[04:18] <lamont> dieman: you here?
[04:43] <dieman> yeah
[04:43] <dieman> lamont: poke
[04:44] <lamont> dieman: trying to remember if I asked if you were ppc or i386
[04:44] <dieman> im i386
[04:44] <dieman> by far
[04:44] <lamont> ok
[04:44] <dieman> i dont even think i have a ppc box in the house
[04:44] <dieman> i do have m68k tho :)
[04:44] <dieman> (and hppa)
[04:45] <dieman> oh shit
[04:45] <dieman> i do have a ppc box
[04:45] <dieman> my tivo
[04:47] <dieman> Linux (none) 2.1.24-TiVo-2.5 #8 Wed May 8 15:38:27 PDT 2002 ppc unknown
[04:47] <dieman> 2.1, ow.
[04:47] <dieman> thats somewhere beyond painful
[04:49] <mjg59> Oh, wow
[04:49] <mjg59> I remember 2.1.24
[04:49] <mjg59> We had a pile of Macs running it
[04:59] <lamont> dieman: tivo series 1, eh?
[04:59] <lamont> my tivo is mips
[04:59] <lamont> dieman: remember to firewall the tivo, eh?
[05:20] <dieman> lamont: yeah, series 1
[05:20] <dieman> 2 drives
[05:21] <dieman> with a cachecard
[05:21] <dieman> yay cachecard!
[05:21] <lamont> required some small mods to do that...
[05:21] <dieman> yeah
[05:21] <dieman> i 'only' have a 30gb and a 40gb
[05:22] <dieman> im fairly surprised at how nice these 'newer style' part 15 fm transmitters are.
[05:22] <dieman> the fm radio injector things
[05:22] <dieman> im using one while i clean my room so i can listen in to net radio
[05:22] <dieman> wife is sleeping, so i have to be quiet
[10:27] <rburton> morning all
[10:27] <Oskuro> morning
[10:35] <sabdfl> hi  everyone
[10:36] <Mithrandir> hi sabdfl
[10:38] <mako> sabdfl, Oskuro, Mithrandir, rburton: good morning!
[10:38] <fabbione> hi guys
[10:38] <mako> ciao fabbione
[10:38] <rburton> morning!
[11:16] <rburton> can i suggest gaiksaurus for the default install?
[11:20] <fabbione> hey ik5pvx !
[11:20] <ik5pvx> hello
[12:44] <Kamion> thom: your sudoers hack in base-config doesn't work; sudo is part of Base so /etc/sudoers has already been created by the time base-config runs
[12:45] <Kamion> fabbione: am I supposed to get a question about the modes I want to be available during xserver-xfree86 ubuntu7's postinst?
[12:58] <fabbione> Kamion: it depends which version of xresprobe you are using, and in any case it is possible if it fails
[12:59] <fabbione> Kamion: it is done in postinst because we need the server unpacked
[12:59] <Kamion> sure, I don't mind that
[01:01] <cef> heya bdale
[01:01] <fabbione> Kamion: just check that you will get xresprobe 0.2-2
[01:01] <fabbione> because -1 was broken
[01:02] <Kamion> 20040822/warty-i386-1.list:/pool/main/x/xresprobe/xresprobe_0.2-0ubuntu1_i386.deb
[01:02] <Kamion> 20040823/warty-i386-1.list:/pool/main/x/xresprobe/xresprobe_0.2-0ubuntu2_i386.deb
[01:02] <Kamion> installing now, we'll see how it goes
[01:02] <fabbione> ok
[01:04] <sabdfl> kamion: the trashcan applet isn't showing on auckland, any idea why?
[01:05] <Kamion> sabdfl: it doesn't seem to have been built yet; the source is there but no .debs
[01:05] <sabdfl> ok, tnx
[01:05] <seb128> [   ]  trashapplet_0.2-0ubuntu2_i386.deb
[01:05] <Kamion> sabdfl: this is the case for openssh -9 too, so I'm wondering if lamont's hilltop is down or something
[01:05] <seb128> I see the deb here ..
[01:05] <Kamion> uh, let me go update little
[01:06] <Kamion> (my comments as of the state of the archive at the last CD build ...)
[01:07] <Kamion> ah, yes, it's there now
[01:18] <fabbione> re
[01:36] <Kamion> fabbione: ok, so xresprobe still fails here
[01:36] <Kamion> ddcprobe output ends with 'edidfail'
[01:36] <fabbione> Kamion: ok. than we can't probe your box
[01:36] <fabbione> and it is normal that it asks the question
[01:36] <Kamion> oh, it's a VIA chipset
[01:36] <Kamion> that explains it
[01:36] <fabbione> is that a laptop?
[01:36] <fabbione> oh yes
[01:36] <fabbione> via is banned from autoprobing
[01:37] <Kamion> yes, it's the Averatec AMD Athlon XP that was at the conference
[01:37] <fabbione> the via chipset we were testing was hardfreezing the entire machine
[01:37] <fabbione> ok
[01:39] <fabbione> rburton: you around?
[01:40] <rburton> yeah
[01:40] <fabbione> do you feel lucky today?
[01:40] <rburton> heh
[01:40] <rburton> why not
[01:40] <fabbione> ehehe cool
[01:40] <Kamion> good, panel much happier now
[01:40] <fabbione> apt-get --purge remove xserver-xfree86
[01:40] <fabbione> apt-get install discover1 xresprobe mdetect laptop-detect
[01:40] <fabbione> apt-get install xserver-xfree86
[01:40] <fabbione> just be sure that X removes its config file
[01:41] <fabbione> i am curious to see if it will detect your hardware correctly
[01:41] <rburton> ok
[01:41] <rburton> bbiab :)
[01:46] <lamont> Kamion: Aug 23 11:52:25 buildd-mail: openssh has been installed; removing from upload dir:
[01:46] <lamont> that's a london time
[01:47] <seb128> hey lamont
[01:47] <seb128> lamont: gst-plugins0.8 is still not built, could you check if it's ftbfsing ?
[01:48] <fabbione> hey lamont
[01:48] <lamont> libs/gst-plugins0.8_0.8.3-1: Dep-Wait by buildd+rockhopper [optional:out-of-date]
[01:48] <lamont>   Dependencies: libtheora-dev
[01:48] <lamont> morning fabbione
[01:48] <fabbione> libtheora-dev is missing in the archive
[01:48] <seb128> lamont: oh ok, thanks
[01:50] <rburton> weird
[01:50] <rburton> it only asked what resolutions i wanted to use, but 1280x1024 (the native res for my lcd) wasn't in the list
[01:50] <seb128> what ?
[01:51] <rburton> fabbione: done
[01:51] <fabbione> rburton: are you on a laptop?
[01:51] <Oskuro> ok, starting my first ubuntu install
[01:51] <rburton> fabbione: no, desktop with iiyama lcd
[01:51] <fabbione> rburton: chipset?
[01:51] <Oskuro> I think I've got one of those evil machines that break Debian installer badly.
[01:51] <rburton> toggle 1280x1024 and X started fine
[01:51] <rburton> fabbione: nVidia Corporation NV18
[01:51] <Oskuro> Does this belong in #ubunto or #warthogs?
[01:51] <rburton> (geforce4 mx)
[01:51] <fabbione> can you run xresprobe?
[01:52] <fabbione> it should print out 2 lines
[01:52] <rburton> fabbione: in X or from a console?
[01:52] <rburton> and should i kill X before running it
[01:52] <fabbione> rburton: it doesn't matter
[01:52] <rburton> ok
[01:52] <fabbione> it should work with or without X
[01:52] <rburton> $ /usr/sbin/xresprobe nv lcd
[01:52] <rburton> id: Generic Monitor (non-DDC)
[01:52] <rburton> res:
[01:53] <fabbione> which version of xresprobe do you have?
[01:53] <rburton> 0.2-0ubuntu2
[01:53] <fabbione> ok...
[01:53] <fabbione> if you can...
[01:53] <fabbione> exits from X and run:
[01:53] <fabbione> xresprobe nv lcd
[01:53] <rburton> mouse acceleration is much higher than it was before i restarted btw
[01:53] <fabbione> and tell me if it prints something sane
[01:53] <rburton> like, really fast.
[01:53] <rburton> ok, bbiab
[01:58] <rburton> fabbione: no change
[01:59] <rburton> ddcprobe returns edidfail
[01:59] <fabbione> ok thanks
[01:59] <fabbione> i guess we can't probe everything
[01:59] <rburton> these monitors support "ddc 2b" apparently
[02:00] <lamont> Kamion: hilltop has been happy all night
[02:00] <fabbione> rburton: well when ddcprobe will support them, we will too :-)
[02:00] <rburton> heh
[02:01] <rburton> fabbione: any idea why my mouse is way faster?
[02:01] <fabbione> rburton: perhaps because we are using /dev/input/mice as default
[02:01] <fabbione> it didn't change on my machine (installed this morning)
[02:02] <rburton> maybe i can blame seb128
[02:02] <seb128> hum
[02:03] <rburton> the mouse speed setting in gnome is, like, not working
[02:03] <seb128> I've not changed anything on this afaik
[02:10] <rburton> better
[02:56] <sabdfl> anybody else stuck with upgrades to aspell-bin, gnome-games, libglademm, libgtksourceview, yelp and libapache-mod-auth-xxx that won't complete?
[03:00] <Mithrandir> libgail-gnome- python2.3-gnome and libzvt2.0-0 seems to be a bit stuck here
[03:18] <SteveA> hi
[03:19] <SteveA> I'm using ubuntu linux, and I can't get "compose" working in x
[03:19] <SteveA> any hints?
[03:23] <fabbione> SteveA: known bug. check bugs.debian.org/src:xfree86
[03:23] <fabbione> i can't remember the exact number but it should be one of the first
[03:34] <sabdfl> could the failed-upgrades stuff be related to the new apt?
