[00:30] <CIA-3> debian-installer: ogra * r1272 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 20081029ubuntu95
[06:20] <Vadtec> how do you get the graphical installer for 9.10 into "expert" mode? ive tried expert and priority=low in the boot options, but it doesnt seem to work
[09:44] <ev> gah, thanks for that fix superm1.
[09:47] <ara> ev, morning
[09:47] <ev> good morning ara
[09:48] <ara> ev, do you happen to remember a bug in ubiquity that prevented people to change the destination of grub from the drop down?
[09:48] <ev> yes, one second
[09:48] <ev> bug 539204
[09:49] <ara> ev, thanks, there are a lot of duplicates. I will mark them as dup
[09:49] <ev> ara: cool, thanks
[09:50] <ev> if they're using a version of ubiquity newer than 2.2.6, then it's a new bug.
[09:51] <ev> but I suspect they're all just using old CDs
[10:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: evand * r4039 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/frontend/gtk_ui.py):
[10:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: Move the install window color setting code closer to when the window
[10:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: is shown, so the colors don't get reset before then.
[11:16] <CIA-3> ubiquity: evand * r4040 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/components/ubi-language.py):
[11:16] <CIA-3> ubiquity: Fix alpha warning being shown all the time with recent changes to
[11:16] <CIA-3> ubiquity: the KDE frontend.
[11:39] <ev> shtylman: I've filed bug 556376 per our discussion last week.
[11:42] <shtylman> ev: k.. I will check that out ... any ideas on the matter?
[11:42] <shtylman> how does the gtk frontend do the event loop without eating 100% cpu?
[11:44] <ev> shtylman: it runs a gtk mainloop without doing anything fancy (just calls gtk.main)
[11:44] <shtylman> so the main loop runs in a separate thread?
[11:48] <ev> no, see ubiquity/frontend/gtk_ui.py:499
[11:48] <ev> if you're noticing the threads_init call at the top of gtk_ui, that's for webkit
[11:55] <cjwatson> any sane event loop (and surely Qt's is in this category, I'd be astonished if it weren't) only uses the CPU when an event is actually received
[11:55] <cjwatson> the alternative is called "busy-waiting" but I wouldn't expect Qt to do that
[11:59] <cjwatson> if it did, then every process on a KDE system would be sitting there spinning all the time; performance would go through the floor, and power consumption would go through the ceiling
[12:38] <ara> ev, cjwatson: is anybody having a look to bug 539463?
[12:49] <cjwatson> ara: in future could you file new reports rather than attaching information to existing ones, please?
[12:50] <cjwatson> the problem with attaching information to existing ones is that often the same symptom is caused by multiple different problems
[12:50] <ara> cjwatson, sure, will do
[12:50] <cjwatson> ara: indeed, your problem is definitely different from that of the original report
[12:51] <cjwatson> er
[12:51] <cjwatson> ara: so if you could file a new bug now for your problem, I'd appreciate it
[12:51] <ara> cjwatson, ok, I'll get back to you
[12:51] <CIA-3> tzsetup: evand * r515 tzsetup/ (debian/changelog tzsetup):
[12:51] <CIA-3> tzsetup: Use LC_ALL=C when running sed over the geoip data, otherwise it
[12:51] <CIA-3> tzsetup: fails on UTF-8 text.
[12:51] <ev> ^ thanks ara, noticed that from your debug log
[12:52] <cjwatson> ara: this also means you can use apport to attach all the log files :)
[12:53] <ara> cjwatson, does ubuntu-bug ubiquity attach the correct logs?
[12:53] <cjwatson> yes
[12:58] <ara> cjwatson, bug 556436
[13:19] <CIA-3> tzsetup: evand * r516 tzsetup/debian/changelog: releasing version 1:0.26ubuntu6
[13:25] <CIA-3> grub-installer: cjwatson * r853 ubuntu/ (debian/changelog grub-installer):
[13:25] <CIA-3> grub-installer: 'nosplash' doesn't work because it isn't passed through by user-params.
[13:25] <CIA-3> grub-installer: Use debian-installer/splash=false for this behaviour instead
[13:25] <CIA-3> grub-installer: (LP: #548954).
