[01:08] <ubotu> In ubotu, g_m_t_s said:  that is fine
[03:14] <yoand1> hi,
[03:15] <yoand1> question: is there a plan/interest to certify ubuntu for oracle?
[04:30] <ubotu> Daisuke_Ido called the ops in #ubuntu (GeraldBurns)
[04:34] <tritium> People never cease to disappoint...
[04:35] <Darksiteevil> buenas
[04:35] <Darksiteevil>  hello
[04:36] <Darksiteevil> i have a querstion
[04:36] <Darksiteevil> perenme que quiero hacer algo
[04:36] <nalioth> Darksiteevil: we're listening
[04:37] <Darksiteevil> nalioth
[04:37] <Darksiteevil> i have a big problem
[04:37] <Darksiteevil> in ubuntu-es
[04:37] <Darksiteevil> this focking bot ban me
[04:38] <Darksiteevil> go #ubuntu-es and see this focking bot ban you for anything
[04:39] <tonyyarusso> Such as mispelling profanity, for instance?
[04:39] <Darksiteevil>
[04:39] <Darksiteevil> The op ubuntu are crazy to leave a bot that kick and ban anyone
[04:39] <nalioth> Darksiteevil: we don't need the bad language  :|
[04:40] <Darksiteevil> ok
[04:40] <Darksiteevil> ok
[04:40] <Darksiteevil> sorry
[04:40] <tonyyarusso> Not to mention that this is the wrong channel to raise LoCo questions in.
[04:40] <Darksiteevil> ¿?
[04:40] <tonyyarusso> #ubuntu-irc is what you want.
[04:40] <tonyyarusso> This one is for the primary channels (#ubuntu, #kubuntu, #ubuntu-offtopic, and such).
[04:41] <Darksiteevil>
[04:41] <Darksiteevil> Forgiveness is that I have to google as a translator at some things
[04:41] <Darksiteevil> tony
[04:42] <Darksiteevil> is #ubuntu-es
[04:42] <Darksiteevil> Was on that channel that I just banish, was the bot that there
[04:43] <Darksiteevil>
[04:43] <Darksiteevil> When I set new rules that were only call fmaq and I baneo this bot
[04:43] <Darksiteevil> ban me
[04:44] <nalioth> Darksiteevil: vaya de #ubuntu-irc, por favor
[04:44] <Darksiteevil> ok
[04:45] <Darksiteevil> ok
[04:45] <Darksiteevil> ya estoy alla
[04:45] <Darksiteevil> thx
[04:45] <Darksiteevil> i stay in ubuntu-irc
[05:02] <PriceChild> Wooooot. Finished for the day.
[05:03] <Darksiteevil> hello PrinceChild
[05:03] <Darksiteevil> :)
[05:04] <PriceChild> !idle | Darksiteevil
[05:04] <ubotu> Darksiteevil: Please keep in mind that this channel is for operator/abuse questions only, and we ask you to part when you have no further business here, in order to keep track of users with pending inquiries.
[05:05] <Darksiteevil> Forgiveness by hail
[05:12] <Darksiteevil> good bye i go to my chatroom
[05:13] <Darksiteevil> and PrinceChild sorry, forgiveness by hail
[05:13] <Darksiteevil> good bye
[05:14] <PriceChild> All hail PrinceChild!!!
[05:15]  * mneptok holds his gladius aloft
[05:15]  * tritium wonders what forgiveness by hail is...
[05:16] <tritium> Perhaps physical punishment, purging one's sins, while being pelted by golf-ball sized hail.
[05:16] <mneptok> tritium: i think it's one of those ANGERGOD things
[05:16] <nalioth> tritium: ask google (it's what darksiteevil was using to talk to us)
[05:16] <tritium> mneptok, nalioth: :)
[05:23] <mneptok> Pici: meep
[05:25] <tritium> Fryguy (Bryan Alves) is ban evading.
[05:25] <tritium> mneptok: yeah, wrong channel the first time
[05:38] <bryanalves> I have a question about creating custom session files for gdm but I seem to be banned from #ubuntu. what's wrong?
[05:38] <tritium> What's wrong with what?  Your session file, or ban evading?
[05:38] <bryanalves> ?
[05:38] <bryanalves> my session file
[05:39] <nalioth> this is not a support channel
[05:39] <bryanalves> i realize that, I'm asking why I can't get into the support channel
[05:40] <tritium> bryanalves: because you (Fryguy--) were banned previously.
[05:40] <bryanalves> fryguy--?  I have a nickname fryguy that I used to go by.  never used -- though.
[05:40] <bryanalves> is that the problem?
[05:41] <bryanalves> would it be possible for me to just ask my question in here, since I can't get into the main support channel?
[05:41] <nalioth> bryanalves: you obviously have other business in here
[05:41] <bryanalves> nalioth: no, I really just want to get this session file set up correctly
[05:42] <tritium> bryanalves: you're suggesting you're not this person, who was banned from #ubuntu tonight:
[05:42] <tritium> 23:03 -!- Fryguy--<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[05:42] <tritium> 23:03 -!-  ircname  : Bryan Alves
[05:42] <tritium> 23:03 -!-  server   : irc.freenode.net [http://freenode.net/]
[05:42] <tritium> 23:03 -!-           : is identified to services
[05:42] <tritium> 23:03 -!-  idle     : 0 days 0 hours 2 mins 58 secs [signon: Thu Mar 20  22:07:11 2008]
[05:42] <tritium> 23:03 -!- End of WHOIS
[05:42] <bryanalves> that is a crazy coincidence lol
[05:42] <nalioth> isn't it?
[05:42] <bryanalves> can I just ask my question here, since I can't get into #ubuntu?
[05:42] <nalioth> this is not a support channel
[05:43] <bryanalves> so how am I supposed to get support if I can't get into the support channel?
[05:43] <nalioth> you need to talk to tritium
[05:43] <bryanalves> why him?
[05:43] <tritium> bryanalves: because I banned you
[05:44] <bryanalves> why did you ban me? I joined the channel and got banned a second later, without saying anything
[05:44] <tritium> bryanalves: for ban evasion.  As I said earlier, Fryguy-- (Bryan Alves) was banned earlier for code of conduct issues.
[05:45] <tritium> Now, it's quite a coincidence to have not only used the same nick, but to also have the same name.
[05:45] <bryanalves> this time I joined #ubuntu was my first time every joining the channel.  That's a ridiculous coincidence that this other person has the exact same name as me,  but I don't know what to tell you
[05:45] <bryanalves> I would just like the opportunity to ask this question about my session file I'm trying to create
[05:49] <bryanalves> Well, I'll ask in here I guess.  I installed a window manager that isn't in ubuntu's repositories (called golem), and I need to create a session file for it so that i can load it.  I copied one of the existing ones from /usr/share/xsessions and modified it for my needs, but it does not show up in gdm, even after restarting gdm (and in fact the entire xserver).  What could be wrong?
[05:53] <mneptok> bryanalves: http://ubuntuforums.org/  |  http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=23788
[05:54] <bryanalves> mneptok: thank you for the links. I took the opportunity of browsing the ubuntuforums already, and came across this http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=61135  which is what I followed and it didn't seem to work (as I mentioned).  As for the golem mailing list, the problem seems to be more with gdm than the window manager itself.  I've been looking through the gdm mailing lists and having come across a matching issue yet.
[06:02] <bryanalves> any other ideas?  It seems to be ubuntu related, because I had no problems copying the xsession file on another linux machine (not ubuntu)
[06:06] <tritium> bryanalves: bans often last a day or two.  Of course, ban evading can extend that duration.  Also, please read the topic, regarding idling.  Thanks.
[06:07] <bryanalves> tritium: so you can not help me with my problem, and you can not provide me access to the support channel so I can ask for help with a wider audience?
[06:08] <bryanalves> I thought that ubuntu was a friendly community, I just installed it yesterday and that definetely doesn't seem to be the case so far
[06:08] <tritium> bryanalves: it is.
[06:10] <bryanalves> how am I supposed to believe that it's friendly when I get banned 1 second after joining the main source of live support?
[06:11] <tritium> bryanalves: you've seen the evidence.
[06:11] <tritium> 1) same name
[06:11] <tritium> 2) same nick
[06:11] <tritium> So, it should be easy to understand why you're facing the situation you're in.
[06:11] <tritium> It has no bearing on how friendly the community is.
[06:11] <bryanalves> yes I have, and I find it awfully hard to believe as well.  However, that doesn't really involve me.  I would just like access to support so I can ask my question
[06:12] <bryanalves> i have done nothing wrong, and yet here I am asking for permission to obtain support
[06:12] <tritium> bryanalves: it does involve you, obviously.  You are Bryan Alves, yes?
[06:12] <bryanalves> That is my name, yes.
