[07:35] <dholbach> good morning
[17:46] <mhall119> davidcalle_afk: can you sanity check https://code.launchpad.net/~mhall119/developer-ubuntu-com/apidoc-frameworks-creation/+merge/287069 for me?


[03:23] <cj> cjwatson: were you the one behind grub2?
[03:26] <cj> looks like you're on the pkg-grub-devel probably
[03:26] <cj> weren't you the sole maintainer at one point?  I recall seeing my name on grub at one point :-)
[11:20] <|Ost`Age|> Good Morning
[19:05] <cj> so...  why does I gets prompted to enter the mirror country if I specify ubuntu.osuosl.org instead of us.archive.ubuntu.com ?
[20:09] <cj> it doesn't look like make -j works for the rebuild_netboot target, eh?
[20:10] <cj> It takes 1:30 to rebuild the initrd with that target.  it's seriously putting a crimp in my development lifecycle
[20:22] <cj> anyone have an example of using the classes selector?
[20:28] <cjwatson> cj: don't think there's any tftp preseed support, no
[20:29] <cj> looks like url=tftp://... works fine
[20:29] <cjwatson> cj: I'm a bit inactive at the moment, but I used to be active upstream and I maintain the Debian package.  I don't think it would be fair to describe me as the one behind grub2 though; yes I have a fair bit of code in there, but I was late to the party
[20:30] <cj> and the busybox has a tftp client
[20:30] <cjwatson> oh gosh, so it does
[20:30] <cj> but I'm baking the files in to the initrd now
[20:30] <cjwatson> entirely hadn't noticed that fetch-url had a tftp method
[20:30] <cj> I thought you added that patch
[20:30] <cj> ha
[20:31] <cjwatson> no, git blame says it was Ryan Niebur
[20:31] <cjwatson> oh, I uploaded that particular version to Debian but there was lots of stuff in there :)
[20:31] <cj> your name was all over the debbug I think.
[20:32] <cj> so... classes... I can't find any examples.
[20:32] <cj> what does it do?  just export some value for the early- and late- scripts to use?
[20:43] <cjwatson> is it still a thing?
[20:43] <cjwatson> I thought it was from the old auto-install, which I think was integrated in a somewhat different way
[20:58] <cj> okay.  Maybe so.  I guess that would explain why I can't find any examples.
[20:58] <cj> I am automating the process of preseeding a set of openstack nodes
[20:59] <cj> I figured I could use controller, compute, block and object as classes with slightly different preseed files for each
[21:00] <cj> but what I'm doing now is specifying file=.../${CLASS}.preseed on the kernel args list and having the first line of ${CLASS}.preseed be d-i preseed/include string preseed
[21:00] <cj> where ./preseed contains general values and ./${CLASS}.preseed contains specific values
[23:15] <cj> if I just wanted to build tmp/netboot/dir_tree/ubuntu-installer/amd64/initrd.gz is there a better target to use than qemu_netinst / rebuild_netinst ?


[09:46] <xnox> tsimonq2:  aha! i should use that to update the branch!
[10:01] <xnox> tsimonq2:  also, why do you think you do not have commit access? all ubuntu core devs have commit access to lp:ubiquity
[12:08] <nteodosio> Hello bryceh, would you like to review bug #1980518 ?
[13:49] <xnox> juliank:  i'm trying to figure out if ubiquity -> sudo -> ubuntu-drivers -> apt -> dpkg all preserve file descriptors between themselves. Or if everything tries to exec things with all descriptors closed.
[13:50] <juliank> xnox: apt tries to exec with all descriptors except 1,2 closed
[13:50] <juliank> though it's configurable
[13:50] <juliank> I think python does too?
[13:50] <xnox> which bits of code should i look at? i.e. where is it configurable / where does it do the closing?
[13:50] <juliank> You have to manually mark fds as keep open in python since a few months?
[13:51] <xnox> maybe i should give up on that, and instead just create a new file in /run and pass environment variable to be used.....
[13:51] <xnox> i am assuming apt doesn't randomly clear DEBCONF_DB_OVERRIDE variable
[13:51] <juliank> e.g. APT::Keep-Fds { "3"; "4"; "5"; }
[13:51] <juliank> um
[13:51] <juliank> add a ;
[13:52] <xnox> ack.
[13:52] <xnox> thanks.
[13:58] <xnox> and yes python changes are urgh.
[13:58] <xnox> so i think i will give up on the idea of passing FDs because it is fragile to go via three codebases reliably.
[13:59] <xnox> and will opt for an extra debconf database.
[15:01] <bryceh> nteodosio, sure will do
[15:07] <jawn-smith> During my +1 shift I noticed an odd circular dependency.
[15:08] <jawn-smith> Package golang-github-jackc-pgtype is in NEW and is dependency wait on golang-github-jbackc-pgx-v4-dev
[15:08] <jawn-smith> s/jbackc/jackc/
[15:09] <jawn-smith> golang-github-jackc-pgx-v4-dev is a new binary package from the source package golang-github-jackc-pgx, which is currently trying to migrate from major version v3 to v4
[15:10] <jawn-smith> However, the major version v4 can't build because it is dependency wait on golang-github-jackc-pgtype-dev
[15:10] <jawn-smith> so package A in NEW can't build without a binary from package B that can't be built without binaries from package A.
[15:11] <jawn-smith> ∞
[15:26] <jawn-smith> I briefly thought about combining the packages, but that is not idea for a few reasons. One being it breaks our golang-github-<username>-<repo> packaging convention, and the other being that it would install possibly un-needed source code on people's machines if they install the combined package but really only needed one. Does anyone have any suggestions?
[15:27] <rbasak> seb128 or tsimonq2: please could one of you review https://code.launchpad.net/~racb/ubuntu-sponsoring/+git/ubuntu-sponsoring/+merge/426087 for me, as you've touched the code recently?
[15:50] <seb128> rbasak, no today, but if tsimonq2 doesn't beat me to it I will try to review it monday
[16:04] <rbasak> Sure, thanks!
[16:22] <bryceh> jawn-smith, the two approaches I've generally found effective are a) if the dependency is only due to test requirements, disable testing during build; b) if there are earlier versions in debian that do not have the dependency issue, you can ask an AA to remove the back packages from New, then incrementally upload the earlier intermediary versions and bootstrap your way up
[16:24] <jawn-smith> bryceh: Thanks for the reply! I'll take a look to make sure they're not just test dependencies
[16:51] <tsimonq2> rbasak: OOOH yes I'll review this today!! An MP to ubuntu-sponsoring, I'm excited :)
[18:37] <bryceh> nteodosio, pdf2djvu lgtm, upload sponsored.  I notice you also had a debian-goodies merge proposed, which LGTM, and have sponsored that as well.
[18:38] <nteodosio> Thanks bryceh, cheers
[19:42] <FreeVariable[m]> Hello, is there a dedicated Matrix channel for Ubuntu-devel questions?
[19:43] <FreeVariable[m]> Or Slack / Mastodon / Telegram, etc.? Just not IRC in fact :)
[19:43] <FreeVariable[m]> s/Mastodon/Mattermost/
[19:51] <vorlon> if there is, many of us aren't there
[19:51] <vorlon> and matrix can proxy to IRC, so
[19:52] <FreeVariable[m]> Yeah but the user experience is god awful
[19:52] <FreeVariable[m]> but you if suggests there is none. so ok
[19:53] <arraybolt3[m]> FreeVariable: All Matrix features work here, like I can use Matrix reactions on stuff. It's just that only other Matrix users see it.
[19:54] <FreeVariable[m]> arraybolt3[m]: Yeah so there is no point to use features most people won't be able to see / use
[19:54] <FreeVariable[m]> Anyway, my question is: Is there any place where I can see the "pipeline" / stages of a particular Ubuntu package?
[19:55] <vorlon> I'm afraid I don't understand the question.  stages of what?
[19:55] <FreeVariable[m]> packages
[19:55] <FreeVariable[m]> builds
[19:55] <FreeVariable[m]> that are not released yet.
[19:56] <FreeVariable[m]> where I can see the tests, tests results, commits, patches, etc.
[19:56] <vorlon> launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/$package shows all of the versions of a package that are current in the archive, you can drill down into them to see the build logs
[19:56] <vorlon> but most packages in Ubuntu are not driven through VCS commits
[19:56] <FreeVariable[m]> But I am only interested n things not yet released.
[19:56] <FreeVariable[m]> s/n/in/, s//**/, s//**/
[19:57] <FreeVariable[m]> In most distros there is staged worked being tested or otherwise tried out in the build pipeline
[19:57] <FreeVariable[m]> that's what I am interested in
[19:57] <FreeVariable[m]> before it's published
[19:58] <FreeVariable[m]>  * In most distros there is "stage area" with work being tested or otherwise tried out in the build pipeline
[19:58] <vorlon> so you can see this at the granularity of a per-upload package diff, but there's nothing more fine-grained than that
[19:58] <FreeVariable[m]>  * In most distros there is "stage area" with work being tested or otherwise tried out, as in a build pipeline, before release.
