[10:23] <BenChapman> morning
[10:52] <czajkowski> ello
[10:52] <czajkowski> hows folks?
[10:56] <ebel> grand
[10:56] <ebel> CDs have arrived
[10:57] <ebel> czajkowski: thanks to you & the loco council for sorting it out
[11:00] <czajkowski> np
[11:01] <czajkowski> we realised something was up when we weren't hearing anything on lists saying teams got them
[11:01] <czajkowski> which was odd
[11:01] <ebel> indeed
[11:01] <ebel> from the lococontacts list it looks like they all arrived at the same day aswell
[11:01] <ebel> which was spooky ☺
[11:02] <czajkowski> yeah....
[11:31] <sheng> can anyone explain the weird firefox 7.0.1 performance on my pc?
[11:32] <sheng> if i scroll on facebook page....only facebook, cpu usage shoots up and I feel obvious lag
[11:34] <sheng> sorry it's actually xorg's cpu usage shooting up
[12:20] <BenChapman> Finally upgrading
[12:20] <BenChapman> sheng: I couldn't figure out how to resolve, but I've always had huge problems on FF with facebook because of their continuous scrolling crap
[12:21] <sheng> BenChapman, and it's working quite well on my laptop, same version FF
[12:22] <BenChapman> Strange
[12:22] <sheng> isn't it?
[12:22] <BenChapman> I wonder is flash doing something stupid
[12:22] <BenChapman> Have you tried upgrading flash?
[12:22] <sheng> And I'm curious why xorg has to do with that
[12:23] <BenChapman> Oh yeah, you were saying about xorg
[12:23] <BenChapman> sorry
[12:23] <BenChapman> forgot about that
[12:23] <sheng> yea but normally if it's flash the plugin-container will get crazy
[12:23] <BenChapman> Yup, well aware, sadly.
[12:24] <sheng> I did something strange, not sure if it is stupid
[12:24] <sheng> I swapped the adobe-flash player .so lib with the one comes with chrome
[12:24] <BenChapman> Oh?
[12:24] <BenChapman> hmmmm
[12:24] <sheng> for a while it worked well
[12:25] <sheng> must be the container design which allows it to run
[12:25] <BenChapman> I'm guessing it's probably to do with certain feature compatability
[12:25] <BenChapman> well... even in firefox flash is run like an entirely different program
[12:25] <sheng> ok
[12:26] <sheng> I see
[12:26] <sheng> maybe i'll try with javascript disabled
[12:26] <BenChapman> hence you see a plugin-container
[12:26] <BenChapman> process running
[12:26] <sheng> right
[12:28] <sheng> well with javascript disabled it doesn't solve the whole problem but it definitely improved
[16:06] <dax_roc> Evening
[16:06] <BenChapman> hi
[16:07] <czajkowski> http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/Thunderbird-8-released-1375603.html
[16:07] <czajkowski> http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/Strobe-acquired-by-Facebook-1375813.html
[16:07] <czajkowski> 2 articles I've written today :)
[16:09] <BenChapman>   error adding /etc/ssl/certs/EBG_Elektronik_Sertifika_Hizmet_Sağlayıcısı.pem
[16:09] <BenChapman> hmmm
[16:09] <BenChapman>   error adding /etc/ssl/certs/NetLock_Arany_=Class_Gold=_Főtanúsítvány.pem
[16:09] <BenChapman> seeing a pattern here
[16:13] <BenChapman> almost upgradedd
[16:13] <BenChapman> took most of the day
[17:02] <BenChapman> Well, I'm now running 11.10
[17:08] <BenChapman> Anyone know how to change the login screen to this new lightDM facebrowser... it hasn't done so itself
[17:21] <shanem> BenChapman: sudo dpkg-reconfigure lightdm
[17:21] <shanem> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LightDM
[17:21] <BenChapman> cheers :)
[17:22] <BenChapman> oH
[17:22] <BenChapman> not installed :/
[17:22] <shanem> sudo apt-get install lightdm?
[17:22] <BenChapman> yup, am doing so
[17:23] <shanem> np
[17:23] <BenChapman> just was a little confised
[17:23] <BenChapman> thought it came as standard
[17:23] <shanem> Yeah it should as far as I'm aware.
[17:23] <BenChapman> Oh well, I did a dist-upgrade
[17:23] <BenChapman> probably my fault
[17:24] <BenChapman> anyway, brb... reboot time
[17:32] <irishman23> how we doin


[12:19] <Malder> should I worry about how I partition my server as far as security is concerned? Most articles I've been reading about security are very brief about this topic...
[12:19] <theacolyte> a couple considerations
[12:19] <theacolyte> like if you'll be having people keep user directories, you may consider keeping them on a seperate drive/partition/filesystem
[12:19] <theacolyte> often times people do /boot and /root as well
[12:20] <Malder> like having a xxGB partion /home ? or are we talking about /usr
[12:20] <theacolyte> it depends
[12:20] <theacolyte> what is the box for
[12:20] <Malder> hehe
[12:20] <theacolyte> i was referring to /home though
[12:20] <Malder> ok
[12:21] <Malder> it serves a couple small website and also a file server for a small office
[12:21] <Malder> so it is not dedicated in either way and really can't be...
[12:21] <theacolyte> ah... it really wouldn't matter
[12:21] <theacolyte> although best practices would dictate you cared
[12:21] <theacolyte> I wouldn't though :)
[12:21] <theacolyte> is the web server public facing?
[12:22] <Malder> yes
[12:22] <theacolyte> ehhh
[12:22] <theacolyte> it's not necessary
[12:22] <theacolyte> you can though
[12:22] <Malder> It got cracked a couple days ago and I'm starting from scratch with 7.04
[12:22] <theacolyte> permissions takes care of the majority of issues
[12:22] <theacolyte> cracked? how?
[12:22] <theacolyte> what?
[12:22] <theacolyte> hgehe
[12:23] <Malder> my best guess is brute force (weak password... I was lazy)
[12:23] <theacolyte> that'll do it every time
[12:23] <Malder> there were multiple accepted logins from a Bulgarian IP address through ssh
[12:23] <Malder> ;(
[12:24] <Malder> got a few thousand error messages from postfix saying that xyz domain is bad or some such... not from anytthing I did...
[12:25] <theacolyte> how do you know you were hacked?
[12:25] <Malder> admin password didn't work. Looked at auth.log and it was growing by about 10x each day....
[12:27] <Malder> so you would advise to just go with basically one big partition and then just lock everything down with file permissions? Don't worry about trying to mess with boot options for security...?
[12:27] <Malder> and obviously strong passwords...
[12:29] <Burgwork> don't activate your root account
[12:29] <Burgwork> there is a nifty iptables script I saw to prevent brute forcing of ssh via looking at multiple connections
[12:30] <Malder> I think I am going to go with fail2ban for that... pretty neat little package...
[12:30] <Malder> I didn't have any root account active, but still did no good. Everything was done through sudo
[12:31] <Malder> I didn't turn off root login for ssh, but didn't think that would matter since there was essentially no root user... right?
[12:31] <Nafallo> do you need to permit password login?
[12:31] <Nafallo> I just use public key
[12:31] <Malder> I'm not sure. I would like to look into just using keys.. is that what you're thinking?
[12:31] <Nafallo> yea
[12:32] <Nafallo> I've turned off all other ways of logging in.
[12:32] <Nafallo> that and serial cable :-)
[12:32] <Malder> do you have a reference article on that? When are passwords necessary? I've never used keys...
[12:32] <Malder> hehe
[12:32] <Nafallo> I never uses passwords anymore. I think there is something on help.ubuntu.com/community about that.
[12:32] <Malder> I do have physical access so I can do that too... always nice
[12:33] <Nafallo> or rather. I use passwords for sudo :-)
[12:33] <Malder> right, but that's after login to SSH with your key, right?
[12:33] <Nafallo> yes
[12:34] <Malder> Sounds good to me
[12:34] <Malder> ok. Off to partition. Thanks for the help.
[12:34] <Nafallo> no problem :-)
[12:55] <theacolyte> sorry about that Malder, had to go AFK
[12:56] <theacolyte> you may try also installing rkhunter, apf, and bfd
[12:56] <theacolyte> i've used them before, and they work great for brute force attacks
[12:56] <theacolyte> http://www.rfxnetworks.com/proj.php
[12:57] <Nafallo> I hope you meant against :-)
[12:57] <theacolyte> hehe
[12:58] <theacolyte> maybe!
[12:59] <defendguin> i'm trying to install feisty server and it's telling me it can't mount my cdrom drive
[12:59] <defendguin> obviously its able to read the cdrom or it wouldn't have booted
[01:00] <theacolyte> what kind of controller is the cdrom attached to?
[01:00] <defendguin> ide
[01:00] <theacolyte> mobo?
[01:01] <defendguin> yeah right to the motherboard
[01:01] <defendguin> nothing very special about the box no odd hardware
[01:02] <theacolyte> well, if feisty isn't finding the cdrom when you load up the installer, 100% of the time it's because your controller isn't supported through normal channels
[01:02] <theacolyte> what motherboard?
[01:02] <defendguin> i couldn't tell you off hand
[01:02] <theacolyte> ah
[01:03] <defendguin> it was supported when i installed edgy desktop
[01:03] <theacolyte> a good example of it would be my jmicron controller is hated by 99% of the distros out there
[01:04] <defendguin> does server edition support less hardware than desktop?
[01:04] <Burgwork> no
[01:05] <defendguin> besides wireless card
[01:06] <defendguin> hmmm i wonder why it had no problem with edgy
[01:06] <theacolyte> distros change
[01:06] <theacolyte> but without knowing the specific hardware, there's no way of knowing for sure
[01:07] <defendguin> well i can just boot up without the CD and let you know what hal says
[01:09] <Burgwork> that is why big orgs keep testing hardware around
[01:10] <defendguin> what item am i looking at in the device manager
[01:10] <defendguin> ?
[01:11] <defendguin> says intel brookdale chipset
[01:11] <Burgwork> if it is wireless, do you need the firemaer
[01:12] <defendguin> no wireless on this computer
[01:12] <theacolyte> defendguin: what's under either RAID controller or IDE/ATA/ATAPI controllers?
[01:12] <defendguin> intel 82801BA ide U100
[01:13] <theacolyte> that it?
[01:13] <defendguin> oem vendor HP
[01:14] <defendguin> pci_8086_244b
[01:17] <defendguin> i'm just poking through what the hal device manager says is there a specific field you would like to know about?
