[00:46] <katastro63> hello people I want to know if we can for example run with an intel gpu but in the same time sometimes choose to run juste a program with nvidia ?
[01:59] <xubuntu45w> I downloaded and saved on a dvd, xubundu remix 14.04.iso. I would like to install on my new laptop over windows 8. Is there anything I need to know before I start
[01:59] <aynrand420> man xubuntu keeps doing a disk check then restarting then freezing
[02:01] <drc> xubuntu45w: define "saved"
[02:05] <xubuntu45w> downloaded the full program and copied on the DVD to use for installing.
[02:05] <bazhang> copied how
[02:05] <drc> nope, won't work... see  http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop/burn-a-dvd-on-windows
[02:06] <drc> assuming you mean simply copied the iso to the dvd (see bazhang :)
[02:10] <xubuntu45w> so nero burner wouldnt work, "question mark". sorry, i bought this in colombia, it came spanish, and when they changed it to english for me, just windows is english, and the keys don't correspond correctly, so i don't know where the question mark is,
[02:11] <xubuntu45w> so how do i install xubundu remix
[02:11] <bazhang> xubunDu with a D?
[02:11] <drc> from a windows machine?
[02:11] <xubuntu45w> sorry, new to this
[02:12] <xubuntu45w> yes
[02:12] <xubuntu45w> windows 8
[02:12] <bazhang> T or D
[02:12] <xubuntu45w> t
[02:12] <drc> Xubuntu or XubunDu ?
[02:12] <drc> ok
[02:12] <drc>  http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop/burn-a-dvd-on-windows
[02:12] <xubuntu45w> is there a d
[02:12] <bazhang> give us the link
[02:12] <drc> no
[02:12] <xubuntu45w> ok
[02:12] <bazhang> where did you get this iso
[02:15] <xubuntu45w> http://sourceforge.net/projects/xubunturemix/files/
[02:15] <xangua> xubuntu45w: you can download xubuntu from http://xubuntu.org/
[02:17] <drc> xubuntu45w: No idea what this remix is...wouldn't trust it...get the official iso from the link xangua gave you
[02:17] <xubuntu45w> this one is a remix with added apps and look etc...
[02:17] <drc> wouldn't trust it, don't know the project, dont know the person.
[02:17] <xubuntu45w> http://www.cupoflinux.com/SBB/index.php/topic,842.0.html
[02:18] <bazhang> not supported here, get the real deal
[02:18] <xubuntu45w> okay, thanks
[02:18] <drc> not only not supported, actively discouraged.
[02:18] <bazhang> it's trivial to add the other stuff later
[02:19] <xubuntu45w> just thought it would same me time figureing it all out, lol
[02:19] <xubuntu45w> and i liked the look
[02:19] <bazhang> just a few commands, and you have nearly all of it
[02:19] <xubuntu45w> if you have time, take a look
[02:19] <bazhang> I just did
[02:19] <xubuntu45w> really, okay, thanks
[02:20] <bazhang> plus you get the never sleeping support here
[02:20] <xubuntu45w> awesome
[02:20] <xubuntu45w> thanks again
[02:21] <xubuntu45w> is this ubuntu or xubuntu
[02:21] <xubuntu45w> the link you gave me
[02:21] <drc> xubuntu is ubuntu+XFCE...it's all the same underneath.
[02:22] <drc> the like will say ubuntu, just replace with xubuntu
[02:23] <xubuntu45w> is there any danger in installing over windows8
[02:23] <drc> yes
[02:23] <xubuntu45w> i thought so,,,,what do i need to know
[02:24] <drc> I thought you said install "over windows"...you want to keep windows AND install xubuntu?
[02:24] <xubuntu45w> if i install windows 7 and use that would it be better. i just bought this and they said they could install windows 7 but loose the 8 licence
[02:25] <xubuntu45w> thats fine, i can keep windows 8 but the keyboad is messed up when they change from spanish to english
[02:25] <xubuntu45w> its a spanish keyboard\
[02:25] <drc> the question remains, do you want Xubuntu or Windows + Xubuntu?
[02:25] <xubuntu45w> xubuntu
[02:26] <drc> then don't worry, the install program will take care of all partitioning and formatting...just select the autoinstall feature.
[02:26] <xubuntu45w> great, thanks
[02:26] <drc> But it WILL get rid of windows on that machine.
[02:27] <xubuntu45w> thats fine, as long as xubuntu works
[02:27] <drc> And you don't want to install Xubuntu/linux and THEN windows (causes big problems)
[02:27] <xubuntu45w> okay, no windows, i am sold on linux
[02:28] <drc> It Xubuntu works from the live DVD, the chances are great that it will work after an install
[02:29] <xubuntu45w> not familiar with this. how does it work with live DVD
[02:30] <xubuntu45w> thats okay, i will try to figure it out
[02:30] <xubuntu45w> so copy from here... http://xubuntu.org/
[02:30] <drc> WHen you burn the iso to a DVD you get what is called a Live DVD...boot the DVD and you can both install and Run Xubuntu itself, prior to installing
[02:31] <xubuntu45w> cool
[02:34] <xubuntu45w> do i save it, or download it with free torrent helper
[02:34] <drc> actually http://xubuntu.org/getxubuntu/ will get you closer to DL the iso.  Make sure you know which version you want 14.04 LTS (long term support) or 14.10 the most recent version.  The make sure you get which ever architecture you computer is 32 or 64 bit
[02:34] <xubuntu45w> its 64
[02:35] <drc> If in doubt, go for the 14.04 64 bit version.
[02:37] <drc> er...how much RAM?
[02:38] <xubuntu45w> 4
[02:38] <bazhang> more than enough
[02:38] <drc> yup 14.04 64 bit.
[02:38] <xubuntu45w> so do i save or open with torrent
[02:39] <drc> I use torrents
[02:39] <bazhang>  .torrent is open with utorrent or whatever
[02:40] <bazhang>  .iso is just straight dl
[02:40] <xubuntu45w> so once i start, it will erase windows
[02:40] <bazhang> no
[02:41] <xubuntu45w> okay, thanks
[02:41] <bazhang> is that what you want?
[02:44] <xubuntu45w> yes, if it is easy is that
[02:44] <bazhang> it's certainly possible, but you might consider first running it as a dual boot
[02:45] <xubuntu45w> how do i do that
[02:45] <bazhang> the installer will walk you through it, and you can connect to this irc channel as you go
[02:46] <xubuntu45w> sounds good
[02:46] <xubuntu45w> sounds great even
[02:47] <xubuntu45w> is there any real issues with windows8
[02:48] <bazhang> apart from you'll want to use it less and less?
[02:48] <xubuntu45w> lol, awesome
[02:48] <bazhang> again, any problems/issues *during * install, ask here
[02:49] <bazhang> of course, back up any important things beforehand, as well as you can
[02:52] <xubuntu45w> okay, thanks,,,,new computer so nothing to loose
[02:53] <bazhang> :)
[02:55] <drc> xubuntu45w: Since this is a new computer, I'd run Xubuntu from the Live DVD for a little while before installing, just to make sure all your hardware works.  If it does, you can install Xubuntu driectly  from the running Live DVD without rebooting.
[04:19] <Deezl> What is a good lightweight graphical file browser?  Dolphin?
[06:48] <perfarator> Deezl, obviouly, thunar
[07:47] <Gotolei> just upgraded to 14.10, and I'm having a difficult time with the power manager
[07:48] <Gotolei> I'm trying to set it to only lock and power off the screen when I close the lid, but it ignores the settings I set and suspends
[07:48] <Gotolei> in 14.04 it could be changed by hacking around some obscure config file, but not even that works anymore
[07:48] <Gotolei> how does a person actually change the settings?
[08:15] <Gotolei> also while I'm at it, is there a way to change how lightlocker handles transparent wallpapers
[08:15] <Gotolei> on the desktop, it draws gradients etc behind it like it's supposed to
[08:15] <Gotolei> but on the lockscreen it's a glitchfest
[08:19] <Poisoned_Dragon> transparent wallpapers?
[08:20] <Poisoned_Dragon> Is this something that requires the compositor to be enabled? If so, lightlocker may not benefit from this, since the compositor for the desktop environment may not extend to lightlocker.
[08:21] <Poisoned_Dragon> So, if lightlocker doesn't have a compositor, you're going to have a bad time.
[08:21] <Gotolei> it's definitely displaying something behind the image
[08:21] <Gotolei> mostly solid white, but if profiles are switched around it gets all sorts of seams and what looks like buffer leaks
[08:23] <Gotolei> anyway it's definitely not the bluish-green gradient i have set
[08:24] <Poisoned_Dragon> Is the background just a standard picture file?
[08:24] <Poisoned_Dragon> And, are you using compiz?
[08:27] <Gotolei> it's a semitransparent image with a gradient background
[08:28] <Gotolei> it works in both compiz and xfwm4, even with compositing disabled
[08:28] <Gotolei> and this is the *lockscreen*
[08:28] <Poisoned_Dragon> But, it's still just a standard format. Like, jpg, or gif, or png.
[08:28] <Gotolei> yes, semitransparent png
[08:28] <Poisoned_Dragon> So, compiz can be off and the background is still fine, on the desktop?
[08:29] <Gotolei> yes
[08:29] <Poisoned_Dragon> Hmm... Starting to sound more like a gpu issue.
[08:29] <Poisoned_Dragon> What is your gpu?
[08:29] <Gotolei> intel integrated
[08:30] <Poisoned_Dragon> what model?
[08:30] <Gotolei> i think 3000? the cpu is i3-2330m
[08:30] <Poisoned_Dragon> hmm.... can't say it's too old. :)
[08:31] <Gotolei> if it's capable of running compiz then i'd hope it'd be capable of overlaying a simple transparent image :p
[08:32] <Poisoned_Dragon> It might be possible that the issue can be fixed with a conf file in an xorg.conf.d directory. You may have to enable a display option to clean that up.
[08:32] <Poisoned_Dragon> Could be something with the acceleration method.
[08:32] <Gotolei> why is everything in xubuntu some obscure config file or another :I
[08:33] <Gotolei> first power manager, now this
[08:33] <Gotolei> it didn't work in 14.04 either, but it wasn't this bad
[08:34] <Poisoned_Dragon> Well, newer intel gpus have a newer acceleration method. It's possible that it's not enabled in xorg by default. So, you make one to change the default behavior of xorg, governing that gpu.
[08:35] <Poisoned_Dragon> It's not a mile long thing you have to write. Just gotta add the lines you want to affect.
[08:35] <Gotolei> i'd messed around with xorg before, and nothing good has come out of it
[08:35] <Gotolei> 14.10 is broken enough as it is lol
[08:36] <Poisoned_Dragon> arch wiki has a great page on the subject of writing xorg conf files, and where they should go.
[08:36] <Gotolei> more trouble than it's worth, it seems :/
[08:36] <Poisoned_Dragon> lol... I've had to mess with it for older intel chips.
[08:36] <Poisoned_Dragon> Especially i865 laptop chips.
[08:37] <Gotolei> if i'm going to pour a bunch of time into troubleshooting something and trial and error
[08:37] <Gotolei> i'd rather spend it trying to figure out wth is with the lid close behavior
[08:38] <Poisoned_Dragon> Oh... that's a systemd thing.
[08:38] <Gotolei> i've changed the settings in a logind.conf but that doesn't work anymore
[08:38] <Gotolei> i was under the impression the systemd problems were supposed to be fixed after 14.04
[08:39] <Poisoned_Dragon> Oh, I thought I was the only one.
[08:40] <Gotolei> https://forum.xfce.org/viewtopic.php?id=9169
[08:40] <Gotolei> ^ worked in 14.04, but not anymore
[08:40] <Poisoned_Dragon> One day, it did exactly what I wanted. After an update, it ignored me.
[08:40] <Gotolei> isn't it fun :3
[08:40] <Poisoned_Dragon> Oh, a barrel of monkeys. XD
[08:41] <Poisoned_Dragon> I use to use the LidSwitchIgnoreInhibited=
[08:41] <Gotolei> i'd like to give 14.10 a bit of a chance because i've been running it all of five hours
[08:42] <Gotolei> but not a good first impression
[08:42] <Poisoned_Dragon> It worked perfectly, until it didn't.
[08:42] <Gotolei> yeah, i changed that and HandleLidSwitch
[08:42] <Poisoned_Dragon> That line allowed the power manager to control everything about the lid switch. Now, meh...
[08:43] <Poisoned_Dragon> When it was working, I didn't even use light locker.
[08:44] <Poisoned_Dragon> I used gnome-screensaver.
[08:44] <Poisoned_Dragon> I found lightlocker gave me issues.
[08:44] <Gotolei> i like to have it when i close the lid it a) locks and b) powers off the lid
[08:44] <Gotolei> and c) actually turn the screen back on after unlock
[08:44] <Gotolei> yeah idk about lightlocker
[08:45] <Poisoned_Dragon> Which is a shame because, I like the premise of lightlocker as being a compliment to xfce.
