[02:54] <Telordya> hi?
[02:55] <Telordya> is there some kind of Launchpad admins here, I have a question?
[03:02] <thumper> Telordya: if you really need an admin, best thing to do is to ask a question on the launchpad project in launchpad itself
[03:02] <thumper> Telordya: what question do you have?
[03:02] <Telordya> ok
[03:03] <Telordya> I subsribed to a a bug about 1 year ago, but it doesn't affect me anymore, and I still receive email notifications, and I can't see in my settings how to stop it
[03:05] <Telordya> my subscribed bugs list is empty
[03:06] <Telordya> ho, I think I found some solution, from "I reported a bug, and now I'm getting spammed with emails. Why? How can I stop it?" in the FAQ
[03:11] <Telordya> I think I fixed it
[03:12] <Telordya> thanks anyway
[03:12] <thumper> :)
[03:13] <jeblair> Does launchpad run in Lucid?  (https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting mentions only up to Karmic)
[03:14] <spiv> I think most of the developers run it on Lucid now.
[03:16] <jeblair> thanks
[04:55] <ddecator> anyone else running into trouble with loggerhead again?
[04:55] <poolie> ddecator, are you getting 'please try again'?
[04:56] <ddecator> poolie: yup
[04:57]  * thumper slumps in his chair
[05:10] <ddecator> now it's working
[05:13] <thumper> it was somewhat overloaded
[06:43] <poolie> thumper, do you want to catch up sometime
[06:43] <poolie> if you're not flat out otday
[06:48] <lifeless> poolie: he's cooking dinner
[06:48] <poolie> mm i just realized it's late there
[06:48] <poolie> maybe another day
[06:50] <lifeless> he'll be back
[06:50] <lifeless> there are .eu folk to talk to too
[09:37] <dutchie> hi, I'm trying to download a bzr branch off launchpad onto my debian lenny server, but I can't since lenny only has bzr 1.5. is there a way round this without installing a newer bzr?
[09:44] <mrevell> Hey dutchie. I'm not sure. jelmer_, do you know the answer to dutchie's question? ^^^^^
[09:59] <jelmer_> dutchie: if the branch is in the 2a format you'll have to upgrade
[09:59] <jelmer_> dutchie: there are newer versions of bzr available in backports
[10:20] <lvh> Hey! I'm having a bit of an lp problem with a particular branch and I'm not sure if I should file a bug or not.
[10:20] <lvh> https://code.launchpad.net/~lvh/twisted/positioning-statistics
[10:20] <lvh> "Upgrade this branch" doesn't work like on other branches (warning goes away, but branch doesn't actually get upgraded)
[10:21] <lvh> Also, "View the branch content" doesn't actually work
[10:21] <lvh> see: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lvh/twisted/positioning-statistics/files
[10:21] <lvh> Link just in case I'm the only person who gets Internal Server Error there.
[10:22] <lifeless> has your branch pushed successfully?
[10:22] <lvh> Maybe. It's been a long time. How do I check/repair?
[10:22] <lifeless> if not, please ask a question on https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad about it
[10:22] <lifeless> lvh: bzr push :P
[10:22] <lvh> Well, obviously, but I don't have a checkout anymore.
[10:22] <lifeless> oh sorry
[10:22] <lifeless> I see the issue
[10:23] <lvh> Some people reported "it doesn't work" but told me that was because of the branch version
[10:23] <lifeless> uhm definitely ask a question, we probably need a losa to poke at it
[10:23] <lvh> I think it might just not work because the branch is in a really bad state
[10:23] <lifeless> humour me :)
[10:23] <lvh> I'll try a checkout myself first
[10:28] <lvh> Yeah, checkout doesn't work. bzr: ERROR: CHKInventoryRepository('http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~twisted-dev/twisted/trunk/.bzr/repository/') is not compatible with KnitPackRepository('http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lvh/twisted/positioning/.bzr/repository/') different serializers
[10:28] <lvh>
[10:32] <lvh> lifeless: Hi! https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/112183
[10:41] <wgrant> lvh: Interesting -- I just checked it out fine.
[10:42] <wgrant> Although it was into an existing repo seeded with lp:twisted, so maybe it didn't have to use the stacked-on branch.
[10:46] <wgrant> Indeed, attempting to branch somewhere without a repo downloads about the right volume of data, then dies with that error message.
[10:52] <lvh> wgrant: I thought I was checking it out with a repo
[10:57] <wgrant> lvh: I just created a clean repo, branched lp:twisted, then was able to branch both of your branches without trouble.
[10:58] <lvh> strange, that's what I thought I had done. Hang on.
[10:58] <lvh> Wait, should I try that first, or do bzr upgrade lp:... ?
[10:58] <lvh> I've been told bzr ought to do remote upgrades too. Inefficiently and slowly, but it should work.
