[00:15] <Mystified> Hi all, can you guys recommend a GUI app for PDFtoText ? Thanks
[01:58] <mra90>  I noticed kernel rebuild does not utilize incremental build fully, what I mean by that is a lot of files are unnecessary recompiled again
[01:59] <mra90> examples: CC      arch/x86/boot/compressed/misc.o or BTF [M] fs/orangefs/orangefs.ko
[01:59] <mra90> why is that?
[02:07] <mybalzitch> because you never know what may or may not have changed
[02:08] <mybalzitch> there's options like ccache if you're frequently recompiling the kernel
[02:40] <mra90> mybalzitch, what do you mean, the timestamp of the file tell you exactly that
[02:45] <rbox> mra90: thats if a single input file produces a single output file... what if it pulls in a header, or some other genreated file?
[02:49] <mra90> rbox, but the point is neither one of them was modified
[02:49] <rbox> neither of what
[02:49] <mra90> what I see is, let's say I've just finished a compilation and a second later start a new one - a lot of object files and *.ko files are recompiled again!
[02:49] <rbox> thats just the way the kernel  build system is
[02:50] <rbox> if you want to change it, and guarnatee it works every time
[02:50] <rbox> go for it
[02:50] <mra90> that is a waste of time
[02:50] <mra90> why would you rebuild an object that has just been compiled
[02:52] <arraybolt3> How exactly are you rebuilding the kernel?
[02:53] <arraybolt3> I suspect whatever build tooling you're using simply lacks the advanced stuff that allows incremental builds. That's actually helpful for some things since more can change between builds than just source files (depending libraries for instance), but for some things it can be frustrating and a slowdown, in which case something like ccache (which I
[02:53] <arraybolt3> see was mentioned before) may help out.
[02:55] <mra90> arraybolt3, what I do is: make -j 10 ARCH=x86_64 bindeb-pkg
[04:04] <Kadigan> If you want a fun Saturday evening project: build, make a duplicate, rebuild, then - diff sources to get a list of unchanged files, compare against the build log to see which ones were rebuilt, and then compare the objects for THOSE to see if they're different.
[04:34] <tanja_> I have a small question but I'm not sure if it should be asked here. I have noticed that my ubuntu server wont verify ssl certs from GoGetSSL (GoGetSSL RSA DV CA). what can I do to fix that?
[04:36] <tanja_> or could it be because of the website has something miss configured
[04:40] <Bashing-om> tanja_: Valid question - that I can not answer - wait for one who has the knowledge.
[04:44] <tanja_> just digged further into it and it looks like its because GoGetSSL arent trusted by mozilla so yeah its probably the reason for the failing hmm.
[04:48] <tanja_> as in checked against Mozilla's root store so I guess it's on the websites end even though other systems have no issues
[04:59]  * guiverc_live camn
[04:59]  * guiverc_live can't even open a qterminal to apt-cache policy.. :(
[05:02]  * guiverc_live apolgozies; ^ was intended for another room
[07:47] <linux^> when we build a raid array using a os(debian for example, installed in a seperate ssd) can I  switch to another OS( ex:ubuntu) and attach that previously built raid array here ?
[09:02] <retarded> how to uninstall
[09:03] <retarded> how to uninstall openvpn
[09:03] <retarded> how to uninstall open vpn connector
[09:04] <retarded> they still tunneled
[09:05] <retarded> is jammy here?
[09:05] <zoomm10> sudo apt remove openvpn
[09:10] <retarded> i installed not with openvpn...  with file like ubuntu_22_04.sh
[09:13] <retarded> comnetor to cloud connexa
[09:13] <retarded> *connector
[09:14] <zoomm10> what is inside the file?
[09:20] <retarded> https://dpaste.com/ARKAG3C6N
[09:23] <ravage> it is unclear what that setup package does
[09:23] <ravage> ask their support
[09:27] <retarded> okey
[09:50] <zoomm10> retarded: you need to remove their gpg key, their repository and to update the repository, remove the package python3-openvpn-connector-setup, remove the ip forwarding from the file /etc/sysctl.conf , nat in iptable in file rule4, but you can just stop openvpn to be connected with the command: sudo systemctl stop openvpn; sudo systemctl disable openvpn
[09:59] <ravage> That still does not cover anything that setup tool does
[10:06] <zoomm10> ravage: what not cover? gpg curl?
[10:07] <ravage> it executes openvpn-connector-setup
[10:09] <zoomm10> ravage: yes correct....need to remove the openvpn-connector-setup too....
[10:09] <ravage> that only removes the package
[10:09] <ravage> not anything that binary dod
[10:09] <ravage> did
[10:10] <ravage> i doubt that removing the package will undo that
[10:15] <zoomm10> ravage: correct, we do not install if we do not know what the package install, except GNU/Linux
[11:58] <amcsi> hey, on one of our servers, php-fpm was killed due to the oom killer, and was not restarted. I checked the relevant systemd unit file and sure enough there's no Restart defined
[11:59] <amcsi> am I expected to edit the unit file itself to define a Restart clause, or is there something else I'm supposed to edit? note I'm using the ondrej ppa
[12:24] <vic-thor> is there any list of the certified ubuntu arm machines?
[12:24] <PeGaSuS> Q: ca I run `smartctl` on a running disk or it's not advisable? if yes, what would be the command? TIA
[12:25] <lotuspsychje> !hardware | vic-thor
[12:26] <vic-thor> yeah, i found that, but it doesn't filter by architecture
[12:32] <lotuspsychje> vic-thor: did you check iot and soc category?
[12:33] <lotuspsychje> otherwise maybe the !arm guys might know more of it
[12:34] <vic-thor> yes, i can find arm certified models, but i have to go one by one to get the list
[13:04] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[14:42] <golden_ticket> Hey guys! My system keeps crashing whenever I open a gui application. This is on a fresh install
[14:42] <golden_ticket> But I'm able to log into desktop
[14:43] <golden_ticket> Does anyone know how to debug this?
[14:46] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: what release of ubuntu? Installed on what hardware?
[14:47] <golden_ticket> processor: intel xeon gold 6312U CPU @ 2.40GHz x 40. Graphics: NVIDIA Corporation TU104GL [Quadro RTX 4000]. It also has an 8 TB HDD, 4 TB HDD, and a 1 TB SSD. Description:	Ubuntu 22.04.3 LTS
[14:47] <golden_ticket> leftyfb: ^
[14:48] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/ubuntu-linux-install-nvidia-driver-latest-proprietary-driver/
[14:48] <golden_ticket> leftyfb:
[14:48] <golden_ticket> Oops
[14:49] <golden_ticket> I don't know that I am using any graphics driver other than what the cpu uses. I'm running xen
[14:50] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: why are you trying to run a graphical desktop on xen?
[14:50] <golden_ticket> Xen runs dom0 in a graphical environment by default
[14:51] <leftyfb> do you need a graphical desktop Does it need to be on xen? Why not qemu or lxd or virtualbox?
[14:51] <golden_ticket> I don't know how to use lxd. I'm tyring to use something minimal because I need to manage this server remotely
[14:51] <golden_ticket> Is lxd a good option though?
[14:52] <leftyfb> ah, so it's a server. Don't run a GUI at all
[14:52] <leftyfb> install ubuntu server
[14:52] <leftyfb> and yes, LXD is great
[14:52] <golden_ticket> Okay thanks
[14:53] <golden_ticket> I'm going to do a fresh install to wipe everything I did off of here
[14:53] <golden_ticket> I've been in an uphill battle modifying things trying to get xen to work approrpriately
[14:53] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: what OS are you running on the host?
[14:54] <golden_ticket> ubuntu 22.04.3 LTS
[14:55] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: https://documentation.ubuntu.com/lxd/en/latest/tutorial/
[15:03] <arraybolt3> Keep in mind that LXD containers aren't as well isolated as LXD VMs. You may want to use VMs if you need to keep things fully isolated.
[15:05] <Habbie> LXD VMs? did you just mean VMs?
[15:05] <Habbie> oh, i'm wrong
[15:05] <Habbie> and learned a thing
[15:26] <golden_ticket> leftyfb: How can I mount a folder from the host OS to the lxc vm?
[15:27] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: lxd container, not lxc vm.
[15:27] <golden_ticket> leftyfb: I made a vm though
[15:27] <leftyfb> why?
[15:28] <golden_ticket> Because I want it to be more isolated. I have to route networking from one vm to another once I get this folder mounted
[15:28] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: from a networking perspective, an LXD vm is not more isolated than an LXD container
[15:29] <golden_ticket> Ah okay. I still would like to make it more isolated
[15:29] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: you can try https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/how-to-add-or-mount-directory-in-lxd-linux-container/    I don't know if it'll work with VM's though
[15:29] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: just use a container
[15:29] <golden_ticket> thanks
[15:29] <leftyfb> keep it simple
[15:59] <arraybolt3> leftyfb: I was the one who recommended VMs for security since they were using Xen to begin with :p
[15:59] <leftyfb> arraybolt3: an LXD VM doesn't really provide more security than an LXD container
[15:59] <arraybolt3> But if the security advantages of a VM are overkill for your use case, then yeah, just containerize it.
[16:00] <arraybolt3> leftyfb: For practical use cases and for most users, sure, but in edge cases that's not true, and people in those edge cases often use Xen since it's supposedly more secure for that sort of thing.
[16:02] <arraybolt3> (But they'd probably know if they needed the extra security of something like that, so if they're willing to just use containers, it should be fine.)
[16:58] <Guest2147> hello
[17:37] <ttys000> hello, i am trying to do this: https://askubuntu.com/questions/802326/how-can-i-move-my-extended-swap-partition but i am stuck on step 2. i am not able to move the logical volume to the right. the difference in my case is that logical volume is encrypted, is this why i can't move it to the right?
[17:37] <ttys000> gparted allows me to grow it in size, but not move it.
[17:38] <ravage> it cant "move" it because that needs access to the filesystem. that is encrypted
[17:38] <ravage> so your tool cant access it
[17:39] <ttys000> also i am running off this disk at the moment, maybe i need to do this from a live cd?
[17:39] <ravage> yes
[17:39] <leftyfb> you shouldn't need to decrypt it to move it
[17:39] <leftyfb> the problem is having it mounted
[17:39] <leftyfb> boot to a live usb
[17:39] <ttys000> what's a good live cd?
