[12:14] <mpt> "With the release of Ubuntu 7.04 last year..."
[14:27] <nigelb> mhall119: I suggest we do all the reviews on friday
[14:28] <nigelb> and keep submitting merge requests throughout the week
[14:28] <nigelb> (not that you do all of them)
[14:28] <nigelb> But that way, everyone's slightly free and around generically
[14:28] <mhall119> that's a good idea, since my Fridays are generally going to be more free
[14:30] <nigelb> Yeah, and I like the idea of just doing merge requests and then looking at all of them together
[14:31] <nigelb> what in the.... mothership is missing on my copy of summit :\
[14:57] <mhall119> nigelb: get the latest ubuntu_website?
[14:57] <nigelb> mhall119: django light themes?
[14:58] <mhall119> yesh
[15:29] <nigelb> cjohnston: No, we won't
[15:30] <nigelb> We don't use information from Launchpad that's not already publically available, meaning, we don't depend on LP information from a particular user.
[16:06] <daker_> newz2000, http://i.imgur.com/sUH3D.png
[16:07] <newz2000> daker: what should I be looking for here?
[16:07] <daker_> everyone can request CDs even if he is the team owner
[16:07] <daker> i am not the team owner/contact and i have the form to request the package
[16:08] <daker> newz2000, do you know where
[16:08] <daker> i fill bugs for it ?
[16:09] <newz2000> Hmm...
[16:09] <newz2000> sadly, I don't but let me ask
[16:09] <daker> 2 or 3 packages where send to people who are no the team owner
[16:12] <newz2000> daker: I've pinged the guy behind the forms.c.c website to see if he knows
[16:12] <daker> newz2000, you can test https://forms.canonical.com/lococd
[16:13] <daker> ok
[16:13] <newz2000> daker: why don't you go ahead and e-mail me the details and I'll forward it on<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[16:14] <daker> ok
[16:36] <daker> newz2000, ok sent
[16:37] <newz2000> daker: thanks
[17:58] <nigelb> heh, my respect for kirkland increased a few folds
[17:58] <nigelb> He actually scrolled through render.py *at* UDS and submitted a merge proposal
[18:14] <nigelb> cjohnston, mhall119: Either of your around?
[18:15] <nigelb> https://code.launchpad.net/~kirkland/summit/irc-url/+merge/60931
[18:16] <nigelb> I'm not sure if we want to do this, it would add another icon to each session with irc:// links to the channel
[18:16] <nigelb> It breaks because you can't know room name until the session is placed on a room.
[18:17] <nigelb> and at the point of rendering that the merge is proposed we just don't know which room it goes into
[18:19] <nigelb> (just reply when either of you are back)
[18:19] <nigelb> With that I call it a day today, extremely productive day I think :)
[18:38] <mhall119> nigelb: yeah, if anything the link should be on the room name in the column header
[18:38] <mhall119> since it's specific to the room, not the session
[18:39] <nigelb> mhall119: Yeah, feel free to reject the merge now or on friday when we go through all the pending ones
[19:18] <cjohnston> yo
[19:20] <nigelb> ahoy cjohnston
[19:30] <cjohnston> hey joey
[19:30] <cjohnston> nigelb: bug 784015
[19:30] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 784015 in summit "Summit should use login.ubuntu.com (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/784015
[19:30] <nigelb> cjohnston: ya
[19:31] <cjohnston> did you read my reply?
[19:31] <nigelb> cjohnston: I replied to your comments in there here
[19:31] <nigelb> nigelb>cjohnston: No, we won't
[19:31] <nigelb>  [8:00 PM] <nigelb>We don't use information from Launchpad that's not already publically available, meaning, we don't depend on LP information from a particular user.
[19:31] <cjohnston> Yes we do.. Registering
[19:32] <cjohnston> nigelb: imo the channel name at the top should be the irc link
[19:32] <nigelb> cjohnston: that's pulled from an XML.
[19:32] <nigelb> cjohnston: the channel name at top is the link to icecast
[19:33] <nigelb> okay, I have a call now.  Be back in a few.
[19:33] <cjohnston> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-o/2011-05-09/ I see no links to icecast
[19:34] <nigelb> cjohnston: no one bothered to fill it up
[19:34] <cjohnston> but you cant register attendance without having an lp account
[19:34] <nigelb> I blame jorge
[19:34] <cjohnston> gotcha
[19:34] <nigelb> cjohnston: you can't have a SSO account without launchpad account
[19:34] <cjohnston> I believe you can
[19:34] <nigelb> cjohnston: ubuntu sso is basically exactly the same as launchpad, but with different themeing and config
[19:35] <cjohnston> right. but you dont have to have an LP account iirc
[19:35] <nigelb> ya
[19:35] <nigelb> so how does that block us?
[19:35] <nigelb> to register use your launchpad account
[19:35] <nigelb> to sign in, use SSo
[19:35] <nigelb> SSO
[19:35] <cjohnston> how are you going to register your attendance in LP without having an LP acocunt
[19:35] <cjohnston> so you want a user to create an sso and then create an LP?
[19:35] <nigelb> ya
[19:36] <cjohnston> umm.
[19:36] <cjohnston> IMO no
[19:36] <nigelb> Well, I'll be honest
[19:36] <cjohnston> that seems like doubling the work
[19:36] <cjohnston> for the user
[19:36] <nigelb> how many users coming to UDS doesn't have LP account?
[19:36] <nigelb> No, it isn't
[19:36] <nigelb> most people have launchpad accounts and then sso acconuts
[19:36] <cjohnston> but you dont have to have an sso account if you have an lp account
[19:37] <cjohnston> nigelb: they all have one if they have done anything on summit
[19:37] <nigelb> cjohnston: yes, you have an sso account if you have LP


[00:01] <raevol> 1 minute over D:
[00:02] <pleia2> raevol: what were we counting down to?
[00:02] <raevol> 5pm gotime BYYYE
[00:02] <pleia2> ah
[00:49] <pleia2> heading down to the SF Ubuntu Hour :)
[01:00] <raevol> home
[01:08] <pleia2> yay, I'm not alone! (michelle just showed up)
[02:06] <wiretapped> http://www.sfmysql.org/events/29160421/?eventId=29160421&action=detail starting now
[03:39] <DarkwingDuck> Anyone active?
[03:41] <gua> DarkwingDuck: sorta, but i'm new, so i dunno if that counts. what's up?
[03:41] <DarkwingDuck> Do you use bzr at all?
[03:43] <gua> i do not
[03:43] <gua> planning to learn git. i've only used scm tools to check out code. "svn co" and "git clone".
[03:43] <DarkwingDuck> ahhh, got ya.
[03:43] <DarkwingDuck> NM
[03:48] <pleia2> DarkwingDuck: need bzr help?
[03:50] <DarkwingDuck> I just needed someone to branch lp:kubuntu-docs and let me know the revision.
[03:50] <broder> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/kubuntu-docs/oneiric says 228
[03:50] <DarkwingDuck> Mine says 226 and LP is reporting 228
[03:50] <aaditya> Is it weird that I read bzr as bizzare? :P
[03:51] <broder> DarkwingDuck: the revision numbers aren't guaranteed to be consistent across different branches
[03:51] <broder> especially if the history is at all non-linear
[03:51] <broder> hm...actually, maybe that's not true with how bzr works
[03:51] <broder> git has warped my brain too much
[03:51] <DarkwingDuck> broder: They are not..
[03:51] <DarkwingDuck> But, the fact mine is two behind worries me.
[03:52] <pleia2> aaditya: well it is "bazaar" :) and people get all weird when I call it that instead of bzr
[03:52] <DarkwingDuck> lol
[03:52] <broder> DarkwingDuck: compare it against the long-form revision id at http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/kubuntu-docs/oneiric/revision/228
[03:52] <broder> (that's the equivalent to git's sha1s)
[03:52] <aaditya> pleia2: lol, bazaar is still easier to pronounce.
[03:52] <DarkwingDuck> Yeah, and I'm trying to figure out why mine wont update. It reports 226 is the current revision.
[03:53] <DarkwingDuck> Hence me concern.
[03:54] <broder> DarkwingDuck: what is the revision-id line in "bzr log -l 1 --show-ids"?
[03:54] <DarkwingDuck> I got the issue now.
[03:55] <pleia2> DarkwingDuck: if you "bzr pull" it should update your branch and notify you of conflicts
[03:56] <pleia2> then a bzr status will show you diffs
[04:41] <philipballew> would anyone wanna give their opinions of how things look on my wiki  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/philipballew
[04:45] <rww> It's spell fo... never mind, I'll just fix it myself >.>
[04:47] <philipballew> as a computer information systems major spelling is not super high on my list
[04:49] <rww> It should be. Poor communication skills are a detriment to most professions.
[04:50] <rww> Also, I'm a Computer Science major, so that argument doesn't really work :P
[04:51]  * rww shrugs, commits edit, ponders again how silly the new wiki theme is
[04:52] <philipballew> does the wiki support html?
[04:53] <DarkwingDuck> moinmoin sux as a wiki in general
[04:54] <rww> It was a lot less annoying when we had a theme that didn't break revision diffs
[04:54] <rww> but yeah, it's not my favorite thing in the world
[05:00] <philipballew> i guess someone liked it
[05:00] <philipballew> otherwise they wouldnt have implamented it
[05:13] <philipballew> you can download windows 8 beta for free and play with it. I might want to see what ways they have coppied linux soon
[06:12] <pleia2> jtatum: michelle asked tonight if there would be an ubuntu hour in mt view tomorrow, I'm not seeing anything in the loco directory
[06:13] <pleia2> no announcements either, so I'm assuming "no" but I wanted to be sure before I tell everyone that it's not :)
[12:44]  * bkerensa waves good morning
[12:44] <bkerensa> time to go setup a Ubuntu Booth at this ungodly hour
[16:36] <nhaines> There is no Windows 8 beta.
[16:38] <nhaines> Also Computer Information Systems majors need to have spelling as a super high priority.  Not only because communications skills are paramount, but because config files care about spelling too.
[16:38] <nhaines> (I'm a Computer and Business Information Systems major.)
[19:19] <raevol> 4 hours 41 minutes
[21:43] <philipballew> hey pleia2 you got a quick second for a pm?
[21:43] <pleia2> sure
[22:39] <raevol> 1 hour 11 minutes
[22:40] <seidos> mysterious
[22:48] <philipballew> 1 hour 2 minutes?
[23:00] <raevol> 1 hour 1 minute!
[23:00] <raevol> wow in the two seconds it took to type that the minute changed
[23:00] <raevol> that was surprisingly on-topic
[23:02] <philipballew> raevol, what happens?
[23:03] <raevol> 5pm time to go hooome :D
[23:04] <gua> raevol: if you're counting down the minutes until you get to leave, you might want to look into another job.. or something
[23:04] <raevol> i am
[23:05] <raevol> can't make a fun job appear out of the air though
[23:05] <philipballew> what do you do?
[23:06] <raevol> customer service at a web company


[00:24] <fluvvell> tomreyn,  thanks for all the help, its recovering now, looks like completing within an hour or so.  Time to take a lunch break methinks.
[00:30] <tomreyn> welcome, enoy lunch
[01:40] <drab> anybody using ldirectord or some other load balancer that can redirect queries based on src ip?
[01:41] <drab> load balancing seems the correct answer to my question from the other day re: running CF on a different box than the GW
[01:41] <drab> at this stage I'd like to run 2 CF boxes especially for upgrades
[01:42] <drab> so that I can upgrade one, and redirect some traffic to it, make sure stuff works, and then upgrade the other
[01:42] <drab> however I can't see a lb that will allow me to choose which traffic to route to a real server based on src ip
[01:42] <drab> they all seem to pick the destination based on weight or availability, which isn't helpful
[01:44] <drab> I guess I could use REDIRECT on the gw and redirect to a different service based on src ip with iptables
[01:44] <drab> that'd work
[01:50] <tomreyn> normally you'd add a custom cookie or request header to deviate from default traffic flow for testing / debugging purposes.
