[16:00] <gaughen> I'm here!
[16:00] <cpaelzer> p/
[16:00] <cpaelzer> o
[16:01] <nacc> o/
[16:01] <gaughen> cpaelzer, hold on a sec.. I need to get myself sorted
[16:01] <nacc> gaughen: you did it!
[16:01] <gaughen> time got away from me
[16:01] <gaughen> I made it!!!
[16:01] <gaughen> I haven't started the meeting yet
[16:01] <nacc> ok, you're halfway to doing it!
[16:01] <cpaelzer> time is space and that expands, it gets away from us all
[16:01] <gaughen> cpaelzer, nacc imagine that the best hold music you've ever heard is currently playing
[16:02] <cpaelzer> it actually is
[16:02] <powersj> o/
[16:02] <gaughen> okay I'm ready
[16:02] <jgrimm> o/
[16:02] <gaughen> #startmeeting ubuntu-server-team
[16:02] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Sep 13 16:02:42 2016 UTC.  The chair is gaughen. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:02] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[16:02] <gaughen> #topic Review ACTION points from previous meeting
[16:03] <gaughen> no action points to review... wee!
[16:03] <gaughen> #topic Yakkety Development
[16:03] <gaughen> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/YakketyYak/ReleaseSchedule
[16:03] <gaughen> GA is a month from today - gaaaaa!
[16:04] <caribou> o/
[16:04] <gaughen> Final beta is coming up - week of Sept 22
[16:04] <smoser> o//
[16:04] <gaughen> and I see kernel freeze is week of Sept 29
[16:04] <gaughen> so get on it, people!
[16:04] <gaughen> moving on
[16:05] <gaughen> #subtopic Release Bugs
[16:05] <gaughen> #subtopic Release Bugs
[16:05] <gaughen> grr
[16:05] <gaughen> #subtopic Release Bugs
[16:05] <gaughen> okay, guess it's right
[16:05]  * gaughen drinks some coffee
[16:05] <cpaelzer> so many bugs :-/
[16:06] <gaughen> any worth talking about?
[16:06] <gaughen> #topic Server & Cloud Bugs (caribou)
[16:06] <caribou> nothing to report !
[16:06] <gaughen> caribou, you have any words of wisdom for everyoone?
[16:06] <gaughen> everyone
[16:06] <nacc> jgrimm: did we get a new url for release bugs?
[16:06] <gaughen> too late, nacc, I've moved on
[16:06] <gaughen> no link allowed
[16:06] <caribou> gaughen: no :)
[16:06] <gaughen> this is caribou's time
[16:06] <gaughen> ;-)
[16:07] <gaughen> okay, let me move on
[16:07] <gaughen> #topic Weekly Updates & Questions for the QA Team (powersj)
[16:07] <gaughen> #link https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/
[16:07] <jgrimm> nacc, i owe that.  happy to take an action
[16:07] <powersj> Completed the addition of an s390x system and a dedicated amd64 system to the server team jenkins (https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/). Other than getting the NVMe storage running faster on the baremetal system, this should complete all the outstanding infrastructure/Jenkins related tasks. On to writing more tests!
[16:07] <gaughen> and in this section, we quiz powerj
[16:07] <powersj> Speaking of tests, have a daily ISO sizer job started to determine how much the daily ISOs have increased or decreased each day.
[16:07] <powersj> As we approach the end of Yakkety, the automated ISO tests are getting better and better. Nuclearbob and I have evaluated many of the failures and continue to clean things up.
[16:07] <nacc> jgrimm: thanks
[16:07] <powersj> And a thank you to gaughen for getting me access to AWS, Azure, and GCP for cloud-init/curtin/bug work.
[16:07] <gaughen> that's awesome powersj
[16:08] <gaughen> no problem-o powersj - use it well and make cloud-init fabulous!
[16:08] <gaughen> powersj, do you have anything else to say?
[16:08] <powersj> not on this topic :) thanks
[16:08] <gaughen> anyone questions for the powersj?
[16:08] <gaughen> k
[16:09] <gaughen> #topic Weekly Updates & Questions for the Kernel Team (smb, sforshee, arges)
[16:09] <gaughen> kernel homies, it is your turn
[16:09] <smb> nothing new *sight* ...still
[16:09] <smb> *sigh*even
[16:09] <gaughen> smb, did you all move to 4.6?
[16:10] <smb> not publicly yet... there is previews but the archive is still back on 4.4
[16:10] <gaughen> so coming soon - 4.6!
[16:10] <gaughen> okay moving on
[16:10] <gaughen> #topic Upcoming Call For Papers
[16:10] <gaughen> any call for papers worth noting?
[16:10] <gaughen> bueller
[16:11] <gaughen> #topic Ubuntu Server Team Events
[16:11] <nacc> gaughen: do you want to note the prior action for jgrimm ? (adding a url for server release bugs)
[16:11] <gaughen> jgrimm, nacc, cpaelzer, smoser, powersj - you all have any cocktail hours planned or anything?
[16:11] <gaughen> nacc, yup, plotting to
[16:11] <gaughen> thanks!
[16:11] <nacc> gaughen: thanks!
[16:11] <cpaelzer> yep, planned
[16:11] <nacc> gaughen: i mean, 5pm every day?
[16:11] <jgrimm> gaughen: would be beer for us, you know that!
[16:12] <gaughen> pssh
[16:12] <jgrimm> snooty beers even
[16:12] <cpaelzer> <- wine as well
[16:12] <gaughen> grapefruit radler!
[16:12] <nacc> :)
[16:12]  * jgrimm shakes head
[16:12] <gaughen> okay, moving on
[16:12] <gaughen> #topic Open Discussion
[16:12] <cpaelzer> here, typing ...