[17:39] <leftyfb> ubuntu
[17:39] <ravage> gparted has a livecd
[17:40] <ttys000> thanks
[17:40] <Habbie> i doubt encryption is the reason, to be clear
[17:40] <leftyfb> it's not
[17:40] <ravage> it depends how you define move
[17:40] <ravage> if you move the beginning of a partition that will be a problem
[17:40] <Habbie> without moving all data you mean
[17:41] <Habbie> then yes
[17:41] <Habbie> i'm not sure many filesystems can even do that when not encrypted
[17:41] <ravage> ext4 supports that
[17:41] <Habbie> ah
[17:48] <ttys000> live cd fixed my problem. thanks. don't know why i didn't think of that. stupid reeall.
[17:48] <ttys000> really*
[17:48] <Habbie> yay
[17:53] <ash_worksi> why would `xdg-open somefile.html` open somefile in firefox and switch to that window, but running `firefox --new-window somefile.html` does not switch?
[17:54] <telgareith> I installed docker.io and I'm having trouble finding the config file locations. any suggestions?
[19:31] <golden_ticket> Where can I edit the conf file for a specific container in lxc?
[19:31] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: what do you need to change?
[19:34] <rfm> golden_ticket, "lxc config show <instance>"
[19:35] <rfm> golden_ticket, uh, "lxc config show <instance> >tempfile"
[19:36] <rfm> golden_ticket, edit it then "cat tempfile | lxc config edit <instance>"
[19:36] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: there are proper methods to changing things with lxc containers. There's also #lxc and #lxd.
[19:37] <rfm> golden_ticket, there's also "lxc config edit <instance>" but only a few editors are supported
[19:42] <rfm> golden_ticket, actually that restriction is only if lxd was installed by snap...
[19:43] <leftyfb> rfm: we should find out what exactly they need to change before digging too deep into how
[19:54] <itu> how to get ab bigger vertical scrollbar in ubuntu?
[19:56] <golden_ticket> leftyfb: rfm I'm trying to route my container's traffic through tor which is installed on the host
[19:56] <golden_ticket> Sorry, I was afk getting food
[19:56] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: so just install and setup tor on the container
[19:56] <leftyfb> you don't need to edit the container config itself
[19:56] <golden_ticket> leftyfb: but tor operates as a transparent socks5. I need to route the entire container through tor, not a specific application
[19:57] <golden_ticket> I thought it might be easier if I set tor up on the host and somehow pointed the container to it
[19:57] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: so route all traffic within the container
[19:57] <golden_ticket> How?
[19:57] <leftyfb> no, it would not be easier
[19:57] <golden_ticket> Ah
[19:58] <golden_ticket> Well, in any case. I have tor installed on the host and I am already going down this path. Do you know how to do it?
[19:58] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: don't do it that way
[19:58] <golden_ticket> Okay
[19:58] <leftyfb> it's going to be WAY more complicated than it's worth
[19:58] <leftyfb> golden_ticket: https://www.wikihow.com/Route-All-Network-Traffic-Through-the-Tor-Network
[19:59] <golden_ticket> Ah okay.
[19:59] <leftyfb> though some of that is unsupported here if you have issues
[19:59] <golden_ticket> Okay. Thanks for the input
[19:59] <golden_ticket> I'm going to try torctl now
[21:13] <PeGaSuS> Q: how do I make it that `ps x` always uses `ps x --cols 10000`? TIA
[21:16] <CosmicDJ> PeGaSuS: alias psx='ps x --cols 10000' ?!
[21:16] <leftyfb> add to ~/.bashrc :     alias ps=ps x --cols 10000
[21:17] <leftyfb> PeGaSuS: it's not worth only making an alias for "ps x" as opposed to "ps"
[21:19] <PeGaSuS> to make it global, should I add it to /etc/profile or /etc/bash.bashrc?
[21:20] <at_work> or you could read the man page and look at environment variable
[21:22] <PeGaSuS> adding to /etc/profile seems to work
[21:22] <at_work> you probably want to drop customizations globally in /etc/profile.d
[21:22] <mzoku> how do I reenable the feature to remember my visited folders and actions? I am tired to clicking through folders to reach to a file each time. If you know what I mean
[21:28] <Kadigan> Hah, map vs territory. I think the idea of that functionality is subtly broken in different ways on all OSes. :D
[21:32] <mzoku> its predefault on install
[21:33] <pyeverything> hi how can I download the entire folder of https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1eh_enBx1BHM_XB2eULmD2XSnING0nSQ5?usp=drive_link using Ubuntu terminal?
[21:33] <leftyfb> pyeverything: you don't
[21:35] <leftyfb> pyeverything: you can do a search for "gdown" but it's unsupported here
[22:12] <itu> how to get ab bigger/thicker vertical scrollbar in ubuntu?
[22:12] <itu> gnome~
[22:12] <leftyfb> itu: https://askubuntu.com/questions/1456446/ubuntu-22-04-change-scrollbar-width
[22:13] <itu> thx
[22:22] <itu> needs reboot?
[22:24] <Guest24> Hello, I am currently using Ubuntu 22.04, Wondering if Firefox has default protection against Evercookies or how to block or clear evercookies.
[22:24] <leftyfb> Guest24: https://blog.mozilla.org/en/mozilla/firefox-rolls-out-total-cookie-protection-by-default-to-all-users-worldwide/
[22:26] <Guest24> Is Total Cookie Protection, On by default? Is there a way to disable it? Just wondering, I want to keep it on though, lol.
[22:27] <Guest24> Is there any reason to use basic Ubuntu rather than Xubuntu, or Lubuntu, is there any enhanced features, security, etc that comes from Ubuntu rather than an Ubuntu flavor?
[22:28] <leftyfb> Guest24: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/total-cookie-protection-and-website-breakage-faq  first result on google for firefox disable "Total Cookie Protection"
[22:28] <leftyfb> Guest24: it's personal preference
[22:29] <Guest24> is there any technical advantage or ease of use from using Ubuntu rather than an Ubuntu-flavor
[22:29] <Guest24> I've seen a RAM usage test showed that Ubuntu used more RAM at rest, but when programs are loaded, Ubuntu used only a little extra RAM rather than Lubuntu
[22:29] <Guest24> Ubuntu used 200mb more RAM than Lubuntu in this one test
[22:29] <leftyfb> Guest24: not really. Try them out and decide which one you like best
[22:30] <Guest24> I think the only advantage to using Ubuntu is the 5 years of updates you get compared to the Flavors 3-years
[22:30] <Guest24> that should have been mentioned imo
[22:31] <JanC> most of your RAM usage will be from applications like browsers probably
[22:31] <Guest24> yeah of course
[22:31] <Guest24> I have only 4g of ddr4 on a slowbook laptop
[22:31] <Guest24> so even an extra 200mb of default ram use can make a big difference here
[22:31] <Guest24> I think I'll stay on Lubuntu
[22:52] <ElongatedLongman> Hello, I am encountering a weird bug in Ubuntu. I have Tor Browser downloaded and extracted to a folder, and it works great. However, if I change the default name of the folder from 'tor-browser' to anything else, suddenly Tor wont launch, the folders internal files operate differently and Tor browser won't launch. Any ideas what is causing this
[22:52] <ElongatedLongman> effect? In my opinion, changing the folder name, shouldn't change the internal files operational behaivors at all, so It's very weird and I'm here seeking advice or answers. Thanks :)
[22:53] <leftyfb> ElongatedLongman: sounds like a tor/3rd party application issue completely unrelated to ubuntu
[22:53] <ElongatedLongman> But I am only changing the Folders name
[22:53] <ElongatedLongman> The folders name shouldn't affect anything internally
[22:53] <leftyfb> ElongatedLongman: tell that to the tor developers
[22:53] <ElongatedLongman> The folder is just a system construct holding the files
[22:53] <ElongatedLongman> But I dont think its Tor related
[22:53] <ElongatedLongman> Its about my Folder
[22:54] <leftyfb> ElongatedLongman: sudo apt install torbrowser
[22:54] <leftyfb> ElongatedLongman: the issue is your downloaded binary not working when you change it's parent directory name. That's an issue with the binary, not the OS
[22:55] <ElongatedLongman> hmmmm ok
[22:55] <leftyfb> ElongatedLongman: install the tor browser from apt and you won't have that issue
[22:58] <ElongatedLongman> I figured it out
[22:58] <ElongatedLongman> The Launcher program, is hard-coded to use the file path where it is first ran on
[22:58] <ElongatedLongman> So if the folders name is tor-browser upon first program launch, then I change the folder, the Exec command now doesnt run right
[22:58] <ElongatedLongman> due to the different folder name
[22:59] <leftyfb> so 100% an issue with the 3rd party application you downloaded
[22:59] <ElongatedLongman> not so much an issue, just the way it runs
[22:59] <ElongatedLongman> but yeah not OS related
[22:59] <ElongatedLongman> That was interesting, and I'm glad I figured out exactly why it was happening
[23:56] <bray90820> Hey sdo no matter what I do I can't install teamviewer with sudo dpkg -i on 22.04
[23:56] <rbox> what have you tried
[23:57] <bray90820> I run sudo dpkg -i teamviewer.deb it gives me errors so I run sudo apt install -f and it askes to uninstall it
[23:57] <rbox> what errors
[23:59] <bray90820> It's saying a couple things arn't imnstalled but shouldn't apt install -f install them
[23:59] <Habbie> please show us
[23:59] <Habbie> use a pastebin
[23:59] <Habbie> or take a photo if you have to


[20:22] <Haris> hello all
[20:23] <Haris> I have mysql install on 14. Something's watching over it. Whenever I stop it, its instantly restarted. Is that apparmor or something else like another watchdog ?
[20:28] <Haris> hmm


[00:16] <marcoceppi|away> help, anyone around?
[00:17] <marcoceppi|away> Dragging and dropping an exported yaml from gui doesn't accept the file, I simply get  the file downloaded again
[00:17] <marcoceppi|away> Google Chrome
[00:18] <marcoceppi|away> and Firefox
[00:18] <marcoceppi|away> about to demo, using jujucharms.com public deployment
[00:30] <huwshimi> marcoceppi|away: Seeing the same thing. http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com is erroring when I try it too.
[00:30] <marcoceppi|away> huwshimi: this is really unfortunate :\
[00:33] <huwshimi> marcoceppi|away: Can you drag charms from the sidebar onto the canvas?