[13:26] <CIA-3> grub-installer: cjwatson * r854 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 1.49ubuntu11
[14:16] <ev> (14:15:44) kwwii: just wanted you to know that I am working on the time zone map this afternoon
[14:16] <ev> (14:15:54) kwwii: so it will be ready tonight or tomorrow morning
[14:16] <ev> ^ for what it's worth
[14:33] <rgreening> hey ev
[14:33] <ev> hi
[14:34] <rgreening> ev: wrt bug 484252, can we disable format button in UI if a partition is selected and enable if it's not a partition? Or is there something which would preclude this case
[14:35] <ev> rgreening: well, that would horrendously break if they had written just a filesystem to the disk
[14:35] <ev> rgreening: I'm going to try to get some design team consultation on this
[14:36] <rgreening> yeah, the "select" a partition/disk and expecting it to be the only thing formatted seems pretty reasonable ot expect in the way the UI works today.. but its not the behaviour we have programmed. so we either need to change the UI or the behaviour.
[14:37] <ev> which is why I suggested the button label being changed to "wipe disk" which is pretty clear, in my opinion
[14:38] <ev> as much as possible, I really don't want to expose partitioning to users, especially in a tool with such a simple set of use cases as usb-creator
[14:38] <persia> ev: Do you see any reason not to process bug #460298 as an SRU?
[14:39] <ev> persia: indeed, I pulled up the backports wiki page this morning and then got caught up in other things
[14:39] <rgreening> hey persia
[14:39] <persia> Cool.  It's currently being discussed in the ubuntu-ja team meeting, and I just wanted to make sure you knew about it (as the nomination hadn't been approved).
[14:39] <ev> I'd like to shove an entire new version of usb-creator in karmic, given that it's mostly bug fixes
[14:39] <persia> hey rgreening.
[14:40] <rgreening> ev: we'd have to revert the UDisks for karmic right?
[14:41] <ev> yeah, I failed to consider that
[14:41] <ev> we'd have to create a branch that did s/DeviceKit/UDisks/
[14:42] <rgreening> ya. that should work...
[14:42] <rgreening> either that or we simply backport individual fixes/patches based on specific commits
[14:43] <rgreening> I leave that for you to decide. just let me know if the kde UI needs changes in the process.
[14:48] <cr3> I have a preseed to install on /dev/sda, the problem is that when there's a card reader the desktop image detects it as /dev/sdb but the alternate image detects it as /dev/sda
[14:49] <cjwatson> you need to make it deal with it dynamically
[14:49] <cjwatson> partman/early_command may be helpful
[14:51] <cr3> cjwatson: if I understand correctly, from the early_command script, I need to preseed the value of partman-auto/disk. if so, what's the command to set a d-i preseed value?
[14:59] <cjwatson> cr3: debconf-set
[14:59] <cjwatson> cr3: or maybe better, echo 'd-i ...' | debconf-set-selections
[15:00] <cjwatson> oh, wait, damn, I bet that doesn't work in that context
[15:00] <cjwatson> sorry, doing three things at once
[15:00] <cjwatson> . /usr/share/debconf/confmodule; ...; db_set partman-auto/disk ...
[15:00] <cjwatson> more likely to work
[15:04] <davmor2> ev: what happened to the web pic on the slides again?
[15:05] <cr3> cjwatson: thanks, I'm glad I asked :)
[15:05] <CIA-3> usb-creator: evand * r300 usb-creator/ (5 files in 4 dirs):
[15:05] <CIA-3> usb-creator: Change the format button's label to 'Erase Disk' as it wipes the
[15:05] <CIA-3> usb-creator: entire disk, rather than an individual partition.
[15:05] <ev> davmor2: eh?
[15:06] <davmor2> ev: on this mornings iso on wubi install in i386 there is no graphic on the web slide just an image marker
[15:06] <CIA-3> usb-creator: evand * r301 usb-creator/debian/changelog: Add LP bug reference to previous commit.
[15:07] <ev> davmor2: what distribution?
[15:07] <davmor2> Ubuntu
[15:07] <davmor2> 10.04
[15:07] <ev> not netbook edition or anything crazy like that?
[15:07] <davmor2> no
[15:08] <ev> very odd, I definitely didn't notice that with today's CDs
[15:09] <davmor2> ev: I'll do a side-by-side install after and double check for you
[15:09] <ev> thanks
[15:10] <superm1> i noticed the same thing on a une disk yesterday
[15:11] <ev> weird, it just points at /usr/share/pixmaps/firefox.png
[15:12] <superm1> er does it? <img class="icon" src="/usr/lib/firefox-3.6/icons/mozicon128.png" alt="" />
[15:12] <ev> ah, I'm looking at trunk
[15:12] <ev> right, I see why this is failing then :)
[15:13] <davmor2> :D
[15:14] <ev> davmor2: bug 554976 covers this as a UI freeze exception
[15:15] <superm1> ev, some time a while back we discussed some usability improvements to usb-creator to not be offering the full disk device when using an ISO.  any chance you think you're still going to make lucid with that?
