[04:13] <iamnewbie> is there an image for ubuntu that can be loaded on an old windows hp slate?
[07:23] <nhaines> So, realtalk time!  How do I get a OSK while running an X app via Libertine? :P
[11:12] <Walex> nhaines: I suspect that's a bit of an issue currently.
[11:14] <zzarr> hello! what is OSK?
[11:15] <svij> on screen keyboard
[11:16] <zzarr> svij, thank you, I guess I'm tired... should have understood that
[11:18] <zzarr> about that, is there a way to get arrow keys on a on screen keyboard?
[11:18] <zzarr> (or some other way to move the marker in text)
[11:19] <davmor2> zzarr: use the emoji layout I think they have arrows could be wrong though
[11:20] <zzarr> davmor2, I will test that
[11:21] <zzarr> how do I change keyboard (emoji is already marked)
[11:23] <davmor2> zzarr: press and hold the little globe to select  additional keyboard layouts
[11:23] <davmor2> zzarr: then you can just tap the globe to switch between text and emoji
[11:25] <zzarr> what globe?
[11:25] <zzarr> in language settings?
[11:26] <zzarr> on the keyboard dohh..... never mind
[11:26] <davmor2> zzarr: you got it then :)
[11:27] <zzarr> :)
[11:28] <zzarr> but those arrows are to select among emojis not moving the marker
[11:29] <davmor2> zzarr: there are some further along that are actual emojis
[11:29] <zzarr> ohh, thanks
[11:30] <davmor2> zzarr: also you can still use <- and -> in the default keyboard
[11:41] <zzarr> davmor2, I can't find them (I'm on a Meizu MX4)
[11:44] <davmor2> zzarr: oh well you will have to resort to <-> then
[11:46] <zzarr> davmor2, I'm confused... can't find them (I'm on OTA-11)
[11:46] <zzarr> (stable)
[11:48] <davmor2> zzarr: tap on the ?123, that displays the - symbol then tap on the 1/2 that take you to the second page where you will find < and >
[11:48] <davmor2> zzarr: you also get ^ for up but nothing for down I don't think
[11:50] <zzarr> davmor2, yes, but if I click "<" I get a "<" (no supprise), but I still don't know how to move the cursor in the text ;)
[11:51] <zzarr> I think I might have written marker when I meant cursor
[11:51] <zzarr> I did.... sorry
[11:51] <davmor2> zzarr: no what you said was how do I get an arrow
[11:51] <davmor2> zzarr: you just tap on where you want it on the screen
[11:52] <zzarr> davmor2, yes, but it's hard between two i or l
[11:52] <MCMic> That’s hard to use
[11:53] <zzarr> yes
[11:53] <MCMic> uTouch would need some good alternate keyboard like messageease or compass keyboard ^^
[11:53] <MCMic> But being able to move the cursor with gesture on the space bar would already be a big help
[11:54] <zzarr> it would be nice if I could slide over the text field with the finger and move the cursor
[11:54] <zzarr> or on the spacebar
[11:55] <davmor2> zzarr, MCMic: you can drag the cursor using the little blue dragger at the bottom
[11:55] <davmor2> that is one character at a time
[11:56] <zzarr> davmor2, ohh, thank you, that's nice
[12:34] <bregma> nhaines, if you want the OSK in XApps you either have to use the rc-proposed channel or else wait for OTA-12
[16:31] <ghosalmartin> has anyone attempted to port ubuntu-touch to aarch64?
[16:33] <davmor2> ghosalmartin: won't work currently lots of big parts are currently being made available to aarch64 once that is completed we will be testing that it boots
[16:33] <ghosalmartin> davmor2: so no one has tried to compile the patched bionic to aarch64?
[16:34] <popey> not sure, it's in progress though
[16:34] <davmor2> ghosalmartin: it is all currently being setup so an initial build can be attempted
[16:37] <ghosalmartin> davmor2: okays, any idea whose doing that?
[16:38] <davmor2> ghosalmartin: all of the canonical ennoblement team, the browser guys and more
[16:38] <ghosalmartin> davmor2: fair enough, i'll keep an eye out then, thanks :)
[16:39] <davmor2> enablement team even
[20:17] <Asad2005> can someone help install adb latest version. i am on ubuntu 16.04 and adb installed ver is 1.0.32
[20:17] <Asad2005> latest is 1.0.36
[20:20] <dobey>   Installed: 5.1.1r36+git20160322-0ubuntu3
[20:20] <dobey> is the version i have
[20:20] <Asad2005> but i am haviong probelm unlocking nexus 6p with that version
[20:21] <popey> you can probably grab a tarball and unpack it in a folder and run it directly
[20:21] <dobey> yeah, grab the upstream one from android then?
[20:22] <Asad2005> i have downloaded a zip file so can i run it from the folder i extract to?
[20:23] <dobey> probably
[20:25] <Asad2005> no it did not
[20:25] <Asad2005> do i need to kill server first?
[20:26] <dobey> probably
[20:26] <Asad2005> it did not help
[20:26] <dobey> well what is the error?
[20:30] <Asad2005> it will just list the usage of fastboot command
[20:30] <Asad2005> i am using "fastboot flashing unlock"
[20:38] <dobey> well, fastboot and adb are not the same thing
[20:40] <dobey> i guess you want "fastboot oem unlock" while the phone is at the bootlaoder screen
[21:17] <nhaines> bregma: I'm *on* rc-proposed.  ;)
[21:26] <grandrew> Hi all! I find "onboard" much  more suitable for libertine apps than maliit - the ubuntu-keyboard just can't send correct events and is not intended to
[21:30] <dobey> grandrew: you mean ubuntu-keyboard doesn't do meta/control/super/etc?
[21:36] <grandrew> I mean when I use the maliit gtk framework it messes up with firefox/chrome even in straight typing, I can't use c9 ide for example
[21:36] <grandrew> so the support is completely broken I believe
[21:37] <dobey> ok i don't undersatnd what you're complaining about exactly
[21:39] <grandrew> the touch keyboard puts weird characters when typing into X11 browsers on libertine/xmir
[21:40] <grandrew> I dug into sources a bit and I think it is a wrong approach to use the method proposed for libertine/maliit integration
[21:41] <grandrew> it would be much better to use onboard instead with the similar-looking layout
[21:41] <dobey> grandrew: might be best to file a bug or start discussion on the mailing list, then
[21:41] <dobey> i doubt onboard will be used
[21:42] <dobey> it would be better to fix the problems with ubuntu-keyboard
[21:45] <grandrew> ok I'll try the mailing list :)
[21:54] <sergiusens> ogra_ you've been playing with libertine containers, right? do you know if it is possible to setup a xenial one?
[22:14] <bregma> sergiusens, yes, libertine works on xenial...  it also works to set up a xenial container on vivid+overlay, but not recommended
[22:17] <bregma> so, we also dicovered today that Firefox checks the CPU and disables the use of IMEs (input method engines, like what is required for Chinese or password entry via OSK) when built for ARM CPUs, which is a very broken approach
[22:21] <sergiusens> bregma heh, I meant creating a xenial one on the m10 (which is vivid)
[22:21] <bregma> sergiusens, yes, you can do it, but like I said not recommended (because the kernel is still 13.10 or whatever)
[22:22] <bregma> give it a try, see what happens
[22:23] <bregma> "libertine-container-manager create --help" shows you the options, I think "--distro xenial" is what you want
[22:30] <nhaines> Or as I like to put it, "-d xenial"
[22:30] <nhaines> bregma: is the OSK for Libertine apps supposed to be automatic or something?
[22:31] <bregma> nhaines, yes, works for me in rc-proposed...  you may need to regenerate your Libertine containers though, I think they need some magic fairy dust added inside
[22:32] <nhaines> But I can't regenerate my puritine container!  :)
[22:33] <nhaines> Well, I guess I can make a new games one.  I hoped for Aisleriot and Mines and maybe Mahjongg and Sudoku, but only Aisleriot works.
[22:33] <nhaines> Although everyone on G+ seems to believe it should just start working.
[22:34] <nhaines> Oh!  Unless the shipped Puritine container changed.
[22:41] <bregma> nhaines, yes, it's changed, but not yet available in the store because it got caught on a security review
[22:42] <bregma> and unfortunately, it;s holiday time in North America and probably won;t appear until next Turesday
[22:42] <bregma> so irresponsible....
[22:45] <nhaines> bregma: is the Puritine container in the store?  I finally talked someone into sending me a click.
[22:45] <nhaines> Now I should harass mhall119 about this.  :P
[22:45] <bregma> nhaines, yes, it will be in the store for OTA-12 (actually earlier, for testing)
[22:46] <bregma> just a standard update through the updates mechanism
[22:46] <bregma> as it should be
[22:49]  * nhaines shakes fist at store review.
[22:49] <nhaines> bregma: okay, thanks!  In that case, I'll rebuild my games container.
[22:49] <nhaines> Actually, I guess this is as good a time as any to find out if containers can have the same label!
[22:49] <bregma> they can't
[22:50] <nhaines> Aww.
[22:50] <bregma> I apologise for making you rebuild your containers, but that's the price of living on the edge like this
[22:51]  * bregma realizes why they called it 'Ubuntu Edge'
[22:51] <nhaines> I'd be happier if the price was knowing I'd have to rebuild my containers rather than no one mention it or window decorations for three days and then I find out.  :)
[22:51] <nhaines> Actually, I suspect a lot of people are going to be really angry at the window decorations come OTA-12.
[22:53] <Acou_Bass> wait, whats happening to window decorations?
[22:53] <nhaines> Acou_Bass: they're all pink and blue in OTA-12.
[22:53] <Acou_Bass> 0,o
[22:53] <nhaines> No, libertine apps are now displaying matchbox window decorations in addition to the Unity decorations.
[22:54] <Acou_Bass> ahhh
[22:54]  * Acou_Bass woldve preferred pink and blue
[22:54] <nhaines> It's just temporary, although it's kind of a weird reversion.
[22:54] <Acou_Bass> yeah sounds it hehe
[22:54] <bregma> it's a workaround for fixing focus issues with the OSK
[22:54] <Acou_Bass> ahhhhh yeah, thats ben an issue for libertine for a while hasnt it
[22:55] <bregma> I beat the developers every day but it isn;t helping
[22:55] <Acou_Bass> guess you need to choose a bigger switch
[22:56] <bregma> I make them go out back and choose their own
[22:56] <Acou_Bass> :D
[22:58] <bregma> I confess I don't understand how having the decorations apprear fixes the focus issues, but it does, for now, until we get more window management built in to the Unity 8 + XMir stack
[22:58] <Acou_Bass> XD
[22:58] <Acou_Bass> yeah i dont get it either, but i suppose thats why im not pushing fixes to launchpad :D
[23:13] <nhaines> Hmm, actually, the store doesn't list Puritine, so now I'm not sure I'll get the update at all.
[23:17] <nhaines> Unless it's going in the store for OTA-12 (earlier, as mentioned), in which case maybe I will!
[23:18] <nhaines> This new container is getting both FocusWriter and Aisleriot.  Perfect for a mobile office!
[23:55] <nhaines> bregma: ooh, now it works!  :)
[23:55] <nhaines> Although Focuswriter has some odd thing... brown is blue and blue is sort of gray-brown.  But no window decorations!


[07:17] <ara> morning all :-)
[08:46]  * ara takes a break
[11:51] <mattycoze> anyone tested out scibuntu?
[11:58] <ara> mattycoze: not me
[11:58] <ara> mattycoze: have you found something?
[11:59] <mattycoze> ahh i dunno if i'm in the right room to be asking this - no bug reports or anything, just general advice about programs suitable for scientific application
[12:57]  * ara -> lunch
[15:51]  * ara -> doesn't believe she finished tracking the ids of Ubuntu Desktop testcases of the new wiki


[22:47] <tsimonq2> wxl: I am going to do some more QA tests now
[22:48] <wxl> hurry tsimonq2 and beat ianorlin's record!
