[21:39] <Squirm> ooh
[21:39] <Squirm> Quiet in here
[21:39] <Squirm> A few familiar faces still hanging around I see


[18:23] <AlanBell> hggdh: flags should be sorted now
[18:34] <IdleOne> Congrats on finally getting membership m4v!!!
[19:04] <hggdh> AlanBell: thank you
[23:17] <hggdh> AlanBell: sorry, I missed #ubuntu-br-pe -- please reset my perms there as admin
[23:33] <m4v> IdleOne: thanks :)
[23:41] <m4v> also, thanks IRCC.


[05:10] <tjaalton> bryceh: there are some "can be synced" tags on the versions_current list, do you think that sync requests should be filed for those?
[05:10] <tjaalton> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/PackageNotes
[05:11] <tjaalton> hmm, slightly outdated though, there are more
[05:12] <tjaalton> libxi for instance is very much needed, there are some bugs filed against libxcb that this should fix
[05:12] <tjaalton> http://bugs.debian.org/400442
[05:13] <tjaalton> superm1: libvdpau can be synced too, it won't break anything?
[05:14] <tjaalton> oh and lifeless should merge libx11 ;)
[05:15] <tjaalton> ok, list updated
[05:25] <superm1> tjaalton, although it's unlikely to break, it would be better to test it first
[05:37] <tjaalton> superm1: ok, sure
[05:37] <tjaalton> left it out from the list
[05:39] <superm1> tjaalton, when trying to build even: The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[05:39] <superm1>   pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy: Depends: x11proto-dri2-dev (>= 2.2) but it is not installable
[05:39] <superm1> is that not in lucid yet?
[05:39] <tjaalton> superm1: hah, no. but on the list of syncs
[05:40] <superm1> tjaalton, okay well after all that's in place i'll try a build and look at it again
[05:44] <tjaalton> there was a sync request for the proto, confirmed it now so hope that it'll get synced soon
[06:32]  * RAOF prepares to hang his system by trying to suspend.
[07:10] <tjaalton> RAOF: nouveau suspend works fine for me
[07:10] <tjaalton> it's nice how the user-switch is instant
[07:10] <tjaalton> +also
[07:10] <RAOF> tjaalton: Yeah; my laptop's just a bit of a problem-child.
[07:10] <tjaalton> ok, mine is a desktop
[07:11] <RAOF> It *has* worked with nouveau suspend in the past, but it now goes through the motions and then fails to actually power down in any way.
[07:11] <RAOF> I think that no_console_suspend is the next step in debugging.
[07:56] <mvo> can we get ctrl-alt-f2 and friends back when in X-is-in-trouble mode please? the menus are all nice but much less efficient than just going to the terminal
[07:57] <tjaalton> doesn't change the vt for you?
[07:58] <mvo> it didn't
[07:58] <mvo> but maybe something else was wrong too - is it mean't to work?
[07:58] <tjaalton> what hw? works for me on intel and nouveau
[07:58] <tjaalton> of course :)
[07:58] <mvo> nvidia (very new one)
[07:58] <mvo> aha .) I though it was removed for "safety" (just like ctrl-alt-backspace)
[07:58] <mvo> glad that its not :)
[07:59] <tjaalton> heh, no. looks like it's missing ctrl for some reason?
[08:00] <mvo> yeah, it looks like my keyboard map is wrong too
[08:00] <mvo> so that may explain it, I look into it
[08:00] <mvo> thanks
[08:00] <tjaalton> np
[08:03]  * mvo was also missing nouveau-firmware for some reason
[08:04] <tjaalton> nothing depends on it
[08:05] <tjaalton> but aiui it won't be needed for long
[08:06] <RAOF> Indeed; the .33 drm backport kernel also has the voodoo generator backported to it, too.
[08:35] <mvo> RAOF: nouveau is not working for me, gives me a "module nouveau not found" error - do I just need to wait for a new kernel with the .33 bits backported?
[08:37] <tjaalton> do you have a -pae kernel?
[08:45] <RAOF> mvo: You could wait for the kernel, or add-apt-repository ppa:apw/red to get it now, or check that you've got the right linux-backports-modules-nouveau-lucid-FLAVOUR installed.
[08:48] <mvo> RAOF: odd, modprobe lbm_nouveau gives me the module and X starts but for some reasons its not loading it itself (linux-backports-modules-nouveau-lucid-FLAVOUR)
[08:50] <RAOF> Hm.  Feel free to throw up your dmesg.
[08:51] <mvo> [drm] failed to load kernel module "nouveau" in Xorg.0.log - but I can wait for the new kernel to hit the archive, if -backports-nouveau is temporarely anyway its probably not worth spend (too) much time debugging
[08:52] <mvo> nothing in dmesg releated to nouveau, just [lbm-drm] initialized 1.1.0
[08:52] <mvo> (amd64)
[08:52] <RAOF> Yeah.  If you feel like it, check out the apw/red PPA; if that doesn't work, we've got an issue.
[08:53]  * mvo tries that now
[08:54] <mvo> the prospect of having free driver finally is just too tempting :)
[09:02] <mvo> RAOF: I'm much impressed, works like a charm now with the apw/red kernel
[09:02] <RAOF> Good to hear.
[09:04] <apw> mvo is that amd64 or i386
[09:04] <mvo> amd64
[09:04] <mvo> I can not switch to a vt anymore, but I had a similar problem earlier so it may be unreleated
[09:04] <mvo> and no compiz for me (G86 I think) - but that is probalby know, the 2d bits are fine though (so far)
[09:04] <RAOF> mvo: Can you post your dmesg; that sounds annoyingly like a bug I was sure the backport kernel would fix.
[09:05] <mvo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/388159/
[09:05] <tseliot> yes, compiz shouldn't work
[09:06] <mvo> (uname -a http://paste.ubuntu.com/388160/)
[09:06] <RAOF> Yeah, we don't have the 3D components in the main archive.  You can try the xorg-edgers PPA; lots of people have had compiz-level success with it.
[09:06] <tseliot> RAOF: my late congratulations on joining Canonical :-)
[09:06] <RAOF> tseliot: Thanks :)
[09:07] <RAOF> mvo: Can I have the rest of dmesg?  I think the error in there is plymouth, and unrelated.
[09:07] <mvo> RAOF: sure, sorry, give me a second
[09:07] <RAOF> tseliot: Oh, I was looking at some of the nvidia bugs, and bug 530481 sprang up as something you'd know about.
[09:08] <RAOF> I guess that's the new alternatives system making nvidia no longer *totally* break every other driver.
[09:09] <mvo> RAOF: mailed
[09:10] <RAOF> But leaving libgl just broken enough that compiz thinks everything's ok, but is actually horribly broken.
[09:19] <tseliot> RAOF: yes, right. It looks like mplayer's build-dep should be fixed and there is very little I can do if people install the wrong driver
[09:20] <tseliot> I could make mesa's libraries have the highest priority (with alternatives) so that this doesn't happen though
[09:20] <tseliot> and users will get the nvidia libraries only if they switch to them manually (or through jockey)
[09:21] <tseliot> superm1: thoughts? ^^
[09:22] <tseliot> note: this may break dist-upgrades
[09:23] <tjaalton> tseliot: but wasn't it meant to be able to install these side-by-side?
[09:23] <tjaalton> hmm though in this case nvidia was probably enabled as well
[09:24] <tseliot> tjaalton: yes but unless you choose the correct alternative automatic mode kicks in
[09:25] <tseliot> i.e. the alternative with the highest priority wins
[09:26] <tjaalton> shouldn't the free one have that?
[09:26] <tjaalton> because there's no way to decide the highest priority among the blobs
[09:27] <tjaalton> so even if you install the blog, you need to enable it
[09:27] <tjaalton> that way it doesn't break any setups
[09:28] <tseliot> tjaalton: that's what I was suggesting but there's a use case we wouldn't cover
[09:28] <tseliot> think of dist-upgrades
[09:28] <tseliot> users with nvidia would be left with mesa's libraries
[09:28] <tseliot> instead of nvidia's
[09:29] <tseliot> and even if we fixed this in update manager, things would still be broken for dist-upgrades from the command line
[09:30] <tjaalton> and the hw manager would then suggest to enable the nvidia libs
[09:30] <tjaalton> isn't that what happens?
[09:31] <tseliot> yes, if X doesn't crash
[09:31] <tseliot> nvidia would still be in xorg.conf
[09:31] <tseliot> but we would have no kernel module or gl libraries for that driver
[09:32] <tjaalton> the kernel module would be loaded, no? or does the alternatives touch that too?
[09:32] <tjaalton> the ddx driver loads it
[09:34] <tjaalton> then X wouldn't crash, just that GL is broken
[09:34] <tseliot> tjaalton: no, it wouldn't be loaded because of nouveau
[09:34] <tseliot> the KMS moduel
[09:34] <tseliot> module
[09:34] <tjaalton> uh, so how does nvidia make it not load nouveau?
[09:35] <tseliot> alternatives put a blacklist file in /etc/modprobe.d/
[09:35] <tseliot> then we update the initramfs
[09:35] <tjaalton> ok then
[09:35] <tjaalton> I give up :)
[09:36] <RAOF> But there wouldn't be any other alternative for the blacklist file, right?