[01:51] <zul> jamespage:  when you get a chance https://review.openstack.org/#/c/488254/
[01:51] <tomreyn> i'm not sure which open source LBs support this, but i would assume most L7 do.
[01:55] <drab> tomreyn: good point, will take another look at the config files/man pages, altho most of these LBs are advertised as L4, not L7
[01:58] <drab> oh, LVS has KTCPVS which is L7
[02:09] <drab> nope, all those solutions seem way more work to setup and maintain than the iptables trick with multiple virtual services
[02:10] <drab> there are some new L7 balancers like one from lyft, but they aren't even packaged
[06:01] <ah-donny> Hey all, Is there any cloud storage software for Ubuntu Servers that can used on my home network to communicate with Android, iOS, Linux and Windows machines
[06:28] <lordievader> Good morning
[12:21] <zul> icey: I think you got more breakage in the nova-lxd tree, its missing wsgi-intercept as a build dependency now
[12:21] <zul> in the test-requirements.txt
[12:22] <icey> zul saw that test failure :-/
[12:26] <ivoks> zul ! :)
[12:26] <zul> ivoks: heylo
[12:28] <ivoks> how are you?
[12:37] <zul> I'm good how are you
[12:41] <icey> zul: this one is piled on behind your tracebnack fix: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/488403/1
[12:42] <zul> icey:  yeah I think you are going to have more problems though but it could be just me I think
[12:42] <icey> zul at least it passes tox with your commit and mine ;-)
[12:43] <zul> icey: coolio
[13:28] <xpistos> Hi all. I am currently running Ubuntu 16.04.02. How do I upgrade my server to the most current rev? I thought apt-get dist-upgrade would take care of that
[13:29] <rbasak> xpistos: what do you want to upgrade to?
[13:29] <xpistos> rbasak: isn't 16.04.04 out ?
[13:30] <rbasak> No, it's not.
[13:30] <rbasak> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseSchedule
[13:30] <ogra_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseSchedule
[13:30] <ogra_> *snap*
[13:31] <xpistos> ok. Thanks
[13:31] <ogra_> funny ... .4 isnt even on there
[13:32] <xpistos> I thought i saw it was out but thanks for that page!
[13:33] <xpistos> So when a point rev gets released then am I correct that dist-upgrade will install that?
[13:33] <ogra_> yes
[13:34] <rbasak> Point releases are just roll ups of all updates released up to that point, together with some installer changes.
[13:34] <rbasak> If you're installing updates regularly, then upgrading to a point release is effectively a no-op for you anyway.
[13:35] <rbasak> (installer defaults can change though, such as the hardware enablement stack, which you need to opt in to if upgrading; but there's no point usually if everything works since by definition you don't need hardware enablement updates then)
[13:48] <zul> icey: you have problems with the wsgi-intercept fix
[13:51] <icey> zul and we're running a tempest test for dvsm that isn't passing :-/
[13:51] <zul> icey: *sigh*
[16:26] <DammitJim> oh man, I'm about to get bashed... I've been asked to set up an Ubuntu Server 16.04 with Unity
[16:26] <DammitJim> however, stubborn me doesn't want to install everything that comes with ubuntu-desktop
[16:26] <DammitJim> so, I did the no-install-recommends
[16:26] <DammitJim> however, I am having a very hard time configuring rdp to this desktop
[16:27] <DammitJim> do you guys have any pointers as to how to configure rdp for unity? I got it to work with xfce
[17:55] <android> how to install held packages
[17:57] <android> held because no verification gpg key
[17:59] <genii> Add the key.
[17:59] <android> I don't have it.
[18:00] <android> where can the propesed key be found in the package info?
[18:02] <android> it is going to call for a key id such as 0xFFFFFF right?
[18:03] <android> --ignore-hold didn't work
[18:04] <android> apt-get info <package>?
[18:29] <android> where can the proposed key be found in the package info?
[18:33] <nacc> android: the key is from the repository that hosts the package (if I understand what you are saying)
[18:33] <android> this is an old version
[18:34] <android> does old-versions have a signer key?
[18:34] <android> is the release upgrade going to need a new key?
[18:35] <android> this is planned for upgrade to system76
[18:37] <android> nacc the virtex shader graphics need to go
[18:38] <android> the website says the old version can be upgraded using do release upgrade
[18:39] <android> nacc you did well with an on target observation however support is taking too long
[18:40] <android> you just dont have enough energy to be support
[18:40] <android> find a new job
[18:41] <android> it doesnt need to take hours to formulate a response
[18:42] <android> do something like production line sorter
[18:42] <android> sort beans or somethinb
[18:46] <android> ok nacc
[18:47] <android> ok nacc?
[19:30] <hashwagon> Help meh, Ubuntu 16.04 system most commands result in Segmentation fault. How do I reboot this system? sudo doesn't seem to work either. Logged in as sudo user now.
[19:30] <hashwagon> It's a remote system so Ctrl+Alt+Delete isn't very accessible.
[19:31] <sarnold> you may be able to use echo something > /proc/sysrq-trigger
[19:31] <sarnold> of course the defaults for what can be done via the sysrq-trigger are pretty limited; I can't recall off-hand what is allowed vs not allowed
[19:32] <sarnold> the sysrq-trigger file takes the same commands as the sysrq key on the keyboard
[19:32] <sarnold> so u to umount, s to sync, b to boot, etc. I always used sync sync umount boot when doing a sysrq shutdown..
[19:32] <sdeziel> sound advise but IIRC, writting to sysrq-trigger requires root
[19:33] <sarnold> oh sigh I thought that was a sudo shell :/ not just sudo user. uh. that's not ideal.
[19:34] <hashwagon> Permission denied on echo to proc
[19:34] <hashwagon> cannot sudo echo
[19:35] <sdeziel> last time I ran into such situation was when I was wiping the root fs ... I hope you are no facing a similar situation
[19:35] <hashwagon> There's some keyboard command I thought could be used to reboot, not sure if that works remotely though..
[19:36] <sarnold> it might; that'd be the sysrq key; I think I heard some systems can let you send a break command to trigger it
[19:36] <sdeziel> hashwagon: for a remote system that's what the sysrq-trigger file is for but as you noticed, you need to be root to use it
[19:42] <sdeziel> hashwagon: I'd probably take a look at dmesg (if that works) just to know what's up with the machine. Regarding the reboot, there is AFAIK no way for a regular user to trigger one remotely
[20:01] <JanC> otherwise would be disastrous on any shared system  :)
[20:36] <gunix> hey guys. where was i supposed to open ticket to get the packagers to add an openstack cinder version to the package list?
[20:36] <ahasenack> nacc: hey, am I using git ubuntu lint correctly here: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/25192910/ ?
[20:37] <ahasenack> nacc: $(pwd) is a clone of https://git.launchpad.net/~powersj/ubuntu/+source/mongodb branch fix-1584431-xenial
[20:37] <nacc> ahasenack: let me check
[20:37] <gunix> there is a big bug currently within openstack horizon on ubuntu server. when cinder is available, it doesn't allow any actions related to volumes. but it should. this was corrected with the latest dashboard patch. but it's not available. where can i open a ticket for this?
[20:37] <ahasenack> I did git remote add to add the pkg remote, then used that
[20:37] <ahasenack> before a git fetch pkg
[20:37] <ahasenack> er, after
[20:37] <ahasenack> anyway
[20:39] <ahasenack> gunix: against horizon itself perhaps?
[20:40] <ahasenack> the openstack-dashboard package in this case
[20:50] <nacc> ahasenack: fwiw, you shouldn't need to pass -d $(pwd), that's the default
[20:50] <ahasenack> ok
[20:51] <nacc> ahasenack: but still reproducing the issue (sorry network is a bit slow today for some reason)
[20:51] <ahasenack> it's Friday :)
[20:51] <nacc> ahasenack: hrm, locally (on a slightly differnet branch), i got all of them passed, let me recheck with master (need to stash some changes)
[20:52] <ahasenack> nacc: hm, they all passed now too
[20:52] <ahasenack> with or without -d
[20:52] <nacc> ahasenack: there were some fixes that went out, did the snap possibly refresh locally?
[20:52] <ahasenack> that would have been an amazing coincidence
[20:52] <nacc> ahasenack: yeah, it passes with master too
[20:52] <ahasenack> let me check the logs
[20:52] <nacc> ahasenack: :)
[20:53] <nacc> ahasenack: the linter isn't stateful, so i'm not sure why it would have changed the result otherwise
[20:53] <ahasenack> I see this from a couple of minutes ago
[20:53] <ahasenack> Jul 28 17:50:51 nsn7 git-ubuntu[7671]: cmd.go:118: DEBUG: restarting into "/snap/core/current/usr/bin/snap"
[20:53] <ahasenack> Jul 28 17:51:41 nsn7 git-ubuntu[7777]: cmd.go:118: DEBUG: restarting into "/snap/core/current/usr/bin/snap"
[20:53] <ahasenack> not sure yet what it means
[20:53] <ahasenack> but there is "git-ubuntu" in it :)
[20:54] <ahasenack> snap info has an old timestamp (many hours ago) for "refreshed"
[20:55] <ahasenack> well, it's working
[20:55] <nacc> ahasenack: yeah, i'm really not sure on that
[20:55] <nacc> ahasenack: but yeah, all i can say is the linter seems to be passing in my testing
[20:56] <ahasenack> even the hash in the last "git checkout" line is still the same
[20:56] <ahasenack> so yeah
[20:56] <ahasenack> let's ignore this
[20:56] <nacc> :)
[21:27] <gunix> ahasenack no, they already released the package. ubuntu has to add it to the repos
[21:32] <ahasenack> gunix: you mean they made a new source tarball release, and ubuntu has to grab it, or just backport the fix
[21:40] <gunix> yes, 11.0.3 was released but we still have 11.0.2: https://paste.gnome.org/psldpujzk
[22:39] <drab> urm, I'm trying to implement that return address thing with policy routing and it seems ip route default doesn
[22:39] <drab> 't like eth0:1
[22:39] <drab> anybody has seen that before?
[22:40] <sarnold> I don't know if the iproute2 utilities handle aliases well
[22:40] <sarnold> afterall not needing aliases any more was one of their advertising points :)
[22:40] <drab> mmmh, how would I be assigning a new ip to the same interface then?
[22:42] <drab> it seems you can do it with the ip utilities, however in network/interfaces the only supported syntax seems ethX:X kind of thing
[22:42] <sarnold> ip addr add <IP_ADDRESS> dev eth0 kind of thing
[22:43] <sarnold> true /etc/network/interfaces is twenty year old cruft :( gotta use up and down scripts there to use ip or add ipv6 to nics or whaetever
[22:43] <drab> yeah that worked (the ip addr, retrying the policy routing bit now)
[22:44] <sarnold> thankfully something better is coming https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2017-June/001215.html
[22:45] <drab> is that systemd-networkd? :P
[22:45] <sarnold> netplan
[22:45] <drab> oh, never heard of netplan, thanks for sharing
[22:45] <drab> yeah , just clicked the link
[22:45] <drab> will read up, thanks
[22:47] <drab> nope, still not working
[22:47] <drab> I'm trying to dig as a test and it complains that "reply from unexpected source"
[22:47] <drab> which is the ip of eth0
[22:47] <drab> maybe I'm messing up the PR part...
[22:51] <sarnold> drab: hrm, that reminds me a bit of
[22:51] <sarnold> arp_filter from https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/networking/ip-sysctl.txt
[23:01] <drab> sarnold: good idea, but still having the same problem :/
[23:02] <drab> net.ipv4.conf.all.arp_filter = 1
[23:04] <sarnold> drab: and the source routing, I've never needed to know owto do that, did you set that up as the lartc guide recommended?
[23:05] <drab> yeah, and then also found this: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/4420/reply-on-same-interface-as-incoming/23345#comment476516_23345
[23:05] <drab> which is basically confirming the same thing
[23:06] <sarnold> wow cool
[23:06] <sarnold> so that's what the separate routing tables are for :) not only containers
[23:07] <drab> what about containers?