[22:50] <tsimonq2> :D
[22:51] <tsimonq2> wxl: he is 2 away, gotta gain some distance :D
[22:58] <tsimonq2> wxl: I do 4 at a time, this will be easy
[23:07] <tsimonq2> wxl: ha ha, *5* away from him now!
[23:14] <tsimonq2> ianorlin: are you doing QA today, or not?
[23:25] <ianorlin> somewhat
[23:25] <ianorlin> I found a really unimportant bug in obconf though
[23:26] <tsimonq2> ianorlin: starting with amd64 tests but I might get them all tonight
[23:31] <ianorlin> bug 1522625  is the minor one I found
[23:33] <tsimonq2> oh
[23:33] <tsimonq2> ok


[00:00] <robert_ancell> yes, that looks like a valid correction
[00:00] <seb128> robert_ancell, I'm about to sponsor it I just wanted a second check, thanks
[00:00] <robert_ancell> go for it
[00:01] <bratsche> robert_ancell: Cool, thanks!
[00:02] <seb128> bratsche, uploaded to karmic, it's waiting for approval
[00:02] <bratsche> woot, thanks very much seb!
[00:02] <seb128> robert_ancell, the beta freeze is in action, we can still get fixes in but we need approval
[00:02] <seb128> bratsche, you're welcome
[00:02] <seb128> bratsche, thanks for fixing ;-)
[00:02] <robert_ancell> bratsche, so you've been using the API then :)
[00:03] <bratsche> robert_ancell: I've been trying to get all the user switching stuff working for the fusa applet and stuff, and once it was all setup I ran into this problem.
[00:05] <bratsche> I was trying to switch to a uid that seemed like a -really- high number and that didn't seem right. :)
[00:05] <bratsche> Oh wait, no.. this wasn't when switching it was just that adding a new user to the applet wasn't working.
[00:06] <bratsche> Hi andreasn!
[00:06] <andreasn> bratsche, hello!
[00:06] <chrisccoulson> wow, 2 evolution crashes in 20 minutes!
[00:06] <robert_ancell> cool.  I'm fixing up the old fusa applet so we can get the patch integrated upstream
[00:07] <robert_ancell> have you used the UserUpdated signal?  I think we need to add a bitfield to it so you know which part of the user has been updated
[00:07] <bratsche> No, I've got a callback setup for it but I'm not actually doing anything with it yet.
[00:18] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - do you know off the top of your head which plugins in totem use the python interpreter?
[00:18] <chrisccoulson> so far, the only plugin that makes it crash for me is our BBC plugin
[00:18] <seb128> no
[01:25] <hggdh> Laney: ping
[06:58] <pitti> Good morning
[06:58] <pitti> kwwii: hi; can look at wallpapers now
[07:09] <kenvandine> hey pitti
[07:09] <kenvandine> good morning
[07:16] <pitti> hey kenvandine
[07:16] <pitti> kenvandine: I saw some indicator-session bugs getting fixed upstream
[07:17] <pitti> do you need some sponsoring?
[07:17] <kenvandine> i think seb128 finished them
[07:17] <kenvandine> but i haven't seen mail for them
[07:22] <pitti> hm, nothing in the upload queue
[07:22] <pitti> oh, there it is, already accepted
[07:23] <pitti> indicator-messages 0.2.4-0ubuntu1
[07:23] <pitti> kenvandine: ^ that's it?
[07:23] <kenvandine> no
[07:23] <kenvandine> there is more
[07:23] <kenvandine> libdbusmenu
[07:24] <kenvandine> indicator-session
[07:24] <kenvandine> libdbusmenu 0.1.5
[07:24] <kenvandine> indicator-session 0.1.5
[07:25] <kenvandine> i got fix committed mails for them
[07:25] <kenvandine> but no upload mails
[07:25] <kenvandine> also uploads for pidgin, empathy and evolution-indicator
[07:25] <kenvandine> he said he uploaded
[07:26] <pitti> kenvandine: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue?queue_state=1
[07:26] <pitti> kenvandine: there's libdbusmenu, indicator-session, pidgin, and empathy
[07:26] <kenvandine> yeah
[07:26] <pitti> I'll review the queue and accept stuff accordingly
[07:26] <kenvandine> thx
[07:26] <kenvandine> evolution-indicator was one of the first, i think slangasek might have approved it
[07:35] <pitti> kenvandine: for new upstream releases, please inlude a list of changes in changelog
[07:36] <kenvandine> yeah.... seb yelled at them last week for that
[07:36] <pitti> kenvandine: e. g. for libdbusmenu it's not really clear how intrusive and how important it is
[07:36] <kenvandine> no NEWS file and very little info in the changelog
[07:36] <kenvandine> seb128 went over that with a fine tooth comb :)
[07:36] <kenvandine> he did find an api breakage, but on something that isn't imported
[07:36] <pitti> the diff looks bugfixish, but it's an API brekage
[07:36] <kenvandine> he doesn't miss anything!
[07:37] <pitti> -void dbusmenu_menuitem_buildxml (DbusmenuMenuitem * mi, GPtrArray * array);
[07:37] <pitti> +void dbusmenu_menuitem_buildxml (DbusmenuMenuitem * mi, GPtrArray * array, gint revision);
[07:37] <kenvandine> exactly what seb caught
[07:37] <pitti> libdbusmenu-glib/menuitem.h
[07:37] <kenvandine> nothing is using it yet so he uploaded anyway
[07:37] <kenvandine> but warned ted
[07:38] <pitti> hm
[07:38] <kenvandine> in general we need a better way of knowing what has changed
[07:38] <kenvandine> bzr log isn't as useful as it should be
[07:38] <kenvandine> seb won't settle for anything less than a NEWS file
[07:39] <pitti> kenvandine: empathy.preinst has a bug
[07:40] <pitti> kenvandine: the "le" should be "lt-nl" in the compare-versions
[07:40] <pitti> kenvandine: it's not serious, but can you please fix it in bzr?
[07:40] <kenvandine> sure... that was what seb told me to use?
[07:40] <pitti> we don't want to run that on new install
[07:40] <kenvandine> what is lt-nl?
[07:40] <pitti> thus the "-nl"
[07:40] <pitti> lt or le is just nitpicking
[07:41]  * kenvandine fixes
[07:41] <pitti> kenvandine: see dpkg --help
[07:41] <pitti> lt-nl le-nl ge-nl gt-nl (treat empty version as later than any version);
[07:41] <pitti> kenvandine: i. e. "-nl" -> don't run on fresh installs
[07:42] <pitti> kenvandine: pidgin's changelog says
[07:42] <pitti> +  * debian/pidgin.postinst:
[07:42] <pitti> +    - use preinst rather and do some tweaking
[07:42] <pitti> but there's no change to postinst
[07:42] <pitti> kenvandine: same "le" error, can  you please apply to bzr?
[07:42] <kenvandine> oh... he renamed it
[07:42] <kenvandine> there is no bzr branch for pidgin
[07:43] <pitti> (accepted)
[07:43] <pitti> hmkay; well, let's at least fix it for empathy
[07:43] <kenvandine> pkg --compare-versions "$2" lt-nl "2.28.0-0ubuntu1";
[07:43] <kenvandine> right?
[07:44] <pitti> *nod*
[07:44] <pitti> 'd'... :)
[07:45] <kenvandine> i fixed evolution-indicator too
[07:45] <kenvandine> :)
[07:46] <pitti> indicator-session seems to fix a ton of stuff, nice
[07:47] <pitti> kenvandine: how much have you tested this version?
[07:47] <kenvandine> not a ton
[07:47] <kenvandine> we found a bug in it already
[07:47] <kenvandine> it crashes once on guest session
[07:48] <pitti> kenvandine: I mean with MC5, and screen locking
[07:48] <kenvandine> MC5 a lot
[07:48] <kenvandine> works well
[07:48] <kenvandine> screen locking not at all
[07:51] <pitti> ok, queue is empty
[07:51] <pitti> kenvandine: thanks for all the updates
[07:51] <kenvandine> :)
[07:51] <kenvandine> thx
[07:51] <kenvandine> i need to get to bed soon
[07:51] <pitti> so, now off to finding ken's ubuntu-wallpapers
[07:51] <kenvandine> alarm will go off in just over 3 hours :/
[07:52] <pitti> ouch
[07:52] <pitti> kenvandine: what kept you up? :-)
[07:52] <kenvandine> gwibber
[07:52] <kenvandine> the daemon and client talk to each other over dbus... and sometimes hit a race condition and block
[07:52] <kenvandine> dbus is really pissing me off :)
[07:52] <pitti> uh
[08:03] <pitti> kwwii: uploading wallpapers
[08:13] <lool> pitti: Hey, since the switch to humanity on the desktop I'm getting an invalid icon for the message indicator in my panel; but you said you tried guest session and everything is working for you right?
[08:14] <pitti> lool: it's correct in both my normal and the guest session for me, hm
[08:14] <lool> I dont quite get why it's not working on that particular icon and on my desktop; the icon is fine on UNR
[08:14] <lool> Hmm perhaps I have some messages and it tries using another icon
[08:16] <pitti> I have a little grey speaking bubble
[08:16] <pitti> but I'm not yet running the fixed indicator-session which actually works with empathy
[08:16] <pitti> (that just got accepted from unapproved)
[08:16] <lool> uhoh
[08:17] <lool> pitti: I just noticed something interesting while trying to create another applet
[08:17] <pitti> lool: oh, you mean the message indicator, not the user indicator, sorry
[08:17] <pitti> lool: I have a grey envelope, looks correct; what do you have?
[08:17] <lool> pitti: You can seemingly add more notification applets in the panel but they aren't visible
[08:17] <lool> pitti: I have the "broken icon" icon
[08:17]  * kenvandine goes to get a little sleep... see you guys in a bit :)
[08:18] <lool> Hmm why dont I find the message indicator in the list of applets
[08:22] <didrocks> morning pitti, hey lool :)
[08:23] <lool> hey didrocks
[08:25]  * mac_v wishes someone could lend him the hicolor icon folder :)  ... /me lost all hicolor icons on a recent update when um crashed :(
[08:28] <mvo> Amaranth: I added feedback to the page now, please have a look and let me know if its appropriate
[08:30] <pitti> hey didrocks
[08:30] <seb128> hello pitti
[08:30] <pitti> bonjour seb128
[08:30] <didrocks> lut seb128
[08:30] <seb128> 'lu didrocks
[08:31] <mvo> hey seb128!
[08:31] <seb128> how is everybody?
[08:31] <seb128> mvo, alter! ;-)
[08:31] <mvo> *tired*
[08:31] <seb128> same here
[08:31] <seb128> I went to bed to 3am thanks dxteam and late updates
[08:31] <mvo> but tea ftw
[08:31] <mvo> weeh :/
[08:31] <mvo> poor seb128
[08:31] <seb128> that's ok
[08:31] <seb128> I slept a bit later
[08:31] <seb128> and weekend coming
[08:34]  * didrocks seems to be almost the only one to not have missed the UDS sponsoring announce. But as huats saw it too, I infer it was not so hidden :)
[08:35] <pitti> didrocks: you have time to come?
[08:35] <didrocks> pitti: yes, I've already planned some holidays in case I'm sponsored :)
[08:37] <pitti> nice!
[08:38]  * seb128 will be happy to see didrocks again
[08:39] <seb128> pitti, sorry for the gdm "lp :nnn" typo
[08:39] <seb128> pitti, thanks for closing the bug ;-)
[08:40] <pitti> seb128: np :)
[08:40] <pitti> asac: bug 430067  -- are there any blockers, such as reproducing, missing hardware, etc.? or is it just a matter of doing and finding time?
[08:41] <seb128> pitti, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/401822/comments/6
[08:41] <seb128> pitti, could it be due to one change for yours?
[08:41] <seb128> "of yours"
[08:42] <seb128> hey MacSlow
[08:42] <MacSlow> salut seb128
[08:42] <pitti> seb128: weird; what's your /etc/xdg/autostart/polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1.desktop?