[04:08] <sabdfl> anybody else seeing fb corruption during boot?
[04:08] <sabdfl> gdm / x are coming up fine but my console is b0rked
[04:09] <fabbione> sabdfl: which video card?
[04:10] <sabdfl> ati 9800xp
[04:10] <sabdfl> seb128: right click on the desktop is not working for me
[04:10] <fabbione> isn't the one on the packard bell?
[04:10] <sabdfl> fabbione: no, it's my home desktop
[04:11] <seb128> sabdfl: nautilus manages the desktop ? the icons are displayed ? opening a dir on the desktop works ?
[04:12] <fabbione> sabdfl: i remember fb broken on that laptop and iirc it was an ati too. perhaps it's just the kernel fb driver that is broken. we should give it a shot after we sync 2.6.8
[04:12] <sabdfl> nothing is displayed, currently
[04:13] <seb128>  ps ax | grep nautilus
[04:14] <sabdfl> seb128: nothing
[04:14] <seb128> $ gconftool-2 -g /apps/nautilus/preferences/show_desktop ?
[04:14] <sabdfl> true
[04:15] <seb128> if you start nautilus from a gnome-terminal, any error ?
[04:15] <sabdfl> ah. nautilus is... not installed
[04:15] <seb128> ok
[04:16] <seb128> that doesn't help to get a desktop managed by nautilus :)
[04:16] <sabdfl> must have been an automatic installation previously, dropped by aptitude when it wasn't needed for an older package
[04:17] <seb128> perhaps yes
[04:18] <sabdfl> ok, working nicely now
[04:18] <sabdfl> thanks
[04:18] <sabdfl> btw this trash applet is excellent
[04:19] <rburton> trash applet?
[04:20] <seb128> apt-get install trashapplet
[04:20] <seb128> a trash can on the panel, you can DND your files here
[04:21] <seb128> you can also open the trash with a click, or empty it, or see how many files are in
[04:24] <mdz> sabdfl: what does the fb corruption look like?
[04:27] <sabdfl> mdz: lots of dots and squggles, text is partly readable
[04:27] <sabdfl> it gets worse the more gets written to the screen
[04:27] <sabdfl> mdz: also, apt seems unable to complete the install on several packages at the moment
[04:30] <mdz> sabdfl: which packages?
[04:32] <sabdfl> gnome-games
[04:38] <sabdfl> libapache-modu-auth-(plain | sys-group )
[04:38] <sabdfl> aspell-bin
[04:38] <sabdfl> yelp
[04:38] <sabdfl> libglademm2.0
[04:38] <sabdfl> libgtksourceview1.0-0
[04:38] <sabdfl> mdz: ^^^
[04:38] <mdz> ok
[04:39] <npmccallum> Kamion: we need to make sure that cdroms (and other removable media) do not end up in fstab
[04:40] <mdz> Kamion: setuid /bin/mount is going to be disabled in favour of pmount, which doesn't require entries in fstab
[04:40] <npmccallum> Kamion: all removable media needs to be handled by pmount, which will refuse to mount anything in fstab (for good reason)
[04:40] <Kamion> hm, ok
[04:40] <Kamion> can somebody create a partman-target component so I can actually put that bug in the right place?
[04:41] <Kamion> or even just partman
[04:42] <thom> npmccallum: you pinged the other day? (i only just got to a computer since friday)
[04:42] <mdz> Kamion: done
[04:43] <npmccallum> thom: I pinged a few minutes ago
[04:43] <npmccallum> thom: did you make a usplash package?
[04:44] <thom> nope; totally flaked out the last couple of days, sorry
[04:45] <npmccallum> rburton: a wrapper around mount that handles mounting and umounting of removable devices
[04:45] <rburton> why that over mount?
[04:46] <npmccallum> basically we're creating a policy which says: system devices use fstab, non system devices (less security) should be dynamically allocated a mountpoint
[04:46] <mdz> it uses a flexible policy mechanism, rather than relying on static entries in fstab
[04:46] <mdz> and therefore works nicely with hot-pluggable devices as well
[04:47] <npmccallum> its better than the redhat idea of dynamically modifying fstab (also forcing hal to run as root)
[04:47] <rburton> nice
[04:48] <npmccallum> thom: its ok
[04:56] <mdz> any opinions on smartmontools?
[05:03] <Kamion> npmccallum: presumably I should make the same quietinit->splash change in yaboot-installer?
[05:03] <mdz> A South African skydiver survived a 3,500 meter (11,500 ft) plunge after her parachute failed to open and lines broke on her reserve chute, a local skydiving club said Monday.
[05:03] <mdz> sabdfl: they build 'em sturdy down there, apparently
[05:03] <thom> yow
[05:04] <Kamion> thom: did you see my comment about base-config/sudoers?
[05:04] <thom> mdz: turns out starting acpid in rcS causes problems
[05:04] <thom> Kamion: yes
[05:04] <rburton> "she was reported to have bounced 15 times down the main road"
[05:04] <mdz> thom: what sort of problems?
[05:06] <thom> mdz: we start it before /var gets cleaned. so the socket goes away
[05:06] <mdz> ah
[05:07] <thom> and you don't need the daemon anyway, so i think munging the relevant modules into the initrd and then starting the saemon in rc2 again might be a better option
[05:08] <mdz> I agree
[05:09] <mdz> hopefully there don't exist machines where loading those modules hangs the system
[05:09] <mdz> that'd be rather inconvenient
[05:10] <npmccallum> Kamion: yes
[05:10] <thom> it'd be unfortunate
[05:10] <Kamion> npmccallum: done
[05:11] <Kamion> npmccallum: (was the actual option change in sysvinit, or somewhere else?)
[05:11] <npmccallum> Kamion: sysvinit
[05:11] <thom> mdz: are you happy for me to upload sulogin, by the way?
[05:12] <npmccallum> Kamion: usplash will also check for it and not display if it isn't there
[05:12] <Kamion> right, so still waiting for that part of the change then
[05:12] <npmccallum> Kamion: sysvinit is already changed (at least the package is uploaded)
[05:12] <Kamion> hm, it's not on little
[05:12] <npmccallum> strange
[05:13] <Kamion> nor warty-changes
[05:13] <npmccallum> yeah, I just checked
[05:13] <npmccallum> should I upload again?
[05:13] <Kamion> were there new packages or anything?
[05:13] <npmccallum> no
[05:13] <npmccallum> just a string change
[05:14] <mdz> this was just aa short time ago; it might still be in the queue
[05:14] <mdz> thom: yes
[05:14] <Kamion> there doesn't seem to be a sysvinit*.upload file in chinstrap:~npmccallum/UploadQueue/, so maybe it's still waiting
[05:14] <Kamion> (how do you run that queue, btw?)
[05:14] <npmccallum> dput
[05:15] <npmccallum> by hand
[05:15] <npmccallum> I intend to script it later
[05:15] <Kamion> ah, ok :)
[05:15] <npmccallum> yeah, sysvinit is the only one that doesn't have .upload
[05:20] <npmccallum> mdz: should I try to upload again since I got no .upload file?
[05:20] <mdz> npmccallum: sure; if there's no .upload, it either got deleted, or it was never uploaded
[05:41] <mdz> sabdfl: those packages seem to install fine for me here
[05:41] <mdz> with current warty
[05:42] <mdz> Mithrandir: how is amd64 looking?
[05:49] <sabdfl> mdz: over here they install fine, but then apt wants to install them again
[05:50] <sabdfl> and then they install fine, but apt just wants to install them again
[05:50] <sabdfl> rinse and repeat
[05:50] <mdz> that typically means that apt is seeing multiple packages with the same version number which are actually distinct
[05:50] <mdz> or else a broken pinning configuration
[05:51] <mdz> anything funny in /etc/apt/sources.list or /etc/apt/preferences?
[05:52] <Keybuk> mdz: there's something definitely screwy with the archive
[05:52] <Keybuk> we're all seeing it for different packages
[05:52] <mdz> hmm
[05:52] <mdz> I don't see it on a fresh debootstrap
[05:52] <sabdfl> in apt/sources.list I have another archive which has an ati binary driver in it
[05:52] <sabdfl> but it doesn't also have any of the b0rked packages
[05:53] <sabdfl> and in /etc/apt/preferences I have some bits that relate to when we had no unstable, so I had some pinning going on
[05:53] <sabdfl> I could remove the /etc/apt/preferences and the extra archive from sources.list with pleasure
[05:55] <sabdfl> hmm... no change
[06:06] <Oskuro> definitely, the kernel in warty-sounders-6 is fucked for my test machine.
[06:06] <Oskuro> I've had to hack around my way through the install to get the cdrom detected.
[06:07] <Oskuro> I suspect this is the case with normal d-i too, so I wonder if you guys want a bugzilla report, or should I just go to debian-boot@ directly?
[06:31] <Mithrandir> mdz: I see the same problem as everybody's seeing; wrt amd64, I've been spending most of the day sleeping and recovering from Oxford.
[06:32] <Mithrandir> mdz: I need to whack ia32-libs into shape (and preferably amd64-libs too) and then get the new gcc in together with doko.
[06:33] <mdz> it might be fallout from the flush/rebuild during wartyconf
[06:33] <mdz> maybe try apt-get clean?
[06:33] <doko> are the 3.3/3.4 uploads in warty, or are they rejected?
[06:35] <Mithrandir> mdz: I can try.
[06:41] <Mithrandir> doko: you've already uploaded the biarch ones?
[06:41] <Mithrandir> mdz: that seemed to fix it, thx
[06:51] <mdz> sabdfl: try apt-get clean?
