[00:00] <Eickmeyer> I believe it was a new version of libc, so there was a LOT that had to be rebuild against it.
[00:00] <sirriffsalothp> *sigh* new install it is. Sorry for the idiotic questions, but I just have no idea with this stuff
[00:01] <Eickmeyer> Ha, no worries.
[00:02] <sirriffsalothp> Alright, doing a re-install, rofl
[00:02] <sirriffsalothp> I love the Pollock-style background you guys added by the way, it's sick
[00:03] <sirriffsalothp> Reinstall -->
[00:34] <sirriffsalothp> That was quick
[00:34] <sirriffsalothp> a-Compressor is now there, but now General MIDI is acting up
[00:35] <sirriffsalothp> The general midi plugin thingy that goes in a standard midi-track in ardour that is
[00:40] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I'm really going to miss Catia though... :)
[00:49] <Eickmeyer> sirriffsalothp: Carla has the exact same patchbay as Catia built-in.
[00:49] <Eickmeyer> The patchbay tab is identical to Catia.
[00:50] <Eickmeyer> Same code even.
[00:51] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: omg, there it is... lol
[00:51] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Any ideas on general midi in Ardour? ^
[00:52] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: without the repos I'll be missing some TAL-plugins though, and I'm having trouble finding out how to get them where they should be. Like tal-reverb III for instance
[00:54] <sirriffsalothp> This question might save you some time if there is an answe to it... I've been looking through the .ardour file for where ardour is trying to fetch my plugins from, so I know where to download and drop them into, but I'm having no luck working that out. How can I see where ardour is trying to get them from?
[00:54] <Eickmeyer> Well, you can always go to the actual repo and download them individually. Also, the Ubuntu Studio Backports has dragonfly-reverb.
[00:55] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I will use them, I swear. But I have to mixes that are 80% finished, once those are out of the way, I'll try to be religiously UB for a while, see how it goes
[00:55] <Eickmeyer> Ardour's preferences show where it looks for reverbs. I don't have my system up in front of me.
[00:55] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: yeah, but the ones in particular that are missing/made as inactive stubs, how can I tell where this one should be found?
[00:56] <Eickmeyer> sirriffsalothp: You can add them individually here: https://launchpad.net/~kxstudio-debian/+archive/ubuntu/plugins/+packages
[00:56] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: good idea for the repo-thing, thanks
[00:56] <Eickmeyer> Are you talking about the tap-lv2 packages?
[00:58] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I went here and fetched them, that would amount to the same, correct? https://kx.studio/Repositories:Plugins
[00:58] <sirriffsalothp> Again, sorry for wasting your time on this, I had no idea this would turn into such a wrench
[00:58] <Eickmeyer> Well, it comes from the same place.
[00:58] <sirriffsalothp> Nice
[00:58] <sirriffsalothp> tap..? hmm
[00:59] <sirriffsalothp> Nope, the tap-plugins are already installed
[00:59] <Eickmeyer> Looks like it's part of distrho-ports. I might have to look into packaging these.
[01:00] <Eickmeyer> This page you showed me is completely new since the last time I looked.
[01:00] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: you lost me now?
[01:00] <Eickmeyer> Sorry, was thinking aloud.
[01:00] <sirriffsalothp> You only saw the that kxstudio repo-page now..?
[01:00] <Eickmeyer> Either way, that page you linked shows where to get them.
[01:00] <sirriffsalothp> Yeah, working on it
[01:01] <Eickmeyer> I want these in Ubuntu. As long as they're open source, then they should be good.
[01:02] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: yeah, they're sweet plugins. We're making headway, the tal plugins are now in place
[01:03] <sirriffsalothp> That just leaves the General MIDI-synth (not that important for the moment), and, more importantly, this Graillon autotune I discovered
[01:03] <sirriffsalothp> It's pretty neat by the way, you might consider adding it as some of the autotunes you're sporting are very counter-intuitive for people who aren't accustomed to writing midi-notes et cetera
[01:04] <Eickmeyer> I'm just going to go through the page you showed me and cross-compile it against what's in the repos and figure out what I need to package.
[01:05] <sirriffsalothp> But this Graillon package I remember fetching gave three options for GNU/Lin, LV2, VST3 and VST... I can't remember which one I chose to use and where exactly I put it, that's why I wonder how I can check where ardour is expecting to find it
[01:05] <Eickmeyer> Why not install all 3?
[01:06] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I'm too stupid to understand where I should put them atm, lol
[01:06] <Eickmeyer> Uh... you don't. You install the .deb package like a normal deb package.
[01:06] <sirriffsalothp> It's not a .deb
[01:07] <Eickmeyer> Ohhhh....
[01:07] <sirriffsalothp> For Linux users:
[01:07] <sirriffsalothp> • Copy the LV2 plug-in in your LV2 directory
[01:07] <sirriffsalothp> • Copy the VST2 plug-in in your VST2 directory
[01:07] <Eickmeyer> Then ~/.lv2 ~/.vst
[01:07] <sirriffsalothp> • Copy the VST3 plug-in (a .vst3 directory) in your VST3 directory
[01:07] <Eickmeyer> ~/.vst3
[01:07] <sirriffsalothp> Hmm, okay, sec
[01:07] <sirriffsalothp> By the way, huge thanks for being so patient with me :P
[01:07] <Eickmeyer> No worries.
[01:08] <sirriffsalothp> I'm actually getting paid to do some mixing these days, so I can't risk something being f'ed up now with other peoples' tunes
[01:08] <Eickmeyer> Oh, absolutely!
[01:09] <sirriffsalothp> Needless to say, I'm not the one using the autotune for my vocals, a couple rappers requested it *uhuh*
[01:09] <sirriffsalothp> By the way, this august will be my 10th anniversary for using ubuntu studio (I think), you've been at it for as long as I can remember using ardour anyways
[01:10] <sirriffsalothp> So here's to you people, if any of you developer are in Norway, hit me up and I'll treat you some beers, lol
[01:10] <sirriffsalothp> developers*
[01:11] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: for the General MIDI Synth problem, this might solve it? https://x42-plugins.com/x42/x42-gmsynth
[01:11] <Eickmeyer> I think the closest might be Ross, and he's in Denmark
[01:11] <Eickmeyer> That's probably the one.
[01:14] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I imagine there have been loads in inquests like these, it's a shame I couldn't find any tutorials for those who have this kind of problem. I've gotten into making tutorial videos for friends on certain issues, and they tell me I should do more as they're easy to follow. If I made one that covers this, for those who were absolutely clueless as to how to solve this, would that be something you guys could slap out there somewhere
[01:14] <sirriffsalothp> for people to watch?
[01:14] <sirriffsalothp> loads of*
[01:15] <Eickmeyer> Yeah, I'd link it.
[01:16] <sirriffsalothp> Kay, I'll keep you posted
[01:16] <Eickmeyer> We need people making tutorial videos and doing documentation. It seems I can't find anybody to do stuff like that.
[01:16] <sirriffsalothp> I imagine it is boring, for the most part. But a tutorial-video on this would be a piece of cake, even for me.
[01:17] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: by the way, it seems I don't have any ~/.vst or .lv2 folders there :-S
[01:17] <Eickmeyer> Make them.
[01:17] <Eickmeyer> "mkdir ~/.lv2 && mkdir ~/.vst"
[01:18] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I just wonder if ardour will know to look there... hang on
[01:18] <sirriffsalothp> Since I do recall never making those folders to begin with
[01:18] <Eickmeyer> Yeah, they're not default folders.
[01:20] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: does ardour search recursively for them, or will they have to be just the file itself?
[01:20] <sirriffsalothp> Inside the .lv2 folder that is, for instance
[01:20] <Eickmeyer> Should be recursive.
[01:20] <sirriffsalothp> Mkay
[01:21] <Eickmeyer> https://manual.ardour.org/appendix/files-and-directories/
[01:21] <Eickmeyer> That explains everything.
[01:24] <sirriffsalothp> Huh, that solved it, for both the autotune and General Midi Synth
[01:25] <sirriffsalothp> I imagine a lot of people use the general midi synth, a lot of good samples there, might wanna add that to US?
[01:25] <Eickmeyer> Like I said, I want to add everything that's there to Studio.
[01:26] <Eickmeyer> I don't want anyone to have a reason to add KXStudio.
[01:26] <sirriffsalothp> Lol, nice. Feels good having contributed, but also probably saving myself a lot of time later down the road with this
[01:26] <Eickmeyer> I've been working on this for two years, but have had to stop for the LTS release. I'll probably startup again soon.
[01:27] <Eickmeyer> Now that I have the full Ubuntu Studio packageset, it will at least be easier to keep things updated.
[01:27] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: what's the "this" you speak of? Fixing this wrestle with kxstudio-repo issues?
[01:28] <Eickmeyer> Yep.
[01:29] <sirriffsalothp> Aight, I guess this was a prime example of some issues that doubtlessly will come up. I'll try opening all of my sessions if I have time and see what else might happen (unless it's an obvious fix from the website we saw, in which case I won't mention it)
[01:29] <Eickmeyer> Right. At least I can get people to the page to download the plugins they need.
[01:29] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I have some sessions with ideas floating around that were from back when Ardour was still in A2-A3... lol
[01:30] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: yeah, cheers
[01:30] <Eickmeyer> You too!
[01:30] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: while we're at it, what are your thoughts on the Enlightenment DE?
[01:30] <Eickmeyer> I've only messed around with it. Hard to take seriously as a full-fledged DE though.
[01:31] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: how come?
[01:31] <sirriffsalothp> I've loved it for a long time, but it does have issues that just seem to have stuck for ages..
[01:31] <Eickmeyer> Well, I don't know. I think part of it is it's not exaclty in Debian or Ubuntu, so that would mean packaging it myself, which also means I'd have to maintain a whole DE... *snowball*
[01:32] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: oh, rofl, I didn't mean as in "what do you think about using E in US", more just in general
[01:32] <Eickmeyer> Ohhh... yeah, it seems nice.
[01:37] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: kay, well now I can sleep tonight. Thanks again, man! I'll let you know once a comprehensive tutorial is on the way
[01:37] <Eickmeyer> Hehe, glad to help. :)
[01:40] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: wow, some of my biggest sessions (150 tracks) open up without fault. To think that all I needed were a few plugins fetched directly, and here I've been installing an entire repo that partly shreds my US.. lol
[01:40] <sirriffsalothp> Catch you later! :)
[01:42] <Eickmeyer> See ya!
[10:40] <AppAraat[m]> OvenWerks: One other thing I can try I guess is just upgrade to 20.04 and hope that solves the issue.
[10:41] <AppAraat[m]> Is it recommended to upgrade from 18.04 (obviously after uninstalling the extended support PPA), or to just do a clean install?
[10:42] <AppAraat[m]> I usually always wait until a .1 release of an Ubuntu LTS, but maybe this is my only option.
[14:51] <OvenWerks> AppAraat[m]: I can not really comment on the upgrade option. In my case I almost always do a fresh install. but Eickmeyer has done the upgrade with success. 20.04 is better than 18.04 so far as I can tell. I have been using it as my daily desk for over a month now. (Studio on to of kubuntu actually) I have not had any difficultys. However, my application uses may not be the same as your's. I do
[14:51] <OvenWerks> run jack as my back end, and have have run Ardour and some other audio apps.
[17:33] <AppAraat[m]> Hmm I see. I think I'll just do a clean install then to be sure.
[18:50] <AppAraat[m]> <aprt_test[m] "image.png"> It's interesting how the "Capture" level says "CAPTURE" with L and R above it in red, while here (where capture doesn't work) it's just stripes:
[18:50]  * AppAraat[m] uploaded an image: image.png (47KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/MJpgqGGaDjZAYlUsEPuQniUC >
[18:50] <AppAraat[m]> I wonder why that is, perhaps a certain module isn't loaded?