[08:45] <Poisoned_Dragon> or rather to lightdm.
[08:45] <Poisoned_Dragon> gnome-screensaver feels a little out of place. But, it always worked as expected.
[08:47] <Gotolei> does it handle lid closing properly? or is that an underlying systemd issue
[08:47] <Poisoned_Dragon> It seemed to help. with lightlocker, it felt as though it didn't respect user settings in power manager..
[08:48] <Gotolei> indeed it doesn't
[08:48] <Poisoned_Dragon> But, have the updates to systemd it's not as cooperative.
[08:48] <Gotolei> hm, does it pull in a ton of deps?
[08:48] <Poisoned_Dragon> *have=after
[08:48] <Poisoned_Dragon> I don't remember off hand, but I don't believe it pulls in too much.
[08:49] <Poisoned_Dragon> xfce is gtk2, so no extras there.
[08:49] <Poisoned_Dragon> and it's not like it pulls in an entirely new de.
[08:49] <Poisoned_Dragon> apt-get will tell you better, when it confirms install.
[08:49] <Gotolei> ..welp synaptic's broken as well now
[08:50] <Gotolei> yeah it doesn't look like it pulls in anything extra
[08:50] <Poisoned_Dragon> Really? When did that happen?
[08:50] <Gotolei> just now, it froze for like half an hour while installing wine
[08:51] <Poisoned_Dragon> It might be an issue with installing wine. You may have to get apt-get to fix it, or install from there.
[08:51] <Poisoned_Dragon> Once upon a time, there was a prompt you had to answer, and it didn't show up in synaptic. so, it just sat there.
[08:51] <Gotolei> ttf-mscorefonts-installer
[08:52] <Poisoned_Dragon> yeah, it's that stupid EULA.
[08:52] <Gotolei> funny how one random thing is enough to cripple a system
[08:52] <Poisoned_Dragon> They had fixed it, at one point. But, who knows.
[08:52] <Poisoned_Dragon> regressions can happen.
[08:53] <Gotolei> how does one recover from it
[08:53] <Gotolei> it never geve me any prompt
[08:55] <Poisoned_Dragon> if you kill synaptic, and try to run apt-get in terminal, it'll tell you that it can't because an install was interupted. Then, it'll give you the command you need to use.
[08:55] <Gotolei> it's giving me nothing
[08:55] <Gotolei> trying something found on ubuntuforums anyways
[08:56] <Gotolei> terminals whining about libssl now :?
[08:56] <Poisoned_Dragon> sudo dpkg -a --configure
[08:57] <Poisoned_Dragon> I think that's the command to fix an interupted install.
[08:57] <Poisoned_Dragon> what's the error for that?
[08:57] <Gotolei> zero output
[08:57] <Gotolei> screw it, i'll just try a reboot
[09:01] <Gotolei> reinstalled without hassle
[09:01] <Poisoned_Dragon> cool
[09:02] <Gotolei> there we go, only now does it do the popup :|
[09:02] <Poisoned_Dragon> XD
[09:02] <Poisoned_Dragon> linux life.
[09:02] <Poisoned_Dragon> Still better than windows.
[09:03] <Gotolei> so for gnome-screensaver, do you set it to run at startup and replace lightlocker or something?
[09:03] <Poisoned_Dragon> Yes.
[09:03] <Gotolei> --replace ?
[09:03] <Poisoned_Dragon> no
[09:03] <Poisoned_Dragon> Well, I dunno.
[09:04] <Poisoned_Dragon> I just installed it, changed it in startup, rebooted, tested it, and then remove the other on success.
[09:04] <Poisoned_Dragon> A bit lengthy but, effective.
[09:05] <Gotolei> ..and now synaptic's running through ttfjunk-installer again
[09:05] <Gotolei> and yup, got gnome-screensaver working
[09:06] <Poisoned_Dragon> cool
[09:06] <Gotolei> doesn't fix lid close causing suspend though
[09:06] <Gotolei> but at least it doesn't look like a giant swathe of bird poop]
[09:07] <Poisoned_Dragon> Well, once gnome-screensaver is installed, logind.conf options should be more compliant.
[09:07] <Gotolei> so reboot again?
[09:07] <Poisoned_Dragon> "should"
[09:07] <Poisoned_Dragon> With gnome-screensaver installed, the ignore inhibited option should work better. Then the power manager should be more compliant.
[09:08] <Poisoned_Dragon> It's a PITA, all the way around.
[09:08] <Poisoned_Dragon> But, when it was working, it worked great.
[09:08] <Gotolei> ..ok, just realized another dumb
[09:08] <Gotolei> everysingle line is commented
[09:08] <Poisoned_Dragon> Yes. lol
[09:08] <Poisoned_Dragon> Commented lines show you the default behavior
[09:08] <Gotolei> HandleLidSwitch=ignore  and  LidSwitchIgnoreInhibited=no to have it not suspend?
[09:09] <Poisoned_Dragon> I like to write a new line to preserve the information.
[09:09] <Poisoned_Dragon> Just leave the Handlelidswitch alone
[09:09] <Gotolei> it's set to suspend by default
[09:09] <Gotolei> which is exactly the opposite of what i want it to do
[09:10] <Poisoned_Dragon> Ignore Inhibited should be yes, if I remember correctly.
[09:10] <Gotolei> ..which is the default behavior it's currently set to
[09:10] <Poisoned_Dragon> Oh, then it's no
[09:11] <Poisoned_Dragon> Thanks. I always get that backwards.
[09:11] <Gotolei> mmk
[09:11] <Poisoned_Dragon> By using the the inhibited line, systemd should fall into lockstep with power manager settigs.
[09:11] <Gotolei> xfce's or what gnome-screensaver uses?
[09:11] <Gotolei> or are they one and the same
[09:12] <Poisoned_Dragon> gnome-screensaver shouldn't have pulled any gnome power manager.
[09:12] <Gotolei> ok so xfce's
[09:12] <Poisoned_Dragon> yup
[09:12] <Gotolei> mmk
[09:12] <Gotolei> rebooting again
[09:17] <Poisoned_Dragon> wb
[09:17] <Gotolei> o/
[09:17] <Gotolei> still suspends ._.
[09:17] <Poisoned_Dragon> :(
[09:17] <Poisoned_Dragon> Well, one out of 2 ain't the worst.
[09:18] <Poisoned_Dragon> As I said, after a specific update, it hasn't been the same.
[09:18] <Gotolei> mm
[09:18] <Gotolei> trying handlelidswitch=ignore because can't be too sure
[09:18] <Poisoned_Dragon> At least you don't have a freaky display with gnome-screensaver.
[09:18] <Gotolei> yeah
[09:21] <Gotolei> still a no
[09:21] <Poisoned_Dragon> :(
[09:21] <Gotolei> guessing 14.10 is a lost cause at this point
[09:21] <Poisoned_Dragon> Well, that's a problem with 14.04 too.
[09:21] <Gotolei> synaptic still throwing errors
[09:21] <Gotolei> yeah but at least the fix worked
[09:21] <Poisoned_Dragon> really?
[09:22] <Gotolei> "failure to download extra data files"
[09:22] <Poisoned_Dragon> I guess I'm glad I didn't upgrade.
[09:23] <Poisoned_Dragon> Usually, I chase after the newest versions. Didn't help that the only way to get something better than xfce 4.8 was to not use 12.04.
[09:23] <Poisoned_Dragon> But, with no major upgrades to 4.1x, It's not as neccessary to move.
[09:24] <Gotolei> ah, 12.04. last i had a distro that actually handled backlights properly
[09:24] <Gotolei> now it glitches around if set under 15% or so
[09:24] <brainwash> Gotolei: I did not read the whole backlog, but I suggest that you report the greeter wallpaper glitch on launchpad -> run "ubuntu-bug lightdm-gtk-gteeter"
[09:25] <Poisoned_Dragon> I don't think it's lightdm itself, brainwash. It's coupled with the use of lightlocker
[09:25] <Gotolei> well it's the initial login as well
[09:25] <Poisoned_Dragon> Oh, then report it.
[09:26] <brainwash> also, bug 1307545
[09:27] <Poisoned_Dragon> Oh gosh. It's been a bug for some time.
[09:27] <Gotolei> a typical ubuntu bug, then
[09:27] <Gotolei> "this is a big problem. let's ignore it"
[09:27] <brainwash> it's a strange bug, it was initially fixed in 13.10.. and some people still report, that it's not working properly
[09:28] <Gotolei> mm
[09:30] <brainwash_> got disconnected
[09:31] <Gotolei> wonder what changed from trusty to utopic to break it again
[09:32] <Gotolei> hm does upower ring any bells
[09:33] <Poisoned_Dragon> I never messed with it. It's the first I've heard of it.
[09:33] <Gotolei> mm
[09:33] <Gotolei> comments in linked bug mention it
[09:34] <brainwash> there were no changes in upower in 14.10
[09:34] <Poisoned_Dragon> With that said, they're having issues with a blank screen on resume.I haven't had that in a while.
[09:34] <Poisoned_Dragon> I just can't get the behavior to jive.
[09:34] <Gotolei> i get that semi-randomly
[09:35] <Gotolei> i think it has to do with the interval between ctrl+alt+l and the lid being closed or something
[09:35] <Gotolei> because that's totally something and end user should have to worry about
[09:35] <Gotolei> :p
[09:35] <brainwash> bug 1374830
[09:36] <Gotolei> this keyboard doesn't have a suspend key
[09:37] <Gotolei> ctrl+alt+L is supposed to just lock the screen
[09:38] <brainwash> yes, there is some sort of timing issue
[09:38] <brainwash> which is bad in the first place, it should work whatever the user does
[09:39] <brainwash> the suspend key triggers obviously the suspend sequence which triggers the lock screen
[09:40] <brainwash> which is similar to pressing ctrl+alt+l and then closing the lid "too early"
[09:40] <Gotolei> ctrl+alt+l isn't for the express purpose of triggering suspend, though
[09:41] <Gotolei> but yeah probably some similarities at least
[09:42] <brainwash> we got quite few reports, tons of bug comments.. but no one was able to debug this problem completely yet
[09:42] <Gotolei> hm
[09:42] <brainwash> because it's a tricky one
[09:43] <Gotolei> tbh at the moment i'm more concerned about the undesired behavior that occurs every single time than the undesired behavior that's easily bypassed
[09:44] <brainwash> you mean the glitched wallpaper?
[09:44] <brainwash> or ignored power settings?
[09:44] <Gotolei> both
[09:44] <Gotolei> also the power manager applet is a bit clumsy now but that's a minor thing
[09:44] <brainwash> make sure that you file a bug report for the first one :)
[09:45] <brainwash> the classic power manager tray icon has been replaced by a new panel plugin in 14.10
[09:45] <brainwash> sadly, you cannot fall back to the old tray icon
[09:45] <Gotolei> https://forum.xfce.org/viewtopic.php?id=9282 yeah
[09:46] <brainwash> https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11054
[09:47] <Poisoned_Dragon> lol, interesting title/
[09:48] <brainwash> again, I recommend that you file a bug report, so the devs are informed about the breakage in the new panel plugin
[09:48] <brainwash> filed on the Xfce bug tracker ^
[09:50] <Gotolei> specifically xfce bug tracker?
[09:50] <Gotolei> the command from before took me to launchpad
[09:51] <Gotolei> i'm thinking of reverting to 14.04 anyways because upgrading to 14.10 just made things worse
[09:51] <brainwash> yes, lightdm-gtk-greeter bugs are filed there, the project is hosted on launchpad
[09:52] <brainwash> you can file Xfce bugs on launchpad too, but it's always better to forward them directly to the Xfce bug tracker
[09:52] <Gotolei> this is the first i've heard of an xfce bug tracker
[09:52] <Gotolei> never done this before
[09:52] <Poisoned_Dragon> lol
[09:53] <Poisoned_Dragon> where did you think xfce came from? wasn't an ubuntu invention. :)
[09:53] <Gotolei> let's just say that 99% of the time i try to get support from anywhere, nothing happens
[09:54] <Poisoned_Dragon> That's the only drawback with a coalition of projects. Support can be fragmented and weak.
[09:54] <Gotolei> and yeah good riddance it's not from canonical
[09:54] <Gotolei> better off because of that
[09:54] <brainwash> going back to 14.04 could be the right choice, 14.10 is only supported for 9 months, then you will have to upgrade to 15.04 (9 months of support also)
[09:55] <Gotolei> http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=173622 about sums up my experiences with various support sites
[09:55] <cfhowlett> My machine eats LTS only since 10.04.  No regrets, way fewer problems.
[09:56] <Gotolei> aright, i think i have 14.04 flash drive still floating around somewhere
[09:59] <Gotolei> 14.04.1 is still most recent, right? no new point releases
[09:59] <Gotolei> most recent of trusty specifically
[09:59] <brainwash> that's right
[10:00] <cfhowlett> !LTS
[10:00] <Gotolei> mmk, i've already got it then
[10:01] <Gotolei> welp guess i'll go do that
[10:01] <Gotolei> thanks for the help anyways, all \o
[10:01] <brainwash> you're welcome :)
[10:02] <Gotolei> can't say it's been fun, but at least it hasn't made me want to rip my hair out like the linux mint channel did :p
[11:21] <athlon> hello.
