[01:33] <magnon> grgrmmgrmbl.
[01:33] <magnon> some customers... arh
[01:33] <magnon> *stab*
[01:34] <ogra> at 1:33 ?
[01:34] <magnon> that's when I read mail :P
[01:34] <ogra> ah :)
[01:34] <magnon> "we're having problems with some email stuff, which you already told us that we cannot get a proper solution to before we change ISPs to your cooperative one. But please fix it fast anyway."
[01:35] <magnon> not exactly quited :P
[01:35] <magnon> quoted
[01:35] <magnon> also they're having lots of trouble with the network
[01:35] <magnon> if they propose that they want to go back to Windows, I'm all ears :P
[01:36] <magnon> done so much free work for them, and now they breach the contract by doing stuff without notifying us, and complain because it doesn't work
[01:37] <magnon> same customer who wondered why the unshielded cat-5 hanging from a powerline didnt work
[01:38] <magnon> *sigh* guess I have to go out there tomorrow though :P
[01:39] <ogra> hmm
[01:40] <magnon> this was the first place we started working at so we were unexperienced, we didn't put enough demands towards their infrastructure etc.
[01:40] <magnon> deeply regret that now
[01:42] <magnon> as long as they pay up for server + network infrastructure, and make sure everything else is compatible, the rest can be crap :P
[01:42] <magnon> mostly.
[05:25] <jsgotangco> hmm JaneW  are you doing an all-nighter?
[06:23] <highvoltage> ogra: i did a ltsp-build-client from the latest edubuntu cd, but it said some packages failed to download, run apt-get update, should it still work as expected?
[08:03] <JaneW> hi jsgotangco
[08:03] <JaneW> no I wasn't at my screen all night
[08:03] <JaneW> just stayed on-line
[08:20] <magnon> hehe
[08:20] <magnon> 2 hours of sleep :D
[08:53] <JaneW> magnon: you?
[08:54] <JaneW> I intended to work again last night, but passed out while watching 'CSI-NY' after going to gym ;)
[08:55] <jsgotangco> hmm
[08:55] <jsgotangco> nice going
[09:02] <magnon> JaneW: yeah
[09:09] <JaneW> heh
[09:09] <JaneW> this winter has not been kind to me...
[09:16] <magnon> oh, you guys have winter
[09:16] <magnon> hehe
[09:16] <magnon> not that there's any difference anyway
[09:16] <magnon> either rain or snow
[11:51] <JaneW> ogra: ping
[11:52] <ogra> JaneW, pong
[11:52] <JaneW> ogra: you never mailed me a tech update on edubuntu yesterday
[11:52] <ogra> ergh.. oh, sorry...
[11:52] <JaneW> ogra: I put in what I could, which I hope was accurate
[11:52] <JaneW> ogra: can you give me a few lines for the BreezyGoals pages please?
[11:52] <ogra> the main work was caring for all apps to get to main
[11:52] <JaneW> ogra: do you know if/when we gcan go 'green'?
[11:53] <JaneW> ogra: yes I mentioned the status of the main inclusion reports
[11:53] <ogra> i hpe the next CD build will be good enough to go with it... lets see, i'm actively working with Kamion on it currently
[11:54] <JaneW> ogra: great, is kamion helping with the problems you had?
[11:54] <ogra> if i have the first successfull install here, we can go to green
[11:54] <JaneW> yay - how optimistic are you feeling?
[11:54] <JaneW> ogra: are you available for the meeing later?
[11:55] <ogra> in fact they were caused by his bootloader config, and by some missing entrys ... i just couldnt change it with him because he wasnt here and i didnt recognize it before...
[11:55] <ogra> sure i am
[11:55] <JaneW> ogra: that sounds promising
[11:55] <ogra> yup
[11:55] <JaneW> is the artwork ok now?
[11:55] <ogra> i'm very courious... Kamion triggers a new build directly after the changes
[11:56] <ogra> do you run breezy ?
[11:56] <JaneW> ogra: no not yet... I am dying to see it
[11:56] <JaneW> where can I see screen shots?
[11:56] <JaneW> I keep hearing it looks nice..
[11:56] <ogra> ah, ok, else i would have said just instal edubuntu-artwork
[11:58] <ogra> the package is up, i'll add the other artwork in the next upload again... currently its only my stuff and a huge license... elmo wanted a special flavour of the cc
[11:58] <JaneW> right
[11:58] <JaneW> but is the artwork ok legally now?
[11:58] <JaneW> will elmo accept it? do you think?
[11:59] <ogra> i'll ask him for every piece i add :-P
[12:12] <JaneW> oh, which one?
[12:12] <JaneW> (license)
[12:12] <JaneW> and must I put that up on the site too?
[12:12] <JaneW> there's licensing all over our wiki now...
[12:13] <JaneW> must I get official permission from highvoltage too? :p
[12:32] <JaneW> **REMINDER** Edubuntu Dev Update Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 90 mins
[12:49] <jsgotangco> no way
[12:49] <jsgotangco> i should be drinking tonight
[12:51] <JaneW> any doc updates?
[12:51] <JaneW> will we still get any docs?
[12:51] <jsgotangco> not the cookbook for sure
[12:51] <jsgotangco> do we have a usable system?
[12:51] <JaneW> BOooHOOoo
[12:51] <JaneW> we are waiting
[12:51] <JaneW> kamion is building it right now
[12:51] <jsgotangco> we can't have docs with something we don't have atm
[12:51] <JaneW> I out the how to pdf on the wiki in the mean time
[12:52] <jsgotangco> or else i'll be better off writing a fiction novel
[12:52] <JaneW> lol
[12:52] <jsgotangco> i hope you understand my reasons for that
[12:53] <jsgotangco> it doesn't help as well that me an jbailey are a bit busy for preview release
[12:53] <JaneW> yes I do, because you are difficult
[12:53] <jsgotangco> i'm difficult?
[12:53] <jsgotangco> ????
[12:55] <jsgotangco> i hope that is a typo because i do not understand what you mean by that
[12:57] <JaneW> *run*
[12:57] <JaneW> *hide*
[12:57] <JaneW> *rotfl*
[12:58] <jsgotangco> i'm difficult?
[01:01] <jsgotangco> im going out
[01:01] <jsgotangco> "i'm not difficult"
[02:00] <JaneW> **REMINDER** Edubuntu Dev Update Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting iNOW
[02:00] <JaneW> **REMINDER** Edubuntu Dev Update Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting NOW
[03:10] <JaneW> jsgotangco: are we still talking?
[03:10] <JaneW> I am sorry if I upset you - my comment was in jest. I don't always think before I speak
[03:10] <JaneW> and it seemed funny at the time
[03:12] <jsgotangco> sure i was just working all day on the docs
[03:12] <jsgotangco> i was just tired
[03:12] <jsgotangco> we were under pressure to deliver by preview
[03:15] <JaneW> sorry
[03:15] <jsgotangco> i didn't really understand the joke
[03:15] <JaneW> I really do appreciate all you have done so far
[03:15] <jsgotangco> nahh its ok
[03:15] <JaneW> I was teasing
[03:16] <JaneW> I don;t think you are difficult, in fact you have been very accomodating so far, so the joke was that it's so far from the truth it's funny... but whatever
[03:16] <JaneW> let's forget it?
[03:17] <ogra> jsgotangco, why were you under pressure ? doc freeze is still more then a week to go, isnt it ?
[03:17] <jsgotangco> ogra: we don't have that great docs atm
[03:17] <jsgotangco> we were thinking of asking mdz to drop the freeze
[03:18] <ogra> i think thats a good plan, but i doubt mdz will agree
[03:18] <ogra> i'd drop both, artwork and doc freeze
[03:18] <jsgotangco> jbailey started uploading today
[03:19] <jsgotangco> the whole day we were fixing the faqguide so its the most decent doc we'll have for 5.10
[03:19] <jsgotangco> but some of the stuff i'm not really in favor
[03:19] <ogra> jsgotangco, if the CD is in shape i'll have time left to help out on the cookbook...
[03:20] <jsgotangco> don't worry about it, its just a hectic time for me atm
[03:20] <ogra> and since i know the technical side best it would probably speed up things...
[03:20] <jsgotangco> even if im not working, i've been invited to talk to schools and im preparing for linuxworld in 2 weeks
[03:21] <jsgotangco> the structure is there, but what really lacks now is the technical side
[03:22] <jsgotangco> docs can be easily pushed as an update anyway
[03:22] <jsgotangco> that is my opinion
[03:31] <ogra> yup
[03:31] <jsgotangco> it doesn't help as well that we're only 4 people active in writing
[03:32] <jsgotangco> well make that 3
[03:34] <ogra> i hae no problem with writing docs as long as i have the time :)
[03:37] <jsgotangco> same here
[03:37] <jsgotangco> the fault we made was that half of the time people were talking about ingfrastructure
[03:38] <ogra> yup
[03:38] <ogra> same with edubuntu, to many discussions...packed with xorg and c++ transition...
[03:40] <jsgotangco> well generally xorg really had a huge impact on our workflow
[03:41] <ogra> yup
[03:42] <ogra> c++ too...
[03:42] <ogra> its still not done for universe
[03:44] <jsgotangco> gyahh
[03:44] <jsgotangco> hmm so i guess some stuff in universe won't come out by release?
[03:45] <ogra> yup, looks like... i'm pushing as much as i can... but we are simply not enough MOTUs
[03:47] <jsgotangco> i was hoping for the intro developer doc being done in time, but i still don't see it
[03:47] <jsgotangco> hopefully i grow further after breezy
[03:49] <ogra> Unfrgiven was making a lot of noise after UDU about that docs... but since he's MOTU i havent even seen him online (2 months or so)
[03:52] <jsgotangco> well yes we talked about it as well
[03:52] <jsgotangco> but he is probably busy at school
[04:06] <ogra> YAY
[04:06] <ogra> the CD looks gooood !!!!