[18:51] <AppAraat[m]> hmm doubt - https://paste.debian.net/plain/1149592/
[18:57] <OvenWerks> mic boost doesn't help?
[18:59] <OvenWerks> Oh yeah that --- means it is turned off
[19:00] <OvenWerks> I can turn it on with qasmixer
[19:01] <OvenWerks> space bar should turn it on in alsamixer
[19:01] <OvenWerks> (shows how much I use alsamixer... I had to look it up)
[19:03] <OvenWerks> Also, looking at my HDA internal interface, it is three devices.
[19:05] <OvenWerks> So my HDA shows two inputs HDA,0,0 and HDA,2,0
[19:06] <OvenWerks> it also has two outputs: HDA,0,0 and HDA,1,0
[19:07] <OvenWerks> In the case of the output, HDA,1,0 is my digital output but with HDA,2,0 it is labeled as "Alt Analog".
[19:07] <OvenWerks> maybe one is front and the other is the rear
[19:09]  * OvenWerks doesn't actually ever use his internal audio aside from seeing it it can be connected to.
[19:09] <OvenWerks> I use a Delta 66 for all my audio.
[19:49] <AppAraat[m]> > space bar should turn it on in alsamixer
[19:49] <AppAraat[m]> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[19:49] <AppAraat[m]> OMFG!
[19:50] <AppAraat[m]> AUDACITY REGISTERS AUDIO FROM INTERNAL MIC WOOOOOOOOOOO
[19:52] <veremitz> \o/
[19:57]  * OvenWerks is surprised that pulse doesn't turn capture on when it gets used...
[20:00] <AppAraat[m]> PA not working when you need it the most has been more or less my previous experience :p
[20:01] <OvenWerks> :)
[20:01]  * AppAraat[m] is crossing fingers that audio just works on my Steam games
[21:09] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: hey man. I wonder with Carla, is there a way to start jackd, as in Catia, without having to use Qjackctl or other means..?
[21:11] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: I can't find a way to select my external sound card with it, et ceteral
[21:12] <Eickmeyer> sirriffsalothp: There is, but you'll find the options aren't as robust as Ubuntu Studio Controls.
[21:13] <Eickmeyer> Also, Ubuntu Studio Controls works out of the box for pretty much everything and actually allows for multiple audio devices.
[21:13] <Eickmeyer> !ubuntustudio-controls
[21:14] <Eickmeyer> qjackctl will only let you do one at a time, same with Catia and Carla.
[21:14] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: ooh, how did I miss this... USCtrl looks great
[21:15] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: once again, sorry, old habits make it difficult to think exploratory
[21:15] <Eickmeyer> We've upstreamed it, so soon it will simply be named "Studio Controls" and automaticlally replaced in the Backports.
[21:17] <Eickmeyer> It's already available in Fedora and will be included by default in Fedora Jam 33.
[21:17] <sirriffsalothp> Cool, looks great, thanks
[21:18] <Eickmeyer> 👍
[21:18] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: why only performance/powersave though? Why not an "ondemand" function as well?
[21:18] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: ^
[21:18] <Eickmeyer> (OvenWerks is the author)
[21:19] <OvenWerks> sirriffsalothp: it depends on the cpu you have
[21:19] <Eickmeyer> sirriffsalothp: Also, whatever explanation he comes up with, ondemand isn't an option in all distros.
[21:19] <OvenWerks> modern intel cpus powersave is much better than powersave
[21:19] <OvenWerks> *ondemand
[21:20] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: hm, ok. Is there a way to make USC start jack automatically once I make USC start automatically at startup?
[21:20] <OvenWerks> powersave changes speed faster and does not require the OS to monitor the cpu load
[21:20] <Eickmeyer> sirriffsalothp: All settings on it persist.
[21:20] <Eickmeyer> Meaning, if jack was running when you shut off the machine, it will start when you sign back in.
[21:20] <OvenWerks> ondemand actually uses more power in some cases than performance
[21:21] <OvenWerks> you do not need to start usc at asession start
[21:21] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: yes, but I'd like my system to run the jack audio server as soon as it boots
[21:21] <sirriffsalothp> Oh...
[21:21] <OvenWerks> autojack already does that and studio controls tells autojack what to do.
[21:21] <sirriffsalothp> I see!
[21:22] <OvenWerks> the system will start up the way it was shutdown
[21:22] <OvenWerks> so if jack is running when you shutdown it will run when you start up
[21:22] <Eickmeyer> So, throw away everything you know about qjackctl and having to manually start Jack because those days are over.
[21:22] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: well the reason I ask is because now I have to tell ardour to connect to jack every time I open a session..
[21:22] <OvenWerks> That is why we hid qjackctl in a sub directory...
[21:23]  * Eickmeyer might even remove it from the seed.
[21:23] <OvenWerks> I don't see that here
[21:23] <OvenWerks> when I start ardour it is already connected to jack
[21:24] <Eickmeyer> Same.
[21:24] <StevenJayCohen> Need a hand, I feel like I am missing at least 1 step: How do I remove all traces of UbuntuStudio from a vanilla Ubuntu reverting to the stock kernel?
[21:24] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: nop, every time I try to open a session I get the Audio/MIDI setup-prompt
[21:24] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: You.... leaving... us....?
[21:24] <sirriffsalothp> And I swear this is a clean US install, no ppa's what so ever
[21:24] <OvenWerks> if you are using ardour with the alsa backend it should do that yes
[21:25] <StevenJayCohen> No, I thought there was a software issue and tried messing with stuff. Turns out there's a hardware issue on this machine and I need to revert just that 1 box to stock
[21:25] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: alsa backend..? I've never had to do this before, what's causing this then? :-S
[21:25] <StevenJayCohen> Dell is sending a tech to work on the machine on Monday and it needs to be stock 20.04
[21:25] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: Remove ubuntustudio-branding-common, linux-lowlatency, ubuntustudio-performance-tweaks.
[21:26] <OvenWerks> if jack is already running when ardour starts and jack was the used backend the last run (of that session)
[21:26] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: hmm
[21:26] <OvenWerks> (I think the back end is part of the session.. not sure)
[21:27] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: Also, if it's from the repos, I'm pretty sure Dell doesn't care.
[21:27] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: Ubuntu Studio doesn't "mod" Ubuntu beyond what can be done by installing software from the repos.
[21:28] <sirriffsalothp> I opened a session with the correct jack settings, closed it, when I try to reopen it I still get the same prompt...
[21:28] <Eickmeyer> The lowlatency kernel is considered a subkernel of the generic one as far as Ubuntu is concerned.
[21:29] <StevenJayCohen> I told the phone support guy (Ubuntu user) what was up. He recommended that I revert it. He said that he's seen some techs find something odd and make a stink.
[21:29] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: Then they're not operating within Dell's contract with Canonical.
[21:29] <OvenWerks> sirriffsalothp: before opening ardour run jack_lsp in a terminal.
[21:29] <OvenWerks> if it errors... that would be why
[21:29] <StevenJayCohen> brb
[21:30] <OvenWerks> That is if ardour has to start jack then the dialog makes sense
[21:30] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: yeah, i do get an error
[21:30] <OvenWerks> so jack is not yet running
[21:30] <sirriffsalothp> However, if I start jack through qjackctl, no problems
[21:30] <sirriffsalothp> Wtf..
[21:30] <sirriffsalothp> Autojack is running
[21:30] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: "sudo apt autoremove --purge ubuntustudio*" might actually do the trick.
[21:30] <OvenWerks> Ardour will will start jack but it will give the dialog first
[21:31] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: Warning: Untested.
[21:31] <OvenWerks> autojack running is not the saem as jack running
[21:31] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: ah, lol, well in that case we're back where we were. If there's no way to make USC run jack automatically, I guess I'll have to make qjackctl do it after all then, for instance?
[21:32] <Eickmeyer> StevenJayCohen: Though, it's possible that just removing the branding would do enough to ward-off overzealous Dell techs.
[21:32] <OvenWerks> that does not sound right
[21:32] <OvenWerks> sirriffsalothp: go into ubuntustudio-controls, set the right device and hit the start/restart jack button
[21:32] <Eickmeyer> sirriffsalothp: If Jack was already running via qjackctl or other means, then Ubuntu Studio Controls won't see it as running.
[21:33] <OvenWerks> sirriffsalothp: then run jack_lsp again
[21:33] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: it might
[21:33] <OvenWerks> in fact it should because it tried to create a jack client
[21:34] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Users have reported that Controls won't detect an already-running Jack instance.
[21:35] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: that would tend to tell me they have named the server something other than default, run it it as root
[21:35] <Eickmeyer> I guess that's possible.
[21:35] <OvenWerks> or that what they mean is that it doesn't auto start jack the next time
[21:35] <sirriffsalothp> Trying stuff
[21:35] <OvenWerks> it will only auto start if jack was started by controls
[21:36] <OvenWerks> so long as jack is run as the same user, controls should be able to restart it. (even if borked)
[21:39] <sirriffsalothp> Humm
[21:42] <sirriffsalothp> My sessions are distorted as hell now, and I can't work out what on earth could be causing this..
[21:42] <sirriffsalothp> Audio from browser is the same
[21:42] <OvenWerks> odd
[21:42] <OvenWerks> but things are ok with jack started from qjackctl?
[21:43] <sirriffsalothp> Nah still distorted there too
[21:43] <sirriffsalothp> God dammit.. always something
[21:43] <OvenWerks> how does it sound with jack stopped?
[21:43] <OvenWerks> US-C stop jack.
[21:44] <sirriffsalothp> Okay so I stopped jack in USC
[21:44] <sirriffsalothp> I did a ps -A |grep jack, and autojack is still running
[21:44] <OvenWerks> (that will make sure pulse is restarted
[21:44] <OvenWerks> autojack should still be running
[21:44] <OvenWerks> it is waiting for a command to do something
[21:44] <OvenWerks> but is not jack itself
[21:45] <sirriffsalothp> Still distorted as fuck when my external sound card is chosen via pavucontrol
[21:45] <OvenWerks> good-ish
[21:45] <sirriffsalothp> Even if I lower it to 50% I can still hear that something iss off, the sound is distorted somehow
[21:45] <OvenWerks> at least it is not a jack problem anyway.
[21:46] <OvenWerks> external audio = USB?
[21:46] <sirriffsalothp> Yeah, I'm using the TASCAM US16x08
[21:46] <sirriffsalothp> I NEVER had this issue in 19.10
[21:47] <OvenWerks> right
[21:47] <sirriffsalothp> Real odd
[21:47] <OvenWerks> can it handle being unplugged and plugged?
[21:47] <sirriffsalothp> Trying to mess around with the settings in pulse but still the same...
[21:47] <sirriffsalothp> Sure, sec
[21:47] <OvenWerks> If it has external power a power cycle may be needed too
[21:48] <sirriffsalothp> I switched it on and off, still the same
[21:48] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: power cycle?
[21:48] <OvenWerks> same thing
[21:48] <sirriffsalothp> :P
[21:48] <OvenWerks> switch off/on which you did
[21:49] <sirriffsalothp> Yah... other ideas?
[21:49] <OvenWerks> does it have extrenal sync options?
[21:49] <OvenWerks> (wordclock, spdif)
[21:49] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: not that I am aware of, and if so I never used it
[21:52] <OvenWerks> there is no plug on the unit for external sync
[21:52] <sirriffsalothp> Nope..