[11:22] <athlon> is there anyone here using voyager?
[11:22] <athlon> perhaps the voyager 14.04.03?
[11:23] <bekks> Whats voyager?
[11:23] <cfhowlett> athlon, rephrase.  what do you REALLY need to know?  or are you counting voyager users?
[11:23] <athlon> voyager linux
[11:23] <athlon> no, I have problem with it not loading at all
[11:23] <bekks> I'd ask the voyager linux community instead.
[11:23] <cfhowlett> athlon, as this channel is for XUBUNTU ... I'm going to guess "no"
[11:24] <athlon> ok.
[11:46] <athlon> so I'd take it "ubuntu" and "ubuntu-french" are different?
[11:46] <cfhowlett> athlon, oui.
[11:47] <cfhowlett> !fr
[11:47] <athlon> thanks, ubottu.
[11:48] <athlon> I don't understand French at all but thanks.
[11:50] <athlon> since I only understand and write in English, would it be okay to use English in that #ubuntu-fr channel?
[11:59] <bazhang> for voyager support?
[12:00] <cfhowlett> athlon, you're going to ask for support in ENGLISH on a FRENCH language site ... ?
[12:00] <bazhang> !alis | athlon search here for voyager irc
[12:01] <Alexfrench> there is xchat on ubuntu or xubuntu working
[12:02] <bazhang> try hexchat
[12:02] <athlon> yeah, for voyager support.
[12:02] <bazhang> !info hexchat | Alexfrench
[12:03] <bazhang> athlon, none of the ubuntu/xubuntu channels are for voyager support
[12:03] <cfhowlett> Alexfrench, +1 for hexchat
[12:03] <Alexfrench> i don't know it, thanks
[12:03] <bazhang> athlon, /msg alis list *voyager*
[12:04] <cfhowlett> !flavors | Alexfrench these are the ONLY official Ubuntu versions.  If it's not on this list, it's on Ubuntu and it's not supported here.
[12:04] <bazhang> athlon ^
[12:05] <athlon> cfhowlett: that doesn't allowed?
[12:06] <cfhowlett> athlon, note: no voyager linux = NOT ubuntu = NOT supported here.
[12:06] <bazhang> athlon, no voyager support nope
[12:06] <Alexfrench> ok
[12:06] <bazhang> athlon, I just told you how to search using alis
[12:16] <athlon> cfhowlett: I know, I was referring to your question " you're going to ask for support in ENGLISH on a FRENCH language site ... ?"
[12:17] <bazhang> athlon, its for french Ubuntu support, not english, not voyager
[12:19] <athlon> I guess I mistaken "http://forum.ubuntu-fr.org/" for ubuntu-fr
[12:22] <cfhowlett> athlon, if you want support, install xubuntu.  otherwise search the voyager site for support options.  no voyager support in ubuntu irc/forums/mail lists.
[12:24] <athlon> well, sorry for the trouble then.
[12:33] <athlon> why would then "voyagerlive" site listed the "http://forum.ubuntu-fr.org/" there?
[12:34] <cfhowlett> athlon, you'd have to ask them.
[12:34] <Unit193> Indeed, but as it's somewhat French based, likely just tried to piggy back off the Ubuntu French community.
[12:35] <cfhowlett> unfortunate.  a distro that can't/won't support their own distro is a distro I wouldn't even touch
[12:42] <Alexfrench> athlon are you french ??
[12:49] <athlon> no. i'm from Asia.
[12:50] <cfhowlett> athlon, "Asia" meaning exactly ... ???
[12:53] <athlon> that wouldn't help too.
[12:54] <cfhowlett> athlon what language do you speak at home?
[12:55] <athlon> what would that question for?
[12:56] <cfhowlett> athlon, nvm.  done here.
[13:28] <PeterRJG> anyone here that can help me with something?
[13:28] <cfhowlett> !ask | PeterRJG
[13:29] <PeterRJG> alrighty, I have a failed download in apt-get that pop up every time I use it for something else. How do I clear it?
[13:29] <cfhowlett> PeterRJG, paste the exact message please.  paste.ubuntu.com
[13:35] <PeterRJG> http://paste.ubuntu.com/9502305/
[13:38] <Alexfrench> maybe i am wrong but you miss java stuff like jre ???
[13:39] <Alexfrench> so every time one call is done for things in java, bam error message
[13:39] <PeterRJG> I downloaded the icedtea 7 and it works. Everything in java works, but every time I use apt-get or synaptic, I get this message and I want to get rid of it
[13:41] <Alexfrench> ah sorry
[18:21] <halpme> me again
[18:21] <drc> Welcome back...what is it this time :)
[18:22] <drc> please notice the smilie face and don't take it the wrong way.
[18:22] <halpme> so at college I get 3 working wifi networks, at home, 20 cm away from the router, I get nothing. Is there something like a memory effect (in this case it would mean my machine recognizes 3 networks just ecause sometime in the past I used them, but in reality my chipset is no longer recognized by the actual version of xubuntu?
[18:23] <halpme> what do I have to write in a search engine to buy a compatible wifi app?
[18:23] <halpme> i dont know how those things aare called
[18:23] <halpme> usb wifi card?
[18:24] <halpme> smartcard wifi card?
[18:24] <drc> I don't think an "app"is the solution (if they even exist)
[18:24] <drc> maybe a usb wifi card is a solution.
[18:25] <drc> Forgive if this was covered yesterday, are you sure the home wifi router is really working?
[18:25] <holstein> halpme: may i suggest, since you literally *just* discovered that this issue is *drastically* different that what you thought it was, maybe just relax, and spend some time with it
[18:26] <holstein> otherwise, test my working with the access point
[18:26]  * drc (meaning the geek daughter) just replace our old router because it was not funtioning properly anymore.
[18:26] <halpme> home router works via ethernet cable. I was 20 cm away from the router, the wireless app with big letters "networks activated" but not a single wifi network listed
[18:26] <holstein> *if* you can connect to other access points, then, you *know* its not a problem with the wifi device in the machine.. but, either a compatility issue, or something where the ssid is hidden, or something with configuration, et
[18:26] <holstein> etc*
[18:26] <drc> halpme: The same here, it was just the wifi part that was going.
[18:27] <halpme> holstein:  test my working with the access point << donot udnerstand
[18:28] <holstein> halpme: test *by* working with the access point, since thats the issue
[18:29] <holstein> halpme: does *anything* connect to your wifi access point? of so? what are the settings? have you tried disabling encryption? do you have the ssid hidden? or wps push to connect? or MAC address filtering, or *any* other automatically configured setup that can be causing you to not be able to connect?
[18:30] <holstein> do you have another wifi router handy to plug in and test? i'll just power one on, without hooking it up, that doesnt have any encryption on it.. i'll see that the unit connects to that, and move on from there
[18:31] <holstein> i have seen issues where, one machine requires something the others dont.. wpa vs wpa2..
[18:32] <drc> holstein: Wouldn't <all> available access points within the geographic area show up even if one can't connect to them (I an see all sort of neighboring access points on my machine, even though I can't connect to them)?
[18:32] <holstein> drc: not sure what the case is here..
[18:32] <drc> It sounds like <nothing> is showing up atwhen he's at home.
[18:33] <holstein> drc: i read this as, at school, wifi access points are showing, and at home, not.. i dont see any other details about if anything can ever connect at home, or if the router is configured, etc
[18:34] <drc> True, but here at least, when the daughter plugged the new, out of the box, router in it showed up in the listings.
[18:35] <drc> a misconfigured router might not but it's hard to see why it wouldn't al least show up in the listings.
[18:35] <holstein> yup.. but, we dont know anything about that home access point.. could be hidden ssid, or whatever that "push to connect" is/does that i always manually disable
[18:36] <drc> True, I was just about to say that it looks like its been narrowed down to the router itself :)
[18:36] <halpme> im toot ired now, ill try what you suggest in 30 minutes
[18:36] <drc> The laptop appears to function properly (see school)
[18:41] <drc> halpme:  My next step would be to have a friend (with a known good computer re: wifi) come over. If s/he can't connect, that pretty much defines the problem as in the router.  Where you go from there, no help from here (I turned all that stuff over to the geek daughter years ago and have forgotten most of what I knew, which is probable out of date also)
[19:01] <halpme> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWzRd2vtnIs suggests I need propietary drivers
[19:20] <halpme> if I edit my environmetal variables file, do I habe to reboot for it to take efect?
[19:21] <halpme> got access to internet after editing said file, but its a pain!!!!!!
[19:22] <drc> halpme: Do you have to re-edit it everytime you re-boot?
[19:22] <halpme> no, I saved the changes, but still, not how I want to connect...
[19:23] <drc> and it could be you need p-drivers, I never have (works out of the box for me), but I've seen some folks say they do.
[19:23] <halpme> what is a p driver?
[19:23] <drc> "propietary drivers"...I was lazy
[19:24] <drc> But, iirc, needing a driver is usually a thing for the NIC, not the router.
[19:25] <halpme> additional drivers lists x.org and 4 nvidia drivers, 2 legacy binaries and 2 binaries
[19:25] <halpme> none of the nvidia drivers are for the wifi, right?
[19:25] <drc> nope, video
[19:26] <halpme> apparently college doesnt like the tor network
[19:26] <drc> x.org is usually for the display, mouse, etc.
[19:26] <halpme> a good reason to get your own provider
[19:26] <drc> a lott of them don't...you might be doing something terrile :)
[19:43] <holstein> halpme: again, i say, relax, and take your time.. nothing about proprietary graphics drivers help with your wifi
[19:43] <holstein> and, if that is an older machine, you are likely not going to be doing any gaming on it, anyways
[19:43] <halpme> holstein: i need a month off
[19:43] <holstein> not that thats the only reason to get proprietary drivers, but, thats the main reason.. if you are not having any issues with the graphics
[19:43] <holstein> halpme: sure.. *or* buy with linux support in mind
[19:43] <halpme> holstein: is 5 years "old"
[19:44] <holstein> halpme: you have to ask who creats the game you are trying to run.. typically, for computer gaming, yes, 5 years *is* old
[19:44] <halpme> i dont need gaming
[19:44] <holstein> i use machines older than that for audio production work.. but, i dont expect 3d from it
[19:44] <holstein> halpme: then, do you *need* the proprietary graphics driver?
[19:45] <halpme> are you talkking about x now?
[19:45] <drc> The only reason I use the nvidia driver on my laptop is it runs about 10C cooler with the driver than without...have no need for 2D playing Zork :)
[19:46] <drc> s/2D/3D/
[19:46] <holstein> halpme: im talking about you stating a youtube video suggests you need a proprietary graphics driver.. do *you* need a proprietary graphics driver?
[19:47] <halpme> i think not, the nvidia driver under 14.04 created a lot of prblems of broken packages
[19:48] <holstein> halpme: doenst here
[19:48]  * drc thinks that was becasue of the install, I've have never had any problems install nvidia driver, either thu the binary for nvidia or the repos.
[19:48] <holstein> halpme: *no* packages are broken for me in 14.04 with any proprietary drivers. though, i try and avoid them, when possible, when i dont need/want 3d, and you can as well
[19:50] <halpme> non issue as long as im in college, i cannot download anything here, just use firefox
[19:51] <halpme> even if I use my laptop
[19:53] <halpme> 16mbits/s for one person, is that enough?
[19:53] <halpme> say im gonna torrent 50GBof data
[19:55] <drc> halpme: The bottleneck in Torrents is usually not the pipe, but what each node contributing to the torrent gives.  Normally I'm happy if the torrent DL runs !2M/S, far slower than my pipe.
[19:56] <halpme> drc: even so, I get higher speeds if the advertised mbits/s of my provider are 50 instead of 16...
[19:56] <halpme> am I wrong?
[19:56] <drc> halpme: Your totall pipe is faster, boesn't mean any particular DL/torrent is faster.
[19:57] <drc> The really big question for me (re: pipes) is Are you streaming?, if so the bigest pipe is best.
[19:57] <halpme> 16 Mbits/s costs 15, 50 MBits/s costs 20...
[19:57] <drc> go for 50 :)
[19:58] <halpme> all I do is watching videos, movies and listen to the radio
[19:58] <drc> the cost diff is minimal (unless you're a poor college student :)
[19:58] <halpme> i AM a poor college student
[19:58] <drc> I know, I saw the uni-mainz :)
[19:58] <halpme> privacy ftw!!!
[19:59] <perfarator> 256kbps ADSL for 25$! Unlimited plan! Only in my country!
[20:00] <drc> halpme:  It sometimes pays to know a bit about a person when trying to help.  For example, the .de in the address says you are from germany, that way I know thet English is probably not your mother tongue and one can make adjustments accordingly.
