[04:49] <Kilos> hellooo africa
[09:31] <Na3iL> Good morning Africa o/
[10:13] <Kilos> hi Na3iL hows things there lad
[10:14] <Na3iL> Hiya Kilos I am fine thanks what about you?
[10:14] <Kilos> hi ZionistExCath funny nick
[10:14] <Kilos> im good too ty Na3iL
[10:14] <Na3iL> :D I am back with a new laptop :D
[10:14] <Kilos> what spec lappy?
[10:15] <Kilos> im running kubuntu on an i5 with 4g ram and runs well
[10:16] <Na3iL> i5 3rd generation with 8 go ram
[10:16] <Na3iL> I am running Kubuntu also! :D
[10:16] <Kilos> wonderful
[10:16] <Kilos> im hooked on kde
[10:17] <Kilos> but bento would be faster
[10:17] <Kilos> thats ubuntu with openbox i think its called
[10:17] <Na3iL> Yep, but I will try Arch Linux asap
[10:17] <Na3iL> I liked it somehow
[10:18] <Kilos> too much hard work for me
[10:18] <Kilos> kde everything just works
[10:18] <Na3iL> yep
[10:18] <Na3iL> Otherwise, what's new in Ubuntu Africa?
[10:18] <Kilos> we could have a meeting on the 27th hey
[10:19] <Kilos> major drought and heat waves for weeks
[10:19] <Kilos> just now well also be living on dates and camel milk
[10:20] <Na3iL> haha :D
[10:20] <Kilos> 80% of our farmers didnt even get maize crops in
[10:21] <Kilos> hows things up there
[10:21] <Na3iL> I was passing exams last week, and I passed them hopefully with good mark :D
[10:21] <Kilos> good man
[10:22] <Na3iL> Ty ^^
[10:22] <Na3iL> For that, I wasn't always available in irc
[10:22] <Kilos> np study and exam time comes frst
[10:22] <Kilos> first
[10:22] <Na3iL> Indeed.
[10:27] <Kilos> hi Dro
[10:27] <Na3iL> Hey Dro
[10:28] <Dro> hi hi Kilos Na3iL !
[10:28] <Dro> how are you guys?
[10:28] <Kilos> good ty and you?
[10:28] <Na3iL> Fine Dro thanks wbu?
[10:29] <Dro> I'm fine, thanks! :D
[11:31] <Kilos> hi Bilel_mk
[11:31] <Bilel_mk> hey Kilos :) how are you ?
[11:31] <Kilos> good ty and you?
[11:33] <Bilel_mk> thank god perfect :)
[11:37] <Kilos> :D


[18:41] <kreign> could someone take a peek at an upstart conf file for me and tell me if it's correct?
[18:52] <JanC> kreign: depends on what you mean by "correct", but if you post a link to a pastebin or such, people can try...
[18:52] <kreign> JanC, ok.
[18:52] <kreign> JanC, just found a false assumption, and then someone needs my attention, and then.... well, i might get to it by dinner, at this rate. :|
[18:52] <kreign> thanks though


[04:18] <pitti> Good morning
[04:57] <jibel> Good morning
[08:04] <Laney> morning!
[08:05] <mhr3> seb128, hilfe
[08:05] <mhr3> seb128, my compiz crashes
[08:05] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[08:05] <seb128> hey Laney mhr3
[08:05] <Laney> haha
[08:05] <seb128> mhr3, you are pinging the wrong guys, try bregma or Trevinho or ...?
[08:05] <Laney> now that's a good welcome
[08:05] <seb128> mhr3, what's the stacktrace?
[08:05] <mhr3> seb128, it's schema related, thought you'd know about it
[08:05] <czajkows1i> aloha
[08:06] <mhr3> CRIT  2013-10-09 09:03:11 unity.glib-gio <unknown>:0 Settings schema 'org.compiz.unityshell' does not contain a key named 'alt-tab-right'
[08:06] <seb128> mhr3, dpkg -l | grep unity?
[08:07] <mhr3> 7.1.1+13.10.20131004-0ubuntu1
[08:07] <seb128> hum
[08:07] <seb128> mhr3, compiz version?
[08:07] <mhr3> i'm running dist-upgrade as we speak, not sure this was the ver that crashed
[08:07] <mhr3> 1:0.9.10+13.10.20131004-0ubuntu1
[08:08] <mhr3> compiz ^
[08:08] <seb128> mhr3, do you have an apport file for the segfault?
[08:08] <seb128> well abort() rather
[08:09] <mhr3> seb128, well, it's the schema thing
[08:09] <mhr3> oh you want the ver from there
[08:09] <mhr3> let me check
[08:09] <seb128> mhr3, yeah, I just want you to grep for unity.so in the procmaps
[08:09] <seb128> mhr3, no, I want to make sure you are using the unity plugin from the package and not a local build
[08:10] <mhr3> /usr/lib/compiz/libunityshell.so
[08:10] <seb128> :-(
[08:10]  * Laney looks at https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/update-manager/lp1200775
[08:10] <mhr3> dist-upgrade finished, let's see
[08:11] <Laney> mvo saving the day
[08:11] <seb128> mvo, thanks for the fix there ;-)
[08:11] <seb128> Laney, yeah, I gentled pinged him yesterday evening and being mvo he had a look ;-)
[08:11] <mhr3> seb128, still crashes :(
[08:11] <Laney> yeah I saw
[08:11] <Laney> \o/
[08:12] <seb128> mhr3, OH
[08:12] <seb128> mhr3, can you grep for schemas in the procmaps?
[08:12] <seb128> mhr3, I wonder if you have a buggy/outdated schemas in /usr/local or something
[08:13] <seb128> though that doesn't make sense
[08:13] <mhr3> seb128, you mean in the crash file?
[08:13] <seb128> mhr3, well, apport-unpack it in a dir and go look at ProcMaps
[08:14] <seb128> mhr3, the unpack command is going to give you a directory with the dump and a bunch of text files, including the procmaps info
[08:14] <mhr3> yea, got it, i can't see anything from /usr/local
[08:14] <seb128> nor from your user dir?
[08:15] <mhr3> just mime.cache and dconf
[08:15] <mvo> Laney, seb128: my pleasure
[08:15] <seb128> mhr3, I don't get it, grepping for alt-tab-right in the current compiz and unity source returns no match (only some .convert files)
[08:16] <seb128> mvo, hey, wie gehts? ;-)
[08:16] <seb128> mvo, when do you come back working with us, we miss you here! ;-)
[08:17] <seb128> mhr3, can you share the .crash?
[08:17] <mhr3> sure
[08:17] <mhr3> seb128, http://ubuntuone.com/3xCpBN7ikkmgORyG1x2aDP
[08:20] <mhr3> seb128, i see reference to it in my old unity builddir, but yea the current source has it only in the .convert files
[08:21] <mhr3> still, it the key isn't there, isn't the conversion going to blow up?
[08:21] <mhr3> s/it/if/
[08:21] <seb128> mhr3, it is, but the conversion should be done by gsettings-schema-convert not compiz...
[08:21] <seb128> mhr3, well, try deleting the .convert in case that's the issue
[08:21] <mhr3> hmm, odd
[08:22] <seb128> mhr3, well, try deleting the .convert in case that's the issue, /usr/lib/compiz/migration/compiz-*.convert
[08:23] <mhr3> seb128, nope, still crashes :/
[08:23] <seb128> mhr3, can you get a debug stacktrace?
[08:28] <mhr3> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6212851/
[08:28] <mhr3> good enough or do you want more symbols?
[08:29] <seb128> mhr3, good enough to get an idea that the issue is compiz ... I guess it's specific to your user?
[08:30] <mhr3> seb128, i'd love to check, but i don't have indicators to switch to guest :P
[08:30] <mhr3> will log out and see, but need to jump into our standup
[08:30] <seb128> mhr3, it started today though? did you do changes to your compiz config recently?
[08:30] <seb128> mhr3, ok
[08:31] <mhr3> seb128, yes, started today
[08:31] <seb128> mhr3, it's weird, neither compiz nor unity changed this week
[08:31] <mhr3> seb128, i didn't restart for a couple of days
[08:32] <seb128> mhr3, but yeah, I've no idea, it looks like compiz is finding a setting and trying to match it to a gsettings key
[08:33] <seb128> you should probably try asking somebody who knows how the gsettings backend work there
[08:33] <seb128> e.g duflu or maybe bregma/Trevinho/Townsend
[08:34]  * duflu doesn't remember compiz gsettings. But does recall lots of pain and screaming.
[08:34] <seb128> duflu, hey
[08:34] <seb128> duflu, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6212851/ is the issue mhr3 is having, it ends up trying to get the value of a gsettings key that doesn't exist anymore ... do you know where compiz gets its canonical "list of keys"?
[08:37] <seb128> pitti, hey, wie gehts?
[08:38] <seb128> pitti, I commented on that libnotify's bug, let me know if I'm overlooking something
[08:38] <pitti> seb128: bonjour
[08:39] <pitti> seb128: just saw; indeed, you're right (wrt. exposing the API in Ubuntu)
[08:39] <pitti> ABI
[08:39] <pitti> well, for pygobject it's really API, but nevermind
[08:39] <seb128> pitti, what do you think about renaming the binary for a proper transition?
[08:39] <pitti> seb128: but that again breaks compatibility with third-party packages?
[08:40] <seb128> pitti, that's what happens when incompatible api changes are done
[08:40] <pitti> if that's the current upstream version, it should have the upstream API IMHO, especially as the old one is actually broken
[08:40] <seb128> pitti, you can't win, half the world is going to use the old API still
[08:40] <pitti> I know, but at least the direction will be towards the new one
[08:40] <seb128> I would argue that, since the change is recent, more code out there is still using the old API
[08:41] <pitti> we can only really do a code grep for that (from Python)
[08:41] <duflu> seb128: Could not remember, but found it... /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/org.compiz.*
[08:41] <seb128> duflu, thanks
[08:41] <seb128> mhr3, can your "grep alt-tab-right /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/org.compiz.*" ?
