[00:19] <ubptgbot> yicvgvmdRCAx1 was added by: yicvgvmdRCAx1
 Who are youtube?
 Friends please subscribe my channel to inform about more techy things
 The URL of the channel is https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI67RWAS1e0Tu-NjnWDJ8JQ
 @SandeepaDil we are not interested in unrelated unsolicited content in this channel. You may try in @ubports_ot if you can justify why the community would like it.
[02:09] <ubptgbot> HiboHWJbqEfa6 was added by: HiboHWJbqEfa6
[04:01] <ubptgbot> nekmtlWWJHPt2 was added by: nekmtlWWJHPt2
[05:53] <ubptgbot> ySQNWFtvQLNh10 was added by: ySQNWFtvQLNh10
 @Fiona C, Just one more step to success 👍 … Good luck !!
 Hi everyone, I'm not sure I'm on the right chat, but I'd like to develop some apps for ubuntu touch, I've successfully built the C++/QML example with clickable, and now I'm struggling to find the right documentation. …  I've tried to look here: https://api-docs.ubports.com but I can't find what I'm looking for.  … I'd like to open
[07:09] <ubptgbot>  an image from my app, by using the small panel that let the user choose if he wants to open his image by using the gallery, the camera, or something else (a little bit like when you try to upload a file from telegram app).  … Does anyone have some pointers that could help me ? … Thanks everyone !
 @tforgione, Hi, you can join the devel group (https://t.me/UbuntuAppDevEN) & the OpenStore group (https://open-store.io/telegram) … Devs can help you there
 Thank you !
 You're welcome !
 Hi! Is there a VM image for Ubports? Is the ubuntu-emulator still working?
[07:26] <ubptgbot> <Steff Meister> https://forums.ubports.com/topic/514/simulating-a-ubports-16-04-on-x86-hardware-or-vm-work-in-progress here you go
 @Steff Meister, Thanks!
[07:26] <ubptgbot> <Steff Meister> You're welcome , I hope that's the one you seek, good luck!
[07:38] <ubptgbot> jXGLGZyPtrdT8 was added by: jXGLGZyPtrdT8
[08:33] <ubptgbot> mz8kan was added by: mz8kan
 @mz8kan, Hi Omzy, welcome! Take a look to https://ubports.com/telegram-welcome to get you started :)
[09:30] <ubptgbot> KNtNWlglTkmP2 was added by: KNtNWlglTkmP2
[11:11] <ubptgbot> [THE]'MARKER' was added by: [THE]'MARKER'
[12:29] <ubptgbot> Anton was added by: Anton
 Trying to install om my old Nexus 5 but it can't connect tried on Win10 and Ubuntu 18
 [Edit] Trying to install on my old Nexus 5 but it can't connect tried on Win10 and Ubuntu 18 ...phone in developer mode USB debug is on the drivers are installed computer restarted tried USB for charging, USB for files, USB for Photos doesn't work  ...any suggestions?
 Anton , please have a look at https://ubports.com/telegram-welcome
 Hi any news for n5x
 There is not
 abandon
 It's not abandoned, but it's one of the lowest possible priorities given our development resources and workload. If you'd like to continue the fight, I can provide you with my build documentation and help you out.
 Just ask in @halium or @ubports_porting, I can get to all that after work today (~9 hours from now)
 who can (and maybe is willing to) add dates to the posts, if I read this out of context https://ubports.com/blog/ubports-blog-1/post/ubuntu-touch-rc-ota-4-148 I cannot tell how old or new it is; the general listing https://ubports.com/blog does have dates though, but that is not discoverable from just reading a post from a link s
[12:59] <ubptgbot> ent over e.g.; a tweet
 @UniversalSuperBox, thank you for your reply, i have 0 programming knowledge, can i still do porting
 HI guys sorry to be a pain but for 16.04 any updates on dekko and barclays web app ?
 @leoaslan, It's possible if you're willing to learn, but the 5X is to the point where it's much better to have the knowledge of the Ubuntu Touch system before continuing. Maybe another device would suit?
 @UniversalSuperBox, Xperia x
 Hmm, I think someone has started a port on that already. Maybe try checking https://github.com/halium/projectmanagement for a port status issue for it
 @sergiusens, @Ralf_W, can I add this to your list?
 @prpleXist, There's a forum thread about updating dekko2: https://forums.ubports.com/topic/1477/dekko2-developer-community-thread
 @sergiusens, looking into this now, thanks.
 Ok so here is the deal.  This is a website design issue it looks like but here is a workaround: go to the 'index' area of the website to get dates from the main "NEWS" drop down at the top like this: … https://ubports.com/blog/ubports-blog-1/tag/blogs-2
 Hey everyone!  Did you catch the latest news?   … If not, that's because you are not subscribed to the Telegram News Channel - the best way to stay up to date about Ubuntu Touch and UBports. … It's just one click: https://t.me/ubports_news … Do it.  You won't regret it!
[14:43] <ubptgbot> <Mark Mullins> @Anton, Boot into fastboot mode. Sudo ubports-installer. Choose device manually install. Watch terminal window for errors
[15:42] <ubptgbot> Biju Joseph was added by: Biju Joseph
 @wayneoutthere, Excellent way to keep up with the latest.
 Not sure where I can recommend this, but would it be possible to have a site or location where people can view all submissions to the cultural showcase after the winning submissions are chosen? I think it would be pretty neat to see what other people around the world have submitted and inspire future work?
 Have anyone tested sony xperia ultra phone can be flashed UBports ROM?
 @pcharif, It would need a port, which requires a lot of work done by someone with that device
[16:28] <ubptgbot> <Biju Joseph> is it possible to install regional languages in ub touch
 there is not a reliable way to do so at the moment, no
[16:38] <ubptgbot> <Biju Joseph> thanks Rodney
 you might be albe to remount the rootfs as rw, and then run `sudo apt-get update` and `sudo apt-get install language-pack-XX-touch` where XX is the langauge code you want to install, in case the language pack is available
[16:44] <ubptgbot> KuleshD was added by: KuleshD
 Привет. Какой смартфон используете для UbuntuTouch?
 @KuleshD, https://t.me/UBports_Ru
 please use English in this channel. If you need Russian there is an RU channel
 that one
[17:12] <ubptgbot> <Biju Joseph> Rodney Dawes how to check the language pack available or not
 @Biju Joseph, try to install it I suppose. what language is it?
[17:15] <ubptgbot> <Biju Joseph> Malayalam
 oh sorry, it's `language-pack-touch-XX` for the package name
 it looks like `language-pack-touch-ml` is available on 15.04, but not in 16.04 (hopefully at some point soon we can fix it so that there are no more language packs which need installed, and all the translations are always available, though)
 note that the langueis probably less than 70% translated as well, which is why it's not in the default list
 @AlexanderPlaza, The cultural showcase has only just finished and submissions are being collated and put together at the moment. More info to follow
 @Lakotaubp, 😊 Oh yeah, I didn't mean it right away. I meant further into the future.
 @AlexanderPlaza, And I forgot ☺ at the end also the word shortly. Keep a look out😉
 @AlexanderPlaza, [Edit] And I forgot 😃 at the end also the word shortly. Keep a look out😉
[19:00] <ubptgbot> Mike was added by: Mike
 can you make ubuntu work with one +6?
 @jteder, Not the moment unless your good at porting https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/porting/introduction.html and https://docs.halium.org/en/latest/porting/first-steps.html would get you started . This is the list of current devices https://devices.ubuntu-touch.io/
[19:50] <ubptgbot> miikasat was added by: miikasat
[19:52] <ubptgbot> Breezy365 was added by: Breezy365
 thank you for help!
 I think 1+6 has only Android Oreo?
 wikipedia doesn't say
 released 2018
 so yes, should come only with 8
 isn't it problemless to run nougat if it's treble?
 @K31j0, Treble doesn't work retroactively
 lel
 Oreo and above
 heck
 thought Nougat already had treble
 or at least an option to build it with
 my bad
 Nope, that's oreo
 I still have no interest in running that OS tho :P
 Seems OnePlus guys were in mexico
 OnePlus 6 has codename enchilada
 @TartanSpartan, Just made bug reports for these two programs.


[01:46] <benlebovitz> Hi, i was wondering if anyone could suggest a laptop to run Ubuntu Studio on
[01:46] <benlebovitz> looking for something around $700
[01:46] <benlebovitz> to do mostly audio production, but some video
[01:47] <benlebovitz> audio productoin = midi, and usb to audio
[02:00] <stochastic> benlebovitz, pretty much any laptop for $700 would be great to run Ubuntu Studio on
[02:01] <stochastic> was there any particular concerns you had about them?
[02:02] <stochastic> in theory it'd be useful if you had a 10,000 rpm harddrive as the access time to load in large hunks of data would be decreased but it's hard to find a laptop with a drive like that
[02:03] <benlebovitz> well... i have an asus now
[02:04] <benlebovitz> i'm having problems getting it working
[02:04] <benlebovitz> many things crashing
[02:12] <stochastic> hmm, which release are you using?
[02:21] <benlebovitz> i was trying to use 11.10
[02:21] <benlebovitz> was having not much luck wiht it, using 10.04 now


[16:17] <CIA-4> debian-installer: cjwatson * r1369 maverick-proposed/ (7 files in 2 dirs): Move to 2.6.35-23 kernels.
[16:17] <CIA-4> debian-installer: cjwatson * r1370 maverick-proposed/debian/changelog: releasing version 20100211ubuntu29.1
[17:15] <cjwatson> ev: so I think these m-a crashes are happening because of:
[17:15] <cjwatson> -BEFORE = 'summary'
[17:15] <cjwatson> +AFTER = 'usersetup'
[17:15] <cjwatson> partman will never be running after usersetup in the parallel install model
[17:16] <cjwatson> is it possible for it to go earlier, or does it have to be after usersetup (which is always after partitioning, etc.)?
[17:16] <cjwatson> if the latter, it will have to do something else to get partitioning information
[17:17] <ev> it has to be after usersetup, but I'm wondering if we still need partition information
[17:17] <ev> as we assume the partition table is written now, so we don't need to filter out anything
[17:18] <cjwatson> yeah, no more "scheduled for deletion"
[17:18] <cjwatson> sounds reasonable
[17:19] <cjwatson> I suspect this is why the installer always gets stuck on "Ready when you are" in natty right now
[17:19] <cjwatson> since plugininstall will be crashing out I think
[17:20] <ev> indeed, I noticed that as well
[17:20] <ev> I'd like to get to the root cause of that
[17:20] <ev> make sure it's not the page counter getting the wrong value
[17:20] <ev> as it should be able to adapt to these situations
[17:20] <ev> without falling over completely
[17:21] <cjwatson> I have a broken kvm here, but since plugininstall is no longer running I don't know if I can extract further data from it
[17:21] <cjwatson> you can have the logs if they would be helpful?
[17:23] <ev> I can reliability reproduce it, so no worries
[17:23] <cjwatson> ok
[17:23] <cjwatson> I suggest we should get the CDs working and then deliberately break it locally if needed for root-causing, though
[17:24] <cjwatson> if you're not already on that ...
[17:25] <ev> oh definitely
[17:25] <ev> I can build an old copy of ubiquity, that's not a problem
[17:27] <ev> working on a fix now
[17:29] <cjwatson> thanks!
[17:32] <CIA-4> ubiquity: evand * r4436 trunk/ (debian/changelog ubiquity/plugins/ubi-migrationassistant.py):
[17:32] <CIA-4> ubiquity: Do not filter out partitions in migration-assistant anymore.
[17:32] <CIA-4> ubiquity: parted_server is no longer running by the time it starts, but that's
[17:32] <CIA-4> ubiquity: of no matter as it runs long after the partitioning has been
[17:32] <CIA-4> ubiquity: committed.
[17:37] <davmor2> ev: should that get sucked into the iso tomorrow?
[17:46] <ev> I'll work on an upload now
[17:46] <CIA-4> ubiquity: evand * r4437 trunk/ (d-i/manifest debian/changelog): (log message trimmed)
[17:46] <CIA-4> ubiquity: Automatic update of included source packages: apt-setup
[17:46] <CIA-4> ubiquity: 1:0.49ubuntu1, base-installer 1.114ubuntu1, choose-mirror
[17:46] <CIA-4> ubiquity: 2.36ubuntu1, clock-setup 0.105ubuntu1, debian-installer-utils
[17:46] <CIA-4> ubiquity: 1.81ubuntu1, grub-installer 1.57ubuntu1, hw-detect 1.81ubuntu1,
[17:46] <CIA-4> ubiquity: migration-assistant 0.6.8, netcfg 1.57ubuntu2, partconf 1.35,
[17:46] <CIA-4> ubiquity: partman-base 146ubuntu2, partman-basicfilesystems 68ubuntu1,
[17:58] <CIA-4> ubiquity: evand * r4438 trunk/debian/changelog: releasing version 2.5.1
[18:22] <highvoltage> ev: have you had any chance to look at bug 667243?