[15:16] <ev> superm1: indeed, I have our discussion saved as a document, but it's not going to make lucid.  I've disabled the format warning entirely anticipating this would happen.
[15:16] <superm1> ah too bad :(
[15:22] <ev> yeah, definitely.  I'll endeavor to get a work item for fixing that in Maverick.
[15:23] <superm1> ok. one more question on usb-creator then.  are the windows builds actually happening?  in any sort of discoverable way?
[15:25] <ev> manually
[15:25] <ev> I have a TODO item for making sure the windows frontend is working, but it's growing cobwebs
[15:27] <superm1> when you get around to checking it, will the builds get published somewhere easy to find?
[15:28] <ev> well, they currently go in http://people.canonical.com/~evand/usb-creator/lucid/ - is that not discoverable?
[15:28] <ev> or do you mean for end users?
[15:31] <superm1> yeah i mean end users
[15:31] <davmor2> ev: why does resizing partition not move off 0% until it's completed?
[15:32] <superm1> i had no idea on that URL myself either and was having a hard time w/ google, i'll bookmark that
[15:35] <cjwatson> davmor2: because the underlying tool doesn't provide progress feedback
[15:35] <cjwatson> or at least not in a form that we can easily deal with
[15:36] <davmor2> cjwatson: would it not be better to just display the text "this might take a while" and remove the bar?
[15:40] <cjwatson> I'd rather fix it to deal with the resize feedback somehow; but neither answer is actually trivial
[15:40] <cjwatson> there is *no such thing* in the debconf protocol as an indeterminate progress bar
[15:40] <cjwatson> so right now it is not actually possible to remove the bar in any sensible way
[15:49] <davmor2> ev, cjwatson: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/556373  have you guys seen this?
[15:49] <ev> yes, I changed the title
[15:49] <ev> haven't gotten to it yet though
[15:50] <ev> trying to figure out why the kde frontend is having difficulties on the partitioning page
[15:51] <davmor2> ev: cool
[16:00] <shtylman> ev: is the partitioning page returning the right result?
[16:01] <ev> shtylman: can you elaborate on what you mean?  The bug I'm investigating appears to be fallout from r4023
[16:03]  * shtylman tackes a look
[16:04] <ev> ah, think I've got it
[16:04] <shtylman> what was the problem?
[16:20] <ev> shtylman: missing definitions
[16:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: evand * r4041 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/frontend/kde_ui.py):
[16:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: Define allowed_change_step in the KDE frontend to fix the manual
[16:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: partitioner buttons not working (LP: #556180).
[16:28] <cjwatson> hah, good catch
[16:28] <cjwatson> sorry about that, I was unwisely assuming some degree of parity ...
[16:49] <ev> quite okay, I had assumed the same parity which ate up quite a bit of time while I wasn't checking kde_ui.py :)
[16:52] <CIA-3> ubiquity: evand * r4043 ubiquity/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/components/ubi-language.py):
[16:52] <CIA-3> ubiquity: Do not show the 'ready to install' or alpha warning text in the KDE
[16:52] <CIA-3> ubiquity: frontend when in oem-config mode (LP: #556577).
[17:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: evand * r4044 ubiquity/ (10 files in 2 dirs):
[17:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: Update timezone images to cover changes to the Russian timezones and
[17:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: make further adjustments around UTC+5, UTC+5.5, and UTC+7
[17:23] <CIA-3> ubiquity: (LP: #368060).
[17:29] <CIA-3> ubiquity: evand * r4045 ubiquity/ (d-i/manifest debian/changelog):
[17:29] <CIA-3> ubiquity: Automatic update of included source packages: grub-installer
[17:29] <CIA-3> ubiquity: 1.49ubuntu11.
[17:45] <CIA-3> ubiquity: evand * r4046 ubiquity/debian/changelog: releasing version 2.2.15
[18:43] <cjwatson> ev: I've sent a message to ~amichai2 regarding his ubiquity branch
[18:45] <cjwatson> copyright assignment and such
[20:15] <bipolar> cjwatson: thanks for adding the crypt passphrase to preseeding!
[20:16] <cjwatson> that's ok
[21:13] <shtylman> cjwatson: my only concern about lp:~amichai2/ubiquity/fixes is that the progress bar width is unbounded, which means the progress bar might expand/contract with different text ... which looks weird from a ui perspective
[21:13] <shtylman> other than that.. it seem ok
[21:14] <shtylman> the ui can be tweaked later if needed
[21:25] <NCommander> cjwatson: ping, are you planning another d-i upload before B2?