[08:42] <seb128> pitti, well, we can archive grep but that doesn't solve the 3rd party problem
[08:43] <pitti> if we rename the binary, it'll break those even more (including consumers of the C API)
[08:43] <seb128> pitti, in any case I suggest we do take on doing the transition next cycle, it's late to do that for saucy at this point, and since the new api didn't get released in any distribution yet I doubt many 3rd party ported their code to make it incompatible with what 95% of their users are running
[08:43] <duflu> seb128: /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/org.compiz.unityshell.gschema.xml:    <key type="s" name="alt-tab-right">
[08:43] <pitti> seb128: sounds good
[08:43] <duflu> seb128: Exists on raring, not saucy
[08:43] <seb128> pitti, great
[08:44] <seb128> pitti, (I was suggesting renaming the gir, not the lib)
[08:44] <pitti> ah, not sure whether that'd help; I don't know any software which actually bothers to check the gir version except for gtk 2/3
[08:44] <seb128> pitti, and only the Ubuntu binary, e.g gir1.2-notify-0.7.1
[08:44] <seb128> or something
[08:45] <pitti> seb128: I think in that case we should rather ship an override
[08:45] <seb128> duflu, right, but mhr3 is having the issue on current saucy, which puzzles me
[08:45] <pitti> which calls the new API and falls back to the old
[08:45] <seb128> pitti, that would allow the old number argument to work rather than hit an exception?
[08:45] <duflu> seb128: The issue is surely _because_ the key no longer exists on saucy?
[08:45] <pitti> the override would catch the exception and call the old API
[08:46] <seb128> duflu, well, the key is not used in the code so it should be fine to not have it in the schemas?
[08:46]  * duflu shrugs
[08:46] <seb128> duflu, I grepped compiz and unity trunk, no mention of "alt-tab-right" (out of a .convert)
[08:46] <seb128> neither in the saucy sources
[08:46] <duflu> Could be leftover config from an upgrade and gsettings is hitting it (not Unity)
[08:47] <seb128> duflu, right, thanks for the help, I was not sure why the code was hitting an assert trying to read a key which is not mentioned in the source
[08:47] <seb128> duflu, the missing piece was "it gets its list of key from the schemas"
[08:53] <mlankhor1t> oh i forgot to say good morning to all :)
[09:09] <mhr3> seb128, so, yea guest works fine :/
[09:10] <seb128> mhr3, you have a schemas or config somewhere that lists that key...
[09:10] <seb128> mhr3, grep "alt-tab-right" ~/.config -r ?
[09:10] <mhr3> where though... thats the question
[09:11] <mhr3> ~/.config/compiz-1/gsettings/schemas/org.compiz.unityshell.gschema.xml:
[09:11] <mhr3> hmmm
[09:13] <seb128> mhr3, delete it and be happy?
[09:13] <mhr3> didn't help :/
[09:14] <seb128> :-(
[09:14] <seb128> mhr3, strace -f compiz 2>&1 | grep schemas > telluswhatyouareloading
[09:14] <mhr3> seb128, any idea how  to reset that schema?
[09:15] <mhr3> i never remember it for the relocatable ones
[09:16] <seb128> gsettings reset org.compiz.core:/org/compiz/profiles/unity/plugins/core/ active-plugins
[09:16] <seb128> mhr3, ^ I've that in my irc logs
[09:16] <seb128> so "org.compiz.core:/org/compiz/profiles/unity/plugins/core/" I guess
[09:16] <seb128> mhr3, "gsettings list-recursively org.compiz.core:/org/compiz/profiles/unity/core/ | grep alt-tab-right" ?
[09:18] <seb128> mhr3, org.compiz.unityshell:/org/compiz/profiles/unity/plugins/unityshell/
[09:18] <mhr3> seb128, nothing, yet it still crashes
[09:18] <seb128> rather
[09:18] <seb128> mhr3, I gave you the wrong one before
[09:18] <seb128> ^
[09:18] <mhr3> seb128, not there either :/
[09:19] <seb128> mhr3, did you try the strace?
[09:20] <seb128> not sure if you saw the command I just gave some lines up
[09:20] <seb128> before you asked about the reset
[09:21] <mhr3> not much there really, just opening them from /usr/share/glib...
[09:22] <seb128> which doesn't mention "alt-tab-right" at all?
[09:22] <mhr3> seb128, well it's compiled
[09:23] <mhr3> oh.. not that much compiled... but no, no alt-tab-right
[09:23] <seb128> mhr3, the gschemas db is compiled yes, but compiz doesn't read that config apparently, it reads the .schemas to compute the keys list
[09:24] <mhr3> i'll restart, maybe that will finally refresh everything
[09:27] <mhr3> seb128, :'-(
[09:27] <mhr3> i want my desktop back
[09:28] <mpt> seb128, I haven't used any headers in the System Settings designs.
[09:28] <seb128> mhr3, grep "alt-tab-right" / -r
[09:28] <seb128> mpt, well, jouni and matt say that the section titles should be header widgets
[09:28] <mhr3> you want to kill my laptop, don't you?
[09:29] <seb128> mhr3, don't you have a ssd drive? ;-)
[09:29] <mhr3> seb128, i do, and ubuntu doesn't use it :/
[09:30] <seb128> mhr3, well, I've no better idea, you can strace -f -e stat compiz 2>&1 | grep mhr3 or local or stuff
[09:30] <mpt> seb128, then they're mistaken. :-) They are often the beginning of sentences that the following labels complete, and it would be weird to use different font styles for the beginning and end of the same sentence.
[09:30] <seb128> to see what it reads in non standard location
[09:30] <seb128> mpt, I opened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1236804 also
[09:30] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1236804 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "shouldn't use colon in section titles" [Low,Confirmed]
[09:31] <mpt> ok
[09:31] <seb128> mpt, well, at least in the visual (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AboutThisDevice?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=phone-about.mockup.png) they have different colors for those titles
[09:31] <seb128> mpt, which doesn't happen if we use a Standard element
[09:31] <seb128> mpt, we discussed it for a while here yesterday and decided to not change anything for v1, we still have bug fixes and you guys don't agree
[09:31] <mpt> seb128, yeah, it's fine just there, but for example in Time & Date where you have "Set the time: Automatically / Manually", it makes less sense
[09:32] <seb128> mpt, did you see http://ubuntuone.com/1DapfTL5unqLohs7hTQAqv
[09:32] <seb128> mpt, it's some playing around, they want also the rounded version of the selector in the UIs
[09:33] <mpt> seb128, yes. Three different left text margins on one screen! Wow.
[09:34] <seb128> mpt, yeah, they ideally wanted the right version without the divider line before the selector
[09:34] <seb128> but that's a bit hackish and the Header elements don't allow to hide the divider
[09:35] <seb128> mpt, in any case it would be nice if you could sort it out and come to an agreement with them about header/no header issue
[09:35] <seb128> mpt, I think their main concern is that, currently, the titles and elements have the exact same style, which makes the UI a bit less easy to "parse"
[09:36] <mpt> Yes, it's tied in with the (lack of) styling for interactive elements
[09:37] <seb128> mpt, do you want me to open a bug about the header topic so we can track the issue/have the discussion there?
[09:37] <mpt> seb128, I think it's the same bug ... If they were headers then they shouldn't have colons
[09:38] <seb128> mpt, ok, that's sort of what I though ... so good, let's keep that one ;-)
[09:40] <mpt> seb128, that rightmost image in <http://ubuntuone.com/1DapfTL5unqLohs7hTQAqv> reminds me of <http://sloppyui.tumblr.com/image/62180500498> ... Pick one indentation and stick to it. :-)
[09:40] <seb128> hehe
[09:41] <seb128> mpt, well, thing is that we got a special version of the optionselector to use in lists (that's what we use atm), but they don't like it ... and the standalone version if not really made to be used there so it's not aligned with other elements
[09:41] <xnox> mpt: seb128: I see 5 indentation levels in the right-most one?!
[09:41] <seb128> but that optionselector problem is another one
[09:42] <xnox> (including Time & Date top level title.)
[09:42] <seb128> xnox, it should be 3 "headers: most left, items: middle, selector: most right"
[09:42] <seb128> xnox, the top level title is aligned on Europe/Paris
[09:43] <mpt> ...and mardi
[09:43] <xnox> seb128: maybe I need to check my eye-sight, but "top level title" looks to me a pixel or two mis-aligned from Europe/paris.
[09:44] <seb128> xnox, that would be a toolkit bug if that's true
[09:44] <seb128> xnox, I don't see it here but maybe you are right, I don't have pixel perfect eyes ;-)
[09:45] <xnox> seb128: or it's the day I find out I am cross-eyed ;-)
[09:56] <seb128> Laney, mpt: opened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1237317 about the option selector thing
[09:56] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1237317 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Should have an UbuntuShaped version of the ListItem.ItemSelector" [Low,Triaged]
[09:58] <mhr3> seb128, wooo, compiz runs
[09:59] <Laney> It could just be that it's not obvious enough when ui elements are interactive
[09:59] <mhr3> seb128, now tiny problem, i don't get unity :/
[09:59] <seb128> mhr3, what was it?
[09:59] <mhr3> seb128, there was one more .xml in ~/.compiz-1 (not just ~/.config/compiz-1)
[10:00] <mhr3> oh, restarted, got unity
[10:00] <mhr3> yeye!
[10:00] <mhr3> and an hour wasted
[10:01] <seb128> mhr3, :-(
[10:02] <seb128> mhr3, the make install always bite back...
[10:02] <mhr3> seb128, but soon we'll be in the wonderful compiz-free world :P
[10:02] <mhr3> and all these issues will be in mir
[10:02] <seb128> hehe
[10:02] <seb128> that's great
[10:03] <seb128> it means people are going to stop pinging #ubuntu-desktop about those :p
[10:03] <Laney> haha, you wish
[10:03] <mhr3> lol
[10:04] <sil2100> seb128: hello! Can I propose a modification to the ubuntu-touch-settings package? ;) https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/+junk/ubuntu-settings_background
[10:05] <seb128> sil2100, that seems wrong, you listed the desktop filename in there?
[10:05] <seb128> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~sil2100/+junk/ubuntu-settings_background/revision/36
[10:06] <sil2100> Shiiit
[10:06] <sil2100> hehe, oh my
[10:06] <sil2100> That's what I get for testing on my phone
[10:06] <sil2100> hm, and this didn't happen for the first time, need to start paying attention
[10:07] <Laney> does that mean the form factor detection in unity8 gets to go away?