[06:13] <bryanalves> I don't know who this other person is though, or why they have (or are using) the same name as me
[06:13] <tritium> Great, then you should understand that the odds of having the same name and nick as somebody just banned this evening are too high to allow you into the channel at this time.
[06:13] <tritium> too low, rather
[06:13] <bryanalves> Like I said, I joined irc, registered my nick, and tried to join the support channel to ask a question
[06:14] <earlmred> bryanalves: Hi Fryguy
[06:14] <LimCore> boy, is mneptok not a very friendly admin
[06:14] <tritium> LimCore: you were given ample warning.
[06:14] <LimCore> I thought freenode wellcomed open discussion on technical topic.
[06:14] <tritium> LimCore: you were insulting others, violating the code of conduct.
[06:14] <tonyyarusso> LimCore: In the proper place, which you were told it was not.  And what he said.
[06:14] <bryanalves> tritium: so what am I supposed to do about my problem, just not use this software?
[06:15] <LimCore> tonyyarusso: how come ubuntu+1 is not proper place to discuss possible changes to be placed in next ubuntu version again?
[06:15] <nalioth> LimCore: because it is not the proper place
[06:16] <Hobbsee> LimCore: developers don't tend to sit in #ubuntu+1
[06:16] <mneptok> LimCore: #ubuntu+1 is a support, not development channel. and there is a Hardy feature freeze.
[06:16] <tonyyarusso> LimCore: a) because that's not what you were really doing, you just used it as a thinly veiled cover, b) because such things would be addressed through the Launchpad blueprints system.
[06:16] <LimCore> so what is the proper place to discuss changes to be placed in next ubuntu then
[06:16] <tonyyarusso> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/
[06:16] <LimCore> and nothing on freenode's irc?
[06:16] <bryanalves> tritium: if I go and reinstall my system to xubuntu instead of ubuntu, will I be able to get support that way? Or will I get banned from that channel too because of this other person using the same name as me?
[06:16] <tonyyarusso> Or, http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/, for the less fleshed out ones.
[06:17] <bryanalves> I really would like to get support on this topic, as there is some amount of limited timeframe for it (it's related to a project I'm working on)
[06:17] <tonyyarusso> Not initially - after some stages of review it becomes more appropriate, but not just thinking out loud, no.  (Would get very noisy with everyone's pet wishes, and waste lots of developers' time.)
[06:17] <nalioth> bryanalves: the odds of two people with the same info joining within hours of the other NOT being the same person are astronomical
[06:17] <nalioth> bryanalves: as was mentioned, most bans disappear within 24 hours
[06:17] <LimCore> mneptok: now this makes so much more sense then kick. if ubuntu+1 is support only too, then ok
[06:18] <earlmred> who would evade a ban to ask for help in #ubuntu?
[06:18] <earlmred> that's just dumb.
[06:18] <bryanalves> nalioth: I need to be presenting about this project in the next 15 hours, I can't afford to wait because of some other bonehead
[06:19] <nalioth> earlmred: can we help you with something?
[06:19] <earlmred> nalioth: yes, how do I become an operator in #ubuntu?
[06:20] <nalioth> you are asked to be one
[06:20] <earlmred> oh, okay
[06:21] <earlmred> so are you asking me now? or should I wait a few minutes?
[06:21] <bryanalves> nalioth: please, I really need assistance with this matter
[06:21] <mneptok> cereal | nose > kybd
[06:21] <mneptok> ow ow ow
[06:22] <nalioth> bryanalves: there are many gnome support channels here
[06:22] <bryanalves> nalioth: as I mentioned, based on my experience with another operating system, I'm led to believe that it is ubuntu related and not gnome/gdm related
[06:22] <earlmred> mneptok: did you have cereal in your nose?
[06:22] <bryanalves> should I file a bug?
[06:23] <mneptok> earlmred: not before you spoke
[06:23] <LimCore> mneptok: you can lift the ban now, especially as I need to ask some questions about the blueprints
[06:24] <mneptok> LimCore: we're all going to stop discussing this now.
[06:24] <mneptok> right?
[06:24] <tritium> LimCore: you don't tell an op when he/she lifts a ban.
[06:24] <LimCore> we will move with this, to a blueprint if its a better place
[06:26] <bryanalves> so can no one assist me? I'm really under some time pressure to figure this out
[06:27] <tritium> bryanalves: nalioth suggested a gnome channel
[06:27] <bryanalves> tritium: like I mentioned, I have good reason to believe that it is an ubuntu issue, not a gnome issue, based on my experimentation.  Should I file a bug
[06:28] <nalioth> this is not a support channel
[06:28] <bryanalves> nalioth: I realize that, I'm asking to be allowed into the live support channel to ask my question
[06:28] <nalioth> bryanalves: and we've responded
[06:29] <bryanalves> why am i getting punished because of the actions of someone else?
[06:29] <nalioth> bryanalves: we've responded to your questions.  is there anything else we can help you with?
[06:30] <bryanalves> this other guy must have done some really bad things in order to cause other people to get banned from support :(
[06:30] <nalioth> bryanalves: is there anything else?
[06:31] <bryanalves> nalioth: nah, if I can't get the support I need that's it.  Time to go polish off the resume I guess
[06:31] <bryanalves> thanks for not allowing me into the channel because of the actions of someone else.  It's really appreciated.  I hope whatever he did was really disruptive :(
[06:32] <Hobbsee> tritium: erm, the ip's are different?
[06:32] <tritium> Hobbsee: yes
[06:32] <nalioth> Hobbsee: everything else matches
[06:33] <Hobbsee> nalioth: ie, real name only
[06:33] <tritium> Hobbsee: and nicks
[06:34] <tritium> He admits to going by fryguy in the past
[06:34] <Hobbsee> oh, right
[06:34] <tritium> And neither IP resolved.
[06:34] <Hobbsee> ah right
[06:35]  * tritium things he was a good actor, though
[06:36] <tritium> Fryguy was very helpful, but condescending and rude.
[06:37] <ubotu> FloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)
[06:37] <ubotu> FloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)
[06:38] <ubotu> FloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)
[06:41] <tritium> Hobbsee: don't you think it's simply too improbably?
[06:41] <tritium> improbable*
[06:41]  * Hobbsee shrugs
[06:42] <mneptok>  /msg tritium he's either got the worst luck ever, or is the most boldface liar.
[06:43] <mneptok> i'm still wrapping my brain around it
[06:43] <tritium> Me too.
[06:57] <tritium> Good night.
[07:39] <emma> Hello. I would like to speak to any op in here. On your ubuntu-ops log so that it is recorded for everyone to see.
[07:41]  * Hobbsee hears echoes
[07:42] <Myrtti> hello tuxteddy, how may we help you today?
[07:42] <emma> Will any op please step forward.
[07:42] <Hobbsee> emma: what do you want?
[07:42] <emma> Myrtti - You are deciding not to speak to me?
[07:42] <ompaul> tuxteddy,  how can we help you
[07:43] <tuxteddy> Yes ..
[07:43] <emma> Okay let this Ubuntu ops log show that the ops in here are choosing to not speak to me.
[07:44] <emma> ompaul are you able to see me?
[07:44] <Hobbsee> emma: you haven't actually brought up anything concretely useful in here yet.  Last few times you were in here, you brought up useless rubbish that took up extensive periods of time.  are you altogether surprised?
[07:44] <ompaul> yes
[07:45] <emma> ompaul --  I have an issue that I want clarified.
[07:45] <ompaul> you can always ask
[07:45] <Myrtti> I'm having a headache and can't really work out difficult things so I'll just step aside from this one
[07:45] <Myrtti> tuxteddy: yes?
[07:45] <elkbuntu> emma, we dont read minds
[07:45] <emma> Ompaul - Is it fair to say that the reason this channel is logged is so that things are done in the open and the behavior of the ops is as much accountable as the behavior of the users?
[07:45] <nickrud>  tuxteddy are you here as an observer?
[07:46] <tuxteddy> i've seen a clock script, I may not be able to see it..can you tell me how do I set up ..
[07:46] <Hobbsee> tuxteddy: you probably want #ubuntu
[07:46] <nickrud> tuxteddy help is on #ubuntu+1
[07:46] <tuxteddy> something like ubuntu/member/nickname
[07:46] <emma> nickrud, glad you are here. I know that you would agree with the above statement.
[07:46] <Myrtti> cloak... aha
[07:46] <nickrud> tuxteddy erm, #ubuntu I've been in the wrong channel for me today
[07:47] <emma> nickrud - It is fair to say that the reason this channel is logged is so that the behavior of the ops is held accountable as much as the behavior of the users.
[07:47] <ompaul> emma, it is logged so that logs may be reviewed in the case of a dispute, your phrasing is to put it politely confrontational
[07:47] <emma> Very well. I don't need it to be confrontational.
[07:47] <elkbuntu> emma, then dont be.
[07:47] <nickrud> emma you've heard my view of things. If you have a grievance you need to use the channels provided.