[01:18] <theacolyte> no just the device names under ide controller, i'm just a little slammed right now
[01:19] <defendguin> maybe i could just do a dist upgrade
[01:19] <theacolyte> you could
[01:19] <defendguin> nah i like fresh installs
[01:21] <defendguin> how could the installer even get started if the cdrom isn't supported
[01:22] <defendguin> i guess i could rip the CD to an iso on this machine and mount the iso and do a net install?
[01:26] <theacolyte> well
[01:26] <theacolyte> it will boot because your BIOS takes care of that
[01:27] <theacolyte> to actually copy files from the cd to your hard drive, it needs a driver to mount it
[01:27] <theacolyte> not quite the best explanation of it, but like I said, i'm slammed
[01:28] <defendguin> i understand
[02:38] <Atlas95> hello
[02:38] <Atlas95> anybody here pleasE?
[02:38] <Atlas95> i have a big problem
[02:38] <Atlas95> i follow perfect setup guide
[02:39] <Atlas95> and i have this error when i try to install some packages:
[02:39] <Atlas95> E: Le sous-processus /usr/sbin/dpkg-preconfigure --apt || true a renvoy un code d'erreur (100)
[06:15] <sahafeez> is the only diff between desktop and server what is installed by default?
[07:08] <Burgundavia> sahafeez: the default kernel is slightly different
[07:08] <sahafeez> can you install desktop and then apt-get the server kernel
[07:12] <Burgundavia> yes
[07:23] <sahafeez> i take it that the desktop installs tons of stuff and it is better to just do server and then install a gui if you need it.
[07:23] <Kamping_Kaiser> desktop installs a desktop. if its not going to be a desktop, its probably a bad choice of intall
[07:23] <Kamping_Kaiser> *install
[07:24] <sahafeez> i am replacing a w2k3 server at work and have tried sles, rhel. i think i am settling on ubuntu
[07:24] <sahafeez> i need to have ldap+samba+postfix+cryusimap+postgress+opengroupware
[07:24] <sahafeez> and everything needs to auth on ldap
[07:26] <Kamping_Kaiser> i havent tried setting up those services, so i cant comment. ldap+samba+postfix+postgres are in the repos, not sure about the other two you meantion
[07:26] <Burgundavia> install the server, then install what you need
[07:29] <sahafeez> ok, thanks.
[07:29] <Burgundavia> then you can absolutely control what is on the server
[07:30] <Burgundavia> desktop will leave you with all kinds of stuff you don't need
[07:30] <Burgundavia> I would also spread out those services across multiple servers
[07:31] <Burgundavia> ldap+samba on one, mail on the other
[07:32] <sahafeez> it is for 10 people.
[07:33] <Burgundavia> still worth it
[07:33] <Burgundavia> hardware is cheap
[07:33] <sahafeez> one box with 2gb of ram, 3ware raid5 and core 2 is easier
[07:33] <Burgundavia> then kvm it up
[07:33] <sahafeez> trying to cut down on the support.
[07:34] <sahafeez> have another box running slack + asterisk pbx
[07:34] <Burgundavia> ahh
[07:34] <sahafeez> have openbsd box for vpn/firewall
[07:34] <Burgundavia> I would have a common platform
[07:35] <sahafeez> and the w2k3 sbs file+exchange. guess which box gives me issues?
[07:35] <Burgundavia> except asterisk is not in main
[07:35] <sahafeez> going to move the asterisk box to whatever disto i put on the file server. so ubuntu if it works out.
[07:35] <sahafeez> i will do asterisk from source
[07:36] <Burgundavia> hmm, I distrust source
[07:36] <Burgundavia> security updates are a headache
[07:36] <sahafeez> naw, asterisk is simple.
[07:37] <Burgundavia> setting it up is a royal pain
[07:37] <Burgundavia> and debugging is a bigger one
[07:37] <sahafeez> took me forever the 1st time.
[07:38] <sahafeez> after that it got simple. just had to learn it
[07:38] <Burgundavia> we have a lot of moving pieces, with two offices
[07:38] <sahafeez> server installs compile tools by default or no?
[07:38] <Burgundavia> no
[07:38] <Burgundavia> server installs enough to run the hardware and login
[07:38] <Burgundavia> that is it. No open ports, no running services, nothing
[07:39] <sahafeez> 2 offices, one east one west, openbsd vpn. 3 houses with vpn and remote phones. all ip phones. just works
[07:39] <sahafeez> very openbsd like
[07:39] <sahafeez> i am a bsd person. i am forced onto linux by hardware/or software that i need.
[07:39] <Burgundavia> ahh
[07:42] <Burgundavia> personally, I like having a common server platform
[07:42] <Burgundavia> having 3 distros like that means 3 times as much security
[07:42] <sahafeez> settled on opengroupware for the exchange replacement so i need to run it on linux for the most part. it runs on bsd, etc but its a pain to setup and i need the blackberry push stuff
[07:43] <sahafeez> i would run every thing on solaris if i could or openbsd. those would be my main choices
[07:44] <sahafeez> i would do gentoo for linux however i need something a bit simpler because others may have to touch it. i started looking at SLES and RHEL because of that.
[07:44] <sahafeez> RHEL sucks
[07:44] <volvoguy> can i ask you guys a support question or is this just a dev channel?
[07:45] <sahafeez> and SLES is very very good cept the updated make the system unbootable as the hardware is too new and i do not feel like figuring it out
[07:45] <Burgundavia> volvoguy: both
[07:45] <volvoguy> woohoo!
[07:45] <Burgundavia> I have heard good things about SLES
[07:45] <sahafeez> very clean and polished. comes out of the box with samba+ldap setup correct. YAST is a great tool.
[07:46] <volvoguy> i'd like to upgrade my breezy server to at least edgy, if not feisty. the support pages recommend not using apt-get for this, but i don't exactly have "update-manager" which they DO recommed. is there a safe way to use non-gui tool?
[07:46] <Burgundavia> some of the integration stuff is better in SLES/RHEL
[07:46] <Burgundavia> volvoguy: release cycle was breezy --> dapper --> edgy
[07:47] <Burgundavia> I would keep servers on dapper, as it is supported longer
[07:47] <Burgundavia> sadly, there is no tool yet
[07:47] <volvoguy> oh, i'm sorry. i meant I'm on dapper, not breezy.
[07:47] <Burgundavia> ahh
[07:47] <Burgundavia> if you update past dapper, you will have to update a lot
[07:47] <Burgundavia> just to be aware
[07:47] <volvoguy> that's what i want to avoid though - having to upgrade through many releases.
[07:48] <Burgundavia> then you should stay on dapper until the next LTS
[07:48] <Burgundavia> in april 2008
[07:48] <Burgundavia> I am a very conservative person when it comes to my servers, however
[07:48] <volvoguy> and not bother with performance/feature updates until then?
[07:49] <Burgundavia> less headaches > a bit of performance
[07:49] <volvoguy> Burgundavia, yeah - i can understand that. this is a simple file server and part-time web-dev server. it doesn't do much.
[07:49] <Burgundavia> backup your data and do the edgy update manually
[07:50] <Burgundavia> then use the edgy --> feisty update
[07:50] <volvoguy> Burgundavia, so you'll do a clean install for every LTS release?
[07:50] <sahafeez> i would love to see zfs ported to linux. that would be the best of all worlds, well zfs and pf
[07:50] <Burgundavia> no, LTS --> LTS supported
[07:50] <volvoguy> right.
[07:50] <Burgundavia> thus 6.06 will update to 8.04
[07:50] <volvoguy> and will do so with less complication?
[07:51] <Burgundavia> or you can do 6.06 --> 6.10 --> 7.04 --> 7.10
[07:51] <ajmitch> (assuming that 8.04 is LTS, and that significant work is put in to support upgrades)
[07:51] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: the latter is assumed. Canonical has large paying customers that will demand it
[07:51] <Burgundavia> and what better way to test an update tool than on the community, no?
[07:52] <ajmitch> what I mean is that many packages will need to be checked & modified for upgrades
[07:52] <volvoguy> ajmitch, that was my concern. it seemed to me that smaller updates made more sense, but if canonical is going to try to make a smooth upgrade path to 8.04 - i'll wait for that.
[07:52] <ajmitch> little things like directories moving around, symlinks, handling corner cases in maintainer scripts
[07:52] <ajmitch> it'll take a bit of work, but I'd say that it's expected
[07:52] <volvoguy> ok. cool. :)
[07:53] <Burgundavia> the cool stuff is on the desktop anyway
[07:53] <ajmitch> the next LTS release would probably end up with less cool new stuff, and more time spent polishing
[07:53] <volvoguy> yeah. feisty looks great.
[07:53] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: pfft, server is getting cool stuff :)
[07:53] <sahafeez> the fact that i can buy support is the reason i am looking at ubuntu
[07:53] <Burgundavia> so I keep my laptop running the absolutely latest and my servers and work desktops running the LTS
[07:55] <volvoguy> my "production" server is a virtual ubuntu server at unixshell. hopefully their xen system will be upgradable to 8.04 easily too. :)
[07:56] <volvoguy> they're probably one of those paying customers though - so they'll be one demanding it. hehe.
[07:57] <volvoguy> well, thanks for the quick updates guys. i'm not involved and online anymore as much as i'd like to be, but i know i can always turn to you for help! talk to you later.
[07:57] <Burgundavia> cya
[08:13] <sahafeez> what is with the delay in the partitioning when doing anything - switching between stuff, lvm, etc.
[08:13] <Burgundavia> on the installer?
[08:13] <sahafeez> yes
[08:13] <Burgundavia> no idea
[08:13] <sahafeez> it could tell you something you know.
[08:13] <fabbione> sahafeez: known issue
[08:14] <fabbione> it was in the release notes.. there is a bug linked from there
[08:14] <fabbione> it's only annoying but it doesn't affect final installation or functionality
[08:14] <sahafeez> no, but it makes the install take, oh, 2 hours longer ;)
[08:15] <fabbione> i know.. it adds 3 minutes wait on each lv you create
[08:15] <fabbione> there is really nothing we could do to fix it when i first found out of the problem
[08:15] <fabbione> it was too late in the release process :(
[08:15] <sahafeez> oh well. just happy it is not just me
[08:15] <fabbione> it's a good excuse for a cup of coffee
[08:16] <fabbione> the bug is generic..
[08:16] <fabbione> that'd work too :)
[08:16] <sahafeez> this is my 1st install of ubuntu. i was having debian flash backs.
[08:18] <sahafeez> still waiting ....
