[07:03] <debianist> mdz : what about other peripherals, digi cams, firewire xfer thingies
[07:03] <doko> what is a blob in this context
[07:03] <daniels> if it doesn't happen for warty, i might do a radeon-driver-r4xx diversion crack attack on people.n-n-y.com
[07:03] <mdz> debianist: yes, what about them? :-)  are there any binary-only drivers that you need for such hardware?
[07:04] <mdz> doko: object code
[07:04] <pitti> jdub told us about some webcams
[07:04] <daniels> pwcx, iirc
[07:04] <mdz> pitti: I think the one he was talking about was pwcx
[07:04] <mdz> and that driver was discontinued
[07:04] <doko> yes, then the avm binary capi library
[07:04] <mdz> doko: ok, will you package it?
[07:04] <pitti> wasn't there a pwc also?
[07:04] <mdz> pitti: pwc is in the kernel, and free
[07:04] <pitti> great!
[07:05] <mdz> pwcx implemented extended features of the same devices
[07:05] <Mithrandir> mdz: pwc got removed with 2.6.8, didn't it?  Or rather, is in 2.6.9 somewehere?
[07:05] <doko> mdz: ok, for linux-restricted as a module?
[07:05] <mdz> Mithrandir: it did? oh
[07:05] <mdz> doko: is it kernel or userland?
[07:05] <Mithrandir> mdz: according to lwn.net, at least,  iirc
[07:05] <lamont> I thought it was that pwc removed the hooks that pcwx needed
[07:05] <doko> mdz: kernel
[07:05] <mdz> doko: ok, then it goes in linux-restricted-modules
[07:05] <mdz> doko: herbert is working on it now, then fabio, then daniel
[07:05] <mdz> er
[07:05] <mdz> scratch daniel, we dropped ati
[07:06] <mdz> doko: so you should get linux-restricted-modules after fabio
[07:06] <debianist> mdz : creative NOMAD JukeBox player, Webcam
[07:06] <doko> mdz: fine, hope I can manage it ...
[07:06] <mdz> doko: send email to fabio asking him to pass the packages to you after he has added the nvidia driver
[07:06] <mdz> doko: if you have trouble, mail herbert
[07:06] <mdz> hopefully it should be clear from the examples
[07:06] <doko> fine
[07:06] <mdz> if not, a little documentation would be nice
[07:07] <mdz> ok
[07:07] <mdz> debianist: do you have URLs and information about the drivers?
[07:07] <mdz> debianist: if so, please send them to me via email (description of the device, URL for the driver, any other information about it you may have)
[07:07] <doko> what about inclusion of the isdnutils-base, libcapi20-3 and isdnactivecards in desktop?
[07:08] <mdz> isn't isdnutils already in base?
[07:08] <debianist> mdz : k, i'll have to recollect those, it's been long time since I tampared with it ;)
[07:08] <mdz> hmm, it's in supported
[07:08] <mdz> doko: what is isdnactivecards?
[07:08] <mdz> debianist: are these drivers that you personally use?
[07:08] <mdz> debianist: (and can help us to test)?
[07:09] <mdz> doko: isdnutils-base sounds like it should go in base
[07:09] <debianist> mdz : hmmm seems there are open source "replacments" for most of them now, I will try to work out those ones than it would releive us from adding it
[07:09] <doko> isdnactivecards is the package to handle isdn cards using the capi interface, packaged together with firmware for active isdn cards (active: own processor on the card). maybe I should split that into to capituils and activecards.
[07:09] <debianist> mdz : to restricted , that is
[07:10] <mdz> doko: is libcapi20-3 useful on its own?
[07:10] <mdz> doko: it does not seem to be depended on by either of the other packages
[07:11] <doko> it's needed by the capi utilities in isdnactivecards.
[07:11] <mdz> debianist: ok, let me know via email if there is anything that you feel is missing that we could add to the restricted module package
[07:11] <mdz> doko: why does it not depend on it?
[07:12] <debianist> mdz : ofcourse! np
[07:12] <doko> mdz: you found a bug.
[07:12] <tvon|x31> anyone using 'tpb' for thinkpads?
[07:13] <HcE> tpb?
[07:13] <thom> tvon|x31: i have, but it's a criminally ugly hack
[07:13] <doko> tvon|x31: I couldn't get it working yesterday.
[07:13] <mdz> I'm going to add isdnutils-base to BaseSeed; Kamion, can you update debootstrap?
[07:13] <Mithrandir> HcE: thinkpad buttons
[07:13] <Kamion> mdz: sure
[07:13] <mdz> thanks
[07:13] <HcE> which "extra" buttons?
[07:13] <Mithrandir> HcE: uses some osd thingy to make volume changing and such look fancy
[07:13] <HcE> the "Access IBM" button?
[07:14] <Mithrandir> HcE: I can show you tomorrow.
[07:14] <HcE> IIIIIK
[07:14] <tvon|x31> volume controle usually...there are some others
[07:14] <Mithrandir> if you remind me
[07:14] <tvon|x31> yes, access ibm as well
[07:14] <HcE> volume buttons work here without tpb
[07:14] <mdz> doko: what about ipppd and the other binary packages?
[07:14] <mdz> doko: what is the minimum needed for ISDN networking, which should go in base?
[07:14] <tvon|x31> tpb uses xosd to display the volume
[07:14] <thom> you don't need it for any of the buttons - it just prettifies the display
[07:14] <daniels> mdz: oh, while we're on this, could we please seed bpalogin in if it isn't already?
[07:15] <thom> and it's an evil hack, reading stuff out of /dev/kmem or something iirc
[07:15] <doko> mdz: I prepare that list offline, ipppd is needed as well.
[07:15] <mdz> doko: ok
[07:15] <Mithrandir> HcE: work, yes.  But does it show it onscreen?
[07:15] <daniels> mdz: it's dfsg-free, it's a custom login client for australia's largest cable modem network (and dsl, too), and has been picked up by a few others
[07:15] <mdz> Kamion: let's hold off until we've decided on the final list
[07:15] <HcE> Mithrandir: I said they work ;)
[07:15] <tvon|x31> I'd kinda like to rewrite it, using gnome-osd or something
[07:15] <mdz> daniels: supported?
[07:15] <Kamion> mdz: I'll just remove pppoe for this release then
[07:15] <daniels> thom: yeah, we shouldn't ship anything that just randomly maps shit out of /dev/kmem ;)
[07:15] <mdz> Kamion: ok
[07:15] <daniels> mdz: in the warty sense, or the upstream sense?
[07:16] <SteveA> I have totem-xine <IP_ADDRESS>-1.  It crashes on start.
[07:16] <mdz> daniels: they are very closely related :-)
[07:16] <Mithrandir> daniels: it doesn't use kmem, it uses some other device.
[07:16] <daniels> mdz: heh
[07:16] <mdz> SteveA: ubuntu team meeting is in progress
[07:16] <lamont> SteveA:  I have that version, runs fine here..
[07:16] <mdz> daniels: is it supportable?
[07:16] <debianist> are we already supporting dell inspiron laptops?
[07:16] <daniels> mdz: well-supported upstream, would be nice to have in shipseed at least as you kind of need it to get online here
[07:16] <mdz> daniels: if so, it can go in supported
[07:16] <SteveA> mdz: sorry -- figured that would be on ubuntu-meeting
[07:16] <daniels> mdz: yes
[07:16] <debianist> including Alps touchpad module / driver etc?