[07:47] <emma> But my point is that at some level it is important that what the ops do to users is done in the open.
[07:47] <emma> Alright now here is my concern:
[07:48] <elkbuntu> finally
[07:48] <Daviey> ...
[07:48] <emma> I have a channel that is not an official Ubuntu channel. I do not prevent members of the Ubuntu ops from joining it and participating in it.  But now I discover that members of the Ubuntu ops team are recording my channel, and then submiting a report on me.
[07:49] <Myrtti> tuxteddy: to have ubuntu/member/nickname cloak you need to become a Ubuntu member. However you can get an unaffiliated/nickname -cloak too
[07:49] <ompaul> emma, and where is this report you talk of?
[07:49] <emma> Where is this report? Who is doing that logging? And why can't I see this out in the open as is the policy of the Ubuntu Council?
[07:49] <Myrtti> tuxteddy: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#cloaks
[07:49] <emma> ompaul -- That is exactly my question.
[07:50] <elkbuntu> emma, you find us proof of this report, and we'll try find it for you, but until then, we have no clue what you're on about
[07:50] <emma> ompaul -- Look at this -- logged from my channel by an ubuntu op, and then reported on me --- http://rafb.net/p/vY7Pm394.html
[07:50] <tuxteddy> Myrtti, I'm currently an ubuntu Methor in somekind..in local community.
[07:50] <emma> elkbuntu -- It is right there. Click on it.
[07:50] <tuxteddy> Myrtti, will that help me mask my IP?
[07:50] <Hobbsee> emma: what evidence do you have of it being reported by an ubuntu op?
[07:50] <elkbuntu> emma, that's not a report
[07:51] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: looks like that could be by anyone.
[07:51] <Myrtti> tuxteddy: yes. the cloak isn't done by a script, it's a network issue
[07:51] <elkbuntu> Hobbsee, exactly
[07:51] <elkbuntu> emma, it's probably one of the people in the passage
[07:51] <ompaul> emma, someone in that channel did that
[07:52] <ompaul> it could even be you - you have no way to link that to someone here - only opinion
[07:52] <elkbuntu> emma, we're not going to manage your channel for you.
[07:52] <tuxteddy> Myrtti, I found it difficult to set things up..Can you point the easy way?
[07:52] <ompaul> emma, now that we have cleared that up why the pm I have not opened it yet I don't want to put you on ignore
[07:52] <tuxteddy> Myrtti, I'm sorry to be an idiot here
[07:52] <ompaul> but either you are in the open or not
[07:53] <Myrtti> tuxteddy: I'm sorry to have an headache :-/
[07:53] <ompaul> emma, in the history of my time on irc on freenode I have put two people on ignore
[07:53] <emma> ompaul -- I told you this -- -One of the ops in this channel is lying right now. I don't know what to do. I don't want to get them in trouble.
[07:53] <Daviey> tuxteddy: np, #freenode will help you set un an unaffiliated  cloak :)
[07:53] <Hobbsee> emma: why do you believe that to be the case?  where is your evidence?
[07:53] <ompaul> !register | tuxteddy
[07:53] <ubotu> tuxteddy: By default, only registered users can send private messages - Information about registering your nickname: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#userregistration - Type « /nick <nickname> » to select your nickname.
[07:53] <emma> I could just paste the pm where they TOLD me that it was a report.
[07:54] <emma> That would really contrast with them telling me that I have no proof.
[07:54] <Hobbsee> emma: but, who's to say that the report was given to them by another op?
[07:54] <ompaul> emma, you have only some opinion, not fact or proof
[07:54] <emma> I do not want the Ubuntu ops to continue to log my channel. Any one of you is welcome to be there. Join it, enjoy it, participate, idle. Whatever. I won't stop you.
[07:55] <emma> Please do not log the channel and if you are going to report on me, do it in the open. Thank you.
[07:55] <Daviey> I'm really confused, someone has pastebined a _short_ extract from your own channel.  A) Is that some sort of problem?  B) How can you suggest that is an op?
[07:55] <tuxteddy> Myrtti, Daviey thanks for the help
[07:55] <Myrtti> tuxteddy: np
[07:55] <Daviey> tuxteddy: o/
[07:55] <elkbuntu> emma, you might want to make sure that you let everyone know they cant log their own conversations
[07:55] <emma> Daviey - Because an Ubuntu op who is in this channel right now, GAVE me that link and TOLD me that it was the report.
[07:55] <elkbuntu> you know, as a rule of the channel
[07:56] <elkbuntu> emma, that doesnt mean it was that op who put it there
[07:56] <emma> I do not accuse that op of putting it there and I would like it to be noticed and appreciated at some level that I am not naming this op.
[07:56] <tuxteddy> ompaul, Well, I have registered at #freenode
[07:56] <emma> I am doing that absolutely on purpose.
[07:56] <elkbuntu> emma, you already did accuse that op
[07:56] <emma> I did not.
[07:56] <ompaul> tuxteddy, so then you move down that page until you find nicksetup
 I have a channel that is not an official Ubuntu channel. I do not prevent members of the Ubuntu ops from joining it and participating in it.  But now I discover that members of the Ubuntu ops team are recording my channel, and then submiting a report on me.
[07:57] <ompaul> tuxteddy, it is not a ubuntu channel
[07:57] <ompaul> !member  | tuxteddy
[07:57] <ubotu> tuxteddy: Want to become an Ubuntu member? Look at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember
[07:57] <ompaul> tuxteddy, and there I am afraid we will have to leave it
[07:57] <ompaul> tuxteddy, is there anything else?
[07:57] <emma> elkbuntu,  I did not identify the op who GAVE me the link and TOLD me and this is a quote: " it was reported.  the report had an accompanying log."
[07:58] <ompaul> emma, you assume the person who gave you that link is an op
[07:58] <Daviey> emma: and you failed to enquire WHERE it was reported?
[07:58] <emma> No. I know they are. They are in this channel right now.
[07:58]  * Hobbsee did get a report.
[07:58] <elkbuntu> s/gave you/gave the op/
[07:58] <elkbuntu> ompaul, you need more coffee
[07:59]  * Hobbsee got a log reported to her, and then queried emma about it, as emma is not doing what she says she would.
[07:59] <ompaul> ahh
[07:59] <ompaul> I see
[07:59] <Hobbsee> however, that in no way says who the reporter was.
[07:59] <ompaul> well it is 8am
[07:59] <Myrtti> this is getting Officially Too Difficult And Complicated For A Small Finn With A Big Headache To Understand
[07:59] <Hobbsee> nor even implies that it is an op who sent it.
[07:59] <Myrtti> -->
[07:59] <Hobbsee> if emma wishes to imply that, she wishes to do it completely without proof.
[08:00] <Hobbsee> in which case, it's effectively lies and propaganda.
[08:00] <ompaul> emma, do you see the dots that fail to join up
[08:00] <ompaul> cos I do
[08:00] <emma> I'm not implying anything. Until 20 seconds ago everyone in here was telling me I had no proof that there was any report.
[08:00] <elkbuntu> emma, we cant control what other people report to us
[08:00] <nickrud> ompaul you started your day here before 8 on a saturday?
[08:00] <elkbuntu> we cant control who reports stuff to us
[08:00] <Hobbsee> emma: you still have not provided proof.
[08:00] <emma> elkbuntu - So if it is not an op that is 'reporting' it to you then how can you trust that it is accurate or fair?
[08:00] <ompaul> now if you can ink in the parts between those dots great if you can't go away
[08:00] <elkbuntu> emma, because other than hobbsee, we didnt know of any report
[08:00] <Hobbsee> emma: i have made the allegation that it was i who received the report, but i may be talking rubbish.
[08:01] <emma> I have not made any claim other than that I am being 'reported on' and it is not being done in the open.
[08:01] <elkbuntu> emma, as much as we can trust that what you're saying now is accurate and fair
[08:01] <ompaul> emma, you said there was a report to ops
[08:01] <ompaul> well it appears it went to one
[08:01] <Daviey> emma: I'm yet to see a problem, that you have raised.
[08:01] <ompaul> so you need to be specific
[08:01] <Myrtti> oy.
[08:01] <emma> elkbuntu - Okay not at all then. Good, then why are you concerning yourself with reports you cannot trust? And then holding me accountable for them?
[08:01] <ompaul> reallllllllllllllly specific
[08:01] <ompaul> nickrud, yes
[08:02] <nickrud> ompaul well, it can only get better
[08:02] <ompaul> Myrtti, get a cuppa, nice herbal tea
[08:02] <ompaul> nickrud, I am going out to breakfast if I get an sms and may go even if I don't ;-)
[08:02] <emma> I'm going to ask that every single op actually reads this log from the moment I came in here until this moment. Because I think that every sane, reasonable, and intellectually honest person can see that this stinks.
