[00:11] <UndiFineD> proudhawk,
[00:11] <UndiFineD> It has been 1 am
[00:11] <UndiFineD> and I like to go to bed
[00:11] <UndiFineD> but I sure hope we will talk again
[04:42] <Cheri703> hello...
[04:42] <proudhawk> greetz
[04:43] <Cheri703> so...2 things, one is that rww says you guys should update your meeting time :)
[04:43] <Cheri703> the other is something I'm sure someone has noted before, but I ran into it again tonight and it just seems so incredibly illogical when I encounter it
[04:43] <proudhawk> I'm not sure what meeting you are referencing.
[04:43] <Cheri703> in the room topic
[04:44] <Cheri703>  Next Team Meeting, September 15, 2010 21:00 UTC
[04:45] <Cheri703> the other is in reference to the on-screen keyboard
[04:45] <proudhawk> oh. ok. I am not part of the meetings yet. btw, I am a blind user here.
[04:46] <Cheri703> well, (as far as I can tell) there is no way to access the on-screen keyboard without using a keyboard
[04:46] <Cheri703> unless it has been pre-set to open at start
[04:47] <Cheri703> and once the on-screen keyboard is open, it is not accessible when needing to enter a password for administrative tasks. (again, perhaps it is, but not in a quick use case)
[04:47] <proudhawk> give a couple of seconds between messages. it starts getting hard to hear 3 things at once
[04:47] <Cheri703> sorry
[04:48] <proudhawk> it happens.
[04:48] <proudhawk> an on screen keyboard needing admin access? thats funny
[04:48] <Cheri703> well, not the keyboard needing access
[04:48] <proudhawk> hmmmm
[04:49] <Cheri703> but if you wanted to open synaptic (or anything else needing admin privileges), you have to enter a password, this greys out all other programs INCLUDING the keyboard, so you're unable to enter password
[04:49] <proudhawk> oh brother. what desktop is this on?
[04:50] <Cheri703> I have experienced it on both ubuntu 10.04 and 10.10
[04:50] <Cheri703> especially the inability to open the keyboard without typing in some way (as far as I can tell)
[04:51] <proudhawk> ooooh kay....  well, I haven't seen that yet. however, I have had no end of trouble getting orca to work on a powerbook G3
[04:52] <proudhawk> I even have someone on skype acting as my eyes
[04:52] <fuzzyvader> thats me
[04:52] <fuzzyvader> :)
[04:52] <Cheri703> :)
[04:53] <fuzzyvader> he's not gettting emoticons
[04:53] <Cheri703> smiley
[04:53] <Cheri703> colon right parentheses
[04:53] <proudhawk> oh
[04:53] <proudhawk> don't worry about it
[04:54] <Cheri703> I may amuse myself by spelling out emoticons in the future semi colon capital p
[04:54] <fuzzyvader> ell oh ell
[04:54] <Cheri703> ha ha
[04:56] <Cheri703> proudhawk: have you heard about a tv show called "covert affairs"? there is a blind man on there that has a ridiculously unreasonable computer
[04:56] <proudhawk> ROFL
[04:56] <proudhawk> rofl. its not that  unreasonable. I have one
[04:56] <proudhawk> its called a mac
[04:56] <Cheri703> has a braille bar that runs interactive and changing bumps so he can read info?
[04:57] <proudhawk> oh yah. tnats a 40 cell braille display unit. it can react in real time
[04:57] <Cheri703> wow, that's really cool! I didn't know that actually existed!
[04:58] <proudhawk> yes, it does. and its expensive as hell (about $6,000)
[04:58] <Cheri703> I would imagine
[04:59] <Cheri703> I don't know how one can help with the accessibility team other than coding, I'm not a programmer, but I'd be interested in helping in any way I can. I have deaf relatives, a brother with severe hearing loss, a friend who is very visually impaired, and I have helped with (and hope to train) service dogs for varying uses.
[05:00] <fuzzyvader> skype seems to be a great addition for those than can't seen and those that are willing to help
[05:01] <proudhawk> well, I am totally blind (about 4 months now). before I was a low partial (functional large print was abot it)
[05:01] <fuzzyvader> s/seen/see
[05:03] <Cheri703> fuzzyvader: do you just read along with the irc room? or what?
[05:04] <fuzzyvader> eh?
[05:04] <fuzzyvader> I'm on skype with proudhawk and reading his screen to him
[05:05] <fuzzyvader> and whatever messages he misses from here
[05:05] <Cheri703> ah, ok
[05:05] <proudhawk> woot orca is working!
[05:06] <Cheri703> yay!
[07:08] <proudhawk> well, thanks to <fuzzyvader> II was able to get a working 10.10 LTS orca configured and up and running. his eyes by skype and my fingers on the keyboard
[07:09] <proudhawk> orca works, but there were a couple of stutters. not sure why orca failed the 2 times, but everything is recovered
[07:18] <UndiFineD> good morning
[07:18] <proudhawk> boo!
[07:19] <proudhawk> so? whats up?
[07:19] <UndiFineD> hey
[07:19] <proudhawk> got speech working on the G#
[07:19] <UndiFineD> so you can "hear" us now
[07:19] <proudhawk> hehehe
[07:19] <proudhawk> yeah, I still need to install an irc client on there
[07:20] <proudhawk> but espeak works now (using the 10.10 LTS version
[07:20] <UndiFineD> do you prefer a CLI like client or GUI interface
[07:21] <proudhawk> the gui works ok for my means. I can use cli anytime I want. but some thing like web browsing are a  bit limited
[07:21] <UndiFineD> CLI: irssi or BitchX are the ones I know
[07:21] <UndiFineD> GUI: xchat
[07:21] <proudhawk> hmmmm. let me see if that one is in the package repository
[07:21] <UndiFineD> bitchx is not
[07:22] <proudhawk> whoa. something caused my G3 to freeze (again)
[07:23] <UndiFineD> I find orca failing on me from time to time
[07:24] <UndiFineD> as in, logging me out
[07:24] <proudhawk> well, this was an ssh session installing a bunch of packages
[07:28] <proudhawk> I can tell that something is off. orca is supposed to start on startup and sometimes it doesn't
[07:30] <UndiFineD> and now it doesn't
[07:30] <proudhawk> actually it does. not sure what is going on. checking the logs now
[07:31] <proudhawk> its something on the system. it just went unresponsive with nothing running
[07:34] <proudhawk> whoa. system load at 11.94
[07:35] <UndiFineD> something is going bad
[07:35] <proudhawk> udisks-daemon using 99% cpu
[07:36] <UndiFineD> udisk depends upon the system bus, which you also you for voice
[07:37] <UndiFineD> use
[07:37] <proudhawk> well, let me reboot that machine and see if it calms down
[07:38] <proudhawk> its behaving like there's a runaway process or a memory leak
[07:39] <proudhawk> even sudo reboot is taking a very long time to respond
[07:41] <UndiFineD> yes, shutting down is taking longer than starting up, as it seems
[07:41] <proudhawk> it finally rebooted
[07:41] <proudhawk> I am wondering if the HD is going south
[07:42] <proudhawk> its the original for that device. its like 7 or 8 years old
[07:42] <UndiFineD> a replacement would be welcome then
[07:43] <proudhawk> problem is, unless I can check the drive without the silly thing freezing up, I can't really know.
[07:43] <UndiFineD> do you like the loco ?
[07:43] <proudhawk> huh?
[07:44] <UndiFineD> the people on #Ubuntu-US-AZ
[07:45] <proudhawk> found one that helped me via skype. he was my eyes and I did all the keyboarding. he's a linux newbie, but more than capable for what I needed
[07:45] <UndiFineD> great that it worked out
[07:46] <UndiFineD> I hope you will meet some of them in real life too
[07:46] <proudhawk> same here.
[07:46] <proudhawk> I even had hiim come into this chan to see who was around. he runs a computer shop in lake havasu city arizona
[07:47] <proudhawk> btw, I figured out what it was, it seems the machine can't handle high levels of HD i/o before the disk deamon goes into overdrive
[07:48] <proudhawk> now all I have to do is learn the various shortcuts on orca and I am gtg
[07:48] <UndiFineD> then I suspect it is logging too much
[07:49] <proudhawk> possibly
[07:49] <proudhawk> checking logs now
[07:51] <proudhawk> dammit, why do they always have to have apparmor running. that takes a lot of cpu and disk I/O
[07:53] <proudhawk> looks like pulseaudio is also having a few issues.
[07:58] <proudhawk> ok, turned off a few of the startup applications. I may have to dig a little deeper to turn off some system services
[07:59] <UndiFineD> gah, and then i got logged out again
[08:00] <proudhawk> hmmm. is this on a mac or an intel/amd box?
[08:00] <UndiFineD> an 7 year old xeon
[08:00] <proudhawk> you may want to check the logs for large number of repeated items.
[08:00] <UndiFineD> with 2 new disks
[08:01] <proudhawk> hmmm. something else failing?
[08:02] <UndiFineD> yes pulseaudio
[08:03] <proudhawk> oh brother. that may take a bit of troubleshooting. I saw large numbers of repeated entries here for that one
[08:04] <UndiFineD> Nov  4 08:59:15 head pulseaudio[13450]: pid.c: Stale PID file, overwriting.
[08:04] <UndiFineD> which only happens when i run orca
[08:05] <proudhawk> question; do you happen to be visually impaired? (I never really thought to ask)
[08:05] <UndiFineD> just before that it says pulseaudio[7128]: ratelimit.c: 5151 events suppressed
[08:05] <proudhawk> uh....yeah
[08:05] <UndiFineD> no I just need a 12px font
[08:05] <proudhawk> ah ok
[08:06] <proudhawk> thats a lot of events to have to surpress
[08:06] <UndiFineD> there are several of those event messages before it dies
[08:07] <proudhawk> and when it dies, so does orca
[08:07] <UndiFineD> every 5 seconds
[08:07] <proudhawk> there's your problem. looks like pulseaudio has a bug
[08:09] <UndiFineD> if could find that bug and fix it, orca must be happier
[08:18] <proudhawk> Nov  4 01:16:09 T72 pulseaudio[1168]: ratelimit.c: 43 events suppressed
[08:18] <proudhawk> Nov  4 01:17:12 T72 pulseaudio[1168]: last message repeated 12 times
[08:18] <proudhawk> Nov  4 01:18:12 T72 pulseaudio[1168]: last message repeated 12 times
[08:18] <proudhawk> my log is filled with that
[08:22] <UndiFineD> I found the related bug with pulseaudio
[08:22] <UndiFineD> but they passed it on to dbus
[08:22] <proudhawk> do tell
[08:23] <proudhawk> figures
[08:23] <UndiFineD> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/434436
[08:23] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 434436 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "pulseaudio: sudden crashes while watching video clips or listening to songs (affects: 52) (dups: 1) (heat: 235)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[08:29] <UndiFineD> i am not sure, but i found something that may fix it
[08:29] <proudhawk> ok, do tell
[08:33] <UndiFineD> ok, that did not work
[08:34] <proudhawk> what did you try?
[08:35] <UndiFineD> ln -s /bin/dbus-launch /usr/bin/dbus-launch
[08:35] <UndiFineD> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/582999
[08:35] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 582999 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "main.c: Unable to contact D-Bus: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.Spa wn.ExecFailed: /bin/dbus-launch terminated abnormally with the following error: Autolaunch error: X11 in itialization failed (affects: 1) (heat: 20)" [Undecided,New]
[08:37] <proudhawk> well, its time I hit the sack. I'll probably be back on tomorrow night (after my tandem bike ride)
[08:39] <UndiFineD> ofcourse I had not been logged out after the crash
[08:40] <proudhawk> before I go, I need to test my autojoin options.
[08:40] <UndiFineD> :)
[08:42] <UndiFineD> seems to work here
[08:43] <proudhawk> ok, it took me a moment, but I got the autojoin figured out
[08:43] <UndiFineD> enjoy your sleep and ofcourse the tandem ride
[08:44] <proudhawk> oh yeah. especially that. I've been wanting to ride for a long time
[08:45] <UndiFineD> great
[08:45] <proudhawk> well, good night.
[08:45] <UndiFineD> see you soon then :)
[15:58] <Pendulum> charlie-tca: hey, are you possibly going to put your install guide on a wiki page?
[16:03] <charlie-tca> did
[16:04] <Pendulum> awesome :)
[16:04] <charlie-tca> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Accessibility/doc/StartGuide
[16:05] <charlie-tca> is the basic procedure. The entire procedure will become the TestCase for QA testing
[17:50] <lazarus_> how can i help
[17:58] <AlanBell> lazarus_: hi
[17:58] <lazarus_> AlanBell, hi
[17:58] <AlanBell> what did you have in mind?
[17:59] <lazarus_> i have no idea
[17:59] <AlanBell> :)
[17:59] <Pendulum> lazarus_: what are you interested in with regards to accessibility?
