[00:21] <Ishmael> hey everyone
[00:22] <Ishmael> if anyone gets a chance, i need to know what to do to get a usb dvd burner to be recognized in xubuntu
[00:22] <TheSheep> connect it
[00:23] <Ishmael> :D
[00:23] <Ishmael> it is
[00:23] <Ishmael> k, maybe i'm asking the wrong question;  how do i access it? or see where it's at?
[00:24] <charlie-tca> put a disc in it
[00:24] <Ishmael> that's just crazy enough to work, brb
[00:24] <charlie-tca> with data on it
[00:24] <TheSheep> or empty
[00:24] <TheSheep> (then a cd burning app should start)
[00:24] <charlie-tca> data disc comes up on the desktop
[00:28] <Ishmael> nothing has happened so far
[00:28] <charlie-tca> look in /media for it
[00:31] <Ishmael>  /media has cdrom and cdrom0  but ls brings up nothing for both of them (data disk is in drive)
[00:32] <Ishmael> do i have to reboot with the cdrom installed?
[00:33] <TheSheep> no
[00:33] <TheSheep> does the command 'lsusb' in terminal show your drive?
[00:34] <Ishmael> Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub  <--is that my drive?
[00:35] <TheSheep> no
[00:35] <TheSheep> that's internal usb hub
[00:35] <Ishmael> :(
[00:46] <Ishmael> sure there's no usb thing i have to load up with boot-up?
[01:00] <txDEF> good evening all
[01:01] <txDEF> I've got a bit of an issue that I am hoping that someone can help me with
[01:02] <txDEF> I am having issues getting my hdd to mount with the alt xubuntu install disk
[01:04] <txDEF> the sudo command is not recognized
[01:05] <txDEF> when I type "mount /dev/sda1 /mnt/C" it states invalid argument
[01:05] <gaurdro> you need a -t <filesys>  in there
[01:05] <txDEF> before /dev or after C?
[01:06] <gaurdro> it's usually something like "mount -t ntfs /dev/sda1 /mnt/C"
[01:07] <txDEF> well that seems to have worked, how can I get back to the install to check and see if the hdd is seen now?
[01:07] <gaurdro> probably alt-F8
[01:07] <marc1453> Hello,  I just installed FuseSmb as per the suggestions at http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=304131.  As far as I can tell, I did as suggested.  I now have a shortcut link to media/network that should allow me to browse my MS Windows shares.
[01:07] <marc1453> can someone give me some hints as to why this folder shows as empty in thunar?
[01:07] <txDEF> gaurdro alt-F8 didn't work any other ideas?
[01:08] <gaurdro> go through the other alt-f-key combinations.
[01:08] <txDEF> got it alt-F1
[01:09] <txDEF> thanks gaurdro
[01:09] <gaurdro> no problem
[01:10] <txDEF> the installer is still not recognizing the hdd, any ideas that I can try?
[01:12] <Ishmael> any ideas for me guys? i'm thinking that maybe my usb ports are just dead
[01:15] <Ishmael> wait, my usb mouse worked
[01:15] <Ishmael> so what's the deal here?
[01:16] <knome> marc1453, so you have mounted it?
[01:19] <marc1453> knome: I am not very familiar with Unix.  I would say that I am a person who can use, but not really troubleshoot or use *nix.  I have worked in it, but mounting drives was never something I needed to worry about.  I just ran the commands I was asked to and used the scripts I needed. I followed the steps as per the tutorial.  http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=304131.   I presumed it...
[01:19] <marc1453> ...was mounted.
[01:20] <knome> marc1453, can you see it when you issue the command 'mount' in terminal?
[01:20] <marc1453> knome: will chekc
[01:22] <marc1453> I see  http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=304131, but I see no reference to /media/mswindows (the mount point)
[01:22] <marc1453> knome: oops
[01:22] <marc1453> I see fusectl on /sys/fs/fuse/connections type fusectl (rw), not the mount point
[01:22] <knome> hmm..
[01:25] <marc1453> the MS windows network I would like to be able to browse has several XP boxes with multiple shares.  A typical one would be <IP_ADDRESS>\music.  that ip is known as zaphod, so in windows I mount it (assign drive letter) to \\zaphod\music
[01:26] <marc1453> is there a way to use FuseSmb to just mount that ServerName\MountName in Thundar as well as within the terminal?
[01:27] <knome> marc1453, i'm not sure.
[01:27] <acalbaza> how can i install a package that is not listed in synaptic?  i need to install enfuse but the version i need is in the jaunty repo and i am running ibex
[01:27] <marc1453> kno I just noticed...
[01:28] <marc1453> knome: I just noticed that Samba does not appear to be running ~$ ps -ef | grep samba
[01:28] <txDEF> okay was able to fdisk launch fdisk and delete the ntfs partitions on the hdd and create a new partition but it states it will not be able to be used until a reboot, does that seem right?
[01:30] <marc1453> txDEF: I am catching your thread in the middle... but usually a reboot is required whenever you fdisk
[01:30] <txDEF> okay
[01:31] <marc1453> txDEF: I believe that is something fundamental to the x86 architecture
[01:32] <txDEF> I just don't remember having to do that before when I ran fdisk on dos, windows 95-xp and red hat, but maybe it has been too long
[01:32] <marc1453> knome: is there a need to formally add samba to the auto started applicaitons under Settings -> Settings Manager?
[01:33] <knome> marc1453, sorry, i'm not sure about that either
[01:34] <Ishmael> k, usb was just loose...i guess
[01:35] <Ishmael> idk, weirdest thing, mouse wasn't even working in it for a while
[01:36] <invisime> every now and then when I'm using an application that has sound, all sound will cut out. if I close the application, its process will remain open and sound will not play. if I kill the process, sound will be restored.
[01:36] <cody-somerville> That happens to me too
[01:36] <cody-somerville> In particular, firefox
[01:36] <marc1453> knome: thanks for the help, I will look for what I can find and come back to the channel if I have no luck.
[01:36] <invisime> yeah, I get it on firefox and vlc.
[01:37] <invisime> it's really really annoying. does anyone have a fix?
[01:39] <txDEF> what is the default file system that fdisk creates a partition with?
[01:39] <txDEF> I am trying to mount the partition and don't know the file system to go after -t flag
[01:41] <Ishmael> ext3?
[01:41] <Ishmael> i'm just guessing
[01:41] <txDEF> I have already tried ext3, ext, xfs, hfs, nfs and no go
[01:44] <txDEF> any other ideas?
[01:44] <knome> ext3
[01:45] <txDEF> still no go with ext3
[01:45] <Ishmael> what about ext3?
[01:45] <txDEF> okay is this a joke I am missing?
[01:45] <Ishmael> i'm just out of ideas past that
[01:46] <invisime> actually, I'm pretty sure it's ext3.
[01:46] <Ishmael> i would have assumed that's the default
[01:47] <knome> it is. now stop joking about it.
[01:47] <txDEF> okay fdisk -l shows that sda1p1 is hpfs/ntfs
[01:47] <txDEF> and it will not allow me to mount the partition now
[01:48] <txDEF> okay I am frustrated with this, how do I mount the hdd and not the partition so that I can wipe the drive completely?
[01:50] <cody-somerville> txDEF, you can not.
[01:50] <cody-somerville> txDEF, To do that, you'll have to use dd
[01:52] <txDEF> cody, can you give me an example?
[01:53] <cody-somerville> http://www.google.ca/search?q=how+to+wipe+an+entire+drive+in+linux :)
[01:53] <cody-somerville> There are lots of different tutorials
[01:53] <cody-somerville> txDEF, Its a dangerous operation (naturally)
[01:54] <cody-somerville> You can write all zeros to the disk, write random data to the disk, just delete the partitions, etc.
[01:54] <cody-somerville> txDEF, In the end, what exactly are you trying to accomplish anyhow?
[01:55] <txDEF> I am trying to do a clean install of xubuntu on an older system, but the hdd is not being recognized by the regular installer, so someone suggested the alt install
[01:56] <txDEF> the alt install is not recognizing the hdd either so I figure I need to jump into the command line a wipe out the partition first, b/c it was booting with windows without an issue
[01:56] <cody-somerville> Nah, I doubt thats the issue.
[01:56] <cody-somerville> I dunno why the installers wouldn't recognize the hard drive.
[01:56] <txDEF> me to
[01:57] <cody-somerville> What version are you trying to install?
[01:57] <txDEF> 8.10
[01:57] <cody-somerville> I suggest filing a bug or visiting #ubuntu-installer during EU business hours
[01:57] <txDEF> but it does see the hdd on the command line
[01:57] <txDEF> "/dev/sda1"
[01:58] <txDEF> and it does see the partitions there as well as it let me fdisk them away
[01:59] <txDEF> any other suggestions that I can try prior to filing a bug?
[02:02] <txDEF> well the fdisk didn't work as it is booting into windows just fine still!
[02:02] <txDEF> so frustrated with this!
[02:03] <Mood> txDEF: are you using a live cd?
[02:05] <txDEF> not sure of the definition of "live cd", but I burned the iso of the alt install that I downloaded from xubuntu's website
[02:06] <txDEF> thanks for the help cody
[02:06] <Mood> txDEF: i've never used the alt install disc, but what happened when you tried using the standard install disc?
[02:07] <txDEF> same
[02:07] <Mood> are you using dual boot? or 100% linux?
[02:07] <cody-somerville> txDEF, Does it just say "Sorry, can't find any hard drives. Can't install."?
[02:07] <txDEF> the existing hdd has a windows 2k install but I want to wipe it completely off
[02:08] <txDEF> cody, it does say something like that
[02:08] <txDEF> give me just a minute and I can get the message again
[02:08] <Mood> txDEF: how many harddrives do you have? just 1?