[23:08] <drab> btw I'm in a container... I guess I should test this on the bare host just in case
[23:08] <sarnold> I've seen the multiple routing tables used with containers before but knew they long predated containers..
[23:08] <drab> I actually use that very lartc stuff on the gateway
[23:08] <drab> to balance 2 upstreams
[23:08] <drab> and works just fine
[23:09] <android> what junk are you making now?
[23:10] <android> --ignore-hold doesn't work
[23:10] <drab> I'm building a bed, a table and a shelf unit out of 2by4 and plywood
[23:10] <drab> oh, maybe wrong channel?
[23:10] <android> drab now that isnt junk
[23:11] <drab> you should see my table saw :P
[23:11] <drab> and what the output is :...(
[23:11] <drab> but it works and it's cheap
[23:12] <drab> plus hacking and hammering stuff together is the only way I can preserve sanity from working with computers... :)
[23:12] <drab> woodworking as therapy ftw
[23:12] <sarnold> sounds like you could use a lathe
[23:13] <sarnold> doesn't matter if you actually want any lathed output. but it's hypnotic and makes a mess and smells good.
[23:13] <drab> a lathe would be nice. and a jointer
[23:13] <drab> lol
[23:13] <sarnold> jointer would be more useful perhaps
[23:13] <drab> msot of the 2by4 I get are just about ready to build arches...
[23:14] <android> cover it with paint
[23:14] <drab> I still don't quite get how a jointer is going to fix that tho, if a piece of wood is bent and you pass it through a jointer at most you get uneven thickness
[23:14] <android> clear paint
[23:14] <drab> which doesn't seem useful even if it "looks
[23:14] <drab> " flat
[23:15] <drab> anyway, need to figure out this ip route thing first :/
[23:16] <android> ip route?
[23:16] <android> what of it?
[23:18] <drab> I'm migrating services from some old hw into containers
[23:19] <drab> and during the transition I need the container to have its new and final ip + the current hw's ip
[23:19] <drab> so that clients still using the old ip will work during transition
[23:19] <android> containers?
[23:19] <nacc> drab: won't they see two hosts responding to the same IP?
[23:19] <drab> however if I just add the hw's ip to the container replies will come through the container's primary ip and the client will discard them
[23:19] <android> amazon junk?
[23:19] <drab> nacc: the hw will go down as soon as I have this working
[23:19] <nacc> drab: i'm assuming there are more details being glossed :)
[23:20] <nacc> drab: ah sure
[23:20] <drab> so I flip the rule on and unplug the cable to the hw
[23:20] <nacc> drab: yep, that makes sense
[23:20] <drab> but right now I'm testing on a box and can't get it to work
[23:20] <drab> testbox*
[23:20] <drab> android: lxc containers
[23:21] <drab> they have a bunch of old hw (desktops) which fail a lot so I've been migrating all their stuff into a server grade piece of hw running lxc
[23:23] <android> drab where do you work?
[23:24] <android> it looks like I am being targetes by the app devels
[23:24] <android> when I install an app they start updating
[23:25] <android> I have plans on pulling source code for apps
[23:25] <android> when they update they change the code
[23:43] <drab> mmmh this is both interesting, useful and annoying
[23:43]  * drab scratches head
[23:43] <drab> so now unbound works
[23:43] <drab> but none of the policy routing stuff was needed
[23:44] <drab> all the examples I'm finding were using multiple nics/interfaces so I'm wondering if just one and a secondary address that just doesn't work for some reason
[23:45] <drab> what I had to change was the ip unbound listened on... using <IP_ADDRESS> created the routing/src ip issue
[23:45] <drab> but if I explicitly set it to listen on primary and secondary ip then it works just fine
[23:45] <drab> which makes sense I guess...
[23:46] <sarnold> drab: curious. very curious.
[23:46] <drab> on the other hand for example ssh does not seem to have a problem whatsover... set to listen on <IP_ADDRESS> but connections through the secondary ip work just fine
[23:46] <sarnold> <IP_ADDRESS> is probably not ideal for a dns server anyway
[23:47] <nacc> heh
[23:48] <drab> it's internal only with all wan traffic fw'ed so not a big of a deal and it saves me having more config tasks to handle, but I hear you
[23:58] <drab> fw'ed in hindsight was probably the wrong way to shorten firewalled :)
[23:58] <drab> anyway, all done and working \o/
[23:58] <drab> thanks all for the support, as usual nothing beats bouncing ideas around
[23:59] <sarnold> drab: sweer! :D
[23:59] <sarnold> sweet too.
[23:59] <sarnold> heh
[23:59] <nacc> sweer!
[23:59] <nacc> sarnold: i like it
[23:59] <drab> sweer... sweet beer! lol


[01:05]  * Eickmeyer just linked Ubuntu Studio Installer on the front page of the website
[01:43] <Eickmeyer> !ubuntustudio-installer
[01:43] <Eickmeyer> And now it's on the website.
[05:51] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: I wouldn't worry about that bug report. Some people want to argue with the developers because "They Know Better (tm)".
[05:51] <Eickmeyer> Unrelated: I think I've gotten to the bottom of the issue with Calamares screwing-up the audio perms in legacy BIOS machines.
[05:51] <Eickmeyer> Should know for tomorrow's daily.
[14:28] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: I just wanted to confirm the -menu install had happened correctly (it has). I have tried doing bug reports about includes before and the responce I have got has been a brush off
[14:28] <OvenWerks> so I have done as much as I can
[14:41] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Yeah, I don't think that person understands what -menu actually does. They referred to a "missing menu". It is going to devolve into a support request, so it's still invalid.
[14:42] <OvenWerks> actually a bug report against the DE
[14:42] <OvenWerks> but I think not worth it
[14:44] <Eickmeyer> Right, it'll go unnoticed. Really, it depends on which menu you're using in MATE if it's going to honor XDG. The newer ones don't very well, the original one does.
[17:21] <Eickmeyer> Success: All new installations of Ubuntu Studio, whether legacy BIOS or UEFI, have correct user audio permissions by default. Andy fixes from here on out for Calamares will be purely cosmetic.
[17:25] <Eickmeyer> s/Andy/Any
[17:51] <OvenWerks> I will download and check here too
[18:12] <OvenWerks> is there any fixes to the iso live stuff? or should I expect trouble still?
[18:32] <OvenWerks> iso live boot still borked
[18:36] <OvenWerks> there is a new dialog pops up saying you should use a gpt or something like that
[18:37] <OvenWerks> The slide show looks nice BTW
[18:38] <OvenWerks> there are no hard links in the slide show like in the old slideshow last page. That is probably a good thing as the user can not bookmark it anyway
[18:39] <OvenWerks> The menu already has those things
[18:40] <OvenWerks> I think the install instructions (whatever they are called) should have something (even a link) to explain this new partition they want people to install.
[18:42] <OvenWerks> merely having a dialog pop up and say "hey this is a good thing" doesn't really cut it.
[18:49] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: the live iso still hangs on shutdown, can only boot with safe mode (even with intel graphics only). I think these are major stumbling blocks. Is this a problem with all the ISOs?
[18:50] <OvenWerks> Ack! and the terminal steals my screen short cuts :P
[18:59] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: confirm the installing user has RT rights
[19:02]  * OvenWerks adds konsole to favourites
[19:22] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Yes, the live ISO hangs at shutdown, seems to be a livecd-rootfs or casper issue (so problem with all ISOs).
[19:22] <Eickmeyer> The GPT thing only applies to EFI, so it's just a warning. If EFI doesn't apply to you, GPT doesn't either.
[19:23] <Eickmeyer> Can't do hardlinks in the slideshow. It's image ony.
[19:24] <Eickmeyer> The install instructions? It all seems pretty clear at the partitioning section.
[19:52] <Eickmeyer> I'm just going to silence myself in main because I can't do anything right.
[19:53] <eylul[m]> what happened?
[19:55] <Eickmeyer> They got upset when I told them we can't support what they're doing.
[19:55] <Eickmeyer> Accused me of having attitude when I was just giving straight facts.
[19:58] <eylul[m]> I am not seeing the backlog but.. I see
[19:59] <eylul[m]> I am a firm believer that devs shouldn't be doing tech support feels guilty about not being able to step in for that
[20:01] <Eickmeyer> Nobody will step-up. I just need to reign-back my role from helping to just being a moderator when things go bad.
[20:01] <eylul> *nods*
[20:03] <Eickmeyer> Maybe people will step-up and help each other if I keep my mouth shut.
[20:13] <OvenWerks> having a really good lowlatency machine requires the one with physical access to the machine to have some basic computer hardware knowlage, I think.
[20:13] <OvenWerks> PCs are not designed for lowlatency anything.
[20:14] <Eickmeyer> Well, they're asking advanced stuff but showing zero skill in accomplishing their tasks.
[20:14] <OvenWerks> the user has to be willing to owrk aroun d those limitations... but also needs to be willing to find out what they are on that machine
[20:17] <Eickmeyer> Yep, but this particular one wants their hand held. And they're in #ubuntu right now doing the same thing and getting angry when people aren't giving them the answer they want.
[20:17] <OvenWerks> if I don't feel I can hand hold someone who appears to need it, I remain silent... they will go away...
[20:29]  * Eickmeyer needs to stay silent more often
[20:29] <Eickmeyer> eylul: The logs seem to have updated: https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/latest/%23ubuntustudio.html


[00:28] <chris38home_> marcoceppi, don't seem on precise
[00:28] <marcoceppi> chris38home_: It might not be available yet then
[00:30] <chris38home_> is it a way in a bundle to say --to lxc:0 ?
[00:47] <hazmat> cjohnston, pong
[17:33] <imhotep> hello, how do I update code after I deploy with juju ?
[17:35] <JoshStrobl> imhotep: Are you referring to Charms that you have created and wishing to update, charms you've deployed with Juju that aren't yours?
[17:35] <marcoceppi> imhotep: which code, the charm or the software?
[17:39] <JoshStrobl> marcoceppi: Lemme tell you, setting up vagrant and grabbing the Vagrant box for Ubuntu Server w/ Juju is sooooo much easier than manually setting up my own VM :D
[17:40] <marcoceppi> JoshStrobl: yeah, that's why we pursued that in the first place, we really should promote it more
[17:40] <JoshStrobl> marcoceppi: That said, out of curiousity, any reason why LXC is being promoted without using some nice abstraction layer like Docker (since with Docker you can have a Dockerfile that sets everything up as well)
[17:41] <marcoceppi> JoshStrobl: well, because juju talks to LXC directly, there's no need to use an abstraction layer like docker
[17:41] <marcoceppi> juju /is/ docker in this case, only docker + much more
[17:41] <marcoceppi> and the charm is the dockerfile
[17:41] <imhotep> JoshStrobl, marcoceppi: software. I believe charm will be frozen since it works (I know there is an upgrade-charm)
[17:41] <marcoceppi> in very /very/ loose terms
[17:41] <hazmat> imhotep, upgrade-charm
[17:42] <imhotep> basically I want to trigger config-changed to force an update
[17:42] <hazmat> imhotep, or for software installed by charm, it should ideally have a config option
[17:42] <marcoceppi> imhotep: it depends on the charm, but some expose a version configuraiton option which allows you to move between versions of the deployed software
[17:42] <JoshStrobl> marcoceppi: I suppose but until LXC is really the more promoted method, things are going to be virtualized using Vagrant + VirtualBox, which isn't as "bare-metal" as LXC
[17:42] <hazmat> JoshStrobl, because juju and its lxc support pre-date docker by quite a while
[17:43] <imhotep> ok it sounds like the one I am using doesn't have that ( I am using the nodejs one)
[17:43] <marcoceppi> JoshStrobl: the vagrant box simply starts an Ubuntu machine with Juju, LXC, and the local provider enabled
[17:43] <imhotep> it has a crontab option that updates code on frequent basis (if user sets it)
[17:43] <JoshStrobl> marco: I see.