[19:58] <vorlon> ok, for that you probably want https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html
[19:59] <vorlon> the -proposed pocket is where the testing happens before packages are released
[19:59] <vorlon> there are corresponding pages for each of the stable release series
[19:59] <FreeVariable[m]> Ok, I'll start with that. Thanks a lot!


[15:49] <mgerdts> @smoser - I pushed some updates for my merge proposal.  Not sure if I should have clicked "resubmit proposal".  Still learning the ropes with LP.  https://code.launchpad.net/~mgerdts/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/343118
[15:51] <smoser> mgerdts: no. dont push 'resubmit' just git push over the top
[15:53] <mgerdts> I did a git push.  Should I have squashed, then push -f?
[15:56] <smoser> mgerdts: you dont have to squash. we squash when we merge.
[15:56] <smoser> and generally, it is nice to  see commits that say "addressed feedback"
[15:56] <smoser> ie, as you did it is really nice. thank you.
[15:56] <mgerdts> :)
[15:57] <mgerdts> The one thing I've not figured out is a portable way to deal with the byte comparisons, other than ord()
[15:58] <mgerdts> I dislike having special code to help tests pass - there's probably a better way for me to do side_effects but I don't know what that is.
[16:00] <smoser> mgerdts: ok. i can poke a bit anad see if i can improve that.
[16:01] <mgerdts> thanks
[16:01] <blackboxsw> looks like it's cloud-init status meeting time again
[16:01] <smoser> o/
[16:01] <blackboxsw> #startmeeting Cloud-init bi-weekly status meeting
[16:01] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Apr 16 16:01:49 2018 UTC.  The chair is blackboxsw. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:01] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[16:02] <rharper> o/
[16:03] <blackboxsw> Hi folks, welcome to cloud-init's bi-weekly status meeting. Feel free to interject at any time or bring up branches/bugs/questions over the next 30-60 mins. We'll have a number of folks around to get eyes and/or keyboards onto any problems.
[16:03] <dpb1> o/
[16:04] <blackboxsw> As always we'll go through the following topics (feel free to suggest others): Recent-changes, In-progress Development, and ~30 mins Office Hours)
[16:04] <blackboxsw> #topic Recent-changes
[16:06] <blackboxsw> a quick rundown of the hi level changes landed:
[16:06] <blackboxsw> Prune integration test artifacts
[16:06] <blackboxsw> Add support for LXD 3.0, fix pylxd integration test dependency
[16:06] <blackboxsw> Fix Ubuntu proposed integration test CI job
[16:06] <blackboxsw> Fix ec2 validation of instance-data.json network info
[16:06] <blackboxsw> Do not retry optional userdata on 404 (LP: #1702160)
[16:06] <blackboxsw> Add explicit cloud-init package dependency on isc-dhcp-client (LP: #1759307)
[16:06] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1702160 in cloud-init "OpenStack datasource should not retry user-data on 404" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702160
[16:06] <ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1759307 in cloud-init (Ubuntu) "missing dependency on isc-dhcp-client (dhclient)" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1759307
[16:08] <blackboxsw> additionally from most recent commits we have:
[16:08] <blackboxsw> tools: Fix make-tarball cli tool usage for development
[16:08] <blackboxsw> renderer: support unicode in render_from_file.
[16:08] <blackboxsw> Implement ntp client spec with auto support for distro selection
[16:08] <blackboxsw> Apport: add Brightbox, IBM, LXD, and OpenTelekomCloud to list of clouds.
[16:08] <blackboxsw> tests: fix ec2 integration network metadata validation
[16:08] <blackboxsw> tests: fix integration tests to support lxd 3.0 release
[16:08] <blackboxsw> correct documentation to match correct attribute name usage.
[16:08] <blackboxsw> cc_resizefs, util: handle no /dev/zfs
[16:09] <blackboxsw> Last week rharper found and fixed a regression in zfs resize behavior that was blocking our ubuntu SRU
[16:09] <blackboxsw> We have uploaded those fixes, as well as rharper's ntp spec changes (which should incorporate a number of robjo's opensuse/sles needs too)
[16:10] <blackboxsw> anything else notable that I'm missing gentlemen?
[16:10] <blackboxsw> If not, I'll jump to in-progress development
[16:11] <blackboxsw> #topic In-progresss Development
[16:13] <blackboxsw> So, on the ubuntu side of the house we are about to approve the cloud-init 18.2 SRU (Stable release update) into xenial and artful. Just one more validation run and we should be good to see 18.2.4 on xenial, artful. Ubuntu Bionic is already a few commits beyond that.
[16:13] <blackboxsw> On Ubuntu as well we are beating the drop to the Bionic LTS (Long term release) feature/bug freeze.
[16:14] <blackboxsw> This week marks the last week for use to get fixes into Bioinic images before that release is cut.
[16:14] <blackboxsw> so we'll be heads down on any Bionic-specific changes that need to get in.
[16:14] <blackboxsw> Feel free to checkout our trello board @
[16:14] <blackboxsw> #link https://trello.com/b/hFtWKUn3/daily-cloud-init-curtin
[16:15] <blackboxsw> we track all tasks we are working on in public view there so if there are any questions you can ping one of us here about our development efforts
[16:17] <blackboxsw> additional tasks that are in flight:  bash-autocompletion for cloud-init CLI (rhaper).  dropping ifconfig and route in favor of 'ip' (bbsw), and moving openstack datasource to cloud-init's local stage
[16:17] <blackboxsw> (smoser)
[16:17] <blackboxsw> also a couple of bugs to fix such as #1570997
[16:17] <blackboxsw> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cloud-init/+bug/1759406
[16:17] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1759406 in cloud-init (Ubuntu) "sru cloud-init (17.2-35-gf576b2a2-0ubuntu1~16.04.1 update to 18.2-4-g05926e48-0ubuntu1)" [Medium,Confirmed]
[16:17] <blackboxsw> oops paste fail:
[16:17] <blackboxsw> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1570997
[16:17] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1570997 in ssh-import-id (Ubuntu Xenial) "fail if HOME environment variable is not set" [Low,Fix committed]
[16:18] <blackboxsw> I think that about wraps in-progress development, anything else that should be noted smoser rharper ?
[16:18] <rharper> I think you covered it
[16:18] <smoser> ssh-import-id is not relally at all related to cloud-init
[16:19] <smoser> thanks blackboxsw
[16:19] <blackboxsw> oops grabbed the wrong one, was thinking about this card
[16:19] <blackboxsw> #link https://trello.com/c/JVaXSfpo/749-eol-fix-for-ssh-file
[16:19] <smoser> right.
[16:21] <blackboxsw> also of note, in some of our SRU testing we found time-tracking gaps in cloud-init analyze tracking on Azure. rharper put of a logging tracker fix to avoid those tracking gaps
[16:21] <blackboxsw> #link https://code.launchpad.net/~raharper/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/343123
[16:21] <smoser> i'll point out one thing i just finished up with...
[16:22] <smoser> for testing ubuntu, the https://github.com/cloud-init/ubuntu-sru/ has 'get-proposed-cloudimg' and 'lxc-proposed-snapshot'
[16:22] <smoser> which now work more like each other.l and can do more than just upgrade cloud-init.
[16:23] <blackboxsw> thanks smoser. Great tools to quicken dev-test cycles and make cloud-init development easier. That wraps up what we've been up to. We can probably move to the open forum for any discussions folks want to have
[16:23] <blackboxsw> #topic Office Hours (next ~30 mins)
[16:24] <blackboxsw> We'll be hanging out here for anyone who wants more eyes on a review, feature discussions or bug triage....
[16:28] <smoser> mgerdts: i'm poking at the branch i think i shoudl be able to get something.
[16:29] <mgerdts> I'm working on a bunch of fixes for things that have turned up on bhyve with SmartOS.  Since we are looking to transition from KVM to bhyve, we will need to provide updates at least as far back as xenial and probably trusty.  Is the process for this any more complicated than get the fixes in master, then cherry-pick the fixes into branches?
[16:29] <mgerdts> thanks @smoser
[17:09] <rharper> mgerdts: we preferrer not to cherry; rather we release master back to xenial via our SRU (Stable Release Update) process; however, we spend a lot of effort to not modify existing behavior on prevlous SRU releases;  so if the changes to support bhyve can be done in a compatible way (working with either) that'd be best;  worst-case, we patch in release specific bahvior into the release branch.
[17:13] <mgerdts> Pretty much everything that I've got queued up is fully compatible.
[17:14] <mgerdts> https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+bug/1667735 implements proper protocol negotiation over the serial port.   The lack of this has caused problems with KVM at times too.
[17:14] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1667735 in cloud-init (Ubuntu Trusty) "cloud-init doesn't retry metadata lookups and hangs forever if metadata is down" [Medium,Confirmed]
[17:15] <mgerdts> https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+bug/1746605 adressess times when cloud-init and other software may be trying to use the metadata serial port at the same time.  This is purely a bug fix.
[17:15] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1746605 in cloud-init "DataSourceSmartOS needs locking" [Medium,Confirmed]
[17:15] <mgerdts> I hit it when rc.local and cloud-init were both trying to get metadata.