[16:12] <jgrimm> cpaelzer, want to give a headsup on dpdk/ovs testing
[16:12] <gaughen> jgrimm, I've been doing an exhaustive analysis of radlers
[16:13] <cpaelzer> actually qemu I think, but yes
[16:13] <cpaelzer> The feedback to the machine type handling was not a lot
[16:13] <cpaelzer> a few private replies
[16:13] <jgrimm> cpaelzer, well.. both relevant, though indeed qemu is more interesting
[16:13] <cpaelzer> I integrated all of that and created a wiki page just as hallyn did in the far past (trusty)
[16:13] <cpaelzer> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QemuKVMMigration
[16:13] <cpaelzer> It is still WIP
[16:14] <cpaelzer> but the good message is that I have automated tests for in-release, cross-release and backward migration
[16:14] <cpaelzer> as well as a wrapper to run the qa tests of the security team against any those release
[16:14] <jgrimm> very nice
[16:14] <cpaelzer> that will be my guide to prep the next (most urgendt) uploads for issues
[16:15] <gaughen> cool
[16:15] <gaughen> anything else cpaelzer?
[16:15] <cpaelzer> the dpdk testing still works as is, but I really think this cycle we will have the chance to move both of those from manual to something driven by jenkins
[16:15] <cpaelzer> powersj: already has the right machine
[16:15] <cpaelzer> so that should work out
[16:15] <powersj> yep!
[16:15] <cpaelzer> I guess that's it for now
[16:15] <cpaelzer> just wanted to let you know
[16:16] <gaughen> it's very good progress
[16:16] <gaughen> anyone else have any topics for the open topics?
[16:16] <gaughen> #topic Announce next meeting date, time and chair
[16:16] <gaughen> next week at the same time and place, the famous jamespage is the chair!
[16:17] <cpaelzer> thanks gaughen
[16:17] <gaughen> #topic Assign daily bug triage for week (powersj, rbasak, nacc, cpaelzer)
[16:17] <powersj> On deck for the rest of the week are nacc (wed), cpaelzer (thur), and rbasak (today & fri). Any issues with completing this?
[16:17] <gaughen> oh wait, there are two more little topics
[16:17] <jgrimm> :)
[16:17]  * powersj thinks the announce next meeting topic should be last FYI
[16:17] <gaughen> I'm moving it, powersj
[16:17] <jgrimm> powersj, i was thinking the same
[16:17] <gaughen> ditto
[16:18] <jgrimm> we did it intentionally to let people go... but its confusing
[16:18] <nacc> powersj: no issues
[16:18] <gaughen> okay moving on
[16:18] <gaughen> #topic Assigned merges/bugwork (rbasak)
[16:18] <rbasak> Agreed. Also these topics are pretty short now.
[16:18] <gaughen> rbasak, has been quiet this meeting
[16:18] <powersj> jgrimm, thx
[16:18] <gaughen> oh you are here
[16:18] <rbasak> Since people are pretty much self-managing now.
[16:18] <gaughen> I had already made the executive decision to move it ;-)
[16:18] <rbasak> So...any issues?
[16:18] <gaughen> but glad you all agree
[16:18] <rbasak> I feel that progress is slowing, so it would be great if everyone could remember to look at their bugs please.
[16:18] <jgrimm> rbasak, i've updated the spreadsheet.   1 bug closed (fixed even), 1 waiting on someone else, 1 i need to get back to
[16:19] <cpaelzer> no issues on my side, but also no capacity to catch more bugs
[16:19] <powersj> rbasak, I could look at 1-2 small ones
[16:19] <cpaelzer> depending on what you want we might add  a few of the qemu/kvm bug to the list
[16:19] <rbasak> powersj: OK, I'll find you some after the meeting. Thanks!
[16:19] <cpaelzer> rbasak: would you want me to add those?
[16:19] <rbasak> cpaelzer: sure, go ahead.
[16:19] <nacc> rbasak: i'm going to pull some bugs off our backlog today, as i'm freeing up now
[16:19] <cpaelzer> ok, will do that
[16:19] <jgrimm> rbasak, i'd take 1 too
[16:19] <rbasak> nacc: great, thanks!
[16:20] <jgrimm> nacc, don't forget pollinate
[16:20] <nacc> jgrimm: ack, it's fixed in yakkety, waiting on testing from bug originator
[16:20] <nacc> jgrimm: before we upload to xenial, as we don't want to regress/break via SRU
[16:20] <jgrimm> nacc, cool. powersj will want to test that across clouds
[16:20] <jgrimm> nacc, +1
[16:20] <nacc> jgrimm: ack
[16:20] <nacc> powersj: --^ :)
[16:20] <powersj> yep!
[16:21] <gaughen> nacc, curious what the bug was..


 Sehr gut.  Im Shirt!!!
[07:33] <larsu> wie gehts dir?
[07:34] <pitti> larsu: prima, danke! keine Sonne mehr heute, aber immer noch warm
[07:34] <larsu> schade :(
[07:34] <seb128> larsu, hey :-)
[07:35] <seb128> bah
[07:35] <seb128> it's sunny here as well but they forecast rain starting midday for the afternoon/evening
[07:39] <larsu> don't believe the forecast!
[07:40] <seb128> that's right
[07:40] <seb128> well for now I see blue sky and sun so I'm happy ;-)
[07:54] <willcooke> morning all
[07:54] <Sweet5hark> moin
[07:56] <willcooke> morning Sweet5hark
[07:57] <Sweet5hark> willcooke: heya
[08:01] <seb128> hey willcooke Sweet5hark
[08:03] <Sweet5hark> seb128: how is it going? are you at a/that sprint btw?
[08:04] <seb128> Sweet5hark, I'm doing well thanks, got mostly over the holidays backlog and back on track for 16.04 I think ... and no, no hackfest for me, getting a week to get some work done before holidays and travelling for the planning sprint
[08:04] <seb128> what about you?
