[00:22] <djbeenie> hello, any way to use my directtv remote with my usb-uirt2 transmitter?
[06:20] <Pwen> hi all. question about mythtv-backend and upstart. my backend won't start using upstart, but will if I manually run it from the commandline. when trying to start it using upstart/init.d it prints this to the log:
[06:20] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 15:19:18.875 Using configuration directory = /.mythtv
[06:20] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 15:19:18.886 Cannot locate your home directory. Please set the environment variable HOME
[06:20] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 15:19:18.897 Failed to init MythContext.
[06:22] <Pwen> I guess I could symlink /.mythtv to /home/mythtv/.mythtv, couldn't I?
[06:22] <Pwen> that should work.
[06:23] <Pwen> ... nope
[06:32] <Gibby> how do you start it?
[06:32] <Pwen> sudo service mythtv-backend start
[06:33] <Pwen> or sudo /etc/init.d/mythtv-backend start
[06:33] <Gibby> hmm ok, give me a second I saw this problem last week
[06:33] <Gibby> what is the userid you use to login with?
[06:34] <Pwen> its not mythtv, I changed the /etc/init/mythtv-backend.conf to say user=owen (my username)
[06:34] <Pwen> and all the correct mythtv configs etc are in /home/owen/.mythtv/
[06:34] <Gibby> open a terminal and do id owen
[06:34] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:~$ id owen
[06:34] <Pwen> uid=1000(owen) gid=1000(owen) groups=1000(owen),4(adm),20(dialout),24(cdrom),44(video),46(plugdev),105(mythtv),113(admin),115(sambashare),118(lpadmin)
[06:35] <Pwen> so when I run mythtvbackend from a terminal in that username, it works fine
[06:35] <Gibby> change it back to start with mythtv ID, no reason to start it as your ID
[06:36] <Pwen> it doesnt work with user mythtv either
[06:37] <Gibby> did you do anything to the startup config's?
[06:37] <Pwen> aside from changing the username, nope
[06:38] <Pwen> its the most recent version, I updated just before
[06:38] <Pwen> but my backend hasnt auto started since the switch to upstart
[06:38] <Gibby> did it ever work?
[06:38] <Pwen> no it never has, I am just getting around to fixing it now :)
[06:38] <Gibby> ahhhhh ok
[06:40] <Gibby> your backend has a static IP right?
[06:40] <Pwen> yep of course
[06:41] <Gibby> copy you /etc/init.d/mythtv-backend and put it in pastebin.org
[06:42] <Pwen> Ive been reading on the forums about it, they say the fix is to specify a --user, but it doesnt :(
[06:42] <Pwen> http://pastebin.org/791853
[06:45] <Gibby> what version is the OS?
[06:45] <Pwen> 10.04 I believe
[06:46] <Gibby> Use this for your /etc/init.d/mythtv-backend script
[06:46] <Gibby> http://pastebin.org/791878
[06:46] <Gibby> You shouldn't have to relink it to upstart since you aren't change the name
[06:48] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:~$ sudo service mythtv-backend start
[06:48] <Pwen> start: Unknown job: mythtv-backend
[06:48] <Gibby> cd /etc/init.d
[06:48] <Gibby> ls -al|grep backend
[06:48] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ ls -al | grep backend
[06:48] <Pwen> lrwxrwxrwx   1 root root    21 2010-08-28 14:56 mythtv-backend -> /lib/init/upstart-job
[06:50] <tgm4883> Pwen, do you have a /etc/init/mythtv-backend.conf
[06:52] <Gibby> Pwen: /etc/init/mythtv-backend.conf should look like this http://pastebin.org/791910
[06:53]  * tgm4883 goes back to mythbuntu-bare
[06:53] <Gibby> Pwen: After you check that and it still doesn't work do: cd /etc/init.d then sudo update-rc.d mythtv-backend defaults
[06:54] <Gibby> tgm4883: bare? like back?
[06:54] <tgm4883> Gibby, yep ;)
[06:54] <tgm4883> BAckup and REstore
[06:55] <Gibby> becareful, don't want any baby myth's
[06:55] <Gibby> hmm Guess i should backup... just in case
[06:55] <tgm4883> Gibby, won't get any, i'm just working with the backend right now ;)
[06:55] <Pwen> Gibby: yeah I pasted that in to mine
[06:55] <Gibby> lucky... mine does like it there
[06:56] <Gibby> *doesn't
[06:56] <Pwen> still prints an unknown job message after the rc.d update
[06:59] <Gibby> what is the out put of runlevel?
[06:59] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ runlevel
[06:59] <Pwen> N 2
[07:00] <Gibby> :?
[07:00] <Gibby> dpkg -l upstart
[07:00] <Pwen> ... I guess that's not quite right?
[07:00] <Gibby> no it is right....
[07:00] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ dpkg -l upstart
[07:00] <Pwen> Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Purge/Hold
[07:00] <Pwen> | Status=Not/Inst/Cfg-files/Unpacked/Failed-cfg/Half-inst/trig-aWait/Trig-pend
[07:00] <Pwen> |/ Err?=(none)/Reinst-required (Status,Err: uppercase=bad)
[07:00] <Pwen> ||/ Name                               Version                            Description
[07:00] <Gibby> just the last line
[07:01] <Pwen> ii  upstart                            0.6.5-7                            event-based init daemon
[07:01] <Gibby> dpkg -l mythtv-backend
[07:01] <Pwen> ii  mythtv-backend                     0.24.0~trunk25893-0ubuntu0~mythbun A personal video recorder application (server)
[07:02] <Gibby> what happens if you run /etc/inti.d/mythtv-backend start?
[07:02] <Pwen> same thing: that is, nothing, but same error message in the log
[07:02] <Gibby> and you verified with ps -ef that it is not running?
[07:04] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ sudo /etc/init.d/mythtv-backend restart
[07:04] <Pwen> Rather than invoking init scripts through /etc/init.d, use the service(8)
[07:04] <Pwen> utility, e.g. service mythtv-backend restart
[07:04] <Pwen> Since the script you are attempting to invoke has been converted to an
[07:04] <Pwen> Upstart job, you may also use the restart(8) utility, e.g. restart mythtv-backend
[07:04] <Pwen> mythtv-backend start/running, process 4302
[07:04] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ sudo ps -ef | grep 4302
[07:04] <Pwen> owen      4325  2422  0 16:04 pts/0    00:00:00 grep --color=auto 4302
[07:05] <Gibby> ps -ef|grep back
[07:05] <Gibby> dpkg -l ureadahead
[07:06] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ ps -ef|grep back
[07:06] <Pwen> owen      4334  2422  0 16:06 pts/0    00:00:00 grep --color=auto back
[07:07] <Pwen> ii  ureadahead                         0.100.0-4.1.3                      Read required files in advance
[07:07] <Gibby> are any other upstart jobs failing?
[07:07] <Pwen> dont think so, heaps of the init.d scripts were linked to upstart when the changeover happened
[07:08] <Pwen> and the system works fine aside from autostarting the myth backend
[07:08] <Gibby> cat /etc/lsb-release
[07:08] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ cat /etc/lsb-release
[07:08] <Pwen> DISTRIB_ID=Ubuntu
[07:08] <Pwen> DISTRIB_RELEASE=10.04
[07:08] <Pwen> DISTRIB_CODENAME=lucid
[07:08] <Pwen> DISTRIB_DESCRIPTION="Ubuntu 10.04.1 LTS"
[07:11] <tgm4883> Pwen, can you pastebin your /etc/init.d/mythtv-backend
[07:12] <Pwen> http://pastebin.org/791952
[07:13] <Pwen> so ... that looks exactly like the stuff I put into /etc/init/mythtv-backend before, for upstart
[07:13] <Pwen> I have since changed that back btw
[07:15] <Gibby> brb
[07:15] <tgm4883> out of curiosity, what does this return
[07:15] <tgm4883> service mythtv-backend stop
[07:15] <tgm4883> service mythtv-backend status
[07:16] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ sudo service mythtv-backend stop
[07:16] <Pwen> stop: Unknown instance:
[07:16] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ service mythtv-backend status
[07:16] <Pwen> mythtv-backend stop/waiting
[07:16] <tgm4883> well thats at least semi-better
[07:16] <Pwen> when I 'start', it says its started and gives a PID, but ps ax | grep <pid> doesnt turn anything up
[07:17] <tgm4883> so start says that it starts
[07:17] <tgm4883> anything in the backend log?
[07:18] <Pwen> yeap
[07:18] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 16:04:08.794 mythbackend version: trunk [25893] www.mythtv.org
[07:18] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 16:04:08.794 Using runtime prefix = /usr
[07:18] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 16:04:08.798 Using configuration directory = /.mythtv
[07:18] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 16:04:08.809 Cannot locate your home directory. Please set the environment variable HOME
[07:18] <Zinn> [www.mythtv.org] MythTV, Open Source DVR
[07:18] <Pwen> 2010-08-28 16:04:08.820 Failed to init MythContext.
[07:19] <Pwen> its starting as the wrong user, like it is ignoring the --user=$USER part of the upstart script
[07:20] <tgm4883> and you have a /etc/init/mythtv-backend.conf file and it sets the USER?
[07:21] <Pwen> yep
[07:21] <Pwen> http://pastebin.org/791859
[07:21] <Pwen> thats my file
[07:22] <Pwen> no matter what user I specify, by it mythtv or owen, the result is the same
[07:22] <Pwen> tho when I run mythbackend from a console in the user owen, it works fine
[07:23] <tgm4883> thats cause the issue isn't the user you are setting
[07:23] <tgm4883> Pwen, what about "echo $LANG"
[07:24] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ echo $LANG
[07:24] <Pwen> en_AU.UTF-8
[07:25] <tgm4883> ok, try this
[07:25] <tgm4883> edit that script, and replace '--user $USER' with '--user mythtv'
[07:25] <tgm4883> that way it won't try to use the variable
[07:26] <Pwen> same result - w/ user "mythtv" or "owen"
[07:27] <tgm4883> ok, then instead replace $ARGS with the full ARGS list '--logfile /var/log/mythtv/mythbackend.log --user mythtv'
[07:28] <tgm4883> that way only the last line matters
[07:29] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ ps ax | grep 4775 4775 ?        Ss     0:00 /bin/sh -e /proc/self/fd/12 4800 pts/0    S+     0:00 grep --color=auto 4775
[07:29] <Pwen> now there is a process with that id
[07:29] <tgm4883> service mythtv-backend status
[07:29] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$ service mythtv-backend status
[07:29] <Pwen> mythtv-backend start/running, process 4775
[07:29] <Pwen> owen@owen-htpc:/etc/init.d$
[07:29] <Pwen> :D
[07:29] <tgm4883> ok sec
[07:30] <tgm4883> what language/locale settings did you pick during installation?