[08:42] <pitti> mine says "Exec=/usr/lib/policykit-1-gnome/polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1" which is correct
[08:42] <seb128> mine too
[08:43] <seb128> but I'm not the one having the bug
[08:43]  * pitti subscribes and asks
[08:43] <seb128> thanks
[08:44] <seb128> pitti, bug #421318 ... I disagree with your change
[08:44] <pitti> seb128: done
[08:44] <seb128> pitti, I would have changed the milestone to 9.10 but let the blocker
[08:44] <seb128> pitti, totem crash on closing for everybody
[08:44] <pitti> seb128: ok, fine for me as well
[08:44] <seb128> pitti, you just dropped it off the karmic radar
[08:44] <pitti> but it shouldn't block the beta
[08:44] <seb128> right, but you just dropped it from karmic proper
[08:45] <pitti> ok, changed
[08:45] <seb128> ie if we don't review medium bugs after beta we will overlook it
[08:45] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[08:51]  * didrocks will be happy to see you all again :-)
[08:54] <asac> pitti: the PUK thing is blocked on upstream atm
[08:54] <asac> pitti: is that marked for beta? unlikely it gets fixed before beta
[08:54] <pitti> asac: no, but it's a karmic bug
[08:54] <asac> yes thats correct
[08:55] <asac> nothing blocking ... just that upstream wants no quick fix
[08:55] <pitti> asac: so upstream is working on it? (there's no upstream task)
[08:55] <asac> in worst case i can fix it
[08:55] <asac> pitti: upstream doesnt use the bug tracker
[08:55] <asac> well dan uses it
[08:55] <pitti> asac: ok, so it's being handled, and well understood
[08:55] <asac> but if you want something fixed, better not use it :)
[08:55] <asac> yep
[08:56] <pitti> asac: lol
[08:56] <pitti> thanks
[08:59] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[08:59] <chrisccoulson> hey seb128
[08:59] <chrisccoulson> how are you today?
[08:59] <seb128> a bit tired
[08:59] <seb128> but good otherwise
[08:59] <seb128> you?
[09:00] <chrisccoulson> yeah, same as well. looking forward to finishing early today:)
[09:01] <seb128> breakfast at work and early weekend, not too bad for a friday I guess ;-)
[09:02] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i always look forward to friday ;)
[09:03] <pitti> aah, glib finally built \o/
[09:04] <chrisccoulson> yay!
[09:04] <pitti> (it was a stupid error in pkg-create-dbgsym)
[09:05] <seb128> pitti, it was not looking to the arch list?
[09:05] <pitti> seb128: it was
[09:05] <pitti> but it used grep -w
[09:05] <pitti> which causes "Architecture: kfreebsd-amd64" to match on amd64
[09:05] <pitti> same for i386
[09:06] <pitti> I testcase'd and fixed it last night
[09:09] <chrisccoulson> breakfast time :)
[09:09] <mvo> seb128: is there a known issue with the icon theme? I got bug #436310
[09:09] <seb128> dpm, hi
[09:10] <seb128> dpm, can you tell me what version of the gnome-control-center po have been imported
[09:10] <dpm> hey seb128, just a second, I'll check
[09:10] <seb128> dpm, thanks
[09:10] <seb128> mvo, not that I know about at least, the categories in the menu still have icons
[09:10] <seb128> mvo, do you get the issue?
[09:11] <mvo> no
[09:11] <mvo> and sianis can not reproduce it too
[09:11] <mvo> but I will try another machine that is less in the flux than my desktop
[09:11] <mvo> asac_: hey
[09:11] <asac_> good morning mvo
[09:11] <mvo> how is life on this glorious morning for you?
[09:12] <seb128> dpm, could you also look at the template version?
[09:12] <mac_v> mvo: i'v not been able to figure out the icon label for software store search... what is the right name?
[09:12] <asac_> pitti: i am officially on vac today ... but two uploads for beta i had to do: gnome-bluetooth (bug 429523)
[09:12] <pitti> asac_: great, thanks
[09:13] <mvo> mac_v: what label exactly? I'm not sure what you mean
[09:13] <asac_> and network-manager-applet fixing assertions and making applet to match UI what is now on the newmenu branch upstream (remove the funny hearts, etc.)
[09:13] <asac_> pitti: i will be here for a while in case you need explanation or something.
[09:13] <seb128> asac_, enjoy your vac day ;-)
[09:13] <pitti> asac_: g-b accepted
[09:13] <seb128> I should take some fridays off too
[09:13] <pitti> asac_: I don't see n-m-a in the queue
[09:13] <asac_> pitti: if you want to test the applet builds you can grab them from todays daily: https://edge.launchpad.net/~network-manager/+archive/trunk
[09:13] <mac_v> mvo: the icon used for the search field , the magnifying glass with a paper behind it , the icon is displayed in human but not Humanity
[09:14] <asac_> yes ... just pushed a minutes ago
[09:14] <asac_> i will ping you in 5 minutes after making some coffee
[09:14] <pitti> asac_: ok, will have an eye on this; you tested it, I assume?
[09:14] <asac_> network-manager-applet_0.8~a~git.20090923t220421.1ac8ffd-0ubuntu4_source.changes
[09:14] <mvo> mac_v: aha, give me a sec
[09:14] <asac_> pitti: i tested the corner cases for the fixed assertion crashers and the UI update in general.
[09:14] <pitti> asac_: your word is good enough for me :)
[09:14] <mac_v> mvo: even the broom [for search "clear"], doesnt display with humanity :(
[09:15] <asac_> unfortunately applet bug reporters are too laggy as usual ;)
[09:15] <mvo> mac_v: its using gtk.STOCK_FIND
[09:15] <asac_> i asked them on two bugs (one has 6 dupes or so) ... noone tested
[09:15] <mvo> mac_v: with gtk.ICON_SIZE_MENU
[09:15] <asac_> err ... noone answered ;)
[09:17] <mac_v> mvo: hrm , back , the STOCK_FIND is for the search  , and for the clear ...?
[09:19] <mvo> mac_v: STOCK_CLEAR with IOCN_SIZE_MENU
[09:19] <mac_v> ok, thanks
[09:19] <mvo> is the size missing maybe?
[09:19] <mac_v> maybe , i'm checking it
[09:19]  * mac_v just recoving from another X crash
[09:29] <didrocks> asac: so bug #436215 is updated with the debdiff (no update of epiphany-webkit). I didn't subscribed ~ubuntu-release yet. My ppa is currently building it: https://edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/+archive/proposed
[09:29] <asac> didrocks: looks good.
[09:29] <seb128> didrocks, you don't need to
[09:29] <seb128> didrocks, just get it uploaded
[09:30] <asac> didrocks: want me to upload?
[09:30] <seb128> didrocks, it's GNOME it has a standing expection
[09:30] <seb128> exception
[09:30] <seb128> asac, please do
[09:30] <asac> ok doing now
[09:30] <didrocks> asac: so yes, you can upload, please :)
[09:30] <asac> didrocks: there is a ~ubuntu-desktop branch ... would be precious if you could replay there
[09:30] <didrocks> seb128: didn't know the stading exception was working even in hard freeze
[09:30] <didrocks> asac: no pb, doing it right now
[09:30] <seb128> didrocks, hard freeze doesn't prevent uploads
[09:31] <seb128> didrocks, things are reviewed in the queue or let for after beta
[09:31] <Laney> hi hggdh
[09:31] <didrocks> seb128: yes, only the binary are pushed manually
[09:31] <pitti> didrocks: standing exception for beta freeze> it's not :-)
[09:31] <pitti> but you can still upload, and we'll review it from teh queue
[09:31] <didrocks> ok, thanks for the process clarification :)
[09:31] <tgpraveen> mac_v: I was thinking maybe we could have different icons for usb harddisk and usb pendrive
[09:32] <tgpraveen> maybe a icon in hsape of pendrive for the usb pendrive
[09:32] <dpm> seb128: here are the dates for the latest PO and POT imports in gnome-control-center -> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/d4a21d6c9 (please have a look at the warning note at the end)
[09:32] <asac> didrocks: uploaded
[09:33] <seb128> dpm, thanks for looking
[09:33] <dpm> np, you're welcome
[09:33] <seb128> dpm, did I read the warning correctly that old po versions overwrote new ones
[09:33] <didrocks> asac: thanks :-) (I don't find an epiphany-* branch in ~ubuntu-desktop)
[09:33] <seb128> dpm, because they are strings not translated in rosetta which are translated in the upstream tarball
[09:33] <asac> didrocks: hmm. maybe it was webkit that was there then
[09:33] <mac_v> tgpraveen: pls file a bug ;) with a screenshot ... we'll see the problem [i think it can be done]
[09:33] <didrocks> asac: I can create it, or do it for next upload if you wish
[09:34] <asac> didrocks: nevermind. i just got confused by something else. there is no branch afaics
[09:34] <tgpraveen> mac_v: it can be easily done as in the humanity theme also there are explicity mentioned icons for both of them so just have to change the pendrive icon
[09:34] <tgpraveen> will file a bug now
[09:34] <MacSlow> tseliot, hey there
[09:35]  * didrocks normally always check for a bzr branch with debcheckout, that's why I was surprised :)
[09:35] <tseliot> MacSlow: hi
[09:35] <tgpraveen> mac_v: which package should I assign it? ubuntu?humanity?
[09:35] <mac_v> tgpraveen: humanity main
[09:35] <asac> didrocks: seems epiphany-webkit is officially still in universe ... so seems this will just get in ;)
[09:36] <asac> not even sure we should promote it to main for now ... but leave that to whoever decided to put epiphany-gecko there
[09:36] <didrocks> asac: really? I was just thinking it was in main...
[09:36] <didrocks> ok
[09:37] <tgpraveen> mac_v: btw is it confirmed that we will use humanity in karmic as the default icon theme?
[09:37] <mac_v> tgpraveen: as far as i know ;) ...
[09:37] <didrocks> well, I'll wait after beta to push 2.28.0 version, in every case, as it'll update 3 packages (webkit, epiphany-webkit and epiphany-extension).
[09:38] <asac> didrocks: yes. we also need webkit ... and that is in main
[09:38] <dpm> seb128: yes, that seems to be the case, old translations form the database overwrote the Karmic ones in some packages, but the LP translations team is fixing them now
[09:38] <asac> didrocks: i would suggest we wait and see if we still have something for ephy-webkit to fix for beta or a regression from this upload
[09:38] <seb128> dpm, ok thanks
[09:38] <dpm> jtv knows the details
[09:38] <asac> didrocks: if thats not the case we can upload all stuff so it gets in when beta opens up
[09:38] <seb128> dpm, I will wait a bit before investigating or pinging other people
[09:39] <didrocks> asac: yes, let's wait for a week, the diff seems not to be so big
[09:39] <dpm> seb128: if you need more info, let me know and I can ask him, but for now I'd say wait until the rollout at 1400UTC before investigating further on translations problems
[09:39] <didrocks> at least, we have now a epiphany-browser package :)
[09:41] <asac> yep
[09:41] <asac> very good ;)
[09:41] <seb128> dpm, ok thanks
[09:41] <dpm> np
[09:47] <mac_v> !logs
[09:56] <tgpraveen> mac_v: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/humanity-icon-theme/+bug/436462
[10:00] <Amaranth> did edge just die for anyone else?
[10:00] <pitti> WFM
[10:00]  * pitti retries build of indicator-session yet again
[10:01] <Amaranth> mvo: Thanks, that's perfect :)
[10:05] <Amaranth> hmm, yesterday all my ISP wanted me to do was bug triage (could only get to launchpad) but today it seems they want to keep me away :)
[10:14] <asac> one question before i bail out ... whats the status on compiz on intel atm
[10:17] <mvo> asac: Amaranth did a lot of triage the last days, he may know
[10:17] <Amaranth> asac: Works great now, suspend too
[10:17] <Amaranth> asac: except for 845
[10:37] <davmor2> asac: N-M is still just spiralling on live desktop.  I will try it on another machine in a moment for confirmation and then I'll bug it
[10:44] <asac> Amaranth: ok. thanks i will enable it again and hope it doesnt freeze every other second ;)
[10:44] <asac> i have 9something
[10:45] <asac> searching for available drivers ....