[10:58] <wgrant> I suspect that an upgrade will fail, but I'm not sure.
[10:58] <wgrant> lifeless: Do you know?
[11:01] <lifeless> know what ?
[11:01] <wgrant> If an upgrade on a branch in this state will succeed.
[11:01] <lifeless> oh
[11:01] <lifeless> in theory it will work
[11:01] <wgrant> Or if one must first obtain a 2a copy then clobber.
[11:01] <lifeless> but in theory the button on the branch page would work too
[11:01] <lifeless> I'd get a local copy in 2a
[11:01] <lifeless> lftp in and delete the .bzr dir
[11:01] <lifeless> then push --use-existing-dir back to where it came from
[11:02] <lvh> Doing on-the-fly conversion from RemoteRepositoryFormat(_network_name='Bazaar RepositoryFormatKnitPack6RichRoot (bzr 1.9)\n') to RepositoryFormat2a().
[11:02] <lvh> Now it (appears to) work.
[11:03] <wgrant> This is a checkout into a pre-populated repo?
[11:06] <lvh> lvh@lagavulin:~/Development/twisted/positioning$ bzr upgrade .
[11:06] <lvh> bzr: ERROR: The branch format Meta directory format 1 is already at the most recent format.
[11:06] <lvh> wgrant: Nope, shiny new.
[11:06] <lvh> I take it that error is actually a good thing. But first, lunch!
[11:42] <lvh> lifeless: <lifeless> lftp in and delete the .bzr dir <lifeless> then push --use-existing-dir back to where it came from # sorry, do not grok
[11:42] <lvh> lifeless: Any pointers to relevant documentation?
[11:42] <lvh> I have both branches locally in 2a now.
[11:45] <lvh> I'm trying the remote upgrade now, fingers crossed, I guess :-)
[11:56] <fta> wgrant, bigjools: any update on the status of the ppa stat bug? i need to figure out if i still have enough users for some of my dailies.. so i can drop some of them to spare build resources
[11:57] <wgrant> Uni is killing me at the moment. It just needs someone to work out a quick hack to limit the script's resource usage until it has completed the log backlog.
[11:58] <bigjools> fta: there was a problem with resource usage on the backend; wgrant was going to sort out a temporary patch to make it do an initial run, and then we have more work to do to expose the data externally.
[11:58] <bigjools> ah so no he's not :)
[11:58] <wgrant> It's already exposed over the API, but UI is more difficult.
[11:58] <bigjools> oh you did that already?
[11:58] <wgrant> Yes.
[11:58] <bigjools> cool
[11:58] <wgrant> The API has been there for a couple of releases.
[11:59] <bigjools> I missed that for some reason then
[11:59] <fta> hm, any pointer where i should start?
[12:03] <wgrant> The easiest is to just hack lp.services.apachelogparser.base.parse_file to return early after parsing some number of lines.
[12:03] <wgrant> When rerun it will resume where it left off.
[12:04] <wgrant> I don't know what that number of lines should be.
[12:04] <wgrant> Nor do I have the resources at the moment to QA it.
[12:08]  * abogani waves
[12:08] <abogani> Are there some special tricks for build kernels on LP through PPA?
[12:09] <dutchie> jelmer_: backports for debian?
[12:09] <jelmer_> dutchie: yep
[12:09]  * dutchie googles
[12:10] <lvh> wgrant, lifeless: Great news everyone! The two branches have been fixed.
[12:10] <persia> abogani: Does seem strange that uploading essentially the same source with a different name ends up with http://paste.ubuntu.com/439296/
[12:10] <bigjools> abogani: no, just upload the package and wait for it to builder.  However please make sure it builds locally first (e.g. with pbuilder) before uploading
[12:10] <bigjools> s/builder/build/
[12:12] <abogani> bigjools: I have already did it. If you recall me where pbuilder store log I can show it to you! :-)
[12:13] <wgrant> abogani: There is a slight trick: the Ubuntu kernel build system always tries to grab the latest ABI data to confirm that an ABI version bump isn't required.
[12:13] <wgrant> This causes problems if it can't find the latest package.
[12:13] <persia> So one needs to hack around that to bootstrap a new kernel source package?
[12:13] <wgrant> I believe the build system has a 'PPA mode', however. This uses the git revision ID as the ABI, eliminating that check that often breaks for PPA builds.
[12:14] <wgrant> At least that's how it was 18 months ago; I've not built a custom kernel on Launchpad since then.
[12:14] <wgrant> Hm, but that log (which I just noticed now) suggests something different.
[12:15] <abogani> wgrant: I skip ABI check at all.
[12:31] <abogani> wgrant: Could I put an "set -x" at top of copy-modules file (which in turn is executed by kernel-wedge) to avoid than it will be killed?
