[00:46] <stilofromfr> Good night everyone , can somebody help me with this udev rules to recognize an android allwinnner A10 tablet with ADB over usb ? : # adb protocol on passion (ondaVi30v1) SUBSYSTEM=="usb", ATTR{idVendor}=="18d1", ATTR{idProduct}=="0003", MODE="0600", OWNER="<ylan>"
[00:46] <stilofromfr> it doesnt show up in adb ... thanks if someone is still up :)
[00:47] <stilofromfr> is there anything differnet to configure those on 12.04?
[03:19] <stilofromfr> Hello everyone I need urgent help on adb please ?!
[03:21] <stilofromfr> I cant get to see my tab I only get ??????????? no permission when Im rooted on my tablet according to superuser also I cant backup wcorrectly the stock rom , I need lights pls
[07:02] <diplo> Morning all
[07:36] <christel> morning!
[07:36] <christel> diplo: how was it? :D
[07:37] <diplo> Hiya christel, ok I think. We chatted for about 3 hours so can't have been that bad :)
[07:37] <diplo> She was nicer than her photo which was a bonus ( not that looks are everything but they do help )
[07:38] <diplo> Just as we left she said about seeing me again, but dont know if that's to remove the awkwardness, so will see in the coming days
[07:38] <popey> yay
[07:39] <popey> now leave it the industry standard two days before contacting again :)
[07:39] <popey> or.. find her on facebook and stalk her
[07:39] <diplo> Well lets just hope that has removed some of the nervousness from me!
[07:39] <diplo> Found her on FB already but won't stalk :D
[07:39] <popey> heh
[07:40] <diplo> She's away for 2 days anyway so good timing for me.
[07:41] <christel> diplo: :D
[07:41] <christel> superb!!
[07:41] <christel> i am most pleased for you \o/
[07:43] <TheOpenSourcerer> Gosh - so glad I don't have to deal with that kind of thing anymore.
[07:44] <TheOpenSourcerer> morning all btw
[07:44] <diplo> TheOpenSourcerer: I'd rather not as well
[07:44] <TheOpenSourcerer> oh.
[07:45] <diplo> quite happy to go straight to a full time relationship, skip the dating side that is
[07:45] <TheOpenSourcerer> yeah.
[07:45] <diplo> More because I'm rubbish at it
[07:45] <TheOpenSourcerer> I was never much cop at the chase. In fact Mrs OpenSourcerer ended up having to ask me out ;-)
[07:46] <christel> hehe
[07:46] <TheOpenSourcerer> Mightily glad she did.
[07:46] <diplo> TheOpenSourcerer: That would be great!
[07:51] <christel> i am suffering slightly today
[07:51] <diplo> booze ?
[07:52] <christel> yeah, went for a post-holiday gossipfest with friends last night... and feel in dire need of another holiday today!
[07:53] <TheOpenSourcerer> you back now then christel?
[07:53] <christel> yesss :D
[07:53] <christel> we should go on a date!
[07:53] <christel> of the lunch variety
[07:54] <TheOpenSourcerer> Hmm - not sure how my beloved wife would react.
[07:54] <christel> haha <3
[07:54] <christel> sok, we can bring AlanBell to chaperone!
[07:54] <TheOpenSourcerer> lol
[07:55] <TheOpenSourcerer> Next week is pants. AlanBell is helping at the Paralympics most of the week so I will be "manning the fort" as they say.
[07:55] <christel> ah yes! he is donning his dreadfully camp polyester suit for a week
[08:23] <JamesTait> Good morning all! :)
[08:28] <christel> MORNING JAMESLOVELYTAIT <3
[08:32]  * daubers sits in the dark waiting for the UPS to run out and the router to go off
[08:32] <daubers> stupid electric company
[08:35] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[08:39] <christel> \o brobostigon
[08:39] <brobostigon> \o christel
[08:45] <AlanBell> choo choo
[09:24] <mungojerry> http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2012/Aug-29.html << miguel de icaza gives up on desktop linux
[09:25] <mungojerry> to be fair, he's always talked like that. people used to think he was secretly working for MS
[09:39] <TheOpenSourcerer> mungojerry: That's a yawn inspiring post if ever I read one.
[09:40] <mungojerry> tinged with flamebait
[09:40] <TheOpenSourcerer> indeed. Well he's probably a bit skint and needs to get a new job.

[09:40] <directhex> he gave up on desktop linux years ago
[09:41] <directhex> how many years ago was helixcode, have things changed much since then?
[09:42] <directhex> or International GNOME Support before that
[09:43] <TheOpenSourcerer> I think, except for devs and graphic designers the whole "desktop" (whatever that is) is probably dead anyway.
[09:44] <mungojerry> i think who you mix with has an effect on your opinions. where i work, the linux desktop is thriving. if you hang out with hipsters and designers, then you could be forgiven for wondering if any other company besides apple & adobe produce hardware and software
[09:44] <directhex> mungojerry, introspection is important though
[09:45] <directhex> TheOpenSourcerer, the world & hos wife is on ipads these days?
[09:45] <mungojerry> yes, constructive criticism indeed
[09:46] <TheOpenSourcerer> directhex: ipads, Tabs, smartphones, phablets and whatever next will pop out of the woodwork...
[09:47] <TheOpenSourcerer> The new Samsung Camera is an interesting development - bits of "intelligent h/w" for a specific job rather than a general purpose "PC"...
[09:47] <popey> my mother in law has a desktop computer in her office, no smartphone. she recently retired, and got an ipad as a retirement present. i dont think she's used the pc since
[09:48] <gord> i don't see the worlds offices being replaced with ipads anytime soon
[09:48] <mungojerry> popey, how about data entry? does she have a bluetooth keyboard?
[09:48] <mungojerry> i like the idea of asus transformer, but you still need large disk to store your stuff
[09:48] <popey> she didnt until this week when her hubby bought one for her as a present
[09:49] <popey> i doubt she'll use it tbh
[09:49] <mungojerry> how does she type emails?
[09:49] <popey> there is this virtual keyboard which pops up on the screen
[09:49] <mungojerry> 10x slower than typing though
[09:49] <mungojerry> maybe she has the time
[09:49] <popey> i dont think its that slow
[09:50] <popey> i can type pretty quick on iphone and ipad
[09:50] <popey> but if she needs to she now has the hw keyboard if it's a tome
[09:50] <mungojerry> even swyping i can't write more than a few lines without thinking i need to crack open the laptop or not bother
[09:50] <popey> *shrug*
[09:51] <gord> typing on an ipad or anything larger isn't so bad, anything small sucks though
[09:52] <mungojerry> i think laptops will become slimmer and more device-like (i.e hard to replace parts), but laptops will be around for quite a while
[09:52] <Mez> mungojerry: on the transformer - typing isn't too bad as it feels close to a full size keyboard in landscape.
[09:52] <mungojerry> on the real keyboard or the touchscreen?
[09:55] <davmor2> Morning all
[09:55] <davmor2> czajkowski: Prod
[10:02] <christel> GOOD MORNING davmor2
[10:03] <davmor2> christel: oh that's loud I'm guessing you had a good night at the pub :D
[10:04] <christel> the pub was good, the morning was not so good :P
[10:04] <christel> improving now though
[10:08] <popey><PHONE_NUMBER>5
[10:08] <popey> uh, oops
[10:09]  * christel calls
[10:10] <davmor2> popey: D'oh
[10:10] <popey> meh
[10:11] <christel> (i always use irc as my "place to write stuff down" -- but i now have a query window with myself for the purpose as i end up sharing the weirdest stuff with The World otherwise)
[10:13] <popey> :)
[10:13] <gord> i've typed passwords into irc lots recently, cos i'm super smart
[10:13] <popey> thats exactly what i did
[10:13]  * davmor2 goes back and checks all of gords irc chats for passwords
[10:14]  * bigcalm rolls in
[10:14] <bigcalm> Sprints are painful
[10:14] <davmor2> bigcalm: how do chap
[10:15] <bigcalm> davmor2: worn down. How's you?
[10:15] <davmor2> bigcalm: I'm good thanks
[10:15] <christel> BIGCLAM :D:D:D:D
[10:15] <christel> how are you one of my bestestest and most favourite people in the entire world ever?!
[10:15] <bigcalm> mgdm: Boss is going to attend phpnw conference and is buying our tickets :D Have to pay for the hotel myself though...
[10:15] <bigcalm> LOL
[10:15] <bigcalm> Hey christel :D
[10:16] <bigcalm> christel: all the happier for seeing you
[10:16] <mgdm> bigcalm: woo!
[10:16] <bigcalm> christel: how are you my dear?
[10:16] <bigcalm> christel: I get the feeling that you want something of me? ;)
[10:17] <christel> bigcalm: :D
[10:17] <christel> me?! never!
[10:18] <christel> i just miss you that is all!
[10:18] <christel> :P
[10:18] <gord> genius idea, sprinkle some sort of mint on my vanilla latte
[10:19]  * bigcalm hugs christel
[10:22] <christel> HUGS ARE MY FAVOURITE :D
[10:22]  * christel hugs bigcalm
[10:24]  * mungojerry prods diplo
[10:30] <diplo> ello
[10:31] <mungojerry> how'd it go last night?
[10:32] <Mez> christel: are you causing trouble again ?
[10:34] <diplo> not to bad thanks, not sure if it's a goer or not, but I got more comfortable as the night went on, like an interview it'll get better with time I'm hoping :)
[10:35] <christel> Mez: never! i always behave well like the angelic person that i am :)
[10:35] <mungojerry> cool diplo :D
[10:35] <Mez> christel: I think I just saw something pink fly past my window.
[10:35] <mungojerry> did you show her your tux tattoo?
[10:36] <davmor2> Mez: wow you have pink planes out in coventry?
[10:36] <diplo> heh, no but her son has got a Rasp Pi! I was well impressed ( he's 12 )
[10:36] <Mez> It was kind of .... bacon shaped.
[10:36] <daubers> bacon?????
[10:36]  * daubers wants bacon
[10:36] <davmor2> Mez: but Jono's in the states
[10:37] <mungojerry> how do you get a surname like bacon anyway?
[10:37] <Mez> mungojerry: I'd reply to that - but it's too easy to make jokes about ancestry and pigs.
[10:37] <mungojerry> This most interesting surname has two possible interpretations, both of Germanic origin. It may be a metonymic occupational name for someone who prepared and sold cured pork, a pork butcher, from the Old French, Middle English "bacun, bacon", bacon, ham (of Germanic origin). The name, according to another source may derive from the Germanic personal name "Bac(c)o", "Bahho", from the root "bag", to fight, which was common among t
[10:37] <mungojerry> he Normans in the form "Bacus", "Bacon". Hence, the name was probably introduced into England by the Normans after the Conquest of 1066.
[10:38] <davmor2> mungojerry: well some woman marry Sir Francis and then had kids, and they had kids and so on
[10:39] <mungojerry> just discovered that synapse has an gnome-do theme...cheeky lol
[10:39] <mungojerry> looks identical
[10:40] <daubers> all this talk of bacon has made me hungry
[10:40] <mungojerry> i might go for bacon sarnie this lunch
[10:40] <christel> mmm i quite fancy some bacon also
[10:40] <davmor2> is betting that christel already has a bacon sandwich
[10:40] <christel> not yet!  so i now have to decide what my urgency fee should be
[10:43] <daubers> christel: Roll a d20 and multiply by £1000?
[10:43] <christel> i like your thinking!
[10:43] <daubers> (that's not how I cost engineer days for people I don't like..... honest)
[10:44] <christel> *grin*
[10:44] <mungojerry> time x 1.5 ?
[10:44] <davmor2> daubers: I think you mean roll 5 d20's
[10:44] <daubers> davmor2: Hah!
[10:44] <mungojerry> i have managed to avoid ever having to work on a sunday before
[10:45] <mungojerry> i just say "aint gonna happen dude"
[10:46] <davmor2> daubers: with a d20 there is still the chance of getting 1
[10:46] <bigcalm> mgdm: this is what I get for booking late. Had to get the Executive room for 75 quid a night
[10:47] <christel> x 1.5 could work.. or simply x 2 (they need it so they're hardly likely to argue)
[10:47] <christel> bigcalm: where you off to?
[10:49] <bigcalm> christel: PHP North West conference in October up in Manc
[10:49] <christel> aa
[10:56] <christel> :)
[10:56] <daubers> davmor2: Not with my d20...