[10:45] <asac> ok good... hitting alt-tab a few times works ;)
[10:46] <asac> hmm
[10:46] <asac> the appearence dialog still has the "None" radio selected
[10:46] <asac> but compiz is definitly on
[10:46] <asac> let me close it and reopen
[10:46] <asac> yes. now its correct
[10:46] <asac> mvo: ^^
[10:47] <asac> so after enabling "Normal" desktop effects, the "none" radio is still selected until you reopen the dialog
[10:47] <mvo> asac: hrm, bad. could you file a quick bug and mark it for beta?
[10:48] <mvo> asac: but do not assign to me please, I am officially not working on compiz ;)
[10:49] <lool> mvo: hey
[10:49] <lool> mvo: how goes?
[10:49] <lool> mvo: Could you please merge lp:~lool/software-store/misc-fixes ?
[10:49] <lool> fixes .desktop file and vcs-bzr
[10:51] <mvo> lool: cool, sure!
[10:52] <mvo> lool: merged, many thanks
[10:53] <lool> np; it's not related but the software-store icon wasn't showing up
[10:53] <lool> in UNR
[10:58] <lool> I might be asking something really stupid but is it normal to get the gdm screen sound when using autologin?
[11:13] <seb128> lool, I think it's due to the recent change to not autolog users again after logout
[11:13] <seb128> and no that's not wanted
[11:13] <seb128> you are welcome to send a patch too ;-)
[11:14] <lool> Funny the number of people who are happy to get patches
[11:14] <lool> seb128: Is that reported already?
[11:14] <lool> otherwise I'll start there
[11:14] <seb128> lool, bug #435801
[11:15] <lool> thanks
[11:15] <seb128> lool, yw
[11:40] <Amaranth> figured out why you've been able to set workspaces again
[11:41] <Amaranth> we've probably had this bug for a couple releases :/
[11:50] <seiflotfy> whoa
[11:52] <mpt> kwwii, do you think bug 435718 is a bug in the GTK theme(s), or it deeper than that?
[11:52] <mpt> kwwii, the issue is that a GTK treeview and a webkit-gtk container have different borders -- different colors and different corner radiuses
[11:53] <kwwii> mpt: that can probably be fixed in the gtkrc by adding a special case, if it is a normal gtk class
[11:54] <kwwii> I am working on another bug in the human theme currently, I will have a look
[11:54] <mpt> kwwii, a special case for webkit-gtk frames in general, or just for those that appear inside the Ubuntu Software Store?
[11:54] <kwwii> mpt: for webkit-gtk in general
[11:54] <mpt> kwwii, ok cool, I'll assign it to you :-)
[11:54] <kwwii> I cannot promise that it is not a bug in the softwarestore, but I don't think it is at first sight
[11:55] <kwwii> sounds good
[11:55] <mpt> thanks
[13:05] <chrisccoulson> bug 436524 is wierd. has anyone ever seen a crash like that?
[13:07] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: needs valgrind
[13:09] <chrisccoulson> Amaranth - yeah, i think so
[13:09] <Amaranth> nautilus crashes like that are painful though
[13:10] <Amaranth> gnome-session keeps restarting it, apport keeps popping up, X runs out of available connections, whole session grinds to a halt
[13:18] <mac_v> aw , just missed mvo!
[13:19] <mac_v> mvo: hi... why is the icon size specified for software store search's clear and find ?
[13:19] <mac_v> this would cause problems in not only humanity with any theme which does not have the icon at the specific size
[13:19] <mvo> mac_v: I can remove that if it helps
[13:20] <mac_v> mvo: pls remove it... thanks :) ....its not a problem adding a new icon for Humanity , but this problem will arise with any theme which does not have the icon :)
[13:22] <diverse_izzue> theora 1.1 was just released yesterday. is that something people would consider a FF exception? could improve video calling quality quite a bit i guess...
[13:43] <Amaranth> mac_v: Eh? GTK+ will just grab a different size and scale it
[13:44] <mac_v> Amaranth: it is supposed to  , but it not happening , the scalable icons are not scaling for some reason
[13:44] <Amaranth> mac_v: That'd be a broken index.theme
[13:44]  * mac_v checks again
[13:49] <mvo> mac_v: hm, so stupid question, but how do I tell gtk that its ok to give me a different size? I mean, icon_size_menu is what I want
[13:52] <Amaranth> diverse_izzue: Does it actually make a difference?
[13:52] <Amaranth> diverse_izzue: Would be good to test it and see if there is an improvement
[13:57] <diverse_izzue> Amaranth, the thusnelda branch has a considerably better quality at the same bitrate. see for example http://web.mit.edu/xiphmont/Public/theora/demo7.html where the developer shows quality comparison
[13:57] <diverse_izzue> it's bitstream compatible with the 1.0 release
[13:57] <Amaranth> diverse_izzue: I've seen all that
[13:57] <diverse_izzue> all right
[13:57] <Amaranth> diverse_izzue: But you have to prove it actually helps empathy :)
[13:57] <diverse_izzue> Amaranth, empathy was just an example :-)
[13:58] <diverse_izzue> people using any kind of video editing would also be happy about it
[13:58] <seb128> re
[13:58] <seb128> grrr, box frozen again while opening a guest session
[14:00] <Amaranth> diverse_izzue: I guess someone would need to update the package and file an exception request bug
[14:00] <Amaranth> diverse_izzue: Is it API/ABI compatible with 1.0?
[14:01] <diverse_izzue> Amaranth, not 100% sure, but i believe it's a drop-in replacement. i've been using prereleases on my machine for a while now and haven't encountered an application that didn't work anymore
[14:11] <mac_v> mvo: .... i'm really not sure how , but the problem now is that when the icon theme has the icon in the scalable folder the theme does not fall back to the inherits , so now that the icon size is fixed it just is blank and not resizing...
[14:16] <seb128> ok come on
[14:16] <seb128> asac, greasemonkey in firefox broke again after updating xulrunner
[14:18] <kwwii> how is it that we don't have space for wallpapers and artwork from the design team but we do have space for pictures of space?
[14:18] <kwwii> and how decided to include this artwork?
[14:19] <Amaranth> pictures from space are awesomely autochanging though!
[14:20] <seb128> we don't have space wallpapers
[14:20] <Amaranth> Yes we do
[14:20] <Amaranth> I think they're actually from a screensaver though?
[14:20] <seb128> no we don't
[14:21] <seb128> yes, those are screensaver images
[14:21] <seb128> they are not listed in the appareance capplet
[14:21] <Amaranth> They are
[14:21] <Amaranth> They just showed up
[14:21] <seb128> not there
[14:21] <seb128> and I dist-upgraded one hour ago
[14:21] <seb128> weird
[14:21] <Amaranth> And they have a neat little html file that makes nautilus change them every 15 minutes or whatever
[14:22] <seb128> what package did you install to get those?
[14:22] <seb128> I've some in a screensaver
[14:22] <Amaranth> I don't think I've installed anything special
[14:22] <seb128> but not in the background capplet
[14:22] <seb128> well you have something which is not installed there
[14:22] <Amaranth> Everyone on the forums seems to think they are part of the final artwork drop :P
[14:22] <seb128> lol
[14:22] <mvo> I just had a x screensaver active with a funny huge X - reminds me back of the 90s
[14:22] <seb128> oh, it's one entry only
[14:23] <seb128> with a play button
[14:23] <Amaranth> yeah
[14:23] <seb128> mvo, good old time ;-)
[14:23] <Amaranth> These do take up 4MB though
[14:24] <tgpraveen1> I think even softpedia had an article where they said that the new space wallpapers were there
[14:24] <seb128> Amaranth, no they don't
[14:24] <mac_v> mvo: i think kwwii will know about it ;)
[14:24] <seb128> Amaranth, hum, or maybe they do ;-)
[14:25] <tgpraveen1> also is palimpest disk utility included by default in karmic?
[14:25] <Amaranth> They're really awesome though
[14:25] <seb128> they are part of gnome-screensaver, not sure if they are meant to be displayed there
[14:25] <pitti> tgpraveen1: palimpsest> yes
[14:26] <pitti> Riddell: could you please do a quick kubuntu update on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus ?
[14:26] <pitti> Riddell: in particular, do you plan a polkit-1 migration for final still?
[14:27] <pitti> I wasn't sure whether that's still on the plan (new packagekit, etc.)
[14:27] <tgpraveen1> pitti: wow awesome don't remember it being mentioned before. this will really help a lot of users do a lot of tasks which had to be done by cli earlier
[14:27] <seb128> it's gnome-disk-utility
[14:27] <pitti> tgpraveen1: right, like "sudo luks-format" :)
[14:29] <seb128> pitti, I reopen the gpm task on bug #428115
[14:30] <seb128> pitti, seems the "go to sleep after n minutes inactive" is still buggy
[14:30] <pitti> ah, ok; it works fine with lid close
[14:31] <seb128> right
[14:32] <mvo> mac_v: I tried various options now (foce_svg, generic_fallback, use_buildin) and I just get no icon
[14:32] <mac_v> kwwii: any ideas^ ?
[14:32] <mac_v> the software store does not display the icon for search and clear
[14:33] <mac_v> because the those icons are present only in the scalable folder. atm we are making 16px icons but this would cause a problem for other themes too
[14:39] <pitti> seb128: do you happen to know how gdm could use a gtk theme which isn't shown to normal users? I guess it can't go to /usr/share/themes/ for that?
[14:39] <seb128> pitti, I don't think it could no
[14:39] <huats> hello everyone
[14:39] <huats> hey pitti and seb128
[14:39] <seb128> pitti, it's a normal gnome-session
[14:39] <seb128> lut huats
[14:40] <pitti> seb128: could we install it into /var/lib/gdm/.themes/ ?
[14:40] <seb128> pitti, we could
[14:40] <pitti> seb128: like an user-installed one?
[14:41] <pitti> or .local/share/themes/ or whatever
[14:43] <tgpraveen1> bigon: so has it been decided whether karmic will have msn a/v chat or not?
[14:45] <cassidy> tgpraveen1, afaik, it won't
[14:45] <cassidy> but package is available in the TP PPA for users who feel adventurous :)
[14:48] <tgpraveen1> cassidy: :-( that's sad. it being there would certainly have helped people like the change to empathy much more. and silence its  critics a little
[14:49] <cassidy> tgpraveen1, tbh, I'm not convinced the MSN support is mature enough
[14:49] <cassidy> it's really new and hasn't been tested a lot yet
[14:49] <cassidy> having it in the PPA will allow more experienced users to test it and report issues
[15:02] <kwwii> seb128: we need to change the link that the "Get more wallpapers" button in the Appearance Preferences window uses
[15:02] <seb128> why?
[15:02] <seb128> there was a bug and a discussion about that recently and it has been decided against
[15:02] <seb128> and to use what?
[15:02] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[15:03] <rickspencer3> hi seb128
[15:07] <seb128> cassidy, bug #432511 seems to be a frequent crasher, do you know if that's known upstream already?
[15:07] <tseliot> rickspencer3, pitti: if the fix in my PPA for intel solves bug #428662 maybe we can put it in the beta (I'll test it here as soon as I get a Kubuntu iso)
[15:07] <pitti> tseliot: you rock, thanks!
[15:08] <tseliot> pitti: thanks for bringing it to my attention
[15:08] <cassidy> seb128, don't know; didn't have time to look at Empathy bugs this week
[15:08] <seb128> ok
[15:08] <cassidy> seb128, hopefully I should have more time next week
[15:09] <pitti> tseliot: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/32433050/xserver-xorg-video-intel_2%3A2.8.1-1ubuntu1_2%3A2.8.1-1ubuntu2%7Extesting1.diff.gz looks like a pinpointed patch, so if it's confirmed to fix the bug, I'm all for pushing this into beta
[15:09] <davmor2> tseliot: what intel or all intel
[15:10] <tseliot> pitti: great
[15:10] <pitti> tedg: thanks for fixing the users in the session applet! empathy status also works great now
[15:10] <tseliot> davmor2: it could affect all intel cards with Kubuntu
[15:11] <seb128> only kubuntu?