[21:48] <cr3> not that I'm complaining or anything, but is there any particular reason why the alternate image doesn't log any disk information (as found in media/.disk) anywhere under /var/log/installer?
[21:49] <cr3> I mean, .disk/info
[22:06] <cjwatson> NCommander: not currently
[22:07] <NCommander> cjwatson: alright, then I don't need to rush to fix the Dove netboot files as long as we'll have an upload for RC :-)
[22:07] <cjwatson> cr3: I thought it was saved in media-info - if it's not it's a bug
[22:07] <cjwatson> NCommander: certainly will
[22:07] <NCommander> cjwatson: thanks
[22:08] <cr3> cjwatson: I just finished an alternate install and this is the content of /var/log/installer: cdebconf/ hardware-summary initial-status.gz lsb-release partman status syslog
[22:10] <cjwatson> bug on cdrom-detect with that syslog, please?  assign me
[22:12] <cr3> cjwatson: done, reported bug #556842
[22:15] <cr3> I wonder if the problem might be related to:
[22:15] <cr3> Apr  6 18:31:16 debconf: Adding [CHOICES] -> [cdrom-checker: Verify the cd contents, cdrom-detect: Detect CDROM devices and mount the CD, eject-udeb: ejects CDs from d-i menu, file-preseed: load debconf preseed file, iso-scan: Scan hard drives for an
[22:15] <cr3> Apr  6 18:31:16 debconf: --> INPUT medium anna/choose_modules
[22:15] <cr3> Apr  6 18:31:16 debconf: <-- 30 question skipped
[22:16]  * cr3 tries to figure it out
[22:17] <cjwatson> no
[22:18] <cjwatson> that just means "not bothering you with boring question about which installer modules you want"
[22:19] <cr3> cjwatson: is there a trick to interrupt the installer at various places to debug stuff from the console?
[22:21] <cr3> cjwatson: by the way, I'm an idiot: this is a network install, so it makes sense that the media info is not being logged. I added a comment to the bug, but should I mark it as invalid?
[22:25] <cjwatson> cr3: yes, if it's a network install then there's no media info (the mutant netinst-from-CD trick is just treating it as an apt archive)
[22:25] <cjwatson> cr3: alt-f2 or alt-f3 to get a console
[22:25] <cr3> cjwatson: right, but to interrupt the installation assuming a preseeded install
[22:26] <cjwatson> drop the priority
[22:26] <cjwatson> if you make it medium, it'll stop at each menu entry transition
[22:26] <cr3> gotcha, thanks
[23:10] <bladernr> Is there a way to tell the alternate installer to load the restricted drivers (e.g. for the Broadcom B43 wireless card)


  As grotesque as that is.
[17:23] <h00k> Flannel: Oh. You're serious.
[17:24] <h00k> I did not realize this.
[17:24] <h00k> I have 3 non-CoC comments, but I'll not share in this channel.
[17:25] <h00k> phablet sounds like...a vaporware thing that never happens, like phantom-tablet
[17:25] <h00k> or like Steam on Linu--nevermind
[17:52] <Myrtti> Duke Nukem
[17:53] <Pici> That came out.


[01:43] <popey> do they have to be computer related?
[01:43] <popey> or even ubuntu related images?
[02:11] <beuno> popey: computer-related is fine
[02:11] <beuno> (the first one was a processor)
[09:14] <juliux> morning
[05:08] <shirish> Hi all, just like fedora has fedora ambassador, is there something similar for ubuntu?


[00:22] <phunyguy> hey folks, how do I get rid of the cloud icon in the systray? I have no need for Ubuntu One...
[00:46] <IdleOne> uninstall ubuntuone-client and ubuntuone-control-panel possibly
[00:55] <jbicha> phunyguy: you can uninstall indicator-sync
[01:00] <phunyguy> ahh ok, thanks
[04:25] <yown> Hi, may I please ask a basic wish of ubuntu that might make this release?
[04:25] <yown> or some future release?
[04:25] <yown> Anyone here though?
[04:38] <bjsnider> yown, don't ask to ask, just ask
[04:39] <yown> I know, but if there isn't anyone here...
[04:40] <yown> I want better support of browser links, including windows browser links
[04:41] <yown> I hear most linux users use bookmarks or what not, but addressing this issue shouldn't be too difficult either
[04:41] <yown> And it won't detract from those who just want to use bookmarks
[04:42] <yown> bjsnider: And don't make ask to ask statements, just to go silent when someone does  just ask :p
[04:44] <yown> Does anyone know when this release might come out?