[02:08] <G-Bleezy> Hey how do i start a telnet daemon so people can telnet to me?
[02:09] <txDEF> just one
[02:09] <Mood> txDEF: and from BIOS you chose boot order as cd first, then hd?
[02:09] <txDEF> first it comes back saying activate serial ata raid devices
[02:10] <txDEF> but there are no SATA devices and certainly no raid controller on this system
[02:10] <txDEF> then fails step: detecting disk
[02:10] <Mood> txDEF: do you have a sata pci controller?
[02:10] <cody-somerville> G-Bleezy, I recommend ssh over telnet :)
[02:10] <txDEF> Mood, yes the bios is setup for cdrom, then hd
[02:11] <cody-somerville> G-Bleezy, ssh is encrypted whereas telnet is plain text
[02:11] <cody-somerville> G-Bleezy, to install ssh, install openssh-server
[02:11] <txDEF> Mood, no it is just a plain MSI MS-6131 MB
[02:11] <txDEF> from like 1998
[02:12] <Mood> txDEF: so when you boot, there's something on the screen that pops up saying "activate serial ata raid devices"?
[02:12] <txDEF> in the xubuntu install
[02:13] <txDEF> not in the regular boot sequence
[02:13] <Mood> txDEF: your BIOS recognizes the HD as "MSI MS-6131 MB"?
[02:14] <txDEF> sorry I meant the motherboard is from MSI the manufacture and the model is a MS-6131
[02:14] <txDEF> the hdd is an IBM ~13GB
[02:14] <txDEF> the BIOS recognizes it just fine
[02:15] <Mood> txDEF: when you boot from xubuntu standard install live cd, you get a message saying "activate serial ata raid devices" before login prompt?
[02:16] <txDEF> sorry again, that is from the alt install disk
[02:16] <Mood> txDEF: (yeah apologies here since i wasn't in the orig thread)... what did the standard install disc say when you booted?
[02:17] <txDEF> when booting to the alt install disk it goes through the sequence up until the detect disk step
[02:17] <txDEF> then it runs the detect disk and pops up with the following:
[02:19] <txDEF> "one or more drives containing SERIAL ATA RAID configuration have been detected. Do you wish to activate these devices?"  Active Serial ATA RAID devices? Yes No
[02:19] <txDEF> if I do yes it immediately kicks to popup "installation step failed"
[02:20] <Mood> txDEF: and when you select "No"?
[02:21] <txDEF> kicks back to the ubuntu main installer menu
[02:22] <Mood> txDEF: is there a setting in the BIOS to disable RAID?
[02:22] <txDEF> and of course if I go to the next step partitioner, it does not see any drive space
[02:22] <txDEF> no b/c there is no on board RAID or add in card
[02:23] <Mood> txDEF: i'm trying to help you isolate whether the RAID issue is w/ the mobo, HD, or other
[02:23] <txDEF> Mood I really appreciate this by the way, I have got to be overlooking someting
[02:24] <txDEF> There is no RAID on the mobo, there is only one HD that has no RAID controller built in, I really don't know why it is referencing RAID
[02:24] <Mood> txDEF: are you 100% certain there's no disable/enable RAID setting in the BIOS? (mobo) even if you don't have a RAID hooked up
[02:24] <txDEF> there are no add in PCI/ISA/AGP/PCI-x/etc cards
[02:25] <txDEF> give me a minute and I'll boot into it just to check
[02:27] <txDEF> there was previously an hdd block mode that I have disabled but that did not make a change
[02:28] <txDEF> there is an on-chip primary pci ide that is enabled
[02:28] <txDEF> but no RAID
[02:29] <Mood> txDEF: what's your HD? ibm 13 gig, what model? do you know w/o opening up your machine? is it sata?
[02:33] <txDEF> it is an IDE, IBM - DJNA-371350
[02:34] <txDEF> both recognized by the BIOS as such and just visually confirmed
[02:34] <Mood> appears to be an IDE/ATA drive, not SATA at all
[02:35] <Ishmael> http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/sandwich.png
[02:35] <txDEF> yeah that is why I am so frustrated by this
[02:35] <Mood> so the question is: why does xubuntu think you have RAID + SATA? hmm... let me think...
[02:35] <txDEF> would it default to that if it does not find any regular ATA drives?
[02:36] <Mood> not sure... legacy ATA should be supported
[02:36] <Mood> you only get the RAID/SATA message only after you boot from live CD and initiate format->partition?
[02:37] <txDEF> nope only when in the detecting disk step
[02:37] <Mood> detecting disk? how do you get there? through the "install ubuntu"?
[02:38] <txDEF> yes
[02:38] <Mood> txDEF: what happens when you fdisk -l /dev/sd?
[02:39] <txDEF> it sees
[02:39] <txDEF> it fine
[02:39] <Mood> txDEF: paste.ubuntu.com
[02:39] <Mood> oh wait... i guess you can't copy+paste from a different machine :-P
[02:40] <txDEF> lol
[02:40] <Mood> what's the line w/ the drive?
[02:40] <txDEF> now that was funny
[02:40] <txDEF> "/dev/sda1"
[02:40] <Mood> anything else?
[02:40] <txDEF> just a sec
[02:42] <txDEF> having to get back to that point
[02:47] <txDEF> boot =* start =1 end =1122 blocks =9012433+ id =7 system =hpfs/ntfs
[02:47] <Mood> no other devices?
[02:47] <txDEF> nope
[02:47] <Sinister> i just got a sunbeamtech keyboard thats backlite it wont turn on and off with the scroll loc key it has a bunch of windows special keys on it anyone know how i can get it to work or if  i cant at all ?
[02:49] <Mood> txDEF: can you cat /var/log/dmesg to see if you can see anything that fails, or anything w/ RAID or SATA?
[02:50] <txDEF> no such directory
[02:51] <JihadJack> hey folks
[02:51] <Aquina> n8
[02:52] <ZachFlem> is there a way to limit what starts up with the computer?
[02:53] <ZachFlem> ie, my machine seems to be bogging down alot latly
[02:53] <ZachFlem> *latley
[02:55] <txDEF> well I am going back and trying the regular install disk, b/c I can not think of anything else
[02:55] <Mood> txDEF
[02:55] <txDEF> what up?
[02:55] <Mood> cat /boot/grub/device.map
[02:56] <txDEF> okay give me just a minute
[03:00] <Mood> txDEF: could be the way you wired your HD. are you using 1 cable master/slave for HD and CDROM?
[03:06] <txDEF> one cable for hdd and an different one for the cdrom, hdd connecting to IDE1 on mobo and cdrom connecting to IDE2 on mobo
[03:06] <txDEF> would that be an issue
[03:07] <Mood> ah, it's possible. use one cable
[03:07] <Mood> i think somehow the installer is thinking the 2 controllers are RAID
[03:08] <txDEF> really?
[03:08] <Mood> it's a good possibility
[03:08] <Mood> txDEF: are you in a position where you can try to do it now?
[03:09] <txDEF> give me a minute the regular install is getting to the detecting hdd part
[03:10] <Mood> ah ok
[03:10] <txDEF> what the heck!
[03:10] <Mood> works?
[03:10] <txDEF> now it is recognizing the hdd in the regular install
[03:10] <Mood> :-)
[03:11] <txDEF> is there a way to wipe the entire hdd and only install xubuntu with the installer at this point?
[03:11] <Mood> isn't that the function of the xubuntu installer?
[03:12] <txDEF> not sure...
[03:12] <Mood> txDEF: yes
[03:12] <Mood> txDEF: the installer has a choice for reformatting/partitionining
[03:12] <Mood> wasn't that what you were doing before?
[03:14] <txDEF> yes, sorry, I meant it looked like the only choice was to install a dual boot option with the disk
[03:14] <Mood> txDEF: nope
[03:14] <txDEF> but I made a different choice and it should use the entire hdd for the install now
[03:14] <Mood> txDEF: i'm glad it's working now. but even after you install, the real test would be upon reboot
[03:15] <txDEF> right
[03:15] <txDEF> I really appreciate your patience and assistance Mood
[03:15] <Mood> no worries man. good luck w/ xubuntu!
[03:15] <Mood> i love it
[03:33] <G-Bleezy> How can i list the last few packages installed on a machine??
[03:40] <Mood> dpkg.log?
[03:40] <Mood> G-Bleezy
[03:53] <G-Bleezy> k
[06:10] <jkoltner> Hello... I installed xubuntu 8.10 the other day, and I'm trying to get the wireless network card working, but I'm finding that I don't have a Applications->System->Network icon.  Does anyone know what the network manager application's program name is?  (So I can try it using just Alt+F2...)
[06:13] <source> jkoltner, gnome-network-manager
[06:13] <jkoltner> Thanks, I'll try it in a moment here
[06:13] <Mood> jkoltner: it's NetworkManager Applet, upper right corner
[06:14] <Mood> jkoltner: but first you need to make sure your system recognizes the wifi card. use ndiswrapper for that
[06:15] <jkoltner> The Xfce desktop is a lot closer to Gnome than KDE, correct?
[06:17] <Mood> jkoltner: yes
[06:18] <jkoltner> KDE/Gnome/Xfce/etc. all pretty much agree on things like how icons get added to the applications menu though?
[06:19] <Mood> jkoltner: they are all x managers if that's what you mean
[06:21] <jkoltner> Actually what I meant was that, historically, if you were compiling a package from source code, even after you had the executable you had to do a desktop manager-specific step in order to get an icon to show up in, e.g., Applications->Multimedia or wherever, whereas now it seems that that step is common to all the popular desktop managers, so installing a package these days almost always picks up the appropriate application menu icon a
[06:21] <jkoltner> s well.