[06:53] <lamont> doko: gcc-3.3_1:3.3.4-9ubuntu1??
[06:53] <lamont> that was ftbfs on ppc/amd64
[06:53] <sabdfl> mdz: that fixed it, thanks
[06:54] <sabdfl> i wonder if that will happen to upgraders from woody?
[06:54] <Mithrandir> lamont: why?
[06:56] <lamont> sabdfl: any package that we're shipping the same version as woody, which is already in your cache, will have issues.... :-(
[06:56] <lamont> since we rebuilt from source all of the source packages
[06:56] <sabdfl> ok closer to release time we can do the analysis and bump versions if we have to
[06:56] <sabdfl> sarge is likely to be a much bigger problem then
[06:57] <lamont> Mithrandir: /usr/bin/ld: skipping incompatible /usr/lib/gcc-lib/x86_64-linux/3.3.4/../../../libc.so when searching for -lc
[06:57] <lamont>  and so on, for amd64
[06:57] <lamont> dh_movefiles -pgnat-3.3 usr/lib/gcc-lib/powerpc-linux/3.3.4/gnat1 usr/lib/gcc-lib/powerpc-linux/3.3.4/{adalib,adainclude} usr/bin/gnat usr/bin/gnatbind usr/bin/gnatbl
[06:57] <lamont> +usr/bin/gnatchop usr/bin/gnatfind usr/bin/gnatkr usr/bin/gnatlink usr/bin/gnatls usr/bin/gnatmake usr/bin/gnatname usr/bin/gnatprep usr/bin/gnatxref usr/bin/gnatpsta
[06:57] <lamont> xargs: rm: terminated by signal 4
[06:57] <lamont> dh_movefiles: command returned error code
[06:57] <lamont> on ppc
[06:57] <Mithrandir> lamont: ok, missing ia32-libs-dev build-dependency.
[06:58] <Mithrandir> lamont: I wonder why it failed on ppc, though
[06:58] <Mithrandir> and my home router just died, *grumble*
[06:59] <lamont> Mithrandir: actually, that could just be ppc flakiness - I'll see if giving it back helpo
[06:59] <lamont> s
[07:00] <Mithrandir> lamont: goodie, I don't see why it should fail on ppc (though, I haven't looked at the source, just listened to what doko's told me)
[07:01] <mdz> sabdfl: that issue shouldn't affect upgrades from woody; I don't think that any Warty packages have the same version number as a woody package
[07:01] <sabdfl> ok, so just sarge then
[07:02] <Mithrandir> mdz: it's trivial to check, though
[07:02] <lamont> seb128: theora is installed
[07:02] <lamont> Mithrandir: gcc-3.4 is d-w amd64-libs-dev
[07:04] <mdz> sabdfl: yes, there are many such packages in that set (same version in sarge and warty)
[07:04] <Mithrandir> because it's biarch
[07:04] <seb128> lamont: thanks
[07:04] <Mithrandir> lamont: I'm working on it, but ia32-libs has higher priority for me atm.
[07:05] <mdz> but sarge->warty is a downgrade anyway
[07:05] <mdz> we may or may not have this situation with sarge->hoary
[07:07] <fabbione> mdz: perhaps we can ship an ad-hoc apt_prefereces
[07:07] <mdz> the cache issue can be fixed in apt
[07:07] <fabbione> anyway
[07:07] <fabbione> i want to get drunk now :-)
[07:07] <mdz> but there will still be other, more difficult problems
[07:08] <fabbione> time for heavy party
[07:10] <Mithrandir> fabbione: that was last friday. :)
[07:12] <fabbione> too :-)
[07:12] <fabbione> Mithrandir: we bought the house today !:)
[07:12] <Mithrandir> AWESOME!
[07:12] <Mithrandir> party at your place, then?
[07:12] <Mithrandir> :)
[07:12] <fabbione> i need to get drunk :O)
[07:12] <fabbione> Mithrandir: ALWAYS!
[07:12] <fabbione> gotta go now
[07:12] <fabbione> bbl
[07:12] <Mithrandir> see you around
[07:12] <Mithrandir> and congrats.
[07:13] <thom> fabbione: have fun, and congrats
[07:29] <doko> lamont: if the gcc packages failed to build, please send me the logs (or maybe the last 100 lines ...)
[08:16] <lamont> doko: OK. one more round on ppc...
[08:17] <Mithrandir> lamont: works now?
[08:17] <lamont> Mithrandir: gcc-3.3 really gets annoyed when the build directory wasn't removed from the previous try
[08:20] <Mithrandir> hm, it should rm it in the clean target, shouldn't it?
[08:23] <lamont> yeah, it should
[10:00] <Kamion> thom: I plan to change sudo to put 'Defaults !lecture,tty_tickets' in the standard sudoers file it creates in its postinst, and in base-config just append to the sudoers file. Sound good?
[10:00] <Kamion> (append> if it exists, probably)
[10:01] <thom> Kamion: i was just about to ask if that was the best way ;-)
[10:01] <thom> Kamion: so yes, sounds good
[10:04] <Kamion> heh, ok
[10:05] <thom> i can do sudo if you do base config, or 've you done it already?
[10:06] <Kamion> just done sudo actually
[10:06] <Kamion> obviously the wrong order :-)
[10:07] <thom> heh
[10:07] <thom> i'll let you do base-config then, since you're obviously ahead of me as usual :-)
[10:08] <thom> Keybuk: yes, they're very useful to sudo
[10:08] <Keybuk> thom: %patrons  theatre_tickets(+opera_glasses)
[10:09] <thom> yessssss
[10:09] <thom> hey Gman
[10:09] <Kamion> thom: ok, done; now for shadow </scared>
[10:09] <Keybuk> ya know, I swear ... these metacity focus hacks are sweeeet
[10:10] <Gman> hey hey thom
[10:10] <Keybuk> now we just need Typing Break to wait until I've finished typing and not interrupt me mid-flow :p
[10:10] <thom> Kamion: hacking sulogin felt /so/ wrong
[10:10] <thom> Keybuk: *g*
[10:10] <Keybuk> Gman: hey
[10:10] <Kamion> thom: I'm sure we're going to get a lot of hate mail about this change, you know ...
[10:10] <Gman> evening Keybuk
[10:11] <Kamion> thom: we need some documentation of the whole thing somewhere too
[10:12] <thom> Kamion: yeah
[10:12] <Kamion> shadow away
[10:12] <thom> Kamion: i hope in expert mode you'll get the choice?
[10:13] <Kamion> thom: probably not right now since everyone sent me hate mail about base-config's priority handling so it's forced to high
[10:13] <Kamion> in fact I'm just commenting out all the code anyway ;-)
[10:14] <Kamion> for the moment I mostly want to see what the reaction to the setup is
[10:21] <mdz> Kamion: speaking of hate mail, we need to re-enable the hostname question in d-i
[10:25] <thom> yes
[10:25] <Kamion> mdz: under all circumstances, I take it?
[10:26] <mdz> Kamion: I would say so
[10:27] <Kamion> mdz: done
[10:27] <mdz> thanks
[10:27] <mdz> Kamion: I will accept responsibility for the additional question :-)
[10:56] <Oskuro> Keybuk: seriously, that typing-break feature would be so welcome :)
[10:57] <Keybuk> kinda defeats the purpose though, doesn't it? :p
[10:58] <Keybuk> the "stop tying" alert waiting until... you stop typing
[11:00] <thom> c'mon! c'mon! oh man, stop typing so i can tell you to stop typing!
[11:19] <Oskuro> Keybuk: well, no.
[11:20] <Oskuro> make it lock it after 2 seconds of no activity
[11:20] <Oskuro> so you at least can finish introducing the command you were introducing or whatever
[11:20] <Oskuro> of no keyboard activity I mean
[11:20] <Oskuro> this has the nice side-effect of not spoiling a tetrinet game :D
[11:38] <mdz> use workrave
[11:40] <Oskuro> is workrave still included in warty?
[11:44] <Kamion>   workrave |    1.6.2-1 |         warty | powerpc, i386, source


[00:17] <sbalneav> vistro: So, what happens if you log in with the superuser account?
[00:27] <sbalneav> gotta take my son out to his music lesson.  Back on in a couple of hours.
[01:43] <oscurochu1> where can i get a list of all the applications included with the latest release?
[01:44] <sbalneav> oscurochu1: Not sure if we've got that on the site at all.
[01:44] <sbalneav> gotta go
[01:44] <sbalneav> be back on in 1/2 hour
[01:44] <oscurochu1> is there a list in the image?
[01:44] <sbalneav> the packages are all there
[01:44] <oscurochu1> ok thanks thats all
[13:14] <researcher> :)Hello
[13:15] <researcher> I did not find the Fish Applet as suggested yesterday
[13:15] <alkisg> are you on an ubuntu system now?
[13:15] <researcher> yes
[13:15] <researcher> ub untu 9.10 64 Bit AMD
[13:16] <alkisg> Right click on the bottom panel, and select to add an applet
[13:17] <researcher> please wait a while
[13:17] <researcher> did it
[13:18] <alkisg> OK, and you don't see the wanda fish applet there?
[13:18] <researcher> yes its there
[13:18] <researcher> now How do I make my photo appear here with name?
[13:19] <alkisg> http://amitksaha.blogspot.com/2008/01/wanda-gnome-fish.html
[13:19] <alkisg> """Right-Click on the GNOME Fish Applet, and go the 'Preferences' menu:"""
[13:19] <researcher> done
[13:19] <alkisg> etc etc, if you don't find it ask again...
[13:19] <researcher> yes I CAN BROWSE TO MY PHOTO FILE NOW
[13:20] <alkisg> You can even put animated pictures, if you like (and if you know how to make one)
[13:22] <researcher> thanks a lot
[13:42] <researcher> hello alkisg r u there?