[17:17] <mgerdts> https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+bug/1763480 makes it so that cloud-init doesn't stack trace and exit when there is no customer_metadata.  This is an unlikely case, but something that is hit when you are testing things that don't need ssh keys, etc.
[17:17] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1763480 in cloud-init "DataSourceSmartOS list() should always return a list" [Medium,Confirmed]
[17:18] <mgerdts> https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+bug/1763512 finishes off the partial implementation of sdc:routes support.  Previously, we didn't publish the required information to VMs, so it is fair to consider this a new feature.
[17:18] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1763512 in cloud-init "DataSourceSmartOS ignores sdc:routes" [Medium,Confirmed]
[17:19] <mgerdts> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cloud-init/+bug/1763511 is probably the most incompatible change.  New ephemeral disks will get ext4 instead of ext3, which is needed for larger disks that seem to be getting more common.
[17:19] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1763511 in cloud-init (Ubuntu) "DataSourceSmartOS should default to ext4" [Undecided,New]
[17:21] <mgerdts> I think that's all that I have in the works right now.  Do any of these sound like they would be problematic as far back as Xenial?
[17:29] <rharper> new features are OK ,bug fixes are fine as well; I think that different filesystem is somewhat tricky
[17:30] <smoser> i think i'm generally ok with the different filesystem.
[17:31] <smoser> if the reason is that simply ext3 can't handle super-big
[17:31] <rharper> yeah, that doesn't seem so user-visible w.r.t configuration;
[17:32] <smoser> we could ensure being more backward compat if we checked the size of the disk and made an ext4 if > that-size
[17:32] <smoser> then there'd less issue
[17:32] <smoser> but more complication and future we'd be stuck with that
[17:32] <rharper> yeah, it wouldn't have worked on ext3 then it would be fine to use ext4
[17:32] <smoser> so i'd rather really just bite the bulleet
[17:32] <rharper> it could be a metadata flag that the Datasource looks for
[17:32] <smoser> rather than describing to pepole forever "well, if your  disk is < X you'll get ext3 otherwise ext4"
[17:49] <blackboxsw> rharper: got time for a netplan global dns hangout?
[17:49] <rharper> y
[17:49] <blackboxsw> I want to make sure I'm reading the tea leaves right
[17:52] <smoser> mgerdts: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/5qdtFzY8w7/
[17:52] <blackboxsw> ok rharper I'm in cloud-init hangout
[17:52] <smoser> that makes tests pass. and i think the changes to the code path are right
[17:52] <rharper> ok
[17:52] <rharper> brt
[17:54] <smoser> it is still hacked in a sense that the response only deals with fp.read(1) rather than possibly anything that read more than 1.
[17:56] <cyphermox> blackboxsw: rharper: what's this about netplan global dns?
[17:57] <rharper> cyphermox: converting network v1 syntax from maas into something that works with netplan which doesn't have "dns" unbound to any interfaces
[17:57] <cyphermox> ok
[17:57] <rharper> maas I believe has fixed this for 2.4.x
[17:58] <rharper> they no longer will emit the type: nameserver  but legacy maas would have that, so we've a branch that stuffs them in reasonable places under defined interfaces which don't already have DNS values
[17:58] <blackboxsw> cyphermox: just SRU validation w.r.t. https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-init/+bug/1750884
[17:59] <ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1750884 in cloud-init "[2.4, bionic] /etc/resolv.conf not configured correctly in Bionic, leads to no DNS resolution" [Medium,Fix released]
[17:59] <cyphermox> all good
[18:11] <blackboxsw> ooops, and /me forgot the end the epic meeting
[18:11] <blackboxsw> thx rharper for the chat
[18:11] <blackboxsw> #endmeetiung
[18:11] <blackboxsw> #endmeeting
[18:11] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Apr 16 18:11:33 2018 UTC.
[18:11] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/cloud-init/2018/cloud-init.2018-04-16-16.01.moin.txt
[18:11] <blackboxsw> e
[18:11] <rharper> y
[18:34] <mgerdts> smoser: everything checks out on my end with your change.  I've pushed an update to LP.  Thanks!
[20:32] <blackboxsw> ok just finished SRU verification
[20:32] <blackboxsw> officially.
[20:32] <blackboxsw> I'm adding the verification-done tags now
[20:34] <rharper> \o/
[20:48] <smoser> mgerdts: still there?
[20:48]  * mgerdts here
[20:48] <smoser> ok. i'm on 62cafc5080ce3a21180770b65c43bb0964cdd70d of your (i think out of date branch)
[20:48] <smoser> i paste-failed earlier
[20:49] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/MtHPY4PKRb/
[20:49] <smoser> thats what i have now. i have been working on it since.
[20:51] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Qq9YZkfJQY/
[20:52] <smoser> that one with flake8 fixes
[20:53] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/kbhVHvJHCs/ <-- and that with one fix
[20:53] <mgerdts> ok, is it this last one I should be grabbing?
[20:53] <smoser> yeah.
[20:53] <smoser> i can paste files too if thats easier
[20:54] <mgerdts> Is there a trick to make curl work with paste.ubuntu.com?
[20:54] <smoser> not really
[20:54] <smoser> here https://hastebin.com/raw/exukejojec
[20:54] <smoser> https://hastebin.com/raw/fagotonixu
[20:55] <mgerdts> I'm fine with (and prefer) patches.  It's just the download to my mac, scp where I need it to be, then run patch workflow that is tedious.
[20:55] <mgerdts> curl | patch is much eaiser
[21:21] <smoser> mgerdts: patch raw https://hastebin.com/raw/damujotohe
[21:21] <smoser> sorry. went afk for a bit
[21:22] <mgerdts> no worries.. I had it worked out already.  Was just reading through trying to make sense of it all.
[21:22] <smoser> i think its fairly straight forward. the reader just returns the bytes it has. like BytesIO
[21:23] <smoser> but allows the 'end_byte' to indicate an EOF. so as to get your short readds in there.
[21:23] <mgerdts> Yeah, mostly so.  It looks as though it has more features than are strictly needed and I was just looking to see if there was something I was missing.
[21:23] <smoser> i did the ShortReader rather than what i initially had because previously only 'read(1)' would work. if we changed the implementation it'd be busted.
[21:23] <smoser> yeah... i knwo.
[21:24] <mgerdts> I think we pretty much have to stick with read(1), as we don't have a way to put bytes that shouldn't have been read back.  But maybe that'
[21:25] <mgerdts> s not a big deal
[21:25] <smoser> yeah.
[21:26] <mgerdts> tox is happy, and it still seems to work in a VM.
[21:27] <mgerdts> I've pushed this change up to LP.
[21:27] <mgerdts> thanks, again, for your help with this.
[21:35] <mgerdts> from my read of the docs, I should be able to put cloud-config into cloud-init:user-data and that should override defaults.   But that seems not to work, at least for disk_setup and fs_setup.  Any idea where I might be going wrong?  https://hastebin.com/ovopajituh.php
[21:45] <rharper> mgerdts: do you have your cloud-init.log ?
[21:47] <mgerdts> https://hastebin.com/oxekuluhum.sql
[21:48] <mgerdts> I guess it is sql because it found 'blob' in it somewhere.
[21:48] <rharper> looks like yourr layout isn't correct
[21:48] <rharper> you have a boolean and it should be a list of partition sizes
[21:49] <rharper> oh, I see
[21:49] <rharper> the single partition
[21:50] <rharper>  Failed to find device during available device search.
[21:50] <rharper> 2018-04-16 21:13:42,054 - cc_disk_setup.py[DEBUG]: Automatic device for /dev/vdb identified as None
[21:50] <rharper> 2018-04-16 21:13:42,054 - cc_disk_setup.py[DEBUG]: No device aviable that matches request.
[21:50] <rharper> it didn't find your /dev/vdb
[21:53] <mgerdts> Doing a fresh run... one minute
[21:56] <mgerdts> https://hastebin.com/wexarotilu.go
[21:56] <rharper> looking
[21:56] <mgerdts> changed layout and overwrite to false.  cloud-init clean, rm /var/log/cloud-init*
[21:57] <mgerdts> then halted the vm, rolled-back the zvol under vdb to its initial state (all zeroes), then booted it.
[21:57] <rharper> that looks good
[21:57] <rharper> cc_disk_setup.py[DEBUG]: Creating file system ephemeral0 on /dev/vdb
[21:57] <rharper> 2018-04-16 21:53:25,025 - cc_disk_setup.py[DEBUG]:      Using cmd: ['/sbin/mkfs.ext3', '/dev/vdb', '-L', 'ephemeral0', '-F']
[21:57] <rharper> 2018-04-16 21:53:25,025 - util.py[DEBUG]: Running command ['/sbin/mkfs.ext3', '/dev/vdb', '-L', 'ephemeral0', '-F'] with allowed return codes [0] (shell=False, capture=True)
[21:57] <rharper> 2018-04-16 21:53:25,402 - util.py[DEBUG]: Creating fs for /dev/vdb took 0.386 seconds
[21:58] <mgerdts> but I specified xfs
[21:58] <rharper> oh, fs isn't right though, you wanted xfs
[21:58] <rharper> hrm
[21:59] <mgerdts> It looks like I'm specifying it correctly but it's just being mishandled, right?
