[18:43] <waldelf> hi there..
[18:43] <waldelf>   before reporting a bug i just wanted to see if i am alone with this one...
[18:43] <waldelf>  i've got a dualscreen setup and everytime a monitor goes to sleep plasmashell "partly" crashes..   that means it doesn't entirely crash and restart.. it just sits there
[18:44] <waldelf> without widgets and panels... and one of the screens is black and does't react to rightclick.. the other screen still shows the context menu
[18:45] <waldelf> using plasma 5.5.5 here on kubuntu 16.04 beta
[18:45] <waldelf> thx


[14:56] <MaxFrames> hello
[14:56] <MaxFrames> can you tell me how to upgrade now from 14.04 to 16.04?
[14:57] <MaxFrames> I know that by default lts releases are not made available right away through software update
[14:57] <tsimonq2> MaxFrames: sudo do-release-upgrade in the terminal
[15:00] <MaxFrames> that command will install 16.06 lts?
[15:01] <MaxFrames> it didn't ask for any confirmation...
[15:01] <MaxFrames> a lot of entries with "err"
[15:02] <MaxFrames> it says press enter to continue
[15:02] <MaxFrames> if I ctrl+c will it abort nicely?
[15:02] <tsimonq2> I think so
[15:11] <MaxFrames> no
[15:11] <MaxFrames> and now even the gui updates wont work
[15:11] <MaxFrames> ....
[15:12] <MaxFrames> "unable to install all the updates" because of "a previous incomplete update"
[15:12] <MaxFrames> :((
[15:12] <MaxFrames> I shouldn't have tried that command.....
[15:13] <MaxFrames> now I need help to restore normal functionality
[15:13] <MaxFrames> I think it has updated the repositories to point at the new version
[15:27] <MaxFrames> lesson learned... don't ask for advice here :(
[18:19] <n-iCe> hi
[18:24] <tsimonq2> hi n-iCe
[18:26] <n-iCe> :D
[18:38] <tsimonq2> n-iCe: just so you know, this is a support channel, hop over to #lubuntu-offtopic to chat :D
[18:41] <n-iCe> :)
[21:46] <Shravan> I install lubuntu on my Pentium 4 (3.4 GHz) 1 GB RAM but video performance in bad. How Can I install Graphics drivers to enhance video performence
[21:47] <extinct_potato> depends what graphics you have.
[21:47] <extinct_potato> if you have built-in graphics then their performance is usually crappy.
[21:48] <Shravan> yes I have built in graphics. but it perform relatively well with windows XP
[21:49] <Shravan> currently my system feels like fresh windows XP without graphics drivers.
[21:49] <genii> What says the result of sudo lspci -nn| grep VGA
[21:49] <Shravan> Is there any way to find out what hardware I have and whether driver is installed or not
[21:50] <Shravan> glxinfo shows unknown
[21:50] <Shravan> unknown render
[21:51] <genii> To find out driver, you need lshw installed, then: sudo lshw -C video
[21:52] <genii> In the "capabilities" line if a driver is being used, it will have the name there
[21:54] <Shravan> thanks <gennii> I will check it and get back with more info


[15:56] <`23meg> hi all
[15:57] <`23meg> how can I override the icons used in evolution's toolbar?
[15:57] <andreasn> hey
[15:57] <andreasn> I'm not sure you can do that in the stable release
[15:57] <andreasn> montreal have a couple of patches to trunk to make it work though
[15:58] <`23meg> I remember doing it before; I just replaced some icons somewhere
[15:58] <andreasn> any particular icon you're thinking about?
[15:59] <`23meg> the "new", "send/receive" etc. icons in the toolbar
[16:00] <andreasn> ah, those
[16:00] <andreasn> hold on
[16:01] <andreasn> it should be mail-send-receive.png
[16:01] <andreasn> although, evo might still use a old name for that
[16:01] <andreasn> if you have icon-naming-utils at hand it will rename it though
[16:01] <andreasn> let me check what the old name could be
[16:02] <`23meg> the human theme mostly inherits them from the gnome theme, right?
[16:03] <andreasn> yes
[16:03] <andreasn> don't you get the new gnome-icon-theme icon in evo?
[16:04] <andreasn> hm, there is gnome-stock-mail-new
[16:04] <andreasn> and mail_new
[16:05] <`23meg> I think this is it: /usr/share/icons/gnome/22x22/actions/stock_mail-send-receive.png
[16:05] <andreasn> ah, yeah, that sounds right
[16:05] <andreasn> it will probably break next evo release though
[16:10] <andreasn> montreal said his patches didn't get into 2.20, so it's still the old names
[16:13] <_MMA_> andreasn: Hello sir. How was your flight home? Have you heard from Lessig? (I forgot how to spell his name.)
[16:13] <andreasn> Lessing?
[16:13] <andreasn> Lasse you mean?
[16:13] <_MMA_> Yeah. :)
[16:13] <_MMA_> I also got to find his email as he said he had a friend that wanted to work on Ubuntu Studio.
[16:14] <andreasn><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[16:14] <_MMA_> Awesome. Thanx.
[16:14] <andreasn> but no, I haven't chatted with him since I got home
[16:14] <darkmatter> mornin' ladies.. err.. "lads" >_>
[16:16] <_MMA_> andreasn: Did you fly out Saturday in all that rain?
[16:17] <andreasn> no, I flew out on friday
[16:17] <_MMA_> Ahh....
[16:18] <andreasn> quite some turbulece in the air though
[16:19] <andreasn> was your flight home good?
[16:19] <_MMA_> Yeah. I flew out Saturday and it was pouring. Take-off was bumpy but after that was fine. :)
[16:19] <_MMA_> My flight was only 1.5hrs.
[16:34] <lapo> hi
[16:35]  * _MMA_ waves.


[07:06] <mup> PR operator#797 opened: cleaned up logging output <Created by PietroPasotti> <https://github.com/canonical/operator/pull/797>


 any idea on how to setup proxy in 19.04 or 18.10 for the terminal? To clone repos for example.
 you mean like HTTP proxy?
 or SSH proxy u:P
 Http
 Haven't thought about ssh...
[16:32] <teward> https://gist.github.com/evantoli/f8c23a37eb3558ab8765 maybe this helps?
 Thanks!


[01:52] <EleanorEllis> Is the realtime kernel for ubuntustudio any slower than the regular ubuntu kernel for general purpose activities like web browsing or using office applications? I have a fairly old computer with only 8GB RAM which struggles when I have several tabs open in my browser so I am wondering whether to dual boot ubuntustudio with regular ubuntu and only use ubuntustudio when I am editing video or audio.
[02:04] <ubuntu-studio> I haven't noticed any difference but I haven't clocked them or anything.
[02:29] <EleanorEllis> ubuntu-studio: Thank you
[02:30] <ubuntu-studio> No worries.
[02:31] <EleanorEllis> I see ubuntustudio uses xde. I prefer gnome-flashback. Also gnome supports secure access to online accounts such as gmail and I was struggling to get that working in xubuntu. Is there any advantage to xde over gnome-flashback?
[04:26] <OvenWerk1> EleanorEllis: ubuntustudio uses xfce
[04:29] <OvenWerk1> I personally gave up on Gnome as a desktop when I couldn't even open the desktop on anything older than one or two years
[04:30] <EleanorEllis> OvenWerk1: I know it does. I am using Gnome-Flashback rather than Gnome-Session which mimics the old Gnome 2 interface with Gnome Panel which used to ship with Ubuntu. My laptop is more than 5 years old.
[04:30] <OvenWerk1>  I hear gnome has gotten better, I am not sure they handle multilevel menus very well and I don't seem to navigate search based menuing worth anything... I spend more ti==me looking for an application than running it.
[04:31] <EleanorEllis> I don't use Compiz though, only Metacity
[04:31] <OvenWerk1> how many devs work on flashback?
[04:31] <EleanorEllis> I don't know
[04:32] <OvenWerk1> Most of what Studio has should be able to work with just about any DE
[04:32] <EleanorEllis> I must say being able to search in the applications menu in xde is good but I find some other parts clunky and the file browser doesn't integrate with Dropbox so I have to install Nautilus on it. I am just wondering if XDE is inherently faster than Gnome-Flashback
[04:33] <OvenWerk1> Either install your de on top or install your de fisrt and add the UbuntuSTudio meta packages
[04:33] <OvenWerk1> What is xde?
[04:34] <OvenWerk1> The last time I used nautilus I found they had removed functionallity and made menus a) hard to find and b) non-standard
[04:35] <EleanorEllis> That is also true
[04:36] <EleanorEllis> Sorry I meant XFCE!
[04:36] <OvenWerk1> Ah. anyway, I have had no trouble with thunar as a filemanager. I do not know if it still has trouble with high file rename activity though.
