[01:50] <Viral> can anyone help me understand why I can get an ec2 instance boot into a low latency kernel : https://gist.github.com/623aa20f9de9b7a5ae44
[02:19] <ali1234> ok, i figured out the answer to my question above, putting the answer on my question on stack exchange if anyone is interested
[10:18] <smoser> apw, http://pad.ubuntu.com/other-kernel-o-version-and-flavours
[16:50] <mardy> can I use the symbol first_ec from a module? It's exported, but defined in drivers/acpi/internal.h
[16:50] <mjg59> So right now, no
[16:52] <mardy> mjg59: thanks. Do you know how I could get it? I guess I could register an ACPI driver for the id "PNP0C09", but maybe there's a faster/better way?
[16:53] <mardy> (I want to read a few fields, which are probably related to the Lenovo Ideapad's accelerometer)
[16:54] <mardy> ikepanhc: hi, I see you wrote most of ideapad-laptop.c. Are you also working on the accelerometer support?
[16:57] <mjg59> You could move the declaration to a public header
[16:57] <ikepanhc> mardy: hi, I do not. I do not have an ideapad with accelerometer
[16:58] <ikepanhc> mardy: actually, I know nothing about the accelerometer...
[16:59] <mardy> mjg59: I'm rather new to kernel development, I'm a bit hesitant in changing things... I'll see if I can get it in some other way
[16:59] <mardy> ikepanhc: maybe you know how I can get a handle to the EC, from inside ideapad-laptop.c?
[16:59] <mjg59> mardy: What are you actually trying to do? Just get the APCI handle for the EC?
[17:00] <mjg59> The cleanest thing to do would just be to move it from the internal header to the public one
[17:00] <ikepanhc> mardy: what kind of information you need?
[17:00] <mardy> mjg59: yes, then I plan to call acpi_evaluate_integer() on a couple of fields, to see if they contain the accelerometer data
[17:03] <ikepanhc> mardy: could you send me an email about what you plan to do? so that I can think about how to help. This week I am busy in company event and now have to leave
[17:03] <mardy> ikepanhc: I want to read GSV{X,Y,Z} from http://people.canonical.com/~ikepanhc/DSDTs/dsdt-s10-3.dsl
[17:03] <mardy> ikepanhc: OK
[17:44] <mardy> mjg59: are you somewhat interested? Should I add you in CC to the e-mail I'm writing to Ike?
[20:41] <baggles> i've been getting some crashes today since i have been trying to use a new wireless driver
[20:43] <baggles> i get a virtual terminal screen without X and the caps lock is flashing on and off. and the hold-down-the-power-button-for-10-seconds doesn't even work!
[20:47] <baggles> i'm not sure if it was a kernel panic, or something, but is there a cleaner way out of it than cutting the power and taking the battery out of my netbook?
[22:36] <hallyn> bug 776936 is solved with the natty-proposed kernel.  WHen is that expected to go to natty-updates?
[22:36] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 776936 in linux "Running KVM guest causes kernel panic on host" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/776936


[18:55] <johnjaye> is it possible to make a cloud image with no default users at all? and then just have cloud-init create them?
[18:56] <johnjaye> i'm really confused here. i thought 'debian' was the default user in all the debian cloud images. but when i made a seed file which created user foo then user debian didn't exist
[18:56] <falcojr> default user should get created by cloud-init...default cloud images won't come with users defined
[18:57] <johnjaye> but the file /etc/cloud/cloud.cfg on the debian images says to create default user debian
[18:57] <johnjaye> did i override it somehow by specifying a users: section and creating foo?
[18:57] <johnjaye> i checked both /etc/passwd and /home and there was nothing. just foo
[18:58] <johnjaye> this is the config i used: https://dpaste.com/D9SAGC2C2
[18:58] <falcojr> johnjaye: if you're creating additional users via cloud-init, ensure you include "- default" in your users list
[18:59] <johnjaye> if i don't does it override the default user?
[19:00] <falcojr> yes
[19:00] <johnjaye> o_o
[19:00] <johnjaye> ok.
[19:00] <johnjaye> would not have guessed that to be the case
[19:00] <johnjaye> i thought i was avoiding that by omitting -default from the list
[19:06] <minimal> johnjaye: this is mentioned in the docs but possibly it needs to be in large red flashing letters as it is a common mistake people make ;-)
[19:07] <minimal> from the docs: "Omission of 'default' as the first item in the 'users' list skips creation[sic] the default user."
[19:10] <falcojr> Ooh, typo with it. Even better!
[19:11] <minimal> falcojr: 50/50 choice of "creation of" or "creating" ;-)
[19:16] <minimal> falcojr: can we ask the browser makers to bring back the <blink> tag? lol


[00:09] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Fridge:: Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter Issue 671 @ https://fridge.ubuntu.com/2021/02/22/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-671/ (by guiverc)
[02:47] <guiverc> Bashing-om, you've been doing this a long time now, 148/224 is ~2/3 of my contribs (I contrib a higher % of issues now than I did initially; it was certain week(s) a month which is why that 1/3rd maybe feels longer in my mind)
[02:53] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Does not seem possible this much time has elapsed - enough so I am practiced and know where to look out for my errors - mostly.


[02:28] <doko_> Riddell: hmm, I thought we were not using -fvisibility? the patch is not upstream, and even delayed for 4.1
[02:30] <Riddell> well I thought I'd give the -fvisibility thing a shot, but I can always turn it off
[02:31] <doko_> give it a shot in a rebuild which doesn't hit the archives?
[02:31] <Riddell> not yet
[02:31] <Riddell> waiting on the c++ transition stuff
[02:46] <Riddell> doko_: any idea why subversion is failing to build?  http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/428529
[02:47] <Riddell> I changed the build-dep from libdb4.2 to libdb4.3
[02:47] <Riddell> but that doesn't seem to be the issue
[02:59] <doko_> Riddell: didn't look I have here a 1.3.0 build, which builds ok for me
[03:00] <Riddell> doko_: any plans to upload that?
[03:00] <Riddell> I need a subversion using libdb4.3 for kdesdk
[03:00] <doko_> Riddell: did you read 19664? It's a can of worms ... requires more than the visibility patch to the headers
[03:01] <doko_> hmm, and what about upgrading subversion databases? is it needed?
[03:02] <Riddell> subversion databases?
[03:03] <Riddell> doko_: I've not read 19664 closely, gcc hacking is more your area than mine, if it's a bother then I'll just not use visibility
[03:08] <doko_> from the report:
[03:08] <doko_> I agree Geoff, we should hold off on this for 4.1, and try to hit 4.2. If
[03:08] <doko_> things get solid sooner, maybe this can be reconsidered. Adding this patch to
[03:08] <doko_> 4.0.x is out of the question, it has the potential to change too many things.
[03:11] <Riddell> aw man, 4.2.  we'll never get visibility in :(
[08:25] <doko> fabbione: regarding the libstdc++ allocator change: I did ask lamont to shutdown the hppa buildd tomorrow at 22:00 UTC, could you do the same for sparc and/or only build the gcc-4.0 and gcc-3.4 packages?
[08:25] <fabbione> doko: will do
[08:26] <doko> fabbione: do you know when infinity is back?
[08:28] <fabbione> doko: i think tomorrow
[08:28] <fabbione> he had today off
[08:28] <fabbione> and i am going to crash really soon
[08:29] <doko> ok, it's enough if he's online tomorrow
[08:29] <fabbione> doko: the sparc buildd is surely lagging behind
[08:29] <fabbione> given that i didn't turn on my pc for 2 days
[08:30] <fabbione> what's the watermark for this allocator change
[08:30] <fabbione> ?
[08:30] <fabbione> what do i need to build before gcc?
[08:30] <doko> http://lists.debian.org/debian-release/2005/11/msg00097.html
[08:30] <doko> nothing before gcc
[08:30] <fabbione> ok
[03:19] <jbailey> doko: Eh, I see that there's a CVS snap of binutils.  Any idea if that includes the sparc64 TLS stuff?  I think it should.
[03:20] <doko> jbailey: no, forgot about that one. it's just the merge
[03:23] <jbailey> I suspect it's in there anyway.
[03:23] <jbailey> I'll play with it a bit later.