[09:37] <tseliot> tjaalton: heh :-)
[09:37] <tseliot> RAOF: no, when you switch to mesa the blacklist file goes away and you (meaning jockey) will have to update the initramfs
[10:26] <RAOF> mvo: Have you done anything strange to your initramfs hooks?  It takes 26 seconds for nouveau to start to come up, which seems strange as it should be in the initramfs.
[10:26] <mvo> RAOF: nothing
[10:29] <RAOF> What does your computer *do* in the 23 seconds before it starts udev?!
[10:30] <mvo> RAOF: I don't know, I was making tea - I can start it again and see if its reproducable
[10:31] <RAOF> I'm not entirely sure how to read that dmesg; could you just make sure that nouveau.ko appears in /lib/modules/2.6.32-16-whatever/modules.order, before vga16fb?
[10:31] <RAOF> mvo: Ah, well, if you were making tea!
[10:33] <mvo> RAOF: sure, I can do that
[10:34] <mvo> RAOF: I just checked, nouveau is way before vga16
[10:49] <RAOF> mvo: Finally... can you check that the output of “sudo update-initramfs -u -v” contains /lib/modules/2.6.32-16-generic/kernel/drivers/gpu/drm/nouveau/nouveau.ko
[10:55] <mvo> RAOF: running that now - it says its running the nouveau_kms hook, but that is it. the module is not mentioned in the output (i can provide the full output if you want)
[10:56] <RAOF> Yes, please.
[10:58] <jcristau> 'zcat /boot/initrd.img-$(uname -r)|cpio -t |grep nouveau' maybe
[10:58] <jcristau> if you want to know whether it's in the initramfs
[10:59] <RAOF> Yeah, or that. :)
[10:59] <RAOF> Is -t really a synonym for --list?
[10:59] <RAOF> Yes it is.  How strange.
[11:02] <mvo> RAOF: here it is http://pastebin.com/VjqCNVTA
[11:02] <mvo> RAOF: I need to leave for lunch now, but I will read scrollback
[11:03] <ara> I am getting a lot of X crashers in a dell mini 9 (with an i945), is it known¿
[11:04] <ara> (lucid, of course)
[11:05] <jcristau> hard to say with 0 details
[11:11] <RAOF> mvo: Ok.  Now I ask you whether /usr/share/initramfs-tools/hooks/framebuffer exists, is executable, and if it's both of those, to pastebin its contents.
[11:11] <RAOF> mvo: I will be off to the more extended version of lunch in which I lie in a bed and sleep for 8-odd hours.  I shall also read scrollback  :)
[11:12] <mvo> RAOF: exists, executable, http://pastebin.com/UrGTFc9b is the content - is that outdated?
[11:12] <mvo> RAOF: heh :)
[11:51] <apw> RAOF, yay i beat the docbook failure
[12:44] <alkisg> How can I debug 100% xorg usage problems? (lucid, ancient ati)
[12:44] <apw> strace perhaps?
[12:45] <alkisg> strace xorg? ugh, any specific functions to look for?
[12:46] <tjaalton> check with gdb where it's spinning
[12:47] <tjaalton> or some profiler
[12:47] <alkisg> I think strace or gdb would be too much for my abilities - could you propose some profiler?
[12:51] <tjaalton> not really, google around
[12:51] <alkisg> Thanks
[13:26] <alkisg> Heh, an update solved my 100% xorg usage problem with ati :)
[13:51] <apw> bryceh, ok, we have some thumbs up from RAOF for the new kernel, i am getting a whole set together in my red ppa, to make sure the interactions on upgrade work correctly ... so don't test with it till i tell you its all there ... need to get kernel lbm and meta sorted as a group, to make it a proper test
[14:35] <Sarvatt> apw: * (pre-stable) drm/i915: blacklist lid status: Sony VGN-BX196VP, Dell    Inspiron 700m
[14:35] <Sarvatt> that's pointless isnt it?
[14:35] <Sarvatt> theres already a commit in .33 blacklisting all 8xx machines lid status
[14:36] <Sarvatt> ...if i'm not mistaken, checking
[14:38] <Sarvatt> http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/anholt/drm-intel.git;a=commit;h=7b9c5abee98c54f85bcc04bd4d7ec8d5094c73f4
[14:40] <tjaalton> bryceh: expect a yet-another merge clash with xorg, since you didn't push the changes :)
[14:41] <tjaalton> just the changelog though, as usual
[14:50] <Sarvatt> so yeah that commit is only in drm-intel-next only, wont make it back to stable until its merged I guess anyway
[15:06] <superm1> tseliot1, mplayer just needs to be fixed
[15:06] <superm1> dont worry about adding hacks for the fact that mplayer is doing it wrong
[15:06] <tseliot1> superm1: that's for sure
[15:06] <Sarvatt> it wasnt even a PPA version of mplayer that was causing it but one in the archive??
[15:07] <tseliot1> superm1: right, at this point I would rather not make too many changes. I will only re-enable the nvidia installer
[15:08] <superm1> i think the problem is it's not just s/nvidia blah dev/libvdpau-dev/ because mplayer FTBFS right now
[15:08] <superm1> so siretart really needs to fix the FTBFS
[15:08] <tseliot1> ah
[15:09] <Sarvatt> what mplayer package is pulling in nvidia-current? i dont see anything on 2:1.0~rc3+svn20090426-1ubuntu13
[15:09] <superm1> it's the build-deps that pull it in
[15:10] <Sarvatt> ahh
[15:11] <bjsnider> he has to refresh ffmpeg first
[15:12] <bjsnider> and x264, theora, vorbis, et al.
[15:13] <bjsnider> and then finally mplayer
[15:13] <bjsnider> and as far as i know none of this has been started
[15:13] <bjsnider> every time i ask him about it he gets snippy
[15:17] <superm1> bjsnider, yeah it's an annoying problem :(
[15:18] <superm1> i would think since he tries to maintain them in debian and ubuntu it would be stable in debian and more syncable though
[15:19] <bjsnider> the debian version is in no sense upstream. it's horribly outdated
[15:20] <bjsnider> the commands listed in his upstream-upgrade file for ffmpeg no longer work because there is no ffmpeg-debian to git pull from
[15:20] <bjsnider> so i don't know what is going on there
[15:20] <bjsnider> the ffmpeg 5.1 release happened yesterday i think. i went in to their irc room and asked about it. they said debian/ubuntu wanted them to release it
[15:21] <bjsnider> even though it's outdated code
[15:21] <bjsnider> debian/ubuntu i assume refers specifically to siretart i would assume
[15:21] <bjsnider> said assume twice there
[15:22] <superm1> well there's more to the debian multimedia team than just him i thought
[15:22] <bjsnider> that's older code than what is currently in karmic
[15:23] <bjsnider> well, debian/ubuntu and specifically ffmpeg? who else is there?
[15:24] <bjsnider> the 5.1 release notes specifically mentioned the linker bug that he fixed
[15:29] <bjsnider> it's also awfully late in the lucid cycle for a multimedia refresh
[15:31] <superm1> well if nothing else then, perhaps patching mplayer to not FTBFS
[15:33] <bjsnider> why not just delete it until it's fixed
[15:35] <superm1> that sounds like a waste of archive administration resources to me
[15:46] <tjaalton> hm, need to merge xorg since xorg-dev is uninstallable
[16:34] <bjsnider> does nvidia-current have a provides: nvidia-libvdpau or something like that?
[16:38] <tseliot> nope
[16:39] <bjsnider> are there provides at all?
[16:40] <bjsnider> dpkg must somehow think nvidia-current is related to nvidia-glx-xxx
[16:40] <bjsnider> otherwise i don't see why mplayer would pull it in
[16:40] <tseliot> we have transitional packages for that
[16:40] <superm1> it pulls in the 185 stuff
[16:40] <superm1> which is transitional
[16:41] <bjsnider> oh, right hahahaa
[16:41] <bjsnider> i forgot about the transitional packages
[16:41] <bjsnider> those darned things
[16:41] <bjsnider> what would happen if those didn't exist and someone tried to install mplayer?
[16:42] <superm1> probably wouldn't work
[16:42] <bjsnider> it would error out if the dependent packages weren't there i assume
[16:43] <superm1> but remember they're build-deps and suggests right now
[16:43] <superm1> not recommends or depends
[16:43] <bjsnider> i wonder what would happen during upgrades if the transitional packages weren't there
[16:44] <bjsnider> does nvidia-current have a conflicts: nvidia-glx-xxx?
[16:46] <bjsnider> without that i guess dpkg would fail due to duplicate files
[16:47] <tseliot> no, its doesn't conflict with that
[16:58] <bjsnider> tseliot, if someone manually installs nvidia-current, and does nvidia-xconfig to take care of xorg.conf, (bypassing jockey) are they missing anything?
[16:58] <bjsnider> it seems to me they're missing the glx part
[16:58] <tseliot> bjsnider: they will have to update the initramfs
[16:59] <bjsnider> tseliot, nvidia-current doesn't do that though dkms?
