[00:13] <bdrung> can someone change the status of https://code.launchpad.net/~yofel/ubuntu/lucid/ubufox/lp557240/+merge/29858 to merged?
[00:14] <yofel> bdrung: done ;)
[00:14] <bdrung> thanks
[00:22] <bdrung> yofel: can you mark https://code.launchpad.net/~serge-hallyn/ubuntu/lucid/qemu-kvm/memleak-fix/+merge/28645 as merged?
[00:23] <yofel> no, I could only mark the first one as merged because that was my branch
[00:24] <bdrung> aha, ok
[00:25] <bdrung> then i have to wait that launchpad get fixed
[00:25] <isleshocky77>  I've been looking through the packaging documentation for a while now and still I'm running in circles. Could someone set me straight. I took the source of pidgin-libnotify and modified one file. Now I want to get a build in my personal launchpad ppa for x32 and amd64
[00:27] <bdrung> isleshocky77: you might want to ask this in #ubuntu-motu
[00:27] <isleshocky77> bdrung: Thanks.
[00:39] <micahg> bdrung: #ubuntu-packaging is for PPA packaging Qs
[00:40] <bdrung> micahg: k, that's an even better place
[00:40] <micahg> :)
[01:21] <Toluxero> hi!
[01:24] <thumper> hi
[01:25] <Toluxero> hi thumper i need help with a team.
[01:25] <Toluxero> can you help me?
[01:26] <thumper> not sure how much help I can be, but ask away
[01:28] <Toluxero> the owner registered in the team is not more available and I need a ticket to send a LoCo Council, thumper
[01:29] <thumper> which team?
[01:29] <Toluxero> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mx
[01:31] <thumper> https://edge.launchpad.net/~fetova is an admin of the team
[01:31] <thumper> what is it you need to do?
[01:32] <Toluxero> ahm, actually I'm a LoCo Contact of the team, but the owner is not available, the LoCo Council know the situation.
[01:33] <Toluxero> and request me a ticket support
[01:36] <thumper> https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad/+addquestion <- say the team and loco council info
[01:37] <Toluxero> ok
[01:37] <Toluxero> thats all?
[01:43] <thumper> Toluxero: that's all I think
[01:44] <Toluxero> thumper, thanks! :D
[01:46] <thumper> np
[01:47] <Toluxero> thumper, so... the question in what language?
[01:47] <thumper> english preferrably as the admins are all english speaking
[01:48] <Toluxero> oks
[01:56] <Toluxero> thumper, thanks again :D
[09:18] <mrevell> Hello
[09:19] <lifeless> !oops
[09:20] <lifeless> !help
[09:20] <lifeless> @help
[09:21] <nigelb> lifeless: !messagethebot :D
[09:21]  * nigelb hides.
[09:22] <lifeless> nigelb: if you know how to teach it a new help topic, that would be grand
[09:22] <lifeless> I wrote up a wiki page about oopses
[09:22] <lifeless> and I'd like to make it easy to point people about it
[09:32] <nigelb> lifeless: I do
[09:33] <jussi> o/
[09:33] <nigelb> lifeless: jussi will help you with it
[09:33] <nigelb> what do you want to add?
[09:33] <jussi> !owner
[09:33] <lifeless> I want tou be able to do !oops
[09:33] <jussi> :)
[09:34] <lifeless> and have it give a link to
[09:34] <nigelb> jussi: "kindly"? free?
[09:34] <jussi> lifeless: what should !oops say?
[09:34] <lifeless> https://help.launchpad.net/Oops
[09:34] <jussi> nigelb: correct
[09:34] <nigelb> whoa, cool
[09:34] <jussi> !test
[09:34] <lifeless> jussi: just giving the URL would be ok
[09:35] <lifeless> saying a little more like 'An OOPS is a system error in launchpad, please see https://help.launchpad.net/Oops' would be better.
[09:35] <jussi> lifeless: we need to follow how factoids need to be constructed, small explanation, url.
[09:35] <lifeless> jussi: syre
[09:35] <lifeless> sure
[09:36] <jussi> lifeless: ok. for future reference, use this syntax, and the bot will forward it for moderation. !oops is <reply>An OOPS is a system error in launchpad, please see https://help.launchpad.net/Oops
[09:37] <lifeless> with the <reply> in it ?
[09:37] <jussi> !oops
[09:37] <jussi> lifeless: yes
[09:37] <lifeless> ok, thanks
[09:37] <lifeless> I'll try to remember ;)
[09:37] <nigelb> \o/
[09:37] <jussi> no probs.
[09:37] <jussi> !bot
[09:37] <jussi> lifeless: that link has how to do it if you ever need it again
[09:38] <lifeless> jussi: thanks a lot
[09:38] <jussi> lifeless: also, Ive made that a specific factoid for this channel only. if you want to call it outside of here, use !oops-#launchpad
[09:39] <lifeless> ok
[09:40] <jussi> ok then. Laters!
[11:22] <aquarius> maxb, ping
[11:22] <maxb> hi
[11:22] <aquarius> yeah, I'm thick and meant just the android-trunk bit :)
[11:22] <aquarius> er, android-client
[11:22] <maxb> just wanted to check :-)
[11:23] <aquarius> Launchpad: saving me from my own stupidity. again :)
[11:24] <maxb> updated, import in progress
[11:31] <aquarius> winner, thanks
[11:40] <aquarius> If I've got two separate codebases which may share some code and are of the same sort of thing -- we have an "Android client for Ubuntu One" project on LP, but we'll actually have a few separate clients, in time (one for contacts, one for files, etc) -- should they be separate LP projects? Or are separate branches in the one project a good idea?
[11:49] <maxb> aquarius: Generally the question "Are the Bazaar branches going to have interrelated history?" is a good guide to "Should these things all be one project?"
[11:50] <aquarius> well...some of it will be interrelated. The different clients will share code, but will start from different places. I'm not sure what that means as an answer to your question :)
[11:53] <maxb> Maybe there's a shared library plus N clients, all of which are projects?
[11:58] <wgrant> aquarius: Sounds like they should be separate projects.
[11:58] <wgrant> Or a single branch.
[11:59] <aquarius> wgrant, cheers; that's exactly why I'm asking the question. Obviously all of these are doable technically; what I'm trying to do is fit in with the zen of launchpad
[12:14] <esteve> hi all
[12:15] <esteve> I bought a subscription the other day and created a proprietary project
[12:15] <esteve> but I can't seem to find the documentation to make branches private
[12:15] <esteve> doesn't anybody know where I can find it?
[12:16] <mwhudson> esteve: you have to ask an admin (aka losa) for that
[12:17] <esteve> mwhudson: thanks
[12:17] <noodles775> (that is, they can update a setting so that your project will default to private branches)
[12:18] <esteve> noodles775: so all the branches that my team pushes will be made private, am I right?
[12:18] <noodles775> Once a losa has update your project, all the branches that your team pushes for that project will be private by default, yes. (ie. pushing to ~username/project-name/branch-name)
[12:19] <noodles775> (or ~teamname/project-name/branch of course :) ).
[12:19] <esteve> noodles775: great! thanks
[12:20] <esteve> so, who is an admin/losa?
[12:21] <esteve> or can I just open a question against malone (not sure about the name)?
[12:21] <noodles775> esteve: they would normally have already jumped by this point (by mentioning losa), but they're currently off sprinting together, so it might be worth asking a question against launchpad-code.
[12:26] <esteve> noodles775: ok, thanks, I just opened one https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad-code/+question/120715
[12:46] <X3> can anyone shed some light on why the svn revisions are off on https://code.launchpad.net/~x3lectric/xbmc/svn-trunk
[12:46] <X3> comparing to http://trac.xbmc.org/timeline
[12:47] <X3> the svn versions dont match but commits do
[12:48] <X3> the real svn displays version 32624 and the lauchapad is 2something its well off version nr
[12:49] <X3> is this a bug in launchpad?
[12:50] <wgrant> X3: Bazaar revision numbers are unique within a branch. Subversion revision numbers are unique across all branches in the repository.
[12:50] <wgrant> If you do an svn log on trunk, you'll see there are revision numbers missing (since they're in other branches).
[12:51] <wgrant> bzr doesn't know about the other branches, and doesn't count the revisions outside trunk.
[12:51] <X3> wgrant but if I build that those packages will never trigger update on ppa cause revision is way lower
[12:51] <wgrant> X3: What's your versioning scheme?
[12:51] <X3> er svn?
[12:51] <bigjools> wgrant: your branch should be on staging now
[12:51] <wgrant> bigjools: Thanks. I'll QA it.
[12:52] <wgrant> X3: I mean, how do you construct the version string for your packages?
[12:52] <X3> you mean the recipe?
[12:53] <wgrant> Yes.
[12:53] <X3> atm none cause idk how to
[12:53] <X3> + the discrepancy im totally lost
[12:54] <wgrant> If you're not already building packages from svn directly, then there are no packages with the svn revision number for your bzr packages to be less than.
[12:59] <X3> wagrant what recipe should it use that?
[13:08] <X3> can you help with recipe?
[13:32] <det> How often does PPA publication happen ?
[13:33] <maxb> 5 minutes, in theory, though it seems sluggish lately
[14:00] <bigjools> det, maxb: nominally it's 5 minutes but when the load is large it will take longer
[14:34] <det> Thanks
[14:34] <det> seems mine took like 1 hour
[15:52] <pc_magas> hi
[15:55] <pc_magas> hi
[16:34] <hexmode> rockstar: is there a bug for recipe builds on Maverick?  They fail b/c of no orig.tar.gz
[16:34] <rockstar> hexmode, not that I'm aware of.
[16:34] <rockstar> hexmode, do you have a buildlog I can see?
[16:35] <hexmode> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/53488576/buildlog.txt.gz
[16:35] <hexmode> from https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~hexmode/+recipe/org-mode-daily
[16:37] <hexmode> Also, just fyi, I'm impressed that estimated build times were actually pretty accurate this morning.
[16:38] <hexmode> rockstar: ^^ in case you missed it
[16:44] <rockstar> hexmode, well, the problem wasn't in their accuracy, but in the number of packages that were "cutting" in line.
[16:45] <hexmode> heh
[16:51] <hexmode> rockstar: final q: build schedule says "built daily" but no builds have happend for several days.  Why?
[16:52] <rockstar> hexmode, known issue, but I don't know the details.  I'll have to find out.
[16:53] <hexmode> rockstar: ok, if you know who I should bug about it, I could find out.  otherwise, thanks.
[16:54] <rockstar> hexmode, you should me about it.  :)
[17:02] <rockstar> hexmode, sorry, just got to looking at your Maverick issue, and it looks like that bug is https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad-code/+bug/614768
[17:05] <hexmode> rockstar: thanks...
[17:52] <hexmode> rockstar: also, looks like it does a source build first (-S) and then reschedules for a binary build (ex: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~hexmode/+recipe/emacs-daily/+build/796)
[17:52] <rockstar> hexmode, yeah, that's correct.
[17:52] <hexmode> rockstar: but, under pending builds, it doesn't really show that.
[17:52] <rockstar> hexmode, there's a bug about that, but it's not really a pending build.  It built the source package like you asked.  :)
[17:52] <hexmode> rockstar: it says "successful build" ... even though, since these are from trunk, they could fail
[17:52] <hexmode> heh
[17:53] <hexmode> rockstar: ok
[17:57] <bahamas10> i can't figure out how to get the FAQ to show up on my projects overview
[18:56] <lamont> wgrant: around?