[12:33] <wgrant> abogani: You should prevent it from taking that long.
[12:34] <abogani> wgrant: Sorry I can't do more than which I have already did. I'm already provide the minimum of requirements.
[12:44] <abogani> wgrant: Sorry if I bother you: Do you have some other suggestions?
[14:08] <jetienne> https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA/Uploading <- say "Simply follow the instructions in the Uploading packages to this PPA section of your PPA overview page." but where is this page ?
[14:13] <bilalakhtar> mrevell: Hi there! I thought that you were going to send me interview-style questions related to gnome-media-player. Thats what you said here a month ago.
[14:14] <mrevell> jetienne, If you've activated your PPA, there's a link to it on your Launchpad profile page, which you can find at https://launchpad.net/people/+me
[14:15] <mrevell> bilalakhtar, I'll re-send them now
[14:15] <jetienne> mrevell: do you know this link ?
[14:15] <jetienne> mrevell: or any hint on how to find it ?
[14:16] <bilalakhtar> mrevell: FYI, my e-mail address is<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[14:18] <mrevell> jetienne, If you've activated your PPA, follow the link I posted above and scroll down to the section of the page headed "Personal package archives". It's on the left of the page. Do you see it?
[14:19] <jetienne> mrevell: yep but no doc there. only "activating new ppa" and the ppa i activated
[14:20] <jetienne> i think i got it tho
[14:20] <jetienne> dput ppa:jerome-etienne/neoip neoip-get_0.0.1_source.changes <- the doc likely refere to this syntax
[14:20] <jetienne> aka no need to do a .dput.cf
[14:21] <mrevell> jetienne, So, you need to follow the link to the PPA you activated and on that page should be the info you need.
[14:22] <jetienne> mrevell: ok
[14:59] <jetienne> q. with ppa, how to disable building for lpia and amd64?
[15:04] <maxb> Does it really matter to you?
[15:05] <jetienne> maxb: i guess. so should i deduce this is not possible ?
[15:05] <maxb> Are you asking because you actually want to avoid those architectures specifically, or because your package is architecture-independent and so should only be built once for all architectures?
[15:06] <jetienne> maxb: im asking because compilation will fail on those arch
[15:07] <maxb> Interesting package you've got there! OK, in that case you probably want to declare "Architecture: i386" in your debian/control first stanza
[15:08] <jetienne> ok thanks
[15:08] <shtylman> any news on when launchpad build from branch will hit?
[15:08] <maxb> jetienne: oh, apologies I think I am misremembering. It actually goes in the binary stanzas, not the first stanza
[15:09] <jetienne> maxb: stanza = ?
[15:09] <maxb> jetienne: group of lines separated by a blank line
[15:09] <jetienne> maxb: ok thanks
[15:10] <bigjools> shtylman: Real Soon Now
[15:10] <shtylman> bigjools: :)
[15:10] <shtylman> I can't wait... very exciting
[15:10] <bigjools> shtylman: we need to get some firewall changes done etc and then we can let it loose
[15:10] <bigjools> abentley: did that i386-builder-only-thing land?
[15:11] <bigjools> and CP'ed even
[15:11] <jetienne> is there a way to do rsync with dput ? when uploading my package which is 22mbyte... this is long :)
[15:11] <bigjools> shtylman: yes, it's pretty exciting for us too, we've been working on it since last November
[15:11] <abentley> bigjools, I believe so.  rockstar was doing that.
[15:11] <bigjools> jetienne: no, we only have ftp right now.  sftp is coming soon but that won't help you either :)
[15:12] <jetienne> bigjools: ok :)
[15:12] <maxb> If the big part is the upstream source, then make sure you are using an .orig.tar.gz correctly
[15:13] <abentley> bigjools, see: "Launchpad Production Cherry Pick r9345" in canonical-launchpad
[15:13] <minjoo> Hello,
[15:14] <bigjools> abentley: roger, thanks
[15:14] <minjoo> Can I recover my PPA in Launchpad that I removed before?
[15:15] <bigjools> minjoo: no, the warning on the deletion page makes that very clear.
[15:16] <minjoo> but the PPA NAME in ppa list has been gray color
[15:17] <jetienne> q. should i change the version number at each upload ?
[15:18] <bigjools> minjoo: that's because it retains the history, but the files are all delete
[15:18] <bigjools> d
[15:18] <bigjools> jetienne: yes, that's mandatory
[15:18] <jetienne> File neoip-get_0.0.1.tar.gz already exists in neoip, but uploaded version has different contents. <- this is the msg i receive by email
[15:18] <minjoo> can i delete that history? bigjools ?
[15:18] <jetienne> bigjools: ok
[15:18] <bigjools> minjoo: no that's not possible yet
[15:19] <minjoo> bigjools: OMG, thanks.