[04:38] <EleanorEllis> My only problem with Thunar is that there seems to be no integration with Dropbox
[04:38] <EleanorEllis> So I can't tell if my files are up to date or being updated
[04:38] <OvenWerk1> The main reason for moving from gnome 2 to xfce is that gnome 3 was unusable for many people and so was unity. Now that gnome has moved forward some and unity is going away... Studio may revisit what DE we use.
[04:39] <OvenWerk1> Then in your case you would have to install nautilus or some ther file manager for your use.
[04:41] <EleanorEllis> Do you think that would be preferable to installing gnome-flashback?
[04:42] <OvenWerk1> I do not know gnome flashback well enough to say. If you like gnome flash back, install it and add some or all Studio meta packages. There are only about 5 or 6 if you need the lowlatency kernel.
[04:43] <EleanorEllis> I was going to install Ubuntu Studio in a new partition, so that I get JACK preconfigured and all the standard Ubuntu Studio video apps
[04:44] <EleanorEllis> I already gnome-flashback installed on the version of Ubuntu desktop I am using right now.
[04:44] <OvenWerk1> That is another way yes. ubuntustudio-controls will fix a jack install that is not done right.
[04:45] <EleanorEllis> In the past I have found JACK very hard to configure. But installing the meta-packages here would be a lot quicker.
[04:45] <OvenWerk1> Biggest hint, don't use a GUI software installer besides synaptic
[04:46] <EleanorEllis> I only synaptic or the command line. I don't like Ubuntu Software. It seems buggy to me.
[04:46] <OvenWerk1> USC and the newer "software" will probably install jack wrong.
[04:46] <EleanorEllis> Oh and if I install a DEB that I have downloaded I use gdebi
[04:46] <EleanorEllis> I would uninstall Ubuntu Software if I could. I hate it!
[04:46] <OvenWerk1> They don't tell you when they wish to remove software that doesn't fit either
[04:47] <EleanorEllis> How do you mean?
[04:47] <OvenWerk1> Sometimes to install new software other software has to be removed... apt or synaptic will tell you this is going to happen and let you back out, the software center just does it.
[04:48] <OvenWerk1> Wine for example is bad for removing some video drivers
[04:48] <OvenWerk1> The computer still works but video is much slower
[04:48] <EleanorEllis> Oh I see.
[04:48] <EleanorEllis> Would you mind helping me configure JACK if I just install the meta packages?
[04:49] <EleanorEllis> Then again, on the other hand, I have probably installed a lot of crap I don't need which will be taking up disk space so perhaps starting from a clean install would have advantages.
[04:50] <OvenWerk1> Jack is not hard to set up in general so long as you use onlu one audio device for both inputs and outputs
[04:50] <OvenWerk1> *only
[04:51] <OvenWerk1> as soon as you want to use one device for output and a USB mic or something like that for input, it get s harder
[04:52] <EleanorEllis> That is the reason I need JACK. I need multiple inputs from possibly multiple devices.
[04:53] <OvenWerk1> So you also need zita-ajbridge
[04:53] <EleanorEllis> Really? I thought I remember JACK being able to do this stuff as is
[04:53] <OvenWerk1> You set jack up for the device you use for outputs and use zita-a2j for any other inputs you need
[04:54] <EleanorEllis> I seem to remember an application where you could draw the connectivity you want, linking physical devices to software inputs, or even outputs of one software to inputs of another
[04:54] <OvenWerk1> jack1 does have zita-ajbridge built in... sort of but does not have dbus yet so pulse can't auto bridge to it.
[04:55] <EleanorEllis> I use more than one device for output as well.
[04:55] <OvenWerk1> zita can do that as well
[04:55] <EleanorEllis> What is dbus?
[04:55] <EleanorEllis> I always get confused with alsa and pulse
[04:55] <OvenWerk1> it is a method for one application to communitcate with another
[04:56] <OvenWerk1> pulse is a layer that goes over top of alsa that makes each appl;ication think it has full access to alsa by auto mixing streams together without bloacking
[04:57] <OvenWerk1> It is a front end, alsa is a backend
[04:57] <EleanorEllis> You mean without pulse, each application would try to get exclusive access to ALSA?
[04:57] <OvenWerk1> pulse is really good for desktop kinds of things, but is generally not usable for (semi)profesional audio
[04:57] <OvenWerk1> yes that is correct
[04:58] <EleanorEllis> Can't I route desktop app sounds through JACK without PULSE?
[04:58] <OvenWerk1> pulse is not sample for sample acurate. if it gets behind it just looses audio
[04:59] <OvenWerk1> some of them yes, some not. Skype talks to pulse directly... won't even work with raw alsa. Pulse is the only option for bluetooth audio right now.
[05:00] <OvenWerk1> but again, for profesional use, wire is better anyway.
[05:01] <OvenWerk1> For someone who wants BT headphones for mixing on the train, going from jack to pulse to bt is fine.
[05:01] <EleanorEllis> Wire? Yet another sound module I don't know about. Don't most applications talk to JACK directly? I don't need skype as I will use Pidgin for that
[05:02] <OvenWerk1> no I mean wired as oposed to wireless. Bluetooth is wireless, phones that plugin are wired
[05:02] <EleanorEllis> Oh, of course.
[05:03] <EleanorEllis> I was thinking of using bluetooth as a cheap alternative to radio mics, and hopefully suffering less degradation than analogue FM
[05:04] <OvenWerk1> Then you would need pulse as a front end for jack if you are using SW that needs jack.
[05:04] <OvenWerk1> Jack can be set up with more than a stereo pair bridged
[05:05] <ubuntu-studio> Hey OvenWerk1 when you 2 get to a stopping point I have a question.
[05:05] <OvenWerk1> I have set it up with 3 stereo pairs in the past.
[05:05] <EleanorEllis> ubuntu-studio: Feel free to jump in
[05:05] <OvenWerk1> go ahead. I will be going to bed soon.
[05:06] <EleanorEllis> OvenWerk1: Thanks for your help so far
[05:06] <OvenWerk1> I think I am the farthest west on here
[05:06] <OvenWerk1> most are utc or utc +1 or 2
[05:06] <OvenWerk1> I am -7
[05:09] <OvenWerk1> EleanorEllis: you may find the next beta of ubuntustudio-controls helpful at https://launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/+archive/ubuntu/autobuild
[05:10] <ubuntu-studio> casper/vm/linuz not found on install from live usb. Tried chmod  and chown with no results. Kinda a noob here. How can I get the install to recognize the casper I can find?  14.04.5 btw
[05:10] <OvenWerk1> except not really for blue tooth
[05:11] <OvenWerk1> ubuntu-studio: huh, that is one I would find hard to answer. It seems to me it is about usinf the right tool to print the usb stick. I used to use dd
[05:11] <OvenWerk1>  it worked for me
[05:12] <OvenWerk1> Oh vm? does that mean you are trying to install on a vm
[05:12] <ubuntu-studio> I've done (from an xp) Rufus, unetbootin, and pendrive. All to no avail.
[05:14] <ubuntu-studio> no I want it as the sole OS. I'm running a frankenstien that SATA is burned on motherboard. So everything is all SS flash. My HD..LMAO...is a 128G nano flash.
[05:14] <OvenWerk1> have you just tried sudo dd if=isofilename of=/dev/sd*? (where sd* is the device name of your usb drive at the time)
[05:15] <ubuntu-studio> I'm not familiar with that one very much.
[05:16] <OvenWerk1> can you get a vanilla ubuntu to work? There are a lot more people on #ubuntu than there are here and there is little or no difference from one iso to the next in ubuntu.
[05:16] <OvenWerk1> Anyway, my wife is calling I must go
[05:16] <ubuntu-studio> ROger... will make my first dive at the dd
[19:35] <studio-user892> http://i.imgur.com/G2phXAh.png
[21:08] <studio-user892> anyone around?
[21:08] <studio-user892> im getting error http://i.imgur.com/G2phXAh.png
[21:30] <xebax-argentine> holas, hello
[21:30] <xebax-argentine> alguien aqui, hey frickies????
[21:39] <xebax-argentine> chiauuuuuuu


[03:45] <jphilips> bluesabre: any thoughts on how i can fix this - https://gitlab.xfce.org/apps/xfce4-screensaver/-/issues/52
[09:23] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xfce4-announce:: ANNOUNCE: xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin 2.4.6 released @ http://xfce.10915.n7.nabble.com/ANNOUNCE-xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin-2-4-6-released-tp59311.html (by Graeme Gott)
[09:24] <Unit193> Crap.
[09:28] <Unit193> bluesabre: You still good, alive?
[10:57] <bluesabre> Unit193: alive, just stretched thin :)
[10:58] <Unit193> Figured that latter part.
[11:06] <Unit193> Hope it eases up soon.