[18:22] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 667243 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Ubiquity takes a very long (>20 minutes) time to remove langpacks on the Edubuntu image (affects: 2) (heat: 153)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/667243
[18:23] <highvoltage> ev: the logs posted in the comments should give you all the information you need, if not, feel free to poke me :)
[19:14] <CIA-4> debian-installer: cjwatson * r1386 ubuntu/ (5 files in 2 dirs): Move to 2.6.37-6 kernels.
[19:15] <highvoltage> w/win 21
[19:16] <CIA-4> debian-installer: cjwatson * r1387 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 20101020ubuntu4
[21:32] <CIA-4> usb-creator: superm1 * r329 usb-creator/ (3 files in 3 dirs):
[21:32] <CIA-4> usb-creator: If the EFI bootloader isn't present in the proper location but efi.img is
[21:32] <CIA-4> usb-creator: available in boot/grub, extract the EFI bootloader and place it in the proper
[21:32] <CIA-4> usb-creator: location. (LP: #677260)


[23:43] <jose> daker: ping
[23:43] <daker> jose: pong
[23:44] <jose> daker: hey, I was wondering how can we update the logo displayed on loco.ubuntu.com for the LoCo Council
[23:45] <daker> jose: can file a bug with the new logo ?
[23:45] <jose> oh, sure
[23:45] <jose> any resolution in specific?
[23:45] <daker> let's say 300x300px ?
[23:46] <jose> cool
[23:46] <jose> filing now
[23:46] <daker> i'll make sure to fix it with the merge team stuff tomorrow
[23:47] <jose> daker: also, btw, bug 1251958 is not fixed yet, don't know why
[23:47] <daker> yes i was speaking about i
[23:47] <daker> t
[23:48] <jose> great
[23:53] <jose> filed, thanks a bunch! :)
[23:55] <daker> yw


[11:58] <zequence> Time to delete my Precise testing machines
[15:05] <zequence> Debian uses a CD size i386/amd64 hybrid as their installer
[15:06] <zequence> Would be easier for some people to have that
[15:12] <holstein> i like those
[15:12] <holstein> our iso is already so large, it likely doenst matter.. but folks complain about the disk size
[15:12] <holstein> there are folks in bandwidth restricted scenarios..
[15:16] <zequence> I started work on CD size. It wouldn't ship any of the workflows, but those would be available to install over the internet
[15:16] <zequence> cjwatson was helping me, but didn't want to bother him too much as he was having some trouble
[15:17] <zequence> I'm aiming at having that ready for the next LTS
[15:18] <zequence> This weekend I'm taking some time to set up some servers at my home for stuff like owncloud
[15:18] <zequence> Hoping to sync my Ubuntu phone with that. Still watiting for the phone though
[15:18] <zequence> No idea what happened to it, and BQ has only created a ticket so far
[15:19] <zequence> Well, I'll be syncing all my devices with it
[15:20] <zequence> Don't know how reliable spanish mail is. I know Italian mail is not to be trusted
[15:24] <holstein> i suppose, where you are not interested in discussing removing things, im not really keen on adding things
[15:25] <holstein> i would say, if a user were here, and actively asking for that, and willing to "go to the mat" for it, and be the major contributor to it, sure.. but otherwise, i dont know that we need another iso
[15:34] <zequence> holstein: As you yourself said, folks complain about bandwidth
[15:34] <zequence> The CD size has a clear purpose
[15:34] <zequence> Even for people who have good bandwidth, but do not want to install the whole thing
[15:35] <zequence> We need to redo the plugin for meta selection though.
[15:37] <holstein> sure.. so who is saying they will take care of it?
[15:37] <holstein> you?
[15:37] <holstein> i dont think its constructive to add another iso to our setup that the xubuntu team has to test
[15:37] <zequence> holstein: If you take a look at the sources, you will find that I already am
[15:38] <zequence> I'm the only one testing ISOs in this team currently, and if someone on the Xubuntu team chooses to help, that is up to them
[15:38] <zequence> holstein: Really?  And I will always answer them
[15:40] <holstein> i didt say it is, or should be up to me
[15:40] <zequence> For the past two years I've been updating linux-lowlatency every three weeks, sometimes for three different releases
[15:40] <holstein> if you want to take it on, take it on, and you dont need my permission
[15:40] <zequence> I've also tested every single ISO
[15:40] <holstein> if you want to shape a team, you can ask the team
[15:41] <holstein> and im answering, thinking about resources.. and thats all
[15:41] <zequence> Who else knows better of the resources than me?
[15:41] <holstein> if you want to test another iso, thats great.. and i appreciate your work, as do lothers
[15:41] <holstein> if you want this to be all your show, thats fine.. but, it will likely lead to burn out
[15:42] <holstein> and, im still not at the point in my life where i can constructively do more than i do, which is really only support
[15:42] <zequence> And that's perfectly fine
[15:42] <holstein> so, im not offering to take on any responsiblity or work.. im only discussing the use of resources
[15:43] <zequence> And it's also fine to come and go, as many will do.
[15:43] <holstein> which, as far as specific code contribution, is just you and len
[15:44] <zequence> A new ISO is not that big of a deal to maintain. It's just one more file, and a couple more lines in the seeds
[15:44] <zequence> ..as long as the packages in the seeds are ok
[15:44] <holstein> sure.. enjoy!
[15:44] <holstein> but, its not a team decision, if, you just say "well, here a new thing that we have, that im going to maintain"..
[15:45] <zequence> First you need a team
[15:45] <zequence> One that actually knows what is going on
[15:45] <zequence> But, perhaps we will have that now again
[15:46] <zequence> And, I'm much better equipped to do my part as well, so I'm actually looking forward to the next year
[15:48] <zequence> Us being less active the past cycle was only a good thing I think
[15:48] <zequence> We should have more fresh energy for the next two cycles, and for the next LTS
[15:50] <zequence> The next version of Debian (9) should see a change in how realtime admnistration is handled
[15:50] <zequence> I will make sure that it will be really simple to have any Ubuntu flavor get a good working system for audio production, one way or the other
[15:51] <zequence> And, Ubuntu Studio will be a bonus
[15:51] <zequence> It is a good distro to have. It has everything in place already. And, that is something you can't get easily on other distros
[15:51] <zequence> But, the main goal is to make things work on anything Debian based (preferably) - at least that is my goal
[15:52] <zequence> The work I do for Ubuntu Studio is for making new users have as easy a time getting to know Linux + Multimedia production as possible
[15:52] <zequence> That in my view is the job that Ubuntu Studio should be doing
[15:53] <holstein> agreed
[15:53] <holstein> and, we have quite a negative image
[15:54] <zequence> Well, people choose to do what they do. Some people could actually help us, and Debian as a whole, if they wanted to. Instead they maintain PPAs
[15:54] <zequence> Or, their own custom Debian based distros
[15:55] <holstein> well, i think the question is, can they?
[15:55] <zequence> Sure
[15:55] <holstein> and if not, why? and if they just think not, why not?
[15:55] <zequence> But they don't want to
[15:55] <holstein> i know, falk cant upload what he does either place, AFAIK
[15:55] <holstein> i think upstream to debian would be ideal..
[15:55] <zequence> falktx could easily start maintaining Debian sources
[15:56] <holstein> i think its harder to do so, than just maintain ones own sources
[15:56] <zequence> You know how easy it was for me to become Debian Multimedia members?
[15:56] <holstein> and why? and where can  we step in and address that?
[15:56] <zequence> I've talked to falktx about it. But, he's not interested
[15:56] <holstein> is it financial? the connonical funds are never going to make it to us, and thats fine.. but what about debian?
[15:57] <holstein> things that go upstream would trickle in.. if debian "just worked" out of the box, the way we needed, then, it would just work here
[15:57] <zequence> Yep
[15:57] <zequence> That's what I'm working on
[15:57] <holstein> but, then, you get to why we have a negative image in ardour
[15:57] <zequence> Though, it's not easy as far as realtime adminstration goes
[15:57] <holstein> we cant address that, unless we address rolling it, like firefox
[15:57] <holstein> but, then, what would get rolled, and why? and what would that break.. etc
[15:57] <zequence> Ardour people are talking about stuff that happened a millenia ago
[15:58] <zequence> IMO las and many others have no clue of why they are against buntu
[15:58] <holstein> well, if i dl fully supported ubuntu studio 14.04, the ardour version is not supported anywhere
[15:58] <zequence> They don't have any first hand experience themselves
[15:58] <holstein> we cant, and dont have the man power to support that older version without the help of las, and they dont support the older versions
[15:58] <zequence> For some reason they like Debian better, but all our packages are from Debian
[15:58] <holstein> so, is it constructive to *not* included it?
[15:58] <holstein> to link to where to buy the binary? i think thats  extreme
[15:59] <zequence> Could be for Ardour the best choice will be something like snappy
[15:59] <holstein> but, i would like to openly and constructively talk about these options, and realistic outcomes of such decisions..
[16:00] <holstein> unless, they, (ardour) dont use snappy, and something happens that gets blamed on that version
[16:00] <holstein> then, it would be the "snappy is crappy" story.. and its another -
[16:00] <holstein> but, i think that would constructively address keeping the versioning up to date
[16:01] <zequence> If you ask me, most of that is just a lod BS
[16:01] <holstein> not that i personally actually want/need a newer version, but, i think folks are used to that.. "you need the latest version for support".. thats pretty common
[16:01] <holstein> zequence: oh, i agree. but, i get it
[16:01] <holstein> "its not the current veresion".. its easier than supporting the issue
[16:01] <zequence> snappy would enable ardour to release the latest version
[16:02] <zequence> Trouble is, las prefers fedora, or something like that
[16:02] <holstein> which leads me to the larger issue of support in general
[16:03] <holstein> if a new ubuntustudio user running ardour has an issue, and goes to #ubuntustudio , which irc is already a niche, and the channel is dead/slow, then they go to #ardour, where, there decision to run ubuntustudio is immediately questions..
[16:03] <holstein> questioned
[16:03] <zequence> If you want to talk constructive, it would be more constructive for ardour people to stop trashing distros that they don't use, to stop using hearsay as a library of facts, and just focus on what they do well - namely coding ardour
[16:03] <holstein> i *did* get loud in #ardour, and i feel like the discussion is better.. way better
[16:03] <holstein> all it took was asking for facts, and stating that things had been addressed, and please stop the fud..
[16:03] <zequence> So much fud going on there
[16:04] <holstein> not a big deal.. but, it takes constant attention.. i feel someone would need to do the same in the forums etc where fud *is* still going on
[16:04] <holstein> and, there is still some fud in #ardour.. just not as bad..
[16:04] <zequence> I've been in there too sometimes, trying to steer things up, but it's tough
[16:04] <zequence> in #ardour that is
[16:04] <zequence> It was almost getting ridiculous at times
[16:05] <holstein> it takes a lot of time, for sure
[16:05] <holstein> its like baby sitting..
[16:05] <zequence> The best thing we can do is make sure our distro is the best there is. No one can say otherwise.
[16:05] <holstein> but, i would also like to look at the legitimate issues
[16:05] <zequence> For that to happen, we need to put some time into it. And he more who work, the better
[16:06] <holstein> why do folks like kxstudio or avlinux better? what are they able to do that we are not? what  would it take for falk to package for US, or debian?
[16:06] <zequence> again, falktx could easily package for Debian, but he doesn't
[16:06] <holstein> he was trying.. and it didnt pan out
[16:06] <zequence> Also, he could do SRUs for Ubuntu. He doesn't need to be a member of either UBuntu of Ubuntu Studio
[16:06] <zequence> But, he doesn't want to
[16:07] <zequence> I don't believe it
[16:07] <holstein> i dont know the details, but, i havent kept up, since i was discussing with him being a MOTU way back
[16:07] <holstein> i think its more work than he has time for, to actually do it properly
[16:07] <holstein> and thats understandable..
[16:07] <holstein> from both perspectives
[16:07] <zequence> If he wanted to customize Debian packages to some form that he himself personally liked best, then I'm sure there would be some problems
[16:07] <zequence> The work we do is not for ourselves, but for the community
[16:08] <holstein> but, if its a matter of getting 2 or 4 grand together to pay falk for a minute.. we could, as a community, have that discussion
[16:08] <zequence> falktx has had his anti-PA periods, for instance
[16:08] <holstein> well, many folks *still* have that
[16:08] <holstein> and i usually settle the argument by simply asking "when is the last time you used pulse?"
[16:09] <holstein> the user usually says "well, i dont.. its a pos".. and thats that.. they actually dont look at the options
[16:09] <zequence> If someone is not being very objective, their work might not be suitable for the larger masses
[16:09] <holstein> which is fine, but, that opinion can be disregared, at least, at that point.. since, the person has  not collected all the data
[16:09] <holstein> yup.. but, i think falk is *not* being objective.. but, that might be what the audio specific team would need
[16:10] <holstein> someone who is looking out for that work flow.. i dont know..