[15:11] <Amaranth> mvo: compiz bzr contains a fix for compiz allowing you to use workspaces again and readds the intel 845 blacklist so we don't get swamped with bugs from those still broken chips
[15:11] <pitti> tedg: however, I see myself in the users list, which should be suppressed; also, I see my test user ("Joe") there, which isn't logged in; when I click on it, joe isn't selected in the following gdm login manager, I have to select it again
[15:11] <tedg> pitti: No problem.  Now to fix all the bugs that I'm sure will be filed :)
[15:11] <davmor2> tseliot: I need to do an alternate side by side to see if that is work on my intel box but I can check it for you after that
[15:11] <pitti> tedg: neither is a bit problem for beta, but perhaps could be polished for final?
[15:11] <pitti> tedg: known already, or shall I file bugs?
[15:11] <tedg> pitti: You should be in the user list, but insensitive.  It's already filed.
[15:12] <pitti> tedg: I should? My name is already at the top of the menu
[15:12] <seb128> hey tedg
[15:12] <chrisccoulson> hey pitti - thanks for approving my MIR
[15:12] <tedg> pitti: The gdm login thing, that might be trickier... there doesn't seem to be an API for it in the new GDM :(
[15:12] <pitti> tedg: right, I guess so
[15:12] <chrisccoulson> do you mind if i do the gnome-python-extras change now?
[15:12] <tedg> pitti: We've stubbed it appropriately, we're still looking.
[15:12] <mvo> Amaranth: thanks, is there more pending or should I sposnor?
[15:12] <pitti> tedg: perhaps we could only show users which already have a running session?
[15:13] <tedg> pitti: The user list should be in a submenu.
[15:13] <Amaranth> mvo: shouldn't be anything else before beta
[15:13] <tseliot> seb128: no, it's a bug in the driver which seems to be triggered by kdm (where TerminateServer=true is commented out)
[15:13] <pitti> tedg: oh, I thought it was to be displayed inline for < 7 or so?
[15:13] <tedg> pitti: We've discussed that.  It kinda sucks a little though for the standard case of a family.
[15:13] <pitti> rightg
[15:13] <mvo> Amaranth: ok, thanks
[15:13] <Amaranth> mvo: Oh, there is another change in there to use glXWaitX() that upstream xorg/mesa guys say we need
[15:13] <Amaranth> mvo: Want to get it in before beta to see if it causes any issues
[15:14] <tseliot> davmor2: ok, thanks
[15:14] <mvo> Amaranth: ok
[15:14] <Amaranth> Although several people have assured me it won't
[15:14] <mvo> Amaranth: I saw that discussion, its something that needs to be added to upstream git too, right? so we probably need a new snapshot?
[15:14] <Amaranth> compiz git would have it too but onestone is waiting for the plumbers conf and such to see what else they come up with
[15:15] <mvo> is he going there?
[15:15] <Amaranth> because technically glXWaitX() isn't what we want but it's the closest we have
[15:15] <Amaranth> I dunno
[15:15] <Amaranth> They are supposed to discuss fixes for composite problems though
[15:15] <onestone> I'm not going there
[15:15] <Amaranth> there and the XDC
[15:18] <onestone> But as long there is the buggy compiz core, they have a reason to think about a final solution
[15:19] <Amaranth> hehe
[15:22] <pitti> Riddell: wow, KNE runs in kvm, nice
[15:22] <pitti> UNR requires compositing
[15:23]  * Riddelll licks finger and puts a score 1 mark into the air
[15:23] <Amaranth> pitti: kvm supports OpenGL and compositing but you have to install extra things
[15:23] <pitti> oh? that's news to me
[15:24] <Amaranth> VMGL or something
[15:24] <Amaranth> But you have to use VNC to access the guest, the standard SDL interface doesn't support it
[15:25] <pitti> heh, konqueror looks funny in kvm; I  guess that does use some graphics trick
[15:26] <davmor2> pitti: no that's the way it looks all the time ;)
[15:26] <pitti> with black-white stripes?
[15:26] <davmor2> pitti: It's the zebra themeing
[15:27] <pitti> Riddelll: I confirmed that mounting internal drives still works fine
[15:27] <Riddelll> pitti: does it pop up a kdesudo dialogue?
[15:28] <pitti> Riddelll: no, but kdesudo doesn't appear for passwordless users as it seems
[15:29] <seb128> pitti, is pidgin-libnotify in universe wanted?
[15:30] <pitti> uh, I don't know, but I guess it should be in main? tedg?
[15:31] <seb128> pitti, I'm just discussing it with ted the dx chan
[15:31] <seb128> and I was surprised to see it in universe
[15:31] <tedg> pitti: I'm not sure.  I mean, when we were talking about putting Pidgin out of main... that made sense.  But now that Pidgin is still in main, I think the plugin should be as well.
[15:32] <pitti> Riddelll: ubuntu-bug works fine on KNE for me; I get an "ICE default IO handler error" thing on stderr, but it collects info, uploads to LP, opens brwoser
[15:32] <seb128> ok, I will add a recommends on pidgin
[15:32] <pitti> tedg: I agree; it should be recommended or so
[15:32] <seb128> rather pidgin Recommends notify
[15:32] <pitti> seb128: :)
[15:32] <pitti> I guess previously we just pulled it in through ubuntu-desktop
[15:32] <pitti> seb128: re-promoted
[15:32] <seb128> thanks
[15:33] <seb128> I guess we will need a rebuild for rosetta
[15:33] <Riddelll> pitti: great, that should be fine then
[15:34] <pitti> now, jockey
[15:38] <Riddelll> pitti: 15:37 < yuriy> Riddelll: but does the process still hang afterwards?
[15:38] <pitti> hm, it just goes back to the terminal
[15:38] <pitti> as it should
[15:39] <hggdh> seb128: can I prepare evo for libpst, or are you going to publish another update soon?
[15:40] <seb128> hggdh, you can work on the change if you want otherwise I will do it after beta
[15:40] <seb128> it should be adding a build-depends, changing a .install and updating the description
[15:40] <Laney> hggdh: did you want something?
[15:40] <hggdh> seb128: yes. I will prepare it, publish on my PPA a version, and ask for tests
[15:40] <Laney> libpst is going to main? cool beans
[15:41] <seb128> hggdh, thanks!
[15:41] <seb128> Laney, yes, the mir is approval for some time
[15:41] <hggdh> Laney: I am sorry I got stuck on the teleconference.
[15:41] <hggdh> seb128: I will also add a comment on the MIR that Evo now depends on it
[15:41] <Laney> no problem i uploaded it anyway
[15:41] <seb128> hggdh, thanks
[15:42] <hggdh> Laney: the only tghing left is to find out what goes with the python option. There seems to be a mismatch on libboost-python
[15:42] <hggdh> I will check on it, also
[15:42] <Laney> what happens?
[15:43] <hggdh> it seems to build-depend on libboost-python-dev, but fails to ln on the run-time library
[15:43] <hggdh> s/ln/link/
[15:44] <hggdh> this is why I disabled the python option -- there is no immediate use for it, anyway
[15:47] <hggdh> hum. Is there any problems with pull-lp-source?
[15:48] <Laney> yeah
[15:48] <Laney> use the bzr versions
[15:48] <Laney> -s
[15:48] <hggdh> thanks
[15:49] <Laney> i'm going to upload that later too
[15:49] <hggdh> Laney: sorry, which bzr option?
[15:49] <hggdh> not bzr clone, I guess
[15:50]  * hggdh is not an expert on bzr
[15:50] <Laney> bzr branch lp:ubuntu-dev-tools
[15:51] <hggdh> oh, OK. <shame/>
[16:04] <hggdh> huh. Shouldn't the package evolution-plugins depend on Evolution (same version), like evolution-plugins-experimental?
[16:05] <seb128> hggdh, it does?
[16:06] <hggdh> seb128: I would expect so, as much as plugins-experimental does
[16:06] <seb128> well it does right now
[16:07] <kwwii> seb128: we want it to point to the buttload of pics we received in the contest since we couldn't fit them all on the CD
[16:07] <kwwii> and that, being a design issue should be left to the design team, I think
[16:07] <seb128> rickspencer3, pitti: ^ opinion
[16:08] <seb128> they suggest dropping the url the GNOME community website for background, themes, etc
[16:08] <seb128> and setting an ubuntu one instead
[16:08] <rickspencer3> seb128, would such a change introduce risk, and how much work would it be?
[16:08] <seb128> no risk, trivial
[16:08] <seb128> I'm just concerned about the community impact
[16:09] <rickspencer3> can the website point to GNOME in turn?
[16:09] <seb128> dunno about the website
[16:09] <seb128> but I would recommend it does
[16:09] <seb128> or we might have unhappy GNOME users who want GNOME themes and not only a set of ubuntu wallpapers
[16:10]  * mclasen floats the radical idea of just putting the buttloads of pics on the gnome site...
[16:10] <pitti> seb128: hi (sorry, lagging; release meeting)
[16:11] <pitti> hm, would be a shame to hide the ones on gnome.org
[16:11] <pitti> mclasen: does that have a low barrier for contributions?
[16:12] <mclasen> pitti: I don't know, I'm not much of artist, so I never tried to put anything up there...
[16:13] <pitti> seb128: oh, themes and wallpapers have the same link? that sounds a bit weird
[16:13] <seb128> pitti, no, there is one url on each tab
[16:13] <chrisccoulson> yeah, they should be different
[16:14] <chrisccoulson> they are here anyway
[16:14] <seb128> the background one leads to http://art.gnome.org/backgrounds
[16:17] <chrisccoulson> they're configurable in gconf too. should please those who want it pointing to gnome-look ;)
[16:18] <rickspencer3> kwwii, well ... around here no issue is left to any one entity, but ...
[16:18] <rickspencer3> I agree that it's Ubuntu, and the Ubuntu community contributed artwork should be accessible
[16:19] <rickspencer3> kwwii, is there a page set up for the ubuntu art work yet?
[16:22] <kwwii> rickspencer3: so far, all we have is our flickr page
[16:22] <kwwii> I am trying to get the other peeps from the desing team here, one second
[16:22] <rickspencer3> ok
[16:22] <rickspencer3> I think that we should change the link to point to a page that the design team controls, and that page in turn should refer to the gnome page
[16:23] <rickspencer3> however, we need the actually page from the design team before we can make that change
[16:23] <kwwii> rickspencer3: yes agreed...maybe we could put the pics on a wiki page and point it to that
[16:24] <rickspencer3> kwwii, but couldn't random people edit the wiki page?
[16:24] <rickspencer3> and thus defeat the purpose?
[16:24] <kwwii> true
[16:24] <rickspencer3> could there be a people.ubuntu.com/ayatana page or something?
[16:25] <rickspencer3> I like the idea of the page being integrated into the ubuntu community infrastructure
[16:26] <kwwii> well, if someone could post something nasty without us knowing it could go very wrong
[16:26] <kwwii> in any case, it would have to locked down
[16:27] <mat_t> rickspencer3: I think having a Flickr pool where everyone, from all art communities can contribute to Ubuntu, makes a lot of sense
[16:27] <mat_t> rickspencer3: we had great results already for wallpapers
[16:28] <kwwii> mat_t: pointing to the short-list flickr page would be a good idea, it is controlled by the admins who are canonical employees and trusted community members
[16:28] <seb128> not sure every user would like to be sent to flickr though
[16:28] <rickspencer3> mat_t, doesn't that defeat the pripose
[16:28] <rickspencer3> purpose, even
[16:29] <rickspencer3> I thought the change was to point to the top tier of submissions first
[16:29] <kwwii> seb128: because it is not opensource?