[18:57]  * lamont bets on sleeping
[18:57] <lamont> wondering if the build-record populator that we run after PaS changes got updated for arch: linux-any packages as part of the fix
[22:24] <MTecknology> Is there any way I could have https://launchpad.net/nginx-obsolete unlinked from https://launchpad.net/~nginx ?
[22:40] <wgrant> lamont: Yes.
[22:40] <wgrant> lamont: I was thinking about that, and yes, it should work.
[22:40] <wgrant> But I really need to strip it down to a create-build-records-only mode.
[22:41] <wgrant> However, just running it right after the rollout should fix everything.
[22:41] <wgrant> And fix a few things that shouldn't be fixed, but they're not significant.
[22:45] <lamont> wgrant: heh
[22:46] <lamont> 'twould be nice if there were a way to tell it package, version, and distro-arch-series, and have it either create it because it should, or bitch-n-whine and ask if I'm really really really sure I want that even though it shouldn't exist.
[22:46] <lamont> and have it do just that one tuple, instead of walking the world
[22:46] <lamont> oh, and ponies.  I want ponies.
[22:47] <lamont> anyway, afk
[22:48] <wgrant> Hmm.
[22:49] <lifeless> MTecknology: what is nginx-obsolete ?
[22:50] <MTecknology> lifeless: it was replaced by launchpad.net/nginx
[22:50] <lifeless> grah, why ?
[22:50] <MTecknology> lifeless: Realistically.. you could simply delete it - but I don't think you guys do that
[22:50] <lifeless> anyhow - file a question on launchpad.net/launchpad asking for help
[22:50] <lifeless> there is no help contact on atm
[22:51] <MTecknology> lifeless: It was my fault- you can slap me :(
[23:02] <MTecknology> I want to make a project called builders :(
[23:02] <MTecknology> wgrant: I see the builders have returned to a state of normalcy - That's nice. :)
[23:03] <wgrant> Were they broken?
[23:03] <wgrant> They'll be even better than normal tomorrow.
[23:19] <MTecknology> wgrant: why's that?
[23:21] <wgrant> MTecknology: The buildd master has been rewritten.
[23:21] <MTecknology> wgrant: cool - any specific changes?
[23:22] <mwhudson> does more stuff in parallel
[23:22] <MTecknology> oh, cool
[23:34] <bdrung> why can't i change the status of https://code.launchpad.net/~toabctl/ubuntu/maverick/xf86-input-wacom/new_upstream_0.10.7/+merge/30469 to invalid or something similar?
[23:36] <micahg> bdrung: it's a personal branch, not an ubuntu branch
[23:39] <bdrung> micahg: but it's a merge request
[23:39] <ajmitch> bdrung: oddly enough there's the resubmit proposal & delete proposal links listed
[23:39] <bdrung> micahg: the members of the target branch team should be able to reject a merge request
[23:40] <bdrung> i could delete the merge request
[23:40] <ajmitch> ~ubuntu-branches is set as reviewer (& owner of the branch)
[23:40] <bdrung> but then the commend would vanish
[23:40]  * micahg has no idea
[23:41] <ajmitch> you're able to set the reviewer of that branch, but that still doesn't fix the problem
[23:41] <ajmitch> I think the default reviewer for all those branches needs to be changed from ~ubuntu-branches
[23:42] <bdrung> yes
[23:42] <ajmitch> we probably need the TB to do it
[23:42] <bdrung> to ~ubuntu-dev?
[23:42] <ajmitch> or maybe lifeless, he's in the owning team :)
[23:42] <ajmitch> probably not
[23:42] <ajmitch> some might be ~ubuntu-core-dev, it'll need some thought


[00:55] <ailo> holstein, I see the US home page has been updated
[00:56] <ailo> Does someone have access to that now?
[00:56] <holstein> autostatic
[00:56] <holstein> AFAIK
[00:56] <holstein> ailo: logo is still bad though
[00:59] <ailo> Well, since Oneiric will be quite different, it seems suitable that the homepage should change at that time as well
[01:00] <holstein> ailo: did you see that page?
[01:00] <holstein> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Oneiric/Timeline
[01:00] <ailo> Which one? Jorges?
[01:00] <holstein> i think you should add test cases
[01:00] <holstein> at your liesure
[01:00] <holstein> and assign them or whatever
[01:01] <holstein> ailo: the testing section is still a bit vague
[01:01] <ailo> It's a little bit like a short version of ScottL's page
[01:02] <holstein> pretty much
[01:02] <holstein> cory really wanted it
[01:02] <ailo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/ReleasePlanning
[01:02] <holstein> and i like it
[01:02] <holstein> nice and official
[01:02] <ailo> It's missing some stuff, though
[01:02] <ailo> Documentation and -controls
[01:02] <holstein> yeah
[01:03] <ailo> In my view top prio on both, really.
[01:03] <holstein> i think this should be an expanded version specific list
[01:03] <holstein> more about what and when
[01:03] <holstein> so its not a redundant mess
[01:03] <holstein> ailo: you and paultag working on controls?
[01:04] <ailo> Haven't talked with paultag, but I've decide to start working on it in a month or so
[01:04] <holstein> OK
[01:04] <ailo> Have a lot on my hands right now, and I need some extra time for it.
[01:05] <holstein> think about a good ending date for that
[01:05] <ailo> Takes some researching
[01:05] <holstein> goal*
[01:05] <holstein> and i'll put that up there too
[01:05] <ailo> The only things stopping me last time was time. Not a problem now
[01:06] <holstein> cool... lemme pack up for the gig.. BBL
[01:07] <ailo> I should have a basic version ready within a couple of weeks after beginning the coding. What happens after that is whatever time there is to work on things, and what features people would like to put in, or maybe even replace the -controls with falktx work.
[01:07] <ailo> In any case, I will aim for a basic application first. If we have nothing else, at least we have that
[01:08] <ailo> The other thing I need to learn is packaging, which I will do once I finished the basic application
[01:08] <ailo> I suppose all of this should be ready to test by the end of June the latest
[01:09] <ailo> In the form of a package
[01:16] <ScottL> ailo, holstein: i think what cory wanted was some thought into setting some milestones with dates in order to make release
[01:16] <ScottL> like we need to have the -lowlatency kernel built by a certain date so we can devote one month of testingg
[01:16] <ScottL> cory and i need to update the seeds probably within this month
[01:16] <ScottL> etc
[01:18] <ailo> I can set up a periodic testing system and write a script for it, but I wonder who will assist me in testing?
[01:18] <ailo> We need more machines
[01:19] <ailo> I guess I could try get some volunteers on mail lists, once a script is ready
[01:19] <ailo> Haven't seen meganerd around for a while. He started sketching, but don't know if he continued
[01:20] <ailo> In any case: We already know -lowlatency is the safe choice, right?
[01:20] <ailo> So why not just decide to put it in?
[01:20] <ailo> What do you think ScottL?
[01:21] <ScottL> ailo, right, but i think cory (and i was thinking the same) need to prioritize by assigning milestone dates to it, just like ubuntu does with feature freeze, debian import freeze, etc
[01:22] <ailo> ScottL, We still need to learn how to create the source for -lowlatency, right? Not just package from abogani's, which I assume he will stop mantaining
[01:23] <ailo> It's basically a ubuntu kernel source with a patch, so it shouldn't be too much trouble
[01:25] <ailo> 2nd of June is Alpha 1
[01:25] <ailo> I guess by then it would be good to have a working -lowlatency then
[01:27] <ailo> ScottL, I will come back in two weeks time to see if there's anything I can help out with. I will try upload a -lowlatency to my PPA then
[01:27] <ailo> ScottL, If I can pull it off, I might as well host a testing script, as well as -controls. I hope to have a working controls ready by the middle of June, the end of June the latest
[01:32] <ailo> ScottL, Here's my schedule, if you want it - 2nd of June: -lowlatency(whoever does that), 15th of June: testing script, 15-30th June: basic working -controls
[01:38] <ailo> ScottL, Have you any thoughts on documentation, how you want to work on that?
[01:46] <ScottL> ailo, abogani agreed to keep putting it into git as he already has but only if someone else packages, builds, and "maintains" it
[01:46] <ailo> ScottL, Great
[01:47] <ScottL> ailo, i think we already feel that -lowlatency is good, i'd like to get a few other people to test, especially with firewire
[01:47] <ScottL> ailo, i don't have any thoughts yet on documentation at this point, maybe after this weekend
[01:49] <holstein> ScottL: yeah
[01:49] <holstein> i just dont feel like i can but dates on things
[01:49] <holstein> without talking to the leads
[01:49] <holstein> like dick
[01:49] <holstein> i got some dates from kokito
[01:49] <holstein> and i'll work down the list as we go
[01:50] <ailo> ScottL, I suppose a draft of the documentation should be ready by some point, but it won't need to be finished until next release, or that would feel like an absolute deadline
[01:51] <ailo> ScottL, If we can decide on the content tree no later than some time in June, I guess that's enough?
[01:51] <ScottL> ailo, that sounds good, but we should probably prioritize which sections should be done first, in what order, and which ones should be done this cycle versus next cycle
[01:51] <holstein> i said but dates up there ^
[01:51] <holstein> s/put
[01:51] <ScottL> holstein, the idea was just to get something there and we can discuss it (meaning the dates)
[01:52] <ScottL> holstein, lol, i knoew what you meant ;)
[01:52] <holstein> :)
[01:52] <holstein> ScottL: is it way off base?
[01:52] <holstein> what i have?
[01:52] <ScottL> i think i'm about to convert my in-laws to ubuntu
[01:53] <ScottL> their windows install went tits up last week and i'm not able to fix it so i offered them a couple of live cds with kubutnu and xubuntu
[01:53] <ailo> ScottL, Don't do it. They'll harass you for tech support
[01:53] <ailo> ;)
[01:53] <ScottL> they were amazed that the live disc would allow them to get the internets right off the bat, when they're windows install kept dorking them around :P
[01:53] <ScottL> ailo, i think i can ssh to their computer for most problems
[01:54] <ailo> ScottL, Yeah, I was only kidding
[02:59] <ScottL> hi Daviey
[05:03] <Kokito> good evening folks
[05:06] <Kokito> ScottL: you should have your blog added to Planet Ubuntu
[05:27] <TheMuso> Kokito: It already is.
[05:30] <Kokito> TheMuso: hmmm... interesting. I am suvscribed to the planet's feed, but I did not see Scott's recent post. maybe I just missed it :)
[05:32] <Kokito> TheMuso: you are right. I just missed the post. Maybe I should not check my feed reader too early in the morning (before I have some coffee) :)
[05:32] <Kokito> bbiab
[05:55] <Kokito> re
[14:56] <scott-work> i've added a chart with rough dates for the timeline wiki page:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Oneiric/Timeline#preview
[14:57] <scott-work> comments, additions, corrections, deletions, etc welcome :)
[14:58] <scott-work> i'm still going to add some more line items to a few things
[14:59] <scott-work> after i feel that all the line items for all topics are added with dates, then i'll parse it sorted by date
[15:06] <holstein> scott-work: i like it :)
[18:47] <scott-work> holstein: re: timeline - if there's some stuff you want to add go for it :)
[18:49] <astraljava> scott-work: Did you send the agenda for the meeting, and did I just miss it?