[04:45] <IdleOne> Congrats on alienating probably one of the fiew people who could help
[04:45] <IdleOne> few*
[04:46] <IdleOne> yown: Ubuntu release numbers are year.month so 13.04 is 2013.April
[04:47] <IdleOne> what is a "windows browser link" ?
[04:48] <yown> the icon next to a web addres in a browser that can be dragged and dropped to desktops or folders
[04:48] <yown> What would you call it?
[04:48] <yown> IdleOne: You seriously think that was enough to alienate someone? If so, that is scary sensative
[04:49] <yown> beware strong breezes
[04:51] <bjsnider> what happens on your ubuntu system when you try to open those links?
[04:51] <IdleOne> yown: I think that in the Ubuntu community we have a code of conduct and a set of guidelines which in part state that you should always assume good faith on the part of other users. bjsnider was trying to point out that your question was perhaps not very specific and that you should expand.
[04:51] <yown> Well links from windows simply don't work, they do the about: thing, I forget exact details
[04:52] <yown> IdleOne: Yeah and I didn't do anything in bad faith, please some falsely criticizing me
[04:52] <yown> *stop falsely criticizing me
[04:52] <bjsnider> what about any other link?
[04:52] <yown> Some of us duel boot, you know
[04:52] <bjsnider> dual
[04:53] <yown> thanks
[04:53] <IdleOne> in some cases it is a duel :)
[04:53] <bjsnider> yes, that's an ironic way of spelling it
[04:53] <yown> Also some links don't work when saved with ubuntu, it tries to save more of the website then the address, which means it doesn't load right
[04:54] <bjsnider> is that normally how you go about bookmarking something, dragging the favicon to the desktop?
[04:54] <yown> I mean when made from drag and drop shortcuts
[04:54] <yown> I have, it depends on my needs
[04:54] <bjsnider> IdleOne, can you test that? i'm on gnome-shell and nautilus isn't handling the desktop
[04:55] <yown> Its useful for getting the link for to open when I am in windows, or if I wish to save them for someone else to open
[04:56] <yown> So will this version take both cinnamon and gnome 2.x DEs?
[04:56] <bjsnider> not gnome 2
[04:57] <bjsnider> that's dead
[04:57] <yown> well I want gnome 2s menus, and I can't find many alternatives
[04:57] <yown> so it will take cinnamon?
[04:58] <IdleOne> bjsnider: I just click on the star at the right end of the url bar when I need to bookmark a site
[04:58] <IdleOne> I don't like having 6000 icons on my desktop
[04:59] <bjsnider> yeah, so gnome 3.8 will have a built-in retro mode, i forget what they call it now, but it will have a lot of gnome 2 looking stuff including the menus.
[04:59] <yown> Well I just care about the menus, well and being able to disable that annoying unity bar thing if i wish
[04:59] <bjsnider> cinnamon is a mint thing, it's up to them
[05:00] <yown> I take it 13.4 has gnome 3.8?
[05:01] <bjsnider> classic mode is what they call it. it's extensions that modify the stock gnome-shell to look and behave more like gnome 2.
[05:01] <bjsnider> 3.6, not 3.8
[05:01] <bjsnider> but the extensions also work for 3.6, you just have to manually instlal them
[05:04] <yown> So I can do that now with 12.10 for classic mode?
[05:04] <yown> There is also the issue with bookmarks made with ubuntu that it does not mark or save icon information
[05:05] <yown> it presents them in boring doc form, which can be confused with actual text files
[05:05] <yown> There is a way to give them a new icon, its rather a pain though, and something I did reverted it too, but even then, it uses the same for all of em
[05:06] <yown> bjsnider:  	So I can do that now with 12.10 for classic mode with the menus and stuff?
[05:07] <bjsnider> ah, hold on a sec
[05:07] <bjsnider> which de are you running?