[22:00] <rharper> I don't know what's getting passed to mkfs, but it appears that it's not the fs_setup entry
[22:00] <mgerdts> 2018-04-16 21:53:25,011 - cc_disk_setup.py[DEBUG]: Partitioning disks: {'/dev/vdb': {'_origname': 'ephemeral0', 'overwrite': False, 'table_type': 'mbr', 'layout': False}}
[22:01] <mgerdts> that comes some time after it shows that it picked up the config that I set in user-data
[22:01] <rharper> hrm, lemme check something
[22:02] <mgerdts> notice that it says mbr rather than gpt
[22:02] <rharper> y
[22:02] <rharper> this smells like user-data from DataSource isn't getting updated
[22:10] <rharper> hrm, let's see if we can find it in object; on the instance: # python3 -c "from cloudinit import stages; import cloudinit; cloudobj = cloudinit.stages._pkl_load('/var/lib/cloud/instance/obj.pkl'); print(cloudobj.userdata_raw)"
[22:10] <mgerdts> device_aliases: {'ephemeral0': '/dev/vdb'}
[22:10] <mgerdts> disk_setup:
[22:10] <mgerdts>     ephemeral0:
[22:10] <mgerdts>          table_type: gpt
[22:11] <mgerdts>          layout: False
[22:11] <mgerdts>          overwrite: False
[22:11] <mgerdts> fs_setup:
[22:11] <mgerdts>     - label: ephemeral0
[22:11] <mgerdts>       filesystem: xfs
[22:11] <mgerdts>       device: ephemeral0.0
[22:11] <rharper> I see your debug message
[22:11] <rharper> but I want to see if it's recorded into the object; the 'ud' param in the datasource is kepted as self.userdata_raw
[22:11] <rharper> that's referenced in the cloudify() stage which merges config before calling modules
[22:27]  * rharper steps away for a bit
[22:37] <mgerdts> yay, figured it out
[22:37] <mgerdts> needs to start with '#cloud-config`
[22:38] <mgerdts> and with that, I'm stepping away too.
[22:38] <mgerdts> thanks for your help rharper


[06:47] <smoser> erichammond, alestic.com seems to be sad
[06:47] <smoser> i'm getting timeouts
[06:49]  * flaccid goes to check
[06:49] <flaccid> i can confirm that
[06:58] <flaccid> how you been smoser ?
[06:58] <smoser> not bad.
[06:59] <smoser> you ?
[06:59] <smoser> i owe you an email .. its on my todo list (regarding using launching official ubuntu amis)
[06:59] <flaccid> pretty good thanks
[07:00] <flaccid> yep, no problems.  you could send that to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>and ask for an enhancement request, but cc me at<EMAIL_ADDRESS>and i'll get in touch with our team that does the images directly
[07:00] <flaccid> personally, i'm trying to find time to get a debian kernel going with pvgrub..
[07:26] <smoser> you going to come to UDS ?
[07:28] <flaccid> probably not. got a URL to the event?
[07:33] <smoser> flaccid, http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-n/
[07:34] <flaccid> ah october in USA. yeah i just got back from usa and probably won't be back for a few months
[07:34] <flaccid> i am resident in Australia..
[07:37] <smoser> booh
[07:38] <smoser> didn't know where you were, east would have made sense, you have funny hours from my perspective (us eastern)
[07:38] <flaccid> yep +10.00
[08:36] <erichammond> smoser, flaccid: http://alestic.com was revived.  A different web site on the server was being flooded by a botnet and I had to take counter measures.
[08:36] <smoser> erichammond, thanks for your post on the mountall issue
[08:37] <erichammond> smoser: and for all your work.
[08:38] <erichammond> It seemed like not everybody was getting the message through ec2ubuntu and launchpad, so I thought I'd spread it a bit further.
[08:52] <ehsantux> Salaam,
[08:52] <ehsantux> My Dear Friends
[08:52] <ehsantux> I have some questions about Cloud Computing
[08:53] <ehsantux> I want to implement a VCL(Virtual Computing Lab) in our University.
[08:53] <ehsantux> and I want to use a cloud computing solution to implement it.
[08:54] <kim0> ehsantux: please explain in more detail what will that lab be doing
[08:55] <ehsantux> something like this: vclcloud.org
[08:55] <ehsantux> Building a website that users can login and register in it.
[08:56] <ehsantux> and make a reservation system
[08:56] <ehsantux> and submit their jobs in my cloud and get their results
[08:57] <kim0> what kind of "jobs"
[08:57] <ehsantux> High computing jobs
[08:57] <kim0> so like HPC
[08:57] <ehsantux> yep
[08:58] <kim0> all jobs are batch in background
[08:59] <ehsantux> and I want to overlap the grid system to my cloud
[08:59] <ehsantux> people don't need install softwares like Matlab,Gaussian,...
[09:00] <ehsantux> We do it for them
[09:00] <ehsantux> they just submit their jobs and task
[09:00] <ehsantux> and reserve the system
[09:01] <ehsantux> Cant I implement this with Eucalyptus or Opennebula?
[09:04] <kim0> since non of the core devs are talking .. my own opinion is that you don't really need virtualization nor multi-tenancy nor ec2 api compatbility
[09:04] <kim0> you need a HPC grid .. with a batch job scheduling system ... google for "rocks cluster"
[09:05] <kim0> and you might need to write a web front end for submitting jobs/results
[09:06] <ehsantux> So I don't need a cloud solution?
[09:07] <ehsantux> I want to overlap my grid system to a cloud?
[09:07] <ehsantux> Is it possible?
[09:18] <kim0> ehsantux: everything is possible if you code it .. but it's really not needed and not too easy
[19:42] <daker> kim0, anything from the IS ?
[21:36] <kim0> daker: howdy ... not really .. jono says let's bug em next week
[21:37] <daker> fine
[21:44] <daker> kim0,  i think *.u.c should have some priority
[21:44] <kim0> daker: yeah :/ it's just the guys are hyper busy it seems


[08:05] <ikt> how long till meeting?
[08:07] <head_victim> I believe, 2 hours :)
[08:10] <ikt> time for some quality kfc
[08:10] <head_victim> Hah you and your kfc
[08:12] <sagaci> wow, thanks for the indirect reminder :P
[08:13] <head_victim> I'm actually doing my grocery shopping between now and then. THank goodness for online grocery stores.
[08:14] <sagaci> see you all at 9/8pm
[09:26] <ikt> mmmm
[09:45] <birchb> hi
[09:46] <head_victim> Evening birchb
[09:46] <birchb> Well that sucked. Took me ten minutes to figure out to get here :-(
[09:47] <head_victim> Hmm that does suck, what page were you coming from (and we'll try to make it easier)
[09:47] <birchb> First of all the instructions were loosey goosey. You assume we all know IRC.
[09:48] <birchb> Your server is actually chat.freenode.net:7000
[09:48] <head_victim> Yep, but where were you coming from? The wiki page, the loco page, somewhere else?
[09:48] <birchb> and then the dfault Ubuntu client doesn't have a way to specify the IRC channel. :-(
[09:49] <birchb> Facebook message
[09:49] <head_victim> Ok, good to know. jaddi27 maybe next time we can link to a web client that you just have to click to open?
[09:49] <head_victim> birchb: sorry I was just trying to figure out where it wasn't working. It should be easy to join in, that's why we use IRC.
[09:50] <birchb> Wahahahh
[09:51] <birchb> UP on Natty, clieck the 'mem' menu "Chat Account...' menu item
[09:51] <head_victim> You can also just use the link - webchat.freenode.net/#ubuntu-au
[09:52] <head_victim> Sorry, http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=ubuntu-au is the more direct link
[09:53] <ikt> je
[09:53] <ikt> he's not kidding though
[09:53] <ikt> the default empathy irc chat is horrible
[09:53] <ikt> I said that in 11.04 testing but nobody seemed to care =(
[09:53] <ikt> might make a bug report against empathy
[09:54] <head_victim> I've only ever used xchat sorry
[09:55] <head_victim> Just putting stuff to fb and twitter/identica now to try and make it easier in case others are lookinga s well
[09:56] <ikt> kk
[09:56] <sagaci> brb
[09:56] <birchb> That web link you sent me doesn't work cos it uses Flash. Nice try though.
[09:56] <ikt> birchb: grab xchat
[09:56] <ikt> head_victim: yeah I use irssi, but xchat + any other irc in the world is easier to use than the default empathy
[09:56] <birchb> Anyhoo, does anyone here live ni Melbourne and know the Camberwell Sunday market??
[09:57] <ikt> <- adelaide
[09:57]  * head_victim is a Brisbanite
[09:57] <head_victim> Hmmm is it gorilla that lives down there? I know there are a couple of Melbournians in here.
[09:58] <birchb> OK, well I'll explain. The market is a 'flea' market in a carpark. People rent a spot from Rotary for $50. They sell their junk on tables.