[08:07] <Sweet5hark> trying to get my back back it shape -- it was hurting badly recent days, its better now. as for work: xenial looks all well AFAICS -- lets see how stuff will get amazing after that ;)
[08:07] <pitti> hey Sweet5hark
[08:07] <pitti> Sweet5hark: urgh, good luck with your back, that sounds scary
[08:07] <pitti> Sweet5hark: too much exercise or too much sitting?
[08:09] <Sweet5hark> pitti: too much bad sitting apparently and then hurt myself by being too hard on myself when swimming.
[08:09] <Sweet5hark> ... but jogging helps. doing that daily now.
[08:54]  * Laney is free
[08:54] <Laney> free from the dmb
[08:59] <seb128> Laney, congrats? ;-)
[08:59] <seb128> and hey!
[08:59] <seb128> still enjoying London?
[09:04] <larsu> dmb?
[09:06] <davidcalle> @dekstopers, hi, I'm looking for an ubiquity slideshow slide (the Gnome Software one), where is it located?
[09:06] <meetingology> davidcalle: Error: "dekstopers," is not a valid command.
[09:07] <willcooke> hey davidcalle
[09:08] <willcooke> davidcalle, have you got the ubiquity source downloaded already?
[09:08] <davidcalle> willcooke: nope, I was expecting to find it somewhere on my xenial system  :)
[09:09] <seb128> larsu, devmemberboard, the group that grants e.g upload rights
[09:09] <willcooke> davidcalle, https://launchpad.net/ubiquity
[09:09] <willcooke> err
[09:09] <willcooke> wrong
[09:10] <willcooke> davidcalle, correct link:  https://launchpad.net/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu
[09:10] <larsu> seb128: thanks :)
[09:10] <seb128> larsu, yw!
[09:10] <willcooke> davidcalle, then: ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/slideshows/ubuntu/slides
[09:11] <willcooke> usc.html
[09:11] <seb128> davidcalle, willcooke, did we get an agreement on what to use there?
[09:11] <davidcalle> willcooke: perfect, thanks :)
[09:11] <davidcalle> seb128: not sure. But on my end, I just need a nice screenshot ;)
[09:11] <willcooke> seb128, seems to still be pending.  I went with not mentioned g-s at all and instead talking about "access to the store"
[09:12] <willcooke> davidcalle, if those screenshots are too small we can find you a better one
[09:13] <willcooke> davidcalle, e.g. http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/g-s.png
[09:13] <davidcalle> willcooke: this one is perfect, thanks!
[09:13] <willcooke> nw
[09:13] <seb128> willcooke, davidcalle, didn't we get those screenshots updated some weeks ago?
[09:14] <willcooke> seb128, yeah
[09:14] <seb128> ah
[09:14] <seb128> davidcalle is looking for a screenshot, not at changing the current one?
[09:15] <davidcalle> seb128: yeah, I jsut need a screenshot matching roughly how we are presenting Gnome software to users
[09:15] <seb128> k, gotcha
[10:04] <Laney> hey seb128
[10:04] <Laney> yeah!
[10:04] <Laney> raining today though
[10:05]  * Laney might actually look at g-s itself
[10:06] <Laney> noticed the list of nominees to the TB
[10:06] <Laney> lots of good candidates there ;-)
[10:10] <didrocks> where is this list? (hey Laney!)
[10:11] <Laney> didrocks: on the tb list
[10:11] <seb128> on planet ubuntu as well
[10:11] <didrocks> oh right, this was posted
[10:12] <didrocks> ah, the fridge, I probably bypassed it :)
[10:12] <seb128> Laney, good candidates, rrrright
[10:12] <seb128> wonder who nominated those!
[10:15] <Laney> teehee
[10:59] <cyphermox> morning
[10:59] <willcooke> hey cyphermox
[11:12] <seb128> hey cyphermox!
[11:14] <cyphermox> hey :)
[11:26] <seb128> cyphermox, did you see that awe seemed to have found the issue with new nm and vpn?
[11:30] <cyphermox> great
[11:53] <willcooke> urgh. Another odd bug in terminal
[11:53] <willcooke> open a few tabs, cd to somewhere with a longish path
[11:53] <willcooke> then drag that tab out of the window and don't let go of the button
[11:58]  * flocculant did that and is pleased it looks as expected here :p
[12:08] <flexiondotorg> Trevinho, https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/compiz/fix-1559371/+merge/289588
[12:08]  * Trevinho checks
[12:12] <Trevinho> flexiondotorg: I'd really love to have the client fixed though... Also changing the mate.ini later couldn't cause the setting not to be updated by upgraders?
[12:13] <willcooke> seb128, just noticed the padding on the bluetooth window (for example) is gone again.  Didn't we already fix that?  I think it was an u/s bug?
[12:13] <willcooke> maybe it was called a wizard screen?
[12:14] <seb128> willcooke, wfm, where do you see it?
[12:14] <willcooke> a new 16.04 install from the daily iso  yesterday
[12:14] <seb128> if I go to the bluetooth panel and click the "+" button the new dialog has space between the buttons and border
[12:15] <flexiondotorg> Trevinho, I'd like the client fixed too. But small team, little time and no obvious solution. This winrule is the best we have.
[12:16] <Trevinho> flexiondotorg: I understand, you tried to check what happens if that mate.ini option is removed? Is the option unset (for future use case)
[12:16] <seb128> willcooke, it was a gtk bug that got fixed, the patch is still there afaik and wfm
[12:17] <flexiondotorg> Trevinho, Compiz is not enable by default in Ubuntu MATE. It can be optionally enabled via MATE Tweak.
[12:17] <flexiondotorg> New activations will use whatever the mate.ini provides.