[05:07] <bjsnider> i'm talking about gnome-shell. the default on ubuntu is unity
[05:08] <yown> I am currently running ubuntu 11.4, I want to update though, but I am concerned over lack of DE I would want to use
[05:08] <yown> which I am running in classic mode
[05:08] <bjsnider> i see, so you have the gnome menus and whatnot
[05:08] <yown> yes
[05:08] <bjsnider> ok, hold on a sec
[05:08] <yown> and I was wondering if I can get that in 12.10
[05:09] <yown> I like the discove ability of it all, that I don't need to know the names of all these programs to do searches for them, I can just look through the menues and see whats there
[05:09] <yown> And I dislike having lots of menus crammed into one like a windows start menu
[05:10] <yown> Especially as it requires you to be so careful with the mouse as you pull out these menus within menues, and scroll down menu lists
[05:10] <yown> one slip and you start all over again
[05:12] <yown> Actually, I could see it expanding even past the 3 listed in classic, but 3 is still better then 1
[05:15] <bjsnider> i can't find the exact list of extensions right now, but it is possible to do that
[05:15] <bjsnider> there's probably a blog post about it somewhere
[05:15] <yown> Cool
[05:16] <yown> Well if you can link me, I am terrible at finding things through search engines, especially with my limited understanding of linux
[05:16] <bjsnider> also, the extensions can be tricky because they have to be compatible with your version of gnome-shell
[05:16] <bjsnider> if you have a limited understanding of linux it will be very hard to get done
[05:16] <yown> Which means having to redo it ever so often with updates?
[05:17] <yown> Well with 13.4, this will be present as a option in default, newbie friendly?
[05:17] <bjsnider> it would have to be redone every 6 months
[05:17] <bjsnider> no
[05:17] <bjsnider> because gnome 3.8 won't be there
[05:17] <bjsnider> 13.10
[05:17] <yown> There is a gnome 3.8, but it isn't in ubuntu, or compatible with it?
[05:18] <yown> I mean 13.4
[05:18] <bjsnider> no, 13.4 will have gnome 3.6
[05:18] <bjsnider> there are problems integrating 3.8
[05:18] <yown> and how long do I have to wait for 13.10?
[05:18] <bjsnider> october
[05:18] <bjsnider> 10=october
[05:18] <yown> oye
[05:19] <yown> OK, so what can I do for DE, so I can update but have things like something akin to that gnome 2.x menu? it doesn't have to be the same, just that principle
[05:19] <yown> without something really complicated
[05:19] <bjsnider> if you use mint i guess they'll have cinnamon
[05:19] <yown> But some have told me that mint is less reliable then ubuntu
[05:20] <bjsnider> xubuntu has a simple old-style setup
[05:20] <bjsnider> mint is ubuntu
[05:20] <bjsnider> 99% of it anyway
[05:20] <bjsnider> just a different paint job
[05:21] <yown> But not something I can ask about in the ubuntu channel I am told, and less reliable in some way? Does it keep up perfectly with updates?
[05:21] <bjsnider> not supported here
[05:21] <yown> which means...
[05:21] <yown> ?
[05:21] <bjsnider> i'm not sure how closely it tracks updates
[05:22] <bjsnider> why don't you try xubuntu for awhile?
[05:22] <yown> hmmm, maybe
[05:22] <bjsnider> just install the xubuntu-desktop package and switch sessions at the login screen
[05:22] <yown> I have already downloaded the 12.10 ubuntu though, would it be less time for me to install that and switch to XFCE?
[05:23] <bjsnider> no, not less time i don't think
[05:23] <yown> bjsnider, are you a developer?
[05:23] <bjsnider> no, i do a lot of packaging and whatnot
[05:24] <bjsnider> and badmouthing fedora
[05:24] <bjsnider> as one naturally does
[05:26] <yown> So you are positive of all you said bjsnider? Because someone in another channel said that you can put cinnamon on  13.4
[05:27] <bjsnider> you mean without mint?
[05:27] <bjsnider> someone might have packaged it in a ppa
[05:27] <bjsnider> so it might be possible
[05:30] <yown> and is saying there is a fall back to gnome 2 style bjsnider  (in 13.4)
[05:32] <yown> I mean without complicated setup
[05:34] <bjsnider> http://packages.ubuntu.com/raring/gnome-session-fallback
[05:34] <bjsnider> that?
[05:34] <bjsnider> i thought you were still using gnome 2
[05:35] <bjsnider> that package was intended as disaster planning, not a permanent desktop environment, although some people unfortunately use it as such
[05:35] <bjsnider> it's like windows safe mode
[05:36] <jbicha> bjsnider: I haven't tried it but there's now https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cinnamon
[05:36] <bjsnider> jbicha, cool, so not a ppa
[05:36] <yown> bjsnider: Switch sessions?
[05:36] <bjsnider> that makes it easier on people
[05:37] <bjsnider> yown, can you expand on that question?
[05:38] <yown> bjsnider: "just install the xubuntu-desktop package and switch sessions at the login screen" What do you mean about the switching of sessions? And why is it unfortunate for someone to use that gnome fallback as a permanent desktop?