[16:59] <tseliot> bjsnider: ah, right it does that in the postinst
[16:59] <superm1> s/dkms/postinst/
[17:00] <bjsnider> but are they using mesa or are they using nvidia-s glx?
[17:00] <bryceh> morning
[17:01] <tseliot> morning bryceh
[17:01] <tseliot> bjsnider: the alternative provided by nvidia-current already has the highest priority so it should use Nvidia's gl libraries
[17:02] <bjsnider> ah, so you do not in fact need to use jockey to install the driver
[17:03] <superm1> nvidia-xconfig is probably writing out a lot of unnecessary content to xorg.conf though
[17:04] <bjsnider> yes, i agree
[17:04] <bjsnider> at one point it was writing data that was incompatible with xorg and it was causing the driver to fail to load
[17:04] <bjsnider> it still writes the mouse/keyboard info to it
[17:05] <superm1> i almost think it would be better to provide a shim that uses xkit in place of nvidia-xconfig to avoid that
[17:05] <tseliot> you can use jockey from the command line. That will give you a very minimal xorg.conf
[17:05] <superm1> that or ship an xorg.conf in nvidia-current as a conffile
[17:05] <bjsnider> but nvidia-settings will still write that parochial data to it as well
[17:06] <superm1> i thought it was patched?
[17:06] <bjsnider> oh, i don't know what's happening in lucid, but all other versions do
[17:10] <tseliot> I patched nvidia-settings to use policykit, I'm not aware of any other work on it
[17:10] <bjsnider> yeah, so nvidia-settings will be writing gobbledygook data to xorg.conf
[17:10] <tseliot> superm1: shipping a conffile can make things ugly
[17:10] <bjsnider> but it's nvidia's fault
[17:27] <Sarvatt> hmm, just had an idea.. maybe we could add a pci id check in the nvidia-current postinst that checks for a 10de vendor id before it sets the nvidia alternatives
[17:40] <superm1> Sarvatt, that doesnt help if you need to master an image with nvidia in it already
[17:43] <Sarvatt> hmm, if you did that though it wouldnt use nvidia GL by default in that case and activating it in jockey would end up running the postinst wouldnt it?
[17:46] <Sarvatt> we should be able to add the fglrx/nvidia to the autoconfiguration list at this point in xserver I imagine also
[17:47] <Sarvatt> that way we dont need an xorg.conf for nvidia anymore
[17:48] <superm1> bryceh had some patches for that, but they needed work
[17:48] <bryceh> hmm?
[17:49] <bryceh> yeah, tseliot was going to look into improving that but ran out of time
[17:49] <Sarvatt> yeah I added those :) we can add nvidia to the nouveau patch easily, our problem at the time was that we were shipping a stock xorg.conf with no explicit driver specified so it only used the first device from the autodetection list
[17:49] <bryceh> it gets complicated though.  for nvidia there are also some xorg.conf settings aside from specifying the driver, like the depth, and autoconfiguring the driver would not set those up automatically
[17:50] <Sarvatt> only the nologo option, dont really need that
[17:50] <jcristau> wasn't fglrx the one needing to have Depth set?
[17:50] <bryceh> maybe it was fglrx
[17:50] <jcristau> (which is incredibly stupid, but hey)
[17:50] <Sarvatt> ah nvidia has depth and Load    "glx" in it too but i didnt think they were required
[17:51] <Sarvatt> i'll test it out in a bit
[17:52] <bryceh> I seem to remember that at least many cards won't boot if depth is not specified
[17:52] <bryceh> anyway, I believe with some work it could be hacked around server-side, but makes the size of the effort just beyond what seems easy to do quick
[17:55] <Sarvatt> building xserver now with nv swapped to nvidia in the nouveau default patch to test it out real quick, will be a few hours though because I'm out of the house with a spotty connection
[17:55] <Sarvatt> there seems to be an x client leak with chromium/flash/nvidia blob :(
[18:05] <Sarvatt> rebooting to the new xserver without an xorg.conf now
[18:05]  * Sarvatt crosses fingers.
[18:06] <Sarvatt> it worked
[18:07] <superm1> i thought the problem was if you had an xorg.conf though, it doesn't use the proper fallback logic
[18:07] <Sarvatt> or not! :D
[18:07] <Sarvatt> load glx is required
[18:07] <Sarvatt> http://pastebin.com/0nGXwtDX
[18:08] <Sarvatt> that was only during the jaunty and early karmic devel stage superm1 where there was a default xorg.conf with no specific driver specified but that was dropped a long time ago
[18:09] <Sarvatt> so glx is not loading with no xorg.conf but 2D works fine
[18:11] <Sarvatt> that seems like a win to me, jockey installs the xorg.conf still and it'll still work without 3D if theres no xorg.conf for some reason
[18:11] <superm1> is there a way to get it to conditionally load glx if it's using nvidia
[18:12] <Sarvatt> need to dig into that more when I have some time, but this would make things basically work for people who install via a terminal instead of jockey (like me)
[18:13] <jcristau> the server loads glx unconditionally
[18:13] <superm1> Sarvatt, you can install via a terminal using jockey, jockey-text -e xorg:nvidia-current
[18:14] <Sarvatt> nice!
[18:14] <Sarvatt> is that new?
[18:14] <superm1> i added it a release or two ago to jockey
[18:15] <Sarvatt> sweet, thank you for that because I use that machine headless 99% of the time
[18:19] <Sarvatt> hmm mesa is kind of screwed up now on intel, 4 glx visuals 6 glxfbconfigs and some 3D apps arent working
[18:19] <Sarvatt> (in edgers not lucid's packages)
[18:36] <Sarvatt> hmmm
[18:36] <Sarvatt>   * Add 11_nvidia_suspend.patch: Re-enable chvt quirk for nvidia driver, to repair suspend with the current driver versions. (LP: #488720)
[18:36] <Sarvatt> I swear I tested that when I was looking into it and it didnt work on my machine
[18:37] <Sarvatt> yay for a mesa upload at 3KB/second
[18:41] <Sarvatt> time to test out this drm backport kernel, the -14 drm backport kernel had all kinds of problems on my intel that a .33 kernel didn't have for some reason
[18:45] <superm1> bjsnider, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/lucid-changes/2010-March/007277.html
[18:48] <Sarvatt> apw: might still want to enable the powersave=0 i915 module parameter default patch on -16, still have the hangs here after resume
[19:43] <bjsnider> well, siretart has decided to go with a very conservative release
[19:44] <superm1> mplayer doesn't build-dep on ffmpeg though does it?
[19:44] <bjsnider> oh yes it does
[19:44] <bjsnider> it uses dynamic ffmpeg like everything else
[19:45] <bjsnider> i tried building the 5.1 release yesterday and it still had the vhook stuff in it
[19:45] <bjsnider> not part of current svn code and hasn't been for a long time
[19:45] <bjsnider> but whatever. he's the expert
[21:32] <apw> bryceh, RAOF, finally have gotten what i think is the upgrade packages for drm33.  all in my red PPA
[21:33] <bryceh> apw, great thanks
[21:56] <bdrung> will xserver-xorg-video-ati updated to version 6.12.191? this will fix the tearing bug #514845
[22:04] <bryceh> bdrung_, 6.13 just came out iirc; probably we'll move to that
[22:04] <bdrung_> bryceh: great
[22:04] <bryceh> we'll probably need a ffe though
[22:06] <bdrung_> bryceh: you can use my bug report for getting it accepted ;)
[22:06] <bdrung_> bryceh: the current version in the archives hurts my eyes (found no translation for augenkrebs)
[22:07] <bryceh> bdrung_, no, there's not evidence that you tested the newer version and found it solved the issue, so it won't work as a base for a ffe
[22:08] <bryceh> I don't know what augenkrebs is
[22:09] <bdrung_> maybe going cross-eyed (direct translation would be eye cancer, but this is meant metaphorically)
[22:11] <bdrung_> bryceh: i tested a snapshot from 2010-02-24, but i will explicitly test 6.12.191 or 6.13.
[22:11] <bdrung_> bryceh: according to http://www.x.org/wiki/radeon 6.13 is not yet released
[22:40] <Trinity33> hi anyone here?
[22:41] <Trinity33> knock knock........
[22:42] <BUGabundo> no
[22:43] <Trinity33> i just found info somewhere that is i want to help i should come over :) so i got lucid alpha 3 q9000 quadcore ati hd4850 ddr2 4gb so where is that driver i have to test:) the last one i tested from open source included in lucid doesnt work so is there anything a=else i could do?
[22:43] <Trinity33> any other driver to check ?
[22:43] <Trinity33> catalyst 10.2 doesnt work in 2.6.32
[22:52] <Sarvatt> Trinity33: there is no catalyst for lucid to test yet unfortunately
[22:54] <Sarvatt> I'm kind of doubting there even will be one at this point..