[16:10] <zequence> He has to compromize
[16:10] <holstein> sure.. but, now, he doenst
[16:10] <holstein> he can compromise the other way.. for the audio user
[16:10] <zequence> It's not his stule
[16:10] <zequence> style*
[16:10] <holstein> and thats handy.. but, i dont think its the only way
[16:11] <holstein> seems like there is something more down the middle.. or, with the tools that you are len discuss.. the settings that can tweak what is needed..
[16:11] <zequence> -controls can help
[16:11] <zequence> I've actually come a far way with it
[16:11] <zequence> It's too bad it's taking such a long time
[16:11] <holstein> seems like, it really could be a place where settings can address what is needed to fix things..
[16:12] <zequence> falktx would be better at coding it, but I think we are better at figuring out the layout
[16:12] <holstein> sure.. i want him putting code in as far upstream as possible, personally
[16:12] <zequence> Not one of his packages are in Debian yet
[16:12] <zequence> I mean, applications
[16:13] <zequence> There is one attempt at packaging his suite, but don't know how far that has come
[16:13] <zequence> He won't do it himself anyway
[16:13] <holstein> well, i think it may be constructive to try and have that talk.. and see what that takes
[16:13] <zequence> Sure
[16:14] <holstein> there is an ubuntu debian liason..
[16:14] <holstein> i forget who that is.. but, its an ubuntu team member i just heard in an interview
[16:14] <zequence> universe is mostly Debian. It's what we stand on
[16:14] <holstein> and, i cant imagine that changing, correct? what do you think
[16:14] <holstein> i dont think snappy will change that..
[16:14] <holstein> *if* snappy even comes to the desktop space where we are..
[16:15] <zequence> Snappy is just another tool. As long as Ubuntu remains open, what was will still be
[16:15] <zequence> But, if Ubuntu does start to change, it will be very easy to jump ships for all the flavors
[16:15] <zequence> Debian is another world as far as the community goes though
[16:16] <zequence> I feel the Ubuntu community is in many ways a lot more constructive
[16:16] <zequence> I'm sure it depends largely on who you are and what you do
[16:16] <holstein> well, debian would still be there, but, the ubuntustuduio flavor, if main ubuntu would move away, would be quite changed
[16:16] <zequence> We could do the same thing, but in Debian
[16:16] <zequence> Though, it wouldn't be the same of course
[16:17] <holstein> but, i really dont think thats in the pipeline
[16:17] <holstein> well, it would be *much* different, though
[16:17] <holstein> not having a scheduled release to push
[16:17] <zequence> We are still we. If we continue to work on the same project, much will remain the same
[16:17] <holstein> not having iso hosting.. etc
[16:17] <zequence> Debian does 2 years LTS releases. They are calling them LTS now
[16:18] <holstein> i mean, sure. we are still us, but, with a lot of bandwidth and a brand name..
[16:18] <zequence> every 2 years
[16:18] <zequence> Then there's the rolling release
[16:18] <zequence> Not much of a difference
[16:18] <zequence> The infrastucture would need to be set up
[16:18] <zequence> That's a bit of work
[16:18] <zequence> But, it's far from doable
[16:21] <zequence> Debian Multimedia is a much different beast from how we do things
[16:21] <zequence> They do mostly packagin. Not so much work on the big picture, so to speak
[16:22] <zequence> I think that's a result of decentralization. Has it's + and -
[16:26] <holstein> im just saying, it would change things.. since, we would have to self host iso's, etc..
[16:27] <zequence> Either that, or we find a way to be an official Debian variant
[16:32] <zequence> ..though it's good to think about options, that's of course not something we need to worry about for the next year or so
[16:33] <holstein> maybe not at all
[19:24] <cub> just read through the irc log, so Ardour people don't like Ubunbu Studio? How come? Why would they care since you can run Ardour in any linux distro?
[19:25] <holstein> cub: factually, its hard for them to support
[19:25] <holstein> they dont support the version, other than the one they support.. so, if the typical user has an issue with ardour, they are running the repo version, which is repackaged ,and out of date
[19:25] <cub> aha ok
[19:26] <cub> But wouldn't that be the same for every distro which is not rolling release?
[19:26] <cub> you still have the option to install the latest version yourself
[19:27] <cub> And that would kind of be Ubuntu's fault, not US per se
[19:27] <cub> since we only include what's in the repos
[19:28] <holstein> cub: yup.. it is the same
[19:28] <holstein> but, i think ubuntustuduio is just the more popular one that folks go to #ardour about
[19:30] <cub> sure, since if you want to do audio it's one of the easy choices
[19:32] <cub> which version did make it into US 15.04?
[19:33] <holstein> !info ardour
[19:33] <holstein> looks relatively new..
[19:33] <holstein> but, its not the one they support
[19:34] <cub> !info kdenlive
[19:37] <cub> it would be nice to do some work with the community, but not sure how much time I will have available.
[19:45] <DalekSec> http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-multimedia-maintainers/2015-April/043650.html bit of a thread on it.


[01:07] <thumper> babbageclunk: a few questions on the metrics thing
[01:08] <babbageclunk> thumper: thanks, looking
[01:58] <babbageclunk> thumper: take another look?
[02:03] <thumper> babbageclunk: ack
[02:03] <babbageclunk> ta
[02:12] <thumper> I have to say, this new model summary watcher driven by the cache is turning out to be real smooth
[02:26] <babbageclunk> thumper: the main reason I wasn't going to include timings for errors was that the worker bounces when it gets an error, so they're kind of outside the normal request handling. Unlike in the store, where errors are reported back to the client, so errors are part of the usual workload. Might be wrong though - want me to add them in?
[02:27] <thumper> ah... so if we get one, it has a very small likelihood of every being observed in the metrics?
[02:27] <babbageclunk> yup
[02:27] <thumper> ok, I'm fine with us not having that then
[02:27] <thumper> we have a worker start count
[02:27] <thumper> which gives an indication
[02:28] <thumper> hmm...
[02:28]  * thumper thinks about getting worker starts as an engine metric
[02:28] <babbageclunk> ha
[02:28]  * babbageclunk hits merge
[02:34] <babbageclunk> easy test review for someone? https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/11108
[02:34]  * thumper looks
[02:36] <babbageclunk> thanks
[02:37] <thumper> babbageclunk: lgtm
[02:43] <babbageclunk> thanks again!
[05:09] <babbageclunk> kelvinliu: haven't quite finished reviewing your pr yet, sorry! it's looking great though - will finish it tomorrow morning..
[05:10] <kelvinliu> babbageclunk: no rush, take ur time, thanks!
[07:49] <Bandu> Hi
[11:10] <nammn_de> manadart achilleasa: I keep getting it wrong with the facades, could one help me out and take a quick look in regards to the facade bumpings? Seems to be correct to me. The code itself still needs to be tested, but cannot seem to get the correct facade versions https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/11088
[11:11] <manadart> nammn_de: Looking.
[11:19] <nammn_de> manadart: ahhh sorry it seems to work now!
[11:20] <nammn_de> manadart: looks like I was having too many controller running at once and accidentally upgraded the wrong one and got confused, sorry again!
[11:21] <manadart> nammn_de: I was going to say, it looks right. You also need to mask the new method for the old facades, so something like `func (api *APIv5) ShowSpace(_, _ struct{}) {}`
[11:21] <nammn_de> manadart: ahh great soo looking still helped me :D
[13:10] <achilleasa> The formatters used by jujuc cmds seem to append a line-feed. Anyone knows whether I can somehow suppress this?
[13:15] <achilleasa> jam: This confuses my storage implementation as it assumes that data is available and tries to unmarshal it. I can probably trim the last LF (payload may contain linefeeds) as a workaround but it's an ugly hack (plus I would need to detect the os LF char)
[13:22] <jam> achilleasa: there has been a fair bit of discussion around line endings. in bash, it auto-trims the (foo=$(relation-get bar) just returns the contents), and it is a lot friendlier for human consumption
[13:22] <jam> achilleasa: I think you're hitting this because you're doing pure bytes instead of str
[13:22] <jam> achilleasa: ideally, we wouldn't use pickle for this
[13:22] <jam> IMO
[13:23] <achilleasa> jam: for now I will just call '.rstrip()' assuming that the payload is encoded and not just plain-text
[14:45] <jam> achilleasa: hml: so we talked for a while on the 'should process-hook always be called', I think we're back at "yes", and I'll talk through the details we talked about a bit later. (my EOD)
[14:46] <hml> jam:  I can be available a 1/2 before standup tomorrow to chat?
[14:46] <hml> 1/2 hour
[20:28] <mruffell> Hi. Any chance I can get some eyes on my promulgation request for the wordpress charm? https://discourse.jujucharms.com/t/promulgation-request-for-wordpress-charm/2494
[21:14] <thumper> cory_fu: do you know who is currently handling promulgation requests?
[21:15] <cory_fu> thumper: Anyone in the charmers group can do it with `charm promulgate`
[21:15]  * thumper goes to see who is in the charmers group
[21:15] <cory_fu> thumper: But if there's a pending request, I'm happy to do it
[21:16] <cory_fu> Oh, I see there is.  One sec
[21:16] <thumper> cory_fu: thanks
[21:19] <cory_fu> thumper, mruffell: Done, but there was one hiccup.  The old charm was trusty only, and the new one is xenial and bionic.  So now trying to deploy on trusty with either cs:wordpress or cs:trusty/wordpress will fail, and it also reset the rev number down to 0
[21:20] <cory_fu> I don't know how much of an issue that will be, and the old rev was only 5, so it wouldn't be hard to fast-forward past that.
[21:21] <thumper> it is weird that the rev number dropped to 0
[21:21] <mruffell> cory_fu: I couldn't support trusty, as wordpress has moved past the php version in trusty's repos
[21:21] <mruffell> this charm is all good for xenial, bionic, and focal when it comes out
[21:21] <cory_fu> thumper: Because it's technically a different name (cs:wordpress vs cs:trusty/wordpress)
[21:22] <cory_fu> mruffell: +1, I doubt anyone is going to be doing any new deployments onto trusty these days anyway
[21:22] <thumper> cory_fu: ah... ok
[21:24] <mruffell> anyway, thank you very much thumper and cory_fu. I will let customer know that wordpress is good again. Plus it makes the documentation where wordpress is used as an example make sense too.
[22:25] <evhan> thumper: Are you able to invite other users to that openstack tenant? Management > Project Users > (there should be an Invite User button). If not, I might have to add some role.
[22:28] <thumper> evhan: I'm not sure I'm seeing the same thing you are
[22:28] <thumper> the Projects element in the Identity section gives me a 403
[22:29] <evhan> Hrn, that'll be related, 1s caller...
[22:29] <evhan> thumper: Perhaps now?
[22:30] <thumper> stil 403
[22:32] <evhan> Hm, and I don't suppose if you navigate directly to https://dashboard.cloud.catalyst.net.nz/management/project_users/ it'll work?
[22:33] <thumper> different type of 403, rather than top level 403, which I get for /identity, I get the page rendered with header and side bar, but contents says  "You are not authorized to access this page Login"
[22:35] <evhan> Curse you, web stuff.
[22:35] <evhan> Alright, I'll have to check about that and get back to you, soz.
[22:55] <babbageclunk> review for a backport of my test tweak to 2.7 (now that 2.7.1 is approved)? https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/11115
[22:59]  * anastasiamac looking
[22:59] <anastasiamac> babbageclunk: +1
[23:00] <babbageclunk> thanks!
[23:11] <Bandu> hi


[15:40] <kc2bez> Eickmeyer: wxl Your wallpaper creation looks great. Thanks to you both!
[15:41] <Eickmeyer> yw!
[20:18] <jbicha> tsimonq2: Mantic Beta is scheduled for Thursday, are you still planning to do an upload for bug 2036098 ?
[20:18] -ubottu:#lubuntu-devel- Bug 2036098 in lubuntu-default-settings (Ubuntu) "[mantic] xdg-desktop-portals no longer working in default Lubuntu after xdg-desktop-portal 1.17.1" [Critical, Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2036098
 jbicha: Yes, I've had some fires to put out but I'm planning on having it uploaded before Monday Europe EOD
[20:34] <jbicha> groovy


[15:29] <robjh> hi all. I'm trying to run a program called egltriangle that i found here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mir-team/mir/development-branch/files/head:/examples/       ive got it to compile without errors, the program's output surgests that it should work but i cant get it to output to the display. im using a meizu MX4. is it doing this because im not on a real pc?
[17:12] <robjh> I'll ask on the forum later on I guess
[22:13] <RAOF> robjh: What errors are you getting? You need to do some stupid wrangling to make it show up in Unity8, but if you stop lightdm and start your own Mir server it should show up on the MX4 (we use it as a basic smoke-test).


