[15:01] <infinity> Oontz, oontz, oontz.
[15:01] <infinity> \o
[15:01] <infinity> o/
[15:01] <infinity> \o/
[15:01]  * mvo_ waves
[15:01]  * slangasek waves
[15:02] <slangasek> #startmeeting
[15:02] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Apr  3 15:02:00 2014 UTC.  The chair is slangasek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[15:02] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[15:02] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Lightning round
[15:02] <slangasek> $ echo $(shuf -e barry doko stgraber jodh bdmurray slangasek cjwatson xnox caribou infinity mvo)
[15:02] <slangasek> xnox jodh doko barry stgraber mvo cjwatson infinity slangasek bdmurray caribou
[15:02] <slangasek> and go!
[15:02] <xnox> me first =) ok
[15:03] <xnox> * chase up usb-creator patches, many bugfixes merged and uploaded
[15:03] <xnox> * chase up flickerless boot requests from #Cert, turned out kernel and
[15:03] <xnox>   apw fixed those (bug #1300247 and bug #1300244)
[15:03] <xnox> * chase up xts/kernel SRU bug (d-i released, all is done)
[15:03] <xnox> * finish up python3.3 dropage
[15:03] <xnox> * drop u1, remaining task for trusty is thunderbird patch
[15:03] <xnox> TODO
[15:03] <xnox> * android-x86 does not boot when compiled with my toolchain
[15:03] <xnox> * upload plymouth
[15:03] <xnox> ..
[15:03] <xnox> and last week was out skiing.
[15:03] <xnox> on a snowboard but that's minor details.
[15:04] <slangasek> you should've taken your laptop with while snowboarding, it's nearly as ergonomic as working while chasing a deer with a spear
[15:04] <infinity> jodh_: You're up, if your bouncing internet hasn't caught up with reality.
[15:04] <jodh_> infinity: yeah, perfect timing... :) one sec...
[15:04] <xnox> slangasek: noted. There actually was free wifi on most slopes (not black though, not sure why not)
[15:05] <slangasek> hah
[15:05] <jodh_> * foundations-1305-upstart-work-items
[15:05] <jodh_>   - cgroup support:
[15:05] <jodh_>     - Updated cgroup branch to make use of new cgmanager
[15:05] <jodh_>       API RemoveOnEmpty() (which simplifies the Upstart code significantly).
[15:05] <jodh_>     - Now mostly working (currently debugging a re-exec issue).
[15:05] <jodh_>     - Having a 1 day sprint tomorrow with xnox to work on the tests.
[15:05] <jodh_> ❂
[15:05] <infinity> jodh_: Say, do I get my session bug fixed? ;)
[15:06] <jodh_> infinity: it's in the pile somewhere, but cgroups is the priority atm. You could try bending xnox/stgrabers ear though? :)
[15:06] <infinity> Or I could just submit an MP to invert the option and the result and call it done.  Tempted.
[15:06] <doko> - openjdk-6 and openjdk-7 updates, merges, icedtea-web pending
[15:06] <doko> - finally libjogl2-java building, no more jvm crash on aarch64.
[15:06] <doko> - gnat bootstrap for ppc64el
[15:06] <doko> - various fixes to clean up -proposed
[15:06] <doko> - arm64 and ppc64el build fixes
[15:06] <doko> - built two scheme interpreters on arm64 and ppc64el
[15:06] <doko> - prepare a final gcc-4.8 upload
[15:06] <doko> (done)
[15:06] <barry> phone: Python 3 gdebi: LP: #1283574 & LP: #1299169.  push notifications meeting.  autopilot py3 work and removal of py2 continuing.
[15:06] <barry> debian/ubuntu: pyflakes 0.8-1 and 0.8.1-1 (LP: #1300366). debian bug 741832 (perplexing & still in progress).  python-pip 1.5.4-1 (LP: #1200389)
[15:06] <barry> working on "the ensurepip issue" for py34.  engaging upstream about pip install dist-packages, etc.  pycon starts next week.
[15:07] <barry> done
[15:07] <stgraber>  - Final beta
[15:07] <stgraber>  - A ton of queue reviews, some FFes and a bit of patch piloting
[15:07] <stgraber>  - Got logind to talk to cgmanager, now dealing with the bugs
[15:07] <stgraber>  - Looking into a few network related bugs (mostly precise to trusty upgrades)
[15:07] <jodh_> infinity: knock yourself out :)
[15:07] <stgraber>  - Fixed a few issues with LXC's CI environment, usual code reviews, about to release 1.0.3.
[15:07] <stgraber>  - Added adt tests to cgmanager.
[15:07] <stgraber>  - Couple more bugfixes here and there.
[15:07] <stgraber>  - Booking some more flights.
[15:07] <stgraber> (DONE)
[15:07] <mvo_> DONE:
[15:07] <mvo_> apt: add "Debug::RunScripts", ignore SIGPIPE in RunScriptsWithPackage, merge apt-manpage branch, release 1.0, look into implementing SrcCacheDB, look into backport for https range-request bug #1157943 (failed), cherry pick fix #1157943
[15:07] <mvo_> sponsoring: #1001376, review lp:~barry/update-manager/lp1295392/+merge/212065, #880493,
[15:07] <mvo_> misc: try to reprocue #1069133, command-not-found data update, play with ubuntu-emulator, new unattended-upgrades for debian/ubuntu, click phonecall with tvoss
[15:07] <mvo_> release-upgrades: look into #1286161 and do fix
[15:07] <mvo_> TODO:
[15:07] <mvo_> * get my calendar under control so that I don't overlook meetings again
[15:07] <mvo_> * implementing SrcCacheDB in apt-ftparchive
[15:08] <mvo_> * familiarize myself with all the stuff that is new or changed (click, system-images, ...)
[15:08] <mvo_> DONE
[15:08] <bdmurray> mvo_: can you document how to update all of command-not-found data?
[15:09] <cjwatson> Ported a few more packages to new architectures: mplayer2, lua-posix, meta-gnome3.
[15:09] <cjwatson> Fixed regression in grub-installer/Kickstart (bug 1292628).
[15:09] <cjwatson> Finished packaging OpenSSH 6.6p1.
[15:09] <cjwatson> Integrated parted patches from Phillip Susi and outstanding Ubuntu changes into Debian, and synced.  Fixed a resulting regression (bug 1300072).
[15:09] <cjwatson> Fixed some ppc64el problems in GRUB, plus Debian #735935, bug 1299041, and bug 1298399.
[15:09] <cjwatson> Fixed a few more click bugs (bug 1298457, bug 1297519, and a build failure for backports).
[15:09] <cjwatson> Fixed up missing hardening features in schroot and moved it to main.
[15:09] <cjwatson> Finished packaging iprutils.
[15:09] <cjwatson> ..