[15:19] <jetienne> bigjools: can i delete an uploaded pacakge ?
[15:20] <jetienne> got it
[15:20] <bigjools> jetienne: yes
[15:20] <bigjools> jetienne: you should consider using an orig tarball instead of native tarballs, so you can avoid uploading as much data for each version
[15:21] <jetienne> bigjools: i dont understand what you mean. can you elaborate
[15:21] <maxb> jetienne: Also, even if you delete a package, you still can't/shouldn't upload the same version number again.
[15:21] <bigjools> jetienne: you should consult a packaging guide
[15:22] <jetienne> doing a modification to add the build date in the version number
[15:23] <bigjools> matsubara: woohoo, OOPS frequencies!
[15:23] <matsubara> bigjools, :-)
[15:23] <jetienne> the version is taken from changelog ?
[15:25] <bilalakhtar> mrevell: I have rent you the reply
[15:26] <mrevell> Thanks bilalakhtar
[15:33] <jetienne> dch -v 0.0.1build`date +%Y%m%d%H%m` -m
[15:43] <rockstar> bigjools, yes, it landed and was CP'ed as well.
[15:43] <bigjools> rockstar: coolio
[15:44] <rockstar> bigjools, this guy? http://goodjobbb.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/coolio_large.jpg
[15:46] <bigjools> rockstar: aieee
[15:47] <bilalakhtar> mrevell: Did you get the mail?
[15:47] <mrevell> Yes thanks bilalakhtar
[15:47] <bilalakhtar> I was concerned whether it went to spam or something
[15:53] <jetienne> for ppa, one can not use pkg-config in my build makefile ? how can i know the proper options ? hardcoded by hand ?
[15:55] <bilalakhtar> jetienne: You should add a build-dependency for pkg-config in your debian/control file
[15:55] <jetienne> bilalakhtar: oh ok
[16:11] <jetienne> q. is there a ccache on the building machines ?
[16:22] <jpds> jetienne: I don't think so.
[17:08] <Vixor> Hello, anyone around?
[17:10] <jetienne> q. i added a Build-Depends: in control.... but it doesnt seems to be honored by ppa... is it supposed to be?
[17:19] <jetienne> gpgv: Signature made Tue May 25 15:48:08 2010 UTC using DSA key ID 5877E4E4  gpgv: Can't check signature: public key not found..... but http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?search=0xE1698EF696AB4EC9CB312DFFDFAEB2805877E4E4&op=index shows it is available ... how come ?
[17:21] <Vixor> Can anyone help me??
[17:26] <jetienne> Vixor: there is a old saying. "dont ask to ask, just ask"
[17:26] <jetienne> Vixor: aka ask a question, and dont ask for help
[17:26] <jetienne> Vixor: not that i will answer the questions you may have :)
[17:28] <Vixor> hrhr
[17:28] <Vixor> hehe*
[17:28] <Vixor> can I pm you?
[17:30] <Vixor> I am new to Sikuli, and I am trying to make a macro
[17:30] <Vixor> that will observe a window
[17:30] <Vixor> wait till a particulare "text" pops up
[17:30] <Vixor> and when it does
[17:30] <Vixor> it pastes the "text" onto another window
[17:30] <Vixor> with a text prefixed to it
[17:30] <Vixor> for ex: source text is "going home"
[17:31] <Vixor> i prefix "i am " while pasting it on the target window
[17:31] <Vixor> output on target window: "i am going home"
[17:31] <jetienne> Vixor: another saying is "put a clear well explained message in single line", it improve the chance to get answer
[17:32] <Vixor> :|
[17:32] <Vixor> k lemme put it this way:
[17:32] <jetienne> q. apparently previous versions of my packages got deleted from my ppa, is this normal ?
[17:33] <Vixor> I want a macro that waits for specific text to show on 1 window, n it pastes that text to another window with something prefixed to it
[17:33] <bigjools> jetienne: yes they are automatically superseded
[17:35] <Vixor> are there more functions that the one listed on the left side bar?
[17:36] <jetienne> bigjools: is there a way i could reproduce the way building machine are building my package. i still got errors, and each iteration÷attempts costs me 20min.... due to upload time and delay.... rather painfull... if i could test on my local box it would be more efficient
[17:38] <jetienne> ok booting a vm with a fresh install :)
[17:40] <Vixor> ahh F made me type
[17:40] <Vixor> n now quits
[17:48] <alkisg> Hi, I'm not sure if it's a packaging problem or a launchpad problem, but I'm getting the following build error on a package (LTSP) which was previously building OK:
[17:48] <alkisg> dpkg-shlibdeps: error: couldn't find library libpopt.so.0 needed by debian/ltsp-client-core/usr/bin/getltscfg (ELF format: 'elf32-i386'; RPATH: '').