[00:33] <marcoceppi|away> huwshimi: I can, I did mocked a large HA OpenStack deployment earlier
[00:34] <marcoceppi|away> it works and it's up, but I've dropped internet connection a few times so I wanted to reload the page to get the last missing charm
[00:34] <marcoceppi|away> I'm going to just wing it though for now
[00:34] <marcoceppi|away> If it's not working post-meeting I'll open a bug
[00:35] <huwshimi> marcoceppi|away: OK. I'm not getting any errors so the drop targets might not be working somehow. If you can check if it works in  http://comingsoon.jujucharms.com
[00:35] <huwshimi> that would be good
[00:36] <marcoceppi|away> huwshimi: I get an environment import failed, Unparsable environment data
[00:36] <huwshimi> marcoceppi|away: OK, that's what I get too
[00:37] <marcoceppi|away> which is a step up from it not accepting the target
[00:37] <marcoceppi|away> for refernce: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5975549/
[00:37] <marcoceppi|away> huwshimi: thanks for confirming, about to demo
[00:38] <huwshimi> marcoceppi|away: Hope it goes well!
[00:42] <marcoceppi|away> huwshimi: any idea on IE support paths?
[00:43] <huwshimi> marcoceppi|away: For this issue?
[00:43] <marcoceppi|away> huwshimi: no, just in general
[00:43] <marcoceppi|away> what's the lowest (if any) supported version of IE?
[00:44] <huwshimi> We try and support IE10 fully, but there are some outstanding bugs (https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-gui/+bugs?field.tag=ie10)
[00:44] <huwshimi> We are working towards them at the moment
[00:51] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: is the feature complete? I know there's work around deployer formats and such in progress
[00:51] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: I had that same issue while testing in sprints and was told it wasn't done yet
[00:52] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: if you got the unparseable environment data that might be the format switch
[00:52] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: ie10 is only supported version and some known bugs in progress. https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-gui/+bugs?field.tag=ie10
[00:54] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: well the file came from juju-gui
[00:54] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: I assuemd it could read what it created
[00:54] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: thanks for the info!
[00:54] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: right, but in the last month the format changed around? I'm only vaguely familiar
[00:55] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: https://canonical.leankit.com/Boards/View/102529849 is a card in progress
[00:55] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: yaml support was added, but I'm not aware of format changes. I don't follow the deployment that closely
[00:55]  * rick_h isn't sure if you can read that :/
[00:55] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: yea, me either while is hurting getting you help
[00:55] <rick_h> but a card in progress from bcsaller right now is titled "import deployer format"
[00:55] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: well that's good to know, since i'm writing an abstration layer for deployer files
[00:55] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: it's okay, I've still got the original deployment in a browser tab
[00:56] <marcoceppi|away> we can make it through this
[00:56] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: yea, sorry. You can cli that?
[00:56]  * rick_h isn't sure how that works cli -> gui and back
[00:56] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: well, I don't want to actually deploy it, since it's a huge openstack install
[00:56] <rick_h> marcoceppi|away: ah, gotcha
[00:56] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: no, it was jujucharms.com gui -> disk -> gui (error)
[00:56] <marcoceppi|away> I haven't actually done that deployment
[00:56] <marcoceppi|away> just wanted to be flashy about it
[00:56] <rick_h> I see
[00:58] <marcoceppi|away> rick_h: huwshimi: thanks!
[13:13] <benji> abentley: good morning; I have fixed up my branch, if you have a moment to look it over: https://code.launchpad.net/~benji/charmworld/featured-breakout/+merge/179503
[13:14] <abentley> benji: Have you pushed your branch?  I don't see the fixes you're talking about.
[13:14] <benji> "Pushed up to revision 343."
[13:15] <abentley> benji: The current diff is still adding qa: None
[13:15] <abentley> Line 104 of the diff
[13:16] <abentley> My IRC app is flaking out.  Back in a sec.
[13:16] <jcsackett> ccccccbljtrvvbbchjvnjubrkcnjhuhvbkrbvihcuunj
[13:16] <jcsackett> ccccccbljtrvhgivfevfvkdfkbjegleuutfhchunbkkv
[13:16] <jcsackett> =]\['\]
[13:17] <jcsackett> ...i walk away from the computer. i come back and my dog is pawing at it on the coffee table.
[13:17] <benji> abentley: fixed and pushed
[13:17] <jcsackett> ....when did my dog become a cat?
[13:17] <gary_poster> heh
[13:19] <abentley> benji: Also at 486
[13:19] <benji> yow!  I really botched that merge.
[13:21] <benji> fixed and pushed
[13:25] <gary_poster> dentist, biab.  I am tweaking Huw's branch.
[13:28] <abentley> benji: r=me
[13:36] <abentley> benji: Wait a sec, I don't think this works, because you're storing charm_ids.
[13:36] <abentley> benji: And I'm making charm-ids versioned.
[13:37] <abentley> benji: So we would have to update the featured charm-id every time.
[13:37] <abentley> benji: I.e. every time we ingest.  Which is exactly the kind of thing we don't want to do.
[13:46] <rick_h> hatch: ping for when you get in. Need to chat login code.
[13:48] <benji> abentley: I thought that the (revisionless) charm ID would be good for featured charms, since only ownership changes or series changes would affect the ID
[13:49] <abentley> benji: You are storing the soon-to-be-revisioned charm-id as an attribute at line 68, AIUI.
[13:50] <benji> abentley: I am, and when it is revisioned we'll have to change that
[13:52] <abentley> benji: I proposed that you store name, owner and series in the document.  That will work now, and it will work in the future, too.  But if we do it in the future, we also have to do a migration to change it.
[13:53] <abentley> benji: So let's do it now, so we don't have to do the migration later.
[13:55] <benji> abentley: my concern with that approach is that constructing the set of featured charms for the API would then become N searches, one for each charm.  Is that going to be fast enough?
[13:57] <abentley> benji: I think we could construct a single search with an OR block at the top, so that we could use a single search to find all the charms.
[13:57] <sinzui> orangesquad, can everyone join a hangout in a few minutes?
[13:57] <rick_h> sinzui: rgr
[13:57] <abentley> sinzui: Sure.
[13:57] <jcsackett> sinzui: rgr.
[13:57] <rick_h> sinzui: our standup hangout?
[13:58] <sinzui> rick_h, Do you still have a link to it?
[13:58]  * sinzui looks in browser history
[13:58] <rick_h> sinzui: yea, in my calender sec
[13:58] <hatch> rick_h: hey, just going to grab a coffee then ready to chat
[13:58] <rick_h> oh shoot, I did but guess not.
[13:58] <benji> abentley: ok, I'll take a stab at that approach.  To be clear, running that query would result in all revisions of all featured charms and we would then drop the non-latest, right?  Or is there a way to query for only the latest revision?
[13:58] <rick_h> hatch: will be a few
[13:58] <rick_h> hatch: sorry
[13:59] <sinzui> oh. maybe I do remember it
[13:59] <rick_h> sinzui: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/9e4f8e4352c744b862c522c70e8fdde42f531f57
[13:59] <rick_h> orangesquad ^
[13:59] <jcsackett> orangesquad: be there in a moment.
[14:00] <sinzui> adeuring, can you join this hangout ^
[14:00]  * adeuring is coming...
[14:58] <benji> abentley: can a revision of a charm ever be removed?
[14:59] <abentley> benji: I am assuming no, for a given instance of charmworld
[15:00] <sinzui> https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1IP02eriK3TlaIeyL_3gXnCmPQphRDrtUi3jAm0kpGeU/edit
[15:03] <hatch> sometimes I wish js had real interfaces
[15:15] <rick_h> hatch: I'm about to relocate but while I'm in transit let me know if there's any reason I shouldn't do http://paste.mitechie.com/show/998/ to fix #1199392
[15:15] <_mup_> Bug #1199392: can't view fullscreen charm details from url <charmbrowser> <juju-gui:In Progress by rharding> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1199392>
[15:16] <sinzui> orangesquad, I I think saucy decided the meeting is over.
[15:17] <sinzui> I have nothing left to say
[15:17] <rick_h> sinzui: thanks for he info. Going ot relocate back to real interwebs back home then.
[15:20] <abentley> benji: Sorry, was in a meeting.
[15:22] <adeuring> abentley: could you please update staging to r341?
[15:22] <abentley> benji: Yes, when charms are versioned "running that query would result in all revisions of all featured charms and we would then drop the non-latest", just as we're doing with other searches.  We might switch it to Elasticsearch later, since that's versionless.
[15:22] <abentley> adeuring: Sure.
[15:22] <benji> abentley: ok, thanks
[15:24] <hatch> rick_h: i dont see any issue pending QA is ok
[15:25] <abentley> adeuring: done.
[15:25] <adeuring> abentley: thanks!
[15:28] <rick_h> hatch: k, I wasn't sure on this login event and why this is going on. I'm not sure how best to get some tests in there because I have to url mangle and the test suite won't like it
[15:29] <hatch> rick_h: yeah this is all wako becuase the login comes from the ws
[15:29] <rick_h> hatch: k, thanks for the sanity check
[15:29] <hatch> rick_h: maybe we should create our own 'url manager' which handles fetching things like window.location
[15:29] <hatch> so that we can actually test these things
[15:29] <rick_h> hatch: well I'd expect it in the ns-routing
[15:29] <rick_h> hatch: but his code is diong it's own dispatch call
[15:30] <rick_h> hatch: and only dispatching the small little path it knows/wants to know about
[15:30] <hatch> well I'm just saying we can't unit test this login method because it pulls right from window.location which asyou said will bust up the tests if we change that
[15:31] <hatch> so if we had it pull from 'fake().window.location'
[15:31] <hatch> then we could mock it
[15:31] <hatch> I'm not saying you should do this now
[15:31] <hatch> :)
[15:31] <rick_h> hatch: ugh, well I'd rather that it didn't use pathname at all, but it's fed that already upstream
[15:31] <rick_h> but use the whole url
[15:32] <hatch> yeah I was thinking that too but then we have to deal with parsing out multitutes of base urls
[15:32] <rick_h> hatch: right
[15:32] <hatch> still doesn't make it any easier to test though
[15:32] <rick_h> hatch: well then I don't need my change at all :)
[15:32] <rick_h> I just need to get the whole url into the navigate call
[15:33] <hatch> I suppose you could change the regex's to parse the full url
[15:33] <hatch> not sure if that's any less work though
[15:33] <rick_h> hmm, maybe I don't care about that. If we hit this else block why can't I just use window.location.url?