[01:17] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Stéphane Graber: Inexpensive highly available LXD cluster: Server setup @ https://stgraber.org/2020/12/18/inexpensive-highly-available-lxd-cluster-server-setup/
[13:01] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Alan Pope: Multiple GPUs in a Skull Canyon NUC @ https://popey.com/blog/2020/12/multiple-gpus-in-a-skull-canyon-nuc/
[22:21] <Bashing-om> UWN: Gdoc set to go - note that guiverc did the summaries. a lot of time and effort there :D
[22:22] <guiverc> a lot of time and effort goes into selecting & preparing articles too !
[22:24] <Bashing-om> guiverc: That process could be better - as if it is not GA, kernel and hardware. I generally exclude - there is just so much we can do :(
[22:25] <guiverc> you do a great job Bashing-om
[22:27] <Bashing-om> guiverc: I can only try - note too in my clean up I ran a new item for the TB election.
[22:28] <guiverc> ack


[09:32] <mup> PR pc-amd64-gadget#65 opened: Build from snapcraft.yaml and use ucdev PPAs <Created by alfonsosanchezbeato> <https://github.com/snapcore/pc-amd64-gadget/pull/65>
[09:53] <ppd[m]> hi, what's the plan with https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft-desktop-integration ? The comeback of the desktop helpers? It popped up on my Github feed...
[10:06] <ppd[m]> ah, I see, it's used in the new gnome platform: https://github.com/ubuntu/gnome-sdk/blob/gnome-42-2204/snapcraft.yaml
[11:32] <ricotz> hello, please take a look into https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd/+bug/1951210/comments/23
[11:32] <mup> Bug #1951210: libreoffice help doesn't open in firefox (404 error on file:///tmp/lu417531j7po.tmp/NewHelp0.html) <amd64> <apport-bug> <impish> <iso-testing> <jammy> <snap> <uec-images> <libreoffice (Ubuntu):Fix Released by ricotz> <snapd (Ubuntu):New> <libreoffice (Ubuntu Jammy):Fix Released by
[11:32] <mup> ricotz> <snapd (Ubuntu Jammy):New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1951210>
[12:32] <mup> PR pc-amd64-gadget#65 closed: Build from snapcraft.yaml and use ucdev PPAs <Created by alfonsosanchezbeato> <Merged by alfonsosanchezbeato> <https://github.com/snapcore/pc-amd64-gadget/pull/65>
[12:48] <mup> PR snapcraft#3855 opened: extensions: Do not default to Nvidia VDPAU <Created by nteodosio> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3855>
[13:57] <mup> PR pc-amd64-gadget#66 opened: Build from snapcraft.yaml and use ucdev PPA <Created by alfonsosanchezbeato> <https://github.com/snapcore/pc-amd64-gadget/pull/66>
[22:51] <kiskadee> Hi, I am trying to install snapd for arch. When I run mkpkg -si in the root of the snapd folder I get "PKGBUILD does not exist". I found  PKGBUILD under packaging/arch but then I get a bunch of errors about missing Go packages.
[23:54] <mup> PR snapcraft#3856 opened: plugins: early registration of application plugins <Created by cmatsuoka> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3856>


[05:11] <didrocks> good morning
[07:10] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[07:17] <anpok_> seb128: ok .. AlbertA removed the libmirprotobuf0 ABI breaks from 0.14
[07:17] <anpok_> with that boottest should work
[07:18] <seb128> anpok_, does that resolve the usc issue?
[07:18] <seb128> great :-)
[07:19] <anpok_> need to fix my krillin - I bricked it yesterday with my last attempt to bump libmirprotobuf0 to 1 which went boom..
[07:22] <Noskcaj> Does anyone here have the time to upload gegl 0.3?
[07:23] <Noskcaj> It and the required patches to gnome-photos and gimp are in ppa:noskcaj/gegl
[07:23] <Noskcaj> Debian hasn't yet uploaded this due to a lack of response from the gimp maintainer, and it would be nice to get it before FF
[08:04] <willcooke> hihi
[08:05] <seb128> hey willcooke
[08:05] <seb128> how is u.k today?
[08:05] <willcooke> so far, not bad.   There's a debian auto-gegl tracker, and we have bugs for the new upstream release of gegl and gnome-photos from robert_ancell, but no actual transition bug
[08:18] <seb128> Noskcaj, how is debian handling that transition if they don't update gegl?
[08:18] <seb128> Noskcaj, can you share the bug numbers?
[08:19] <Noskcaj> bug 1470282 bug 1470658
[08:20] <Noskcaj> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=790421
[08:20] <seb128> I guess first step would be to add your work to the first bug and subscribe sponsors then?
[08:20] <Noskcaj> it's in debian exp currently, waiting on a response from the gimp maintainer AFAIK
[08:21] <seb128> response to what?
[08:21] <seb128> is there an issue/concern with gimp?
[08:21] <Noskcaj> about patching gimp to support the new gegl
[08:21] <Noskcaj> It's just changing compile stuff, no real code patches
[08:21] <seb128> is that patch upstream?
[08:21] <Laney> renamed pcfile
[08:21] <Noskcaj> I've tested gimp and gnome-photos
[08:21] <Noskcaj> brb, dinner
[08:28] <darkxst> hey Laney  seb128,  robert_ancell bounced me back to you guys for the u-s-d/u-c-c gsettings changes ;(
[08:28] <seb128> lol
[08:28] <seb128> he's not interested? or too busy? or not in agreement?
[08:28] <darkxst> seb128, said he didnt understand enough about the changes
[08:28] <Laney> haha
[08:29] <seb128> k, same than me then :p
[08:29] <seb128> it needs somebody wanting to sit down for some hours
[08:29] <darkxst> I added some more details on the bug about what has changed
[08:29] <Laney> i am supposed to patch pilot some time
[08:29] <Laney> will look then
[08:29] <darkxst> Laney, k, thanks
[08:33] <seb128> somebody should hit GNOME with a "gsettings schemas are api" stick
[08:36] <darkxst> seb128, at the same time, it makes no sense having mutter use schemas from g-s-d (under wayland, where the g-s-d plugin is disabled)
[08:37] <seb128> darkxst, it doesn't need to, they could have let the old schemas in place untouched and created a new set of keys
[08:38] <seb128> having some migration code write the new keys on first start and letting the old untouched
[08:38] <seb128> and having the new code using the new keys only
[08:38] <seb128> that would have let the old "api" untouched
[08:38] <darkxst> seb128, the issue here is that u-s-d shares g-s-d schemas
[08:38] <darkxst> seb128, how do you know the settings have been migrated?
[08:39] <seb128> you write a new boolean key "settings-migrated"?
[08:39] <seb128> which default to false
[08:39] <darkxst> the GNOME approach was to reset everything to default setting
[08:39] <seb128> and write it to true when you do the migration
[08:42] <darkxst> seb128, but really this is a unique case, no other downstream, shares the g-s-d schemas
[08:42] <Noskcaj> seb128, gimp is patched upstream, but i've not yet found the patch
[08:48] <seb128> darkxst, it's the usual GNOME line of thinking, they do the same for GTK
[08:48] <seb128> "let's change ABI, the only users of that API that we know about are things we can fix'
[08:49] <seb128> oh well, I guess that's not a discussion that's going to help there
[08:49] <seb128> darkxst, if Laney doesn't review it I can try to have a look this week
[08:50] <seb128> but same as robert_ancell, I don't understand the details atm
[08:53] <darkxst> seb128, its a little different to GTK, but yes I do agree they behave similar in that case
[08:59] <darkxst> since there is absolutely no guarantee about g-s-d api's/schemas
[09:03] <Noskcaj> upstream gegl patch https://git.gnome.org/browse/gimp/commit/configure.ac?id=f72c138771369575f87f272be1cb94372c220d97
[09:07] <seb128> that commit is from 2013
[09:07] <Noskcaj> yes
[09:07] <Noskcaj> gimp hasn't had a new major release in years
[09:07] <Noskcaj> and that's in master, not the 2.8 branch
[09:08] <seb128> you made sure that 2.8 builds with the new gegl?