[07:31] <Pwen> I cant remember, that was a long time ago
[07:31] <Pwen> but I would assume I picked English/Australia
[07:31] <Pwen> or Brisbane/Australia
[07:32] <tgm4883> ok, let me try to reproduce here
[07:33] <tgm4883> hmm, no australia keyboard layout
[07:33] <Pwen> for keyboard I pick standard US 104 key
[07:33] <tgm4883> ok
[07:34] <tgm4883> I chose an AU timezone, so hopefully it will set it to that
[07:39] <tgm4883> almost done installing
[07:40] <Gibby> sorry i am back, Pwen: what was the fix?
[07:40] <tgm4883> Gibby, we basically bypassed the variables in the backend conf
[07:40] <tgm4883> so now i'm trying to reproduce it
[07:40] <Gibby> ahh
[07:40] <Gibby> where the permissions correct on the file?
[07:41] <tgm4883> yea
[07:41] <Gibby> and was the init script properly calling the conf file?
[07:41] <tgm4883> yep
[07:41] <tgm4883> I think it might be a language thing
[07:41] <Gibby> Pwen: Did you upgrade from 9.04 or 9.10?
[07:42] <Pwen> 9.10
[07:43] <tgm4883> booting up now
[07:44] <Gibby> I read there were alot of issues with upstart and mythbackend upgrading from 9 to 10
[07:46] <Pwen> yeah :/
[07:46] <tgm4883> well not causing issues out of the box, let me upgrade to trunk
[07:47]  * tgm4883 shrugs
[07:47] <tgm4883> idk, that is odd
[07:47] <tgm4883> it will probably break on upgrades though
[07:48] <Pwen> yeah
[07:49] <Pwen> copying over my custom file on each update wont be as annoying as manually starting it every reboot
[07:49] <tgm4883> true
[07:49] <Pwen> it'll get fixed eventually I'm sure :p
[07:49] <tgm4883> superm1, thoughts on why the backend upstart script doesn't like variables on an upgrade from 9.10?
[07:49] <Pwen> just going to reboot to try it out, brb
[07:49] <tgm4883> ok
[07:52] <tgm4883> he better hurry back, i'm falling asleep here
[07:53] <Pwen> yeap works fine now
[07:53] <Pwen> after a reboot
[07:53] <tgm4883> sweet
[07:53] <Gibby> 5hr energy... no 2pm feeling later
[07:54] <tgm4883> Gibby, but what does that say about 2AM?
[07:54] <Gibby> lol... i took 1 2hrs agos
[07:54] <yardleydobon> Every once in a while the sound in a new recording gets screwed up, but will be fine again at the next recording. Does this bug sound familiar to anyone?
[07:55] <tgm4883> yardleydobon, you are using a ivtv tuner aren't you. Like the PVR-150
[07:55] <yardleydobon> tgm4883: one of the hauppauges.
[07:55] <Pwen> oh yeah while I'm here, another question or two... what's this all about?
[07:55] <tgm4883> yardleydobon, and you are using composite in?
[07:55] <Pwen> The following packages will be upgraded: mythtv-common
[07:56] <Pwen> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/mythtv-common_0.24.0~trunk25893-0ubuntu0~mythbuntu1_i386.deb (--unpack): trying to overwrite '/usr/share/mythtv/mythconverg_backup.pl', which is also in package mythtv-database 2:0.24.0~trunk-24111-0ubuntu1
[07:56] <yardleydobon> tgm4883: yep
[07:56] <tgm4883> yardleydobon, yep, I know that issue
[07:56] <tgm4883> Pwen, yea, thats my bad, although i'm not sure why
[07:56] <yardleydobon> tgm4883: homed in on that one like a laser. know a fix?
[07:57] <tgm4883> yardleydobon, yea, there is a channel channel change script that you need to know. It's a workaround, not a fix
[07:57] <tgm4883> Pwen, i'll check the packaging in a sec
[07:57] <tgm4883> Gibby, so much for bed ;)
[07:58] <tgm4883> yardleydobon, http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Ivtv_Channel_changer
[07:58] <Zinn> [www.mythtv.org] Ivtv Channel changer - MythTV
[07:59] <tgm4883> you need to use that to change channels
[08:00] <Pwen> tgm4883: also, is it just because I am running trunk that sometimes this happens?
[08:00] <Pwen> ii  mythvideo                          0.24.0~trunk25854-0ubuntu0~mythbun A generic video player frontend module for MythTV
[08:00] <Pwen> ii  mythtv-backend                     0.24.0~trunk25893-0ubuntu0~mythbun A personal video recorder application (server)
[08:00] <tgm4883> Pwen, you mean different versions?
[08:00] <Pwen> (different trunk versions, even tho everything is "up to date")
[08:00] <Pwen> yeah
[08:01] <tgm4883> yea pretty much. Upstream will do a commit or move something around that breaks a build. Takes us a day or so usually to fix it
[08:02] <Pwen> Im going to blame that situation on my LCD working every other update as well in that case ;-P
[08:03] <Pwen> tgm4883: sorry, last question: ETA for mythtv-common file conflict fix?
[08:03] <tgm4883> Pwen, sec, looking at it now
[08:03] <tgm4883> IIRC, if you do the update twice it works
[08:04] <Pwen> nah Ive tried a few times
[08:05] <tgm4883> wait, you had the avenard repos didn't you
[08:05] <yardleydobon> tgm4883: thanks!
[08:05] <tgm4883> yardleydobon, yw
[08:06] <Pwen> tgm4883: I *did*, but I dont think I do anymore since 9.10/0.24
[08:06] <Pwen> err 10.04
[08:06] <tgm4883> yea you do, your mythtv database package is from there
[08:06] <tgm4883> you have a few packages left over anyway
[08:07] <tgm4883> mythtv-database 2:0.24.0~trunk-24111-0ubuntu1
[08:07] <tgm4883> I thought that version number looked funny
[08:07] <Pwen> oh
[08:07] <Pwen> righto. should I fix that somehow?
[08:07] <tgm4883> hmm
[08:08] <tgm4883> IIRC, his website has info on how to go back to mythbuntu packages.
[08:08] <tgm4883> i'd have to check that
[08:12] <Pwen> hmmm ok Im having a look
[08:12] <tgm4883> Pwen, I can't find it. I would think it is probably a remove then reinstall of the mythtv-database package
[08:12] <tgm4883> i'd also have a look and see what other packages you have laying around from his repo
[08:13] <Pwen> if I remove mythtv-database, it will remove the mythtv metapackage and everything else along with it
[08:13] <Pwen> if I do that, I can reinstall and all my config/databases will still exist, right?
[08:14] <tgm4883> all of your configs should be fine. Thats kept in the db and it's not removing mysql
[08:14] <tgm4883> and I don't think it would touch config.xml
[08:14] <tgm4883> of course, you could probably also fire up synaptic and force a specific version
[08:14] <tgm4883> which is probably the better choice
[08:15] <Pwen> I did not know you could do that
[08:17] <Pwen> so I have the options of
[08:17] <Pwen> 0.24.0~trunk25893
[08:17] <Pwen> 0.23.0+fixes24158
[08:17] <Pwen> 0.24.0~trunk24111
[08:18] <Pwen> the last is what I currently have
[08:18] <Pwen> I guess the first is the 0.24 of mythbuntu, what you guys do
[08:18] <Pwen> and 0.23 is obviously the stable release
[08:19] <Pwen> there are lots of packages in here that are wrong
[08:19] <Pwen> going to force version them all
[08:20]  * Pwen crosses fingers
[08:20] <Pwen> the F1 quali is on in a few hours, and I have a dinner date, hope stuff doesnt break ;-P
[08:20] <Pwen> haha
[08:26] <Pwen> ok, no more 24111 packages
[08:26] <Pwen> rebooting time
[08:33] <Gibby> http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/man-severs-privates-at-airport-to-avoid-extradition-reports/story-e6frfku0-1225911173354
[08:33] <Zinn> [www.news.com.au] Man severs privates at airport to avoid extradition - reports |  News.com.au
[08:33] <Pwen> ok so now I have the correct backend version
[08:33] <Pwen> it does start up properly
[08:33] <Pwen> I can watch live tv
[08:33] <Pwen> but all my plugins are the wrong version
[08:33] <Pwen> presumably that will be fixed in a few days
[08:34] <Pwen> why cut your man jewels, and not something else?
[08:34] <Pwen> god what a crazy man
[08:39] <Gibby> i know lol
[08:50] <Pwen> ok well all my stuff is at the proper latest versions now
[08:50] <Pwen> ^_^
[08:50] <Pwen> thanks for your help guys
[15:41] <Twiggy2cents> Matt, You awake?
[22:09] <klucas> Hi All, anyone else have all their videos show up in the 'Watch Recordings' menu after they went from 9.xx to 10.xx?
[22:10] <tgm4883> nope
[22:10] <tgm4883> klucas, you mean everything from mythvideo?
[22:10] <klucas> Humm, in 9.xx only the items that I'd recorded off the antena were in there now all the videos show up there.
[22:11] <klucas> tgm4883: yes.  mythvideo has apparently taken over :)
[22:11] <tgm4883> klucas, what is the output of 'dpkg -l mythtv-frontend mythvideo'
[22:11] <klucas> on the frontend or backend?
[22:11] <tgm4883> both
[22:12] <klucas> one sec
[22:12] <tgm4883> I just need to last two lines of each
[22:12] <tgm4883> the part that shows the version number
[22:12] <klucas> tgm4883: cool one sec
[22:14] <klucas> 0.23.0+fixes24104-0ubuntu2 on the frontend / slave backend for both mythtv-frontend and mythvideo
[22:14] <tgm4883> hmm
[22:14] <tgm4883> sec
[22:14] <klucas> tgm4883:  let me just ssh over to the master backend and try it there.
