[15:00] <bac> #startmeeting
[15:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 09:00. The chair is bac.
[15:00] <bac> hello everyone and welcome to the AMEU reviewer's meeting.
[15:00] <bac> who is here today?  team leads will you help me round up your folks who may be tardy?
[15:00] <gary_poster> me, me me!
[15:00] <bigjools> me
[15:00] <rockstar> ni!
[15:00] <noodles775> me
[15:00] <henninge> ich
[15:00] <leonardr> me
[15:00] <kfogel> hey
[15:01] <sinzui> me
[15:01] <bigjools> soyuz non-vacationing/non-seconded team members all correct and present SAH
[15:01] <abentley> me
[15:01] <bac> sinzui, EdwinGrubbs, salgado: registry team ping
[15:01] <rockstar> Code's here.
[15:01] <bac> sorry sinzu
[15:01] <bac> i
[15:01] <sinzui> o
[15:01] <sinzui> u
[15:02] <salgado> me!
[15:02] <EdwinGrubbs> me
[15:02] <bac> thanks bigjools
[15:02] <allenap> me
[15:02] <mars> me
[15:02] <bac> henninge: any more bug folks?
[15:02] <bigjools> bac: o7
[15:03] <bac> will flacoste be joining us?
[15:03] <flacoste> i am
[15:03] <flacoste> me
[15:03] <henninge> bac: you mean translations? danilos?
[15:03] <bac> welcome back flacoste!
[15:03] <bac> henninge: yeah, that's what i meant.  sorry.
[15:03] <bac> allenap: any of your cohorts around?
[15:04] <allenap> bac: I've just pinged them all... let's see..
[15:04] <jtv> me
[15:04] <intellectronica> me
[15:04] <danilos> ok, ok, me too
[15:04] <danilos> :)
[15:04] <bac> welcome special guest kfogel
[15:04] <bac> [TOPIC] agenda
[15:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  agenda
[15:04]  * jtv applauds kfogel
[15:04] <bac> * Roll call
[15:04] <bac> * Apologies: None
[15:04] <bac> * Action items
[15:04] <bac> * Mentoring update (leondardr/rockstar)
[15:04] <bac> * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda)
[15:04] <kfogel> thanks bac, jtv
[15:05] <bac> [TOPIC] * Action items
[15:05] <bac> * Karl to update wiki about sponsoring contributions and take RFC to the mailing list.
[15:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  * Action items
[15:05] <kfogel> So, kfogel would like to know if that item is done or not.
[15:05] <kfogel> I wasn't sure what the original spec was; I improvised.  Thoughts, folks?
[15:05] <bac> Thanks kfogel for taking care of that item.  I read it and it looks good.
[15:05] <kfogel> bac: thank you.
[15:05] <salgado> where is it?
[15:05] <bac> Did anyone else get a chance to read karl's updates?
[15:06] <intellectronica> no, url?
[15:06] <kfogel> (most of the material was there already, actually -- barry and I put it there long ago)
[15:06]  * kfogel finds urls...
[15:06] <bac> https://dev.launchpad.net/FixBugs
[15:06] <kfogel> okay, three:
[15:06] <kfogel> https://dev.launchpad.net/Patches
[15:06] <kfogel> https://dev.launchpad.net/FixBugs
[15:06] <kfogel> https://dev.launchpad.net/Reviews
[15:06] <kfogel> they interlink
[15:07] <bac> kfogel: are these all new pages or just additions to existing ones?
[15:07] <kfogel> the first two are directly linked from the top nav box on the home page
[15:07] <kfogel> bac: FixBugs is a new page
[15:07] <kfogel> bac: I updated Patches (and renamed it from PatchSubmission); I don't think I tweaked Reviews much.
[15:08] <bac> i think this is a good start.
[15:08] <intellectronica> i think we should avoid using the word "patch", because it might confuse people that are familiar with diff/patch but not with dvcs
[15:08] <bac> the process and our description on the wiki will evolve but i appreciate karl writing the first cut.
[15:08] <kfogel> I'd like to know what's missing; my email to the list didn't get much reaction AFAICT.
[15:09] <kfogel> Happy to add more (also happy for people to edit directly, of course!).
[15:09] <bac> intellectronica: do you have a suggested wording?
[15:09] <intellectronica> bac: branch
[15:09] <kfogel> intellectronica: I didn't quite understand: how will "patch" confuse people in that situation?
[15:09] <intellectronica> or changeset, if you want to talk about it in the abstract
[15:10] <kfogel> "change" ?
[15:10] <intellectronica> kfogel: they might think that we want them to produce a patch file, rather than a bzr branch
[15:10] <abentley> So I thought the idea was that when you wanted to fix a bug, for example, you found a sponsor and they guided you through the process, starting with some facimile of a pre-implementation call.
[15:10] <kfogel> intellectronica: ah.  One way might be to simply explain at the top of the Patches page that the end result is a bzr branch, not an actual patch file.
[15:10] <kfogel> I think "patch" might still be the term of art for changes.
[15:11] <intellectronica> kfogel: yeah, i guess just stressing that might be enough
[15:11] <kfogel> abentley: if that's the idea, I'd like to suggest that we be more lightweight.  It's certainly okay to do that, but people should also feel free to do more lightweight process...
[15:11] <EdwinGrubbs> The name "Patches" doesn't explain whether they can get patches on that page or learn how to submit patches.
[15:12] <bac> EdwinGrubbs: yeah, i think i prefer the old name PatchSubmission
[15:12] <kfogel> EdwinGrubbs, bac: I can revert, easy enough.
[15:12] <abentley> I try to refer to submitting a "change", rather than a patch.  Even that's broken, though, because we deal in branches, and branches represent a state, not a change.
[15:13] <kfogel> so ACTION items so far: rename back to PatchSubmission; explain at top of page that 'patch' means 'branch'.  I do think sticking with the accepted term for patches would be a good idea.  It's what everyone uses, even when they're not trading actual patch files.
[15:13] <intellectronica> abentley: +1 i think change or changeset are good terms which are much less ambiguous
[15:13] <abentley> intellectronica: bzr doesn't have changesets, so I don't think that's a good term to use.
[15:14] <jtv> "improvement"?
[15:14] <intellectronica> abentley: we could call it revision, which is what bzr actually has, no?
[15:14] <abentley> intellectronica: But multiple revisions are often submitted.
[15:14] <kfogel> intellectronica: changeset is a technical term in VC; also, having tried to use it with lots of people, I find I often have to explain it.  Many people already know "patch"; those few who don't, once they understand it, will be permanently enabled across the software ecosystem.
[15:15] <intellectronica> anyway, this turning into a theological discussion. sorry for starting. continue on the list?
[15:15] <kfogel> Let's reinforce the existing term, not try to promote a new term.  (This is an old debate and an old effort, and it hasn't succeeded in dethroning "patch" yet, IMHO.)
[15:15] <kfogel> heh
[15:15] <deryck> I'm not sure people really get tripped up over thinking "patch" literally means a patch.  The generic use of the term seems common to me.
[15:15] <bac> intellectronica: yes, good idea.
[15:15] <kfogel> okay, let's go with the two ACTION items above.  Any others so far?
[15:15] <bac> thanks again to karl.  please follow up to his email if you have further discussion.
[15:16] <bac> [TOPIC] * Mentoring update (leondardr/rockstar)
[15:16] <MootBot> New Topic:  * Mentoring update (leondardr/rockstar)
[15:16] <bac> rockstar: you have the floor
[15:16] <rockstar> leonardr has done an amazing job as a manatee since day one. His reviews are insightful and exploratory. I'm happy to announce his graduation.
[15:16] <leonardr> yay
[15:16] <rockstar> Congratulations leonardr
[15:16] <bac> whee
[15:17] <bac> congratulations leonard.
[15:17] <noodles775> congrats leonardr !
[15:17] <bac> with his graduation we are mentat-free, i believe.
[15:17] <kfogel> leonardr++
[15:17] <bac> have we reached the goal of every developer being a reviewer?
[15:18] <rockstar> I believe so.