[09:08] <Noskcaj> yep, that's what's in the ppa
[09:08] <Noskcaj> worked fine on my pc
[09:09] <seb128> k
[09:09] <seb128> no gegl in the sponsoring queue?
[09:10] <seb128> let me know when it's there and I can have a look
[09:10] <Noskcaj> there
[09:11] <Noskcaj> the ~ppa1 versions will need dropping, i won't have time to do that for a while, so just take it if you can please
[09:11] <seb128> there?
[09:12] <Noskcaj> there = sponsors subscribed
[09:13] <seb128> k
[12:19] <desrt> *yawn* good morning desktop
[12:39] <seb128> hey desrt
[12:40] <seb128> desrt, how are you?
[12:40] <desrt> okay
[12:40] <desrt> how's life in schengen?
[12:40] <seb128> good
[12:40] <seb128> we have some sun again since yesterday ;-)
[12:40] <didrocks> morning desrt!
[12:40] <desrt> it's been great here lately
[12:40] <desrt> except a bit humid :)
[12:40] <desrt> hihi didrocks
[12:40] <didrocks> still really warm here
[12:41]  * desrt is starting to get excited about vacation :)
[12:41] <didrocks> will be better in a couple of hours, supposed to rain
[12:41] <seb128> desrt, when/where do you go?
[12:41] <desrt> i have two weeks off starting monday
[12:41] <desrt> when i return, i will not be the same person
[12:41] <desrt> my mind will have been warped
[12:42] <desrt> two solid weeks of speaking esperanto
[12:42] <seb128> :-)
[12:42] <seb128> do you go to any european conf after that?
[12:42] <desrt> debconf is two weeks after
[12:42] <desrt> then back home
[12:43] <seb128> so spending a bit over a month in europe?
[12:43] <desrt> about a month
[12:43] <desrt> two weeks after = "not the next week, but the one after"
[12:43] <seb128> I see
[12:43] <seb128> we probably see each others at debconf then ;-)
[12:44] <desrt> reminds me
[12:44]  * desrt has to send an email about that
[12:44] <seb128> I'm still not 100% sure going but I should
[12:45] <desrt> is everyone eating at the venue place?
[12:45] <desrt> ie: did you take the meal option in the sign-up?
[12:46] <seb128> no
[12:46] <seb128> I didn't at least
[12:46] <desrt> "From the main train station you can reach the youth hostel by bus within 10 minutes"
[12:47] <desrt> sounds like there will be no shortage of food outside :)
[12:48] <didrocks> I didn't either
[12:49] <didrocks> seb128: but your room is book, isn't it?
[12:49] <didrocks> booked*
[12:49] <seb128> didrocks, I guess so, Michelle was supposed to do the booking no?
[12:49] <seb128> I didn't check
[12:49] <desrt> msm sent an email to me saying that she booked me a room
[12:50] <didrocks> seb128: I don't know if she doesn't only do that for those having their travel request number
[12:51] <seb128> I've a confirmation number on the gdoc
[12:51] <seb128> so I guess she did
[12:51] <didrocks> great :)
[12:51] <desrt> attente will be here soon
[12:51] <desrt> i'm going to go put on some pants
[12:51] <desrt> :D
[12:52] <seb128> lol
[12:52] <didrocks> ;)
[12:52] <desrt> there's a bit of an inside joke there.  ask attente some time about his new opinion on pants ;)
[12:54] <seb128> or ask him about swimming pants
[12:54] <seb128> I'm sure Laney remembers ;-)
[12:54] <desrt> was there an 'accident'?
[12:56] <seb128> let's say that one should be aware that some clothes become transparents when wet
[12:56] <desrt> oh.  i see.
[12:56] <desrt> or maybe i'd prefer not to see, in fact...
[12:56] <seb128> right
[12:56] <desrt> that is some seriously poor engineering on swim shorts....
[12:56] <seb128> unsure if those were designed to swim
[12:57] <seb128> or if attente just decided to pick that to go swimming
[12:57] <desrt> no 'usability testing'
[12:57] <didrocks> you are not supposed to wear pants in swimming pool, so then, bear with it! :)
[12:57]  * ogra_ finds another channel to lurk
[12:57] <desrt> "William is a young software engineer.  He enjoys rock climbing and swimming."
[12:57] <desrt> ^ gotta have your usecases down
[13:32] <attente> D:
[13:35] <seb128> tedg, what makes an url type defined for url-dispatcher?
[13:35] <tedg> seb128, If the package has a hook for a url-dispatcher file.
[13:35] <tedg> seb128, We then parse it and put that into a cache database
[13:36] <tedg> seb128, So technically, in the sqlite db, but realistically the url-dispatcher file is how you get there.
[13:36] <seb128> tedg, hum, so entries in /usr/share/url-dispatcher/urls/ ?
[13:37] <tedg> seb128, Yeah, for debs
[13:37] <tedg> seb128, I was thinking you were asking for clicks
[13:37] <seb128> tedg, I'm trying to understand bug 1477149
[13:38] <ogra_> for clicks you use an "app.url-dispatcher" file .... http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ogra/junk/google-plus-app/files
[13:38] <seb128> tedg, which is basically appid:/// not being recogniezed
[13:38] <seb128> " appid://com.ubuntu.camera/camera/current-user-version "
[13:38] <tedg> seb128, appid:/// is handled internally, so in that case it is the camera not being installed.
[13:39] <seb128> it's installed
[13:39] <seb128> and I can start it from the dash
[13:39] <tedg> seb128, click list ?
[13:39] <tedg> seb128, Is it still called com.ubuntu.camera ?
[13:39] <seb128> it's not a click
[13:39] <seb128> that's on the snappy personal image
[13:39] <tedg> Oh, then that appid won't work.
[13:39] <seb128> yeah for convergence :-/
[13:40] <tedg> Why is it not a click on personal?
[13:40] <seb128> because snappy and clicks are not friends
[13:40] <seb128> we have snaps there only
[13:40] <tedg> Ah, so we need a way to launch snaps.
[13:41] <tedg> Which requires a way for snaps to define applications instead of binaries.
[13:41] <seb128> well, camera is not snapified yet
[13:41] <seb128> it's part of the image
[13:41] <seb128> but I guess you have no interest in supporting debs on the base image?
[13:41] <tedg> I'm not sure how that'd really work...
[13:42] <tedg> We're using those fields to look up in the Click database.
[13:42] <seb128> can't we just look up for a <name>.desktop
[13:42] <tedg> I think the work around that would be possible is if you had the camera register camera:/// and then gallery call that.
[13:42] <tedg> Then the deb could register that URL and we could call the desktop file.
[13:43] <tedg> I need to run a kid to camp, brb.
[13:43] <seb128> tedg, thanks for the replies!
[13:53] <ogra_> seb128, do you happen to know a way to set a kbd layout on a user level without accessing the system settings (/me just has a question on G+ from someone using a real kbd with his phone and i dont want to suggest making it writable)
[13:53] <seb128> ogra_, under mir? no idea, I don't even know if that's possible...
[13:54] <ogra_> heh, k
[13:54] <ogra_> thanks
[13:54] <seb128> greyback_ might know
[13:54] <seb128> yw
[13:54] <ogra_> well, for convergence it will have to be possible ... one day :)
[13:55] <seb128> yeah, kenvandine is working with the mir team to get api defined for input config
[13:55] <ogra_> (but i guess we'll just add keymaps to the rootfs and make the confi dir writable for that)
[13:55] <greyback_> ogra_: I believe mir supports different kbd layouts, but unity8 not exporting that yet
[13:55] <ogra_> ah, k
[14:40] <dgadomski> cyphermox: hey, do you have a sec to talk about bug #1297849?
[14:40] <cyphermox> sure
[14:41] <dgadomski> cyphermox: I don't know what the root cause is, but since it has be identified that it has something to do with obtaining shell version by dbus it may be some kind of a race condition
[14:41] <dgadomski> upstream has removed this shell watcher implementation
[14:41] <dgadomski> do you think backporting https://git.gnome.org/browse/network-manager-applet/commit/?id=4473e6a48fcfda1d87d4a4bc9f5c0589235dcfe0 makes sense?