[10:07] <Laney> for background
[10:08] <sil2100> Laney: it can stay, but I guess it doesn't make much sense - as the two backgrounds they are providing are the same one, but the phone version is just a cropped version of the phone one - when we use the tablet picture and let unity8 do the cropping, actually it crops to almost the same background
[10:08] <sil2100> Laney: I guess that when we ask design to provide a real form-factor neutral background then it will be even better
[10:08] <Laney> yep, if that's true then you might be able to remove it
[10:09] <Laney> then everyone can use the same fallback stuff just by referring to gsettings
[10:09] <Laney> which would be nice
[10:09] <sil2100> Indeed!
[10:12] <sil2100> seb128: I re-pushed the branch but corrected now
[10:12] <sil2100> seb128: pointing to /usr/share/unity8/graphics/tablet_background.jpg
[10:18] <seb128> sil2100, Laney: I feel that we should use the phone background, since we only target the n4 for v1
[10:18] <seb128> it seems logic to default to what should be used on the form factor
[10:22] <sil2100> seb128: right, but as mentioned earlier (at least on surfaceflinger) when unity8 does the wallpaper cropping of the tablet wallpaper, it crops it the same way as the phone wallpaper looks like
[10:22] <Laney> I'm not bothered, but if it ends up looking the same then it's less work to just do that
[10:22] <seb128> exactly the same way?
[10:23] <seb128> I've learnt to not trust myself looking at images or pixels
[10:23] <seb128> when it seems fine to me, others see bending, or compression, or not pixel perfect
[10:23] <seb128> e.g the wallpapers we ship seem fine to me but some people complain they look wrong
[10:25] <sil2100> seb128: I'm checking that in gimp now
[10:26] <sil2100> seb128: and there are slight differences - it's the same image, the same cropping but brightnes/contrast seem to be modified a bit, as tablet BG is darker
[10:27] <sil2100> seb128: I was worried on using phone, as even though we only target phone for v1, the wallpaper ran on a tablet will look terrible then
[10:27] <seb128> sil2100, I wonder if we should try to change it for v1...
[10:27] <sil2100> Since there's no way of having a good backdrop when using a 450px wide image on a tablet-wide screen
[10:27] <seb128> sil2100, btw did you get feedback from mpt on the "reset image button"?
[10:28] <mpt> Reset image button?
[10:28] <sil2100> seb128: not yet, no movement on the bug, but since mpt is around here ;)
[10:28] <sil2100> mpt: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1234994
[10:28] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1234994 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "can't reset background to default" [Low,Triaged]
[10:29] <sil2100> mpt: I proposed a workaround for v1 to include a 'Reset background' button for now
[10:29] <sil2100> 'Revert to default' or such
[10:29] <mpt> So #ubuntu-desktop is where we talk about everything relating to Ubuntu Touch
[10:29] <Laney> haha
[10:30] <sil2100> mpt: no no, this was just something that popped up during our desktop-schema related talk ;p
[10:30] <Laney> it's where the desktop team, hijacked to work on touch, chats :-)
[10:30] <seb128> mpt, we tend to do that, part is habits, part is that -touch can be really busy at times which makes impossible to have a conversation
[10:31] <seb128> but yeah, we should probably should use -touch a bit more
[10:31] <sil2100> My bad!
[10:32] <mpt> sil2100, sorry, I don't know what either the current code or your proposal looks like. Could you link a screenshot?
[10:32] <sil2100> mpt: sure thing, one moment
[10:33] <seb128> mpt, the current code is http://ubuntuone.com/1Rb2gkYMa3JvnsgzzOjwDb
[10:34] <seb128> mpt, which runs gallery to pick an image, when you click on it
[10:34] <seb128> sil2100, ^ (I had it shared already from a previous discussion)
[10:34] <seb128> sil2100, would still be good to make one with the button
[10:34] <mpt> seb128, I thought we unrounded those corners earlier?
[10:35] <mpt> Oh, Matt unrounded them in the mockup, not in the code
[10:35] <mpt> My mistake
[10:35] <seb128> mpt, no, we didn't and nobody told us to unround them
[10:36] <sil2100> mpt: posted the screenshot on the bug
[10:36] <mpt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Appearance?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=phone-background.mockup.png
[10:37] <mpt> thanks sil2100
[10:37] <sil2100> I used a standard button
[10:37] <seb128> mpt, right, we didn't pay enough attention to details I guess
[10:38] <sil2100> mpt: I'll change the corners then anyway
[10:38] <mpt> thanks :-)
[10:39] <mpt> The squbuntircle is great, but not for showing a phone screen that is always perfectly rectangular.
[10:39] <sil2100> ;)
[10:40] <Laney> You might as well get rid of the whole of SwappableImage then
[10:40] <Laney> most of that was only to make it work inside an UbuntuShape
[10:40] <Laney> also ChangeImage.qml is dead now
[10:44] <mpt> sil2100, commented
[10:44] <sil2100> mpt: thanks!
[10:45] <sil2100> Laney: time for some good ol cleanup then
[10:45] <Laney> oh man
[10:45] <Laney> the content hub MPs added some > 80 column lines
[10:45] <Laney> my beautiful right margin, trashed
[10:46] <sil2100> mpt: the comment makes super sense, will fix it accordingly and provide a screenshot when done so - again thanks for looking into this ;)
[10:47] <mpt> ta
[10:48] <ritz> bregma Hi, where is this committed https://launchpad.net/unity/+milestone/5.26.0 ? I am unable to find any bzr tree for this
[11:09] <seb128> mhr3, do you know about https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-lens-music/+bug/1210357 ?
[11:09] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1210357 in unity-lens-music (Ubuntu) "FTBFS" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[11:09] <seb128> sil2100, Mirv: ^
[11:10] <Mirv> seb128: that should interest bregma's team
[11:10] <seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-lens-music/+bug/1230343 as well, not sure if that's still accurate
[11:10] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1230343 in Music Lens "Missing gfvs-backends dependency" [High,Confirmed]
[11:11] <bregma> our purview expands daily
[11:11] <seb128> bregma, good morning
[11:11] <bregma> that's an oxymoron
[11:13] <mhr3> seb128, yea, FTBFS sounds plausible
[11:13] <seb128> mhr3, can you get it fixed? ;-)
[11:13] <mhr3> seb128, but you know... the binary works :)
[11:13] <seb128> mhr3, lol
[11:13] <seb128> mhr3, "The name `FLOW' does not exist in the context of `Unity.CategoryRenderer'"
[11:14] <seb128> mhr3, I'm sure you know what that is and you can easily fix it ;-)
[11:14] <mhr3> yea, it's called CAROUSEL these days
[11:15] <seb128> mhr3, great, I see you are on top of it, feel free to ping me to get your merge request reviewed ;-)
[11:16] <mhr3> seb128, damn, your avoiding-to-make-a-patch skill has higher level than mine :P
[11:16] <seb128> ;-)
[11:16] <seb128> mhr3, btw is https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-lens-music/+bug/1230343 making sense?
[11:17] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1230343 in Music Lens "Missing gfvs-backends dependency" [High,Confirmed]
[11:17] <mhr3> seb128, it's reported by pstolowski, so surely it does :)
[11:17] <seb128> do we have gvfs on the phone/do we want it there?
[11:17]  * seb128 looks
[11:20] <sil2100> ;p0
[11:25] <mhr3> seb128, eh, sorry, my wifi died :/
[11:25] <mhr3> seb128, so, no need for gvfs-backends cause we don't have that scope on the phone
[11:26] <seb128> mhr3, no worry, I was saying
 seb128, it's reported by pstolowski, so surely it does :)
 do we have gvfs on the phone/do we want it there?
[11:26] <seb128> * seb128 looks
[11:32] <mhr3> seb128, https://code.launchpad.net/~mhr3/unity-lens-music/fix-1210357/+merge/190093
[11:33] <seb128> sil2100, ^ can you test build an approve it works for you?
[11:33] <seb128> mhr3, thanks
[11:34] <mhr3> seb128, bots will build it ;)
[11:34] <sil2100> seb128, mhr3: doing that locally as well ;)
[11:34] <seb128> mhr3, that's a good point ;-)
[11:34] <seb128> sil2100, thanks
[11:38] <sil2100> mhr3: here it seems to build fine
[11:39] <sil2100> mhr3: I approve globally, if anything the auto-merger will burp
[11:39] <mhr3> sil2100, sure
[11:43] <seb128> sil2100, mhr3: thanks
[11:44] <seb128> sil2100, mhr3: who should be looking at https://launchpadlibrarian.net/153086899/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-i386.unity-scope-github_0.1%2B13.10.20130723-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz ?
[11:44] <sil2100> seb128: normally I would look for David
[11:44] <sil2100> But he's sadly not around
[11:45] <mhr3> seb128, verterok might as well
[11:58] <seb128> Laney, mpt: I've added https://launchpadlibrarian.net/153088854/optionselector.png to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1237317
[11:58] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1237317 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Should have an UbuntuShaped version of the ListItem.ItemSelector" [Low,Triaged]
[11:58] <seb128> Laney, mpt: I guess the issue is that the option group is not visually marked, so it doesn't make obvious what are the options of a selector and what are items ... I commented on the bug saying that
[12:00]  * sil2100 thinks we should really get rid of habbits and start discussing these things on -touch
[12:00] <sil2100> ;p
[12:01] <seb128> sil2100, heh, that screenshot was taken on my desktop, it's a toolkit issue ;-)
[12:06] <Laney> That's #ubuntu-app-devel ;-)
[12:06] <Laney> Anyway, yeah it does, but I don't really have good input to give on how to fix it
[12:06] <seb128> Laney, yeah, me neither, let's wait for design input
[12:06] <seb128> the previous valueselector has a colored background for the options
[12:07] <seb128> but that didn't look really nice either
[12:10] <sil2100> ! ;p
[12:10] <ubot2`> Factoid 'p' not found
[13:05] <happyaron> I wonders how to push an update of translation update?
[13:06] <seb128> happyaron, translation update of what?
[13:06] <happyaron> seb128: language packs
[13:07] <seb128> happyaron, there is a new export scheduled for tomorrow
[13:07] <seb128> happyaron, you don't push updates for those, they are regular cron jobs
[13:07] <happyaron> I see. Where I can find the update schedule?