[22:14] <tgm4883> ok
[22:16] <klucas> tgm4883: the master backend is running opensuse and doesn't seem to have a provider for dpkg installed give me a sec I'm trying to find something that'll get you the version #
[22:17] <tgm4883> klucas, rpm -qa packagename
[22:17] <tgm4883> probably ^
[22:19] <klucas> tgm4883: :)  ya or yast-->versions :)  it's 0.23-2 64 bit
[22:19] <tgm4883> hmm
[22:19] <klucas> tgm4883: I think it may have something to do with the directories it's looking for it's files in.
[22:19] <tgm4883> 0.23-2?
[22:20] <tgm4883> klucas, could be, although that would all be handled by the backend
[22:20] <tgm4883> not by the frontend
[22:20] <tgm4883> go into watch recordings, and hit M and see if changing your group filter fixes it
[22:20] <klucas> I've got the myth (myth/videos, myth/default, myth/livetv, etc) mounted as an NFS share on the frontend machine.
[22:21] <klucas> tgm4883: okay let me see what's in there.
[22:23] <klucas> tgm4883: I've not used filters in here before so please bear with me.  I've got 5 options in there: 'All Porgrams 11877 items', ----Groups---, Default 11877 items, ----Categories----, and Miro 11877 items.
[22:23] <klucas> tgm4883: not sure what do do in here
[22:24] <tgm4883> hold fsck
[22:24] <tgm4883> 11877 is a lot
[22:24] <tgm4883> ok, on your Ubuntu frontend, what is the output of
[22:25] <tgm4883> dpkg -l mythtv-backend
[22:25] <klucas> tgm4883: well it does take a bit to load which is why i'm after getting them out of the recordings menu :)
[22:25] <klucas> ii  mythtv-backend                    0.23.0+fixes24158-0ubuntu2        A personal video recorder application (server)
[22:26] <tgm4883> klucas, ok, so we are getting somewhere
[22:26] <tgm4883> so your Ubuntu frontend has a backend as well, probably going to be an issue with storage groups
[22:27] <tgm4883> on your ubuntu frontend, go into mythtv-setup and look at the videos storage group. What are the directories listed?
[22:27] <klucas> tgm4883: yes the tuner card is in the 'front-end' machine so I've got it configured as a slave backend as well
[22:29] <klucas> tgm4883: default is /media/myth/default
[22:30] <klucas> tgm4883: the others are /media/myth/<whateverelse> livetv, music, db_backups, etc.
[22:30] <klucas> tgm4883 /media/myth is a mounted NFS share from the server
[22:31] <tgm4883> klucas, ok
[22:31] <tgm4883> so what is the output of
[22:31] <tgm4883> or rather
[22:31] <tgm4883> do you see your videos when you do
[22:31] <tgm4883> ls /media/myth/default
[22:33] <klucas> tgm4883 I see several files with names like 9999_20100822060342.avi and 9999_20100822060342.avi.png (presumably for the screenshots) but not all the videos that are under /media/myth/videos
[22:35] <tgm4883> hmm
[22:35] <klucas> tgm4883: Indeed :)
[22:36] <tgm4883> klucas, that looks like a mirobridge file
[22:37] <klucas> tgm4883: googling microbridge....
[22:37] <tgm4883> mirobridge, it's your shows from miro
[22:38] <klucas> mirobridge: huh, I setup miro when I installed 10.xx of mythbuntu but havne't played around with it yet.
[22:39] <tgm4883> hmm ok
[22:39] <klucas> tgm4883: interesting
[22:39] <tgm4883> can you play that file then and see if it is a show or a video?
[22:39] <klucas> tgm4883:  Give me a few minutes to fire up the mythfrontend.  (there's another issue where the front end tries to mount all the partitions on the backend machine and it has to wait until each times out before I get the interface
[22:40] <tgm4883> klucas, whats the output of  ls -R /media/myth/default | wc -l
[22:40] <klucas> tgm4883:  "no kidding failed to mount /dev/sde!"
[22:40] <klucas> tgm4883:  one sec
[22:41] <klucas> tmg4883: 15
[22:42] <tgm4883> klucas, ok, can you do that on your backend as well?
[22:42] <klucas> tgm4883: sure one sec
[22:42] <klucas> tgm4883: same 15
[22:43] <klucas> tgm4883:  which I think makes sense as they're looking at the same dir
[22:43] <tgm4883> yea it does, just wanted to make sure there weren't any subdirs over there
[22:43] <klucas> tgm4883:  cool cool :)
[22:43] <tgm4883> so it is definitly something with the mythtv config
[22:44] <klucas> tgm4883: Ya, specifically with the Miro config section if my hunch is correct
[22:44] <klucas> tgm4883:  well your hunch :)
[22:45] <klucas> tgm4883: it would make sense, you said they look like miro files and that wasn't in 9.xx which didn't have the issue
[22:45] <tgm4883> klucas, can you play that file outside of mythtv?
[22:45] <tgm4883> 9999_20100822060342.avi
[22:45] <klucas> tgm4883:  one sec I'm still waiting for the mount points to time out
[22:46] <tgm4883> klucas, that issue sounds like you have a flash media reader in your frontend (ie a 21-in-1 reader)
[22:46] <tgm4883> and that you have enabled watch inserted media
[22:47] <tgm4883> klucas, out of curiosity, do you have a frontend on your suse box?
[22:47] <klucas> tgm4883: I do.
[22:47] <tgm4883> does your frontend over there show the same number of recordings?
[22:48] <klucas> tgm4883: vlc doesn't like the 9999_201008...avi file at least not through ssh -X
[22:48] <tgm4883> 11877
[22:48] <klucas> tgm4883:  um hang on I'll check.
[22:48] <tgm4883> I thought the dir was an nfs mount? can't you just open up thunar, browse to that dir and play it?
[22:48] <tgm4883> or open up vlc, and play the file?
[22:48] <tgm4883> not over ssh
[22:49] <klucas> tgm4883: yep the frontend on the suse box has the same number 11877
[22:50] <klucas> tgm4883: yes but the front end runs headless
[22:50] <tgm4883> the ubuntu one/
[22:51] <klucas> tgm4883:  I'm on a laptop talking to you ssh'ed into the mythbox and the master backend with a vnc console open to the frontend as well
[22:52] <klucas> tgm4883: Okay I've got the frontend started I'm going to try playing one of those files in the 'watch recordings' menu
[22:52] <tgm4883> ok
[22:53] <klucas> tgm4883:  nope they don't play with the mythfrontend
[22:53] <tgm4883> klucas, can you check the size of one of them?
[22:54] <klucas> tgm4883:  sure ... interesting.  Looks like they're symlinks to the corrisponding /media/myth/video files
[22:54] <klucas> tgm4883:  for example, lrwxrwxrwx 1 klucas klucas   68 2010-08-22 06:03 9999_20100822060403.avi -> /home/klucas/myth/videos/Star_Trek/S02E02 Who Mourns for Adonais.avi
[22:55] <klucas> tgm4883: odd that they don't play.
[22:55] <tgm4883> klucas, ok, now we are getting somewhere ;)
[22:55] <klucas> tgm4883:  let me try plaing that file in mythvideo
[22:55] <tgm4883> now, was /home/klucas/myth/videos/Star_Trek/S02E02 Who Mourns for Adonais.avi a rip, or a recording?
[22:56] <klucas> tgm4883: interesting, doesn't play in mythvideo either. :\  It's a rip
[22:57] <tgm4883> ok sec
[22:57] <klucas> k
[22:59] <klucas> tgm4883: brb
[23:02] <klucas> tgm4883: Okay a bit more info here.  The video does play on the suse box via mythfront end thorugh the 'watch videos' interface but not throught the 'watch recordings' inteface.  Additionally, the symlinks on the suse box indicate that the target of the link is missing.
[23:03] <klucas> tgm4883: the link is looking for the file in /home/klucas/myth/videos/Star_Trek rather than /media/myth/videos/Star_Trek.
[23:03] <klucas> tgm4883: /home/klucas/myth is the place I had originally mounted the NFS share when I installed 10.xx
[23:04] <klucas> tgm4883:  on the front end
[23:04] <klucas> tgm4883:  which suggests that somehow it got stuck in a config file somewhere
[23:04] <klucas> tgm4883:  with that dir for the link.
[23:04] <klucas> tgm4883: question is where and which one. :)_
[23:05] <klucas> tgm4883: and perhaps more over, why is it looking for it in the recordings in the first place?
[23:05] <tgm4883> ok
[23:05] <tgm4883> klucas, ok, so ls -R /media/myth/default | wc -l returns 15
[23:06] <tgm4883> klucas, does 'ls /media/myth/default' return more than 15?
[23:06] <klucas> tgm4883:  on both frontend/slave backend and master backend
[23:06] <klucas> tgm4883:  checking
[23:07] <klucas> 15 files are returned on both
[23:07] <tgm4883> klucas, any of them symlinks?
[23:08] <klucas> or more specifically filenames :)  yes all of the .avi files are simlinks.  The colour coding on the susebox suggests that they're broken
[23:08] <tgm4883> hmm
[23:08] <klucas> the ubuntu box doesn't think they're broken
[23:09] <klucas> at least as near as I can tell.
[23:09] <tgm4883> ok, on your suse backend, in mythtv setup, what do you have listed for the default SG?
[23:09] <klucas> tgm4883:  /media/myth/default but I'll double check
[23:10] <tgm4883> yea double check that it is the same as on the ubuntu frontend
[23:11] <klucas> tgm4883:  yes /media/myth/default I'll double check the frontend
[23:12] <tgm4883> klucas, ok and in watch recordings, you actually have 11000+ items listed? (not 15)
[23:13] <klucas> tgm4883: yes /media/myth/default is set on the front end.
[23:14] <klucas> tgm4883:  let me fire up the front end again.  I've disabled the monitor external media so we'll see if this is faster ;)  If nothing else you'll have helped me on that.
[23:16] <klucas> tgm4883:  nicely done on the disable monitoring of external inputs :)
[23:16] <klucas> tgm4883:  in answer to your question...