[08:19] <fabbione> sahafeez: as i said... 3 minutes for each lv you created
[08:20] <sahafeez> well i am on 6 mins now and all i am trying to do is active an existing lvm setup
[08:20] <fabbione> sahafeez: read the bug or you will keep waiting and asking herre
[08:20] <fabbione> here even
[08:20] <sahafeez> yes, i am reading now..
[08:21] <sahafeez> since i have the time and all.
[08:22] <sahafeez> between this and the broken ide on my sparc copying files....
[08:22] <sahafeez> :)
[08:24] <sahafeez> i am kinda wondering why your servers got so hammered, being large network scaling guy
[08:27] <Burgundavia> lots and lots of people
[08:27] <Burgundavia> we did better than suse and fedora last releas
[08:27] <Burgundavia> they went off the air
[08:27] <sahafeez> yah, but it is so simple to fix
[08:27] <maswan> sahafeez: well, it depends, if you can answer me why suddenly there were thousands of CLOSE_WAITs on my mirrors, filling up all the apache slots?
[08:28] <maswan> with 0 bytes in send-q too
[08:28] <sahafeez> nice.
[08:28] <sahafeez> how many servers
[08:28] <maswan> for my mirror? 6
[08:28] <maswan> (i'm se.releases.ubuntu.com)
[08:29] <sahafeez> how does your SLB work?
[08:29] <Burgundavia> maswan: you guys are the big ones, no?
[08:29] <maswan> what's slb? :)
[08:29] <sahafeez> ah, server load balancers
[08:29] <maswan> Burgundavia: we peaked at 3.8Gbit/s, so yeah.
[08:30] <maswan> ah, large requests (.isos etc) get http-redirected to one of the frontends depending on hash (so that one iso always ends up on the same backend, to keep cache locality)
[08:30] <sahafeez> was it a load issue or an apache bug issue. 3.8 is not alot
[08:30] <maswan> sahafeez: don't know, afaik they blame eachother
[08:31] <maswan> or go "huh?" when reported
[08:31] <sahafeez> what box is doing that? a linux box or switch hardware
[08:31] <maswan> the frontend[s]  that's in dns, they have to handle the small files (deb:s etc that can't be http-redirected), and also ftp&rsync
[08:32] <maswan> individual isos that have more demand than one frontend can satisfy, we manually identify and spread out on more frontends
[08:32] <maswan> it actually works really well, except when we get that CLOSE_WAIT issue
[08:33] <sahafeez> was the traffic balanced over the servers - after action - looking that the mrtg or whatever you use
[08:33] <maswan> http://www.acc.umu.se/technical/statistics/ftp/monitordata/index.html.en
[08:33] <sahafeez> rrdtool
[08:34] <maswan> so, not very well balanced, but then the servers are not equal either
[08:34] <maswan> well enough balanced after 21:00 local time yesterday though
[08:34] <sahafeez> question, and this is because i am not a linux guy, using ext3 on a lvm for a postgress db. any mount options i should look at
[08:34] <sahafeez> ok. it would be interesting to see the network drawing.
[08:35] <sahafeez> i love this kind of stuff.
[08:35] <sahafeez> setup a network that took a 10gb/s DoS once and kept working
[08:35] <maswan> well, remember, this is just my mirror at the academic computer club at umea university
[08:36] <maswan> we're depending on what hardware gets donated to us, and whatever bandwidth the university feel like giving us
[08:36] <sahafeez> ok.
[08:36] <maswan> the canoncial setup (main servers) is not public, AFAIK
[08:36] <sahafeez> no big. i am a nut about network design.
[08:37] <maswan> so in short, out of those machines orion,vega,napoleon are on a separate 2Gbit/s network [borrowed machines from the hpc center at the uni] , the rest share a 2Gbit/s uplink too.
[08:38] <maswan> then it ends up roughly like this: http://www.umdac.umu.se/netmaster/net/Campusnetpresentationumu.jpg
[08:38] <maswan> and then: http://stats.sunet.se/stat-q/load-map/optosunet-kunder,,traffic,peak
[08:39] <maswan> and sorry, can't think of anything for your mount options question
[08:39] <sahafeez> no prob
[08:40] <sahafeez> interesting. it looks abit over complex for my taste...the network
[08:40] <maswan> the campus one or the optosunet?
[08:42] <sahafeez> the 2nd one.
[08:42] <sahafeez> the campus - those are routed or layer2 links
[08:42] <sahafeez> between the cisco switches
[08:43] <maswan> sahafeez: remmeber that on the second one, all those names are different universities accross sweden that requires redundant paths
[08:44] <maswan> the campus one shows the routers on campus, not all the dumb switches
[08:44] <sahafeez> based on as the cable runs and build out time no doubt vs what would be logical
[08:45] <sahafeez> ok, so you are using the 65xx as swtich/routers to distribute
[08:45] <sahafeez> 6509 is a switch cisco just added a router card as an after thought
[08:45] <maswan> yeah, that's my understanding of it. the next-gen campus network is in next year or so
[08:46] <maswan> well, there aren't very big routing decisions that needs to be made within campus
[08:46] <sahafeez> whatever you do do not fill them with gige ports and run them flat out. it will crash ;)
[08:46] <maswan> :)
[08:46] <loVolt> mind if I pose a fiesty/samba question ?
[08:46] <sahafeez> as i am trying to setup samba myself sure
[08:46] <maswan> loVolt: go ahead, don't be surprised if noone is around to answer
[08:46] <loVolt> thx , I give it a try
[08:47] <loVolt> walking though any number of howto's
[08:47] <maswan> sahafeez: actually, the optosunet one is based on the returns of a single tender for dark fiber across sweden
[08:47] <loVolt> I can get everything cept' getent passwd/group to work
[08:47] <loVolt> like nssswitch is ignored
[08:48] <loVolt> like bank in 2000/2001
[08:48] <loVolt> er bank/back
[08:48] <loVolt> wbinfo and others work fine
[08:48] <maswan> sahafeez: and the weirdness comes from requiring a "red" and a "green" network connection to all sites, and there not being enough fiber in the ground to make the most logical extension to all sites
[08:48] <loVolt> is there a ubuntu-samba chan?
[08:49] <ajmitch> loVolt: 'winbind enum users = true' in smb.conf
[08:49] <ajmitch> that allows enumeration of users with getent
[08:49] <ajmitch> it should be able to resolve normally anyway
[08:49] <maswan> sahafeez: http://basun.sunet.se/karta/opto2.gif a bit more geographical
[08:49] <loVolt> yes
[08:49] <sahafeez> ah, makes sense.
[08:50] <sahafeez> maswan thanks for sharing the info. i love looking at this stuff
[08:50] <loVolt> getent only show local pass/groups
[08:51] <loVolt> shot in the dark
[08:51] <maswan> sahafeez: btw, sthml is clickable on the optosunet map and you can get to nordunet that way too
[08:51] <ajmitch> and you restarted winbind after changing that option?
[08:51] <loVolt> I ran cvs and samba4 last night on fiesty ...semms to go well
[08:51] <sahafeez> looking..
[08:51] <loVolt> ajmitch, rebooted even
[08:52] <ajmitch> loVolt: sorry, it's 'winbind enum users = yes'
[08:52] <ajmitch> and the corresponding one for groups
[08:52] <loVolt> ajmitch, yeah users and groups
[08:52] <ajmitch> getting users/groups off an AD server?
[08:52] <loVolt> yeah
[08:52] <ajmitch> security=ads, and realm is set?
[08:53] <loVolt> yeup
[08:53] <maswan> sahafeez: everything goes into the a[123] sth routers, using virtual routers in those junipers, AIUI
[08:53] <ajmitch> wbinfo -u returns the right info?
[08:53] <loVolt> yes
[08:53] <loVolt> wbinfo -g as well
[08:53] <sahafeez> junipers are the best routers right now so that is good.
[08:54] <ajmitch> loVolt: you could increase the debug output on winbindd
[08:54] <loVolt> checking
[08:54] <ajmitch> in /etc/default/winbind
[08:56] <loVolt> log level = 3 in defaults/winbind do ?
[08:56] <sahafeez> what is the deal with using a custom kernel on ubuntu. no issues?
[08:57] <loVolt> sahafeez, haven't found any issues
[08:57] <loVolt> lots of apt-getting :)
[08:57] <sahafeez> ok, cool.
[08:57] <sahafeez> i want to mount an mac hfs drive ;)
[08:58] <loVolt> don't forget autoconf if you want other pcakacges
[08:58] <ajmitch> loVolt: no, I'd put "-d 3 -n" in WINBINDD_OPTS
[08:58] <loVolt> k
[08:58] <loVolt> heh screaming about invalid option :)
[08:58] <loVolt> fixing
[09:00] <loVolt> I've got two boxes , one fiesty dns only no devl tools and 2nd is fiesty dns with devl / samba4
[09:00] <loVolt> darned is samba4 didn't "just work"
[09:01] <loVolt> k' started again , lets tail the chaos
[09:03] <loVolt> cool idmap went boom
[09:03] <loVolt> fatal error uid range full
[09:03] <ajmitch> wonderful
[09:04] <loVolt> max 200000
[09:04] <loVolt> lets up that a bit
[09:05] <ajmitch> enum users/groups may not be a good thing if you have that many :)
[09:05] <loVolt> I don't
[09:05] <loVolt> about 150 not inc a/d spare parts
[09:05] <loVolt> doubled it and rebooting
[09:06] <loVolt>  load average: 5.64, 5.71, 5.64
[09:06] <loVolt> different box
[09:06] <loVolt> :)
[09:08] <loVolt> wierdness
[09:09] <loVolt> still says full , could not lookup domain user luser
[09:10] <loVolt> wonder if I lower the level
[09:12] <loVolt> trying 2000-10000
[09:15] <loVolt> same
[09:15] <loVolt> I need coffee to live
[09:39] <sahafeez> silly question. how do i see what to install when i do not know the package name. i want to install sshd
[09:41] <lionel> sahafeez: for ssh the package name is openssh-server
[09:41] <lionel> in general, you use apt-cache search for package search
[09:41] <sahafeez> ok. i need to read about apt as it is new to me.
[09:41] <sahafeez> thanks
[09:52] <loVolt> gnite
[12:11] <foxiness> hi, am on step of create " Virtual Server Scenario " url: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RubyOnRails? , on this line sudo nano /etc/apache2/sites-available/<servername> , <servername> = ??? its not clear to me if i need to <domain.net> or domin.net or domaindotnet
[12:17] <ivoks> it is irrelevant
[12:17] <ivoks> you can put there 000-mambo-jambo
[12:18] <ivoks> content of that file is important
[12:26] <foxiness> k,now it clear thanks i need now to figure out ,next step port 80
[12:27] <ivoks> heh
[12:27] <ivoks> first time configuring apache?