[18:49] <scott-work> astraljava: no, i'm behind on that :(   i'll try to get it tonight though
[18:49] <scott-work> astraljava: if you want to make one that would be awesome :)
[18:50] <astraljava> scott-work: Do you have any sketches already? I can finish it for sure.
[18:51] <scott-work> astraljava: i don't at this time
[18:51] <astraljava> scott-work: Okay. I'll write something up and send it to you for review.
[18:54] <scott-work> astraljava: i would suggest that you go ahead and do it here:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Meetings
[18:54] <scott-work> astraljava: just make another entry and we'll go over it later
[18:54] <astraljava> scott-work: Sure that'll work.
[19:17] <holstein> scott-work: thanks for putting that into a table
[19:17] <holstein> i think thats what cory wanted
[19:21] <scott-work> holstein:  no problem :)
[19:26] <holstein> scott-work: i might just expand the information i put up
[19:26] <holstein> the stuff below the table
[19:27] <holstein> *at some point
[20:23] <astraljava> scott-work: holstein: Agenda is up. Didn't really have an idea what items we should discuss about, so just left a couple from the one that happened exactly a year ago at this same phase of new devel cycle.
[20:24] <astraljava> Please add details, add/remove items etc.
[20:52] <scott-work> holstein: this weekend is not going to be good for me for the meeting
[20:52] <scott-work> holstein: if everyone else still wants to have it, then that's fine by me
[20:52] <scott-work> holstein: if everyone wants to push one week, that is fine as well
[20:52] <scott-work> either way, i will still try to finish the agenda tonight
[21:12] <astraljava> scott-work: No objections for pushing another week.
[21:28] <holstein> scott-work: i cant be here either*
[21:39] <scott-work> holstein: lol, i'll send an email later today then pushing the meeting again :/


[07:34] <vila> hi all !
[07:48]  * fullermd waves at vila.
[09:07] <mgz> morning all
[09:08] <vila> mgz: morning
[09:25] <mgz> vila: what are you up to today?
[09:25] <vila> udd stuff mainly
[09:26] <vila> on a related note I'm also up to 48 ;)
[09:27] <mgz> surely not!
[09:28] <vila> since 17 minutes to be precise
[09:28] <vila> grr
[09:28] <vila> 18
[09:28] <vila> clocks are conspiring to make me tyop now ?
[09:33] <vila> I'll probably lose my internet access today, hopefully no longer than 1/2 hour, I may even be able to warn here first
[11:18] <vila> mgz: ha, *asking* if there was a problem was needed to trigger the reconnect :)
[11:19] <mgz> only 15 minutes downtime though :)
[11:28] <vila> yeah, no I need to restore wireless and phone though
[11:28] <vila> now
[11:53] <vila> hmm, got the phone but still no wifi, lunch break, will obviously work better after that ;)
[11:56] <fullermd> Hm, I've got no wifi either.  Maybe that means I should eat..
[12:48] <chromaticwt> What advantages does bzr have over git?
[14:25] <smoser> hey all. i'm wondering if i could get a little help doing a merge.
[14:25] <smoser> i'm trying to 'bzr merge-upstream' with lp:ubuntu/python-boto
[14:25] <vila> smoser: hi, you're welcome
[14:25] <smoser> python-boto exhibits bug 883207
[14:26] <smoser> and the merge reports a bunch of conflicts that are just silly.
[14:26] <smoser> vila, thank you ;)
[14:26] <vila> ha, hmm, sounds like a parallel import again, right ?
[14:27] <smoser> maybe..
[14:27] <vila> can you pastebin the output of 'bzr conflicts' ?
[14:27] <smoser> i'm perfectly willing to just say "bzr merge-upstream" and take upstreams' version of any file.
[14:28] <vila> in this case, 'bzr resolve --take-other' should get you pretty close to what you're after
[14:28] <smoser> vila, i can... but you can very easily see the same thing as me. (bzr branch lp:ubuntu/python-boto && cd python-boto && bzr merge-upstream )
[14:28] <Wellark> hmm.. am I doing something wrong or is this a real bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bzr/+bug/898179
[14:28] <Wellark> argh.. it's private atm..
[14:29] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/754921/
[14:29] <vila> smoser: branching...
[14:29] <Wellark> ok, public now
[14:30] <Wellark> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bzr/+bug/898179
[14:30] <vila> smoser: merge-upstream'ed, looking
[14:31] <smoser> so --take-other is probably pretty close to what i want. i can go forward with that.
[14:32] <smoser> however, it has the issue on some files as reported in 883207.  it thinks some files have been deleted and replaced with the same content.
[14:32] <smoser> and i would really like to fix this branch so it doesn't do that any more.
[14:32] <jelmer> Wellark: I think that's a dupe of a bug mgz fixed earlier
[14:32] <smoser> as its really annoying.
[14:32] <jelmer> Wellark: what version of bzr-builder are you running?
[14:33] <vila> smoser: so, the root issue is that to track renames, bzr assign a file-id when a file is first added
[14:33] <vila> smoser: when it happens for the same file in two separate branches, we call it a 'parallel import'
[14:33] <smoser> yeah, i'm not sure what got it into this situation, and quite likely the source of the problem is typing this sentance.
[14:34] <vila> smoser: when these two branches are merged, bzr (so far) fail to realize that these two files are really the same
[14:34] <smoser> but i'd like to get it fixed, and am willing to do some hacks now to get there.
[14:34] <vila> 'bzr resolve --take-other' removes the file-id present in the branch and takes the other one
[14:35] <vila> so if you keep merging from the same branch, you shouldn't encounter the same issue
[14:36] <smoser> well that is good enough for me.
[14:36] <vila> the long term fix is to allow both file histories to be merged
[14:37] <vila> smoser: let me know how it goes for the *next* merge-upstream
[14:37] <vila> smoser: and if you're subscribed to the udd mailing list, there is a thread about collecting such issues/recipes
[14:38] <vila> smoser: called 'UDD: categorising and working around common issues'
[14:38] <smoser> vila, thanks.
[14:38] <smoser> one other thing as punishment for your helpfulness
[14:38] <smoser> i just did merge-upstream... resolve --take-other...
[14:38] <smoser> then 'bzr commit'
[14:39] <smoser> and it did not ask me to add a message
[14:39] <smoser> it did the same thing as debcommit would have
[14:39] <smoser> which is not what i wanted (non-interactively taking the debian changelog entry)
[14:39] <vila> jelmer: is that ^ Riddell patch striking ?
[14:40] <jelmer> vila, smoser: yes, that's fixed in bzr-builddeb trunk
[14:40] <jelmer> in other words, trunk now has it disabled by default and you have to explicitly enable it
[14:40] <vila> pfew, lucky me ;)
[14:40] <jelmer> in older versions of bzr-builddeb the option defaults to True, but you can disable it
[14:41] <smoser> jelmer, ok. i'm bzr-builddeb 2.7.9ubuntu1
[14:41] <smoser> but, thanks.
[14:41] <smoser> is there a way to explicitly request edit ?
[14:41] <smoser> i guess i can just type a message and use --file
[14:41] <jelmer> smoser: set "commit-message-from-changelog = False" in bzr-builddeb's config, e.g. ~/.bazaar/builddeb.conf
[14:42] <smoser> thanks to everyone.  i have to say, that i find #bzr to be probably the most immediately helpful channel that i frequent, followed closely by #launchpad.
[14:47] <Wellark> jelmer: the one which comes from oneiri repositories
[14:47] <Wellark> lemmecheck
[14:48] <Wellark> jelmer: 0.7.1-0ubuntu1
[14:48] <jelmer> Wellark: It's fixed in 0.7.2, which is in oneiric. I've just marked your bug as a dupe.
[14:49] <mgz> hm, bzr-builder doesn't have an exposted version number?
[14:49] <jelmer> mgz: it does in 0.7.2 :-)
[14:49] <mgz> and hey, you're talking about exactly the same bug I was just reading mail on
[14:50] <Wellark> 0.7.2 is probably still in proposed
[14:50] <mgz> bug 837741 is the one.
[14:50] <Wellark> I'll grap it there
[14:54] <Wellark> jelmer: I see 0.7.2 for precise, but not for oneiric
[14:55] <jelmer> Wellark: sorry, my bad. I meant to say precise
[14:55] <Wellark> I'll just grab the trunk directly
[14:55] <Wellark> np
[14:55] <jelmer> Wellark: 0.7.2 is indeed not in oneiric. You should be able to grab it from the bzr daily build PPA or install it in ~/.bazaar/plugins manually.
[14:56] <Wellark> yeah, I go manual
[14:59] <Wellark> or not.. apparently I have to upgrade bzrlib, too
[14:59] <Wellark> daily PPA, here I come :)
[15:00] <jelmer> Wellark: it's ppa:bzr/daily
[15:00] <jelmer> Wellark: I'm surprised you would need a newer bzrlib though, did you get an error of sorts?
[15:03] <mgz> hey, on the ubuntu bugs index page for a package it tells you what versions are in what series, hadn't noticed that before
[15:10] <smoser> vila, i just realized that 'take-other' didn't get me my bin.moved directory
[15:10] <smoser> so i'm missing a bunch of bin/ files.
[15:10] <smoser> suggestions on thta ?
[15:12] <vila> bin.moved was put out of the way and 'bzr rm'ed' , so either you move the files you want back into your branch and add them again (suboptimal)
[15:13] <vila> or you come back to the state after 'bzr resolve' to cancel the removal of the files you want to keep
[15:13] <vila> ghaa, this sounds horribly complicated :-/
[15:15] <vila> smoser: did the above make sense or should I explain more ?
[15:15] <smoser> i can easily reproduce the prior-to-resolve state.
[15:15] <jelmer> vila: yeah, we really should address parallel imports at some point..
[15:15] <vila> ok
[15:15] <smoser> so how would i 'cancel the removal' ?
[15:16] <vila> smoser: justasec, trying locally
[15:19] <vila> right,
[15:20] <vila> so, you 'bzr mv bin.moved/* bin' to say : I want to keep those
[15:20] <smoser> i didn't do that, but i can.
[15:20] <vila> it will fail for s3put, leave it for now, do 'bzr mv bin.moved/*admin bin' to get the missing ones
[15:20] <smoser> and there was one file i think that existed in both.
[15:20] <smoser> right.
[15:21] <vila> *now*, if you do 'bzr resolve --take-other' you'll notice that it says: deleted bin.moved/s3put (and deleted bin.moved)
[15:21] <vila> so the original bin and bin/s3put are the only ones deleted
[15:22] <vila> you may want to do the same for ec2/*.moved/*
[15:22] <vila> s/may/probably/
[15:23] <smoser> ok.. so what do i do about the conflicts ?
[15:23] <smoser> what i've done before, which probably got us into this situation was 'bzr rm, bzr add'
[15:24] <vila> EEEEEERK !
[15:24] <vila> :)
[15:24] <vila> never ever do that :)
[15:24] <smoser> well bzr rm seemed like the only way to get the original outof the way.
[15:24] <vila> That's exactly the cause indeed, not a parallel import but a remove/add pair breaking the rename tracking :)
[15:24] <smoser> as 'bzr mv --force' isnt a thing.
[15:25] <vila> when do you need to get the original out of the way ?
[15:25] <smoser> because its different than the right version
[15:25] <smoser> and 'bzr mv' wouldn't do it.
[15:25] <vila> the content ?