[11:24] <kodez> good day everyone
[11:25] <superfly> hi kodez
[11:26] <kodez> hi superfly, how are you today?
[11:33] <kodez> which book is good for system analysis and design?
[11:36] <superfly> kodez: it depends on who you ask
[11:36] <superfly> I would say, "experience"
[11:37] <kodez> superfly, please elaborate
[11:38] <superfly> kodez: nothing beats experience. books help, but actually designing a system and seeing how it works beats what the books tell you
[11:38] <superfly> and often, the people who write those books are teachers, not developers
[11:38] <superfly> as the saying goes, "those who can, do, those who can't, teach."
[11:39] <kodez> i am a student, i am interested in the theory for now and practical later
[11:42] <kodez> superfly, which project do you prefer in the FOSS that is good for a first timer?
[11:43] <superfly> kodez: that's an extremely open-ended question, and you're assuming a heck of a lot about me without knowing much about me
[11:43] <superfly> rule #1 of development: never assume *anything*
[11:44] <superfly> how do you know I'm involved in FOSS development? how do you know I even know anything about FOSS development?
[11:44] <kodez> superfly, i indicated my level of experience
[11:44] <kodez> this forum is for ubuntu users and developers
[11:44] <superfly> kodez: mostly users
[11:45] <superfly> (the developers mostly hang out in -devel channels, and "Ubuntu Developers" do not necessarily actually do any development)
[11:46] <superfly> kodez: you see, when you're building a system you cannot assume any\thing
[11:46] <kodez> i agree that the majority might be users hence my first question was general. unfortunately you are the only person who responded to it
[11:47] <superfly> part of system analysis and design is finding out what the stakeholders actually want
[11:47] <superfly> in order to do that, you need to assume nothing, and ask them everything before heading forward in doing any design
[11:47] <kodez> i agree that i can not assume hence raising the question
[11:47] <superfly> kodez: no, you assumed there are developers in the channel
[11:48] <superfly> my point is not that you were doing something wrong, my point is to illustrate why experience beats books hands down
[11:49] <superfly> I know from experience that one cannot assume anything when designing a system
[11:49] <superfly> they don't teach you that in the text books (I know, I still have my System Analysis & Design textbook somewhere)
[11:54] <superfly> kodez: to answer your question about projects: I don't know. Almost all projects are not simple, and the best thing to do is to look for a project where your interests lie
[11:54] <superfly> don't just join a project because you want to learn how to program (you can do that through plenty of free e-books)
[11:56] <superfly> kodez: http://books.google.co.za/books?id=7QMlAQAAIAAJ
[11:57] <superfly> kodez: that's the book I had when I studied. I can't tell you whether it's good or not because I haven't read any others, and that one is lying somewhere gathering dust
[11:58] <kodez> thanks for the link. i will go through it
[11:58] <kodez> i guess we need to have more developers in order for some of us to benefit
[12:03] <superfly> kodez: or you can do what a lot of others do, and use the Internet to your benefit
[12:03] <superfly> I never learned Python because I logged into IRC and hung around people whom I thought might know Python
[12:03] <superfly> I went and studied it on my own
[12:04] <Banlam> teaching yourself stuff is fun
[12:20] <kodez> hi Banlom. i agree. i think this is the emphasis superfly is making. unfortunately not everything can be learned without consulting those with knowledge. nothing replaces your own experience
[12:21] <kodez> sorry for the spelling mistake. Banlam
[12:21] <Banlam> with the internet these days
[12:21] <Banlam> no worries
[12:21] <Banlam> there are so many resources
[12:21] <Banlam> and tutorials
[12:21] <Banlam> you can teach yourself almost anythign up to a point
[12:21] <Banlam> obviously it's nic eto ask people certain things
[12:21] <Banlam> especially when you get stuck
[12:22] <kodez> indication to the tutorials is most important to me.
[12:22] <Banlam> sure
[12:24] <kodez> i guess we need to have classes here to keep learning consistant and interesting
[12:38] <kodez> do we have people based in Nelspruit in this group?
[13:19] <inetpro> kodez: you can always learn through sharing with others
[13:20] <inetpro> start driving the process at your level
[13:20] <kodez> hi inetpro, how are you?
[13:20] <inetpro> kodez: good and yourself
[13:20] <kodez> i am just inexperienced at the moment
[13:21] <kodez> i am in good shape and spirit. i will try to develop notes for system analysis and design but i have a challenge to identify the software to propose
[13:21] <inetpro> kodez: don't expect to learn everything at once, but don't assume that you have learned nothing yet
[13:23] <kodez> yes inetpro. hence i said i am inexperienced
[13:23] <inetpro> the experience you have gained so far may be worth sharing already
[13:24] <kodez> i am in a process of learning and part of it is practice that i am lacking
[13:25] <kodez> i am interested in a kiosk management system and am still gathering relevant information to develop the proposal
[13:27] <inetpro> kodez: and what does that have to do with development?
[13:28] <kodez> i mean developing a computerised kiosk management system
[13:28] <inetpro> why?
[13:30] <kodez> one, to develop my skills and two to have an application that can respond to the south african environment. it will be released withing the FOSS community
[13:30] <inetpro> have you looked around to find similar systems?
[13:31] <inetpro> what specifically do you want to achieve?
[13:32] <inetpro> perhaps there is no need to redesign the wheel
[13:32] <inetpro> or perhaps you can get involved with other groups who need your inputs
[13:41] <inetpro> kodez: in the end I agree with superfly, nothing beats experience
[13:42] <inetpro> you need to understand the real-life practical business without using technology before you try to build the technology
[13:45] <kodez> the are different challenges that i am facing at the moment. but they can be resolved over time.
[14:51] <kbmonkey> hi
[14:51] <inetpro> good morning kbmonkey
[14:51] <kbmonkey> good arvie inetpro
[14:52] <inetpro> arvie?
[14:52] <kbmonkey> afternoon
[14:52] <kodez> good day kbmonkey
[14:52] <kbmonkey> hi kodez
[14:52] <kodez> how are you?
[14:52] <kbmonkey> how was the weekend for everybody?
[14:53] <kbmonkey> I am super, and yourself?
[14:53] <kodez> not well for me. my team, Orlando Pirates,  failed to win yesterday
[14:53] <kbmonkey> what timezone are you in inetpro?
[14:54] <inetpro> kbmonkey: hmm... let me think about that
[14:54] <inetpro> not so sure
[14:54] <kbmonkey> that's unfortunate kodez
[14:55] <kbmonkey> better luck next time ;)
[14:55] <kodez> we must win the remaining 4 games at all cost to defend the league
[14:55] <kodez> thanks
[14:56] <kbmonkey> was it a close game?
[14:59] <inetpro> kbmonkey: thanks
[15:00] <inetpro> I think you just helped me out of my nothing zone
[15:00]  * inetpro needs to go feed the chickens
[15:01] <kodez> kbmonkey: they failed to convert chances and they were disorganised
[16:00] <inetpro> kodez: what language do you speak?
[17:10] <inetpro> hmm... did I chase him away?
[17:47] <superfly> inetpro: kodez is not actually interested in learning, he just wants people to teach him
[17:48] <superfly> not the kind of atitude that gets you far in life, nor the kind of atitude that geeks on the Internet take kindly to
 i guess we need to have classes here to keep learning consistant and interesting
[17:49] <superfly> ^^ why? so that you don't have to do any work?
[17:50] <superfly> the biggest applications that I have worked on to date are written in Python, Qt4 and Pylons, all of which I taught myself.
[17:50] <superfly> I didn't hang around in an IRC channel waiting for people to teach me
[17:51] <superfly> Neither did I learn from anyone else. I taught myself.
[17:51] <nlsthzn> because superfly is awesome
[17:51] <inetpro> superfly: I guess you may be right
[17:52] <inetpro> superfly: some peeps need a kick in the bee hind before they can get going
[17:52] <superfly> nlsthzn: No, because superfly just got on with the job of learning, and having what the recruitment agents call a "self-starter attitude"
[17:52] <nlsthzn> true man... superfly , that is what makes you awesome
[17:52] <superfly> inetpro: which is what both Banlam and I were trying to tell kodez, but he didn't get the memo
[17:53] <inetpro> at least he keeps coming back :-)
[17:53] <Banlam> lol
[17:56] <superfly> The only problem with diplomacy is that when you're diplomatic with people that don't usually understand exactly what you are trying to tell them.
[17:56] <superfly> s/that/they/
[17:57] <inetpro> superfly: you think I was diplomatic?
[17:57] <superfly> inetpro: let me actually read what you wrote :-)
[17:58] <superfly> inetpro: You were trying to steer him in a particular direction, but in a way you were being diplomatic ;-)
[17:59] <inetpro> yikes!
[17:59] <superfly> inetpro: he still didn't understand that he needs to go and teach himself
[17:59] <inetpro> sad part is that he seems to loose himself while you try talking to him
[17:59] <superfly> but I like your approach, good comments
[18:01] <kbmonkey> happy earth day! http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/04/earth_day_2012.html
[18:01] <inetpro> almost like this other guys with the lost nickname, but at least he knows when he is lost :-)
[18:01] <superfly> I should probably do some of these courses, since I'm in that field: http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/electrical-engineering-and-computer-science/
[18:02] <inetpro> nlsthzn: how's you doing?
[18:02]  * inetpro wonders where Kilos is this evening
[18:02] <nlsthzn> Fine thanks inetpro ... and how are you guys?
[18:02] <superfly> I'd better go and check on the Shepherd's Pie, bbiab
[18:03] <inetpro> what does Kilos always say about diplomacy?
[18:03] <inetpro> Maaz: diplomat
[18:03] <Maaz> A diplomat is a person who can tell others to go to hell in such a nice way that they look forward to the trip
[18:03] <superfly> there we go :-)
[18:04] <inetpro> nlsthzn: very well thanks
[18:04] <kbmonkey> ha ha, so true! XD
[18:04] <kbmonkey> I saw a film today called "The invention of Lying", exactly what that quote is about
[18:05] <superfly> Maaz: lastfm for who_da_fly
[18:05] <Maaz> superfly: Becoming The Archetype – March of the Dead (5 hours, 24 minutes and 50 seconds ago), Becoming The Archetype – The Trivial Paroxysm (5 hours, 31 minutes and 25 seconds ago), Becoming The Archetype – Into Oblivion (5 hours, 37 minutes and 27 seconds ago), Becoming The Archetype – Beyond Adaptation (5 hours, 40 minutes and 1 second ago), Becoming The Archetype – No Fall Too Far (5 hours, 45 minutes and 48 seconds ago), Beco
[18:06] <superfly> nlsthzn: might be a little too heavy for you, but I'm enjoying this right now ^^
[18:06] <kbmonkey> I forgot Maaz has lastfm in his vocab :)
[18:06] <kbmonkey> Maaz, lastfm for thejunkieman
[18:06] <Maaz> kbmonkey: 3 Inches Of Blood – Crazy Nights (5 minutes and 14 seconds ago), Gojira – The Silver Cord (8 minutes and 47 seconds ago), Deine Lakaien – Contact (11 minutes and 19 seconds ago), Kreator – Phobia (22 minutes and 56 seconds ago), Snot – Stoopid (26 minutes and 19 seconds ago), Ninesin – In The Battle (30 minutes and 11 seconds ago), Korn – Wake Up (33 minutes and 37 seconds ago), Tori Amos – All the Girls Hate Her (
[18:06] <nlsthzn> don't know em superfly ... but sounds interesting
[18:07] <kbmonkey> ^ that is random shuffling
[18:07]  * nlsthzn hasn't linked anything to last.fm for some time :/
[18:07] <Kilos> hiya superfly kbmonkey nlsthzn
[18:07] <nlsthzn> Maaz, lasfm for thenailedone
[18:07] <Maaz> nlsthzn: Sorry...
[18:07] <Kilos> and all others
[18:07] <nlsthzn> lol
[18:07] <kbmonkey> hello Kilos
[18:07] <nlsthzn> hi Kilos
[18:07] <inetpro> heh Kilos
[18:08] <nlsthzn> strange that my lastfm didn't work
[18:08] <inetpro> I was just wondering what happened with you today
[18:08] <Kilos> yo pro hoe gaan dit? koud ne
[18:08] <inetpro> koud?
[18:08] <Kilos> rek die data goed
[18:08] <inetpro> lekker hier by my
[18:08] <Kilos> ja man ek trek swaar in die winter
[18:09] <kbmonkey> we having a koue front Kilos brrr
[18:09] <superfly> hey Kilos!
[18:09] <inetpro> kort broek en al
[18:09] <Kilos> enigiets onder 22°c is sleg
[18:09] <inetpro> sjoe
[18:09] <Kilos> my vuur binne is nie soos jong mense nie
[18:10] <superfly> inetpro: short pants? I took a blanket with me to church this morning, I was cold!
[18:10] <inetpro> hmm...