[06:23] <Mood> jkoltner: well, i only know that xfce shares some gnome dependencies
[06:24] <jkoltner> Cool, thanks
[06:24] <jkoltner> I seem to have really hosed up my installation... right before I asked you guys about gnome-network-manager, I uninstalled and reinstalled it via Synaptic, and now the Ethernet card doesn't get an IP address either.  @#$@#%
[06:25] <jkoltner> (Whereas previously Ethernet was working fine...)
[06:27] <Mood> ifconfig
[06:27] <Mood> jkoltner: what's the issue?
[06:27] <jkoltner> ifconfig no longer shows an IP address, just many, many dropped packets :-)
[06:28] <jkoltner> I think the problem is that removing network manager removed eth0's entry from /etc/network/interfaces
[06:28] <jkoltner> I added back... "auto eth0" and "iface eth0 inet dhcp" to /etc/network/interfaces... hopefully that will fix it?
[06:28] <jkoltner> Hmm... how do I restart networking without rebooting?
[06:29] <Mood> sudo /etc/init.d/networking restart
[06:29] <jkoltner> Thanks
[06:30] <jkoltner> Hmm... it's just spitting out some "DHCPDISCOVER on eth0 to <IP_ADDRESS> port 67 interval..." messages
[06:30] <jkoltner> and now "no DHCPOFFERS received"
[06:31] <jkoltner> I'll try rebooting anyway...
[06:31] <Mood> try just putting the default /etc/network/interfaces entry
[06:31] <Mood> auto lo
[06:31] <Mood> iface lo inet loopback
[06:31] <Mood> then /etc/init.d/networking restart
[06:32] <jkoltner> ok, will do
[06:37] <jkoltner> With the added lines in interfaces, ifconfig added an "eth0:avahi" entry that apparently it eventually assigned IP <IP_ADDRESS> to, but the regular "eth0" entry still isn't getting an IP address
[06:37] <jkoltner> Return the interfaces file to its default and restarting networking hasn't helped, although there are no errors listed
[06:37] <jkoltner> (Just "reconfiguring network interfaces... [ok]")
[06:38] <Mood> IP 269.254.x.x is your router
[06:38] <Mood> 169*
[06:38] <jkoltner> Actually everything on my network here is 192.168.2.xx
[06:38] <Mood> "added lines"? it just have those two lines
[06:39] <jkoltner> I think the 169.254... range are "auto-configuration" IP addresses?  I believe that's what Windows machines end up with as well these days if they don't get a DHCP IP assignment.
[06:39] <jkoltner> Yeah, I was just mentioning what it did with the added lines prior to removing them
[06:39] <jkoltner> I'm now back to the default /etc/network/interfaces as you suggested
[06:39] <Mood> 192.168.2.x should be the DHCP assigned IP addresses, which is fine. the 169.154.x.x means it's not communicating with the modem
[06:39] <jkoltner> Agreed, it just seems awfully odd that it was working just fine until I removed and then re-installed network manager
[06:40] <jkoltner> Hmm... I should probably try booting from a live CD, shouldn't I...
[06:40] <Mood> try restarting networking
[06:40] <Mood> what does it say in ifconfig? paste.ubuntu.com
[06:40] <jkoltner> sudo /etc/init.d/networking restart --> * Reconfiguring network interfaces... [OK]
[06:40] <Mood> no i mean ifconfig
[06:41] <jkoltner> ifconfig says "eth0 Link encap: Ethernet HWaddr xxxxx ... UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST .... Rx packets: 0 errors: 0 dropped : 4529483 ... TX packets: 0 errors: 0"
[06:41] <Mood> inet?
[06:42] <jkoltner> There's an "inet6 addr: xxxxx" line
[06:42] <Mood> is it 192.168.x.x?
[06:42] <Mood> actually, no, i meant does it show inet addr? (inet6 addr is different)
[06:42] <jkoltner> No, it's "inet6 addr: fe80::223:8bff .... (more numbers)"
[06:43] <jkoltner> There's no "inet addr: 192.168.2.xx" line like the PC I'm typing this on has
[06:43] <Mood> inet addr comes before
[06:43] <Mood> hmm....
[06:43] <Mood> try sudo ifconfig eth0 down
[06:43] <Mood> then up
[06:43] <jkoltner> ok
[06:44] <jkoltner> No error messages, but no "inet addr:" line either
[06:44] <jkoltner> Lemme check dmesg quick....
[06:45] <jkoltner> Just "r8169: eth0: link up" and "eth0: no IPv6 routers present"
[06:46] <Mood> hmm...
[06:46] <jkoltner> I think I'll try booting a live CD...
[06:46] <Mood> is your networkmanager up?
[06:46] <Mood> upper right
[06:46] <jkoltner> No, "sudo gnome-network-manager" just says "command not found"
[06:47] <Mood> can you reboot (instead of live cd)
[06:47] <jkoltner> Sure, will do
[06:51] <jkoltner> (getting around to re-booting, was slightly distracted)
[06:52] <jkoltner> It doesn't seem as though there's a whole lot of functionality missing from Xfce relative to Gnome -- that what's missing is largely eye candy
[06:53] <jkoltner> I re-booted... ifconfig still has the same output... a link line followed by an inet6 line, but no inet line
[06:54] <Mood> hmm....
[06:55] <Mood> is our ethernet card being recognized in lspci?
[06:56] <jkoltner> Yeah, it's in there (as is the wireless card)
[06:56] <Mood> ahh
[06:56] <jkoltner> I'm trying a quick live CD boot now, just to make sure it's not the network
[06:56] <Mood> so it's wlan0
[06:56] <Mood> not eth0
[06:57] <jkoltner> Well, the only output from ifconfig was for eth0: and lo: (since I never did get that wireless card going yet!)
[06:57] <Mood> do you use ndiswrapper?
[06:57] <jkoltner> I was going to, but hadn't gotten that far
[06:57] <Mood> yeah so you need to use wired connection, install ndiswrapper, then try again
[06:57] <Mood> do you have the windows drivers?
[06:58] <jkoltner> Right, hence my dismay at discovering that I'd killed the Ethernet connection
[06:58] <Mood> ah, so you can't get ethernet connection either?
[06:58] <jkoltner> I believe I found them via Google... it's an Acer Aspire One netbook that I'm installing Xbuntu on here
[06:58] <jkoltner> Booting a live CD (well, memory stick, really) comes up with <IP_ADDRESS> for eth0 like it should
[06:59] <Mood> what about regular boot?
[06:59] <jkoltner> So I'm convinced that removing network manager via the GUI hosed some configuration file that I'm not educated enough to fix :-)
[06:59] <jkoltner> Last time it wasn't picking anything up... I can try one more time here for good measure...
[07:00] <jkoltner> (waiting for it to boot)
[07:00] <jkoltner> I'm feeling pretty confident there has to be another configuration file around that I need to fix
[07:01] <Mood> did you install network-manager-gnome via apt-get? or synaptic gui?
[07:01] <jkoltner> The GUI
[07:02] <jkoltner> hmm... maybe it is working here... a failsafe terminal session shows an IP address... let me get back into Xfce...
[07:02] <Mood> ps auxx|egrep -i nm
[07:02] <Mood> do you see nm-system-settings and nm-applet?
[07:03] <jkoltner> oooh, xfce is happy... lemme check Firefox...
[07:03] <jkoltner> Cool, it's all working again, although I'm not quite sure why
[07:03] <Mood> nice
[07:04] <jkoltner> The output of grep there does include nm-system-settings and nm-applet
[07:04] <Mood> ah, ok
[07:04] <jkoltner> I still don't have an Applications->System->Network manager icon though!
[07:04] <Mood> one of those may not have restarted before you rebooted
[07:04] <Mood> add new item. right click panel
[07:05] <jkoltner> But... if gnome-network-manager doesn't run from a terminal, it won't run from an icon either...
[07:05] <jkoltner> gnome-network-manager still says "command not found"
[07:05] <Mood> i don't think the process is called "gnome-network-manager"
[07:05] <jkoltner> Ah, ok
[07:05] <Mood> it's just a family of processes
[07:05] <jkoltner> So how do I make an icon for it without knowing the command name? :-)
[07:06] <Mood> if you right-click, panel should list all the avail items
[07:06] <jkoltner> ok, I'll try it here
[07:09] <jkoltner> nm-connection-manager is looking promising...
[07:11] <jkoltner> The menu editor (xfce4-menueditor) just has a line "---include--- system" that presumably pulls in Accessories/Games/Graphics/.../System ... how do I edit that system menu?
[07:13] <Mood> jkoltner: what're you trying to do?
[07:13] <jkoltner> Add nm-connection-manager to Applications->System
[07:15] <Mood> do you have network manager in your autostarted applications?
[07:16] <jkoltner> Checking..
[07:16] <jkoltner> Yes, "network manager (network manager applet)" is checked
[07:17] <Mood> but it's still not showing up?
[07:18] <Mood> in your panel?
[07:18] <jkoltner> If I just right-click on the main panel and select "Add New Item" the closest there is to anything "networky" is "network monitor" (with a little mouse icon beside it)
[07:18] <jkoltner> Correct
[07:18] <Mood> hmm.. network monitor isn't the same thing...
[07:19] <jkoltner> Hmm... maybe I'm just not seeing it?  Presumably it wouldn't be in the add new items dialog if it thought it was already on the panel somewherE?  (I did play around with the layout and positioning on my app panel some...)
[07:19] <Mood> jkoltner: do you see something called Notification?
[07:20] <jkoltner> No... so apparently I inadvertently deleted some controls... hmm... I should try to find a screenshot of what it's supposed to look like...
