[22:27] <yoasif> i dunno ive seen some of the stuff for karmic
[22:27] <yoasif> not really liking it too much
[22:28] <mphill> yoasif: what have you seen?
[22:28] <aapzak> best designers work @ apple
[22:28] <BUGabundo> aapzak: ohh that's low
[22:28] <calc> yoasif: 1-2 years probably :)
[22:28] <aapzak> BUGabundo: is it?
[22:28] <calc> ubuntu is getting more designers all the time :)
[22:28] <aapzak> OSX has been looking like this for years
[22:28] <mphill> gnome 3.0 and gtk will probably be a huge push in the right direction
[22:28] <calc> the first bits of the work are going in to 9.04
[22:29] <aapzak> I really like the new notifications
[22:29] <yoasif> mphill: cant find it atm, just some mockups for some new themes
[22:29] <yoasif> on wiki
[22:29] <BUGabundo> calc: canonical just didn't get Nuno Pinheiro!
[22:29] <calc> prior to 9.04 there weren't really anyone working on desktop design for Ubuntu
[22:29] <BUGabundo> that guy works REALLY well
[22:29] <mphill> the new themes in jaunty are slick
[22:29] <mphill> dust
[22:29] <BUGabundo> not cheap, but wonderful work
[22:29] <aapzak> Nuno isn't at apple either, right? Did he do Oxygen?
[22:29]  * BUGabundo hates how dark human looks on white
[22:30] <BUGabundo> aapzak: he did, him and his team
[22:30] <yoasif> ew oxygen looks like crap
[22:30] <aapzak> :)
[22:30] <BUGabundo> I really should file a bug on Dark Theme
[22:30] <yoasif> i much prefer shiki colors and the like
[22:30]  * BUGabundo punchs yoasif
[22:30] <aapzak> oxygen looks very very good
[22:30] <calc> BUGabundo: they are hiring for several other DX people currently
[22:30]  * BUGabundo goes read Code of Conduct
[22:31] <yoasif> oxygen looks like a shoddy copy of osx sorry
[22:31] <calc> iirc Ken, current artwork guy, worked on oxygen as well
[22:31] <aapzak> I love OSX and I like oxygen a lot
[22:31] <yoasif> kde4 looks like a really weird looking mix of osx and 7
[22:31] <BUGabundo> calc: don't know him
[22:32] <aapzak> yoasif: I guess thats the chosen direction
[22:32]  * calc doesn't like oxygen theme much either.. but the people who made the icons definitely know what they are doing
[22:32] <yoasif> for karmic, really? thats so lame :(
[22:32] <BUGabundo> but I had the chance to co-organize TOKAMAK and have 16 KDE core devs with me for 5 days WOOT
[22:32] <yoasif> i mean, i love os x but we need something NICER not something that looks like a shoddy ripoff :/
[22:32] <thiebaude> windows 7 copied kde
[22:33] <aapzak> point for thiebaude
[22:33] <yoasif> thiebaude: yeah, but it still manages to look better (and i really dont like msft)
[22:33] <aapzak> OSX invented the eye-candy, gnome/kde/compiz challenge osx, 7 copies :)
[22:33] <calc> there are some MS patents that actually reference KDE work, been a while since i saw it though so i can't remember the patent number
[22:33] <thiebaude> i cant run win7 and sure cant vista with 512mb
[22:34] <calc> thiebaude: win7 seems to take less resources than vista, but i am not sure how much less
[22:34] <drbobb> I just loaded jaunty on a 5+ year-old HP compaq laptop. Unfortunately, inserting a PCMCIA wifi card makes the kernel panic
[22:34] <thiebaude> calc: true
[22:34] <yoasif> calc: more than xp, less than vista
[22:34] <thiebaude> calc win7 1gb
[22:34] <yoasif> not a bad OS overall, my machine suspends perfectly using it
[22:34] <calc> and Ubuntu less than all of them (at least once xp has a virus scanner/etc)
[22:34] <aapzak> I think OSX is the heaviest, the slowest
[22:35] <yoasif> unlike ubuntu
[22:35] <aapzak> but noone cares about that with osx, funny ey?
[22:35] <yoasif> aapzak: osx is faster than gnome, surprisingly
[22:35] <calc> ubuntu takes ~ 250MB booted into Gnome
[22:35] <aapzak> yoasif: is it?
[22:35] <yoasif> (same hardware, tried it)
[22:35] <thiebaude> calc: thats why i use blackbox
[22:35] <calc> drbobb: do you have the laptop running the newest bios available?