[10:57] <davmor2> daubers: weighted d20's don't count, also d20's with 20 on every side don't count either :D
[10:58] <daubers> davmor2: :p
[10:59] <popey> mungojerry, you work in public sector? :)
[11:07] <mungojerry> popey, yes
[11:07] <mungojerry> only recently though, most years were in banking sector and softwre
[11:09] <mungojerry> where i was often the main linux guy
[11:09] <popey> why don't you work weekends?
[11:10] <jpds> popey: I do.
[11:11]  * jpds runs.
[11:11] <mungojerry> i value time with my family, and i enjoy going to church on sunday more than i do going to work. my good spiritual wellbeing has an impact on my work life too
[11:11] <popey> Ah.
[11:12] <mungojerry> i've managed to avoid issues until now by agreeing to do a saturday and then early on the monday for office moves and power downs etc
[11:12] <popey> people still go to church on sunday :S
[11:12] <mungojerry> it generally works out well for my sanity not to make too many compromises
[11:12] <mungojerry> yes, my church has over 1000 on a sunday, it's brilliant
[11:13] <christel> see, i wish i had sensible values like that... i frequently end up working at weekends instead of spending time with my family, most often motivated by shoes... i may place too high a value on my ability to purchase shoes :s
[11:13] <popey> golly
[11:14] <christel> my that is a rather large attendance
[11:15] <mungojerry> it's not your songs of praise type dusty church thing. most churches nowadays have different approach
[11:17] <mungojerry> anyone understand what the zeitgeist full text search extension does? i understand it doesn't index all of the text in a file, but trying to understand what it gives me
[11:19] <brobostigon> interesting, amazon android appstore, now available in the uk.
[11:19] <mungojerry> brobostigon, do they still do free app of the day?
[11:19] <brobostigon> mungojerry: yes.
[11:20] <christel> balls, they accepted my x2 quote, i should have gone higher!
[11:20] <mungojerry> gamblers regret.
[11:21] <mungojerry> brobostigon, do you have a link please?
[11:21] <mungojerry> not showing on my amazon page
[11:21] <christel> i always quote way too conservatively i think... i never know what would be "too far" so i tend to play it safe and then go "duh... i should have gone higher" :)
[11:22] <mungojerry> amazon are announcing some stuffs in september too
[11:22] <brobostigon> https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/feature.htmfedup.com.aul?docId=1000644603
[11:22] <mungojerry> ta
[11:23] <brobostigon> :)
[11:23] <mungojerry> no room on my phone for more apps but my tablet has loads :D
[11:23] <mungojerry> i'm enjoying world of goo like never before on my tablet
[11:26] <daubers> Hmmm... never liked the Amazon ToS for their App Store. Have they fixed it yet?
[11:28] <TheOpenSourcerer> It's not fair. 12 peeps have rated christel 's rack but only 3 mine :-( http://ratemyspicerack.com/opensourcerer/
[11:31] <TheOpenSourcerer> Funny pic of the day - a cow laughing at a horse stuck in a gate https://twitter.com/MATTYB00SH/status/241104086630539264/photo/1
[11:31]  * christel rates TheOpenSourcerer's rack
[11:32] <diplo> I will take a look tonight and rate TheOpenSourcerer as I have to add my cupboard rack :)
[11:33]  * TheOpenSourcerer hates waiting for the postman...
[11:36] <directhex> badger
[11:38] <TheOpenSourcerer> hedgehog
[11:46] <czajkowski> dog
[11:47] <davmor2> Moo Cow
[11:54]  * mungojerry returns to desk with BLT and after eight sweets
[11:56] <mungojerry> been thinking about the amazon appstore. i would actually be more inclined to use it than google one since i don't have goog payments set up
[11:56]  * gord has candy that tastes like sweet potato and has edible wrappers :P
[11:57] <popey> i used to eat the wrappers from opal fruits
[11:57] <gord> that explains a lot
[11:58] <mungojerry> remember mint acers?
[11:58] <mungojerry> mmmm
[11:59] <davmor2> popey: thet missed a treat not making them out of rice paper :)
[12:10] <czajkowski> oh edible paper
[12:10] <czajkowski> yummy stuff
[12:13] <oly> hi, Anyone know if you can create web app integrations with python, ie using the new ubuntu feature in 12.10 looked around but not finding anything :/
[12:19] <mungojerry> just read that gnomebuntu is getting a release with 12.10
[12:24] <czajkowski> gnomebuntu?
[12:26] <KungFuPanda> Hi guys, I want to write a init.d script in order to run youtrack or teamcity on system boot up,  I do not know anything about init.d script, anyone can give a good script tutorial ?
[12:28] <mungojerry> czajkowski, http://worldofgnome.org/gnomebuntu-is-set-to-arrive-in-october-18/
[12:33] <bigcalm> mgdm: is there a guide to writing good annotations so that phpdoc can pick them up?
[12:35] <bigcalm> KungFuPanda: 1st result searching on "how to write a init.d script": http://www.cyberciti.biz/tips/linux-write-sys-v-init-script-to-start-stop-service.html
[12:35] <bigcalm> KungFuPanda: there are many more results to wade though as well
[12:40] <KungFuPanda> bigcalm: thanks a lot
[13:04] <ali1234> oly: you use dbus like a normal application
[13:15] <mungojerry> bacon tshirt: http://shirt.woot.com/offers/the-piglets-of-the-caribbacon
[13:16] <mungojerry> if i was vegetarian i'd still eat bacon :D
[13:16] <christel> surely it counts as one of your five-a-day? :)
[13:16] <mungojerry> five animals a day?
[13:17] <christel> haha
[13:17] <oly> ali1234, thats intresting will see if i can find some example on that :)
[13:17] <mungojerry> they don't specify 5 what do they?
[13:17] <oly> used dbus a little in python
[13:26] <davmor2> mungojerry, christel: you 5 pork items a day, have pigs in blankets you hit 2 straight away :)
[13:26] <mungojerry> mmm pigs in blankets, inserted inside a chicken
[13:26] <mungojerry> which is inside a turkey
[13:28] <directhex> turducken?
[13:29] <directhex> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Xc5wIpUenQ
[13:29] <KungFuPanda> anyone successfully run youtrack on ubuntu ?
[13:30] <mungojerry> lol : ie, the most feared icon : http://imgur.com/a/nuKR2
[13:43] <mgdm> bigcalm: other than the phpdoc manual, I don't know
[13:44] <bigcalm> mgdm: fair enough, ta
[13:44] <mgdm> bigcalm: also, wrt hotel, fuck :(
[13:44] <mgdm> I'm not booked yet
[13:44] <mgdm> also, whoops, didn't clock what channel I'm in
[13:45] <bigcalm> :)
[13:45] <bigcalm> At least you noticed afterwards
[13:46] <bigcalm> mgdm: hurry, you might not get a room at all in the more expensive hotel
[13:46]  * davmor2 tickles czajkowski and christel and dives for the bunker
[13:49] <popey> KungFuPanda, never heard of it
[13:49] <KungFuPanda> :P
[13:49] <The_Fred> hello
[13:49] <s-fox> hello The_Fred
[13:50] <The_Fred> i'm not sure if im worrying too much,but im seeing a 7degree temp difference on my cpu - is that normal?
[13:50] <The_Fred> its a dual core celerol g530
[13:50] <The_Fred> *celeron
[13:51] <The_Fred> core0 = 34 core1 = 41
[14:03] <davmor2> popey: Well it's a disney cartoon where you have a panda that does kungfu :)
[14:05] <directhex> http://www.zurmat.com/2012/08/29/samsung-pays-apple-1-billion-sending-30-trucks-full-of-5-cent-coins/
[14:06] <directhex> wrong.
[14:06] <directhex> kung fu panda is dreamworks
[14:08] <directhex> hmph. never mind. http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/blog/2012/aug/29/apple-samsung-trucks-nickels-fake?newsfeed=true
[14:27] <Mez> welp, mass invites sent out to past attendees for the Global Jam... now hopefully we'll get some signups
[14:31] <davmor2> directhex: I got pixar and dreamworks mixed up, paramount own dreamworks and disney own pixar
[14:33] <arsen> just found a filserver running on a root of 8*32GB SSD's in raid6 xD
[14:43] <directhex> yikes
[14:44] <directhex> i mean, raid5/6 make sense on small drives, but 32G SSDs are gonna have extremely short lifetimes
[14:44] <directhex> hell, a "good" intel 520 only has 60T of life
[14:50] <directhex> lolz. http://mobile.theverge.com/2012/8/27/3271637/bitcoin-savings-trust-pyramid-scheme-shuts-down
[14:52] <popey> catching up with olde news there directhex :)
[14:53] <directhex> stabbystabstab
[15:01] <Laney> Inconsistency detected by ld.so: dl-open.c: 667: _dl_open: Assertion `_dl_debug_initialize (0, args.nsid)->r_state == RT_CONSISTENT' failed!
[15:01] <Laney> no spotify for laney :(
[15:53] <MartijnVdS> poor laney
[15:56] <mattt> WEWT WEWT WEWT
[15:58]  * davmor2 mocks that Software-updater text that reads, Software has been updated since the release of 12.10  it's not released yet :D
[16:07]  * mattt mocks davmor2
[16:08] <KungFuPanda> Hi guys, is this the right way to do it ? I write a init.d script to run a custom service under that user. example , I create a Teamcity user, and write a teamcity script under init.d, inside that script, teamcity runed by teamcity user. so now every time when I start service teamcity start, it will ask me to input the teamcity user password.
[16:09] <davmor2> mattt: why?
[16:09] <KungFuPanda> so now, every user want to start teamcity service, have to input teamcity user password ?
[16:42] <mattt> davmor2: no reason
[16:42]  * mattt unmocks davmor2
[17:31] <cliftonts> Evening all
[17:31] <popey> pip pip
[17:31] <cliftonts> Gnomebuntu? I've heard it all now!
[17:32] <davmor2> popey: when you say that it makes me think it pims o'clock
[17:34] <cliftonts> Does anyone here know anything about the Pentium P6200 processor?
[17:34] <davmor2> cliftonts: I know it's a processor, it's a pentium and it's made by intel does that help?
[17:35] <popey> nothing that google doesn't know
[17:35] <cliftonts> I'm doubting the first statement there davmor2
[17:35] <cliftonts> If it is a processor based by how it performs I think it pre-dates the original pentium!
[17:37] <popey> my first Pentium was a P200
[17:37] <popey> iirc
[17:37] <cliftonts> I was under the illusion my new laptop was going to have an i3 processor, instead I got this!
[17:37] <popey> unlucky
[17:38] <cliftonts> Aah, are you suggesting that P6200 is a misprint popey?
[17:38] <popey> heh
[17:38] <cliftonts> Brand new laptop and if I try to play video in a quarter of the screen, with thunderbird and firefox open everything keeps stalling
[17:39] <cliftonts> for a machine with 4GB, 500GB I find that dissapointing
[17:39] <davmor2> cliftonts: did it actually say i3 processor if so send it back
[17:41] <cliftonts> no, it said pentium processor, which I thought was fantastically vague
[17:41] <cliftonts> I did some research and decided that i3 was the likely model
[17:43] <cliftonts> It is odd though that my new laptop can't do what my old one with a 60gb hard drive was fine with
[17:43] <davmor2> cliftonts: sadtrombone.com
[17:44] <cliftonts> although this one can unplug from the wall without switching off and the power socket is properly attached to the motherboard so all in all it's an improvement!
[17:46] <cliftonts> I remember being able to tell one processor was better than another purely by the name, i.e. 386 vs 486
[17:46] <cliftonts> the good old days!
[17:48] <cliftonts> you lot are quiet tonight
[17:53] <Azelphur> is it just me or is there no button on ebay to change your phone number
[17:53] <Azelphur> why is it that when you ask on IRC you find it, after searching for 30 minutes
[17:54] <cliftonts> Ebay was modelled around a labyrinth
[17:54] <Azelphur> indeed
[17:54] <Azelphur> phone number is apparently under "primary postage address" and it shows address next to the button but not the phone number, just to make it easy to find
[17:55] <cliftonts> I find that I can locate the section to change it but there's always one more buried elsewhere I didn't change
[17:55] <Azelphur> fun
[17:55] <cliftonts> you love it
[17:55] <cliftonts> that's why I use ebid instead
[17:56] <Azelphur> cliftonts: yep, it stores my phone number in two places xD
[17:56] <cliftonts> Thought so
[17:56] <Azelphur> cliftonts: I was actually tempted to use ebid, PPPay escrow sounds pretty cool although I couldn't find many people online using it
[17:57] <cliftonts> Azelphur: It's growing all the time, at the moment you can sign up for £49.99 lifetime membership and get free listings forever
[17:57] <Azelphur> why does the UI blank out my phone number with partial X's
[17:57] <cliftonts> I figured sign up now before they take the offer awau
[17:57] <cliftonts> away
[17:57] <Azelphur> someone might be standing behind me...and they might....PHONE ME (dramatic music riff)
[17:58] <cliftonts> I list everything on ebid and select items on ebay, I've got nothing to lose
[17:58] <Azelphur> cliftonts: ah that's pretty cool
[17:58] <Azelphur> I hear PPPay charges you for every little thing
[17:58] <cliftonts> Azelphur: Exactly, the final sale fee is 2% if you have a gallery photo and nothing if you don't!