[17:43] <marcoceppi> imhotep: ah, yeah, that doesn't really have a version config, you'll need to use the crontab config
[17:44] <marcoceppi> JoshStrobl: it's the simplist solution to "how do I support LXC on Mac and Windows"
[17:44] <imhotep> which means I can't really control right ? crontab would fetch latest code every n seconds/minutes/...
[17:45] <marcoceppi> imhotep: yes, there is work being done on the nodejs charm to make it more responsive to users
[17:45] <imhotep> ah cool
[17:45] <JoshStrobl> marcoceppi: Of course, since Vagrant is multi-platform, unlike Docker (LXC) which is just now getting Mac support. Not that I have anything against Vagrant, seems to accomplish the same as Docker with some quirks (and Vagrantfile syntax is more complex).
[17:46] <marcoceppi> Just like juju + LXC, Vagrant also pre-dates Docker ;)
[17:47] <JoshStrobl> But yea, I was just curious. Figured it never hurts to ask questions, learn along the way and maybe use that knowledge in the future.
[17:47] <marcoceppi> but yeah, we only use the Vagrant box to spin up an Ubuntu machine so you can use juju + LXC
[17:47] <hazmat> JoshStrobl, where do you see docker getting mac support?
[17:47] <JoshStrobl> uno momento
[17:48] <JoshStrobl> http://docs.docker.io/en/latest/installation/mac/
[17:48] <JoshStrobl> It's really recent
[17:48] <JoshStrobl> http://blog.docker.io/2014/02/docker-0-8-quality-new-builder-features-btrfs-storage-osx-support/
[17:48] <hazmat> JoshStrobl, that's just downloading a linux a vm to run lxc/docker in
[17:49] <JoshStrobl> hazmat: Yes and Vagrant utilizes VirtualBox as well to run lxc, not much different.
[17:50] <hazmat> JoshStrobl, yes.. there both using vagrant.. i though you meant some form of native support
[17:50] <hazmat> docker notionally has mentioned they'd like to support other containers then lxc
[17:50] <hazmat> er.. s/vagrant/virtualbox
[17:50] <JoshStrobl> hazmat: Native support in Mac OS X for Linux tech? Haha, don't we all wish? :P
[17:51] <hazmat> JoshStrobl, well.. solaris have zones, freebsd have jails.. osx has some support for chroots
[17:52] <hazmat> and is based on freebsd userspace.. ie tools like jailkit
[17:52] <hazmat> not quite the same though
[17:53] <marcoceppi> hazmat: seems like they'd just have the "providers" as plugins like Vagrant, so you can say run against X container and just abstract an API for provider plugin
[17:55] <cjohnston> hazmat: hey! question for ya.. IIRC you had recommended to us that for our automated testing we don't destroy the bootstrap node for speed.. we have been doing that, however after making a change to one of our charms we started to get errors with our testing.. it appeared as though we were using a cached charm for deployment or something.. if we killed the bootstrap node and then redeplyed the tests ran with no
[17:55] <cjohnston> errors. is this expected?
[17:55] <hazmat> cjohnston, hmm..
[17:55] <hazmat> cjohnston, so your modifying the charm without incrementing the version?
[17:56] <cjohnston> hazmat: possibly. I don't know if the version changed or not
[17:56] <hazmat> cjohnston, yeah.. juju will internally cache the charm with the given revision
[17:56] <hazmat> cjohnston, i filed a bug for this in the api fwiw https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1194880
[17:56] <cjohnston> hazmat: so if we changed the charm version number it should have worked
[17:57] <hazmat> cjohnston, yeah.. you can also deploy with -u which will do it for you
[17:57] <cjohnston> cool. thanks
[17:59] <marcoceppi> hazmat: I thought -u only worked on local?
[18:00] <hazmat> marcoceppi, that's true, but how else would the charm change without a revision increment
[18:00] <marcoceppi> hazmat: juju deploy --repository . local:<charm> and not bump the revision file?
[18:00] <hazmat> marcoceppi, that's what -u is for
[18:01] <marcoceppi> OH local charm, I thought it only worked on local provider
[18:01] <marcoceppi> I got my locals mixed up
[18:02] <hazmat> marcoceppi, no worries.. so digital ocean plugin is looking good.. if your up for testing.. one issue thats preventing release is the precise images there need some massage before use.
[18:02] <marcoceppi> hazmat: I'm always down for testing
[18:06] <hazmat> marcoceppi, oh.. it also needs a one-line patch against core to fix a bug in manual provider (https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1280432) .. latest is pushed to https://github.com/kapilt/juju-digitalocean
[18:06] <marcoceppi> hazmat: I'll go ahead and compile juju then
[18:09] <hazmat> marcoceppi, cool, thanks.. i'll try to plug away at the precise image issues. basically they need an apt-get update/upgrade cycle before juju talks to the machine.
[18:09] <hazmat> i've been keeping away from the juju api client so far, but it would be the easiest way to resolve this.
[18:14] <marcoceppi> hazmat: well, shouldn't the manual provider do that?
[18:14] <hazmat> marcoceppi, no.. it tries not to perturb machines without cause.
[18:14] <marcoceppi> ah
[18:16] <hazmat> marcoceppi, the api for manual provisioning it has some knobs around package install (which i use for my fast lxc provider) but this one is needed a bit earlier in the install cycle.
[18:16] <hazmat> mostly the providers rely on cloudinit behavior here
[19:24] <lazyPower> hazmat: is the plugin currently available in pip?
[19:24] <hazmat> lazyPower, not yet.. just registered it :-)
[19:25] <lazyPower> I didn't think so :) just confirming. Following along at home through the readme
[19:25] <hazmat> lazyPower, it works welll enough for 13.04/13.10 atm, but till it solid on precise there's not much point to pushing it
[19:25] <hazmat> lazyPower, still in pre-release atm
[19:25] <lazyPower> right. I'm a saucy user
[19:25] <lazyPower> so i'll clone it and go from there
[19:25] <hazmat> lazyPower, well its more about the instances then the client version
[19:25] <hazmat> lazyPower, there aren't many charms for non-precise in the official charms.
[19:25] <lazyPower> oh, you mean their images. Ok
[19:26] <lazyPower> right
[19:26] <lazyPower> well its easy enough to pull a precise image, change the series and do a local charm deployment
[19:27] <hazmat> lazyPower, for a power user like yourself :-) sure... but goal is end users.
[19:28] <lazyPower> thats, quite possibly the nicest thing anyone has ever said tome
[19:28] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: buy this guy a beer for me.
[19:28] <hazmat> marcoceppi, they have this awesome beer on tap @ lost dogs.. abraxis :-)
[19:29] <marcoceppi> hazmat: I guess we'll have to go drink up again soon
[19:29] <lazyPower> We should do a drinkup soonish
[20:27] <hazmat> marcoceppi, lazyPower if you have DO support accounts, i'd appreciate an upvote on http://digitalocean.uservoice.com/forums/136585-digitalocean/suggestions/5524786-update-ubuntu-12-04-3-images-to-12-0-4-4
[20:27] <marcoceppi> you have my votes
[20:28] <lazyPower> hazmat: all 3 of mine just joined the choir
[20:58] <hazmat> marcoceppi, lazyPower precise issue fixed in client provider.. and behold.. wordpress charm running on DO http://<IP_ADDRESS>/
[20:59] <lazyPower> nice!
[20:59] <marcoceppi> huzzah
[21:00] <hazmat> pushed latest, and taking a break
[21:19] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: you going to be around in about 10 mins? I think I found the issue with mysql need someone to test
[21:19] <lazyPower> yep
[21:35] <hazmat> marcoceppi, lazyPower confirmed btw that the do provider should work with the dev ppa version of juju 1.17.2 .. but needs --upload-tools on juju docean bootstrap
[21:35] <lazyPower> hazmat: i'll be on my desktop rig in about 20 minutes and i'll try my hand at bootstrapping
[21:37] <marcoceppi> hazmat: sweet, I'll give it a go after getting the mysql charm patch up
[21:50] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: you pushing those changes to GH? LP is going offline in 10 minutes.
[21:50] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: already pushed
[21:50] <lazyPower> branching now
[21:50] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: https://code.launchpad.net/~marcoceppi/charms/precise/mysql/actually-start-mysql/+merge/206597
[21:51] <marcoceppi> hazmat: I get a missing api creds even though i have a ~/.juju/docean.conf
[21:51] <hazmat> marcoceppi, updated the readme.. only env vars at the moment
[21:51] <marcoceppi> oh, hah, cool
[21:52] <hazmat> also dropped a release on pypi so the readme should work..
[21:52] <marcoceppi> hazmat: huh, still not working
[21:53] <hazmat> marcoceppi, pastebin?
[21:53] <marcoceppi> hazmat: sure, what would you like?
[21:53] <hazmat> marcoceppi, just command and output
[21:54] <marcoceppi> hazmat: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6939820/
[21:55] <hazmat> marcoceppi, hmm.. and values look sane if you do $ env | grep DO_
[21:55] <hazmat> the DO_CLIENT_ID should be the short string
[21:57] <marcoceppi> hazmat: apparently just sourcing the conf wasn't enough, I had to export each line
[21:57] <marcoceppi> now I get this http://paste.ubuntu.com/6939829/
[21:57] <marcoceppi> did a git pull and install for latest
[21:58] <hazmat> marcoceppi, hmm.. argh.. that's probably a delta from the old dop client and the current api it has in github trunk.
[21:59] <hazmat> marcoceppi, i'm going to resolve i think my just having a separate do client internal to the plugin, but for now.. resolution is grab a copy of https://github.com/ahmontero/dop and run python setup.py develop in it
[21:59] <hazmat> or python setup.py install
[22:02] <hazmat> or maybe i should switch out to the other python digital ocean client lib
[22:06] <hazmat> fwiw here's some relative timing and usage for bootstrap + add-machine http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6939864/
[22:06] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: success on the mysql charm in HP, checking local and amazon now
[22:10] <marcoceppi> hazmat: bootstrap still fails even with latest dop
[22:11] <marcoceppi> using what's in the git repo
[22:12] <hazmat> marcoceppi, same error?
[22:12] <marcoceppi> hazmat: yeah
[22:12]  * marcoceppi digs a bit
[22:12] <hazmat> marcoceppi, you may have to kill the other dop that got installed to /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/
[22:12] <hazmat> marcoceppi, surprised your not using virtualenv..
[22:13] <marcoceppi> hazmat: I still haven't gotten used to virtual env
[22:13] <marcoceppi> I just setup.py install stuff, then blow away /usr/local/... when I get tired of it
[22:14] <marcoceppi> though I might try venv next
[22:14] <hazmat> marcoceppi, aha.. sorry i see the issue
[22:14] <hazmat> marcoceppi, unset DO_SSH_KEY
[22:15] <marcoceppi> hazmat: ah, I still have to switch to null provider?
[22:15] <marcoceppi> errrr manual provider
[22:15] <hazmat> marcoceppi, yes.. whatever env your pointing to must be a null/manual provider
[22:17] <marcoceppi> hazmat: so what should the environments.yaml stanza look like?
[22:17] <hazmat> marcoceppi, see readme
[22:17] <marcoceppi> nvm, found the readme
[22:17] <marcoceppi> okay, moving now
[22:19] <hazmat> marcoceppi, cool.. also -v gives quite a bit more  output then the default.. which is terse
[22:19] <marcoceppi> hazmat: good to know
[22:20] <marcoceppi> hazmat: if bootstrap fails, it should capture that failure and destroy the instance it spun up
[22:21] <hazmat> marcoceppi, noted. also if bootstrap fails. you have to manually kill a directory.. boot-$envname in $JUJU_HOME
[22:21]  * hazmat files bugs
[22:21] <marcoceppi> hazmat: yeah, just found that :)
[22:21] <marcoceppi> hazmat: you tracking bugs on gh? I can start putting those there as I find them
[22:22] <hazmat> marcoceppi, yup
[22:22] <hazmat> marcoceppi, https://github.com/kapilt/juju-digitalocean/issues/
[22:23] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: as soon as launchpad comes back i'll +1 approve the MP. Works on all the providers I have access to.