[17:59] <AlanBell> ok, so hanging out in the channel is helpful in itself
[18:00] <AlanBell> there are often people asking questions about navigation around Ubuntu with keyboard and screenreader
[18:00] <AlanBell> also join the mailing list
[18:01] <AlanBell> and look around the wiki page at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accessibility
[18:01] <lazarus_> well my eyes are sensitive to colours but to chang that you need to edit themes sepratley there needs  to be in my mind one configure tool across  the whole system ifthat makes any sense
[18:02] <AlanBell> there is a compiz colour filter plugin
[18:03] <AlanBell> which can be used to simulate colour blindness and presumably compensate for it (although there are no filters aiming to do that right now)
[18:05] <lazarus_> hmm
[18:15] <lazarus_> trying to think of other things
[18:43] <AlanBell> lazarus_: the next team meeting will be discussing some items that arose from the Ubuntu Developer Summit
[18:43] <AlanBell> Pendulum: when is the next meeting?
[18:43] <Pendulum> next week
[18:43]  * Pendulum starts drafting that e-mail...
[18:43] <AlanBell>  and /topic
[18:45] <lazarus_> i will be about
[18:54] <charlie-tca> lazarus_: how are you with the wiki?
[18:55] <lazarus_> charlie-tca, im not sure i understand what your asking
[18:56] <charlie-tca> Have you ever done any updates or anything ? We have 82 pages in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accessibility to review and update.
[18:57] <lazarus_> i can try and help
[18:58] <charlie-tca> great! We need to update references to Gnopernicus. That is no longer used, instead we use Orca
[18:58] <charlie-tca> We need to verify the references are still valid, some have become obsolete
[18:59] <lazarus_> i am sorta new to all of this
[18:59] <charlie-tca> and we need to review/proof read the text and make grammar and spelling corrections
[19:00] <charlie-tca> A guide to get started is https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WikiGuide.
[19:00] <charlie-tca> If you have questions, feel free to ask here.
[19:01] <charlie-tca> We do not use the tags they have there, but other than that, editing should be pretty much under those guidelines
[19:07] <lazarus_> charlie-tca, why does the wiki use the old style ubuntu colours?
[19:08] <charlie-tca> hmm, Most of that wiki does. wiki.ubuntu.com is the developers wiki, so it gets updated last, normally.
[19:08] <AlanBell> if you log in to the wiki and go to your preferences you can select the light theme
[19:08] <AlanBell> that is the new wiki theme which is not yet released as the default, but it will be
[19:09] <AlanBell> hopefully after they finish fixing it
[19:11] <charlie-tca> AlanBell: Is there a bug to get a high-contrast theme for the wiki?
[19:12] <charlie-tca> I talked to several developers and website people that were surprised to find out there was no theme suitable for high contrast.
[19:13] <Pendulum> charlie-tca: I think there may be a work item on it
[19:13] <AlanBell> well I was doing a load of help on the light theme on the basis that they would install an accessible theme along with it
[19:14] <AlanBell> bug 654643
[19:14] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 654643 in ubuntu-website "low contrast text bad for low vision users (affects: 1) (heat: 7)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/654643
[19:14] <charlie-tca> Okay, I will sit tight for a while more. If we don't get one though, we will have to keep pushing.
[19:15] <Pendulum> yep. czajkowski has an action item about it
[19:15] <AlanBell> http://moinmo.in/ThemeMarket/SimpleMente is the theme I want them to install
[19:16] <charlie-tca> That would be good!
[19:18] <AlanBell> don't think there is a bug related to that though
[19:18] <AlanBell> just some slightly stroppy emails
[19:20] <AlanBell> trouble is with the wiki is that things end up going as rt requests which get routed to /dev/null
[19:23] <AlanBell> we should have a little project to review bugs all over the place, tag them a11y and boost the priority as per the new rules
[19:24] <charlie-tca> I agree. Of course, I can only do importance on the Ubuntu bugs. All those little side projects are separate
[19:25] <charlie-tca> But anything I find is getting the a11y tag added
[19:25] <charlie-tca> I did review all the bugs in Ubuntu tagged accessibility. Triaged some, tagged all
[19:26] <Pendulum> AlanBell: UndiFineD were you the two who looked at askubuntu.com using orca and confirmed it's inaccessibility?
[19:30] <AlanBell> bug 671122
[19:30] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 671122 in ubuntu-website "install an accessible wiki theme (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/671122
[19:31] <AlanBell> Pendulum: actually I am not entirely sure that askubuntu.com is inaccessible
[19:31] <Pendulum> I thought someone tested it?
[19:36] <AlanBell> http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/68898/how-accessible-are-the-stack-exchange-sites-for-users-of-screen-reader-software
[19:38] <AlanBell> I don't really know how to properly test it with orca
[19:41] <charlie-tca> Thanks, AlanBell
[19:42] <charlie-tca> I thought it was accessible in firefox?
[19:42] <Pendulum> I've commented back to Jared asking him to test.
[19:42] <Pendulum> I really thought UndiFineD looked during UDS and it broke using orca for him
[19:55] <UndiFineD> Orca fails for me from time to time, several websites do not make text audiable, today i found that orca skips audio, passes empty data to pulse, which passes it on to alsa, which causes an issue in dbus
[19:55] <UndiFineD> I have not checked it for use with askubuntu.com
[20:25] <Pendulum> ah, okay
[20:25] <Pendulum> UndiFineD: are you willing to check?
[20:26] <Pendulum> also, please file bugs on your problems if you aren't already doing so!
[20:26] <UndiFineD> at this time .. no, orca makes me log out
[20:26] <Pendulum> ah, okay
[20:26] <UndiFineD> this is a bug , already reported by someone else
[20:26] <Pendulum> *nods*
[20:27] <UndiFineD> but some website choose to protect their content by an overlay, these are especially hard
[20:28] <Pendulum> yeah
[20:28] <Pendulum> from what I can tell, the link about accessibility says essentially that one needs to run a script every time they're on stack exchange to make screen readers read it correctly
[20:28] <UndiFineD> you find them for example on groundbreaking scientific reports
[20:28] <Pendulum> *nods*
[20:29] <UndiFineD> where you *should* buy the content
[20:29] <Pendulum> btw, I apologize for any incoherency I'm ill (I also apologize if I don't remember any of this tomorrow)
[20:30] <UndiFineD> what happened to you ?
[20:31] <Pendulum> I went to UDS and caught ubuflu
[20:31] <UndiFineD> lol
[20:31] <Pendulum> so I'm curled up on the couch with liquids and snacks and brainless stuff to watch and do
[20:31] <UndiFineD> yes that what you get from flying
[20:32] <Pendulum> nah, it wasn't flying. it was definitely UDS
[20:32] <Pendulum> it started monday/tuesday-ish
[20:32] <UndiFineD> yes but many others were
[20:32] <Pendulum> heh
[20:32] <Pendulum> well, I did fly to UDS. just symptoms were long enough afterwards that I know I didn't catch it on the way there
[20:32] <Pendulum> it is what happens when you stick 350 people from various parts of the world in one area, though, yes
[20:33] <UndiFineD> I hope I will be able to go to bucharest
[20:33] <Pendulum> you mean budapest?
[20:33] <UndiFineD> and get sick too
[20:34] <UndiFineD> yes
[20:34] <Pendulum> heh
[20:34] <Pendulum> I hope to make it to budapest as well :)
[20:34] <Pendulum> I didn't get this sick last UDS
[20:34] <UndiFineD> i can choose, by train or plane
[20:34] <UndiFineD> both equally exspensive
[20:34] <Pendulum> I think I had more stress during this one
[20:34] <Pendulum> nice
[20:35] <Pendulum> I wish I could have taken the train to this one, but it would have been 3x as expensive and 24+ hours on the train in a wheelchair :-/
[20:37] <UndiFineD> oh your in a wheelchair, yes, such a train trip through europe is quite nearly impossible
[20:37] <UndiFineD> train aisles are too small, doors can be too small
[20:37] <Pendulum> where I've been in europe train travel hasn't bee a problem
[20:37] <UndiFineD> and the incredible number of stairways you encounter
[20:38] <Pendulum> UndiFineD: where in europe are you?
[20:38] <UndiFineD> the netherlands
[20:38] <Pendulum> actually, my experience with Dutch trains has been quite good :)
[20:39] <Pendulum> (I am in love with the city of Amsterdam and want to see more of the Netherlands :) )
[20:39] <UndiFineD> not all of them are good, and wheelchair help usually has to be ordered 2 days in advance
[20:40] <Pendulum> I've done it both ways
[20:40] <UndiFineD> I lived in amsterdam, the citty is too crowded, i went back to the countryside up north in friesland
[20:40] <Pendulum> although I suspect when I just show up the fact that I'm an American tourist probably helps
[20:41] <Pendulum> I've lived in NYC. Nothing seems crowded after that ;-)
[20:42] <UndiFineD> heh, queensday is madness in amsterdam, you can walk on heads
[20:45] <dutchie> tourism is worse when you are one of the tourist attractions
[20:45] <UndiFineD> yes you are dutchie
[20:45] <dutchie> and when you live/work inside tourist attractions
[20:45] <UndiFineD> :D
[20:47] <UndiFineD> I think dutchie is afraid to cross the channel
[20:47] <dutchie> eh?
[20:47] <UndiFineD> so many people are waiting for Mr holland
[20:48] <dutchie> not sure if i could live up to that :)
[20:48] <UndiFineD> see I am right
[20:48] <dutchie> i have spent a week in .nl before
[20:48] <dutchie> the jokes began to get old after ~2 hours
 I didn't get this sick last UDS --> Belgium must be a less dangerous place than Florida  ;)
[21:19] <Pendulum> JanC: but Florida is warmer.
[21:19] <Pendulum> I partially blame the rainstorm that my wheelchair broke during the middle of on Tuesday
[21:21] <JanC> wheelchair broke?
[21:25] <Pendulum> yeah
[21:25] <Pendulum> fixed within 30 minutes
[21:25] <Pendulum> but it meant I got really thuroughly soaked
[21:25] <Pendulum> and didn't get anywhere that I could get dry for several hours
[21:27] <JanC> yeah, that's always bad to get sick
[21:27] <JanC> BTW: I upvoted the meta.se question too
[21:27] <Pendulum> thanks :)
[21:29] <JanC> every SE site I register on, I get 100 points for free because of linking the account to my other SE accounts, so I get upvoting rights automatically
[21:30] <Pendulum> :)
[21:30] <JanC> (might be a good trick for those who need more rep)


[17:48] <pvl1> is there a standard for like, repo structure
[17:48] <pvl1> the pcduino repo isnt functioning for me


[01:25] <warewolf> YES. I WIN.
[01:25] <warewolf> quirks=0x0486:0x0185:0x40
[01:27]  * RAOF considers opening up his laptop so he can help it push the bits around faster by hand.  Less slow, more speed, damnit!
[01:27] <warewolf> nooooooooooo! the cursor doesn't track correctly when xrandr rotated! noooooooooo!
[01:28] <RAOF> Fixed in xserver 1.9
[01:28] <warewolf> RAOF: was that directed at me?
[01:28] <RAOF> (Although I think you'll need to manually set the input transformation matrix)
[01:28] <RAOF> Yup.
[01:28] <warewolf> I'm on a roll tonight, tell me what to do
[01:29]  * RAOF tries to remember…
[01:29] <RAOF> So, if you're using Xserver 1.9 you can set an input transformation on your input device.
[01:30] <RAOF> It's a 3x3 perspective matrix, so you basically just want the last column to be 1s, the last row to be 0s, and the top-left 2x2 submatrix to be a rotation matrix for your xrandr transform.
[01:30] <warewolf> X.Org X Server 1.7.6
[01:30] <warewolf> so I preusme I'm not running 1.9
[01:30] <RAOF> No.
[01:30] <warewolf> so close!
[01:31] <warewolf> man I have been fighting with this t91mt and the touchscreen under lucid
[01:35] <warewolf> RAOF: so wait, how come xrandr under Karmic worked fine?
[01:37] <RAOF> As in: it rotated your input device, too?
[01:37] <warewolf> yep.
[01:37] <warewolf> infact, I have a live usb stick I can test that on too. 1 sec
[01:44] <warewolf> yep works fine
[01:44] <RAOF> Ah.  So the basic rotation case should still be handled.
[01:47] <warewolf> I'm not sure what the difference is
[01:54] <RAOF> I'm not familiar with what you've had to do to make it work in Lucid — in an ideal world, it should work as well as karmic (hah!)
[02:04] <warewolf> hah
[02:04] <warewolf> well, the kernel in lucid blacklisted the touchscreen from hiddev
[02:04] <warewolf> so I unblacklisted it
[02:05] <warewolf> then I had to quirk it with the multitouch quirk
[02:05] <warewolf> now it works and reports correct axises, except when xrandr rotated.
[02:10] <bryceh> RAOF, do you have a few minutes to chat?
[02:10] <RAOF> bryceh: Yeah.