[15:25] <smoser> yeah
[15:26] <vila> so you got .THIS .OTHER .BASE ?
[15:26] <vila> and conflict markers in the file /
[15:26] <vila> s!/!?!
[15:26] <smoser> bzr diff ./boto/ec2/autoscale.moved/group.py ./boto/ec2/autoscale/group.py
[15:26] <smoser> as an example.
[15:27] <vila> if .moved appears somewhere, there was a conflict on the name (abusively called content conflict)
[15:27] <vila> resolve --take-other should do the right thing
[15:27] <vila> oh
[15:27] <vila> resolve --take-other  boto/ec2/autoscale/group.py
[15:27] <vila> in this case
[15:28] <vila> either path can be used, which one you use doesn't change the result
[15:29] <smoser> ok.
[15:30] <smoser> i understand the 'rm and add' are bad, but from other rcs (ie git) the result is still sane.
[15:30] <vila> yup
[15:31] <vila> because renames are not tracked
[15:31] <vila> it's the other side of the same coin
[15:32] <vila> and breaks badly for bzr which is why we need to address it
[15:34] <smoser> vila, so does this seem sane:
[15:34] <smoser> $ for d in $(find . -name "*.moved"); do for e in "$d/"* ; do o=${e//.moved/}; if [ -e "$o" ]; then echo bzr resolve --take-other $o; else echo bzr mv $e ${e//.moved/} ; fi; done; done
[15:34] <smoser> bzr resolve --take-other ./bin/s3put
[15:34] <smoser> bzr resolve --take-other ./boto/ec2/autoscale/group.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr resolve --take-other ./boto/ec2/autoscale/__init__.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/autoscale.moved/instance.py ./boto/ec2/autoscale/instance.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr resolve --take-other ./boto/ec2/autoscale/launchconfig.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/autoscale.moved/policy.py ./boto/ec2/autoscale/policy.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/autoscale.moved/request.py ./boto/ec2/autoscale/request.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/autoscale.moved/scheduled.py ./boto/ec2/autoscale/scheduled.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/elb.moved/healthcheck.py ./boto/ec2/elb/healthcheck.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr resolve --take-other ./boto/ec2/elb/__init__.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/elb.moved/instancestate.py ./boto/ec2/elb/instancestate.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/elb.moved/listelement.py ./boto/ec2/elb/listelement.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/elb.moved/listener.py ./boto/ec2/elb/listener.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/elb.moved/loadbalancer.py ./boto/ec2/elb/loadbalancer.py
[15:34] <vila> !pastebin :)
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/elb.moved/policies.py ./boto/ec2/elb/policies.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/elb.moved/securitygroup.py ./boto/ec2/elb/securitygroup.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch.moved/alarm.py ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch/alarm.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch.moved/datapoint.py ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch/datapoint.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr resolve --take-other ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch/__init__.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr mv ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch.moved/listelement.py ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch/listelement.py
[15:34] <smoser> bzr resolve --take-other ./boto/ec2/cloudwatch/metric.py
[15:34] <smoser> crap!
[15:35] <smoser> sorry
[15:35] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/755002/
[15:35] <smoser> thats what i meant to paste.
[15:35] <vila> lol, nw
[15:36] <vila> yup, looks sane, does the resulting diff looks sane ?
[15:41] <smoser> vila, boto/ec2/elb/__init__.py is not conflicted
[15:42] <vila> smoser: no, you did: 'bzr resolve --take-other ./boto/ec2/elb/__init__.py'
[15:42] <vila> so you took the other content
[15:42] <smoser> ok. so that output was expected, and did what i wanted. thats fine.
[15:43] <smoser> now do a blanket resolve ?
[15:43] <vila> what does 'bzr conflicts' says ?
[15:44] <vila> testing locally, there is a problem
[15:45] <vila> my 'either path can be used' was misleading, it applies only when .moved is the only difference between the two paths
[15:46] <smoser> conflicts still lists all the original conflicts.
[15:47] <vila> right, 'bzr st' is clearer here (and also list the conflicts)
[15:47] <vila> is the 'tests' hierarchy deletion deliberate ?
[15:53] <smoser> it moved. i think. have to check, though
[15:54] <smoser> no. tests removal was not deliberate. upstream has it.
[15:55] <smoser> oh wait. it *was* deliberate :-(
[15:55] <smoser> the upstream tarball apparently does not have tests/ in it although revision control does.
[15:55] <vila> testing locally, 'bzr resolve --take-other' output seems fine
[15:55] <smoser> so that sucks for a different reason.
[15:56] <vila> 'bzr revert tests' will restore it
[15:57] <smoser> yeah, but dont you think its probably best to leave it gone ?
[15:57] <vila> I have no idea
[15:57] <smoser> yea.. i was hoping you'd have a better feel for that.
[15:57] <vila> Only a personal preference for not deleting tests (especially all of them ;)
[15:57] <smoser> it does suck that upstream's tarball and revision control tag aren't equal.
[15:58] <smoser> well, the only issue is that my tests/ directory would then be that of 2.0.2, not 2.1.1 and potentially not even work, *and* its different than upstream tests/
[15:58] <smoser> i'll mail upstream about lack of that in tarball as a long term fix.
[16:01] <vila> yeah, exploring with 'bzr qlog', 'tests' was added in 2.0.0-ubuntu1 which get them from upstream-2.0
[16:02] <vila> which ironically outlines why getting the parallel import fixed is important as here if upstream add the tests again, we really want to reconcile the histories
[16:38] <Wellark> jelmer: running bzr daily ppa version of dailydeb fixed the problem as you guessed
[16:39] <Wellark> now. Is there a way to trigger rebuild on dailyppa after uploading new branches?
[16:40] <Wellark> is there any way to see what is the current rebuild period?
[16:41] <jelmer> Wellark: there is a "Build now" link that is shown whenever one of the branches has unbuilt revisions
[16:41] <Wellark> let's see
[16:41] <jelmer> otherwise the branches with changes get rebuilt within a 24-hour window
[16:41] <jelmer> there is no ETA on when in the 24-hour window that is (but an open lp bug about showing that)
[16:43] <Wellark> hmm.. odd.. I can't find the recipe on any of the branches
[16:44] <Wellark> there has to be one as the daily ppa sends me build error emails
[16:44] <Wellark> the build uses these branches: https://code.launchpad.net/~indicator-network-developers/ofono/trunk, https://code.launchpad.net/~indicator-network-developers/ofono/trunk.packaging
[16:45] <Wellark> but both of those branches say: No recipes using this branch.
[16:47] <Wellark> I'm a bit puzzled now
[16:48] <jelmer> Wellark: how did you create the recipe?
[16:48] <Wellark> no, somebody created it before
[16:49] <Wellark> now, I'm suppose to continue development and maintenance of those packages and I'm trying to figure out all the pieces of the puzzle
[16:49] <Wellark> s/no/no, I didn't create it my self/
[16:50] <Wellark> jelmer: do you have some powertool to list the recipes which land stuff to this PPA: https://launchpad.net/~indicator-network-developers/+archive/daily-ppa ?
[16:54] <jelmer> Wellark: usually I just look for recipes owned by the same user that owns the PPA
[16:55] <jelmer> Wellark: based on the versions of the packages in that PPA, it seems like those packages weren't created by a recipe
[16:55] <jelmer> Wellark: it's probably just somebody (a bot?) doing daily source package uploads
[16:56] <Wellark> sigh...
[16:57] <vila> jelmer, mgz: I'm looking at some import failure and I encounter a weird case you may help me to understand, get the branches for debootstrap -rtag:1.0.36 for oneiric, sid and wheezy, launch qlog on them  and tell me it's not as bad as I fear :-/
[17:00] <jelmer> vila: hmm, it seems like the debian and ubuntu branches have parallel imports?
[17:01] <jelmer> vila: seems like it was caused by the fact that ubuntu diverged for a bit, then discarded its changes
[17:01] <mgz> hm.
[17:01] <jelmer> vila: it diverged in 1.0.29ubuntu1, and then discarded that
[17:01] <vila> but the tags '1.0.xx' should be for upstream no ?
[17:02] <vila> they seem to exist with different revids in debian and ubuntu
[17:02] <jelmer> vila: there is no upstream in this case
[17:02] <jelmer> vila: it is a native package
[17:02] <vila> surely the same tag can't be used for different revs ?
[17:03] <vila> even for native packages
[17:03] <vila> and the picture is even more fun when you add the precise branch :-/
[17:05] <jelmer> vila: different branches can have different tags
[17:05] <vila> right, that's the theory, but does it make sense here ?
[17:05] <jelmer> vila: in this case bzr-builddeb doesn't pull from the Debian branch anymore because it sees the Ubuntu and the Debian branch have diverged
[17:06] <vila> precise merged them
[17:07] <mgz> this branch is a little large for my connection, it's not finished yet.
[17:07] <mgz> there we go.
[17:07] <vila> mgz: oh, sorry :-( ~133MB
[17:09] <jelmer> vila: please file a bug against bzr-builddeb
[17:09] <vila> jelmer: so, debian and ubuntu, for native packages, having the same tag used for different versions is expected ?
[17:10] <vila> jelmer: I'm trying to understand first, I'm not sure builddeb is at fault here, the failure is udd so far and it seems it assumes a tag cannot point to different revs there
[17:10] <vila> s/udd/in udd/
[17:10] <vila> jelmer: so, debian and ubuntu, for native packages, having the same tag used for different versions is expected ?
[17:11] <jelmer> vila: no, that's not expected
[17:11] <vila> what tags should they use then ?
[17:12] <vila> x.y.zdebianN and x.y.z.ubuntuN ?
[17:12] <mgz> okay, I see the pretty picture.
[17:12] <jelmer> vila: the tag names aren't the issue
[17:13] <jelmer> vila: it's the fact that bzr-builddeb doesn't pull from the debian branch to import those revisions, and then reimports them itself.
[17:13] <jelmer> vila: and when it reimports htem itself, they end up with new revision ids and tags
[17:14] <vila> ha
[17:14] <vila> so the ubuntu ones are wrong is what you're saying ?
[17:14] <jelmer> vila: when 1.0.30 was synced from debian to ubuntu, that discarded 1.0.29ubuntu1
[17:15] <jelmer> vila: yes
[17:15] <jelmer> it would be interesting to see if you can reproduce this issue by taking the ubuntu branch at 1.0.29ubuntu1 and then trying to import the 1.0.30 package
[17:15] <vila> but the parents of the ubuntu 1.0.30 are 1.0.29ubuntu1 *and* debian 1.0.30
[17:16] <jelmer> vila: the parents of ubuntu 1.0.30 should be 1.0.29 only
[17:16] <jelmer> vila: it should be the same revision as debian 1.0.30
[17:17] <jelmer> vila: what happened is basically the equivalent of "bzr push --overwrite"
[17:17] <vila> meh, 1.0.29ubuntu1 cannot be part of debian right ? Oh, you mean 1.0.29ubuntu1 shouldn't be there *at all* anymore ?
[17:18] <jelmer> vila: right, it shouldn't be there anymore at all
[17:18] <jelmer> vila: if you look at the current changelog.gz, you'll also see it's not there
[17:19] <vila> which the 1.0.30 merge shows in its associated diff yes
[17:20] <vila> I suspect the package importer have no idea this can occur
[17:20] <vila> so both may need to be fixed (importer and buildeb)
[17:22] <vila> no, wait, something is wrong here
[17:24] <vila> say 1.0.29 was for lucid and then 1.0.30 for maverick, I still want 1.0.29 to be there so I can make other dot releases for lucid, as long as the content for 1.0.30, the prior history shouldn't need to be altered
[17:24] <vila> s/as the content/& is correct/
[17:25] <jelmer> vila: I'm not sure I follow?