[16:29] <seb128> yes
[16:29] <mat_t> exactly
[16:29] <kwwii> seb128: I mean, we send them to google to search
[16:29] <kwwii> :p
[16:30] <seb128> no, we send them to a custom ubuntu google webpage ;-)
[16:30]  * rickspencer3 kicks seb
[16:30] <mat_t> rickspencer3: yes, top tier only, so it's a kind of permanent "contest"
[16:30] <rickspencer3> this sounds like it is getting unnecessarily complicated
[16:30] <kwwii> yes, this effort will be ongoing
[16:30] <rickspencer3> beta freeze was *yesterda*
[16:30] <rickspencer3> we need to sort this stuff out asap
[16:31] <rickspencer3> I think if you have a set of backgrounds you are happy with, put them on a web page that contains a link to the GNOME page ...
[16:31] <rickspencer3> give the url to seb128, and then be finished for Karmic
[16:31] <kwwii> we either a) point it to the flickr page, b) make a page of the website with those pics ro c) don't change anything
[16:31] <rickspencer3> if we want to have a more fluid and dynamic system, let's do that in Lucid after a good UDS discussion, etc...
[16:31] <rickspencer3> sound ok?
[16:31] <kwwii> rickspencer3, seb128: ok, we'll figure this out asap and get back to you
[16:32] <seb128> I'm fine with any of those
[16:32] <kwwii> before we make things worse, we leave it alone though
[16:32] <kwwii> seb128, rickspencer3: thanks :)
[16:33] <mat_t> kwwii: I'd go with a) since we used Flickr already and it met good response from the art community.
[16:34] <Riddelll> pitti: although I did spot a missing icons in jockey-kde
[16:34] <kwwii> mat_t: very good point
[16:34] <Riddelll> didn't note down which one it was
[16:34] <kwwii> mat_t: it would also encourage and point people to the ongoing context
[16:34] <kwwii> contest
[16:34] <pitti> Riddelll: oh, indeed I don't see the "tested by Ubuntu devs" and "license" icons
[16:35] <mat_t> kwwii: exactly - in essence, we're starting the Lucid contest right now
[16:36] <kwwii> right
[16:36] <seb128> mat_t, but you have freedom, our users might not ;-)
[16:38] <seb128> mat_t, it might be a wrong concern but there is still a possibility that some user feels strongly about being sent to a outside service
[16:38] <pitti> TheMuso: can you please add a test plan to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/GnomeSpeechReplacement ? it's quite important to have them for the beta
[16:39] <mvo> mpt: hello, nzmm (the guy who wrote the shinny pathbar code) showed me a pic with some thoughts of his today, what do you think? http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/123544/thoughts.jpg
[16:39] <pitti> didrocks, rickspencer3: can we have a "test plan" on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/Quickly for beta? it's quite important to have those for beta
[16:40] <pitti> didrocks, rickspencer3: it's also the last TODO item, as it seems
[16:40] <rickspencer3> pitti, ok
[16:41] <rickspencer3> pitti, it's mostly, do the tutorial and make sure it works
[16:41] <rickspencer3> is that ok?
[16:41] <mpt> mvo, I had a private chat with him about it. The summary was (1) I plan to do user-testing of navigation in the next couple of months (Back+Forward buttons, search results segment in path button, icon as first segment, etc), and (2&3) I'd rather fix double borders by removing one of them rather than by adding extra empty space between them.
[16:41] <rickspencer3> by "ok", I mean "sufficient"?
[16:41] <mpt> mvo, he also has plenty of other cool ideas for the Store :-)
[16:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: our specs have a "test plan", which is usually a small paragraph and a series of commands/steps to check the most basic functionality
[16:43] <andreasn> mvo, mpt, it's starting to look really nice
[16:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: sth. like "apt-get install quickly", "quickly foo", "quickly deb" and check that you can install the resulting .debs and you see a main window
[16:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: something along that granularity
[16:44] <rickspencer3> pitti, ok, so I can just summarize the commands from the tutorial
[16:44] <pitti> rickspencer3: many thanks
[16:44] <rickspencer3> pitti, before next Thursday, or for yesterday?
[16:44] <mpt> thanks andreasn
[16:44] <pitti> rickspencer3: preferably until next Monday or Tuesday, when we finalize the beta release notes
[16:45] <pitti> rickspencer3: ^ at that time we mainly need the "release note" section
[16:45] <pitti> (which might get a little more verbose for quickly)
[16:45] <rickspencer3> pitti, will do, no problems
[16:45] <rickspencer3> thanks
[16:45] <pitti> rickspencer3: on Thursday, when we release beta, it'd be good ot have the test plans, so that the community and testers can use them
[16:45] <pitti> great
[16:46] <kwwii> pitti: thanks for the wallpaper upload, people are loving it :)
[16:46] <pitti> yay :)
[16:46] <pitti> kwwii: first thing I did was to fire up eog and look at them all; marvellous ones
[16:47] <kwwii> pitti: thnx...it went really well, we are very lucky
[16:48] <kwwii> seb128: ok, one more question about that link...can we simply remove it altogether? currently clicking that link opens a firefox window where it is totally unclear where to go from there to get the wallpaper installed
[16:48] <seb128> easy to drop
[16:49] <kwwii> seb128: ok, let's axe it then, if you have the time, naturally
[16:49] <seb128> some users were suggesting using http://gnome-look.org
[16:49] <kwwii> for lucid we can do it right
[16:49] <seb128> you can dnd from the website to the capplet
[16:49] <kwwii> it should open a window with an rss feed of pics and install them directly
[16:49] <seb128> is that worth the change?
[16:50] <seb128> I mean installing a background is not rocked science
[16:50] <rickspencer3> maybe a quickly app for installing new backgrounds?
[16:50] <rickspencer3> :)
[16:50] <kwwii> seb128: but you have to click on the picture, which takes you directly that size and then dnd it into the capplet...my wife or mother would not get it
[16:50] <kwwii> rickspencer3: yes!
[16:50] <seb128> well you can also browse those and save it on disk
[16:50] <seb128> and then right click
[16:50] <kwwii> seb128: but it is totally unclear how to do that
[16:50] <seb128> I mean they are still background collections
[16:50] <pitti> well, does it hurt to have the link there?
[16:50] <seb128> what, store an image on your disk?
[16:50] <kwwii> so before we confuse people even more, just get rid of the link
[16:51] <pitti> it's no different than installing a friend's photo from his webpage
[16:51] <seb128> lot of users know how to save a file
[16:51] <seb128> give them some credit ...
[16:51] <rickspencer3> seb128, but it is weird conversion for a system->preference dialog to the web
[16:51] <kwwii> well, if you ask me, it should either be gone or point to http://www.flickr.com/groups/1188458@N24/
[16:52] <seb128> because it's easier to install a background from flickr than from gnome-look?
[16:52] <rickspencer3> I don't feel comforatable pointing from the Ubuntu desktop off to flickr
[16:53] <rickspencer3> that seems odd to me
[16:53] <seb128> seems here
[16:54] <seb128> I would suggest it's such a detail and coming from upstream that we should let it this way
[16:54] <seb128> the ui freeze is passed by now
[16:54] <seb128> we should focus on stabilizing karmic
[16:54] <seb128> not on arguing over a button
[16:55] <pitti> +1 from me, FWIW
[16:56] <kwwii> well, the button did not appear until very recently...nobody on the deisgn team knew about it :p
[16:56] <kwwii> but I can accept defeat :D
[16:58] <andreasn> those backgrounds look nice, we could clean up the art.gnome.org selection and add them there.
[17:00] <andreasn> selection/section I mean :)
[17:00] <kwwii> andreasn: hrm, that might be a good idea...I don' necessarily like art.gnome.org though, it looks to geeky for me
[17:02] <andreasn> well, we could set up a new page and host it there
[17:02] <andreasn> but I'm not going to drive this, I don't want one more thing on my todo :)
[17:03] <kwwii> andreasn: lol...I think in the end the best thing is not to point someone to a website...it should be an intregrated rss feed driven wallpaper installer that anyone could use
[17:04] <andreasn> indeed
[17:04] <andreasn> there have been 2-3 pieces of code doing that already
[17:04] <andreasn> clarkbw did one and auritz did another one
[17:04] <kwwii> yeah, I was thinking of one that existed a long time ago for themes and such
[17:07] <andreasn> lets try to make it happen for the next release
[17:07] <Amaranth> pitti: If an nvidia crasher keeps getting assigned to compiz while apport start filing dupes automatically if I add a compiz task to the nvidia bug report but mark it invalid?
[17:08] <pitti> Amaranth: s/while/will/?
[17:08] <Amaranth> yeah
[17:08] <pitti> Amaranth: you should be able to just reassign it
[17:08] <Amaranth> It's a crash when compiz exits but the crash is inside the nvidia driver
[17:08] <Amaranth> I can but I'm getting at least one a day
[17:09] <kwwii> andreasn: agreed :)
[17:09] <Amaranth> It doesn't look for dupes in different packages so I was hoping it would mark new ones as dupes automatically if I added an Invalid compiz task to the bug report
[17:10] <Amaranth> well, I guess it's one every other day
[17:10] <Amaranth> I expect that to go up real soon though :)
[17:10] <Amaranth> I'll try it and see what happens
[17:10] <Amaranth> worst case I get bug mail for that bug full of people saying "unsubscribe" here in a couple weeks
[17:15] <rugby471> kwwii: is there a package which the new wallpapers in? if so what is it's name
[17:16] <pitti> Amaranth: we should just have a package hook which looks at the trace and assigns it to the nvidia driver automatically..
[17:16] <pitti> Amaranth: but it _should_ duplicate to bugs in other packages
[17:16] <pitti> oh, hang on, ignore me
[17:16] <pitti> we explicitly didn't do that, in case other packages have similar stack traces due to using the same libs
[17:16] <pitti> Amaranth: an invalid task doesn't help, thouhg
[17:17] <pitti> Amaranth: let me check that after the meeting, I jsut have 1/4 of a brain here right now
[17:17] <rugby471> mvo: have we had a name change?
[17:17] <mvo> mpt: ok, thanks
[17:17] <mvo> rugby471: yes
[17:18] <Riddelll> does upstart have a log?
[17:21] <mvo> rugby471: see bug #436648
[17:21] <kwwii> rugby471: no, I have not packaged them (yet)...19 are in main, I will make a package when my work relating to the beta is done ;)
[17:21] <rugby471> kwwii: cool thanks
[17:23] <kwwii> np
[18:06] <pitti> seb128: your pidgin-libnotify upload just has a changelog, nothing else; control.in trick perhaps?
[18:06] <pitti> seb128: I reject this
[18:07] <seb128> pitti, no
[18:07] <seb128> pitti, it's a no change upload after promotion for rosetta
[18:07] <pitti> seb128: hm, it says "Update url to avoid another redirection"
[18:08] <seb128> urg
[18:08] <seb128> wrong line copy for the changelog
[18:08] <seb128> it's was supposed to be "Rebuild so translations are moved to language packs as expected"
[18:08] <seb128> let me reupload
[18:08] <pitti> thanks
[18:08] <seb128> I messed 2 dch calls
[18:11] <seb128> pitti, reuploaded
[18:11] <seb128> or not
[18:11] <seb128> "Uploading to ubuntu (via ftp to upload.ubuntu.com):
[18:11] <seb128> Connection failed, aborting. Check your network (111, 'Connection refused')
[18:11] <seb128> "
[18:11] <seb128> gnagnagna
[18:11]  * pitti hugs seb128
[18:12] <seb128> pitti, upload.ubuntu.com is down
[18:12] <pitti> seb128: it's trying to tell you "it's weekend"
[18:12] <seb128> lol
[18:12] <seb128> yes, but I want this no change upload in ;-)
[18:12] <pitti> seb128: I accepted your original one
[18:12] <pitti> *shrug* :)
[18:12] <seb128> lol
[18:12] <seb128> thanks
[18:16] <Riddelll> seb128: do you know about the gdm upstart-ification?  I can't work out how the old /etc/rcX.d scripts get removed
[18:16] <seb128> Riddelll, no, scott did the changes
[18:16] <pitti> # Automatically added by dh_installinit
[18:16] <pitti> update-rc.d -f gdm remove >/dev/null || exit $?
[18:18] <pitti> -DEB_DH_INSTALLINIT_ARGS = --noscripts
[18:18] <pitti> +DEB_DH_INSTALLINIT_ARGS = --no-start
[18:18] <pitti> this was the only change in debian/rules from Scott
[18:18] <pitti> seems that current dh_installinit now works for either init.d and upstart and DTRT?