[08:02] <emma> ops!
[08:02] <emma> !ops
[08:02] <elkbuntu> emma, same reason that security personnel follow up every hint of a breakin
[08:02] <ubotu> Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - Mez, LjL, elkbuntu, imbrandon, DBO, gnomefreak, Hobbsee, rob, ompaul, Madpilot, Seveas, CarlK, crimsun, ajmitch, tritium, Nalioth, thoreauputic, apokryphos, tonyyarusso, PriceChild, Amaranth, jrib, jenda, nixternal, Myrtti, mneptok, Pici, Jack_Sparrow or nickrud!
[08:02] <ubotu> emma called the ops in #ubuntu-ops ()
[08:02] <ompaul> emma, we can see that
[08:02] <tonyyarusso> emma: What's your emergency?
[08:02] <elkbuntu> emma, that is inappropriate use of that factoid
[08:03] <Hobbsee> bang.
[08:03] <Hobbsee> bot abuse == bad.
[08:03]  * tonyyarusso was about to do the same
[08:03] <Daviey> any excuse :)
[08:03] <ompaul> tuxteddy, is there anything else, if not please see the topic, part about idlers
[08:03] <tuxteddy> ompaul, thanks for rejuvenated interest, I'm a mentor too..
[08:03] <ompaul> Daviey, yes
[08:03] <Hobbsee> Daviey: no.  i just don't appreciate useless highlights.
[08:03] <Daviey> agreed
[08:03] <tonyyarusso> Especially not when they rouse me from getting close to sleeping.
[08:04] <ompaul> jheheh
[08:04] <Hobbsee> either way, she still has absolutely no proof that whoever was actually doing the logging, and passed it to an op, was actually an op, or any of us.
[08:04] <ompaul> hehehe
[08:04] <ompaul> Daviey, you missed nothing
[08:04] <Hobbsee> ie, lies and propaganda.
[08:04] <ompaul> or just paranoia
[08:05] <elkbuntu> hey, we shouldnt slag her
[08:05] <Hobbsee> ubotu lies
[08:05] <ubotu> Mostly just statistics, but yeah.
[08:05] <elkbuntu> hehehe
[08:05] <elkbuntu> brb, dinner
[08:05] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: that was a summary of what just happened, for those who will read, after being triggered by the highlight.  apart from that, yes, you're very right.
[08:06] <ompaul> Daviey, never say any excuse that is excuse number 71
[08:06] <Daviey> :)
[08:11] <Myrtti> oh shoot, I've used all my dishes :-<
[08:11] <Hobbsee> oh dear.  go wash up.
[08:11] <stdin> or get a dishwasher
[08:12] <Myrtti> either way, the sound of the dishes clincking each other is making my world explode
[08:12] <Myrtti> blergh.
[08:30] <tuxteddy> Myrtti, thanks again
[08:30] <tuxteddy> see you all later
[08:31]  * jussio1 reads the backlog and sighs...
[08:31] <ompaul> jussi01, don't bother
[08:32] <ompaul> don't waste a good sigh
[08:32] <jussio1> hehe
[08:32] <jussio1> too late
[08:59] <elkbuntu> i just wish she'd understand how lenient we've been on her
[09:01] <nickrud> smart, but not very wise. I've talked with her in pm's, and they are enjoyable until it comes to any disagreement. Others should flex, not her.
[09:02] <ompaul> so she has issues
[09:02] <ompaul> we all do
[09:02] <jussio1> hmm, steve_jobs in #ubuntu looks very trollish, someone may want to keep an eye in there
[09:02] <nickrud> very true.
[09:02] <nickrud> I've already welcomed him ;)
[09:02] <jussio1> :)
[09:03] <jussio1> hehe, I just looked in and saw: [10:57:30] <Steve_Jobs> All of you should switch to Windows.
[09:09] <Myrtti> fun
[09:48] <jussi01> Jucato: all yours. sigh
[10:02] <nickrud> there's a guy in #ubuntu who would like ubotu in -bg , anyone can do that?
[10:06] <Jucato> jussi01: all's well
[10:06] <Jucato> you might get an apology :)
[10:07] <elkbuntu> nickrud, he needs to ask in a more appropriate place, like -irc
[10:07] <nickrud> elkbuntu ok, I will point him there
[10:08] <nickrud> there are so many of these, irc , ops-monitor, etc. nearly fractal
[10:09] <nickrud> dtRz I was told to tell you #ubuntu-irc
[10:09] <dtRz> oh yeah
[10:09] <dtRz> sry
[10:09] <nickrud> heh. My fault
[10:09] <elkbuntu> nickrud, not really fractal, they all have their purpose
[10:09] <dtRz> hahaha
[10:09] <dtRz> ;)
[10:09] <nickrud> elkbuntu so do fractals
[10:09] <dtRz> n
[10:09] <dtRz> np
[10:09] <elkbuntu> otherwise this becomes an invariable sloshpit, especially when we have marathons with trolls
[10:10] <nickrud> to the outside observer, chaotic but with a pattern to those with eyes ;)
[10:10] <Hobbsee> (fyi, chickbot is not a bot)
[10:11] <elkbuntu> Hobbsee, i'd figured that by her non-bot behaviour
[10:11] <Hobbsee> his
[10:11] <dtRz> nickrud maybe now i have 2 wait?
[10:11] <nickrud> dtRz wait in #ubuntu-irc , not here
[10:11] <dtRz> /part ?
[10:11] <nickrud> yes
[10:11] <elkbuntu> Hobbsee, is she aware how her nick makes us wary though?
[10:12] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: nobblynu is proclaimed male.  at least, emma's calling him a male.  then again, emma has called both of us males numerous times, so...
[10:12] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: i doubt it.
[10:13] <elkbuntu> hehe
[10:27] <jpatrick> mneptok: arg, sorry, had to go as soon as I left the message..
[10:32]  * Gary has headache from reading scrollback
[10:32] <ubotu> unop__ called the ops in #ubuntu (ailean)
[10:33]  * jpatrick reads the backlog and weeps
[10:33] <elkbuntu> Seveas, what did she do?
 unop__, how helpful. idiot
[10:34] <elkbuntu> Seveas, and that one comment was *ban* worthy?
[10:35] <Seveas> just a no-auto-rejoin ban
[11:22] <ubotu> ani1 called the ops in #ubuntu (NaViBorN)
[11:23] <jpatrick> hmm
[11:23] <ubotu> ani1 called the ops in #ubuntu (Diamonds)
[11:29] <Gary> having fun Hobbsee :-)
[11:29] <Hobbsee> Gary: oh yes.  i've always liked chucking people under +q's.
[11:29] <Hobbsee> always makes me think of rats in cages, where you can see them running out of control, but they don't know you're there.
[11:29] <Gary> hehe
[11:29] <Gary> did they carry on even when muted then?
[11:29] <Hobbsee> one did
[11:30] <Gary> silly trolls
[11:30] <Hobbsee> the other hasn't said so much yet
[11:30] <Hobbsee> apart from that no he wasn't going to behave, got removed, a smiley face, then "windows must die!"
 Go out!!!!!!
[11:32] <Gary> Hobbsee: and biting to naviborn's trolling
[11:32] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[11:32] <jpatrick> < ~Diamonds> NaViBorN: �������� ������
[11:32] <Hobbsee> gone too
[11:32] <jpatrick> anyone who why /clones outputs a ton of useless names in #u: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/60519/
[11:58] <PriceChild> Just checked over the backlog with emma, on first read I don't think I see much wrong.
[12:01] <PriceChild> Everyone is perfectly entitled to log their activities on irc, in their own channels and others' as far as I am aware. (Whether or not those logs came from one of us or not)
[12:04] <elkbuntu> PriceChild, exactly. it's not public logging just because someone quotes some of it somewhere
[12:04] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: even if it is, do you want to have a guess at how many people you'd have to kick out, before you guessed correctly over which one was actually doing the logging?
[12:05] <PriceChild> anyway, no need for more discussion on that unless someone has something new :)
[12:05] <elkbuntu> nope
[12:06] <Hobbsee> no, and i can't see emma coming bakc here anytime soon
[12:09]  * PriceChild doesn't like the idea of people being banned in -ops though.
[12:09] <PriceChild> Maybe remove it in a little?
[12:10] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: maybe.
[12:11] <PriceChild> :)
[12:14] <Hobbsee> my hopes of a resolution are dropping, though, if she appears to think it's a good idea to accuse people of things with no proof at all, and not even provide the basic proof that there was a log that got passed to an op at all, even when requested.
[12:15] <Hobbsee> obviously, for anything, we need to have proof, and to be able to provide it on request.