[18:10] <superfly> Kilos: I must be old then, cause I agree with you :-P
[18:10] <Kilos> superfly, you arent thick skinned as some others
[18:10] <Kilos> hehehe
[18:10] <Kilos> hiya ballie
[18:11] <kbmonkey> a good time to get that usb-powered coffee cup warmer
[18:11] <Kilos> lol kbmonkey thats a good idea
[18:11] <superfly> kbmonkey: sadly, I have been told it doesn't actually work that well :-/
[18:11] <Kilos> need to add seat and feet warmer
[18:11] <superfly> maybe it'll work better with USB3? :-P
[18:12] <kbmonkey> perhaps superfly, he he
[18:12] <Kilos> does anyone here use debian
[18:13] <kbmonkey> almost. a Debian deriv
[18:13] <superfly> nah, it won't... the power is the same... but if you get one of those USB chargers that you plug into the wall it might work... if the warmer itself can handle the ampage
[18:13] <kbmonkey> why Kilos?
[18:13] <superfly> supper time! later folks
[18:13] <Kilos> im still looking for a way past unity kbmonkey
[18:14] <Kilos> enjoy superfly
[18:14] <kbmonkey> enjoy!
[18:14] <kbmonkey> okay Kilos. the last time you tried xubuntu, right?
[18:14] <Kilos> but need to get the iso from ian and if possible the updates too
[18:14] <Kilos> yeah but xubuntu might have been a bad install
[18:15] <kbmonkey> does the gnome classic thing not work for you Kilos ?
[18:15] <Kilos> i tried it with 11.04 but it gave lotsa probs kbmonkey
[18:15] <Kilos> not appearnce but many things didnt work and it hung often
[18:16] <Kilos> appearance
[18:17] <Kilos> dunno why unity wants a better graphics card because i can  watch all videos
[18:19] <kbmonkey> but you ran it with unity turned off?
[18:20] <kbmonkey> could the problems have been with ubuntu itself and not unity ?
[18:20] <Kilos> ya on classic gnome
[18:20] <kbmonkey> okay. just asking.
[18:20] <Kilos> i can install 11.04 but only in classic
[18:21] <kbmonkey> ubuntu is based off Debian
[18:21] <kbmonkey> wonder if your issues could have been related..
[18:21] <kbmonkey> getting Debian from Ian some time?
[18:21] <Kilos> the crash kid gave me a command whereby you update an iso file but way back in lucid
[18:22] <Kilos> i am trying to get him to download the isos so when he comes i can burn to cd and try install
[18:22] <Kilos> but he too has min time
[18:22] <Kilos> so dunno when he will get here again
[18:24] <Kilos> i also would like for him to get lubuntu for me but only if we can sort the update command
[18:24] <kbmonkey> I see
[18:24] <kbmonkey> that wil be good if you can get those discs :)
[18:25] <Kilos> here is that iso update command.. how would one modify it to work with lubuntu and debian
[18:25] <Kilos> zsync -i ubuntu.iso http://ubuntu.mirror.ac.za/ubuntu-release/lucid/ubuntu-10.04.1-desktop-i386.iso.zsync
[18:26] <Kilos> worked great with lucid
[18:26] <Kilos> dink inetpro
[18:27] <inetpro> :-)
[18:27] <Kilos> hehe
[18:27] <inetpro> waaroor moet ek dink?
[18:27] <Kilos> oor daai opdrag man
[18:28] <inetpro> Kilos: that is to update it when you have downloaded it already
[18:28] <Kilos> if you update the iso before installing then you save 100's of megs of data
[18:29] <Kilos> yes thats right. want ian to download and update before he brings it here
[18:29] <inetpro> Kilos: depends
[18:29] <Kilos> inetpro, on?
[18:30] <inetpro> sometimes there are many updates on top of what is on an updated cd
[18:30] <Kilos> ai
[18:32] <inetpro> but zsync is very cool for sure
[18:32] <inetpro> kbmonkey_:  wb
[18:32] <kbmonkey_> did I time out?
[18:32] <inetpro> kbmonkey_: not yet
[18:32] <kbmonkey_> ah seems like
[18:33] <Kilos> no you just appeared again kbmonkey
[18:33] <Kilos> you gotta tail
[18:33] <kbmonkey_> that don't make sense, what I did, lol
[18:33] <Kilos> connection glitch
[18:33] <inetpro> kbmonkey_: you may have missed some bits
[18:33] <Kilos> you gotta wait 256 secs
[18:34] <Kilos> or ghost it
[18:34] <kbmonkey_> that is strange, cos im connected via a remote shell, anyways
[18:34] <inetpro> Kilos: you have a good memory
[18:35] <zeref> hmmmm
[18:35] <inetpro> zeref: wb
[18:35] <Kilos> ha ha i member ghost but forgot how to do it
[18:35] <zeref> hi hi
[18:35] <Kilos> hi zeref
[18:35] <Kilos> hi roryy
[18:35] <zeref> 12.04 is using alot of ram
[18:35] <inetpro> kbmonkey: wb
[18:35] <roryy> hi kilos
[18:36] <kbmonkey> thanks inetpro :)
[18:36] <kbmonkey> hi roryy
[18:36] <roryy> hi kb
[18:37] <kbmonkey> Kilos, I was asking from which version of that ubuntu iso do you want to move from/to using zsync?
[18:37] <Kilos> i want ian to get me 12.04 kbmonkey
[18:38] <kbmonkey> okay
[18:38] <Kilos> then update it before he brings it here
[18:38] <kbmonkey> I wonder how often the Ubuntu ISO's get updated...
[18:38]  * Kilos very sad about going away from maverick
[18:39] <Kilos> every coupla weeks
[18:39] <kbmonkey> don't worry Kilos, there will always be other OS's
[18:39] <kbmonkey> lol
[18:39] <Kilos> no man i love maverick. its been great
[18:39] <Kilos> very stable now
[18:40] <roryy> fight the future, eh? :-)
[18:40] <inetpro> kbmonkey: AFAIK they get updated with each official release
[18:40] <roryy> at least we've got a long weekend to get our installs sorted
[18:40] <inetpro> but then you also get the daily version
[18:40] <inetpro> or some such
[18:40] <kbmonkey> ah thanks inetpro
[18:41] <inetpro> kbmonkey: tumbleweed would know more about the iso release and daily schedules
[18:42] <Kilos> maverick is almost dead but they just brought out another 150m of updates
[18:42] <kbmonkey> it will likely be in the wiki too
[18:42] <Kilos> hi psydroid
[18:43] <zeref> o0o0
[18:43] <Kilos> inetpro, did nicom ever come back with his xchat problem
[18:44] <inetpro> kbmonkey: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseSchedule
[18:44] <inetpro> Kilos: hmm... I don't know
[18:44] <inetpro> don't think so
[18:44] <kbmonkey> I'm wondering if zsync could work between 11.04 and 12.?
[18:44] <tumbleweed> hrm?
[18:44] <Kilos> it must kbmonkey
[18:45] <Kilos> hiya tumbleweed
[18:45] <tumbleweed> Kilos: no, it wouldn't
[18:45] <inetpro> tumbleweed: sorry to wake you up
[18:45] <tumbleweed> err kbmonkey
[18:45] <Kilos> oh my
[18:45] <tumbleweed> inetpro: just having supper :)
[18:45] <Kilos> oh i see between different releases
[18:46] <tumbleweed> I think it's safe to assume that very little of the CD is the same between releases
[18:46] <tumbleweed> probably none of it
[18:46] <Kilos> kbmonkey, it must be done with the same release
[18:47] <inetpro> I guess very little of it would be the same
[18:47] <inetpro> if any
[18:47] <tumbleweed> well, lots of files will be. But the order probably wouldn't be the same
[18:47] <inetpro> exactly
[18:47] <tumbleweed> and zsync works in small chunks
[18:48] <inetpro> would be interesting to test and see
[18:48] <inetpro> eish!
[18:49] <Kilos> hehe
[18:49] <inetpro> Kilos: ek wonder of hy weet van eish?
[18:49] <Kilos> tot die ausies weet van dit
[18:49] <kbmonkey> aibo
[18:50]  * inetpro lol
[18:50] <Kilos> ek was eens by ubuntu-au en een ou het iets gese toe se ek eish
[18:51] <Kilos> toe kom n ander in en se "dont say eish, explain your problem and we will help you
[18:51] <Kilos> maybe they think it means help
[18:53] <Kilos> Maaz, seen nuvolari
[18:53] <Maaz> Kilos: nuvolari was last seen 1 day, 21 hours, 45 minutes and 48 seconds ago in #ubuntu-za on freenode [2012-04-20 14:07:42 PDT], and has been online on freenode since 2012-04-20 16:10:17 PDT
[18:54] <Kilos> Maaz, tell nuvolari Haai vreemdeling, kom kuier nou en dan
[18:54] <Maaz> Kilos: Okay, I'll tell nuvolari on freenode
[18:56] <nuvolari> i oom Kilos
[18:56] <Maaz> nuvolari: By the way, Kilos on freenode told me "tell nuvolari Haai vreemdeling, kom kuier nou en dan" 2 minutes and 33 seconds ago
[18:56] <nuvolari> *hi
[18:57] <nuvolari> Ek is hier rond oom
[18:57] <Kilos> lol naand seun
[18:57] <Kilos> jy moet nou en dan iets se
[18:57] <nuvolari> naand oom
[18:57] <nuvolari> oh! is dit wat 'n mens hier doen?
[18:57] <nuvolari> ek dog 'n mens wag tot iemand jou naam sê
[18:57] <Kilos> ha ha
[18:57] <nuvolari> :P
[18:58] <Kilos> nee man jy moet soggens en saans groet
[18:58] <kbmonkey> hi nuvolari
[18:59] <Kilos> kbmonkey, why are you using dropbox?
[18:59] <nuvolari> hi kbmonkey!
[18:59]  * nuvolari tips hat
[18:59] <Banlam> why would someone not use dropbox?
[18:59]  * nuvolari never got caught in dropbox
[18:59] <kbmonkey> cos it allows me to 1) share some files and 2) auto backup my .config files Kilos
[18:59] <inetpro> wow!
[18:59] <Kilos> Banlam, i need more than that
[18:59] <Banlam> kilos, more space?
[19:00]  * inetpro didn't know that sabdfl is into beekeeping
[19:00] <kbmonkey> why do you ask Kilos?
[19:00] <Kilos> Banlam, no more explanation into why
[19:01] <Kilos> um
[19:01] <Banlam> kilos, it has version control
[19:01] <Banlam> allows you to sync over various devices
[19:01] <Kilos> interested in finding an alternative if i gotta go off ubntu
[19:01] <Banlam> haha, yeah :)
[19:01] <inetpro> http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1115 From the “One thing that scares you, every day” dept
[19:01] <Banlam> but you can use it on pretty much any platform
[19:02] <superfly> mmm, yummy shepherd's pie
[19:02] <Banlam> I use it for work, means I don't have to worry about doing backups
[19:02] <Banlam> or transporting work on flash drives
[19:02] <Banlam> it's always up to date
[19:02] <Banlam> no matter where I am
[19:02] <Kilos> hehe sounds like full tummy superfly
[19:02] <kbmonkey> it has a Linux command line interface too, don't need to use the dropbox website
[19:02] <Banlam> It's a nice way to share files and especially photos
[19:03] <Banlam> you can install it in ubuntu
[19:03] <Banlam> so you have a fdropbox folder
[19:03] <Kilos> and what does it look like Banlam ?
[19:03] <Banlam> Kilos, what does what look like?
[19:03] <Kilos> oh its not a stand alone os
[19:03] <Banlam> o.O
[19:03] <Banlam> it's not an OS at all
[19:03] <Kilos> desktop
[19:03] <Banlam> it's jsut a folder on your computer
[19:03] <kbmonkey> lol, no Kilos. it is a program
[19:04] <Banlam> you install the program
[19:04] <kbmonkey> it does what Ubuntu one does
[19:04] <Banlam> specify a folder as your dropbox folder
[19:04] <Kilos> ah
[19:04] <Banlam> but anywhere
[19:04] <zeref> dropbox creates a folder for you :-)
[19:04] <Kilos> kbmonkey, so what OS are you using it on
[19:04] <inetpro> superfly: enjoy!
[19:05] <superfly> inetpro: I did, thank you.
[19:05] <kbmonkey> it runs on Debian Kilos
[19:05] <Kilos> sigh
[19:06] <Kilos> are you running debian or ubuntu
[19:06] <kbmonkey> I didn't know you use Ubuntu One Kilos
[19:06] <Kilos> i dont kbmonkey
[19:06] <Kilos> what you see there
[19:06] <kbmonkey> I run it under a Debian derivative called Crunchbang
[19:06]  * inetpro got it working perfectly on Ubuntu 11.10, on Kubuntu 12.04 as well as on the droid
[19:06] <Banlam> same
[19:06] <Banlam> also on ios
[19:07] <Banlam>  and windows :P
[19:07] <inetpro> dropbox is really nice and easy to use
[19:07] <inetpro> how UbuntuOne should have been
[19:07] <Kerbero> indeed
[19:07] <Banlam> have Google released their product yet?