[04:07] <ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/20050902.3/report.html
[04:07] <ogra> only ppc stuff left
[04:12] <jsgotangco> hmmm getting better
[04:13] <ogra> if i'd drop emacs now, ppc would be good too, and we'd have a preview release
[04:13] <ogra> *g*
[04:14] <jsgotangco> *sigh* i guess thats a necessary evil
[04:15] <ogra> dont worry, i'D drop vim too... and we had to deal with nano :)
[04:15] <ogra> no, seriously, i can still drop the langs other then en
[04:17] <jsgotangco> are you still aiming for 1CD?
[04:17] <ogra> i'm aiming for one CD without langpacks ad a DVD with langpacks, yes
[04:17] <ogra> but for testing i want to leave some additional langs on the cD
[04:47] <jsgotangco> oh it just stopped raining
[04:47] <jsgotangco> maybe the pub across is still open...
[05:16] <jsgotangco> later all, have a nice weekend
[05:16] <jsgotangco> JaneW: we're fine now :)
[05:17] <JaneW> good :)
[05:18] <JaneW> I have such a nack of rubbing ppl up the wrong way...
[05:18] <jsgotangco> huh?
[05:20] <jsgotangco> errr
[05:24] <jsgotangco> JaneW: what is this pdf that you said you posted?
[05:24] <jsgotangco> nvm i'll just look for it myself
[05:26] <jsgotangco> tuxlab cookbook
[05:27] <jsgotangco> *sigh*
[05:29] <JaneW> yes
[05:29] <JaneW> sorry
[05:29] <jsgotangco> for?
[05:30] <jsgotangco> it can't be helped
[05:30] <jsgotangco> i'll make you a compromise
[05:30] <JaneW> ok...?
[05:31] <jsgotangco> i'll rip the existing cookbook now and just change all the entries from tuxlab to edubuntu
[05:31] <jsgotangco> and just edit up the remaining text
[05:31] <jsgotangco> and you'll have your cookbook by hmmm thursday
[05:31] <JaneW> that will be a good start :)
[05:32] <JaneW> and I am sure we can get to fixing other intricacies after..
[05:32] <jsgotangco> by pushing it as an update
[05:32] <JaneW> :)
[05:33] <jsgotangco> im not that much of a scripting guru but i'll sort out the image not being included in the pdf/html by next week
[05:34] <JaneW> I'd better go my son just said 'I noticed that 1 minute is shorter than 5 minutes'
[05:34] <JaneW> clearly I am misleading him...
[05:34] <jsgotangco> ok i should try to sleep
[05:34] <jsgotangco> i've been in front of a laptop all day
[06:43] <highvoltage> JaneW_away: you got a response :)
[07:26] <ali4728> Can anyone help with multiple web site hosting on a single IP ( Name Based Virt Host) ?
[09:36] <ogra> gnah
[09:38] <highvoltage> hang
[09:40] <ogra> damned... only one small error on the current CD
[09:41] <ogra> ltsp-build-client doesnt get run at the end of the install process.... otherwise the CD is fine now
[09:45] <highvoltage> wow.
[09:46] <ogra> and the artwork is still in universe, but that should change next week
[09:46] <ogra> so we are ready to go with a preview release hand in hand with ubuntu...
[09:47] <highvoltage> that's so cool. what's the status on teachertool? i've been a bit out of touch.
[09:47] <ogra> me too :)
[09:47] <ogra> i'll get back to it as soon as the CD stands
[09:48] <highvoltage> nice
[09:48] <ogra> i did a lot of work on the login manager, it will be no problem to have a xdmcp like feature, but only to edubuntu (ssh driven) servers
[09:49] <ogra> which can be in principle every ssh server that has a windowmanager (no X needed) installed
[09:54] <highvoltage> i hope i get to test the edubuntu ltsp properly this weekend. last i got to play with it was more than three weeks ago. have had lots of deadlines recently.
[09:54] <ogra> it would be really nice if you could...
[09:55] <ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/20050902.4/
[09:55] <ogra> thats the best one we have now...
[09:55] <highvoltage> i think i just need to focus myself more.
[09:55] <ogra> and its really good already...
[09:56] <highvoltage> i get distracted easily, there's just so more i wish i knew, i'd like to learn python really well.
[09:56] <ogra> lets wok together on some stuff for breezy+1
[09:56] <ogra> work even
[09:57] <highvoltage> yes, that would be great.
[09:57] <highvoltage> how do i uuencode those icons in the gartoon theme?
[09:58] <highvoltage> nevermind, i'll ask you tomorrow, it's been a long day :)
[09:58] <highvoltage> how are you feeling? things are coming together good, hey?
[09:58] <ogra> yup, and i'm a bit distracted, just finishing my test install
[09:58] <ogra> yep
[09:59] <ogra> i'm feeling great, except we shuld have had this status a month ago :)
[09:59] <highvoltage> is it just edubuntu that's a bit behind, or ubuntu too?
[09:59] <ogra> but i'm confident we'll match the release deadline with a really cool distro
[09:59] <ogra> ubuntu just dropped all stuff that couldnt make it very early...
[09:59] <highvoltage> that's cool. i have lots of confidence in you and the ubuntu team.
[10:00] <ogra> but universe is in a very bad state... the transitions are all not finished yet
[10:00] <ogra> edubuntu will suffer from that as well
[10:00] <ogra> sadly
[10:01] <highvoltage> transitions? is that when the sid packages need to be ubuntu-ised?
[10:01] <ogra> nope, thats if something very basic changes an everything depending on it has to be fixed
[10:02] <ogra> i.e. gcc4 and xorg
[10:02] <ogra> that were the most noticeable
[10:02] <ogra> ones
[10:03] <ogra> hey JaneW
[10:05] <highvoltage> geez.


[23:52] <figure8car> sudo apt-get install Haskell...
[23:53] <SecretFire> ubuntu isn't recognizing my iphone
[23:53] <rribeiro> figure8car: There's no Haskell package
[23:53] <Kilroyy> so I guess I picked a good week to install ubuntu, lol
[23:53] <Kilroyy> it only barely recognizes my Galaxy s3
[23:53] <figure8car> Was there in previous release? I know only QT, not Haskell
[23:54] <rribeiro> figure8car: in previous versions of ubuntu, have a haskell-platform package... but in 13.04 no :(
[23:54] <OerHeks> gustav, i read about Optimus/bumblebee, see  >> http://www.webupd8.org/2013/04/7-things-to-do-after-installing-ubuntu.html
[23:54] <OerHeks> after part 4
[23:54] <bean> !info haskell-platform
[23:54] <bean> !info haskell-platform lucid
[23:54] <frankbro> THATS IT! HASKELL IS DEAD
[23:55] <KurtKraut> rribeiro, did you check if the package named changed? http://packages.ubuntu.com is an easy way of checking that.
[23:55] <Kilroyy> and for this linux noob...haskell would be??
[23:55] <OerHeks> !find haskel
[23:55] <rribeiro> KurtKraut: I'check
[23:56] <OerHeks> Kilroyy, it is a program language > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/UncommonProgrammingLanguages/Haskell
[23:56] <Kilroyy> ah ok
[23:57] <Kilroyy> like I said , I'm a total linux noob. just installed last week
[23:57] <OerHeks> Kilroyy, hang in here, you will have plenty to read
[23:57] <wilee-nilee> Kilroyy, This is not a 12 step meeting, lol.
[23:57] <Name141> Is there any news of what's new in 13.04 ?
[23:58] <Kilroyy> I've figured out a lot on my own already, by either googling questions or searching forums
[23:58] <figure8car> omgubuntu
[23:58] <bean> figure8car, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/i386/haskell-platform  seems they're waiting until haskell-platform for GHC 7.6
[23:58] <reduz> question: Installed Ubuntu 12.10 on machine with Win8 OEM preinstalled, in efi mode, secure boot enabled. After install, Windows 8 does not boot. If I repair Windows 8 then grub goes away. Running boot-repair completely destroys Windows 8 and it needs to be system-restored from restore partition. Any hints? Is there any way to magically disable efi/secure boot in Windows 8 so it's all back to how it used to be before without reinstalling it?
[23:59] <gustav> Like always with nVidia, there are instructions, and they look like they would work, but they don't.
[23:59] <Kilroyy> my windows startup files got corrupt and I don't have  a backup cd so I installed ubuntu rather than having a laptop that was totally useless, lol
[23:59] <OerHeks> gustav yes there are issues.
[23:59] <wilee-nilee> reduz, Not many are up on uefi here I have yet to see any good detailed help here, however the ubuntu forums does have user focused on it.


[19:59] <ailo> Scheduling meetings: Only through launchpad? I added one as proposed to uds-r
[19:59] <ailo> knome: ^
[22:48] <knome> ailo, that should be scheduled automatically when approved.
[22:49] <knome> ailo, if it seems to be stuck in approving, ask #ubuntu-community-team
[22:49] <knome> ailo, (considering you filed it under the community track)
[23:04] <ailo> knome: I just copied yours :P


[00:00] <Eickmeyer> cjwatson: fair. Thanks for the pointer. :)
[00:00] <cjwatson> np
[00:07] <Eickmeyer> Looks like either xnox or Laney might know per the changelogs. ^
[00:07] <Eickmeyer> (If either ara available)
[00:07] <Eickmeyer> *are
[00:12] <Eickmeyer> Perhaps sil2100?
[00:14] <sil2100> hm, I sadly don't remember off the top of my head and it's a bit late here, so I won't be able to check
[00:14] <sil2100> I'll try refreshing my memory tomorrow
[00:19] <Eickmeyer> sil2100: I'd appreciate it. Having a bit of a downstream OEM manufacturer support issue at the moment.
[00:19] <sil2100> Ouch, let me write that down then not to forget in the morning
[00:20] <Eickmeyer> sil2100: Awesome. Just highlight me and I'll get to it. You're several hours ahead of me.