[15:19] <bac> excellent.  i think that plan was hatched in our MIT sprint.  congratulations everyone.
[15:19] <flacoste> and barry isn't here to join the fun!
[15:19] <flacoste> congratulations leonard
[15:19] <bac> [TOPIC] * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda)
[15:19] <MootBot> New Topic:  * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda)
[15:20] <bac> does anyone have another topic to discuss?
[15:21] <bac> thanks for coming everyone.  please do read the new wiki pages in detail and offer feedback.
[15:21] <bac> #endmeeting
[15:21] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 09:21.
[15:21] <abentley> bac: thank you!
[15:21] <jtv> thank you bac!
[15:22] <mars> thanks bac


 Did a reminder make it out to twitter/facebook/identica?
[09:48] <jaddi27> first meeting as chair for me
[09:48] <head_victim> I posted one during the week
[09:48] <jaddi27> somethinginteres: Yes, a message went to all of them
[09:48] <somethinginteres> jaddi27: cool, cool.
[09:48] <head_victim> Is it the sort of thing that's monitored immediately? Should I send another out?
[09:49] <jaddi27> I put one of Facebook, and the event showed up on Facebook again
[09:49] <somethinginteres> head_victim: I don't think it would hurt to do another. A lot of people using twitter get instant updates.
[09:49] <jaddi27> head_victim: You could do one saying that the meeting is starting in a few minutes - It might get a few more people to remember it is on
[09:50] <head_victim> Ok, I'm quite open to suggestions for tweets/dents to btw, I don't really know what I'm doing here but want to get on top of it all
[09:50] <benonsoftware> Hi all
[09:51] <jaddi27> head_victim: I think you are doing fine at the moment. Not much else that needs to have been said, I think
[09:51] <somethinginteres> jaddi27, head_victim: I agree
[09:51] <head_victim> There's not a lot of people follwing yet but that should build
[09:52] <head_victim> Trying not to upset everyone with random crap :)
[09:52] <jellyware> evening everyone
[09:53] <benonsoftware> jellyware, Evening
[09:54] <benonsoftware> How is everyone tonight?
[09:55] <head_victim> Pretty cold up here in Brisbane, it's only 14 degrees :/
[09:55] <jaddi27> Fine, thanks. Just watching the netball grand final - a very intense game
[09:56] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: Was watching that and Everybody Loves Rymond
[09:56] <somethinginteres> Resting after being in Melbourne for the week. :)
[09:56] <benonsoftware> somethinginteres: Where do you live?
[09:57] <somethinginteres> benonsoftware: SA
[09:57] <benonsoftware> somethinginteres: Ok
[09:57] <benonsoftware> somethinginteres: Do you mind if I do this months reports and you do next?
[09:58] <somethinginteres> benonsoftware: no worries at all.
[09:58] <benonsoftware> somethinginteres: Thanks. It is just I can't come to the next meeting
[09:59] <somethinginteres> benonsoftware: Ah, I see. No problem. If I was a better student I would be working on my research now but I'm not and I want to contribute like a boss.
[10:00] <sagaci> Can i delay my item til later in the meeting
[10:00] <benonsoftware> somethinginteres: The reason I can't come to the next few meetings is because of school
[10:00] <sagaci> on a dodgy connection atm
[10:00] <jaddi27> sagaci: Yes, that is fine. Just reorder the agenda on l.u.c so I know
[10:00] <sagaci> can't do on this symbian browser :3
[10:01] <benonsoftware> sagaci: Isn't it a sub of my item
[10:01] <sagaci> yes
[10:01] <head_victim> The browser was the real downside of symbian
[10:01] <jaddi27> Ok. I will just delay that until later
[10:01] <benonsoftware> sagaci: Will that mean my item will get pushed too?
[10:02] <sagaci> Nevermind, i'm here, just gotta login again
[10:02] <sagaci> brb
[10:03] <benonsoftware> Anyone feel it's later than what it is here?
[10:03] <head_victim> 2003 is what my clock says
[10:03] <jaddi27> head_victim: Is there a special way to do the item for mootbot for sub-items?
[10:03] <benonsoftware> head_victim: Same here
[10:03] <gorilla> head_victim: same here also.
[10:03] <sagaci> yeah, scrub mine for later
[10:03] <head_victim> jaddi27: not really, I think you ahve to do a separate item or include it in one
[10:04] <jaddi27> head_victim: Ok
[10:04] <jaddi27> Is everyone ready to start?
[10:04] <benonsoftware> Sure thing
[10:04] <jellyware> yes
[10:04] <mrshr3d> yep
[10:04] <jaddi27> #startmeeting
[10:04] <MootBot> Meeting started at 05:04. The chair is jaddi27.
[10:04] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[10:05] <jaddi27> [LINK] http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-au/111/detail/
[10:05] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-au/111/detail/
[10:05] <jaddi27> Agenda is at the above link
[10:05] <benonsoftware> Got it
[10:05] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Roll Call - Jared Norris
[10:05] <MootBot> New Topic:  Roll Call - Jared Norris
[10:06] <head_victim> Gday all, wave your hands if you're here :)
[10:06]  * benonsoftware waves
[10:06]  * mrshr3d waves
[10:06] <jellyware> waves
[10:06] <jaddi27> hi
[10:06] <somethinginteres> here
[10:06] <head_victim> While we're waving I would just like to say that I'm still following up about the website renewal. I don't have any further details on a timeline though.
[10:07]  * gorilla waves
[10:07] <benonsoftware> and well done head_victim for submiting the bug report for approval
[10:07] <head_victim> And, the team reapproval was put in really early Saturday morning AEST time.
[10:07] <head_victim> I'm not sure on a timeline for hearing back about that other than it's been acknowledged as being received by the council at this stage.
[10:07] <fabricator4> Sorry, I'm late...
[10:07] <jellyware> what do you mean by website renewal?  I'm lost already jared
[10:07] <head_victim> As always, I will definitely keep everyone up to date the second I hear anything
[10:08] <jaddi27> head_victim: Thanks a lot for submitting that. Hopefully we will get good feedback (and hopefully will be resume official status)
[10:08] <benonsoftware> and also too point out about 25 other times are applying for approval too
[10:08] <head_victim> jellyware: the last couple of meetings I've been keeping people up to date, I've submitted a request to Canonical to update the Drupal install for the website so we can install the newer looking Ubuntu themes to make it line up with the current branding.
[10:08] <head_victim> The themes aren't available for the current version installed.
[10:08] <jellyware> oh.  cool.  thanks head_victim
[10:09] <Octatron> Hey everyone soz I'm late
[10:09] <jaddi27> Octatron: That is alright. just doing roll call
[10:09] <head_victim> Cool, well that's all I had to update the team on and I think most people have indicated attendance. Over to you jaddi27
[10:10] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Ubuntu Global Jam - Benny
[10:10] <MootBot> New Topic:  Ubuntu Global Jam - Benny
[10:10] <benonsoftware> Ready?
[10:11] <jaddi27> yes
[10:11] <benonsoftware> [LINK] http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/global/1011/detail/ Ubuntu Global Jam
[10:11] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/global/1011/detail/ Ubuntu Global Jam
[10:11] <benonsoftware> I was just wondering what we are doing to do for the Jam?
[10:11] <sagaci> hi
[10:12] <benonsoftware> Are we going to have it on IRC or any other ideas?
[10:12] <jaddi27> I think sagaci will be organising a translation jam for the oneiric cycle
[10:12] <sagaci> Yeah, I'd be happy to send out an email
[10:13] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: So that's one thing down in NSW
[10:13] <jaddi27> benonsoftware: I think it would actually be done online
[10:13] <sagaci> translation jam will be aus wide
[10:13] <benonsoftware> Well that would be a great thig.
[10:13] <benonsoftware> Anyone here good at bugs. I want one of them. :)
[10:14] <benonsoftware> If someone teaches me how to do one online I would be happy to do a docs one.