[15:09] <cjwatson> mvo_: (most productive first three days eva)
[15:09] <infinity> - Final beta released
[15:09] <infinity> - +1, build fixes, etc
[15:09] <infinity> - Hunted some fun glibc bugs upstream
[15:09] <infinity> - Stuff, also things
[15:09] <infinity> - Annoyed mvo
[15:09] <cjwatson> fsvo "first"
[15:09] <infinity> ☭
[15:10] <mvo_> bdmurray: yes, I hope I can prodive a stable download location so that its just a bzr-buildpackage to update the data in the future. but yes +100 for better documentation there!
[15:10] <infinity> bdmurray: He's set it up cronned on nusakan right now, we might move it to a role account somewhere sane and make it vaguely self-documenting at that point.
[15:10] <mvo_> cjwatson: I had a bit of a head-start :)
[15:10] <barry> mvo_: a readme in the source package would be great :)
[15:11] <xnox> mvo_: about command-not-found, the amd64 package should really also ship indexes for i386, since multiarch is enabled by default and some apps are i386 only e.g. "ubuntu-emulator" shall i file a separate bug about that?
[15:11] <mvo_> barry: indeed, I will do that
[15:11] <slangasek>  * off on Monday, so shorter week
[15:11] <slangasek>  * various queue reviews for the final freeze
[15:11] <slangasek>  * spending some time looking at the Qt gl/gles split for x86, to see if we can make this work
[15:11] <slangasek>  * working with bdmurray, infinity, xnox on packaging of various new ppc64el-specific packages (lsvpd, libvpd, ppc64-diag)
[15:11] <slangasek>  * UPCOMING:
[15:11] <slangasek>   * interviewing for the Java role this week
[15:11] <mvo_> xnox: good point, please do (but I also write it down now)
[15:11] <slangasek>   * discussion with the TB about how archive-specific archives can/should be managed under the Ubuntu umbrella (UbuntuKylin)
[15:12] <infinity> slangasek: "archive-specific archives"?
[15:12] <slangasek> heh
[15:12] <slangasek> flavor-specific
[15:12] <infinity> As in, they don't want to be in our archive anymore?
[15:13] <infinity> This should be fun.
[15:14] <xnox> mvo_: bug #1302011
[15:14] <bdmurray> worked with webops to resolve issues with the daisy not accepting OOPSes and retracers failing
[15:14] <bdmurray> updated errors.ubuntu.com to r463 (don't display derivatives or unknown distros on the front page count)
[15:14] <bdmurray> updated daisy to use python-distro-info for determining the devel release of Ubuntu (r419)
[15:14] <bdmurray> also updated error-tracker-dependencies to depend on python-distro-info
[15:14] <bdmurray> updated cassandra tunnels code with prodstack host IPs for evan
[15:14] <bdmurray> wrote a tool to query launchpad with outdated dbg sym log messages from the retracers to see if the packages are recent so we can create the ddebs
[15:15] <infinity> mvo_: One could really argue that point for all arches.  I suspect the extra data for including all arches would be tiny, so maybe worth if it c-n-f said something like "for binary ppc-thing, install foo:powerpc or foo:ppc64el, it's not available on your current architecture"... Or, even more cleverly, only tell me about it if it's available on a foreign-arch I already have enabled.
[15:15] <bdmurray> research into a failed armhf retrace for seb128
[15:15] <slangasek> infinity: see your TB list mail; it's not that they don't want to be in our archive, but that they have "partner" apps that can't go in the /Canonical/ partner archive
[15:15] <bdmurray> wrote a tool to check retracer log files to find out why a retrace failed
[15:15] <bdmurray> SRU queue work with arges
[15:15] <bdmurray> uploaded fix for ubuntu-release-upgrader bug 1294814
[15:15] <bdmurray> wrote and uploaded an apport package hook for kerneloops
[15:15] <bdmurray> research and testing of ubuntu-release-upgrader bug 1298281
[15:15] <bdmurray> apturl bug triage and reporting (LP: #1300465 and LP: #1300466)
[15:15] <bdmurray> reported apport LP: #1300474 regarding tmpdir
[15:15] <bdmurray> uploaded fix for libpng bug LP: #1298779
[15:15] <bdmurray> testing upgrade bug 1286161
[15:15] <bdmurray> ✔ done
[15:16] <caribou> * Onboarding of new colleague Jorge Niedbalski
[15:16] <caribou> * Worked on updating the Onboarding documentation
[15:16] <caribou> * Completed pre-sponsor SRU work for bug #1293291 (enable btmp logging)
[15:16] <caribou> * Tested new kexec-tools v2.0.6
[15:16] <caribou> * sosreport development & SRU (bug #1296755)
[15:16] <caribou> * Started investigation on bug #1157943 with mvo
[15:16] <xnox> infinity: mvo_: i guess we should ship data for all arches in an arch_all package, and simply do lookup across arches that are enabled e.g. (all, amd64, foreign)
[15:16] <caribou> btmp logging is bug #743858
[15:16] <caribou> done
[15:16] <slangasek> infinity, stgraber: it's obviously not great timing in the release cycle for them to be raising this question, so it's understandable if the TB doesn't manage to sign off on it before release, but this is an important problem so please make this TB discussion a priority
[15:17] <infinity> slangasek: Yeah, just caught up on the thread, I haven't read that folder for a few days.
[15:17] <infinity> slangasek: Ick.
[15:17] <stgraber> slangasek: yeah, I already replied to their proposal yesterday (though not particularly positively :))
[15:18] <slangasek> stgraber: well, you replied saying "too late for 14.04" - I'm saying we should try our best to decide this for 14.04, even though the request is quite late :)
[15:19] <slangasek> any questions re: status?
[15:19] <caribou> I'm not sure it's the right place to ask, but one may show me where to ask :
[15:20] <stgraber> slangasek: well, if we want to decide on this quickly, I'm fine sending a simple -1 now, but thought it may be worth seeing if they can come up with something slightly more reasonable that I may be convinced to approve.
[15:20] <caribou> I'm member of BugControl so I can add task to series
[15:20] <caribou> but I cannot approve them : who should I ask to be added to the proper team ?
[15:20] <infinity> caribou: Me.
[15:20] <infinity> caribou: What's your LP ID?
[15:20] <caribou> infinity: so plleeeaase : louis-bouchard
[15:21] <caribou> arges is tired of approving them for me
[15:21] <caribou> infinity: thanks!
[15:21] <slangasek> stgraber: heh - I would expect a more subtle engagement than just a -1.  AFAIK we have no clearly stated policy describing what flavors can or can't have enabled for user downloads, and I think the TB should really write up a policy grounded in principle
[15:21] <infinity> caribou: You're welcome.
[15:22] <caribou> that's all I had
[15:22] <slangasek> [TOPIC] AOB
[15:22] <slangasek> anything else for today?
[15:22] <infinity> Naps.
[15:23] <barry> green tea
[15:23] <mvo_> !!!
[15:23] <infinity> Unicycle hockey?
[15:23] <mvo_> green tea!