[00:20] <Eickmeyer> sil2100: long story short, /boot is defaulting to 512MB which is way too small anymore.
[00:24] <sarnold> Eickmeyer: I wonder if it's in partman-auto rather than ubiquity? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/partman-auto/+bug/1716999
[00:24] <Eickmeyer> sil2100: Possible.
[00:25] <Eickmeyer> er... sarnold: Possible.
[00:25] <Eickmeyer> sarnold: Except this is in Focal and that issue was fixed in Xenial, so it shouldn't be an issue.
[07:55] <cpaelzer_> bdmurray: I don't mind if it takes another few days to phase it in - thanks for the FYI
[07:55] <cpaelzer_> bdmurray: I ahve other SRUs in the pipe, just drop me a mail or a ping here once it is fully out of the door
[08:41] <joelkraehemann> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gsequencer/3.7.33-1
[08:41] <joelkraehemann> ^^ why does it fail?
[10:23] <Laibsch> somebody around with access to wiki.ubuntuusers.de?  I found a small mistake but don't feel like signing up.
[10:32] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  our normal sizing is supposed to support 3 kernels at a time. is 512MB too small for three kernels nowadays?
[10:32] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  is autoremove working correctly?
[10:44] <Laney> I wish it had fixed up my system when we changed that, I got 237M and it's a constant source of pain :p
[12:03] <sil2100> Eickmeyer: did you figure it out? From what I see the minimum/maximum sizes are in partman-auto recipes/*, so just look for the /boot ones in those
[12:57] <rbalint> Eickmeyer, https://git.launchpad.net/ubiquity/tree/d-i/source/partman-auto/recipes/atomic ?
[12:58] <rbalint> sil2100, xnox  imo it is time to bump the default to 1G, kernels & initrds won't shrink until zstd becomes the default compression
[12:59] <rbalint> and they will keep growing again
[13:31] <RikMills> juliank: so to be clear, if I want my machine to ignor phasing status, and just install all available updates, it is 'always-include-phased-updates' that needs to be added as an apt preference?
[13:31] <RikMills> *ignore
[13:31] <juliank> RikMills: yeah
[13:32] <RikMills> thanks
[14:13] <Laibsch> Why is ubuntukylin-default-settings allowed to install its own sources.list.d snippet?  I find that quite worrisome.
[14:14] <Laibsch> I would never expect that a package from the official Ubuntu sources fiddles with my sources.list configuration.
[14:17] <RikMills> Laney: I thought this was not allowed ^^ ?
[14:32] <Laney> RikMills: I think generally not, not sure if there's been an exception to this for that case though
[14:32] <Laney> I seem to kind of vaguely remember exceptions coming up before
[14:32] <Laney> e.g. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ExtensionRepositoryPolicy but it's not quite that I don't think
[14:32] <Laney> vorlon may remember
[14:33] <RikMills> ok. thanks. I recall something about it being raised also, but perhaps about ppas
[14:51] <xnox> Laney:  RikMills: Laibsch: ubuntukylin is special like that, yes.
[14:51] <Laney> reference?
[14:52] <seb128> rbalint, replying here, n-m from release pocket fails the same way and it migrated back then so probably something else that broke it ... do we have any journal log from the unit failure?
[14:53] <xnox> I think it started here https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/technical-board/2014-April/001858.html
[14:54] <xnox> said repo should play nice; be signed by the key that kylin controls; and it should have only 3rd party stuff that doesn't override anything in Ubuntu itself.
[14:54] <xnox> kylin software centre installs things from there
[14:56] <rbalint> seb128, replying here, too, no n-m was still pulled from -proposed, systemd test passes with n-m from release
[14:57] <rbalint> seb128, if you would like to check the release pocket, trigger with hello
[14:58] <seb128> rbalint, thanks for pointing that out, I though that triggering with ADT_TEST_TRIGGERS=network-manager/1.26.2-1ubuntu1 would make that version installed
[14:58] <seb128> rbalint, would be nice if the systemd tests log would include the journal log from failed units
[14:59] <Laney> those tests can be done locally and then you'll have access to a shell if it fails
[14:59] <rbalint> seb128, re triggering: LP: #1767235 :-(
[15:00] <rbalint> seb128, it is also easily reproducible with plain lxc, so you don't need the whole test
[15:01] <Laney> you don't need to reach for weird hacks unless you're trying to find an excuse to get the test skipped
[15:01] <RikMills> xnox: thanks for that info on kylin!
[15:01] <seb128> Laney, systemd tests takes forever and I was trying to go for the easy way to see if that was a regression from the n-m update
[15:02] <seb128> anyway, trying locally now :-)
[15:02] <seb128> being lazy works sometimes but not always
[15:03] <Laney> heh
[15:03] <Laney> yeah I would recommend --test-name
[15:06] <rbalint> seb128, i'd recommend trying triaging this with simple lxc because the tests-in-lxd test runs autopkgtest inside the test and will _not_ keep the failing container even if you pass -s to the outer autopktest command
[15:07] <Laibsch> xnox: I'm appalled
[15:07] <Laibsch> obviously, others were equally surprised
[15:14] <Odd_Bloke> paride: I know you're likely busy with point release stuff, but if you have time to look at the cloud-utils autopkgtest regressions, I'd appreciate it: https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/hirsute/update_excuses.html#cloud-utils
[15:15] <paride> Odd_Bloke, saw it :/ that's the kind of failure that the latest upload was supposed to avoid
[15:15] <paride> and apparently it was not enough
[15:15] <Laibsch> xnox: In that discussion did I miss the part where it allows packages from official Ubuntu repos to inject sources.list outside that scope?  Again, it came as a huge surprise to me and immensely affected my trust in Ubuntu.
[15:16] <Laibsch> Any other package outside the usual scope, I had to specifically enable it.  It did not sneak up on me.
[15:25] <Odd_Bloke> paride: :(
[15:30] <rbasak> Laibsch: looks like this is what was agreed? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ubuntu%20Kylin/Ubuntu%20Kylin%20Archive
[15:31] <rbasak> Laibsch: is your concern about that policy, or that the policy doesn't appear to be being followed?
[15:31] <Laibsch> rbasak: thanks, I read that.  My concern is written up in bug 1914266
[15:31] <Laibsch> I have no problem with the existence of the archive
[15:32] <Laibsch> but I have a HUGE problem with it sneeking up on me behind my back
[15:32] <Laibsch> I installed a software from universe and baboom, I have a 3rd-party repo now being active
[15:32] <Laibsch> not funny
[15:33] <cjwatson> Mm, it feels like this should have been added by the Kylin installer instead
[15:34] <rbasak> Laibsch: can you be specific please? What's the sources.list line that got added?
[15:35] <xnox> cjwatson:  that would have been better, yes.
[15:36] <xnox> cjwatson:  however, we have oem-*-meta packages that enable canonical-oem sources.list.d snippets too, via deb.
[15:36] <Laibsch> rbasak: http://paste.debian.net/1183733/  I've disabled the repo now, but it is active after install.
[15:36] <xnox> and i thought in the past we had multimedia something as a snippet too.
[15:37] <Laibsch> that is not good, either, I'd say
[15:37] <rbasak> Laibsch: OK, so I think Ubuntu Kylin are doing what they had approval from the TB to do, right? Your concern is about the specific mechanism they used, because that results in the repository being added if you install a package from universe, without having installed that flavour?
[15:37] <Laibsch> but at least a meta package more clearly points to the fact of pulling in packages
[15:37] <cjwatson> Do oem-*-meta have other packages that depend on them?
[15:37] <Laibsch> this packages is innocently named -settings
[15:38] <Laibsch> rbasak: My understanding is that Kylin had approval to set up a repo.
[15:38] <Laibsch> I see no approval to install a package which enables a third-party repo by default.
[15:38] <Laibsch> in universe
[15:39] <Laibsch> if that package was part of the repo that was approved, I'd have no objection
[15:39] <xnox> Laibsch:  but it's not just a universe packag. it's an official flavour seeded package.
[15:39] <xnox> Laibsch:  that is part of what define "kylin"
[15:39] <rbasak> Laibsch: so you think that no package in universe should be permitted to add to sources.list.d unless named according to some rule?
[15:40] <xnox> cjwatson:  "do oem-*-meta have other packages that depend on them" => no, the only entry point is `ubuntu-drivers list-oem` & install.
[15:40] <xnox> (which ubiquity installer, does by default, for the Ubuntu Desktop flavour only)
[15:41] <cjwatson> I think there's definitely something to be said for very strictly constraining what packages may add to sources.list.d, although I'm not sure exactly what the rule should be.  In this case it seems as though there would be a perfectly good alternate approach that doesn't take people by surprise and so that should be used instead
[15:41] <Laibsch> rbasak: more or less.  I'd have no problem with the snippet being added, but disabled by default and a warning to the admin that he/she needs to enable it to get the full benefit or something.  But this "tada, surprise" is an obvious no-no.
[15:44] <rbasak> Laibsch: OK, thanks. It might be worth clarifying that in the bug - because it wasn't clear to me if you were objecting to the existing policy or not.
[15:45] <Laibsch> rbasak: comment added
[15:46] <juliank> They'd need a debconf prompt for that
[15:46] <rbasak> I wondered about debconf. Have the installer preseed an answer.
[15:46] <rbasak> Anyway
[15:47] <rbasak> I suggest giving the Kylin team a chance to respond
[15:48] <cjwatson> Or just have the installer write out the sources.list you need, as it does for Ubuntu's archive.
[15:48] <cjwatson> Doesn't need to be in a secondary package.
[16:07] <rick_h> jdstrand:  did you get somewhere with the email issue?
[17:00] <Eickmeyer> xnox: Autoremove is not working correctly for marking old kernels. We're having to come up with our own method, unfortunately.