[05:39] <bjsnider> well, you don;t have to because cinnamon is in 13.4
[05:39] <yown> Well is it in 12.10?
[05:39] <bjsnider> no
[05:39] <yown> stable 13.4 isn't out yet, and I don't want to experiment right now
[05:39] <bjsnider> you came to the wrong place
[05:40] <bjsnider> at the login screen look for the sessions button
[05:40] <yown> well I mean for main system anyway
[05:40] <bjsnider> it wil give you the list
[05:42] <bjsnider> it's unfortunate because it's abandoned code that's not supported or maintained and hasn't been for years and so forth and so on
[09:32] <raymond> I am trying to make my radeon card's power_mode automatically be set to use dynpm at boot.  So I tried writing a UDEV rule, but UDEV seems to be ignoring the rule (or the rule doesn't work and requires debugging):  http://pastebin.com/maxH2DCs
[10:23] <edakiri> How can one see which X Org server is running? --not which version, but for which chipset.
[10:24] <edakiri> the /var/log/Xorg.* shows modules for various 'servers' being loaded, and I see indications which suggest which is being used, but I look for something clear and conclusive.
[10:27] <humanoids> high
[10:28] <humanoids> why dmesg shows my ssd as connected udma 133?
[10:28] <humanoids> ata4.00: ATA-8: MKNSSDCR120GB, 504ABBF0, max UDMA/133
[10:28] <humanoids> its drawring
[10:29] <edakiri> humanoids: maybe hdparm can help you examine or test UDMA setting.
[10:29] <humanoids> its udma 133 current active mode
[10:30] <edakiri> You think it should be faster UDMA setting?
[10:30] <humanoids> it should be connected with 6gbps
[10:30] <humanoids> its a sandfnord ssd
[10:30] <edakiri> Can hdparm probe the available UDMA settings?
[10:30] <humanoids> yes
[10:31] <edakiri> Does it show other ones than 133?
[10:31] <humanoids> yes it shows lower ones
[10:32] <edakiri> I guess that is what the device is showing. To establish otherwise, you could snoop the traffic. I don't know what tools for that.
[10:33] <humanoids> snoop the traffic?
[10:33] <edakiri> In other words, the device can do it faster, but is reporting it can not.
[10:33] <humanoids> now i do a sequential benchmark to show the controller speed, the disk is capable of 500mb/s write
[10:34] <edakiri> If it is 133MB/s bus, it should be able to do 500Mb/s.
[10:39] <humanoids> 133 MB/s should do 500MB/s
[10:39] <humanoids> lol
[10:40] <humanoids> 133 Megabytes are 133MB not 500
[10:40] <humanoids> udma uses megabytes /s not gigabits
[10:49] <edakiri> humanoids: MB is MegaBytes. Mb is Megabits
[10:51] <edakiri> so 500Mb is less than 133MB
[12:46] <BluesKaj> Hey all
[16:02] <ts^^> Hey
[16:02] <ts^^> quickie question - there used to be 'startup applications' in top menu / system preferences, but it's missing in raring. how on earth i'm supposed to set and edit startup applications nowadays?
[16:05] <mandoguit> try system settings > administration > startup and shutdown > autostart
[16:06] <ts^^> .. where is that supposed to be, exactly
[16:07] <ts^^> i don't have 'administration' item in system settings, and searching for 'start' or 'auto' bring nothing
[16:08] <mandoguit> well all I can tell you is that is exactly where it is on my system    Kernel: 3.8.0-7-generic x86_64 (64 bit)
[16:08] <mandoguit>            Desktop: KDE 4.10.00 Distro: Ubuntu Raring Ringtail (development branch)
[16:09] <mandoguit> are you upto date with your updates?
[16:10] <ts^^> i don't run kde
[16:10] <mandoguit> ahh... ok.   have to ask someone else then.
[16:12] <ts^^> kinda stupid assume non-default desktop for questions unless otherwise mentioned btw
[16:13] <bazhang> ts^^, all versions are supported here, its not stupid at all
[16:13] <genii-around> ts^^: #kubuntu+1 forwards here
[16:14] <mandoguit> ts^^:  try learning some manners
[16:17] <ts^^> mandoguit: i have manners, and i find giving kde answers for ubuntu questions being bad manners instead.
[16:17] <bazhang> ts^^, lose the attitude
[16:18] <ts^^> well, back to the original problem, i assume it's just yet another removed feature, it's just not.. anywhere in any system settings panel :/
[16:18] <humanoids> whats a banhang?