[02:10] <bryceh> RAOF, I want to talk a bit about handling X bug reports that are filed against lucid
[02:11] <bryceh> I was going through the -ati bug reports looking for ones to test my new upstreamer tools on, and it struck me that the vast majority of bug reports are against lucid
[02:11] <bryceh> in fact nearly all of these were reported post-release
[02:12] <bryceh> as usual most are kinda low quality, but not all of them
[02:13] <bryceh> in the past before we tagged releases, bugs reported against prior releases were always kind of a nuisance to me, but when I started tagging them and was able to filter them out, I found it quite helpful
[02:13] <bryceh> as I could just ignore anything not tagged with the current development release
[02:14] <RAOF> So we've got a bit of a decision tree here, right?
[02:15] <RAOF> Does the lucid bug probably have enough information to fix it? No: ask for retesting against Maverick, Yes: go to part 2
[02:15] <bryceh> RAOF, I guess I've gotten kinda bigoted against bug reports against non-development versions, and consider them to basically not much more than technical support requires
[02:15] <bryceh> RAOF, yeah that's true we have a tree
[02:15] <RAOF> Part 2: If this bug were fixed, would it be SRUable?  No: Ask to retest against Maverick.  Yes: … um?
[02:15] <bryceh> but what I want to talk about is if we could just lop the entire limb off?
[02:16] <bryceh> IOW, when someone files a bug report against a released version, have a script close the bug with a kindly message, or convert it to a question, or similar
[02:17] <RAOF> That's pretty tempting.  On the other hand, there may well be bugs reported post-release that we do want to fix *in that release*, particularly LTS releases.
[02:17] <bryceh> so my question to you really is, to what degree do you care about bugs reported against released versions of ubuntu?  Do you think having them open helps you in some way?
[02:17] <bryceh> right
[02:18] <bryceh> however I get the sense that we defer from closing 99 bugs so as to keep 1 open that we want to fix
[02:18] <RAOF> Yes.
[02:18] <bryceh> but then, reading through 99 bugs gets tedious, so I'm not sure how often we actually find that 1 bug ;-)
[02:19] <bryceh> RAOF, what's been your experience so far with SRU'ing X bugs to lucid?
[02:19] <RAOF> Perhaps what we want is to (a) auto close, with a nice message but (b) send them somewhere where we can periodically review them and re-open?
[02:20] <RAOF> bryceh: Mostly my experience has been: poke the kernel team to fix it.
[02:20] <bryceh> *nod* yeah that's exactly what I was mulling over myself
[02:21] <bryceh> RAOF, ok yeah I think I've done a few SRUs but of those they were all either bugs that had been reported prior to the release which I had been working on, or ones I'd noticed myself
[02:21] <RAOF> That matches my experience.
[02:22] <bryceh> ok cool
[02:22] <RAOF> How would auto-close interact with regressions introduced in an SRU, though?
[02:22] <bryceh> alright, well my time is going to be pretty chopped up this next month, so dunno if I'll ever get a chance to work on it, but I've got an idea on how to render this into a script
[02:23] <bryceh> that's a good question
[02:23] <RAOF> That could possibly be incorporated into the script.
[02:24] <RAOF> Actually, that would be useful regardless of auto-close or not:
[02:24] <RAOF> Highlight bugs reported in the 10 days after an update goes from -proposed to -updates.
[02:24] <bryceh> yep
[02:25] <bryceh> and it could verify that the user had the requisite version installed, so it still filters out unrelated bug reports
[02:26] <bryceh> ok cool
[02:26] <bryceh> hey I have something cool for you :-)
[02:26] <RAOF> That would be pretty handy.
[02:26] <RAOF> Oh?
[02:26] <bryceh> http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/cgi-bin/send_upstream.cgi
[02:26] <bryceh> RAOF, this is the bug upstreamer I demoed at UDS
[02:26] <RAOF> OOooooooooh
[02:27] <bryceh> it's now been generalized sufficiently that others can use it
[02:27] <bryceh> once I get a few people test driving it successfully (and have a couple other features added in) I'll publish it for general use
[02:28] <bryceh> RAOF, mostly I've tested it with -ati and -intel bugs
[02:28] <RAOF> I'll give it a whirlygig.
[02:28] <bryceh> there may be some problems using it against source packages that don't have upstream bug tracker info set... but these should be rare (tell me if you run into one)
[02:28] <bryceh> RAOF, thanks
[02:29] <bryceh> one of the upcoming features (which is ultra cool) is sending attachments as well.  We've got the code to do it, but it needs some integration work
[02:29] <bryceh> Kamran, my GSoC student, put it together
[02:29] <bryceh> here's the evidence that it works:  https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28969
[02:29] <ubot4> Freedesktop bug 28969 in Driver/intel "[Intel Arrandale] Screen flickers" [Normal,New]
[02:30] <bryceh> RAOF, I don't know if you've been upstreaming many bugs so far, but if so this'll majorly save time
[02:30] <RAOF> I haven't been upstreaming too many bugs at this point.
[02:30] <bryceh> RAOF, also if while using it you have ideas on improving it let me know
[02:31] <RAOF> I most assuredly shall!
[02:31] <RAOF> Incidentally, pitti's new add_drm_info hook is a bit of a winner.
[02:31] <bryceh> oh?
[02:33] <bryceh> I've landed that change I was talking about to make launchpad show the first/last 40  comments on highly commented bugs.  Went in earlier this afternoon
[02:33] <RAOF> In some respects its duplicates the xrandr output, but it's got the edid in an easier to use form, and is right there on the bug info.
[02:33] <bryceh> should show up on edge in a day or so
[02:33] <bryceh> oh nice
[02:33] <RAOF> Cool.  That'll be *substantially* more useful than just the first 80 :)
[02:33] <bryceh> yeah that was on my todo list to get that edid info parsed better
[02:33] <bryceh> yeah I hope so
[02:34] <bryceh> aaaand I happened to make it 1.5% faster at rendering the bug page :-)
[02:34] <RAOF> :)
[02:36] <RAOF> Yay!  Kernel's finished building.
[03:03] <bryceh> RAOF, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/460901/
[03:03] <bryceh> copyediting appreciated (especially anything we could leave *out* to shorten the message)
[03:19] <RAOF> bryceh: Maybe http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/460905/ ?
[03:46] <bryceh> RAOF, yeah that's better
[06:32] <RAOF> Bah.  Die, cursor, die!
[10:11] <Sarvatt> RAOF: regarding the slowness, are they all on maverick? i'm hitting some really strange problems making my machines really slow too
[10:11] <Sarvatt> I/O problems with 2.6.35 after a few hours it looks like, goes away after a reboot
[10:13] <Sarvatt> i can't get more than 1MB/second out of my HDD when it happens, haven't had it with 2.6.35-7 yet knock on wood
[10:27] <RAOF> Sarvatt: Yeah, they are.
[10:28] <tseliot> only I/O slowness?
[10:28] <RAOF> I suspect something might be leaking video memory again?  1.6GiB of gem objects, and although there was only ~200MiB of the 2GiB RAM used it seemed to be paging out to swap.
[10:29] <Sarvatt> there's ureadahead causing an extra 500MB memory load on all my systems too :D
[10:29] <Sarvatt> oh boy things are leaking again?
[10:30] <Sarvatt> 58MB here so its not a problem on edgers it looks like
[10:30] <RAOF> After restarting X it dropped back to 70ish.
[10:31] <Sarvatt> sure it wasn't 160MB?
[10:31] <RAOF> Pretty sure.
[10:31] <scar_> is there any incompatibilities with llvmpipe via xorg-edgers ppa on lucid?
[10:31] <Sarvatt> what do you mean incompatibilities?
[10:31] <RAOF> I counted the triplets.
[10:31] <seb128> bug #603507, does anybody has seen similar issues?
[10:31] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 603507 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "[intel] clutter views not updated correctly with the new clutter (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/603507
[10:32] <Sarvatt> i compare it to GTT total, if its got an extra digit it's gigs :D
[10:32] <seb128> not sure if that's a driver issue or a clutter one...
[10:32] <scar_> Sarvatt: I want to test llvmpipe but was wondering if lucid is supported, in other words if I should have to upgrade to mavrick to test llvmpipe
[10:33] <Sarvatt> scar_: nope its on lucid too
[10:33] <Sarvatt> seb128: any quick ways to test that bug?
[10:33] <scar_> ok great, then also is it necessary for me to use the xorg-edgers ppa or can I use x-updates?
[10:34] <seb128> Sarvatt, run unity on maverick if you have intel
[10:34] <seb128> or unity --popup
[10:34] <RAOF> I'm running unity right now on Intel.
[10:34] <seb128> Sarvatt, or some of the gnome-games using clutter
[10:34] <seb128> the worms one has the issue as well
[10:34] <seb128> RAOF, under GNOME or an unity session?K
[10:35] <RAOF> In a unity session - it needs to be run under GNOME?
[10:35] <Sarvatt> nibbles isn't working
[10:35] <seb128> Sarvatt, working as displayed content?
[10:35] <Sarvatt> quadrapassel is fine
[10:35] <seb128> displaying
[10:36] <seb128> RAOF, right, I'm unclear what the issue is exactly
[10:36] <seb128> unity session works fine
[10:36] <seb128> but running unity --popup under GNOME doesn't
[10:36] <seb128> nor does the worm game, it never displays the board
[10:36] <RAOF> Hm.
[10:36] <seb128> it works fine with clutter 1.2.4
[10:36] <seb128> or it works fine on clutter 1.2.10 and nvidia
[10:36] <RAOF> There is a known problem with fullscreen flash, which could possibly be related.
[10:36] <RAOF> That'll be resolved when we move to intel 2.12.
[10:37] <RAOF> Which should be soon!
[10:37] <Sarvatt> i would say its a mesa or clutter bug
[10:37] <seb128> hey njpatel
[10:37] <njpatel> hey hey
[10:38] <seb128> njpatel added a comment to the bug
[10:39] <RAOF> That does sound like a very similar behaviour to the flash problem.
[10:40] <seb128> could you add a reference to that flash bug on launchpad?
[10:40] <RAOF> I'll hunt it down.
[10:40] <seb128> thanks
[10:43] <RAOF> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28573 is what I was thinking of.
[10:43] <ubot4> Freedesktop bug 28573 in Driver/intel "[i965] Fullscreen flash and windowed SDL games fail to update the screen" [Normal,Reopened]
[10:46] <Sarvatt> dont suppose http://git.clutter-project.org/clutter-gtk/commit/?id=d50240f524870fd80b2cc5bb96a7bf9b8e10c754 might be related?
[10:47] <seb128> njpatel, ^ what do you think?
[10:47] <seb128> Sarvatt, it seems worth trying
[10:47] <seb128> let me try
[10:47] <Sarvatt> CLUTTER_VBLANK=none fixes it seb128
[10:47] <Sarvatt> so it might be
[10:48] <seb128> indeed
[10:48] <njpatel> seb128, that clutter bug sounds like it could be the issue
[10:48] <seb128> thanks for the CLUTTER_VBLANK=none workaround
[10:49] <Sarvatt> i cant remember the clutter debug option to only disable INTEL_swap_events, argh
[10:50] <Sarvatt> it would make sense that it only affects maverick though even though lucid had 1.2.x because INTEL_swap_events are in xserver 1.8+ only
[11:05] <Sarvatt> yep its stuck in event processing without CLUTTER_VBLANK=none
[11:06] <seb128> ok, that patches to clutter-gtk fixes the issue
[11:06] <seb128> I'm uploading that to maverick, thanks guys
[11:06] <seb128> njpatel, ^
[11:07] <Sarvatt> \o/ good to hear
[11:08] <njpatel> seb128, awesome
[11:08] <njpatel> Sarvatt, thanks!
[11:10] <Sarvatt> scar_: sorry, missed your question, xorg-edgers is required
[11:15] <scar_> Sarvatt: no problem, just finished updating. If I break my x-server and can't get up back up after trying a few xorg.conf changes... do you suppose i can just remove the ppa and do update & upgrade to try and revert?
[11:15] <jcristau> upgrade won't downgrade
[11:15] <Sarvatt> scar_: sudo apt-get install ppa-purge then just run sudo ppa-purge xorg-edgers
[11:16] <scar_> ok thanks, hopefully I won't need to use that
[11:17] <Sarvatt> i'd install it anyway now while you can and if things are broken you can just run it in a recovery console :)
[11:18]  * scar_ sighs and holds down the shift button
[11:19] <ricotz> Sarvatt, hi
[11:19] <Sarvatt> heyo
[11:19] <ricotz> is the disappearing mouse cursor normal or is it a bug
[11:20] <jcristau> it's normal
[11:20] <Sarvatt> its the unclutter package
[11:20] <ricotz> jcristau, so it is a feature?
[11:20] <Sarvatt> "feature" yeah
[11:20] <ricotz> ok ;-)
[11:21] <scar_> can I remove nvidia proprietary via apt-get purge nvidia-glx ?
