[10:25] <lool> cjwatson: Around?
[10:25] <lool> cjwatson: I need some help to document the next steps on #345534 a bit more verbosely
[10:25] <lool> cjwatson: It's not entirely clear to me in what form the last actions should be implemented
[10:25] <lool> I'll add an ubiquity task as well
[10:27] <cjwatson> "moving stuff out of postinst to a separate script as to allow ubiquity to run it" delete that
[10:27] <cjwatson> it's entirely feasible for ubiquity to just call the postinst
[10:27] <cjwatson> fconfig I don't know about, I'll have to leave that to you guys
[10:28] <cjwatson> I can do a first pass at the ubiquity work
[10:29] <lool> cjwatson: Would be happy to have that
[10:29] <lool> cjwatson: fconfig is to update the bootscript which has the kernel cmdline
[10:29] <lool> The one we use on the install SD card will be replaced by the one to boot the final system
[10:30] <lool> e.g. the cmdline with boot=casper in live SD will be replaced with one which has an UUID= and all
[10:30] <cjwatson> ok
[10:34] <ogra> cjwatson, have you seen my updated syslog for the pre-partitioned issue ?
[10:35] <ogra> i did a try with ext3 as well for which i didnt upload logs (to make sure its no ext4 specific prob) which had the same result
[10:35] <cjwatson> ogra: yes, haven't dug into it yet though
[10:35] <ogra> just wanted to point out its not caused by selecting the wrong fs
[10:36] <ogra> behavior is identical with the right one selected
[10:58] <cjwatson> ogra: that just means there are two bugs :-)
[10:59] <cjwatson> ogra: there are several places where parted_server might incorrectly decide that the partition table needs to be rewritten; this is why working on a device with busy partitions is so delicate, because a very minor logic flaw in any one of those will cause the whole thing to break
[11:16] <ogra> cjwatson, yeah, i understand that
[11:49] <CIA-28> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3150 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog scripts/install.py): Refactor architecture/subarchitecture detection slightly.
[11:59] <CIA-28> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3151 ubiquity/ (7 files in 5 dirs): First pass at flash-kernel integration for armel (LP: #345534).
[12:00] <cjwatson> lool,ogra: ^- that's the general approach but of course may well need adjustment (it's untested); feel free to shout if anything else is needed in ubiquity
[12:00] <ogra> will do, i'll test with the next iso
[12:01] <ogra> note that there is still someting missing that sets the UUID in flash-kernel-installers postinst
[12:01] <cjwatson> right, happy for you guys to fix that though ;-)
[12:01] <ogra> i'm working on that today and might need your help later (i have no idea how to find the target device to get the uuid, i guess there is a d-i function or variable))
[12:02] <cjwatson> ha, not really
[12:02] <ogra> oh
[12:02] <cjwatson> it's just reimplemented with mount wherever it's needed
[12:02] <cjwatson> see the findfs function in grub-installer, for example
[12:02] <ogra> how does the grub installation udeb know it ?
[12:02] <cjwatson> findfs () {
[12:02] <cjwatson>         mount | grep "on $ROOT${1%/} " | cut -d' ' -f1
[12:02] <cjwatson> }
[12:02] <ogra> yeah, thats what i planned to look at
[12:03] <cjwatson> hardly worth abstracting elsewhere
[12:03] <cjwatson> grub-installer takes $ROOT as a parameter but you can just hardcode it to /target
[12:03] <ogra> oki
[12:03] <ogra> that should suffice
[12:03] <ogra> just need to assemble a proper cmdline and add some fconfig glue
[12:04] <cjwatson> and then obviously vol_id -u. Careful of paths though
[12:04] <ogra> yep
[12:04] <cjwatson> partman-target does: PATH="/lib/udev:$PATH" vol_id -u blah
[12:05] <ogra> ok
[12:05] <cjwatson> since it's been variously in /lib/udev/vol_id and /sbin/vol_id IIRC
[12:05] <ogra> why vol_id (which needs root) and not blkid ?
[12:06]  * ogra would have used blkid by default
[12:06] <cjwatson> the installer is root
[12:06] <ogra> indeed
[12:07] <cjwatson> also, blkid has a cache and it doesn't check whether it's up to date
[12:07] <cjwatson> so it can give wrong answers
[12:07] <ogra> ah, ok, that makes sense
[12:07] <cjwatson> especially when you've just done something like putting a new filesystem on the device ;-)
[12:07] <ogra> oh, and apparently blkid doesnt have a short output, i would need to parse it
[12:07] <cjwatson> the installer uses vol_id consistently everywhere
[12:08] <cjwatson> I don't think blkid is available in a udeb in any case
[12:08] <ogra> ah
[12:08] <cjwatson> hmm, the reason why I've been half-dozy all morning is that I FORGOT TO HAVE COFFEE
[12:09] <ogra> ouch and its alreayd past morning ... you have to travle back in time to correct that
[12:09] <ogra> *travel
[12:09] <lool> ogra: flash-kernel already has findfs
[12:09] <ogra> lool, oh, i didnt know ... in the udeb ?
[12:10] <lool> debian/flash-kernel-installer.postinst
[12:10] <ogra> yeah, i see it
[12:10] <ogra> i should have looked first :)
[12:10] <ogra> so my patch turns even more trivial
[12:12] <ogra> the ugly part is that fconfig turns \n into just \ ... so the quoting is nontrivial
[12:12] <lool> Uh?
[12:13] <ogra> the redboot script needs \ as newline char
[12:13] <ogra> silly convention
[12:13] <ogra> FCONFIG_STRING=" $LOAD_INITRAMFS\ $LOAD_KERNEL\ e -r 0x1000000 -s $INITRAMFS_SIZE -c $CMDLINE"
[12:14] <ogra> luckily it doesnt break if you add leading spaces to lines
[12:14] <ogra> so =" $LOAD_INITRAMFS\ $LOAD_KERNEL\ e ..." works
[12:14] <ogra> ugly nontheless
[12:20] <lool> ogra: are the backslashes needed?!
[12:20] <lool> ogra: I see space in the raw config bytes
[12:20] <lool> 005f030: 0062 6f6f 745f 7363 7269 7074 0066 6973  .boot_script.fis
[12:20] <lool> 005f040: 206c 6f61 6420 6b65 726e 656c 0a65 202d   load kernel.e -
[12:20] <lool> 005f050: 6320 2263 6f6e 736f 6c65 3d74 7479 6d78  c "console=ttymx
[12:20] <lool> sorry, it's 0a
[12:21] <lool> if (*dest == '\\') { *dest = '\n';
[12:21] <lool> So there's a conversion from \\ to \n (0a above)
[12:22] <lool> But you could as well use real newlines  :)
[12:22] <lool> And on print there's no conversion
[12:22] <lool> It ends with 0a 00
[12:24] <lool> ogra: (I'd personally use \\ instead of \ though)
[12:49] <ogra> lool, using \n makes me end up with something like http://paste.ubuntu.com/141370/
[12:52] <lool> ogra: \n isn't interpreted as 0x0a in bash; you want something like `printf "%s\n%s\n%s\n" "fis load initramfs" "fis load initrd" "exec -c ..."`
[12:53] <ogra> ah, well, escaped backslashes do it as well
[12:56] <lool> Yeah
[12:59] <lool> ogra: So I guess you're picking this up?
[12:59] <ogra> working actively on it already
[12:59] <ogra> so yes, feel free to assign to me
[13:05] <mvo> woah, thanks cjwatson for your super-quick fix for #351547
[13:09] <cjwatson> that's ok
[13:09] <cjwatson> did it work? :)
[13:12] <CIA-28> oem-config: cjwatson * r642 trunk/debian/ (changelog control):
[13:12] <CIA-28> oem-config: Suggest checkbox/checkbox-gtk rather than recommending
[13:12] <CIA-28> oem-config: hwtest/hwtest-gtk.
[13:20] <lool> cjwatson: Looked at the ubiquity changes for flash-kernel, they look really slick and nice, and I saw you patched the place which was patched for beta to allow us to continue without bootloader previouslyt
[13:32] <mvo> cjwatson: not sure, I have not rsyned a daily yet .) but I will try soon(ish) - my test machines mainboard died today, so I need to wait for the replacement before I can continue
[13:44] <CIA-28> partman-partitioning: cjwatson * r705 ubuntu/ (debian/changelog lib/resize.sh):
[13:44] <CIA-28> partman-partitioning: When resizing a non-virtual partition, update it after committing
[13:44] <CIA-28> partman-partitioning: changes, otherwise we might miss a change of filesystem that was just
[13:44] <CIA-28> partman-partitioning: committed (LP: #333356).
[13:47] <CIA-28> partman-partitioning: cjwatson * r706 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 65ubuntu2
[14:00] <CIA-28> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3152 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/components/usersetup.py): Fix yes/no question text in weak-password warning (LP: #352348).
[15:26] <CIA-28> oem-config: cjwatson * r643 trunk/debian/ (64 files in 2 dirs): Update translations from Launchpad.
[15:34] <CIA-28> casper: cjwatson * r607 trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs):
[15:34] <CIA-28> casper: Fix writing of "$@" to diverted update-initramfs script (here-documents
[15:34] <CIA-28> casper: perform parameter expansion unless the delimiter is quoted).
[15:37] <CIA-28> casper: cjwatson * r608 trunk/ (debian/changelog scripts/casper-bottom/24preseed):
[15:37] <CIA-28> casper: Don't bring up a temporary network interface while fetching the preseed
[15:37] <CIA-28> casper: file when netbooting, as that will disconnect our root filesystem
[15:37] <CIA-28> casper: (LP: #351982).
[15:39] <ogra> cjwatson, for the initramfs size i have: initrd_size=$(wc -c /target/boot/initrd.img-$(uname -r)|cut -d ' ' -f1) in flash-kernel-installer, lool thinks thats not safe enough, but i am not sure the /initrd.img symlink exists at the point where flash-kernel-installer runs, do you know more ?
[15:39] <ogra> (i simply assumed $(uname -r) matches our installer kernel anyway)
[15:41] <cjwatson> ogra: the symlink should exist; although uname -r should indeed match
[15:41] <cjwatson> well, in ubiquity it should match otherwise you'll have trouble booting; not necessarily in d-i
[15:41] <cjwatson> so it's probably safer to use the initrd.img symlink
[15:41] <ogra> ok
[15:42] <ogra> i wasnt sure it exists yet since we're just configuring kernel-img.conf in this place
[15:42] <CIA-28> casper: cjwatson * r609 trunk/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.168
[15:42] <cjwatson> in d-i, base-installer sets it up, which runs well before flash-kernel-installer
[15:43] <cjwatson> in ubiquity, it's created by configure_hardware, which runs immediately before configure_bootloader
[15:43] <ogra> ah, good
[15:43] <NCommander> cjwatson, did persia's lpia fixes make it in to the last upload? I'm working on the resolving the kernel problems ATM, but its not that useful if we can't install a kernel
[15:43] <cjwatson> besides, other bootloader installers need the initrd.img symlink
[15:43] <cjwatson> NCommander: which ones? I know I've merged several of his fixes
[15:44] <NCommander> the one that added lpia to base-installer
[15:44]  * NCommander goes hunting for the bug
[15:44] <cjwatson> apparently not
[15:44] <cjwatson> I'll merge that now
[15:45] <NCommander> cjwatson, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/base-installer/+bug/291670
[15:45] <NCommander> I'm working on resolving #347458 which will make cdrom-detector work, and make installation possible.
[15:48] <lool> ogra: Forget initramfs size calculation, we don't need them anymore
[15:49]  * ogra has http://paste.ubuntu.com/141467/
[15:49] <ogra> lool, got it booting ?
[15:49] <ogra> wow
[15:49] <lool> Yup
[15:49] <lool> ogra: I can actually get it to boot for you without changing your kernel :)
[15:49] <lool> ogra: Pass ramdisk_size=65536 on your kernel command-line and replace flash-kernel with a script I'll hand yuo
[15:49] <ogra> but i assume we need a special cmdline
[15:50] <lool> ogra: I'd like to push a new flash-kernel just updating the main flash-kernel script (for that change), ok with you?
[15:50] <ogra> sure
[15:50] <lool> ogra: i'm using: exec -r 0x01000000 -s 0x00940000 -c "console=ttymxc0,115200 root=/dev/mmcblk0p2 ro rootdelay=2"
[15:51] <lool> It makes booting slower because we're reading from flash (padding)
[15:51] <ogra> yeah
[15:51]  * NCommander notes something is seriously wrong with his laptop
[15:51] <lool> ~ 10 M instead of 4 M
[15:51] <CIA-28> base-installer: cjwatson * r358 ubuntu/ (11 files in 4 dirs): merge from lp:~persia/base-installer/add-lpia
[15:51] <ogra> 10M should be fine for the start
[15:54] <CIA-28> base-installer: cjwatson * r359 ubuntu/kernel/ (4 files in 2 dirs): try linux-lpia first, as is standard behaviour for Ubuntu
[15:56] <NCommander> thanks cjwatson
[15:58] <CIA-28> base-installer: cjwatson * r360 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.98ubuntu5
[16:06] <CIA-28> oem-config: cjwatson * r644 trunk/ (d-i/manifest debian/changelog):
[16:06] <CIA-28> oem-config: Automatic update of included source packages: console-setup 1.28ubuntu7,
[16:06] <CIA-28> oem-config: user-setup 1.23ubuntu15.