[17:58] <cliftonts> I don't know, I haven't used PPPay yet
[17:59] <Azelphur> fun
[17:59] <cliftonts> But ebay are screwing more and more out of us. I don't remember using it being so painful 10 years ago
[17:59] <Azelphur> hehe
[18:00] <cliftonts> So ebid has to work, the more greeder ebay gets the bigger ebid grows
[18:00] <cliftonts> Amazon are just as bad
[18:01] <Azelphur> fun
[18:01] <Azelphur> cliftonts: I'm having fun with ebay atm, it seems the world is conspiring against me having a Galaxy S3
[18:01] <cliftonts> how do you mean?
[18:02] <Azelphur> I bought one that was described as brand new in box but when I got it it was all messed up, so I sent it back
[18:02] <Azelphur> now I've ordered another one and the guy isn't shipping it
[18:02] <Azelphur> :(
[18:05] <gareth_> sorry got cut off
[18:05] <gareth_> What was that about an s3 Azelphur?
[18:05] <Azelphur> gareth_: are you cliftonts?
[18:06] <gareth_> yes, stupid irc!
[18:06] <Azelphur> gareth_: hehe, http://pastebin.com/U1WuQ96L
[18:07] <cliftonts> What do you mean messed up? Broken? Or just opened and tampered with?
[18:09] <Azelphur> cliftonts: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/x1btb0c9w9futq4/3mEOQEpIEW?m xD
[18:09] <cliftonts> Ok, looks like he may have had a game of football before shipping it!
[18:10] <Azelphur> cliftonts: indeed
[18:10] <cliftonts> If I were you I'd push for money back. If he's not shipping another one out I'd just write him off as un-trustworthy and work on the theory a replacement from him is probably never going to be right.
[18:11] <Azelphur> cliftonts: I already got my money back off him, he was an obvious scammer but he lost in every sense of the word in that little war :)
[18:11]  * Azelphur lawyered him
[18:12] <cliftonts> Good. I hate it when people like that weasel their way into profit
[18:12] <Azelphur> indeed
[18:12] <Azelphur> his feedback is really bad now too since he did it to a couple of people, I doubt anyone sane will buy off him any more
[18:12] <cliftonts> I'd better get going anyway. I just realised I've only got 66mb data to last the week. I can't top up until the 7th!
[18:12] <Azelphur> ouch :p
[18:13] <cliftonts> Good, the feedback system rarely works so that makes a change
[18:13] <cliftonts> Yeah, the wonders of pay as you go 3g!
[18:14] <cliftonts> Nice chatting anyway. See you next time
[18:14] <brobostigon> the joys of three, unlimited no fup, PAYG data :)
[18:15] <cliftonts> brobostigon - three's crappy service is what drove me to never go contract ever again. Their name is worse than dirt round here!
[18:15] <Seeker`> hallo
[18:15] <Azelphur> Seeker`: hallo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPVAdM43kQs
[18:15] <cliftonts> anyway, bye for now
[18:15] <brobostigon> cliftonts: i just use that much data, that anything else, that wasnt truly unlimited, would be pointless.
[18:16] <cliftonts> brobostigon, same here and I'm having serious culture shock issues now I don't have a proper connection
[18:16] <brobostigon> cliftonts: understandable.
[18:16] <cliftonts> so you're on unlimited pay as you go?
[18:17] <brobostigon> yes.
[18:17] <cliftonts> I can't see that on their site anywhere. How much?
[18:17] <brobostigon> £15
[18:18] <brobostigon> all you can eat data.
[18:18] <cliftonts> I can see that on a contract, but not payg
[18:18] <brobostigon> it is there,
[18:19]  * Seeker` is off to belgium tomorrow!
[18:19] <brobostigon> cliftonts: let me find it for you. minute.
[18:19] <cliftonts> That would be a great help.  I only check emails and maintian my website and I run out every month
[18:25] <Azelphur> obligatory http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/watch-out-we-got-a-badass-over-here-meme.png
[18:25] <Azelphur> I think a lot of ISPs are not in touch with reality when it comes to data
[18:26] <cliftonts> I've now reached the point where I have 2 sims so I can top the 2nd up with a bundle when the 1st runs out
[18:26] <Azelphur> I wrote a little informative rant about data on the giffgaff forums in reply to someone elses post, http://community.giffgaff.com/t5/Contribute-Innovation-Promotion/Gigabags-not-so-great/m-p/5650416/highlight/true#M136065
[18:27] <cliftonts> Aah, so you're a convert then?
[18:27] <Azelphur> I'm a giffgaffer, yep
[18:27] <cliftonts> How do you tether? Mine cuts the connection completely whenever I try
[18:27] <Azelphur> I just use android and tethering, but I havn't tried it recently
[18:27] <Azelphur> lemme check it again
[18:28] <cliftonts> Mine used to work but when I try now even the phone doesn't get it
[18:28] <Azelphur> if they are detecting it I know how and will just bypass it anyway
[18:28] <cliftonts> I just bypass it by putting the sim card in my dongle!
[18:28] <Azelphur> haha
[18:29] <cliftonts> But it's not fair that contracts get 20gb+ allowances and I'm stuck with a pathetic 3gb.
[18:30] <cliftonts> They are talking about how 4g will revolutionise mobile data but the simple fact is it's going to do it in very short bursts unless they give us more allowance!
[18:30] <Azelphur> cliftonts: yea it still works for me I'm browsing on my tablet tethered to my phone
[18:31] <Azelphur> unless they detect browser user agent, lemme try my laptop.
[18:31] <cliftonts> It'd possible there's just something wrong with my phone, who knows
[18:32] <Azelphur> nope works on all the things, sounds like something wrong with your phone
[18:32] <cliftonts> Just my luck
[18:32] <Azelphur> what phone?
[18:32] <cliftonts> galaxy mini
[18:32] <Azelphur> using a custom rom?
[18:33] <cliftonts> can you use internet on the phone while it's tethered?
[18:33] <Azelphur> cliftonts: yep
[18:33] <MartijnVdS> come to .nl, we have net neutrality
[18:33] <Azelphur> I just used laptop + tablet + phone all tethered to phone lol
[18:33] <MartijnVdS> ISPs can't limit your internet connection like that :)
[18:33] <Azelphur> MartijnVdS: I want to go to there.
[18:33] <cliftonts> MartinVdS, I can't afford the bus fare to the airport!
[18:33] <MartijnVdS> we do get tiny allowances on 3G though :(
[18:34] <Azelphur> :(
[18:34] <MartijnVdS> cliftonts: don't use so much data :)
[18:34] <cliftonts> MartinVdS, when you use it to earn a living is that a realistic option?
[18:34] <MartijnVdS> so it's a chicken/egg thing :)
[18:35] <Azelphur> I once had my entire house tethered to my giffgaff phone when our internet was down (4 people)
[18:35] <Azelphur> I think they are getting more aggressive against people tethering now, I've heard a couple of people getting suspended now
[18:35] <cliftonts> nope, I turned on the wireless hotspot on and now I can't view web pages on the phone
[18:35] <cliftonts> as I said, I was suspended for 2 months
[18:36] <cliftonts> I think that's a load of crap! I've paid for it, so who cares how I use it. If they don't want me using unlimited data, then don't offer it!
[18:36] <Azelphur> cliftonts++, that's why I bypass all the limits
[18:37] <Azelphur> I hate ISPs that are only interested in selling "unlimited" bandwidth to people who won't use it
[18:37] <cliftonts> Trouble is when the end result is that they suspend you then you don't win
[18:37] <Azelphur> I'd just go elsewhere
[18:37] <cliftonts> I hate ISPs that offer unlimited services, and by that I mean limited
[18:38] <cliftonts> Go elsewhere and pay more for the same thing?
[18:38] <Azelphur> cliftonts: you know sky is proper unlimited broadband right?
[18:38] <Azelphur> no FUP, I've done 1TB in a month on it
[18:38] <Azelphur> but that's home not mobile
[18:38] <cliftonts> fup?
[18:38] <Azelphur> fair usage policy
[18:38] <cliftonts> exactly. I'm only in this house temporary
[18:39] <Azelphur> hehe
[18:39] <cliftonts> If I get a landline installed it'll cost money I don't have and they'll screw me when I move
[18:39] <Azelphur> :(
[18:40] <cliftonts> Did you guys know by the way that I'm the richest man in the world?
[18:40] <Azelphur> nice
[18:40] <cliftonts> Judging by my emails so far this year EVERY SINGLE nigerian is giving me a million dollars
[18:41] <Azelphur> cliftonts: I had a UK company offering me millions of dollars a couple days ago
[18:41] <Azelphur> made it through my spam filter :o
[18:44] <cliftonts> I don't have one set up on my work emails. I don't like the idea of missing anything genuine]
[18:44] <cliftonts> I had one today trying to convince me to adopt a puppy. That's a new angle!
[18:49] <Azelphur> haha
[18:49] <Azelphur> cliftonts: I use gmail so usually there arn't any false positives
[18:49] <cliftonts> I use gmail for my personal mail, it has been known to make mistakes
[18:50]  * Azelphur shrugs
[18:50] <Azelphur> I get so much spam I couldn't live without a spam filter
[18:50] <cliftonts> I think I've been quite lucky with the work addresses so far
[18:51] <Azelphur> lol wtf I just looked in my spam box I have mail from "Linux Insurance Service"
[18:51] <Azelphur> http://pastebin.com/2PEXhSGE haha
[18:52] <cliftonts> I can't even follow what they are saying it's so bad
[18:52] <Azelphur> xD
[18:53] <cliftonts> Why would an insurance company be sending you a package anyway?
[18:53] <Azelphur> who knows XD
[18:53] <cliftonts> How can these people not realise that it has to make sense to fool you?
[18:55] <cliftonts> I miss having proper broadband I'm fed up with having to go down the pub every time I want to download something!
[18:59] <Azelphur> cliftonts: it's actually designed to be terrible afaik to filter down to only the most gullible people
[19:00] <cliftonts> And the worst thing is I know one of those people
[19:00] <cliftonts> He sent his iphone to someone in nigeria
[19:01] <Azelphur> fail
[19:04] <cliftonts> He sold it on ebay and they faked an escrow message from paypal telling him the money was safe with them so he could send it.
[19:05] <cliftonts> I could forgive him that, it was actually very convincing. But the fact they sent another paypal email telling him they had overcharged the customer and he needed to send £200 by western union, and HE WAS GOING TO DO IT, idiot!
[19:22] <cliftonts> Right, I'm off then!
[19:40] <bigcalm> Good evening peeps :)
[19:43]  * davmor2 prods bigcalm hello sciver
[19:43] <bigcalm> Hi davmor2
[19:43] <bigcalm> Sciving from IRC?
[19:43] <davmor2> bigcalm: yeah
[19:44] <bigcalm> Amazing how much can get done without the distraction ;)
[19:44]  * bigcalm fires up his unit tests and hopes for the best
[19:45]  * davmor2 waits for test one to fail before doing his evil laugh
[19:46] <bigcalm> :P
[19:46] <bigcalm> Test 15 failed
[19:46] <bigcalm> Yay
[19:47] <davmor2> Muhahahahahaahahahahahahaha
[19:47] <MartijnVdS> All tests successful
[19:47] <bigcalm> It's the one with the hairiest logic
[19:47] <bigcalm> davmor2: that's a bit unfair, test one passed
[19:48] <davmor2> bigcalm: if you've had anything to do with it it's all hairy logic, you need bald logic for it to work ;)
[19:48] <davmor2> bigcalm: that was my mock evil laugh not my real one :P
[19:48] <bigcalm> Ha
[19:48]  * bigcalm shakes his head
[19:49] <davmor2> bigcalm: just got with my testing theory,  If at first a test passed use a big hammer till it breaks
[19:50] <bigcalm> davmor2: indeed. I never trust a test that passes 1st time
[19:50] <bigcalm> Though, some of my unit tests are longer than the methods themselves
[19:50] <bigcalm> Which is silly. I can see why unit/functional testing is so expensive and why so much of the 'net is broken
[20:00] <davmor2> night all
[20:09] <bigcalm> And just like that, I make all of my tests work :D
[20:13] <SuperEngineer> bigcalm: I'm tempted to ask if you spelt 'tests' correctly... if you did, well done, if you didn't - you naughty boy, you!