[10:14] <sagaci> an intro email and short description of progress and common strings to watch for, etc
[10:15] <benonsoftware> Well I'm happy to do a Jam on Documentation
[10:15] <jaddi27> An online jam would be conducted here on IRC, where one person leads and everyone else can join in
[10:15] <gorilla> the problem with doing a face-to-face meeting is finding a venue which is affordable and has internet connection of some sort.
[10:15] <benonsoftware> gorilla: I know about venues
[10:15] <benonsoftware> So anyone want a Documentation Jam?
[10:16] <sagaci> writing and/or fixing documentation
[10:16] <benonsoftware> sagaci: Yeah
[10:16] <jaddi27> [IDEA] benonsoftware to investigate holding a documentation jam and email the list with suggestions
[10:16] <MootBot> IDEA received:  benonsoftware to investigate holding a documentation jam and email the list with suggestions
[10:17] <Octatron> gorilla: coffee shops? Zaraaffa's they have wifi
[10:17] <mrshr3d> Same with Maccas
[10:17] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: Sure
[10:17] <benonsoftware> mrshr3d: Maccas no power points
[10:17] <mrshr3d> ah....good point
[10:17] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: Should someone register our team for it?
[10:17] <gorilla> Octatron: you really need a separate corner or room.
[10:18] <jaddi27> the other problem is the distance that some would have to travel, because a lot of things that can be done as a jam can involve the entire team
[10:18] <sagaci> [ACTION] sagaci to email list in re: translation jam for 11.10
[10:18] <sagaci> or is that a chair only thing... i guess so
[10:18] <head_victim> action is chair only, idea is everyone.
[10:19] <jaddi27> [ACTION] sagaci to email list in re: translation jam for 11.10
[10:19] <MootBot> ACTION received:  sagaci to email list in re: translation jam for 11.10
[10:19] <benonsoftware> So any over ideas for Jams?
[10:19] <jaddi27> benonsoftware: I think we will register for the jam a bit later, after we have finalised more of the events we are going to hold
[10:19] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: Sure thing
[10:19] <sagaci> leads onto my point about an install jam
[10:20] <benonsoftware> sagaci: Sounds fun
[10:20] <head_victim> sagaci: I like the idea of an install jam and would LOVE to combine it with SFD events around the country.
[10:20] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Remote Installation Jam for Beta 1 - Joel Pickett
[10:20] <MootBot> New Topic:  Remote Installation Jam for Beta 1 - Joel Pickett
[10:21] <sagaci> head_victim, are you referring to installfests or ubuntu-install looking-for-bugs jam
[10:21]  * benonsoftware Will be a minute
[10:21] <jaddi27> just logging it to make it easier to find in the minutes
[10:21] <head_victim> sagaci: oh so you mean a testing install jam?
[10:21] <gorilla> head_victim: regarding SFD, LUV (Linux Users of Victoria) have a comittee meeting tomorrow to decide that Melbourne is doing for SFD.
[10:21] <gorilla> s/that/what/
[10:22] <Octatron> perhaps we need to take a different tack with this and all buy prepaid internet sticks for the location?
[10:22] <sagaci> head_victim, yep
[10:22] <sagaci> only need a couple to make it worthwhile
[10:22]  * benonsoftware is back sorry
[10:23] <head_victim> gorilla: let me know if they want me to try for some CDs
[10:23] <gorilla> head_victim: will do.
[10:23] <head_victim> (or if you have spares from 10.10 still feel free to use them)
[10:24] <sagaci> it's probably something that need to go to the mailing list, since I'll be able to consult about availability and security for my machine :3
[10:24] <mrshr3d> Octatron: For Brisbane I could probably organise to use a conference room with wi-fi access (would have to run it by Office Manager first), I work in the CBD.
[10:25] <benonsoftware> Question: Should we choose a overall theme for the Jam?
[10:25] <head_victim> benonsoftware: the overall theme is Ubuntu.
[10:25] <Octatron> mrshr3d: sounds good, it's be good if somewhere could cater to us in return for advertising or the consistent purchase of food and drink
[10:26] <head_victim> My suggestion is if people are volunteering to run jams to edit wiki pages in the /Projects section (reuse old ones if possible) and then mail the list.
[10:26] <benonsoftware> head_victim: I mean say a installation type theme so I could do a docs one with installing
[10:26] <benonsoftware> head_victim: Ok. (About /Projects)
[10:26] <head_victim> benonsoftware: each jam is different, the translation jam is about translations, installation jams are about installations, bug jams are about bugs, etc.
[10:26] <benonsoftware> head_victim: Got it
[10:26] <jaddi27> seeing as we are getting into the meeting, is there anything else before I move to the next topic?
[10:27] <benonsoftware> Yeah
[10:27] <mrshr3d> Octatron: didn't think that thru.... weekends are access card entry only anyway
[10:27] <benonsoftware> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuGlobalJam/LucidTrainingLogs/HowToRunAJam-2010-03-10
[10:27] <benonsoftware> That would be a good guide on how to run a Jam
[10:27] <head_victim> Tis ok, I think public venues are better so that we can try and garner public interaction.
[10:27]  * gorilla muses and propping open doors is a pain.. bad idea also.
[10:27] <sagaci> head_victim, install jams would be good too but I'd have to hold an ubuntu hour before that kind of commitment
[10:28] <head_victim> sagaci: yep, hence why I think trying to tie into SFD is a good way of cross promotion
[10:28] <benonsoftware> If my internet cuts out sorry.
[10:28] <mrshr3d> sorry to sound ignorant, what is SFD?
[10:29] <Octatron> Surely there are businesses that would find in their best interests to host us as a group every once in a while
[10:29] <head_victim> Software Freedom Day, sorry, I should have said that to start with.
[10:29] <gorilla> mrshr3d: software freedome day.
[10:29] <mrshr3d> thx
[10:29] <Octatron> Other than that prepaid internet would at least mean we need a venue
[10:30] <benonsoftware> Octatron: Local community centre's are a good place
[10:30]  * sagaci is brb in 5
[10:30] <benonsoftware> Power points etc.
[10:30] <head_victim> [IDEA] Create a thread for each jam on the mailing list and organise them on the wiki
[10:30] <MootBot> IDEA received:  Create a thread for each jam on the mailing list and organise them on the wiki
[10:30] <gorilla> benonsoftware: they can be booked out by regaulr groups.. and may cost.
[10:30] <head_victim> Next up?
[10:30] <jaddi27> I think we should aim to move on to the next topic now
[10:31] <benonsoftware> New users I think
[10:31] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Induction for new members - Clinton Hunter
[10:31] <MootBot> New Topic:  Induction for new members - Clinton Hunter
[10:31] <head_victim> jaddi27: good idea, further conversation should go to the ML, there's a full roster of topics tonight.
[10:31] <jellyware> hang on.  what happened to Update of Local CD Mailout Service
[10:31] <benonsoftware> Is mrshr3d here?
[10:31] <jellyware> point 3
[10:31] <mrshr3d> Yeah thought it would be good to have something formal around that, or is ad-hoc preferred?
[10:32] <jaddi27> jellyware: that is point 4
[10:32] <mrshr3d> ie have a session on translating...I certainly have no idea how that works at present
[10:32] <jellyware> cool.  thanks
[10:33] <head_victim> mrshr3d: I think it's a good idea, but we're already halfway through the hour and no where near half way on the topic list, would new users be comfortable posting to the mailin glist?
[10:33] <jaddi27> mrshr3d: I guess we could formalise the structure a bit more
[10:33] <head_victim> Or do you mean in general?
[10:33] <benonsoftware> Well I'm a 2 month old member.For me the list is easy
[10:34] <head_victim> Because if you just want to formalise the process a bit more I'd suggest having a play with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AustralianTeam/Members/NewMembers and see what you come up with
[10:34] <mrshr3d> I've signed up for the mailing list but haven't posted on it.
[10:35]  * blahdeblah waves hi - sorry i'm late
[10:35] <jaddi27> We might be able to improve the website to detail what is available to new members
[10:35] <jaddi27> Even if it is just a mimic of the wiki page
[10:35] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: Good idea
[10:36] <somethinginteres> I'm wondering if there's a specific need for the site to be in its current form rather than just directing to the wiki?