[16:07] <lool> ogra: I pushed the updated flash-kernel
[16:07]  * ogra waits patiently
[16:07] <ogra> i cant get it booting
[16:08] <ogra>  e -r 0x1000000 -s 0x00940000 -c "console=ttymxc0,115200 console=tty1 file=/cdrom/preseed/ubuntu.seed ramdisk_size=65536 boot=casper LIVEMEDIA=/dev/mmcblk0p1 --"
[16:08] <ogra> gives me a kernel panic ... so i assume you added something special ?
[16:08] <lool> ogra: did you pad your initrd with zeroes?
[16:08] <ogra> indeed i didnt
[16:08] <lool> ogra: also, check fis list -d
[16:09] <lool> ogra: It should show a datalength of 0x00940000; that was what prevented me using the actually correct padding I had earlier
[16:09] <ogra> ah
[16:09] <lool> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lool/flash-kernel
[16:09] <lool> Run that, and it should just work (tm)
[16:10] <lool> ogra: I pushed that one to the archive, it's much cleaner, but sadly even more complex
[16:10] <ogra> ogra@osiris:/var/build/babbage/images$ sudo fis -d /dev/mmcblk0 -o 0x40000 list|grep initramfs
[16:10] <ogra>        initramfs: addr = 0x00560000, size = 0x002e0000, entry = 0x01000000, length = 0x00452133, cksum = 0x1d051f73
[16:10] <lool> It's the only arch where we have to create an intermediate file and it also requires fis partitions instead of mtd
[16:10] <lool> ogra: Oh you need to use -s $size
[16:10] <ogra> indeed thats not 0x00940000
[16:12] <lool> ogra: Do you have changes in progress for flash-kernel?  Otherwise I could as well do that flash-kernel.conf thingy
[16:12] <lool> ogra: BTW I'm using a fixed kernel
[16:13] <ogra> feel free, i have http://paste.ubuntu.com/141467/
[16:13] <ogra> but that will need modification after your changes
[16:13] <ogra> i can push my stuff later if all your changes are in
[16:15] <lool> ogra: load_initrd versus ld_initrd
[16:16] <ogra> that makes the var name so long
[16:16] <ogra> (it was load_initrd load_kernel before :)
[16:17] <ogra> but i can indeed change it back
[16:18] <ogra> ah, intresting, with -s $size i get "RAMDISK: ran out of compressed data"
[16:20] <ogra> http://paste.ubuntu.com/141491/
[16:27] <lool> ogra: That's without ramdisk_size?
[16:27] <ogra> no, still with
[16:27] <lool> With padded ramdisk?
[16:27] <lool> and correct datalength?
[16:27] <ogra> no
[16:27] <ogra> its based on the current image
[16:28] <ogra> oh, wait, thats with ramdisk_size
[16:28] <lool> ogra: You need to have zeroes in memory, if you just fis load initramfs, it will be random RAM data after the initrd
[16:28] <ogra> yeah
[16:29] <ogra> i dont have the intramfs handy since i build the image on antimony ...
[16:33] <ogra> lool, pad=$(expr $ifissize - $ifilesize) .... pad=$(($ifissize - $ifilesize))
[16:33] <ogra> saves you the call to expr
[16:35] <lool> ogra: I copied this from Thecus; I didn't want to diverge from the rest of the file, but now that i look at it, i see that $(()) is used in the file as well
[16:35] <ogra> yeah, dirty
[16:35] <ogra> just noticed the same
[16:36] <CIA-28> oem-config: cjwatson * r645 trunk/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.54.10
[16:43] <ogra> lool, hrm, that flash-kernel change will produce probs for users that already have a babbage install
[16:44] <ogra> we would need to repartition the fis setup on the fly
[16:45] <ogra> initramfs: addr = 0x00560000, size = 0x002e0000, entry = 0x01000000, length = 0x00452133, cksum = 0x1d051f73 ...
[16:45] <ogra> 0x002e0000 = 3014656 bytes
[16:45] <lool> ogra: ?
[16:45] <ogra> ogra@osiris:/var/build/babbage/images$ wc -c armel.initrd-imx51
[16:45] <ogra> 4530483 armel.initrd-imx51
[16:46] <lool> ogra: I will fail on upgrades with the version I just pushed
[16:46] <ogra> check_size "$initrd" $ifilesize $ifissize
[16:46] <ogra> that will always fail
[16:47] <lool> Why?
[16:47] <lool> Oh you're saying your fis entry was too small
[16:47] <lool> Well I don't know how you picked your values; mine work   :-P
[16:47] <ogra> yes, since it doesnt hold anything
[16:47] <lool> But note that it's not a flash-kernel change, it's just an issue with newer kernels and your partition
[16:47] <lool> (more modules, not enough space)
[16:48] <ogra> yours uses addr and size
[16:48] <lool> ogra, NCommander, persia: you should create a /etc/flash-kernel.conf with:
[16:48] <lool> fis_dev="/dev/mmcblk0"
[16:48] <lool> fis_offset_hex="0x40000"
[16:48] <ogra> while the old way was to use addr and length
[16:48] <lool> fis_size_hex="0x1F000"
[16:48] <lool> ogra: Uh?
[16:49] <NCommander> huh?
[16:49] <ogra> size only tells how big the fis entry is ...
[16:49] <lool> ogra: Yes, and I'm padding it in full
[16:49] <ogra> not how big the initramfs is
[16:49] <lool> Yes, I don't care how large it is
[16:49] <lool> I'm just checking it fits
[16:49] <ogra> into what ? the fis entry only has meta info we dont need it that big
[16:49] <lool> ogra: I think you're confused
[16:50] <lool> ogra: check_size "$initrd" $ifilesize $ifissize is a check to make sure that the initramfs data fits in the initramfs partition
[16:50] <ogra> i think check_size should check on lenght
[16:50] <lool> $ifissize is the size of the initramfs partition, as listed in fis -l output
[16:50] <ogra> right
[16:50] <lool> ogra: What "length"?
[16:51] <lool> $ifilesize is the size of the file we want to write
[16:51] <ogra> initramfs: addr = 0x00560000, size = 0x002e0000, entry = 0x01000000, length = 0x00452133, cksum = 0x1d051f73
[16:51] <lool> length is the data length of the *old* data
[16:51] <lool> It's irrelevant
[16:52] <lool> ogra: Your fis partition for initramfs is too small; it's 3014656 bytes; my initrd is currently 3913573
[16:52] <ogra> so why did the 4530483bytes big initramfs we use atm ever get loaded at all if it was stored in a 3014656 bytes big partition ?
[16:52] <lool> ogra: Yours?  I don't know
[16:53] <ogra> the fis partition only holds metadata
[16:53] <lool> ogra: My partition is large enough; are you sure your ramdisk was loaded?  perhaps it was cut?
[16:53] <ogra> lool, we released beta with that
[16:53] <ogra> and yes, i'm sure it wasnt cut
[16:54] <lool> ogra: Perhaps the initrd was smaller?  I don't know
[16:54] <lool> ogra: Did flash-kernel run with the beta image?
[16:54] <lool> ogra: Perhaps you truncated it when creating the SD card image
[16:54] <ogra> length = 0x00452133 == 4530483 bytes
[16:54] <lool> Ouch
[16:54] <lool> I know what you did
[16:55] <lool> You wrote past the end of the fis partition for the initramfs
[16:55] <lool> fis is really stupid
[16:55] <lool> ogra: You had a fis entry for <-----> and you wrote <-----------> to it
[16:55] <ogra> fis only contains metadata that tells redboot from where to load the actual payload
[16:55] <lool> ogra: This is exactly like a partition table
[16:56] <ogra> so the fis partition doesnt need to have the actual size of the initramfs
[16:56] <lool> erf
[16:56] <ogra> entry = 0x01000000, length = 0x00452133 are the relevant infos redboot uses ...
[16:57] <lool> ogra: No
[16:57] <lool> Not if you fis create
[16:57] <ogra> i do fis create
[16:57] <lool> It will flash past the end of your partition
[16:57] <lool> ogra: You realize that if anything is after the initramfs partition it will be overwritten?
[16:57] <ogra> i actually copied your code from flash-kernel to do that
[16:58] <lool> You're lucky to have 20M as the first partition
[16:58] <ogra> and used the settings the FSL binary blob had as defaults
[16:58] <lool> ogra: No, my code in flash-kernel enforces the size to be large enough
[16:58] <lool> You might have copied the code doing the write, but not copied the test...
[16:59] <lool> ogra: Anyway, done is done; it's a really serious bug for that flavour but fortunately it's used by a handful of people
[17:00] <lool> ogra: let's move it to -arm
[17:03] <ogra> grr
[17:04] <ogra> lool, i always used whats created by default by sd_init_babbage.bin
[17:04] <lool> ogra: I never used that
[17:05] <ogra> you never used updater.sh ?
[17:06] <lool> No
[17:06] <ogra> ah
[17:06] <ogra> well, everyone else did :)
[17:06] <lool> ogra: I think I mentionned the size of the partitions I created on my 16M SD card
[17:06] <lool> And mentionned that they were a bit tight, but enough
[17:07] <lool> ogra: The way I created my partition table was by running fis init -f and fis create on a running system; then I did it again by using the fis command
[17:07]  * ogra adjusts the builder script to use 0x00940000 by default from now on
[17:08] <lool> ogra: I think you would have caught that error with a tighter size for the first partition
[17:09] <lool> ogra: Hey let's have a quick phone call
[17:09] <ogra> one sec
[17:10] <ogra> ready
[17:10] <ogra> (we should probably also take that conversation to #ubuntu-arm :) )
[18:33] <NCommander> This may be a stupid question, but what is a driver update disk, and when do we produce them?
[18:34] <cjwatson> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ubiquity/DriverUpdates
[21:21] <CIA-28> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3153 ubiquity/ (16 files in 9 dirs): bump to 1.12
[22:23] <CIA-28> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3154 ubiquity/debian/ (80 files in 2 dirs): Update translations from Launchpad.
[23:17] <CIA-28> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3155 ubiquity/ (d-i/manifest debian/changelog):
[23:17] <CIA-28> ubiquity: Automatic update of included source packages: base-installer
[23:17] <CIA-28> ubiquity: 1.98ubuntu5, flash-kernel 2.13ubuntu5, partman-partitioning 65ubuntu2.
[23:25] <CIA-28> ubiquity: cjwatson * r3156 ubiquity/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.12.1


[00:00] <directhex> ought to be okay, from that
[00:00] <penguin42> OY1R: I mean the good thing there is that it found there is a display on VGA, it's got the wrong res, but it's got the display
[00:00] <dwatkins> http://forum.oktabit.gr/files/PB_Maestro_240_TV.jpg and other pictures show n physical input selector, so I assume it's done from the remote, but the xrandr suggests the laptop 'sees' the display, it's just not initialising it, I guess.
[00:00] <penguin42> directhex: It's possible the display doesn't really like the 1152x864 ?
[00:00] <dwatkins> *no
[00:00] <directhex> if you click the button on the top right of the screen, then click "displays" (second option) it's got 2 screens listed?
[00:01] <directhex> you may need to untick "mirror displays" for it to show both
[00:01] <OY1R> penguin42, http://pastebin.com/eEZjCF3t
[00:02] <penguin42> OY1R: 2 more things, what res were you using the CRT at, and is it the VGA socket on the back of the monitor you're using or the phono set?
[00:03] <penguin42> OY1R: Well, it's good you're not using the Nvidia drivers, because you've got an ATI Radeon
[00:03] <OY1R> the crt runs @ 1600x1200
[00:05] <OY1R> phono set? ?
[00:05] <penguin42> OY1R: It's a VGA<->VGA lead ?
[00:05] <OY1R> i only have vga<>vga
[00:05] <penguin42> that Xorg.0.log is fine
[00:06] <penguin42> OY1R: OK, so if you bring up the monitor selector dialog, I assume it shows both monitors?  Does it show it as being mirrored? Does it show both monitors as being on?
[00:06] <OY1R> they are not mirrored and both are ON
[00:07] <penguin42> OY1R: OK, and what res does it think the external is set to?
[00:07] <OY1R> penguin42, once i connect it, resolution is set at 1920x1080 (highest)
[00:08] <penguin42> OY1R: Really? That's not what the xrandr seemed to say?
[00:08] <penguin42> oh sorry, yes it did
[00:09] <penguin42> OY1R: Try knocking that res down, as dwatkins suggested - see what happens
[00:09] <OY1R> penguin42, i have tried the whole list
[00:10] <penguin42> OY1R: Weird, what model laptop is this?
[00:10] <OY1R> inspiron 9400
[00:10] <OY1R> dell
[00:10] <penguin42> nod
[00:11]  * penguin42 is out of ideas - from those logs everything looks happy
[00:11] <OY1R> i just took a screen shot, and both screens are there
[00:12] <OY1R> i see both backgrounds and an open window on the secondary monitor in the screen shot, so it is fed video data, it's just in "no signal" mode or something like that.
[00:13] <penguin42> OY1R: Have you got a spare VGA lead?
[00:13] <OY1R> penguin42, yes, i tried it as well
[00:14] <penguin42> sorry, out of ideas
[00:15] <OY1R> snap
[00:15] <OY1R> thanks for trying tho.