[15:33] <rick_h> vs the redirectPath.
[15:34] <hatch> because the redirectPath can be set by external stuff
[15:35] <rick_h> hatch: guichat?
[15:35] <hatch> sure
[15:50] <Makyo> jujugui call in 10 kanban now
[15:51] <gary_poster> Thanks Makyo.  Also, jujugui, orangesquad, early warning that this meeting may go over a bit, reviewing some of the changes from the past week..
[15:51] <rick_h> story time!
[15:52] <hatch> weeeee!
[15:52] <gary_poster> :-)
[15:52]  * hatch grabs his blanky
[15:52] <gary_poster> lol
[15:52] <rick_h> as my son would say "
[15:52] <rick_h> "criss cross apple sauce with a bubble in your mouth"
[15:52] <gary_poster> heh
[15:52] <hatch> lol what?
[15:53] <rick_h> it's how the kids sit at day care. Sit on the floor with criss-crossed legs and your mouth closed as if it had a bubble in your mouth
[15:53] <hatch> ahh - smart teacher
[15:53] <rick_h> and keep it closed tight so the bubble doesn't get out
[15:53] <gary_poster> lol
[15:53] <rick_h> oh yea, great for story time
[15:53] <bac> so where does the apple sauce come in?
[15:54] <rick_h> rhyming, kids love it
[15:54]  * bac likes apple sauce
[15:58] <gary_poster> jujugui call in 2
[16:02] <gary_poster> sinzui jcsackett call ping
[16:02] <sinzui> gary_poster, google refuses to believe I am logged in
[16:03] <gary_poster> ack sinzui :-( proceeding with kanban for now but let us know if you want us to wait on anything
[16:38] <Makyo> gary_poster, May be misreading the UX by unit bit, actually.  It looks like it's listing charms, rather than units.
[16:39] <gary_poster> Makyo, ah, yes
[16:39] <Makyo> gary_poster, Which we can do for up/downgrade, but not cross-grade, which I guess is okay.
[16:39] <hatch> review time!
[16:39] <Makyo> That would leave cross-grade as some manual step for CLI.
[16:39] <gary_poster> Makyo, right, I thought crossgrade would be a bit much for the GUI
[16:39] <Makyo> Yep.
[16:39] <gary_poster> at least for now
[16:39] <gary_poster> cool, thanks for reviewing it again Makyo.
[16:41] <hatch> jcsackett: url for your branch?
[16:41] <hatch> sorry my email is being dumb
[16:41] <rick_h> hatch: https://codereview.appspot.com/12768043/
[16:41] <hatch> thanks
[16:44] <hatch> jcsackett, did you merge trunk into your branch?
[16:49] <jcsackett> hatch: i believe so.
[16:49] <jcsackett> hatch: what makes you ask?
[16:50] <hatch> just curious
[16:51] <hatch> I also added a note tot he code review wondering if we should rename it from browsercharm in the cleanup
[16:51] <hatch> thinking that browser is going away :)
[16:53] <jcsackett> hatch: we want to keep a distinction between browsercharm and charm right now.
[16:53] <jcsackett> when we remove the charm model code we'll also rename browsercharm.
[16:53] <hatch> right right of course
[16:55] <gary_poster> hatch, I didn't understand what you meant in #1211356.  could you be a bit more concrete in bug?
[16:55] <_mup_> Bug #1211356: service configuration is used in too many formats <juju-gui:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1211356>
[16:56] <hatch> gary_poster, sure - I added a card to talk about it on Friday as well
[16:57] <gary_poster> cool thanks hatch (but I won't be there, so I want a clue too ;-) )
[16:57] <hatch> gary_poster, oh right....ok updated
[17:09] <hatch> gary_poster, does the new description make a little more sense?
[17:11] <gary_poster> hatch maybe :-P .  on a charm, the config is about schema, while on the service, the config is about values, so that seems reasonable to be different, unless there's a simple way to unify them.  The template diff sounds clearer on the face of it.
[17:13] <hatch> yeah this is mostly about requiring you to run a util parse method on the service data in order to render it
[17:20] <hatch> Makyo, is there any QA required for your branch?
[17:21] <Makyo> hatch, if you would be so kind: change 'python' to 'go' in app/config-debug.js and deploy a service - it should have units in the inspector, a health graph on the service, etc.  Should be quick.
[17:22] <hatch> will do!
[17:40] <hatch> rick_h, do you use irssi for irc?
[17:41] <rick_h> hatch: yes
[17:42] <hatch> I'm trying to decide between that or quassel
[17:42] <rick_h> hatch: weechat is the one to check out these days
[17:42] <rick_h> hatch: I've just not bothered to switch my config over atm
[17:42] <rick_h> since I've had this setup for so long
[17:43] <hatch> it's been around for 10 years and isn't even at version 1
[17:43] <hatch> lol
[17:43] <rick_h> welcome to OSS
[17:43] <hatch> what is this...a nodejs script?
[17:46] <hatch> Makyo, review and qa done
[17:47] <hatch> rick_h, hmm it looks pretty cool
[17:47] <rick_h> jcsackett: qa issue: http://gui:8888/:gui:/charms/charms/precise/ceph-14/json/ auto reloads over and over
[17:47] <hatch> nice UI....console
[17:47] <rick_h> hatch: yea, if I didn't already have a setup I'd be using weechat and one day when I'm bored I'll port over
[17:48] <hatch> I really want to setup a irc client which is always running so I can just hook into it as I move from computer to computer
[17:48] <rick_h> hatch: yea, <3
[17:49] <Makyo> hatch, Until pyjuju is fully deprecated, I would assume the pyjuju sandbox will remain, but perhaps someone else from jujugui can comment.  +1 on splitting into separate files if possible, though.  Will make a slack task.
[17:49] <hatch> have you used/looked into quassel?
[17:49] <hatch> Makyo, yeah I kind of figured as much, cool
[17:49] <rick_h> hatch: graphical? no...I've not looked at it
[17:49] <hatch> jujugui lf two reviews on https://codereview.appspot.com/12770043/
[17:50] <hatch> rick_h, well it also has a server component
[17:50] <rick_h> yea, no thanks
[17:50] <rick_h> just use weechat and be happy
[17:51] <hatch> I'm going to built up my terminal and try and go cold turkey
[17:51] <rick_h> let me know when you need a hang :)
[17:51] <rick_h> hand
[17:51] <hatch> tmux, weechat(I guess :P), vim?
[17:51] <rick_h> yep
[17:51] <rick_h> when you get ready for mutt let me know :)
[17:52] <Makyo> Haha
[17:52] <hatch> haha no
[17:52] <hatch> that'll never happen
[17:52] <rick_h> best email client out there!
[17:52]  * rick_h hugs mutt
[17:53] <hatch> ya know I say that.....but who knows!
[17:53] <hatch> your horrible terminalness is rubbing off on me
[17:54] <rick_h> I'm a horrible influence, just ask the locals around me
[17:54] <hatch> gary_poster, shall I continue on the inspector tasks? Did you want anything in particular done right now?
[17:54] <hatch> I bet!
[17:55] <hatch> rick_h, I love how mutt's feature list includes 'color support' lol
[17:55] <rick_h> hatch: yea, very handy
[17:56] <Makyo> Need to switch from screen to tmux one of these days.
[17:56] <hatch> Makyo, yeah, even I know that's the right move :)
[17:56] <Makyo> I'm just so used to screen.  Will take some effort.
[17:56] <rick_h> Makyo: the pragmatic prog tmux book helped me switch. Really handy read
[17:56] <hatch> rick_h, how does mutt handle html emails?
[17:57] <rick_h> hatch: so I patch it through to w3m for the most part, or else I open them in chrome through mutt
[17:57] <hatch> ahh ok - just curious really
[17:57] <rick_h> yea, most I can read in w3m, a command line browser. Otherwise you can write the message out to /tmp and them chrome them
[17:58] <hatch> the reason I'm considering vim at all is that I pretty much navigate through sublime with keyboard shortcuts anyways and switching between irc/sublime/terminal is getting to be a pita
[17:59] <rick_h> have you ever heard of a tiling window manager? /me runs away cackling
[18:00] <hatch> lol yes
[18:00] <Makyo> So...vim + ctrlp \o/
[18:01] <rick_h> Makyo: glad you like it :)
[18:01] <Makyo> Yeah!
[18:01]  * hatch goes to google ctrlp
[18:01] <rick_h> see, this is what's great about sprints. You walk away with new side things that are awesome
[18:02] <hatch> rick_h, Makyo ahh yes sublime does that with ctrl+p :D
[18:02] <hatch> guess I could have assumed lol
[18:06] <hatch> rick_h, I know I asked this before but I can't remember the answer - do you use a vim window manager or tmux for different windows
[18:07] <rick_h> hatch: I use my tiling WM and lots of splits in vim. I don't use tmux to window/split
[18:07] <hatch> ahh right right
[18:08] <hatch> and is there anything in vim which has the idea of a 'project'
[18:08] <rick_h> jcsackett: nvm I guess. I can't dupe now. The code is going away soon as well so carry on!
[18:08] <rick_h> meh, that stuff is too much imo
[18:09] <gary_poster> hatch, bcsaller, would it be reasonable for hatch to tackle the scale up/down ux?
[18:09] <bcsaller> gary_poster: Thats fine with me, but I can get to it once I've finished this import stuff
[18:12] <gary_poster> bcsaller, if hatch thinks scale up/scale down is a good task, then you could prototype how to use the sandbox + topologies to display bundles in the charm browser
[18:12] <bcsaller> gary_poster: that sounds like a good use of time to me
[18:12] <gary_poster> cool bcsaller
[18:12] <bcsaller> and fits well with the import story
[18:12] <gary_poster> y
[18:13] <hatch> alright I'll take the scaleup/down
[18:13] <gary_poster> cool thanks hatch, bcsaller
[18:13] <rick_h> sinzui: wanted to check in on the deploy docs and process for charmworld?
[18:13] <hatch> bcsaller, did you have any work done on it yet?
[18:14] <sinzui> abentley, I see staging is at r341. Do you have any reservations if we deploy it for rick_h?
[18:15] <bcsaller> hatch: I didn't take it very far, I'd just started with the template. Mostly I moved to the import stuff. I'm happy to do a pre-imp call though
[18:15] <abentley> sinzui: Let me check...
[18:16] <rick_h> sinzui: I'm looking at 342 as my icon branch didn't really require updating staging.