[21:53] <sirriffsalothp> https://www.google.com/search?q=tascam+us+16%C3%9708&client=ubuntu&hs=Vz&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwil3aDBh9rpAhUhtYsKHe9vBbYQ_AUoAXoECAsQAw&biw=1463&bih=860
[21:53]  * OvenWerks wonders why features shows windows software rather than whats on the unit :P
[21:53] <OvenWerks> https://tascam.com/us/product/us-16x08/feature
[21:54] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: I think it's safe to assume it's not my sound card, but rather something in pulse/jack/US
[21:54] <Eickmeyer> !language | sirriffsalothp: I didn't catch this earlier, but warning
[21:54] <sirriffsalothp> Eickmeyer: oh, sorry :)
[21:55] <sirriffsalothp> Did you add any volume controllers that might be causing this?
[21:55] <OvenWerks> no
[21:55] <sirriffsalothp> I installed two desktop environments, but that should hardly make my audio become distorted..
[21:56] <OvenWerks> that would not be it, both will expect pulse
[21:57] <OvenWerks> it does have an internal mixer with effects
[21:57] <OvenWerks> I don't think alsa can see that or the routing.
[21:58] <Eickmeyer> Alsa cannot usually see internal mixers or internal effects.
[21:58] <Eickmeyer> internal to external hardware, that is.
[21:59] <sirriffsalothp> The audio settings in system settings has my tascam set to "US-16x08 Analog Surround 7.1"
[22:00] <OvenWerks> that makes sense
[22:00] <sirriffsalothp> I'm not mixing with surround lol, I just need a stereo signal, L/R
[22:00] <OvenWerks> it would do that for my D66 as well
[22:00] <OvenWerks> you should be able to change the profile
[22:00] <OvenWerks> in configuration in pavucontrol
[22:00] <OvenWerks> there is a drop down
[22:00] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: yeah I know, but..
[22:01] <sirriffsalothp> In pavucontrol I have it set to analog output
[22:01] <sirriffsalothp> And it's the only option...
[22:01] <sirriffsalothp> Whereas in configuration, it's Analog Surround 7.1 Output
[22:01] <OvenWerks> 8 chanels
[22:01] <OvenWerks> channels even
[22:01] <sirriffsalothp> Other options are Off, Multichannel Input or Analog Surround 7.1 Output +  Multichannel Input
[22:02] <OvenWerks> so no stereo then
[22:02] <OvenWerks> still I thin that is not the sound problem
[22:02] <sirriffsalothp> No... but this distortion was never an issue before, I always saw these options in pavucontrol in the past :(
[22:02] <sirriffsalothp> I guess not
[22:05] <sirriffsalothp> Well this is pretty bad news.. I'm at a real loss here, google has nothing that I can find to be helpful either
[22:06] <sirriffsalothp> Lemme try a reboot and going into your DE, just to be sure
[22:06] <OvenWerks> just in case... too late..
[22:07] <OvenWerks> almost any of the DSP inside could cause this...
[22:07] <sirriffsalothp> Still the same...
[22:07] <sirriffsalothp> !!!
[22:08] <OvenWerks> sirriffsalothp: are all the level controls set 12 oclockis?
[22:08] <sirriffsalothp> Level controls? In pavucontrol?
[22:08] <OvenWerks> straight up on the unit?
[22:08] <sirriffsalothp> Oh on my sound card?
[22:08] <OvenWerks> yes
[22:08] <OvenWerks> it has knobs on the front?
[22:08] <sirriffsalothp> Sure, one for headphones, one for the line out 1-2 which is for my speakers
[22:09] <sirriffsalothp> Headphones and speakers have both the same distortion, even at very low levels
[22:09] <sirriffsalothp> The rest are input knobs
[22:09] <OvenWerks> ok, just checking
[22:09] <OvenWerks> does alsamixer show any controls?
[22:09] <sirriffsalothp> The master is at 100, master mute is MM and DSP Bypass is MM
[22:10] <OvenWerks> use  the right/left arrows on your keyboard to highlight DSP Bypass and hit M
[22:10] <sirriffsalothp> Still the same
[22:11] <OvenWerks>  doesx that make any difference? Master Mute should be off as well
[22:11] <sirriffsalothp> Master must says MM, if I press M for it, everything goes quiet
[22:11] <OvenWerks> so it is backwards
[22:11] <OvenWerks>  ok
[22:12] <OvenWerks> with master highlighted does the down arrow work to bring the level down?
[22:12] <sirriffsalothp> I see a bunch of eq's and compressors way out to the right... should they be active?
[22:12] <sirriffsalothp> Of course it brings the level down, but as few notches down it goes real quiet, but the distortion is still there
[22:12] <OvenWerks>  oh wow so you can control everything from alsa
[22:12] <sirriffsalothp> Yeah
[22:13] <OvenWerks> if you hit the mute button on DSP by pass do they go away?
[22:13] <sirriffsalothp> Hmm okay, the distortion goes away if I lower the master in alsa to, say, 80, and the crank up my headphones
[22:14] <OvenWerks> oh, that might be it then
[22:14] <sirriffsalothp> No they still remain
[22:14] <OvenWerks> yeah alsamixer is not that smart
[22:15] <sirriffsalothp> But this is still a problem... I don't want to have to set my master to what I THINK is close to 100%, as I'm doing mixing-jobs for other people I need to know my system is working properly.. this is too odd to just ignore, you know what I mean?
[22:15] <OvenWerks> considering the master mute is backwards... I would guess that having the dsp bypass set to mute is bypass
[22:15] <sirriffsalothp> Item: DSP Bypass [off] when DSP Bypass is MM
[22:16] <sirriffsalothp> I've never ever run into this problem before lol
[22:16] <OvenWerks> yeah I know. with alsamixer open does changing pavuacontrol's output level change the master level on the box?
[22:17] <sirriffsalothp> System sounds: no. Output Devices, US-16x08 etc: yes
[22:17] <OvenWerks> sirriffsalothp: I am also wondering if there is an internal loop
[22:17] <OvenWerks> yeach.!
[22:17] <sirriffsalothp> So alsamixer master alters pavucontrol, and vice versa
[22:18] <OvenWerks> yeah. so jack is safer. once jack owns the device (and US-c doesn't let pulse see alsa devices) pulse can't change that setup once you have set it.
[22:20] <sirriffsalothp> But my ardour sessions were equally distorted...?
[22:20] <OvenWerks> only if they were recorded that way
[22:20] <sirriffsalothp> Haha hell no dude :) I know what I'm doing there
[22:20] <OvenWerks> :)
[22:21] <OvenWerks> you shold be able to still turn master down with alsamixer or qasmixer (take your pick)
[22:21] <OvenWerks> qas mixer may be a bit nicer/easier to use for a complex box like that
[22:23] <sirriffsalothp> Yeah, but.. what exactly is making the audio clip at 100%..? Since I'm mixing I need to know at what level my machine is pumping out the levels at, so I'm not willie-nillie mixing and risking that what goes out will sound radically different due to some  fluke here
[22:24] <sirriffsalothp> https://upload.picpaste.me/image/AP28B
[22:24] <sirriffsalothp> https://upload.picpaste.me/image/APRm2
[22:24] <OvenWerks> i understand that... I would be just as frustrated
[22:24] <sirriffsalothp> This might be interesting, check out the dsp off-on discrepancy
[22:25] <sirriffsalothp> Oh nvm
[22:25] <sirriffsalothp> I got confused lol, that makes sense
[22:25] <sirriffsalothp> Are you using an external usb device as well?
[22:26] <OvenWerks> no, I have an old ice1712 device. Delta 66
[22:26] <OvenWerks> it also has an internal mixer
[22:26] <OvenWerks> but in my case there is a linux applet for this device
[22:27] <OvenWerks> it is much nicer and better laid out than the alsa mixers
[22:28] <OvenWerks> but I do not have near as many control as you have to deal with...
[22:32] <sirriffsalothp> When I use my internal sound card on the machine
[22:33] <sirriffsalothp> I disabled my external sound card altogether, using a usb-headset with a mic, and alsa is at 100% now. The audio here is fine
[22:33] <sirriffsalothp> Odd....
[22:33] <sirriffsalothp> That means something's going on with my sound card, lemme try plugging in some 3.5mm jack headphones to the back of my machine, see how that sounds
[22:34] <sirriffsalothp> OvenWerks: perfectly fine directly plugged into the back of my machine
[22:34] <sirriffsalothp> God dangit this sucks.. :/
[22:41]  * OvenWerks needs to spend time with his wife as she just got home from work. Back later...
[22:41] <sirriffsalothp> Okidok
[23:02] <sirriffsalothp> Brb
[23:04] <AppAraat[m]> yay! Internal mic in L4D2 works :)


[03:18] <bkerensa> How would I upload a patch for possible sponsor?
[03:19] <nigelb> You can either attach a debdiff to a bug and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
[03:19] <nigelb> Or you can submit a merge proposal
[03:20] <bkerensa> nigelb: Ahh well I prepared a packge for multiarch at the join Jam/DSP and just wanna get credit for my first submission
[03:20] <bkerensa> nigelb: which might be easier?
[03:20] <nigelb> heh, that varies from sponsor to sponsor.
[03:20] <nigelb> I personally find debdiff easier
[03:20] <nigelb> But I might be old school :P
[03:22]  * micahg also prefers debdiff, but that only works if there isn't an official non-UDD Ubuntu VCS branch
[03:23]  * micahg is piloting tomorrow, so can take a look then
[03:24] <bkerensa> micahg: Well I do not know how to do either ;) so any guidance :P this isnt a bug but just a package moved to multiarch
[03:25] <micahg> bkerensa: I have to run right now, but someone else should be able to help you here, otherwise, I'll be happy to when I get back (1-4 hrs)
[03:29] <jtokarchuk> so how does MOTU work? I have read the literature, but can I basically just pick a package that's not in ubuntu and make it so? Is there a todo list?
[03:37] <stlsaint> JontheEchidna: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
[03:44] <jtokarchuk> I'm going to assume that was directed at me, I read that, so essentially, just work through bugs and produce meaningful packages?
[04:30] <micahg> jtokarchuk: that's the general idea, MOTU fixes random stuff in the archive
[04:30] <micahg> bkerensa: did you manage to find help yet?
[04:31] <jtokarchuk> micahg, Thank you. I submitted an app for mentorship, but am awaiting a reply
[04:31] <bkerensa> micahg: Yeah apparently I should wait till patch is uploaded upstream then sync down and I will get credit since I'm in changelog?
[04:32] <micahg> bkerensa: well, you won't get credit in LP per se, but it can count towards development activity
[04:34] <micahg> bkerensa: regardless of whether or not a patch is uploaded to Ubuntu, we try to upstream appropriate patches to Debian
[04:35] <EvilResistance> micahg:  so they get synced in to the next version of Ubuntu?
[04:35] <EvilResistance> (from debian)
[04:35] <micahg> bkerensa: the question of whether or not to upload to Ubuntu directly vs Debian is time frame and immediate impact of having the fix in Ubuntu generally
[04:35] <micahg> EvilResistance: we're still in Debian Import mode
[04:35] <EvilResistance> micahg:  true, but i meant when in a non-import mode
[04:35] <EvilResistance> i.e shortly after the release of oa version of ubuntu
[04:36] <EvilResistance> s/oa/a/
[04:36] <micahg> EvilResistance: eh, depends on what and when
[04:36] <bkerensa> micahg: What if someone does the same work and I miss out?
[04:36] <bkerensa> :D
[04:36] <bkerensa> micahg: I just dont know how to submit the patch since it is not a bug but instead moved a package to multiarch
[04:37] <micahg> bkerensa: you can still use a wishlist bug to track that sort of thing
[04:37] <micahg> bkerensa: which package is it?
[04:37] <bkerensa> audiofile0
[04:38] <EvilResistance> you mean libaudiofile0 ?