[12:28] <foxiness> :) yes
[12:28] <ivoks> grab a book or something :D
[12:28] <foxiness> host@home
[12:29] <foxiness> book? or something? , like what ?
[12:29] <ivoks> howtos, tutorials, etc..
[12:29] <ivoks> i have two apache books, both are over 300 pages :)
[12:30] <ivoks> and these are small apache books
[12:30] <ivoks> bbl; bye
[09:03] <foo> Hm, what's your mta of preference? exim? postfix? hopefully not sendmail.
[09:04] <Nafallo> postficx
[09:04] <Nafallo> postfix
[09:04] <sahafeez> telnet mail 25
[09:04] <sahafeez> ;)
[09:05] <foo> Nafallo: What's your reasoning? Have you used exim? Someone recently told me to check out ensim, I'm a postfix fan too
[09:07] <Nafallo> foo: it's built with security in mind and is extendible into infinity. also it's what are recommended from the distroteam.
[09:08] <foo> Nafallo: Hm, ok, then I think I'll just stick with that.
[09:09] <Nafallo> good choice :-)
[09:09] <foo> Hm, now, this system has 5 domains. I've never set up "virtual domains" or something before with postfix, I'll need to figure that one out
[09:10] <foo> Nafallo: eh, actually, I just remember, this server has debian etch. The data center couldn't put ubuntu on them, eh. I'll still use postfix, though, hehe
[09:10] <Nafallo> foo: help.ubuntu.com/community/Servers is a good one
[09:11] <foo> ah, thanks
[09:27] <foo> Nafallo: Hm, I'm checking out that wiki. I guess, my main concern is say, this server hosts about 5 domains... it only sends mail via the web scripts, it does not receive. How does postfix distinguish which @domain to send mail from if 5 different domains are on the system?
[09:28] <Nafallo> not sure. I use MUA to send mail myself.
[09:30] <foo> Mail User Agent ?
[09:31] <Nafallo> yes
[09:54] <foo> Nafallo: yeah, seems like the best way to change From: field is just in the code
[09:54] <foo> Nafallo: thanks
[09:54] <Nafallo> that's probably right. no problem.
[09:54] <Impaque> hello, is anyone using AMD64 on Intel-based 64-bit machines?
[09:55] <Impaque> (amd64 version of ubuntu-server)
[11:09] <sahafeez> if i want software raid, that is not part of LVM right. i have to make the raid 1st then put the LVM over it'
[11:43] <soothsay_> Anyone know how to use DHCPD to set (some) fixed ip addresses?
[12:02] <sahafeez> man dhcpd.conf
[12:03] <sahafeez> you have to create a static entry via the mac address in the config file


[00:03] <gverrilla> Hi there! I have upgraded to ubuntu Ubuntu 22.04.1, and I have a problem with distutils now when trying to use some python libraries. I have tried apt-get install and force reinstall python3-distutils and still not working. Tried searching google but found nothing. Any ideas? Error is: "ImportError: cannot import name 'ccompiler' from 'distutils'"
[00:16] <sazbos> flyback, sorry for the late response.
[00:16] <sazbos> actually, when it comes to software, if something is offline, there is no need to upgrade it as long as it all works.
[00:17] <sazbos> i do not get why businesses upgrade just for the sake of upgrading, it is not like that improves their business a lot of the time.
[00:17] <sazbos> say a saw mill with 3 computers not connected to the internet, they could still run windows 3.11 and do fine.
[00:17] <sazbos> hehe
[00:17] <sazbos> or even dos
[00:18] <sazbos> it would be interesting to know the most obscure old setups out there still in use, i guess there is a lot of them
[01:49] <pycurious> Can anyone look at this hardware error from dmesg : https://dpaste.org/5cO2y (Any ideas why this happens and how to fix it)
[05:28] <junebug> If I upgrade to 22.04 does the linux kernel version change or am I able to keep the older linux kernels?
[05:29] <enigma9o7> It'll update.
[05:30] <enigma9o7> You may be able to mark hold it so it doesnt update tho.
[05:30] <enigma9o7> not sure
[05:30] <junebug> enigma9o7, sorry. Are you saying I will lose the old kernels?
[05:32] <junebug> enigma9o7, I'm currently stuck on kernel 5.11.0-46-generic because anything after that breaks my wifi
[05:33] <junebug> Do you think I'll lose that kernel if I upgrade to Ubuntu 22.04?
[05:33] <enigma9o7> doesnt 22.04 use 5.10 anyway?
[05:33] <junebug> No idea
[05:34] <junebug> I think they're on 5.13
[05:34] <toddc> 5.15.0-48
[05:35] <junebug> 5.15 right
[05:35] <junebug> https://ubuntu.com/about/release-cycle#ubuntu-kernel-release-cycle
[05:35] <junebug> toddc, do you know if I would lose my 5.11 kernel?
[05:36] <enigma9o7> maybe they've fixed your wifi by now in new ubuntu version?
[05:36] <enigma9o7> maybe it'll work, try a live boot to see
[05:37] <junebug> Yeah I'll have to give that a shot
[05:37] <junebug> Thanks
[05:37] <enigma9o7> but I dunno the actual answer, maybe you can still boot into the old kernel via grub, etc
[05:38] <enigma9o7> there's probably a way to install it
[05:38] <enigma9o7> if its completely removed
[05:41] <toddc> junebug: I tend to always do a clean install but would assume that a old kernel would cause issues in other places on 22.04
[05:41] <yezariaely> I have a laptop connected to a USB-C docking station having one monitor attached. I use a laptop monitor + external monitor setting. Now, if I am leaving the desk, both monitors go to sleep. I get back, move the mouse, only the laptop internal monitor awakes. Any idea what I can do to also awake (a commandline would also be ok) the external monitor?
[05:41] <yezariaely> The old unplug, replug the USB-C docking station works.
[05:42] <junebug> thanks toddc and enigma9o7
[05:43] <sazbos> if taking the cable in and out works, that is ok? and what about increasing the sleep counter?
[05:50] <yezariaely> sazbos, well it is annoying. increasing the sleep counter wouldn't help, since I look my screen when leaving the desk.
[05:51] <yezariaely> There must be some USB powersafe option or so I could fiddle with
[05:51] <sazbos> could you just have the screensaver active, and the screen not to black out?
[05:52] <sazbos> i am not sure what causes the need to have to reinsert the hdmi cable, could it be solved in sw, dunno
[05:54] <alkisg> yezariaely: what's the output of `ps faux|grep screensaver` ?
[05:55] <yezariaely> alkisg, nothing is running.
[05:55] <alkisg> yezariaely: which desktop environment is that?
[05:55] <yezariaely> awesome wm
[05:56] <alkisg> Ah no idea, I was going to suggest something like mate-screensaver-command --poke in a loop
[05:56] <yezariaely> looked to me that the desktop env does not play a role and the problem is deeper.
[05:56] <matsaman> yezariaely: or xrandr can add/remove monitors, simulating re-insertion
[05:57] <matsaman> fairly common issue with HDMI
[05:57] <yezariaely> matsaman, ah that might be a solution! I will give that a try.
[05:57] <alkisg> As long as it doesn't happen when you're working, you can simulate you're working and call it a day :)
[05:57] <matsaman> had to do that with a laptop hooked up to a TV once
[05:57] <matsaman> don't remember the exact xrandr params, but you'll be able to find'm quick
[05:57] <yezariaely> alkisg, :D
[05:57] <yezariaely> matsaman, yeah I should be able to figure this out.
[05:58] <matsaman> yezariaely: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/xrandr#Toggle_external_monitor
[05:59] <matsaman> the intern/LVDS1 & extern/VGA1 values may vary on your system
[05:59] <matsaman> just 'xrandr' should show the names
[07:55] <hermano> What is the most "straightforward" way to get a graphical web browser from a remote machine?
[08:06] <alkisg>   hermano are you interested in forwarding the traffic (as in a proxy) which has the best performance, or in forwarding the screen?
[08:07] <alkisg> In the first case, you run your local browser, but it uses the remote connection and IP
[09:35] <pickanick> which command line tools are great for converting .WAV to FLAC or OGG?
[09:38] <ogra> pickanick, ffmpeg should be able to convert pretty much any media format to any other media format (movies, audio files, etc)
[09:39] <arkanoid> I keep receiving "perl: warning: Setting locale failed."
[09:39] <arkanoid> locale-gen "en_US.UTF-8" && dpkg-reconfigure locales doesn't fix
[09:40] <arkanoid> here the output of $ locale: https://termbin.com/ce1y
[09:41] <arkanoid> should I set it in my local shell environment instead?
[09:43] <murmel> arkanoid: where do you get that error?
[09:44] <arkanoid> murmel: in a lot of places, I thin it happens when perl is called
[09:44] <arkanoid> so in many OS scripts
[09:44] <arkanoid> it happens a lot when doing apt stuff
[09:45] <murmel> any weird packages installed (outside of the official repos?)
[09:53] <arkanoid> murmel: no
[09:54] <arkanoid> I had it before upgrading to 22.04, I have it now that I've just upgraded to 22.04
[09:54] <arkanoid> (22.04.1)
[10:48] <pickanick> arkanoid: If you look under system settings : RegionalSettings : Formats , what is your Region Format called?
[10:54] <pickanick> I found that "Default.UTF-8"  sounded good, except it appears to be unsupported and error messages are triggered by certain commands.  Somehow the GUI settings are not affected by the command line changes, and override them for some applications.  (this was KDE 22.04)
[11:33] <dsd079> Hi installed xubuntu alongside windows and after rebooting i got error: no such partition
[11:33] <dsd079> And got into grub rescue
[11:33] <EriC^^> dsd079: can you boot a live usb to troubleshoot?
[11:33] <dsd079> Yes
[11:33] <EriC^^> type 'sudo parted -ls | nc termbin.com 9999' and paste the link it gives you here
[11:34] <dsd079> Oh ok one sec
[11:40] <winircuser-263> Ubuntu 22.04.1 LTS Desktop scripts in /usr/lib/systemd/system-sleep/ fail to execute upon sleep/resume
[11:42] <winircuser-263> This behaviour worked fine in 20.04
[11:43] <dsd079a> Eric^^ https://termbin.com/cvzuy
[11:43] <dsd079a>  here it is
[11:45] <EriC^^> dsd079a: windows is installed in legacy booting mode, but ubuntu was installed in efi mode, you have to reinstall ubuntu in legacy mode, or convert it if you want, i can help with that
[11:45] <dsd079> Oh thx
[11:45] <dsd079> One sec thought because the live usb just crashed
[11:45] <dsd079> Seems weird
[11:47] <dsd079> Probably because of my Nvidia graphics its an old one and have run into the same problem with it in many distros
[11:48] <ogra> winircuser-263, according to https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/systemd-suspend.service.html ... "Note that scripts or binaries dropped in /usr/lib/systemd/system-sleep/ are intended for local use only and should be considered hacks. If applications want to react to system suspend/hibernation and resume, they should rather use the Inhibitor interface."