[13:08] <happyaron> it seems we have too few updates during development cycle, and I suggest to add more in next cycle, :)
[13:09] <seb128> happyaron, https://dev.launchpad.net/Translations/LanguagePackSchedule
[13:09] <seb128> that seems outdated though
[13:09] <seb128> pitti, ^ do you know?
[13:10] <happyaron> it was written when dpm is the translation coordinator, but nobody works on it now I think...
[13:18] <seb128> happyaron, well, dpm and pitti still look at those
[13:18] <seb128> happyaron, http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/10/09/%23ubuntu-devel.html#t09:04
[13:18] <ritz> seb128 hi, can we own desktop bugs if we are working on it ?
[13:18] <seb128> happyaron, that's from earlier today
[13:18] <seb128> ritz, sure can
[13:18] <seb128> ritz, oh, and hey ;-)
[13:19] <ritz> sweet, thank you
[13:21] <mlankhor1t> android's weird :S
[13:23] <happyaron> seb128: I see. ypwong asked dpm not too long ago and he said dpm told him language pack responsibility could belongs to desktop team.
[13:23] <seb128> where dpm hidding? :p
[13:23] <seb128> +is
[13:23] <seb128> happyaron, if you want to help with those I'm sure that would be welcome
[13:24] <happyaron> seb128: as far as I see, the most recent update of language packs are for base pack, not full pack. the base pack contains quite little stuff.
[13:24] <seb128> happyaron, I think we should have a full export for release, I guess tomorrow's one should be that set
[13:25] <happyaron> seb128: sure, and kylin people asked whether we are able to help on it and they can know who to ask for updating langpacks at least.
[13:25] <happyaron> I see.
[13:27] <seb128> happyaron, if you want to help it's great, maybe let's see that after release when things are a bit less crazy
[13:27] <happyaron> great
[13:29] <happyaron> seb128: I think dpm now works as a liaison for Ubuntu App development.
[13:29] <happyaron> his LP profile says that.
[13:29] <seb128> happyaron, yes, but old roles tend to stick
[13:29] <seb128> e.g he didn't handover langpacks to anyone
[13:30] <happyaron> yes
[13:30] <seb128> well, he and pitti still try to help, but reality is that we didn't assign anyone to those
[13:30] <seb128> anyway, changing the cron schedule should be trivial
[13:30] <seb128> let's wait for dpm to be back online
[13:30] <happyaron> ok
[13:30] <seb128> I think he's at a conf today
[13:31] <pitti> seb128: re (sorry, was in meeting)
[13:31] <seb128> pitti, wb (no worry)
[13:31] <pitti> seb128: not sure about that wiki page, but I have it on my todo list to build the final saucy packs tmorrow evening/friday morning
[13:31] <pitti> tomorrow is langpack translation deadline
[13:31] <pitti> and I requested a full export
[13:31] <seb128> pitti, they are going to be a new set of base ?
[13:31] <pitti> yes
[13:31] <seb128> right
[13:31] <pitti> for the final images
[13:32] <seb128> pitti, happyaron would like to help with langpacks (and maybe have updates more often for those)
[13:32] <pitti> so the LP and langpack-o-matic cronjobs were updated
[13:33] <seb128> how often do we roll updates? happyaron mentioned we didn't have as much as some people wanted in saucy
[13:33] <seb128> (I guess that includes Kylin)
[13:33] <happyaron> seems we only updated base langpacks, but full exports are much fewer..
[13:33] <pitti> hm, it seems I can't edit that page
[13:33] <happyaron> which page?
[13:33] <happyaron> I have u-t-c membership, maybe can help
[13:33] <pitti> for the devel release we update twice a week (automatically)
[13:34] <pitti> for stable releases we haven't done updates for a long time
[13:34] <happyaron> but that seems to be only base ones I guess, I mean the twice a week updates
[13:34] <pitti> happyaron: if you want to pick up the coordination of starting and testing stable langpack updates, that would be appreciated indeed
[13:34] <pitti> dpm used to do that, but as seb128 said there was no successor for him
[13:35] <happyaron> I can start to work on it, but may not be as active as dpm before, of course
[13:36] <pitti> happyaron: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/LanguagePackUpdatesQA was the central testing feedback page
[13:36] <happyaron> pitti: well, I still insist on checking if the twice a week updates are only base ones or full exports, :)
[13:36] <pitti> happyaron: only updates
[13:36] <pitti> happyaron: "-base" refreshes are what updates all langpacks
[13:37] <pitti> the net effect is the same, but for images we want empty update packs to save space
[13:38] <happyaron> I see.
[13:40] <happyaron> I'll need to check a bit for unity translations for zh_CN first, it seems some of them are not working but still need to find the cause.
[13:42] <seb128> happyaron, which ones?
[13:43] <seb128> happyaron, what locale do you use?
[13:43] <seb128> oh zh_CN
[13:43] <happyaron> ok. shoot the ubuntukylin-default-settings.
[13:43] <seb128> happyaron, I think your main issue is that nobody translated https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/saucy/+source/unity-scope-home/+pots/unity-scope-home
[13:44] <seb128> happyaron, it has only zh_TW and zh_HK translations
[13:44] <seb128> happyaron, that has all the dash strings nowadays
[13:44] <seb128> happyaron, you better get that done today if you want to catch the full export tomorrow
[13:44] <happyaron> I'm working on that right now, and I found ubuntukylin-default-settings overwrites some translation files.
[13:44] <Laney> never look inside that package
[13:44] <Laney> it's scary
[13:44] <seb128> hehe
[13:45] <happyaron> :p
[14:25] <seb128> Sweetshark, hey
[14:27] <Sweetshark> seb128: ho
[14:28] <seb128> Sweetshark, how are you?
[14:28] <seb128> Sweetshark, so, the libreoffice precise SRU, bdmurray is looking at it for us and he pointed an issue
[14:28] <seb128> Sweetshark, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/148219309/libreoffice_1%3A3.5.7-0ubuntu4_1%3A3.5.7-0ubuntu5.diff.gz
[14:29] <seb128> Sweetshark, lp-1194740-fdo-50304-fix-xls-row-height-again.diff is in that diff but not in the series
[14:29] <seb128> Sweetshark, was it supposed to be in the serie or to not be in the diff?
[14:29] <seb128> +Subject: hopefully more successful attempt to solve fdo#50304
[14:29] <happyaron> oh hell, I think there's more odds than I expected in UbuntuKylin.
[14:29] <seb128> Sweetshark, it seems like it should be in the series
[14:29] <seb128> happyaron, :-(
[14:40] <xclaesse> is there a way for webpages like facebook to not appear in the alt-tab ?
[14:42] <Sweetshark> seb128: http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commit;h=95c677321ac0a7b895bb5d6d3d109d2a561f7dd1 <- should explain it in all its glory.
[14:42] <mlankhor1t> brrrr too much kernel stuff for me today
[14:42] <Laney> colonel
[14:42] <mlankhorst> indeed
[14:43] <mlankhorst> lieutenant
[14:43] <seb128> Sweetshark, it does, thanks
[14:44] <mlankhorst> Sweetshark: hah, my mesa compiles take 2 minutes now :P
[14:45] <seb128> Laney, hum? is that way to say that kernel hacking leads to vodka drinking? ;-)
[14:45] <mlankhorst> no it's how you pronounce colonel
[14:45] <Laney> I was caling him the colonel of the kernel
[14:45] <seb128> oh, I see ;-)
[14:46]  * seb128 could do with lemon and vodka :p
[14:46] <seb128> or maybe let's just keep getting some work done for now ;-)
[14:46] <mlankhorst> hah eod for me :P
[14:46] <Sweetshark> mlankhorst: Oh, you should write home about that: "Hey, I compile mesa quicker that this Sweetshark guy does compile LibreOffice on his machine!" ;>
[14:47] <mlankhorst> :D
[14:47] <mlankhorst> did I beat your 8092 core or w/e libreoffice yet?
[14:47] <seb128> Laney, my small mr to hide the "security:" header is still up for review btw, not sure if you saw that I fixed the typo in the variable yesterday (not that it matters much anyway, with the upstream mergers down)
[14:47] <seb128> Sweetshark, libreoffice's sru approved to precise, congrats ;-)
[14:47] <Laney> yes, looking at u-s-s reviews in a second
[14:48] <seb128> Sweetshark, next time we should make sure to ping those guys sooner which there is a small diff
[14:48] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[14:48] <Laney> I kind of ran out of ideas of things to work on for u-s-s btw
[14:48] <Laney> let me know some if you have them
[14:50] <Sweetshark> seb128: yep, the SRU got fired off right before I left for vacation and thus I lost track of it somewhat.
[14:52] <seb128> Laney, are you looking for small things or something that might be a bit more work/looking around?
[14:52] <Laney> either
[14:52] <Laney> I had a look at the bugs and didn't really find anything to fix now
[14:53] <seb128> Laney, ted mentioned earlier than there is a new mechanism somewhere in the sdk to receive parameters on a running instance
[14:53] <seb128> Laney, which we should listen to, and react if it asks to change a panel
[14:53] <seb128> Laney, e.g if u-s-s is running and it got called again on another panel
[14:54] <seb128> Laney, that's bug #1237414
[14:54] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1237414 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Open settings app should redirect to linked settings page" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1237414
[14:54] <Laney> oh that exists now?
[14:54] <seb128> Laney, ted said loicm added it to the toolkit
[14:54] <Laney> I guess http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/devel/ubuntu-13.10/qml/ui-toolkit/qml-ubuntu-components0-urihandler.html
[14:54] <seb128> seems so
[14:54] <Laney> let me see
[14:54] <Laney> I bet you can't try it on desktop
[14:55] <seb128> probably not :/
[14:55] <seb128> Laney, otherwise
[14:55] <seb128> bug #1237030
[14:55] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1237030 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) ""Set time & date" number picker highlight slightly misaligned" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1237030
[14:55] <seb128> bug #1236812 (not sure if that's on the indicator side, settings side, or menumodel stuff)
[14:55] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1236812 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "[Wifi] bottom item should be a caption" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1236812
[14:56] <seb128> bug #1236772
[14:56] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1236772 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "while setting language works in ubuntu touch, currency and date settings are still en_us.UTF-8" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1236772
[14:56] <sil2100> seb128, Laney: thanks for the review guys! Will take that into consideration and fix ;)
[14:56] <seb128> sil2100, thanks
[14:56] <Laney> thought that 812 would be ted and 772 attente
[14:56] <Laney> can take 030 too
[14:59] <seb128> Laney, they are both busy enough that it's likely they are welcoming help, you can check with them
[15:00] <attente> Laney, it's ok, i can do it
[15:00] <attente> 772
[15:00] <Laney> cool
[15:00] <seb128> attente, hey, did you try the g-s-d "adding us fallback" trick?