[18:19] <tgpraveen> will tracker be updated to 0.7 series? it is going to be released in a week or less. and brings many new features currently it is 0.6.95
[18:19] <tgpraveen> who is the best person to speak to about this?
[18:20] <Riddelll> pitti: mm, clever
[18:20] <seb128> doubtfully in karmic
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> tpgraveen - no, it probably won't be updated
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> too much has changed, and too little time to fix bugs
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> and it's really only intended for developers
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> i'll probably be maintaining a PPA with it in, when i can free up some time ;)
[18:21] <tgpraveen> :-( a good search app is really missing in linux desktop right now
[18:21] <chrisccoulson> tpgraaven - agreed
[18:21] <tgpraveen> well will have to use your ppa chrisccoulson it seems :-)
[18:22] <chrisccoulson> tpgraaven - i started maintaining git snapshots ages ago, but they are way out of date now
[18:22] <chrisccoulson> i lost interest ;)
[18:22] <tgpraveen> hehe
[18:22] <chrisccoulson> but maybe i'll put some time in to it again if people actually want to use it
[18:22] <seb128> do you really expect new versions to work much better?
[18:22] <seb128> the indexing issues are not due much to tracker
[18:22] <seb128> rather to io load handling and inotify
[18:23] <chrisccoulson> yeah, and the major benefit of the new tracker is not yet used by anything else on the desktop
[18:23] <chrisccoulson> (ie, you can have the RDF store without any indexing now)
[18:23] <chrisccoulson> but nothing uses it yet
[18:25] <chrisccoulson> so, karmic is sticking with 0.6.95 - although, perhaps i should have a look in GIT and cherry pick some bug fixes out of the 0.6.9x series, if they're not planning to do another release
[18:26] <pitti> seb128: seems we just had a LP rollout, which explains upload going down
[18:26] <pitti> that broke change-override.py, *mumble*
[18:26] <seb128> pitti, great ...
[18:26] <chrisccoulson> was there an announcement there?
[18:26] <seb128> no
[18:27] <chrisccoulson> hmmmm
[18:27] <pitti> probably a cherrypick
[18:37] <pitti> bye everyone!
[18:37] <chrisccoulson> have a good weekend pitti
[18:37] <pitti> and you!
[18:37] <chrisccoulson> thanks :)
[18:39] <chrisccoulson> my friday afternoon seems to have completely disappeared!
[18:39] <djsiegel> bye pitti
[18:40] <seb128> pitti, enjoy your weekend
[18:59] <Laney> seb128: OK to sync gnome-backgrounds?
[18:59] <seb128> Laney, I guess so but I will not do sync before next week since I think they bypass the freeze
[18:59] <mvo> Amaranth: sorry, but what was the latest on compiz? we wait for the upstream changes for after beta? and upload whats in bzr now?
[19:00] <Laney> seb128: It's universe anyway, I just wanted ffe
[19:00] <seb128> Laney, ok, got that
[19:00] <Laney> thanks
[19:00] <Amaranth> mvo: yeah, that should be fine
[19:00] <Amaranth> mvo: we'll probably get a lot of dupes for alt-tab randomly crashing but it doesn't seem too common
[19:00] <mvo> Amaranth: cool, doing that now then
[19:01] <mvo> r301? nice ts quite a busy repo
[19:02] <Amaranth> hehe
[19:03] <mvo> Amaranth: the glxWaitX change looks a bit scary, but it seems that it should not cause performance issue if it does not need a roundtrip
[19:03] <Amaranth> mvo: Right now glXBindTexImageEXT is doing the round trip but it has no reason to need to
[19:04] <Amaranth> mvo: So right now glXWaitX() called there will almost never do anything but once the drivers are optimized it will save us a lot of headaches
[19:04] <Amaranth> And I'm sure someone will make new drivers available for karmic (xorg-edgers)
[19:04] <Amaranth> err
[19:04] <Amaranth> oh, no, that's what I meant
[19:05] <Amaranth> mvo: And hopefully in a couple weeks the Xorg guys will have a proper solution thought up we can use in lucid
[19:06] <Amaranth> Oh, right, the err was because I didn't mean round trip :)
[19:06] <Amaranth> I meant XSync minus the round trip, which is what glXWaitX does :)
[19:08] <Amaranth> I haven't seen any issues in the last 5 hours since I've had that in there
[19:09] <Amaranth> and an option in the workarounds plugin basically does the same thing but not as well since plugins can't hook into this point and no one has had problems with it
[19:09] <Amaranth> and it makes Qt apps look right on nvidia :)
[19:10] <didrocks> pitti, rickspencer3: I'm already working on a complete testsuite for Quickly. But it's target for 0.4 which won't be in karmic. A simple test plan can be done easily
[19:11] <chrisccoulson> does anything look right on nvidia? ;)
[19:12]  * didrocks was almost sure it was seahorse-plugins that handle ssh key. Even installing it, I can't get the nice dialog showing…
[19:13] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - i'm not sure there - that's still all magic to me ;)
[19:13] <mvo> Amaranth: and emacs is behaving without artifacts for me now too \o/
[19:13] <Amaranth> mvo: oh yeah, that too
[19:13] <Amaranth> If only everything used GTK+...
[19:14] <mvo> :)
[19:14] <Amaranth> GTK+ is very resilient to things like this :)
[19:15] <Amaranth> Probably because GTK+ used _NET_WM_SYNC_REQUEST for pretty much everything
[19:16] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh, you who knows almost everything in GNOME :)
[19:16] <didrocks> I'm disapointed :p
[19:16] <chrisccoulson> heh, didrocks - that's one part i don't understand yet
[19:16] <Amaranth> I thought it was something with ssh-agent and seahorse-daemon
[19:17] <Amaranth> but it's black magic to me too
[19:17] <chrisccoulson> that's the next part of GNOME which i need to bury my head in!
[19:17] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm always wondering how you was able to dive in a particular as documentation is tight sometimes
[19:18] <Amaranth> apt-get source and grep
[19:18] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - i don't like not understanding how things work ;)
[19:18] <chrisccoulson> that's probably how i ended up doing engineering!
[19:18] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: so do I, but you have been able to dive into GNOME, really easily, apparently :)
[19:19] <didrocks> Amaranth: seahorse-daemon is running
[19:19] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - sometimes not so easily. i sometimes just spend more time on it than i should ;)
[19:19] <didrocks> Amaranth: it's in /etc/xdg/autostart/seahorse-daemon.desktop in fact
[19:22] <djsiegel> seb128: do you know if it's possible to do one humanity-icon-theme package for UNR, and another for the desktop?
[19:26] <didrocks> so, gnome-keyring is installed and conftool-2 --get /apps/gnome-keyring/daemon-components/ssh returns true
[19:27] <didrocks> hum, $ eval `seahorse-agent --variables`
[19:27] <didrocks> ** Message: Another GPG agent already running
[19:29] <Amaranth> right, the regular ssh-agent
[19:31] <didrocks> well, I try to not mess up my installation and find a nice way to setup it :)
[19:31] <Amaranth> probably just log out
[19:33] <didrocks> finishing full-upgrade before :)
[19:39] <didrocks> Amaranth: reboot solved nothing :/
[19:49] <seb128> re
[19:50] <chrisccoulson> hey seb128
[19:50] <chrisccoulson> ready for the weekend?
[19:50] <seb128> yes:
[19:50] <seb128> yes!
[19:50] <seb128> you?
[19:50] <seb128> didrocks, what are you looking at?
[19:50] <chrisccoulson> i am now. this afternoon didn't go entirely to plan though ;)
[19:51] <seb128> oh?
[19:51] <seb128> you had to work?
[19:51] <chrisccoulson> well, i worked later than planned, and then i had issues with my car when i finished
[19:52] <chrisccoulson> so i've spent the rest of the afternoon trying to get that sorted
[19:52] <seb128> not sure if you do half of a day every friday or if that was getting hours back the previous time you had ;-)
[19:52] <seb128> oh
[19:52] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's half day every friday;)
[19:52] <seb128> did you manage to get it fixed now?
[19:52] <chrisccoulson> i did, but it's money that i'd rather not have spent ;)
[19:53] <didrocks> seb128: just to setup seahorse and gnome-keyring to display a nice windows when using my gpg and ssh key
[19:53] <seb128> didrocks, gnome-keyring should work out of the box for ssh
[19:53] <seb128> you need seahorse-plugins for gpg
[19:54] <chrisccoulson> i really need to spend some time looking at this logout issue with gnome-keyring this weekend :-/
[19:54] <didrocks> hum, I installed both, copy my ~/.ssh/id_rsa and ssh isn't working :/
[19:54] <didrocks> I have "Enter passphrase for key '/home/didrocks/.ssh/id_rsa':" in my shell
[19:55] <didrocks> I didn't export/import it into seahorse, maybe that's the root issue?
[19:56] <seb128> no
[19:56] <seb128> seahorse has nothing to do with ssh agent
[19:56] <seb128> didrocks, env | grep -i ssh?
[19:57] <didrocks> SSH_AGENT_PID=1762
[19:57] <didrocks> SSH_AUTH_SOCK=/tmp/keyring-oxQ0AD/socket.ss
[19:57] <didrocks> so, SSH_AGENT is making some trouble?
[19:57] <seb128> well it's the ssh agent
[19:57] <seb128> ls /tmp/keyring-oxQ0AD/socket.ssh
[19:58] <didrocks> it exists
[19:58] <seb128> is gnome-keyring-agent running?
[19:58] <seb128> gnome-keyring-daemon
[19:58] <didrocks> /usr/bin/gnome-keyring-daemon is running
[19:58] <seb128> ok, so I don't now
[19:58] <seb128> ssh -vvv ...
[20:00] <didrocks> well, no real useful output: http://paste.ubuntu.com/278168/
[20:01] <seb128> ok, suck to be you then ;-)
[20:01] <c_korn> tedg: hello
[20:01] <didrocks> seb128: thanks :-)
[20:02] <c_korn> tedg: currently indicator-applet crashes on startup
[20:02] <tedg> c_korn: Howdy
[20:02] <didrocks> I'll try a clean install in beta…
[20:02] <tedg> c_korn: Hmm... that's no good.
[20:02] <seb128> didrocks, seems you have no key
[20:02] <tedg> c_korn: Do you get a backtrace or anything?
[20:02] <c_korn> tedg: maybe it is related to that icon issue
[20:02] <seb128> debug2: key: /home/didrocks/.ssh/identity ((nil))
[20:02] <seb128> debug2: key: /home/didrocks/.ssh/id_rsa ((nil))
[20:02] <seb128> debug2: key: /home/didrocks/.ssh/id_dsa ((nil))
[20:02] <seb128> didrocks, ^
[20:02] <c_korn> tedg: apport is currently collectiong information
[20:03] <c_korn> tedg: and fails: The program crashed on an assertion failure, but the message could not be retrieved. Apport does not support reporting these crashes
[20:03] <didrocks> seb128: hum, I still have id_rsa (see below) and I can type in my private ssh passphrase and I can connect
[20:03] <tedg> c_korn: Err, hate that in apport.
[20:04] <c_korn> tedg: oh, it is indicator-applet-session which crashes
[20:04] <tedg> c_korn: Hmm, that's probably similar to what seb128 was seeing.  Do you see it on all logins?
[20:04] <tedg> c_korn: seb128 was getting it on guest only.
[20:05] <seb128> tedg, not only
[20:05] <seb128> tedg, that's just what I use for testing
[20:05] <seb128> didrocks, debug1: PEM_read_PrivateKey failed
[20:05] <seb128> didrocks, that's weird
[20:05] <c_korn> tedg: yes, it crashed on all logins. when I reload it does not crash however
[20:05] <didrocks> seb128: right, that's weird as I still can type my passphrase to decrypt this key :/
[20:06] <seb128> didrocks, seems a ssh issue rather than a keyring one
[20:06] <tedg> c_korn: Hmm, probably the same as seb128's issue.