[22:23] <lazyPower> great work
[22:23] <stokachu> has there been any interest in perl bindings for juju?
[22:24] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: are you verifying that /usr/bin/mysqld is running on each stand up?
[22:24] <lazyPower> i am
[22:26] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: standup, validate service is active, add relational charm mediawiki and wordpress
[22:26] <hazmat> stokachu, not really.. but if scratches an itch i'd say go for it.. although.. the ideal client technically would be callback or poe based for perl.
[22:26] <lazyPower> all of the above completed without issue
[22:26] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: oh, nice
[22:26] <marcoceppi> \o/
[22:26] <stokachu> hazmat: ive got a non-blocking library i started
[22:26] <hazmat> stokachu, not idiomatic though.. the websocket is async bidi..
[22:26] <hazmat> stokachu, cool
[22:27] <marcoceppi> I mean, it's not really a fix more than it is a huge bandaid until the re-write
[22:27] <stokachu> hazmat: https://github.com/battlemidget/perl-juju
[22:27] <stokachu> im basically using your api calls as starting point
[22:27] <lazyPower> stokachu: epic github handle
[22:27] <stokachu> but its async
[22:27] <stokachu> lazyPower: haha thank you :)
[22:28] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: I feel like I should go back and add percona tests to some of the charms i've written amulet tests for after our standup on Friday
[22:28] <stokachu> hazmat: it uses anyevent which can interface with poe, ev etc
[22:28] <hazmat> stokachu, that still looks a bit fishy re the async bits
[22:28] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: really, the mysql charm needs to make sure percona supplies the exact things the interface for mysql implements
[22:28] <hazmat> stokachu, your doing sync on top of async loop expecting sync usage
[22:28] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: the burden is on the MySQL charm, not on other charms
[22:29] <hazmat> stokachu, afaics.. imagine do 5 calls in a row, and getting responses back in different order
[22:29] <stokachu> hazmat: thats what the $done = AnyEvent->condvar handles
[22:29] <stokachu> https://github.com/battlemidget/perl-juju/blob/master/lib/Juju/RPC.pm#L83-L94
[22:30] <hazmat> stokachu, yeah.. looking at it.. my perl .. is rusty :-) i generally pull out the camel book
[22:30] <stokachu> but its still in early stages so i could be missing soemthing
[22:30] <stokachu> so basically condvar handles each session separately
[22:31] <stokachu> so even though the calls may be out of order the data responds properly
[22:31] <stokachu> so far anyway
[22:31] <hazmat> stokachu, cool
[22:31] <stokachu> ive still got a lot to learn on event programming apparently
[22:32] <stokachu> hazmat: also understand the hybi-13 now
[22:32] <hazmat> stokachu, its why goroutines win
[22:32] <stokachu> hazmat: yea go does it right
[22:32] <stokachu> so much easier
[22:32] <hazmat> python gevent does okay.. but baked into the language makes things much nicer
[22:32] <stokachu> agreed
[22:32] <hazmat> s/gevent/greenle
[22:33] <stokachu> i like python tornado
[22:33] <stokachu> at least for understanding python events
[22:33] <hazmat> stokachu, also nice, but its callback with syntax sugar around yield as coroutine.. py3.4 asyncio is much the same.. tornado is nice though
[22:33] <hazmat> gui uses it to proxy intercept augment juju-api
[22:34] <stokachu> ah nice
[22:34] <stokachu> hazmat: do you think ill get lashes if i blog out the perl bindings at some point
[22:34] <stokachu> maybe when it reaches 1.0
[22:35] <hazmat> stokachu, lashes.. no way. code/results == good.. osource .. early and often :-)
[22:35] <stokachu> hazmat: hah ok cool
[22:36] <hazmat> stokachu, to quote gkh's response back to me on debating/patching kdbus.. "That's why the Linux kernel mailing list very rarely has "idea" discussions, real patches are what matters."
[22:36] <hazmat> s/patches/source
[22:36] <hazmat> for the same effect
[22:36] <stokachu> sweet
[22:37] <stokachu> i like that philosophy
[22:38] <hazmat> stokachu, so hyb13 vs rfc?... delta == ?
[22:38] <stokachu> hazmat: so i think hyb13 == rfc6455
[22:38] <stokachu> i was just confused on those versionings
[22:39] <hazmat> stokachu, yeah.. that's basically what i got out of it.. delta being grammatical/syntax on the way to publication afaics.
[22:39] <stokachu> the websocket library from go.net is rf6455/hybi13 compliant
[22:39] <stokachu> yea i read the diff between them
[22:39] <stokachu> and it was just grammatical stuff
[22:39] <hazmat> marcoceppi, any progress?
[22:40] <stokachu> what i dont get is how to check out what version of the libraries are used within juju
[22:40] <stokachu> it just points to p.google.com/go.net/websocket for example
[22:41] <hazmat> stokachu, godeps are a state of sadness.. juju-core implements its own dep rev mechanism
[22:41] <hazmat> its in dependencies.tsv in root dir of checkout of juju-core
[22:41] <stokachu> ah ok that helps
[22:44] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: http://blog.dasroot.net/juju-plugins-ahoy/
[22:46] <hazmat> lazyPower, so.. how do plugins install in that model.. if they have deps?
[22:46] <lazyPower> hazmat: we haven't gotten that far with the plan
[22:47] <lazyPower> the idea originally was to build an API service that works similar to npm that fetches the plugin, and the plugin registers the dependency chain
[22:47] <lazyPower> but with only 5 plugins to start, we haven't exactly got a need for something that complex
[22:47] <hazmat> lazyPower, there are dozens of plugins..
[22:47] <lazyPower> not in the juju/plugins repository
[22:47] <hazmat> lazyPower, then its not really the plugins repository is it
[22:47] <lazyPower> depends on your definition of a repository
[22:49] <lazyPower> One of the ideas I heard was to change it to an organization, and give each plugin their own repository, that way you could warehouse all the dependencies together. But the juju-plugin-plugin aims to solve some of those concerns.
[22:49] <hazmat> well a git repo by itself is just a name grab.. the need for more exists, the question is discovery.. minus the npm (cross-language arbitrary install) .. the easiest thing is to just document location via docs page on plugins imo.
[22:50] <lazyPower> thats cumbersome to update, and invalidate old plugins that are no longer useful as features get expanded in core
[22:50] <lazyPower> i disagree with it being "the easiest"
[22:51] <lazyPower> in the first run, yes. that would be insanely easy. When you have 50+ plugins - nope.
[22:51] <hazmat> lazyPower, the alternative you proposed was documenting them in that plugin repo.. which amounts to the same issue.
[22:51] <lazyPower> true, but this is step 1
[22:51] <marcoceppi> hazmat: if you plugins has deps, package it up like quickstart
[22:52] <hazmat> marcoceppi, again discovery is the question
[22:52] <marcoceppi> hazmat: I forsee having plugins in their own github repos soon, and a central registry which will likely have a way to know "how to install plugin"
[22:53] <marcoceppi> hazmat: yay, I deployed wordpress too
[22:53] <stokachu> is there a system path that searches for plugins or just ~/.juju-plugins?
[22:53] <hazmat> marcoceppi, YIPEE :-)
[22:53] <hazmat> stokachu, PATH for juju- prefix commands
[22:53] <marcoceppi> stokachu: plugins work as long as they're in PATH
[22:53] <hazmat> stokachu, juju help plugins
[22:54] <marcoceppi> this just adds ~/.juju-plugins to path
[22:54] <stokachu> ah ok reading now
[22:54] <hazmat> stokachu, only real req on them is --description return one liner .. the rest is per the executable logic.
[22:55] <stokachu> gotcha
[22:55] <marcoceppi> stokachu: and have a --help flag
[22:55] <hazmat> juj
[22:55] <hazmat> oops
[22:55] <stokachu> marcoceppi: ok
[22:56] <hazmat> marcoceppi, really that's a  best practice/suggestion.. not a req afaics
[22:56] <marcoceppi> hazmat: juju help <plugin> invokes it
[22:56] <hazmat> marcoceppi, cool, something new everyday :-)
[22:57] <hazmat> marcoceppi, re destroy error, you can rerun
[22:57] <hazmat> marcoceppi, i need to introduce a sleep or auto-retry there
[23:00] <hazmat> marcoceppi, did you ever find that biz card?
[23:00] <marcoceppi> hazmat: yeah, it's the one you've got
[23:00] <hazmat> ack.. bummer.. oh well hopefully more response with working code or via twitter
[23:07] <marcoceppi> hazmat: yeah, could berate over social media
[23:09] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: thanks, merged and should be in the store soon
[23:10] <lazyPower> awesome, now that i know LP is back online, just commited my approval review
[23:10] <lazyPower> Oh.. it stored it when they were in maintenance mode. thats nice to know it queues


[17:28] <ryanakca> newz2000: ping, what's the status of the feature tour?
[17:29] <newz2000> hey ryanakca, nothing yet, I have a meeting one week from today to discuss it w/ the design team
[17:29] <newz2000> ryanakca: why do you ask?
[17:39] <ryanakca> newz2000: for the Kubuntu website
[17:40] <newz2000> ah, ok. The design team is going to help me. We're going to have an "emergency fixes" sprint to fix some things that are important before the complete redesign which can't start until later in the year.
[17:40] <newz2000> The sprint is the week after next and will encompas three areas of the site, one being the feature tour
[17:45] <ryanakca> ok, so it'll be done at least a month and a bit before release?
[17:46] <newz2000> That's the plan
[17:54] <ryanakca> newz2000: lovely :)


[09:22] <alan_g> alf_: your "Needs Fixing" has been addressed. OK now? https://code.launchpad.net/~andreas-pokorny/mir/libinput-package/+merge/269534
[09:23] <alf_> alan_g: yes, (top) approved
[09:28] <alan_g> ta
[09:43] <jibel> anyone would know what the message in dbus.log means in bug 1496773 ? Is it a problem with mir ?
[09:44] <jibel> it started suddenly this morning and makes the device very slow
[09:44] <alan_g> jibel: mir itself doesn't do dbus
[09:46] <jibel> alan_g, the dbus message refers to mir, any idea how I can find the source that triggers this message?
[09:48] <jibel> davmor2, ^ when did the problem start?
[09:49] <alan_g> jibel: well the Mir message says that an application is trying to connect to an invalid prompt session.
[09:49] <davmor2> jibel, alan_g: this morning  uptime is in the paste-bin in the bug report,  I'd not seen any slow down till this morning
[09:51] <alan_g> greyback: any idea why ^^ gets passed to dbus?
[09:54] <greyback> alan_g: not a clue. does the SSO service somehow return it as an error to the dbus daemon?
[09:57] <greyback> jibel: could you attach unity8.log to that bug please?
[09:57] <jibel> greyback, all the logs are in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/1496773/+attachment/4466701/+files/logs.tar.xz
[09:58] <greyback> jibel: ah nice
[09:59] <alan_g> jibel: From Mir's POV when a prompt helper (the SSO) creates a prompt session it must identify the application. This is failing because Mir doesn't recognise the application (maybe it just exited). So the prompt session is rejected. No idea why failing to create a prompt session causes a dbus message (presumably from the SSO service).
[10:00] <greyback> unity8 is indeed reporting online-account-service is starting and then stopping. No suggestion unity8 is interfering with it.
[10:02] <jibel> alan_g, okay, thanks for the explanation.
[11:50] <dandrader> anpok, ping
[11:52] <anpok> pong
[11:54] <dandrader> anpok, https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1496814
[11:54] <dandrader> anpok, is that easy to fix?
[12:27] <anpok> dandrader: yes I think so...
[13:05] <tsdgeos> alf_: you there? i'm investigating fd leaks in uniy8 process and i'd need some help
[13:05] <alf_> tsdgeos: sure, how can I help?