[07:21] <jkoltner> On this screenshot here: http://www.zenco.net/img/xubuntu_8.10.png -- is network manager any of the icons shown?
[07:22] <jkoltner> Aha!
[07:22] <jkoltner> I think "System Tray" is the control I need
[07:23] <Mood> jkoltner: yes
[07:23] <Mood> jkoltner: show notification iconds :-)
[07:23] <Mood> icons*
[07:24] <jkoltner> Wow, hazards of re-arranging my  menus...
[07:27] <jkoltner> OK, but the Xubuntu documentation still says (in the "Connecting to the Internet" section)... "Open Applications->Systems->Network" and I don't have such a menu item
[07:27] <Mood> Applications->System->Network i think is ubuntu
[07:28] <jkoltner> ok, a "documentation bug" then?
[07:28] <Mood> in xubuntu, it's under Applications->Settings->Settings Manager
[07:29] <jkoltner> And then what?  There's not a Apps->Settings->Settings Manager->Network icon...?
[07:30] <Mood> jkoltner: there is no network icon in xubuntu
[07:30] <Mood> a consequence of streamlining i think
[07:30] <jkoltner> ok, it's just supposed to work? :-)
[07:31] <Mood> well, it works via autostarted apps and panel showing system notifications
[07:31] <jkoltner> Fair enough
[07:31] <Mood> but seriously though, xubuntu rocks
[07:31] <Mood> lean, mean, fighting machine. ubuntu feels bloated by comparison
[07:31] <jkoltner> I haven't been missing much from full-blown Gnome... seems pretty nice
[07:32] <Mood> yeah i've been using xubuntu for a while now... and i simply love it
[07:33] <jkoltner> I am surprised they didn't include gedit by default though :-)
[07:34] <Mood> jkoltner: there's a lot they didn't include as the base install... i actually prefer that. i end up not using most of what's avail through full blown ubuntu... even some apps on xubuntu
[07:34] <jkoltner> Yeah, it is amazing that a regular Ubuntu install has hundreds of commands that most people probably never use
[07:34] <Mood> i prefer xemacs as my standard text editor :-)
[07:36] <jkoltner> I never used emacs during my "formative" years (it was all vi back then), and these days I have to use so many IDEs that I've pretty much given up trying to choose an editor and then try to get all the IDEs to have reasonable emulations of that favorite editor
[07:37] <jkoltner> (about to work on getting wireless working again...)
[07:37] <Mood> jkoltner: so your ethernet connection works now, right?
[07:38] <jkoltner> Yes, it certainly does
[07:38] <Mood> ok, so now ndiswrapper
[07:38] <Mood> you have windoz drivers you said, right?
[07:38] <jkoltner> I was planning on following this guide? --> http://bad.ilink.lv/2008/07/guide-how-to-install-xubintu-on-acer-aspire-one/
[07:38] <jkoltner> I do have Windows drivers available if need be though
[07:39] <Mood> Xubuntu?
[07:39] <Mood> Xubintu?
[07:39] <jkoltner> The guy can't spell? :-)
[07:39] <jkoltner> Actually typo, I'm sure, 'u' and 'i' being right next to each other
[07:40] <Mood> hmm.... i think you just need two files, the inf and sys files
[07:41] <Mood> if you have those, all you have to do is sudo apt-get install ndiswrapper and be done with it
[07:41] <homebrewcider> hey there, I have a Canon MP610 printer/scanner, printer working okay, scanner not being recognized, sane is installed, don't know what to do next
[07:41] <Mood> jkoltner: but if you want to follow that guide, be my guest :-)
[07:43] <jkoltner> I'll try it out and see how it goes...
[07:43] <Mood> good luck :-)
[08:08] <jkoltner> Cool, the instructions for the WiFi card work :-)
[08:10] <jkoltner> Thanks for all the help, Mood!  It was most useful!
[08:10] <Mood> nice
[08:10] <Mood> good luck w/ xubuntu. hope you like it. i love it!
[08:10] <jkoltner> Thanks
[08:11] <jkoltner> Out of curiosity, where are you?  I'm in southern Oregon, USA
[08:11] <Mood> nyc :-)
[08:11] <jkoltner> And I thought it was late here ;-)
[08:12] <Mood> heh
[08:12] <Mood> need. sleep. now
[08:12] <jkoltner> Go for it
[08:30] <_Pete_> morning
[08:32] <_Pete_> I have probelem when trying to login to xfce-desktop from kdm, after login desktop quickly shows and then quits and I am back in login manager (kdm)
[08:32] <_Pete_> anyideas what might be wrong?
[08:32] <_Pete_> logging to KDE works fine
[08:32] <_Pete_> and before logging to xfce worked also
[08:35] <titan_ark> hello :)
[08:42] <_Pete_> Do xfce has it's own login manager?
[08:45] <chewit> _Pete_, xfce uses GDM
[08:45] <chewit> could install that, u will be able to login into kde with gdm
[09:10] <G-Bleezy> Hey what is a good VNC server i can run?
[09:15] <titan_ark> quit
[09:49] <G-Bleezy> How do i get graphical GUI for vnc4server?
[09:55] <_Pete_> I would use freenx instead
[09:56] <_Pete_> it's secure (tunnels thru ssh) and works well over slow (1Mbit) upstream links
[10:11] <cheyne> Hello, how can I browse my network drives in xfce? Thanks
[10:11] <TheSheep> cheyne: you can't, you need an additional program for that
[10:11] <TheSheep> cheyne: if you mean windows network, at least
[10:11] <cheyne> yeah - windows network
[10:12] <cheyne> do you have any reccomendations?
[10:12] <TheSheep> fusesmb and/or pyneighbourhood
[10:12] <cheyne> excellent - thanks for the tip
[10:12] <knome> switch the windows pc's to xubuntu
[10:12] <TheSheep> but I don't use them myself, so I can't help much
[10:15] <_Pete_> I started to use xfce after pissed of to new kde4 and am using some kde4 apps with it
[10:15] <_Pete_> one of is konqueror
[10:15] <_Pete_> with that you can access remote places
[10:16] <knome> _Pete_, you will get more out of xfce/xubuntu if you don't use any kde apps :)
[10:16] <_Pete_> maybe
[10:16] <knome> _Pete_, that way you don't have to load the kde libs
[10:17] <_Pete_> I will replace kde stuff with xfce if they are bettr
[10:17] <_Pete_> I dont realy care are they kde/gnome/xfce
[10:17] <_Pete_> until they work as I want
[10:17] <knome> with jaunty, you should be able to throw konqueror out of the window.
[10:18] <_Pete_> and this machine have 8G memory so some extra libs dont count much
[10:18] <knome> true. but there might be situations where they count.
[10:18] <knome> (i should up my mem to 8G also)
[10:18] <knome> and renew the cpu
[10:20] <claritas> hello
[10:21] <cyzie> i have my own packages installed in xubuntu. how do update-manager ignore those packages so that the upgrade can proceed from hardy to ibex?
[10:21] <knome> !hi
[10:21] <Myrtti> cyzie: pin them with synaptic
[10:21] <Myrtti> or aptitude
[10:22] <claritas> ...how can i do irc cloaking...? (sorry about my bad english)
[10:23] <cyzie> Myrtti, how to pin them?
[10:23] <claritas> ...can anybody help with that..?
[10:26] <TheSheep> claritas: read the howto at http:///wwww.freenode.net
[10:26] <TheSheep> one less w
[10:33] <Myrtti> cyzie: package - lock version
[10:34] <Myrtti> cyzie: that's in synaptic
[10:40] <cyzie> k thanks Myrtti
[11:03] <_Pete_> If I want to share xfce desktop with vnc, how to do that?
[11:03] <_Pete_> there's no "desktop sharing" or such in the menus
[11:03] <TheSheep> !vnc
[11:21] <_Pete_> right thanks
[11:21] <_Pete_> btw is this bug or something, when I press alt-f2 to get run-program
[11:21] <_Pete_> first time the run-dialog quickly pops up and then disappears
[11:22] <_Pete_> pressing 2nd time brings it visible
[11:24] <TheSheep> sounds like a bug
[11:24] <TheSheep> does it say anything if you start xfce4-run from the terminaL/
[11:24] <TheSheep> sorry, xfrun4
[11:26] <_Pete_> no it behaves the same
[11:26] <_Pete_> first time it dissapears and with second run it works
[11:46] <cyzie> what is the package that got installed when we do update-manager -d in the comand line and click upgrade?
[12:56] <Cooper> hi
[12:59] <Cooper> hi
[12:59] <TheSheep> hihi
[13:00] <Cooper> im installing right now
[13:00] <Cooper> had errors
[13:02] <rocko> what kind of errors Cooper ?
[13:03] <Cooper> partitioning, then failure to copy files
[13:10] <Cooper> its installing right now
[13:50] <Peaker> Hey, I can't modify xorg.conf because xubuntu keeps overwriting it :-(
[13:51] <Peaker> Also, dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg doesn't seem to set any of the chosen options in the xorg.conf file
[14:16] <durt> Peaker: xubuntu doesn't rewrite xorg.conf, dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg does.
[14:21] <bn43> hi I'm running xubuntu on a system with 256mb ram - on startup theres about 210mb used - is there a way I can bring this down?
[14:23] <durt> bn43: run top and tell us whats using all that ram
[14:25] <bn43> how do I pastebin that?
[14:26] <knome> bn43, copy+paste should work
[14:26] <knome> !pastebin | bn43
[14:27] <durt> just run top, press m, and take note of what the top three or four are
[14:28] <bn43> X-org, xfce4-mixer-plu, gnome-terminal
[14:29] <durt> about 3-5% each?