[20:06] <didrocks> seb128: indeed, I'll try to copy the whole .ssh folder, not just the key
[20:06] <tedg> We need a way to corner this one somehow.
[20:10] <seb128> didrocks, using karmic?
[20:11] <didrocks> seb128: of course
[20:11] <seb128> didrocks, bug #348126 is similar to yours
[20:11] <seb128> but should be fixed
[20:14] <didrocks> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openssh/+bug/348126/comments/30 is exactly mine
[20:14] <didrocks> seb128: creating a new ssh key and exporting it works… but well…
[20:14] <Amaranth> ccheney: Get your new machine setup?
[20:15] <didrocks> seb128: in seahorse, it's listing in "other key", not in "my personal key", maybe an hint?
[20:15] <didrocks> (the new one is listed in "my personal key")
[20:16] <didrocks> well, going to have some dinner, bbl
[20:16] <seb128> didrocks, could be
[20:17] <seb128> didrocks, open an upstream bug they are responsive sometime
[20:17] <seb128> didrocks, enjoy!
[20:19] <didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
[20:19] <didrocks> I'll do some additional tests before opening the upstream bug
[20:20] <mac_v> pitti: you around?
[20:21] <mac_v> or seb128 is there space for ~290 kb on the cd ?
[20:21] <seb128> mac_v, not around until next week no
[20:21] <seb128> mac_v, it's late for beta what do you need?
[20:22] <mac_v> the UNR has dark panel and Ubuntu has light panel... so figuring out a solution.. and thats needs just aroung that much space
[20:22] <seb128> the space should be ok
[20:23] <mac_v> ok thanks
[20:42] <kwwii> seb128: jfyi, I am working with djsiegel and mac_v to solve this issue...we should have some idea of what we need to do by monday
[20:42] <djsiegel> kwwii: I have an email typed up
[20:42] <djsiegel> "Ken and I advocate using Human icons for just the panel in the desktop edition, but I am told that it's too difficult to revert to Human icons in the Desktop edition panel while keeping Humanity icons in the UNR panel. Let's improve this situation in Lucid so we can do a dark-panel icon theme for UNR and a light-panel icon theme for the Desktop edition, but for Karmic let's go with Humanity."
[20:43] <djsiegel> as far as mixing color icons and stencil-look, "We are just going to live with this, it's not terrible. We can't cover all application icons, and even we could, there is no mechanism in place at the moment for us to specify panel-only icons. If we were to change the Tomboy icon for example, the panel icon would show up unintentionally within Tomboy. We will consider this something to address in the Lucid cycle."
[20:43] <mac_v> djsiegel: i'v proposed an alternate solution to kwwii ... lest see how he decides ;)
[20:43] <mac_v> let's*
[20:43] <djsiegel> what's that, mac_v?
[20:43] <kwwii> djsiegel, mac_v let's talk about this some more and then make a final decision ;)
[20:44] <djsiegel> ok, I will sit on the email :)
[20:44] <kwwii> I do not think we are going to start merging/splitting/creating icons tonight and be done with it by tomorrow in any case
[20:44] <kwwii> let's figure out the best course and then bug seb128 :P
[20:44] <mac_v> hehe , ;)
[20:45] <djsiegel> can we avoid bugging seb128 altogether? I am kind of scared of him
[20:45] <kwwii> seb128: does that sound best to you, or is there a pressing need to get everything wrapped up tonight?
[20:46] <seb128> djsiegel, lol
[20:46] <seb128> kwwii, no hurry the archive is frozen for beta since yesterday
[20:46] <seb128> kwwii, you will get nobody to let uploads in until next week now
[20:46] <djsiegel> kwwii: I called ivanka to discuss, and she said sticking with humanity everywhere is acceptable -- she feels it is still an improvement over jaunty, and as long as it's an improvement it's ok
[20:46] <seb128> you guys should really work on respecting freezes next cycle
[20:46] <djsiegel> The panel icons are not awesome on the desktop edition
[20:47] <djsiegel> seb128: yeah yeah, the decision to go with humanity on the desktop was made at the absolute last minute
[20:47] <kwwii> seb128: it was not my idea to switch icon themes one day before beta without any testing
[20:47] <seb128> well just saying for whoever idea it was
[20:47] <kwwii> seb128: trust me, this is not my fault, I just want to get the best solution
[20:47] <djsiegel> it's a huge pain for all of us, but users will like it a lot
[20:47] <kwwii> djsiegel: that is for you, I guess :D
[20:47] <seb128> it create issues for everybody and we have other things to fight at beta time usually
[20:47] <djsiegel> and excite the community
[20:47] <djsiegel> ok, kwwii
[20:48] <djsiegel> mac_v: what was your alternate solution?
[20:48] <seb128> well anyway nothing will go in before monday
[20:48] <seb128> so don't hurry
[20:48] <djsiegel> I am fine sticking with humanity everywhere, and having a light-style panel on the desktop
[20:48] <seb128> and if that's after beta that's ok too we still have some weeks
[20:48] <djsiegel> gives us a nice thing to improve for lucid
[20:49] <kwwii> seb128: right, that was my point...I don't want to distract you with this discussion, you have better things to do
[20:49] <kwwii> djsiegel: let's take this offline...we are also discussing it on #ubuntu-artwork
[20:49] <mac_v> djsiegel: we make the icons darker , for Ubuntu , , for UNR , we split those specific icons and make lighter icons ... or even easier would be to just mkae UNR's default panel light!
[20:49] <mac_v> make*
[20:50] <djsiegel> kwwii: ok, I can work on something else
[20:51] <kwwii> mac_v: no, unr was designed to use a dark panel, that should not change
[20:51] <mac_v> hehe , yeah
[20:51] <kwwii> mac_v, djsiegel: let's discuss this in #ubuntu-art
[20:52] <djsiegel> ok
[20:54] <didrocks> seb128: ok, got it. Having the public secret key in .ssh folder is needed for gnome-keyring
[20:54] <didrocks> -secret
[20:54] <didrocks> public key :)
[20:55] <seb128> didrocks, ok, good
[20:56] <seb128> enough work for me now, see you later
[20:56] <didrocks> seb128: enjoy your week-end!
[20:56] <seb128> thanks, you too!
[20:56] <seb128> bye
[20:57] <hggdh> Laney, ping
[20:57] <Laney> hi
[20:58] <Laney> content in pings appreciated :)
[20:58] <hggdh> Laney: I just found (while building evolution) that I was missing libpst.pc in the libpst package
[20:58] <hggdh> Laney: sorry about the content-less ping
[20:58] <Laney> bad .install?
[20:58] <hggdh> indeed
[20:59] <hggdh> I just rebuilt it locally, seems to be OK, but I will test it against evo before asking a new upload
[20:59] <Laney> ok
[21:00] <hggdh> since evo has this quirk about only building pst-import if it finds the bloody libpst there
[21:00] <hggdh> what would you prefer: reopen the bug (and assign it to you), or ping you here?
[21:00] <Laney> just give me a diff
[21:01] <Laney> doesnt need a bug
[21:01] <hggdh> regoer willco
[21:23] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: are you on amd64?
[22:09] <chrisccoulson> hi Amaranth - yeah, i'm on amd64
[22:10] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: http://people.ubuntu.com/~amaranth/compiz/ has some compiz packages with a possible workaround for the nvidia bug
[22:10] <chrisccoulson> Amaranth - thanks.mind if i take a look a but later?
[22:10] <chrisccoulson> i'm just about to eat dinner;)
[22:10] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: That's fine although there is a process to testing
[22:11] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: You have to install, start compiz in terminal, turn off unredirect fullscreen windows in general options in ccsm, then go to guest session and back
[22:11] <chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll try that in a bit
[22:11] <Amaranth> compiz-wrapper is still turning the option on when you start compiz so you have to disable it after starting
[22:11] <Amaranth> probably should have patched that out of my test stuff :)
[22:12] <chrisccoulson> that's ok, i can work around that;)
[22:12] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: Oh and don't leave it installed as it will quickly fill up your .xsession-errors and chew up CPU when you have the screensaver active (due to the printf on every paint)
[22:58] <hggdh> Laney: new libpst correctly sets up, and Evo correctly builds with it. How can I give you the diff?
[23:02] <Laney> upload it somewhere
[23:02] <Amaranth> chrisccoulson: ignore all that, new ubuntu4 packages uploaded that don't enable the option on start and don't do the printf spew so all you have to do is disable the option, reload compiz, and switch to guest user to test (they've also been uploaded for the beta)
[23:09] <ccheney> Amaranth: not yet, just got the last part a few min ago, was feeling pretty sick earlier today too :-(
[23:10] <ccheney> Amaranth: i'll try to put it together after dinner if I still feel ok then
[23:10] <hggdh> Laney: uploaded to people.ubuntu.com/public_html/libpst_0.6.41-0ubuntu2.diff.gz
[23:10] <ccheney> Amaranth: can't wait to build OOo on it and see how fast/slow it goes :)
[23:10] <Amaranth> ccheney: Ok, I'm kind of excited to hear about your OOo build times now :)
[23:10] <ccheney> i thought for sure the motherboard was a scam until i held in my own hands, it was $70 off retail and new
[23:11] <Amaranth> wow
[23:11] <hggdh> Laney: I also have prepared an update to Evolution; both libpst and Evo are available on my PPA
[23:11] <ccheney> Amaranth: its a gigabyte ga-p55-ud5 got it for $149
[23:11] <Amaranth> i7 boards are usually like $200
[23:11] <Amaranth> oh, even more than $200 :)
[23:12] <ccheney> yea well 1156 boards are somewhat cheaper but this was one of the top end models
[23:12] <ccheney> i think it normally goes for $220+
[23:12] <Amaranth> ccheney: DDR3 RAM then, right?
[23:12] <ccheney> yea, got 8GB of 1333
[23:12] <Amaranth> *drool*
[23:13] <ccheney> 4gb dimms are still really expensive ~ $400/ea
[23:13] <ccheney> so i ended up with 4 2gb dimms for $190
[23:13] <Amaranth> I suppose when OOo builds use 2GB that's not so much :)
[23:13] <ccheney> yea use at least 2GB i think on this box it will probably go way above 4GB
[23:13] <ccheney> since OOo can build threaded
[23:13] <Amaranth> Doesn't DDR3 run the best when you only have 3 sticks?
[23:14] <ccheney> i7 1366 is three channel and 1156 is only dual channel, so have 2 dimms on each channel
[23:14] <Amaranth> I suppose not enough of a difference to lose 2GB
[23:14] <Amaranth> Ah
[23:14] <ccheney> the 1366 boards generally have 6 slots so you could put up to 24GB ram in them if you want to pay $400/dimm or 12gb for cheaper stuff
[23:14] <Amaranth> ccheney: nvidia graphics?
[23:15] <ccheney> i just got a amd 4350 since its oss
[23:15] <Amaranth> yay
[23:15] <ccheney> and i don't play games, heh
[23:15] <Amaranth> I was going to be upset if you said yes :)
[23:15] <ccheney> my old system that my wife now has nvidia 7600gt  but that was because at the time there was no ati with dual dvi and fanless, iirc
[23:16] <Amaranth> lucid may have 3D support for you anyway, depending on how fast upstream is and how aggressive we are with mesa/drm updates considering it's LTS
[23:16] <ccheney> my even older system is ati 9600
[23:16] <ccheney> ok
[23:16] <ccheney> well 4350 is really slow for games anyway so even accel 3d wouldn't make it fast enough for current win32 games
[23:17] <Amaranth> I know r500 went from glxgears to compiz in about 2 months but then again r500 is based on r300 which they already had code for
[23:17] <ccheney> but having working compiz would be nice :)
[23:17] <ccheney> yea iirc this is rv770 or something like that
[23:17] <ccheney> er rv710 apparently
[23:18]  * ccheney really hopes his hsf will be able to mount
[23:37]  * ccheney bbl, food


[14:38] <dkessel> Noskaj: what do you think about closing testdrive bug 1037671 ? it is fairly old and the original reporter already stated that it is probably invalid.