[11:48] <ogra> winircuser-263, my guess would be that they changed the defaults upstream and you probably have to explicitly enable that feature if you do not use the new dbus interface instead
[11:49] <EriC^^> dsd079: if you open a terminal and run 'sudo dmesg -w' it might show why it's crashing
[11:50] <EriC^^> if it logs anything before it crashes
[11:50] <dsd079> It just crashed and i rebooted
[11:51] <dsd079> Im back on it
[11:51] <EriC^^> ok, so do you want to convert or just reinstall ubuntu in legacy mode?
[11:51] <winircuser-263> OK I guess I need to read up on the Inhibitor interface - any pointers where to find that info?
[11:52] <ogra> it is linked from that exact sentence in the url i pasted
[11:53] <EriC^^> dsd079: ok, so do you want to convert or just reinstall ubuntu in legacy mode?
[11:53] <winircuser-263> Ignore that, found info on the link you provided - Thanks!
[11:53] <ogra> 🙂
[11:53] <dsd079a> Eric^^ i guess just convert unless i created the partitions a little weird
[11:54] <EriC^^> dsd079a: ok, type 'sudo mount /dev/sda6 /mnt'
[11:54] <dsd079a> done
[11:56] <EriC^^> dsd079a: for i in /dev /proc /sys /run; do sudo mount -R $i /mnt$i; done
[11:57] <dsd079a> so i just navigate to /dev/proc/sys/run and do sudo munt -R $i /mnt$i right?
[11:57] <EriC^^> no, type the whole line above
[11:58] <dsd079a> ok done i got nothing from the terminal
[11:58] <EriC^^> ok, type 'sudo chroot /mnt'
[11:58] <dsd079a> ok
[11:59] <EriC^^> type 'nano /etc/fstab' find the line that has "UUID=...blabla...... /boot/efi" and add a "#" at the beginning of the line, ie #UUID=...blabla
[12:00] <dsd079a> ok i added the "#" in front of the UUID  that i see theres is also another one below
[12:01] <EriC^^> dsd079a: press ctrl+o  save then ctrl+x to exit
[12:01] <dsd079a> done
[12:02] <EriC^^> dsd079a: type 'cat /etc/fstab | nc termbin.com 9999' paste the link here
[12:03] <dsd079a> https://termbin.com/6xhl
[12:05] <EriC^^> dsd079a: type nano /etc/fstab again, you added the # at the first UUID (which is for the root filesystem "/") you need to remove it and add one on the bottom one that has /boot/efi in it
[12:06] <dsd079a> done do you want me to send you the link again?
[12:06] <EriC^^> yeah
[12:07] <dsd079a> https://termbin.com/qw7q
[12:07] <EriC^^> looks good
[12:09] <dsd079a> is it done? is it ok now?
[12:09] <EriC^^> dsd079a: type 'apt-get install --reinstall grub-pc grub-gfxpayload-lists'
[12:11] <dsd079a> EriC^^ also done
[12:13] <pycurious> Can anyone look at this hardware error from dmesg : https://dpaste.org/5cO2y (Any ideas why this happens and how to fix it)
[12:14] <EriC^^> dsd079a: ok, type 'update-grub'
[12:14] <EriC^^> then type 'exit' to exit the chroot and try rebooting
[12:14] <ogra> pycurious, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machine-check_exception
[12:14] <dsd079a> ok lets see then
[12:15] <ogra> not much that can be done here with software ...
[12:15] <ogra> " The error usually occurs due to component failure or the overheating or overclocking of hardware components."
[12:16] <ogra> check your fans ... drop overclocking settings from your BIOS etc
[12:16] <ogra> (ad check your RAM too)
[12:16] <pycurious> ogra: It's running a dual gpu setup. Perhaps that is causing the temperatures to rise beyond what it should be?
[12:16] <ogra> *and
[12:17] <ogra> pycurious, well, did you work on these hardware changes recently ? perhaps a card is not properly sitting in the socket, perhaps a fn cable is loose etc etc
[12:18] <dsd079> Eric^^ sadly its still the same thing
[12:18] <EriC^^> dsd079: ok no worries, are you sure legacy mode is enabled in the bios and uefi disabled?
[12:18] <pycurious> ogra: it is a machine I built 4 weeks ago - I just noticed this error. I do have a replacement RAM that I can try
[12:18] <dsd079> Let me check
[12:19] <EriC^^> dsd079: it's probably called "csm legacy"
[12:20] <dsd079> Hmm not sure about it cant seem to find anthing with it. I can provide a photo if you want od the bios menu
[12:21] <dsd079> In the boot category i can only change the boot order from the devices
[12:21] <EriC^^> aha, that's good enough
[12:21] <EriC^^> ok, when you get the grub rescue> try typing "ls" there
[12:21] <pycurious> ogra: https://dpaste.org/3MZD0 - current temps - do you see anything off?
[12:22] <dsd079> Ok i see hd0,hdmsdos6…5…2…and 1
[12:25] <ogra> pycurious, well, temps in the seventies seem pretty high for an idling system
[12:26] <pycurious> ogra: that system has a 100% dual gpu cooking going on.
[12:27] <EriC^^> dsd079: ok type "ls (hd0,msdos6)/"
[12:27] <EriC^^> do you see the linux files /boot /home etc
[12:28] <dsd079> Yeah i see a lot of things like boot,etc,media
[12:28] <pycurious> ogra: the GPUs are running 83C and 87C currently with almost 100% usage for multiple hours
[12:33] <EriC^^> dsd079: type 'set root=(hd0,msdos6)'
[12:34] <EriC^^> dsd079: then type     set prefix=($root)'/boot/grub'
[12:35] <EriC^^> then try 'insmod normal'
[12:36] <dsd079> I typed the set prefix and gor nothing back in insmod normal i got a "error no such partition"
[12:38] <pickanick> rob0, do you have time to look at wifi matters again?
[12:39] <dsd079> Eric^^ does it seems easy to fix it or it would be better to just reinstall xubuntu ?
[12:40] <EriC^^> dsd079: 1sec, *googles*
[12:40] <EriC^^> i think something weird is going on and not sure that a reinstall would cut it
[12:41] <dsd079> Hmm that does not sound any good
[12:42] <dsd079> Did the problem happened because my pc is old ?
[12:42] <dsd079> 10-15 years for sure
[12:43] <EriC^^> nah you're using legacy booting it should be fine
[12:44] <EriC^^> dsd079: try to reinstall ubuntu, this time when the live usb boots up, type 'ls /sys/firmware/efi' it should show no files (which means youve booted into legacy mode) then continue the installation, if it shows files then you have to reboot the live usb in legacy mode by using the boot options menu of the pc and choosing the entry that doesnt have uefi in it
[12:44] <EriC^^> dsd079: also when you reinstall, dont choose 'reinstall ubuntu' in the installer or itll overwrite windows
[12:45] <EriC^^> instead manually delete the ubuntu partitions, then choose 'install alongside windows'
[12:45] <dsd079> Ok let me check
[12:45] <EriC^^> easy way to know if you booted the live usb in legacy mode is if you get a nice menu in the middle, if you get a black/white grub menu then it's booted in uefi mode
[12:46] <pickanick> *many* (repeating every 10-150 sec)  dmesg messages like iwlwifi 0000:00:14.3: Microcode SW error detected. Restarting 0x0.  Preceded by "Queue 11 is active on fifo 1 and stuck for 10000 ms. SW [144, 161] HW [144, 161] FH TRB=0x0c010b09f" and followed by two "IWL Error Log Dump:" and "IML/ROM dump:" and "Fseq Registers:" ....
[12:46] <dsd079> Thx a lot by the way for the help!
[12:48] <Guest3630> can anyone see my message?
[12:48] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[12:49] <BluesKaj> Guest3630, yes
[12:49] <Guest3630> thank god
[12:50] <respawn> Guest3630: this is ubuntu help channel if you need help ask here
[12:50] <respawn> Guest3630:for non help general chat go to #ubuntu-offtopic right click join
[12:51] <SmellyCat> I started mysql-server with "bind <IP_ADDRESS>" while it should also listen on <IP_ADDRESS> (or all interfaces as in <IP_ADDRESS>). Is it possible to (temporarily) port-forward packets coming in from <IP_ADDRESS>:3306 to <IP_ADDRESS>:3306 so I don't have to restart the mysql-server during the day?
[12:52] <Guest3630> I hope some1 can help me out here. I'm trying to install kubuntu(yeah, the K)... tried like a thousand ways(with rufus/USBimager), can't boot this thing on my xps 13... meanwhile, I just tried to make an ubuntu bootable stick and it worked just fine. Tried to ask  the same question half an hour ago in the kubuntu channel here, but no1 is alive in
[12:52] <Guest3630> there...
[12:53] <respawn> Guest3630:do you get any errors when you try to boot kubuntu
[12:53] <dsd079> EriC^^ hey so in the sys/firmware i see only acpi,dmi and memmap no efi thing
[12:53] <SmellyCat> Guest3630: While it should be possible to install a clean Kubuntu, it's also possible to install kubuntu-desktop in the regular Ubuntu. This might be a quick solution
[12:54] <SmellyCat> Guest3630: As in installing the "kubuntu-desktop" package, that is
[12:55] <dsd079> EriC^^ is it ok then that i see no efi in firmware should i continue with the install?
[12:55] <Guest3630> respawn: not at all, I just can't even boot it... I get "press f1 key to retry boot, press f2 key to reboot into setup..."... Maybe I should create a boot myself in the bios and point on something?
[12:56] <EriC^^> dsd079: yeah
[12:56] <respawn> yeah and try disabling safeboot in uefi bios
[12:56] <EriC^^> dsd079: you're welcome
[12:57] <Guest3630> SmellyCat: Yeah, thanks. I actually googled that, but thought the kubuntu would be prefered option. btw: if I'll go with the ubuntu it self, would I be able to disable to pick the option on the start where I'll need to choose the gnome/kde?