[00:16] <penguin42> OY1R: If you boot with it plugged in do you see the BIOS display on it?
[00:16] <OY1R> No
[00:17] <penguin42> that's pretty odd
[00:17] <penguin42> OY1R: I've heard of TVs that are 1920x1080 like that one, but they can't do 1920x1080 on the VGA - but you've said you've tried lower res, I've also seen ones that have to select that input and stuff - but you said you used it on a vista laptop
[00:18] <OY1R> looking at it now on the vista laptop, runs fine both mirrored and extended
[00:18] <penguin42> OY1R: Have you got an Ubuntu boot cd/thumb drive you can try booting on that vista laptop?
[00:19] <OY1R> at full res, once i unplug it i get " no cable connected" and when i plug it in the ubuntu laptop it says "No signal" and powers down/sleeps
[00:19] <OY1R> hmm mi have not tried that
[00:19] <OY1R> i'll give it a shot
[00:20] <penguin42> OY1R: I'd try that, and the other thing I'd try is a 12.04 boot CD/thumb on your 10.04 laptop
[00:20] <ali1234> we get someone with this problem at least once a week
[00:20] <penguin42> ali1234: Monitor problems yes, but this one is a bit unusual
[00:20] <ali1234> always with HDTVs
[00:21] <penguin42> ali1234: I know there are problems with 1366x768 TVs, not seen/known of it with 1920's
[00:21] <ali1234> i suspect it is something to do wth HDCP
[00:21] <penguin42> ali1234: It's on VGA
[00:21] <OY1R> ubuntu live cd runs fine on the "vista" latop
[00:21] <ali1234> exactly
[00:21] <penguin42> ali1234: But it's on VGA - it can't be expecting HDCP
[00:21] <ali1234> VGA doesn't support HDCP for obvious reasons
[00:22] <penguin42> OY1R: OK so live cd on vista laptop works on this display - what about that live cd on the unhappy laptop?
[00:22] <OY1R> penguin42, i tried that, didnt work.
[00:22] <penguin42> OY1R: OK, what version is the live cd?
[00:22] <OY1R> 9.04
[00:23] <penguin42> OY1R: Well, only things I can think left to try (other than poking options on the monitor) are a) try a 12.04 live cd, b) try installing the radeon closed source drivers - not necessarily in that order
[00:24] <penguin42> OY1R: but IMHO it's odd that it wont see it from the BIOS screen
[00:24] <OY1R> i dont have the balls to mess with drivers atm, i need the laptop in working order on Monday at 8:30
[00:24] <OY1R> i just have to replace the monitor.
[00:25] <penguin42> OY1R: I've heard of monitor/machine incompatibilities - it's very rare though
[00:25] <OY1R> ok
[00:25] <penguin42> OY1R: Then try a 12.04 boot CD - if it works then you know you have a way out
[00:25] <ali1234> what do + and * mean on xrandr output?
[00:25] <penguin42> ali1234: Can't remember!
[00:26] <penguin42> ali1234: One of them is 'currently selected'
[00:26] <ali1234> one is current mode
[00:26] <ali1234> + is preferred more
[00:26] <ali1234> current mode used for the TV is 1152x864       75.0*
[00:26] <ali1234> it seems unlikely that that would work
[00:27] <penguin42> There was a fun bug in the Intel drivers a while back where one guys monitor only worked when it was the right temperature (due to a screw up int he way i2c was driven)
[00:27] <penguin42> ali1234: But hey said he tried all the modes
[00:27] <OY1R> can 12.04 use gnome ?
[00:27] <ali1234> 800x600?
[00:28] <ali1234> or 1024x768@60
[00:28] <penguin42> OY1R: Not gnome2 with the standard install - but youcan add the packages from mate-desktop.org that is a back ported gnome2
[00:28] <penguin42> OY1R: Actually, when you plug it into the Vista machine, what res does the vista machine think it's driving the monitor at?
[00:29] <OY1R> penguin42, vista sets the monitor at 1920x1080
[00:29] <ali1234> good question :)
[00:29] <penguin42> hmph
[00:31] <OY1R> screen shot i tool > http://postimage.org/image/rfbdtn7bp/full/
[00:31] <OY1R> the video data is there but the monitor does not want to switch on.
[00:31] <ali1234> that mode sn't even in the xrandr list
[00:32] <penguin42> ali1234: It i, the internal LCD is selected there - it's showing it's res
[00:33] <ali1234> set the mode to 800x600 60Hz then switch the TV to a different input and then back again
[00:34] <OY1R> i cant select anything on the monitor, it needs to be ON in order to access the menu
[00:34] <ali1234> turn it on then
[00:34] <OY1R> hehe i cant
[00:35] <ali1234> i don't understand
[00:35] <OY1R> well it says "No Signal" for a few seconds then turns off
[00:35] <OY1R> or goes to sleep
[00:35] <ali1234> the monitor has a tuner?
[00:35] <ali1234> the picture you posted has an RF input on it
[00:36] <ali1234> and scart for that matter
[00:36] <OY1R> no it does not!
[00:36] <ali1234> it only has VGA?
[00:36] <OY1R> it's a pc monitor, it has a dvi and vga only.
[00:37] <ali1234> i dunno then
[00:38] <ali1234> what happens if you reboot and enter the system bios with the external display connected?
[00:38] <penguin42> ali1234: Doesn't show anything - see above
[00:39] <OY1R> http://s14.postimage.org/c9vh3q3gx/Screenshot_2.png
[00:40] <OY1R> ali1234, no image on the external device when in bios either.
[00:42] <ali1234> Modeline "1920x1080"x0.0  148.50  1920 2008 2052 2200  1080 1084 1089 1125 +hsync +vsync (67.5 kHz)
[00:47] <ali1234> Modeline "1920x1080"x60.0  172.80  1920 2040 2248 2576  1080 1081 1084 1118 -hsync +vsync (67.1 kHz)
[00:47] <ali1234> weird
[00:51] <ali1234> the problem here is almost certainly bad EDID, with X being more willing to try odd modes than vista
[00:51] <ali1234> and both the 1080 modes have same overall refresh rate so there's no way to tell which it is using from xrandr
[00:51] <penguin42> ali1234: Except none of the modes work - not just the 1920
[00:52] <ali1234> yeah but you can't try both of the 1080 modes
[00:52] <ali1234> because xrandr is only listing one of them
[00:52] <penguin42> ali1234: Right, but if it's just one duff modeline that can't be the problem
[00:53] <penguin42> ali1234: Oh, add in the fact that it works on his other laptop with a 9.04 boot cd
[00:53] <ali1234> other laptop has what graphics card?
[00:53] <penguin42> dunno
[00:53] <ali1234> modeline choice is dictated by the graphics driver, which takes the EDID and calculates all valid modes; some of them calculate it better than others
[00:55] <ali1234> that second 1080 modeine i pasted has an excessive amount of overscan and also different sync polarity
[00:55] <penguin42> yeh, tvs often have odd overscan values
[00:55] <ali1234> but this isn't a TV
[00:56] <penguin42> oh yeh
[00:57] <penguin42> anyway, I'll stick with the previous recommendation; try a 12.04 boot cd, and try the closed radeon driver - not necessarily in that order
[00:57] <ali1234> i would set IgnoreEDID in xorg.conf and then write modelines by hand until i found one that worked
[00:58] <ali1234> but that takes time and effort
[00:58] <ali1234> oh, and i wouldn't bother using the open source drivers
[00:59] <penguin42> ali1234: They work well for me, and they worked fine for him on his previous monitor!
[00:59] <penguin42> (but he is on 10.04 at the moment and they were young then)
[01:21] <OY1R> i packed up the monitor i'll have it replaced tomorrow.
[01:28] <penguin42> OY1R: Good luck
[07:38] <popey> Morning
[07:39] <_serial_> Hi all :) I don't suppose you guys/gals know of any editor that can change the Unity panel colour?  At current I'm changing via CSS and the unity.css located in /usr/share/themes/
[07:40] <_serial_> The dash is covered via ubuntu-tweak
[07:40] <_serial_> but no panel :(
[07:45] <popey> _serial_: myunity?
[07:46] <_serial_> thank you popey :)
[08:18] <AlanBell> morning all
[08:19] <MartijnVdS> howdy AlanBell
[08:56] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[08:58] <dwatkins> hiya folks
[08:58]  * dwatkins waits patiently for his Raspberry Pi to arrive
[08:58] <brobostigon> hi dwatkins
[09:01] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: PI!
[09:01]  * MartijnVdS assembled a case yesterday
[09:01] <brobostigon> morning MartijnVdS
[09:02] <dwatkins> I also ordered a case from ModMyPi, which I should get later this month.
[09:02] <MartijnVdS> I have the Shropshire LUG one
[09:03] <MartijnVdS> http://shropshirelug.wordpress.com/2012/04/21/raspberry-pi-cases-now-available-5/
[09:03] <MartijnVdS> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=251053134771#
[09:03] <dwatkins> very nice :)
[09:03] <popey> i removed the cover from mine
[09:03] <popey> so i can get to the connectors inside
[09:04] <MartijnVdS> popey: yeah I might do that too
[09:04] <Myrtti> lol
[09:04] <popey> its still structurally sound
[09:04] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: lawl?
[09:04] <dwatkins> popey: completely, or just part of the cover?
[09:04] <Myrtti> I baked pie cases yesterday  ;-)
[09:04] <popey> the whole top
[09:04] <MartijnVdS> popey: Or I might get the Adafruit case http://www.adafruit.com/blog/2012/05/29/raspberry-pi-case-preview/
[09:04] <popey> yeah, it makes it look like that adafruit one
[09:04] <MartijnVdS> it has a ribbon cable output
[09:05] <Myrtti> Adafruit one looks good
[09:05] <MartijnVdS> I love how there's an entire industry growing around it
[09:06] <MartijnVdS> hardware people making cases, software people porting their distros, etc.
[09:07] <popey> thats kinda the idea ☺
[09:07] <popey> but its no different than arduino or beagle is it?
[09:07] <popey> more mainstream perhaps?
[09:07] <kvarley> popey: Difference is - the Raspberry Pi Foundation aren't getting a huge chunk of profit
[09:08] <MartijnVdS> popey: I didn't know about Arduino and Beagle before they were released
[09:08] <directhex> no, broadcom are :p
[09:08] <popey> nobody gets huge profit with arduino or beagle either
[09:08] <popey> yeah, raspi is to broadcom as beagle is to TI
[09:09] <directhex> pi is what happens when a major set-top box manufacturer cancels an order after the chips are at the fab
[09:09] <popey> and the other one.. panda
[09:09] <kvarley> popey: With the beagleboard-xm somebody has to, I mean - £140 for the board. The components and distribution can't cost that much, can they?
[09:09]  * kvarley has a beagleboard-xm
[09:09]  * popey has a beaglebone
[09:09] <kvarley> hehe
[09:09] <popey> not 140 quid
[09:09]  * directhex has an efikamx
[09:09] <directhex> freescale powah!
[09:09] <kvarley> popey: My beagleboard-xm was £140 from Farnell
[09:09]  * MartijnVdS imagines popey's house to be made out of computers
[09:09] <kvarley> Beaglebone is lower in price? £80?
[09:09] <popey> no, i mean the comparable beaglebone
[09:09] <popey> yeah
[09:10] <kvarley> I think all these small boards/devices that are springing up are amazing - especially for getting Linux ... well ... even more domination xd
[09:10] <popey> or android ☺
[09:10] <popey> that new VIA one looks interesting
[09:10] <directhex> android ¬_¬
[09:11] <directhex> what are these things gonna run other than the linux kernel? windows ce?
[09:11] <kvarley> popey: have you seen the Linux Mint PC announcement? fanless, small form factor - looks promising
[09:11] <MartijnVdS> directhex: aka "wince" 8-)
[09:11] <kvarley> directhex: Microsoft would have you believe it could run Windows 8 ... yeah right
[09:11] <popey> kvarley: i have
[09:12] <directhex> kvarley, well, not really, windows 8 arm has *very* exact requirements, which no £30 board will match
[09:12] <popey> mint has no mass-market future IMO
[09:13] <kvarley> directhex: I bet their requirements are too low as well. For example, you can't run windows 7 without a minimum of 2GB RAM and even that's not enough lol
[09:14] <directhex> kvarley, they've done a decent job with the WP7 requirements. i can't imagine W8 ARM being different
[09:14] <kvarley> popey: True - although - do you think Ubuntu has?
[09:14] <popey> yes, of course
[09:14] <popey> I can't see any tier-1 vendor shipping mint
[09:14] <directhex> mint, the distro with all the stuff ubuntu can't legally ship, shipping on hardware?
[09:14] <directhex> this can't possibly go wrong 8D
[09:15] <kvarley> I think Ubuntu needs to target lower power devices again ... i.e. make it faster on common slower harware. Aside from that I'm totally itching to get my hands on an Android  phone with Ubuntu on it
[09:15] <popey> why?
[09:15] <popey> whats the lowest spec desktop you can buy now?
[09:15] <popey> or laptop
[09:17] <kvarley> popey: 1.6 GHz dual core with 2 GB ram ?
[09:17] <MartijnVdS> good enough for Ubuntu \
[09:17] <kvarley> I can't run unity on that hardware
[09:18] <MartijnVdS> you can
[09:18] <popey> i run it on lower
[09:18] <kvarley> Or at least, I can't run it without waiting a while for each menu
[09:18] <directhex> dash is slow on any hardware.