[14:29] <bn43> am I looking at virt and res?
[14:29] <durt> no %mem
[14:29] <bn43> yeah but gnome-terminal is 11.9
[14:30] <durt> well it's running top ain't it :)
[14:30] <bn43> yeah
[14:30] <bn43> doh!
[14:30] <bn43> and firefox is 21%
[14:31] <durt> firefox eats ram like a big panty gal eats oreos
[14:31] <bn43> memory is cheap I think I should just get more
[14:31] <durt> yes!
[14:32] <durt> try running a page with flash and then look at mem usage
[14:32] <durt> ouch
[14:32] <bn43> the user is going to say but XP was working fine on it - now why do I have to fork out more cash.....
[14:32] <bn43> and they want firefox cause thats what they got used to on windows with extensions
[14:32] <bn43> ah well
[14:32] <durt> bet firefox was just as slow on xp
[14:33] <bn43> seems its slower on linux for some reason
[14:33] <bn43> but could be my imagination
[14:33] <durt> don't run anything along side of firefox
[14:33] <durt> you wouldn't in windows
[14:34] <bn43> unfortunately they have too - office work and stuff - they do some admin work via the browser too
[14:35] <bn43> but at least they have agreed to go onto ubuntu desktops!  now just have to work on the financial director that has payroll software on his desktop
[14:35] <bn43> sigh
[15:42] <peaker> Hey, Xubuntu is mapping the "shift-spacebar" to some unknown key..  How can I tell it not to?
[15:42] <peaker> I often press shift-space accidentally (still having shift in before/after a capital letter) and its really disruptive
[15:43] <nielsbom> hi I just installed Xubuntu 8.10, sound worked, then installed Amarok and VLC and sound stopped working, how do I troubleshoot?
[15:45] <charlie-tca> peaker: I don't think Xubuntu remaps that key combination. You can change the shortcuts using Applications -> Settings -> Settings Manager -> Keyboard or Window Manager
[15:47] <peaker> charlie-tca: it doesnt appear there
[15:47] <charlie-tca> nielsbom: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingSoundProblems
[15:47] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: thanks
[15:48] <charlie-tca> peaker: then it is not remapped, it is the original keyboard setup
[15:49] <peaker> charlie-tca: ok, thanks. I think I had some weird variant of "us" set up instead of "us" itself. Re-added "us" and now it seems to be ok
[15:49] <charlie-tca> You are welcome
[16:06] <nielsbom> I can't change my headphone output. The volume can't be turned up or down, it stays at 0.
[16:06] <nielsbom> I fired up the volume controls with alsamixer
[16:07] <peaker> nielsbom: maybe your audio hardware wasn't detected properly?
[16:08] <nielsbom> Well, it was and it worked, then I installed VLC and Amarok, it stopped working, I deinstalled both and sound is still not working.
[16:08] <nielsbom> So my hardware _was_ detected properly once.
[16:08] <nielsbom> So I guess somewhere it still is.
[16:08] <charlie-tca> You may have to reinstall alsamixer and alsautils
[16:09] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: I'll try that
[16:09] <peaker> xubuntu is surprisingly nice, coming from Ubuntu.. my ancient laptop is responding faster than my new desktop :)
[16:10] <cody-somerville> :)
[16:11] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: nope. deinstalled alsa-gui and alsa-utils, reinstalled alsa-utils, no dice.
[16:12] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: the silly thing is: my master volume does work (laptop speakers do have output) just the headphone doesn't
[16:13] <charlie-tca> I'm out of ideas, then
[16:15] <gabkdlly> nielsbom: try if your headphones work when booting from a live cd
[16:16] <gabkdlly> nielsbom: my experience is that headphone jacks don't last forever
[16:17] <nielsbom> gabkdlly: well, I just switched to Xubuntu from Windows this morning and my headphone output worked, so that's one of the more drastic conclusions
[16:17] <nielsbom> gabkdlly: also there are a lot of people who have my soundcard and report similar problems
[16:17] <nielsbom> but charlie-tca and gabkdlly thanks anyway
[16:18] <charlie-tca> Sorry I couldn't be more helpful
[16:19] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: any help > 0 :)
[16:20] <gabkdlly> nielsbom: if you are sure that these steps reproduce your bug every time on your hardware, it would definitely be worth it to file a bug on launchpad (after searching to see if someone else has filed one for you, of course)
[16:21] <nielsbom> gabkdlly: I might do that, but I think a solution has been found, just not an easy one :S
[16:21] <nielsbom> gabkdlly: and I still have to find it
[16:40] <craigbass1976> Is there a simple way to shut down the computer from the desktop (without using a terminal)?  Right now, I quit, then have to shut down from the login screen
[16:43] <gabkdlly> the button on the panel that you push to quit should also give you the option to shut down
[16:44] <craigbass1976> gabkdlly, nope
[16:47] <charlie-tca> craigbass1976: What version of Xubuntu? Is it 8.04?
[16:47] <craigbass1976> charlie-tca, hardy, is that 8.04?
[16:48] <charlie-tca> Yes, it is. It needs a bug report filed. It broke on the last updates, I think.
[16:48] <craigbass1976> Ahh.
[16:48] <charlie-tca> Could you file a bug at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu and let me know the number?
[16:49] <craigbass1976> I'm all over it.  Hang on a sec
[16:50] <craigbass1976> Have to register first.  Hang on a couple mroe secs...
[16:52] <nielsbom> How do I start using multiple monitors?
[16:55] <charlie-tca> nielsbom: xinerama or twin-view(nvidia video)
[16:56] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: so you're saying it depends on my video card what software I should use?
[16:56] <charlie-tca> yes
[16:56] <charlie-tca> Xfce does not have the software built in, so it depends on video card
[16:57] <craigbass1976> charlie-tca, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/329774
[16:57] <charlie-tca> craigbass1976: thank you. I got it.
[16:58] <charlie-tca> Even better, all the information, too
[16:58] <craigbass1976> charlie-tca, THat was a PITA.  WHat was it asking for in version#?  I put in xfce version, no good.  ubuntu version, still no good
[16:58] <craigbass1976> Ended up putting I Don't Know
[16:59] <charlie-tca> that's okay. I'm not sure where it asks it, now. Should have been 8.04, I think
[17:00] <craigbass1976> I didn't try 8.04.2... maybe that's what it was looking for
[17:00] <charlie-tca> You did good.
[17:01] <titan_ark_> hello :)
[17:01] <charlie-tca> Hello
[17:01] <nielsbom> What command do I use to see which video card I have?
[17:02] <craigbass1976> lspci maybe?
[17:02] <charlie-tca> lshw  or lspci
[17:05] <craigbass1976> Ok, I give up.  I set xfce to make some windows (the ones that aren't in focus) transparent.  I need to shut that off, but can't find how I did it.
[17:06] <knome> craigbass1976, settings > settings manager > window manager tweaks > compositor ?
[17:06]  * craigbass1976 slaps himself
[17:07] <craigbass1976> It was only annoying for GIMP, which has three windows.  I hear tell there's a Windows version of GIMP where everything is docked like in photoshop into one window.
[17:10] <rocko> you can make it so that it is in one window craigbass1976
[17:10] <craigbass1976> I think I just found a site telling me that.
[17:10] <rocko> link
[17:10] <rocko> plz
[17:11] <craigbass1976> http://tombuntu.com/index.php/2008/04/15/more-productive-window-management-in-gimp/
[17:11] <craigbass1976> But it's not right, as far as I can tell yet
[17:11] <rocko> what I do is just set the windows to utility and then press f11
[17:13] <craigbass1976> what's f11 do?  I've just set them to keep above,a nd it should be fine.  I've always run gimp on it's own desktop anyway
[17:14] <rocko> it goes fullscreen when you press f11
[17:14] <rocko> but you have to set the windows to utility not keep above
[17:14] <rocko> if you want to use f11
[17:14] <craigbass1976> How do you move across desktops if it
[17:14] <craigbass1976> 's set to full screen?
[17:15] <rocko> just the normal way
[17:15] <knome> craigbass1976, ctrl+alt+left/right :P
[17:15] <craigbass1976> Oh, and then the other desktops look normal?  have to try 'er out
[17:17] <rocko> yes
[17:20] <rocko> or you can just press f11 again so that it goes out of fullscreen mode
[17:20] <rocko> firefox also allows you to use f11
[17:33] <rocko> craigbass1976 how do you like that layout I told you ?
[17:33] <rocko> is it working for you?
[17:59] <craigbass1976> rocko, f11 won't go full screen for some reason
[18:08] <b0o> hello all
[18:11] <gabkdlly> b0o: hi
[18:15] <peaker> Hey, how do you use XFCE4 to browse SFTP's?  nautilus can do it, but the xfce file browser seems not to?
[18:16] <knome> !sftp
[18:16] <knome> !ssh
[18:16] <knome> peaker, one way is to use nautilus, the other is to use fuse and sshfs.
[18:16] <knome> !sshfs
[18:17] <knome> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSHFS
[18:18] <Aizawa> Hey guys, I have a problem. I installed xubuntu, everything worked fine, I installed compiz, everything worked fine, now when I tried to start xubuntu the splash screen flickered for a moment and then I saw my wallpaper and nothing worked.
[18:18] <Aizawa> So I started it in terminal and removed compiz, and now I got into xubuntu.
[18:19] <Aizawa> Now, in the settings manager, if I go to "Window Manager" settings or something like that it tells me it doesn't work with my current window manager. And I don't have any window borders.
[18:19] <Aizawa> How do I get it to switch back to the xfce window manager thingie?
[18:20] <peaker> knome: thanks
[18:21] <Aizawa> Well I reinstalled compiz and now it works.. it probably wont the next time I boot though..