[11:21] <Sarvatt> nvidia-current
[11:21] <jcristau> apt-get has no purge command, it has remove
[11:21] <Sarvatt> yeah it does!
[11:23] <Sarvatt> has for years, i haven't been using debian distros that long but i've used apt-get purge the whole time i have
[11:24] <scar_> any idea how I can pipe Xorg -configure to more? or even a file...
[11:24] <Sarvatt> why are you running Xorg -configure?
[11:25] <Sarvatt> if its for the blob you want nvidia-xconfig, if you're moving away from the blob you want to just remove it completely
[11:25] <Sarvatt> xorg.conf I mean
[11:25] <scar_> before and after the xorg-edgers i had to use xorg.conf other wise my pc hangs on startup
[11:26] <scar_> my geforce 2 doesn't like nouveau
[11:26] <ricotz> scar_, you can use "COMMAND 2>1& | tee OUTPUTFILE"
[11:27] <jcristau> Sarvatt: really? heh.
[11:27] <scar_> the famous stdout stderr redirections :)
[11:27] <jcristau> Sarvatt: ooh
[11:28] <jcristau>   * cmdline/apt-get.cc: really applies Julien Danjou<EMAIL_ADDRESS>patch to add 'purge' command line argument (closes: #133421).
[11:28] <jcristau> 2007.  it's brand new!
[11:28] <jcristau> no wonder i didn't know about it
[11:37] <scar_> Kernel driver in use: nouveau, which is awesome, but still getting Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0". Should I try creating xorg.conf again to force GLX to load?
[11:38] <scar_> also xrandr only shows 640x480 and 800x600, I think I need to change my monitor's verical and horisontal sync
[11:38] <Sarvatt> scar_: you still have nvidia installed
[11:38] <Sarvatt> sorry, since you have a geforce 2 its not nvidia-current that you have to purge
[11:39] <scar_> I think so tried to purge nvidia-current but it did nothing
[11:39] <scar_> I also did rmmod nvidia
[11:39] <Sarvatt> its sudo apt-get purge nvidia-96 i believe?
[11:40] <Sarvatt> also what distro are you using?
[11:40] <Sarvatt> if its lucid you want to sudo apt-get install linux-image-2.6.35-7-generic
[11:40] <scar_> ubuntu i368 lucid'
[11:40] <Sarvatt> you need the newer kernel to actually use nouveau otherwise you are using the fbdev X driver
[11:41] <scar_> I did aptitude search nvidia, it shows A next to nvidia-96-modaliases, nvidia-common, nvidia-current-modaliases and nvidia-settings
[11:42] <Sarvatt> oh maybe it got removed on upgrade then, just installing the kernel might fix it
[11:42] <Sarvatt> no i dont think it did if you're getting the glx missing error, hmm..
[11:43] <Sarvatt> does purging nvidia-96 do anything?
[11:44] <Sarvatt> i've got to run, about to pass out here. hope ya can get it going, removing nvidia installing the new kernel and installing libgl1-mesa-dri-gallium should do it though
[11:44] <scar_> I'm going to try that now, the other option is llvmpipe which i initially wanted to try out, but have no idea how to use/configure it, but yeah first going to remove all this proprietary borked drivers
[11:45] <Sarvatt> llvmpipe is just swrast
[11:45] <Sarvatt> if you get nouveau working you dont need it, but you can use it by using LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1 yourapp
[11:53] <scar_> after purging nvidia-96 I've now got 2d and 3d rendering via 2.1 Mesa 7.9-devel (still not nouveau)
[11:54]  * scar_ rases his hands in the air and screams no more lag when scrolling !!! :D
[11:54] <Sarvatt> whats the OpenGL renderer string?
[11:54] <Sarvatt> because that vendor string is the same as nouveau's
[11:54] <Sarvatt> err version string
[11:55] <Sarvatt> software rasterizer?
[11:56] <scar_> yes, Software Rasterizer
[11:56] <Sarvatt> you installed and rebooted into the new kernel too right?
[11:56] <scar_> I guess that's clasic mesa
[11:57] <scar_> I'm using 2.6.32-23-generic-pae
[11:57] <Sarvatt> ah no nouveau 3D because you are using fbdev and not nouveau
[11:57] <Sarvatt> nouveau in that ppa requires a 2.6.34 or newer kernel
[11:57] <Sarvatt> thats why you're using swrast too
[11:58] <Sarvatt> yeah software rasterizer is classic mesa
[11:58] <Sarvatt> OpenGL vendor string: VMware, Inc.
[11:58] <Sarvatt> OpenGL renderer string: Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe
[11:58] <Sarvatt> OpenGL version string: 2.1 Mesa 7.9-devel
[11:58] <Sarvatt> OpenGL shading language version string: 1.20
[11:58] <Sarvatt> thats what gallium swrast looks like
[11:59] <scar_> I see, so obtaining the new kernel would you recommend using mavrick or is there a ppa i can use for that too?
[11:59] <Sarvatt> linux-image-2.6.35-7-generic is in the PPA
[12:00] <Sarvatt> the maverick kernel
[12:00] <Sarvatt> its in xorg-edgers just not installed automatically
[12:00] <scar_> w0w that's quite a change
[12:00] <scar_> 32 to 35
[12:01] <Sarvatt> the lucid kernel is a frankenstein of 2.6.32 and 2.6.33 parts :)
[12:03] <scar_> backports++
[12:04] <Sarvatt> you can use this PPA if you want automatic updates https://edge.launchpad.net/~kernel-ppa/+archive/ppa
[12:05] <Sarvatt> when maverick releases that ppa will be directly in lucid too
[12:06] <scar_> deb http://edge.launchpad.net/~kernel-ppa/+archive/ppa lucid main <- does that look good to you or should I use mavrick?
[12:06] <Sarvatt> yep thats right
[12:07] <Sarvatt> i'm not sure what you install for the automatic updates though..
[12:07] <Sarvatt> linux-image-generic-lts-backport-maverick i think
[12:07] <Sarvatt> or linux-image-lts-backport-maverick
[12:08] <scar_> I will try it soon..
[12:30] <Sarvatt> oh yeah, forgot the copy-fb patch was broken pretty horribly in intel 2.12 :(
[12:38] <tseliot> how so?
[12:38] <tseliot> broken as in buggy or as in "doesn't apply any more"
[12:38] <tseliot> ?
[12:38] <Sarvatt> needs major refreshing
[12:39] <tseliot> aah
[12:39] <Sarvatt> doesn't apply
[12:39] <tseliot> that's better
[12:39]  * tseliot -> lunch
[12:40] <Sarvatt> just merged ati and was going to do intel and remembered that I had a heck of a time trying to refresh it when it broke in git
[12:43] <Sarvatt> don't suppose I could bug you to sponsor ati 6.13.1 sometime tseliot? :) http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-xorg/driver/xserver-xorg-video-ati.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/ubuntu          http://sarvatt.com/downloads/merges/ati/
[12:56] <Sarvatt> RAOF: about to submit sync requests for the updates needed for xserver 1.9, any idea if that really is going to be an option? i don't see fglrx updating in time since the abi bump is pretty significant this time around and they *just* introduced their new XA
[12:59] <Sarvatt> ricotz: some people reporting that your last ia32libs today broke flash?
[13:00] <ricotz> Sarvatt, lucid or maverick?
[13:00] <ricotz> mhh, i am using the native 64bit flash plugin
[13:02] <Sarvatt> they didn't say
[13:02] <Sarvatt> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-1476691.html
[13:02] <jcristau> 'screw fglrx' not an option i guess? :)
[13:03] <Sarvatt> probably not since theres people paying canonical to make ubuntu work on hardware that only works with fglrx i'm guessing :)
[13:04] <Sarvatt> but i have no idea
[13:04] <jcristau> i would have thought those people would use an lts
[13:04] <jcristau> but maybe not
[13:09] <Sarvatt> don't suppose you know an easy way to get a list of symbols that changed between abi's in the server by any chance? :)
[13:10] <Sarvatt> like nvidia fails to load because WindowTable is undefined in 1.9, just want to look over what the blob drivers are using thats gone
[13:13] <jcristau> a diff on /usr/include/xorg/* would give an idea
[13:15] <jcristau> or diff of objdump -T Xorg | grep Base, but that won't tell you if prototypes or structures changed
[13:16] <Sarvatt> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/log/include?qt=grep&q=abi looks like its good enough since the commits are obvious, i just wasn't sure if there was an easier way
[13:18] <jcristau> anyway, uploading 1.9rc4 to experimental now.
[13:24] <warewolf> morning Sarvatt
[13:25] <warewolf> Sarvatt: btw, ty for the help w/ the touchscreen
[13:25] <warewolf> Sarvatt: the xinput axis stuff you linked me was the final bit I needed, I'm 100% set now
[13:30] <Sarvatt> sweet, glad to hear it, thats the part i couldn't do remotely :)
[13:31] <scar_> my computer hangs in 2.6.35-7 even in recovery mode, it looks like it's trying to startx in recovery mode though...
[13:36] <tseliot> Sarvatt: yes, of course I can sponsor the upload. I'm also using radeon and Maverick on my main machine :-)
[13:37] <tseliot> as regards fglrx, it will remain broken until they support xserver 1.9. I guess that's acceptable
[13:38] <tseliot> oh, nvidia would break too though, ouch
[13:40] <jcristau> meh nvidia is fast at picking up new abis
[13:41] <tseliot> faster than amd for sure
[13:41] <tseliot> fast enough? well..

[13:42] <tseliot> what is it?
[13:42] <jcristau> a mail
[13:43] <bjsnider> at one point nvidia released two drivers per year. then in more recent times they were releaseing two per week. now it's more conservative again. puzzling
[13:43] <tseliot> yes, I picked that up
[13:43] <jcristau><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[13:43] <jcristau> better? :)
[13:43] <tseliot> definitely
[13:44] <jcristau> mid.gmane.org is ♥
[13:44] <tseliot> :-)
[13:55] <Sarvatt> jcristau: ack, did you already upload xserver?
[13:55] <jcristau> Sarvatt: yeah
[13:55] <Sarvatt> oh ok you added x11proto-xinerama-dev to xserver-xorg-dev, phew
[13:55] <tseliot> Sarvatt: I assume you tested -radeon
[13:56] <Sarvatt> I have no machines to test it on but I compile tested it
[13:57] <tseliot> Sarvatt: ok, let me test the package with my card here, then , if all goes well, I'll upload it
[13:57] <Sarvatt> https://edge.launchpad.net/~sarvatt/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/1228102/+listing-archive-extra
[13:58] <tseliot> ah, good, I won't have to build the package
[13:59] <tseliot> Sarvatt: also, I think I'll move the nvidia headers back where they used to be and remove the Conflicts with mesa-common-dev
[14:00] <warewolf> Sarvatt: http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=9526140&postcount=5
[14:01]  * tseliot tries the new radeon
[14:06] <tseliot> the new radeon driver seems to work well here
[14:07] <Sarvatt> tseliot: yeah I got a complaint email about that header move
[14:08] <Sarvatt> silly people thinking they needed nvidia-current-dev for GL headers :)
[14:08] <tseliot> hehe
[14:08] <Dr_Jakob> Sarvatt: did you ever manage to get vmwgfx running?
[14:09] <Sarvatt> Dr_Jakob: without 3D yeah, my vmware trial ran out though :)
[14:09] <bjsnider> Sarvatt, who was the email from?
[14:09] <Dr_Jakob> Heh, just use player it should work just as fine.
[14:09] <Sarvatt> Paulo Dias
[14:09] <bjsnider> did it have to do with mythtv?
[14:10] <Dr_Jakob> Sarvatt: I can see if I can't get you a ws key tho.
[14:10] <Sarvatt> The following packages are BROKEN:
[14:10] <Sarvatt>   libgl1-mesa-dev
[14:10] <Sarvatt> The following packages will be REMOVED:
[14:10] <Sarvatt>   mesa-common-dev{a}
[14:10] <Sarvatt> The following packages will be upgraded:
[14:10] <Sarvatt>   nvidia-current-dev
[14:11] <Sarvatt> noooo I deleted my VM, I thought player didn't work with the gallium stuff!
[14:11] <tseliot> I'll simply revert my change and everything should be back to normal(ish)
[14:11] <tseliot> changes
[14:12] <Dr_Jakob> Sarvatt: :-/
[14:12] <Dr_Jakob> Sarvatt: so all I need to do is install the xorg edgers and it should work?
[14:12] <Sarvatt> depends, lucid or maverick host? :)
[14:12] <Sarvatt> actually that doesn't matter, its the guest i'm thinking of
[14:13] <Dr_Jakob> lucid guest.
[14:13] <Sarvatt> if its a lucid guest you need to update the kernel manually, its in the PPA though
[14:13] <Sarvatt> linux-image-2.6.35-7-generic at the moment
[14:14] <Dr_Jakob> ok whats that ppa called?