[17:48] <alkisg> It only errored in the amd64 build, while the i386 build was fine. Here's the full log:
[17:48] <alkisg> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/49075644/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.ltsp_5.2.1-0ubuntu10~ppa0-bzr1745_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[17:53] <geser> alkisg: /usr/bin/getltscfg is a 32bit binary while the build is for amd64. why doesn't this binary get rebuild for 64bit?
[17:54] <alkisg> I've no idea why. It was building fine the last years up to my last upload 2 weeks ago
[17:55] <alkisg> There hasn't been any change in the rules or the makefiles since the last upload, so I'm puzzled
[17:58] <geser> also no upstream changes not cleaning the file correctly (so it gets rebuild properly)?
[17:59] <alkisg> geser: No, the only changes were 10 lines I changed in a bash script which is unrelated to the build process
[17:59] <geser> hmm
[18:03] <alkisg> Here's the build log of the previous, successful build (2010-05-12): http://launchpadlibrarian.net/48350229/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.ltsp_5.2.1-0ubuntu10~ppa0-bzr1743_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
[18:11] <geser> alkisg: when you look at client/getltscfg/ in the .tar.gz for bzr1745 you see that it's not cleaned
[18:11] <alkisg> Ugh, then it would be a problem in the cleaning script
[18:11] <geser> and therefore make thinks the binary is still uptodate and doesn't rebuild it (make[1]: `getltscfg' is up to date.)
[18:11] <alkisg> geser: thank you, I'll have a look
[18:12] <alkisg> Sorry for the noise :)
[18:29] <jetienne> houray i got a begining of compilation on ppa :)
[18:57] <shtylman> is there a guide on creating source package recipies?
[19:52] <jetienne> shtylman: search for "ubuntu packaging guide"
[19:55] <geser> !packaging guide
[19:55] <geser> shtylman: ^^ there
[19:57] <shtylman> geser: jetienne: I was actually looking for: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DailyBuilds/BzrBuilder but thanks
[20:40] <cjohnston> james_w: are you available for a PM?
[20:41] <james_w> yep
[21:45] <alkisg> What happens if I uploaded a newer package version before an older one starts building? Does the new version "cancel" the building of the older one? Is there any way to cancel a build if I saw something wrong in my code?
[21:47] <BlackZ> alkisg: are you referring to PPA?
[21:48] <geser> alkisg: if the old version didn't start yet the new upload will supersede it, but once it got started it will go on (and the result discarded (IIRC))
[21:49] <geser> there is no way to cancel a currently running build
[21:49] <alkisg> BlackZ: yes, sorry I wasn't clear
[21:49] <alkisg> geser: that's perfect, thank you
[21:53] <maxb> The superseded builds only get marked as such when they reach the head of the queue, by the way, so don't expect them to be removed from the build queue before that
[22:02] <fta> anyone for a quick ppa quota boost? https://edge.launchpad.net/~chromium-daily/+archive/stable/+packages   or should i file a question?
[23:25] <thumper> fta: file a question
[23:26] <fta> thumper, https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/112255
[23:26] <mthaddon> fta: so 10G?
[23:27] <mthaddon> that's been done
[23:28] <fta> thanks


[13:46] <stefandebacker> does anyone has experience with fat clients on edubuntu?
[15:33] <alkisg> stefandebacker: yes, any problems?
[15:33] <stefandebacker> not yet, i was just wondering if it works ok. Now I use self made thin clients (pentium 1 an 2 with 16 - 32 mb ram and no hard disk) with ubuntu
[15:34] <alkisg> Well, for LTSP thin client you'll need at least 64MB ram
[15:34] <stefandebacker> but because i read that multimedia works on fat clients, i was wondering
[15:34] <alkisg> And for fat clients, probably more than 500 MB
[15:34] <alkisg> (how are you even booting those thin clients? with windows 95?!)
[15:35] <stefandebacker> nog linux
[15:35] <stefandebacker> with a floppy :-D
[15:35] <stefandebacker> I really works quiet well
[15:35] <alkisg> which linux?
[15:36] <stefandebacker> hum, i have to check, its something i downloaded specially for turning a old pc into a thin client
[15:36] <alkisg> please do, I wonder what can still be used with 16mb except for deli linux
[15:37] <stefandebacker> well this works for sure, I use it at a school
[15:37] <stefandebacker> I have a quad core with 4 GB RAM and 500 GB hard disk as server
[15:37] <alkisg> ok, if it's easy, please check and tell me which distro that is
[15:38] <stefandebacker> and then the thin clients are all old pc's with only a videocard, floppy and network
[15:38] <stefandebacker> booting from this diskette
[15:38] <stefandebacker> we tested it with 40 clients, and it still works quiet well
[15:39] <stefandebacker> of course not for youtube, but firefox and openoffice are much better than with windows 98se on these machines
[15:40] <stefandebacker> but do you have experience with fat clients?