[23:17] <klucas> tgm4883:  I can't confirm that there are 11 thousand some odd files but there are certainally more than 15
[23:17] <tgm4883> ok
[23:17] <klucas> brb
[23:22] <klucas> tgm4883: sorry 'bout that duity called
[23:24] <tgm4883> klucas, odd. Setup looks to be correct, directories look to be correct. Maybe an issue with the database
[23:26] <klucas> tgm4883:  the only thing I can think of is to remove miro and see if it continues to be an issue
[23:27] <klucas> then reenable miro and look at that
[23:27] <tgm4883> klucas, i'm going to send you to #mythtv-users and ask if there is an updated script to check recordings against what is in the database since myth.rebuilddatabase.pl and myth.find_orphans.pl have been deprecated
[23:27] <tgm4883> klucas, doesn't look to be a mirobridge issue
[23:27] <tgm4883> but something made that symlink, and IDK where the other 11000+ entries are coming from
[23:27] <tgm4883> klucas, is it safe to assume you don't have 11000 videos?
[23:28] <klucas> tgm4883: I didn't think so but it may be up there
[23:28] <klucas> I have been using handbrake a lot to convert my dvd collection
[23:28] <tgm4883> as have I, i only have 111 though
[23:28] <tgm4883> 11000 is seriously alot
[23:29] <klucas> tgm4883: ya no kidding :)
[23:29] <klucas> tgm4883:  thanks for your help
[23:30] <klucas> tgm4883: whoever says open source programs don't have support is full of it!\
[23:32] <tgm4883> klucas, out of curiosity
[23:32] <tgm4883> ls -R /media/myth/videos | wc -l returns 1
[23:32] <tgm4883> err
[23:32] <tgm4883> ls -R /media/myth/videos | wc -l
[23:33] <klucas> tgm4883:  looks like there aren't any updates ot those scripts I see in #mythtv-users a good effort though
[23:34] <tgm4883> yep, looks like it's going to be something for 0.24
[23:34] <klucas> tgm4883:  ya not a prob
[23:34] <klucas> tgm4883:  it's not like it's a huge deal to find the recordings I'm after I just found it odd.
[23:34] <tgm4883> klucas, how many recorded shows should you have?
[23:35] <klucas> tgm4883:  well none now that I've gone and deleted the old recordings.
[23:35] <klucas> tgm4883:  since In instaled 10.xx my tuner card hasn't been playing nicely.
[23:35] <tgm4883> klucas, ok, so you should have zero shows
[23:35] <tgm4883> hmm, we might be able to blow away the rest of the recorded shows then
[23:35] <tgm4883> "recorded" shows
[23:35] <klucas> tgm4883:  I've got it now so that it'll show live tv so I'm waiting a day to see if it records the shows in the next daily cycle
[23:35] <tgm4883> the 11,000+ number
[23:36] <tgm4883> ok
[23:37] <klucas> tgm4883:  ya I don't really fancy sitting here blasting through all the recorded entries deleting them one by one
[23:38] <klucas> tgm4883:  after the upgrade it kept creating enteries for the recordings it was susposed to have made but when i'd try to play them back it would say that it couldn't find the file to play
[23:38] <klucas> tgm4883: I'd been waiting for a chance to check this out and when I did the first thing I tried was playing live TV and when that failed I figured that was the source of the trouble
[23:39] <tgm4883> klucas, ok, we'll need to run an SQL query on the db. Unless you are pretty good with SQL give me a minute to find the query
[23:40] <tgm4883> klucas, you don't happen to have phpmyadmin installed on your backend do you?
[23:40] <klucas> tgm4883:  one sec I'm monitoring mythtv-users.  Let me fire up the mysql client to the backend
[23:41] <klucas> tgm4883:  I don't typically I use webmin to deal with mysql
[23:41] <tgm4883> ok
[23:41] <tgm4883> lets see if wagnerrp has a better solution, otherwise you can see if you can truncate that table
[23:42] <klucas> I can send through sql via that interface
[23:46] <tgm4883> klucas, ok, so try sphery's suggestion, if they are still listed after that, then make a python script and run wagnerrp's
[23:46] <klucas> sounds good I'll give it a go
[23:53] <klucas> thanks tgm4883 I hope I haven't been the typical clueless user
[23:54] <tgm4883> nope, your issue is strange


[07:15] <geosmin> new user. i find i have to set the correct output device in sound settings every time i login. what would the proper way of setting up the default be?
[07:16] <geosmin> i've found some stackexchange answers that involve setting a devault pulseaudio sink command to run during every startup but that seems hacky to me
[15:32] <tomreyn> geosmin: an alsa configuration file would be the right approach
[15:32] <tomreyn> https://www.alsa-project.org/wiki/Setting_the_default_device
[15:35] <tomreyn> that's if this is about different sound cards / audio chipsets. if it's just about different output devices provided by a single sound card, then you may need to configure it differently (i'm unsure how actually)
[19:31] <MarkHollis> Hi all
[19:34] <alkisg> Hello


[00:03] <|val|> hi all, someone can explain what options "replace" and "applies" (in gfxboot.cfg) excatly do to isolinux command line ?
[00:08]  * cjwatson reminds himself
[00:09] <cjwatson> |val|: so here's an example:
[00:09] <cjwatson> label workstation=Install a workstation
[00:09] <cjwatson> replace workstation=file=/cdrom/preseed/workstation.seed
[00:09] <cjwatson> applies workstation=install
[00:10] <cjwatson> |val|: the 'replace' there causes any existing 'file=' parameters in the command line to be replaced with 'file=/cdrom/preseed/workstation.seed'. (compare 'append', which would just append the argument to the command line without checking.)
[00:10] <|val|> ok and what about applies ?
[00:10] <cjwatson> hang on I'm typing
[00:11] <cjwatson> |val|: the 'applies' means that the "Install a workstation" option should only be available for selection in the "Modes" menu if the option corresponding to 'label install' in isolinux.cfg is currently selected in the main menu.
[00:11] <cjwatson> in other words this permits the definition of modes that only apply to some top-level boot methods.
[00:12] <|val|> ok I undestand well !!!
[00:12] <|val|> thx a lot
[00:12] <cjwatson> the point of all this was to reduce combinatorial explosion of top-level options.
[00:14] <|val|> cat /proc/cmdline is quite cool !
[00:16] <|val|> just a question...are there differences between an ubuntu cmd-line system and an xubuntu one ?
[00:26] <|val|> have a nice day...
[02:17] <lfaraone> cjwatson: why is it that you remove a device after formatting it in the usbcreator backend?
[02:18] <lfaraone> cjwatson: (what would happen if you didn't pop it from devices and call the device_removed action on the frontend?)
[08:44] <cjwatson> lfaraone: usb-creator is evand's code rather than mine, so I'm not sure
[08:44] <cjwatson> you'd need to ask him
[13:08] <lfaraone> evand: why is it that you remove a device after formatting it in the usbcreator backend? (what would happen if you didn't pop it from devices and call the device_removed action on the frontend?)
[15:19] <Torgoton> During install on a low-memory machine, when it says "set up swap space as soon as possible", how would I do that? I do have a swap partition on the drive, and I'm attempting to install using the netboot files.
[18:53] <evand> lfaraone: best to check ~evand/usb-creator/future as I'm on the cusp of merging that back into trunk (just have some somewhat invasive changes to add a devicekit backend to commit on top of that)
[18:53]  * evand heads out


[07:51] <Noskcaj> darkxst, gnome 3.12, bluez5, and upower 0.99 are all now in debian
[07:53] <Noskcaj> Let the games begin
[10:31] <darkxst> Noskcaj, did they do full transitions for bluez5 and upower?
[10:32] <darkxst> none of the unity stuff has been ported for upower yet afaik
[10:32] <darkxst> gnome-desktop is still in limbo
[10:33] <darkxst> and I relly doubt seb would like too add a bluez transition to that!
[10:34] <darkxst> ricotz, did you get your system fixed? anychance you can look at the tracker rpath stuff sometime this week?
[11:16] <ricotz> darkxst, it seems to work again, but the systemd boot is broken
[11:17] <ricotz> darkxst, will try to take a look
[11:19] <ricotz> and yeah bluez5 is quite something
[11:19] <darkxst> ricotz, I know, i think we would be ok not to have it this cycle
[11:20] <darkxst> systemd boot was always broken on my desktop, been meaning to try 208 out
[11:21] <darkxst> only tested that in a VM so far
[11:21] <ricotz> it worked here fine until some cgmanager and kernel updates
[11:21] <darkxst> gnome really needs 210+ though right?
[11:22] <ricotz> 212 iirc
[11:22] <ricotz> gnome 3.13/14 that is
[11:23] <darkxst> 210 and 214 are the 'so called' stable branches, if there is such a thing in Lennarts world
[11:23] <ricotz> hehe, i see
[11:23] <darkxst> I don't think they actually do any bug fix releases though
[11:23] <darkxst> just pile patches into git branches
[11:24] <ricotz> i dont follow the changes closely but yeah since there are no branches besides master
[11:25] <darkxst> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/systemd/systemd-stable/
[11:25] <ricotz> ah there is a separate repo
[11:26] <darkxst> seem to be a lot of commits in there for stable branches though
[11:26] <ricotz> still requires a snapshot since there are no releases
[11:27] <darkxst> yup
[11:27] <darkxst> and there are only 48 patches in ubuntu systemd
[11:27] <ricotz> did pitti already merged 208-6?
[11:28] <darkxst> I think its still blocked on systemd-shim supporting cgroups
[11:29] <ricotz> oh, i think there was something with that in the last last shim upload
[11:30] <ricotz> darkxst, btw don't bother to look at tracker 1.1.1
[11:30] <darkxst> ricotz, wasn't planning on it
[11:30] <darkxst> just wanting to get 1.0 into main for nautilus search provider
[11:31] <ricotz> it is quite borked due misnamed dev files
[11:31] <ricotz> pushed 1.0.2 to the ppa
[11:36] <darkxst> right, I hooked up the unit tests on jenkins, plan to push 1.0.2 once I can address all didiers other comments
[11:36] <darkxst> shlibs.local seems right to me though
[11:39] <darkxst> functional-tests seem pretty broken
[11:39] <darkxst> which just leaves the rpath thing, which might be ok if we can justify it, but I don't really get why they are needed in the first place
[12:01] <MrChrisDruif> o/
[12:02] <MrChrisDruif> Is there an offtopic channel for ubuntu-gnome by any chance?
[12:21] <ricotz> darkxst, there is no real rpath usage at all, it is just causes by a pretty outdated way to initialize the buildsystem
[12:32] <darkxst> ricotz, can you add a comment about it on the MIR
[12:32] <darkxst> ?