[10:36] <head_victim> jaddi27: we could add it to the contact us link or create a different join us link that just points to it.
[10:37] <benonsoftware> somethinginteres: One word. Planet :)
[10:37] <mrshr3d> maybe listing activities members can help out with and if they need to know how, ask in the mailing list or on IRC?
[10:37] <head_victim> somethinginteres: the idea of the site is to post news and events. The idea of the wiki is to collaborate and organise.
[10:37] <head_victim> The current issue with the website is the lack of contributed content (which btw, anyone can add to, just need to ping an admin to spellcheck and approve)
[10:37] <jaddi27> head_victim: I think we could make a new Join Us link on the header - nice and prominent
[10:38] <blahdeblah> head_victim: Don't forget its other purposes: showing off our great web design skills and Canonical's speedy Drupal upgrade policy ;-)
[10:38] <head_victim> blahdeblah: yeah :/ It's being worked on still with no estimated time of completion yet.
[10:39] <somethinginteres> speaking from just my personal experience it actually took me a long time to find the wiki. I think given the usefulness of the info it contains it could be more visable somehow.. just thinking aloud here.
[10:39] <head_victim> Ok mrshr3d so if we completed the detail on the wiki and made it more prominent that would suit?
[10:39] <benonsoftware> head_victim: To be honest I got lost when I wanted to join
[10:39] <mrshr3d> sounds good, the simpler the better I think :-)
[10:39] <blahdeblah> somethinginteres: So at least two links in the header of the web site isn't enough?
[10:39] <somethinginteres> the other thing is some people may not even understand what a wiki is
[10:40] <somethinginteres> blahdeblah: evidently not. When I first discovered the site I "got lost" as it were. I wasn't aware of what the wiki contained, wasn't aware that it was the meat of content for e.g.
[10:40] <benonsoftware> Anything else?
[10:41] <head_victim> blahdeblah: I might rejig the description a tiny bit on the welcome bar of the website.
[10:41] <jaddi27> [ACTION] Website to be updated to have a link for new members
[10:41] <MootBot> ACTION received:  Website to be updated to have a link for new members
[10:41] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Update of Local CD Mailout Service - jellyware
[10:41] <MootBot> New Topic:  Update of Local CD Mailout Service - jellyware
[10:42] <jellyware> the aussie cd mailout is still ticking along.  $3/disc, posted anywhere in australia.  I have just updated ubuntu.net.au to wordpress
[10:42] <benonsoftware> Has anyone ordered from this yet?
[10:42] <blahdeblah> somethinginteres: Was http://www.ubuntu.org.au/node/11 there when you started looking? head_victim and i updated it a few months back to make it clearer
[10:42] <benonsoftware> jellyware: Do you run it?
[10:42] <jellyware> I get an order every day or two...
[10:42] <jellyware> benonsoftware, yes, I run this
[10:42] <benonsoftware> jellyware: Well done!
[10:42] <jellyware> thanks
[10:43] <fabricator4> Benonsoftware: I got Natty through the mailout
[10:43] <benonsoftware> jellyware: Love that it is using WordPress
[10:43] <fabricator4> Great service
[10:43] <jellyware> its my contribution since I'm no good with the tech stuff
[10:43] <somethinginteres> blahdeblah: no I don't believe it was.
[10:43] <head_victim> jellyware: looks nice
[10:43] <head_victim> blahdeblah: it's there for me
[10:43] <jellyware> I need to clean up the working I know...
[10:44] <jellyware> thats all I wanted to say
[10:44] <head_victim> Cool, keep up the great work
[10:44] <sagaci> jellyware, need any help?
[10:45] <somethinginteres> jellyware: what's the "open disc dvd"?
[10:45] <benonsoftware> somethinginteres: I think it has free open source Windows software if I'm not mistaken
[10:45] <jellyware> somethinginteres, you can google it.  its basically edubuntu with a bunch of open source apps for windows users so they can dip their toes
[10:46] <head_victim> somethinginteres: good point though, maybe include a link to the homepage for the project as well?
[10:46] <benonsoftware> jellyware: Weill that's great
[10:46] <somethinginteres> jellyware: ah, cool!
[10:46] <jellyware> sagaci, send me an email.  I think I'm ok at the moment but I can keep you in mind.  thanks
[10:46] <head_victim> sorry that was for jellyware
[10:46] <somethinginteres> head_victim: yeah. I think that'd be a good idea
[10:46] <somethinginteres> head_victim: woops :)
[10:46] <jellyware> will do head_victim
[10:47] <head_victim> Sweet, half way through the list :)
[10:47]  * gorilla looks at clock and realise eek!
[10:47] <sagaci> jellyware, i'd be more inclined to help for the 12.04 LTS cycle, due to demand, etc
[10:47] <somethinginteres> maybe a link to the AU loco on there too?
[10:47] <benonsoftware> head_victim: Knw the hard half
[10:47] <jaddi27> Ok. any further points relating to the CD mailout service?
[10:47] <jellyware> sure somethinginteres
[10:47] <jellyware> I have to do some cleaning up
[10:48] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Find more events to go to - Clinton Hunter
[10:48] <MootBot> New Topic:  Find more events to go to - Clinton Hunter
[10:48] <mrshr3d> Being aware of the time happy to skip this until next month.
[10:48] <mrshr3d> plus I have already had one topic of mine discussed tonight don't want to be greedy.
[10:48] <jaddi27> Yes, that is a good idea.
[10:48] <jaddi27> [ACTION] Move these topics to the next meeting
[10:48] <benonsoftware> I can skip mine
[10:48] <MootBot> ACTION received:  Move these topics to the next meeting
[10:49] <head_victim> mrshr3d: cool, also, feel free to ask on the mailing list
[10:49] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Mission Statement - Chris
[10:49] <MootBot> New Topic:  Mission Statement - Chris
[10:49] <jaddi27> apologies for not using IRC nicks in topics - I am just copying them from l.u.c
[10:49] <fabricator4> [LINK]https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AustralianTeam/MissionStatement
[10:49] <MootBot> LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AustralianTeam/MissionStatement
[10:49] <gorilla> Is there a point of having one? /devil advocat.
[10:49] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: That's fine
[10:49] <head_victim> I like the idea of updating the mission statement.
[10:50] <fabricator4> I think it would be a good idea to update the mission statement
[10:50] <blahdeblah> gorilla++
[10:50] <head_victim> I think we could probably include the next topic in the same discussion as I don't see formal goals working well but if we put general goals into the mission statement it would cover both bases.
[10:50] <blahdeblah> Keep up the good work, gorilla :-P
[10:50] <fabricator4> When I was looking at the loco originally it wasn't clear what the loco did or how it worked
[10:50] <jaddi27> head_victim: I agree with that
[10:50] <head_victim> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AustralianTeam
[10:50] <benonsoftware> Hold on while I find the UF link
[10:51] <head_victim> THe first paragraph of that page is what I call "the mission statement" now
[10:51] <gorilla> blahdeblah: you can stop now. :-)
[10:51] <head_victim> I'm all for tweaking that to suit our needs better and including it on the website if that helps?
[10:51] <benonsoftware> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1787200 Ubuntu Forms Post
[10:51] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1787200 Ubuntu Forms Post
[10:52] <fabricator4> headvictim: I deliberately made them separate topics so as not to confuse the issue.  I didn't think the mission statement should get buried under discussions about team goals etc.
[10:52] <head_victim> fabricator4: ah ok, I just don't see how we can be accountable for goals and if we're not accountable how can we set them.
[10:52] <gorilla> head_victim: Remove the first sentence as it doesn't really adding anything. we know is a home page
[10:53] <head_victim> gorilla: I think it's a copy/paste of the website heading as well
[10:53] <gorilla> head_victim: oh :-/
[10:53] <head_victim> Maybe by changing them to suit the medium they're on we can reduce confusion of what the wiki and website are for.