[20:13] <bigcalm> Haha
[20:14] <SuperEngineer> ;)
[20:18] <bigcalm> Great, I have a single failing test for no reason
[20:18] <bigcalm> Blah
[20:18] <bigcalm> Scratch that, 2 fails now
[20:19] <bigcalm> Aha, they are related tests that make calls to an external service
[20:20] <bigcalm> The success tests are failing while the exception tests are working just fine
[20:20] <bigcalm> I'm okay with this
[21:41] <zleap> hi
[21:43] <Darael> Greetings, zleap.
[21:43] <zleap> hi
[21:43] <zleap> just found a weird bug in lubuntu
[21:44] <zleap> according to df -h i have an 8 gb flash disk,  if I right click on /media/kingston It comes with 10.7 TB (10,692,911,955,968 bytes
[21:44] <zleap> for the same device
[21:44] <zleap> i don't have 10.7 tb anywhere on my system
[21:45] <Darael> A ridiculous-compression-level squashfs, or something?
[21:45] <Darael> That or a bug.
[21:46] <mgdm> I would guess something is corrupt, first :)
[21:46] <zleap> well df -h seems to show it properly
[21:47] <popey> what app are you right clicking in?
[21:47] <zleap> the lubunt file manager
[21:47] <zleap> Lightweight file manager
[21:48] <zleap> navigating to /media/kingston and then right clicking on the kingston folder and selecting properties
[21:48]  * zleap wonders how much a 10tb flash drive would cost
[21:49] <Darael> Don't know if we can even /make/ things with the data-density.
[21:49] <zleap> yeah
[21:49] <zleap> would be nice eh
[21:49] <Darael> I wander if we could calculate by extrapolating Moore's Law...
[21:49] <Darael> s/wander/wonder/
[21:50] <Darael> I can type, I swear.
[21:50] <zleap> would we want to,  as some user is bound to lose the one device with all data for everyone
[21:51] <Darael> Nah - requirements and available resources go up roughly in tandem.
[21:51] <zleap> ok
[21:51]  * zleap will investigate further
[21:55] <zleap> chat later
[23:00] <The_Fred> hello


[08:44] <seb128> hello everybody
[08:54] <ajmitch> hello seb128
[08:54] <seb128> hey ajmitch, it has been a while, how are you?
[08:55] <ajmitch> good, how are you?
[08:55] <seb128> good thanks
[08:55] <seb128> buse as usual ;-)
[08:55] <ajmitch> how's intrepid going?
[08:55] <ajmitch> heh, so am I :)
[08:55] <seb128> intrepid looks good imho, still quite some bugs that would be nice to fix though
[08:56] <seb128> but we are getting there ;-)
[08:56]  * ajmitch was running into a bug recently that was forwarded upstream awhile ago - the missing desktop icons
[08:56] <ajmitch> rather hard to track down what was going wrong there :)
[08:57] <seb128> which one?
[08:57] <ajmitch> bug 218070
[08:58] <ajmitch> race conditions, possibly, pretty much only happened with a cd in the drive
[08:58]  * ajmitch should update to the latest packages first
[08:59] <didrocks> morning o/
[08:59] <ajmitch> hi
[09:00] <seb128> hey didrocks
[09:00] <seb128> slomo: hey, could you look at bug #279800?
[09:14] <slomo> seb128: sure
[09:14] <seb128> slomo: thanks ;-)
[09:15] <slomo> i can't reproduce it though, this needs a backtrace ;)
[09:17] <seb128> slomo: ok, I though the bug was not very useful but that was in case you knew about a similar issue ;-)
[09:18] <slomo> seb128: well, i run banshee since ~2 hours with latest gstreamer today... and many hours yesterday without a single problem ;)
[09:19] <seb128> slomo: maybe the bug is amd64 specific, or maybe you play mp3 and the guy ogg
[09:29] <seb128> asac, lool, pitti: could anybody look to the babl and gegl mir so the new gimp which has been uploaded on monday can build? ;-)
[09:32] <pitti> oh, sure
[09:34] <seb128> pitti: sorry for nagging about this one it would just be nice to give the new version testing before intrepid ;-)
[09:34] <pitti> seb128: no need to be, you are totall yright
[09:36] <pitti> didrocks: FYI, some fields in the MIR aren't filled out, and in "Dependencies" you don't need to specify the binaries of the source package you are filing the MIR on; it should list the dependencies that this package *has*, and whether they are in main
[09:36] <pitti> didrocks: (no problem here, just for the future)
[09:36] <davmor2> seb128: ping me when it's in I'm smoke testing till RC I can play around with it for a bit :)
[09:37] <seb128> ok
[09:38] <seb128> pitti: can I make apport catch any crash on the system easily? ie local binaries ones too
[09:40] <pitti> seb128: not with an option; however, you can hack /usr/share/apport/apport and drop the paragraph on line 258ff
[09:40] <seb128> pitti: ok thanks
[09:40] <pitti> seb128: or just enable core dumps, that might suffice for your needs
[09:41] <pitti> since for unpackaged binaries, there isn't a lot what apport would give you on top of a core dump
[09:41] <seb128> right
[09:41] <pitti> (ulimit -c unlimited)
[10:29] <didrocks> pitti: thx. I will note it :)
[10:46] <Ng> presumably when I plug in a removable storage device and hal sends out the dbus notification, it's nautilus that should pick up on that and mount it?
[10:46] <seb128> who wants to do the totem-pl-parser and totem new version updates?
[10:47] <Ng> (still trying to figure out why my machine at home isn't doing that. hal sees it, sends the dbus notification, and me calling gnome-mount by hand works, so it seems like it's the nautilus stage which isn't working)
[10:47] <seb128> Ng: depending of the device, it should rather ask what you want to do
[10:47] <Ng> seb128: I have Music Player set to Open Folder
[10:49] <Ng> hmm, I didn't actually check if hal was reporting the ipod as an audio player, but it ought to
[10:49] <seb128> Ng: that's working for me, I doubt nautilus is buggy there but maybe it doesn't find the matching properties for the device
[10:50] <Ng> I'm pretty much certain it's something wrong with that install, since it works fine on my laptop
[10:51] <Ng> it would just be nice to be able to debug it enough to fix it, rather than have to apply nuclear reinstall options ;)
[10:52] <Ng> I was able to monitor hal and dbus to ensure they were behaving correctly, but I don't know of a way to do that with nautilus
[10:52] <seb128> Ng: lshal --monitor and plug the device? also lshal > log before and after plugin it and copy the diff somewhere
[10:53] <Ng> I'll give those a try when I get home, but even if it wasn't showing up as an audio player it should still have mounted, right?
[10:53] <Ng> (fwiw it gets an ipod icon, so something clearly knows it's an ipod)
[10:55] <seb128> Ng: not really, the nautilus code filter on properties, it'll do the audio player action only if the right capabilities are set
[10:55] <Ng> but if that capability was missing it would just look like USB storage?
[10:55] <seb128> Ng: what ipod model do you have?
[10:55] <Ng> 80gb classic
[10:56] <seb128> Ng: it can have a correct icon set but wrong capabilities
[10:56] <Ng> hrm
[10:56] <seb128> the icon is also a property
[10:57] <Ng> I wonder if one can manipulate the power state of a USB port such that it seems like a device has been ejected/inserted, because then I could leave the ipod at home and be able to experiment from here ;)
[10:58] <pitti> Ng: I believe that's possible with some fiddling
[10:58] <pitti> Ng: you can use the "bind" and "unbind" sysfs properties to attach/detach the device from the usb-storage driver
[10:58] <Ng> ooh
[10:59] <seb128> slomo: ok, good informations on the gstreamer build issue now
[10:59] <seb128> slomo:
[10:59] <seb128> #0  gst_registry_binary_cache_finish (registry=<value optimized out>, cache=0x0, success=0) at gstregistrybinary.c:353
[10:59] <seb128> 353	    g_remove (cache->tmp_location);
[10:59] <seb128> (gdb) bt
[10:59] <seb128> #0  gst_registry_binary_cache_finish (registry=<value optimized out>, cache=0x0, success=0) at gstregistrybinary.c:353
[10:59] <seb128> #1  0x400b0928 in gst_registry_binary_write_cache (registry=0x92ae808,
[10:59] <seb128>     location=0x92af2a0 "/root/.gstreamer-0.10/registry.i486.bin") at gstregistrybinary.c:841
[11:00] <seb128> #2  0x4004457f in scan_and_update_registry (default_registry=0x92ae808,
[11:00] <seb128>     registry_file=0x92af2a0 "/root/.gstreamer-0.10/registry.i486.bin", write_changes=1, error=0x0) at gst.c:761
[11:00] <seb128> #3  0x400451b5 in ensure_current_registry (error=0xbfecc7d0) at gst.c:823
[11:00] <seb128> #4  0x400468eb in init_post (context=0x9295880, group=0x92962b0, data=0x0, error=0xbfecc7d0) at gst.c:1096
[11:00] <seb128> #5  0x40193803 in IA__g_option_context_parse (context=0x9295880, argc=0x0, argv=0x0, error=0xbfecc7d0)
[11:00] <seb128>     at /build/buildd/glib2.0-2.18.1/glib/goption.c:1796
[11:00] <seb128> #6  0x40045fa6 in gst_init_check (argc=0x0, argv=0x0, err=0xbfecc7d0) at gst.c:434
[11:03] <seb128> slomo: cache=0x0 so cache->tmp_location == crash
[11:03] <slomo> thanks
[11:05] <pitti> Ng: e. g. if you look into /sys/bus/usb/drivers/usb-storage, you have symlinks to the bound devices
[11:05] <pitti> Ng: if you write the name of one of them to "unbind" or "bind", you can detach/attach it
[11:05]  * pitti tests
[11:05] <slomo> seb128: that one is easy to fix... but unfortunately it's only called when something else before goes really wrong
[11:06] <Ng> pitti: nice. I don't want to take up too much time with this though - my busted install isn't yous guys' problem, especially right before a release :)
[11:06] <slomo> seb128: ah... non-writable home? :)
[11:07] <slomo> seb128: could you try again with a patch in a few minutes? :)
[11:07] <seb128> slomo: well, building under a standard user not using sudo so it tries accessing the wrong directory
[11:07] <seb128> slomo: sure
[11:08] <pitti> Ng: echo -n '1-8.4:1.0' | sudo tee  unbind
[11:09] <pitti> Ng: that works for me (in that dir), after doing the same with "bind", the USB stick appears like just being plugged in
[11:09] <pitti> Ng: the -n is important, though :)
[11:09] <slomo> seb128: http://freedesktop.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/gstreamer/gstreamer/gst/gstregistrybinary.c.diff?r1=1.36&r2=1.37
[11:09] <pitti> anyway, lunch o'clock
[11:09] <slomo> seb128: if it works i'll upload a new version to debian with this patch ;)
[11:12] <seb128> slomo: that fixed the debuild binary which was breaking, I'll do a full build to be sure next but the patch makes sense and seems to work, new debian revision using it would be welcome ;-) I'm wondering why it didn't break on the debian buildds though
[11:13] <Ng> pitti: cool thanks :)
[11:14] <slomo> seb128: because most of them have writable home... it probably failed on some, i didn't check yet
[11:15] <seb128> slomo: ok
[11:22] <seb128> Ng: let's take this discussion there maybe to not flood #gnome-hackers ;-)
[11:22] <Ng> sure
[11:23] <seb128> Ng: those softwares have gtk fileselectors
[11:23] <Ng> but they don't work very well for this
[11:23] <seb128> why ?
[11:23] <seb128> the patch I pointed just do the transparent mapping to give those applications which don't understand gvfs uris a .gvfs fuse local url
[11:24] <seb128> the gvfs mount is transparently used in this case
[11:24] <Ng> yeah so that patch will fix one of the OOo problems (which is that it does very badly when yo ulaunch it on a remote file)
[11:24] <seb128> when using nautilus or a gtk fileselector
[11:24] <Ng> as I mentioned, firefox3 doesn't seem to show remote shares for whatever reason (and yes, I have failed to file a bug about this since it was brought to my attention on friday)
[11:25] <seb128> so now in which case on a standard ubuntu desktop to you open non local files using something which is not nautilus or a gtkfilechooser?