[15:23] <mvo_> infinity: not today :)
[15:23] <stgraber> slangasek: I believe we actually have documentation on that somewhere back when we introduced extras.ubuntu.com. One of those pages is the extension repository documentation but it's not particularly clear, I vaguely remember there being some other page which more clearly states what flavors can use.
[15:23] <xnox> icecream truck arrived \o/
[15:24] <slangasek> stgraber: if you could find that page and bring it to the discussion, I think that would be very useful
[15:25] <infinity> slangasek: cf: my discussions last night about Canonical UNIX user groups and being paranoid about exposure of a few accounts on ftpmaster and cdimage, I'm really not comfy with flavours defaulting to near-impossible-to-audit external archives of potential doom.  So, we need both some policy and some better descriptions of what they plan, and what they could compromise on once that plan is deemed nutty.
[15:26] <slangasek> infinity: righto.  Let's not discuss here with a captive audience though, let's please take it to the list
[15:26] <infinity> xnox: And thanks, now I want a nap *and* ice cream.  This could get messy.
[15:26] <slangasek> #endmeeting
[15:26] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Apr  3 15:26:43 2014 UTC.
[15:26] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2014/ubuntu-meeting.2014-04-03-15.02.moin.txt
[15:26] <jodh_> thanks!
[15:26] <slangasek> thanks :)
[15:27] <mvo_> thanks!
[15:27] <caribou> thanks
[15:27] <stgraber> thanks!
[15:27] <barry> thanks!
[15:34] <cjwatson> slangasek: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ExtensionRepositoryPolicy
[15:34] <cjwatson> as stgraber says, it's a bit vague
[15:34] <slangasek> cjwatson: ta
[15:35] <cjwatson> but it was intended for this kind of thing
[16:17] <Laney> stgraber: Maybe you're thinking of what the old trademark policy said
[16:17] <Laney> https://web.archive.org/web/20130517062713/http://www.ubuntu.com/trademark-policy
[16:18] <Laney> Mainly links to the extension repository policy, but does say a little bit more about what remixes can do
[16:18] <Laney> Don't know how relevant the ™ policy would be to Kylin though
[16:19] <stgraber> Laney: ah yeah, I believe that's what Allison wrote back then, that must be it
[16:20] <Laney> Yes, I helped draft it ;-)
[16:21] <Laney> But as I say, I doubt it helps you with precedent here
[16:59] <pleia2> o/
[16:59] <pleia2> #startmeeting Community Council
[16:59] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Apr  3 16:59:47 2014 UTC.  The chair is pleia2. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:59] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[16:59] <pleia2> #chair mhall119 elfy
[16:59] <meetingology> Current chairs: elfy mhall119 pleia2
[17:00]  * mhall119 is here
[17:00]  * elfy is too
[17:01] <pleia2> today on the schedule we have quick check-ins with the Doc team and QA team, we'll wait a couple minutes to see if more CC folks drift in
[17:01] <pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncilAgenda
[17:02] <mhall119> cprofitt: meeting time
[17:02] <mhall119> I know dholbach wasn't going to be here, and czajkowski is setting up for an event so may not be
[17:03] <GunnarHj> o/
[17:03] <belkinsa> o/ and I'm for the Doc Team.  GunnarHj is too.
[17:04] <pleia2> alright, let's get rolling
[17:04] <pleia2> #topic Doc team check-in
[17:04] <dholbach> yep, back again
[17:04] <pleia2> hello Doc team friends! how are things going this cycle?
[17:04] <dholbach> sorry for being a bit late
[17:05] <GunnarHj> We have been missing a driver for the desktop guide.
[17:05]  * pleia2 switches hats
[17:05] <dholbach> hello GunnarHj :)
[17:05] <pleia2> I've tried to help nudge things along by helping with writing calls, but having more folks willing to push Desktop stuff forward would really help
[17:05] <GunnarHj> dholbach: Hi
[17:06] <dholbach> a driver being somebody who's aware of the bug situation, reviews merge proposals and things like that?
[17:06] <mhall119> pleia2: GunnarHj: is it particularly difficult or otherwise putting people of from trying to do it?
[17:06] <pleia2> the getting involved docs have improved a lot, recruitment itself is just down
[17:07] <GunnarHj> Fixing bugs and handling MPs works.
[17:07] <GunnarHj> But keeping up to date with news and taking responsibility for the docs update has not worked well.
[17:08] <mhall119> how are the current contributors being promoted/praised for their work?
[17:08] <pleia2> we also have the typical problem of FFes hitting us hard, Ubuntu One is the big nusiance this time - thanks to GunnarHj for being on top of that
[17:09] <pleia2> I wish they could have told us a month ago :)
[17:09] <belkinsa> Agreed.
[17:09] <dholbach> oh yeah, I can imagine :-/
[17:09] <GunnarHj> mhall119: I'm biased, but I think we show that they are welcome and that their work is appreciated.
[17:09] <mhall119> GunnarHj: I was thinking more externally and publicly
[17:10] <dholbach> are reviews of the docs and/or updates of the TODO list something which is discussed in regular meetings?
[17:10] <pleia2> I think what we really need is a Desktop Champion, who herds cats and makes sure we're on top of calls for Doc review and things
[17:10] <mhall119> it might help recruitment if others see the current contributors getting that kind of recognition
[17:10] <elfy> so - it's mostly recruitment and 'it's cycle end' issues again?
[17:10] <GunnarHj> pleia2: Right, Desktop champion, driver or whatever...
[17:10] <pleia2> elfy: yeah, but technical process wise I think we've got packaging and translations stuff down, finally :)
[17:10] <elfy> I think recruitment is not easy for anyone that I've had much to do with lately to be honest
[17:11]  * elfy has a bucket full of his own like that
[17:11] <mhall119> docs are typically a challenge for recruiting, in my experience
[17:11] <mhall119> for any project
[17:11] <elfy> mhall119: yep agreed
[17:11] <GunnarHj> I also think we should ask ourselves if it's motivated to maintain both the desktop guide and the Ubuntu manual separately, considering that we are short of contributors. But that should better be discussed among the docs people first, I suppose.
[17:12]  * pleia2 nods
[17:12] <pleia2> we did have a successful Doc Day where we intermingled Doc and Manual sessions, that was nice :)
[17:12] <belkinsa> I agree there.  Maybe another meeting might be needed in the near time.
[17:12] <pleia2> everyone does seem willing to work together
[17:13] <pleia2> dholbach: we haven't really had regular meetings
[17:13] <dholbach> pleia2, do you think having regular doc days would help?
[17:13] <pleia2> dholbach: I don't know, they're a lot of work to put on
[17:13] <pleia2> it didn't really seem to increase contributors either :\
[17:13] <belkinsa> And maybe Global Jams early the cycle?
[17:13] <dholbach> pleia2, in terms of organising the todo list?
[17:14] <pleia2> dholbach: to get terms right, doc days were a user-facing thing in Classroom; meetings are internal team things
[17:14] <pleia2> I think regular meetings would be useful
[17:14] <GunnarHj> pleia2: Agree.