[10:53] <head_victim> [IDEA] Make the wiki welcome more wiki specific
[10:53] <MootBot> IDEA received:  Make the wiki welcome more wiki specific
[10:54] <jaddi27> I second that idea. I think that will remove a lot of confusion that people experience
[10:54] <fabricator4> Is it possible to make the Mission statment heading part of the website menu.
[10:54] <benonsoftware> fabricator4: I think it is
[10:54] <head_victim> fabricator4: our current "mission statement" already is there
[10:55] <jaddi27> fabricator4: Do you mean add a link to Mission Statement?
[10:55] <head_victim> So it's more updating the current one if we feel the need.
[10:55] <fabricator4> head_victim: it's on the first page, but it's not part of the menu/header.  I think it should have it's own page.
[10:55] <fabricator4> jaddi27: yes I mean a link :-)
[10:56] <jaddi27> I think that there are a few things that should be made clearer on the website that will happen with the new template
[10:56] <head_victim> fabricator4: ah ok, well I think the length of it will determine that. If it's only a sentence or so it would seem odd on it's own page, but if it becomes a 2 paragraph affair I see your point
[10:57] <jaddi27> Can we work out what we would like to do with the mission statement?
[10:57] <head_victim> I don't recall, has it made the mailing list yet?
[10:58] <benonsoftware> head_victim: Yeah. Well I'm sure it has
[10:58] <fabricator4> I think kyphi had some good ideas which were posted to the discussion page.
[10:59] <head_victim> Cool, well I personally prefer to keep it short enough to be a sentence or two so if I go through the wiki page, pull out the feedback from people and post to the list for objections would that be a good way to decide on it?
[10:59] <jaddi27> yes, I think that would be a good way to go
[10:59] <fabricator4> sure, if that's the way to do.  Do we have to decide tonight after all?
[10:59] <benonsoftware> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-au/2011-June/007263.html Here is the mailing list subject
[11:00] <benonsoftware> [LINK] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-au/2011-June/007263.html
[11:00] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-au/2011-June/007263.html
[11:00] <fabricator4> I'm happy to re-open this on the mailing list and pull a few things together...
[11:00] <jaddi27> [ACTION] head_victim to work out a mission statement based on feedback, and post to the mailing list
[11:00] <MootBot> ACTION received:  head_victim to work out a mission statement based on feedback, and post to the mailing list
[11:00] <benonsoftware> fabricator4: Sure thing. Sounds good
[11:01] <fabricator4> Thanks :-)
[11:01] <jaddi27> Take that action to mean head_victim and fabricator4 as the people working on it then
[11:02] <fabricator4> Sure.  headvictim?
[11:02] <jaddi27> I would like to move on to the next topic now, to get finished
[11:02] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Declaration of Goals - Chris
[11:02] <MootBot> New Topic:  Declaration of Goals - Chris
[11:02] <fabricator4> This one is not so clear to me
[11:02] <fabricator4> Setting goals it a good thing, and the idea came of the previous discussion
[11:02] <benonsoftware> I think we should have say a 12 month goal.
[11:02] <head_victim> fabricator4: I'll collate the feedback from the wiki and post to the list :)
[11:03] <fabricator4> If we set goals they have to be achievable, but how at the goals decided on?
[11:04] <benonsoftware> fabricator4: Team?
[11:04] <head_victim> To me the issue is if we set easy goals there is no challenge, if we set hard ones and don't reach them what happens then?
[11:04] <jaddi27> I think that it could be difficult to measure what we have achieved with the goals
[11:04] <benonsoftware> head_victim: Then we should break the goals gone
[11:04] <head_victim> I think if we freshen the mission statement and use that as our rolling goal that would work to a similar effect
[11:05] <fabricator4> If we set easy goals and achieve them, then we can set harder ones next time.
[11:05] <mrshr3d> I think it is hard to set "achievable"  goals...in that our goals are ongoing, (e.g.  promote Ubuntu and help new users with Ubuntu)
[11:05] <fabricator4> mrshr3d: shouldn't that be part of the mission statement?
[11:05] <somethinginteres> mrshr3d: I agree
[11:05] <head_victim> The main issue we have is the team is voluntary and constantly changing with people's abilities fluctuating with other commitments.
[11:06] <jaddi27> I can see why you would want a list of goals, but after reading some of the mission statements, they sort of include the goals
[11:06] <gorilla> Setting goals could make it difficult to achive someting that is not aligned with the agreed goals.
[11:06] <benonsoftware> Just to let you know I have to go soon
[11:06] <gorilla> in that they can be used to reject an otherwise idea becuae it's not a goal for the next 12 months or whatever the period is.
[11:07] <mrshr3d> it kind of blurs the distinction for sure.  I guess it could be measured in some way - how many users have quit Windows and are Ubuntu through our efforts this year.
[11:07] <head_victim> I see our current goal as becoming reapproved, not for the sake of just being "official" again but reapproval in itself shows an improvement in team performance.
[11:07] <head_victim> mrshr3d: how do you measure that goal?
[11:07] <fabricator4> gorilla: I agree... kind of.
[11:08] <fabricator4> h_v: if you get approval , then you achieved the goal?
[11:09] <jaddi27> I think that it would partially achieve the goal, because we have to continue to keep the status
[11:09] <mrshr3d> head_victim: exactly, I think for a team like it is hard to set goals that are measurable
[11:09] <head_victim> mrshr3d: ah ok, sorry I thought you were suggesting an example goal.
[11:09] <fabricator4> Benonsoftware's idea of a yearly goal isn't so bad, lookinglike this...
[11:10] <benonsoftware> fabricator4: well that's what we do in school :)
[11:10] <fabricator4> :-)
[11:10] <jaddi27> I think there are always mini-goals along the way
[11:10] <head_victim> The problem is finding something measurable that is relevant.
[11:10] <benonsoftware> I have to go in 5 minutes
[11:10] <head_victim> If people can come up with something relevant and measurable I'm all ears.
[11:10] <jaddi27> eg. Translations should be completed by the end of the year, hopefully by oneiric release
[11:10] <fabricator4> head_victim: I agree, and it's the reason I had some misgivings about proposing it.
[11:11] <benonsoftware> head_victim: I just finished completing one templatie for translations. Maybe all of them by 12.04
[11:11] <jaddi27> my idea would be to fix up the mission statement to make it clearer what we are trying to achieve as a team, and then assess whether or not we will need further goals to keep us on track
[11:12] <fabricator4> jaddi27: agreed
[11:12] <head_victim> jaddi27: That's a good way to go I think. I'll collate the mission statement ideas, email the team and open it for discussion.
[11:12] <gorilla> jaddi27: good idea.
[11:12] <benonsoftware> jaddi27: I have to go now. Any other things I must be here for?
[11:12] <head_victim> benonsoftware: you had the last topic
[11:12] <gorilla> oop
[11:12] <gorilla> s
[11:12] <jaddi27> [TOPIC] Kubuntu - Benny
[11:12] <MootBot> New Topic:  Kubuntu - Benny
[11:13] <jaddi27> just quickly for benonsoftware
[11:13] <benonsoftware> Basicly I was wondering what is the support for Kubuntu in AU?
[11:13] <head_victim> Just quickly, I don't see this as a separate thing, we displayed Kubuntu, Lubuntu and Ubuntu all together at LCA
[11:13]  * gorilla confirms that one.
[11:13] <mrshr3d> Is the main difference just KDE rather than Gnome/Unity?
[11:13] <benonsoftware> Sorry have to go
[11:13] <jaddi27> yes
[11:13] <head_victim> Just because we're "UbuntuAU" doesn't mean lots of people don't use Kubuntu
[11:14] <gorilla> benonsoftware: you can grab the transscipt later one.
[11:14] <jaddi27> maybe we can make that clearer on the wiki and website
[11:14] <jaddi27> well I think that will be all for the meeting
[11:14] <gorilla> perhaps a straw poll could be a good idea also.
[11:14] <head_victim> gorilla: feel free to start one on the ML :)
[11:14] <jaddi27> anything else that should be discussed now?
[11:15] <head_victim> gorilla: or forum
[11:15] <jaddi27> seems to be nothing else
[11:15] <head_victim> jaddi27: I'm out of ideas :) I think you've done a good job with the long list of topics we had to cover.