[11:25] <seb128> that's a firefox bug
[11:25] <seb128> well not really, as said they probably set the fileselector to local mode which made sense in a gnome-vfs context
[11:26] <seb128> since they don't use gnomevfs and were not able to deal with those locations
[11:26] <Ng> in a standard ubuntu desktop that doesn't happen, I have to admit that, but that's simply because everything there is a GNOME app. My point is really that we're spending all this effort dancing around making things work for non-GNOME apps when one change would instantly fix everything
[11:27] <Ng> I could just say "go to Remote/workshare" and it would always work in everything
[11:27] <seb128> what efforts are we doing?
[11:27] <seb128> you can already do that
[11:27] <seb128> what you ask is to symlink .gvfs to some non hidden directory
[11:27] <Ng> not necessarily "we", but someone is patching OOo, firefox, thunderbird to use these things
[11:27] <seb128> the issue is that it adds a directory GNOME users should not have to know about
[11:28] <seb128> what things?
[11:28] <Ng> gvfs
[11:28] <seb128> no
[11:28] <seb128> again, those applications not using gvfs will be given a .gvfs fuse directory
[11:28] <seb128> in a transparent way
[11:28] <Ng> only on launching though
[11:28] <seb128> no application patching is required
[11:28] <seb128> no
[11:28] <seb128> on fileselector use or launching
[11:29] <seb128> how do you open files if you don't use nautilus or a gtkfileselector?
[11:30] <Ng> those are generally the only ways for normal users
[11:30] <seb128> slomo: the patch works fine gstreamer0.10 built correctly
[11:30] <Ng> and if both launching and fileselector stuff will work transparently then that will cure a lot of the problems
[11:31] <Ng> I think it's a shame that it doesn't work in a generic way for non-gnome stuff, but since I'm not putting any code or money in, I don't get a say on that ;)
[11:31] <seb128> Ng: right, that's what the upstream bugs I pointed are about ;-)
[11:31] <slomo> seb128: perfect, thanks for getting a backtrace :)
[11:31] <seb128> slomo: and thanks for fixing it ;-)
[11:31] <seb128> Ng: you are just debating over the .gvfs naming there apparently
[11:32] <seb128> Ng: the upstream view is that GNOME users should not have to know about mounts or mountpoint and not have this extra directory which is confusing
[11:32] <seb128> Ng: the mounts are just listed in the sidebar, place menu, etc
[11:33] <seb128> Ng: I think it's fair to optimize the GNOME user experience for people using GNOME, now if you have an installation where you use lot of non GNOME applications which don't have a gtkfileselector just symlink .gvfs to some other directory
[11:33] <Ng> seb128: nothing would stop the Places menu showing the things that are in ~/Remote/, or the fileselctor sidebar having a section labelled "Remote" which did the same thing
[11:34] <seb128> Ng: right, they just feel that would be confusing rather than bring something to expose the directory
[11:34] <Ng> well I certainly look forward to seeing the patched versions :)
[11:34] <seb128> Ng: because people would then have to understand mountpoint, and why a remote server is a local directory too
[11:35] <Ng> err, but right now all remote servers look like local directories
[11:35] <seb128> Ng: in the current case they don't have remote server showed as local directories
[11:35] <seb128> no they don't
[11:35] <Ng> sure they do
[11:35] <seb128> they are special location in the sidebar
[11:35] <Ng> nobody knows that the sidebar shows bookmarks
[11:35] <Ng> they look like folders, they even have the same icon
[11:35] <seb128> they have drive icons and not folder ones
[11:35] <Ng> nope, because people use bookmarks to get to them
[11:36] <Ng> otherwise they don't persist
[11:36] <seb128> Ng: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=555332
[11:36] <seb128> Ng: that gives a connect server feature equivalent to what gnomevfs had
[11:36] <seb128> Ng: we are getting there ;-)
[11:37] <Ng> aha, good :)
[11:37] <Ng> well in that case I might as well pull out my last problem and hope there's a bug for that too ;)
[11:38] <Ng> changing network connections :)
[11:38] <seb128> changing? you mean editing?
[11:38] <seb128> there is a bug but I don't think it's being worked at the moment
[11:38] <Ng> people whip out an ethernet cable and roam onto wireless and gvfs doesn't seem to notice immediately that it needs to discard existing connections and reconnect
[11:38] <seb128> ah
[11:38] <seb128> it should be using network-manager ;-)
[11:39] <Ng> afaik NM sends dbus events when it changes networks, so gvfs ought to be able to notice and reconnect
[11:39] <seb128> right, there is a wishlist open about that
[11:39] <Ng> ok
[11:39] <Ng> well then I'll just go back to my corner and wait ;)
[11:40] <Ng> thanks seb, I feel re-assured that the smart people working on this aren't all mad :)
[11:40] <asac> pitti: langpack o matic ... could we pass 8.04 for hardy exports and 8.10 for intrepid to the po processor?
[11:41] <asac> or is there another way i can easily guess that?
[11:42] <seb128> Ng: you're welcome ;-)
[11:47] <Ng> ooh actually one more thing, but not related to gvfs this time - can we have remote printer discovery enabled by default? :)
[11:48] <Ng> afaics it only opens a port on <IP_ADDRESS>:631, but I dunno if there are other security implications in having cups accepting broadcast traffic
[11:51] <pitti> Ng: opening UDP 631 for discovery is ok, but we need to adapt the GUI printer dialogs accordingly
[11:52] <pitti> Ng: to clearly separate locally configured, trustworthy printers, from the potentially malicious autodetected network ones
[11:52] <Ng> pitti: ah right
[11:53] <pitti> asac: yes, we can pass the release as an extra command line option
[11:59] <asac> pitti: ok. lets look into this after release i guess.
[11:59] <asac> pitti: anyway,  i rolled out the fix for bug 268674 to rookery
[11:59] <pitti> asac: nice, thanks
[11:59] <asac> doing a final test run right now
[11:59] <asac> will let you know in 5 minutes or so
[12:00] <pitti> asac: depends, do you need the 8.04/8.10 argument right now to produce correct updates for both hardy and intrepid?
[12:02] <asac> pitti: we can live without it because ffox is 3.0.x in hardy and intrepid
[12:02] <asac> pitti: only problem is that i cannot have a different whitelist/blacklist for 8.04/8.10
[12:03] <asac> pitti: but that should be OK for now ... unless we get complains now.
[12:04] <asac> pitti: so ... can you do a langpack processing run for intrepid? i got a quick verification from Mirv on the "fi" langpack, but getting broader feedback would be nice :)
[12:04] <asac> pitti: or should i ask Arne?
[12:07] <asac> pitti: i've some strange things going on with NM which I currently think come from consolekit/policykit (havent tracked this down completely). how sure are we that both versions work perfectly together?
[12:10] <pitti> asac: langpacks are handled by Arne now
[12:10] <pitti> asac: but yes, we urgently need new intrepid packs, I spoke about that with Arne
[12:10] <pitti> asac: CK/PK should work fine, they haven't changed recently except for some bug fixes
[12:10] <pitti> asac: CK itself has a few crashes, so if nm doesn't work, it might be due to not having a CK session
[12:12] <asac> pitti: yeah. the crashes definitly struck me :) ... but i still think there is more bustage. but if you dont know anything i will look ... maybe its just a "normal" NM bug ;)
[12:13] <asac> pitti: doesnt console kit persist its session so when it crashes/restarts the session can still be used?
[12:13] <pitti> asac: no, it only keeps them in memory; if you restart CK, all sessions are obliviated
[12:13] <asac> ouch
[12:13] <asac> ;)
[12:14] <pitti> (ouch++)
[12:14] <james_w> hey pitti, on the subject of PK, have you seen bug 275432?
[12:14] <asac> too bad that one cannot propagate environment changes to child processes
[12:15] <asac> so we could at least update the XDG_ session or something
[12:15] <pitti> james_w: no, I didn't; looking
[12:15] <james_w> it's only really a problem in minimal environments
[12:19] <pitti> james_w: right, this circular CK/PK dependency has caused a lot of discussion upstream, but it should only actually matter if you use the shutdown/reboot scripts
[12:19] <pitti> so that dependency isn't reflected as a package Depends:
[12:19] <pitti> james_w: indeed it should complain less verbosely if the PK files aren't present, I think
[12:20] <james_w> yeah, I was thinking that
[12:20] <james_w> it would be possible to write to code so they are still watched by inotify, even if not present
[12:20] <james_w> I'll report it to Debian and upstream today shall I?
[12:21] <pitti> james_w: please do, yes
[12:21] <james_w> sure
[12:21] <pitti> james_w: in fact, I wonder what CK's business is with watching PK's config files
[12:22] <pitti> I don't see a reason why it should do that in the first place, do you?
[12:22] <james_w> no, this is code in libpolkit
[12:23] <james_w> ck calls polkit_context_init() which sets up the watches
[12:23] <james_w> which seems valid to me
[12:30] <pitti> oh, sure, sorry
[13:49] <didrocks> do we need to ask for a build for each gimp plugins? (when libgimp2.0 will be updated to 2.6)
[13:58] <seb128> didrocks: why, is that required?
[14:00] <didrocks> seb128: in my mind, all gimp plugins were rebuilt from libgimp 2.2 -> 2.4 transition
[14:01] <didrocks> (IIRC)
[14:01] <seb128> didrocks: could be that they broke the compatibility then but not between the new versions
[14:02] <seb128> crevette: do you have a sponsoring request bug for your g-u-s update?
[14:02] <didrocks> seb128: ok, that's better if the compatibility is assured :)
[14:03] <crevette> seb128: no
[14:03] <seb128> didrocks: I didn't try but better to look at if things are working before asking for a rebuild
[14:03] <seb128> crevette: you should ;-)
[14:03] <crevette> actually I'm trying to make it work with Bluez 4 at least
[14:03] <crevette> yeah
[14:03] <didrocks> seb128: we'll see on monday (time for all librairies and gimp to be updated and built) :)
[14:03]  * crevette is in a Bluez fury these days
[14:04] <seb128> didrocks: what libraries? the new gimp already built and is in intrepid
[14:04] <seb128> crevette: that's cool but open a sponsoring request if you want your new version update uploaded
[14:05] <crevette> seb128: yeah, just trying the version I'm building in ppa
[14:05] <didrocks> libgimp2.0 will not be updated to 2.6?
[14:06] <seb128> didrocks: ???
[14:06] <seb128> didrocks:
[14:06] <seb128> $ apt-cache showsrc gimp
[14:06] <seb128> Package: gimp
[14:06] <seb128> Binary: libgimp2.0, gimp, gimp-data, libgimp2.0-dev, libgimp2.0-doc, gimp-dbg
[14:06] <seb128> didrocks: a source package can build several binaries if that's the question you are asking there
[14:07] <didrocks> $ rmadison libgimp2.0
[14:07] <didrocks> ... snip ...
[14:07] <didrocks> libgimp2.0 | 2.4.7-1ubuntu1 |      intrepid | amd64, i386
[14:07] <seb128> and gimp?
[14:07] <didrocks> 2.6.0-1ubuntu1
[14:07] <didrocks> oh, for source
[14:08] <seb128> the gimp binary
[14:08] <didrocks> 2.4.7-1ubuntu1 for binary
[14:08] <seb128> it looks like the new binaries have not been published yet
[14:08] <seb128> or that your mirror is lagging
[14:08] <didrocks> yes, probably :)
[14:09] <didrocks> (my company cache is awful, it will not update even if new pages are available)
[14:09] <didrocks> (and I use the archive.ubuntu.com mirror)
[14:10] <seb128> didrocks: weird, the new binaries should be published there, maybe for the next update
[14:11] <didrocks> yes, hence our misunderstanding :)
[15:51] <ember> seb128 mind if i update plparser and tomboy?
[15:52] <seb128> ember: you can do tomboy, somebody is already working on the totem updates
[15:52] <ember> oki, thanks.
[16:11] <slomo> seb128: apart from the banshee crasher new gstreamer stuff works fine?
[16:11] <seb128> slomo: yes, and -3 built fine on i386
[16:11] <slomo> seb128: also, i heard that ffmpeg is in main now... i guess gst-ffmpeg should be in main too then? ;)
[16:12] <seb128> I didn't know that ffmpeg was in main if that's not an error gst-ffmpeg could go there too ;-)
[16:21] <Keybuk> I always think Banshee is almost, but not quite, appropriately named
[16:21] <Keybuk> according to legend, the scream of the Banshee signifies an impending death
[16:21] <Keybuk> whereas any sound from Banshee signifies *its* impending death
[16:30] <dobey> haha
[16:30] <dobey> there is good reason why i use rbox now instead of banshee :)
[16:48] <crevette> seb128: hey
[16:48] <seb128> re crevette
[16:48] <crevette> seb128: did you use NM to connect to GPRS / 3G networks ?