[12:20] <ompaul> Seveas, be glad you only just arrived
[12:20]  * ompaul is happy
[12:21] <ompaul> great food good coffee and a bit of a chinwag what more would one want of a Saturday
[12:21]  * PriceChild withholds his suggestions
[12:34] <ompaul> Seveas, I started off the day several hours ago with no coffee </end mock shock> I am now all coffeed up for the day
[12:55] <Gary> coffee rulez
[12:56] <ompaul> coffee is the new coff.... oh wait
[13:04]  * jpatrick has no coffee ... that tastes good :(
[13:07] <ompaul> all coffee drinkers are invited into #ubuntu-offtopic
[13:17] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: can you op me in -meeting a sec? Want to clear out old bans
[13:17] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: sure
[13:21] <Hobbsee> speaking of which, do we have a powerful staffer around yet?
[13:22] <PriceChild> Hobbsee: what is needed?
[13:22] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: reset the levels in -motu, and make me the channel contact
[13:22] <Hobbsee> or the alt, if you must
[13:22] <Hobbsee> ie, anyone can autoop atm.
[13:23] <Hobbsee> [Fri Mar 21 2008] [19:05:44] <Hobbsee> Gary: [Wed Mar 19 2008] [18:52:00] <Hobbsee> will one of you please issue a /cs level #ubuntu-motu reset and make me the alternate channel contact please?
[13:23] <Hobbsee> [Fri Mar 21 2008] [19:05:50] <Hobbsee> elky already said ack.
[13:25] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: it seems that staffers who are active, and actually have power, are really hard to find.
[13:26] <Gary> Hobbsee: i'll need elkbuntu to confirm direct with me
[13:27] <Gary> ie ping elkbuntu :-)
[13:27] <Hobbsee> Gary: she confirmed it, in this channel, days ago.
[13:27] <Hobbsee> Gary: search for elkbuntu: ack
[13:27] <PriceChild> I can ack this... Hobbsee who of the motu council asked for you to own it?
[13:28] <PriceChild> Why can't sladen give it to you? he's active no?
[13:28] <Hobbsee> none of them, but htey have no power over irc by their own logic, and they delegate to the irc council.
[13:28] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: he's roaming the world again, and doesn't care about irc.
[13:28] <ompaul> Gary, I can ack that it was acked
[13:29] <Gary> too much ack'ing
[13:29] <ompaul> PriceChild, I can confirm sladens abense from things ubuntu
[13:29] <ompaul> absence
[13:29]  * PriceChild hacks Gary instead.
[13:29] <ompaul> I have had him a few times in PM but only about OSM
[13:29] <tonyyarusso> Gary: I can make a funny **ack** noise before running off to work.
[13:29] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: i'm the one who's already set up the ops, etc, there
[13:29] <ompaul> which reminds me I am to take photos of a walk way for him
[13:29] <tonyyarusso> Dunno what it means though.  Probably should get that looked at.
[13:30] <PriceChild> I think persia said IRC Council looks after the channel as far as MC is concerned... he's on MC isn't he? *checks*
[13:30] <ompaul> Gary, do nothing
[13:30] <ompaul> Gary, do everything
[13:30] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: he is, yes.
[13:30] <tonyyarusso> Gary: do a dance!  o-\-<
[13:31] <ompaul> Gary, do gar..... ooh wait
[13:33]  * jpatrick saw sladen yesterday in #debian-uk, something about packing up junk..
[13:33] <PriceChild> Hobbsee: done.
[13:33] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: ah, thanks.
[13:33] <Hobbsee> now random people shouldn't be able to op in there
[13:35] <ompaul> Gary, consider this - the irc council owns the ubuntu space .. therefore etc
[13:35] <ompaul> Gary, but then you should never feel pressure :)
[13:35]  * ompaul sits on garys chest with the object of expelling air
[13:35] <Gary> help help, see the violence inherent in the system, help help, i'm being repressed!
[13:35]  * ompaul hears a crack gets up
[13:36] <ompaul> sorry about that
[13:36]  * ompaul got confused
[13:36] <ompaul> I thought for some reason this was in -ot
[13:36] <ompaul> arrrg
[13:50] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: you have access in #k-devel?
[13:50] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: yes
[13:50] <jpatrick> this guy's just random..
[13:51] <Hobbsee> yeah, i know
[13:52] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: he hasn't learnt about where to do things usefully
[13:53] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: we've told him to file bugs a million times
[13:53] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: he prefers to "leave the developers a message"
[13:53] <Hobbsee> heh
[13:53] <Hobbsee> tell him there's a mailing list for that.
[13:55] <jpatrick> and suffer floods there?
[13:56]  * Hobbsee would have thought it was fairly obvious when he got few replies, but...
[13:56] <Hobbsee> no, some of the stuff looks useful.  Most people do actually read the ML, but don't read irc, particualrly on weekends
[13:57] <Gary> win 29
[13:57] <Gary> oops
[13:58] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: we'll get lynched if we turned KDE orange
[13:58] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: yeah.  that orange is a bit brutal anyway.
[13:58] <Hobbsee> besides, we turned it purple with no great harm.
[13:59] <Hobbsee> now that edubuntu doesn't have a theme (i don't think), i'd like to see a maroon kubuntu, but i won't be on the council then
[13:59] <Gary> make it pink!
[13:59]  * Hobbsee has a pink gnome theme.
[14:00] <Gary> yay, I can has a pink osx theme
[14:00] <Hobbsee> burnt (lolly pink)
[14:00] <jpatrick> Gary: http://vizzzion.org/?blogentry=807
[14:02] <Gary> owwww pretty
[14:02]  * Gary wants
[14:03] <ompaul> Gary, makez it yourselves
[14:06] <Hobbsee> jpatrick: should i bring out the good old "i am a release manager of ubuntu, and am telling you that this will not happen" line?
[14:08] <jpatrick> :)
[16:10] <mneptok> jpatrick: no worries
[16:14] <jpatrick> :)
[16:59] <Jack_Sparrow> ompaul, Did you just reset/fix  the ban I set a minute ago?
[16:59] <ompaul> did you ban
[16:59] <ompaul> I saw a remove
[16:59]  * ompaul looks again
[17:00] <Jack_Sparrow> One sec.. want your opinion
[17:00] <ompaul> you only removed
[17:00] <ompaul> I banned
[17:00] <ompaul> good double check though
[17:00] <Jack_Sparrow> Scroll back krushaeerr
[17:00] <ompaul> k
[17:01] <ompaul> krushaeerr >#
[17:01] <Jack_Sparrow> I wanted to stop that.. even with the Im sorry right after
[17:01] <ompaul> ?
[17:01] <Jack_Sparrow> krushaaar

[17:01] <ompaul> yeap that was what I targeted
[17:02] <ompaul> (A) get xchat
[17:02] <ompaul> (B) install seveas's script
[17:02] <Jack_Sparrow> got it
[17:02] <Jack_Sparrow> got it
[17:02] <ompaul> (C) world peace
[17:02] <Jack_Sparrow> good luck
[17:02] <ompaul>  /cs kb idiot
[17:02] <Jack_Sparrow> we can onlky hope
[17:02] <ompaul> that is how you do that ;-)
[17:02] <ompaul> you did k
[17:03] <Jack_Sparrow> I was not sure how far to kick
[17:03] <Jack_Sparrow> I knew the one would give me a chance to review it and or bring it in here.
[17:03] <ompaul> all the way out
[17:03] <ompaul> racist remarks get you terminated in my books
[17:04] <Jack_Sparrow> agreed.. TIme to go for my walk and see how I do..  HAve a good day..
[17:04] <Jack_Sparrow> Zero tolerance .. agreed.
[17:04] <ompaul> keep looking up ;-) and good luck
[17:42] <ubotu> In #ubuntu-offtopic, MenZa said: !n00b is <alias> noob
[17:43] <LjL-Temp> !-noob
[17:43] <ubotu> noob aliases: stfu, jfgi, rtfm, newb, acronym - added by Seveas on 2006-06-17 23:26:47
[17:43] <LjL-Temp> !n00b is <alias> noob
[17:43] <ubotu> In #ubuntu-ops, LjL-Temp said: !n00b is <alias> noob
[17:44] <Seveas> !n00b is <alias> noob
[17:44] <ubotu> I'll remember that, Seveas
[17:44] <LjL-Temp> thanks
[17:44] <jussio1> hei all
[18:02] <LjL-Temp> Pici`: bad desk
[18:02] <Pici`> yes
[18:02] <LjL-Temp> ...