[11:10] <bluesabre> Vacation starts tomorrow, so that’s a massive relief... just got a ton of things I’ve gotta do today
[11:12] <DarkTrick> Hm... is it possible to write into window frames of xorg? E.g. to create buttons there like for Client-side-windows?
[14:16] <jphilips> bluesabre: is there a git repo of your UI theming app that you were working on?
[15:04] <DarkTrick> bluesabre, if you have a git repo, I would also be highly interested in a link. Could you mention my name in that case?
[23:45] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xfce4-announce:: ANNOUNCE: xfce4-timer-plugin 1.7.1 released @ http://xfce.10915.n7.nabble.com/ANNOUNCE-xfce4-timer-plugin-1-7-1-released-tp59313.html (by Andre Miranda)


[01:30] <jbicha> bug 1659448
[01:33] <jbicha> ubot9: wake up!
[01:42] <jbicha> "grub fails to install bootloader for zesty LVM with Encryption" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1659448
[21:51] <jbicha> cyphermox: do you anticipate but 1659448 being fixed today? I'm doing an Ubuntu GNOME zesty Alpha2 candidate respin now but can wait for that
[22:50] <cyphermox> jbicha: most definitely not, it needs careful testing. I have a fix in mind, but it's a little special that it needs rebuilding ubiquity and some testing to make sure I don't break lvm in the process
[22:51] <jbicha> cyphermox: no problem, thanks


[07:06] <LaserJock> anybody know how to change branch details in the new LP?
[07:09] <wgrant> LaserJock: Pencil next to the branch title?
[07:10] <LaserJock> I don't see one
[07:11] <wgrant> LaserJock: Hm, I can see one on my branches. https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-qa/debcheck/ubuntuwire is one you should be able to see too.
[07:11] <LaserJock> ok, right, I see it there
[07:11] <LaserJock> then why can't I see it on a vcsimport I registered
[07:12] <wgrant> Because you're aren't a member of ~vcs-imports
[07:12] <LaserJock> well that's stupid
[07:12] <wgrant> Quite possibly.
[07:12] <LaserJock> I was gonna fix an import that's been down since 2007-10-07 but I guess not
[07:13] <wgrant> How do you propose to fix it?
[07:13] <LaserJock> the project moved to svn
[07:13] <LaserJock> all I need to do is update the url and it should work
[07:13] <wgrant> File an answer, I propose.
[07:20] <LaserJock> wgrant: yeah, I suppose that'll have to do
[08:21] <wgrant> Hm. That's a few buildds.
[13:42] <psycose> I run a Launchpad PPA builder session using Ubuntu Intrepid, can i tell the system to create a symlink (sudo ln -s /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.3 /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.3.1) because the compiler tool chain crash without it ?
[13:43] <psycose> or should i wait that ubuntu packager solve that problem ?
[13:52] <persia> psycose: You should probably file a bug against gcc in Ubuntu describing the issue.  I suspect we'd have *many* more FTBFS reports if it affected every package.
[14:45] <fta> too bad it's not possible to re-upload a deleted package with a different src tarball in ppa :(
[14:45] <fta> as the tarball is gone from the pool, it should be possible..
[15:15] <persia> fta: Yeah, but it violates the archive model.
[15:16] <fta> it's a ppa
[15:16] <persia> Once an orig.tar.gz has been published, it ought not be changed.  REVU makes a special exception to this because so many orig.tar.gz files there are initially broken, but even REVU probably oughtn't.
[15:16] <persia> Yes, but it violates the very idea that an orig.tar.gz is actually the original tarball.
[15:17] <persia> Where it isn't the original tarball, it ought have an appropriate indicator indicating modification, which indicator ought be bumped when it is changed.
[15:18] <fta> most ppa are probably not better than REVU..
[15:19] <fta> in my case, it was a buggy vcs tag but as i want this package to enter the repo, i don't want to publish a higher version in my ppa
[15:20] <persia> Yeah, sadly most PPA probably aren't better.
[15:21] <persia> And I understand your use case: it's an unforunate side effect when orig.tar.gz's don't match upstream.
[15:22] <cprov> persia: agree
[15:23] <cprov> fta: wouldn't it be clearer to add a patch (using dpatch) modifying the orig ?
[15:23] <persia> cprov: Not in the case of a buggy tag.
[15:23] <cprov> fta: just and idea, I don't know exactly if it would be legitimate.
[15:23] <fta> cprov, not in this case, that would be a several megs patch
[15:24] <persia> Essentially, sometimes there isn't an original tarball that upstream releases.  In these cases, we construct one with a get-orig-source rule.
[15:24] <persia> If the wrong rev is pulled, the orig.tar.gz is mislabelled, so a packaging mistake ends up costing the appropriate version number.
[15:25] <persia> This is especially annoying for VCS-centric upstrems that are good about tagging releases appropriately.
[15:26] <cprov> yes, I see, very annoying from the maintenance PoV.
[15:26] <persia> fta: Don't let a several meg patch frighten you: you don't want to adjust because it would be wrong, not because of the patch size.
[15:26] <persia> cprov: Part of why some maintainers don't like VCS.  Mind you, when it works, it can vastly simplify the work, it just doesn't always work.
[15:27] <persia> (especially when the maintainer makes a mistake)
[15:28] <cprov> persia: right. Do you think a bug should be filled to discuss this issue ? Do you see anything we could do on the infrastructure side to make it work better ?
[15:29] <fta> i created bug 263301 already
[15:29] <cprov> fta: thank you.
[15:29] <persia> cprov: I would have said no :)  But it depends on the purpose of a PPA.
[15:29] <persia> If a PPA is supposed to be a scratch space for people to fiddle and learn, then deletion ought actually delete.
[15:30] <persia> While this might violate all sorts of conventions, and permit people to do things like upload lower versions, etc., it makes it a better scratch space.
[15:30] <cprov> persia: it does delete, however the package version and the orig version|content remains blacklisted
[15:31] <persia> If PPAs are supposed to be little release archives for stuff not in other distributions or with patches not in other distributions, then fixing the bug is a bad idea, as it fails to encourage adherence to the conventions.
[15:31] <persia> cprov: The content is deleted.  The existence of the upload is not deleted.  My apologies for confusion.
[15:31] <fta> cprov, i also opened bug 263296 just before.. a ui problem with delete
[15:32] <persia> I already opened that bug, so that's a dup.  I'll see if I can find mine.
[15:32] <persia> And you can delete the packages, it's just very awkward.
[15:32] <fta> i looked but couldn't find it
[15:33] <jpds> Does anyone know how I can use the "inTeam" method described in http://people.ubuntu.com/~flacoste/launchpad-api-doc.html ?
[15:35] <cprov> fta: persia: nice, two new bugs on ppa, I will investigate solutions for them Monday. Thank you, guys.
[15:35] <jpds> I do: me.inTeam("ubuntu-dev") and I get this error: http://paste.ubuntu.com/42171/
[15:35] <fta> thank *you*
[15:36] <persia> fta: I can't find it either.  Odd.  Thanks for filing then :)
[15:36] <fta> persia, i usually search 1st :)
[15:36] <persia> cprov: which is the intended model for the PPAs?  I'll comment on 263301 appropriately.
[15:37] <persia> fta: Certainly :)  I was just *sure* I filed that bug, as it was causing me lots of issues in June.
[15:39] <cprov> persia: well, the intended model is the current one, package and orig versions always grow coherently. However this model has issues. Better describe the broken workflows and decided to change the system to fit all of them.
[15:40] <persia> cprov: At a much higher level, are PPAs scratch spots for people to play, or intended for release purposes for teams?
[15:40] <cprov> persia: both.
[15:40] <cprov> persia: since we assume they are compatible.
[15:41] <persia> Ah.  That assumes that anyone uploading always does it right :)  With that assumption, we don't need PPAs, as we could just take it in Ubuntu.
[15:41] <cprov> persia: the current situation suggests they are *not* (as I see it)
[15:41] <persia> No.  I'll comment both ways to underscore this in the bug.  Thanks for describing the confusion.
[15:41] <cprov> persia: ehe, thanks
[15:44] <fta> funny, go to +delete-packages, enter something bogus in the search field but don't search, select a package to be deleted and click delete, you get the bogus search error.
[15:44] <fta> is it the same form ?
[15:45] <fta> my bogus search was to search for something in the version, not in the package name
[15:55] <cprov> fta: they are part of the same form, indeed.
[15:57] <fta> cprov, ok, so the question is, should search prevail over delete ?
[15:58] <cprov> fta: IMHO, it does because of the way the page is implemented "search/select/act", but that can be changed.
[16:00] <fta> cprov-lunch, it should look for field.actions.update vs field.actions.delete to do the right thing
[16:00] <fta> need a another bug ?
[16:00] <fta> -a
[16:00] <cprov-lunch> fta: yes, file that too.