[18:23] <_Pete_> I'm using IntelliJ IDEA Java IDE under xfce and it's keyboard shortcuts dont work e.g. ctrl-f9 shoul make the project
[18:23] <_Pete_> I have set ctrl-f9 not to be any xfce shortcut
[18:23] <_Pete_> how to fix this?
[18:24] <peaker> knome: I like the simplicity of this xfce thing -- sshfs is probably a more elegant solution than tons of userspace libs supporting sftp
[18:25] <peaker> knome: though it could be nice to GUI'ize/automate the mount/umount of sshfs
[18:36] <b0o> has anyone run across/solved the intel i810/i830 issue?
[18:37] <b0o> in Ibex
[18:37] <smultron> i'm using a Netgear WG111 wireless adapter from linux. every other network in my area shows up, EXCEPT mine (Airport Extreme). My macs can connect and see the ssid fine... any reason why this USB dongle wouldn't be able to see the Airport broadcast?
[18:42] <charlie-tca> b0o: What issue? Is there a bug report?
[18:45] <b0o> I don't know if there is a bug report for my particular problem but there are bug reports which don't seem to spell anything good for me
[18:45] <b0o> basically the i810 drivers (which I was using in hardy) are no longer used in the new xorg
[18:46] <charlie-tca> I never had a problem with Intel 810 until jaunty. Since Intel discontinued the drivers, I can't make it work
[18:46] <b0o> yeah, that's pretty much what i'm thinking i'm running in to
[18:47] <charlie-tca> Not much Ubuntu/Xubuntu can do about it, since it was Intel that decided
[18:48] <b0o> I was considering trying to compile the old drivers that were working with hardy
[18:48] <charlie-tca> I just added a pci video card
[18:49] <charlie-tca> No more issues
[18:49] <b0o> i'm on a laptop :\
[18:49] <charlie-tca> :(
[18:49] <b0o> well, I think a reinstall of hardy might be my option
[18:50] <charlie-tca> Yeah, at least that is good for a couple of years
[18:52] <b0o> hmm....looks like I happen to have the disc sitting around...time to go install (*again*)...wish me luck
[18:52] <charlie-tca> good luck :-)
[19:09] <titan_ark_> hey everyone :) am back with more doubts :P
[19:11] <titan_ark_> i was looking up on scheduling activities on the system basically cos Transmission doesnt seem to be doing its job! Looked up about cron but makes no sense :(
[19:12] <charlie-tca> !cron
[19:13] <charlie-tca> Does any of that help?
[19:14] <titan_ark_> shall look it up thx :)
[19:16] <titan_ark_> charlie-tca: is it possible to start and kill my net connection using cron?
[19:16] <charlie-tca> I don't know
[19:17] <titan_ark_> okay :)
[19:17] <charlie-tca> I barely get cron to do what I want
[19:17] <titan_ark_> oh! and why is that?
[19:17] <charlie-tca> don't understand it very good
[19:17] <titan_ark_> I am having trouble with scheduling downloads on torrents!
[19:17] <titan_ark_> uTorrent is great in that aspect
[19:18] <charlie-tca> Write a script that works, then add it to /etc/crontab
[19:18] <titan_ark_> oh i have no idea about all that! i just started using linux 3 days back :P
[19:18] <charlie-tca> the lines in crontab decide what to run and when
[19:19] <titan_ark_> hmm okay
[19:19] <charlie-tca> If your script works when you run it, it makes life easier to schedule it
[19:20] <titan_ark_> i doubt il reach the writing the script part of it!
[19:20] <charlie-tca> That is what makes it work. You can't schedule cron to run something that won't run
[19:21] <titan_ark_> well i was hoping I could just try to start the application at a given time and close it at a given time
[19:21] <titan_ark_> or my network connection
[19:22] <charlie-tca> Maybe, but the app then needs to know what to do when it starts
[19:22] <titan_ark_> or probably just shut down! thats worst case!!!
[19:22] <titan_ark_> Well, Transmission just starts connecting to peers and starts the DL the moment it is invoked
[19:22] <titan_ark_> so i guess that should work right
[19:27] <charlie-tca> Then you should be able to schedule it in crontab. It is similar to the lines there already, but the command will be to start transmission
[19:28] <charlie-tca> 47 5	* * *	titan_ark	transmission
[19:28] <charlie-tca> something like that
[19:29] <charlie-tca> That says start at 05:47 AM to run transmission
[19:30] <titan_ark_> yes i was planning to try something like that
[19:30] <titan_ark_> but confused with the whole way of how to go about it
[19:30] <titan_ark_> this must be the 1st time you got this question: Any texts I can read up, references so that i can do this kind of code?
[19:30] <charlie-tca> Just edit /etc/crontab with sudo nano
[19:31] <charlie-tca> install rutebook and read it
[19:32] <titan_ark_> okay i did a "sudo crontab -e" :S
[19:32] <titan_ark_> it says choose an editor!
[19:33] <charlie-tca> That's why I didn't say do that
[19:33] <titan_ark_> lol okay :P i saw that on some site
[19:33] <charlie-tca> ctrl-c gets you out of there
[19:33] <charlie-tca> That is not needed on Ubuntu
[19:34] <charlie-tca> Just edit /etc/crontab using root
[19:34] <titan_ark_> http://www.cyberciti.biz/tips/howto-shutdown-linux-box-automatically.html
[19:34] <titan_ark_> okay
[19:34] <titan_ark_> yeah am out
[19:34] <charlie-tca> Other distros need that
[19:34] <titan_ark_> did a ctrl+x
[19:34] <titan_ark_> okay
[19:35] <charlie-tca> you can use sudo mousepad /etc/crontab if you like mousepad
[19:36] <charlie-tca> Clocks in crontab use the 24-hour system, not the 12-hour
[19:36] <titan_ark_> okay.
[19:36] <titan_ark_> hmmm
[19:36] <charlie-tca> If you want to run something between 12 noon and midnight, add 12 to the hour
[19:37] <titan_ark_> yeah i know the 24 hr clock :)
[19:37] <titan_ark_> i am more into asm coding. have no idea at all about linux etc :P
[19:37] <charlie-tca> I don't code at all anymore
[19:37] <titan_ark_> :D okay
[19:43] <ranko> hello im having a problem with the text color in firefox using a dark theme
[19:45] <charlie-tca> titan_ark_: you can look in /usr/share/doc for bash-doc and install it if it is not there for other docs on editing files
[19:47] <titan_ark_> charlie-tca okay :)
[19:54] <titan_ark_> charlie-tca i was trying out the command to edit in crontab. Here i need to give the full path for transmission right? I am supposing it is in /usr/bin. but here there is transmission, transmission-daemon, transmission-remote, transmissioncli. I think it cant be transmissioncli. Would you be able to tell me what i need to run?
[19:55] <charlie-tca> transmission
[19:55] <titan_ark_> i could only find a folder by the name bash in the doc folder
[19:55] <titan_ark_> okay :)
[19:55] <titan_ark_> shall try that
[19:56] <charlie-tca> Then install bash-doc through synaptic-package-manager, if you want to know about it
[19:57] <charlie-tca> Rutebook is very big, contains a lot of info, some of which is out of date, but most is still valid
[19:58] <titan_ark_> oh okay.
[20:01] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu community meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
[20:01] <titan_ark_> I just tried this: "29 1    * * * home /usr/bin/transmission" to start transmission at 1:29 am, but it dint start up! its 1:31 now
[20:02] <charlie-tca> Could it be the user name?
[20:03] <titan_ark_> no, my system name is home,
[20:03] <charlie-tca> Might to give it 5 minutes to take
[20:04] <titan_ark_> okay il try it again
[20:04] <Myrtti> hmmm
[20:04] <Myrtti> why is there "home" then?
[20:04] <charlie-tca> user name is "home"
[20:05] <Myrtti> ah, how clear ;-)
[20:05]  * charlie-tca nods
[20:10] <peaker> is there anything lighter than pidgin to run on xfce?
[20:10] <charlie-tca> xchat for IRC
[20:14] <peaker> I guess I'll use the web interface for gtalk
[20:14] <peaker> which is open anyway most of the time
[20:27] <titan_ark_> I just tried sudo cron tab -l and this what i got! "no crontab for root"
[20:27] <titan_ark_> that means the crontab is not running?
[20:28] <charlie-tca> We don't use separate cron for users. root is just another user
[20:28] <titan_ark_> okay but then shouldnt it have displayed the one i had sceduled?
[20:29] <titan_ark_> *scheduled
[20:29] <Tlyman> Hello! I have just upgraded to Intrepid Ibex. Is it possible that evince has been removed from this release?
[20:29] <charlie-tca> I don't know
[20:29] <chewit> Tlyman, evince is in xubuntu by default
[20:29] <charlie-tca> Tlyman: no, evince was not removed
[20:29] <Tlyman> I'm offered to open a PDF with GIMP...
[20:30] <titan_ark_> okay. sorry to disturb through the meeting :(
[20:30] <charlie-tca> That's just a bad association, not a missing app
[20:30] <Tlyman> and trying to start evince didn't work
[20:30] <Tlyman> i mean alt + f2 -> evince -> run
[20:31] <Tlyman> "Failed to execute child process "evince" (No such file or directory)"
[20:31] <charlie-tca> Open a terminal and type "which evince" to see if it is there
[20:31] <Tlyman> ok
[20:32] <Tlyman> returns without a message
[20:32] <charlie-tca> strange! it gives me /usr/bin/evinc e
[20:32] <charlie-tca> on a fresh install
[20:32] <Tlyman> that's what i got on hardy, but now.. really strange
[20:33] <Tlyman> first, i thought it has been replaced by something new
[20:33] <charlie-tca> Did you upgrade to 8.10?