[15:41] <alkisg> Yes
[15:41] <alkisg> They work fine, like if they had local ubuntu
[15:41] <alkisg> And with gigabit network they're even faster
[15:41] <alkisg> E.g. a lab of mine boots in 13 secs as fat clients, and in 50 normally
[15:41] <stefandebacker> so you install a local ubuntu on it
[15:42] <alkisg> No, I had that from before installing fat clients, and I'm just doing a comparison
[15:43] <alkisg> They don't need to have local disks
[15:43] <stefandebacker> ah
[15:43] <stefandebacker> that's what i want
[15:43] <stefandebacker> and does youtube work?
[15:44] <alkisg> Youtube , google earth, games etc everything runs localy
[15:44] <alkisg> So, like if they were running locally (because that's what they do) :)
[15:44] <stefandebacker> but without hard disk
[15:44] <alkisg> Yes
[15:45] <alkisg> Fat clients == a networked disk and also authentication on the ltsp server, nothing more
[15:45] <stefandebacker> wich version of edubuntu do you use?
[15:45] <alkisg> ubuntu 10.04 on the server, and usually edubuntu 10.04 on the client disk
[15:45] <alkisg> (the virtual disk, the chroot, one for all clients)
[15:45] <stefandebacker> ah
[15:45] <stefandebacker> tried that, but that wouldn't work with old hardware
[15:46] <alkisg> Yes, fat clients == new hardware
[15:46] <alkisg> Otherwise it's not so fat :)
[15:46] <stefandebacker> it did with new hardware, but not with old thin clients
[15:46] <alkisg> I'm using mixed labs
[15:46] <stefandebacker> 2 servers?
[15:46] <alkisg> Everything with < 300 mb ram boots as thin, and with > 300 mb ram as fat
[15:46] <alkisg> No, on the same server, with the same chroot
[15:46] <stefandebacker> that's my plan to
[15:46] <stefandebacker> hum
[15:46] <alkisg> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
[15:47] <alkisg> That should get you started, and ask whatever you can't get to work there
[15:47] <stefandebacker> what is your oldest thin client?
[15:50] <alkisg> AMD K6 300 MHz
[15:50] <stefandebacker> i found the diskette. Its http://www.rom-o-matic.net
[15:50] <alkisg> stefandebacker: that isn't a linux version
[15:50] <stefandebacker> there you can download the image for your network card
[15:50] <stefandebacker> no?
[15:50] <alkisg> No. I already use that.
[15:50] <alkisg> You can't boot 16 MB clients with current ubuntu versions
[15:51] <alkisg> Not even 32MB clients
[15:51] <stefandebacker> not with current
[15:51] <alkisg> gpxe (that in rom-o-matic) is just a network boot loader
[15:51] <stefandebacker> I had to use 7.10
[15:51] <alkisg> It's not an OS
[15:51] <alkisg> I don't think 7.10 works with 16 RAM either
[15:51] <stefandebacker> it does
[15:51] <alkisg> If I remember correctly, 64MB were needed back then too.
[15:51] <stefandebacker> it works here
[15:51] <alkisg> Maybe your clients have 64MB RAM?
[15:52] <stefandebacker> no
[15:52] <stefandebacker> clients 16 - 32 mb
[15:52] <alkisg> Are you using LTSP with 7.10?
[15:52] <stefandebacker> server 4 GB
[15:52] <stefandebacker> yes
[15:52] <alkisg> What ltsp version is that? dpkg -l ltsp-server
[15:53] <stefandebacker> 5.0.40
[15:53] <stefandebacker> but it doesn't support new hardware
[15:54] <alkisg> I tried booting clients with < 64MB RAM with Ubuntu 7.10, and it wasn't possible, so I wonder why it works for you...
[15:54] <alkisg> (actually, the kernel needs at least 48MB)
[15:54] <alkisg> So you must be using something else, but I can't imaging what
[15:54] <stefandebacker> the booting is rather slow (2 - 3 minutes) but after that it works good enough
[15:55] <stefandebacker> i started from the edubuntu 7.10
[15:55] <alkisg> With 48MB I was getting kernel panic, they wouldn't boot
[15:55] <alkisg> I started with edubuntu 7.04...