[17:25] <vila> you said 'right, it shouldn't be there anymore at all' , that sounds excessive
[17:26] <jelmer> in the revision graph for the oneiric branch, 1.0.29ubuntu1 shouldn't be present at all
[17:27] <vila> the tags was a red herring as you explain, knowing they are legit, the branches don't look that weird now
[17:27] <jelmer> 1.0.29, 1.0.30, etc should be present in the oneiric branch
[17:28] <vila> 1.0.29ubuntu1 commit says: 'Cherry-pick from trunk:' so it has been released right  (in natty) ?
[17:28] <vila> why should it disappear from the history in this case ?
[17:29] <vila> it seem the branches converge again at 1.0.30 if they can have different revs for the same tag, what's the issue ?
[17:29] <jelmer> vila: it's like bzr release series
[17:29] <vila> endless superfluous merges ?
[17:30] <jelmer> vila: it's possible to cherry-pick a change from trunk onto 2.1 but it will become a different revision, and that different revision isn't in lp:bzr
[17:30] <vila> right, but it's still part of the 2.1 history and becomes part of bzr.dev history when merged up
[17:31] <jelmer> vila: there was no up-merging from ubuntu into debian here though
[17:31] <jelmer> vila: which is why that revision shouldn't be part of the oneiric history
[17:31] <vila> right and they will never be because ubuntu is downstream and has a larger history
[17:32] <jelmer> vila: ubuntu oneiric has the exact same history as debian sid at the moment
[17:32] <jelmer> vila: they're both shipping 1.0.38
[17:32] <vila> but their branches are different, same content because ubuntu merges debian but still different histories
[17:32] <jelmer> vila: the ubuntu natty branch *should* have 1.0.29ubuntu1
[17:33] <jelmer> vila: their branches should be the same, like for any package where ubuntu doesn't have a delta
[17:33] <vila> we seem to agree about the branch content but disagree about the branch history
[17:34] <jelmer> vila: about what should be in the branch history you mean?
[17:34] <vila> the oneiric history should be a subset of the natty history so 1.0.29ubuntu1 should also be part of oneiric
[17:34] <vila> yes
[17:35] <vila> grr
[17:35] <vila> s/subset/superset/ of course
[17:35] <vila> or not ?
[17:35] <jelmer> vila: I don't think it should be a superset, it doesn't reflect what has actually happened
[17:36] <vila> are you saying the history can somehow be restarted when a new ubuntu release is started ?
[17:36] <vila> so the natty branch and the oneiric one can really diverge and never be reconciled ?
[17:38] <vila> my understanding was that launchpad was always creating the new release branches from the previous release...
[17:38] <jelmer> vila: sure - the same thing happens e.g. with SRUs
[17:39] <jelmer> james_w: around?
[17:39] <vila> right, but SRU happen *after* the branches have been bootstrapped
[17:39] <vila> miss an s, here are some ssss
[17:40] <jelmer> vila: the bootstrapping and old branches don't really matter I think
[17:41] <jelmer> vila: the point is that when ubuntu discards its changes for a package, we should reflect that in the history
[17:41]  * vila blinks
[17:41] <vila> by removing a revision ?
[17:41] <jelmer> vila: effectively, what ubuntu is doing is:
[17:42] <jelmer> taking a debian, making some local changes to it
[17:42] <jelmer> taking a debian package (1.0.29), making some local changes to it and uploading that (1.0.29ubuntu1)
[17:42] <vila> recording that in the branh history
[17:42] <jelmer> then later, when e.g. the fixes in 1.0.29ubuntu1 have been applied upstream too, they discard their version of it
[17:42] <jelmer> "bzr pull --overwrite debianlp:debootstrap"
[17:43] <jelmer> so they again have the same history as debian
[17:43] <vila> wow
[17:43] <vila> and no trace that 1.0.29ubuntu1 ever existed ?
[17:44] <jelmer> right - see debian/changelog in e.g. 1.0.37, no sign that 1.0.29ubuntu1 was ever there
[17:44] <vila> hehe, touche
[17:44] <vila> hmm
[17:44] <vila> right, so I see your point
[17:44] <vila> I don't think it is what is implemented yet though,
[17:45] <vila> but I can imagine that the failures are related
[17:45] <vila> I'll big further tomorrow, thanks for the explanations and the discussion
[17:46] <vila> s/big.... ???/dig/
[17:47] <jelmer> :) see you tomorrow
[17:48] <vila> hmm, and the tag should be deleted too, everywhere :) ...
[17:49] <jelmer> vila: not everywhere, just those ubuntu releases that no longer have the version..
[17:49] <vila> ha ! Who is making things harder now ! :0D
[17:50] <jelmer> vila: I don't think that's making things harder - it's just one of the things we should do when we do the "bzr pull --overwrite" from debian
[17:53] <vila> yeah, was mostly kidding.
[17:54] <vila> --overwrite may have a lot of unforeseen fallouts is what I meant, people having mirrors and so on
[17:54] <vila> or pending proposals
[17:55] <Wellark> hmm.. I'm trying to write a recipe
[17:55] <Wellark> my .recipe file contains:
[17:55] <jelmer> vila: I don't think we necessarily handle that very well at the moment, as we record the parent but don't actually have the changes from 1.0.29ubuntu1
[17:55] <vila> anyway, food for thougt, first of all, fixing the imports ;) EOD, have fun !
[17:55] <Wellark> # bzr-builder format 0.4 deb-version {debupstream}-0ubuntu1+bzr{revno}+bzr{revno:packaging}
[17:56] <jelmer> vila: g'night & g'appetite :)
[17:56] <Wellark> but running $bzr dailydeb gives me an error
[17:56] <Wellark> bzr: ERROR: Invalid deb-version: {debupstream}-0ubuntu1+bzr5947+bzr2792: Invalid version string '{debupstream}-0ubuntu1+bzr5947+bzr2792'
[17:56] <Wellark> so it seems that {depupstream} doesn't get substituted
[17:57] <jelmer> Wellark: what's the full recipe?
[17:58] <Wellark> jelmer: $ cat ofono.recipe
[17:58] <Wellark> # bzr-builder format 0.4 deb-version {debupstream}-0ubuntu1+bzr{revno}+bzr{revno:packaging}
[17:58] <Wellark> ofono.trunk
[17:58] <Wellark> arg,,
[17:58] <Wellark> argh.
[17:58] <Wellark> jelmer: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/755157/
[17:59] <jelmer> Wellark: does ofono.trunk have a debian/ directory? If not, you probably want {debupstream:packaging}
[17:59] <Wellark> ah, ok
[18:01] <Wellark> jelmer: ok, now it works!
[18:01] <Wellark> jelmer: then there's a documentation bug
[18:02] <Wellark> bzr help dailydeb says
[18:02] <Wellark> "{debupstream} will be replaced by the upstream portion of the version number taken from debian/changelog in the final tree."
[18:02] <Wellark> bzr help builder, I mean
[18:02] <jelmer> Wellark: "bzr help dailydeb" doesn
[18:02] <jelmer> t mention {debupstream} here
[18:06] <jelmer> Wellark: never mind, found it in "bzr help builder"
[18:06] <Wellark> jelmer: 20:00:11 < Wellark> bzr help builder, I mean
[18:06] <Wellark> :)
[18:08] <Wellark> jelmer: do you want a bug report or will you handle this on your own?
[18:13] <jelmer> Wellark: submitting a fix now
[18:16] <jelmer> Wellark: thanks for reporting that, btw
[18:18] <Wellark> jelmer: no problem
[18:18] <Wellark> thank you for fixing it so quickly! :)
[18:48] <smoser> vila, i can't seem to get rid of all the add/remove pairs
[18:48] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/755216/
[18:52] <mgz> jelmer: reviewed bzr-builddeb mp
[19:02] <jelmer> mgz: merci
[19:27] <jelmer> mgz: updated
[19:34] <smoser> vila, i'm sure you're sleeping or afk, but it seems to me that this ended up doing what i wanted
[19:34] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/755287/
[19:34] <smoser> i would appreciate your input (or others) as to if this will then get me into a sane state for merges from debian and/or upstream in the future.
[19:38] <mgz> ah, so I don't get bzr-builddeb bug mail...
[19:38] <jelmer> smoser: I'm not entirely sure if that revert command will do the right thing. I would personally use "bzr resolve --take-other $d"
[19:40] <mgz> I probably need to join bzr-builddeb-hackers
[19:43] <jelmer> mgz: you should be able to be subscribed without being in the team that owns bzr-builddeb
[19:44] <jelmer> mgz: that said, you probably should join bzr-builddeb-hackers >-)
[19:44] <jelmer> smoser: the diff output seems reasonable enough though
[20:49] <mgz> hey, that's a fun regression
[20:49] <mgz> too many yaks, too many yaks
[20:51] <jelmer> mgz: hmm?
[20:55] <poolie> hi all
[20:55] <mgz> something in 2.5 broke the error you get when trying to commit an unversioned file, with non-ascii filenames
[20:56] <mgz> it was kinda bust before but now it's good ol' "Unprintable exception"
[20:56] <mgz> which... as I was trying to test a different fix against that was very confusing
[21:05] <poolie> hm
[21:05] <poolie> mgz, i would like to change the tests from using hardcoded file names to getting the names from some kind of factory object
[21:11] <mgz> picking well known problem values isn't bad.
[21:11] <poolie> so that more of them can be unicode
[21:11] <poolie> right they could just start with a list like that
[21:11] <poolie> we may need to adjust it for non unicode filesystems
[21:11] <poolie> though, actually, there really are none of them
[21:12] <poolie> so perhaps we just need to make sure the tests always run with the right fsenc
[21:16] <mgz> there is a problem at the moment where testing of filenames is ad hoc where people have reported bugs rather than systematic
[21:16] <mgz> but...
[21:16] <poolie> right
[22:04] <james_w> jelmer, I am now
[22:05] <jelmer> hi james_w
[22:05] <james_w> hi
[22:05] <james_w> how are you?
[22:05] <jelmer> I'm well, how are you ?
[22:06] <jelmer> james_w: vila and I were looking at an interesting importer issue this afternoon
[22:06] <jelmer> james_w: basically, the importer wasn't dealing well with revisions with ubuntu-specific changes that were discarded
[22:07] <jelmer> james_w: shouldn't those just be discarded from the branch history in Ubuntu as well so that the ubuntu branch has the same contents as the debian branch ?
[22:09] <james_w> jelmer, IIRC it should make the trees the same, but leave the revisions in place
[22:09] <jelmer> james_w: and then do a merge for every subsequent revision?
[22:10] <jelmer> james_w: IOW, once there has been a ubuntu-specific revision, the revision graphs will never ever converge again?
[22:12] <james_w> jelmer, yeah
[22:12] <james_w> that seemed to more accurately reflect the upload history to Ubuntu
[22:14] <jelmer> james_w: ah, so it's about the upload history rather than the actual package history I guess
[22:14] <james_w> yeah
[22:15] <jelmer> vila: ^
[23:08] <mgz> heh
[23:08] <mgz> bisected regression... comes out at r6124 ;_;
[23:10] <mgz> guess it's a gettext change then.