[17:14] <belkinsa> Once a month?  As in those?
[17:14] <pleia2> I organized a couple during the cycle, but I have too much on my plate and didn't do a great job of it :)
[17:15] <elfy> I rarely see anything about docs - unless I actually go digging - doesn't appear to be much publically happening
[17:15] <dholbach> pleia2, would it help to set up a schedule with assigned chair for the meetings?
[17:15] <elfy> on planet for instance
[17:15] <pleia2> elfy: yeah, pretty sure my post from February is the only one recently
[17:16] <elfy> mmm - that would help raise awareness
[17:16] <pleia2> anyway, aside from the standard kind of recruitment issues, I think things are going well compared to where we were a year ago
[17:16] <GunnarHj> I think that regular meetings would be valuable to start with.
[17:16] <pleia2> the team is much more open, we do have new contributors
[17:16] <belkinsa> Agreed.  I could help organize them.
[17:17] <pleia2> belkinsa: thanks!
[17:17] <dholbach> awesome :-D
[17:17] <belkinsa> Not a problem and I think at least three per cycle is the idea i have in mind.
[17:17] <elfy> I'd say that maybe blogging and getting it on Planet would help
[17:17] <dholbach> do you think it'd help to have a standing agenda item in desktop team's meetings about docs?
[17:17] <pleia2> elfy: yeah
[17:18] <pleia2> dholbach: yes, we've really struggled to get anyone from teams to talk to us
[17:18] <elfy> so could we help with that?
[17:18] <GunnarHj> elfy: Maybe.
[17:18] <pleia2> rickspencer offered to help at the last vUDS, but it was too late in the cycle (I'll reach out to him again in a few months)
[17:19] <GunnarHj> In the long run I think that contacts with the desktop team and others ought to be responsibilty of 'the Champion'
[17:20] <dholbach> pleia2, maybe it'd help to raise it with seb128/jasoncwarner so they add it to their meeting agendas and note down things which might be of interest for the docs team?
[17:20] <pleia2> dholbach: yeah, that'd be great
[17:20] <belkinsa> A thought (before I lose it): you think using Trello, the to do list, help the doc team?
[17:21] <elfy> do you use it now belkinsa ?
[17:21] <belkinsa> No.
[17:21] <elfy> personally I use it for xubuntu qa and found it very useful
[17:22] <elfy> it's not a public one - but all the qa team have access to it
[17:22] <belkinsa> Yeah, that's my idea is to have a team only one.
[17:22] <elfy> belkinsa: I'd certainly try it
[17:22] <belkinsa> Because I think the meeting bot action items (blueprints) don't help that well.
[17:22] <belkinsa> I will.
[17:23] <dholbach> Are there any other things in the project you'd like to improve?
[17:23] <dholbach> Or are there things which went really well this cycle?
[17:24] <belkinsa> Cleaning up the wiki was a failure.  I tried to organize a jam but I lost tack of time and forgot the jam is this weekend.
[17:25] <GunnarHj> belkinsa: But the wiki is not tied to cycles, so it's just keep going with it.
[17:25] <belkinsa> GunnarHj, right.  Duh.
[17:25] <GunnarHj> ;)
[17:26] <GunnarHj> dsmythies does a great job behind the scenes to make things work technically.
[17:26] <GunnarHj> Both with the desktop guide and the server guide.
[17:26] <dholbach> cleaning the wiki would make jcastro happy :)
[17:26] <pleia2> belkinsa: I wouldn't say it was a failure :) a lot of work got done, we added more admins and brought in the PopularPages team who've been doing a lot
[17:27] <pleia2> dholbach: this is help.ubuntu.com, not wiki.o.o
[17:27] <belkinsa> pleia2, I guess you are right.  A lot of work was done.
[17:27] <dholbach> still he'd be happy :-)
[17:28] <GunnarHj> dholbach: What more exactly is it he is after?
[17:28] <GunnarHj> dholbach: Mass deletion of outdated pages?
[17:28] <czajkowski> aloha
[17:28] <belkinsa> Hey there, czajkowski.
[17:29] <elfy> hi czajkowski
[17:29] <czajkowski> sorry for being late at another event
[17:29] <GunnarHj> dholbach: The general problem with the wiki is that the docs team members usually don't have the expertise needed to dig into the contents.
[17:29] <dholbach> GunnarHj, yes - he gave a lightning talk at a UDS some years ago in which he got very passionate about removing outdated/misleading information :)
[17:31] <dholbach> GunnarHj, I can imagine - it'd probably need to be in conjunction with members of other teams
[17:31] <belkinsa> GunnarHj, I agree and the only way is to have is a Global Jam.
[17:31] <belkinsa> Or that.
[17:32] <pleia2> thanks for coming GunnarHj and belkinsa :)
[17:32] <GunnarHj> Whichever method, it needs to be organized somehow. So regular meetings may help also there.
[17:32] <belkinsa> Not a problem.
[17:32]  * belkinsa nods
[17:33] <pleia2> anyone here from the QA team?
[17:33] <GunnarHj> np
[17:33] <elfy> thanks for coming along belkinsa GunnarHj
[17:33] <dholbach> thanks a lot, and thanks for your tireless work!
[17:33] <pleia2> balloons: about?
[17:33]  * elfy prepares sharp needle ...
[17:34] <dholbach> :-)
[17:34] <pleia2> no one responded when we told them about the meeting, so I'm not holding my breath
[17:34] <belkinsa> Your welcome and thank you for this check-in meeting.
[17:34] <pleia2> we can move on to AoB and see if anyone shows up in the meantime
[17:34] <czajkowski> thank belkinsa GunnarHj for coming
[17:34] <pleia2> #topic Any other Business
[17:35] <elfy> pleia2: tbh - I don't even know who the QA team is ...
[17:35] <pleia2> elfy: I had hoped it would be *bigger* now that QA and Bug folks were working together so closely
[17:36] <belkinsa> I have a question.  What teams are required to go through this check-in?
[17:36] <czajkowski> belkinsa: any of the elected coucils we over see
[17:36] <czajkowski> and then ones we'e  had request for a catch up
[17:36] <czajkowski> *we've
[17:36] <belkinsa> Okay, thank you.
[17:36] <pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncilAgenda#Team_catch-up has the current list
[17:36] <dholbach> belkinsa, we started out with our governance boards, then added the flavour teams and then some additional teams: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncilAgenda hast a list
[17:37] <pleia2> anyone have anything else?
[17:38] <dholbach> I'm all set
[17:39] <pleia2> ok, thanks everyone
[17:39] <pleia2> #endmeeting
[17:39] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Apr  3 17:39:18 2014 UTC.
[17:39] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2014/ubuntu-meeting.2014-04-03-16.59.moin.txt
[17:39] <elfy> thanks everyone
[17:39] <belkinsa> Not a problem, thanks for the meeting.
[17:39] <czajkowski> thank you
[17:39] <czajkowski> pleia2: thank you
[17:40] <dholbach> thanks a lot everyone
[21:30] <iulian> cjohnston: How many are we?