[14:49] <sbalneav> Morning all
[16:56] <researcher> I have ubuntu installed in english and installed ubuntu-edu-preschool using apt-get command.Can I work edubuntu now in other language?
[16:57] <researcher> :)hello friends here
[17:14] <sbalneav> You know, 5 minutes is not enough time for people to hang around waiting for an answer to their question.
[17:17] <Ahmuck> ?
[17:19] <Ahmuck> what's the new release called?
[17:19] <Ahmuck> what's 10.04 called?
[17:20] <Ahmuck> Leaping Leapord?
[17:20] <alkisg> Lucid Lynx
[17:20] <Ahmuck> ah
[17:24] <sbalneav> Ahmuck: researcher came in here with a question, asked at 11:01, and bailed at 11:05
[17:36] <Ahmuck> i'm torn
[17:37] <sbalneav> Must be painful.
[17:37] <sbalneav> Try eating more fibre :)
[17:37] <Ahmuck> given the chioce, id close the lab in december
[17:41] <sbalneav> What's the other choice?
[17:43] <Ahmuck> leave it open
[17:44] <Ahmuck> operating it at a significant loss
[18:40] <sbalneav> How come operating it at a loss?
[18:40] <sbalneav> This a school lab?
[18:45] <Ahmuck> it's an independent community lab
[18:46] <Ahmuck> we do compete with the local school district.  they lease out to the college.  they are windows
[18:47] <Ahmuck> and the local library
[18:47] <Ahmuck> we've been looking at grants
[18:47] <sbalneav> So is this your job?
[18:47] <Ahmuck> no, i do IT work on the windows side
[18:48] <Ahmuck> for manufacturers.  windows labs are a piece of cake.
[18:50] <Ahmuck> msg me if you want to know more sbalneav
[18:50] <sbalneav> So, is this lab an edubuntu lab, or a windows lab?
[18:52] <Ahmuck> it's a ltsp lab.  focusing on scribus, openoffice, some hand selected edu apps, gimp, etc.
[18:52] <Ahmuck> it's an open source lab
[18:53] <Ahmuck> it's used to teach theory/concepts in word processing, DTP, spreadsheets, etc.
[18:53] <Ahmuck> open during the day, teaching at night.  we have mixed groups during the day
[18:53] <Ahmuck> the problem we've had is the law is so onereous
[18:53] <sbalneav> And, what, nobody's interested in renting it?
[18:54] <Ahmuck> we don't lease
[18:57] <sbalneav> Then I'm unclear on why you want to shut it down.
[19:12] <Ahmuck> sbalneav: ok, back to the subject
[19:12] <Ahmuck> the original premise was
[19:12] <Ahmuck> 1. create a public education lab using oss software only
[19:13] <Ahmuck> 2. create a space where linux was used and promoted
[19:13] <Ahmuck> 3. real world testing of software/ideas and comparison
[19:14] <Ahmuck> 4. be self-supporting
[19:16] <Ahmuck> sbalneav: sooo, when ur back, drop me a note
[19:17] <Ahmuck> 5. provide a place where underprivledge could gain access to pc technology
[19:23] <sbalneav> Ok, so what's prompting the shutdown?
[19:27] <Ahmuck> well, i've been unable to get the clients to function properly, hence i've been looking at NDB & LDAP
[19:27] <dgroos> Hi sbalneav and Ahmuck...
[19:27] <Ahmuck> if the clients don't function, advertising it is a no no
[19:27] <Ahmuck> cause I don't want to advertise it and make linux/oss look bad
[19:27] <Ahmuck> even if it is me
[19:28] <Ahmuck> the other problem is cost.  after doing books for the year end or near year end, the roi, or cost/benifit ratio isn't there
[19:28] <Ahmuck> however, we have used it for 1. LUG use and 2. community magazine production using OO.o and scribus
[19:29]  * Ahmuck is a bit of a bleeding heart
[19:37] <sbalneav> So, remind me, what isn't working about the thin clients?
[19:41] <Ahmuck> sbalneav: well, we do have inet access during the day.  firefox has been a problem, as well as flash.
[19:41] <Ahmuck> however, scribus has been a problem as well
[19:41] <Ahmuck> games like ri-li
[19:42] <Ahmuck> i've actually found that windows games runs faster from the ltsp server on the client than linux games
[19:42] <Ahmuck> as a result, if given the choice, i download the windows version over the linux version
[19:44] <Ahmuck> scribus/gimp can be problems
[19:45] <Ahmuck> i understand alkisg has no issues, but i'm not sure why
[19:45] <sbalneav> "Problems" in what way?
[19:45] <Ahmuck> slooooow
[19:45] <Ahmuck> lockups
[19:45] <Ahmuck> etc.
[19:45] <sbalneav> What kind of thin clients do you have?
[19:45] <Ahmuck> 800Mhz - 1Ghz with 512mb ram
[19:45] <sbalneav> Do you have NBD swap turned on?
[19:45] <Ahmuck> gigabyte network and gigabyte swtich
[19:46] <Ahmuck> don't rightly know, but can check.  iirc, i did turn that on
[19:46] <Ahmuck> the clients have 20G hard disks, but they were dbaned
[19:46] <alkisg> Ahmuck: do you have local firefox & flash, and you're still not satisfied with the result?
[19:46] <sbalneav> when things are slow, is the server's cpu loaed?
[19:47] <Ahmuck> alkisg: local firefox
[19:47] <Ahmuck> i'd have to check on flash
[19:47] <Ahmuck> sbalneav: not sure, i can top it and see
[19:48] <alkisg> Well if the firefox is local, and you see flash, then flash is local too. Then, the speed is not a matter of LTSP, it's just your client CPUs, as flash runs locally.
[19:49] <alkisg> I *do* have problems, e.g. I can't run googleearth etc, but with my ancient clients, googleearth wouldn't run on windows as well.
[19:49] <alkisg> Overall, I'm more satisfied with LTSP than with Windows with those clients (I've had windows 98 and 2000 on them before switching them to LTSP)
[19:50] <alkisg> On newer labs I don't install LTSP, but standalone Ubuntu
[19:50] <alkisg> You have to know what to expect...
[20:13] <Ahmuck> alkisg: can you run scribus, gimp?
[20:13] <alkisg> Gimp yes, scribus I didn't try
[20:14] <Ahmuck> multiple gimps?
[20:14] <Ahmuck> so, if not ltsp, then what?
[20:15] <Ahmuck> i'm really really trying to make this work, but have began to have serious doubts
[20:15] <Ahmuck> essentially we've been in a year of testing.  i've considered getting a new server, quad core and new clients
[20:15] <alkisg> What do you mean "multiple gimps"? I've tried with one gimp per PC (the studens drawing stuff...)
[20:15] <Ahmuck> however, i'd hate to put out the cost without having any good test cases
[20:16] <Ahmuck> how many pcs
[20:16] <alkisg> 8
[20:17] <alkisg> But I didn't have any bottleneck, so I guess I could run about 20 with the same server / network. Of course the behavior is a little slower than e.g. on my desktop PC, but that's to be expected...
[20:20] <Ahmuck> i think we worked out i didn't have a bottleneck either ...
[20:22] <alkisg> And? Gimp doesn't go fast enough, or it doesn't work at all?
[20:22] <alkisg> (I think we just found out that you didn't have a network problem, we didn't look at other common bottlenecks, like CPU etc...)
[20:23] <Ahmuck> it works slowly
[20:23] <Ahmuck> i'm sure ur aware, that when using scribus, you can load a photo of any size into the image frame
[20:23] <alkisg> I've never seen scribus...
[20:23] <Ahmuck> three of four people doing this is murder on ltsp
[20:23] <Ahmuck> ...
[20:23] <Ahmuck> it's a great DTP tool
[20:24] <alkisg> I use openoffice for DTP :P
[20:24] <Ahmuck> *groan*
[20:24] <alkisg> I did publish books with openoffice, and they're fine. Much better than I could do with Word.
[20:25] <Ahmuck> well, ok, i agree, OO.o will work for that and it does well i guess
[20:42] <dgroos> I'm running gnome-watchdog and it really helps eliminate processes abandoned after a user logs out.
[20:43] <Ahmuck> dgroos: kewl, thx
[20:43] <Ahmuck> this has been a problem.  user logs out, and then logs in the next day and can't use firefox
[20:43] <dgroos> Ahmuck: watchdog helps lot.
[20:43] <dgroos> But...
[20:44] <dgroos> ...after a few classes of logging in and out I notice that the overall memory usage of the server is a good ways up.
[20:45] <dgroos> (as compared to right after reboot)
[20:45] <Ahmuck> btw, how is your classroom lab?
[20:46] <dgroos> Ahmuck: have you checked this w/ top or Administration/System Monitor?
[20:48] <dgroos> It's going pretty well!  I can feel your pain though on wanting to go system wide w/Edubuntu and LTSP and feeling that it's not quite ready for primetime (UNDER MY LEADERSHIP).
[20:49] <dgroos> I've a feeling it would be if I had alkisg's knowledge/skills (I've got a bit of them though thanks to him teaching me!)
[20:49] <Ahmuck> my problem is time
[20:49] <dgroos> LocalApps made a quantum leap ahead for me.
[20:49] <Ahmuck> i don't like working 18 hour days
[20:49] <dgroos> Yes.
[20:50] <dgroos> Family/Health doesn't like it either, in my case!
[20:51] <dgroos> You using PIII's, right?
[20:53] <Ahmuck> dgroos: yep
[20:53] <Ahmuck> gateways
[20:54] <dgroos> localapps?
[20:54] <Ahmuck> heh, i thought for a sec you said pills
[20:54] <dgroos> or are you doing Hardy?