[20:13] <vooze> Command to remove unity and all gnome from 13.04 ? :)
[20:13] <vooze> or just list all packages to need to remove
[20:15] <BluesKaj>  http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/purekde , vooze
[20:15] <BluesKaj> in 13.04 it may not be so easy tho
[20:18] <vooze> hmm
[20:19] <vooze> Is there a big diffrence? It seems its only 10 packages that it cant find, if i have these 10 packages "too much" aka. they have gotten a new name its no problem
[20:19] <vooze> is that what you mean BluesKaj?
[20:25] <BluesKaj> vooze, if you want to delete gnome/unity the commands on the purekde site need to be edited to replace 12.10 with 13.04 and I'm not sure even that will work successfully due to libs etc not being replaced
[20:29] <vooze> yeah okay, I will just wait :D
[20:33] <BluesKaj> you could install kubuntu-desktop and choose either desktop in the login menu ..I did it for a while til I went pure kde '
[21:19] <Bauer1> I discovered there are issues with video display on RR: in VLC player, video is "choppy" (I hope its the right word, where chunks of the picture show up as huge unprocessed pixels)
[21:20] <Bauer1> then installed compizconfig-settings-manager, but all I see are checkboxes, not the text near them
[21:22] <BluesKaj> RR?
[21:22] <bjsnider> raring ringtail
[21:22] <Bauer1> Raring Ringtail - 13.04
[21:22] <bjsnider> right?
[21:23] <Bauer1> yup :) any idea what to do/try?
[21:24] <BluesKaj> ok , never seen it referred to as RR before ,  graphics driver , maybe
[21:26] <bjsnider> does totem work alright?
[21:28] <Bauer1> bjsnider, same issue, testing using H264 codec file in Matroska container btw
[21:29] <bjsnider> was it encoded using x264 or is it h264?
[21:30] <Bauer1> I didnt encode it, unfortunately missing NFO file on this one, sec will try another file.. but it did work properly on windows before
[21:30] <bjsnider> you can use mediainfo to determine that
[21:34] <BluesKaj> Bauer1, I assume all videos are acting up ?
[21:36] <Bauer1> bjsnider, Totem says code is H264, but actually only the first file I tried is "choppy" and it is in Totem, not VLC
[21:36] <Bauer1> my bad I confused it because Totem is default player, not VLC atm
[21:36] <Bauer1> in VLC both files I tested look fine
[21:36] <Bauer1> both are H264 in codec
[21:37] <Bauer1> BluesKaj, that answers your question - not all video.. and I see still only chcekboxes in Compig Config Settings Manager
[21:37] <bjsnider> i have trouble playing h264 files in totem here on quantal
[21:37] <Bauer1> quantal is which version?
[21:38] <bjsnider> 12.10
[21:38] <bjsnider> your issue is no different than mine
[21:38] <bjsnider> if you try a file encoded by x264 i think you'll see it plays fine
[21:38] <bjsnider> h264 means it probably came from apple or something like that
[21:39] <Bauer1> hmmm, well I meant to use VLC anyway, question is how to change the filetype default... its not so obvious in linux :)
[21:40] <Bauer1> found it :)
[21:41] <Bauer1> do you have the issue I mentioned in CompizConfig SEttings Manager in 13.04?
[21:42] <bjsnider> i don't use unity, so no need for anything to do with compiz
[21:43] <BluesKaj> yeah VLC is my default video player , it's so reliable , plays practically everything
[21:44] <BluesKaj> yeah , KDE here, no compiz issues to worry about
[21:46] <Bauer1> well, overall I am pleased with GTK..  my last 2 major problems are that I cant get Evolution to work with our Exchange 2010 emails, and I cant start Juniper's VPN for some reason even though I followed all the special installation instructions for 64bit Ubuntu
[21:47] <Bauer1> we tested at work on 12.04, same issue.. cant start the VPN - the window either wont launch, or will open for a split sec and disappear
[21:48] <Bauer1> while java -version looks good, but java test on Chrome crashes the test tab
[21:50] <Bauer1> and works on Firefox - but the VPN window disappears so fast I cant tell what happend
[21:52] <bjsnider> i think thunderbird works with exchange
[21:54] <Bauer1> you sure? I actually read a comparison, buttom line was that Evolution supports Exchange, while Thunderbird was better at overall integration or something else which didnt matter to me
[21:55] <bjsnider> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqU7ZZPo9Og
[21:55] <bjsnider> there's a video on connecting exchange and evolution
[22:05] <Bauer1> thanks bjsnider , hmm that Exchange MAPI Server Type is not showing up for me even though the second package is installed, closest I have is Exchange Web Services...