[09:18] <MartijnVdS> I made the cheapest PC I could find, with an AMD on-board graphics thing
[09:18] <directhex> well, maybe not with an ssd
[09:18] <MartijnVdS> worked out of the box
[09:18] <popey> not everyone buys the lowest spec machine
[09:18] <kvarley> True
[09:18] <directhex> takes about a second on this i7
[09:18] <kvarley> I have no issues with unity other than maybe it could be more optimised
[09:18] <popey> yeah, it could always be faster ☺
[09:18] <kvarley> I suspect that hardware I said it can't run on is failing anyway
[09:19] <kvarley> GPU runs at 75 degrees celcius and the fans are always running really fast
[09:19]  * kvarley needs to get rid of it lol
[09:19] <MartijnVdS> clear the dust out of it
[09:19] <popey> i cant see a tablet or phone running a full ubuntu desktop stack
[09:20] <kvarley> popey: Unity got ported to Open GL ES so maybe it'd work on tablets
[09:20] <directhex> kvarley, 75 isn't much for a GPU
[09:20] <directhex> therman cutout on a geforce is >100
[09:20] <kvarley> directhex: It's in a netbook tho so it burns to touch it lol
[09:20] <popey> yeah, maybe
[09:32] <popey> oh and there's elementary OS too just out..
[09:32] <popey> it does amuse me that these ubuntu derivatives claim LTS status.
[09:33]  * popey wonders who is responsible for the non-ubuntu bits in 5 years time
[09:33] <MartijnVdS> popey: you will be
[09:34] <popey> nope ☺
[09:37] <dwatkins> has anyone here used the GPIO header on the Pi yet?
[09:37] <dwatkins> Just curious as to what applications it can have.
[09:38]  * popey installs arduino (and thus java) on his arm based laptop
[09:38]  * popey wonders how badly this will run
[09:39] <dwatkins> An ARM based laptop? What is this witchcraft? ;)
[09:39] <popey> its an old toshiba ac100
[09:39] <popey> ships with android
[09:39] <popey> !ac100
[09:39] <popey> bah, stupid bot
[09:39] <dwatkins> ah I see, for a second I thought you might have built a laptop out of a RaspPi, popey :)
[09:39] <popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM/TEGRA/AC100
[09:39] <popey> hah
[09:40] <dwatkins> I have discussed the possibility of fitting a RaspPi with a 7-inch screen and bluetooth keyboard into one of those kids' laptop cases with someone I know.
[09:40] <popey> heh
[09:40] <popey> i always wanted to put a cell phone in a kids toy phone
[09:41] <dwatkins> http://is03.thegumtree.com/image/big/107643459.jpg and http://www.kaboodle.com/reviews/winfun-laptop-junior-cow
[09:42] <popey> buzz_: happy birthday!
[09:42] <buzz_> heh thanks popey :)
[09:42] <buzz_> im not really sat on irfc on my bd. just checking in before my bath
[09:42] <dwatkins> many happy returns, buzz_
[09:43] <buzz_> :)
[09:44] <popey> yay, arduino works on arm
[09:45] <buzz_> popey, done much with your raspberry pi? just got mine - although still in its box
[09:45] <buzz_> i need to get a case, i saw you posted about one the other day that looks nice
[09:45] <popey> not a lot
[09:45] <popey> yeah MartijnVdS has the same case, we were talking about it earlier here
[09:48] <buzz_> i wanted to play with xbmc on the pi, and perhaps as a router also
[09:48] <popey> kvarley: has made an image of openelec with xbmc on board
[09:49] <popey> http://kvarley.co.uk/RaspberryPi/OpenELEC/
[09:49] <kvarley> popey: =]
[09:49] <kvarley> Only thing you may need to do is after the first boot resize your second partition to fill the card.
[09:49] <buzz_> nice
[09:49]  * popey pinps that a bit
[09:49] <popey> *pimps
[09:49] <kvarley> I'm working on a boot script to do it automatically for the next revision
[09:50] <popey> you on G+ kvarley ?
[09:50] <kvarley> popey: have an account but never use it
[09:50] <popey> ok
[09:50] <dwatkins> automatic resize sounds really handy
[09:51] <dwatkins> I assume that would be with resizefs
[09:51] <kvarley> dwatkins: yup
[09:51] <kvarley> The openelec automatically checks for /storage/.config/autostart.sh
[09:52] <buzz_> i started backported the libjpegturbo stuff from xbmc mainline to xbmc4xbox. massive difference for image viewing and especially thumbnailing. seems to be a memory leak though in my code. erg
[09:52] <popey> kvarley: you might get some more hits now ☺
[09:52] <kvarley> So I'm just gonna add a hook to call a resize function
[09:52] <kvarley> popey: hehe - why?
[09:54] <popey> kvarley: tweeted it and G+'ed it
[09:56] <kvarley> popey: Thank you =]
[09:56] <kvarley> popey: I'm nearly in a position to automate the build and upload process
[09:57] <popey> oh thats even better
[09:57] <popey> daily builds
[09:57] <kvarley> Just looking at the ubuntu one api
[10:03] <bigcalm> Hullo peeps :)
[10:06] <popey> pip pip
[10:07] <kvarley> Can it really be as simple as "resize2fs /dev/mmcblk0p2" ? lol
[10:07] <dwatkins> you need to edit the fstab data first
[10:08] <dwatkins> as I understand it, resize2fs grows the partition to fill the space indicated by the new partition table, but it must begin at the same exact byte as the filesystem starts
[10:15] <bigcalm> popey: have I been missing much?
[10:18] <kvarley> dwatkins: you're right
[10:19] <kvarley> dwatkins: For my purposes I can just remove the partition and make a new one which is proportional to the device's size
[10:20] <dwatkins> ah ok cool, kvarley
[10:24] <popey> bigcalm: oh, you're "back" back?
[10:25] <bigcalm> popey: back in merry old England, in my office, trying not to work
[10:26] <bigcalm> Also, I'm not using bigcalm_laptop ;)
[10:27] <Pendulum> bigcalm: get out of your house. Or at least off the computer :P
[10:28] <bigcalm> Pendulum: I will once Hayley has stopped using her computer :P
[11:19] <kvarley> popey: Resize script is a no-go
[11:19] <kvarley> popey: Can't seem to unmount the second partition after boot
[11:50]  * AlanBell plays with a pi
[11:51] <penguin42> doing anything fun with it?
[11:52] <AlanBell> making several debian SD cards at the moment
[11:52] <AlanBell> I was trying to install gnome on it, but I got in a bit of a muddle
[11:53] <AlanBell> I might end up using it as an irssi terminal in the office
[11:54] <AlanBell> and as a general always on thing I can get to in the office, maybe with a webcam attached to it
[11:55] <AlanBell> it seems a class 10 SD card really is quite a lot faster than a class 4 SD card
[11:58] <penguin42> 2.5 times faster?
[11:59] <penguin42> AlanBell: Be a little careful, there are apparently some that are fast at specific things - like single streams (optimised for video, great at dd speed but not great for file access)
[11:59] <AlanBell> well with the class 4 ones it seems to be taking longer to get onto the card than it did to download
[12:01] <penguin42> AlanBell: Some SD cards are AWFULlY slow, and some SD interfaces are awful, put the two together and you may as well be using punch card
[12:01] <popey> AlanBell: which class 10 device do you have?
[12:01] <AlanBell> popey: an oggcamp vintage 16GB class 10 SD card from the cameras
[12:02] <penguin42> AlanBell: https://wiki.linaro.org/WorkingGroups/Kernel/Projects/FlashCardSurvey    has some details and a bit of a survey
[12:02] <AlanBell> it took 724.841 seconds to dd the pi debian image to the class 4 device. will try the class 10 again shortly after I grow the partitions on this one
[12:06] <penguin42> AlanBell: I assume you were using a decent blocksize?
[12:07] <AlanBell> no, forgot about that
[12:08] <AlanBell> hmm, maybe it isn't massively faster
[12:10] <AlanBell> anyhow, I will let this run on the class 10, then repeat with a block size set
[12:12] <penguin42> oh, use a bs of at least 128k
[12:20] <popey> does blocksize make a big difference?
[12:21] <AlanBell> 378.601 s for the class 10 device with default blocksize
[12:21] <penguin42> what size is your file?
[12:22] <AlanBell> 1.9GB
[12:22] <penguin42> AlanBell: I mean that's not too bad - 5MB/s
[12:22] <AlanBell> 69.5577 s with a 1MB blocksize
[12:22] <AlanBell> 28MB/s
[12:23] <AlanBell> on the class 10 SD card
[12:24] <penguin42> AlanBell: It's very difficult to know - I mean a class 10 card is supposed to mean 10 MB/s (according to wikipedia) - so who the heck knows what's going on
[12:24] <AlanBell> well clearly block size makes a huge difference
[12:24] <AlanBell> trying the class 4 with a 1M blocksize
[12:28] <AlanBell>  228.404 s for the class 4 with 1M blocksize
[12:39] <AlanBell> I wish stuff on SD cards and USB cards didn't require sudo access
[12:44] <penguin42> ?
[12:44] <AlanBell> maybe it should, but with gparted and dd I could so easily be installing a raspberry pi image on sda by accident
[12:45] <AlanBell> that would be a bad thing
[12:49] <penguin42> AlanBell: I'm sure you could set up a udev rule appropriately
[12:50] <AlanBell> 135.117 s for a class 8 card
[13:03] <MartijnVdS> I needs more CPU!
[13:04] <MartijnVdS> Video encoding + RAW image decoding = ouch @ i3
[13:04] <AlanBell> yeah, that is nearly as processor intensive as adding a file to Ubuntu One
[13:10] <AlanBell> 414.804 s to copy the image to an elderly unrated 2GB SD card
[13:10] <AlanBell> whilst uploading stuff to Ubuntu One so my processor was maxed out
[13:16] <MartijnVdS> wut
[13:16] <MartijnVdS> how is that cpu-bound and not network-bound?
[13:17] <AlanBell> I have no idea
[13:17] <AlanBell> it has calmed down a bit, but it was sending the fans crazy
[13:18] <AlanBell> it was a folder of 331MB and 29,000 files so maybe it was doing lots of hashing and stuff first
[13:21] <czajkowski> aloha
[13:21] <AlanBell> hi czajkowski, got your bunting up?
[13:23] <czajkowski> ah no :)
[13:23] <czajkowski> so not very me
[13:34] <AlanBell> I now have 5 assorted SD cards with debian raspberry pi images on them
[15:58] <MartijnVdS> \o/ firmware bug in DSL modem fixed
[16:00] <MartijnVdS> I can now connect it to my gbit switch without link dropping 30% of the time
[16:14] <ali1234> bastion is up in the software centre :D
[16:17] <ali1234> popey: using lowest available spec to buy as an excuse for dropping hardware support is a bad idea because once you go down that path you can justify it at every release
[16:19] <ali1234> supposing i buy that lowest-possible-spec machine today. ok, fine, ubuntu runs on it
[16:19] <ali1234> then in six months it's upgrade time, but since the machine is no longer available, ubutu no longers runs on it
[16:19] <ali1234> so if i can only afford the cheapest machines i'm now trapped in a cycle of buying a new computer every 6 months
[16:19] <MartijnVdS> that's why you run LTS, so you don't have to upgrade for 5 years
[16:19] <ali1234> this is bad for obvious reasons
[16:20] <ali1234> LTS is not a solution, the software is extremely out of date
[16:20] <MartijnVdS> not yet..
[16:20] <MartijnVdS> also, backports will exist
[16:21] <ali1234> you may as well say to use puppy linux or something
[16:21] <AlanBell> so what is the solution ali1234
[16:21] <MartijnVdS> Make it work on 386-SX-16s
[16:21] <ali1234> this is a slippery slope and at the bottom there's a message that says "don't use ubuntu if your computer is over 1 year old"
[16:22] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: but Ubuntu works fine on my 2-year old machine
[16:22] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: and my 4-year old one
[16:22] <ali1234> AlanBell: the solution is to force all developers to use machines with VGA graphics and 256MB of memory
[16:23] <AlanBell> heh, no!
[16:23] <ali1234> someone always brings out the 386 strawman every time this issue is raised
[16:23] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: Where do you draw the line then?
[16:23] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: because you do have to draw a line somewhere
[16:24] <ali1234> you draw the line at anything purchasable up to 5 years ago
[16:24] <MartijnVdS> 386, etc. is exaggerated.. but Pentium 1 MMX-233? Pentium III-400?
[16:24] <ali1234> as opposed to anything purchasable today
[16:24] <ali1234> nope, none of those
[16:24] <MartijnVdS> So Pentium IV at least?
[16:24] <ali1234> yeah, sounds good
[16:25] <ali1234> basically, by supporting anything you could buy 5 years ago, you ensure that anything you buy new today will be supported by the latest ubuntu in 5 years
[16:25] <MartijnVdS> I have a P4 that works fine. Unity is 2D, but that's because of the ancient NVidia card
[16:25] <ali1234> i never said that it wouldn't
[16:26] <MartijnVdS> then what's the problem? :)
[16:27] <MartijnVdS> because that P4 is from '03 or '04 I think
[16:27] <ali1234> the problem is that "you can't buy those any more" is too often used as an excuse for poor programming
[16:27] <ali1234> and whenever i call anyone on it they trot out the 386 strawman
[16:27] <MartijnVdS> Find a better way to call them on it ;)
[16:27] <ali1234> and then refuse to commit to a reasonable middle ground
[16:28] <MartijnVdS> "But they're still around and common"?