[20:54] <Ahmuck> dgroos: not sure yet
[20:54] <Ahmuck> nope, i'm on jaunty
[20:54] <dgroos> (tempting... ;)?)
[20:55] <dgroos> So not using localapps.
[20:55] <Ahmuck> jaunty did fix a number of problems, however i did'nt have firefox issues on an ealier release
[20:55] <Ahmuck> i'd have to check.  i'm in the middle of something with Jack right now
[20:56] <dgroos> sure.  When you get a chance, let's talk about localapps.  I sunk a good bit of my summer in them--and it was worth it.
[21:26] <dgroos> I'm remotely exploring my server (via NX) trying to find why it's slow to log in, and why memory use grows throughout the day.
[21:26] <dgroos> I just found that my file system is at 100% full!
[21:27] <dgroos> How can I find memory usage by directory?
[21:30] <alkisg> dgroos: there's a tool for that in applications > accessories
[21:30] <dgroos> after I type: df -h it tells me that /dev/cciss/c0d0p1 is 100%
[21:30] <dgroos> thanks alkisg--I'll check it out.
[21:31] <dgroos> nice :)
[21:41] <Ahmuck> dgroos: actually, i'm on karamic
[21:41] <dgroos> cool.  So, have you looked much into LocalApps?
[21:43] <Ahmuck> some.  i think i have localapps enabled
[21:44] <dgroos> Easy to tell.  If you are sitting at a client, boot firefox and at the 'title bar' where it says 'firefox' it should say something like 'firefox ltsp 48' or something like that.
[21:45] <dgroos> alkisg: I'm doing a 'Scan Folder' and it is telling me some things I can't make sense of...
[21:47] <dgroos> I'm scanning the /home directory, click on a user that is, for example, using 184 MB.
[21:47] <Ahmuck> sbalneav: fwiw, my pay job pays for my non-pay community stuff
[21:50] <dgroos> it then lists the top 2 folders for this user as 'boot' using 19.4% and '.mozilla' using 19.2%, then is bin with 3.3% and quickly all things lists are .1%.  Thus, doing quick math, the things listed account for less than 50%!
[21:50] <dgroos> Where is the hidden 50% being used?
[21:52] <dgroos> Other confusion... Looking at this user (and I've got dozens like him), I then open the 'boot' folder which is said to be using 19.4% of his contents.
[21:54] <dgroos> ... and inside this folder only 1 thing is listed, 'pxelinux.cfg', using 0.0% of this.  So, where is the 35.8 MB of content it is said to have?
[21:54] <dgroos> Maybe I ought to launch this from terminal as root...
[22:16] <dgroos> Weird... why would it say my home directory used 2.3 gigs when Disk Analyzer was opened as user with admin privileges and LESS THAN HALF that when examined by Disk Analyzer running as root?
[22:17] <Ahmuck> http://deals.ebay.com/5000005280 - i can't build em cheaper than this
[22:35] <dgroos> A user kker1101 is said to be using 7.4 gigs.  I examine his directories using Disk Usage Analyzer with root privileges.  100% of this 7.4 gigs is in this directory: home/kker1101/dev/fd/3/fd/3/fd/3/fd/3/fd/3/fd/3/fd/3/fd/3/... seemingly forever.  What's going on?  Googling hasn't given me any lead.  There are many users that have this fd/3/... issue!
[22:36] <sbalneav> dgroos: They're putting spaces in their usernames
[22:36] <sbalneav> have you updated your ltsp packages from stgrabers ppa?
[22:36] <sbalneav> he fixed this
[22:37] <dgroos> do I have to do this manually or if I run sudo apt-get update then upgrade it will that do it?
[22:37] <Ahmuck> you need to add the ppa manually
[22:38] <Ahmuck> or via the software sources interface
[22:38] <dgroos> I think I had that... I'll check.
[22:40] <dgroos> ahhh... I have it in my source list but had them unchecked.  I think I did that because I also have edubuntu-italc-devel ppa selected and thought they might conflict or read that somewhere--don't remember.
[22:41] <dgroos> sbalneav: after I run the update do I have to delete this seeming infinite series of fd/3 or should I delete the user or... ?
[22:45] <sbalneav> yeah, delete the fd's
[23:02] <dgroos> wow... took about 2 minutes to rm -r the fd of that 7.4 gig user, now working on the next....
[23:28] <dgroos> sbalneav: do I need to rebuild the chroot or anything after the update?  It's taking a while to remove all these spurious fd/ directories and don't want them to be re-created on Monday again.  Is there some link that describes this issue?  THANKS!
[23:38] <Ahmuck> sbalneav: what do you suggest for my situation?


[06:42] <RikMills> packages built 7 hours ago, still not published. idle x86 builders, but 44 jobs in the queue.
[06:43] <RikMills> not nagging. I don't envy LP engineers sometimes!
[06:44] <wgrant> Those 44 jobs are stuck because the publisher is, let's see
[07:45] <oSoMoN> good morning launchpad!
[07:45] <oSoMoN> I filed bug #1836010 re- the question I asked yesterday about webhooks
[08:44] <cjwatson> oSoMoN: Confused, because I already gave you the existing bug yesterday, didn't I?
[08:44] <cjwatson> I guess this is slightly different
[08:58] <oSoMoN> cjwatson, sorry I must have missed your message yesterday
[08:59] <oSoMoN> what was the existing bug?
[09:03] <cjwatson> You referred to it actually
[09:03] <cjwatson> I've just added a backlink from https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/1638333
[09:08] <oSoMoN> cjwatson, thanks. I guess I should have started by looking for existing bugs before asking my question yesterday
[09:09] <oSoMoN> cjwatson, does the use case make sense?
[09:11] <cjwatson> It's reasonable, just not sure when we'd fit it in.  (Though it's probably not completely inaccessible for a new developer)
[10:01] <Nakato> Is there anyone here able to help me out with launchpad erroring out on a bug submission?
[10:02] <cjwatson> Nakato: Do you have an OOPS ID?
[10:02] <Nakato> cjwatson:  OOPS-be239c7023dce658b606040ab1522a2f
[10:03] <cjwatson> Nakato: There's no source package in Ubuntu called "linux-snap"
[10:04] <Nakato> Oh, okay, where can I file a bug for https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-kernel/ubuntu/+source/linux-snap/+git/xenial/tree/Makefile ?
[10:04] <cjwatson> Nakato: I don't know, you'll have to ask the kernel team
[10:04] <ginggs> Is there a known problem uploading to PPA?  I keep getting [Errno 104] Connection reset by peer
[10:04] <cjwatson> Nakato: Try #ubuntu-kernel
[10:05] <cjwatson> ginggs: Could be related to the rollout we did to make the uploader IPv6-ready I suppose
[10:05] <cjwatson> ginggs: Are you using FTP?
[10:05] <ginggs> cjwatson: yes, using ftp
[10:10] <cjwatson> ginggs: Can you try stracing it from your end?  Since it's FTP the trace shouldn't contain any secrets
[10:10] <cjwatson> ginggs: strace -f -s 1024 -tt
[10:16] <ginggs> cjwatson: it seems to be disconnected after PASV
[10:16] <ginggs> let me know if i should send the trace somewhere
[10:18] <cjwatson> ginggs<EMAIL_ADDRESS>please
[10:19] <cjwatson> ginggs: In the meantime you should be able to use SFTP
[10:20] <Nakato> Is it a bug that I was able to get to that bug-submission page that errored out?  I started at this url: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-kernel/ubuntu/+source/linux-snap/+git/xenial then clicked "bugs" in the title, then "Report a bug".
[10:23] <cjwatson> Nakato: Yes, it's https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/1635118
[10:24] <Nakato> Thanks cjwatson
[10:24] <cjwatson> The fix that caused it was for a more important problem, so it needs some more digging rather than just reverting the change that introduced it
[10:53] <ginggs> cjwatson: SFTP worked, thanks
[10:56] <cjwatson> ginggs: strace> interesting - I have a nearly identical strace here except I get a proper response to PASV and everything works fine
[10:59] <cjwatson> ginggs: What time zone is this strace in?
[11:00] <ginggs> south africa, GMT +2
[11:00] <cjwatson> Thanks, even after all this time my interhemisphere timezone guessing still sucks
[11:06] <RikMills> normal ftp stalled here as well. sftp succeeded
[11:31] <cjwatson> I really don't understand this - it works fine for me, with the company VPN disabled
[11:32] <cjwatson> Try "telnet ppa.launchpad.net 21", then "USER anonymous", "PASS testing", "PASV" and see what you get?
[11:44] <ginggs> cjwatson: Connection closed by foreign host.
[11:44] <cjwatson> What the heck is going on
[11:45] <cjwatson> ginggs: Could I see the full transcript of that telnet session?
[11:45] <ginggs> cjwatson: so at home, earlier today, dput was just stalling and never timing out. now at the office i'm getting the connection closed
[11:45] <cjwatson> Including the "Trying ..." line at the start
[11:46] <ginggs> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/pwDvKDkWbk/
[11:47] <cjwatson> For me it's fine from home and from chiark, hangs from master.debian.org
[11:50] <GyrosGeier> if I send "QUIT" right after PASV, I get 550 Requested action not taken: internal server error
[11:50] <GyrosGeier> 221 Goodbye.
[11:50] <GyrosGeier> so two responses to one command
[11:54] <cjwatson> GyrosGeier: FTP permits multiple replies
[11:54] <cjwatson> GyrosGeier: See RFC 959 section 4.2
[11:54] <cjwatson> GyrosGeier: "Every command must generate at least one reply, although there may be more than one"
[11:57] <cjwatson> GyrosGeier: I don't know if it's correct in this case, but it seems to be permitted in general, even though it's bizarre.  But presumably in your case PASV had already produced a response?