[21:33] <iulian> OK, we need one more board member.
[21:36] <iulian> #startmeeting 2200 UTC Ubuntu Membership Board
[21:36] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Apr  3 21:36:08 2014 UTC.  The chair is iulian. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[21:36] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[21:36] <iulian> Hello and welcome to the Ubuntu Membership Review Board for the 2200 UTC meeting for April 3, 2014.
[21:36] <iulian> We will attempt to get through all of the applicants that have added themselves to that list before today's meeting. If we are unable to make it through the entire list due to time constraints, then at the next meeting we will pick up where we left off.
[21:36] <iulian> The format for the meeting is as follows: We will go through the list of applicants one by one, by date of application (FIFO).
[21:36] <iulian> Each applicant should introduce themselves (1-5 sentences) and provide links to their Ubuntu Wiki page. After the introduction the members of the Membership Review Board will review the pages and, if needed, ask the applicant further questions.
[21:37] <iulian> During this time it is encouraged for other members of the community to show their support for the applicant. Do not be alarmed if the members of the Membership Review Board are quiet during this time; they are most likely reading wiki/launchpad/forum/other pages and deciding how they are going to vote.
[21:37] <iulian> When the board is ready to vote, they will publicly vote in the channel with either +1, 0, or -1 (for membership, abstain, and against membership, respectively). If the sum of those numbers is positive, then the applicant is now an official Ubuntu member! (feel free congratulate them!)
[21:37] <cjohnston> iulian: lets wait another 20 minutes :-)
[21:38] <mihir> Hi
[21:38] <iulian> Whoops.
[21:39] <mihir> Mihir
[21:40] <iulian> Hi there mihir. Apparently I got confused with the time. The meeting should start 20 minutes.
[21:40] <iulian> But if everyone's here, then I wouldn't mind to start earlier. :-)
[21:40] <iulian> RoozbehShafiee: Here?
[21:40] <RoozbehShafiee> Im here too
[21:40] <iulian> thomi: Here?
[21:40] <RoozbehShafiee> iulian: yes
[21:40] <thomi> iulian: yes
[21:40] <mihir> iulian, okay
[21:41] <iulian> cjohnston, Pendulum, hggdh: Do you guys mind if we start earlier? Everyone is present so I believe just waiting for another 20 minutes isn't going to make much of a difference.
[21:41] <cjohnston> iulian: we should give the candidates time to gather any supporters that they may have had coming to the meeting to support them
[21:42] <iulian> RoozbehShafiee, thomi, mihir: Would you like to start the meeting earlier? Are you guys ready?
[21:42] <iulian> Ah, right, sure.
[21:42] <mihir> iulian, yeah
[21:42] <RoozbehShafiee> iulian: yes Im ready :)
[21:42] <thomi> I'm happy either way
[21:46] <mihir> iulian, ?
[21:48] <iulian> We are just waiting for someone to reply.
[21:50] <mihir> iulian, okay.
[21:50] <hggdh> iulian: go for it
[21:52] <iulian> Okey dokey.
[21:52] <iulian> #voters hggdh cjohnston Pendulum iulian
[21:52] <meetingology> Current voters: Pendulum cjohnston hggdh iulian
[21:52] <iulian> #subtopic RoozbehShafiee
[21:53] <iulian> RoozbehShafiee: You're up first. Could you please introduce yourself?
[21:53] <RoozbehShafiee> iulian: yes sure
[21:53] <RoozbehShafiee> iulian: Im Roozbeh Shafiee 27 years old
[21:53] <RoozbehShafiee> iulian: linux user since 2003
[21:54] <RoozbehShafiee> Im from IRAN-Tehran
[21:54] <RoozbehShafiee> a member of ubuntu iran loco team
[21:54] <RoozbehShafiee> also ubuntu.ir forum moderator
[21:55] <RoozbehShafiee> my job is virtualization architect and systems administrator in a telecommunication company
[21:55] <iulian> RoozbehShafiee: Thank you. I see that you have been a member of the Iran LoCo team since 2009. What is your role within the team?
[21:56] <RoozbehShafiee> my role is forum moderator in this team
[21:56] <RoozbehShafiee> and some of coordinations ubuntu iran in isfahan city are with me
[21:57] <cjohnston> RoozbehShafiee: it looks like most of your activities you listed are from 2009, 2010... what have you done more recently?
[21:58] <RoozbehShafiee> also in past I worked some of artworks for web site
[21:58] <RoozbehShafiee> recently we had an ubuntu conference in May 2013
[21:59] <RoozbehShafiee> in Tehran University
[21:59] <Pendulum> RoozbehShafiee: Do you have a link to your profile on the Ubuntu Iran forums?
[21:59] <RoozbehShafiee> I have some coordination in this event
[21:59] <RoozbehShafiee> Pendulum: yes
[22:01] <cjohnston> RoozbehShafiee: do you have anyone here to support you?
[22:01] <Pendulum> RoozbehShafiee: Can you please give us the link to your forum profile?
[22:02] <iulian> #voters PabloRubianes
[22:02] <meetingology> Current voters: PabloRubianes Pendulum cjohnston hggdh iulian
[22:02] <RoozbehShafiee> Pendulum: my profile: http://forum.ubuntu.ir/index.php?action=profile;u=1706
[22:02] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: yes but they are not in channel right now
[22:03] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: daniel holbach is one of my ubuntuish friend
[22:03] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: I visit him 3 years ago in IRAN
[22:03] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: also Mehdi Hassanpour
[22:03] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: the Iran ubuntu team coordinator
[22:04] <cjohnston> RoozbehShafiee: I noticed that you have no testimonials... we normally use testimonials as a way of getting to know the candidate and their contributions
[22:04] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: well...
[22:04] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: I emailed to Daniel and Mehdi
[22:05] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: but for persian new year Mehdi didnt answer me
[22:05] <RoozbehShafiee> unfortunately
[22:05] <iulian> Any more questions for RoozbehShafiee?
[22:05] <RoozbehShafiee> cjohnston: also it seems Daniel was not accessible
[22:05] <hggdh> RoozbehShafiee: so, the lack of visible *recent*, sustained contributions to Ubuntu, and lack of testimonials, make our task much more difficult
[22:07] <iulian> OK, if there are no more questions, then I believe it's time to vote.
[22:07] <iulian> #vote RoozbehShafiee to obtain Ubuntu membership.
[22:07] <meetingology> Please vote on: RoozbehShafiee to obtain Ubuntu membership.