[16:48] <crevette> I would like to test with SFR
[16:48] <seb128> crevette: no, I've no gprs or 3g devices
[16:48] <crevette> ah, I've one on my laptop so I wanted to test
[16:49] <seb128> there is a wiki page about that no?
[16:49] <crevette> I've seen a lot of threads about SFR usb key
[16:49] <crevette> http://forum.ubuntu-fr.org/viewtopic.php?pid=2111610 ah too bad for him
[16:50] <crevette> it seems the 3G usb key works without any tweaks
[16:58]  * crevette is happier and happier of the Linux desktop quality
[17:06] <crevette> asac: around ?
[17:06] <crevette> salut huats
[17:06] <huats> hey crevette
[17:06] <huats> :)
[17:06] <asac> crevette: not really :-P
[17:07] <huats> hello asac :)
[17:07] <huats> and seb128 of course :)
[17:07] <seb128> lut huats
[17:07] <crevette> asac: are you aware of an issue were the button "Ok" keeps unsensitive when you edit parameter of a connection in NM ?
[17:08] <crevette> I try editing my default 3G connection to add parameter but I can't press the button
[17:16] <asac> crevette: usually that means that your settings are not complete
[17:16] <asac> or invalid
[17:17] <crevette> asac: I field all them to test
[17:17] <crevette> I hav one combox empty I don't know why
[17:18] <asac> crevette: which is that?
[17:18] <crevette> band
[17:18] <crevette> not sure if this is the right name in english
[17:19] <asac> crevette: did you use the wizard to create that connection?
[17:20] <crevette> I chose the profile among the list, ibrought pre-defined parameters
[17:20] <crevette> I did that few days/weeks ago, but didn't look closely until today
[17:20] <asac> crevette: ok. then remove the whitespace in your DNS list
[17:20] <asac> thats a bug in the wizard atm (or the applet whatever you like more)
[17:21] <crevette> doesn't change a thing
[17:21] <crevette> I can perhaps delete the profile
[17:21] <crevette> let's do tahr
[17:21] <crevette> that
[17:21] <asac> crevette: no thats not the problem
[17:21] <asac> start nm-connection-editor from terminal
[17:21] <asac> wait till things have settled
[17:21] <asac> then open the connection and see if you see anything
[17:22] <asac> crevette: most likely if you filled all fields you entered something else now that isnt legal
[17:22] <asac> syntax wise
[17:22] <crevette> ehy, I've some warning when starting
[17:22] <crevette> and other when editing the profile
[17:22] <asac> in the beginning it was most likely the dns whitepace
[17:22] <asac> crevette: dont call it profile please
[17:23] <asac> its a connection ;)
[17:23] <crevette> ah sorry
[17:23] <asac> crevette: trash that thing. then create a new onw
[17:23] <asac> and remove the whitespace in dns
[17:23] <crevette> ah this time the whitespace fixed the issue
[17:23] <asac> crevette: right
[17:23] <asac> crevette: and i am sure that when filling the other fields you made another syntax error ;)
[17:23] <asac> obviously a usability issue :)
[17:23] <crevette> are you intereste by some warning at start ?
[17:23] <asac> crevette: paste them
[17:23] <asac> if i am ill tell you :-D
[17:24] <crevette> asac: some icons beside field would be a plus I assume
[17:24] <asac> yeah. but if you start to do that kind of hint, then you also need to add an explanation ;)
[17:24] <asac> and that explanation needs a doc and so on :-D
[17:24] <asac> hehe
[17:24] <asac> but yeah. a icon would be quite nice i guess
[17:25] <crevette> wow taht pastebin plugin for Do is awesome
[17:25] <asac> crevette: pastebinit ... worked for a while for paste.ubuntu.com
[17:25] <asac> not sure if its not broken again :)
[17:27] <crevette> http://pastebin.ca/1222853
[17:28] <crevette> asac: I'm going to open a usability bug for NM upstream
[17:28] <asac> crevette: did you use a VPN connection in the past and now dont have the package installed anymore?
[17:28] <crevette> never I think
[17:28] <asac> crevette: yes, please open in launchpad and in upstream bug tracker
[17:28] <asac> crevette: against -applet
[17:28] <crevette> you want it in launchpad too ?
[17:28] <asac> crevette: i dont mind
[17:29] <asac> crevette: i usually will not receive mail from upstream trackers
[17:29] <asac> (or better said: i will not be able to read them regularly enough)
[17:29] <crevette> ah okay
[17:29] <asac> but its only important in case i have spare cycles and want to fix on my own
[17:29] <asac> so just post upstream
[17:29] <asac> i will proably remember ;)
[17:44] <crevette> asac: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=555574 clear enough ?
[17:48] <crevette> asac: it seems the withespace cames back each time I edit the connection
[17:50] <asac> crevette: it comes back?
[17:50] <crevette> yep
[17:50] <asac> if that happens with wired/wireless too its definitly an applet bug
[17:50] <asac> we should file that too ;)
[17:50] <crevette> I don't have dns servers for wired/wireless
[17:50] <crevette> :)
[17:50] <crevette> at least not hard coded
[17:51] <crevette> if I delete and create again my GPRS connection, the space is here
[17:52] <crevette> and moreover the tooltips example has a space :)
[17:53] <crevette> and if I add 2 DNS servers with space between I've the same problem
[17:53] <crevette> it cames back
[17:53] <crevette> « The return of the whitespace »
[17:56] <asac> crevette: you can setup a new wired connection with wired + dns
[17:56] <asac> to test
[17:56] <crevette> asac: yeah it's what I did
[17:56] <asac> crevette: ok. its reproduciable in wired too?
[17:56] <crevette> yep
[17:56] <asac> crevette: http://paste.ubuntu.com/55340/ please test that
[17:57] <asac> i guess that should fix it
[17:57] <asac> let me know. i will send the patch to ML
[17:57] <asac> crevette: you can just apt-get source network-manager-applet ... then apply patch and build with debuild -b
[17:58] <asac> crevette: oh wait ;)
[17:59] <asac> crevette: http://paste.ubuntu.com/55344/
[17:59] <asac> thats the right one
[18:05] <crevette> okay I'll try it
[18:08]  * crevette is lazy and build it in ppa
[18:08] <crevette> cpu cycle is expensive
[18:08] <crevette> :)
[18:09] <asac> well ... ppa makes this test take 1h instead of 3 minutes ;)
[18:10] <asac> given that time is probably more expensive id oubt that this is a good deal :-D
[18:11] <cody-somerville> asac, why does the PPA make it take 1h instead of 3 minutes?
[18:15] <asac> cody-somerville: with some bad luck it takes ages to build. once finished, it take 1-30 minutes to publish
[18:15] <asac> given that one usually forgets to run apt-get update, apt-get instlal constantly one pprobably notices 1h after upload that it can be grabbed ;)
[18:16] <cody-somerville> asac, Why does it take so long for stuff to get built?
[18:16] <asac> cody-somerville: have you ever used the PPA? if you are out of luck you have two linux builds and a xulrunner and a openoffice build before you get cycles ;)
[18:17] <asac> but usually its starts quite instantly
[18:17] <asac> (now)
[18:17] <asac> still you have the huge publishing gab
[18:17] <asac> gap
[18:17] <cody-somerville> Yea, there is roughly 40 or so buildds now for PPAs
[18:18] <cody-somerville> So you don't experience delays anymore starting the build, just waiting for it to publish?
[18:19] <asac> cody-somerville: well. sometimes it takes some time even now
[18:19] <asac> cody-somerville: but publishing is definitly a big issue (at least it was till last week)
[18:19] <cody-somerville> any reason why?
[18:19] <cody-somerville> so its fixed now?
[18:19] <asac> cody-somerville: i think the publisher runs by a cronjob
[18:19] <cody-somerville> ok
[18:19] <asac> now in recent launchpad versions that coupled the publisher run with when things become available in launchpad
[18:19] <asac> so you cannot even grab the .deb before you can find them with apt-get
[18:19] <asac> cody-somerville: no not fixed
[18:19] <asac> i doubt it will be fixed ;)
[18:20] <asac> PPAs are just not made to do a "quick testbuild" ;)
[18:22]  * cody-somerville rubs his chin.
[18:44] <crevette> asac: around ?
[18:45] <asac> crevette: no
[18:45] <asac> :-P
[18:46] <crevette> asac: it works
[18:46] <crevette> I can close the dialog when there is a space between dns servers
[18:46] <crevette> when I open the dialog  the space is back but it is not a pb now
[18:47] <asac> crevette: thats true good.
[18:52] <asac> crevette: ok sent upstream
[18:52] <asac> thanks for testing
[18:53] <crevette> you're welcome
[18:53] <crevette> okay let's take a break
[18:53] <asac> lucky you ;)
[18:53] <asac> but well. i will stop now for a while too :-P
[18:53]  * crevette is more tired during in holidays than during worksdays
[18:53] <crevette> s/in/its/
[22:20] <seb128> didrocks: there?
[22:30] <norsetto> thx for your sponsoring seb128
[22:30] <seb128> norsetto: thank you for working on the updates ;-)
[22:31] <crevette> ah, I nees gnome-user-share sponsoring
[22:31] <crevette> need
[22:35] <seb128> crevette: did you open a bug?
[22:35] <crevette> seb128: not exactly :)
[22:36] <seb128> crevette: so no wonder that people don't sponsor your changes ;-)
[22:36] <crevette> I need to look how work Sponsoring
[22:36] <crevette> but i'm uncomfortable requesting sponsoring for something I can't test
[22:36] <seb128> crevette: just open a bug which has a debdiff and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
[22:37] <seb128> why can't you test it?
[22:38] <crevette> seb128: sending files over bluetooth doesn't work for me, it seems obex-data-server doesn't work
[22:38] <crevette> s/sending/receipt/
[22:39] <seb128> does the current intrepid version works?
[22:46] <crevette> seb128: no
[22:48] <dobey> seb128: hey. i made a new intltool release today, btw
[22:48] <seb128> dobey: I noticed and it's already in intrepid thank you ;-)
[22:52] <dobey> cool


[03:01] <mrdeb> hi is openbox a lot different in 1404 vs 1204
[03:01] <mrdeb> worth upgrading or not, or is it only unity that is shiny .thanks
[03:02] <rww> !info openbox saucy
[03:02] <rww> !info openbox trusty
[03:02] <mrdeb> hi
[03:02] <rww> mrdeb: no, it's not a lot different
[03:02] <mrdeb> ok
[03:02] <mrdeb> so stay on 1204 to 2017, is that it
[03:03] <mrdeb> and then go to 1604
[03:03] <rww> I'd upgrade to 14.04, but it's your choice *shrug*
[03:03] <rww> (once it's released, which is not yet)
[03:03] <mrdeb> ok homie
[03:31] <AussieDownUnder> xubuntu 14.04, not sure if this is a problem or meant to happen, but for me it's being a pain. I drag & drop albums into VLC to listen to them , when I've put one album in & go to put another it won't drag the file but rather want to highlight things, I worked out I can hold down the mouse for long before dragging to then be able to hold & drag it. Seems a bit anal to me.
[03:48] <Beldar> AussieDownUnder, So your saying vlc is sentient, or your wants are the representation?  ;)
[03:52] <AussieDownUnder> beldar, It's a folder thing, when I'm looking in my music folder on my hard drive & want to click on an album folder to drag it into an already open vlc, sometimes when I'm in my hard drives folders it just tries to make my only highlight things not drag. Does that make sense?
[03:54] <Beldar> AussieDownUnder, I've not really figured out how to get vlc to have a play list per say, I use it primarily for radio and videos is all.
[04:00] <Beldar> AussieDownUnder, I just tried this with no problem, vlc version 2.0.10
[04:02] <AussieDownUnder> beldar, it's not vlc that's the problem, I'm talking about xubuntu's file managment I guess, when I'm looking at folders from the o/s not vlc.
[04:02] <AussieDownUnder> beldar, I have no problem playing albums with vlc, vlc is not the problem.
[04:02] <Beldar> ah my mistake
[04:37] <habanany> ubuntu  brainstorm is closed  ?
[04:57] <rww> habanany: yes
[06:21] <soee> some more info posted https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-prime/+bug/1283353
[06:59] <susundberg> Hu, i think i reported duplicate before, at my case it was problem that the nvidia prime overwrote the default login manager setting
[07:03] <susundberg> soee: see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-prime/+bug/1267442
[07:05] <soee> susundberg: in /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf ?