[13:05] <tsdgeos> alf_: so the fd leaks i'm seeing now are of the type anon_inode:dmabuf
[13:06] <tsdgeos> do you know where/if in mir one of those might be created?
[13:06] <tsdgeos> maybe DMABufTextureBinder ?
[13:07] <tsdgeos> alf_: the leaks now happen only when the process is killed because of memory pressure
[13:07] <tsdgeos> i have as many leaked anon_inode:dmabuf as processes where killed my the memory pressure
[13:08] <tsdgeos> unfortunately strace doesn't seem to "see" the calls that allocate those fds
[13:09] <alf_> tsdgeos: these are fds backing buffer objects
[13:10] <alf_> tsdgeos: that's on the desktop right?
[13:10] <tsdgeos> alf_: no, phone
[13:10] <alf_> tsdgeos: hmm, then I guess that's not the graphics buffers
[13:11] <alf_> tsdgeos: so, DMABufTextureBinder is even there on the phone, it's in the mesa platform plugin
[13:11] <tsdgeos> is -> isn't ?
[13:12] <alf_> tsdgeos: "is *not* event there"
[13:12] <alf_> tsdgeos: right
[13:12] <tsdgeos> ok
[13:12] <tsdgeos> so it's not that :/
[13:12] <tsdgeos> alf_: do you have any idea what may be using dmabuf inotes?
[13:16] <alf_> tsdgeos: not really, it's a general cross-device/driver buffer sharing mechanism, I am only familiar with its use for graphics buffers
[13:16] <tsdgeos> ok, thanks
[13:16] <tsdgeos> i'll keep trying to find out who's creating it
[13:17] <alf_> tsdgeos: did you use strace -f , perhaps a subprocess is involved
[13:17] <tsdgeos> alf_: but a subprocess could not create fds on the unity8 process, no?
[13:18] <alf_> tsdgeos: right, thinko...
[13:21] <alf_> tsdgeos: which calls are you tracking with strace (or all calls)?
[13:21] <tsdgeos> alf_: all of them
[13:21] <tsdgeos> the thing is
[13:21] <tsdgeos> strace doesn't seem to be showing me the calls that create fds of dmabuf type
[13:22] <tsdgeos> since for example i have fd 240 shown in proc
[13:22] <tsdgeos> but the last time 240 shows up in the strace output
[13:22] <tsdgeos> it was because it was a pipe
[13:22] <tsdgeos> and was correctly closed
[13:24] <alf_> perhaps they are sent to unity8 with sendmsg, does strace show fds sent this way?
[13:24] <alf_> tsdgeos: ^^
[13:25] <tsdgeos> i do not know
[13:25] <tsdgeos> i'll check that thanks :)
[13:27] <alf_> tsdgeos: also, now I am reading that android has started using dmabuf internally, so perhaps we can't rule out these being part of graphics buffers
[13:28] <alf_> tsdgeos: (although at a lower level, which we don't access directly)
[13:28] <tsdgeos> right
[13:39] <alf_> tsdgeos: also, sometimes fd leaks are associated with memory leaks (classes holding fd resources internally, especially if the fd handling in the app is robust with RAII etc), so that's something to look out for in case the strace approach doesn't lead anywhere
[13:39] <tsdgeos> totally
[13:53] <kgunn> alf_: i rebooted about the time you were talking about android gfx possibly using dmabuf...curious if i missed anything
[13:55] <alf_> kgunn: nothing new since then
[14:18] <tsdgeos> so it's not sendmsg/receivemsg because it doesn't happen while starting apps
[14:32] <kgunn> tsdgeos: on this idea of closing apps, any chance you've looked at associated screen shots in spread
[14:32] <tsdgeos> kgunn: yeah getting there
[16:18] <alan_g> bschaefer: your vote is "blocking" this. Do you want to reconsider? https://code.launchpad.net/~mir-team/mir/attestable-timestamps-server/+merge/270457
[16:19] <bschaefer> alan_g, well i want to go through and fix the small things mentioned
[16:19] <bschaefer> o wait you pushed some changes :)
[16:20] <alan_g> bschaefer: just some small things
[16:20] <bschaefer> yeah those changes look good
[16:24] <bschaefer> anpok, braces of lambda functor? Should they be line or same line?
[16:24]  * bschaefer reading through mir style
[16:29] <bschaefer> alan_g, everything looks good to me, anything small can be fixed in later MPs
[16:29]  * bschaefer will have to re-do the client code but shouldnt be to hard
[16:29] <bschaefer> and will most likley need some changing around :)
[16:33]  * alan_g thinks bschaefer will need to change "override_the_cookie_factory(mir::cookie::Secret const& secret);" to "override_the_cookie_factory(Builder<> const& builder);" to capture the secret in the builder.
[16:34] <bschaefer> alan_g, well from what i understand you would store the secret before calling override
[16:35] <bschaefer> at lease thats how it was done before when we kept the secret around in tests/default_server_config
[16:35] <alan_g> Where would you get the first secret from?
[16:35] <bschaefer> yes that'll be different
[16:36] <alan_g> I think using a builder will solve it, and be more consistent with the rest of the API
[16:36] <alan_g> ymmv
[16:36] <bschaefer> right, just need to figure out what the builder is :)
[16:36] <bschaefer> yeah we are trying to predict the future, which is fine just not 100% sure how RAOF imagined using it
[16:37] <bschaefer> though this is a bit easier to predict how it *should* be used
[16:38] <anpok> alan_g: there is one thing in the device settings MP.. that I still ponder about.. what would be the best way to indicate whether a setting is applicable for a device..
[16:38] <zzarr> hello! I have a plan, to build a tablet/laptop 2-in-1 unit, I wish to use a strong SBC, I have looked att Hummingbird H88, wish have a A80 CPU
[16:38] <alan_g> [&]() -> std::shared_ptr<CookeFactory> { ... }
[16:38] <zzarr> do anyone know how "good" they are?
[16:39] <anpok> that A80 is an allwinner?
[16:39] <bschaefer> alan_g, cool, i see a lot of other examples in the code as well
[16:39] <zzarr> anpok, yes AllWinner A80 is correct
[16:39] <bschaefer> but mainly we pass in the way we want to build it (i guess?) Ill have to get a better understand once i attempt to implement it :)
[16:40] <anpok> zzarr: where do you get your drivers from? and do those drivers provide access to the hardware overlays?
[16:42] <alan_g> anpok: just pondering... Maybe you should be using a struct of optional fields?
[16:42] <zzarr> anpok, on the page it says that it supports Android 4.4.2 and Linux 3.4.39
[16:42] <anpok> alan_g: but struct might be more problematic for abi compilance?
[16:43] <zzarr> anpok, but that sounds old in my ears
[16:43] <alan_g> if we just add fields at the end it isn't much different to adding to vtab
[16:43] <alan_g> Well, if we disable creating in user code
[16:46] <zzarr> as it seams the source code for the SoC is open and some specifications http://linux-sunxi.org/images/1/10/A80_Datasheet_Revision_1.0_0404.pdf
[16:50] <anpok> zzarr: driver quality is essential...
[16:50] <anpok> i would look out for other projects that try to use it, and look for experiences..
[16:50] <zzarr> I know, I might have to use another SoC
[16:50] <zzarr> yepp
[16:51] <zzarr> I'll do that
[16:52] <anpok> zzarr: if you want to use mir you would have to use android drivers I guess..
[16:53] <anpok> i guess the stock imagination tec winsys drivers wont let .. hmm ..
[16:53] <anpok> that could be an interesting task.. not sure if the image tec winsys interface would allow you implement a mir platform ..
[16:54] <anpok> alan_g: hm ok I will give it a try .. it is kind of annoying that this seems to become a growing struct.. (or structs i could split them into devices classes..)
[16:55] <alan_g> anpok: I've not given it deep thought. Just been musing
[16:57] <zzarr> anpok, yes, but is it a problem that it's an old version of Android?
[17:53] <greyback_> bregma: can I have this added to your "sooner rather than later" list: https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1496814
[17:54] <bregma> greyback_, sure
[17:54] <greyback_> anpok: opinion would be appreciated, as that bug means our cursor handling code fails with trackpads
[18:07] <anpok> nope oh I should add my thoughts on what causes this..
[18:07] <anpok> -nope
[19:14] <mhall119> camako: ping
[19:15] <camako> mhall119, hi
[19:15] <mhall119> camako: hey, I just watched https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCsZ2jYUTqk very cool stuff
[19:15] <mhall119> I was wondering if qmlscene and QML apps can be run in a Mir on X window that way
[19:16] <mhall119> and if so, how to tell qmlscene to use Mir instead of X11
[19:17] <camako> mhall119, I haven't tried myself... Have you seen this? ---> https://plus.google.com/+MarcoTrevisan/posts/ZLWYfRMZWNG
[19:17] <mhall119> yes, I did, and I asked Trevinho about it already, trying to get mir_demo_server working on my laptop
[19:17] <mhall119> but I just want to run a single app, not all of Unity
[19:20] <camako> mhall119, TBH, I haven't looked into it yet.
[19:53] <Trevinho> mhall119: ah, if you only need an app, I think what's in wily should be enough to get that working
[19:53] <Trevinho> Since last Mir is needed only for unity
[21:21] <kgunn> Trevinho: that post is kick ass
[21:21] <Trevinho> :)


[15:32] <LocutusOfBorg> Unit193, did I smell debhelper backport?
[15:32] <LocutusOfBorg> I think we should do it! :)
[15:32] <LocutusOfBorg> care to open a bug against debhelper? happy to discuss/sponsor, we really need compat level 12 for bionic, now that Debian is widely using it
[17:02] <infinity> LocutusOfBorg: I don't see how it follows that Debian using 12 in unstable means our stable release needs it.
[18:48] <LocutusOfBorg> infinity, because some developers are using bionic as their base os...
[18:48] <LocutusOfBorg> and you can't even create a dsc or changes without the required compat 12...
[18:48] <LocutusOfBorg> so, not even able to create something to upload in a ppa or pbuilder
[18:48] <LocutusOfBorg> I manually backported it in my laptop, but still, I need it for e.g. backbox ppa and somewhere else
[18:49] <LocutusOfBorg> and when many people need the same thing, for different reasons... maybe an SRU is worth
[19:26] <infinity> LocutusOfBorg: Wat?
[19:27] <infinity> LocutusOfBorg: You don't need debehlper at all, regardless of version, to create a "dsc or changes".
[19:27] <infinity> LocutusOfBorg: If you're running full no-op clean targets on source builds, those should always be done in target chroots.  If you're not, you need no debhelper.
[19:30] <infinity> LocutusOfBorg: Anyhow, "I can't figure out how to develop for the devel release" is never a reason to backport the devel toolchain to stables.  (using your argument, DDs that don't Debian stable should be petitioning for debhelper 12 in stretch, and I'm assuming you don't think that's a good idea)
[19:40] <juliank> LocutusOfBorg: There are a lot of options for you: (1) use a devel lxd (2) upgrade to devel (3) build source package with -nc
[19:41] <juliank> Oh, infinity I think it did get harder to build without a debhelper due to Build-Depends: dh-compat (= 12)
[19:41] <juliank> but I'm not sure
[19:41] <juliank> no, -nc ignores b-d too
[19:41] <juliank> So ignore that bit, I was stupid
[19:42] <juliank> I usually build packages for releases like this
[19:42] <juliank> lxc exec $release -- sudo -i -u ubuntu bash -c "cd $PWD && <gbp buildpackage/debuild> -S -uc -us"
[19:42] <juliank> and then debsign on the host
[19:42] <juliank> and have $HOME mounted into $release container
[19:43] <juliank> Well, mostly applies to apt/xenial
[19:45] <juliank> I try building on host (which runs devel), and then do debdiff of .dsc for non-devel upload to see if there are any spurious changes
[19:59] <infinity> juliank: Yeah, I do all my builds -nc where I know it's safe, and if it's not safe, it's because the package does Weird Stuff in clean, in which case it should be in a target chroot anyway (so as to not skew autotools versions, etc), so...