[22:54] <Trinity33> why doesnt soemone make one? for me? nvidia is working in lucid
[22:55] <Sarvatt> because its a closed source driver and only ATI can do it
[22:56] <Trinity33> the driver included in lucid doesnt work with hd4850 too it use to much cpu
[22:56] <Sarvatt> it stinks because we really need time to work out the packaging issues like we did with the nvidia binary driver
[22:56] <Sarvatt> Trinity33: try booting with radeon.modeset=0 added to the kernel command line
[22:56] <Sarvatt> the 2.6.32-16 kernel should hopefully help with that a bit
[22:57] <Sarvatt> i'm guessing you're complaining about how slow flash is with the radeon drivers? radeon.modeset=0 should help with that alot
[22:59] <Trinity33> im not that good with drivers and generally linux im beginner :) so if i have to change something u need to speak english or russian i tried open source driver in karmic <IP_ADDRESS> and it use lot of cpu too the same like in lucid in karmic i have installed catalyst and the cpu usage is between 0 and 2% with open source driver between 30 and 50% cpu
[22:59] <bryceh> Sarvatt, yes there will be an -fglrx
[22:59] <bryceh> Sarvatt, they always deliver it in time, but only just.
[23:10] <johanbr> Does anyone know if it's possible with nouveau to detect a GPU lockup and do a reset (similar to what Intel does) ?
[23:13] <bryceh> johanbr, not afaik
[23:13] <bryceh> at least not currently
[23:14] <johanbr> alright, thank you
[23:15] <Sarvatt> only 965+ intel you should say :) it doesn't now but i imagine some of the newer hardware will be able to do it at some point because I'm pretty sure I remember the windows drivers doing it. nouveau is reverse engineered though so i wouldnt hold my breath for it to happen anytime soon if the blob doesn't already do it
[23:32] <RAOF> johanbr: It would actually be pretty easy to implement that.
[23:32] <johanbr> oh, alright :)
[23:32] <johanbr> so the nouveau people know how to "hot-reset" the gpu?
[23:32] <RAOF> In some cases.
[23:33] <RAOF> Oh, I was thinking more of “when you have detected a GPU lock up, tell someone so you can get a good bug report”.
[23:33] <RAOF> I'm not sure that being able to recover from arbitrary GPU lockups is easy.
[23:34] <RAOF> But GPU lockups are currently detected, various errors are detected, and a subset of them can be resloved.
[23:34] <johanbr> I get them every few days, but I'm not sure how to get the debug information...
[23:34] <johanbr> I could ssh in from my phone, I guess
[23:35] <RAOF> #nouveau is likely to be a better resource for actual debugging.
[23:37] <johanbr> alright, thanks


[05:44] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- cpaelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4100 No packages are being considered! If you are preparing sources manually, please upload them to the PPA now
[05:55] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- jamespage, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3535 Needs rebuild due to higher version at destination (cosmic/ceph). Ready to build (cosmic/nfs-ganesha)
[09:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- sil2100, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4002 Diff missing (focal/bluez-firmware, focal/flash-kernel, focal/livecd-rootfs, focal/raspberrypi-wireless-firmware, focal/shim, focal/shim-signed, focal/snapd, focal/ubuntu-core-initramfs, focal/unittest2). Needs rebuild due to higher version at destination (focal/linux-raspi). Ready to build (focal/awscli, focal/containerd, focal/debian-med, focal/python-botocore, focal/python-funcsigs, focal/pyt
[11:58] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- mitya57, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4101 Preparing packages
[12:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- mitya57, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4101 Preparing packages
[12:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- cpaelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4102 Failed to build
[13:23] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- mitya57, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4101 Pending binary packages
[15:01] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- cpaelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4100 Pending binary packages
[15:03] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- mitya57, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4101 Successfully built
[15:11] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- mitya57, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4101 Preparing packages
[15:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- cpaelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4100 Diff missing
[15:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- mitya57, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4101 Pending binary packages
[17:03] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- mitya57, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4101 Successfully built
[18:37] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- RikMills, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4095 Proposed pocket (groovy/kactivities-stats, groovy/kcontacts, groovy/kxmlrpcclient). Release pocket (groovy/attica-kf5, groovy/baloo-kf5, groovy/bluez-qt, groovy/breeze-icons, groovy/extra-cmake-modules, groovy/frameworkintegration, groovy/kactivities-kf5, groovy/kapidox, groovy/karchive, groovy/kauth, groovy/kbookmarks, groovy/kcalcore, groovy/kcmutils, groovy/kcodecs, groovy/kcompletion, groov
[18:57] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- RikMills, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4095 Release pocket
[22:22] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- cpaelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4102 Pending binary packages
[22:42] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- cpaelzer, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4102 Diff missing


[15:27] <scotty^> Hi all.
[15:27] <scotty^> Will the xserver-xorg-video-ati package in Quantal be updated soon to one based on at least 6.14.4, and preferably 6.14.5?
[15:28] <scotty^> This will allow for testing of AMD "Trinity" APU's.


[11:05] <Odd_Bloke> Looking at all of my server and desktop installs, I have backports enabled, but http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/livecd-rootfs/trunk/view/head:/live-build/auto/build#L132 has it commented out; could that change to have it enabled?
[11:05] <Odd_Bloke> (I'm asking in the context of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/livecd-rootfs/+bug/1513529, where we're being asked to have the same sources.list in cloud images as server images, including enabled backports)
[11:07] <Odd_Bloke> infinity: cjwatson: (You seem like you would have Thoughts on the above. :)
[11:10] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: You're reusing my old preinstalled code?  Ick.
[11:10] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: But yes, if that's where your sources.list is coming from, it should be resynced to match what apt-setup does, as it originally did.
[11:11] <cjwatson> do the same kind of thing as is done for universe just above I guess
[11:13] <infinity> Not convinced that's where your sources.list is coming from, though.
[11:14] <infinity> Oh, maybe it is.
[11:15] <infinity> Gross.
[11:15] <infinity> I'm so full of regret right now.
[11:17] <Odd_Bloke> infinity: Is there a right way that we could start doing it in yakkety?
[11:18]  * yofel goes fixing nmqt in x-proposed
[11:18] <Odd_Bloke> (We're also going to want this back in xenial, so we'll presumably have to just make the gross change there)
[11:18] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: Well, just fix that bit for now.  I need to tear out half my stale preinstalled-server stuff, and if some of that causes fallout for CPC, we'll think of a less gross way to do things.
[11:18] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: But yeah, for now, just do the obvious thing for xenial/yakkety.
[11:18] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: When I go deleting 500 lines of evil, we'll talk. :)
[11:19] <Odd_Bloke> ^_^
[11:25] <Odd_Bloke> Hmph, I can't totally cargo-cult universe thought because having backports in LB_PARENT_ARCHIVE_AREAS doesn't make sense.
[11:27] <Odd_Bloke> Aha, but there are already backport related options in live-build that I can, perhaps, steal.
[11:31] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: Hrm?
[11:31] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: What you should do it look at a clean sources.list from a server install, and then translate that to the bit in live-build/auto/build so the result looks the same.
[11:32] <Odd_Bloke> infinity: The way universe works is by checking if universe is in LB_PARENT_ARCHIVE_AREAS (which is used verbatim elsewhere).  Having backports in there doesn't make sense, so I need another way to signal from auto/config to auto/build that backports should be enabled.
[11:33] <Odd_Bloke> infinity: Unless we're happy to just remove the comments wholesale (to match a server install), rather than make it tweakable?
[11:33] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: If installs no longer comment things by default, cloud images should match.
[11:35] <Odd_Bloke> infinity: Cool, I'll just make it match.
[11:40] <Odd_Bloke> "On releases after and including Ubuntu 11.10 (Oneiric Ocelot) ... apt is configured with Backports enabled by default."  <-- probably safe to switch cloud images over now ¬.¬
[11:40] <yofel> pitti: ^ now with fixed symbols (the pre-upload testenv didn't have -proposed enabled, sorry)
[12:14] <pitti> yofel: thanks!
[15:04] <bdmurray> pitti: that remove from the archive SRU code, which you are using, is commenting on bugs multiple times
[15:05] <pitti> bdmurray: I sometimes ran it twice due to LP timeouts, just that?
[15:05] <pitti> bdmurray: other than that I removed the same package from multiple releases, and the comments would only differ in the release name
[15:06] <bdmurray> pitti: okay, looking at bug 1512902 I guess there is only one comment but I got 5 emails or so
[15:17] <bdmurray> pitti: let me know when you wrap w/ SRU work so I can do some (if there's any left!)
[15:17] <pitti> bdmurray: I'm done, and yes, there's still plenty left :) (I didn't even start on t/w queues yet)
[16:59] <bdmurray> infinity: Could you fully phase the ubuntu-drivers-common update for xenial?
[17:03] <LocutusOfBorg> any anybody please make vmtk migrate (I think by removing powerpc binary), and then try to remove insighttoolkit too? it should be the blocker for removal
[17:04] <LocutusOfBorg> and then if you demote fslview we can also just remove vtk too
[17:04] <LocutusOfBorg> (note: they have been both removed in debian)
[17:06] <infinity> bdmurray: Seems possible.
[17:27] <rbasak> smoser: ^^ do you want that simplestreams upload rejected?
[17:27] <smoser> nah.
[19:51] <infinity> bdmurray: ^--- That mtr SRU is SUPER IMPORTANT.
[19:54] <bdmurray> infinity: then why isn't importance CRITICAL?