[17:00] <Eickmeyer> sil2100: Yeah, I found the partman-auto/recipes. Might have to do a downstream fork.
[17:00] <Eickmeyer> And I agree with rbasak.
[17:00] <Eickmeyer> *rbalint.
[17:01] <Eickmeyer> (sorry about the unnecessary ping. :)
[17:23] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  can you allaborate? i'd rather fix autoremove to work correctly. as most likely it means automatic installation of security updates is also broken. Which is dangerous.
[17:24] <Eickmeyer> xnox: Autoremove is not doing the expected removal of old kernels in this case.
[17:25] <Eickmeyer> I think the symptom is Packagekit is not marking old kernels for removal the same way apt does.
[17:25] <Eickmeyer> Or update-manager.
[17:25] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  can you open the bug report please? and list what the apt state for them is, and how many there are, and which one is currently booted?
[17:26] <xnox> rbalint:  juliank: ^
[17:26] <Eickmeyer> xnox: I might be able to do that. This was discussed in an email with seb128, rbasak, rbalint, and juliank. But, I'd be more than happy to open a bug report.
[17:27] <juliank> Why are we discussing this in a second forum now?
[17:28] <Eickmeyer> juliank: It wasn't intentional. Started as a discussion about how to increase the /boot partition in partman-auto recipies and kept moving.
[17:29] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  but the two are the same thing.
[17:30] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  irrespective of the size of /boot, if kernel autoremove is not working, or we don't have enough space for 3 kernels, it will always be too small.
[17:30] <juliank> Eickmeyer: For hirsute, all we need to do _config->Set("APT::Get::AutomaticRemove::Kernels", "true"); in packagekit when initializing
[17:30] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  i will not be changing /boot size, unless it is confirmed that kernel autoremovals are working correctly.
[17:30] <juliank> Eickmeyer: unattended-upgrades also should remove those kernels automatically, so what discover and friends do shouldn't matter
[17:30] <xnox> otherwise you will want unlimited size /boot.
[17:31] <Eickmeyer> juliank: But it's not.
[17:31] <Eickmeyer> xnox: I'm not asking you to, but that's between you and rbalint since he's suggesting increasing it.
[17:31] <xnox> Eickmeyer:  do 3 kernels fit in your /boot? does your system have more than 3 installed?
[17:32] <Eickmeyer> xnox: It's mostly on my company president's machine (and a support ticket that has been filed) that the standard generic kernels are increasing beyond 3.
[17:32] <Eickmeyer> And when installing the hwe kernel it increases even more.
[17:32] <Eickmeyer> We had a system that had 15 kernels.
[17:32] <juliank> Eickmeyer: then investigate why unattended-upgrades is failing for you, Unattended-Upgrade::Remove-Unused-Kernel-Packages is set to true by default and it should work
[17:33] <juliank> did you disable unattended upgrades?
[17:33] <Eickmeyer> juliank: No, unattended upgrades is installed, but I haven't messed with anything.
[17:34] <juliank> in any case, we should be able to resolve this for 21.04
[17:35] <juliank> But I need you to testi t
[17:35] <Eickmeyer> juliank: I could probably test it for 21.04, but our machines are all on 20.04 because they target Enterprise users.
[17:35] <Eickmeyer> (this is me with my Kubuntu Focus hat on, not my Ubuntu Studio hat)
[17:35] <juliank> Eickmeyer: Yes, that's a totally different story, but we need to get the basic requirementsi n first
[17:36] <Eickmeyer> juliank: That's fair.
[17:36] <Eickmeyer> juliank: Where is the configuration for unattended-upgrades stored?
[17:40] <juliank> Eickmeyer: in files in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d containing unattended-upgrades in their name
[17:41] <Eickmeyer> juliank: Ok, thanks. I'll investigate there. In the meantime, I'm filing a bug as requested by xnox.
[17:43] <Eickmeyer> juliank: Looking at that, it appears as though, for some odd reason, the lines regarding removing old kernel packages were commented-out.
[17:50] <juliank> Eickmeyer: what did it use, discover?
[17:50] <juliank> what was that upgrader called again?
[17:50] <Eickmeyer> juliank: Yes, Kubuntu uses Discover to do updates.
[17:50] <Eickmeyer> Packagekit is the backend.
[17:51] <Eickmeyer> That way KDE can be distro-agnostic.
[17:51] <Eickmeyer> RikMills: (you might want to follow this conversation)
[17:53] <juliank> Eickmeyer: got it
[17:53] <juliank> Eickmeyer: It does not seem to call the right code paths, so my fix doesn't help :(
[17:53] <Eickmeyer> juliank: So, should we look at adding packagekit to this bug report?
[17:54] <juliank> Eickmeyer: I don't know what it does to upgrade systems, it's not like packagekit supports that
[17:55] <Eickmeyer> I'd assume on the backend it's running apt as usual, but then not following your fix somehow.
[17:55] <Eickmeyer> Basically figuing out whatever distro it is on and running its default package manager accordingly.
[17:55] <Eickmeyer> *figuring
[17:55] <Eickmeyer> juliank: *
[17:55] <Eickmeyer> ^
[17:57] <juliank> I think it figures out the individual updates rather than use the code path that calls APT::Upgrade::Upgrade
[17:57] <Eickmeyer> I'd say that's most likely. Added packagekit *and* discover to the bug report.
[17:58] <Eickmeyer> I would say, however, that unattended-upgrades *should* be finding this and fixing it every reboot, but I'm not an expert in that.
[18:04] <RikMills> this is probably why Neon users (where unattended upgrades are disabled) keep finding their /boot partition filled up with old kernels!
[18:13] <JawnSmith> Is anyone available to restart an autopkgtest for me? The package icu had a failed armhf autopkgtest because it failed to fetch a .deb file
[18:13] <JawnSmith> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#icu
[18:18] <juliank> JawnSmith: sure
[18:18] <juliank> JawnSmith: done
[18:19] <rbasak> finding this and fixing it every reboot> that'd be really annoying for people who _want_ to comment out config file lines. If a config file is changed, packages should assume that the user wants them changed, and preserve that.
[18:19] <JawnSmith> juliank: thanks!
[18:21] <juliank> rbasak: how does that relate to kernels being removed?
[18:21] <juliank> rbasak: some context mismatch?
[18:32] <vorlon> Laibsch, RikMills, Laney: the ubuntukylin setting is one that went through the TB several years ago; it has to be a separate source because of restrictions on geographic hosting of the packages in question, and the agreement was that it would be a repository signed by Canonical to not have multiple roots of trust
[18:33] <Laibsch> vorlon: the reason for the existence of the repo is understood.  that is separate from the question of injecting a sources.list.d snippet
[18:33] <Laibsch> as I mentioned here and in the bug ticket, I have read the public discourse on the creation of the repo.
[18:35] <vorlon> ok, the approval was not for "setting up a repo", it was for having a repo separate from archive.u.c / archive.c.c that would be enabled by default on UbuntuKylin
[18:35] <vorlon> the obvious mechanism for this is to have a package provide that bit of config
[18:35] <Laibsch> as part of Kylin, I have no issue with that
[18:37] <vorlon> I certainly have no technical or policy objections to the Kylin team implementing this in a different way as you describe; but I'm also not personally bothered by the current implementation
[18:37] <Laibsch> vorlon: can you point me to where it was discussed that a package in universe would be allowed to inject a sources.list.d snippet pointing to an outside repo?
[18:37] <vorlon> it's not an "outside" repo
[18:38] <Laibsch> it's certainly not part of the ubuntu mirror system or of the normal processes, you can't argue it's just part of the normal infrastructure
[18:38] <Laibsch> or part of the normal processes
[18:39] <vorlon> it has the same root of trust and is only authorized to be used for packages that have this geographic restriction
[18:39] <Laibsch> or under the control of the standard people
[18:40] <Laibsch> maybe you can still answer the question even if you do not consider it an outside repo?
[18:40] <vorlon> I cannot point you to a discussion about the specific point.  To me it was implicit
[19:01] <Laibsch> vorlon: I am very saddened that you see no issue here.  To me, it's a huge issue.  I trusted Ubuntu that I would not be subjected to non-FOSS software "by accident".  It is my understanding that the necessity for the separate repo is precisely because of the closed-source nature and unfree licensing of the software hosted there.  That is fine and dandy and I welcome its availability just like I welcome Skype, etc.
[19:01] <Laibsch> The huge difference to me as a user is that those pieces of software won't end up by accident on my computer, there is a very explicit step needed to get that software.  Universe software is not allowed to depend on software in multiverse or restricted, for example.  Granted, the software in universe from Kylin apparently does not declare a depends on the software in the kylin "outside" repo AFAIK.  But that's just to show tha
[19:01] <Laibsch>  snipped is in the entirely wrong place.
[19:34] <wxl> Laibsch: for context, do i assume correctly that you used a non-Kylin flavor to install ubuntukylin-default-settings?
[19:34] <Laibsch> wxl: of course, I'm running regular Ubuntu
[19:35] <Laibsch> I cannot even remember anymore why I installed the package
[19:35] <wxl> Laibsch: ok, so then that kind of explains your alarm, but why on earth would you do that? i mean that's the edgiest edge case i've heard of yet XD
[19:35] <Laibsch> I believe it was because I wanted to try out some replacement desktop environments for Unity (which I use until now)
[19:36] <wxl> then you should install the different desktop environment metapackages rather than whole flavor metapackages
[19:36] <Laibsch> I don't think I installed a flavor metapackage
[19:36] <wxl> hm
[19:36] <Laibsch> you will get that snippet just by installing the config package
[19:36] <Laibsch> I can dig into the dependency on my machine
[19:36] <wxl> default-settings is not the config package for the desktop environment
[19:37] <wxl> it's the config package for that flavbor
[19:37] <wxl> afaik the only way to get that package except by explicitly installing it is by installing the ubuntukylin-desktop package
[19:37] <wxl> which again is not a desktop environment metapackage, but a flavor one
[19:38] <Laibsch> Ah, I already purged the package so I cannot see why it was installed on my machine, but I can have a look around aptitude
[19:38] <Laibsch> It might certainly be that I installed ubuntukylin-desktop
[19:38] <LocutusOfBorg> jamespage, FYI I'm syncing
[19:38] <LocutusOfBorg> geronimo-jms-1.1-spec
[19:39] <Laibsch> I have budgie-desktop installed FWIW
[19:39] <LocutusOfBorg> the remaining delta was     - d/rules: Add --usj-name=geronimo-jms-1.1-spec to ensure consistent jar
[19:39] <LocutusOfBorg>       naming with previous versions.