[19:07] <Kilos> yo Kerbero
[19:08] <kbmonkey> oh, Kilos I am confused.  I thought you said you wanted to more your ubuntu one to dropbox when you start on debian?
[19:08] <kbmonkey> move*
[19:08] <inetpro> Maaz: wb
[19:08] <Maaz> Thank you so much inetpro my good good friend
[19:08] <Kilos> hi magespawn
[19:08] <inetpro> hmm...
[19:08] <Kilos> geez kbmonkey did i say that?
[19:08] <inetpro> magespawn: wb
[19:09] <magespawn> Hi Kilos, inetpro, kbmonkey
[19:09] <Kilos> kbmonkey, what are you smoking?
[19:10] <magespawn> Whats up this evening?
[19:10] <Kilos> we chatting about alternatives to unity
[19:10] <inetpro> magespawn: anything and everything
[19:11] <magespawn> Coop good to know
[19:11] <magespawn> Good
[19:11] <kbmonkey> nothing as good as I'd like, Kilos ;P
[19:11] <magespawn> Cool
[19:11] <Kilos> lol
[19:12] <magespawn> kbmonkey programming question?
[19:13] <kbmonkey> hello magespawn o/
[19:13] <kbmonkey> question?
[19:14] <Kilos> hmmm he's thinking about it
[19:14] <magespawn> Would you write 'if money:' or 'if money != 0:'
[19:15] <Kilos> ah still the game
[19:15] <kbmonkey> ah okay,, let's see :)
[19:15] <kbmonkey> both would work
[19:15] <kbmonkey> both does
[19:16] <magespawn> Yes they would, but apparently the first is better
[19:16] <zeref> magespawn: i think 1st would would if money was boolean
[19:17] <zeref> *work
[19:17] <kbmonkey> Python tests false if your value is 0, otherwise it will be true
[19:17] <kbmonkey> so it's a syntax shortcut
[19:18] <kbmonkey> there's nothing wrong with that way
[19:18] <magespawn> Right
[19:18]  * inetpro waves everyone good night
[19:18] <kbmonkey> good night inetpro
[19:18] <Kilos> night inetpro sleep tight
[19:19] <magespawn>  Night inetpro
[19:19] <Kilos> im not far behind
[19:19] <kbmonkey> magespawn, its very fine, as long as you consider for example, the value can it be negative? and such things
[19:20] <kbmonkey> because <0 values would also test true :)
[19:20] <Kilos> night guys. hope you all have a good start to the new week tomorrow
[19:20] <magespawn> Yes have run into that
[19:20] <kbmonkey> night Kilos
[19:20] <magespawn> Night Kilos
[19:20] <kbmonkey> as long as you consider these other cases, just using "if money:" is fine
[19:21] <magespawn> This part comes from a short program like the others, and if you 'obey' the question you would not enter a negative
[19:22] <kbmonkey> lol
[19:22] <kbmonkey> that's convenient ;)
[19:22] <superfly> magespawn: what happens if you enter a negative?
[19:23] <kbmonkey> i wish many of my old clients 'obeyed' the system rules.
[19:23] <magespawn> Th3 program still runs but you do not have to give the waiter money to get into the restaurant
[19:24] <magespawn> Let me see if I have the full code here
[19:25] <magespawn> No it is not one I have put in the d4op box y
[19:30] <kbmonkey> on a similar note magespawn ...
[19:30] <kbmonkey> if money:
[19:30] <kbmonkey> will convert money into a boolean first
[19:30] <kbmonkey> this is done similar to bool(money)
[19:30] <kbmonkey> or bool(0)
[19:31] <kbmonkey> you get the idea
[19:31] <kbmonkey> so a conversion is done, and then the test
[19:31] <magespawn> Yup
[19:31] <kbmonkey> but, if you say "if money > 0", then no conversion is done
[19:31] <kbmonkey> only comparisson
[19:32] <magespawn> Then it wouod have to be positive
[19:32] <kbmonkey> yes. I just used >0 as example
[19:33] <magespawn> That fits with the program though
[19:33] <magespawn> Better tha the one at the begininng
[19:33] <kbmonkey> yes :)
[19:34] <kbmonkey> for numbers, its best to use comparisson, sombody reading your code wil then know what you are testing for
[19:34] <magespawn> So then the waiter would only let you in if you tip real money
[19:34] <magespawn> Right i see
[19:34] <kbmonkey> the first method is more suited for comparing boolean values, and object instances
[19:35] <magespawn> Still onky on chapter 3
[19:35] <magespawn> Typing is all wrong tonight
[19:36] <kbmonkey> I'd go crackers if it took me that long :p
[19:36] <kbmonkey> I get impatient sometimes
[19:36] <magespawn> Me do but have nit had anytime lately to do anything but 'real' work
[19:37] <magespawn> not
[19:39] <kbmonkey> the PEP guide does not specify which is better in this case
[19:40] <kbmonkey> are you allowed to use functions, magespawn ?
[19:41] <magespawn> Have not got there yet but you and the fly showed me how to use print as a function
[19:42] <magespawn> print()
[19:43] <kbmonkey> later you will learn how to write your own functions, that would help you a lot in cases like this ;)
[19:43] <magespawn> All in good time I suppose
[19:53] <superfly> Generally, you'll see "if money:" more often than, "if money != 0:"
[19:53] <superfly> BUT, as you guys pointed out, in this case using "if money > 0:" is much better
[20:10] <zeref> hmmmm
[20:18] <magespawn> It is a very simple program so also a very simple example
[20:21] <magespawn> Definately form the program in question.
[20:23] <magespawn> Zeref do you also write pythin?
[20:24] <zeref> yebo
[20:24] <magespawn> Cool
[20:25] <zeref> been working on a tennis game in python
[20:26] <magespawn> Like the atari game or more advanced?
[20:27] <kbmonkey> like to see that sometime zeref :)
[20:29] <zeref> magespawn: multiplayer stats game
[20:30] <zeref> no graphics, you just see other players stats, and challenge them, see the results etc
[20:30] <zeref> kind of like massively multiplayer online browser-based strategy game
[20:31] <zeref> but not broswr-based
[20:34] <magespawn> I see sounds cool
[20:34] <magespawn> Platform? Anything running python?
[20:36] <zeref> yep
[20:36] <magespawn> Very wide reach then
[20:38] <zeref> been looking for friends to join in, but none of them have done python
[20:38] <superfly> zeref: good opportunity for them to learn
[20:40] <zeref> yep, told them that, but they were meh about that
[20:43] <zeref> thats how i've learnt teh pythons
[20:44] <magespawn> I would not mind being a part of it, and kbmonkey also said he wanted to have a look
[20:47] <zeref> that would be cool :-D
[20:47] <superfly> nothing much you can do if they're like kodez and aren't willing to put effort in
[20:48] <zeref> o0o0, what did kodez do or not do
[20:48] <magespawn> Do not know how much I can help, but I am sure I will learn a lot
[20:48] <kbmonkey> sure zeref. I take interest in any code while I learn soemthing new from it
[20:49] <kbmonkey> like I'd be interested in the technologies used to communicate your stats between clients
[20:51] <magespawn> Okay now
[20:51] <zeref> cooliz
[20:51] <magespawn> Now that is odd
[20:52] <zeref> i'll get in touch with you guys, when i get back on it. now i'm dealing with a student enrollment system in java
[20:52] <magespawn> gc and gc_ here at the same time
[20:52] <gc_> magespawn: *blink*
[20:52] <magespawn> Cool Zeref
[20:53] <magespawn> hey gc
[20:53] <kbmonkey> there was a netsplit. like when i was on here x2 :p
[20:54] <magespawn> Ahh right
[20:55] <magespawn> Bit slow to catch up since I am on mobile
[20:57] <magespawn> I am out of here, night all.
[20:57] <zeref> ciao
[20:59] <kbmonkey> me too, need an early night. let us know how that goes once you back on it zeref...
[20:59] <zeref> kk, will do
[21:00] <zeref> anybody else having a blue tint in their youtube videos: http://i.imgur.com/Xbnpz.jpg
[21:00] <kbmonkey> lol
[21:00] <kbmonkey> I saw that the other week
[21:01] <kbmonkey> could it be youtube?
[21:04] <zeref> peeps say its due to the recent update of flashplugin, only happens to nvidiea drivers
[21:05] <Kerbero> yes
[21:05] <Kerbero> nvidia+flash
[21:05] <Kerbero> http://www.my-guides.net/en/guides/linux/324-how-to-fix-the-blue-tint-on-youtube-videos-problem-flash-and-nvidia
[21:06] <kbmonkey> I want to remove the flash plugins and just use the html5 youtube method
[21:06] <Kerbero> soemtimes it falls back to flash anyway
[21:06] <Kerbero> even though one is set to html5
[21:09] <kbmonkey> because the html5 is betta, and does not support videos with adverts yet
[21:09] <kbmonkey> -t
[21:09] <Kerbero> ahh ok
[21:10] <zeref> "Of course the whole proccess has the side effect that your CPU will be used more to decode flash videos..."
[21:10] <zeref> meh
[21:12] <Kerbero> does not make sense
[21:12] <Kerbero> enabling hardware video decode
[21:12] <Kerbero> should make cpu load less
[21:13] <Kerbero> i guess the config file is the wrong way round
[21:13] <Kerbero> 1 = disabled, 0 = enabled
[21:22] <kbmonkey> the poster got the config values wrong ;)
[21:22] <Kerbero> i disagree
[21:22] <kbmonkey> can also use gnash, the free flash plugin
[21:22] <Kerbero> as i used those config values and it worked
[21:23] <kbmonkey> lol
[21:23] <kbmonkey> I don't have that file. weird.
[21:23] <Kerbero> one have to create it
[21:23] <Kerbero> the folder too
[21:24] <Kerbero> *directory
[21:34] <zeref> good heavens
[21:35] <zeref> 905/2012MB


[16:30] <tenach> Greetings.
[17:38] <Dan68> hia
[17:38] <tenach> How are ya?
[17:40] <Dan68> oh, good
[17:41] <tenach> Awesome. :D
[22:15] <tenach> Are there any meetings that we hold? I want to become active in this loco
[22:16] <Salt> organize things :)
[22:18] <tenach> Are more people here from eastern or western washington?
[22:18] <tenach> I would think they'd be in the Seattle area, but that's not a very scientific guess.
[22:19] <Salt> western
[22:19] <tenach> Well, that certainly makes things easier.
[22:19] <Salt> from my understanding of the people who I've actually communicated with
[22:19] <tenach> Alright.
[22:19] <Salt> yes, mostly seattle area
[22:19] <Salt> btw, if you want to piggy back on my group, feel free
[22:19] <tenach> Okay. I'm most often often between the Tacoma/Kent areas.
[22:19] <tenach> Your group?
[22:20] <Salt> I run gslug
[22:20] <tenach> Oh!
[22:20] <Salt> you could use the space and have people come and get together to meet after the meeting
[22:20] <Salt> or summat
[22:25] <tenach> Hmm, alright.
[22:29] <tenach> Thanks for making me aware of gslug.
[22:30] <Salt> of course, thanks for taking an interest in ubuntu-us-wa loco
[22:31] <Salt> I used to be heavily involved, now I just keep the doors open waiting for someone to come along with interest
[22:31] <tenach> Mhmm! I have been around here before, just never physically attended anything.
[22:31] <tenach> My friends in the Ohio LoCo keep pestering me to be more active in this one.
[22:31] <tenach> pestering/suggesting.
[22:31] <Salt> yeah, we stopped holding physical things after some stuff when down with canonical that forced ubuntu-pnw to split to -wa and -or
[22:32] <tenach> Ah, yeah. I think I've heard about that a little
[22:32] <Salt> also disappeared activity in alaska and idaho, but i'm just ranting now
[22:33] <tenach> I was more active when I visited AK, than here.
[22:34] <Salt> oh, we do hold one yearly event for ubuntu-us-wa
[22:35] <Salt> we have a LFNW booth
[22:35] <tenach> Oh cool


[05:55] <sam_wong> what does this message mean? Escape character is '^]' after successfully logging in a telnet server


[00:00] <h00k> Try control+tab
[00:01] <h00k> It looks hot!
[00:01] <BUGabundo> h00k: -_-' OLD
[00:01] <h00k> BUGabundo: NO YOU ARE
[00:01] <h00k> BUGabundo: is that on the list to replace alt-tab?
[00:02] <BUGabundo> no
[00:02] <h00k> Huh, so, it's just duplicating that feature?
[00:02] <h00k> with nicer-looking icons?
[00:02] <h00k> That seems silly.