[20:01] <halpme> can you paste a link with instructions regarding editing splash screens?
[20:01] <drc> And if you are worried about privacy on freenode, you can always register and ask for a "cloak".  Right click on your nick and mine and see the difference in the USER: data.
[20:01] <holstein> halpme: what splash screen? and why?
[20:02] <halpme> holstein: not to see a blank screen every time I turn on the machine
[20:02] <holstein> halpme: thats the machine.. so, you ask the creator of the hardware for that info.. though, i can save you the trouble..
[20:03] <holstein> otherwise, you can look at messing about with grub..
[20:03] <holstein> !grub
[20:16] <halpme> what linux compatible webcams should I star looking for?
[20:26] <drc> halpme: You might be better off to ask this in a webcam channel (if there is one) or on #ubuntu (bigger user base and if it works on ubuntu, it'll probably work on Xubuntu)
[20:27] <halpme> ok dr
[20:27] <halpme> drc:
[20:42] <holstein> halpme: what do i do? as i said before, i shop looking for *specific* linux support stated from the manufacturer.. if not that, then, i go and plug the thing into my laptop, or i buy, and make certain i can return it
[20:43] <holstein> linux/ubuntu/xubuntu does nothing to prevent *any* webcam from working
[20:45] <drc> holstein's correct (again, as always :)...If it says it supports "linux", *buntu support is almost a given.
[20:46] <holstein> drc: i actually have found a few USB cams that didnt work, as well.. :/
[20:46] <drc> but some support is more equal than other.
[20:46]  * drc hedged his bet..."almost" :)
[20:53]  * drc had to look at the back of his laptop to see if it indeed had a serial and parallel port.
[20:54] <drc> nope
[21:11] <xubuntu08w> quien habla español?
[21:11] <krytarik> !es | xubuntu08w
[21:54] <Lucky___> anyone here :) ?
[21:55] <drc> Nope, we've closed up shop and went to the pub.
[21:56] <drc> This is a recording.
[22:05] <Lucky___> anyone?
[22:05] <krytarik> Lucky___: Just ask.
[22:07] <Lucky___> Ok, I have a problem with Xubuntu/Lubuntu. My screen just freezes when I launch the "Try Xubuntu" or when I click on "Install Xubuntu". here's a picture : http://imgur.com/kLUG3XR
[22:07] <Lucky___> I need help !
[22:09] <krytarik> !nomodeset | Lucky___
[22:09] <Lucky___> thanks :D


[00:00] <LPCIBot> Project db-devel build #764: STILL FAILING in 6 hr 2 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/db-devel/764/
[00:17] <wallyworld> jtv: you back on board yet?
[00:56] <poolie> wallyworld: hello, can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~xaav/loggerhead/export-tarball/+merge/66408
[00:57] <poolie> and merge it if appropriate
[00:58] <wallyworld> poolie: sure
[00:58] <wallyworld> that one was marked as needing info for a while i think
[00:59] <poolie> it stalled for a bit
[01:00] <poolie> if people push and don't ask for more review it's easy for things to get stuck
[01:12] <poolie> which is https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/745469 i guess
[01:12] <_mup_> Bug #745469: please send notifications when merge page has been updated with new revisions <code-review> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/745469 >
[01:23] <wallyworld> poolie: in the above case, i normally add a comment to the mp explaining what i did and why and how it relates to any previous request for change
[01:23] <wallyworld> this causes an email to be sent
[01:23] <poolie> yup
[01:23] <poolie> it's not obvious that you ought to do this though
[01:23] <poolie> ought/need
[01:23] <wallyworld> too true
[01:39] <lifeless> fixing up aaron's incremental diff thing will address that - and get sensible incremental diffs with merges from trunk (which the loggerhead based diff thing does not do)
[01:49] <LPCIBot> Project devel build #928: STILL FAILING in 5 hr 37 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/devel/928/
[02:28] <wallyworld> lifeless: can you +1 this? i'm not 100% familar with loggerhead etc but it seems reasonable and has had a lot of input already.... https://code.launchpad.net/~xaav/loggerhead/export-tarball/+merge/66408
[02:32] <poolie> thanks wallyworld
[02:33] <poolie> to merge it, when you're ready, you should be able to just merge into lp:loggerhead
[02:33] <poolie> and i guess it would be good to deploy that to lp too
[02:33] <wallyworld> poolie: np. i'll clean up the lint first
[02:34] <wallyworld> poolie: i may need to ask for help deploying - i've had nothing to do with loggerhead so far :-)
[02:46] <poolie> np
[02:46] <poolie> i'm getting "lib/canonical/launchpad/icing/yui/yui/yui.js" in my lp checkout
[02:47] <poolie> oh, a broken symlink or something, isn't it
[02:50] <wallyworld> poolie: likely. a make clean will fix it
[02:50] <wallyworld> will || should
[05:06] <lifeless> are there any tests of the personmerge view other than the doctest ?
[05:41] <LPCIBot> Project db-devel build #765: STILL FAILING in 5 hr 40 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/db-devel/765/
[05:49] <lifeless> hahaha
[05:50] <wgrant> ?
[05:50] <lifeless> -> ops
[06:15] <lifeless> wgrant: are there unit tests for person.merge() ?
[06:17] <wgrant> I doubt it. But let's see..
[06:17] <lifeless> I can't see any in test_person
[06:18] <wgrant> There is a _do_merge in test_person.
[06:18] <wgrant> Is that not relevant?
[06:18] <wgrant> I haven't actually seen anything beyond its existence.
[06:18] <lifeless> nothing in there looking for notifications that I can see
[06:18] <lifeless> which is what I'm touching
[06:18] <wgrant> :/
[06:29] <lifeless>  and \o/
[06:33] <lifeless> can has review ?
[06:33] <lifeless> https://code.launchpad.net/~lifeless/launchpad/bug-761874/+merge/69748
[06:44] <lifeless> wgrant: ^ or wallyworld ^
[06:44] <lifeless> wallyworld: I will look at the loggerhead thing monday; it requires some pagination
[06:44] <wallyworld> lifeless: ok, thanks. will look at your mp
[06:44] <lifeless> wallyworld: deployment is the usual thing - update the version we use, and qa that once that commit hits qa-staging
[06:44] <wallyworld> ok
[07:21] <poolie> cheerio wallyworld
[07:21] <poolie> what's the idiomatic way to html-escape things in lp python code?
[07:22] <wgrant> Don't do it.
[07:22] <wallyworld> poolie: i'll do that mp on monday when it gets +1ed
[07:22] <wgrant> poolie: What are you trying to do?
[07:22] <wgrant> Escaping is usually the wrong thing.
[07:22] <wallyworld> wgrant: you want to mentor: ://code.launchpad.net/~lifeless/launchpad/bug-761874/+merge/69748 ?
[07:23] <poolie> wgrant: test_scope_documentation_displayed is checking that the feature scopes are in the browser.contents
[07:23] <poolie> it's failing to find them, i think because the new one i've added contains angle brackets
[07:23] <wgrant> Ah, so this is in a test?
[07:23] <wgrant> Just use cgi.escape.
[07:23] <poolie> heh :) ok
[07:24] <LPCIBot> Project devel build #929: STILL FAILING in 5 hr 34 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/devel/929/
[07:24] <poolie> i agree with not having random escaping and unescaping in  production code
[07:35] <adeuring> good morning
[07:42] <poolie> hi abel
[07:42] <poolie> could someone do a review for me, on https://code.launchpad.net/~mbp/launchpad/mail-scope/+merge/60281
[07:52] <adeuring> poolie: I'll look
[07:53] <poolie> thanks
[07:55] <lifeless> wallyworld: still here ?
[07:55] <lifeless> wallyworld: you asked for create to mention delete, but I do that in my patch already.
[07:55] <lifeless> wallyworld: do you mean you want the interface to talk about implementation ?
[07:55]  * lifeless loads the question
[07:57] <adeuring> lifeless: could you have a look at this mp: https://code.launchpad.net/~adeuring/launchpad/bug-739052/+merge/69625
[08:01] <lifeless> adeuring: hahha, on friday night no less.
[08:01] <lifeless> adeuring: great stuff
[08:01] <adeuring> lifeless: thanks!
[08:12] <bigjools> morning
[08:14] <poolie> o/
[08:15] <mrevell> hallo there bigjools
[08:26] <poolie> ok, good night
[08:41] <lifeless> adeuring: reviewed
[08:42] <adeuring> lifeless: thanks!
[08:52] <lifeless> adeuring: no probs
[08:53] <bigjools> wgrant: need a chat with you
[09:05] <bigjools> adeuring: morning!  I have a lovely branch for you if you can take it please?
[09:05] <adeuring> bigjools: sure
[09:06] <bigjools> adeuring: https://code.launchpad.net/~julian-edwards/launchpad/utf-codes-in-emails-bug-817106/+merge/69758
[09:06] <wgrant> bigjools: Not entirely here, but what's up?
[09:07] <bigjools> wgrant: I wanted to talk about the no-builds-in-progress check in the IDSJ, and whether/how we should fix the packagecopier
[09:07] <bigjools> I am very concerned
[09:08] <wgrant> Your concern is well-placed.
[09:09] <bigjools> wgrant: so I'd rather mumble/skype.  If now is bad, next week is ok.
[09:09] <wgrant> bigjools: Next week is probably best, sorry.
[09:09] <bigjools> not a problem
[09:09] <bigjools> thanks
[09:10] <adeuring> bigjools: the diff on the MP page shows a minor merge conflict
[09:12] <bigjools> adeuring: ah I'll fix that, thanks
[09:22] <bigjools> adeuring: conflict fixed, just waiting for the branch scanner
[09:22] <adeuring> bigjools: thanks
[09:38] <adeuring> bigjools: r=me
[09:38] <bigjools> adeuring: thank you sir.  Did the unicode stuff look ok?  I figured you'd have more experience of that than me :)
[09:39] <adeuring> bigjools: as I wrote in the MP, we used something like u'Lo\u2345c' and avoided the "coding: utf-8" line at the top
[09:39] <bigjools> ah ok
[09:39] <adeuring> bigjools: but
[09:39] <adeuring> I thin k we can really switch to the way you did it
[09:40] <bigjools> I took inspiration from a different python file in our tree
[09:40] <adeuring> bigjools: even better then :)
[09:40] <bigjools> Loïc looks better than Lo\u2345c huh? :)
[09:40] <adeuring> there is a small risk that somebody uses an editor which does not understnd utf-8
[09:40] <adeuring> but I am not aware of any such editors...
[09:41] <bigjools> yeah - I had issues with Vim but then it seems all ok with it today :/
[09:41] <adeuring> bigjools: and yeah, this '\u3456' looks really ugly and is sometimes hard to understand
[09:42] <bigjools> indeed
[09:42] <jml> lifeless: can you please merge: lp:~jml/python-fixtures/misc-fixes
[09:43] <adeuring> I think Python supports also something like "LATIN_CAPITAL_A_WITHDIERESIS" with some escape mechanism but that's not much better than \u1234
[09:44] <bigjools> heh
[09:44] <bigjools> it is a total minefield
[09:47] <adeuring> bigjools: not such a big pitfall as some Qt unicode -> string conversion method (can't remember which one exactly) It gave you ISO8859-1 strings by default. Was quite annoying for any language spoken that did not originate in western europe
[09:48] <bigjools> adeuring: nice.
[10:14] <cjwatson> https://dev.launchpad.net/LaunchpadPpa says "The current development series [...] (currently: natty)" and "The current release [...] (currently: maverick)"
[10:15] <cjwatson> should that be changed to oneiric and natty respectively now?
[10:15] <wgrant> Indeed. It does work on oneiric.
[10:17] <cjwatson> launchpad-dependencies has versions 0.95~oneiric1, 0.95~natty1, 0.95~lucid1.  lp:meta-lp-deps only has 0.95.  Is that done by hand?  How do you deal with different versions of dependencies in different releases?
[10:17] <bigjools> jtv: the expander sections on the queue syncs look nicer now
[10:17] <cjwatson> oh, hm, https://code.launchpad.net/~launchpad/+recipe/meta-lp-deps-on-demand
[10:17] <jtv> bigjools: Thanks.  Actually expanding does look more appropriate on an expander, does it not?
[10:18] <bigjools> jtv: generally :)
[10:18] <jtv> BTW it looks like the other expanders don't get the colspan quite right.
[10:19] <jtv> My eye keeps expecting a link where the archive name is.  Is there anything to link to?
[10:19] <wgrant> cjwatson: Right, that recipe is used. The deps are identical between series these days, though, so the series-specific sources are unnecessary.
[10:19] <cjwatson> I guess I can use substvars to force the right versions of apt/python-apt
[10:20] <cjwatson> cleaner than series-specific sources
[10:20] <wgrant> Slightly.
[10:20] <wgrant> maverick doesn't have a sufficient version?
[10:20] <cjwatson> no
[10:21] <wgrant> That is inconvenient.