[12:17] <willcooke> seb128, ah, buttons look ok actually.  Seems to be the text on the left: http://imgur.com/glJoTXC
[12:18] <flexiondotorg> But MATE Tweak also has a button to reset Compiz to mate.ini defaults, should an updated mate.ini be released.
[12:26] <seb128> willcooke, I can't confirm here but my virtualbox has no bluetooth and my system is in french so not having the same labels lead to a layout things differently
[12:28] <willcooke> I dont think its that big a deal, I'll see if I can fix it
[12:28] <seb128> thanks
[12:28] <seb128> I'm unsure it's a theming issue though
[12:29] <seb128> you had another example of dialog last time iirc
[12:29] <seb128> what was it? something with nm?
[12:29] <willcooke> yeah, I thnk it was vpns or something
[12:29] <willcooke> I'll see if I get time
[12:29] <willcooke> nw
[12:30] <seb128> ah, right
[12:30] <seb128> adding a mobile connection
[12:30] <seb128> k, I can confirm in that dialog
[12:32] <seb128> I've a feeling it's due to https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/gtk/ui/gtkassistant.ui?id=9c39232ab399eb3138fa4924b6072c3d340c215e
[12:32] <darkxst> willcooke, are you guys considering rebranding gnome-software this late in the cycle? atleast that is the impression I got from Michaels email
[12:34] <willcooke> mhall119, can I get a copy of that email?
[12:35] <seb128> darkxst, "rebranding"?
[12:35] <davidcalle> seb128: where does the feature app comes from in gnome software? Gnome server somewhere?
[12:35] <seb128> there are discussions about the wording of the ubiquity slide
[12:36] <seb128> davidcalle, I don't know, but we have people at a hackfest who know and are working on changing that list I think ... why? please don't dup work by looking also at doing similar changes
[12:37] <seb128> davidcalle, in any case please talk to Laney on this channel, he mentioned that on the first day of the hackfest so I guess he's the person to talk to about those changes
[12:37] <davidcalle> seb128: I'm not, no worries, just looking if there was a way to change this featured app locally. Nothing related with the wider GNome Software discussion ;)
[12:38] <darkxst> willcooke, i sent you a copy
[12:38] <seb128> willcooke, we might need something like https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/tree/gtk/theme/Adwaita/_common.scss#n225 ?
[12:38] <seb128> davidcalle, k, Laney can help you with that I think
[12:38] <davidcalle> thanks
[12:39] <seb128> darkxst, there are discussions about the wording of the slide as just said and maybe naming of the .desktop under Unity
[12:39] <willcooke> darkxst, ta
[12:39] <seb128> darkxst, no changing of the look/branding of the software
[12:39] <darkxst> seb128, thats fine, and not I would consider rebranding
[12:43] <mhall119> willcooke: darkxst: which email?
[12:44] <seb128> willcooke, if you play with css maybe look if something around the
[12:44] <seb128> GtkAssistant {
[12:44] <seb128> .sidebar GtkLabel {
[12:44] <seb128> padding: 6px;
[12:44] <seb128> would fix it?
[12:45] <darkxst> mhall119, the snap email, where you suggested gnome-software might be rebranded, but apparently that is not the case actually
[12:47] <mhall119> darkxst: ok, that. It's actually not branded "GNOME Software" right now, it's just "Software", we put that in because we weren't sure how it was going to be called
[12:49] <larsu> the "using packages from other distributions" section on https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA/Uploading could use some clarification: the url should probably say ~<lp_name>/<ppa_name>/ubuntu/<a ubuntu suite>
[12:49] <larsu> at least it confused me :)
[12:50] <davmor2> willcooke: OMG an upgrade and it seems to be working this can't be right :)
[12:51] <willcooke> davmor2, It'll never last.
[12:51] <willcooke> quick pull the plug
[12:51] <darkxst> mhall119, ok, so long as its only Unity specific desktop files, I couldnt care what you call it
[12:53] <darkxst> we have already made our slideshows, and our users are expect GNOME "Software" not some other name ;)
[12:53] <mhall119> darkxst: I think this was more a case of the community team not knowing what name to use for it than anything
[12:54] <seb128> larsu, open a bug against launchpad ;-)
[12:54] <davmor2> willcooke: it's got time to break on the mokutil yet something to blame cyphermox for again cause you know how he likes me to blame him for stuff :)
[12:54] <mhall119> since we've always heard it called "GNOME Software" but the app itself only uses the name "Software"
[12:54] <mhall119> and we know that non-GNOME flavors are also using it
[12:54] <cyphermox> what what ? mokutil broken?
[12:54] <darkxst> mhall119, all the core GNOME apps are like that
[12:54] <larsu> seb128: thanks, will do (didn't know where the correct place would be...)
[12:55] <mhall119> darkxst: yeah, it causes some confusion :)
[12:56] <seb128> darkxst, not really, we don't have "GNOME gedit" or "GNOME nautilus"
[12:56] <darkxst> seb128, ok all the newer GNOME apps are like that
[12:56] <darkxst> photos, maps, music, logs, etc
[12:57] <seb128> right, I don't think we include any of those on Unity default install atm
[12:57] <larsu> seb128: done, #1566839
[12:57] <seb128> larsu, danke
[12:58] <darkxst> and then the oddball epiphany => web
[12:59] <darkxst> but its all just desktop file tinkering
[13:00] <darkxst> and the lack of security support makes the latter rather irrelevant I guess
[13:00] <seb128> yeah
[13:00] <darkxst> otherwise it would be a really nice browser
[13:11] <davmor2> cyphermox: not yet
[13:13] <davmor2> cyphermox: is the kernel code in play now that disables the modules if secureboot isn't enabled
[13:13] <cyphermox> davmor2: not yet
[13:14] <davmor2> cyphermox: right thanks
[13:45] <flexiondotorg> TheMuso, Thanks for the a11y work.
[13:45] <flexiondotorg> Can I just confirm what packages I need to seed?