[19:39] <LocutusOfBorg> is it still needed?
[19:39] <wxl> yeah i would never recommend that sort of behavior to anyone wanting to simply try out desktop environments
[19:41] <Laibsch> wxl: nonetheless, no matter what package I install from universe, it should not install non-free all on its own or add sources.lists allowing such.
[19:41] <LocutusOfBorg> well I'm merging but please let me know if we can discard the delta so I can followup and remove it
[19:41] <wxl> Laibsch: so we shouldn't install non-free firmware blobs either?
[19:42] <Laibsch> wxl: I believe you understood my point
[19:42] <Laibsch> if not think about why packages in universe are not allowed to depend on packages in restricted/multiverse
[19:42] <wxl> Laibsch: no i don't. i bring that up because that's an example where we give no warning to the user but install non-free firmware.
[19:43] <Laibsch> which would be in multiverse or restricted, I suppose
[19:43] <wxl> here's a great example https://packages.ubuntu.com/hirsute/firmware-b43-installer
[19:44] <wxl> technically there's no non-free blob in there
[19:44] <wxl> but what it does is it downloads the non-free blob and installs it
[19:44] <wxl> so it gets it FROM AN EXTERNAL SOURCE
[19:44] <wxl> arguably that's worse than this example because at least here we have canonical signing the source
[19:46] <Laibsch> wxl: read my second-last comment
[19:46] <wxl> i read them all
[19:47] <Laibsch> then please answer the implicit question in it
[19:48] <wxl> i provided a link with the implicit answer
[19:50] <Laibsch> wxl: so you think that the restriction in place should be dropped?
[19:50] <Laibsch> you see, this is getting silly
[19:50] <wxl> sure is
[19:50] <Laibsch> I believe the problem I have is blatantly obvious
[19:51] <Laibsch> wxl: I did not come here for silliness.  I am sorry if you did.
[19:51] <Laibsch> are you trying to waste my time?
[19:51] <wxl> hahahahha ok bye
[20:04] <Eickmeyer> Laibsch: Your inquiry seems as though it's more of a support inquiry, has become argumentative, and as such, is off-topic for this channel. This channel is for discussion between developers. If you wish to discuss this, please go to #ubuntu-disucss.
[20:04] <Eickmeyer> *#ubuntu-discuss
[20:08] <rbasak> juliank: I thought Eickmeyer was suggesting that unattended-upgrades finds and "fixes" config files automatically on reboot. If I understood that correctly then I don't think that's a good idea.
[20:09] <juliank> rbasak: No remove kernels, not fix config files
[20:10] <Eickmeyer> rbasak: We've got a downstream OEM Enterprise issue where old kernels aren't gettting removed and are filling-up the boot directory on LUKS systems. We've got a very dirty downstream implementation in place, but we'd rather use something built-in that works as expected.
[20:11] <rbasak> FWIW, I think Laibsch has a valid point.
[20:11] <rbasak> It's never come up before, but it's a fair question and there's apparently a reasonable solution
[20:12] <rbasak> IMHO, he should be welcome here to try and find consensus, get a decision from the TB if that fails, and/or drive trying to get it changed (I don't think one needs to wait for the other)
[20:13] <Eickmeyer> rbasak: That's fair.
[20:13] <wxl> i think they should consult the technical board. period.
[20:13] <rbasak> Eickmeyer: I get that, but I'm with the others in that I think if there's a problem with the way autoremove kernels work, we should fix that bug
[20:13] <Eickmeyer> rbasak: Bug has been filed. bug 1914278
[20:13] <wxl> ultimately this all concerns very explicit exceptions (there is more than one) the technical board have made for kylin.
[20:14] <rbasak> Is it unattended-upgrades+debconf that comments it out?
[20:15] <juliank> rbasak: Both a bug in unattended-upgrades not running for them; and a missing feature in packagekit
[20:15] <juliank> rbasak: there is no commenting out
[20:15] <juliank> rbasak: The default is commented out in the file as its installed, as its the default
[20:15] <juliank> rbasak: don't get too hang up on that comment thingy :D
[20:15] <rbasak> OK:)
[20:16] <rbasak> Anyway, I was only commenting on one specific comment about what I took to be changing config files on reboot. I have nothing else to add.
[20:16] <cjwatson> Also, Laibsch is a developer applicant, so I think "discussion between developers" is uncomfortably close to gatekeeping here
[20:18] <cjwatson> Actually a developer, sorry, I misremembered
[20:21] <juliank> Laibsch: I agree to some extend
[20:23] <juliank> OTOH, we do allow the same thing for the OEM repo, so I'm meh
[20:23] <juliank> I don#t know who controls the ubuntu kylin keys
[20:26] <Eickmeyer> cjwatson: Didn't know. Had my IRC OP hat on with that.
[20:40] <jamespage> LocutusOfBorg: wow - when did I last touch that package?
[20:41] <LocutusOfBorg> jamespage, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/geronimo-jms-1.1-spec/1.1-1.2ubuntu1
[20:41] <LocutusOfBorg> only 10 years ago
[20:41] <LocutusOfBorg> and again 8 years ago https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/geronimo-jms-1.1-spec/1.1-1.2ubuntu3
[20:41] <LocutusOfBorg> to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/geronimo-jms-1.1-spec/+bug/1047080
[20:41] <jamespage> no wonder its only a hazy memory from halcyon days
[20:42] <LocutusOfBorg> :)
[20:42] <LocutusOfBorg> in any case I think that naming can be just discarded now
[20:43] <jamespage> I would tend to agree - looks like I shim'ed in a symlink for compat during quantal
[20:43] <jamespage> the world has moved on since then so should be good to drop that change
[20:43] <jamespage> jms - java messaging service
[20:44] <jamespage> somethings you don't forget apparently
[20:44] <LocutusOfBorg> I hope so


[01:20] <xubuntu32i> I had to reinstall cause my stuff would disappear if i minimized. but anyway, i can't seem to get windows themes to work on here
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[15:45] <limbo408> ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ we have got more than 200% of the monthly donations today, thank you all so much!(weechat devs)ljfwczv: gonyere Israphel wook_ ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
[15:46] <limbo408> ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ we have got more than 200% of the monthly donations today, thank you all so much!(weechat devs)rupozvptr: vinzv Hund phunyguy ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
[15:46] <limbo408> ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ we have got more than 200% of the monthly donations today, thank you all so much!(weechat devs)esecorawk: thc202 linxon phunyguy ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
[15:46] <limbo408> ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ we have got more than 200% of the monthly donations today, thank you all so much!(weechat devs)zabmeczrym: mpmc fiet tsglove ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
[18:14] <brandon12> Does anyone have experience dealing with the "error: file '/grub/i386-pc/normal.mod' not found." error following install? cannot boot from external USB, forced into grub-rescue and not able to locate normal.mod on any partitions.
[21:24] <dreamon> hello. want to have mainscreen with taskbar on right screen (using mulitscreens on notebooks)
[21:25] <dreamon> if I place external screen to right, notebook has taskbar control. but if I move external screen to left, taskbar is gone on left too
[21:42] <well_laid_lawn> !msg ubottu !xrandr
[21:43] <well_laid_lawn> !xrandr
[21:49] <ochosi> dreamon: with the latest panel release you can more easily control that. just set the "output" in the panel preferences dialog to "primary" and configure your laptop display in the display dialog as "primary", then the panel will always remain on your laptop
[21:50] <ochosi> latest release is 4.12.2
[21:50] <dreamon> I found out I can choose in panel prefs screen where panel have to be. Using Xubuntu 16.04 ..
[21:51] <dreamon> using xrandr 1.5.0
[21:51] <ochosi> yes, but if you only choose a specific output this may change with changing layouts
[21:52] <ochosi> but anyway, it also works with more manual steps or rinse-and-repeat with the 4.12.1 panel
[21:52] <dreamon> ochosi, which version?
[21:54] <dreamon> I used arandr to create scripts to change different monitor profiles.
[21:55] <dreamon> but whatever primary screen I use it didnt change anythin.
[22:04] <ochosi> as i said, you need the xfce4-panel 4.12.2
[22:04] <ochosi> that has support for primary
[22:04] <ochosi> the previous versions didn't
[22:06] <dreamon> Thanks 4.12.0 is here running. mybe next ubuntu release...
[22:11] <ochosi> dreamon: yeah, should be part of the next LTS (18.04)


[01:20] <tntc> So... google music for linux.
[01:21] <tntc> I'm sticking with UbuntuOne.
[01:22] <tntc> Lets see, a website for docs, a website for music, a website for mail, a website for dozens of other things...
[01:22] <tntc> or I can just have a big folder and a few checkboxes.
[08:25] <karni> Morning everyone
[09:53] <fagan> mandel not around I wonder if its connectivity issues or if he is travelling to ar
[10:39] <duanedesign> morning
[10:39] <fagan> morning duanedesign
[11:11]  * fagan beak
[11:11] <fagan> *break
[12:12] <ralsina> good morning ubuntuone!
[12:13] <fagan> morning ralsina
[12:13] <fagan> ralsina: is mandel travelling?