[12:33] <darkxst> bug 1313996
[14:54] <ceed^> I'm running 14.04 with the Staging PPA (3.12) and notice these extremely long confirmation dialogs when you for instance cancel an e-mail. Is this a Gnome 3.12 problem, or?
[14:55] <ceed^> An example here: http://bit.ly/1sofygS
[21:10] <Noskcaj> darkxst, full transitions i think, just a few other packages were left behind
[23:38] <darkxst> Noskcaj, ok, can you go through upower bug and mark all packages that are fixed in debian
[23:40] <darkxst> ceed^, maybe a theme bug? can you test with adwaita?


[00:00] <seb128> lol
[00:00] <seb128> I didn't notice the pycairo changes had been done
[00:00] <seb128> I would have uploaded the pygtk changes otherwise
[00:00] <pochu> ember: why?
[00:03] <seb128> they can be accepted after beta if those are stable updates
[00:05] <pochu> liferea is, and has a bug fix for 1.0 -> 1.4 cache updates, which is interesting for dapper->hardy upgrades
[00:06] <pochu> I think I'll call to Dell tomorrow to make sure everything's going fine ;)
[01:50] <linoss> anyone of a software application that records a phone conversation utilizing the internal modem on a PC?
[01:50] <linoss> I hope this is the correct channel to post this question
[08:24] <seb128> hey hey mvo
[08:26] <mvo> hwy seb128
[08:27] <mvo> (that was a bavarian hey)
[08:27] <seb128> ;-)
[08:52] <slomo> seb128: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/12662959/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.gtk%2B2.0_2.12.9-2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz  <--- something is unhappy... known problem? :)
[08:53] <pitti> kwwii: did human-theme build for you locally? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/12625757/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.human-theme_0.13_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[08:54] <pitti> kwwii: "error: can't copy 'build/share/themes/Human/index.theme': doesn't exist or not a regular file
[09:11] <mvo> Amaranth: can you reproduce bug #99508 ?
[09:11] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 99508 in compiz "Window titlebar displayed not right with compiz enabled" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/99508
[09:12] <XiXaQ> hmm. I was sure I registered a bug regarding the new clock applets "Adjust date and time" menu item not using the default dialog for doing so in Hardy, but I can't find it..
[09:13] <XiXaQ> is the old clock applet still available in hardy, does anyone know?
[09:13] <dholbach> good morning
[09:14] <mvo> hey dholbach
[09:15] <dholbach> hey mvo
[09:16] <mvo> Amaranth: meh, I can not reproduce #150702 either
[09:46] <seb128> lool, slomo: do you know if public modules using python-support are available during upgrade now?
[09:47] <slomo> seb128: no, i know nothing about the new python policy and everything related to it... i'm trying to not touch packaging of such stuff and if i have to i'm looking at other packages ;)
[09:49] <lool> seb128: I don't know
[09:50] <seb128> I got complain from pygtk upstream than pygtk is broken during upgrades
[09:50] <seb128> and I think the new pycentral fixes this issue and pysupport is still buggy
[09:50] <seb128> I'm pondering if we should switch to pycentral for hardy
[09:50] <lool> seb128: I would think not as I see update-python-modules -c in prerm
[09:50] <seb128> lool: not what?
[09:50] <lool> seb128: But then python-support is a bit special
[09:51] <lool> seb128: I would think it's not available
[09:51] <lool> Would it be available, it would be in postrm
[10:17] <lool> seb128: I see libglib-perl has been uploaded in Debian
[10:18] <seb128> lool: a new version you mean? something we want to use?
[10:20] <lool> I guess so
[10:21] <lool> seb128:  libglib-perl (1:1.180-1) unstable; urgency=low
[10:21] <lool>  .
[10:21] <lool>    * New upstream release
[10:21] <lool> That's all
[10:21] <seb128> ok
[10:21] <seb128> will be for after beta then
[10:21] <lool> Sure
[10:22] <seb128> slomo: btw you might want to use the shared-mime-info change I did yesterday for debian
[10:25] <slomo> seb128: will do, thanks
[11:05] <mvo> asac: the firefox restart required informatio is displayed for me unconditionally even if ff is not running. is that a knwon issue?
[11:07] <asac> mvo: can you see whats wrong?
[11:07] <asac> (no its not known)
[11:07] <mvo> asac: I think the firefox-3.0-restart-required is lacking the "DisplaIf" line AFAICS
[11:08] <asac> strange. i took it from the old package
[11:09] <asac> mvo: how should it read?
[11:09] <mvo> I can have a look after lunch
[11:09] <asac> DisplayIf: $STARTUPWMCLASS ?
[11:09] <asac> i thnk i found it: DisplayIf: ps -C firefox-bin
[11:10] <mvo> asac: yes, thats it
[11:10] <mvo> asac: probably with a ps -C firefox-bin >/dev/null to avoid spittng stuff to ~/.xsession-errors
[11:11] <asac> thanks
[11:11] <mvo> thank you !
[11:12] <asac> mvo: is there a pattern that also takes into account that firefox is running for the current user?
[11:13] <mvo> asac: update-notifier runs with the same uid as the logged in user, so we need to limited the ps to the users processes and we are good
[11:13] <asac> ok
[11:14] <asac> mvo: you have an expression at hand (its friday and i feel botty :))
[11:14] <asac> ok fixed with the above in bzr
[11:14] <mvo> asac: give me a sec (friday for me too ;)
[11:15] <mvo> asac: pgrep firefox-bin -u $USER
[11:16] <asac> that works
[11:16] <mvo> or pgrep firefox-bin -U $(id -u)
[11:16] <asac> :)
[11:16] <asac> ok
[11:17] <asac> yeah the last one looks good
[11:18] <asac> thanks
[11:18] <mvo> cheers
[11:19] <asac> fixed in bzr
[11:30] <asac> mvo: i would like to discuss if its possible to make firefox/xulrunner upgrades safe in intrepid and if we think it might be possible discuss this at UDS.
[11:31] <asac> mvo: you think we can do a pre-call to discuss some ideas i have .... lets say next week?
[11:37] <Hobbsee> asac: "safe"?
[11:42] <slomo> seb128: can sync shared-mime-info from debian now
[11:42] <seb128> slomo: ok, will do after the beta freeze
[11:47] <asac> Hobbsee: yes its not safe atm :)
[11:49] <Hobbsee> asac: i'm trying to figure out what you're defining as "safe", though
[11:57] <asac> no crashes ... no unexpected behaviour and so on
[11:57] <asac> (that do eventually happen - in case you had been lucky and never experienced that :))
[11:59] <Hobbsee> ah right
[11:59] <Hobbsee> yeah, true
[11:59] <asac> not a trivial thing to fix though
[12:40] <dholbach> I wished somebody killed scrollkeeper for good
[12:53] <seb128> dholbach: why?
[12:53] <dholbach> the update runs take ages on my laptop :)
[12:53] <seb128> dholbach: I think rarian compat thing is slower
[12:54] <dholbach> really?
[12:54] <seb128> I did try by then and that's one of the reason why I didn't do the switch
[12:54] <seb128> yes, the compat is not optimized, the goal is to ride of it
[12:54] <seb128> to get rather
[12:55] <dholbach> that'd be the best thing since sliced bread
[12:55] <seb128> ;-)
[12:58] <mvo> asac: sounds great
[12:58] <mvo> asac: (sorry, lunch took longer)
[12:58] <dholbach> hmmmm lunch
[13:01] <seb128> pitti: do you do freeze exception or that's only steve now?
[13:03] <Hobbsee> seb128: afaik, anyone can do them
[13:03] <seb128> Hobbsee: anyone?
[13:03] <Hobbsee> seb128: well, anyone in -release
[13:04] <seb128> Hobbsee: that includes you? ;-)
[13:04] <Hobbsee> seb128: in some mutant sense, yes.
[13:04]  * seb128 hugs Hobbsee
[13:05]  * Hobbsee hugs seb128 bakc, and waves her antlers around
[13:06] <Hobbsee> seb128: it's the kind of mutant-cant-do-much-due-to-no-drescher-access, so....
[13:06]  * Hobbsee may or may not be therefore useful.
[13:08] <seb128> Hobbsee: that's alright, I'm just going to do some bug fix upload and I was wondering if they were likely to be accepted today
[13:08] <Hobbsee> seb128: tbh, i'm not overly comfortable doing high-impact accepts, as i'm aware that a lot of the release decisions get taken in private areas, which i don't have access to.
[13:09] <Hobbsee> seb128: i had proof of that after UDS, and, afaik, it still happens, so
[13:09] <seb128> I don't think that's a true statement
[13:09] <Hobbsee> seb128: it's safer not to work with obsolete info.
[13:17] <seb128> anyway I've no high impact uploads
[13:17] <seb128> I've just uploaded a one liner fix to gvfs which is waiting
[13:17] <seb128> and the patch is from the upstream svn
[13:18] <Hobbsee> seb128: in unapproved?
[13:18] <seb128> seb128: dunno, in wherever things we upload during a freeze land ;-)
[13:19] <Hobbsee> seb128: approved.
[13:19]  * Hobbsee waits to see if this all still works
[13:20] <Hobbsee> grrr
[13:20]  * Hobbsee grumbles at this bug, just as she did last cycle.
[13:21] <seb128> Hobbsee: thanks
[13:21] <Hobbsee> seb128: you're welcome
[13:21] <Hobbsee> and a timeout.
[13:26] <dholbach> the workspace switcher applet thing is still broken in hardy
[13:26] <dholbach> NARF!
[13:27] <dholbach> so no compiz for me on my laptop
[13:41] <seb128> dholbach: how is it broken now?
[13:42] <dholbach> the same as before
[13:42] <dholbach> hang on, I'll post a screenshot
[13:44] <dholbach> http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/compiz-b0rk.png
[13:45] <Hobbsee> dholbach: iz undocumented feature.