[04:38] <EvilResistance> (there's nothing that directly matches audiofile0 in natty, oneiric, or precise)
[04:38] <micahg> EvilResistance: hopefully he means the audiofile source :)
[04:39] <EvilResistance> indeed
[04:40] <EvilResistance> wouldnt that show up in the source repos though?  *tends to have them enabled by default*
[04:41] <micahg> bkerensa: IMHO, that should probably go through Debian as it has a lot of reverse dependencies that might break with the multiarched package, you can file a bug in LP for Ubuntu and link it to the Debian bug so people are aware of your work
[04:42] <micahg> eh, I guess <30 isn't that many...but still having 10 days to migrate from unstable to testing gives time to catch these things
[04:43] <micahg> slangasek: ^^ any opinion on whether or not multiarched audiofile should go through Debian first?
[04:44] <bkerensa> micahg: heh well slangasek will be adding to debian since he helped me multiarch it ;)
[04:45] <micahg> bkerensa: well, whatever he says, I'd listen to in this case :)
[04:45] <bkerensa> peh :P
[04:45] <micahg> actually, I'd listen to what he says in general :)
[04:45] <bkerensa> :D
[05:12] <slangasek> bkerensa, micahg: we certainly want multiarch patches to be pushed to Debian, but we don't want Ubuntu to wait for them to land in Debian first
[05:12] <slangasek> because there's no guarantee that will happen in time for precise
[05:13] <micahg> slangasek: what do we do about rdeps, rebuild blind?
[05:15] <slangasek> micahg: what about rdeps?  multiarch doesn't require them to be rebuilt unless there are .la file references
[05:16] <micahg> slangasek: ah, ok, I know sometimes depending on how paths are hard-coded in apps at build time, a rebuild might be necessary, but I guess the answer is wait and see if anything breaks and fix it :)
[05:19] <micahg> i.e. pkg-config paths converted to some version of hard-coded paths at run-time
[05:19] <slangasek> oh, well, that is generally only relevant when plugins are involved
[05:19] <slangasek> which is why today's Local Jam avoided libraries with plugins :)
[05:22] <micahg> sounds good
[05:23] <micahg> bkerensa: so, if you get can get a debdiff into a bug and that bug in the sponsorship queue, I'll have a look tomorrow when I'm piloting, unless slangasek was planning on sponsoring :)
[05:25] <micahg> bkerensa: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Traditional_Process if you didn't use bzr to get the source package
[05:26] <micahg> bkerensa: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Use_Ubuntu_Merge_Proposals if you did use bzr
[05:47] <bkerensa> micahg: How do I turn the .patch into debdiff?
[05:49] <bkerensa> slangasek: ok well.... I need to figure out how to get a debdiff from the patch file I have?
[05:50] <slangasek> bkerensa: it's already a debdiff
[05:50] <slangasek> a debdiff is just a patch expressing the difference between two source packages :)
[05:50] <bkerensa> slangasek: Oh ok and I just need to file a bug requesting it be added or?
[05:50] <bkerensa> :D
[05:50] <slangasek> bkerensa: yep
[05:50] <bkerensa> slangasek: Nothing special? if so I will file it now with Debian and Ubuntu
[05:51] <slangasek> bkerensa: nope, nothing really special :)  I did send you an email with some info about how to file the bug in Debian, but if you already know how to do that, you can ignore that mail
[05:53] <jtokarchuk> x.x Why does it seem that everything is fixed in harvest
[06:00] <bkerensa> slangasek: Ok just fired away to Debian
[06:00] <bkerensa> :D
[06:01] <bkerensa> slangasek: Is the format of opening a bug pretty much the same?
[06:01] <bkerensa> on Ubuntu
[06:01] <slangasek> bkerensa: no, for Ubuntu it's best to use the 'ubuntu-bug' command
[06:01] <bkerensa> heh
[06:02] <bkerensa> ;)
[06:02] <bkerensa> slangasek: Then I just attach the same patch and request it be supported?
[06:02] <slangasek> yes - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Traditional_Process
[06:04] <broder> slangasek: out of curiosity, has pkg-create-dbgsym been modified to set multi-arch same?
[06:04] <slangasek> I don't know
[06:07] <broder> oh hey, apparently it does. go pitti
[06:10] <bkerensa> slangasek: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audiofile/+bug/900153
[06:11] <bkerensa> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=651029
[07:06] <micahg> bkerensa: thanks for your work :), I should be able to get to this tomorrow when I pilot unless pitti beats me to it
[07:09] <bkerensa> micahg: thx
[07:54] <dholbach> good morning
[08:14] <highvolt1ge> jgood morning
[08:14] <highvolt1ge> *good
[08:26] <Laney> ello
[17:21] <l3on> fabrice_sp, ping
[17:37] <l3on> cjwatson, can I look at merging ttf-cjk-compact ?
[17:40] <cjwatson> l3on: please leave that to me
[17:40] <l3on> cjwatson, ok :)
[17:41] <l3on> some merge to suggest? :)
[17:42] <micahg> l3on: there are some labeled free to take on merges.ubuntu.com
[17:43] <l3on> micahg, ok :)
[18:00] <micahg> l3on: would you happen to be interested in preparing security updates?  there's lots of those that need to be done for universe packages
[18:00] <l3on> micahg, ok... could you provide more info? :D
[18:00] <jtaylor> is there a list for security updates that need done?
[18:01] <micahg> jtaylor: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/universe.html
[18:02] <micahg> we also highlight 5 packages per week in our weekly security meeting in #ubuntu-meeting starting about now :)
[18:04] <micahg> here we keep a list of highlighted packages which gets refreshed weekly: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/HighlightedPackages
[18:05] <micahg> if you're interested in helping with these, feel free to join #ubuntu-hardened to learn more :)
[18:07] <l3on> thanks , I'll do :)
[19:57] <fabrice_sp> l3on, pong
[19:58] <fabrice_sp> !ping > l3on
[20:19] <jtaylor> is there some documentation on all the motu formalities and procedures? I still suck at navigating the wiki efficently ._.
[20:21] <geser> I don't know of any, just ask and someone will point you to the matching wiki page :)
[20:21] <tumbleweed> there are no formalities, really
[20:21] <tumbleweed> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership list the benefits
[20:22]  * micahg thought there was a work item that came out of UDS for new developer tasks
[20:22] <tumbleweed> DMB session?
[20:22] <micahg> maybe
[20:22] <tumbleweed> we seem to have a massive lack of notes for it...
[20:22] <micahg> ah :)
[20:24] <zooko> Dammit, I just registered https://launchpad.net/python-fs and I somehow failed to change the desired URL to https://launchpad.net/pyfilesystem .
[20:24] <zooko> I don't see how to change it now.
[20:24] <jtaylor> yey lwn subscription :) only I'm already ~4 weekly editions behind in reading :/
[20:24] <zooko> Shall I send some sort fo support request to launchpad?
[20:25] <cjwatson> zooko: I believe so, yes; https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad
[20:25] <zooko> Hrm, and why can't I report a bug here now? https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-fs
[20:25] <zooko> cjwatson: thanks.
[20:26] <cjwatson> Bug tracking has to be turned on explicitly for new projects.  Should be in https://launchpad.net/python-fs/+configure-bugtracker
[20:26] <cjwatson> linked from the front page under "Configuration options"
[20:26] <cjwatson> the project page, I mean
[20:31] <tumbleweed> cjwatson: we were chatting a while ago about a tool that'll tell you if something is safe to upload during a freeze
[20:31] <zooko> cjwatson: thanks.
[20:31] <tumbleweed> i'm currently grabbing daily build .list and .manifests to build an index of included packages
[20:31] <zooko> cjwatson: https://launchpad.net/python-fs/+configure-bugtracker says "Sorry, you don't have permission to access this page. "
[20:31] <tumbleweed> micahg, and stgraber suggested grabbing the contents of the supported seed too
[20:32] <zooko> cjwatson: but I already requested that launchpad folks do it in my launchpad support question.
[20:32] <tumbleweed> is there any convenient way to do that?
[20:32] <micahg> tumbleweed: it's in a bzr branch
[20:32] <tumbleweed> micahg: aah
[20:33] <stgraber> micahg: or rather, in multiple bzr branches
[20:34] <micahg> stgraber: right, just saw there's the desktop supported and then other supported in platform (and possibly others in the other seed branches)
[20:34] <stgraber> tumbleweed: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/seeds/*/supported
[20:34] <stgraber> tumbleweed: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/seeds/*.precise/supported rather
[20:34] <tumbleweed> stgraber: will they always have the same names?
[20:34] <tumbleweed> otherwise I've got to parse HTML file listing
[20:34] <cjwatson> um, that only gives you the top-level packages
[20:34] <cjwatson> please don't reinvent germinate
[20:35] <tumbleweed> heh
[20:35] <cjwatson> it's complicated enough as it is
[20:35] <stgraber> yeah, the initial suggestion was to look at germinate's output :) not sure what tumbleweed needs that's not part of germinate's output
[20:35] <cjwatson> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.precise/structure and then work from the files it lists
[20:35] <cjwatson> it's kind of complex though
[20:35] <tumbleweed> ah, missed that file
[20:36] <cjwatson> and that's only for i386; there will be some differences across architectures
[20:36] <cjwatson> and s/ubuntu/somethingelse/ etc.
[20:36] <cjwatson> also why is the supported seed relevant?  supported doesn't end up on any images
[20:37] <micahg> cjwatson: the only time it seems relevant is after final freeze
[20:37] <el2ro> Hi, could someone help a bit explaining in rough level.. what would be needed to build (backport) some packages in lauchpad?
[20:38] <cjwatson> we could symlink the LP publisher's germinate output to somewhere public, maybe
[20:38] <cjwatson> that might not be an entirely crazy thing to do
[20:39] <el2ro> I have started to play with backportpackage tool.. And tried to backport latest PHP to lucid, but it fails with dependency issues. Those should not be so hard to fix, but is there some page explaining what backportpackage tool is doing... e.g. how to that stuff manually and fix the package to make it work
[20:40] <tumbleweed> cjwatson: I assume that'd give the output from other architectures?
[20:41]  * tumbleweed has a go at parsing this
[20:42] <micahg> el2ro: backportpackage just changes the version so that's it's lower than the current one to support upgrades, it also changes the target in the changelog to whatever you're targeting (it has nice help output to show you the rest of its features), it won't "fix" a backport for you though, for that you need to make source changes
[20:46] <el2ro> micahg: ok, but I am still missing the big picture :) Howto do those things manually and fix things. What tools needed to fetch package from launchpad... changes most likely I can handle... how to push changes package to own PPA.
[20:47] <el2ro> I guess it is not so hards, but learning curve is so hard or well hidden, that it is so templating just building stuff on my web hosts and I don't want to do that :)
[20:54] <micahg> el2ro: well, if you're using backportpackage, you already have the source, you'll want to look in the source folder at debian/control, these instructions might be helpful as well: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Updating_an_Ubuntu_Package
[20:57] <micahg> el2ro: actually, this one might be better except you don't need steps 8 or 9 (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Traditional_Process)
[20:58] <el2ro> micahg: thx, I will take a look if they will take me any further
[21:04] <cjwatson> tumbleweed: the LP publisher's output would, yes
[21:06] <tumbleweed> any way to get a lits of the flavors? (pity it isn't rsyncable, like cdimage.u.c is)
[21:07] <cjwatson> LP source, cronscripts/publishing/cron.germinate, I'm afraid
[21:07] <tumbleweed> meh, I'll just use hardcoded lists that get stale
[21:07] <micahg> tumbleweed: wget --mirror?
[21:08] <tumbleweed> micahg: yeah, that's the other way...
[22:07] <jtaylor> ubuntu no change rebuilds will auto-sync?