[10:21] <cjwatson> bigjools has copied stuff into the PPA now (including maverick), but I assume that that won't necessarily get upgraded without forcing versions in lp-deps
[10:21] <wgrant> Sometimes we force it, sometimes we don't...
[10:22] <cjwatson> Should I just not bother?
[10:23] <wgrant> Probably not. Only the two buildbots + cocoplum really need it.
[10:23] <wgrant> And we can ensure that those are correct easily.
[10:23] <wgrant> And it avoids the substvar mess.
[10:24] <cjwatson> it's mildly inconvenient that cocoplum doesn't seem to have the Launchpad PPA in sources.list
[10:24] <wgrant> Right, the DC machines use CAT.
[10:24] <wgrant> We generally import stuff from the PPA into CAT.
[10:24] <cjwatson> so I should RT that?  it's just for apt/lucid
[10:24] <wgrant> Not sure. LOSAs ^^?
[10:25]  * mthaddon catches up
[10:26] <mthaddon> yeah, an RT asking for it to be uploaded to the -cat repos and installed would be good
[10:26] <cjwatson> OK
[10:26] <mthaddon> cjwatson: unf we can't install directly from PPAs on servers in the DC as that would basically mean a compromise of LP would root all DC servers
[10:26] <mthaddon> s/would/could/
[10:26] <wgrant> Erm...
[10:26] <wgrant> You know what controls the Ubuntu archive, yeah? :)
[10:27] <mthaddon> well, that's true, but it's a slightly different case
[10:27] <wgrant> The security of the primary archive is less tested, yes.
[10:29] <cjwatson> I'd normally use the ubuntu-platform@ RT address, but I assume I should use the launchpad@ address in this case ...
[10:31] <cjwatson> wgrant: assuming that the buildbots are up to date or will update, then https://code.launchpad.net/~cjwatson/launchpad/dpkg-xz-support-619152 could be landed now, I believe
[10:32] <wgrant> cjwatson: Has it been through ec2 lately?
[10:33] <cjwatson> No
[10:34] <bigjools> wgrant: can you help the dude in #launchpad?
[10:45] <cjwatson> mthaddon: done, RT#47110
[10:45] <_mup_> Bug #47110: [UNMETDEPS] php4-yaz links against old libmysqlclient <php4-yaz (Ubuntu):Fix Released> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/47110 >
[10:45] <mthaddon> thx
[10:47] <mthaddon> cjwatson: do you know if this has been tested on staging/dogfood?
[11:05] <allenap> adeuring: Would you be able to review a mostly JavaScript branch for me? https://code.launchpad.net/~allenap/launchpad/localpackagediffs-filter-by-person-or-team-bug-798873-ui/+merge/69766
[11:05] <adeuring> allenap: sure
[11:06] <allenap> Thanks :)
[11:06] <allenap> adeuring: I am going to get some lunch now but I'll try to watch for pings. Is that okay? If not, leave it for later when I'm back.
[11:07] <adeuring> allenap: then let me ytart my lunch break too before I start to look at the mp :)
[11:07] <allenap> adeuring: Cool :)
[11:24] <LPCIBot> Project db-devel build #766: STILL FAILING in 5 hr 43 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/db-devel/766/
[11:29] <bigjools> """Gina's changelog parser and muncher for great justice"""
[11:53] <jml> am thinking of doing work to address / mitigate https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/814725
[11:53] <_mup_> Bug #814725: No feedback between upload & acceptance/rejection <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/814725 >
[11:53] <jml> james_w suggested adding an API method for upload
[11:54] <jml> any thoughts from folk here? bigjools? wgrant? StevenK?
[11:54] <bigjools> jml: it's not a trivial problem
[11:55] <wgrant> Until we have a message queue.
[11:55] <bigjools> an API for upload is not going to work, it'll time out
[11:55] <wgrant> Until then, best not to think about it :)
[11:56] <bigjools> we need to decide what feedback people would be happy with
[11:56] <jml> bigjools: so the timeout starts from 'request received'?
[11:56] <jml> or rather, request started
[11:56] <jml> rather than, say, request finished
[11:57] <wgrant> jml: The processing itself can easily take many seconds.
[11:57] <bigjools> jml: to make sure we're talking about the same thing, is that a webservice API?
[11:57] <bigjools> s/seconds/minutes/
[11:57] <jml> bigjools: yes.
[11:57] <jml> why minutes?
[11:57] <bigjools> jml: ok, that will never work.  we need a different transport
[11:58] <bigjools> jml: the upload processor has to unpack the package
[11:58] <bigjools> that can take a loooong time
[11:58] <jml> why does it need to do that?
[11:58] <bigjools> to verify its contents
[11:58] <wgrant> It should never take minutes, but it can have to un-xz and un-bz2 a few hundred megabytes :/
[11:58] <bigjools> "should" :)
[11:59] <bigjools> jml: at a stretch we could make poppy poke something into the database to say "pending uploads +=1" and then make the upload processor decrement that.  Then the UI can show something.
[12:00] <bigjools> not sure of the ramifications of that though
[12:00] <jml> bigjools: well, there are other checks that are fast to do that the user would be well served to be told about sooner
[12:00] <jml> e.g. permission checks
[12:00] <bigjools> jml: yes, they are all done first
[12:01] <wgrant> I have considered deferring the extraction to a job.
[12:01] <jml> bigjools: yeah, but currently asynchronously
[12:01] <wgrant> We could possibly get away with removing a couple of the pedantic checks on the extracted package.
[12:01] <bigjools> jml: I think it doesn't try to unpack unless all the other stuff passes
[12:01] <jml> I can't see any mention of tarfile in archiveuploader
[12:01] <wgrant> And then do the file retrieval async.
[12:01] <wgrant> jml: Hahah
[12:01] <wgrant> dpkg-source
[12:01] <bigjools> anyway - there's a load of bugs which means it'll just OOPS
[12:01] <wgrant> Not that easy :)
[12:01] <jml> wgrant: ah, ok. got it.
[12:02]  * bigjools has deja vu
[12:02] <wgrant> archiveuploader is a bit special.
[12:02] <wgrant> Not gina-special.
[12:02] <wgrant> But still fairly special.
[12:02]  * bigjools found a horrible bug in gina
[12:02] <bigjools> it doesn't help when the doctest that checks for output format doesn't have a -NORMALIZE_WHITESPACE :/
[12:03] <jml> afaict, the verification here is just for 'single directory', 'changelog' and 'copyright'
[12:03] <jml> I guess dpkg-source might do verification that the code implicitly relies on.
[12:04] <wgrant> bigjools: While you're there, want to fix archiveuploader's changelog_entry generation?
[12:04] <bigjools> what aspect?
[12:04] <wgrant> jml: Right. dpkg-source does a lot of checks.
[12:04] <jml> why not check the first by listing the tarball contents, and get the other two by just extracting those files?
[12:05] <wgrant> jml: But if we accept an invalid package, it will just fail to build, so it's not that bad.
[12:05] <wgrant> Extracting those files how?
[12:05] <wgrant> We'd have to be able to unpack all the source formats.
[12:05] <wgrant> Untar + diff
[12:05] <wgrant> Or untar + untar
[12:05] <wgrant> Or whatever they come up with next.
[12:05] <bigjools> accepting invalid packages to the build farm is nuts, don't do that
[12:06] <wgrant> bigjools: They are rare and will just end up FAILEDTOBUILD. It's not *that* bad.
[12:06] <bigjools> it's build time wasted
[12:06] <jml> wgrant: hmm. I see. I guess you'd have to patch upstream to provide the feature.
[12:06] <bigjools> disk space wasted
[12:06] <bigjools> and crufty
[12:06] <jml> bigjools: every successful check is wasted CPU too
[12:07] <bigjools> reject early, reject often
[12:07] <bigjools> jml: no, it's just getting deferred
[12:10] <bigjools> the later you reject in a pipeline that has a lot of steps, the harder it is to produce a decent error message
[12:11] <jml> Certainly failing early is good.
[12:11] <jml> But if you are doing an expensive check early that is also implicitly done in later steps, you are penalizing successful cases to help the bad ones.
[12:12] <bigjools> in this case I disagree; you're just pushing the penalty to later on
[12:14] <wgrant> Perhaps we should get some data.
[12:14] <jml> but it's actually making it take longer, isn't it? Or is the output of dpkg-source in the upload check saved so that the build farm doesn't need to run it?
[12:15] <wgrant> I suspect it's very rare that dpkg-source fails.
[12:15] <jml> wgrant: yeah, that'd be interesting to see.
[12:15] <jml> funnel graphs
[12:15] <wgrant> No, all the buildds have to rerun it.
[12:15] <bigjools> so assuming most uploads are actually OK, then you're right.  But yeah we need data on that.
[12:16] <bigjools> I still think we need to check this stuff :)
[12:17] <wgrant> I'm also not quite sure on how a webservice API would work here.
[12:17] <bigjools> it wouldn't
[12:17] <wgrant> I guess you'd upload files to the librarian and then fire off an MQ-based job.
[12:17] <wgrant> It's doable, and should be done eventually :)
[12:18] <bigjools> please not the librarian
[12:18] <wgrant> They would have a <24h expiry.
[12:19] <bac> hola abel
[12:19] <jml> still probably need a  MQ though.
[12:19] <bigjools> the way we do it is fine.  We can make poppy send a message to something to kick off processing
[12:19] <bigjools> I'd like to parallelise per archive (up to a max thread count)
[12:20] <wgrant> Indeed.
[12:20] <wgrant> It would be nice if Python did threads :/
[12:20] <bigjools> heh
[12:21] <wgrant> Maybe by the time we have a MQ-based jobrunner we will have moved to PyPy.
[12:21]  * bigjools can't believe this changelog parsing bug has been in Gina so long
[12:21] <jml> well
[12:21] <bigjools> wgrant: haha
[12:22] <jml> we'll see what I actually need to get my thing done.
[12:23] <bigjools> jml: in lieu of a message, another solution would be to have some sort of pending upload indicator in IArchive which poppy increments and the upload processor decremements
[12:23] <wgrant> jml: Recipes!
[12:23] <jml> wgrant: I asked for in-page updates for async jobs for every feature LP did since January 2010.  Including recipes.
[12:23] <bigjools> jml: when we finish DDs, we'll be finishing *that* :)
[12:24] <jml> bigjools: looking forward to it.
[12:24] <bigjools> hellyes
[12:24] <wgrant> Bug #628738
[12:24] <_mup_> Bug #628738: SourcePackageRelease.changelog_entry now incorrectly generated <lp-soyuz> <soyuz-upload> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/628738 >
[12:24] <wgrant> bigjools: That's the bug.
[12:25] <wgrant> (also not caught because of NORMALIZE_WHITESPACE, IIRC)
[12:25] <bigjools> yay
[12:25] <bigjools> different problem to the one I am fixing though
[12:25] <wgrant> doctests, yay
[12:25] <wgrant> Yeah.
[12:25] <bigjools> there's nothing like testable documentation
[12:26] <bigjools> and our doctests are nothing like testable documentation
[12:26] <jml> except maybe burgers with turds in them.
[12:26]  * bigjools blinks
[12:28] <adeuring> allenap: r=me
[12:28] <allenap> Thanks adeuring :)
[12:32] <bigjools> wgrant: do you know if iron is in NDT?
[12:32] <wgrant> bigjools: It is.
[12:32] <wgrant> mcmurdo too.
[12:32] <bigjools> good
[12:33] <bigjools> I love the way that someone thought that list.append(string) included a newline
[12:33] <wgrant> ftpmaster, ppa, librarian, librarian2, mailman, codehosting are not in nodowntime.
[12:33] <wgrant> Everything else is.
[12:33] <wgrant> mailman might be as of 12 hours ago. I forget.
[12:34] <wgrant> And codehosting will be on monday.
[12:34] <wgrant> Shall be good.
[12:34] <bigjools> woo
[12:46] <cjwatson> mthaddon: TTBOMK it has not
[12:46] <mthaddon> cjohnston: ok, I've added a note to the ticket that we should do that first, so we'll make it so
[12:46] <cjwatson> great, thanks
[12:47] <jml> cjwatson: that's a new acronym for me.
[12:47] <jml> excellent. no more learning required from me for the rest of the day.
[12:53]  * cjwatson prescribes jml alcohol
[12:53] <cjwatson> mthaddon: do I need to take that backlogged message seriously, or is it automatic irrelevancy?
[12:54] <mthaddon> cjwatson: it basically just means it hasn't been directly assigned to someone yet, but I've given in a priority, and if that needs bumping up it can be done at any time
[12:54] <mthaddon> s/given in/given it/
[12:54] <jml> cjwatson: with prescriptions like that, perhaps there's more to be said for private medical practitioners than I had previously thought!
[12:54] <cjwatson> mthaddon: ok, cool
[13:08] <deryck> Morning, all.
[13:42] <jtv> Hi bac!  Free for a review?  I've got this: https://code.launchpad.net/~jtv/launchpad/bug-818032/+merge/69791
[13:43] <bac> jtv: sure
[13:43] <jtv> Thanks.