[20:33] <Tlyman> yes
[20:34] <charlie-tca> That is the problem. The upgrades don't always work for everything. it is reported bug
[20:34] <charlie-tca> You need to install evince then
[20:34] <Tlyman> well ok then, if you say it's supposed to be in 8.10, i'll just install it from the repositories
[20:35] <Tlyman> ok, then i'll do that
[20:35] <Tlyman> thanks a lot, charlie!
[20:36] <charlie-tca> no problem.
[20:36] <Tlyman> bye
[21:06] <slow-motion> hi
[21:18] <knome> slow-motion, hello.
[21:18] <slow-motion> hi knome
[21:19] <nielsbom> I'm on Xubuntu 8.10, can I use Debian packages?
[21:20] <nielsbom> I'm having a hard time choosing which installer to pick: http://do.davebsd.com/download.shtml
[21:21] <nielsbom> I know Debian gave birth to Ubuntu, from which Xubuntu "came". (very myhthological :P)
[21:21] <charlie-tca> nielsbom: yes, you can use Debian packages
[21:21] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: and if I can choose between Ubuntu and Debian packages?
[21:22] <charlie-tca> but you should look in Synaptic-Package-Manager first to see if it is packaged for Ubuntu
[21:22] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: yeah my SPM is kinda limited, can't even find amarok on it...
[21:22] <nielsbom> or VLC for that matter
[21:22] <j1mc_> nielsbom: debian packages may have different dependencies (sometimes) than x/ubuntu packages, though
[21:22] <charlie-tca> Then you need to add the repositories to it.
[21:22] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: maybe I'm doing something wrong
[21:23] <Mood> nielsbom: just use sudo apt-cache search xxx
[21:23] <nielsbom> j1mc_: so Ubuntu is the preferred option, then Debian works, but maybe has some dependencies?
[21:23] <j1mc_> nielsbom: right - you may need to download some dependencies sometimes...
[21:23] <j1mc_> from the debian repos... not recommended, really.
[21:23] <charlie-tca> add medibuntu: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Medibuntu
[21:24] <j1mc_> i mean, not that debian repos are bad, but . . . there really shouldn't be much of a reason to use them if you have any version of ubuntu installed
[21:24] <nielsbom> if I do "sudo apt-cache search medibuntu" I should get the packages for medibuntu right?
[21:25] <nielsbom> j1mc_: so getting/having packages which have dependencies is ill-advised?
[21:25] <charlie-tca> If you follow the wiki page I referenced, it will work. Not apt-cache search
[21:26] <j1mc_> nielsbom: well, no... all packages have dependencies.  but a package from debian may have dependencies that are different from packages in ubuntu
[21:26] <j1mc_> or they are the same dependencies, but different versions of those dependencies
[21:26] <j1mc_> does that make sense?
[21:27] <nielsbom> j1mc_: sort of, it's probably easier to use *buntu packages, because a lot of programs I have depend on stuff I already have, right?
[21:34] <j1mc_> nielsbom: exactly.
[21:34] <j1mc_> there would have to be a pretty special reason for you to really need a package straight from debian
[21:39] <nielsbom> j1mc_: alright, but a reason might be that there are no *buntu packages for an application and there are Debian packages, or something
[21:39] <nielsbom> or would a better idea then be to recompile it myself?
[21:46] <charlie-tca> nielsbom: got something specific in mind?
[21:46] <j1mc_> nielsbom: right - that would be a situation to do that, but i would still ask for help in an irc channel for help first...
[21:46] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: i _was_ looking for a good package for Gnome-do but I found it with sudo apt-cache search
[21:47] <charlie-tca> It is in synaptic
[21:47] <nielsbom> j1mc_: I'm not gonna roll my own just yet :)
[21:47] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: but I could not find it
[21:47] <knome> nielsbom, do you have all the repositorieS?
[21:47] <charlie-tca> If you found it with apt-cache, it has to be
[21:48] <nielsbom> knome: so I have to add repositories to SPM first and then search in SPM?
[21:48] <charlie-tca> You click on search, enter gnome-do, version 0.8.0-1~ubuntu1
[21:49] <nielsbom> I could not find gnome-do in the SPM but I did find it with apt-search
[21:49] <nielsbom> apt-cache search
[21:50] <nielsbom> And if I do a command line install of a package, it should also be visible from the SPM right?
[21:51] <charlie-tca> You may need to hit the Reload once, for it to be able to search everything.
[21:51] <nielsbom> Because I installed Gnome-Do from the command line, and still can't see it in the SPM
[21:51] <charlie-tca> Yes, if a package shows using apt-cache search, it should show in SPM
[21:52] <nielsbom> charlie-tca: apt-cache search searches the local cache right?
[21:53] <nielsbom> And the "Add/remove" is a wrapper for the SPM, as the SPM is for the command line, right?
[21:53] <charlie-tca> I don't know, for sure. It should be the same search for both
[21:53] <charlie-tca> Add/Remove is it's own database
[21:54] <charlie-tca> It doesn't contain as much info as S-P-M or apt-cache
[21:56] <zerothis1> hos do i add a user from the command-line? i used useradd name and passwd name but can't log into the account
[21:58] <nielsbom> thanks for the info guys!
[21:58] <knome> nielsbom, np.
[21:58] <knome> zerothis1, adduser should work but it's not encouraged.
[22:03] <charlie-tca> nielsbom: no problem.
[22:03] <Mood> so which one's encouraged? adduser or useradd? i prefer adduser because it prompts for every field
[22:03] <charlie-tca> and, welcome to Xubuntu
[22:04] <knome> Mood, adduser over useadd yes, but any CLI interface is not encouraged.
[22:04] <knome> at least adduser should work :P
[22:05] <Mood> cli interface? you mean the prompts? you think it's a security risk?
[22:05] <Mood> i prefer cli vs gui
[22:05] <Mood> i never heard of 'cli is not encouraged' on linux... peculiar...
[22:06] <knome> well, we have a gui for that. if a regular user wants to add a user to her system, we encourage her to use the gui.
[22:06] <knome> if you are a linux geek, of course you are free to use the cli.
[22:07] <knome> but in normal situation you should not have to use the cli
[22:07] <Mood> what's the gui for adding users? never heard of it
[22:08] <Mood> ah i see it now under System->Users
[22:08] <knome> system -> users and gourps
[22:09] <Mood> knome: so you almost never use terminal for admin tasks?
[22:09] <zerothis1> whats' the command-line to invoke the program at System>users and groups ?
[22:10] <knome> Mood, i do. but i don't encourage users to do that.
[22:10] <knome> zerothis1, users-admin
[22:10] <Mood> knome: perhaps users who are recent migrants from windoz :-)
[22:11] <knome> Mood, any users...
[22:12] <Myrtti> Mood: I dare say most Buntu users are recent migrants. with loose definition on recent.
[22:12] <zerothis1> tried to install that "could not find package users-admin"
[22:13] <Myrtti> zerothis1: type it in a terminal
[22:13] <Myrtti> as is
[22:13] <Myrtti> no aptitude, no apt-get no nothing, not even sudo
[22:13] <knome> command name != package name
[22:13] <Myrtti> just users-admin
[22:13] <zerothis1> i typed "users-admin", it was not installed
[22:14] <knome> zerothis1, have you removed a lot of packages?
[22:14] <Mood> knome: you know, it's somewhat peculiar, but you're the first person i've ever heard discourage using terminal for admin tasks in linux, ubuntu or otherwise :-)
[22:14] <zerothis1> I didn't install alot of packages to begin with, I'm going for minimal
[22:14] <knome> Mood, i'm not discouraging. i'm not encouraging. that's two completely different things.
[22:15] <knome> Mood, most people here seeking for support don't really *want* to use cli.
[22:15] <Mood> knome: disagreed. but anyways, it's probably not worth the time/effort to debate it :-)
[22:17] <knome> Mood, if i'd discourage you, i'd say "don't do it". if i don't encourage, i say "do it like this (instead)"
[22:17] <knome> Mood, not encouraging is like giving some alternatives, not taking anything away ;)
[22:18] <Mood> knome: point taken :-)
[22:18] <knome> Mood, (of course i wouldn't have said it's not encouraged if i knew he is isntalling minimum. then of course he uses cli :))
[22:19] <knome> Mood, but in a normal situation you can expect a user has the default set of applications
[22:19] <Mood> zerothis1: which users-admin
[22:20] <zerothis1> ?
[22:21] <Mood> zerothis1: are you familiar with terminal?
[22:21] <zerothis1> yes, raised on DOS, redeemed by bash
[22:22] <Mood> zerothis1: do you have terminal open?
[22:22] <zerothis1> yes
[22:22] <Mood> zerothis1: type lsb_release -a
[22:24] <zerothis1> Ubuntu | Ubuntu 7.10 | 7.10 | gusty
[22:24] <Mood> zerothis1: type which users-admin
[22:26] <zerothis1> the program 'users-admin' is currently not installed blablabla
[22:26] <Mood> zerothis1: strange. users-admin should be part of 7.10. how did you install 7.10?
[22:27] <zerothis1> from a CD, advanced installation step by step, tried to do minimal
[22:27] <Mood> zerothis1: also, "which user-admin" should not come up with "currently not installed" -- that seems like a strange message. usually there's no message
[22:28] <lukinfore> hi
[22:28] <Mood> if you want minimal, i'd suggest xubuntu, not ubuntu
[22:28] <lukinfore> after last jauntu update i've got real ugly view of settings manager
[22:28] <knome> if you want minimal, i'd suggest minimal cd.