[14:42] <dgadomski> I think it will make the problem go away, but I'm not sure if it will not have any unwanted implications
[14:45] <cyphermox> it looks fine, aiui we also don't autostart in the shell, but better make sure first
[14:46] <dgadomski> I've done some tests with this change backported and saw no problems
[14:46] <cyphermox> otherwise the other patch looked okay-ish
[14:46] <cyphermox> in which release?
[14:46] <dgadomski> however, I haven't been able to reproduce the problem in the first place
[14:46] <cyphermox> ok
[14:46] <dgadomski> in vivid
[14:46] <cyphermox> ok
[14:46] <dgadomski> maybe I can prepare a ppa and ask for testing in a comment
[14:47] <cyphermox> bah
[14:47] <cyphermox> let me just check the autostart, then we can just upload to trusty-proposed
[14:48] <dgadomski> backporting to trusty is less trivial, I would need more time to merge it
[14:48] <dgadomski> or we could use the other patch for trusty
[14:50] <cyphermox> sorry i meant vivid :)
[14:51] <dgadomski> phew :)
[14:51] <dgadomski> attaching debdiff to the bug is ok?
[14:52] <cyphermox> sure, but what concerns me is that I'm not sure this is gnome-shell specific
[14:57] <dgadomski> cyphermox: I've analyzed comment #60 and it makes sense, for whatever reason nm-applet hangs there before it failed to obtain shell version in 5 attempts
[14:57] <dgadomski> so it's either a race condition or something else, but this patch should remove that dependency
[15:06] <cyphermox> dgadomski: the short patch with a notify is safest
[15:06] <cyphermox> but I'm still not convinced it will actually really fix the "bugs" people are seeing
[15:07] <dgadomski> cyphermox: for both vivid & trusty?
[15:07] <cyphermox> vivid and utopic
[15:07] <cyphermox> well, for wily too
[15:07] <cyphermox> can you upload?
[15:08] <dgadomski> I can only attach it to the bug (but it's already there), I don't have other upload rights
[15:09] <cyphermox> ok
[15:09] <cyphermox> well I already have a debdiff then
[15:09] <cyphermox> I'll do the uploads now
[15:09] <dgadomski> cool, thanks
[15:28]  * Laney cries at moar autopkgtest failures
[15:46] <cyphermox> dgadomski: uploaded to wily., utopic and trusty, but there currently is a package in -proposed for vivid.
[15:48] <dgadomski> thanks
[15:48] <dgadomski> so I guess it will hit vivid-proposed right after this one will be promoted to -updates, right?
[15:52] <willcooke> hrm.  Just downloaded the W daily image and I can't log in.  From /var/log/lightdm/x-0-greeter.log
[15:52] <willcooke> I see that unity-greeter.vala died
[15:52] <willcooke> is that a red herring?
[15:57] <seb128> willcooke, what happens when you try to log in?
[15:57] <willcooke> seb128, it just sits there
[15:58] <seb128> on the greeter?
[15:58] <seb128> like after you entered your password?
[15:58] <willcooke> I've just got purple salad "Ubuntu 15.10" in the cornet
[15:58] <willcooke> corner
[15:58] <willcooke> the login boxes etc have gone
[15:58] <seb128> can you check what logs are in .cache/upstart ?
[15:58] <seb128> like gnome-session-Unity.log
[15:59] <willcooke> dont have that one
[15:59] <seb128> weird
[15:59] <willcooke> have dbus, jayatana, notify-cgmanager and unity-gtk-module
[15:59] <seb128> anything in ~/.xsession-errors ?
[16:00] <willcooke> $things terminated with status 127
[16:02] <seb128> right, those are not an issue
[16:02] <seb128> what about /var/log/*.log?
[16:02] <seb128> the lightdm and greeter ones
[16:02] <seb128> can you pastebin those?
[16:04] <willcooke> sure
[16:05] <willcooke> seb128, how's this?  http://paste.ubuntu.com/11920734/
[16:06] <seb128> willcooke, it's like you entered wrong password or something
[16:06] <seb128> "[+13.27s] DEBUG: Session: Failed during authentication"
[16:07] <seb128> then you tried a guest session which "worked" it seems
[16:10] <willcooke> seb128, guest session is the same
[16:10] <seb128> not according to the log
[16:10] <willcooke> lies
[16:10] <willcooke> !
[16:10] <willcooke> ;)
[16:11] <seb128>  /var/lib/lightdm-data/guest-TYxDIn/.xsession-errors doesn't have more issues?
[16:11] <seb128> or /var/lib/lightdm-data/guest-TYxDIn/.cache/upstart
[16:11] <seb128> but it looks like your normal session failed on auth issues ... you are sure of your password? not keymap issue?
[16:12] <Laney> password on a live session?
[16:13] <willcooke> I've tired another guest session, same deal, just sits there
[16:13] <willcooke> having checked /var/lib/lightdm-data/guest<whatever>
[16:13] <willcooke> there is no .xsession-errors file
[16:14] <willcooke> or indeed a .cache dir
[16:15]  * willcooke tries a live session from usb
[16:15] <seb128> Laney, who said it's a live session?
[16:15] <willcooke> oh, side note - when I boot up the network notification is just a black oblong
[16:15] <seb128> I assumed it was a new install
[16:15] <Laney> "the W daily image"
[16:15] <willcooke> yeah, install from the daily iso
[16:15] <seb128> right, I assumed it was an install from the daily
[16:15] <Laney> I wouldn't call that booting the daily image
[16:16] <seb128> nobody said that
[16:16] <seb128> he said he downloaded the daily image :p
[16:16] <seb128> anyway
[16:16] <seb128> willcooke, is that a liveCD or an install?
[16:16] <willcooke> install
[16:16] <seb128> if it's an install, was the live session working?
[16:16] <willcooke> just trying a live session from usb now...
[16:16] <seb128> or did you pick the installer mode?
[16:17] <willcooke> I did installer
[16:17] <willcooke> live session just booting....
[16:17] <seb128> k
[16:17] <willcooke> hrm, black screen
[16:18] <willcooke> I can get to tty1
[16:18] <Laney> same here
[16:18] <Laney> something is fucked
[16:18] <seb128> k
[16:19] <seb128> I don't have a daily handy, I can download one but it's likely going to be a first thing tomorrow for me
[16:19] <seb128> I wonder if that's the buggy live-build upload that bugged upstart on the phone
[16:19] <seb128> there was a fix just uploaded for that
[16:19] <Laney> only-ubiquity mode works
[16:19] <Laney> weird
[16:20] <seb128> I guess upstart buggy would only bug the user sessions
[16:20] <seb128> since system is systemd
[16:20] <seb128> unsure about ubiquity mode
[16:20] <Laney> yeah that probably doesn't use upstart
[16:20] <seb128> k, so my bet is on that
[16:20] <seb128> willcooke, I would say to wait tomorrow morning
[16:20] <seb128> it's likely fix commited and going to be good on next iso build
[16:20] <Laney> what is worrying is that the smoke testing passed
[16:20] <willcooke> sure thing, thanks
[16:20] <Laney> ...
[16:21] <seb128> we have a "boot to desktop" test?
[16:21] <Laney> obviously not
[16:21] <seb128> k, I was unsure what is in the tests you just mentioned
[16:22] <seb128> but I guess "not enough"
[16:23] <Laney> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-test-case-dev/ubuntu-test-cases/desktop/files/head:/testsuites/usit/
[16:23] <seb128> k
[16:23] <seb128> nothing about the user session indeed
[16:24] <Laney> I don't know if they run on an installed system or just the image
[16:24] <Laney> cyphermox: halp?
[16:25] <Laney> well, actually a test that live mode works would have been enough here
[16:26] <Laney> indeed I see initctl not found in .cache/upstart/dbus.log
[16:28] <Laney> willcooke: if you reinstall upstart it fixes things, btw
[16:28] <Laney> apt-get install --reinstall upstart
[16:28]  * willcooke tries
[16:29] <willcooke> yah!
[16:29] <willcooke> is good
[16:29] <cyphermox> hello?