[18:16] <abentley> sinzui: No, I'm happy.
[18:16] <sinzui> abentley, fab.
[18:16] <sinzui> rick_h, are you saying staging is 1 rev behind?
[18:17] <rick_h> sinzui: yes
[18:17] <hatch> bcsaller, sure in a bit - I'm just fixing some IE test failures
[18:17] <sinzui> rick_h, we need to see it on staging to verify the charm can stop and start for the rev
[18:18] <abentley> sinzui: Staging still isn't auto-updating on branch landings.
[18:19] <sinzui> abentley, I was going to run the tests for 342 then juju set revno
[18:19] <abentley> sinzui: Yes, that's what we have to do right now.
[18:20] <rick_h> sinzui: ok
[18:20] <abentley> sinzui: But you could also go straight to 344.
[18:21] <sinzui> works for me
[18:21] <rick_h> jujugui 2 reviews please for tiny diff to fix #1199392 https://codereview.appspot.com/12791043
[18:21] <_mup_> Bug #1199392: can't view fullscreen charm details from url <charmbrowser> <juju-gui:In Progress by rharding> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1199392>
[18:22] <bac> rick_h: i'll do one
[18:22] <rick_h> bac: thanks
[18:23] <hatch> bcsaller, the upgrade story is on mockup v11 or did we have a different one for it?
[18:23] <bcsaller> hatch: upgrade charm ux?
[18:24] <gary_poster> hatch this isn't the upgrade story but the scale up/down story
[18:24] <hatch> ohh ok so we are using the v11 version?
[18:25] <Makyo> hatch, upgrade charm ux: https://www.dropbox.com/s/d6sc200adk2dszs/juju-gui-2-inspector-09.jpg
[18:25] <gary_poster> think so.  verifying
[18:25] <Makyo> Just so you can diff them
[18:25] <hatch> yup pretty close thanks
[18:26] <hatch> ok I'm going to grab lunch first then get started on this
[18:27] <gary_poster> cool.  and yes, v11 should be it
[18:35] <sinzui> rick_h, staging updated. Are you satisfied it has the feature you need?
[18:36] <rick_h> sinzui: yes, thanks!
[19:05] <rick_h> jcsackett: hatch can I interest either of you into a small itty bitty review? https://codereview.appspot.com/12791043
[19:05] <hatch> mayyyybe
[19:06] <hatch> rick_h, so you're going this way instead of a util method eh?
[19:06] <rick_h> hatch: yes, a util method isn't needed and needs a home, and doesn't get me anything as then it needs tests that muck with the url
[19:07] <hatch> I'm not sure I agree because this way we can't unit test this method
[19:07] <hatch> although we had this discussion already
[19:07] <hatch> haha
[19:07] <rick_h> sure we can, override the getter as we talked about. It's 'a util method'
[19:08] <rick_h> just in an attr atm right next to the code using it that needs it
[19:08] <hatch> we can override the getter?
[19:08] <rick_h> but it's ugly, I give you that
[19:08] <rick_h> hmm, can't you override the getter of an ATTR?
[19:09] <hatch> I didn't think so
[19:09] <hatch> maybe you can and I've been missing out...
[19:09]  * rick_h didn't look I guess. It's a function, why not be able to override it
[19:10] <hatch> I think you have to pass in a named fn and override that one because I am pretty sure YUI doesn't give you access to the getter fn's after instantiation
[19:11] <rick_h> ok, well this can be pulled into a util when someone else needs it. For now it seems like fixing this special onLogin event issue with a sledgehammer
[19:11] <rick_h> and woot, autocomplete landing. /me keeps refreshing comingsoon
[19:11] <hatch> lgtm'd
[19:12] <rick_h> thanks
[19:12] <rick_h> gary_poster: sinzui so autocomplete is out the door and bug fix. Is there a priority from here I should take into account? inspector cards? other browser bugs? should we chat on some of the new ones that came out of IoM?
[19:13] <gary_poster> rick_h, awesome~
[19:13] <gary_poster> !
[19:14] <gary_poster> rick_h, working up answer.  have a glass of water. ;-)
[19:15] <rick_h> gary_poster: np
[19:19] <gary_poster> rick_h, how about (dun dun dun!) the STICKY HEADER CODE! <sound echoes>
[19:20] <gary_poster> rick_h, you can say no, but, your mission, should you choose to accept it...
[19:20]  * rick_h pretends gary_poster was talking to hatch :P
[19:20] <gary_poster> lol
[19:20]  * hatch pretends he doesn't exist and can't be assigned this tasks
[19:20] <gary_poster> lol
[19:20] <rick_h> gary_poster: k, I don't have all the background. If you can link me to the notes/info I can look into it. I've seen a couple of links of demos from hatch
[19:21] <hatch> rick hop into guichat I can give you a rundown
[19:21] <gary_poster> ...would be to get a simple variant of sticky headers working in the inspector and the charm browser.
[19:21] <rick_h> hatch: k
[19:21] <rick_h> gary_poster: ok, yea I've seen the card about a demo, but know there was some confusion abuot when/how it was used as well?
[19:22] <gary_poster> hatch, do you have a link of the FF demo?  Please emphasize that we should go with something quick rather than something perfect--we can negotiate with  UX, but the user testing said load and clear that the sticky headers were helpful
[19:22] <hatch> yep definitely
[19:22] <hatch> I think I have the link somewhere I'll have to look
[19:23] <gary_poster> thanks hatch.  rick_h, the confusion was that we thought it needed to be implemented a certain way.  what UX actually wanted seemed easier and more common, but turned out to be harder.  hatch knows where the bodies are buried.  I can hop on the call at a moments notice if desired
[19:24] <rick_h> gary_poster: k, thanks. Chatting now
[19:29] <gary_poster> bcsaller, I suspect you want to do this almost as much cutting your fingernails to the quick, but we do have you done for "Write documentation for Databinding Engine and Controller" and that is something that both of your reviewers requested.
[19:29] <gary_poster> s/done/down/
[19:30] <gary_poster> That would be a good task to complete before you move to the prototype.
[19:30] <bac> hi sinzui
[19:30] <sinzui> hi bac
[19:30] <bac> sinzui: you got a sec so i can pick your brain?
[19:30] <sinzui> yes
[19:31] <bac> sinzui: guichat is occupied.  i'll make a hangout
[19:32] <bac> sinzui: you are unavailable.  :(
[19:33] <sinzui> I am here
[19:33] <sinzui> in g+
[19:34] <sinzui> I am trying to call you
[19:34] <gary_poster> jujugui, could I have two volunteers for charm reviews today of frankban's branch, please?  https://codereview.appspot.com/12770044/
[19:35] <bac> sinzui: it thinks i'm in a call with both of your identities and it won't let me join either!
[19:35] <benji> gary_poster: I'll take one
[19:35] <gary_poster> thanks benji
[19:35] <sinzui> bac, ring me again?
[19:35] <bac> yes, the non-canonical you
[19:36] <bac> gah, killed ff and am trying again
[20:03] <hatch> bcsaller, have a moment for that pre-imp?
[20:07] <rick_h> gary_poster: autocomplete is on comingsoon. Do we still have the css build issue on there as it looks funky? I've got to run but will look into it in the morning if needed. fyi
[20:08] <gary_poster> rick_h, ack, thanks, will investigate
[20:16] <gary_poster> rick_h, was a conflict *and* a build issue. :-) resolved
[20:31] <bcsaller> hatch: sorry, was at lunch, want that call now?
[20:31] <hatch> yup lets do it
[20:32] <bcsaller> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5959504/
[20:36] <hatch> gary_poster: want to pop into guichat for a second?
[20:36] <benji> abentley: I've upadated my branch to not depend on charm ID
[20:36] <gary_poster> hatch will be there in 5
[20:36] <abentley> benji: Looking...
[20:38] <abentley> benji: While waiting on your branch, I've been working on removing doctype: https://bugs.launchpad.net/charmworld/+bug/1208477
[20:38] <_mup_> Bug #1208477: Bundle metadata contains redundant "doctype" attribute <charmworld:In Progress by abentley> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1208477>
[20:39] <benji> abentley: hmm, I think doctype is pretty important for my branch
[20:40] <abentley> benji: The caller should know what the document type is.
[20:41] <benji> abentley: right, but how will the FeaturedSource know what kind of document it has been given?
[20:42] <benji> abentley: I'm sorry, but I really have to run an errand right now, I'll be back later but I suspect we'll have to iron this out in the morning
[20:42] <abentley> benji: The caller can pass that info in.  It already does for get_featured.
[21:28] <abentley> sinzui: Could you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~abentley/charmworld/remove-doctype-attribute/+merge/179814 ?
[21:29]  * sinzui does
[21:30] <sinzui> abentley, r=me
[21:30] <sinzui> that was nice without a single surprise
[21:31] <abentley> sinzui: The surprise for me was that Elasticsearch doesn't support bulk updates.
[21:37] <bac> sinzui: could you review https://code.launchpad.net/~bac/charmworld/create_replacemet-bundle-aware/+merge/179816 ?  it is the fix we discussed, i just pulled it out into a bite-sized branch.
[21:38]  * sinzui looks
[21:40] <bac> sinzui: with this fix, bundles added before running bin/es-update survive.
[21:44] <sinzui> bac: Your have two tests of similar name, but they do different things with create_replacement()
[21:46] <sinzui> bac maybe the names could be test_create_replacement_default_bundles() and test_create_replacement_with_bundles()
[21:47] <bac> sinzui: i followed the existing pattern with charm/charms.
[21:47] <sinzui> hmm.
[21:47] <bac> sinzui: but i'm happy to change the names of them all to be clearer
[21:48] <sinzui> bac, could you? That's all I ask. r=me
[21:48] <bac> sure.  thanks sinzui
[22:08] <hatch> bcsaller: what do you use for vim to allow you to use the mouse the way you do?
[22:08] <hatch> do you use gvim?
[22:09] <bcsaller> hatch: no, console vim. I think its :set mouse a
[22:09] <bcsaller> for
[22:09] <bcsaller> all modes
[22:09] <bcsaller> :help mouse will tell you
[22:10] <hatch> what was after 'its' my irc client turned it into an emoticon
[22:16] <rick_h> hatch: colonset mouse a
[22:16] <rick_h> gary_poster: thanks! looks much nicer
[22:17] <hatch> rick_h: thanks :) I finally got zsh running on my laptop, it didn't want to run
[22:17] <hatch> now trying to find a theme
[22:25] <rick_h> hatch: theme? for the prompt?