[07:06] <susundberg> Yeah, i think i fixed the file, but you should be ok just by moving it to say /root/ (e.g. deleting, but with backup ;)
[07:06] <susundberg> i mean, that specific nvidia-prime version had bug that it created that file with bad settings if the file didn't existis
[07:28] <soee> susundberg: did you modified lightdm.conf ?
[09:58] <susundberg> soee: yeah, i think i edited there to be proper login manager (i was using kubuntu), but i guess you can just remove the file (==copy it to other location)
[10:06] <soee> susundberg: nah it some deeper problem
[10:13] <Fudge> are dailies still building?
[10:13] <susundberg> soee: good luck with debugging ..
[10:54] <dav> Quick question, if XYZ-proposed is where packages go before going into XYZ, why is there a trusty-proposed given that trusty isn't yet stable anyway?
[11:18] <geser> it's easier to also generate the -proposed, -updates, -security etc. when a new release gets created on LP even when they aren't used yet
[11:19] <geser> and trusty-proposed is used as a staging area for newly build packages before they get moved to trusty till the release (trusty-proposed will be used for testing updates after the release as usual)
[11:27] <k1l> -proposed is used for the automated testing. to make sure there are not so much packages pushed into the release (or dev-release) that break the whole system
[11:28] <geser> k1l: we are both too late with the answer dav already left
[11:29] <k1l> yes, just realised after i answered :/
[11:34] <BluesKaj> ' Morning folks
[11:42] <streulma> hello, my unity crashes on ubuntu 14.04, also in livecd mode, is it the videocard?
[11:48] <BluesKaj> streulma, try running with no acpi in live mode, at the ubuntu page check your options, apci=off
[11:48] <BluesKaj> oop acpi=off
[11:48] <streulma> BluesKaj, yes, but I remember from before in earlier versions, that my network will not work
[11:50] <BluesKaj> streulma, have you updated/upgraded dist-upgraded since installing ?
[11:50] <streulma> BluesKaj, clean install
[11:50] <streulma> daily from today
[11:50] <streulma> tomorrow Beta1 is there :)
[11:51] <BluesKaj> no matter run the upgrades anyway
[11:55] <streulma> BluesKay, once upon a day I run Ubuntu on my unsupported Mac
[11:56] <BluesKaj> intel gpu ?
[12:04] <streulma> no nvidia 9600 512mb
[12:07] <BluesKaj> streulma, install the nvidia-331 driver
[12:44] <SuperLag> hooray... compiz crashes remain
[13:07] <xsacha> hi, just wondering approx. what time beta 1 is due?
[13:23] <streulma> xsacha: tomorrow I think
[13:23] <xsacha> sure but what time, GMT, until i could find a built iso?
[13:24] <k1l> 23:55 in the last timezone ;p
[13:25] <k1l> if you are that impatient go with the daily. it will upgrade to the beta anyway
[13:47] <xsacha> k1l: oh it can upgrade to milestone release? awesome, thanks
[13:56] <k1l> xsacha: milestone releases are just snapshots of the daily development.
[13:57] <k1l> i think they get some extendet iso testing but if you install a milestone and run a update you will be the same state as daily
[13:58] <xsacha> ahh thanks!
[14:13] <Wnt> I'm using Gnome shell in 14.04. If I choose Ambiance as the GTK+ theme I don't get any resize gandles in the edges of some applications, e.g. Nautilus and gnome-tweak-tool. Should I report problems like this somewhere?
[14:14] <Wnt> Using the default Adawaita theme there are resize handles in those applications
[14:18] <Wnt> Also, in the default interface font Cantarell the characters '8' and '9' are not as tall as other characters, while e.g. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cantarell2.svg shows that they should be as tall as other characters
[15:08] <urmysony> Hi all
[15:09] <urmysony> I was trying to install unity8 mir but it broke my system
[15:09] <urmysony> Now m not able to go past login screen
[15:11] <urmysony> Gettibg message like stopping system v runlevel compatibility..
[15:12] <urmysony> Help please..
[15:19] <Wnt> urmysony: how did you install it?
[15:19] <urmysony> I followed from omgubuntu site
[15:20] <Wnt> maybe you can uninstall it from a command line only virtual terminal (ctrl + alt + F1)
[15:20] <urmysony> But that didn't work.. So i installed from deb directly..
[15:20] <urmysony> That i already removed.. But now its not passing greeter
[15:37] <Daekdroom> He possibly didn't have the -proposed repos installed, then manually installed a .deb file that broke dependencies and removed important packages
[15:37]  * Daekdroom sighs
[15:49] <genii> My webcam stopped working with the latest round of updates
[16:58] <soee> susundberg: iv been using xorg ppa and it seems that thir packages break nvidia-prime
[16:58] <soee> iv reinstalled from trusty ppa
[16:58] <soee> and it seems to work fine
[16:58] <soee> *edgers
[17:00] <genii> soee: I also had nvidia breakage today from xorg-edgers
[17:01] <soee> yeah when reinstalling where was an warning that some patch cant be applied
[17:02] <soee> patch reladted 3.13 kernel
[17:02] <soee> *related
[17:10] <susundberg> soee: oh, ok.
[17:10] <xsacha> 3.13 has been great for my graphics drivers (radeon)
[17:43] <pietro10> $ ls /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libX11.so.6
[17:43] <pietro10> /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libX11.so.6
[17:43] <pietro10> $ gcc -m32 ... -L/usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/ -lX11  -lpthread
[17:44] <pietro10> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lX11
[17:44] <pietro10> I have libX11:i386 (or whatever it's called precisely) instealled - what am I doing wrong? thanks
[17:52] <genii> pietro10: Might try: sudo ln -s /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libX11.so.6 /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libX11.so
[17:53] <pietro10> is there a package I can install that does that? I'm personally not a fan of manually touching /usr/lib like that
[17:54] <genii> pietro10: All it's doing is making a symbolic link to libX11.so.6
[17:57] <pietro10> eh
[17:57] <pietro10> all right then
[17:58] <pietro10> I had problems when I tried to fix libpng errors and earlier multiarch issues manually so eh
[17:59] <pietro10> either way, thanks
[18:56] <xsacha> just wondering, how is hybrid graphics handled in ubuntu 14.04?
[18:57] <xsacha> i seem to be on the intel gpu now. xrandr shows intel and amd
[18:59] <xsacha> running something with DRI_PRIME=1 seems to use the amd gpu, interesting
[19:01] <xsacha> whoops, running glxgears on the amd and then the intel crashed compiz


[00:13] <arraybolt3> tsimonq2: ACK
[01:07] <arraybolt3_wc> tsimonq2: o/ from WeeChat
[01:23] <arraybolt3> I now have rudimentary "apt update" support in the new updater. It's a bit funky I think because of an error in my backend script, but it seems to work and it looks nice.
[01:24] <arraybolt3> so now there's a "Check for Updates" button rather than a "Details" button. The "Details" button I intend to replace with allowing the user to double-click an update in the list to see more info about that particular update, which should be way lower on resource consumption and allow much more in-depth info display.
[01:52] <arraybolt3> guiverc, Leokolb, and anyone else who is a tester: If you haven't already, check your application menu -> Preferences and see if "Apply Full Upgrade" has been replaced with "Lubuntu Update". If it hasn't, run a full upgrade and reboot, if it has, reboot. A reboot is required to get the new updater working (unless you want to start it manually, which will work but it's best to just reboot),
[01:53] <arraybolt3> and the old one will almost without question be broken after it is replaced.
[01:54] <arraybolt3> anyway, going to package that new obconf-qt fanciness
[01:54] <guiverc> arraybolt3, I have an 'Lubuntu Update' in my menu...  (on this noble box)
[01:55] <arraybolt3> guiverc: kk, reboot and let me know what you think of it once it starts working :)
[01:56] <guiverc> i'll test it out on another box (I reboot this one only fornightly... not due yet)  yeah it don't work yet it appears here; but I'd expect logout/login required at minimum
[01:57] <arraybolt3> guiverc: If you just clicked on it, the first time clicking on it starts the background process.
[01:57] <arraybolt3> So click on it one more time and you should see it.
[01:58] <arraybolt3> (The background process is also set to autostart, but that doesn't happen until a reboot or some such. Clicking it once is how you manually start it the first time without rebooting. I dunno if that makes sense)
[01:59] <guiverc> yep.. second click & a menu appears..   it reports no updates 'will be updated'.. but I install updates many times a day at terminal so no updates is ~expected
[01:59] <guiverc> more a dialog box (rather than menu)...
[01:59] <arraybolt3> perfect
[02:01] <arraybolt3> oy, actaully I won't be doing packaging right now, because Lubuntu Git is down and I don't want to accidentally get our Git out of sync with the archive.
[02:01] <guiverc> ack & likley a very smart move.
[02:01] <arraybolt3> np, I'll go back to coding or perhaps see what patches need sponsored over in #ubuntu-devel.
[02:01] <arraybolt3> or try to install OpenBSD on an old i386 laptop :P
[02:02] <guiverc> :)
[02:02] <arraybolt3> actually what I really should be doing is getting some way to remote into my primary system so I can get rid of my clunky Chromebook and do work more easily.
[02:02] <arraybolt3> anyway, off-topic (like we care but still), I'll figure that out somewhere else :P
[02:15] <guiverc> arraybolt3, on this box; I've perforemd `apt update` & two packages can be updated.. (libv4l-0 libv4lconvert0) but 0 are showing in 'lubuntu-update'  (i've not logged out/in or rebooted)
[02:20] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: You could also just keep local repo copies for now.
[02:21] <tsimonq2> That's my plam
[02:21] <tsimonq2> *plan.
[02:21] <tsimonq2> Anyway, we should have a new Calamares and a new obconf-qt.
[02:21] <tsimonq2> My first meeting starts at 5 AM, so I am about to EOD.
[02:25] <arraybolt3> guiverc: could be because of "held back" updates?
[02:25] <arraybolt3> oh, actually, I know why
[02:25] <arraybolt3> you don't have the new "Check for Updates" button yet
[02:26] <arraybolt3> and so the updater is still using in-memory data about updates rather than fetching it anew
[15:17] <tsimonq2> For those on the IRC side that are unaware, our bridging service is down until Friday, unless teward and/or myself find some magic to work.
[15:17] <tsimonq2> IRC stays the (lowercase c) canonical communication platform for Lubuntu. I'd like this to be Matrix soon, but for now this is IRC.
[19:58] <lynorian> tsimonq2 thanks for telling me about the new version of htop
[19:58] <tsimonq2> lynorian: Of course, sorry if the message got delayed :)
[19:59] <tsimonq2> Looks like our Twitter strawpoll is 100% for shipping the new version in Backports. Nice.


[01:46] <kees> I'm finally playing with SecureBoot! :)
[01:46] <kees> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1658255
[07:10] <apw> kees,
[07:11] <apw> kees, would you dump in a dmesg on that one please
[12:12] <hwpplayer1> Hi
[12:13] <hwpplayer1> Could you please show me the documentation for live kernel patch
[12:13] <hwpplayer1> I need more details
[12:16] <apw> hwpplayer1, what sort of details are you looking for (so i can figure our who is best placed to help you)
[12:16] <hwpplayer1> how it works , which protocols , source code of service
[12:17] <hwpplayer1> i want to create a new technical support and collaboration service
[12:17] <hwpplayer1> which different teams work on the same issue / computer
[12:18] <hwpplayer1> if i can learn how canonical patch , i can design a clean service
[12:19] <apw> the live patches themselves use the in kernel live patching facilities
[12:19] <hwpplayer1> yes beginning from 4.x
[12:19] <apw> the patches themselves are generated by a team of people and batched up
[12:19] <apw> into release packages which are provided via a canonical service hosted in-house
[12:20] <apw> i will let people know you are asking and they may have more details to share
[12:20] <hwpplayer1> okay , if it is a basic server - client model
[12:21] <hwpplayer1>  than we can expand it with different models
[12:21] <apw> the livepatch service installs a daemon which handles aquisition and delivery of livepatches
[12:21] <hwpplayer1> the daemon works like an init ?
[12:22] <apw> it runs all the time yes
[12:22] <hwpplayer1> apw : thanks , i'm searching other things related , by the way i work with hardened team , i'm new , not accepted to the team yet
[12:23] <apw> ahh ok
[12:34] <hwpplayer1> Patch Analysis                                                                                --------------
[12:35] <hwpplayer1> sorry
[12:36] <hwpplayer1> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23839078/
[12:37] <hwpplayer1> So we need more hackers


[22:57] <qwebirc21175> Eben though I install a fresh version of 14.04 mcc takes forever to start and when I try to update the repos the flyout partially opens and just sits there.  Does anyone have an idea what is going on ?