[12:57] <Guest3630> respawn: u mean secure boot? it's disabled
[12:59] <SmellyCat> Guest3630: I don't believe you get to choose between gnome and anything else with the regular Ubuntu installer.
[13:00] <dsd079> EriC^^ and one more thing( hope i do not bother with so many questions) in the install i will just delete the xubuntu partition and the efi one and then create again 2 partitions one for / and another one partition for the efi correct?
[13:01] <Guest3630> SmellyCat: oh, wait a sec... I thought you were talking about installing KDE on ubuntu. what's the "kubuntu-desktop" thing?
[13:01] <lotuspsychje> Guest3630: wich kubuntu version is that you cant boot?
[13:01] <EriC^^> dsd079: yes delete both partitions, but only create 1 "/" , no need to efi partition since you're using legacy
[13:01] <Guest3630> lotuspsychje: oh, I forgot to mention it... 22.04.1
[13:01] <Guest3630> lotuspsychje: Kubuntu 22.04.1 LTS
[13:02] <SmellyCat> Guest3630: I was talking about install KDE/Kubuntu on Ubuntu, but that's after you've installed Gnome. You end up with an installation with both Gnome and KDE then. You probably could de-install gnome, if you wanted.
[13:02] <lotuspsychje> Guest3630: weird, i dont think there are bugs around that
[13:03] <ogra> and the isos/imgs are all built the same way for all flvours, so kubuntu should boot the same way as ubuntu does
[13:03] <dsd079> EriC^^ ok i will do that but if i remember it would not let me go further with the install if i did not have also an efi one. Might be mistaken but will see
[13:03] <lotuspsychje> yeah, my thought too ogra
[13:03] <Guest3630> SmellyCat: got it
[13:03] <Guest3630> lotuspsychje: I feel lucky then
[13:04] <lotuspsychje> Guest3630: maybe try an unofficial 'ventoy' to burn your kubuntu to stick, see if you can boot from there
[13:05] <lotuspsychje> Guest3630: and if several usb burning methods arent working, perhaps it might be your machine's settings/bios/uefi?
[13:05] <pickanick> Example of the wifi crash dumps in dmesg are in https://termbin.com/ky06
[13:06] <Guest3630> lotuspsychje: but how can it be my machine if I can do the same with ubuntu/manjaro/windows? doesn't seem logical.
[13:07] <lotuspsychje> yeah that would be weird indeed
[13:09] <lotuspsychje> Guest3630: im checking the jammy kubuntu releasenotes, bug dont think something about your issue; https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JammyJellyfish/ReleaseNotes/Kubuntu
[13:10] <lotuspsychje> Guest3630: you recall where you grabbed the jammy kubuntu iso from?
[13:11] <Guest3630> lotuspsychje: what do you mean, I've d/l it from the off website: https://kubuntu.org/getkubuntu/
[13:13] <lotuspsychje> allrighty
[13:24] <rob0> pickanick: sorry, swamped today. But others in channel are more likely to have Ubuntu-specific help for you. I've only used Ubuntu in virtual environments, never on real hardware.
[13:25] <rob0> My network hardware experience has been in other distributions.
[13:26] <rob0> Interestingly, though: in the vast majority of cases, everything Just Works, with little effort from the user.
[13:26] <pickanick> It used to just work, until the motherboard replacement. X-(
[13:28] <pickanick> And I have not been able to get through Dell support to someone who can read dmesg logs.
[13:28] <pickanick> Dell: "Take a screenshot of the error message (in Windows)"
[13:29] <pickanick> rob0: thanks for replying, maybe someone else can help, and/or I may try another time. Best regards!
[13:30] <rob0> yeah, Dell won't support you :(
[13:31] <rob0> so you transferred a hard drive with Ubuntu to a new machine/motherboard?
[13:32] <rob0> just for fun, did you try booting a live USB stick (any distro, or Ubuntu ideally)
[13:32] <rob0> My suspicion there is that everything will Just Work.
[13:33] <pickanick> I tried the 22.04 install USB and received the same errors.
[13:34] <pickanick> The machine was sold as "linux compatible" with an older version of Ubuntu.
[13:35] <sazbos> you could try fedora and linux mint
[13:37] <pickanick> which is more likely to be up to date? I'm guessing fedora, but I do not know linux mint.
[13:37] <rob0> Can Dell tell you what Linux distro was tested, to earn the "compatible" label? (Maybe they documented that?)
[13:37] <pickanick> I think it was 18.04
[13:45] <pickanick> I suppose I could try that too.
[13:52] <secure_> can i ask about lubuntu here ?
[13:54] <SteelRose> secure_: ask away ... :-)
[13:54] <secure_> i just install lubuntu. my terminal always dissapear.
[13:55] <samy1028> secure_, how do you mean your terminal always disappears?
[13:56] <secure_> when i type terminal.. then the menu show me QTerminal. i click on it... open then close... in just 1/2 s ( i dont count in real time actually :D )
[13:56] <nteodosio> secure_: Have you added something to your .bashrc?
[13:57] <secure_> fresh install
[13:58] <nteodosio> secure_: Switch to another VT (Ctrl+Alt+F3), log in, install xterm or whatever other terminal emulator, go back to your GUI, launch it.
[14:00] <secure_> now it working :( after ctrl alt F3 and back to desktop again
[14:00] <secure_> maybe first time install
[14:00] <nteodosio> I guess s/:(/:)/ ?
[14:01] <secure_> thank you
[14:01] <nteodosio> Glad to help
[14:16] <ogra> nteodosio, hmm dont you need to escape all these colons and parentheses (though that will indeed mess up the smileys) 🙂
[14:18] <nteodosio> ogra: Haha no, basic regular expression there: sed 's/:(/:)/' <<< ':('
[14:18] <ogra> hah kay
[15:27] <wad> I'm currently running ubuntu on a PC laptop. It boots to an external 1TB SSD, with LUKS encryption. How hard do you guys think it would be to run it under Windows 11, via VirtualBox, by mounting this same external SSD?
[15:28] <wad> Actually... there is 100GB of regular filesystem with the Ubuntu OS on it, and the rest is my home directory, LUKS encrypted.
[15:35] <pickanick> re wifi firmware:  if I rename iwlwifi-9000-pu-b0-jf-b0-46.ucode will the existing iwlwifi-9000-pu-b0-jf-b0-43.ucode be used instead? Or do I need to find an older version of the exact same filename? Are the last two characters of the filename the major version numbers ?
[16:01] <alkisg> wad: the slow way would be to use usb passthrough, the quick way would be to pass a raw disk: https://www.virtualbox.org/manual/ch09.html#rawdisk
[16:01] <alkisg> wad: that's all there is to it, linux doesn't care about hardware changes
[16:12] <SteelRose> wad: why don't you run Linux as the main OS and Win11 as a VM? VirtualBox is nice but slow as hell when compared to, say, KVM or qemu...
[16:19]  * wad sees answers, reads!
[16:21] <wad> Yeah, I _want_ to just run Ubuntu as the main OS. Sadly, there is a compliance issue with my employer, and my device is required to be "managed", which just means that the IT department can screw around with it without me having a say. -_-
[16:22] <wad> Looking at options currently.   :( So annoying.
[16:47] <wad> I wish there were a compliance-friendly version of Ubuntu available.
[16:47] <wad> It needs to come with a built-in unremovable rootkit, giving remote control to whoever has the extra super-root credentials.
[17:14] <Pagan> hi
[17:16] <ogra> wad, have you considered using WSL (or WSL2) instead ?
[17:17] <wad> I did, actually.
[17:17] <wad> The thing is, I really don't like using Windows at all. It's a toy.
[17:18] <wad> Once a power user gets familiar with Linux, trying to do anything in windows is like.... just smashing your head on the wall.
[17:18] <Pagan> arraybolt3 reinstall ubuntu 20.04 and Nvidia-340  with ppa:graphics-drivers/ppa error install vs kerbelen ppa
[17:19] <Pagan> it done i am on ubuntu
[17:20] <Pagan> arraybolt3 if u want we can install together
[17:22] <sazbos> was, exactly
[17:25] <morgan-hp> OK morgana has a new wist ie problem.  OK using an HP laptop with 22.04 I try to write on it (using the gui) and it doesnt work. I dont understand this, the df -h   https://pastebin.com/9uLRx68J
[17:26] <morgan-hp> Oops s/wist ie/ /
[17:27] <morgan-hp> I have a flash drive and cnt write on it. It looks fine to me.
[17:27] <morgan-hp> I tried every flash drive I have.
[17:30] <jhutchins> It's probably owned by root and read-only by users.
[17:30] <cryptz> hello, i am testing out ubuntu pro. My system just did a kernel upgrade from 5.15.0-48 to 5.15.0-50. A reboot was not flagged as required. trying to figure out what the expected behavior is or if its tweakable. I manage the systems with ansible, if a reboot is required I have it run the reboot. In this case it looked like pre pro behavior. The
[17:30] <cryptz> /lob/modules folder was created for 5.15.0-50, but uname -r was still 5.15.0-48 until a reboot. The issue being without the reboot required flag being set ansible did not act to reboot
[17:31] <jhutchins> morgan-hp: It might help if you were to specify what release you're on and what desktop & file manager you're using.
[17:32] <jhutchins> cryptz: What does the kernel changelog say the operational differences were?
[17:34] <jhutchins> morgan-hp: Short answer is it's supposed to work like that.
[17:34] <jhutchins> morgan-hp: Long answer: https://askubuntu.com/questions/251206/mount-usb-drive-with-write-permissions-for-everyone-or-specific-user
[17:35] <cryptz> jhutchins, if im interpretting it correctly, the change log may have only been for CVE-2022-3176
[17:35] -ubottu:#ubuntu- There exists a use-after-free in io_uring in the Linux kernel. Signalfd_poll() and binder_poll() use a waitqueue whose lifetime is the current task. It will send a POLLFREE notification to all waiters before the queue is freed. Unfortunately, the io_uring poll doesn't handle POLLFREE. This allows a use-after-free to occur if a signalfd or binder fd is polled with io_uring poll,... <https://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2022-3176>
[17:36] <cryptz> and two issues with ip/nexthop
[17:37] <jhutchins> cryptz: Are you likely to encounter those in normal use?
[17:37] <cryptz> no but im not looking to debate if I should have installed the update or not
[17:37] <cryptz> just trying to understand how livepatch matches up with the reported kernel version and the kernel packages installed
[17:37] <jhutchins> cryptz: No, just trying to figure out if a reboot is required.  Doesn't really look like it.
[17:38] <cryptz> its possible livepatch applied the cve update, using the newer linux package, but still reports the old kernel version?