[09:58] <birchb> Sooooo
[10:00] <birchb> There's a large number of folk looking for bargains.
[10:00] <sagaci> hi all
[10:00] <jaddi27> head_victim, Yes, I will try to remember to put links to the webchat irc client on the Facebook events from now on
[10:00] <jaddi27> hi sagaci
[10:00] <head_victim> jaddi27: no worries, just trying to lower the level of entry to make it as easy as possible.
[10:00] <jaddi27> Yes, that is fine
[10:00] <head_victim> birchb: sounds like a good spot to promote :)
[10:00] <birchb> Perhaps it would be an opportunity to 'sell' Foss, specifically give away Ubuntu disks...
[10:01] <sagaci> ready to go?
[10:01] <jaddi27> yes, i am
[10:01] <sagaci> #startmeeting Ubuntu-AU October IRC Meeting
[10:01] <meetingology> Meeting started Sun Oct  9 10:01:33 2011 UTC.  The chair is sagaci. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot.
[10:01] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[10:01] <head_victim> birchb: definitely worth a try. We currently don't have any pressed CDs to give away but I could post some business cards or something if that would help.
[10:01] <sagaci> #topic Roll Call
[10:01] <head_victim> o/
[10:01] <jaddi27> hello
[10:01] <ikt> o\
[10:02] <sagaci> hello
[10:02] <jaddi27> to all those who are new, say hello to make sure your attendance is registered
[10:02] <head_victim> birchb: we should be getting some pressed CDs after the release of 11.10 though
[10:02] <sagaci> hi xannen
[10:02] <birchb> Would it be OK to ask for a gold coin to cover the cost of the spot?
[10:02] <xannen> hi sagaci and friends <3
[10:03] <head_victim> birchb: as long as you're covering costs I don't see a problem but I'll definitely ask the powers that be for guidance on the issue.
[10:03] <sagaci> anyone else around?
[10:03] <birchb> I'll shut up now. Need Melbournites though.
[10:03] <head_victim> Evening xannen
[10:04] <head_victim> birchb: tis ok, might be somethign worth bringing to the mailing list as well, there's a LOT more people on that than in here.
[10:04] <xannen> anyone still playing diablo 2 lod 1.13?  :D
[10:04] <sagaci> xannen: maybe for #ubuntu-au-chat since we have our monthly meeting at the moment
[10:04] <sagaci> #chair sagaci head_victim jaddi27
[10:04] <meetingology> Current chairs: head_victim jaddi27 sagaci
[10:04] <xannen> ah sorry my bad, didn't know :P
[10:05] <sagaci> #topic Release Party Updates
[10:06] <sagaci> Just yesterday we had a small release party for Sydney at the Ampersand Bookstore/Cafe... there were six people who came along, ranging from primary-schoolers to veteran IT/linux/ubuntu users
[10:06] <sagaci> We chatted about ubuntu and linux general... we did get a picture, but just waiting for permission off one of the attendees until we can post it to flickr/loco.ubuntu.com
[10:07] <xannen> i'm curious as what's happening at bris party?
[10:07] <head_victim> Looks like it was a good little group that went.
[10:07] <sagaci> the other attendees found out via omgubuntu and facebook. none were on IRC or in this official team, to my surprise
[10:07] <sagaci> but all were keen to have a similar event for each cycle
[10:07] <head_victim> Just goes to show the value of social media I guess. Glad we're branching out.
[10:08] <sagaci> good attendance, considering it was the first one in a few years for sydney
[10:08] <jaddi27> I am glad I made that Facebook event the day before then
[10:09] <sagaci> there was a bit of confusion about the time but I guess we can just blame daylight savings for that
[10:09] <sagaci> I'll do a small report of the event for the wiki, and review for next meetings
[10:09] <head_victim> Yeah I'm beginning to notice dramas with that myself :/
[10:09] <xannen> LOL DL saving
[10:09] <jaddi27> Yes, Facebook times are very difficult to get correct.
[10:09] <sagaci> #action sagaci to write review/reflection of Sydney release event
[10:09] <meetingology> ACTION: sagaci to write review/reflection of Sydney release event
[10:09] <head_victim> The loco.u.c is having fits over it. Where possible I'd suggest making sure you log events/meetings to a UTC time, not a location time.
[10:09] <xannen> catch a photon light, put it in a bottle, save it for a rainy day :D
[10:10] <sagaci> Brisbane update?
[10:10] <head_victim> sagaci: well it's going ahead next weekend
[10:10] <jaddi27> UTC is not possible on Facebook, but i did add the time to the description to try to alleviate the issue somewhat
[10:11] <head_victim> jaddi27: good to know, thanks.
[10:11] <head_victim> The Brisbane release party is going to return to the Breakfast Creek Hotel as it seems this has been a popular venue in the past.
[10:11] <birchb> Easy to understand if you just say "Sydney time" or whatever.
[10:11] <xannen> That's what I was thinking too.
[10:12] <sagaci> yeah, I guess we'd have to make a decision, but I strongly prefer local time
[10:12] <head_victim> Local time is ok for real world events, but when we're running online ones UTC is far better in my opinion.
[10:12] <sagaci> head_victim: agreed
[10:12] <xannen> Here's an idea:  Put both?
[10:13] <jaddi27> Yes, I can do that
[10:13] <xannen> LOL
[10:13] <sagaci> yeah, for local events
[10:13] <birchb> UTC sux
[10:13] <xannen> It's like we're doing admin 101 :D
[10:13] <head_victim> xannen: can't for the loco.u.c pages other than in the description.
[10:13] <jaddi27> For someone in Sydney or Melbourne, that has a Facebook account, can you tell me what times it has listed for this event: http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=142514102513127
[10:13] <head_victim> It hasn't really been an issue until day light savings rolled around.
[10:13] <xannen> head_victim, well, I guess do what we can, and the more info and clarity we can state, the better?
[10:13] <sagaci> head_victim: should be able to, as long as the event venue is in the right timezone
[10:14] <jaddi27> xannen, agreed
[10:14] <sagaci> jaddi27: 08 October · 13:00 - 14:30
[10:14] <jaddi27> ok. that means Facebook is not aware of daylight saving
[10:15] <jaddi27> I will just put the time there, and again in the details with timezone information
[10:15] <xannen> Is there a googleplus page?
[10:15] <jaddi27> You can't do google plus pages yet, as far as i know
[10:15] <sagaci> gorilla: ping for melbourne event...?
[10:15] <jaddi27> You just +1 anything on the internet
[10:16] <xannen> Ah, okay.  I don't trust facebook that all.
[10:16] <head_victim> Last I heard googleplus were actively discouraging groups using their service, it was strictly individuals only.
[10:16] <jaddi27> xannen, http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-au has all of our upcoming events
[10:16] <jaddi27> and you can subscribe to an ical feed of it
[10:16] <sagaci> ikt: ping... adelaide event?
[10:17] <ikt> no adelaide event afaik, it's definitely on my list of things to organise for 12.04
[10:17] <head_victim> ikt: a Sunday evening would suit if you wanted to do one next weekend or evening the weekend after.
[10:17] <ikt> jaddi27: i think with google plus you have a circle, and then you post to that circle although that's more of a group thing :/
[10:18] <ikt> head_victim: yeah definitely, I'll send a msg to the mailing list to see if we have some internet
[10:18] <ikt> interest*
[10:18] <ikt> although 1 week is fairly short notice
[10:18] <sagaci> righteo then
[10:19] <sagaci> #topic Roadmap for Ubuntu-AU/Ubuntu 12.04 LTS
[10:19] <jaddi27> ikt, Yes, I could set up a google+ circle for ubuntu-au, but I am not sure that it is worth it at the moment
[10:19] <head_victim> I already have a circle in my account for UbuntuAU'ers
[10:20] <ikt> share circle with me plx :P
[10:20] <ikt> I have a massive ubuntu circle, has around 50 people in it I think
[10:21] <sagaci> I have a few ideas for events/goals of the next cycle but I'll just swing it around for anyone else to have a say first
[10:21] <xannen> free intel core i7 for everyone?  :D
[10:21] <head_victim> sagaci: focus points being events, socialising and translations?
[10:21] <ikt> wtb more australian bug triagers
[10:21] <jaddi27> I am guessing this is one of your goals, but I would like to see the translations at or close to 100% complete
[10:21] <sagaci> head_victim: yup
[10:22] <head_victim> ikt: as soon as you're willing to hold a session on how to do it I'm sure you'll get more :) Bug triaging is well beyond me at this stage though.
[10:22] <jaddi27> We should also decide on the local version customisations we want to include, as has been raised at previous meetings
[10:22] <sagaci> base packs have been updated but then again, no point until we're 95-100% complete
[10:23] <xannen> ikt, are you a bug coder/fixer?
[10:23] <head_victim> jaddi27: has there been much more movement on the locolisation images from Canonical yet?
[10:23] <ikt> xannen: nah, I deal with the easy stuff :P
[10:23] <jaddi27> I am not really sure - I think sagaci knew more about it than I did
[10:23] <jaddi27> If I can find the link, I will check it out
[10:23] <birchb> what localisations pry tell?