[22:35] <aapzak> then I need a new iMac, the machine anoys me
[22:35] <yoasif> yeah, i have some older vintage boxes (3ghz p4 is now vintage)
[22:36] <thiebaude> most of the time i have 300mb free ram
[22:36] <drbobb> calc: I have no idea
[22:36] <yoasif> but osx definitely runs faster than gnome on it
[22:36] <calc> drbobb: could be a port resource issue that possibly could be fixed with a newer bios
[22:36] <calc> my wife's computer is pretty old, athlon64 3200+, 2gb ram, 250gb hd
[22:37] <aapzak> yoasif: I've got the first Intel mac, it makes me wait a lot :(
[22:37] <drbobb> calc: the reason it was free to play with was that i tried to reinstall XP on it and failed, the windows installer faild to reformat the hdd
[22:37] <yoasif> i want more focus on speeding stuff up, heh
[22:37] <calc> drbobb: ah
[22:37] <BUGabundo> calc: last time I tried a daily image on my laptop 64bits, after boot took 234MiBs
[22:37] <siegie> yoasif: osx must only work one kind of pc, while ubuntu works on ...
[22:37] <BUGabundo> calc: that's *old* ? LOL
[22:37] <thiebaude> xp used the least ram because the min is 64mb
[22:37] <drbobb> so I threw Ubuntu at it to see if I can trigger a drive failure there. Nothing so far
[22:38] <yoasif> siegie: i know that, but os x on the same hardware is faster than gnome
[22:38] <yoasif> thats all that really matters at the end of the day in the speed question
[22:39] <siegie> yoasif: linux can be optimized, remember the 3 seconds boot?
[22:39] <calc> BUGabundo: i'm supposed to give her my current computer around the end of the year
[22:39] <aapzak> siegie: the point was that I claimed OSX was slow
[22:39] <calc> BUGabundo: c2d e6300, 4gb ram, 500gb hd
[22:40] <aapzak> and yoasif knows I was wrong :)
[22:40] <yoasif> hehe
[22:40] <calc> thiebaude: yea but xp in practice uses 400MB+ at boot after loading a few apps on it
[22:40] <calc> thiebaude: esp virus scanners, heh
[22:40] <drbobb> I still need some help.. what has changed so seriously about keyboard handling in recent releases? on my keyboard, mapping of PgUp/PgDn/Home/End etc is all messed up
[22:40] <siegie> aapzak: then apple does a verry bad job, with the advantages they have :)
[22:40] <thiebaude> calc: yup
[22:40] <aapzak> siegie: I was wrong
[22:40] <calc> BUGabundo: well the athlon64 3200+ is 5 years old now
[22:41] <thiebaude> calc: im glad i only have ubuntu 9.04 on this computer
[22:41] <thiebaude> a 9.04 that doesn't work,lol
[22:41] <BUGabundo> calc: my old desktop is a AMD 1.9+ with 512MiBs of ram
[22:41] <BUGabundo> old laptop is a PM 1.7 with 1GiB of RAM
[22:41] <yoasif> i remember when linux was faster than osx ... on my b&w g3, os x 10.1 vs yellow dog linux...
[22:42] <calc> BUGabundo: i had something like that for my previous computer to my wife's current one, oct 2001, athlonxp 1800+, 1GB ram (iirc), 2 100GB HD
[22:42] <yoasif> even without a propietary graphic driver
[22:42] <yoasif> gnome etc have gotten more bloated as osx has slimmed down
[22:42] <yoasif> (bw g3 @ 350mhz)
[22:42] <calc> yoasif: macos 10.5 runs faster on your b&w g3 than 10.1 ?
[22:43]  * calc thought current osx didn't even still run on ppc
[22:43] <aapzak> I believe 10.5 is the last ppc osx
[22:43] <yoasif> calc: nope... 10.2/3 ran faster than 10.1 though
[22:43] <yoasif> and l0.5 does run on ppc, slower though than 10.4
[22:43] <calc> yoasif: ubuntu 9.04 runs faster than older Ubuntu (except for Intel braindamage)
[22:44] <thiebaude> haha
[22:44] <yoasif> calc: where are the speedups coming from? upstream, i assume?
[22:44] <badfish69> intel braindamage?