[07:16] <mdz> SteveA: long story :-)
[07:17] <daniels> debianist: aieee, alps
[07:17] <daniels> debianist: i don't know if that still needs a kernel patch or not, but last i saw, it did
[07:17] <debianist> daniels : huh?
[07:17] <daniels> the userspace support is all there tho
[07:17] <daniels> debianist: last i saw, the kernel needed a patch to meaningfully talk to alps touchpads
[07:17] <debianist> daniels : i used a modconf insertion, when it still worked :)
[07:18] <debianist> daniels : it has a kernel module
[07:18] <daniels> debianist: so it works with current warty kernels? what did you have to insert?
[07:18] <mdz> daniels: ok, I'll add it to supported and ship
[07:18] <daniels> debianist: yeah, but i'm not sure if that's in the mainline kernel yet
[07:18] <daniels> mdz: thanks dude
[07:18] <debianist> daniels : i'd test that on the warty. havn't yet done so...
[07:18] <daniels> debianist: which kernel were you using?
[07:19] <debianist> daniels : it evens works with <IP_ADDRESS> currentl on the sid on the inspiron
[07:19] <pitti> can we sort out this specific things out of the meeting?
[07:20] <mdz> ok
[07:20] <mdz> Kamion: a quick update on the installer is the last item on my agenda
[07:20] <Kamion> today's daily was broken, that's fixed
[07:20] <mdz> the two specific issues I wanted to talk about were the apt-setup stuff for restricted and universe, and archive-copier
[07:21] <Kamion> apt-setup has been fabbione's baby; it seems to be working on the install I just did
[07:21] <Kamion> I have commented-out lines in sources.list for main+restricted and for main+restricted+universe
[07:21] <mdz> so those changes will be in sounder 8?
[07:21] <Kamion> yep
[07:21] <Kamion> archive-copier is my current final headache for sounder 8
[07:22] <Kamion> I've almost got the integration there to make the CD totally unnecessary after the first reboot, but am working through bugs
[07:22] <mdz> archive-copier itself, or are you working out the apt-config-in-prebaseconfig bits?
[07:22] <Kamion> the latter
[07:22] <mdz> ok
[07:22] <Kamion> archive-copier itself has been working well for a while now
[07:22] <mdz> do you think sounder 8 will see the light today?
[07:22] <Kamion> yes
[07:22] <mdz> yes, it worked fine for me
[07:22] <Mithrandir> mdz: how is the amd64 installer ATM?
[07:22] <Kamion> if I can't get this to work I'll punt it
[07:22] <Kamion> (like, within the next hour or so)
[07:23] <mdz> Mithrandir: today's daily was broken, so I haven't tried it
[07:23] <mdz> I'll test sounder 8
[07:23] <mdz> Kamion: in fact, if it's ok with you, I'd like to test a sounder 8 candidate before you bless it
[07:23] <Kamion> mdz: sure
[07:23] <Mithrandir> I'm also interested in that
[07:23] <mdz> it'd be excellent to have a sounder 8 which installed on all arches
[07:23] <Kamion> any other installer issues on people's minds?
[07:24] <Kamion> nothing much else comes to mind here
[07:24] <mdz> that's all I had on my list.  anything interesting in bugzilla?
[07:24] <npmccallum> Kamion: the installer is looking great
[07:24] <Kamion> there are a couple of debconf priority issues which have come up in sounder reports
[07:24] <Kamion> WEP keys in netcfg is one of them
[07:24] <Kamion> that's currently a priority high question
[07:24] <debianist> Kamion : the partitioner bug.
[07:25] <mdz> Kamion: is it just a matter of increasing the priority, or is it trickier than that?
[07:25] <mdz> what partitioner bug?
[07:25] <Kamion> debianist: yep, that's another open issue
[07:25] <Kamion> mdz: resizing ext3 not working; may be a parted issue, haven't diagnosed it yet
[07:25] <mdz> hmm, haven't tested that
[07:25] <Kamion> mdz: increasing the priority would fix it, but may incur Mark's wrath at an additional question :-)
[07:25] <mdz> Kamion: it would only be asked if it couldn't associate without one, no?
[07:26] <Kamion> mdz: I think it's asked regardless, but wouldn't swear to it
[07:27] <mdz> ah, I thought there was some fallback there, where it would try it with no configuration, and if that didn't work, fall back to asking for the essid
[07:27] <debianist> Kamion : also, the fact d-i advances to installation although no root filesystem has been setup. Maybe block the next stage with a flag untill a partition is created?
[07:27] <mdz> asking for the wep key at the same time sounds like a minimum of evil
[07:27] <Kamion> there are also some CD-ROM issues on my bug list that I'm not sure how to fix, and may be hardware specific
[07:28] <Kamion> oh, and all the fstab stuff; I need somebody to tell me the currently-approved state of play on that
[07:28] <Kamion> preferably in the bug so I remember
[07:28] <mdz> Kamion: is the question which devices should be added to fstab?
[07:28] <pitti> Kamion: regarding CD-ROM entries?
[07:29] <Kamion> mdz: yes
[07:29] <Kamion> pitti: and floppies
[07:29] <pitti> Kamion: we should leave them in fstab by now; floppies and CD-ROMs cannot be mounted by pmount currently
[07:29] <mdz> someone posted to the sounder list saying that their SCSI CD-ROM wasn't added
[07:30] <mdz> the current behaviour is fine for my systems
[07:30] <Kamion> bug #1040
[07:30] <pitti> Kamion: we could change pmount policy for that, but it's a bit late I think
[07:30] <pitti> Kamion: in addition, it is nice if the CD-ROM appears in the computer window even if no CD is present
[07:30] <debianist> add those to fstab,
[07:30] <debianist> leave GNOME handle the mounts
[07:30] <Kamion> please, guys, in the bug
[07:30] <debianist> sorry
[07:30] <mdz> agreed, post your comments to #1040
[07:30] <Kamion> I don't want a discussion, I just want the current approved state :-)
[07:31] <Kamion> a discussion will render me more confused, since I haven't followed all of this
[07:31] <mdz> ok, does anyone else have anything they need to discuss before we close the meeting?
[07:31] <pitti> can we agree how to disable the cups admin interface?
[07:31] <doko> planning the release party might be a bit early ;)
[07:31] <mdz> can we replace the HTML with some explanatory text?
[07:31] <pitti> the error page? should be possible
[07:31] <Mithrandir> for the next meeting, I would very much like to have a list of items to go through beforehand; it's been a bit unstructured.
[07:31] <pitti> but at that time, the user already entered his root password
[07:31] <mdz> the page you get at /admin
[07:32] <debianist> mdz : how many language checked from d-i ?
[07:32] <pitti> mdz: you can get there from everywhere
[07:32] <debianist> mdz : how many language checked for d-i ?
[07:32] <mdz> Mithrandir: oh, I think I skipped over amd64 status
[07:32] <mdz> Mithrandir: what remains on your todo list?  openoffice.org?
[07:32] <mdz> pitti: we should disable the authentication and show a placeholder page, ideally
[07:32] <Mithrandir> mdz: OOo, some mozilla stuff is still not fixed (thunderbird at least, epiphany was broken because I gave seb a broken patch)
[07:32] <mdz> which tells them where to find gnome-cups-manager
[07:33] <debianist> mdz : never mind that. I need to check this problem on real hardware also
[07:33] <pitti> mdz: you cannot disable the authentication
[07:33] <pitti> mdz: but I can change the web pages not to refer to /admin any more
[07:33] <mdz> Mithrandir: please file bugs in bugzilla so that I can keep up easily
[07:33] <Mithrandir> I need to run through the installer a few times and make sure it's works well, but apart from that, amd64 is in good shape.