[19:54] <infinity> bdmurray: I can reupload.
[19:54] <bdmurray> infinity: I meant the bug tasks.
[19:55] <infinity> (In all seriousness, it's about as critical as my decision about pizza or burgers for dinner, but if you use mtr daily, it's probably bugged you too... :P)
[19:56] <infinity> bdmurray: And it's one of those annoying bugs where I finally got sick of it, taught myself ncurses so I could fix it, fixed it locally, which then gave me the keywords required to Google and discover that upstream had already fixed it.
[19:56] <bdmurray> The choice between burgers or pizza could lead to heart disease (or something)
[19:56] <infinity> (argh)
[20:04] <flocculant> couple more a's there - argh is just indigestion


[00:04] <sijk> Hi all. I'm having graphics issues. When I ran software update yesterday nvidia-common failed to update. I tried removing and reinstalling it, but no luck. I eventually figured out that it was because my cc -> clang not gcc. Fixed that, update succeeded. Now, though, apparently I have no opengl support. Has anyone had a similar experience? Any thoughts?
[00:05] <wlfreeman> I have what is probably a rather simple problem involving a laptop touchpad. It's an ETPS/2 Elantech touchpad, with two physical buttons. The left one works fine, but the right one does nothing; it produces no events  in xev, and the KDE input settings claims that my touchpad only has one button. Any ideas?
[00:05] <sijk> Kubuntu 12.04, Thinkpad T420 (Intel HD3000 + NVS4200M). I am using bumblebee so I'll ask them too.
[00:06] <wlfreeman> sijk: Are you using the new Nvidia driver that claims to support hybrid graphics? I had some nightmares involving trying to use it with Bumblebee.
[00:07] <sijk> wlfreeman: Umm, I'm not sure? I'm using nvidia-current. I also tried nvidia-current-updates.
[00:12] <wlfreeman> I dunno, then. I sadly am a neophyte at getting wonky graphics card problems to work, although I've had my fair share of them.
[00:16] <sijk> wlfreeman: Thanks anyway. I'll keep bashing my head against it for a while...
[00:26] <FernandoBasso> I quit the kde accessibility icon, but it just gets back right away. How to completely obliterate it?
[00:26] <FernandoBasso> I couldn't find the package to uninstall.
[00:43] <Axlin> FernandoBasso: What about the package kdeaccessibility
[00:44] <Axlin> Which includes dependencies: jovie, kaccessible, kde-icons-mono, kmag, kmousetool, kmouth
[00:45] <FernandoBasso> Nope. No packages removed.
[00:45] <FernandoBasso> It is not even installed.
[00:45] <Axlin> What about the dependencies?
[00:45] <FernandoBasso> aptitude search kdeaccessibility
[00:45] <FernandoBasso> p   kdeaccessibility                                        - accessibility packages from the official KDE release
[00:46] <FernandoBasso> I was able to uninstall kaccessible. The icon is still there, though.
[00:47] <FernandoBasso> Yep, but it didn't come back this time after I quit it.
[00:47] <Axlin> After removing all of them, I'd try logging out and back in, since the services will still be running after removing.
[00:47] <FernandoBasso> Axlin: Thanks a bunch.
[00:47] <Axlin> No problme
[00:47] <Axlin> problem*
[01:32] <z1g7ag> hello
[03:10] <marktaff> Hi all
[03:15] <marktaff> I have a 4TB zpool under ZFS (4-2TB drives as stripped and mirrored vdevs), in kubuntu 13.04.  The pool was healthy.  I just installed a new 4TB single drive, the plan was to format it as ext4 and mount it at /backup to be used to hold backups.  I do not want this drive to be under ZFS.  The pool was created using sda/b/c/d.  With this new drive connected, the new drive is recognized as sdc, which makes the zpool report that it is d
[03:19] <marktaff> If I physically disconnect the new drive and reboot, ZFS recovers just fine.  What would be the best way to fix this?  I was thinking about formatting the new drive as ext4, then ensuring that /etc/fstab would mount the new drive by UUID, then rebooting and hopefully sdc would be correct again, and ZFS would recover.  Anyone see any problems with that plan, or have a better idea? ?  Thank you.
[03:33] <john______> howdy! I need to resize my partition without losing my stuff. Any hints?
[03:35] <john______> nvm got it ty
[04:04] <rush_> whatsup?
[04:04] <rush_> anyone out there????
[04:05] <rush_> I am the only one left on this godforsaken planet!!!!!
[04:06] <rush_> waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
[04:06] <valar> hi
[04:07] <rush_> hello valar
[04:07] <rush_> where are you from?
[04:07] <valar> hello rush
[04:07] <valar> i am from chennai. you?
[04:07] <rush_> i am from australia
[04:08] <valar> what are you?
[04:08] <rush_> a south african
[04:09] <valar> i asked you profession
[04:09] <rush_> it tech
[04:09] <rush_> just installed kubuntu for the first time to test
[04:10] <rush_> pretty cool
[04:11] <valar> i also installed IRC client first time
[04:11] <valar> then i tried it
[04:11] <rush_> i believe there are many different chatrooms
[04:11] <valar> yes
[04:12] <rush_> will see if i can get a list somewhere
[04:12] <rush_> see you....keep well and enjoy
[04:12] <valar> ok
[04:12] <rush_> sweet
[05:52] <marktaff> The solution was to restore the original physical hard disk connections to get the zpool healthy, then immediately execute 'zpool export poolname' followed by 'zpool import -d /dev/disk/by-id poolname'.  This makes the zpool recognize the disks by id instead of as sda/b/c/d as I had originally created the zpool.  Then I was able to reconnect the new 4TB drive, format it and mount it, no problem.
[05:52] <marktaff>   Exporting and importing the zpool only took a second, and I didn't lose any data.
[07:11] <Ab3L> hi. in my home directory, in .kde/share/apps, there is a folder named kmix. but i cannot access with my login. i've to use root permissions to navigate inside it. is it normal that user and group both are root for that folder? the files in my home directory shouldn't they be accessible with my standard permission?
[07:15] <piorekf> i'm trying to upgrade kubuntu 12.10 and in sandbox mode 12 packages fail (probably because linux-image-generic post-config fails)
[07:15] <piorekf> any sugestions?
[08:18] <Motak_> Hi
[08:22] <Mabus_> hi
[08:22] <Mabus_> anyone who can help me?
[08:23] <cjae> whats going on with the system monitor registering 100% cpu load, in 12.10
[08:24] <Mabus_> I have a question concerning plasma
[08:25]  * cjae wishes this room was more active
[08:26] <Mabus_> indeed
[08:29] <Mabus_> support?
[08:29] <valorie> Mabus_: ask your question
[08:29] <valorie> if any of us know the answer, we'll help
[08:30] <valorie> also, have some patience; some people help when they have a minute to spare
[08:30] <Mabus_> On a netbook. I figured out how to switch between netbook and desktop workspace type. but on start up it changes back. what can i do?
[08:31] <Mabus_> I want kubuntu so startup with desktop type
[08:31] <Mabus_> thanks valorie. sorry for being rude
[08:35] <valorie> that's not rude, but sometimes people don't realize that over 250 people in a channel doesn't mean everyone is watching it every minute
[08:35] <valorie> hmmmm
[08:35] <valorie> so you changed it in systemsettings?
[08:37] <valorie> Mabus_: how did you shut down?
[08:38] <Mabus_> yes I did. It worked.
[08:38] <Mabus_> shutdown by shutdown button
[08:40] <valorie> ok, you might try running: kbuildsycoca4 --noincremental once you reset it again (in a console)
[08:44] <Mabus_> ok thx. will try
[08:45] <Motak_> Hi room, I guess i have the same kind of issue than Mabus
[08:45] <valorie> which issue, Motak_?
[08:46] <Motak_> I am with  dual screen and since i upgraded to 13.04 my dual screen configuration is reseted when i reboot the computer
[08:46] <Motak_> It starts with on screen and i have to reconfigure it manually to extend to the second monitor
[08:46] <Motak_> one*
[08:47] <valorie> I don't think that's the same issue
[08:47] <Motak_> if it can help, the login page is on the 2 screens, cloned, but when kubuntu starts it goes back to one
[08:48] <valorie> sorry, I've always used a laptop
[08:48] <Motak_> ok thanx anyway
[08:48] <valorie> no experience with multi-screens
[08:56] <Mabus_> @valorie: I found the solution. There is a "default" option you have to click. (I'm supporting my sister by phone, thats why I didn't see it
[08:57] <valorie> cool
[08:58] <Motak_> Ok anyone else has an idea ?
[08:59] <greywalk> hi. i install skype on kubuntu 13.0 64bit and when i hover the coursor over skype, it uses some other cursor theme than the rest of the desktop. is there a way to make skype use the system's default cursor theme?
[09:02] <Motak_> I'll come back later when there will be more people. bye
[09:04] <soee> greywalk, don't know but i can confirm that is uses black cursor
[09:18] <Ab3L> hi. in my home directory, in .kde/share/apps, there is a folder named kmix. but i cannot access with my login. i've to use root permissions to navigate inside it. is it normal that user and group both are root for that folder? the files in my home directory shouldn't they be accessible with my standard permission?