[14:14] <Sarvatt> and all the normal decrapification of vga16fb and stuff :)
[14:14] <Sarvatt> https://launchpad.net/~xorg-edgers/+archive/ppa
[14:14] <Dr_Jakob> kernel ppa?
[14:14] <Sarvatt> its in xorg-edgers I meant
[14:14] <Dr_Jakob> ah
[14:14] <Sarvatt> just have to manually update the kernel
[14:14] <Dr_Jakob> ah cool
[14:14] <Sarvatt> oh yeah you need to install libgl1-mesa-dri-gallium as well
[14:15] <Sarvatt> sorry if it all changes soon, I need to rebase all of my mesa packaging on what actually went into debian one of these days and its called libgl1-mesa-dri-experimental there
[14:15] <Dr_Jakob> heh
[14:16] <Sarvatt> i cant use the mesa 7.8 packaging from debian/ubuntu as a base because the egl/gles stuff changed so much in 7.9
[14:16] <Dr_Jakob> yeah sorry about that, it might change again.
[14:17] <Dr_Jakob> and there is no ABI rules between libEGL and the drivers so that might explode at anytime as well.
[14:17] <Dr_Jakob> But that probably isn't so much of a problem for you guyys.
[14:18] <Sarvatt> yeah it's only really shipped for headers and testing stuff anyway at the moment
[14:19] <Dr_Jakob> ok
[14:20] <Dr_Jakob> Sarvatt: do you know Andy from VMware?
[14:20] <Sarvatt> nope, sure don't
[14:20] <Dr_Jakob> Ok, nm then.
[14:25] <Sarvatt> jcristau: do you guys not see weird bugs where the breaks: oldabi on xserver-xorg-core forces drivers not in xserver-xorg-{video,input}-all to be installed on a dist-upgrade in debian?
[14:26] <Sarvatt> if i dont drop the breaks on the previous abi then xserver-xorg-core always gets held back and it installs stuff it shouldn't like nvidia and radeonhd here every time :(
[14:27]  * tseliot uploads radeon
[14:27] <jcristau> Sarvatt: what i've seen is dist-upgrade removing all of X
[14:28] <Sarvatt> yeah that happens too
[14:28] <Sarvatt> i think that was when i didnt have input and video all installed
[14:28] <jcristau> guess why i'm getting rid of the breaks entirely..
[14:29] <Sarvatt> i can't figure it out though, some voodoo in apt ordering
[14:30] <Sarvatt> right now on one box i have no packages providing video 6 installed, and i uploaded xserver with the breaks intact, the next dist-upgrade tried to install nvidia-current and radeonhd which had video-6 and that put xserver-xorg-core on hold
[14:32] <Sarvatt> and if i apt-get upgrade first which removes input/video-all the next dist-upgrade removes all of X
[14:32] <Sarvatt> i gave up trying to understand whats going on and just started dropping the breaks, driving me bonkers :)
[14:34] <jcristau> Sarvatt: see the 'Xorg dist upgrade troubles' thread i started on the debian-x and deity lists.  maybe you can follow up there.
[14:35] <Sarvatt> thanks tseliot!
[14:36] <tseliot> Sarvatt: thanks to you. Videos seem smoother now here :-)
[14:37] <Sarvatt> tseliot: did you see that fglrx 10.6 works with xserver 1.8?
[14:38] <tseliot> Sarvatt: yes, the latest fglrx should do that
[14:38] <Sarvatt> it just has a problem where BusID *has* to be specified in xorg.conf..
[14:38] <jcristau> ah i've seen something about that
[14:38] <Sarvatt> not sure if they fixed that or plan to fix that but it didn't sound hopeful when i was following it
[14:39] <jcristau> had to laugh.
[14:39] <tseliot> I wanted to wait for the new release and to apply some changes I've been working on, so as to allow delayed build of the kernel module (the module is built on next boot if the user wishes so)
[14:39] <Sarvatt> way to make it impossible to package ati! :)
[14:40] <tseliot> that BusID thing is weird. I doesn't sound new to me though
[14:40] <jcristau> before there was something about depth
[14:40] <Sarvatt> that's nvidia, ugh
[14:41] <tseliot> the defaultdepth problem should affect both fglrx and nvidia
[14:42] <tseliot> as they don't support 8 bits depth
[14:42] <tseliot> which is why we set that in xorg.conf through Jockey
[14:43] <jcristau> these things sound like they would be one liners to fix (not the 8bit thing).  good thing we don't have source.
[14:43] <Sarvatt> is it? i got nvidia auto loading without an xorg.conf fine outside of that depth being required, it wouldn't be that hard i dont think to make the autoconfig logic just add that section for those two drivers
[14:44] <bjsnider> jcristau, you do have the kernel module's source
[14:44] <scar_> thanks for the help earlier
[14:44] <jcristau> bjsnider: no i don't
[14:44] <bjsnider> just not the pre-built libs
[14:44] <Sarvatt> no we dont
[14:44] <tseliot> Sarvatt: yes, it should be easy to do that
[14:44] <jcristau> and the kernel module is irrelevant anyway
[14:45] <Sarvatt> they just have an open source shim interface to the actual kernel module blob
[14:45] <tseliot> that's the wrapper
[14:45] <jcristau> Sarvatt: adding hacks in autoconfig to work around trivial bugs in drivers considered harmful
[14:45] <jcristau> but maybe that's just me
[14:46] <tseliot> I think we all agree that certain things should be fixed in the driver
[14:47] <Sarvatt> will all be moot with 1.10 where there's hopefully video xorg.conf.d support :)
[14:47] <tseliot> however, if you want to get autoloading right with proprietary drivers, it's likely that hacks are needed
[14:48] <tseliot> yes, that would definitely help
[14:48] <jcristau> i guess that's why i couldn't care less about binary drivers
[14:48] <Sarvatt> well the BusID thing is nasty, jockey is going to need to grow some logic to determine that
[14:49] <Sarvatt> aticonfig --initial sets it up but it has to be run outside of X
[14:49] <tseliot> Sarvatt: do you have a bug report about that? I'd like to report it to AMD
[14:50] <Sarvatt> oh they know, its on the amd bug tracker
[14:50] <Sarvatt> will try to dig it up
[14:50] <jcristau> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=587708
[14:50] <ubot4> Debian bug 587708 in fglrx-driver "[fglrx-driver] Driver crash after upgrade from 10-5 to 10-6" [Important,Open]
[14:50] <Sarvatt> one of those 40+ page catalyst 10.6 threads on phoronix has bridgeman saying its intended that its required to run aticonfig after installing the driver always
[14:51] <jcristau> haha
[14:51] <Sarvatt> and we should be lucky it worked without it before :)
[14:51] <jcristau> way to go there.
[14:52] <tseliot> ouch
[14:52] <jcristau> or should i say way to make radeon more attractive by the minute
[14:53] <Sarvatt> http://ati.cchtml.com/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=busid
[14:53] <jcristau> the debian bug points at http://ati.cchtml.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1848
[14:53] <ubot4> ati.cchtml.com bug 1848 in X Server "Without BusID fglrx crashes" [Critical,New]
[14:55] <Sarvatt> oh yeah 10.6 is also broken with nforce chipsets
[14:56] <Sarvatt> darn i dont see the main busid one on that list, guess i have to dig through phoronix
[14:57] <Sarvatt> http://ati.cchtml.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1836
[14:57] <ubot4> ati.cchtml.com bug 1836 in X Server "xserver crash at startup with catalyst 10.6 on openSUSE 11.2/x86_64" [Critical,Resolved: fixed]
[14:57] <Sarvatt> well theres another but nothing really in it
[14:59] <tseliot> ok, I've sent them an email, hopefully we'll see what the current status is
[15:00] <jcristau> resolved as fixed, really?
[15:01] <Sarvatt> http://sarvatt.com/downloads/xserver.gdb.txt -- thats the backtrace I get without a BusID
[15:05] <Sarvatt> looked like something i could fix on the server side to work around it but then i sold that box and stopped caring :)
[15:19] <Sarvatt> bug status Opinion?
[15:22] <Sarvatt> whee, that bug status closes all of the synaptics bugs just about then :)
[15:28] <tseliot> Sarvatt: I'll take care of that fglrx bug. I'm not allowed to say more
[15:28] <Sarvatt> woohoo!
[15:33] <tseliot> :-)
[15:39] <warewolf> haah not allowed to say more
[17:29] <bryceh> :-)
[17:30] <bryceh> Sarvatt, yeah I think there's quite a few bugs in xserver that could be closed with that
[17:31] <bryceh> Sarvatt, the status is experimental and might go away in a few months if they find it doesn't do the job it's intended for
[17:36] <Sarvatt> bryceh: remember the monster intel bug that led us to turn off automatic reporting? :)
[17:36] <bryceh> heh
[17:36] <Sarvatt> guess whats back because its not upstream and the patch was dropped?
[17:36] <bryceh> oh no
[17:37] <Sarvatt> ya upstreamed one that had an exact same hang dump as the monster one did :D
[17:37] <Sarvatt> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/603064
[17:37] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 603064 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "[i965gm] GPU lockup 77c6dfe5 (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Triaged]
[17:38] <Sarvatt> i'm guessing g-p-m put his monitor to sleep while watching a movie in totem like what was happening before
[17:39] <bryceh> mm, yeah good theory
[17:40] <bryceh> oh hey btw Sarvatt, I got my upstreamer tool posted publically
[17:40] <Sarvatt> upstreamer tool?
[17:40] <Sarvatt> ooo!
[17:40] <bryceh> Sarvatt, http://bryceharrington.org/cgi-bin/send_upstream.cgi
[17:41] <bryceh> that's the tool I've been using all along to help me upstream bug reports, it's pretty handy.  I've made it so it doesn't require my creds to run, so anyone can use it now
[17:41] <Sarvatt> do you get to preview before it works its magic?
[17:42] <bryceh> Sarvatt, I'd appreciate it if you would give it a test on one or two X bugs today or early next week; I'm hoping to get it more public once I've had a few people kick the tires with it
[17:42] <bryceh> yep, it populates the bugzilla page so you can see what it'll do before committing anything
[17:42] <Sarvatt> sure thing! cautious about doing it because i dont know what it does :)
[17:42] <Sarvatt> ahh ok, nice
[17:42]  * bryceh nods
[17:43] <bryceh> I'm interested to hear of any parts of it that cause fright, so I can de-fright them :-)
[17:43] <bryceh> if you like it a lot, I also have a greasemonkey script which will automatically insert a link into bug pages, so it's really easy to launch into
[17:47] <Sarvatt> bookmarked it and will give it a shot as soon as I get back, gotta run and powerwash a deck now though
[17:48]  * bryceh waves
[20:12] <jbarnes> superm1: ping
[20:12] <superm1> jbarnes, pong
[20:32] <Sarvatt> scared him away? :)
[20:33] <Sarvatt> i guess intel-gpu-tools is a good candidate for a get-orig-source rule making a git checkout since its never going to have releases
[20:33] <bryceh> drive-by jbarnesing
[20:33] <bryceh> jbarnestorming
[20:34] <bryceh> Sarvatt, never going to have releases?
[20:34] <bryceh> that sounds dire
[20:34] <Sarvatt> well they add new stuff to it all the time and anholt said he had no plans to release :)
[20:35] <bryceh> O_o
[20:35] <jcristau> Sarvatt: well you could bump it and call that a release
[20:44] <Sarvatt> git clone git://anongit.freedesktop.org/xorg/app/intel-gpu-tools && \
[20:44] <Sarvatt> 	cd intel-gpu-tools && autoreconf -v --install && \
[20:44] <Sarvatt> 	REVISION=$(git show --pretty=format:"%h" HEAD | head -n1) && cd .. && \
[20:44] <Sarvatt> 	PREFIX=intel-gpu-tools_1.0.2+git$(date +%Y%m%d)+$REVISION && \
[20:44] <Sarvatt> 	tar --exclude=.git --exclude=autom4te.cache -cf - intel-gpu-tools | gzip -9 >$PREFIX.orig.tar.gz && \
[20:44] <Sarvatt> 	rm -rf intel-gpu-tools
[20:44] <Sarvatt> ^ that works for now for ppa updates at any rate
[20:46] <Sarvatt> had to do the same thing for rendercheck packaging since that never has releases either


[00:06] <mrooney> lifeless: oh okay, I can't get a diff to generate but, I'll try to find one, I know there is a youtube video I think
[00:06] <mrooney> maybe I need to copy it to an orig.tar.gz first
[03:05] <stochastic> Does anyone have a free minute to REVU either http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid or http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax or http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo
[03:16] <stochastic> oh and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2
[04:22] <kamalnandan> Hi Guys...
[04:25] <kamalnandan> I am learning basic ubuntu packaging and also went thru the basic guide..but this guide makes me download some already existing "tar.gz" using "apt-get source"...and doing this creates some dsc file as well..
[04:25] <kamalnandan> I was able to create a basic pkg using that..