[07:33] <mdz> pitti: I thought the problem was that users were accustomed to going to http://localhost:6031/admin or whatever
[07:33] <pitti> mdz: we cannot do anything about that
[07:33] <pitti> mdz: we need this interface because gnome-cups-manager uses the CGI as well
[07:34] <pitti> mdz: (anything apart from rewriting half of cups)
[07:34] <debianist> :)
[07:34] <pitti> mdz: okay, I will change the error page and remove the admin links.
[07:34] <mdz> pitti: but gnome-cups-manager does not care what text is displayed on the page, does it?
[07:35] <pitti> mdz: I think so
[07:35] <mdz> pitti: ok, that sounds reasonable
[07:35] <Mithrandir> mdz: ok, I'll file bugs and grab them myself?
[07:35] <mdz> pitti: if the user at least gets a reasonable error when their password is rejected, that is enough for Warty
[07:35] <mdz> Mithrandir: yes, you can assign them to yourself when opening them
[07:35] <pitti> I still have an open issue: how to efficiently handle the remaining translations?
[07:35] <mdz> Mithrandir: it's just easier for me to see the status at a glance that way
[07:35] <Mithrandir> sure
[07:35] <mdz> pitti: translations of what?
[07:36] <pitti> is there a better way than to upload a new package for every translation?
[07:36] <pitti> mdz: translations of programs
[07:36] <pitti> mdz: gksudo still talks english to me
[07:36] <pitti> mdz: so does gnome-cups-admin
[07:36] <pitti> and so on...
[07:36] <mdz> if the problem is that some programs are not fully translated yet, that is a Hoary problem
[07:36] <debianist> pitti : what language do you need it ?
[07:37] <pitti> debianist: Myself I'm fine with English, but I can do the German translations
[07:37] <pitti> debianist: if I need your's, I will come back to you :-)
[07:37] <debianist> pitti : k :) thanks for that
[07:37] <mdz> pitti: we cannot afford to spend your time on it right now; we can maybe revisit it after preview
[07:37] <pitti> mdz: okay, so we defer that until we have Rosetta?
[07:38] <mdz> pitti: please file bugs
[07:38] <mdz> (severity minor)
[07:38] <pitti> will do.
[07:38] <mdz> ok, anything else?
[07:38] <mdz> trying to keep it under 2 hours here :-)
[07:39] <thom> quick, someone filibuster for 20 minutes
[07:39] <thom> i'm sure we can do it
[07:39] <mdz> I'll send out an email with the deliverables I've collected
[07:39] <debianist> mdz : yeah, some of us are dead hungry :))
[07:39] <mdz> ok, we're done
[07:39] <mdz> thanks, everyone
[07:39] <daniels> or dead tired
[07:39] <debianist> thanks mdz
[07:39] <daniels> 'night all
[07:39] <pitti> thanks, Matt
[07:39] <thom> cheers
[07:39] <pitti> daniels: sleep well
[07:40] <thom> daniels: night kiddo
[07:40] <doko> bye
[07:40] <Oskuro> nite little daniel
[07:40] <Oskuro> :)
[07:40] <Mithrandir> daniels: see you around
[07:40] <debianist> bye all
[07:40] <debianist> (that are going to sleep)
[07:40] <pitti> so where's the buffet? :-)
[07:40] <debianist> or leaving
[07:40] <debianist> haha
[07:41] <lamont> there's a buffet?
[07:41] <pitti> lamont: don't tell me there isn't!
[07:41] <debianist> I don't reckon there's too much to eat here currently, but some other folks went shopping. I hope there'd be something good for eating , although I'd rather order a pizza
[07:41] <debianist> :)
[07:43] <lamont> ummmm... pizza......
[07:43] <debianist> yes. to damn shame havn't got a nickel to spare this month, maybe next one :)
[07:43] <debianist> *too
[07:44] <debianist> Kamion : a new image is ready and fixed?
[07:44] <Kamion> debianist: no
[07:45] <debianist> Kamion : you said it was fixed on the meeting, or was it me helusinating?
[07:45] <Kamion> debianist: fixed in the archive
[07:45] <Kamion> please go have a pizza or something :)
[07:45] <doko> kamion: for a new installer, is there anything smaller to download than the whole warty iso?
[07:45] <debianist> Kamion : when would an image be ready?
[07:46] <debianist> Kamion : just though of letting it rsync while I eat :) sorry, not meant to nag you
[07:46] <Kamion> doko: rsync?
[07:47] <Kamion> debianist: I don't know.
[07:47] <Kamion> (yet)
[07:47] <Kamion> asking me every five minutes will just slow it down :)
[07:47] <debianist> hint taken.
[07:47] <doko> kamion: don't have an old archive here :(
[07:48] <lamont> -ENOSODA.  panic
[07:48] <Kamion> doko: there's also netboot ... it's in /dists/warty/main/{,daily-}installer-$ARCH/netboot/ or thereabouts
[07:48] <doko> kamion: ok, I'll look at it.
[07:52] <Kamion> aha, found my bug
[08:06] <mdz>  * Starting PCMCIA services...                                           [fail]
[08:06] <mdz> has anyone else seen that?
[08:09] <elmo> kamion: ubuntu9's in for all arches, fyi
[08:09] <Kamion> elmo: woo, thanks
[08:09] <npmccallum> mdz: on just a normal boot?
[08:09] <mdz> npmccallum: on an upgrade
[08:10] <mdz> Preparing to replace pcmcia-cs 3.2.5-7ubuntu3 (using .../pcmcia-cs_3.2.5-7ubuntu4_powerpc.deb) ...
[08:10] <mdz> Unpacking replacement pcmcia-cs ...
[08:10] <mdz> Setting up pcmcia-cs (3.2.5-7ubuntu4) ...
[08:10] <mdz>  * Starting PCMCIA services...                                           [fail]
[08:10] <npmccallum> mdz: did it fail to bring down the interface?
[08:10] <mdz> I didn't see a "Stopping" message
[08:11] <npmccallum> mdz: wierd
[08:11] <mdz> never mind
[08:11] <mdz> I was not logged into the system I thought I was
[08:12] <mdz> that one has no pcmcia
[08:12] <mdz> I should stop naming them all 'ubuntu'
[08:12] <npmccallum> that would do it :)
[08:12] <Mithrandir> heh :)
[08:13] <npmccallum> bbiab
[08:13] <Mithrandir> mdz: you know, if you don't feel like inventing something, ubuntu1, ubuntu2, ubuntu3, etc would work. ;)
[08:13] <Kamion> OK; dinner while everything builds, then I'll roll and test a new daily.
[08:14] <mdz> Kamion: ready to test when you are
[08:14] <Kamion> counting all the archive/buildd schedules, should be an hour or so
[08:15] <elmo> so, like, anyone got a better name for warty-p-u than -p-u?  -errata maybe?
[08:16] <Mithrandir> RH used to call it errata, ISTR.