[13:45] <Hobbsee> dholbach: it's now up to you what you would like to see in that bottom box :)
[13:45] <dholbach> Hobbsee: ahhhh nice :)
[13:45] <seb128> dholbach: reset your compiz config
[13:45] <dholbach> (MacSlow), mvo, seb128: ^
[13:46] <seb128> dholbach: gconftool --recursive-unset /apps/compiz
[13:46] <dholbach> OK... here we go again
[13:47] <seb128> dholbach: not the first time you do that? ;-)
[13:48] <dholbach> seb128, mvo: http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/compiz-b0rk2.png
[13:48] <dholbach> new variation :)
[13:48] <seb128> dholbach: cat .config/compiz/compizconfig/Default.ini
[13:48] <dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$  cat .config/compiz/compizconfig/Default.ini
[13:48] <dholbach> cat: .config/compiz/compizconfig/Default.ini: No such file or directory
[13:48] <dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$
[13:48] <seb128> dholbach: what do you have in .compiz and .config/compiz?
[13:50] <dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$ find .config/compiz/
[13:50] <dholbach> .config/compiz/
[13:50] <dholbach> .config/compiz/compizconfig
[13:50] <dholbach> .config/compiz/compizconfig/config
[13:50] <dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$ find .compiz/
[13:50] <dholbach> find: .compiz/: No such file or directory
[13:50] <dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$
[13:50] <dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$ cat .config/compiz/compizconfig/config
[13:50] <dholbach> [gnome_session]
[13:50] <dholbach> profile =
[13:50] <dholbach> plugin_list_autosort = true
[13:50] <dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$
[13:51] <mvo> dholbach: my, bugger, can you please run ccsm
[13:51] <mvo> and go to general options
[13:51] <mvo> desktop size
[13:51] <mvo> and check the "number of desktops" property there?
[13:51] <seb128> mvo: where should that be written?
[13:51] <mvo> in gconf
[13:51] <seb128> mvo: and I though that is was not possible to have a different setting that 1 workspace now?
[13:51] <dholbach> and it deactivated my Ctrl-< key for open terminal
[13:52] <mvo> seb128: yes, I want to make sure that dholbach has it too
[13:52] <seb128> mvo: what key is the corresponding one?
[13:52] <mvo> seb128: it should not be possible anymore, but the screenshot suggests that it is still for some reason :/
[13:52] <seb128> mvo: I suspect something like your issue this week, wrong gconf default to etc or something
[13:52] <dholbach> horizontal 3, vertical 2, number of desktops 6?
[13:52] <dholbach> does that make sense?
[13:53] <dholbach> it was at 2, 1, 1
[13:53] <dholbach> oh, I can't change number of desktops
[13:53] <mvo> dholbach: but it is still 6 even though you can not change it?
[13:53] <dholbach> no, it's 1
[13:53] <seb128> mvo: what is the gconf key involved?
[13:54] <seb128> dholbach: grep compiz /etc/gconf/* -r
[13:54] <dholbach> seb128: nothing
[13:54] <seb128> bah, ok, I'll let mvo debug it
[13:54] <mvo> seb128: it should be "number_of_desktops" in /apps/compiz/general/screen0/options
[13:55] <dholbach> also ccsm gives me GConf backend: There is an unsupported value at path /apps/compiz/plugins/scale/allscreens/options/initiate_edge. Settings from this path won't be read. Try to remove that value so that operation can continue properly.
[13:55] <dholbach> GConf backend: There is an unsupported value at path /apps/compiz/plugins/scale/allscreens/options/initiate_edge. Settings from this path won't be read. Try to remove that value so that operation can continue properly.
[13:55] <mvo> dholbach: thanks! the vnumber_of_desktops 6 is the culprit, it should no longer be possible, but apparently it is, it looks like a bug in compiz to me
[13:55] <mvo> dholbach: you have restarted or loged in loged out?
[13:56] <dholbach> mvo: I'll remove all the settings again, then re-login, then switch to compiz again
[13:56] <dholbach> let's see what happens
[13:57] <mvo> dholbach: I had hoped the limited the number of desktops would fix it. oh well
[13:57] <seb128> mvo: you should remove this if [ $user == "dholbach" ] joke now ;-)
[13:57] <dholbach> haha
[13:57] <dholbach> brb
[14:00] <dholbach> mvo: no dice
[14:01] <dholbach> same as in b0rk2.png
[14:01] <dholbach> anyway... I'm going out for lunch now :)
[14:03] <seb128> dholbach: does it happen with an another user?
[14:03] <seb128> dholbach: enjoy your lunch
[14:42] <kwwii> dholbach: did you ever figure out the problem with the cookie stuff?
[14:53] <Amaranth> bug 150702
[14:53] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 150702 in compiz "alt shift tab stopped navigating windows (gutsy)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/150702
[14:53] <Amaranth> mvo: i can preproduce the titlebar thing, sometimes
[14:53] <Amaranth> haven't tested recently but a bunch of other people have :P
[14:54] <Amaranth> only happens to maximized windows and only happens with clearlooks-based themes
[14:54] <Amaranth> and i think it doesn't happen to the new clearlooks so only human, unless human has been updated as well
[14:58] <dholbach_> seb128: I'll try later on
[15:04] <_MMA_> seb128: Has the little GDM drum sound vanished for you on Hardy? Has here and On Ubuntu Studio. I'm still looking into it but I figured Id ask if its known or just me.
[15:10] <pochu> good afternoon slomo
[15:13] <Amaranth> pitti: say, does jockey have a list of pciids that fglrx works with?
[15:23] <Amaranth> _MMA_: before you got your CDs made 'officially' how were you making them? UCK?
[15:25] <_MMA_> Amaranth: The old fashion way. You would have to talk to joejaxx for exact details. But is wasnt with any app.
[15:26] <Amaranth> _MMA_: did it involve modifying an existing disc or did you make one from scratch?
[15:26] <_MMA_> An Alt disk from scratch.
[15:26] <Amaranth> ah, alt disc
[15:26] <Amaranth> yeah, those are easy :P
[15:27] <_MMA_> Suuurre. :)
[15:38] <pitti> seb128: I can help out for easier cases
[15:38] <pitti> Amaranth: no, jockey itself does not have such lists; they are shipped by l-r-m
[15:38] <Amaranth> yeah, i found that out
[15:39] <Amaranth> but they don't look like something i can use
[15:39] <Amaranth> if you're using a laptop with a chip supported by fglrx i want to block compiz loading if you're using ati
[15:40] <pitti> Amaranth: I don't quite understand why you would do this?
[15:41] <Amaranth> pitti: because those chips have problems with compiz and the ati driver
[15:41] <pitti> Amaranth: shouldn't you rather test for models where compiz works with the free ati driver? (independent of fglrx)?
[15:41] <Amaranth> random lockups
[15:41] <Amaranth> the only ones that seem to work right are the ones old enough that fglrx no longer supports them
[15:42] <Amaranth> right now i've just got all laptops using the ati driver blocked
[15:42] <pitti> but shouldn't this be a pretty static set?
[15:42] <Amaranth> it's a pretty large set too :P
[15:42] <Amaranth> and i don't know what all of them are
[15:43] <Amaranth> so i need to blacklist a bazillion pciids or whitelist a bazillion pciids
[15:43] <Amaranth> i'd like to have one of those lists autogenerated, if i can
[15:48] <pitti> right; however the autogeneration needs to have a solid criterium as well
[15:48] <Amaranth> what do you mean?
[15:48] <pitti> so at one point you have to input external knowledge
[15:48] <pitti> (like testing results, or feature tests, etc.)
[15:48] <Amaranth> If you're on a laptop and fglrx supports your chip I want to block compiz from starting if you're using ati
[15:49] <Amaranth> until fglrx drops support for more cards this should work fine
[15:49] <Amaranth> I thought about doing a feature check to see what series of chip you had but the xpress 200 is one of the broken ones and it doesn't have shaders
[15:49] <Amaranth> so I ran out of things to chck
[15:50] <Amaranth> check*
[15:50] <pitti> Amaranth: so, for that you could check whether /usr/share/linux-restricted-modules/2.6.24-12-generic/modules.alias.override/fglrx has the graphics card
[15:50] <pitti> but that's a very ubuntu specific hack
[15:50] <pitti> not an upstream solution
[15:50] <Amaranth> Yeah, but so was my last hack :P
[15:51] <Amaranth> the only problem is i don't know how to turn that file into something i can use :P
[15:51] <Amaranth> what do i read to compare to it? our current system is based on pciids as reported by lspci -n
[15:51] <pitti> right
[15:52] <pitti> grep -q 'pci:0000$VID:0000$PID' /usr/share/linux-restricted-modules/2.6.24-12-generic/modules.alias.override/fglrx
[15:52] <pitti> somehting like that
[15:53] <pitti> the better way is of course something like printf("%08X", vid)
[15:53] <Amaranth> oh, duh
[15:53] <pitti> Amaranth: those are modaliases, and for pci they are composed from vendor ID (v), product ID (p), subvendor (sv), subdevice (sd)
[15:53] <pitti> and device class, subclass, and interface
[15:54] <pitti> Amaranth: this entire hack is only necessary because both the fglrx and the nvidia kernel module do not have proper modaliases
[15:54] <Amaranth> yeah
[15:54] <Amaranth> they just always try to load, don't they?
[15:54] <pitti> Amaranth: e. g. if you look at "modinfo b43", it has
[15:55] <pitti> but modinfo nvidia ist just a catch-all
[15:55] <pitti> ooh
[15:55] <pitti> modinfo fglrx -> that actually looks sensible with the latest version
[15:55] <pitti> before it didn't have any
[15:55] <pitti> \o/
[15:55] <Amaranth> hey, that looks like your list :P
[15:55] <pitti> yay, so we can remove the list frim l-r-m
[15:56] <pitti> Amaranth: right, except that the nvidia and fglrx lists from l-r-m are created by some hackish parsing of the shared libraries :)
[15:56] <pitti> Amaranth: modinfo fglrx | grep -q is at least a hack which is not distro dependent
[15:57] <Amaranth> yeah, i remember when you first wrote this it didn't detect my chip and i got a different list when i ran the script than you
[15:57] <pitti> right, that's why we now have per-arch lists
[15:57] <pitti> (in gutsy, too)
[15:57] <Amaranth> pitti: except in can't guarantee fglrx (or l-r-m) will be installed so i'll probably just turn this into something i stuff in the compiz package
[15:58] <pitti> Amaranth: true that
[15:58] <pitti> Amaranth: but at least it's a script which you could run when you wrap a release
[15:58] <Amaranth> just run a bit of regex magic over it to turn it into a regular pciid list so i don't have to write more code :)
[15:58] <pitti> it's just a handwavy heuristics anyway
[15:58] <Amaranth> oh, but i need separate arch versions
[15:58] <Amaranth> hrm
[15:58] <pitti> right, that should be easy
[15:59] <Amaranth> sure, except seb128 thinks we already call too many things in this shell script :)
[16:00] <pitti> modinfo fglrx | perl -ne 'if (/^alias:.*pci:v(\d+)d(\d+)/) { print "$1 $2\n" }'
[16:01] <pitti> erm, not \d
[16:02] <pitti> [0-9A-F] of course
[16:02] <pitti> anyway, you get the idea
[16:02] <pitti> Amaranth: per-arch> well, as you said it's only a handwavy hack, not a precise whitelist anyway
[16:04] <Amaranth> modinfo fglrx | perl -ne 'if (/^alias:.*pci:v0000([0-9A-F]+)d0000([0-9A-F]+)/) { print "$1:$2\n" }'
[16:04] <pitti> Amaranth: anyway: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5687/  <= amd64 list, for your comparison with i386
[16:04] <Amaranth> that should get me a list of pciids in the format lspci returns, right?