[22:07] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname)
[22:08] <cjohnston> +0 I'm not able to see much in the way of recent work, nor are there any testimonials to help support you
[22:08] <meetingology> +0 I'm not able to see much in the way of recent work, nor are there any testimonials to help support you received from cjohnston
[22:08] <PabloRubianes> -1 please re done your wiki with more helpful info for us and come back
[22:08] <meetingology> -1 please re done your wiki with more helpful info for us and come back received from PabloRubianes
[22:08] <hggdh> -1 I do not see current Ubuntu contributions (the forum at ir needs registering), and no testimonials
[22:08] <meetingology> -1 I do not see current Ubuntu contributions (the forum at ir needs registering), and no testimonials received from hggdh
[22:08] <iulian> -1
[22:08] <meetingology> -1 received from iulian
[22:09] <Pendulum> -1 Please come back with testimonials and more information about current work.
[22:09] <meetingology> -1 Please come back with testimonials and more information about current work. received from Pendulum
[22:09] <iulian> #endvote
[22:09] <meetingology> Voting ended on: RoozbehShafiee to obtain Ubuntu membership.
[22:09] <meetingology> Votes for:0 Votes against:4 Abstentions:1
[22:09] <meetingology> Motion denied
[22:09] <iulian> RoozbehShafiee: Unfortunately, you have been unsuccessful this time. Please do keep up the good work that you are doing with the LoCo team. We are looking forward to reading your application next time you apply. We suggest that you re-apply in a few months. Also please talk to your friends and get some testimonials as they are really useful.
[22:10] <Pendulum> RoozbehShafiee: I agree with iulian. It looks like you've done good work, it's just not possible for us to really see what it is.
[22:10] <iulian> thomi: I believe you're up next. The stage is all yours.
[22:10] <RoozbehShafiee> iulian Pendulum: ok guys , no problem
[22:10] <thomi> cool
[22:11] <thomi> so, I'm Thomi Richards, my wiki page is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThomiRichards - I currently reside in Dunedin, New Zealand
[22:11] <thomi> The wiki page contains most of the information you probably care about. To summarise...
[22:11] <thomi> I'm the principle author of Autopilot, which we use in our Ubuntu Touch & Desktop acceptance test suites. This is what I spend 90% of my day-to-day hacking time on.
[22:11] <RoozbehShafiee> Pendulum: maybe because I completed my wiki page in 4 days ago, I had not much time to find testimonials
[22:11] <thomi> I'm passionate about improving the quality of Ubuntu releases, and autopilot is one way I can do that. Right now we have dozens of high-profile projects using autopilot for their acceptance tests, and more coming online all the time.
[22:11] <thomi> I'm also a consumate hacker, I have code in dozens of Ubuntu packages and open source projects (to name a few: Ogre3D, crystalspace, blender3d, testtools, etc).
[22:11] <cjohnston> wait.. theres going to be more? :-/
[22:12] <thomi> In my spare time I advocate for Linux, open source, and Ubuntu in my local community. I've spoken at conferences (Kiwi PyCon mostly) representing Ubuntu (can link to video if anyone wants).
[22:12] <iulian> :-)
[22:12] <thomi> I was involved in helping organise Linux.conf.au waaaay back in 2006, where Mark Shuttleworth was a keynote speaker, talking about launchpad.
[22:12] <thomi> I work for Canonical, but have been using Linux for about 15 years now, and using Ubuntu since the good old days of Warty Warthog. I'm sure that if I ever stopped working for Canonical I'd still participate in Ubuntu.
[22:12] <thomi> Apart from all that, I'm 'thomir' almost everywhere on the Internet - I think my launchpad, github, ohloh, etc profiles speak for themselves.

[22:13] <cjohnston> Any questions for thomi ?
[22:13] <iulian> None from me.
[22:13] <popey> ooh
[22:13] <thomi> oh, there are some testamonials on my wiki page as well
[22:13] <popey> +1 from me
[22:13] <hggdh> none from me.
[22:13] <PabloRubianes> not for me
[22:13] <cjohnston> who woke up popey :-P
[22:13] <PabloRubianes> none*
[22:13] <hggdh> uhu, do I see popey crashing the party?
[22:13] <thomi> hi popey o/
[22:13] <popey> Didn't know thomi was up for membership!
[22:13] <hggdh> :-)
[22:13] <iulian> :-)
[22:14] <popey> thomi has bee instrumental in creating the quality of Ubuntu for some time.
[22:14] <cjohnston> popey had any good bacon and syrup recently :-)
[22:14] <popey> shush
[22:14] <hggdh> I have no questions for thomi, except why took him so long to apply...
[22:14] <popey> that too ☻
[22:14] <iulian> #vote thomi to obtain Ubuntu membership
[22:14] <meetingology> Please vote on: thomi to obtain Ubuntu membership
[22:14] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname)
[22:14] <thomi> umm... I was.. busy?
[22:15] <iulian> +1
[22:15] <cjohnston> +1
[22:15] <meetingology> +1 received from iulian
[22:15] <meetingology> +1 received from cjohnston
[22:15] <PabloRubianes> +1
[22:15] <meetingology> +1 received from PabloRubianes
[22:15] <hggdh> +1 finally!
[22:15] <meetingology> +1 finally! received from hggdh
[22:15] <Pendulum> +1
[22:15] <meetingology> +1 received from Pendulum
[22:15] <iulian> #endvote
[22:15] <meetingology> Voting ended on: thomi to obtain Ubuntu membership
[22:15] <meetingology> Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[22:15] <meetingology> Motion carried
[22:15] <cjohnston> hggdh: noone wrote it as an autopilot test
[22:15] <hggdh> cjohnston: ah, that's a thomi failure there!
[22:15] <PabloRubianes> congrats thomi
[22:15] <cjohnston> hehe
[22:15] <thomi> cheers!
[22:15] <hggdh> thomi: welcome :-)
[22:15] <popey> \o/
[22:15] <iulian> thomi: Welcome aboard.
[22:15] <iulian> mihir: You're up next. Fire away!
[22:15] <popey> Well done thomi
[22:16] <Pendulum> thomi: Welcome and congrats!
[22:16] <mihir> Hi , My name is Mihir Soni
[22:16] <mihir> i started contribute for Ubuntu touch core applications project.
[22:16] <mihir> Initially I have been involved in Ubuntu touch core application as a contributor and then as core team developer for Calculator. After making successful progress in calculator I have been moved to Calendar app and started contributing there.
[22:16] <mihir> My work includes creating new functional ties and resolving bugs and maintain bug trackers for calendar & calculator.
[22:16] <mihir> Currently focusing on making calendar application stable and more functional.
[22:16] <mihir> i have been using Ubuntu since 2006
[22:16] <mihir> My wiki page :- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/mihirsoni-123
[22:17] <mihir> Launchpad profile :- https://launchpad.net/~mihirsoni-123
[22:17] <mihir> I am mostly working for core apps projects for ubuntu touch.
[22:17] <popey> I'm actually here to cheer for mihir.
[22:17] <popey> I'd back mihir for membership based on his valuable contributions.
[22:17] <popey> He's been a reliable and consistent contributor to the core apps project on Ubuntu for phones.
[22:17] <popey> He's been prompt, attentive and friendly with his code reviews, irc meetings, mails and hangouts and has been forthcoming with well thought out opinions and technical conributions.