[08:16] <Kamion> or drop the -proposed and just call it -updates
[08:18] <elmo> kamion: clashes with debian's stable/updates on sec.d.o
[08:21] <elmo> but yeah, either works for me to be honest.. -updates or -errata
[08:22] <mdz> elmo: -updates WFM
[08:22] <lamont> dpkg: considering removing mtr-tiny in favour of mtr ...
[08:22] <lamont> dpkg: yes, will remove mtr-tiny in favour of mtr.
[08:22] <lamont> when did dpkg get polite???
[08:23] <elmo> dude, it's done that for years.. it's an iwj-ism, I think
[08:51] <lamont> hrm... jdub around yet?
[08:52] <lamont> until such time as I can force an ssh-add to happen after the login, and before all of the windows are restored...
[08:53] <Keybuk> .gnomerc ?
[08:53] <lamont> Keybuk: remember the cluefactor wrt gnome here...
[08:55] <lamont> I currently have a window popping up to do the ssh-add, but metacity likes to steal focus from it, and life is sad.
[08:55] <lamont> and all the other windows come up before I can get the passphrase love in
[08:55] <lamont> so they all want the passphrase.
[08:55] <lamont> which sucks
[08:56] <lamont> what would I put in (my nonexistant) .gnomerc?
[08:56] <mdz> the right place for this stuff is in the session preferences...but you're saying that it doesn't wait for ssh-add to complete before it moves on?
[08:56] <mdz> or that ssh-add runs too late?
[08:56] <mdz> if it runs too late, there's a numeric sort order in there
[08:56] <mdz> if it doesn't wait, that seems like a bug
[08:57] <Keybuk> you're using gnome-ssh-askpass ?
[08:57] <lamont> scheduled to run early, as xterm -e ssh-add
[08:57] <lamont> Keybuk: uh, what's that...
[08:57] <Keybuk> ssh-askpass-gnome, sorry
[08:57] <Keybuk> it's an ssh-askpass UI for GNOME
[08:57] <Keybuk> so instead of an Xaw dialog for your password, you get a GNOME HIGy one
[08:58] <Keybuk> which has the advantage that it tells Metacity "THE FOCUS IS MINE" and grabs the keyboard
[08:58] <lamont> but does everything else wait?
[08:58] <Keybuk> no, but nothing takes the keyboard until it goes away
[08:59] <Keybuk> in a terminal, do: ssh-add < /dev/null
[08:59] <mdz> ssh-askpass-gnome is installed by default in ubuntu-desktop
[08:59] <Kamion> lamont: xterm -e ssh-add seems like a somewhat strange approach
[08:59] <lamont> by which time all the other xterm -e ssh sessions will have decided they want a passprhase...
[08:59] <Keybuk> yeah, I see the problem there
[08:59] <Kamion> I'd just do plain ssh-add
[08:59] <mdz> and will be used by default if no tty is available
[08:59] <Kamion> then it ought to work
[09:00] <lamont> Kamion: remember: gnome illiterate...
[09:00] <Kamion> s/work/wait/
[09:00] <Kamion> lamont: so am I, this is my plain X setup
[09:00] <Keybuk> you need to do the ssh-add before the session manager starts really
[09:00] <lamont> "No response to the SaveYourself command...."  Le huh?
[09:02] <debianist> somebody ought to change the channel's subject :)
[09:04] <Kamion> elmo: crap, I forgot to add hdparm-udeb to the cdrom initrds :-/
[09:05] <Kamion> elmo: uploading *another* debian-installer build ...
[09:06] <Oskuro> elmo: hug him!
[09:06] <mdz> elmo: what's the status of warty-security?  we're going to need to do some security updates soon, and we might as well put them through the -security infrastructure to test it out, if you'll be ready
[09:07] <mdz> thom: hmm, encountered a bug in the new xscreensaver
[09:07] <mdz> thom: ifs appears to be disabled :-P
[09:08] <lamont> my RAM arrived - gotta go fetch it this afternoon
[09:14] <seb128> hum, "An error occurred. Dammit. Error was: 270465 state kill-init at end." with the Debian BTS
[09:15] <Kamion> will fix
[09:15] <Kamion> whoa, or not. where'd the .log go?
[09:16] <Kamion> -rw-rw-r--    1 debbugs  debbugs         0 Sep  7 07:34 270465.log
[09:16] <seb128> weird
[09:16] <Kamion> we did get a scary mail earlier today
[09:18] <seb128> what sort of mail ?
[09:18] <Kamion> seb128: cron error from processall
[09:19] <Kamion> that bug doesn't appear to be in any indexes; I'm inclined to just delete it and reprocess
[09:20] <Kamion> seb128: ok, that's now bug #270528; #270465 "never existed".
[09:21] <seb128> ok
[09:21] <seb128> in fact I was just looking the "Opened/upgraded release-critical bugs" list
[09:22] <seb128> rc -= 1 :p
[09:30] <mdz> daniels: your mail is looking
[09:30] <mdz> s/looking/looping/
[09:32] <elmo> mdz: tonight
[09:32] <mdz> pitti: still here?
[09:33] <elmo> (having a life is for losers after all :P)
[09:36] <lamont> mdz: someone working on 1080?
[09:37] <elmo> mdz: oh yeah, why was I cc'ed on that?
[09:37] <mdz> lamont: you? :-)
[09:37] <mdz> elmo: ah, forgot to mention in the bug.  we had talked about whether it would be a good idea to add a global Bugs: override
[09:37] <mdz> that's part of the same issue
[09:38] <mdz> that would be one way to address the reportbug part of it
[09:38] <elmo> oh, ok
[09:38] <elmo> I think we should do that regardless
[09:38] <elmo> 'cos it's trivial and obviously correct
[09:39] <lamont> do we have an email injection method for our bugzilla?
[09:39] <elmo> hmm, assuming apt-ftparchive will overwrite existing fields, will have to check that
[09:39] <lamont> 1066 is a valid bug.  bummer.
[09:40] <lamont> not just because it means there'll be another linux-source upload...
[09:40] <lamont> mdz: who are we assigning kernel bugs to these days?
[09:41] <mdz> lamont: me, for now
[09:41] <mdz> lamont: no, but we need one
[09:42] <mdz> justdave: ?
[09:42] <lamont> mdz: I'd like to be able to burn dvd's on warty...
[09:42] <mdz> that is
[09:42] <mdz> kernel: me, for now
[09:42] <mdz> email injection method for bugzilla: no, but we need one, ->justdave
[09:43] <justdave> ah that, yes, that'd be me
[09:43] <mdz> (#1080)
[09:43] <mdz> we need a way to gateway reportbug into our bugzilla
[09:43] <lamont> mdz: OK.  First issue is that ide-scsi isn't getting loaded, hence lots of bitchiness as noted.
[09:43] <mdz> email seems like the most expedient way, since reportbug already sends a nicely-formatted email
[09:43] <mdz> lamont: ide-scsi should not be necessary anymore
[09:44] <lamont> then, once ide-scsi is modprobed into existance (and the bitchiness is gone from kern.log), it says: :-( unable to PREVENT MEDIA REMOVAL: Operation not permitted
[09:44] <lamont> or is that perms again..
[09:44] <mdz> I haven't tried to write a DVD yet under 2.6.8, but writing CDs with cdrecord works fine so far
[09:44] <mdz> I'll try one right now
[09:44] <Kamion> speaking of, fixing #923 is easy, but I'm going to leave it until sounder 8's done now
[09:46] <tvon|x31> 'sounder 8' is like an RC/beta sorta thing?