[16:07] <fta> bug 263314
[16:16] <persia> fta: Please update 263301 if my description of the general case in support of your need is insufficiently general to cover your specific situation.
[16:19] <fta> persia, it's indeed what happened to me: i fixed it earlier today http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/mozilla-devscripts/mozilla-devscripts/revision/171
[16:20] <persia> fta: Great.  Let's see how it gets interpreted tomorrow.  I'm still not sure which is the right answer (for all the reasons I describe), but it's better that the implementation be based on an informed decision, rather than just what happens to be right for Ubuntu.
[16:27] <fta> i would not say i'm new to packaging, but my get-orig-source rule is far from trivial and then probably not bugfree. Got the proof today with mercurial and firefox 3.1
[16:56] <persia> fta: No, you're not new to packaging, and your get-orig-source rules tend to make people cry, but I think that a novice packager is more likely to end up in this situation than yourself, and would rather avoid the bug being rejected because you are special: better to have the decision be based on a general case.
[17:35] <fta> persia, sure. that's why i didn't use mozilla anywhere in the bug, or my vcs specificities. btw, who's crying about my get-orig-source rules and about which package(s) ? i'd be interested to know the arguments.
[17:36] <persia> fta: At least me for prism.  That was probably the least easy get-orig-source I ever reviewed.
[17:36] <persia> Note that this isn't necessarily a bad thing: sometimes things must be done that way.
[17:37] <persia> Also note that the final result produced correct data, so the fact that it was hard for me to understand isn't very important.
[17:41] <fta> persia, ok. for prism, that's history now. my last version of debian/rules looks like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/42200/ but that whole WEBAPPS thing will probably disappear too.
[17:43] <persia> fta: You include /usr/shre/mozilla-devscripts/prism.mk and you still need 99 lines for a CDBS rules file?  I like CDBS with 1 line.
[17:43] <persia> This isn't the forum really, but complication is relative :)
[17:49] <fta> persia, 2 reasons, 1st: /usr/share vs /usr/lib (preferred upstream path) to please lintian, 2nd: as i said, WEBAPPS mess that will disappear. I tried to simply xulapp packaging as much as possible, see my (temptative of) tutorial here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/XulApps/Packaging but it's still not easy business. yet the rules files in there is small
[17:49] <fta> indeed, not the right forum
[23:08] <komputes> I always seem to run into an issue when I want to report a bug against 2 packages, can someone tell me how that's done again (without removing the first package or relating it to a URL to an upstream project)
[23:08] <wgrant> komputes: You want to have the same bug against two packages?
[23:09] <komputes> wgrant: yes
[23:09] <wgrant> komputes: "Also affects distribution..."
[23:11] <komputes> wgrant: great, thanks. I guess I always get confused since the field is filled with the previous package name, making it seem that I am replacing it with this new package, thanks for reminding me...
[23:12] <wgrant> komputes: That's useful when you want to add a task against Debian, which uses the same package names.
[23:12] <komputes> wgrant: gotcha, guess i'll have to learn to live with it.


[06:42] <afsal> hi
[06:43] <afsal> i want to join this group
[06:43] <afsal> the group is active now


 I still have R125 'free airtime" until Saturday. My data is nearly up, so that's a good thing
[07:00] <Kilos> yeah its just if i had got the 2+1 yesterday it would last 1 month and 1 day not 2 months
[07:01] <Kilos> gotta get at month start
[07:02] <Trixar_za> I'd probably burn through that deal in less than a month - knowing me
[07:02] <Kilos> whew
[07:02] <Trixar_za> Especially with the prospect that I could make 1200 USD
[07:03] <Kilos> only downloading iso's uses mine
[07:03] <Kilos> wow how?
[07:03] <Kilos> you might have won thingie
[07:04] <Kilos> i dont trust any of them. goosie always tells me read the fine print
[07:04] <Kilos> hehe its too small for me to see
[07:08] <Kilos> this bundle might struggle some as i wanna try 12.10
[07:10] <Kilos> i wonder why they dropped the right click format option for usb devices on 12.04
[07:11] <Kilos> lo Vince-0
[07:11] <Vince-0> Haai Kilos
[07:11]  * Kilos greets superfly too also as well
[07:12] <superfly> morning Kilos
[07:16] <Kilos> dag Kerbero Banlam bakuman
[07:16] <Kilos> Symmetria, you didnt answer me
[07:16]  * Kilos cries
[07:21] <magespawn> Kilos is there not someone who can download it for you
[07:23] <Kilos> magespawn, im getting the dvd from our main chick but wanna try kubuntu and see if they fixed the little probs i have with it
[07:24] <magespawn> ahh right
[07:25] <Kilos> they say said sound will be fixed in quassel so then kde could be good for me
[07:25] <Kilos> but still got maverick on other pc for the serious work
[07:27] <superfly> Kilos: you want CDs/DVDs?
[07:27] <Kilos> of kubuntu superfly ?
[07:27] <Kilos> dvd please
[07:28] <Kilos> got dvd on here
[07:28] <superfly> Kilos: of whatever you want. Jy moet maar net sê and I'll organise
[07:29] <Kilos> ai ty superfly would like a remastersys dvd of your kde
[07:29] <Kilos> hehe
[07:29] <Kilos> that up to date and got alla goodies installed
[08:13] <inetpro> Kilos: wb
[08:13] <inetpro> by the way, there is no difference between the timeframe of a prepaid bundle of Vodacom or 8ta, they all work together
[08:13] <charlvn> good morning
[08:14] <charlvn> Maaz: coffee on
[08:14]  * Maaz flips the salt-timer
[08:14] <inetpro> they all expire at the end of the next calendar month
[08:14] <charlvn> hi Kilos, inetpro
[08:14] <inetpro> hi charlvn
[08:14] <Kilos> no man inetpro voda is 2 months from date of purchse or have they changed that too
[08:14] <inetpro> Kilos: no
[08:15] <Kilos> no what?
[08:15] <Kilos> hi charlvn
[08:15] <Banlam> mybroadband did an article on this a month or two ago
[08:15] <Banlam> everyone is different
[08:15] <Banlam> vodacom is the most lenient
[08:15] <inetpro> well, no they don't last 2 months from purchase and no they have not changed
[08:15] <Banlam> ir is this data specificallty?
[08:15] <Banlam> or
[08:16] <inetpro> Banlam: data
[08:16] <Kilos> oh yes used to be from date of purchase not just till end of next calender month
[08:16] <inetpro> Kilos: no
[08:17] <Kilos> hmm
[08:17] <Kilos> ok not arguing. use 8ta now
[08:18] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charlvn!
[08:18] <Kilos> but still member it was 2 months from date of purchase im sure
[08:18] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee please
[08:18] <Maaz> Kilos: There isn't a pot on
[08:18] <Kilos> eish
[08:18] <Kilos> Maaz, swine
[08:18] <Maaz> If you call me names Kilos you will make you're own coffee and do your own googling!
[08:18]  * inetpro have been using both Vodacom and 8ta prepaid for a long time now, they both expire at the end of the following month
[08:19] <Kilos> have/has
[08:19] <inetpro> lol
[08:19] <Kilos> lol
[08:19] <inetpro> I use Vodacom on me mobile and 8ta at home
[08:19] <Banlam> my memories aalign with inetpro
[08:19] <inetpro> you should never buy at the end of the month!
[08:20] <Kilos> starnge i member things like your data will expire on the 17th
[08:20] <Kilos> strange
[08:20] <Kilos> must really be going bonkers
[08:21] <inetpro> Kilos: never
[08:21] <inetpro> well not for a very long time
[08:22] <Kilos> define very long
[08:22] <inetpro> I don't know how long but never is just to long a time
[08:22] <Kilos> lol
[08:23] <Kilos> i have memories os saying voda lekker because its 2 months from purchase
[08:23]  * inetpro 's memory is not long enough to even grok never
[08:23] <Kilos> look in logs from 8.10 time
[08:23] <Kilos> google is your friend
[08:23] <Kilos> hehe
[08:24] <Kilos> but its fine, gang up on me i got broad shoulders
[08:25] <inetpro> golden rule is to buy on the 1st of the month to get maximum value for money, until such time as they change the policy
[08:26] <Kilos> ya but i came short so stretched last bit
[08:28] <Kilos> hi drussell tumbleweed i hope the right click format option for usb devices is gonna return
[08:28] <drussell> Kilos: from the launcher?
[08:28] <drussell> Kilos: btw, hiya from UDS in copenhagen :oD
[08:29] <superfly> hiya drussell! :-)
[08:29] <inetpro> drussell: wb
[08:29] <drussell> superfly: hiya :o)
[08:29] <drussell> inetpro: thx :o)
[08:29] <Kilos> nope on maverick you could right click a mounted device and format with a name in place of new volume
[08:29] <tumbleweed> drussell: ohi. I'm in B3-M1
[08:29] <inetpro> drussell: how many people attending this time around?