[04:27] <kamalnandan> but I want to do packaging from scratch..say, I have my own "hello world" program, in a file called "hello.cpp", and a makefile that compiles that..
[04:27] <kamalnandan> so how should I go about it?
[04:29] <kamalnandan> BTW...Gurus..I followed the example given on this page..:"https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Basic"
[04:41] <kamalnandan> no response guys??
[04:43] <kklimonda> kamalnandan: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Packaging%20from%20Scratch
[04:48] <kamalnandan> kklimonda: thanks for reply..i have gone through this guide...but let me go thru this once again..probably I have missed something..
[05:30] <kamalnandan> a bit off topic..but...whats the difference between a configure.in file and configure.ac file?
[05:35] <kamalnandan> ok..found it, configure.ac is the new name for configure.in
[06:24] <kamalnandan> am writing a configure.in script for the first time for a helloworld program..
[06:25] <kamalnandan> i.e. hello.c
[06:25] <kamalnandan> when i do "autoconf" i get the following error:
[06:26] <kamalnandan> configure.in:2: error: possibly undefined macro: AM_INIT_AUTOMAKE
[06:26] <kamalnandan> what does it mean?
[06:27] <kamalnandan> or is there some other channel where i nust put this question?
[06:29] <jmarsden> kamalnandan: This is a build system question not a packaging question.  See http://mij.oltrelinux.com/devel/autoconf-automake/ for one tutorial, and http://sources.redhat.com/autobook/autobook/autobook_toc.html for a book all about these tools.
[06:30] <jmarsden> Your error probably means you forgot to put an AC_INIT macro invocation near the start of the file ?
[06:32] <kamalnandan> jmarsden: sorry to put this question here..but I have to do packaging..and got to know that it will require configure script too...so learning to write configure script..and thats why this question..
[06:32] <kamalnandan> BTW, I have put AC_INIT macro at the start..
[06:32] <jmarsden> kamalnandan: No, packaging does not require a configu8re script, just some way to build the software.
[06:33] <jmarsden> Any way the original software author chooses that works is fine.
[06:35] <kamalnandan> infact i was going thru the following steps where it mentions that we must have a configure script too..
[06:35] <kamalnandan> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=51003
[06:35] <kamalnandan> though i agree..even a makefile would do..since configure script is just used to generate a makefile..
[06:39] <kamalnandan> however, i believe i must not get distracted and try to learn too many things at a time.:-)..so now I am not going to get into configure script writing and concentrate on packaging only...:-)..its more important to complete the given task at hand..infact, they are already using some cmake utility and have written a file that for cmake that probably works similar to configure..
[06:39] <jmarsden> The forum post you linked to is not at official guide, it just uses an example project that has a configure file.  I do not see it saying "you must have a configure script" anywhere in that forum thread.  You will be better off using the official documentation instead.
[06:39] <jmarsden> Yes, cmake should work fine.
[06:40] <jmarsden> Use whatever the software developers use when they build the software.
[06:40] <kamalnandan> ok..thanks jmarsden..infact, i got distracated and started getting into configure which I was not required to..:-)..
[06:41] <kamalnandan> thanks for your help ..
[06:41] <jmarsden> No problem.
[07:41] <ppzico> Hi, I have a question about packaging. I have a single project having 2 different executables. Another is made with C and the other with Python. Those executables communicate through TCP/IP on localhost.
[07:41] <ppzico> How should I package them?
[07:41] <ppzico> Maybe as multi binary or should I consider having those executables different projects?
[07:42] <ppzico> Just want to know which is the best approach and giving the least hairloss for me..
[07:45] <hyperair> ppzico: you should only split a package if there is something that's very large if unsplit -- i.e. dependency chain, or package size.
[07:45] <hyperair> ppzico: otherwise, don't split it
[07:47] <kamalnandan> if I dont have to use a configure script in my package and have to simply use a makefile what should i remove from the rules file?
[07:48] <kamalnandan> here is the link to the rules script that I am using..
[07:48] <kamalnandan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/243401/
[07:49] <ppzico> hyperair: Do you mean now splitting the project or the binary?
[07:50] <hyperair> binary.
[07:51] <ppzico> hmm, then I might need help how to package a project with both C and Python, since I have found it complicated
[07:51] <ppzico> Could try to think a bit more myself first though, if that is the right approach
[07:53] <ppzico> Is the dh_make still usable for this or should I do packaging the hard way without any autotools?
[08:11] <hyperair> ?
[08:12] <hyperair> dh_make is usable for all cases
[08:12] <hyperair> you just have to customize the debian/* files
[08:12] <hyperair> and remove some template files
[08:15] <ppzico> alright, thanks :) That's good to know that I don't go soloing with some worse techniques
[09:30] <maxb> Do we have a canned reply for "We usually only update packages in the development release. SRUs and backports blah blah blah.... " ?
[09:31] <mrooney> I thought so, did you look in stock responses?
[09:34] <maxb> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses ?   I don't see anything quite applicable.
[09:40] <mrooney> maxb: hm maybe not, I'd certainly link to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates though
[14:35] <kamalnandan> why is it so that when i build a package using "debuild -us -uc", the binary also gets installed?
[14:35] <kamalnandan> i dont want to get it installed, i just want to create the package i.e. .deb file
[14:35] <kamalnandan> i want to get it installed only when i do "dpkg -i <package i.e. .deb file>"
[14:36] <kamalnandan> experts, any idea?
[14:41] <Hobbsee> er, the binary shouldn't be getting installed?
[14:41] <Hobbsee> are you running a hook or something?
[14:53] <kamalnandan> while doing "debuild -us -uc", i just want the *.deb file to be created and not to be installed..
[14:53] <kamalnandan> it must be installed only when i do "dpkg -i <*.deb>"
[14:53] <kamalnandan> folks..any idea about this?
[14:57] <iulian> kamalnandan: Hobbsee already answered.
[14:57] <iulian> 1441.37 <@Hobbsee> er, the binary shouldn't be getting installed?
[14:57] <iulian> 1441.42 <@Hobbsee> are you running a hook or something?
[15:00] <Abd4llA> hi there, any idea what's the difference between /lib/libc.so and /lib/tls/i686/cmov/libc.so ?
[15:02] <kamalnandan> iulian: infact, I had got disconnected for a while..perhaps Hobbsee answered within that time..sorry..
[15:03] <kamalnandan> thanks @Hobbsee for your reply...:-)
[15:03] <Hobbsee> kamalnandan: long ping timeout, with 4 mins ;)
[15:03] <Hobbsee> and you're welcome
[15:03] <kamalnandan> can you plz reply once again..
[15:04] <kamalnandan> yes..thare was some problem...
[15:04] <kamalnandan> because of which network got disconnected..
[15:08] <kamalnandan> @Hobbsee, can you plz copy and paste your last answer...thanks..and also sorry, if i am getting impatient...:)
[15:09] <Hobbsee> kamalnandan: it's what iulian pasted?
[15:10] <kamalnandan> oh..sorry..i thought it was for someone else..
[15:10] <maxb> kamalnandan: debuild does _not_ install what it builds. You *must* have something additional on your system which is doing it
[15:10] <kamalnandan> well..but the binary is getting installed..what could be the problem..
[15:11] <Hobbsee> pebkac, most likely.
[15:11] <Hobbsee> of one form or another
[15:11] <kamalnandan> i have "install" target in my makefile..
[15:11] <kamalnandan> would that be doing this..
[15:11] <kamalnandan> and moreover the deb file doesnt contain the binary..
[15:16] <kamalnandan> I have pasted the contents of my rules script here..
[15:16] <kamalnandan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/243950/
[15:16] <kamalnandan> and this is the makefile
[15:17] <kamalnandan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/243951/
[15:18] <kamalnandan> it would be great, if someone takes a look...thanks..:-)
[15:21] <kamalnandan> i also tried removing the "install" target from my makefile...but in that case "debuild -us -uc" fails..
[15:22] <kamalnandan> however, here is the output of "debuild -us -uc", after removing "install" target from my makefile..
[15:28] <kamalnandan> no response guys???
[15:28] <debfx> is revu only for universe packages (but not multiverse)?
[15:28] <pochu> debfx: multiverse is fine too AFAIK
[15:32] <debfx> pochu: ah ok, the wiki only mentions universe
[15:34] <maxb> 'main' and 'universe' are sometimes meant in ways which include their less-free counterparts - e.g. there's no separate sponsors teams for restricted and multiverse
[15:35] <maxb> kamalnandan: erm...
[15:35] <maxb> install:
[15:35] <maxb> 	cp ${TARGET} /usr/local/bin/
[15:35] <maxb> The problem should be obvious
[15:36] <kamalnandan> maxb: thanks for your response...:-)..
[15:37] <kamalnandan> but when i remove the install targe, i get this error
[15:37] <kamalnandan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/243958/
[15:38] <kamalnandan> moreover, even if install target is there in the makefile, one doesnt expect the binary to be installed while building..
[15:38] <kamalnandan> it must be installed only when one installs it using something like "dpkg -i <*.deb>"
[15:39] <kamalnandan> maxb: am i right?
[15:39] <maxb> One expects commands to do what you tell them to do. You told cp to put the binary in /usr/local/bin/, so that's what it did
[15:40] <maxb> You really shouldn't run builds as root, by the way, for exactly this sort of reason
[15:41] <kamalnandan> but, the install target has to be executed while installing the package..isnt it? and not when I am building the package..
[15:41] <kamalnandan> maxb: sorry..I am new to packaging..
[15:42] <maxb> kamalnandan: Your rules file includes the DESTDIR variable in the "make install" command. This is not a feature of make, it is a convention for how people write makefiles. Your install target does not pay attention to the DESTDIR variable.
[15:45] <mzz> how do I get sbuild to produce a .ddeb file (or at least I think that'd be preferable for debugging this)? Alternatively: how do I get it to not strip binaries?
[15:46] <kamalnandan> maxb: thanks..perhaps I am getting it now..let me try fixing that..
[15:46] <kamalnandan> maxb: BTW, why doesnt the deb file contain the binary?
[15:47] <maxb> Because your install target malfunctioned and put it into the system root, rather than the package staging directory
[15:48] <kamalnandan> oh..ok..so install target should be copying the binary in the $DESTDIR directory...am i right?
[15:49] <kamalnandan> sorry..am a novice in packaging..thats why asking so many questions..
[15:58] <kamalnandan> maxb: now i can see that the binary gets included in the .deb file..thanks for you help..
[15:58] <kamalnandan> and when I do dpkg -i <deb file>..then it gets installed too..
[15:59] <kamalnandan> but I am wondering where the binary got installed..i mean in which directory..
[16:01] <kamalnandan> ok..it got installed in the "/" folder..which i think is not a good idea..i will need to install somewhwere else..
[16:01] <kamalnandan> but getting it now..
[16:05] <kamalnandan> what is the best location to install a binary? /usr/local/bin or /usr/bin?
[16:06] <geser> for a package: /usr/bin, /usr/local is out of package space, it's for local installations
[16:07] <kamalnandan> geser: thanks for response...:-)..
[16:07] <kamalnandan> so, i need to create this dir /usr/bin inside debain folder ...right(when I am making a package)??
[16:16] <geser> yes
[16:18] <StevenK> kamalnandan: man dh_installdirs
[16:26] <kamalnandan> geser: thanks
[16:27] <kamalnandan> StevenK: OK..let me have a look in the man page..
[18:30] <douwei> I am having trouble with compiz and the animation add-ins....it is installed and I can go to preferences and they look to be checked but they are not working
[18:31] <douwei> anyone there?
[18:31] <iulian> douwei: Please join #ubuntu for support.
[18:32] <douwei> oops sorry
[18:35] <ximion> Could someone recheck the http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/libqtintf4 package? I think it's fine now. I added the missing README file also. (With instructions to change the version in rules for on new upstream versions)
[19:04] <alefteris> how can i use the config file with pbuilder, i tryed with no luck: sudo pbuilder build ./opensc_0.11.4-5ubuntu1.dsc --configfile /home/thanos/dev/packaging/pbuilderrc-jaunty
[19:09] <jbernard__> what is the best way to handle package versioning when upstream employs a "-r3", "-r4", "-r5" scheme?
[19:16] <alefteris> nevermind
[19:19] <ximion> jbernard: I would suggest appname-<IP_ADDRESS>r3
[19:20] <ximion> simply add the letter and the number without -
[19:20] <jbernard__> what if there is no digit before the 'r'?
[19:20] <ximion> but maybe there exists a fixed naming-standard?
[19:20] <jbernard__> upstream is releasing <package-name>-r5, for in instance
[19:21] <ximion> jbernard: What is the exact version of the application?
[19:21] <jbernard__> "r5" ;)
[19:21] <jbernard__> i would assume
[19:21] <ximion> only this?
[19:21] <jbernard__> the previous release was "r4"
[19:21] <jbernard__> yep
[19:21] <jbernard__> kinda weird
[19:22] <ximion> what is the name of the application?