[16:30] <Laney> hey, how's it going? ;)
[16:30] <cyphermox> not bad, you? :)
[16:30] <Laney> super
[16:30] <Laney> it's nearly quittin' time
[16:30] <Laney> aaaaaaaaaaaanyway
[16:30] <willcooke> Laney, next time you boot you daily can you see if you also get a black oblong where the "Connected to network" notification should be while in the greeter.  Might just be me
[16:31] <Laney> willcooke: those happen in the greeter on the desktop for me, I think it's a driver/compositing/something thing
[16:31] <Laney> maybe Robert knows
[16:31] <willcooke> oki, thx
[16:31] <Laney> cyphermox: I/we was wondering about the smoke tests... do they operate purely on the image or do/can they work on the resulting installed system?
[16:32] <Laney> cyphermox: Today's image has a busted live session due to missing /sbin/initctl and yet smoke testing passed
[16:32] <cyphermox> they do work on the installed system
[16:32] <cyphermox> that's how lvm test works
[16:32] <Laney> so can we add a test that checks unity comes up, or something?
[16:32] <cyphermox> smoke tests are busted in general, I think they don't fail if it times out in some particular state
[16:32] <cyphermox> well, provided you have one way to test that
[16:33] <cyphermox> I'm thinking we should add a "desktop screenshot" thing at the end, just to be safe.
[16:33] <cyphermox> (if it's not already tehre)
[16:33] <Laney> I just see tests which poke around the filesystem, nothing which does anything desktoppy
[16:33] <Laney> unless that is somewhere else
[16:34] <cyphermox> the empty app thing
[16:34] <cyphermox> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-test-case-dev/ubuntu-test-cases/desktop/files/head:/testsuites/usit/empty_startup_app/
[16:35] <Laney> ah right, cool
[16:35] <Laney> sooo... did that pass?
[16:36] <Laney> do these even all get run?
[16:36] <cyphermox> ah, wait, no
[16:36] <cyphermox> the oem-config one should be failing
[16:36] <cyphermox> if it was run..
[16:37] <Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/wily/view/Smoke%20Testing/job/wily-desktop-amd64-smoke-oem/
[16:37] <Laney> it ran yesterday
[16:37] <Laney> ...
[16:37] <cyphermox> yeah, this is special
[16:37] <cyphermox> jsut a sec
[16:38] <Laney> I'm going to file a bug
[16:38] <Laney> are you the right person to be going to for this stuff or should it be the QA team?
[16:38] <cyphermox> it runs next to nothing: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-test-case-dev/ubuntu-test-cases/desktop/view/head:/runlists/default.run
[16:39] <Laney> HAHA
[16:40] <cyphermox> it's not really owned by anyone
[16:41] <cyphermox> I can enable moar tests and then start the smoke testing again, we'll see how things behave
[16:41] <davmor2> willcooke: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQC7dweRTKU you'll appreciate this :)
[16:42] <cyphermox> Laney: tests still might need adjustin'
[16:43] <Laney> probably
[16:43] <willcooke> davmor2, screw you! :D
[16:43] <cyphermox> ahahaha
[16:43] <davmor2> willcooke: you're welcome
[16:44] <Laney> cyphermox: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-test-cases/+bug/1477227
[16:44] <cyphermox> Laney: thanks
[16:44] <cyphermox> so, about the live session now, I think there are no tests for it
[16:45] <cyphermox> how do we not have an initctl?
[16:46] <Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/live-build/+bug/1477051
[16:47] <cyphermox> cute.
[18:44] <willcooke> gnight
[19:34] <Noskcaj> seb128, Where you going to upload gimp too?
[19:34] <Noskcaj> *were
[19:43] <seb128> Noskcaj, yeah, sorry got sidetracked
[19:43] <seb128> going to be for tomorrow
[19:44] <seb128> or maybe some .au/.nz/.us can sponsor it for you
[19:44] <seb128> you can try asking TheMuso or robert_ancell or on #ubuntu-devel
[19:44] <seb128> night
[19:45] <Noskcaj> Is someone around to upload gimp from ppa:noskcaj/gegl ?
[21:35] <Noskcaj> robert_ancell, Do you have time to upload gimp from ppa:noskcaj/gegl?
[21:35] <robert_ancell> Noskcaj, sure
[21:35] <Noskcaj> seb128 already uploaded the other 2 packages
[21:35] <Noskcaj> ty
[21:35] <robert_ancell> Noskcaj, thanks for doing that migration!
[21:35] <Noskcaj> no problem
[21:36] <Noskcaj> There's some gcc5 build issue with the new gegl, although i'm not sure if it's gegl or ilmbase at fault
[21:36] <Noskcaj> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/212351937/buildlog_ubuntu-wily-amd64.gegl_0.3.0-2ubuntu2~gcc5.1_BUILDING.txt.gz
[21:38] <robert_ancell> Noskcaj, why did you add the build-dep on libjson-glib-dev?
[21:39] <Noskcaj> It was in the debian patch, i've not actually check if it's needed or not
[21:40] <Noskcaj> Could you please drop it?
[21:40] <robert_ancell> sure
[21:42] <robert_ancell> Noskcaj, Uploaded as 2.8.14-1ubuntu2. I also update the changelog to be more detailed.
[21:42] <Noskcaj> thanks
[21:48] <Noskcaj> robert_ancell, looks like we've found out why json-glib was needed
[21:48] <robert_ancell> Noskcaj, heh, I was wondering if that would happen :)
[21:48] <robert_ancell> Uploads are cheap
[21:48] <Noskcaj> for you, i need to pretend i never make a mistake until i can get motu
[21:49] <Noskcaj> I'll have a look and find if the dep should be part of gegl
[21:49] <robert_ancell> Noskcaj, yeah, it's probably in the .pc file


[12:42] <glick> hi
[12:43] <glick> hey can anyone recommend some good reading to start cutting my teeth on kernel development?
[12:44] <crimsun> kernelnewbies.org should still be around.
[12:47] <glick> so linux device drivers and understanding the linux kernel is probably the two most important books to read
[08:44] <cyclopse> hi i use kubuntu 6.06 LTS can somebody help me?
[08:44] <cyclopse> where r the kernel headers located
[08:44] <cyclopse> ?
[08:44] <crimsun> linux-headers-$(uname -r)
[08:44] <crimsun> please use
[08:44] <crimsun> #ubuntu for general support questions
[08:45] <cyclopse> k
[08:50] <raffytaffy> i relized i can change the xchat.conf entery and i fixed my menu issue hehe
[09:14] <bluffer_> BenC i was bugging you some days ago about network card not being detected by ubuntu dapper on vpc
[09:17] <bluffer_> and i changed the eth0 config via system->admin->network-tools to  DHCP after this i can surf the net but smb doesnt show my windows Domain pcs :(
[09:20] <bluffer_> with DHCP ican wget ,syanptic and sudo aptget install some package from net works etc etc only \\pc14 \\pc12 etc are not visible :( neitehr does smbtree shows any resu
[09:48] <doko> how do I build just one flavour without building the others?
[09:49] <fabbione> doko: check debian/rules, you can specify flavour or FLAVOUR.. can't remember offhands
[09:50] <fabbione> doko: or move away the configs you don't want from debian/config/$arch
[09:50] <fabbione> and use binary-debs target
[09:50] <Mithrandir> doko: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelMaintenance#head-898bc4657c398ebb0d3d70597997cb9956d9b2c9
[09:51] <doko> ok, thanks. now I have to find out why an addition to debian/config/powerpc/sp3 is unseen ...
[09:51] <doko> Mithrandir: did look at it, but that didn't answer my question
[09:52] <Mithrandir> doko: uh, then you meant to ask another question than you did.
[09:52] <raffytaffy> has paravirtualization been added rescently?
[09:52] <fabbione> doko: be careful to what you add to the configs.. i suggest you do this...
[09:52] <fabbione> export LC_ALL=C
[09:53] <fabbione> cd debian/config/$arch
[09:53] <fabbione> remove the option you want to change in all config.*
[09:53] <doko> fabbione: just an additional driver
[09:53] <fabbione> fakeroot make -f debian/rules updateconfigs
[09:53] <fabbione> it will prompt you for the question
[09:53] <doko> ahh, ok
[09:53] <fabbione> if it doesn't it means something else is required to enable it
[09:54] <fabbione> it won't ask for questions already answered
[02:51] <TheMuso> c
[04:19] <Whoopie> mjg59: hi, hdaps inverting for xy-, x- or y-axis is missing in feisty kernel. and also tp_smapi. both are in edgy. Shall I open a bugreport?