[10:24] <head_victim> birchb: there was a push to start looking at LoCos being able to spin their own customised editions for download.
[10:24] <birchb> Why?
[10:24] <head_victim> Customising language, default wallpapers and settings, etc.
[10:24] <jaddi27> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-cd-localization
[10:24] <sagaci> it was pretty primitive this cycle but the tools are there to make all the possible defaults, like wallpapers, bookmarks, etc
[10:24] <ikt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AustralianTeam/Projects#Translation
[10:25] <birchb> Timezone fixes would #1 for me.
[10:25] <sagaci> events - a few jams, release parties, classroom events
[10:26] <birchb> Especially now that the NIH tz db is out of action.
[10:26] <ikt> free t-shirts >:D
[10:26] <head_victim> ikt: free? You paying? ;)
[10:26] <head_victim> sagaci: I'm really hoping I can work on some Ubuntu Hours now I have a weekday job
[10:26] <jaddi27> ikt, I'd be up for one if you are getting them
[10:27] <ikt> LOL
[10:27] <sagaci> probably better to get the official ubuntu polos then customise
[10:27] <ikt> group buy for discount imo :D
[10:27] <head_victim> I looked into it, and to be honest, I'd probably see more bang for buck in a screenprinted shirt like the lca volunteer ones
[10:27] <sagaci> could be possible, there was a planet-ubuntu post suggesting LoCo discount rates
[10:28] <sagaci> but it'd be hard to gauge who's contributed enough, etc
[10:29] <ikt> mailing list stuff I think
[10:29] <xannen> will it be 100% cotton base polo or T shirt?
[10:29] <sagaci> yep
[10:29] <ikt> could be useful to get who's interested
[10:29] <sagaci> ready to move on?
[10:30] <head_victim> I prefer polos if we're using it when presenting at events
[10:30] <head_victim> sagaci: mailing list looks like a good idea to gauge interest. Although I'd suggest having mockups to take to the ml if someone has time
[10:31] <sagaci> #action t-shirt order/design/feasibility to mailing list
[10:31] <meetingology> ACTION: t-shirt order/design/feasibility to mailing list
[10:32] <xannen> is there an AU section in ubuntuforums?
[10:32] <sagaci> #topic Facebook group upgrade -- jaddi27
[10:32] <head_victim> xannen: yep :)
[10:33] <head_victim> It's in the topic
[10:33] <jaddi27> xannen, au.ubuntuforums.com
[10:33] <xannen> then why don't we use that instead of creating a mailing list?
[10:33] <ikt> mailling list hits more peopel
[10:33] <head_victim> We already have a mailing list, no creating either.
[10:33] <jaddi27> Facebook group update:
[10:33] <xannen> ikt, argh!...  i've been shot.  :P
[10:33] <ikt> lol
[10:34] <jaddi27> Our current Facebook group is in the old groups format, which will all be archived soon
[10:34] <jaddi27> http://www.facebook.com/help/?page=18966
[10:34] <jaddi27> That Facebook page outlines the changes
[10:34] <jaddi27> I propose that we upgrade our group to the new groups format, which will allow us to keep our group, basically as it is at the moment
[10:35] <head_victim> Does anyone else here use FB extensively?
[10:35] <xannen> is it feasible to give google+ circle a go?  just following on social media, and i'm not a fan of facebook.
[10:35] <jaddi27> There will be a few differences, but I think they should not disadvantage us
[10:35] <head_victim> xannen: there's no official way of making circles, everone makes their own circles
[10:35] <head_victim> My circles will never be the same as yours, etc.
[10:35] <jaddi27> xannen, that is the problem with google+ circles at the moment
[10:35] <xannen> ah... damn...
[10:36] <head_victim> We do have twitter and identica accounts as well though
[10:36] <xannen> thanks for the info, head_victim, jaddi27
[10:36] <jaddi27> The other thing we can do, which I have sort of raised before, is create a Facebook page
[10:36] <jaddi27> However, pages cannot create events, which would be a disadvantage to us at the moment
[10:36] <ikt> head_victim: you can make a circle and share it afaik
[10:37] <head_victim> jaddi27: would it be better though to just link to loco.u.c so there is only one source for events?
[10:37] <head_victim> I'm not sure how the FB crowd would take to that though
[10:37] <jaddi27> Facebook Pages do have the benefit of posting all updates to people's news feed, which groups do not do
[10:37] <jaddi27> head_victim, That would be one way of doing it
[10:37] <jaddi27> I think though that to maximise the messages getting out to people, you would have both
[10:38] <sagaci> head_victim: I'd prefer having loco.ubuntu.com for all rsvp/info
[10:38] <head_victim> I'm a big fan of reducing duplication.
[10:38] <jaddi27> The way I see it:
[10:38] <birchb> YEah but FB is run by an evil basket. Please can you use twitter?
[10:38] <head_victim> birchb: we have twitter and identica accounts as well :)
[10:39] <jaddi27> current group is for discussion by those who are not sure on how to use the mailing list, and for creating events
[10:39] <head_victim> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AustralianTeam/ContactUs is a list of what accounts we have and who admins them
[10:39] <xannen> lol birchb, the evil basket is held by the evil christmas critters (bunny)  (south park reference)  :P
[10:39] <jaddi27> page would act like the twitter account, and whoever is updating the twitter accounts can post the same thing to the Facebook page
[10:39] <head_victim> jaddi27: is there a way to auto feed tweets/dents to the page?
[10:40] <jaddi27> There may be - I know that tweet deck could post to Facebook pages, so I presume others can also
[10:40] <jaddi27> I have not looked into all of the different clients though
[10:40] <jaddi27> (there are a lot of them available)
[10:41] <head_victim> jaddi27: no worries, just trying to see if there' s a streamlining benefit to this as well ;)(
[10:41] <jaddi27> Yes, I think there would be
[10:42] <head_victim> Would it still be open to general discussion like the current one is or would it be locked down to only admins posting?
[10:42] <xannen> lol our discussion on media/publicity is like the recent tax forum, it's a mess.  :P  not here, not there.  :P
[10:42] <jaddi27> You can set it up in both formats
[10:43] <jaddi27> http://www.facebook.com/ubuntulinux
[10:43] <ikt> xannen: i think that's just the situation at the moment, facebook/g+/twitter/iden are all not compatible with each other
[10:43] <jaddi27> That is an example of a Facebook page
[10:43] <ikt> closed source ftl :P
[10:43] <head_victim> I like the idea of members posting to it to encourage discussion but not sure how it would go spamming all members
[10:43] <jaddi27> twitter and iden are compatible with eachother
[10:44] <jaddi27> head_victim, posting to a Facebook page will not spam people who like the page
[10:44] <jaddi27> only the posts from the admins of the page will go to the news feed of the people who have liked it
[10:44] <head_victim> Ah that sounds good then
[10:44] <xannen> ikt, it's outrageous that social media is about connecting, and the social media are not talking to each other!  LOL
[10:44] <sagaci> anything else?
[10:45] <jaddi27> Am I fine to upgrade the current group?
[10:45] <head_victim> I'm happy to go along with whatever jaddi27 recommends as he's by far the most active admin of the FB page
[10:45] <jaddi27> and do the page
[10:45] <sagaci> let's try this
[10:45] <head_victim> And knows a whole heap more than I do about the FB stuff :)
[10:45] <head_victim> Others ok with the idea as proposed?
[10:45] <sagaci> #vote Should jaddi27 update the Facebook group?
[10:46] <meetingology> Please vote on: Should jaddi27 update the Facebook group?
[10:46] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[10:46] <ikt> +1
[10:46] <meetingology> +1 received from ikt
[10:46] <sagaci> +1
[10:46] <head_victim> +1
[10:46] <meetingology> +1 received from head_victim
[10:46] <meetingology> +1 received from sagaci
[10:46] <jaddi27> can I vote, or not?
[10:46] <xannen> +0.5
[10:46] <meetingology> +0.5 received from xannen
[10:46] <head_victim> Sure :)
[10:46] <xannen> +1
[10:46] <meetingology> +1 received from xannen
[10:46] <jaddi27> +1
[10:46] <meetingology> +1 received from jaddi27
[10:46] <birchb> +1
[10:46] <meetingology> +1 received from birchb
[10:46] <sagaci> #endvote
[10:46] <meetingology> Voting ended on: Should jaddi27 update the Facebook group?
[10:46] <meetingology> Votes for:6 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[10:46] <meetingology> Motion carried
[10:46] <sagaci> gg
[10:47] <jaddi27> i have always wanted to do a vote
[10:47] <xannen> "ring the bell for division"  :D
[10:47] <sagaci> can't just let everything go to an action
[10:47] <jaddi27> Ok. I will go about setting all that up
[10:47] <birchb> Crouch. Touch. Pause. Engage.