[20:27] <ahasenack> hm, question about the d/<package>.symbols file. Ubuntu backported a certain feature, which added new symbols, and added them to the symbols file
[20:27] <ahasenack> at the version of the backported package: 1.5.7-2ubuntu1~
[20:28] <ahasenack> later, debian adopted a new upstream version which had that feature, and updated its symbols file at that version: 1.6.2
[20:28] <ahasenack> so the question is if we should keep setting it to 1.5.7-2ubuntu1~, which is when ubuntu introduced it
[20:28] <ahasenack> but that means keeping a delta with debian
[20:29] <ahasenack> I'm inclined to drop the delta
[20:29] <ahasenack> the 1.5.7 package will still have that versioned symbol, but now we are ahead
[20:30] <infinity> ahasenack: Dropping the delta is fine, just means that packages built against the new library will pick up a newer versioned dep if they use those symbols, which isn't a big deal.
[20:32] <infinity> ahasenack: The versioned dep will be a bit of a lie for Ubuntu, but we also don't actually want people running eoan binaries with bionic libraries (or whatever), so eh.
[20:32] <ahasenack> I will have to rebuild everyting, though
[20:32] <infinity> No you won't..
[20:32] <infinity> Why would you?
[20:32] <ahasenack> or else the reverse-deps won't be installable? let me check what that dep looks like
[20:33] <infinity> Current deps will be >= 1.5.7-2ubuntu1~, and last I checked, 1.6.2 is bigger than 1.5.7
[20:33] <ahasenack> right, it's >=
[20:34] <infinity> Things will organically pick up the higher dep as they're rebuilt for other reasons, but no need to force the issue.
[20:34] <ahasenack> cool, thanks


[12:19] <impex93> Hi everyone :)
[12:41] <user82> anything new about 3g support on the nexus 4?
[13:15] <ajalkane> Has something changed and getting console.log output from QML needs to be enabled somehow? Some environment variable?
[14:49] <ajalkane> What's up? Ubuntu phone development files can't be installed in 13.04? http://pastebin.com/z0UuHcVp
[14:49] <ajalkane> Seems to relate to upgrade to Qt 5.0.2
[15:05] <nik90> ajalkane: when I update my system, I noticed that the qtdeclarative-ubuntu-ui-toolkit-plugin has been kept back.
[15:06] <nik90> ajalkane: hopefully it should be sorted out tomorrow
[15:06] <ajalkane> nik90: alright. So I'll not waste me time on that and just wait for an update.
[15:06] <ajalkane> Thanks
[15:19] <user82> does anyone know how far 3g support on the nexus 4 is?
[15:32] <ASim215> Hi people!)
[17:08] <Galahad> Salut/Hello
[19:08] <user82> popey, does 3g internet work already?
[19:08] <popey> no
[19:09] <user82> too bad. maybe in two weeks
[19:11] <popey> thats a reasonable expectation
[20:23] <adfad666> is there anything in ubuntu touch that depends on something specific in android 4.2 or would it work on android 4.1 with the same changes made to it?
[20:27] <wilee-nilee> adfad666, Ubuntu touch is one package with android and the touch combine dthat makes no sense.
[20:33] <adfad666> from the porting wiki it says ubuntu is simply runnung on top of a minimal android build, I'm wondering if that means it's relatively android version agnostic
[20:34] <tassadar_> I think it is, it just need some kernel options changed and doesn't really care about the android at all, as long as it can go to chroot
[20:36] <adfad666> I've got a tablet that simply refuses to run CM10.1 so i'm cherry-picking the changes made by Ricardo Salveti et al just to see if it works
[20:40] <k1l_> adfad666: it uses the android kernel and the displaymanager. not the android app system (which is a java VM)
[20:42] <adfad666> k1l_, I get that it doesn't use the app system, perhaps I should ask: does ubuntu touch depend on anything specific in the 4.2 display system or would any display system work?
[20:44] <k1l_> i dont know the state in which is ubuntu-touch right now. but it used to rely on the cm10.1 base. so if your device doesnt work with that its getting harder. best way is to name your device and look for that specific
[20:45] <adfad666> it's a Rockchip rk3066 tablet that I only have 4.1 binaries for.
[20:46] <adfad666> there now exist some 4.2 binaries for other tablets but none for my tablet's resolution
[20:59] <Alamo777> Hello all! I am willing to install an ubuntu mobile os on my china unkown android 4 device, is there any tutorial for that? Also is there a sence to do that? Is it oing to work faster and give me more proveleges like running python scripts on it and tracing gsm packets? thanks
[21:00] <user82> Alamo777, which device specifically?
[21:00] <Alamo777> user82, i dont know it is a phone i buy it from china website
[21:00] <Alamo777> some kind of fake samsung galaxy ii
[21:01] <Alamo777> on back it says samsumg:)))
[21:02] <user82> Alamo777, i really doubt that works...you need to access the boot loader and have a backup rom of your original android. without knowing the exact type of phone that is impossible i think
[21:02] <Alamo777> how i can know that?
[21:04] <user82> hah good question. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.electricsheep.asi&hl=de
[21:04] <user82> with a little luck
[21:04] <user82> china phones usually have a sticker where sim/battery is palced with a name on it too
[21:05] <Alamo777> oh that, just a moment i will check that
[21:05] <user82> probablly have to take the battery out...
[21:06] <Alamo777> ok it says mobile phone model n9300
[21:06] <user82> dual core Alamo777 ?
[21:06] <Alamo777> how i know that? with tha store app?
[21:06] <user82> uhm yeah i guess
[21:07] <user82> just look with the app i posted under CPU
[21:07] <Alamo777> just a moment i will boot up the device:)
[21:08] <user82> yep. buildinfos and cpu might help
[21:08] <user82> if you got that write it down and wait for someone to create a modified ubuntu image...i am sure it does not exist yet
[21:09] <Alamo777> user82, ok, please bear with me i my device is out of battery, just a moment i will get the info and come back later
[21:10] <user82> i am afk probablly. also you have to know: you can not install ubuntu touch on the device right now you need to be lucky if at any point but with the specific infos you can search for it
[21:10] <user82> maybe someone makes a ubuntu touch rom for your phone
[21:11] <Alamo777> where i can check that?
[21:11] <user82> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
[21:11] <user82> here maybe
[21:11] <Alamo777> oh ok, anyway the app is almost installed just a second i will get the info and write here
[21:12] <user82> but i personally doubt someone makes a rom for this phone ever. the china phones are all different specs and not very well known
[21:13] <Alamo777> ok the buildinfos there is a bunch of information there
[21:13] <user82> just do the "export system infos"
[21:13] <user82> in the popup menu
[21:14] <user82> might remove some personal info. serial#, phone#, IMEI mostly
[21:14] <Alamo777> there is no any information regarding cpu cores?
[21:15] <user82> maybe the type/hardware?
[21:15] <Alamo777> it says cpu revision 1
[21:15] <user82> well there is some. "processor 0" "processor 1"
[21:15] <user82> etc
[21:15] <user82> if you have more than one core
[21:16] <user82> above "bogomips"
[21:16] <user82> and maybe "cpu implementer/aarchitecture/hardware"
[21:16] <Alamo777> ARMv7 Processor rev 1
[21:17] <user82> yeah that is true for many devices..not enough info to identify it
[21:17] <user82> nothing more??
[21:17] <Alamo777> CPU archivetcure 7
[21:18] <Alamo777> cpu implementator 0x41
[21:18] <Alamo777> cpu variant 0x0
[21:18] <Alamo777> xpu part 0xc05
[21:19] <Alamo777> freq ranga 400.0->1000.0mgz
[21:19] <Alamo777> wow i can also see the IMSI
[21:19] <Alamo777> :)
[21:20] <user82> hmh that could be a lot of cpu's...sorry
[21:20] <Alamo777> what you mean?
[21:21] <user82> not really enough info do identify the cpu. or the phone
[21:22] <Alamo777> i see, anyway if i install the ubuntu, will i be able to work mostly with GSM protocol?
[21:22] <Alamo777> if it be a samsung or known device for example?
[21:22] <user82> all the clones from china are almost the same. but it is a little problematic with china phones the tutorial that might work for one phone bricks the next one
[21:23] <user82> my guess is that you will not be able to install ubuntu touch on this phone ever. maybe get a used nexus 4 or wait for the nexus 5 if you really want ubuntu touch
[21:24] <Alamo777> i see, more i buy mobile devices more i love them:) I think i will never stop buying them and examining:) What you think is it possible to trace gprs signals and work with GSM protocol with ubuntu-touch? what are the benefits of that? I like to play and expore that stuff. Ok forget about device, but the system info program was very useful:) I want to know some abbilities using ubuntu-touch in working with GSM?
[21:25] <user82> sorry i am not a developer. i know a littel bit but just from a pure end user perspective
[21:26] <user82> but by end of may ubuntu touch is supposed to be "usable" with phone calls and 3g data. so yes it should work with GSM then!
[21:26] <Alamo777> oh i see, :) Thank you so much your help. Though i think it is cool to have a tablet with ubuntu-touch on it installed and running a webserver via wifi
[21:26] <user82> nexus 7...
[21:26] <user82> yeah
[21:26] <Alamo777> user82, wait a sec.....you cant make calls with ubuntu-touch???????
[21:26] <user82> i think it works with some devices. wait
[21:27] <user82> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install#What_to_expect_after_flashing
[21:27] <user82> Connection to the GSM network (on Galaxy Nexus and Nexus 4)
[21:27] <user82> Phone calls and SMS (on Galaxy Nexus and Nexus 4)
[21:27] <Alamo777> what you mean nexus 7?
[21:28] <Alamo777> so it is not possible to install ubuntu-touch on iphone device right?
[21:28] <user82> if you scroll a little you can see the nexus 7 is the only tablet right now which is officialyl supported
[21:28] <Alamo777> oh ok
[21:28] <user82> no that will never work
[21:28] <user82> (likely...)
[21:28] <user82> there has been one android version for one iphone i think...but that is nonsense
[21:28] <user82> nexus 10 if you like expensive toys ;)
[21:29] <Alamo777> i have asus tf201
[21:29] <Alamo777> i see, so how much cost in the area nexus 7 where you live? Is it expensive?
[21:30] <user82> with that you might eventually be lucky. maybe someone ports it
[21:30] <user82> when ubuntu touch is ready i could really imagine it being ported to the tf201
[21:31] <Alamo777> i see
[21:31] <user82> nexus 7 is the "google tablet" http://www.google.com/nexus/7/
[21:31] <Alamo777> what about acer iconia? It is alot way powerfull then tf201 and nexux10 right?
[21:32] <user82> i read it has a intel atom. intel atom is a different cpu architecture ubuntu touch is not designed to run on.
[21:33] <Alamo777> user82, yes definitely it has atom and also i5 if i am not wrong
[21:34] <Alamo777> i saw on review how a dude was running the Mass Effect 3 on iconia with windows8 tablet
[21:34] <user82> might work yeah
[21:34] <Alamo777> So is it expensive in area where you live the nexus7 tablet?
[21:35] <user82> it is almost the same everywhere. $199 or €199 where avaiable
[21:36] <user82> in uk it might be different
[21:36] <user82> also there are different verions. with 3g internet, without etc
[21:36] <Alamo777> nexus 7 already has a sim card?
[21:36] <user82> there is one version with support for 3g internet. no calls
[21:37] <Alamo777> user82, but you can insert a sim card?
[21:37] <Alamo777> or some dongle adapter?