[15:56] <alkisg> I could get them to boot with other methods, e.g. deli linux, thinclientos etc, but not with LTSP 5 (that in edubuntu 7.04)
[15:56] <stefandebacker> I also seem to remember getting a kernel pannick
[15:56] <stefandebacker> i changed something in the ltsp.conf i think
[15:56] <alkisg> NBD_SWAP=true, but that's not enough
[15:57] <alkisg> They still wouldn't boot for me with anything less than 64MB RAM
[15:57] <alkisg> (both in 7.04, 7.10, 8.04, 8.10, 9.04, 9.10 and 10.04)
[15:57] <alkisg> Anyway
[16:00] <stefandebacker> edubuntu server 7.10 i368 is the oldest i have, so it had to have been this one
[16:00] <stefandebacker> ah i know
[16:00] <stefandebacker> i compiled it with "old hardware" setting
[16:01] <alkisg> Compiled what? The chroot kernel?
[16:01] <stefandebacker> no the image of the thin client
[16:02] <alkisg> There's no such option in LTSP 5
[16:02] <alkisg> Maybe you somehow used LTSP 4?
[16:02] <stefandebacker> it's a long time ago,
[16:02] <alkisg> If it really works with LTSP 5, it's a major success
[16:02] <alkisg> I've never heard anyone doing that
[16:02] <stefandebacker> it must have been something
[16:03] <alkisg> 64MB RAM is the lowest client limit - nowadays people even suggest 256 MB
[16:03] <alkisg> *as the lower limit
[16:03] <stefandebacker> but I am sorry i don't rember what
[16:03] <highvoltage> heh, last night stgraber complained that his thin client only has 512 MB :)
[16:03] <alkisg> So if you were able to do it with LTSP 5, we should put your method upstream, for others to benefit from it :)
[16:04] <stefandebacker> maybe I started with 6.06 and upgraded it to 7.10 (I found my installation log of 2007)
[16:04] <alkisg> stefandebacker: is it possible to upload your /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp directory somewhere?
[16:04] <alkisg> The kernels there are the most important thing to manage booting with 16 RAM
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1696312 2007-10-15 03:35 vmlinuz-2.6.22-14-386
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root<PHONE_NUMBER>-10-15 03:35 System.map-2.6.22-14-386
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root   75391 2007-10-15 03:35 config-2.6.22-14-386
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root<PHONE_NUMBER>-10-15 03:35 abi-2.6.22-14-386
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1904248 2008-04-10 18:51 vmlinuz-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root<PHONE_NUMBER>-04-10 18:51 System.map-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root   79964 2008-04-10 18:51 config-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root<PHONE_NUMBER>-04-10 18:51 abi-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -r--r--r-- 1 root root 6132278 2010-01-29 19:59 nbi.img-2.6.22-14-386
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4438038 2010-01-29 19:59 initrd.img-2.6.22-14-386.bak
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4438033 2010-01-29 20:00 initrd.img-2.6.22-14-386
[16:07] <stefandebacker> drwxr-xr-x 3 root root    4096 2010-01-29 20:00 ../
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root     369 2010-01-30 16:44 lts.conf
[16:07] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4518675 2010-03-04 18:17 initrd.img-2.6.24-16-generic.bak
[16:08] <stefandebacker> -r--r--r-- 1 root root 6417787 2010-03-04 18:17 nbi.img-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:08] <stefandebacker> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root      25 2010-03-04 18:17 vmlinuz -> vmlinuz-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:08] <stefandebacker> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root      25 2010-03-04 18:17 nbi.img -> nbi.img-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:08] <stefandebacker> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4518671 2010-03-04 18:17 initrd.img-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:08] <stefandebacker> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root      28 2010-03-04 18:17 initrd.img -> initrd.img-2.6.24-16-generic
[16:08] <stefandebacker> can this help?
[16:09] <highvoltage> a kernel is also a dangerous thing to have chmod 777'd :)
[16:09] <stefandebacker> I will change it
[16:12] <alkisg> Hmm, no, it doesn't really help (we'd need to boot it to see), it just says it's a recent kernel which shouldn't be able to boot with anything less than 64 mb :-/
[16:12] <alkisg> So I've no idea how it's possible to boot that with 16mb..
[16:12] <alkisg> highvoltage: 777 are the symlinks only
[16:14] <highvoltage> alkisg: ah
[16:15] <alkisg> stefandebacker: maybe that "16 MB" that you see is the VideoRAM number?
[16:15] <stefandebacker> no
[16:15] <stefandebacker> sure not
[16:16] <stefandebacker> i put in the rams myself
[16:16] <stefandebacker> the videocard has 2 mb ram
[16:16] <alkisg> Really, really strange. I wish I could see for myself how you managed to do it.