[13:45] <bac> jtv: did you have any pre-implementation discussions about this bug and branch?
[13:45] <jtv> bac: yes, hence the "pre-implementation notes" :)
[13:45] <jtv> With Julian, to be precise.
[14:01] <bac> jtv: ok.  since you didn't list any one in that section i wanted to find out.
[14:04] <jtv> bac: in retrospect I see I wasn't very helpful in that section, sorry.
[14:04] <bac> jtv: looks good.  thanks!
[14:04] <jtv> thank you.
[14:27] <abentley> adeuring or bac: could you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~abentley/launchpad/fix-lpviews/+merge/69800 ?
[14:27] <bac> abentley: i will
[14:27] <adeuring> bac: you bebat me :)
[14:27] <abentley> bac: I have fixed the lint.
[14:27] <bac> i did bebat you!
[14:39] <bac> abentley: done.  good catch.
[14:40] <abentley> bac: thanks.
[14:40] <bac> i didn't realize we had pages using the zope default
[15:04] <jcsackett> sinzui: i see that you are working on 800361. i just unassigned myself from that in lp; shall i assign you?
[15:06] <sinzui> jcsackett, I suppose
[15:07] <jcsackett> sinzui: is there a reason i shouldn't? i only unassigned myself b/c i'm not currently working further on it after UI tests and thought someone else might have the time to do it. which seemed to be you.
[15:08] <sinzui> jcsackett, I have been very distracted the last two days and have made no progress. If I am distracted today, I will give up the work to wallyworld. This is critical path work and I not certain I should ever be on the critical path
[15:08] <jcsackett> sinzui: ok. leave it till monday and decide then?
[15:09] <sinzui> jcsackett, I have been working to unblock others. I am participating in the product strategist interviews
[15:09] <jcsackett> sinzui: aaah.
[15:09] <sinzui> jcsackett, do you have time to mumble?
[15:09] <jcsackett> sinzui: sure.
[15:22] <gary_poster> bigjools, is there anyone with a somewhat overlapping timezone to mine whom I can bother about a relatively simple soyuz question (https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/166346 fwiw)?  I'm sorry I've been bothering you a lot lately.
[15:23] <bigjools> gary_poster: that doesn't look like a soyuz question
[15:23] <gary_poster> oh
[15:23] <bigjools> project release stuff isn;t it?
[15:23]  * gary_poster feels dumber...
[15:24] <gary_poster> ok
[15:24] <gary_poster> bac...do you have any idea about https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/166346 ?
[15:24] <bigjools> gary_poster: oh and I think the answer is "no" anyway :(  You've got 2 Aussies, and me.
[15:25] <gary_poster> bigjools, heh, ok, thanks
[15:47] <bac> sorry, gary your message didn't get highlighted.  maybe my client doesn't like "bac..."
[15:50] <bac> gary_poster: i can't answer that question off the top of my head.  i'm not familiar with how that pattern is used.  i can look into it, though.
[16:14] <gary_poster> thanks bac.  maybe on your CHR rotation.  I'm not pursuing it
[16:28] <jml> mrevell: did you just put Welsh on the Launchpad blog?
[16:50] <dobey> hey guys
[16:51] <dobey> i got OOPS-2036MPJ10 from lp trying to generate a diff for my branch
[16:51] <dobey> i think it might be a bug in bzr or something
[16:56] <jelmer> hi dobey
[16:57] <jelmer> hmm, that OOPS hasn't synced yet
[17:01] <dobey> ok
[17:01] <dobey> jelmer: it probably says something akin to this, anyway: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/654553/
[17:03] <LPCIBot> Project db-devel build #767: STILL FAILING in 5 hr 38 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/db-devel/767/
[17:17] <jelmer> dobey: that's a known bug
[17:17] <jelmer> a 5 digit bug even
[17:17] <jelmer> bug 82555
[17:17] <_mup_> Bug #82555: Merging to an empty branch doesn't work <merge> <Bazaar:Confirmed> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/82555 >
[17:20] <dobey> wow
[17:22] <jelmer> dobey: while you're here... :)
[17:22] <jelmer> dobey: did you see my mps against lptools?
[17:23] <dobey> yeah, but i haven't had time to look at them. i guess poolie hasn't either
[17:24] <jelmer> there's no hurry
[17:29] <dobey> that bug is interestingly odd
[17:29] <dobey> since it is possible to merge to an empty branch, but weird things can happen
[17:30] <dobey> if i just merge to the empty branch and commit straight away, it sort of 'rights' itself
[17:33] <dobey> so, this is interesting...
[17:34] <dobey> jelmer: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/654630/ <- notice the revnos that are listed as negative :)
[17:35] <dobey> and log -n0 shows them as 1..5
[17:37] <jelmer> dobey: yeah, there seem to be multiple issues here
[17:37] <jelmer> dobey: this sort of thing is tricky because of the way we do revno assignment, as you can see :)
[17:38] <dobey> sure
[17:42] <gmb> bac: I have a branch that needs reviewing, if you've got time: https://code.launchpad.net/~gmb/launchpad/remove-unused-potmsgsets/+merge/69841
[17:43] <bac> gmb: i do have time.
[17:43] <gmb> Thanks
[17:43] <gmb> Woah.
[17:43] <gmb> bac: Hang on. Bad diff.
[17:44] <gmb> bac: Should have submitted against db-devel. https://code.launchpad.net/~gmb/launchpad/remove-unused-potmsgsets/+merge/69842
[18:07] <bac> gmb: review done with a couple of suggestions
[18:08] <gmb> bac: Thanks
[19:00] <deryck> abentley: I'll be ready for our call in about 3 minutes.  Meet you in mumble then?
[19:00] <abentley> deryck: sounds good.
[19:13] <LPCIBot> Project devel build #930: STILL FAILING in 6 hr 1 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/devel/930/
[20:07] <abentley> gary_poster: ping
[20:08] <gary_poster> abentley, hi
[20:08] <abentley> gary_poster: I'd like to talk about the jsoncache.  Do you have a couple of minutes?
[20:09] <gary_poster> abentley, sure, in 5 ok?
[20:09] <abentley> gary_poster: sure.
[20:09] <gary_poster> cool, abentley, I'll ping
[20:17] <gary_poster> abentey, thanks, ready
[20:17] <gary_poster> I'd prefer skype
[20:24] <gary_poster> abentley ping :-)
[20:24]  * gary_poster has EoD in 5
[20:24] <abentley> gary_poster: So that the Thunderdome, you expressed concern about the idea of reloading the whole JSONRequestCache as a means of updating pages.
[20:25] <gary_poster> yeah
[20:25] <gary_poster> at least as one to be applied as a blanket approach
[20:25] <abentley> gary_poster: Was the concern about the size of the download or the expense of calculating it server-side?
[20:25] <gary_poster> probably fine in some cases
[20:25] <gary_poster> abentley, expense
[20:26] <abentley> gary_poster: I think you suggested using ETAGs as a remedy to avoid retrieving already-known data?  But wouldn't that still be expensive server-side?
[20:29] <gary_poster> abentley, I don't remember suggesting ETAGs for this problem, but who knows. :-)  My preferred solutions might be long poll pushes, and/or MVC in client-side code (which in isolation would only address part of the "curentness" problem, but would be better than what we have).
[20:32] <abentley> gary_poster: I don't understand how MVC would address it.  The +sharing-details page wants to use it, and IS MVC.
[20:34] <abentley> gary_poster: Anyhow, I guess we can pick this up next week.
[20:36] <gary_poster> abentley, ack.  I'm glad that we have the mechanism, and my concerns/thoughts maybe can go under the category of "future work".
[20:37] <lifeless> gmb: still her e?
[20:37] <abentley> gary_poster: Anything I come up with will be opt-in, at least initially.  But If there opportunities to support other use cases better, I don't want to miss them.
[20:38] <gary_poster> abentley, ack.  You might want to talk to wgrant; he has some thoughts about the long poll that might be nicely integrated in the future
[20:38] <abentley> gary_poster: Yes, we've chatted about that.  He was my roommate at the Thunderdome.
[20:39] <gary_poster> abentley, heh, ok
[20:39] <gary_poster> cool
[20:39]  * gary_poster needs to run
[20:39] <gary_poster> have a good weekend abentley, all
[20:39] <abentley> gary_poster: you too.
[20:42] <abentley> lifeless: IIRC, we have a mechanism for a web client to control what page a form submission redirects us to.  Do you know what it is?
[20:43] <lifeless> I'm not aware of that except in the special case of the login / logout handshakes
[20:43] <abentley> lifeless: cool, thanks.
[20:44] <lifeless> I believe those cases are special-cased by the page being submitted to
[20:48] <abentley> lifeless: XHR automatically follows redirects, so submitting a form via AJAX redirects to a useless page, which is a pointless roundtrip.  I'd like to either avoid the redirect or redirect to a useful page.
[20:50] <lifeless> abentley: is this the new ++ thing, or existing form submissions ?
[20:51] <abentley> lifeless: existing form submissions, but the "useful page" would be the ++model++.
[20:51] <lifeless> can you tell that its an ajax xhr request on the server?
[20:52] <lifeless> abentley: also, if you're tuning this, wouldn't it be better not to redirect at all ?
[20:52] <lifeless> the redirect exists for web clients to end up with nice urls is all.
[20:52] <lifeless> (ah, as you say above 'avoid the redirect') +1
[20:52] <abentley> lifeless: Yes, it would be better to not redirect at all, but that would have to be decided server-side.
[20:53] <abentley> lifeless: Even better would be to return the data we actually want.
[20:54] <abentley> lifeless: I don't know whether there's a generic way to detect an XHR client, but I'm sure we could set a header or something.
[20:59] <lifeless> I think having a 'this is xhr' flag and then calculating and returning -only- the needed data would be ideal.
[21:00] <lifeless> it would avoid the redirect, and avoid the concerns around ++model++ doing too much work on big pages (e.g. BugTask:+index w/bug 1)
[21:00] <_mup_> Bug #1: Microsoft has a majority market share <iso-testing> <ubuntu> <Clubdistro:Confirmed> <Computer Science Ubuntu:Confirmed for compscibuntu-bugs> <dylan.NET.Reflection:Invalid> <dylan.NET:Invalid> <EasyPeasy Overview:Invalid by ramvi> <elementary OS:In Progress by elementaryproject> <GenOS:In Progress by gen-os> <GNOME Screensaver:Won't Fix> <Ichthux:Invalid by raphink> <JAK LINUX:Invalid> <LibreOffice:In Progress by bjoern-michaelsen> <Th
[21:02] <lifeless> http://activitystrea.ms/
[21:04] <abentley> lifeless: "returning -only- the needed data", where that's a subset of the ++model++ would be quite a trick.
[21:05] <lifeless> abentley: are we blocked on deploys until we fix all these views ?
[21:07] <abentley> lifeless: The only known-broken view is fixed in r13560.
[21:08] <lifeless> abentley: I'm a little worried that there are others we don't know about, and we'll find out the hard way.
[21:08] <lifeless> abentley: is it possible to make the code gracefully handle the absence of the method (and perhaps log / write a soft oops) when that happens ?
[21:08] <abentley> lifeless: In the words of Robert Collins, "Untested code is broken code".
[21:09] <abentley> lifeless: Writing a soft oops would be fine with me.
[21:10] <lifeless> I agree that untested code is broken code. We know now that we have (at least) one untested view.
[21:11] <lifeless> If we deploy as-is and find more untested views exist, we'll have to halt all deployments, rollback the deploy - moderately expensive shenanigans
[21:12] <abentley> lifeless: That's not the only way to handle a regression.  You can also just fix it.
[21:13] <abentley> lifeless: these fixes are trivial, e.g. a line of zcml or adding a parent class.
[21:14] <abentley> lifeless: this morning I searched the oopses for any more affected views and didn't find any.  I can search again.
[21:15] <lifeless> reverting the deployment takes minutes; the fixing pipeline takes (minimal) 6 hours
[21:16] <lifeless> doing a cowboy on the spot requires an incidentreport and analysis - its something we want to avoid as much as possible (perhaps too much, but thats a separate discussion)
[21:17] <lifeless> Lynne and I are popping out, so I have to go
[21:17] <lifeless> sorry
[21:19] <abentley> lifeless: I just re-synced qastaging oopses and didn't find any more broken views.


[08:01] <RAOF> Oh, damnit.
[08:01] <RAOF> Who thought calling alarm->cancel() from an alarm's callback was a sensible thing to do?!
[12:50] <guest42345> !seen mir 0.15
[12:50] <guest42345> sudo apt-get remove ubot5


[02:53] <dennis__> hi there, I am developing a small ubuntu app that is using the d-bus. The question is how should I name the  dbus objects. I saw names like 'org.freedesktop.thermald'. But does it need to be a real internet domain name?