[15:01] <attente> seb128, something really strange is happening here
[15:02] <attente> g-s-d as far as i can tell is doing the right thing
[15:02] <attente> but for some reason, the xprop wipes away the us layout
[15:02] <seb128> what xprop?
[15:03] <attente> _XKB_RULES_NAMES
[15:03] <attente> something must be resetting it
[15:03] <attente> and i don't think it's g-s-d
[15:03] <seb128> well, something is in g-s-d...
[15:03] <seb128> hum
[15:03] <seb128> but it doesn't get reset with g-s-d 3.6
[15:03] <seb128> and I didn't have either ibus nor indicator-keyboard running during my testing
[15:04] <seb128> I don't see what else could be doing it
[15:05] <seb128> Laney, other "easy" one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1233682
[15:05] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1233682 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Updates panel should not say Ubuntu Phone" [High,Triaged]
[15:05] <seb128> Laney, e.g make the Version in about include the image number
[15:05] <attente> yeah, logging it on the libxkbfile side seems to indicate that g-s-d is doing the right thing already
[15:05] <seb128> attente, did I mention how much I hate that bug? :-(
[15:06] <attente> seb128, i think you mentioned that a few times :)
[15:07] <seb128> Laney, you can get the version though the dbus interface of system-image (the update panel does that already) or probably call the cmd line utility/read a file
[15:08] <Laney> ok, should be simple enough, thanks
[15:09] <seb128> Laney, yw, thanks to you for your working on those ;-)
[15:09] <Laney> it was that or rls-s bugs ;-)
[15:10] <seb128> Laney, oh, on my backlog I've also a "update farstream-0.2 from 0.2.2 to 0.2.3" if you fancy having a look, it fixes a segfault, upstream pinged me about it on friday
[15:10] <seb128> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=70087
[15:10] <ubot2`> Freedesktop bug 70087 in GStreamer Elements "ERROR:fs-rtp-discover-codecs.c:127:debug_codec_cap: assertion failed" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
[15:10] <Laney> debian has that already
[15:11] <Laney> should be a simple merge
[15:11] <seb128> great
[15:11] <seb128> Laney, and I think that was for things I can think about ;-)
[15:13] <Sweetshark> jibel: btw, thanks for unblocking http://people.canonical.com/~j-lallement/libreoffice/binrepo/ -- it wasnt updating for quite a while by now there is a newer version uploaded.
[15:26] <attente> seb128, hey
[15:26] <attente> it was entirely my fault...
[15:27] <attente> https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/indicator-keyboard/lp1226962/+merge/190163 should fix it
[15:29] <attente> but media-keys shortcuts are still broken
[15:30] <seb128> attente, that doesn't really make sense to me, I'm pretty sure I didn't have indicator-keyboard running during my tests yesterday
[15:30] <seb128> attente, I had moved the .service away to make sure it was not started, and I renamed ibus-daemon as well
[15:30] <seb128> to rule those out
[15:31] <seb128> attente, let me try anyway
[15:31] <seb128> attente, yeah, media-keys were already not working in raring, nor are they working in xfce, that's another topic
[15:32] <attente> seb128, i can take a second look at the g-s-d branch, try to figure out why it's only working under unity
[15:33] <seb128> attente, for the media keys?
[15:43] <seb128> hum
[15:43] <seb128> does lightdm/indicator-session keeps indicating users as logged in after they log out, for others as well?
[15:43] <seb128> e.g with the ">" next to the name
[15:47] <seb128> attente, ok, your vcs fixes the issue indeed
[15:47] <attente> seb128, under lightdm, there are no users in indicator-session for me
[15:47] <seb128> attente, is indicator-keyboard applying the config? (I still don't get why it was not working in my indicator-less session yesterday)
[15:47] <seb128> attente, oh, for lightdm I was speaking about the usernames on the main screen
[15:48] <seb128> they also have the ">"
[15:48] <attente> oh
[15:48] <seb128> but I've the same bug in indicator-session of my own user
[15:48] <seb128> e.g I use indicator-session to log into a test user, log out
[15:48] <seb128> the greeter shows a ">" next to "Testuser"
[15:48] <seb128> I log back into my session
[15:48] <attente> seb128, if i-keyboard wasn't running then i guess it still kept the old xprop value
[15:49] <seb128> and indicator session has a checkmark next to Testuser
[15:49] <Laney> does it show in loginctl?
[15:49] <seb128> Laney, yes
[15:49] <seb128> wth :/
[15:50] <Laney> could be a logind bug or lightdm not ending the session properly I guess
[15:50] <seb128>           CGroup: systemd:/user/1002.user
[15:50] <seb128>                   └─c6.session
[15:50] <seb128>                     ├─ 2464 /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/indicator-sound/indicator-sound-service
[15:50] <seb128>                     ├─ 2482 /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/indicator-bluetooth/indicator-bluetooth-service...
[15:50] <seb128>                     ├─32559 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --start --log-target=syslog
[15:50] <seb128>                     └─32578 /usr/lib/pulseaudio/pulse/gconf-helper
[15:50] <seb128>            State: closing
[15:51] <seb128> leftover processes
[15:51] <seb128> (that's from "loginctl user-status Testuser")
[16:00] <seb128> charles, larsu: ^ do you have any idea why the sound and bluetooth indicator keep running after sessions end?
[16:53] <tkamppeter> jasoncwarner, hi
[18:15] <larsu> seb128: no clue. the session should SIGTERM them when it quits. Is this with the new upstart stuff?
[18:26] <popey> Hmm. my unity session seems broken today. rebooted and my mouse cursor doesn't appear, then eventually it does..
[18:26] <popey> [   89.820980] dbus-daemon[3776]: segfault at 10 ip<PHONE_NUMBER>408057 sp 00007fff951ac2d0 error 4 in dbus-daemon[400000+64000]
[18:26] <popey> that doesn't look good
[18:34] <popey> bug 1237573
[18:34] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1237573 in unity (Ubuntu) "Desktop unusable. Can't click on anything in unity." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1237573
[18:45] <seb128> larsu, no, it's not upstart, and no, gnome-session doesn't do that to what is running
[18:45] <seb128> larsu, gnome-session basically exit, which makes stuff it spawned exit, and most of stuff just go down when xorg and dbus exit
[18:46] <seb128> larsu, but yeah, that issue is not new, we had it with e-d-s gvfs and other stuff for ever
[18:47] <seb128> the only thing gnome-session does is to use the xorg libsm (or whatever it's called) to tell software that the session is ending
[18:49] <larsu> seb128: hm, so who terminates those processes then? dbus?
[18:49] <seb128> larsu, nothing, that's the issue
[18:50] <seb128> larsu, they usually go away because dbus go away and they don't like it and exit
[18:50] <seb128> larsu, or they use the libsm stuff and respond to session closing by exiting
[18:50] <seb128> that's something the cgroup session stuff would resolve
[18:51] <seb128> if it wouldn't lead to close your screen sessions as well
[18:51] <larsu> hm
[18:51] <larsu> I'm confused
[18:51] <larsu> why doesn't this happen with the other indicators?
[18:51] <seb128> that's a good question... session closing details are out of my understanding
[18:52] <larsu> mine too. Let's ask an expoert
[18:52] <larsu> desrt: ^^
[18:54] <desrt> the session goes down in two ways, traditionally:
[18:54] <desrt>  - processes die because they're unhappy that X went away
[18:54] <desrt>  - processes die because they're unhappy that dbus went away
[18:54] <desrt> there is no implicit killing of processes by the kernel just because gnome-session died
[18:55] <desrt> and it's currently quite easy for a process to remain around after the session quits just by backgrounding itself and not exiting when dbus dies
[18:56] <larsu> hm, looks indicator-sound stops when the bus goes away...
[18:56] <larsu> desrt: thanks
[18:58] <seb128> larsu, that's basically what I was saying...
[18:58] <desrt> seb128: fun thread on gtk-devel right now, if you want to pile on...
[18:59] <seb128> desrt, "Removal of icons in buttons/menus"?
[18:59] <desrt> ya
[18:59] <larsu> seb128: no, I'm saying it does stop. It quits its main loop as soo as it loses the bus name
[18:59] <larsu> which happens when the connection dies, too
[18:59] <seb128> desrt, looking at who commited... not surprised
[19:00] <larsu> didn't we remove those a long time ago?
[19:00] <seb128> desrt, well, anyway, those are one of the reason I want to stay on 3.8 a bit longer
[19:00] <desrt> seb128: if this is our reason for not taking new gtk versions, maybe you should say as much
[19:00] <desrt> to the list, not to me.
[19:00] <seb128> desrt, well, I feel like that if that's their choices/way to go, it's their call
[19:01] <larsu> ah, the _option_ got removed
[19:01] <seb128> desrt, but I want to avoid to controversy for the LTS and have a longer cycle to deal with the side effects/complains
[19:01] <desrt> seb128: and it's your call as to which gtk version we ship.  providing rationale for our decision-making to the upstream is just an FYI.
[19:02] <seb128> desrt, yeah, I'm going to reply tomorrow, let's wait a bit for thing to settle/think about how to write it
[19:03] <seb128> larsu, https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/log/?qt=grep&q=Deprecate+and+ignore
[19:03] <seb128> larsu, do you see some name coming often in there?
[19:04] <larsu> seb128: lol!
[19:06] <seb128> larsu, ;-)
[19:06] <desrt> be nice
[19:10] <seb128> yeah
[19:11] <seb128> larsu, btw since you are around, what's the status on the "don't display a sound notfication when using the hardware buttons on touch"?
[19:11] <seb128> larsu, that keeps coming back my way, I would appreciate if there is a merge request up this week
[19:13] <larsu> seb128: I have a fix in https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/indicator-sound/volume-action-activation
[19:13] <larsu> seb128: but it breaks the volume slider on the phone (not on the desktop though)
[19:14] <seb128> larsu, yeah, I pointed that out on the bug, but it's not proposed so "not ready to land"
[19:14] <seb128> oh? why?