[12:13]  * fagan noticed he wasnt here
[12:13] <ralsina> fagan: he was going from mallorca to somewhere else and is not working today to rest for the sprint
[12:14] <fagan> ralsina: ah ok I was worried he was just having connectivity issues or something
[12:14] <ralsina> nah, he just has a long and complicated travel schedule
[12:14] <fagan> seems so much quieter during the EU morning without him :(
[12:15] <ralsina> we are not a very EU team :-(
[12:15] <fagan> ralsina: yeah just me and mandel its a shame since it is the far superior contenent
[12:15] <fagan> :D
[12:15] <ralsina> sure. The content is the problem, not the continent ;-)
[12:16] <fagan> hahahah
[12:22] <nessita> good morning everyone!
[12:22] <fagan> morning nessita
[12:22] <nessita> hi fagan
[12:23] <ralsina> morning nessita
[12:23] <nessita> hi ralsina, how is it going?
[12:23] <ralsina> nessita: awesome!
[12:35] <ralsina> nessita: could I get a re-review on https://code.launchpad.net/~ralsina/ubuntuone-windows-installer/show_spinner/+merge/68145 ? It should be ok
[12:35] <nessita> sure!
[12:37] <ralsina> Also, I want to merge https://code.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntuone-windows-installer/installer-ui/+merge/67788 that has a +2 but with a conflict I suppose Diego hasn't gotten around to fixing.
[12:37] <ralsina> So I will push that to a branch of mine and then ask for a quick check
[12:40] <fagan> ralsina: need any testing done
[12:41] <nessita> internet connection at the uni sucks :-/
[12:41] <fagan> nessita: id bet my uni has a worse one
[12:42] <ralsina> fagan: not right now, but I will in abuot 3 hours
[12:42] <fagan> It goes at like 20kbs and has all the ports but 8080 blocked
[12:42] <ralsina> fagan: Is that too late for you?
[12:42] <nessita> ralsina: I made the paperwork I had to do, I'll come back home right after the stand up
[12:42] <ralsina> nessita: cool
[12:42] <fagan> ralsina: hmmm well then maybe I could break till then since id probably be better used doing that than looking at more bugs
[12:43] <fagan> since my day ends in like 3 hours ish
[12:43] <nessita> ralsina: I think you may need to merge trunk in in that branch... I see some things in the diff that were not there before, I think
[12:43] <nessita> @ping
[12:43] <ubot4> pong
[12:48] <nessita> @ping
[12:48] <ubot4> pong
[12:49] <nessita> ralsina: did you see my "trunk" question?
[12:49] <fagan> ralsina: na its about dinner time
[12:49] <fagan> ralsina: I dont mind
[12:50] <ralsina> nessita: on show_spinner?
[12:50] <ralsina> I'll check
[12:50] <nessita> ralsina: yes
[12:51] <ralsina> nessita: tells me I have nothing to pull
[12:51] <nessita> ralsina: what about doing bzr merge lp:ubuntuone-windows-installer?
[12:52] <nessita> into the show_spinner branch
[12:52] <ralsina> Nothing to do
[12:53] <nessita> ralsina: and is that branch pushed to the latest?
[12:53] <ralsina> And it's not that I didn't push because there is no revisons to push
[12:53] <nessita> ralsina: I'll re check in this end then :-)
[12:53] <nessita> thanks!
[12:53] <nessita> ralsina: ah! I know what happened!
[12:53] <ralsina> ?
[12:54] <nessita> ralsina: I have this scripts to branch stuff for reviews, which pulls trunk before doing anything else, and that failed due to internet crapness
[12:54] <ralsina> ohhhh. It happens
[12:55] <ralsina> fagan, nessita, dobey: standup in 5 minutes
[12:55] <ralsina> alecu, too!
[12:56]  * ralsina has not had coffee in 4 days and it's starting to show
[12:56] <fagan> ja
[13:00] <fagan> moi
[13:00] <ralsina> me
[13:00] <nessita> me
[13:00] <fagan> dobey: ?
[13:00] <alecu> herro!
[13:00] <fagan> hello alecu say me
[13:01] <alecu> fagan
[13:01] <nessita> alecu: lol
[13:01] <fagan> ha
[13:01] <nessita> dobey: stand up?
[13:01] <nessita> fagan: go
[13:01] <dobey> me
[13:01] <fagan> DONE
[13:01] <fagan> * Read the triage process more for high and critical bugs
[13:01] <fagan> TODO
[13:01] <fagan> * help duanedesign have a look at the windows client
[13:01] <fagan> * test some stuff
[13:01] <fagan> * write up some stuff for the college paperwork
[13:02] <fagan> BLOCKED
[13:02] <fagan> * Nope
[13:02] <fagan> ralsina: go
[13:02] <ralsina> DONE: sprint organization tasks, canonicaladmin queue, cleaned up taleo, hard review, polished a bit some of my pending branches so I have cool stuff to do on the sprint, TODO: make a cute bundle, merge a couple of branches, BLOCKED: no, next: nessita
[13:02] <nessita> DONE: meetings, hard reviews, landed a couple of control panel branches, started improving the UI to match build guide specs (bug #813073).
[13:02] <nessita> TODO: land mandel's u1client branches in trunk
[13:02] <nessita> BLOCKED: nopes
[13:02] <nessita> NEXT:  dobey
[13:02] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 813073 in ubuntuone-control-panel "QT UI: do something after the user deletes "this device" (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/813073
[13:02] <dobey> λ DONE: Nightlies/tarmac setup for u1client-gnome, pulled gnome bits out of u1client
[13:02] <dobey> λ TODO: hack day, some releasing
[13:02] <dobey> λ BLCK: None.
[13:02]  * ralsina high fives nessita on the "hard review" match :-)
[13:02] <dobey> no mandel?
[13:02] <alecu> no mandel today
[13:03] <ralsina> mandel is off, going to madrid to come to argentina tomorrow
[13:03]  * nessita highs five back
[13:03] <dobey> ah
[13:03] <alecu> hahahaha
[13:03] <nessita> any comments?
[13:03] <fagan> na
[13:03] <ralsina> nope
[13:03] <alecu> writing my notes!
[13:03] <ralsina> TODO: write notes
[13:03] <nessita> alecu: were you able to do the review? I was planning on grabbing all the energy I have a fix the branch :D
[13:04] <ralsina> nessita: you need to go an an colacion-de-alcayota-powered rampage through that branch
[13:04] <alecu> nessita, I'm half way thru it. I plan to finish it before our usual mumle.
[13:04] <alecu> *mumble
[13:04] <nessita> alecu: great!
[13:04] <nessita> alecu: I will be traveling home from now to before the mumble, so we're in sync (?)
[13:05] <ralsina> BTW: I have no idea how the tests on that branch ever work without a UnicodeDecodeError
[13:05] <nessita> ralsina: before the changes, you mean?
[13:05] <ralsina> nessita: oh, there were changes?
[13:05]  * ralsina looks
[13:05] <nessita> ralsina: nono
[13:05] <nessita> but now, like we said yesterday, char in unicode does not fail
[13:05] <nessita> but returns false
[13:05] <ralsina> nessita: basically, for any non-ascii character, 'á' in u'á' fails with error
[13:06]  * ralsina rechecks
[13:06] <alecu> me
[13:06] <alecu> DONE: ferry day, so not much done really. Worked a bit on bugs #803672 and #803669, started reviewing mandels megabranch
[13:06] <alecu> TODO: finish review mandel, push all above branches, take over remaining sd branches
[13:06] <alecu> BLOCKED: not today
[13:06] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 803672 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Do not start two instances of this process (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/803672
[13:06] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 803669 in ubuntuone-client (and 1 other project) "Get the port numbers from the users' registry (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/803669
[13:07] <nessita> In [4]: 'a' in u'o'
[13:07] <nessita> Out[4]: False
[13:07] <nessita> ralsina: that was our case
[13:08] <ralsina> nessita: but didn't we have actual non-ascii stuff there?
[13:09] <ralsina> and u'a' in 'a' => True
[13:09] <ralsina> but yeah, it probably worked by accident
[13:13] <alecu> ralsina, nessita: so, depending on the "layer" the test is testing, the original linux-based tests will have to be changed to use either str or unicode when passing the values to our tested functions
[13:14] <ralsina> alecu: but the functions always expect unicode or str (depending on which function)
[13:14] <alecu> ralsina, nessita: and there should be few tests that need this: only the tests testing os_helper behaviour that's common to both platforms.
[13:14] <alecu> ralsina, right: but not *every* function in syncdaemon.
[13:15] <ralsina> alecu: oh, ok, that makes sense
[13:15] <alecu> ralsina, most functions in syncdaemon should take the utf-8 encoded str that's already on the tests.
[13:16] <nessita> sorry, internet went down
[13:16] <alecu> nessita, does it make sense?
[13:16] <alecu> nessita, let me repaste it
[13:16] <alecu> ralsina, nessita: so, depending on the "layer" the test is testing, the original linux-based tests will have to be changed to use either str or unicode when passing the values to our tested functions
[13:16] <alecu> ralsina, nessita: and there should be few tests that need this: only the tests testing os_helper behaviour that's common to both platforms.
[13:16] <alecu> but not *every* function in syncdaemon.
[13:17] <alecu> most functions in syncdaemon should take the utf-8 encoded strs that are already on the tests.
[13:17] <alecu> nessita, ^^^
[13:18] <nessita> right
[13:18] <nessita> I'm not sure what you mean with:
[13:19] <nessita> "depending on the "layer" the test is testing"
[13:20] <ralsina> the only tests that should call unicode-receiving functions are windows-specific
[13:20] <ralsina> right? Since on linux it's all utf-8
[13:22] <nessita> exactly
[13:22] <nessita> ok, I gotta go back homw
[13:22] <alecu> let's say "inside most of syncdaemon" it's all utf-8
[13:23] <Chipaca> ralsina: ping
[13:23] <nessita> ralsina, alecu: I'll be back for the mumble, if the public transport behave :-)
[13:23] <ralsina> Chipaca: pong
[13:23]  * nessita -> brbs
[13:35] <ralsina> blajk ping
[13:36] <blajk> ralsina, pong
[13:36] <ralsina> hi blajk, there was an email forwarded to you by claire a couple of days ago about simplifying the installer UI a bit
[13:37] <ralsina> I would need an answer today since we are on sprint starting monday and want to have more defined goals
[13:38] <blajk> ralsina, oh yes sorry! I thought I replied already! I do it straight away.