[13:47] <flexiondotorg> TheMuso, just a11y-profile-manager and a11y-profile-manager-indicator?
[13:52] <willcooke> flexiondotorg, might be better by email, he's UTC+12
[13:52] <flexiondotorg> willcooke, Ah. OK, thanks :-)
[13:54] <andyrock> willcooke: looks like we don't need to modify any unity code to support alt+space
[13:54] <andyrock> we just need to modify the key binding
[13:54] <willcooke> andyrock, sweet!  How about the two modifiers issue?  Are we stuck there?
[13:55] <andyrock> willcooke: ccsm partially support them
[13:55] <willcooke> if so I will see what the alternatives are from design etc
[13:55] <GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin! Regression from yesterday's fontconfig upload. Can you please take a look at bug #1566651.
[13:55] <ubot5`> bug 1566651 in fontconfig (Ubuntu) "Blurry fonts after update to fontconfig 2.11.1-0ubuntu9" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1566651
[13:55] <andyrock> also i experiences some problems showing that menu with alt+super
[13:55] <andyrock> *ed
[13:55] <willcooke> andyrock, partially meaning that it will be really buggy and crap?
[13:55] <willcooke> right
[13:55] <willcooke> oki
[13:56] <willcooke> lemme see if I can get a better choice then...
[13:56] <andyrock> like if you press two times super+alt you can get stuck with that menu
[13:56] <andyrock> :D
[13:56] <willcooke> erk
[13:56] <willcooke> oki
[13:57] <andyrock> willcooke: the branch for lp:hud has already been proposed I'll finish the bamf one today
[13:57] <andyrock> do you have the bug number?
[13:57] <willcooke> andyrock, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1551986
[13:57] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1551986 in unity (Ubuntu Xenial) "HUD hotkey assignment is suboptimal" [Undecided,In progress]
[13:57] <andyrock> thx
[14:27] <davmor2> willcooke, cyphermox: see what did I say no mok-util trigger on upgrade for intel-microcode :'( I blame cyphermox I'll try it on nvidia hardware and see what happens there though now that I know that upgrades are at least working
[14:27] <seb128> tjaalton, Trevinho, andyrock, saw https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/1566878 ?
[14:27] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1566878 in xorg (Ubuntu) "Alt-backtick regression" [Undecided,New]
[14:27] <seb128> tjaalton, the bug states it's due to the recent xserver update
[14:27] <Trevinho> nope...
[14:27] <cyphermox> davmor2: on upgrade for intel-microcode?
[14:27] <cyphermox> you mean upgrading from trusty?
[14:28] <davmor2> cyphermox: install trusty, install intel-microcode, upgrade to 16.04
[14:28] <cyphermox> right, no
[14:29] <cyphermox> intel-microcode doesn't seem to need dkms
[14:29] <andyrock> seb128: backtick?
[14:29] <davmor2> cyphermox: but it is the only driver that gets installed for 3rd party drivers on 16.04 and that triggers it unless it is like mp3 codec or something crazy
[14:30] <seb128> andyrock, the key on left of 1 (top of tab)
[14:30] <seb128> andyrock, the one to switch between wins of the active application
[14:30] <cyphermox> fglrx?
[14:31] <Trevinho> andyrock: alt+\ :)
[14:31] <Trevinho> or alt grave..
[14:31] <Trevinho> for us keys
[14:31] <andyrock> ah yeah
[14:31] <andyrock> sorry
[14:31] <andyrock> :D
[14:31] <Trevinho> Well, tjaalton there might be some changes in xkb code?
[14:32] <Trevinho> as it's the one we use to figure out which key is above tab
[14:37] <tjaalton> seb128, Trevinho: hrm, i'll have a look later
[14:38] <seb128> Trevinho, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/251848437/xorg-server_2%3A1.18.1-1ubuntu4_2%3A1.18.3-1ubuntu1.diff.gz
[14:39] <tjaalton> ppa:canonical-x/x-staging has had 1.18.2+fixes for several weeks, weird if noone else sees that
[14:48] <tjaalton> 1.18.3 adds only a commit or two on top of the ppa
[14:49] <tjaalton> i guess that shortcut is kbd layout specific?
[14:49] <seb128> yes
[14:51] <willcooke> andyrock, what do you think about alt-super-space for window controls?
[14:51] <willcooke> might be confusing I guess
[14:52] <seb128> Trevinho, do you have any idea about bug #1565522? Mikkel is one of the njpatel time unity devs if you knew/remember him ;-)
[14:52] <ubot5`> bug 1565522 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "No menu bar in gtk apps" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1565522
[14:53] <Trevinho> seb128: yeah, i do know him
[14:53] <andyrock> willcooke: too big? but i'm now a designer
[14:53] <andyrock> should not conflict with other stuf
[14:58] <pitti> GunnarHj: ah, is there anything to sponsor? or should we revert the change for now?
[14:59] <seb128> Trevinho, k, unsure if that's a really issue but it would be nice to at least follow up on the bug
[14:59] <GunnarHj> pitti: Nothing to sponsor yet. That issue would be resolved with 2.11.94, so I'd like your view (again).
[15:01] <Trevinho> seb128: sure, I think it's a duplicate of anohter one we're getting... It seems like a race though
[15:01] <pitti> GunnarHj: well, it hasn't changed much; if even one patch does such damage, there's little reason to believe that taking 50 more patches is regression free
[15:01] <seb128> Trevinho, well, you at least have somebody who knows how to follow debug intructions if you need some info ;-)
[15:01] <pitti> GunnarHj: that said, upgrading is not off the table, but there's a lot more QA to be done there than just "crossing fingers"
[15:01] <Trevinho> sure...
[15:02] <pitti> GunnarHj: Mingye suggested some comparison script, that looks like a good start
[15:02] <GunnarHj> pitti: I rather think that the commits are too interdependent to be cherry picked.