[09:46] <Kamion> yeah
[09:47] <tvon|x31> Gotcha
[09:47] <Kamion> the Sounder CD releases are testing milestones for Warty
[09:47] <tvon|x31> k
[09:47] <tvon|x31> The nightlies are snapshots of them I take it?
[09:47] <Kamion> for Hoary, they'll be Array CD releases, I'm told
[09:47] <mdz> lamont: seems to be working fine so far
[09:47] <mdz> lamont: mine is USB, so no ide-scsi madness anyway
[09:47] <lamont> will update the bug with my findings for ide...
[09:48] <Kamion> the dailies are entirely automatic snapshots, yes; they might be arbitrarily broken
[09:48] <Kamion> the Sounder CD releases usually have some kind of development milestones associated with them, they come with release notes, and they have at least been used by me to do a complete install :-)
[09:49] <mdz> lamont: try it without ide-scsi and see what happens
[09:49] <mdz> eek
[09:49] <mdz> I spoke too soon
[09:49] <mdz> it got to 4.5% and went nuts
[09:50] <mdz> er
[09:50] <mdz> well, it's spewing SCSI errors at the rate of several hundred per second
[09:50] <mdz> but the burn seems to be chugging merrily along
[09:50] <mdz> fascinating
[09:51] <lamont> bug updated, assigned to you
[09:53] <mdz> Kamion: I was just thinking
[09:53] <mdz> Kamion: apt-cdrom essentially does "find /cdrom/"
[09:53] <mdz> Kamion: maybe that could substitute for your explicit find
[09:53] <doko> mithrandir: gcc-3.4 build finished on amd64, i386, powerpc without new regressions. waiting for your ok now.
[09:56] <Mithrandir> I'm going to build m-t with it to test, ok?
[09:57] <doko> fine. amd64 binaries currently on yellow:~doko/gcc/
[09:58] <Mithrandir> is gcc-3.4_3.4.1ds1-7ubuntu5 the right version?
[10:00] <doko> no, 3.4.2-1ubuntu1
[10:01] <Kamion> mdz: probably not in cdrom-detect, since apt-cdrom isn't even close to installed yet ...
[10:03] <fabbione> hey guys
[10:03] <fabbione> was the meeting here in #ubuntu?
[10:04] <Mithrandir> yes
[10:04] <fabbione> ok
[10:04] <fabbione> thanks
[10:08] <Kamion> lamont: let me know if debian-installer fails (blocking on that at the moment)
[10:09] <Mithrandir> doko: uhm
[10:09] <Mithrandir> : tfheen@golem /tmp > g++-3.4 -o hello hello.c
[10:09] <Mithrandir> In file included from hello.c:1:
[10:09] <Mithrandir> /usr/include/stdio.h:34:21: stddef.h: No such file or directory
[10:09] <Mithrandir> (and then a lot of errors)
[10:10] <Mithrandir> m-t fails to build as well, which was what got me started
[10:10] <doko> amd64?
[10:11] <Mithrandir> yes
[10:11] <Mithrandir> from m-t:
[10:11] <Mithrandir> configure:2230: g++-3.4 -o conftest    conftest.C  1>&5
[10:11] <Mithrandir> ld: cannot open crtbegin.o: No such file or directory
[10:11] <Mithrandir> configure: failed program was:
[10:11] <Mithrandir> #line 2225 "configure"
[10:11] <Mithrandir> #include "confdefs.h"
[10:11] <Mithrandir> int main(){return(0);}
[10:12] <Mithrandir> sure you don't have to tighten some deps?
[10:12] <lamont> mdz: re 1072: yeah, ok.
[10:12] <lamont> I meant to say NOTWARTY, honest.
[10:13] <Mithrandir> doko: mea culpa, version skew
[10:13] <Mithrandir> doko: if you don't upgrade g++, but only libgcc and gcc, g++ blows up
[10:15] <doko> yes, g++-3.4_3.4.1 has a dependency on gcc-3.4 (<< 3.4.2), so that should not happen,
[10:15] <Mithrandir> well, it did.
[10:16] <thom> mdz: hey, i just do what i'm told
[10:17] <thom> :-)
[10:17] <Kamion> mdz: but yes, apt-cdrom would substitute for it in the case where you aren't using archive-copier; I didn't make any post-reboot changes along those lines
[10:20] <doko> hmm, g++-3.4_3.4.1-7ubuntuX has a Depends: gcc-3.4-base, libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-4), gcc-3.4 (>= 3.4.1-10), gcc-3.4 (<< 3.4.2), libstdc++6-dev (>= 3.4.1-10)
[10:20] <fabbione> mdz: yes.. that's correct. i am going to add the nvidia bits only.
[10:21] <fabbione> daniels: i will pass the package to you after for ati
[10:21] <fabbione> no.. no ati :-)
[10:25] <fabbione> ok.. cya tomorrow guys
[10:25] <fabbione> good night everybody
[10:25] <lamont> night fabbione
[10:26] <thom> night
[10:28] <lamont> mdz: the question on dvd burning is, should failure to lock the door (EPERM, to be specific) be fatal to the burn process, or is that just caveat emptor?
[10:30] <mdz> lamont: I would say emphatically no, it should not be fatal
[10:30] <lamont> specifically, commenting out the exit()..
[10:31] <mdz> lamont: is read/write permission on the device no longer sufficient to lock the door, or something?
[10:32] <lamont> dunno, but user with rw, not root can't do it..
[10:32] <lamont> mdz: no dice.
[10:32] <lamont> About to execute 'builtin_dd if=warty-i386-1.iso of=/dev/hdc obs=32k seek=0'
[10:32] <lamont> :-( unable to PREVENT MEDIA REMOVAL: Operation not permitted
[10:32] <lamont>  /dev/hdc: "Current Write Speed" is 2.5x1385KBps.
[10:32] <lamont> :-( unable to WRITE@LBA=0h: Operation not permitted
[10:32] <lamont> :-( write failed: Operation not permitted
[10:33] <lamont> so it looks like write access to the device is no longer sufficient to write to the device.
[10:34] <mdz> clever
[10:34] <mdz> lamont: so it works as root?
[10:34] <doko> keybuk: around?
[10:34] <lamont> yes
[10:34] <lamont> providing you don't have the environment variable 'SUDO_COMMAND' in your environment
[10:34] <mdz> lamont: so is this the same issue as #1066, or really a different one?
[10:35] <lamont> this is 1066
[10:35] <mdz> lamont: yeah, I filed a bug about that
[10:35] <mdz> I think
[10:35] <mdz> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=268308
[10:35] <lamont> 1066's reporter only had the non-root-user perspective
[10:36] <mdz> Now, the funny thing here is that neither doing this as root or user
[10:36] <mdz> worked, but cdrecord with the dvd patch applied was successfull in
[10:36] <mdz> blanking the media, but not in burning afterward. Once
[10:36] <mdz> cdrecord+dvd-patch blanked the disk, i could without problem burn the
[10:36] <mdz> media with the above growisofs invocation.
[10:36] <mdz> that's from #269397
[10:36] <lamont> want me to remove the predjudice???  huh, huh, can I? can I?
[10:36] <mdz> sounds like a different problem
[10:39] <lamont> actually, 269397 looks to be the one I see after I defeat the door-lock code.