[21:37] <user82> yes sim card
[21:38] <Alamo777> never seen before, i think i was not quite careful when reading descriptions
[21:38] <Alamo777> that is awesome i think
[21:38] <user82> well ubuntu touch for now supports the "googel devices"
[21:38] <user82> but i am sure when it is usable others will be supported too
[21:39] <user82> also there is supposed to come out a new google phone this year. until then ubuntu might be fully usable. just be a little patient and see what happens
[21:39] <user82> other devices see here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
[21:40] <Alamo777> well, i can wait:) I ammostly  looking for device smalll powerfull and with sim support, which most of them dont
[21:40] <user82> under work in progress more tablets are listed
[21:41] <Alamo777> well as i understand the benefit of android is they work on all unknown devices as well, rather then known brands like ubuntu-touch does
[21:43] <Alamo777> Which is the best tablet today for you to  buy, the flagman tablet for you?
[21:43] <Alamo777> i mean the most powerfull
[21:54] <user82> Alamo777, i did not really follow recent hardware releases
[21:55] <user82> probably wait what will happen with the next generation nvidia tegra?
[21:55] <Alamo777> user82, oh ok, anyway thank you for your time, you helped me alot today:)
[21:55] <user82> glad i could help.
[21:55] <Alamo777> yes tegra is super i think
[21:56] <user82> tegra 4 is out very very soon...i think some manufacturers want their tablets with tegra 4 to be ready for cristmas or sooner
[21:56] <Alamo777> user82, super, one thing i still dont undersand does the ipad last generation is more powerfull then the latest android devices like asus tf301 etc?
[21:57] <user82> partitally. i think the gpu is yes
[21:57] <Alamo777> gpu of which one is more powerfull?
[21:58] <user82> the ipad gpu seems to be the most powerful one
[21:58] <user82> until tegra4 is out
[21:59] <Alamo777> i see.
[22:00] <Alamo777> user82, ok i have once more question:)
[22:01] <user82> that would be?
[22:02] <Alamo777> Which one is more powerfull latest MacBookPro or Asus G-series latest laptops? Sorry for such question
[22:03] <user82> uh..yeah you might go to #ubuntu-offtopic for that
[22:03] <user82> i think this dicussion is not wanted in the ubuntu touch channel sorry
[22:03] <Alamo777> :) i promiss this is the last question
[22:04] <Alamo777> Anyway thank you for explaining about ubuntu-touch, i think it will be best for me to wait for the end of the month and see the latest ubuntu-touch release and understand what is compatible for me to work with GSM protocol
[22:05] <user82> i think you can get them with the same cpu and gpu but i am not sure..grab the asus tech specs and the mac book ones and google. more oppinions on that in #ubuntu-offtopic
[22:05] <Alamo777> ok thanks!


[01:21] <DawnLight> yo
[02:13] <DawnLight> anyone?
[02:13] <zkriesse_> DawnLight: yes?
[02:15] <DawnLight> hey zkriesse_
[02:15] <zkriesse_> yo
[02:15] <DawnLight> a page has been written in the wiki by me
[02:15] <DawnLight> i'd like to let the doco team know about it
[02:16] <zkriesse_> ok
[02:16] <DawnLight> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/wakeonlan
[02:18] <zkriesse_> is that your personal wiki page?
[02:20] <zkriesse_> wrong place for that page dude
[02:20] <DawnLight> no, it is documentation
[02:20] <zkriesse_> and wiki.ubuntu.com is NOT the place for doc
[02:21] <DawnLight> i apologize. i didn't bother reading the instructions
[02:22] <zkriesse_> its ok
[02:22] <zkriesse_> Want me to explain it to ya?
[02:22] <zkriesse_> im a wiki guru...
[02:22] <DawnLight> sure
[02:23] <DawnLight> but
[02:24] <DawnLight> if only to inform me of where i should put my doc and anything else i must know apart from the style
[02:24] <zkriesse_> ok
[02:25] <zkriesse_> i could teach ya quite a bit
[02:25] <zkriesse_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/zkriesse is my personal wiki page
[02:27] <zkriesse_> wiki.ubuntu.com is for all the ubuntu teams and their respective projects
[02:28] <zkriesse_> https://help.ubuntu.com/community is where all the community contributed help docs need to go
[02:29] <zkriesse_> so instead of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/wakeonlan it should be
[02:30] <zkriesse_> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WakeOnLan
[02:38] <DawnLight> thanks


[00:29] <locodir-user> hi,
[00:30] <locodir-user> is someone on line??
[00:30] <locodir-user> need help with my ubuntu
[00:33] <ibeardslee> what sort of help
[00:33] <kcj> Helpful help probably.
[00:34] <ibeardslee> that's helpful
[00:34] <ibeardslee> locodir-user: what sort of help do you need?
[00:36] <kcj> locodir-user: Also, this channel's kinda small. #ubuntu would probably be of more use.
[00:38] <ibeardslee> locodir-user: but often #ubuntu-nz can help for some things especially if you find #ubuntu to full of other discussion that you can't get traction.
[00:39] <kcj> Well, we sure helped him.
[00:40] <ibeardslee> awesome assistance there kcj, if all the help you can offer is by telling people that someone who has asked how they can help that they can't really .. don't bother
[00:41] <ibeardslee> you may be better off in #troll or something
[00:42] <kcj> Really?
[00:44] <kcj> #ubuntu is a much better equipped channel for assistance.
[00:45] <ibeardslee> sure, but I was here and was offering my assistance
[00:45] <kcj> Yes, I wasn't getting in the way of that.
[00:45] <ibeardslee> and then you basically said we can't help
[00:45] <kcj> So no need for passive-aggressive attacks. Okay?
[00:46] <ibeardslee> yeap, and no need to go knocking people's offering to help
[00:46] <ibeardslee> that ISN'T helpful at all
[00:46] <kcj> You done?
[00:46] <ibeardslee> are you?
[00:47] <kcj> Telling a user where the main support channel is located is a helpful thing to do.
[00:47] <ibeardslee> telling a user they are able to help here and now is even better
[00:47] <kcj> Why not both?
[00:47] <locodir-user> this computer dont work well... sorry about that
[00:47] <ibeardslee> anyway, sorry locodir-user, what can I help you with?
[00:48] <locodir-user> hi, i'm from argentina and my computer is with this... Ubuntu 13.10 to 14.04 upgrade: Filesystem check or mount failed
[00:49] <locodir-user> i'm now in New Zealand, travelling around, is there any place where i can take it so somebody can fix it??
[00:49] <ibeardslee> at what point does that happen? after the upgrade or as it is getting ready to start?
[00:50] <locodir-user> soon as i start the computer
[00:50] <ibeardslee> after the upgrade?
[00:50] <locodir-user> i really dont know...
[00:50] <locodir-user> i think that the update never finish
[00:51] <kcj> Ooh, not good.
[00:51] <ibeardslee> ouch, that'll makes things 'fun'
[00:51] <ibeardslee> where are you in your travels at the moment?
[00:51] <kcj> You may need to re-install.
[00:51] <locodir-user> now i'm in morrinsville
[00:52]  * ibeardslee goes to google
[00:52] <locodir-user> but we are leaving today to Te Puke and then to Auckland tomorrow morning
[00:52] <locodir-user> the problem is that i don't have another computer and i'm using the internet in the library
[00:53] <ibeardslee> ahh ok
[00:53] <ibeardslee> you can probably get away without having to reinstall .. depending on what the real problem is
[00:53] <ibeardslee> do you have the laptop handy?
[00:53] <locodir-user> yes
[00:54] <ibeardslee> when it starts up, if you start hitting the 'left shift' key before ubuntu starts you should be able to get to the grub menu, and from their choose other ubuntu options and then the recovery option
[00:56] <locodir-user> yes, but after that i put any choice and came this:
[00:56] <locodir-user> Filesystem check or mount failed.
[00:57] <ibeardslee> at what point? the grub menu or the recovery option?
[00:59] <locodir-user> now i get something else... recovery mode, but i don't know how keep going
[00:59] <kcj[work]> http://askubuntu.com/a/40058 looks like the way to go.
[01:00] <ibeardslee> recovery mode that's a good start.
[01:01] <ibeardslee> from there I suggest choosing 'root' or something like that, I think the bottom or second to bottom one
[01:02] <locodir-user> i get the root, what now??
[01:02] <ibeardslee> first type 'ls /etc/fstab'
[01:03] <ibeardslee> that'll tell us what file systems the system expects to have
[01:03] <ibeardslee> gah .. 'less /etc/fstab' is what I meant
[01:03] <locodir-user> nothing happend
[01:04] <ibeardslee> with the less or ls ?
[01:04] <locodir-user> now work
[01:04] <locodir-user> with less
[01:06] <ibeardslee> how much do you know about linux/ubuntu?
[01:06] <locodir-user> not much really
[01:06] <locodir-user> i get a friend in argetnina who was my support
[01:06] <locodir-user> sorry about that...
[01:07] <ibeardslee> ahh ok .. can you summarise what the output was?
[01:07] <ibeardslee> mainly after things that have /dev/ in them
[01:09] <locodir-user> sda1 during installation uuid=8b69687d6-8d4b-4837-96eb-bba3e93f29fe /
[01:10] <locodir-user> ext4 errors=remount
[01:10] <locodir-user> swap was on /dev/sda5 during installation
[01:11] <locodir-user> UUID= 25bac448-fa27-44c0-b6f1-6b7b0b1613bc none    swap     sw
[01:12] <ibeardslee> heh .. don't actually need all those letter/numbers ;)
[01:12] <locodir-user> sorry
[01:12] <ibeardslee> np
[01:12] <ibeardslee> it'd have saved you a bit of time if I'd mentioned it
[01:12] <locodir-user> its ok
[01:13] <ibeardslee> is that all of them?
[01:13] <locodir-user> yes
[01:14] <ibeardslee> ok .. now  'df -h'
[01:15] <ibeardslee> just looking for the one entry in that .. probably the top one that is '/' in the mounted on column
[01:15] <ibeardslee> and number in the 'Avail' column
[01:17] <locodir-user> i got lost... sorry...
[01:17] <ibeardslee> ok .. now type  'df -h'
[01:18] <ibeardslee> we want to make sure you haven't run out of space (one of the reasons a upgrade will die, although it shouldn't)
[01:19] <locodir-user> its says waiting for data, is that ok?
[01:21] <ibeardslee> not ideal
[01:21] <locodir-user> sorry, but is there any place where i can take the computer because i'm not so helpfull
[01:22] <ibeardslee> not sure who I could point you to in the next couple of days
[01:23] <ibeardslee> my worry about pointing you to a random computer shop could mean that you are stuck with someone who only knows windows
[01:23] <locodir-user> i was worried about the same
[01:24] <locodir-user> here in the library they told us that maybe in the waikato university there is a group that helps with ubuntu
[01:25] <ibeardslee> oh true, one of the key user groups is based there
[01:25] <locodir-user> can we go there and ask for some help??
[01:29] <ibeardslee> not sure
[01:29] <kcj[work]> There's a whole channel on this network that helps with Ubuntu.
[01:30] <ibeardslee> locodir-user: I'm asking around to see if someone can give you some hands on attention
[01:30] <locodir-user> thanks!!
[01:30] <kcj[work]> I'd say.
[01:30] <kcj[work]> Neat.
[01:31] <ibeardslee> I'm happy to keep walking you through it remotely, but it can't be quite frustrating if you are stumbling around.
[01:33] <locodir-user> yes, that's the reason because i'm asking for someone i can go with the computer...
[01:34] <locodir-user> it's quite hard because i don't understand about ubuntu
[01:34] <ibeardslee> yeah I can understand
[01:38] <locodir-user> well, i must leave the computer, thanks for everithing!!! sorry for don't understand!!!
[01:39] <ibeardslee> np .. probably best bet to try a computer shop to see if they can help
[01:39] <ibeardslee> sorry I can't really help beyond that
[01:40] <locodir-user> np!!... i will try that!! thank you!!!
[04:40] <G> ouch, powered on a laptop, still running 12.10
[04:46] <ibeardslee> eww
[04:49] <G> exactly
[04:51] <G> The odd thing though, based on the file creation times it seems that it was put on in Aug 13, so it should've had 13.04
[19:21] <ibeardslee> morning
[20:45] <ajmitch> morning
[20:46] <kcj> Morning