[23:10]  * mgz does the hidden 16 former mainline revs as well
[23:11] <mgz> 6123.1.10 indeed.


[00:17] <trentg> Hello
[00:18] <trentg> Anybody know why I get connection refused trying to connect/upload to ppa.launchpad.net?
[00:18] <trentg> Using ftp, using sftp or scp it times out.
[00:18] <penguin42> trentg: It broke
[00:18] <trentg> Oh
[00:19] <trentg> Any ideas when it might be back online?
[00:21] <oojah_> It worked for me just now.
[00:21] <elmo> it's back online at the moment
[00:22] <kri0> This is kinda offtopic, but does anyone one know if there is a bug tracker that allows setting a bounty for a bug, real money? )
[00:23] <trentg> Thanks, it's working now
[00:25] <kri0> for an open source project
[00:29] <penguin42> kri0: There are bug bounty sites out there - never used ones; of course there are also places that youc an buy support (as you say OT)
[00:40] <kri0> yeah, i see some 'bug bounty programs' from different vendors, what i'd like is to have a reverse 'bounty option' built-in to a tracker. That is, when someone submits a bug he would really like to see fixed, he could assing a bounty from his pocket, not the vendors. and others to be able to chip in micropayment like. The bounty goes to the developer who fixes it.
[01:54] <MTecknology> GAH!!!
[01:54] <MTecknology> I build perfect in a pbuilder environment; but breaks right near the tail end on lp
[01:55] <Ampelbein> MTecknology: do you have a buildlog?
[01:55] <MTecknology> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/70703826/buildlog_ubuntu-maverick-amd64.nginx_1.0.0-svn3185-ppa205~maverick1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[01:56] <MTecknology> Ampelbein: builds nginx-light and nginx-full great; almost finishes nginx-extras; poof
[01:58] <MTecknology> aah........
[01:58] <MTecknology> it's missing from the pushed branch
[01:59] <MTecknology> that'll make a big difference. :P
[02:24] <MTecknology> wow!
[02:24] <MTecknology> estimated time until build.... on 2011-05-01
[02:37] <reviczky> Hi, I'm trying to make a launchpad-recipe, merging 2 branches. They have partially common folders, but no common files, like branch1: test/file1 and branch2: test/file2. If I try "merge" I get "Branches have no common ancestor", if I try "nest-part" I get "ERROR: Conflicts from merge" It's somewhat bug #515731, but not packaging related. Any solutions or workarounds? I have to keep the branches separately.
[02:40] <wgrant> reviczky: Why must they be set up like that?
[02:40] <wgrant> That sounds like an awful mess :(
[02:40] <reviczky> because they are two different projects
[02:40] <MTecknology> even messier than the recipes I needed to come up with :P
[02:41] <wgrant> reviczky: And you have to merge the trees at the same level to build?
[02:41] <reviczky> yes
[02:41] <wgrant> Why?
[02:42] <reviczky> so I'm importint the code into launchpad, 2 different branches, and one is the main containing the program, the others are extension modules that needs to be there at build time
[02:42] <wgrant> You can't include them as a subdirectory instead?
[02:42] <reviczky> the use the same folder structure
[02:42] <reviczky> scripts/... doc/.. are all shared
[02:42] <reviczky> but no conflicts
[02:42] <wgrant> Well, there are conflicts :)
[02:42] <wgrant> Just not file conflicts.
[02:43] <reviczky> yeah, thats what i mean
[02:43] <MTecknology> a directory is a conflict the same as a file
[02:43] <reviczky> i see
[02:43] <reviczky> until now i was merging by hand, means copying together, i wanted to have some automation
[02:43] <MTecknology> a copy isn't a merge
[02:44] <MTecknology> a merge is for branches that separated
[02:44] <wgrant> reviczky: How do you normally build it during development?
[02:44] <wgrant> reviczky: Having to manually merge two trees together sounds like a terrible task.
[02:44] <reviczky> well this is what i did until now, by hand:
[02:44] <reviczky> getting the two branches
[02:44] <reviczky> copying them together
[02:44] <reviczky> add the debian tree
[02:44] <reviczky> and build
[02:45] <reviczky> so i could do the same in 1 branch
[02:45] <reviczky> but it since they are maintained deparately it would be nicer to hve them in separate branches
[02:45] <wgrant> It seems like a fairly bad idea to be trying to merge two trees together like that.
[02:45] <MTecknology> the branches?
[02:45] <wgrant> They should either be one branch, separate packages, or one should be in a subdirectory of the other.
[02:46] <reviczky> what does the Fix commited in bug 515731 mean? is it solved? how? is it available on the launchpad buildfarm?
[02:47] <wgrant> It's not available on Launchpad yet.
[02:47] <MTecknology> reviczky: what branches?
[02:47] <reviczky> so this is what i have right now: https://code.launchpad.net/context-beta
[02:47] <reviczky> its more then 2 branches, but that doesnt matter
[02:48] <wgrant> What's the difference between /context and /context-beta?
[02:48] <reviczky> that this uses an experimental tree
[02:49] <wgrant> It should probably not be a separate project unless it's a fork, but OK.
[02:49] <reviczky> i have some own modifications
[02:49] <reviczky> but yeah, ive noticed that
[02:49] <reviczky> but until i dont really have it working, i just wanted to experiment with the repices
[02:50] <wgrant> reviczky: Is there a good reason to not have the separate trees as separate packages?
[02:50] <wgrant> A reasonable rule is that one source tree => one source package
[02:50] <MTecknology> reviczky: something like that... each separate module you're building should be in it's own sib directory and your packaging should handle bringing the process together, even better - the vompile process .. (assuming these are modules)
[02:50] <wgrant> s/rule/guideline/
[02:51] <wgrant> Or that, yes.
[02:51] <reviczky> hmm, right, i can do that
[02:51] <reviczky> thanks, im gonna give that a try
[02:52] <wgrant> reviczky: I would really encourage you to use the existing https://launchpad.net/context project instead.
[02:52] <reviczky> ok, im gonna get in touch with them
[02:53] <wgrant> You can just push branches up there.
[02:53] <reviczky> i see
[02:55] <reviczky> the problem is also btw, that they dont have a version controlled source code ...
[02:55] <reviczky> and that wont change in the near future
[02:55] <wgrant> That is quite spectacular.
[02:56] <reviczky> so i have to import the code myself or with a script
[02:56] <wgrant> :/
[02:56] <reviczky> and this is why id like to have the branches separate, because i would loose the overview
[02:57] <wgrant> I guess this explains why it seems somewhat insane and completely VCS-unfriendly.
[02:57] <reviczky> right, so using separate subdirs is fine, thanks for the help
[02:57] <wgrant> :(
[02:57] <reviczky> yeah, its all a mess a right now :(
[02:58] <reviczky> and it doesnt work out of the box in ubuntu anymore
[02:58] <reviczky> thats why i have some patches
[03:02] <MTecknology> wgrant: please make builds go faster! :'(
[03:03] <MTecknology> buy 500 machines for builders!
[04:05] <cody-somerville> MTecknology, You could use AWS yourself.
[04:19] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: hm?
[04:20] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: oh! amazon?
[04:20] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: It was building perfectly fine in my own setup; turns out i missed svn add on 3 files in obscure places
[04:21] <cody-somerville> MTecknology, My comment was in reference to "buy 500 machines for builders!". ;)
[04:22] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: i don't think my purchase of amazon systems would help launchpad ... and i'm still struggingling to pay for taxes in the next 3 months
[04:24] <cody-somerville> I'm suggesting using in lieu of Launchpad. It would be pretty cheap for just yourself and you could spawn as many builders as you needed.
[04:25] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: but then how would the nightly builds end up on launchpad?
[04:25] <MTecknology> https://code.launchpad.net/~nginx/+recipe/nginx-nightly
[04:25] <MTecknology> Don't ask me why I sent it to build for oneiric.....
[04:27] <MTecknology> is the toolchain for 11.11 even close to settled yet?
[04:28] <cody-somerville> This probably isn't the right place to ask that.
[04:28] <MTecknology> true, i'd go bug in +1 but that's still closed
[04:29] <StevenK> MTecknology: *11.10*
[04:30] <MTecknology> .....
[04:30] <MTecknology> wow.... i've been calling it 11.11 for so long too
[04:30] <MTecknology> face meets palm moment
[04:30] <cody-somerville> maybe its a sign :)
[04:31] <StevenK> MTecknology: And if you read ubuntu-devel-announce, you'd see that doko announced 11.10 is open for uploads over eight hours ago.
[04:33] <MTecknology> cody-somerville: a sign that i need sleep?
[04:33] <wgrant> StevenK: Over eight hours ago?
[04:33] <MTecknology> StevenK: i thought the toolchain still changed after uploads were opened
[04:34] <wgrant> StevenK: It was well over 12.
[04:34] <wgrant> MTecknology: It's mostly done before that.
[04:34] <wgrant> There will be further minor changes, mostly after UDS.
[04:34] <wgrant> The major toolchain changes are done in a PPA per
[04:34] <wgrant> ... before release.
[04:34] <wgrant> So the new series can be opened within hours of the previous series' release.
[04:35] <wgrant> (assuming the mirrors aren't misbehaving, which caused this one to take almost 24 hours :/)
[04:36] <StevenK> wgrant: Meh, the point is, it was multiple hours ago, so there is no point going "Geee, when does Oneiric open for uploads?"
[04:36] <wgrant> Indeed.
[04:39] <MTecknology> StevenK: pretty sure, that's not what I asked
[04:39] <MTecknology> I sent this to upload...
[04:39] <StevenK> MTecknology: However, wgrant answered your question anyway.
[04:39] <MTecknology> yes, he did
[04:41] <MTecknology> StevenK: I used to remember you being a really helpful and friendly person. :(
[15:55] <c_korn> hello, I keep getting this error with my script: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=72urwRAa
[16:09] <wgrant> c_korn: staging's broken at the moment. You might want to use qastaging.launchpad.net for the next few days instead.
[16:22] <c_korn> hm, if I knew how to change this. I think this is the line I somehow need to configure: launchpad = Launchpad(credentials, EDGE_SERVICE_ROOT, cachedir)
[16:51] <maxb> c_korn: Thats a pretty old-style invocation of launchpadlib, what version are you using?
[16:55] <c_korn> the version of natty I think
[16:56] <c_korn> Installed: 1.9.7-0ubuntu2
[17:12] <maxb> c_korn: OK, for your immediate issue, pass 'qastaging' instead of EDGE_SERVICE_ROOT
[17:12] <c_korn> maxb: ok, this works now, launchpad = Launchpad.login_with('My Application', 'production'). thanks for the hint
[20:18] <MTecknology> my day wait for build is almost up :D
[21:08] <timrc>     0 source packages (5.3 KiB)
[21:09] <timrc> seems odd to me that 0 source packages takes up 5.3 KiB of space :)
[21:09] <timrc> perhaps due to lazy package deletion?