[22:14] <micahg> jtaylor: yes (i.e. -XbuildY)
[22:24] <tumbleweed> micahg: is that output better?
[22:25] <micahg> tumbleweed: what output?
[22:25] <tumbleweed> micahg: committed a new version of the ubuntu-safe-to-upload tool (it's new name)
[22:25] <micahg> tumbleweed: ah, will check
[22:28] <micahg> tumbleweed: looks nice
[22:29] <micahg> tumbleweed: although the name doesn't match the tool per se
[22:29] <tumbleweed> is-seeded ?
[22:30]  * micahg forgot what the hangups around the word seeded were
[22:30] <tumbleweed> people misuse the term a lot
[22:30] <tumbleweed> this, of course, started out looking at image contents, not seeds
[22:31] <tumbleweed> but now does look at seeds (although not all seeds, only supported)
[22:31] <micahg> is-seeded seems appropriate since this is what it's checking
[22:50] <broder> tumbleweed: can i possibly get you to sponsor http://mentors.debian.net/package/rfs/freeimage for me?
[22:50] <broder> hmm...actually, hold that thought. i just realized that i want to try and tweak one of my patches for the purposes of future maintenance
[22:51] <tumbleweed> hrm, it's git tree is out of date
[22:52] <el2ro> Some help pls... trying to upload a package to ppa with dput to be build for lucid (from Oneiric). How to make it build that stuff only to lucid?
[22:53] <tumbleweed> el2ro: put lucid as the distribution in the changelog
[22:54] <el2ro> tumbleweed: thanks, I will try to digg in
[22:57] <broder> tumbleweed: oh, huh. i didn't notice it had a git tree. my inclination is to just drop the debian/control tags
[22:57] <tumbleweed> it's only *just* out of date, so easy enough to sync it up again
[22:57] <broder> oh, i see. ok
[22:58] <tumbleweed> oh, sorry, it is up to date
[22:58] <tumbleweed> just not tagged
[22:58] <broder> ugh. yeah, but reconstructing the history in git will be annoying
[22:58] <broder> i guess i can do it the trivial way
[22:58] <tumbleweed> yeah, screw pretty history
[22:59] <tumbleweed> it's orphaned, after all
[23:00] <broder> the package is kind of a mess - it ships with embedded copies of a half dozen libraries
[23:00] <broder> and its makefile lists the source files for *all* of them on a single line
[23:01] <Resistance> broder:  wouldnt dget be preferred for getting the source packages for <packagenamehere> rather than using backportpackage to try and get the source?
[23:01] <broder> the last debian upload dropped in a new version of libtiff, which was the only one the uploader couldn't tease apart from the rest of the package
[23:01] <broder> which made the merge, uh, well, unpleasant
[23:01] <broder> Resistance: sorry, i'm not sure what you're referring to?
[23:02] <Resistance> broder:  random question, basically.  Which is preferred for getting the source package of any given package, in order for modification in order to prep for backporting?
[23:02] <broder> tumbleweed: i think i can tweak the patch process so that the insane makefile is generated automatically at build time, instead of being in debian/patches/ and requiring a painful manual merge
[23:02] <Resistance> broder:  assuming that the modification is needed before actually submitting to a PPA or testing the actual backport
[23:02] <broder> Resistance: i'm not really sure i see how that's a backport specific question
[23:02] <Resistance> broder:  its not sec
[23:03] <broder> but in general, i like pull-lp-source for getting random source packages
[23:03] <tumbleweed> broder: sounds reasonable
[23:04] <Resistance> broder:  do yo uknow if the oneiric php5 exists in the backports for natty?
[23:04] <broder> Resistance: "rmadison php5" can tell you that fairly quickly
[23:04] <broder> it doesn't look like php5 has been backported to any active release
[23:05] <broder> i would expect doing so to be a pretty hard sell
[23:05] <Resistance> mmm
[23:05] <Resistance> yeah, i was considering backporting it within a PPA (not in the -backports repo), but if it was already backported i'd just add the backports repo here ;P
[23:10] <Resistance> hey broder, possible bug in backportpackage
[23:10] <Resistance> broder:  theoretically this would work: backportpackage -s oneiric -p natty php5
[23:10] <Resistance> it errors
[23:11] <broder> uh, backportpackage doesn't take a -p argument
[23:11] <Resistance> s/-p/-d/
[23:11] <Resistance> accidential mistype
[23:11] <broder> can you pastebin the error?
[23:11] <Resistance> [kahless /var/teward/php/sourcepackage/oneiric]% backportpackage -s oneiric -d natty php5                                                  [ teward on pts/1 ]
[23:11] <Resistance> Usage: backportpackage [options] <source package name or .dsc URL/file>
[23:11] <Resistance> fooey
[23:12] <Resistance> anyways, its just not taking the source package name
[23:12] <Resistance> sec i'll pastebin the entire thing
[23:12] <broder> Resistance: you didn't specify an operation to do with the package once it was backported
[23:12] <Resistance> ah
[23:12] <broder> you either need to specify -w or -u
[23:12] <Resistance> -u is upload...
[23:13] <Resistance> what's -w
[23:13] <broder> so the build product has somewhere to go - either on your filesystem or LP
[23:13] <broder> it specifies a "temporary" directory to stuff the build products
[23:13] <broder> it should specify that in the error message:
[23:13] <broder> "backportpackage: error: Please specify either a working dir or an upload target!"
[23:13] <Resistance> yep seems to be working now
[23:14] <Resistance> i assume pbuilder is a prereq for using -w ?
[23:14] <broder> no
[23:14] <Resistance> ah
[23:14] <Resistance> nevermind there we go
[23:22] <Resistance> broder:  if i locally backport the oneiric php5 to natty, what's the probability i explode PHP?
[23:22] <Resistance> (upon installation in the natty system)
[23:23] <broder> no idea
[23:23] <Resistance> i guess asking in the php channel would be a better idea, or poking around the Ubuntu developer network?
[23:24] <broder> or at least finding somebody who knows how the php stack is put together (#ubuntu-server, maybe?)
[23:24] <Resistance> mmm
[23:25] <Resistance> i'll stop there
[23:25] <zooko> Folks, where is the official Ubuntu web page describing the Release Schedule?
[23:25] <zooko> And in particular, when is Feature Freeze for 12.04?
[23:25] <zooko> I'm wondering if we'll have a new Tahoe-LAFS release out in time for that.
[23:26] <broder> zooko: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseSchedule
[23:26] <broder> FF is 2/16
[23:26] <zooko> thx
[23:26] <broder> note that feature freeze exceptions for packages in universe without a lot (any?) reverse-deps are pretty easy to get
[23:30] <zooko> When's the deadline for FF exceptions?
[23:30] <tumbleweed> they get harder to get, closer to release
[23:31] <broder> the hard, unbreakable cut-off is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UnseededUniverseFinalFreeze
[23:31]  * zooko nods.
[23:31] <zooko> Okay, thanks.
[23:31] <broder> but it's sort of a gradual transition from "whatever you want goes in" to "nothing goes in"
[23:33] <broder> tumbleweed: ok, i'm happy with http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/f/freeimage/freeimage_3.15.1-1.dsc now
[23:33] <broder> it has some excellent dh-autoreconf abuse
[23:34] <tumbleweed> ah, I sponsored the current version in Ubuntu. That's why I remember it
[23:35] <broder> does that mean i can blame you for re-enabling the embedded libraries? :)
[23:35] <tumbleweed> broder: there wasn't much choice
[23:35]  * broder shrugs
[23:35] <broder> i think it's more long-term maintainable with my tweaks, hopefully
[23:36] <tumbleweed> unless I'm thinkig of something else...
[23:36] <Resistance> broder:  is there any way i can grab the Debian sid source for a package using either backportpackage or dget?
[23:37] <Resistance> or should I be askign that in the debian channel on their home net
[23:37] <broder> Resistance: backportpackage can take debian releases for -s
[23:37] <broder> alternatively, pull-debian-source
[23:37] <tumbleweed> broder: are you ignoring the git tree?
[23:38] <Resistance> broder:  so theoretically i can put sid in for -s and (attempt) to backport to <ubuntudistro> ?
[23:38] <broder> Resistance: yes
[23:38] <Resistance> (granted that'd be stupid to direct backport without testing ;P)
[23:38] <broder> tumbleweed: oh, bah. let me see if i can fake the requisite commits
[23:38] <tumbleweed> broder: ok, I'm off to bed, anyway, but I'll have a look in the morning
[23:39] <broder> tumbleweed: cool. i'm assuming i can't push to git.debian.org, so i'll throw the tree on github or something
[23:39] <tumbleweed> do you have an alioth account yet?
[23:39] <broder> i think so
[23:39] <broder> does that grant git.debian.org access?
[23:40] <tumbleweed> yes and no
[23:40] <broder> (incidentally, i don't actually blame you for turning the embedded libraries back on - it took me a solid 3 or 4 hours to get everything teased apart correctly)
[23:40] <tumbleweed> git.debian.org is part of alioth
[23:41] <tumbleweed> this package is in collab-maint, so all collab-maint members can commit to it
[23:41] <Resistance> broder:  out of curiosity, is it possible to use both -w and -u simultaneously, thereby throwing the backported source into a directory, and uploading it to a PPA?
[23:41] <broder> Resistance: yes
[23:42] <broder> you just have to pass one of the options, otherwise backportpackage would do all of its work into a tmp dir and then chuck all of it
[23:42] <tumbleweed> broder: however, you can push a private branch, http://wiki.debian.org/Alioth/Git#Using_personal_Git_repositories
[23:42] <broder> tumbleweed: ok. i'll get that sorted out, then
[23:43] <tumbleweed> bonus points for adding the missing tags :)
[23:43] <broder> k
[23:45] <broder> snapshot.debian.org ftw
[23:45] <RoAkSoAx>  /win 4
[23:45] <broder> ooh, even better, git-import-dscs can do it for me
[23:45] <tumbleweed> broder: the commits look there, just not tagged
[23:45] <broder> ah, so they are


[07:14] <earthling_> How safe is my machine while chatting on IRC? Can someone gain control of my computer remotely?
[10:56] <Ram__> Hi team
[10:57] <Ram__> I am Ram Murthy from India working as a developer from 2 years in python
[10:58] <Ram__> I am intrested in joining the development of ubuntu .
[10:59] <Ram__> Team, Please respond to me and can you please guide to start the development
[11:07] <Ram__> is there any one able to view my messages ?
[11:09] <Ram__> can any one please help me in starting development in ubuntu
[11:10] <how_world> What kind of development you want involve in ubuntu?
[11:11] <Ram__> I am really intrested to involve in the kernel development
[11:12] <Ram__> how i need to join the team?
[11:14] <Ram__> Do i need to qualify in knowledge to start the development
[11:16] <Ram__> I am familiar with writing python scripts and shell scripts
[11:18] <Ram__> Please ignore the above messages..
[19:12] <pigna_colada> hello
[19:13] <pigna_colada> holstein good evening! are you online?
[19:14] <bodhizazen> hello pigna_colada
[19:14] <pigna_colada> hi bodhi!
[19:14] <pigna_colada> bodhi which is your fav distro?
[19:16] <bodhizazen> I mainly run Fedora these days
[19:16] <bodhizazen> or kubuntu
[19:16] <pigna_colada> can kubuntu be installed on older pc's?
[19:17] <pigna_colada> is it lighter than normal ubuntu or xubuntu?
[19:19] <bodhizazen> kubuntu runs fine on my "older" hardware
[19:19] <bodhizazen> for really old hardware, use something such as puppy
[19:19] <pigna_colada> i dont know if it must considered really old...