[11:15] <gorilla> head_victim: forum then :-)
[11:15] <jaddi27> Thanks everyone for attending the meeting. We have got a lot discussed in the time we had
[11:16] <jaddi27> #endmeeting
[11:16] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 06:16.
[11:16] <gorilla> jaddi27: well done on keeping the meeting moving :-)
[11:16] <fabricator4> Thanks all.
[11:16] <head_victim> Next one is 14/08, same time :)
[11:16] <jaddi27> gorilla: Thanks. It was certainly an interesting meeting to do for a first meeting as chair
[11:17] <jaddi27> I will update the wiki to have the next meeting date, and send an email out with the link to the new agenda
[11:18] <head_victim> jaddi27: nice work :)
[11:18] <head_victim> It's been good to get the help from yourself and others with the team basics.
[11:18] <jaddi27> head_victim: I am happy to help out with that
[11:19] <head_victim> When you've emailed the list the meeting details I'll tweet/dent it.
[11:19] <head_victim> You've bookmarked the "todolist" page?
[11:19] <jaddi27> I think I have it somewhere there
[11:20] <head_victim> Cool, makes it easy to figure out what needs doing.  I'll take care of the topic when the next meeting info is posted to loco.u.c as well
[11:20] <jaddi27> head_victim: On the l.u.c page for ubuntu-au, have you had a look at the new timezone options?
[11:20] <head_victim> jaddi27: yeah, I'm not sure what to do with that.
[11:21] <jaddi27> what options are there for the overall team settings?
[11:21] <head_victim> It's all event/meeting specific I believe
[11:21] <jaddi27> Ok. I was not sure if was per team as well as per event/meeting
[11:22] <head_victim> Just confirming now.
[11:22] <head_victim> Ahh I CAN set a default timezone
[11:22] <head_victim> But I'm not sure I should change it from UTC?
[11:22] <jaddi27> I think it might be better changing it to AEST, seeing as we advertise the time in that timezone
[11:23] <jaddi27> and it does say on the meeting page what timezone the event/meeting is in now, so it is not as confusing
[11:23] <head_victim> Ok, anyone here from the western half of AU to make sure we wont offend you doing that?
[11:24] <head_victim> gorilla: from memory you're in SA?
[11:24] <gorilla> head_victim: nope. Melbourne.
[11:24] <head_victim> Hm, sorry, probably just offended you with that :P
[11:24] <gorilla> I was in SA for a number of years but wasn't from there originally either.
[11:25] <gorilla> you were partly right ;-)
[11:25] <head_victim> Ah, maybe it was somethinginteres
[11:25] <somethinginteres> head_victim: yep :D
[11:25] <gorilla> go ahead.. see who becomes offended :-D
[11:25] <head_victim> As a SA'er would you be overly offended if we advertised team events in UTC+10 ?
[11:25] <head_victim> Or is it something you're used to?
[11:26] <somethinginteres> head_victim: I am used to converting timezones, so that's no worries, as long as the timezone is indicated it's no problem.
[11:26] <head_victim> somethinginteres: ok, just don't want people feeling left out
[11:27] <head_victim> And always living in Brisbane I'm not sure what the TZ issue is like for others.
[11:27] <jaddi27> somethinginteres: Are you on Facebook, and if yes, are you a member of the Ubuntu Australia group?
[11:27] <head_victim> So, next question, UTC+10 or Sydney/Melbourne time?
[11:27] <somethinginteres> jaddi27: yes and yes
[11:27] <head_victim> As there is a slight difference, in daylight savings.
[11:27] <jaddi27> What time does it list for the meeting tonight on your browser?
[11:27] <fabricator4> UTC+10
[11:27] <jaddi27> on facebook
[11:29] <jaddi27> head_victim: UTC+10
[11:29] <head_victim> jaddi27: done
[11:29] <mrshr3d> If you write it as AEST (UTC+10)   and  AEDST (UTC+11) in summer it would avoid any confusion
[11:30] <head_victim> It's set at UTC+10, it's an issue every year when daylight savings rolls around :/
[11:30] <jaddi27> mrshr3d: from memory, in the past we have used AEST for meeting times during the daylight saving time
[11:30] <gorilla> jaddi27: that's my recollection also.
[11:30] <head_victim> jaddi27: can you double check the August meeting on the loco.u.c now as playing with the settings may have changed it
[11:31]  * gorilla thinks AU has too many timezones!
[11:31] <head_victim> I think we've actually done both.
[11:31] <head_victim> gorilla: I concur. We should all move to BRISBANE time :)
[11:31] <gorilla> head_victim: better idea than everyone moving to Brisbane :-P
[11:31]  * mrshr3d thinks Daylight Savings is a hack for something that isn't broken :-)
[11:31] <fabricator4> h_v: Brisbane time is the only correct time :-)
[11:32] <head_victim> gorilla: yeah, you can stay there, just follow our rules :P
[11:33] <jaddi27> http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-au/130/detail/
[11:33] <jaddi27> The new timezone data is set now
[11:33] <gorilla> head_victim: like defending the merits of drinking XXXX?
[11:33] <jaddi27> I think it looks alright
[11:33] <head_victim> jaddi27: yeah no idea what the -1000 on the end is
[11:34] <gorilla> head_victim: offset without the :
[11:34] <head_victim> But looks ok
[11:34] <jaddi27> the 1000 means 10 hours
[11:34] <fabricator4> Yeah, why does it say : GMT+10 (-1000)
[11:34] <jaddi27> but I can't remember why the '-' is there
[11:34] <fabricator4> Should be +1000 then
[11:34] <head_victim> No idea, as long as it works.
[11:35] <gorilla> yeah.. I reckon that someone has stuffed up :-)
[11:35] <jaddi27> That would make sense, but I am fairly sure I have seen it like that before. I will look into it
[11:35] <head_victim> Now I just need to assimilate the calendar to my google account and I'm set
[11:35] <fabricator4> gorilla: someone on the other side of the world has stuffed up.
[11:36] <gorilla> fabricator4: usually the case ;-)
[11:36] <fabricator4> :-)
[11:36] <head_victim> Is http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-au/ical the best link to get meetings AND events?
[11:36] <head_victim> (I just right clicked ont he ical feed and selected copy link)
[11:37] <mrshr3d> or is it saying to convert it  back to GMT,  subtract 10 hours?
[11:37] <jaddi27> I think it might be something like that. I will look through the code to find what they are doing
[11:38] <jaddi27> head_victim: Yes, I am fairly sure that is the right one
[11:38] <fabricator4> mrshr3e; seems redudant
[11:38] <gorilla> fabricator4: perhaps it's to cater for the maths challenged :-P
[11:39] <head_victim> jaddi27: when I add it to google it thinks it's UTC time not _10
[11:39] <jaddi27> That means they have not added in the proper data for ical creation with their timezone update
[11:39] <jaddi27> I will look at it again and try to get them to fix i
[11:40] <head_victim> Google or loco.u?
[11:43] <gorilla> google calendar is showing that the meeting will be at 4PM tomorrow.
[11:43] <jaddi27> head_victim: loco.u might have to be fixed
[11:44] <jaddi27> still looking at the code
[11:47] <head_victim> jaddi27: cool, they just pushed a new version so I'm sure patches welcome ;)
[11:48] <head_victim> Not that I could ever patch anything
[11:52] <head_victim> If you're ever looking for them they hang in -community and -website
[11:54] <head_victim> jaddi27: could just take some time to update and refresh since I've only jsut changed it from UTC ?
[11:54] <jaddi27> I guess it could
[11:54] <jaddi27> the main issue could be in their code
[11:55] <jaddi27> if it is setting the ical feed to be UTC, and the event times do not have timezone data with them, then the ical feed will not be correct
[11:55] <head_victim> And I can't adjust the TZ in the google calendar after adding it either.