[18:02] <LjL-Temp> ok so unop and fabouney were talking in french in #ubuntu
[18:02] <LjL-Temp> i whined a little so unop asked the other to move to -fr
[18:02] <LjL-Temp> ... where he started to speak english
[18:03] <Myrtti> lol
[18:04] <ompaul> haha#
[18:04] <ompaul> LjL-Temp, that has to go down as a classic
[18:04] <ompaul> so funny Pici fell off the internwebz
[18:05] <LjL-Temp> kind of happened to me too with a spaniard, though
[18:07] <ompaul> LjL-Temp, so it has pedigree
[18:07] <LjL-Temp> jrib: (#ubuntu) <LjL-Temp> !fr | fabouney <unop> fabouney, allez a #ubuntu-fr, je vais la bas <fabouney> unop, ok (#ubuntu-fr) <unop> fabouney, have you installed the w32codecs ?
 themime: no, full GNOME is a part of emacs, not of vim (sorry i couldn't resist that)
[18:36] <ompaul> bad LjL :)
[18:48] <jrib> heh
[18:53] <PriceChild> Security just pulled on balaclavas, ran out into the main hall, chose a random kid, kidnapped him and took him to crew:care, fed him, then sent him back out.
[19:01] <ompaul> PriceChild, the point of that exercise?
[19:02] <PriceChild> I'm not completely sure, but it was amusing for all involved.
[19:02] <ompaul> hehe
[19:12] <jrib> why did chanserv ban the nick "jesus"?
[19:13] <Myrtti> there was pretty many trolls here yesterday
[19:13] <Myrtti> ask ompaul
[19:13] <jrib> but banning the nick is a bit wide no?
[19:13] <ubotu> In #ubuntu-offtopic, SNuxoll said: !botlag is <reply> HEY, gimme a break!  You'd slow down some too if you had to cater to the whim of a couple thousand people daily, constantly making me repeat what I just said 10 minutes ago.
[19:13] <ompaul> jrib, we had crazymethjesus
[19:13] <ompaul> jrib, and a few theres
[19:14] <ompaul> others
[19:14] <ompaul> jrib, the one useing that nick was using a biblical "real name"
[19:16] <ompaul> jrib, in a way that I found taunting
[19:16] <ompaul> jrib, as in I thought about this for days
[19:17] <ompaul> it was bugging me and I thought at the end of the day that if someone called them selves something-budda where something was not a great thing we would feel a lot better about removing them
[19:17] <jrib> people are named "jesus" as well though.  The last ban was just on "jesus".  I feel like the ban is going to catch too many innocent people
[19:18] <ompaul> jrib, and the clincher is that same with those who defile Hebrew stuff or Islam so .. on those grounds - No
[19:18] <ompaul> jrib, in 4 years on freenode I have seen several who claimed it was their real name
[19:18] <ompaul> jrib, and they were all trolls
[19:19] <ompaul> jrib, hang on
[19:19] <nalioth> ompaul: Jesus is a popular name in Middle and South America
[19:20] <ompaul> let me make one final point - the name is usual in spanish speaking perhaps countries
[19:20] <ompaul> and the one I banned on the back of was living in sweden
[19:20] <ompaul> who had "I am with you" in hebrew in their real name space but if they knew anything it should have been aramiec ;-)
 I just banned *jesus* using chanserv from #ubuntu +1 and offtopic on the grounds that some idiots think it is fun to be disrespectful to certain religions for whatever reasons - in the spirit of ubuntu that kind of thing is not to be encouraged
 examples in the last few hours in #ubuntu are as follows: jesusccs infernal_jesus Crazymethjesus   and for those who don't speak english as a first language that last one was Crazy Meth ... right so and the last one was just Jesus who appears to live in sweden if the domain name is to be believed
 lovely usernames....
 08:18 <+ompaul> I just banned *jesus* using chanserv f
 though the way it was phrased gave me a quick chuckle
 btw the last one might seem okay until you know this  they had a real name of:  Iahve
[19:22] <ompaul> jrib, I add to that that I know of no way to let in jesus and keep out the others without building one ban per troll
[19:22] <ompaul> and then it looks like they are victims
[19:24] <ompaul> jrib, I think I am right - been at this game a long time, however I am interested if you think otherwise given what I just pasted?
[19:27] <ompaul> jrib, I checked the ban and it was from a spanish isp
[19:27] <jrib> ompaul: well, the way I see it, banning on name is useless.   If they are not trolls, and instead are legitimate users, they will be confused.  If they are trolls, and they want to troll, they will just rejoin with a new name
[19:28] <ompaul> jrib, but without offending those who hold certain beliefs, that was the aim
[19:28] <ompaul> I see what your saying
[19:28]  * ompaul takes a look at the ban
[19:29] <ompaul> let me see if I can do anything sensible
[19:30] <jrib> thanks ompaul
[19:35] <ompaul> jrib, I have another version in there now
[19:35] <ompaul> I just hope it works
[19:35] <ompaul> and I am going to do a few more
[19:43] <ompaul> jrib, btw we have crazymethjesus in the channel
[19:44] <ompaul> I did not want to go head to head with the nick
[19:44] <ompaul> so they can't talk
[19:44] <ompaul> they will get bored or there will be a netsplit and they won't get back
[19:45] <ompaul> jrib, got some more gods for me to look after
[19:45] <ompaul> hehe
[19:45]  * ompaul has a few ideas himself
[19:46] <jrib> heh :)
[19:49] <ompaul> jrib, also added Yahweh and Allah
[20:51] <nikrud> wanna know what's really stupid?
[20:52] <Seveas> you?
[20:52] <nikrud> yup
[20:52] <nikrud> brain fart on which partition to install hardy to
[20:52] <Seveas> you wiped your files?
[20:53] <nikrud> just the gutsy install.
[20:53] <nikrud> I'd been switching back and forth between two partitions for installs for so long I got complacent and didn't look
[20:55] <nikrud> The stupidest thing I've done in the last 12 hours
[20:57] <ompaul> !restore | nikrud
[20:57] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about restore - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[20:57] <ompaul> !backups
[20:57] <ubotu> There are many ways to back your system up. Here's a few: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BackupYourSystem , https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DuplicityBackupHowto , https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HomeUserBackup , https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MondoMindi - See also !sbackup and !cloning
[20:57] <ompaul> who knows
[20:58] <LjL-Temp> !recover
[20:58] <ubotu> Some tools to recover lost data are listed and explained at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DataRecovery - Remember that it's tricky to recover deleted files from your journalled !filesystem, and you should keep !backups of important data.
[20:58] <nikrud> heh. It was only an os install. Takes a couple hours to rebuild. sbackup is run regularly on relevant /etc and /var files
[20:59] <LjL-Temp> !info wipe
[20:59] <ubotu> wipe (source: wipe): Secure file deletion. In component universe, is extra.


[05:29] <cpaelzer> good morning
[05:39] <microwaved_> morning ^^
[09:29] <microwaved_> anyone got some cool must happ applications on their ubuntu server i'm fiddling around with mine
[09:38] <rbasak> microwaved_: lxd. It's there by default I think. It allows you to nest Ubuntu server installs. Perfect for experiments.
[09:44] <microwaved_> rbasak: thanks!
[09:52] <neo4> what is wildcard subdomain?
[09:53] <neo4> I'm going to install on a test server wordpress mulstisite that will use wildcard subdomain
[10:24] <neo4> how to configure apache to use wildcard?
[10:24] <neo4> it should be like *.site.com
[10:24] <neo4> or whole host
[10:25] <neo4> it might for dns
[10:25] <neo4> Can we somehow turn on all dubdomain for our server?
[10:26] <neo4> that from our WP app we will able to create network
[10:26] <ikonia> what ?
[10:26] <ikonia> subdomains are nothing to do with your server
[10:34] <neo4> ikonia: see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildcard_DNS_record
[10:35] <neo4> nothing do, there might apache should accept *.site.com and DNS redirect to all domains *.site.com to my server
[10:35] <ikonia> so you're asking can apache handle wildcards ?
[10:35] <neo4> in wordpress exists 'multisite network' it's when we install one copy of wordpress and can create multiple sites with naem site1.example.com site2.example.com
[10:36] <ikonia> I know what multisite is
[10:36] <ikonia> but you're not really asking a question
[10:36] <blackflow> he's asknig a bunch of loosely related things all in one sentence. dns, apache and now WP.
[10:36] <neo4> ikonia: both, I'm going install this set up on test server
[10:36] <ikonia> both what ?
[10:36] <blackflow> neo4: perhaps slow down and start from the actual problem you want to solve, ignoring whether it's dns, apache or WP.
[10:36] <neo4> ikonia: both customization DNS server and apache
[10:37] <ikonia> what about it ?
[10:37] <neo4> blackflow: actual problem it's make a test server for wp plugins and themes using wp multisite installation
[10:37] <ikonia> ok - so follow the multisite install guide
[10:37] <ikonia> it calls out the DNS and webserver setup
[10:38] <ikonia> it actually walks you through this is the setup and preq section
[10:38] <neo4>  ok
[10:38] <ikonia> do you actually ever read the docs on the products/setups you're trying to do ?
[10:38] <neo4> ikonia: you seems not to have heard abut wildcard for DNS or Apache?