[22:44] <yoasif> im seeing stuff on the forums about slowdowns though
[22:45] <thiebaude> badfish69: i815
[22:45] <aapzak> I guess a lot depends on how much memory you have'
[22:45] <yoasif> im sure we'll see more of those once jaunty is stable
[22:45] <calc> yoasif: boot speedup was from ubuntu itself, the other parts mostly from upstream and compiler improvements
[22:46] <yoasif> boot speedup concerns me less than my suspend not working ;) sucky to have a laptop without working suspend
[22:46] <calc> yoasif: probably most of the things you are seeing wrt slow downs are due to people having intel video... which slowed down a LOT on 9.04 due to intel screwing up their driver
[22:46] <aapzak> yoasif: even ... if suspends works, we don't care about boot time at all
[22:46] <calc> yoasif: if you had been around to do the suspend/resume testing ~ 1-2 months ago when the call went out yours would work
[22:47] <yoasif> bah... what call? :p
[22:47] <yoasif> ill start hanging out here more though
[22:47] <calc> yoasif: there was a large push to make sure suspend/resume worked on every persons laptop that tested it
[22:47] <yoasif> maybe it can get it fixed for karmic
[22:47] <calc> yoasif: it was on the ubuntu mailing lists
[22:47] <yoasif> calc: yeah, who do i contact about that *now*
[22:47] <yoasif> yeah, i need to get on those too :/
[22:48] <calc> yoasif: uh probably should contact ogasawara
[22:48] <aapzak> I think Intel is working very hard on rigoreus changes in their drivers
[22:48] <BUGabundo> my hibernate works, but 50% of the time it won't power off
[22:48] <aapzak> I hope we'll see lot of improvement soon, they release quite often
[22:48] <calc> aapzak: yea its just taking a lot longer than expected (i suppose) and has been broken for 6 months or so
[22:48] <BUGabundo> plus I get a trace back on shutdown 80% of the time
[22:49] <BUGabundo> I wish I had a better phone camera to take a pic
[22:49] <calc> also file bugs about your problems in launchpad :)
[22:49] <yoasif> calc: how? email?
[22:49] <yoasif> calc: already done
[22:49] <calc> yoasif: yea or via irc
[22:49] <aapzak> calc: isn't intel the most progressive video driver developer? one day we will be very happy with intel
[22:50] <yoasif> yeah i'm not worried about intel, they support linux a good deal
[22:50] <calc> aapzak: yea eventually we will be but after they have made desktop linux unusable for a while :\
[22:51] <calc> someone forward ported the old intel 2.4 x driver so that might work well enough for this release cycle
[22:51] <aapzak> calc: I don't know what you need, but without too much eye candy it works fine?
[22:51] <yoasif> calc: that is crap and you know it. it's up to the distros to make sure things work for end users
[22:51] <calc> aapzak: oh it works fine for me, but anyone who does compositing or 3d it is EXTREMELY slow for
[22:51] <yoasif> shuttleworth says this as well, so it's not like i'm spreading heresy
[22:51] <calc> aiui if you have compiz on it is very slow for most users, i hate compiz and always turn it off, so i don't see many issues myself
[22:52] <aapzak> calc: actually, compiz works very smooth, even with EXA without any options
[22:52] <voss> calc, which intel driver is having the problem?
[22:52] <thiebaude> aapzak: i even tried AccelMethod and UXA and it made it worse
[22:52] <aapzak> voss: x3100, g965 , that family
[22:52] <BUGabundo> calc: humm i like it
[22:52] <calc> yoasif: so... intel 2.4 didn't work at all with new xorg, the intel driver that works with new xorg just plain doesn't work, and so no blame at all rests with upstream... sure
[22:52] <thiebaude> it couldn't even finish booting
[22:52] <BUGabundo> for many months and releases I disabled it too
[22:53] <aapzak> thiebaude: that made my laptop unstable, huge memload on X
[22:53] <BUGabundo> until I got it exaclty was I want Compiz working
[22:53] <cwillu> thiebaude, uxa with vsync on will be horrible
[22:53] <thiebaude> aapzak: i have 9.04 and cant even use it
[22:53] <BUGabundo> now it's a TOOL more then Fancy stuff
[22:53] <calc> the situation was so bad that someone finally stepped up and ported intel x 2.4 driver to new xorg so people could have something halfway reliable to use
[22:53] <voss> aapzak, I have a dell mini 9, it uses 945 chipset. All the rest of my stuff is nvidia
[22:53] <BUGabundo> plus it helps me "sell" Ubuntu
[22:53] <thiebaude> im glad im able to get to a boot menu
[22:54] <calc> voss: the intel driver, it breaks in different ways depending on the chipset you have apparently on 965 it breaks pretty badly
[22:54] <aapzak> voss: then you have the same intel issues we're talking about
[22:54] <thiebaude> i mean log in screen
[22:54] <calc> afaik there is only one main intel driver - xserver-xorg-video-intel
[22:54] <thiebaude> x freezes and then the mouse freezes
[22:54] <voss> aap, I havent had any problems so far with my mini and 9.04
[22:54] <aapzak> voss: depends on what you do
[22:54] <aapzak> UXA is a problem
[22:55] <aapzak> and EXA performs badly
[22:55] <voss> aap, 945 doesnt do much 3d stuff anyway
[22:55] <aapzak> I cannot run KDE on this laptop
[22:55] <thiebaude> aapzak: but ubuntu 8.10 is great
[22:55] <aapzak> I love 9.04 too :)
[22:56] <aapzak> It's just like walking on thin ice, I manage to keep it running but I wish it was easier
[22:56] <aapzak> it is a matter of time
[22:56] <aapzak> overal this release is very pretty
[22:56] <aapzak> and intel will fix this driver
[22:57] <voss> aapzak, No pretty is 9.04 NBR!