[16:17] <stefandebacker> hihi
[16:17] <alkisg> :)
[16:17] <stefandebacker> i know that i started from an old edubuntu server, because the new ones didn't work on the old software
[16:18] <stefandebacker> but i wasn't able to make one that would support old and new hardware
[16:18] <stefandebacker> i tried it. And the old server wouldn't boot new thin clients
[16:19] <stefandebacker> and the new edubuntu wouldn't boot the old ones
[16:21] <stefandebacker> i did change the /etc/apt/sources.lst
[16:23] <stefandebacker> and added this:
[16:23] <stefandebacker> deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ gutsy  main restricted multiverse universe
[16:23] <stefandebacker> deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ gutsy-security  main restricted multiverse universe
[16:23] <stefandebacker> deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ gutsy-updates  main restricted multiverse universe
[16:23] <stefandebacker> before update and upgrade
[16:24] <stefandebacker> according to my personal log: this is the cd I downloaded http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/edubuntu/gutsy/
[16:25] <alkisg> OK, all that sounds right, I can't tell you how to fix something that wasn't supposed to be working on the first place :D
[16:25] <alkisg> I.e. I don't know of *any* (ed)ubuntu version that would boot with 16 RAM
[16:25] <alkisg> ...and yes, older kernels don't see new hardware
[16:26] <alkisg> So if I were you I wouldn't even try to upgrade anything, ever :D Those clients won't boot with anything recent
[16:26] <alkisg> For new clients, with > 300 MB RAM etc, ok, you can boot them as fat clients
[16:27] <stefandebacker> think I know what happened
[16:27] <stefandebacker> it was the network card
[16:27] <stefandebacker> that gave me the kernel pannick
[16:28] <stefandebacker> and I also got it with a sertain video card
[16:32] <stefandebacker> a SiS card I think it was
[16:44] <alkisg> Sure, network and graphics cards can cause kernel panics, but that wasn't my problem, I tried with a very big number of clients. Booting with any less than 64 MB just wasn't possible for me.
[16:51] <stefandebacker> don't worry about it, I think I am the only one in belgium anyway, that uses these old computers till the bitter end,
[16:52] <stefandebacker> there should be a low against people who run a computer on less than 64mb anyway
[16:52]  * alkisg has 2-3 labs here with 32mb, that's why he was interested..
[16:52] <alkisg> They work with win95 currently
[16:52] <stefandebacker> ola
[16:53] <stefandebacker> that's really old
[16:53] <alkisg> Well, with 32mb you can't boot windows 2000...
[16:53] <stefandebacker> i rather have linux
[16:53] <alkisg> (don't tell me you also booted XP with 16mb?! :D)
[16:53] <stefandebacker> no
[16:54] <alkisg> Sure, me too, but no linux works with such low ram
[16:54] <stefandebacker> well i am surely glad it does here
[16:55] <alkisg> (that's why I was asking so many questions, to see if it was something I could replicate)
[16:56] <stefandebacker> maybe you can try starting from edubuntu 6
[16:56] <alkisg> I don't think so, ogra straggled to lower the LTSP 5 RAM limit to 64MB
[16:56] <alkisg> So it was *higher* before gutsy
[16:57] <alkisg> I've heard LTSP 4.2 working with 32MB RAM, but noone installs this anymore, it's been unmaintained for ages
[16:57] <stefandebacker> can i see my version of ltsp somewhere?
[16:58] <alkisg> dpkg -l ltsp-server, the one above
[16:58] <alkisg> So you have 5.0.40
[16:58] <stefandebacker> ah
[16:58] <stefandebacker> 5
[16:58] <stefandebacker> bzr20080212-0ubuntu7
[16:59] <stefandebacker> Basic LTSP server environment
[16:59] <alkisg> The only thing that would help is a zip of your /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386 directory, to try to see if actually that kernels boots with 16 mb
[16:59] <alkisg> (or if you are not even using that kernel, and are booting with some other method)
[16:59] <stefandebacker> does this hold any passwords?
[16:59] <alkisg> No
[16:59] <stefandebacker> youre 100% sure its absolutely safe?
[16:59] <alkisg> You can skip lts.conf if you don't want to share it (or check yourself if you wrote something there)
[17:00] <alkisg> Yes, the kernel and the initramfs don't have anything from the user
[17:00] <alkisg> Only lts.conf may contain passwords, if you put them there
[17:02] <stefandebacker> one moment
[17:04] <stefandebacker> where do you want it?
[17:18] <Utrinqueparatus> does anyone have any experience with using edubuntu with a touchscreen?
[17:26] <alkisg> stefandebacker: anywhere would do, e.g. rapidshare, and PM me with the link
[17:29] <Utrinqueparatus> i didnt realise anyone used rapidshare since their crazy rapidpoints scheme
[17:58] <alkisg> Feel free to use whatever you want
[17:59] <alkisg> Ah sorry I thought that was stefandebacker, ignore the answer
[18:00] <Utrinqueparatus> its ok was just sticking my oar in anyway
[18:24] <Utrinqueparatus> what packages in edubuntu are best aimed at pre-school users?