[04:20] <mjg59> Whoopie: Please do, yes
[04:24] <Nafallo> mjg59: my disk works again after a reboot. I have no idea what happened with the bugger :-)
[04:26] <Whoopie> mjg59: already reported, didn't see: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.20/+bug/33950
[04:27] <Nafallo> https://beta.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/95921
[04:27] <Nafallo> where is the problem? :-)
[04:30] <mjg59> Possibly in the cable detection code
[04:31] <Nafallo> doesn't it look like it's actually using UDMA100 and hdparm is just busted with the new-world-order? :-)
[04:31] <Nafallo> dooh. missed the last two lines :-P
[04:31] <Nafallo> nm me today ;-)
[04:31] <Nafallo> hehe
[09:00] <Nafallo> baah
[09:20] <fabbione> BenC: #96058 <- suckage
[11:17] <PhinnFort> what is the lowlatency kernel?
[11:17] <JoseStefan> BenC, here?
[11:17] <PhinnFort> is it realtime-ish for sound editing and the like, or soft realtime, for desktops?
[11:17] <crimsun> PhinnFort: identical to -generic save preempt is enabled and hz is 1000
[11:18] <PhinnFort> ah, ok
[11:18] <PhinnFort> no preempt big kernel lock, and the like?
[11:18] <crimsun> PhinnFort: it's nowhere close to realtime, but yes, it's more suitable for audio and video work. The use case is UbuntuStudio.
[11:18] <PhinnFort> plain preempt?
[11:18] <JoseStefan> i think bug 84964 is still alive :(
[11:18] <crimsun> PhinnFort: the former. Full preemption within the scope of 2.6.20.
[11:19] <PhinnFort> how many of con-kolivas patches does .20 include?
[11:19] <JoseStefan> How can i provide boot text for a daily-live, without the use of a digital camera (or a lot of typing) ?
[11:19] <PhinnFort> *do you know...
[11:19] <benh> heya folks !
[11:19] <crimsun> PhinnFort: none.
[11:19] <mjg59> Hi Ben
[11:19] <benh> is the feisty kernel based on 2.6.20 "bare" or <IP_ADDRESS> ?
[11:19] <crimsun> PhinnFort: (unless they were merged into 2.6.20)
[11:20] <crimsun> benh: .3, at least
[11:20] <benh> ah ok
[11:20] <PhinnFort> crimsun: that was what i was trying to ask;)
[11:20] <benh> so the ilog2 bug has been properly reverted...
[11:20] <benh> good
[11:20] <benh> Revert "[PATCH]  LOG2: Alter get_order() so that it can make use of ilog2() on a constant"
[11:20] <PhinnFort> i know his scheduler is scheduled to be included soon
[11:20] <PhinnFort> though
[11:20] <benh> without that, random mem corruption on ppc ... no fun :-) should be all right in .3
[11:20] <benh> another questing while there...
[11:21] <benh> why 2 separate CDs for PS3 vs. other powerpc ?
[11:21] <crimsun> a benc question (I don't know offhand, sorry)
[11:21] <mjg59> benh: http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/bcollins/ubuntu-2.6.git;a=commit;h=25239266d554a0442eb676044f03de9d43364c42
[11:21] <JoseStefan> I can't boot feisty, because of jmicron bug, Is there anyway to dump the boot text on to a usbkey, while i'm at the "busy box"
[11:21] <mjg59> So yeah, it's certainly been reverted
[11:21] <mjg59> JoseStefan: Wait for the next daily
[11:22] <benh> I suppose I really need to get a 0.1 of my ps3 gfx bootloader out
[11:22] <benh> so you guys can get some nice icons in your config file to show up on it :-)
[11:22] <crimsun> mjg59: let me know if sound works on your mac* now
[11:22] <mjg59> crimsun: Oh, good question
[11:22] <crimsun> (at your convenience, of course)
[11:22] <benh> there should be no need for separate CDs... unless something is fuckd up with kboot
[11:22] <JoseStefan> mjg59, i understand this daily has the kernel that is supposed to fix the problem, so maybe if i could provide more info, it would be useful
[11:23] <crimsun> JoseStefan: err, -13 just rolled into the archive today, so I'm pretty sure the current daily _doesn't_ have it
[11:23] <PhinnFort> woohoo, ck has it's own wiki now: http://ck.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page
[11:25] <JoseStefan> crimsun, anyway of knowing of what kernel is on the disk, by looking at the disk tree, or opening files on the CD ?
[11:26] <crimsun> JoseStefan: uname -r  in a shell is sufficient
[11:26] <BenC> benh: No room for otheros.bld and ps3 kernel+initrd on normal ppc CD
[11:26] <JoseStefan> crimsun, if it's running, i mean without booting it (live-cd)
[11:26] <benh> BenC: wow, it's -that- cramped ?
[11:27] <benh> BenC: what kernel do you use ? once it's finally properly merged, it should be a single image for all ppc64 including ps3, but we aren't quite there yet
[11:27] <crimsun> JoseStefan: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/source/feisty-src-1.list
[11:27] <crimsun> JoseStefan: in fact, according to that, the current daily has it
[11:29] <JoseStefan> crimsun, does this apply to daily-live as well?
[11:30] <crimsun> JoseStefan: no
[11:30] <mjg59> crimsun: Ok, that's got it, but I needed to manually unmute the "speaker" channel
[11:30] <mjg59> (Which wasn't displayed by default)
[11:31] <crimsun> note that http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/feisty-desktop-i386.list still lists 12.20
[11:31] <crimsun> ^ JoseStefan
[11:31] <crimsun> mjg59: ok, thanks
[11:31] <JoseStefan> crimsun, thanks was looking for a /source subdir :o
[11:31] <mjg59> crimsun: That is, I have separate speaker and headphone options, and no master control
[11:32] <crimsun> mjg59: is your /proc/asound/card0/codec* in a bug report? [I think it is, but $toomanybugs]
[11:33] <mjg59> crimsun: Eh, not sure
[11:33] <JoseStefan> crimsun, ok, now i've learned how to find out what kernel is on a daily-live without going for the surprise element :D
[11:33] <crimsun> JoseStefan: if you're really itching for feisty, just use the current daily
[11:33] <mjg59> Hm. -13 seems to have lost the ability to reboot my mbp.
[11:34] <benh> hrm... they powerpc feisty CDs aren't in the main location... not mirrored :-(
[11:34] <PhinnFort> is there any reason not to use noatime in fstab on a normal desktop system?
[11:34] <JoseStefan> crimsun, i'm trying to help fix this jmicron issue, since it's been there for a while ;)
[11:35] <crimsun> benh: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ports/releases/7.04/beta/
[11:35] <crimsun> (or http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ports/daily/current/ if you want more current)
[11:35] <benh> crimsun: yeah, found that, but not mirrored herre... thanks anyway
[11:35] <benh> (.au is slow when not mirrored)
[11:35] <mjg59> crimsun: Any idea why gnome-volume-applet claims to be altering PCM, but is in fact altering front?
[11:36] <crimsun> benh: http://se.archive.ubuntu.com/mirror/cdimage.ubuntu.com/ports/releases/7.04/beta/
[11:36] <benh> crimsun: not on au.archive.
[11:36] <crimsun> ah
[11:36] <benh> well. ... let me dbl check
[11:36] <crimsun> mjg59: err, no idea about g-v-a
[11:37] <benh> yeah, not there
[11:37] <crimsun> I should stop using pA momentarily to check that. Will see what I can whip up tonight.