[13:38] <ralsina> blajk: cool thanks!
[14:18] <nessita> ralsina: I'm finally home
[14:19] <nessita> gosh the city is insane today
[14:20] <nessita> alecu, ralsina: I'm in mumble, not sre if we're having the meeting?
[14:21] <alecu> nessita, I'm there.
[14:22] <ralsina> going!
[14:23] <nessita> Chipaca: if you can, we're in mumble
[14:24] <Chipaca> and if I can't?
[14:24] <nessita> Chipaca: we can either reschedule or do it without you, as you wish :-)
[14:27] <nessita> Chipaca: what do you wish? :-)
[14:28] <Chipaca> nessita: I wish it were saturady
[14:28]  * nessita too
[14:38] <dobey> Chipaca: you have a head start to that end, at least
[14:39] <duanedesign> Chipaca: didn't you do a blog post or something on installing Ubuntu One on a Ubuntu Server?
[14:40] <Chipaca> dobey: I'm thinking of moving to Uzbekistan to make that headstart bigger
[14:40] <Chipaca> dobey: only thing stopping me is that I don't like double-landlocked countries
[14:40] <dobey> eh
[14:51] <ralsina> Chipaca: 2 hours to go and then you can ignore us for a week!
[14:52] <Chipaca> what? sorry, i can't hear you through all the partying
[14:56] <nessita> Chipaca: you must now I envy you very much, VERY much
[14:56] <nessita> and not in the good way :-P
[14:56] <Chipaca> yes, i know
[14:59] <ralsina> nessita, alecu: here is Diego's branch of installer styling re-pushed with the conflicts fixed. I think I should just approve it: https://code.launchpad.net/~ralsina/ubuntuone-windows-installer/diego_installer_ui/+merge/68856
[15:08] <alecu> ralsina, there's something in that branch that's making launchpad think whole files changed
[15:08] <alecu> ralsina, either line endings or tabs, or something.
[15:08] <nessita> alecu: end of lines
[15:08] <nessita> alecu: but is ok, since ralsina had some files with windows eolds
[15:08] <ralsina> fffffffffff ok, I'll fix it
[15:08] <nessita> eols
[15:08] <nessita> ralsina: I think is good to change all your windows eols to linux eols
[15:09] <nessita> since that is the convention we have: all source files will have linux eols
[15:09] <ralsina> nessita: I tried, I may have to change editors
[15:09] <nessita> ralsina: I mean, I think we need to land these eol changes
[15:09] <nessita> as part of diego s branch
[15:09] <ralsina> nessita: oh, ok
[15:09] <nessita> alecu: would you agree?
[15:09] <ralsina> hey, I have dos2unix on windows :-)
[15:10] <alecu> nessita, if we do a careful review of the changes, then I say we can land it.
[15:10] <ralsina> alecu: it's the same as a previous branch that had 2 approves
[15:10] <nessita> alecu: if you use meld, it will not matk that as changes
[15:11] <alecu> nessita, ok, looking.
[15:11] <alecu> ralsina, if you've carefully checked and it's the same as the one with two approvals, then land it.
[15:12] <ralsina> alecu: I just fixed two conflicts and they were "all-file" conflicts that were unrelated to the branch
[15:12] <ralsina> because the files had been completely changed in trunk
[15:13] <alecu> ralsina, oh, ok.
[15:17] <dobey> lunch time, bbiab
[15:19] <nessita> ralsina: while tetsing show_spinner, I found out I can click on 'Sign In' even I did not enter any value as email nor password
[15:19] <nessita> ralsina: I'll report in windows-installer, you may later move that to sso, ok?
[15:20] <ralsina> nessita: please file, I will fix it in SSO
[15:20] <nessita> ok, will report in SSO then :-)
[15:20] <ralsina> or file in installer, I will change it ;-)
[15:21] <nessita> ralsina: bug #814686
[15:21] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 814686 in ubuntu-sso-client "QT UI: 'Sign in' button can be clicked even if not values were entered (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/814686
[15:22] <ralsina> nessita: thanks!
[15:24] <nessita> ralsina: I will extend the bug report since the same happens with the code verification screen
[15:25] <ralsina> nessita: I think I have a fix for that one...
[15:26] <nessita> ralsina: so, I clicked 'next' in the enter verification code screen, and the spinner showed up
[15:26] <ralsina> but yes, extend it, it's not the same thig
[15:26] <nessita> ralsina: but,
[15:26] <nessita> ralsina: in the terminal I can see how there was a BadEmailTokenError, and I got nothing in the UI, and of course the spinner did not stop
[15:26] <ralsina> Yes, that is another bug, let me find it
[15:26] <ralsina> once that bug is fixed, the spinner will go away when a popup appears
[15:27] <nessita> ralsina: can you confirm where is the bug so I can evaluate if this branch can land or not?
[15:27] <nessita> ah
[15:27] <nessita> you sure? :-D
[15:27] <nessita> if you're sure, this branch will have my +1 (please seek one more review, I would advice pinging Chipaca for help, since we're short in staff)
[15:27] <ralsina> nessita: bug #805460
[15:27] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 805460 in ubuntu-sso-client "Entering the wrong verification code should give error (affects: 1) (heat: 13)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805460
[15:27] <nessita> ralsina: great!
[15:28] <nessita> ralsina: reviewing diego's branch now
[15:29] <ralsina> nessita: hmmmm I approved that one, it already had your +1
[15:29] <nessita> ralsina: which one you approved?
[15:29] <ralsina> https://code.launchpad.net/~ralsina/ubuntuone-windows-installer/diego_installer_ui/+merge/68856
[15:29] <nessita> ah, ok
[15:30] <nessita> ralsina: I wanna test it IRL, if anything comes up, I'll file bug reports
[15:30] <alecu> nessita, ralsina: I've just finished reviewing mandel's branch.
[15:30] <nessita> alecu: wanna mumble?
[15:30] <alecu> nessita, let's, sure. ralsina?
[15:32] <ralsina> going
[15:38] <ralsina> dobey: when you come back, maybe you can tell me why https://code.launchpad.net/~ralsina/ubuntuone-windows-installer/diego_installer_ui/+merge/68856 did not merge? It complains about something I have no idea how to fix :-(
[15:53] <ralsina> ok, I guess I missed the rest of the mumble
[16:03] <nessita> ralsina: yeap
[16:03] <nessita> ralsina: we decided you will fix this branch instead of me ;-)
[16:03] <ralsina> hey!
[16:12] <dobey> hmm
[16:13] <dobey> ralsina: https://launchpad.net/~diego-sarmentero <- where did this go?
[16:20] <ralsina> dobey: since he had no time to fix the conflicts, I pushed the branch under my name
[16:20] <ralsina> Oh, ~diego-sarmentero? I don't know!
[16:20] <dobey> ralsina: yes, but he's still the author
[16:21] <ralsina> oh, mine, and his account seems to have gone away!
[16:22] <dobey> right, why? and where to?
[16:22] <ralsina> not the slightest idea
[16:25] <ralsina> Now this is just weird. I am asking Diego by email, hope he knows what happened. I suppose I can start a new branch and just copy stuff in it
[16:25] <ralsina> but I would hate losing the change history :-(
[16:26] <dobey> ralsina: answer in other channel :)
[17:18] <ralsina> I'm gonna have lunch. See you all in one hour.
[17:23]  * nessita -> lunch too
[17:23] <dobey> ugh, it's even hard to breathe inside, thanks to sinuses acting up too
[19:15] <CardinalFang> beuno, I polished the music app some more.  I'm ready to release, if you approve of these changes.
[19:15] <beuno> CardinalFang, what else changed since the last apk I saw?
[19:16] <CardinalFang> beuno, I got rid of purple bar, and replace with orange.  Change the arrow on list items.  Changed the style of the active button at bottom.
[19:16] <CardinalFang> beuno, so, see app now.  Compare to ....
[19:16] <CardinalFang> http://chart.apis.google.com/chart?cht=qr&chl=http%3A%2F%2Fsandbox.chad.org%2Fu1m-1.3pre2.apk&chs=260x260
[19:17]  * beuno tests
[19:19] <beuno> CardinalFang, push on to the market!
[19:19] <CardinalFang> Yay.
[19:19] <CardinalFang> I fear any time I have to break out Gimp.
[19:20] <beuno> it's an erratic beast
[19:20] <CardinalFang> I think I'm okay at it, but I know all programmers think that, so....
[19:23] <beuno> CardinalFang, it looks much nicer
[19:23] <beuno> thanks for adding all that extra polish
[19:28] <CardinalFang> beuno, Okay, in Market now.  Updated changelog too.
[19:29]  * beuno does the happy dance
[19:29] <beuno> CardinalFang, \o/
[19:30] <beuno> CardinalFang, you get to move cards into the release column!
[19:31] <CardinalFang> :)
[19:37] <alecu> CardinalFang, ping
[19:38] <alecu> CardinalFang, testing that app, I get a weird "Exit" button when I hit the menu key.
[19:38] <beuno> ah, me too
[19:38] <beuno> as if the image is missing
[19:38] <alecu> CardinalFang, it looks like the icon for the "Exit" button is a "Ubuntu One Music" png with
[19:39] <alecu> mostly text
[19:48] <CardinalFang> alecu, Huh.  That's strange.
[19:48] <CardinalFang> alecu, thank you.