[22:18] <popey> (much as I love thomi) :D
[22:18] <mihir> popey, thank you.
[22:18] <popey> np
[22:18] <iulian> Great, thanks popey.
[22:18] <iulian> Any questions for mihir?
[22:18] <PabloRubianes> mihir, do you do any LoCo work related?
[22:19] <mihir> PabloRubianes, not much , but i am trying to be involved here in my loco team.
[22:19] <mihir> well it is not much active here
[22:20] <PabloRubianes> ok, mihir giving app development school could help activate the LoCo ;-)
[22:20] <mihir> PabloRubianes, sure !!!
[22:21] <mihir> PabloRubianes, i'll try to initiate
[22:21] <iulian> OK, thanks mihir.
[22:21] <iulian> #vote mihir to obtain Ubuntu membership
[22:21] <meetingology> Please vote on: mihir to obtain Ubuntu membership
[22:21] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname)
[22:21] <iulian> +1
[22:21] <meetingology> +1 received from iulian
[22:21] <hggdh> +1 good work
[22:21] <meetingology> +1 good work received from hggdh
[22:21] <PabloRubianes> +1
[22:21] <meetingology> +1 received from PabloRubianes
[22:21] <popey> \o/
[22:22] <Pendulum> +1 good work
[22:22] <meetingology> +1 good work received from Pendulum
[22:22] <hggdh> popey: life is good, I see ;-)
[22:22] <cjohnston> +1
[22:22] <meetingology> +1 received from cjohnston
[22:22] <iulian> #endvote
[22:22] <meetingology> Voting ended on: mihir to obtain Ubuntu membership
[22:22] <meetingology> Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[22:22] <meetingology> Motion carried
[22:22] <iulian> Welcome aboard, mihir.
[22:22] <popey> Thanks membership board!
[22:22] <mihir> iulian, thanks a lot :)
[22:22] <hggdh> mihir: welcome in, and thank you for your work
[22:22] <popey> congratulations mihir
[22:22] <iulian> #endmeeting
[22:22] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Apr  3 22:22:30 2014 UTC.
[22:22] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2014/ubuntu-meeting.2014-04-03-21.36.moin.txt
[22:22] <mihir> popey,  thanks a lot.
[22:22] <popey> np, well deserved
[22:22] <iulian> Bed time for me, nighty night.
[22:22] <popey> keep up the great work
[22:22] <PabloRubianes> congrats mihir keep the good work and if you need some help in the LoCo counicl we can give you a hand with the loco activvation
[22:22] <cjohnston> popey, you should go get some bacon and syrup
[22:22] <popey> hah
[22:22] <cjohnston> congrats thomi and mihir
[22:23] <pleia2> oh hey, while I have you here - can the membership team send a list of folks they've approved lately to the ubuntu-news-team list?
[22:23] <mihir> PabloRubianes, sure I'll ping your or email you for that.
[22:23] <PabloRubianes> mihir, sure
[22:23] <pleia2> we haven't gotten an email in a while, just a list is fine so we can include them in the weekly newsletter :)
[22:27] <mihir> PabloRubianes, thank you :)
[22:28] <RoozbehShafiee> iulian: can I apply for membership in 16th April ?


[10:50] <ssam> is there a way to report spam in lp bug comments?
[14:47] <geekosopher> can someone have a look at bug 631080 and mark it as triaged (guess it is complete)
[14:47] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 631080 in msttcorefonts (Ubuntu) "[MASTER] package ttf-mscorefonts-installer 3.0 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1 (affects: 42) (dups: 43) (heat: 342)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/631080
[15:21] <mdeslaur> geekosopher: wouldn't that be a dupe of bug 274421
[15:21] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 274421 in msttcorefonts (Ubuntu) "Cannot download fonts, "Error parsing proxy URL http://:8080/" (affects: 110) (dups: 52) (heat: 243)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274421
[15:24] <geekosopher> mdeslaur: oh yes, it looks the same, got fooled by the title, I just got all the ones with same title
[15:25] <mdeslaur> geekosopher: I'm slightly confused though...this should already be fixed in lucid
[15:25] <geekosopher> but people are also complaining in natty
[15:26] <geekosopher> version 3.2
[15:26] <mdeslaur> geekosopher: could you find me one of the bugs that affects natty?
[15:27] <geekosopher> just a minute
[15:27] <geekosopher> mdeslaur: will be back in 10 mins some urgent work
[15:52] <xelister> ubuntu 10.10 after recent upgrade seems to hang often when using py OpenCL gpu cpomputing lib (using Radeom). Was there any update recenlty that could cause that
[16:14] <yofel> xelister: see /var/log/apt/history.log what was recently upgraded on your system and then check what of those was graphics related
[16:21] <xelister> yofel:  libqt4-opengl-dev  linux-image-2.6.35-23-generic  linux-libc-dev  libc-bin  libc*
[16:21] <yofel> might have been the kernel update then, do you still have -22 installed to try it?
[16:45] <geekosopher> mdeslaur: sorry, 10 mins became > 1 hour, and there are none of the dupes in natty,
[19:57] <bcurtiswx> vish, what's involved with the help needed fr papercuts ?
[20:04] <vish> bcurtiswx: hey, for bug triage and just helping new members, any questions they have ..
[20:22] <bcurtiswx> vish, I was reading a canonical post that said the papercuts project needed more members
[20:23] <vish> bcurtiswx: yea, for checking/triaging the bugs and when possible fixing them would be neat too ;)
[20:23] <bcurtiswx> vish, OK count me in :)
[20:23] <vish> bcurtiswx: cool, thx just apply and I'll approve :)
[20:24] <nisshh> vish, whats this? the papercuts project needs more members?
[20:25] <vish> nisshh: yup.. :)
[20:25] <vish> nisshh: http://design.canonical.com/2010/11/paper-cuts-need-you/
[20:25]  * nisshh looks
[20:26] <nisshh> vish, i might join in, i recently finished a couple of projects :)
[20:26] <vish> nisshh: more the merrier ;)
[20:27] <nisshh> hehe
[20:27] <vish> bcurtiswx , nisshh : https://launchpad.net/~papercutters  just apply and i'll approve the membership..
[20:28] <bcurtiswx> i was lookin for that.. :P joined
[20:28] <bcurtiswx> there's probably a ton of possible papercuts with empathy, i figure I can find and attack those on my own.
[20:29] <vish> bcurtiswx: yea, i figured you were looking for the link.. ;)  just started another team as well, setting up a mailing list lp is really crappy with mailing lists :(
[20:29] <nisshh> i dont know what ill try and fix tbh :)
[20:30] <nisshh> vish, wow, only 30 active members? i thought it was really popular among newer users looking to contribute :|
[20:31] <vish> nisshh: fixing bug descriptions are the easiest.. ;)  tip, just follow the HowtoFix wiki and it done..