[16:04] <pitti> right
[16:04] <pitti> lspci -n | grep -w 0300:
[16:04] <pitti> ^ graphics cards only
[16:06] <Amaranth> ah, they are the same thing
[16:07] <Amaranth> same list on i386 and amd64 for fglrx
[16:37] <ember> isn't gpm to request password after suspend?
[16:56] <Amaranth> ember: no, gnome-screensaver locks the screen on resume
[16:56] <Amaranth> or should
[17:33] <crevette> wtf, gnome-screensaver was not installed anymore
[17:35] <Amaranth> put it out of its misery
[17:48] <seb128> re
[17:49] <seb128> pitti: sorry I was away, you were looking for work to do? ;-) I guess it'll be for next week now
[18:04] <soulc> anyone have an idea of how to fix compiz when it stops working?
[18:19] <Amaranth> 203 bugs in compiz
[18:19] <Amaranth> so close
[18:19] <Amaranth> goal was under 200 by the end of today
[18:20] <cody-somerville> Amaranth, You can do it! :)
[18:21] <Amaranth> I can get one of them into "Fix Committed" state
[18:21] <Amaranth> but I dunno how to get rid of 3 others
[18:24] <seb128> Amaranth: randomly reassign to libwnck as you do usually? ;-)
[18:24] <Amaranth> haha
[18:24] <Amaranth> hey, i _fixed_ all the bugs i assigned to libwnck :P
[18:25] <seb128> Amaranth: btw do you think you could look at bug #118936 before hardy?
[18:25] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 118936 in alacarte "Alacarte does not recover deleted menu items" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/118936
[18:25] <seb128> Amaranth: right, thanks for that ;-)
[18:25] <Amaranth> seb128: that's a tricky problem
[18:25] <Amaranth> gnome-menus offers no way to get items are are Hidden
[18:25] <Amaranth> and I mark things as Hidden to "delete" them
[18:25] <seb128> isn't the menu reset just a rm .config/something?
[18:26] <seb128> or wouldn't that work rather
[18:26] <Amaranth> well no in this case i've changed the .desktop file
[18:26] <Amaranth> and you might have .desktop files in ~/.local/share/applications that alacarte didn't put there
[18:26] <seb128> right
[18:26] <seb128> nautilus uses that too ;-)
[18:26] <Amaranth> for mime stuff, yes
[18:26] <Amaranth> and WINE uses it
[18:27] <seb128> ok, so not as trivial as I though$
[18:27] <Amaranth> although i think all the files i put there are called "alacarte-madeX.desktop"
[18:27] <seb128> ah
[18:27] <Amaranth> i'll have to look again, i know that was the idea
[18:27] <seb128> in which case that's easy to delete those
[18:27] <Amaranth> to work around a couple bugs
[18:27] <Amaranth> in gnome-menus :P
[18:28] <seb128> I don't think the menu editor is that important
[18:28] <seb128> but I was trying to figure bugs that would be nice to fix for hardy
[18:28] <Amaranth> i could just remove all alacarte-made items
[18:28] <seb128> and that's the only alacarte one which seemed to be annoying
[18:28] <Amaranth> it might not recover everything but it should work 99% of the time
[18:28] <seb128> better than current ;-)
[18:31] <Amaranth> i think the rest of the alacarte bugs are it not responding well to your .menu files being broken
[18:31] <Amaranth> which means you're in trouble anyway
[18:34] <crevette> seb128: can you tell to your big chief to buy laucnhpad.net and all approximative domains around launchpad;
[18:34] <Amaranth> ah, no, that won't work
[18:34] <crevette> my fingers thanks you
[18:34] <Amaranth> to "delete" something I have to have it be named the same as the original
[18:35] <Amaranth> so no easy fix
[18:36] <seb128> crevette: ;-)
[18:37] <seb128> Amaranth: alright
[18:37] <mvo> seb128: are you aware of http://paste.ubuntu.com/5693/ ? (and/or the right person to talk to :) ?
[18:37] <Amaranth> probably requires an ABI breaking patch to gnome-menus
[18:37]  * seb128 teachs crevette how to use bookmarks
[18:38] <Amaranth> down to 202, wonder who closed another bug
[18:38]  * Amaranth guesses pedro_
[18:38] <mvo> just koffice-dev and libgphoto2-2-dev file overwrite problem for most of hardy, that is pretty impressive
[18:38] <Amaranth> mvo: i've got a better fix for ati laptops
[18:38] <Amaranth> well, i have all the stuff i need to code the better fix, just need to do it :)
[18:39] <Amaranth> also, are you going to wait until after beta to update to git?
[18:39] <seb128> mvo: no, I'm not but I'm happy to fix it, pitti does update this package usually
[18:42] <lapo> uhm, it's just me or there are problems with compiz+nvidia and the notification area?
[18:43] <mvo> seb128: I'm happy to do it, but I need to leave now for the evening so I can do it either tonight (late) or monday
[18:43] <Amaranth> lapo: just you?
[18:43] <seb128> mvo: ok, I can do it if you want
[18:43] <Amaranth> please don't file a bug, i'll never get below 200 :P
[18:43] <lapo> eheh, ok, it's a known bug :-)
[18:43] <Amaranth> seb128: also, i know how you feel about libwnck, calc sends me all OOo bugs that he can't reproduce when the reporter is using compiz :P
[18:44] <seb128> Amaranth: ;-)
[18:44] <Amaranth> one of them got upstreamed twice
[18:44] <seb128> I used to do that too with libwnck bugs
[18:44] <seb128> but you kicked all those back :-p
[18:44] <Amaranth> i sent the bug to compiz-fusion and they send it to OOo
[18:45] <Amaranth> OOo is really cool, it requests 200x200 windows for dialogs much larger than 200x200
[18:45] <Amaranth> and requests that they are not resizeable
[18:47] <mvo> seb128: yeah, go ahead if you have time for it, if not, no problem, just let me know
[18:49] <seb128> mvo: ok, I'll go for dinner soon but might look at it after that
[18:50] <mvo> thanks
[18:52] <pedro_> Amaranth: 200 ;-)
[19:03] <Amaranth> pedro_: yay
[19:27] <LaserJock> pedro_: ping
[19:35] <pedro_> Amaranth: just below the 200 now woohoo
[19:35] <pedro_> LaserJock: hello
[19:35] <Amaranth> yep :)
[19:35]  * Amaranth hugs pedro_
[19:35]  * pedro_ hugs Amaranth back
[19:35] <Amaranth> now it can't go back up, don't let anyone file new bugs
[19:35] <LaserJock> pedro_: I just wondered why you marked bug #183060 as Invalid
[19:35] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 183060 in gnumeric "gnumeric crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183060
[19:35] <pedro_> hahaha
[19:35] <pedro_> LaserJock: looking
[19:36] <pedro_> i've doing a lot of clean up lately
[19:36] <LaserJock> pedro_: I would think the LP Janitor would take care of it after 60 days
[19:37] <pedro_> LaserJock: more than a month in a incomplete state without a response from the reporter
[19:37] <LaserJock> and that's enough to get it marked "Invalid"?
[19:37] <pedro_> as i said i was doing some clean up lately, so that's why
[19:37] <pedro_> yes it is
[19:37] <LaserJock> ok then
[19:38] <Amaranth> i'm trying to make compiz bugs look less depressing
[19:38] <Amaranth> so i'm not waiting 60 days for the janitor :P
[19:38] <LaserJock> alright, so we make it look like we dont' have bugs by just closing them?
[19:39] <Amaranth> 30 days without a response for a bug i can't reproduce means no one is ever going to help me figure out how to fix it
[19:39] <Amaranth> with compiz a driver point release or new compiz snapshot can cause and/or fix a million different problems
[19:40] <pochu> does the janitor already close bugs? or is still disabled?
[19:40] <Amaranth> it claims it will
[19:40] <Amaranth> i haven't seen it do so
[19:40] <pedro_> haven't seen the janitor lately either
[19:40] <LaserJock> well, in this case though, somebody just asked for a backtrace
[19:41] <LaserJock> but shouldn't apport be providing those?
[19:41] <Amaranth> ah, sometimes apport does a bad job
[19:41] <Amaranth> or the coredump is bad
[19:41] <LaserJock> right, so we're just gonna ignore it?
[19:42] <Amaranth> if you can't get a good backtrace how can you fix it?
[19:42] <LaserJock> and as far as I can see nobody has *not* confirmed the bug
[19:43] <LaserJock> that's of course what needs to be worked on
[19:43] <LaserJock> but marking it "Invalid" basically is saying "We're not gonna look at it"
[19:45] <Amaranth> Right, it means "we're ignoring this unless you give us more info"
[19:46] <LaserJock> and why should we require the reporter to necessarily do that?
[19:46] <Amaranth> If it just sits there open someone might think they don't have to do anything
[19:46] <Amaranth> Because if they want the bug fixed they need to give the info needed to fix it
[19:46] <LaserJock> but we're not gonna do anything in the mean time?
[19:46] <LaserJock> I don't see anybody trying to confirm or not confirm the bug
[19:47] <LaserJock> it's just "give us a backtrace or we close the bug"
[19:48] <Amaranth> So someone should explicitly say "I cannot reproduce this" before starting the countdown to closing it?