[08:29] <drussell> tumbleweed: hehe I'm in B3-M8 in an xorg session
[08:30] <drussell> inetpro: over 500 afaik
[08:30] <tumbleweed> ah, we're just giving mlankhorst xorg upload rights
[08:30] <drussell> tumbleweed: cool
[08:31] <Kilos> or even from the launcher would be nice drussell not just safely remove
[08:35] <Kilos> hehe yeah i saw your info here dave@conference etc
[08:35]  * Kilos loves xchat
[08:42] <Kilos> tumbles doesnt change his info
[08:42] <Kilos> we gotta smell where he is
[08:42] <Kilos> SmilyBorg, did you say hey there this morning
[08:42] <Kilos> ?
[08:43]  * Kilos forgets , these peeps chat so much
[08:43] <SmilyBorg> Hey
[08:43] <SmilyBorg> sorry, been rather busy
[08:45] <Kilos> you forgiven
[09:21] <Kilos> hi Cantide
[09:21] <Cantide> hello
[09:21] <Cantide> i am CanStudy right now actually
[09:21] <Cantide> '-'
[09:21] <Kilos> good lad
[09:41] <charlvn> hi Cantide
[09:48] <Cantide> hello :)
[09:49] <Cantide> i have an exam in 2 hours
[09:49] <Cantide> so i'm preparing for it 'ㅁ'
[09:49] <Kilos> good luck
[09:51] <Cantide> thanks :)
[09:56] <charlvn> Cantide: ganbatte ne!
[09:57] <Cantide> arigatougozaimasuuu
[10:05] <Cantide> time to go actually ;_;
[10:05] <Cantide> 후후후후
[10:09] <Squirm> hi
[10:09] <Kilos> hi Squirm where you been
[10:09] <Squirm> around
[10:09] <Kilos> ah
[10:30] <psydroid> hi Kilos
[10:30] <psydroid> hi Squirm
[10:30] <psydroid> hi Ludo
[10:30] <psydroid> hi everyone
[10:31] <Squirm> hi psydroid
[10:31] <Squirm> yeah Kilos, kind of busy, etc
[10:31] <Kilos> hi psydroid
[10:32] <Kilos> lol i just thought seeing as you said hi again you came back from somewhere
[10:32] <Kilos> ludo is a lurker
[10:32] <Kilos> mostly
[10:41] <inetpro> Kilos: eh.... I think you chased him out of here now
[10:42] <Kilos> lol
[10:42] <Kilos> i think he has chatted once
[10:42] <Kilos> to me anyway
[10:42] <Kilos> maybe im distracting him
[10:43] <Kilos> hell be back
[10:43] <psydroid> hi inetpro
[10:43] <psydroid> or not
[10:43] <inetpro> psydroid: wb
[10:43] <psydroid> ty
[10:44] <Kilos> na lurker are nosy peeps
[10:44] <psydroid> haha
[10:44] <Kilos> why go to a movie if you not gonna watch
[10:45] <charlvn> lol no he just got a ping timeout
[10:45] <Kilos> ah for the popcorn
[10:45] <charlvn> his connection not so good
[10:45] <charlvn> hi psydroid, long time no speak to
[10:46] <psydroid> hi charlvn, yeah, I've been pretty busy lately
[10:46] <charlvn> no problem, i had that a month or two ago, was pretty scarce myself
[10:46] <Kilos> Superhuman, at least once a week you gotta say something exciting
[10:46] <charlvn> i got a new apartment that i needed to move into, had to paint the whole place out, get a floor in, etc
[10:46] <Superhuman> something exciting
[10:46] <charlvn> then move all my stuff... lol
[10:47] <psydroid> yeah
[10:47] <superfly> ohi Superhuman
[10:47] <Kilos> like hi all im still standing
[10:47] <charlvn> hi Superhuman
[10:47] <Kilos> yeah yeah yeah
[10:47] <Superhuman> hey superfly
[10:47] <charlvn> Kilos: yup
[10:47] <Superhuman> hi charlvn
[10:47] <Kilos> see you are a popular oldie
[10:48] <psydroid> I'm preparing a move to another country, so finishing things here and preparing for a job hunt is most of what occupies my time
[10:48] <psydroid> hi superfly
[10:48] <psydroid> hi Superhuman
[10:48] <superfly> ohi psydroid
[10:48] <charlvn> psydroid: oh wow! you are living in the netherlands now right?
[10:48] <Superhuman> hi psydroid
[10:48] <charlvn> well you have a telfort ip so unless it's a vpn :)
[10:49]  * Superhuman thinks charlvn is spying on us all
[10:49] <charlvn> Superhuman: no i use irssi so i see the hostnames of people joining / leaving :)
[10:49] <charlvn> i irc through my server so nobody can see where i am :P
[10:50] <charlvn> not that i care in any case
[10:51]  * Superhuman quassels through a server in Germany
[10:51] <psydroid> charlvn, yes, I'm planning to move to Poland, if not permanently as in forever then at least temporarily
[10:52] <Kilos> whats in poland thats the attraction psydroid
[10:52] <Kilos> poles
[10:52] <Kilos> we plant them here for fencing
[10:53] <psydroid> poles are definitely a major attraction
[10:53] <charlvn> lol Kilos
[10:53] <charlvn> psydroid: interesting, never been to poland myself
[10:53] <charlvn> Superhuman: same here, i have a vps at hetzner
[10:53] <charlvn> except i use ssh+irssi+screen instead of quassel
[10:54] <charlvn> psydroid: i always heard poland was a fairly poor country with terrible bandwidth
[10:54] <charlvn> psydroid: not sure if that is still the case but i have seen some amazing pictures from there
[10:55] <charlvn> psydroid: i heard some good things about linux desktops being sold there being quite a normal thing
[10:55] <Superhuman> charlvn: can't have worse bandwidth that here...I'm sure they have fibre at least
[10:55] <psydroid> charlvn, I was there this summer, it's fairly poor but it's not like completely uncivilised and the country looks pretty nice indeed
[10:55] <charlvn> psydroid: yeah that sounds about right... i know some poles, good people\
[10:55] <charlvn> some very educated people there as well, not stupid at all
[10:56] <Superhuman> We do some coding outsourcing to a Polish company...no complaints from our side.
[10:56] <psydroid> charlvn, the people there have been very good to me, even when I was out of money and didn't speak the language, I can't say much bad about them
[10:57] <charlvn> Superhuman: south africa doesn't have fibre? i used to work for an mweb service provider, we had fibre running right into the office from telkom
[10:57] <charlvn> and this was like 8 years ago
[10:58] <charlvn> psydroid: sounds good, people in poorer countries often have a lot more of a caring attitude towards others, in rich countries people seem to have an f-you attitude
[10:58] <Superhuman> yeah, but most European nations have fibre to the homes
[10:58] <charlvn> Superhuman: that's BS - i do not have fibre in my home and i live in a "wealthy" eu country
[10:58] <charlvn> Superhuman: not sure where you heard that... but i have to say, a lot of homes do in fact have fibre to the home in NL at least
[10:58] <Superhuman> that's why I said most
[10:59] <Kilos> lol
[10:59] <charlvn> Superhuman: NL is one of the better connected countries in europe so if it's not even that common here yet i doubt it would be in the rest of europe
[10:59] <Kilos> inetpro, have you sprayed your banweed yet
[10:59] <charlvn> Superhuman: the well connected countries are mostly in northern europe and scandinavia
[10:59] <Superhuman> ah ok
[11:00] <Kilos> it works slowly from the leaves back
[11:00] <Kilos> where the vikings come from
[11:00] <Kilos> ?
[11:00] <charlvn> Kilos: norway, supposedly
[11:01] <charlvn> but norway is also a super-wealthy non-EU country
[11:01] <charlvn> they have gas they pump out of the north sea
[11:01] <Superhuman> Vikings came from Norway and Northern Germany. When it was called Celtic-Germany (if I remember my ancient history well enough)
[11:02] <Kilos> same celts that went to ireland?
[11:02] <psydroid> and originally came from a region in South East Europe and Asia Minor
[11:02] <charlvn> Superhuman: makes sense, schleswig-holstein mostly
[11:03] <Kilos> holstein is where cows come from
[11:03] <charlvn> cows?