[10:39] <lamont> but still kernel bug
[10:40] <lamont> mdz: OK to upload a fix for 268308?
[10:40] <lamont> given our trend towards sudo, and all that..
[10:40] <mdz> lamont: if it's trivial (only removing code), yeah, why not
[10:42] <lamont> Kamion: debian-installer_20040801ubuntu10 succeeded x3
[10:42] <lamont> mdz: OK.  gotta go fetch the kidds
[10:42] <Kamion> cool
[10:43] <lamont> Kamion: and checking that is the only reason I'm still here... :-)
[10:45] <Kamion> elmo: can I have that byhanded? sorry to pester, I'm blocked on it
[10:58] <mdz> alextreme: ping?
[10:58] <alextreme> mdz: pong
[10:59] <alextreme> i've been lurking since the meeting started :)
[11:00] <mdz> alextreme: will it be possible for you to build a live CD which corresponds to sounder 8?  that would be excellent
[11:01] <elmo> kamion: powerpc still isn't built ..
[11:01] <elmo> the others are done though
[11:02] <Kamion> elmo: hm, lamont must've been confused
[11:02] <elmo> meh
[11:03] <elmo> 4,9,14,19,24,29,34,39,44,49,54,59* * * *        /usr/bin/buildd-uploader
[11:03] <Kamion> d'oh
[11:04] <elmo> cron.daily's running now
[11:04] <alextreme> mdz: and sounder 8 is the end of this week?
[11:04] <mdz> alextreme: sounder 8 is tonight :-)
[11:04] <alextreme> hmm, that might get kinda tight :)
[11:05] <elmo> kamion: if you're blocked on me and I've wandered off, just hate-sms me
[11:05] <Kamion> elmo: all right, thanks
[11:05] <mdz> alextreme: hmm...what is a realistic date to have an updated live CD?  is it more than one day's work?
[11:05] <Kamion> alextreme: doesn't have to be exactly in sync
[11:05] <mdz> I thought it was almost automated now
[11:06] <Kamion> alextreme: you might want to grab the archive as of a few minutes from now, though
[11:06] <alextreme> and updated live CD doesn't cost much time to make, but with only one hour left... :)
[11:07] <mdz> alextreme: well, it doesn't need to be released at the same time, the idea was just to have the same packages on it
[11:07] <mdz> or very close to it
[11:07] <alextreme> has there been a lot of changes lately?
[11:08] <mdz> alextreme: there have been a lot of changes since wartylive-v1 :-)
[11:09] <alextreme> i'll check the wiki and update my packagelist :)
[11:10] <mdz> alextreme: you should use germinate to generate the package list, so that it is consistent with ours
[11:10] <mdz> or perhaps Kamion can send you a current copy
[11:11] <alextreme> i know, but not all packages are installable or usable from the live cd, so i've had to edit it a bit
[11:12] <alextreme> seems only the base has had any changes though, desktop packagenames seem to be unaltered
[11:12] <seb128> hey SurcouF
[11:12] <SurcouF> hi
[11:12] <SurcouF> hi seb128
[11:12] <SurcouF> hi everyone
[11:12] <seb128> guys, SurcouF has cancelled the user creation during the installation
[11:13] <Kamion> current copies of germinate output are here: https://chinstrap.warthogs.hbd.com/~cjwatson/germinate-warty-output/
[11:13] <seb128> and he has no root password
[11:13] <Kamion> init=/bin/sh
[11:13] <seb128> and no user account
[11:13] <seb128> how he solves that ? :)
[11:13] <alextreme> k, thanks Kamion
[11:13] <SurcouF> seb128, no problem to solve
[11:13] <Kamion> or boot with single, on i386 there's probably even an entry for that on the grub boot menu
[11:13] <SurcouF> but
[11:13] <seb128> SurcouF: oh, I was thinking so :)
[11:13] <SurcouF> this is a bug
[11:13] <seb128> SurcouF: how do you log ?
[11:13] <SurcouF> from installer
[11:14] <Kamion> cancelled how?
[11:14] <SurcouF> seb128, what do you mean ?
[11:14] <SurcouF> Kamion, by select "Cancel" and hit down
[11:14] <Kamion> please file a bugzilla bug
[11:14] <SurcouF> okay
[11:14] <Kamion> component passwd (if that exists, otherwise UNKNOWN); assign to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[11:15] <Kamion> (i.e. me)
[11:16] <SurcouF> ok
[11:17] <Kamion> mdz: new daily is up
[11:18] <debianist> yey!
[11:18] <debianist> :)
[11:18] <debianist> btw , just installed from previous one
[11:18] <seb128> kagou: working daily ? :)
[11:18] <debianist> over my system.
[11:18] <seb128> oups
[11:19] <seb128> Kamion: working daily ? :)
[11:19] <kagou> seb128, :)
[11:19] <seb128> kagou: I hate the new xchat's completion
[11:19] <kagou> me too
[11:19] <SurcouF> seb128, like irssi ? ;-)
[11:19] <seb128> SurcouF: probably yes
[11:19] <Kamion> seb128: dunno yet
[11:20] <Kamion> rsyncing now to find out
[11:22] <alextreme> mdz: k, i've set up everything to build a new warty overnight. it still has a 2.6.7 kernel though, would that be an issue?
[11:32] <debianist> would the list be a proper place for install experience?
[11:32] <Kamion> sure
[11:32] <Kamion> there've been other installation reports there
[11:32] <debianist> however there is one thing i feel i'd better ask you here, im not sure if this is something i did wrong
[11:32] <debianist> regarding x resultion probes
[11:33] <debianist> (or the other guys for that matter)
[11:34] <Keybuk> doko: firefly break ... back now?  what's up?
[11:35] <doko> already submitted a report against dpkg, if you want to have a look ...
[11:35] <debianist> config chose the monitor biggest resulotion, however i barely can use the desktop on it. where is the gnome desktop resolution chooser?
[11:35] <Kamion> debianist: don't think the X guys are around right now, probably best to mention it in the installation report and say what graphics hardware you've got, then they'll be able to look at it
[11:36] <Kamion> ah, there's one somewhere, I don't remember where though ...
[11:36] <debianist> couldn't find any under "Computer" --> "Desktop prefs"
[11:37] <debianist> oh
[11:37] <debianist> it's under ssytem prefs
[11:37] <debianist> :)
[11:40] <Keybuk> doko: hmm, how can you fulfil that dependency?
[11:40] <Keybuk> oh, wait, sorry, misread it
[11:41] <SurcouF> Kamion, #1085
[11:42] <doko> keybuk: installing new g++-3.4, libstdc++6, libstdc++6-dev as well.
[11:43] <Kamion> SurcouF: I quite like the idea of cancelling the user addition and being sent back to set the root password, actually
[11:43] <Kamion> mdz_: what do you think?
[11:43] <SurcouF> Kamion, as you wish
[11:43] <SurcouF> just some ideas
[11:44] <Kamion> yup, thanks
[11:44] <Kamion> we'll talk about what the right thing to do is; the current situation is clearly a bug
[11:45] <SurcouF> ok
[11:45] <SurcouF> I'll report another bug against xserver-xfree86
[11:46] <Keybuk> doko: if I try with the following, is that enough of a test?