[19:14] <larsu> seb128: I don't know... that's why I haven't MRed it yet. I've asked dednick to have a look. If he doesn't have time and I can't find it tomorrow, I'll fix it differently.
[19:15] <larsu> seb128: I'll have a fix by tomorrow evening in any case. It will need a small patch to unity8 as well
[19:16] <seb128> larsu, can't we just make that code be called only in the desktop profile? (</naive question>)
[19:18] <larsu> seb128: sadly no, the same actions are used on both. I've fixed it now by overloading an existing action, but I can also just add a new one for the phone
[19:19] <larsu> seb128: which feels hacky, but will be my "other" fix if I can't figure the right one out
[19:25] <dednick> larsu: did you get my comments from earlier about unitymenumodel?
[19:27] <larsu> dednick: I don't think so - there were a lot of pings, I might have missed some further up
[19:27] <dednick> larsu: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6213854/
[19:27] <dednick> action_target and parameter_type need to be the same.
[19:28] <dednick> otherwise we dont even fetch the state.
[19:29] <bigon> pitti: hey, do you still have any plans to do an upload for libgphoto2 in debian?
[19:29] <larsu> dednick: ah cool, thanks! I totally didn't think about that
[19:29] <larsu> dednick: "this is not a standard menu item, so target doesn't apply". I thought wrong I guess...
[19:30] <larsu> seb128: ^^ I'll have a fix tomorrow. Gotta pack and sleep now :)
[19:30] <seb128> larsu, have a good night and safe trip tomorrow!
[19:30] <dednick> larsu: :) cool. cya
[19:30] <seb128> larsu, when do you leave/flight?
[19:32] <larsu> seb128: I leave at ~4:30 for a 6:40 flight
[19:32] <larsu> am :(
[19:33] <larsu> will be in Montral (via Brussels) at 12:30
[19:33] <larsu> *Montréal
[19:33] <ogra_> at least you leave that crappy weather behind
[19:33]  * bigon also goes to Montréal
[19:34] <larsu> ogra_: yes!
[19:34] <larsu> bigon: awesome!
[19:34] <larsu> Montreal summit as well?
[19:34] <bigon> yes, I just bought my plane tickets an hour ago
[19:34] <bigon> yes + visit some friends
[19:35] <bigon> from Friday to the next Friday
[19:35] <larsu> how spontaneous :)
[19:35] <larsu> cool, we'll be there for the full week as well
[19:36] <bigon> well I was thinking about this for some times now
[19:37] <bigon> I really need to be away from work for some days :p
[19:37] <seb128> larsu, ok, not seeing you tomorrow morning then!
[19:37] <seb128> larsu, have a safe flight, and good luck trying to sleep/get up so early
[19:37] <larsu> seb128: thanks!
[19:38] <larsu> seb128: I'll check in from Brussels, but that will be ~8:30 or so
[19:38] <larsu> might be a bit early still :)
[19:38] <seb128> larsu, yeah, for sure
[19:39]  * bigon is doing BRU -> CDG -> YUL
[19:40] <larsu> bigon: ha, too bad, we could have been on the same flight (I'm TXL->BRU->YUL)
[19:40] <larsu> but I guess that probably wasn't available / expensive at this time
[19:40] <larsu> anyway, I'm off. See you!
[19:41] <seb128> larsu, night!
[19:57] <attente> seb128, you said the language switching worked for you on the device?
[19:58] <seb128> attente, yes
[19:58] <seb128> attente, we seeded some langpacks, that works for those (well, after rebooting)
[19:58] <attente> i'm getting authentication problems
[19:58] <seb128> oh?
[19:58] <attente> "(process:25873): AccountsService-WARNING **: SetLanguage call failed: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.Accounts.Error.PermissionDenied: Not authorized"
[19:58] <seb128> how do you run system-settings?
[19:58] <seb128> from the device?
[19:59] <attente> yes, as phablet, i do:
[19:59] <attente> /usr/bin/system-settings --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/ubuntu-system-settings.desktop --stage_hint=main_stage
[19:59] <seb128> attente, how do you get "as phablet"?
[19:59] <attente> su - phablet
[19:59] <seb128> hum
[19:59] <seb128> let me try
[20:00] <attente> how are you normally running it?
[20:00] <seb128> I usually test from the device itself
[20:00] <attente> oh, through the ui?
[20:00] <seb128> e.g unlock
[20:00] <seb128> click on the icon on the top left
[20:00] <seb128> type "settings"
[20:00] <seb128> click on the settings icon
[20:00] <seb128> yes
[20:01] <Laney> t source accountsservice
[20:01] <Laney> oops
[20:01]  * Laney was trying to secretly get the source to see what the pk action is :P
[20:01] <seb128> lol
[20:02] <seb128> attente, I can confirm your issue from an adb shell start
[20:02] <seb128> attente, if you need debug, you can start from the device and read ~/.cache/upstart/unity8.log
[20:02] <seb128> that's the process that spawn it and that gets the output
[20:04] <attente> ok, thanks seb128
[20:04] <seb128> yw:
[20:04] <seb128> !
[20:05]  * desrt is not super happy about this seemingly new cool thing to put logs in ~/.cache/
[20:05] <seb128> desrt, what would you put it?
[20:05] <desrt> not .cache
[20:05] <desrt> maybe the journal? :)
[20:06]  * seb128 slaps desrt
[20:06] <seb128> desrt, I though .cache was "should be fine to wipe out"
[20:06] <seb128> which is true for log
[20:06] <desrt> no...
[20:06] <desrt> (and no...)
[20:07] <desrt> the spec is not very thorough about what it says.  only "user-specific non-essential data"
[20:07] <seb128> that matches the logs definition
[20:07] <desrt> but i see it as "data that can be replaced at a cost, either by downloading or recomputing"
[20:08] <desrt> ie: fitting the more traditional definition of browser cache, thumbnail cache, etc.
[20:08] <seb128> that's your understanding of that statement it seems... ;-)
[20:08] <desrt> logs are not "fine to wipe out"
[20:09] <desrt> at least not under all circumstances
[20:10] <seb128> where would you recommend storing those?
[20:11] <desrt> i honestly think the journal (or equivalent) is a good answer
[20:11] <seb128> the journal is an abstract concept
[20:11] <desrt> and i just noticed that the other thing that i hated for doing this (gdm) has indeed started to do that instead
[20:11] <seb128> it does store its datas somewhere
[20:11] <seb128> you are just shifting the blame
[20:11] <desrt> it stores it in /var/log
[20:11] <seb128> ok
[20:11] <desrt> which is, indisputably, where logs belong
[20:12] <seb128> so /var/log/<user> would be our call
[20:12] <desrt> ya.  that would be better, i suppose.
[20:12] <seb128> which would work for me...
[20:12] <seb128> though I doubt in practice it creates lot of issues
[20:13] <desrt> i think given that, plus the xdg runtime dir, i could expand my idea of "no dconf writes on login" to "no homedir writes on login" :)
[20:13] <seb128> usually most users don't care about lot and they never clear .cache
[20:13] <seb128> lot->logs
[20:13]  * desrt cares very deeply about .cache
[20:13] <seb128> I said "users" :p
[20:13] <desrt> nod
[20:13]  * desrt is being excessively idealistic here
[20:13] <seb128> yeah, same as /etc use ;-)
[20:13] <desrt> but i don't like to see things progressing backwards, which we seem to be doing in this case
[20:14] <desrt> for lack of the journal, /var/log/<user>/ would be a neat idea
[20:14] <desrt> i guess rather /var/log/user/<user>/
[20:15] <desrt> time for XDG_LOG_DIR!!
[20:15] <seb128> yeah, that would work for me as well
[20:15] <seb128> lol
[20:16] <seb128> on that note, /me drops offline
[20:16] <seb128> have a good night everyone!
[20:16] <desrt> seb128: talk to you tomorrow.  good night.
[20:16] <seb128> thanks, you too ;-)


[00:54] <tsimonq2> *yawn* woke up from nap, been told Y has a name, then I have some homework, so maybe later but no promises, I have a lot of homework
[20:45] <tsimonq2> pleia2: I'll work on making sure that the articles are good on the document, then all you have to do is check over and send out to summary writers
[20:45] <tsimonq2> good meaning present
[22:36] <pleia2> tsimonq2: can you add articles from the planet? else I'll take care of it
[22:36] <pleia2> but I'm collecting other news, and have a ton else on my plate tonight
[22:46] <tsimonq2> k there
[22:49] <tsimonq2> pleia2: flavor release announcements - where do those go?
[22:50] <tsimonq2> pleia2: with general news maybe?
[22:50] <pleia2> tsimonq2: official ones from the flavors themselves? we don't typically put them in
[22:51] <tsimonq2> pleia2: oh? why not, just curious?
[22:51] <pleia2> tsimonq2: I recommend searching through the archives for the last UWN that had a release in it to see how we've done things
[22:51] <tsimonq2> pleia2: alright I'll do that, thank you
[22:51] <pleia2> tsimonq2: not all flavors have them, some are delayed or hard to link to, it ends up looking messy and incomplete
[22:51] <tsimonq2> alright
[22:52]  * tsimonq2 is just a little biased because I wrote the Lubuntu one, but makes total sense :)
[22:53] <pleia2> yeah, I'm usually involved with writing the Xubuntu one
[22:54] <tsimonq2> but I wrote it all myself the night before ;)
[22:54] <tsimonq2> (not smart, but I was tasked :P)
[22:54] <pleia2> happens all the time
[22:58] <tsimonq2> pleia2: https://s3hh.wordpress.com/2016/04/20/lxd-image-updates/ good for planet? thought I'd double-check with you.
[22:59] <pleia2> tsimonq2: too distracted right now, want to just add it and I'll sort through them later? feel free to leave a comment saying you're not sure about it so I can pay particular attention :)
[22:59] <tsimonq2> alright, that's fine pleia2 :)
[23:00] <pleia2> thank you
[23:16] <tsimonq2> planet links done, collecting general release articles


[00:12] <jk_> After a battery failure in my UPS and consequent sudden shutdown, I'm having problems with the mouse and also with a couple of panel plugins. I'm fairly certain that several sectors on the disk were corrupted, but so far haven't found them.