[16:29] <ali1234> yes, hence the 5 year limit
[16:40] <diplo> afternoon all
[16:53] <ali1234> directhex: does bastion use that xna/gamepad library you were talking about packaging the other day?
[16:54] <Azelphur> wtf lol, amazon just emailed me they want me to submit a review for a gift card xD
[16:56] <ali1234> directhex: GamepadBridge.dll and MonoGame.Framework.Linux.dll, that's it isn't it?
[16:56] <ali1234> wonder why it doesn't work...
[18:42] <ali1234> http://askubuntu.com/questions/145615/how-to-make-xbox-joypad-work-with-bastion
[18:42] <ali1234> i tried to debug this by building monogame from source, but bastion uses a modified version and because it is MS-PL licensed, they didn't release their modifications
[18:42] <ali1234> so i can't compile it with debugging to figure out why it doesn't work
[19:01] <penguin42> did someone say there was something like a cut down base ubuntu install available in 12.04 ?
[19:02] <penguin42> oh, tgz only not iso?
[19:18] <penguin42> right, time to reinstall one of my dads machines; last reinstalled in '03 with debian and upgraded ever since
[19:20] <palnj> hello people!
[19:22] <penguin42> Hi
[19:22] <popey> penguin42: ubuntu-core, yeah, no kernel in it either
[19:25] <penguin42> popey: Oh right, ok, I'll go with a desktop image and see what happens; it's getting MATEd after I get the base install on
[19:25] <popey> ⍨
[19:30] <Laney> g'day MATE
[19:31] <popey> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/mele-1080p-android-2-3-internet-tv-set-top-box-w-wifi-optical-3-x-usb-hdmi-av-lan-sd-119913
[19:31] <popey> interesting device
[19:32] <directhex> ali1234, yes, it does
[19:32] <directhex> ali1234, bastion needs an opengl 2.1 capable 3d driver, so if you're on intel, it won't fly
[19:33] <palnj> AlanBell: I finally managed to get some stamps for that CD and the RAM :)
[19:33] <AlanBell> heh
[19:34] <AlanBell> you get 12.04 now
[19:34] <directhex> ali1234, monogame upstream has two opengl codepaths, one for opengl 1.1, and one for 2.0 - bastion's monogame isn't the same as the upstream 2.5 release, and also the 1.1 codepath isn't very well tested
[19:34]  * AlanBell reminds people of http://ubuntu-uk.org/free-cds/
[19:34] <directhex> since real computers can do 2.0
[19:34] <ali1234> directhex: what does opengl have to do with my joypad?
[19:35] <palnj> that's cool, i recently had to reflash my PC's HDD with Vista...
[19:35] <ali1234> http://askubuntu.com/questions/145615/how-to-make-xbox-joypad-work-with-bastion
[19:35] <directhex> ali1234, i assumed you were having the usual issues people report w/ bastion
[19:36] <ali1234> no, it works perfectly except for joypad
[19:36] <directhex> i'll try with my pad
[19:36] <ali1234> basically, the game makes noises when i press buttons, but that's it
[19:37] <ali1234> it's like it recognises the pad but doesn't understand what any of the buttons are
[19:37] <palnj> So yeah, it should be in the post by tomorrow, AlanBell, and then I'll actually be able to use that piece of junk PC in the basement.
[19:38] <directhex> ali1234, okay, i can repro the issue
[19:38] <ali1234> what type of pad?
[19:38] <directhex> xbox 360 wired pad
[19:38] <ali1234> hmm
[19:39] <ali1234> if anything would work, that should
[19:41] <directhex> trying to force the issue
[19:41] <ali1234> monogame does detect joypad type by looking for "x-box" or "microsoft" in the name
[19:41] <ali1234> so perhaps it only affects x-box controllers, and the other code path works?
[19:41] <ali1234> even though yurs is 360 and mine is classic...
[19:48] <directhex> let me see if i can get a joypad test built against monogame
[19:49] <ali1234> i've already done that
[19:49] <ali1234> with monogame trunk my pad works, but bastion needs a modded monogame
[19:49] <ali1234> or are you gonna build against their modded one?
[19:50] <directhex> erk... i can do
[19:50] <directhex> didn't know you'd tested that far!
[19:51] <directhex> you might want to report a bug with supergiant then
[19:53] <penguin42> hmm it doesn't like that - won't get past the boot/ do you want to install/try etc screen - maybe try a xubuntu cd
[20:02] <penguin42> when I hit return on the 'install ubuntu' what does it actually do at that point - how much of the iso does it read into RAM?
[20:02] <directhex> penguin42, the alternate installer?
[20:02] <penguin42> no, main
[20:06]  * penguin42 has a nasty feeling that the problem is that it's reading the stick at USB1
[20:06] <penguin42> it's got to the desktop now - after 5min+
[20:12] <penguin42> I think the USB interface that will boot is the USB1 interface - the give away is if you unplug the USB stick after a few mins then you get errors about failed to do block reads
[20:18] <popey> penguin42: how much ram does the machine have?
[20:33] <penguin42> popey: 2GB
[20:33]  * popey shakes his head at yet another UEFI thread
[20:34] <penguin42> popey: I think it's that the standard installer can't cope with USB1.1; I'll file a bug after I get the damn thing installed - a) It doesn't give  any feedback in the section after hitting return on the 'install ubuntu...' and b) because USB1.1 is so slow lightdm times out
[20:34] <popey> why are you using a USB 1.1 port?
[20:35] <penguin42> popey: It won't boot off the USB2 addin card
[20:36] <popey> it doesnt have any native USB 2 ports?
[20:36] <penguin42> popey: I don't think so
[20:36] <popey> golly
[20:37] <penguin42> popey: Using Xubuntu installer DVD booted OK and started the installer OK, although the installer is crashing (with no logs) - but I think that's the xubuntu installer, I'm going to burn a Ubuntu DVD and try that
[20:37] <penguin42> popey: Machine is 2003 vintage; 2GHz Athlon, now has 2GB RAM (added over the years), a USB-2 addin card
[20:38] <popey> retro
[20:38] <popey> 2GHz in 2003 doesn't sound right
[20:38] <popey> I didnt get 2GHz until 4 years ago iirc
[20:38] <penguin42> popey: Yeh it does - nothing has happened for the last 10 years in clock speed
[20:39] <popey> mind you, thats a laptop
[20:42] <penguin42> popey: Actually, it's 1.8GHz, Athlon XP2200+
[20:45] <mattt> evening
[20:45] <popey> lo
[20:52] <mattt> popey: breaking anything interesting this evening?
[20:52] <mattt> :)
[20:53] <popey> heh, no
[21:10] <penguin42> sigh - I can see I'm going to have to debootstrap this one like the other machine
[21:11] <popey> penguin42: tried the mini iso?
[21:13] <penguin42> which mini iso?
[21:14] <penguin42> popey: This ? https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD
[21:14] <dogmatic69> anyone using the Ethernet over mains, can you recommend one and tell me if there is a limit to the number of them you can use
[21:14] <penguin42> popey: I'll give it a go after my (imminent) shower - thanks
[21:28] <popey> penguin42: sorry, yes, that one
[21:41]  * hamitron loves the mini cd
[21:54] <czajkowski> herrrro
[22:00] <czajkowski> popey: how are you getting to the tower tomorow?
[22:01] <AlanBell> ooh, best viewpoint in the city I should think
[22:04] <czajkowski> hope so
[22:04] <czajkowski> https://plus.google.com/102921374554385564572/posts/X2tNkxyBMyy nyomtastic
[22:05] <AlanBell> who got to lick the spoon?
[22:10] <mattt> what happens tomorrow, boat parade ?
[22:10] <AlanBell> yeah, flotilla and royal barge thing
[22:10] <AlanBell> canonical is on the 27th floor of Millbank tower and has a great view of the river
[22:11] <Seeker`> Oooh, Alien just started on C4
[22:12] <czajkowski> AlanBell: jon
[22:12] <mattt> sweet, will canonical be open to the public?
[22:12] <mattt> :P
[22:12] <AlanBell> http://www.techdrivein.com/2012/02/no-more-dodge-windows-in-unity-global.html looks like this
[22:13] <mattt> AlanBell: i want me a view like that at work!
[22:13] <AlanBell> czajkowski: not surprised :)
[22:15] <czajkowski> mattt: nope
[22:15] <czajkowski> AlanBell: he got the choclate one
[22:15] <czajkowski> didnt want the one which had choclate and marshmallows and bisuits in it
[22:21]  * AlanBell spots another bug with the annoying and badly implemented top bar shadow :(
[22:22] <popey> czajkowski: train
[22:23] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/Screenshot%20from%202012-06-02%2023:21:03.png it pops up *over* an impress slide when using the presenter console
[22:23] <AlanBell> naughty shadow
[22:24] <popey> i wish that shadow would die
[22:25] <popey> czajkowski: bought tickets a couple of days ago, 8 quid each for adults 1 quid for each kid
[22:25] <popey> super cheap
[22:26] <popey> also, wow, presenter mode works?
[22:26] <AlanBell> bug 956863
[22:26] <AlanBell> presenter mode works perfectly
[22:27] <AlanBell> as do the openGL transitions
[22:27] <AlanBell> and they both might be in by default in quantal
[22:27] <popey> nice
[22:27] <popey> oh, not in 12.04?
[22:27] <AlanBell> not on the CD
[22:28] <AlanBell> !info libreoffice-presenter-console
[22:28]  * popey installs
[22:28] <AlanBell> !info libreoffice-ogltrans
[22:29] <AlanBell> they are dropping a bunch of template stuff and giving back space to the CD, I suggested they give with one hand and take with the other :)
[22:29] <AlanBell> still giving back a decent net reduction in space
[22:30] <penguin42> popey: hmm, there don't seem to be sums or signed sums in http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/precise/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/  which is where that mini.iso is
[22:30] <popey> penguin42: they should be on that wiki page
[22:30] <popey> yes, they are
[22:30] <penguin42> popey: Ah yes, it has the MD5 and SHA, and the page is on an https site so I guess that's OK
[22:31] <penguin42> ish
[22:31] <AlanBell> night all o/
[22:31] <penguin42> nn AB
[22:31] <popey> nn
[22:33] <czajkowski> popey: cool into vauxhaull station or waterloo ?
[22:33] <popey> both
[22:33] <popey> going to waterloo and changing to vauxhall
[22:34] <popey> then walk over bridge
[22:34] <czajkowski> nods
[22:35] <popey> hope the kids dont get bored ⍨
[22:35] <czajkowski> think we may end doing similar
[22:35] <czajkowski> westminster bridge is open for us
[22:35] <czajkowski> sorry tube to westminster and then walk
[22:36] <czajkowski> popey: they wont and I'm sure others will have kids also
[22:36] <czajkowski> I made cake
[22:36] <czajkowski> not sure how its gonna turn out
[22:36] <penguin42> cake is good
[22:37] <penguin42> the Times (yesterday?) had a recipie/design for a cake that assembled into a union jack
[22:37] <popey> hah
[22:37] <directhex> union flag
[22:37] <penguin42> carefully cut slices of raspberry and blueberry sponge
[22:38] <directhex> and hang from the jackstaff of your ship?
[22:39]  * penguin42 doesn't have a ship, and it might be a bit large for that (if I made it)
[22:39] <popey> bet its going to rain loads of cloud cover will be low so we see nothing ☺
[22:39] <popey> nvm, cake and stuff
[22:40] <Laney> partay
[22:42] <czajkowski> popey: aye does loook pretty wet up here alright
[22:42] <czajkowski> but so muggy
[22:46] <daftykins> what are you lot up to D:
[22:51] <popey> daftykins: canonical are having a party at Millbank tower tomorrow
[22:51] <popey> to say goodbye because we're moving out
[22:51] <popey> and it turns out there's some royal party going on, on the thames, on the same day
[22:52] <directhex> i'm busy not going to bed
[22:52] <directhex> this is fine, because new fathers do not need sleep
[22:52] <popey> directhex: when's it due?
[22:52] <daftykins> popey: ah interesting
[22:52] <daftykins> heh 'it'
[22:53] <directhex> popey, end of the month. however, arrival was on wednesday.
[22:53] <popey> oh, congrats
[22:53] <popey> what flavour was the derivative?
[22:53] <czajkowski> ROFLOL
[22:55] <Seeker`> mmmm, mint
[22:56] <dogmatic69> When converting an image from svg to png with `convert` is it possible to scale the svg before the conversion?
[22:57] <dogmatic69> I an using `convert file.svg -resize 1000 file.png` for example, but if the .svg is saved as 100px it is very grainy.
[22:58] <dogmatic69> would prefer to not open and edit (300+) svg files
[23:04] <penguin42> popey: Yeh! Debian installer wins
[23:27] <directhex> popey, all the data has been on twitter. you must not follow me on twitter. SHAMEFUL
[23:40] <dogmatic69> imagemagic not doing it, inkscape works well though


[08:28] <whiskers> tmpfs                   128404         0    128404   0% /dev/shm
[08:28] <whiskers> none                      5120      2820      2300  56% /dev
[08:28] <whiskers> there it is..