[11:03] <psydroid> I was there this summer too
[11:03] <charlvn> i hope you're not referring to the women :)
[11:03] <Kilos> those you milk methinks
[11:03] <psydroid> on my way to Denmark
[11:03] <Kilos> oh no friesland
[11:03] <charlvn> oh my goodness, i _really_ hope you're not referring to the women now :D
[11:03] <psydroid> hahaha
[11:03] <charlvn> Kilos: yes the fresians are largely farmers
[11:03] <Kilos> lol
[11:03] <psydroid> they are nice too :D
[11:04] <charlvn> not very well liked in the rest of NL though
[11:04] <Kilos> and great horses charlvn
[11:04] <Kilos> had a friesian stallion once
[11:05] <Kilos> somewhere that holstein still sticks to milk cows as well
[11:06] <Kilos> maybe they purified the friesland cows to produce more
[11:06] <Kilos> watery milk not lekker like jerseys
[11:07] <Kilos> but good for peeps who sit in front of a pc all day so they dont get too fat
[11:08]  * Superhuman doesn't sit in front of a pc all day, most of the time I scream at the screen and throw stuff around
[11:08] <Superhuman> good exercise, for you and your fellow office workers (mostly keeps their reaction times good)
[11:13] <inetpro> Superhuman: wb
[11:13] <Superhuman> hey inetpro
[11:15]  * inetpro with the super{human,fly} both awake now has to be careful with super[tab]
[11:16]  * Superhuman is off (half day for Doc visit)
[11:19] <Kilos> hehe
[11:19] <psydroid> charlvn, I had actually been thinking of going to Norway but as usual something came in between that compelled me to move to Poland instead, otherwise I wouldn't have thought of going to live there
[11:21] <magespawn> Superhuman: some body throw something and your reaction not quick enough?
[11:22] <psydroid> hello magespawn
[11:23] <magespawn> hey psydroid
[11:57] <mazal> elo all
[12:06] <Kilos> hi mazal
[12:07] <mazal> Middag oom Kilos
[12:10] <mazal> I haven't heard anything back from my query from Telkom. BUT , oddly enough , last night when I got home I wanted to send mail and my isp wasn't working again
[12:11] <mazal> This forced me to get into the router , same as Monday , and my eye caught that my router is at 1mb
[12:11] <mazal> Can you believe it. Just yesterday we talked about it and this must have happened Tuesday or yesterday
[12:12] <Squirm> mazal: we were upgraded to 1Mb about 2 weeks ago
[12:12] <mazal> Well it looks like mine happened yesterday , but my work line is still 384k ???
[12:13] <mazal> So they might be busy now with our exchange , from what I can see at my side that is
[12:13] <mazal> So this gives me a little bit more courage to go over to 1.10
[12:13] <mazal> 12.10 even
[12:14] <mazal> Just need a build pc now , I never build on my main machine
[12:15] <mazal> So gonna try the install to usb thing
[12:22] <charlvn> ok back, sorry had lunch in between :)
[12:23] <charlvn> psydroid: makes sense, as long as you can find work and a place to live, you can live anywhere for a while right?
[12:23] <charlvn> psydroid: it's fun to get experiences in different countries / cultures / languages
[12:43] <mazal> Apart from Gimp , what would you guys recommend to use for basic pics work (copying and pasting etc.) ?
[12:48] <magespawn> Inkscape, maybe?
[12:50] <mazal> Will look into that one ta
[12:52] <mazal> Bye all
[12:52] <mazal> God bless
[13:09] <superfly> magespawn: I wouldn't use inkscape
[13:10] <magespawn> was the only other i use regularly
[13:10] <superfly> Maaz: tell mazal you can try showfoto which is an offshoot of Digikam
[13:10] <Maaz> superfly: Okay, I'll tell mazal on freenode
[13:28] <charlvn> wow nice, you can buy a .eu domain for 1 euro!
[13:28] <charlvn> just bought one :)
[13:28] <charlvn> sorry, completely OT for this channel i guess :)
[13:29] <magespawn> where charlvn?
[13:36] <Kilos> lol
[13:42] <Kilos> charlvn, what does one do with a domain
[13:48] <Kilos> no energy to google
[13:48] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee on
[13:48]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[13:49] <Kilos> Maaz, grandpas please
[13:49] <Maaz> Kilos: Go get it yourself!
[13:49] <Kilos> grr
[13:49] <superfly> Kilos: you put a website on it/behind it
[13:50] <Kilos> oh ty superfly like the sites yola supply
[13:50] <Kilos> is that a domain
[13:50] <superfly> Kilos: a domain is the URL of the site
[13:51] <superfly> ubuntu-za.org is a domain (or rather, a domain name)
[13:51] <Kilos> oh
[13:52] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[13:53] <Kilos> Maaz, ty
[13:53] <Maaz> You are welcome Kilos
[13:56] <charlvn> magespawn: https://www.transip.nl/
[13:58] <charlvn> Kilos: you can host a website or receive email, run an irc server, etc at a nice hostname of your choosing
[13:58] <charlvn> Kilos: providing it's available for registration, of course :)
[13:59] <charlvn> sorry only read superfly's reply now
[13:59] <charlvn> Maaz: coffee on
[13:59]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[14:00] <magtie> Hi Kilos & All
[14:00] <charlvn> hi magespawn
[14:00] <charlvn> gah
[14:00] <charlvn> hi magtie
[14:00] <Kilos> hi magtie
[14:00] <charlvn> sorry magespawn, autocomplete fail :)
[14:00] <magespawn> no worries
[14:01] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee please
[14:01] <Maaz> Kilos: Okay
[14:01] <Kilos> Maaz, with rusks
[14:01] <Maaz> There is a packet of Ouma's in the cupboard Kilos help yourself
[14:01] <Kilos> ty
[14:03] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charlvn and Kilos!
[14:03] <Kilos> Maaz, baie dankie
[14:03] <Maaz> Plesier Kilos
[14:06] <magespawn> looks like we may be getting more rain again
[14:06] <magespawn> charlvn that about what you pay for a domain from google apps
[14:07] <magespawn> through enom or godaddy
[14:08] <charlvn> magespawn: 1 euro? that's the cheapest i've ever seen a .eu as yet
[14:08] <charlvn> magespawn: i paid about 10 dollar to renew my mom's .com domain recently via godaddy
[14:08] <magespawn> i was working on the sa exchange rate
[14:09] <charlvn> magespawn: ??
[14:09] <magespawn> sorry 1 euro not ten my mistake
[14:09] <charlvn> magespawn: it's about R11,21 according to google
[14:10] <charlvn> np
[14:10] <magespawn> for some reason my brain worked on 10 euro
[14:15] <psydroid> charlvn, I usually adapt quickly and am not bad at learning languages so I guess being in a state of motion comes natural to me :)
[15:06] <charlvn> l8r
[15:06] <Kilos> toods
[15:19] <Kilos> wbb
[15:20] <inetpro> hmm
[16:39] <Kilos> you home magespawn ?
[16:41] <Kilos> evening magtie
[16:41] <superfly> hi Kilos
[16:42] <Kilos> hi superfly
[16:42]  * superfly is home, with new brakes on his car, but the grinding sound still there
[16:42] <Kilos> can you pin point where
[16:43] <Kilos> which wheeel?
[16:43] <Kilos> evening SmilyBorg_h
[16:43] <Kilos> wheel too superfly
[16:43] <superfly> Kilos: front left
[16:43] <superfly> (if you're sitting in the car)
[16:44] <Kilos> all the time while going straight or mainly when turning to one side superfly
[16:45] <superfly> Kilos: all the time
[16:46] <Kilos> maybe wheel bearings
[16:46] <Kilos> can you jack it up and spin that wheel
[16:46] <Kilos> maybe something too close to rim or so
[16:47] <superfly> it only really makes that sound when it gets to 50kph
[16:47] <superfly> I'm taking the car in on Monday again, I'll make sure he knows about it
[16:47] <SmilyBorg_h> hey all
[16:48] <superfly> hi SmilyBorg
[16:55] <Kilos> methinks wheel bearing superfly ,
[16:55] <Kilos> they get noisier as they get worse till the grind all the time
[16:56] <Kilos> get worse after 50
[16:56] <superfly> Kilos: I'll make sure the mechanic knows about it. He didn't driver the car far or fast enough today to hear it
[16:57] <Kilos> haha how do you eat an elephant
[16:57] <Kilos> bite by bite
[17:00] <Trixar_za> Somebody just watched 7de Laan
[17:02] <Trixar_za> I always find it funny how everybody in a series or soapy end up knowing and using the same sayings
[17:02] <Trixar_za> Bad writing I suppose
[17:03] <Cantide> Trixar_za, are you South African?
[17:03] <Cantide> oh
[17:03] <Cantide> lol
[17:03] <Cantide> i take that back
[17:03] <Cantide> haha
[17:03] <Cantide> i thought i was looking at another channel -.- where few South Africans lurk
[17:04] <Trixar_za> Yes Cantide, I'm South African :P
[17:04] <Cantide> :p
[17:05] <Trixar_za> Gerrit Engelbrecht
[17:05] <Trixar_za> Ek hoor daar is 'n nuwe seksposisie genaamd SHARKS; jy le die heeltyd bo en kom dan 2de hahaha <--- Bwahahaha
[17:05] <Cantide> hahahahahaha
[17:05] <Cantide> ouch
[17:05] <Cantide> I am from Durban, so that cut deep :p
[17:19] <Kilos> lol
[17:19] <Kilos> you also watch Trixar_za ?