[12:23] <cjwatson> ginggs: Would you mind filing a bug on https://bugs.launchpad.net/txpkgupload about this?  I managed to reproduce it in an environment where I might be able to debug it
[12:23] <cjwatson> Maybe
[12:24] <ginggs> cjwatson: doing
[12:25] <cjwatson> Also confirmed that reverting the recent deployment fixes it, so now just to work out why
[12:29] <GyrosGeier> cjwatson, yes, it did
[12:29] <GyrosGeier> there was 30 seconds pause after the PASV, which got a positive reply
[12:30] <ginggs> cjwatson: LP: #1836059
[12:30] <GyrosGeier> so I'd say the error was definitely in response to the QUIT
[12:31] <cjwatson> ginggs: thanks
[12:32] <ginggs> cjwatson: np
[12:38] <cjwatson> Huh, running txpkgupload on a different port makes it go away
[12:38] <cjwatson> I wonder if we're managing to confuse some conntrack nonsense or something
[12:39] <cjwatson> Oh, or maybe the problem is a leading ::ffff: in the PASV response
[13:50] <cjwatson> ginggs,RikMills,GyrosGeier: Worked around for now
[13:51] <RikMills> ty
[15:40] <ginggs> cjwatson: workaround working, ta!


[00:00] <Sarvatt> i *just* got libxfont
[00:00] <Sarvatt> shoot cant use apt-get either
[00:01] <bryce> grumble grumble
[00:01] <bryce> well, at least I did verify this time that 190 applies
[00:01] <Sarvatt> somethings majorly screwed up, i better reboot and hope for the best
[00:10] <johanbr> hmm... nouveau + all the other bits from xorg-edgers fails for me, "error opening the drm"
[00:11] <johanbr> http://pastebin.com/f2c14c96b
[00:11] <bryce> Sarvatt, luck?
[00:11] <Sarvatt> yeah just something screwy. latest intel git doesnt boot x though which was fun to find out :D
[00:12] <Sarvatt> Version: 7.0.16~git20091111.3ec82cd7-0ubuntu0sarvatt  Version: 7.0.15-1 for x11proto-core-dev, looks like the protos arent even built yet
[00:14] <Sarvatt> oh hey
[00:14] <Sarvatt> 190 actually applies to master now with your change
[00:14] <bryce> good
[00:14] <RAOF> Argh!  Why do I _still_ need to look up 'git help checkout' to switch to an upstream branch?
[00:20] <Sarvatt> shoot, auto-xorg-git changes coming back to bite me now that it was updated, i used ~ instead of + in alot of the protos and libs so >=1.2.0 build deps fail for 1.2.0~whatever
[00:25] <RAOF> Should I upload a new nouveau-kernel-source package to Lucid, or wait for whatever falls out of the kernel team discussions?
[00:26] <RAOF> Interesting context: nouveau is currently untestable on Lucid, because the current nouveau-kernel-source fails to build against 2.6.32 kernels.
[00:27] <bryce> RAOF, I'd doublecheck with the kernel team first
[00:38] <Sarvatt> oops, looks like 177_animated_cursor_change_master.patch needs to go too
[00:39] <Sarvatt> ../../render/animcur.c: In function ‘AnimCurDisplayCursor’:
[00:39] <Sarvatt> ../../render/animcur.c:222: error: ‘struct _DeviceIntRec’ has no member named ‘isMaster’
[00:57] <Sarvatt> thats on master but will be the same on 1.7 branch -- http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/commit/?id=b12d302df8283186ce87882c29b2b0294adb2770
[00:59] <Sarvatt> darn http://paste.ubuntu.com/334210/
[01:06] <Sarvatt> yep 177 fails on 1.7.2 too
[01:08] <Sarvatt> checking if 190_cache-xkbcomp_output_for_fast_start_up.patch makes 1.7.2 fail to build now too like it does master
[01:09] <Sarvatt> pushing this little atom cpu hard tonight :)
[01:09] <bryce> hehe
[01:11] <bryce> hrm, wonder if there exists an updated version of 190
[01:11] <bryce> bugger my pbuilder environment still isn't updated
[01:12] <bryce> well, we can leave 190 disabled for alpha-1, that won't be the end of the world
[01:13] <bryce> ditto 177
[01:14] <Sarvatt> yeah i'm using edgers just to see if things work, had to change x11proto-xf86bigfont-dev (>= 1.2.0), to x11proto-xf86bigfont-dev (>= 1.1.99), to make it build because of 1.2.0~ behind lower than 1.2.0
[01:15] <Sarvatt> hmm
[01:15] <Sarvatt> checking for DMXMODULES... yes
[01:15] <Sarvatt> ../configure: line 20715: XDMXCONFIG_DEP_CFLAGS: command not found
[01:15] <Sarvatt> ../configure: line 20716: C: command not found
[01:15] <Sarvatt> ../configure: line 20717: XDMXCONFIG_DEP_LIBS: command not found
[01:15] <Sarvatt> ../configure: line 20718: linker: command not found
[01:15] <Sarvatt> (sorry for so many lines at once)
[01:17] <Sarvatt> 1.7.2 failed the same as master with 190 applied :(
[01:17] <jcristau> Sarvatt: that's fixed in 1.7.3
[01:18] <jcristau> that doesn't fail the build here tho
[01:18] <Sarvatt> yeah doesnt fail, just saw the error while that one was building
[01:19] <Sarvatt> same failure on 1.7.2 with 190 though http://paste.ubuntu.com/334216/
[01:25]  * bryce comments out in git
[01:25] <bryce> it's my fault, I said "190 was easy" earlier and jinxed us
[01:39] <Sarvatt> now its failing in hw/xfree86/common/xf86Events.c :(
[01:40] <Sarvatt> patch 135
[01:41] <Sarvatt> trying 1.7.2 to see if it fails there too
[01:41] <Sarvatt> gotta love ccache
[01:42] <Sarvatt> http://paste.ubuntu.com/334223/
[01:44] <RAOF> Ok.  So, nouveau would also like libdrm 2.4.16 for Lucid.
[01:45] <Sarvatt> intel requires 2.4.16 to build now too
[01:45] <RAOF> And it looks like it's practically finished in pkg-xorg git.
[01:48] <Sarvatt> darn, ccache doesnt work when you build 2 seperate versions of the same package :D
[01:56] <Sarvatt> and i'm an idiot.. disabled 135 when i built 1.7.2 to see if 135 made it fail that time :D
[02:05] <Sarvatt> yeah 135 fails on 1.7.2 in origin/ubuntu too :( http://paste.ubuntu.com/334228/
[02:05] <Sarvatt> builds fine without it
[02:08] <Amaranth> oh yeah, can we drop the XAA hack now? I don't think any driver that supports compiz uses XAA by default anymore
[02:08] <Amaranth> I can't drop the compiz half of it until the Xorg half is gone
[02:10] <bryce> which XAA hack is this?
[02:10]  * Amaranth looks for it
[02:10] <bryce> the radeon XAA hack for low mem cards?
[02:10] <Amaranth> it was a way to dynamically enable XaaNoOffscreenPixmaps
[02:11] <Amaranth> from way back in feisty or something
[02:11] <Amaranth> looks like maybe it's gone already
[02:11] <Amaranth> I know it wasn't some time during karmic development though
[02:12] <bryce> if you spot it, let me know
[02:12] <bryce> we mostly don't care about XAA anymore
[02:12] <Amaranth> well nothing in debian/patches mentions _COMPIZ_GL_INCLUDE_INFERIORS anymore so I guess it is gone
[02:13] <bryce> Amaranth, there actually is a situation where XAA is used on -ati
[02:13] <bryce> upstream found that on some antique cards they can't do EXA very well so they do XAA by default on them
[02:14] <Sarvatt> they'd have to be crazy to be using compiz in that situation where they have 32mb or under video ram though lol
[02:14] <Amaranth> those are the same ones that report invalid GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE, aren't they?
[02:14] <bryce> however from what I've seen and heard this causes as much trouble as it solves, and I'm tempted to just force it all EXA anyway, and deal with the EXA bugs
[02:15] <bryce> Sarvatt, what our users crazy?
[02:15] <Amaranth> that need KMS to do it properly because they create a buffer large enough to fit the screen when rotated so they run out of memory
[02:17] <Sarvatt> doesn't fglrx use XAA still? I dont use it but thought it did for some reason
[02:18] <Amaranth> Pretty sure they have almost useful XRender acceleration so I don't think so
[02:19] <Sarvatt> thats the most positive comment about fglrx 2d acceleration i've ever heard
[02:21] <Sarvatt> wow 1.7.2 has a _huge_ load of dmx compile warnings, no wonder they rushed out 1.7.3
[02:22] <Amaranth> Well, fglrx is almost faster than software :)
[02:30] <Sarvatt> how many times is this darn xserver compile going to run the tests
[02:32] <Sarvatt> ...answer is 2
[02:37]  * Amaranth stabs xmodmap
[02:38] <Sarvatt> yep fully compiles fine without 135_rethrow_signals.patch. not the full build log because my scrollback didnt go back far enough: http://sarvatt.com/downloads/xserver_1.7.2_buildlog.txt
[02:38] <Sarvatt> not the same build environment that is going to be in lucid as soon as the stuff builds though of course
[02:58] <Amaranth> bryce: Should I turn on the compiz reflection plugin to test your GPU wedge hook? :)
[03:01] <Sarvatt> patches.ubuntu.com doesnt have the extracted patch folders anymore? :(
[03:06] <Sarvatt> hmm, guess it isnt that big a deal not having the apport hooks in the edgers packages but i need to add a hook for the intel-gpu-tools recommends update
[03:07] <Sarvatt> intel hasnt been stable upstream in almost a month now, i'm still having to use ones checked out on 11-11
[03:10] <Sarvatt> oh wait its 11/06, forgot i reverted back and dated it higher so it'd override the broken ones even then
[03:13] <Sarvatt> <IP_ADDRESS>1 release is ok except I cant use it on a 2.6.31 kernel without it killing x randomly, and cant suspend without the flickering problems under 2.6.32 on any 2.9.x release
[03:46] <Sarvatt> hmmm so what all do I need for this new udev driven xserver? i see synaptics in experimental has a udev rule installed with it, need to do anything special with evdev?