[08:29] <whiskers> looks like 13gigs
[08:29] <whiskers> already
[08:29] <whiskers> and no movies, games or mp3s
[08:29] <KaiL> how did you fill that?
[08:29] <whiskers> KaiL, building a basic ubuntu system
[08:29] <KaiL> wget -r *?
[08:30] <whiskers> KaiL, how can i find out how much space in my build directory .../usr/src
[08:30] <KaiL> du
[08:30] <whiskers> du what
[08:30] <prototyp> or use mc
[08:30] <PenguinBoy> great....the install continues!
[08:30] <KaiL> du /usr/src
[08:30] <KaiL> :)
[08:31] <whiskers> KaiL, i did du /usr/src...and a list is going on forever
[08:31] <whiskers> KaiL, how can i just get the stats
[08:31] <KaiL> at the end you get the numbers
[08:31] <whiskers> KaiL, well it may take hours
[08:31] <prototyp> 52 here...
[08:31] <prototyp> but 52 what?
[08:31] <prototyp> 52 files?
[08:31] <prototyp> 52 bytes?
[08:31] <KaiL> 52 KiB
[08:31] <whiskers> KaiL, ok i got to the end
[08:32] <whiskers> 3804496 /usr/src
[08:32] <whiskers> KaiL, so is that about 3gig in /usr/src....build files for ubuntu
[08:32] <KaiL> ~4GB
[08:32] <prototyp> so that's 3,8GB?
[08:32] <PenguinBoy> yes
[08:32] <whiskers> KaiL, so not too much....the rest of the 13gigs is strictly kubuntu
[08:33] <PenguinBoy> i did not think it require so much
[08:33] <whiskers> KaiL, and i still don't have the db stuff working so there is still some to go
[08:33] <Boogieman> hello
[08:33] <PenguinBoy> afternoon boogieman
[08:33] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, yes i would allocate 20gigs...if you don 't want any movies, games, mp3s, etc
[08:33] <Boogieman> for me evening
[08:33] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, but at least it is less than 80gigs for gentoo
[08:33] <prototyp> whiskers: how did you install kubuntu? CD? apt?
[08:34] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, dsl connection
[08:34] <KaiL> whiskers: 4GB sources out of which you need 0 byte is "not so much"?
[08:34] <PenguinBoy> whiskers...it is a moot point now....unless I want to reformat.....reinstall Xp......repartition...and reinstall Kubuntu.....that is a lot of work
[08:34] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, well i would before it is too late
[08:34] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, or try to resize
[08:34] <PenguinBoy> how then
[08:34] <prototyp> PenguinBoy: If your demands are not too high, 7 gigs should be plenty
[08:35] <prototyp> let me give you my df -h
[08:35] <PenguinBoy> k
[08:35] <whiskers> KaiL, i needed every byte of those 4gigs.
[08:35] <whiskers> KaiL, and still there is a few to go
[08:35] <prototyp> Filesystem            Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
[08:35] <prototyp> /dev/hda2             5,3G  3,2G  1,9G  63% /
[08:35] <prototyp> tmpfs                 126M     0  126M   0% /dev/shm
[08:35] <prototyp> /dev/hdb3             2,4G  4,0K  2,4G   1% /home/uitwisselmap
[08:35] <prototyp> /dev/hdb2             957M   33M  925M   4% /tmp
[08:35] <prototyp> /dev/hdb1             2,8G  422M  2,4G  15% /var
[08:36] <gdh> yeh, mine sits at 3G and there's a whole load of dross installed already. the base install was about 1.5G
[08:36] <PenguinBoy> wonderful
[08:36] <KaiL> ~3.7 - more common...
[08:36] <prototyp> exactly
[08:37] <PenguinBoy> I have Kubuntu on my desktop on an 80 GB HDD all of its own.....but my laptop only have 35 GB total
[08:37] <whiskers> prototyp, well maybe i will try ls of my build directory
[08:37] <prototyp> penguinboy: that's still 10 gigs more than my total diskspace :)
[08:37] <whiskers> automake       glom3       lame                         pgaccess  soundfonts
[08:37] <whiskers> cupid-0.0.2    gnolin      libgda2                      phex      transcode
[08:37] <whiskers> epson          gtkdoc      libgdamm                     playmidi  vienna
[08:37] <whiskers> f4l            gtranscode  libogg                       postgres  vorbistools
[08:37] <whiskers> ffmpeg         hdparm      libvorbis                    pygda     w32cod
[08:37] <whiskers> ffmpeg2theora  hk_classes  libxslt                      pygtk     xbase
[08:37] <whiskers> firefox        hplayer     linux-headers-2.6.10-5       rekall    XML::Parser
[08:37] <whiskers> freemat        imlib       linux-headers-2.6.10-5-386   rekall2
[08:37] <PenguinBoy> i fell much better now
[08:37] <whiskers> gimpshop       java        mysqladministrator           rpm
[08:37] <whiskers> glom           kexi        nvidia-kernel-source.tar.gz  scons
[08:37] <whiskers> glom2          knoda       nvu                          scummvm
[08:38] <whiskers> ok this is my build directory so far
[08:38] <prototyp> why build so much yourself?
[08:38] <gdh> lucky ol' you
[08:38] <PenguinBoy> lol
[08:38] <gdh> whiskers: give up now and use gentoo
[08:38] <prototyp> -grin-
[08:38] <whiskers> gdh, i don't have a big enough hard disk for gentoo
[08:38] <KaiL> now why you build all that manually?
[08:38] <PenguinBoy> how hdd intensive is gentoo
[08:38] <gdh> try Windows 95 then :)
[08:39] <prototyp> lol
[08:39] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, well i was up to 80gigs....before the HD crashed
[08:39] <prototyp> still sad what happened to good old BeOS
[08:39] <KaiL> PenguinBoy: with gentoo, you can fill every disk ;)
[08:39] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, but i am just working on the basics in ubuntu as you can see from sl
[08:39] <whiskers> ls
[08:39] <whiskers> ls /usr/src
[08:39] <prototyp> small, *nix based and blazing fast
[08:40] <PenguinBoy> does Gentoo have something similar to apt-get?  or do you compile everythign from source?
[08:40] <KaiL> source
[08:40] <prototyp> gentoo is emerging everything, right?
[08:40] <PenguinBoy> I really like apt-get
[08:41] <KaiL> gentoo is a great system: you compile 1 year to save 1sec a week afterwards :)
[08:41] <prototyp> KaiL: LOL
[08:42] <PenguinBoy> install done......everything okay this time
[08:42] <prototyp> do you guys also have the problem that the backports-repositories aren't working?
[08:43] <KaiL> which backports?
[08:44] <prototyp> deb http://backports.ubuntuforums.org/backports hoary-backports main universe multiverse restricted
[08:44] <prototyp> deb http://backports.ubuntuforums.org/backports hoary-extras main universe multiverse restricted
[08:44] <whiskers> KaiL, look at my ls /usr/src....and you will see i needed every byte of those 4 gigs
[08:44] <whiskers> KaiL, and still there is more to go
[08:45] <KaiL> whiskers: needed for what?
[08:45] <prototyp> 'Internal server error'
[08:45] <whiskers> KaiL, for a basic desktop system
[08:45] <prototyp> is what I get when I do apt-get update using those sources
[08:45] <KaiL> a better ego, that you compiled everything on your own?
[08:45] <whiskers> KaiL, no...if they would have been in synaptic...i would not have had to compile them
[08:46] <whiskers> KaiL, but you search for ffmpeg2theora for example and you will see
[08:46] <prototyp> I think that's what the backports were for...
[08:46] <KaiL> whiskers: and why hdparm? it's in main
[08:46] <whiskers> KaiL, the one in main is way out of date
[08:47] <whiskers> KaiL, same with scummvm
[08:47] <gsuveg> prototyp: me drop a http://backports.ubuntuforums.org/backports/dists/hoary-backports/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz  500 Internal Server Error
[08:47] <KaiL> oh, and you know 'universe'?
[08:48] <PenguinBoy> Now if I could only get my wireless connection to work I would be in perfect Linux bliss
[08:49] <prototyp> gsuveg: exactly
[08:49] <Boogieman> i cant unrar any file. booth unrar and rar-2.80 are not doing it somehow
[08:49] <gsuveg> ah
[08:49] <prototyp> but it's still on ubuntuguide.org
[08:49] <prototyp> so I wonder why
[08:49] <KaiL> whiskers: so now you have hdparm 5.9 instead of 5.8?
[08:49] <whiskers> Kail..yes 5.9...how did you know
[08:50] <whiskers> KaiL, the one in main was too old to be useful
[08:50] <KaiL> looked at /usr/share/doc/hdparm/copyright
[08:50] <whiskers> KaiL, you can see my computer
[08:50] <KaiL> next time you should try packages from breezy first - there's 6.1 :p
[08:50] <whiskers> KaiL, well i did not know breezy was ready yet
[08:50] <KaiL> /usr/share/doc/hdparm/copyright has the download-URL :)
[08:50] <whiskers> KaiL, did they fix a few of the problems
[08:50] <KaiL> but that seams to have changed recently
[08:51] <Boogieman> where is a source for 5.9?
[08:51] <KaiL> hdparm-6.1
[08:51] <KaiL>         - fix BLKGETSIZE bug introduced in 6.0
[08:51] <KaiL> hdparm-6.0
[08:51] <KaiL>         - correct usage of BLKGETSIZE64 (returns bytes instead of sectors)
[08:51] <KaiL>         - Added ATA Security switches (Benjamin Benz bbe[AT] heise[DOT] de)
[08:51] <whiskers> Boogieman, i have it all here and will upload it to you for free if there is anything you want from my build directory
[08:52] <PenguinBoy> whiskers can you fix my wireless connection???
[08:52] <Boogieman> at the moment i only need a working unrar
[08:52] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, i don't have the hardware to experiment with
[08:52] <Boogieman> lol PenguinBoy
[08:52] <whiskers> PenguinBoy, but if there is anything you want from my system...just let me know
[08:52] <PenguinBoy> nirvana
[08:53] <gBoodh> feck
[08:53] <gdh> Boogieman: tried the 'unrar' package from "multiverse" repository?
[08:53] <AMIGrAve> is there a solution for the kdelibs-data bug (#10035) in order to get back all kubuntish look of kde and the user kde configuration ?
[08:53] <gdh> it's the non-free 3.x which will deal with your RAR.
[08:53] <KaiL> whiskers: you know about that security thing?
[08:54] <gsuveg> http://my.opera.com/gsuveg/affiliate/ < please click this link
[08:54] <PenguinBoy> thanks for the assistance guys,,,,you were great!
[08:55] <whiskers> KaiL, also i have a little more to build let me give you an ls of unfinished stuff
[08:55] <gdh> gsuveg: get bent :)
[08:55] <Boogieman> gsuveg forget it
[08:55] <PenguinBoy> adios amigos y amigas!
[08:55] <Boogieman> multiverse?
[08:56] <whiskers> 141-Compleet bank  synth.zip
[08:56] <whiskers> 4494-wavetoy 4.zip
[08:56] <whiskers> 4494-wavetoy.zip
[08:56] <whiskers> admin.pdf
[08:56] <whiskers> all-20050216.tar.bz2
[08:56] <whiskers> Anatomic.P2P.Tracker.0.2.BETA.tar.gz
[08:56] <Boogieman> i only have universe
[08:56] <whiskers> Anvil of Dawn.zip
[08:56] <whiskers> autoconf-2.59.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> automake-1.9.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> bakery-2.3.13.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> beagle-0.0.9.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> cupid-0.0.2.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> curl-7.13.2.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> dmocodecs.tar.bz2
[08:56] <whiskers> essential-20050216.tar.bz2
[08:56] <whiskers> F4L-BETA-0.2.tar.bz2
[08:56] <prototyp> well... let's try the reboot... see if we still have a working system after that :P
[08:56] <whiskers> fairnat-0.79.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> fairnat-1.79.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> ffmpeg-0.4.9-pre1.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> firefox-1.0.3.installer.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> fixscript
[08:56] <whiskers> font-arial-iso-8859-1.tar.bz2
[08:56] <whiskers> FOTAQ_Floppy.zip
[08:56] <whiskers> fotaq.zip
[08:56] <whiskers> frabs210.zip
[08:56] <whiskers> gda2-postgres_1.2.1-2_i386.deb
[08:56] <whiskers> glame-2.0.0-1.1.fc3.fr.i386.rpm
[08:56] <whiskers> glom-0.8.20.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> glom-0.8.21.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> glom-0.8.22.tar.gz
[08:56] <whiskers> gtksql-0.4.2.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> gtranscode-v0.3.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> gtweakui-0.4.0-1.1.fc3.fr.i386.rpm
[08:57] <whiskers> hdparm-5.9.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> hdparm-6.0.tar.gz
 is there a solution for the kdelibs-data bug (#10035) in order to get back all kubuntish look of kde and the user kde configuration ? < that i want to know too
[08:57] <whiskers> hdparm-6.1.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> hk_classes-0.7.4-test1.tar.bz2
[08:57] <whiskers> hk_classes-htmldocumentation-0.7.3-test2.tar.bz2
[08:57] <whiskers> hxplay-1.0.3.tar.bz2
[08:57] <whiskers> imlib-1.9.15.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> Industrial-1.0.tar.bz2
[08:57] <Boogieman> yes whiskers you are great
[08:57] <whiskers> iso-codes_0.46-1.diff.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> iso-codes_0.46.orig.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> jeti0.6.4.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> kexi-0.1beta5.tar.bz2
[08:57] <whiskers> kexi_0.1cvs20050408-1_i386.deb
[08:57] <prototyp> Boogieman: hmm... I think I just faced that problem ;)
[08:57] <whiskers> knoda-0.7.4-test1.tar.bz2
[08:57] <gsuveg> ignore it ;)
[08:57] <whiskers> lame-3.96.1.tar.gz
[08:57] <AMIGrAve> Boogieman: yeps, I guess that like me you found a lot of posts about it but no real solution
[08:57] <whiskers> lame-3.96.1.zip
[08:57] <whiskers> lame-4.0a10.tar.bz2
[08:57] <whiskers> libao-0.8.6.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> libgda2_1.2.1.orig.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> libgda2-dev_1.2.1-2_i386.deb
[08:57] <whiskers> libming_0.2a.cvs20020110-1_i386.deb
[08:57] <whiskers> libmp3lame-devel-3.96.1-EL-1.tar.bz2
[08:57] <whiskers> libogg-1.1-1.src.rpm
[08:57] <whiskers> libogg-1.1.tar.gz
[08:57] <whiskers> libspeex1_1.1.6-2_i386.deb
[08:58] <whiskers> libspeex-dev_1.1.6-2_i386.deb
[08:58] <whiskers> libtwolame0_0.3.3-1_i386.deb
[08:58] <whiskers> libtwolame0-dev_0.3.3-1_i386.deb
[08:58] <whiskers> libvorbis-1.0.1-1.src.rpm
[08:58] <whiskers> libvorbis-1.0.1.tar.gz
[08:58] <whiskers> libvorbis-devel-1.0.1-1.i386.rpm
[08:58] <whiskers> libxslt-cvs-snapshot.tar.gz
[08:58] <prototyp> Is part of the bug that the entire kde panel 'dissapears' ?