[19:48] <LaserJock> I think so yes
[19:48] <Amaranth> *shrug*
[19:48] <LaserJock> and ask if other people have experience it
[19:48] <Amaranth> I know in compiz I try my best to reproduce the bugs whether I mention that or not
[19:49] <LaserJock> I guess the theory is if it's really a problem we'll get dups
[19:50] <Amaranth> that too


[11:08]  * abogani waves
[11:09] <jussi> hello abogani!!!
[11:09] <abogani> jussi, Hi Jussi!
[11:09] <abogani> Anyone could remove all references to -rt from Studio's seeds, please?
[14:19] <scott-work> abogani: you really want all reference to -rt kernel removed from the seeds?
[14:19] <scott-work> *sigh*
[14:19] <scott-work> i've been meaning to update the seeds for some time now
[14:19] <scott-work> and i just haven't gotten to it...now things are stacking up :(
[14:21] <abogani> scott-work: Yeah. I don;t have choice I'm ignored at all from UKT so they don't neither upload the old -rt  kernel nor upload the -realtime one. Also -lowlatency (which was the old -preempt and was created and supported by that team) is totally since March.
[14:22] <abogani> So what can I propose to different?
[14:23] <abogani> Without upload right the only thing that I can do without depends from others is give up.
[14:46] <scott-work> hmmm, i don't know abogani, i don't have a good understanding of the UKT and howit works, or quite frankly a lot of the politics involved around the kernel
[15:11] <falktx> scott-work: hi
[15:11] <falktx> scott-work: is ubuntustudio interested on a wine-rt patch ?
[15:11] <falktx> http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=56&Itemid=12
[15:12] <scott-work> i'm not sure falktx, abogani was actually talking about removing the -rt kernel from ubuntustudio-seeds
[15:12] <falktx> scott-work: this one is different... you should read that page, I'm not the best guy to explain it...
[15:13] <scott-work> falktx: which programs used in ubuntu studio would need both wine and -rt functionality?
[15:14] <falktx> scott-work: any wine applications
[15:14] <falktx> scott-work: also dssi-vst, fst/festige or similar
[15:14] <scott-work> falktx: while i wouldn't say that any wine application might need -rt i could see dssi-vst and fst/festige needed it :)
[15:17] <falktx> it's not about the rt-kernel, just making wine apps getting higher priorities
[15:31] <scott-work> oh, and less dropped audio then, cool
[15:32] <falktx> eheh, someone finished reading...
[16:33] <holstein> what is going on with linux-rt?
[16:34] <falktx> holstein: will be removed from US afaik
[16:39] <holstein> scott-work abogani jussi
[16:39] <holstein> can we wait on that -rt removal
[16:40] <holstein> theres a couple UKT guys local to me
[16:40] <holstein> one of them is im my LUG
[16:40] <holstein> maybe i can help make some communication happen between them and abogani ??
[16:40] <scott-work> holstein: that would absolutely rock!
[16:43] <holstein> couple days...
[16:43] <holstein> i'll get back to you scott-work when i hear from one of them
[17:02] <holstein> scott-work: this is JFo
[17:02] <JFo> o/
[17:02] <JFo> :)
[17:02] <scott-work> hi JFo  :)
[17:02] <JFo> hi scott-work
[17:02] <JFo> how are things?
[17:03] <scott-work> doing okay...can i ask a few questions about the -rt kernel, i'm pretty ignorant about the UKT and how things are messing
[17:03] <JFo> certainly
[17:03] <scott-work> i guess first i should ask about the -lowlatency and -preempt kernels...i've heard rumours that they might be included in the main, any thruth?
[17:03] <JFo> the -rt kernel is community sponsored, but I'll answer what I know :)
[17:04] <JFo> scott-work, I can find out about that
[17:04] <JFo> one sec...
[17:05] <JFo> let me see if I can catch the ear of one of the engineers
[17:05] <scott-work> certainly, i'm working with one eye anyways :)
[17:05] <JFo> :)
[17:06] <JFo> abogani, have you heard anything about them while I'm asking?
[17:07] <falktx> scott-work: do you really want to remove rt kernel from ubuntustudio?
[17:07] <JFo> they are usually deep in code, so it may be a minute before they see my request :)
[17:07] <JFo> so 'preempt is an official flavour for Lucid, not for Maverick' I am told
[17:08] <scott-work> falktx: ideally, no.  some users will greatly benefit by having the -rt kernel
[17:08] <scott-work> JFo:  :(
[17:08] <falktx> have to go
[17:08] <scott-work> was an rationale offered?  (not trying to sound rude)
[17:08] <scott-work> falktx: see ya
[17:09] <JFo> and I am told there is nothing for -lowlatency in Lucid or Maverick
[17:09] <JFo> scott-work, I can ask about that
[17:09] <JFo> it is no problem :)
[17:10] <scott-work> JFo: sorry i'm distracted, i have people coming to my desk and asking questions as work
[17:11] <JFo> scott-work, <tgardner> the -rt guys are providing a kernel AFAIK, so it was duplicated functionality.
[17:11] <JFo> no problem
[17:11] <JFo> we can discuss later if you like
[17:11] <scott-work> JFo: i would like to explain my concern about the kernels
[17:11] <JFo> I am all ears
[17:11] <scott-work> we can certainly create any flavour we like and host it in ppa but the precludes us from it being installed by default
[17:11] <JFo> right
[17:12] <JFo> I understand your concern there
[17:12] <scott-work> we have several types of users who either don't understand ppa's, are unwares of them, or simply choose to not use them
[17:12] <scott-work> so we lose the functionality for those users
[17:12] <scott-work> i understand as well that we multiply the work for the UKT by having soo many flavours for such a niche group of users though
[17:13] <scott-work> i was hoping we can find some compromise that would allow us to provide fucntionality to our users without appreciably increasing the workload on UKT
[17:14] <scott-work> JFo: i'm not sure i understand your quote about providing the -rt kernel but duplicated functionality
[17:16] <JFo> sorry, I'm in a meeting so my attention is divided as well
[17:16] <JFo> let me read back a bit
[17:16] <JFo> :)
[17:17] <JFo> I completely understand your comment about PPA;s
[17:17] <JFo> I'm working on something around that myself now
[17:18] <JFo> I think that there is a movement toward the -rt, but I have not pushed into it myself
[17:18] <JFo> I'm not sure why they decided not to have a preempt or lowlatency kernel
[17:18] <JFo> but I think they are under the impression that the -rt met those needs
[17:19] <JFo> is that not true
[17:19] <JFo> or is there an issue in the -rt kernel in this case
[17:20] <scott-work> i hope other's will chime in as well (for my experience is more with -generic and -rt) but i  ** think ** the -rt will provide what the other two do not, with one caveat
[17:20] <JFo> ok
[17:20] <scott-work> laptop users will find that possible the -generic isn't enough but that the -rt might each up too much battery
[17:21] <scott-work> but please don't misunderstand me, getting the -rt kernel supported would be an incredibly awesome milestone
[17:21] <scott-work> not to sound to jono-ish, that would absolutely rock!
[17:21] <scott-work> ;)
[17:23] <JFo> heh
[17:27] <scott-work> JFo:  does this mean we might see the -rt kernel available for maverick?  or possibly natty?
[17:27] <JFo> unfortunately I can't answer that
[17:27] <JFo> I believe abogani is doing the -rt kernel
[17:27] <JFo> but I could be mistaken
[17:28] <JFo> I do know that it is a community effort
[17:28] <JFo> so I don't have much in the way of detail
[17:28] <JFo> :-/
[17:28] <JFo> but there again, it is something I can bring up with the team
[17:29] <JFo> both so that I can get some detail for myself and so that I can see why we aren't doing it ourselves
[17:29] <scott-work> abogani: are you around?
[17:29] <scott-work> JFo: that would be really appreciated!  sometimes it is hard to find the right channels to get accurate information
[17:30] <JFo> I understand
[17:30] <JFo> but you can freely ask me or anyone else on the team in #ubuntu-kernel
[17:30] <scott-work> JFo: i was under the impression that the kernel team wasn't interested in abogani 's -rt kernel , but perhaps i misunderstood his position
[17:30] <JFo> I'm in there all the time :)
[17:30] <JFo> scott-work, that isn't my impression
[17:31] <JFo> but I'd love to talk to him about that
[17:31] <JFo> and see what isn't getting done for him
[17:31] <scott-work> i might join #ubuntu-kernel this afternoon when i have more time :)
[17:31] <scott-work> i hope your impression is right ;)
[17:31] <JFo> sounds good :)
[17:32] <JFo> there could always be some miscommunication too
[17:32] <JFo> all of us have our tons of work :)
[17:33] <JFo> one thing to consider is that all of these guys are deep in the code, so it may take some time to get to you and your question should you ask one :)
[17:33] <scott-work> very, very true.... JFo thank you for your time and consideration, it really helps :)
[17:33] <JFo> it took them a minute to answer me and they work with me :-)
[17:33] <scott-work> oh, no problem in that, i understand
[17:33] <JFo> scott-work, I'm always happy to chat
[17:34] <JFo> any time you like
[17:35] <JFo> I'll add this to my channel list so you guys can ping me with questions too. I'll answer any I can
[17:36] <scott-work> sweet, thanks
[17:42] <JFo> my pleasure
[17:42] <JFo> and I am serious about being available for your questions. you can send me e-mail to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>if I'm not online
[17:43] <JFo> I'll do my best to get the information you are asking for and get back to you
[17:43] <JFo> if you find that useful
[17:52] <scott-work> wow, that is very, very gratious of you!  and really appreciated, thank you very much
[18:03] <JFo> it's no problem :)
[19:21] <astraljava> Anyone else have trouble with cdimage.u.c ?
[19:22] <holstein> astraljava: i'll confirm something if you need
[19:24] <astraljava> holstein: Downloading is clipping real bad. Halts for minutes, then slowly gains bandwidth, then grinds to a halt again.
[19:25] <astraljava> Might be my connection though, 3G is a joke.
[19:25] <holstein> yeah
[19:25]  * holstein just complaining about verizon in another channel ;)
[19:26] <holstein> astraljava: shoot me a link if you want, and i'll check it out for you
[19:28] <astraljava> holstein: Thanks, but I'm fairly confident it's my end.
[23:21] <TheMuso> 6eeee1y/c