[17:38] <jhutchins> !livepatch
[17:38] <cryptz> my main concern is the descrepency of the reported kernel version, and the existing of newer kernel version lib files, and then seeing a newer kernel version reported after a reboot, yet the system not reporting a reboot is required. to me that's a bit unmanageable
[17:38] <jhutchins> cryptz: Pretty sure livepatch has to be installed/enabled by the user.
[17:39] <cryptz> it is, im testing pro and lviepatch for the first time on this system
[17:39] <cryptz> so i understand its likely the cause of all of this
[17:39] <cryptz> but it still seems like from a practical sense, there are changes pending a reboot
[17:39] <cryptz> and its just a bit annoying to manage with ansible =)
[17:39] <cryptz> i might just back it out and disable it
[17:39] <cryptz> id prefer to reboot if theres something pending I guess..
[17:41] <cryptz> i might be missing somethign obvious, but from my perspective if livepatch can apply a security update without a reboot great, but if there are changes that will occur on the next reboot the system should still flag a reboot as required
[17:41] <Aavar> Hi. I have a server where Apparmor failes to start. How can I find out why and fix it?
[17:41] <ogra> cryptz, livepatch patches your binary kernel at runtime, i'D assume you had at least the CVE fix arriving via livepatch already so you'd be running a safe kernel and in that case a reboot is not actually required (i'D still do one though, just to make sure)
[17:42] <ogra> Aavar, apparmor is a kernel feature so if the userspace bits can not start it is likely you are not running a proper ubuntu kernel
[17:42] <cryptz> yea i wonder if there is some config option to flag a reboot as required when lviepatch acts in this manner, allowing us to of course delay the reboot. at the moment I have ansible scrips that would reboot these hosts when ran and remove older kernel versions as well. they arent acting due to the lack of a flag
[17:42] <ogra> Aavar, check with "uname -a" what your server is runnng
[17:43] <ogra> cryptz, well, how would livepatch know when the kernel deb comes in ?
[17:43] <Aavar> ogra: Linux aa-srv3 5.4.0-126-generic #142-Ubuntu SMP Fri Aug 26 12:12:57 UTC 2022 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[17:44] <Pagan> has anyone managed an nvidia 340 installer on ubuntu 20.04?
[17:44] <ogra> cryptz, matching your ansible scripts to notify a reboot every time you see linux-image come in should be safe, livepatch itself is not helpful here since it does not need a reboot at all
[17:44] <ogra> Aavar, hmm, that looks like a correct ubuntu kernel
[17:45] <ogra> Aavar, have you checked your journal for any reasons why apparmor can not start ?
[17:46] <Aavar> ogra: no, that is a good idea ;)
[17:48] <Aavar> ogra: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/vv3Cp8VK2j/ What is "capability bpf,"? Can I comment that line?
[17:50] <morgan-hp> jhutchins, thank you will go to the link. (I am using 22.04 with the vanilla DE, I think it is called gnome (but not gnome-classic)) -- I went to the link and it is above my level. I need something more basic to  understand what all the entries on the df -h mean) -- So hold my question while I search to try to learn what I need and I will ask again.  TY again.
[17:51] <morgan-hp> I will say hexchat on this laptop is much better than my desktop. I installed it through snap.
[17:51] <cryptz> ogra, i guess a better description of the problem was livepatch doing what it needed to do, followed later by me doing a apt-get dist-upgrade resulted in the system not prompting for a reboot, but after a successful reboot the kernel version being incremented
[17:51] <ogra> Aavar, grep bpf /sys/kernel/security/apparmor/features/caps/mask
[17:51] <cryptz> im going to disable livepatch for now
[17:52] <ogra> does that return anything ?
[17:52] <cryptz> that scenario is more of a problem for us then the benefits of livepatch
[17:52] <Aavar> ogra: Nothing in return
[17:53] <ogra> cryptz, well, i'd still check if your assumption is true then and try to go back to the "before livepatch" state if you can, just to make sure the suppression of the reboot-required requests actually comes from livepatch 🙂
[17:54] <ogra> Aavar, well, ten your kernel does not have bpf capabilities and the error is correct ... where does that libvirtd come from ? the ubuntu archive or some PPA
[17:55] <ogra> s/ten/then/
[17:55] <Aavar> ogra: I don't know... Its an old server... how can I find out?
[17:57] <ogra> Aavar, apt policy libvirt-daemon-system .... that should show where it comes from (and should typically only return *.archive.ubuntu.com addresses if no PPA or third party archive is involved)
[18:39] <Aavar> ogra: I think it came from quickemu ppa
[18:42] <ogra> Aavar, aha ... well, it seems they blindly backported a version (obviously without testing) that can not run on your ubuntu release ...
[18:43] <Aavar> ogra: I dont use quickemu on this machine anymore, so I will revert to the official version :)
[18:44] <ogra> you could try to hack the apparmor profile it complains about and simply drop bpf (it is just a text file) ... but i'D suggest to switch to the archive version instead
[18:44] <ogra> hah
[18:44] <ogra> you were faster (i was typing 😛 )
[18:44] <Aavar> ogra: what is bpf anyway?
[18:44] <Aavar> :)
[18:45] <ogra> Aavar, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Packet_Filter
[18:45] <Aavar> ogra: seems like a good thing to keep enabled.
[18:46] <ogra> (it allows apparmor to secure your network traffic)
[20:33] <ash_worksi> on VERSION="22.04.1 LTS (Jammy Jellyfish)", I switched back to my terminal and its "fullscreen" but part of it is behind the side dock
[20:33] <ash_worksi> I can fix it by minimizing and re-maximizing
[20:33] <ash_worksi> I am not sure when this occurs; I just left and came back after awhile
[20:33] <Square> Snap is showing pop ups (desktop notifications type) of pending updates in X days. Can I turn off those?
[20:56] <ogra> Square, you can turn it off, but that means your browser will update quietly while it is running and you will lose your session history from the point of the update to the point where you restart the browser
[20:56] <ogra> Square, if you still want that anyway https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/how-to-disable-snapd-update-notifications-permanently/31117/2
[20:57] <Square> ogra, oh ok. So it only says that for browsers?
[20:57] <ogra> no, it says that for all desktop app snaps currently
[20:57] <Square> ok, gotcha
[20:57] <ogra> but it is actively being worked on to improve it
[20:58] <ogra> (the UX is awful and everyone knows ... 🙂 )
[20:58] <Square> ogra, but basically, you just need to shut down the app and restart it?
[20:58] <Square> or shut down and actively update it?
[20:58] <ogra> the latter (i said the UX is awful 🙂 )
[20:59] <Square> NP, can't complain about a free lunch right.
[20:59] <ogra> this is all being fixed ... and since snaps are rolling release apps you'll get the fix as soon as it is ready
[21:00] <ogra> (i.e. nothing is bound to a release version and snapd (the tool managing snaps) is a snap itself so fixes roll in all the time)
[21:01] <Square> ...updating firefox
[21:01] <ogra> 👍
[21:01] <wez> 👍
[21:02] <ogra> (lots of hitchhikers here today 😄 )
[21:11] <ash_worksi> anyone else experiencing my issue on 22?
[21:14] <Habbie> ash_worksi, i did not read back to see what your issue was, but please be clear about 22.04 or 22.10 :)
[21:14] <Habbie> oh, the terminal behind the side dock
[21:14] <Habbie> i have a 22.04 that does that when i unlock it, but it fixes itself after a few seconds
[21:16] <ash_worksi> hmm
[21:16] <ash_worksi> I don't know what the source could be since it was me incidentally switching back
[21:17] <ash_worksi> I can't reproduce it just by locking
[21:18] <ash_worksi> w/e
[21:37] <Clammy> hello
[21:55] <dkee> is there a talk to text ap for me available?
[22:18] <Batzy> anyone know why the zoom client is locking up my system? it's using like 60% cpu
[22:19] <morgan-hp> I have a torrent link (from internet archive, no piracy here) I have 2204-gnome, I have transmission. I dont know how to download the torrent from the internet archive page. I dont know how to put the "torrent link" into transmission. Since this all comes with 22.04 please help me in this channel. This is what the link looks like:   torrent:urn:sha1:318608cba588c638d36b505cd3f1ff607bde79fe
[22:20] <morgan-hp> Batzy dont feel like the lone ranger. (I upgraded xoom and then removed it and tried to insatallit with anap -- oops too many things and it broke my ubuntu.
[22:20] <morgan-hp> )
[22:20] <ogra> Batzy, did you enable any fancy feaures ? zoom has some video manipulation options that can heavily hammer your system
[22:21] <morgan-hp> ogra can you even do those in ubuntu?
[22:21] <Batzy> er no i havent. i also wasnt using video
[22:21] <Batzy> i mean the laptop can run games better than zoom
[22:21] <Batzy> also when i was arch based i do not think it lagged
[22:22] <ogra> heh, well, it is proprietary software ... (though gmost games are too, that's probably not an argument)
[22:22] <Batzy> same hardware, but i might not be remembering
[22:22] <ogra> have you tried switching to Xorg for a test ?
[22:22] <Batzy> i can try the snap version i guess?
[22:22] <Batzy> whats the xorg version?
[22:23] <Batzy> rather where do i find it
[22:23] <ogra> if you log out and click your name on the login screen, there should be a little gear that lest you select the Xorg session
[22:23] <ogra> *lets
[22:31] <sid_> ig
[23:41] <noarb> I'm trying to build a deb from source using sbuild and I'm getting this error: https://bpa.st/WY3Q 'sbuild-build-depends-main-dummy : Depends: dh-python but it is not installable'. Any ideas of how to dig into this? Those logs are already verbose


[02:30] <skellat> Is there a link anywhere to go back and watch today's Ubuntu On Air talking about the Rolling Release proposal?  I had to be out doing errands.
[02:31] <Unit193> Is there not a channel on YouTube?
[02:32] <pleia2> skellat: see ubuntuonair.com
[02:33] <skellat> Ah, so this would be the link I can come back to later then I take it: http://youtu.be/z04ndWaVfJs
[02:34] <skellat> Oy.  There's an hour of it talking about rolling release?  Crap.  I'll watch that after I get a good night's sleep.
[02:35] <pleia2> yeah, looks like they explain it and then do lots of Q&A
[02:35] <pleia2> (I had work today, and tonight I am going to watch movies, it's been a long week :))
[02:36] <skellat> I was running errands, had to finally break down and buy a printer, and tend to business
[02:36] <skellat> Yeah, I'll watch it tomorrow
[02:36] <skellat> I may very well remark on it in The Burning Circle
[02:36] <skellat> How badly received is my small bit that showed up on the planet?