[09:20] <hke> hi folks, precise here. in krdc. i dont get protocols in the drop-down list and thus, cant connect to anything. how can i change that?
[09:21] <hke> and when started, i get the following in a terminal: "KServiceTypeTrader::defaultOffers: KServiceTypeTrader: serviceType  "KRDC/Plugin"  not found"
[09:22] <hke> any ideas?
[10:07] <valar> asd
[10:08] <valar> hi
[10:13] <valar> hi
[10:36] <greywalk> soee: still here? here is how to resolve the cursor issue for skype - sudo apt-get install ia32-libs -- it lacks a dependencie to be able to use the system coursor theme, installing that package will solve the issue
[10:37] <soee> isn't this package obsolate ?
[10:37] <soee> Riddell, maybe you can tell?
[10:37] <greywalk> i guess not, it just worked for me - i have the default coursor on skype
[10:39] <soee> also it wants to install ~ 100 new packages
[10:39] <greywalk> yep, that;s true
[10:40] <greywalk> but no choice unless you want to compile that lib only
[10:40] <soee> for me not worth to install such amount of packages only to get cursor :D
[10:41] <greywalk> no problem )
[11:15] <Aison> hello, i'm upgraded my kubuntu to raring and so far everything was fine
[11:15] <Aison> but somehow from yesterday on my kwin allways crashes at login
[11:15] <Aison> no idea why
[11:16] <Aison> I can use the desktop, but everything is very slow, eg. moving windows
[11:18] <soee> hard to say, are you using nvidia driver ?
[11:18] <PasNox> Hi
[11:18] <PasNox> i'm trying to use libmount-dev on recent kubuntu, but i got this bug: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=691889
[11:18] <PasNox> any hint on how to ask package upgrade to the last version ?
[11:19] <soee> PasNox, sorry i dont know
[11:19] <PasNox> np, thanks
[11:29] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[12:26] <qww> hello all
[12:27] <qww> i am install kubuntu 13.04 and i didn't instal Chrome ( Google chrome)
[12:48] <Aison> soee, sorry, forgot to say that i'm using fglrx
[12:49] <Aison> it worked perfectly in past
[12:50] <Graefin_Westerho> Linux froze again.
[12:50] <soee> :D
[12:50] <soee> winter is coming
[12:51] <Graf_Westerholt> It is winter everyday for my Linux.
[12:52] <soee> strange
[12:53] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, have you checked the logs , /var/log/,  look in syslog for errors
[12:53] <soee> i haven't any problems with Kubuntu
[12:54] <Graf_Westerholt> There are 7 syslog.gz
[12:55] <BluesKaj> soee, seems Graf_Westerholt has had this problem for a while , even on different kubuntu versions , correct Graf_Westerholt ?
[12:55] <Graf_Westerholt> Sim. More then a year.
[12:55] <BluesKaj> just the syslog
[12:55] <soee> for me if something freezes or wont strt its usually after i do something with nvidia drivers :)
[12:56] <soee> Graf_Westerholt, laptop or desktop ?
[12:56] <Graf_Westerholt> soee, I do not use Nvidia drivers.
[12:56] <Graf_Westerholt> It is a tower-PC
[12:57] <Graf_Westerholt> soee, I do not use Nvidia drivers.
[12:57] <Graf_Westerholt> Fucking Quassel
[12:57] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, which graphics gpu ?
[12:57] <Graf_Westerholt> May  9 14:48:45 lost kernel: [   98.067387] virtuoso-t[2514]: segfault at ffffffffffffffff ip<PHONE_NUMBER>975b8b sp 00007fff9fd8c070 error 7 in virtuoso-t[400000+b44000]
[12:58] <soee> Graf_Westerholt, use xchat (for me its much better than quassel)
[12:58] <Graf_Westerholt> *g*
[12:59] <soee> :)
[13:00] <BluesKaj> konversation ftw
[13:00] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj http://www.sysprofile.de/id10404
[13:00] <Graf_Westerholt> My panel of plasma-desktop is missing, too.
[13:01] <Graf_Westerholt> I have to restart plasma-desktop.
[13:02] <soee> Graf_Westerholt, the same happens also on fresh installation ?
[13:02] <Graf_Westerholt> Sure. Two fresh installations.
[13:02] <Graf_Westerholt> This installation is a few weeks old.
[13:02] <Graf_Westerholt> Now restart of plasma does not get my panel back.
[13:03] <soee> and it happens from the beginning ?
[13:03] <Graf_Westerholt> No. I started one and a half year ago, I guess.
[13:03] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, you have nvidia graphics gpu , you shouild be using nvidia drivers , look in kmenu >apps>system>additional drivers
[13:04] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, I used them and with nvidia drivers is freeze, too.
[13:05] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, using nouveau ? it's a good driver
[13:06] <Graf_Westerholt> How can I check nouveau?
[13:06] <Graf_Westerholt> Is there a bug with the panels? When at top at the screen it is not shown. At bottom or side it is shown.
[13:13] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, run, dkms status , in the terminal
[13:15] <BluesKaj> pastebin the output , Graf_Westerholt
[13:15] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, "dkms status" does not put anything out.
[13:23] <BluesKaj> really Graf_Westerholt ? that's odd
[13:23] <Graf_Westerholt> supertux@lost:~$ dkms status
[13:23] <Graf_Westerholt> supertux@lost:~$
[13:26] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, what should dkms put out?
[13:27] <BluesKaj> it should show the drivers in use for graphics and audio
[13:27] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, try this , dpkg -l | grep nvidia , pastebin the output please.
[13:29] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj http://paste.kde.org/740582/
[13:35] <BluesKaj> ok one more , Graf_Westerholt , I'm trying to determine which drivers in use , try this and pastebin it as well , sudo lshw -c video
[13:37] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, I do as much as you want. :)
[13:39] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, lshw is putting everything in one line, so it is deleted.
[13:39] <Graf_Westerholt> Very strange.
[13:39] <BluesKaj> sudo lshw -c video
[13:40] <Graf_Westerholt> Yes, I run it like this.
[13:40] <Graf_Westerholt> It overwrites the outprinted lines.
[13:40] <Graf_Westerholt> ok, I can print in in a file.
[13:40] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, ok ,  lspci -nnk | grep -i vga -A3 | grep 'in use' , include the quotes
[13:41] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj http://paste.kde.org/740588/
[13:47] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, ok you're using the nouveau driver and it's a very capable driver for nvidia cards ...Have you made sure the graphics card is not loose and is well seated into the motherboard pci slot , sometimes thay can work loose, because yor symptoms indicate an intermittent problem and they are difficult to track down.
[13:48] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, I am going to check the card when I shut my PC down.
[13:49] <BluesKaj> ok , Graf_Westerholt , good for a start
[13:53] <lupusimprobus> Ciao
[13:53] <lupusimprobus> !list
[14:13] <lordievader> Good afternoon.
[14:18] <Graf_Westerholt> Hi, lordievader.
[14:18] <lordievader> Hey Graf_Westerholt, how are you doing?
[14:21] <BluesKaj> lordievader, we're trying to track down Graf_Westerholt's desktop freeze problem , using the nouveau driver on nvidia 9300ge gpu
[14:22] <lordievader> Syslog and dmesg doesn't give a clue?
[14:22] <BluesKaj> and he;s tried the nvidia additional drivers without any luck
[14:24] <Graf_Westerholt> lordievader, my Pinguin is freezing. :D
[14:25] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, not the desktop is freezing. Linux is freezing.
[14:26] <BluesKaj> ok ,what do you mean by linuix freezing , describe some details
[14:27] <Graf_Westerholt> I cannot use the magic sysrequest.
[14:27] <lordievader> Kernel panic?
[14:27] <Graf_Westerholt> I have to press the hard-reset-button .
[14:27] <Graf_Westerholt> No kernel panic. Screen freeze and no reaction to magic sysrequests.
[14:28] <Graf_Westerholt> Sound stops.
[14:28] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, look in syslog in /var/log/  to see what the error=s are
[14:28] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj I did and postet.
[14:29] <Graf_Westerholt> [14:57:26] <Graf_Westerholt> May  9 14:48:45 lost kernel: [   98.067387] virtuoso-t[2514]: segfault at ffffffffffffffff ip<PHONE_NUMBER>975b8b sp 00007fff9fd8c070 error 7 in virtuoso-t[400000+b44000]
[14:29] <lordievader> Graf_Westerholt: Does dmesg log hold any errors at that point?
[14:31] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, did you try re-nstalling plasma-desktop
[14:31] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, this is the second new installation of Kubuntu.
[14:31] <Graf_Westerholt> Or third.
[14:32] <BluesKaj> looks like nepomuk is causing problems , do you have file indexing enabled
[14:32] <Graf_Westerholt> It is not plasma. I cannot switch to terminal when Linux freezes.
[14:32] <Graf_Westerholt> I cannot kill the x-server.
[14:33] <lordievader> Graf_Westerholt: That is why you should look in the dmesg log ;)
[14:33] <Graf_Westerholt> There is one error in dmesg: [   25.386777] EXT4-fs (dm-1): re-mounted. Opts: errors=remount-ro
[14:33] <lordievader> That is all? Hmm, that ain't helpfull :(
[14:33] <Graf_Westerholt> lordievader, that is the point since one and a half year. No error logs.