[15:02] <seb128> GunnarHj, pitti, 2.11.1 is the current stable version, .94 is an unstable one ... seems late for such changes without a good rational?
[15:03] <pitti> seb128: well, my point :) (see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fontconfig/+bug/1556457/comments/18)
[15:03] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1556457 in fontconfig (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Demilight (OS/2 weight=350) confuses fontconfig" [High,Fix released]
[15:03] <GunnarHj> pitti: Yeah, if I understand it correctly, Mingye's script would check for proper weigths.
[15:03] <pitti> still, I think if someone can come up with a convincing plan to test this across fonts/glyphs/locales/desktops, it'd be okay, but this is a high-risk update
[15:04] <seb128> pitti, right, I was just  throwing in that 11.1 is the current stable and .9x are unstable versions since their versionning is a bit confusing
[15:04] <GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: What triggered this was the switch for Chinese from fonts-droid to fonts-noto-cjk. 2.11.1 is simply not ready for all the fonts weights in fonts-noto-cjk.
[15:05] <seb128> :-/
[15:05] <seb128> blame happyaron!
[15:06]  * happyaron hummmmm...
[15:06] <GunnarHj> seb128, pitti: If you talk to the upstream fontconfig developers, they have left 2.11.1 behind long ago. "Ancient". So we should probably not take the distinction between stable and development too seriously.
[15:07]  * happyaron goes to his bed
[15:07] <seb128> happyaron, night!
[15:08] <seb128> happyaron, sorry was teasing you, it's a side effect of the change to use fonts-noto-cjk but you are not the only responsible for that transition ;-)
[15:09] <happyaron> yeah I know, :p
[15:10] <pitti> so, no idea here -- damned if you do, damned if you don't
[15:10] <seb128> yeah :-/
[15:10] <GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: Yeah, it may be high risk, but the risk for a regression wrt Chinese rendering is 100% if we don't do anything.
[15:11] <willcooke> larsu, do you have a German kbd layout?  If so, can you tell me where you / key is?
[15:11] <willcooke> your
[15:11] <willcooke> is it on 7?
[15:11] <pitti> willcooke: Shift+7
[15:11] <seb128> GunnarHj, pitti, just as a data point, seems that fedora is on 2.11.94 so at least that version got some testing
[15:11] <larsu> willcooke: I don't, but it's on the 7
[15:11] <willcooke> thanks pitti
[15:12] <larsu> pitti beat me to it. Of course :)
[15:12] <willcooke> cheers larsu
[15:12] <pitti> it's been a long time since I had a German keyboard, but my wife still has one :)
[15:12] <GunnarHj> seb128, pitti: Right, we would certainly not be first. Also Arch Linux (and some more, don't remember...).
[15:13] <seb128> willcooke, just for info you can add a german layout and click the keyboard icon then to see the keyboard drawing with the symbols
[15:13] <seb128> in unity-control-center
[15:13] <willcooke> thanks seb128
[15:13] <seb128> yw!
[15:13] <GunnarHj> seb128, pitti: Arch Linux upgraded to 2.11.94 for this same reason.
[15:16] <willcooke> andyrock, thinking alt-; for window controls.  It's in the same place on most kbds and not far from space.  Asking design and Mark to advise....
[15:18] <GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: I could try to make use of Mingye's test script together with Mingye tomorrow. (Suspect he is sleeping now.)
[15:19] <willcooke> andyrock, looking at your mps - tests as well, nice!
[15:19] <GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: At the same time, wouldn't it be advisable to get 2.11.94 into the archive ASAP, so we have some time for the community/testers to provide feedback?
[15:20] <happyaron> GunnarHj: he never sleep at this moment
[15:20] <pitti> GunnarHj, seb128: either that, or a call for testing (flavors times locales) with the PPA
[15:20] <pitti> although I guess the more probable outcome will be that we do upgrade
[15:20] <pitti> and we can revert back to 2.11.1 in the worst case
[15:20] <happyaron> GunnarHj: well, a senior high student with quite a lot motivation
[15:21] <GunnarHj> pitti: Right, reverting would be easy .
[15:21] <happyaron> go to my bed really this time...
[15:21] <pitti> I went over the other commits in 2.11.94 and almost all of them are bug fix-y
[15:21] <GunnarHj> happyaron: Then I'll try to reach him.
[15:22] <GunnarHj> pitti: So, are you ready to take the chance?
[15:22] <pitti> I feel like getting my arm twisted, but I don't see a lot of other options
[15:22] <pitti> seb128: WDYT?
[15:23] <seb128> pitti, I think I would go for the update, it's relatively easy to revert if needed
[15:23] <pitti> seb128: i. e. do you object to update+call for testing+revert to 2.11.94 on regressions? any better idea?
[15:23] <seb128> it's likely going to be the most maintainable solution for a LTS
[15:23] <seb128> cherry pick of random patches might backfire
[15:24] <GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: Where would we post a call for testing?
[15:24] <seb128> ubuntu-devel@list
[15:24] <GunnarHj> seb128: Ok.
[15:24] <seb128> happyaron, night
[15:25] <andyrock> willcooke: i just have a problem with the "_" char showing up in the hud
[15:25] <andyrock> not sure where is the problem but should not be a big thing to fix
[15:25] <willcooke> thx andyrock
[15:27] <GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: I could reopen bug #1556457, somebody uploads the thing, and I can made the call for testing on the ubuntu-devel list.
[15:27] <ubot5`> bug 1556457 in fontconfig (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Demilight (OS/2 weight=350) confuses fontconfig" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1556457
[15:28] <pitti> GunnarHj: ack, sounds like a plan
[15:30] <GunnarHj> pitti: Just a detail as regards the PPA source: I think it would be proper to change the FreeType build dependency to 2.5.1.