[22:57] <thiebaude> aapzak: amazing thing about linux, even though i cant use the 9.04 kernel, i can still use linux
[22:57] <thiebaude> no way windows can do that
[22:57] <voss> 9.04 NBR is gorgeous!
[22:57] <aapzak> thiebaude: you lost me :)
[22:58] <thiebaude> aapzak: i can get to a log in screen and choose gnome or blackbox
[22:58] <voss> I only wish Dell would use it on their mini 9 and 10s
[22:58] <voss> KDE has been problematic since 4.0 anyway
[22:58] <thiebaude> aapzak: and gnome would be the wrong choice
[22:59] <yoasif> anyone in here a packager?
[22:59] <aapzak> voss: like Intel, kde has a nice future, won't take too long
[22:59] <aapzak> thiebaude: you confused me with the 9.04 kernel :)
[22:59] <voss> aapzak, the problem is KDE has a lot of nice features, features that should have waited for kde 4.5 :)
[22:59] <yoasif> i installed jwm but it doesn't create a new entry in the login prompt
[22:59] <thiebaude> aapzak: i think i didn't say that right,lol
[23:00] <aapzak> voss: maybe they released too early, but how else are you going to get beta/test users?
[23:01] <aapzak> it comes with the model
[23:01] <dotblank> hey Anyone noticeing the gtk 2.6 filechooser save dialog is really slow and takes 20 secs to open?
[23:01] <thiebaude> aapzak: i was wondering should they delay it like they did with 6.06
[23:01] <dotblank> with OO.org save dialog is very very slow
[23:01] <AaronMT> dotblank: Where is this dialog?
[23:02] <dotblank> As well as inkscape
[23:02] <aapzak> thiebaude: thisone is hard, when will the driver be alright? I would not delay I think
[23:02] <thiebaude> aapzak: and i wonder will future releases be like this
[23:02] <dotblank> This is weird cause the open dialog is normal
[23:03] <aapzak> thiebaude: I guess its always possible that not everything is working 100%
[23:04] <thiebaude> im going to check if i have 9.04 updates
[23:05] <BUGabundo> thiebaude: I did ! a bunch too
[23:06] <thiebaude> oh ok
[23:06] <thiebaude> i have none,:-(
[23:08] <aapzak> just a couple here
[23:09] <Jordan_U> I get a grub error about "unsupported executable format" when trying to boot 2.6.28-11
[23:10] <Z3ro3X> I've been having random (all though rare) hard lock ups after installing ubuntu 9.04 with / as ext4.  Is this from the new file system or running the RC of ubuntu?
[23:11] <aapzak> btw, I'm looking forward to the xorg fix which fixes the memory leak when using UXA. How can I find out if this upstream fix is already in Ubuntu?
[23:12] <aapzak> Z3ro3X: I've had some lockups (not really, but heavy swapping) on Intel gfx + kde
[23:12] <BUGabundo> Z3ro3X: talk to cwillu. he is our resident speciallist on those bugs
[23:12] <Z3ro3X> cwillu, Hey.
[23:14] <BUGabundo> YAY net split
[23:14] <Z3ro3X> I think I just felt a great disturbance in the force.
[23:16] <Jordan_U> Z3ro3X, Known bug with ext4, unfortunately won't be fixed by release ( or at least doesn't look like it will be )
[23:16] <Z3ro3X> Jordan_U, But is it related to ext4 or a bug in the RC?  That's what I want to know.