[14:34] <LjL> yesterday i messed with the clock settings in the GUI, sync-from-internet specifically, because of reasons. then i set it back to what it was, but now it's not working properly. if i ask it to "sync the time from the internet", it shows UTC time (even though "date" shows me CEST time correctly), even though it says "Rome" below it. if i set it manually to the right time (which i wouldn't like to have to do, anyway), then of course the "date" time is wrong,
[14:34] <LjL> which is an issue.
[14:34] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, systemsettings>desktop search , turn it off
[14:35] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, done.
[14:36] <BluesKaj> LjL, I'm not using the auto-sync time , uncheck UTC and just use your local time
[14:36] <BluesKaj> it works
[14:36] <BluesKaj> Graf_Westerholt, are you using kmail?
[14:37] <Graf_Westerholt> LjL, I had such a probem, too. I set it with the console and all was fine again.
[14:37] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, I do.
[14:37] <BluesKaj> aha
[14:37] <Graf_Westerholt> kmail is freezing my penguin?
[14:39] <BluesKaj> I'll bet that akonadi server is causing the freezes linked to nepomuk index/desktop search and the database server in akonadi
[14:40] <Graf_Westerholt> But should the magis sysrq still work when akonadi chrashs?
[14:40] <LjL> BluesKaj: no actually it doesn't work, because then only KDE programs have the right time, other programs (including system "date") have it wrong. also, if i don't use NTP, the clock drifts, and i don't want that to happen
[14:41] <LjL> Graf_Westerholt: like with "date"?
[14:41] <Graf_Westerholt> LjL, sorry, I do not know anymore what command I used.
[14:41] <BluesKaj> LjL, ok then your problem is obviously much different than mine
[14:43] <Graf_Westerholt> LjL, try "sudo ntpdate -u ntp.ubuntu.com "
[14:43] <LjL> oh wait i gave wrong info, because i inadvertently used "date" on an SSH session to something else, not on my system :P what actually happens is that KDE thinks i'm in "Rome" time (i.e. CEST), but "date" thinks i'm in UTC. both give a number that corresponds to UTC time.
[14:43] <BluesKaj> LjL, try, sudo dpkg-reconfigure tzdata
[14:45] <LjL> BluesKaj: now "date" gives the right time, KDE still has it wrong but maybe that will fix itself after a logout
[14:45] <Graf_Westerholt> I am here at UTC+2 and KDE told me that UTC+2 is same as UTC.
[14:45] <LjL> Graf_Westerholt: ntpdate still thought i was UTC
[14:45] <LjL> Graf_Westerholt: ... :\
[14:45] <BluesKaj> UTC is useless
[14:45] <LjL> UTC is useless? O.o
[14:45] <BluesKaj> who cares about utc
[14:45]  * Graf_Westerholt cares about UTC.
[14:46] <LjL> uhm, anyone who needs to deal with international things, or for that matter anyone who wants to have accurate clock from an international source?
[14:46] <BluesKaj> fine , suffer with it :)
[14:46] <BluesKaj> LjL, just adjust the time with simple arithmetic , timezones
[14:47] <Graf_Westerholt> BluesKaj, if you use more than one OS you need to have your system clock at UTC.
[14:47] <LjL> BluesKaj: gah, i reconfigured "tzdata" and told you it worked, because it had seemed to... but now, "date" has switched back to UTC *again*. something has clicked in my head though, i seem to remember this being a problem with someone else or myself before... i need to grep my logs
[14:47] <BluesKaj> perhaps the system clock , but not local time
[14:47] <LjL> Graf_Westerholt: well no not necessarily
[14:48] <LjL> BluesKaj: nobody here is saying that you should have your local time set to UTC (unless you're British and in the winter, of course)
[14:48] <BluesKaj> ok LjL , exactly
[14:49] <Graf_Westerholt> I am off. See you later!
[14:49] <BluesKaj> unchecking UTC in the time settings won't affect the system clock , that's my point
[14:49] <LjL> laters
[14:50] <LjL> BluesKaj: eh? what i can uncheck in the time settings is NTP ("Set date and time automatically"), not UTC (which is a time standard)
[14:50] <BluesKaj> I'm talking about the panel clock settings here
[14:50] <BluesKaj> yes
[14:50] <BluesKaj> LjL, I have the UTC unchecked in panel claock
[14:51] <LjL> but i have no "UTC" checkbox in the panel clock
[14:51] <LjL> there is just no such thing
[14:51] <BluesKaj> ok
[14:53] <BluesKaj> there's an option for UTC in the "Time Zones" in the Panel clock settings GUI
[14:53] <LjL> oh
[14:53] <LjL> i know what you mean
[14:53] <LjL> but i don't have that set, never did
[14:53] <LjL> besides, that shouldn't affect the time "date" gives me
[14:54] <LjL> anyway i see from the channel's log a few people have had this problem, maybe there's a known solution. looking better
[14:55] <BluesKaj> and it was auto setting to UTC for some reason , so i unchecked it and unchecked the auto setting public time server option
[14:56] <BluesKaj> LjL, yes , think it's bug with the time server links
[14:57] <BluesKaj> because I was having time server linkm problems with W7 as well
[15:46] <supermagnum357> Hi, is there anybody here that has any knowledge of Python ?
[15:49] <Pici> supermagnum357: Yes, but asking in #python will probably be a better course of action
[15:49] <Pici> You'll need to register/identify to speak there though
[15:49] <Pici> !register
[15:53] <supermagnum357> pici: i need help to debug a script , its 70 lines.
[16:06] <G__81> i am installing Kubuntu 12.10 in my PC. Would it be possible for me to add the Kubuntu Backports repo and upgrade to 4.10.2 instead of upgrading to Kubuntu 13.04 as such. would that work ?
[16:07] <G__81> can some one advice me on this ?
[16:09] <BluesKaj> G__81, yes that will work
[16:10] <wlfreeman> I recently installed Kubuntu on an Asus G46 laptop with an Elantech ETPS/2 touchpad. This isn't one of the "clickpads"; it has two physical buttons. Everything works except the right-click. There seem to be lots of problems like this and solutions, but they're all for clickpads rather than old-fashioned touchpads with real buttons. Any ideas about how I can diagnose this?
[16:10] <G__81> BluesKaj: thanks
[16:13] <scherenhaenden> hi, i got the problem that pulseaudio makes everything stuckup... so i can use alsa... but i cant use wine n skype at the same time.... dunno what can i do
[16:23] <BluesKaj> sch why are you using wine with skype ?
[16:23] <BluesKaj> oops , no patience
[16:33] <Ab3L> hi. in my home directory, in .kde/share/apps, there is a folder named kmix. but i cannot access with my login. i've to use root permissions to navigate inside it. is it normal that user and group both are root for that folder? the files in my home directory shouldn't they be accessible with my user (not sudo) permission?
[16:44] <TekkBuzz> Ab3L: just go in to .kde/share/apps and do: sudo chown -R username:username *
[16:48] <Ab3L> ok. but i don't understand why it has those permissions. it may be created when i was sudo....
[16:48] <Ab3L> thank TekkBuzz
[16:49] <sha1sum> I just installed the latest release from kubuntu.org yesterday, and I was surprised to see that it's using maverick sources... ? I had to manually change the domain for the repos to old-releases.ubuntu.com... Is this right?
[16:50] <BluesKaj> TekkBuzz, which kubuntu version ? because kmix doesn't resoie in my .kde/share/apps
[16:50] <BluesKaj> reside
[16:52] <sha1sum> ...and "cat /etc/*release" shows Ubuntu 10.10 maverick
[16:52] <sha1sum> Should I be doing a dist-upgrade or will this break my installation?
[16:57] <BluesKaj> sha1sum, is this a clean install , if you want the latest kubuntu :  http://www.kubuntu.org/getkubuntu/download
[16:58] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: Yeah I formatted and installed Kubuntu 13.04 as downloaded (64-bit DVD) from this page: http://www.kubuntu.org/getkubuntu/download#download-block
[16:59] <TekkBuzz> BluesKaj: yeah that's true, mine resides in /usr/share/kde4/apps/kmix, but anytime I have a problem like Ab3L, I'll just switch the permisssions or ownership back to what it should be.
[17:00] <sha1sum> and I noticed, when trying to set up my applications again, that when I went to download firefox I was getting 404 errors all over the place, which is when I started browsing through the repository indexes to find that maverick moved to old-releases.ubuntu.com, which got me thinking: why the hell is the newest release using an OLD release? lol
[17:01] <BluesKaj> sha1sum, lsb_release -sr
[17:01] <sha1sum> So should I be changing to a later release and then doing an "apt-get update; apt-get upgrade; apt-get dist-upgrade" ?
[17:01] <BluesKaj> what's the output?