[10:47] <sagaci> #action jaddi27 to update the facebook group per vote
[10:47] <meetingology> ACTION: jaddi27 to update the facebook group per vote
[10:48] <sagaci> #topic Ubuntu-AU status updates -- head_victim and sagaci
[10:48] <xannen> +1
[10:48] <head_victim> Well good news, I'm sure you're all aware, we're now offical again :)
[10:48] <sagaci> just wanted to put this in a meeting, just a statement from head_victim about the ubuntu-au LoCo status
[10:48] <sagaci> that's fine
[10:48]  * ikt dances again
[10:49] <jaddi27> great news
[10:49] <head_victim> Thanks everyone for their hard work over the last year or two, it's really paid off.
[10:49] <head_victim> I do think we need to keep the effort up though and make sure we document what we do so that when the next approval rolls around we don't suffer the same fate.
[10:49] <sagaci> and also, I've been changed to the owner for the ubuntu en_AU translation group.. not a huge deal but we now have a mailing list and more control of the group as a whole
[10:49] <xannen> yes, yes.  you're welcome  :P  LOL
[10:49] <head_victim> I think the documentation is just as important as the actualy events. Without the documentation they never happened to anyone who wasn't there.
[10:50] <sagaci> head_victim: that's right
[10:51] <head_victim> xannen: turning up counts as helping mate :)
[10:51] <sagaci> and lastly,
[10:51] <sagaci> #topic Monthly meeting time - daylight savings change?
[10:51] <xannen> head_victim, i'll try  :P
[10:51] <jaddi27> For me the time is fine, but I am in Brisbane, so don't really count, I guess
[10:51] <head_victim> We can do the half hour, because before 6 is getting early for WA people
[10:52] <head_victim> Set it up as 1930 UTC+10 ?
[10:52] <sagaci> probably something to defer to the mailing list but for NSW, VIC and TAS 9pm may be a bit late
[10:52] <head_victim> Split the different that way?
[10:52] <sagaci> I know people like benonsoftware, it would be a bit late, but just saying
[10:53] <xannen> well until we can verify that neutrino does NOT travel faster than light, no point making a time dilation field for aus.  :P
[10:53] <sagaci> I'd defer to the mailing list to account for people that couldn't come to this meeting
[10:53] <head_victim> sagaci: sounds fair
[10:53] <ikt> I'm only inclined to agree because WA's timezone is always a pain
[10:53] <ikt> was dealing with it the other day with regards to people calling in after we'd closed for the night, 99% of the time they're from WA
[10:54] <ikt> also last time we dealt with timezones we did a poll
[10:54] <ikt> would it be better to do it again?
[10:54] <sagaci> #action meeting time change - defer to the mailing list to account for people that couldn't come to this meeting
[10:54] <meetingology> ACTION: meeting time change - defer to the mailing list to account for people that couldn't come to this meeting
[10:55] <head_victim> Who wants to take ownership of that poll? It shouldn't go for more than a week to allow time for people to plan to attend it whenever it's decided for.
[10:55] <sagaci> yeah, I thought you meant a poll in this meeting
[10:56] <head_victim> Evening Jarthur121
[10:56] <Jarthur121> Evening everyone!
[10:56] <sagaci> hi Jarthur121
[10:56] <Jarthur121> Hi Sagaci
[10:56] <Jarthur121> What time does ze meeting start?
[10:56] <sagaci> erm, an hour ago :P
[10:57] <sagaci> were you at the Sydney release yesterday?
[10:57] <ikt> head_victim: I'm just trying to find it now
[10:58] <xannen> sagaci, Yeah, I was finally set free (from windows).  :P
[10:58] <Jarthur121> Ahh, that's typical :P.
[10:58] <Jarthur121> I wasn't at the Sydney release.
[10:58] <sagaci> Jarthur121: are you subscribed to the ubuntu-au mailing list?
[10:59] <xannen> sagaci, just curious, why was the party arranged pre-release date? o.O
[10:59] <sagaci> xannen: since that's when I was in sydney :)
[10:59] <Jarthur121> No I am not, how do I go about it?
[10:59] <head_victim> Evening chrisuys
[10:59] <xannen> sagaci, so self centred.  :P  heheh.
[11:00] <head_victim> Well should we close the meeting and have a meet and greet to help some of the newcomers connect to the team?
[11:00] <sagaci> #endmeeting
[11:00] <meetingology> Meeting ended Sun Oct  9 11:00:11 2011 UTC.
[11:00] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-au/2011/ubuntu-au.2011-10-09-10.01.moin.txt
[11:00] <sagaci> epic, 11:00:11
[11:00] <head_victim> Right on time :)
[11:00] <ikt> perfect timing
[11:01] <xannen> should have been: 11:09:11 .. wouldn't that be a disaster?  :P
[11:01] <ikt> i think https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AustralianTeam/Meetings needs to be updated
[11:01] <birchb> Thankyou head_victim
[11:02] <head_victim> ikt: yeah just need to point it to the loco page
[11:02] <head_victim> keep it as an archive of the old meetings
[11:02] <head_victim> birchb: glad to help, not sure what I did though :)
[11:02] <xannen> head_victim, so next week release party, do we just turn up, grab a drink and chat?  anything else to look forward to?
[11:03] <head_victim> xannen: nothing overly planned, just more a meet and greet and socialise.
[11:03] <head_victim> I would like to bring up some ideas I've been working on
[11:04] <jaddi27> head_victim, here or at the release party?
[11:04] <head_victim> jaddi27: release party, things like ubuntu hours and install fests, etc. So local stuff
[11:04] <xannen> head_victim, can you tell me some of those ideas?
[11:05] <head_victim> xannen: basically I would like to start running Ubuntu Hours in Brisbane
[11:05] <head_victim> And I want to discuss the installation festival idea I put to the mailing list with little result
[11:06] <xannen> head_victim, what do you mean by that?
[11:06] <jaddi27> head_victim, I didn't get back to you on the installfest. November is hard for me due to Uni exams, but I haven't properly cross-referenced the dates you suggested with the exam times yet
[11:06] <head_victim> xannen: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hour
[11:07] <head_victim> jaddi27: you be at the release party?
[11:07] <jaddi27> no, I won't be
[11:07] <head_victim> Ah ok, well yeah, is there a day of the week that suits you if I started running ubuntu Hours, like the first Tuesday or the month or something?
[11:08] <head_victim> I was going to put a poll up but wanted to talk to people about it
[11:08] <jaddi27> what would be involved with ubuntu hours?
[11:09] <jaddi27> times for me vary from semester to semester, so I can't really say until I have the timetable for next semester
[11:09] <head_victim> Just going to a pub/cafe and socialising. Being approachable by strangers.
[11:09] <jaddi27> this semester is very full, so wouldn't fit in at the moment
[11:09] <sagaci> being that 2011 Ubuntu Guy
[11:09] <jaddi27> ok
[11:09] <xannen> I'm up to Ubuntu Hour.  I have no friends. :(
[11:09] <sagaci> xannen: go to a release party
[11:10] <xannen> sagaci, yeah.  I'll try to.  :D
[11:11] <head_victim> Evening Lord_
[11:11] <Lord_> Hey
[11:12] <head_victim> Evening newkid and caryb as well :)
[11:12] <caryb> hi sorry am late
[11:12] <newkid> evening.
[11:12] <head_victim> caryb: no worries mate, it's been run and won but we're just jabbering about
[11:13] <head_victim> I was putting the idea of a Brisbane ubuntu Hour out there
[11:13] <head_victim> You're coming next week aren't you?
[11:13] <caryb> just got home from wa,gga wagga
[11:13] <sagaci> hi newkid
[11:14] <caryb> sure am and bringing 2 newbies
[11:15] <head_victim> Good to hear :)
[11:15] <xannen> is it free chat again?
[11:15] <caryb> sorry for spelling am on android device
[11:15] <head_victim> xannen: yep
[11:15] <xannen> head_victim, cool.
[11:16] <xannen> anyone still play diablo 2 lod?
[11:16] <head_victim> caryb: no worries, I chaired a membership board meeting from my motorola defy the other week ;)
[11:16] <caryb> this is a xoom
[11:17] <head_victim> Oh well lah te dah :)
[11:17] <sagaci> much better than my old symbian
[11:18] <head_victim> How are they, any good for anything or just inbetween being useful for anything.
[11:19] <xannen> so, no diablo 2 gamers?
[11:19] <caryb> feel like I'm being a prostitute using it but is better tham micro$oft
[11:19] <head_victim> xannen: I play Urban Terror occasioanlly
[11:19] <xannen> i haven't heard of that...  i'll look it up
[11:21] <head_victim> It's a FPS that has a native linux versino
[11:22] <xannen> eww... FPS isn't my thing... although I have played wow, which is partially FPS...
[11:22] <caryb> so its italian? :)
[11:22] <head_victim> Hah no, just someone who can't type
[11:25] <xannen> is empathy still default chat program in 11.10?
[11:25] <xannen> it was sad that skype gave up to microsoft.  :(
[11:25] <sagaci> yup
[11:26] <sagaci> I learned that xchat is on the DVD of ubuntu
[11:27] <Lord_> is urban terror in the default repo's?