[03:48] <Sarvatt> oh theres a ubuntu branch for evdev now? sweet
[03:49] <Sarvatt> ubuntu did it different than debian before where hal installed the evdev fdi so i wasnt sure if udev installed an evdev rule or something like that
[04:13] <Sarvatt> lets see how this udev xserver works now. when I dont come back things blew up horribly :)
[04:15] <Sarvatt> i'm always disappointed when things just work :D
[04:17] <Sarvatt> was I supposed to purge hal first?
[06:02] <tjaalton> bryce: yeah I don't think the protos/libs are all built and published yet
[06:03] <tjaalton> Sarvatt: good catch on that merge goof, I forgot to add the VCS bits back
[06:07] <Sarvatt> the publisher is screwed up or something, even ppa builds arent getting published even though they say they have been and the protos built 6 hours ago https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/i386/+builds?build_text=&build_state=all
[06:07] <tjaalton> yes, well LP has been down for hours
[06:07] <tjaalton> and been up maybe an hour or so
[06:08] <tjaalton> ah, those have been built fine, so it's the publisher alright
[06:09] <Sarvatt> x11proto-xf86bigfont built about 45 minutes ago on edgers and it still isnt getting used building server
[06:10] <Sarvatt> watched it turn into a gear then finish getting published but still not up for download either
[06:17] <Sarvatt> hmm looks like xfonts-utils is missing in the server build deps
[06:18] <Sarvatt> failed on the PPA configure.ac:41: error: must install fontutil 1.1 or later before running autoconf/autogen but its got font-util 1.1.1 in the PPA
[06:21] <Sarvatt> might be a xserver master only problem though
[06:54] <tjaalton> 1.7 doesn't check fontutil at all
[07:03] <Sarvatt> well its starting to update, x11proto-xinerama is breaking gtk app builds ;D
[07:14] <Sarvatt> hmm libx11 didnt get synced
[07:16] <Sarvatt> someone just hit rebuild on all the dep wait libs at the same time, of course it's going to fail :D
[07:44] <tjaalton> well, there are errors too
[07:44] <tjaalton> since the headers were moved...
[07:44] <tjaalton> although it shouldn't have mattered
[07:45] <tjaalton> if the deps were right, the packages would have been waiting in the depwait queue
[07:48] <tjaalton> stupid g-t can't open urls with epochs :)
[07:49] <tjaalton> Sarvatt: ok, maybe the build-deps should have been versioned, seems like four packages failed to build because the old version was available
[07:50] <tjaalton> Sarvatt: and libx11 can't be synced
[07:50] <tjaalton> if we are going to keep the la_AU stuff
[07:56] <tjaalton> so there are a couple of libs that need to bump the build-dep on libxext-dev
[07:57] <tjaalton> we are fine though, since the builds can be retried later
[08:28] <hyperair> Sarvatt: it seems that X segfaults when changing resolution on i965..
[08:28] <hyperair> using xorg-edger
[08:29] <hyperair> 3: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//intel_drv.so(i830_set_pixmap_bo+0x4b) [0x7fda715b2d6b]
[08:29] <hyperair> 4: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//intel_drv.so [0x7fda715c0f7d]
[08:30] <hyperair> weird that it's calling an i830 function
[08:30] <hyperair> hmm there's a new x-x-v-intel around so i'll just upgrade and see
[08:33] <tjaalton> bryce: so, some libs failed to build because our libxext was newer than what the xextproto was set to Breaks. Once the synced libxext is everywhere, I'll order a round of rebuilds for the missing libs (four of them)
[09:02] <hyperair> ...this has to be the first time i've ever seen X screw up so bad i can't even use a terminal
[13:24] <paran> is this the right place to report problems with packages from xorg-edgers ppa?
[13:25] <tjaalton> if the guilty are here
[13:35] <paran> tjaalton: fair enough
[13:36] <tjaalton> tormod and Sarvatt are the ones you want
[13:36] <tjaalton> tormod is missing atm
[13:37] <paran> Sarvatt should be the guilty one in my case... Or, probably intel upstream
[13:38] <paran> I tried the latest intel packages (<IP_ADDRESS>1+git20091202.a938673e-0ubuntu0sarvatt~karmic), too much glitches to even run a terminal windows
[13:39] <paran> characters only show up as black boxes, until I switch desktop back and forth
[13:40] <paran> gnome-terminal in a pretty much default karmic gnome installation
[13:46] <paran> the previous version 2:2.9.1~git-0ubuntu0tormod caused some corrupted fonts after suspend (not the same corruption), but was otherwise ok.
[13:47] <paran> also thanks a lot for the ppa-purge script, very useful :)
[15:35] <freeflyi1g> hi dudes, how to use thinkpad's trackpoint on karmic?
[15:36] <freeflyi1g> I already configure it with gpointing-device-settings
[15:37] <freeflyi1g> X.0.log and lsinput output are here
[15:37] <freeflyi1g> http://paste.ubuntu.com/334564
[15:37] <freeflyi1g> http://paste.ubuntu.com/334565
[15:38] <freeflyi1g> tseliot: any clues?
[15:41] <tseliot> freeflyi1g: it should work just like a mouse, in relative mode, I guess
[15:42] <freeflyi1g> tseliot: I didn't get that lucky :)
[15:43] <tseliot> freeflyi1g: what's the problem?
[15:44] <freeflyi1g> tseliot: like scrolling can't be used
[15:45] <tseliot> tjaalton: ^^
[15:45]  * tseliot doesn't own a trackpoint
[16:28] <tjaalton> tseliot: can't check the urls now. xinput should work though
[16:29] <tseliot> does scrolling work with trackpoints?
[16:29] <tseliot> is it supposed to?
[16:36] <tjaalton> it's disabled by default
[16:37] <tjaalton> you need to hold a button down and then scroll
[16:38] <tjaalton> middlemouse by default
[16:42] <freeflyi1g> tjaalton: is there anything need to be done in kernel?
[16:42] <tjaalton> freeflyi1g: no
[16:43] <freeflyi1g> tjaalton: then trackpoint can't be detected here, I'm using lucid
[16:44] <tjaalton> xinput list, xinput list-props $id, xinput set-int-prop...
[16:44] <tjaalton> it doesn't work at all?
[16:45] <freeflyi1g> tjaalton: just the scrolling
[16:45] <tjaalton> so use xinput
[16:45] <tjaalton> to enble the property
[16:45] <tjaalton> +a
[16:50] <Sarvatt> darn libxinerama needs to publish already, cant build anything right now
[16:51] <bryce> tjaalton, aha.  did xextproto get fixed up?  anything I can do to help with this?
[16:51] <tjaalton> bryce: everything should be ready, but apparently libxinerama needs a retry?
[16:53] <Sarvatt> xinerama built fine
[16:53] <Sarvatt> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libxinerama/2:1.1-1/+build/1378080
[16:54] <Sarvatt> installing x11proto-xinerama-dev wanted to remove all of gnome dev packages too
[16:55] <Sarvatt> proto breaks the old libxinerama-dev version is all
[16:55] <tjaalton> I don't follow..
[16:55] <Sarvatt> hyperair: you and me both! intel git is so messed up right now
[16:59] <Sarvatt> libgtk2.0-dev tries to pull in libxinerama-dev
[16:59] <tjaalton> ok, so it's just a matter of time then
[17:00] <tormod> Sarvatt, I got libxinerama-dev 1.1 a few hours ago
[17:01] <tjaalton> bryce: the drivers might make it in debian this weekend (depends if there are people to upload them), which would allow us to sync them on monday
[17:01] <Sarvatt> ok both of the mirrors i use are screwy then, one didnt have the protos at all
[17:01] <tjaalton> gotta go again ->
[17:01] <bryce> tjaalton, ok
[17:02] <bryce> regarding xorg-edgers breakages... especially this cycle we probably should encourage people to look to upstream when they run into issues
[17:02] <hyperair> Sarvatt: ..again, huh.
[17:02] <tormod> bryce, that's usually what we do when they use xorg-edgers
[17:03] <bryce> tormod, ok
[17:03] <hyperair> Sarvatt: well hopefully it'll get stable before the next release
[17:03] <Sarvatt> hyperair: yeah its like a year ago only worse this past month in intel git :D i'm still using a checkout from 11/06 since it was the last time things just worked
[17:04] <hyperair> Sarvatt: heh, i've gone back to using the one in karmic =D
[17:04] <Sarvatt> oh not using lucid then?
[17:04] <tormod> bryce, it's also the main reason for xorg-edgers :) when upstream says "so you have a bug - try latest git"
[17:06] <tormod> what's cool now is that with lucid A1 + xorg-edgers, you have pretty much everything latest git, kernel, mesa, xserver, drivers
[17:06] <Sarvatt> phew! the libxinerama problem was just a mirror problem, both of the ones I tried weren't updated
[17:06] <hyperair> Sarvatt: no, not using lucid. i think i'll wait until somewhere around alpha 2 or so before upgrading
[17:09] <tormod> Sarvatt, you might noticed libxinerama worked fine in xorg-edgers also :)
[17:09] <bryce> tormod, right, I was just concerned with the number of people coming here for help with xorg-edgers issues
[17:10] <bryce> concerned in the sense that I don't want Sarvatt wearing himself out!  :-)
[17:11] <tormod> bryce, well that's fine, so we know what's up and can tell them/upstream. as long as it does not get too busy in this channel :)
[17:12] <tormod> yes we don't want that!