[02:37] <pleia2> I haven't heard anything
[02:38] <pleia2> lots of opinions floating around right now
[02:39] <skellat> I know
[02:39] <skellat> #kubuntu-devel has provided many insights just from watching it
[02:39] <skellat> But I gotta get back to breaking in that new printer.  Have a good night pleia2...
[02:39]  * skellat wanders off
[02:39] <pleia2> good luck
[03:35] <bluesabre> I've fixed a few things in lp:catfish-search, anybody want to do some light testing to make sure I didn't break anything before I do 0.6.1 release?  :-)
[03:37] <Len-nb> Whats the ppa again? I reinstalled the OS.
[03:43] <bluesabre> It's not in the PPA at the moment, since I moved away from quickly, its not packaged
[03:43] <bluesabre> but you can easily grab it with
[03:43] <bluesabre> bzr branch lp:catfish-search
[03:43] <bluesabre> I'm heading to bed
[03:44] <bluesabre> be back tomorrow
[06:23] <Len-nb> bluesabre, Seems to work ok. anything I tried. Wild cards don't seem to work on an sftp directory. Ok on the local drive.
[06:24] <Len-nb> searched for png works on sftp dir *.png doesn't but works local.
[06:25] <Len-nb> Searched for png in /usr/share/ in both cases
[06:31] <Len-nb> My mistake, I was searching in two different places, my remote machine is a server, the icons directory appears empty. It was the cups directory I was seeing.
[06:31] <Len-nb> Wild cards work in both places.
[09:19] <knome> hrmph, i just had this clear moment and i understood that if ubuntu moves to a rolling release model, they need to support 12.10 to 14.04 updates, or make anybody on 12.10 start using the rolling updates
[09:38] <knome> hmm, watching the video from the hangout
[09:39] <knome> why weren't members of edubuntu, ubuntu studio and xubuntu invited to the chat?
[09:39] <knome> only people from mythtv and kubuntu
[09:40] <bluesabre> Actually, considering that the kubuntu folks are actually being sponsored by another company, that might not be a bad thing
[09:41] <zequence> Was anyone invitie
[09:41] <zequence> ?
[09:41] <zequence> I was there, but found about it on G+
[09:42] <knome> bluesabre, no. micah has been talking about that tentatively
[09:42] <zequence> Didn't think about telling you guys
[09:42] <knome> i *knew* about the session
[09:42] <zequence> I let others know on US, but only I attended
[09:42] <knome> jono just said that some people were invited to join the hangout itself i understood
[09:43] <knome> zequence, what do you think about the ubuntu sdk?
[09:44] <zequence> knome: I've tried getting it to work without success a couple of times, so that perhaps tells you a story
[09:44] <zequence> I think they have some problems in many areas really
[09:44] <knome> they clearly want people to start using their stuff to keep them on ubuntu by telling them "we can guarantee you your app won't break"
[09:44] <zequence> I bought some music on ubuntuone over a month ago, and am still waiting for either the music or a refund
[09:45] <zequence> I'm unable to sync a big folder on ubuntuuone too. Been on it for two days now, trying to upload it, with decent bandwidth
[09:45] <zequence> I've seen problems with other clients too, on Android for instance
[09:46] <zequence> If it's going to be like that when they start selling the phone, won't matter how good it looks
[09:46] <knome> uff
[09:46] <bluesabre> yeah, ubuntuone has some inherent issues, but not sure if thats what knome means by the ubuntu-sdk
[09:46] <knome> no, that's not it
[09:46] <zequence> I wasn't referring to the sdk when talking about ubuntuone
[09:47] <zequence> I did try to install the sdk, but wasn't able to. And after I finally was, I couldn't get a simple example to work
[09:47] <zequence> The first sort of "hello world" example they have on developer.ubuntu.com
[09:48] <zequence> At first look, it looks like they aren't aiming at Java, so that's good
[09:49] <zequence> From what I understand, the first phone versions will be less convergent, but eventually, it'll be like a PC
[09:49] <zequence> How much so, I don't know
[09:49] <zequence> It's the same OS anyway
[09:50] <zequence> And as long as the user has the freedom to install what they want on the phone, that will be the important thing for me
[09:50] <knome> phones are going towards being more like pc's anyway
[09:51] <zequence> Yes, but this one will be more like the actual Ubuntu PC
[09:52] <bluesabre> knome, I'm curious about why we think a rolling-release model would be harmful to xubuntu?
[09:59] <knome> bluesabre, you'd have to discuss more with micah
[10:00] <bluesabre> are there any general details beyond updated packages?
[10:02] <knome> general detail regarding xubuntu or rolling release+
[10:02] <bluesabre> I guess more on the xubuntu side.  Everyone seems kind of bummed out about it, but I'm not sure why.
[10:03] <zequence> Initially, I can understand being disappointed when working for a release for almost half a year, and not being told in advance that it might not be releases
[10:04] <zequence> released*
[10:04] <knome> bluesabre, my main concern is the way it's communicated to the community.
[10:04] <zequence> Also, it seems like the rolling release is intended for developers first, which is not what flavors want
[10:04] <zequence> Other than Ubuntu, of course
[10:06] <bluesabre> Right.  But effectively, aren't the non-LTS releases just stable development checkpoints between LTS's?  "If you want a stable release, use LTS"
[10:06] <knome> bluesabre, i believe that is more true in the ubuntu desktop reality than flavors
[10:07] <zequence> Definately, yes
[10:08] <knome> zequence, can you remember if there was anything interesting for the flavors in the last 10 minutes?
[10:08] <zequence> Might be slight differences. Edubuntu used Unity. We use XFCE, like Xubuntu and rely on Xubuntu. Kubuntu is the larges group, and are probably least affected by what is happening in Unity
[10:09] <zequence> knome: I'm not against a rolling release, as long as we get power to influence
[10:09] <knome> zequence, that's most definitely the first requirement for the change to be succesful from the community point of view
[10:10] <zequence> We want stability, and for that we need some way of ensuring stability. I'm thinking different layers of repos, and from my point of view, there's no other good way of dealing with it
[10:11] <Unit193> I'd be alright with it if it is stable enough.  With Unity and Gnome GTK3, they may change other things (indicators, for example) that do end up affecting Xubuntu and Xfce in Ubuntu.
[10:11] <zequence> Ubuntu needs to be careful with system core libs, anything that can mess up things for others
[10:11] <zequence> I don't think it's ok for them to release r.c versions of kernels, etc
[10:11] <zequence> And, I'm pretty sure they won't
[10:12] <zequence> Not in a "stable" rolling release repo, anyway
[10:12] <zequence> Then it wouldn't be anything else but a rolling unfrozen development release
[10:13] <zequence> I mean, if they did
[10:13] <zequence> Same with xorg related things
[10:14] <zequence> I'm don't know what would cause most problems, but those are two things that everyone relies on
[10:15] <zequence> If the system core is always stable, and we have the power to decide over those things that are specific for us, I'd be ok with that
[10:15] <bluesabre> But doesn't that provide us with an opportunity to maintain and patch our relevant software as well?  I realize that our core development team is small, but I would imagine that there would be some sort of window before big release changes
[10:16] <zequence> I would like it if we get the chance to smoketest packages, and if there are problems, have them frozen. I don't know what the bar for something like that is now - that it doesn't build, or totally crashes your system?
[10:18] <knome> zequence, it's been demonstrated before that ubuntu doesn't care too much about flavors breaking even for LTS releases
[10:18] <bluesabre> heh
[10:18] <bluesabre> damn messaging indicator
[10:19] <knome> zequence, based on that, i don't think i can agree with you that ubuntu will be at all careful with packages affecting flavors in the rolling repository
[10:19] <knome> anyway, i got to take a shower and then leave
[10:19] <zequence> knome: Depends highly on if they will keep different repos or not. If they consider the rolling release, as is, a true development/expirementation release only, than, yes, I would agree with you
[10:20] <knome> even if it was considered stable, i couldn't agree.
[10:20] <zequence> Things are always going to break, but you need the chance to do something about it
[10:20] <knome> they will only make sure ubuntu (the OS) works, and "try" to notice people enough in advance for them to fix/change their things before they break.
[10:21] <knome> that's what they're telling you what happens if you use ubuntu sdk.
[10:21] <knome> if you're not using that, then it's going to be much more random.
[10:22] <knome> anyway, shower now. will check irc quickly before leaving home.
[10:31] <knome> ok, i'm off
[10:31] <knome> zequence, bluesabre: if you're around later today, i'll happily discuss about this further with you
[10:31] <knome> ->
[10:36] <bluesabre> knome, sure.  Not sure when I'll be on today, but I'll keep my account connected :)
[11:33] <bluesabre> there is a remote possibility that I actually managed to upload a package to the catfish stable ppa
[12:00] <bluesabre> Ok, it's definitely uploaded, now whether it builds or not is a different story altogether
[12:00] <bluesabre> and it looks like its a 2-hour wait for next build
[12:01] <bluesabre> So, guess I'll check that out tonight :)
[22:48] <amerigena> Here's a question that's been bugging me : I'm (trying) to work with a distro called OS4. Xubuntu based. Have an older version of it installed on this PC.
[22:49] <amerigena> Between System and Help, on the default menu. there were two separators. Fine.
[22:50] <amerigena> I used Alacarte, removed one of the separators, and now, at the top of the top-level menu, above Web Browser and Mail Reader, there's an entry for Wine, that I don't want there, and haven't been able to figure out how to get rid of.
[22:52] <amerigena> I've tried Googling it, have tried editing the default menus in ~/.config/menus and /etc/xdg/xdg-xubuntu/menus - can't find the solution.
[22:53] <Unit193> amerigena: 1.  This is the Xubuntu development channel, not support.  2. We don't support anything other than Xubuntu in #xubuntu   3. Your issue is with the files in ~/.local/share/applications/
[22:54] <Unit193> (IIRC anyway, I had that issue.)
[23:13] <amerigena> Fair enough.
[23:13] <amerigena> Worth a try.
[23:15] <amerigena> Thank you.
[23:18] <Unit193> Sure, got it?
[23:44] <amerigena> Nope. Not yet. But I'll get there.
[23:44] <amerigena> I see a file called alacarte.made.desktop. But opening it just shows references to Xfce-Terminal, not Wine.
[23:48] <amerigena> That's the problem - can't find any references to Wine.


[20:03] <mup> Bug #1915319 opened: clock sync via NTP causes commissioning or deployment failures <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1915319>