[11:55] <jaddi27> i am just trying to find out if they are including timezone data in the start and end times for the ical
[11:56] <jaddi27> no, that is one annoying feature of google calendar
[11:56] <jaddi27> however, i can't do that in thunderbird either, so it is not just google
[11:56] <head_victim> Maybe it's more complex then we think
[11:57] <head_victim> What about we do set it to UTC then so that everyone's calendars auto update to reflect whatever their local is set to?
[11:57] <jaddi27> yes and no. i think if the ical feed is fixed up a bit, it should work better, but i just have to work out what they have in their code
[11:57] <head_victim> Ok I'll stop pestering, let me know if I can be useful in the process
[11:57] <jaddi27> maybe at the moment that would be easiest. i just need more time than tonight to work out how to fix it
[11:58] <jaddi27> you are not pestering - those questions are perfectly fine
[11:58] <head_victim> Ok so I'm setting back to UTC for now?
[11:59]  * gorilla goes off to check the calendar on his web site.
[12:00] <sagaci> how'd the end of the meeting go
[12:01] <gorilla> hey, wb sagaci. the meeting went well.
[12:01] <head_victim> sagaci: pretty good
[12:02] <jaddi27> yes, set it back to UTC
[12:02] <head_victim> jaddi27: done :)
[12:03] <head_victim> Hah it's still wrong
[12:03] <head_victim> Maybe it just takes a while to update the settings
[12:04] <jaddi27> it might have to be imported again
[12:04] <head_victim> Nah I removed it and readded it
[12:04] <fabricator4> 06:00 - 07:15 UTC (+0000)  Isn't that 4PM?
[12:05] <head_victim> It was showing up for me as 1600 in both occasions a day late
[12:06] <jaddi27> i just have to change it again
[12:06] <jaddi27> i wonder if it was set to GMT-10?
[12:06] <head_victim> Possible
[12:06] <head_victim> That would be right then and the -1000 would make sense?
[12:06] <gorilla> a lot of systems will cache ical files.
[12:07] <head_victim> But we've never ahd it set to -10 as far as I know
[12:08]  * gorilla goes off to get dinner.
[12:08] <jaddi27> no, i didn't think so
[12:08] <gorilla> Night All
[12:08] <head_victim> Night gorilla
[12:08] <jaddi27> night gorilla
[12:08] <fabricator4> Goodnight
[12:08] <head_victim> jaddi27: how about +10 and we leave it a day to settle?
[12:08] <jaddi27> I think leave it on UTC, and I will look through the code to find what is happening
[12:09] <head_victim> No worries
[12:10] <jaddi27> head_victim: when will the meeting log come up on http://www.novarata.net/mootbot/?
[12:10] <jaddi27> I thought it was fairly quick last time
[12:11] <head_victim> I think it's a cron script so could be an hour or two
[12:12] <jaddi27> ok
[12:12] <jaddi27> the translations are going well - we are down to 113781 strings in natty now
[12:12] <head_victim> Yeah you and sagaci  are really leading the charge
[12:13] <sagaci> 69.2%
[12:13] <jaddi27> I didn't know anything about how to do it until a couple of weeks ago
[12:14] <jaddi27> a lot easier than I thought it would be
[12:14] <head_victim> Hah nice, yeah it's not hard at all if you use rosetta
[12:15] <sagaci> there will be bugs
[12:15] <head_victim> sagaci: yep but it seems you've worked out how to fix them already
[12:16] <jaddi27> bugs in the translations?
[12:16] <jaddi27> and how do you fix them?
[12:17] <head_victim> Well I'm off for a while, thanks for chairing tonigiht jaddi27 and good to see you and sagaci working well together :)
[12:17] <sagaci> jaddi27, like if the original string has a typo, etc
[12:17] <jaddi27> That's fine. It is looking like the team is getting more on track now
[12:18] <sagaci> head_victim, just quickly, any news on the reapproval
[12:20] <sagaci> obv not and any news would be on the mailing list already, i think
[12:22] <jaddi27> sagaci: Have you ever got the message 'There are 2 errors in the translations you provided. Please correct them before continuing.'? Do you know what it means?
[12:23] <sagaci> nope...?
[12:24] <jaddi27> I cannot see anything that I have to do, so it is a bit odd
[12:25] <jaddi27> I think we are doing the same package
[12:25] <jaddi27> that must be where the error came from
[12:26] <sagaci> oneiric is at 161000
[12:26] <sagaci> but that will drop once the focus is shifted to oneiric
[12:26] <sagaci> still probably +20,000 strings or so
[12:26] <jaddi27> yes
[12:27] <sagaci> i'd like it done by 12.04, which is still a long way to go but the more we do sooner, means we don't have to jam it in later
[12:27] <sagaci> excuse the pun
[12:29] <jaddi27> i plan on keeping on working on it, but might do not as much during uni
[12:30] <sagaci> you're on sem break?
[12:31] <jaddi27> yes, at the moment
[12:31] <jaddi27> go back on july 25
[12:32] <sagaci> two weeks
[12:34] <jaddi27> yep
[12:34] <sagaci> ah well, at least most of the main packages ordinary users would use are done
[12:35] <jaddi27> yes, that is good
[12:35] <jaddi27> where are firefox and chromium translated?
[12:35] <sagaci> firefox has been done
[12:36] <jaddi27> i just thought i read somewhere saying that firefox and thunderbird are not translated through rosetta
[12:36] <jaddi27> is that right, or am i mixed up a bit?
[12:38] <head_victim> sagaci: no news, the only thing I've had is an acknowledgement that it's been logged
[12:38]  * head_victim disappears again
[12:38]  * sagaci sees the magic smoke
[12:39] <sagaci> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/firefox/+pots/firefox
[12:40] <sagaci> not 100% sure about chromium-browser
[12:40] <sagaci> i need to shoot an email to get lp-en_AU registered as a proper team
[12:44] <jaddi27> it is not a proper team at the moment?
[12:45] <sagaci> not the lp translators team for en_AU, might be getting confused with the ubuntu-au translation team
[12:45] <sagaci> i know, confusing
[12:46] <jaddi27> right
[12:47] <jaddi27> i thought there were two teams
[12:47] <jaddi27> makes sense now
[12:52] <jaddi27> i will be off now
[12:52] <jaddi27> night
[12:53] <sagaci> night
[13:27] <ikt> how did the meeting go?
[13:54] <ikt> sagaci, you there?
[13:55] <ikt> or even head_victim ?
[14:41] <head_victim> ikt: yeah I"m here now. Went well, there should be an email on the list about it soonish
[14:44] <ikt> sweet
[14:44] <ikt> did you want a google plus invite?
[14:45] <ikt> doesn't matter, just tried to share an invite with your gmail address
[14:45] <ikt> laters :)
[14:46] <head_victim> Heh no worries, just add me mate
[14:46] <head_victim> I gotta jet myself, hopefully the email should be tthere in the next day or so


[09:59] <satellit__> dfarning_laptop: any ideas when USR may get updated?
[10:00] <dfarning_laptop> satellit__ it is getting updated daily:)
[10:01] <satellit__> where? I am looking in your sunjammer location is it somewhere else? (for VB)
[10:02] <dfarning_laptop> right now it is still too broken to advertise but you can check out https://launchpad.net/~sugarteam/+archive/ppa
[10:03] <satellit__> ok is there a virtual box version there?
[10:04] <dfarning_laptop> now, we are focusing on the basics first. the most recent isos are at http://<IP_ADDRESS>/seeta/output/
[10:05] <satellit__> ok thanks will try them for testing  I know you have been very busy elsewhere  : )
[10:06] <dfarning_laptop> I don't think yesterday's build even works:(  I'll let you know when we have something worth testing
[10:07] <satellit__> thanks will wait then....
[10:07] <satellit__> have you seen fgrose's 3 scripts for self replicating live usb?
[10:07] <satellit__> it works
[10:08] <dfarning_laptop> thanks I appreciate your offer.
[10:08] <satellit__> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Category_talk:Live_USB#Soas_stick_that_writes_live_USB.27s
[10:08] <satellit__> neat
[10:09] <dfarning_laptop> satellit__, i briefly read the email thread.  But I get distracted by interesting projects.  So, I am keeping my head down working on foundations of USR.