[03:05] <sarnold> dennis__: I understand that something like com.ubuntu.user.sarnold  is going to be available for those who do not wish to own a domain name. it'd be best to find a reference before using that specifically :) but I believe something similar ought to work
[03:14] <dennis__> sarnold: Thanks for the example. I'll use that with my own name. I guess checking the references with d-feet should be sufficient.
[03:17] <sarnold> dennis__: here we go! :)  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-qtcreator-plugins/+bug/1197037
[03:17] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1197037 in click (Ubuntu) "applications should be installed in /opt, not /usr" [Undecided,Fix released]
[03:29] <dennis__> Thanks, I'll check that out.
[07:45] <dholbach> good morning
[08:52] <dpm> morning mardy, I'm not sure if you saw the question yesterday: <dpm> hi mardy! I know we talked about this a few weeks ago, but I've been away for a couple of weeks too and I couldn't recall the status: are we at a stage that we can ship authentication plugins in click packages already? I'm thinking of the Evernote plugin, as right now we'd need to seed it to include in the images.
[08:53] <mardy> dpm: hi! No, they are not ready yet. I'm working on that, but it's actually not even sure that we'll get them by 14.04 (though I'll try my best)
[08:54] <dpm> mardy, ok, thanks for the update. Is there any blueprint I can subscribe to to track the status?
[08:55] <mardy> dpm: let me check...
[08:58] <mzanetti> dpm: o/
[08:58] <mzanetti> dpm: hey, I'll just start merging branches if someone approved, ok?
[09:04] <mardy> dpm: still drafting: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/client-1311-online-accounts
[09:04] <dpm> mzanetti, morning! works for me, let me see if I can quickly test the SSL branch in about 15 mins
[09:04] <mzanetti> dpm: ok, cool. here's the link: https://code.launchpad.net/~mzanetti/reminders-app/use-ssl/+merge/196986
[09:08] <dpm> thanks
[09:24] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday the 13th, and happy Violin Day!  :-D
[09:45] <mzanetti> dpm: btw. I found this doc yesterday: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkBOG7Foul0ZdDVtd2doeDNCSDM5ZFBaRmFmTVdkbFE&usp=drive_web#gid=0
[09:46] <mzanetti> dpm: I cross checked it with the current state and I think the c++ plugin supports everything that's marked mandatory except uploading pictures taken with the camera
[09:46] <mzanetti> so that's the next on my todo and then I can move over to some UI tuning
[09:48] <dpm> mzanetti, yeah, I created the doc a while ago to track the requirements, sorry to have not explicitly pointed you to it. That sounds good. I haven't looked into detail what uploading pictures involves, but I seem to recall it's a matter of uploading a note with an attachment
[09:48] <mzanetti> yeah. I think so
[09:48] <mzanetti> dpm: I realized that there are quite some API calls where we don't have any permissions
[09:49] <mzanetti> dpm: for example we cannot delete a notebook
[09:49] <mzanetti> do you know what's the plan there? I this going to be some sort of "official" app and we might get those permissions at some point or will we always stay a 3rd party app without those permissions?
[09:50] <dpm> mzanetti, I'll have to find out. Strange, as the API key should grant full permissions. Do you think you could create a quick list of the operations that require extra permissions and then we can ask the Evernote guys directly?
[09:51] <mzanetti> dpm: check out this: http://dev.evernote.com/doc/reference/NoteStore.html#Fn_NoteStore_expungeNotebook
[09:52] <mzanetti> dpm: there is a Note in the description
[09:52] <mzanetti> dpm: and there are more of those (I would need to walk through all of them to find out which ones exactly). But I'm pretty sure its a all or nothing thing.
[09:52] <mzanetti> as in: either we get access to all of those or none
[09:53] <mzanetti> and they know for sure which ones that are
[09:53] <dpm> oh, I see, so these permissions are by design
[12:27] <dpm> Mirv, bzoltan, it seems that doing an upgrade the ubuntu-sdk and cordova packages are removed. Something to do with changes on the PPA? -> https://plus.google.com/+NekheleshRamananthan/posts/Uj93GQ9D3uV
[12:28] <bzoltan> dpm: I do not know about any change what would cause that
[12:29] <Mirv> dpm: I haven't touched the PPA for a while, all my Qt work is in other preparation PPA:s
[12:29] <bzoltan> Ohh
[12:29] <bzoltan> dpm, Mirv: the QtC plugin is new inthe PPA 2.8.1bzr57raring0
[12:30] <bzoltan> dpm, Mirv: alex-abreu and Robert Bruce Park has top approved 2 MRs and they triggered the PPA release
[12:31] <dpm> bzoltan, ah, well spotted. So how can we fix this on the PPA and who can do it?
[12:32] <alex-abreu> bzoltan, oops ... ok for the cordova bit, but not sure why it triggers a removal of the ubuntu-sdk
[12:33] <bzoltan> alex-abreu: maybe because those cordova packages are listed as dependency of the ubuntu-sdk metapackage
[12:33] <bzoltan> Mirv ^
[12:33] <alex-abreu> ah
[12:33] <Mirv> sounds like that, yes
[12:35] <alex-abreu> bzoltan, ok what about I push a "fix" for which I keep the cordova plugin ...
[12:36] <alex-abreu> it doesn't hurt to still have it around
[12:36] <alex-abreu> as long as we don't have the wizard
[12:37] <alex-abreu> and we can deprecate it properly
[12:37] <bzoltan> alex-abreu:  or simple update the ubuntu-sdk
[12:37] <bzoltan> Mirv: you or me?
[12:37] <alex-abreu> yeah
[12:37] <alex-abreu> not sure how simple it would be
[12:39] <Mirv> bzoltan: my brain is too filled with Qt 5.2 at the moment, and I don't know the background that caused this change etc. freel free.
[12:39] <bzoltan> Mirv: got it
[12:40] <Mirv> thanks
[12:41] <dpm> thanks bzoltan for taking care of that
[12:42] <bzoltan> alex-abreu:  if you check the dependencies of the ubuntu-sdk package you will see that it pulls the qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu-cordova package
[12:44] <alex-abreu> yup
[12:44] <alex-abreu> it does indeed
[12:45] <alex-abreu> bzoltan, it shouldn't have been top approved, & I should have check w/ u & Mirv for possible issues, ... next time ...
[12:47] <bzoltan> alex-abreu: Your name is on the MR as top approver
[12:48] <bzoltan> Status: Merged   Approved by:	Robert Bruce Park 9 hours ago
[12:48] <bzoltan> Status: Approved   Approved by:	Alexandre Abreu 4 minutes ago
[12:49] <bzoltan> alex-abreu: wait a sec... it is robru who top approved the other one
[12:49] <bzoltan> https://code.launchpad.net/~abreu-alexandre/qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu/single-html5-template/+merge/198390
[12:49] <alex-abreu> yeah I top approved the template changes
[12:49] <alex-abreu> anyway
[12:50] <bzoltan>  alex-abreu: but yours was rejected by Jenkins
[12:51] <alex-abreu> yup
[12:51] <alex-abreu> I pushed an update
[12:51] <alex-abreu> for that
[12:51] <alex-abreu> merging conflicts
[13:08] <lukas_> Hello!
[13:09] <lukas_> I'd like to know why should I use PyGI instead of PyGTK. Thanks
[14:14] <mzanetti> dpm: http://kmix5.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/eclipse-kepler-kmix-productivity-boost/
[14:14] <mzanetti> dpm: check out the first bullet in "The C++ nuisance and rant"
[14:14] <mzanetti> :D
[14:29] <dpm> mzanetti, lol, indeed!
[14:54] <dholbach> dpm, do we have an example of a compiled app which doesn't use qmake?
[14:55] <dpm> dholbach, perhaps the camera app, which I think uses cmake
[14:55] <dholbach> aha!
[15:22] <Mihir> Hi dpm  :)
[15:22] <dpm> hi Mihir, how are you?
[15:23] <Mihir> dpm: Doing good...busy now a days..how are you doing??
[15:23] <dpm> doing well too, busy too :)
[15:25] <Mihir> have kicked off calculator second phase or I guess not yet right ??
[16:16] <mzanetti> jkeyes0: hey man, do you think you could review this one? lp:~mzanetti/reminders-app/rework-error-handling
[16:23] <balloons> nik90, ping
[16:26] <rickspencer3> hi msvb-lab :)
[16:28] <msvb-lab> Hithere, good resource this channel...
[16:28] <msvb-lab> ...I just hope it sees some action. Thanks again for the call, and have a great weekend.
[16:28] <rickspencer3> thank you msvb-lab
[16:28]  * balloons waves to rickspencer3 and msvb-lab
[16:29] <rickspencer3> o/ balloons
[16:29] <msvb-lab> Waves back.
[16:30] <msvb-lab> Balloons: How much do you know about the 'format switch variable' or whatever it is to set the initial format of an app to fullscreen or thin-phone?
[16:30] <msvb-lab> The terminal app for tablets launches wrong, goes to phone mode. So that's what I'm trying to change.
[16:30] <msvb-lab> ...unless you like tilting your head and typing sideways with one hand. Super suckey.
[16:31] <balloons> msvb-lab, ahh.. File manager is a good example of how it works. It converges quite well
[16:31] <balloons> it uses a "wide display" switch and turns it on based on the screen units present on the device
[16:31] <msvb-lab> The file manager of Maguro (tablet) on trusty-proposed starts in phone mode as well (like the terminal.)
[16:32] <balloons> maguro tablet?
[16:33] <rickspencer3> msvb-lab, I believe maguro is the code name for the galaxy nexus phone, though I could be wrong
[16:33] <rickspencer3> maybe you mean Manta? (Nexus 10)
[16:33] <balloons> last I checked on the manta, file manager was tablet  mode ;-)
[16:42] <nik90> balloons: pong
[16:43] <balloons> nik90, I saw your comment on the mp :-) It was so funny I sent the comment, and boom, update in trunk from nik90
[16:43] <balloons> jenkins is coming back online atm, I'll review as well and we'll land this ;-)
[16:43] <nik90> balloons: awesome
[16:44] <nik90> balloons: one thing though
[16:44] <balloons> nik90, I'm sending a mail on all those open ap tests that are awaiting features.. The only other bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-clock-app/+bug/1188808
[16:44] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1188808 in Ubuntu Clock App "Autopilot Testcase needed: Check current time" [Medium,Confirmed]
[16:45] <nik90> balloons: the bug you mentioned, is dependent on what time format is shown to the user in the clock app. This has not been confirmed yet by design.
[16:46] <balloons> care to just update the bug with a status update I guess?
[16:46] <nik90> btw regarding my stopwatch MP, it adds a test -> Test searching a world city online and adding it (clock)
[16:46] <nik90> sure
[16:46] <nik90> I thought in the UDS, it was explained during the QA session that an autopilot test should not send online API calls?
[16:47] <nik90> this test does it thought (in my defence I wrote it before the UDS :D )
[16:48] <nik90> balloons: the bug report already has a comment explaining the blocker -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-clock-app/+bug/1188808/comments/4
[16:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1188808 in Ubuntu Clock App "Autopilot Testcase needed: Check current time" [Medium,Confirmed]
[16:50] <balloons> nik90, I guess I don't want the bug to stagnate forever. So if we need design's input, let's get it on there todo list so to speak :-)
[16:51] <nik90> balloons: but we dont get designer's input anymore to the core apps for this cycle
[16:51] <balloons> heh, well, we need to solve it somehow ;-)
[16:51] <balloons> I don't like stagnating bugs
[16:51] <nik90> nik90: either we have an option in the settings app which defines if time will be shown in 24 hour format
[16:52] <balloons> I'm sure you don't either
[16:52] <nik90> yup
[16:52] <nik90> I will send a mail to ubuntu-touch list asking if such an option can be integrated into the settings app
[16:52] <nik90> since the rule has to come from somewhere
[16:54] <balloons> thanks nik90
[16:55] <balloons> We'll at least be able to update some status on it
[17:04] <iBelieve> davmor2: ping
[17:04] <davmor2> iBelieve: hello
[17:05] <iBelieve> davmor2: Hi. My app, Tasks, that you reviewed yesterday, isn't working for somebody, and I think that is caused by the packaging. Is there any way for me to get the actual package without having to buy the app myself?
[17:06] <davmor2> iBelieve: you can change the price to zero install it and raise the price again other than that not really.
[17:07] <davmor2> iBelieve: do you know what issue they are having?
[17:08] <iBelieve> davmor2: This is what the user reported seeing: http://i.imgur.com/KMuoDet.jpg
[17:09] <iBelieve> davmor2: It has to be a problem with the packaging, since running the app from the source tar that I uploaded works fine.
[17:10] <davmor2> iBelieve: it is working fine here, http://ubuntuone.com/2ODSsYFcIEgAiZawCytHVk
[17:12] <iBelieve> davmor2: Not quite. The icons on the toolbar buttons at the bottom are missing.
[17:13] <iBelieve> davmor2: I think I'll just end up purchasing it myself to look at how it is installed.
[17:13] <iBelieve> davmor2: Once I figure out what the problem is, what is the best and fastest way to get an update into the app store or have the packaging be changed?