[22:29] <knome> !minimal
[22:29] <lukinfore> any chance to turn it back
[22:29] <lukinfore> ?
[22:29] <knome> lukinfore, real ugly = ?
[22:29] <charlie-tca> lukinfore: It probably will fix itself in a day or two of updates
[22:29] <lukinfore> oh
[22:29] <lukinfore> very real ugly
[22:29] <lukinfore> ehm
[22:29] <lukinfore> its not the plans?
[22:29] <Mood> lukinfore: you mean your user interface? or just the settings manager app?
[22:30] <lukinfore> well user iface too
[22:30] <Mood> lukinfore: you can change your user interface pref
[22:30] <Mood> Settings->User Interface->Theme
[22:30] <charlie-tca> lukinfore: you are running the alpha jaunty, things come and go.
[22:30] <lukinfore> i've got tips started  with sessionso it slowdowns
[22:31] <lukinfore> theme had not changed
[22:32] <lukinfore> but there was big buttons in setting manager
[22:32] <lukinfore> and now  there is some windoz-like
[22:32] <lukinfore> let me do screenshot
[22:32] <charlie-tca> Have you done a restart lately?
[22:37] <lukinfore> http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=10gh7kj&s=5
[22:37] <lukinfore> wonder is this normal
[22:38] <Mood> isn't that tango theme?
[22:38] <lukinfore> no
[22:38] <lukinfore> my own
[22:38] <charlie-tca> What is wrong with it? It looks just like mine, except you have some in a different language
[22:38] <lukinfore> argh
[22:38] <charlie-tca> Do you have two languages installed?
[22:38] <lukinfore> but before it was other?
[22:39] <Mood> what icon themes do you have?
[22:39] <lukinfore> it was some mcs package removed during last update
[22:40] <lukinfore> icon - tango, yes
[22:41] <lukinfore> xfce4-mcs-plugins exactly
[22:42] <charlie-tca> Which in not used in jaunty
[22:43] <charlie-tca> xfce 4.6 does not use xfce4-mcs-plugins
[22:43] <lukinfore> so
[22:43] <lukinfore> it is xfce policy
[22:43] <charlie-tca> what is?
[22:44] <Mood> lukinfore: try http://art.gnome.org for more artsy icons
[22:45] <Mood> these have more of a mac os x kind of feel to them -- http://people.freedesktop.org/~jimmac/icons/#oxygen
[22:45] <lukinfore> Mood, there is no problems with current
[22:46] <Mood> lukinfore: ? weren't you complaining about your theme?
[22:46] <lukinfore> just want my view back:)
[22:46]  * Mood scratches his head in confusion
[22:46] <Mood> ok
[22:47] <lukinfore> in previous version(before update i mean) settings was different window, and all its sons running separatly
[22:47] <lukinfore> uhm
[22:47] <lukinfore> my english
[22:49] <charlie-tca> I think this is the new thing for jaunty, lukinfore
[22:49] <zerothis1> ok, so i got a new user working using the adduser command (not useradd). but the internet doesn't work when I log in as the user
[22:49] <lukinfore> where is autostarted apps?
[22:49] <lukinfore> well using jaunty month at least
[22:50] <lukinfore> was fine
[22:50] <lukinfore> now - not
[22:50] <Mood> zerothis1: define 'internet doesn't work'
[22:50] <Mood> zerothis1: can you ping? does ifconfig show your device?
[22:51] <Mood> zerothis1: did you log in after shutdown as new user? or just su username?
[22:51] <lukinfore> oh no
[22:51] <lukinfore> yet another registry in 4.6
[22:51] <charlie-tca> I don't know what happened to autostarted apps yet. It disappeared...
[22:52] <charlie-tca> I still waiting to see where it went
[22:53]  * lukinfore thought about xfce becoming little gnome
[22:53] <zerothis1> all commands like apt-get update and wget fail to resolve hosts
[22:55] <zerothis1> xfce is not so little. maybe "half-gnome"
[22:56]  * charlie-tca hoping it never becomes gnome
[22:57] <lukinfore> hope won't rich full
[22:57] <lukinfore> or little more than full
[22:57] <charlie-tca> that is true
[23:18] <lukinfore> charlie-tca,  if still interesting autostarting apps is in "session and startup"
[23:18] <charlie-tca> yeah?
[23:19] <charlie-tca> Thanks
[23:22] <Guest11783> Hi can someone please tell me how I can get Middle Mouse Drag Scrolling in Firefox?
[23:25]  * lukinfore hate that update
[23:25] <lukinfore> where xkill goes?
[23:26] <charlie-tca> I don't know that either
[23:31] <lukinfore> shouldn't xkill be default shortcut?
[23:32] <lukinfore> treat this as feature requeat :P
[23:32] <lukinfore> *quest
[23:34] <charlie-tca> You can file a bug on it, so it does not get lost. Also, be sure to state which key you want it to use
[23:35] <lukinfore> but where to post it?
[23:35] <charlie-tca> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu
[23:35] <charlie-tca> package source is xfce4-session
[23:36] <charlie-tca> and let me know the bug number, please
[23:36] <lukinfore> not xubuntu-default-settings?
[23:36] <charlie-tca> That will work, too
[23:46] <lukinfore> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xubuntu-default-settings/+bug/329890
[23:46] <lukinfore> not sure that was right-formatted though
[23:46] <charlie-tca> Thanks, lukinfore
[23:46] <charlie-tca> It looks fine to me
[23:46] <lukinfore> np


[06:24] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: 32bit didn't build - rebuilding now
[07:30] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: rebuilt in time - checked it boots, nothing else done though
[08:05] <akxwi-dave> cheers flocculant will give them a bash
[11:53] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: caught up now
[12:02] <akxwi-dave> :-)
[16:26] <nairwolf> hi, the bug with apt and ubiquity and non-english keyboard has been fixed and released, apparently ;)
[16:28] <flocculant> nairwolf: then tomorrow the iso will have new versions of those packages
[16:36] <nairwolf> I'm waiting for that !
[16:37] <flocculant> :)
[16:37] <flocculant> you can check that it has updated packages beforehand of course
[17:57] <nairwolf> flocculant: I've searched where I could find that, but I haven't found anything
[17:57] <nairwolf> I was looking here : http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/
[17:57] <nairwolf> but I can't find the current version of ubiquityin the daily build
[19:28] <nairwolf> flocculant: okay, I've found it ;)
[19:28] <nairwolf> that was easy !
[19:28] <nairwolf> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20160824/yakkety-desktop-amd64.manifest
[19:30] <flocculant> except that's ubuntu :p
[19:31] <flocculant> I usually look at buildlog, but I'm usually checking we built properly too https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cdimage/+livefs/ubuntu/yakkety/xubuntu
[19:32] <flocculant> nairwolf: for the 'current' one - http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily-live/current/yakkety-desktop-amd64.manifest
[19:32] <nairwolf> oh, you right ;)
[19:32] <nairwolf> and where can I find the list of all packages avaible with apt ?
[19:32] <nairwolf> does it exists somewhere ?
[19:33] <flocculant> well that would be the whole of the repositories
[19:33] <flocculant> thousands and thousands and thousands of packages
[19:34] <flocculant> 55802 listed in synaptic for yakkety
[19:34] <nairwolf> I suppose that's here : http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/yakkety/
[19:36] <nairwolf> I haven't said it would be small ;)
[19:46] <flocculant> /var/lib/apt/lists/
[19:48] <flocculant> now there's more than 3 monimations I'll set up civs :)
[19:50] <knome> i was just wondering if we should set up civs on the xubuntu development server or if there was some reason why not to
[19:51] <flocculant> knome: can't imagine there being much point tbh
[19:51] <knome> can be used for all subsequent xubuntu polls, is a central archive controlled by the team itself
[19:52] <flocculant> mmm
[19:52] <flocculant> except it's all private
[19:52] <knome> still, on a team server
[19:53] <knome> but, just a thought
[19:53] <flocculant> what I mean by private here is people's votes aren't known - not sure it needs to be archivable
[19:54] <flocculant> what obviously does need to be archivable is the result
[19:54] <Unit193> Sounds like more effort than it's worth to me.
[19:54] <flocculant> and the result's archived by mailman
[19:54] <knome> Unit193, for a single vote, likely
[19:54] <knome> the result that is posted by a single person to a mailing list
[19:55] <knome> also, is there any reason not to make the results in civs public?
[19:55] <flocculant> of course
[19:55] <knome> which is?
[19:55] <flocculant> it's a private poll - just like any other ubuntu council vote
[19:55] <flocculant> nobodies business but yours who you vote for and in what order
[19:56] <Unit193> 0_o
[19:56] <knome> except the poll maintainers, again
[19:56] <flocculant> poll maintainers don't see the votes by 'people'
[19:56] <knome> okay
[19:56] <flocculant> at least didn't the last time I ran one, can't imagine they changed it
[19:57] <knome> me neither
[20:02] <flocculant> knome: you has mail
[20:02] <knome> ack
[20:02] <flocculant> tell me when you've voted and I'll close it :)
[20:02] <knome> done
[20:03] <flocculant> http://civs.cs.cornell.edu/cgi-bin/results.pl?id=E_db57c4ef90122089
[20:03] <flocculant> is all the poll maintainer sees :)
[20:03] <flocculant> not voting lost completely :D
[20:04] <flocculant> and http://civs.cs.cornell.edu/cgi-bin/control.pl?id=E_db57c4ef90122089&key=349fa483c50299b6&akey=96b8387c652c3912 is the link I got at the beginning
[20:05] <flocculant> nothing wrong with linking that once the poll's closed either to the result if you want to archive that
[20:06] <flocculant> but no-one else does
[20:06] <flocculant> ochosi: you has mail too :p