[10:10] <satellit__> ok I sent wrong link. but I have a 2GB soas B that reproduces itself after customization
[10:10] <satellit__> s/USB
[10:11] <dfarning_laptop> Very nice sounds like steady progress....
[10:11] <satellit__> http://people.sugarlabs.org/Tgillard/Custom-Spin-20100405-README-FIRST.txt
[10:12] <dfarning_laptop> satellit__, I also like that several people besides the orginal core group are making interesting and useful contributions.
[10:13] <satellit_> : ) let you go....
[10:14] <dfarning_laptop> thanks for every thing.  I hope we have a useful and interesting USR soon.
[10:14] <satellit_> can't wait....: ) ubuntu is a major OS It will be great...
[10:15] <satellit_> * on ubuntu 9,04 here on my main PC
[21:32] <satellitgbS-f488> test


[10:08] <Guest3816> Hi
[13:30] <kamil41> Hello!
[13:31] <kamil41> Can i change screen login ?
[13:31] <kamil41> Its possibile?
[13:34] <kamil64> Its possible to change login screen?
[13:36] <diogenes_Vx15> kamil64, on Linux everything is possible.


[11:05] <txomon_> hi, can anyone have a look into bug 928193
[11:05] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 928193 in ns2 (Ubuntu) "ns2/nam error with tcl8.4, doesn't recognise (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/928193
[11:06] <txomon_> I am not very sure if it is about ns2,... but yes it involves somehow it
[11:24] <txomon> so anyone... ?
[11:30] <dlentz> so ns2 is giving an error about tcl8.4, but the package depends on 8.5? odd
[12:56] <txomon> I think I was misunderstood, I meant that It depends on 8.4, and although I have it installed, doesn't recognise the 8.4 and says I just have 8.5
[15:54] <dlentz> If anyone's using precise/12.04, can you check to see if python-dirspec package is installed by default?
[15:54] <dlentz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-ubuntuone/+bug/928317
[15:54] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 928317 in rhythmbox-ubuntuone (Ubuntu) "Rhythmbox-UbuntuOne Plugin Crashes (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[18:25] <krnekhelesh> Hi, I have a question
[18:25] <krnekhelesh> A user reported a bug and I tried reproducing it but couldn't...I asked for more information and marked it incomplete
[18:26] <krnekhelesh> he reported then that the bug is fixed in 12.04 but is still present in 11.10
[18:26] <krnekhelesh> what should I set the status of the bug?
[18:26] <krnekhelesh> should i set it to Fix Released or Confirmed?
[18:34] <s9iper1> krnekhelesh:bug number plz
[18:54] <dlentz> krnekhelesh, it should be marked fix released
[18:59] <krnekhelesh> s9iper1, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/927736
[18:59] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 927736 in unity "Unity freezes when dragging images in the web browsers (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[19:00] <krnekhelesh> I have marked the bug as fix released
[19:00] <krnekhelesh> thank u dlentz
[19:00] <krnekhelesh> s9iper1, I have provided the bug report link
[19:01] <s9iper1> ok
[19:01] <s9iper1> s9iper1: looking
[19:02] <s9iper1> om26er:
[19:02] <s9iper1> ping
[19:02] <s9iper1> ping
[19:02] <s9iper1> its yours
[19:03] <s9iper1> unity
[19:03] <om26er> say what ??
[19:03] <om26er> aha
[19:03] <s9iper1> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/927736
[19:03] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 927736 in unity "Unity freezes when dragging images in the web browsers (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,Fix released]
[19:04] <s9iper1> is its status would be fix released or invalid ..in this case  krnekhelesh is asking
[19:06] <s9iper1> i guess you done well krnekhelesh;
[19:07] <krnekhelesh> thnx
[19:08] <s9iper1> np
[19:08] <s9iper1> i see the history somebody has already answered you
[19:09] <krnekhelesh> yeah, well more opinions the better
[19:17] <krnekhelesh> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/928339
[19:17] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 928339 in unity "'alt+tab' menu has a 1.5 sec of latency (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[19:18] <krnekhelesh> does anybody here feel that the alt-tab takes more time to appear?
[19:18] <krnekhelesh> there is a bug report about this in the link i provided
[19:19] <krnekhelesh> s9iper1 or om26er
[19:26] <s9iper1> ?
[19:26] <krnekhelesh> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/928339
[19:26] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 928339 in unity "'alt+tab' menu has a 1.5 sec of latency (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[19:26] <krnekhelesh> could u check out this bug report
[19:27] <krnekhelesh> do you have a 1.5 sec lag?
[19:28] <s9iper1> here working fine
[19:29] <krnekhelesh> so it is a problem on his comp?
[19:30] <s9iper1> i cant guess or say anything i suggest you talk with somebody in ubuntu-unity channel..i have not to much experience with unity .
[19:31] <krnekhelesh> oh ok
[19:31] <krnekhelesh> thnx anyway for checking it out
[19:31] <s9iper1> np
[20:39] <||cw> I have a bug I'm not sure what package to assign to.  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/928401  the guide says "the kernel" but the link in the guide does not link to any anchors on the page.
[20:39] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 928401 in ubuntu "Cannot boot Oneric installation disk on eBox 3300 (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[20:39] <||cw> if I put "kernel" in the search, it says too many packages.  I don't seem to be able to put anything in there that doens't say too many or no results.
[20:40] <||cw> so, what's the magic keyword for "the kernel" on oneric
[20:47] <yofel> ||cw: kernel bugs are against the "linux" package
[20:48] <||cw> k, expected search to list something, "linux" is too many matches.  I'll just leave it as linux
[20:54]  * yofel wonders where that link was *supposed* to point...
[21:02] <txomon> hi, what means fix commited?
[21:02] <txomon> I would like to learn something about ubuntu packaging progress etc... any link?
[21:11] <txomon> I have read the one in the topic about helpingwithbugs, but don't know how accurate is the deffinition
[21:16] <dlentz> txomon, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Status
[21:16] <txomon> dlentz, yes, I got there...
[21:17] <txomon> but don't fully understand the description to fix commited
[21:17] <txomon> is it pending to be uploaded or something like that?
[21:17] <yofel> txomon: depends a bit on the context, which bug?
[21:18] <txomon> yofel, bug 928193
[21:18] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 928193 in nam (Ubuntu Oneiric) (and 1 other project) "nam doesn't start on oneiric: Tcl version mismatch (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/928193
[21:18] <yofel> that's an SRU - there it means the package was uploaded to oneiric-proposed and is ready for testing
[21:19] <yofel> !sru
[21:19] <ubot4> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[21:19] <txomon> yofel, so it would have to be available by activating proposed, shouldn't it?
[21:19] <yofel> Fix committed isn't really used usually besides for things like this
[21:20] <txomon> yofel, so, how can I access to that fixed version?
[21:20] <yofel> hm
[21:22] <yofel> here the procedure doesn't look right. Maybe he uploaded the package, but usually a bug is only fix committed once it has been accepted
[21:22] <yofel> which doesn't seem to be the case yet here
[21:23] <txomon> so... ?
[21:25] <yofel> wrong status on first glance
[21:25] <txomon> oki
[21:26] <yofel> someone in #ubuntu-motu might know whether something was actually uploaded
[21:28] <txomon> oki ty for the info yofel
[21:57] <micahg> txomon: yofel: it's in unapproved
[21:58] <yofel> k
[21:58] <yofel> thanks for checking
[23:00] <iceroot> can someone change the package to libc6 instead of the kernel? (i think libc6 is the correct package and not linux or usb-modeswitch) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/927954
[23:00] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 927954 in linux (Ubuntu) "Mobile broadband device causes segfault when plugged in (segfault in libc6 when using usb-modeswitch) (affects: 3) (dups: 1) (heat: 18)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[23:01] <iceroot> or is that a kernel-issue?
[23:15] <iceroot> it was usb-modeswitch and already fixed in debian
[23:17] <iceroot> what are my possibilites to make this bug visible to the important ubuntu-people so we can fix this "fast"?
[23:18] <micahg> cyphermox: ^^