[00:31] <h00k> BUGabundo: can't be that new, I was just ctrl+tabbing chromium browser windows like...yesterday, I think
[00:31] <BUGabundo> ahh you said ctrl.. I read super
[00:31] <BUGabundo> sorry
[00:33] <h00k> BUGabundo: :) No, ctrl! Try it!
[00:33] <BUGabundo> I'm on lubuntu
[00:33] <h00k> ahha.
[00:34] <h00k> I bet it doesn't work ;)
[00:40] <h00k> Alt+tab: http://i.imgur.com/jhoPX.jpg, and Ctrl+tab: http://i.imgur.com/caxmR.jpg
[00:41] <BUGabundo> looks good
[00:42] <h00k> Yeah!
[00:42] <h00k> Also, I have that battery monitor
[00:46] <h00k> :(
[01:04] <BUGabundo> i share his enthusiasm! i better go to bed! https://plus.google.com/110546133384368429145/posts/QWbCBz8oi6u
[01:24] <strace> Anyone else having strange graphical problems with Unity and ATI? (both open source and closed source)
[03:24] <snadge> can anyone recommend a blog or something like that, with commentary about whats happening with oneirc dev at the moment?
[03:27] <snadge> i'd like to assist by doing some testing.. and i have been doing so on at least one machine, with some success.. until the past few days, there has been a significant amount of x.org updates, updates to compiz, nux etc
[03:28] <snadge> anyways.. fglrx is refusing to cooperate now, im getting black rectangles all over the screen
[03:28] <snadge> i tried the radeon driver, and cant get it to display anything at all
[03:32] <snadge> i understand im meant to have a higher competence level to be doing this, and im most likely annoying seasoned devs by "getting in the way" .. but i can figure out quite a lot on my own.. it would be nice to receive some advice, or have someone point out some information that might be able to assist me.. or i could just not do this, and only use natty
[03:38] <snadge> really? ubuntu dev channel is really this quiet? :p
[03:38] <bjsnider> it's night
[03:39] <bjsnider> people often engage in a little-known seldom-used activity called "sleep"
[03:39] <snadge> i guess so .. its lunch time here, i forget that the world is spherical, rotates upon its axis and revolves around a giant ball of hydrogen fusing into helium and other heavier atoms sometimes
[03:40] <bjsnider> this activity usually makes it hard to respond to irc messages
[03:41] <rww> !night
[03:41] <bjsnider> phoronix and webupd8 often have info about oneiric
[03:41] <rww> there's a factoid for everything :3
[03:42] <bjsnider> rww, did you write that one for the bot?
[03:42] <rww> !-night
[03:42] <bjsnider> who writes these things?
[03:42] <snadge> yeah.. phoronix is great actually.. if it wasn't for phoronix i'd have zero idea about whats happening with fglrx/radeon and vaapi support
[03:43] <bjsnider> hobbsee is australian. very strange
[03:43] <snadge> it makes sense to me.. im australian too
[03:43] <snadge> and i guess im the one that message was directed at ;)
[03:43] <bjsnider> i suspect a huge conspiracy
[03:43] <snadge> its only us aussies that are up and at them when the US and UK is asleep
[03:44] <bjsnider> i figgered
[03:44] <snadge> thats how come the english speaking world has been able to dominate the world.. we take it in turns whilst each other is sleeping.. j/k
[03:44] <rww> also, people in the US that don't sleep properly o/
[03:45] <snadge> it is a conspiracy, canonical was started by a south african who lives in the UK.. a conspiracy of english speaking nations
[03:45] <bjsnider> no, it's the cia
[03:46] <bjsnider> always the cia
[03:46] <snadge> hes a cia and mi5 agent.. double
[03:47] <snadge> who else here is actually brave enough to dedicate a physical machine to oneiric?
[03:48] <bjsnider> you're talking to sleepers
[03:48] <snadge> and has installed updates in the past few days and uses x :p
[03:48] <nit-wit> it crashes x like natty
[03:48] <nit-wit> a reported bug
[03:48] <snadge> im just getting blotchy black rectangle with fglx, and nothing with radeon.. no crashing thankfully
[03:49] <snadge> radeon 6300m
[03:49] <bjsnider> fglrx rarely works for long during a dev cycle. they usually update it at the very end
[03:49] <nit-wit> I finally had to just install fedora xfce, I can't watch a vid
[03:49] <snadge> yeah thats kind of annoying bjsnider ... do canonical devs at least get preview versions of catalyst from amd?
[03:49] <snadge> or have access to an fglrx dev tree?
[03:50] <bjsnider> i think so
[03:50] <snadge> i'd sign an nda for that :P or slip somemone cash
[03:50] <bjsnider> but if you want working graphics during a dev cycle you have to go with intel or nvidia
[03:51] <snadge> given that all of my hardware except my netbook uses catalyst.. and i want my netbook to actually work, that makes things tough
[03:51] <bjsnider> catalyst is just a marketing word
[03:52] <snadge> fglrx then.. they're kind of interchangeable to me
[03:52] <bjsnider> ati/amd
[03:52] <snadge> fglrx is specific to linux.. catalyst encompasses the proprietary driver on all platforms
[03:52] <bjsnider> you did not choose hardware that is as linux friendly as some
[03:52] <snadge> amd are trying to make amends for what is actually ati's doing
[03:53] <snadge> and they have opened up a lot of stuff.. it must be hard work or something
[03:53] <bjsnider> opened up what? they haven't released any documentation in years
[03:54] <snadge> they really could be doing better, if nvidia has better support for in development code
[03:54] <snadge> especially if they want more than just a handful of people to test their driver before its released
[03:54] <snadge> to me.. that tells me that they just dont care
[03:54] <bjsnider> nvidia replaces mesa entirely, so in not depending on mesa they can quickly add support for new x-servers and kernels
[03:55] <snadge> the xvba sources just got opened up recently
[03:55] <snadge> too little.. too late
[03:56] <snadge> and hasn't some of their documentation assisted the radeon driver with new chipset support and limited 3d support improvements
[03:56] <bjsnider> yea, back in 2008 it did
[03:56] <bjsnider> my calendar says it isn't 2008 right now
[03:57] <snadge> im just kind of gutted at the moment
[03:57] <snadge> went out and bought an amd based zacate board for my htpc.. which works great under windows.. can get it to work reasonably with natty, with some minor problems
[03:58] <bjsnider> besides, it's really ahrd to code graphics drivers, and documentation alone ain't gonna git 'er done
[03:59] <snadge> upgraded it to oneiric thinking.. well why not, obviously before things are going to get better they're going to get worse.. i may as well follow along out of curiosity
[03:59] <snadge> and now it turns out i can't even help, or follow whats going on.. because i've got no display in X at all, even with the radeon driver.. sigh
[04:00] <bjsnider> did you buy the amd board because it was cheap or something?
[04:00] <snadge> both value for money, and features.. they're an excellent board
[04:00] <snadge> http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/AMD_CPU_on_Board/E35M1I_DELUXE/
[04:00] <snadge> on paper, its better than atom/ion2
[04:00] <bjsnider> the difficulty i have with it is that it's not intel
[04:01] <snadge> most of my stuff is amd
[04:01] <snadge> it may not be technically superior in all areas.. but compared to whatever the intel equivalent is, its usually a lot better value for money
[04:02] <bjsnider> that's like saying you wanted to run the 4-minute mile so you started your plan by intentionally breaking both your legs
[04:02] <snadge> i've never personally had a problem with amd cpus.. ati/radeon, is a completely different story
[04:02] <snadge> im sure i could quite happily use nvidia with amd, and enjoy far less problems
[04:02] <bjsnider> i mean i'm sure it's reasonably functional on windows, if that floats your boat
[04:03] <snadge> oh yeah.. i think i mentioned earlier this hardware is excellent under windows 7
[04:03] <snadge> and thankfully it dual boots.. its just unfortunate i didnt make it a triple boot for oneiric
[04:04] <snadge> instead i stupidly chose to upgrade my natty installation.. and part of me would rather wait for things to unbreak in oneiric, than reinstall natty
[04:04] <snadge> because i can still use windows in the meantime.. or console ;) *shrugs*
[04:12] <daurnimator> how stable is 3.0rc7?
[04:43] <snadge> linux 3 is very stable
[04:44] <snadge> xorg and friends is a completely different story
[04:44] <rww> daurnimator: about as stable as every other Linux RC. It's not really notable, despite the version bumb.
[04:44] <rww> bump **
[05:16] <daurnimator> rww: I want to use va-api with amd fusion (zacate); its apparently only in 39+ with optimisations in 3.0.
[05:32] <snadge> daurnimator: i love you
[05:33] <snadge> i think we're the only two people in the universe who owns an amd zacate platform and want to use it with linux ;)
[05:35] <snadge> i had vaapi working fine.. until a few days ago, when something exploded in x.org
[05:35] <snadge> and now i have black rectangles all over my display
[05:36] <snadge> if you have access to pre-release fglrx 11.7 for linux.. now is the time to say so :p
[08:55] <Squall5668> Hello, anyone care to give me a hand with an Ubuntu 11.10 box that boots in BusyBox right after the upgrade? At least how i can see what's wrong so i can do reinstalls with chrooting. I can't understand anything in dmesg
[09:01] <Squall5668> at least a guide on how to understand the output of dmesg?
[09:02] <bazhang> !dmesg
[09:03] <Squall5668> eh, can i output it to a file then? since i can't see anything on the lines i can read, nothing like "Error" or "Warning" :/
[09:27] <antihero> How would I switch the new unity switcher to be on Alt+Tab not Ctrl+tab?
[09:28] <antihero> Surely the convention would be to have put it on Super+Tab instead of messing with everyone's in-app tabbing?
[12:04] <dr_willis> Hmm.. cant seem to get the nvidia drivers working.. broke about 2 days ago.
[12:06] <coz_> dr_willis,  and I was about to install :(
[12:06] <dr_willis> it was working.. then broke about 2 days ago.  tried removing it.. cant seem to get the nv driver going either
[12:09] <coz_> dr_willis,  oh man,, always n vidia  but its not unusual at this stage
[12:11] <dr_willis> yea. but just seems odd its been broke for 3 days straight now. :) luckly i can irc/znc from the con sole.
[12:11] <dr_willis> One odd bug i noticed.. lightdm kept starting/crashing soo fast it looked like the console was flickering...
[12:11] <dr_willis> it never did error out like 'we crashed 100 times in 20 sec.... aborting...' :)
[12:14] <jamesbond2> Hi I have question about unity. I don't see any button for reboot/shutdown etc
[12:16] <coz_> jamesbond2,  see if  ctrl+delete  brings up the shutdown dialog UI
[12:17] <jamesbond2> coz_: that doesn
[12:17] <coz_> mm
[12:17] <jamesbond2> coz_: that doesn't work for me
[12:18] <coz_> jamesbond2,  I was just about to install oneiric  until I heard about nvidia issues,,  unless they changed that keybinding it should have brought the shutdown     dialog UI  up
[12:18] <coz_> jamesbond2,  sorry i is crl+alt+delete
[12:18] <coz_> jamesbond2,  try that ^^^
[12:19] <jamesbond2> i get popup with logout option :)
[12:19] <coz_> jamesbond2,  oh darn,  it was changed then,, that's what happens on gnome3  also
[12:20] <jamesbond2> ok
[12:21] <coz_> jamesbond2,  I havent had anyone give me the command for the shutdown dialog UI  on gnome3  which apparenlty is also on 11.10 now
[12:21] <coz_> jamesbond2,  if I find it,, I will let you know :)
[12:21] <jamesbond2> thnx coz_
[12:21] <coz_> jamesbond2,  this is a partiularly important one for me,, I use easystroke and need to associate that command with a gesture
[12:22] <jamesbond2> it's bad that they have removed the button on the panel
[12:23] <coz_> jamesbond2,  yeah,, I know
[12:31] <jamesbond2> coz_
[12:31] <jamesbond2> i have the solution
[12:31] <coz_> ooo cool
[12:31] <coz_> jamesbond2,  what is it?
[12:31] <jamesbond2> indicator-messages-gtk2
[12:31] <jamesbond2> indicator-session-gtk2
[12:31] <jamesbond2> those packages are needed
[12:31] <coz_> jamesbond2,  those are the commands?
[12:32] <coz_> jamesbond2,  ah
[12:32] <coz_> jamesbond2,  interesting they are not already installed
[12:32] <jamesbond2> indeed
[12:32] <coz_> jamesbond2,  perhaps at release they will be
[12:34] <jamesbond2> coz_: i hope so
[12:34] <coz_> jamesbond2,  did you install them, yet?
[12:35] <jamesbond2> coz_: Yes and it's working
[12:35] <coz_> jamesbond2, with the same keybinding?
[12:35] <coz_> ctrl+alt+delete?