[17:19] <Trixar_za> Yes
[17:19] <Trixar_za> :P
[17:29] <Kilos> so you clever guys. i have a partition that should be /storage but somehow ended up as /_storage
[17:29] <Kilos> is there a way to rename it?
[17:30] <Kilos> or format as /storage
[17:30] <Kilos> they killed the right click format option
[17:30] <Kilos> grrr
[17:30] <Kilos> in unity this is
[17:34] <Kilos> if one formats it now it changes the uuid i think then there more probs
[17:34] <Kilos> uid or uuid
[17:35] <Kilos> daai ding
[17:36] <Kilos> gparted only gives the option of adding a label
[17:37] <Trixar_za> umount it and then mount it again?
[17:37] <Kilos> how will that change the _
[17:38] <Trixar_za> Well if it's label is storage and it added the _ before it because of some issue, then remounting it should change it to /storage again/
[17:38] <Trixar_za> again.*
[17:39] <Trixar_za> And... instantly I think of regular expression
[17:39] <Kilos> ok ill try that ty
[17:41] <Kilos> mount is stupid
[17:41] <Kilos> wants to find it in fstab
[17:42] <Kilos> mount: can't find /media/storage in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab
[17:42] <Kilos> mount: can't find /media/_storage in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab
[17:43] <Kilos> gui mounts after hunting
[17:44] <Kilos> when mounted from home it shows as /media/storage but cant use it unless the /_storage is used
[17:44] <Kilos> gparted showed that quirk
[17:47] <Trixar_za> Weird :/
[17:47] <Kilos> yeah
[17:47] <Kilos> hehe
[17:48] <Kilos> thats my life on pcs. if it can go wrong it will
[17:48] <Kilos> helped with the learning curve though
[17:59] <smileE17> hallo :D
[18:00] <Kilos> hi smileE17
[18:01] <smileE17> I made a lot of "update" edits to software articles on wikipedia today :)
[18:01] <smileE17> it was needed :P
[18:02] <Kilos> good
[18:02] <Kilos> whats an update edit
[18:02] <Kilos> to fix edits that werent right to start with?
[18:19] <smileE17> Kilos: no :) to correct 'current' version numbers :)
[18:19] <Kilos> ah
[18:19] <smileE17> if firefox article is at 14.0, i edit it to say: latest version is 16.0
[18:19] <smileE17> :)
[18:20] <Kilos> that one good thing about kubuntu. no firefox updating every 2 weeks
[18:24] <smileE17> yeaah ;)
[18:25] <smileE17> :p
[18:33] <inetpro> Kilos: where do you get that from?
[18:33] <Kilos> what inetpro ?
[18:33] <inetpro> 01/11 20:20:53 <Kilos> that one good thing about kubuntu. no firefox updating every 2 weeks
[18:33] <inetpro> kubuntu uses the same repositories
[18:34] <Kilos> isnt firefox something you have to manually install
[18:34] <Kilos> defaultwise i mean
[18:34] <inetpro> ahh
[18:34] <Kilos> my kde uses some other browser and opera
[18:34] <inetpro> but who would not want to install firefox?
[18:34] <Kilos> me
[18:35] <inetpro> it's still the best browser out there
[18:35] <Kilos> even removed in unity
[18:36] <smileE17> it's default in the standard ubuntu, Kilos :p
[18:36] <Kilos> ya thats why i remove it
[18:36] <smileE17> :(
[18:36] <smileE17> just disable the updates :p
[18:36] <Kilos> lol
[18:36] <smileE17> it's in about:config, I think :)
[18:37] <smileE17> btw, Midori is also a nice browser :p
[18:37] <Kilos> no opera works good enough for what i do
[18:37] <Kilos> ya i used midori before and ephany
[18:37] <Kilos> epiphany
[18:38] <Kilos> opera is lekker. some sites think im onna mobile device
[18:38] <Kilos> hehe
[18:41] <Kilos> maverick had some beautiful screensavers hey
[18:44] <Kilos> inetpro, you work with winsucks pcs. can i download the nvidia fx5500 driver here then take it to xp and install?
[18:44] <inetpro> Kilos: nee ek werk nie regtig met MS Windows nie
[18:44] <Kilos> bang to go online with xp without wasting data on firewalls and antivirusses first
[18:45] <inetpro> net af en toe waar ek uithelp
[18:45] <Kilos> o is werk rekenaars linux ook?
[18:45] <inetpro> maar ek probeer wegbly so vêr as moontlik
[18:45] <inetpro> Kilos: yep
[18:45] <Kilos> mooi
[18:45] <Kilos> superfly, ^^
[18:45] <inetpro> servers meestal, FreeBSD, Ubuntu, Solaris...
[18:46] <superfly> Kilos: ?
[18:46] <Kilos> doen jy servers en admin
[18:46] <Kilos>  can i download the nvidia fx5500 driver here then take it to xp and install?
[18:47] <Kilos> cant even play AOE3 on it
[18:47] <Kilos> grrr
[18:47] <inetpro> Kilos: jy moet net seker maak dit is presies die regte drywer
[18:47] <Kilos> oh not this one?
[18:49] <Kilos> http://www.nodevice.com/driver/GeForce_FX_5500/get37195.html
[18:49] <Kilos> http://download.cnet.com/NVIDIA-GeForce-FX-5500/3000-2108_4-56888.html
[18:50] <Kilos> http://www.nvidia.com/object/winxp_2k_93.71_2
[18:50] <Kilos> that nvidia link doesnt show the card id
[18:55] <Kilos> but that doesnt answer my question. will downloading here still work when i take it to xp?
[18:59] <Kilos> hi kodez
[19:05] <inetpro> Kilos: a file is a file
[19:05] <Kilos> oh ty so winsucks will recognise it
[19:05] <inetpro> all you need is the right file and the right medium to transfer it
[19:06] <Kilos> stick?
[19:06] <inetpro> well the stick and a filesystem that is understood by both operating systems
[19:07] <inetpro> I guess your stick is formated as FAT, which is readable by XP
[19:07] <Kilos> yip
[19:08] <inetpro> then what is your problem?
[19:08] <Kilos> i didnt wanna download 40 or 50 meg and it dont work
[19:08] <Kilos> thats why i asked
[19:08] <Kilos> grrr
[19:08] <Kilos> rofl
[19:09] <Kilos> you want my mail addy?
[19:09] <inetpro> Kilos: this channel is not a Windows support channel
[19:09] <Kilos> i know but i have friends here
[19:09] <inetpro> there are plenty of those
[19:11] <inetpro> Kilos: the enemy of my enemy is my friend
[19:11] <Kilos> hahaha
[19:12] <Kilos> i cant very well go ask a windows support channel if i can download drivers to ubuntu and install on winsucks
[19:12] <Kilos> they will say its not a ubuntu support channel
[19:13] <Kilos> and dont type winsucks with a capital w
[19:13] <Kilos> shows too much respect for the enemy
[19:14] <Kilos> sjoe magtie maar jy is stil
[19:15] <inetpro> Kilos: shhh... sy slaap
[19:15] <Kilos> skuus
[19:16] <Kilos> ou vrou
[19:16] <Kilos> hmm
[19:16] <magtie> ja my kind..... so is die jeug van vandag!
[19:17] <Kilos> ha ha ha. skuus tante
[19:17] <magtie> Ek sit maar en volg julle stories
[19:17] <inetpro> lol
[19:18] <Kilos> hoekom sit jy nie jong inetpro in sy plek nie
[19:18] <Kilos> hy baie parmantig partykeer
[19:19] <magtie> Got my printer driver installed today
[19:19] <magtie> See,  Im studying Ubuntu in-between
[19:19] <Kilos> lol
[19:20] <magtie> Takes 'older' people longer to do the common stuff you people know already.
[19:20] <Kilos> rofl
[19:24] <Kilos> inetpro, are you paying attention?
[19:24] <inetpro> uh?