[21:22] <cody-somerville> timrc, indexes probably count
[22:06] <akoskm> hi! can anybody help my in using my existing gpg key. debsign returns with "...secret key not available" even if my key is showing up in gpg --list-keys
[22:07] <lifeless> If I remember gpg --edit-secret <email>
[22:07] <lifeless> will let you see that
[22:08] <akoskm> hmm. it says invalid options
[22:12] <lifeless> check the help :)
[22:13] <lifeless> [sorry I'm not all that helpful, I'm really not here today]
[22:13] <maxb> akoskm: Try gpg --list-secret-keys
[22:14] <akoskm> just tried, that shows nothing
[22:16] <maxb> akoskm: That would imply you have no secret keys available in your current keyring
[22:16] <akoskm> what I did was # gpg --search-keys akoskm, it listed me I selected that entry
[22:16] <akoskm> maxb: indeed. what should I do to add the secret key too?
[22:16] <maxb> Where is your secret key currently stored?
[22:17] <akoskm> in ~/.ssh/
[22:17] <maxb> Your GPG key is stored in your ~/.ssh/ ? I am sceptical
[22:17] <akoskm> if that one is which end with .asc
[22:18] <akoskm> I'm not really sure in these terms, just followed the guide on launchpad..
[22:19] <maxb> Which guide?
[22:19] <akoskm> where I can modify the OpenPGP keys
[22:19] <akoskm> there were the instructions to create and upload the key
[22:20] <akoskm> I did that and signed my packages so far successfully
[22:20] <maxb> akoskm: I'm fairly sure none of that would have told you to put OpenPGP keys in ~/.ssh, because that would just be weirdly confusing
[22:21] <maxb> Well, what have you changed since you last signed a package successfully?
[22:21] <akoskm> upgraded my ubuntu to natty
[22:21] <akoskm> so I suppose some things were gone
[22:21] <maxb> Did this involve doing anything destructive to your home directory?
[22:22] <akoskm> no, it is on a separate drive
[22:25] <akoskm> here is the message what I'm getting at the end of debuild: http://pastebin.com/6eMP9pfX
[22:25] <akoskm> and my key is uploaded to http://keyserver.ubuntu.com/
[22:26] <maxb> This seems to indicate that you have somehow lost your secret key from where it should be stored in ~/.gnupg/secring.gpg
[22:31] <akoskm> Indeed, all files in that directory were created today. :/
[22:32] <maxb> Oh dear.
[22:32] <maxb> Did you have a backup?
[22:33] <Ampelbein> akoskm: just a wild guess, is the filesystem with your home mounted? as you indicated it is on a seperate drive.
[22:33] <akoskm> from that directory? no.
[22:33] <akoskm> Ampelbein: it is
[22:33] <akoskm> :)
[22:33] <Ampelbein> akoskm: ok, I had the same problem once, wondered where all my stuff is gone ;-)
[22:40] <akoskm> maxb: so, if there is no backup about that directory I can't use my key, it is simple like that?
[22:40] <maxb> yes
[22:40] <maxb> You will have to generate a new one from scratch, and redo all setup steps involved.
[22:41] <akoskm> hmm
[22:41] <akoskm> can I sign the code of conduct with one account twice?
[22:41] <maxb> (and there is no way to remove your old key from the public keyservers, ever)
[22:44] <maxb> Oh, you can skip the CoC step - your old signature still counts for that
[23:00] <akoskm> maxb: thank you, I'll back up my key next time ;)


[01:43] <NefariousAryq> Hey folks... considering a switch to Mythbuntu.  Currently run a self-rolled Slackware + MythTV setup, but it doesnt have the "ease" to administer as I'd like (as much as I love Slackware, its really not 'right' for this project).  Anyway -- can someone give me some good pointers on the best way to move my database once I install Mythbuntu?  This DB goes back 4+ years now, and I definitely dont wanna screw this
[02:18] <bushtuckerman> Hi, I installed Mythbuntu 10.04 and it looks great, only the most fundamental aspect of having a HTPC eludes me. From where can I add video files into it? More importantly where can I add network shares from? I have been through the settings and there is nothing there that I can see that will allow this!
[02:34] <peter81> hi all, I downloaded the latest mythbuntu 10.04 lastnight and installed it on my HPG61 Laptop. The install went well, however when myth boots, I only ever get to a blank screen (there are some myth splash screens during bootup, but eventually just a blank screen). I suspect it's a video card driver issue, but my experience with linux is limited. Can anyone step me through how to solve
[02:34] <peter81> this problem?
[07:44] <bushtuckerman> Can anyone help? I installed Mythbuntu 10.04 and it looks great, only the most fundamental aspect of having a HTPC eludes me. From where can I add video files into it? More importantly where can I add network shares from? I have been through the settings (or more to the point "Applications" because this is the only menu I have) and there is nothing there that I can see that will allow this!
[08:02] <stefano> Hi everyone! I've just installed 10-04 and I would share media between Windows Media Player and 10-04. I'm using virtual machines as test before install. Where can I start?
[08:02] <stefano> Hi rhpot1991!
[08:02] <stefano> Perhaps I forgot something of your suggestion of yesterday...
[08:03] <stefano> :-(
[08:11] <stefano> Please, I haven't found much help in wiki and forum, is there any other source I can use?
[08:12] <stefano> I have some customers interested in buying a solution based on Myth so I can pay for close cooperation
[09:26] <stefano> Am I the only one here? :-)
[10:11] <hads> No
[11:37] <hunter> hello
[11:37] <hunter> i need help
[11:37] <hunter> please
[16:31] <Shadow__X> hey guys so in the auto builds you switched the protocol version to 56 instead of 23056 on mythtv 23.1 fixes?
[16:33] <tgm4883> Shadow__X, no?
[16:33] <Shadow__X> hmm thats weird because i am trying to use my os x frontend and i keep getting a mismatch
[16:33] <tgm4883> what is the output of
[16:34] <tgm4883> dpkg -l mythtv-backend
[16:34] <Shadow__X> my os x frontend says the server uses network protocol version 56 but this frontend only understands 23056
[16:35] <tgm4883> what is the output the above command?
[16:35] <Shadow__X> dpkg -l mythtv-backend
[16:35] <Shadow__X> Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Purge/Hold
[16:35] <Shadow__X> | Status=Not/Inst/Cfg-files/Unpacked/Failed-cfg/Half-inst/trig-aWait/Trig-pend
[16:35] <Shadow__X> |/ Err?=(none)/Reinst-required (Status,Err: uppercase=bad)
[16:35] <Shadow__X> ||/ Name           Version        Description
[16:35] <Shadow__X> +++-[16:35] <Shadow__X> ii  mythtv-backend 0.23.0++fixes2 A personal video recorder application (serve
[16:36] <tgm4883> mythtv-backend 0.23.0
[16:36] <tgm4883> there is your problem
[16:36] <tgm4883> you aren't on 0.23.1
[16:36] <Shadow__X> hmm do i have to update the auto builds package
[16:37] <tgm4883> dpkg-reconfigure mythbuntu-repos
[16:39] <Shadow__X> ok working thanks i didnt know i had to do that
[16:39] <Shadow__X> also it would seem the us mirror was erroring out
[16:39] <Shadow__X> so i used the ppa one
[16:39] <tgm4883> yep
[16:39] <tgm4883> working on it :)
[16:39] <tgm4883> unfortunatly, i'm not in control of those servers
[16:40] <Shadow__X> oh ok
[16:40] <Shadow__X> thanks tgm4883
[16:42] <Gibby1313> cool, I think that is the issue I was having too
[17:06] <Gibby1313> so i did the dpkg -l mythtv-backend, and it reports 0.23.0+fixes 25, I did the dpkg-reconfigure and there is no 23.1 option
[17:09] <tgm4883> Gibby1313, dpkg -l mythbuntu-repos
[17:10] <Gibby1313> 8.0
[17:11] <tgm4883> Gibby1313, apt-get install mythbuntu-repos
[17:11] <tgm4883> that should upgrade it
[17:11] <tgm4883> IIRC, you need 8.2
[17:11] <Gibby1313> k
[17:11] <Gibby1313> have to do that on all my frontends then too huh?
[17:11] <tgm4883> yep
[17:12] <tgm4883> an apt-get upgrade would bring that down too
[17:12] <tgm4883> but apt-get install mythbuntu-repos is faster cause it only does that package
[17:13] <Gibby1313> ok
[17:18] <Gibby1313> so then i do the dpkg-reconfigure mythbuntu-repos and select 23.1 then i do apt-get install mythtv-backend
[17:21] <tgm4883> Gibby1313, yea, although i'd just do the apt-get upgrade after that instead of mythtv-backend
[17:25] <Gibby1313> errr, it was to do a kernel upgrade too... errrrr
[17:27] <Gibby1313> I am now having issue failed to fetch 404 errors with apt-get update
[17:28] <Gibby1313> Does anyone know if mythzoneminder got fixed?
[17:30] <Gibby1313> is http://us.autobuilds.mythbuntu.org/mythbuntu/0.23.1/ubuntu...... down?
[17:31] <rhpot1991> Daviey: tgm4883 ^
[17:33] <Daviey> no, something is wrong and i need to investigate
[17:33] <Daviey> :(
[17:34] <Gibby1313> who hosts its?
[17:37]  * tgm4883 shrugs
[17:37] <tgm4883> Gibby1313, use the PPA
[17:38] <rhpot1991> ya PPA works fine
[17:38] <tgm4883> Daviey, if you can find jya, I think his is broken too
[17:38] <tgm4883> same way
[17:38] <rhpot1991> Gibby1313: sudo dpkg-reconfigure mythbuntu-repos
[17:38] <rhpot1991> and then choose PPA instead
[17:39] <Gibby1313> k
[17:40] <Gibby1313> thanks guys
[17:40] <Gibby1313> wish I had a way to contribute
[17:40]  * Daviey runs US and UK (same server)
[17:40] <Daviey> FR is run by jya
[17:40] <tgm4883> de works :)
[17:41] <Daviey> superm1 runs DE??
[17:43] <tgm4883> Daviey, yep
[17:43] <Gibby1313> I have space on a server in FR if it is ever needed
[17:44] <rhpot1991> but superm1 doesn't live in DE
[17:44] <Gibby1313> I don't live in FR.... :)
[17:46] <tgm4883> I live in the US, but don't have a server
[17:47] <Daviey> Gibby1313: it is appreciate!  I think jya has it in hand, but if he ever goes awol - it's good to know there is someone that can take the slack!
[17:47] <Daviey> appreciated*
[17:47] <Gibby1313> Anyway I can help Myth, I will do
[17:48] <Gibby1313> looks like us.archive.ubuntu.com is down too
[17:48] <Zinn> [us.archive.ubuntu.com] Index of /
[17:50] <Daviey> that is not related to us :/
[17:50] <Gibby1313> I know just saying...
[17:54] <superm1> Daviey, yes superm1 runs DE
[17:54] <superm1> what's so crazy about that?
[17:55] <superm1> or at least controls that vhost
[17:56] <Daviey> at least the DE server really is in DE :)
[18:10] <Gibby> I am trying to signin to http://www.mythbuntu.org with my Google Open ID, I use https://www.google.com/accounts/o8/id as my open ID, it accepts my google ID, I am redirected back to mythbuntu and it tells me to fill out the form below, but there is no form....
[18:15] <superm1> Gibby, is the ID that google's openid spitting out something that might already be in use?
[18:16] <superm1> i thought the way it works is that it tries to generate a username from the openid and then binds that openid to the username it generated
[18:16] <Gibby> nope, i even updated and it used a custom profile openid for google
[18:18] <Gibby> errrr, google even shows mythbuntu has access to use my id
[18:25] <Gibby> mythbuntu.org — Sign in using your Google account [ Revoke Access ]
[18:25] <Gibby> That is what my google account show
[18:25] <Gibby> s
[22:38] <tgm4883> !auto%
[22:38] <Zinn> Auto builds contain more recent bug fixes than the normal Ubuntu repository contains.  See http://www.mythbuntu.org/auto-builds for more info.