[12:37] <jamesbond2> that is still only log out option. But the desktop show now the shutdown button
[12:37] <coz_> jamesbond2,  then there has to be a keybinding / command to bring it up
[12:42] <jamesbond2> ok
[12:59] <BUGabundo> bRoas
[13:00] <BUGabundo> wow
[13:00] <BUGabundo> h00k was right
[13:00] <BUGabundo> ctrl tab is over writing every other app
[13:00] <BUGabundo> I can't use Pidgin anymore or Chormium
[13:32] <BUGabundo> if anyone has *any* idea on how to remove ctrl+tab shortcut in unity/gnome3 PLEASE let me know! its USELESS like this
[13:33] <dr_willis> that would be a ccsm setting/plugin i think
[13:33] <dr_willis> I cant even get to X right now.. :)
[13:34] <BUGabundo> let me check so
[13:35] <dr_willis> I recall compiz having like 4 differnt 'plugins' that could do that alt-tab stuff..
[13:35] <dr_willis> differnt eyecaney/look was the main feature of them i recall.
[13:36] <BUGabundo> thanks
[13:36] <BUGabundo> THANK YOU
[13:36] <BUGabundo> its the Unity plugin shortcut
[13:36] <BUGabundo> h00k: ^^^^^^^
[13:38] <BUGabundo> wait
[13:38] <BUGabundo> not its not
[13:38] <BUGabundo> its disabled and still doesn't change it
[13:38] <BUGabundo> fuuuuuuuuuu
[13:53] <dr_willis> disable all of them? :) disable compiz?   Reconfigure the warp drive!
[13:53] <dr_willis> (watching startrek right now....)
[13:55] <BUGabundo> :D
[13:59] <coz_> :)
[14:01] <daurnimator> snadge: sadly I do not; any progres on your end?
[14:26] <sudipta> can anyone share some desktop-screenshots of gnome shell with me?
[14:27] <dr_willis> I cant even get 11.10 to boot to X at the moment. :)
[14:28] <sudipta> natural...still in alpha :)
[14:32] <snadge> daurnimator: i gave up and have been trying to fix an unrelated performance issue in xbmc
[14:32] <snadge> i was going to try out unity-2d with fglrx.. to see if that worked
[14:32] <snadge> to see if its just a problem with compiz/nux
[14:35] <daurnimator> snadge: I tried to give up but i seem to have lost all my windows discs+isos >.<
[14:38] <BluesKaj> Howdy
[14:41] <dr_willis> moo!
[14:50] <BluesKaj> How now brown cow , what's new with you ?
[14:50] <BluesKaj> dr_willis, :)
[14:50] <snadge> i've nearly cracked this xbmc issue though.. so i have renewed enthusiasm, this could be my first useful patch :p
[14:53] <BluesKaj> snadge,  which xbmc , the stand alone or the build ?
[14:55] <dr_willis> Playing with my 'boxee' box today.
[14:56] <BluesKaj> there's more than 2 xbmc versions , now when I think about it
[14:56] <dr_willis> then the boxee spinoff.
[14:57] <dr_willis> got boxee and xbmc both on the PC in the front room. wife tends to perfer xbmc.
[14:58] <BluesKaj> tried it for a while..found it too cluttered , and the menus are clunky , went back to vlc
[14:58] <BluesKaj> xbmc that is
[14:59] <dr_willis> it has themes.. it also does 100x things then vlc does. :)
[15:00] <dr_willis> boxee seems to do more things then xbmc does even.
[15:02] <dr_willis> Coolest trick i learned for VLC, boxee, and xbmc is to use my android phone as a remote. :)
[15:04] <bjsnider> there's no shortage of media center apps for linux
[15:05] <BluesKaj> we just wanted a player that plays the media without too much fuss
[15:09] <snadge> BluesKaj: its a mysql database performance issue with any version of xbmc
[15:09] <snadge> well i think only 11.0-pre which is latest git version has mysql support
[15:09] <snadge> most people dont use the mysql database option
[15:10] <snadge> but it becomes of use if you wish to share the same media collection amongst multiple clients
[15:10] <onca> hi. how can I install gnome as it is in the oneiric-desktop-amd64.iso liveCD
[15:11] <BluesKaj> yeah, I tried the git version, but it had too many undefeatable default options like subtitles in foreign languges that couldn't be turned off
[15:11] <snadge> you press t to turn subtitles off :p
[15:11] <BluesKaj> snadge, ^
[15:11] <dr_willis> onca:  it should be that way by default. If your 3d drivers are set to work with Unity.
[15:11] <snadge> im compiling xbmc from source for what i want to do.. packages are a bit useless
[15:12] <snadge> im contributing to upstream.. ubuntu can wait :p
[15:12] <BluesKaj> snadge, odd , that was my first try ...didn't turn anything on or off
[15:12] <BluesKaj> T that is
[15:12] <snadge> i havn't seen that myself.. perhaps its a bug with a specific video or subtitle format i dont know
[15:13] <onca> dr_willis, I understand, but say I'm trying to mimic on another instillation ?
[15:13] <snadge> it might be encoded into the video itself
[15:13] <snadge> play it with mplayer or something else ;)
[15:13] <BluesKaj> maybe the version had too many flaws , I was running natty bets at the time ..integration was obviouslt iffy
[15:14] <onca> vlc ftw
[15:14] <snadge> ahh things have changed since then.. if you tried it again, it would probably work
[15:14] <dr_willis> onca:  on a differnet ubuntu version?
[15:14] <snadge> it compiled on natty without issues for me.. and oneiric as well, when it wasnt broken that is
[15:15] <BluesKaj> ok
[15:16] <onca> dr_willis, uhm, naw, gentoo.
[15:16]  * onca *squirms*
[15:16] <onca> please.
[15:16] <dr_willis> onca:  good luck with getting unity on gentoo.
[15:16] <onca> unity ..
[15:16] <dr_willis> !unity
[15:16] <BluesKaj> well, I'm sticking with VLC anyway ...it passes the digital audio like I set it up , relatively simple and direct
[15:16] <onca> that's a new one to me
[15:17] <onca> documentation here I come.
[15:17] <onca> thank you dr_willis.
[15:17] <onca> alright if I stick around?
[15:34] <BluesKaj> how's the state of nvidia drivers on X with the new 3.0 kernel release ?
[15:35] <penguin42> BluesKaj: Ther earen't any big changes in 3.0 (except the number)
[15:37] <BluesKaj> penguin42, let me rephrase that..how's the kernel source support for nvidia ?
[15:38] <Ian_Corne> atm I can't install nvidia current via jockey
[15:38] <dr_willis> Ian_Corne:  dont work here either...
[15:38] <BluesKaj> penguin42, I'm on natty and thinking of upgrading , but my last try broke X
[15:38] <dr_willis> No nvidia for me.. for now. been patently waiting. :)
[15:39]  * yofel has nvidia working, but installed by apt-get
[15:39] <penguin42> Intel works fine :-)
[15:39] <yofel> 275 *does* support kernel 3.0 in any case
[15:39] <yofel> my last issue with nvidia was udev/initrd related
[15:41] <BluesKaj> yofel, how did yo fix that
[15:41] <yofel> I worked around it by forcing nouveau out of the initrd, but the bug is fixed by now
[16:02] <penguin42> hmm - not exactly stable at the moment :-(
[16:02] <Ian_Corne> had to apt-get install nvidia-current --reinstall
[16:02] <Ian_Corne> but it works now
[16:03] <snadge> im testing this xbmc database performance patch :p
[16:03] <snadge> if it works and gets accepted that will be a defining moment hehe
[16:05] <antihero> How do I redefine the new Ctrl+Tab behaviour in Unity to be on Alt+Tab?
[16:12] <dr_willis> antihero:  that would be a compiz plugin setting i imagine
[16:13] <antihero> dr_willis: cool
[16:13] <dr_willis> I dont even see a nvidia 275 version yofel  :) I was using nvidia-current a few days ago.. then broke about 2 days back
[16:15] <antihero> dr_willis: Hmm, changed the logical options, has made no difference. I'll try reinit
[16:16] <dr_willis> ive seen compiz quirks in the past where changes in ccsm dont take affect till you relogin/out
[16:17] <Ian_Corne> dr_willis: I'vegot 275.09.07-0ubuntu4 installed atm
[16:17] <Ian_Corne> and it works
[16:18] <dr_willis> Hmm
[16:18] <antihero> dr_willis: Nope, just done that, even restarted GDM
[16:18] <dr_willis> I dont even see that version # Ian_Corne . just 96 and 173
[16:18] <antihero> I do like the new switcher, just wish it replaced alt tab
[16:19] <antihero> ah, got it now
[16:20] <dr_willis> Had to use a biger hammer?
[16:22] <antihero> It just worked this time, when I had the old switcher enabled it asked to steal the hotkey and I said OK
[16:22] <antihero> this switcher is much faster and nicer
[16:56] <gnomefreak> is anyone else having issues with fglrx drivers?
[17:17] <yofel> !info nvidia-current | dr_willis
[17:17] <yofel> see, 275 ;)
[17:20] <jakemp> Still getting lag on my touchpad on my Lenovo T420 that wasn't there on 11.04.
[17:21] <yofel> no lag on my t510
[17:21] <dr_willis> Hmm. nvidia-current installed a differnt version here.
[17:21] <dr_willis> I just update/upgraded
[17:22] <yofel> dr_willis: what does apt-cache policy nvidia-current say?
[17:22] <dr_willis> let me check
[17:22] <dr_willis> there we go.. seems to be 275 now.
[17:22] <dr_willis>  275.09.07-0ubuntu4 0
[17:23] <dr_willis> I just checked that like  an hr or so ago.
[17:35] <dr_willis> installed and rebooting.. brb
[17:54] <dr_willis> Hmm. nvidia still fails to load.
[17:54] <dr_willis> Installed: 275.09.07-0ubuntu4
[17:55] <dr_willis> (EE) NVIDIA(0): Failed to load the NVIDIA kernel module!
[17:55] <dr_willis> FATAL: Module nvidia not found.
[17:56] <yofel> dr_willis: what does dkms status say?
[17:57] <dr_willis> now thats.. interesting.. 2 differnt versions..
[17:58] <dr_willis> willis@CowBuntu:/etc/X11$ dkms status
[17:58] <dr_willis> nvidia-173, 173.14.30, 3.0.0-5-generic, i686: installed
[17:58] <dr_willis> nvidia-current, 275.09.07, 3.0.0-6-generic, i686: installed
[17:58] <dr_willis> but one is for the older kernel if i read that right.
[17:59] <dr_willis> removeing the 173,and current, and reinstalling curent.
[18:00] <dr_willis> dkms status returns nothing now.
[18:00] <yofel> hm, is nouveau loaded? (check lsmod)
[18:02] <dr_willis> dosent seem to be
[18:02] <dr_willis> nvidia-current installed..
[18:02] <dr_willis>  dkms status
[18:02] <dr_willis> nvidia-current, 275.09.07, 3.0.0-6-generic, i686: installed
[18:03] <dr_willis> and i am using that kernel. :)
[18:03] <dr_willis> time to reboot and see i guess.
[18:03] <dr_willis> brb
[18:06] <coz_>  have to break for a bit , be back later
[18:09] <cjohnston> I'm trying to install the propriatry wireless drivers, however when I do I get an error saying look at /var/log/jockey.log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/650742/ any ideas?
[18:17] <trism> cjohnston: do you have the linux-headers package for your current kernel installed? I see a post on ubuntu forums that suggests that error is a result of the headers not being install when you try to activate the driver with jockey
[18:18] <cjohnston> trism: http://paste.ubuntu.com/650752/ it looks like it
[18:54] <dr_willis> yea. got X going now.
[18:59] <penguin42> anyone having problems with windows+number not working on unity this week?
[19:01] <dr_willis> Hmm. not working at all here
[19:01] <dr_willis> shows text in some little search box at the bottom right here...
[19:05] <penguin42> oh I don't get a search box, they just don't do anything
[19:06] <dr_willis> not sure that the box is .. little text entry field at buttom right
[19:07] <dr_willis> actually when imn in this termiunal window. i dont even get that..  the text goes here
[19:07] <dr_willis> 12345
[19:07] <penguin42> nod that's what I'm seeing
[19:07] <dr_willis> the #'s appear over the icons. but text goes here
[19:08] <dr_willis> if i open a file maanger window. and do it.. the text appears in a little box at the bottom left of the filemanager window
[19:08] <dr_willis> same as if i was not holding the win-key
[19:12] <dr_willis> so basically i can say.. yes. the win-key seem,s to do nothing other then make the #'s show on the icons...
[21:39] <antihero> dr-willis: I get that - I pres winkey+# and nothing happens
[21:39] <dr-willis> yep.
[21:40] <dr-willis> they sort of fovus a lot pn keybord shorycuts in unity. sort of counterintuitive at times
[21:41] <dr-willis> win key is getting used for too many tjings.
[22:12] <penguin42> I guess it's not doing much otherwise
[22:27] <BluesKaj> upgraded to Oneiric , but desktop effects sttings are still ignored , I see