[11:46] <Keybuk>   cpp-3.4 g++-3.4 gcc-3.4 gcc-3.4-base libstdc++6 libstdc++6-dev
[11:46] <Keybuk> all 3.4.1-7
[11:47] <doko> libgcc1 is missing, and then all these but g++-3.4,  libstdc++6 libstdc++6-dev from 3.4.2-1 (which doesn't exist yet in the archive)
[11:49] <doko> basically, it should be enough to install cpp-3.4 gcc-3.4-base libgcc1 gcc-3.4 from 3.4.1-7 and then only upgrade cpp-3.4 gcc-3.4-base libgcc1
[11:49] <Keybuk> I already have libgcc1
[11:50] <doko> do you have an amd64 platform o check on=
[11:50] <debianist> Nuvola theme missing from ubuntu :(
[11:51] <Keybuk> I have no 3.4.2 of those ... where is it?
[11:52] <debianist> i had many unmet dependencies at the package installation setup phase from the CD, after which I was sent back to aptitude to correct these. ofcourse i couldn't take note of all the packges that failed as this was blzing fast. anyone seen this?
[11:52] <doko> amd64: yellow:~doko/gcc, or else currently uploading to people.debian.org/~doko/gcc-3.4/ ...
[11:53] <Keybuk> doko: ok, ping me when the i386 debs are up
[11:54] <doko> these are debian unstable only, rebuilding the warty debs, but going to bed now.
[11:54] <Keybuk> that's ok, am on my unstable machine atm
[11:55] <mdz_> Kamion: regarding #1085?  I'll take a look
[11:56] <doko> Keybuk: I don't ping you, the upload should be finished in about one hour (it's finished if you see the treelang deb)
[11:57] <Keybuk> ah
[11:57] <Keybuk> ok
[11:57] <Keybuk> I've got it
[11:57] <Keybuk> the bug isn't what you think it is
[11:57] <Keybuk> it's just the "dpkg doesn't reverify dependencies on upgrade" bug
[11:57] <Keybuk> when you upgrade packages, it only takes their dependencies into account, it doesn't recheck any dependencies on the old package
[11:58] <mdz_> Kamion: I like the idea of falling back to setting a root password, but it seems simpler to disallow skipping that step
[11:58] <mdz_> Kamion: whatever is simplest, really
[11:58] <justdave> is there a way to make the terminal services client have real scrollbars instead of the classic xterm style ones?


[00:00] <jjesse-android> I didn't turn to on my computer or my phone
[00:01] <brousch> I avoided the vendors, except for beer
[00:01] <brousch> One guy showed how he ran DLP on his home network to monitor his wife and kids
[00:02] <brousch> At least now I know what DLP does
[00:03] <jjesse-android> That's an interesting use case
[00:03] <jjesse-android> What dlp product did he say?
[00:04] <brousch> He didn't day, but it looked Semantic to me
[00:04] <brousch> say
[00:04] <jjesse-android> Oh Symantec :-)
[00:05] <jjesse-android> It's an awesome product but like I said weird use case
[00:10] <brousch> He admitted that
[00:10] <brousch> But then showed how it was useful
[00:11] <jjesse-android> I think I met the guy he works for Symantec and lives in Iowa
[00:58] <snap-l> Evening
[00:59] <snap-l> Wonderingif anyone is here at OLF?
[02:44] <dzho> snap-l: me too ;-)
[03:46] <greg-g> holy crap: http://pastebin.com/9RBBniM1
[11:27] <snap-l> greg-g: Are you shitting me?
[11:29] <snap-l> Not good. Lots of folks relied on CIA.vc.
[11:29] <snap-l> Though if they didn't have an offsite backup, that's just dumb.
[13:17] <jrwren> what was cia.vc ?
[13:18] <jrwren> wait? is that OLD news? http://scanlime.org/2011/05/cia-vc-service-is-down-indefinitely/
[17:55] <greg-g> uh, it wasn't down a while ago I know, I was checking it out for something within the last 1.5 months
[20:22] <derekv> hi
[20:33] <jjesse> hello
[21:23] <derekv> good place for pulic domain/free use icons?
[21:23] <derekv> jus need some "delete item" png or svg
[21:24] <derekv> nvm
[23:58] <rick_h_> ugh, migraine during vacation FML
[23:59] <snap-l> ugh
[23:59] <snap-l> sorry to hear that
[23:59] <rick_h_> all good, got some really nice meds
[23:59] <rick_h_> will sleep like a rock tonight


[09:27] <JonathanD> Morning.
[09:33] <rmg51> Morning
[12:12] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, dogs, turkeys?, hamsters and everything else
[13:48] <lazyPower> o/ everyone
[16:04]  * ChinnoDog yawns
[16:59]  * InHisName streaches


[13:49] <JHOSMAN> mhall119: Hello, I stated that I did not get the mail yesterday.
[13:57] <mhall119> JHOSMAN: ok, I'll check what happened. Monday was a holiday in the UK, that might be why
[14:02] <JHOSMAN> mhall119:  When I receive mail? Yesterday was Tuesday. Already missing 10 days for the event and we must make the process of withdrawing money to send to manufacture the shirts and make all necessary purchases. You think you can help us with this?
[14:02] <mhall119> JHOSMAN: I'm checking for you
[14:03] <JHOSMAN> mhall119: Thanks!
[16:01] <mhall119> JHOSMAN: you should have an email now
[16:16] <JHOSMAN> mhall119:  =) Thanks!
[16:20] <mhall119> no problem


[01:35] <jayjo> is there a way to ssh tunnel a connection from my local machine (pgadmin3) to a server that I have that has access to a database?
[01:36] <jayjo> Im not really understanding the ssh tunnel, is it everything on my port is forwarded to that remote port (through an ssh connection on port 22) and then I appear to be on the server?
[01:38] <sarnold> jayjo: there's -R and -L variants, which describe which system should have the open listening port: -L for the local side, -R for the remote side
[01:39] <sarnold> jayjo: you probably want the -L variant here; set a local port for ssh to listen on, and use the remote port to describe which port onthe server it should connect to
[01:39] <sarnold> gotta run, probably someone else can help further i fyou still need it
[01:39] <jayjo> ok thank you
[06:48] <lordievader> Good morning.
[08:58] <nocontrol> is anyone using foreman with upstart for rails projects ? I am exporting to services but I get a message "No such file or directory" when trying to start it
[10:35] <nocontrol> I have an issue with foreman/upstart and rails, any help is appreciated http://stackoverflow.com/questions/35221886/export-foreman-workers-from-rails-app-to-upstart
[10:55] <Daviey> hggdh: Yes, that urgent ticket from 5 years ago can be closed :)
[12:32] <nocontrol> I have an issue with foreman/upstart and rails, any help is appreciated http://stackoverflow.com/questions/35221886/export-foreman-workers-from-rails-app-to-upstart
[14:44] <rbasak> nacc: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/
[22:14] <VelusUniverseSys> hello is there anyone able to help me set up a virtual user mail server
[22:17] <sarnold> this guide looks tasteful https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PostfixVirtualMailBoxClamSmtpHowto
[22:22] <VelusUniverseSys> yeah i followed that last time and was getting errors when it came to the clam part
[22:25] <sarnold> do you need clam? maybe ignore those bits? :)
[23:23] <VelusUniverseSys> yeah i might just ignore that bit i guess i dont need it
[23:24] <sarnold> it might be worth it, since giving windows usres -some- protection from viruses might be nice. but if it's not working and not a requirement, maybe just skip it for now.