[15:30] <GunnarHj> pitti: Required according to one of the commits.
[15:31] <GunnarHj> pitti: Will you do the upload? https://launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/+archive/ubuntu/fontconfig-test2
[15:31] <pitti> GunnarHj: ah, you already merged in the previosu changelog? thanks
[15:32] <pitti> GunnarHj: yes, will do
[15:32] <pitti> GunnarHj: +1 for bumping the build dep indeed
[15:34] <seb128> GunnarHj, did you update to .95?
[15:34] <seb128> if we go with the new version we can as well take thecurrent one
[15:35] <GunnarHj> seb128, pitti: The version in the PPA is 2.11.94. I think 2.11.95 was tagged today...
[15:36] <pitti> yeah, but .94 got some testing, so let's rather update in two steps
[15:36] <seb128> k
[15:36] <seb128> that makes sense
[15:36] <pitti> (that said, still a good idea to follow the .9x)
[15:45] <pitti> GunnarHj: I suppose I should keep the gperf build dep from the previous upload too?
[15:45] <pitti> there was no rationale, but your PPA package doesn't have it
[15:45] <GunnarHj> pitti: Not sure. It proved to be necessary for the patching approach, but not for 2.11.94.
[15:45] <pitti> ah, ok
[15:46] <pitti> GunnarHj: ok, I took your PPA package, merged the ubuntu9 changelog, bumped fontconfig and mentioned the dropping of gperf b-dep and dropping the 0002 patch
[15:47] <pitti> test-building now
[15:48] <pitti> oh, should add a ref to the regression
[15:48] <GunnarHj> pitti: The regression was reported at bug #1566651.
[15:49] <ubot5`> bug 1566651 in fontconfig (Ubuntu) "Blurry fonts after update to fontconfig 2.11.1-0ubuntu9" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1566651
[15:49] <pitti> yep, that; just added to changelog
[15:49] <pitti> uploaded
[15:50] <GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, great. I'll post the call for testing in an hour or so. (Need a break for food...).
[15:50] <pitti> GunnarHj: thanks for your perseverance, and bon appetit !
[15:50]  * pitti grabs some dinner too
[15:50] <GunnarHj> ;)
[16:30] <andyrock> seb128: where is the lp branch for libwnck xenail?
[16:30] <andyrock> i need to provide a small distro patch (1 line) for the hud change
[16:30] <seb128> andyrock, I don't think we have a vcs for that?
[16:30] <seb128> just add a debdiff to a bug and subscribe sponsors
[16:30] <seb128> or ask for sponsoring here
[16:30] <andyrock> oki
[16:49] <andyrock> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/xenial/+source/bamf/+bug/1551986/comments/4
[16:49] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1551986 in unity (Ubuntu Xenial) "HUD hotkey assignment is suboptimal" [Undecided,In progress]
[16:49] <andyrock> not sure the patch format is ok :D
[16:50] <seb128> seems fine
[16:50] <seb128> did you upstream that one?
[16:50] <seb128> you know Trevinho right? :p
[16:50] <Trevinho> I'm not sure i will accept that... :-D
[16:51] <seb128> andyrock, btw you are sure you want libwnck and not libwnck3?
[16:51] <andyrock> seb128: is not the same :D
[16:51] <andyrock> ?
[16:51] <seb128> no
[16:51] <seb128> libwnck is old gtk2 version
[16:51] <andyrock> ah ok
[16:51] <andyrock> sorry didn't know we had two
[16:51] <andyrock> I'll make a new one
[16:52] <seb128> yw
[16:52] <seb128> did you test it?
[16:52] <seb128> did it work? ;-)
[16:52] <seb128> maybe hud is still using the old lib
[16:59] <dobey> anyone else notice that in 16.04, when closing the empathy window, most accounts are also disconnected?
[17:01] <seb128> dobey, no, what account types? how do you notice?
[17:03] <dobey> at least icq and jabber (gtalk); close empathy window, then click on messaging menu -> empathy to open it again, and most of my online contacts no longer appear
[17:03] <andyrock> seb128: yeah it works like a charm
[17:03] <andyrock> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/xenial/+source/bamf/+bug/1551986/comments/6
[17:03] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1551986 in unity (Ubuntu Xenial) "HUD hotkey assignment is suboptimal" [Undecided,In progress]
[17:04] <andyrock> the problem is that set_text (...) resets the use-underline property
[17:04] <seb128> andyrock, how come it worked if you patched the wrong package?!
[17:04] <andyrock> so if there is something (in our case dbusmenuitem) attached to the notify:label signal
[17:04] <seb128> or did you patch a source and ld_preload that to test?
[17:05] <andyrock> seb128: nope i tested it on the upstream project
[17:05] <seb128> I see
[17:05] <seb128> thanks
[17:05] <andyrock> that's why i didn't know about the libwnck libwnck3 difference
[17:15] <dobey> weird; seems to behaving better now after a reboot
[17:16] <seb128> weird
[17:17] <dobey> and it finally did the contact linking correctly it seems
[17:17] <dobey> was having issues with that
[17:17] <dobey> although that could still be very weird
[17:33] <GunnarHj> seb128: Talking about regressions due to fonts-droid -> fonts-noto-cjk: Kubuntu and Xubuntu have not yet included fonts-noto-cjk in their seeds.
[17:33] <GunnarHj> https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu-seeds/kubuntu.xenial_chinese-fonts/+merge/288192
[17:33] <GunnarHj> https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu-seeds/xubuntu.xenial_chinese-fonts/+merge/288195
[17:33] <GunnarHj> Are you able to help here?
[17:34] <seb128> not really
[17:34] <seb128> I'm not involved in those flavors
[17:34] <seb128> unsure who to ping either
[17:35] <GunnarHj> seb128: So they have themselves to blame, is that it?