[23:19] <Othor> are nautilus scripts broken? none of mine are working
[23:21] <Othor> i tried to make a simple python script that just displays the value of NAUTILUS_SCRIPT_SELECTED_FILE_PATHS in a message box, but it didn't show on the screen
[23:21] <syke> hi
[23:22] <syke> any Canonical folks around?
[23:23] <BUGabundo> syke: a few
[23:23] <BUGabundo> why? does it matter?
[23:23] <syke> I noticed a bug in pmccabe 2.5: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/19404556/pmccabe_2.4%2Bnmu1_2.5.diff.gz
[23:23] <syke> -echo "\nAnalyzing $newdir ...\c" >&2
[23:23] <syke> +prnitf "\nAnalyzing %s ..." "$newdir" >&2
[23:24] <syke> the second line is supposed to be printf
[23:24] <BUGabundo> so what you want is a LP dev
[23:24] <BUGabundo> syke: try #launchpad
[23:24] <BUGabundo> or file a bug
[23:24] <meoblast001> hi
[23:24] <meoblast001> has the art team made their contributions yet?
[23:24] <syke> LP dev?
[23:25] <syke> oh, launchpad
[23:25] <aapzak> meoblast001: I think it looks amazing, I'd say they did ;)
[23:25] <meoblast001> new sounds?
[23:25] <meoblast001> tell me new sounds or i'll pop my brain out the back of my skull
[23:26] <aapzak> meoblast001: I never use sounds
[23:26] <meoblast001> aapzak: like the login sounds?
[23:26] <aapzak> ah, still the same I guess
[23:26] <aapzak> meoblast001: as little OS sound as possible
[23:26]  * meoblast001 shoots himself
[23:27] <aapzak> meo?
[23:27] <aapzak> meoblast001?
[23:27] <Othor> are nautilus scripts broken? none of mine are working
[23:27]  * meoblast001 has been getting sick of the same sound for the past 2 years
[23:27]  * aapzak always disables those sounds
[23:27] <BluesKaj> i just disable the dumb sounds
[23:27] <aapzak> meoblast001: I do that since the windows jungle sound theme :)
[23:28] <yoasif> i don't get why sounds are even on by default
[23:28] <meoblast001> aapzak: why can't we have something new every 5 years?
[23:28] <meoblast001> if 9.10 doesn't have new sounds.. i'm making them
[23:28] <meoblast001> and i'll force everyone to like them
[23:28] <meoblast001> >:)
[23:28] <aapzak> :)
[23:29] <BUGabundo> I had my sounds disalbe for 2 years
[23:29] <meoblast001> i'll file a brainstorm entry "New Freaking Sounds.. AHHH"
[23:29] <BUGabundo> brought them back 3 weeks ago
[23:30] <aapzak> the woman I married uses sounds on her msgr, every login/logout produces sound, annoys the %@@& out of me
[23:30] <mrwes> divorce her
[23:31] <void^> married, past tense. see the problem there?
[23:31] <mrwes> :)
[23:31] <aapzak> I can hear my own laptop reboots through her machine :)
[23:31] <meoblast001> aapzak: so that means you would vote yes for new sounds?
[23:31] <syke> will gcc-snapshot be updated to GCC 4.4 RC1?
[23:32] <aapzak> void^: to marry, is a one time activity, which happened in the past :)
[23:32] <meoblast001> aapzak: and lasts a life time :P
[23:32] <Othor> anyone else having issue with nautilus scripts?
[23:32] <aapzak> meoblast001: I never use sounds, could not care less :)
[23:32] <aapzak> meoblast001: exactly
[23:32] <BUGabundo> aapzak: divorce her?
[23:33] <aapzak> hehehe, no way
[23:33] <BUGabundo> Othor: please stop asking , ok?
[23:33] <BUGabundo> aapzak: she is that good?
[23:33] <meoblast001> who agrees with me that the Linux kernel needs to support something like DLL's... where you can basically put SO's in the directory of the executable?
[23:33] <aapzak> she's interesting :)
[23:33] <BUGabundo> can you lend her to me for a while?
[23:33] <BUGabundo> meoblast001: those are called Modules!
[23:33] <Othor> BUGabundo, sorry i thought this was a support channel
[23:34] <aapzak> BUGabundo: we'll see :)
[23:34] <BUGabundo> Othor: it is! asking it 4 times is just "noise"
[23:34] <coppro> random question: What is with libklibcgoobledegookblabla.so?