[22:25] <rick_h> hatch: because the colors are the terminal colors
[22:25] <hatch> yeah alanpeabody is what I went with
[22:29] <hatch> ehh I don't like that one either
[22:29] <hatch> looks like I'll end up making my own hah
[23:01] <huwshimi> Morning
[23:09] <hatch> morning huwshimi


[20:22] <ax562> hello
[20:22] <knome> 'lo
[20:22] <ax562> haha
[20:22] <ax562> brb gonna login to x
[20:30] <ax562> back
[20:32] <pleia2> so, we have a #LoveXubuntu campaign draft up now for team members to view: https://xubuntu.org/?p=3974&preview=true
[20:32] <pleia2> particularly interested in feedback from flocculant, but really everyone should chime in :)
[20:33] <pleia2> also, yes, we did just have our 10th anniversary :) woooo
[20:33] <ax562> cool
[20:33] <knome> \o/
[20:34] <ax562> page not found pleia1
[20:34] <ax562> page not found pleia2
[20:34] <knome> ax562, "for team members"
[20:34] <pleia2> ax562: you have to be a team member to view it
[20:34] <ax562> haha ooops
[20:34] <ax562> sorry
[20:34] <pleia2> it's a preview, not published for everyone yet
[20:35] <pleia2> that's why I'm asking for feedback :)
[20:35] <ax562> nm
[20:35]  * knome waits the day when everybody in the internet reads things before replying ;)
[20:35] <ax562> gonna be old and grey
[20:35] <pleia2> haha, right
[20:35] <knome> yeah, as if that ever happened...
[20:38] <flocculant> pleia2: mmm
[20:38] <flocculant> \o/
[20:38] <flocculant> managed to login :p
[20:38] <pleia2> :)
[20:38] <pleia2> haha
[20:38] <knome> hah
[20:39] <knome> not blocked
[20:39] <knome> ...yet
[20:39] <knome> :P
[20:39] <flocculant> pleia2: I lost all my bookmarks ...
[20:39] <pleia2> I recall
[20:39] <flocculant> reading now
[20:39] <knome> flocculant, you relocated?
[20:39] <pleia2> I give them all to google to steal my privacy and autosync them between all my devices
[20:39] <pleia2> because convenience++
[20:39] <knome> i just remember all the URLs i need to access
[20:39] <knome> (:
[20:40] <Unit193> I give them all to my server and sync them too. >_>
[20:40] <flocculant> knome: good for you
[20:40] <pleia2> knome: we talkad about this, you have an unusual memory
[20:40] <knome> yes we did ;)
[20:40] <flocculant> what's that then pasi.web./bookmarks
[20:40] <flocculant> remember one :D
[20:40] <pleia2> lol
[20:41] <ax562> do you guys need any help with anything?
[20:41] <Unit193> They need mental help for sure.
[20:41] <flocculant> they?
[20:41] <knome> ax562, yes, but it would make more sense if you would tell us what kind of things you can help with
[20:41] <ax562> haha
[20:41] <knome> flocculant, you and your other person.
[20:42] <flocculant> if anyone should have said us it would be more or Unit193 :p
[20:42] <ax562> well pretty much anything I read in the team stuff
[20:42] <knome> ax562, in that case fix a few thunar bugs please ;)
[20:42] <flocculant> \o/
[20:42] <knome> flocculant remembers the bug numbers...
[20:43]  * flocculant did
[20:43] <ax562> I would say start something simple first maybe test something
[20:43] <flocculant> lost the bookmark with bugs
[20:43] <knome> flocculant, don't we have them in a blueprint
[20:43] <ax562> you guys use github right?
[20:43] <knome> ax562, nope.
[20:43] <ax562> what do you guys use?
[20:44] <knome> launchpad for the code that is from us
[20:44] <flocculant> ax562: testing is easy - hardware or virtual - mostly documented here http://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/
[20:44] <knome> xfce uses git (there's a github clone though)
[20:44] <pleia2> yes yes, testing, always need help there
[20:44] <flocculant> http://dev.xubuntu.org/#tab-details/spec=xubuntu-y-bugs
[20:44] <knome> i agree testing is a great place to start with as well
[20:44] <ax562> isn't xfce = xubuntu?
[20:44] <flocculant> no
[20:45] <knome> you can do it when you have time, and you can finish the task on the same sitting
[20:45] <ax562> well isn't it xfce = xubuntu desktop envirenoment
[20:45] <knome> yes, xubuntu uses xfce, but xubuntu !== xfce
[20:45] <knome> and xfce !== xubuntu
[20:45] <knome> (implied..)
[20:45] <ax562> now im a little confused
[20:46] <ax562> i thought xfce was part of the xubuntu bundle which are part of the same team?
[20:46] <flocculant> ax562: xubuntu uses xfce and some lots of xfce apps - but it's not *just* xfce
[20:46] <flocculant> lots of the xubuntu team are xfce devs - but not all
[20:46] <knome> ax562, xfce is indeed included in xubuntu, but the xubuntu team isn't integrated with the xfce team
[20:47] <flocculant> some lots is a special testing term
[20:47] <ax562> so xfce and xubuntu are not the same team per say
[20:47] <flocculant> nope
[20:47] <knome> as flocculant says there is some overlap
[20:47] <flocculant> xfce would have no idea who I am :)
[20:47] <flocculant> though I'm not sure I do either
[20:47] <ax562> haha
[20:48] <flocculant> seems we do a lot of testing for xfce though ;)
[20:48] <ax562> so xfce > 10 years then right?
[20:48] <pleia2> yeah
[20:48] <knome> sure, it helps us if xfce does well
[20:48] <pleia2> I started using Xfce in 2003 or so
[20:48] <ax562> oh wow
[20:49] <flocculant> pleia2: nice post - but question ... what is colro?
[20:49] <ax562> i wasn't even on linux then
[20:49] <ax562> i was an xp baby
[20:49] <flocculant> I'm guessing should be  t-shirt size and color?
[20:49] <pleia2> maybe it was 2004 :) http://princessleia.com/images/MyImages/screen/Desktop110604.jpg
[20:49] <knome> flocculant, colro is the new black.
[20:49] <flocculant> aaah
[20:50] <flocculant> ok - just so long as that's plain ...
[20:50] <ax562> is there like a xubuntu timeline like android?
[20:50] <pleia2> I don't know what the android timeline is
[20:50] <ax562> !?!
[20:50] <ax562> blasphemy pleia2 :)
[20:50] <knome> well, xubuntu has been doing releases for the last 10 years every 6 months...
[20:51] <ax562> my bad for all the qustions, that used to be my nickname back in the day
[20:52] <knome> that? qustions?
[20:52] <ax562> yeah, questions, then quest, then quest quest, go figure
[20:52] <ax562> im just waiting on this bleach bit
[20:53] <ax562> you guys still use torrents to distribute x16.04?
[20:54] <knome> what about trying to see some bits from the website?
[20:54] <knome> we don't have a website lead for nothing
[20:54] <knome> :)
[20:54] <ax562> wait i thought you were knome
[20:55] <knome> i didn't say i wasn't, please read again...
[20:55] <ax562> lol
[20:55] <ax562> how can i help on that end
[20:55] <knome> at the moment, we have stuff well in control
[20:55] <ax562> my buddys lappy is so full of junk
[20:56] <ax562> gonna try to convince him to go x16.04 later this afternoon..hehehe
[20:57] <flocculant> pleia2: I changed colro to color
[20:57] <pleia2> flocculant: thanks :)
[20:58] <flocculant> mmm ... gstreamer updates ... this is where it went wrong 6 months ago :p
[21:57] <ax562> good god this is taking forever
[22:18]  * genii makes more coffee and passes the mugs around
[22:18] <pleia2> mmmcoffee
[22:41] <knome> i only had one starbucks cappuccino in the US ;)
[22:45] <genii> Starbucks actually has good coffee but such rediculous names to order something when all you want is for instance their largest mug of strong dark coffee. Also the locations seem populated with unemployed screenwriters pounding furiously on their MacBooks
[22:50] <ax562> haha
[22:50] <pleia2> knome: who else should we get to sign off on #lovexubuntu?
[22:55] <knome> pleia2, the XPL!
[22:55] <knome> genii, yeah...
[22:55] <knome> genii, "i'd like a large cappuccino"
[22:55] <knome> genii, "which size?"
[22:55] <knome> genii, "large"
[22:55] <knome> genii, "which size?"
[22:55] <knome> genii, *looks at the table* "grande"
[22:56] <knome> genii, "OK!"
[22:56]  * knome facepalms
[22:56] <knome> and unsurprisingly, they spelled my name wrong. maybe i should've kept my badge visible :)
[23:00] <genii> knome: Yeah, it's annoying!
[23:01] <Unit193> knome: To be fair, you *are* Finnish.
[23:01] <knome> Unit193, sure.
[23:01] <knome> no denying...
[23:02] <Unit193> Just like nobody can get my lastname right.  I've learned to find amusment and laugh though so it all works out.


[00:44] <ptl> does any of you know how to enable HDMI sound on the UG802 with ubuntu?
[02:54] <stgraber>  /win 37
[07:52] <dholbach> good morning
[08:19] <feasty> morning dholbach
[08:19] <dholbach> hey feasty
[08:20] <feasty> Cheers for the email the other day.
[08:24] <dholbach> thank YOU
[08:24] <dholbach> I'll reply to it in a bit - just finishing up some other small bits
[08:25] <feasty> Hey no worries.
[09:14] <hrw> hello
[09:16] <smartboyhw> hello
[09:24] <feasty> hey
[10:57] <xnox> ogra-cb_: so i get initramfs busybox from the nexus boot/rootfs on cdimage.
[10:58] <xnox> ogra-cb_: and I haven't been able to boot a single one off cdimage so far (as far as i remember)
[10:58] <xnox> the one from hwe still works... but I do use the 16GB specific image there.
[11:23] <ogra_> xnox, how did you install ?
[11:24] <hrw> ogra_: does unity 3d works on opengles?
[11:25] <ogra_> hrw, sure
[11:25] <ogra_> else nexus7 wouldnt be possible
[11:26] <hrw> ogra_: someone complains for chromebook: https://bugs.launchpad.net/chromebook-arm/+bug/1085596
[11:26] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1085596 in Cross distro support for Samsung Chromebook (ARM based) "Graphics acceleration not working in ubuntu desktop 12.10" [Undecided,New]
[11:26] <ogra_> yes, seems the GLES driver doesnt offer all features, you can force it to GLES though but that will still render parts in SW
[11:27] <ogra_> though its fast enough to be usable even with that
[11:27] <hrw> nux-tools has a tool to check it iirc?