[19:22] <jbernard__> lua-iconv
[19:22] <ximion> (I've never seen this strange release naming!)
[19:22] <jbernard__> http://luaforge.net/projects/lua-iconv/
[19:22] <jbernard__> i haven't either
[19:23] <jbernard__> dh-make gets really upset
[19:23] <jbernard__> and i would assume other tools will have issues as well
[19:25] <ximion> They named it 0.r5
[19:25] <jbernard__> where did you get the '0' from?
[19:25] <jbernard__> they only did the '0' for "r3", from what i can tell
[19:25] <ximion> The project provides DEB packages.
[19:26] <ximion> The version of those packages is 0.r5 ;-)
[19:26] <jbernard__> I see no '0' for the r5 release
[19:27] <jbernard__> they distributed a deb for "r3", but it needs work
[19:28] <ximion> okay, they named it 0.r3, so you can name your package version 0.r5, I think this is o.k.
[19:31] <jbernard__> cool, thanks
[20:21] <mrooney> if I am working on a manpage, what is the easiest way to preview it?
[20:23] <nellery> mrooney: man ./<manpage>
[20:24] <mrooney> nellery: haha wow, how silly of me, thanks!
[20:24] <nellery> mrooney: no problem
[20:24] <mrooney> maybe that is too simple for the internet to solve, all I could find was creating a postscript file from it :)


[00:19] <renebarbosa> hello folks
[00:22] <renebarbosa> somebody here can help me with the membership meeting?
[00:26] <sarnold> renebarbosa: was that 2.5 hours ago?
[00:26] <renebarbosa> yep :(
[00:27] <sarnold> renebarbosa: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2014/ubuntu-meeting.2014-08-07-22.00.moin.txt
[00:27] <renebarbosa> had issues with my car
[00:27] <renebarbosa> i saw that log
[00:27] <sarnold> did you see the chat after the meeting?
[00:27] <renebarbosa> yep
[00:27] <sarnold> okay good good :)
[00:27] <renebarbosa> the votting will be done by e-mail
[00:28] <renebarbosa> my doubt is
[00:28] <renebarbosa> can I participate?
[00:29] <sarnold> I can't speak for them but if you were on today's agenda, probably missing a meeting that didn't happen is no big ding :)
[00:29] <renebarbosa> hmm
[00:30] <renebarbosa> Who I Can talk to?
[00:34] <pleia2> renebarbosa: you can email<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[00:34] <renebarbosa> thank you pleia2, I'll do it
[00:34] <renebarbosa> =)
[00:35] <pleia2> you're welcome :)
[00:38] <renebarbosa> =D
[00:44] <renebarbosa> pleia2, i did it. My message is awaiting moderator approval
[00:44] <renebarbosa> are you a moderator? =)
[00:44] <pleia2> renebarbosa: I'm not, but someone will let it through, no worries
[00:45] <renebarbosa> okay
[00:45] <renebarbosa> thank you again
[00:46] <renebarbosa> you saved my night :P
[00:46] <pleia2> happy to help
[01:40] <hggdh> renebarbosa: just approved your email
[01:40] <renebarbosa> hggdh, thanks


[01:28] <callmepk> morning
[01:42] <jamesh> morning callmepk
[01:47] <pieq> Morning everyone!
[01:47] <pieq> jamesh, are you the jamesh quoted in this Raspberry Pi post? https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=274595
[01:48] <pieq> duflu, hey, I've seen your name in https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/-/issues/363
[01:48]  * jamesh looks
[01:49] <duflu> pieq, yeah I wrote a fix and it was closed because other people already had... and then nobody's fix landed :/
[01:49] <pieq> duflu, do you know what's the status for this? It's really super annoying. I have a 4k screen, I created 2 desktop files to run Firefox with different profiles, but when I search "Firefox", I get "Firefo… Firefo…"
[01:49] <pieq> FFS!
[01:49] <jamesh> pieq: no.
[01:49] <pieq> jamesh, OK :) When I saw "JAMESH", it rang a bell :)
[01:50] <duflu> pieq, please subscribe to bug 968213 for that
[01:50] <duflu> Yeah 6 digits
[01:50] <pieq> duflu, thanks
[01:50] <pieq> damn...
[01:50] <duflu> Also good morning callmepk, jamesh, pieq
[01:50] <pieq> I remember reading somewhere (probably OMG!Ubuntu) that this issue would finally be fixed with 3.36.... and... nope.
[01:50] <pieq> duflu, g'day!
[01:51] <duflu> Yeah people really dropped the ball. I keep meaning to remind them but then more important issues come up instead
[01:52] <jamesh> pieq: that appears to be someone else with the title "Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd."
[01:54] <pieq> duflu, I recently got a 4k screen, and I ran into a lot of small yet annoying problems
[01:54] <pieq> "First World problems", I guess, but still, it's annoying.
[01:57] <sarnold> pieq: after many months of squinting at terribly tiny things in firefox for months, I recently found that there's a setting in the View | Zoom menu for "zoom text only", and things are WAY BETTER after I unchecked that
[01:57] <sarnold> pieq: hit alt v, z, then there it is for you to toggle :)
[01:57] <pieq> sarnold, I just set the default zoom to 133% in the preferences
[01:58] <sarnold> opoh there's a default zoom?
[01:58] <pieq> sarnold, cause I was finding myself Ctrl+Scroll Up all the time
[01:58] <pieq> even on 1080p screen
[01:58] <pieq> sarnold, yes, found that out after I got my 4k screen :D
[01:58] <sarnold> pieq: <3 thanks :D
[01:59] <pieq> I had the hope that fractional scaling would work well on Wayland, but it doesn't work well (at least with amdgpu). Yet 200% is really too big
[02:00] <duflu> pieq, try Gnome Tweaks > Fonts > Scaling Factor
[02:00] <pieq> so I settled with 100%, then tweaking GNOME (using a big cursor from the Accessibility options, then pushing Font Scale Factor to 1.4 in GNOME Tweaks)
[02:00] <pieq> duflu, hehe :)
[02:00] <pieq> Yes, it works well, but it's not ideal
[02:00] <duflu> pieq, I'm going to jump in the deep end and try to switch to 4K this year
[02:01] <duflu> Hopefully that will motivate me to fix things quickly
[02:02] <pieq> duflu, haha, that's the thing: we should offer the HW that we have issues with to Ubuntu developers in the hope that these problem annoy them enough to get them to be fixed :D
[02:02] <callmepk> hi duflu jamesh pieq
[02:03] <pieq> hi callmepk !
[02:03] <pieq> 早安！ :)
[02:06] <callmepk> pieq 早晨！；）
[02:09] <pieq> callmepk, ha! 我不會寫香港的繁體中文！ :D
[02:13] <callmepk> pieq Actually Hong Kong have two sets of writing system: Written Cantonese and Written Chinese so actually it's the same ;)
[02:18] <pieq> callmepk, you mean Cantonese Vs. Mandarin? When I go to HK, I can recognize if something is written in Cantonese cause I don't understand anything :D
[02:18] <pieq> (whereas in Mandarin I still don't understand much, but more than written Cantonese :D)
[02:24] <callmepk> pieq No, hong kong also use Traditional Chinese, but there is two written form: one is Madarin that is the official one and nearly same as Taiwan; the other is Cantonese: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Written_Cantonese Wiki for reference
[02:26] <pieq> callmepk, oh, thanks, I wasn't aware about this!
[02:29] <callmepk> you are welcome
[04:38] <jibel> morning world
[05:04] <duflu> Hi jibel
[05:05] <jibel> Hello duflu
[06:06] <callmepk> hi jibel
[06:14] <didrocks> good morning
[06:16] <seb128> goood morning desktopers
[06:16] <callmepk> good morning didrocks seb128
[06:16] <seb128> hey callmepk, how are you?
[06:17] <callmepk> I am good, and you seb128 ?
[06:17] <seb128> I'm a bit tired today but fine otherwise, coffee should help there :)
[06:20] <didrocks> salut seb128, bon retour :)
[06:20] <didrocks> hey callmepk
[06:21] <seb128> lut didrocks, merci!
[06:23] <seb128> Trevinho, jamesh, kenvandine, marcustomlinson, jibel, robert_ancell, weekly summary reminder
[06:26] <jibel> salut seb128
[06:30] <duflu> Hi didrocks and seb128
[06:31] <didrocks> hey duflu
[06:55] <marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
[07:18] <oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
[07:18] <didrocks> hey oSoMoN
[07:18] <oSoMoN> salut didrocks
[07:31] <duflu> Hi marcustomlinson and oSoMoN
[07:44] <oSoMoN> hey duflu
[07:45] <oSoMoN> morning marcustomlinson
[07:46] <marcustomlinson> hey oSoMoN
[08:02] <Laney> sup
[08:24] <duflu> Hi Laney
[08:28] <didrocks> hey hey Laney
[08:29] <marcustomlinson> hey hey hey Laney
[08:30] <Laney> |o/ duflu didrocks marcustomlinson
[08:30] <Laney> that's me waving distantly
[08:30] <duflu>    \o\
[08:31] <duflu>    /🙃/
[08:33] <oSoMoN> hey Laney
[08:37] <Laney> 👋 oSoMoN
[08:40] <ricotz> hello desktopers!
[08:47] <duflu> Hi ricotz
[09:00] <Laney> 👏 ricotz
[09:38] <oSoMoN> hey ricotz
[09:52] <ricotz> hey duflu Laney oSoMoN
[09:53] <ricotz> oSoMoN, hi, in case you have some changes for firefox to merge back, please do so
[11:06] <oSoMoN> ricotz, done (the only branch that had relevant changes was the groovy one)
[11:07] <ricotz> oSoMoN, why doesn't this apply to the other series?
[11:07] <oSoMoN> ricotz, because it's python3-specific
[11:08] <ricotz> I am not a fan of diverging the branches if it can be avoided
[11:08] <oSoMoN> I mean, I suppose applying it to the other series wouldn't hurt, I haven't tested tbh
[11:08] <oSoMoN> and I've been using the script in the groovy branch to create tarballs lately
[11:09] <oSoMoN> ricotz, you're right, I'll test that the change doesn't have unexpected side effects with python2, and if it doesn't I'll apply it to the other series
[11:09] <ricotz> I see, you were claiming it being a regression in the changelog, so this really should apply everywhere
[11:10] <ricotz> I have ran it in groovy-only too :(
[11:13] <ricotz> oSoMoN, jfyi, there will be fun with s390x and icu again
[11:13] <oSoMoN> :/
[11:14] <ricotz> do you know anyone running the current build on s390x?
[11:14] <ricotz> afaict it is likely to be broken anyway
[11:15] <ricotz> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1264836
[11:25] <oSoMoN> ricotz, s390x has been broken for as long as I can remember anyway, it's building but not actually starting
[11:26] <ricotz> correct
[11:40] <xnox> ricotz:  oSoMoN: i can help provide the big endian datafiles, which firefox then can just commit
[11:41] <xnox> ricotz:  oSoMoN: or they should stop building external data files, and just compile them into the shared library. That way they just dlopen built-in libicudata without external dat file, and it will always be in the correct indianness
[11:41] <xnox> ricotz:  oSoMoN: it's not like it is common to ship firefox builds for more than one architecture and share the file on end-users disk.
[11:50] <oSoMoN> xnox, I'm not familiar with that bug , but I see that there's a reference to an ICU bug: "Not enough.  We don't put big endian's dat file into our tree because it is no way to create it on little endian environment.  If http://bugs.icu-project.org/trac/ticket/11046 is fixed, we can generate it and include it."
[11:50] <oSoMoN> unfortunately that link is dead, so I don't know whether that ICU bug was fixed
[11:54] <xnox> https://unicode-org.atlassian.net/browse/ICU-11046
[11:54] <xnox> i think is the new thing
[11:54] <xnox> or not
[13:26] <hellsworth> good morning desktopers
[13:27] <oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
[13:28] <hellsworth> hi oSoMoN
[13:31] <Wimpress> Good afternoon desktoppers o/
[13:31] <seb128> hey :)
[13:31] <kenvandine> hey
[13:31] <Wimpress> Shall I run this one or does kenvandine want to? :-)
[13:32]  * Wimpress emerges from all things Ubuntu Core and appliances
[13:32] <didrocks> hey Wimpress
[13:32] <kenvandine> Wimpress: you can have a turn :)
[13:32] <Wimpress> OK
[13:32] <oSoMoN> hey Wimpress
[13:32] <Wimpress> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-02
[13:32] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jun  2 13:32:43 2020 UTC.  The chair is Wimpress. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[13:32] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[13:32] <Wimpress> Roll call:  didrocks, duflu, hellsworth, jamesh, jibel, kenvandine, Laney, marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, seb128 , tkamppeter, Trevinho, robert_ancell, callmepk
[13:33] <hellsworth> o/
[13:33] <kenvandine> o/
[13:33] <Trevinho> o/
[13:33] <oSoMoN> o/
[13:33] <marcustomlinson> o/
[13:33] <seb128> o/
[13:34] <Wimpress> Hi all o/
[13:34] <Wimpress> We'll cover LTS' first.