[19:19] <pigna_colada> its a laptop with a p4 2.0 ghz
[19:19] <pigna_colada> i have tried to run the last ubuntu on it but it doesnt work
[19:20] <bodhizazen> http://www.puppylinux.com/
[19:20] <bodhizazen> could be any number of problems
[19:20] <bodhizazen> http://www.slitaz.org/en/
[19:21] <bodhizazen> Of the 'buntus, lubuntu is lightest, I would use that
[19:22] <pigna_colada> yes holstein the other day suggested me lubuntu
[19:22] <pigna_colada> and i have installed it, but i dont like it much :(
[19:22] <pigna_colada> its too light:(
[19:22] <bodhizazen> http://www.slax.org/
[19:22] <bodhizazen> OK, well, IMO, KDE is lighter then it used to be
[19:22] <bodhizazen> IMO kde works better then Unity/gnome on old hardware
[19:22] <bodhizazen> xubuntu is another option
[19:23] <pigna_colada> i could install ubuntu but it was running very slow and the dekstop had strange effects and blocks
[19:23] <pigna_colada> holstein told me because of the 3d supportg
[19:23] <bodhizazen> http://blog.bodhizazen.net/linux/desktop-environments-ram-use/
[19:23] <pigna_colada> yes, I was looking at xubuntu and it seems "something more" than lubuntu
[19:23] <bodhizazen> yea
[19:24] <bodhizazen> bodhi is a great option- http://www.bodhilinux.com/
[19:25] <pigna_colada> also puppylinux doesnt seem so bad
[19:26] <pigna_colada> but to have more compatibility and sharing with ubuntu itself i think i have to try xubuntu
[19:26] <bodhizazen> x or kubuntu , you will do well with either
[19:27] <pigna_colada> kubuntu has more potential than xu?
[19:29] <bodhizazen> kubuntu has a little more eye candy, works well
[19:29] <bodhizazen> xubuntu has an old school feel
[19:31] <bodhizazen> gnome / unity have high requirements of your video card (3d), the 2d stuff (fall back) is slow
[20:02] <duanedesign> lubuntu is a nother light distro that is really nice
[20:02] <duanedesign> oops you alll already discussed lubuntu :)
[20:02] <duanedesign> then i would go with bodhi's suggestion xubuntu
[20:23] <pigna_colada> yes I am downloading xubuntu :)
[20:23] <pigna_colada> I have formatted the old lubuntu partitions
[20:23] <pigna_colada> and i am in a few moments proceeding in installing xu
[20:23] <pigna_colada> hoping will be the final choice
[20:23] <pigna_colada> I hope the xubuntu install is similar to ubuntu/xubuntu
[20:23] <pigna_colada> I hope the xubuntu install is similar to ubuntu/Lubuntu
[20:30] <Quillaine> My laptop (running Ubuntu 12.04 LTS) has started "freezing up" so that I have to actually hold down the power button and restart to get it to work.  Where can I find help for this problem?  (I already tried searching the forum, but no luck.)
[21:27] <bodhi_zazen> o/
[23:39] <Gorgonait> Hi!
[23:40] <Gorgonait> I need some help with virtualbox?


[08:49] <inetpro> goeiemore
[10:04] <andrewlsd> Maaz: coffee please
[10:04] <Maaz> andrewlsd: There isn't a pot on
[10:40] <magespawn> good afternoon


[03:31] <ruiboon> should i close bug 234015? as it seems to be a specific faulty hardware issue
[08:33] <lucas> mp
[08:33] <lucas> oops
[09:09] <qense> hello
[10:27] <qense> can someone help me out on bug 229477 ?
[10:27] <qense> I don't know what part is responsible for keeping track of the status of the CD/DVD-drive, lshal -m didn't show anything here
[10:28] <qense> what should I ask him for?
[10:48] <albert23> qense: that may happen if some process is accessing the cdrom
[10:49] <albert23> qense: my first question would be: is there a cd in the drive?
[10:49] <qense> aargh! of course
[10:49] <qense> I forgot that
[10:49] <albert23> qense: and if there is a cd in the drive, lsof | grep cdrom may tell what is keeping the drive busy
[10:50] <qense> and where there isn't? Isn't the closure and opening of CD/DVD drives monitored by the hardware itself?
[10:51] <albert23> qense: I tried the lshal -m trick, but that didn't say anything for me either
[10:51] <albert23> so I guess the hardware may handle the key directly indeed
[10:52] <qense> ok, thx
[12:04] <ciaramooney> Hey hows the global bug hunt going?
[12:32] <ciaramooney> Hey, would the following qualify as a "wishlist"? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pm-utils/+bug/238303
[12:37] <qense> I wouldn' touch it
[12:37] <qense> I think it's a workflow bug
[12:37] <qense> since the universe sponsors are subscribed to it
[12:38] <qense> main sponsors *
[12:38] <qense> there were some pretty heavy discussions about workflow bugs lately and some people got angry
[12:38] <qense> this kind of bugs are used to keep track of things the people who maintain the packages have to do
[12:40] <qense> oops, I forgot to ping ciaramooney ;)
[12:40] <qense> now I've did
[12:40] <qense> done!
[12:40] <ciaramooney> Lol. Thanks.
[12:41] <qense> ;)
[12:47] <ciaramooney> qense: I have a question. When a bug is triaged as "incomplete" launchpad says something like "If nothing happens in 60 days then it will be close" or something. Does this mean that the bug eventually gets taken off the tracker or at least "closed"
[12:47] <ciaramooney> ?
[12:48] <qense> they planned to mark the bug as invalid after 60 days
[12:48] <qense> but if I'm right they disabled it and now stops couting down at 59 days to go
[12:49] <ciaramooney> so it remains on the tracker, and has to be closed manually at some point?
[12:49] <qense> yes
[12:49] <qense> but there's some discussion about that
[12:49] <qense> some people say a bug should never be markes as invalid unless it's not a bug or doesn't happen(anymore)
[12:50] <qense> others say that inactive bugs take valuable space in search lists and make things harders/longer for people
[12:50] <qense> the triage guide advices to close a bug after there hasn't been a response for more than a month after the last comment
[16:54] <afflux> morning
[16:57] <dejv_ntb> hello
[17:04] <mrooney> hello!
[17:36] <pwnguin> maybe a compromise should be reached along the lines of "dont mark expired bugs invalid, but do hide them from default searches
[19:49] <pwnguin> oh thats annoying
[19:49] <pwnguin> gnome bugzilla marks dups invalid and LP doesn't migrate to the dup
[19:50] <pwnguin> oh thats interesting
[19:50] <pwnguin> the dup also has a partner on LP
[19:51] <pwnguin> if one was to trust upstream bug trackers, one could automatically suggest dups in LP
[21:14] <Awsoonn> hi all~ how should 'X needs packaging' bugs be dealt with?
[21:14] <Awsoonn> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/238170
[21:35] <mrooney> Awsoonn: that is a workflow report so unless you really know what you are doing you probably shouldn't touch it
[21:37] <Awsoonn> I want to learn what to do if possible
[21:38] <mrooney> well, what I mean is, they are for developers themselves
[21:38] <mrooney> see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-bugsquad/2008-May/000851.html
[21:38] <mrooney> basically triagers should avoid them as the devs are using them to track their own progress and not report a bug persay
[21:42] <mrooney> I would recommend installing greasemonkey (if it isn't already) and Brian's script in that email, which puts in big text at the top "This is a workflow bug" so triagers know to leave them alone
[21:43] <Awsoonn> alright
[21:43] <Awsoonn> thank you
[21:44] <mrooney> Awsoonn: no problem :) does it make sense?
[21:44] <mrooney> it took me a fair amount of reading to (I think) wrap my head around them
[21:44] <Awsoonn> totaly
[21:44] <mrooney> okay, great, thanks for helping out
[21:45] <mrooney> if you are looking for bugs to triage, do you know about #ubuntu-bugs-announce?
[21:45] <mrooney> it announces bugs as they come in with packages and importance and status, etc, so you can scan that for interesting bugs you think you can help with, it is a useful resource
[21:46] <Awsoonn> nope, I'll keep that in mind
[21:46] <alan_m> I have a question, would firefox maximizing so huge that the title bar goes underneath the top panel be considered a bug?
[21:47] <alan_m> its not in fullscreen mode...but acts like it is, i have to PUT it in fullscreen, then resize it to get it back from doing this.
[21:48] <Awsoonn> alan_m, I would say yes
[21:48] <alan_m> its...quite annoying.
[21:49] <alan_m> it does it on a regular install with no addons to firefox
[21:49] <Awsoonn> It has happened to me as well, I feel your pain
[21:49] <alan_m> i know if i remove firefox package and install it back it gives a quick fix...but..then it goes back to old habits :/
[21:53] <alan_m> Awsoonn, even a clean profile doing it to you?
[21:54] <Old_Soldier> mrooney: thanks for the linkage for that greasemonkey script
[21:56] <Awsoonn> alan_m: it doesn't happen often to me
[21:57] <alan_m> its nuts :/
[21:57] <Old_Soldier> alan_m: it never happens to me but ive got plenty of extensions installed from other teams and trusty old foxclocks
[21:58] <alan_m> yeah
[22:02] <mrooney> Old_Soldier: no problem!
[22:02] <mrooney> thank bdmurray really!
[22:03] <Old_Soldier> im pretty new to bug triage ive been more involved in the forum teams and lately ubuntu docs but bug squad and bugcontrol is definitley complimentary to my other activities :)
[22:40] <Awsoonn> problems with an upgrade go to what package?
[22:43] <Old_Soldier> Awsoonn:  sometimes "problems with upgrade" are actually questions.  I always start off with making sure they dont have a transient archive server connection issue
[22:43]  * Old_Soldier deals with that daily on the forums
[22:44] <Old_Soldier> just my 2 cents :)
[22:45]  * alan_m takes your 2 cents and runs hehe j/k
[22:45] <Awsoonn> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/238035
[22:46]  * alan_m is confused by that description, heh, gonna read on
[22:46] <alan_m> thats...weird
[22:46] <Old_Soldier> i'd reply and get more information. its kind of confusing and really isnt very helpful
[22:47] <Awsoonn> alan_m: indeed
[22:47] <alan_m> yeah, im doing that now Old_Soldier
[22:47] <Old_Soldier> lol but i guess i think too much like a forum rat
[22:49] <alan_m> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/238035
[22:50] <alan_m> I cant do anything but add that comment to it....way more info needed.
[23:19] <mohbana> hi
[23:19] <darthanubis> !hi
[23:20] <Old_Soldier> hello mohbana
[23:20] <mohbana> is there a bug file against ubuntu not adjusting the font settings? i.e., selecting no subpixel rendering has no effect
[23:20] <darthanubis> !google
[23:21] <darthanubis> thats how I find out the fast way if a bug exists or no
[23:21] <darthanubis> t
[23:33] <mohbana> could someone tell me?
[23:40] <windmill> Hi, I'm about to report a bug on launchpad. I can't find a bug report for the specific problem. I read it's better to submit it through apport but it's not program crash, should I use the apport-cli version to submit?
[23:48] <mrooney> windmill: good question, I have never used apport to submit a bug by hand, I don't know if that is proper or not
[23:51] <dsas> windmill: If it's a GTK program you can click on "help->report a problem"
[23:52] <windmill> dsas, I can't dot
[23:53] <windmill> sorry, I was trying to say I can't do that because of the nature of the bug
[23:53] <windmill> it displays a dialogue that I can't close, so technically the app (nautilus) is still running


[00:15] <e2096> Hi,  can somebody tell me if there is a way to boot up Lubuntu without generating the locales?
[00:20] <GnuSense1> What are the hard drive requirements for 11.04 lubuntu.? I have Hardy xubuntu on 2.5 GB ext3, but 8.04 won't be supported anymore.  /dev/sda5     ext3    2.5G  2.2G  177M  93% /
[00:20] <KM0201> GnuSense1: 2.5gb is bare, bare minimum.