 It can be for me also. But usually only when I'm slamming through multiple apps quickly. This was a bigger problem at my last job where I used my phone for work.
 goodness Polari just blows as an IRC Client
 Freenode will not change my nick with it
 Google+ post by Rodney Fletcher … https://plus.google.com/+RodneyFletcher/posts/UFn11Mo3wJT
 that last one would be me lol
 ESC  :q! <-- I know
 Only the ! if you don't want to save changes
 It could be wq
 Only if you made changes you want to keep.  The ! Is for I'm sure I don't want to keep the changes.
 It's the safest way to exit vi.  Vi is a horrible editor. If you can't exit, you probably messed up editing.
 Haven't had much issue with Vim
 @SivaMachina, Vim... You monster!
 @AdamOutler, sudo apt-get install nano works best
 Syntax highlighting with markdown and word wrapping out of the box or with issue on vim.... Might be easy on Nano didn't have much luck when I tried with word wrapping but it quite possibly user error.
 Vi bad, vim goooood
 @KMyers, sudo *apt* install.  apt-get is soooo 15.10
 I know, just a force of habit
 Hehe.  Me too.  However I've started adapting.
 I am currently drinking Champaign at work
[17:09] <maxolasersquad> I worked at a wine and cheese place for a few months. Would sometimes tell me boss, "Sure, I'll take out the trash. I just need to sober up a bit."
[17:10] <maxolasersquad> A little known vim tip, to save and quit: ZZ
[17:10] <maxolasersquad> Easier than :wq
 I'm having a problem with Ubuntu Server.  When I'm booting the installation USB, I select HWE (hardware enablement).  This allows network access.  But once it is installed, I have no way to use network.  Ethernet and WiFi are down.  To make drivers, I need internet to install make.
 Maybe someone can help a Linux n00b?
[17:18] <maxolasersquad> Which version of Ubuntu?
[17:23] <maxolasersquad> On 16.04 server installation just select English, then "Install Ubuntu Server". Select your keyboard. Give it a hostname and username/password. Select timezon, partitioning. After installation completes reboot.
[17:37] <maxolasersquad> There are more questions, like installing additional packages, installing grub. But the defaults should automatically configure the network interfaces.
 The defaults leave me with only a LO network connection.
 Apparently the HWE kernel used to install Ubuntu, is not used during runtime.
 Any idea what HWE changes?  Is it used for Secure/verified Boot or simulating some resource?
 I've tried using 16.04.02 and 17.04
 Seever 16.04.02 has the option for HWE which enables networking. But after installation, I have none.
[17:57] <maxolasersquad> I just ran an install in a VM, but it was 16.04.1.
[17:57] <maxolasersquad> I think HWE gives you a newer kernel, but I could easily be wrong on that point.
 Speaking of servers has anyone tried  Mastadon?
[18:15] <maxolasersquad> The twitter alternative?
[18:17] <maxolasersquad> "The Ubuntu LTS enablement (also called HWE or Hardware Enablement) stacks provide newer kernel and X support for existing Ubuntu LTS releases." - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/LTSEnablementStack
[18:22] <maxolasersquad> The 16.04.2 installer did add the HWE option, but that's neither likely nor helping anything.
[18:22] <maxolasersquad> hurting or helping anything.
 It helps because I can actually get updates in the installer, but how do I install the HWE package to the disk from the installer or from the recovery mode?
[18:29] <maxolasersquad> Without HWE networking doesn't work?
[18:29] <maxolasersquad> doesn't work in the installer?
[18:31] <maxolasersquad> On the machine you installed it type `sudo apt install linux-generic` then hit your tab key. It should complete to "linux-generic-hwe-16.04" if the hwe packages are installed. Choosing that option from within the installer should have installed that package.
[18:33] <maxolasersquad> You can manually donwload that package from http://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/kernel/linux-generic-hwe-16.04-edge
[18:34] <maxolasersquad> But it's just a meta package, what you really want is http://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/kernel/linux-image-4.8.0-46-generic
 There are recommends that total 500mb.  Is there a simpler way?
 --install-recommends must be used as a switch with that installation.  It's a lot of extra packages.
 Networking works in the installer, but not once I've booted.
[18:53] <maxolasersquad> There are so many possibilities. Sounds like a SE question.
 Server Exchange?
 I really just need a way to download all of the recommended packages for the HWE kernel to a thumb drive...  Without having to manually download each one, one-by-one, I think.
[18:58] <maxolasersquad> Stack Exchange.
[18:59] <maxolasersquad> Did you check that The hwe kernel is not already installed?
 I will try that.   No it is not.  I have network in the installer but only when selecting HWE.  after booting, no network.
 BTW this is Intel NUC mini itx hardware.
 Looks like this. https://www.google.com/shopping/product/8935983269331792570?lsf=seller:8438988,rt:2,lsfqd:0&prds=oid:2707067936222825461&q=intel+nuc&hl=en&ei=1rP3WJ-3L-fg0gL2waOACw&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwif-v-emrHTAhVnsFQKHfbgCLAQsIwCCAQ.  I have a 500GB ssd and 8Gb ram.
[19:01] <maxolasersquad> In the installer there is a place where you can manually select packages to install. You could select the meta package at that point.
[19:02] <maxolasersquad> Those NUCs are super cool. We run one at a food coop I volunteer at.
 https://www.xda-developers.com/xda-external-link/pre-alpha-build-of-arch-linux-running-natively-on-the-google-pixel-c/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+xda-developers%2FShsH+%28xda-developers%29
 so is keith switching to arch then?
 I wonder what this could be
 The installer for Ubuntu server manual selection is not working. It's broken apparently
 Nice ∆∆
 Is that one of those old things from Samsung?
 @AdamOutler, Damn.. the fingerprint reader is really badly placed
 I helped refine the security on it a few months ago
 The design was completed tho.
 You likely will be frustrated with Android auto
 BTW. Windows Master race!
 Ha


[14:22] <shakes808> morning
[14:23] <cmaloney> ahoy
[14:24] <widox> morning
[15:05] <rick_h> jrwren: yea sorry, was jumping on the post more than yourself
[15:07] <jrwren> oh, the post was definiting making some better way suggestions... adn it DOES have a point.
[15:08] <jrwren> my comment was largely sparked by some folks I know who buy lots of books and don't read them and then complain they have no money while they have tens of thousands of dollars in unread books on their shelves. I'm not exagerating.
[15:08] <rick_h> heh
[15:09] <rick_h> the library is definitely an underutilized resource these days for sure
[15:09]  * rick_h is guilty of that though my wife is good about it which makes me happy
[15:09] <jrwren> rick_h: does clarkston have a library, or do you get to use orion twp?
[15:09] <rick_h> jrwren: clarkston has one
[15:10] <jrwren> clarkston probably built a nice new one since I was a kid. Most of the surrounding cities did in the 90s
[15:10] <rick_h> my wife takes the boy every couple of weeks ot get a stack of libary books and to play the games on the computers there
[15:10] <cmaloney> jrwren: Shut up about my library
[15:10]  * cmaloney dusts the shelves
[15:10] <rick_h> In 1965, the Women’s club transferred the library to the authority of Independence Township. The Library was officially established under Act 269, the School Code of 1955, making the Library a Township Department governed by the Independence Township Board.
[15:11] <rick_h> so a bit before the 90's it looks like
[15:11] <cmaloney> I've been working to not buy so many books and instead find out if the library has it so they can store it instead.
[15:11] <jrwren> oh wow, so it is the same old 80s library I remember from when I was a kid?
[15:11] <jrwren> err, 60s library that I remember from the 80s. lol
[15:11] <rick_h> jrwren: yea, looking at the history doc it was started in the 60s and expanded several times
[15:11] <rick_h> jrwren: with a big $2M expansion in the late 80s
[15:12] <cmaloney> <3
[15:13] <jrwren> cmaloney: i have the crap dusty shelves too. I should probably do something about it.
[15:13] <jrwren> but hten I also think about some of my favorite fiction and as the kid gets older I want her to be able to grab those books off the shelf.
[15:13] <jrwren> but maybe in another 10yrs I'll clear the shelves.
[15:14] <rick_h> heh, I'm waiting for my son to get reading more textual books so I can get him a kindle
[15:15]  * rick_h has pared down the books on shelves waaaay down
[15:15] <rick_h> and with audible/kindle I don't think I've more than a dozen books on the shelves in the last 2-3 years
[15:17] <jrwren> ha! yeah!
[15:17] <jrwren> sometimes i wish I were a digital reading person, but I am not.
[15:18] <cmaloney> I vascillate betweehn digital / print
[15:18] <rick_h> I wish I wasn't, but every time I travel or go camping, or finish a book while in the car somewhere I am glad
[15:18] <rick_h> The "idea" of the physical book is attractive, but the practicalities just get in the way.
[15:19] <rick_h> I'm just "whatever works to keep folks reading"
[15:19] <rick_h> my son's got stacks of books taller than he is lol
[15:19] <rick_h> have to find a good box to save them in for his own kids one day maybe
[15:19] <cmaloney> rick_h: You're well on the way of the whole "living out of a knapsack" efficiency curve. ;)
[15:19] <rick_h> wish I had more of that
[15:20] <rick_h> cmaloney: working on it, will go to ghent next week with my tortuga backpack and that's it
[15:20] <jrwren> you are probably right. My issue is, I'm too damn lazy to get organized enough to have an e-library that I want to read.
[15:20] <cmaloney> Ye gods. :)
[15:20] <cmaloney> The biggest problem I have with digital is the silly DRM nonsense
[15:20] <jrwren> that too.
[15:20] <rick_h> heh, see something good, search it in google, click the AMZ link, click if I want to listen or read it and have it delivered to my device
[15:20] <cmaloney> Sorry, but I don't want to have to re-buy digital products if your business model goes belly up.
[15:21] <rick_h> 60s later start listening/reading to it
[15:21] <rick_h> yea, that's the part that will one day bite me I'm sure
[15:21] <rick_h> it did with music
[15:21] <jrwren> i've still got some cassette. :p
[15:21] <cmaloney> That and RPG books are letter-sized and unless I get used to zoom / scroll they tend to be suboptimal to read
[15:21] <cmaloney> plus I like books on a shelf
[15:22] <rick_h> jrwren: lol we moved the entertainment center and my wife wants to know what's on a couple of VHS tapes that were in the back there
[15:22] <jrwren> ha!
[15:22] <rick_h> "if this has got cute video of you as a kid I'm digitizing it!!!"
 I wonder if we have any VHS still. We DO have a player.
[15:22] <cmaloney> I have a bulk eraser if you want to borrow it
[15:22] <rick_h> do you? don't tell my wife
[15:22] <jrwren> but I do not think we have any tapes
[15:22] <rick_h> we've not had one in forever
[15:23] <jrwren> the player is sitting here on basement shelf. it hasn't been plugged in since we moved. lol
[15:23] <cmaloney> My dad has a VHS / DVD burner. I can burn discs if you want
[15:23] <jrwren> seems like as much as I try to purge old stuff, some things just stick around.
[15:23] <cmaloney> Did that with the "Stella at 20" tapes that I have before they released them online