[13:34] <Wimpress> #topic rls-ff-bugs
[13:34] <Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-incoming-bug-tasks.html
[13:35] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1881364
[13:35] <seb128> it's a KDE issue with manually installed packages, I don't think our team should consider that as a rls target
[13:35] <seb128> I vote -1
[13:36] <Wimpress> Yeah, Lubuntu.
[13:36] <hellsworth> i agree too. it's only Lubuntu
[13:36] <hellsworth> should i not but Lubuntu/Kubuntu/etc in incoming tags?
[13:36] <hellsworth> i wasn't sure so i did it anyways
[13:36] <Wimpress> I've dropped RLS
[13:37] <Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/1869747
[13:37] <seb128> depending if you consider there is a reason our team should be concerned by the issue
[13:37] <seb128> we can always discuss it
[13:37] <hellsworth> hmm ok seb128 thanks
[13:38] <seb128> Wimpress, that one is incomplete, I would just wontfix for now unless it proove to be a real issue and got the informations requested
[13:38] <Wimpress> Yep.
[13:39] <Wimpress> Done.
[13:39] <Wimpress> And updated.
[13:39] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1872527
[13:40] <seb128> incomplete as well and I think the server team is on it
[13:40] <Wimpress> We see this because we seed the spice agent in the desktop image, right?
[13:40] <didrocks> yes
[13:40] <Laney> phew
[13:41] <Wimpress> Yep, I'll just leave that one for now.
[13:41] <Trevinho> so it seems, I wouldn't shocked if mutter has something to do either too
[13:41] <Trevinho> but let's wait
[13:42] <Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-tracking-bug-tasks.html
[13:42] <seb128> that was reported before .2 landed which fixes some clipboard issues I think?
[13:42] <seb128> would be worth testing with the current versions
[13:42] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1864307
[13:43] <seb128> one for kenvandine
[13:43] <Wimpress> kenvandine: You seem to be on that.
[13:44] <kenvandine> yup
[13:44] <Wimpress> I've assigned you to the gnome-software entries.
[13:44] <Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/mutter/+bug/1877075
[13:44] <Wimpress> Daniel seem to be on that.
[13:44] <seb128> right
[13:45] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1876065
[13:46] <Wimpress> Fix is in proposed.
[13:46] <seb128> right
[13:46] <Wimpress> Should we assign this to Kai
[13:46] <Wimpress> For focal.
[13:46] <seb128> sure
[13:46] <seb128> I usually don't bother reviewing the "fix commited' ones
[13:46] <seb128> in the meeting I mean
[13:47] <seb128> s/I/we
[13:47] <Wimpress> OK
[13:47] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1874091
[13:48] <seb128> the focal line should probably be assigned to Alberto and that's it from our side
[13:48] <Wimpress> Should that be owned by FOundations?
[13:48] <Wimpress> Done.
[13:48] <seb128> we own ubuntu-drivers-common
[13:49] <seb128> so that's for us to triage
[13:49] <seb128> the u-r-u part is for foundations
[13:49] <Wimpress> Yep
[13:49] <Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-440/+bug/1881137
[13:50] <Wimpress> Looks like we need to assign someone for common-drivers in the above?
[13:50] <seb128> tseliot I guess?
[13:50] <seb128> alo why is that component line washed out?
[13:51] <Wimpress> Because "undedcided"?
[13:51] <oSoMoN> Alberto marked the bug as not affecting ubuntu-drivers-common today
[13:51] <Laney> I think that means it got deleted
[13:51] <Wimpress> Yep, just saw that.
[13:52] <oSoMoN> s/today/yesterday/
[13:52] <oSoMoN> (I seem to be living in the past)
[13:52] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1879475
[13:52] <seb128> I'm dealing with that one
[13:52] <Wimpress> OK
[13:52] <Wimpress> Just saw.
[13:53] <seb128> it's a SRU that was in the queue and got reviewed while I was off
[13:53] <seb128> I need to sort it out, it's on my todo for today
[13:53] <Wimpress> OK.
[13:53] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1875665
[13:53] <seb128> that's being fixed in the kernel side
[13:53] <Wimpress> Looks like Seth is on that.
[13:53] <seb128> the rtkit line can probably be deleted
[13:54] <seb128> or marked invalid
[13:55] <Wimpress> Everything else that is Unassigned appears to be Fix commited for focal.
[13:55] <seb128> great :)
[13:55] <Wimpress> #topic rls-bb-bugs
[13:55] <Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
[13:55] <Wimpress> All clear.
[13:56] <Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
[13:56] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1880832
[13:56] <Wimpress> That looks like one for Patrick.
[13:56] <seb128> +1
[13:57] <Wimpress> Done
[13:57] <Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/1881094
[13:58] <Wimpress> paulseaudio is now marked invalid.
[13:59] <Wimpress> I think that concludes Bionic.
[13:59] <Wimpress> #topic rls-gg-bugs
[13:59] <Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-gg-incoming-bug-tasks.html
[13:59] <Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1881699
[14:01] <Wimpress> Look fresh an jibel is triaging.
[14:01] <seb128> only one report, pulseaudio didn't change since focal
[14:01] <seb128> I would notfixing it at this point
[14:01] <Wimpress> Look like it is more kernel related.
[14:02] <kenvandine> probably
[14:02] <Wimpress> sound open firmware
[14:02] <Wimpress> I'll leave it for now.
[14:02] <Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-gg-tracking-bug-tasks.html
[14:03] <Wimpress> Only 1 and it is fix committed.
[14:03] <Wimpress> seb128: Do you want to review EE?
[14:04] <seb128> no
[14:04] <seb128> we stopped doing that a while ago
[14:04] <Wimpress> Good.
[14:04] <Wimpress> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
[14:04] <Wimpress> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
[14:05] <Wimpress> glib2 lolz
[14:05] <seb128> well, it's mostly waiting for results
[14:05] <seb128> I can handle that section
[14:05] <Wimpress> Yep.
[14:05] <Laney> big ol queue at the minute
[14:05] <Laney> one of the cloud regions is fubared
[14:05] <Wimpress> Ah.
[14:06] <seb128> pulseaudio started failing a test on risc64, including on focal which blocks the oem SRU, great :/
[14:06] <Wimpress> Is there anything meaningful in that list right now?
[14:06] <seb128> ideally it would need debugging
[14:06] <seb128> n-m/netplan/arm64 seems real and need debugging
[14:07] <seb128> Trevinho, could you look at the mutter build issue?
[14:07] <Trevinho> seb128: ok
[14:07] <seb128> thx
[14:07] <seb128> we will also probably need to investigate some of the xorg and glib reported regression
[14:08] <seb128> I will card things, please grab in the trello if you can
[14:08] <seb128> Wimpress, that should be it I think for today
[14:08] <Wimpress> Yep.
[14:08] <Trevinho> weird that mutter built properly in my schroot, while failed in various archs including amd65
[14:09] <Trevinho> 4*
[14:09] <Wimpress> #topic AOB
[14:09] <Wimpress> ANyone have anything else they want to discuss?
[14:09] <didrocks> nothing for me
[14:09] <Trevinho> As per gnome-shell .2. Yeah, unfortunately .2 is blocked, while .3 should have been out already (reason why I waite but actually florian is busy still. Not sure if to get the debian git snapshot to focal as well. Or wait some more days...
[14:10] <Wimpress> Trevinho: Is there a good reason to grab a snapshot now?
[14:10] <Trevinho> eh, there are already lots of nice fixes in .2 that we're still missing as it also included also (from my POV) minor regressions
[14:10] <Wimpress> Right.
[14:10] <seb128> Trevinho, wait for .3 if you think it's going to be out in the next week or so, otherwise snapshot I would say
[14:11] <Trevinho> so, we're getting a bit late, and not sure what upstream times are... as at my question there was no date answered
[14:11] <Wimpress> What would you like to do Trevinho?
[14:12] <Trevinho> I'd define a final date, if we've not a .3, we go with the snapshot
[14:12] <Trevinho> so like... maybe thu?
[14:13] <seb128> +1
[14:13] <Wimpress> If you have confidence in a snapshot release, I'm fine with it.
[14:13] <Trevinho> debian unstable has it for few days already FWIW, so.. some testers already
[14:13] <seb128> or cherry pick the regresion fix for the issue blocking .2?
[14:14] <Trevinho> seb128: I had that done, then I saw debian having a snapshot, while the .3 in theory would be coming Sat, so I said myself to wait
[14:14] <Trevinho> but...
[14:14] <seb128> nag floriqn and let(
[14:15] <seb128> nag florian and let's discuss again on,thursday
[14:15] <Wimpress> +1
[14:15] <Wimpress> Anyone else have anything to discuss?
[14:16] <seb128> no
[14:16] <Wimpress> Looks like a no :-)
[14:16] <Wimpress> OK, thanks everyone.
[14:16] <seb128> thanks!
[14:16] <hellsworth> thanks
[14:16] <Wimpress> #endmeeting
[14:16] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jun  2 14:16:53 2020 UTC.
[14:16] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2020/ubuntu-desktop.2020-06-02-13.32.moin.txt
[14:16] <marcustomlinson> thx
[14:35] <didrocks> Laney: putting appstream-doc to universe isn’t enough apparently. I’ll look at hilight.js
[14:35] <Laney> didrocks: it migrated didn't it?
[14:36] <Laney> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.svg HHUUHH
[14:36] <didrocks> Laney: it did, but it still have hilight.js in component-mismatches
[14:36] <didrocks> yeah!
[14:37] <Laney> don't understand why
[14:37] <didrocks> I didn’t look into it, I’ll try tomorrow
[14:37] <didrocks> just blindly demoted -doc without reminder :)
[14:37] <didrocks> and saw it migrated, so I though c-m was good
[14:45] <Laney> I think it probably needs an Extra-Exclude in the seeds
[15:41] <seb128> didrocks, Laney, thx for the demotion, I did demote it before being away but I always forget that doing in in the release is not enough to fix proposed
[15:54] <Laney> nod
[15:54] <Laney> just pushed the seed change, hopefully that works
[19:50] <hellsworth> kenvandine: would you pretty please restart this test for me: http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=groovy&arch=arm64&package=netplan.io&trigger=network-manager/1.24.0-1ubuntu2
[19:51] <kenvandine> hellsworth: sure
[19:55] <hellsworth> thanks


[00:54] <alocompsci_> Hey, I can't find any article for this bug I'm getting. I just installed xubuntu as dual boot with mac. Everytime after waking up the imac after suspend
[00:55] <alocompsci_> the screen is fuzzy like static
[00:55] <alocompsci_> imac is early 2008, xubuntu 16.04
[00:55] <alocompsci_> any ideas?
[01:09] <knome> alocompsci_, macs aren't officially supported
[01:32] <alocompsci_> oh, is there any forum for unofficial fixes?
[01:39] <makitoro> Hi
[01:39] <makitoro> Can someone help me out or point me in the direction of a HOW to for setting xfce-taskmanager to run at startup but hidden in notification area? I have it running at start up, and if I close it by hitting the X it hides in notification area as per the setting I checked off in preferences. Is there something I can append to the xfce-taskmanager command to make it start up hidden in the notification bar?
[01:40] <knome> alocompsci_, not a specific one, but people have ran xubuntu on macs, so maybe you can find some information online
[01:41] <tengelic> makitoro: Maybe disable the notification feature in the taskmanager?
[01:43] <makitoro> I want it loading it a start up, I want it in the task bar. I want to know if there is a way to have it not pop up or to automatically close to the taskbar by it self when it loads
[01:44] <makitoro> Popup asin open the window maximized but still running
[01:44] <knome> makitoro, if not else, you could looking at gdevilspie, which is essentially a piece of software that handles how new windows appear
[02:05] <tengelic> How can i add a shortcut in thunar for opening a terminal in the currend directory (file menu)?
[16:03] <sernylabs> Strange ongoing video bug: Monitor spontaneously displays a screenshot from the past.
[17:35] <dirtylifeandtime> I'm having issues joining to a Windows domain. Getting the DNS_ERROR_BAD_PACKET error when running domainjoin-cli...anyone willing to help?
[17:38] <dirtylifeandtime> I'm having issues joining to a Windows domain. Getting the DNS_ERROR_BAD_PACKET error when running domainjoin-cli...anyone willing to help?
[17:42] <dirtylifeandtime> I'm having issues joining to a Windows domain. Getting the DNS_ERROR_BAD_PACKET error when running domainjoin-cli...anyone willing to help?
[17:43] <flocculant> !patience | dirtylifeandtime
[17:43] <dirtylifeandtime> sorry flocculant I just saw new people entering the room :)
[20:49] <BrunoBSC> exit
[23:58] <xubuntu03w> hello. i am dumb.  i need help installing pandas into pythong 3.5