[00:22] <GnuSense1> I figure I can strip out LibreOffice and any games, that should give me enough breathing room to get updates and install a few packages I use.
[00:25] <GnuSense1> I saw something on the release notes about pcmanfm having gvfs/gio.  Does it now support browsing network shares like xfce 4.8 Thunar?
[00:26] <KM0201> GnuSense1: i dunno... minimum install, is 2.1gig
[00:26] <KM0201> and... i don't know about browsing network shares, hang on
[00:26] <GnuSense1> I guess LibreOffice isn't on the CD, Gnumeric and Abiword are, but they are pretty small.
[00:26] <KM0201> right
[00:27] <KM0201> GnuSense1: i don't see browsing network shares
[00:27] <KM0201> GnuSense1: i don't think you're gonna get much out of 2.1gigs to be honest
[00:28] <GnuSense1> 2.5, but yes, its a tight squeeze.  I've been running Hardy Xubuntu since 2008, though.
[00:28] <KM0201> GnuSense1: i'm surprised honestly
[00:29] <GnuSense1> Sometimes I have to update some packages, do a 'apt-get clean', then update the rest.
[00:30] <GnuSense1> And obviously immediately clean up any old kernels
[00:31] <KM0201> wow.. i think i'd spread it to about 4-5gigs, to make it much easier
[00:33] <GnuSense1> 8 year old laptop, small hard drive, the Windows partition only has a spare 1.9 GB, and even though I never use it, I figured I paid for it and out to keep it.
[00:33] <KM0201> 8yrs old? for crying out loud, nuke windows
[00:35] <GnuSense1> I guess I should.  I only boot it to update it and it was never super stable, but it is nice to have a Windows install to use as a model to support Windows using friends and family.
[00:40] <GnuSense1> It doesn't look like there is too much extra to strip out of the base install, Ace of Penguins, gnumeric, maybe Sylpheed, Transmission and xchat (since it has pidgin), but then I need to install flash and codecs.  I like the package choice (audacious is my favorite music player, mtpaint is great, pcmanfm is light but has tabs, GPicView is one of my favorite graphics browsers (along with Geeqie)
[00:46] <KM0201> GnuSense1: i dunno.. seems awful low on space
[00:48] <GnuSense1> I could probably nuke my 2.2 GB /home partition and give myself a bit more overhead without a dedicated /home, but I run straight Lucid Ubuntu on a Dell Mini with a 4 GB ssd and it works OK.
[00:49] <GnuSense1> Boots to GDM in something like 10 seconds, too, with an Atom CPU
[01:27] <mrowley> Hello, is this where I can get help configuring my system? I just switched from Ubuntu to Lubuntu, and have a few quick questions.
[01:30] <WiZ> what would you like to do?
[01:32] <mrowley> Thanks! I just want to disable touch-clicking on my touchpad. Stray clicks bother me. I have the synaptics touchpad package installed (by default, apparently), but the keyboard and mouse settings in the menu are very simple and include no touchpad features.
[01:34] <mrowley> I just installed 11.04, and the synaptics touchpad driver worked for the same laptop on ubuntu 10.8.
[02:06] <szczur> mrowley, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1457053
[02:15] <mrowley> Thank-you szczur. I read about setting MaxTapTime=0, but didn't know where to do it. I'll give this a try now!
[02:17] <szczur> no problem :)
[03:26] <KM0201> is there an eay way to change lubuntu's login screen wallpaper?
[03:34] <Unit193> KM0201: sudo nano /etc/lxdm/default.conf and put your pic in /usr/share/lubuntu/wallpapers/ (with correct permissions)
[03:37] <KM0201> gotcha
[06:51] <MK``> Where can I get the previous versions of Lubuntu and the alphas?
[06:54] <KM0201> MK``: previous versions?.. probably on lubuntu.net would be my guess.. the alphas for 11.10 probably aren't out yet
[06:55] <MK``> it lists md5sums for them but the isos/torrents are not linked
[06:55] <MK``> http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/
[06:55] <MK``> there
[06:55] <Unit193> MK``: One second from posting that...
[06:56] <KM0201> man, thats slower than christmas
[06:56] <MK``> I mean that only has the recent ones D:
[06:58] <bioterror> i have a secret stash!
[06:59] <bioterror> phillw, give kids some alphas ;)
[07:08] <Ascavasaion> I just looked at http://www.linoob.com/2011/04/lubuntu-11-04-final-released/ for minimum requirements.  I am running an AMD Duron 1300MHz, 384Mb RAM and 20Gb HDD which is well within the minimum requirements there.  I was wondering if anyone here has run lubuntu on a similar or older machine and if they can tell me if it is really worth it.
[07:08]  * Unit193 walks it on 500MHz
[07:09] <Ascavasaion> Unit193: Walks it?  As in 11.04 runs okay on it?
[07:10] <Unit193> It's not as fast as it is on newer computers. Your computer will run it just fine!
[07:11] <Ascavasaion> Unit193: Thank you buddy... I appreciate it.  I am capped by my ISP, so I tend to be a scrooge with large downloads of ISOs.  But if you say it will be fine then I will go ahead and download the ISO.
[07:12] <Unit193> Ascavasaion: I have never tested it on a computer in that range, only faster and slower
[07:13] <Ascavasaion> Unit193: I am just looking for a machine I can play MP3s on like a uke box, run a small internal IRC server, and leave conenctions onto international IRC connections, MSN, etc.  runngin 24/7
[07:14] <MK``> sounds fine
[07:14] <phillw> MK``: they al on my server area :P
[07:15] <MK``> phillw: can I has?
[07:15] <Unit193> Ascavasaion: I run it 24/42 (so far ;) ) with irssi and some other programs
[07:16] <Ascavasaion> thank you guys.  I appreciate it.  Let me get downloading :)
[07:21] <Ascavasaion> Um, another thing... is lubuntu 11.04 a LTS version?
[07:21] <Unit193> Not that I know of
[07:22] <Ascavasaion> Oh :(
[07:22] <Ascavasaion> Darn!
[07:23] <MK``> Ascavasaion: it's not an "official" LTS but the community is providing support for it as if it were
[07:23] <MK``> due to 10.10's dropping of support for i586 processors
[07:23] <MK``> er...
[07:23] <MK``> 10.04 I meant
[07:23] <Ascavasaion> MK``: Aaah, thank you :)
[07:23] <MK``> sorry
[07:23] <MK``> 11.04 is not an LTS.
[07:24] <phillw> MK``: 10,04 is on the documentation
[07:24] <MK``> k
[07:24] <MK``> phillw: is this server area public? :P
[07:25] <phillw> MK``: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#10.04
[07:25] <MK``> ahh
[07:26] <MK``> ok
[07:26] <MK``> thanks
[07:26] <MK``> Damn...
[07:27] <MK``> the HD I was going to install xubuntu and lubuntu on has 33 bad sectors :(
[07:27] <phillw> I'm not too sure how many torrent feeds you will find, if none then use my server but it is throttled on iso uploads.
[07:28] <phillw> 33 is not too bad :)
[07:28] <Unit193> "The team are committed"?
[07:30] <phillw> Unit193: it was a very sort exchange of emails once we became aware of i586 being dropped from 10.10..... We will support 10.04 as if it was an LTS (even though for us it was not).
[07:30] <phillw> s/sort/short
[07:50] <MK``> phillw: doesn't seem to have any torrents :P
[07:52] <Unit193> MK``: I *think* this might be what you're looking for: http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/lubuntu-10.04.iso.torrent
[07:53] <MK``> I was looking for the alpha and beta torrents/isos, Unit193
[07:54] <MK``> Seems phillw has the natty ones, I will have to search around for the lucid and maverick ones
[07:54] <Unit193> Then I think wrong...
[07:54] <MK``> :P
[07:57] <phillw> MK``: I have the majority of the lubuntu alpha and beta releases still on my server, if you tell which one you are after I'll check and see if it is there.
[07:57] <MK``> all the ones listed here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/md5sum.txt
[07:57] <phillw> MK``: what, you want them all?
[07:58] <MK``> I want to make an archive :P
[07:58] <head_victim> I have 10.04, 10.10, 10.10 Alternate, 11.04 A1, A2 A3 B1 B2 and Final Release seeding ATM.
[07:59] <phillw> My server provider would fry my delicate parts were I to do that!
[08:00] <head_victim> My 11.04 is nearly at a ratio of 10 already
[08:00] <Unit193> MK``: If you get them, screenshots of all the default desktops?
[08:00] <MK``> can you send me the torrents head_victim
[08:00] <head_victim> Would have been better but I forgot to switch it on properly release night
[08:00] <MK``> sure Unit193 :P
[08:01] <head_victim> MK``: pm me an email address?
[08:01] <MK``> can't dcc?
[08:01] <head_victim> On a different pc
[08:04] <phillw> MK``: there is an archive, fully backed up of every iso uploaded to my server in Canada, which is where my server lives (I'm in the UK).
[08:04] <MK``> cool
[08:05] <phillw> The company were kind enough to allow the shared server be allowed to be a direct download fall back for lubuntu iso's.
[08:06] <head_victim> MK``: so they're all the ones I still seed anyway.
[08:06] <head_victim> Let me know if there's  a problem
[08:07] <head_victim> It's currently open as much as my residential connection allows. If anyone starts gaming it gets slowed right down though. So just a heads up they will still seed, just the speed goes up and down sometimes.
[08:07] <MK``> yeah that's fine, no rush
[08:09] <head_victim> I have a 50GB plan at home here that I generally only use 20 or so of a month. The rest I try and donate to Lubuntu by seeding (uploads count towards my quota)
[08:12] <phillw> head_victim: even as the direct server for lubuntu, I'm still classed as a 'light' user by the company I use for my server.
[08:13] <MK``> Once I got them all I will seed them
[08:13] <MK``> my ISP introduced data caps yesterday, actually heh. Previously unlimited.
[08:14] <Unit193> I still have unlimited
[08:14] <phillw> MK``: only 10.04 and 11.04 need seeding
[08:14] <MK``> naturally
[08:15] <head_victim> I was actually going to clean up my torrent stuff this week now that the new release is out
[08:15] <head_victim> I would have deleted all those alphas and betas in that process
[08:16] <MK``> Seeding 11.04 now.
[08:16] <MK``> heh
[08:16] <head_victim> Nice to see oneiric popping up in the repositories today.
[08:17] <head_victim> (I noticed it when running my daily rsync of a Ubuntu mirror)
[08:17] <phillw> head_victim: as we are comitted to support 10.04, that should still be available. 10.10 does not really need to be used with the release of 11.04
[08:17] <head_victim> phillw: yeah that's what i was thinking.
[08:17] <head_victim> I was going ot keep the iso
[08:17] <head_victim> Never know when having an old release is handy. The testing ones I was going to ditch
[08:18] <MK``> I'm that guy that hordes files
[08:18] <MK``> so, yeah
[08:19] <phillw> head_victim: bioterror keeps my server up to date with all the releases, heck I only have 1 TB of space and still rattle around like one bean in an empty can :P
[08:20] <phillw> Just to hit 20% would be great :)
[08:20] <head_victim> Hah, mirror a Ubuntu release and archive server - that's just under 700GB as of today :)
[08:20] <MK``> i'm on my way
[08:23] <phillw> head_victim: once the new dedicated server is set up, I have something like 10 TB on it... Even that young crazy Australian will not need two accounts to store his pornogaphy DVDs on :P
[08:26] <phillw> Holy crap, we're on the support channel. :(
[08:26]  * phillw moves to offtopic
[08:27] <MK``> Well I'm getting to bed. Night guys.