[20:31] <vish> it;s*
[20:31] <nisshh> yeah, i would prefer something a little more challenging tbh
[20:31] <nisshh> although im happy to fix whatever
[20:32] <vish> nisshh: well, the papercutters team is for bug triagers but random people fixing the bugs are more
[20:32] <nisshh> vish, ok, im joined up too
[20:32] <nisshh> ah i see
[20:32] <vish> there is a new open team coming up for that too : https://launchpad.net/~papercuts-ninja
[20:33] <nisshh> vish, one thing that i dont quite get, can a trivial bug in a non-default installed application be considered a papercut?
[20:33] <vish> nisshh: ^so that people can just get notified when a bug lands/upload fixes to ppa or ask questions
[20:33] <nisshh> ah ok
[20:34] <vish> nisshh: until now non-default app descriptions were looked into, this Natty cycle we would be having the preferred applications as well
[20:35] <vish> rather, the featured applications
[20:35] <nisshh> yeah
[20:36] <nisshh> vish, what i mean is, can say, a trivial bug in vlc, which is not a default app, be nominated to be a papercut? or do we only do default and featured apps?
[20:36] <vish> nisshh: only default and featured.. so no vlc
[20:37] <nisshh> vish, ah ok, thats cleared that up then
[20:37] <nisshh> vish, also, should i look at papercuts in the maverick series? or natty series?
[20:38] <vish> nisshh: all bugs, /not/ series restricted..
[20:39] <nisshh> vish, no, i mean i want to fix a papercut? should i fix one in the maverick series?
[20:40] <yofel> fixes always go into the development release, stable only if SRUable
[20:40] <vish> nisshh: yea, for those too, not restricted to series..  if it is not fixed in time for maverick, we fix for natty
[20:40] <nisshh> vish, ok
[20:42] <nisshh> vish, so all the unfixed bugs in the papercut maverick series, should they be retargeted to the natty series?
[20:42] <vish> nisshh: yup..
[20:42] <nisshh> vish, want me to do that?
[20:43] <vish> nisshh: i'm right now, setting up the natty series' milestones.. so the milestones are not yet available … should be there tomorrow, or late in the evening for you ;)
[20:43] <nisshh> ah ok
[20:44] <nisshh> i guess ill look for potential papercuts till then :)
[20:44] <bcurtiswx> i would imagine papercuts wouldn't ever qualify for a SRU, so thats why they would need to be retargeted to natty
[20:45] <nisshh> bcurtiswx, good point
[23:51] <nisshh> vish, do you just want the new and triaged bugs moved to the natty series? or the in progress bugs as wel?
[23:51] <nisshh> well*


[10:47] <lordievader> Good afternoon.
[10:49] <BluesKaj> G'Day folks
[11:24] <BluesKaj> Hi again
[17:42] <teward> has anyone seen network interfaces named `ens##` in virtual environments instead of `eth##` for Wily?
[17:42] <teward> (whereas installer disks see `eth##`)
[17:43] <lordievader> ens? Not enp?
[17:44] <teward> mhm
[17:45] <teward> also, installer set up the interfaces file with eth0, eth1, so networking didn't come up (this is the server iso but still)
[17:45] <teward> (so I had to write /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules to assign the names)
[17:46] <teward> lordievader: it threw me for a loop too
[17:46] <teward> and there's a discrepancy between the installer ISO and what's actually installed
[17:46] <teward> so IDK where to report such issues
[17:46] <teward> or what to file against
[17:46] <teward> and it wasn't part of the ISO testing, i needed the VM set up for package change verify-it-works ness :P
[17:47] <lordievader> Hmm, well we should be moving to bios names sometime soon. But ens is new for me, perhaps because it is virtual, but nic's are named as enp with me.
[17:48] <teward> lordievader: that still doesn't explain why /etc/network/interfaces was populated with eth#, nor why the installer ISO read the interfaces as eth#
[17:48] <lordievader> True, true.
[17:48] <teward> and that shows the bigger problem of if the ISO doesn't correctly configure the /etc/network/interfaces on install, you get a nuked network routing table and connectivity
[17:49] <TJ-> the naming is done by systemd now, isn't it?
[17:49] <teward> and it's a damn good thing i keep a 70-persistent-net.rules file template lying around
[17:49] <teward> TJ-: if it is, does that explain the discrepancy between installer naming and system naming?
[17:49] <teward> and does that explain the broken /etc/network/interfaces upon install?
[17:49] <lordievader> Still udev right? Though udev and systemd share a lot.
[17:50] <lordievader> http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/PredictableNetworkInterfaceNames/
[17:50] <lordievader> Hmm, perhaps it is systemd..
[17:50] <teward> lordievader: i had to put a udev override
[17:51] <teward> but there's still that ISO/installed discrepancy
[17:51] <teward> that will make people be "WTH Y DOESNT IT WORK"
[17:51] <teward> (and this was the daily iso from yesterday)
[17:51] <teward> "Names incorporating Firmware/BIOS provided PCI Express hotplug slot index numbers (example: ens1)"  <-- explains the ens##
[17:51] <teward> does NOT explain why only 2 cards got ens33 and ens35
[17:52] <teward> (at least from the guest os's perspective)
[17:52] <teward> I am much more concerned about the ISO seeing the kernel style naming versus the installed version using systemd and the predictable method in that link
[17:54] <lordievader> Ah, thanks for clearing that up :)
[17:55] <TJ-> what init system does the installer use?
[17:59] <teward> can't tell i can only get a busybox prompt o.O
[17:59] <TJ-> unpack the squashfs image, if that's what it is
[18:00] <lordievader> No ps in busybox?
[18:03] <teward> /bin/busybox init  <-- that
[18:03] <lordievader> Sounds like sysv/upstart.
[18:04] <teward> so what do i file the bug agains
[18:04] <teward> because this is a HUGE issue
[18:04] <TJ-> teward: I'm pulling in the ISO to try in a VM
[18:05] <teward> TJ-: i have two interfaces attached, one NAT, one host only
[18:05] <teward> i use VMware
[18:05] <teward> VBox might be different
[18:06] <TJ-> I use neither :)
[18:06] <lordievader> KVM?
[18:06] <TJ-> but of course :)
[18:07] <TJ-> I have several servers here with multiple interfaces so I can test it on those
[18:07] <lordievader> Whoop whoop
[18:19] <TJ-> teward: is it booting UEFI or BIOS?
[18:25] <teward> TJ-: I think BIOS, within VMware
[18:25] <teward> any way to find out from the shell?
[18:32] <TJ-> "ls /sys/firmware/efi/vars/"
[18:33] <teward> no such dir
[18:33] <teward> no efi dir either
[18:33] <teward> so probably BIOS
[18:33] <TJ-> OK, so BIOS
[18:40] <TJ-> I've found another bug... missing kernel package!
[18:44] <teward> o.o
[18:52] <teward> TJ-: did you try a BIOS boot yet, and what did you find?  I see the +UEFI boot issue in -devel you just said
[18:59] <TJ-> I'm about to try it... but it wont make any difference. The detection happens from within the /target/ chroot and the device names will already have been set