[10:39] <neo4> exists a few kinds of wildcards
[10:39] <ikonia> yes, I have
[10:39] <ikonia> as I've just said I have, and I've just said I know what multicard is
[10:39] <neo4> I too
[10:39] <ikonia> no, there is one kind of wildcard - a wildcard
[10:39] <neo4> ikonia: ok,
[10:39] <ikonia> there are multiple technologies that can/cannot use wildcards
[10:39] <neo4> I haven't
[10:39] <ikonia> you haven't what ?
[10:39] <neo4> haven't heard
[10:40] <ikonia> ok - so read the documentation then
[10:40] <neo4> i thought there existed special app that automatically add records to dns and creates virtual hosts :)
[10:40] <neo4> ok
[10:40] <neo4> this theme worth learning
[10:41] <ikonia> a special app ??
[10:41] <ikonia> to be honest, you're spam server technology stack is getting a bit old
[10:41] <ikonia> ubuntu-server is not here to help you with this
[10:43] <neo4> ikonia: It was delusion
[10:43] <ikonia> ?
[10:43] <neo4> about how it works
[10:43] <neo4> it doesn't use app
[10:43] <ikonia> no, it won't use an app
[10:43] <neo4> passed, will read docs
[10:43] <ikonia> as most people don't host apache/dns/email/webmail on one server
[10:43] <ikonia> so that would require complex API calls to multiple infrastrcture components
[10:44] <neo4> yes, and if you don't know server it looks like it uses app
[10:44] <ikonia> which isn't realistic for an app like wordpress to deal with
[10:44] <ikonia> nothing looks like it uses an app to do that
[10:44] <blackflow> ikonia: (we do, but each is jailed and isolated :)   )
[10:44] <neo4> ikonia: ok
[10:44] <ikonia> blackflow: I'll cut that some slack then ;)
[10:45] <blackflow> neo4: sounds like you really want to purchase a hosted centos/cPanel service and use cPanel. That is "an app" that integrates all that and does dns + virtualhost + a lot more, automatically.
[10:45] <blackflow> if not, you'll have to write your own integration.
[10:46] <neo4> blackflow: no, this is for people who badly know inside server but I am supposed to be a powerful linux user :)
[10:47] <neo4> )))
[10:47] <ikonia> then you are a liar
[10:47] <blackflow> then you'll have to learn it yourself, which kind of excludes looking for "an app" that does that automatically.
[10:47] <neo4> blackflow: I want to create wp plugin for codecanion that will deploy on server a wildcard multisite wp installation
[10:48] <blackflow> neo4: I don't know what codecanion is, but sure, writing a WP plugin that integrates with DNS and Apache (re)configuration is of course doable.
[10:48] <neo4> user install usual wordpress, then run my activate my plugin and run will get server and wp prepared for put there demo plugins and tests, left only put record to DNS server
[10:49] <neo4> blackflow: it's big market
[10:49] <ikonia> do you understand how silly that sounds
[10:49] <ikonia> you want to create a plugin that will deploy codecanion
[10:49] <ikonia> he means codecanyon
[10:50] <blackflow> ah I see.
[10:50] <ikonia> neo4: you understand hoiw infrastructure works......
[10:50] <ikonia> "you install wordpress, install my plugin and it will configure wordpress for you"
[10:50] <neo4> ikonia: which infrastracture?
[10:50] <ikonia> for your plugin to work - you'd need wordpress installed and configured
[10:50] <ikonia> so you're building a plugin to configure the dependency of the plugin actually working
[10:51] <blackflow> unless there's some base WP installation that bootstraps other WP installations.
[10:51] <ikonia> the wordpress default installer does it
[10:51] <blackflow> but that sounds extremely advanced for somoene asking these questions.
[10:51] <blackflow> well if I understand it correctly, this plugin should also integrate with DNS and Apache reconfig?
[10:52] <ikonia> but apache will already need to be setup - or you can't install wordpress, which means you can't install the plugin
[10:52] <ikonia> and dns will alrady need to be setup if you wish to access your blog via a friendly name
[10:52] <ikonia> rather than IP
[10:53] <ikonia> hence "do you understand how infrastructure works"
[10:53] <neo4> blackflow: only server, there will on plugin a tip for user how  to set up DNS for using wildcard
[10:53] <blackflow> yeah, but what I mean is, you have already a WP setup (with apache and whole infra), and then a plugin that deploys new WP installations, and changes apache and DNS for those new multisite installations.   Basically, replicate what cpanel does in a way :)
[10:53] <ikonia> neo4: how to setup wildcard dns will depend on the dns provider, and it's well documented already
[10:53] <ikonia> so you're plugin to provide a tip is pointless
[10:54] <ikonia> I suggest you take this to the wordpress channel and ask how useful this is
[10:54] <ikonia> and take a flameproof hat
[10:54] <blackflow> heh, yeah.
[10:54] <neo4> ikonia: apache have been set up already, Plugin will only configure and user have to put 755 right on shell script before run wp plugin, I think it will allow wp plugin to access /etc folder
[10:54] <ikonia> errr no
[10:55] <blackflow> eh no.... nononononon. don't do that
[10:55] <ikonia> wordpress doens't touch etc
[10:55] <ikonia> neo4: basically "stop what you are doing"
[10:55] <ikonia> and you don't change the permissions
[10:55] <neo4> ikonia: for DNS looks like standard *.example.com.   3600 IN  MX 10 host1.example.com.
[10:55] <ikonia> neo4: that's just an MX record, that's not how DNS servers work
[10:55] <ikonia> neo4: basically - you don't understand what you are trying to do, stop doing it
[10:56] <neo4> ikonia: no, I'm going to do this plugin and sell it users
[10:56] <neo4> on codecanion many sellers who need test server
[10:56] <ikonia> ok - good luck with that
[10:56] <ikonia> this channel is not here to help you with that, so please don't ask for help
[10:57] <neo4> ok
[10:57] <neo4> I'll ask if have some troubleshooting
[10:57] <ikonia> no
[10:57] <ikonia> do not ask
[10:58] <ikonia> this channel is not here to help you build comercial software that could put people at risk
[11:00] <neo4> I'll ask about software for myself )
[11:00] <ikonia> no
[11:00] <ikonia> you're done here
[11:00] <ikonia> we helped you with your spam mail server
[11:00] <ikonia> we've helped you with various other problems
[11:00] <ikonia> you're now asking for help building comercial software that you don't understand - this is not this channels purpose
[11:00] <neo4> ikonia: and you'll continue to help me with others things
[11:01] <neo4> thanks )
[11:01] <ikonia> word with the channels that provide and support the software stack you need
[11:01] <ikonia> neo4: no, not in this channel
[11:01] <neo4> I appreciated yours input
[11:01] <neo4> ikonia: nothing bad, people have to help others, I don't thing it something bad if you helped me
[11:01] <ikonia> no
[11:01] <neo4> ikonia: yes, people require to help others
[11:02] <neo4> it's human needs
[11:02] <ikonia> they do
[11:02] <ikonia> I agree
[11:02] <ikonia> try the others such as #wordpress
[11:02] <ikonia> this channel is not for your help needs though
[11:02] <ikonia> ##php etc
[11:02] <neo4> and I don't force anybody to help me,..
[11:02] <ikonia> no, but I'm telling you to no longer ask for help on your projects
[11:02] <neo4> ask and you get help, read bible
[11:02] <ikonia> your projects are nothing to do with ubuntu
[11:02] <ikonia> this is not a christian channel, and has nothing to do with the bible
[11:03] <neo4> ikonia: I'll run my projects using ubuntu
[11:03] <ikonia> yes, but they are nothing to do with ubuntu support
[11:03] <ikonia> hence please no longer ask
[11:03] <neo4> ikonia: ok, I understood, stop it, If I have trouble I'll ask
[11:03] <ikonia> what part of "do not ask" am I not making clear
[11:04] <neo4> ikonia: and what do you offer me to do?
[11:04] <ikonia> use the channels that support the software stack/engineering you want to do
[11:04] <neo4> ikonia: it means you offered me to leave a channel?
[11:04] <neo4> I dont' understand
[11:04] <ikonia>  you're welcome to stay, just don't ask people for help on your projects
[11:04] <neo4> about shall I ask?
[11:05] <ikonia> sorry I don't understand
[11:05] <neo4> all questions relate to ubuntu server I'll ask here
[11:05] <ikonia> not in reference to your development projects
[11:05] <neo4> what about shall I ask?