[19:25] <Kilos> you must offer to help the older peeps that struggle
[19:25] <inetpro> sjoe Kilos, maar asb nie Windows probleme hier bring nie
[19:25] <Kilos> grrr
[19:26] <Kilos> dit was n vraag nie n probleem nie man
[19:26] <inetpro> die goed maak my kniee lam
[19:26] <Kilos> lol
[19:26] <Kilos> ty magtie you made my night
[19:26] <inetpro> die mense wat daai goed gebruik het 'n onverklaarbare angs vir verandering
[19:27] <Kilos> man jy weet beter van my
[19:27] <Kilos> dis net vir n speletjie
[19:27] <inetpro> ja ja
[19:28] <Kilos> sjoe ek gaan jou tik as ek jou weer sien
[19:28] <inetpro> :-)
[19:28] <Kilos> maak dit n goeie kop dag
[19:28] <Kilos> sodat ek jou weer kan optel
[19:29] <inetpro> ai Kilos, ek kry elke dag slae van die mense wat so sukkel om verandering aan te gryp
[19:29] <inetpro> so ek is gewoond daaraan :-)
[19:29] <smileE17> see ya tomorrow :)
[19:29] <inetpro> smileE17: good night
[19:29] <Kilos> toods smileE17
[19:29] <smileE17> inetpro & Kilos: big hug :)
[19:29] <Kilos> sleep tight
[19:29] <smileE17> good night :)
[19:29] <Kilos> haha
[19:30] <magtie> OK ek groet - Lekker slaap
[19:31] <inetpro> magtie: lekker slaap daar
[19:31] <Kilos> hmm cant even go get tea
[19:32] <inetpro> Kilos: en hoekom nie?
[19:32] <Kilos> then i miss the nighting peeps
[19:32] <Kilos> and its past my crash time too
[19:32] <inetpro> lol
[19:33] <inetpro> nee man, ek dag jy bly wakker vir die elfuur ding
[19:33] <Kilos> het julle toe die foon geblok gekry inetpro ?
[19:33] <inetpro> Kilos: ai
[19:33] <Kilos> ai?
[19:33] <inetpro> ek kom ook nie orals uit in die lewe nie
[19:34] <Kilos> thats not good
[19:34] <Kilos> ai
[19:34] <inetpro> wag, ek moet vir VC vra wat om te doen
[19:34] <Kilos> VC?
[19:35] <Kilos> a
[19:36] <inetpro> Vodacom
[19:37] <Kilos> ja i twigged
[19:38] <inetpro> ek wens daar was 'n maklikke manier gewees om 'n selfoon onbruikbaar te stel
[19:39] <Kilos> hulle doen dit in 5 minute
[19:39] <inetpro> die eerste ding wat die ouens duidelik gedoen het was om die sim uit te haal
[19:39] <Kilos> die bel en wag om by n ops uittekom is die pyn
[19:40] <Kilos> ja maar die imei nommer in die foon maak dit dood
[19:40] <Kilos> geen sim werk meer nie
[19:40] <inetpro> Kilos: hoe doen ek dit?
[19:40] <Kilos> jy bel hulle en gee die imei nommer
[19:40] <inetpro> bel wie?
[19:41] <Kilos> vodacom
[19:41] <Kilos> 173 ek dink
[19:41] <Kilos> wag ek soek
[19:42] <Kilos> 111
[19:42] <inetpro> http://help.vodacom.co.za/portal/engine?handler=script&script=template&view=html&context=template&name=main_help_topics&top_faq=true&source_id=topics&resource_id=88&category=Basic%20Phone%20Services&sub_category=Blacklisting
[19:42] <Kilos> help my fones been stolen
[19:42] <inetpro> Step 5: Please report the incident to the South African Police Services (SAPS).


[02:02] <shang> jimbaker: yes we did :)
[14:32] <_mup_> ensemble/security-acl r291 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[14:32] <_mup_> an acl abstraction allowing grants/removals by principal name on nodes
[17:14] <SpamapS> shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
[17:20] <jimbaker> SpamapS, yes quiet. heads down all around i guess
[17:24] <SpamapS> thats a very good thing. :)
[18:11] <Aram> hi.
[18:13] <Aram> happen to know where niemeyer or robbiew are? :-).
[18:16] <jimbaker> Aram, robbiew is on vacation; niemeyer is at a conf
[18:17] <Aram> thanks.
[18:23] <adam_g> jimbaker: is there a PPA somewhere that contains your hookProtocol fix?
[18:24] <jimbaker> adam_g, no, i could push the branch however. still needs some more testing btw
[18:24] <jimbaker> adam_g, then you can just use environments.yaml to use that branch, using the ensemble-branch option
[18:25] <adam_g> jimbaker: that sounds doable. where is the branch?
[18:26] <jimbaker> adam_g, just pushed it to lp:~jimbaker/ensemble/robust-hook-exit
[18:26] <jimbaker> adam_g, hope that works for you!
[18:27] <adam_g> jimbaker: great, thanks ill give it a shot later
[18:27] <jimbaker> adam_g, cool
[19:49] <adam_g> well, openstack via ensemble is coming together quite nicely: http://paste.ubuntu.com/650191/
[19:49] <adam_g> you have anyway of turning that into a graph, SpamapS ?
[20:07] <SpamapS> adam_g: yes!
[20:07] <SpamapS> adam_g: ensemble status --format=svg --output=file.svg will produce something..
[20:08] <SpamapS> adam_g: if you use the branch I made yesterday you can try out a few different layouts (fdp seems the most consistently useful)
[20:08] <adam_g> neat
[20:11] <SpamapS> adam_g: lp:~clint-fewbar/ensemble/dot-raw-output
[20:11] <SpamapS> if you use tha tone you can do ensemble status --format=dot | fdp -Tsvg > file.svg
[20:11] <SpamapS> adam_g: and btw, w00t.
[21:26] <RoAkSoAx> any ensemble core dev around?
[22:09] <SpamapS> hmm.. new analogy for what Ensemble is..
[22:09] <SpamapS> Ensemble is to config management as Home Depot is to your toolbox at home.
[22:13] <adam_g> SpamapS: when you get into town?
[22:24] <SpamapS> adam_g: Thursday morning
[22:24] <SpamapS> adam_g: I unfortunately have 3 other family obligations M,T, and Wed.. :-/
[22:24] <SpamapS> adam_g: and Fri night.. so leaving around 6pm Friday. :-P
[22:41] <fwereade> hi all
[22:42] <fwereade> I need a quick second opinion about test coverage
[22:43] <fwereade> you may or may not be aware that there's a problem in trunk, with certain tests that fail or timeout depending on the absence or flakiness of the network
[22:43] <fwereade> it emerges that there was a commented-out line in the mocking setup, and that reinstating it (with a minor tweak) fixes the issue
[22:45] <fwereade> however, doing this leaves the coverage only *slightly* improved
[22:45] <fwereade> please confirm that the appropriate response is to write the necessary battery of additional tests
[22:46] <fwereade> and that just reinstating the tweaked line is a pitiful and weaksauce dodge of the real issue, that I should be ashamed of myself for considering
[22:58] <SpamapS> fwereade: tests that work w/o the network are critical.. eventually we want the Ubuntu buildd's to run the test suite .. and they have no network connectivity.
[22:59] <fwereade> SpamapS: agreed
[22:59] <fwereade> SpamapS: the question is, do I reinstate weak tests that work without a network or do I write a bunch more that also work without the network, and give us better coverage?
[22:59] <SpamapS> fwereade: so I'd say that if you have the time to do the additional testing.. it is a noble and high cloud that awaits you in programmer heaven. But if you are pressed for time.. making the tests run w/o the network would get the tests run more often, which may be more important.
[23:00] <fwereade> SpamapS: cheers, I won't spend too much time on it
[23:00] <SpamapS> Do we graph test coverage anywhere?
[23:00] <fwereade> SpamapS: but I'll have a go at least ;)
[23:00] <fwereade> SpamapS: not that I'm aware of, but that would be interesting
[23:01] <SpamapS> My last employer had a graph over time of test coverage. Bonuses were attached to significant increases.
[23:01] <SpamapS> Which did very little for the graph going up.. because programming isn't motivated by the carrot and stick.
[23:02] <SpamapS> Still, the graph was quite interesting when drilling down into a specific subsystem.. you knew how risky the change was..
[23:22] <fwereade> SpamapS: that's a shame
[23:23] <fwereade> SpamapS: even if the carrot itself wouldn't work, perhaps they hoped that being seen to care about such things might be a sort of, er, motivational meta-carrot
[23:23] <fwereade> SpamapS: ...as it were
[23:34] <SpamapS> fwereade: well certainly, new stuff got more tests because you didn't want the percentage to go *down*
[23:42] <bcsaller> there is a `make coverage` target which will generate a table
[23:48] <SpamapS> So in theory, we could run back through all the commits and run it for each one, and graph that, and then do that on an ongoing basis?
[23:54] <SpamapS> bcsaller: did I see service config settings land this week?
[23:54] <bcsaller> SpamapS: yeah, there is still an approved branch I have to merge for `deploy` but the `set` version of things work. I expect the other will go in today and it will be ready


[04:41] <nhatz> waaaaaaaazzzzzzzzzzzzzzaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
[05:09] <Terminus> o/
[05:12] <nhatz> yo
[05:20] <Terminus> wassup?
[06:44] <wers> waaaaaaaazzzaaaaaaaaaaaa