[17:12]  * Sarvatt disappears for months again
[17:24] <Sarvatt> woohoo, took 6 reboots but I made it into X with the latest intel :D
[17:24] <tormod> Sarvatt, your 12-Add-libudev... does not apply against master?
[17:25] <Sarvatt> i have a hook to wget a refreshed one that does
[17:26] <tormod> yes, the wget'ed one does not apply, unless I am doing something stupid
[17:27] <tormod> yes I did ^
[17:27] <Sarvatt> phew
[17:28] <Sarvatt> was going to say, it was working 30 minutes ago when i uploaded a new xserver
[17:28] <tormod> I had the old version laying around, did you just change it?
[17:28] <Sarvatt> change what? the patch? nope havent touched it since last night
[17:29] <Sarvatt> ahh i've gotta run, 2 hours late to a job :D
[19:25] <Sarvatt> jcristau: the flashing on 2.6.32 is fixed in drm-intel-next for me. of course what fixed it i have no clue
[19:28] <Sarvatt> down to 7.4w idle power usage now from around 8.1 too. i just tried this out since drm-intel-next doesnt merge into 2.6.32 cleanly right now http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/drm-intel-next/current/
[19:30] <jcristau> Sarvatt: ah.  would be nice to figure out what fixed it to get it into 2.6.32.x.. :)
[19:31] <Sarvatt> 31 possibilities there
[19:32] <jcristau> maybe i can try tomorrow.  need to work though, and right now i should get home..
[19:47] <tormod> drm-next in kernel-ppa, that's awesome! how come I missed that
[20:06] <tjaalton> tormod: are you a DD now?-)
[20:07] <tormod> tjaalton, no why?
[20:07] <tjaalton> tormod: ah ok, saw the intel-gpu-tools upload, but that was sponsored?
[20:07] <tormod> at my current rate of Debian development I can be a DD in like ten years I guess :)
[20:08] <tormod> yes, I am a co-maintainer ("uploader" which is kind of wrong name) of some packages
[20:09] <tormod> I am discussing with the radeontool maintainer also
[20:10] <tjaalton> heh ok. I guess we need a DD to upload the current stack to unstable, and the drivers once they are ready in git
[20:10] <tormod> starts with j and ends with cristau :)
[20:11] <tjaalton> too busy I hear :)
[20:11] <tjaalton> any DD, willing to do the job this weekend after everything is go, would do
[20:13] <tormod> did you ask bgoglin?
[20:16] <tjaalton> jcristau did, no reply so far. let's see how it goes :)
[20:16] <jcristau> i'm asking -release if that'd be ok with them, too..
[20:16] <tjaalton> great
[21:02] <bryce> tjaalton, anything I can help with on xserver 1.7 right now?
[21:03] <bryce> ideally it would be nice to get xserver 1.7 uploaded today, but if that's not looking possible I have some bug tool work for the desktop team I should get to
[21:11] <tjaalton> bryce: it wouldn't help much anyway, since all the drivers need a rebuild, and it's wise to do that as syncs from unstable
[21:12] <tjaalton> or less work anyway
[21:13] <tjaalton> I believe the uploads to unstable will happen this weekend
[21:13] <tjaalton> so we could sync on monday
[21:13] <bryce> mm
[21:13] <tjaalton> some drivers will remain broken though, like wacom an evtouch (which doesn't build against 1.7)
[21:13] <tjaalton> but that shouldn't matter much for a1
[21:14] <bryce> fair enough, although I'm off all next week (and wife has stated she's banishing me from the computer) so won't be able to assist
[21:14] <tjaalton> oh :)
[21:14] <pwnguin> as long as you mention it in the release notes
[21:14] <tjaalton> bryce: well, there shouldn't be much drama
[21:14] <pwnguin> (wacom, not vacation)
[21:15] <bryce> tjaalton, tseliot might be able to help on the wacom and evtouch issues, could you touch base with him about it?  At least, like pwnguin says, it should be mentioned in release notes
[21:15] <tjaalton> I thought evtouch is dead, evdev supports runtime calibration now..
[21:15] <tjaalton> wacom needs xf86-input-wacom, but ron hasn't packaged it yet
[21:22] <bryce> maybe it is; from the touchpad session at UDS I got the impression it still had its uses
[21:22] <bryce> however evdev was clearly the way forward, it just needs more hardware support
[21:28] <tjaalton> runtime calibration support was added recently, so maybe it was just features missing from evdev that kept evtouch around
[21:29] <bryce> mm
[21:32] <tormod> I remember recently some evdev bugs, and some people using evtouch instead, was it the eeetop maybe?
[21:36] <tormod> no that was 441408 which was fixed in evdev. I guess only older howto
[21:37] <tormod> howto's talk about evtouch
[21:39] <tjaalton> ron packaged wacom after all http://people.debian.org/~ron/wacom/
[21:40] <pwnguin> fast!
[21:40] <tormod> xf86-input-evtouch (0.8.8-0ubuntu7) came recently, with fixes for eeetop
[21:40] <tjaalton> well, I mailed him about the progress yesterday or so
[21:42] <tjaalton> tormod: that's just calibration quirks
[21:42] <tjaalton> same thing can be done for evdev, it's just a matter of deciding where
[21:42] <tjaalton> aiui quirks belong to the kernel
[21:43] <tormod> the fix yes, but why are these people using evtouch?
[21:43] <tjaalton> I believe ogra babbled about calibration once
[21:43] <tjaalton> don't know where we stand now
[21:47] <bryce> we talked about it at length in a session on UDS
[21:47] <bryce> ogra seemed extraordinarily depressed about the whole situation, but gave a ton of good info
[21:48] <bryce> we scoped out a plan for an updated calibration tool, although the blocker is finding someone to do the work (what's new)
[22:21] <tjaalton> bryce: yeah maybe it was about the fact that evtouch had a tool for that. it should be a lot easier to make one for evdev now
[22:24] <bryce> yeah that rings a bell
[22:24] <bryce> (in my swiss cheese memory)
[22:25] <tjaalton> hehe
[22:27] <tormod> RAOF, is it linux-nouveau-modules instead of nouveau-kernel-source now?


[07:04] <dholbach> good morning
[11:13] <dholbach> dpm, do we still need to discuss anything wrt the bundles?
[11:14] <dpm> dholbach, I thought you and popey had finished them last week? Or are there any pending questions?
[11:15] <popey> gah, need to speak to msm about numbers.
[11:16] <popey> dpm: sorry, completely forgot. We don't have exact numbers for how many bundles. It's not clear to me from the ubucontest hangout doc how many there should be
[11:17] <dpm> popey, did you talk to dholbach about it?
[11:17] <popey> he said it was in the doc
[11:17] <popey> but I'm seeing more than just two tiers of swag
[11:18] <popey> and it's further vague because teams can have more than one person, and thus "one swag per person" can be more or less, depending on how many people enter
[11:19] <dholbach> I don't have any more details
[11:19] <dholbach> I guess we need to talk to sturmflut
[11:19] <dholbach> is the question just how many bundles of each tier we need?
[11:19] <popey> we can go for the maximum
[11:20] <popey> yes, but we can't know that until we know how many people enter
[11:20] <popey> e.g. 3 people per team, max N teams
[11:20] <popey> he's on holiday but I can speak to him via telegram
[11:20] <dpm> yes, we should go for the maximum as per http://ubucon.de/sites/ubucon.de/files/UbuContest-Termsofentry.pdf
[11:21] <popey> Ok, I'll go for max. We can always order fewer if we don't need them.
[11:21] <dholbach> ok cool
[11:21] <dpm> yes, that's the idea
[11:21] <dholbach> once we have everything confirmed I can update the terms again
[11:21] <dholbach> Wunmi told me that us that we have to specify them there
[11:22] <popey> how odd.
[11:22]  * popey is speaking to sturmflut
[11:27] <dpm> popey, dholbach in summary, it's http://pad.ubuntu.com/ubucontestbundles
[11:27] <dholbach> thanks!
[11:27] <dpm> popey, dholbach, can I leave it in your hands? Any other questions?
[11:29] <dholbach> I'll just specify in the terms what a large and what a medium bundle is
[11:29] <dholbach> not sure if I need to do anything else?
[11:29] <popey> ya
[11:29] <popey> no it's all good
[11:30] <popey> i just summarised it at http://paste.ubuntu.com/11959051/ :)
[11:30] <popey> 11x small, 4x large
[11:30] <popey> oh, i got it wrong then.
[11:30] <popey> yeah, leave it with me.
[11:33] <dpm> sorry, computer froze
[11:34] <popey> np, all good.
[11:34] <dpm> ok, cool
[12:16] <dholbach> dpm, hum... do we have the contents of the bundles?
[12:16] <dholbach> popey, ^
[12:17] <dholbach> that's what we need for the terms
[12:17] <popey> dholbach: yes, it's in the spreadsheet
[12:17] <popey> but dont yet
[12:17] <popey> because msm needs to check stock
[12:17] <dholbach> ok, let me know once it's confirmed :)
[12:18] <popey> kk
[16:35] <dholbach> all right my friends - I'm out for today - see you all tomorrow!
[17:01] <dpm> Off here too, see you all ... on Monday!
[18:06] <Na3iL> hey, is there any other council members here that could grace us with their presence for a few minutes on meeting in #ubuntu-africa in about 40 mins time?
[18:10] <mhall119> Na3iL: which council?
[18:12] <Na3iL> mhall119, community council or even loco council
[18:17] <Na3iL> mhall119, I think u're the one am looking for x)