[00:15] <jk_> Right now, a log-out/log-in sometimes gets me a frozen system with two of the keyboard LEDs blinking. I can eventually get back in by forcing power off, re-starting in recovery mode, and looking around in root mode for a while before resuming normal boot. My question is "How can I diagnose this problem?"
[00:17] <jk_> Additional info: The login gets as far as displaying the XFCE splash screen before freezing. The system is 12.04.2 64-bit and I've purged all saved session files from the time of the incident.
[02:11] <cones> lost my terminal in 12.10 and only can open from a script on the desktop, how do i set the default one?
[02:20] <nerdtron> cones what do you mean you lost the terminal?
[02:24] <cones> well i just figured it out, and lost by can't launch it with keyboard shortcut or in the start menu
[03:18] <Matthew_Moore> Anyone here?
[07:18] <infamy> Man
[07:18] <infamy> I gotta say
[07:18] <infamy> I am most impressed with the new Xubuntu
[07:19] <infamy> It does everything windows did for me that I need
[07:19] <infamy> and more
[07:19] <infamy> I dunno who to say that to, but there it is
[07:20] <infamy> I just have one question. How do I make VLC media player my default media player?
[07:20] <infamy> As of now I have to right click and "Open with..."
[07:22] <TheSheep> you can right-click the file you want, select 'properties' then change the 'open with' selection
[07:22] <infamy> TheSheep: let me try that, sec
[07:23] <infamy> That did it
[07:23] <infamy> thanks
[07:39] <HisaoNakai> infamy: seconded :)
[07:45] <MrHotsauce> vlc is nice but have you tried audacious?
[07:50] <baizon> my recommendations: Video - SMPlayer, Audio - Exaile or Clementine
[07:53] <TheSheep> !best | baizon MrHotsauce
[07:53] <baizon> thats why this are my personal :P
[07:54] <koegs> try to show a video with audacious :)
[08:06] <bazhang> !players
[08:11] <xubuntu680> Hi all, I installed Xubuntu 13.04, and since that, I can not reproduce any soundf
[08:11] <xubuntu680> do you have these problems?
[08:12] <xubuntu680> how could I solve it?
[08:14] <TheSheep> !sound
[08:19] <xubuntu680> Thanks, in Xubuntu I cannot find, where I can open the Audio Preferences
[08:19] <xubuntu680> I only can see the icon on the "taskbar", next to the clock
[08:22] <well_laid_lawn> right click it
[08:28] <xubuntu018> Hi, I reboot my machine, so I lost my nick
[08:28] <xubuntu018> but I can not find the audio settings
[08:30] <TheSheep> xubuntu018: you can just start 'xfce4-mixer' in a terminal
[08:31] <xubuntu018> not installed :'(
[08:31] <xubuntu018> so I try to install it
[08:31] <xubuntu018> maybe it gives me more ways to configure the sound
[08:34] <xubuntu018> I have selected my soundcard SB5.1 (quite old), and not the internal one
[08:34] <xubuntu018> so I reboot trying to get some results
[08:35] <TheSheep> xubuntu018: you can also try 'pavucontrol'
[08:35] <xubuntu018> ok, I try
[08:35] <xubuntu018> thanks
[08:35] <TheSheep> if you have more sound cards, use 'padevchooser'
[08:35] <xubuntu018> but any idea what should I change?
[08:37] <TheSheep> for a start, try to unmute any muted channels
[08:38] <TheSheep> how are you testing for the sound?
[08:41] <xubuntu018> playing youtube
[08:42] <xubuntu018> aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Front_Center.wav
[08:42] <xubuntu018> but none of them work
[08:43] <xubuntu018> I'm restarting again, I come back in 2 minutes
[08:45] <wanchope11> I'm back "TheSheep"
[08:45] <wanchope11> i was xubuntu018
[08:46] <wanchope11> but nothing works
[08:49] <TheSheep> wanchope11: I don't think constant restarting will fix anything
[08:51] <wanchope11> you are right but I'm trying to change some things, which I read in forums
[08:51] <wanchope11> but none of them works
[08:51] <bekks> Which things?
[08:51] <wanchope11> because of that I restart each time :)
[08:52] <wanchope11> for example http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=983723
[08:52] <wanchope11> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SoundTroubleshooting
[08:53] <TheSheep> where do they say to restart?
[08:54] <wanchope11> actually in these websites, they don't say to restart
[08:54] <wanchope11> I have close some others forums...
[08:54] <wanchope11> but in ALSAMIXER, which sound card should appear at the beginning?
[08:54] <bekks> Then wgy did you restart, if noone tells you to? :)
[08:55] <TheSheep> how many sound cards do you have in your computer?
[08:55] <wanchope11> only 1
[08:55] <wanchope11> but I guess there is another one in the base
[08:56] <bekks> Why do you guess that=
[08:56] <bekks> Did you check it?
[08:56] <wanchope11> how can I check that?
[08:56] <bekks> lspci
[08:56] <wanchope11> when I open the ALSAMIXER, appears SiS SIK7012
[08:57] <wanchope11> 00:02.7 Multimedia audio controller: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] SiS7012 AC'97 Sound Controller (rev a0) 00:0b.0 Multimedia audio controller: Creative Labs SB Live! EMU10k1 (rev 0a)
[08:57] <bekks> !pastebin | wanchope11
[08:58] <xubuntu345> hi, all!
[08:59] <wanchope11> 00:02.7 Multimedia audio controller: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] SiS7012 AC'97 Sound Controller (rev a0)
[08:59] <wanchope11> 00:0b.0 Multimedia audio controller: Creative Labs SB Live! EMU10k1 (rev 0a)
[09:00] <bekks> Dont paste it to this channel, use a pastebin, thank you :)
[09:00] <wanchope11> sorry
[09:00] <wanchope11> I have never used pastebin
[09:01] <bekks> Then use it now, for the first time :)
[09:01] <wanchope11> so, I have 2 soundcards, the integrated one, and the SB
[09:01] <wanchope11> :)))
[09:05] <TheSheep> wanchope11: in pavucontrol you can switch which one is to be used
[09:05] <TheSheep> wanchope11: in the Output Devices tab
[09:10] <wanchope11> TheSheep I do not see any place to select the soundcard,  I canonly  select: "Analogic output - Amplified" "Analogic output . not amplified"...
[09:11] <TheSheep> wanchope11: there are green checkbox buttons next to them
[09:12] <wanchope11> no, there are not checkbuttons in my pavucontrol
[09:13] <TheSheep> can you upload a screenshot somewhere?
[09:13] <wanchope11> yes... any idea where?
[09:13] <TheSheep> imgur?
[09:14] <TheSheep> http://jan.newmarch.name/LinuxSound/Sampled/PulseAudio/images/pavucontrol.png <-- should be something like this
[09:14] <TheSheep> and the buttons with the green circles are what you want
[09:14] <TheSheep> they select the default device to use
[09:14] <TheSheep> (also make sure it's not muted)
[09:15] <wanchope11> ok!
[09:15] <wanchope11> i found it
[09:16] <wanchope11> I had to select the correct device (sound card) and the correcto configuration
[09:16] <wanchope11> and now it works
[09:16] <TheSheep> \o/
[09:16] <wanchope11> yeah!
[09:16] <wanchope11> thank you guys!
[11:49] <Guest15965> hi
[11:49] <bgardner> Guest15965: Hello
[11:49] <Guest15965> i have just installed xubuntu, i can surf internet but the wifi menu is not showing any wifi network, how can i fix it?
[11:50] <Guest15965> bgardner, hi :)
[11:51] <cfhowlett> Guest15965, right click on the panel >properties > add new items
[11:52] <Guest15965> cfhowlett, i did, i added one of my two wifi networks but still it is not appearing in the list
[11:53] <cfhowlett> Guest15965, clarify: no wifi menu or no wifi network listed on the menu
[11:54] <Guest15965> cfhowlett, the two arrows of wifi is appearing on the top panel, when i click on that icon, a drop down list appears and in that list there is no wifi network is appearing
[11:54] <cfhowlett> Guest15965, but you can get online?  weird
[11:55] <cfhowlett> Guest15965, is it a hidden wifi network?  NO netorks showing or just not that one ...
[11:56] <Guest15965> cfhowlett, its not hidden, xubuntu automtically connects to that wifi which i added but the list is not showing any network
[11:58] <cfhowlett> Guest15965, as it does successfully connect, I'm inclined to believe there's a setting that's hiding the networks.  Just a guess.  Sorry, can't offer any guidance beyond that ...
[11:59] <Guest15965> cfhowlett, hmm, i have installed xubuntu from minimal-iso, may be some required package is missing!!
[12:00] <cfhowlett> Guest15965, possible I guess ... sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade may pull it in ...
[12:00] <Guest15965> cfhowlett, ok, let me try it :) thanks
[15:18] <xubuntu070> Hello
[15:19] <xubuntu070> Anyone know how I can connect my Canon MP480 printer/scanner using Xubuntu 12.04 precise?
[15:20] <GridCube> plug it in?
[15:22] <xubuntu070> It says that driver is missing.
[15:23] <GridCube> ok, from a terminal copy the relevant result of lsusb
[15:23] <GridCube> perticularly the part that says "canon"
[15:24] <howefield> n old thread, but seems to work for someone : http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1166715
[15:25] <GridCube> https://sites.google.com/site/tipsandtricksforubuntu/printer-info/canon-drivers
[15:27] <xubuntu070> thanks, I will try...
[15:56] <xubuntu070> Well, I have it printing now, but cannot scan.  It's a step in the right direction. thanks.
[15:59] <Poisoned_Dragon> I dislike all in one printers
[15:59] <Poisoned_Dragon> too many issues with function.
[16:16] <ffio> how can i install xfce on ubuntu without xubuntu artwork ?
[16:17] <holstein> ffio: just install xfce4 and not xubuntu
[16:17] <holstein> !purexfce
[16:17] <holstein> ^^ might help point you in the "right" direction
[16:18] <Sysi> that's different, it's for making pure xubuntu system
[16:42] <ffio> holstein: i need pure xfce system not xubuntu-desktop.
[16:42] <ffio> Sysi: any idea how can i do that ?