[12:43] <lubuntu> how run Bluetooth in lubuntu ?
[12:43] <bioterror> !bluetooth
[12:45] <lubuntu> i know but where is icon of BT default is off
[12:45] <lubuntu> in tray
[12:45] <bioterror> you need to run it
[12:46] <lubuntu> ok i have
[12:46] <bioterror> add to startup or something
[12:46] <lubuntu> bluetooth-agent
[12:46] <MrChrisDruif> Bluetooth isn't a systray but an indicator these days
[12:46]  * bioterror still prefers cable
[12:46] <bioterror> ;)
[12:49] <lubuntu> i preffer too but BT is easy to send one file ;)
[12:51] <MrChrisDruif> Indeed :)
[12:51] <MrChrisDruif> Ow, have we managed to create a distribution which can finally talk for itself? =-O
[12:59] <head_victim> The SII is among us!
[13:01] <MrChrisDruif> xD
[13:01] <MrChrisDruif> Indeed
[13:03] <lubuntu> what program is good on ubuntu  for nokia phone ?
[13:04] <bioterror> I used pcmanfm with my N97 mini
[13:04] <bioterror> for file management :D
[13:16] <lubuntu> i use too but something like pcsuit is on linux ?
[13:16] <lubuntu> for internet connection 3g?
[13:16] <bioterror> hahaha
[13:17] <bioterror> I know a finnish guide
[13:17] <bioterror> how to make your pc dial thru phone
[13:17] <bioterror> but nowdays phones can work as a wlan AP
[13:18] <lubuntu> my n73 dont have wifi
[13:18] <lubuntu> its possible to use internet from usb ?
[13:18] <lubuntu> on phone
[13:20] <bioterror> sure
[13:20] <bioterror> pppon pppoff and so on
[13:29] <bioterror> actually
[13:29] <bioterror> now I remember
[13:29] <bioterror> I used network manager for calling to internetz!
[13:29] <bioterror> few months ago
[13:29] <bioterror> you choose your ISP and click next next next
[14:42] <lubuntu> thx, i try
[14:43] <lubuntu> i download rar file and dont unrar default in system? ;)
[14:51] <MrChrisDruif> Rar isn't an open format afaik. You can install it with Synaptic
[15:00] <lubuntu> yes i do it
[15:00] <lubuntu> its unrar free and not free i see in synaptic
[17:40] <stlsaint> room poke
[17:54] <lubuntu> ?
[17:55] <KM0201> something kinda strange i've noticed with lubuntu... if you got o yoru desktop preferences to change your wallpaper, and choose in wallpaper mode "Fill with background color"... you'll immediately go to a black screen w/  acursor... i tried running some commands, but there's no prompt, just a flashing cursor.  Did it twice.. had to reboot to get back to my normal desktop.
[17:56] <KM0201> not a huge deal, just a heads up.
[18:11] <stlsaint> lubuntu: yes
[18:11] <stlsaint> KM0201: if that is repeatable then that is a bug that you can file with launchpad
[18:11] <lubuntu> what yes?
[18:11] <stlsaint> brb
[18:12] <KM0201> stlsaint: well, definitely repeatable... but my launchpad password isn't working for some reason.. lemme check and see if they mailed me a new password.
[18:13] <KM0201> nope
[18:13] <KM0201> i signed up for a new one a fwe days ago
[18:15] <kill3> Why can't I find Lubuntu alternative install iso?
[18:15] <lubuntu> becouse instalator dont take too much
[18:16] <KM0201> kill3: they're out there...
[18:16] <kill3> I need one, but I could not find
[18:17] <kill3> I burned normal cd but my old computer can't handle it really
[18:17] <KM0201> hang on, someone posted a link to the server yesterda
[18:18] <KM0201> hmm
[18:18] <KM0201> maybe there is no alternate, i thought there was
[18:18] <KM0201> !alternate
[18:18] <KM0201> that goes to ubuntu
[18:19] <kill3> Kinda funny that Lubuntu alternate cd is hidden or there is none
[18:19] <KM0201> kill3: that really is strange
[18:19] <bioterror> there's none afaik
[18:19] <bioterror> noone has made it yet :D
[18:20] <KM0201> wonder if you could do a minimal install cd (with ubuntu) and install lxde?
[18:20] <kill3> Should I wait for it or use my 10.10 alternate cd?
[18:20] <KM0201> kill3: is it lubuntu 10.10, or ubuntu?
[18:20] <kill3> Lubuntu 10.10
[18:20] <KM0201> !minimal
[18:20] <KM0201> eh, nevermind
[18:21] <KM0201> that wouldn't work, becasue thats just gionna download gnome or whatever min. cd you downloaded.
[18:21] <kill3> Is there going to be released one?
[18:21] <KM0201> i was thinking it let you choose your GUI.
[18:21] <KM0201> kill3: i would certainly think (and hope) so
[18:22] <kill3> So should I use Ubuntu 10.04 minimal install or Lubuntu 10.10 minimal install?
[18:23] <KM0201> kill3: i'd use the 10.10 minimal, install, update, then upgrade lubuntu to 11.04
[18:23] <KM0201> thats just me though.. kind of a long way to go about it though
[18:24] <KM0201> well, looks like my bug is "known"... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pcmanfm/+bug/718343
[18:25] <kill3> Do I need to download all 10.10 updates before upgrading to 11.04  Lubuntu?
[18:25] <KM0201> kill3: hm, i'm not really sure...
[18:26] <lubuntu> no
[18:26] <KM0201> kill3: i would think so.. but i really don't know... of course, it also seems logical that 11.04 upgrade, will pull in appropriate pcakages
[18:26] <KM0201> well theres your answer. :)
[18:35] <kill3> I could not find my Lubuntu cd and my Ubuntu cd is 64bit so I guess I just wait if somebody makes a minimal iso for Lubuntu 11.04...
[18:38] <MK``> head_victim: I am now downloading the torrents
[19:04] <szczur> kill3, you can download this iso http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/natty/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/mini.iso
[19:04] <szczur> and then follow these steps https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp/MinimalInstall
[19:08] <WiZ> kill3: - http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/natty/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/mini.iso
[19:18] <KM0201> WiZ: pretty slick...
[19:19] <KM0201> WiZ: i take it that will also work w/ Lubuntu?
[19:19] <KM0201> sorry.. lubuntu 11.04
[19:21] <WiZ> yes
[19:40] <lubuntu> lubuntu 11.04 is grate ! :)
[19:41] <lubuntu> have some problem with gdesklets but its ok
[19:44] <KM0201> WiZ: yeah, i realized that after i posted that question.. that was specifically about lubuntu..lol
[19:45] <lubuntu> why in lubuntu radiotray info is so big?
[19:49] <WiZ> lol
[19:56] <bioterror> lubuntu, we like it things big!
[19:56] <lubuntu> yes but it soo big ;) 100px height;)
[20:12] <stlsaint> BORKED MINIMAL INSTALL
[20:12] <KM0201> stlsaint: i'm trying it in vbox now.
[20:12] <KM0201> :)
[20:13] <KM0201> so far, so good.. but its just now installing the base
[20:13] <stlsaint> Yea well i was too excited to go with vbox so now i have to download the full iso to do a live install
[20:13] <KM0201> lol
[20:13]  * Unit193 Installed LiveCD in VBox than added Liquorix :)
[20:13] <KM0201> i just wanna see if thosee instructions work.. where did you fail?
[20:14] <KM0201> what is the "--no-install-recommends lubuntu-desktop"... can you change that to "yes"... ? and install the codecs and what not? (i guess ic an try
[20:15] <stlsaint> KM0201: i dunno it stalled and i rebooted and BORK
[20:15] <KM0201> hmm
[20:15] <KM0201> guess we'll see, i'm only about 6% instaling the base system now, so i got a ways to go
[20:19] <KM0201> now it's cooking, its extracting and installing.. :)
[20:20] <KM0201> Unit193: liqurix?
[20:20]  * KM0201 has no idea what that is
[20:20] <KM0201> :)
[20:21] <Unit193> KM0201: Bleeding edge kernel (It's a bit faster)
[20:21] <KM0201> oh ok
[20:22] <KM0201> i don't do bleeding edge, unless i have a really good reason.. a bit faster wouldn't qualify
[20:22] <Unit193> Faster really does it for me (And it's only currently in a VM)
[20:23] <KM0201> oh ok.
[20:23] <KM0201> i probably would've tried it there.
[20:28] <kill3> szczur: I cannot use ethernet connection
[20:30] <kill3> So I guess I just wait if alternate install iso appears
[20:33] <kill3> or should I try installing from USB, does it need same a mount of memory? Strange that 256MB is not enough to normal live cd installation btw...
[20:33] <KM0201> kill3: i take it the alt. cd doesn't recognize your wireless device?
[20:36] <kill3> I didn't manage to get it work even before install in 10.10, drivers, drivers...
[20:40] <KM0201> kill3: hmm.. well, so far so good.. i'm at 83% on instaling the base now.. when thats done, i'll restart the virtual machine and follow the instructinos, see what happens
[20:52]  * KM0201 wonders how long could it possibly take to "prepare linux-headers".
[20:52] <KM0201> lol.. and now it moves
[20:52] <KM0201> slowly but surely.. now at 91%
[20:53] <KM0201> uh oh, 93, and it looks like its really running now..lol
[20:55] <KM0201> configuring apt.. almost there
[23:38] <Gulfstream> Is there a Lubuntu Mac PPC .iso?
[23:40] <Unit193> Gulfstream: You may be able to install lubuntu-desktop from the !mini iso
[23:40] <Gulfstream> maybe that'll work. thanks
[23:46] <kosaidpo|>  is it possible to install the 11.04 from my usb but iwanna keep these apps and games i have
[23:50] <MrChrisDruif> kosaidpo|: Not sure, with Ubuntu you get the option to upgrade your current install. Don't know if it's the same with Lubuntu
[23:51] <kosaidpo|> wht abt cp my game folders from the sytem 's folder and past it late
[23:51] <kosaidpo|> wud that wok ??
[23:52] <MrChrisDruif> I don't know what you mean, not would I know if that'll work
[23:56] <kosaidpo|> MrChrisDruif: well i have for ex X game in the /usr/bin place so ill copy it
[23:57] <MrChrisDruif> Alright
[23:57] <kosaidpo|> then when im done installin 11.04 ill past it their again
[23:57] <kosaidpo|> MrChrisDruif: you got me now : ]
[23:57] <MrChrisDruif> Yeah, kinda :)
[23:58] <kosaidpo|> hahah so wht you think wud that work ??


[17:36] <burli> Hi
[17:36] <burli> I have a question
[17:36] <burli> where do you get the EPG informations for Ubuntu-TV?
[17:37] <burli> I think about an EPG App for Ubuntu Tablet and Phone, but I have a problem to get legal and free data for germany
[17:37] <ogra_> i think the demo only used public BBC data
[17:38] <burli> and how it should work in the final version?
[17:38]  * ogra_ has no idea :) i'm not coding it ... but i saw the demo
[17:38] <ogra_> and played with it
[17:39] <ogra_> and that had all free BBC channels in it and nothing more ... for germany you might be able to do the same with the öffis :)
[17:39] <ogra_> by pulling it from their websites
[17:40] <ogra_> but i doubt you will find free data for private stations
[17:40] <burli> öffis? are you from germany? ;)
[17:40] <ogra_> jup
[17:41] <burli> lol
[17:43] <burli> yeah. it's really annoying. fu** content mafia.
[17:43] <burli> ogra_, http://forum.ubuntuusers.de/topic/apps-fuer-ubuntu-tablet-und-ubuntu-phone/
[18:30] <willcooke> the real product will download OTA, plus for regions without OTA there will be agreements with service providers