[11:05] <neo4> ok
[11:05] <neo4> I won't mention  for why I need it
[11:06] <ikonia> no, that wasn't what I said
[11:06] <ikonia> hiding your needs will not be tollerated any more either
[11:06] <neo4> it isn't my development project, it was just what we can do using whildcard possibilities. I don't have such project
[11:07] <ikonia> you just said you are doing this to build commercial plugin to make money
[11:07] <neo4> ikonia: if I won't say about my needs it will looks like proper question, silence is gold
[11:08] <ikonia> that attitude will not be acceptable
[11:08] <ikonia> as I've already said
[11:08] <ikonia> look - either comply with what I've said, you'll be remove from teh chanbnel
[11:08] <ikonia> you got removed from #ubuntu for ignoring the rules and requests to change your behaviour
[11:08] <ikonia> there is nothing different about this channel
[11:08] <ikonia> no more discussion on it please
[11:08] <neo4> ikonia: say is one, but done thing is others. You can say much but in actually will have done nothing
[11:08] <ikonia> I have no idea what your last sentence meant, sorry
[11:08] <neo4> people do this frequently, empty words around
[11:09] <neo4> ikonia: this saying
[11:09] <ikonia> I'm sorry, I honestly don't understand what you are trying to say
[11:09] <blackflow> neo4: except some can kickban if you cross the line ;)
[11:10] <neo4> ikonia: fast tales is said but not fast bussness is being doing
[11:10] <ikonia> again, I don't know what that means
[11:10] <ikonia> sorry
[11:10] <neo4> :(
[11:13] <neo4> blackflow: it doesn't matter, I've banned on #ubuntu and #wordpress and today I went to #wordpress and asking there. If I need some channel I can reach it...
[11:13] <neo4> :)
[11:13] <neo4> on #wordpress they kicks me by default
[11:13] <blackflow> neo4: sure but think why are people telling you all these things. is there a reason.
[11:14] <blackflow> think hard. You want to write commercial software that someone will PAY for, but you have ZERO experience in things that software would have to do, and very little knowledge.
[11:14] <neo4> blackflow: because deviate from topicks
[11:14] <blackflow> Please explain to me, how is that NOT scamming people?
[11:14] <blackflow> Like, buying a car only to find out it was put together by people who never built cars, and of course it breaks down.
[11:14] <blackflow> Woudln't you want to find the seller and demand your money back?
[11:15] <neo4> and #wordpress was first my irc channel, I hardly speak there and strong violate rules, put there links from youtube and speak in very familiar way.... )))
[11:15] <blackflow> do you want to be called a scammer? a spammer? a criminal?
[11:16] <neo4> blackflow: it's world, might buyer wanted to save money and buy cheaper thing, etc... greedy guy always pay twice
[11:16] <ikonia> no
[11:16] <ikonia> enough, this is nothign to do with ubuntu-server
[11:16] <ikonia> neo4: you've been told what is expected of you, you've been told the consiquences
[11:16] <blackflow> indeedy.
[11:16] <ikonia> it's up to you what you do
[11:16] <neo4> blackflow: yes, it's market
[11:17] <blackflow> I meant this is offtopic for the channel :)   as for the market, no you will become a scammer and a thief and people will want you to return their money.
[11:18] <neo4> blackflow: no, it isn't scam this is the silly of them to buy cheap things and not trusted expensive brands and nothing else
[11:19] <ikonia> neo4: final warning - please stop now
[11:19] <neo4> ok
[11:56] <lordievader> Good afternoon
[12:02] <microwaved_> anyone ever heard about flockport
[14:03] <coreycb> jamespage: do you mind if I update gnocchi-api and gnocchi-common to default to py2 and have py3 as an alternative?
[14:04] <jamespage> coreycb: that feels like a step backwards? I think some of the dependencies only ship py3 pkgs...
[14:05] <coreycb> jamespage: that might be true for gnocchi. i'm planning to make everything else py2 default and py3 as alternative for now and then do a full switch to py3 all at once when all projects are ready.
[14:05] <coreycb> jamespage: mainly due to issues with all-in-one installs
[14:05] <jamespage> coreycb: ok
[14:05] <jamespage> i'd not bother to much with gnocchi for now
[14:05] <coreycb> ok
[14:06] <jamespage> coreycb: I'm working on the ceph mimic release for cosmic btw
[14:06] <jamespage> trying to get the parallel build target up for lp buildd's
[14:06] <jamespage> might be able to use 4 - we'll see
[14:07] <coreycb> jamespage: ok cool
[14:46] <geoffmcc> Im running Ubuntu 18.04 and today I noticed I have a debian-tor group. I don't recall seeing it there before, but it may have been there. Im also pretty sure I never seen it on other versions before. All I have been able to figure out is that tor does not seem to be installed, but I cant find any documentation as to if that is now a default group.
[14:52] <rbasak> geoffmcc: it doesn't look present by default on a Bionic image.
[14:54] <rbasak> geoffmcc: looks like it gets created dynamically when you install the tor package.
[14:54] <geoffmcc> rbasak: hmm.. weird. I wonder if an update pulled in something that somehow required it, but not tor
[14:55] <rbasak> Nothing that I can see.
[14:56] <geoffmcc> rbasak: okay thanks for looking
[16:25] <geoffmcc> rbasak: debian-tor must be a default group on Bionic. I did a fresh install, checked and there it was again.
[16:44] <rbasak> geoffmcc: which installer are you using?
[16:45] <geoffmcc> rbasak: I just burned the latest image and i got that new installer, forget what its called.
[16:46] <rbasak> debian-tor isn't present if I boot a KVM or lxd Bionic image (using official images). It could be an artifact of the installer though. You mean subquity?
[16:46] <rbasak> subiquity
[16:46] <nacc> and my ubuntu desktop that was a fresh install of 18.04 just before release does not have it either
[16:47] <geoffmcc> rbasak: yes, subiquity.
[16:48] <rbasak> smoser: ^
[16:48] <rbasak> I don't understand why this would be happening.
[16:48] <rbasak> The user-setup udeb looks like it defaults to adding users to debian-tor, but won't if the gruop doesn't exist.
[16:48] <rbasak> I've not confirmed this though.
[16:48] <rbasak> Is subiquity perhaps creating the group if it doesn't exist?
[16:52] <smoser> rbasak: i do not think that subiquity is doing anything with tor
[16:53] <rbasak> smoser: geoffmcc's report above is that a fresh install of Bionic using subiquity results in a debian-tor group created
[16:53] <geoffmcc> rbasak: smoser: fresh install - $groups geoff adm cdrom sudo dip plugdev lxd lpadmin sambashare debian-tor libvirtd
[16:54] <smoser> hm..
[16:54] <geoffmcc> smoser: as far as i can tell, tor is not installed
[17:22] <powersj> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/zCcBFCJw2C/
[17:22] <powersj> confirmed the debian-tor group is there on latest bionic daily-live iso :\
[17:24] <nacc> powersj: what about the non-live one?
[17:26] <powersj> I created LP: #1775228 and will check d-i now
[17:43] <rbasak> powersj: thanks!
[19:29] <nacc> rbasak: are you still around?
[20:19] <axisys> anyone successfully made sssd working on ubuntu 14.04.. I am getting much success... exact same sssd.conf works on 5 centos 7 I tried
[20:20] <axisys> I am *not* getting much success
[20:20] <axisys> checked with #sssd team and so far no success there either
[20:20] <axisys> ldapsearch works fine ..
[20:26] <granjero> hi, trying to follow this guide to install SQL driver for php but i got an error on the second line. the echo "extension....
[20:26] <granjero> https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/developer-get-started/php/ubuntu/step/2.html
[20:27] <sarnold> sudo and echo don't usually mix
[20:27] <sarnold> whoever wrote this probably adapted instructions from elsewhere without testing
[20:28] <sarnold> (well, sudo and echo work perfectly, as designed, etc., but people expect them to do something other than they do ;)
[20:28] <sarnold> instead of prefixing every command with sudo, run sudo -s once, and then run the commands without 'sudo'
[20:29] <granjero> let me try
[20:30] <granjero> sort of worked
[20:30] <granjero> got a wanrnig
[21:54] <thedac> roaksoax: That seems to have fixed things. I am running a full OpenStack deploy now.
[21:55] <roaksoax> thedac: cool


[03:17]  * skellat is going dark on IRC for now since he has a music festival to help run this weekend and can be best reached at<EMAIL_ADDRESS>in the interim
[09:00] <Noskcaj> There's been some talk of Lubuntu software center being an active project again. It can be re-named light software center if we're willing to use it
[09:06] <ochosi> Noskcaj: have you tested it yet? last time i tried it really wasn't ready yet
[09:12] <Noskcaj> ochosi, I've not tested it yet. It purely talk at this stage. mh0 said he wanted to take over the project, and there's another guy whose made some fixes before who might help. I'll try and fix up some debian/ things too
[09:12] <Noskcaj> i think Unit193 knows more than i do on this
[09:12] <ochosi> alrighty
[09:13] <Unit193> But everyones been ignoring me on the subject...
[09:13] <Noskcaj> Then speak again, now
[09:16] <Unit193> I'll get right on that.
[17:50] <Unit193> knome: POKE, http://xubuntu.org/getxubuntu/ .3 was released.
[21:27] <knome> Unit193, yeah, i'm on it
[21:28] <knome> done