[23:50] <VelusUniverseSys> it wont work full stop im still having problems when i try to log in grrr, can someone not do the setup for me please?


[04:20] <xmetal> is anyone else (note: while i am on a nightly release + updates of 18.04 now, the issue happened on a few month install of 17.10 too and only seems to happen in Ubuntu mate) having issues with snaps, say installing or removing where you get auto-logged off?   I did find installing "squashfuse" helped reduce the number of times this behavior happens but it still happens from time to time
[07:26] <ole_Denmark> good morning helpers
[07:26] <kernal> good evening
[07:45] <ole_Denmark> morning kernal
[07:47] <ole_Denmark> Here we have blue sky and - 3 deegres
[07:48] <kernal> time for me to head home.. See Ya!
[09:58] <guest-CkYCxZ> ello
[09:58] <diogenes_> hi
[09:59] <guest-CkYCxZ> wiccoutryareyouasedi
[15:59] <usuarioX> hi all, how/where do I move the application menu for each window out of the main panel and "onto" the window title bar?
[16:00] <usuarioX> (is there a setting in dconf-editor "somewhere" that may do this?)
[16:28] <vkareh> usuarioX: in dconf-editor, go to /org/mate/desktop/interface and there are two options: 'gtk-shell-shows-app-menu' and 'gtk-shell-shows-menubar'. Play with those to see how you like them (you'll probably need to restart an application for it to take effect). Also, you will need to add the Global Application Menu applet on the panel (I think)
[16:29] <vkareh> If you get stuck, I think you can use F10 to get menus to show up again
[17:09] <usuarioX> vkareh, my recently installed (and updated) Ubuntu Mate 16.4 does not have those two entries in /org/mate/desktop/interface - how can I add them?
[17:10] <vkareh> ah - no, there's no support for that in 16.04...
[17:10] <usuarioX> vkareh, ok, any way to add it with some extras?
[17:10] <vkareh> wait, you said that the menus are in the panel, rather than on the application windows?
[17:11] <vkareh> I don't think so... this feature was added in 17.10
[17:11] <usuarioX> vkareh, yes, and I am not sure if the choice of "theme" affects this. Right now I am playing around with "Mutiny" theme and Crux
[17:12] <vkareh> hmmm... Mutiny shouldn't be available in 16.04... this is a new panel layout, and 16.04 is a two-year old release :/
[17:12] <usuarioX> vkareh, are you talking about some other ubuntu distro (17.04) with Mate, or the Distro with the name "Ubuntu Mate"? (which I think has 16.04 as its latest release...)
[17:13] <vkareh> no, the latest release of Ubuntu MATE is 17.10
[17:13] <vkareh> released in october 2017: https://ubuntu-mate.org/blog/ubuntu-mate-artful-final-release/
[17:14] <usuarioX> vkareh, my main aim is to explore the one that also Raspberry Pi minicomputers list as one of the recommended distros, which I think is 16.04, to see if I would like to standardise on that on several computers. It must be lightweight.
[17:14] <vkareh> ah, yeah for Raspberry Pi I think there's only 16.04
[17:14] <vkareh> but that wouldn't have Mutiny or anything like that
[17:15] <vkareh> usuarioX: so you might want to download Ubuntu MATE 16.04 for your desktop to explore, as that's the one they use for the rpi
[17:17] <usuarioX> vkareh, ahh, I see now, it is only the 16.04 one that is LTS, that is why I downloaded it...
[17:17] <vkareh> go to https://ubuntu-mate.org/download/ and click on either 64bit or 32bit and choose the 16.05 LTS (Xenial)
[17:17] <vkareh> 16.04 I mean
[17:18] <usuarioX> vkareh, hmm, maybe I will check out the newer one for the stronger machines, are they very different?
[17:18] <vkareh> usuarioX: but if you have the Mutiny layout it means that you already have the newer 17.10...
[17:22] <usuarioX> vkareh, oh, wrong theme name, it is inside Mate-Tweak that there is a "panel design" that is called Mutiny ...
[17:22] <vkareh> oh cool, okay I didn't know that it existed for 16.04
[17:23] <usuarioX> vkareh, so I have 16.04 with "some theme" and then applied the "Mutiny" panel design, which gives a vertical unity-like panel/toolbar on the left side
[17:24] <vkareh> if you chose a different layout (like Traditional) does it fix the application menu issue?
[17:27] <usuarioX> vkareh, yes, when I choose "Ubuntu Mate" instead of "Mutiny" for the panel layout, then the application menu pops back onto each window. Solved... Wonder if I can tweak/customize such layouts "easily"? Would really like to have just Mutiny, but need the app menu inside each window to avoid going crazy...
[17:30] <usuarioX> vkareh, btw, do you know if there is a tool for UM that lets us set "window rules" to have certain windows/apps always be on top, also across reboots (a policy tool like Compiz has)?
[17:32] <usuarioX> These are the Compiz tools I seriously miss in Ubuntu Mate: Window Rules, Ring Switcher and Wobbly Windows.
[17:32] <vkareh> usuarioX: you should be able to re-create a layout similar to Mutiny by deleting the bottom panel and adding a new one on the left side with the Dock applet
[17:32] <vkareh> usuarioX: for window rules check out devilspie (`sudo apt install devilspie`)
[17:33] <usuarioX> vkareh, oh, interesting, thanks for the tip :-)
[17:33] <vkareh> sure! there's a graphical interface for it, but I don't remember the name
[17:35] <vkareh> usuarioX: https://code.google.com/archive/p/gdevilspie/wikis/gDevilspie.wiki
[17:36] <usuarioX> vkareh, that Panel Dock tip did the trick, just what I wanted :-)
[17:36] <vkareh> or if you want the cli version, here's a tutorial: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Devilspie
[17:37] <vkareh> great!
[17:52] <usuarioX> vkareh, oh, man, that devilspie tip was a real lifesaver.  Thanks a bunch! :-)
[17:52] <vkareh> usuarioX: you're welcome! :)
[17:54] <usuarioX> hi all, can anyone give a short comment about the main difference(s) between ubuntu mate 16.04 (LTS) and 17.10 (non-LTS)?
[17:56] <usuarioX> (for example, is UM 17.10 no longer "lightweight" as 16.04 seems to be?)
[18:01] <usuarioX> vkareh, final question; do you know if UM 17.10 no longer is "lightweight" as 16.04 seems to be?
[18:03] <vkareh> usuarioX: here are the minimum hardware specs: https://ubuntu-mate.org/about/ - if you want to run it as a lightweight distro, you might want to make sure you select Marco (No Compositor) in MATE Tweak as your window manager. That will allow it to run in most hardware
[20:29] <owen> My sound is not working. Can you help me?
[20:29] <diogenes_> owen, headphones/speakers? is it a fresh installation? give some more info
[20:30] <owen> speakers and headphones are not working. as well as hdmi sound
[21:29] <Boyette> who can help me install wine
[21:29] <diogenes_> Boyette, sudo apt install wine
[21:30] <Boyette> https://pastebin.com/MymyFeXW
[21:33] <diogenes_> Boyette, do you see any difference between my command and the one you are showing?
[21:34] <Boyette> yes
[21:34] <Boyette> but
[21:34] <Boyette> thats becuase
[21:34] <Boyette> https://pastebin.com/TcpEvekR
[21:35] <diogenes_> sudo apt install wine-stable
[21:37] <Boyette> thx that worked out
[23:10] <Josema> Buenas