[19:49] <CardinalFang> That image is the same as the header on main page.
[19:49] <alecu> CardinalFang, oh, right.
[19:50] <alecu> CardinalFang, sorry I didn't saw it earlier :-(
[19:50] <CardinalFang> alecu, one "ant clean" later, it's fixed.  :\
[19:51] <CardinalFang> I'll hack on those help and exit icons too.
[20:16] <CardinalFang> alecu, beuno, remade, and updated icons.  Name it 1.4.  Published in Market.
[20:17]  * beuno updates
[20:18] <CardinalFang> Hrm, Market is taking longer than the usual 90 seconds.
[20:19] <beuno> hm
[20:19] <beuno> yeah, I still see 1.2+gx
[20:22] <CardinalFang> FWIW, http://chart.apis.google.com/chart?cht=qr&chl=http%3A%2F%2Fsandbox.chad.org%2Fu1m-1.4.apk&chs=260x260
[20:22] <CardinalFang> I'd still like to know that the Market works, though. :(
[20:27] <CardinalFang> beuno, 1.4 now.
[20:27] <ralsina> nessita: ping
[20:27] <nessita> ralsina: dying pong
[20:27] <ralsina> whoa, what happened?
[20:27] <nessita> ralsina: I'm absolutely angry at this point :-D
[20:27] <nessita> ralsina: the branch is driving crazy
[20:28] <ralsina> ok,hopefully not with me
[20:28] <nessita> it will end up being a doll, but the process is painful
[20:28] <nessita> ralsina: tell me
[20:28] <ralsina> I have had problems with my installer script but I finally fixed them
[20:28] <nessita> good
[20:29] <ralsina> so, since the installer was not ready for today's USA people, it doesn't matter if I release it late
[20:29] <nessita> ralsina: were you able to run syncdaemon with 'success'?
[20:29] <ralsina> as long as it's tday
[20:29] <ralsina> nessita: about to test it, actually
[20:29] <nessita> ralsina: ok
[20:30] <ralsina> so, I'll give a report about that in maybe half an hour, and wanted to know how that branch was going. I am nt going to ask you right nw, though ;-)
[20:30] <nessita> ralsina: yes please, ask me in 30 min
[20:30] <nessita> I will try to cool down :-D
[20:31] <ralsina> ok, cool :-)
[20:42] <beuno> CardinalFang, hm, I can't see it in the market at all
[20:44] <beuno> there we go
[20:44] <beuno> had to isntall it via the website
[20:45] <CardinalFang> beuno, I found it by visiting the other app, viewing "Other by this developer".  (Caching!  Grr.)
[20:57] <ralsina> ok, with manuel's branch, syncdaemon doesn't start at all: https://pastebin.canonical.com/50146/ without it, it fails to upload with key errors: https://pastebin.canonical.com/50145/
[20:58] <nessita> ralsina: looking
[20:58] <ralsina> I couldn't try it on a clean account yet, this is with my account.
[20:59] <nessita> ralsina: do you have this file? \\\\?\\C:\\Users\\ROBERTO\\Ubuntu One\\Aranduka Books\\delayed-action - Copy.zip
[20:59] <ralsina> yep
[20:59] <nessita> ralsina: you may have corrupted metadata due to previous runs...
[21:00] <ralsina> nessita: could be
[21:00] <nessita> ralsina: if you could try with a clean account, that would be the best
[21:00] <ralsina> nessita: about to try it
[21:00] <ralsina> Switching to clean user, so I'll be gone a bit
[21:00] <nessita> ralsina: ack
[21:13] <ralsina> Ok, clean user with trunk syncdaemon: Uploads fail with KeyError, downloads work fine, unlinks (local => web) work fine
[21:14] <ralsina> nessita:  ^
[21:14] <nessita> grm
[21:15] <ralsina> And that's on paths without any encoding issues
[21:16] <ralsina> Here's the trace from the clean user: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/650238/
[21:50] <alecu> hola DiegoSarmentero!
[21:50] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, buenas
[21:50] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, ya hiciste la valija? :-)
[21:51] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, jejee estoy en eso, hoy estuve cerrando todas las cosas en mi ultimo dia en globant :P
[21:52] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, felicitaciones!!!
[21:52] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, gracias! :D me hicieron una despedida muy copada..... y ahora a darle de lleno a Canonical!! :D
[21:52] <alecu> \Q/
[21:55] <dobey> have a good weekend all!
[22:05] <androidangel> hello there
[22:15] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, si vos sos fanatico de Battlestar Galactica, tengo algo para mostrarte cuando vaya! jeje
[22:15]  * nessita -> eod
[22:15] <nessita> bye all!
[22:15] <DiegoSarmentero> bye
[22:15] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, I've only seen a few episodes of the new series. I've seen all the old ones, but when I was a kid.
[22:16] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, I got interested in the board game because toote recommended it.
[22:16] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, ahhhhhh ok, I saw all the episodes of the new serie three times :P
[22:16] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, wow!
[22:16] <DiegoSarmentero> It is a really good tv show
[22:16] <DiegoSarmentero> really
[22:17] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, I love Edward James Olmos, from both Miami Vice and Blade Runner. I should give the new Battlestar a go.
[22:17] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, btw: my favorite all time series was "Robotech"
[22:18] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, yes! that is really famous!
[22:19] <ralsina> alecu: I suppose you watched all the Macross things that were not retrofitted into Robotech? :-)
[22:19] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, maybe I can't be imparcial jeje but from my point of view, BG has the best ending of any serie that i watched... and i have watched a lot jeje
[22:19] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, ahahah
[22:20] <ralsina> The whole idea of a series made by grabbing three random anime series and redubbig them so they (sort of) make sense in continuity is so meta people should study that in college.
[22:20] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, i even made a web application that crawl the web, and obtain the calendar of any tv show that i like and notify me when a new episode is released :P
[22:21] <alecu> DiegoSarmentero, I saw a few of the things that were cut in robotech, yes... I had some VHS with the "perfect collection": two robotech episodes plus two "original subtitled" episodes, and it was bizarre.
[22:21]  * ralsina imagines a series made by pasting together "The prisoner" and "Lost"  called "The Island"
[22:21] <alecu> ralsina, wasn't that already a series called "Fort Voyard" ?
[22:22] <ralsina> alecu: you mean the contest thing with Julian Weich and Areceli Gonzalez???? :-D
[22:22] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, that was a tv competition show
[22:22] <alecu> ralsina, exactly :-)
[22:22] <DiegoSarmentero> ralsina, i think so
[22:22] <ralsina> Nah, that's too bizarre to paste coherently :-)
[22:23] <DiegoSarmentero> ralsina, agree jeje
[22:23] <ralsina> I suspect Fringe makes more sense if you watch it mixed with "Bones", for example.
[22:24] <DiegoSarmentero> ralsina, uhhh Fringe and Bones are really great tv shows!!
[22:24] <alecu> or dexter with 6ft under
[22:24] <ralsina> alecu: right
[22:24] <ralsina> DiegoSarmentero: so Bones and Booth are ordinary cops that find increasingly bizarre murders, which are really caused by the interdimensional war that they never notice.
[22:25] <DiegoSarmentero> ralsina, jejeejjee seems interesting!! jejee
[22:25] <ralsina> And everyone they send to jail is actually completely innocent
[22:25] <ralsina> All forensic evidence is of course explained by the twins from the parallel universe
[22:26] <DiegoSarmentero> ralsina, the bold guy who appears everywhere :P lol
[22:26] <ralsina> exactly. He worked in Lost, so we could mix that easily.
[22:27] <alecu> you should throw in a midget or two, for good measure.
[22:28] <ralsina> nah, too david lynch
[22:29] <alecu> ralsina, no, let's have him dancing "forwards"
[22:29] <ralsina> That will just confuse everyone! :-D
[22:29]  * ralsina starts writing a short story called "Bonge" with his Bones/Fringe idea
[22:30] <ralsina> Which apparently is swedish slang for an erection. Weeeeeeird :-D
[22:31] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, ralsina changing a little bit the subject..... have you ever seen "The Man From Earth" (movie)?? It's an amazing movie!!!
[22:31]  * DiegoSarmentero can resist to recommend this movie :P
[22:31]  * DiegoSarmentero can't resist to recommend this movie :P
[22:31] <ralsina> DiegoSarmentero: doesn't ring a bell. Let me IMDB it
[22:31] <ralsina> Nope, haven't. Any good?
[22:32] <alecu> """An impromptu goodbye party for Professor John Oldman becomes a mysterious interrogation after the retiring scholar reveals to his colleagues he is an immortal who has walked the earth for 14,000 years"""
[22:32] <alecu> not seen it either.
[22:32] <DiegoSarmentero> ralsina, it is really awesome, it is one of that movies, when you realize that you don't need FX or anything else if the story is really great and the actors do an amazing job
[22:32] <DiegoSarmentero> alecu, ^
[22:32] <ralsina> """An impromptu  goodbye party for Professor John Oldman becomes a mysterious interrogation after the retiring scholar reveals to his colleagues he is the egyptian god of tulips and wants to see their student's bulbs"
[22:32] <DiegoSarmentero> jejjeeje
[22:33] <ralsina> Usually those two confessions lead to the same outcome ;-)
[22:37] <ralsina> Ok, I am *GONE*
[22:37] <ralsina> see you guys on monday, in person
[22:38] <alecu> ralsina, see you!
[22:38] <ralsina> alecu: I'll do a review for that branch before monday
[22:38] <alecu> ralsina, I've just pushed two branches.
[22:38] <alecu> and sure, they can wait till monday.
[22:38] <ralsina> I meant user-id-tcp-port
[22:39] <ralsina> so b-b-b-b-b-bye
[22:46] <alecu> bye all too
[22:46] <DiegoSarmentero> bye
[22:46]  * alecu eods, eows, and says goodbye to irc for a while.