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-3_files
[08:58] <AMIGrAve> whiskers: do you know about the #flood channel ?
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-3.html
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-4a_files
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-4a.html
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-5_files
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-5.html
[08:58] <prototyp> I've had to rebuild every section of it
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-6_files
[08:58] <prototyp> manually
[08:58] <Boogieman> me too
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-6.html
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-7_files
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-8_files
[08:58] <whiskers> Linmodem-HOWTO-8.html
[08:58] <whiskers> linux568.zip
[08:58] <whiskers> menueditor_0.4.3ubuntu1_all.deb
[08:58] <KaiL> Boogieman: dpkg -i --force-overwrite /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb
[08:58] <whiskers> menueditor_0.4.3ubuntu1.tar.gz
[08:58] <whiskers> mjpeg2kdlls.tar.bz2
[08:58] <whiskers> MonteCarlito_v1_05.xls
[08:58] <KaiL> whiskers: SHUT UP
[08:58] <whiskers> MPlayer-1.0pre6a.tar.bz2
[08:58] <whiskers> mplayer-w32codec-1.0-1.src.rpm
[08:58] <whiskers> mysql-administrator-1.0.20-linux.tar.gz
[08:58] <whiskers> mysql-administrator-2.0.20-linux.tar.gz
[08:59] <whiskers> norom-linmodem.t
[08:59] <Boogieman> whiskers please stop i
[08:59] <whiskers> KaiL,no..not trying to flood...just some additional stuff that needs to be done
[08:59] <whiskers> KaiL, along with breezy fixing the DSO and PHP stuff
[08:59] <whiskers> AMIGrAve, not trying to flood ..just pointing some of the shortcomings of ubuntu
[08:59] <Boogieman> it
[08:59] <whiskers> KaiL, ok..i will shut up
[08:59] <AMIGrAve> whiskers: all people will ignore you nick if you continue
[08:59] <buz> i solved that problem with a simple ignore
[08:59] <buz> forever
[08:59] <prototyp> well... I can add mc to that ;)
[08:59] <prototyp> for the basic install, that is
[08:59] <KaiL> not trying to flood << minister of information from Iraq? :)
 Boogieman: dpkg -i --force-overwrite /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb < that brings the kubuntu look back?
[09:00] <prototyp> no it doesn't
[09:00] <prototyp> it just fixes the dependency prob
[09:00] <KaiL> Boogieman: I thought, you have the problem while installing the update :)
[09:00] <prototyp> which is fine by me... I don't need the ubuntu-ish look, just a working system ;)
[09:00] <Boogieman> yes but i brought everything back manually
[09:01] <prototyp> anyway, thanks for your help guys
[09:01] <prototyp> I'll try a reboot now and see if everything stays working ;)
[09:01] <AMIGrAve> Boogieman: KaiL : the force overwrite will allow to install kdelibs-data but it won't bring back kubuntu look and behaviour. I tried to add a new user and log on with, I had a kde default desktop, not the kubuntu defaults
[09:02] <KaiL> test dpkg -i --force-overwrite /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb
[09:02] <KaiL> test: sudo "dpkg -i --force-overwrite /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb"
[09:02] <KaiL> ok
[09:02] <KaiL> just created an user command for that
[09:03] <gsuveg> i removed kdenetwork?, install kdelibs-data, and after reinstall kdenetwork
[09:03] <KaiL> knetworkconf afair
[09:03] <gsuveg> yes. that dont remember
[09:04] <KaiL> also a way
[09:04] <prototyp> brb
[09:04] <Boogieman> i have kdelibs-data 4:3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1
[09:04] <prototyp> (I hope) ;)
[09:05] <gsuveg> Version: 4:3.4.0-0ubuntu3
[09:05] <gsuveg> hmm
[09:05] <Boogieman> and where do i find multiverse sources for apt-get? is that the same as universe?
[09:05] <AMIGrAve> KaiL: did you had the problem ?
[09:06] <gdh> Boogieman: If it was the same as universe, it wouldn't be called multiverse :)
[09:06] <gdh> Boogieman: duplicate the universe line in your sources.list
[09:06] <gdh> Boogieman: and change universe to multiverse
[09:06] <Boogieman> what?
[09:06] <Boogieman> ahh
[09:06] <Boogieman> ok
[09:07] <KaiL> AMIGrAve: the dpkg-error or the gone away kubuntu-look?
[09:10] <KaiL> everybody get's the first (bad...), duno about the second
[09:10] <KaiL> I've set everything manually, as this once way a debian sarge
[09:10] <prototyp> well... that seems to work :)
[09:10] <AMIGrAve> KaiL: both. Well I had the dpkg-error and I forced the install. But now I can't get back kubuntu look and behaviour (with behaviour I mean that when I insert my usb storage, the icon won't come on the desktop anymore, the same for DVD's and my camera) and there are also other things that won't work anymore
[09:10] <prototyp> running 2.6.11-1
[09:10] <prototyp> :D
[09:11] <KaiL> grr, here 2.6.11 freezes on login :(
[09:11] <prototyp> the 686 or 386?
 Boogieman: and change universe to multiverse < that will do the trick?
[09:11] <KaiL> k7
[09:11] <gdh> That's what I said =)
[09:11] <prototyp> hmmm
[09:12] <prototyp> I'll try kubuntu on my brand-new k7 tomorrow
[09:12] <KaiL> login into X to be exact
[09:12] <gdh> deb http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hoary universe
[09:12] <gdh> deb http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hoary multiverse
[09:12] <gdh> both work like a charm
[09:12] <prototyp> have to get myself a decent disk imager first
[09:12] <KaiL> it's a 32Bit-K8 here (also known as Sempron)
[09:12] <prototyp> errr
[09:12] <prototyp> then I have a... K9? :)
[09:12] <gdh> arf :)
[09:12] <prototyp> AMD64-3200
[09:13] <KaiL> that's a 64Bit-K8
[09:13] <whiskers> i don't know why everybody gets mad at me...i just try to be honest
[09:13] <whiskers> and in my opinion...ubuntu needs more work
[09:13] <KaiL> K9 will follow in late 2007 :)
[09:13] <KaiL> whiskers: which kind of work?
[09:13] <AMIGrAve> KaiL: gonna try to reinstall kubuntu-desktop
[09:14] <KaiL> it's not the most important thing to have every app in the most recent version
[09:14] <prototyp> whiskers: linux needs more work in general ;)
[09:14] <whiskers> KaiL, well it would help to have all those packages plus a few more in synaptic already built....and also...to fix the DSO problem and the PHP problem
[09:14] <KaiL> I'm only a bit unlucky with the "universe", as so around everybody needs to fight with sources.list
[09:15] <whiskers> KaiL, universe does not have this material
[09:15] <KaiL> DSO? PHP?
[09:15] <KaiL> does debian?
[09:15] <whiskers> KaiL, i dont know what debian has....i go get the stuff myself
[09:16] <whiskers> KaiL, but if anybody wants anything for free...let me know
[09:16] <KaiL> currently I only hope, the last remaining hardware issues will go away until 5.10 comes out
[09:17] <KaiL> imho that's a "bit" more important than uncommon apps :)
[09:17] <prototyp> but... why is, for example, OOo not the latest version?
[09:17] <prototyp> why 1.1.3 when 1.1.4 is already months around?
[09:18] <buz> and why no *security* updates for thunderbird and firefox???
[09:18] <KaiL> compiling OOo is something for somebody who has killed mother and father...
[09:18] <buz> i thought there was a deb somewhere
[09:18] <KaiL> buz: ask on #ubuntu-devel :)
[09:19] <prototyp> KaiL: exactly... so why not ship it with ubuntu? :)
[09:19] <buz> i built oo 1.1.1 once
[09:19] <buz> took a long time but wasnt hard at all
[09:19] <gdh> and was ultimately disappointing :)
[09:19] <buz> of course, that could be related to the fact that it was on freebsd ;)
 KaiL: gonna try to reinstall kubuntu-desktop < but that want to also reinstall all the thing i have deinstalled
[09:20] <KaiL> Boogieman: only an idea:
[09:20] <KaiL> insert kubuntu cd
[09:20] <KaiL> mount /cdrom
[09:21] <KaiL> dpkg -i /cdrom//pool/main/k/kubuntu-default-settings/kubuntu-default-settings_5.04-11_all.deb
[09:21] <KaiL> ...I hope, the patch is correct :)
[09:22] <Boogieman> uhoh
[09:22] <KaiL> eh path
[09:22] <Boogieman> ./cdrom//pool < two //?
[09:23] <KaiL> apt-get --reinstall install kubuntu-default-settings << does the same
[09:23] <KaiL> ops, / is enough
[09:25] <Boogieman> ok i try to reinstall it
[09:26] <Boogieman> i have reinstalled it
[09:27] <Boogieman> i do a reboot now
[09:27] <KaiL> relogin should be enough
[09:27] <Boogieman> ok
[09:27] <Boogieman> i try
[09:31] <Boogieman> re
[09:32] <Boogieman> reinstalling the default settings did not do it
[09:34] <KaiL> hmm :(
[09:37] <Boogieman> and how can i get the preview funktion for videos back?
[09:38] <Boogieman> so that it show the first frame of the video as a pic
[09:38] <SpookyET> hi
[09:38] <prototyp> ey
[09:39] <SpookyET> What's up with the mem usage?  I got konqueror, kopete, konversation, and amaroK, and it is using 400 MiB of RAM.
[09:39] <KaiL> Boogieman: in konqueror view -> preview
[09:40] <KaiL> SpookyET: without buffers?
[09:40] <Boogieman> KaiL i know where to find it
[09:40] <SpookyET> buffers?
[09:40] <KaiL>              total       used       free     shared    buffers     cached
[09:40] <KaiL> Mem:           504        499          4          0         32        220
[09:40] <KaiL> -/+ buffers/cache:        247        256
[09:40] <KaiL> Swap:            0          0          0
[09:40] <Boogieman> but on what do i need to click
[09:41] <KaiL> ....499 MiB used, but only 257 for apps, the other half are buffers
[09:41] <SpookyET> what's that?
[09:41] <KaiL> output from free -m :)
[09:41] <KaiL> Boogieman: any of them not checked?
[09:41] <KaiL> then try that one :)
[09:42] <SpookyET> what are buffers
[09:42] <KaiL> caches of any kind
[09:43] <Boogieman> i have checked pdf, text files, written stuff, pictures, html files
[09:43] <Boogieman> but what do i need to check to get the video files
[09:43] <KaiL> no idea, which one that is...
[09:45] <Boogieman> i have checked all now
[09:45] <Boogieman> no viedeo preview
[09:45] <KaiL> akode-mpeg is installed?
[09:46] <Boogieman> whoops
[09:46] <Boogieman> no
[09:46] <KaiL> hmm
[09:46] <KaiL> but doesn't work here too - grrrr
[09:47] <Boogieman> installed it and same here
[09:47] <Boogieman> what is akode for?
[09:48] <KaiL> one of these media libs
[09:48] <Boogieman> can i uninstall it or is it needed by something?
[09:48] <KaiL> afair by this function only
[09:50] <Boogieman> akode and akode-mpeg deinstalled
[09:50] <KaiL> I'd say, this kdelibs-data update isn't the best thing I've seen....
[09:50] <KaiL> it worked with the old version?