[17:16] <davmor2> iBelieve: through myapps just click on your app, click on edit by the package details and upload a new package.  If it is something specific with the packaging then message us on the feedback tab and we can deal with it from there.
[17:43] <balloons> nik90, re: online accounts. Yes, we don't want tests to depend on external servers. So we should mock it instead
[17:55] <davmor2> balloons: you're an evil non existent analogue account that no-one ever uses why can't you be more like this nice accout that is digital and always there.........is that enough mocking?
[17:56] <balloons> davmor2, :-)
[18:25] <iBelieve> davmor2: I uploaded a new version and also left comments regarding problems in the packaging. Do you know when I can expect it to be reviewed and the packaging fixed?
[18:57] <davmor2> iBelieve: depends how long it takes to package
[18:58] <iBelieve> davmor2: thanks for the answer. The packaging was just missing the icons directory I had in my tar ball, and then I uploaded a couple of changes to work with 13.10 better.
[18:58] <davmor2> cool
[19:31] <lukas> Hello!
[19:31] <lukas> Im making an indicator for ubuntu 13.10
[19:31] <lukas> Id like to find documentation on how to implement counter
[19:31] <lukas> like the one uses emapthy in messasing menu
[19:32] <lukas> thanks in advance!
[19:33] <daker> lukas: see https://launchpad.net/hello-unity
[19:34] <lukas> thanks
[19:34] <daker> lukas: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wiyL2jqfWc&feature=youtu.be
[19:36] <lukas> exactly what ive been looking for. THAAAANKS!!!! <333
[19:39] <daker> :)
[19:44] <lukas> I've encountered a problem: in  hello_unity/window.py  error: from gi.repository import GtkSource, ImportError: cannot import name GtkSource
[19:47] <lukas> apparently cannot use app from source (tar.gz file)
[19:48] <lukas> but deb launched fine
[19:56] <daker> i think you were missing some deps and the deb did install the missing package


[09:10] <farhaan> hey there
[09:10] <farhaan> anyone here?
[09:11] <diogenes_Vx15> farhaan, welcome.
[09:17] <farhaan> diogenes thanks
[09:17] <farhaan> any thing helpfu
[09:17] <farhaan> im new to this platform
[09:21] <diogenes_Vx15> farhaan, helpful only if you need help :)
[09:28] <farhaan> ok thank you


[00:53] <seh> hello
[00:53] <seh> how i can change the login screen wallpaper in kubuntu 16
[00:54] <lethu> seh: hi
[00:54] <lethu> seh: kde-look.org
 Yes, there's a setting in system settings for that
[00:55] <seh> lethu: thanks! but i look for the methode to change it
[00:55] <lethu> seh: you should find the instructions there along with the themes
[00:59] <seh> okay i ll try
[03:01] <YankDownUnder> Anyone familiar with constant "plasmashell" crashes? Or how to fix them? It's getting relatively annoying...
[03:37] <Guest33824> i don't have any virtual terminals
[05:19] <valorie> Guest33824: what version are you running
[05:19] <valorie> ?
[05:20] <valorie> I had trouble getting all of them working for awhile, but I think that was in the 16.04 beta
[05:20] <valorie> long fixed....
[06:16] <lordievader> Good morning.
[08:34] <JohnDroid> Hello
[08:34] <JohnDroid> where could I find a beatiful KDE mug?
[08:35] <hateball> Mug, as in to drink from?
[08:36] <hateball> I am not sure there exists any official Kubuntu or KDE merchandise
[10:20] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[10:22] <Smurphy> Morning :)
[10:23] <BluesKaj> what's happeneing today?
[10:24] <Smurphy> Only thing that I can say for sure, is that I'm not really motivated for work ...
[10:24] <Smurphy> :}
[10:24] <Smurphy> A part from that - rain.
[10:24] <Smurphy> :D
[10:27] <BluesKaj> I know the feeling, and we need rain
[10:41] <Smurphy> it rained for 6 weeks non-stop here. WE could send it over....
[10:43] <BluesKaj> wow ok the floods in France
[11:01] <eeos> hi everybody .... I have problems in making a samsung syncmaster p2450 work as external monitor with my laptop on kubuntu 16.04 lts
[11:01] <eeos> it does work during bootstrap up to after I log into plasma then it stops working.
[11:05] <hateball> eeos: can you delete your configs in ~/.local/share/kscreen and reboot, have kscreen re-detect the monitor?
[11:06] <hateball> Multimonitor support is... not awesome in 16.04. You can upgrade to Plasma 5.6 using kubuntu backports, it makes things less terrible
[11:06] <yossarianuk> hateball: mutli monitor hotplugging seems fixed (ish) in 16.04 + PPA
[11:23] <eeos> yossarianuk: hateball: thank you .... how do I do that?
[11:24] <hateball> eeos: Do what?
[11:26] <eeos> hateball: updte only plasma and not everything else
[11:26] <hateball> eeos: well that'll be hard once you add the PPA. but for now the applications are not updated
[11:26] <hateball> you can hold packages back of course
[11:27] <hateball> eeos: https://community.kde.org/Kubuntu/PPAs#Kubuntu_Backports
[12:24] <eeos> hateball: thank you. Have you used thm already?
[12:25] <hateball> eeos: thm?
[15:19] <viewer|30705> how can I install kubuntu alongside win10 with saving of the win10 metro bootloader? please provide step by step guide
[19:48] <allesz_> hi guys. Is there a GUI tool for creating luks file images?
[19:49] <allesz_> I would love to create luks encrypted image files with a nice preferably QT gui app.
[19:49] <allesz_> is there an dolphin add-on?
[19:59] <Dragnslcr> allesz_- it doesn't look like it, but if I remember correctly, writing Dolphin services/add-ons is fairly easy
[20:09] <allesz_> Dragnslcr: thanks. I am really surprised that something "essential" does not exist. Also not in gnome camp as far as I know.
[20:09] <allesz_> Dragnslcr: I would love to help developing an add-on like this.
[20:35] <valorie> allesz_: please join #dolphin or the devel list and propose such an add-on
[20:35] <valorie> sounds useful
[20:55] <allesz_> valorie: thank you. yes will do. I would be really great to have this to finally say good bye to truecrypt ;-)
[21:05] <Fritigern> I am trying to figure out why ffmpegthumbnailer does not seem to make thumbs of my videos. I have it enabled in Settings => Configure Dolphin => General => Previews bit nothing is happening. I can call ffmpegtumbnailes from the command line, and it works there. What am I missing?
[21:09] <allesz_> valorie: done: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=364831
[21:17] <valorie> thank you allesz_
[21:17] <valorie> I hope you will hang out with the dolphin devels and make it even more awesome
[21:18] <valorie> Fritigern: I see the same question quite a few places
[21:18] <Fritigern> So am i doing something wrong, or is rthere something else going on?
[21:18] <valorie> perhaps check bugs.kde.org and see if it's been filed?
[21:19]  * bprompt didn't know hanging out with the dolphin developers make bugs more awesome
[21:19] <valorie> bprompt: lol
[21:19] <valorie> dolphin is awesome!
[21:19] <valorie> bugs not so much
[21:19] <valorie> Fritigern: sometimes there is great info in a bug report
[21:20] <bprompt> ohhh ok, misread, thought you wanted a more awesome bug, like with an avatar of a crawling ladybug, ok
[21:21] <allesz_> bprompt: lol
[21:21] <allesz_> neon colored super bug
[21:22] <valorie> I do like ladybugs
[21:22] <allesz_> valorie: could not join #dolphin it says  [Error] Cannot join #dolphin: The channel is password-protected and either a wrong or no password was given.
[21:22] <valorie> but in real life, not in my software
[21:22] <Fritigern> bugs.kde.org show exactle zero entries for ffmpegthumbnails
[21:22] <valorie> hmmm
[21:23] <valorie> alis says that they don't have a channel
[21:23] <valorie> I guess they hang out in #kde-devel then
[21:25] <bprompt> http://irc.netsplit.de/channels/?net=freenode&chat=dolphin  <----
[21:27] <allesz_> valorie: yup they do ;-)  thanks a lot.
[21:38] <Fritigern> So... nobody can be of any use with my ffmpegthubnailer problem?
[21:39] <bprompt> Fritigern:    I don't use it, for one
[21:39] <bprompt> Fritigern:   check the manpages :)
[21:42] <bprompt> Fritigern:    you can always view the manpages in chrome or konqueror, by typing in dolphin -> man:/WHATEVER
[21:44] <bprompt> if you use konqueror, it has a few KIOs, you can type help:/SOMEAPP to read its docs, or use the man:/SOMECOMMAND to read the manpages
[21:44] <Fritigern> As prevoiously stated, it works in a terminal, but they are not generated in dolphin
[21:44] <Fritigern> I am trying to figure out why ffmpegthumbnailer does not seem to make thumbs of my videos. I have it enabled in Settings => Configure Dolphin => General => Previews bit nothing is happening. I can call ffmpegtumbnailes from the command line, and it works there. What am I missing?
[21:45] <bprompt> Fritigern:     well, is dolphin View using preview ON?
[21:46] <bprompt> Fritigern:   the previews only work if you set the View > Preview, feature ON
[21:47] <bprompt> Detail view by default has it off, but you can set it ON, anyhow, when changing Views, their default is to have it off
[21:50] <Fritigern> It is on. I t is always on. When else would one expect there to be a preview?
[21:50] <bprompt> well.. hmmm dunno... tried other file managers? besides dolphin?
[21:51] <Fritigern> I have even gone as far as attempting to compile ffmpeg and ffmpegthumbnailers, with zero success
[21:52] <bprompt> IIRC thumbnails are stored at ~/.thumbnails folder, maybe giving it a good reset, may help, well, you don't have to reset it, just say..... rename it, do a few thumbnails to see if dolphin picks up anything
[21:52] <Fritigern> I have googled, I have consulted man pages (when available) and nothing that i tried helped
[21:53] <bprompt> hmmm I don't use it myself, as far as video thumbnails, most video players browsers, have them
[22:04] <valorie> Fritigern: did you search for bugs filed about this?
[22:05] <valorie> as I said, it's been asked here, in #kde-neon and #kde a few times, but not enough information is ever given pin it down
[22:05] <bprompt> or, have you searched for bugs in general?   specially mosquitoes and cockroaches
[22:06] <valorie> ....
[22:06] <bprompt> heheh, I don't use the app, so... for all we know, is just an app bug, not a dolphin one per se
[22:09] <valorie> could be, yes -- but bko will tell the tale
[22:13] <Fritigern> valorie: I searched for bugs first about ffmpegthumbnailer, but no bugs found. Then under Dolphin since I expect the thumbs to show inthere, but nothing. Not even under kio did i find the bug. And as for info, all I can tell you is what I have already said. The Dolphin plugin does not generate video thumbs, but running from a terminal it will generate a thumb.
[22:17] <bprompt> Fritigern:    what do you mean by "runnning from a terminal"?    as in doing -> $: dolphin <-- ?    as opposed to running it from the menu?
[22:19] <Fritigern> Running from a terminal as in ffmpegthumbnails -i"Video" -o"Thumbnail"
[22:20] <bprompt> well.. hmmm sounds  hmmm dunno... that's not exactly dolphin
[22:21] <Fritigern> No, it isn't. But I never claimed that ruinning from command line is dolphin, did i?
[22:21] <Fritigern> But Dolphin is SUPPOSED to be able to use an addon/plugin (which is installed!) and generate the thumbs itself
[22:23] <Fritigern> .. which I expect to show when i have previesws ON
[22:24] <valorie> right, that is def. a bug against the plugin, at least
[22:25] <valorie> and if nobody has filed it yet, please file it
[22:26] <bprompt> well, the idea behind the development of the plugin, is to have it work with file managers, including dolphin, now, if it doesn't work, then.. that simply means the plugin isn't ready for release
[22:28] <Fritigern> I just looked at kffmpegthumbnailer some more, altough it seems to have been built against KF5, installs certain files in /usr/lib/kde4 and /usr/share/kde4, and I don;t think that is right
[22:29] <valorie> wow
[22:30] <valorie> that def. seems off -- unless it is/was intended to make it work with Dolphin before it was ported
[22:30] <Fritigern> I wonder if i can fix this with a symlink
[22:31] <valorie> http://developer.kde.org/~cfeck/portingstatus.html says that both Dolphin and -plugins still use kde4-support or whatever
[22:31] <valorie> so the porting is not 100% complete
[22:32] <valorie> help porting is always welcome
[22:33] <Fritigern> They may say that, but the kde4 part no longer works. I had to make a symlink to some kde4 folder to get some system menus working again, especially KIM (and image converter script thing)
[22:34] <Fritigern> Or did I move the stuff? I don;t even remember, it's been months, perhaps over a year
[22:39] <valorie> please please please file a bug and give this information
[22:40] <valorie> all of KDE software is made better by users who help out by filing good bugs
[22:40] <valorie> and maybe contribute patches