[16:43] <Sysi> install xfce4, not xubuntu-desktop
[16:43] <Sysi> or if you have xubuntu-desktop, select xfce-session instead of xubuntu one
[16:43] <Sysi> I recommend setting whatever suits tourself though
[16:45] <ffio> i don't have xubuntu installed.
[16:45] <ffio> so installing xfc4 :)
[16:46] <ffio> Sysi: any idea about kde ?
[16:46] <ffio> would that be kde10 or something like that, just a wild guess
[16:46] <ffio> kde4 may be
[16:49] <ffio> Sysi: thanks this is what i was looking for
[17:11] <Sysi> ffio: kubuntu doesn't personalize KDE, it's shipped vanilla AFAIK
[17:47] <xubuntu598> Hello, good afternoo eveyone
[17:48] <bekks> hi
[17:48] <xubuntu598> I have an urgent issue with 12.04 LTS
[17:48] <xubuntu598> I installed 12.04 LTS on Dell M4500, it won't boot
[17:48] <bekks> So what happens after the BIOS screen?
[17:49] <xubuntu598> it hangs on the DELL
[17:49] <xubuntu598> it hangs after the boot screen Dell logo
[17:49] <bekks> Is there something on the screen?
[17:49] <pmjdebruijn> xubuntu216: did you install using 12.04.2 media?
[17:50] <xubuntu216> Hi - I need to remove xubunto from my hard drive (need to get it back into original state due to sale).
[17:50] <xubuntu598> Yes, I download and burn it on a DVD
[17:50] <pmjdebruijn> also, is the system in UEFI or Legacy BIOS mode
[17:50] <xubuntu216> how do I do that
[17:50] <bekks> xubuntu216: Reinstall another OS, or remove the ubuntu partitions using a live CD.
[17:50] <xubuntu598> OK, that I did not check. UEFI or Legacy make difference??
[17:51] <xubuntu216> I dont have cd drive in my x220
[17:51] <bekks> xubuntu216: Then you have to create an USB boot medium.
[17:51] <pmjdebruijn> xubuntu598: of course it does, you should probably be in Legacy BIOS mode
[17:51] <xubuntu216> but think that the xubuntu loader sqrewed my recovery option
[17:51] <pmjdebruijn> xubuntu216: only if you've asked it too
[17:51] <xubuntu598> OK, I will try USB media
[17:52] <xubuntu216> ok - thanks - I will try the usb way
[17:52] <pmjdebruijn> xubuntu598: with 12.04.2 UEFI could work too, but considering UEFI support is still fairly new, so Legacy BIOS mode is generally most robust
[17:54] <xubuntu598> pmjdebruijn: since the labtop is with default DELL settings, the last install was in Legacy BIOS mode
[17:55] <xubuntu598> pmjdebruijn: other than BIOS mode, any other tips? Could this be the laptop issue or software issue?
[17:55] <pmjdebruijn> xubuntu598: I don't know what Dell's defaults are... don't make any assumptions... verify it
[17:56] <pmjdebruijn> xubuntu598: keep in mind that Xubuntu LTS tends to lag a bit behind in hardware support, so you might want to try 13.04 then
[17:56] <xubuntu598> pmjdebruijn: OK, will do, thanks
[17:56] <pmjdebruijn> buying really bleeding edge hardware typically isn't a great idea if you want to stick with an LTS release
[17:57] <pmjdebruijn> but I think xubuntu even slightly behind on regular ubuntu lts (which defaults to the quantal hardware enablement stack now)
[17:59] <xubuntu598> pmjdebruijn: Thanks! Have a good day
[19:53] <ransom> anyone have any trouble with software updater on 13.04?
[19:53] <ransom> after i type in my root password and hit "ok" when it tells me it's going to update from so-and-so
[19:53] <ransom> nothing
[19:55] <bekks> Why do you have a root password set?
[20:09] <Shane_> I need help installing xubuntu, I've just set up a RAID 1 array via the built in Intel RAID controller.   --  Using low-level tools, did you check if your RAID 1 works all right?
[20:34] <ransom> bekks, well i mean when it just asks you to input your password
[20:35] <ransom> misspoke
[20:40] <Shane_> My RAID controller is an Intel Matrix Storage Manager or "Intel RAID Option ROM utility."  The manual for the computer (Dell T3400) says it should be able to create RAID arrays, and it instructs you on how to do so.
[20:42] <Shane_> I have not tested it using low-level tools (not sure what that is), also why is it a fake RAID controller?
[20:43] <bekks> Those mainboard-onboard controllers do support RAID - using Windows drivers.
[20:43] <bekks> And without Windows, you cant use them. Thats why they are fake-RAID controllers.
[20:44] <bekks> The Dell T-Series do not have a hardware RAID controller.
[20:46] <Shane_> Ok, next question.  Would a PCIe RAID controller be as fast as a motherboard controller?
[20:47] <w30> wonderfull, I remember Win modems now we have Win raid ..duh
[20:49] <bekks> Shane_: More fast.
[20:49] <bekks> :P
[20:50] <bekks> Shane_: Those onboard stuff is connected using PCI mostly, while PCIe is faster.
[20:53] <Shane_> If I do get a PCIe controller, will I configure that in BIOS?
[20:53] <bekks> You need a PCIe hardware raid controller.
[20:54] <bekks> And it will ship its own BIOS - and a manual :)
[20:54] <Shane_> Ok, thanks a lot Bekks.  Have a good day!
[21:31] <Psil0Cybin> hey guys quick question
[21:32] <Psil0Cybin> has anyone figured out how to change the xscreensaver logo
[21:32] <Psil0Cybin> i know the owner asked us not to change it, but i need to for a company computer
[21:33] <bekks> So the copyright owner refused to permit the change?
[21:40] <Psil0Cybin> Well said that the logo is the identity of the software
[21:40] <Psil0Cybin> but also stated the software is open source
[21:41] <Psil0Cybin> its the xscreensaver logo when u have a login after a screensaver
[21:41] <Psil0Cybin> on the left is a fire beside a computer i want to change it to a Biohazard sign or osmething
[22:03] <holstein> Psil0Cybin: why not use another screen saver and/or screen locker?
[22:06] <Psil0Cybin> holstein, i like that xscreensaver lets me see the matrix screensaver
[22:06] <Psil0Cybin> which i changed to show binary numbers
[22:06] <Psil0Cybin> im in love with that
[22:06] <Psil0Cybin> i just want to be able to theme the lock box the same way
[22:06] <Psil0Cybin> >.<
[22:07] <holstein> i dont know what you are talking about, as far as not being able to change that.. if its open, you can fork it.. dont see how that cant be "ok"


[15:08] <waseidel> hi there!!
[15:08] <waseidel> it's me again with the trouble with wiki.ubuntu.com i need to recover my user WaSeidel at this wiki please somebody help me
[15:34] <waseidel> i have a trouble with wiki.ubuntu.com i need to recover my user WaSeidel at this wiki please somebody help me
[15:42] <waseidel> hi there
[17:36] <WaSeidel> hi there, i have a trouble with wiki.ubuntu.com i need to recover my user WaSeidel at this wiki please somebody help me
[18:04] <jpds> WaSeidel: What problem do you have/
[18:04] <jpds> WaSeidel: It should all be done via OpenID.
[18:05] <WaSeidel> uhh sorry, ok my problem it's the following (too large i write slow wait please)
[18:07] <WaSeidel> I created my user WaSeidel when open ID was not integrated to wiki.ubuntu.com but by problems that i was, i have to disconnect myself from the internet about a year or a little more, when i come in again to the internet world i was wanting to reclaim all my accounts and users at the internet (my nickname in everyplace is WaSeidel) and when i get connected to wiki.ubuntu.com i see this was integrated to launchpad
[18:09] <WaSeidel> and when i try to log in it ask me for my user in launchpad but when i entered the user it shows me my old username on wiki.ubuntu.com and it tells me it's allready taken that i have to enter my old password i write it but it doesn't let me to log in
[18:09] <WaSeidel> i click in "forgot your password" and it sends to my mail a link to restablish my password but from launchpad
[18:14] <WaSeidel> jpds, that it's my problem
[18:16] <jpds> WaSeidel: Ah, you mean your wiki names on Launchpad?
[18:16] <WaSeidel> no, my wiki username on wiki.ubuntu.com
[18:16] <jpds> Yeah, that will be your real name as set on Launchpad.
[18:17] <WaSeidel> aha
[18:18] <WaSeidel> because https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Waseidel it's my wiki (wait i'll be back in 5 minutes)
[18:20] <jpds> With the new Launchpad intregration, people will see your FirstName LastName in edit logs and stuff.
[18:20] <jpds> And this will have links to you Launchpad account.
[18:20] <jpds> Which you can list your wiki page on as you have.
[18:20] <WaSeidel> but i can't log in to wiki.ubuntu.com
[18:20] <WaSeidel> and the user waseidel it's my username
[18:21] <jpds> WaSeidel: From https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Home?action=login ?
[18:23] <WaSeidel> sorry if i can't explain me the trouble it's i have the account too much before to this integration and when the integration comes i wasn't here to make it now when i'm trying to do it i can't, because for some reason in my account the password doesn't work
[18:24] <WaSeidel> i mean my old password doesn't work
[18:24] <jpds> Yep, and the old login system is gone.
[18:24] <jpds> You have to use OpenID.
[18:25] <WaSeidel> jpds, i do but it still asking me for my old password to integrate my account
[18:25] <jpds> You can't?
[18:25] <WaSeidel> i log in to launch pad
[18:26] <jpds> I think that the account→launchpad linking was done in the transition.
[18:26] <WaSeidel> but then it say's me this "The username you have chosen is already taken. If it is your username, enter your password below to associate the username with your OpenID. Otherwise, please choose a different username and leave the password field blank."
[18:26] <jpds> Seriously? Never seen that before...
[18:26] <jpds> WaSeidel: Is that Launchpad or the Ubuntu telling you that?
[18:27] <WaSeidel> ubuntu
[18:27] <jpds> Sorry, don't know what the problem is there myself...
[18:27] <WaSeidel> jpds, that's because i created my wiki.ubuntu.com so long ago
[18:28] <jpds> WaSeidel: I know what your problem is, I don't know how to fix it.
[18:29] <WaSeidel> all i need its to if its possible to delete that "Waseidel" account and i create it again or if you want just send me a reminder of that password to my e-mail