[11:27] <head_victim> Lord_: nah it's a download you unzip and then make the right file executable and it works
[11:27] <xannen> is diablo 3 also in default repo?  XD
[11:27] <Lord_> ah okay fair enough. I'll have to get it when I get home from uni :P
[11:28] <sagaci> it's not a free as in gpl program
[11:28] <sagaci> iirc
[11:28] <head_victim> Nah it's free as in you don't pay for it.
[11:28] <caryb> am waiting till 13th so i can rebuild my sick oneiric machine
[11:29] <head_victim> caryb: you tested it too hard?
[11:29] <xannen> has anyone use empathy 3.2?  i didn't like empathy 2.34 (in ubuntu 11.04).
[11:30] <caryb> too many work arounds like nvidia etc
[11:30] <head_victim> caryb: ah I've only been VM'ing it so far. I'm too lazy for real testing
[11:31] <ikt> testing it in vm and on a 2nd ssd
[11:31] <caryb> also crappy ppa's
[11:31] <ikt> it's a massive improvment over 11.04
[11:31] <head_victim> I'm starting to remember why I don't use PPAs as a general rule. Too slow to download updates
[11:31] <ikt> but there are still so many tiny issues, that mark pointed out back in like 10.10's uds
[11:31] <head_victim> ikt: I agree, I was hoping it would be and relieved to see it's something I can recommend.
[11:31] <head_victim> 12.04 is going to be great.
[11:32] <caryb> i always have a dedicated lenovo lappy for testing
[11:32] <head_victim> caryb: nice for some :P
[11:33] <caryb> this i would say is my least impressive kubuntu release to date
[11:34] <ikt> http://thisisthecountdown.com/
[11:34] <head_victim> Ah I forgot you're one of those K people :)
[11:34] <head_victim> ikt: yeah that was a surprise, even to the release team. They stumbled across it by accident and wondered where it came from :/
[11:34] <sagaci> there's still an apt-get string that says Updating software catalog... annoys the crap out of me everytime I reinstall, grepped the latest base pack and it looks to be fixed but hasn't been integrated
[11:34] <caryb> long time for fixes
[11:35] <sagaci> kubuntu looks pretty polished but I'm not a kde user
[11:36] <ikt> very good to watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUAzicy_01o&t=30m30s it's marks view on quality
[11:36] <ikt> It always comes to mind whenever there's a small issue that bugs me
[11:37] <Lord_> Is anyone else using python-iview?
[11:37] <sagaci> that keynote was good but there's still those bugs in the icecream
[11:38] <ikt> ueaj tjat
[11:38] <ikt> yeah that's my issue
[11:38] <ikt> specially screen flickers during boot
[11:38] <ikt> i still get text on the screen during boot and shutdown with 11.10
[11:38] <sagaci> I haven't got that issue now
[11:38] <sagaci> I want my login screen to fade into the unity desktop
[11:39] <xannen> When 11.10 is release, will my previous version get automatically notified and updated?
[11:39] <caryb> any how is zzz time night folks
[11:39] <sagaci> when I login - I usually have autologin
[11:39] <xannen> Night caryb <3
[11:39] <sagaci> xannen: not automatically
[11:39] <head_victim> Night caryb
[11:39] <head_victim> xannen: you will be notified there is an update available but you will have to select it
[11:40] <ikt> ^
[11:40] <ikt> it's at the top of update manager
[11:40] <head_victim> Anyone using unity on dual screens?
[11:40] <xannen> head_victim, sagaci, but it will be a seamless over the net update, right?  Do I need to do anything special, besides giving my computer the "go ahead" ?
[11:40] <xannen> head_victim, I am. :D
[11:40] <sagaci> xannen: back up
[11:41] <ikt> xannen: http://ikt.id.au/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/update.png
[11:41] <xannen> I'll probably back up my home folder.  Nothing much on.
[11:41] <ikt> also upgrading sometimes doesn't go well
[11:41] <Lord_> decent net connection is also handy, my net cut out halfway through upgrading from 10.04 to 10.10, ended up having to do a clean install as it wouldn't reboot
[11:41] <head_victim> Lord_: that sucks, usb dongle or adsl?
[11:42] <Lord_> adsl. I think its the router, but I can't afford a new one :P
[11:42] <xannen> Thanks ikt :D
[11:42] <head_victim> I don't mind their move to make Thunderbird the default, but why oh why do they not have the calendar installed as well :/
[11:42] <ikt> but if you're on an isp with an ubuntu mirror, I'd say download it, format and set your home folder to be on a seperate partition, then format/install every new release
[11:43] <ikt> I thought they did?
[11:43]  * head_victim keeps a whole Ubuntu Mirror handy
[11:43] <ikt> gonne check it out
[11:43] <head_victim> Oh wait, it just has gedit as the default for some weird reason
[11:44] <head_victim> Does thunderbird integrate well enough with gmail? I want an offline backup of data and thought that might be an idea
[11:44] <ikt> head_victim: http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/07/14/thunderbird-in-ubuntu-11-10/ <- Work is going on to integrate the Lightning extension for calendar integration into Thunderbird. This will bring the feature-set more on par with Evolution. Last time I tried Lightning it was quite young in it’s development, so I am keen to see how this works.
[11:44] <xannen> i use gmail with thunderbird, much better than hotmail/live account
[11:45] <nnn> ？？？
[11:45] <head_victim> I generally use it online all the time but don't like the idea of not having a backup somewhere
[11:45] <nnn> ?????
[11:45] <nnn> ?????????????????????????????????
[11:45] <nnn> ???????????????????????????////////
[11:45] <head_victim> Gday nnn
[11:45] <nnn> teah
[11:45] <nnn> yeah
[11:45] <xannen> i use lightning/thunderbird.  the main limitation so far (for me anyway) is google task.
[11:46] <head_victim> I've never liked google task anyway
[11:46] <head_victim> I use an android app for basic listing
[11:47] <head_victim> Anyone have any comments on the deja dup backup system they have installed?
[11:49] <Lord_> i tried it out a while back, before I realised that my needs were too basic. Seemed to be pretty good in a does what it says it will kinda way
[11:49] <sagaci> seems ok, haven't used it to restore a backup yet
[11:49] <sagaci> very set and forget kinda tool
[11:49] <head_victim> That's what I hate, backups are only as good as how they restore :/
[11:50] <sagaci> plus it saves in a special duplicity format rather than tar.gz
[11:50] <sagaci> or similar
[11:51] <sagaci> i'd rather ubuntu one, but for smaller stuff
[11:51] <sagaci> text files and files <10MB
[11:52] <head_victim> I use Ubuntu One for some stuff, mainly documents I want to edit from multiple locations
[11:52] <head_victim> Nice now it has a windows client
[11:52] <Lord_> External hdd with esata meets copy and paste. But then I have very little data :P.
[11:53] <Lord_> the windows client requires installation I'm guessing?
[11:54] <head_victim> Not sure, not used it yet.
[11:54] <head_victim> Could be web based
[11:55] <Lord_> Web based would be great. Would be handy for uploading my uni files so I don't have to take my laptop every day. I shall do some investigating
[12:00] <Lord_> Looks like you can install it or use a web-based program.
[12:01] <head_victim> Alrighty, domestic duties call. I'll be back some other time no doubt :)
[12:01] <head_victim> Cheerio
[12:01] <Lord_> cya
[12:02] <gorilla> sagaci: I don't know. I barely have the time to think at the moment.
[12:58] <sagaci> head_victim: planetubuntu-au down again?
[13:00] <sagaci> head_victim: also should put brisbane release event on ubuntu.org.au?
[13:33] <head_victim> sagaci: yeah that and the officialness should go there
[13:34] <head_victim> It's hard to get excited about it though, I keep prodding them to update it and it never even gets a response
[13:34] <sagaci> yep
[13:34] <sagaci> wear your official LoCo hat
[13:36] <head_victim> That's what I did when I first put the RT in :P
[13:36] <head_victim> I understand they're busy and all.
[13:36] <head_victim> It might be easier to push the loco.u.c people to come up with some sort of CMS for there
[13:36] <sagaci> at least the meetings are a bit brighter
[13:36] <head_victim> Which would suit us down to the ground.
[13:37] <head_victim> Just redirect ubuntu.org.au to the loco.u.c team page
[13:37] <head_victim> All we're really missing from the ubuntu.org.au site is blog type content.
[13:38] <head_victim> And the planet
[13:40] <sagaci> yeahp
[13:40] <head_victim> Anything else I'm missing?
[13:40] <sagaci> not really
[13:41] <sagaci> I'd prefer to have loco.u.c as the first point/most structured place anyway
[13:43] <head_victim> Hmm I might have a think and talk to some people and see what we can come up with.
[13:43] <head_victim> But, the downside of this mon - fri job is I really should be in bed now.
[13:43] <sagaci> it'll be interesting to diff to see how many strings overall have changed fom en_US to en_AU
[13:43] <sagaci> righteo, cya later
[13:44] <head_victim> You guys are doing great on the translations :D Can't wait until it's down to 0
[13:44] <head_victim> Night mate
[14:25] <ikt> damnit
[14:25] <ikt> got tea all over my monitor


 Has anyone reached out about the touchegg project email?
 I don't believe I have the access/knowledge to fix it.