[11:28] <ogra_> yes, and that seems toi be bugy
[11:28] <ogra_> *buggy
[11:28] <ogra_> xnox, just installing the latest daily here, seems to work fine so far
[11:29] <ogra_> zsync http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-preinstalled/current/raring-preinstalled-desktop-armhf+nexus7.img.gz.zsync
[11:29] <ogra_> zcat raring-preinstalled-desktop-armhf+nexus7.img.gz >raring-preinstalled-desktop-armhf+nexus7.img
[11:29] <ogra_> sudo fastboot erase boot
[11:29] <ogra_> sudo fastboot erase userdata
[11:29] <ogra_> sudo fastboot flash userdata raring-preinstalled-desktop-armhf+nexus7.img
[11:29] <ogra_> sudo fastboot flash boot raring-preinstalled-desktop-armhf+nexus7.bootimg
[11:29] <ogra_> sudo fastboot reboot
[11:30] <ogra_> xnox, thats my installation preocess, there is no reason it shouldnt work for you the same way
[11:30] <ogra_> *process
[11:30] <mjrosenb> odd, my chromebook does not seem to ant to update to 12.10
[11:30] <mjrosenb> it seems to really like 12.04
[11:31] <ogra_> mjrosenb, you need to tell update-manager that you want to run non LTS releases
[11:31] <mjrosenb> did that already
[11:31] <ogra_> (somewhere in /etc/default)
[11:31] <mjrosenb> oh, I think I did it through the gui.
[11:31] <ogra_> well, should be the same
[11:32]  * mjrosenb verifies that he did this...
[11:32] <hrw> mjrosenb: I wish you lack with alsa mixer then
[11:33] <hrw> s/lack/luck
[11:33] <ogra_> it is actually in /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades
[11:33] <hrw> mjrosenb: when you will start playing with alsa mixer switches be aware of smoke possibilities
[11:33] <mjrosenb> hrw: alsamixer isn't currently working, so upgrading can't hurt.
[11:34] <xnox> ogra_: I'll purge my downloads and redownload just in case.
[11:34] <mjrosenb> hrw: "smoke possibilities"?
[11:34] <ogra_> xnox, on the 16G model it should still work, it just wont use all of the available diskspace
[11:34] <hrw> mjrosenb: many people (including me) already fried speakers in chromebook
[11:34] <ogra_> mjrosenb, you can blow up the speakers apparently
[11:35] <mjrosenb> neato.
[11:35] <hrw> mjrosenb: smoke, melted plastic etc
[11:35] <hrw> and lot of heat of course
[11:35] <mjrosenb> I usually leave my laptop's speakers muted, so unless that option is inverted...
[11:35] <hrw> it is a bit more complicated
[11:38]  * ogra_ is in oem-config
[11:41] <ogra_> gah
[11:41] <ogra_> the WLAN paswword input field doesnt take any input
[11:43] <ogra_> xnox, hmm, i thinnk compiz screws up onboard here
[11:44] <ogra_> i can provide the wlan PW via the NW applet ... but not through the installer
[11:44] <xnox> ogra_: interesting.
[11:44] <ogra_> and now i cant type in my name
[11:45] <ogra_> fridays image worked though
[11:46] <ogra_> sigh
[11:46] <ogra_> not being able to create a user is kind of a blocker
[11:46]  * ogra_ reboots
[11:49] <ogra_> ah, better, a reboot fixed it (though probably because i didnt need to configure the wlan this time)
[11:56] <hrw> ogra_: which keymap does ac100 uses?
[11:56] <hrw> ogra_: kernel one, own xkb one, generic xkb one?
[11:57] <ogra_> consoilesetup as every ub untu out there
[11:57] <ogra_> *console-setup
[11:57] <ogra_> nexus7 install finished ... no issues beyond the kbd input stuff above
[11:59] <hrw> ogra_: console-setup is just a package.
[12:00] <ogra_> yes, the package conatining all kbd and console font related setup bits
[12:01] <ogra_> it uses keyboard-configuration, xkb-data and kbd in the backend
[12:03] <hrw> ok, but did you added ac100 specific keymap or not had to?
[12:04] <ogra_> why would i `
[12:04] <hrw> ok
[12:05] <hrw> I am wondering how to handle chromebook keyboard. default keymap under chromium has set of useful mappings (pgup/down home/end) which are missing under ubuntu
[12:59] <ppisati> ok, this is weird
[12:59] <ppisati> i've a package (oprofile) that was removed in precise
[12:59] <ppisati> but later was reintroduced
[12:59] <ppisati> but was only built for armel
[12:59] <ppisati> ?!?!
[13:00] <ppisati> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/oprofile/
[13:00] <ppisati> here is the Q version
[13:00] <ogra-cb> likely debian/control messed up
[13:01] <ppisati> showing that it was only built for i386/amd64 and armel
[13:01] <ppisati> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/oprofile/0.9.8-0ubuntu1
[13:01] <ogra-cb> check debian/control if it is "Architecture: any"
[13:01] <ogra-cb> (it should)
[13:02] <ppisati> nope
[13:02] <ppisati> Architecture: alpha amd64 arm armel hppa i386 ia64 mips mipsel powerpc ppc64 s390 sparc
[13:02] <ogra-cb> yeah. fix that then :)
[13:03] <ppisati> adding armhf should be enough
[13:03] <ogra-cb> well, it defines all available arches anyway
[13:03] <ogra-cb> so "Architecture: any" would be proper
[13:03] <ppisati> yeah, "any" is probably better
[13:51] <ppisati> actually it's more than this
[13:51] <ppisati> the importer fails
[13:51] <ppisati> http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/oprofile.html
[13:52] <ppisati> bah
[13:52] <janimo> ogra-cb, do you know what could have bringed and empty  /lib/modules/3.5.0-213-omap4/ on the nexus7?
[13:52] <janimo> I only noticed it now, no idea which package brought it
[13:52] <ppisati> weird
[13:53] <janimo> I suppose it's not via the default install. It only had a build symlink in it
[13:53] <ogra-cb> ppisati, well, bug 653312 shows some activity at least
[13:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 653312 in Ubuntu Distributed Development "Import fails with NoSuchRevision" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/653312
[13:53] <ogra-cb> ppisati, make some noise there :)
[13:53] <ogra-cb> janimo, headers most likely
[13:55] <ogra-cb> 3.1.10-8-nexus7  3.5.0-215-omap4
[13:55] <ogra-cb> ogra@nexus7:~$ dpkg -S /lib/modules/3.5.0-215-omap4
[13:55] <ogra-cb> linux-headers-3.5.0-215-omap4: /lib/modules/3.5.0-215-omap4
[13:55] <ogra-cb> yeah
[13:56] <ogra-cb> ogra@nexus7:~$ apt-cache show linux-headers-3.5.0-215-omap4|grep Task
[13:56] <ogra-cb> Task: ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-usb, edubuntu-desktop, edubuntu-usb
[16:26] <ogra-cb> ppisati, err, whats that about disabling ondemand +
[16:26] <ogra-cb> ?
[16:27] <ppisati> ondemand is broken in P
[16:27] <ppisati> or actually
[16:27] <ppisati> cpufreq was broken back then
[16:27] <ppisati> in fact the default scheduler is performance
[16:27] <ppisati> but there's one guy insisting in using ondemand
[16:28] <ogra-cb> cant be, i never had a simgle issue with that
[16:28] <ppisati> so i decided to swith it off completely
[16:28] <ppisati> precise?
[16:28] <ogra-cb> and thats an essential ubuntu default
[16:28] <ppisati> no, it's not
[16:28] <ogra-cb> natty to raring
[16:28] <ppisati> here is the original bug
[16:28] <ppisati> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-ti-omap4/+bug/971091
[16:28] <ogra-cb> ppisati, yes, we forcefully set it in userspace since 2008
[16:28] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 971091 in Linaro-Ubuntu "Pandaboard ES freezes with the default CPU scaling governor ondemand" [Medium,Fix committed]
[16:29] <ogra-cb> i know, i see the bug (you mention it in the merge request too)
[16:29] <ppisati> comment #16 says "AFAIK this should be solved in tilt-3.4, the problem was coming from frequency update code which should now be in good shape."
[16:29] <ogra-cb> if you disable it in kernel, did you test how the userspace bits behave if the module is nonexisting ?
[16:30] <ppisati> wait
[16:30] <ppisati> i'm not using on demand on my boards
[16:30] <ppisati> i mean, no one forces it
[16:30] <ogra-cb> afaik the only prob we ever had with ondemand vs perfocmance that was actiually traceable against cpufreq was when we switched to cpuidle for a short period in precise
[16:30] <ogra-cb> ppisati, see the init scripts
[16:32] <ogra-cb> specifically /etc/init.d/ondemand
[16:32] <ppisati> ogra-cb: wait
[16:33] <tassadar_> ogra-cb: will 12.10 ubuntu for nexus7 receive any updates or will you update only raring now?
[16:34] <ogra-cb> tassadar_, *i* wont touch quantal (but i also havent touched it since UDS)
[16:34] <ogra-cb> tassadar_, quantal is a very evil hacked up demo image that shoouldnt actually be used for more than demoing or looking at bugs
[16:35] <ogra-cb> raring recieves all the love
[16:37] <tassadar_> okay, thanks, one more annoying question: I would like ubuntu to be able to use some folder in /data/media/ as root folder and to be able to use .img file from flash drive as /. Is there a chance that modification like that would get into official ubuntu packages, if it is clean&properly done?
[16:38] <ogra-cb> yes, i think i told you about the work in grub that linaro is doing
[16:38] <ogra-cb> thats exactly using such a setup
[16:38] <ogra-cb> using grub for a boot menu, then lupin for mounting an img
[16:40] <ogra-cb> atter all i would still suggest to just use the recovery partition, apply two minot changes to the userspace and be done though
[16:40] <ogra-cb> *minor
[16:40] <tassadar_> I don't want to lose recovery :/
[16:40] <ogra-cb> (ita auper trivial)
[16:41] <ogra-cb> *its super ...