[09:51] <Boogieman> yes in the old version everything was fine
[09:52] <Boogieman> kubuntu looked like kubuntu and the video files had a preview
[09:53] <sdogi> the bloodbath http://nurme.yi.org/~sdogi/Intro.avi.torrent
[09:54] <KaiL> bad :((
[09:55] <Boogieman> and can someone tell me why xine freezes when i want to load a subtitle?
[09:57] <whiskers> maybe if glom could make use of hd_classes like knoda does...it might have a chance to work
[09:57] <whiskers> but still the DSO needs to be fixed for kexi
[09:58] <whiskers> and PHP needs to be fixed for DBMaster
[09:59] <whiskers> and the kernel needs to be fixed for linmodems
[09:59] <Boogieman> what is better xine or mplayer? or is it just another holy war?
[09:59] <sdogi> Boogieman: mplayer consumes less
[09:59] <whiskers> Boogieman, one is gnome the other is kde
[10:00] <sdogi> but if you have powerful pc then xine could be easier and flexible to use i guess
[10:01] <Boogieman> i dont now if my 800mhz are powerful
[10:01] <whiskers> Boogieman, is it a P3
[10:01] <Boogieman> amd duron
[10:02] <whiskers> Boogieman, not too familiar with that...but if it is similar to P3...it should be fast enough for video...but it is right at the cutoff
[10:02] <whiskers> Boogieman, the 800M was really the cutoff point for a lot of apps
[10:03] <KaiL> whiskers: "cutoff point"?
[10:04] <Boogieman> can someone tell my why the mandrake guys are no using apt-get?
[10:04] <Boogieman> it is much easyer
[10:04] <smouche> I don't understand something: when I inserted dvd's before, an icon appeared on the desktop - now, no.  What's up with that?
[10:04] <whiskers> KaiL, yes...everybody was experimenting with video apps and dvd burning and many games....and 800M seemed to be around the cutoff point where they did not work well
[10:04] <KaiL> Duron 800 should be enough for Videos
[10:05] <KaiL> here mplayer wins a little bit, as it has --framedrop
[10:05] <KaiL> if you drop every 10th image,or so, nobody will see, but it doesn't get out of sync
[10:06] <Boogieman> can i user the 586 or 686 version on my 800m?
[10:07] <buz> 800m what
[10:07] <Boogieman> amd duron
[10:07] <KaiL> there's no k7 one?
[10:07] <buz> 686 for sure
[10:07] <buz> but there ought to be a k7 versio
[10:08] <Boogieman> yes
[10:08] <KaiL> lol..
[10:08] <KaiL>   mplayer-k7: Depends: mplayer-k6 but it is not going to be installed
[10:09] <KaiL> http://moba.linuxfaqs.de/mplayer_1.0cvs_i386.deb
[10:09] <KaiL> try that file
[10:09] <KaiL> has runtime detection of cpu features
[10:10] <KaiL> afair the "mplayer-k6" from debian doesn't even use 3DNow
[10:10] <sdogi> that sucks
[10:10] <sdogi> runtime detection cpu features
[10:10] <KaiL> why?
[10:10] <sdogi> mplayer is best compiled by yourself, then it is awsome
[10:10] <sdogi> by that i mean it consumes so few cpu cycles
[10:11] <KaiL> because it's 0,0000000000000001 slower, if there's one if() more?
[10:11] <sdogi> i use it on very shitty pc's like pentium I
[10:11] <gdh> Isn't the most important CPU-related part of 'mplayer' the libavcodec ? i.e. not part of mplayer ? :)
[10:11] <KaiL> I bet not using the features at all is much worse
[10:12] <Boogieman> ok you gave me the answer mplayer for itself is a holy war
[10:12] <KaiL> ack
[10:12] <gdh> haha
[10:12] <KaiL> I had that package made for my K6-2/500, as there using 3DNow is a rather good idea
[10:12] <whiskers> Boogieman, the entire GNU/Linux effort is a Holy War...and has been from the beginning
[10:13] <whiskers> Boogieman, Linus did not want to pay MS one dime for a kernel...so he began to write one himself
[10:13] <KaiL> sdogi: btw., why isn't xine much slower, as it always uses runtime detection?
[10:13] <KaiL> as all the libs do...:)
 http://moba.linuxfaqs.de/mplayer_1.0cvs_i386.deb < how do i install it?
[10:14] <KaiL> dpkg -i <file>
[10:14] <sdogi> KaiL: it is
[10:14] <sdogi> KaiL: it is a lot slower
[10:14] <KaiL> sdogi: because it has no framedrop option
[10:15] <sdogi> well i can nicely run mplayer without framedrop on my laptop
[10:15] <KaiL> if you disable that on mplayer, there's no relevant diff
[10:15] <KaiL> and xine not?
[10:15] <Boogieman> and what is with the dependencys?
[10:15] <sdogi> but with xine, there are those post processing things and stuff like that i have to disable and it wouldn't still be good as mplayer
[10:16] <KaiL> Boogieman: apt-get -f install
[10:16] <sdogi> also mplayer starts instantly but xine takes a lot time, which is minor issue for me though
[10:16] <Boogieman> KaiL help me
[10:16] <KaiL> ?
[10:17] <Boogieman> how do i install it?
[10:17] <prototyp> try mc
[10:17] <prototyp> apt-get install mc
[10:17] <prototyp> run it
[10:17] <KaiL> it's a bit dirty, but works: dpkg -i mplayer_1.0cvs_i386.deb; apt-get -f install
[10:17] <prototyp> step into the package
[10:17] <prototyp> goto the 'install' option
[10:17] <prototyp> (file)
[10:17] <prototyp> and press enter
[10:18] <nydust> why do i get this error: i get an error when i do an dist-upgrade .. kde-libs its trying to overwrite som files, but it cant do it
[10:18] <KaiL> nydust: sudo "dpkg -i --force-overwrite /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb"
[10:18] <prototyp> KaiL: you've had that in your cache, didn't you? :p
[10:18] <KaiL> prototyp: I made a user command
[10:19] <KaiL> after typing that 10 times
[10:19] <Choubaka> KaiL: those quotes are unnecessary.
[10:19] <prototyp> a user command... wow
[10:19] <Boogieman> E: Unable to lock the administration directory (/var/lib/dpkg/), are you root? KaiL
[10:19] <nydust> thanks
[10:19] <prototyp> Boogieman: type sudo in front of it
[10:19] <KaiL> Choubaka: but they make that endless line a bit more readable
[10:19] <Boogieman> i have done it with sudo
[10:20] <KaiL> second sudo after the ;
[10:20] <KaiL> so:
[10:20] <KaiL> sudo dpkg -i mplayer_1.0cvs_i386.deb; sudo apt-get -f install
[10:20] <KaiL> ..or really "" this time :)
[10:20] <nydust> where is the mysq lib for apache2?
[10:21] <KaiL> nydust: uhm?
[10:21] <KaiL> libapache2-mod-auth-mysql not I guess....
[10:21] <whiskers> nydust, the mysql module works with apache2...just the php does not
[10:22] <whiskers> nydust, i have no idea what is wrong with PHP...it does not work on win98 either even with a different webserver
[10:22] <whiskers> nydust, it was working on gentoo very well
[10:23] <nydust> cause i am trying to install mamboserver but it says that mysql is unavaiabel, but mysql-server and client are installed
[10:23] <nydust> whiskers, php is working here
[10:23] <whiskers> nydust, how did you get it working
[10:24] <nydust> apt-get install libapache2-mod-php4
[10:24] <whiskers> nydust, i got apt-get apache2-mfm-prefork-dev and libapache2-mod-php4 and php4-dev and php4-mysql and php4-pear
[10:24] <whiskers> nydust, and uh...php does not work here
[10:24] <whiskers> nydust, how did you get it working
[10:25] <nydust> whiskers, just that
[10:25] <whiskers> nydust, well the shit does not work here
[10:25] <nydust> and i did an apt-get install php4
[10:26] <nydust> try that
[10:26] <whiskers> nydust, nor does it work on win98 with xiopen web server either
[10:26] <nydust> do you have apache2-common
[10:26] <whiskers> nydust, let me see
[10:27] <whiskers> nydust, yes i have apache2common
[10:27] <nydust> strange
[10:27] <nydust> try to reinstall it
[10:27] <whiskers> nydust, apache2 works and it handles mysql ok...but php doesn't work worth a damn
[10:28] <whiskers> and i need it for testing DBMASTER
[10:28] <nydust> whiskers, strange, cause here php work and not mysql
[10:28] <whiskers> nydust, well there are still some problems with the kernel and ubuntu
[10:36] <whiskers> nydust, maybe there is another free webserver we can try on ubuntu instead of apache
[10:36] <whiskers> nydust, personally i think there is something wrong with php4...it seems to not be multithreaded or something
[10:37] <whiskers> nydust, beats the hell out of me
[10:38] <Boogieman> why is every mplayer packet broken?
[10:38] <sdogi> don't care, compile it
[10:40] <Boogieman> but will there be an update on the apt-get sources with working packets?
[10:40] <Boogieman> someday?
[10:41] <sdogi> the steps are -> get the source -> get essential codecs -> get fonts if you care about subtitles -> get skin or skins... unpack codecs to /usr/local/lib/codecs/ unpack fonts to /usr/local/share/mplayer/fonts unpack default skin to /usr/local/share/mplayer/Skin/default.. unpack mplayer source, write ./configure --enable-gui ..check what it tells you about what codecs are enabled and what not, if you care about something install it, if you don
[10:41] <sdogi> and after that you are done
[10:41] <sdogi> also i think that marillat mplayer thingy worked
[10:41] <sdogi> but i like to compile it anyway
[10:42] <segfault2k> mplayers works better if it's compiled
[10:42] <sdogi> and the things i told you are basically full howto, you can read about that from mplayersourcedir/README possibly.. most of the stuff at least
[10:42] <sdogi> it is too simple to compile it
[10:43] <Boogieman> i have marillat in my sources file but it dosent appear in kynaptic
[10:43] <whiskers> nydust, i am just going to go compile the whole thing from scratch and see if i can get it working
[10:45] <whiskers> nydust, i think there is a serious problem with libc6
[10:46] <whiskers> nydust, apparently there is a libc6.1 that makes use of some database stuff....but i only see the sourcecode for Intel64bit architecture and alpha architecture
[10:46] <whiskers> nydust, this is a serious fuck-up by the free software community
[10:47] <gdh> aye, someone's going to get fired over this one for sure :)
[10:50] <whiskers> nydust, because not everybody can afford the very expensive Intel 64 chip...nor the very expensive alpha chip
[10:50] <Boogieman> hm why does nothing with marillat in the name in kynaptic?
[10:53] <smouche> lol gdh
[11:12] <yannux> Hye eveyrbody
[11:14] <amichai> can someone tell me how i can get the menu transparent?
[11:15] <randabis> amichai: you can use kde control center to do so
[11:15] <yannux> I've got a little problem with konqueror
[11:15] <yannux> background color are setup to be white
[11:16] <yannux> but every time I open a new directory , it's blakc ;:s
[11:16] <amichai> randabis: yeah i know, u just dont remember where. i managed to make my bar transparent
[11:20] <randabis> hmm, I can't seem to find where you do that either
[11:20] <randabis> but I know it can be done...my k menu is using transparency
[11:26] <Boogieman> i like these black themes where everything uses transparency
[11:29] <segfault2k> how is the full codename?
[11:29] <segfault2k> badgeR?
[11:29] <yannux> bonne nuit tlm
[11:35] <whiskers> the only thing i can think of is for glom to try to make use of hk_classes so all that other shit doesn't have to be rebuilt
[11:36] <randabis> yeah; breezy badger
[11:36] <segfault2k> :D
[11:36] <randabis> It's not ready for any kind of real usage though from what I understand
[11:37] <whiskers> randabis, well when they get an installable copy...i will be glad to make an extra partition to check it out
[11:38] <whiskers> randabis, i still have 30gigs left
[11:38] <rzei> are devs aware that there are problems upgrading to the latest stable kdelibs?
[11:39] <rzei> pkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_4%3a3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb (--unpack): trying to overwrite `/usr/share/icons/default.kde', which is also in package knetworkconf
[11:39] <Anlar> rzei: it is in the bugzilla
[11:39] <randabis> yeah, there's a work around for that
[11:39] <whiskers> randabis, the problem seems to be that libc6.1 requires libdb4.2-dev and this destroys nearly everything gnome is built on...since gnome seems to heavily depend on libdb3-dev
[11:39] <rzei> randabis: do i need to remove knetworkconf?
[11:39] <Anlar> rzei: dpkg -i --force-overwrite /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_4%3a3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb
[11:40] <rzei> Anlar: oh ofc, thanks
[11:40] <whiskers> randabis, so it is one hell of a problem
[11:40] <rzei> restarting session..
[11:42] <whiskers> randabis, to see how serious it is...just do dpkg -i libdb4.2-dev but dont install
[11:42] <Anlar> whiskers again just whining because he is a skilless piece of shit it seems :)
[11:43] <randabis> heh
[11:43] <whiskers> Anlar, really Anlar..i am not whining...i am stating facts...non-emotioanlly....you are the one with some kind of defect
[11:43] <whiskers> Anlar, and your gutter language is indicative of your character
[11:45] <whiskers> Anlar, i would not doubt if you were really some type of capitalist pig
[11:46] <Anlar> lol
[11:48] <darwinist> hi peeps, peace