[22:58] <qwebirc21175> By the way sorry to hear that Mythbuntu is  getting no further updates.  Was same with Kmoppix
[22:58] <qwebirc21175> Knopmyth
[22:59] <tgm4883> 14.04? Did you post this question on the forums too?
[22:59] <qwebirc21175> no I did not
[22:59] <tgm4883> hmm, ok
[22:59] <qwebirc21175> I have searched for an answer there but there is nothing I can find
[23:00] <tgm4883> 14.04 should work I think. I wonder if it's trying to refresh the db list
[23:00] <tgm4883> refreshing the mythtv updates list would hang I think
[23:01] <qwebirc21175> I have done that several times. Erased the disk, started with 14.04 LTS
[23:01] <tgm4883> Yea that's not something... Any reason you aren't going to 16.04?
[23:01] <qwebirc21175> also get the same response if I try to do this from a DVD in the Try mode
[23:01] <qwebirc21175>  suspect some kind of access problem
[23:02] <qwebirc21175> as in the repos it is trying to get to are someplace else
[23:02] <tgm4883> Any reason you aren't going to 16.04?
[23:02] <qwebirc21175> experience shows provocative maintennce is asking for trouble ;)
[23:02] <qwebirc21175> maintenance
[23:03] <tgm4883> hmm, ok
[23:03] <qwebirc21175> also comments about 16.04 show problems
[23:03] <qwebirc21175> and reduced quality so concerned about upgrading until stabilizes
[23:03] <tgm4883> well the refresh button isn't working because I moved the location that was hosting that db file
[23:03] <qwebirc21175> well that might be it ;)
[23:04] <tgm4883> There's a file you can edit to point it at the right location
[23:04] <qwebirc21175> is there a place to change the location in the mcc script ?
[23:04] <tgm4883> Let me look it up
[23:04] <qwebirc21175> ta very much
[23:05] <qwebirc21175> Hey TGM thanks for what you have done for community with this system
[23:06] <qwebirc21175> sorry to hear it has become too much of a burden (assuming you are one of the last 2 developers) never easy to figure out  in a place where you might be talking with Putin ;)
[23:07] <qwebirc21175> place == Internet
[23:07] <qwebirc21175> Oh you are Thomas Mashos
[23:13] <tgm4883> heh, yea
[23:14] <tgm4883> Sorry, let me look at up in a few minutes, finishing something else currently
[23:14] <qwebirc21175> OK
[23:14] <qwebirc21175> Missis is calling, will leave chat open if that is OK
[23:14] <tgm4883> off the top of my head, I think /usr/share/mythbuntu/plugins/py/  is that a directory?
[23:15] <qwebirc21175> not on my machine
[23:15] <qwebirc21175> it is /usr/share/mythbuntu/plugins/python
[23:15] <tgm4883> ah yea
[23:15] <tgm4883> what files are in there?
[23:15] <qwebirc21175> log_grabber.py          mythexport.py          services.py mysql_configuration.py  plugins.py             startup_behavior.py mythbuntu-bare.py       proprietary_codecs.py  system_roles.py mythbuntu_repos.py      remote.py
[23:16] <tgm4883> mythbuntu_repos.py
[23:16] <tgm4883> edit that, look for a line that has repos.db in it
[23:16] <tgm4883> should be a URL
[23:17] <qwebirc21175> #shutil.copy("/usr/share/mythbuntu/repos.db", self.USERHOME+"/.mythbuntu/")
[23:17] <tgm4883> nope
[23:17] <qwebirc21175> only occurence
[23:17] <tgm4883> hmm
[23:17] <tgm4883> ok, let me dig into it, give me a few minutes
[23:17] <qwebirc21175> do you think it is in the mcc script ?
[23:18] <tgm4883> no, it should be there I think
[23:18] <qwebirc21175> OK. Get a beer - diffing gets easier ;)
[23:18] <qwebirc21175> digging
[23:18] <tgm4883> unless I pulled it out into a conf file
[23:18] <qwebirc21175> clearly I already got mine
[23:21] <tgm4883> qwebirc21175: actually, can you do 'cat /usr/share/mythbuntu/plugins/python/mythbuntu_repos.py | nc termbin.com 9999'
[23:21] <tgm4883> that will make it easier, it will give you a link so I can see the exact version of the file you have
[23:22] <qwebirc21175> http://termbin.com/t92s
[23:23] <tgm4883> There it is
[23:23] <tgm4883> http://download.mythbuntu.org/repos/repos.db
[23:23] <tgm4883> That needs updated
[23:23] <tgm4883> about 3/4 way down
[23:23] <qwebirc21175> Sorry Tom, what am I updating ?
[23:24] <qwebirc21175> you mean in this file /usr/share/mythbuntu/plugins/python/mythbuntu_repos.py
[23:24] <tgm4883> yea
[23:24] <tgm4883> that file needs updated
[23:24] <tgm4883> It should be this instead
[23:25] <tgm4883> http://people.ubuntu.com/~tgm4883/repos.db
[23:25] <qwebirc21175> oh I see now
[23:25] <qwebirc21175> I should replace the url
[23:25] <qwebirc21175> got it
[23:25] <tgm4883> yep
[23:25] <tgm4883> that will at least let the refresh finish
[23:26] <qwebirc21175> Ok thanks a lot Tom
[23:29] <qwebirc21175> starts fast but no repos button ;)
[23:30] <tgm4883> hmm
[23:30] <tgm4883> Maybe a typo in that file that you edited?  I need to know what was being fed into it
[23:37] <tgm4883> because I don't think the format of that db file changed
[23:37] <qwebirc21175> you have good instincts -- here you go
[23:38] <qwebirc21175> dash it
[23:38] <qwebirc21175> cant paste forsome reason probably line length
[23:39] <qwebirc21175> ARNING: Failed to set from config file. Setting defaults Traceback (most recent call last):   File "/usr/lib/python3.4/configparser.py", line 1116, in _unify_values     sectiondict = self._sections[section] KeyError: 'General'
[23:39] <qwebirc21175> During handling of the above exception, another exception occurred:  Traceback (most recent call last):   File "/usr/share/mythbuntu/plugins/python/mythbuntu-bare.py", line 85, in captureState     self.changes['serverip'] = self.config.get("General", "serverip")   File "/usr/lib/python3.4/configparser.py", line 754, in get     d = self._unify_values(section, vars)   File "/usr/lib/python3.4/configparser.py", line 1119, in
[23:39] <tgm4883> ok
[23:39] <tgm4883> yea we don't really care about -bare
[23:39] <tgm4883> any other errors?
[23:40] <qwebirc21175> let me try new window
[23:42] <qwebirc21175> (mythbuntu-control-centre:3940): Gtk-CRITICAL **: gtk_widget_event: assertion 'WIDGET_REALIZED_FOR_EVENT (widget, event)' failed
[23:43] <tgm4883> Can you paste the 20 or so lines? other than the -bare error, none of this is relevent
[23:43] <tgm4883> there's still no -repos button on the right?
[23:44] <qwebirc21175> right but starts fast ;)
[23:44] <tgm4883> ok do this
[23:44] <qwebirc21175> ok starting from the top of errors
[23:44] <tgm4883> -bare doesn't work, so lets remove it
[23:44] <qwebirc21175> Traceback (most recent call last):   File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/MythbuntuControlCentre/plugin.py", line 56, in reload_plugins     __import__(plugin, None, None, [''])   File "/usr/share/mythbuntu/plugins/python/mythbuntu_repos.py", line 223     url = 'http://people.ubuntu.com/~tgm4883/repos.db'                                                      ^
[23:44] <tgm4883> yea, that's the line
[23:45] <tgm4883> why doesn't it like that line though...
[23:45] <qwebirc21175> it is catching an error - is this all about indentation ?
[23:45] <tgm4883> possibly
[23:45] <tgm4883> everything does need to be indented properly in python
[23:45] <qwebirc21175> I dont know python so could be
[23:45] <tgm4883> should use spaces, not tabs
[23:47] <qwebirc21175> OK
[23:50] <qwebirc21175> OK rewrote line but still no repos button
[23:51] <qwebirc21175> I must have screwed  something up.  Let me take a copy of the file from the dvd and use that
[23:51] <qwebirc21175> Tom thanks a lot.  I very much appreciate this.  I wonder why others have not mentioned this
[23:53] <qwebirc21175> goodnight Irene ;)
[23:54] <qwebirc21175> Im leaving for a bit ..
[23:54] <tgm4883> k


[15:24] <qense> hello
[15:26] <newz2000> hhhhheeeelllllooooo
[15:26] <newz2000> (cccoold heeere)
[15:29] <nand> newz2000: hey! Guess what was the performance bottleneck? The session table, with 1.5M entries! That was making a 600ms query for every user, even non registered
[15:29] <nand> Drupal sucks at session handling
[15:29] <newz2000> yeah, I've had this exact problem myself
[15:29] <newz2000> it's worse when you're using mysql since table contention is a serious problem
[15:34] <nand> we put a cron to clean it regularly
[15:34] <nand> and for info, the mix of drupal internal cache and squid is bad : registered users are being server anonymous pages
[15:35] <newz2000> there are three options aren't there, none, basic and extreme
[15:35] <newz2000> did you try the minimal caching option?
[15:37] <nand> I did the basic (since not sure about this extreme options side effects)
[15:37] <nand> right now I've removed drupal internal cache, only squid is live
[15:37] <newz2000> let me check ubuntu.com... I think the basic is the suggested option
[15:38] <nand> yep
[15:38] <nand> it is
[15:38] <newz2000> no, we're running disabled too, so I guess you're on the right track
[22:49] <Flaw> Hi


[13:12] <Goog_Josh> when i trying to start kaffeine - display next message: "Loading of player part 'XinePart' failed. All Video Drivers failed to initialize!". does anyone know how to solve this problem?
[13:12] <Goog_Josh> when i trying to start kaffeine - display next message: "Loading of player part 'XinePart' failed. All Video Drivers failed to initialize!". does anyone know how to solve this problem?
[22:54] <TheMuso> c


[00:10] <McPeter> special french joke : http://omploader.org/vMWg2Yw
[00:10] <McPeter> (hi all)
[00:10] <McPeter> look on bottom right
[07:11] <bazhang> w00t
[07:55] <jpds> Hello bazhang.
[07:56] <bazhang> jpds, hi
[10:22] <elky> jpds? i think there's an issue in -es
[10:22] <jpds> I'm there.
[10:22] <hASDhaQ> hello? I need help in #ubuntu-es
[10:22] <jpds> hASDhaQ: Estoy ahi.
[10:23] <jpds> He's gone.
[10:23] <hASDhaQ> thx
[10:23] <hASDhaQ> :)
[10:26] <jpds> And ban forwarded him here.
[10:26] <hASDhaQ> yes, I saw :P
[12:17] <Nafallo> Myrtti: time to run you IPoSN router :-)
[13:43] <elky> IPoSN?
[14:38] <Nafallo> elky: IPv6 over Facebook :-)
[14:39] <Nafallo> well. IPv6 over Social Networks ;-)
[19:12] <nhandler> Hello. I came in here a while ago requesting an ubuntu cloak for my bot (VoteBot). I was wondering what the status of this was.
[19:55] <Nafallo> p
[19:55] <Nafallo> http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=pub-2070091971271392&q=Tower+Hill,+London+EC3N,+United+Kingdom&ie=UTF8&cd=7&geocode=FWb5EQMd-Nf-_w&split=0&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=23.875,57.630033&ll=51.509474,-0.076974&spn=0,359.994223&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=51.509458,-0.077154&panoid=oykE_5_fyJGP32-op0wrPg&cbp=12,312.14730445959293,,0,-11.044568245125353
[20:40] <nhandler> I also have a few other things that I think need to be looked at. 1) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/Cloaks#Mantainance produces output. 2) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/IrcCouncil/MeetingAgenda has not been updated in a long time. 3) There does not appear to be a seenserv as mentioned on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines
[20:44] <jpds> SeenServ went away with the new services package ages ago.
[20:44] <LjL> nhandler: fixed the seenserv thing
[20:45] <nhandler> Thanks LjL. I would have fixed it, but it says to talk to the IRC council first
[20:46] <LjL> nhandler: yeah, well i am a former irc council member and i'm pretty sure nobody will be upset at that edit since it simply reflects a change in the network
[20:47] <LjL> nhandler: as for the cloaks script, i haven't run it, but keep in mind that i believe some space is allowed for former ubuntu members in case they forgot to renew the membership
[20:50] <nhandler> LjL: I figured that was the case. Personally, I think that if they are still active and wish to use the cloak, they should re-apply for membership. However, in the end, the irc council has the final say