[17:37] <seb128> sort of I guess
[17:39] <willcooke> desktoppers - I got the OK from design to use the grey colours for the tabs in terminal (@bg_color for active and shade(@bg_color, 0.7 for the others)
[17:39] <willcooke> but...
[17:39] <willcooke> I wondered...
[17:39] <GunnarHj> seb128: IMO they have. Besides those MP:s, it was also up at ubuntu-devel: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2016-February/039217.html
[17:39] <willcooke> http://imgur.com/MhMd1wo
[17:41] <seb128> GunnarHj, you can maybe try mentioning in on #ubuntu-release
[17:42] <seb128> willcooke, the orange is not light enough imho
[17:42] <willcooke> seb128, it's the right colour, but yeah, I agree.  If I tweaked it - what do you think about an orange active tab?  Too much?
[17:43] <seb128> willcooke, I still wonder if the adwaita way would be nicer, having a colored line at the top
[17:43] <willcooke> "right colour" = "ubuorange"
[17:44] <andyrock> willcooke: other thing in the hud the items are going to appear as "Close (Window)", "Resize (Window)"
[17:45] <GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks for the tip, will do.
[17:45] <seb128> GunnarHj, yw
[17:45] <andyrock> to distinguish from Close (File) e.g.
[17:45] <willcooke> andyrock, perfect, thanks
[17:46] <seb128> willcooke, I saw some website today doing the 'color line at the top' thing, can't remember which one now but I think it was a popular one because I though that if even them were doing it that might be a good option
[17:46] <willcooke> andyrock, can we use the original short cuts from the window menu, i.e. minimize = n to get the HUD to match against it?
[17:47] <willcooke> seb128, the only way I can think of doing that would be with a coloured border
[17:47] <andyrock> willcooke: we need to modify hud-service to take into account the mnemonic
[17:47] <andyrock> not sure it's that easy
[17:48] <andyrock> i'll take a look as soon as i push the bamf branch
[17:48] <willcooke> thanks andyrock
[17:50] <flocculant> GunnarHj: I've passed the comment along for us (xubuntu)
[17:51] <willcooke> seb128, ha - I've done it!
[17:51] <GunnarHj> flocculant: Great, thanks! Then there is only Kubuntu left.
[17:54] <willcooke> seb128, ignore the borders etc for now; http://imgur.com/ffyCZ1y
[17:56] <willcooke> seb128, I'm pretty pissed though.  It's taken me hours and hours to get those colour tabs working properly, and that took about 5 mins.  ;D
[17:56] <willcooke> and I like it better
[17:56] <willcooke> more
[17:56] <willcooke> don't learn English from me
[17:57]  * willcooke -> dinner
[17:58] <flocculant> alphabettispaghetti for you
[18:04] <seb128> willcooke, enjoy!
[18:06] <davmor2> Yeah learn proper English like what I does
[18:08] <flocculant> \o/
[18:11] <seb128> zat i'ow you speek then?
[18:15] <flocculant> on day's with a y in them yup
[18:23] <Sweet5hark> https://twitter.com/mjg59/status/717778599902744576 <- Matthew Garrett owes me a handle of gin (he says)
[18:24] <willcooke> ha
[18:25] <ogra_> Trade it for a new xscreensaver
[18:26] <sarnold> Sweet5hark: hah, nice
[18:29] <willcooke> seb128, oki, issues with coloured bar at the top of the tab....
[18:29] <willcooke> * I'll have to turn off image borders and replace with solid ones
[18:29] <willcooke> (not a big deal at all)
[18:29] <willcooke>  * Need to sort the padding on the buttons, they're huuuuge at the moment
[18:30] <willcooke> (easy fix)
[18:30] <willcooke> and I think that's it
[18:31] <willcooke> http://imgur.com/E6ByaXz
[18:31] <willcooke> could probably do with a bit more separation between the tabs
[19:00] <Trevinho> willcooke: that's quite nice... Some separation would be cool
[19:01] <Trevinho> willcooke: what about doing the same in FF then? :-)
[19:01] <willcooke> it's gtk2 right?
[19:01] <willcooke> might be able to
[19:01] <willcooke> imgur.com/S6hjZN3
[19:01] <willcooke> http://imgur.com/S6hjZN3
[19:02] <willcooke> what do you think?
[19:02] <willcooke> it doesnt work with radiused tabs
[19:02] <willcooke> and I feel that the tabs are still too big, but the "+" and the drop down arrow are a bit buggy and can't be fixed (by me, now)
[19:03] <davmor2> willcooke, cyphermox: good news Nvidia upgrade upgraded and mokutils kicked in
[19:03] <willcooke> and they need extra padding to work
[19:03] <willcooke> woah!
[19:03] <willcooke> good news davmor2
[19:03] <davmor2> willcooke: tomorrow morning AMD/ATI
[19:04] <davmor2> willcooke: see what havoc comes from going from fglrx to whatever the hell it's called now
[19:07] <willcooke> :)
[19:13] <Trevinho> willcooke: maybe a px less? If possible it would be nice to have the border bigger on selected one, and very tiny in the others
[19:14] <willcooke> Trevinho, that's as small as I can get it
[19:17] <willcooke> but I can make it 2px wide when selected
[19:19] <willcooke> http://imgur.com/QR4tyVB
[19:44] <willcooke> bed time
[19:44] <willcooke> night all
[20:06] <TheMuso> flexiondotorg: And mate-accessibility-profiles, but it needs to be let through binary NEW.
[20:10] <TheMuso> flexiondotorg: And it seems they have.
[20:19] <TheMuso> flexiondotorg: I've made a few changes since the indicator and profiles can be shipped on the desktop install, the redesign was to allow for that after all.
[20:19] <TheMuso> flexiondotorg: Will upload a new ubuntu-mate-meta to address this.