[16:41]  * ogra-cb cant see his keys in the dark
[16:42] <ogra-cb> you can even do dual boot with the current images with a minor modificatio
[16:42] <ogra-cb> n
[16:42] <tassadar_> ...continue...)
[16:42] <ogra-cb> ?
[16:42] <tassadar_> what exactly do you mean by minor modification
[16:43] <ogra-cb> well, flash bootimg to recovery and develop a patch for flash-kernel to respect that
[16:43] <ogra-cb> thats all dual boot needs
[16:44] <ogra-cb> ppisati, is there no way to fix it in kernel ?
[16:44] <tassadar_> well, now that kexec-hardboot support is in n7 kernel, I can just use files from /boot folder in Ubuntu's root, which is awesome
[16:44] <ogra-cb> instead of chopping out the option
[16:44] <ppisati> ogra-cb: the fix is "somewhere" is tilt-3.4
[16:45] <ppisati> ogra-cb: so it could be anywhere
[16:45] <ogra-cb> tassadar_, that wont save you, it will berak on the fist run of update-initramfs
[16:45] <tassadar_> yes, I'll have to remove the flash-kernel hook
[16:46] <ogra-cb> which you really want to keep in case someone uses i.e. an encrypted homedir
[16:47] <ogra-cb> tassadar_, if you want to avoid flashing, tra to have a file that exports FLASH_KERNEL_SKIP on boot
[16:47] <ogra-cb> (set it to something indeed)
[16:47] <ogra-cb> that should save you
[16:47] <ogra-cb> thats better than removing packaged files
[16:47] <tassadar_> yeah, saw that in the hooks, that will indeed be better
[16:47] <ogra-cb> (they have a tendency to re-appear) ;)
[16:50] <ppisati> ogra-cb: anyhow, if you try to use a governor that is not available, it's a noop
[16:50] <ogra-cb> k
[16:51] <ogra-cb> still, its an ubuntu default we dont offer
[16:51] <ogra-cb> also are we sure the thing wont overheat if it permanently runs at full speed ?
[16:51] <ppisati> either we do this, or we have to disable cpufreq
[16:52] <ogra-cb> which means full power anyway and bigger changes
[16:53] <ogra-cb> well, seems there is no way around unless we offer a backported kernel then :/
[16:54] <ppisati> ogra-cb: btw, i was pretty sure i asked what our builders were running, and i was told it was performance
[16:55] <ogra-cb> ppisati, ah, could be, i think they use ubuntu-core or something similar, that might not ship these userspace bits
[16:55] <ppisati> ogra-cb: so if they don't melt, i'm good with performance
[16:56] <ogra-cb> heh, k
[16:56] <ogra-cb> infinity, so whats your plan wrt nexus7 and flavours
[16:57] <infinity> Not sure I have one.
[16:57] <ogra-cb> currently an ubuntu desktop build takes 130-150min
[16:57] <ogra-cb> if we switch doing tarball post processing on nusakan i guess we could get to 90min or so
[16:58] <ogra-cb> i have definitive requests from kubuntu. lubuntu and edubuntu
[16:59] <ogra-cb> and would like to provide something for them by A2 time
[16:59] <infinity> We'll have to talk about it in a bit, then.
[16:59] <infinity> It may require bringing up another buildd.
[16:59] <ogra-cb> do you think there are chances for simply getting a second builder in place
[16:59] <ogra-cb> ah, snap
[17:13] <whatissixbynine> sup sup
[17:17] <whatissixbynine> I've got a galaxy s3 i9300 (exynos 4212 quad core version, 1gb ram, no lte). Would like to get this going for it.. any advice?
[17:19] <whatissixbynine> 4412 i meant, sorry!
[17:41] <whatissixbynine> :/
[18:01] <whatissixbynine> jeez guys
[18:02] <whatissixbynine> how ya gonna pick up momentum if no one is ever around ;_;
[18:05]  * ogra-cb sees 178 people in the channel
[18:06] <ogra-cb> whatissixbynine, usually people react to questions in this channel, you should probably ask yours :)
[18:07] <whatissixbynine> [09:18] <whatissixbynine> I've got a galaxy s3 i9300 (exynos 4212 quad core version, 1gb ram, no lte). Would like to get this going for it.. any advice?
[18:07] <ogra-cb> thats not a question is it ?
[18:08] <whatissixbynine> sure looks like it to me o.O
[18:08] <ogra-cb> what exactlyy do you want to know ?
[18:08] <whatissixbynine> its enough information to correctly ident it (was 4412 rather than 4212 cpu btw)
[18:08] <ogra-cb> we dont offer any images for phones
[18:09] <whatissixbynine> well, i don't see an ubuntu for general exynos, but i do see one for odroid-x
[18:09] <ogra-cb> so its up to you
[18:09] <ogra-cb> the userspace can surely run on that HW
[18:09] <whatissixbynine> there was a great project with the motorola, vids and such, calls and texts working
[18:09] <ogra-cb> not from here though
[18:10] <whatissixbynine> so your saying that no one bothered to pull the stuff in?
[18:10] <ogra-cb> there is a commercial project from canonical, if you mean ubuntu for android
[18:10] <whatissixbynine> hm
[18:10] <ogra-cb> of which there is nothing more available than these videos
[18:11] <xnox> publically that is.
[18:11] <ogra-cb> ubuntu-arm offrers current;y images for panda and beagleboard as well as the nexus7 tablet and the ac100 netbook
[18:11] <ogra-cb> if you want anything else you need to build it
[18:12] <ogra-cb> (oh, and i forgot highbank and armadaxp arches on server)
[18:12] <whatissixbynine> hm
[18:12] <whatissixbynine> yeah i figured i would have to build it, but i thought i could take something like the odroid and hack it towards this. anyway not sure how to start.
[18:12] <whatissixbynine> so
[18:13] <whatissixbynine> Would like to get this going for it.. any advice? where do i start?
[18:13] <whatissixbynine> I can get chroot working, and i don't like it. vnc sucks.
[18:13] <ogra-cb> well, userspace is usuallz always the same in ubuntu-arm
[18:13] <whatissixbynine> just its crashing is a dealbreaker
[18:14]  * xnox is not sure what "odroid" is that you are talking about.
[18:14] <whatissixbynine> the ubuntu for android is what I am looking for
[18:14] <ogra-cb> so you need to know how to modify the bootloader and shoudl provide your own kernel
[18:14] <whatissixbynine> http://www.hardkernel.com/renewal_2011/main.php
[18:14] <ogra-cb> ubuntu for android only exists in videos
[18:15] <whatissixbynine> ok, so the repos for the packages i want arn't open source or openly available?
[18:15] <ogra-cb> no idea if there are repos
[18:15] <ogra-cb> there is surely code, but yeah, thats not public yet
[18:15] <whatissixbynine> i dont really care if i got to build from scratch, i'm looking for a guide or howto or something
[18:15] <ogra-cb> well, there is nothing yet
[18:16] <whatissixbynine> well, how does one go about porting arm to a new device?
[18:16] <whatissixbynine> one that's NOT new
[18:16] <whatissixbynine> 99% of what i need driver wise should be in the odroid image
[18:16] <ogra-cb> well, userspace is usually ported :)
[18:16] <whatissixbynine> ?
[18:16] <whatissixbynine> no comprende
[18:16] <ogra-cb> as long as you have an ARMv7 device all of ubuntu will just run
[18:17] <whatissixbynine> yes it is
[18:17] <ogra-cb> what you need to get your specific device going is ehough insight into the bootloader and boot process and your own kernel build
[18:18] <whatissixbynine> give me a sec
[18:18] <ogra-cb> (as i said above a few lines)
[18:18] <whatissixbynine> i'm having trouble with ur head
[18:20] <ogra-cb> all of ubuntu is built and available for ARMv7 ... if you have a working setup you can just apt-get install whatever you want ... not different to any intel PC
[18:20] <ogra-cb> but whats not in ubuntu is any support for your device
[18:20] <ogra-cb> (bootloader and kernel)
[18:21] <ogra-cb> everything above bootloader and kernel level is already there and usable ...
[18:21] <ogra-cb> so to enable your device you need to get these two bits working
[18:26] <whatissixbynine> ok
[18:26] <whatissixbynine> that makes a bit more sense
[18:27] <whatissixbynine> when I chroot into it, and do the vnc type install, that does not create an acceptable kernel/bootloader?
[18:27] <whatissixbynine> that's actually a vm?
[18:27] <ogra-cb> no, that uses the android kernel and bootloader
[18:28] <ogra-cb> its a chroot, a VM emulates a machine
[18:28] <whatissixbynine> right, thought so
[18:28] <ogra-cb> the chroot just uses the android and runs an ubuntu rootfs inside
[18:28] <ogra-cb> whcih also means that various bits indeed wont work
[18:28] <whatissixbynine> got it
[18:37] <whatissixbynine> hm
[19:07] <Ethernin> yeah it would be great if you could just install full arm ubuntu with it's own kernel on android phones...
[19:07] <Ethernin> like the Nexus 7
[19:08] <whatissixbynine> yes
[19:14] <whatissixbynine> Ethernin, it really should be possible. very annoying that it's even this hard. even more annoying that there's little to no open projects for porting to new devices
[19:16] <RaYmAn> It's not hard at all. Getting basic linux/debian/ubuntu running on any arm device where you can flash your own kernel is trivial..Getting it running good is a whole other matter of course.
[19:20] <whatissixbynine> RaYmAn, ok now your talking sir!
[19:21] <whatissixbynine> i have ability to dual boot into secondary rom, so initially i would slam in there
[19:21] <whatissixbynine> running good may indeed take a lot more, but i would be happy to get a start on
[19:21] <whatissixbynine> currently downloading the android sammy source for my i9300 and gonna try to slam the linux image from odroid inside it
[19:22] <RaYmAn> usually the easiest is just a couple of steps. 1) get a standard rootfs that doesn't start anything graphical - disable plymouth.Put it on an sdcard 2) build a kernel with fbconsole enabled and point cmdline at sdcard. fbcon should give some info
[19:23] <whatissixbynine> not sure at all what i'm doing at this point, but i suppose i could update yall as we go
[19:24] <whatissixbynine> right
[19:33] <slangasek> hey, anyone here who could help with a gdb-multiarch issue?
[19:37] <slangasek> am trying to run gdb-multiarch on x86_64 against an Ubuntu armhf corefile + executable; I swear this used to work, but I never remember quite how to do it so I'm not sure if gdb has regressed or if I'm just missing the magic option