[17:01] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: 10.01
[17:01] <sha1sum> whoops
[17:01] <sha1sum> 10.10
[17:02] <BluesKaj> then you have mistakenly installed 10.10 somehow
[17:02] <sha1sum> But my KDE version is 4.8.4, which I highly doubt was the maverick version
[17:02] <sha1sum> more likely something jacked around with my repositories... I looked at sources.list and there's no comment about where the repo list came from (any kind of app that may have altered them)
[17:02] <BluesKaj> kde 4.8 can run on it
[17:03] <BluesKaj> what's your sources.list show , maverick ?
[17:04] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: yeah. I had to change the domain names to old-releases.ubuntu.com to get the repos to at least find packages again
[17:04] <sha1sum> which they were at http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/......
[17:05] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: for instance, here's the main repo entry: deb http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ maverick main restricted universe
[17:05] <BluesKaj> archive ubuntu , no wonder
[17:05] <BluesKaj> backup your data ,and install a 13.04 image
[17:05] <sha1sum> So I guess I can resolve this with a dist-upgrade, but I just want to be sure that it wasn't meant to be 10.10
[17:06] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: I promise you that during the install it said 13.04 on the installer branding
[17:06] <sha1sum> I think something just messed with the repos lists
[17:07] <sha1sum> I've already configured the hell out of a lot of stuff on this install... If I don't have to do it all over again I'd definitely prefer not to lol
[17:07] <BluesKaj> sha1sum, did you install to / and not touch /home
[17:07] <sha1sum> What's the code name that I should be using for the latest kubuntu release?
[17:08] <BluesKaj> quantal
[17:08] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: I don't have separate partitions (I know, I know)
[17:08] <G__81> Hi i have installed Kubuntu 12.10. I have added teh kubuntu backports ppa repo. I want to get only the KDE 4.10.2 and not the new kernel etc. So when i do apt-get dist-upgrade will it get upgraded to 13.04 ?
[17:09] <BluesKaj> sha1sum, no that's not it , you should have a clean 13.04 if you installed to / only
[17:09] <BluesKaj> G__81, no
[17:09] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: yeah, and I moved from OpenSUSE, so I'm sure that it's not remnants of an old release, because that would be damn near impossible
[17:10] <sha1sum> I'm going to try a dist-upgrade first, and if that doesn't work then I'll reinstall from a redownloaded image
[17:10] <sha1sum> at least I have everything backed up.
[17:10] <G__81> BluesKaj: so if i do dist-upgrade i ll still stay with 12.10 and would get only the updates from backports ppa ?
[17:10] <BluesKaj> don't dist-upgrade , that will only upgrade the 10.10 pacjkages
[17:11] <BluesKaj> sha1sum,^
[17:11] <G__81> BluesKaj: so what should i do ?
[17:11] <G__81> BluesKaj: i just want the 12.10 kernel and other stuff. I want the 4.10.2 and other KDE updates alone
[17:12] <BluesKaj> G__81, yes your backports will upgrade kde and existing packages in 12.10
[17:12] <G__81> BluesKaj: so what command should i give ?
[17:12] <G__81> apt-get upgrade?
[17:12] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: even if I change the repo sources to quantal and do an apt-get upgrade first?
[17:13] <BluesKaj> G__81, sudo apt-get update;sudo apt-get upgrade , then sudo dist-upgrade
[17:14] <BluesKaj> sha1sum, no , changing the sources list will just muck up your install totally, you can't go from 10.10 to 13.04 directly
[17:14] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: sad-face :(
[17:15] <sha1sum> really didn't want to do all this again... Oh well... here I go.
[17:15] <sha1sum> BluesKaj: thanks for your help! :)
[17:15] <BluesKaj> sha1sum, np
[17:17] <G__81> BluesKaj: ok thanks so giving those commands will make me stay with 12.10 alone and will not move me to 13.04 kernel or other stuff. is that right?
[17:18] <G__81> and not to mention, it will fetch the kde updates too right?
[17:18] <BluesKaj> G__81, right
[17:18] <BluesKaj> yes
[17:18] <G__81> thanks a lot
[17:19] <BluesKaj> np, G__81
[17:19] <G__81> i am facing problems with 13.04 kernel especially hibernate and suspend.its not a kubuntu issue, i see the same issue with fedora too and hence i stayed in 3.6 kernel series but 13.04 has 3.8 which is where i see the issue
[17:20] <Ab3L> TekkBuzz: i was thinking about the folder with the permissions only for root. if i created it when i was root, it should be found in /home/root instead of /home/ab3l/, shouldn't it?
[17:20] <BluesKaj> G__81, afaik the 12.10 kerenel stick with the 3.5
[17:20] <BluesKaj> sticks
[17:24] <G__81> BluesKaj: yeah i guess thats why i want to have 12.10 + kde 4.10 and then probably later on move to 13.10 once its released :)
[17:24] <TekkBuzz> Ab3L: depends on the environment you had set when you became root, there are different ways of becoming root.
[17:25] <bbeck> Does anyone know how to import an opml file into Amarok.  I press the import button, and nothing happens.
[17:25] <TekkBuzz> Ab3L: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo
[17:26] <BluesKaj> G__81, I'm testing 13.10 atm and it's quite stabel , using nvidia graphics here , but I haven't heard any complaints about ATI or Intel graphics , but ione ask in #ubuntu+1 about any issues, if you wish
[17:26] <Ab3L> TekkBuzz: thank you again
[17:26] <BluesKaj> stabel=stable
[17:29] <BluesKaj> bbeck, http://pcsupport.about.com/od/fileextensions/f/opmlfile.htm
[17:30] <BluesKaj> bbeck, it's not a media/codec playable file
[17:34] <bbeck> BluesKaj: yeah, I know I can't play it, but Amarok has a button to import an opml file, but pressing the button does not cause a file dialog to pop up or an error to be produced.
[17:44] <BluesKaj> bbeck, perhaps amarok looks for the file locally , try downloading the opml file to your /home/user
[17:44] <BluesKaj> first
[17:45] <sebastiano> hi, my clock automatically changes the time to two hours earlier after every reboot, any ideas? tnx
[17:52] <BluesKaj> bbeck, where is the option to import opml in amarok
[17:58] <BluesKaj> sebastiano, make sure you set your clock to your time zone in "adjust date and time" and uncheck "set date and time automatically" ..there's a bug in the time server links , and make sure UTC is not checked in "Time Zones"
[17:59] <bbeck> BluesKaj: Go to the podcast pane, then it's the last icon on the toolbar.
[18:01] <sebastiano> BluesKaj: uhm I think I already tried that, my time zone is set on berlin... yeah the problem started when once I checked the  "set date and time automatically"
[18:07] <BluesKaj> bbeck, yeah in configure amarok> settings plugins>podcast directory ..clicking on it does nothing here either :(
[18:09] <BluesKaj> sebastiano, leaving the "adjust date and time" unchecked works here on all clocks on 3 OSs
[18:11] <sebastiano> BluesKaj: ok tnx
[18:12] <ik_> chidooooooooo
[18:17] <claycorn> hello
[18:17] <bbeck> BluesKaj: thanks for checking for me
[20:11] <Sput> hi all
[20:12] <Sput> trying to upgrade an old 10.10 machine to something recent, but do-release-upgrade as well as all graphical tools fail because extras.ubuntu.com/blabla/natty/foo/Packages.gz is not found
[20:12] <Sput> is there any way to recover this outdated installation somehow?
[20:12] <bazhang> !eolupgrades | Sput
[20:13] <Sput> thx :)
[20:28] <Sput> wtf, I have 26 GB free space on hdd, and do-release-upgrade now fails because it doesn't have enough?
[20:30] <bazhang> Sput, do you have a separate /boot ?
[20:32] <BluesKaj> Sput, what's the error ?
[20:32] <Sput> bazhang: yeah, and the graphical tool actually told me that I should clean /boot
[20:32] <Sput> on the shell I didn't get that important piece of info :)
[20:32]  * Sput goes hunt for that snippet to remove unused kernels
[20:33] <bazhang> that is exactly what I got when upgrading from 12.10 to 13.04
[20:33] <BluesKaj> why bother with /boot to clutter thigs up
[20:34] <Sput> dunno, I'm sure it was kind of default when I installed this system
[20:34] <BluesKaj> or do ppl use it for grub maybe ?
[20:34] <Sput> I don't usually use *buntu, so I'm rather poking around :)
[20:34] <Sput> at least in my usual distro I know how to fix things
[20:36] <genii-around> On the later *buntu from around 12.04 it will automatically mark your running kernel and the just-previous one with APT::NeverAutoRemove::  so then you can just use sudo apt-get autoremove   and the old cruft can go
[20:36] <genii-around> But on previous versions, you have to manually specify each one in apt-get remove
[20:38] <BluesKaj> ok genii-around that's good to know , I use autoremove a lot along with autoclean
[20:39] <BluesKaj> ok , that's it for another day
[21:10] <marconotaria> hi would like to know how to install skype in my zorin computer idk why is not listed
[21:11] <bazhang> #zorinos marconotaria for zorin support
[22:11] <Guest55913> hello
[22:28] <TekkBuzz> anyone here use BasKet notes?
[22:29] <TekkBuzz> seems it got broken between kde3 and 4.
[23:07] <bunjee> anyone having trouble connecting to the internet with 13.04?