[11:40] <benh> same with planetmirror and optus
[11:40] <benh> mirrors don't get "ports"
[11:40] <JoseStefan> ok, thanks for everything, i'll wait until next daily


[04:47] <micahg> mr_pouit: xubuntu seems to have regressed (no education menu, internet menu became network)
[04:48] <micahg> s/education menu/education menu icon/
[08:50] <mr_pouit> yeah, confirmed :/
[08:50] <mr_pouit> I probably dropped too many patches from garcon
[08:50] <mr_pouit> although I checked everything was upstream
[08:50] <mr_pouit> sigh
[09:00] <mr_pouit> bah, no, it's one commit upstream
[09:02] <mr_pouit> http://git.xfce.org/xfce/garcon/commit/?id=799e206b6780ee6bab2bb56debf8412dca0346f5 breaks the menu file choice
[09:28] <mr_pouit> micahg: Bug #753274
[14:58] <micahg> mr_pouit: thanks
[15:09] <charlie-tca> Good morning
[16:44] <Aquina> hello charlie! :-)
[16:44] <charlie-tca> Hello, Aquina
[17:16] <ochosi> charlie-tca: is there anyone to take care of xubuntu-docs?
[17:19] <charlie-tca> Book em dano got the together, they should be ready for natty
[17:19] <mr_pouit> if they are ready, I'll upload
[17:19] <mr_pouit> when is the meeting?
[17:19] <charlie-tca> 19:00 UTC
[17:19] <charlie-tca> 3 hours
[17:20] <mr_pouit> eh, okay
[17:23] <ochosi> charlie-tca: nice
[17:23] <ochosi> sry guys, i can't attend the meeting today (friend's birthday)
[17:23] <ochosi> but i guess i don't have many news anyway
[17:23] <knome> i don't know if i can attend either...
[17:24] <ochosi>  * icon-theme was updated to fix gdm, xfce-panel-plugins etc.
[19:00] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu community meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 60 minutes. Everyone is invited to attend. Agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings
[19:15] <beardygnome> charlie-tca: is the xubuntu meeting still un the ubuntu-meeting room?
[19:15] <Unit193> beardygnome: Yes,  it's in #ubuntu-meeting
[19:15] <knome> beardygnome, starts in 45mins
[19:16] <beardygnome> cool, thanks
[19:52] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu community meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 8 minutes, or when TB finishes theirs. Everyone is invited to attend. Agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings
[19:53] <pleia2> charlie-tca: no updates from me (I'm alone at the office today, so can't particpate in meting)
[19:53] <charlie-tca> okay
[19:53] <pleia2> oh, I nudged canonical on that ticket, no reply
[19:53] <pleia2> for wordpress
[19:54] <charlie-tca> We will be looking at better metting day and time, Maybe I need to send an email out for that.
[19:54] <charlie-tca> Thanks for following up with canonicla
[19:54] <charlie-tca> um, canonical, even
[20:35] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: I forgot the hard freeze for natty date - Beta 2 freeze - 4/11 (at UTC 09:00 ) - hard freeze
[20:36] <micahg> oh, it's UTC 09:00
[20:36] <micahg> ?
[20:36] <charlie-tca> Unseeded Universe/Multiverse Freeze - 4/26 (at UTC 12:00)
[20:37] <charlie-tca> yeah
[20:37] <charlie-tca> times seem to move around
[20:37] <charlie-tca> any other freeze we need? kernel and main?
[20:38] <charlie-tca> Main/Seeded Final Freeze 14 days (4/14->4/28)
[20:38] <charlie-tca> but I don't have the time for that one
[20:41] <charlie-tca> should I ML the freeze dates/ times?
[20:54] <Unit193> I take it it's fine to subscribe to the dev ML to just watch and know what's going on? (I just did)
[20:55] <knome> Unit193, of course.
[20:59] <Unit193> I'm at all the meetings and in here all the time, but was missing all the stuff put out on the ML
[21:02] <charlie-tca> yup, that is a good idea, then
[21:03] <Unit193> You sure did a good job on 11.04 (Testing the beta)
[21:04] <charlie-tca> We try harder, we are number 3
[21:05] <charlie-tca> knome: email will go to ML for new times for meeting.
[21:05] <knome> charlie-tca, right, thanks


[10:00] <AlanBell> hi all, we have an IRCC team meeting over in #ubuntu-meeting in one hour from now
[10:03] <ikonia> I am doing my best to attend but maybe driving
[10:04] <AlanBell> probably not a wise combination
[10:05] <ikonia> no, it would not be my best decision
[15:11] <LjL> ftr <Guest81454> is not using Ubuntu but Backtrack, found out in PM
[16:14] <oCean> !~bittorrent
[16:14] <oCean> !-bittorrent
[16:16] <oCean> !no torrent is <reply> Some torrent clients: Transmission (GTK and terminal-based), Deluge-Torrent, Freeloader, BitStormLite, BitTornado-GUI (GTK), KTorrent (KDE), QTorrent (Qt), Azureus/Vuse (Java), !Frostwire (Java), TorrentFlux (web-based), bittornado, rTorrent, cTorrent, bittorrent, aria2 (terminal-based) - FAQ: http://www.bittorrent.com/help/faq
[16:16] <oCean> almost
[16:17] <oCean> !torrent is <sed> /$/ - See also !P2P
[16:17] <oCean> !torrent is <sed> /$/ - See also !P2P/
[16:17] <oCean> !torrent
[16:43] <EvilResistance> opinions on the discussion of 'aircrack' in channels?
[16:44] <EvilResistance> i know that at least one or two operators in #ubuntu / #ubuntu-offtopic are not fond of that discussion
[16:44] <LjL> it's a package in the repos, i don't see why it wouldn't be discussed
[16:44] <EvilResistance> LjL:  my take on it, if you're open to opinions, is this:
[16:45] <EvilResistance> aircrack, and other wifi security cracking tools, should be considered offtopic because in most cases of its discussion, it is discussed under the ruse of security, when it is more than likely used to actually gain access to a protected wifi one shouldnt have access to.
[16:46] <LjL> well i disagree with that stance, we shouldn't judge what "in most cases" something is discussed for.
[16:46] <LjL> if it's clear that someone *specifically* is using it to that purpose, then don't help them
[16:46] <EvilResistance> i do agree that *basic walkthroughs* would be decently on-topic
[16:46] <EvilResistance> i do not agree with answering of specific questions outside a basic walkthrough, if you know what i mena
[16:47] <LjL> err
[16:47] <LjL> i was saying the opposite thing
[16:47] <LjL> walkthroughs are not for #ubuntu-offtopic really
[16:47] <EvilResistance> I come from the cyber security field, so the discussion of aircrack in general is something i dont agree with
[16:47] <LjL> and i think if someone wants to crack his or her (or others') network, they can have the decency to do their own research on how exactly to do that
[16:47] <EvilResistance> last week, someone cracked the passcode to a low-importance state-owned wifi network with aircrack
[16:48] <EvilResistance> i only identified it because i was monitoring the network for errors, but you understand my concerns
[16:48] <LjL> so your stance is that security shouldn't be discussed?
[16:48] <LjL> and you think not discussing security helps keep it?
[16:48] <AlanBell> the package should install and run, and we can tell people where the man page is and other documentation
[16:48] <LjL> AlanBell: in #ubuntu. in #ubuntu-offtopic, i don't see why we can't also talk about security.
[16:48] <EvilResistance> i'm not saying security can't be discussed
[16:49] <EvilResistance> my only concern is with my historic monitoring of #Ubuntu channels and what the discussions of aircrack produce
[16:49]  * EvilResistance has seen questions regarding it in #ubuntu and all other ubuntu channels dealt with negatively (in general)
[16:49] <LjL> well i don't think we should go beyond instructions on installing it and reaching the manpage *in #ubuntu*
[16:49] <LjL> but it's not #ubuntu we're talking about
[16:50] <LjL> in fact i was the one who asked to take the discussion out of #ubuntu
[16:50] <EvilResistance> <ubottu> Some topics are controversial and often end in negativity.  The topics are not banned; stating your position is ok, but trolling, baiting, hostility or repetition are not. If you are asked to stop, do so politely. Disputes to !appeals, please adhere to !freenode Policy and the !Cod
[16:50] <EvilResistance> eOfConduct
[16:50] <EvilResistance> indeed
[16:50] <EvilResistance> but while i quote ubottu here...
[16:50] <EvilResistance> i point at "potentially illegal activities"
[16:50] <EvilResistance> (that's !o4o btw)
[16:50] <LjL> i point at "this topics are not banned"
[16:50] <LjL> these*
[16:51] <LjL> also it's an interesting issue you raise
[16:51] <LjL> what is a "potentially" illegal activity?
[16:51] <LjL> should we not talk about knives because "potentially" they can be used to kill people, other than cutting vegetables?
[16:52] <LjL> i'd much rather that factoid said "illegal activities"
[16:52] <AlanBell> then we get into a jurisdiction debate
[16:52] <EvilResistance> i think that potentially illegal activites should at the least cover topics such as hacking, cracking wifi security, etc.
[16:52] <LjL> well
[16:52] <LjL> anyway
[16:52] <topyli> i think it refers to different legislations around the world. it *can* be taken to mean aircrack tutorials
[16:52] <EvilResistance> namely because those can be considered illegal activities
[16:52] <LjL> using aircrack is not a "potentially illegal activity"
[16:52] <EvilResistance> hence why i bring this up here
[16:53] <LjL> cracking networks is a "potentially illegal activity"
[16:53] <topyli> aircrack is certainly legal, breaking someone's wifi keys may be
[16:53] <topyli> right
[16:53] <AlanBell> anyhow, already if you are uncomfortable with a discussion you can ask them to stop, and expect them to do so politely
[16:53] <LjL> but anyway don't worry, dexter is already scaring the guy away
[16:53] <topyli> heh
[16:55] <LjL> AlanBell: eh i don't agree with that either, if you're trolling, baiting, being hostile or repeating, then you must stop when asked, but otherwise, should i really stop discussing anything just because someone arbitrarily decides i should?
[16:56] <Tm_T> approach aircrack discussion similarly to torrent discussion: you help people to use them for good (distributing Ubuntu for example in case of torrents) but make full stop if there's any indication to questionable activities
[16:56] <Tm_T> or something
[16:59] <LjL> now, slander and libel - those are things that should definitely be disallowed.
[17:02] <mneptok> i'm a US gun owner. i'll always side with, "do not punish the tool because some people choose to wield it wrongly."
[17:03] <mneptok> aircrack can have legitimate uses. i think discussion of the package and how to install and get basic usage should be allowed. no one is forced to participate, and the topic is never allowed to veer into actual illegal/morally questionable ground.
[17:05] <topyli> well we have many packages that can be used illegally and/or "wrong"
[17:06] <mneptok> exactly.
[17:07] <mneptok> if the MPAA or RIAA read this channel's logs with the same regularity as some, they'd be /join-ing about now to discuss BitTorrent
[17:07] <Tm_T> indeed
[17:08] <topyli> which would be nice. it's about time they learned to use it!
[18:01] <LjL> someone please examine this pastebin carefully  http://pastebin.com/Fzs9Dj3Z and tell me if they're thinking what i'm thinking
[18:30] <AlanBell> LjL: if it just isn't executable it should say permission denied rather than file not found
[18:32] <LjL> AlanBell: yeah, but also, bash says "No such file or directory" for me, not "File or directory doesn't exist", and certainly not "Filee or directory doesn't exist"
[18:32] <LjL> maybe i see evil where there's none but...
[18:33] <AlanBell> chkrootkit would be my next command, yes
[18:38] <topyli> maybe the user just doesn't know how to copy/paste from a terminal, or maybe they translated from another language
[18:38] <LjL> hm
[19:57] <LjL> @mark #ubuntu-offtopic Masters Using much-less-than-acceptable epiteths for someone
[20:01] <LjL> @mark #ubuntu-offtopic I've had enough of dexter, he constantly provokes people, and accuses people assuming they're always acting in bad faith.  => based on when we started doing ubottu poking, started doing eir poking, and when those stats go down, I wouldn't give much credit to ubottu's pokings.
[21:04] <Tm_T> dax: ubottu does poking in private, I think that's the real difference
[21:04] <dax> "11:56:22 <AlanBell> improving eir and contributing back enhancements to freenode is an appealing concept, but fewer bots seems like a less complicated architecture" => I strongly agree with this, especially since I looked at the eir bug list and the majority of them are either irrelevant to upstream or things we'd consider not a bug :\
[21:05] <dax> Tm_T: ubottu's poking was ignored is the difference I saw. Several very banful operators completely disregarded it.
[21:05] <dax> plus unremoved FloodBot bans were a problem
[21:07] <dax> and this: "<topyli> afaik eir also has handy autoremove timeouts, which ubottu doesn't" is essentially what brought the banlist size down anyway, not notifications, imho
[21:08] <dax> That's the main feature we wanted when eir was added, and if ubottu did it instead (on an opt-in basis) that'd adequately cover it, imho
[21:08] <Tm_T> dax: yu, I think why ubottu's nags were ignored is because they were private
[21:09] <dax> less annoying public nagging might also be nice, but I don't know what y'all consider less annoying (since notices don't annoy me)
[23:56] <trinitas> LjL: my grounded time is up!!
[23:57] <trinitas> sitll banned :/
[23:58] <trinitas> hello??


[07:06] <dholbach> good morning
[07:12] <svij> moin dholbach
[07:12] <dholbach> hey svij
[07:13] <svij> dholbach: forgot to mention yesterday that dpm s Portugal Holidays sounds like more fun that Meck-Pomm :P
[07:14] <dholbach> svij, right :)
[07:14] <dholbach> I'll be back to more exciting travels at some stage again :)
[07:15] <svij> sure ;) you're india travel photos from a few years back looked more interesting! ;)
[07:16]  * dholbach hugs svij
[07:17] <dpm> I see, it's holiday competition season ;-)
[07:17]  * dpm hugs svij and dholbach
[07:17]  * svij rehugs dpm and dholbach
[07:18] <svij> my summer holidays were actually back in January
[07:20] <svij> dpm: btw, can you please submit your Ubuntu Phone Talk for ubucon.de asap? The deadline was on monday and yours is missing, we're nearly finished with the first draft of the program schedule :)
[07:23]  * dholbach hugs dpm back :)
[07:23] <dholbach> svij, do you have enough submissions?
[07:23] <svij> dholbach: yep
[07:23] <dholbach> excellent!
[07:24] <svij> we had ~13 before monday (the last day) and another ~13 on the last day :)
[07:25] <svij> dholbach: oh btw, do you may have any suggestion for a place where we could do the second social event on saturday? We're in "Route 66" on Friday, but we don't have a restaurant (or sth similar) for saturday…
[07:26] <dholbach> how many folks do you expect?
[07:27] <svij> ~30-50
[07:28] <svij> or more like 30-40 I think
[07:29] <dholbach> let me ping doko
[07:29] <svij> doko?
[07:29] <dholbach> Matthias doko Klose
[07:29] <svij> we have 25 registrations for the ubucon so far, 14 ticked the "social event" for saturday
[07:30] <svij> oh I don't know him
[07:30] <dholbach> he lives in Berlin too
[07:30] <svij> is he also coming? :)
[07:30] <dholbach> he should :)
[07:30] <svij> great :)
[07:30] <dholbach> hey hey
[07:30] <dholbach> thanks doko
[07:30] <svij> hi doko
[07:30] <dholbach> doko, svij is organising ubucon in Berlin later this year
[07:31] <dholbach> and was trying to think of a place for 30-50 to meet up for drinks and dinner as a social event on the saturday
[07:31] <dholbach> doko, and svij also asked if you were going to come to ubucon as well ;-)
[07:31] <dholbach> http://ubucon.de/2015/
[07:31] <svij> :)
[07:43] <svij> dholbach: I also had the idea to have a "bug triage" talk/workshop, on how to report and triage bugs on launchpad correctly, what do you think?
[07:43] <dholbach> sure, sounds like a good idea
[07:44] <svij> can you do that? :)
[07:44] <dholbach> I'm not sure
[07:45] <svij> I'm not really familiar with that topic, that's why I want a talk about that
[07:45] <svij> "I'm not sure" is the wrong answer.  :D
[07:46] <dholbach> yeah, I think I'm going to have a few other things on my plate until then
[07:46] <svij> hmm…
[07:56] <dholbach> doko, do you have an idea where we could meet up?
[07:57] <doko> dholbach, I'll be in Hamburg this weekend
[07:57] <dholbach> bah
[07:59] <svij> sad, if you still have a recommendation for us, that'll be great
[08:01] <dholbach> you could try to ping larsu about it
[21:50] <joseargcapfed> hola a todos hay alguien...